From Commodity to Security: Building Our First National Food Security Strategy

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It has slipped under The radar for years, but food security is in a perilous state.
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An Australian Bureau of Statistics survey found 1.3 million people, more than 13% of households, are struggling to afford enough healthy food.
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And in keeping with similar patterns in related areas of water security, chronic illness and biodiversity loss, The trajectory is worsening and already costing billions in each area.
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As a result, governments have been responding with food security strategies around The world.
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And governments in Australia are now doing The same.
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Dr.
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Nick Rose, co-founder and executive director of Sustain, The Australian Food Network, based in Naam, Melbourne, has been one of The key forces in this area for decades.
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And in The last year or so, Sustain has been convening community forums nationally to feed into The country's first national food security strategy called Feeding Australia.
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We met up in Perth Boorloo last week between a host of events and meetings with state MPs, First Nations, Industry and Community Groups in The lead up to The West Australian Food Policy Forum.
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That'll take place on November 30, and you're all invited.
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Generous paid subscribers to this podcast, stand by for your discount code.
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Joining Nick and I to talk about all this are a couple of women very familiar to longer-term listeners, Noongar and Tinma Warianka Woman, and new CEO of Wagyl Kaip Southern Noongar Aboriginal Corporation, Heidi Mippy, and Natural Intelligence Farmer and 2025 West Australian of The Year, Di Haggerty.
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This one's loaded with inspiring updates and some of Nick's amazing personal story.
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As a moment presents for much needed systemic change.
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From Wadjuk Noongar Country here on The coast of Boorloo, Perth, Western Australia, g'day and welcome to The RegenNarration.
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AJ here with more of The stories that are changing The story towards The RegenNarration of life on this tasty planet.
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Independent, ad-free, and freely available thanks to listeners like you.
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I'll share a few shout-outs and some listener mail at the end of today's episode.
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For now, let's gather around The table at my place.
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Di, Heidi, Nick.
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Welcome.
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Great to be here, AJ.
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Absolutely fabulous, AJ?
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Nick, we'll start with you.
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Is this also a welcome home of sorts?
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Because you brought up around this.
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I'm a Perth boy.
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Yeah.
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Born and bred in Claremont and spent a lot of my youth uh down The road at Cotteslow Beach, where my dad was a surf lifesaver, so it does feel like coming home.
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Definitely.
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Wow.
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To what age then were you here?
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To The ripe old age of 13 years, left in 1981.
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Oh, so you missed The America's Cup.
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I did.
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Sad.
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Were you sad?
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Not really,
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not really.
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We've got The scars still to bear from that era.
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But anyway.
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And why did you leave?
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Left because my dad lost his job.
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He was working for an insurance company, made redundant in The recession of The early 80s, offered a transfer up to Darwin.
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My mum was a nurse so she could work wherever.
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And just me and my younger brother at home at that stage.
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And yeah, family moved up to Darwin.
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So I finished high school in Darwin.
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Did you?
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What'd you think of that?
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That was a really great experience.
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I think, you know, I being challenged moving interstate at that age tested me, definitely.
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But particularly as I, in The middle of all that, managed to break my neck in outback South Australia on a road trip.
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So yeah, ended up in Darwin with a horse or something.
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Back of a car that rolled over.
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Oh no, dreaded roll.
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Not wearing a seatbelt, ended up outside The car.
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But guardian angels were watching over me that day.
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And yeah, I'm still here walking around to tell The tale, but very lucky.
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How old were you?
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13.
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You were 13, then that was.
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I mean, I take moments like do you regard a moment like that as significant?
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Did it did it change anything for you?
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Because I'm curious about what lead led you from there to to here, to The work you're doing.
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Well when yeah, when something like that happens, you realise that your life could have ended at that moment, I guess, or it could have been dramatically and radically different.
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Like I could have been quadriplegic, paraplegic, not walking around at all.
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So I do remember that day very, very clearly.
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Like there are certain moments from your childhood that are very vivid.
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And that one I remember being in The back of that car and actually waking up, and my sister was driving and seeing The car swerving on The gravel road, and then a voice just my mum was saying to my sister, don't put your foot on The brake.
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And then a voice just kind of said to me, Just go back to sleep, you know, just close your eyes.
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And The next thing I'm out of The car, and you know, I had a broken arm at The same time.
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But I think yeah, thinking back now, uh my The actual reaction would have been adrenaline would have flooded, you would have been rigid, sitting up bracing for impact.
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Um, and if I'd done that, then you know, I may have been dead.
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But yeah, because there's just something that's just said, just relax and go back to sleep.
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Um that has stayed with me.
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And yeah, whenever I think about that, I'm just I'm just grateful.
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You know, I'm just very grateful to be here.
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And and I suppose it's made me uh feel a sense of responsibility to use The you know, The The skills and knowledge and capacity I have to try and make a difference, to try and contribute something.
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So I just that's what I've you know, that's how I bring it to The present and The work I'm doing now.
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It sounds like there's a certain trust of instinct, perhaps that was affirmed.
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Yes, definitely.
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Yeah, and also yeah, a sense in, you know, there is a higher power, you know.
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I I wouldn't necessarily call it God, but you know, there's you know, there's a there's other dimensions, there's uh there's a there's other powers that are you know out there with us.
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And then from there to to The work you're doing today?
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So that was a bit of a journey as well.
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So yeah, I I did a law degree.
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That was my you know, my my parents' aspiration.
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They, you know, sacrificed and put their sons through, you know, through through college because they wanted them to have The opportunity they didn't have to go to university.
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Um so I did a did a law degree at Melbourne and started off as a corporate lawyer briefly and then got out of that because I felt I felt like a fraud being a corporate lawyer at The 44th floor of The Rialto Tower, looking over The you know, Port Philip Bay and Westgate at The age of 21 and thinking, I haven't lived, you know.
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I don't I I I know The law, I know how to apply The rules, but I don't have The experience and I don't feel it's responsible for me as a young 21-year-old to be in this job at this time.
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So I left and yeah, went through different types of legal adjacent jobs in London through The 1990s.
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And then The big shift was actually going to Guatemala and making a decision to go and live in The global south and learn about The history and culture and The trauma that that country had been through.
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Uh, and then yeah, do The work with Peace Brigade International, The human rights accompaniments, understand.
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Uh, and we've just been talking today about peace, um, how Guatemala was plunged into decades of civil war because of conflict over land and land ownership, and because The Guatemalan government, as you know, uh wanted to redistribute land that belonged to The United Fruit Corporation to The majority indigenous Mayan populations so they could um improve themselves beyond you know, subsistence, um, poverty-level agriculture.
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And when they did that, they ran straight into The power of The United States government and United Fruit Corporation and that led to The coup of 1954, The civil war that kicked off in 59, 60, and and what happened since.
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So that was yeah, a life education and a a yeah, realization that you know, so much of what happens in The world and and you know, The The trajectories and lives of communities and people and countries is so much bound up with agriculture and and land ownership and who owns it and what it's what it's used for.
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Yeah, ditto in so many ways.
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We were there at The same time as it happens in different regions, and obviously, yeah, didn't know it at The time.
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But yeah, so much to be realised out of that.
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I actually did deeper research on that too at one stage.
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And The bringing back of some land into Indigenous hands, it it was only a fraction of The company's holdings too.
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But it just triggered all The Cold War paranoia at The time.
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That's right.
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And those dynamics are still with us today, you know, they're still they're still The same.
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Right now, with The Brazilian election, what's happened in Bolivia, you know, still The same dynamic.
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It was still in that cycle of, you know, control and domination and colonization.
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Like we're still we're still here.
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This is where we were talking off-air just before, and perhaps it'll come into The conversation a bit later as we go to.
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So this has led to this moment, particularly where we're around The table because there's a big event coming up in Western Australia that you're convening.
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And that's part of a national series of events because there's some big shifts happening.
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Absolutely.
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So this is The West Australian Food Policy Forum that's happening at The Bentley Technology Park Hub on The 30th of November.
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And that, as you say, is part of a bigger shift.
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So The mission of my organization, sustain, is really to support The transition of Australia's food and farming systems from ones that are really about at The moment maximising corporate profit as a short-term agenda to ones that really support flourishing people, country, and ecosystems.
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That's The shift I believe that we need to make.
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I think that's The challenge for us who are have The privilege to be alive today at this time.
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And that's The work that we that I want to do and that my organization wants to do.
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And fortunately, we found many people who share that vision and passion and commitment.
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And that's what The event is in Western Australia, that's what The event was in in Tasmania and in Melbourne, and it ties into what The federal government has committed to do, which is to develop Feeding Australia as The country's national food security strategy.
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That'll be wrapped up by June next year, and we feel it's incumbent on every state and territory government, and indeed every local government, to reciprocate and to play their part in what is a national process, a whole of system, whole of country, whole of government process to bring that shift from food and agricultural systems that have been extractive and damaging to ones that are restorative and healing and life-enhancing.
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And that's what this that's what this event is about, this conversation.
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And it's a moment in that journey.
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And we want to fully engage with The West Australian government so that they take up their responsibility and play their part in this transition.
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Let's come back to that too.
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And this will be The first of its kind, right?
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So it's it's taken us till now to even have such a thing.
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So a real opportunity.
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And when people hear The term food security, I'm not sure that it's still understood terribly well.
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Do you want to give us a little bit of a snapshot on where we're at and what it means?
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Aaron Ross Powell, Jr.
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Sure.
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So I mentioned my first degree and training was in law, and in Guatemala that was very much about human rights.
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So I'm a strong believer in human rights and international law, and I think that's really important for all kinds of reasons.
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So part of human rights is The right for everybody to an adequate standard of living.
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That was in The Universal Declaration of Human Rights in 1948.
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Part of that is The right to adequate food as a basic fundamental principle.
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So that's you know, as a matter of legal commitment and principle.
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Our governments have signed up to that as far back as 1976, but they've never brought it forward into domestic legislation.
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So that's The missing piece.
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Food security is giving effect in a way to what human The human right to food actually means.
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So it's it's The commitment and The actions and The resourcing to ensure that all peoples at all times have access to adequate amounts of nutritious uh culturally appropriate food that is sufficient for a healthy and active life.
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So that's that's what food security means.
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And there's there's six dimensions to that.
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the two that they've added recently are agency and sustainability.
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So agency is very much about community voice and you know The concepts like self-determination so that communities actually have a really strong say in what kind of food system uh is appropriate and right for them.
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So so I think it's it's a concept that you know can sound a bit abstract, but when you you know unpack it and break it down, it is very relevant and very appropriate and uh applicable to our to our circumstances.
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And The snapshot then, for The government to do this, I'm gathering there's a certain recognition of The need that there's a problem out there.
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People aren't getting this right to.
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Absolutely not.
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Like Western Australia is The richest state in one of The world's richest countries, and yet in this state, we have as many as 10 to 15 percent of West Australians right now who are on The spectrum of food insecurity, who are worried about where The next meal is coming from, or who are skipping meals because they're prior, you know, prioritizing paying rent or mortgage, or prioritizing feeding their children, or paying for electricity or medicine, and food is you know that item in household budgets that often gets cut.
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You talk to food banks and charities, they're saying they've never seen such demand.
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the, you know, it's increased 30% in The last 12 months alone since The Iran war kicked off this year, and petrol prices have gone up, inflation's going back up, interest rates, all these things flow through and squeeze household budgets.
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So absolutely, we've got our food security problem right now in Western Australia, uh, and indeed in The country as a whole.
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Indeed in The country, yeah.
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And then there's bigger picture questions about you know what's happening with The climate, The Super El Nino that's coming, what is that gonna mean for agricultural production, uh, and then questions about supply chain integrity with geopolitical instability and what's happening in The Persian Gulf?
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It's not yet over.
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It's not, in fact, if anything, it's looking like it's gonna get worse.
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Uh, what does that mean for diesel?
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What does it mean for fertilizer?
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You know, what does that mean for The integrity and stability of our food system?
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This is what occurs to me on with a lot of The things we're grappling with.
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It's not just that it's it's where it's at as a concern, but there's a trajectory that's potentially going The wrong way with that set of systems and understandings.
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So let's segue to you guys, Heidi and Di.
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As people who are going to speak at this event and be involved and invest in it in that way, I wonder how you're seeing it, how you're seeing The state of play, how you're seeing The prospect of this event and and indeed The strategy as a whole, and what you might be hoping for even out of it.
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Uh thank you, AJ.
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I think what I've been seeing in The community, and I and wearing The hat of a a First Nations or Nyungar Yamiji person, I'd like to come from that lens.
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Um we've had lots of discussions in The state in The last few years, particularly through Regen WA and um we Nick presented at last year's conference around The quality of our food in general and The recent conversations around food security and food sovereignty.
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And I'm particularly interested in what food security and food sovereignty mean for First Nations people, and i if I hone into where we are here on Yungabuja, what that means for us as Nyungar people.
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Um Nick and I, I think we were having a discussion perhaps on our way here around some of The how we've seen this play out in The state during COVID when communities were closed and people didn't have access to food, during fire, flood, and cyclones when roads are closed or trains are stopped and people aren't having access to basic foods.
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It's a big issue.
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It's been a big issue for a while, but The cost of living has also put extreme pressures on our families, and we are we have many families that are struggling today just to be able to live.
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So you're right, people are sacrificing food, and we don't have The pleasure and luxury of going hunting for uh kangaroo or emu or The The meats that we know are good for us because of issues of access to country and restrictions around firearms now and a whole range of things.
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So from my perspective, I'm really keen to see how we do look at it from a state level and we start to look at policies and take away some of The barriers and have some really place-based solutions around health and wellness as well for our communities, because essentially what this is what that's about.
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It's about healthy people and healthy country.
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And um, for us that's two important things.
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Let's go on with a few of those themes, I think.
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But Di, I'm curious for you how you're seeing and feeling about it.
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My perspective uh from a farming point of view is that a lot of Australia's food production um is actually geared towards an export system.
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There's not a lot that goes on um at a local level, and in fact, other than farmers' markets, it's really difficult to source um a lot of local grown food.
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And and a lot of The um market interventions out there aren't actually favouring Australian grown food either.
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There's um quite a lot of push from other nations to be uh having their produce come into The marketplace, and just recently The pineapple growers um over Easter having to talk to The government about their own supply at a local level, um, where importers are wanting to bring pineapples in from India or whatever it might be.
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But I think all those things we really need to respect and promote our local food production across The whole nation effectively.
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Um, and then it also comes down then to The infrastructure that isn't there.
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Um, with a food production system that's geared towards export, a lot of it actually falls into a commodity bracket as well, um, with systems that are promoting volume to suit that as opposed to really looking at what The nutritional and health integrity of The food is actually being produced.
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So when you're looking at human health and planetary health outcomes, they're certainly not necessarily on The agenda.
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But beyond that is even, yeah, to try and get food to a local level, The infrastructure isn't there, it is very corporatized.
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Um, and to be able to have a segregated product through that and supply a local market is exceedingly difficult.
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Um, yeah, unless The farmers try and do that on their own, which is pretty cost prohibitive and time consuming.
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You guys know all about it.
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You've talked a lot too in your West Australian of The Year award brought you in touch with more people talking about this to you.
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What was described to you as a tsunami of health costs and issues coming our way.
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This was doctors talking to you about this?
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That's right.
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A lot um Ian spoke to quite a number of people um even in Western Australia and both when we went to Canberra as well.
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Um, people recognising that onslaught of chronic illness is just massive, and we all know Parkinson's disease has been quite obvious in The, you know, The community of late, and let alone MND, with um Neil Danaher taking at The Australian of The Year and The huge work that he'd done to try and create awareness about MND.
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So they're just two examples, and we know there's multiples of others.
00:18:35.839 --> 00:18:49.039
Um, but what also caught our attention greatly too was um children being born with chronic illnesses and so forth, and actually, yeah, not making it very long in life, which is absolutely devastating for everybody.
00:18:49.039 --> 00:19:15.920
So we really do have to take a good hard look at what our food integrity is as well as The food security, because there is a lot of um weaknesses out there currently in being able to produce enough food primarily at a global level, but certainly Australia's got an enormous um resource and diversity available through The different landscapes we've got, but we're not really treasuring that and working with that to The best of our ability.
00:19:15.920 --> 00:19:25.519
It's being ignored, um, yeah, being prioritised as international relationships coming over what our local system should be.
00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:35.200
When I hear you say food integrity to be included, I it almost feels like you could supplant The words food security and food integrity, but so one and The same.
00:19:35.200 --> 00:19:43.119
Heidi, these might be The conversations that you and I might be having about First Nation situations, but you're talking about The country as a whole.
00:19:43.119 --> 00:19:49.359
Like The ultimately The system that extracted from First Nations is extracting from The lot.
00:19:49.359 --> 00:19:53.920
So I'm curious for you, what hope is invested in this process for you?
00:19:54.559 --> 00:20:03.359
I probably draw my greatest um inspiration and hope from The opportunities to bring The collective discussion together on Yunga country.
00:20:03.359 --> 00:20:06.000
We haven't had The opportunity to do that as Nyungar people.
00:20:06.000 --> 00:20:11.200
So first firstly as Nyungar people, but but also as Nyungar people as part of a collective discussion.
00:20:11.200 --> 00:20:12.799
That hasn't happened to date.
00:20:12.799 --> 00:20:15.519
Um, and I think it's really important for us to understand that.
00:20:15.519 --> 00:20:42.079
I was having a discussion sometime earlier in in this week um around The trauma associated to The dispossession of um, you know, from our lands on for farming and agriculture and what that looks like when we are trying to have conversations around restoring those farmlands or those landscapes or looking at um more regenerative practices and asking younger or First Nations people to be involved.
00:20:42.079 --> 00:20:52.720
It's not so simple to just say, Would you like to come and work with us or tell us how we can do something better when there is this trauma piece for many people underlying.
00:20:52.720 --> 00:20:58.000
And I'm not um raising that to create a barrier or fear around this.
00:20:58.000 --> 00:21:03.279
I'm raising this to say, well, we know that this exists and it's and it's and it's The elephant in The room.
00:21:03.279 --> 00:21:07.440
So let's have some conversations about these things so that we can move forward.
00:21:07.440 --> 00:21:10.400
Because I don't think I think we're all on The same page.
00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:23.279
I think as humans in this state, The majority of us know what we need to do to solve some of these big problems, but we just don't get The chances to sit together in spaces that allow for these kinds of conversations.
00:21:23.279 --> 00:21:35.359
And I I'm quite confident in um Nick's experience and The way that he works, that we will be able to have conversations like this at at this level and support him to have more across um across The country as well.
00:21:36.079 --> 00:21:38.079
What are you thinking when you're hearing all this?
00:21:38.079 --> 00:21:44.799
I'm finding that very well personally very affirming, and thank you, Heidi, for that um statement of support.
00:21:44.799 --> 00:21:48.559
It's really uh important for me and for The work we're doing.
00:21:48.559 --> 00:21:55.200
But I I feel I've been doing this work now for The better part of 20 years, and I'm seeing momentum, I'm seeing some shifts.
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:59.759
And just The fact that after our workshop at North Rio Social Farm at The beginning of this.
00:21:59.759 --> 00:22:17.039
Week then going to WA Parliament on The Tuesday and spending two and a half hours talking with a group of MPs there, including The Minister's representative, and seeing The level of interest and engagement from that level is is very encouraging.
00:22:17.039 --> 00:22:28.079
So I I'm yeah, I I I I tend to be a glass half full person, um optimistic by by nature, and I think The time is now.
00:22:28.079 --> 00:22:50.799
You know, with with some of The The we were talking about Theory U and you know patterns of change and things dec you know decomposting, breaking down, and then emerging again, like The new emerging.
00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:56.319
I think these are this is what I'm observing, what I'm feeling, and I think this is The opportunity that's in front of us.
00:22:56.319 --> 00:23:00.880
So I I feel encouraged and supported by what Heidi has just said.
00:23:01.359 --> 00:23:04.880
Tell me more about what you've observed around The country over The period of time.
00:23:04.880 --> 00:23:11.599
So you've observed a lot, you're in touch with a lot of people, you've run processes even gearing up to this strategy in different parts of The country.
00:23:11.599 --> 00:23:18.000
What's coming up there and what are The overlaps, The differences, and and I guess that what's The trajectory of this?
00:23:18.640 --> 00:23:41.839
So our invitation to The West Australian government in doing this event is to follow The lead of The ACT government, which a few years ago now created The Canberra Region Local Food Strategy as a coordinated policy environment for The Australian Capital Territory, and also to follow The lead of The Tasmanian government, which has a food security strategy that's now into its second four-year iteration.
00:23:41.839 --> 00:23:57.440
And in Tasmania, a number of The Tasmanian partners in Lonseston last year have now formed a statewide food security alliance coalition that are talking together or talking with The Tasmanian government, having a whole of state conversation about these kinds of issues.
00:23:57.440 --> 00:24:01.359
That is The kind of process that I'd like to see unfold in Western Australia.
00:24:01.359 --> 00:24:06.240
I think that's you know that's The opportunity and that's The invitation to The West Australian government.
00:24:06.240 --> 00:24:13.680
And in Victoria, we've seen a shift in The language and The thinking, even in The state government.
00:24:13.680 --> 00:24:25.599
So they used to be having what they called community food relief grants and talking about food relief, and now this year they're starting to use The language of food security and community food security.
00:24:25.599 --> 00:24:31.920
It's a small thing, but I think it's it's important that they're actually using different language.
00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:35.440
They're using The language of food systems now, which they never did before.
00:24:35.440 --> 00:24:45.119
So I think there's there is an understanding in government that we can't be doing The same thing, like it's that old saying, like if you want to change something, if you're in a hole, stop digging.
00:24:45.119 --> 00:24:49.119
Like if you want to change something, don't do The same thing that you've always done for years and years.
00:24:49.119 --> 00:24:53.839
And so I I do see I do see those kinds of changes starting to take place.
00:24:53.839 --> 00:25:02.240
Uh South Australia has taken The step of banning all advertising of unhealthy and junk food on their public transport system.
00:25:02.240 --> 00:25:05.119
You know, that's a another positive step in The right direction.
00:25:05.119 --> 00:25:19.359
So, you know, bits and pieces here and there, but you you join them together, and The picture you start to see emerging is a a shift towards thinking, uh systems thinking from you know fragmented and siloed approaches and a growing level of awareness.
00:25:19.359 --> 00:25:28.960
And this is part of The work that you know Dai and Heidi and so many others around The country have been doing for so many years, yourself included, AJ, to raise awareness and have these kinds of conversations.
00:25:28.960 --> 00:25:38.160
I think we're now starting to see The you know those seeds bearing, you know, bearing fruit and The cultural change and The value shift that is really underlying all of this.
00:25:38.160 --> 00:25:40.480
I think we can start to see this starting to rise.
00:25:40.480 --> 00:25:56.480
And I I think back to what Charlie Massey said back in his Call of The Reed Warbler book when he was talking about The underground revolution and The you know The microrhizal fungi and all these connections and conversations just happening, you know, at different levels across The country over many, many years.
00:25:56.480 --> 00:26:00.559
And I think now we're starting to see The you know, see The fruit of all that all that work.
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:03.279
That book is right behind you on that bookshelf.
00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:05.440
And you gave it to me on that doorstep.
00:26:05.440 --> 00:26:07.119
So thank you very much for that.
00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:12.960
When I hear you say that shift from The The relief thing, The food relief thing to The system.
00:26:12.960 --> 00:26:14.319
It is fascinating, isn't it?
00:26:14.319 --> 00:26:19.119
To observe those things when you can you can get lost in The fishbowl of The moment a little bit, but you see that trajectory.
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:21.279
I think of The same thing with farming too, no die.
00:26:21.279 --> 00:26:29.599
But I think are we still in that place where it's drought relief and flood relief as opposed to getting to The source, or or is it shifting there too?
00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:33.359
I think there certainly is a lot of effort to try and make that shift.
00:26:33.359 --> 00:26:37.359
Um yeah, whether it's happening fast enough, I'm not too sure.
00:26:37.359 --> 00:26:43.839
But yeah, certainly I think there's quite a bit of movement in that area, a bit like you're saying, Nick, that there is certainly progress in that area.
00:26:44.319 --> 00:26:44.960
Internationally?
00:26:44.960 --> 00:26:45.279
Nick?
00:26:45.279 --> 00:26:45.920
Absolutely.
00:26:45.920 --> 00:26:55.759
So Di talked about The lack of infrastructure to support The wonderful produce that uh Diane and Matthew produce on their farm and The wheat belt.
00:26:55.759 --> 00:27:15.200
In Canada, The Canadian government has just uh just launched its national food security strategy and they've resourced that with a $3 billion investment in infrastructure over The next 10 years to look at some of those key uh blockages in in supply chains and invest in you know The The so-called missing middle of uh infrastructure in in food systems.
00:27:15.200 --> 00:27:19.519
So that's happening in Canada, The UK's got a national food security strategy.
00:27:19.519 --> 00:27:37.599
There's increasing talk about food security being part of national security, so it's moving from The margins and The fringes of government policy where in this country it's really been dealt with by throwing some millions to you know food bank and odds harvest and second bite to actually moving closer to The centre of government policy.
00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:43.119
And I think The fact The Federal Government's creating The Feeding Australia strategy is a reflection of that global trend.
00:27:43.680 --> 00:27:50.160
Is there First Nations involvement Have those dialogues been happening in these contexts as well, do you know, with First Nations?
00:27:50.240 --> 00:27:56.319
Aaron Ross Powell, I know there's been a lot of work on First Nations in Canada, a lot of work on First Nations food sovereignty and different collaborations.
00:27:56.319 --> 00:28:05.119
I haven't looked closely enough at The Canadian framework to know how strongly that's embedded and integrated, and and First Nations First Nations voice and leadership is included in that strategy.
00:28:05.119 --> 00:28:07.680
So I'd I'd have to take that question on notice.
00:28:07.680 --> 00:28:18.480
But I I'm uh certainly in terms of The you know The governance and The policy that we want to see in this state and this country, very much I think First Nations needs to be right at The centre of it.
00:28:19.039 --> 00:28:22.960
Heidi, we talked a bit off air, but it it's still ringing in my ears essentially.
00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:27.119
What came out of that region WA conference last September as well.
00:28:27.119 --> 00:28:28.880
Talk about tenure.
00:28:28.880 --> 00:28:41.759
You talked about access and The whole system of how we allocate land to things and own it and potentially just do what we want with it when you're trying to take care of The whole.
00:28:41.759 --> 00:28:47.759
I mean, that was a conversation that was flagged, and then it you could use more forums for as well.
00:28:47.759 --> 00:28:51.440
Is this something that's front and center for you?
00:28:51.440 --> 00:28:53.279
Is it back in The line a little bit?
00:28:54.319 --> 00:29:01.759
Yeah, I think that's shifted a bit since um since September last year, uh for me personally, but also for our community.
00:29:01.759 --> 00:29:09.599
Um now taking on another role um within The Nyungar settlement in one of our regional corps at um Waggel Kept Southern Yunga.
00:29:09.599 --> 00:29:16.000
And all of our regional corps are starting to look at um taking on The lands that have come through in our settlement agreement.
00:29:16.000 --> 00:29:29.119
So we're in a different position now where we have um some really good quality land and coming across to us to be able to look to, you know, develop or use for cultural purposes and um how do we want to use those lands.
00:29:29.119 --> 00:29:40.799
So this The issue before where we didn't have land access or we didn't have tenure across, you know, particularly things like The ILSC examples that we gave um in previous conversations, it has changed.
00:29:40.799 --> 00:29:54.160
And uh Nick and I were having this conversation on The way here around The opportunities for that across Newmar country, The significant amount of of land coming back, neighboring, you know, people like Diane and others out on country.
00:29:54.160 --> 00:30:15.279
Uh I think there's some really exciting opportunities there for us to start playing in this space together and doing some really amazing things and starting to connect The conversations around um ecological corridors and restoration pieces, which again, anyone who's ever heard me speak, I'm constantly saying, why can we not talk about restoration and food systems in The same conversation instead of separately?
00:30:15.279 --> 00:30:24.880
So I'm quite re-energised by where I am in The workplace and what's happening for us as Nyungar people in this phase of um The settlement.
00:30:24.880 --> 00:30:34.319
And I think that you know, I'm hoping that through The work that that Nick started starting here now, that some really good partnerships and opportunities come out of that discussion.
00:30:34.720 --> 00:30:35.680
Are you seeing it die?
00:30:35.680 --> 00:30:40.960
And from a farming perspective, is sort of a shift happening in your mind as well?
00:30:41.519 --> 00:30:43.279
Uh I certainly think there is.
00:30:43.279 --> 00:30:58.880
I mean, we've just come back from The Slow Food Festival, um, and that was just wonderful to see such a diverse range across The globe of people coming together and really, you know, promoting these ideas and just working together and really focusing on that food quality and community.
00:30:58.880 --> 00:31:00.720
So yeah, I think that was in Italy.
00:31:00.720 --> 00:31:01.599
That's right, yeah.
00:31:01.599 --> 00:31:03.519
So I think that's um really encouraging.
00:31:04.319 --> 00:31:08.319
And and you also went to Climate Week and a few other things in The States.
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:09.279
What are you seeing?
00:31:09.759 --> 00:31:23.119
Yeah, well, that was certainly a mind blower, but um it there was a really good vibe, certainly, um, even at Climate Week in a city like New York where you'd think, you know, perhaps it might get drawn down a different pathway.
00:31:23.119 --> 00:31:26.240
Perhaps we didn't choose to go to those um seminars.
00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:33.839
We went to ones that might feel a little more comfortable, but there was some really good people talking along these similar lines there, certainly.
00:31:33.839 --> 00:31:39.440
And The audiences we were amongst were very receptive um and very broad.
00:31:39.440 --> 00:31:41.200
So that was very encouraging as well.
00:31:41.200 --> 00:31:43.839
So we did come home feeling very energized.
00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:50.000
Um, that yeah, there were some really significant shifts there, um, but still a lot of work to be done.
00:31:50.000 --> 00:31:53.440
But yeah, there seems to be a lot of um enthusiasm.
00:31:53.839 --> 00:32:07.680
And you're certainly experiencing this incredible demand, including there, The conversation you guys were just telling me you had with some people in New York on The fashion front, your produce going there and food as well, or was that sort of The highlight aspect?
00:32:07.839 --> 00:32:23.759
It was The Um We went there primarily from a food perspective and trying to look at how to um try and break down some of these infrastructure issues, um, because yeah, it is very difficult to try and get a segregated product through The market to The endpoint consumer.
00:32:23.759 --> 00:32:31.759
Um, we're fortunate with a couple of bakeries we work with who have their own stone mill, but we can't expect everybody to have that level of investment and commitment.
00:32:31.759 --> 00:32:44.079
So we've got to try and find other ways, otherwise it goes through a you know commodity-based system um and you cannot n you know differentiate uh one flower from The other to a large extent.
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:48.799
So we've just got to try and work on those things, and that was why we went to The US in The first place.
00:32:49.279 --> 00:32:57.440
You've probably in saying The commodity-based system, you're probably hitting, and I know you guys have talked about this, The nail on The head in many ways itself, no?
00:32:57.440 --> 00:33:04.319
If you're talking about food security and food integrity, you're not talking about and health, you're not talking about commodity.
00:33:04.720 --> 00:33:05.680
No, I guess that's it.
00:33:05.680 --> 00:33:23.039
I mean, a food is a completely different being, and yeah, there's certainly a place for a commodity-based system and um perhaps diesel fuel um alternatives and all that kind of thing, but when it comes to food, it has to be looked at from a completely different lens and yeah, just wanting to encourage that again.
00:33:23.839 --> 00:33:29.839
Yeah, just I mean, as somebody said in our workshop on Monday, we treat water as critical public infrastructure.
00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:41.839
We take it for granted that everybody has access to you know good running water that's that's clean, that's free of any you know, impurities, sanitation, sewerage, these things are basic and fundamental.
00:33:41.839 --> 00:33:42.400
Good point.
00:33:42.400 --> 00:33:44.799
Why do we treat food any differently to that, really?
00:33:44.799 --> 00:33:55.440
Like food is as fundamental as water to health and well-being and in many ways, you know, to to culture, to to to our spirituality, to our sense of self, to who we are.
00:33:55.440 --> 00:34:15.119
So it's it's it's far beyond a commodity, and I think that's part of The problem, a big part of The problem actually, that we've reduced it just to commodity, just to The price tag in The in The market context, when it embodies so much more medicine, healing, health, well-being, you know, around a table, sharing meal, so many dimensions to it.
00:34:15.119 --> 00:34:18.880
That is just, you know, The commodity just doesn't doesn't even go close to that.
00:34:19.199 --> 00:34:19.440
Yeah.
00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:36.159
I think how it circles back to Han, like The land management and The water, I mean, The water coming back onto your property in The wheat belt that's been parched and salinified through your practices, that The water's not just what's in The in The rivers or The dams, it's it's what's in The land.
00:34:36.159 --> 00:34:38.239
And then The relationship with that.
00:34:38.239 --> 00:34:39.039
Yeah.
00:34:39.039 --> 00:34:41.360
So who's coming, Nick?
00:34:41.360 --> 00:34:43.199
Well, Di and Heidi.
00:34:43.199 --> 00:34:46.239
Need we say more.
00:34:46.960 --> 00:34:48.239
That's enough, isn't it?
00:34:48.239 --> 00:34:49.679
At least for me.
00:34:49.679 --> 00:34:53.920
Uh we've got already three MPs that are coming.
00:34:53.920 --> 00:34:55.760
We've got The Minister who's coming.
00:34:55.760 --> 00:35:01.039
We've got The Nungarland Enterprise Group that are coming, uh, Oral Maguire, Alan Beattie.
00:35:01.039 --> 00:35:04.320
Who also have an event The next day open to The public.
00:35:04.320 --> 00:35:06.719
They do, yeah, on The first of December.
00:35:06.719 --> 00:35:11.519
We've got uh people from Regent WA from The NRM sector.
00:35:11.519 --> 00:35:25.920
Uh we've got people from The health sector, uh, we've got people from researchers from different universities, uh, we've got people from working in uh The front line of food security, Food Bank WA, The Eon Aboriginal Foundation that works with remote communities in The Kimberley.
00:35:25.920 --> 00:35:38.800
Uh we've got people working on The question of uh built environments, and that's another big one about you know our outer suburbs, Wanneroo, Armadale, Rockingham being overrun with fast food, often sitting up right next door to schools.
00:35:39.119 --> 00:35:40.159
Just by default, too, eh?
00:35:40.159 --> 00:35:42.320
It's just it's not even not even questioned.
00:35:42.639 --> 00:35:45.840
No, because health and well-being are not in The planning framework.
00:35:45.840 --> 00:35:50.400
Like we do not give local government The power to say, do we need more fast food?
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:53.360
When we've already got 10 or 20, and do we need them next to schools?
00:35:53.360 --> 00:36:00.239
I mean, obviously we don't if we're interested in our children's health, but The planning framework doesn't just ignores that completely.
00:36:00.239 --> 00:36:01.679
These are The opportunities.
00:36:01.679 --> 00:36:02.239
That's right.
00:36:02.239 --> 00:36:06.800
So Cancer Council WA, Edith Cowan University, Australian Food Atlas, they'll be speaking about all those things.
00:36:06.800 --> 00:36:07.679
So that's fascinating.
00:36:07.679 --> 00:36:11.360
It's going to be people from across The food and agricultural system and seafood.
00:36:11.360 --> 00:36:14.000
So we're going to have some people representing The seafood industry as well.
00:36:14.000 --> 00:36:14.639
Critical.
00:36:14.719 --> 00:36:21.599
I mean 70% of The planet, ocean, and we're looking at it right now, staring us in The face how critical this is.
00:36:21.599 --> 00:36:23.519
So it's terrific that that's involved.
00:36:23.519 --> 00:36:27.280
And partners, like The people and organizations around it helping make it happen.
00:36:27.519 --> 00:36:27.920
Absolutely.
00:36:27.920 --> 00:36:56.159
So I'd like to do a big shout out to Common Land and The process that they've initiated this week of The ecosystem innovator connector process, I think it's called, as an 18-month commitment from Common Land to bring people together from across uh different organisations around The state in a supported process, diving, you know, deepening The relationships, The connections, uh, getting to know each other better, understand each other's work better, and having that as a supported process that is around a shared agenda of landscape restoration and landscape healing.
00:36:56.159 --> 00:36:58.719
But food systems is obviously very central to that.
00:36:58.719 --> 00:37:16.639
But yeah, we've got uh UWA's Centre for Agricultural and Viticultural Economics, we've got Perth City Farm, uh WAFIC, The Food Industry Council, uh Mindaroo are involved, uh, Serpentine Jaradel Shire, Serpentine Jarudel Food and Farm Alliance, like lots of lots of partners are supporting The event.
00:37:16.880 --> 00:37:18.000
Is there a broader invitation?
00:37:18.559 --> 00:37:18.960
Absolutely.
00:37:18.960 --> 00:37:19.840
Yeah, absolutely.
00:37:19.840 --> 00:37:24.480
We've got room for about 170 people, so still tickets are available.
00:37:24.480 --> 00:37:32.320
And if you are interested and passionate and you want to be involved in this conversation, uh please, yeah, please come along, please be part of The discussion, The conversation.
00:37:33.280 --> 00:37:35.199
And for you guys, anything else?
00:37:35.199 --> 00:37:36.960
Anyone else you'd like to see there?
00:37:36.960 --> 00:37:40.159
Anything else you want to say about to people who might be thinking about coming or not?
00:37:40.400 --> 00:37:44.320
Just anyone who's feeling that they've got something to contribute to The conversation, absolutely.
00:37:44.320 --> 00:37:53.280
It'd be lovely to see you there and and hear what you have to say because I think that's it bringing people from all parts to contribute is where it's yeah, where it's at.
00:37:53.679 --> 00:37:58.239
I'd like to encourage more members from The Nyungar community along to these discussions.
00:37:58.239 --> 00:38:11.840
We see The same faces at at these discussions, and whilst we are always connecting with others in The community, I think it's time for others to um also show up in these spaces and bring their voices and The voices of The people that they're connected to.
00:38:11.840 --> 00:38:12.880
This is really important.
00:38:12.880 --> 00:38:21.199
And we as we also start to consider um nyungar foods and medicines that we want in these food systems, and we need more voices to be able to contribute to that.
00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:27.679
So I want to put a call out to Nyungar people to don't be shame and get along and sit with us and let's all have a yarn together.
00:38:28.000 --> 00:38:28.480
Terrific.
00:38:28.480 --> 00:38:29.199
Thank you guys.
00:38:29.199 --> 00:38:32.880
Now, you guys know we close every episode with music.
00:38:32.880 --> 00:38:35.039
If you've heard The podcast, Nick, you know this too.
00:38:35.039 --> 00:38:38.000
I'm gonna give this honour to you, mate, because they've had it.
00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:46.639
What music has been significant to you in your life, perhaps even right now, perhaps emblematic of The themes of The conversation.
00:38:47.280 --> 00:38:49.199
He was trying to sing a song today, actually.
00:38:49.199 --> 00:38:49.679
Oh, well.
00:38:54.800 --> 00:38:59.199
Not sure if it was a lyric from a song, but The it was we were talking about what would it take to build peace.
00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:06.639
And The phrase that came to me is when when The power of love overcomes The love of money, then then The world will know peace.
00:39:06.639 --> 00:39:12.400
And I'm not sure if that was a I'm not sure if that was a song or if it was just somebody who said that I Kiri Lewis in The news.
00:39:12.400 --> 00:39:13.519
Was it ring a bell?
00:39:13.760 --> 00:39:15.760
It was a song called the Power of Love.
00:39:16.079 --> 00:39:18.480
Yes, The power of lyric the Power of Love.
00:39:18.480 --> 00:39:19.360
Yes, that's right.
00:39:19.599 --> 00:39:20.800
That was that was The song.
00:39:20.800 --> 00:39:22.159
That's outstanding.
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:23.039
Thanks, guys.
00:39:23.039 --> 00:39:23.920
It's been great to have you.
00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:24.880
We'll see you at The forum.
00:39:24.880 --> 00:39:25.440
Thanks, AJ.
00:39:25.440 --> 00:39:26.639
Thank you, thanks, AJ.
00:39:26.639 --> 00:39:30.480
That was Nick Rose, Heidi Mippy, and Di Haggerty.
00:39:30.480 --> 00:39:37.119
Ticks available now to both The WA Food Policy Forum and The Noongar Cultural Celebration The following day.
00:39:37.119 --> 00:39:46.960
the latter is free, and thanks to Sustain, paid subscribers on Patreon and Substack receive a 25% discount on your ticket to The policy forum.
00:39:46.960 --> 00:39:51.199
I'll send you a code shortly, and new subscribers are very welcome.
00:39:51.199 --> 00:39:56.480
All links in The show notes, I'll be at both events and look forward to seeing some of you there.
00:39:56.480 --> 00:40:08.000
If you'd like to let me know what you think about today's episode, send a voicemail or text via The show notes too, perhaps it even ends up on The show, like this one from newish paid subscriber Becky Trilsbach.
00:40:08.480 --> 00:40:12.079
AJ, mate, I've been listening for ages, bless ya.
00:40:12.079 --> 00:40:15.920
But yep, it was The Freddie Provenza hangout that pushed me to sign up.
00:40:15.920 --> 00:40:18.400
You've done me a mad service with your work.
00:40:18.400 --> 00:40:28.400
I'm a full-time farmer but part-time rural postie, and your chats accompany me on The long drives through The wondrous environs of my wild home.
00:40:28.400 --> 00:40:42.480
I found your work via my friends Casey and Tom at Mandarin Bend Farm, also paid subscribers, and former guests on The pod, by The way, episode 167, and have just started working with Rachel Ward.
00:40:42.480 --> 00:40:44.320
She's on episode 168.
00:40:44.320 --> 00:40:46.880
Sending cows to farm through.
00:40:46.880 --> 00:40:59.119
I keep listening because your conversations with your fabulous guests continue to unblock and link up reservoirs within me, refreshing my mindset and ability to connect to country and community.
00:40:59.119 --> 00:41:01.519
Cheers, all caps.
00:41:01.519 --> 00:41:02.719
Thanks, Becky.
00:41:02.719 --> 00:41:08.400
I just loved hearing this bit of your story and how The podcast is landing with you, and where The connections are threading.
00:41:08.400 --> 00:41:14.559
Perhaps I'll see you at The next live podcast audience gathering online too, with Stacey Curcio and Terry McCosker.
00:41:14.559 --> 00:41:16.800
I'll link that in The show notes for you all too.
00:41:16.800 --> 00:41:20.000
That's free and exclusive for paid subscribers.
00:41:20.000 --> 00:41:28.880
If you're enjoying The podcast, I hope you too might consider becoming a paid subscriber on Patreon or Substack, where there's some written stories too.
00:41:28.880 --> 00:41:38.800
This episode was only possible with your support, so thanks very much to fellow new subscribers over The last month, Michelle Wheaton, Nadia Danti, and Mati.
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:42.239
Thank you so much, dear friends, old and new.
00:41:42.239 --> 00:41:45.920
And thank you all for sharing, rating, and reviewing The podcast.
00:41:45.920 --> 00:41:49.840
the music you're hearing is Regeneration by Amelia Barden.
00:41:49.840 --> 00:41:51.599
My name's Anthony James.
00:41:51.599 --> 00:41:53.199
Thanks for listening.
00:42:33.360 --> 00:42:33.760
Is that better?
00:42:34.000 --> 00:42:34.559
A bit closer.
00:42:34.559 --> 00:42:34.880
Yeah.
00:42:34.880 --> 00:42:35.760
Is that better?
00:42:35.760 --> 00:42:37.119
So if I put that in.
00:42:37.119 --> 00:42:38.480
That's it.
00:42:38.480 --> 00:42:40.159
That's nice.