Trail Magic: Adaptability, THC Bans & AI

WEBVTT

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Hello and welcome to episode thirteen of
the Delta Dispatch Podcast.

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I'm joined by the illustrious team behind
Trail Magic,

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Mr. Jason Dayton and David O'Neill.

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I'd love for you guys to take a moment to
kind of ~ chat about yourselves

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a little bit and then we can get started.

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Yeah, thanks Ian. ~ good to be here.

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For those that ~ we haven't met ~ or
aren't familiar with Trail Magic.

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~ so David and I started this company long
before THC was ever ~ considered

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in THC Beverages. It was actually a hard
cider company we started back

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as our senior project in college as a
bunch of twenty one year olds.

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and in twenty twenty two when the law
changed in Minnesota and

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THC beverages became legal, ~

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We launched Trail Magic in a period of
nineteen days,

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which if you know anything about the
beverage industry is a little bit

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~ insane from a timeline. And we're one of
the first brands to hit

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the market in Minnesota and we've been
building ~ in the THC beverage space since

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and then also continuing to build our our
cider and our alcohol business nationally

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as well.

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Great.

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Yeah.

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thanks Ian for having us. ~ David,

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one of Jason's business partners,

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we've got another that ~ that does
production as well,

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just to kind of fill in some gaps a little
bit about our team.

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~ Jason really fills the role of kind of
the sales marketing,

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~ you know, run a thousand miles an hour.

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~ I run behind Jason and try to piece it
all back together for us

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to actually be able to to kind of keep up
with ~ with his speed.

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And then our other business partner,

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Rob.

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~ is one of the best cider makers in the
country.

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~ so he's he's got his agricultural roots,

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masters in horticulture. ~ at one point,

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you know, sold his house to move to a an
orchard and grow apples.

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So really deep kind of expertise on the
product ~ you know,

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side of things. And ~ yeah, it's a lot of
fun to be in this THC space.

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It was a kind of an avenue that we we
weren't anticipating when we first wrote

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our business plan, that's for sure.

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Yeah, I want to get into that.

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So ~ one question that I'm asked quite
often is how we

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as Delta Emerald choose the teams that we
want to work with and and invest with.

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And the two things that I I say most often

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is adaptability and tenacity or some
version of that.

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And as listeners I think are well aware,

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~ we've been presented with many

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Iterations of what adaptability means,

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whether you're talking about ~ cannabis
that preceded THC beverages

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in its current form, or the obvious ~
issues at hand in terms of ~

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the the November 12th pending potential
ban on the category or effective ban.

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So ~ I say that to kind of tee you guys

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up on the concept of adaptability and also
listening

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to one's customers.

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Can you guys give some context or stories
about ~ I think what makes y'all special,

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which is your willingness to listen to
your customer first and then

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let that lead you in terms of adapting to
where the market is going or

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or where you might need to go?

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And maybe let's start with the earlier
days and then we'll transition into

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how you're going to approach ~ or you are
approaching the potential band that's

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coming up.

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Yeah, I mean I would say, you know,

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from our

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Cool. ~ go ahead, Jason.

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I d yeah, from from our earliest days as a
company,

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~ we have ~ always needed to adapt.

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~ there's a story that David will like to
tell and remind me of is when

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we started this project, I stood in front
of a PowerPoint presentation

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and I said Cider is easy and it was gonna
take two thousand dollars

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and we're gonna be in stores in Christmas.

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And this was, you know, three months
forward from a class project.

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and that did that didn't happen.

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It didn't go any way that we expected.

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And and our business has been a story of ~
reinvention,

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you know, every six to eighteen months for
almost a decade.

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And that adaptability has allowed us to
survive and it's allowed us

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to see new opportunities and make make the
most of them when they when they came

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around. I mean, we opened our tap room,

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our our production facility up in
Minnesota,

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~ in May of twenty nineteen and our our
first profitable month

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was February of twenty twenty.

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~

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Obviously, we all know what happened in
March of that year.

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And, you know, it was that, you know,

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experience going through COVID,

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and we added pickleball.

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Ma maybe n not everyone will know ~ yeah,

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I'm I'm gonna I'm gonna stop you there.

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Not everyone might know what happened
then.

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So you wanna you wanna ~ explain a little
bit more on that?

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Yeah, so you know, middle of March,

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just as we felt we were getting our feet
underneath us as a business,

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the city of Minneapolis, you know,

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and then soon the state shut down all bars
and restaurants.

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And at the time, we didn't have a
distribution business.

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So a lot of brands sold way more product
in total wine,

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but we only had our tap room. we only had
the product sold over the bar

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and out the front door. And we were a
brand new business with very little
capital.

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And so we had to adjust and adapt

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very quickly. David ran our tapram at the
time,

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so he can speak more to that experience.

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~ and that story has kind of repeated
itself again and again.

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So as we're coming up to the potential ban
on hemp in November,

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you know, we are now again looking at the
business and saying,

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how are we going to keep surviving?

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What do we have to do from an
organizational structure?

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And then also what are the assets that we
have in terms of brand,

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product, liquid, production capacity?

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that we can now go find you know new
market opportunities.

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And and for us, you know, one of the
things that we launched ~ just three

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or four weeks ago was we expanded our
Trail Magic brand into a new cocktail
line,

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right? Of a 2.9 and an 8% ABV product.

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And that for us is is a pivot.

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We're an alcohol business, we can get into
that space.

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~ By no means are we abandoning hemp or
THC,

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but we are recognizing the need to make
sure that the business can

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be diverse and stable so that when we get
through what we

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you know, expect at worst to be a period
of prohibition.

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Trail Magic and Minneapolis Cider are
gonna be one of the brands that

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are are still here at the other side of
it.

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And I always go back to the example,

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I think it's Line and Kugels. They sold
ice cream for a decade,

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right? That's how they survived
prohibition.

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I I hope we don't have to sell ice cream
for a decade.

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you know, but if we have to sell ice cream
for a decade,

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we will sell ice cream for a decade so
that,

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you know, Trail Magic THC is here when ~
when that market's there.

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The other classic story of this was
brewer's yeast,

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which ~ Anheuser Busch sold by the by the
ton.

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~ but first they had to convince people to
actually put brewer's yeast

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in their mouths, ~ and that was its own
marketing ploy,

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if you will. But I did not know the Len
Lenin Kugels.

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David, you were about to say something
too.

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Yeah, I mean just to just

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to kind of double tap on you know on top
of what Jason was talking about,

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even thinking about our origins,

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~ w we're built differently, ~ you know,

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fundamentally. ~ we have, you know,

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physic we have about 30,000 square feet
that we lease.

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we have a physical tap room where we where
we connect with consumers

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and engage ~ and and get feedback on our
products.

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We have a manufacturing facility where
we're constantly tinkering

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and playing with different things,

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which gives us the flexibility to

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to iterate and and to kind of have fun
with our products in ways that

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if we were coping, which we do cop as
well,

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that we wouldn't have the flexibility to
do.

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So I think from like kind of a you know
reinvention every six months or so,

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like it's just kind of it's it's how we're
structured to be able

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to execute that way. And then I think the
industry that we're that

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we initially chose and are in ~ didn't,

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you know, it wasn't it wasn't just all
sunshine and rainbows.

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you know, we're selling cider to a
population that really didn't even know
what

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cider was. So how do we how do we reinvent
that?

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How do we bring something to the table
there?

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You know, Jason and I would go talk to
people in liquor stores when

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we were first selling our first cider
brand called Lionheart,

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which means bold, courageous, get out
there,

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you know, and ~ we were selling it as
like,

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hey, you know, you might know what angry
orchard is,

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and people like, you I don't like cider.

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It's like, all right, ours is half the
sugar of an angry orchard.

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And people are like, okay.

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So it's like we kind of started in this
niche having to convince people who we
are,

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why we should exist, and what value we're
bringing to the table.

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~ even when we opened up our tap room,

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~ you know, I thought, wow, and naively,

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~ I thought, wow, you know, we're the
we're the shiny new ~ tap room in the
town.

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We're not beer, we're different,

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we're cider, people are gonna appreciate
that.

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Nobody, you know, people came,

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but not many people, and and it's like
very humbling to realize,

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like,

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You you don't just build it and they will
come.

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Like you're gonna lose, you know,

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we were losing ten, twenty, thirty
thousand dollars every month and

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I left my corporate job and I and to wash
the bar towels ~ and and you know kind

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of make the tap everyone's like,

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what the heck did we just do? It's like,

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well, you know, you you didn't tell the
story,

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you didn't get out there. So it's like,

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okay, great. How do we how do we make
people care about cider?

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How do we get them excited about kind of
this like,

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you know, cool heritage from the farm,

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you know, to here? It's like one of the
least kind of process it's you know,

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very similar to wine, but kinda like beer.

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Anyways.

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So it's like, how do get people excited
about that?

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How do we do events? How do we,

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my gosh, ~ you know, long story short,

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had a ended up with a building that was
twice the size of our business plan.

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How do we use the extra space?

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~ we brought pickleball into, you know,

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the basically the the Twin Cities market
in,

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you know, what November of 2019.

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There wasn't a single other dedicated
court.

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We were the first ones. so it's like our
we we've been we've iterated

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and pivoted because we've had to.

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Like you you sign up for ~ you know,

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you put your back against the wall,

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you take on loans, you make commitments to
investors and other people,

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and and you basically, you know,

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you're looking at your community and
everybody else and you know,

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and it's like, what am how am I going to
serve you?

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What am I gonna do? And and you get
creative and you,

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you know, you kind of you know put the
gloves on and get to work.

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So I feel like the hemp ban and whatever
else,

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it's like, yeah, are we happy about it?

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Absolutely not. Does it cause a lot of
headache?

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A hundred percent. Are we gonna get
through it?

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I think so because you know, we we just
believe that we can kind

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of overcome and pivot and do different
things.

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So Jason was kind of alluding to a new
product line.

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We've got three new verticals.

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So it's like that's that's kind of what we
do well is ~ of is just kind

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of keep moving, pivoting, iterating.

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So I think ~ and I wanna get to some of
the game theory on on some

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of the scenarios ~ coming up, but before
we go there,

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~ just to circle back on this this notion
of adaptability,

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with a team of three co founders,

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I think a key part of adaptability is also
inviting conflict

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and being willing to disagree and then
commit to something.

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So can you guys

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share any experience you have with that or
how do you how do you invite that type

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of conflict without making it be something
where you guys are

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at each other's throats all the time.

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Unless you actually are at each other's
throats and I'm just not aware of it.

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I think we're I think we're pretty
friendly,

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but I you know, I'll say over the course
of being in business together

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for eleven years, ~ we've had challenges
and conflicts as a team.

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we've come out stronger because of that.

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Every week we ha the three of us sit down
for supposed to be an hour and a half,

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sometimes it's longer. ~ it's very rarely
shorter,

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you know, and sit down as an ownership
group and and talk about the core issues

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of the business. Each of us I think what's
unique about our business

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and the ownership structure is none of us
are passive.

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We're all actively involved day-to-day.

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This is all of our full-time job,

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and we each have really unique lanes to
run in.

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Right. So on my side, it's sales,

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marketing, brand development, distributor
relationships,

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sales. David, it's finance, back of house,

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tap room operations. Rob, it's all of our
production and logistics.

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And so our skills are very complementary
and our areas are very unique.

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And so, you know, what we do well is we
challenge each other by,

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you know, asking

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Good questions and when each of us comes
to the table and presents,

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here's what's going on in my side of the
business for the week.

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And you know, that striving to understand
what's going on has made,

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you know, time and time again us make
better decisions.

00:12:42.610 --> 00:12:47.885
~ a great example is we're we're about to
launch a new large format bottle

00:12:47.885 --> 00:12:49.856
in Minnesota. The law changes August 1st.

00:12:49.856 --> 00:12:51.698
It's five milligrams per serving,

00:12:51.698 --> 00:12:54.870
so it's not quite the ten milligram per
serving that you'd see,

00:12:54.659 --> 00:12:56.099
So seven seven fifty ML.

00:12:54.870 --> 00:12:55.870
you know, in techs.

00:12:57.142 --> 00:13:00.525
Kind of. No, it's not. ~

00:12:59.284 --> 00:13:00.772
n kind of. Okay. All right.

00:13:00.772 --> 00:13:01.772
Interesting.

00:13:01.419 --> 00:13:04.480
So, you know, for us, the law is seven
fifty ml or larger,

00:13:04.480 --> 00:13:06.331
and that's what everybody assumes they're
gonna be doing.

00:13:06.331 --> 00:13:08.272
And we started with that as our,

00:13:08.272 --> 00:13:10.813
you basis for the conversation of could we
make a spirit?

00:13:10.813 --> 00:13:13.564
Could we make a, you know, some type of
mixer,

00:13:13.564 --> 00:13:17.136
vodka alternative, you know, but for us it
it didn't feel like trail magic.

00:13:17.136 --> 00:13:18.756
It didn't feel really like a unique play.

00:13:18.756 --> 00:13:22.628
It felt very much, you know, there's a
dozen or two dozen other brands doing

00:13:22.628 --> 00:13:24.659
the same thing. And, you know,

00:13:24.659 --> 00:13:26.540
over the course of one of these ownership
meetings,

00:13:26.540 --> 00:13:29.981
that iterated into ~

00:13:30.113 --> 00:13:34.567
you know, we're gonna make large format
iced tea and a large format lemonade,

00:13:34.567 --> 00:13:36.378
so two separate skews, not a half and
half,

00:13:36.378 --> 00:13:40.862
in a 32 ounce glass bottle like you would
see at a high-end grocery store.

00:13:40.862 --> 00:13:43.905
Right? And for us that is something that's
uniquely trail magic.

00:13:43.905 --> 00:13:46.167
It's different from anything else out in
the market,

00:13:46.167 --> 00:13:51.171
its use case is different, and it wasn't
something that any of us came

00:13:51.171 --> 00:13:54.494
up with individually. We each sort of
brought little different pieces

00:13:54.775 --> 00:13:56.746
to the conversation and at the end of it
it,

00:13:56.746 --> 00:13:57.746
you know, we came out with this

00:13:58.423 --> 00:14:00.093
new product line that we're really excited
about.

00:14:04.377 --> 00:14:05.377
Is that mine?

00:14:05.367 --> 00:14:07.148
Is that Yeah, go ahead.

00:14:05.530 --> 00:14:07.260
And I and I think tying Ian kind

00:14:07.260 --> 00:14:09.453
of tying the original question into that,

00:14:09.453 --> 00:14:11.875
you know, kind of format, ~ you know,

00:14:11.875 --> 00:14:13.957
we we work well together because,

00:14:13.957 --> 00:14:17.590
you know, I think we we know what our
strengths are and I think we have

00:14:17.590 --> 00:14:20.733
a mutual respect for what each other's
strengths are.

00:14:20.733 --> 00:14:24.266
We kind of trust that and that's that's
built over a long period of time.

00:14:24.266 --> 00:14:26.298
~ like when we make a product,

00:14:26.298 --> 00:14:28.149
like I know Rob is gonna hit it out of the
park.

00:14:28.149 --> 00:14:29.149
~

00:14:28.876 --> 00:14:30.657
If he he does that, he's gonna make it
taste great.

00:14:30.657 --> 00:14:31.947
I don't have to sit and kind of,

00:14:31.947 --> 00:14:34.769
you know, micromanage or kind of like give
feedback on anything.

00:14:34.769 --> 00:14:36.849
Like I, you know, I just I just trust
that's gonna happen.

00:14:36.849 --> 00:14:39.150
He's his own worst critic. you know,

00:14:39.150 --> 00:14:41.451
when it's like exploring new markets or
getting out,

00:14:41.451 --> 00:14:42.732
you know, kind of sales and marketing
ideas,

00:14:42.732 --> 00:14:45.263
I'm not like, mm, is Jason is Jason
putting in the effort?

00:14:45.263 --> 00:14:47.804
Is he trying hard enough? Is he thinking
out of the box enough?

00:14:47.804 --> 00:14:49.555
It's like, no, I of course I know he is.

00:14:49.555 --> 00:14:55.217
~ and so I think that there's like a
mutual respect ~ for for each other.

00:14:55.217 --> 00:14:56.798
And ~

00:14:56.964 --> 00:14:59.676
kind of when it comes to you know new new
product development,

00:14:59.676 --> 00:15:02.258
like that's where we can kind of lean on
each other's strengths and kind

00:15:02.258 --> 00:15:04.547
of push each other and ~ and kind of like,

00:15:04.547 --> 00:15:05.791
all right, hey, if we did this,

00:15:05.791 --> 00:15:08.934
like does that work? And like there's kind
of a general trust and like,

00:15:08.934 --> 00:15:10.685
you know, maybe some healthy nudging of
like,

00:15:10.685 --> 00:15:13.638
like, yeah, I know Rob, it's another skew
and I know we're at,

00:15:13.638 --> 00:15:15.400
I don't even know what our skew count is
right now,

00:15:15.400 --> 00:15:18.352
but like, ~ you know, yeah, I know it's
another one,

00:15:18.352 --> 00:15:20.334
but like, can we do it? Do you think we
can pull it off?

00:15:20.334 --> 00:15:22.365
What resources do we need to allocate to
that,

00:15:22.365 --> 00:15:23.646
you know, time, money, you know,

00:15:23.646 --> 00:15:25.318
kind of whatever, other firepower.

00:15:25.740 --> 00:15:28.345
to help you accomplish that. So I I think
we're we're kind

00:15:28.345 --> 00:15:31.952
of accommodating with each other to to
make that ~ to make new things happen

00:15:31.952 --> 00:15:34.326
and because I think that there's a
baseline of trust there.

00:15:35.257 --> 00:15:37.308
So on the topic of making new things
happen,

00:15:37.308 --> 00:15:42.342
now I I do want to transition to kind of
the menu

00:15:42.342 --> 00:15:47.816
of possibilities and options ~ as we think
about November twelfth.

00:15:47.816 --> 00:15:50.328
You already mentioned one of those
scenarios,

00:15:50.328 --> 00:15:54.951
David, I think, which is or maybe it was
Jason saying there could be a

00:15:54.951 --> 00:15:59.094
ban for some period of time. Let's let's
put that on on

00:15:59.174 --> 00:16:02.717
one kind of leg of a stool.

00:16:03.427 --> 00:16:07.499
Can you guys walk me through some of the
other scenarios that you think

00:16:07.499 --> 00:16:13.763
are kind of the most likely and and if
you're willing to ~ offer probabilities
even

00:16:13.763 --> 00:16:18.845
better? But I I've I've been doing this
for myself and and also asking others too.

00:16:18.845 --> 00:16:21.667
Very curious to hear based on what you
know today,

00:16:21.667 --> 00:16:26.240
~ what are the odds on favorite one or two
potential outcomes?

00:16:26.240 --> 00:16:30.192
And then maybe what's the curve ball that
that you think is low probability

00:16:30.192 --> 00:16:32.393
but but still has has some likelihood?

00:16:33.834 --> 00:16:35.395
I think, you know, first and foremost,

00:16:35.395 --> 00:16:37.897
I like to say that it is we're recording
this on Wednesday,

00:16:37.897 --> 00:16:41.560
July twenty second at ten twenty-five
Central Standard Time.

00:16:41.560 --> 00:16:42.560
Ha ha.

00:16:42.432 --> 00:16:43.432
Ha ha ha

00:16:42.722 --> 00:16:43.722
because, you know,

00:16:43.923 --> 00:16:48.016
as as in politics, you'll find that things
can change very rapidly and you know,

00:16:48.016 --> 00:16:50.628
we're all sitting here currently waiting
for the bar bill.

00:16:50.628 --> 00:16:53.020
And I think at the end of by the time this
podcast airs,

00:16:53.020 --> 00:16:55.272
we'll likely have a good picture of what
that looks like.

00:16:55.272 --> 00:17:00.837
I mean overall, you know, we are planning
our business as if

00:17:01.485 --> 00:17:05.247
The November 12th law is going to go into
effect because you know I don't know

00:17:05.247 --> 00:17:10.030
any other way. We are not a company like
we've talked about that is 100% hemp drive

00:17:10.030 --> 00:17:11.480
THC. We have a hard cider business,

00:17:11.480 --> 00:17:12.911
we have other angles, we have a tap room.

00:17:12.911 --> 00:17:17.254
So responsibly, we need to make sure that
we manage the business accordingly.

00:17:17.254 --> 00:17:21.986
~ and we're also having you know proactive
conversations with retailers

00:17:21.986 --> 00:17:26.579
and distributors to make sure that we're a
brand that they understand that

00:17:26.579 --> 00:17:29.770
we are respecting and helping them manage
their own business and risk,

00:17:29.770 --> 00:17:30.871
right? I want retailers.

00:17:31.341 --> 00:17:34.863
If the worst case scenario happens and we
have a full ban and that is in place

00:17:34.863 --> 00:17:37.915
for a period of six months, I don't want
trail magic to have been

00:17:37.915 --> 00:17:42.258
the brand that they felt ~ they got
stiffed on or they had to throw away
product

00:17:42.258 --> 00:17:45.410
or was an issue for them. I want to manage
it responsibly,

00:17:45.410 --> 00:17:48.012
make as much money for everybody else as
we can along the way,

00:17:48.012 --> 00:17:50.614
but then have this very smooth transition.

00:17:50.614 --> 00:17:53.736
So that's, you know, scenario one.

00:17:53.736 --> 00:17:55.617
I think

00:17:55.204 --> 00:17:56.204
And and that

00:17:55.764 --> 00:17:58.015
said, Jason, just to just to interject,

00:17:58.015 --> 00:17:59.496
you know, and that doesn't mean that,

00:17:59.496 --> 00:18:03.358
you know, all the all the crap in the
pipeline flows back

00:18:03.358 --> 00:18:05.600
to the supplier necessarily either.

00:18:05.600 --> 00:18:07.491
We just, you know, we can't bear the
brunt,

00:18:07.491 --> 00:18:09.062
we can't bear the entire load.

00:18:09.062 --> 00:18:11.833
So ~ you know, it's going to and that's
why I think,

00:18:11.833 --> 00:18:13.184
you know, when we kind of approach,

00:18:13.184 --> 00:18:14.735
you know, our different partners is like,

00:18:14.735 --> 00:18:16.666
okay, how do we work together to solve
this issue?

00:18:16.666 --> 00:18:19.197
Like we can't just swallow all of it.

00:18:19.197 --> 00:18:23.369
No no no brands can. ~ it's like we need
to we need to how can the retailers,

00:18:23.369 --> 00:18:24.369
how can the distributors

00:18:24.606 --> 00:18:26.698
And the suppliers all work together to,

00:18:26.698 --> 00:18:28.119
you know, kind of work through inventory,

00:18:28.119 --> 00:18:30.783
you know, and and kind of figure out any
solutions to issues.

00:18:30.816 --> 00:18:33.858
you think that there's an understanding of
that from the trade?

00:18:33.858 --> 00:18:36.681
Because I I I've heard different stories.

00:18:36.681 --> 00:18:41.425
~ in some cases, maybe ~ a brand that

00:18:41.425 --> 00:18:47.520
has already ~ I guess run low on its
political capital,

00:18:47.520 --> 00:18:53.685
so to speak, and it doesn't even sound
like there is ~ leeway going into

00:18:53.685 --> 00:18:55.716
the selling season that we're currently
in.

00:18:55.716 --> 00:18:58.949
On the other hand, I hear from folks like
you that

00:18:59.321 --> 00:19:01.952
you know, th this this kind of
understanding exists.

00:19:01.952 --> 00:19:05.573
So wh what do you think is the difference
there and and do you think there

00:19:05.573 --> 00:19:08.804
is some variance in terms of the trade
understanding,

00:19:08.804 --> 00:19:12.235
well it can't all go back to the brand
necessarily because if you want

00:19:12.235 --> 00:19:16.486
to to continue to do bus business with us
~ in the two,

00:19:16.486 --> 00:19:18.537
three, four year time horizon,

00:19:18.537 --> 00:19:21.798
you understand that we also need to
continue,

00:19:21.798 --> 00:19:24.649
you know, to be able to to to survive as
well.

00:19:24.649 --> 00:19:25.719
So how does that work?

00:19:26.711 --> 00:19:30.104
It's it's different depending on which
part of the trade you're you're kind

00:19:30.104 --> 00:19:32.606
of having these discussions with and and
their relationships,

00:19:32.606 --> 00:19:39.221
right? So ~ distributors have a unique
problem in that their primary customer,

00:19:39.221 --> 00:19:44.346
the retailer, THC might only be ten
percent of their business with that
retailer.

00:19:44.346 --> 00:19:46.968
And so they need to make sure that they're
managing the entire relationship

00:19:46.968 --> 00:19:50.571
~ and making sure that retail it retailer
is taken care of.

00:19:50.571 --> 00:19:54.134
~ and so you all you will have
distributors who will pick up product

00:19:54.374 --> 00:19:55.565
~ because they are

00:19:55.887 --> 00:19:58.608
focused on maintaining the long term
relationship with that retailer.

00:19:58.608 --> 00:20:04.961
a lot of THC distribution contracts have
language around ~ what happens

00:20:04.961 --> 00:20:07.062
in the case of a ban. ~ you know,

00:20:07.062 --> 00:20:09.313
ours incl ours included, kind of depending
on the

00:20:08.910 --> 00:20:09.910
Uh-huh.

00:20:09.313 --> 00:20:13.234
the contract in it, you know, really at
the time when these were contracts were

00:20:13.234 --> 00:20:15.816
made, it was focused on state level ban.

00:20:15.816 --> 00:20:17.576
So if it gets banned in one state,

00:20:17.576 --> 00:20:20.057
hey, can we pick this up and be a good
partner and if we can move

00:20:20.057 --> 00:20:21.518
it to another state and resell it,

00:20:21.518 --> 00:20:23.859
you know, I'm gonna do everything possible
to

00:20:24.325 --> 00:20:25.916
To be a good partner and be able to do
that.

00:20:25.916 --> 00:20:31.698
the tough thing that I think that we've
had some conversations with

00:20:31.698 --> 00:20:34.229
our distributors and wholesalers are not
just on trail magic,

00:20:34.229 --> 00:20:36.340
but just more broadly, how are you
planning the industry?

00:20:36.340 --> 00:20:39.021
Is you're gonna see brands go out of
business.

00:20:39.021 --> 00:20:40.382
And so you're gonna see distributors,

00:20:40.382 --> 00:20:42.142
you know, try to come back to brands and
said,

00:20:42.142 --> 00:20:45.894
We had a contract guarantee saying if this
category ~ went under,

00:20:45.894 --> 00:20:48.845
you would buy back all of the product in
our inventory,

00:20:48.845 --> 00:20:51.096
and the brand might turn around and just
say,

00:20:51.096 --> 00:20:52.207
We're out of business, and you know,

00:20:52.207 --> 00:20:53.207
I'm sorry.

00:20:53.231 --> 00:20:54.532
You know, I can't I can't help you.

00:20:54.532 --> 00:20:58.503
and so, you know, I've also tried to be a
a resource for our wholesalers and saying,

00:20:58.503 --> 00:21:00.134
like, here's how I'm planning trail magic.

00:21:00.134 --> 00:21:03.175
Let's be proactive and wind down our
inventory and make sure that we've got,

00:21:03.175 --> 00:21:05.576
you know, our highest rate of rate of sale
items.

00:21:04.975 --> 00:21:05.975
Mm-hmm.

00:21:06.467 --> 00:21:09.298
make sure you're not stuck on long tail of
inventory.

00:21:09.298 --> 00:21:11.509
Can we proactively move this through the
market?

00:21:11.509 --> 00:21:14.060
You know, what day are you telling
retailers,

00:21:14.060 --> 00:21:15.901
hey, if you buy this after this date,

00:21:15.901 --> 00:21:18.202
it's yours and you and you own it,

00:21:18.202 --> 00:21:21.443
right? I'm trying to get ahead of those
problems because I know they're gonna be

00:21:21.893 --> 00:21:26.414
having some challenges with you know other
brands and inventory that they just

00:21:26.414 --> 00:21:28.735
weren't able to get rid of. And the
problem too in the market is going

00:21:28.735 --> 00:21:31.836
to get flooded. Right. If we have this
November ban and that becomes

00:21:31.836 --> 00:21:33.966
a reality and there's no fix ahead of
that,

00:21:33.966 --> 00:21:37.145
you're going to see a lot of product push
to market and people are going

00:21:37.145 --> 00:21:39.468
to just be trying to get rid of everything
they can because you'll end

00:21:39.468 --> 00:21:43.349
up in a situation, which this happened in
Ohio earlier this year,

00:21:43.349 --> 00:21:47.310
the distributors couldn't have it in their
warehouse.

00:21:47.310 --> 00:21:49.331
The retailers couldn't have it in their
back room,

00:21:49.331 --> 00:21:50.331
right? You couldn't have

00:21:50.469 --> 00:21:52.801
be in possession of it at all in the state
because then it was

00:21:52.801 --> 00:21:56.799
a Schedule One substance. And so it became
not a,

00:21:56.799 --> 00:21:58.747
you know, November twelfth problem.

00:21:58.747 --> 00:22:02.821
It became a, know, two weeks ahead of that
problem.

00:22:02.555 --> 00:22:03.555
Hmm.

00:22:02.821 --> 00:22:03.821
And

00:22:02.922 --> 00:22:05.234
so that'll kind of go distributor by
distributor,

00:22:05.234 --> 00:22:06.245
market by market.

00:22:06.339 --> 00:22:08.116
So in a in a way we've actually seen

00:22:08.827 --> 00:22:09.827
Mm-hmm.

00:22:10.425 --> 00:22:13.985
Yeah, in in a way we've actually seen a
preview of that if you look at Ohio

00:22:13.985 --> 00:22:15.811
as an example. Is that a fair statement?

00:22:16.249 --> 00:22:18.670
Yeah, yep, absolutely. But at the same
time,

00:22:18.670 --> 00:22:23.803
you will have, you know, markets where
maybe it's a cannabis product,

00:22:23.803 --> 00:22:27.676
~ you know, and that state has more
lenient cannabis rules.

00:22:27.676 --> 00:22:29.717
So maybe you can still hold on to that
product and kind of figure

00:22:29.717 --> 00:22:30.767
out something else to do with it.

00:22:30.767 --> 00:22:34.129
Like there there's gonna be some other
paths and avenues.

00:22:34.129 --> 00:22:37.071
~ so no state is gonna be the exactly the
same.

00:22:37.071 --> 00:22:44.005
and you know, brands should think about
overall reducing their inventory.

00:22:44.975 --> 00:22:47.199
And then figuring out a state by state
strategy for,

00:22:47.199 --> 00:22:50.947
you know, how to manage that process ahead
of the November twelfth date.

00:22:56.653 --> 00:23:02.447
Okay, so if if on one end of the spectrum
total ban ~ sticks,

00:23:02.447 --> 00:23:08.210
it sounds like implicit in that scenario
from y'all's perspective,

00:23:08.210 --> 00:23:15.175
that's a total ban that lasts for some
number of months to could I say up to a
year,

00:23:15.175 --> 00:23:21.249
or do you think a year is is i is too
bearish in that kind of downside scenario?

00:23:23.279 --> 00:23:24.279
I don't think

00:23:24.522 --> 00:23:26.475
Jason's the bear and I'm the optimist,

00:23:26.475 --> 00:23:29.450
so but he knows way more than I do about
how politics works,

00:23:27.109 --> 00:23:30.450
I don't yeah, I mean I

00:23:29.450 --> 00:23:30.450
so

00:23:30.450 --> 00:23:33.644
think the problem here is politics is just
inherently unpredictable.

00:23:33.644 --> 00:23:36.217
~ you know, I remember, you know,

00:23:36.217 --> 00:23:41.371
Ian when we were back at your conference
in February and and talking about this

00:23:41.371 --> 00:23:43.172
and is Congress gonna get something done?

00:23:43.172 --> 00:23:47.076
you know, one of the sort of offhand
comments was who knows,

00:23:47.076 --> 00:23:50.919
we could be at war tomorrow and literally
flying home on the plane,

00:23:50.919 --> 00:23:53.441
the Iran war was starting. So,

00:23:53.441 --> 00:23:56.013
you know, Congress Congress can get

00:23:54.998 --> 00:23:56.087
Yes, that was

00:23:56.087 --> 00:23:57.703
yeah, that was an opening remark.

00:23:57.071 --> 00:23:58.071
Congress can get

00:23:57.811 --> 00:24:02.375
distracted. ~ what we hope is going to
happen,

00:24:02.375 --> 00:24:06.537
is obviously this hopefully this gets
resolved before November twelfth.

00:24:06.537 --> 00:24:08.719
If it's not resolved before November
twelfth,

00:24:08.719 --> 00:24:15.063
~ our hope is that the concern of the
economic loss of jobs

00:24:15.063 --> 00:24:19.846
in the district will motivate ~ members of
Congress to fully understand

00:24:19.846 --> 00:24:20.867
and appreciate the issue.

00:24:21.701 --> 00:24:25.454
What I don't think a lot of members of
Congress fully understand yet is

00:24:25.454 --> 00:24:28.976
how many of their breweries and their
liquor stores and their distributors

00:24:28.976 --> 00:24:32.008
are dependent on this. People have this
idea that this is just something that's

00:24:32.008 --> 00:24:33.899
going on in the hemp of the cannabis
industry,

00:24:33.899 --> 00:24:36.291
and it's just those head shops that,

00:24:36.291 --> 00:24:38.743
you know, maybe people didn't want in
their district to begin with.

00:24:38.743 --> 00:24:44.907
And they will be really surprised when a
major brewery that's a huge economic
driver

00:24:44.907 --> 00:24:48.039
for their downtown community and their
downtown revival is now all

00:24:48.039 --> 00:24:50.861
of a sudden facing a dire financial
straight because of this product category.

00:24:52.107 --> 00:24:54.279
And we hope that that will, you know,

00:24:54.279 --> 00:24:55.670
spur them to action beforehand.

00:24:55.670 --> 00:25:00.425
Or if it doesn't, that that noise will be
so loud between November twelfth

00:25:00.425 --> 00:25:03.137
and the start of the next Congress that
this is something that

00:25:03.137 --> 00:25:07.721
can be addressed relatively quickly by the
new Congress in twenty twenty seven.

00:25:07.721 --> 00:25:09.923
But I wouldn't put any bets on it.

00:25:09.923 --> 00:25:11.575
It could be a year, it could be longer
than that.

00:25:11.575 --> 00:25:13.677
We really just we really don't know.

00:25:18.285 --> 00:25:21.267
And then ~ to push one step further,

00:25:21.267 --> 00:25:25.259
so ~ I I think we can always talk about
the upside scenario.

00:25:25.259 --> 00:25:27.820
something gets done before November
twelfth.

00:25:27.820 --> 00:25:30.882
My opinion and I'm aligned with you guys,

00:25:30.882 --> 00:25:35.980
better to prepare for the worst in this
case and especially when you have

00:25:35.980 --> 00:25:37.946
a pre existing business like you do,

00:25:37.946 --> 00:25:43.419
it's easier to do that. ~ so you mentioned
another kind of scenario,

00:25:43.419 --> 00:25:47.531
maybe a sub scenario here, which is
different states

00:25:48.611 --> 00:25:54.445
approach the ban differently. can you kind
of expound on that a little

00:25:54.445 --> 00:25:57.497
bit and and like what could that look
like?

00:25:57.497 --> 00:26:02.950
Are there any leading examples of states
where you think that that's starting

00:26:02.950 --> 00:26:09.054
to materialize or we have evidence that
there's a will to to find

00:26:09.054 --> 00:26:13.066
a solution in spite of a ban and maybe

00:26:14.287 --> 00:26:16.250
Minnesota probably is an easy one for you,

00:26:16.250 --> 00:26:17.772
so you can take that if you want,

00:26:17.772 --> 00:26:19.745
or or go in another direction as well.

00:26:21.945 --> 00:26:23.500
I think what we're trying to understand

00:26:23.776 --> 00:26:28.458
right now is, you know, what does the
state rec cannabis market look like?

00:26:28.458 --> 00:26:31.940
And then what can businesses do inside of
that space?

00:26:31.940 --> 00:26:35.152
I think there's opportunity and there's
also warning,

00:26:35.152 --> 00:26:40.174
right? So California I think is a warning
in this space in that California

00:26:40.174 --> 00:26:45.957
has a state rec program, had hemp drived
products available for a period of time.

00:26:46.867 --> 00:26:48.499
when they were removed from Total Wine and
Bevmo,

00:26:48.499 --> 00:26:51.241
they went back to the dispensaries and
that that market hasn't picked up,

00:26:51.241 --> 00:26:52.702
right? That's still 1% of sales,

00:26:52.702 --> 00:26:54.593
and there's still only a handful of brands
available.

00:26:54.593 --> 00:27:00.298
~ so I think we're still waiting to see if
the hemp drived market going

00:27:00.298 --> 00:27:04.402
to carry over and drive people into the
dispensary channel or into

00:27:04.462 --> 00:27:06.763
the traditional cannabis space.

00:27:06.763 --> 00:27:11.357
What I think's unlikely to succeed is a
pivot to either

00:27:11.357 --> 00:27:15.671
a.4 or this broad market pivot into.

00:27:16.101 --> 00:27:20.525
functionals, you know, kava or other types
of products that are that are not THD.

00:27:20.525 --> 00:27:22.402
I think people are buying the product for
the effect.

00:27:22.402 --> 00:27:24.927
And if you take away the effect that
people can feel,

00:27:24.927 --> 00:27:27.161
I think you lose them you lose the market.

00:27:27.496 --> 00:27:28.601
I agree with you there. David,

00:27:28.601 --> 00:27:29.987
anything else to add to that?

00:27:31.059 --> 00:27:32.941
No, I I think I'll let that land with
Jason,

00:27:32.941 --> 00:27:35.134
although I think Kava does have an effect.

00:27:35.134 --> 00:27:38.948
I have ~ I've actually got samples coming
for for that.

00:27:38.948 --> 00:27:41.491
I haven't told you Jason just to just to
play around with it,

00:27:41.491 --> 00:27:42.491
but

00:27:43.562 --> 00:27:45.063
See, we're always we're always pivoting,

00:27:44.169 --> 00:27:45.816
That's a that's another R and D.

00:27:44.215 --> 00:27:48.521
Some future future conflict. Yeah,

00:27:45.063 --> 00:27:48.292
we're never stopping. Yeah.

00:27:45.816 --> 00:27:49.213
We'll see. Yeah.

00:27:48.292 --> 00:27:50.347
But you know, the other the

00:27:48.521 --> 00:27:50.338
exactly. Yeah.

00:27:50.347 --> 00:27:51.347
other thing that's interesting,

00:27:51.197 --> 00:27:52.878
Ian, is I'm in I'm in Texas this week,

00:27:52.878 --> 00:27:57.972
and you know, one of the questions that
we're asking in Texas is there's

00:27:57.972 --> 00:27:59.663
a license program in Texas, right?

00:27:59.663 --> 00:28:02.425
~ there's licensing and manufacturing,

00:28:02.425 --> 00:28:06.628
but you also have a government that's not
super friendly to the category,

00:28:06.628 --> 00:28:12.202
so could you operate an intrastate Texas
business potentially?

00:28:12.602 --> 00:28:16.886
Is the Texas Alcohol and Gaming
Enforcement.

00:28:16.886 --> 00:28:19.818
I'm I'm not actually sure the exact ~
acronym for their agency.

00:28:19.818 --> 00:28:22.370
Are they gonna get involved? Will they
will they be okay?

00:28:22.370 --> 00:28:25.303
And then and then obviously there's the
downstream effects of banking

00:28:25.303 --> 00:28:28.105
and payment processing and everything else
that sort of goes along with

00:28:28.105 --> 00:28:29.887
it of operating a cannabis company.

00:28:29.887 --> 00:28:35.391
but I do think you're going to see some
really interesting market dynamics take

00:28:35.391 --> 00:28:39.144
away. Like I don't I don't believe in this
like November 12th cliff and

00:28:39.144 --> 00:28:40.856
the thing is dead. I think you're gonna
see

00:28:41.364 --> 00:28:44.525
you know, different markets and different
brands try unique approaches.

00:28:44.361 --> 00:28:45.361
Mm.

00:28:44.846 --> 00:28:46.706
And the question all of us are gonna have
to see is like,

00:28:46.706 --> 00:28:50.508
will that work? I think what we do know,

00:28:50.508 --> 00:28:53.949
and and I'll be really clear, this is not
coming from inside information from

00:28:54.029 --> 00:28:55.440
our relationships with retailers.

00:28:55.440 --> 00:28:57.121
This is just sort of, you know,

00:28:57.121 --> 00:28:59.242
my understanding of the market is is
you're not going to

00:28:59.242 --> 00:29:03.423
see major retailers continue. ~ you know,

00:29:03.423 --> 00:29:06.925
you're not gonna see likely the targets of
the world or or some of

00:29:06.925 --> 00:29:09.636
the big chains probably keep in the space
because I think for them

00:29:10.120 --> 00:29:12.101
it's gonna be a more of a, you know,

00:29:12.101 --> 00:29:15.753
compliance risk where you'll see this
market sort of evolve and adapt

00:29:15.753 --> 00:29:18.355
is gonna be independence, just like we did
back in twenty twenty

00:29:18.355 --> 00:29:20.436
two at the beginning of the category.

00:29:20.436 --> 00:29:23.377
~ and they'll lead the way and they'll
kind of figure out what the

00:29:23.377 --> 00:29:24.448
new route forward is.

00:29:27.521 --> 00:29:29.372
I think Ian, you can look to, you know,

00:29:29.372 --> 00:29:31.583
just kind of the rec cannabis market about
like,

00:29:31.583 --> 00:29:33.896
okay, how did how do these, you know,

00:29:33.896 --> 00:29:37.468
businesses who are, you know, not
federally blessed as Hemp was,

00:29:37.468 --> 00:29:40.890
~ operate in states that, you know,

00:29:40.890 --> 00:29:43.472
that have a licensing structure or
something for them?

00:29:43.472 --> 00:29:46.004
~ and kind of to touch on, you know,

00:29:46.004 --> 00:29:47.455
some of the compliance challenges,

00:29:47.455 --> 00:29:51.738
banking, you know, insurance, payment
processing,

00:29:51.738 --> 00:29:55.321
two ADE taxes, you know, how how do you

00:29:55.659 --> 00:29:58.250
Can your organization jump over those
hurdles?

00:29:58.250 --> 00:30:03.862
~ and you know, I I think that there's
ways for for smaller operations

00:30:03.862 --> 00:30:05.723
or kind of more nimble operations to do
that,

00:30:05.723 --> 00:30:08.133
like our business. But ~ you know,

00:30:08.133 --> 00:30:11.655
to kind of Jason's point, like large
national retailers,

00:30:11.655 --> 00:30:16.336
it's hard to, you know, ~ I don't even
know what the analogy would be,

00:30:16.336 --> 00:30:17.787
steer the ship, just a, you know,

00:30:17.787 --> 00:30:18.787
it's a bigger ship.

00:30:19.143 --> 00:30:24.366
Do you also think that that means that the
largest ~ players

00:30:24.466 --> 00:30:29.618
in the THC beverage space is it is it more
difficult to adapt in this

00:30:29.618 --> 00:30:32.750
way at size and scale,

00:30:32.750 --> 00:30:33.911
or is it easier?

00:30:35.443 --> 00:30:38.164
I mean, I think it probably depends on how
much capital you've got and,

00:30:37.340 --> 00:30:38.340
That's a good question.

00:30:38.984 --> 00:30:42.085
you know, how willing how able you are to
to adjust,

00:30:42.085 --> 00:30:44.316
~ and how much runway you have.

00:30:44.316 --> 00:30:47.466
I I I think from our own personal
experience,

00:30:47.466 --> 00:30:53.185
as we've grown as a company, it has been
harder to launch new products.

00:30:53.185 --> 00:30:55.329
I mean, we we like to talk about all the
time,

00:30:55.329 --> 00:30:58.630
you know, hey, we launched Trail Magic in
nineteen days.

00:30:58.630 --> 00:31:01.060
And we did. It was it was an incredible
effort by the team.

00:31:01.060 --> 00:31:03.391
~ new product development now.

00:31:03.741 --> 00:31:05.141
For variety of reasons takes longer.

00:31:05.141 --> 00:31:06.453
We're just a bigger organization.

00:31:06.453 --> 00:31:08.895
We've got, you know, more checkboxes.

00:31:08.895 --> 00:31:13.359
And so I think it will be a market that
rewards small,

00:31:13.359 --> 00:31:15.261
nimble companies who, you know,

00:31:15.261 --> 00:31:17.403
have some capital, who are willing to take
a risk.

00:31:21.373 --> 00:31:24.505
Alright, so we've we've talked about some
of the scenarios.

00:31:24.505 --> 00:31:26.827
No one knows for sure. It is Wednesday,

00:31:26.827 --> 00:31:29.588
July twenty second, and all this could
change in a week.

00:31:29.588 --> 00:31:35.268
I would love to transition now to

00:31:35.268 --> 00:31:40.449
a a third topic that I think we're all
quite passionate about and is certainly

00:31:40.449 --> 00:31:45.840
a a hot topic of late, and that being ~ AI
and the way that

00:31:45.840 --> 00:31:50.023
AI is transforming and integrating into

00:31:50.738 --> 00:31:54.910
these businesses and a favorite kind of
way of thinking about this from

00:31:54.910 --> 00:32:00.422
my perspective is that ~ there is no world
where and people ha will have heard

00:32:00.422 --> 00:32:06.044
me say this before ~ potentially there's
no world where we download a joint from

00:32:06.044 --> 00:32:08.675
the cloud or a beverage from the cloud.

00:32:08.675 --> 00:32:13.376
So in in in some sense there is a a a pure
form

00:32:13.957 --> 00:32:19.779
of the physicality of of of consumer
packaged goods that never goes away.

00:32:20.293 --> 00:32:23.224
And in my mind, it's actually more
interesting for that reason,

00:32:23.224 --> 00:32:27.805
because anyone can spin up a an app now,

00:32:27.805 --> 00:32:32.367
a mobile app, let's say it's gonna be
clunky and and cost you a lot of tokens,

00:32:32.367 --> 00:32:36.018
but you can do it. It's more interesting
to me to think about how

00:32:36.018 --> 00:32:39.309
the physical world changes as a result of
AI.

00:32:39.309 --> 00:32:45.501
And you all are in the business of
producing and moving physical goods

00:32:45.501 --> 00:32:46.501
in this world.

00:32:46.843 --> 00:32:52.826
I would love to maybe start off to to hear
how you guys got started.

00:32:52.826 --> 00:32:59.310
And then I know ~ you've built some
internal proprietary things that you use.

00:32:59.310 --> 00:33:04.903
So I'd love to then move into a little bit
more depth as far as what you're doing.

00:33:04.903 --> 00:33:06.534
And and then at the very end of this,

00:33:06.534 --> 00:33:10.297
we will do some show and tell and screen
sharing,

00:33:10.297 --> 00:33:13.779
acknowledging, of course, that not
everyone is going to be able to watch this
over

00:33:13.779 --> 00:33:14.779
video.

00:33:14.631 --> 00:33:17.544
So we'll do our best to kinda narrate
what's going on as well.

00:33:17.544 --> 00:33:20.045
But but yeah, I'd love to get into that
topic.

00:33:20.729 --> 00:33:21.919
Yeah, I mean so I can say, you know,

00:33:21.919 --> 00:33:23.870
how we got started, you know, in

00:33:24.770 --> 00:33:29.432
AI in our business is is similar to I
think where most businesses are right now.

00:33:29.432 --> 00:33:33.573
Is, you know, we're a small organization
and we're always trying to find ways

00:33:33.573 --> 00:33:36.434
to to do more with the resources that we
have.

00:33:36.434 --> 00:33:38.534
~ it's a blessing and a curse.

00:33:38.534 --> 00:33:41.055
I can tell you, you know, being a well
funded organization,

00:33:41.055 --> 00:33:42.786
it's easy to spend money, you know,

00:33:42.786 --> 00:33:45.467
a bit more carelessly and all of a sudden
when you're watching every single penny,

00:33:45.467 --> 00:33:46.817
you know, you you start to get

00:33:47.363 --> 00:33:48.934
you know, really focused on, you know,

00:33:48.934 --> 00:33:50.466
how do I maximize my time and effort?

00:33:50.466 --> 00:33:53.988
And as three founders who are actively
involved in the day-to-day business,

00:33:53.988 --> 00:33:57.301
you know, we always have more work than is
feasible within,

00:33:57.301 --> 00:33:59.132
you know, our lives, especially as
parents.

00:33:59.132 --> 00:34:01.805
And so, you know, how do we improve the,

00:34:01.805 --> 00:34:04.507
you know, the operations and the
efficiency that we're doing.

00:34:04.507 --> 00:34:07.149
So very basically it started with,

00:34:07.149 --> 00:34:09.891
~ on a sales operations side of things,

00:34:09.891 --> 00:34:15.055
how can I better analyze data for my
wholesalers and be a better communicator
with

00:34:15.055 --> 00:34:17.077
my wholesalers? one of the

00:34:17.273 --> 00:34:19.824
You know, number one things that we talk
about in sales operations

00:34:19.824 --> 00:34:24.065
and especially as a small brand working
with a network of sixty plus wholesalers
is,

00:34:24.065 --> 00:34:27.536
you know, we can win by being a stronger
communicator than most of

00:34:27.536 --> 00:34:31.737
the other brands and by making sure that
we show up with the right information

00:34:31.737 --> 00:34:35.058
for the wholesalers exactly when they need
it and make it very actionable

00:34:35.058 --> 00:34:37.569
for their team. So we're not creating it
an extra burden.

00:34:37.569 --> 00:34:41.480
For a lot of our wholesalers, some of them
were one of their largest suppliers.

00:34:41.480 --> 00:34:43.471
A lot of them were were pretty small
supplier.

00:34:43.471 --> 00:34:44.801
And so we don't necessarily get

00:34:45.303 --> 00:34:48.175
the time of day from their internal teams.

00:34:48.175 --> 00:34:50.956
So we needed to make it, you know,

00:34:50.956 --> 00:34:55.379
really straightforward. And one of the
projects that we worked on first

00:34:55.379 --> 00:34:58.041
was managing our target sets, which was,

00:34:58.041 --> 00:35:03.594
you know, almost 3,000 points of
distribution across 21 wholesalers,

00:35:03.594 --> 00:35:06.346
across 350 stores, right? And so you're,

00:35:06.346 --> 00:35:10.729
you know, trying to get to 100% ex set
execution.

00:35:11.361 --> 00:35:16.285
And making sure all of those items are in
the right spots and then identifying gaps

00:35:16.446 --> 00:35:18.767
as as long as you go. And so in that in
that case,

00:35:18.767 --> 00:35:25.353
there are existing software that you can
pay for that will

00:35:25.353 --> 00:35:26.955
do your chain management for you.

00:35:26.955 --> 00:35:30.438
~ there are specialized software in the
industry like Vermont Information
Processing

00:35:30.678 --> 00:35:33.510
that has some of these systems ready
built,

00:35:33.510 --> 00:35:35.392
but it's gonna cost you, you know,

00:35:35.392 --> 00:35:38.775
hundreds or potentially thousands of
dollars of additional cost per month.

00:35:40.139 --> 00:35:41.750
Now, if you have the raw data,

00:35:41.072 --> 00:35:42.072
Hmm.

00:35:42.631 --> 00:35:48.165
your $20 a month Claude subscription ~ can
get you that plus more

00:35:48.165 --> 00:35:50.467
and make it customized for your use case.

00:35:50.467 --> 00:35:53.800
So very simply, as I was going through
this process with wholesalers

00:35:53.800 --> 00:35:58.123
and managing this set, I would take our
set execution data from Target.

00:35:58.123 --> 00:35:59.885
You know, they would send us a list of
saying,

00:35:59.885 --> 00:36:01.046
here's the items that have been set,

00:36:01.046 --> 00:36:02.907
here's the items that haven't been set by
store,

00:36:02.907 --> 00:36:05.650
~ by item. And this spreadsheet is,

00:36:05.650 --> 00:36:07.381
you know, not just Trail Magic,

00:36:07.381 --> 00:36:08.381
it's every other brand in the set.

00:36:08.362 --> 00:36:09.843
So it's 10,000 lines long.

00:36:10.577 --> 00:36:15.379
~ I would pair that up with ~ my
distributor data and information

00:36:15.379 --> 00:36:17.170
and which distributors covered which
store.

00:36:17.170 --> 00:36:20.851
Cause in beverage, if you kind of have
been through this,

00:36:20.851 --> 00:36:24.783
you recognize that there is a ton of data
and not a lot of it's connected anywhere.

00:36:24.783 --> 00:36:27.004
It's all living in sort of these
independent spreadsheets.

00:36:27.004 --> 00:36:30.065
And using Claude,

00:36:30.065 --> 00:36:32.026
we were able to merge that data,

00:36:32.026 --> 00:36:36.568
have Claude filter it for Trail Magic and
have it identify the immediate gaps

00:36:36.568 --> 00:36:39.289
~ that were left in our set execution.

00:36:39.649 --> 00:36:44.272
And then create a live dashboard that I
could send to my wholesalers,

00:36:44.272 --> 00:36:47.334
and then they could very easily just click
in and say,

00:36:47.334 --> 00:36:51.257
Great, here's the four stores and these
items that are missing for Trail Magic.

00:36:51.257 --> 00:36:52.698
Take a screenshot, send it to their rep.

00:36:52.698 --> 00:36:57.702
And it it is a process that you could
manage with manual Excel work.

00:36:57.702 --> 00:36:59.343
It would have taken significantly longer.

00:36:59.343 --> 00:37:02.115
You could manage by paying, you know,

00:37:02.115 --> 00:37:04.627
several hundred dollars or several
thousand dollars a month,

00:37:04.627 --> 00:37:07.929
or a twenty dollar Claude subscription and

00:37:08.343 --> 00:37:11.615
Five minutes and a quick prompt ~ spits
out the data,

00:37:11.615 --> 00:37:13.266
the exact data that we needed as a
business.

00:37:13.266 --> 00:37:15.247
And so that was the start of our journey.

00:37:15.247 --> 00:37:17.418
And I think from a sales operations
standpoint,

00:37:17.418 --> 00:37:23.822
it's a lot of those types of prompts and
data processing that we use.

00:37:23.822 --> 00:37:26.644
~ and then as I'm going through this,

00:37:26.644 --> 00:37:29.525
I'm passing along these insights to David
and kind of some of the work that we're

00:37:29.525 --> 00:37:33.127
doing. And then David really ran with it
for a lot of back-end operations

00:37:33.127 --> 00:37:34.738
in our team, especially on the finance
side of things.

00:37:34.738 --> 00:37:36.139
So I'll let him jump into it there.

00:37:38.958 --> 00:37:44.340
Yeah. I I mean I think that it's like a
you know it's it's an amazing tool.

00:37:44.340 --> 00:37:48.525
I think w you know we're not I I don't
personally feel like I'm on anywhere near

00:37:48.525 --> 00:37:53.629
the cutting edge. ~ I'm I'm you know
trying to figure it out,

00:37:53.629 --> 00:37:56.330
keep up with ~ all all the different
changes and things,

00:37:56.330 --> 00:37:58.042
but but it really at the end of it it's
like,

00:37:58.042 --> 00:38:01.344
okay, how do I how do I build,

00:38:01.344 --> 00:38:03.495
you know, just as we would with any other
process,

00:38:03.495 --> 00:38:05.117
something that can, you know, kind of run,

00:38:05.117 --> 00:38:06.518
execute, make our lives easier.

00:38:06.518 --> 00:38:07.518
So

00:38:07.346 --> 00:38:09.167
~ from like a financial side of things,

00:38:09.167 --> 00:38:12.170
you know, one of the most one of the most
difficult things for us

00:38:12.350 --> 00:38:16.343
as we've expanded and kind of really grown
up and changed our business from this,

00:38:16.343 --> 00:38:18.795
you know, local cider company that's just,

00:38:18.795 --> 00:38:21.648
you know, distributing has a couple
distributors in Minnesota to like,

00:38:21.648 --> 00:38:23.679
my gosh, I don't even I don't even what do
we have?

00:38:23.679 --> 00:38:25.881
70 distributors, Jason, something like
that,

00:38:25.881 --> 00:38:31.136
~ around the country in you know 20
different states with you know three
different

00:38:31.136 --> 00:38:33.648
brands and you know, however many
different SKUs,

00:38:33.648 --> 00:38:36.390
it's like, my goodness, ~ how do we

00:38:36.612 --> 00:38:38.363
possibly get our arms around all of this?

00:38:38.363 --> 00:38:44.028
How do we how do we know what SKUs are
profitable when we ship it to California?

00:38:44.028 --> 00:38:46.950
Are we even making money on kegs that we
send to California?

00:38:46.950 --> 00:38:52.144
~ how do I how do I instruct our warehouse
team to you know make sure that when

00:38:52.144 --> 00:38:55.799
we're booking freight, which when you have
a war in the Middle East and

00:38:55.799 --> 00:38:59.300
f you know freight goes you know
absolutely bananas,

00:38:59.300 --> 00:39:01.982
like ~ we're not we're not sophisticated
enough to be

00:39:02.318 --> 00:39:07.733
hedging or doing any kind of like aluminum
or or oil kind of ~ hedging operations.

00:39:07.733 --> 00:39:11.155
Like maybe that's ~ maybe that's in
another decade or or maybe a couple

00:39:11.155 --> 00:39:13.287
of years with AI, maybe I'll we'll be
hedging that.

00:39:13.287 --> 00:39:17.651
But ~ but anyways trying to use these
tools to to accomplish some of those
things.

00:39:17.651 --> 00:39:20.613
So for us at a very core on the back end
side of things,

00:39:20.613 --> 00:39:24.637
~ you know, it's like I had to learn what
an API was and how did that work?

00:39:24.637 --> 00:39:28.740
~ so getting an API to connect like to you
know my finan or

00:39:28.740 --> 00:39:30.692
my my accounting software, QuickBooks.

00:39:31.012 --> 00:39:33.954
you know, pulling that into my kind of
forecasting spreadsheet,

00:39:33.954 --> 00:39:36.286
which I basically live in and kind of
have,

00:39:36.286 --> 00:39:38.928
you know, for a decade for our business.

00:39:38.928 --> 00:39:42.191
And pulling pulling in financial
information from that,

00:39:42.191 --> 00:39:44.163
how do I make that easy? my gosh,

00:39:44.163 --> 00:39:45.694
every t I I update books, you know,

00:39:45.694 --> 00:39:48.787
all the time. ~ you know, I kind of used
to work at Ernst and Young,

00:39:48.787 --> 00:39:51.639
so I'm I'm kind of dangerous enough on the
accounting side to like,

00:39:51.639 --> 00:39:55.102
you know, to meddle in there. And and and
basically it's like,

00:39:55.102 --> 00:39:57.324
okay, cool. How do I write something that
I don't have to pull

00:39:57.324 --> 00:39:58.725
a spreadsheet manually to do that?

00:39:58.725 --> 00:40:00.226
It doesn't take long to do that.

00:40:00.460 --> 00:40:02.231
It takes a couple hours, you know,

00:40:02.231 --> 00:40:04.433
especially when you're learning what the
heck an API is,

00:40:04.433 --> 00:40:06.255
it takes, you know, several hours in the
beginning,

00:40:06.255 --> 00:40:07.606
setting up a developer account,

00:40:07.606 --> 00:40:09.257
figuring this all out, you know,

00:40:09.257 --> 00:40:10.328
banging your head in the cloud,

00:40:10.328 --> 00:40:12.980
which is getting easier, especially with
like more advanced models.

00:40:12.980 --> 00:40:18.324
~ but r basically making the time to not
work in the business but work

00:40:18.324 --> 00:40:20.526
on it and using AI to do that is super
helpful.

00:40:20.526 --> 00:40:23.758
So kind of like tactfully, like what we do
is,

00:40:23.758 --> 00:40:26.020
you know, I have an API that connects to
QuickBooks.

00:40:26.366 --> 00:40:29.087
~ using a Python script that it wrote.

00:40:29.087 --> 00:40:35.229
~ it I don't code. And and basically it it
it pulls financials for me into it.

00:40:35.229 --> 00:40:38.620
And then it kind of then starts to update
my spreadsheet and it's like,

00:40:38.620 --> 00:40:40.430
hey, did I add any new chart of accounts?

00:40:40.430 --> 00:40:42.260
Sometimes accountants like to do that.

00:40:42.260 --> 00:40:43.671
So it kind of flags different things.

00:40:43.671 --> 00:40:45.352
And it's like, hey, I actually don't want
that account.

00:40:45.352 --> 00:40:47.572
Cause like I'm our treasurer, I'm our
controller,

00:40:47.572 --> 00:40:49.373
I'm our CFO, I'm all the different things.

00:40:49.373 --> 00:40:52.864
~ so if if our kind of our bookkeeper does
something that,

00:40:52.864 --> 00:40:53.864
you know, kind of ~

00:40:54.158 --> 00:40:55.979
you know, outside the outside the scope.

00:40:55.979 --> 00:40:59.191
I don't have a robust internal controls
and processes.

00:40:59.191 --> 00:41:02.684
It's like it's two people. ~ so anyways,

00:41:02.684 --> 00:41:05.045
I'll I'll pull that, I'll run a script to
do that,

00:41:05.045 --> 00:41:09.478
and then ~ and then then it's kind of then
kind of cleaning or doing like

00:41:09.478 --> 00:41:11.790
a budget to actuals process. How do I

00:41:11.567 --> 00:41:12.567
Mm.

00:41:11.790 --> 00:41:15.015
get how do I get my other owners to know
what the heck is going on?

00:41:15.015 --> 00:41:18.404
So or even my chaproom ~ hospitality
director.

00:41:18.692 --> 00:41:21.574
So it's like cool running run the budget
to actuals for the company,

00:41:21.574 --> 00:41:25.127
budget to actuals for our ~ for our
production and wholesale business,

00:41:25.127 --> 00:41:26.888
budget to actuals for our tap room.

00:41:26.888 --> 00:41:29.230
And then kind of along with that process,

00:41:29.230 --> 00:41:33.683
here's here's a scorecard that's again
another formatted kind of separate thing.

00:41:33.683 --> 00:41:37.396
Like most of the people I'm I love the
full you know PL.

00:41:37.396 --> 00:41:40.118
That's great. ~ but for most people,

00:41:40.118 --> 00:41:42.479
that's wildly overwhelming. Okay,

00:41:42.479 --> 00:41:45.932
how do I scorecard it, get kind of
different metrics that really matter?

00:41:46.486 --> 00:41:49.967
and that might even pull information
that's coming outside of you know

00:41:49.967 --> 00:41:51.828
a financial system. Okay, cool.

00:41:51.828 --> 00:41:58.299
I need an API to ~ to my my point of sale
software ~ for for the tap room.

00:41:58.299 --> 00:42:01.450
I need an API to my you know pickleball
court reservation software,

00:42:01.450 --> 00:42:03.051
you know, what hours are doing well?

00:42:03.051 --> 00:42:05.501
It's like, all right, cool, like let's
start building these Legos on

00:42:05.501 --> 00:42:07.162
top of each other. It's like great,

00:42:07.162 --> 00:42:08.602
then here's here's a scorecard.

00:42:08.602 --> 00:42:10.953
So it's like my my tap room manager,

00:42:10.953 --> 00:42:14.894
my kitchen lead, whoever can see these
numbers and like we're all

00:42:15.128 --> 00:42:16.999
Like this is the direction we want to go.

00:42:16.999 --> 00:42:20.042
Like, and then here's the measurements of
on how we're doing.

00:42:20.042 --> 00:42:22.263
~ and then and then on top of that,

00:42:22.263 --> 00:42:23.824
even for like my director of hospitality,

00:42:23.824 --> 00:42:25.746
which was super helpful, like he's like,

00:42:25.746 --> 00:42:26.967
wow, this is amazing. It's just like,

00:42:26.967 --> 00:42:30.890
here's a general ledger account dump of
like everything that you know hits these

00:42:30.890 --> 00:42:33.491
accounts. You're PNL, he's PL responsible.

00:42:33.491 --> 00:42:35.803
Here's your PL, here's your scorecard,

00:42:35.803 --> 00:42:37.895
and here's all if you want to search a
transaction,

00:42:37.895 --> 00:42:41.147
here's all the transaction, and here's a
little financial package I

00:42:41.147 --> 00:42:42.318
can give you every month.

00:42:42.584 --> 00:42:44.995
I can run it by month, I can ask it by
quarter,

00:42:44.995 --> 00:42:47.136
I can re-update the accounting,

00:42:47.136 --> 00:42:49.717
rerun the scripts and just like pump it
out again.

00:42:49.717 --> 00:42:52.026
So it's like trying to make these things
like,

00:42:52.026 --> 00:42:55.560
you know, in a in a Python script where
it's like something changes

00:42:55.680 --> 00:42:58.961
and then that can just run. And like I
don't even have any agents that

00:42:58.961 --> 00:43:02.043
are autonomously doing this. I'm sure that
that's the next step where it's like

00:43:02.123 --> 00:43:03.683
stuff changes or whatever else.

00:43:03.683 --> 00:43:06.355
Like, I'm sure it could run for me and do
some of these checks.

00:43:06.355 --> 00:43:09.346
Like I'll I'm I'll get there, but I'm not
sophisticated enough yet.

00:43:09.784 --> 00:43:13.015
And then really for us is the is the kind
of the ownership beyond the

00:43:13.015 --> 00:43:14.855
you know just kind of like what happened,

00:43:14.855 --> 00:43:17.516
like we need to figure out like what we're
gonna do next.

00:43:17.516 --> 00:43:20.547
~ and and basically like for us,

00:43:20.547 --> 00:43:23.258
like for as we've expanded across the
country,

00:43:23.258 --> 00:43:26.799
one thing that we haven't done a great job
of is figuring out,

00:43:26.799 --> 00:43:30.950
you know, what is and like I think
everybody needs to kind of shift to this
that

00:43:30.950 --> 00:43:33.771
if they haven't already, that's like what
is your what is your kind

00:43:33.771 --> 00:43:36.632
of your actual like margin contribution?

00:43:36.772 --> 00:43:43.667
margin dollars that you get on each skew
and then go further ~ by channel like what

00:43:43.331 --> 00:43:44.331
Mm-hmm.

00:43:43.667 --> 00:43:44.667
market

00:43:44.047 --> 00:43:45.948
is it going to? So like getting,

00:43:45.948 --> 00:43:47.315
you know, kind of looking at, you know,

00:43:47.315 --> 00:43:51.132
your your kind of your system and your
market and like figuring out like

00:43:51.132 --> 00:43:53.133
how do we how do we want to set this data
up?

00:43:53.133 --> 00:43:54.814
Cause like as we've gone through,

00:43:54.814 --> 00:43:58.136
I gosh, it feels like every year I feel
like I I've changed like

00:43:58.136 --> 00:44:01.108
our PNL structure to kind of like better
fit the business.

00:44:01.108 --> 00:44:04.371
Whereas like now I think I'm in like a
structure that can at least accommodate

00:44:04.371 --> 00:44:06.222
you know a lot more kind of growth.

00:44:06.804 --> 00:44:11.397
it's like we have each brand has kind of
like a revenue and cost side of thing,

00:44:11.397 --> 00:44:14.088
like that's broken out. ~ and then like,

00:44:14.088 --> 00:44:15.616
you know, kind of like a pet like if it's
either,

00:44:15.616 --> 00:44:18.131
you know, cans or or kegs or something
like that.

00:44:18.131 --> 00:44:20.642
Cause it's like every one of those choices
you make,

00:44:20.642 --> 00:44:23.224
you then have to track the costs for on
the back end too.

00:44:23.224 --> 00:44:24.904
Otherwise, kind of like what's the point?

00:44:24.904 --> 00:44:28.316
~ so it's like you kind of have you can't
just describe everything.

00:44:28.316 --> 00:44:30.388
You have to be choosy. so it's like,

00:44:30.388 --> 00:44:33.329
okay, that amount of work, I think that
that that works for us.

00:44:33.329 --> 00:44:34.540
And then it's like, all right.

00:44:34.680 --> 00:44:38.283
Wow, like I don't even know when I sell a
keg to California versus,

00:44:38.283 --> 00:44:41.855
you know, ~ you know, Iowa, what's
profitable?

00:44:41.855 --> 00:44:43.817
How do I how do I kind of tag that?

00:44:43.817 --> 00:44:45.919
So it's like we did it by state for a
while.

00:44:45.919 --> 00:44:47.490
It's like, well, I might have multiple
distributors,

00:44:47.490 --> 00:44:50.852
some might overlap. Like this isn't
actually functional for Jason to then

00:44:50.852 --> 00:44:52.814
go have conversations with distributors.

00:44:52.814 --> 00:44:56.377
So it's like, hey, if we're investing in
the market or we're not making money

00:44:56.377 --> 00:44:59.109
in the market and we're spending too much
on freight or something like that,

00:44:59.109 --> 00:45:00.790
like it's not just like, like,

00:45:01.108 --> 00:45:02.588
Iowa sucks. Like it's like, well,

00:45:02.588 --> 00:45:04.979
that doesn't help. Like we might have a
couple different distributors there.

00:45:04.979 --> 00:45:09.911
It's like, how about we then change our
class structure to then tag expenses,

00:45:09.911 --> 00:45:11.721
to tag, you know, all that type of stuff.

00:45:11.721 --> 00:45:14.962
Let's do it by market, which we consider
as like basically a distributor.

00:45:14.962 --> 00:45:17.212
or like a distributor has a bunch of
locations,

00:45:17.212 --> 00:45:19.273
like, okay, Wisconsin, like your six
distributors,

00:45:19.273 --> 00:45:21.504
like you're all the same. Like we're gonna
keep we're gonna put you in a bucket.

00:45:21.504 --> 00:45:23.054
So it's like kind of being, you know,

00:45:23.054 --> 00:45:26.565
myth like, I don't know, considerate about
how you wanna organize your data

00:45:26.685 --> 00:45:28.966
to then ~ you know, be able to then run

00:45:29.380 --> 00:45:31.451
For example, like what I'm working on
building,

00:45:31.451 --> 00:45:34.171
like literally, you know, right now is
like cool,

00:45:34.171 --> 00:45:38.883
like how do I have Claude then tell me ~
and I can run now a script

00:45:38.883 --> 00:45:40.193
I haven't I'm not I'm not there yet,

00:45:40.193 --> 00:45:42.454
but run a script to basically tell me I
want a

00:45:42.606 --> 00:45:46.225
breakdown of every SKU and the
profitability,

00:45:46.225 --> 00:45:48.815
like the margin dollars ~ by channel.

00:45:48.815 --> 00:45:53.127
~ and I want that every month for all the
products that were sold in the last month.

00:45:53.127 --> 00:45:56.748
How do we do? And that I think is gonna be
a little bit more real time for

00:45:56.748 --> 00:45:58.278
us to be better managing.

00:45:58.530 --> 00:46:01.112
fuel surcharges for freight to California.

00:46:01.112 --> 00:46:02.893
So then I can go tell my, you know,

00:46:02.893 --> 00:46:06.735
my logistics ~ you know guy in our
warehouse like,

00:46:06.735 --> 00:46:11.948
hey like like we you know these SKUs you
have some flexibility on these ones don't

00:46:11.948 --> 00:46:15.961
do that. How can we reorganize and and
kind of change our our shipping processes

00:46:15.961 --> 00:46:20.364
to be actually profitable for things
because you know you just you can't

00:46:20.764 --> 00:46:23.796
you can't let you know kind of some of the
the dead weights drag you down.

00:46:24.382 --> 00:46:25.382
~ you have

00:46:24.640 --> 00:46:25.640
Yeah.

00:46:25.024 --> 00:46:27.139
to have all of your if like that's why
you're business.

00:46:27.139 --> 00:46:29.614
You have to have all these things actually
make sense and be adding

00:46:29.735 --> 00:46:32.140
~ additive for you. So I kinda rambled,

00:46:31.534 --> 00:46:32.855
You said no,

00:46:32.140 --> 00:46:33.140
so I'll I'll stop.

00:46:32.855 --> 00:46:34.285
that was perfect that's perfect.

00:46:34.285 --> 00:46:40.167
You you said one thing I wanna circle back
on is working in the business rather than

00:46:40.188 --> 00:46:43.149
on the business. And ~ it

00:46:42.458 --> 00:46:43.458
Flip that.

00:46:43.164 --> 00:46:45.970
I'm sorry, on the business, not in the
business.

00:46:46.052 --> 00:46:47.052
Mm.

00:46:46.430 --> 00:46:51.002
So yeah, explain that a little bit more
and and I guess related to this

00:46:51.002 --> 00:46:55.704
is in my mind everyone has kind of this
journey of w how how do

00:46:55.704 --> 00:47:01.076
you first start using it and then how does
using it allow you to

00:47:01.380 --> 00:47:03.151
I wouldn't say add more complexity,

00:47:03.151 --> 00:47:09.626
but maybe more detail to what you were
already doing before in such

00:47:09.626 --> 00:47:14.769
a way that you can get higher quality
answers or you can get closer to

00:47:14.769 --> 00:47:17.211
a version of what you're trying to
actually accomplish,

00:47:17.211 --> 00:47:19.813
whereas before it wouldn't have been
possible for you,

00:47:19.813 --> 00:47:21.794
David, just to do that all on your own.

00:47:21.794 --> 00:47:22.845
So ~ I'd

00:47:22.447 --> 00:47:23.447
Right.

00:47:22.845 --> 00:47:24.386
love to hear a little bit more about that.

00:47:25.220 --> 00:47:29.861
Yeah. well I think just kind of the the
just to that last part with like

00:47:29.861 --> 00:47:31.312
the detail kind of side of things.

00:47:31.312 --> 00:47:34.133
Like if I was gonna do profit
contribution,

00:47:34.133 --> 00:47:36.593
you know, by skew, you know, by channel,

00:47:36.593 --> 00:47:40.754
I might be able to do that once a quarter,

00:47:40.754 --> 00:47:43.065
couple times a year, kind of do some of

00:47:42.403 --> 00:47:43.403
Mm, mm.

00:47:43.065 --> 00:47:46.036
these pulse checks. And maybe for the size
of our business,

00:47:46.036 --> 00:47:47.716
maybe for the complexity of our business,

00:47:47.716 --> 00:47:49.837
maybe that's okay. And like, hey,

00:47:49.837 --> 00:47:50.927
I'm I'm not like kind of like,

00:47:50.927 --> 00:47:53.538
you know, di- d getting all like little
data points that I'm

00:47:53.678 --> 00:47:56.779
probably not necessarily making wild
decisions and changes off of,

00:47:56.779 --> 00:48:02.202
maybe that's fine. ~ but it's it's still a
it's still a burden to process and do.

00:48:02.202 --> 00:48:06.574
And if I can set up my system to whether
it's doing it monthly or doing

00:48:06.574 --> 00:48:07.974
it a couple of times a year to be like,

00:48:07.974 --> 00:48:11.296
hey guys, you know, we're resetting we're
resetting pricing for distributors,

00:48:11.296 --> 00:48:14.067
probably, you know, once, maybe twice a
year.

00:48:14.067 --> 00:48:17.568
so it's like as long as I've got the
information for doing those,

00:48:17.568 --> 00:48:19.509
you know, kind of types of thing within
the business,

00:48:19.509 --> 00:48:21.750
great. So it's like the AI can help me do
that.

00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:24.811
but working working in the business versus
on it,

00:48:24.811 --> 00:48:30.753
~ I mean, like the in the business is like
you're managing your email.

00:48:30.753 --> 00:48:34.164
All the crap, all the storms, all the you
know,

00:48:34.164 --> 00:48:36.864
distributor issues, product is,

00:48:36.864 --> 00:48:41.376
you know, has an issue, ~ transportation
didn't show up,

00:48:41.376 --> 00:48:45.327
whatever. All the like the the Monday
morning like fires,

00:48:45.327 --> 00:48:47.918
the fire drills, that's all in the
business type of stuff.

00:48:47.918 --> 00:48:49.228
And anytime that like

00:48:49.602 --> 00:48:51.803
I'm trying to learn how to get a,

00:48:51.803 --> 00:48:54.013
you know, how to have Claude, you know,

00:48:54.013 --> 00:48:59.625
automatically run, you know, pull an API
of data and then run a script that adds,

00:48:59.625 --> 00:49:02.426
you know, kind of some type of like
dashboard or insight for me,

00:49:02.426 --> 00:49:07.767
like that I can then repeatedly do and
like that changes the way that I work,

00:49:07.767 --> 00:49:10.808
like that's on the business. So ~

00:49:08.076 --> 00:49:10.465
Mm-hmm. Got it.

00:49:11.668 --> 00:49:14.789
you can't it's a balance. ~ you know,

00:49:14.789 --> 00:49:17.400
I try to as much as possible, you know.

00:49:17.688 --> 00:49:20.659
be working on the business, but like the
reality is it's like

00:49:20.659 --> 00:49:22.761
I'm probably working way more within it.

00:49:22.761 --> 00:49:27.293
~ and it's like, okay, then can I find can
I have somebody else hire them

00:49:27.293 --> 00:49:28.934
to do some of the in-person stuff?

00:49:28.934 --> 00:49:31.235
It's like, yeah, you can do like there's
plenty of,

00:49:31.235 --> 00:49:32.786
you know, things that you can do that for.

00:49:32.786 --> 00:49:34.662
But it's also kind of an art of like,

00:49:34.662 --> 00:49:36.048
you know, what are you giving up?

00:49:36.048 --> 00:49:38.249
Like what and do you have kind of your,

00:49:38.249 --> 00:49:41.491
you know, process is set up or controls
kind of in place where,

00:49:41.491 --> 00:49:43.822
you know, that person is set up for
success to do that.

00:49:43.822 --> 00:49:46.894
Or are you now disconnected? Or if you
give that away,

00:49:46.894 --> 00:49:47.894
like

00:49:47.268 --> 00:49:49.599
How do you stay in touch? So like a great
example would be like,

00:49:49.599 --> 00:49:53.621
I do not run the day to day of our tap
room at all.

00:49:53.621 --> 00:50:00.265
Like I am out of it. That is like it is a
it is death by a thousand cuts.

00:50:00.265 --> 00:50:02.076
It is the definition of a constant

00:50:01.389 --> 00:50:02.389
Uh-huh.

00:50:02.076 --> 00:50:05.008
treadmill of working within the business
because you have customers come

00:50:05.008 --> 00:50:07.039
in and like they're never fully satisfied.

00:50:07.039 --> 00:50:09.130
You can always extend more hospitality.

00:50:09.130 --> 00:50:11.925
So like it's just, you know, there's the
ball is keep getting,

00:50:11.925 --> 00:50:13.373
you know, you pulled away from you.

00:50:13.373 --> 00:50:15.904
~ so for me to be able to like

00:50:16.190 --> 00:50:18.371
release that and feel comfortable.

00:50:17.648 --> 00:50:18.648
Mm.

00:50:18.611 --> 00:50:22.732
Like, I don't know. I'm I'm the type of
person who sees a lot of things through

00:50:22.732 --> 00:50:24.652
a financial lens. That's how I kind of
like,

00:50:24.652 --> 00:50:28.464
you know, like grab a hold of something
and like kind of understand

00:50:28.464 --> 00:50:30.314
it and feel comfortable. So it's like for
me,

00:50:30.314 --> 00:50:32.015
it's like there's that process that I was
talking about.

00:50:32.015 --> 00:50:34.535
Cool. I can run financials, I can do
scorecards,

00:50:34.535 --> 00:50:36.716
I can give these things to my my kind of
manager.

00:50:36.716 --> 00:50:39.627
And it's like I literally had this
conversation yesterday and it's like,

00:50:39.627 --> 00:50:41.997
gosh, like our pickleball sales are
dropping off.

00:50:41.997 --> 00:50:43.738
What's going on within the market?

00:50:43.738 --> 00:50:44.738
Like

00:50:44.280 --> 00:50:46.412
You know, like and and trying to explore
that.

00:50:46.412 --> 00:50:48.373
It's like, all right, our leagues are kind
of dropping off.

00:50:48.373 --> 00:50:49.814
We're losing competitive players.

00:50:49.814 --> 00:50:51.695
Well, that's fine that we're losing
competitive players.

00:50:51.695 --> 00:50:53.036
We're kind of more of the social spot.

00:50:53.036 --> 00:50:54.748
But then like kind of ideating with them
of like,

00:50:54.748 --> 00:50:57.680
you know, how do we ~ like kind of
providing direction of like,

00:50:57.680 --> 00:50:59.881
okay, how do we how do we garner more
private leagues?

00:50:59.881 --> 00:51:01.312
How do we, you know, reach like,

00:51:01.312 --> 00:51:02.963
my gosh, like do it like the business
community,

00:51:02.963 --> 00:51:05.725
whatever. Like you can kind of start to go
into kind of different things.

00:51:05.725 --> 00:51:06.725
So it's like I

00:51:06.244 --> 00:51:07.244
~

00:51:06.556 --> 00:51:08.467
can kind of provide like, you know,

00:51:08.467 --> 00:51:11.970
these these kind of ~ there's I have
enough insight.

00:51:12.206 --> 00:51:14.627
to give me context as to what's going on,

00:51:14.627 --> 00:51:18.488
to then prompt really good questions and
conversation for then the people that I've

00:51:18.488 --> 00:51:20.388
got, you know, actually doing the day to
day,

00:51:20.388 --> 00:51:24.030
~ to then like kind of continue to give
them guidance and direction

00:51:24.030 --> 00:51:26.550
and make sure that they're kind of pointed
in the right direction

00:51:26.550 --> 00:51:27.901
and we're working on, you know,

00:51:27.901 --> 00:51:30.391
~ working on things that I think are going
to be productive.

00:51:30.391 --> 00:51:31.822
But then it's also having great people,

00:51:31.822 --> 00:51:32.842
you know, kind of in those spots.

00:51:32.842 --> 00:51:36.323
So it's it's it's an art. I don't have any
there's no secret sauce to that.

00:51:36.323 --> 00:51:38.194
It's it's a thing that you're constantly
working at.

00:51:38.194 --> 00:51:39.194
So

00:51:38.852 --> 00:51:41.854
But you try and have that infrastructure
in place so you can do some

00:51:41.854 --> 00:51:45.936
of the other processing that then makes
your working in the business easier.

00:51:45.936 --> 00:51:49.698
So if I if I can do the script that gives
me the information to help

00:51:49.698 --> 00:51:52.329
me better manage the the day-to-day in the
business,

00:51:52.329 --> 00:51:55.381
then like then I don't have to be in the
business as much.

00:51:55.381 --> 00:51:58.953
I'm I'm like freeing myself. And I think
entrepreneurs in general,

00:51:58.953 --> 00:52:01.554
like they just kind of like entrepreneurs
are very,

00:52:01.554 --> 00:52:03.515
you know, like out there and get shit
done,

00:52:03.515 --> 00:52:06.437
but they're also like, I don't want to do
something twice.

00:52:06.437 --> 00:52:08.258
That's like that's boring. Like

00:52:07.342 --> 00:52:08.342
That's key.

00:52:08.728 --> 00:52:11.480
I don't like and I'm an op like Jason's
more shiny object.

00:52:11.480 --> 00:52:13.972
I'm a more operator. Like I can do things
more than once,

00:52:13.972 --> 00:52:17.425
but like but like man, if we have really
good work on you know,

00:52:17.425 --> 00:52:20.908
on the business to make things that we
don't have to do all the time,

00:52:20.908 --> 00:52:23.630
like entrepreneurs love that. So like
we're really good,

00:52:23.630 --> 00:52:27.853
I think, in that as like a ~ like as a
kind of an industry or kind

00:52:27.853 --> 00:52:29.024
of like a headspace of people.

00:52:29.444 --> 00:52:32.505
There there no, I think I mean it's it's
really interesting you say that 'cause

00:52:32.505 --> 00:52:34.468
I I f I I feel of two minds about it,

00:52:34.468 --> 00:52:36.210
that sometimes an entrepreneur,

00:52:36.210 --> 00:52:39.383
and I wouldn't I wouldn't call myself an
entrepreneur in the way that you all are,

00:52:39.383 --> 00:52:42.155
but everyone in this business is at some
level.

00:52:42.155 --> 00:52:48.300
There can be sometimes a ~ falling in love
with

00:52:48.300 --> 00:52:52.514
the process of doing things that if you
really ask yourself like

00:52:52.910 --> 00:52:55.482
If I'm gonna be doing this more than once
today,

00:52:55.482 --> 00:52:59.275
in today's age, there's no reason why I
need to do it more than once.

00:52:59.275 --> 00:53:02.088
I can do it once, teach a machine how to
do it,

00:53:02.088 --> 00:53:03.479
and I don't have to do it again.

00:53:03.479 --> 00:53:05.851
Now, maybe I like to do certain things,

00:53:05.851 --> 00:53:09.134
and so then that that that gives me more
time for that.

00:53:09.134 --> 00:53:11.736
But really asking yourself that question.

00:53:11.736 --> 00:53:14.819
So the the maybe to to wrap this up,

00:53:14.819 --> 00:53:19.903
I've heard about ~ a bit from Jason as far
as the communication elements,

00:53:19.903 --> 00:53:21.044
and I'd call it

00:53:21.146 --> 00:53:24.639
Call that the business to business part of
where AI has been helpful.

00:53:24.639 --> 00:53:28.843
We are going to circle back at the final
bit of this to to ~ dive in on that

00:53:28.843 --> 00:53:30.785
of what you guys have built. David,

00:53:30.785 --> 00:53:35.409
you've talked a lot about the internal
processes that you have been able

00:53:35.409 --> 00:53:38.031
to build or that has unlocked as a result
of AI.

00:53:38.031 --> 00:53:42.915
But just as a clarification, does that
should I take that to mean that from like

00:53:42.915 --> 00:53:44.857
a business to consumer standpoint,

00:53:44.857 --> 00:53:45.857
is that

00:53:45.658 --> 00:53:47.259
maybe ~ a less

00:53:48.910 --> 00:53:53.700
less trodden ground for you when it comes
to AI or or are you also doing things

00:53:53.700 --> 00:53:54.762
in that realm as well?

00:57:44.625 --> 00:57:48.320
we'll so so to to wrap things up,

00:57:48.320 --> 00:57:52.913
we have decided as a collective team that
we don't necessarily want

00:57:52.913 --> 00:57:54.724
to show live data on some of this.

00:57:54.724 --> 00:58:01.489
So ~ what we're gonna do is ask the Trail
Magic team to basically replicate what

00:58:01.489 --> 00:58:07.073
they have but with dummy data and we will
include that in this podcast

00:58:07.093 --> 00:58:08.093
in the show notes.

00:58:08.970 --> 00:58:13.033
Great. Well thank you both so much for
participating in this.

00:58:13.033 --> 00:58:15.596
Jason, especially you dealing with the
Texas Heats.

00:58:15.596 --> 00:58:17.791
myself, I know a thing or two about that.

00:58:17.791 --> 00:58:24.147
So ~ keep your AC on and ~ thank you both
for all that

00:58:24.147 --> 00:58:28.741
you do and thanks for listening everybody
to another episode of

00:58:29.021 --> 00:58:30.242
the Delta Dispatch Podcast.

00:58:31.429 --> 00:58:32.429
Thanks again.