Edward Erdelac

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With tranquil energy and peaceful thoughts, I welcome you to an extremely curated, meticulously
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edited, easygoing and tame podcast.
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This is Domesticated Housecat, the interview show.
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Wrong.
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Get ready for a wild fucking ride.
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The FCC and cowards aren't welcome here.
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This is Without Sensor, the GRM interview podcast.
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Oh yeah, man.
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That song gets me every time.
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I don't know what it is.
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I don't know if it's because I'm saying fuck the government or what have you, but man,
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it just gets me going.
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Anyways, welcome everyone to episode number two of the Without Sensor podcast.
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As always, if you're a fan of us, you know who I am.
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I'm Josh and I'm here today also with Adam.
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Howdy.
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Today, we have a very, very special guest.
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Now I don't want to give the guest too much credit, but you know, our first opening guest
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was probably the most famous person we've ever seen in our lives.
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But this guy right here, oh man, he might be very close.
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So without further ado, let me give my...
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Oh, go ahead.
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You got to wash his balls?
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Oh yeah.
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Well, yeah, just listen.
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Just like I watched Lana Max balls, I got to wash every guest's balls.
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And I'm thinking that this is probably going to be a thing every episode is I'm just going
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to give an intro in this fashion to everyone.
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So it's only fair, I guess, right?
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True story.
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This is my, for those of you who listened to episode one, you'll know this is what this
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is.
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This is my Bruce Buffer fucking boxing introduction.
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Wait a minute.
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Yes, there it is.
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Okay, sorry.
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I fucked up.
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He is the 16 time published author with dozens and dozens of published short stories and
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articles.
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He has been called a wizard of wordsmithery, a numinous novelist, if you will.
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He sits upon the edicule of editorial eminence.
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He has been called the Leonidas of literary luster and will kick you into a giant hole
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of $20 words from which you will never escape.
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He is Edward, the excellence of exposition.
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Oh, yeah.
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Oh, there he is.
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What's going on, Ed?
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What's happening?
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Thank you guys.
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Thank you.
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Thank you.
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Probably more special and famous, but I appreciate the intro.
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Well, you know, Ed, honestly, I really do think you deserve it because, man, you put
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in the work to say the least.
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Say what you will.
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Again, much like us, say what you will.
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If people don't like us, that's fine, but you can't deny that the work has been done.
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Same goes for you.
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The work has been done.
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Yes.
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The anthology of books you have written, Andersonville, I believe it was Once Upon a Time in the
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Weird West and a number of books that you have written.
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I mean, certainly there have been many people that have tried to complete a novel or a book,
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but you, sir, have done what was the number 16?
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Sixteen times I sat my butt in a chair.
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Yeah.
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It's something to say.
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It's bragging rights, I guess.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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It takes some.
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It takes some discipline, but a lot of people have stories and not a lot of people have
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the discipline, I guess, to just sit down and write.
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But I got that if nothing else.
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Yeah, no, no, for sure.
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Hold on to say Adam's having a little bit of headphone trouble here.
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So try it.
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Try clicking it on the on the bottom part, like the part that it connects into where
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you connect into the extender.
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Try wiggling around that.
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Maybe unplug it and plug it back in.
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Man, this this old technology.
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You got it now?
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Yeah, I think I'm good now.
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OK, all right.
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Anyway, so sorry.
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The the mensch with no name.
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I was trying to get so these are to me.
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This is like really interesting because, you know, some of the and I don't want to rush
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too much into some of the things that we'll talk about.
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But, you know, for somebody like myself that I'm no expert at, you know, Western films,
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but you know, somebody that appreciates like Sergio Leone, I thought it was cool, cool
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nods of titles you made there.
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And then, yeah, I mean, even for you to write historical fiction, that is certainly a task
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in and of itself not only to write about the during, you know, the Civil War period and
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creating characters and dialogue that reflects those times.
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I mean, dude, that is that is quite the feat.
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So props to you for all that you've accomplished.
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And yeah, let Josh go ahead and take it.
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Oh, well, OK, so before we get into the, you know, Inquisition, if you will.
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What Ed, do you have expect that nobody expects that?
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It's correct.
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No one ever expects the the game rage Inquisition.
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So do you have any social medias or any kind of anything to plug right here at the beginning
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before we we get into it while we still have people's attention?
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You know, story.
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I mean, social media wise, I mean, yeah, I've got my Facebook.
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And if you can spell my last name, you can find me pretty much anywhere on the Internet,
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basically.
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OK, I got a I got a I have a blog, you know, I'm on Twitter.
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I'm a little bit on Instagram.
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Tick tock.
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I have not dipped my toe in.
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But it's pretty much you look at my if you look if you can spell my name, you can find
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me.
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I'm all over the place.
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I got a new book coming out tomorrow.
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Thirteenth, it's kind of a Friday the 13th take like just the Friday the 13th to end
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all Friday 13th is what I call it.
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And it debuts tomorrow.
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So that's that's the latest thing.
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What could you tell us about the book itself?
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Well, it's imagine.
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So like, I mean, I can talk about how I came to write it or I could just like you want
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the short answer or the long answer, basically.
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I mean, it's up to you.
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We have all the time.
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So there's no there's no time limit here.
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So the only thing I could say, don't try to spoil it for some of the readers out there.
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All right.
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Give us a spoiler free synopsis, I would say.
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Basically the concept is it's so it's imagine all the names change, you know, because I'm
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dealing with somebody else's property.
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It's kind of a pastiche like John Scalzi's red shirts or something like that.
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You know, Star Trek, but he just seems all the names and everything.
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So this is like if Friday the 13th were to encompass the entire crazy continuity, you
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know, where he's body hopping and like in part nine and he's like, you know, he turns
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back into a child in Manhattan and like goes into space and all that in ten like encompasses
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all of that.
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I was trying to basically like basically like make sense of all that continuity and everything.
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I used to write for Star Wars.
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And one of the things that we did before Disney took over and everything that was kind of
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like the pull of writing for Star Wars or the main drive was to like take stuff that
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didn't make sense and kind of like make it make sense.
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And like in the old days of Marvel, they used to call it like a no prize basically, like
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you something something didn't gel and we would as writers make a gel and everything.
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So for this Friday the 13th, you know, is about to be rebooted.
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They're going to have that show this year.
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Crystal Lake or something.
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I think so.
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They're probably going to throw out the whole old continuity and everything.
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And I grew up watching that and everything.
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And I was like, I'm never going to get a chance to write this.
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So I'm just going to do it myself.
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You know, I'm just going to put it out there for the love basically and everything.
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And it's something it's something I've never tried before.
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Like normally I'm just writing my own stuff and everything.
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This is like a total pastiche, but it's like it takes place after a friend versus Jason,
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but before 10.
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So it's like, imagine that Jason has suddenly come back and this in my book, he's called
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Joshua Joshua hotter after Kane hotter and everything.
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So he comes back again as he always does.
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And his modus operandi has changed.
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He's not just hanging around New Jersey.
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He's going like all over the country, like killing people.
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And it turns out that he's killing all the people who have ever defeated him.
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But he's killing all the final girls, all the final guys, whatever.
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And each time he kills somebody, he becomes stronger and faster and stuff.
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And so Jason's father, who was never has never been in the series, you know, Joshua's father
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in this comes back from like a like a mission, like a Christian mission in like Guatemala.
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He's like a priest and he comes back and he wants to gather the survivors together.
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The last survivors, which is like the Tommy Jarvis character and the daughter of the psychic
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from parts part seven, you know, and everything.
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And like a couple of the other characters and stuff.
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One of the survivors from Jason takes Manhattan and gather them all together to kind of face
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down Jason one last time and send him back to hell for for good basically, because kind
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of to like redeem himself and everything, redeem his son's crimes and everything.
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So the basic just is that it's like all the final girls and guys getting together from
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all the movies to fight Jason one more time and everything.
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Sounds interesting.
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I so with the Halloween series that Rob Zombie, I believe, rebooted and how he kind of created,
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I guess, exposition for Mike Myers himself.
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Would there be something similar in the novel itself where because you are bringing in the
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father figure into the fold for the Jason character, would you give him a little bit
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of a little bit of a sympathetic background or is that completely out the window that
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this is a nefarious character altogether and there is no redeemable?
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Definitely for me, out of all the like major Hollywood slashers, you know, Freddie, Michael
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Myers, Chuckie, whatever the most sympathetic one to me has always been Jason, because like,
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you know, he he dies, you know, not of his own volition.
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He's bullied and pushed into a, you know, or falls into a lake, you know, and then the
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counselors are supposed to be watching him or not watching him and he drowns and he sees
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his mother killed.
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So he's out for revenge.
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Right.
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Because his mother's mother's the only one that ever, you know, there's a Norman Bates
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thing where mother's the only one that kind of like cared for him and stuff.
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And there's also so I watched these with my daughters and stuff.
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Right.
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And my daughter kind of made the observation and I've heard it elsewhere before too, but
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it's like Jason never kills children, you know, because in his mind, he's kind of childlike
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himself and everything.
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Right.
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And there's there's only there's only one entry.
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I think it's part six where the kids actually show up to the camp instead of the counselors.
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And he never he stalks right through their sleeping bunk and everything, but he doesn't
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kill any kids ever.
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So I always feel like Jason is kind of he's kind of I wouldn't call him an antihero because
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he's slaughtering everybody, you know, that basically gets a boner.
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He's out to kill.
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But there's definitely like part of part of the inspiration for this also was like years
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ago.
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I don't know how many years ago, Stephen King, like put out a tweet or something that like
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he'd like to write something from Jason's point of view.
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And I kind of dug into my head and I was like, not only did I want to do that, it had kind
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of already been done.
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So one of the first things there were two books that I can point to, two adult books
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that I can point to that kind of inspired me to write and everything.
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Because I was reading, you know, I read like Beverly Cleary and Judy Blume and all that
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stuff when I was a kid, you know, but Nicola and all that shit.
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But not that it's great.
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But yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Like about eighth grade or something.
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I was going to Catholic school and Sister Marie read us out loud.
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Jack London's called wild.
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And besides the, you know, the whatever the pull of a nun sitting down and cussing all
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the time, she's reading this out loud.
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And the ending of that book is like super bloody, like the dog buck like spoilers here
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for a hundred year old book jumps into this campfire and slaughters all of these like Native
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Americans, you know, like ribs that wrote sound stuff.
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And it's very like gory and crazy.
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And that kind of threw me for a loop, you know, that that was like going to happen in
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a book that I could happen in a book.
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So I was reading.
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So my parents were very like, boy, this is like spiraling.
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I don't know if I'm talking about my parents now.
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We're going to get into all that.
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Probably.
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But psyche here.
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So, so, okay.
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So we'll just, we'll just say that's your new book coming out called 13th.
241
00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:17,760
What 13th, 13th, right?
242
00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:18,760
That's what it's called.
243
00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:19,760
13th.
244
00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:20,760
Okay.
245
00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:22,960
So we're going to get into that book and we're just real quick for everybody before we get
246
00:14:22,960 --> 00:14:26,400
deep in the weeds here, where can everybody buy it?
247
00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,920
Just or where can they get it?
248
00:14:28,920 --> 00:14:31,280
You can get that on Amazon and Kindle and print.
249
00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:33,280
They don't let you preorder.
250
00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:35,640
They don't let you create preorders for print, but it drops tomorrow.
251
00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:37,140
It's already on preorder for Kindle.
252
00:14:37,140 --> 00:14:38,140
So it'll be out.
253
00:14:38,140 --> 00:14:39,140
Paperback drops tomorrow.
254
00:14:39,140 --> 00:14:40,140
So it'll be out January.
255
00:14:40,140 --> 00:14:41,140
What?
256
00:14:41,140 --> 00:14:42,140
Wait, what's tomorrow?
257
00:14:42,140 --> 00:14:43,140
12th.
258
00:14:43,140 --> 00:14:44,140
Okay.
259
00:14:44,140 --> 00:14:45,140
So January 12th for the people listening to this.
260
00:14:45,140 --> 00:14:46,140
So if you're listening to this, it's already out.
261
00:14:46,140 --> 00:14:47,920
So you can go to Amazon or wherever.
262
00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:48,920
Yeah.
263
00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:49,920
For all you slasher fanatics out there.
264
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:50,920
Yeah.
265
00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:51,920
Barnes and Noble.
266
00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:52,920
Yeah.
267
00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:53,920
Barnes and Noble.
268
00:14:53,920 --> 00:14:55,640
Now, do you, is it just coming out in English?
269
00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:56,960
Because I mean, we are hot in Belgium.
270
00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:59,640
So is English the only language it's in?
271
00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:00,640
Oh, okay.
272
00:15:00,640 --> 00:15:01,640
All right.
273
00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:02,640
So to the Belgians?
274
00:15:02,640 --> 00:15:03,640
Until I find a Belgian translator.
275
00:15:03,640 --> 00:15:04,640
Yeah.
276
00:15:04,640 --> 00:15:05,640
Sorry.
277
00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:06,640
There's one out there.
278
00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:07,640
Hey, it's all right.
279
00:15:07,640 --> 00:15:08,640
Hey, you know what?
280
00:15:08,640 --> 00:15:10,440
Maybe we can, maybe if there's one out there, you can hit us up and we can, we can get this
281
00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:11,440
made in Belgium.
282
00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:12,440
All right.
283
00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:14,840
So we'll do a Belgian audio book.
284
00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:16,000
Yeah, absolutely.
285
00:15:16,000 --> 00:15:17,000
So all right.
286
00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:18,000
Anyways.
287
00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:22,040
So let's dial it back a little bit and let's just kind of, just to give everybody a nice
288
00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:26,480
little backstory on, on Ed, the author, right?
289
00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:27,480
Oh yeah.
290
00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:29,480
So going back to my parents.
291
00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:30,480
Right.
292
00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:31,480
Yeah.
293
00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:33,640
So going back to your, your, your parents and your abusive child.
294
00:15:33,640 --> 00:15:34,640
I mean, wait.
295
00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:35,640
Not at all.
296
00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:36,640
Not at all.
297
00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:37,640
Yeah.
298
00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:38,640
Yeah.
299
00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:39,640
Good.
300
00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:43,080
So my dad was a cop and my mom's a nurse, that kind of thing, whatever, but they were
301
00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:44,720
very like, it was a Catholic household.
302
00:15:44,720 --> 00:15:45,720
Yeah.
303
00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:50,760
And I had a Catholic grandmother and they were very, they were very like on me about
304
00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:51,760
what I watched.
305
00:15:51,760 --> 00:15:52,760
You know what I mean?
306
00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:53,760
Like I couldn't watch rated R movies.
307
00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:58,400
I couldn't watch PG and stuff, but I could read absolutely anything I wanted.
308
00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:03,520
So instead of watching rated R movies, I would get the paperbacks, like the novelizations
309
00:16:03,520 --> 00:16:04,520
and shit.
310
00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:05,520
Yeah.
311
00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:09,480
So I'd read like a lot of Alan Dean Foster, a lot of like, you know, guys that were doing
312
00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:11,120
an adaptation back then and everything.
313
00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:14,240
And the first, so the second, I was talking about the two books that kind of influenced
314
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:15,960
me to be a writer.
315
00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:21,760
The second one besides Jack London, which sounds like crazy, Ingham Minyus or whatever,
316
00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:29,200
but it was the Simon Hawks novelization of Flight of the 13th, part six, Jason Lentz.
317
00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:33,040
I got it off the rack in my mall, like went in the mall or something.
318
00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:37,280
I sat in the backseat of the parking lot and I read this thing like in an hour or two hours
319
00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:39,000
or something like cover to cover.
320
00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,480
Like it was the fastest thing I ever read.
321
00:16:41,480 --> 00:16:47,280
And I was saying, Stephen King had tweeted this thing about writing for Jason's POV and
322
00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:48,560
everybody was like, oh, what a great idea.
323
00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:52,160
Simon Hawke did that in Friday the 13th, part six, his novelization.
324
00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:57,440
There were parts where you jumped into Jason's head and those were the most compelling to
325
00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:04,680
me because it was like, it was just a peek at this just brain full of like disorder and
326
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:09,800
rage and like, you know, it was gorier than anything that ever showed up in any of the
327
00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:10,800
movies.
328
00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:15,080
And he was chasing down Tommy and thinking about how much he hated Tommy and like he
329
00:17:15,080 --> 00:17:19,880
wanted to reach into his like, you know, chest cavity and pull out his entrails and flame
330
00:17:19,880 --> 00:17:21,520
in the trees and all kinds of stuff.
331
00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:27,880
It was really wild shit, you know, really like gnarly and just the visceralness of the
332
00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:31,560
read kind of made me like, wow, I want to do this thing.
333
00:17:31,560 --> 00:17:32,880
I want to do this kind of thing too.
334
00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:33,880
You know?
335
00:17:33,880 --> 00:17:34,880
Yeah.
336
00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:35,880
So I don't know.
337
00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:42,040
It's a weird dichotomy to say like my two most influential books were Jack London and
338
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,000
the novelization of Friday the 13th, part six.
339
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,000
How old were you at this point?
340
00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:51,120
Jesus would have been like 89 or 88 or something like that.
341
00:17:51,120 --> 00:17:53,680
So I wasn't, I wasn't out of middle school yet.
342
00:17:53,680 --> 00:17:57,000
So like 13, maybe 12.
343
00:17:57,000 --> 00:17:58,000
Okay.
344
00:17:58,000 --> 00:17:59,000
13 on 13.
345
00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:00,000
So that would be pretty amazing.
346
00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:01,000
That's true.
347
00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:06,000
So that was, that was about the time when you kind of were thinking, okay, I kind of
348
00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:10,280
want to maybe do this or kind of get into writing.
349
00:18:10,280 --> 00:18:15,440
And so once, once you hit, had that hit, what was your first, what was the first thing that
350
00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:20,840
you wrote that you ever wrote with you being in mind of like, Oh, I want to be an author.
351
00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:22,440
The first thing I started writing.
352
00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:25,480
So I was watching a bunch of, I started sneaking movies at the same time.
353
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:29,960
I'm like, Oh, actually I think I saw like an edited for version, edit for TV version
354
00:18:29,960 --> 00:18:31,240
of the road warrior.
355
00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:36,440
So like the first thing I started writing, I filled up notebooks of this story about
356
00:18:36,440 --> 00:18:38,200
this guy who was like, it was in the future.
357
00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:42,560
It was a post-apocalyptic future, but there was still like technology and he was a truck
358
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:48,840
driver and he was like, it was kind of like, uh, so mass communications had dropped all
359
00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:53,880
over the world and everything relied on like courier services and stuff.
360
00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:58,280
Like there were no GPS, there were no GPS back then, but like, you know, there was no
361
00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:01,880
mass communications, so everything relied on courier services and this trucker had to
362
00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:08,320
like, had this, uh, he got hired to like get the satellite component that they would launch
363
00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:11,520
into space that would turn the whole network back on or something.
364
00:19:11,520 --> 00:19:13,600
So everybody was after him and shit.
365
00:19:13,600 --> 00:19:16,080
And, uh, his name was clutch Barracuda.
366
00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:17,080
I remember that.
367
00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:19,240
Oh, what a great fucking name for it.
368
00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:21,200
That's a great character.
369
00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:22,200
Right.
370
00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:23,200
Yeah.
371
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:28,120
And, uh, I filled up notebooks were of this like road warrior, like barely disguised road
372
00:19:28,120 --> 00:19:30,120
warrior thing and everything.
373
00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:37,320
Uh, you know, the trucks were kind of like, you remember masked mass crusaders.
374
00:19:37,320 --> 00:19:38,320
I've seen that.
375
00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:39,320
Yeah.
376
00:19:39,320 --> 00:19:40,320
I've seen it.
377
00:19:40,320 --> 00:19:43,720
So I know what you're talking about with the truck with the like jet that could, you know,
378
00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,400
the trailer would open up and then be a jet in the back and take off.
379
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:50,240
And so it was all that kind of, it was ripping off basically everything that I loved at the
380
00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:51,240
time, you know?
381
00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:52,240
Yeah.
382
00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:56,000
So, I mean, that's most of most creativity when you're, when you're starting out is,
383
00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:00,840
is just homages or, I mean, you call it ripping off as an extreme version, but yeah, you're
384
00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:04,120
just kind of inspired and that's coming out, right?
385
00:20:04,120 --> 00:20:05,880
Um, in your works.
386
00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:10,080
So you, uh, you are, you imitate what you're, what you're inspired by.
387
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:11,080
Yeah.
388
00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:13,120
Like you, you grab everything that's around you that you love and then you want to do
389
00:20:13,120 --> 00:20:15,760
it when you just do the same thing for a while.
390
00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,240
So it was road warrior, but like extremely gory.
391
00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:19,240
Yeah.
392
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:20,240
Okay.
393
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:25,120
So as any 14 year old or 15 year old would probably be, you know, right.
394
00:20:25,120 --> 00:20:26,120
Taking it to the extreme.
395
00:20:26,120 --> 00:20:27,120
So, okay.
396
00:20:27,120 --> 00:20:31,620
So you, you, you get that going and you do that, you fill up the notebooks.
397
00:20:31,620 --> 00:20:38,400
So from, from that day that you wrote your first thing or your first not novelization,
398
00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:42,440
cause I mean, I don't know how, how deep you got into it, but when from that point, did
399
00:20:42,440 --> 00:20:46,440
you actually get something out there?
400
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:50,160
I mean, I don't know if published is the right word, but what was the, what was the, what
401
00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:52,840
was the timeframe of, Hey, here I am.
402
00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:56,480
I'm writing this first, not this first idea down on paper.
403
00:20:56,480 --> 00:21:01,520
And then now how many years later and then what, what was the thing that was published
404
00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:02,520
first?
405
00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:05,400
Was it that, was it that old Mad Max satellite story or?
406
00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:06,400
No, definitely not.
407
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:07,400
Definitely not.
408
00:21:07,400 --> 00:21:09,040
I tried to do that as a script actually.
409
00:21:09,040 --> 00:21:15,680
And the funny part is I adapted, I made it like, I made it that he was out to avenge
410
00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:17,920
somebody and you think it's his wife the whole time.
411
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:23,640
And then it turns out it's his dog and then they did John Wick and I was like, Oh, you
412
00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:28,440
know what sucks too is that that twisted metal show on whatever Paramount I think it is.
413
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:32,080
They that's kind of the same because twisted metal didn't really have a story, the video
414
00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:33,080
game.
415
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,760
So they took a thing where basically it's the apocalypse and it's courier services that
416
00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:39,180
are going around and anything that got, it has to get delivered.
417
00:21:39,180 --> 00:21:41,160
So it's like, Oh man, that sucks.
418
00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:42,160
They already did it.
419
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:43,160
It's like guys.
420
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:44,160
Yeah, exactly.
421
00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:48,000
The collective consciousness, don't put it down.
422
00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:49,000
Somebody else does.
423
00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:50,000
That's always what happens.
424
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:51,000
Yeah.
425
00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:52,000
True story.
426
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,640
But the first thing we think of so my timeframe, that was like 93.
427
00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:59,280
I graduated high school and I was writing that thing all through high school and passing
428
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:01,640
it to my friends and they loved it and stuff and everything.
429
00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:06,360
Even though it looked like, it looked like, you know, the killer from seven, it looked
430
00:22:06,360 --> 00:22:12,880
like those notebooks cramped ass writing, threw up on the subway on this guy's shoes.
431
00:22:12,880 --> 00:22:21,760
But so from 93, I started like, I moved to Chicago, like from, I was in the suburbs.
432
00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:23,600
I was in County, Mid-City where the blues brothers are from.
433
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:28,000
I moved up to Chicago, uptown and I was writing there.
434
00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:31,200
I was trying to submit to like a famous science fiction magazine.
435
00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:33,600
I was getting rejected, all that kind of stuff.
436
00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:38,400
And then I went into film school and I turned to screenwriting and like student films and
437
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:39,400
stuff like that.
438
00:22:39,400 --> 00:22:40,400
Right.
439
00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:47,760
And so actually the first thing I ever, ever got published, like I was a kid, I wrote like
440
00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:53,080
a poem about Billy the kid or some shit to some like Billy, because I was in a young
441
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:54,640
guns phase, you know?
442
00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:55,640
Yeah.
443
00:22:55,640 --> 00:23:01,720
And I wrote some like poem about Billy the kid to some like crazy, you know, Billy the
444
00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:02,720
Kid fan club thing.
445
00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:03,720
And they put it in a newsletter.
446
00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:06,800
That was the first thing I ever, ever got published.
447
00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:12,600
But the first time I was ever professionally published, it didn't happen until like maybe
448
00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:14,760
2008 or something.
449
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:16,240
Like that's how long it took, you know?
450
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:17,240
Oh wow.
451
00:23:17,240 --> 00:23:18,240
So we're talking about 19.
452
00:23:18,240 --> 00:23:19,240
Yeah.
453
00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:20,240
Like 20, 20 years or so.
454
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:21,240
Yeah.
455
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:28,280
Like from 1998 when I was, you know, getting, getting out of film school until about 2008.
456
00:23:28,280 --> 00:23:30,640
Was when you were, you were, that's when I was seriously writing.
457
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:31,640
Yeah.
458
00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:34,960
And then it's, so it took about 10 years from when you started seriously getting into it
459
00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,480
to get something actually published.
460
00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:42,440
And it was a British magazine that posted like bought a short story of mine finally
461
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:49,360
or something that was about like, like Blackfoot Indians hunting vampires, you know, or something
462
00:23:49,360 --> 00:23:50,360
crazy.
463
00:23:50,360 --> 00:23:54,200
I remember they, they would like, it was, I was a little bit, a little bit near dark.
464
00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:55,560
They would hide from the sun and everything.
465
00:23:55,560 --> 00:24:00,080
I remember the Indians came across the camp and they were like, the horses were all there,
466
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:04,080
but the guys were under buffalo robes with the, with the reins tied around their like
467
00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:06,160
wrists or something.
468
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:09,480
So when they, they scared the horses, like the horse dragged the guy off into the road
469
00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:12,080
when he caught fire and all this, it was all right.
470
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,120
It was not a bad story, I think.
471
00:24:14,120 --> 00:24:19,920
But how did, how did you, how did you measure success for your writing?
472
00:24:19,920 --> 00:24:28,080
Is it, was it more internal to say that you got, you know, you completed a story and that
473
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:33,640
was where ultimately the satisfaction came from, or was it monetary where, you know,
474
00:24:33,640 --> 00:24:42,000
you mentioned getting added to this UK publishing is where, where does the satisfaction of writing
475
00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:43,000
come for you?
476
00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:49,280
For it used to be like, oh my God, I have to, it changes in increments, you know, as
477
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:51,800
you reach a level, then you want to get to another level, you know?
478
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:56,960
So it's like, first it was like, oh my God, if I don't get published, I know I'll die.
479
00:24:56,960 --> 00:25:00,200
And then you break through that and you start publishing and then you realize, well, I'm
480
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:04,320
publishing, but it's getting into little, it's just a little dinky stuff here and there.
481
00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:06,040
I'm getting like 25 bucks, 28 bucks.
482
00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,520
Then you're like, well, I got to make a big advance or some money or something.
483
00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:15,440
And then I like, at one point I wrote a book for Andersonville was for Delray.
484
00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,960
And I got like, you know, I got a five figure advance for that.
485
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:20,520
So that was like, oh my God, I made it.
486
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:21,520
This is it.
487
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:23,000
You know, now from now on my life's going to change.
488
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:24,800
And now I fucking did not.
489
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:26,480
I'm with Josh.
490
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:27,480
So obviously it didn't.
491
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:28,480
Yeah.
492
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:29,480
Yeah.
493
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:30,480
It's true.
494
00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,560
It actually probably got much worse after that.
495
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:35,280
Well, I mean, it was weird.
496
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:39,560
It was like when the first thing was finally accepted and I made a little bit of money,
497
00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:46,000
I don't know if they, if somehow the community of whatever publishers kind of sees your,
498
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:49,640
that you have credits and then they start, it's like, it's, it's like you break through,
499
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,560
you know, and then other people start buying your stuff.
500
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,320
And I started selling a lot more, you know, things and everything.
501
00:25:55,320 --> 00:25:56,320
Right.
502
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:57,320
So then the measure.
503
00:25:57,320 --> 00:25:58,320
Oh no, go ahead.
504
00:25:58,320 --> 00:25:59,320
Yeah.
505
00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:05,160
Well, the measure of success then becomes, well, I want to do this and nothing else,
506
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:09,760
you know, and that's kind of, that killed me for like a long time.
507
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:14,120
Like I mean, that twisted my guts up for a long time because it's almost impossible.
508
00:26:14,120 --> 00:26:18,040
You know, it's like, you have to have a major, you have to basically get adapted into a movie
509
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,360
if you want to be a writer and make a living at it.
510
00:26:20,360 --> 00:26:25,600
You know, I don't know too many writers that just do books that make a living.
511
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:29,280
I don't know any personally, but I mean, there are some out there.
512
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:30,280
For sure.
513
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:34,080
And there's guys that churn out like, uh, that are like factories, you know, they churn
514
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:38,640
out like a couple of books a year and everything, you know, like on Kindle and stuff.
515
00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:40,760
And I can't do that.
516
00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:46,120
You know, I tried, I tried to like, just be this machine and kind of like, I already aspired
517
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:47,120
to that anyway.
518
00:26:47,120 --> 00:26:48,120
I didn't really try that hard.
519
00:26:48,120 --> 00:26:51,960
I put out like, I average like a book, maybe two a year or something like that.
520
00:26:51,960 --> 00:26:52,960
That's more than most people.
521
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:55,440
But, uh, I, yeah, I couldn't do this.
522
00:26:55,440 --> 00:26:58,840
Like I couldn't do this assembly line kind of writing that a lot of people do and everything
523
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:04,360
where it's just like, you know, uh, Walter Gibson, the guy that wrote the shadow in the
524
00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:09,920
thirties, you know, the pulp, he has the world's record for like the amount of books he could
525
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:10,920
put out.
526
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,200
You know, he put out like hundreds of these shadow novels and it was just him writing
527
00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:16,880
them, you know, and, um, I couldn't do that.
528
00:27:16,880 --> 00:27:20,720
You know, I, I got to like, I maybe it's a historical fiction angle because I kind of
529
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:22,640
gravitate towards that is very research heavy.
530
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:27,640
You know, I take a lot of time on stuff and, uh, more than I, more than I probably should
531
00:27:27,640 --> 00:27:32,720
if I want to make a living at it and be like, you know, constantly, uh, successful.
532
00:27:32,720 --> 00:27:36,600
But yeah, then the measure of success becomes, I want to make a living doing this.
533
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:42,040
But, um, I kind of had to not really give that up, but, uh, you know, I've got kids
534
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:43,600
and everything.
535
00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:47,400
So I've had to work for a living and I have to work like 40 hour jobs, like everybody.
536
00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:54,280
And, uh, the measure of success then kind of becomes, um, for me personally, the, the
537
00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:58,320
kind of the feedback you get from readers and stuff and people and review people that
538
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,480
bother to put up reviews and stuff, you know, if something moves them enough to put up a
539
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,160
review, that becomes pretty cool.
540
00:28:04,160 --> 00:28:09,400
When I, when I did my, uh, my Zorniel Hurston book, my it's like Rainbringer, it's, uh,
541
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:14,400
this home Renaissance writer and I painted her against like Cthulhu mythos stuff and
542
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:18,760
everything, you know, and like, uh, it turned out that a lot of people weren't even aware
543
00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:23,160
of who that woman was, you know, that she was an actual person and stuff.
544
00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,520
And I had people like contact me privately and say, like, you know, I didn't know this
545
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:30,240
was a real person and it led me to her books and I want to thank you for that.
546
00:28:30,240 --> 00:28:31,240
That's pretty cool.
547
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:35,520
You know, like if I said book doesn't sell a million copies, but it brings people to
548
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:39,680
this, you know, forgotten writer who's so much, you know, on a higher level than I am
549
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:40,680
and everything.
550
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:42,480
And it's kind of been forgotten.
551
00:28:42,480 --> 00:28:43,480
That's pretty cool too.
552
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:45,800
You know, so there's like different, there's different levels of success.
553
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:51,400
Now it just, it just depends on, uh, your passion, I guess, you know, like, uh, if you're
554
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:57,240
following your passion, then, and people are enjoying it, you know, then, uh, I feel like
555
00:28:57,240 --> 00:28:59,040
there's some success there.
556
00:28:59,040 --> 00:29:00,400
I still want to make a living at it.
557
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:01,560
You know, I still look towards that.
558
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:08,680
I strive for that, but, uh, in the meantime, you know, this is, it's not, uh, what's the,
559
00:29:08,680 --> 00:29:12,080
what's the phrase something like, it's not the, it's not the best kind of from the, from
560
00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:13,080
the end of the wild bunch.
561
00:29:13,080 --> 00:29:17,640
He says, like, it's not the best life, but it'll do, you know, kind of going with that.
562
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:18,640
Right.
563
00:29:18,640 --> 00:29:19,640
Yeah.
564
00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:26,280
I definitely don't think it's out of the realm of possibility to at least make a, not maybe
565
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:28,640
not necessarily, we're not going to be millionaires, right?
566
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:33,160
But you know, you know, comfortable living, doing what you love.
567
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:36,360
Um, no, it shouldn't, and it shouldn't be, right.
568
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:38,520
Everybody should be able to do what they love and make money doing it.
569
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:42,640
I mean, and I make a little bit of money and enough to like, you know, pay bills once in
570
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:43,640
a while and stuff.
571
00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:44,640
And that's all right.
572
00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:45,640
You know, it's not bad.
573
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:46,640
Yeah.
574
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:47,640
Yeah.
575
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:53,040
I mean, Hey, you know, whatever small victories you can get to keep pushing forward, right?
576
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:54,040
That's the goal.
577
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:57,640
Make maybe enough to break even so that you can continue doing it.
578
00:29:57,640 --> 00:29:58,640
Right.
579
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:03,640
That's, that's kind of the lesson, I guess, until you get a break or whatever it is, you
580
00:30:03,640 --> 00:30:10,240
know, what sucks is, was when I got that advance, you know, like you really do think from then
581
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:12,720
on, you know, are we going to be gravy after this?
582
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:13,720
Right.
583
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:15,720
And then it doesn't come and you're like, Oh man.
584
00:30:15,720 --> 00:30:17,880
You know, and then it's like, I got to go back.
585
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:20,400
It's like getting booted back down in the minor league sometime, you know?
586
00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:21,400
Yeah.
587
00:30:21,400 --> 00:30:22,640
You know, what are you going to do?
588
00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:24,600
You just work at it.
589
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:30,800
The good thing about writing is as opposed to being an athlete, I don't have a time limit
590
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:33,360
on my, you know, my body's not going to give out on me or something.
591
00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:34,360
Right.
592
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:38,160
I can just keep, I can keep writing until you get, until you get, until you get dementia
593
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:43,160
or you know, something, you know, something fucked up like that.
594
00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:45,880
You can, yeah, you can, you can be, you can shit your pants all you want and still be
595
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:47,160
able to fucking write, write books.
596
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:48,160
That's true.
597
00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:49,160
I can write in the bathtub.
598
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:50,160
Yeah, exactly.
599
00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:54,200
Just sit in the tub and do your own shit and just write.
600
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:57,280
Maybe that's what you do is you, that's, that's the code to defeating the matrix here is
601
00:30:57,280 --> 00:31:02,640
you, you get to the point where your brain still works and your body only works enough
602
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:04,360
just to type on a keyboard.
603
00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:08,640
And then you just sit in a tub and you just crank out books for 24 hours a day.
604
00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:09,820
And then that's how you make it.
605
00:31:09,820 --> 00:31:11,560
And then you can't enjoy it because you're a vegetable.
606
00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:15,520
So, you know, yeah, because I'm all, yeah, I can't go to fucking Belize because I'm all
607
00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:16,520
fucked up.
608
00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:17,520
Yeah, exactly.
609
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:18,520
Yeah.
610
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:24,080
So you had mentioned, you know, having to work these, these 40 hour, me and Adam, I
611
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:25,080
mean, I don't know.
612
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:26,720
I call them, I call them the matrix jobs.
613
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:27,720
All right.
614
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:28,720
It's yeah, for sure.
615
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:30,000
It's, it's your horseshit job.
616
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:33,640
You got to do to make enough money to be able to do what you love until you can make the
617
00:31:33,640 --> 00:31:35,940
money doing what you love.
618
00:31:35,940 --> 00:31:38,640
So you had mentioned, you know, you've obviously had to do that.
619
00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:44,400
What are, what are some of the odd jobs or, or interesting jobs you've had to do in your,
620
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:48,680
in your time of, you know, making ends meet?
621
00:31:48,680 --> 00:31:53,560
It's hard to call them interesting, but I have done like a lot of jobs.
622
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:55,760
I mean, I've started off like a grocery stores.
623
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:59,080
I worked all kinds of retail jobs and shit.
624
00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:03,700
One of my favorite jobs that I ever worked, I was a, I was a part-time manager at a revival
625
00:32:03,700 --> 00:32:06,760
movie house, like a 1929 movie theater in Chicago.
626
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:14,760
This famous one called the music box that these two gay Republican dudes bought it for
627
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:19,760
when it was a porno theater and like revamped it and like, and you know, they were antiquarian.
628
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:22,400
So they like refurbished it and made it exactly like it was.
629
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:27,640
So it was like, you know, they fixed the pipe organ and then there was the, there was a
630
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:34,040
facade of it being, it's like a hundred seat theater and it looked like a, like an outdoor,
631
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:36,320
it was painted up to look like you were sitting outdoors.
632
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:37,320
Yeah.
633
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:38,320
At night.
634
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,800
So the ceiling would have these projected lights that would go up to look like clouds
635
00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:43,520
passing over stars and stuff.
636
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:44,520
And it's just beautiful.
637
00:32:44,520 --> 00:32:49,280
It was like, if there was a church, if movies were your God, the music box would be like
638
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:50,280
a church, you know?
639
00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:51,280
Right, right, right.
640
00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:52,280
It was really beautiful.
641
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:57,480
And we had, and we had all these like interesting people come in, not just the usual, like weirdo
642
00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:02,560
cinephiles that just kind of haunt Chicago and everything, but like, you know, we had
643
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:03,560
like Harry house in there.
644
00:33:03,560 --> 00:33:04,560
We had Ray Harry house in there.
645
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:05,560
We had Larry Fishburne.
646
00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:06,560
We had Gregory Peck.
647
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:07,560
I told you my Gregory Peck story.
648
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:15,560
Why don't you give me the Gregory Peck story real quick, if you'd be so kind.
649
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:20,560
So this is like a, you know, Gregory Peck, you know, to kill a mockingbird, this like,
650
00:33:20,560 --> 00:33:25,480
star of stars, you know, this like legendary actor and everything.
651
00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:29,320
And he does a Q and A because his son did a documentary about him or something, whatever
652
00:33:29,320 --> 00:33:34,080
he's there, he's doing a Q and A and it's packed and we're on the sidelines.
653
00:33:34,080 --> 00:33:36,840
The only buddy, Joey, that worked there, we're on the sidelines or whatever.
654
00:33:36,840 --> 00:33:39,680
And we're listening to people stand up and ask questions.
655
00:33:39,680 --> 00:33:44,880
And this nevish guy kind of stands up and gets the meal, they pass him the mic and he
656
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:51,480
proceeds to ask this long, really drawn out and detailed question about like really movie
657
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:57,920
nerd question about like the blocking and the setup and the placement of the scene of
658
00:33:57,920 --> 00:34:02,640
the characters in Masala in the bath house in Ben Hur.
659
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:06,920
And as he's going on and on and on, people start looking and kind of murmuring and all
660
00:34:06,920 --> 00:34:08,720
this shit and everything.
661
00:34:08,720 --> 00:34:10,720
And the guy gets to the end of this thing.
662
00:34:10,720 --> 00:34:13,480
Gregory Peck has like got the mic waiting to answer.
663
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:17,360
He's got that scowl, you know, he's like scowling at you and everything.
664
00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:22,160
And the guy finishes and yes, I just wondered, I don't even remember what the question was,
665
00:34:22,160 --> 00:34:24,680
but it went on for like a while.
666
00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:27,400
And the guy sat down waiting for his answer, whatever.
667
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:32,280
And Gregory Peck stares at him for a minute with the mic and he goes, you do realize,
668
00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:35,440
sir, I wasn't in Ben Hur.
669
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:41,840
The whole freaking theater just erupts in fucking laughter.
670
00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:46,040
And I swear, I said, I think they had to confiscate the guy's shoelaces and belt on the way out
671
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:48,320
because he probably tried to kill himself when he went home.
672
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:50,480
Oh yeah, I'm sure you did man.
673
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:55,200
God, that is such a great fucking story, man.
674
00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:56,200
That's hilarious.
675
00:34:56,200 --> 00:34:59,160
So that was my favorite matrix job.
676
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:05,440
I would consider that a fringe matrix job because you're still kind of like, you're
677
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,040
still being exposed to the arts and like, what's his name?
678
00:35:09,040 --> 00:35:10,200
Roger Ebert would come there.
679
00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:14,600
It was like Gene Siskel's favorite theater and stuff.
680
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:16,200
So it was just cool, man.
681
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:19,720
The people were cool and like, there were so many, I got so many stories out of it.
682
00:35:19,720 --> 00:35:20,720
There were certainly odd characters.
683
00:35:20,720 --> 00:35:23,280
We had a serial masturbator where we always turn the caps.
684
00:35:23,280 --> 00:35:25,280
I mean, it's just crazy.
685
00:35:25,280 --> 00:35:29,640
It could be a movie on its own, you know, this place.
686
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:36,480
And the two gay Republicans with their massive fur coats would come in in the winter.
687
00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:41,560
Like Rufus T. Firefly, Groucho Marx, big ass fur coats from Horse Feathers or something.
688
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:43,240
You know, just on their way.
689
00:35:43,240 --> 00:35:49,160
We're going to Nevis, make sure you, you know, whatever, balance the drawers and blah, blah,
690
00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:50,160
blah.
691
00:35:50,160 --> 00:35:53,440
Anyway, clearly jobs is the only thing.
692
00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:56,880
Probably matrix jobs, the worst I ever had was a city mortgage.
693
00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:57,880
Oh my God.
694
00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:00,280
I worked there for like a temp job.
695
00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:04,600
When I first moved out here to California and I wound up at city mortgage and those
696
00:36:04,600 --> 00:36:08,640
guys were like, it was Cal Fed first and it was an okay place to work.
697
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,040
And then city mortgage bought it.
698
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:16,560
And they wanted to try the temp and they trained all, they want to train all the temps as like
699
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:18,040
loan officers or something.
700
00:36:18,040 --> 00:36:21,720
And the loan officer training went on for like three days or something.
701
00:36:21,720 --> 00:36:25,960
And finally somebody came by my cubicle and was like, Oh, why aren't you in a loan officer
702
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:26,960
training?
703
00:36:26,960 --> 00:36:28,520
And I was like, cause I'm, I don't want to be a loan officer.
704
00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:31,160
I said, I was like, I'm not interested in that and stuff.
705
00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:32,640
I'm cold as being a temp.
706
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:33,640
It's fine.
707
00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:35,840
I was the only one that didn't go to wicked training.
708
00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:40,720
And then it was like, it turned out the city mortgage, like a week before they were going
709
00:36:40,720 --> 00:36:44,120
to do the takeover, like the complete the takeover.
710
00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:48,120
They fired all the temps anyway, even the people that were in the training.
711
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:50,760
So I was like, okay, at least I didn't have to do that.
712
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:55,960
The only thing I remember from that was sitting in on one of those trainings and the guy who
713
00:36:55,960 --> 00:37:01,720
was doing the presentation kept referring to the, the pros, the progress of a home loan
714
00:37:01,720 --> 00:37:04,880
through the system as the pig going through the Python.
715
00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:08,840
He said it over and over and over again, the pig in the Python, this is where the pigs
716
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,640
in the Python and all this is where the pig is in the Python.
717
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:15,080
And Oh, that was awful.
718
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,680
And I ended up fired from there eventually.
719
00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:21,360
I think they forgot I worked there because like I was not doing anything in the last
720
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:22,360
month that I worked here.
721
00:37:22,360 --> 00:37:27,080
I would just come in and open a file and like sit it on my desk.
722
00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:31,320
And then I'd read Gutenberg shit online and play PBM games and stuff.
723
00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:35,360
If anybody walked past my cube, I just turned quickly to look like I was doing something,
724
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:39,080
you know, turn the page of the folder and then just go back to what I was doing.
725
00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:40,080
Yeah.
726
00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:41,080
Yeah.
727
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:43,120
What primarily, you know what?
728
00:37:43,120 --> 00:37:44,520
Oh, I'm sorry.
729
00:37:44,520 --> 00:37:48,680
Yeah, what primarily brought you out to California?
730
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:55,000
Because you kind of mentioned that you are, you know, a passionate writer and reader.
731
00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:57,680
And in addition, I imagine you are also a cinephile.
732
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:04,280
So did you come out to California with the hopes of being a screenwriter or just trying
733
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:06,280
to make it out here, quote unquote?
734
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:07,280
Yeah, absolutely.
735
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:11,880
I went to film school at Columbia in Chicago and that was my thing.
736
00:38:11,880 --> 00:38:13,960
I was coming out to do screenwriting.
737
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:19,840
I met my soon to be ex-wife there, not soon, 19 years to be ex-wife.
738
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:21,480
And we moved out together and stuff.
739
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:27,660
And like, yeah, I was trying to do screenwriting, but I had about as much luck getting screenplays
740
00:38:27,660 --> 00:38:31,960
read as like George Bush finding oil in Texas.
741
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:36,920
Weapons of mass destruction in Iraq.
742
00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:38,720
It was just, I was like, I was terrible at it.
743
00:38:38,720 --> 00:38:43,160
I couldn't network because I was working all these shit jobs and I had to support my family
744
00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:44,160
and stuff.
745
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:48,640
I couldn't do the, I couldn't go to the lunches and the parties and then all that shit.
746
00:38:48,640 --> 00:38:53,000
I just couldn't get into the orbit of the people that would probably have helped me
747
00:38:53,000 --> 00:38:54,000
with that career.
748
00:38:54,000 --> 00:39:00,240
At one point I had to turn down a job at Miramax because I couldn't do the schedule, you know,
749
00:39:00,240 --> 00:39:01,920
like my wife made more money than me.
750
00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:05,400
So like, you know, that was just the way I went.
751
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:11,000
I was not prepared for all the stuff besides the writing of the screenplays, you know.
752
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:15,440
I did do a movie in 2009 about it.
753
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:16,440
No, no, 2000.
754
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:17,440
When was that?
755
00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:18,440
I don't know.
756
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:19,440
I did a Western though.
757
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:24,760
I was trying to do a, when I first started writing, my first book that I ever finished
758
00:39:24,760 --> 00:39:30,120
writing was a straight up Western because I wanted to be like Larry McMurtry or something.
759
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:32,240
And nobody read that stuff.
760
00:39:32,240 --> 00:39:34,680
Not from me anyway, because I didn't look like a cowboy, you know.
761
00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:40,200
I went to one of these like cowboy festivals to sell books and man, I didn't have a 10
762
00:39:40,200 --> 00:39:41,200
pound hat.
763
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:42,200
I didn't have a ball o' tie.
764
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:43,200
I was boxed.
765
00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:44,200
I couldn't talk horses.
766
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:46,200
It was like nobody wanted to read my set.
767
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:50,680
You know, everybody around me was like, you know, Elmer Kelton or something.
768
00:39:50,680 --> 00:39:54,040
I just didn't, I didn't look the part.
769
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:58,320
They're looking at you going, who's this goddamn city boy in here right now?
770
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:00,760
Who's this Yankee dude?
771
00:40:00,760 --> 00:40:03,040
Get a rope.
772
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:08,200
I was over there with my paste for Connie sauce, you know.
773
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,640
So you finished, you finished college, what in like 98 you graduated.
774
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:13,920
And then that was when you came out here.
775
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:19,080
So then I came out here like 2000 actually with 99 or 2000.
776
00:40:19,080 --> 00:40:22,320
So pre 9 11 you came out to California.
777
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:23,320
Yeah.
778
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:24,320
Yeah.
779
00:40:24,320 --> 00:40:25,320
Yeah.
780
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:29,360
Pre 9 11 I've been here that long and I never made any headway like screenwriting and stuff.
781
00:40:29,360 --> 00:40:34,040
So like, I mean, there was, there's always like around here.
782
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:36,840
I mean, everybody always wants to take a meeting.
783
00:40:36,840 --> 00:40:40,600
Everybody always wants to have lunch and everybody wants to get your hopes up and nothing ever
784
00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:41,600
happens.
785
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:47,160
You know, like, or rarely, I guess things happen for some people does not remain.
786
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:49,320
But I always had close calls that never went anywhere.
787
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:52,920
You know, like I was in talks with Edward James almost into a Western about Joaquin
788
00:40:52,920 --> 00:40:54,640
Marietta for a minute.
789
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:59,560
I was trying to get on the star Wars live action show before they had a star before
790
00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:04,040
they had a name for it or even, or even before Disney took over, you know?
791
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:05,040
Yeah.
792
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:07,680
Like I was always on the fringe, but never quite.
793
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:10,760
I'm like, I was always like famous adjacent.
794
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:15,960
You're always the bridesmaid, but never the bride, as they say, never the bride.
795
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:24,520
How did one go about trying to make those arrangements to speak with, you know, television
796
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:26,760
or even movie executives?
797
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:33,120
Is that something that you had to talk to some kind of agent to pitch a script or were
798
00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:38,720
you making friends that were in the area in your local area that were trying to do the
799
00:41:38,720 --> 00:41:42,560
same thing, whether it was screenwriting or acting?
800
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:45,200
How were you trying to climb the ladder?
801
00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:51,280
I suppose it's hard because a lot of it when you don't have any contacts at all is just
802
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:57,760
cold, cold calling, you know, your phone calling agents to try to pitch stuff to them.
803
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:04,320
You're cold calling like just, you know, you're going through the phone book or some directory
804
00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:08,880
and finding like, you know, studios, anything with studio in it and sending it, sending
805
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:09,880
them stuff.
806
00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:13,400
I talked to Rob Zombie at one point at a convention.
807
00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:16,120
I mean, and he told me, send him something and I got all excited.
808
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:19,080
You know, I gave him his address and everything.
809
00:42:19,080 --> 00:42:24,480
It's just anything you can do basically, like whatever you can, whatever route you can find.
810
00:42:24,480 --> 00:42:26,040
I don't think there's a path of success.
811
00:42:26,040 --> 00:42:30,520
I think it's just, you know, it's different for every single person and everything.
812
00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:34,400
So my thing was, you know, at first it was cold calling.
813
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:35,720
I saw that wasn't going to go anywhere.
814
00:42:35,720 --> 00:42:40,640
It's very much your relationships and who you know and stuff.
815
00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:41,640
I didn't know anybody.
816
00:42:41,640 --> 00:42:44,280
So I was just trying to meet people at one point.
817
00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:47,280
So it's more of a, it doesn't really matter what you know, because you know, you're, you're
818
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:51,800
an educated man from Columbia with, you know, a degree in filmmaking.
819
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:53,840
Yeah, it's so, so helpful.
820
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:55,760
You got me my city market job.
821
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:56,760
Yeah.
822
00:42:56,760 --> 00:43:02,120
And you can't, yet you can't get any kind of headway out here in the actual, you know,
823
00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:03,120
industry.
824
00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:05,560
So it's really, it's really doesn't matter what you know, it's who you know.
825
00:43:05,560 --> 00:43:06,560
Right.
826
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,080
That's kind of the, the moral, at least just what you do.
827
00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:14,080
Like the best piece of advice I've found, like reading stuff is like Robert Rodriguez
828
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:15,080
wrote this book.
829
00:43:15,080 --> 00:43:18,400
I forget what his book is about, I'm in guerrilla filmmaking or whatever.
830
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:23,540
And it's just like, you know, go out and do it, go to film school for like a semester
831
00:43:23,540 --> 00:43:28,800
to learn how to use a camera, to learn how to cut film, to learn the screenwriting format.
832
00:43:28,800 --> 00:43:30,800
And then you just drop out and go make movies.
833
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:32,800
You know, that's what I should have done.
834
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:36,680
But my mom really wanted me to finish college and she was like, you know, who are you going
835
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:37,680
to finish?
836
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:39,640
And I should have just gone out.
837
00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:45,600
You know, I should, I had a buddy who's now like, you know, crewing on everything.
838
00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:49,960
And he went out right before I did, like invited me to go with him.
839
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,040
And I was tied up with my girlfriend at the time.
840
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:54,440
And I just made all these excuses and didn't go.
841
00:43:54,440 --> 00:44:00,000
And I regret that, you know, like the thing to do is learn the basics, go out and make
842
00:44:00,000 --> 00:44:01,000
movies.
843
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:04,840
Like Martin Scorsese had a thing, like he made a student film or whatever.
844
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:08,560
And he went to before some producer or something and showed it to him.
845
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:10,040
And the guy was like, yeah, it's really impressive.
846
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:14,520
Now go make a movie because nobody cares about all that stuff.
847
00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:15,520
It's only what you do.
848
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:19,120
It's when you're as good as your next thing as your, as your, as the last thing you did
849
00:44:19,120 --> 00:44:20,120
or whatever.
850
00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:23,680
So do you think that obviously with the advent of technology, right?
851
00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:24,680
Okay.
852
00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:28,880
Us sitting here doing this right now, any, by any normal standard 10 or 15, maybe even
853
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:33,740
20 years ago, we would have to try to get hired and work at a radio station as an intern
854
00:44:33,740 --> 00:44:37,920
and then back our way up to eventually maybe in 10 or 15 years hosting a show.
855
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:39,720
But maybe in front of a mic.
856
00:44:39,720 --> 00:44:40,720
Right.
857
00:44:40,720 --> 00:44:43,680
Well, but now all you literally need is an internet connection and a cell phone.
858
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:44,800
That's, that's basically it.
859
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:46,760
And I mean, the cell phone might even be optional.
860
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:49,160
You really just need an internet connection.
861
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:52,160
And I mean, here we are, you can have your own radio show essentially.
862
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,600
So do you think that you got the basis?
863
00:44:55,600 --> 00:44:59,560
All you need is an audience, you know, I mean, that's, that's up to you to build, you know,
864
00:44:59,560 --> 00:45:06,000
I mean, it's, and it's, at some point it's, I, what I really hate about this kind of endeavor,
865
00:45:06,000 --> 00:45:10,520
creative endeavor is like, you're, you really are, it's like an extension of high school.
866
00:45:10,520 --> 00:45:11,800
It's a popularity contest.
867
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:15,320
You really do have to like, you know, you do rely on other people.
868
00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:19,480
You rely on the word of mouth of other people and the appreciation of other people.
869
00:45:19,480 --> 00:45:20,480
Yeah.
870
00:45:20,480 --> 00:45:21,480
They don't take the time to pass it on.
871
00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:23,480
It's like, you know, thanks.
872
00:45:23,480 --> 00:45:24,480
Oh yeah.
873
00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:26,440
Well, shit like the same thing as with us, right?
874
00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:28,520
We we've been, we've been doing the work, right?
875
00:45:28,520 --> 00:45:32,040
We've been putting in the work in the hours and it's, and it's the goddamn thing.
876
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,760
I can't, we know we can't figure it out how we have all these people that listen every
877
00:45:35,760 --> 00:45:38,440
fucking week, but no one wants to follow us on social media.
878
00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:40,120
It doesn't make any goddamn sense.
879
00:45:40,120 --> 00:45:41,120
It's just a click.
880
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:42,120
Yeah.
881
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:43,120
It's the click of the button.
882
00:45:43,120 --> 00:45:44,120
Right.
883
00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:47,560
And then you can just review, just pass it to even give the book for free to somebody.
884
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:49,800
You know, that's fine by me.
885
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:54,840
Like I, a lot of the mere misses I've had with like, have been like big writers coming to
886
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:57,400
me like, uh, and saying, Oh, I really love this.
887
00:45:57,400 --> 00:45:58,400
I'm a fan of it.
888
00:45:58,400 --> 00:46:02,720
And I'm like, I want to say, please just pass it on to somebody, you know?
889
00:46:02,720 --> 00:46:06,160
And it's like, like Jeff Darrow, uh, wove me out of the blue.
890
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:10,040
The guy that did, uh, he did hard boiled and I don't know, he's a, he's a comic book guy.
891
00:46:10,040 --> 00:46:12,640
You know, he did stuff for dark horse with Frank Miller and everything.
892
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:13,640
He did hard boiled.
893
00:46:13,640 --> 00:46:17,400
He was a concept artist for like the matrix and stuff.
894
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:18,800
And now he loved him a Cabo writer.
895
00:46:18,800 --> 00:46:19,800
He just wove me out of the blue.
896
00:46:19,800 --> 00:46:23,880
I thought it was only friends like fucking with me, you know, at first, but then I got
897
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:24,880
him on the phone and yeah.
898
00:46:24,880 --> 00:46:26,760
And then I sat with him at a couple of comic cons.
899
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:29,560
He let me sit down and like, I was meeting all these people through him.
900
00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:32,000
Like, uh, uh, Robert Kirkman came over.
901
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:36,000
I gave him a book cause he just, you know, all that kind of shit, but it's like, they
902
00:46:36,000 --> 00:46:40,080
don't crack the book or they don't like, yeah, they don't pass you on.
903
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:41,080
I don't know.
904
00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:42,080
I don't know what it is.
905
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:44,600
I've had people like, I've had big, bigger writers tell me, Oh, this is great.
906
00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:49,360
I'm going to recommend it for a stoker award, but the recommendation ever comes, you know,
907
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:51,000
it's like, yeah, fuck man.
908
00:46:51,000 --> 00:46:52,000
I know what it is.
909
00:46:52,000 --> 00:46:53,000
Make it happen, please.
910
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:54,000
Yeah.
911
00:46:54,000 --> 00:46:55,000
I know what it is.
912
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:58,300
And it's that's that if no one wants to put anybody else over and everybody wants to gatekeep
913
00:46:58,300 --> 00:47:01,520
and say, Oh shit, man, I had to fucking go through all this horse shit to get to where
914
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:02,520
I'm at.
915
00:47:02,520 --> 00:47:03,520
So guess what?
916
00:47:03,520 --> 00:47:06,480
You're going to have to go through the same thing, but it's kind of like, fuck man as
917
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:07,480
parents, right?
918
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:10,840
We want to have our children not go through the same shit that we had to go through.
919
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:11,840
Right?
920
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:12,840
And our parents.
921
00:47:12,840 --> 00:47:15,760
So, you know, I do not want, I want it to be easier.
922
00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:16,760
Right.
923
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:20,520
So what is the people like, like, like for me, like if we make, well, when we make it
924
00:47:20,520 --> 00:47:23,400
and we can help others out, I'm not going to be like, Oh yeah, fuck off, go away.
925
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:25,480
I don't want you have to go through the suffering that I did.
926
00:47:25,480 --> 00:47:26,480
No, man.
927
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:27,480
If I can make it easier, I already cracked the code.
928
00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:28,480
Yeah.
929
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:29,480
I cracked the code to the matrix.
930
00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:31,760
Let me, let me help you crack the code as well.
931
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:33,400
You know, shit, come on this way.
932
00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:34,400
What do you got?
933
00:47:34,400 --> 00:47:35,400
Show me what you got.
934
00:47:35,400 --> 00:47:36,400
Yeah.
935
00:47:36,400 --> 00:47:37,400
And if it's great, definitely I'll tell somebody.
936
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:38,400
Yeah.
937
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:39,400
Yeah, absolutely.
938
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:40,400
So it's like, it sucks.
939
00:47:40,400 --> 00:47:44,240
It's like the gatekeeping aspect of the entertainment industry as a whole.
940
00:47:44,240 --> 00:47:45,240
And it applies to music.
941
00:47:45,240 --> 00:47:46,920
Cause I mean, we've seen it.
942
00:47:46,920 --> 00:47:49,080
We've been a part of it with, with the music industry.
943
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:52,680
We've, we've dealt with it with, you know, I mean, obviously with probably everything,
944
00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:57,280
everything that we do, it's, it's just, everyone wants to keep you out and no one wants to
945
00:47:57,280 --> 00:48:02,280
try to just give you that one little bit, that one little morsel that'll get you over
946
00:48:02,280 --> 00:48:04,200
and get you to the next level or whatever.
947
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:06,440
You got to go out and fucking get it yourself.
948
00:48:06,440 --> 00:48:07,920
So I don't get it.
949
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:08,920
Yeah.
950
00:48:08,920 --> 00:48:11,440
Like I talked about Jeff, he's, he's a great guy.
951
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:15,240
He's, I want, I don't want to flunk Jeff in that because he's really a nice guy and stuff.
952
00:48:15,240 --> 00:48:20,680
He just, what happened with him was, uh, I don't think the dark horse people that he
953
00:48:20,680 --> 00:48:24,080
did pass me to like dark horse, like to Scott Alley and all these guys.
954
00:48:24,080 --> 00:48:26,720
And they didn't, uh, they, I don't think they cracked the books, honestly.
955
00:48:26,720 --> 00:48:30,080
Well, it's probably, yeah, I would say it's probably one of those things where, yeah,
956
00:48:30,080 --> 00:48:32,680
there are good people in the entertainment industry for sure.
957
00:48:32,680 --> 00:48:36,600
I mean, there definitely are good people that want to help you out, but they're not necessarily
958
00:48:36,600 --> 00:48:40,240
in a position where they're the one who's going to make it happen for you.
959
00:48:40,240 --> 00:48:43,040
Jeff was not the, he was not the power guy.
960
00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:44,920
He was, he was, he was like, I love this.
961
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:45,920
I think this is great.
962
00:48:45,920 --> 00:48:50,000
You know, you guys should do this, but you know, they just, whatever.
963
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:51,000
Yeah.
964
00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:54,240
And it's honestly, yeah, it's just, you might as well start your own shit.
965
00:48:54,240 --> 00:48:55,240
I talked to the guy.
966
00:48:55,240 --> 00:48:59,960
I met the editor that he recommended me to afterwards and he was like, who, you know,
967
00:48:59,960 --> 00:49:01,520
he didn't know what the fuck I was talking about.
968
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:03,400
You know who the fuck I was.
969
00:49:03,400 --> 00:49:08,000
So Jeff definitely like passed me on, but they just, it goes in a pile somewhere and
970
00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:09,000
they don't look at it.
971
00:49:09,000 --> 00:49:15,360
So there, there was a potential there that you could have written comic books at one
972
00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:18,680
point or, or am I mistaken on that?
973
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:24,280
I wanted to do comic books, but I like a couple of my novels, Macabre Rider and Monster and
974
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:29,960
Fear both started out as graphic novels and I just couldn't find an artist that was, the
975
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:34,640
thing about working with young upcoming artists is they want you to write their stuff.
976
00:49:34,640 --> 00:49:40,240
They don't want to draw your stuff and they all want to draw Batman or some variation
977
00:49:40,240 --> 00:49:41,240
of Batman, you know?
978
00:49:41,240 --> 00:49:42,240
Yeah.
979
00:49:42,240 --> 00:49:46,360
And I'm like, okay guys, you know, but, uh, you know, and they don't want to defer their
980
00:49:46,360 --> 00:49:50,760
costs, which I totally understand because everybody's trying to get paid, but it's like,
981
00:49:50,760 --> 00:49:54,960
you know, you got to make a sacrifice when you start now, you gotta like, you gotta,
982
00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:56,960
you know, take bite the bullet a little bit.
983
00:49:56,960 --> 00:50:01,880
And a lot of the, we went around comic with like scripts, me and my writing buddy, Jeff
984
00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:04,040
Carter, and like, we just couldn't make anything happen.
985
00:50:04,040 --> 00:50:05,040
Yeah.
986
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:06,640
Nobody was interested in working with writers.
987
00:50:06,640 --> 00:50:10,480
It's hard to break in as a writer in comic books too, because it's a visual medium, you
988
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:11,480
know?
989
00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:13,360
So like the artists have a leg up on you.
990
00:50:13,360 --> 00:50:15,000
If an artist can write, they're awesome.
991
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:19,440
You know, they're, they're gods, but like most of them, I don't think most of them can.
992
00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:24,480
I mean, if an artist can just write a, write a comprehensible shitty story, then they're
993
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:25,480
good to go.
994
00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:31,440
They're in because they can do a splash page that you can, you'll want to hang on your
995
00:50:31,440 --> 00:50:32,440
wall.
996
00:50:32,440 --> 00:50:33,440
There's an exception for that.
997
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:39,360
There's Rob Liefeldt who does writing and art and not, not except for either one.
998
00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:40,360
It's still made it.
999
00:50:40,360 --> 00:50:41,360
It's still made it.
1000
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:42,360
Yeah.
1001
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:45,920
Well, that's, yeah, that's a strike of lightning right there.
1002
00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:51,000
I mean, the guy is still hanging his hat on Deadpool.
1003
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:54,120
Like he reminds everybody, Hey, I created Deadpool.
1004
00:50:54,120 --> 00:50:55,120
Like, Oh, well, thanks.
1005
00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:59,880
I mean, that's all you've been saying for the last 30 or 40 years at this point, but
1006
00:50:59,880 --> 00:51:00,880
I don't know.
1007
00:51:00,880 --> 00:51:01,880
Yeah.
1008
00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:02,880
So everything I said about you're only as good as the last thing you did.
1009
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:03,880
I mean, I guess I'm full of shit.
1010
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:04,880
I don't know.
1011
00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:08,880
Whatever he does, he can just fall back on Deadpool.
1012
00:51:08,880 --> 00:51:09,880
Yeah.
1013
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:15,720
But it is interesting now that is, and maybe it's because they have the leverage, but I've
1014
00:51:15,720 --> 00:51:20,160
seen writers and artists.
1015
00:51:20,160 --> 00:51:26,760
There's a new, I think a publisher called Distillery now with, with Scott Snyder, Brian
1016
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:33,820
Asrillo and a bunch of artists and writers that are trying to make more creator own stuff.
1017
00:51:33,820 --> 00:51:36,640
So I mean, I don't, I don't know.
1018
00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:42,200
Maybe the dynamic has changed more to maybe I don't even have to go to DC or Marvel to
1019
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:43,200
get writing.
1020
00:51:43,200 --> 00:51:44,200
Yeah.
1021
00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,760
I don't think you want to really, I don't think you really want to go to them anymore.
1022
00:51:46,760 --> 00:51:47,760
Yeah.
1023
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:48,760
You would just want to create your own things.
1024
00:51:48,760 --> 00:51:50,720
So I don't know.
1025
00:51:50,720 --> 00:51:53,640
I think for you, like that's still on the table.
1026
00:51:53,640 --> 00:51:57,280
You know, it's just at this point, it'll just be finding an artist.
1027
00:51:57,280 --> 00:52:00,640
And if that's something you want to visit down the road, I mean, it'd be cool to find
1028
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:04,560
out if you would want to visit that at some point.
1029
00:52:04,560 --> 00:52:06,160
Yeah, I would love to.
1030
00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:09,000
Like Jeff asked me to do, he did Shaolin Cowboy.
1031
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:10,720
That's like his thing he's working on mostly now.
1032
00:52:10,720 --> 00:52:17,720
And he did this, he did a novella kind of a Shaolin Cowboy adventure magazine or something.
1033
00:52:17,720 --> 00:52:21,160
He only put out one issue, but he wanted me to write the next one.
1034
00:52:21,160 --> 00:52:22,440
And yeah, I don't know.
1035
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:25,720
Dark Horse just didn't go for it or something.
1036
00:52:25,720 --> 00:52:30,840
I would have loved to have made the jump from writing prose to like writing comic book scripts.
1037
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:31,840
I mean, I've done it.
1038
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:33,400
I did comic book scripts.
1039
00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:34,400
They just never got produced.
1040
00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:35,400
Yeah.
1041
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:36,400
Yeah.
1042
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:39,400
So I kind of want to shift gears a little bit and I got to know about the Star Wars
1043
00:52:39,400 --> 00:52:44,320
shit because you've touched on it a couple of times and obviously, I mean, we're huge
1044
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:48,280
Star Wars fans over here, maybe not into so much of the new stuff, but you know, Star
1045
00:52:48,280 --> 00:52:49,680
Wars in general.
1046
00:52:49,680 --> 00:52:53,200
So how did that come about?
1047
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:54,460
What year is it?
1048
00:52:54,460 --> 00:52:58,080
How do you get into writing something for Star Wars magazine?
1049
00:52:58,080 --> 00:52:59,080
That's what it was.
1050
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:00,080
It was the Star Wars magazine.
1051
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:03,760
It was Star Wars Insider.
1052
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:08,400
I think it was like 2006, maybe 2008, somewhere around there.
1053
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:12,840
Right around the same time I sold my first story.
1054
00:53:12,840 --> 00:53:17,200
The hyperspace online was like the online content for Star Wars dot com and everything,
1055
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:18,200
exclusive stuff.
1056
00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:23,720
And Pablo Hidalgo, who's the guy that's now on the story group or whatever with Leng
1057
00:53:23,720 --> 00:53:28,720
and Chi and all those guys, he was kind of in charge of hyperspace and all that.
1058
00:53:28,720 --> 00:53:32,640
And they did this contest called What's the Story?
1059
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:36,360
And every month, and I found out about it in the last four months it was running or
1060
00:53:36,360 --> 00:53:37,360
something like that.
1061
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:38,920
I didn't even know, I wasn't even aware of it.
1062
00:53:38,920 --> 00:53:41,440
I was working at 2K games at night.
1063
00:53:41,440 --> 00:53:44,720
That's one of the other matrix jobs that wasn't quite a matrix.
1064
00:53:44,720 --> 00:53:49,600
I was working nights at 2K doing QA and I found this and everything.
1065
00:53:49,600 --> 00:53:51,240
So I submitted to it.
1066
00:53:51,240 --> 00:53:54,600
It was basically they would take a screenshot every month.
1067
00:53:54,600 --> 00:53:59,660
They publish a screenshot on the website of some minor character from the background of
1068
00:53:59,660 --> 00:54:01,040
Star Wars or something.
1069
00:54:01,040 --> 00:54:06,760
First one that I remember seeing was in the jealous sand crawler when they pick up 3PO
1070
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:13,240
and R2, there's this little droid that looks like a stove that like rolls by or something
1071
00:54:13,240 --> 00:54:14,800
with a pipe and everything on the back.
1072
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:18,600
It literally looks like a cast iron stove or something.
1073
00:54:18,600 --> 00:54:20,400
And it rolls by or something.
1074
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:24,000
And basically, so for characters like that, they then ask you to come up with a backstory
1075
00:54:24,000 --> 00:54:28,240
for it or they'll give you a little bit of a writing prompt like, this is what this droid
1076
00:54:28,240 --> 00:54:30,560
is, what's his story?
1077
00:54:30,560 --> 00:54:32,960
This is this character's name, what's his story?
1078
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:36,040
You know where this character is, that kind of thing?
1079
00:54:36,040 --> 00:54:39,880
And so I started submitting to that and I did one, the first one I did was for that
1080
00:54:39,880 --> 00:54:48,480
droid and I turned it into, it was a binary mining droid or some shit that Tuskens would
1081
00:54:48,480 --> 00:54:54,160
bust open for the water catches and everything because it would drill down and that pipe
1082
00:54:54,160 --> 00:54:56,960
it would fling out like sand and rock.
1083
00:54:56,960 --> 00:55:01,240
And so we had a little water catch pocket and Tuskens would break it open and stuff.
1084
00:55:01,240 --> 00:55:06,960
I had this whole history of some kind of miners, water prospectors riot, I wrote all this stuff
1085
00:55:06,960 --> 00:55:10,040
into it and I got it.
1086
00:55:10,040 --> 00:55:17,240
And they gave it to me, I won that month and then the next month was I think they did this
1087
00:55:17,240 --> 00:55:24,360
little Ugnott guy who shows up on Jabba's sail bar, he's wearing all orange, he's all
1088
00:55:24,360 --> 00:55:26,760
pimped out in his orange jumpsuit and everything.
1089
00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:33,000
His name was Jaksget or something so I submitted for him and I won that one too.
1090
00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:38,320
And I basically won like I think three consecutive times, yeah.
1091
00:55:38,320 --> 00:55:39,320
Three, yeah.
1092
00:55:39,320 --> 00:55:44,640
The other one was like a bounty hunter, Bane Mellor, the last one and they gave me, they
1093
00:55:44,640 --> 00:55:47,920
did an action figure of him.
1094
00:55:47,920 --> 00:55:50,760
So I still got the action figure with the little stuff on the back and everything, that
1095
00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:53,120
was all me and everything, that was pretty cool, they adapted it.
1096
00:55:53,120 --> 00:56:02,120
So back then it became canon because this was before Disney took over, so it was like
1097
00:56:02,120 --> 00:56:06,640
everything you, Expanding Universe, that anybody came up with, writers came up with
1098
00:56:06,640 --> 00:56:08,560
became canon and stuff.
1099
00:56:08,560 --> 00:56:12,040
So because I did this like three months in a row or something, then Pablo emailed me
1100
00:56:12,040 --> 00:56:16,880
and was like, hey do you want to write some stories for us and stuff, just give me your
1101
00:56:16,880 --> 00:56:19,640
six best pitches or something.
1102
00:56:19,640 --> 00:56:27,800
So I did and then I ended up doing, it was a boxing story, it was a shock boxing, it
1103
00:56:27,800 --> 00:56:29,800
was what they call boxing in Star Wars.
1104
00:56:29,800 --> 00:56:33,960
They gleaned that from old West End games, like role playing games that had all these
1105
00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:38,040
supplements because Pablo started out writing for that I think and a lot of the Star Wars
1106
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:40,920
writers did.
1107
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:44,840
And I had all those books because I played that game like religiously for like two years
1108
00:56:44,840 --> 00:56:48,080
and stuff and I ran it.
1109
00:56:48,080 --> 00:56:53,840
So yeah, I got to write this shock boxing story that had Bryn Durwin, the character
1110
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:58,920
that freaking the mailman from Cheers plays in Empire Strikes Back.
1111
00:56:58,920 --> 00:57:03,200
You know that one Hoth officer and stuff, he becomes like an intelligence officer and
1112
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:08,600
I did this thing that was like basically this take on this near human fighter fighting an
1113
00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:10,120
Imperial champion and winning.
1114
00:57:10,120 --> 00:57:16,800
It was kind of like Matt Schnelling versus, oh shoot I'm blanking on the other guy's name,
1115
00:57:16,800 --> 00:57:17,800
the Brown Bomber.
1116
00:57:17,800 --> 00:57:20,600
You know that thing where he beat the Nazi champion and everything?
1117
00:57:20,600 --> 00:57:21,600
Oh okay, yeah.
1118
00:57:21,600 --> 00:57:24,240
And like inspired all these people and everything.
1119
00:57:24,240 --> 00:57:26,040
Joe Lewis, I'm totally blanking on it.
1120
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:27,040
Yeah, Joe Lewis.
1121
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:34,080
So like I did this story and it was called Pists of Aion.
1122
00:57:34,080 --> 00:57:38,440
So I got to come up with like the rules for shock boxing, that was pretty cool.
1123
00:57:38,440 --> 00:57:44,560
And then from there, God what did I do after that Star Wars wise?
1124
00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:53,040
I think I did a short story called Hammer that was about this like Padawan or something
1125
00:57:53,040 --> 00:57:56,800
that kind of washed out.
1126
00:57:56,800 --> 00:58:02,120
And like when you wash out from the Jedi like training or whatever, you get adopted by some
1127
00:58:02,120 --> 00:58:06,420
master who takes you out as like, and you get in these various service corps and one
1128
00:58:06,420 --> 00:58:09,520
of them was like the Explorer's Corps or something.
1129
00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:13,980
So this guy was working as an explorer with another washed out Jedi and this master was
1130
00:58:13,980 --> 00:58:19,200
this guy that like had lost his Padawan in the arena or something.
1131
00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:23,480
You know that big arena fight with all the Jedi where Inseam died.
1132
00:58:23,480 --> 00:58:25,480
Oh yeah.
1133
00:58:25,480 --> 00:58:29,760
And so but the editor that I was working with for that one, that was the one that got in
1134
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:33,840
Star Wars Insider and the editor I was working with on that one, I talked to him with Comic
1135
00:58:33,840 --> 00:58:37,880
Con and stuff and I started pitching the idea of that character.
1136
00:58:37,880 --> 00:58:42,240
This Padawan goes to the dark side because he finds this like dark side artifact, this
1137
00:58:42,240 --> 00:58:48,080
armor that belonged to some character that was from Tales of the Jedi comic or something.
1138
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:53,280
And I got cool art by Joe Caroni, you know, he did like the splash page for the magazine.
1139
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:56,760
I got a cool thing, you know, painting of the character and everything that's signed
1140
00:58:56,760 --> 00:58:57,760
by him and all that.
1141
00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:04,480
And we tried to develop it into, he was going to be the big bad in the trilogy of novels
1142
00:59:04,480 --> 00:59:06,560
like that I was trying to pitch to them and everything.
1143
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:11,600
And the editor got really excited about it when it was going to take place across various
1144
00:59:11,600 --> 00:59:12,600
eras.
1145
00:59:12,600 --> 00:59:18,080
It was going to start in like Revenge of the Sith and then wind up in like the Dark Times
1146
00:59:18,080 --> 00:59:19,080
or whatever.
1147
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:26,800
And it involved like rebel explorers, rebel archaeologists versus Imperial archaeologists
1148
00:59:26,800 --> 00:59:28,360
trying to find all these artifacts and stuff.
1149
00:59:28,360 --> 00:59:30,120
It was going to be kind of like Raiders of the Lost Ark.
1150
00:59:30,120 --> 00:59:35,200
I based it off of like this guy Otto Rahn that was going after the grail for the Nazis
1151
00:59:35,200 --> 00:59:38,800
in the 1930s and stuff.
1152
00:59:38,800 --> 00:59:42,600
And it was all set to go.
1153
00:59:42,600 --> 00:59:44,560
San Diego, I was there, I pitched it to him again.
1154
00:59:44,560 --> 00:59:45,560
He was like, yeah, this is awesome.
1155
00:59:45,560 --> 00:59:46,560
We're going to get together.
1156
00:59:46,560 --> 00:59:50,400
I would get a pitch document together, contact me two weeks from now.
1157
00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:55,880
I contacted him two weeks after San Diego and got on the phone with him.
1158
00:59:55,880 --> 00:59:59,440
And he was like, this is my last day here.
1159
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:00,440
Literally.
1160
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:05,320
And then he was like, also Disney is buying everything.
1161
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:12,520
Disney's bought, I got the news that Lucasfilm sold to Disney and everything that I'd written
1162
01:00:12,520 --> 01:00:18,000
before got regulated to legendary status, which means it's non-canonical until somebody
1163
01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:20,280
knew who you like decides to use it.
1164
01:00:20,280 --> 01:00:21,680
And that was that.
1165
01:00:21,680 --> 01:00:23,720
That was my Star Wars experience pretty much.
1166
01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:29,000
I tried to get in with other editors and I just couldn't make it happen after that.
1167
01:00:29,000 --> 01:00:35,040
I mean, from what you've mentioned, the Raiders of the Lost Ark story that you were writing
1168
01:00:35,040 --> 01:00:41,920
for Star Wars, that to me, if there was a television show for the expanded universe
1169
01:00:41,920 --> 01:00:46,760
within Disney, I mean, I would watch that without a doubt.
1170
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:53,520
Well, I heard that there's a character now, because that kind of broke my heart with Star
1171
01:00:53,520 --> 01:00:55,240
Wars, first of all.
1172
01:00:55,240 --> 01:00:57,320
I tried to keep into the new stuff.
1173
01:00:57,320 --> 01:00:58,720
There are a couple of things I like.
1174
01:00:58,720 --> 01:00:59,720
I love Solo.
1175
01:00:59,720 --> 01:01:03,600
I loved, oh, I told Josh my Rogue One story.
1176
01:01:03,600 --> 01:01:10,480
He hit me up in the years before Rogue One came out and said, hey, you watch a lot of
1177
01:01:10,480 --> 01:01:11,480
movies.
1178
01:01:11,480 --> 01:01:12,480
I know we talked about movies and stuff.
1179
01:01:12,480 --> 01:01:14,680
Just give me a list of man on a mission movies.
1180
01:01:14,680 --> 01:01:15,680
And I did.
1181
01:01:15,680 --> 01:01:23,400
And I gave him Were Eagles Dare, The Wild Bunch, Dirty Dozen, The Professionals, all
1182
01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:24,400
these movies.
1183
01:01:24,400 --> 01:01:31,080
And yeah, I saw the first, two years later, I saw the first cast photo for Rogue One and
1184
01:01:31,080 --> 01:01:34,480
I contacted Pablo and was like, dude, when you hit me up for all those movies, was this
1185
01:01:34,480 --> 01:01:35,480
what it was for and stuff?
1186
01:01:35,480 --> 01:01:37,400
And he was like, yeah, it was.
1187
01:01:37,400 --> 01:01:39,760
So it sounds like bullshit.
1188
01:01:39,760 --> 01:01:42,040
And I didn't get a thank you credit or anything like that.
1189
01:01:42,040 --> 01:01:45,320
But I liked that movie because I feel like I contributed in a very small way to it and
1190
01:01:45,320 --> 01:01:46,320
stuff.
1191
01:01:46,320 --> 01:01:50,080
And that was the last thing I ever had any involvement with Star Wars.
1192
01:01:50,080 --> 01:01:53,520
But I heard that there's this character now called Dr. Something.
1193
01:01:53,520 --> 01:01:54,520
Yeah, Dr. Aphra.
1194
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:55,520
Like female character.
1195
01:01:55,520 --> 01:01:56,520
Yeah, she's-
1196
01:01:56,520 --> 01:01:57,520
Dr. Aphra, yeah.
1197
01:01:57,520 --> 01:02:01,240
And it sounds like they kind of took a lot of that stuff that I was working on and kind
1198
01:02:01,240 --> 01:02:03,120
of changed it enough.
1199
01:02:03,120 --> 01:02:06,920
Yeah, she's basically, they changed it enough from probably what you wrote, but it's basically
1200
01:02:06,920 --> 01:02:08,400
she is like Indiana Jones.
1201
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:10,760
She's like the Indiana Jones of fucking Star Wars almost.
1202
01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:14,400
So yeah, with me, that was going to be Lando's mom.
1203
01:02:14,400 --> 01:02:16,280
Like in my book, it would have been Lando's mom.
1204
01:02:16,280 --> 01:02:17,280
Oh, okay.
1205
01:02:17,280 --> 01:02:20,960
But yeah, it was going to be like a Calrissian.
1206
01:02:20,960 --> 01:02:23,960
But yeah, that's the way it went.
1207
01:02:23,960 --> 01:02:26,960
That's the way a cookie crumble.
1208
01:02:26,960 --> 01:02:28,040
All right.
1209
01:02:28,040 --> 01:02:29,800
So did you have something you wanted to ask?
1210
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:32,240
I did, but I'm having trouble with the-
1211
01:02:32,240 --> 01:02:33,240
With the words?
1212
01:02:33,240 --> 01:02:34,240
The-
1213
01:02:34,240 --> 01:02:35,240
Oh, the headphones?
1214
01:02:35,240 --> 01:02:36,240
The headset.
1215
01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:37,240
Oh, no.
1216
01:02:37,240 --> 01:02:38,240
Oh, here we go.
1217
01:02:38,240 --> 01:02:39,240
All right, I think I got it.
1218
01:02:39,240 --> 01:02:43,320
I'm just going to hold in my Fox position like on Mary with Children when they would get
1219
01:02:43,320 --> 01:02:48,280
in a specific position with the antenna to make it work.
1220
01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:49,800
Yeah.
1221
01:02:49,800 --> 01:02:54,360
So in terms of writing, I don't know if this is going to turn into a whole segment at just
1222
01:02:54,360 --> 01:03:00,800
about the writing process itself, but I just had a question as far as-
1223
01:03:00,800 --> 01:03:04,400
Because something I had trouble with, because Josh and I tried writing something back when
1224
01:03:04,400 --> 01:03:07,120
we were, you know, or 10 years ago.
1225
01:03:07,120 --> 01:03:13,760
And I have this thing where I feel as though I'm writing the same person, even if it's
1226
01:03:13,760 --> 01:03:15,060
not really the case.
1227
01:03:15,060 --> 01:03:22,860
How is it that you are able to put yourself in all these characters you create, regardless
1228
01:03:22,860 --> 01:03:32,880
of genre, without feeling like you are injecting yourself into the story?
1229
01:03:32,880 --> 01:03:38,920
It's unavoidable to inject yourself a little bit, but the secret to being a good writer,
1230
01:03:38,920 --> 01:03:41,880
I feel like, I'm not saying like I'm not tootin' my own horns and I'm a good writer or whatever,
1231
01:03:41,880 --> 01:03:48,780
but I think the most important tool for a writer is empathy, just in listening.
1232
01:03:48,780 --> 01:03:52,120
So I got two awesome pieces of advice from writers.
1233
01:03:52,120 --> 01:03:56,880
One was reading Stephen King's On Writing, where he says, read 100 words for every word
1234
01:03:56,880 --> 01:03:57,880
you write.
1235
01:03:57,880 --> 01:03:59,560
That's the one thing I remember from that book.
1236
01:03:59,560 --> 01:04:03,640
It's perfect, and don't stick to one genre, you know, like don't stick to the genre you
1237
01:04:03,640 --> 01:04:05,880
read, read all over the place.
1238
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:11,520
Read like classic stuff, read science fiction, read stuff from like 100 years ago, read stuff
1239
01:04:11,520 --> 01:04:13,480
from right now, you know, whatever.
1240
01:04:13,480 --> 01:04:14,480
And read primary documents.
1241
01:04:14,480 --> 01:04:20,280
When I do history writing, I always look for primary documents, meaning like accounts,
1242
01:04:20,280 --> 01:04:23,720
first person accounts of people that like lived in that time and everything.
1243
01:04:23,720 --> 01:04:26,680
So I get the language down, the cadence and like what they thought and stuff.
1244
01:04:26,680 --> 01:04:33,520
I got this great book called George Hans' Saloon Diary, and it's just fucking diary
1245
01:04:33,520 --> 01:04:35,480
entries of the saloon owner.
1246
01:04:35,480 --> 01:04:41,880
It might be like two lines for a day, you know, got tight today, Mary got the clap,
1247
01:04:41,880 --> 01:04:45,480
you know, shit like that, whatever.
1248
01:04:45,480 --> 01:04:49,520
But you get that language and you get that like, you get that there was like, you know,
1249
01:04:49,520 --> 01:04:51,080
I used to talk sucker back in the day.
1250
01:04:51,080 --> 01:04:55,240
I didn't know that unless I read primary documents, you know, you can get that out of history.
1251
01:04:55,240 --> 01:05:02,280
But like the other piece of advice, I went to a writing convention for a whole writers
1252
01:05:02,280 --> 01:05:05,880
or something and Joel Lansdale was there and I sat at the table with Joel Lansdale and
1253
01:05:05,880 --> 01:05:10,480
he said he does, he does like, you know, I don't know if you know Joel, Joel Lansdale,
1254
01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:14,240
he wrote that happened Leonard series on Netflix.
1255
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:21,880
He wrote, he wrote my favorite Batman villain, his episode, all the episodes for Batman the
1256
01:05:21,880 --> 01:05:27,000
animated series that featured the ventriloquist and Mr. Scarface.
1257
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:28,360
He did all those and everything.
1258
01:05:28,360 --> 01:05:32,520
He wrote a lot of who's that cowboy character DC does with the scar?
1259
01:05:32,520 --> 01:05:33,520
Oh, Jonah Hex.
1260
01:05:33,520 --> 01:05:36,120
Yeah, he did a lot of great Jonah Hex stuff.
1261
01:05:36,120 --> 01:05:40,160
He's and he's written like, you know, just books of like weird west stuff and everything.
1262
01:05:40,160 --> 01:05:48,200
But he said writing is like a muscle and you have to work it every day at the same, you
1263
01:05:48,200 --> 01:05:52,520
know, try to get the same one time in every day, like two hours, whatever.
1264
01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:58,600
I think Stephen King writes four hours, but you work it and if you don't work it in an
1265
01:05:58,600 --> 01:06:02,640
enterprise, you know, like you got to stay in practice always, just always write.
1266
01:06:02,640 --> 01:06:09,960
But otherwise, it's just in terms of like, how do I make my voice different?
1267
01:06:09,960 --> 01:06:11,400
I read, I read a lot.
1268
01:06:11,400 --> 01:06:12,560
I read primary documents.
1269
01:06:12,560 --> 01:06:13,880
I listen a whole lot.
1270
01:06:13,880 --> 01:06:17,440
Like I'm sitting, whenever I'm sitting, just listening to most mundane conversation I'm
1271
01:06:17,440 --> 01:06:18,880
picking up.
1272
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:26,320
I went to a, I went to this Civil War reenactment of all the things with my dad, you know, like
1273
01:06:26,320 --> 01:06:29,280
a couple number of years ago and everything.
1274
01:06:29,280 --> 01:06:31,800
And this old dude like said, damn, there's not enough.
1275
01:06:31,800 --> 01:06:33,160
I overheard this old dude.
1276
01:06:33,160 --> 01:06:36,360
He was like, damn, there's not enough room in here to cuss a cat without getting a mouthful
1277
01:06:36,360 --> 01:06:37,360
of hair.
1278
01:06:37,360 --> 01:06:38,360
Boom, I wrote that right down.
1279
01:06:38,360 --> 01:06:43,360
I wrote everything, you know, stuff just, you just listen to the characters around you
1280
01:06:43,360 --> 01:06:44,840
and kind of put them in there.
1281
01:06:44,840 --> 01:06:52,920
And then in terms of writing like others, you find what resonates for you with that
1282
01:06:52,920 --> 01:06:53,920
person.
1283
01:06:53,920 --> 01:06:57,240
Like you might not be like, I may not be like, you know, I whatever.
1284
01:06:57,240 --> 01:07:02,720
So writing Zora, you know, I'm not a poor, I'm not a poor black woman, you know, but
1285
01:07:02,720 --> 01:07:05,000
I know what it means to be poor.
1286
01:07:05,000 --> 01:07:07,280
And I know what it means to be disappointed with writing.
1287
01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:10,920
You get all these disappointments and stuff and you find the empathy that you have with
1288
01:07:10,920 --> 01:07:15,880
the person that you're writing about and kind of so that, that, that, uh, that old adage
1289
01:07:15,880 --> 01:07:20,080
about write what you know, you find what you know in each person that you write about,
1290
01:07:20,080 --> 01:07:21,080
you know what I mean?
1291
01:07:21,080 --> 01:07:24,320
You know, something you might not know their experience totally.
1292
01:07:24,320 --> 01:07:29,000
You might not know what it means to be like a Buffalo hunter or like a space Marine, whatever,
1293
01:07:29,000 --> 01:07:34,160
but there are elements of that person's personality that you can, that will resonate with you.
1294
01:07:34,160 --> 01:07:38,280
And if you speak the truth about them, you know, it'll resonate with the reader too.
1295
01:07:38,280 --> 01:07:39,280
I feel like, yeah.
1296
01:07:39,280 --> 01:07:44,160
And some of the elements that you have written in as far as, uh, you know, you've written
1297
01:07:44,160 --> 01:07:50,280
Westerns and historical fiction, and then you also have these lovecraftian creatures.
1298
01:07:50,280 --> 01:07:57,880
Uh, so how did, how and why did you put all of those elements together?
1299
01:07:57,880 --> 01:08:04,080
And then also having a protagonist of Jewish faith, you know, what, what stirred all that?
1300
01:08:04,080 --> 01:08:05,080
Yeah.
1301
01:08:05,080 --> 01:08:09,880
So like I started out wanting to be Larry McMurtry and like Louie Lamour and shit.
1302
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:13,360
You know, I wanted to write just straight up Westerns because I was like a Western nut
1303
01:08:13,360 --> 01:08:15,480
at one point in my life and everything.
1304
01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:20,600
I still am, but, um, I found that I couldn't, like I told you, I went to these Western things
1305
01:08:20,600 --> 01:08:25,240
and like, you know, I, I just, I didn't, I didn't, I didn't walk the walk, you know,
1306
01:08:25,240 --> 01:08:28,120
I could talk the talk, but I couldn't walk the walk.
1307
01:08:28,120 --> 01:08:33,200
So, um, I found, uh, Robert E. Howard was a big influence on me.
1308
01:08:33,200 --> 01:08:36,120
I started reading some of his, uh, stories in high school and everything.
1309
01:08:36,120 --> 01:08:38,400
And you know, he did Coney and he did Solomon Kane.
1310
01:08:38,400 --> 01:08:39,400
Solomon Kane is my favorite.
1311
01:08:39,400 --> 01:08:45,000
He did like all this stuff, but he did a couple of mashup, weird Western stories.
1312
01:08:45,000 --> 01:08:47,360
Like he did this story called the thunder rider.
1313
01:08:47,360 --> 01:08:51,360
That was about this guy that had repressed memories of being Comanche and like fighting
1314
01:08:51,360 --> 01:08:54,800
like monsters as an Indian and stuff.
1315
01:08:54,800 --> 01:08:58,640
Like he, he injected the weird into like Western stuff and everything.
1316
01:08:58,640 --> 01:09:02,840
I got into weird Western stuff because I couldn't make the regular Western sell.
1317
01:09:02,840 --> 01:09:06,600
So I had to add ghoulies basically.
1318
01:09:06,600 --> 01:09:10,200
And then I just, I just started reading more ghoulies stuff and like getting back into
1319
01:09:10,200 --> 01:09:11,200
that.
1320
01:09:11,200 --> 01:09:13,560
And, uh, yeah, that became a winning combination.
1321
01:09:13,560 --> 01:09:20,720
And in terms of, uh, uh, McCobber writer, the Jewish, uh, angle that started with, uh,
1322
01:09:20,720 --> 01:09:25,040
my wife picked up one of these cheap old books you get, uh, on the end cap at like Barnes
1323
01:09:25,040 --> 01:09:29,840
and Noble, I think it was a dictionary on angels or something, you know, you know, I
1324
01:09:29,840 --> 01:09:33,280
was flipping through and reading all these like angelic names and I came across the term
1325
01:09:33,280 --> 01:09:36,080
McCobber writer and it's a real thing.
1326
01:09:36,080 --> 01:09:41,640
It's an, it's an aesthetic, like a Jewish mystic, like scholar who enters into like a
1327
01:09:41,640 --> 01:09:49,360
ecstatic state and then leaves his body and, uh, kind of, um, traverses like these things.
1328
01:09:49,360 --> 01:09:50,360
There's like seven heavens.
1329
01:09:50,360 --> 01:09:52,920
They're called the seven heck a lot and seven palaces.
1330
01:09:52,920 --> 01:09:57,200
And you can ascend all the way up to the top and stand before God, you know, in the presence
1331
01:09:57,200 --> 01:09:58,200
of God and everything.
1332
01:09:58,200 --> 01:10:01,120
And you can get through all this stuff and you wear all these, it's, it mentioned that
1333
01:10:01,120 --> 01:10:06,360
you, they, they, they memorize all these prayers and they wear all these like talismans and
1334
01:10:06,360 --> 01:10:07,640
inscribe them themselves and everything.
1335
01:10:07,640 --> 01:10:11,720
And it just, it jumped right into my head, you know, and everything, uh, full blown.
1336
01:10:11,720 --> 01:10:18,160
The image I got was of, uh, uh, I lived in an Orthodox neighborhood too in Valley village
1337
01:10:18,160 --> 01:10:24,100
and I'm, you know, had these, uh, awesome looking, you know, has seeds and stuff like
1338
01:10:24,100 --> 01:10:28,320
walk into the temple on Saturdays and everything, uh, Friday nights and all this.
1339
01:10:28,320 --> 01:10:32,320
And, you know, like who gets to walk around looking like a cowboy, you know, no questions,
1340
01:10:32,320 --> 01:10:34,040
you know, and everything all day long.
1341
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:40,360
Uh, so I was, I was interested in that just like, cause I knew nothing about, you know,
1342
01:10:40,360 --> 01:10:43,320
Orthodox Judaism and I want, I just wanted to learn about it.
1343
01:10:43,320 --> 01:10:46,760
So the part of it was me wanting to learn about why these guys were dressed this way
1344
01:10:46,760 --> 01:10:47,760
and everything.
1345
01:10:47,760 --> 01:10:52,860
But I got this image of a Hasidic guy, like in the Orthodox garb and everything on this
1346
01:10:52,860 --> 01:10:59,720
flaming like fire horse out of like, uh, cause there's that story of, uh, I think it's, is
1347
01:10:59,720 --> 01:11:01,160
it Eliza or is it Ezekiel?
1348
01:11:01,160 --> 01:11:03,040
I think it's Eliza, Elijah.
1349
01:11:03,040 --> 01:11:07,440
Oh, he's got this flaming chariot that carries him up to heaven and that's where, where Kaba
1350
01:11:07,440 --> 01:11:10,360
comes from or Kaba means chariot.
1351
01:11:10,360 --> 01:11:12,640
So I just, it just jumped full blown.
1352
01:11:12,640 --> 01:11:17,760
I have this image of this, like, uh, has seed on a horse made out of fire rearing up like
1353
01:11:17,760 --> 01:11:19,760
the lone ranger on silver and shit.
1354
01:11:19,760 --> 01:11:21,080
And I just went from there.
1355
01:11:21,080 --> 01:11:23,920
I just started studying more of that and everything.
1356
01:11:23,920 --> 01:11:28,040
I picked up a book, um, on, uh, Hebrew.
1357
01:11:28,040 --> 01:11:30,240
First I had to learn straight up about Judaism.
1358
01:11:30,240 --> 01:11:34,560
So I picked up a book on Judaism, you know, like it wasn't Judaism for dummies.
1359
01:11:34,560 --> 01:11:38,960
It was something, you know, like, uh, something like the Jewish reader, I don't know, something
1360
01:11:38,960 --> 01:11:39,960
like that.
1361
01:11:39,960 --> 01:11:42,360
But then I had this book by this guy, Rabbi Jeffrey Dennis.
1362
01:11:42,360 --> 01:11:44,140
And I was so, dude, I was so pleased.
1363
01:11:44,140 --> 01:11:48,720
Like a couple of years ago, he actually left a review from a Kaba writer on the fricking
1364
01:11:48,720 --> 01:11:54,280
on Amazon, which is cool because, uh, I, I, I pimp his book whenever I can.
1365
01:11:54,280 --> 01:12:02,040
He wrote this great, like, uh, dictionary on, um, on a Judaic, like folklore and stuff.
1366
01:12:02,040 --> 01:12:06,400
And, uh, when, really when you want to learn about something, whether it be a time period
1367
01:12:06,400 --> 01:12:12,240
or a, uh, a subject or religion or whatever, if you can find one of those dictionaries,
1368
01:12:12,240 --> 01:12:16,320
like this is a, something A to Z just flip through it and read the entire thing and you'll
1369
01:12:16,320 --> 01:12:23,620
get this crazy like cross section and smattering of everything and, uh, marrying it to love
1370
01:12:23,620 --> 01:12:24,620
craft.
1371
01:12:24,620 --> 01:12:32,400
There's always really cool, uh, uh, things that kind of cross over with Judaic, um, mystic
1372
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:37,200
thought and folklore and everything, because, uh, they, they had this thing that says, um,
1373
01:12:37,200 --> 01:12:40,160
you are forbidden to study what came before creations.
1374
01:12:40,160 --> 01:12:43,280
You're not even supposed to contemplate it.
1375
01:12:43,280 --> 01:12:44,840
It's like, it's a forbidden thing of study.
1376
01:12:44,840 --> 01:12:46,440
And that's very lovecrafty.
1377
01:12:46,440 --> 01:12:50,200
And you know, it's, it's like very much like the idea of forbidden study and forbidden
1378
01:12:50,200 --> 01:12:51,400
works and books and all this.
1379
01:12:51,400 --> 01:12:57,360
And then there's another thing I came across this entry of this creature called Rahav or
1380
01:12:57,360 --> 01:12:58,840
something.
1381
01:12:58,840 --> 01:13:05,800
And they describe it as this creature that God subdued while creating the earth or something,
1382
01:13:05,800 --> 01:13:06,800
creating the universe.
1383
01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:12,360
And he threw his body into the waters and it gives the ocean its smell.
1384
01:13:12,360 --> 01:13:16,520
Like this thing slumbering at the bottom of the ocean gives the ocean its smell.
1385
01:13:16,520 --> 01:13:21,120
I don't know if lovecraft read this stuff before he wrote his own shit or whatever,
1386
01:13:21,120 --> 01:13:25,200
but it just gelled so well, you know, it wasn't even looking for it.
1387
01:13:25,200 --> 01:13:28,240
It was like, uh, I just started reading.
1388
01:13:28,240 --> 01:13:32,320
I only started reading lovecraft when I started writing Rahav or writer.
1389
01:13:32,320 --> 01:13:36,520
I needed like a big bad and I didn't want it to be the devil because in Judaic, whatever
1390
01:13:36,520 --> 01:13:42,480
the devil is not really a concept, at least not in the way it is in like the exorcist
1391
01:13:42,480 --> 01:13:43,480
and stuff like that.
1392
01:13:43,480 --> 01:13:48,680
You know, it's not a, it's not an adversary so much as a guy that works with God to tempt
1393
01:13:48,680 --> 01:13:52,320
and like test mankind and everything.
1394
01:13:52,320 --> 01:14:00,880
So then the whole, the whole point of like Rahav or writer is preserving creation as
1395
01:14:00,880 --> 01:14:01,880
it is.
1396
01:14:01,880 --> 01:14:07,840
But first he has his faith tested and realizes that there are these things that exist outside
1397
01:14:07,840 --> 01:14:13,120
of creation that are more powerful than the God that he worships and all this and knows.
1398
01:14:13,120 --> 01:14:20,720
And he has to decide is creation worth preserving as it is, you know, because the, the, the
1399
01:14:20,720 --> 01:14:25,320
alternative is just roiling chaos, you know, the, the chaos that preceded creation and
1400
01:14:25,320 --> 01:14:26,320
everything.
1401
01:14:26,320 --> 01:14:31,440
So it's kind of like, he just decides, well, you know, even though my, first his faith
1402
01:14:31,440 --> 01:14:36,320
is shaken and he's like, you know, he doesn't want to go on, but then it's like, you know,
1403
01:14:36,320 --> 01:14:41,440
all that I love and all that I've ever known is it worth, is it worth preserving?
1404
01:14:41,440 --> 01:14:44,800
And you know, that's, that's pretty much it is, you know, to him.
1405
01:14:44,800 --> 01:14:47,240
So that's the premise of that series.
1406
01:14:47,240 --> 01:14:52,920
So in, in researching and cause you know, you, you like to be historically, you know,
1407
01:14:52,920 --> 01:14:56,440
accurate when you're, when you're doing works and things like that.
1408
01:14:56,440 --> 01:15:01,800
So is that, is that kind of part of the passion of, of the writing for you is, is not just
1409
01:15:01,800 --> 01:15:06,600
obviously writing it down, but doing that backstory, that backend research.
1410
01:15:06,600 --> 01:15:10,680
Is that, is that also kind of sort of a passion for you?
1411
01:15:10,680 --> 01:15:12,580
It's fun to learn.
1412
01:15:12,580 --> 01:15:16,400
It's like taking a college course without having to pay all the fucking money and worrying
1413
01:15:16,400 --> 01:15:18,760
about the credits and the grades and all that.
1414
01:15:18,760 --> 01:15:21,320
Like I do a deep dive on something that I want to write about.
1415
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:26,080
Like my book, my last couple of books were set in 1977, New York.
1416
01:15:26,080 --> 01:15:30,480
And I just did a deep dive on all things, 1977, New York, you know, everything that
1417
01:15:30,480 --> 01:15:36,800
was going on in the summer of Sam, Reggie Jackson, frickin' Muhammad Ali, like in the
1418
01:15:36,800 --> 01:15:39,480
first black mayoral run and all this kind of stuff.
1419
01:15:39,480 --> 01:15:41,400
You know, it's just all this stuff I learned.
1420
01:15:41,400 --> 01:15:43,560
I like to learn as I'm writing.
1421
01:15:43,560 --> 01:15:49,120
So like, I guess I would tack on to that whole, write what you love thing or write what you
1422
01:15:49,120 --> 01:15:52,040
know, I say, write what you know you love.
1423
01:15:52,040 --> 01:15:53,800
Don't worry about what you know, you can learn anything.
1424
01:15:53,800 --> 01:15:56,200
You can learn, you're supposed to learn your entire life.
1425
01:15:56,200 --> 01:15:59,840
You know, if you ever think you know enough, then you don't.
1426
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:01,760
You know, that's the bottom line.
1427
01:16:01,760 --> 01:16:04,080
Obviously, you're always going to keep learning.
1428
01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:06,880
And for me, like writing is a learning experience.
1429
01:16:06,880 --> 01:16:11,000
I like to push myself and write in things that I don't know anything about, you know,
1430
01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:13,280
because I want to learn about them.
1431
01:16:13,280 --> 01:16:16,300
I posit a question for you.
1432
01:16:16,300 --> 01:16:22,520
Would there ever be a possibility of writing something like, is it My Dinner with Andre,
1433
01:16:22,520 --> 01:16:27,440
I think is the title of the movie where it's just a conversational, the whole the whole
1434
01:16:27,440 --> 01:16:32,840
book, or even maybe a script that you would write that is entirely conversational?
1435
01:16:32,840 --> 01:16:35,560
Is that something that you would ever want to tackle?
1436
01:16:35,560 --> 01:16:39,880
Sure, I'll try anything, honestly.
1437
01:16:39,880 --> 01:16:45,320
There are chapters in like there I'd like to my last book, the conquer novel got really
1438
01:16:45,320 --> 01:16:48,040
kind of, I did some experimenting in that and everything.
1439
01:16:48,040 --> 01:16:55,740
But like, so it has to do with this, this cult, who's kind of trying to suppress this
1440
01:16:55,740 --> 01:17:02,000
magical revolution that turns out to be hip hop, as hip hop kind of like sprung out of
1441
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:04,600
1977, like inner city New York.
1442
01:17:04,600 --> 01:17:08,160
And if you think about it, it spread over the entire culture, and it totally changed
1443
01:17:08,160 --> 01:17:10,440
the face of culture and everything.
1444
01:17:10,440 --> 01:17:16,200
It like made it brought like African American issues into the forefront and stuff.
1445
01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:19,920
And it was a cultural revolution, I feel like.
1446
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:23,840
And I attribute it to this magical thing and everything, this magical occurrence in my
1447
01:17:23,840 --> 01:17:24,840
book.
1448
01:17:24,840 --> 01:17:28,880
It's the book is about a cult detective in the 70s and stuff.
1449
01:17:28,880 --> 01:17:31,760
So it's kind of like Shaft meets Constantine or something.
1450
01:17:31,760 --> 01:17:36,040
But at one point he encounters this goddess, this revolutionary goddess, who's there to
1451
01:17:36,040 --> 01:17:42,160
kind of mid wipe in this like, this, this act, this magical occurrence.
1452
01:17:42,160 --> 01:17:46,080
Another cool thing like that I read that I learned while reading this, okay, so like
1453
01:17:46,080 --> 01:17:53,120
this is just an aside, but like, hip hop really spread when because people couldn't afford
1454
01:17:53,120 --> 01:17:55,760
all these turntables and electronic shit and everything.
1455
01:17:55,760 --> 01:17:58,240
It spread because of the blackout of 1977.
1456
01:17:58,240 --> 01:18:03,840
And the blackout happened because people broke into these stores and like the next day everybody
1457
01:18:03,840 --> 01:18:08,520
was mixing and everybody was sampling because they got they stole all the electronic equipment.
1458
01:18:08,520 --> 01:18:13,120
They disseminated, hip hop basically got disseminated by the 1977 blackout.
1459
01:18:13,120 --> 01:18:19,480
And the 1977 blackout was caused by a lightning strike, which is fucking crazy if you think
1460
01:18:19,480 --> 01:18:20,880
about it, you know.
1461
01:18:20,880 --> 01:18:26,720
So like I worked that in to where this goddess kind of is there to mid wipe in this magical
1462
01:18:26,720 --> 01:18:30,120
revolution, she calls down the lightning and shit.
1463
01:18:30,120 --> 01:18:36,960
And so like I had this whole scene where he's talking to her and she he knows her as this
1464
01:18:36,960 --> 01:18:41,800
woman that he knows, but she's possessed and she's just speaking all hip hop lyrics.
1465
01:18:41,800 --> 01:18:47,520
So like hip hop lyrics taken from the breadth of hip hop history.
1466
01:18:47,520 --> 01:18:52,320
And I basically like took as many lyrics as I could gather and just kind of tried to make
1467
01:18:52,320 --> 01:18:53,400
sense of them.
1468
01:18:53,400 --> 01:18:56,600
Like it becomes like stream of consciousness, you know.
1469
01:18:56,600 --> 01:18:57,600
Yeah.
1470
01:18:57,600 --> 01:19:01,600
So I did that and that was a really interesting thing that came to me while I was writing
1471
01:19:01,600 --> 01:19:03,680
it and I thought it was kind of experimental and everything.
1472
01:19:03,680 --> 01:19:11,000
And then he also has this car that's possessed by the spirit of this pimp that got killed
1473
01:19:11,000 --> 01:19:12,000
in the trunk.
1474
01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:16,600
And so he kind of drives around in this car, talks to him through the radio and everything,
1475
01:19:16,600 --> 01:19:17,840
the pimp talks to him through the radio.
1476
01:19:17,840 --> 01:19:21,560
It's kind of like a 1970s like Knight Rider.
1477
01:19:21,560 --> 01:19:29,160
But at one point I took I dove into I took a whole chapter and I went into the pimp's
1478
01:19:29,160 --> 01:19:35,200
point of view and it was because I had read I had read shit.
1479
01:19:35,200 --> 01:19:36,200
What is it?
1480
01:19:36,200 --> 01:19:40,320
Iceberg Slim, you know, and like I wanted to like get into this guy's mind and like
1481
01:19:40,320 --> 01:19:44,160
what it meant to be a pimp in the 70s and like what led you into that life and like
1482
01:19:44,160 --> 01:19:46,240
how horrible it really was and stuff.
1483
01:19:46,240 --> 01:19:48,840
Like it's not it's not something to be glorified.
1484
01:19:48,840 --> 01:19:53,440
You know, it's like a horrible like it's a horrible way to make a living because you're
1485
01:19:53,440 --> 01:19:55,640
exploiting like you know these women and everything.
1486
01:19:55,640 --> 01:19:59,360
It's it's how do you get how do you get to that level and everything?
1487
01:19:59,360 --> 01:20:00,360
How do you get to that point?
1488
01:20:00,360 --> 01:20:06,800
And I told this whole this whole chapter was like a big experiment for me to just write
1489
01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:10,960
this guy's history from the point of view of this like side character that was a pimp
1490
01:20:10,960 --> 01:20:18,160
and it was all like very much in his like natural way of speaking his patois and everything.
1491
01:20:18,160 --> 01:20:21,200
And you know, I do try to experiment in every little thing.
1492
01:20:21,200 --> 01:20:24,040
I try to I try to try new things.
1493
01:20:24,040 --> 01:20:28,840
So yeah, I can see myself writing the whole thing of dialogue like that one Cormac McCarthy
1494
01:20:28,840 --> 01:20:31,760
novel I think where they're on a train and it's just God and the devil talking.
1495
01:20:31,760 --> 01:20:32,760
It's the whole book.
1496
01:20:32,760 --> 01:20:34,240
I mean, it's pretty interesting.
1497
01:20:34,240 --> 01:20:36,920
I try to devour stuff like that.
1498
01:20:36,920 --> 01:20:39,160
And yeah, I think it shows up in my own mind.
1499
01:20:39,160 --> 01:20:43,200
Yeah, and yeah, I don't want to I don't want to jerk you off too bad.
1500
01:20:43,200 --> 01:20:47,120
But honestly, man, that is some of the that's like the coolest fucking shit I've ever heard
1501
01:20:47,120 --> 01:20:51,200
about just the way you come up with this stuff.
1502
01:20:51,200 --> 01:20:55,440
And honestly, people don't fucking get it that don't know.
1503
01:20:55,440 --> 01:21:00,280
But it's like this, I know, at least for me, when I'm writing or creating, it's like streaming,
1504
01:21:00,280 --> 01:21:03,040
like you said, streaming consciousness, I'm pulling shit from the ether that
1505
01:21:03,040 --> 01:21:08,600
one little exactly one little thought, one little kernel I pulled from the ether.
1506
01:21:08,600 --> 01:21:13,600
And then it explodes into this this fucking idea that just goes in all these different
1507
01:21:13,600 --> 01:21:16,760
ways and runs these different routes in your brain.
1508
01:21:16,760 --> 01:21:19,040
All these pathways open up and stuff.
1509
01:21:19,040 --> 01:21:20,040
Yeah.
1510
01:21:20,040 --> 01:21:24,560
And every little thing that you're experiencing in your life at that time seems to feed it
1511
01:21:24,560 --> 01:21:27,560
seems to like go into it somehow, work it somehow.
1512
01:21:27,560 --> 01:21:31,760
Like I'll do research and like I'm not researching, you know, whatever.
1513
01:21:31,760 --> 01:21:35,720
But all of a sudden, I feel this thing comes and says, hey, look at me, you know, and you
1514
01:21:35,720 --> 01:21:38,000
work this in there and stuff and it all fits.
1515
01:21:38,000 --> 01:21:42,360
You know, everything kind of just falls into place like all creation like a funnel.
1516
01:21:42,360 --> 01:21:43,360
Yeah.
1517
01:21:43,360 --> 01:21:48,800
So like all this roiling stuff out in the collective consciousness and you just you
1518
01:21:48,800 --> 01:21:51,880
make the connections, you know, stuff comes to you and whatever's got the loudest voice,
1519
01:21:51,880 --> 01:21:52,880
it's going to make its way in.
1520
01:21:52,880 --> 01:21:53,880
Yeah, exactly.
1521
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:54,880
True story.
1522
01:21:54,880 --> 01:22:00,640
So I do want to know more about because you mentioned earlier about the movie that you
1523
01:22:00,640 --> 01:22:01,920
made, the film.
1524
01:22:01,920 --> 01:22:05,520
I this is definitely going to be its own fucking segment right here for sure.
1525
01:22:05,520 --> 01:22:11,000
But I I got I have to fucking know that was what you went to school for.
1526
01:22:11,000 --> 01:22:13,760
That was what you that's what you got your degree in.
1527
01:22:13,760 --> 01:22:14,760
Right.
1528
01:22:14,760 --> 01:22:17,280
And it took you from graduation to making this movie.
1529
01:22:17,280 --> 01:22:18,280
What would you say?
1530
01:22:18,280 --> 01:22:20,280
Ten, ten, twelve years, something like that.
1531
01:22:20,280 --> 01:22:21,280
Yeah, something like that.
1532
01:22:21,280 --> 01:22:28,480
And it was just me with a stupid idea, honestly, like we and it was not a wise decision at
1533
01:22:28,480 --> 01:22:29,480
all.
1534
01:22:29,480 --> 01:22:36,200
We were getting booted out of our apartment building because Kaiser was going to turn
1535
01:22:36,200 --> 01:22:37,200
into a parking lot.
1536
01:22:37,200 --> 01:22:38,200
And they did.
1537
01:22:38,200 --> 01:22:42,240
They turned our building in Panoram City into more parking for Kaiser.
1538
01:22:42,240 --> 01:22:44,360
But they gave us relocation money.
1539
01:22:44,360 --> 01:22:50,880
And I posited to my wife, hey, can I use this as a aid to make a movie and stuff?
1540
01:22:50,880 --> 01:22:51,880
You know, God bless her.
1541
01:22:51,880 --> 01:22:59,240
Now, I'm not going to say anything bad about my ex-wife because she let me she let me gamble
1542
01:22:59,240 --> 01:23:00,240
that and everything.
1543
01:23:00,240 --> 01:23:02,280
And it didn't pay off.
1544
01:23:02,280 --> 01:23:03,280
None at all.
1545
01:23:03,280 --> 01:23:06,760
But we should have bought a house for that for sure.
1546
01:23:06,760 --> 01:23:10,440
But then again, what would I have if I had I have a house?
1547
01:23:10,440 --> 01:23:11,440
OK, but right.
1548
01:23:11,440 --> 01:23:12,440
I'm getting divorced.
1549
01:23:12,440 --> 01:23:13,440
I'd be fighting.
1550
01:23:13,440 --> 01:23:16,680
We'd be fighting tooth and nail over that house.
1551
01:23:16,680 --> 01:23:21,400
And I wouldn't have the experience of, you know, making a grab for what I really wanted
1552
01:23:21,400 --> 01:23:22,400
to do.
1553
01:23:22,400 --> 01:23:26,520
I like a lot of people like you said, like like you said in the beginning, a lot of people
1554
01:23:26,520 --> 01:23:29,440
say they got a book in them, say they want to write, but then don't do it.
1555
01:23:29,440 --> 01:23:32,440
And a lot of people say they want to make a movie.
1556
01:23:32,440 --> 01:23:34,440
But, you know, maybe it didn't, you know, maybe it didn't work.
1557
01:23:34,440 --> 01:23:36,440
But like like our P. McMurphy, at least I tried.
1558
01:23:36,440 --> 01:23:37,440
God damn it.
1559
01:23:37,440 --> 01:23:38,440
Yes.
1560
01:23:38,440 --> 01:23:39,440
You're the one percent as far as we're concerned.
1561
01:23:39,440 --> 01:23:42,360
You put the effort in, you completed it.
1562
01:23:42,360 --> 01:23:48,400
So I mean, in our in our own definition, you are, I mean, a winner because you you did
1563
01:23:48,400 --> 01:23:50,080
it like I don't know how else to put it.
1564
01:23:50,080 --> 01:23:52,000
Like I respect that dearly.
1565
01:23:52,000 --> 01:23:53,400
Like I don't know how else to put it.
1566
01:23:53,400 --> 01:23:54,400
Yeah.
1567
01:23:54,400 --> 01:23:55,400
It's really nice to hear.
1568
01:23:55,400 --> 01:23:56,400
Thank you.
1569
01:23:56,400 --> 01:23:57,400
It's it's on Amazon, too.
1570
01:23:57,400 --> 01:23:58,400
You can watch it on Amazon.
1571
01:23:58,400 --> 01:23:59,400
What's the name of it?
1572
01:23:59,400 --> 01:24:00,400
I wouldn't recommend it.
1573
01:24:00,400 --> 01:24:05,320
I would say the last half hour.
1574
01:24:05,320 --> 01:24:06,320
What's the name of it?
1575
01:24:06,320 --> 01:24:07,320
What's the name of the movie?
1576
01:24:07,320 --> 01:24:08,320
It's called Meena.
1577
01:24:08,320 --> 01:24:09,320
It's called Meena than Hell.
1578
01:24:09,320 --> 01:24:10,320
I got it from a Johnny Cash song.
1579
01:24:10,320 --> 01:24:11,320
Meena than Hell.
1580
01:24:11,320 --> 01:24:17,160
A lot of my things come from Johnny Cash because my dad like like had this tape that we went
1581
01:24:17,160 --> 01:24:18,160
on a road trip in the Bronco.
1582
01:24:18,160 --> 01:24:19,160
He always had Johnny Cash playing.
1583
01:24:19,160 --> 01:24:20,160
Yeah.
1584
01:24:20,160 --> 01:24:21,160
And yeah, Meena than Hell.
1585
01:24:21,160 --> 01:24:22,160
Who's the name of it?
1586
01:24:22,160 --> 01:24:27,440
And it was a straight up Western with no fucking horses because I couldn't afford horses.
1587
01:24:27,440 --> 01:24:29,840
I couldn't afford like horse trainers.
1588
01:24:29,840 --> 01:24:30,840
Yeah.
1589
01:24:30,840 --> 01:24:36,120
I just put like I opened it in a in this in this dark desert in a campfire.
1590
01:24:36,120 --> 01:24:37,120
It's only lit by the campfire.
1591
01:24:37,120 --> 01:24:41,240
You can only see the faces and you can hear the horses in the background and the guy runs
1592
01:24:41,240 --> 01:24:42,720
the horses off in the first scene.
1593
01:24:42,720 --> 01:24:45,720
That's how we got rid of the horses.
1594
01:24:45,720 --> 01:24:48,040
That's a perfect way to come.
1595
01:24:48,040 --> 01:24:51,680
It's the it's it's I know you're maybe you don't know pro wrestling like me and Adam,
1596
01:24:51,680 --> 01:24:58,440
but it's the it's the Paul Heyman esque type of of mantra where you hide the negatives,
1597
01:24:58,440 --> 01:24:59,680
accentuate the positives.
1598
01:24:59,680 --> 01:25:04,920
I ain't got no money for horses, so I'm going to run these ass horses out of here for sequence
1599
01:25:04,920 --> 01:25:06,640
and then I got to worry about horses anymore.
1600
01:25:06,640 --> 01:25:07,640
Yeah.
1601
01:25:07,640 --> 01:25:08,640
In the dark.
1602
01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:10,640
We can see him riding away.
1603
01:25:10,640 --> 01:25:11,640
Exactly.
1604
01:25:11,640 --> 01:25:15,640
And yeah, it was basically this bounty hunter comes across these outlaws in the desert and
1605
01:25:15,640 --> 01:25:18,400
he runs their horses off and he's he's only after the one.
1606
01:25:18,400 --> 01:25:24,840
So he shoots all the other ones, keeps the boss alive, shoots him in the foot.
1607
01:25:24,840 --> 01:25:27,160
So he's getting this gangrenous foot.
1608
01:25:27,160 --> 01:25:28,160
That was the idea.
1609
01:25:28,160 --> 01:25:32,160
He's going to have this gangrenous foot getting worse and worse throughout the whole movie.
1610
01:25:32,160 --> 01:25:35,840
Because he's he says, I'm only going to take you to a doctor until you tell me where the
1611
01:25:35,840 --> 01:25:39,280
money from your last job is, where you hit it.
1612
01:25:39,280 --> 01:25:41,700
And he dynamited the gambling boat basically.
1613
01:25:41,700 --> 01:25:42,700
So he didn't even get the money.
1614
01:25:42,700 --> 01:25:44,400
It like went to the bottom of the lake.
1615
01:25:44,400 --> 01:25:46,160
He doesn't tell them that to later.
1616
01:25:46,160 --> 01:25:53,280
But so then it becomes this bounty hunter, this outlaw trying to get to town because
1617
01:25:53,280 --> 01:25:57,960
they wake up the next day and the bounty hunter's horse is gone as well because Apache Indians
1618
01:25:57,960 --> 01:25:59,440
stole it.
1619
01:25:59,440 --> 01:26:02,200
So they're stuck in the desert and they're like kind of change.
1620
01:26:02,200 --> 01:26:04,080
It's kind of like a change, the change to each other.
1621
01:26:04,080 --> 01:26:05,080
What's that thing?
1622
01:26:05,080 --> 01:26:10,880
I can't think of the name of the original with Sydney Portier and Tony Curtis.
1623
01:26:10,880 --> 01:26:15,960
Anyway, they're going across the desert on foot and one guy's got a bad foot that's separating
1624
01:26:15,960 --> 01:26:16,960
and getting worse.
1625
01:26:16,960 --> 01:26:23,320
And I called it at one point, the guy has a line that what we're doing here is we're
1626
01:26:23,320 --> 01:26:24,920
playing a game of matrimonial poker.
1627
01:26:24,920 --> 01:26:29,720
We're both trying to fuck each other.
1628
01:26:29,720 --> 01:26:34,120
They're going through the desert and they're trying to contend with this threat of unseen
1629
01:26:34,120 --> 01:26:40,640
threat of Indians because I can only afford one real Indian guy and trying to kill each
1630
01:26:40,640 --> 01:26:42,120
other at the same time.
1631
01:26:42,120 --> 01:26:43,120
Yeah.
1632
01:26:43,120 --> 01:26:45,360
So it's like a it's a two man movie basically.
1633
01:26:45,360 --> 01:26:46,360
Right.
1634
01:26:46,360 --> 01:26:47,360
Right.
1635
01:26:47,360 --> 01:26:51,000
So speaking of affording things, what so when you set this out, what was the budget that
1636
01:26:51,000 --> 01:26:53,120
you set essentially?
1637
01:26:53,120 --> 01:26:56,000
And then what what did you actually spend?
1638
01:26:56,000 --> 01:27:00,920
And I guess to truncate that question, did you did you spend more than what you set out
1639
01:27:00,920 --> 01:27:02,240
to?
1640
01:27:02,240 --> 01:27:03,560
I don't think I spent more.
1641
01:27:03,560 --> 01:27:05,880
No, my budget was eight thousand eight grand.
1642
01:27:05,880 --> 01:27:07,440
That's what we got.
1643
01:27:07,440 --> 01:27:11,200
And two of my friends came forward with a grand each.
1644
01:27:11,200 --> 01:27:12,200
So that was like a boom.
1645
01:27:12,200 --> 01:27:13,640
You know, that was like a bonus.
1646
01:27:13,640 --> 01:27:14,640
Yeah.
1647
01:27:14,640 --> 01:27:17,960
And then my friend came out like my buddy also came out from Chicago with a grand and
1648
01:27:17,960 --> 01:27:20,560
like crude for me and stuff, too.
1649
01:27:20,560 --> 01:27:21,560
You know, like he helped out.
1650
01:27:21,560 --> 01:27:22,560
Yeah.
1651
01:27:22,560 --> 01:27:23,560
Yeah.
1652
01:27:23,560 --> 01:27:24,560
This is my buddy since from kindergarten.
1653
01:27:24,560 --> 01:27:29,440
You know, and yeah, so I spent whatever I had.
1654
01:27:29,440 --> 01:27:31,760
You know, I had like 10 grand.
1655
01:27:31,760 --> 01:27:32,760
We did.
1656
01:27:32,760 --> 01:27:35,960
I got the camera that was like three grand.
1657
01:27:35,960 --> 01:27:36,960
So really about seven grand.
1658
01:27:36,960 --> 01:27:40,000
Honestly, I got a three thousand dollar camera.
1659
01:27:40,000 --> 01:27:41,000
You buy it.
1660
01:27:41,000 --> 01:27:42,000
You want the camera?
1661
01:27:42,000 --> 01:27:43,000
Oh, yeah.
1662
01:27:43,000 --> 01:27:44,000
Yeah.
1663
01:27:44,000 --> 01:27:48,080
I mean, I knew I was going out to Death Valley and I knew I was going to be fucking around
1664
01:27:48,080 --> 01:27:50,560
and I didn't want to worry about buying somebody else's camera.
1665
01:27:50,560 --> 01:27:53,400
I'm like, if I'm going to fuck this camera, it's going to be my own camera.
1666
01:27:53,400 --> 01:27:57,360
Well, did you fuck the camera up or did you?
1667
01:27:57,360 --> 01:28:00,400
I got a lot of grit and sand underneath the lens and shit.
1668
01:28:00,400 --> 01:28:02,000
Yeah, it got pretty fucked up.
1669
01:28:02,000 --> 01:28:04,080
And then like my daughter ended up dropping something.
1670
01:28:04,080 --> 01:28:06,900
I mean, my little daughter, I was going over footage.
1671
01:28:06,900 --> 01:28:11,320
She dropped like something on it, shot the tape on it and it totally fucked up the monitor.
1672
01:28:11,320 --> 01:28:12,840
So it was completely fucked up.
1673
01:28:12,840 --> 01:28:13,840
That sucks.
1674
01:28:13,840 --> 01:28:17,000
But hey, you got the one you said it was a digital tape.
1675
01:28:17,000 --> 01:28:18,800
It was a digital tape camera.
1676
01:28:18,800 --> 01:28:21,160
So it was totally it was pretty much in two years.
1677
01:28:21,160 --> 01:28:22,640
It was it was no good.
1678
01:28:22,640 --> 01:28:23,640
I was done.
1679
01:28:23,640 --> 01:28:26,640
Yeah, it was absolutely OK.
1680
01:28:26,640 --> 01:28:37,800
Most of it was spent on the actors and on the my mom and my and my ex also were seamstresses.
1681
01:28:37,800 --> 01:28:41,000
So they could like they sold a lot of the costumes, whatever I couldn't.
1682
01:28:41,000 --> 01:28:46,400
So whatever they couldn't sell, I bought from like these frontier places and stuff.
1683
01:28:46,400 --> 01:28:49,200
I did the hats mainly like the hats.
1684
01:28:49,200 --> 01:28:52,680
The guns were my dad was a cop.
1685
01:28:52,680 --> 01:28:57,520
I mentioned, I think in Chicago, he had a lot of old black powder pistols that he liked
1686
01:28:57,520 --> 01:28:58,520
to fire.
1687
01:28:58,520 --> 01:28:59,520
And I'm just a hobby.
1688
01:28:59,520 --> 01:29:00,520
He let me use them.
1689
01:29:00,520 --> 01:29:05,440
And it's like we just load the we just loaded the pistols with black powder and didn't put
1690
01:29:05,440 --> 01:29:06,440
any loads in them.
1691
01:29:06,440 --> 01:29:07,440
So you didn't have blanks.
1692
01:29:07,440 --> 01:29:09,520
It just made a big pop and a flare.
1693
01:29:09,520 --> 01:29:10,520
Nothing came out.
1694
01:29:10,520 --> 01:29:11,520
It was fire and smoke.
1695
01:29:11,520 --> 01:29:15,720
So we didn't have to buy blank guns or anything like that.
1696
01:29:15,720 --> 01:29:16,720
Yeah.
1697
01:29:16,720 --> 01:29:17,720
Yeah.
1698
01:29:17,720 --> 01:29:25,760
The only time we paid for a location was we filmed the last scene in the skate park up
1699
01:29:25,760 --> 01:29:26,760
North called Bodie.
1700
01:29:26,760 --> 01:29:29,000
That's this like abandoned ghost town.
1701
01:29:29,000 --> 01:29:31,840
And I had to I only paid for it because I had to.
1702
01:29:31,840 --> 01:29:35,000
I had to have a park ranger on site for two hours while I filmed.
1703
01:29:35,000 --> 01:29:37,200
And I was basically filming the park ranger.
1704
01:29:37,200 --> 01:29:39,040
I mean, like paying the park ranger.
1705
01:29:39,040 --> 01:29:40,040
Right.
1706
01:29:40,040 --> 01:29:41,040
Yeah.
1707
01:29:41,040 --> 01:29:43,040
But all the actors got paid.
1708
01:29:43,040 --> 01:29:45,360
Like I don't remember how much exactly.
1709
01:29:45,360 --> 01:29:46,800
Some guys got as low as like 50 bucks.
1710
01:29:46,800 --> 01:29:48,680
You know, they're just there for the day.
1711
01:29:48,680 --> 01:29:49,680
We went home.
1712
01:29:49,680 --> 01:29:50,680
We were so short.
1713
01:29:50,680 --> 01:29:54,160
I put out a call in variety for like Native American actors.
1714
01:29:54,160 --> 01:29:55,160
I didn't get a one, dude.
1715
01:29:55,160 --> 01:29:56,960
I got like a Middle Eastern dude.
1716
01:29:56,960 --> 01:30:00,240
I got my best friend at the time was Mexican.
1717
01:30:00,240 --> 01:30:01,240
I got him.
1718
01:30:01,240 --> 01:30:04,200
My son is like part Mexican.
1719
01:30:04,200 --> 01:30:09,280
So we put a we put a wig on him, you know, and like fucking.
1720
01:30:09,280 --> 01:30:16,640
So on the way up to Bodhi, we hit an Indian casino and my buddies, my buddy, Elliot, who
1721
01:30:16,640 --> 01:30:21,240
was the assistant director, just went through with money and was like anybody who wants
1722
01:30:21,240 --> 01:30:22,240
to be on this.
1723
01:30:22,240 --> 01:30:25,800
And we got one guy who was like perfect looking.
1724
01:30:25,800 --> 01:30:27,480
He looked like fucking Geronimo.
1725
01:30:27,480 --> 01:30:33,480
We put him out front and the other guys behind him and we paid him like 80 bucks or something.
1726
01:30:33,480 --> 01:30:36,720
Oh, no, we did a little bit more than that because he got what we were budgeted for all
1727
01:30:36,720 --> 01:30:37,720
the other Indians.
1728
01:30:37,720 --> 01:30:42,920
We gave it to him because he was the only guy that showed up.
1729
01:30:42,920 --> 01:30:43,920
That's pretty, pretty.
1730
01:30:43,920 --> 01:30:45,120
He stayed under budget too.
1731
01:30:45,120 --> 01:30:46,120
That's pretty amazing.
1732
01:30:46,120 --> 01:30:47,120
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
1733
01:30:47,120 --> 01:30:52,760
We didn't go over because yeah, the other thing was we had an editor.
1734
01:30:52,760 --> 01:30:54,760
My buddy does editing.
1735
01:30:54,760 --> 01:30:59,860
He cuts at the time he was working for game show network doing like promos.
1736
01:30:59,860 --> 01:31:01,720
So he had all the editing software at home.
1737
01:31:01,720 --> 01:31:04,160
So yeah, we got the edit for free.
1738
01:31:04,160 --> 01:31:08,000
My other buddy does SFX makeup.
1739
01:31:08,000 --> 01:31:12,280
So all the bullet moons and shit were all like him.
1740
01:31:12,280 --> 01:31:14,720
He like buckets the caro syrup.
1741
01:31:14,720 --> 01:31:16,440
We brought my minivan home.
1742
01:31:16,440 --> 01:31:20,760
My Saturn minivan looked like we gave birth in the bathroom.
1743
01:31:20,760 --> 01:31:23,560
It's something that's just a complete slaughterhouse.
1744
01:31:23,560 --> 01:31:27,200
Yeah, yeah, it was a fun time.
1745
01:31:27,200 --> 01:31:29,800
It was the most fun I ever had failing.
1746
01:31:29,800 --> 01:31:32,040
You know, like I pretty much failed.
1747
01:31:32,040 --> 01:31:39,400
But there was one point though, man, like just one day that we filmed in Ballarat, this
1748
01:31:39,400 --> 01:31:43,880
crazy ass like little town out in the middle of like past past that valley in the middle
1749
01:31:43,880 --> 01:31:47,880
of that by Edwards Air Force Base, we had to stop sometimes because like F-16s would
1750
01:31:47,880 --> 01:31:52,240
be flying over and shit or 18s, which are the ones that are on land base.
1751
01:31:52,240 --> 01:31:55,360
16s, I think anyway, but they'd be blooming over the mountains.
1752
01:31:55,360 --> 01:32:00,320
Yeah, like Top Gun, they'd be blooming over the mountains and we had to stop.
1753
01:32:00,320 --> 01:32:08,000
And this one crazy dude lived out there in this in this like crummy like, you know, local
1754
01:32:08,000 --> 01:32:11,160
museum with his dad, his elderly father.
1755
01:32:11,160 --> 01:32:14,280
And I swear he had one eye that was reptilian.
1756
01:32:14,280 --> 01:32:18,560
I swear to God, the one eye was just blown out and he had a sliver of an iris.
1757
01:32:18,560 --> 01:32:21,120
It was the weirdest thing.
1758
01:32:21,120 --> 01:32:24,600
And we were out there and we were filming in this cabin.
1759
01:32:24,600 --> 01:32:25,600
We had this cabin shot.
1760
01:32:25,600 --> 01:32:30,680
It was the best, best day I ever had in my probably one of the best days I ever had in
1761
01:32:30,680 --> 01:32:32,680
my life, because we were fighting the sun.
1762
01:32:32,680 --> 01:32:37,560
The sun was going down and everything was going exactly as I pictured it, you know,
1763
01:32:37,560 --> 01:32:38,560
in the script and everything.
1764
01:32:38,560 --> 01:32:40,560
And the guys were hitting their lines.
1765
01:32:40,560 --> 01:32:41,560
Perfect.
1766
01:32:41,560 --> 01:32:45,560
It was this surprise moment and I was really fucking take two because it's this surprise
1767
01:32:45,560 --> 01:32:50,120
moment where this guy's been hiding this like derringer all along and he they're in the
1768
01:32:50,120 --> 01:32:52,160
middle of laughing like they pulled this.
1769
01:32:52,160 --> 01:32:59,360
They shoot this guy, this Indian air quotes and somebody drags his body away out of the
1770
01:32:59,360 --> 01:33:03,080
door like because they're not going to leave their dad or whatever because they're getting
1771
01:33:03,080 --> 01:33:05,840
they're getting besieged in this cabin and shit.
1772
01:33:05,840 --> 01:33:11,000
And the one guy says to the other guy something like his squalor must have had dinner late
1773
01:33:11,000 --> 01:33:15,200
and there's something and they all started they both start laughing in the middle of
1774
01:33:15,200 --> 01:33:16,200
the laugh.
1775
01:33:16,200 --> 01:33:20,640
He pulls a derringer out and pops the guy in the face and it was so fucking perfect.
1776
01:33:20,640 --> 01:33:25,080
He did the reaction like the gun went off perfect and all this.
1777
01:33:25,080 --> 01:33:30,880
And I almost ruined the tape because I went fuck in the middle of this thing.
1778
01:33:30,880 --> 01:33:33,800
I think he probably had added me out or something.
1779
01:33:33,800 --> 01:33:36,160
But that was the best day I had shooting man.
1780
01:33:36,160 --> 01:33:40,280
And like when we were fighting the light and we were getting all we had to do all the makeup
1781
01:33:40,280 --> 01:33:46,280
real fast and his bullet wound in his face and like everything just hit perfect.
1782
01:33:46,280 --> 01:33:51,360
And it was so good that like a couple of like maybe two years later or something we went
1783
01:33:51,360 --> 01:33:55,240
back there to give the guy that lived there a DVD copy of this and everything.
1784
01:33:55,240 --> 01:34:02,120
I remember when the sun went down on that day of shooting the guy had this kiddie pool
1785
01:34:02,120 --> 01:34:07,640
and all these fucking bats came down from the mountains and just lit on this pool and
1786
01:34:07,640 --> 01:34:10,680
were drinking water and flying all over the place and screeching everything was the weirdest
1787
01:34:10,680 --> 01:34:11,680
thing.
1788
01:34:11,680 --> 01:34:16,080
But I came back like two years later and get this guy a DVD and like I was walking around
1789
01:34:16,080 --> 01:34:18,840
in that cabin and the cabin had fallen in and shit.
1790
01:34:18,840 --> 01:34:22,560
And I got all misty eyed dude because I got really like emotional.
1791
01:34:22,560 --> 01:34:26,440
I was like this was this right here like two years ago I was the happiest I had been in
1792
01:34:26,440 --> 01:34:27,440
the life at that time.
1793
01:34:27,440 --> 01:34:28,440
Yeah.
1794
01:34:28,440 --> 01:34:30,480
It was a really cool experience.
1795
01:34:30,480 --> 01:34:35,960
I mean that's where that was where that was where you created some art right.
1796
01:34:35,960 --> 01:34:40,680
You fucking poured you poured your shit into it not only on the back end with writing it
1797
01:34:40,680 --> 01:34:43,800
but you were there creating it in the moment with these guys.
1798
01:34:43,800 --> 01:34:48,360
And honestly that's the thing that's not not to fucking sound religious or anything stupid
1799
01:34:48,360 --> 01:34:51,720
like that but man that's like to me that's like what God is right.
1800
01:34:51,720 --> 01:34:55,760
It's like that whole thing of you're there with your dudes you're creating something
1801
01:34:55,760 --> 01:34:59,220
and it's like these moments that you could never you can't quantify it.
1802
01:34:59,220 --> 01:35:01,820
It's not tangible in any way.
1803
01:35:01,820 --> 01:35:08,200
It's almost not even articulate or articulable in words to describe the feeling of sitting
1804
01:35:08,200 --> 01:35:11,200
there and creating something in that moment.
1805
01:35:11,200 --> 01:35:14,720
But it's just it's religious is almost really the best way to describe it.
1806
01:35:14,720 --> 01:35:19,960
Yeah it's divine you're touching like you're creating you you are creating as God creates.
1807
01:35:19,960 --> 01:35:23,400
Yeah it's something it's really something I totally agree with you.
1808
01:35:23,400 --> 01:35:24,400
It's like a mystical experience.
1809
01:35:24,400 --> 01:35:28,640
Yeah yeah yeah I got emotional when I went two years later I hadn't been there in two
1810
01:35:28,640 --> 01:35:33,160
years I went back to the same spot and I was like I was it was like I was on a pilgrimage
1811
01:35:33,160 --> 01:35:36,360
you know and I went to this place where like I went to Calgary or some shit.
1812
01:35:36,360 --> 01:35:37,360
Yeah did you have to?
1813
01:35:37,360 --> 01:35:38,360
I got crucified there.
1814
01:35:38,360 --> 01:35:39,360
Yeah did you have to?
1815
01:35:39,360 --> 01:35:40,360
I'm the one that got crucified.
1816
01:35:40,360 --> 01:35:45,800
Yeah did you have the cloak on over your head as you walk up and you're just like just looking
1817
01:35:45,800 --> 01:35:47,160
all somber and shit?
1818
01:35:47,160 --> 01:35:51,680
Yeah put my head to the earth and all this.
1819
01:35:51,680 --> 01:35:56,440
When you when you gave that guy the the old reptile eye when you gave him the DVD did
1820
01:35:56,440 --> 01:35:57,440
he look at this?
1821
01:35:57,440 --> 01:35:58,440
Rocky his name was.
1822
01:35:58,440 --> 01:36:01,000
Rocky he couldn't be anything else but Rocky.
1823
01:36:01,000 --> 01:36:06,680
Did he look at the DVD and just look at you and say I don't have a thing for this?
1824
01:36:06,680 --> 01:36:09,520
No he had a DVD.
1825
01:36:09,520 --> 01:36:11,520
I was like man do you have a DVD?
1826
01:36:11,520 --> 01:36:15,560
He was like oh yeah man we got a DVD player I want movies with my dad.
1827
01:36:15,560 --> 01:36:16,560
So perfect.
1828
01:36:16,560 --> 01:36:17,560
Oh man that's great.
1829
01:36:17,560 --> 01:36:18,560
So he's got a copy.
1830
01:36:18,560 --> 01:36:19,560
He's got a copy.
1831
01:36:19,560 --> 01:36:20,560
Do you do you have any?
1832
01:36:20,560 --> 01:36:23,560
He told us ghost stories and shit it was crazy.
1833
01:36:23,560 --> 01:36:26,960
He told us like stories about ghost miners and all kinds of shit on there.
1834
01:36:26,960 --> 01:36:27,960
It was awesome.
1835
01:36:27,960 --> 01:36:28,960
Oh yeah man.
1836
01:36:28,960 --> 01:36:33,360
That whole Edwards Air Force base area because that's where that's where Katie my wife goes
1837
01:36:33,360 --> 01:36:35,720
out to Wasteland Weekend every fucking year right?
1838
01:36:35,720 --> 01:36:37,640
It's a little like California City.
1839
01:36:37,640 --> 01:36:41,960
Like honestly I feel the reptile eye guy I swear to God I've met I've met a dude out
1840
01:36:41,960 --> 01:36:46,320
there in California City that that has that fucking I don't know if it's the same guy
1841
01:36:46,320 --> 01:36:47,320
or not.
1842
01:36:47,320 --> 01:36:49,480
I don't know what the dude's name is but he's a local celebrity.
1843
01:36:49,480 --> 01:36:51,440
You can look him up on email.
1844
01:36:51,440 --> 01:36:55,720
Anybody that goes to like if anybody has a reason to go to Ballarat you've got to stop
1845
01:36:55,720 --> 01:36:56,720
there.
1846
01:36:56,720 --> 01:36:57,720
He's the only guy.
1847
01:36:57,720 --> 01:37:00,080
Yeah yeah there was there was a dude that had this shop.
1848
01:37:00,080 --> 01:37:05,480
He was like an old hippie guy in California City and he just has this he was a weird dude
1849
01:37:05,480 --> 01:37:09,200
and as I'm in there just kind of trying to kill time waiting for her to come come back
1850
01:37:09,200 --> 01:37:11,640
so I can drive the U-Haul out.
1851
01:37:11,640 --> 01:37:16,120
I'm literally in this shop and I'm looking for he has all these old like record posters
1852
01:37:16,120 --> 01:37:20,800
or whatever of like he got Jimi Hendrix he had you know for all the Led Zeppelin and
1853
01:37:20,800 --> 01:37:22,640
all these and they were all original.
1854
01:37:22,640 --> 01:37:23,640
They weren't original.
1855
01:37:23,640 --> 01:37:24,640
Yeah he was there.
1856
01:37:24,640 --> 01:37:28,040
And yeah exactly and he had all this shit and he's sitting there and he's selling them
1857
01:37:28,040 --> 01:37:30,840
and man he's not he's selling them on the cheap.
1858
01:37:30,840 --> 01:37:34,320
I got the I got a bunch of Godzilla posters from him.
1859
01:37:34,320 --> 01:37:39,760
The original they were not like original ones and he sold to me for like 15 bucks a pop
1860
01:37:39,760 --> 01:37:41,720
and so I got a bunch of anyway.
1861
01:37:41,720 --> 01:37:46,560
So as I'm in that store I swear to God man this dude comes in with this fucking like
1862
01:37:46,560 --> 01:37:48,800
he had one like one fucking lizard eye.
1863
01:37:48,800 --> 01:37:51,040
I don't know it was it now that you say it.
1864
01:37:51,040 --> 01:37:54,680
I didn't I didn't it didn't click in my head reptile eye but now that you say that it like
1865
01:37:54,680 --> 01:37:58,200
brought up a core memory and I said you know what that's the rise near that fucking guy
1866
01:37:58,200 --> 01:38:02,360
saw in that store and he went in there and they chopped it up and then he left but I'm
1867
01:38:02,360 --> 01:38:05,520
like man I wonder if that's the same dude because it's all like the same area out there
1868
01:38:05,520 --> 01:38:09,120
so that'd be funny as shit if it was the same guy.
1869
01:38:09,120 --> 01:38:13,960
He had like he had hair when I filmed but then when we went back he had shaved his head
1870
01:38:13,960 --> 01:38:16,120
and he looked like that yellow bastard.
1871
01:38:16,120 --> 01:38:17,760
Remember that Sin City spinoff guy.
1872
01:38:17,760 --> 01:38:18,760
Oh yeah.
1873
01:38:18,760 --> 01:38:19,760
That character.
1874
01:38:19,760 --> 01:38:21,080
He looked like that yellow bastard.
1875
01:38:21,080 --> 01:38:22,080
Yeah.
1876
01:38:22,080 --> 01:38:23,520
That's great.
1877
01:38:23,520 --> 01:38:29,520
So did you in making this film do you have any any regrets or anything that you wish
1878
01:38:29,520 --> 01:38:33,320
you would have done different if you could go around and decide for not making the film.
1879
01:38:33,320 --> 01:38:34,320
Well yeah.
1880
01:38:34,320 --> 01:38:37,040
No I don't regret that for sure.
1881
01:38:37,040 --> 01:38:39,760
I mean because I definitely would have regretted not doing it.
1882
01:38:39,760 --> 01:38:43,120
I feel like I'd have been I've been eating my own I'd be chewing my own guts if I hadn't
1883
01:38:43,120 --> 01:38:49,160
done it but like I wanted to shoot the thing like a spaghetti western and fully the entire
1884
01:38:49,160 --> 01:38:54,800
movie I didn't want to use any live sound at all and my whole crew turned on me everybody
1885
01:38:54,800 --> 01:38:57,760
involved were like we do not want to do that.
1886
01:38:57,760 --> 01:39:02,320
Like and I had to so at the last minute I caved and I had to buy like a shotgun mic
1887
01:39:02,320 --> 01:39:06,400
and you know boom and all this and I was not planning on any of that and I don't think
1888
01:39:06,400 --> 01:39:08,640
the sounds very great.
1889
01:39:08,640 --> 01:39:12,320
And if I had to do it over I'd have been like you know it's my way or the highway.
1890
01:39:12,320 --> 01:39:16,680
If we're going to do fully sound we're going to do this whole thing like like fucking a
1891
01:39:16,680 --> 01:39:20,560
good the bad the ugly you know no no live sound at all maybe I'll play some music for
1892
01:39:20,560 --> 01:39:21,560
you guys whatever.
1893
01:39:21,560 --> 01:39:23,760
That's what I wanted to do in my head you know.
1894
01:39:23,760 --> 01:39:24,760
Yeah.
1895
01:39:24,760 --> 01:39:27,240
Yeah everybody rebelled on me.
1896
01:39:27,240 --> 01:39:31,280
I wish I had not done that because the sound is like crummy of parts you know like there
1897
01:39:31,280 --> 01:39:34,800
was there was one night when you're filming in a cabin and the wind was blowing and it
1898
01:39:34,800 --> 01:39:40,800
was just like you know constantly over everything and then you can do but yeah there's nothing
1899
01:39:40,800 --> 01:39:43,040
you can do to change that.
1900
01:39:43,040 --> 01:39:44,040
It's just there.
1901
01:39:44,040 --> 01:39:45,040
Yeah.
1902
01:39:45,040 --> 01:39:46,040
Yeah.
1903
01:39:46,040 --> 01:39:51,280
And I could have kept I could have maintained the same sound quality if I had just controlled
1904
01:39:51,280 --> 01:39:55,120
it entirely like I wanted to but didn't do it.
1905
01:39:55,120 --> 01:39:56,120
Yeah yeah I get you.
1906
01:39:56,120 --> 01:39:57,120
I get you.
1907
01:39:57,120 --> 01:39:58,120
All right.
1908
01:39:58,120 --> 01:40:00,080
So Adam do you have any other questions about the movie thing.
1909
01:40:00,080 --> 01:40:01,080
No no.
1910
01:40:01,080 --> 01:40:02,080
Okay.
1911
01:40:02,080 --> 01:40:03,080
All right.
1912
01:40:03,080 --> 01:40:06,040
So I kind of feel like we're getting you know we're getting a little towards the towards
1913
01:40:06,040 --> 01:40:08,040
the end here of this of this interview.
1914
01:40:08,040 --> 01:40:11,760
So I would like to know I mean we've been going for an hour and 40 minutes so I mean
1915
01:40:11,760 --> 01:40:14,320
that's that's pretty pretty fucking good mainly.
1916
01:40:14,320 --> 01:40:15,320
I'm sorry.
1917
01:40:15,320 --> 01:40:16,320
I've been preaching up.
1918
01:40:16,320 --> 01:40:20,320
Well I mean you know we want to hear the story you know shit.
1919
01:40:20,320 --> 01:40:25,920
But so do you have any what's what's your what's your some or god damn if I could know
1920
01:40:25,920 --> 01:40:27,640
how to find you had to talk.
1921
01:40:27,640 --> 01:40:32,600
What is a current thing that you're working on and what are some of the future any future
1922
01:40:32,600 --> 01:40:36,520
projects you have that you're looking forward to putting out.
1923
01:40:36,520 --> 01:40:42,280
I decided after doing this this kind of like pastiche told with a love novel I don't expect
1924
01:40:42,280 --> 01:40:45,600
I expect to get if I don't get sued for it I'll be happy.
1925
01:40:45,600 --> 01:40:46,600
Yeah.
1926
01:40:46,600 --> 01:40:52,040
So I decided to step back and like try to go back to screenwriting a little bit.
1927
01:40:52,040 --> 01:40:54,520
I did this short story and I told you about it at work Josh.
1928
01:40:54,520 --> 01:41:02,880
But like I did this short story a while back about this kid who's like these two kids in
1929
01:41:02,880 --> 01:41:07,880
the projects who are all into like kung fu and hip hop and like Wu Tang and stuff like
1930
01:41:07,880 --> 01:41:12,920
this and the one kid is heavy into flying guillotine flying flying guillotine flying
1931
01:41:12,920 --> 01:41:16,840
guillotine movies where the guys throw this chain like 100 feet and a little basket drops
1932
01:41:16,840 --> 01:41:18,600
down you yank their heads off and stuff.
1933
01:41:18,600 --> 01:41:19,920
Great movies are so much fun.
1934
01:41:19,920 --> 01:41:20,920
I really recommend them.
1935
01:41:20,920 --> 01:41:27,720
But so I wanted to do a slasher.
1936
01:41:27,720 --> 01:41:32,200
There's this movie called the Kung Fu Killer from back in the 90s or early 2000s or something
1937
01:41:32,200 --> 01:41:33,200
that opens.
1938
01:41:33,200 --> 01:41:39,080
It's a Hong Kong movie and it opens with these cops doing a forensic investigation of a scene
1939
01:41:39,080 --> 01:41:41,880
in the tunnel and it's a Wushu fight.
1940
01:41:41,880 --> 01:41:46,760
There was a there's a crazy wire food fight in this like space and they're treating it
1941
01:41:46,760 --> 01:41:50,880
all scientifically and they're like they're doing the bullet trajectories and the sword
1942
01:41:50,880 --> 01:41:53,880
cut on the top of the tunnel like how did he get up there and all this.
1943
01:41:53,880 --> 01:41:56,440
I love that and I'm extrapolating from that.
1944
01:41:56,440 --> 01:42:05,920
I wanted to do this slasher that's like an ode to like the crossover between kung fu
1945
01:42:05,920 --> 01:42:08,040
and hip hop and stuff.
1946
01:42:08,040 --> 01:42:12,520
So it's this slasher with a character is like basically a flying guillotine killer.
1947
01:42:12,520 --> 01:42:14,240
It's called FG killer.
1948
01:42:14,240 --> 01:42:17,000
And I did a short story on it.
1949
01:42:17,000 --> 01:42:20,240
I sold this in a slasher antho and I've been thinking about it a lot and so now I'm trying
1950
01:42:20,240 --> 01:42:21,800
to write it as a script or something.
1951
01:42:21,800 --> 01:42:22,800
I would like to do.
1952
01:42:22,800 --> 01:42:25,000
I want to do another movie for sure.
1953
01:42:25,000 --> 01:42:26,000
Don't know how.
1954
01:42:26,000 --> 01:42:29,000
I don't know how I'm going to make it happen.
1955
01:42:29,000 --> 01:42:32,040
Nobody's paying me money to move anymore.
1956
01:42:32,040 --> 01:42:34,080
So I don't know how I'm going to make it happen.
1957
01:42:34,080 --> 01:42:36,680
I'm going to try to do a movie on this.
1958
01:42:36,680 --> 01:42:44,840
Kind of like a kung fu slasher that's got an all hip hop soundtrack with like underground
1959
01:42:44,840 --> 01:42:48,280
guys, like Athro and I don't know.
1960
01:42:48,280 --> 01:42:49,280
There's a lot of you.
1961
01:42:49,280 --> 01:42:51,000
You're going to black rock stuff like that.
1962
01:42:51,000 --> 01:42:55,480
Just a heavy hip hop slasher kung fu movie.
1963
01:42:55,480 --> 01:42:56,480
I don't know.
1964
01:42:56,480 --> 01:42:58,440
I think it's I'm really excited about it right now.
1965
01:42:58,440 --> 01:42:59,440
I'm working on that.
1966
01:42:59,440 --> 01:43:05,360
And then in the future, I'm going to go back to books.
1967
01:43:05,360 --> 01:43:13,000
I'm probably going to do people have been asking for a I teased like a prequel to Macabre
1968
01:43:13,000 --> 01:43:17,400
writer, which was like I hate to do prequels, but it was like I had all these civil war
1969
01:43:17,400 --> 01:43:22,320
stories that I wrote like I wrote seeds for and then I never used them.
1970
01:43:22,320 --> 01:43:23,320
So I thought about doing that.
1971
01:43:23,320 --> 01:43:29,200
I thought about doing I've been doing I did two like prison novels.
1972
01:43:29,200 --> 01:43:34,880
I did Andersonville and then I did I count Auschwitz Monster and Führer as like a prison
1973
01:43:34,880 --> 01:43:35,880
thing.
1974
01:43:35,880 --> 01:43:38,040
And I got this prison trilogy in my head.
1975
01:43:38,040 --> 01:43:42,160
The next book I want to do with the last book I want to do in it is set an angle of prison,
1976
01:43:42,160 --> 01:43:46,760
you know, the that crazy like chain gang prison in the south.
1977
01:43:46,760 --> 01:43:50,800
And I want to have this I got to give it a weird angle.
1978
01:43:50,800 --> 01:43:55,840
And the weird angle is this this this vampire hunter is hunting this vampire that killed
1979
01:43:55,840 --> 01:43:56,840
his family.
1980
01:43:56,840 --> 01:43:59,320
And the guy is so dogged.
1981
01:43:59,320 --> 01:44:06,680
The vampire just decides to go to prison to a maximum security prison and just outlive
1982
01:44:06,680 --> 01:44:07,680
the fucking guy.
1983
01:44:07,680 --> 01:44:11,720
Like he commits a public crime and gets put in the maximum prison.
1984
01:44:11,720 --> 01:44:15,600
And then he starts slowly influencing everybody in this angle of prison and kind of like taking
1985
01:44:15,600 --> 01:44:18,160
over while he's in this prison.
1986
01:44:18,160 --> 01:44:24,000
So vampire hunter goes and commits another crime to get in the prison with the guy.
1987
01:44:24,000 --> 01:44:28,360
And it's like so it's like he's hunting this guy that hunting this vampire in Angola prison
1988
01:44:28,360 --> 01:44:29,360
and everything.
1989
01:44:29,360 --> 01:44:31,240
And it's called ditch bank blade.
1990
01:44:31,240 --> 01:44:33,040
That's probably the next thing I'm going to try to work on.
1991
01:44:33,040 --> 01:44:34,040
All right.
1992
01:44:34,040 --> 01:44:35,520
Well, that sounds pretty awesome.
1993
01:44:35,520 --> 01:44:40,320
When when can people expect to potentially have that out for for their reading pleasure?
1994
01:44:40,320 --> 01:44:42,320
Oh, hell no.
1995
01:44:42,320 --> 01:44:43,320
I didn't start.
1996
01:44:43,320 --> 01:44:46,000
I'm already putting pressure on.
1997
01:44:46,000 --> 01:44:47,000
That's what I do, man.
1998
01:44:47,000 --> 01:44:48,000
I put the pressure on.
1999
01:44:48,000 --> 01:44:49,000
You know what?
2000
01:44:49,000 --> 01:44:50,000
You know what?
2001
01:44:50,000 --> 01:44:54,320
The 13th novel came about because I was on another podcast and the guy I just offhandedly
2002
01:44:54,320 --> 01:44:58,240
said, yeah, if I was going to do another Friday 13th movie, this is what I do.
2003
01:44:58,240 --> 01:44:59,800
And the guy was like, you got to write that.
2004
01:44:59,800 --> 01:45:01,400
And then I ended up writing it.
2005
01:45:01,400 --> 01:45:03,440
So like, you know, pressure me.
2006
01:45:03,440 --> 01:45:08,200
Well, here this this podcast, I'm telling you, not only do you have to do the fucking
2007
01:45:08,200 --> 01:45:13,120
cut, the flying guillotine hip hop movie, but we need to do that.
2008
01:45:13,120 --> 01:45:15,560
I think we should fucking make that movie together.
2009
01:45:15,560 --> 01:45:17,240
I think that'd be fucking awesome.
2010
01:45:17,240 --> 01:45:18,720
I mean, Jesus, that'd be amazing.
2011
01:45:18,720 --> 01:45:19,720
Do it.
2012
01:45:19,720 --> 01:45:22,800
And I'm like, the best thing to do is to work.
2013
01:45:22,800 --> 01:45:23,800
Go ahead, man.
2014
01:45:23,800 --> 01:45:24,800
Go ahead.
2015
01:45:24,800 --> 01:45:25,800
I want to talk.
2016
01:45:25,800 --> 01:45:26,800
Oh, no, no, good.
2017
01:45:26,800 --> 01:45:30,360
The best thing to do, man, is to work with people that are passionate about something
2018
01:45:30,360 --> 01:45:32,840
like I don't really want to.
2019
01:45:32,840 --> 01:45:36,520
Like I was for a long time, I was trying to sell scripts, trying to sell scripts, trying
2020
01:45:36,520 --> 01:45:37,520
to make that money and everything.
2021
01:45:37,520 --> 01:45:40,440
But like you sell a script and it's not the story's not yours anymore.
2022
01:45:40,440 --> 01:45:44,520
It goes through like 40 million guys that don't give a fuck about it.
2023
01:45:44,520 --> 01:45:45,520
They're just getting paid.
2024
01:45:45,520 --> 01:45:49,000
And then when it finally gets made, it's a bunch of union guys sitting around and they
2025
01:45:49,000 --> 01:45:51,840
don't want to really be there because they don't care.
2026
01:45:51,840 --> 01:45:52,840
It's so much more.
2027
01:45:52,840 --> 01:45:56,760
It's so much cooler, man, to work with a bunch of people who like all believe in the project
2028
01:45:56,760 --> 01:45:59,800
and all want something to happen and stuff and like, you all want to get lifted up with
2029
01:45:59,800 --> 01:46:04,360
it and everything, even though nobody got lifted on my fucking last movie.
2030
01:46:04,360 --> 01:46:07,600
Well, actually, one of the actors is like a director for Asylum.
2031
01:46:07,600 --> 01:46:08,600
Now he works constantly.
2032
01:46:08,600 --> 01:46:11,000
He goes to fucking he flies to fucking Thailand.
2033
01:46:11,000 --> 01:46:17,320
One of his movies was on what's that show where they make fun of shit?
2034
01:46:17,320 --> 01:46:20,120
There's a lot of science theater.
2035
01:46:20,120 --> 01:46:21,920
No, it was it was Mr. Science.
2036
01:46:21,920 --> 01:46:22,920
Yeah.
2037
01:46:22,920 --> 01:46:25,800
The last season of Mr. Science Theater, one of his movies got Atlantic Rim.
2038
01:46:25,800 --> 01:46:26,800
Jared Cohen.
2039
01:46:26,800 --> 01:46:28,920
Yeah, he was the star of Meadowlark.
2040
01:46:28,920 --> 01:46:29,920
I'll see.
2041
01:46:29,920 --> 01:46:30,920
There you go.
2042
01:46:30,920 --> 01:46:33,920
So you had a positive impact on somebody's career trajectory.
2043
01:46:33,920 --> 01:46:39,800
He was not happy about being made fun of Mr. Science Theater, but I thought it was awesome.
2044
01:46:39,800 --> 01:46:40,800
I was like, congratulations.
2045
01:46:40,800 --> 01:46:43,080
Yeah, that means you made it.
2046
01:46:43,080 --> 01:46:44,080
Shit.
2047
01:46:44,080 --> 01:46:45,080
Up to me.
2048
01:46:45,080 --> 01:46:46,080
That's fucking cool.
2049
01:46:46,080 --> 01:46:47,080
You're in the zeitgeist.
2050
01:46:47,080 --> 01:46:48,080
You're in the pop culture.
2051
01:46:48,080 --> 01:46:49,080
Exactly.
2052
01:46:49,080 --> 01:46:50,080
Oh, yeah.
2053
01:46:50,080 --> 01:46:55,360
I was just going to say as far as the hip hop slasher film, I mean, I don't know what
2054
01:46:55,360 --> 01:46:57,320
or rather the kung fu.
2055
01:46:57,320 --> 01:47:00,840
It makes me think of this the series on Adult Swim called.
2056
01:47:00,840 --> 01:47:05,960
Well, I don't know if it's I think it's ended by this point, but it's called Boondocks.
2057
01:47:05,960 --> 01:47:06,960
Oh, yeah.
2058
01:47:06,960 --> 01:47:11,640
And Boondocks scenes are the Boondocks.
2059
01:47:11,640 --> 01:47:13,240
I think you and all that.
2060
01:47:13,240 --> 01:47:14,240
Yeah.
2061
01:47:14,240 --> 01:47:17,880
I mean, something of that vein as far as a kung fu movie.
2062
01:47:17,880 --> 01:47:24,160
I mean, I don't know if it was comedic, but I could already kind of see in that same light.
2063
01:47:24,160 --> 01:47:26,880
I think it'd be a really cool idea.
2064
01:47:26,880 --> 01:47:31,160
There's a because there's an element of one of the four elements of hip hop is break is
2065
01:47:31,160 --> 01:47:32,720
b-boying and break dancing.
2066
01:47:32,720 --> 01:47:33,720
Yeah.
2067
01:47:33,720 --> 01:47:37,560
They got those moves from watching like Five Fingers of Death in the 70s, Grimehouse theaters
2068
01:47:37,560 --> 01:47:38,840
and shit and pull that shit out.
2069
01:47:38,840 --> 01:47:43,760
You see them like the old the old footage of those guys like squaring off and stuff.
2070
01:47:43,760 --> 01:47:44,760
It's like a kung fu movie.
2071
01:47:44,760 --> 01:47:48,320
You know, like the guys like square off and each other and the one guy drops down and
2072
01:47:48,320 --> 01:47:52,080
does all these moves and poses and everybody kind of stands back like a dude, you know,
2073
01:47:52,080 --> 01:47:54,480
and like Bruce Lee's fighting everybody in Chinese connection.
2074
01:47:54,480 --> 01:47:55,480
Yeah, right.
2075
01:47:55,480 --> 01:47:57,520
So like it's it's an element.
2076
01:47:57,520 --> 01:48:00,560
You know, it it it it it influenced the culture.
2077
01:48:00,560 --> 01:48:02,920
And I just want to like do something that comments on that.
2078
01:48:02,920 --> 01:48:03,920
Yeah, yeah.
2079
01:48:03,920 --> 01:48:05,920
Because I got some higher whatever else.
2080
01:48:05,920 --> 01:48:07,720
I just think it'd be pretty fucking cool.
2081
01:48:07,720 --> 01:48:11,640
Yeah, it would just be cool as shit to do.
2082
01:48:11,640 --> 01:48:14,760
Before we go, I would be remiss if I didn't ask you about this.
2083
01:48:14,760 --> 01:48:20,440
But you're you're friends with with Tom Kenny, the guy who does the voice of SpongeBob SquarePants,
2084
01:48:20,440 --> 01:48:21,440
right?
2085
01:48:21,440 --> 01:48:23,120
He's telling me he loves me.
2086
01:48:23,120 --> 01:48:24,960
I'm just curious.
2087
01:48:24,960 --> 01:48:26,880
How did that how did you meet that guy?
2088
01:48:26,880 --> 01:48:31,800
And how did you get how did you con him into being friends with you?
2089
01:48:31,800 --> 01:48:32,800
I think about that all the time.
2090
01:48:32,800 --> 01:48:36,800
Like I go to a movie with them and I sit there and I'm like, who am I?
2091
01:48:36,800 --> 01:48:43,080
We went to we went to watch some Western the other night at the at the Newward and fucking
2092
01:48:43,080 --> 01:48:45,080
Clint Turantino was sitting in front of us.
2093
01:48:45,080 --> 01:48:46,080
It's fucking crazy.
2094
01:48:46,080 --> 01:48:47,080
That is great.
2095
01:48:47,080 --> 01:48:53,760
But yeah, my daughter and his daughter went to school together at, you know, Birmingham
2096
01:48:53,760 --> 01:48:59,800
High and they got in my daughter crude on the Wizard of Oz and his daughter was Dorothy.
2097
01:48:59,800 --> 01:49:04,520
And they had a fundraiser at his house and his wife is Jill Tully.
2098
01:49:04,520 --> 01:49:07,440
She's the computer wife on SpongeBob and she was on Mr. Show with him.
2099
01:49:07,440 --> 01:49:10,040
She's hilarious from Chicago, like kind of the same area.
2100
01:49:10,040 --> 01:49:11,960
I'm from and stuff.
2101
01:49:11,960 --> 01:49:16,200
And I actually like saw her first at this barbecue or whatever at their house and was
2102
01:49:16,200 --> 01:49:19,320
like, you know, Jill, I was said I wasn't going to say nothing, but like there's this
2103
01:49:19,320 --> 01:49:21,320
line you did in Mr. Show.
2104
01:49:21,320 --> 01:49:27,160
Shut that baby up that I always say to my kids.
2105
01:49:27,160 --> 01:49:29,000
And she correct up or whatever.
2106
01:49:29,000 --> 01:49:30,000
And then Tom came around.
2107
01:49:30,000 --> 01:49:31,000
He has this back house.
2108
01:49:31,000 --> 01:49:36,240
He has this little like guest house and like Bobcat Gold the way it is his best friend.
2109
01:49:36,240 --> 01:49:38,360
He stays there and comes in town and stuff.
2110
01:49:38,360 --> 01:49:39,360
Yeah, I met him too.
2111
01:49:39,360 --> 01:49:40,360
He's great.
2112
01:49:40,360 --> 01:49:41,360
I love that guy.
2113
01:49:41,360 --> 01:49:42,360
Oh my God.
2114
01:49:42,360 --> 01:49:45,360
Oh, dude, did you ever see a world's greatest dad?
2115
01:49:45,360 --> 01:49:47,920
No, I don't think I have.
2116
01:49:47,920 --> 01:49:48,920
That's a movie Bobcat.
2117
01:49:48,920 --> 01:49:51,920
They are best friends from like childhood, man.
2118
01:49:51,920 --> 01:49:52,920
They're friends.
2119
01:49:52,920 --> 01:49:56,000
They got this picture of them on a couch when they're kids.
2120
01:49:56,000 --> 01:49:58,480
Yeah, because he's Bobcat and Tom was Tomcat.
2121
01:49:58,480 --> 01:50:00,480
Like that was their nickname or whatever.
2122
01:50:00,480 --> 01:50:01,480
Right.
2123
01:50:01,480 --> 01:50:03,640
But like the world's greatest dad with Robin Williams did watch that.
2124
01:50:03,640 --> 01:50:05,480
It's the best thing Robin Williams has ever done.
2125
01:50:05,480 --> 01:50:06,480
It's fucking amazing.
2126
01:50:06,480 --> 01:50:14,280
He finds his son dead in his room of suicide and he was choking himself out while masturbating.
2127
01:50:14,280 --> 01:50:20,960
So like Robin Williams has to like write a suicide note in his son's hand and everything
2128
01:50:20,960 --> 01:50:25,480
and pretend that he killed himself like because he was depressed.
2129
01:50:25,480 --> 01:50:27,920
And then the whole school rallies behind this.
2130
01:50:27,920 --> 01:50:29,960
He's just he's just writing this lie.
2131
01:50:29,960 --> 01:50:30,960
It's so great.
2132
01:50:30,960 --> 01:50:31,960
It's such a great movie.
2133
01:50:31,960 --> 01:50:37,720
Have you seen have you happen to see Shakes the Clown with Bobcat?
2134
01:50:37,720 --> 01:50:39,600
I got to see that because Tom is in it.
2135
01:50:39,600 --> 01:50:40,600
I've never seen it.
2136
01:50:40,600 --> 01:50:41,920
I've never seen Shakes the Clown.
2137
01:50:41,920 --> 01:50:43,040
Oh, it's so good.
2138
01:50:43,040 --> 01:50:46,400
It's it's I don't know how to describe it.
2139
01:50:46,400 --> 01:50:48,960
It's just it's just the movie you have to see with with him.
2140
01:50:48,960 --> 01:50:52,400
So if you ever get a chance, I don't I don't even know where you stream it because it's
2141
01:50:52,400 --> 01:50:57,240
not one of those larger distributed movies or I don't even know.
2142
01:50:57,240 --> 01:50:58,240
Maybe.
2143
01:50:58,240 --> 01:50:59,240
Maybe.
2144
01:50:59,240 --> 01:51:04,600
But if you ever get a chance to see see Shakes the Clown, it's it's pretty it's pretty great.
2145
01:51:04,600 --> 01:51:05,600
I got to check that out.
2146
01:51:05,600 --> 01:51:06,600
Where was it going?
2147
01:51:06,600 --> 01:51:08,600
Oh, but he had this guesthouse.
2148
01:51:08,600 --> 01:51:09,600
Right.
2149
01:51:09,600 --> 01:51:10,600
Sorry.
2150
01:51:10,600 --> 01:51:11,600
Sorry.
2151
01:51:11,600 --> 01:51:14,840
He had a Johnny Cash poster autographed in there.
2152
01:51:14,840 --> 01:51:19,560
And I told you how my dad like ingrained Johnny Cash in me from a young age and everything.
2153
01:51:19,560 --> 01:51:23,280
So like Thomas, whatever, making the rounds and shit like around this party showed up
2154
01:51:23,280 --> 01:51:26,200
later and I kind of went up to him and was like, hey, man, I saw that Johnny Cash poster
2155
01:51:26,200 --> 01:51:27,200
you got in the back.
2156
01:51:27,200 --> 01:51:29,920
Did you buy that sign or did you actually meet him?
2157
01:51:29,920 --> 01:51:33,180
And he was like, dude, I met him in the 70s.
2158
01:51:33,180 --> 01:51:37,040
Like when he was not he was on a low, you know, and like there was no line, you know,
2159
01:51:37,040 --> 01:51:39,720
he was in a mall and like he was signing shit.
2160
01:51:39,720 --> 01:51:45,080
And I had him sign him signed a poster for this movie he was in where he like fights
2161
01:51:45,080 --> 01:51:50,600
Kirk Douglas in a in a gunfight in a bullfighting arena, like for money.
2162
01:51:50,600 --> 01:51:51,600
It's great.
2163
01:51:51,600 --> 01:51:52,960
I can't think of the name of it.
2164
01:51:52,960 --> 01:51:53,960
The gunfight or something.
2165
01:51:53,960 --> 01:51:54,960
I think it's called.
2166
01:51:54,960 --> 01:51:55,960
But yeah, he said, yeah.
2167
01:51:55,960 --> 01:51:58,320
And I got to sit there and talk to him.
2168
01:51:58,320 --> 01:52:03,280
And then like, June Carter came along with a bunch of bags full of like shit that she
2169
01:52:03,280 --> 01:52:05,240
bought and she left him with them and stuff.
2170
01:52:05,240 --> 01:52:09,920
And so we kind of bonded over that, like just talking about music and then from there, we
2171
01:52:09,920 --> 01:52:14,160
started talking comics like he's a big plastic man fans.
2172
01:52:14,160 --> 01:52:17,840
And he was talking just movies.
2173
01:52:17,840 --> 01:52:19,120
And then I said, he asked me what I did.
2174
01:52:19,120 --> 01:52:21,080
I started talking about my writing and stuff I wrote.
2175
01:52:21,080 --> 01:52:22,800
And he was like into Westerns.
2176
01:52:22,800 --> 01:52:26,440
And then we started going to movies together and we go to luchador.
2177
01:52:26,440 --> 01:52:30,200
We go to Mexican wrestling like all the time and stuff like we just hit it off because
2178
01:52:30,200 --> 01:52:31,560
we had the same interests basically.
2179
01:52:31,560 --> 01:52:32,560
Yeah, I was.
2180
01:52:32,560 --> 01:52:36,800
It's weird, it's such a weird Hollywood kind of thing that never ever happened to me in
2181
01:52:36,800 --> 01:52:40,080
the 19, you know, how many years I've been out here.
2182
01:52:40,080 --> 01:52:44,200
I didn't I didn't befriend any celebrities until like this dude, but he's a great dude.
2183
01:52:44,200 --> 01:52:45,200
He's really fun.
2184
01:52:45,200 --> 01:52:46,200
He's fun to be around.
2185
01:52:46,200 --> 01:52:47,960
He gathers all these people around.
2186
01:52:47,960 --> 01:52:49,400
I call him like Planet Tom.
2187
01:52:49,400 --> 01:52:52,480
You know, everybody kind of goes in orbit around him and shit.
2188
01:52:52,480 --> 01:52:53,480
Yeah, yeah.
2189
01:52:53,480 --> 01:52:57,360
I was just so out of those when Ed told me about this, that he that he goes and sees
2190
01:52:57,360 --> 01:53:01,080
fucking Mexican wrestling with SpongeBob SquarePants.
2191
01:53:01,080 --> 01:53:02,840
I was like, are you fucking kidding me?
2192
01:53:02,840 --> 01:53:05,120
Why didn't why is it that we've known each other for months?
2193
01:53:05,120 --> 01:53:06,600
And this is the first I'm hearing of this.
2194
01:53:06,600 --> 01:53:08,160
You didn't fucking open with this.
2195
01:53:08,160 --> 01:53:10,880
That would be, you know, I feel like that's an opener.
2196
01:53:10,880 --> 01:53:12,240
I feel like I don't know.
2197
01:53:12,240 --> 01:53:14,240
It sounds like I'm being an asshole.
2198
01:53:14,240 --> 01:53:18,280
Listen, you'd be like that's anytime you meet someone, you should just say, hey, oh, hey,
2199
01:53:18,280 --> 01:53:21,600
just just so you know, I know Tom Kenny and we go watch we go watch Mexican wrestling
2200
01:53:21,600 --> 01:53:22,600
together.
2201
01:53:22,600 --> 01:53:23,600
That's the opening.
2202
01:53:23,600 --> 01:53:24,600
That's all you got to say.
2203
01:53:24,600 --> 01:53:25,600
Yeah.
2204
01:53:25,600 --> 01:53:29,200
But yeah, I said, dude, next time you guys go, if he would be down, let me know, because
2205
01:53:29,200 --> 01:53:32,240
we would love to go to fucking watch Mexican wrestling.
2206
01:53:32,240 --> 01:53:34,200
Because I mean, we just love wrestling in general, too.
2207
01:53:34,200 --> 01:53:36,000
So we have a whole wrestling podcast.
2208
01:53:36,000 --> 01:53:40,040
So down to me, people do like all my all my guys that worked on my movie like no, and
2209
01:53:40,040 --> 01:53:43,400
now we just go to bar.
2210
01:53:43,400 --> 01:53:44,400
He's got a band, dude.
2211
01:53:44,400 --> 01:53:45,760
One thing you don't know about it.
2212
01:53:45,760 --> 01:53:48,760
He has a band that's like he does 60 soul music.
2213
01:53:48,760 --> 01:53:50,800
60 got three back.
2214
01:53:50,800 --> 01:53:52,800
Got three background singers.
2215
01:53:52,800 --> 01:53:56,920
Yeah, he just put he did a Chuck Berry song.
2216
01:53:56,920 --> 01:53:58,840
He gave me a shout out the first time he did it.
2217
01:53:58,840 --> 01:53:59,840
It was awesome.
2218
01:53:59,840 --> 01:54:01,280
It was my favorite Chuck Berry song.
2219
01:54:01,280 --> 01:54:02,880
What the fuck is it?
2220
01:54:02,880 --> 01:54:03,880
I'm blanking now.
2221
01:54:03,880 --> 01:54:08,680
He does need he does he does like Expressway to your love.
2222
01:54:08,680 --> 01:54:13,600
He does all these like, you know, crazy ass like he likes obscure 60s 50s kind of stuff
2223
01:54:13,600 --> 01:54:14,600
and everything.
2224
01:54:14,600 --> 01:54:19,000
He's got like a brass band and like a full band behind him and stuff.
2225
01:54:19,000 --> 01:54:21,040
And he does shows like all over L.A. and stuff.
2226
01:54:21,040 --> 01:54:23,720
He's doing a show on Saturday, I think, actually somewhere.
2227
01:54:23,720 --> 01:54:31,200
I don't know.
2228
01:54:31,200 --> 01:54:34,840
Not that he needs it, but, you know, hey, Tom, good dude.
2229
01:54:34,840 --> 01:54:36,680
Yeah, good dude.
2230
01:54:36,680 --> 01:54:37,680
Great guy.
2231
01:54:37,680 --> 01:54:38,680
Good dude, man.
2232
01:54:38,680 --> 01:54:39,680
Just sounds like a general good dude.
2233
01:54:39,680 --> 01:54:40,680
All right.
2234
01:54:40,680 --> 01:54:41,680
Yeah, he's a nice guy.
2235
01:54:41,680 --> 01:54:42,680
Very funny.
2236
01:54:42,680 --> 01:54:46,120
Yeah, definitely not in the Hollywood Illuminati or whatever.
2237
01:54:46,120 --> 01:54:47,120
Right.
2238
01:54:47,120 --> 01:54:51,080
I took my kids over trick or treating at his house.
2239
01:54:51,080 --> 01:54:57,000
And my son, who's like was like 12 or 11 at the time, goes he's very deadpan.
2240
01:54:57,000 --> 01:55:01,640
My son meets Tom and he's like sort of a lot of celebrities live around here.
2241
01:55:01,640 --> 01:55:08,800
And he was like Tom was just like, see, Lister's he was like, you know, Delta Burke.
2242
01:55:08,800 --> 01:55:12,040
Oh, shit, that's awesome.
2243
01:55:12,040 --> 01:55:13,040
Oh, man.
2244
01:55:13,040 --> 01:55:16,920
Well, anyways, well, I think that is a great way to wrap it up.
2245
01:55:16,920 --> 01:55:20,200
So thank you again, Ed, for coming on.
2246
01:55:20,200 --> 01:55:22,160
You know, we really we really appreciate it.
2247
01:55:22,160 --> 01:55:26,280
And I'm going to bully you into into making that fucking movie with us.
2248
01:55:26,280 --> 01:55:27,280
That sounds good, man.
2249
01:55:27,280 --> 01:55:30,600
The the the flying guillotine Shaolin movie.
2250
01:55:30,600 --> 01:55:32,760
So yeah, it wouldn't take too much twisting.
2251
01:55:32,760 --> 01:55:33,760
It just takes money.
2252
01:55:33,760 --> 01:55:34,760
That's all.
2253
01:55:34,760 --> 01:55:35,760
Yeah.
2254
01:55:35,760 --> 01:55:36,760
Yeah, basically.
2255
01:55:36,760 --> 01:55:39,000
So, you know, Adam, do you have anything to say before we go?
2256
01:55:39,000 --> 01:55:40,000
No, I don't.
2257
01:55:40,000 --> 01:55:46,800
I mean, it was just it was riveting to hear the words and silence of Ed of Edward Erdolag.
2258
01:55:46,800 --> 01:55:47,800
Yeah, it was.
2259
01:55:47,800 --> 01:55:50,720
Yeah, it was just a real joy to hear you talk, man.
2260
01:55:50,720 --> 01:55:51,720
Thank you so much for coming on.
2261
01:55:51,720 --> 01:55:52,720
Oh, it was nice meeting you, man.
2262
01:55:52,720 --> 01:55:53,720
Thanks for having me virtually meeting you.
2263
01:55:53,720 --> 01:55:56,720
Thanks for having me on and just let me like go on and on and on.
2264
01:55:56,720 --> 01:56:00,680
I appreciate an audience talking about my favorite subject myself.
2265
01:56:00,680 --> 01:56:01,680
Oh, that's so great.
2266
01:56:01,680 --> 01:56:02,680
I love that.
2267
01:56:02,680 --> 01:56:03,680
Anyways.
2268
01:56:03,680 --> 01:56:04,680
All right.
2269
01:56:04,680 --> 01:56:11,680
Well, again, if you want to find Ed, you can you can spell his last name.
2270
01:56:11,680 --> 01:56:13,240
E.R.D.E.L.A.C.
2271
01:56:13,240 --> 01:56:15,600
Just put that in the Google or the fucking Twitter or whatever.
2272
01:56:15,600 --> 01:56:17,640
And yeah, he's he's on some of those.
2273
01:56:17,640 --> 01:56:20,240
So, you know, find him there.
2274
01:56:20,240 --> 01:56:24,240
You'll hear in was not that you assholes follow us, but you'll hear in the bumper at the end
2275
01:56:24,240 --> 01:56:31,120
here, you know, all of our all of our social medias to go to Adam Augusto, trash official.
2276
01:56:31,120 --> 01:56:33,200
And you know, the game rage ones, you'll hear it.
2277
01:56:33,200 --> 01:56:34,840
But anyways, thank you guys for listening.
2278
01:56:34,840 --> 01:56:37,360
If you're in Belgium, buy the fucking book.
2279
01:56:37,360 --> 01:56:41,000
I'd like to see some numbers for Ed go up in Belgium.
2280
01:56:41,000 --> 01:56:45,400
I would also like to see the fucking movie downloads on Amazon for his movie.
2281
01:56:45,400 --> 01:56:48,800
I'd also like to see those go up and in Belgium as well.
2282
01:56:48,800 --> 01:56:52,200
So we can maybe help play with our Ed get big and in Belgium.
2283
01:56:52,200 --> 01:56:53,200
All right.
2284
01:56:53,200 --> 01:56:55,680
Maybe that's the next movie we do a documentary.
2285
01:56:55,680 --> 01:56:58,200
Ed, Ed Ertelac takes Belgium.
2286
01:56:58,200 --> 01:57:05,600
If Tommy was if Tommy was so can make the room and somehow become a celebrity and rich,
2287
01:57:05,600 --> 01:57:06,600
we could we could do it.
2288
01:57:06,600 --> 01:57:07,600
Oh, yeah, man.
2289
01:57:07,600 --> 01:57:08,600
We could easily do it.
2290
01:57:08,600 --> 01:57:09,600
Yeah, for sure.
2291
01:57:09,600 --> 01:57:10,600
I believe.
2292
01:57:10,600 --> 01:57:11,600
Anyways.
2293
01:57:11,600 --> 01:57:12,600
All right.
2294
01:57:12,600 --> 01:57:13,600
Well, that does it for us.
2295
01:57:13,600 --> 01:57:15,100
So thank you guys for listening.
2296
01:57:15,100 --> 01:57:29,320
We will catch you on the next episode of the Without Censor podcast.
2297
01:57:29,320 --> 01:57:31,920
That was without sensor.
2298
01:57:31,920 --> 01:57:36,120
The game rage magazine interview podcast.
2299
01:57:36,120 --> 01:57:41,960
Visit www.gameragemagazine.com for the full menu of podcasts.
2300
01:57:41,960 --> 01:57:46,160
Follow us on Instagram and TikTok at GameRage magazine.
2301
01:57:46,160 --> 01:57:50,600
Also on X at GameRageMag for all the latest episodes and content.
2302
01:57:50,600 --> 01:57:51,600
Thanks again for listening.
2303
01:57:51,600 --> 01:57:53,600
Except if you're with the FCC, then go on.
2304
01:57:53,600 --> 01:57:54,600
Get get out of here.
2305
01:57:54,600 --> 01:57:55,600
Go on.
2306
01:57:55,600 --> 01:57:56,600
Go on.
2307
01:57:56,600 --> 01:58:12,600
Go on.