'You're Wrong' With Mollie Hemingway and David Harsanyi, Ep. 208: The Fauci Diaries

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Welcome back, everyone to a new episode of You're Wrong
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with Molly having Way, editor in chief of The Federalist
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and David Harsani, senior writer at the Washington Examiner. Just
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as a reminder, if you'd like to email a show,
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please do so at radio at the Federalist dot com. Hi, Molly.
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I think the big news today and what we'll start
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with and probably spend a lot of time on, is
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the legacy and of Anthony Fauci. Overall this more specifically
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Rampaul dropped. I would call it a documentump. But there's
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a lot there of diary musings, which which is I
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think weird to have electronically, and a lot of emails
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in there. To everyone's always talking about the diaries, you
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have something to say.
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It's not just a diary. It's a diary he kept
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on government time on government computers.
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Right. I would not have, personally, if I was running
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that operation, put the things that he says down on
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in digital form. I would have written them in a
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little notebook, old style. But today we're recording Wednesday morning,
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which is before the Congressional hearings or Senate hearings where
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he will be grilled on all this, you know, by
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by by senators, but specifically, I think everyone's interested in
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ram Paul's questions. It hit me today reading a piece
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I think in Fox on Fox News site that that
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he had been he had been pardoned by I forgot
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he had been pardoned by Joe Biden, right along with
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virtually everyone, which I think the time. I think now
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and then that it's an incredibly dangerous and corrosive precedent
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to offer blanket pardons to government officials in that way.
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But anyway, so, the only way you can really get
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in any kind of legal trouble is by lying to Congress.
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I wonder if that will make him be more honest,
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or will he take the fifth I mean, like, what
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do you expect, I guess to happen here.
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Well, I always try to keep my expectations extremely low
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when it comes to anything in Congress, but also anything
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related to accountability. But I'm still interested in how this
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will go, and I'm glad that it's happening. I know
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it's not the same thing, but even just exposing someone
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with the truth, there is good in that history. I
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hate when history won't look kind on you for being
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a Christian or whatever. I hate when people say stuff
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like that, But a pardon won't change how history will
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view Anthony Fauci, and how he will be viewed does
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matter and for him and for future situations that the
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country goes through. And so I think it's very important
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that people keep fighting for the truth on this. I
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wanted to offer that maybe states could also hold him accountable.
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He's had a pardon from the president for federal crimes,
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but if there are state if there are crimes that
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can be dealt with at the state level, maybe he
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could be held accountable.
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There can I Before we go forward to I just
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quickly want say I'm starting to interrupt you one thing.
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I understand there's so much anger at Fauci, but I
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just want to quickly say this he It does bother
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me a little bit that he takes the brugh, not
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the brunt. He takes essentially all of the anger for
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what happened. But we shouldn't forget that tons of elected officials,
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bureaucrats and others, unskeptically or without any skepticism, just implemented
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whatever he told them to shut people out of churches.
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He's not the only one. There's no reckoning for all
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those mayors and governors and frankly presidents who gave him
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and imbued him with this power over their decisions. Now
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I'm not listen. I think Pratchet deserves everything he gets,
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but I don't Somehow, I think we forget that other
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people who had real power, who didn't have to always
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listen to him, did these things right.
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David, you will appreciate that. Chris Bray, our wonderful California
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based writer, has a piece today at The Federalist headlined
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there were thousands of Fauci's The sub had Los Angeles
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County Supervisor Sheila Cule voted to order the closure of
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all restaurants in the county, then left that very meeting
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and went to dinner at Al Fourno in Santa Monica.
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Imagine if we could read all their pandemic diaries. And
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it's such an important point. Yes, Fauci is evil, absolutely
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evil beyond belief, but it's not just him. There were
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many people who shut down the economy, who destroyed the
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way we vote, who shut down our churches, who caused
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so much emotional damage to a particular age cohort of
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young people that it enrages me. And I know they
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all want to move on and be like, well, we
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really didn't know what was going on. Well, when we
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at the Federalist were publishing things like maybe we shouldn't
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handle it the way you're handling it, we got front
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page New York Times treatment about how awful we were
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to question the pandemic response. We got censored by Twitter,
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we got censored by Facebook, violently censored by Facebook. And
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I don't feel like just moving on, Like people have
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to hurt for what they did to those of us
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who were fighting their extreme non scientific response.
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Well, so there's this idea where it and I get it.
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You want to move on because that's old news, and
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frankly he wants to who wants to relive those days?
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It's it's, it's it. I get very angry. I think
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about I wrote a column I forgot. I was at
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National Review about how my neighbor could go to the
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their son had committed suicide and no one could go
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and give them a hug at their funeral. You know,
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it was just this horrible thing, and that's the moment
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it broke. I broke, and I wrote this column. You know,
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I went off on them. But anyway, the point is
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That's what I think of when I when I see
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this diary and I see him writing about how famous
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he is and luxuriating in the in flowers from Julia
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Roberts and going out to eat with Jake Tapper and
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other journalists who you know, were out there canonizing him
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and all of that. It's very upsetting. But here's the
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thing with it, with it, with the looking back, there
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was a Russia collusion hoax. It I don't know if people,
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I hope they do, but it's the entire country or
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political world was just obsessed with this topic for years.
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It stopped the president, the government from doing their job.
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It was this thing. Then when we moved on, there
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was never any reckoning. People are like, there was a reckoning,
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they were wrong, Well we were wrong, let's move on.
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Then they covered up the Biden. Then there was COVID.
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Then they covered up the Biden, you know, Biden presidency essentially,
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And there's never any reckoning for any of these things.
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We always just move on and until there is a reckoning,
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and each event destroys trust in institutions and our system
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and all of that, and we just keep moving on.
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And I think COVID was the worst. I hate using
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the phrase tipping point. I think it's kind of dumb.
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But if I had to pick a tipping point in
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American history or recent American history, it would be COVID.
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COVID destroyed trust and that there was a big vacuum
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and now it's been filled by a bunch of nuts
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online and all of that, and I blame fact you.
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That's his main legacy. You know, Like what happens tomorrow
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if we have another real pandem or real problem. Is
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anyone going to trust public health officials? No one's going
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to trust them?
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Would we already see this? Right? You know there's a
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measles outbreak. You can't tell me. I don't know exactly
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the details of where the measles are coming out, But say,
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a decreased trust in vaccines has so much to do
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with how the COVID pandemic response was handled. I don't
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even think it's necessarily about how the vaccine was handled,
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although that was also a major part of it. Someone
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pointed out that Fauci's diaries didn't include him absolutely getting
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clowned on by a Rando DC resident who Fauci and
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Mayor Muriel Bowser were going door to door encouraging black
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constituents to take the vaccine, and this one guy was
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just just kind of talking about the speed with which
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the vaccine had been created, the way in which they
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were forcing it on people and trying to pay people
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money basically to take it. And he's like, if it
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were so great, you wouldn't have to do this, and
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it was just funny, like they didn't get mentioned in
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his diary. But that random person, with probably very little
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scientific backing, was doing more critical thinking. I'm not even
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saying I'm not like some.
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I have.
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I think I have fairly nuanced views on the vaccine myself,
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but it's just, yeah, I mean crazy.
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I think it was worthwhile to try to figure out
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a vaccine. I thought it was pretty impressive what they did,
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But I also don't believe the government should be forcing
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people to you know, and that's what they did. They
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use the power of the state to compel people to
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take it, and they should never have done that.
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I do think there's a case for treating Fauci as worse,
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as a worse actor than some of these other people
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who were following what he said. He was was responsible
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in his role as one of the top public health
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officials of funding helping fund gain and function research after
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President Obama banned it in the United States. So they
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came up with a plan, and they funded people doing
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it in other countries and figured out how to take
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their information so that they could basically keep all the
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benefits of gain and function research while technically complying with
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President Obama's order not to do it in the United States. Then,
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when the virus likely escaped from the Wuhan Institute of
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Urology in Wuhan, right near its doors, he engaged in
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a massive cover up and effort to keep people from
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talking openly and honestly about what happened there, And he
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did it in a way that probably did cost quite
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a few lives. And he did this by encouraging people
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to publish papers that said things that were probably not true,
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also pointing government officials to scientists who he knew would
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be publishing these papers, so that when they did come out,
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it would seem like these people were more credible than
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they were. He was incentivizing the publication of these papers
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with large grants for these people's real work, and then
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mocking and deriding in collusion with corporate media types like
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Jake Tapper, anyone who said otherwise going after Tom Cotton,
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you know, people like that when they would say, I
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think it's weird that this virus started steps from the
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Wuhan Institute of Rology, where they were studying how to
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manipulate the coronavirus in precisely the manner in which it
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was manipulated. You know, you might remember the Washington Post
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going after him. That was all with Fauci's help. And then,
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more than anything, I do think as bad as the
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funding of it, of gain a function secret sort of
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like duplicitous funding of it, covering up of the real
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origins of COVID nineteen, I think the weaponization of COVID
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nineteen to shut down schools, which he denied he did,
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but his diaries prove he was the one on the
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phone with California, New York telling them to shut down
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their schools. Just the general panic he caused through his
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public pronouncements as the top public health official in the US,
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shutting down churches, and also kind of being the model
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of that hypocrisy where he would tell everybody else not
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to be with their dying family members while hanging out
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with Jake Tapper, and having a fun meal, or go
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into a baseball game and keeping his mask down and
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then explaining why he did it and not making any sense,
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and like all of that insanity that we were subjected
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to when we didn't have the power and he had
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all the power. I do think it's okay to hold
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him responsible.
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Oh yeah, I agree with that. Well, you mentioned a
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bunch of stuff there, So let's go. Let's just go
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through some of the diary entries and how they show
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that he lied. So on February twenty twenty, Fauci in
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his diary says that after he spoke to former CDC
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director Tom Frieden, he believed that COVID nineteen's fatality rate
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was at ero point two two point three percent, not
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two percent, and was simply and this is a quote,
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acting like a bad influenza, so essentially a bad outbreak
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of the flu. So I go and I look to
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see what did he say about this in the month after.
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In March, well less than a month after, he was
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in front of the House Oversight Committee, and Fauci said
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that COVID nineteen was ten times more lethal than the
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seasonal flu. That is a quote which is obviously stoking
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fear to try to implement obedience. Right, So, like you
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mentioned that, he is more guilty. And here's why I
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think he's more guilty. Let's say I'm a mayor. It
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could happen, right, people may vote for me and someone come, yeah,
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thank you, and there's a pandemic outbreak. I know nothing
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about science. I'm not a virologist. I don't know how
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dangerous it is. And someone like Fauci comes to me,
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and what are politicians but the most risk averse people
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on the planet. So someone comes to me and says,
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if you don't shut down your schools, if you don't
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shut down your restaurants, you're going to have thousands of
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deaths on your hand. What am I going to do?
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I'm going to shut them down. That's why I think
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he deserves that kind of you know, scrutiny. But here
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on June eighteen, twenty twenty, he emails a doctor. Is
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it burks or bricks? I forgot what it is. But anyway,
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she was like the second in command, right, no one's
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mad at her. But anyway, he tells her, I have
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been obsessing about the increases in cases that do not
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seem to be related to openings or closings or massive crowds,
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like he himself right says that he is unsure why.
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It's a frustration. He goes on and on, but yeah,
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what does he do? Like weeks later, he goes after
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Ron DeSantis for opposing mask mandates and school lockdowns and
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pushing backs on some of you know, the questionable science
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going on. He doesn't say Facci doesn't say, hey, you
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know it's complicated. Maybe you know, we're just trying to
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do the best we can. No, he shut he was
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for shutting down schools, and like you said, he claimed later,
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like in twenty twenty two, he said that here's another quote,
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twenty twenty two. I should we should realize and have
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realized that there will be, you know, collateral consequences when
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you do something like that, meaning shutting down schools. Then
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he said later in another another interview with The New
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York Times, show me a school that I shut down,
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and show me a factory that I shut down. Never,
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I never did that. But then in these diar entries,
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he takes credit for convincing Bill de Blasio to shut
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down the schools in New York. He takes credit for
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shutting down bars and restaurants in all of California. No
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mention by the way of any negative collateral consequences.
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So do you know the poet that he's like on Twitter?
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He's great. He highlights great poetry from other people named A. M. Juster. No, okay,
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well he's he's a worthy follow on Twitter, but he
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tweeted that today Anthony Fauci testifies before Congress. Fauci has
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a Biden pardon for past acts, but if he lies today,
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he can go to jail. I worked with him. His
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ego drenched world is so detached from reality he will
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probably keep lying. And he says his lawyers should tell
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him to take the fifth and not answer questions. I don't.
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I think the ego issue might come into play because
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he do. You remember when Rand Paul, who is such
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a wonderful senator and I really love him, when he
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had Fauci before him, like five years ago, four years ago,
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Fauci derided him and mocked him in a way that
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the media and other left wing activists just loved. They
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were like Fauci destroyed Rand Paul. Rand Paul would bring
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up factual things and Fauci would usually say something like
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with all due respect, you are completely and utterly, you know,
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just wrong in every way it's possible to be wrong.
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That's ego, kind of the opposite of a Lindsay Graham.
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I think you how he approached proceedings in the Senate,
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and if you have ego issues like that, I do
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wonder if it'll be hard for him to plead the Fifth.
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That also reminds me that brit Hume the other night
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on Special Report, prior to the panel that I was on,
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said that he can't plead the Fifth because of the pardon,
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and I was like, is that true? Because you could
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always get prosecuted for what you're saying in a current moment.
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Right, There is definitely some legal question as to whether
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a person who receives a pardon loses the ability to
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plead the Fifth because the assertion is predicated on shielding
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them from future crimes, and that's not what the Fifth
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Amendment is about. At least that's my understanding. You can't
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immunize yourself from future crimes using the Fifth. I guess
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it's the argument. I'm not a lawyer, so I'm unsure
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how that will work.
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I don't know, certainly, if you say I've been pardoned
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for all of my crimes, my many, many crimes, and
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I'm going to refuse to be transparent with you about
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what those crimes were. That's very bad for his legacy
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as well.
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I think I think taking the fifth is a completely
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legitimate It's not just completely legitimate, it's constitutional right that
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people have and it doesn't automatically mean they're guilty. But
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yet the perception people have when you take the fifth
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is that you're definitely guilty. And in this case, I
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think they'd be right about that, but I don't know
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that that's always the case. You did mention something else
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about how the market you know where the origins of
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COVID nineteen, and there is a diary entry from January
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twenty sixth, twenty twenty where Fauci says, now we know
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the market, by which he means the uh. I think
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it's the sefred market in Wuhan or whatever.
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The web market is, Yeah, the.
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Web market where gross things go on. I have to say,
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some theorized that the virus had jumped from bats to
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humans there, but he says was not the it was
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the amplifier. Now we know it was not the source.
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It was the amplifier. So if anyone said it was
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was not the wet market, that it had come from
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the institute there, and that's a perfectly legitimate theory. They
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were banned from Facebook and so on. But I went
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back and read some of the fact checks of people
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who made that claim, and they were treated like racists
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and idiots, and many of those fact checks went back
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to an interview that Fauci did five months after this
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diary entry where he said it was probably the bats.
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But then I did more research in June twenty twenty one,
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so a year and a half later, he's talking to
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Kara Swisher, that woman on New York Times podcast. So
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I had to get the transcript. I love that the
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headline was America's Chief Immunologists colaps back and he said
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that people who had studied the virus here are the
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words absolutely totally Oh, that the wet market theory was
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absolutely totally compatible with something that evolved from a bat
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virus because of the closeness to it when he was asked,
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so absolutely totally compatible. When he was asked about the
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virus coming from a lab quote, it is a very
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very very very remote possibility. Four varies remote when he
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knew very well that that was not true at all.
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So even the most generous framing of a person who's
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looking at evolving science and all of that, it is
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perfectly clear that he was blatantly misleading the public about
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the origins. And then everyone who said, you know, I
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think Facebook band talking about that. I remember Joe Biden
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said that Facebook was killing people, quote killing people for
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allowing them. Then I remember that the government would lean
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on social media to kind of elevate certain people who
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said things they liked and suppress certain people who didn't.
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Twitter was suspending like tens of thousands of accounts who
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talked about this. And I don't.
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Know well the theory behind the people who were pushing
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for massive lockdowns. I actually just want to step back
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and say, I remember a very early conversation with Marty
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mackrie mckerry. I don't know how to say his last name.
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I always called Marty, who was a contributor at Fox
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and then ended up working for Trump and then getting
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pushed out over some stupid politics. Reason early on in
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the pandemic, he was sounding the alarm very gently because
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it was a difficult environment in which to operate on
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television and otherwise a heavy censorship environment. But he would say,
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you know, Fauci is not handling this the right way.
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He said, there could come a time where you're going
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to want to shut down schools. It's definitely not in
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the spring when the virus has just emerged. It would
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be more like the following spring, or maybe that following fall,
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when you start to have it happening in so many places.
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And he also worried as a public health professional that
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if you shut down schools in the spring at the
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first sign of any problem, that it will lead to
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very bad effects of people not listening to what public
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health officials say when it might matter. He was talking
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about how in the flu of nineteen eighteen there were
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rolling school closures, like as the flu would hit a
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certain area, they would shut down schools, but not like
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all schools across the nation for months at a time.
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So the whole theory behind shutting down the entire global
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economy was that you could contain this virus. I guess
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until you created a vaccine for it. I think that
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might have been the thinking. This is contrary to everything
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we've ever known about the spread of virus. But if
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you said we think we should instead try to do
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what we have always done since we learned how virus
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is spread, which is herd immunity, that the people who
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can handle the virus the most can get it until
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such a time that enough people have it so that
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you can protect the people who really can't get the virus,
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like the really old or sick people you got written
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about in the New York Times and you got banned
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from Facebook and Twitter. Now there is no question that
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the people who thought you could control the spread were
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just They weren't just wrong, they were like as wrong
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as it's possible to be wrong. As I was joking
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about how Fauci might put it, there was nothing there was.
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They should have known early, and even the diary confirms it, right,
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like when Fauci is saying, it doesn't seem like this
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vaccine is keeping people from getting it, which is very
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late in the game, I realized. But they should have
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kind of figured it out much earlier instead of spending
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all their time trying to politically destroy those esteemed epidemiologists
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and others who were saying we should go for herd immunity.
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That's what the scientists behind the Great Barrington declaration did
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Scott Atlas, Jay Boticharia trying to use real science to
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guide public health response and for that they were mocked.
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But you know you have all these diary entries showing
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Alissa Ferra or not diary entries emails between Alissa Farra,
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the left wing so called Republican representative on the view
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saying we're doing our best. I'm doing my best here
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at the White House to destroy Scott Atlas, and I'm
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so sorry that he's critiquing you and Fauci being like,
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how dare people question me? I am the science. Well,
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Scott Atlas was one billion percent correct and Fauci was not.
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And that's the thing I am. I am I represent
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science or whatever he said, Well science, you know, there
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was dissent, and whenever it popped up, like on October fourteen,
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twenty twenty, here's a diary entry after noting that Julia
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Roberts had sent him beautiful flowers, he says, I had
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a long talk with Jared Kushner quote, asking him to
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help in getting rid of Scott Atlas, who was giving
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him a hard time in the herd immunity issue. But
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when there are we already knew that the Great Barrington Declaration,
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by incidentally, is not authored by some novices or anything.
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I mean, you have three people at you know, top
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schools warning that lockdowns are going to have collateral consequences,
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the thing that he worried about in his own diary,
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and he wanted to he plotted to take them down
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and to smear them with the media and other scientists
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and all that. That doesn't seem like the way signs
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should work to me. And so anyway, I think we knew.
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I thought from what I've read of the diers. I
439
00:27:06.440 --> 00:27:08.599
didn't read every single email. I read the highlights, and
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I tried to go through a lot of it. It
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just confirmed and accentuated the things I already believed and
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knew about Fauci. I don't think that. I think we
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knew he was lying to the extent of which he lied.
444
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And incidentally, like when it's the flatten the curve idea
445
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is not new. You don't want everyone to get sick
446
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at the same time it overwhelms hospitals. I get the
447
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thinking behind it, but it wasn't working. And my problem
448
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with my first problem with all this is that he
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simply wouldn't allow anyone to discuss or debate that, which
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would have been very helpful for public policy. That's all, Like,
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that's the first thing. And then we learned later that
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he lied about these things to suppress debate. Then we
453
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learned that he literally suppressed debate by getting people to
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shut you know, companies to shut down decent like those
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are terrible things for a person who is imbued with
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this immense responsibility. Right, So my lesson is, we shouldn't
457
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imbue people with immense responsibility of this nature, Like, we
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should create a system where there are you know, separations
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of power, competing competing voices, so that we can get
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to the best kind of solutions. And another thing, by
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the way, is like he would always smear people who
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like his main problem was he'd smear people who did
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things differently. The United States is huge places have there
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are different infrastructures, There are different kinds of ways people
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interact in different states. Some people are spread out, some
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people are dense. Like having a one size fit to
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all policy seems like a really big mistake when you
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have something like this happen to begin with. Now, I'm
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not an expert on it, but I'm sure other experts
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you know, real experts on this would agree, and yet
471
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he would not allow for that anyway. And how about
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00:29:01.400 --> 00:29:05.039
those entries talking about how famous he is? Here's my
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take on it, Like it is not hyperbole to say
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that today I am the most famous and talked about
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person in the country and one of the most recognizable
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00:29:12.920 --> 00:29:18.559
persons in the world. I you know, I get the
477
00:29:18.599 --> 00:29:20.720
mockery of that, but you know what, he was right.
478
00:29:21.680 --> 00:29:26.079
He was the most famous person and he had a
479
00:29:26.079 --> 00:29:31.519
lot of responsibility and he failed historically. I actually don't
480
00:29:31.599 --> 00:29:33.920
know has the left been out there or his old
481
00:29:33.920 --> 00:29:36.240
defenders are they're still out there defending him, Like, do
482
00:29:36.240 --> 00:29:37.440
you know what's going on with that?
483
00:29:37.559 --> 00:29:39.240
Like I think so. I think the left. I was
484
00:29:39.279 --> 00:29:41.599
thinking about this, how interesting it is that they're still
485
00:29:41.759 --> 00:29:47.119
white nighting for him. I think the Democrats today will
486
00:29:47.200 --> 00:29:51.319
continue to treat him as their lord and savior. And
487
00:29:52.519 --> 00:29:53.240
I could be wrong.
488
00:29:53.319 --> 00:29:55.240
We'll have to see why. Like what, I don't even
489
00:29:55.319 --> 00:30:02.480
understand the I don't understand the what propels them ideologically
490
00:30:02.680 --> 00:30:07.480
or politically to want to do that. I guess because
491
00:30:07.519 --> 00:30:11.680
of climate change and other issues that they pretend are
492
00:30:12.039 --> 00:30:15.000
settled science that they need. They like the top down
493
00:30:15.039 --> 00:30:18.440
control of the economy and stuff, so they don't want
494
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:22.559
to decimate the idea maybe that it should be.
495
00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:28.720
I think that it's interesting that some Americans loved the
496
00:30:28.799 --> 00:30:33.799
government control during COVID times for real. They felt like
497
00:30:33.839 --> 00:30:37.240
it created a moment of unity for them, that they
498
00:30:37.279 --> 00:30:39.759
were at one with the government, that the government was
499
00:30:39.799 --> 00:30:42.119
taking care of them. And then there are people who
500
00:30:42.200 --> 00:30:48.039
think it was a dystopic hellhole. And this explains voting differences.
501
00:30:48.119 --> 00:30:50.880
And so for Democrats, they don't need to care about
502
00:30:51.039 --> 00:30:54.119
the people who didn't love the COVID lockdowns. They just
503
00:30:54.200 --> 00:30:57.599
need to reframe the debate and suggest that somehow, like
504
00:30:57.720 --> 00:31:00.920
I don't know, Donald Trump is to blame for psychological
505
00:31:00.960 --> 00:31:02.599
problems because of the shutdowns.
506
00:31:03.480 --> 00:31:05.519
Yeah, I'm happy you mentioned that. I knew a lot
507
00:31:05.559 --> 00:31:09.720
of kids, including frankly my own, who couldn't go to
508
00:31:09.720 --> 00:31:13.640
school with their friends, couldn't have graduations, whose entire futures
509
00:31:13.759 --> 00:31:18.400
were thrown off course over this thing needlessly. In my view,
510
00:31:19.960 --> 00:31:22.319
I think that that's a big, a big part of
511
00:31:22.640 --> 00:31:24.720
some of the problems we're having today, or at least
512
00:31:24.880 --> 00:31:28.200
part of those problems. I'd like to see other people.
513
00:31:28.519 --> 00:31:30.799
I guess we started this conversation I was talking about
514
00:31:30.799 --> 00:31:32.440
how he wasn't the only one and I'd like to
515
00:31:32.480 --> 00:31:35.200
see some other people dragged up here. For me, it
516
00:31:35.279 --> 00:31:38.319
was very frightening to see that a government, you know,
517
00:31:38.359 --> 00:31:40.920
because we were scared, or people were scared, the government
518
00:31:40.960 --> 00:31:43.559
could be like, yeah, your church is shut down and
519
00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:48.160
without a vote, without even a vote. Should shouldn't allow
520
00:31:48.240 --> 00:31:51.599
something like that to happen, frankly, but just you know,
521
00:31:51.680 --> 00:31:55.039
laterally shutting down, your business, shutting down and all that,
522
00:31:55.240 --> 00:31:59.319
and honestly, not a lot of pushback. It wasn't a
523
00:31:59.359 --> 00:32:01.440
ton of pushback. People were scared, and I get that,
524
00:32:01.559 --> 00:32:04.240
But what happens when we have something that isn't a
525
00:32:04.279 --> 00:32:08.079
point two percent fatality rate, we get something with a
526
00:32:08.160 --> 00:32:12.119
one percent fatality rate? What happens then? You know? So
527
00:32:15.039 --> 00:32:18.920
I hope we don't find out. Remember, it was the
528
00:32:18.960 --> 00:32:20.960
last thing. I was just thinking about the media and
529
00:32:20.599 --> 00:32:23.599
there and their part in this. Like Paul Krugman is
530
00:32:23.640 --> 00:32:28.559
still out there writing. He wrote column after column saying
531
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:31.759
that Ron and by the way, Ron DeSantis's stock has fallen,
532
00:32:31.880 --> 00:32:34.000
he ran against Trump. All everything that's happened since then,
533
00:32:34.039 --> 00:32:35.839
but at the time he was one of the only
534
00:32:35.880 --> 00:32:38.799
people in this country Frankly who stood up to this
535
00:32:38.880 --> 00:32:41.720
kind of tyranny and he was part of a death cult.
536
00:32:41.799 --> 00:32:44.519
Remember that he I think Krugman said that he was
537
00:32:44.559 --> 00:32:49.039
on the side of coronavirus. He was allied with coronavirus. Like,
538
00:32:49.920 --> 00:32:52.079
where's the reckoning for all those people? Why haven't they
539
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:53.559
explained themselves.
540
00:32:54.039 --> 00:32:59.440
I'm not the world's biggest Brian kempfan from Georgia, but
541
00:32:59.519 --> 00:33:02.720
he really also deserves quite a bit of a credit.
542
00:33:06.599 --> 00:33:07.960
All right, Oh, I say.
543
00:33:07.880 --> 00:33:12.599
One more thing about Julia Roberts. It's undulated, but someone
544
00:33:12.720 --> 00:33:17.519
was showing for a video of her doing a zoom
545
00:33:17.559 --> 00:33:22.799
with Anthony Fauci. I understand that Julia Roberts is quite
546
00:33:22.839 --> 00:33:26.880
literally a pretty woman, although I always remember that when
547
00:33:26.920 --> 00:33:28.680
she married Lyle love It, and there were all these
548
00:33:28.720 --> 00:33:30.880
headlines at the time called like Beauty and the Beast.
549
00:33:31.000 --> 00:33:32.960
I did kind of because I thought Lyle love It
550
00:33:33.000 --> 00:33:35.960
was very handsome. I mean, I know he's kind of
551
00:33:36.000 --> 00:33:38.240
weird looking, but I was like, which one's the beauty
552
00:33:38.279 --> 00:33:44.200
and which one's the beast. Anyway, she overacts at the
553
00:33:44.279 --> 00:33:48.480
level of like forty maryl Streeps combined into one person.
554
00:33:49.200 --> 00:33:51.799
And when Anthony she's waiting for Anthony Fauci to show
555
00:33:51.839 --> 00:33:54.000
up on the Zoom, and when he does, she is
556
00:33:54.680 --> 00:34:00.359
like orgasmic with joy and I this doesn't really have
557
00:34:00.359 --> 00:34:03.480
anything to do with public health. But is it just
558
00:34:03.599 --> 00:34:06.200
a function of getting older that you find actors who
559
00:34:06.240 --> 00:34:11.280
can't stop acting annoying beyond belief? Like, I know I
560
00:34:11.360 --> 00:34:14.320
have children in theater. I get that it's a type.
561
00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:17.400
I did theater growing up, But it's just like, could
562
00:34:17.400 --> 00:34:21.119
you just dial it down a few hundred notches and
563
00:34:21.199 --> 00:34:24.840
just be a normal person? And Anne Hathaway does this too.
564
00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:29.079
I would hate to know people like this in real
565
00:34:29.119 --> 00:34:30.960
life who just can't be normal.
566
00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:35.960
Ever, No, I don't know, No, I agree, I don't know.
567
00:34:36.039 --> 00:34:38.920
They don't live a normal life. They're not in a normalcy,
568
00:34:39.039 --> 00:34:42.320
so they can't act normal. I don't know she's a one.
569
00:34:42.480 --> 00:34:45.639
I mean, her acting is always the same. I don't
570
00:34:45.679 --> 00:34:47.960
think she has much range. As far as I can remember,
571
00:34:48.079 --> 00:34:51.639
she's always kind of the same character. But I'm getting
572
00:34:52.400 --> 00:34:54.800
When I was a kid, I'd want to go see
573
00:34:54.800 --> 00:34:56.599
a movie and my dad would be like, no way,
574
00:34:56.639 --> 00:34:59.280
that guy hates America. You know that actor hates America.
575
00:34:59.400 --> 00:35:02.800
Be like, I can't see anything. But I'm getting the
576
00:35:02.800 --> 00:35:06.559
same way, like I cannot go like they're like Mark
577
00:35:06.639 --> 00:35:11.440
Ruffalo or Javier Damn, Like I cannot watch movies like
578
00:35:11.800 --> 00:35:15.159
for people who are pro terrorists. Let's say, I just
579
00:35:15.519 --> 00:35:18.000
there's gonna be a certain level of leftism from every actor.
580
00:35:18.000 --> 00:35:19.280
I get it. But if you're going to be up
581
00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:23.400
there bashing America, I acted, you know, like Julia Roberts,
582
00:35:23.519 --> 00:35:25.639
I can't. I'm not saying she's out there bashing America,
583
00:35:25.679 --> 00:35:28.320
but after this, reading this thing and what you you know,
584
00:35:28.440 --> 00:35:31.800
her Fauci stuff and remembering it, I just I can't
585
00:35:31.840 --> 00:35:36.039
with her. And we'll be to the culture section in
586
00:35:36.079 --> 00:35:38.239
a moment of other things to say about this.
587
00:35:38.599 --> 00:35:40.440
I have thoughts. I was just like, can we talk
588
00:35:40.440 --> 00:35:41.760
about The Odyssey right now?
589
00:35:42.920 --> 00:35:44.440
I didn't see it, so it's gonna be a work
590
00:35:44.960 --> 00:35:45.400
you then, can.
591
00:35:45.320 --> 00:35:47.519
I just say some things? I'll wait to talk in general.
592
00:35:48.559 --> 00:35:54.119
So I love Christopher Nolan. He is easily my favorite
593
00:35:54.159 --> 00:35:58.159
director right now and has been for many years. And
594
00:35:58.360 --> 00:36:00.960
I did not hate The Odyssey or anything like that,
595
00:36:01.599 --> 00:36:04.000
and in fact, there were parts that I enjoyed it.
596
00:36:04.039 --> 00:36:08.159
I did not think it was that great. More than anything,
597
00:36:08.320 --> 00:36:11.440
it was his casting of the film that I found
598
00:36:12.199 --> 00:36:16.559
utterly distracting from whatever story he was trying to tell,
599
00:36:17.760 --> 00:36:23.239
And like Matt Damon was not is not who I
600
00:36:23.280 --> 00:36:27.000
would have cast as Odysseus, but he did great. It
601
00:36:27.079 --> 00:36:34.920
is great. Sure, Lee's thereon perfect in her role. Persephone
602
00:36:35.199 --> 00:36:39.639
and the rest were pretty bad. Not the rest, but
603
00:36:39.719 --> 00:36:45.920
a lot of them were. And yeah, yeah, I'm sorry,
604
00:36:46.480 --> 00:36:49.119
I said Persephone, it's Calypso and I knew that was wrong.
605
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:52.639
Sorry, did you know that that's the root for apocalypse
606
00:36:52.679 --> 00:36:55.320
as well? The same word? Gosh, now I'm gonna forget
607
00:36:55.360 --> 00:36:55.960
what it means.
608
00:36:56.079 --> 00:36:59.639
But yeah, oh interesting, okay.
609
00:37:00.840 --> 00:37:01.760
But the.
610
00:37:03.639 --> 00:37:07.239
Ellen Page, who now goes by Elliott Page, you know,
611
00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:11.800
she just was so distracting her her the hormones that
612
00:37:11.840 --> 00:37:14.559
she's been taking as part of her mental illness that
613
00:37:14.599 --> 00:37:17.119
where she believes she's a man, have destroyed her voice
614
00:37:17.119 --> 00:37:19.639
in a way. And acting involves not just what you
615
00:37:19.679 --> 00:37:22.519
do with your the rest of your body, but also
616
00:37:22.639 --> 00:37:27.039
a big part of it is your voice. Or Helen
617
00:37:27.079 --> 00:37:31.199
of Troy was so bizarrely cast, And I'm like, I
618
00:37:31.280 --> 00:37:34.599
don't really know Lupita Nyango that well, I don't have
619
00:37:35.000 --> 00:37:37.880
I'm not I actually don't have like the world's biggest
620
00:37:37.880 --> 00:37:40.559
problem with we live in a different world and we're
621
00:37:40.559 --> 00:37:42.079
just going to cast people who are the best for
622
00:37:42.119 --> 00:37:44.440
the part, regardless of skin health, and we're just gonna
623
00:37:44.480 --> 00:37:45.559
kind of pretend it's not a big deal.
624
00:37:46.360 --> 00:37:48.280
It's also a mythology in a sense. I mean that
625
00:37:48.400 --> 00:37:50.880
this movie, but you know going. I mean, it's not
626
00:37:50.920 --> 00:37:54.599
a historical epic. There are no Greek gods, and I
627
00:37:54.639 --> 00:37:56.480
think casting a beautiful woman.
628
00:37:56.280 --> 00:38:01.119
Of any itself is a particular choice. You're making a choice,
629
00:38:01.159 --> 00:38:04.159
I'm saying if you if there are ways that you
630
00:38:04.199 --> 00:38:06.519
could have done this where I don't think it would
631
00:38:06.519 --> 00:38:10.079
have been so distracting. The way this was done was
632
00:38:10.199 --> 00:38:15.599
absurd in some cases and really took you away from
633
00:38:15.639 --> 00:38:20.079
the movie. And I think it was the particular actors
634
00:38:20.119 --> 00:38:24.159
themselves just as much as this, like we're gonna put
635
00:38:24.199 --> 00:38:27.039
a trans person in, We're gonna we're gonna make Helen
636
00:38:27.159 --> 00:38:29.519
be not just black, but like the blackest of black.
637
00:38:29.599 --> 00:38:34.480
Like it seemed like it was a low intelligence person
638
00:38:34.559 --> 00:38:38.320
trying to make a point instead of the brilliant director
639
00:38:39.440 --> 00:38:41.199
helping you get lost in a story.
640
00:38:42.159 --> 00:38:46.360
I have not seen this movie. I completely agree that
641
00:38:46.599 --> 00:38:48.320
a lot of times I'm watching a movie and I'm
642
00:38:48.360 --> 00:38:51.719
distracted by the need to put very famous people in
643
00:38:51.800 --> 00:38:55.719
all these roles. In fact, I can't like Zendea or
644
00:38:55.760 --> 00:38:58.239
someone like the cast of this movie is almost like
645
00:38:58.239 --> 00:39:00.639
the cast of the Dune movies, Like can we just
646
00:39:00.760 --> 00:39:03.440
at least vary and mix it? Like do I need
647
00:39:03.480 --> 00:39:06.239
Spider Man in this movie, whether Tom Holland or whatever,
648
00:39:06.360 --> 00:39:07.840
or do I need I'm not even saying they did
649
00:39:07.840 --> 00:39:11.320
a bad job. I don't know, but I agree. Like
650
00:39:11.480 --> 00:39:15.559
I always think of Apocalypto by Mel Gibson. I don't
651
00:39:15.559 --> 00:39:18.920
know if you've ever seen that movie. It's just an
652
00:39:18.960 --> 00:39:25.360
amazing movie, right, just very realistic, seemingly I wasn't there,
653
00:39:25.480 --> 00:39:28.360
but and just well done. And literally there's no one
654
00:39:28.400 --> 00:39:30.559
in there that you know, and it's still amazing. And
655
00:39:30.599 --> 00:39:33.719
sometimes I think casting very famous people in these roles
656
00:39:33.719 --> 00:39:37.519
is distracting. I should not be thinking about casting choices
657
00:39:37.519 --> 00:39:38.320
when I'm watching.
658
00:39:38.119 --> 00:39:39.679
A movie, That's what I'm saying.
659
00:39:39.840 --> 00:39:41.519
I should just be thinking about the story. I should
660
00:39:41.519 --> 00:39:43.320
be immersed in it. I should not be thinking about
661
00:39:43.320 --> 00:39:47.519
the actors and if they're overacting, if they're underacting, I'll notice,
662
00:39:47.760 --> 00:39:51.440
And if they're Oh, look, here's another famous person making
663
00:39:51.480 --> 00:39:54.960
a came here's another famous like it's annoying. I haven't
664
00:39:54.960 --> 00:39:57.800
seen this movie. I'm always four. I just want to
665
00:39:57.840 --> 00:40:02.320
say that I am for big epics, like I want
666
00:40:02.400 --> 00:40:05.119
more big epics. I want them well done, like I
667
00:40:05.119 --> 00:40:08.800
remember Gladiator two is just awful so and had Denzel Washington.
668
00:40:08.840 --> 00:40:10.440
I don't even know how you mess up a movie
669
00:40:10.440 --> 00:40:14.639
with Denzel Washington. But I love big epics about the
670
00:40:14.639 --> 00:40:17.320
ancient world, and I wish we did more of them.
671
00:40:17.800 --> 00:40:22.480
So I'm generally in favor of it. I like Nolan fine,
672
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:24.159
but I don't love him in the way that it
673
00:40:24.280 --> 00:40:27.360
seemingly you do and others do. I think I give
674
00:40:27.440 --> 00:40:29.280
him an a for effort, like he wants to make
675
00:40:29.360 --> 00:40:31.880
smart movies, he wants to make big movies. I like
676
00:40:31.960 --> 00:40:34.519
that about him. It doesn't always work for me, Like
677
00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:40.039
I'm not the biggest Interstellar fan, you know, I'm not.
678
00:40:40.119 --> 00:40:42.679
I think the Batman movies are fine, but they're a
679
00:40:42.719 --> 00:40:48.000
little nihilistic for me, and they're kind of like his
680
00:40:48.079 --> 00:40:49.880
movies don't have a lot of life in them. They
681
00:40:49.960 --> 00:40:53.599
seem very technical a lot of the times. I don't know.
682
00:40:54.519 --> 00:40:56.559
It does seem like he's been maybe on a decline
683
00:40:56.840 --> 00:41:02.960
of sorts and as writers I think we always need editors.
684
00:41:03.400 --> 00:41:06.719
Editors help us, and I think maybe he could use
685
00:41:06.760 --> 00:41:10.159
a little bit more or I was thinking about this
686
00:41:10.199 --> 00:41:12.880
a lot about how when we place limits on ourselves,
687
00:41:12.960 --> 00:41:16.400
we can excel to a greater degree, and maybe he
688
00:41:16.559 --> 00:41:19.519
just needs some artificial limits put on him instead of
689
00:41:19.559 --> 00:41:22.000
everyone just saying, do whatever you want to do, buddy,
690
00:41:22.039 --> 00:41:24.320
you can do no wrong. Well, he can't do wrong.
691
00:41:24.360 --> 00:41:26.880
He's been doing more wrong recently than is appropriate for
692
00:41:26.920 --> 00:41:29.679
a director of his stature. So maybe someone coming in
693
00:41:29.719 --> 00:41:32.920
and saying, yeah, no, I mean, on the other hand,
694
00:41:32.960 --> 00:41:34.719
he'll make a ton of money and that's all that hints.
695
00:41:35.000 --> 00:41:37.079
Yeah. I think once you're at the success level he's
696
00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:39.239
that no one can tell you to stop. Like. I
697
00:41:39.280 --> 00:41:42.000
did not like Tenant, I didn't think it was cohesive,
698
00:41:43.000 --> 00:41:47.840
but I did love Dunkirk Oppenheimer. My problem with Oppenheimer
699
00:41:47.880 --> 00:41:49.599
is that he was a Soviet spy, and I don't
700
00:41:49.679 --> 00:41:54.920
like the whitewashing of that history at all. But yeah,
701
00:41:55.719 --> 00:41:56.719
very well made movie.
702
00:41:56.760 --> 00:42:00.519
I thought, I promise that I wanted to keep saying
703
00:42:00.559 --> 00:42:04.519
too much, but I will also say that the movie
704
00:42:04.599 --> 00:42:08.719
The Odyssey, I think if you appreciate it as something
705
00:42:09.119 --> 00:42:15.960
with only the loosest connection to this actual story helps.
706
00:42:16.360 --> 00:42:19.079
It's sort of like you took characters and you took
707
00:42:19.159 --> 00:42:22.400
the same things that happened to them, and then you
708
00:42:22.519 --> 00:42:29.360
derived a dramatically contrary meaning, which is I don't again,
709
00:42:29.360 --> 00:42:31.559
I don't have like a I'm not saying you can't
710
00:42:31.599 --> 00:42:35.719
do that to stories. You can. It's just kind of weird.
711
00:42:36.719 --> 00:42:38.320
You can't. I didn't see it, So I can't believe
712
00:42:38.360 --> 00:42:42.039
I'm having this conversation. But you cannot. You cannot end
713
00:42:43.400 --> 00:42:46.719
your version of the twenty twenty six The Odyssey movie
714
00:42:47.519 --> 00:42:50.599
with the with the massacre of the suitors and the
715
00:42:50.639 --> 00:42:55.159
hanging of the maidens. Yeah, you just can't. That's it's
716
00:42:55.239 --> 00:42:59.239
not I mean, you can, but I would have done it.
717
00:42:59.239 --> 00:43:06.280
It's true home the It's a pro I mean again,
718
00:43:07.119 --> 00:43:10.400
I'm not some literary expert at all, but I know
719
00:43:10.840 --> 00:43:13.199
that the ancient Greeks did not view the world in
720
00:43:13.239 --> 00:43:16.760
the same way modern our modern Christian sensibilities, and that's
721
00:43:17.000 --> 00:43:21.079
exactly what we have, even when we're secular, would have viewed,
722
00:43:21.199 --> 00:43:26.280
would have viewed war and murder and executions and women
723
00:43:26.599 --> 00:43:28.440
in the way that we do. So you make a
724
00:43:28.480 --> 00:43:32.480
movie that appeals to the people's moral compass today, right,
725
00:43:33.519 --> 00:43:36.960
I think you're right. Probably. I mean I've written even
726
00:43:37.000 --> 00:43:38.400
when I was at the Federalist. I think I wrote
727
00:43:38.440 --> 00:43:41.159
numerous times that I was begging Mel Gibson to make
728
00:43:41.159 --> 00:43:43.320
a MacCabe movie because he's the only person who could
729
00:43:43.360 --> 00:43:48.639
fix Hankkah for us. You know from this BORI yes,
730
00:43:48.800 --> 00:43:53.039
sanitized lighting the Canal's version to one of the incredibly
731
00:43:53.320 --> 00:43:56.360
you know, important events I think in religious history and
732
00:43:56.519 --> 00:44:00.320
history itself. But anyway, I know I haven't been else
733
00:44:00.480 --> 00:44:02.320
because I've been working on a booke and I just
734
00:44:03.119 --> 00:44:08.079
haven't found the time, but I will. Okay, it's funny
735
00:44:08.079 --> 00:44:10.159
I say I haven't found the time, But my culturalist
736
00:44:10.280 --> 00:44:12.320
is not short, so I guess I've just been watching
737
00:44:12.320 --> 00:44:15.840
things at home when I can. Do we have anything else? Politically?
738
00:44:15.880 --> 00:44:17.920
What are we doing? Well?
739
00:44:18.079 --> 00:44:19.760
Did you want to talk about Lindsay Graham at all?
740
00:44:20.480 --> 00:44:22.440
I think we mentioned we talked about him last week
741
00:44:22.480 --> 00:44:23.039
a bit, then we.
742
00:44:23.119 --> 00:44:24.119
Two weeks ago. Maybe.
743
00:44:24.280 --> 00:44:27.039
Yeah, it was nice to see everyone show up to
744
00:44:27.039 --> 00:44:30.719
his funeral again. Character I think will miss people like that.
745
00:44:30.760 --> 00:44:34.440
He wasn't so you never felt like he was reading
746
00:44:34.480 --> 00:44:37.360
talking points, and I really admire that in almost any politician,
747
00:44:39.039 --> 00:44:41.320
and he was funny, and I admire that in people
748
00:44:41.360 --> 00:44:43.960
as well. So it's say not to see him go.
749
00:44:48.400 --> 00:44:48.960
Said one of the.
750
00:44:49.000 --> 00:44:52.760
Things about him, which is I think he did a
751
00:44:52.760 --> 00:44:57.239
good job of someone. Someone at the funeral or at
752
00:44:57.239 --> 00:45:00.320
the remarks before the funeral, I don't remember. I was
753
00:45:00.360 --> 00:45:05.440
like JD. Vance or Trump or someone else said he
754
00:45:07.119 --> 00:45:13.960
was serious but didn't take himself too seriously. The generosity
755
00:45:13.960 --> 00:45:16.159
that he showed, the lack of ego, I would say,
756
00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:22.159
is remarkable for a Washington d C. Politician. He really
757
00:45:22.280 --> 00:45:24.440
was in it for love of the game. And I
758
00:45:24.480 --> 00:45:27.480
think it's kind of weird that the game for him
759
00:45:27.639 --> 00:45:29.760
was like go to war with every country on earth.
760
00:45:30.119 --> 00:45:34.079
That you might quibble with what the wisdom of that,
761
00:45:34.239 --> 00:45:37.519
But he was not one of these people who enriched
762
00:45:37.599 --> 00:45:42.400
himself or abused his power in a way. In that way,
763
00:45:42.519 --> 00:45:44.719
you know, like so many people go to the Senate
764
00:45:44.800 --> 00:45:48.639
kind of poor and leave extremely wealthy men. He was
765
00:45:48.719 --> 00:45:49.599
not doing that.
766
00:45:49.800 --> 00:45:51.719
He seemed to enjoy his job. That's hard for me
767
00:45:51.840 --> 00:45:55.280
to contemplate enjoying in Washington, but he seemed to enjoy
768
00:45:55.320 --> 00:45:58.639
it and all that. I don't think he wanted to
769
00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:01.320
go to war with every country. I think he had
770
00:46:01.360 --> 00:46:03.679
a true neo conservative view of the world in the
771
00:46:03.719 --> 00:46:05.880
sense that he believed America was a force for good
772
00:46:05.920 --> 00:46:10.599
and should implement good elsewhere, which I think sometimes can
773
00:46:10.639 --> 00:46:13.920
work in certain ways, but sometimes can be a devastating failure.
774
00:46:14.039 --> 00:46:16.440
And I don't think he really grappled enough with that.
775
00:46:16.440 --> 00:46:19.440
That's my only real knit to pick with him in general,
776
00:46:19.760 --> 00:46:22.119
because he was pretty fiscally conservative. I wouldn't call him
777
00:46:22.119 --> 00:46:25.119
like libertarian or anything on that, but he was very
778
00:46:25.119 --> 00:46:28.039
pro life, as you've mentioned, I saw online as well.
779
00:46:28.280 --> 00:46:30.920
I think that legacy is underplayed by a lot of people.
780
00:46:31.840 --> 00:46:33.880
And it seemed like a good guy anyway, And most
781
00:46:33.960 --> 00:46:35.840
senators don't seem like good people to me in the
782
00:46:35.880 --> 00:46:37.800
sense of people i'd want to ever meet or hang
783
00:46:37.840 --> 00:46:39.360
out with. He seemed like one of the few people
784
00:46:39.360 --> 00:46:40.639
that I would want to hang out with.
785
00:46:42.000 --> 00:46:45.440
Yeah, I do worry about the lack of leadership on
786
00:46:45.559 --> 00:46:48.760
pro life issues with his absence. He was willing to
787
00:46:48.800 --> 00:46:51.159
do things that very few other senators were willing to
788
00:46:51.199 --> 00:46:56.000
do to push the agenda forward when a lot of
789
00:46:56.000 --> 00:46:59.760
these senators are very cowardly and weak on social conservative
790
00:46:59.760 --> 00:47:02.360
issue and he was much better.
791
00:47:02.599 --> 00:47:04.440
Maybe this is a topic for another time, but it
792
00:47:04.519 --> 00:47:08.559
is interesting that the fight for Roe really to overturn
793
00:47:08.679 --> 00:47:11.719
Row really focused the pro life movement in a way,
794
00:47:11.760 --> 00:47:14.960
I think they've lost some of their focus. I don't
795
00:47:15.519 --> 00:47:17.920
it's no longer I'm not saying it's no longer a
796
00:47:18.000 --> 00:47:20.599
national issue of importance. I'm saying that there are many
797
00:47:20.639 --> 00:47:23.079
local fights that have to be had and I just don't.
798
00:47:24.119 --> 00:47:26.519
Maybe I'm not that plugged in, but it just doesn't
799
00:47:26.519 --> 00:47:30.159
seem like the energy is there anymore. In the same way,
800
00:47:30.280 --> 00:47:32.920
it seems like they've that a lot of people have
801
00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:35.719
lost their appetite for that fight, at least in the
802
00:47:35.719 --> 00:47:36.840
political sense.
803
00:47:37.239 --> 00:47:39.679
I think a huge issue is that the way people
804
00:47:39.760 --> 00:47:44.880
are that the two big life issues are very different
805
00:47:44.920 --> 00:47:46.800
than what they were even a few years ago and
806
00:47:46.880 --> 00:47:53.280
extremely difficult to combat. So number one is like mail
807
00:47:53.480 --> 00:48:01.119
order abortions, where it's happening in suchwigh or can like
808
00:48:01.159 --> 00:48:04.719
even happen in states that have protected certain unborn children.
809
00:48:05.639 --> 00:48:08.960
That is difficult to tackle, and then you have a
810
00:48:09.000 --> 00:48:12.599
the Trump administration having zero desire to tackle it right now.
811
00:48:13.400 --> 00:48:18.320
And then the other thing being like surrogacy IBF related issues.
812
00:48:18.679 --> 00:48:22.360
The number of children created through IBF is something nobody
813
00:48:22.440 --> 00:48:26.719
wants to think about. So, like grandparents will be like, oh,
814
00:48:26.800 --> 00:48:31.519
my daughter's having trouble conceiving, there's this magical solution IBF,
815
00:48:31.760 --> 00:48:33.559
and then they don't want to think about what that
816
00:48:33.639 --> 00:48:41.760
actually means and how technological interventions have trade offs or downsides,
817
00:48:42.119 --> 00:48:44.320
and they're just like and then she had little Emily,
818
00:48:44.360 --> 00:48:46.840
and Emily's great, and I don't want to think about
819
00:48:46.840 --> 00:48:51.960
the eighteen other embryos that were created. Or on another hand,
820
00:48:52.000 --> 00:48:55.760
it'll be like, oh, my son is gay, which means
821
00:48:55.800 --> 00:48:58.760
I won't have any children. Oh, he can pay a
822
00:48:58.800 --> 00:49:01.719
woman in India to have a baby, so I still
823
00:49:01.760 --> 00:49:04.360
get to be a grandparent. And so the people who
824
00:49:04.400 --> 00:49:09.039
desperately want the children or even their extended families don't
825
00:49:09.039 --> 00:49:12.719
really want to think about what they're doing to commodify
826
00:49:13.559 --> 00:49:17.920
human beings. You know, you think about like, oh, how
827
00:49:17.920 --> 00:49:20.239
would have I been during slavery times whatever, And we're
828
00:49:20.239 --> 00:49:22.039
always like, we would be on the right side, we
829
00:49:22.079 --> 00:49:25.079
would say slavery was wrong, but clearly like millions of
830
00:49:25.079 --> 00:49:29.039
people participated in it, even if they weren't participating directly.
831
00:49:29.440 --> 00:49:31.920
And I think we should always be challenging ourselves at
832
00:49:31.960 --> 00:49:34.119
all times to think through how are what we doing
833
00:49:34.360 --> 00:49:37.360
right now? How are we honoring life? How are we
834
00:49:37.440 --> 00:49:39.719
protecting human life? But it does make it for a
835
00:49:39.840 --> 00:49:42.920
much more challenging environment for the pro life movement.
836
00:49:43.039 --> 00:49:46.480
Yes, I the second part of that, I have never
837
00:49:46.519 --> 00:49:50.039
really thought through completely, and I'm embarrassed to say I should.
838
00:49:50.119 --> 00:49:52.920
I don't really know where my feelings are exactly on
839
00:49:53.000 --> 00:49:56.679
all of that. But anyway, I don't know how we
840
00:49:56.719 --> 00:49:58.440
got here and how we're going to get back to
841
00:49:58.760 --> 00:50:00.360
what we're going to talk about. Oh, I was just
842
00:50:00.400 --> 00:50:03.280
gonna mention Mitch McConnell's been out. He's very old, and
843
00:50:03.320 --> 00:50:06.480
I know that a lot of people are critics of
844
00:50:06.639 --> 00:50:10.920
the geriatric senate we have and house. Frankly, I don't
845
00:50:10.920 --> 00:50:13.079
know a lot of really old people there, and I
846
00:50:13.119 --> 00:50:15.760
am not as angry about that because I don't have
847
00:50:15.840 --> 00:50:20.719
There's no I have no evidence that younger legislators are
848
00:50:20.760 --> 00:50:23.760
any better than older legislators. In fact, most of them,
849
00:50:23.920 --> 00:50:26.280
to me, are are worse in many ways. But I
850
00:50:26.280 --> 00:50:29.000
think there comes a time where you can't perform your
851
00:50:29.320 --> 00:50:32.639
you can do your duties, you shouldn't be there. But
852
00:50:32.719 --> 00:50:34.800
more than that, I don't understand why you'd want to
853
00:50:34.840 --> 00:50:37.599
be there. Don't you have grandchildren. Don't you have a life.
854
00:50:37.639 --> 00:50:40.800
You're in your eighties, you're not middle aged. You will
855
00:50:40.840 --> 00:50:43.800
be dead soon. That's just how it works. Like leave,
856
00:50:44.039 --> 00:50:45.239
we don't need you there.
857
00:50:45.559 --> 00:50:47.239
I will say, the Senate has got to be the
858
00:50:47.280 --> 00:50:50.679
cushiest job on the planet. They work probably in the
859
00:50:50.800 --> 00:50:52.480
average of half a day a year.
860
00:50:53.639 --> 00:50:55.880
I mean, why do you even want a job at all?
861
00:50:56.039 --> 00:50:58.920
Sorry, half a day a week. You know, they're barely
862
00:50:59.039 --> 00:51:01.400
even when they're in sech and they're rarely in session
863
00:51:02.440 --> 00:51:05.519
or real session. They're only there for a few hours
864
00:51:05.519 --> 00:51:07.920
and then they go home. And he lives. He doesn't
865
00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:11.440
live in Kentucky. He lives on Capitol Hill. So what
866
00:51:11.480 --> 00:51:15.480
would retirement mean other than he lost his stature and
867
00:51:15.000 --> 00:51:19.880
he's definitely in it for like he was born to
868
00:51:19.880 --> 00:51:22.119
be a senator. That's all he's ever wanted. He doesn't
869
00:51:22.159 --> 00:51:24.400
have kids, he doesn't have grandkids.
870
00:51:26.800 --> 00:51:29.719
I have not as many problems with him as you do.
871
00:51:29.800 --> 00:51:32.559
In general. I'm just speaking in general. I don't understand
872
00:51:32.559 --> 00:51:34.679
why people have to be wheeled out of that place.
873
00:51:36.840 --> 00:51:39.880
It's funny, as you know. I'm not big on small
874
00:51:39.920 --> 00:51:42.840
d democracy. I think we too often turn to politics
875
00:51:42.920 --> 00:51:49.679
rather than communal societal solutions to fix things. But when
876
00:51:49.719 --> 00:51:56.039
people do vote, I oppose most limitations on that. I
877
00:51:56.039 --> 00:51:57.719
think if you want to vote for an old guy
878
00:51:57.719 --> 00:52:00.320
because he's doing a good job or old woman because
879
00:52:00.360 --> 00:52:02.000
she's doing a good job, you should be able to
880
00:52:02.039 --> 00:52:06.000
do so. So I don't really like placing limits on voting.
881
00:52:07.079 --> 00:52:09.280
I would just like to defend myself again here that
882
00:52:09.840 --> 00:52:13.599
I interview him for my books and for other things,
883
00:52:13.760 --> 00:52:20.400
and after my last book Alito, he thanked me for
884
00:52:20.559 --> 00:52:24.960
my treatment of him. So you always make a point
885
00:52:24.960 --> 00:52:28.679
that I don't like him, but he felt I treated
886
00:52:28.719 --> 00:52:29.480
him very fairly.
887
00:52:31.039 --> 00:52:33.079
When I say you don't like him, I don't mean
888
00:52:33.119 --> 00:52:34.920
in a personal way, a because I don't know what
889
00:52:34.960 --> 00:52:37.599
your personal feelings are about it, and I think I.
890
00:52:37.599 --> 00:52:40.239
Have conflicted feelings about him job he does, and.
891
00:52:40.199 --> 00:52:44.159
I'm just saying I've been quite critical of him, but also.
892
00:52:43.920 --> 00:52:47.599
I can be quite I probably quoted him more than
893
00:52:47.639 --> 00:52:51.079
any other person in Alito, because he and his staff
894
00:52:51.119 --> 00:52:54.199
do a great job of talking about those issues. So okay,
895
00:52:54.239 --> 00:52:55.400
moving on, do.
896
00:52:55.400 --> 00:53:00.960
You want to do culture? I wanted to quickly mention
897
00:53:01.679 --> 00:53:04.719
it's been weeks now, so I don't remember exactly why
898
00:53:04.760 --> 00:53:07.840
I hated this movie that I watched that you like.
899
00:53:08.039 --> 00:53:13.239
The Sheep Detective was Oh, how dare you? It was?
900
00:53:13.280 --> 00:53:13.440
Aw?
901
00:53:14.000 --> 00:53:14.320
Don't you do?
902
00:53:14.440 --> 00:53:17.119
Not listen to David Harsani if he criticizes this film,
903
00:53:17.119 --> 00:53:19.480
this is the best film of twenty twenty six.
904
00:53:19.599 --> 00:53:23.760
Go on. Honestly, I can't remember why I didn't like it,
905
00:53:23.800 --> 00:53:25.719
but I had some reasons. I should take notes. I
906
00:53:25.760 --> 00:53:29.119
always think I'm going to remember these things, but I'm
907
00:53:29.119 --> 00:53:32.159
getting older. I did not like it. I found it.
908
00:53:32.199 --> 00:53:35.400
I think I found it boring and I don't think
909
00:53:35.440 --> 00:53:36.320
I found it funny.
910
00:53:36.480 --> 00:53:37.960
Do you think you watched a different film.
911
00:53:38.440 --> 00:53:41.440
No, it's one with the Australian guy Hugh Jackman.
912
00:53:41.599 --> 00:53:44.960
Jackman playing a shepherd who gets murdered and the crime
913
00:53:45.079 --> 00:53:48.000
is solved by the sheep that he took care of.
914
00:53:49.239 --> 00:53:52.159
Your description is ridiculed, makes it sound ridiculous.
915
00:53:54.440 --> 00:53:55.880
It's like an all star cast.
916
00:53:56.880 --> 00:53:57.920
Yeah, it's a good cast.
917
00:53:58.639 --> 00:54:01.679
The sheep are hilarious. I when I was on my
918
00:54:02.000 --> 00:54:06.800
Rhyan River cruise. On my river cruise, we were sailing
919
00:54:06.840 --> 00:54:08.840
down the Rhine and there were there was a herd
920
00:54:08.840 --> 00:54:14.519
of sheep and there was a winter sheep with the
921
00:54:14.559 --> 00:54:16.800
other sheep, and I was like, I just love that
922
00:54:16.880 --> 00:54:17.800
movie so much.
923
00:54:18.079 --> 00:54:19.360
I might have to say the.
924
00:54:19.280 --> 00:54:21.920
First person to say, because I've been making everybody go
925
00:54:21.960 --> 00:54:24.039
see it, you are literally the first person to say
926
00:54:24.079 --> 00:54:24.719
you don't like it.
927
00:54:26.079 --> 00:54:27.760
I think it was more than just not liking it.
928
00:54:27.760 --> 00:54:31.360
I think I like Really, I think it annoyed me.
929
00:54:32.119 --> 00:54:35.119
But I did learn what a winter sheep is, so
930
00:54:35.239 --> 00:54:38.400
that was a plus. Do you want me to go
931
00:54:38.440 --> 00:54:39.880
through it and then we'll go through your stuff or
932
00:54:39.880 --> 00:54:40.880
do you want to go back and forth?
933
00:54:41.119 --> 00:54:42.480
We just want to hear more about why you don't
934
00:54:42.519 --> 00:54:43.719
like Detective.
935
00:54:44.199 --> 00:54:45.679
I think it was boring. I found it boring, and
936
00:54:45.679 --> 00:54:52.239
I didn't think it was funny or charming. Really, I
937
00:54:52.280 --> 00:54:53.840
don't know. I guess I might be the only one.
938
00:54:53.880 --> 00:54:57.639
I don't you know what letter writers should. If I'm wrong,
939
00:54:57.880 --> 00:55:00.679
let's send the emails. Maybe I'll rewatch it, though I
940
00:55:00.719 --> 00:55:04.480
don't really want to do that. Oh what else did
941
00:55:04.519 --> 00:55:08.280
I do? Oh? I watched a documentary on Netflix about
942
00:55:08.320 --> 00:55:10.920
Hulk Hogan in his life, which was I thought was
943
00:55:10.960 --> 00:55:13.280
pretty interesting the first half. At least the second half
944
00:55:13.360 --> 00:55:15.320
I lived through, so I don't need that, but the
945
00:55:15.360 --> 00:55:19.920
first half about his upbringing his life was pretty interesting.
946
00:55:22.679 --> 00:55:25.519
On that note, I want to say that when we
947
00:55:25.519 --> 00:55:30.079
were struggling to understand the Trump phenomenon in twenty fifteen
948
00:55:31.320 --> 00:55:35.000
and thereabouts, I just remember Hanspieney, one of our writers
949
00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:38.800
at the Federalist, writing things and putting it all in
950
00:55:38.880 --> 00:55:42.880
perspective of wrestling, and it gave me a big appreciation
951
00:55:43.119 --> 00:55:47.920
for the subtle art form of professional wrestling.
952
00:55:50.840 --> 00:55:54.599
Well, let me tell you something in I have it
953
00:55:54.639 --> 00:55:58.679
right in front of me. February thirteen, twenty sixteen, the
954
00:55:58.719 --> 00:56:03.039
Federalist David Harse wrote a piece why debating Donald Trump
955
00:56:03.119 --> 00:56:07.440
is like fighting Thunderlips, and it's all about Rocky three
956
00:56:08.159 --> 00:56:11.000
and the opening scene in Rocky three where Hull Cogan
957
00:56:11.000 --> 00:56:17.119
plays Thunderlips fights fights Rocky. So in this one, this
958
00:56:17.239 --> 00:56:18.840
was the big debate. I don't know if it was coming.
959
00:56:18.840 --> 00:56:20.760
I don't know if you remember where Marco Rubio was
960
00:56:20.800 --> 00:56:23.880
going to take on Donald Trump. And I predicted correctly
961
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:27.079
that this was not going to work. And my thesis
962
00:56:27.280 --> 00:56:31.760
is Thunderlips does not play by the rules that you
963
00:56:31.840 --> 00:56:35.559
understand as a boxer. Marco Ruby was boxing and he
964
00:56:35.679 --> 00:56:37.800
was using the old rules, the rules of boxing, and
965
00:56:37.880 --> 00:56:40.159
Thunderlips would just pick him up and throw him out
966
00:56:40.199 --> 00:56:43.039
of the rink like ring, he did not care about
967
00:56:43.079 --> 00:56:49.360
your rules, and so I too used professional rules.
968
00:56:49.440 --> 00:56:53.800
For giving you the appropriate It's okay, And.
969
00:56:53.719 --> 00:56:56.960
It turned out that way because Ruby at the time.
970
00:56:57.039 --> 00:57:00.320
Now everyone plays why different, Everyone's playing by Donald Trump's rules,
971
00:57:00.360 --> 00:57:03.639
I think. But yeah, I mean, you know, I was.
972
00:57:04.119 --> 00:57:06.880
I grew up at the time where wrestling really blew
973
00:57:06.960 --> 00:57:12.599
up and Hulk Cogan was this huge phenomenon, and you know,
974
00:57:12.679 --> 00:57:14.559
I remember going to see Rocky three as a kid
975
00:57:14.559 --> 00:57:19.360
and all of that. So then I watched this movie
976
00:57:19.679 --> 00:57:22.119
called There is this actor in the eighties. His name
977
00:57:22.159 --> 00:57:26.599
was William Peterson. I think he was around later, like
978
00:57:26.719 --> 00:57:30.719
in CSI or one of those shows that I haven't watched,
979
00:57:31.079 --> 00:57:32.719
But he was in a movie called Manhunter. Have you
980
00:57:32.760 --> 00:57:36.920
ever seen this movie? No? It was directed by Michael Mann,
981
00:57:36.960 --> 00:57:41.079
who did like Heat and I loved Last of the
982
00:57:41.079 --> 00:57:45.079
Mohicans and movies like that. This was the first movie
983
00:57:45.199 --> 00:57:49.719
with Hannibal Lecter. It's kind of like a prequel to
984
00:57:49.719 --> 00:57:52.880
Silence of the Lambs, but it's not really in a way.
985
00:57:53.159 --> 00:57:56.800
It's the same universe, I guess, and it is a
986
00:57:56.840 --> 00:57:59.679
great movie man Hunter. I would say better. I like
987
00:57:59.719 --> 00:58:03.039
it better than Silence of the Lambs. Great movie has
988
00:58:03.039 --> 00:58:09.280
that Michaelman kind of shiny eighties aesthetic which used in Miami,
989
00:58:09.360 --> 00:58:11.400
Vice and elsewhere. So then I'm like, oh, this William
990
00:58:11.400 --> 00:58:13.440
Peterson guy who stars in that movie is really good.
991
00:58:13.519 --> 00:58:16.119
I'm going to rewatch a movie I haven't seen in decades,
992
00:58:16.199 --> 00:58:19.480
to Live and Die in La So I watched that.
993
00:58:20.679 --> 00:58:23.119
That's a Freakin movie, William Friedkin movie.
994
00:58:23.320 --> 00:58:24.800
Oh yeah, I love William Freakin.
995
00:58:26.239 --> 00:58:31.159
So I liked it. Okay, it wasn't as good as
996
00:58:31.159 --> 00:58:32.599
I thought it would be. I would say it's one
997
00:58:32.639 --> 00:58:36.199
of Freakin's lesser movies. At least he had some I
998
00:58:36.239 --> 00:58:39.320
think even lesser ones moving forward. But anyway, that was
999
00:58:39.360 --> 00:58:41.599
somewhat of a disappointment. But it was okay. And then
1000
00:58:41.639 --> 00:58:44.519
because I watched that, then I watched I rewatched The
1001
00:58:44.559 --> 00:58:50.000
French Connection, which I love with Gene Hackman. Oh you
1002
00:58:50.039 --> 00:58:52.000
know what we forgot to talk about, Molly. I forgot
1003
00:58:52.039 --> 00:58:55.920
to mention is Ross Dothat has been reportedly hired by
1004
00:58:56.039 --> 00:59:00.400
sixty Minutes, the New York Times columnist. I think before that, maybe,
1005
00:59:00.559 --> 00:59:03.960
I mean, I know he writes for National Review movie reviews.
1006
00:59:04.039 --> 00:59:06.360
I forget where he worked before that, but he's been
1007
00:59:06.400 --> 00:59:10.159
at The New York Times for years. I would say
1008
00:59:11.400 --> 00:59:18.760
a thoughtful commentator, social conservative. I wouldn't call him a
1009
00:59:18.840 --> 00:59:22.599
Trump fan at all, but but he's definitely on the
1010
00:59:24.039 --> 00:59:27.760
paleo side of things more than the Reaganite side of things.
1011
00:59:27.800 --> 00:59:32.719
Would you say he wrote a book with Didn't he
1012
00:59:32.719 --> 00:59:34.800
write a book Mike confusing him with someone? Didn't he
1013
00:59:34.840 --> 00:59:40.360
write something with Ryhan Slam about sort of populist conservatism?
1014
00:59:41.119 --> 00:59:45.639
Do you remember before Trump came around, there was this
1015
00:59:45.719 --> 00:59:51.960
kind of big government conservative movement driven by social conservatives
1016
00:59:52.000 --> 00:59:55.000
called compassionate Conservatism. I think he was part of that.
1017
00:59:56.079 --> 00:59:59.760
Yeah, he wrote a book with Ryhan called Grand New Party,
1018
01:00:00.079 --> 01:00:03.559
How Republicans Can Win the Working Class, And it was
1019
01:00:03.599 --> 01:00:07.079
all about moving beyond the Reagan legacy to focus more
1020
01:00:07.119 --> 01:00:10.000
on things that would get voters, working class voters to
1021
01:00:10.079 --> 01:00:11.199
vote Republicans.
1022
01:00:12.840 --> 01:00:16.599
So listen, I have nothing I don't I don't agree
1023
01:00:16.599 --> 01:00:18.480
with him on a lot of things that I read,
1024
01:00:18.559 --> 01:00:21.800
But I think he's a thoughtful a guy. He's a
1025
01:00:21.800 --> 01:00:25.440
good interviewer, a decent higher though. I don't know what
1026
01:00:25.440 --> 01:00:25.880
do you think?
1027
01:00:26.400 --> 01:00:29.719
I think it's just huge for sixty minutes, which is
1028
01:00:29.760 --> 01:00:34.239
a horrifically bad Left wing propaganda show that Barry Weise
1029
01:00:34.440 --> 01:00:40.519
is trying to improve somewhat. So for her, it's a
1030
01:00:40.599 --> 01:00:44.519
huge coup, and it's a huge loss for the New
1031
01:00:44.599 --> 01:00:48.280
York Times. This means they so they have zero people
1032
01:00:48.320 --> 01:00:52.119
working at that publication who voted for Trump, and they
1033
01:00:52.159 --> 01:00:56.679
did also have zero people before Ross left. I'm pretty
1034
01:00:56.679 --> 01:00:59.280
sure he didn't vote for Trump. This is a scandal,
1035
01:00:59.360 --> 01:01:04.079
it's a joke. It's a complete, like disaster what American
1036
01:01:04.119 --> 01:01:08.639
media are like these days. But Ross is wonderful. He's
1037
01:01:08.639 --> 01:01:12.480
a great interviewer. He has a podcast he does like
1038
01:01:12.519 --> 01:01:16.079
a podcast interview and he's just thoughtful. He'll interview people
1039
01:01:16.079 --> 01:01:20.280
that he completely disagrees with. And sometimes I'll see people
1040
01:01:20.360 --> 01:01:22.320
take clips from his show and they'll be like, oh,
1041
01:01:22.519 --> 01:01:25.480
Ross destroyed this person, and I'll watch and I'm like,
1042
01:01:25.800 --> 01:01:29.000
no one was destroyed. It was actually great. You might
1043
01:01:29.079 --> 01:01:31.599
disagree with the person he has on or you might
1044
01:01:31.639 --> 01:01:36.119
disagree with Ross, but just having nice conversations where people
1045
01:01:36.159 --> 01:01:38.320
are able to say I believe this, and oh, well
1046
01:01:38.360 --> 01:01:41.320
have you explored the contour of your position? Oh well,
1047
01:01:41.360 --> 01:01:43.239
here's my answer to that. You know, it doesn't have
1048
01:01:43.320 --> 01:01:46.440
to be combative, but it's still very interesting. He asks
1049
01:01:46.559 --> 01:01:49.280
really good questions and he's open minded, So I think
1050
01:01:49.320 --> 01:01:52.840
he's great. And I also think that The New York
1051
01:01:52.920 --> 01:01:57.199
Times should hire as his replacement someone. This is my
1052
01:01:58.239 --> 01:02:03.239
crazy idea, hear me out here in a country where
1053
01:02:03.280 --> 01:02:06.320
Donald Trump has been elected twice. I think the New
1054
01:02:06.400 --> 01:02:09.519
York Times should try to find someone who voted for
1055
01:02:09.639 --> 01:02:12.679
Trump to join their editorial page. And I have an
1056
01:02:12.679 --> 01:02:15.199
idea on who these people might be. Oh do you
1057
01:02:15.719 --> 01:02:19.360
I actually don't know how these people voted, but I
1058
01:02:19.360 --> 01:02:24.440
suspect okay, or at least yeah, Dan McCarthy, I think
1059
01:02:24.480 --> 01:02:27.880
would be a brilliant replacement. He already writes for The
1060
01:02:27.920 --> 01:02:30.480
Times a lot, and you know how they'll do the
1061
01:02:30.559 --> 01:02:33.400
scatterplot of you know, how did Donald Trump do in
1062
01:02:33.480 --> 01:02:37.159
this speech or whatever. Every single person will be clustered together,
1063
01:02:37.599 --> 01:02:41.159
sometimes including Ross, and then Dan will be like way
1064
01:02:41.199 --> 01:02:43.159
out and be like I thought this was great, or
1065
01:02:43.199 --> 01:02:46.360
you know, vice versa. He's an independent thinker who has
1066
01:02:46.360 --> 01:02:49.199
the courage to say things that are true even when
1067
01:02:49.280 --> 01:02:54.880
everybody in his intellectual milieu is saying otherwise. And he's
1068
01:02:54.920 --> 01:02:57.960
He's just interesting in that way that Ross like was
1069
01:02:58.000 --> 01:03:01.840
difficult to categorize, wasn't super conservative, but he was very
1070
01:03:01.880 --> 01:03:07.480
pro life, you know, wasn't MAGA, and in fact warned
1071
01:03:07.679 --> 01:03:11.599
about like the godlessness of some aspects of the Maga coalition,
1072
01:03:12.079 --> 01:03:14.800
like just said things that were interesting and provocative. Dan
1073
01:03:14.880 --> 01:03:16.760
McCarthy would be like that too. Again, you might not
1074
01:03:16.800 --> 01:03:20.079
agree with him on everything, but he's thoughtful. And then
1075
01:03:20.199 --> 01:03:28.400
I also thought maybe a Michael Brendan Doherty m similar thing,
1076
01:03:28.679 --> 01:03:31.320
just like saying different things and also able to reach
1077
01:03:31.960 --> 01:03:34.960
a left wing audience in ways that other people might not.
1078
01:03:37.000 --> 01:03:39.239
Or they could try George Willet or not George. They
1079
01:03:39.239 --> 01:03:43.320
could try oh my gosh, Bill Crystal again he had
1080
01:03:43.360 --> 01:03:46.440
a disastrous run as a New York Times columnist.
1081
01:03:47.119 --> 01:03:51.440
It's probably funny how they're like, how everyone's like they
1082
01:03:51.480 --> 01:03:54.199
need to hire someone who voted for Trump, which is
1083
01:03:54.239 --> 01:03:58.719
fine by me. By the way, two people you mentioned
1084
01:03:59.239 --> 01:04:02.679
are are or fine. I mean, I would say they
1085
01:04:02.840 --> 01:04:05.840
are both paleo conservatives, and those are people who are
1086
01:04:05.880 --> 01:04:08.119
more likely to vote for Trump. But the New York
1087
01:04:08.159 --> 01:04:10.840
Times never had a columnist who voted for Ronald Reagan
1088
01:04:10.880 --> 01:04:14.880
when Ronald Reagan was president, either William Sapphire, who I
1089
01:04:15.039 --> 01:04:17.719
liked fine. He was a conservative there maybe the only
1090
01:04:17.760 --> 01:04:24.639
conservative for years voted for Clinton. David Brooks came after right,
1091
01:04:24.679 --> 01:04:27.800
he was a columnist there. He was. You know, they've
1092
01:04:27.800 --> 01:04:33.039
never really had someone who was in the with the
1093
01:04:33.039 --> 01:04:37.400
majority of conservatives voting with the Republican Party writing for
1094
01:04:37.480 --> 01:04:40.320
them because they're a left wing newspaper. I think that's
1095
01:04:40.360 --> 01:04:40.840
a good choice.
1096
01:04:40.840 --> 01:04:42.599
And you even know why I came up with ideas
1097
01:04:42.599 --> 01:04:44.360
because I don't care what the New York Times stuff.
1098
01:04:44.519 --> 01:04:46.360
I have not read it in so long. Like you
1099
01:04:46.360 --> 01:04:49.760
mentioned William Saffire, I loved reading him when I was
1100
01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:56.719
much younger, and now I honestly don't remember. It has
1101
01:04:56.800 --> 01:05:01.440
been probably decades since I've read an act New York Times.
1102
01:05:01.960 --> 01:05:03.719
Maybe I did it on a plane or something once,
1103
01:05:03.760 --> 01:05:04.159
I don't know.
1104
01:05:04.920 --> 01:05:09.599
I recently resubscribe because I'm working on something and they maken.
1105
01:05:09.800 --> 01:05:12.000
You know, they're behind a paywall, and I need to
1106
01:05:12.039 --> 01:05:15.400
read older articles and this and that. But I think
1107
01:05:15.440 --> 01:05:17.679
it matters to some extent. It's it's still a very
1108
01:05:17.679 --> 01:05:21.280
popular newspaper. It still says something you can still.
1109
01:05:21.480 --> 01:05:24.840
It's product reviews and games. That's what the subscription base is.
1110
01:05:25.760 --> 01:05:31.119
But Wirecutter and Connections or whatever. I don't know what
1111
01:05:31.159 --> 01:05:33.599
the games are. I refuse to give money to The
1112
01:05:33.599 --> 01:05:35.400
New York Times, So I can't tell you.
1113
01:05:35.960 --> 01:05:38.880
If someone like MBD or whoever is there, they would
1114
01:05:38.920 --> 01:05:42.719
at least occasionally get through to people who never ever
1115
01:05:43.079 --> 01:05:48.199
are exposed to anything a Trump voter really believes in
1116
01:05:48.400 --> 01:05:52.760
or you know, so that matters to some extent. I try.
1117
01:05:53.360 --> 01:05:55.800
I think we all fight. I probably do the same
1118
01:05:55.920 --> 01:05:59.400
to try to understand what the other side saying right occasionally,
1119
01:05:59.639 --> 01:06:02.280
and it's sometimes difficult. You get into a bubble. So
1120
01:06:03.360 --> 01:06:05.079
those two are fine. I'm sure there are other good
1121
01:06:05.159 --> 01:06:12.679
choices as well. We were talking about culture. Oh you
1122
01:06:12.679 --> 01:06:13.159
your turn.
1123
01:06:13.599 --> 01:06:16.199
I don't really have much. I got some complaints from
1124
01:06:16.519 --> 01:06:21.880
listeners that I didn't really give do amount of time
1125
01:06:21.960 --> 01:06:27.039
or discussion to my trip down the rine. But I
1126
01:06:27.079 --> 01:06:29.760
will start by saying that I watched one movie.
1127
01:06:29.880 --> 01:06:37.639
And it was The Fugitive with Harrison Ford. MH. I
1128
01:06:37.679 --> 01:06:39.480
have to ask you, have you ever seen that movie?
1129
01:06:39.840 --> 01:06:42.199
Yep, when it came out, I think I was maybe
1130
01:06:42.239 --> 01:06:44.760
in high school or maybe yeah, I think it was
1131
01:06:44.760 --> 01:06:45.400
in high school.
1132
01:06:46.000 --> 01:06:49.320
Yeah. I like that movie. It's fine, it held up well.
1133
01:06:49.360 --> 01:06:51.519
I like movies like that, and I liked that era
1134
01:06:51.800 --> 01:06:57.360
of kind of like action detective Basic Movie.
1135
01:06:57.920 --> 01:07:01.000
There were a lot of those kind of thrillers going about,
1136
01:07:01.039 --> 01:07:03.760
and Harrison Ford wasn't you know a number of them
1137
01:07:03.840 --> 01:07:06.280
that were pretty good. Presumed Innocent was one. I forgot
1138
01:07:06.320 --> 01:07:10.960
the others. Oh, in the Jack Ryan movies that he made.
1139
01:07:12.239 --> 01:07:13.719
It's a good era for him.
1140
01:07:14.039 --> 01:07:16.119
This does remind me that a friend of mine from
1141
01:07:16.239 --> 01:07:21.559
church was insisting that the family go see Hadestown. They're
1142
01:07:21.599 --> 01:07:25.320
doing it might be over now, but might not. A
1143
01:07:25.519 --> 01:07:28.079
this thing they do sometimes, which is like they they
1144
01:07:28.159 --> 01:07:31.599
record the Broadway production and then they show it in theaters.
1145
01:07:32.440 --> 01:07:34.559
Are you familiar with the story of Hadestown.
1146
01:07:35.599 --> 01:07:39.239
I'm gonna tell you a very interesting story. My years ago,
1147
01:07:39.480 --> 01:07:41.480
my kids wanted to go to a Broadway show. I
1148
01:07:41.480 --> 01:07:43.639
grew up in New York. Never went to a Broadway
1149
01:07:43.679 --> 01:07:46.280
show in my life because I have zero interest in that,
1150
01:07:46.400 --> 01:07:49.320
And the only show I've ever seen on Broadway ever
1151
01:07:49.599 --> 01:07:50.440
is Hadestown.
1152
01:07:50.840 --> 01:07:52.400
Oh could you like it?
1153
01:07:53.480 --> 01:07:56.159
I don't remember much about the the plot or anything,
1154
01:07:56.199 --> 01:07:58.400
but I did enjoy the experience and I thought the
1155
01:07:58.559 --> 01:07:59.880
music was fine. Yeah.
1156
01:08:00.320 --> 01:08:05.440
Yeah, so it's I guess it blends to myths Orpheus
1157
01:08:05.480 --> 01:08:11.559
and Eurydice and Hades and Persephone, and the music is supposedly,
1158
01:08:11.840 --> 01:08:15.719
you know, it's loved by musical types. So we were
1159
01:08:15.760 --> 01:08:18.760
not able to go see it, but we did allow
1160
01:08:19.279 --> 01:08:22.079
one of the kids to go see it and it
1161
01:08:22.199 --> 01:08:24.880
was enjoyed. So I can't tell you more about it
1162
01:08:24.920 --> 01:08:27.880
at this point, but unless I get a chance to
1163
01:08:27.880 --> 01:08:29.800
see it before it leaves the theaters.
1164
01:08:30.800 --> 01:08:33.920
Okay, So back, are you a big Broadway play person? Like,
1165
01:08:34.039 --> 01:08:35.560
have you gone to Broadway a lot? Now?
1166
01:08:36.039 --> 01:08:40.000
I've gone, and I am not a big Broadway person.
1167
01:08:40.560 --> 01:08:45.520
I did see Little Shop of Horrors. Wait, is that
1168
01:08:45.560 --> 01:08:48.560
the one? Yeah, that's what it's called, and I loved it.
1169
01:08:49.079 --> 01:08:53.600
I think I mentioned that, didn't I don't remember. So yeah,
1170
01:08:53.640 --> 01:08:56.319
I saw a Little Shop of Horrors off Broadway last
1171
01:08:56.399 --> 01:09:00.960
year with one of the kids. And it's so funny
1172
01:09:00.960 --> 01:09:04.520
because I think making fun of puppetry is a time
1173
01:09:04.560 --> 01:09:09.760
honored thing to do. But I actually do like puppetry
1174
01:09:09.800 --> 01:09:14.079
in theater. And the Bible Museum was doing the Lion
1175
01:09:14.159 --> 01:09:18.079
Witch and Wardrobe or I should say C. S. Lewis.
1176
01:09:18.199 --> 01:09:23.039
They all those stories and puppetry, which.
1177
01:09:22.960 --> 01:09:25.640
Was awesome puppetry Narnia, and.
1178
01:09:25.600 --> 01:09:30.560
I've always wanted to see the Lion King, which supposedly
1179
01:09:30.600 --> 01:09:36.199
has great puppetry, and then this had just wonderful. As
1180
01:09:36.239 --> 01:09:39.600
the plant grows, you know, it gets more and more
1181
01:09:39.720 --> 01:09:42.439
puppeteers involved, and it was really well done, and I
1182
01:09:43.279 --> 01:09:45.760
thought I would I would encourage people to go see it.
1183
01:09:46.199 --> 01:09:48.880
I've seen both movie versions, one with Steve Martin, one
1184
01:09:48.920 --> 01:09:50.520
with Jack Nicholson in the sixties.
1185
01:09:50.520 --> 01:09:54.039
I think I've seen neither. Maybe you should check that out. Okay,
1186
01:09:54.560 --> 01:09:57.520
It's not like my favorite story or anything, but the
1187
01:09:57.640 --> 01:10:03.560
acting in this case was very good. Okay, so maybe
1188
01:10:03.560 --> 01:10:06.159
I should think about what else to share about. My
1189
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one friend was like, you talk about culture. You just
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had a heavy cultural experience going down the Rhine through Germany,
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01:10:16.960 --> 01:10:20.680
and you barely touched on it. So let me think
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about it a little bit, and then I will talk
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about it more next week. Some of the highlights which
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I do want to pull out, including a story about
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this is probably not what my friend has in mind,
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but a story about a record that I didn't buy
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01:10:35.520 --> 01:10:39.479
but then did buy later. So I'll tell that next week.
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Yeah, I look forward to that. I want to hear
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more about the historic places you want. I love stuff
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01:10:44.800 --> 01:10:50.239
like that. Well, that was a ragtag episode. We went
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01:10:50.279 --> 01:10:54.039
all over I hope people stuck it out, and we'll
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01:10:54.039 --> 01:10:57.560
be back next week with Molly's stories about her trip
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01:10:57.640 --> 01:11:00.520
and more news. Until then, be lovers of freedom. Interest
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for the friends followed that downs or along way down
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follow from the poorhouse dog.
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Either get the hell on the hater's tongue.
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Ain't no depresentable We down