Episode # 27 - Interview with Erin Griffo

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from the plush recording studios for iida alabama this is all in design so Hello and welcome to All In Design, IAD Alabama's podcast.
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My name's Chad Moore here with my co-host, Mark Griffo.
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Hey, everybody.
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And welcome to season two.
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Woo, season two.
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Season two, which means nothing really.
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Yeah, nothing's really good.
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It means we've been doing this
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for a
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year.
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A year, I know.
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So I think it was February.
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12th?
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It might have been yesterday was when the first one launched.
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Yeah.
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Okay.
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Which was your anniversary.
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Yep.
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Right?
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Yeah.
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Happy anniversary.
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Yeah, we launched it on your anniversary.
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That was intentional.
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To me, just me.
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Yeah, just you.
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Which I guess is a transition.
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And maybe, you know, season two, you know, I was trying to think like what we might be doing differently this season versus last season.
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And if this episode's any indication, then we're just going to have people that we're related to or, you know, are part of our family.
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Yeah, there we go.
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We'll just do that the whole year.
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I think that's a good plan.
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All right.
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It's going to be a whole new show.
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So, Mark, I don't know if you know this person well or not, but if you will do the honors of introducing them.
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I am very happy to.
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Yeah, so I know this person pretty well.
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She has been mentioned many times on the show, many times.
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She said, damn it, I'm coming on.
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And
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finally, she was like, you better get me, book me, book me on the show.
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Yeah, I mentioned her so many times.
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You've
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been speaking for me.
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Now I'm going to speak
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for myself and correct
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the
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record.
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Exactly.
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We're not going to let her talk, though.
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We're just going to keep talking at the start of the show.
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But yeah, so many times I mentioned to her that she told me to stop talking about her.
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And I think I did.
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I think toward the end of last season, I kind of gave up.
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An episode or two.
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Anyway, but before she gets too bored with you and me talking to ourselves, I am so happy to introduce my wife, Erin Griffo.
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But we're not here to talk about you being my wife.
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We're here to talk about you.
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I don't know why.
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Yeah, exactly.
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We can.
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So Erin is a Senior Healthcare Interior Designer at Gresham Smith here in Birmingham.
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And we are very excited to have you on the show finally and to kick off season two.
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So welcome.
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Thank you.
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I am glad to finally make an actual appearance and not just be talked about behind my back and recorded and put on for the world to hear.
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Well, we wouldn't be talking behind your back if you listened to the show.
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Snap.
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Chad's like, too soon, too soon.
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It's gotten really tense in here.
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Anyway.
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Starting out hot.
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Anyway,
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we'll go back to our regularly scheduled structure.
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And now that I've introduced you, if you would like to talk a little bit about yourself, you know, where you went to school, how you got into design, and just a little potted bio on you.
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That's my
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favorite thing to do, is to talk about myself.
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Yeah,
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good.
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Yeah, great.
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Come to the right
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place.
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Yeah.
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So, yes, I'm a senior healthcare interior designer.
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I did not necessarily always think I wanted to be an interior designer, and I got into it in college.
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I went to Alabama, and I was a part of New College.
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I don't know if you're familiar with New College.
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Do you want to tell people about it?
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Yep, sure do.
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Okay.
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So it is an interdisciplinary program.
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So if the university does not offer the degree that you want, or if you want to craft your own degree and curriculum, you go through New College.
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And it's seminar-based for a lot of very highly creative people that have very specific passions and ideas of what they want to do.
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Anyway, very cool program, like some of the smartest people I've ever met.
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I met their great professors.
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But I was creating a degree based in, like, design, geology, engineering, and kind of creating a sustainable design program.
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type of degree.
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Okay, so high school student, senior year, going to Alabama, and did you have any idea?
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So
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part of that was that I did not know exactly what I wanted because they didn't, I knew they didn't offer exactly what I wanted.
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There was no geology, interior design.
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There was no Indiana Jones major.
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Oh my gosh, the
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dream job.
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Yeah, so I started out in New College.
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Okay.
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And because I knew I wanted to do something creative.
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Okay.
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And I love science and I love– so that's kind of where– like I had a counselor and a professor that kind of helped me shape what that was going to be.
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So I spent two years in New College.
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Then– found out that I would not be able to come from an accredited program of any kind because I would be going that way.
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I'm just making it up.
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Like, what do you want to do?
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What's your major?
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Well...
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So, yeah, totally qualified to make it up.
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But it is a really awesome program.
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So, anyway, that was when I transferred to interior design and definitely knew I wanted to do commercial work and while i was in school and then got out moved to atlanta and worked at a firm that is wonderful but did a lot of hotel work okay and i was like immediately like nah not for me um and so
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what was it about it
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was Now, I was an entry-level designer, so I do realize that there is a lot more depth to hotel design than what I was doing.
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Right.
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You can talk trash about hotel design.
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Oh, stop.
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I was doing a lot of residence zooms.
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Oh, okay.
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Cool.
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Yeah.
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When you're like saying, you know, that kind of design, that was not where my mind was.
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And when you say residence, I was like, oh, well, I understand why you got
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it.
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Well, that was, and that was like the bread and butter type of work.
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And then I did work on a couple of like boutique hotels, but like for whatever reason, I just did not click with like doing the furniture package.
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No offense to either of you.
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We
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don't work for residence in, so it's fine.
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Yeah.
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So I don't know.
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It just did not click.
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with me I did not I know that I'm a passionate person and I just wasn't feeling it in my job so it I knew pretty early on that I needed to move on and then worked at Interior Architects and that was where I had my first experience with the health care project and definitely clicked with that and so from there I moved to Birmingham and worked at Carlsberger which is no longer but they had been around forever and uh, healthcare firm.
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Um,
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was that your first foray into healthcare?
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That was my first actual work.
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Um, not just a one-off project doing healthcare design and I loved it.
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And then, and, and also like even in high school, like I remember doing like, I can't remember what the class would have been, but I was doing like clinical design.
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clinicals that we would do like twice a week at the hospital and I worked in the lab in the pathology lab and I'm like oh my god I love this but also knew that I was wanting to do something creative so it was always kind of this pull of do I do something in medicine or do I do
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something
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didn't make that connection until I worked at a health care firm though that like oh yeah this is a thing that I can do.
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Well, yeah, it sounded like you were interested in science.
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Yes.
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And, you know, there's the geology thing.
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I mean, obviously.
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Yeah, but so, I mean, geology always ties in.
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I can see where there's maybe, yeah, a tie-in of the left brain, right brain.
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Yes, most definitely.
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And so, anyway, I had, the more I was doing healthcare design, the more that I was being able to relate it to myself, my interests, for one, but, like, I've got, like, my life experience with the healthcare system and being able to make those connections.
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It just felt like what I was doing could really, like I could bring a lot to the table from my personal experience.
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I felt a connection to it.
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It was also, yeah, like had my brain firing in all the ways that I wanted it to.
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So, um, Just fast forward for...
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Carlsberger, right?
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Yes.
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And then?
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And then I met Jim Griffo.
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And who is Jim Griffo?
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At Gresham Smith.
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This guy, I'm not really sure what he's doing now.
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I would love to know.
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When's he coming on?
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Is he next?
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He may have to be next,
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yeah.
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Yeah, and I met him through someone in the industry.
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He was like, you've got to meet...
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Jim Griffo.
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I was like, I don't want to work for a large firm.
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So snooty.
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The man.
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I don't want the man to hold me down.
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And she was like, just meet him.
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I think you'll like him.
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And then sure enough, I went to Gresham Smith, met with Jim, and like 20 minutes in, I was like, oh my God, I've got to work for this guy.
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Loved him immediately.
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So Fortunately, I was hired at Gresham Smith at that point.
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And that, I do feel like, even though I had been working for a while, I do feel like my career and just kind of all the things came together when I started at Gresham Smith.
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And that's where I have invested the rest of my career.
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So how long before you– how long you had been working before you started at Gresham?
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So you graduate and then, I mean
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– That is– Eight years.
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Six, eight years, something like that,
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yeah.
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And then you've been at Gresham now for how long?
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Over 13, yeah, 13 or 14.
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Okay.
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So you like it.
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So I like it.
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It's exciting.
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Yes, and that, like, our Birmingham studio is very focused in healthcare design.
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Gresham Smith does all markets, but...
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So anyway, I've just kind of been able to shape what my career has become at Gresham
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Smith.
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Yeah.
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And not to...
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derail the conversation but since you are married how did and you were working for his father
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yeah oh yes
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so where are you going with this I would just think people would find that interesting like how did that when did you meet Mark and how did that start was Jim still there when you guys were dating and how did that
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progress good questions yeah okay we met I had been working there for like a couple of years before we met and We met at an open house Christmas party because the Griffo's had done a renovation on their fabulous house.
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So for the Gresham Smith Christmas party, we're going to do an open house.
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Everybody go there.
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So I had just learned to tie a bow tie, and I was really proud of myself.
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It was a very random, just curious, let me learn how to do that, very useful skill.
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Well, if you need to know.
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But I also
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love how people were like, where is this going?
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Yeah.
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So it was a Christmas party, and I learned how to tie a bow
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tie.
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It's just, when I think about when we met.
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What you didn't know was that Mark loves bow ties.
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Yeah.
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This is really the connection.
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And when I think about it, we met I really do like that is I I in no other circumstance but I remember what I was wearing you know what I mean but I remember that I was wearing my brand new If I'm going to wear a bow tie, I'm going to wear it to the Christmas party.
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And my little sweater and bow tie, it was killer.
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It was a very Diane Lane look.
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I don't want people out there thinking Bozo the Clown.
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Oh, yeah.
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No, it was a very...
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Yes.
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It was elegant.
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Your shoes were huge.
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It was perfect.
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The little horn was obnoxious.
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This is never going to work out.
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And so Mark was there.
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Mark was trying very hard to not make it obvious that he lived there.
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Wow.
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Are
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we recording, Chad?
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But that's where we met.
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And maybe a few months later, you had come out with like a group of us at the office, just like to paramount or something.
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Poppy and I had
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become friends.
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Yeah, that's right.
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Poppy.
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Yeah.
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And so that's, we just kind of start hanging out from there.
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And then, so then we start kind of breaking off and doing our own hanging out.
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And I was so, weird about it um in a lot of ways but um i did not want anybody to know at the office sure yeah because yes jim was still there he was also our office leader so like he was no question my boss everybody else's boss
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yeah um so everyone else that knew was complicit
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yeah right right
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yeah
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So I was like, don't you dare tell anybody, and do not let your father find out.
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Yeah.
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He still doesn't know.
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So dramatic.
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Ten years later.
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And then one day, you did tell your dad, and he was just like, what, do you think I'm stupid?
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Yeah, it was a
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very, like, Jim Griffo response, because, yeah, he just has the uncanny ability of, one, keeping his words short and simple, and then also just knowing, being in the know.
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And so, yeah, I'd called him up and was like, I just need to tell you.
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We've been dating for several months at the time.
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And we're both grown people.
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We're adults.
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We're not like in our early 20s.
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I mean, we were grown.
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Didn't matter where I lived.
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And obviously, you didn't care where I lived.
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So, still gotcha.
00:15:19.235 --> 00:15:21.758
And yeah, I got done with this whole thing to dad.
00:15:21.837 --> 00:15:24.181
And then he was just like, yeah, I know.
00:15:24.522 --> 00:15:25.121
You think I'm stupid?
00:15:25.363 --> 00:15:27.705
And you weren't in the industry yet at that point.
00:15:27.725 --> 00:15:28.405
I was not.
00:15:28.446 --> 00:15:30.688
I was still at the museum at the time.
00:15:30.948 --> 00:15:31.188
So...
00:15:32.129 --> 00:15:34.011
And now look at us.
00:15:34.152 --> 00:15:35.712
Now look at us around this table.
00:15:36.634 --> 00:15:38.115
Now an industry power couple.
00:15:38.235 --> 00:15:38.875
Oh, totally.
00:15:38.975 --> 00:15:42.339
Totally, yeah.
00:15:42.359 --> 00:15:46.001
I'm pretty sure Vince Morgan has actually said that
00:15:46.982 --> 00:15:47.182
before.
00:15:47.243 --> 00:15:49.024
To circle back, I guess, to design.
00:15:50.066 --> 00:15:53.128
We'll delve back into your relationship more later.
00:15:54.870 --> 00:15:55.890
The second half of the interview.
00:15:55.931 --> 00:15:56.091
One
00:15:56.130 --> 00:16:06.500
of the things with our questionnaire that we send out that you mentioned the word experience came up over and over and over and over again in different sentences.
00:16:07.162 --> 00:16:13.730
And I think it goes back to how you answered, are there any specific design styles or themes that you're particularly passionate about?
00:16:13.769 --> 00:16:16.052
And you wrote empathetic design.
00:16:16.173 --> 00:16:19.096
Would you mind talking about what that is and how you implement that?
00:16:20.037 --> 00:16:20.457
Certainly.
00:16:20.498 --> 00:17:16.916
So, yeah, one of just in general approach and what I find interesting about design is that it can be influence an experience in so many ways and that it does whether you want it to or not it's going to influence the experience of a space and just how powerful that can be and you can use it to influence in different ways for different reasons and that has just always been very fascinating to me so going back to just the idea of healthcare design and what kind of impact that can have on people and their experience in something that is almost always not a great experience and different levels of that, that I love the idea of knowing...
00:17:17.538 --> 00:17:33.758
that if you practice with empathy and really try to understand who you're designing for and why and what the needs are, that you can actually impact what an individual is experiencing for the better.
00:17:33.778 --> 00:18:24.913
And, you know, the way I look at it, too, is just, and maybe this is because of, like, a personal reflection and experience, experience with health care um on the personal side that it doesn't have to like i look at it like it doesn't have to affect the masses if you impact one person's experience when they're going through something that is not not good uh that should be worth it it should not take that you are um you know changing the world and i think that you know the idea of empathetic design And knowing that that's how you reach people is really trying to understand where they're coming from, what they're going through.
00:18:24.952 --> 00:18:34.349
And then just back to the whole idea of like the science and puzzle and all of that behind it that also is so interesting to me.
00:18:34.390 --> 00:18:38.037
It's just cool to know.
00:18:39.041 --> 00:18:41.349
how much of an impact you can make with interior design.
00:18:41.391 --> 00:18:56.566
And then just in terms of how I practice, empathetic design is a term that has been used a lot in recent years, but It's really played a part in how I've practiced my entire career in healthcare design.
00:18:56.625 --> 00:18:58.347
So I'm glad that there's a name.
00:18:58.587 --> 00:19:05.753
It's something people are talking about, but it kind of impacts every part of what I do in my process.
00:19:06.134 --> 00:19:06.234
Right.
00:19:06.734 --> 00:19:06.875
Yeah.
00:19:06.894 --> 00:19:16.963
I mean, I think healthcare, especially, I mean, people that are going in either because they've got, you know, that family members, you know, need something done or so they may be there.
00:19:17.003 --> 00:19:21.208
They're just not, there's nothing with them personally, but they're caring about somebody else that's there.
00:19:21.288 --> 00:19:31.644
Or if it's you personally going in I mean it's such a vulnerable space I mean you're at your most vulnerable it seems like going into a health care environment and so if I think if any environment needs empathy it's that one
00:19:32.905 --> 00:19:42.076
yes and a lot of times you know there's a lack of control or most yeah right in most senses you are You have no control.
00:19:42.096 --> 00:19:42.236
You're
00:19:42.256 --> 00:19:44.759
releasing all your total control to other people's hands.
00:19:44.779 --> 00:19:45.320
Yes, exactly.
00:19:45.401 --> 00:19:45.580
Right.
00:19:45.902 --> 00:19:54.394
Yeah, and where you're supposed to be and where you're supposed to sit and when you can go here and how you go, you know, you're there by appointment and you don't go through these doors until you're told to go through these doors.
00:19:54.414 --> 00:20:01.505
And then, like, what diagnosis you're about to get or what the next year of your life is going to look like.
00:20:01.525 --> 00:20:08.296
All of those things that are going through people's minds when they are in a waiting room waiting to see the doctor.
00:20:08.395 --> 00:20:09.758
Right.
00:20:10.049 --> 00:20:13.756
I can get myself lost in thought when thinking about those kinds of things.
00:20:13.895 --> 00:20:15.939
I'm just like, God, that's pretty powerful.
00:20:16.400 --> 00:20:25.733
And if there's a little bit of something that we can do as designers to make that a little bit easier, then that's pretty cool.
00:20:25.875 --> 00:20:26.095
Yeah,
00:20:26.375 --> 00:20:26.536
yeah.
00:20:26.855 --> 00:20:35.869
So when you're talking to your clients, I mean, are they already on the same page with that, or is that something you can help bring them along with you?
00:20:36.642 --> 00:20:39.425
I don't know if that was a very eloquent question.
00:20:39.507 --> 00:20:40.468
I think I know what you're asking.
00:20:40.548 --> 00:20:42.490
She's going to correct her grammar.
00:20:44.875 --> 00:20:49.041
If I'm not answering the right question, stop me, because I do want to answer the right question.
00:20:49.082 --> 00:21:02.162
But I think usually when I'm talking to a client, they absolutely understand, and they are in health care for a reason, too.
00:21:02.663 --> 00:21:17.750
And, of course, there is– There are different positions and leadership and things, but for the most part, people are in healthcare with some sort of capacity for empathy and they want the best for their patients.
00:21:18.069 --> 00:21:33.023
So I do think that it's a good partnership and I think that they appreciate when people come in and can acknowledge that that's a part of it and that we're not just there to spend their money to make it look good.
00:21:33.565 --> 00:21:35.165
Right.
00:21:35.362 --> 00:21:37.547
you're putting people first and their clients first,
00:21:37.788 --> 00:21:37.988
right?
00:21:39.412 --> 00:21:50.156
So in the 14 years or so that you've been at Gresham, has there been a lot of change in healthcare design relative to your understanding of it?
00:21:50.759 --> 00:21:51.460
Does that make sense?
00:21:53.473 --> 00:21:56.176
Your ambiguous questions are great.
00:21:57.137 --> 00:21:59.421
You looked at both of us.
00:21:59.480 --> 00:22:04.346
Only because I feel like I just was saying something like that, and I don't mean to say that.
00:22:04.465 --> 00:22:09.731
But, yes, so, I mean, of course, health care design has absolutely evolved.
00:22:09.971 --> 00:22:14.637
I mean, that's one thing that I love about health care design, too, is that you never get bored.
00:22:15.157 --> 00:22:19.262
It is constantly evolving in big ways, small ways.
00:22:19.923 --> 00:22:27.990
And So, yes, the evolution has been pretty dramatic in some ways.
00:22:28.030 --> 00:22:43.935
So for a long time now, the idea of more hospitality-focused interiors has been something that has definitely been– has grown over the past couple of decades.
00:22:44.557 --> 00:22:48.403
Then, like, evidence-based design, again, you know, that's been going on for a while.
00:22:48.423 --> 00:23:02.317
It has– become more part of the vocabulary in the past five, ten years, but that has been part of a practice for decades.
00:23:04.101 --> 00:23:18.074
So that in itself is all about adding to the field in terms of knowledge and then growing that knowledge based on research and things like that.
00:23:18.173 --> 00:23:22.041
So there's going to be an evolution, there's going to be change the more research you do.
00:23:22.201 --> 00:23:30.218
So that in itself is just going to make the field of healthcare design change over time.
00:23:30.919 --> 00:23:38.028
Can you, so for the people who don't know, talk, just kind of explain a little bit what evidence-based design is.
00:23:38.068 --> 00:24:04.751
You've touched on it there in that answer, but just so the people that don't know, and just, you know, this is part of the shows where, like, I wish there was, like, kind of, we had, you know, 150 listeners, you know, rather than 100, just because I was at an event the other day that was, it was not an industry event, and we were kind of meeting new people and, like, you know, meeting your spouse and what your spouse is doing and everything like that, and I mentioned that you were a healthcare interior designer, and the person was not being rude or anything like that.
00:24:04.751 --> 00:24:09.336
but like you just tell immediately they were just like, okay, healthcare interior design, like what's that?
00:24:09.856 --> 00:24:09.936
Yeah.
00:24:09.957 --> 00:24:11.098
And, um, like that's hard.
00:24:11.439 --> 00:24:11.679
Yeah.
00:24:11.719 --> 00:24:20.608
They're like, they're like, and it's just, and so I think, you know, when, like when you're talking about evidence-based design, that that's like really important for people to understand the backing there and what that means.
00:24:21.710 --> 00:24:21.930
Yeah.
00:24:22.349 --> 00:24:39.779
And the other thing that you just made me think of too, is that that term and that practice is starting to make its way into other types of design too, which I think is really great because again, like, it's all about knowledge it's not about necessarily health care it's about so what evidence-based design is uh...
00:24:40.881 --> 00:24:53.854
using that knowledge to to make the best decisions to create the best outcomes so it's just not working in a vacuum uh...
00:24:54.934 --> 00:24:59.638
there's a lot of it that has to do with making a business case uh...
00:24:59.739 --> 00:25:35.355
for design decisions and that it is every decision is tied back to a reason and it's got evidence to support why you are making that decision or you are trying to find more answers so you're making decisions to you know confirm a hypothesis or whatever it is but it's all based in either using the knowledge to make decisions or creating more
00:25:35.596 --> 00:25:36.157
tests.
00:25:36.198 --> 00:25:37.199
Can you give an example?
00:25:37.380 --> 00:25:38.682
Is that like where a nurse station goes?
00:25:38.701 --> 00:25:39.242
Say the same thing.
00:25:39.262 --> 00:25:41.105
Could you give an example of what that would be?
00:25:41.906 --> 00:25:42.267
Yes.
00:25:42.587 --> 00:25:52.722
So one of the kind of hot topics, I would say, over the past couple of years has been decentralized versus centralized nurse stations.
00:25:53.585 --> 00:25:56.990
Or it's like one of the most researched research.
00:25:57.410 --> 00:26:00.333
not one of the most, but it's researched.
00:26:00.393 --> 00:26:01.974
It is the most researched.
00:26:01.994 --> 00:26:02.935
It's the most researched you will ever find.
00:26:02.955 --> 00:26:03.977
You didn't like that
00:26:03.997 --> 00:26:05.117
definitive statement that you made.
00:26:05.137 --> 00:26:06.940
It was like how you corrected yourself.
00:26:07.721 --> 00:26:12.727
Because I'm sure people are rolling their eyes going, Erin.
00:26:14.509 --> 00:26:15.529
They're like, we didn't catch it.
00:26:15.549 --> 00:26:15.589
We
00:26:16.431 --> 00:26:18.732
still don't know what you're talking about.
00:26:18.752 --> 00:26:21.415
I like to call myself out, keep myself accountable.
00:26:21.455 --> 00:26:36.079
But, you know, there are There are pros and cons and an argument to be made for each of those scenarios, centralized and decentralized.
00:26:36.540 --> 00:26:50.317
So rather than just going off of what you have personally seen, and again, when you're in healthcare design, every decision has such a big impact or the potential to major life and death stuff.
00:26:50.778 --> 00:26:56.484
And so you want it to be supported by...
00:26:57.665 --> 00:27:35.640
the mass approach of understanding it in as many ways as possible so is it better to have direct sight line to all of your patients at their room door or is it better to kind of support collaboration and multidisciplinary practices and when you're all center at a central nurse station i mean that's simplifying it right sure super simplified i was
00:27:35.660 --> 00:27:37.583
thinking to myself yeah that's really simple
00:27:37.603 --> 00:27:59.390
yeah um and and then there are you know so many different um kind of specialties within health care and that require different things so there's not a definitive answer and that's not what the point is there's never going to be like This is the evidence supports that you can only do it this way or you should only do it this way.
00:27:59.450 --> 00:28:21.930
That's it's using the evidence to make the best decision for that client in that project or like staff break rooms, you know, thinking about where they are located and what's it doing to their travel distances and the time that they're away versus, well, now they're going to be like maybe a little bit louder if they're in the core center area.
00:28:21.970 --> 00:28:30.559
So it's just like all of these little things you can study on something It seems kind of just a side thought of, like, where's the break room going to go?
00:28:30.599 --> 00:28:34.305
But there are a lot of factors that could impact a lot of things.
00:28:35.006 --> 00:28:35.286
That was
00:28:35.326 --> 00:28:40.772
one of the things I found really interesting in the IIDA healthcare symposium a couple years ago.
00:28:40.792 --> 00:28:41.994
They actually talked about that.
00:28:42.295 --> 00:28:46.201
I think it was maybe Andrew Gannan with St.
00:28:46.260 --> 00:28:47.261
Vincent's.
00:28:47.362 --> 00:29:02.734
was talking about the studies of staff break rooms in hospitals and how you go to some facilities and it would take the nurses or the doctors or whomever from wherever they are at their nurse station to get to the break room, 10 or 15 minutes to walk there.
00:29:02.755 --> 00:29:03.816
And
00:29:03.855 --> 00:29:06.298
how long it takes them to get there and how you've ruined their break.
00:29:06.317 --> 00:29:09.701
But then also these are people that are on their feet the entire time.
00:29:09.760 --> 00:29:12.723
So the physical exertion just to get to the break room.
00:29:12.763 --> 00:29:17.127
And then once you get to the break room, it's a hole in the wall with no windows and nothing.
00:29:17.327 --> 00:29:20.011
you're trying to take care of your staff like that, that.
00:29:20.353 --> 00:29:28.925
And so you think that you might think you're giving them something nice, even if it was a great break room, but it's like, if you're killing them to get there and back, like, are you, they're spending 20 minutes just
00:29:28.965 --> 00:29:30.407
traveling back to and from.
00:29:30.448 --> 00:29:30.989
Right.
00:29:31.249 --> 00:29:35.375
And, and that's where it's like, again, I'll never get bored with healthcare design.
00:29:35.435 --> 00:29:43.488
There's so much to dig deep into and you could keep digging and so many little things that make big impacts.
00:29:43.989 --> 00:29:55.650
Um, And evidence-based design is also like you can use just reviewing the literature as kind of the first level of research.
00:29:56.771 --> 00:29:58.973
That in itself, which anybody can do.
00:29:58.993 --> 00:30:00.675
You mean you have to read?
00:30:00.796 --> 00:30:01.416
You have to read.
00:30:01.616 --> 00:30:02.278
You do have to read.
00:30:03.960 --> 00:30:04.881
I'm out.
00:30:04.901 --> 00:30:07.284
Yeah, I'm out.
00:30:07.304 --> 00:30:07.605
I'm not kidding.
00:30:07.984 --> 00:30:09.145
Chad and I read, people.
00:30:09.586 --> 00:30:10.047
We read.
00:30:10.067 --> 00:30:10.528
Don't worry.
00:30:13.250 --> 00:30:30.208
But, yeah, there's just a lot– And there's, you'll learn so much and that'll take you on like another tangent of, I mean, I will like find myself up in the middle of the night, like reading about conditions and diseases because I'm like seeing something.
00:30:30.268 --> 00:30:31.269
Thanks for not waking me up.
00:30:31.288 --> 00:30:33.111
Yeah.
00:30:33.651 --> 00:30:37.654
I do like to share stories about things like that, though, that I read that Mark loves.
00:30:37.674 --> 00:30:38.915
It's a good thing your cats are
00:30:38.976 --> 00:30:39.977
nocturnal, right?
00:30:40.298 --> 00:30:40.678
Right.
00:30:40.738 --> 00:30:41.979
Cats are nocturnal, so they're up with you.
00:30:42.078 --> 00:30:42.759
They're such good company.
00:30:42.779 --> 00:30:42.920
Yeah.
00:30:43.361 --> 00:30:43.901
Exactly.
00:30:45.346 --> 00:30:47.229
Yeah.
00:30:47.489 --> 00:30:49.230
Well, we're already 30 minutes.
00:30:49.592 --> 00:30:52.435
We're actually just over 30 minutes in, so it's just flying by.
00:30:52.476 --> 00:30:54.919
Aaron's ready to go another half hour.
00:30:55.159 --> 00:30:55.500
I do have another
00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:55.680
question.
00:30:55.700 --> 00:30:58.564
I was like, those were not even any of the things I thought we were talking about.
00:30:58.624 --> 00:31:00.145
Thanks for setting me up with that.
00:31:01.107 --> 00:31:05.713
Do you have, and this is not a set-up question, but do you have a favorite project?
00:31:07.375 --> 00:31:09.900
Or maybe I will set up a question for you.
00:31:11.181 --> 00:31:14.365
Well, I think you should talk a little bit about Cooper Green.
00:31:15.009 --> 00:31:15.590
Oh, yes.
00:31:15.951 --> 00:31:17.394
I mean, yes.
00:31:17.534 --> 00:31:18.355
I will say that.
00:31:19.016 --> 00:31:21.779
So this is a project you're just completing now?
00:31:21.799 --> 00:31:22.862
That's right.
00:31:22.882 --> 00:31:25.246
Completing the first part of the project.
00:31:25.665 --> 00:32:03.045
And, yeah, this is, I keep saying, like, I don't know what I'm going to do after this project because I didn't realize that when you're in it, um just like this might not ever you might not ever get a project like this again it is possibly a once in a lifetime type of project um and extremely rewarding uh project so cooper green and when i say we just finished the first part so the it's a new building and five floors the first project here
00:32:03.085 --> 00:32:03.786
here in birmingham
00:32:03.865 --> 00:32:09.536
here in birmingham yep i'll yeah kind of describe it but just First part of the project was the first four floors.
00:32:09.836 --> 00:32:10.017
So
00:32:10.557 --> 00:32:15.864
my dad and Aaron both get mad at me for telling stories because, you know, sometimes they go on a little long.
00:32:16.003 --> 00:32:16.285
I get it.
00:32:16.365 --> 00:32:18.968
I know who I am, but I start my stories at the beginning.
00:32:20.871 --> 00:32:22.893
So she's laughing.
00:32:23.374 --> 00:32:25.596
So Cooper Green's in Birmingham.
00:32:25.675 --> 00:32:29.661
Before we get to like how many floors there are, let's tell our listeners what it is.
00:32:30.690 --> 00:32:31.330
It's a hospital.
00:32:31.871 --> 00:32:32.271
It's not a
00:32:32.332 --> 00:32:32.772
hospital.
00:32:32.792 --> 00:32:33.492
You're
00:32:33.512 --> 00:32:34.394
wrong.
00:32:34.414 --> 00:32:34.654
Okay.
00:32:34.914 --> 00:32:35.195
All right.
00:32:35.736 --> 00:32:39.760
I was just saying that to say we're going to talk about the first floor project.
00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:41.442
Anyway, that's not important.
00:32:41.763 --> 00:32:43.144
But not a hospital.
00:32:43.184 --> 00:32:45.909
So, yes, Cooper Green is the...
00:32:46.108 --> 00:32:46.609
It's a hotel.
00:32:47.170 --> 00:32:47.871
Totally.
00:32:49.353 --> 00:32:50.094
A rec center.
00:32:51.736 --> 00:32:51.996
Sort of.
00:32:54.239 --> 00:32:56.382
So it is the indigent care...
00:32:56.961 --> 00:33:30.663
clinic for the state of Alabama or for just Jefferson County specifically but they actually serve a lot more of the state of Alabama than just Jefferson County so they are they accept patients they see patients they treat patients regardless of their ability to pay they bill patients based on their ability to pay and their whole mission is getting health care out to all of the underserved communities in the state.
00:33:31.825 --> 00:33:41.221
They believe in that quality healthcare, fundamental human right, and that is just a really incredible organization.
00:33:41.260 --> 00:34:02.261
I've never worked with, I won't say I've never worked with, but like the hearing, talking to this client and all of the people that we worked with there, it's just like next level, different level of compassion and empathy and mission-driven work.
00:34:02.461 --> 00:34:10.018
And I think, too, just that they...
00:34:10.498 --> 00:34:24.615
were working in a hospital okay so they're an outpatient clinic and they were working in because they originally opened in 1972 as a 300 plus bed hospital well that
00:34:24.655 --> 00:34:25.697
building's next door
00:34:25.717 --> 00:34:37.500
to the next door to the new one and when they converted to an outpatient facility they closed uh in 2012 and it was terrible thing.
00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:43.090
A lot of members of the community were responsible for advocating and getting it back open.
00:34:43.469 --> 00:34:47.016
So they opened again in 2013 as an outpatient facility.
00:34:47.757 --> 00:34:51.945
Well, they did not convert the building to an outpatient
00:34:51.965 --> 00:34:52.126
facility.
00:34:52.146 --> 00:34:52.947
It was still a hospital.
00:34:53.027 --> 00:34:53.628
Still a hospital.
00:34:53.668 --> 00:35:30.494
Every office was a patient room so they all had their own toilet rooms and like it's just kind of bizarre but it sounds amazing it was it was you can have your own toilet room yes um but it was it terrible and just even just thinking about aesthetic upgrades they never had any of this they were also funded by the county so um getting into this project and one knowing that the project is all about How do we, getting more access to healthcare out there.
00:35:30.574 --> 00:35:33.880
So that's kind of a big responsibility.
00:35:34.400 --> 00:35:42.014
And so, I'm losing my train of thought, but yeah.
00:35:42.849 --> 00:35:43.130
So
00:35:43.349 --> 00:35:44.530
y'all got, Gresham got hired.
00:35:45.052 --> 00:35:45.371
Yes.
00:35:45.391 --> 00:35:47.574
To do the new building.
00:35:47.773 --> 00:35:48.635
Yes, thank you.
00:35:48.695 --> 00:35:53.800
And now you can start talking about the floors.
00:35:53.820 --> 00:35:54.000
Thank you.
00:35:54.019 --> 00:35:54.199
Thank you.
00:35:54.219 --> 00:35:55.320
That's why we're a good team.
00:35:55.340 --> 00:35:57.342
That's right.
00:35:57.402 --> 00:36:00.885
Yeah, finish each other's sentences except you start my sentences.
00:36:01.425 --> 00:36:02.306
So I appreciate that.
00:36:04.248 --> 00:36:10.373
So yes, we were hired to build a new building and it's right next door to the old one.
00:36:10.393 --> 00:36:25.422
And when we started talking to all of the stakeholders involved, everyone from like clinic administrator to clinicians, EVS staff, everyone.
00:36:27.146 --> 00:36:30.532
It was actually like an emotional thing to do.
00:36:30.612 --> 00:36:32.376
They were so...
00:36:33.378 --> 00:36:37.923
I mean, one woman started crying when I asked her what does not work well in her space.
00:36:38.384 --> 00:36:39.646
And we were trying to kind of work through that.
00:36:39.686 --> 00:36:42.949
She was crying because she had never been asked that before.
00:36:42.969 --> 00:36:43.010
Oh,
00:36:43.351 --> 00:36:43.590
wow.
00:36:43.992 --> 00:36:49.018
So, like, things that we take advantage or take for granted.
00:36:49.038 --> 00:36:51.420
I'll finish this sentence.
00:36:51.621 --> 00:36:52.623
Thank you.
00:36:52.643 --> 00:36:53.143
Stay away from
00:36:53.824 --> 00:36:56.086
my
00:36:56.106 --> 00:36:56.186
wife.
00:36:56.206 --> 00:36:56.648
Okay.
00:36:58.610 --> 00:37:01.293
So, yeah.
00:37:01.454 --> 00:37:01.534
Yeah.
00:37:01.697 --> 00:37:12.527
This was one that kind of like made me sit back and say, yeah, there are things that I've taken for granted that I just think are like a given that we do for healthcare design.
00:37:12.668 --> 00:37:20.476
And I need to stop and get that out of my head and actually listen to every single word.
00:37:20.496 --> 00:37:26.240
It was a good reminder that a huge part of what we do is listening or should be.
00:37:26.280 --> 00:37:30.885
And so we were impacting...
00:37:31.905 --> 00:37:42.121
every part of this project as if it were, you know, the patient experience, which is what always gets all the attention when people are talking about healthcare design.
00:37:42.161 --> 00:37:43.362
But you've got
00:37:43.402 --> 00:37:44.384
the people working there as
00:37:44.664 --> 00:37:44.744
well.
00:37:44.764 --> 00:37:47.688
And that is also a big topic.
00:37:47.789 --> 00:37:57.463
And a lot of healthcare designers will tell you that is equally important because it is, but it was just like this really getting into the granular things that we have taken for granted.
00:37:57.503 --> 00:38:16.864
So anyway, the, we really worked with them on, talking about how can you make this a resource that goes beyond just like a medical facility because they have goals of you know getting into communities to teach them how to have sustainable, healthy habits, for instance.
00:38:17.686 --> 00:38:20.130
Or the social aspect.
00:38:20.210 --> 00:38:27.083
One of the cool things is that the staff at Cooper Green know their patients so well.
00:38:27.364 --> 00:38:28.686
I've never seen anything like it.
00:38:29.047 --> 00:38:32.755
These are generations of families that have been there.
00:38:32.795 --> 00:38:35.760
Some of them were born at the hospital Cooper Green.
00:38:36.481 --> 00:38:38.347
That now work there or still patients there.
00:38:38.387 --> 00:38:39.590
They all know each other very well.
00:38:39.610 --> 00:38:40.472
So it's very tight knit.
00:38:40.773 --> 00:38:48.713
A lot of the project was about strengthening those relationships, strengthening relationships of like just different families that will be there.
00:38:48.773 --> 00:38:52.985
So it was very much about how do we.
00:38:53.666 --> 00:39:03.894
really nurture relationships and then also extend their capacity to reach more people.
00:39:05.056 --> 00:39:13.382
So most of the building is clinic healthcare spaces, but a lot of it is multi-purpose types of spaces.
00:39:14.664 --> 00:39:24.215
The therapy gym that is for PT and OT also operates as a MOG, which is great name.
00:39:25.000 --> 00:39:25.342
What is it?
00:39:25.402 --> 00:39:27.452
It's a medically oriented gym.
00:39:27.835 --> 00:39:30.202
So they I
00:39:30.262 --> 00:39:31.704
thought that was like a word and we
00:39:31.724 --> 00:39:33.985
were supposed to know it.
00:39:34.005 --> 00:39:34.206
Yeah.
00:39:34.967 --> 00:39:38.269
But I do remember hearing that term and just being like, wait, a what?
00:39:38.409 --> 00:39:39.070
Mog.
00:39:39.090 --> 00:39:39.731
Yeah, a mog.
00:39:41.353 --> 00:39:41.432
Yeah.
00:39:41.452 --> 00:39:53.443
So, but what they do is that once you've done, I mean, you can get your PT and all of that, but then their patients can also pay a very small fee based on what they can afford to use that as their fitness gym.
00:39:53.782 --> 00:40:02.896
So it's giving them resources to actually make an impact and actually like take control of their own health rather than just saying, you need to work out more.
00:40:03.177 --> 00:40:03.418
Right.
00:40:04.099 --> 00:40:05.262
Here's a place you can actually do it.
00:40:05.563 --> 00:40:05.943
Yes.
00:40:06.545 --> 00:40:14.364
And so it's a very cool project, very rewarding, and just we have gotten very close.
00:40:15.297 --> 00:40:17.460
to the people that work at Cooper Green.
00:40:17.480 --> 00:40:23.905
And again, coming out of this project, it just wrapped up.
00:40:23.945 --> 00:40:27.148
They opened in December 2024.
00:40:27.188 --> 00:40:32.592
It's just like, I may not ever work on a project like this again.
00:40:32.612 --> 00:41:17.826
And where you do, you feel the responsibility of what you're doing every, maybe not every day, because you also get frustrated and stressed out and all of the things that come with doing design that, you know, I don't want to lead people to think that I believe it's rainbows and puppy dogs all the time, but it is something that I'm proud to be a part of, and it, again, is just fulfilling to make those types of connections that are going to And things that I learned on this project that I will use in the next project and the next that are not necessarily something I would learn from another project.
00:41:18.326 --> 00:41:19.447
I mean, just the impact, though.
00:41:19.467 --> 00:41:19.947
I mean, that
00:41:20.527 --> 00:41:21.228
is powerful.
00:41:21.949 --> 00:41:22.268
Yes.
00:41:22.929 --> 00:41:24.150
It's a beautiful space.
00:41:24.170 --> 00:41:25.192
I say this without bias.
00:41:25.231 --> 00:41:26.313
It's a beautiful space.
00:41:26.333 --> 00:41:34.099
But one of the things when we were talking about this in the last couple of months, just with different things going on, and I was learning about you.
00:41:34.219 --> 00:41:35.380
She's waking you up at 2 a.m.
00:41:35.400 --> 00:41:38.943
She's waking me up like, I guess what this condition is about.
00:41:39.023 --> 00:42:13.117
But, you know, things that I've been learning about it, and you've been working on this for years now, but that your approach, the team approach, the Gresham approach to this was that, you know, it– the cost of the people paying money for health care like that that was not a factor the factor was this is that we're going to make this a gold star in terms of health care of a health care facility regardless of how monies flow through that
00:42:13.539 --> 00:42:33.076
yes that their mission is to give everyone the same standard of care and we live in birmingham alabama where we have uab we've got some of the most forward-thinking programs in healthcare here.
00:42:33.115 --> 00:42:45.389
And to say that certain groups of people don't get access to what is right there, but then other groups do, you know, that's what they were also trying to combat.
00:42:45.550 --> 00:43:02.490
So they also, like coming to cooper green if you're a patient you are getting seen by cooper green staff that has dedicated their lives to making sure that people have the highest standard of care.
00:43:02.652 --> 00:43:04.612
So that in itself right there.
00:43:04.632 --> 00:43:10.639
You also have UAB staff and providers that are coming there to do clinic.
00:43:10.998 --> 00:43:19.266
So this building also set them up to be able to do diagnostics and behavioral health.
00:43:19.525 --> 00:44:16.746
There are 17 clinics and then dozens of specialties that operate within the clinics but the idea too is that if you can get patients to the building and be able to handle all of that at the same time so they get their diagnostics they see their doctors they may have a cross-disciplinary visit where they're seeing multiple doctors you're going to have a much higher chance of patients being able to take care of all those things these are patients that have trouble getting um child care taken care of or transportation so if you can get that to all happen in one place versus in one place right and then there's so many social determinants of health that keep or i'm sorry uh barriers to health that keep um or barriers to care, I'm doing great.
00:44:17.206 --> 00:44:17.907
You are doing great.
00:44:18.168 --> 00:44:20.652
No, like I get on a roll and then I'm like, wait, let me pull it back.
00:44:20.751 --> 00:44:21.413
Well, I was just
00:44:21.432 --> 00:44:23.215
about to say, it's a shame you're not passionate about it.
00:44:23.536 --> 00:44:26.601
Yeah.
00:44:26.762 --> 00:44:30.268
Yes, I get people, people would...
00:44:31.842 --> 00:44:32.965
Describe me as passionate.
00:44:34.047 --> 00:44:34.168
Well, I
00:44:34.188 --> 00:44:35.431
think that you're, again, unbiased.
00:44:35.490 --> 00:44:41.405
I think your passion is contagious because I've seen you at industry events talk about what you do.
00:44:41.746 --> 00:44:46.186
I've seen you with our friends talk about what you do, and they're like, I had no idea.
00:44:46.206 --> 00:44:48.369
One, I knew you were passionate because we're friends.
00:44:49.429 --> 00:44:55.355
But when you get into the details of the why and the stuff, it brings people in because people don't know.
00:44:55.936 --> 00:44:56.135
Sure.
00:44:56.476 --> 00:44:58.797
Well, it's like the person you were talking to at the party.
00:44:58.818 --> 00:44:59.998
It was like healthcare design.
00:45:00.119 --> 00:45:00.739
Yeah.
00:45:00.780 --> 00:45:02.922
That's the best circle
00:45:02.961 --> 00:45:03.081
back
00:45:03.101 --> 00:45:03.782
you've done in this.
00:45:04.702 --> 00:45:04.782
Yeah.
00:45:04.802 --> 00:45:09.887
I mean, that's like, because, yeah, to come back to that, yeah, like, yeah, healthcare design.
00:45:09.967 --> 00:45:10.188
Yeah.
00:45:10.307 --> 00:45:10.507
Right?
00:45:10.708 --> 00:45:11.088
All that.
00:45:11.449 --> 00:45:11.608
Yeah.
00:45:12.070 --> 00:45:13.190
So, kudos.
00:45:13.291 --> 00:45:14.632
We are now at 45 minutes.
00:45:14.652 --> 00:45:14.831
Yeah.
00:45:14.831 --> 00:45:17.615
You've got to go, Erin.
00:45:17.635 --> 00:45:18.177
Get out of here.
00:45:18.697 --> 00:45:22.684
So we're going to move to our rapid-fire questions, which probably will take a while.
00:45:23.143 --> 00:45:23.565
Did you know?
00:45:23.644 --> 00:45:24.646
Oh, rapid-fire.
00:45:24.686 --> 00:45:24.987
I do.
00:45:25.027 --> 00:45:26.168
I mean, I do listen to y'all.
00:45:26.268 --> 00:45:26.789
Okay, yeah.
00:45:26.949 --> 00:45:28.052
I know you don't think I do.
00:45:28.873 --> 00:45:33.338
Do you listen to us on the podcast or just when we're running out?
00:45:33.358 --> 00:45:33.719
Both.
00:45:33.739 --> 00:45:34.842
I kind of tune you out both times.
00:45:37.304 --> 00:45:37.925
Yeah, exactly.
00:45:38.025 --> 00:45:39.027
All right, I'll go first.
00:45:39.608 --> 00:45:43.293
What's your number one design pet peeve?
00:45:44.673 --> 00:45:45.153
Oh, God.
00:45:45.434 --> 00:45:46.074
Are there too many?
00:45:46.094 --> 00:45:46.135
No.
00:45:48.117 --> 00:45:48.838
Probably.
00:45:48.998 --> 00:45:50.998
She's going to get passionate again.
00:45:51.460 --> 00:45:52.661
I mean, sure.
00:45:52.780 --> 00:45:54.442
Like, just thoughtlessness.
00:45:54.603 --> 00:45:55.242
How about that?
00:45:55.963 --> 00:45:56.403
Hey, that's
00:45:56.463 --> 00:45:58.545
probably the best rapid answer we've got.
00:45:58.565 --> 00:45:59.005
Not the best.
00:45:59.246 --> 00:46:01.548
I don't want to say that the other ones were not good.
00:46:02.528 --> 00:46:03.670
He's not biased at all.
00:46:03.811 --> 00:46:04.351
I don't
00:46:04.371 --> 00:46:04.931
know how many times.
00:46:05.211 --> 00:46:06.193
And I'm not biased.
00:46:06.413 --> 00:46:07.072
He's totally biased.
00:46:07.153 --> 00:46:08.094
But you're the greatest.
00:46:09.916 --> 00:46:10.315
And you.
00:46:11.998 --> 00:46:14.998
If you had a issues.
00:46:16.097 --> 00:46:17.199
Gregory or Dolores?
00:46:17.559 --> 00:46:17.759
Oh,
00:46:18.380 --> 00:46:18.880
no.
00:46:18.900 --> 00:46:19.920
I knew one of these were going to come up.
00:46:19.940 --> 00:46:20.382
No.
00:46:20.862 --> 00:46:28.668
And just for those who don't know or follow Mark on social media, they have a couple groundhogs that live in their backyard, and it's Gregory and Dolores.
00:46:28.688 --> 00:46:31.251
So if you had to choose between one of them.
00:46:31.570 --> 00:46:32.351
I can't choose.
00:46:32.391 --> 00:46:33.432
That's Sophie's choice.
00:46:33.873 --> 00:46:39.739
But I will say that I worry more about Greg than I do Dolores.
00:46:40.159 --> 00:46:40.619
Okay.
00:46:40.679 --> 00:46:45.023
Do you want to, not to, I always make the rapid fire questions longer, but do you want to explain why?
00:46:45.063 --> 00:46:46.063
Gregory's fine.
00:46:46.063 --> 00:46:46.505
He's
00:46:46.664 --> 00:46:47.385
fine.
00:46:47.726 --> 00:46:48.686
He's just lived some life.
00:46:48.726 --> 00:46:49.648
He has lived some life.
00:46:49.708 --> 00:46:52.871
He has got the most terrible battle scar I've ever seen on his side.
00:46:52.931 --> 00:46:54.853
And he gets around and he seems okay.
00:46:54.873 --> 00:46:57.797
But I'm just worried that one day he's not going to come out of that burrow.
00:46:58.639 --> 00:46:59.760
Dolores on the other hand.
00:46:59.780 --> 00:46:59.940
Or maybe
00:46:59.960 --> 00:47:01.222
he just will never die.
00:47:01.722 --> 00:47:02.362
I love that.
00:47:03.565 --> 00:47:04.865
And he can handle it all.
00:47:04.885 --> 00:47:05.626
Yeah, right.
00:47:05.726 --> 00:47:06.148
Clearly.
00:47:06.628 --> 00:47:09.110
And then Dolores, I have no concern.
00:47:09.170 --> 00:47:10.893
She's going to kill it no matter what.
00:47:11.489 --> 00:47:16.253
If you weren't an interior designer, what would you be?
00:47:16.313 --> 00:47:17.094
A geologist.
00:47:18.476 --> 00:47:18.695
I'm teasing.
00:47:18.715 --> 00:47:18.916
No.
00:47:22.159 --> 00:47:27.463
No, I would be definitely the owner of an animal sanctuary.
00:47:27.503 --> 00:47:29.304
Okay.
00:47:29.324 --> 00:47:32.088
I mean, yeah, no surprise there for me.
00:47:32.228 --> 00:47:34.170
I'm going to stay with groundhogs.
00:47:34.710 --> 00:47:35.471
Oh, good.
00:47:36.090 --> 00:47:39.474
If there was one day you could live over and over, like the movie Groundhog
00:47:39.614 --> 00:47:39.673
Day.
00:47:39.693 --> 00:47:40.855
Oh, interesting.
00:47:40.875 --> 00:47:40.956
What
00:47:40.976 --> 00:47:41.456
day would you live over?
00:47:41.456 --> 00:47:42.077
to be and why?
00:47:42.476 --> 00:47:44.219
Oh, my wedding day, right?
00:47:46.181 --> 00:47:46.822
No.
00:47:52.847 --> 00:47:58.134
I don't know which day specifically, but one of our honeymoon days, I'm sure.
00:47:58.173 --> 00:48:00.976
That was like the best time of my life.
00:48:01.077 --> 00:48:01.297
All right.
00:48:02.097 --> 00:48:02.659
Nice.
00:48:02.679 --> 00:48:02.759
It's
00:48:02.778 --> 00:48:04.199
all been downhill since then.
00:48:04.760 --> 00:48:05.121
I'm just kidding.
00:48:05.181 --> 00:48:05.581
That was a joke.
00:48:06.202 --> 00:48:06.503
Crickets.
00:48:07.384 --> 00:48:09.465
Chad's looking at me like, shut up.
00:48:11.108 --> 00:48:11.909
Speaking of dates.
00:48:12.068 --> 00:48:12.851
When's my birthday?
00:48:13.150 --> 00:48:14.574
Oh my God, I knew you were going to ask.
00:48:14.974 --> 00:48:17.960
I wasn't supposed to admit that part, but I knew you were going to ask me that.
00:48:18.181 --> 00:48:19.603
And it is June 18th.
00:48:19.724 --> 00:48:20.626
Yes, it is.
00:48:20.646 --> 00:48:21.126
1980.
00:48:21.288 --> 00:48:22.510
There we go.
00:48:22.690 --> 00:48:25.735
Stop giving all my personal details out there.
00:48:25.755 --> 00:48:26.557
You asked her that.
00:48:26.577 --> 00:48:26.757
I did.
00:48:26.778 --> 00:48:28.541
Seems like you said her for that.
00:48:28.737 --> 00:48:41.528
And just to give continued backstory as I do, the reason that I asked that question is because it's now been a seven or eight year joke because we've been together for 10 and the first two years we were together, you forgot my birthday entirely.
00:48:42.269 --> 00:48:42.510
I did.
00:48:43.331 --> 00:48:43.891
But not anymore.
00:48:44.110 --> 00:48:44.532
She knows it.
00:48:44.552 --> 00:48:44.751
Because
00:48:44.791 --> 00:48:45.773
I ask her every week.
00:48:45.793 --> 00:48:52.798
He cop quizzes me throughout the year and he will do it when I'm not expecting it and then I get my numbers jumbled in my head.
00:48:52.878 --> 00:48:55.260
It says more about Mark than it says about me.
00:48:55.280 --> 00:48:55.621
100%.
00:48:55.681 --> 00:48:56.161
Thank you.
00:48:56.202 --> 00:48:56.762
I don't deny that.
00:48:57.342 --> 00:49:00.706
If animals could talk, which animal would be the most interesting to talk to
00:49:00.746 --> 00:49:10.161
oh man i mean definitely a cat like there's just so much behind those eyes at all times okay unless you're earnest but um yeah a
00:49:10.221 --> 00:49:12.565
cat any cat but earnest is your is your hand
00:49:12.605 --> 00:49:15.047
oh i would love to know what's going on behind i mean there might be a lot
00:49:15.369 --> 00:49:15.548
yeah
00:49:15.748 --> 00:49:17.472
yeah we don't know we'll never know
00:49:17.893 --> 00:49:29.043
but probably probably say no um I've asked this question to people before in terms of like either an architecture project or an interior design project.
00:49:30.405 --> 00:49:33.710
Which project would you most like to visit?
00:49:34.452 --> 00:49:44.266
Now, the way I've always broken this down is you can pick the world, you can pick a country, you can pick Alabama, like whatever makes it easier or not.
00:49:44.307 --> 00:49:45.409
I feel like I always make it harder.
00:49:45.690 --> 00:49:46.170
Yeah, you do.
00:49:46.371 --> 00:49:49.195
Yeah, that is not a rapid fire type question.
00:49:51.202 --> 00:49:53.746
We just said the questions were going to be rapid fire.
00:49:53.865 --> 00:49:54.527
We didn't say the answers.
00:49:54.547 --> 00:49:57.190
I don't even remember what the question was.
00:49:59.793 --> 00:50:00.074
Next.
00:50:00.173 --> 00:50:04.360
I'm going to say that was probably the best answer we've ever had.
00:50:05.661 --> 00:50:08.445
What's one superpower you would not want to have?
00:50:08.465 --> 00:50:08.485
I
00:50:10.548 --> 00:50:13.532
would not want to live forever.
00:50:14.369 --> 00:50:14.891
Okay.
00:50:14.911 --> 00:50:15.431
Definitely.
00:50:15.472 --> 00:50:17.114
Oh, okay.
00:50:17.456 --> 00:50:18.336
You're really good at this.
00:50:18.818 --> 00:50:20.201
Oh, who knew?
00:50:20.842 --> 00:50:26.592
On the CBS TV show Survivor, who's your favorite contestant of all time?
00:50:26.693 --> 00:50:27.373
Oh, snap.
00:50:29.739 --> 00:50:31.621
Oh, gosh.
00:50:31.842 --> 00:50:38.014
I feel like you would know this more than me because I don't remember who I've...
00:50:38.146 --> 00:50:39.228
I
00:50:39.409 --> 00:50:40.432
mean, we like Boston Rob.
00:50:40.793 --> 00:50:42.559
Yeah, we do like Boston Rob.
00:50:42.679 --> 00:50:45.849
I mean, yeah, the strategic players are definitely my favorite.
00:50:45.989 --> 00:50:47.375
They're way more interesting.
00:50:49.121 --> 00:50:54.126
I mean, and then you've got just like people that you would never imagine doing well that kill it.
00:50:54.507 --> 00:50:56.989
And I, that's always fun.
00:50:57.009 --> 00:50:57.369
Which really
00:50:57.509 --> 00:51:00.092
probably deep down are the sneaky, strategic ones.
00:51:00.472 --> 00:51:00.791
Yeah.
00:51:01.092 --> 00:51:03.094
Yeah, because you can't like get through that game with dumb luck.
00:51:03.114 --> 00:51:03.454
They're probably
00:51:03.474 --> 00:51:04.394
coming in wanting you to think.
00:51:04.695 --> 00:51:06.536
They've got nothing going on.
00:51:06.697 --> 00:51:07.217
I'm just here to have
00:51:07.257 --> 00:51:07.958
a good time.
00:51:07.978 --> 00:51:11.181
It is funny when they're like, I'm not telling anybody that I'm 50.
00:51:11.201 --> 00:51:12.481
I'm going to tell them I'm 40.
00:51:12.661 --> 00:51:17.045
And I'm like, oh, that is definitely changing your game.
00:51:17.065 --> 00:51:19.088
So strategic.
00:51:19.088 --> 00:51:20.050
Did
00:51:20.090 --> 00:51:20.672
we get an answer?
00:51:21.172 --> 00:51:22.335
No, we didn't.
00:51:22.876 --> 00:51:26.525
Just like people that play.
00:51:26.905 --> 00:51:28.449
What's your favorite contestant?
00:51:28.489 --> 00:51:29.291
People that play.
00:51:29.572 --> 00:51:29.652
Okay.
00:51:30.253 --> 00:51:30.653
All right.
00:51:30.695 --> 00:51:31.235
Last question.
00:51:31.376 --> 00:51:32.900
What's one thing you would change about Mark?
00:51:33.661 --> 00:51:35.445
Oh, gosh.
00:51:35.465 --> 00:51:35.846
That's
00:51:37.309 --> 00:51:37.469
terrible.
00:51:37.730 --> 00:51:38.550
Nothing is perfect.
00:51:38.990 --> 00:51:42.914
Yeah, I mean, his birthday, to be on my birthday, so it's easier to
00:51:43.494 --> 00:51:43.655
remember.
00:51:43.675 --> 00:51:44.635
Okay, what is your birthday?
00:51:44.655 --> 00:51:45.036
Don't tell
00:51:47.579 --> 00:51:47.759
everybody.
00:51:47.778 --> 00:51:48.960
Hey, that's a terrible question.
00:51:48.980 --> 00:51:49.019
No,
00:51:49.900 --> 00:51:50.581
you're fine.
00:51:51.481 --> 00:51:52.242
I thought it was pretty good.
00:51:52.362 --> 00:51:58.668
All right, so President's Day is coming up, so I thought I would finish the podcast with some facts.
00:51:59.228 --> 00:51:59.648
Oh, sweet.
00:51:59.849 --> 00:52:01.329
It's about the presidents.
00:52:01.931 --> 00:52:07.255
James Madison, father of the Constitution, was our shortest president at 5 feet 4 inches tall.
00:52:07.556 --> 00:52:09.056
He weighed less than 100 pounds.
00:52:10.438 --> 00:52:12.061
Lincoln
00:52:12.081 --> 00:52:13.702
was the tallest president at 6'4".
00:52:14.043 --> 00:52:17.045
Three presidents have died on the 4th of July.
00:52:17.726 --> 00:52:20.148
John Adams, Tom Jefferson, and James Monroe.
00:52:20.510 --> 00:52:23.432
But it was the birthday of Calvin Coolidge who was born on the 4th of July.
00:52:23.492 --> 00:52:26.476
So we're at a two-president deficit, if you're counting.
00:52:27.777 --> 00:52:29.739
Thomas Jefferson invented a folding...
00:52:29.760 --> 00:52:33.382
It was really interesting just looking him up because he was a huge inventor.
00:52:33.844 --> 00:52:39.110
So a folding ladder he invented, a portable writing desk, built the first dumbwaiter in the He learned about them in France.
00:52:39.711 --> 00:52:42.257
A clock that also tells the date, which no one had done before.
00:52:42.336 --> 00:52:44.621
And most importantly, he invented the swivel chair.
00:52:44.661 --> 00:52:46.865
Oh,
00:52:46.885 --> 00:52:47.867
there you go.
00:52:48.289 --> 00:52:49.150
Ulysses S.
00:52:49.251 --> 00:52:53.117
Grant was born Hiram Ulysses Grant, but changed his name.
00:52:53.418 --> 00:52:54.501
Do you know why he changed his name?
00:52:55.617 --> 00:52:55.858
Because he
00:52:55.958 --> 00:52:57.400
got tired of people going, hi, Ram.
00:52:57.940 --> 00:52:59.521
Because he did not like his monogram.
00:52:59.722 --> 00:53:00.442
Because it was hug.
00:53:01.023 --> 00:53:01.163
Oh.
00:53:01.742 --> 00:53:01.862
Oh.
00:53:02.824 --> 00:53:04.565
That's funny.
00:53:04.585 --> 00:53:04.846
That is funny.
00:53:04.865 --> 00:53:07.789
The middle initial for the S in Harry S.
00:53:07.829 --> 00:53:09.969
Truman is not an abbreviation of a name.
00:53:11.612 --> 00:53:13.132
It's just an S.
00:53:13.432 --> 00:53:14.273
There's not a name there.
00:53:14.954 --> 00:53:18.398
And then the final one is, if you're familiar with people saying, OK.
00:53:19.498 --> 00:53:19.599
Right?
00:53:19.818 --> 00:53:20.059
OK.
00:53:20.599 --> 00:53:23.081
Martin Van Buren was from Kinderhook, New York.
00:53:23.461 --> 00:53:25.583
And during his campaign, he was known as Old Kinderhook.
00:53:25.583 --> 00:53:35.230
kinderhook okay and so during the um the campaign they would put you know he's okay or whatever and that's where that whoa yeah
00:53:35.650 --> 00:53:37.853
This might be the most informative show we've done.
00:53:38.092 --> 00:53:40.076
We've set the bar pretty high for season two.
00:53:40.275 --> 00:53:48.126
Yeah, and I do want to say, if you go try to book a room at Residence Inn, if you mention our podcast, you will get 10% off your stay.
00:53:48.547 --> 00:53:49.929
Yeah, that's 100%.
00:53:50.108 --> 00:53:54.114
Lies! Trying to bring it back to the beginning.
00:53:54.295 --> 00:53:55.416
Thank you so much for coming on.
00:53:55.637 --> 00:53:57.059
Yeah, this was fun.
00:53:57.780 --> 00:53:58.039
Awesome.
00:53:58.099 --> 00:53:59.842
And then my wife will be on next time.
00:53:59.981 --> 00:54:00.742
Yeah, great.
00:54:01.184 --> 00:54:02.646
Yeah, way to go, Chesney.
00:54:03.387 --> 00:54:03.547
Awesome.
00:54:03.586 --> 00:54:04.047
Thank you so much.
00:54:04.088 --> 00:54:04.327
Thanks,
00:54:04.509 --> 00:54:04.628
Aaron.
00:54:04.648 --> 00:54:05.630
Awesome, thanks.
00:54:06.273 --> 00:54:07.847
So,