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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Cool People, Did Cool Stuff or c p W D C C AS by for short, and by short I mean long because it takes at least as long to say the acronym as does say the title of the show. And one of my least favorite things is people who try to correct me and say that acronyms are only acronyms when they are pronounceable as words. So I'm Mark kill j your host and with me. Today is the one and only Andrew T. Andrew Good just gave dog two kills. Yeah, everything's gone great on this day. That is definitely a different day from last time, because we definitely don't just record both episodes back to back most of the time. We've also got our producer, Sophie. How are you doing? Sophie? Still doing well? Was doing well all those days ago when we report recorded part one? Still well now? Yeah. The days just fly by between recording part one important by bye, they do. Sometimes it just feels like I get up and get a glass of water, yeah, and then that's it. We also have our editor Ian who's not on the calm, but later we'll be listening to everything we say, just to twist our words around and make it sound like we said are saying things that we're not saying. Like I actually got the acronym correct at the beginning of this episode and then um Ian switched it around to be wrong. And our theme music was written by a woman and you can check out the rest of her music if you would like. So today we're talking about food up bombs, and we're talking abou mutual aid. And if you didn't listen to the first half of this episode, you are missing out on us pontificating about Catholic theology for a moment, and also about why were or at least why I'm not excited about people dressing up as homeless people. Yeah, I mean, it's just so like a classic of the genre. But yeah, you know, so the street theater kind of always has that element to it, I guess, just like, yeah, yeah, it's not a it's not a high art form, and that is both its advantage and disadvantage, both artistically and politically. Exactly. Yeah, So, where we last left our heroes, they're feeding people every week. They're collecting donations from all over the city and delivering free groceries everywhere because they think that people might need free groceries, and then they're taking what's left over and making a ton of free food and feeding people in the park. And this is just a a good thing to do. No notes, the city is less convinced that it's a good thing to do, or at least they don't like the other stuff that these same activists are doing, um like sticking their noses into every protest and action that they possibly can, writing every good fight that they come across. So so Keith mckenry, one of the founders of food nut Bombs, the main person who's written all this history. He who's actually really cool most of the time. Um, he doesn't like that he's getting harassed by the city, Like he's getting harassed a lot by the city. Apparently is being kind of threatened by the city. Don't totally know what that. I don't know exactly. So he fucks off. He sucked off to San Francisco, and Food Up Bombs Boston keeps going without him. In seven he starts Food up Bombs San Francisco, and not long after, some people in Long Beach, which I don't know if you all knew this, but Long Beach is not actually the name of a beach in l A. It turns out apparently it's its own city. M yeah, yeah, Andrew, did you know that Los Angeles resident? Uh? I think, I mean, I assume it is also a beach though, right, I don't know is Los Angeles an actual city or is it just a Hollywood fabrication? So uh yeah, definitely both. Is A is a ridiculous city as far as that goes? Yeah, completely agree? Okay, just does cool Zone media have an official stance on whether or not it's chill for me to spread conspiracy theories like l A is a real place and not just a Hollywood fabrication, because that's the conspiracy for Los Angeles is a real place with stage wink at the audience that they can't see if I'm describing it, you can't see ship. Yeah all right. So some people in Long Beach, legally distinct from Los Angeles started food not bombs, and they were nervous about stealing the name food nut bombs, so they started calling it bread knot bombs. But then they got in touch with food nat bombs and tun bombs, like, oh my god, we don't care that rules used food not bombs. Um, so they become Food Nut Bombs, and food Nut Bombs writes up a little how to Get Started zine and they start passing it around. There's thirty chapters. They had a conference and decided on the three basic principles that I mentioned at the beginning of Monday's episode, free veggy based food, autonomous groups, non violence, and then they put out the first edition of a book called food Nut Bombs that explains the whole thing very direct titlers. I appreciate a good direct title. So the group explodes in popularity after this. Two years later, people attended international gathering in San Francisco and the representing the US, Canada, Mexico, and various countries in Europe. And okay, my my theory is that the only downside of the popularity Food Not Bombs is that we had to go through as activists the whole generation of slogans with names that are like bikes not bombs, home's not jails, food not lawn, solidarity not charity, the something not something. I really appreciate that y'alls is um something and something like. I feel like that's a really positive development. Um Yeah, I wasn't around for the genesis of it. I have no idea how any of that care to be. But yeah, that is actually a good point. Yeah, I we were we were at a protest recently, and I because I hadn't been involved in the early days of it when it was mostly protest support. UM for Solidarity snacks mentioned last episode, which people can financially support, Yes, we need or the fund is getting we we only have a couple more Saturdays left unless we get more funds, which hopefully will come in. Um. But I didn't realize that the like cart that my friend used initially to start the whole thing is like it was like well known amongst people. Really people were like, oh, it's the car, we know you. It's the car. That's pretty amazing. Yeah. Um so yeah, something and something that is my that is my endorsement society. It's a new a new wrinkle on the on the format. We've progressed past the need for things not the other thing that said, all of those things that I named like homes not jail's homes, that jail's rules, and I actually almost did a whole thing about them, but I ran out of time. They're like people who well they do kind of what they say. They they open up squads. The organizations are great, it's often just the like just another pass at the copy usually yeah, yeah, totally, exactly. Yeah, that's the main issue. And so that's why I would like to propose a new something and something food and bombs for people who want to kill the Tsar of Russia. I mean, if you want to kill the Tsar of Russia, it has been proven empirically through trial and air, a lot of air, the most effective way to kill Tazar of Russia is with bombs. So just saying putting that out there, please don't actually do that and then say that I had anything to do with it, Okay, shut yeah, totally no fucking snitches and food and bombs, all right, So food not bombs. It's getting super popular with people who like to eat food. But there are people who hate fun and freedom and people having nice things like food who are waiting in the wings. And these people, of course, best known as the government and the cops. This conflict first arises in a serious way in in San Francisco. You've got this mayor. He's super progressive. His name's Art Agnos. He ran on how environmental and feminist and pro union and ship he was, Ah spoiler. Okay, So he comes in during an intense period of gentrification of San Francisco and it's starting to change it into the yuppie hell hole we all know and love today. He wants to solve the homelessness crisis, and he starts off with some decent ideas about how to solve the homelessness crisis. M He wants to build low income housing, which of course always gets complicated, but it's not inherently wrong. Um. He also makes sleeping bands, and then he revives a nineteenth century law against lying down in public place with camping gear. Because you know that the government is doing something good when they find a law that has not been enforced in a hundred years. Yeah, so you should look at the laws, the other laws from that year and just see what else totally like, if this is who you're in company with, yeah, it can't be. These were not good legislators at the time. Yeah. Like, and here's the law against the following racial oh wait yeah yeah, oh yeah, but that's not for a couple of years. Yeah. No, that's the sweet spot, that is the hey day of that. Yeah. I think San Francisco is like it started being all the like, um, like, Chinese folks don't come here in the late nineteenth century, I think, Yeah, and hooray America has a really cool history. Yeah, and present that's wild the other yeah go ahead, Oh no, they're just just recapping for my brain, all right. Yeah. The laws back, Yeah, the laws back, and he starts sending out cops to sweep parks full of homeless folks. Fuck art Agnos. Uh, he's not progressive, he claims it, and and everyone I think starts seeing him as basically like, oh, he's the classic democrat. He it's a bait and switch. He gets elected by progressives because of the elector the people who vote a manner progressives, and then he serves neoliberalism instead. Um and fount Bombs shows up on the scene around the time same time as art Agnos and food nut Bombs. At the beginning, they weren't even trying to be controversial. They actually applied for a permit and did all of the paperwork and all that stuff. But the local business owners were like, no, you can't have homeless people eating food in public. Um as if there's some other place for people who don't have houses to eat food uh, so they pressure the city, the city denies the permit, and food nut Bombs rolls over and accepts it and ends as an organization. And wait, no, they say fuck it, and they feed people food anyway, And they start to get arrested for it, like a lot, Like in the first few months, there's almost a hundred arrests. It becomes an assembly line. Someone lines up to get a free meal. Someone scoops food onto the plate of the person who's there for a free meal, and the cops arrests the person who serves the food. So the next server steps up and feeds the next person in line and gets arrested. And and they just do this right because they're not afraid of civilis obedience. There. They do what's right, not what's safe. You know. Yeah, it's also truly like you know, obviously, if you're fucking cop, you are the worst human being. But like it's hard to have it more like in your face, what a fun discussing piece of ship you are that day, I know. Yeah. And so the fight is about food, I guess kind of, but not really. It's it's about more than that. It's about who controls public space. Are the parks controlled by the government or are they controlled by the people who make use of the park. And the government, of course, tends to believe that they're the ones who get to control the park, but I would argue, if you've ever been to a park, you know that that's not the case. The politics of a park are remapped daily by the people who are there. Like there might not be a sign up that says don't skateboard on the basketball court, but like the basketball court most of the time is for basketball players and who have their own structures about who decides which courts are being used, and like, you know, it's it's I mean, parts are are beautiful because they are these informal organizational spots that happen daily all over the world. Um, I don't know, it's like one thing I miss about living in cities and yeah, or just like like the like the yeah, the politics of any like public place are like so interesting. Yeah, it's just like you can make all the rules you want, but those aren't the rules, yeah totally. And you know, and people who have no private space to return to, they're going to use public space, which makes sense, right, And I've never had to deal with homelessness. I used to be a traveling activist, but that was by by choice is very structurally different. But I remember at this one time I was taking a nap in a van and a parking lot and it was really hot, so I opened the doors and and I was just thinking about how like I could now get in trouble. It would be perfectly legal for me to park my van and get out of it and leave my van in this public space, but now that I'm sleeping in it, it's sketchy. But even more than that, it seems so weird to me that if I didn't have a car, I can't just set my stuff down in this public space that is meant for holding stuff, right, is a public spaceman for people to leave their car and walk away. And it just sort of like hits me the magic of a car used in a certain way. Yeah, And then even if you have a car, if you don't have a private space to then take it home too later, you're not usually not allowed to park it anywhere. Um, and it I don't know whatever. This isn't news to anyone probably that there's a lot of laws against homelessness that I wish I had the quote in front of me, but I don't. There's that quote about the law and it's it's it's awesome equality outlaws before and the rich from like pissing, Yeah, um law the laws like perfectly fair, like like no one is permitted to sleep under the bridge or something, Yeah exactly. Um. And and l A specifically, they've they've come out with all these like where they pretend like it's not trying to do that type laws where they're like like recently l A City council approved an ordinance where it's like bike repair on the street is now illegal, and and then they were like, well, what do you mean this has not this has nothing to do with you know, the un housed communities. Uh. And and you know anybody with that that reads it is like just be honest, Yeah, what are you? What do you what do you mean? And uh, you know, there's there's so many different things. It's like putting bolder or is under freeway under passes and things like that. They're like, oh no, it's to prevent and they make up some lights like yeah, I saw a bat there once and I don't want people to get rabies. So that's why there's a Boulder. It's like, just treat people with dignity, don't be so bastards. We'll just be gloves off and be like we want our clean city. Actually, don't do that either. Don't do That's always like like, oh I I prefer the open fascists like like sort of it's glib, but yeah, don't tempt them. Yeah, I know, I'm not looking forward to that stage. It's like always like like, oh, I just prefer what people are saying, what they really believe. It's like I promise you don't totally yeah, I know. I know. We were talking about like democrats that run with these liberal policies and it's like, oh, no, you're a Republican and like that sucks. But but having like the actual fascists run on fat like yeah, it's like like the like I prefer it at least I know where I stand. It's like knowledge of where you stand is like such a valueless thing. And also like right, like when everyone had to be quiet about slightly more quiet about the racism and ship, I think it made fewer young racists because if you can't pass it on is this continent, racism is a continuion. So like truly, it is like like that that is like the thing it's like for all like the you know, subconscious or or like quiet racism, Like it truly is better. It is just better better society where at least they have to experience some sort of shame or second guessing themselves. Um, I'm not saying it's good, but it's better than the alternative. It's certainly use that totally Okay. So yeah, so all these people are getting arrested because the city is real clear how they want to control space. They're like, we control the parks. There's actually all these quotes from different city council people that are like or you know, from the city government that's like and cops that are like, we control these parks, not these homeless people in these anarchists or like they're making a political statement. I mean it's like, yeah, of course, feeding people in a society where there's people going hungry and dying in the streets as a political statement like this shouldn't be happening is a political statement because the current political system isn't working. Um. Also like pathetic that that is the like, yeah, you're scared of political statements? Yeah, yeah, totally, So the civil disobedience works, and after a few months, the city sits down to negotiate with them and gives them a temporary permit. They have to like move a couple blocks over to like get out of Um I think they're in Golden Gate Park at this point. They have to go a few blocks away, so they're like less public eye. But they drop all the charges against all the orestes and and things are a little better. But these radical homeless people. The next year they set up an encampment outside of city Hall and they have the coolest slogan ever for this exact thing, which is, we're tired, we're hungry, we don't like the government. Um, just say what you fucking mean. I want our side to say what they fucking mean. You know, that's significantly better. Yeah, well, the problem is most of our side quote unquote our side, uh doesn't mean that. That's true. Yep, that's that's the dark side of things. Uh. Well, fudnut Bombs decides to go support that just to avoid lingering on that dark thought. Turn up Bombs. They decided to go support this, this homeless lead initiative. And I believe at this point a decent nu chunk of the Food Up Bombs organizers are homeless folks themselves. I'm not entirely certain about how all that works, but it's yeah, more complicated than people might initially think. Um, And they set up a twenty four hour super kitchen to feed the protest camp. And this and the fact that some of the organizers non violently occupy the mayor's office, gets the whole encampment swept by the ostensibly progressive mayor and Funup Bombs permit is revoked, and so Found up Bombs is like, all right, fuck it, And they go back to the park no longer a couple of blocks away, and they just, um, they're not gonna be swept out from public eye, and they're just gonna feed people. And over the next seven years, this this fight goes on for seven years, over two administrations. Over a thousand activists get sighted and or arrested for feeding people in the park. Nuns and priests joined them. At one point, my favorite was that lawyers of the National Lawyers Guild showed up. Shout out to the National Lawyers Guild, They're great. They decided to serve food and get arrested. The cops are like, now we're good. I just don't arrest the National Lawyers Guild because that's who there sleep, right of. I mean they used to be. I I was at the UM just for a part of it. I wasn't able to be around for like the most violent parts of the uh disgusting hopefully soon to be gone. City Council member Mitchell Ferrell ordered the LAPD to sweep Echo Park like um here and truly, I mean it was one of those like right like this this felt like a new thing. I'm not super experienced with stuff, but like the l A p D like first of all, like you know, performing acts of violence now with like everything recorded, but like actively going after journalists and the like the green hat National folks, targeting them in some truly fascist ship and then setting up a uh literal concentration camp at Echo Park. They fence it off and you could not You didn't. You weren't free to leave or enter. They're just going to concentrate all the people into one place so that they can be handled. It was concentration, Yeah, it was, it was. It was you know, it was so fucking disgusting. Yeah, it's unforgettable. Major media wouldn't even like really cover it because their cowards. But it's like it was being live streamed on Twitter and you're seeing it and you're like, yeah, this this is a concentration camp in the middle of Los Angeles being run by our by the l A p d by and by actual fascist MITCHO Ferrell. Yeah, if you're listening to this and you're an l A voter and there's or if you're not, actually there's any way to to contribute to the Ugo Soto Martinez campaign in any way to unsee open fascist MITCHO Ferrell. Please do that please. One of the things that I keep running when I was researching this. At one point I got really frustrated about halfway through writing all this, where I was like, it's also quaint. I know that they were fighting for really hard things and it was really hard, but I'm just like, oh my god, Like, just even what you're saying about, you know, the National Lawyers Guild actually gets arrested now right in the exact same situation, and just like, yeah, I'm really not trying to downplay the incredible amount of work that Punat bombs well, that still does and does now in this new context. So I'm really not trying to knock it, um, but it is it's it's hard to see how far we've not come in terms of the move towards it. Yeah, I mean I think it. It is also like like probably the at least some version of this activism. The stuff that I felt like I saw a lot in the nineties was a lot of people insulated by their whiteness from some of the worst things. And but that is like part of you know, it goes both ways too, because it is like of civil disobedience is like civil disobedience only works if you're oppressors have any kind of conscience, and like, yeah, it's just like cops have more of a conscience for like white teens than you know, your average on house person, your average black person, etcetera. Like so there is some version of that, but then that becomes like sort of this white savior re vibe that can go the wrong way. It could turn into people encouraging street theater where you dressed up like the homeless because you don't think about what that means. Um, I don't know, sorry, I'm just like on that little tangent. It's like scary. Now think that's to me, Like like during the George Floyd uprising, it was just like, oh, the l a p D is like beating middle class white women in broad daylight now, which feels like an escalation, Like, you know, at least typically under they in the past, it feels like they would at least wait till sun down to do that. They were like actively kettling people at like on on a on a Tuesday at like one pm and then like and then like beating them on camera. Yeah. It was like pretty remarkable, honestly. Yeah. And you know what else is remarkable? Oh my god, Margaret, I was like, are you going to do that? Because it's that time. The concept of dogs dogs And oh, we have a new advertiser that I'm very excited about that we'll be running, and it would actually be the first host voiced ad that we'll be running on this network. And that is the concept of shut the funk up, Shut the fuck up. Yeah, shut the funk up, don't talk to cops. That is the concept. Oh smart, Yeah, No, sorry, I wasn't on you all to shut the funk up saying that when you get arrested, shut the funk up. Oh there's that too, But some of y'all do need to also shut the funk up. Here's some ads it Hi, Margaret Killjoy here boy, the world sure is a mess right now? Huh. Seems like every day there are more and more reasons to get out into this recent protest. That's why when I get arrested, there's only one strategy. I trust, I shut the funk up. I say, I would like to remain silent, I would like to talk to my lawyer, and then I shut the funk up. In the United States of America, it's constitutionally protected and recommended by the National Lawyers Guild. That's s h U t t h E f U c k u P. Once again, that's s h U T th h E f U c k u P. Because you can't talk yourself out of custody, but you can talk yourself into a conviction. Providing identification to law enforcement required in some states and situations, giving name an addressed expedient. In most circumstances, never discuss the events leading to arrest with anyone except your lawyer, doctor, or therapist. Posting pictures of protests and actions on social media may lead to complications if you have already talked to cops or experienced confuse and about talking to cops, call your attorney immediately, as these maybe signs of more serious legal problems. The concept of not talking to cops does not provide legal advice, and the foregoing statements are for informational purposes only if you have specific legal questions. Consultant attorney and we are back, um, and we are thinking about the escalation. And also yeah, how like people who actually are are more heavily marginalized by society have been dealing with this ship and it wasn't as like quaint even back you know. So that is a really good point. I mean it's it's tough. Yeah, it just goes always like it's like, yes, they're absolutely doing you know, a good thing on the balance, and like certainly there are the allies, but yeah, it's just it is weird, like the the using essentially you're on privilege to advance goals, but sort of still you have that privilege and you can not extend that privilege, which is always the precarious thing too. Yeah, and I mean I think that that has a lot to do with like where you're taking direction from right, Like, um, you know, if I'm going to be protesting in a context in which I'm attempting to use my white privilege, uh, it usually ideally would be in the context of like listening to um, you know, the direction and the overall strategy that is being proposed by the the group that I'm attempting to be in solidary with, you know, UM, and which is of course also really complicated because people are, like people of color or not, the monoliths even among individual you know, like identities, and so you know, you people choosing who they listen to. It. Well, this is why I don't run a politics podcasts. This ship gets messy. I just talk about history. No exactly. I mean I think that's like it's both messy and like ugly and and you know, the reality is there is no like right, Yeah, I think that that. And that's one of the things I love about movements that are so um like like diverse in terms of ideologies, in terms of ideas, in terms of strategies tactics, Like when we can work to coordinate different strategies and tactics together and different people coming from different positions, I feel like that's where we are our strongest personally. UM, so the next mayor San Francisco, speaking of people getting a little more um glove off. The next pair of San Francisco was the chief of police who orchestrated the crackdown on fodnut pomps. All right, and a runs an anti homeless camp on he runs onto anti homeless platform and things just heat up for food nut bombs. But of course also everywhere in the city with this guy. And over the course of the fight, the city removes all the benches from the park, so the folks have to eat sitting on the ground, which didn't stop anyone from eating food. You'll be shocked to know. Then they put up signs everywhere that said serving food without a permit is a crime. Um, these were probably roughly as effective escape warding is a crime science. Yeah, And and it's like it really is like, what, like what society are you in? You know that that that is your like priority. Let's say that means taxpayers spend money on this. It's like, is this really who you fucking are? It? Like it's gross to think about, like or to be that person. And the other thing they spent taxpayer money on was to remove the fountain from the park. Because I guess that would you know, all right, well they're gonna eat, they better not be somewhere with like pretty things. They better not enjoy it, you know, have access to a water feature anyway. Um, So food not Bomb starts getting it comes up with different tactics to deal with all this harassment. Right, people get sick of people of the cops stealing their food, so they start having decoy food buckets where they put a third of the food in the bucket and they go up and they set up, and the cops steal the bucket and then they're like, oh, shut you stole our food, and the cops leaves. So then they bring out the next third of a bucket and they serve some people, and then the cops steal the food, and then they bring out a final third in a third bucket, and the flyer that they distribute all over the world being like here's how to deal with it if the cops are stealing your food is like cops are too embarrassed to come back the third time to steal the food. And I don't know whether it's they're too embarrassed that they got like looney Tunes tricked, or if they're just embarrassed about the fact that it really hits home about the fact that they are like just stealing food. That's what their job is, is steal food from the mouths of hungry people. And Keith mckennry, the founder guy that you know I have the most information about, he was arrested ninety four times between which is more than once a month for seven years straight. As he puts it, he was framed up on three other felonies during that time. It was facing twenty five years in prison. UM. I have no counter argument to this. And during that same time period, for example, the FBI had just covered up the car bombing of two environmentalists, Judy Barry and Darryl Churney, and they the FEDS might have even done the car bombing, but the thing that's been proven in court is that they at least covered it up, right. So this is the so here I am being like ha ha at different times, like, actually, no people are getting car bombed by the FEDS. Um. Probably, but yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's just like it probably is. I mean they are the same people. They're worse than they have the internet now, but like they're the same people that have always been doing this ship. So yeah, it is different. There was more innocent and less innocent. Yeah, you know, in different ways different yea, yeah, yeah, it's just different, is honestly the Yeah. Yeah, they're not any less murderous in service of right, you know, of their their little society. Yeah, just their tactics changed in different situations. Yeah. He spends a total of Keith mckennry spends a total of five hundred days in jail during this seven year time just with all of these minor arrests for serving food. Um, and the harassment started gaining so bad that Amnesty International was wrote a letter to San Francisco saying that they were considering designating food up bombs activists as prisoners of conscience, basically saying like, if you, if you don't start harassing people based on their political beliefs, that we're going to adopt them as prisoners of conscious, you will be breaking international law and we will fight for their unconditional release. And eventually, two mayors later, food nut bombs just kind of wins by default because the city stops at war against them and they keep serving food. And thirty years after all this stuff they're still serving food, and they still serve food all over the world. The current best guests there's no official registry of food up bombs. The best guess is that there's around five hundred cities in the US with chapters and about five more cities around the world, and fun bombs of active US have been spied on by the FEDS and arrested by cops time and time again. Literally, while I was researching this, I messaged Sophia since I figured this out. I ran across a memo from the FBI about how they were spying on Denver Food Not Bombs in two thousand four, which is um when I was in Denver coun bombs, and it stuck out to me because they're describing how they were trying to get information out of my neighbors, like our house ran one day of cooking, and different houses across the city ran different days of it, and some punks like some it's like punks did it some days, students did it other days, whatever, and and so. The the document points out that while they arrested eight activists at the Food Not Bombs house, none of them nor any of the other people at the residents that the FBI was trying to question gave any information to the investigation, which rules and is what how you all should handle interactions with the federal police. You tell them that you have representation and that UM ask for their card and does the only information you give them. You don't lie to them and you don't tell them anything anyway. So after the fall of the Soviet Union, let's just jump gears really quick, run up. Bombs springs up all over Russia and the former Communist block Poland, Ukraine, Serbia, Croatia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, and Russia all have or had chapters, and the stakes there are a bit higher than they've been for a lot of the U S chapters. In November two thousand five, a food nut bombser in St. Petersburg Team or cache Vera, was hanging out at a cafe a few hours after serving food in the park. A crew of bone heads, which are Nazi skinheads, swarmed him, chanting and this will be a familiar chance to Americans that they were chanting anti Antifa Nazis restrained teamer while another another Nazi who was only fourteen years old, stabbed him to death five times in the neck and teamer was it was an anarchist and a philosophy student. He was twenty is old and he played in a punk band called Sandinista. Two years later, Bone had swarmed food not bombs in St. Petersburg again, and if I'm reading the various articles correctly, they swarmed the actual feeding itself. This time they attacked and another food nut bombs are Ivan yelling. He survives, but he got stabbed twenty times for serving food in the park. And while he was recovering in the hospital, dozens of his friends showed up to donate blood at the hospital. Some came from as far away as Moscow, which is like an eight hour train ride. Basically people coming in solidarity too to offer their blood. I'm sure they had plenty of blood. I hope that people showed up then gave blood to other people in the hospital, which is an interesting escalation of mutual aid. And then on the flourth of February two thousand seven, Nazis went for the ultimate irony and they bombed the food nut bombs. No one gets killed, Uh, they just want to like say that up front so there's less tension around that they hid a bomb in the flower stall, and it's I hate to laugh at this. It's to go off at the time of the feeding, but the jokes on the Nazis because feeding was run by punks and so they were late. So the bomb goes off before anyone arrives, and no one was hurt. And they've had people as usual on the day that Nazis tried to bomb them. I said at the very beginning where I was like, in this time, no one gets killed by Nazis, and actually one person gets killed by And I didn't. I didn't. I should have probably known where I was going. I was. I was more chuckling at the you know, we're anti anti five Yeah, yeah, you're just fascist. It's fine, yeah, your regulars Yeah yeah, no, I no, totally. Um yeah. And I remember when this happened. It hit us all kind of hard, and it was like kind of sobering, right, um, because we would get harassed for serving food nut bombs and like a couple of times I've served food, not bombs, are eating it with like riot police all around and helicopters overhead and all that ship. But fucking Russia, they're getting bombed for it. And and the attacks were focused. It's the same focus in the U. S. It's it's about who controls spaces. Right in the US, it is the government is like, we control the parks. And in Russia at the time, the Nazis were like, no, we control the parks, and so it was they were attacking the the St. Petersburg d i y leftist n anarchist punk scene which organized against the fascists under the name Antifa, and so the regular are not fans of Antifa, and so you know, no, it's but it's just like it's like again, if you're murdering people for like handing out food, it's it's I mean, but that's like such a like fascist through line, and it's just like and that is a little you know, we talked, I talked about it. It's like me not understanding, you know. I was sort of like, I guess I was still also just like not not not clear, but like when I was talking about just the small amount of mutual aid stuff I've been doing over the last couple of years, and like the like relative paranoia I feel that you know, these these you know of patriots like have and I think that the thing that is it's like because in my in my mind, it's like, what are they gonna do kill us for handing out you know, granola bars? And the answer is yes, depends on how far things but yeah, yeah, but the answer is yes. Like so so that's like hard to internalize. And I think that is. It's like because often you like come to this sort of thing with like the energy of this is like a social thing, or at least it's part of it, and it's like very hard to not you know, to realize that like yes, like we are like doing something, but it's like we're actually there is an element of parel to this that is hard to like kind of like really realized sometimes. Right, the ship is like real and like even though it shouldn't be. It's literally just handing out fucking snacks and like hand sanity and almost every single food not bombs feeding that happens worldwide is pleasant with good mediocre to good food depending on the cooks, and a good environment and safe, you know and like and I definitely wouldn't discourage people. You know, um, if you're in Moscow right now, it's a lot more complicated, right um, but you know, and and things will get more complicated here as things happen. But but that's going to be true. It's yeah, but it is also like yeah, like elements of like there's always something you can do. M So it's like, you know, if you get to the point where it feels perilous to be there and person, there's things you can do, and it feels perilous to like be with a collective group of people cooking or organizing or whatever, there's things you can do. Yeah, something, there's always more. You can always be doing more than you've been doing, and like, and it can always be something that plays to your strength, and it doesn't have to be something that is like you can think about what you are willing to risk and then think about how you can go about meeting your own needs and still engage, you know, and like just being the person to call like food co ops or big chain organic stores or regular stores and be like, hey, I'm working with you know food nut bombs or if if they're burned on that make up some other I don't know legality what I'm saying, um, find ways to get donations of food and like I think, I think, yeah, you probably can just not name the yeah, yeah, place, I suppose but yeah, yeah, yeah, there's always something. I mean I think that I was doing UM. Also during the George Floyd uprising, was like trying to help out with UM just listening to the police scanner, which was also illuminating in that I was like, oh, these people are both like it was whild listening to cops be legitimately sound afraid. I mean, they're fucking you know, fascist cowards, but it really was. I was like, Oh, you're scared of like I know who's in that crowd, Like you're looking scared of them. You feel towards like you have guns, you're the violent one. And that's I mean because fascism is the cowards ideology, Like it's that's why they only attack when they're in big groups. That's why, you know, like yeah, um, and when there's a fair fight, they backed down. It seems like not universally, but it um and a lot of what I mean not even not even a fair fight. Yeah, but I mean you see it like in Portland and like all like if you just like can stand up and be organized, the fucking proud boy type folks just like they're too stupid and weak and scared, and I mean it is the difference in the ideologies. It's like they don't have each other's backs. So so the reason they need like the swarm is because it's they're they're so brittle, because they are so cowardly. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's literally just I'm afraid of the other. That is the it seems to me, is the core of fascism, you know. And yeah, so speaking of people standing up to fascism, this isn't an ad break. This is just mere talking more about some of these Russian food numbers. But it could be dogs stand up the fascists. Some of them, some of them, I don't know. Okay, that's a hard one. Favorite famously a bunch of them love fascists. Yeah, okay, um, well probably a lot of a lot of our most famous dogs are pro fascism, you know. Alright, alright, fine, regrettably, I'm just saying, yeah, no, no more dogs. More dogs are cops and are not coughs. More dogs are not cops, but more famous dogs are cops. Yeah, but there's riot dogs all over Greece and various countries in South America and Central America. Who who hate cops? All right? Well then here's some unrelated advertisements. Because we live in a capitalistic hell world. Yes, and we are back and we are talking about unat bombs in Russia and Fudna bombs continues in Russia, I believe to this day. During the invasion, well at the beginning of the current invasion of the Russian invasion of Ukraine Moscow, Funat Bombs put out a hasty translation of a statement which is in order to keep an increase the benefits in their hands. The government declares wars who will collect their intestines with their hands, who will have their arms and legs torn off by explosions, whose families will bury their children. Of course, all of this does not apply to the ruling minority. We must resist the militaristic regime and the war it is waging with all of our might. Spread information among your comrades, fight as best you can and uh. And then they've been doing that. The A bunch of food nut bombs activists were arrested in February and anti war demonstration. You can see the video. It's literally just some people walking down the street with a banner and cops grabbing them off the street and arresting them. And then in March at a Food Not Bombs feeding unknown assailants. They might have been cops, they might have been just piece of ship. Warmongers, kidnapped four people out of Food nat Bombs, threw them into a car, drove them out in the forest, said they were going to make them dig their own graves, dropped them off one by one and beat the ship out of them with police batons and seriously wounded several of them. I believe all of them, but I'm not sure. Um. Belarus Food Not Bombs has been going since two thousands six, but they had to suspend operations in January two because of the repression there of the anarchist movement because Belarus is boot looking for Putin and end that things have been going real hard for them there. Um, But that was a terrible bummer note for me to end this part about Food nat Bombs on There's actually one more story that's related to mutual Aid than I want to say. But if you have a way to quickly turn this around on a positive note about Food not Bombs, I'm I'm looking at how I wrote the script and I'm not proud. Well, I mean, I think the thing that is like it's the scary part, but it is the like real part, which is like again, I came to mutual aid mainly because you know, the world, but also like it was like honestly just for my own mental health, like such a like important thing. It wind up being to like do something and it's like there's a social element to it, but like not that it's good that this is this is a political action that is like violently repressed by literal fascists. But I think it's the extent that there's a silver lining for like an American audience is like this is like you are part of something actually powerful when you do things like this. Um that Again, it's it's that like you know, you look around and like for me, I'm like, god, everyone see here seems really fucking paranoid, and it's like they're not, but they're not bad. You know. It's still like like at least there's that power there of realizing that you are like really doing something. Um can be helpful, but yeah, it's sucking hard obviously, Now that makes sense. I mean, like we live in a society that tries to deny us agency, right, that's like one of its main structural ideas um and and here's just a a really good, almost always very safe way to claim agency. And also this, uh, the society we're living in right now is trying to live in the society at large, but trunks of it are trying to disappear people and more and more people are trying are starting to fall through the cracks. And it's not a coincidence from my point of view that this is happening as other things in the world are getting worse. And and here's a way that you can help stop that. You know that there's that there's that fucking poem about the you know, first they came for and then they came for and like great, like give people give stuff to people who are homeless, Like that's good. That is part of that. That is part of stopping that chain of events that does lead to you and I you know, like, um, you know the other like purely selfish way, if if you want to look at it this way, it's like like we're talking about like sort of like in vaguely like militaristic terms. But the thing is it's like again, I am passed probably my brick throwing days, but like why do you keep winking when you say that though, Oh sorry anyway, Uh no, I really am even even even like very funny though carrying carrying a folding table. The other day, I was like, god, damn, I'm like I just can't yeah like you. Here's why not because I'm like, it's it's I'm just like you. You don't want me. I'm not. I'm not best used on brick throwing duty on either side of things. It's just like not, it's not good for anyone. However, it was a thing where I was like during like some of the darkest and the like perpetual upcoming darkest moments, like the darkest moments that come is that like these motherfucker's who are like the paranoid people who are just like you know, in my eyes, paranoid people who are like handing out cranola bars, etcetera. Like when if and when like shit really goes bad, like this is the network, this is the thing that becomes a resistance or whatever or like if not these people, then something like it or something adjacent to it or like and you know it's real because these people have been out on the street doing ship spending their own like energy and money and like time, Like if they were knarcs, it would be you know, they deserve it because I think they put in years this ship. So it's like, yeah, fine, send me to jail. It's great. Yeah, there's this old earth first thing where Earth firsts would be like, Okay, once you figure out who the cop is in the group, you don't you don't kick them out. You just have them take all the notes. You just like make sure that they pay for everything. I am not recommending this as a strategy. I am not trying to opine about how groups should deal with infiltration. I am merely relaying a thing that has happened in the past. U No, truly, because well but yeah, but it's it's like just the element of like, you know, yeah, just again on a purely selfish level, it was like, these are the folks that I having demonstrated having their back, they're going to have my back. Um, and and the people you meet, I don't know. It's like, I mean, you know, if that's another way to look at it, it's like you're just building the structures that hopefully we will never need in a real way, but what we already use them in a real way. And I've always been about you know, I think that this dichotomy between the self interest in the community interest is a false dichotomy because being part of a healthy community that takes care of people rules for me as an individual, Like I love food not bombs because I ate it us so much, and it let me not have a job and just run around and hop freight trains badly and mostly failed at that and hitchhike around and like live the life I wanted to lead in my twenties, right, and and also, yeah, building these networks is like one of the only ways that I can, like, I mean, I'm not doing the work of building these networks now. I just run a podcast and read history books also rules, but I don't know, I mean part knowing these networks exist is part of literally how I sleep as well as I do as a trans woman in the current environment, you know. So yeah, it's like it's like at least you kind of have a sense that, look, you you have a chance, and you have people who are like organized and doing something, and look, yeah, not not everything thing is going to succeed. Mostly it doesn't success, but yeah, you know it's something. Yeah, yeah, well that does not actually naturally lead to. But I want to pivot to talk about the final final part of this whole thing, which is I bet you're wondering. I know a lot of people at home are wondering, what do gay birds have to do with mutual aid? And and I am an answer for you, because this is going to be a story that talks about the origins of mutual aid as a as a term at least, and it brings us back to Russia, where the land where the government says there are no gay people. Um, I don't know whether they say or not there's any gay birds. But so I can't remember the name of the magazine, and I'm so annoyed. I spent so long trying to find this magazine. But I read this magazine in two thousand four. It was about gay birds and mutual aid. And I wish I had a time machine so I'd go back and tell younger me that, like one day, all of these things that I read that give me my ideas, I'll actually have to decite them and source them. I would not have believed you. And I find this magazine in a trash can, and it's about science. It's a science magazine I don't remember the name of it, and as an article, and it's talking about scientists are finally starting to talk about gay animals in the early the turn of the millennia, the early auts and um, and they're trying to figure out what the funk it means for evolutionary science. So so this brings us to Darwin, and I promise we'll come back to the birds. You might have heard of this guy, this guy named Charles Darwin. H soph he's nodding, so if he's heard of this guy and um, he's this rich white British science dude who was like, whoa evolution? And then more than that, he was like, whoa natural selection is? What drives evolution? And he wrote a book about it. And the book is called whoa Natural Selection? The Origin of the Species or something like that, and he wrote a direct quotes, Yeah, damn darge. And he was actually way cooler than most of the people who came after him, who invoke his name, and way cooler than I expected him to be when I started researching this part of the story. Among other things that have nothing to do with today's story, he he and other scientists helped intervene on behalf of a French geographer, Ali Raclu, who fought the Paris Commune and was like going to be executed for trying to overthrow France basically, and all these scientists were like, no, you can't execute him. He's our guy, he's like a scientist. Darwin was also an abolitionist. Um. He pushed back against race science that invoked his name, and he argued against any kind of like social planning that led to eugenics um and he believed that people needed to be free to reproduce as they wanted, which is again since most eugenics is sort of based in calling itself darwinistic. I feel like it's a big deal, and specifically it's kind of interesting to me because he didn't deny this like concept of like, I guess you could change how humans work by selective breeding. But what he says is, and this is a paraphrase, not a quote, Okay, some traits are genetic, but if you control who reproduces, you will get rid of the single best trait in humanity, which is our capacity for empathy. And so he's just like, no, I would never work. And I kind of like that. That's like a science approach to being like you can't do this racist thing because of this like science, you know well, but also too, it's like because that isn't how it works. It's like you need variance and randomness and like trying to direct it is not going to work. Yeah, it's just wrong on some fucking levels. Uh, what wasn't wrong? Where his iconic mutton shops, which later became an epic wizard beard. That almost makes me sad. I got laser hair removal. It's such a good bed. I don't know why. It's everyone has wizard beards back in the day, but Darwin is particularly good. Now that I don't hate him, I kind of always assumed he was. I don't know. I mean I think, like all learned people of the time, you're still grating on a curve. It's true. He um, yeah, I'm gonna get to some of that. Um sorry, no, no, okay. So he was like, whoa, look how species differentiate, and other people were like, yes, this justifies imperialism and the abuse of the poor. The strong survived the meek parish and he had to like waste his time being like, maybe you shouldn't base policy on what made one animal into another animal. Yeah, And he does spend a while trying to figure out colonialism is comparable to evolutionary natural selection. And he also believes that men naturally dominate over women because of genetics or whatever. Um yeah, well, I mean I think it's like just so hard to like any scientists. It's like I think as humans clearly were like wired to believe like it's if it happens, yeah, it's good. Yeah, totally. It's like, yeah, it definitely happens. But like one of the trademarks of being human is realizing that things that happen aren't good just because they happen totally. Yeah, it's like wild, like yes, yes, absolutely, you know, survival of the fittest occurs, but is it good? Yeah, and there are other options and that's what other scientists. But first I'm to talk about scientists who took it the wrong way. So oh, and that's the final note about Darwin total aience nerd uh. The year before he dies, he's like seventy something and which in the nineteenth century means you're kicking as because the life expectancy is forty for men in England at the time that he's alive. Um, there's almost doubled that. And the year before he dies he publishes his last work. And his last work is called The Formation of Vegetable Mole through the Action of Worms, and I just, yeah, I love it. He's a science guy. He never stopped. Um. And so there's two ways you can take all of the stuff he says. And there's the reasonable way and the way that doesn't make any fucking sense. And the guy who took it the most the way it doesn't make any fucking sense, is best exemplified at least by this guy named Herbert Spencer. There's another white British dude. He also has iconic mutton shops. Herbert Spencer should have been cool. His parents were Quakers, he grew up anti authoritarian and socialist and militantly feminist. As someone who is all of those things, I like that. Um. Then he took a turn to the hard right libertarian thing, and he started opposing women's suffering and saying that all socialism is slavery and that at sure is good that all the inferior races are being wiped off the face of the earth. And he spent time complaining about race mixing deluding the white race. He doesn't sound anything like people who are around today. He's the one who coined the term survival of the fittest, and he laid the philosophical groundwork for what later became right wing libertarianism and the economics of I've got Mine, Fuck you. Um, survival fit is truly is yeah, like just a tiny sliver of the theory is like yeah, no exactly. And for some odd reason, this guy died alone and lonely. I'm not it's hard to imagine why. Um. He also might have invented the paper clip. There's a lot of people who claim to have invented the paper clip. He is a month. So that's like the social Darwinism side, all about competition. The thing is, although that Darwin didn't only write about competition. He also wrote about co operation. And this brings me back to the gay animals, because all these Darwinists, they're not the social Darmans particularly a problem. If every animal is just trying to fucking pass on their genes as widely as possible, then why are some of them gay? Which for a long time people just ignored the fact that dogs are animals were gay. But have you met a dog like, I don't know. I only have one dog, and my dog is gay as fuck. My dog gay as fuck. Yeah, I'm pretty sure my dog's pan, but I haven't like proven this, partly because I am removed his capacity to yeah. Yeah. But so some animals are gay. Uh. For a while in the twentie century, reactionaries used to be like, gayness isn't natural. If it was natural, then animals would be gay, and there's no gay animals. And then finally someone was like, yeah, there's so many gay animals, and so now reactionaries instead have to be like, we are better than those gay animals. That's what makes us human, you know. Um. And but then around the beginning century, basically people were like, okay, we have to address the fact that animals are gay. And people were like, but why how does this work with if all we believe is survival of the fittest? And the answer is something that evolutionary biologs just have been talking about for a hundred god damn fucking years, And basically they realized a couple of things hundred goddamn years ago. One, sometimes animals do things just because things are fun. Um, we're not actually robots, Animals try to aren't just trying to maximize the reproduction or whatever. Birds fly around and flocks because like, holy sh it, we can fucking fly the rules, you know, and fucking is also fun unless you're unlucky enough to be like sucking a right wing dude who buys into the Ben Shapiro thing, which case you're not necessarily having a good time all of them, or you know, have other drama that whatever. Anyway, anyway, but also, gay animals are good for community, and this is the main thing that was in this article that I read that like have I had my mind explode moment or whatever about this um. Gay animals foster kids, and they also allow for relationships like within the animal communities that aren't just like one boy ostrich one and making this animal up for an example, and one girl ostrich or whatever. As you have a greater capacity for love within the community, and it turns out that that makes everyone happier, live longer, and everything is good. So this is a confirmation of this fight that had been going on a hundred years ago competition versus cooperation, which wasn't actually competition versus cooperation. It was one side saying competition is the only thing that happens, and the other side saying it's both. It's always been both, it will always be both. Yeah. Well, that's also like cooperation is. Typically it's cooperation within a sphere that helps a larger group possibly compete with you know, different groups or societies or whatever. Yeah. The champion of this other school of evolutionary biology was not other than a friend of the podcast, Peter Kropotkin, who was this Russian prince. He's another rich white guy, let's be honest, and he renounces his royalty to declare war on Czarist Russia and all states. Uh. He dedicates his life to the twin goals of science and anarchism. He breaks out of the most impossible to break out of prison in Russia in the nineteenth century to circumnavigate the world to foster revolution of let's take care of each other like I watched some animals do while I was a biologist. And so he's the anti Spencer, the survival of the fittest guy, and he writes a book about it, and his book about it is called mutual Aid, A Factor and Revolution. Because he's also a very literal title guy and this is where the phrase mutual aid in the modern context comes from. Is this book mutual aid? As far as I can tell, Um, I don't believe this is this is absolutely not the origin of the idea of mutual aid. In fact, since Kropotkin is a scientist, it's like he's like, no, I've observed this, this exists, um, but I don't know. And then he got into all these like arguments about it at the time. But basically people like sort of forgot about all of these arguments, and it was all of the Russian scientists all not just the leftists, were like no, no, no, it's cooperation, it's both you know. Um, but the sort of further West idea kind of one over for a long time. Yeah, it's so yeah, so id I mean, I I learned most of the bog biological side of this from now right wing lunatic Richard Dawkins's books. Um, but his like books on you know, on genetics, correct, Okay, it's his ideas of how to apply them to women Muslims that, yeah, which Darwin would have had a fucking fist fight with him over. Yeah. Well, I think I mean, look, this might be just me liking an older thing. But I would have thought that the older version of Richard or the younger version of Richard Dawkins would also feel the same way. But truly, what do I know? Yeah, we we can reckon it either way and just declare that young Richard Dawkins would absolutely fistfight, would be the champion four Darwin in the fight to death. Maybe even as you say it out loud, that sounds crazy, all right. My idea about the younger Richard Duckin sounds you know, just not the fighting part, the being a good person part. Yeah, yeah, okay, who knows, Well, that's that's kind of So that's like the phenomenon, right, they went observed this phenomenon, and it's a phenomenon that food not bombs, and literally countless other individuals and organizations such as Solidarity and Snacks not Solidarity not Snacks, which was the precursor or popular Um, has been using this phenomenon all over the world and it is a phenomenon that rules. And that is my my story of food not bombs and mutual aid. That's oh my god, thank you for having it for this has been like lovely and educational, but also I think like it is. It is this like double edge thing of like the history is interesting, but one of the important parts of the I think the rules you talked about last week is like the most important part is like you know, yeah, but also these these people weren't gods that founded this thing. You know, It's like they made mistakes. Um, and it's fine, but the basic bedrock is fine and usable and adjustable. Yeah, totally. Yeah, but again, careful when you're serving that meat because it's a real pain in the g s on the streets. Totally. Andrew, do you have any thing you'd like to plug at the end here for us? Oh? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, well yeah, if you've enjoyed listening to me talk, Um, I'm going to be on tour with a couple more dates, not really tours or a mini tour with my podcasts This Racist I co hosted with Tony News So um, we're going to be in Austin on August and Brooklyn on September time. So possibly the single least profitable way to put together a tour humanly possible, but it's fun and it's you know, just a nice chance to see everyone. Awesome, And Margaret, you have a book coming out, correct I do. It's called we Won't Be Here Tomorrow, and I didn't have a pun prepared about the fact that the title reference okay anyway, And you can get it from a k Press or you can get it from different independent bookstores and if you preorder it, you get an art print and it comes out September twenty and it's full of all of my short stories about uh, I don't know. There's like a trans woman who feeds men too. She robs men and then feeds them to her mermaid lover and then it's like, you know, a whole parable imagine that. And there's another one about someone who uses drones to troll CEOs into quitting. And there's another one about the dead from Valhalla back and fight in the civil war against Nazis because there's no Nazis in Valhalla. Um, if you like that kind of thing, yeah, I know, it's kind of a it's a little bit of Apama, you know. Uh So you can you can buy that and also you can, um listen to my podcasts. I have a podcast called Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff, which is on cool Zone Media and you can't do it every Monday and Wednesday, I have another podcast called Lived Like the World is Dying and it is about individual and community preparedness and you can listen to it also on wherever you find podcasts. Um, but Sophie's not on it, so it's not and we all be sad about that for a moment, a moment of silence. Where can people find you on the Internet? Uh? You can? You can? You can. You can find me on Twitter and Instagram. You can just search my name, I pop up, uh, and then you can follow out cool Zone Media also on Twitter and Instagram. And if you look on the Internet archive, you can find Sophie Lichtman's my Space page. Please don't put, please put, please don't, please don't. It's really it's really not not it baby. If you can find my profile, find my space, don't find mine. I'm gonna tell you the name of the band I was in in two thousand five as on my Space. It's terrible. Oh my gosh. Yeah, So everyone get researching you have a vague sense of your assignment. Yeah yeah, And we'll be back on Monday with another story of cool people who did Cool Stuff. Yeah. By Cool People who Did Cool Stuff is a production of cool zone Media or more podcasts on cool zone Media, Visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Cool People, Did Cool Stuff or c p W D C C AS by for short, and by short I mean long because it takes at least as long to say the acronym as does say the title of the show. And one of my least favorite things is people who try to correct me and say that acronyms are only acronyms when they are pronounceable as words. So I'm Mark kill j your host and with me. Today is the one and only Andrew T. Andrew Good just gave dog two kills. Yeah, everything's gone great on this day. That is definitely a different day from last time, because we definitely don't just record both episodes back to back most of the time. We've also got our producer, Sophie. How are you doing? Sophie? Still doing well? Was doing well all those days ago when we report recorded part one? Still well now? Yeah. The days just fly by between recording part one important by bye, they do. Sometimes it just feels like I get up and get a glass of water, yeah, and then that's it. We also have our editor Ian who's not on the calm, but later we'll be listening to everything we say, just to twist our words around and make it sound like we said are saying things that we're not saying. Like I actually got the acronym correct at the beginning of this episode and then um Ian switched it around to be wrong. And our theme music was written by a woman and you can check out the rest of her music if you would like. So today we're talking about food up bombs, and we're talking abou mutual aid. And if you didn't listen to the first half of this episode, you are missing out on us pontificating about Catholic theology for a moment, and also about why were or at least why I'm not excited about people dressing up as homeless people. Yeah, I mean, it's just so like a classic of the genre. But yeah, you know, so the street theater kind of always has that element to it, I guess, just like, yeah, yeah, it's not a it's not a high art form, and that is both its advantage and disadvantage, both artistically and politically. Exactly. Yeah, So, where we last left our heroes, they're feeding people every week. They're collecting donations from all over the city and delivering free groceries everywhere because they think that people might need free groceries, and then they're taking what's left over and making a ton of free food and feeding people in the park. And this is just a a good thing to do. No notes, the city is less convinced that it's a good thing to do, or at least they don't like the other stuff that these same activists are doing, um like sticking their noses into every protest and action that they possibly can, writing every good fight that they come across. So so Keith mckenry, one of the founders of food nut Bombs, the main person who's written all this history. He who's actually really cool most of the time. Um, he doesn't like that he's getting harassed by the city, Like he's getting harassed a lot by the city. Apparently is being kind of threatened by the city. Don't totally know what that. I don't know exactly. So he fucks off. He sucked off to San Francisco, and Food Up Bombs Boston keeps going without him. In seven he starts Food up Bombs San Francisco, and not long after, some people in Long Beach, which I don't know if you all knew this, but Long Beach is not actually the name of a beach in l A. It turns out apparently it's its own city. M yeah, yeah, Andrew, did you know that Los Angeles resident? Uh? I think, I mean, I assume it is also a beach though, right, I don't know is Los Angeles an actual city or is it just a Hollywood fabrication? So uh yeah, definitely both. Is A is a ridiculous city as far as that goes? Yeah, completely agree? Okay, just does cool Zone media have an official stance on whether or not it's chill for me to spread conspiracy theories like l A is a real place and not just a Hollywood fabrication, because that's the conspiracy for Los Angeles is a real place with stage wink at the audience that they can't see if I'm describing it, you can't see ship. Yeah all right. So some people in Long Beach, legally distinct from Los Angeles started food not bombs, and they were nervous about stealing the name food nut bombs, so they started calling it bread knot bombs. But then they got in touch with food nat bombs and tun bombs, like, oh my god, we don't care that rules used food not bombs. Um, so they become Food Nut Bombs, and food Nut Bombs writes up a little how to Get Started zine and they start passing it around. There's thirty chapters. They had a conference and decided on the three basic principles that I mentioned at the beginning of Monday's episode, free veggy based food, autonomous groups, non violence, and then they put out the first edition of a book called food Nut Bombs that explains the whole thing very direct titlers. I appreciate a good direct title. So the group explodes in popularity after this. Two years later, people attended international gathering in San Francisco and the representing the US, Canada, Mexico, and various countries in Europe. And okay, my my theory is that the only downside of the popularity Food Not Bombs is that we had to go through as activists the whole generation of slogans with names that are like bikes not bombs, home's not jails, food not lawn, solidarity not charity, the something not something. I really appreciate that y'alls is um something and something like. I feel like that's a really positive development. Um Yeah, I wasn't around for the genesis of it. I have no idea how any of that care to be. But yeah, that is actually a good point. Yeah, I we were we were at a protest recently, and I because I hadn't been involved in the early days of it when it was mostly protest support. UM for Solidarity snacks mentioned last episode, which people can financially support, Yes, we need or the fund is getting we we only have a couple more Saturdays left unless we get more funds, which hopefully will come in. Um. But I didn't realize that the like cart that my friend used initially to start the whole thing is like it was like well known amongst people. Really people were like, oh, it's the car, we know you. It's the car. That's pretty amazing. Yeah. Um so yeah, something and something that is my that is my endorsement society. It's a new a new wrinkle on the on the format. We've progressed past the need for things not the other thing that said, all of those things that I named like homes not jail's homes, that jail's rules, and I actually almost did a whole thing about them, but I ran out of time. They're like people who well they do kind of what they say. They they open up squads. The organizations are great, it's often just the like just another pass at the copy usually yeah, yeah, totally, exactly. Yeah, that's the main issue. And so that's why I would like to propose a new something and something food and bombs for people who want to kill the Tsar of Russia. I mean, if you want to kill the Tsar of Russia, it has been proven empirically through trial and air, a lot of air, the most effective way to kill Tazar of Russia is with bombs. So just saying putting that out there, please don't actually do that and then say that I had anything to do with it, Okay, shut yeah, totally no fucking snitches and food and bombs, all right, So food not bombs. It's getting super popular with people who like to eat food. But there are people who hate fun and freedom and people having nice things like food who are waiting in the wings. And these people, of course, best known as the government and the cops. This conflict first arises in a serious way in in San Francisco. You've got this mayor. He's super progressive. His name's Art Agnos. He ran on how environmental and feminist and pro union and ship he was, Ah spoiler. Okay, So he comes in during an intense period of gentrification of San Francisco and it's starting to change it into the yuppie hell hole we all know and love today. He wants to solve the homelessness crisis, and he starts off with some decent ideas about how to solve the homelessness crisis. M He wants to build low income housing, which of course always gets complicated, but it's not inherently wrong. Um. He also makes sleeping bands, and then he revives a nineteenth century law against lying down in public place with camping gear. Because you know that the government is doing something good when they find a law that has not been enforced in a hundred years. Yeah, so you should look at the laws, the other laws from that year and just see what else totally like, if this is who you're in company with, yeah, it can't be. These were not good legislators at the time. Yeah. Like, and here's the law against the following racial oh wait yeah yeah, oh yeah, but that's not for a couple of years. Yeah. No, that's the sweet spot, that is the hey day of that. Yeah. I think San Francisco is like it started being all the like, um, like, Chinese folks don't come here in the late nineteenth century, I think, Yeah, and hooray America has a really cool history. Yeah, and present that's wild the other yeah go ahead, Oh no, they're just just recapping for my brain, all right. Yeah. The laws back, Yeah, the laws back, and he starts sending out cops to sweep parks full of homeless folks. Fuck art Agnos. Uh, he's not progressive, he claims it, and and everyone I think starts seeing him as basically like, oh, he's the classic democrat. He it's a bait and switch. He gets elected by progressives because of the elector the people who vote a manner progressives, and then he serves neoliberalism instead. Um and fount Bombs shows up on the scene around the time same time as art Agnos and food nut Bombs. At the beginning, they weren't even trying to be controversial. They actually applied for a permit and did all of the paperwork and all that stuff. But the local business owners were like, no, you can't have homeless people eating food in public. Um as if there's some other place for people who don't have houses to eat food uh, so they pressure the city, the city denies the permit, and food nut Bombs rolls over and accepts it and ends as an organization. And wait, no, they say fuck it, and they feed people food anyway, And they start to get arrested for it, like a lot, Like in the first few months, there's almost a hundred arrests. It becomes an assembly line. Someone lines up to get a free meal. Someone scoops food onto the plate of the person who's there for a free meal, and the cops arrests the person who serves the food. So the next server steps up and feeds the next person in line and gets arrested. And and they just do this right because they're not afraid of civilis obedience. There. They do what's right, not what's safe. You know. Yeah, it's also truly like you know, obviously, if you're fucking cop, you are the worst human being. But like it's hard to have it more like in your face, what a fun discussing piece of ship you are that day, I know. Yeah. And so the fight is about food, I guess kind of, but not really. It's it's about more than that. It's about who controls public space. Are the parks controlled by the government or are they controlled by the people who make use of the park. And the government, of course, tends to believe that they're the ones who get to control the park, but I would argue, if you've ever been to a park, you know that that's not the case. The politics of a park are remapped daily by the people who are there. Like there might not be a sign up that says don't skateboard on the basketball court, but like the basketball court most of the time is for basketball players and who have their own structures about who decides which courts are being used, and like, you know, it's it's I mean, parts are are beautiful because they are these informal organizational spots that happen daily all over the world. Um, I don't know, it's like one thing I miss about living in cities and yeah, or just like like the like the yeah, the politics of any like public place are like so interesting. Yeah, it's just like you can make all the rules you want, but those aren't the rules, yeah totally. And you know, and people who have no private space to return to, they're going to use public space, which makes sense, right, And I've never had to deal with homelessness. I used to be a traveling activist, but that was by by choice is very structurally different. But I remember at this one time I was taking a nap in a van and a parking lot and it was really hot, so I opened the doors and and I was just thinking about how like I could now get in trouble. It would be perfectly legal for me to park my van and get out of it and leave my van in this public space, but now that I'm sleeping in it, it's sketchy. But even more than that, it seems so weird to me that if I didn't have a car, I can't just set my stuff down in this public space that is meant for holding stuff, right, is a public spaceman for people to leave their car and walk away. And it just sort of like hits me the magic of a car used in a certain way. Yeah, And then even if you have a car, if you don't have a private space to then take it home too later, you're not usually not allowed to park it anywhere. Um, and it I don't know whatever. This isn't news to anyone probably that there's a lot of laws against homelessness that I wish I had the quote in front of me, but I don't. There's that quote about the law and it's it's it's awesome equality outlaws before and the rich from like pissing, Yeah, um law the laws like perfectly fair, like like no one is permitted to sleep under the bridge or something, Yeah exactly. Um. And and l A specifically, they've they've come out with all these like where they pretend like it's not trying to do that type laws where they're like like recently l A City council approved an ordinance where it's like bike repair on the street is now illegal, and and then they were like, well, what do you mean this has not this has nothing to do with you know, the un housed communities. Uh. And and you know anybody with that that reads it is like just be honest, Yeah, what are you? What do you what do you mean? And uh, you know, there's there's so many different things. It's like putting bolder or is under freeway under passes and things like that. They're like, oh no, it's to prevent and they make up some lights like yeah, I saw a bat there once and I don't want people to get rabies. So that's why there's a Boulder. It's like, just treat people with dignity, don't be so bastards. We'll just be gloves off and be like we want our clean city. Actually, don't do that either. Don't do That's always like like, oh I I prefer the open fascists like like sort of it's glib, but yeah, don't tempt them. Yeah, I know, I'm not looking forward to that stage. It's like always like like, oh, I just prefer what people are saying, what they really believe. It's like I promise you don't totally yeah, I know. I know. We were talking about like democrats that run with these liberal policies and it's like, oh, no, you're a Republican and like that sucks. But but having like the actual fascists run on fat like yeah, it's like like the like I prefer it at least I know where I stand. It's like knowledge of where you stand is like such a valueless thing. And also like right, like when everyone had to be quiet about slightly more quiet about the racism and ship, I think it made fewer young racists because if you can't pass it on is this continent, racism is a continuion. So like truly, it is like like that that is like the thing it's like for all like the you know, subconscious or or like quiet racism, Like it truly is better. It is just better better society where at least they have to experience some sort of shame or second guessing themselves. Um, I'm not saying it's good, but it's better than the alternative. It's certainly use that totally Okay. So yeah, so all these people are getting arrested because the city is real clear how they want to control space. They're like, we control the parks. There's actually all these quotes from different city council people that are like or you know, from the city government that's like and cops that are like, we control these parks, not these homeless people in these anarchists or like they're making a political statement. I mean it's like, yeah, of course, feeding people in a society where there's people going hungry and dying in the streets as a political statement like this shouldn't be happening is a political statement because the current political system isn't working. Um. Also like pathetic that that is the like, yeah, you're scared of political statements? Yeah, yeah, totally, So the civil disobedience works, and after a few months, the city sits down to negotiate with them and gives them a temporary permit. They have to like move a couple blocks over to like get out of Um I think they're in Golden Gate Park at this point. They have to go a few blocks away, so they're like less public eye. But they drop all the charges against all the orestes and and things are a little better. But these radical homeless people. The next year they set up an encampment outside of city Hall and they have the coolest slogan ever for this exact thing, which is, we're tired, we're hungry, we don't like the government. Um, just say what you fucking mean. I want our side to say what they fucking mean. You know, that's significantly better. Yeah, well, the problem is most of our side quote unquote our side, uh doesn't mean that. That's true. Yep, that's that's the dark side of things. Uh. Well, fudnut Bombs decides to go support that just to avoid lingering on that dark thought. Turn up Bombs. They decided to go support this, this homeless lead initiative. And I believe at this point a decent nu chunk of the Food Up Bombs organizers are homeless folks themselves. I'm not entirely certain about how all that works, but it's yeah, more complicated than people might initially think. Um, And they set up a twenty four hour super kitchen to feed the protest camp. And this and the fact that some of the organizers non violently occupy the mayor's office, gets the whole encampment swept by the ostensibly progressive mayor and Funup Bombs permit is revoked, and so Found up Bombs is like, all right, fuck it, And they go back to the park no longer a couple of blocks away, and they just, um, they're not gonna be swept out from public eye, and they're just gonna feed people. And over the next seven years, this this fight goes on for seven years, over two administrations. Over a thousand activists get sighted and or arrested for feeding people in the park. Nuns and priests joined them. At one point, my favorite was that lawyers of the National Lawyers Guild showed up. Shout out to the National Lawyers Guild, They're great. They decided to serve food and get arrested. The cops are like, now we're good. I just don't arrest the National Lawyers Guild because that's who there sleep, right of. I mean they used to be. I I was at the UM just for a part of it. I wasn't able to be around for like the most violent parts of the uh disgusting hopefully soon to be gone. City Council member Mitchell Ferrell ordered the LAPD to sweep Echo Park like um here and truly, I mean it was one of those like right like this this felt like a new thing. I'm not super experienced with stuff, but like the l A p D like first of all, like you know, performing acts of violence now with like everything recorded, but like actively going after journalists and the like the green hat National folks, targeting them in some truly fascist ship and then setting up a uh literal concentration camp at Echo Park. They fence it off and you could not You didn't. You weren't free to leave or enter. They're just going to concentrate all the people into one place so that they can be handled. It was concentration, Yeah, it was, it was. It was you know, it was so fucking disgusting. Yeah, it's unforgettable. Major media wouldn't even like really cover it because their cowards. But it's like it was being live streamed on Twitter and you're seeing it and you're like, yeah, this this is a concentration camp in the middle of Los Angeles being run by our by the l A p d by and by actual fascist MITCHO Ferrell. Yeah, if you're listening to this and you're an l A voter and there's or if you're not, actually there's any way to to contribute to the Ugo Soto Martinez campaign in any way to unsee open fascist MITCHO Ferrell. Please do that please. One of the things that I keep running when I was researching this. At one point I got really frustrated about halfway through writing all this, where I was like, it's also quaint. I know that they were fighting for really hard things and it was really hard, but I'm just like, oh my god, Like, just even what you're saying about, you know, the National Lawyers Guild actually gets arrested now right in the exact same situation, and just like, yeah, I'm really not trying to downplay the incredible amount of work that Punat bombs well, that still does and does now in this new context. So I'm really not trying to knock it, um, but it is it's it's hard to see how far we've not come in terms of the move towards it. Yeah, I mean I think it. It is also like like probably the at least some version of this activism. The stuff that I felt like I saw a lot in the nineties was a lot of people insulated by their whiteness from some of the worst things. And but that is like part of you know, it goes both ways too, because it is like of civil disobedience is like civil disobedience only works if you're oppressors have any kind of conscience, and like, yeah, it's just like cops have more of a conscience for like white teens than you know, your average on house person, your average black person, etcetera. Like so there is some version of that, but then that becomes like sort of this white savior re vibe that can go the wrong way. It could turn into people encouraging street theater where you dressed up like the homeless because you don't think about what that means. Um, I don't know, sorry, I'm just like on that little tangent. It's like scary. Now think that's to me, Like like during the George Floyd uprising, it was just like, oh, the l a p D is like beating middle class white women in broad daylight now, which feels like an escalation, Like, you know, at least typically under they in the past, it feels like they would at least wait till sun down to do that. They were like actively kettling people at like on on a on a Tuesday at like one pm and then like and then like beating them on camera. Yeah. It was like pretty remarkable, honestly. Yeah. And you know what else is remarkable? Oh my god, Margaret, I was like, are you going to do that? Because it's that time. The concept of dogs dogs And oh, we have a new advertiser that I'm very excited about that we'll be running, and it would actually be the first host voiced ad that we'll be running on this network. And that is the concept of shut the funk up, Shut the fuck up. Yeah, shut the funk up, don't talk to cops. That is the concept. Oh smart, Yeah, No, sorry, I wasn't on you all to shut the funk up saying that when you get arrested, shut the funk up. Oh there's that too, But some of y'all do need to also shut the funk up. Here's some ads it Hi, Margaret Killjoy here boy, the world sure is a mess right now? Huh. Seems like every day there are more and more reasons to get out into this recent protest. That's why when I get arrested, there's only one strategy. I trust, I shut the funk up. I say, I would like to remain silent, I would like to talk to my lawyer, and then I shut the funk up. In the United States of America, it's constitutionally protected and recommended by the National Lawyers Guild. That's s h U t t h E f U c k u P. Once again, that's s h U T th h E f U c k u P. Because you can't talk yourself out of custody, but you can talk yourself into a conviction. Providing identification to law enforcement required in some states and situations, giving name an addressed expedient. In most circumstances, never discuss the events leading to arrest with anyone except your lawyer, doctor, or therapist. Posting pictures of protests and actions on social media may lead to complications if you have already talked to cops or experienced confuse and about talking to cops, call your attorney immediately, as these maybe signs of more serious legal problems. The concept of not talking to cops does not provide legal advice, and the foregoing statements are for informational purposes only if you have specific legal questions. Consultant attorney and we are back, um, and we are thinking about the escalation. And also yeah, how like people who actually are are more heavily marginalized by society have been dealing with this ship and it wasn't as like quaint even back you know. So that is a really good point. I mean it's it's tough. Yeah, it just goes always like it's like, yes, they're absolutely doing you know, a good thing on the balance, and like certainly there are the allies, but yeah, it's just it is weird, like the the using essentially you're on privilege to advance goals, but sort of still you have that privilege and you can not extend that privilege, which is always the precarious thing too. Yeah, and I mean I think that that has a lot to do with like where you're taking direction from right, Like, um, you know, if I'm going to be protesting in a context in which I'm attempting to use my white privilege, uh, it usually ideally would be in the context of like listening to um, you know, the direction and the overall strategy that is being proposed by the the group that I'm attempting to be in solidary with, you know, UM, and which is of course also really complicated because people are, like people of color or not, the monoliths even among individual you know, like identities, and so you know, you people choosing who they listen to. It. Well, this is why I don't run a politics podcasts. This ship gets messy. I just talk about history. No exactly. I mean I think that's like it's both messy and like ugly and and you know, the reality is there is no like right, Yeah, I think that that. And that's one of the things I love about movements that are so um like like diverse in terms of ideologies, in terms of ideas, in terms of strategies tactics, Like when we can work to coordinate different strategies and tactics together and different people coming from different positions, I feel like that's where we are our strongest personally. UM, so the next mayor San Francisco, speaking of people getting a little more um glove off. The next pair of San Francisco was the chief of police who orchestrated the crackdown on fodnut pomps. All right, and a runs an anti homeless camp on he runs onto anti homeless platform and things just heat up for food nut bombs. But of course also everywhere in the city with this guy. And over the course of the fight, the city removes all the benches from the park, so the folks have to eat sitting on the ground, which didn't stop anyone from eating food. You'll be shocked to know. Then they put up signs everywhere that said serving food without a permit is a crime. Um, these were probably roughly as effective escape warding is a crime science. Yeah, And and it's like it really is like, what, like what society are you in? You know that that that is your like priority. Let's say that means taxpayers spend money on this. It's like, is this really who you fucking are? It? Like it's gross to think about, like or to be that person. And the other thing they spent taxpayer money on was to remove the fountain from the park. Because I guess that would you know, all right, well they're gonna eat, they better not be somewhere with like pretty things. They better not enjoy it, you know, have access to a water feature anyway. Um, So food not Bomb starts getting it comes up with different tactics to deal with all this harassment. Right, people get sick of people of the cops stealing their food, so they start having decoy food buckets where they put a third of the food in the bucket and they go up and they set up, and the cops steal the bucket and then they're like, oh, shut you stole our food, and the cops leaves. So then they bring out the next third of a bucket and they serve some people, and then the cops steal the food, and then they bring out a final third in a third bucket, and the flyer that they distribute all over the world being like here's how to deal with it if the cops are stealing your food is like cops are too embarrassed to come back the third time to steal the food. And I don't know whether it's they're too embarrassed that they got like looney Tunes tricked, or if they're just embarrassed about the fact that it really hits home about the fact that they are like just stealing food. That's what their job is, is steal food from the mouths of hungry people. And Keith mckennry, the founder guy that you know I have the most information about, he was arrested ninety four times between which is more than once a month for seven years straight. As he puts it, he was framed up on three other felonies during that time. It was facing twenty five years in prison. UM. I have no counter argument to this. And during that same time period, for example, the FBI had just covered up the car bombing of two environmentalists, Judy Barry and Darryl Churney, and they the FEDS might have even done the car bombing, but the thing that's been proven in court is that they at least covered it up, right. So this is the so here I am being like ha ha at different times, like, actually, no people are getting car bombed by the FEDS. Um. Probably, but yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's just like it probably is. I mean they are the same people. They're worse than they have the internet now, but like they're the same people that have always been doing this ship. So yeah, it is different. There was more innocent and less innocent. Yeah, you know, in different ways different yea, yeah, yeah, it's just different, is honestly the Yeah. Yeah, they're not any less murderous in service of right, you know, of their their little society. Yeah, just their tactics changed in different situations. Yeah. He spends a total of Keith mckennry spends a total of five hundred days in jail during this seven year time just with all of these minor arrests for serving food. Um, and the harassment started gaining so bad that Amnesty International was wrote a letter to San Francisco saying that they were considering designating food up bombs activists as prisoners of conscience, basically saying like, if you, if you don't start harassing people based on their political beliefs, that we're going to adopt them as prisoners of conscious, you will be breaking international law and we will fight for their unconditional release. And eventually, two mayors later, food nut bombs just kind of wins by default because the city stops at war against them and they keep serving food. And thirty years after all this stuff they're still serving food, and they still serve food all over the world. The current best guests there's no official registry of food up bombs. The best guess is that there's around five hundred cities in the US with chapters and about five more cities around the world, and fun bombs of active US have been spied on by the FEDS and arrested by cops time and time again. Literally, while I was researching this, I messaged Sophia since I figured this out. I ran across a memo from the FBI about how they were spying on Denver Food Not Bombs in two thousand four, which is um when I was in Denver coun bombs, and it stuck out to me because they're describing how they were trying to get information out of my neighbors, like our house ran one day of cooking, and different houses across the city ran different days of it, and some punks like some it's like punks did it some days, students did it other days, whatever, and and so. The the document points out that while they arrested eight activists at the Food Not Bombs house, none of them nor any of the other people at the residents that the FBI was trying to question gave any information to the investigation, which rules and is what how you all should handle interactions with the federal police. You tell them that you have representation and that UM ask for their card and does the only information you give them. You don't lie to them and you don't tell them anything anyway. So after the fall of the Soviet Union, let's just jump gears really quick, run up. Bombs springs up all over Russia and the former Communist block Poland, Ukraine, Serbia, Croatia, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, and Russia all have or had chapters, and the stakes there are a bit higher than they've been for a lot of the U S chapters. In November two thousand five, a food nut bombser in St. Petersburg Team or cache Vera, was hanging out at a cafe a few hours after serving food in the park. A crew of bone heads, which are Nazi skinheads, swarmed him, chanting and this will be a familiar chance to Americans that they were chanting anti Antifa Nazis restrained teamer while another another Nazi who was only fourteen years old, stabbed him to death five times in the neck and teamer was it was an anarchist and a philosophy student. He was twenty is old and he played in a punk band called Sandinista. Two years later, Bone had swarmed food not bombs in St. Petersburg again, and if I'm reading the various articles correctly, they swarmed the actual feeding itself. This time they attacked and another food nut bombs are Ivan yelling. He survives, but he got stabbed twenty times for serving food in the park. And while he was recovering in the hospital, dozens of his friends showed up to donate blood at the hospital. Some came from as far away as Moscow, which is like an eight hour train ride. Basically people coming in solidarity too to offer their blood. I'm sure they had plenty of blood. I hope that people showed up then gave blood to other people in the hospital, which is an interesting escalation of mutual aid. And then on the flourth of February two thousand seven, Nazis went for the ultimate irony and they bombed the food nut bombs. No one gets killed, Uh, they just want to like say that up front so there's less tension around that they hid a bomb in the flower stall, and it's I hate to laugh at this. It's to go off at the time of the feeding, but the jokes on the Nazis because feeding was run by punks and so they were late. So the bomb goes off before anyone arrives, and no one was hurt. And they've had people as usual on the day that Nazis tried to bomb them. I said at the very beginning where I was like, in this time, no one gets killed by Nazis, and actually one person gets killed by And I didn't. I didn't. I should have probably known where I was going. I was. I was more chuckling at the you know, we're anti anti five Yeah, yeah, you're just fascist. It's fine, yeah, your regulars Yeah yeah, no, I no, totally. Um yeah. And I remember when this happened. It hit us all kind of hard, and it was like kind of sobering, right, um, because we would get harassed for serving food nut bombs and like a couple of times I've served food, not bombs, are eating it with like riot police all around and helicopters overhead and all that ship. But fucking Russia, they're getting bombed for it. And and the attacks were focused. It's the same focus in the U. S. It's it's about who controls spaces. Right in the US, it is the government is like, we control the parks. And in Russia at the time, the Nazis were like, no, we control the parks, and so it was they were attacking the the St. Petersburg d i y leftist n anarchist punk scene which organized against the fascists under the name Antifa, and so the regular are not fans of Antifa, and so you know, no, it's but it's just like it's like again, if you're murdering people for like handing out food, it's it's I mean, but that's like such a like fascist through line, and it's just like and that is a little you know, we talked, I talked about it. It's like me not understanding, you know. I was sort of like, I guess I was still also just like not not not clear, but like when I was talking about just the small amount of mutual aid stuff I've been doing over the last couple of years, and like the like relative paranoia I feel that you know, these these you know of patriots like have and I think that the thing that is it's like because in my in my mind, it's like, what are they gonna do kill us for handing out you know, granola bars? And the answer is yes, depends on how far things but yeah, yeah, but the answer is yes. Like so so that's like hard to internalize. And I think that is. It's like because often you like come to this sort of thing with like the energy of this is like a social thing, or at least it's part of it, and it's like very hard to not you know, to realize that like yes, like we are like doing something, but it's like we're actually there is an element of parel to this that is hard to like kind of like really realized sometimes. Right, the ship is like real and like even though it shouldn't be. It's literally just handing out fucking snacks and like hand sanity and almost every single food not bombs feeding that happens worldwide is pleasant with good mediocre to good food depending on the cooks, and a good environment and safe, you know and like and I definitely wouldn't discourage people. You know, um, if you're in Moscow right now, it's a lot more complicated, right um, but you know, and and things will get more complicated here as things happen. But but that's going to be true. It's yeah, but it is also like yeah, like elements of like there's always something you can do. M So it's like, you know, if you get to the point where it feels perilous to be there and person, there's things you can do, and it feels perilous to like be with a collective group of people cooking or organizing or whatever, there's things you can do. Yeah, something, there's always more. You can always be doing more than you've been doing, and like, and it can always be something that plays to your strength, and it doesn't have to be something that is like you can think about what you are willing to risk and then think about how you can go about meeting your own needs and still engage, you know, and like just being the person to call like food co ops or big chain organic stores or regular stores and be like, hey, I'm working with you know food nut bombs or if if they're burned on that make up some other I don't know legality what I'm saying, um, find ways to get donations of food and like I think, I think, yeah, you probably can just not name the yeah, yeah, place, I suppose but yeah, yeah, yeah, there's always something. I mean I think that I was doing UM. Also during the George Floyd uprising, was like trying to help out with UM just listening to the police scanner, which was also illuminating in that I was like, oh, these people are both like it was whild listening to cops be legitimately sound afraid. I mean, they're fucking you know, fascist cowards, but it really was. I was like, Oh, you're scared of like I know who's in that crowd, Like you're looking scared of them. You feel towards like you have guns, you're the violent one. And that's I mean because fascism is the cowards ideology, Like it's that's why they only attack when they're in big groups. That's why, you know, like yeah, um, and when there's a fair fight, they backed down. It seems like not universally, but it um and a lot of what I mean not even not even a fair fight. Yeah, but I mean you see it like in Portland and like all like if you just like can stand up and be organized, the fucking proud boy type folks just like they're too stupid and weak and scared, and I mean it is the difference in the ideologies. It's like they don't have each other's backs. So so the reason they need like the swarm is because it's they're they're so brittle, because they are so cowardly. Yeah, yeah, I mean it's it's literally just I'm afraid of the other. That is the it seems to me, is the core of fascism, you know. And yeah, so speaking of people standing up to fascism, this isn't an ad break. This is just mere talking more about some of these Russian food numbers. But it could be dogs stand up the fascists. Some of them, some of them, I don't know. Okay, that's a hard one. Favorite famously a bunch of them love fascists. Yeah, okay, um, well probably a lot of a lot of our most famous dogs are pro fascism, you know. Alright, alright, fine, regrettably, I'm just saying, yeah, no, no more dogs. More dogs are cops and are not coughs. More dogs are not cops, but more famous dogs are cops. Yeah, but there's riot dogs all over Greece and various countries in South America and Central America. Who who hate cops? All right? Well then here's some unrelated advertisements. Because we live in a capitalistic hell world. Yes, and we are back and we are talking about unat bombs in Russia and Fudna bombs continues in Russia, I believe to this day. During the invasion, well at the beginning of the current invasion of the Russian invasion of Ukraine Moscow, Funat Bombs put out a hasty translation of a statement which is in order to keep an increase the benefits in their hands. The government declares wars who will collect their intestines with their hands, who will have their arms and legs torn off by explosions, whose families will bury their children. Of course, all of this does not apply to the ruling minority. We must resist the militaristic regime and the war it is waging with all of our might. Spread information among your comrades, fight as best you can and uh. And then they've been doing that. The A bunch of food nut bombs activists were arrested in February and anti war demonstration. You can see the video. It's literally just some people walking down the street with a banner and cops grabbing them off the street and arresting them. And then in March at a Food Not Bombs feeding unknown assailants. They might have been cops, they might have been just piece of ship. Warmongers, kidnapped four people out of Food nat Bombs, threw them into a car, drove them out in the forest, said they were going to make them dig their own graves, dropped them off one by one and beat the ship out of them with police batons and seriously wounded several of them. I believe all of them, but I'm not sure. Um. Belarus Food Not Bombs has been going since two thousands six, but they had to suspend operations in January two because of the repression there of the anarchist movement because Belarus is boot looking for Putin and end that things have been going real hard for them there. Um, But that was a terrible bummer note for me to end this part about Food nat Bombs on There's actually one more story that's related to mutual Aid than I want to say. But if you have a way to quickly turn this around on a positive note about Food not Bombs, I'm I'm looking at how I wrote the script and I'm not proud. Well, I mean, I think the thing that is like it's the scary part, but it is the like real part, which is like again, I came to mutual aid mainly because you know, the world, but also like it was like honestly just for my own mental health, like such a like important thing. It wind up being to like do something and it's like there's a social element to it, but like not that it's good that this is this is a political action that is like violently repressed by literal fascists. But I think it's the extent that there's a silver lining for like an American audience is like this is like you are part of something actually powerful when you do things like this. Um that Again, it's it's that like you know, you look around and like for me, I'm like, god, everyone see here seems really fucking paranoid, and it's like they're not, but they're not bad. You know. It's still like like at least there's that power there of realizing that you are like really doing something. Um can be helpful, but yeah, it's sucking hard obviously, Now that makes sense. I mean, like we live in a society that tries to deny us agency, right, that's like one of its main structural ideas um and and here's just a a really good, almost always very safe way to claim agency. And also this, uh, the society we're living in right now is trying to live in the society at large, but trunks of it are trying to disappear people and more and more people are trying are starting to fall through the cracks. And it's not a coincidence from my point of view that this is happening as other things in the world are getting worse. And and here's a way that you can help stop that. You know that there's that there's that fucking poem about the you know, first they came for and then they came for and like great, like give people give stuff to people who are homeless, Like that's good. That is part of that. That is part of stopping that chain of events that does lead to you and I you know, like, um, you know the other like purely selfish way, if if you want to look at it this way, it's like like we're talking about like sort of like in vaguely like militaristic terms. But the thing is it's like again, I am passed probably my brick throwing days, but like why do you keep winking when you say that though, Oh sorry anyway, Uh no, I really am even even even like very funny though carrying carrying a folding table. The other day, I was like, god, damn, I'm like I just can't yeah like you. Here's why not because I'm like, it's it's I'm just like you. You don't want me. I'm not. I'm not best used on brick throwing duty on either side of things. It's just like not, it's not good for anyone. However, it was a thing where I was like during like some of the darkest and the like perpetual upcoming darkest moments, like the darkest moments that come is that like these motherfucker's who are like the paranoid people who are just like you know, in my eyes, paranoid people who are like handing out cranola bars, etcetera. Like when if and when like shit really goes bad, like this is the network, this is the thing that becomes a resistance or whatever or like if not these people, then something like it or something adjacent to it or like and you know it's real because these people have been out on the street doing ship spending their own like energy and money and like time, Like if they were knarcs, it would be you know, they deserve it because I think they put in years this ship. So it's like, yeah, fine, send me to jail. It's great. Yeah, there's this old earth first thing where Earth firsts would be like, Okay, once you figure out who the cop is in the group, you don't you don't kick them out. You just have them take all the notes. You just like make sure that they pay for everything. I am not recommending this as a strategy. I am not trying to opine about how groups should deal with infiltration. I am merely relaying a thing that has happened in the past. U No, truly, because well but yeah, but it's it's like just the element of like, you know, yeah, just again on a purely selfish level, it was like, these are the folks that I having demonstrated having their back, they're going to have my back. Um, and and the people you meet, I don't know. It's like, I mean, you know, if that's another way to look at it, it's like you're just building the structures that hopefully we will never need in a real way, but what we already use them in a real way. And I've always been about you know, I think that this dichotomy between the self interest in the community interest is a false dichotomy because being part of a healthy community that takes care of people rules for me as an individual, Like I love food not bombs because I ate it us so much, and it let me not have a job and just run around and hop freight trains badly and mostly failed at that and hitchhike around and like live the life I wanted to lead in my twenties, right, and and also, yeah, building these networks is like one of the only ways that I can, like, I mean, I'm not doing the work of building these networks now. I just run a podcast and read history books also rules, but I don't know, I mean part knowing these networks exist is part of literally how I sleep as well as I do as a trans woman in the current environment, you know. So yeah, it's like it's like at least you kind of have a sense that, look, you you have a chance, and you have people who are like organized and doing something, and look, yeah, not not everything thing is going to succeed. Mostly it doesn't success, but yeah, you know it's something. Yeah, yeah, well that does not actually naturally lead to. But I want to pivot to talk about the final final part of this whole thing, which is I bet you're wondering. I know a lot of people at home are wondering, what do gay birds have to do with mutual aid? And and I am an answer for you, because this is going to be a story that talks about the origins of mutual aid as a as a term at least, and it brings us back to Russia, where the land where the government says there are no gay people. Um, I don't know whether they say or not there's any gay birds. But so I can't remember the name of the magazine, and I'm so annoyed. I spent so long trying to find this magazine. But I read this magazine in two thousand four. It was about gay birds and mutual aid. And I wish I had a time machine so I'd go back and tell younger me that, like one day, all of these things that I read that give me my ideas, I'll actually have to decite them and source them. I would not have believed you. And I find this magazine in a trash can, and it's about science. It's a science magazine I don't remember the name of it, and as an article, and it's talking about scientists are finally starting to talk about gay animals in the early the turn of the millennia, the early auts and um, and they're trying to figure out what the funk it means for evolutionary science. So so this brings us to Darwin, and I promise we'll come back to the birds. You might have heard of this guy, this guy named Charles Darwin. H soph he's nodding, so if he's heard of this guy and um, he's this rich white British science dude who was like, whoa evolution? And then more than that, he was like, whoa natural selection is? What drives evolution? And he wrote a book about it. And the book is called whoa Natural Selection? The Origin of the Species or something like that, and he wrote a direct quotes, Yeah, damn darge. And he was actually way cooler than most of the people who came after him, who invoke his name, and way cooler than I expected him to be when I started researching this part of the story. Among other things that have nothing to do with today's story, he he and other scientists helped intervene on behalf of a French geographer, Ali Raclu, who fought the Paris Commune and was like going to be executed for trying to overthrow France basically, and all these scientists were like, no, you can't execute him. He's our guy, he's like a scientist. Darwin was also an abolitionist. Um. He pushed back against race science that invoked his name, and he argued against any kind of like social planning that led to eugenics um and he believed that people needed to be free to reproduce as they wanted, which is again since most eugenics is sort of based in calling itself darwinistic. I feel like it's a big deal, and specifically it's kind of interesting to me because he didn't deny this like concept of like, I guess you could change how humans work by selective breeding. But what he says is, and this is a paraphrase, not a quote, Okay, some traits are genetic, but if you control who reproduces, you will get rid of the single best trait in humanity, which is our capacity for empathy. And so he's just like, no, I would never work. And I kind of like that. That's like a science approach to being like you can't do this racist thing because of this like science, you know well, but also too, it's like because that isn't how it works. It's like you need variance and randomness and like trying to direct it is not going to work. Yeah, it's just wrong on some fucking levels. Uh, what wasn't wrong? Where his iconic mutton shops, which later became an epic wizard beard. That almost makes me sad. I got laser hair removal. It's such a good bed. I don't know why. It's everyone has wizard beards back in the day, but Darwin is particularly good. Now that I don't hate him, I kind of always assumed he was. I don't know. I mean I think, like all learned people of the time, you're still grating on a curve. It's true. He um, yeah, I'm gonna get to some of that. Um sorry, no, no, okay. So he was like, whoa, look how species differentiate, and other people were like, yes, this justifies imperialism and the abuse of the poor. The strong survived the meek parish and he had to like waste his time being like, maybe you shouldn't base policy on what made one animal into another animal. Yeah, And he does spend a while trying to figure out colonialism is comparable to evolutionary natural selection. And he also believes that men naturally dominate over women because of genetics or whatever. Um yeah, well, I mean I think it's like just so hard to like any scientists. It's like I think as humans clearly were like wired to believe like it's if it happens, yeah, it's good. Yeah, totally. It's like, yeah, it definitely happens. But like one of the trademarks of being human is realizing that things that happen aren't good just because they happen totally. Yeah, it's like wild, like yes, yes, absolutely, you know, survival of the fittest occurs, but is it good? Yeah, and there are other options and that's what other scientists. But first I'm to talk about scientists who took it the wrong way. So oh, and that's the final note about Darwin total aience nerd uh. The year before he dies, he's like seventy something and which in the nineteenth century means you're kicking as because the life expectancy is forty for men in England at the time that he's alive. Um, there's almost doubled that. And the year before he dies he publishes his last work. And his last work is called The Formation of Vegetable Mole through the Action of Worms, and I just, yeah, I love it. He's a science guy. He never stopped. Um. And so there's two ways you can take all of the stuff he says. And there's the reasonable way and the way that doesn't make any fucking sense. And the guy who took it the most the way it doesn't make any fucking sense, is best exemplified at least by this guy named Herbert Spencer. There's another white British dude. He also has iconic mutton shops. Herbert Spencer should have been cool. His parents were Quakers, he grew up anti authoritarian and socialist and militantly feminist. As someone who is all of those things, I like that. Um. Then he took a turn to the hard right libertarian thing, and he started opposing women's suffering and saying that all socialism is slavery and that at sure is good that all the inferior races are being wiped off the face of the earth. And he spent time complaining about race mixing deluding the white race. He doesn't sound anything like people who are around today. He's the one who coined the term survival of the fittest, and he laid the philosophical groundwork for what later became right wing libertarianism and the economics of I've got Mine, Fuck you. Um, survival fit is truly is yeah, like just a tiny sliver of the theory is like yeah, no exactly. And for some odd reason, this guy died alone and lonely. I'm not it's hard to imagine why. Um. He also might have invented the paper clip. There's a lot of people who claim to have invented the paper clip. He is a month. So that's like the social Darwinism side, all about competition. The thing is, although that Darwin didn't only write about competition. He also wrote about co operation. And this brings me back to the gay animals, because all these Darwinists, they're not the social Darmans particularly a problem. If every animal is just trying to fucking pass on their genes as widely as possible, then why are some of them gay? Which for a long time people just ignored the fact that dogs are animals were gay. But have you met a dog like, I don't know. I only have one dog, and my dog is gay as fuck. My dog gay as fuck. Yeah, I'm pretty sure my dog's pan, but I haven't like proven this, partly because I am removed his capacity to yeah. Yeah. But so some animals are gay. Uh. For a while in the twentie century, reactionaries used to be like, gayness isn't natural. If it was natural, then animals would be gay, and there's no gay animals. And then finally someone was like, yeah, there's so many gay animals, and so now reactionaries instead have to be like, we are better than those gay animals. That's what makes us human, you know. Um. And but then around the beginning century, basically people were like, okay, we have to address the fact that animals are gay. And people were like, but why how does this work with if all we believe is survival of the fittest? And the answer is something that evolutionary biologs just have been talking about for a hundred god damn fucking years, And basically they realized a couple of things hundred goddamn years ago. One, sometimes animals do things just because things are fun. Um, we're not actually robots, Animals try to aren't just trying to maximize the reproduction or whatever. Birds fly around and flocks because like, holy sh it, we can fucking fly the rules, you know, and fucking is also fun unless you're unlucky enough to be like sucking a right wing dude who buys into the Ben Shapiro thing, which case you're not necessarily having a good time all of them, or you know, have other drama that whatever. Anyway, anyway, but also, gay animals are good for community, and this is the main thing that was in this article that I read that like have I had my mind explode moment or whatever about this um. Gay animals foster kids, and they also allow for relationships like within the animal communities that aren't just like one boy ostrich one and making this animal up for an example, and one girl ostrich or whatever. As you have a greater capacity for love within the community, and it turns out that that makes everyone happier, live longer, and everything is good. So this is a confirmation of this fight that had been going on a hundred years ago competition versus cooperation, which wasn't actually competition versus cooperation. It was one side saying competition is the only thing that happens, and the other side saying it's both. It's always been both, it will always be both. Yeah. Well, that's also like cooperation is. Typically it's cooperation within a sphere that helps a larger group possibly compete with you know, different groups or societies or whatever. Yeah. The champion of this other school of evolutionary biology was not other than a friend of the podcast, Peter Kropotkin, who was this Russian prince. He's another rich white guy, let's be honest, and he renounces his royalty to declare war on Czarist Russia and all states. Uh. He dedicates his life to the twin goals of science and anarchism. He breaks out of the most impossible to break out of prison in Russia in the nineteenth century to circumnavigate the world to foster revolution of let's take care of each other like I watched some animals do while I was a biologist. And so he's the anti Spencer, the survival of the fittest guy, and he writes a book about it, and his book about it is called mutual Aid, A Factor and Revolution. Because he's also a very literal title guy and this is where the phrase mutual aid in the modern context comes from. Is this book mutual aid? As far as I can tell, Um, I don't believe this is this is absolutely not the origin of the idea of mutual aid. In fact, since Kropotkin is a scientist, it's like he's like, no, I've observed this, this exists, um, but I don't know. And then he got into all these like arguments about it at the time. But basically people like sort of forgot about all of these arguments, and it was all of the Russian scientists all not just the leftists, were like no, no, no, it's cooperation, it's both you know. Um, but the sort of further West idea kind of one over for a long time. Yeah, it's so yeah, so id I mean, I I learned most of the bog biological side of this from now right wing lunatic Richard Dawkins's books. Um, but his like books on you know, on genetics, correct, Okay, it's his ideas of how to apply them to women Muslims that, yeah, which Darwin would have had a fucking fist fight with him over. Yeah. Well, I think I mean, look, this might be just me liking an older thing. But I would have thought that the older version of Richard or the younger version of Richard Dawkins would also feel the same way. But truly, what do I know? Yeah, we we can reckon it either way and just declare that young Richard Dawkins would absolutely fistfight, would be the champion four Darwin in the fight to death. Maybe even as you say it out loud, that sounds crazy, all right. My idea about the younger Richard Duckin sounds you know, just not the fighting part, the being a good person part. Yeah, yeah, okay, who knows, Well, that's that's kind of So that's like the phenomenon, right, they went observed this phenomenon, and it's a phenomenon that food not bombs, and literally countless other individuals and organizations such as Solidarity and Snacks not Solidarity not Snacks, which was the precursor or popular Um, has been using this phenomenon all over the world and it is a phenomenon that rules. And that is my my story of food not bombs and mutual aid. That's oh my god, thank you for having it for this has been like lovely and educational, but also I think like it is. It is this like double edge thing of like the history is interesting, but one of the important parts of the I think the rules you talked about last week is like the most important part is like you know, yeah, but also these these people weren't gods that founded this thing. You know, It's like they made mistakes. Um, and it's fine, but the basic bedrock is fine and usable and adjustable. Yeah, totally. Yeah, but again, careful when you're serving that meat because it's a real pain in the g s on the streets. Totally. Andrew, do you have any thing you'd like to plug at the end here for us? Oh? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, well yeah, if you've enjoyed listening to me talk, Um, I'm going to be on tour with a couple more dates, not really tours or a mini tour with my podcasts This Racist I co hosted with Tony News So um, we're going to be in Austin on August and Brooklyn on September time. So possibly the single least profitable way to put together a tour humanly possible, but it's fun and it's you know, just a nice chance to see everyone. Awesome, And Margaret, you have a book coming out, correct I do. It's called we Won't Be Here Tomorrow, and I didn't have a pun prepared about the fact that the title reference okay anyway, And you can get it from a k Press or you can get it from different independent bookstores and if you preorder it, you get an art print and it comes out September twenty and it's full of all of my short stories about uh, I don't know. There's like a trans woman who feeds men too. She robs men and then feeds them to her mermaid lover and then it's like, you know, a whole parable imagine that. And there's another one about someone who uses drones to troll CEOs into quitting. And there's another one about the dead from Valhalla back and fight in the civil war against Nazis because there's no Nazis in Valhalla. Um, if you like that kind of thing, yeah, I know, it's kind of a it's a little bit of Apama, you know. Uh So you can you can buy that and also you can, um listen to my podcasts. I have a podcast called Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff, which is on cool Zone Media and you can't do it every Monday and Wednesday, I have another podcast called Lived Like the World is Dying and it is about individual and community preparedness and you can listen to it also on wherever you find podcasts. Um, but Sophie's not on it, so it's not and we all be sad about that for a moment, a moment of silence. Where can people find you on the Internet? Uh? You can? You can? You can. You can find me on Twitter and Instagram. You can just search my name, I pop up, uh, and then you can follow out cool Zone Media also on Twitter and Instagram. And if you look on the Internet archive, you can find Sophie Lichtman's my Space page. Please don't put, please put, please don't, please don't. It's really it's really not not it baby. If you can find my profile, find my space, don't find mine. I'm gonna tell you the name of the band I was in in two thousand five as on my Space. It's terrible. Oh my gosh. Yeah, So everyone get researching you have a vague sense of your assignment. Yeah yeah, And we'll be back on Monday with another story of cool people who did Cool Stuff. Yeah. By Cool People who Did Cool Stuff is a production of cool zone Media or more podcasts on cool zone Media, Visit our website cool zone media dot com, or check us out on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
