Transcription complète de Beyond Busy

with before you know preparation for a meeting. 00:04:50.480 --> 00:04:55.040 So I suppose the to-do list is where I know is my second brain. 00:04:55.360 --> 00:04:58.639 Yeah, so you know that nothing gets forgotten, it's your security almost. 00:04:58.800 --> 00:05:00.560 Yeah, I don't think I have that enough, you know. 00:05:00.720 --> 00:05:12.240 So I'm I'm organized in the sense that in the moment when something so what I'm quite good at doing is if I'm on calls or I've got something that's going to need to be done, I'll block it out in that moment. 00:05:12.319 --> 00:05:13.759 So I'll use my outlet calendar. 00:05:13.839 --> 00:05:20.160 I mean, my outlet calendar is a mess because I put it's like a to-do list, which it shouldn't really be, but I need it to be. 00:05:20.240 --> 00:05:26.480 So I do one of one of the things that in in this book that we've been looking at is time blocking. 00:05:26.639 --> 00:05:28.399 So making sure time is blocked in. 00:05:28.480 --> 00:05:40.879 So what I will do is before I finish work at the end of a day, I look at the next day, think of the things I've got to do, but I'm thinking of them, they're in my head, you know, rather than necessarily written down, and then so it's the things I've remembered, really, isn't it? 00:05:40.959 --> 00:05:44.399 And then if something's forgotten, it's forgotten, I probably do need to think about it. 00:05:44.560 --> 00:05:46.959 I suppose it's it's topical as well, isn't it? 00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:49.519 For you, I suppose my role is very process-driven. 00:05:49.600 --> 00:05:56.480 So I have certain things I have to get done at certain points of the month, or certain times of the course or the year, so it's very cyclical. 00:05:56.560 --> 00:06:12.720 Whereas your, I guess yours is what's going on with your clients at the time, and that's or you know, preparation for proposals or whatever, that's more in the moment and over days, I guess, or that's what you need to get done for the week. 00:06:12.800 --> 00:06:15.600 So it's it's more of a bigger task, would you say? 00:06:15.839 --> 00:06:19.439 Yeah, I have very few things that are regularly scheduled in. 00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:26.240 My role doesn't really work like that, so yeah, I just have to, it's it's all quite sort of ad hoc and a bit random, I guess. 00:06:26.319 --> 00:06:28.319 So I think it's really important for me to get this. 00:06:28.399 --> 00:06:29.279 Is why this is timely. 00:06:29.360 --> 00:06:32.800 I think I really need to get some of these methods in place to make sure stuff doesn't slip. 00:06:32.879 --> 00:06:37.439 And especially coming up, I've got quite a lot of work trips, I've got a lot of time out of the office. 00:06:37.519 --> 00:06:39.839 Yeah, so I'm gonna need to be organised. 00:06:39.920 --> 00:06:43.279 You I'm I'm okay because I always find I make sure I give myself quiet time. 00:06:43.360 --> 00:06:51.120 So what I'll do if I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed, I'll think, right, before I do anything now, I need 30 minutes and I need to sit here and think about everything. 00:06:51.199 --> 00:06:58.399 And that's when maybe I will write stuff down and then transfer it into my calendar, but I don't keep a to-do list as such. 00:06:58.639 --> 00:07:06.079 I suppose because we have so many meetings, what I try not to do is put too much in my calendar because, like you say, it could end up looking like your to-do list. 00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:13.279 If I need to block out a chunk of time to work on something, then that goes in like a meeting appointment. 00:07:13.519 --> 00:07:24.800 So then I'm having a meeting with myself at my desk, or I'll work with um my assistant and you know we'll we'll do some parallel working, which holds me accountable to actually getting the task done. 00:07:24.959 --> 00:07:38.399 And we might not actually be working on it together, but just me being on that call with her and and holding me to account and making sure I get it done, you know, by the end of our call at three o'clock, say, that actually makes me that makes me get on with it. 00:07:38.639 --> 00:07:40.240 And that's one of the techniques, isn't it? 00:07:40.399 --> 00:07:43.120 Is like prioritization or picking the power of three. 00:07:43.199 --> 00:07:46.000 So I picking three things that have got to be done that day. 00:07:46.079 --> 00:07:49.759 So out of that to-do list, what are the three things that that need to be done? 00:07:49.920 --> 00:07:54.879 And how do you find a way to make sure you get those things done, particularly if it's a bigger task? 00:07:54.959 --> 00:07:57.920 And I think making sure you're set up to do it. 00:07:58.079 --> 00:08:00.639 I know you do, we we were talking about that earlier, weren't we? 00:08:00.800 --> 00:08:05.920 Making sure that you you've got the time, you've got no distractions, turn off your email alerts. 00:08:06.160 --> 00:08:14.720 Turn off I turn off my email, and uh particularly at this time at the end of the end of the month and beginning of the month, I probably go offline for a couple of days. 00:08:14.879 --> 00:08:21.360 I will look at my emails at the end of the day, but I certainly won't respond to anything during the day because I'm I'm in the detail of what I'm doing. 00:08:21.519 --> 00:08:24.319 Um and people can get hold of me if they want me. 00:08:24.480 --> 00:08:32.639 You know, there's WhatsApp, or you know, I do tend to check WhatsApp through the day just because I know somebody's reached me out reaching out to me on WhatsApp, it's urgent. 00:08:33.519 --> 00:08:36.320 Or they'll phone me, you know, good old traditional phone call. 00:08:36.559 --> 00:08:38.480 So all teams. 00:08:38.720 --> 00:08:40.720 So I think it's quite interesting. 00:08:40.879 --> 00:08:43.120 The the the top three, isn't it? 00:08:43.200 --> 00:08:46.559 I I quite like to get quick things done quickly. 00:08:46.799 --> 00:08:56.159 So although I shouldn't write everything down on my

to-do list, I do write down absolutely all the detail, but I like to cross things off and it makes me feel like I'm actually getting something done. 00:08:56.320 --> 00:08:58.960 So I take a few small things first to get done. 00:08:59.120 --> 00:09:03.039 Yeah, but I know that I know I need to get done before I move on to the bigger stuff. 00:09:03.200 --> 00:09:05.600 And it's giving yourself the time, isn't it? 00:09:05.759 --> 00:09:16.720 You know, if you've got a tight deadline, making sure you've got that space, like you said, to think about things, work on it, know you've got the time to get it done before the deadline's screaming at screaming at you. 00:09:16.799 --> 00:09:21.440 Um it's not always possible, but deadlines do focus the mind, don't they? 00:09:21.679 --> 00:09:30.480 And if you have a if you don't have a tight deadline, then make give yourself a deadline so that because it's very easy, I think, when things are in our calendar and you probably find it as well. 00:09:30.720 --> 00:09:37.360 You put your tasks in, but you know, that time we get hijacked by a meeting or something else that's coming that's urgent. 00:09:37.519 --> 00:09:40.480 Do you do you are you very disciplined? 00:09:40.639 --> 00:09:42.000 No, I'm not disciplined at all with it. 00:09:42.080 --> 00:09:43.679 I move stuff on all the time. 00:09:44.000 --> 00:09:45.919 Are you very disciplined with moving it on though? 00:09:46.000 --> 00:09:53.759 Because what I find sometimes is that I don't necessarily look back through the day the next day and go, Oh shit, I didn't get that done, I'll move that on. 00:09:53.919 --> 00:09:55.120 Or do you do it at the time? 00:09:55.440 --> 00:09:57.519 I do it at the time, I am quite good at doing that. 00:09:57.679 --> 00:09:58.879 Yeah, yeah. 00:09:59.120 --> 00:10:08.240 And I think um, there's a couple of methods actually that in the productivity method that so the first one is figuring out what's actually important. 00:10:08.559 --> 00:10:10.879 So she advises, like, drawing. 00:10:11.039 --> 00:10:14.080 I think this is this is a matrix, it's I think it's called the Eyes and Hower matrix. 00:10:14.240 --> 00:10:21.120 So it's a known productivity tool where you draw four boxes and you literally put urgent and important in one. 00:10:21.279 --> 00:10:34.559 So what's urgent and important, what's important but not urgent, what's urgent and not important, and what's not urgent and not important, and then you you put things into those four categories to help people. 00:10:36.080 --> 00:10:37.279 Good idea, isn't it? 00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:46.960 Because I find I've just got one long rambling list most of the time, rather than sectioning out the urgent and importance. 00:10:47.679 --> 00:10:53.679 And then if you do that, what you then can do is so, right, if it's urgent and it's important, there you go, that's what you need to get done today. 00:10:53.759 --> 00:10:57.759 Because they're things that cannot wait, and you need to do them because they're important, probably. 00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:04.559 So there's your three for the day, and you need to minimize distractions and get them done, or plot in the time when you're going to do it. 00:11:04.799 --> 00:11:10.080 Um, whereas if it's not urgent and not important, I mean, you can probably get rid of it. 00:11:10.399 --> 00:11:13.679 Does it matter if it's not urgent, it's not important, you can probably bin it. 00:11:13.840 --> 00:11:16.879 If it's urgent but not important, you can probably delegate it. 00:11:17.039 --> 00:11:17.360 Yeah. 00:11:17.519 --> 00:11:20.720 Do you how do you get on with delegating stuff? 00:11:21.120 --> 00:11:27.440 Um I've got better with work tasks just because I've had to, because there's a lot of meetings that go on, isn't there? 00:11:27.519 --> 00:11:28.879 We have a lot of meetings. 00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:31.919 So I've had to get better work-wise. 00:11:32.399 --> 00:11:34.720 Um, outside of work, I'm not good. 00:11:34.799 --> 00:11:36.799 I've got too much of a grip on everything. 00:11:36.879 --> 00:11:47.840 And I think we put so much pressure on ourselves to do everything, just thinking about what you're saying about if it's not urgent and not important, you know, you can bin it or just you know, forget it. 00:11:47.919 --> 00:11:50.720 But often when you think, well, I can't just forget that. 00:11:50.879 --> 00:11:53.200 You know, what's the worst that's going to happen if it doesn't get done? 00:11:53.279 --> 00:12:01.039 You know, it doesn't if something doesn't matter, why you giving yourself more to do than is necessary, why you know just let it go? 00:12:01.200 --> 00:12:02.000 That's really hard. 00:12:02.240 --> 00:12:04.879 It is hard because I think we're addicted to being busy as well. 00:12:05.039 --> 00:12:10.559 I think like we've just in this, I mean, like you were saying earlier, with distractions, turning off your email. 00:12:10.639 --> 00:12:12.159 Like we we never want to do that, do we? 00:12:12.240 --> 00:12:13.679 Like we're interrupted. 00:12:13.919 --> 00:12:21.600 And I'll quite often say to our people in my team, just you don't need to answer everything straight away, focus on what you're doing at the time and put your phone. 00:12:21.840 --> 00:12:23.200 I put my phone in a different room. 00:12:23.360 --> 00:12:27.840 I have to, because actually, everybody doesn't need to be to get hold of you every minute of every day. 00:12:27.919 --> 00:12:31.120 That that didn't happen a few years ago when you could have just got hold of everybody. 00:12:31.360 --> 00:12:36.480 We all managed, it's almost like we've become always on and always busy all the time. 00:12:36.720 --> 00:12:42.879 Yeah, but it's it's it's kind of like trying to have all your plates spilling spinning all the time, isn't it, with a phone? 00:12:42.960 --> 00:12:47.120 Because that's binging and ringing and God knows what else all the time, isn't it? 00:12:47.279 -->

00:12:55.360 As a distraction, it it can feel like you've got 20 things spinning at once and you're just not doing anything effectively, yeah. 00:12:55.519 --> 00:13:05.360 But yeah, I I only learnt that probably in the probably in the last couple of years, really putting myself offline because I used to feel well, I can't be offline, that looks like I'm not working. 00:13:06.000 --> 00:13:08.960 You know, it's ridiculous thought, really, isn't it? 00:13:09.039 --> 00:13:10.879 Yeah, but yeah, I I I do. 00:13:10.960 --> 00:13:16.639 And if somebody does does want to get hold of me, but it's not urgent, then they'll wait. 00:13:16.799 --> 00:13:19.600 Yeah, you know, what was what's the worst that's gonna happen? 00:13:19.759 --> 00:13:35.200 So it does it does come with discipline, definitely does come with this discipline, and I think the more you can delegate, and it's also I think delegating, especially work, is well, this is how I do it, and it's not gonna be done the same way. 00:13:35.279 --> 00:13:36.559 That's quite a big thing, isn't it? 00:13:36.639 --> 00:13:41.279 I think it's like well, let somebody else find their way, they might have a better way of doing it, you know. 00:13:41.519 --> 00:13:46.960 And and I say that to Kate, you know, I'm not fixated on on doing it my way. 00:13:47.039 --> 00:13:52.799 If you've got a quicker way of doing it or a more efficient way of doing it, then please you know let me know, that's great. 00:13:53.039 --> 00:14:04.080 So it's getting out of that mindset that it's harder to explain it and delegate it than it is just to do it, but actually, long term you've got to get good at doing that because you can't do everything, can you? 00:14:04.240 --> 00:14:08.080 And if if you think that you're the only one that can do something, I mean that's not the case, is it? 00:14:08.240 --> 00:14:10.399 You have it is a hard way to learn, I think. 00:14:10.720 --> 00:14:11.519 No, exactly. 00:14:11.600 --> 00:14:15.679 And if it gets done wrong, then it that doesn't really matter either. 00:14:15.759 --> 00:14:19.360 It's just a a way of talking it through and and making it better. 00:14:19.519 --> 00:14:22.480 But yeah, I think that's that's only a fairly recent thing. 00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:28.320 I've let go of the grip of the need to do everything and do it my way. 00:14:28.720 --> 00:14:33.279 And I think maybe using that matrix is a really good way to help you think about delegating, isn't it? 00:14:33.360 --> 00:14:41.200 Because if there is stuff in that in that quadrant that is urgent and needs to be done, but isn't important and doesn't have to be done by you, yeah. 00:14:41.440 --> 00:14:46.720 That's a way of perhaps visualising it and really thinking about those specific tasks. 00:14:46.879 --> 00:14:48.799 I think that's quite a useful exercise to do. 00:14:49.039 --> 00:14:49.440 Yeah. 00:14:49.759 --> 00:15:03.600 And also if it's in the urgent but not important, well not urged but important, and

you you know, you need to do it or you want to do it, then just put it in there, but put it out of your mind and block some time out in the future somewhere. 00:15:03.840 --> 00:15:05.039 Yeah, the following week or something. 00:15:05.279 --> 00:15:10.159 So yeah, yeah, so you don't have to keep thinking about it because that's half the trick, isn't it? 00:15:10.240 --> 00:15:20.240 I think all of these methods, it's about not holding it all in your head at all at the same time until it is done, and then gathering more and more things to do, and your head's just like spinning, isn't it? 00:15:20.399 --> 00:15:28.000 And trying to compute, and that's what that's when you feel like you're less productive and procrastinating because you don't know where to start. 00:15:28.320 --> 00:15:33.759 I think actually blocking out the time for organising your week is is important, it's a part should be a part of your working day. 00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:39.120 So whether you do it on a Sunday or whether you do it first thing when you start on a Monday, depending on the type of job you do. 00:15:39.360 --> 00:15:43.840 I think taking the time to plan, look at all of the things you've got to do. 00:15:43.919 --> 00:15:45.279 That's that's a crucial part of the day. 00:15:45.360 --> 00:15:46.559 But we don't necessarily do it, do we? 00:15:46.720 --> 00:15:51.360 Just start the day, and then you're into the day, and before you know it, it's it's Thursday. 00:15:51.519 --> 00:15:59.039 Yeah, but I think actually allowing yourself blocking out that time to to look at your plan, and I think that's really important. 00:15:59.360 --> 00:16:01.200 And like you do at the end of your day. 00:16:01.279 --> 00:16:08.720 I mean, I tend to do it like first thing in the morning, early in the morning when I've got some quiet time before I've even got on the start of my day. 00:16:08.960 --> 00:16:19.519 I'll tend to I'll know what's going on for the week because I would have looked at the week, but I'll just remind myself and then get my head into into gear in the morning rather than doing it the night before. 00:16:19.600 --> 00:16:22.080 So you you sort of finish your day with that, don't you? 00:16:22.320 --> 00:16:30.399 The reason I do that at the end of the day is when I'm going to finish is so I can try and relax in the evening because we'll we'll talk a bit in a minute about the importance of rest, proper rest. 00:16:30.559 --> 00:16:44.879 But I feel like if I my day quite often ends um busily, so I because I might in the afternoon, we've got clients in the US and so I might end up having three meetings back to back in the afternoon, and then I've got to go and pick where you're up. 00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:49.360 So my day ends abruptly, and I'm a little bit panicked then that I feel like I've not. 00:16:49.440 --> 00:16:54.879 So if you imagine I've picked actions up out of meetings to do, and then I need to go, so it's in my head. 00:16:54.960 --> 00:17:10.319 So I

always try and just have, even if it's just 15 minutes before I have to go be somewhere wherever I've got to go at the end of the day, just to write, just to make sure I've blocked into my calendar for the next day all the things that have come out of today that I need to make sure are done because then I feel like I can switch off. 00:17:10.480 --> 00:17:15.519 Yeah, otherwise I feel like I've got to come back and think about it because I'll forget it by the morning. 00:17:15.839 --> 00:17:21.359 I suppose your your routine, now you've changed your gym slot, is a little bit later than mine. 00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:34.799 So mine my day typically finishes about three, as in meeting day, and then I'm I've got uh an abrupt finish and I'm out the door for a couple of hours, but then I'll come back to it to kind of do that window, I guess. 00:17:34.880 --> 00:17:36.960 So yeah, it's the same, just slightly different. 00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:44.319 I suppose I'm not doing my to-do list for the next day, but I'm sort of downloading anything that I've needed to that I sort of finished abruptly with. 00:17:44.480 --> 00:17:45.599 Yeah, yeah, that's interesting. 00:17:45.839 --> 00:17:48.960 Actually, another thing I did this week talking about getting rid of distractions. 00:17:49.039 --> 00:17:52.480 I bought the calculator because I we use our phones, don't we? 00:17:52.640 --> 00:18:02.400 But we kept finding that I was picking my phone up to to use the calculator because I prefer that than using the one with a computer, and then that's it 10 minutes later, or 20 minutes later. 00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:04.960 Well, you've got 20 notifications, yeah. 00:18:05.039 --> 00:18:08.799 I'm still on it because I'm distracted by WhatsApp or I've gone on Instagram and had a little look. 00:18:08.960 --> 00:18:20.880 So I find putting my phone away if I'm gonna do a set task, and actually, another another method that she talks about in the book is quick ticks, tasks, and projects. 00:18:20.960 --> 00:18:28.559 Yeah, so again, so so thinking about separating things up into quick ticks, bigger tasks, and then big projects that need to be broken down. 00:18:28.640 --> 00:18:31.200 And those quick ticks, I think we were saying earlier, weren't we? 00:18:31.359 --> 00:18:33.279 If it's less than two minutes, probably just do it. 00:18:33.519 --> 00:18:34.319 Yeah, yeah. 00:18:34.480 --> 00:18:50.880 And I that's actually quite nice because I think I said I I write down, used to write down every tiny detail about, you know, call the doctor, just pick the phone up and call the doctor now or make that appointment, change, change dentist's appointment, you know, if it's um sort of home stuff. 00:18:51.119 --> 00:18:59.359 So yeah, I'm getting better at that because it can feel you you can feel like you're just writing to-do lists otherwise, and it's just overwhelming, isn't it? 00:18:59.440 --> 00:19:00.160 To look at it. 00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:02.960 I've always been quite

good at doing those things in the moment. 00:19:03.039 --> 00:19:05.119 So as soon as something comes in my head, I'll just do it. 00:19:05.200 --> 00:19:07.440 Yeah, I've always sort of been that's really good. 00:19:07.680 --> 00:19:08.319 That's really good. 00:19:08.400 --> 00:19:12.799 I haven't so much, so it's it's a new thing for me, new territory for me. 00:19:13.279 --> 00:19:17.119 And I think there's two parts to working hard, hardly working. 00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:20.240 I mean, this isn't a review of the book, but there's just some great techniques in there, isn't there? 00:19:20.400 --> 00:19:29.839 So that's it's our it's a really interesting book because the second part is hardly working, and it's just about the importance of rest that rest is so productive too. 00:19:29.920 --> 00:19:33.440 And I just think how often do we truly rest? 00:19:34.400 --> 00:19:35.839 Because life is so busy. 00:19:35.920 --> 00:19:53.440 I don't, I don't know about you, but if I get a free day, I used to well, I'm I'm getting much better at it, but I tend to fill it up with stuff because the thought of just not doing anything, yeah, just feels because what what is I mean, what is sort of proper rest? 00:19:53.599 --> 00:19:54.880 What does that actually look like? 00:19:54.960 --> 00:19:57.039 I suppose you know, would it be going for a walk? 00:19:57.119 --> 00:19:58.240 Is that what are you talking about? 00:19:58.319 --> 00:20:00.000 That leaving your phone at home? 00:20:00.319 --> 00:20:03.200 Yeah, because if I go for a walk, I'll perhaps listen to a podcast. 00:20:03.359 --> 00:20:03.680 Yeah, yeah. 00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:07.039 So then that's really getting your steps in, yeah. 00:20:07.200 --> 00:20:12.160 Um, for me lately, actually, I'd I'd stopped watching TV a lot, like I hardly ever watch TV. 00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:17.680 But actually, I find the one way that really switches me off is if I'm watching something I'm really enjoying. 00:20:17.759 --> 00:20:24.799 So if I can find a series that I love and I can't wait to watch the next one, yeah, find that many, but that is when I will really switch off. 00:20:24.880 --> 00:20:26.640 Because if I don't do that, I'm tempted. 00:20:26.720 --> 00:20:33.200 If I've just got something on, or I'm just sitting down and maybe I'm tempted to just keep doing things unless I get engrossed in something. 00:20:33.359 --> 00:20:35.599 And I think it depends on the sort of job you do, doesn't it? 00:20:35.680 --> 00:20:39.279 But even if you even if it's for us, there's always something that could be done. 00:20:39.440 --> 00:20:45.200 Work from home all the time, there's always something I could be doing if I wanted to. 00:20:45.279 --> 00:20:46.880 I have no set hours, yeah. 00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:47.599 So I could do it. 00:20:47.680 --> 00:20:50.079 It doesn't matter if I do something at 10 o'clock at night, that's fine. 00:20:50.160 --> 00:20:53.359 So there's always something that could be done, and I guess same with the house, isn't there? 00:20:53.440 --> 00:20:55.200 There's always something that can be done in the home. 00:20:55.440 --> 00:21:01.119 Yeah, so finding a way that stops you from thinking about those things or trying to do something. 00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:05.759 I I do find if I'm in the home, I am, I would find something. 00:21:05.839 --> 00:21:08.720 Just I would find something because there's always something. 00:21:08.799 --> 00:21:12.880 I don't know when we talked about decluttering and and organising the home. 00:21:13.119 --> 00:21:19.680 If that's not right, I I can rest when that's organised and when things are you know where they should be in the home. 00:21:19.920 --> 00:21:24.559 But yeah, for me, I suppose it's it's getting out, getting out. 00:21:24.720 --> 00:21:30.400 Not necessarily, you know, exercise or anything, but if I'm out with a dog, that's my switch off time. 00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:33.839 And often I'll I'll not listen to a podcast now, you know. 00:21:33.920 --> 00:21:36.400 I don't always, or I'll leave the phone in the car. 00:21:36.559 --> 00:21:42.880 I know it's only for a short while, but I'll I'll just literally go and I'll I'll just be out walking and you know sleeping. 00:21:43.359 --> 00:21:44.480 Your mind's rested, isn't it? 00:21:44.720 --> 00:21:45.039 Brain's rested. 00:21:45.759 --> 00:21:46.960 Yeah, your brain's rested. 00:21:47.519 --> 00:21:55.599 And one thing I've actually started doing um the last only the last couple of weeks when the weather's started to change a bit, is having a bubble bath. 00:21:55.839 --> 00:21:56.720 And I've loved that. 00:21:57.839 --> 00:21:58.640 Yeah, that's a good one. 00:21:58.799 --> 00:21:59.839 I don't I don't love baths. 00:22:00.319 --> 00:22:01.200 Maybe I'll try. 00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:06.559 I don't really know, I don't really have them throughout the year until it gets to this time of year, I think. 00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:08.880 And then I think, oh, it's quite getting quite dark outside. 00:22:08.960 --> 00:22:12.160 I might have a bubble bath and yeah, just switch off from everyone. 00:22:12.960 --> 00:22:14.079 That's a great one, actually. 00:22:14.160 --> 00:22:15.279 Yeah, that's a good one. 00:22:15.359 --> 00:22:22.880 I think, but for me, yeah, at the moment, watching a good series, because then also because you even find now we you're watching TV and you're going on your phone at the same time, aren't you? 00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:23.440 Yeah, yeah. 00:22:24.559 --> 00:22:25.680 Which is just crazy. 00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:27.920 So you're not really engaged with either, are you? 00:22:29.920 --> 00:22:35.839 Scrolling or flicking about, and and I think that's really important to recognise as well that that's not really rest, is it? 00:22:35.920 --> 00:22:50.960 Because you might think, oh, laying down on the sofa or or having a line in bed and going, I can be quite bad for doing that and just flicking through, scrolling

through Instagram, but that's not really resting, that's not really switching off because you're I find it makes you feel a bit rubbish, actually. 00:22:51.200 --> 00:22:51.920 Yeah, it does. 00:22:52.000 --> 00:22:56.720 It does scroll for a long time, and then you just think, Oh god, what was the point of that? 00:22:56.880 --> 00:23:05.359 Or yeah, you've seen something that's irritated you unnecessarily, or it should yeah, like say you just don't feel rested, do you? 00:23:05.599 --> 00:23:07.279 And if you're not rested, you're not productive. 00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:08.240 It's it's so true, isn't it? 00:23:08.319 --> 00:23:08.880 You're not at your best. 00:23:08.960 --> 00:23:13.519 You've got to, I think what you are then, you can be busy, super busy, but not really productive. 00:23:13.680 --> 00:23:18.160 Yeah, so doing lots of stuff, procrastinating, not not flitting from different things. 00:23:18.319 --> 00:23:20.720 I think you need to be rested to be able to focus properly. 00:23:20.960 --> 00:23:23.440 Yeah, and that's also where ideas come to you, you know. 00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:33.039 Definitely, when you're switched off, yeah, when your mind's rested, or you might be inspired by something, and then it just sort of gives you motivation, and doesn't it? 00:23:33.359 --> 00:23:35.039 I mean, procrastination is another thing. 00:23:35.119 --> 00:23:38.000 Do you is there anything in your life that you procrastinate on? 00:23:38.559 --> 00:23:47.839 I mean, there is different the they're all if there's a job, I mean it's not one set thing particularly, but if I've got something I don't particularly enjoy, that's the thing, isn't it? 00:23:47.920 --> 00:23:53.680 If it's a task you don't necessarily enjoy, you don't want to do it, so you just keep thinking about it rather than just getting on with it. 00:23:53.759 --> 00:23:59.279 And I think that's where the discipline of if you're rested, choose a time, maybe I suppose for those tasks. 00:23:59.440 --> 00:24:04.559 Probably what's quite a good shout is to choose choose a time that you know you're gonna be rested. 00:24:04.640 --> 00:24:13.279 So maybe don't pick Monday morning when you've had a really busy weekend, yeah, to put yourself in a task that you don't actually love doing and you're gonna procrastinate on or it's gonna be really heavy. 00:24:13.519 --> 00:24:16.640 Yeah, pick a time that you know you're gonna be feeling good. 00:24:16.799 --> 00:24:19.039 For me, I do need to put stuff in it for the mornings. 00:24:19.279 --> 00:24:24.559 If I've got stuff that I need to really focus on, then my time to do that is early morning, yeah. 00:24:24.720 --> 00:24:30.880 Yeah, it's when I'm most alert, yeah, and your mind, your mind's quicker, I think, in the morning. 00:24:31.119 --> 00:24:35.759 You can think, yeah, you can think clearly it's not got weighed down from the the day. 00:24:36.079 --> 00:24:37.200 And not everybody's like that. 00:24:37.279 --> 00:24:38.960 Some people are not great in the mornings, are they? 00:24:39.039 --> 00:24:45.039 I mean, I'm talking about if I really have got a big thing to do, I can get it done best probably at like six in the morning if I get up early. 00:24:45.200 --> 00:24:49.920 Yeah, make just sit quietly before anyone else is really around as well. 00:24:50.160 --> 00:24:52.319 Yeah, that's probably why, but not everybody's like that. 00:24:52.400 --> 00:24:55.279 Some people are better later on in the day, aren't they? 00:24:55.359 --> 00:24:58.880 Everyone's got kind of different clocks, some people hate the mornings. 00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:00.960 I think you have to adapt as well, don't you? 00:25:01.039 --> 00:25:09.440 I mean, when when my two uh were little and I was working more evenings because they weren't yet at school, I'd be working like two in the morning sometimes. 00:25:09.680 --> 00:25:10.880 I couldn't I couldn't do it now. 00:25:10.960 --> 00:25:16.640 I'd still be working as our sort of what we're doing in the day, I'd be doing it at night time. 00:25:16.720 --> 00:25:17.759 I don't know how I did it really. 00:25:17.839 --> 00:25:23.440 It's a short-term thing, but you know, some people like you say are more alert at night or more focused. 00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:31.200 I've had to accept that because I used to work, I used to always say, I'll do it this evening, and what I do during the day, if something came up, I say I'll work tonight. 00:25:31.279 --> 00:25:35.119 And I was like, I actually hate this, I don't want to work tonight, I don't need doing it. 00:25:35.279 --> 00:25:43.279 I I'm not I'm too tired, so I've actually accepted that about myself now, and I don't even bother saying that I'm gonna do it tonight because I know I'm not new. 00:25:43.519 --> 00:25:51.519 So I just have started definitely knowing myself better and giving myself things to do when I know I'm more on form. 00:25:51.920 --> 00:25:52.799 Yeah, yeah. 00:25:52.960 --> 00:25:58.640 I I probably could still work at night, but the family think otherwise, and I should expect that, you know. 00:25:58.720 --> 00:26:02.400 I I'd probably be at my desk at 10 o'clock at night, you know, still doing something. 00:26:02.640 --> 00:26:07.920 But I think I've learnt over time where we, you know, we work split shifts sometimes, don't we? 00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:12.319 You know, it might be on early in the morning, then you you know, you might go off for a couple of hours or whatever. 00:26:12.400 --> 00:26:24.720 Our days are quite split sometimes, and I think I'm able to switch between the two so I can have that relaxation say in an afternoon, but then get back on it later in the day. 00:26:25.039 --> 00:26:27.759 I was just gonna say, I'm definitely gonna take on board the matrix. 00:26:27.839 --> 00:26:34.240 I think I'm definitely gonna look at sectioning off those jobs, yeah, and also looking at right quick ticks, tasks, and projects. 00:26:34.400 --> 00:26:37.680 And I do think it's

the the book's actually worth a read. 00:26:37.759 --> 00:26:42.400 I think I think it's a good if you want some sort of guidance and some techniques to use. 00:26:42.480 --> 00:26:45.119 I think it's very practical, it's very practical. 00:26:45.839 --> 00:26:52.720 Yeah, and I know she's got her, I think she's got a Grace Beverly planner of some sort. 00:26:52.880 --> 00:27:01.519 We I I actually use our planner for home weekly planner for our for our home life, so everyone knows what's going on. 00:27:01.680 --> 00:27:06.480 I mean, my daughter's now, one in particular, needs to know what the meal plan is for the week. 00:27:06.559 --> 00:27:10.000 And I'm not great at that, I'm not really not great at meal planning. 00:27:10.160 --> 00:27:17.759 Um, so we'll sit down on a weekend and we'll just see what's going on, who's got what after school, where am I going to be. 00:27:17.920 --> 00:27:26.480 Um, so yeah, we sort of plan that out and then what the meals are for the week, roughly, and then what's what's coming up the following weekend. 00:27:26.640 --> 00:27:29.839 So they kind of have got it in their mind what's going on. 00:27:29.920 --> 00:27:34.720 Because you know, I I feel like I know, and it's in my diary, but it's not obvious to everybody else. 00:27:34.880 --> 00:27:37.759 So we have that, and that just stays in the kitchen now. 00:27:38.079 --> 00:27:39.440 Yeah, that's a really good idea. 00:27:39.519 --> 00:27:42.720 Because how do you get on with so obviously we talked quite a bit about work? 00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:45.839 So, what about personal life planning? 00:27:46.000 --> 00:27:49.599 I mean it's well, it's tricky, isn't it? 00:27:49.680 --> 00:27:56.000 I suppose it revolves around the um weekends of the school day, I guess. 00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:59.680 In if you've got a fight, you've got children still at school. 00:28:00.000 --> 00:28:02.640 I've got a dog, so it works around his walks as well. 00:28:02.720 --> 00:28:19.279 So my day is sort of um planned around that to some degree, and then yeah, just weekends, I guess we just make sure it's in the planner for anything particularly busy plan, maybe work-wise with Matt's work as well. 00:28:19.359 --> 00:28:25.039 So it's kind of gone a little bit awry weekend wise, but normally we kind of all know where we are. 00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:38.160 The girls are now seeing their dad, we see that on a monthly basis, so it just sort of works around that, and then yeah, we just sort of plan on a weekly basis, have the planner, um, try and have a discussion around it, I suppose. 00:28:38.240 --> 00:28:39.519 There's things that crop up, aren't there? 00:28:39.680 --> 00:28:44.480 Appointments, author done's appointments, doctors, you know, all of those things crop up along the way, don't they? 00:28:44.720 --> 00:28:45.599 Waxing. 00:28:45.920 --> 00:28:47.039 No, I always miss. 00:28:49.279 --> 00:28:52.880 I'm a bit rubbish at uh making those appointments, but anyway. 00:28:53.759 --> 00:28:59.279 I think making sure making sure you book in the stuff you really want to do is important, isn't it? 00:28:59.440 --> 00:29:08.000 So I think I mean I've already plotted stuff in for next year because I think if there's things that you really want to do, life gets busy, so you've got to make sure that they're they're planned in. 00:29:08.079 --> 00:29:13.359 And I think I think you can I try not to be, I always try to make sure I do leave space for spontaneous stuff. 00:29:13.440 --> 00:29:22.240 Like I don't want everything to be planned within an inch of its life, but I do think if there's important stuff, especially with Christmas coming up, like we're just coming into this time of year now, which is so busy, isn't it? 00:29:22.319 --> 00:29:23.039 And overwhelming. 00:29:23.119 --> 00:29:24.799 I think it's really overwhelming. 00:29:24.880 --> 00:29:26.720 It can be, it can be, yeah. 00:29:26.960 --> 00:29:28.000 I'm trying to let go. 00:29:28.079 --> 00:29:35.599 I mean, I've I've let go a lot of over the last few years when it comes to Christmas, and I think there's a few key things and key people I really want to see. 00:29:35.680 --> 00:29:39.200 So, what I'll do now is make sure that those dates are kind of locked in. 00:29:39.440 --> 00:29:47.839 I I've started to this year is the first time I've started to book things in advance from October, really. 00:29:47.920 --> 00:29:59.680 I never would have done that before because I I don't enjoy the Christmas period for a number of reasons, but I find the whole December quite overwhelming, and I love that bit in between Christmas and New Year. 00:29:59.759 --> 00:30:07.839 That's my sort of I'm getting ready for the new year, that's I'm a fresh start because I'm done with this Christmas lark kind of um week. 00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:25.440 But yeah, this year I feel I feel I've let go the grip of it quite a lot, and I don't know what what switched in my head about it this year because previously it would have been I could I could feel the tension coming, but this year I started to get um a few dates in the diary with friends, with family. 00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:38.720 Um going to a pants of mine at the end of November, so quite early, so it starts to get us in the mood for it as well, and it's about making sure you've got time in between those hectic times, isn't it? 00:30:38.880 --> 00:30:43.200 Just to recover and just have a bit of downtime, but also not put so much pressure on yourself. 00:30:43.359 --> 00:30:44.559 I'm terrible for that. 00:30:44.799 --> 00:30:50.160 For a perfect day, or not even a perfect day, but I've got to cook, do the whole shebang. 00:30:50.240 --> 00:30:53.200 I'm not even doing that this year, not cooking, aren't you? 00:30:54.480 --> 00:30:54.880 Amazing. 00:30:55.039 --> 00:30:56.400 You're not gonna have Christmas dinner. 00:30:56.720 --> 00:31:03.599 Oh tonight, we're gonna have Christmas Eve, a little gathering, a little, you

know, probably just do party feed to be honest. 00:31:03.680 --> 00:31:06.720 And we'll have I I like Christmas Eve, quite like Christmas Eve anymore. 00:31:06.880 --> 00:31:08.000 I love Christmas Eve, yeah. 00:31:08.079 --> 00:31:08.480 I love it. 00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:14.400 And then yeah, Christmas Day, we'll have the morning with the girls and then they'll go to their dads, and that'll be it. 00:31:14.480 --> 00:31:16.880 We won't be Christmas lunch. 00:31:16.960 --> 00:31:20.799 We'll go off and do something, but oh that'd be nice, yeah. 00:31:20.880 --> 00:31:21.359 That'll be nice. 00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:25.119 I I tend to let go on the year that so Rhea goes to her dad's every other year. 00:31:25.279 --> 00:31:29.759 So last year, I mean I'd had too much drink in a late night the night before Christmas dinner. 00:31:29.839 --> 00:31:34.880 I I needed a nap, so I left my brother to finish off the Christmas dinner and went to your house. 00:31:35.279 --> 00:31:36.000 In my own house. 00:31:36.079 --> 00:31:38.960 Yeah, he was talking about at the weekend because he was saying it's an absolute joke. 00:31:39.119 --> 00:31:45.440 He was calling me the hostess with the least S because I literally just went to bed at the crucial time and just had a lay down. 00:31:46.079 --> 00:31:48.000 But yeah, too much for me. 00:31:48.720 --> 00:31:49.599 You can just overthink. 00:31:49.759 --> 00:31:51.039 I mean, I never used to be like that. 00:31:51.200 --> 00:31:56.000 God, I used to, when I was married, we always hosted Christmas at our house and I we did loads of shopping. 00:31:56.160 --> 00:31:58.079 We spent so much money, we used to buy so much stuff. 00:31:58.160 --> 00:32:00.000 I mean, now I just don't even bother buying anything. 00:32:00.079 --> 00:32:01.279 The shops are open, aren't they? 00:32:01.359 --> 00:32:07.519 Like, think about they are you can get anything most of the time, so you really don't need to spend a fortune stock up. 00:32:07.680 --> 00:32:10.319 We used to have so much stuff left that we didn't eat, so I just refuse. 00:32:10.400 --> 00:32:11.359 I don't do that anymore. 00:32:11.920 --> 00:32:13.200 We don't buy much actually. 00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:17.839 I used to buy loads of all the party food, I don't really buy that anymore, to be honest. 00:32:18.079 --> 00:32:21.680 And it's lovely because I think when when you're younger, so it's exciting, isn't it? 00:32:21.759 --> 00:32:23.759 It's lovely when you have your own home and you've got it all stocked. 00:32:23.839 --> 00:32:24.960 It's it's a nice feeling. 00:32:25.039 --> 00:32:29.759 There's times when it's been nice to do that, but yeah, it's not I don't don't worry about that now. 00:32:29.839 --> 00:32:32.319 And even Christmas presents, we've sort of changed how we do that. 00:32:32.480 --> 00:32:41.839 And for the I mean, not for the children, but for the adults in the family, we do a secret centre, so we just buy one present, you pull them out of the

hat, and then it's a bigger, higher value present. 00:32:41.920 --> 00:32:43.279 So that kind of keeps that in control. 00:32:43.359 --> 00:32:54.720 And with lots of friends, me and my friends actually, but where we used to buy presents for chill each other's children, we we'd made the decision to only do that at birthdays because birthdays a bit more special, it's just you, isn't it? 00:32:54.880 --> 00:32:58.480 And actually at Christmas, where they get so much, yeah. 00:32:58.559 --> 00:33:00.559 We we stopped Christmas. 00:33:00.880 --> 00:33:06.480 Yeah, I mean, we we've in in both of our families, we've now got a cap on what to spend on everyone. 00:33:06.640 --> 00:33:09.039 And if anyone does spend over that, they get told off. 00:33:09.200 --> 00:33:12.240 So because it's it it's just it just keeps it fair. 00:33:13.200 --> 00:33:17.759 Otherwise, it's like you know, you've received a hundred pound gift from someone and you bought them a 25 pound gift, yeah. 00:33:18.319 --> 00:33:20.079 It just got a little bit silly. 00:33:20.400 --> 00:33:26.240 And adults as adults, we don't need anything these days, just a token gift, or if it's something specific you want. 00:33:26.400 --> 00:33:29.759 My mum's usually got a Christmas list, she's like a little child, she is. 00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:31.440 Would you like to see my Christmas list? 00:33:33.359 --> 00:33:34.559 That's quite handy though. 00:33:34.640 --> 00:33:35.519 I wish my mum would do that. 00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:36.400 She never wants anything. 00:33:36.799 --> 00:33:38.160 She buys everything for herself. 00:33:38.240 --> 00:33:39.359 That's the trouble, isn't it? 00:33:39.519 --> 00:33:41.759 You buy uh we buy ourselves what we want. 00:33:42.000 --> 00:33:43.279 Exactly, when you want it. 00:33:43.359 --> 00:33:45.359 So, so how does your secret centre work then? 00:33:45.440 --> 00:33:47.440 Do you not have an idea of what anybody wants? 00:33:47.519 --> 00:33:48.559 They don't give you an idea. 00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:51.039 Yeah, because it's you know, they would give you an idea. 00:33:51.119 --> 00:33:52.319 Yeah, it's a bigger present, yeah. 00:33:52.480 --> 00:33:53.359 Because it's a bigger present. 00:33:53.440 --> 00:33:59.039 So then basically the idea is you get something you actually want that's a higher value rather than not necessarily lots of little stuff. 00:33:59.119 --> 00:34:01.200 So, but that that's there are downsides. 00:34:01.440 --> 00:34:09.920 It is, but there are downsides to that because sometimes I want to I might see something I want to get my mum or which I still then which defeats the object, doesn't it? 00:34:10.000 --> 00:34:15.119 Really, but um well, I suppose you just don't feel the pressure to buy 10 gifts, right? 00:34:15.199 --> 00:34:18.639 You know, if you want to buy your mum a little something extra, that's a bit different, isn't it? 00:34:18.719 --> 00:34:21.119 But you're not trying to think of 10 different people. 00:34:21.760 --> 00:34:27.199 I also think um what's a really nice thing is I'd rather have time with people and experiences. 00:34:27.360 --> 00:34:38.000 So actually, rather than like with my friends who've got children, I'd actually rather arrange a meetup and spend the money on going ice skating or doing something, you know, having doing something together. 00:34:38.239 --> 00:34:45.199 And actually, one of my friends, her her parents are really good at that, so they buy the gift for the family, is is something for them all to do together. 00:34:45.280 --> 00:34:52.320 They're going to the theatre next year next week, which is a gift that they bought everybody the ticket to go and do something together. 00:34:52.480 --> 00:34:53.440 Yeah, and actually, do you know what? 00:34:53.519 --> 00:34:55.920 I might even suggest that this year to my family. 00:34:56.079 --> 00:34:58.559 Let's just all put in instead, maybe. 00:34:58.719 --> 00:35:02.079 Yeah, and think of a really lovely thing that we want to do together. 00:35:02.400 --> 00:35:03.920 Yeah, that's a great idea. 00:35:04.079 --> 00:35:06.320 That's a great idea because there's so many lovely things go on. 00:35:06.480 --> 00:35:11.920 All there's like um they do these, what do they call them, like tunnel of lights and stuff like that, don't they? 00:35:12.159 --> 00:35:14.000 So lots of different things going on. 00:35:14.320 --> 00:35:18.400 I always book a we always book a light show with friends and take the children, we always do that. 00:35:18.719 --> 00:35:23.679 So it's much that's more that's the memories, isn't it, really, rather than the things and the presents. 00:35:24.159 --> 00:35:28.159 I have to say though, I get more presents than anyone these days. 00:35:28.320 --> 00:35:29.519 I've gone years. 00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:30.400 Yeah. 00:35:31.199 --> 00:35:32.719 My girls hate it. 00:35:33.360 --> 00:35:34.400 I've gone years. 00:35:34.480 --> 00:35:36.960 I mean, when I was married, I didn't barely got anything. 00:35:37.039 --> 00:35:47.679 So the when the girls were little, I was you know, they would have these massive piles, but in the last few years, my pile's been the biggest, and I'm the slowest because I like to sleep on it, so I'm there for hours. 00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:49.760 And the girls are like, hurry up. 00:35:51.119 --> 00:35:54.559 And I don't have to look at everything or write down who it's from. 00:35:54.639 --> 00:35:58.639 I mean, most of the uh Matt gets me all that you know, Matt and the girls. 00:35:58.800 --> 00:36:01.119 But yeah, I get a massive pile these days. 00:36:01.679 --> 00:36:04.000 It's lovely, it's all really lovely stuff as well. 00:36:04.159 --> 00:36:06.639 I've already treated it. 00:36:08.079 --> 00:36:10.079 Yeah, Sanjay doesn't come to me. 00:36:10.320 --> 00:36:12.079 Does he know you're not being very good? 00:36:12.400 --> 00:36:12.719 No. 00:36:15.840 --> 00:36:23.280 Um, so I think probably if we were going to sort of share anything

for our listeners, just something useful to do. 00:36:23.440 --> 00:36:33.519 I think if you're feeling overwhelmed, and I think it can work in whether it's work or personal life, I think some of those techniques maybe do in that matrix of looking at what's urgent and important. 00:36:33.599 --> 00:36:39.039 And actually, we could put a a visual of that perhaps just in the yeah, that's a good idea, actually. 00:36:39.199 --> 00:36:40.960 Yeah, in the show link, we'll do that. 00:36:41.039 --> 00:36:50.400 And and just rather than just doing your to-do list, thinking about the to-do list a little bit differently, what is priority, what's bigger tasks, what's quick ticks that you can take off. 00:36:50.559 --> 00:36:52.800 So I think it's it's down to that, isn't it? 00:36:52.960 --> 00:36:54.800 Um and task batching, actually. 00:36:54.960 --> 00:37:05.679 So the bad that was another thing that I read, which was batching similar tasks together so that you can your brain is then on autopilot with short, quick tasks, admin tasks. 00:37:05.840 --> 00:37:10.800 So you feel like you achieve quite a lot in quite a short space of time of those small tasks. 00:37:10.880 --> 00:37:15.679 So I think rather than having one big never-ending list, batching stuff up. 00:37:15.840 --> 00:37:18.880 And and it's like you said, just picking up the phone. 00:37:18.960 --> 00:37:24.079 If you're thinking about something, you've got to make an appointment, or you know, it's gonna be a quick thing, just get on and do it. 00:37:24.320 --> 00:37:26.159 Then you write it down like I do. 00:37:26.400 --> 00:37:30.880 And when it's a bit and when it's a bigger thing, taking away the distraction, I think that's a key takeaway. 00:37:31.119 --> 00:37:32.559 I think turn off the email alert. 00:37:33.199 --> 00:37:36.880 What you can get done in one hour with zero distraction is amazing, isn't it? 00:37:36.960 --> 00:37:47.039 What you think you need to block out three hours for, actually, if you turn off every distraction, you put your phone in a different room for one hour, you can get it's incredible what you can get done. 00:37:47.199 --> 00:37:52.320 Yeah, and what we've started to do, um, we've probably been doing it for a little while now, isn't it? 00:37:52.400 --> 00:37:56.400 When we're on meetings, we don't go away with the actions, we do it in the meeting. 00:37:56.960 --> 00:37:57.840 Let's do it now, right? 00:37:58.000 --> 00:37:59.760 If you send an email to Bloody Got, right? 00:37:59.840 --> 00:38:01.599 Let's do it now, let's let's get this done. 00:38:01.679 --> 00:38:04.800 Yeah, we tend to do it there and then don't we've doing stuff in the morning. 00:38:05.920 --> 00:38:06.639 Really helps. 00:38:06.880 --> 00:38:07.840 Definitely. 00:38:08.320 --> 00:38:12.159 Okay, well, hopefully you've taken a few practical tips away from today. 00:38:12.239 --> 00:38:16.480 That the book is actually Working Hard, Hardly Working, as we said before, by Grace Beverly. 00:38:16.559 --> 00:38:28.000 And I do think for a practical um sort of look at productivity, but also then the the doing less and the rest time, which is equally as important, and it's definitely definitely worth a look. 00:38:28.400 --> 00:38:30.559 I'll put that in the show notes as well, actually. 00:38:30.719 --> 00:38:31.360 Yeah. 00:38:32.159 --> 00:38:32.639 That's it. 00:38:32.880 --> 00:38:34.000 Thanks for joining us. 00:38:34.239 --> 00:38:34.800 Thank you.