Less Noise, More Coherence: Keeping Teachers at the Center of EdTech | Dr. Gene Kerns

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Welcome to Integrate This, your go -to EdTech
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podcast where curiosity meets classroom innovation.
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Join your hosts, David Berner and Jeremy Mikla,
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as we explore the rapidly evolving world of educational
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technology. From game -changing tools to insightful
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conversations with today's top EdTech voices,
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we're here to help educators stay informed, inspired,
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and ready to innovate. So tune in, level up,
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and let's integrate this. Welcome to the Integrate
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This EdTech podcast. I'm Jeremy Mikla, joined
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by co -host David Berner. And we're excited to
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welcome our guest here today. We have Dr. Gene
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Kearns. Gene is the chief academic officer at
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Renaissance. And Gene, welcome to the program.
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Can you help us out, give our listeners a little
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bit of background about who you are? How did
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you get into this EdTech space that we're engaging
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with you here today? Yeah, so as you said, Gene
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Kerns, I'm with Renaissance. I've been here 20
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years before that. I was a teacher. I am a third
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generation educator and we're up to five generations
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in the family. So like biologically, there's
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like some kind of, you know, genetic programming
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that we're going to work in schools. But, you
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know, I think my EdTech journey started really
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early on because my brother -in -law was like
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early to bring computers home. So, you know,
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first computer labs and those were, you know,
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sometimes Atari's. I mean, just like way back
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in the early, early days of the first computers
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coming into school. But I didn't ever dream of
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working for a tech company. I just had so much
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success with Renaissance stuff in my district
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that when they approached me after a while, I
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said, hey, you've done a lot in your district.
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Do you want to come work at the national level
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with us? I'm like, give it a shot. And 20 years
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later, I guess it stuck. Yeah, I, you know, having
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that longevity within your family of so many
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generations is rather unique. Like, seriously,
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is there something in the water there? Oh, I
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mean, it's kind of like, I think it's, you know,
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I think you see some families that kind of follow
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the same professions. I mean, if you, you know,
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I say my sister, now she's 22 years older. So
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I'm the, by far the youngest kid, but you know,
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when you're a kid and you've gone in and it's
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back to school. So you get carted up to the school
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while the teacher sets up the room. It just,
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it gets comfortable. I mean, you, you, you kind
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of envision yourself and it's going to work,
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work there. So we've, we've, we've got some not
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educators in the family, but the educators. grossly
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outnumber the non -educators. The nones, yeah.
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Yeah, they don't get to talk about work at dinner,
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we do. Right, can you just briefly describe for
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us too a little bit about what renaissance is,
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what renaissance does, and then in your particular
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role there too? Yeah, so what's been very cool
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for me is 20 plus years with a company. So I've
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seen it really, really grow. So, you know, if
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I started 20 years ago, I wouldn't say global.
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I would say now we are global in our operations.
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Back in time, we were really focused on just
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practice and reading and math. Now it's practice
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and assessments, probably our largest division.
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In fact, most people don't realize that Renaissance
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actually is the largest provider of interim informative
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assessment tools in the English speaking market.
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When you understand that Star assessment is widely
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used. Fast Bridge is part of our family. We acquired
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a company called GL Education. They work in a
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lot of English speaking schools. British English
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-speaking schools, both in the UK and then globally
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around international schools. So I don't think
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people realize that, that this little company
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that started in Wisconsin in 1986 with one product,
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the Accelerator Reader, is now a global ed tech
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provider, specializing in assessment, practice,
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and instructional supports with our products
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like Nearpod and Flow Capillary. And one of the
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things to with obviously with a lot of the programs
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and things there's always this balance of trying
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to Make sure that you know, the teacher still
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has some autonomy over some of the things that
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they're doing with students and that it's supporting
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both the teacher and the students can you speak
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a little bit to like What what kind of things
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does and you could you could put it in the frame
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of Renaissance if you want or just in general
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having it, you know being an education as well
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your background What kind of things in your opinion
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should technology do for teachers? Like what
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should be its kind of main goal? Well, you know,
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David, this is one that's really important for
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us. So as again, I've been here 20 years. You
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know, I interacted with the founders of the company,
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Terry and Judy Paul, and there's actually a document
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that Terry wrote. more than 30 years ago, that
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actually kind of encapsulates ideas that we still
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use. And one of the things he wrote about is,
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he said, we pledge that our company will only
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produce things that represent the best use of
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technology. With his idea being, we're not just
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going to use tech because it's flashy and it
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seems fun. We've got to guarantee that what we're
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doing with tech is as good as or better. than
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what a human can be and that it doesn't supplant
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something in the process as well. So we are absolutely
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committed to two things that really kind of guide
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what we do. One is the best use of technology.
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The other one is keeping the teacher at the center.
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So we don't... produce things that kind of like
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take over instruction and, you know, do a lot
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of things. Everything that we serve up is presented
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to the teacher as an option. And then the teacher
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gets to decide based on their knowledge of the
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student, which is always going to be more comprehensive
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than any algorithm or single piece of data coming
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off even a myriad of assessments. We are more
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about keeping the teacher at the center. I mean,
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the other phrase we'll use is supporting teachers,
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not supplanting them. Yeah, that's a extremely
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important conversation right now, too, just because
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we are having a lot of EdTech conversations about
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what does proper technology look like or use
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look like in the classroom and how much is too
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much. And there's a lot of data that's being
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brought forth, too, about ineffective versus
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effective use of technology in the classroom.
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One of the things that comes up as a positive
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is the ability to personalize learning. That's
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always been a pretty huge focus, being able to
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help teachers design things in a way that so
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they can get to more students. And even with,
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you know, with AI, obviously that has increased
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even further. And you have that a lot more options
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and capability to do that. Can you talk a little
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bit about how important personalized learning
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is and how Like the Renaissance software helps
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with that Yeah, I mean it and I think we have
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to be really careful with that term personalized
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learning because if you get 40 people You're
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gonna get 40 different definitions of what that
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looks like So I actually I actually prefer like
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learning that is more personalized and what I
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mean by that is We have the same grade level
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expectations that we should be shooting towards
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with kids. They are starting at different points
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So it's more about how do you support the kids
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who are starting in different places to get to
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the expectation you have for all not. letting
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personalized learning like turn it into completely
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different experiences. I mean, we're the adults
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in the room. We know what kids are supposed to
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learn. And, you know, sometimes you got to eat
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your broccoli and that's good for you. You know,
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you got to learn some geometry along the way.
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You got to learn some algebra. These things are
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important. You may not immediately understand
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it when you're, you're an algebra one, but over
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time you'll, you'll understand about math and
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unknowns and those types of things. And you'll
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see it out there in the world. So I get real
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nervous when personalized learning is any kid
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doing anything anywhere. we're more focused in
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on how do we make sure that our systems are aligning
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really well to the great little expectations.
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And more recently, we've done a lot of work to
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align to individual textbook series. So a teacher
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can now tell our system, this is the book that
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I'm using, this is the unit that I am teaching,
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and then everything else that we do will be filtered
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through that lens. So we will present the most
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relevant assessment information for that unit.
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Oh, if you're teaching that unit to these kids,
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Here's what you need to know about where they
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are starting and will offer them the most relevant
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practice opportunities and the most relevant
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instructional material. So, you know, I think
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teachers, you know. I never believed this idea
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that schools were a factory model. I mean, I
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get that we borrowed a lot from factories, but
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you know, the minute a teacher tried to respond
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to a kid's need, whatever it was, the factory
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model was shattered. I mean, the minute that
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a teacher repeated something or helped a kid
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who was hungry get fed or presented in another
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way, machines don't do that. That's what teachers
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do. The challenge, however, is time marches on.
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So teachers are kind of like raging against the
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machine. So it's how do we balance this We have
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expectations, but you know, there's only so much
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time. So we're really focused in on how do we
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help teachers get as quickly as possible to the
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most relevant information, the most relevant
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activities, those things that are going to make
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the biggest difference for their kids in the
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shortest amount of time. So, Gene, when I was
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in the classroom, which was I actually I just
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realized. today that I've been at my current
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position now for five years and you know so I've
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been out of the classroom for that long and but
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it still seems close enough connected that I
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feel like I could still draw experiences from
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that time. Right, you know, my brain is still
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all there and, you know, and wanting to help
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kids and teachers the best that I can. But one
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of the experiences I remember and, you know,
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being an instructional technology coach in the
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district that I was also teaching in meant that
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I was always, you know, like I felt like it was
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part of my job to constantly present new to new
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tools to teachers or new ways of doing things.
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and not really considering that maybe at the
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time what I was really doing was creating more
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work for teachers because they were trying to
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learn all of these different tools and platforms
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and things. And several of them were very disconnected
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and they were maybe just single use things. What
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sort of impact do you think that that has on,
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or how do you try to find balance maybe within
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there about presenting new ideas and new things
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to teachers? at the same time not increasing
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their workload and not preventing them from doing
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what's really important, which is, you know,
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connecting with kids and building great learning
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experiences. Yeah, I think now, you know, the
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connecting with kids and great learning experience,
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there's a human element that goes beyond technology.
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But let's just let's just focus on the technology
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piece. I think a lot of your question is answered
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when you look at the conversations now that are
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sort of really trending upwards around instructional
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coherence. Like, you know, we've all built these
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systems, you know, we have the different parts,
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the different we have to have a tier one and
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we need some interventions and we we need assessments
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because we have requirements around that. We
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might need a social emotional. We've got all
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these things. We buy all these individual parts.
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The question is, how well do those parts fit
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together? I mean, do they make a unified whole?
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So to your point, some new application comes
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out. Is it something that then connects in like
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hand and glove and it kind of does something
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that could not be done before and it's highly
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coherent, or is it doing something random? So
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one of the things we're doing with our new Renaissance
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intelligence system and even within our star
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assessments is, and I alluded to this before,
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The ability for the user to say I'm using this
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particular book in this particular. I'm on this
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particular unit that allows us to filter out
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a lot of the noise so you know historically the
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schools give assessments and every major assessment
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out there produces an instructional planning
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report. Here's all the skills within range of
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your kid. Here's the problem if that assessment
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doesn't know what unit you're on. in what book.
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The best it can do is just present a broad list
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of all skills. But if it knows what unit you're
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teaching in what book, then you can say, well,
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here's the assessment information relevant to
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this unit. You've got all these activities that
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kids could do that are very much constantly driven
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by EdTech solutions. Are those activities that
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are anyway related to what's going on with the
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current grade level unit? If they are, then great.
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That's highly coherent. Okay, we're giving kids
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extension opportunities to continue to work on
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the topics that we're doing in the classroom.
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But if they're completely unrelated to the unit
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that's being taught, that might not be the wisest
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kind of thing. I mean, you know, I use this idea
00:12:24.919 --> 00:12:27.220
of like systems. Schools buy the parts. They
00:12:27.220 --> 00:12:28.940
always buy the parts. We do that. We got to cover.
00:12:29.100 --> 00:12:31.059
We bought the parts. But it's kind of like saying
00:12:31.059 --> 00:12:32.960
I bought a screw and I bought a screwdriver.
00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:36.059
I didn't consider that the screwdriver was Phillips
00:12:36.059 --> 00:12:38.360
and the screw was a flathead because just because
00:12:38.360 --> 00:12:40.679
you got the parts doesn't mean that your parts
00:12:40.679 --> 00:12:43.399
work together. So there's more and more conversations
00:12:43.399 --> 00:12:46.340
now about making sure that the various parts
00:12:46.340 --> 00:12:48.919
that we bring in, that they all work together
00:12:48.919 --> 00:12:53.320
in highly coherent ways. And the same thing would
00:12:53.320 --> 00:12:55.320
work from the data that you collect from the
00:12:55.320 --> 00:12:58.700
assessments that you're giving if it's all disconnected.
00:12:59.019 --> 00:13:02.799
and fragmented and you know you've got like you
00:13:02.799 --> 00:13:05.200
said the the flab head screwdriver and the philip
00:13:05.200 --> 00:13:07.740
screw that's the same thing could happen with
00:13:07.740 --> 00:13:09.759
data that you're collecting from various assessments
00:13:09.759 --> 00:13:12.840
right and so if you collect fragmented data are
00:13:12.840 --> 00:13:15.720
you then getting you know and the teachers still
00:13:15.720 --> 00:13:19.360
look at that data but does it lead to fragmented
00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:22.120
instruction where they're you know it feels like
00:13:22.120 --> 00:13:24.299
they're hopping all over the place rather than
00:13:24.299 --> 00:13:26.919
heading in a in a in a direction to improve learning
00:13:27.129 --> 00:13:29.470
Well there there's two things there i mean what
00:13:29.470 --> 00:13:32.750
is is all the data coming to like one place are
00:13:32.750 --> 00:13:35.129
we losing information so we do a lot with like
00:13:35.129 --> 00:13:37.509
our education or platform of bringing all the
00:13:37.509 --> 00:13:40.210
data together because sometimes you'll find some
00:13:40.210 --> 00:13:42.850
interesting trends like oh my goodness. This
00:13:42.850 --> 00:13:46.269
student is always absent on a certain part of
00:13:46.269 --> 00:13:48.730
the day on a certain day of the week well something's
00:13:48.730 --> 00:13:51.149
driving that that's not random i mean there is
00:13:51.149 --> 00:13:54.240
some life issue. that is causing this kid to
00:13:54.240 --> 00:13:56.700
be out of the building every Wednesday afternoon.
00:13:56.919 --> 00:13:59.539
And as a result, their grades are down. And if
00:13:59.539 --> 00:14:00.879
you can figure out what that issue is and help
00:14:00.879 --> 00:14:02.960
them address that, well, then grades are going
00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:04.399
to come up. But you wouldn't know that if you
00:14:04.399 --> 00:14:07.620
didn't have all of that data searchable together.
00:14:08.019 --> 00:14:10.659
But the other thing is, if we're not careful,
00:14:11.600 --> 00:14:15.860
being data driven. doesn't necessarily help if
00:14:15.860 --> 00:14:18.500
the data that we're getting back is noise. And
00:14:18.500 --> 00:14:20.419
that's why I tried to make this comparison of
00:14:20.419 --> 00:14:22.600
saying, yeah, I can have a broad instructional
00:14:22.600 --> 00:14:24.559
planning report that tells me all possible skills.
00:14:24.600 --> 00:14:27.379
But if I'm teaching a unit on geometry, I need
00:14:27.379 --> 00:14:29.379
information about the skills related to geometry,
00:14:29.659 --> 00:14:34.039
not statistics, not probability. I need information
00:14:34.039 --> 00:14:36.100
that helps me help my kids be successful with
00:14:36.100 --> 00:14:39.419
this grade level geometry unit first and foremost.
00:14:39.980 --> 00:14:43.100
And sometimes we get so much information. There's
00:14:43.100 --> 00:14:45.240
there's no shortage anymore. And sometimes some
00:14:45.240 --> 00:14:48.639
of that information isn't truly information from
00:14:48.639 --> 00:14:52.019
a systems perspective. People refer to it as
00:14:52.019 --> 00:14:55.460
being noise. It's that's not helpful information.
00:14:55.620 --> 00:14:57.879
It's interfering with my ability to have clarity
00:14:57.879 --> 00:14:59.919
about what I should do with this with a student.
00:15:00.720 --> 00:15:03.450
So what did I like? What could it? district what
00:15:03.450 --> 00:15:06.389
could uh maybe even down to the classroom do
00:15:06.389 --> 00:15:09.590
if if they're they're having trouble sorting
00:15:09.590 --> 00:15:12.830
out the noise from the the quality stuff like
00:15:12.830 --> 00:15:15.070
what what can they do to really get to the heart
00:15:15.070 --> 00:15:17.210
of what's going to lead to successful improvement
00:15:17.500 --> 00:15:19.440
Well, I think it really is driven. There's some
00:15:19.440 --> 00:15:22.360
great reports out there around coherence TNTP,
00:15:22.559 --> 00:15:24.120
which is formerly the new teacher project. They
00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:26.379
were in a bunch of papers that are there. The
00:15:26.379 --> 00:15:28.159
council of chief state school officers put out
00:15:28.159 --> 00:15:31.100
a paper in January that was titled instructional
00:15:31.100 --> 00:15:33.000
coherence at the state level. And of course,
00:15:33.039 --> 00:15:35.120
you know, that's likely to filter down to the
00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:37.740
more more local things there. But I think when
00:15:37.740 --> 00:15:39.320
people start reading about that, they kind of
00:15:39.320 --> 00:15:42.360
begin this conversation of, wow, do the parts
00:15:42.360 --> 00:15:45.019
really? fit together or not? Like, do we have
00:15:45.019 --> 00:15:47.419
a tier two program that is completely separate
00:15:47.419 --> 00:15:49.860
from our tier one program and a tier three program
00:15:49.860 --> 00:15:53.600
that's something else? In fact, one school system,
00:15:53.820 --> 00:15:56.000
Knox County Schools in Tennessee, actually, they
00:15:56.000 --> 00:15:58.740
tested out like, like, what would be more effective
00:15:58.740 --> 00:16:00.779
with kids in intervention, they started studying
00:16:00.779 --> 00:16:04.519
coherence. And so what they did was They took
00:16:04.519 --> 00:16:06.240
their kids who were in intervention and kind
00:16:06.240 --> 00:16:08.059
of split them into two groups. Half the kids
00:16:08.059 --> 00:16:10.519
just got what they'd always done, which was we
00:16:10.519 --> 00:16:11.879
have a tier one, we have a tier two, we have
00:16:11.879 --> 00:16:13.519
a tier three. We've built these things. They're
00:16:13.519 --> 00:16:15.539
part of our system. They may not be completely
00:16:15.539 --> 00:16:17.639
connected, but they're part of the system. The
00:16:17.639 --> 00:16:19.379
other half of the kids, they decided, let's do
00:16:19.379 --> 00:16:21.100
something highly coherent. Let's make sure that
00:16:21.100 --> 00:16:23.059
every part of the intervention experience linked
00:16:23.059 --> 00:16:25.460
directly back to what was going on in the classroom
00:16:25.460 --> 00:16:27.679
right now, that unit. So if you're the intervention
00:16:27.679 --> 00:16:30.029
teacher serving. my students, you've got to know
00:16:30.029 --> 00:16:31.549
what I'm teaching right now to make sure that
00:16:31.549 --> 00:16:33.909
everything that you do in intervention supports
00:16:33.909 --> 00:16:36.590
them in what's going on in the classroom right
00:16:36.590 --> 00:16:39.269
now. What they found was the kids that were in
00:16:39.269 --> 00:16:41.730
that highly coherent intervention grew more,
00:16:41.850 --> 00:16:45.909
on average 1 .3 months of additional growth on
00:16:45.909 --> 00:16:49.059
top of the growth rates that have been achieved
00:16:49.059 --> 00:16:52.120
at the base level, just in interventions overall.
00:16:52.659 --> 00:16:55.320
So, you know, in some ways less work for teachers
00:16:55.320 --> 00:16:57.179
because it's just being drawn out of the core.
00:16:57.600 --> 00:16:59.679
But here's what I love about it. Let's say that
00:16:59.679 --> 00:17:01.759
you're the intervention serving, you know, serving
00:17:01.759 --> 00:17:04.859
my classroom and David's a student of mine. If
00:17:04.859 --> 00:17:07.240
he's coming to you. and you're talking about
00:17:07.240 --> 00:17:08.700
things that relate to exactly what I'm doing,
00:17:08.900 --> 00:17:11.119
it's more likely that as he makes his way back
00:17:11.119 --> 00:17:13.460
and forth between the two of us, it's going to
00:17:13.460 --> 00:17:16.259
all start fitting together. So you support him
00:17:16.259 --> 00:17:18.460
on some prerequisite skill that he needs to be
00:17:18.460 --> 00:17:20.759
successful with the unit that I'm teaching. And
00:17:20.759 --> 00:17:22.440
so he comes into my room and I start working
00:17:22.440 --> 00:17:24.519
on something. He says, wait a minute, we were
00:17:24.519 --> 00:17:27.640
just talking about this in the other room. And
00:17:27.640 --> 00:17:30.500
I think for the students, that's where it starts
00:17:30.500 --> 00:17:32.240
to build their confidence. They can feel like,
00:17:32.240 --> 00:17:34.839
wow, it's finally starting to fit together because
00:17:34.839 --> 00:17:37.920
when schools have incoherent systems, when the
00:17:37.920 --> 00:17:40.440
parts don't fit together, our kids who have the
00:17:40.440 --> 00:17:44.200
most needs are the most exposed to that because
00:17:44.200 --> 00:17:46.640
they're the ones that go into all those additional
00:17:46.640 --> 00:17:50.160
programs. And so if those parts are not designed
00:17:50.160 --> 00:17:53.460
or thoughtfully put together, this sad irony
00:17:53.460 --> 00:17:57.940
is our kids who need the most support. are getting
00:17:57.940 --> 00:18:00.779
the most burden because they're cognitively shifting
00:18:00.779 --> 00:18:02.359
between all these different settings. Wait a
00:18:02.359 --> 00:18:04.680
minute, I'm doing a unit on geometry in more
00:18:04.680 --> 00:18:06.740
core classroom, but my intervention teacher is
00:18:06.740 --> 00:18:10.099
talking with me about probability and I'm shifting
00:18:10.099 --> 00:18:12.960
between these and that's very confusing and very
00:18:12.960 --> 00:18:17.640
difficult. So in that example, what is needed
00:18:17.640 --> 00:18:20.759
for those teachers, the interventionist and the
00:18:20.759 --> 00:18:22.660
classroom teacher to get on the same page? Is
00:18:22.660 --> 00:18:26.859
it just a common prep? or team time, or are there
00:18:26.859 --> 00:18:28.900
ways to do that too? Here's an interesting one
00:18:28.900 --> 00:18:30.960
for administrators on the line. I read this one
00:18:30.960 --> 00:18:32.359
report that says, you know, when it comes to
00:18:32.359 --> 00:18:34.079
coherence, teachers can't do this on their own.
00:18:34.160 --> 00:18:35.759
Like they're going to need your help. Like they
00:18:35.759 --> 00:18:38.700
don't control all the levers that have to be
00:18:38.700 --> 00:18:42.099
pulled for this to happen. So there are documents
00:18:42.099 --> 00:18:44.480
from United States Department of Education that
00:18:44.480 --> 00:18:47.599
talk about the need for there to be some joint
00:18:47.599 --> 00:18:50.259
planning time. I think in some ways that can
00:18:50.259 --> 00:18:52.559
be minimalized because you know what, most districts
00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:55.160
have their pacing guides in place. Like they're
00:18:55.160 --> 00:18:58.289
pretty clear. about what's going to be taught
00:18:58.289 --> 00:19:03.069
when. So it shouldn't require in -person meeting
00:19:03.069 --> 00:19:04.950
after in -person meeting after in -person meeting
00:19:04.950 --> 00:19:06.529
for the interventionist to know what the classroom
00:19:06.529 --> 00:19:08.750
teacher is doing. I think it's more about some
00:19:08.750 --> 00:19:10.990
documents and some resources. And then a touch
00:19:10.990 --> 00:19:13.130
base every now and then to kind of just talk
00:19:13.130 --> 00:19:15.309
about, hey, here's what I've learned about this
00:19:15.309 --> 00:19:17.809
student. This is going well. This is not going
00:19:17.809 --> 00:19:20.710
well. Do you have any insights for me? But I
00:19:20.710 --> 00:19:22.759
think, you know, given the fact that most people
00:19:22.759 --> 00:19:24.359
have, I mean, they have their textbook series,
00:19:24.420 --> 00:19:27.480
they have their pacing guides. It's not a mystery,
00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:31.480
but we've historically had more of a remediation
00:19:31.480 --> 00:19:34.200
mindset. And that is, well, we'll just meet the
00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:35.960
kid where they are and we'll work to grow them
00:19:35.960 --> 00:19:39.380
from there. We'll find what the next step is
00:19:39.380 --> 00:19:41.940
for them. And all of this is saying, well, yes,
00:19:42.099 --> 00:19:44.279
but you've got to know what they're working on
00:19:44.279 --> 00:19:45.940
to the current grade level thing. So don't just
00:19:45.940 --> 00:19:48.890
randomly review everything with them. review
00:19:48.890 --> 00:19:50.509
with them what they need to be successful at
00:19:50.509 --> 00:19:53.670
the grade level unit. If you're doing that it's
00:19:53.670 --> 00:19:55.269
parts are going to fit together better for kids
00:19:55.269 --> 00:19:58.190
and I think that that piece is the more that
00:19:58.190 --> 00:20:00.289
we're coherent the more kids will move between
00:20:00.289 --> 00:20:03.130
those settings and find themselves gaining in
00:20:03.130 --> 00:20:06.109
their own confidence because the parts are fitting
00:20:06.109 --> 00:20:07.970
together but we just don't serve up the parts
00:20:07.970 --> 00:20:10.190
that fit together at the same time let's serve
00:20:10.190 --> 00:20:12.349
up the parts that fit together at the same time
00:20:12.349 --> 00:20:14.910
and let's get kids excited when those parts for
00:20:14.910 --> 00:20:17.829
them start falling into place and it starts making
00:20:17.829 --> 00:20:21.430
sense to them so jean i'm gonna try to give you
00:20:21.430 --> 00:20:25.849
like two different Scenarios here. I guess one
00:20:25.849 --> 00:20:29.089
is like so say you have a school that doesn't
00:20:29.089 --> 00:20:32.329
have any any of your tools, right? What is the
00:20:32.329 --> 00:20:34.769
starting point for them to because I know you've
00:20:34.769 --> 00:20:36.930
already brought up instructional coherence? But
00:20:36.930 --> 00:20:39.769
what is the starting point for let's say you
00:20:39.769 --> 00:20:41.210
start working with this school that doesn't have
00:20:41.210 --> 00:20:45.589
any of the your platforms? In use, where do you
00:20:45.589 --> 00:20:48.569
start with that school at? Do I get to sell them
00:20:48.569 --> 00:20:50.250
something or just have to start before they have?
00:20:51.839 --> 00:20:55.160
Yeah, you get to provide whatever way you want
00:20:55.160 --> 00:20:57.980
to take it. Yeah. Well, if they don't have an
00:20:57.980 --> 00:21:00.180
air stuff, I think it starts with just like an
00:21:00.180 --> 00:21:03.099
honest unit. I mean, audit, excuse me. Let's
00:21:03.099 --> 00:21:04.759
lay all the parts out and let's start having
00:21:04.759 --> 00:21:06.539
conversations about whether these things are
00:21:06.539 --> 00:21:09.039
designed or whether we've built any bridges between
00:21:09.039 --> 00:21:10.960
them so that they can potentially work together.
00:21:11.039 --> 00:21:14.400
For us, it could start in multiple places. A
00:21:14.400 --> 00:21:16.140
lot of our customers start on the assessment
00:21:16.140 --> 00:21:20.589
side. They've had us in their school because
00:21:20.589 --> 00:21:24.289
they needed to screen or progress monitor for
00:21:24.289 --> 00:21:27.309
MTSS or they needed screening for characteristics
00:21:27.309 --> 00:21:30.230
of dyslexia or other requirements here. But here's
00:21:30.230 --> 00:21:32.170
what happens when you're an assessment provider.
00:21:32.769 --> 00:21:34.250
The minute the assessment is over and you give
00:21:34.250 --> 00:21:36.630
those scores, every teacher, every teacher worth
00:21:36.630 --> 00:21:38.910
their salt will say, what's next? Okay, you've
00:21:38.910 --> 00:21:41.230
told me, you've told me these kids need these
00:21:41.230 --> 00:21:44.109
skills. How do I do that? Like, what do you have?
00:21:44.190 --> 00:21:46.109
Do you have a lesson plan? Do you have an activity?
00:21:46.609 --> 00:21:49.490
Do you have a resource? And that's where we're
00:21:49.490 --> 00:21:51.930
getting really excited in just connecting these
00:21:51.930 --> 00:21:53.930
things. So for example, a couple of years ago,
00:21:54.150 --> 00:21:57.390
Nearpod, which is a massive collection of instructional
00:21:57.390 --> 00:21:59.269
resources became part of the Renaissance family.
00:21:59.329 --> 00:22:02.009
And that was a purposeful acquisition because
00:22:02.009 --> 00:22:04.349
we had the assessment piece and we wanted a better
00:22:04.349 --> 00:22:08.710
answer to what's. Next, Freckle is one of our
00:22:08.710 --> 00:22:10.630
practice applications. So, you know, you can
00:22:10.630 --> 00:22:12.990
say to a teacher, OK, time out. If you're teaching
00:22:12.990 --> 00:22:14.930
this unit and this kid needs more practice on
00:22:14.930 --> 00:22:17.230
the skills, here they are in this program. Just
00:22:17.230 --> 00:22:21.069
click here to assign them. And then the magic
00:22:21.069 --> 00:22:23.970
sauce is getting those things all to fit together
00:22:23.970 --> 00:22:26.549
in very nice, seamless ways so that for a teacher,
00:22:26.549 --> 00:22:29.410
it's super easy. And that's our our new Renaissance
00:22:29.410 --> 00:22:31.250
intelligence interface where they don't even
00:22:31.250 --> 00:22:33.210
see individual applications. They see all of
00:22:33.210 --> 00:22:36.180
these things integrated together. presented to
00:22:36.180 --> 00:22:38.400
them through the lens of you simply tell me what
00:22:38.400 --> 00:22:40.579
unit you're doing and what book and then I'll
00:22:40.579 --> 00:22:43.119
just organize everything for you through that
00:22:43.119 --> 00:22:46.759
lens and with that perspective. So then I guess
00:22:46.759 --> 00:22:50.140
it might be the case that it's a similar answer
00:22:50.140 --> 00:22:52.059
but like the other scenario I was thinking of
00:22:52.059 --> 00:22:54.660
is let's say you have a school that does have
00:22:54.660 --> 00:23:00.079
some some of your platforms one or more and then
00:23:00.079 --> 00:23:03.849
they've got where There has been some use, but
00:23:03.849 --> 00:23:06.150
because of like school leader turnover and different
00:23:06.150 --> 00:23:07.970
things like that, there hasn't really been any
00:23:07.970 --> 00:23:09.630
follow through. Where do you start with a school
00:23:09.630 --> 00:23:11.789
like that who has some things in place, but just
00:23:11.789 --> 00:23:13.930
isn't really sure how to like kick the thing
00:23:13.930 --> 00:23:16.809
in gear? Yeah, let's hit two things there. One
00:23:16.809 --> 00:23:19.650
is we really begin to change our interfaces for
00:23:19.650 --> 00:23:22.759
multiple product users. So about two years ago,
00:23:22.779 --> 00:23:24.559
we released a new interface called Renaissance
00:23:24.559 --> 00:23:27.880
Next. That's the default interplace for STAR
00:23:27.880 --> 00:23:29.839
and the interface for people that have multiple
00:23:29.839 --> 00:23:32.640
products so that they can see, oh, yes, when
00:23:32.640 --> 00:23:35.119
the assessment recommended something, it will
00:23:35.119 --> 00:23:37.180
index it for them and say, well, over in Freckle,
00:23:37.319 --> 00:23:39.200
they could do this. Over in Nearpod, they could
00:23:39.200 --> 00:23:41.660
do that. With our new Renaissance Intelligence
00:23:41.660 --> 00:23:43.940
interface, the walls just go down. You basically
00:23:43.940 --> 00:23:48.460
get all the resources put together. So for a
00:23:48.460 --> 00:23:50.799
school that's in that situation, part of it is
00:23:50.799 --> 00:23:54.079
understanding these new interfaces. Another part
00:23:54.079 --> 00:23:56.440
of it is just like simply training. We've done
00:23:56.440 --> 00:23:59.319
a number of studies and we're actually one of
00:23:59.319 --> 00:24:02.960
the, at least last time I checked, the only K
00:24:02.960 --> 00:24:07.059
-12 education provider that is a certified partner
00:24:07.059 --> 00:24:10.200
with the ROI or the Return on Investment Institute.
00:24:10.279 --> 00:24:12.920
So they've blessed our methodology for a series
00:24:12.920 --> 00:24:14.980
of studies that basically say, what's the return
00:24:14.980 --> 00:24:17.019
on investment for the money you invest in one
00:24:17.019 --> 00:24:19.740
of our products? If you pay a dollar for it,
00:24:19.740 --> 00:24:22.390
do you get a dollars worth of benefit back measured
00:24:22.390 --> 00:24:25.950
in a variety of ways. Here's what we found. Even
00:24:25.950 --> 00:24:28.869
one hour of remote training, just a little bit
00:24:28.869 --> 00:24:31.769
of training and support, often could make really
00:24:31.769 --> 00:24:36.230
sizable shifts in that return that schools get
00:24:36.230 --> 00:24:38.750
on their investment. Sometimes there's EdTech
00:24:38.750 --> 00:24:40.829
products that schools have bought and you will
00:24:40.829 --> 00:24:43.650
find shockingly like massive numbers of teachers
00:24:43.650 --> 00:24:45.250
don't even know how to log into them. They don't
00:24:45.250 --> 00:24:48.250
even know that they are there. So you go in just
00:24:48.250 --> 00:24:50.980
do the first you know, a couple of hours of training
00:24:50.980 --> 00:24:53.279
and all of a sudden your metrics around that
00:24:53.279 --> 00:24:56.579
change radically. And then, you know, we've alluded
00:24:56.579 --> 00:24:58.779
to this earlier on, you know, these whole conversations
00:24:58.779 --> 00:25:01.809
about, you know, appropriate use of technology
00:25:01.809 --> 00:25:04.450
and what kids are doing online we've got to be
00:25:04.450 --> 00:25:06.910
able to show that when kids are spending time
00:25:06.910 --> 00:25:09.829
it is time that produces results that there is
00:25:09.829 --> 00:25:12.670
efficacy and again we're very much committed
00:25:12.670 --> 00:25:14.529
to making sure that everything that a kid is
00:25:14.529 --> 00:25:16.450
doing online for us needs to be done online because
00:25:16.450 --> 00:25:18.329
it's doing something better than it you know
00:25:18.329 --> 00:25:21.660
could be done otherwise and It's related to what's
00:25:21.660 --> 00:25:23.559
going on in the classroom and the teacher is
00:25:23.559 --> 00:25:25.819
overseeing what's going. We have no algorithms
00:25:25.819 --> 00:25:28.980
that like automatically assign pathways and work
00:25:28.980 --> 00:25:33.309
for kids. The teachers aren't. part of. Those
00:25:33.309 --> 00:25:35.730
things scare me. That's just always been a philosophical
00:25:35.730 --> 00:25:38.690
thing for me. I didn't like the computer lab
00:25:38.690 --> 00:25:41.069
that the teachers went to with the kids and the
00:25:41.069 --> 00:25:42.829
kids logged on to a system and the teacher came
00:25:42.829 --> 00:25:44.710
back 45 minutes later and picked them up. And
00:25:44.710 --> 00:25:46.569
if you ask the teacher what the kids were doing,
00:25:46.589 --> 00:25:48.170
I don't know, they did the program, but I don't
00:25:48.170 --> 00:25:49.529
really know what they were doing. Those things
00:25:49.529 --> 00:25:53.269
just don't feel right to me. I'm more about supporting
00:25:53.269 --> 00:25:55.569
people so that they're involved in the process.
00:25:55.589 --> 00:25:57.289
And I think as teachers, that's what we want.
00:25:58.390 --> 00:26:01.329
But it's got to be manageable and easy. And we've
00:26:01.329 --> 00:26:05.730
taken some huge steps forward in making just
00:26:05.730 --> 00:26:07.650
the interface and the way the teachers do their
00:26:07.650 --> 00:26:10.170
work daily. Something that is just so easy and
00:26:10.170 --> 00:26:11.609
intuitive to use that when they see it, they
00:26:11.609 --> 00:26:14.869
go, Oh yeah, I can do that. Right. Which is one
00:26:14.869 --> 00:26:16.369
of the biggest barriers. Cause it's like, if
00:26:16.369 --> 00:26:19.450
you don't have a, a system that is like user
00:26:19.450 --> 00:26:22.849
friendly and it's, you know, low, low barrier,
00:26:22.970 --> 00:26:26.150
entry barrier. It's like, um, you kind of. get
00:26:26.150 --> 00:26:27.990
overwhelmed right away by some of the things
00:26:27.990 --> 00:26:29.470
that are found there. So that's that's really
00:26:29.470 --> 00:26:32.430
important. I wanted to just quickly. One other
00:26:32.430 --> 00:26:36.390
question is in the Renaissance blog about that
00:26:36.390 --> 00:26:38.970
you did about instructional coherence, because
00:26:38.970 --> 00:26:40.410
I think you've already kind of addressed like
00:26:40.410 --> 00:26:43.829
why coherence is important, you know, so that
00:26:43.829 --> 00:26:46.849
you can be more successful. But one of the things
00:26:46.849 --> 00:26:49.779
you mentioned in there is textbook. alignment
00:26:49.779 --> 00:26:53.279
um and why why is that piece important because
00:26:53.279 --> 00:26:54.920
i think you had mentioned in there something
00:26:54.920 --> 00:26:59.700
about like how a lot of times teachers can abandon
00:26:59.700 --> 00:27:01.299
their standards a little bit but the textbook
00:27:01.299 --> 00:27:04.240
is still used so can you like you speak a little
00:27:04.240 --> 00:27:06.720
bit to that and why um that piece of it's important
00:27:06.720 --> 00:27:10.240
yeah so what uh and you know a podcast is not
00:27:10.240 --> 00:27:12.640
the best place to to like put images but like
00:27:12.640 --> 00:27:15.839
imagine this Imagine like a dashboard with all
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:17.400
these like compasses, and I think that's what
00:27:17.400 --> 00:27:19.200
teachers are driven by. So they've got their
00:27:19.200 --> 00:27:21.180
standards. That's one of the dials. They've got
00:27:21.180 --> 00:27:23.019
their curriculum. That's another dial. They've
00:27:23.019 --> 00:27:25.140
got the assessment they use. That's another dial.
00:27:25.519 --> 00:27:27.960
If they're using a practice product like Freckle
00:27:27.960 --> 00:27:30.759
or IXL or Alex, that's another dial. If a kid's
00:27:30.759 --> 00:27:32.859
an intervention, that's even more dials on the
00:27:32.859 --> 00:27:35.640
dashboard. Here's the problem. Often for teachers,
00:27:36.099 --> 00:27:38.319
those dials like no two of them point in exactly
00:27:38.319 --> 00:27:40.450
the same direction. They may point kind of in
00:27:40.450 --> 00:27:42.250
a general direction, but most teachers, if you
00:27:42.250 --> 00:27:44.309
ask them, they'll say, Well, my standards say
00:27:44.309 --> 00:27:47.009
this. My textbook says this. I got information
00:27:47.009 --> 00:27:49.769
off an assessment. It says that I kind of put
00:27:49.769 --> 00:27:51.609
it all together and kind of like make a path
00:27:51.609 --> 00:27:54.279
from there. Here's what we have to acknowledge.
00:27:54.660 --> 00:27:57.539
The textbooks among all of those dials, they
00:27:57.539 --> 00:27:59.799
probably exert the most power. And that's why
00:27:59.799 --> 00:28:01.700
I alluded to earlier that teachers don't look
00:28:01.700 --> 00:28:02.980
at the standards every day, but they look at
00:28:02.980 --> 00:28:04.579
their textbooks every day. Like that's, that
00:28:04.579 --> 00:28:07.720
is going to decide in most classrooms. What are
00:28:07.720 --> 00:28:09.299
we going to do tomorrow? I mean, I have a pacing
00:28:09.299 --> 00:28:11.920
guide. I have to follow that. What that then
00:28:11.920 --> 00:28:14.740
means is for a company like Renaissance and the
00:28:14.740 --> 00:28:16.680
other companies that fill that space, we are
00:28:16.680 --> 00:28:19.140
supplemental providers. Now we don't like that
00:28:19.140 --> 00:28:21.380
word because supplemental means like extra, and
00:28:21.380 --> 00:28:22.980
like assessments really important. and practice
00:28:22.980 --> 00:28:25.180
is really important, we get it. But the whole
00:28:25.180 --> 00:28:29.700
point is we should supplement the process. So
00:28:29.700 --> 00:28:32.720
if the textbook is so powerful that it can support
00:28:32.720 --> 00:28:34.519
the standards, then we have a decision to make.
00:28:34.539 --> 00:28:37.579
Do we align with or do we not align to it? Do
00:28:37.579 --> 00:28:39.680
we consider the pacing guide? Do we consider
00:28:39.680 --> 00:28:43.240
the units or do we not do that? And what we've
00:28:43.240 --> 00:28:45.839
come to is the point of saying that to not do
00:28:45.839 --> 00:28:51.069
that would be a gross mistake. because this entity
00:28:51.069 --> 00:28:53.450
is going to guide much of what's going on in
00:28:53.450 --> 00:28:56.430
the classroom. So again, through our interfaces,
00:28:56.569 --> 00:28:58.789
tell us what book you're using, tell us what
00:28:58.789 --> 00:29:01.690
unit you're on, and we will refilter everything
00:29:01.690 --> 00:29:04.470
in the Renaissance ecosystem. to serve up for
00:29:04.470 --> 00:29:07.269
you the most relevant information from our assessment,
00:29:07.450 --> 00:29:09.529
the most relevant activities within our practice
00:29:09.529 --> 00:29:12.609
tools, and the most relevant instructional resources
00:29:12.609 --> 00:29:16.529
within our tools like Nearpod and Flow Capillary.
00:29:16.789 --> 00:29:18.670
And you don't have to go look for them. And what's
00:29:18.670 --> 00:29:21.150
exciting about doing this is we were presenting
00:29:21.150 --> 00:29:23.750
it to some administrators, and we showed it one
00:29:23.750 --> 00:29:25.130
time. And one teacher, one guy said, you know
00:29:25.130 --> 00:29:27.230
what? there are teachers of mine that could have
00:29:27.230 --> 00:29:29.049
done this like they understood the parts they
00:29:29.049 --> 00:29:30.589
knew how to put them all together they could
00:29:30.589 --> 00:29:32.029
have done this but they ran out of time they
00:29:32.029 --> 00:29:33.690
didn't have enough time and now you're just serving
00:29:33.690 --> 00:29:36.170
up all the stuff for them automatically he's
00:29:36.170 --> 00:29:37.930
like they're gonna love it he's like but the
00:29:37.930 --> 00:29:39.349
other thing is there's a lot of teachers who
00:29:39.349 --> 00:29:41.230
would have struggled to do that if they're new
00:29:41.230 --> 00:29:43.890
to the field or new to the setting or they haven't
00:29:43.890 --> 00:29:45.430
used that product before they don't know how
00:29:45.430 --> 00:29:48.170
to integrate all this now with the new renaissance
00:29:48.170 --> 00:29:50.009
next interface i don't have to go look for anything
00:29:50.009 --> 00:29:52.839
i tell it what unit And I tell it what book and
00:29:52.839 --> 00:29:54.599
bam, all my kids are grouped. These are kids
00:29:54.599 --> 00:29:56.319
ready for it. These are kids will struggle with
00:29:56.319 --> 00:29:58.039
it. These are kids that are going to go through
00:29:58.039 --> 00:30:00.380
it very quickly. Here's resources to serve all
00:30:00.380 --> 00:30:03.059
three groups. Click here to assign it. Click
00:30:03.059 --> 00:30:06.339
here to I mean, it's all right there in one place.
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:09.299
What we want to do is just like fundamentally
00:30:09.299 --> 00:30:11.579
change the daily planning that teachers are doing
00:30:11.579 --> 00:30:14.180
and make it easier because again, teachers want
00:30:14.180 --> 00:30:17.519
to respond to kids. They want to desperately.
00:30:17.930 --> 00:30:20.390
But the bell rang and I had to be on hall duty
00:30:20.390 --> 00:30:22.849
and I only got 45 minutes of planning. And so
00:30:22.849 --> 00:30:26.170
if you can help them do more efficient planning,
00:30:26.289 --> 00:30:29.990
they will do more for kids. And our belief is
00:30:29.990 --> 00:30:31.789
the only way that's gonna happen is if you acknowledge
00:30:31.789 --> 00:30:34.230
the primacy of the role of those textbooks and
00:30:34.230 --> 00:30:36.430
you build it into your system. And so that's
00:30:36.430 --> 00:30:38.029
what we've been working on. And it's a big piece
00:30:38.029 --> 00:30:40.009
and it's growing. We have a number of textbook
00:30:40.009 --> 00:30:43.230
partners and with every passing day we're getting
00:30:43.230 --> 00:30:47.160
more. Are you starting to see too though, you
00:30:47.160 --> 00:30:51.079
know, and I'm thinking of the teacher who maybe
00:30:51.079 --> 00:30:53.019
for whatever reason, maybe it's a budgetary,
00:30:53.019 --> 00:30:55.180
you know, restraints that they're not able to
00:30:55.180 --> 00:30:57.259
purchase the textbooks that they need. But instead,
00:30:57.259 --> 00:30:59.079
you know, the teachers are going, they're finding
00:30:59.079 --> 00:31:02.539
their open educational resources and, you know,
00:31:02.599 --> 00:31:06.039
now they've been exposed to, you know, like notebook
00:31:06.039 --> 00:31:09.660
LN or Gemini notebook as it's called now, right?
00:31:09.680 --> 00:31:11.480
Where they can dump their sources in there and
00:31:11.480 --> 00:31:16.019
they can now have AI help them create a more
00:31:16.019 --> 00:31:19.259
coherent, organized, you know, that then becomes
00:31:19.259 --> 00:31:21.680
their textbook of sources that they then, you
00:31:21.680 --> 00:31:24.700
know, share out with their kids. Are you starting
00:31:24.700 --> 00:31:27.059
to see some more of that too? I think there's
00:31:27.059 --> 00:31:29.500
some instances of that. And, you know, in this
00:31:29.500 --> 00:31:31.339
first wave, what we've been doing is doing the
00:31:31.339 --> 00:31:33.180
alignments and the partnerships because that's,
00:31:33.259 --> 00:31:35.460
I mean, that represents the majority. of the
00:31:35.460 --> 00:31:37.160
experiences that kids and teachers are having.
00:31:37.559 --> 00:31:40.160
We are going to build within our interface the
00:31:40.160 --> 00:31:41.920
ability for someone to put in their own scope
00:31:41.920 --> 00:31:44.619
and sequence. So if they're committed to, you
00:31:44.619 --> 00:31:47.059
know, we don't use a textbook per se, but we
00:31:47.059 --> 00:31:49.720
have a curriculum, and these are the skills that
00:31:49.720 --> 00:31:51.440
we're going to teach in these orders. We will
00:31:51.440 --> 00:31:54.500
have, possibly for next year, maybe a little
00:31:54.500 --> 00:31:56.519
bit beyond that. That is on the roadmap. We will
00:31:56.519 --> 00:31:58.980
have that in there. That's an interesting one
00:31:58.980 --> 00:32:01.640
and a challenging one. I mean, to me, Jeremy,
00:32:01.720 --> 00:32:05.500
it's not unlike the whole open educational resources
00:32:05.500 --> 00:32:08.460
conversation of five years ago you know because
00:32:08.460 --> 00:32:09.940
it was like I don't need a textbook anymore I
00:32:09.940 --> 00:32:13.259
just get all this stuff online and I think it
00:32:13.259 --> 00:32:15.440
works for some and I think it works in some specialized
00:32:15.440 --> 00:32:17.839
programs I do have some concerns so there was
00:32:17.839 --> 00:32:20.170
a And that's just based on, and I don't mean
00:32:20.170 --> 00:32:23.170
to make a formal statement here, but we had a
00:32:23.170 --> 00:32:24.970
superintendent who was an advisory board for
00:32:24.970 --> 00:32:27.690
ours and his district like went whole in on that.
00:32:28.069 --> 00:32:31.309
And then some kids saw some lessons that had
00:32:31.309 --> 00:32:33.910
some problems and had some errors. And then all
00:32:33.910 --> 00:32:36.410
of a sudden the school board's asking. And not
00:32:36.410 --> 00:32:38.690
that that doesn't ever happen with a textbook,
00:32:38.690 --> 00:32:41.470
but sometimes those resources have gone through
00:32:41.470 --> 00:32:44.829
far more vetting than some of the other resources
00:32:44.829 --> 00:32:48.190
there. But I think. Either way, whether someone's
00:32:48.190 --> 00:32:50.349
using a textbook or doing something that they've
00:32:50.349 --> 00:32:53.490
created on their own, we will have the ability
00:32:53.490 --> 00:32:56.589
in the not too distant future for them to interface
00:32:56.589 --> 00:32:59.250
with our stuff, whatever way. That's the, we
00:32:59.250 --> 00:33:00.970
want to be the supplemental provider that actually
00:33:00.970 --> 00:33:03.049
supplements. I mean, that does so well. That
00:33:03.049 --> 00:33:05.670
brings in additional information, not noise.
00:33:05.789 --> 00:33:08.430
That brings in extensions to what they're doing,
00:33:08.789 --> 00:33:13.210
not distractions from. what they should be doing.
00:33:13.269 --> 00:33:15.250
So we want to be the supplemental provider, the
00:33:15.250 --> 00:33:18.430
truly supplements. And to do that means that
00:33:18.430 --> 00:33:20.210
you have to bring into your world of consideration
00:33:20.210 --> 00:33:22.029
of exactly what are they doing, whether that's
00:33:22.029 --> 00:33:24.630
a textbook or something else. If you've just
00:33:24.630 --> 00:33:26.869
got your own scope and sequence and it's, you
00:33:26.869 --> 00:33:29.130
know, we say alignment, you know, our skill 23
00:33:29.130 --> 00:33:32.609
is your skill 3 .2 .B. Look, we have a spreadsheet
00:33:32.609 --> 00:33:35.369
that shows you that that doesn't that doesn't
00:33:35.369 --> 00:33:38.109
make teachers days coherent. But when systems
00:33:38.109 --> 00:33:41.539
reinvent themselves, based on the reality that
00:33:41.539 --> 00:33:43.259
you're telling us, this is how we do it here.
00:33:43.720 --> 00:33:49.180
Okay, that does make the day more coherent. You
00:33:49.180 --> 00:33:51.759
touched a little bit on this, but I just want
00:33:51.759 --> 00:33:55.440
to bring the attention more focused on it. Your
00:33:55.440 --> 00:34:00.819
Renaissance AI, how are you intentionally integrating
00:34:00.819 --> 00:34:04.779
AI into your systems so that they are more usable
00:34:04.779 --> 00:34:07.369
and friendly for teachers? Yeah, a lot of that
00:34:07.369 --> 00:34:09.690
is sort of underneath the surface behind the
00:34:09.690 --> 00:34:12.590
scenes. So we really have three forms that AI
00:34:12.590 --> 00:34:14.510
is taking. One is just AI teacher tools, and
00:34:14.510 --> 00:34:16.050
those are going to be what a lot of people see.
00:34:16.190 --> 00:34:19.449
So the ability to create a lesson plan or to
00:34:19.449 --> 00:34:21.690
take a text and level it or to generate a quiz
00:34:21.690 --> 00:34:24.940
or questions. And in that sense. That one portion
00:34:24.940 --> 00:34:28.179
of our work is not unlike work that some other
00:34:28.179 --> 00:34:29.980
groups have done. Now it's baked into our system,
00:34:30.000 --> 00:34:31.800
and I think it's got some great functionalities,
00:34:32.300 --> 00:34:35.000
but it's kind of like what they're doing. The
00:34:35.000 --> 00:34:37.880
other two pieces are our alignment engine and
00:34:37.880 --> 00:34:41.480
our learning engine. So for nearly 20 years,
00:34:41.579 --> 00:34:43.239
we've been building custom learning progressions
00:34:43.239 --> 00:34:45.179
for every state. So we take the standards, we
00:34:45.179 --> 00:34:47.179
unpack them, we know the skills in them, we know
00:34:47.179 --> 00:34:50.809
the prerequisites. When a kid has a assessment
00:34:50.809 --> 00:34:53.289
score of X and you're about to do unit number
00:34:53.289 --> 00:34:56.570
Y, if their performance level is below where
00:34:56.570 --> 00:34:58.329
they need to be, we can tell you exactly what
00:34:58.329 --> 00:35:00.670
skills are in between where that kid is and where
00:35:00.670 --> 00:35:03.750
they need to be. So yeah, I mean, here's an easy
00:35:03.750 --> 00:35:06.050
example. If you're going to do that third grade
00:35:06.050 --> 00:35:09.690
unit on area, multiplying length times width,
00:35:10.090 --> 00:35:12.019
and you have a kid that doesn't No multiplication.
00:35:12.300 --> 00:35:13.300
You're gonna have to see it's multiplication.
00:35:13.460 --> 00:35:16.179
Like that's part of getting there. But you know,
00:35:16.340 --> 00:35:18.480
for whatever the skill is at whatever level,
00:35:18.480 --> 00:35:20.559
we have all this information and learning progressions.
00:35:20.599 --> 00:35:22.500
But again, teachers would have had to assorted
00:35:22.500 --> 00:35:24.619
through that on their own. They could find a
00:35:24.619 --> 00:35:27.219
prerequisite skills. It took hours to do that.
00:35:27.559 --> 00:35:30.380
AI can do that really easily. So bam are basically
00:35:30.380 --> 00:35:33.940
our learning engine says, I know. where the kid
00:35:33.940 --> 00:35:36.940
is based on assessment data, I know your standards,
00:35:37.239 --> 00:35:39.079
I know the skills, and I'll build a pathway.
00:35:39.559 --> 00:35:41.360
Like you tell me what you're about to do, I will
00:35:41.360 --> 00:35:44.019
build a pathway for every kid and bam, the minute
00:35:44.019 --> 00:35:45.659
the teacher logs in, the pathway will be there.
00:35:45.679 --> 00:35:47.599
So that's the learning engine. Then the alignment
00:35:47.599 --> 00:35:50.840
engine says, okay, and if those are the skills
00:35:50.840 --> 00:35:53.840
that the kid needs to learn to progress from
00:35:53.840 --> 00:35:56.059
point A to point B to point C to point D, which
00:35:56.059 --> 00:35:59.260
is where they need to be, I'll serve up for you
00:35:59.260 --> 00:36:01.739
all the resources that Renaissance has or the
00:36:01.739 --> 00:36:04.800
partner has. textbook companies that are partnering
00:36:04.800 --> 00:36:09.320
with us, and that's a growing list. For those
00:36:09.320 --> 00:36:12.079
that are partners with us, we will point to their
00:36:12.079 --> 00:36:15.679
resources as well. So, you know, I'll just randomly,
00:36:16.079 --> 00:36:18.239
Envisions is one of our partners, you know, so
00:36:18.239 --> 00:36:21.179
a kid took a star test, and for star math, we
00:36:21.179 --> 00:36:24.059
could point to Envisions resources and say, if
00:36:24.059 --> 00:36:25.360
that's the skill you're working with this kid,
00:36:25.460 --> 00:36:27.739
here's a resource that you can use. So, teacher
00:36:27.739 --> 00:36:30.429
tools, which are, you know, very common. kinds
00:36:30.429 --> 00:36:32.010
of things that people are seeing with AI, but
00:36:32.010 --> 00:36:34.690
then behind the scenes, this whole learning engine
00:36:34.690 --> 00:36:37.289
that is mapping the pathways that kids need to
00:36:37.289 --> 00:36:40.030
follow to be successful. And this whole alignment
00:36:40.030 --> 00:36:43.510
engine that is serving all possible resources
00:36:43.510 --> 00:36:45.750
and saying, if those are the skills you're going
00:36:45.750 --> 00:36:48.110
to work on with kids, here are resources that
00:36:48.110 --> 00:36:50.750
will help you navigate that step by step by step
00:36:50.750 --> 00:36:52.789
with them. You know, we've had these libraries,
00:36:52.909 --> 00:36:54.630
we've had these lessons, these things were all
00:36:54.630 --> 00:36:57.710
over, but the AI is indexing them and serving
00:36:57.710 --> 00:37:01.340
them. serving them up as options to teachers
00:37:01.340 --> 00:37:03.619
as they decide exactly what path they want to
00:37:03.619 --> 00:37:07.380
take kids along. So teachers can really view
00:37:07.380 --> 00:37:11.460
it as an efficiency tool but also a tool that's
00:37:11.460 --> 00:37:13.219
just going to help them better connect the dots
00:37:13.219 --> 00:37:14.960
to provide the best experience that they can
00:37:14.960 --> 00:37:16.980
in the classroom. Remember we don't auto assign
00:37:16.980 --> 00:37:18.900
everything. Everything is the teacher at the
00:37:18.900 --> 00:37:20.000
center. So we're going to serve up the option.
00:37:20.139 --> 00:37:23.980
I view it as like my always on, never tired,
00:37:24.179 --> 00:37:28.059
24 -7 digital teaching assistant. Like, it'll
00:37:28.059 --> 00:37:29.920
write the lesson plan, it will find the resources,
00:37:30.019 --> 00:37:32.300
it will make all kinds of recommendations for
00:37:32.300 --> 00:37:35.099
me, and then I as a teacher get to make the final
00:37:35.099 --> 00:37:38.219
decision on, okay, within these options, these
00:37:38.219 --> 00:37:40.219
are the ones that I want to use with these individual
00:37:40.219 --> 00:37:42.860
students or groups or classes, whatever level
00:37:42.860 --> 00:37:45.559
you want to take it to, we can support that.
00:37:46.599 --> 00:37:48.480
And then I think part of that too then comes
00:37:48.480 --> 00:37:53.309
back to You know, teachers are feeling this push
00:37:53.309 --> 00:37:55.309
of the amount of screen time that kids are facing.
00:37:55.409 --> 00:37:57.469
But if you can show them that if they need to
00:37:57.469 --> 00:38:00.550
use this piece of technology, whatever it happens
00:38:00.550 --> 00:38:03.010
to be, to reinforce their learning, and it's
00:38:03.010 --> 00:38:05.769
going to do it in a way better than any other
00:38:05.769 --> 00:38:09.349
instruction I can provide, that's really what
00:38:09.349 --> 00:38:11.849
we're looking for is the quality over the quantity
00:38:11.849 --> 00:38:13.969
here. And I'm showing you the quality of the
00:38:13.969 --> 00:38:16.809
amount of educational investment we're putting
00:38:16.809 --> 00:38:19.050
into it. Yeah and that whole screen time thing
00:38:19.050 --> 00:38:20.469
is interesting because I mean really what people
00:38:20.469 --> 00:38:23.050
are concerned about is is one social media. I
00:38:23.050 --> 00:38:24.550
mean like like I don't want a kid like you know
00:38:24.550 --> 00:38:26.710
spending all day on Instagram but I think there's
00:38:26.710 --> 00:38:29.090
also this concern about the programs that do
00:38:29.289 --> 00:38:31.710
what I was alluding to when I say that don't
00:38:31.710 --> 00:38:33.570
reflect the best usage or not, the things that
00:38:33.570 --> 00:38:35.449
just take over and kids do a bunch of stuff and
00:38:35.449 --> 00:38:38.090
we don't know what's going on there. If you look
00:38:38.090 --> 00:38:40.650
at what many states are doing, they're saying,
00:38:40.909 --> 00:38:43.250
okay, we may have a screen time limit, but we're
00:38:43.250 --> 00:38:45.690
going to exclude some of the following things.
00:38:45.710 --> 00:38:47.590
We're gonna exclude assessment time because we
00:38:47.590 --> 00:38:49.349
have to assess kids. There's some requirements
00:38:49.349 --> 00:38:51.789
there. Another big area and this is the main
00:38:51.789 --> 00:38:54.550
point is they will say, we will exclude from
00:38:54.550 --> 00:38:58.909
the time limits. Technology that is teacher directed.
00:38:59.949 --> 00:39:02.090
Like things that kids are doing online that teachers
00:39:02.090 --> 00:39:05.530
have complete knowledge of and control of that
00:39:05.530 --> 00:39:07.889
they have assigned that they're going to be part
00:39:07.889 --> 00:39:10.789
of that they're going to be mediating and that
00:39:10.789 --> 00:39:12.969
represents a whole lot of what we do like we
00:39:12.969 --> 00:39:15.309
we are we shy away from those algorithms that
00:39:15.309 --> 00:39:17.349
take over and kids spend a lot of time without
00:39:17.349 --> 00:39:21.650
a teacher so. teacher directed kind of stuff,
00:39:21.809 --> 00:39:24.289
which I think, again, is far less concerning
00:39:24.289 --> 00:39:27.190
to people than, well, my kid logged on to program
00:39:27.190 --> 00:39:30.670
X, and they spent 45 minutes over there, and
00:39:30.670 --> 00:39:32.469
they either liked it or didn't like it, and the
00:39:32.469 --> 00:39:34.230
teacher did or did not know what was going on.
00:39:34.230 --> 00:39:37.210
That's where people get real nervous, I think,
00:39:37.369 --> 00:39:39.289
about screen time. And that's why we're finding
00:39:39.289 --> 00:39:42.550
ourselves in the situation where we are. And
00:39:42.550 --> 00:39:44.909
I think in this in the situation, too, where
00:39:45.739 --> 00:39:48.000
A student gets a reward because they finished
00:39:48.000 --> 00:39:49.840
something early. Oh, well, why don't you just
00:39:49.840 --> 00:39:51.920
go play on your screen over there? You know?
00:39:52.239 --> 00:39:54.739
Yeah. And then then that's the stories that come
00:39:54.739 --> 00:39:57.559
back that it's not being used in an educationally
00:39:57.559 --> 00:40:00.780
sound way. Yeah. Yeah. It's the pendulum swung.
00:40:00.940 --> 00:40:03.000
It's swinging. We've got to get back in the middle.
00:40:03.139 --> 00:40:05.559
They only work in clocks, but we'll go through
00:40:05.559 --> 00:40:07.039
the swing and we'll get back to more balanced
00:40:07.039 --> 00:40:10.929
world. All right, Gene. Well, we appreciate everything
00:40:10.929 --> 00:40:13.429
that you provided is information what you're
00:40:13.429 --> 00:40:16.750
working on and with Renaissance We want to go
00:40:16.750 --> 00:40:19.789
into our lightning round here just to get I've
00:40:19.789 --> 00:40:21.590
heard about your lightning rounds. I hope I'm
00:40:21.590 --> 00:40:25.550
ready Yeah, so we have the lightning round questions
00:40:25.550 --> 00:40:27.989
Some of them are you know, maybe are gonna connect
00:40:27.989 --> 00:40:30.150
to what we've been talking about a little bit
00:40:30.150 --> 00:40:33.309
But we also like to add in personal ones as well
00:40:33.309 --> 00:40:35.090
to get to know our guests. All right, I'm prepared
00:40:36.360 --> 00:40:39.300
So Jeremy's kicking it off here. Okay. Yeah.
00:40:39.360 --> 00:40:41.679
So, Gene, what's a book or a show that you're
00:40:41.679 --> 00:40:44.420
into right now that isn't an education related
00:40:44.420 --> 00:40:46.659
that you go to when you're getting away from
00:40:46.659 --> 00:40:49.099
the space that you work in? We are making our
00:40:49.099 --> 00:40:51.159
way through right now your friends and neighbors.
00:40:51.340 --> 00:40:53.739
So that's kind of been like the most recent show
00:40:53.739 --> 00:40:55.460
and then like everything that Taylor Sheridan
00:40:55.460 --> 00:40:58.199
does. We just watched like season was a season
00:40:58.199 --> 00:41:00.539
three episode one of Lioness. So that's the one
00:41:00.539 --> 00:41:03.900
we just kicked off there. So how that man writes
00:41:03.900 --> 00:41:05.619
all the things he writes at the rate that he
00:41:05.619 --> 00:41:08.760
does it. I do not know, but good lord, he's got
00:41:08.760 --> 00:41:12.659
to be making some money. All right, next one.
00:41:12.739 --> 00:41:14.940
What's a question that a school leader should
00:41:14.940 --> 00:41:18.239
ask of a vendor before purchasing or adopting
00:41:18.239 --> 00:41:21.559
an EdTech tool? Yeah, efficacy research. And
00:41:21.559 --> 00:41:23.840
again, we present a lot of that through the lens
00:41:23.840 --> 00:41:26.480
of ROI. If I'm going to spend a dollar with you,
00:41:26.480 --> 00:41:29.780
am I going to get a dollar or more back? And
00:41:29.780 --> 00:41:33.719
there are ways to quantify that. we need to know
00:41:33.719 --> 00:41:35.380
that the investments that we're making. Because
00:41:35.380 --> 00:41:37.960
you know what, there's always going to be more
00:41:37.960 --> 00:41:40.059
needs than we have time or money in the bank.
00:41:40.099 --> 00:41:43.019
We got to make sure that every play we make is
00:41:43.019 --> 00:41:45.280
getting the return. So ask about that stuff.
00:41:47.380 --> 00:41:49.719
So Gene, you're taking a trip to a theme park,
00:41:49.780 --> 00:41:52.460
maybe like a Disney park or something along those
00:41:52.460 --> 00:41:55.860
lines. Do you map out a plan to maximize your
00:41:55.860 --> 00:41:58.380
efficient use of park time? Or do you just go
00:41:58.380 --> 00:42:00.599
with the flow and what looks good and head that
00:42:00.599 --> 00:42:02.909
direction? Well, that's an interesting one for
00:42:02.909 --> 00:42:04.929
me, because I usually am a planner. Now, if you
00:42:04.929 --> 00:42:06.710
said we're mapping a vacation, it's going to
00:42:06.710 --> 00:42:08.690
be multiple days. I will map the heck out of
00:42:08.690 --> 00:42:10.769
it. Like I will. And that's that can be a bad
00:42:10.769 --> 00:42:13.449
thing. But I am I am a planner for something
00:42:13.449 --> 00:42:16.690
like that. I've never felt complain to help to
00:42:16.690 --> 00:42:18.670
plan a park. I mean, it might be like there's
00:42:18.670 --> 00:42:20.409
a certain show we need to be out at two o 'clock.
00:42:21.090 --> 00:42:23.449
But outside of that, I'll just walk and see how
00:42:23.449 --> 00:42:25.789
the lines are and go from there. So theme parks,
00:42:25.789 --> 00:42:27.909
I guess I drop my planning hat and just kind
00:42:27.909 --> 00:42:31.750
of go with them a little bit more. All right,
00:42:31.750 --> 00:42:34.730
next one is what is something that people would
00:42:34.730 --> 00:42:39.090
be surprised to know about you? Oh I'm an ordained
00:42:39.090 --> 00:42:42.710
minister And if you've ever watched friends you
00:42:42.710 --> 00:42:45.010
think about like Joey getting ordained for 2495
00:42:45.010 --> 00:42:47.429
online to perform a wedding that's pretty close
00:42:47.429 --> 00:42:50.710
to my experience my My now sister -in -law and
00:42:50.710 --> 00:42:52.889
brother -in -law were getting married and his
00:42:52.889 --> 00:42:55.349
sister is a minister. So it would have been like
00:42:55.400 --> 00:42:57.659
Everybody's like, oh, Megan's gonna marry you
00:42:57.659 --> 00:42:59.659
all. Well, they wanted her to just like be off
00:42:59.659 --> 00:43:03.159
duty that day, just be part of the bridesmaids.
00:43:03.360 --> 00:43:04.960
So like, well, someone else has got to marry
00:43:04.960 --> 00:43:07.780
us. So somehow my sister -in -law got this idea
00:43:07.780 --> 00:43:09.880
that I'd get ordained and I'd do their wedding.
00:43:10.119 --> 00:43:12.980
And what she overlooked was that... Yes, the
00:43:12.980 --> 00:43:15.320
ordination is good in 48 states, but New York
00:43:15.320 --> 00:43:17.880
City requires more. So I had to go to the marriage
00:43:17.880 --> 00:43:20.719
office in downtown New York to sign this book.
00:43:21.179 --> 00:43:23.199
I'll tell you, if you've ever got like just even
00:43:23.199 --> 00:43:25.199
half an hour to kill extra time in New York,
00:43:25.500 --> 00:43:28.139
if you go to the marriage office, it's the coolest
00:43:28.139 --> 00:43:29.840
thing ever, because there are people that are
00:43:29.840 --> 00:43:31.760
dressed up. They're in their tuxedos. They're
00:43:31.760 --> 00:43:34.940
people in sweats. And they are every age and
00:43:34.940 --> 00:43:36.820
shape and size. Some are getting their marriage
00:43:36.820 --> 00:43:38.820
license. Some are having the judge marry them.
00:43:39.210 --> 00:43:43.190
I'd like the best people watching in the world
00:43:43.190 --> 00:43:46.369
occurs in New York City's marriage office. And
00:43:46.369 --> 00:43:49.369
I am registered in the big books, 48 states and
00:43:49.369 --> 00:43:53.130
the city of New York. I got you covered. Well,
00:43:53.130 --> 00:43:55.349
perfect. If my wife and I ever decide to renew
00:43:55.349 --> 00:43:58.389
our vows, I'm going to call you up and maybe
00:43:58.389 --> 00:44:03.260
meet you in New York City. Okay, so let's say
00:44:03.260 --> 00:44:05.199
David and I are having a conference tomorrow
00:44:05.199 --> 00:44:07.500
and you're gonna be our keynote speaker and we
00:44:07.500 --> 00:44:09.280
want to make sure that the crowd is all pumped
00:44:09.280 --> 00:44:11.460
up and ready for you to walk out on that stage.
00:44:11.940 --> 00:44:15.659
What's gonna be your walk -up song? Oh, you know,
00:44:15.659 --> 00:44:17.440
they asked me that sometimes for our big sales
00:44:17.440 --> 00:44:19.760
kickoff what I'm gonna walk up to. I think right
00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:21.880
now I'd do the future so bright, you know, that
00:44:21.880 --> 00:44:23.460
once futures are bright, I gotta wear shades.
00:44:24.059 --> 00:44:25.559
Yeah, I'm really excited about where we are.
00:44:25.559 --> 00:44:27.699
I've been running since for 20 years and like
00:44:27.699 --> 00:44:30.510
what we're what we're doing right now is some
00:44:30.510 --> 00:44:32.789
of the most exciting work. I mean we are really
00:44:32.789 --> 00:44:35.789
bringing things together in incredibly intuitive
00:44:35.789 --> 00:44:39.590
and easy ways and the ultimate test is people
00:44:39.590 --> 00:44:42.409
are responding. I mean like we really started
00:44:42.409 --> 00:44:44.530
launching this new system in January which is
00:44:44.530 --> 00:44:47.289
not an ideal time because you know schools don't
00:44:47.289 --> 00:44:49.929
make their buying decisions fast but we had like
00:44:50.119 --> 00:44:53.699
an incredible number of schools like decide and
00:44:53.699 --> 00:44:55.500
make the priority to get the funding and do it
00:44:55.500 --> 00:44:58.579
for this year for back to school. So, you know,
00:44:58.679 --> 00:45:01.699
it's resonating. And so I think the future future
00:45:01.699 --> 00:45:06.980
is bright. All right. And it's by Timbuk3, I
00:45:06.980 --> 00:45:10.239
guess. So I'm going to add it to our playlist.
00:45:10.380 --> 00:45:12.239
We have an integrate this guest playlist. It
00:45:12.239 --> 00:45:14.079
was an 80s one. Maybe it's a different one. I
00:45:14.079 --> 00:45:16.079
just it was Huey Lewis. What is Huey Lewis? Oh,
00:45:16.139 --> 00:45:18.179
is it Huey Lewis? I gotta wear shades. I'm glad
00:45:18.179 --> 00:45:20.780
I said that. I'm a child of the 80s, so it had
00:45:20.780 --> 00:45:23.340
to be an 80s song. Okay, yeah, I'll find the
00:45:23.340 --> 00:45:24.739
right one, because we do have an integration.
00:45:24.739 --> 00:45:26.559
Yeah, be careful. It could have a wrong mix,
00:45:26.780 --> 00:45:28.500
like Gene told me to play that one. I don't know.
00:45:28.920 --> 00:45:31.360
Yeah, because it gets added to our guest playlist
00:45:31.360 --> 00:45:33.360
on Spotify. Oh, yeah, so let's be careful. I'm
00:45:33.360 --> 00:45:34.880
not sure. It's like, maybe Lewis or something
00:45:34.880 --> 00:45:37.880
like that. Okay, I'll find the right one. Yeah.
00:45:39.039 --> 00:45:41.659
Okay, so our last segment here, Gene, is just
00:45:41.659 --> 00:45:43.659
this or that. So it's rapid fire. Got to choose
00:45:43.659 --> 00:45:48.099
one or the other. Notebook, paper, or a notes
00:45:48.099 --> 00:45:52.869
app? No book paper. Podcasts or music while traveling?
00:45:53.889 --> 00:45:56.849
Podcast. Mountains or beach? Mountains, just
00:45:56.849 --> 00:46:00.349
back from them. Text somebody or call somebody?
00:46:00.630 --> 00:46:03.949
Text. And then the first to leave the party or
00:46:03.949 --> 00:46:07.550
the last to stay? First to leave. All right.
00:46:08.590 --> 00:46:10.809
Well, Gene, you survived it. Appreciate your
00:46:10.809 --> 00:46:13.170
time and sharing your experiences with us here
00:46:13.170 --> 00:46:17.039
today. Yeah. So thank you very much. Before we
00:46:17.039 --> 00:46:19.400
do let you off the hook here, is there anything
00:46:19.400 --> 00:46:21.199
that you would like to share for the listeners?
00:46:21.800 --> 00:46:24.619
Contact information, links that people could
00:46:24.619 --> 00:46:26.880
go to, or any upcoming events that you want to
00:46:26.880 --> 00:46:29.239
promote. Oh, sure. I mean, check out what's going
00:46:29.239 --> 00:46:31.619
on with our company right now. So renaissance
00:46:31.619 --> 00:46:34.380
.com and particularly look for the stuff around
00:46:34.380 --> 00:46:37.579
renaissance intelligence. It's really exciting.
00:46:37.719 --> 00:46:39.420
I mean, it's one of those things where just give
00:46:39.420 --> 00:46:41.599
us a few minutes to show you. And I think in
00:46:41.599 --> 00:46:43.159
just a few minutes when we show you what we've
00:46:43.159 --> 00:46:46.539
done, you'll be like, oh yeah, like that really
00:46:46.539 --> 00:46:49.570
works. And like I said, the test has been. the
00:46:49.570 --> 00:46:52.090
number of schools that even when we were launching
00:46:52.090 --> 00:46:54.250
this you know in late in what would have been
00:46:54.250 --> 00:46:56.289
the year buying process that we're still saying
00:46:56.289 --> 00:46:58.070
yeah we're going to make that a priority because
00:46:58.070 --> 00:47:01.489
that's gonna gonna really change everything so
00:47:01.489 --> 00:47:03.550
this is there you know i've got my linkedin page
00:47:03.550 --> 00:47:05.630
you're welcome to follow all that kind of stuff
00:47:05.630 --> 00:47:07.469
uh but really check things out at renaissance
00:47:07.469 --> 00:47:09.889
.com you go there forward slash webinars to tell
00:47:09.889 --> 00:47:11.889
you you'll see the history of the webinars and
00:47:11.889 --> 00:47:13.929
all that kind of stuff what's going on and forward
00:47:13.929 --> 00:47:16.070
slash blog you'll kind of see some of the ones
00:47:16.070 --> 00:47:18.130
you guys referred to you know we've got the standard
00:47:18.130 --> 00:47:20.829
stuff there and it's just exciting stuff going
00:47:20.829 --> 00:47:23.389
on. So I appreciate the time to come and chat
00:47:23.389 --> 00:47:25.809
and just kind of riff with you all a little bit.
00:47:26.889 --> 00:47:29.070
Yeah, definitely. We'll link some of those into
00:47:29.070 --> 00:47:31.869
our show description here as well. So again,
00:47:31.969 --> 00:47:34.610
just thank you so much, Gene. Thank you. Appreciate
00:47:34.610 --> 00:47:39.090
it. Thanks for listening to Integrate This. Want
00:47:39.090 --> 00:47:41.349
to take your learning further? Head over to our
00:47:41.349 --> 00:47:44.309
YouTube channel for quick tutorials, deep dives,
00:47:44.550 --> 00:47:47.050
and more EdTech tips you can use right away.
00:47:47.630 --> 00:47:50.809
Don't forget to subscribe and catch new podcast
00:47:50.809 --> 00:47:54.730
episodes every Thursday on Apple, Spotify or
00:47:54.730 --> 00:47:57.889
wherever you get your podcasts. Until next time,
00:47:58.289 --> 00:48:01.789
keep exploring, keep innovating and keep integrating
00:48:01.789 --> 00:48:02.170
this.