Benny Clark - First Nations Drummer with Baker Boy and Dallas Woods

00:00:00
Speaker 1: This podcast is brought to you by on Track Studio. Welcome to Yarning Up, a podcast that showcases stories of first Nations excellence, to help us learn and unlearn Australia's history to work tillwards a better future. I'm your host, Proud Barbara woman and founder of Black Wattle Coaching in Consulting Caroline col This podcast was taped on the sacred, stolen and unseeded Aboriginal lands of the Runjuri people of the Coolin Nation. I pay my deepest respects.

00:00:45
Speaker 2: To them, my elders, your elders, and all owners of country, of this beautiful place that we call home Yamayama or you beautiful, juicy, delicious peaches. Brothers, my sisters, welcome back to Yarning Up. If you can't tell, I feel a little delirious right now. I don't know whether it's because it's been the end of a big day where recording at night tonight, or whether it's just that feeling in the weird, clumsy stage in the middle of the year, I had the privilege of sitting down with brother boy Benny Clark.

00:01:31
Speaker 1: Bennie is a triple j Unearthed musician, a very talented Melbourne based drummer. He has played for the likes A Baker Boy and Dallas Woods. So in this episode we unpack Bennie's journey in uncovering parts of his identity. We talk about what led him to music almost over a decade agoo, and how that's landed him on stage with some of the more formidable black artists in this country. We have a pretty no nonsense conversation about you know who Benny is and what's important to him. So mad respect to you, Bras. Thank you so much, and I hope that you enjoyed this episode as much as I did. Wow, Bennie Clark, you absolute legend. It is such a delight to sit down and yarn with you. I have so much respect for you and so it's really nice to be able to connect in this way. Thank you for joining me.

00:02:39
Speaker 3: No, thank you me blushing up. I started it now. I was pretty honest when I got the email to say if I wanted to jump on. So now I appreciate you having music. It's awesome.

00:02:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you Bras. And look, I guess you know the beautiful thing about like being a black fella is that so many of us wear so many different different hats, and so I want to just kind of start by asking you to maybe introduce yourself how you would like to be introduced.

00:03:09
Speaker 3: Ooh, I've never had to do that before. Usually I get told what who I am in interviews. All right, So I'm Benny Clark. I guess most people outside of community would know me as the drummer for Baker Boy. I've also played for Dallas Woods. I currently played for Chasing Ghosts, the Mirindas and doing a little solo stuff as well. And yeah, people in community will just know me as Benny Clark.

00:03:37
Speaker 1: I think that's such a modest wrap up of you. Like I think when I think of you, you know, you work in community, but you're a photographer, you yeah, moonlight across these musicians. You're a musician yourself. Yeah. I always think it's interesting how people choose to define themselves because we're so like multi faceted. There's so many things fill us up, and we're really never defined by one one thing, you know.

00:04:04
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, very much so. And I'm very much a person who gets bored easily. So there's always something new to try and you to do, and you know, there's always been this passage through my life. You learn one thing, you need to learn the other thing. So I only how to play drums, but if I'm going to write a sign in the land, to play guitar, if I don't play guitar and need to learn how to sing. So just kind of those gradual you know, picking different things up.

00:04:25
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally, And I imagine it's kind of like just developing a sense of like mastery with some stuff, like you know that kind of Yeah, developing a sense of mastery. I've kind of recently started to hit this this phase in my life where I'm trying to do things, not to be good at them, just to do them and like sit in the kind of like clumsy stage and not be so great at it. But yeah, it's interesting to hear your progression from drums to guitaring to music, which I really want to dig into.

00:04:56
Speaker 3: Definitely.

00:04:57
Speaker 1: But I guess you know, bros, can you tell me a little bit about like, as we do on this show, we always ask about you know, your mob and who you are. I'm wondering if you could share a little bit about what it was like for you growing up. Where did you grow up?

00:05:10
Speaker 3: So I'm a very very proud Gunnar Curno man. But I have and a lot of people wouldn't know, but I have a very very close connection with a very different kind of connection that most players, were black lives, would have to the were undering people. So my I mean, we got shipped around everywhere back in the day. But one of the last points of contacts, so my great grandfather died when he was in his early twenties. So of course my granddad was very young and lost all that connection. But one thing that we did have was a connection to Arnie Joy Murphy. So Arnie Joy Murphy when curen Vert closed, when the mission for finishing up Annie Joy Murphy's parents took him my great grandparents. Wow. So when we lost that connection to country and lost that connection of our story, we were adopted into the we're under culture and we're under a family. So I grew up always thinking, always knowing that Annie Joy was my auntie and that I was were undering. I thought that my entire life, and you know what, it's probably time I let the cat out of the bag. I do have a were undry tattooed, and back in my day we call them tramp stamps, A lower back, and there's a lot of more undry people and ours that still think that's hilarious. And I have that tatooed on my lower back. But that's what I thought up until, you know, my early twenties, until I wanted to really start digging into I want to know what my family tree looks like. I want to know who sits where and what's what, and I'll be starting to become more of a person who wanted to know more about culture than history. So without that real defining moment of a family tree, I couldn't really discover that myself. So after a lot of tracking, and I wasn't were undering.

00:06:57
Speaker 1: Obvious despite the tatoo or.

00:07:01
Speaker 3: The post post tattoo obviously, but you know, all this other beautiful stuff started to come out, and you know, I'm closer to my were under family like Annie Joy and Stacy and Uncle Colin and all those people you know, just as much now as I was then. Then I found this gun I kurrent eyeside that was so brand new and fresh, and started finding all these people that I grew up with and being friends with for so long turned out to be cousins and aunties and uncles and nephews and nieces and your family tree just grows from there. So I mean it's you know, I'm thirty five and I'm still learning a lot about my history and who I am. Is it all? Actually a revelation came out the other day which I'm definitely I was talking about publicly. It's embarrassing, but it's an interesting stuff. So I have a certain person in my family that was a bit of a bit of a stud and we've found some more family from back in the day we didn't.

00:07:59
Speaker 1: Know existed, married up ways I wouldn't.

00:08:02
Speaker 3: Say married up and kind of maybe hanging out with the married up and then getting kicked out of the local town.

00:08:07
Speaker 1: Okay, say no more fans.

00:08:09
Speaker 3: Yes, So the family treats continually growing, you know, finding connections to people that already knew, you know. I found that connection through through the Thorpe family and related to all the Thorpes and the Hoods and the Greens and the Peppers, and it was like all these amazing families and beautiful names and beautiful people that I grew up knowing, and they all started to become such more of a closer connection. So I'm very blessed and proud to be where I'm from and who I am. And ever since finding that information out in my early twenties, there's been nothing but open armed and took me in and showed me the ropes and connect with family. So it was, yeah, that was an amazing little journey. But where I grew up, I unfortunately grew up in a very backwards little town where if you saw anyone that even had a tan, it was quite unusual. So for me being and I hate using the word fair skinned, but me being a little fair skinned thirteen year old walking into an all white school going hey, I'm black didn't really go down that great. So I've definitely been one person that has identified with a lot of struggle in that sense, even though I don't have you know, I guess what you would call the your markings of someone that would be picked out of a crowd as an original person. But I've definitely had to fight for my place and who I am. You know, I was even little things like I was suspended in grade six for being a compulsive liar telling people I was aboriginal. I remember in high school, I actually just told this story to a made of mine and apologies for a little bit of language, but I think it's relevant for it. But I was in art class one day and someone turned around and said, I'll see raccoon, and I'm like, excuse me, So if you want to be one, we'll treat you like one. So they painted my head to tell in black paint, locked me in a locker and kicked and booted it in. So I've definitely fought from my place on this earth. When it comes to my aboriginality, it's not something that I wanted. It's something I want to have, but it's not something I chose. It's something I was and us. And you know when you talk to people about aboriginality and you know, the wants and needs not a once in need, it's a connection. It's just who you are as a human being. And I've definitely have my fair share of bite and tooth and nail to claim that title. So you know, I definitely, yeah, I consider myself lucky that I was given that. I had to go through the ship in the hard yards to have it. I wouldn't change the thing, So I'm very very proud man.

00:10:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you, Braus, thanks for sharing that. I mean, firstly, I'm just so sorry you had to experience that stuff. I mean, if you think back, I mean, I don't know how old you are, maybe around the same age as me, but it was pretty brutal growing up being a follow back in the day like this is like pre it being so cool and trendy nowadays. But yeah, it was difficult growing up and I'm sorry to hear that you went through that, but it does make sense of you know, how you've come to be. And yeah, thanks for sharing the story about your journey. I think a lot of people don't fully understand what that journey of reconnecting back and forward and it's not linear. Family isn't nuclear. It looks really different and really yeah, it looks very vibrant for us. It's not just the nuclear And so it's cool to hear hear you share that. I think I was with a sister, was actually with Mariki the other week and Luly Yanning. I think there's like, I don't know, don't quote me on this and don't revoke my black car, do you mob? But I think that's like five hundred thousand black followers in Australia something to that effect. And so we're like a really small population, but we've got big impact and big oh, big influence, big opportunity. Like you know, we're just big personalities. But we are such a small community. So you know, going back through and reconnecting, you uncover so much because we are such a small small population.

00:12:15
Speaker 3: So because it's it's quality not quantity. Yeah, if you look at our community, that's a great way of saying, we have some of the most amazing minds, generations, family groups, stories, history, activity is big males, small males. We have in our little community. We have more of that than any other community in the world. As far as I'm concerned. We have more quality than quantity when it comes to communities.

00:12:47
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, I mean, like our whole ability to survive is been predicated on our ability to adapt and work together as people, which makes us so fucking Like for me, it's always so sophisticated and nuanced, Like you know, even Morundry Mob they were you know, totally decimated down to you know, such a small percentage. And and now we really do stand on the shoulders of so many giants and we are out here and we are proud and it's a beautiful thing. Yeah, thank you, so much for sharing about that Brus. Look, we put a call out to our listeners, as we do with all of our guests, and there was heaps of questions. I actually came through about kind of three areas. One is around you know, people are really keen to hear about your journey into music as am I mental health and self care, which I think is a truly beautiful thing because I know that you are pretty open and vulnerable and share about that stuff, which is really cool. But before we go into that, I'm going to be a bit of an Arnie Doris here and asks a question that I've been wanting to get off my chest. Okay, and it's about Splendor, believe it or not.

00:14:02
Speaker 3: Yeah, Okay, you.

00:14:03
Speaker 1: Know, obviously the art scene in Australia has been totally decimated and New Mob would have been gearing up for Splendor and then it was canceled. What was Can you describe to me what the vibe was like when you found out from festival organizers that it was canceled and what did your mob do? I've been dying to ask.

00:14:24
Speaker 3: All right, I'll give you the real story.

00:14:27
Speaker 1: Okay, the real story.

00:14:29
Speaker 3: We got it here first, so we were we left the hotel in the van. Yeah, so we took two vans and I was in the van with Danzel or Baker Boys. Vibes were high, high, high high. We've been booked for Splendor three years in a row and it got canceled every time because of COVID. Now, the first time and the last time we played Splendor was year two of Baker Boy's existence. Right, this is before the album, the production, and just before everything. We didn't even have a crew. We had no sound guys, we had nothing. We literally rolled in with barebone shit like a real band and just worked it out when we got there.

00:15:11
Speaker 1: Wow, what year are we talking then, Like.

00:15:16
Speaker 3: I want to say two thousand and eighteen? Yeah, right, eighteen maybe. So to go from that then to having spending well, me and myself weeks, but our production for months and months, months, months and months on this massive show, Like the show was ridiculous. Then we had things like Bernard Fanning was going to come in and do a song with us. We had all this stuff lined up. So it was high. Me and Danzel like We're finally here, We're finally doing it. We're back. This is going to be the real kick off and we'll play in the Amphitheater. So for people who don't know what the Amphitheater is, the last last time we played Split and the headline at the Amphitheater was Kendrick Lamart. What just to give you, just to give you a bit of an aspective, just to give you an idea of how important the Amphitheater is. And the headliner for our night was the Gorillas. Right now, obviously, all the rest of the guys a bit younger than me, so I was probably more excited about the crew. So I was probably the most exciting about But we got their eyes were high and it's like every two where you walk in, you start seeing all these beautiful people you only get to see on two, all the photographers, the crew, the artists, and it was like war home. After having all these yarns, I walked up on stage. We start setting up and Young Blood's crew was setting up behind us, and we're all getting set up. We're ready to go. I literally just positioned my kit on the riser and it was trying to pull my symbols out. I open my symbol bag and there's a guy that was stage managing splinters that stage managed a heap of festivals that were playing. He's run over, he's got Benny. Just just stop for a second. I'm like, what do you mean? He goes, just give me five minutes. And at this point I'm starting to shake a little bit my gust. I'm looking at Toby, our musical director, going what's going on? And Toby's freaking out on the radio, going what's going on? And then we hear young bloods to a manager behind us not even three minutes later, going that's it. Fucke pack the truck. We're going on. So our crews kind of turn around, what do you mean? Pack up? Like, he goes, did you not hear me? Pack up? Confirms when it's done, we're going wow.

00:17:31
Speaker 1: So you're like literally on the stage about So it was.

00:17:36
Speaker 3: Adam Newfield, which is a good mateive as he plays guitar for Ruby Fields and he's got his own little solo thing going on, so you want onearestly he'd set up, so he was playing and it was like a two hour gap and then we went on as the like the first book fan for the show, and then young Blood was after us. So we kind of had this scene where it's like, if we don't pull the people, young Blood's going to pull the people. So we're in a pretty good position. Shouldn't have a packed out show. We're at a really good position. He had found that out. The first thing I remember is our monitor guy Ryan, screaming fuck at the top of his lungs, and he kicked my drum riser and walked off. Toby just kind of stood there and looked into nothing, and I just sat on my riser and looked out into this empty amphitheater like we're so close, like so so so close. So we sat there ten minutes and collected our thoughts because literally no one knew except for us on stage. No one off stage knew that it was done. So we're like, well, let's pack up. So I just grabbed the little bits off the kid that were mine that I haven't set up yet and walked back to the tent and I saw a good made of mind. He's a photographer, and we actually met him when we played with Groove in the move his portrait of the man's main photographer, and he kind of look and he goes, that was a quick setup. He goes, why have you got all your gear I'm like, it's done, man, we're done. What do you mean done. I'm like, they're just cand it because they have not I'm like, dude, they've just cand it. I don't know what to do. So we walked back to the dressing room and I grubbed Dan's ar. I'm likede, we need to find a venue. I'm an old punk rock kid. I'm ready to go.

00:19:24
Speaker 1: You rehearse, You've got all of this, like gt up, you're on the stage, You're ready to go.

00:19:29
Speaker 3: I'm like, I'm like, d let's find a venue. And Denzel kind of laughed it off like I was joking, like, oh yeah, no, wouldn't that be really cool. I'm like, no, I'm serious, find a venue. Then we found out that our tour manager at the time, her husband was one of the production managers of Beach Hotel. M hm, so let's get on this ship. So our crew, our front of house, our MD, our lighting guy, and our monitors guy. So two Toby's Ryan and the Nate. They turned that showerund in four hours. They are the most amazing crew ever.

00:20:03
Speaker 1: So what people are like just ring it up? Hotels are like trying to get you a spot somewhere locally Enviyron at that point, No, So after.

00:20:14
Speaker 3: Having conversations out to a manager's husband is the production manager at the Beach Hotel in Barron Bay, and we're like, let's get it like, that's that's out, let's quickly snag it up. So she made the call and then our crew production crew went out just to make sure that you know, they have enough lines to plug everything in. The venue's right, the pa is good, the lighting rigs okay, just make sure everything's actually going to work. And then when we got the green light, we got in the van. We sped down there and it was a bit It was a bit of a weird one because when we walked in, people much as gone Splendor's canceled, let's just go to the pub. It's an eight hundred cap venue. We walked into maybe eight hundred people lined up out the front and it was the weirdest singer we walked in. All these people started clapping. We're like, like, baker Boys here to save the day.

00:21:01
Speaker 1: I was going to say, yeah, baker boy in his crewer here to like save the day.

00:21:06
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then Danzel Turner, would they be piece if we just ordered the Parmer and went home to play this show. So we set up Tobyo md Rang Bernard Fanning and said, look, we found a new venue. You far, He goes, it doesn't matter where is it. He grabbed his guitar, ran down, and the rest is history. We played that packed out beach hotel. It was overflown, way too many people on the street, and it was probably one of the best shows, most fun shows I've ever played.

00:21:38
Speaker 1: Wow, And what was it totally like a free gig for people who were just kind of that is so sick, Like, what a night, fir. Wow, what a cool story, What a cool story. I love that you mom didn't even contemplate like stopping, you know, just get a new venue, get ye get together. And I love that they always change. Yeah, like you know, they always say the best night to the ones that don't planned. Imagine just like casually being in the pub and then dens out his crew play you a free show, just rock up and roll.

00:22:14
Speaker 3: Yeah, that is so sick because we got one venue and Young Blood got the other venue. Wow.

00:22:21
Speaker 1: And what was the vibe like for you guys to sort of like pull that together? Was it just super surreal?

00:22:27
Speaker 3: Look again, I'm got to give credit to the two Toby's, Ryan and Nate. They did all the hard work. They did all the hard yards where you just kind of sat around and hoped and prayed that it was going to work and we're going to be there. Yeah, they turned that show around, and again they're the those four just some of the most amazing crew and our tool manager and everyone else involved. It was just I can't believe they pulled that off. I mean, we just turned up and played. We just turned up, set up and played them more, pulled the whole thing together. Say it very very very blessed to have crew around it.

00:23:01
Speaker 1: I love that. Sounds like everyone needs a too Toby and Nate deal. Forget about it, Ryan and Ryan, I can't forget that. Well, how cool. Thank you for sharing that. I've been dying. Obviously we were following along and just thinking what's going to happen next? Because yeah, I mean, it was so sad to sort of see that mother nature had different plans that day, but that it wasn't going to stop you. No, no, she's not been happy. But I guess you know a follow up question, if I may, I mean, it's probably up there with one of the most sporadic things that has happened to you while on tour. But you know, is there any other crazy things that have happened on tour that you can share?

00:23:45
Speaker 3: Yeah, we have fortes.

00:23:48
Speaker 1: We could just spend all night talking about things that have happened on tour. Any girl don't get out.

00:23:54
Speaker 3: So I've slept in some of the most horrible places ever. I have gone days, sometimes a week or two without a shower and food, the whole. Like rock and roll lifestyle, it's not all it's wrapped up to. I mean you think like I get questions, especially from young AND's, about what it's like to be on tour, and it's you know, it's booze, drugs and girls. That's what tour. God, no, not even closed. I roll in the sound chests. We usually get to a venue. O'll piss off in my camera for a couple of hours before we go to sound check. We do sound check, we still haven't sleft. Then we're too tired to get food. By the time we wake up, it's too late. We get to the show, we play, then we pack down. Sometimes we stay in the same place. Sometimes we're playing straight out to the next place, and if I have the opportunity, like, as soon as my last drum goes in the case, I'm already in bed. I'm gone and done. I've had my days of party and clubbing and going.

00:25:02
Speaker 1: And it's a job, right, Like you can't be like fully trash like rocking up. I'm sure you could have done that, you know, maybe when we're younger and have all this stamina and all that, but at the end of the day, like it's your profession and it would be so exhausting. I mean, even traveling can suck for work. But yeah, you're right, like it's not always super glamorous.

00:25:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, interesting, I wouldn't give it up, but it's not as glamorous as people think it is.

00:25:26
Speaker 1: Yeah.

00:25:26
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's probably more fun than what people think it is, but you do have to get over the you know, shitty servo food. I mean, being with Denzels a little bit easy. We get to fly and we get accommodation of its and pieces. But you know, I've been with Dan's Up for five years, I've been touring for just over twenty. Yeah, wow, it hasn't hasn't always been that easy?

00:25:48
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it would make it all the more sweeter if you've got like is, like a good crew around you, and people got that sense of camaraderie. But if you want comfort or yeah, if you're like you like your routine and your structure, I imagine you'd have to kind of let some of that go. Interesting. I'm keen to understand when did you start, When did you choose music, and what was the journey that led you to music.

00:26:16
Speaker 3: So I've told this this story a couple of times, and this is my musician creation story. So when I was a kid, my bet in primary school, my best mate had a motorbike and hated motorbikes, but my best mate had one, so I had to have one too. Now, we didn't grow up in the richest part of town. We didn't. You know, my mum and dad are the most amazing people in the world, but you know, you know, normal everage, every day family. We didn't have all the trimmings and bits and pieces, but we all loved each other and we did our things. So one day Dad was able to buy me a little Pee eighty, this little white Yamaha thing. And one day I was doing Philip on on in the motorbike track and I got atacked by a dog and I had this dog chase me around the track. It was the scariest thing I've ever been well, probably not the scariest, but it shook me and I didn't want to touch the motorbike. I related the motorbikes and the dog and didn't want a bar of it. And I loved music, absolutely loved music. I had two very different three very different styles of influence. I mean, my nan very much raised me on Johnny Cash and Buddy Holly and BB King and all those real classic artists. Mum was very it was Abba, which I never got into and never will, but there was that Fleetwood Mac and that kind of stuff. And Dad was a punk kid. Dad was sex Pistols, Clash, Blondie Bowie, you know, and not the Bowie people know today. I mean like CD GBI's Bowie, you know, the Ramones, all those sort of bands and sex Pistols. It's still to this day one of my old time favorite bands. And this is when the whole new metal scene started to come out, so Limp, Biscuit and corn on An all these bands started to get up, and for some reason I asked my dad for a drum kid. Wow.

00:28:05
Speaker 1: Were they like hell no, were they like quite happy to oblige with that sort of music? It sounds like they must.

00:28:12
Speaker 3: So he's the kickerup. I have really bad diagnosed addie HD right, And I tend to, depending on what it is, I tend to pick up projects and get forward with them if I can't complete them in a certain time. So mom and Dad are like, he's six months and he's going to want to sell up for something else. Twenty seven years later, I'm sitting on this podcast with you talking about my drumming.

00:28:36
Speaker 1: Wow. Wow, How crazy is that? I mean, most parents wouldn't oblige to be like, yeah, sure have a drum kit, like you know, it's pretty bold and brave of them. And what an the collecting kind of music? Were they into music themselves?

00:28:53
Speaker 3: Very much? So? Dad was a big music person. We have other family that you know, had had worked in the music industry and bits and peace in the music. But you know, my mom, my dad and my NaN's influences work were huge on me, you know, Mum. With Dad, I gues especially like your Fleetwood Max and that kind of stuff. And again I'll never claim averall take that shit. To my grave. You know, Dad had that again, that pistols and that kind of real edgy punk rock, political, you know, angsty music, and you know, and Nan would chill me out with that, Johnny Cash and Buddy Holly and Baver King and Ray Charles and that kind of era of music. And I think that's why my taste in music now is so vary, because I can sit and listen to to Ray Charles and Johnny Cash on a good day and then go and listen to Stupidly Heavy, a Cannibal Corpse and more. But angel I had those two very separate. But punk rock has always has always been my love. It's always been my biggest thing. And even in that growing as a person likes as original people, we tend to grow up in a very political environment. We tend to know our environment very quickly. And my passion and my first real openness of being shown politics was sex Pists never Mind the Bollocks. That album was the one that showed me that, you know, God saved the Queen just because as the queen doesn't mean you need to like her. And there's reason why we don't like her, and there's reasons, there's all these all these scenarios and then you know, the nineties punk scene come out. I found no effects of Pennywise and Ransom from a Gandhi and all these political punk bands as like, but then I identified that and my black side and my family and I identified them together. Yeah, there are a bunch of white fellows with guitar singing about politics, but I identified that as a young man that had that political side, and that kind of grew and molded me into you know who I am now.

00:30:52
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. It's interesting because, yeah, behind every revolution, the backdrop, there is some music that is kind of like moved the people of that time to yeah, like question the authority and the anti establishment, and it's kind of like buried in these lyrics, but they speak to to that you're so right.

00:31:13
Speaker 3: And then Rage Against the Machine come out and it was like the whole game changed, Like that's it. Yeah, we're done. Rage Against Machine just killed everybody when it comes to political heavy punk music.

00:31:23
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. Well, I mean, do you remember the first song that you like kind of learned on the drums? Did you have like a track that, yeah, you recall learning and vibing out at that age?

00:31:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, the first song I learned on drums was Red Hot Chili Peppers.

00:31:43
Speaker 1: Under the Bridge, Oh, classic class the.

00:31:46
Speaker 3: First song I learned because it was well, I thought it was really easy. Yeah, it's not now, it's kind of like funny when I was playing when I was a Kid's sounds really easy now listen to as an adults like, that's not easy at all and old playing a wrong. But chillipevs. Under the Bridge was the first song I learned because my cousin at the time was learning guitar and that's the only song you could play on guitar. So that's the only song I was able to jam with someone on. So that was the first song I learned.

00:32:14
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's like the classic kind of smoke underwater, a sort of guitar song, but way cooler. Oh cool. And I mean to think back, so you said twenty seven years, how would you say that your sound has evolved? Like now, what sort of how would you describe your sort of current style in working with Denzil and working with Dallas Woods and chasing Ghosts, Like, how would you describe your music now?

00:32:44
Speaker 3: Well, it's funny and it's funny you bring that up, actually, because I had so my first band, I would have been twelve or thirteen, and two of those members are still my best friends to this day. We still hang out all the time, so they're my two closest friends. And one of them was my base player Kobe. Here's something going to name you whole about ten years ago. About ten years ago, he was starting a business. He's now one of the biggest printers, like as in clothing in the country, and he stole my laptop to start his business. Broken in my house and stole my laptop right.

00:33:18
Speaker 1: On the ail entrepreneur.

00:33:20
Speaker 3: What hey, he's got a great business. He's feeding his family with it now, no complaint, But I only got that laptop back a couple of days ago. To god, on that laptop is around three hundred photos that no one else has over our first ever band.

00:33:35
Speaker 1: Wow, what was the band's name.

00:33:37
Speaker 3: It was called Defect.

00:33:39
Speaker 1: Defect it with.

00:33:40
Speaker 3: A D with a D. Yeah, but it was defect because we're all a little bit defected. We all have something wrong with us. So it was like that imperfectly perfect type thing. I like it, and I mean we're thirteen. We had no idea. We just thought it was cool. Let's be honest, but I was played. But again that was in that new metal era, Sodly Biscuit and Lincoln Park, and so we were a lot heavier than those guys were. So we started it was like a little metal called death metal band, right, so to go from all that death metal whatever else. And I've always played heavy in punk music forever. There was some instances through my career that I played for Young Warriors for a little bit. I played for Maricky Hood for a little bit. So I've always done little bits and pieces. You know, in community, there's not a whole lot of metal heads, so if you want to play with community in your family, it's like kind of have to play. And back then it was very much hip hop and R and B. It's all coming back now, yeah, it's all coming back again, But that all those old rock and roll fellows there there, you know, they weren't touring and on the scene. I mean, you had all your colored stone and got the India in that. But my era within the black community is very R and B and hip hop. So I had to play R and B hip hop if I wanted to play Share the Spirit and all those festivals back in the day. But that definitely led me up to to what I'm doing now and you know, to get a little bit more technical, Like that New metal era of heavy music was very hip hop influenced and orientated. So the way I played drums in those bands and certain little techniques and things that I did, it's very much hip hop and gospel drumming. So it didn't take a lot for me to move from Limp Biscuit to ice Q because the patterns and the beats and the grooves and the maladies were all very similar. Just one was heavy and one wasn't. So I think growing up in that generation of music very much helped me to blend into doing hip hop. And then now I'm at the age where I'll play almost anything just for the experience of being able to just give it a go.

00:35:44
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that. I mean, from thirteen year old defect to kind of working with mob and now you know, working with Baker Boy, which has a huge, like you know, following and has made such a big impact, especially in the black music scene as well. Like this is super cool and impressive, and it's cool to hear your kind of evolution of your journey in this and how you've just stuck to it. I mean, how did you then connect with Denzel and start to jam with him? Like how did that kind of come about?

00:36:19
Speaker 3: So that was an interesting one. So I was I just finished up with playing with Philly. So Philly was taking a bit of a break and he kind of wasn't doing music for a little bit. And that kind of crew back in the day was like myself Philly. He had Neil which is now dreaming now, and Adrian Eagle, Kye like this was all you know, Mars who was a DJ. All these people that were involved in this project and had their own little bits outside. So when Philly took a bit of a break, I was doing a little bit with Adrian Eagle and doing a bit with some other artists. Now, the guy that was producing Adrian Eagle was also working with Danzel on his first couple of tracks. So when Danzel had got off at his first two shows, they were like, okay, so we need to get you a DJ, because that's what hip hop artists have, they have a DJ. And Danzel was like, I don't want a DJ. I want I want a drummer, And like, the drummer makes no sense without a band or a DJ and he's like, well, up from where I'm from, drummers are the shit, Like you need to have a drummer, but he has to be black. I want a black drummer because everyone was in there like black drummer, want a black drummer from like we don't know anyone. And Terror was there and was like, finally enough, I know a black drummer who like, he's actually in one of the other studios with Adrian. So pass my details to Dan Brownfield, who used to run indigenous hip hop projects when they were around back in the day. And Dione hit me up and he's likely you don't know me. I work with this kid named Danzel or Baker Boy. Would you be interested in playing drums for it? He's just gone viral with Cloud nine. That was when I was on NTV. It was still kind of very small. We hadn't played a show yet, and I'm like, send me a track. I'll have a listen, and he's like, all right, then they sent me Cloud nine. I stop in the cloud.

00:38:06
Speaker 1: The person is checking the brown to what the end of the day he found.

00:38:09
Speaker 3: So never back down, back down, want of good me by a practice And I actually never spoke about his public but I tea stands up for it all the time. I listened to the track and just went, no, it's not really not really for me. I'm like, good luck to the kids, all really cool. I said, can you send me anything else that might change my life? What's something new you're working on? Like, give me something new, because at this point I just left quite a big band that I was in. We've just done, you know, done an album in America and done some big tours and I unfortunately had a big, very public falling out with that band. So I was pretty done with music at the time being so I was very picky. Yeah. Then Dion sent me, Maddy, you know, I'm a proud.

00:38:57
Speaker 2: Listen to it.

00:38:59
Speaker 3: Put the boy boy don't work from and black Magic, black Magic, Giddy, you do you don't have it? Don't black and Gifted talking the whole package. Magic can't and he's like black Magic. This other guy's name is Dallas Woods. This is kind of the first song he's ever sung on, and this is my you know, this is a song that we're working on at the moment, I think I got about I want to say, thirty seconds in the black Magic I rang down back. I'm like, where do you want me? Wow?

00:39:34
Speaker 1: You just knew at that point, and good on you for being honest though and expressing what you know you were after as an artist as well.

00:39:40
Speaker 3: You know, when you want me, how are we going to put this together? Where's the rest of the band? What are we doing? He's like, we don't have a band. We've got a drummer and that's all Danzel wants. Wow.

00:39:50
Speaker 1: So it's literally just you and Denzel at that point.

00:39:53
Speaker 3: So finally enough, I found footage on that lap on a laptop the other day, so it started with me Danze and an iPod. Wow. So I wear what's called iems or unie monitors, so they're kind of like headphones that are attached to it, usually a wireless pack and you sound guys can kind of send to you whatever you need to hear why you're playing. I had an iPod or an iPad.

00:40:16
Speaker 1: God, so two thousands of the iPod, isn't it.

00:40:19
Speaker 3: I had a split a cable, so I put it into the headphone jack and one Jack would go to front of house to the audio guy, and one Jack would go into my ears. Wow. And because it had to be at full volume. I had everything at full volume because Front of House needed a full volume. So it started me Danzel on an iPad and we had Dallas and Kean come in for the first couple of shows. Now, Dallas, I mean, if you're a black fallI you don't know who Dallas is. You need to get on Spotify right now look him up. And Kean, who's now had his own success with his solo career.

00:40:56
Speaker 1: Yeah, and like also, I mean all those follows that you just rattled off, like Adrian, Eagle and Kiana, they're all killing it. You know, they're all triple J on Earth like a virgin. You know, they're all doing such amazing things. But how cool to hear that you were like part of this early formation of what has come to be Baker Boy who just played like the Commonwealth Games. But also to like what a nice reminder to not let the perfect get in the way. I think sometimes we wait for everything to just be fully perfect, and we also look at people's success I think, and just expect like to be there, But it's really this journey of like coming together and trying and trialing and developing that craft, that relationship, and you know, like going through that clumsy phase at first. Yeah.

00:41:48
Speaker 3: I mean I spent years playing shows to my parents, yeah, and the other band members' parents, and we would travel stupid distances. Our dogs tell the story the other day. So I still live in that same town that I've lived in all those years ago and grew up in. But if we had a show in the city, were all underage. So we me and my singer Sharpie, we used to carry my drum kit from my house to the bus stop, catch the bus to the train, the train to the city, and then walk all my shit to the venue. Yeah, and then at twelve o'clock and I have to try and find a way home if Dad wasn't around. Otherwise, Dad was the a number one roading and would drive us around everywhere.

00:42:28
Speaker 1: It's crazy, like the old foot falcon and how you just walk around, I mean, not cutting drums and things. But yeah, that's crazy. It's so interesting to hear it. I mean, it was being a musician slash drummer in the Crystal Ball for you. At what point were you like, Okay, I'm going to pursue this now, like this is actually something that I really want to do with my life.

00:42:51
Speaker 3: That was all I ever wanted to do. Yeah, I ever wanted to do anything else. Yeah, you know, I've been a youth worker for a very long time as well, And you know, I'm very lucky, to guess to have a career that I love almost just as much. Where if I think I was, if I was a big mus I'm making millions of dollars, I'd probably still be youth worker somewhere.

00:43:14
Speaker 2: Yeah.

00:43:15
Speaker 3: But yeah, other than that, it was always an itch. It was always something that was there. Like if I took two months off playing shows, I'd never been more depressed in my life. I was like, need to go, need to jam with someone, get back on and do it. Even if it's a job now, it's still a job that I love. Yeah.

00:43:33
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so cool to hear you say that, because we can have our foot in many camps, like many things make us feel really whole, And yeah, I guess you know that is maybe a nice little change of pace. As much as I've loved going down like Rocker Memory Lane and just kind of thinking how cool it is that you know, to pick your passion something you really enjoy and where it's taking you, and just I can imagine all the stories we could, we could go on and on and on for maybe over a Kappa or another day. But I do want to circle to this idea of you know, you do work in community and also you know, mental health. I want to spin a little young. I think it was maybe in twenty twenty, during like the height of the pandemic where we connected because you gave up your social media platform for a bunch of sisters to talk about issues that were important to us, which you know as a I've got four brothers, there's six in my family. There's two girls, four boys. And I was like, man, I've got mad respect for anyone who's giving up their platform, but you know, just to see you kind of be so humble on these issues and to give us, you know, your your platform, I just thought, man, mad respect. But yeah, I guess I want to sort of just talk a little bit about, you know, the nexus between staying well and your passion and mental health, and you know, it's certainly something that we as people. You know, we are strong and we are staunch, and we don't we're not often always very good at asking for help, I think, and so I just want to sort of ask a question for you, which is you know, firstly, you know, what what practical tips do you find useful to say, like manage your mental health or self care when you are on the road and when you're kind of in this really fast paced world that we're in, how do you sort of look after yourself? Bruhs So, And.

00:45:30
Speaker 3: I'll be really honest, I've never really been good at self care. I'm still not. I'm still very much learning and trying to find ways to do that. But I guess with the work that I do, and you know, it's a family business, we all do the same type of work. And it was very much some of the hard things in life and some of the things that you see as being you know, I've seen some pretty horrible things in my time, it kind of become part of you and more like that's just how the world looked and what it was, so you didn't really look too much into you know, therapy and counseling and yoagad like what's this shit why? And it was very much COVID that forced me to actually look a little bit more in depth into my own mental health. I mean, youth workers, the most contradicting people in the world were the first people to tell you how to fix your life, but the last ones to take it on board and actually do it. So I had a pretty awful COVID. A little bit before I came out of relationship, I became somewhat homeless. I lived in a caravan in my mum's backyard. So mental health was at all a very very all time low, and for me it was getting back to basics. That's when I started doing solo music again, and I started to I've never been good at talking. Obviously a lot better now, but I was never good at talking about my issues or problems. But if you can sing a song with someone and they relate to it and have their own story to it and make someone feel something, it actually gets it off my chest and hopefully help somebody else as well. Then I got to a point where I wanted to start speaking about it more openly. And it wasn't as a I mean, at the Star people took it the same way, as you know, as like an asking for help type thing, and I was trying to draw attention and it wasn't about that at all.

00:47:31
Speaker 1: It was I thought it was really courageous of you to because we to destigmatize it and to talk about it, but also know that, you know, we don't want to trigger our people, but it is bold and we do have to talk about it. Like as like followers, we do have a responsibility to talk about being not okay as well. So I personally thought it was so bold and courageous of you to do that, and I think, you know, I just thought it was an active courage to champion that issue.

00:48:02
Speaker 3: Thank you. I appreciate that, but it was it was very much if people can see that. And you know, a part of my online identity is being the drummers Baker boy and being a professional musician and this kind of bullshit view of human life life looks really good on social.

00:48:20
Speaker 1: Mediah one hundred. It's that it's the highlight reel of you know, the roady and the guy that doesn't care or the person who Yeah, it's always the best bits. But it's nice.

00:48:32
Speaker 3: If I playing music, I wouldn't have Instagram as simple as that, But I'm like, I don't have a big platform, but how can I use that to show And it was about having someone that may look a certain way on Instagram and people might see me, you know, I'd played on thirty thousand people last night. It's just a normal thing that you know, because my life's great? About that bullshit? How can I throw a spanner in that and go if I can do that and still feel this way and reach out, why can't you do that? Yeah? Why can't other people reach out and say things? And I thought, if I can, I guess I wanted to lead by example, and again very contradictive. I'm very good at telling people how to fix their problems, but very bad and fixing my own. And I wanted to lead by example. But then I tried to find other things in life that I enjoy it because I did realize that music was the only thing I really had, and when I lost music, I felt like I had nothing. So I needed to find a new way to create and a new way to do something. Actually hit up a brother man, Luke Curry Baylor. Luke and I've always been obsessed with photography and photos and different and painting and a different forms of artwork. And Luke supporting me and getting my first camera and teach me how to use it, and we linked up and we actually become really really good friends over that time. COVID talking about cameras. Now it's my way and opportunity because I found something else. But I can stick my I can be in the middle of a festival run in Sydney and if I'm sick of everyone, I just need a bit of mental health. So I put my headphones in a blast of sex pistols and I pissed up and take photos of things and try to make things look pretty. It's my own way of being artistic where I don't have to rely so much on music. I don't have to rely on having a studio and writing and touring. I can do that whenever I want. And I've been very lucky to have a lot of community across the country kind of support me in my photography and give me some tips and help me out. And black lenses help me out a little bit. And you know, finding something else. And don't let your identity. Don't let let your social media or what you're perceived as become your identity. Don't let that be who you are. My identity was you know. Again, as I said at the beginning, if you're from community as Benny Clark, if you're not from a community, probably know me. It's Benny Clark. The place for baker boy, any kind of place with baker boy. It's not an identity, it's not a real person. That's not who I am. Yeah, when you see me at the march or at the house service or just wandering around Fitzroy, that's that's me. That's who I really am. So I want to show that on social media more and I want to want my identity to be me and not what these are. What you're you're supposed to be social Are you supposed to.

00:51:29
Speaker 1: Look the idea of you or whatever? Yeah, I think it's I think it's really cool. Thank you so much for sharing that, because I hear you about the contradiction about you know, when you're working in this space. I was a former counselor. I was ironically a drug and alcohol counselor, and I was battling my own drug and alcohol problems, which you know, so it is this kind of weird and I think it's just human nature. You know, we're really good at, you know, seeing issues from outside of ourselves, but seldom do we take out own advice. But it is kind of cool to hear you be so open and honest about your journey and even how you being honest on that public scale led you to connect with say Luke and this other part of you through photography in another form of art and expression, which might I add, you're really good at that as well. It's kind of like, is there anything you have doing that in that toolkit of yours? But lots of you, But I think it's really cool. Like I had a phone call with one of my brothers the other day, like, and he had that courage to sort of actually be explicit in asking for help and let me know that he wasn't coping. And you know, for a moment there, I really didn't know how to respond because you know, we're in the business of this, but we often don't do it. And you know, my family very strong and very proud, and you know, to sit with him in that and try to just be with him in that space and not problem solve or coach or counsel or go into you know, just be with him in that emotion and just kind of, yeah, give the power of him just expressing what he needed to express, and just for him to be vocal and asking for that was really really powerful for me because we do need to get better at saying that we're having a tough time, and it does really start in a way with being more vulnerable online, and it is such a I hear you about like social media is fake. We all know that, we all you're living in, you know, in a complete and utter egotistical land if you think that it isn't, but there is like this is weird, sort of like paradigm. I guess is that I feel like I'm trying to consciously create a very safe community who can have difficult conversations, who can you know, express themselves. I have people reach out to me all the time, and I'm mindful that everything I put up, you know, I'm always conscious about how is this going to land? You know, is this going to bring people down? Is this? You know, I'm always trying to be very conscious about am I putting up a true and accurate representation of me? And I have a responsibility even though you know, I'm not a huge follow but I've got a community of people who I kind of work with. And so I guess, in a very long winded way, I'm trying to say that we can't eradicate social media, but we can be a bit more, a bit more vulnerable, a bit more real, a bit more authentic online, and we kind of have a responsibility to people to do that, to show that good and the bad and all of the kind of dimensions in between.

00:54:47
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think a couple of points on what you've said, like when and I've actually had conversation with other professionals around you know, it's it's good to tell people to speak up and talk to people, but then how as that person they're speaking to actually react and what do they do and how do they you know, we talk with someone and trigger warning around source sidal ideation. So if someone was to ring, I feel like ending my life and I don't know what to do. How does another person actually react to that? Like? Where is the instead of looking at the fucking Kardashians and all the bullshit on TV, why aren't we promoting safe talk? Why aren't we promoting all these ways to be able to support each other and do all that sort of stuff. And on the other side on the social media realm and speaking of Kardashians and all that bullshit, I am a punk rock kid at heart, and I hate reality TV and I hate this unattainable image and these standards that get put on two people through social media. Everything that I do and have done in life is attainable. Yeah. Everything. I never show you anything that is not real. I never show you anything. Yes, I get to play splendor, but who says it's a sixteen year old kip on me Instagram? Can't play that too? Yeah, why cayn't you do that?

00:56:11
Speaker 1: Yeah? It is such a fine line, though, isn't it. Because I think you're right in showing that things that are attainable, and yeah, like not showing this perfect version of yourself, And because in some ways that could be so inspiring to the person who's on the other side to be like, oh, you know what, Benny Clark's doing this, I can do this, And you could be giving somebody a big g up And you don't even know sort of thing sometimes, so you.

00:56:36
Speaker 3: Don't realize whether you have one hundred followers or one hundred thousand followers. You don't know the impact that you're going to have on that person. Yeah, you have no idea at the top. And I still get told stories and get inboxes and get people come to me that shows and tell me things and that just completely blow me away. And I had no idea and I still have no idea what kind of impact you can have on social media. I remember I Gotta, I Gotta, I got relayed a story around a kid that has quite far on the spectrum and has aspergers and is autistic. And I found out that this kid watches my drum videos to regulate. Wow, And I was just like, what what my shitty little drum covers I do? Because I'm board on the weekend and have no friends that actually did. So you just don't know what's what. Everything you put up, in, everything you say, everything you do and represent is going to have an impact in some way. Doesn't mean you can't be fancy and show you cool holiday and be called for a little bit. That's perfectly fine. I live your life and do your thing. But if you're going to get on some high horseship, just remember that everything is going to have some form of impact on another human being. Social media is so powered.

00:58:00
Speaker 1: It really is. It really is, And I don't even really think as human beings we fully understand that. And I think, I mean, I wish there was a nice, neat answer with it. There's something I certainly really struggle to grapple with, which is, yeah, when values collide. I think I try to be the person who I am in real life, but then I know that you while projecting a version of you. I think also to it's about how you can have integrity and also just take a moment to think about what you're putting out to the world, like yeah, just even pausing for a moment to think what is the intention or the impact of this message or as you say, they have meaning. But also too, I want to flip back to what you said about, you know, mental health when people do are having a difficult time and then they do feel confident in speaking to you. I think, just like having first aid training, there's mental health that a lot of our Aboriginal organizations offer. And I think the as a former counselor and someone who works in this space, the mental health system is has was buckling before and it's buckling now. And so I think we do as communities have a responsibility to understand more about mental health because if something is going on in someone's life, it's usually the friend or the family member or someone who can spot that that person might be withdrawing or having a moment or you know, we see it before they feel they have the courage to sometimes present somewhere, and I think we like just a first aid training, we all should be getting trained and understand mental health because it's going to take communities to support communities on this one. I feel.

00:59:49
Speaker 3: Anyway, there's a brilliant training course that's around the state. So if being Victoria's around, I don't know about other states. We're sure that have something similar. You know, you pay a couple bucks and go to your first DAID. It's day course, run in, run out. Something goes wrong, you probably still wouldn't know what to do, but you know, it gives you the bare bones and the basics on CPR and how to wrap a bandage and whatever else. There is a great program to the stake called safe Talk. Not many people know about it, and it's not for industry professionals. It's not, you know, a three week course through an average organization. It's not a professional thing. It is a bare bones. If someone says this, you do this. Here is a little pamphlet with a Q cards on how to deal with certain situations safe talk. I've done safe talk a couple of times, so a lot of a bit of my background has been in social adiation, self harm and that kind of stuff through most of my career, so I've done a lot of training and that and that Safe Talk one is brilliant. It's your first day course one O one. It doesn't go into mental health, it doesn't go into the need greedy of all the things surrounding. It's someone contacts you or you're scared that someone might be in danger. This is what you do.

01:01:08
Speaker 1: How do you respond? Amazing? I spond, Yeah, I'm just having a little dorry here, bras And yeah, it's so it's a half day alertness workshop that prepares anyone over the age of fifteen as well. Which is there you go. That is so awesome to hear. Thank you for sharing that. I'm definitely going to be putting that, you know, with respect into our show notes because yeah, it's a complicated one, but I want to thank you for sharing that, you know and going there and just you know, I guess getting acquainted with all the many layers and dimensions to Benny Clark, which has been so cool, very cool. I guess, you know, to kind of maybe maybe wrap up in a bit of a lighter note, but I just want to acknowledge thank you, you know, really thank you for sharing, and thank you for keep speaking up and being your authentic self. And yeah, I think paving away for some of these more difficult conversations, especially as a black father, as a man in our community, we need our men to feel empowered to say that they're not coping. And yeah, I just want to take my hat off to you for that, So thank you.

01:02:12
Speaker 3: Before you go to the positive bit, I do want to mention two things on that subject, but anyone that might want your two basic barebone supports and how to deal with someone in that situation. Yes, one, shut up and listen. It's not about you, it's about them. Sometimes saying nothing speaks louder than telling someone who's training their own story, shut up and listen, it's not about you. Second of or if you're worried about someone, all these people sitting to go but you don't talk about it, you need to be really kind. You need to be no, ask, be very straightforward, bring up the uncomfortable conversation. Brus you okay, Yeah, no, you're not okay. I can see that you're not okay. We need to talk. I'm concerned for you, I'm worried about you, and I'm scared you may do something. We need to have a conversation. Don't tiptoe around it, ask because sometimes that opens up that gives them the opportunity to go, you know what, I'm not not okay, I don't know what to do.

01:03:08
Speaker 1: And then what do you do?

01:03:09
Speaker 3: Then you shut up and listen because it's not about you, it's about them.

01:03:12
Speaker 1: Yes, thank you, thank you for sharing that. No, you're right, You're right, there's I mean, I would just want to add a little bit to that, which is, Yeah, when a person has the courage to express their emotion, there's so much power in silence. I mean, we feel like we always need to fill the space with stuff, but if you watch any animal in the wild or anyone have an emotional charged experience, they need the ability to just have that just held and just sit with that in that moment with them and not problems sol like, not have answers. Just listen as you say, Yeah, I mean I think the also too is that yeah, people calling it out, like you say, you know, I've noticed this, I've observed this. You know, I'm concerned because like just being a bit more direct can help somebody who is struggling to maybe feel like they have the safety net to speak up. Yeah, thank you for sharing that. Thank you. I appreciate that. Well, I guess you know, I mean, probably doesn't feel very right now, but I wanted to just ask. You wear many hats, and you navigate these worlds, the dualities and complexities of them all, and I want to know, like, where do you draw your inspiration from? Is it a person? Is it a thing? Like how do you like what kind of inspires the absolute shit out of you when you're having those kind of days.

01:04:38
Speaker 3: So it might sound a little wanky, but it didn't really hit me until after COVID. So COVID's very much taught me about being not taking things for granted. And you know, we can lose so much so quickly, and it's you know, COVID for me, was the closest thing I'd ever come to losing everything in my life and not having one and going down the path of not waking up the next day. COVID has really taught me those small things and the thing that now current really inspires me the most out of anything. And I could throw different drummers at you and different people and whatever else, But the day that we started the march in Natok and the people that I saw, And it wasn't social media. People weren't asking me about Baker Boy. People weren't. There was nothing about mental health, There was nothing about anything. It was about us. It was about our community. It was about the people I surrounded myself via Sue and Lydia, Anie, Pam, like Stacy, Leslie, Candice, like all these amazing people that are in my life and our ridiculous community.

01:05:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, shout out those sisters, by the way, love love, love and respect for all of them. Yeah.

01:06:04
Speaker 3: When I finally had that back, Yeah, and when we got in that march, it was like, holy shit, this is what's actually important.

01:06:12
Speaker 1: Yeah.

01:06:13
Speaker 3: I can lose everything tomorrow that makes me Benny Clark, the drama, the photographer, the mental health worker, the the whatever identity and hat that I wear. As long as I have that community and that community is with me, I can lose everything tomorrow and I couldn't care. Yeah, bother me.

01:06:31
Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that, I really want.

01:06:34
Speaker 3: Yeah. And I could rattle up another one hundred thousand people that are at that march, or at the Nate Opera, at the ball, at the National at the whatever else. Yeah, but the fact that I have that, Yeah, you can't take that away.

01:06:49
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's one of those things like for black fellows who were so humble. It's never about the titles, it's never about the accolades, it's never about It's always been about what's in your heart and mob and community is what kind of makes you you?

01:07:05
Speaker 3: And yeah, my identity is bene heat Gunna Kernoman. Nothing else that I do makes me who I am. Yeah, that's what makes me who I am.

01:07:15
Speaker 1: Oof feel that, feel that, I feel that in my soul. You're right, it is. You know that there's a lot of pressure sometimes on us being black, excellence and all of these things. But when you strip away all of that, what are you left with inside? And who are you? And Yeah, it's kind of nice to say that to hear you say that, and just how important it is just to be with our people.

01:07:41
Speaker 3: Everything else we do is great and supportive and smart and knowledgeable and completely irrelevant to who we are.

01:07:51
Speaker 1: Wow, you're right.

01:07:54
Speaker 3: Work, that's what I do, not who I am. I'm a drummer, That's what I do, not who I am. Yeah, I'm the Night of March and my gun I'm Colonelman from Gippsland. That's who I am, not what I do. Yeah, everything else we do is amazing and fantastic and accolades and politics and everything we do is fantastic and has nothing to do with who we are as human beings. Yeah, to get back to the core of who we are and our community.

01:08:18
Speaker 1: Is who we are exactly. And it's so nice and beautiful and special that we all, you know, are still navigating this pandemic sure, but have abilities to come back together because there's parts of us that were missing during that period and we're getting kind of reacquainted with that and it feels like it feels like home in a way those things. So yeah, I love that. Well, that's a really beautiful way to sort of like finish out what's been a really lovely chat and getting to know, yeah, all the parts to who you are really so.

01:08:52
Speaker 3: Thank you, Yeah, thank you for having me.

01:08:55
Speaker 1: I really appreciate that. Oh, thank you, Thank you so much for listening you mob. If you are vibing this season and yarning up, then please head over to Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts from to show us some love, rate and review. Alternatively, you can get in contact and give us some feedback by visiting www. Dot Caroline Coow, dot com dot au