MERCHHH, What Makes an Excellent Collaboration, Fashion and Our Identity | Lord Landon Michael

Michael: This is Michael Morgan and welcome to Exploring Creativity. I've been on a mission with this podcast for over a year now to uncover new insights into the creative process. My goal is being to help creative people make the best work of their entire lives. These conversations have fundamentally changed how I create, how I collaborate and how I think.

And I hope they'll do the same for you.

I'm recording this conversation a week after I've released my first collection of of clothing from my line called merch

Merch was a year long project that not only took a lot of effort, but involved a lot of people along the way. One of those people I had the pleasure of working with was Lord land. And Michael Lord is a self-described hybrid, creative and fashion architect.

I love that title. I definitely wanna talk about it. Aside from our recent collaboration, he's worked on the Tribeca film festival, red carpet. He's an editor for print boy magazine and costume designer for Saint AMA. Collaboration was one of my favorites and recent memories. And I had to have 'em on the show to talk about our collaboration and introduce you to someone who I think is an excellent human being.

I'd like to welcome Lord Landon, Michael to the show. Hello? Hey

I'm so excited to chat. Um, we've been talking about this for a little bit now. Uh, the merch collaboration was super fun and, uh, I, I knew once we launch, I wanna have a special episode like this where you and I could be in conversation about the brand, about our collaboration and about you.

So that's why you're here today.

Landon: Yeah, I'm excited. I'm so excited about all of it.

Michael: Great. So, um, for listeners, uh, I always send out a survey ahead of time asking the guests what they would like to speak about. If there's anything we should cover. And one of the things, uh, Lord mentioned was why are you so obsessed with me?

he's, that's what he wanted to know. Uh, and then he wrote like LOL JK, but I was like, let's start there. Let's start with why I'm obsessed with you. Because many times throughout the project, you're like you keep saying that I'm such a good collaborator and I'm this and that. And I was like, yeah, I do keep saying it, but it's been so great.

And, um, so I wanted to take this, uh, beginning of the episode to explain why I am so obsessed with you. And hopefully, uh, for people listening, maybe they can see some qualities in people they work with and maybe, uh, or, or people they would like to work with. Um, or they

Landon: can become obsessed too. Like

Michael: forget everyone.

So one of the things, um, I spoke to my buddy Nate, about the other day about you, was how, you know, when I collaborate with people a lot of times, and I'm sure you've seen this, um, you have a vision for something, and then you collaborate with someone else and they have a vision for that thing, or just a totally different vision.

And it almost seems like the collaboration is, uh, here's my vision. They're like, here's mine and I'm going to move your vision closer to mine. Um, and with you, it, it, that mode always kind of bugs me a little bit because I think if you have a really good vision, the collaborator should act in support of that.

Um, and it obviously depends on the arrangement, but in a lot of arrangements, it's cool to have a visionary in whatever group that is. I think what was so great about working with you is that there was never a time where I felt like you were moving the direction away or against where I was already going with it.

And instead, I really feel like you carried the, um, idea and shepherded that idea through, to its full realization. Um, and I never felt like, oh, no, like, I don't know what he's gonna do, or I, you know, I hope this works out or, oh, like, I don't really like that idea that he's going for. It was never that it was always like, literally, I mean, there were so many times where you would present something the first time and I was like, cool, uh, let's talk about this.

And you're like, well, what about that? And I was like, oh, we're already done with that. That's great. nailed it. And I think it's really important to me that. I work with people who get the idea and in service of serving the idea as best as possible. And it's not like a, I think my ideas are the best. It's just that I brought this idea and I wanna see it realized, you know, and, and I wanna work with people that also wanna see that realized.

And I think at the core of it, I think that was like the start of why I think this collaboration was so great and easy, um, to, to work within, which was, you really realized that vision and you carried it forward. And not only did you like it, wasn't just like taking what I had and bringing it forward, but really adding, um, energy into that idea that just helped, uh, making, uh, helped it to be more realized, um, as time went on, in fact so much so that I feel like I realized my own brand because of working with you, like in a way that I didn't see it initially.

And. You know, I initially technically hired you under the role as like stylist, but I feel like, and I, I wrote this note down that I, it felt more like you were a guide for me throughout this process. I hadn't released a fashion line before. I knew you had not only experience in it, but you have a love for this field.

And I knew that you would be someone or at least felt that you would be someone that could guide me through that process. Uh, and you really did. And another part of that guidance was like, There was never a moment where I felt ashamed to ask questions about things that I didn't know. Uh, I felt like you would receive it and be able to explain it to me in a way that, um, if you used some term that I wasn't familiar with or were doing some process, I wasn't familiar with, you were always ready to explain if needed.

Um, I think one of the reasons I, or concepts I had about fashion I said was a very, you know, um, siloed, very pretentious industry. And at least in this collaboration, it didn't feel that way. And so those are some reasons why I'm obsessed with you. Um, and I really mean that, uh, it was such a pleasure to work, uh, with you on this.

Landon: Yeah. You know, it's like removing the best thing to make a collaboration really work is honestly removing these Eagles from things, um, you know, being brought on and knowing that. This was your first launch of many, but, um, this was your first launch. So I knew that there was gonna be questions there, you know, and at times if you go into this situation and you are completely like in the realm of just fashion, then yeah.

You're gonna get to this point where you're like, oh yeah. Why do that to me, these questions, but I know your intentions behind it. And that's where it's like really understanding each partner in a collaboration. You know what I mean? And what we're looking to do. Cause we have one goal on set, no matter what, or within a collaboration, and it's not gonna get, we're not gonna get there.

We're like butting heads, you know, but honestly just understanding your vision and then, you know, my route, I'm definitely rooted in storytelling. So whenever I am presented with anything, I want to know. The full story behind it. I wanted to know the origins of it. I wanted to know the inspiration behind it, because then that helps me to be able to develop the concept and be able to create the fashion that supports what your brand

Michael: needs.

Hmm. Love that. And I wanted to ask you actually about collaboration. What are the key things you're asking yourself when you're working with people or before you start working with people to, um, really help realize that concept. You mentioned knowing the story, knowing the origins, knowing the inspiration.

Is there anything else you're looking for, uh, when you begin working with people?

Landon: Well, and you know, the big thing that I've learned over my time is the energy, you know, the energy that you're met with when you're presented an opportunity to collab, you know, and it's, and that's so important because, um, one of my.

Friends was like, you know what, every time I'm on set with you, you have like a really great team. There's so much great energy. And I was like, that's the only way to work. Like, that's the only way we're gonna walk away from this project and feel fulfilled, satisfied with what we produced, because I've been, I had one instant where I was on a set and it was very combative.

Um, and no good came from it , we didn't even, we weren't even able to produce a project. And that was a learning for me, you know? So I always, I always dive into the, the energy of the other person and then what we're really wanting to do with this project. Cause that weighs like so heavy on me. Um, and then yeah, and we just keep going and you know what I mean?

And it's that communication is always so important

Michael: too. Yeah, you have, um, you know, I mentioned why I'm obsessed with you. A lot of that is about being an excellent collaborator. I'm wondering, like, what does it mean to you to be an excellent collaborator, I assume. And I will ask a follow up, which is, um, you know, were you like this from the start?

Did it kind of take moments where you were like, oh, that's not what I want to do. you know, like what does it mean to be an excellent collaborator? And, and what does it mean and how did you learn it?

Landon: Yeah, you know, I think, um, it really came from that. It really came from that one moment, but I had no idea when I first, when I first started out like collaborating, I was like, the ego was in play.

You know what I mean? I came in as like, I'm gonna be this fashion editor and this is my voice. This is how it should be done. And no, it's definitely not how it works because it's like, especially in. You know, to your point of the fashion realm being contentious. It's like, you feel like you need to play this role as like this fashion stylist and this Anna of sorts.

You know what I mean? But, um, once I shared that and once I shared it, the ego, and once I found out that we can make so much more beauty together than just trying to single handedly steer the ship on your own, you know what I mean? Um, once I figured that out, everything became so much easier, you know what I mean?

And the energy onset were very different. They weren't strange. And we could really just get some work that we are proud of at the end of the day. Um, so once I realized that and two going back to that situation I had, but going back to that moment, that really helped me, um, really redefined. Collaboration

Michael: for me.

I love this idea of shedding narratives that you have around, like who you're supposed to be or how you're supposed to be. Like, what it mean to be the designer in the room. What does it mean to be the stylist in the room? You know, what is that sort of prevailing narrative in the industry? Cause every industry has one, you know, like the, you know, the hipster graphic designer, the, you know, um, musician, you know, like grungy musician or whatever, like there are these archetypes that exist and people kind of hold around.

Um, what would you say led to the shedding of that, uh, for you? What, what moments or, or what thoughts or prompts did you have that kind of led to that? I don't need that narrative anymore,

Landon: you know? Um, So I'm gonna, I'm gonna address that moment. That changed my life. I was doing a, um, I was doing a cover shoot for a publication, and I had been working with the publication for quite some time.

They were based in the UK. Like I had envisioned I was about to be the American editor at large. Like it was going that direction. It was given all of that. Um, but then, you know, the photographer, I started out as like the stylist, but then drifted into more creative direction. But when we got on set, like that idea was just totally, um, forgotten.

And at that point, like there was almost this other team that had come in and like taken over and was like, this is how we're doing it. This is way we're executing. Like. No, if ands, buts about it. So it was a very like toxic, um, set and, uh, in result, I mean, I literally lost the cover. Um, the images never existed.

Like they are dead. Um, so that was like a complete waste. And at that time I literally stepped back for like six months. I stopped working for like six months cuz it took me out because I was like, I've never like lost a cover. Like I've never, well, I've never like had a project that just failed so horribly and I'm like, what was it?

And I had to go back and like definitely reflect on that moment. And it was the fact that there wasn't that collaborative spirit there, you know what I mean? And, and there wasn't any respect on the set. Um, and it was a really, it was a really challenging day and it was, it was a sad moment because you know, that was, um, something that.

As many of my projects or all of my projects, I'm very passionate about. Um, and so, yeah, it took me back, but it gave me, it gave me the strength to know that I will never settle for less one collaborating and make sure that that positive energy is there before the next meeting starts. You know, we have that initial meeting where we're discussing ideas, but like, it has to be those good vibes and it just really has to be that, um, just that like collaborative spirit amongst everybody, you know, I mean, from, from the photographer down to the interns, like, you know, it's like we have one and I always say it on set.

We all have one goal, you know, on set. And so that is, that's the focus, you know, and that's, what's important at the end of the day, not the egos, not any of the other things. Um,

Michael: so yeah, you know, one thing I, I learned from you and I, I was on the phone, uh, with Nate Ferrari, who, um, works with me on the podcast behind the scenes, doing production and doing content.

And we, we had a recap the other day, just talking about, he actually queued up all the content for the merch, uh, Instagram as well. He's a collaborator I love working with love talking to, and we always like sharing learnings about collaborations we've had. So we were talking about merch and we were talking about you.

And I was saying you were an upcoming guest. And one of the other takeaways I had was how, um, a lot of times we feel like we need to have like a strong voice in the room for like, that needs to be heard. Whereas like in a way by like, like a defined style, a defined way of being like this sort of rigid thing in the room.

And it's like, that's how that vision's gonna be achieved. And I felt like with you, you didn't have that. And a lot of people would be nervous to even explore not being that way, but it, as a result of that, you have a defined way of working and it still resulted in an outcome that I think was, was great.

And I think it still represents you just as much as, or maybe more than if you had forced like some sort of vision, um, that sort of suspension of, um, authority, I guess you could say, uh, is for, even for me personally, like it is definitely something that it feels like a lot to let go of. um, did you ever feel like that was a lot to let go over?

It was never an issue or in that moment, was that where it started to erode?

Landon: I think like in, because before I got into the realm of like styling, I was actually like a manager in like retail and I was doing like visual merchandising and things like that. And, um, I have seen myself where that I am more of that just like straight shooter and it hasn't the results haven't been good.

You know what I mean? And people don't receive it well, you know, it's, it's that old saying you attract more bees with honey, you know, so it's still going into this space and knowing that we have this common goal and what's the better way to achieve it. Yes. Still set the tone and the pace for the day.

But then at the same time, we are all there for that goal. And. I'm not gonna diminish anyone's like ideas or, um, anyone's oh, my drawing a bunch child shenanigans. What is going on in my life? My life. Oh my God. But, um, I just feel like it's, it's better received. It should just be able to help along the way and really just like coach people through the day, versus just, just saying this is the, the lay of the land.

Um, and I am Lord, listen to me roars. I think but, um, yeah, it's, it's literally, I've seen both sides of it and that was a learning for me. And from that I, once I came into this realm, I knew that's the same application I wanted to approach every

Michael: shoot with. So. There's the philosophy angle of it, of like, there's a, you're rigid and now you're not.

And listening might be like, I wanna make that same transition in how I work, but then there's the tactics of it. Like what do you actually do to make that happen? There's a way of thinking. And then there's a way of doing to be more open in this collaboration. Like you, you were mentioning guiding people during the process.

Like what are some techniques that you use to allow that to happen? Little tricks, little techniques, questions, anything it's like

Landon: little, okay. I like dangle little shoes, fashion shoes in front of people so they can come. Um, no, you know, I mean, I think it's just really being present and connecting with people.

You know what I mean? And gaining that sense of like trust off the bat, you know what I mean? When people trust you, they, you can lead them through the desert. You know what I mean? But, um, yeah, it's really that I, I think I. I kind of give people that auntie kind of feel too it might be the southernness, but, um, yeah, I just, I think it's just like having a warmth that's there because, you know, I think a lot of times when we think of fashion, we think of very cold and closed off, but I always remember, um, one of my good friends is she always said that she always wants to be the reflection of what she wants to see in the world.

And so that's the same thing that I want be on set or in my personal life as well. Like all of it, you know what I mean? So I know if I'm working on the set and how I would like to have some type of leadership address me and like lead me through the day. Like that's what I, that's what I am, you know, to people.

Hmm.

Michael: Well, it absolutely shows, I mean, working with you on merch, like, I can't say it enough, it was a great collaboration. I feel like I've learned so much about. How to be in the room. I mean, with anyone you work with, you learn something, right. There's always something to be learned, uh, whether it's positive or negative or reflection of the self, whatever it may be.

It's always, you're always learning through other selves. And, um, this was just such a great experience in one where I really thought, how am I in the room? How am I showing up? How can I improve, um, being a collaborator. Um, and I wanted to talk about the brand for people listening that, uh, have been following me for the past almost 30 episodes, I think, which is so exciting.

Um, and might be following me and, and have seen me talk about merch. I wanna talk a little bit with you and just kind of go back and forth in conversation about merch. Um, no, I think one of the first questions I would ask is what was it like, what is it like to work with me? I'm always on air talking about how to work well together, but, um, I'd love to hear the inside scoop.

Landon: like, I don't think we have enough time. No, I'm joking. no, no, no. It was, it was really, really great. Like, I think I was honestly shocked at the beginning because I was like, oh my God, he trust me like so much, you know, with his baby, like you literally like, let me babysit him. Like, you know what I mean, off the bat.

And I was like, wow, like that helped with the process for sure. Because I'm like, okay, we have that sense of trust there. So now it's like, we can get to the real message of it. And we're both in the same space, same goal. Like it felt really, really good. Um, and one thing that I really enjoyed, but it was hard for me to adjust to is that you were like, don't treat the clothing as fragile and you know, like in fashion, like we're very like, oh, be careful with this.

This is like, you know, I love that because it created this sense of like playfulness, this freedom. And I think everybody felt it. And I think you created that, you know, and through the brand, like you still get that sense of like playfulness too, um, with the graphics and the colors, you know? So I'm super in love with that.

Um, but like, I definitely have questions for you too.

Michael: Well, ask away.

Landon: OK. Because I mean, there is like the graphics a are like very unique. So what was like the inspiration behind them? Hmm.

Michael: I was talking to my therapist, shout out to Jeremy today. Uh, and , I told him about the, the release and how excited I was.

And we were talking a little bit about the line and. A word came up that I think kind of just captures all of this, which to me, um, is about noticing. And he asked me like, what does noticing mean to you? And noticing to me is different than seeing or, or looking right. I would often go on walks when, when I moved from LA and came back to New York, I would go on walks and, and immediately was just hit.

As soon as I got here, just hit with New York city. And I didn't really know what it meant other than the fact that it's a location. It's something that emotionally I feel like is home. But I was also hit visually with a lot as everyone is that comes to New York city. Um, and I was seeing a lot. Um, but what changed was, I'd go for these walks.

And I just start like consciously noticing anything that stood out to me that was attracting my brain for some reason. And over time I realized a lot of that stuff was. Things that most people wouldn't notice, which was cool. Cause it's like, oh, that feels like it's, it's just a me thing. But also if they did notice it or if I were to describe it, for example, a sticker on a wall, torn in half of a smiley face, they'd be like, that's gross.

Take that off the wall. And what I realized, like when I was just looking at it object, I'm like, well, one, it kind of says something, but it's like almost art where anyone could assume what it means. And when I started thinking about all these objects I was seeing, I was like, if I remove them from the context they're in, I remove them from New York city and I put them on an object, a shirt or a bag or something, or edit them, maybe, maybe not edit them.

Um, They take on a whole new life. And so what was once this thing I noticed that attracted me because it stood out among all of this, what I was calling it, grime layer of New York city, this grit and grime and just things that are everywhere. If I took it out of the context that was in, um, it gave a new appreciation, a new reverence for, um, these things that most people would overlook.

And so I think to me, when I break that down, psychologically, I think it gets at a lot of the underdog nature, um, which I've always been about. I've always been a part of subcultures that we're not like pop music. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm , it was never, it was always some sort of subculture and this underdog, you know, fight to win mentality.

And I think like, you know, for example, that sticker of a smiley face torn in half one of my favorite shirts I wore yesterday, um, Is the underdog. It's not the smiley face stick anymore. It's not the smiley face stick in color. It has no more color. It faded off a plane it's torn in half. And I don't even know if someone put it back intentionally or just to get it off their child's, you know, arm or something like, but how it has a fighting chance to be seen as something beautiful.

And I think that to me is like the real underlying nature of the graphics. And then obviously like each graphic has their own reason for being, but I think really at the court it's about that.

Landon: Yeah. I love that because that's, that's exactly what I do like within fashion and, and my art is that I find the beauty and what people may, you know, just pass by or feel like it's lost a shine, you know?

But, um, yeah, so that's why I really, I definitely enjoy that. About working with you for sure. And your organization. Oh my God. Cause you got me together.

Phenomenal. I'm just like, so no I'm organized. Visually is

I was like, this is like, oh my God, the timelines, the planning. I was just like, yes, like heavenly, it was heavenly heavenly. Well, I

Michael: like that you notice, uh, mention that because a lot of people can go either way. Another reason why I think I'm obsessed with you is that you took to that really well was like, oh, I wanted this.

Like I wanted yeah. Organization a way of managing this thing. Like I wanted to offset this to a process and not just keep it all in my head. And I'm very much like that. And listeners will know like the first few episodes. Or strictly about process. I love it. I think it's such an interesting thing because it is this underlying hidden process of the business.

It is like, like it's almost the underdog, right? It's the thing. No one notices. Yeah. Does so much of the work. And you know, with this it's like merch was, is a side project, one of a billion that I have, and I couldn't let it take up too much time, but I wanted to give it as much time and as much. Creative space is possible.

So for me, like knowing the dates, knowing what I was waiting on, what would happen next, knowing the phases you needed to go through when we wanted to check in, uh, really having all of those dates ahead of time discussed. I remember our first meeting of just being like, oh, do we wanna do three feedback loops?

Like, yeah, that sounds good. And you were like, oh, I only need a week. I'm like, how about two? You know, like, like let's like stretch this out. We have the time and giving us like that playground by owning the time that we had and saying like, we're gonna give ourselves a nice padded amount of time. So we have the time to meet up, you know, talk about it, sit on it, come back to it, you know, and not feel too much pressure.

Although I felt a lot of pressure the last few days, but you know, it's always gonna happen, but yeah, having the process, being support of like a creative environment, um, I'm curious, like how it is that kind of what you felt as well? Like the process served the Creativity.

Landon: It did help me, like map out, you know what I mean? Because I usually don't do like the, like, those were very detailed timelines. Like I think we need to like show down my screen. They were very detailed timelines, um, which I loved because it really helped me like map out the process of things.

But, um, I think, you know, I'm very much. A dreamer when it comes to like my Creativity. So it's like, I always tell, and I told you like, oh yeah, let's talk about this. And then I wanna dream on it. I wanna sleep on it. And so I don't put timelines on that. Mm-hmm um, but, uh, but yeah, I think it was, I think it was great with the check-ins.

I absolutely loved those. Like that was the, that was the key. Um, you know, and it just, I think it, you know, it kept us, it kept us in momentum and I think we felt that, you know, and it definitely set us up for, um, the success that we had on set. So kudos to organization

Michael: for people curious, we used, um, a tool called Smartsheets to manage timelines, uh, and notion to manage all the products, prices, models, locations, sort of all the other information.

Um, You mentioned momentum. And I think when you think about process and I don't wanna talk too much about process, but when you think about that, when we have spoken about it in earlier episodes, momentum being this key part of the process, I think a lot of times when we want to create something, especially a side project like this or something that isn't your primary job, um, momentum is often the thing that gets lost.

And I think while setting too tight of timelines kind of makes you maybe unsatisfied or stressed setting, no time makes you kind of lose momentum or not really like get any pace. Um, and I felt like this was, it felt really well paced to me, uh, of, of projects I've worked on. How would you say I'm, I'm very curious, honest answers only, you know, did you think it was well paced or what would you

Landon: say?

No, absolutely. Oh, absolutely. I don't think it was, um, I think it was the right amount of time. Like. and the planning of it all, like, I feel like it was just a great flow, you know what I mean? It was great. And it led up to the shoot and, um, but yeah, I think, you know, if you have a project and there is like this huge window, like say you start planning February for July, which I mean, sometimes people do and I can see how easily your focus or that momentum can like just soften throughout.

Yeah. Um, but I think we had that great. We had like a month, you know what I mean? I feel like that was like a perfect amount of time. You know what I mean? And breaking it down and having those check-ins. We're great to keep that. Cause it's, it's at the same time, you're keeping that connection. You know what I mean, amongst each other, you know, and talking about new ideas and sharing new thoughts, you know, and I feel like that's so important and it just makes you even hungrier to like execute this project.

Michael: Yeah. That's a, that's a really great point. That connection gets lost too. Especially if you're working with collaborators, you extend yeah. Too much. It's like everyone kind of gets bored with it or sidetracked or on something else. So yeah. I, I always talk about, you mentioned this, this period to daydream and not wanting to put time on it.

Um, but at the same time, I always mention this. I say, the reason you have process is to optimize for that time. So it's like, let's figure out all the little blocks so that we have as much time to daydream as possible as much free space to do. Yeah. Um, and yeah, I mean, that's been. I'm so glad you mentioned it, but now I'm gonna geek out too hard about process.

So for the sake of everyone listening, we'll keep it moving. But, um, I'm curious. Do you have any other questions about the line or any other thoughts about it?

Landon: I mean, I know you said it's, it comes from a place of like noticing, but I know you also mentioned it was, it was very important that you did this for like your 11 year old self mm-hmm so like, take us on that journey.

Cause I would definitely know about that. Like to know about that. Yeah.

Michael: Okay. So I kind of wanna pull up the Instagram post, uh, to read it because I think that that covers a big part of it. Um, yeah. So the quote from Virgil ALO was everything I do is for the 17 year old version of myself. And, um, I often thought about that.

Quote, when I was building the line. And so my, um, my Instagram post where I kind of go into that. So at 17, I played music in bands, played shows in basements and dirty venues, embraced the subculture of punk rock music and felt at home. And I'll just say that was a big piece of my life, that subculture playing music.

I mean, the energy of music, crowds, bands, other bands, bands, merchandise like that. I can't even explain how influential that's been on my life. And in fact, I would say, I didn't even realize it until I really sat down with it the same way. Any sort of therapeutic or journaling practice goes like you don't know until you sit down and think about it.

And you know, so when I was reflecting on that quote, that was one thing that came up. Another thing that came up. I said at 17, I rode BMX bikes around my town with my best friends. Some of them were skateboarders. We broke bones towards skin and had the best time doing it. It felt like family. Um, and I just posted a photo of a BMX biker wearing, um, the spiral shirt.

And, you know, I very much, when we were at the skate park shooting, I needed that in the shoot, um, bicycling. As a young person for me was not only my mode of transportation, but it was like freedom to me. Right. It was like, yeah, I could go anywhere. Do anything. I felt that freedom. I had my, my, my chosen family as they call it, you know, they were, some of them were in bands with me.

I tagged a few of them on the story. Um, shout out Koji and Matt and Adam. Um, and you know, the list goes on and on honestly, but we were together. We were banded together, listening to punk, rock music, listening to hip hop and, um, riding bikes around and making ramps and falling down and just like tearing every part of our body open.

And it was just like, it was, it was madness, but also there were BMX brands, like where you would just see, like someone would show up with a fit and it wasn't like a dope looking fit, but it was like a t-shirt with the logo of the company or like a silly graphic they had had. Yeah. And like culture and BMX.

Culture, like from a brand point of view was so different, but I remember just like you knew when like someone came in with like a fresh, like, um, uh, Fox, uh, cycling shirt or like whatever, like the icons and logos were iconic. Um, but then the shirts, like they were always some, something cool about them.

And, um, yeah, so BMX was a big part of it. And then I said at 17, I traveled to New York city with my friends. I saw the raw Warren gritty streets of New York city. I experienced a new form of beauty, and I touched on that earlier that sort of grit and grime that people don't. See, um, and even tourists when they visit, they only see the buildings and like the, the, the beauty, but when you're living there, you see all of it.

Um, and then at 17, I listened to punk pop punk, rap music, the energy and storytelling fully captured my attention. I listened on the bus at school at recess at home. My headphones hardly came off and that is big facts. I mean like music, not only playing music, but then listening to music, I can recall so many times, like in the dark lights off headphones on just playing records, start to finish.

I remember hearing Tupac, not for the first time. I don't remember my first time hearing Tupac, but I do remember a very significant time hearing his music. Um, the sound dear mama. I remember hearing when my mom was very sick with cancer and hearing like a tribute, um, A dope song, great beat, great performance, and just a beautiful like narrative as well.

And realizing like that the poetry I was writing for the emo bands I was in, or the pop punk bands I was in and hip hop music, they're all like, they were connected in this emotional Lee rich storytelling place. Um, and so storytelling and the identity and energy that came from that was really important.

Um, and you can kind of see that in some of the colors and also just like the overall aesthetic, the, um, oversized nature of some things, the tightened nature of some things like it's playing with the forums that are associated with those genres. Um, and then, uh, at 17, I was a few years into learning graphic design.

I designed album covers posters, pins, and t-shirts for local bands in my area. This is my life. I mean, I've made a career of design and so. All the shirts are graphics because all I've known is graphics for so long. And so, you know, thinking about 17 year old, me using a computer for the first time, and then, um, you know, having the ability now to like create wild graphics, I had to take the opportunity.

Um, and then I go on to talk about why the name merch is what it is. Um, and you know, it's, again, that underdog nature, because bands always call things merch no matter. Yeah. And I love dualities and I love the fact that like, no matter how thoughtful, beautiful or cool, I thought my work was, it was always just merch.

Like it was always like normalized to a specific thing. And so kind of embracing all of this, really taking, uh, to heart what Virgil said, embracing those elements of my youth. And that word just was like obvious to me that that was the word. Like there was no other word I could use and. Yeah, I, um, you know, so from like an inspiration point of view and the 17 year old me, I think those cover it.

And then also just that freedom that I had at that age, being in bands and biking and everything, I was like, that needs to be in the process of making it so like us going to LS and just walking around and like, Exploring like that kind of fun freedom. We don't do this every day type thing is something that I wanted as well.

Yeah. That was

Landon: so much fun. I was just thinking about that because like even scouting location was just like such a fun day. Like the pizza shop to the Chinese restaurant to just like noticing the graffiti and even like that little alley that you would probably never walk down, but it was like so much beauty within this alley way.

I. So it was, yeah, it was an amazing day. It was like a whole new world that I did not know exist in New

Michael: York. Oh yeah. We said that so many times. We're like, where are we? Like I told somewhere brand new

Landon: and we found my wife at the Chinese.

Michael: I wish that place was open. What a great spot

Landon: was such a great spot. I have to revisit. I have to revisit for sure.

Michael: So, um, I'll ask you again, if there's any more questions. I, I do wanna say big, big shoutout, not only to you, but to Elmer and to the entire team that modeled, um, yeah, they killed it. They were so, so good.

I mean, like, I can't play favorites. I don't want to, I think everyone really brought their a game and like looking at these photos was just like, wow, y'all did it. Like y'all did it. So yeah.

Landon: But, I mean, everybody came to play, honestly, everybody who was there wanted to really be there and you felt that on set, you know what I mean?

And everyone was like, I mean, even, you know, people were jumping into roles that weren't, um, initially assigned to them or expected of them at that, but it was that collaboration spirit. It was that spirit that we are working together, you know? Um, and it was, it was a beautiful thing to see. I think the energy throughout that both days of shooting just felt really great.

Um, it felt really playful and, um, just a great spirit to be around honestly. And that's just always so important to me, you know? Hmm.

Michael: Well, thank you for entertaining. Um, my concept of talking about merch, I don't wanna spend too much time, um, talking about. The line, uh, for those of you interested, definitely check it out.

Uh, merch.com. It's M E R C hh.com. And, um, I set up a coupon code actually. Yeah. Creativity enter that. Um, but I wanna keep going, I wanna talk about you some more let's dive.

Landon: Well, you might have to say that again because I literally was just like, yeah. And I think I cut off the coupon. So if you didn't

Michael: hear it, the code is Exploring Creativity, all one word, the name of the podcast, enter that.

Um, so special. Thank you for listeners who are listening this many episodes in, um, and listening this deep into the episode. Thank you. Um, okay. I wanna talk about fashion as it relates. Cuz I was talking about my 17 year old self and identity came up a lot. Um, I wanna talk about fashion and identity as it relates to you, what it means to like discover your true self.

I wanna hear you riff on it really? Um, let's start there.

Landon: You know, um, even RuPaul's says that, like when you transform into drag, you really become the person that you are. And then you're meant to be. And I feel like that is the same with fashion and the way you dress yourself every day. Um, and it changes because you change as a person and you grow and, you know, and a lot of times when I work with my clients, I really dive into the fact that who are you and where do you want to go?

And where do you wanna see yourself? Because that's important. And that T. Through what you're putting on your back and what you're wearing, you know, I have gotten to this point, um, and I tell everyone it's like, yeah, being in fashion, but at the same time, like, I don't care about the label that's on your back.

I care about the story that it's telling of who you are, because that's the first thing that we get to experience about anyone. You know? I mean, we, we see them across the room and that's what you're drawn to. And now you wanna know more about this person because like, why are you wearing this, um, merch t-shirt with an alien on it?

You know what I mean? Like, I don't wanna know the story behind it. So it's like, I think those things are very important and it just, it really needs to be authentic to you. Not trends, not the feds, but it's like, what's really important to you and what feels good. And what makes you feel good and empowered and strong.

And able to conquer the world that you're faced with. You know, I find those things to be the most important. Now. I wish I would've learned that when I was younger, when I was all on the train of everything and wasting money on craft. But at the same time, I was big on storytelling as a kid, like in my head, I used to have like dress up days for school where I would be like, oh, I'm feeling a little nerdy.

Like I wanna put on this whole little nerdy bit. And then I was like, girl, you really serving costumes at this point. Like, let's get down to the basics of you. Um, but I've always had this. Very fluid and genderless style about myself, even as a kid, even when going back to hiphop and everybody's wearing the ized tees and jerseys, like for me, it was a cute little dress.

Like I was like, yes, this Jersey dress. Like I wanted, you know, I mean, but it was still expressing really who I was even before I could tell people, especially being queer, even before I could tell people who I really was, it was expressing it for me, you know? And that's why I think it's just so important with fashionist to really, to be in a reflection of you, you know, and what you wanna say to the world, not just what's the trend, cause it's gonna let you down every time.

Michael: I continue to learn. I, I love that explanation of fashion. And I think, you know, I was talking earlier about BMX versus skateboarders, um, outfits. Yeah. They were different even though we would ride together or like most of the time, or had like friends that overlapped or were skateboarding together or not, the fashion was just subtly different, but enough to know that they were of different identities that were about slightly different things.

And you know, that was a big thing for me is realizing like how much, how expressive a t-shirt could be. And the line being an exploration of that, but I think you just captured it perfectly. It really does. It says so much it's communication at the end of the day. Mm. Um, just today I was skateboarding and I had, uh, the NYC sales tax shirt on, it's a kind of a more boxy fit.

And I, I personally like those more, um, I'm probably gonna prioritize them a little more next season, but, um, someone came up to me and they were like, oh, I just saw your shirt across the street. And I needed to come over to tell you that that's hilarious. And I was like, I was like, yeah, man, in these, uh, hectic times, like the NYC sales, I was like, I was trying to figure out the most like divisive thing to put on a shirt.

And, uh, this seems like the most, you know, like, but like. There's humor to it. There's like, uh, playfulness to it that I always carry with me. Um, but also like, it's, there's a little bit of politic in it. You know, there's a little bit of like where we're at culturally and historically. Um, and I think I'm done talking about merch at this.

I promise everyone, but no, I, I do think you're right. I think it says so much about us. Um, and I'm very interested, like seeing who chooses, what, like what you know, like,

Landon: right. Chad, you know, my favorite is out of the off. I just keep trying to run out. That's

Michael: a big one. People seems to really like it. And I think it's just so much about the times.

Yeah.

Landon: It's very, that it's very that. So love, love, love, love

Michael: now discovering your true self. It was a topic you selected on the, the initial form. do you feel like fashion played a big role in that discovery? Were there other things, um, in terms of your true self you're creative, the most creatively expressing expressed self, what would you say kind of led to, uh, where you're at now?

Landon: Honestly, it is, it was really about being present to experience the world around me and like all of my experiences that I've collected over the years, like those are still with me. And I think that has really like fine tuned my creative eye. And that's what sets me apart from like other stylists or fashion creatives.

Um, and that's the one thing that I feel like people need to find very important to where the point where you stop the comparison game, because no one is ever gonna view. The old lady on the train with the panty hold that are like rolled down in her new balances, the same way that I'm gonna be. Because I find beauty in that I'm like, yes, like, she's look.

And then the next day you see me with a floral dress and somes and down, you know, I think just really, um, just really enjoying the things that you've collected along the year. Cause that's, what's gonna like set you apart, creatively and even within, and it's the same with building a closet. Honestly, like if you were building your closet over the years, then you have these amazing pieces that, um, relate to a time or a moment in your life.

And yet you still have that and you still continue to build, you know, and, um, some may leave you and some may stay with you, but, uh, at the end of the day, it's still very reflective as to like who you are.

Michael: Hmm. Yeah. You know, we're in such a, a culture now of everything is so instantaneous. It's there, then it's gone.

Yeah. I love the concept of like building and curating the closet space as well. Um, what is that process like for you? What do you recommend for people who are like, I know nothing about fashion

Landon: well, and that's the thing, you know, I think when you tend to feel like, you know, nothing about fashion, you tend to collect these things that are just very like trendy pieces.

And then you'll find over time that you don't even go back to them. Like you don't touch them. They just sit there. They're collecting dust. They mean nothing to you. Um, but I feel like everyone, and I want everyone to feel it, but everyone has a sense of style and a sense of fashion. And it is your own, you know, it is absolutely your own.

No one needs to really understand it. You know, no one even needs to enjoy it. It really goes back to the feeling that, and that's the thing that a lot of people miss is that fashion is very emotional. When you go to your closet, you're selecting things based on how you feel at that moment or how you're preparing for that day.

It still relates to what you're feeling internally, you know? And so I don't want people to think that, you know, I have this like bad sense of style and I need, um, a stylist now. Sometimes it gets a little crazy, but that's, I feel like that's when you're not being authentic to yourself and that's why it doesn't feel right.

It's not connecting with you, the person, you know what I mean? So that's why it feels forced and it feels strain and you feel uncomfortable in it. It's itching. You it's all of the signs that this is not for you. You know what I mean? It is not organically for you. And it's something that you just picked up on the whim.

We can say that about people, you know, ,

Michael: I'm not trying to get into your past relationships, but I can say that

Landon: about collaborating.

Michael: I'm thinking of my clients right now and just like this there's always this, um, I don't wanna post, I don't like social media. I don't wanna post on social media or I don't wanna do this.

And it, and the idea of authenticity always comes up. Like this doesn't feel authentic. Um, and I think with fashion, like, it almost feels like a different space where it's like, there's good fashion and bad and that's it. Um, and I love what you were saying that fashion is more so is it authentic to me?

Does it mean something to me? Does it express me? It's a communication tool. And so is it good communication or is it, um, decodable communication for other people? Or do I want it to be, you know, does it say about. The hobbies I'm into, or does it talk about the bands I'm into, or does it talk about the subcultures I'm into or whatever?

Um, or the designers that I admire, you know, rather than like, do people think it's cool, I'm gonna do that. And I think this happens across industries, um, and I know a lot of audio engineers, a lot of musicians that are looking for, like, what does it mean to be write a great song? Or what does it mean to be a great engineer and a lot, it always comes back to like, do your thing.

Landon: Yeah. Yeah. All of it. I mean, I think a lot of work, um, yeah, to the point, like even from musicians to artists, whatever, if it's authentic to that person, we've enjoyed it more, you know? Yeah. And you can tell, like, even like, if you have a favorite artist and they do. One album that's totally on the other spectrum of things.

And you're like, mm, like what were we thinking? And then they go back to their roots and you're like, this is it like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's the same, that's the same in fashion. That's the same in dressing yourself. That's the same in building and cultivating a closet. All of

Michael: it. I love that. Um, I'm curious.

One thing we had spoken about when we were on the way back for the best car ride of, of, uh, the spring, I'll say best car ride of the spring, 2020 was with you. And we were blasting the merch playlist and, uh, we were just getting down in the cars, having the time of our lives. And, um, then later I was like, I feel like you're always in such a good mood.

Maybe this was a different day. I can remember. I think it might have been, but anyway, I was like, you're always in such a good mood. Like, is there ever a low point? And I'm curious about your career as a creative, like, was there, what were the more challenging parts of you, of your career as a creative individual and like, how have you overcome them?

What was the kind of process of, of overcoming them?

Landon: Yeah, I mean, there's, there's definitely been, um, challenging moments, but you know, I, I literally had this one day that I woke up and I was just like, Ugh, nothing is going right. Like, I just felt like, I'm like, and you get that whole, what am I doing? Is this the right path?

Like everybody themselves, this it's, you know, it's uphill battle. Um, but then I made a conscious decision to, to vibrate higher. Like, I'm like, this is not, this is not my vibration. I need to elevate myself. I need to vibrate high. And one of the things that I do, um, because I used to be a dancer, so I feel the most powerful and like, it's my meditation and it's my thanks.

It's my praise. It's like dancing just really, and really connecting and feeling grounded is very important to me. And I do that through dance and I chose that day to like, okay, clear some stuff out. I'm just gonna go for like, I'm gonna have this moment. And after this, I'm gonna vibrate higher. And literally when I finished that and I felt so good and refreshed and recharged, like literally great emails start coming through requests and things start happening.

And from that moment, I was like, this. This is where you need to be, and this is where you need to keep your vibration and the world will unfold for you. And I tell my friends that all the time, because I literally witnessed it within the day of how things could be shifted by having the right energy. Um, I definitely have my low times everybody does, and those are the times that I go outside, get grounded.

I'm very earthy. Like I love to put my toes in the dirt and the grass, like, and just sit and collect sun, um, and take those moments to myself. But no, that's why I continuously try to vibrate higher because I just know if I'm at that level, I can just literally unfold the world.

Michael: I, you know, I had heard that advice for so many years.

And a lot of times I'm like, that's just bullshit. I don't believe it , which is so funny because it's like the opposite end of what you're saying. Right. It's like, I'm just gonna be negative about this advice. Like I'm gonna say that's bullshit. It's not true at all. Um, you know, people are just saying that it sounds good on the internet, whatever.

And I have really turned a corner on this because it is very weird how it happens and it always seems to happen. And I don't know, even if we wanna take like the mysticism out of it completely. Yeah. Just the fact that you're showing up in a more positive light. Like people want to work with people like that.

Yeah. People be around people like that in your emails are gonna sound better when you're in that head space. So even if it's like, if someone's like where I was, where it was like, that's bullshit. Think about it just practically, like if you showed up better and smiling and excited and you went to a cafe and you were in a good Moon, you asked them how they were doing, you might get your next job right there.

You know? So it's like, and I do believe there is some mysticism to it as well. I think. Absolutely. And you know, that's a whole conversation for another time, but just like the energy we're giving out is absolutely the energy that attracts and that is created too. Like you could just feel when someone's in a bad mood, without them saying anything and the same way works with a good mood.

So I really didn't want to believe that that was true for so long or I resisted believing that that was true. And, um, I just wanna say that I've personally turned a corner on it and I completely agree, and I think it's very hard to do in times where it's hard when, when you're going through a lot. Um, And I think I was reading this study pretty recently about Creativity and hope being one of the most important factors that contribute to creative work.

Um, having that hope that like, yes, the vibe is low, but it will be high again. Or I can make it higher. Like that is such an important part to do anything generative and creative and positive. So, um, for those of you that might be in that place of like the low vibe place, and you're not really feeling that great, and you're unmotivated and stressed and like one, try something to shake it up.

Two have hope that it will get better. Cause usually does. Yeah, absolutely.

Landon: Absolutely. And find out what, find out what recharges you, you know, and meditation for everyone is very different. It doesn't necessarily mean that you need to sit still and be quiet in the dark room or anything like that. You know what I mean?

You have to find out what recharges you and really ignites that passion again. So it's very important.

Michael: Yeah. Um, you say dancing, that's your, that's your mode? Yes, it is. I could see that. I love it. I, you were dancing a little bit on the, uh, during the photo shoot and then definitely at the launch party. Um,

Landon: I like, I can tell you, I believe in TW breaks.

Okay. TW breaks for everybody.

Michael: I believe in it's nothing. If nothing else from this interview, that's the quote that, the word, right,

Landon: right. I mean, and it just like loosens up the Moon. Like if people just start dancing on set it's it just provides such a great energy it's then recharging people, people are awake and feel alive. So yeah, I'm here for all of

Michael: it.

I love dance because in our culture. In this boring American homogenized culture dance is like, not at the forefront of it. You go back in history to any culture origins, any culture's origins. There is dance as some component of that. Yeah. It's such a human, such a communal it's like the most intimate, one of the most intimate obviously forms of like communal engagement.

Um, and it's just so fun. We, we were dancing a little bit on during the shoot. I remember like the moment we started playing music and turning it up, it like changed the vibe of the whole shoot.

Landon: Um, the

Michael: vibes, the vibes, yes. Vibes were flowing um, any other creative challenges, any other, you know, cuz we, we have listeners that are like just starting their creative journey, people that have been wanted for a while.

And um, I always like using this platform as a means of like hoping people see, okay. Oh, look what Lord went through and now, yeah. Now, you know, yeah. You

Landon: know, um, I mean, going into school for dance, I felt like I had to be a dancer. You know what I mean? At first I wasn't open to the journey of where my Creativity could go and, you know, I think that's so important for everyone is to not feel like you have to be in this box, but really just be open to where the, the world may take.

You, you know what I mean? Because you know, starting out in dance and then we had dances theater, so we did like a little costing, but then I went into, um, more editorial work, um, merchandising, and then I went more into, um, more into the realm of like creative direction, you know, over the past year. And then back to costume designing.

But what has remained consistent for me is that I remained a storyteller at the end of the day. Um, that's where I find so much joy into, in what I do, you know what I mean? And I feel like that's how I really relate to, or be able to pass that message on to like viewers or anyone that gets to experience my work, because it's really, um, from an experience in life, whether it be the client's experience or my own, but yet it's something very organic and something that you can relate and you can still feel.

Um, and that's why, you know, I more so label myself as this fashion architect and or artist and, you know, fashion is my medium, honestly, but storytelling is, what's so important. And I think as a creative. you have to figure out what your purpose is. And once you figure that out, I feel like a lot of it unlocks for you because then your work is really gonna show up organic and your voice, your voice, they're gonna be able to, um, discern your voice from anyone else's, you know, and that's why a lot of times I was actually just meeting with someone who wants to get into styling.

Um, and he was like, oh my God, I'm so like, appreciative that you like taken this time. And like, you know, gave me some insight to it and things like that. You know, a lot of other artists aren't interested in doing that. Um, and I said, you know what? Because at that point you're one thinking someone is here to steal your spot, but you have to realize this is that.

Your spot is yours. What is meant for you will be for you. And that's one of the pleasures that I've received, you know, working with you and all of my other clients this past year, I really have received confirmation that people appreciate my voice and my vision as well, you know, and my point of view.

And so it's like, no matter what I could give you all the context that I have, but at the end of the day, what you do and what I do is gonna be totally different because the way you see the world is not the way I see it. And I can't mimic that from anyone. It's not going be organic and it's, it's gonna be a whole mess on both ends.

But, um, but yeah, and I think that's the, you know, the takeaway is definitely be open to the journey and to really like cultivate your voice. And use all those experiences that you've had because that's, what's so important and so beautiful about the work that you do if it's just like

Michael: organically you.

Hmm, absolutely. I wrote a post on Instagram the other day. I feel like I used Instagram as like a blog to document on Creativity. And so the captions usually have them. And one of the things I was saying was how the artist is really tasked as the, the sea or the ability to decide when something is or isn't done.

And that's such a power that only like, if, you know, if you and I were like, like, you know, hit a button to start something and hit a button to stop, we might hit it at different times. If like, if we hit a button, images were flashing and we both stopped it on the ones that stood out to us first, they would be different.

But if I was looking over and saw every button, every time you hit that button, eventually I would just start hitting it similarly. And like, when you really focus on like, what is your intuition say? It's so empowering. It's scary at first. You're like, oh, what are people gonna think? And then it's incredibly empowering.

It goes from like one end to the other so quickly. No, but you know, it's very easy to say, um, to do that. And it's hard in practice, um, because we both had to do it, um, to like say I'm just gonna embrace my own lane. It almost feels it's surrendering more than like doing mm-hmm still, it, it there's a fear with that.

Surrendering. I find that, oh,

Uh, there's a few more questions where this is doing another long one, but you know, people should know. I love talking to you, so, okay. Cause

Landon: my PR team said 7 45.

Michael: on the shoulder right now. So, um, you have, uh, two titles hybrid, creative and fashion architect. I love all of these words. Um, why did you choose those?

Landon: Well, because I definitely wanted to discard the idea of just being a fashion stylist. Um, because I have a creative coach and over time, um, with her working on sets with me too, was like, you're, you're doing more than just being this fashion stylist. Like why are we just putting this blanket over you? And just like continuing with.

I'm a fashion stylist. Like it's so much more. And when it comes to, um, definitely being a fashion architect, um, I am cultivating something. I feel like there's always a foundation, you know, there's always, um, that is brought to me or a store that's created and then we build on it. It grows it flourishes.

Um, and so I am a builder in that sense, you know, and even when working with someone personally, We're still building this amazing closet. We aren't just inserting things, um, with no direction, you know? So there is a process you beloved that , there's a process to this all, you know? And, um, so yeah, and I feel like when you are an architect, I mean, you're building something for the longevity of it and it's not something that's just leading, you know?

Um, and there's so much beauty in there. So

Michael: I love, that's why I love the advice of, of giving yourself a new title that hasn't been created that describes you in a unique form. And, you know, fashion has so much meaning and coded architect has much coded, um, one of the big missions with the show. Started with a manifesto that I wrote before we even went into this second wave of interviews where it was like, what is the real purpose of this?

And I thought a lot about what does it mean to be a creative of the future? What needs to be done? Uh, what skills need to be had, what is hurting them right now? Um, and one of those is education. That's why I'm teaching another one is cross-discipline knowledge, mentorship information. Um, and you have hybrid creative, uh, as a title.

So I was excited to talk about that a little bit. This cross-functionality of creative people. Um, why do you think it's necessary? How has it helped you do what you do?

Landon: I think it is it's helped me even just open up to the possibilities of what I do. Um, honestly, I think like there's no, there's no rules to it.

You know, there is just, there's just this openness of like the possibilities. I feel like, um, because I think with being titled as anything or being titled as a fashion stylist, you just think along those lines and you will keep yourself there. You know what I mean? I was just watching, um, like the Kanye documentary actually, and people kept labeling him as the producer, but there was so much more to him, you know what I mean?

And that's where you're really that creative hybrid, you know, you're able to do this, but you can also do this, you know? So there's so many levels and so many like planes to you and to your Creativity that people need to experience. But I feel like if you just give yourself this title as fashion stylist, um, then that's where they will keep you, you know, and that will be the only thing that they remember you for.

Michael: Hmm. I love that. And what about on like a very, um, day to day grassroots, practical level? Like how does it help you with your work having skills across disciplines?

Landon: Um, well, it definitely helps with the limits. There's no limits . Um, but on a day to day, I feel like it just gives me again, it just lets me know what's really possible.

It's like, it's crazy because I was, if you asked me like two years ago, if I was gonna be doing costume design, I probably would've like what? Like not, but I had this moment where I was creating a piece for Saint and I was like hand sewing. Um, So crystals onto the soup. And I, I just stepped back and I had this moment where like, tears just started to flow because I was like, wow.

Like, I didn't even know that that was in me to create this, you know, and to be able to enjoy the beauty that you create from a day to day and see these things come to life. Like that gives me so much pleasure and so much joy. And that just lets me know and gives me that confirmation that I'm on the right path because that just like, it fuels my soul.

I feel great about it. And I don't feel like I'm working. Yeah. There's the stresses, like I told you, somebody stole a package, but , but, um, yeah, you have your stress, you know, you have those days where you feel, you question yourself, but go back to those moments where. You were really a really touched by it.

And then you could experience other people being touched by your work and how it warms them up and, uh, how they feel, um, based on what you created. Like, those are the moments that we forget during the hustle of things, because we are moving so fast and we're next project and next project. But lately I have been like, I get these moments on like sets where I'm like, sad.

Like, oh, this is this end. Even like, I was like on, I was like, this is the last time with this crew, you know,

Michael: I was so sad. Yeah. So. Yeah, I, I think that's great. I, I, you know, I said, you know, on a practical level, how does it help? And, and you made a good point, just like openness helps in an infinite number of ways and realizing that you're capable of so much more than the label is enough to unlock some of that openness and openness and Creativity are the same way, hope plays into Creativity, so important.

Um, and it really opens you up to feeling more limitless and more capable and able to do, uh, your best work. Yeah. I wanna ask one more question, cuz uh, your agent is, is calling me up saying she said,

Landon: baby,

Michael: the final question. Imagine you're writing a book about Creativity for your younger self. What are the main points that you want to include?

Landon: I would look at myself and say look, bitch, like be fearless because all of your thoughts, all of your dreams are on the right path. Like it is everything you want and need and will enjoy, but be open and released and be fearless about it because, um, that's self doubt. You know, I think that's what, uh, stipend a lot and put, I feel like it definitely put a strain on my creative process and that, you know, those things hindered me a lot in the beginning.

Um, and that whole imposter syndrome and all of that, but, you know, it's like, those are the things like definitely being open and being fearless and trusting your own voice. Hmm. And the importance and the power of it. Like those are the things I would definitely tell myself. And, um, because yes, I mean, if I would've knew this, when I was Kiki in, uh, at seven years old in who knows what the world would've been, I would've been, I would've been ye

Michael: what do you think a young, you might respond to that? Like, where might they go wrong taking that advice and how would you, what would you explain to them to help them stay on that?

Landon: Well, how would he go

Michael: wrong if they're like, all right, embrace my voice. Like, got it. I'm gonna do that.

Landon: I don't think, I don't think, I don't think I would've went wrong, honestly, because you know, for a long time of my life and it wasn't until like, maybe.

Five years ago, but I consider myself as this like introvert and I was like, yeah, I'm such an introvert. I'm such an introvert. And my friend and I'm like, I'm so shy. I'm so sorry. And um, my friend was like, where, like, how is that? How is that? Like, you're not like I don't even understand where you getting this from.

Um, but I know that I smothered my voice as a young queer child because of being in fear of being outed. Um, but if I would've had that fearlessness and had that openness at the beginning of things, I feel like that voice would've been even stronger now, you know, and I don't think that my younger self could have gone wrong by doing those things.

Um, because at the end of the day, it wouldn't. It would've just made me a louder little kid, but , but, um, I don't think that would've stood him wrong because I think that definitely would have led him on the path that, that he should be on you. The way that it was done at that point was the wrong route.

That was the detours, you know, that it took longer to get to my destination when I should've Google mapped the shit and just went straight to it, you know? um, but yeah, so I don't, I don't think that would've been any

Michael: backlash for that. Well, I'm glad I challenged you on it because I loved the second half of that answer as well.

I'm glad you are where you are now. I'm glad that we have met. I'm so grateful for it. Grateful to have worked with you on this. Um, grateful for everything you said today. and, uh, I look forward to season two of merch. I look forward to seeing season two of your life. um, yeah. Yeah. I just thank you again for, for being on the show today.

Landon: Yeah. Well, thank you for having me. I'm so excited. We got to do this. We have been talking about it and now it's here, so I'm so

Michael: excited. Thank you for listening to the episode. If you're interested in learning more about merch, you can visit merch.com. That's M E C HH. So three HS.

M E C hh.com and use the coupon code, Exploring Creativity. One word to get 5% off if you've been listening since our first episode. Thank you. If you're new here. Welcome. It's nice to meet you. Um, thanks for listening to us. Speak for so long. Uh, I hope you learned something today that will enhance your creative process.

If you haven't done so already, please subscribe to the podcast we're on all the podcast platforms. If you do subscribe, leave us a review, preferably five stars. Uh, again, this is Exploring Creativity. Thank you for listening and I'll see you next week.