WEBVTT
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Welcome to the Tortured Podcasters Department. On the agenda for today,
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Season 1, Episode 16, I Heart? I'm your host, Amy,
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and today I'm joined by my colleagues, Liz and Carmen.
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The trio back again.
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Yes.
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This meeting is now a session. Now for a round
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of Swift facts. When the Beautiful Eyes EP was released,
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it replaced Taylor's debut album as number one on the
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Top Country Albums Billboard chart. Taylor Swift moved into the
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number two spot, making Taylor the first artist to hold
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the top two positions on the chart since Leigh-Anne Rimes
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did it in 1997. I love that. Department findings.
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I heart question mark was according to an archived MySpace
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post from Taylor. She wrote it entirely when she was
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13 years old. Which rom-com is this one about? We
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have yet to decide.
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You know, stay tuned because I'm sure we'll have some ideas.
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We will probably. And like Beautiful Eyes, it was produced
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by Robert Ellis Orrell. Just go to his Instagram. It's great.
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Swell guy. So was this the same MySpace post that
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Beautiful Eyes?
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Well, because it's a MySpace post about the EP.
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Oh, okay.
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These are the two songs. I wrote them when I
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was 13. There's going to be not a ton of
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copies because I don't want people thinking this is a
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new album.
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Right?
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It was kind of all in one MySpace post. She
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used to be very active on MySpace.
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Yeah, she definitely was.
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Amen. Weren't we all? What I wouldn't give for, you know,
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a top eight again. But, fun background. According to the
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Taylor Swift wiki, take it with a grain of salt,
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this song had one of its first recordings on some
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of her demo CDs in 2004, which, that doesn't seem surprising.
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That makes sense.
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While here in the U.S., you could get I Heart
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Question Mark through our Walmart-exclusive Beautiful Eyes CD. Internationally, it
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was on the Fearless version in Japan. Fun. The Japanese
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stuff for Taylor Swift is always really interesting. Their vinyls
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and everything are always so cool. And I also found
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an interesting tidbit.
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This.
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Song was available as a digital download if you bought
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debut during released week at Best Buy.
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Yes.
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So lots of ways to get this song in the day.
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And it's a good one.
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It's a great one.
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We're fans. All right. Let's dive into the lyrics because
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there's a lot here. There's actually a lot in this one.
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There's actually a lot.
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All right, so verse one. Wish I had concentrated. They
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said love was complicated, but it's something I just fell into,
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and it was overrated. But just look what I created.
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I came out alive, but I'm black and blue. Before
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you ask me if I'm all right, think about what
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I had to do. Yeah.
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Come on, Amy.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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We just need a super cut.
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I just love these verses. I love the rhyme theme.
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There's so much.
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So much rhyming happening.
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Wish I hadn't concentrated. They said love was complicated. It's
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one of those songs that, like, it's a good karaoke
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song because I feel like no matter how you sing it,
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it sounds good.
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Mm-hmm.
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Like, because you just throw, it's like one of those
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songs you just throw out there and you're like, ba-dum-dum.
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And it just works.
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You know what it reminds me of?
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Like an alto range. Yes.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lower, lower range for her is always good.
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It reminds me of Avril Lavigne, Complicated. Yes. Rhyming, complicated
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and frustrated. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here we've got complicated and overrated.
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Maybe some inspiration. Yeah.
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Hayley Williams.
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Yes.
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Yeah, it's like, if she had concentrated, maybe she wouldn't
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have fallen or fell into this situation. Like, love isn't
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really something you think about, and that can be, like,
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a detriment when it's the wrong person. And I feel
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like that's kind of what this is saying. Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I also think this is a fun conversation song, which
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reminds me a lot of our song, which is funny
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because they're total opposite ends of the spectrum. Our song
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is like a sweet relationship song, and this is obviously
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a breakup. But they have that same sort of conversational
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tone that she's so good at.
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Yeah. What if this is just about the guy from
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Beautiful Eyes?
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This is a continuation. They finally got together.
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Yeah, and it was not great.
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It wasn't good.
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It also is slightly giving serial killer. I came out alive,
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but I'm black and blue. Think about what I had
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to do.
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You know, you're not wrong. OG murder song.
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Just did what I had to.
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I mean, I like that I feel like she's contradicting
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the things people say about love as a whole. Like, Oh,
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you know, love just happens. And she's like... If I'd
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thought about it more, I wouldn't have. Like, you guys
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are lying to me.
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Yeah.
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And I think it's fun. But it also has kind
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of like.
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Like a cynical tone almost.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, it does. Like.
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Which is so funny. We don't hear that on her
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young songs that much.
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Yeah.
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Like, she's always like, we love.
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Like, it's a little cynical. Yeah.
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Okay, so then the chorus is Wake up and smell
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the breakup Fix my heart, put on my makeup Another
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mess I didn't plan And I'll bet you thought you
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beat me Wish you could only see I got an
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I heart question mark Written on the back of my hand.
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I think every time I listen to the song My
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brain wants to fill in Wake up and smell the
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bacon That's funny.
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Uh, yeah, this is very much like a, you have
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to get on with life kind of chorus. Like I'm
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going to wake up and go through my daily routine,
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you know, patch myself back together.
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Um, I.
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Also like this really got kind of like the precursor
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to when they ask if I have a man, I
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can still say, I don't remember. I've got an I
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heart question mark written on the back of my hand.
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Don't know who I love. Ain't got a clue. I
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like that the whole vibe, it's a little messy. And
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then she's like, oh, you thought I'd be pining for you?
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Think again. Like, I'm fine. Like, I'm not great necessarily
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behind closed doors, but in public, I'm great.
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Yeah. Yeah. I will also say, when I was younger,
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it took me way too long to realize what I
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heart question mark meant. because i remember having the moment
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of like oh because she doesn't yeah okay put question
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mark in place of name.
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I heard him here i heard question mark was the
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precursor to spelling is fun yes yes yes i'm still
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upset about that but we're not going to.
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Talk about it we got a few seasons before.
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That one happy to understand that conundrum. But yes.
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I can't get over that people got upset enough about
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it for her to remember.
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Why were people freaking out about it in the first place?
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It was supposed to be a fun song.
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Because they can't spell. It's true. We are in a
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literacy crisis. And it was insulting to those who can't spell.
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I'm just thinking of her quote from the Grammy interview.
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If you guys thought of that. When people mock me,
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I like to use big words that they have to
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look up with a dictionary in order to mock me.
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They can't spell, so they didn't get that one.
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In this course, another mess I didn't play. I can't
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decide if this goes back to, well, I wasn't supposed
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to have a relationship right now, but, you know, we'll
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try it. Because that's almost, it's part of this, you
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know how we were talking about with Beautiful Eyes, where
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it was like, oh, maybe she's, maybe it's someone she's
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not supposed to be with, or like, it's complicated, forbidden love, woo.
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I kind of almost feel like this one was one
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of those times where like, you're like nah I'm gonna
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be single for a while we're good and then it
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happens and you're like oh maybe I'm not actually gonna
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be single right now maybe that's not what's happening.
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Yeah yeah well also like if you're getting into a
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relationship you're expecting it to work out Like, you're not
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going into it expecting it to be a hot mess.
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Especially at, like, 13.
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Like, let's be real.
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So, like, yeah, I didn't really plan for that to
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end that way, but okay.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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Okay, so verse two is, I'd be fine if you
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just walked by, but you had to talk about why.
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You were wrong and I was right. But I can't
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believe you made me sit at home and cry like
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a baby, wait right by the phone every night, And
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now you ask about you and I. There's no you
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and I. Remember what you put me through. I had to.
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You were wrong and I was right?
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Yeah.
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Yeah, that line does not make sense to me. That
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you were wrong and I was right.
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I think it's probably in a manner of, like, you
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know what?
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You're so right. I was wrong.
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Yeah.
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Like a cynical, like... Oh, like sarcasm?
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Yeah, and this is, like... This is... Well.
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Yeah, I think that.
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You know what?
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You're so right.
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I was wrong.
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Or the.
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He was clearly trying to make up with her yeah
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or like he was seeking validation for her to just
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like concede and be like oh it's okay you didn't
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do anything wrong and.
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She's like no like he's feeling guilty about you know
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breaking up with her or something and keeps trying to
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like rehash and talk about it and be like because
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he wants her to be like to comfort him right
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so he can like not feel guilty about it and
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she's like I'm not gonna do that like yeah.
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Yeah Or he's just admitting he was wrong and that
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she was right in order to try and get back
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with her. Because I think as the song progresses, it
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becomes pretty clear that he's trying to get back. And
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she's just like, yeah, no. We're good.
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Huh.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I just like the general callous vibe of this verse.
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Of her being like, dude, no. Like, I'm not going
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to keep talking about this with you. You made me
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feel this way and I'm over it. I'm over you. Goodbye.
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Not getting back together. Yep. Like ever. Like ever. Like
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original we were never getting back together. Yes. And I
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also think it gives the notion that at home it sucks, right?
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She's letting herself cry and figure out her stuff at home.
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But she's putting on a strong front in public and
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not letting him get to her in the ways.
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He can see.
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Which, you know, at 13, it's a great thing to do. Maybe, no,
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the timeline doesn't work out, but a girl could want
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it to be about High School Musical 2. I gotta
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go my own way. Boom, boom, boom. What about us?
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What about everything we've been through? But what about us?
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You know I never wanted to hurt you. But what
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about me? I actually watched. What am I supposed to do?
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I will sing the whole thing.
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I like she's kind of reminding him like what he
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put her through to remember what you put me through
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and then like reiterating, you know, this is how I
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felt and this is how crappy it was. So like, no,
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we're not getting back together.
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Like ever. yeah she's like dude why are you beating
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this dead horse like what's why are we going in
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these circles like i don't want to participate in this
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game yes i'm just gonna.
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And sir my i say the old taylor can't come
253
00:13:57.230 --> 00:13:58.049
to the phone right.
254
00:13:57.970 --> 00:14:00.870
Now i just want to be excluded from this narrative.
255
00:14:03.450 --> 00:14:05.870
Um so then the chorus repeats and then we get
256
00:14:05.909 --> 00:14:09.309
our bridge and Which goes, and when you're home all
257
00:14:09.370 --> 00:14:12.330
alone at night, you'll still wonder why you took everything
258
00:14:12.389 --> 00:14:15.659
I had, oh baby. I haven't thought about you and I,
259
00:14:15.649 --> 00:14:19.450
there's no you and I, and I know someday you will.
260
00:14:19.470 --> 00:14:23.860
God, that was almost, the set of lyrics was almost giving,
261
00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:26.679
I know that you know that I know that you know.
262
00:14:26.440 --> 00:14:28.159
That I know that you know that I know.
263
00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:31.399
See, I'm like, they don't know that we know that
264
00:14:31.440 --> 00:14:31.899
I know you.
265
00:14:32.450 --> 00:14:35.629
It's just reinforcing he wants her to make him feel
266
00:14:35.690 --> 00:14:40.100
better about himself. At the end of the day, she's like, oh,
267
00:14:40.159 --> 00:14:44.559
you're still wondering why. You're still thinking about it. And
268
00:14:44.820 --> 00:14:49.639
he wants validation or forgiveness. Take whatever pick. He wants
269
00:14:49.679 --> 00:14:52.039
to somehow not feel guilty. And she's like, yeah, I'm
270
00:14:52.090 --> 00:14:54.850
not giving that to you. You have to work through
271
00:14:54.870 --> 00:14:57.169
this on your own, same as I'm doing. Sorry.
272
00:14:57.190 --> 00:15:01.960
So our final chorus has a couple changes in it.
273
00:15:02.460 --> 00:15:05.940
We've got, wake up and smell the breakup. Realize that
274
00:15:05.980 --> 00:15:09.279
we won't make up. It didn't go the way you planned.
275
00:15:10.059 --> 00:15:12.240
And you'll know you didn't beat me when you look
276
00:15:12.279 --> 00:15:14.960
down and see I got an I heart question mark
277
00:15:15.080 --> 00:15:17.159
written on the back of my hand. Written on the
278
00:15:17.210 --> 00:15:19.639
back of my hand. An I heart question mark. Yeah,
279
00:15:19.679 --> 00:15:23.950
written on the back of my hand. Yeah, I mean, yeah.
280
00:15:23.990 --> 00:15:26.269
Yeah. Oh. Oh, oh.
281
00:15:27.850 --> 00:15:29.710
I miss Amy's serenadings.
282
00:15:30.470 --> 00:15:31.289
I'm just a girl.
283
00:15:32.809 --> 00:15:36.919
Uh yeah as always I love these little tweaks in
284
00:15:36.940 --> 00:15:43.230
the final chorus it works really well I I think
285
00:15:43.279 --> 00:15:46.610
it's kind of funny too that she's using I mean
286
00:15:47.110 --> 00:15:50.029
we all doodled on our hands oh that was a
287
00:15:50.110 --> 00:15:52.230
thing I don't know if kids still do that but
288
00:15:52.269 --> 00:15:55.590
like we all did it I wish I hope so Like,
289
00:15:55.769 --> 00:15:59.929
I love that she's using that as a statement to
290
00:15:59.970 --> 00:16:02.149
him to almost be like, I hope he sees what
291
00:16:02.169 --> 00:16:03.389
I wrote on my hand and marker.
292
00:16:03.429 --> 00:16:07.980
Yeah. I know he's going to see it. I'm going
293
00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:10.980
to intentionally hand him a note in class so he
294
00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:13.080
sees the note on my hand.
295
00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:16.919
I'm going to conveniently always be going up and using
296
00:16:16.940 --> 00:16:20.139
the pencil sharpener. He's always going to be seeing it.
297
00:16:20.789 --> 00:16:22.409
She throws her pencil on his desk.
298
00:16:22.490 --> 00:16:23.250
Oh, is that my pencil?
299
00:16:23.350 --> 00:16:25.169
Let me... Let me get that. Sorry.
300
00:16:25.590 --> 00:16:26.409
Let me get snap.
301
00:16:26.769 --> 00:16:28.470
I need that. Yes.
302
00:16:29.769 --> 00:16:35.259
She goes in for a handshake.
303
00:16:35.279 --> 00:16:38.460
I need you to walk with me for a sec
304
00:16:38.879 --> 00:16:39.379
on this one.
305
00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:40.440
Okay.
306
00:16:40.519 --> 00:16:44.960
This change in the chorus to me is giving you
307
00:16:44.980 --> 00:16:48.720
broke up with me to see what I do. And
308
00:16:48.740 --> 00:16:51.100
I didn't react how you thought I would. And now
309
00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:53.990
you're like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. No. And I'm
310
00:16:54.019 --> 00:16:56.509
not going to play those games with you. This happened
311
00:16:56.549 --> 00:16:59.389
to me in high school. He dumped me because he
312
00:16:59.429 --> 00:17:01.669
thought I'd like have him out done. I was like, okay.
313
00:17:02.269 --> 00:17:05.069
And then he's like texting my dude friend, having him
314
00:17:05.109 --> 00:17:08.730
out down. Because he's like, she didn't beg for me back.
315
00:17:09.049 --> 00:17:09.410
Yeah.
316
00:17:09.789 --> 00:17:11.890
So that's what this gives the whole, it didn't go
317
00:17:11.930 --> 00:17:14.269
the way you planned. You'll know you didn't beat me. Right.
318
00:17:14.289 --> 00:17:16.009
Cause he wanted to try to get an upper hand.
319
00:17:16.529 --> 00:17:16.730
Yeah.
320
00:17:17.069 --> 00:17:17.769
And it didn't work.
321
00:17:18.250 --> 00:17:20.839
And now she's crawling back and be like, you were right.
322
00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:26.359
And her being like, no. So that's what this gives.
323
00:17:26.740 --> 00:17:30.019
And I love that she's just like, nah, brah.
324
00:17:30.420 --> 00:17:30.819
Bye.
325
00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:35.589
Plenty of fish in the sea. I can pencil anything
326
00:17:35.650 --> 00:17:36.769
in for that question mark.
327
00:17:38.789 --> 00:17:41.049
I think it's the better of the two when it
328
00:17:41.069 --> 00:17:43.750
comes to the new original music on the Beautiful Lies EP.
329
00:17:43.750 --> 00:17:47.190
I do too. I think there's a little more going
330
00:17:47.299 --> 00:17:47.779
on with it.
331
00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:48.839
I think it's more interesting.
332
00:17:48.859 --> 00:17:52.519
Yeah. Both like sonically because it's her in a lower range,
333
00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:55.549
which is fun. It's one of those songs that I
334
00:17:55.569 --> 00:17:57.170
feel like you just grab a guitar and you sing
335
00:17:57.250 --> 00:17:59.569
it and you have a good time. It just like comes,
336
00:18:00.049 --> 00:18:04.390
it rolls off the tongue really well. If that makes sense. Yeah.
337
00:18:04.509 --> 00:18:08.890
When this came out and I was younger, I typically
338
00:18:09.029 --> 00:18:12.960
skipped beautiful eyes and went straight for this one. Um,
339
00:18:13.480 --> 00:18:15.920
I mean, now that I'm older, I like both, but
340
00:18:16.140 --> 00:18:19.680
this one is still my favorite. Um, I think it
341
00:18:19.700 --> 00:18:22.390
just has, I don't know, it has a certain draw
342
00:18:22.450 --> 00:18:22.819
to it.
343
00:18:22.829 --> 00:18:24.170
It does.
344
00:18:26.049 --> 00:18:28.710
I really feel like it should have been on the album. Like,
345
00:18:28.730 --> 00:18:30.390
this is a really strong song.
346
00:18:33.079 --> 00:18:35.079
Maybe they felt like it came on too strong.
347
00:18:36.640 --> 00:18:36.799
Maybe.
348
00:18:36.819 --> 00:18:38.819
Because it is a little bit more aggressive than the
349
00:18:38.859 --> 00:18:40.160
other breakup songs we have.
350
00:18:40.900 --> 00:18:42.000
Yeah, maybe.
351
00:18:42.099 --> 00:18:44.140
Let me remind myself.
352
00:18:44.269 --> 00:18:48.259
It is a little bit more, like, quirky, too, than... Yeah.
353
00:18:48.299 --> 00:18:51.559
It's quirky. And you know, maybe they argue she kind
354
00:18:51.599 --> 00:18:53.809
of hits on some of the themes in like Picture
355
00:18:53.829 --> 00:18:56.609
to Burn and like Should Have Said No.
356
00:18:57.069 --> 00:18:59.589
Yeah, maybe there are like too many breakup songs on
357
00:18:59.650 --> 00:19:00.150
one album.
358
00:19:00.170 --> 00:19:06.569
Or like too many angry leaning breakup songs. Yeah. Because
359
00:19:06.630 --> 00:19:10.609
I feel like you know, Picture to Burn, Should Have
360
00:19:10.630 --> 00:19:14.549
Said No and this are like angry adjacent songs. You know,
361
00:19:14.569 --> 00:19:17.480
Should Have Said No is full anger. But like This
362
00:19:17.539 --> 00:19:20.380
is angry adjacent, I feel like, because it's definitely being, like,
363
00:19:23.049 --> 00:19:25.970
compared to something like Cold As You. Right.
364
00:19:26.630 --> 00:19:28.509
Maybe they were trying to get, like, a good mix
365
00:19:28.970 --> 00:19:31.670
of emotions onto the album.
366
00:19:31.789 --> 00:19:36.190
Yeah. It kind of wouldn't surprise me if, like, misogyny
367
00:19:37.009 --> 00:19:40.049
was happening. And they're like, you're too young for so
368
00:19:40.069 --> 00:19:43.089
many angry songs. Nobody's going to want to listen to that.
369
00:19:43.690 --> 00:19:44.289
Smile more.
370
00:19:44.309 --> 00:19:44.410
Yeah.
371
00:19:45.589 --> 00:19:47.740
Literally though literally.
372
00:19:51.490 --> 00:19:56.130
So yeah yeah but i love this song like it's
373
00:19:56.170 --> 00:19:59.680
just it's fun it's boppy i think it should have
374
00:19:59.700 --> 00:20:01.640
made the cut but to be fair i also feel
375
00:20:01.680 --> 00:20:03.940
that way about message in a bottle i think message
376
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:07.019
in a bottle should have made the og cut mr
377
00:20:07.059 --> 00:20:10.619
perfectly fine should have made the cut like But I
378
00:20:10.650 --> 00:20:13.779
guess maybe that goes to show, in these early albums,
379
00:20:14.299 --> 00:20:18.200
just how little creative control she may have had, right?
380
00:20:18.220 --> 00:20:21.019
I mean, she's been very upfront that, like, they made
381
00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:23.529
her be more country than she wanted to be on
382
00:20:23.569 --> 00:20:28.710
Speak Now. And, like, how they were really dictating some
383
00:20:28.750 --> 00:20:31.049
of the direction that these early albums had.
384
00:20:31.549 --> 00:20:34.349
Yeah, it just goes to show, too, how many strong
385
00:20:34.589 --> 00:20:38.240
songs she had and, like, what a crazy catalog of
386
00:20:38.339 --> 00:20:41.789
music she's got because... a lot of these songs that
387
00:20:41.930 --> 00:20:46.200
never made the cut could have like, there's not a
388
00:20:46.259 --> 00:20:50.099
lot of songs that you're kind of like, yeah.
389
00:20:50.119 --> 00:20:53.420
Cause even rate things like lucky you and permanent marker
390
00:20:53.480 --> 00:20:56.230
and Tennessee blue that like never had official things. You're like,
391
00:20:57.309 --> 00:20:58.190
maybe they should have.
392
00:20:58.569 --> 00:20:58.910
Right.
393
00:20:59.589 --> 00:21:04.849
And she's rare in the fact that we have a
394
00:21:04.869 --> 00:21:07.539
lot more access. I feel like to some of those
395
00:21:08.210 --> 00:21:12.369
unreleased stuff without it being like, Oh, we hacked her, right? Because,
396
00:21:12.390 --> 00:21:14.349
you know, Ariana Grande is currently going through her thing
397
00:21:14.549 --> 00:21:16.470
right now. So many people who have hacked her stuff.
398
00:21:16.849 --> 00:21:19.369
But no, it's just because, right, she was selling CDs
399
00:21:19.430 --> 00:21:22.009
at all of these shows she was doing pre her
400
00:21:22.049 --> 00:21:24.950
signing and all of these demos. And there's just so much, like,
401
00:21:25.089 --> 00:21:29.279
access and availability when it came to having some of it.
402
00:21:30.039 --> 00:21:33.599
And then being like, wow, she's... And that just makes
403
00:21:33.619 --> 00:21:35.819
you wonder all of this stuff that we're never going
404
00:21:35.839 --> 00:21:38.940
to hear and never know about. Like, where did it start?
405
00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:45.049
It's a product of her career going back so far. Because, like,
406
00:21:45.710 --> 00:21:50.049
in the past 10 years or so, like, that's a
407
00:21:50.089 --> 00:21:54.930
vault you're never going to crack. Like, getting unreleased songs
408
00:21:54.970 --> 00:22:01.299
from Taylor Swift now is, like, not... Yeah. But back then,
409
00:22:01.380 --> 00:22:01.839
you could.
410
00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:06.819
They'll end up probably on another, like, Midnight's type of
411
00:22:06.920 --> 00:22:08.859
album if we get them.
412
00:22:10.559 --> 00:22:15.640
Well, and then there's, like, so unlike a lot of people,
413
00:22:16.579 --> 00:22:22.980
she hasn't been revisionist. So, like, I guess she couldn't
414
00:22:23.069 --> 00:22:26.950
necessarily afford to be because of just how quick her
415
00:22:27.029 --> 00:22:31.309
rise came. But, like, Dove Cameron, before Boyfriend blew up,
416
00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:34.839
she had a lot of singles in between that and
417
00:22:34.859 --> 00:22:38.160
the Disneyland era. And many of those were fantastic singles.
418
00:22:38.299 --> 00:22:42.619
Lazy Baby is such a fun song. But because Boyfriend
419
00:22:42.640 --> 00:22:45.539
blew up and that was a very different tone, she
420
00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:48.740
removed all the other ones from Spotify. So that's like a,
421
00:22:48.980 --> 00:22:50.900
if they're on YouTube, you listen to them that way.
422
00:22:51.269 --> 00:22:55.369
Charlie Puth has done it. Like, that's something that happens
423
00:22:55.430 --> 00:22:58.809
because these people spend so long trying to make it happen.
424
00:22:58.849 --> 00:23:01.839
So then that becomes like, quote unquote, lost media in
425
00:23:02.640 --> 00:23:05.440
a way. So it's kind of, I guess what I'm
426
00:23:05.460 --> 00:23:07.440
getting is it's funny to be like, she wasn't really
427
00:23:07.500 --> 00:23:11.269
revisionist like that, right? She hasn't like gotten rid of anything,
428
00:23:11.900 --> 00:23:14.349
but we still kind of have that lost media of like,
429
00:23:15.529 --> 00:23:17.690
the stuff that was on these demos and things she
430
00:23:17.730 --> 00:23:20.210
was performing at festivals while she was still like trying
431
00:23:20.230 --> 00:23:24.349
to get a songwriting deal that we have access to,
432
00:23:24.789 --> 00:23:28.890
but she hasn't tried to like go after people for it, right?
433
00:23:28.910 --> 00:23:31.829
Because if she wanted to, All of, you know, the
434
00:23:31.869 --> 00:23:35.529
lucky you video, you know, like lyric videos on YouTube
435
00:23:35.910 --> 00:23:36.670
would be gone.
436
00:23:37.069 --> 00:23:37.750
Right.
437
00:23:38.230 --> 00:23:41.059
She has the manpower and money to do that now.
438
00:23:41.640 --> 00:23:41.779
Right.
439
00:23:41.799 --> 00:23:46.079
And she doesn't. And I think that's fun. Oh, yeah.
440
00:23:46.299 --> 00:23:46.579
Yeah.
441
00:23:46.940 --> 00:23:50.079
I mean, you got to like respect where you came from. Yeah.
442
00:23:50.299 --> 00:23:54.210
And everybody starts somewhere. So, yeah, that's important to preserve that.
443
00:23:59.549 --> 00:24:02.789
And the cats have it. Let's see where they've spilled
444
00:24:02.829 --> 00:24:05.490
the ink and rearranged the lyrics this time.
445
00:24:07.210 --> 00:24:09.829
This one has some good ones. I feel like this
446
00:24:09.849 --> 00:24:10.349
was a good.
447
00:24:10.369 --> 00:24:12.430
It did.
448
00:24:13.250 --> 00:24:16.630
I went with sit at home and cry like a cat.
449
00:24:17.930 --> 00:24:20.710
And I'm just picturing the cat making all of its
450
00:24:20.769 --> 00:24:25.670
silly trills. And as it looks you and then looks
451
00:24:25.730 --> 00:24:27.529
at something else and then looks back at you and
452
00:24:27.569 --> 00:24:34.119
is like, And I'm like, what?
453
00:24:34.130 --> 00:24:38.000
I had, I got an I heart cats written on
454
00:24:38.019 --> 00:24:38.859
the back of my hand.
455
00:24:39.240 --> 00:24:43.519
I love it. Honestly? Just like, I heart, and then
456
00:24:43.559 --> 00:24:44.680
like a cat sticker.
457
00:24:44.700 --> 00:24:46.880
Or like a little cat face with the whiskers.
458
00:24:46.900 --> 00:24:47.380
Or like a paw.
459
00:24:47.480 --> 00:24:48.039
Ooh, yeah.
460
00:24:48.200 --> 00:24:51.759
A paw, yeah. I like it. All the options. Change
461
00:24:51.799 --> 00:24:55.579
it up every day of the week. Yes. That's fun.
462
00:24:55.880 --> 00:24:59.539
This was a fun one to put cat into. Written
463
00:24:59.720 --> 00:25:05.250
on the back of my cat. I almost, yes, I
464
00:25:05.450 --> 00:25:06.450
almost did that one.
465
00:25:06.470 --> 00:25:12.329
We're writing on cats again. I have, you took every
466
00:25:12.410 --> 00:25:13.230
cat I had.
467
00:25:13.390 --> 00:25:16.720
Oh, baby. He's just a little weird.
468
00:25:17.539 --> 00:25:19.500
No wonder she's so mad at him.
469
00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:20.900
That's why she killed him.
470
00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:25.960
Yeah. Wake up and smell the cat. As the cat
471
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:31.500
breathes the salmon breath into your face. I forget you
472
00:25:31.539 --> 00:25:35.519
don't have a cat sometimes, Carmen. But Amy has a cat, right?
473
00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:38.319
The cat don't mean it. The cat just really likes
474
00:25:38.339 --> 00:25:39.240
to get in your business.
475
00:25:39.799 --> 00:25:40.299
Sure does.
476
00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:41.880
Yeah.
477
00:25:42.259 --> 00:25:43.559
I just wake up in the middle of the night
478
00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:46.849
crawling across. Like, hello.
479
00:25:46.869 --> 00:25:47.009
Oh, gosh.
480
00:25:47.609 --> 00:25:50.750
There are some good ones.
481
00:25:51.589 --> 00:25:51.950
Yeah.
482
00:25:52.390 --> 00:25:52.710
Yeah.
483
00:25:53.829 --> 00:25:59.309
I'm just picturing a cat now, like, waiting by the phone, crying. Like,
484
00:26:00.210 --> 00:26:02.259
you know. All right.
485
00:26:02.950 --> 00:26:05.619
Well, join us next week as we continue in our
486
00:26:05.680 --> 00:26:08.799
debut era with a special bonus episode where we closely
487
00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:12.799
examine I'd Lie, which, in my opinion, existed.
488
00:26:12.819 --> 00:26:16.259
Oh, it existed, but.
489
00:26:16.359 --> 00:26:16.880
It existed.
490
00:26:16.900 --> 00:26:22.839
It's just in what capacity is the question. We would
491
00:26:22.900 --> 00:26:25.000
love to hear from you. So if you have thoughts
492
00:26:25.099 --> 00:26:28.579
on today's department meeting, drop us an email at thetorturedpodcasters
493
00:26:28.660 --> 00:26:32.220
at gmail.com or find us on social media. You can
494
00:26:32.259 --> 00:26:37.700
find us on Facebook at facebook.com backslash thetorturedpodcastersdepartment, on Instagram
495
00:26:37.819 --> 00:26:43.289
and YouTube at thetorturedpodcastersdept, on TikTok at torturedpodcasters, and on
496
00:26:43.349 --> 00:26:47.509
Twitter at torturedpoddept. And if you would like to become
497
00:26:47.529 --> 00:26:50.890
a department benefactor, you can support the show on Patreon
498
00:26:50.910 --> 00:26:57.630
at at patreon.com backslash the Torture Podcasters Department. Can't wait
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for next week. It's going to be a wild ride.
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I can't wait to hear it.
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You guys are literally going to enjoy it so much.
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All right.
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Meeting adjourned.
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Welcome to the Tortured Podcasters Department. On the agenda for today,
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Season 1, Episode 16, I Heart? I'm your host, Amy,
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and today I'm joined by my colleagues, Liz and Carmen.
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The trio back again.
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Yes.
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This meeting is now a session. Now for a round
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of Swift facts. When the Beautiful Eyes EP was released,
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it replaced Taylor's debut album as number one on the
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Top Country Albums Billboard chart. Taylor Swift moved into the
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number two spot, making Taylor the first artist to hold
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the top two positions on the chart since Leigh-Anne Rimes
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did it in 1997. I love that. Department findings.
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I heart question mark was according to an archived MySpace
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post from Taylor. She wrote it entirely when she was
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13 years old. Which rom-com is this one about? We
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have yet to decide.
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You know, stay tuned because I'm sure we'll have some ideas.
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We will probably. And like Beautiful Eyes, it was produced
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by Robert Ellis Orrell. Just go to his Instagram. It's great.
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Swell guy. So was this the same MySpace post that
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Beautiful Eyes?
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Well, because it's a MySpace post about the EP.
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Oh, okay.
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These are the two songs. I wrote them when I
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was 13. There's going to be not a ton of
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copies because I don't want people thinking this is a
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new album.
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Right?
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It was kind of all in one MySpace post. She
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used to be very active on MySpace.
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Yeah, she definitely was.
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Amen. Weren't we all? What I wouldn't give for, you know,
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a top eight again. But, fun background. According to the
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Taylor Swift wiki, take it with a grain of salt,
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this song had one of its first recordings on some
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of her demo CDs in 2004, which, that doesn't seem surprising.
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That makes sense.
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While here in the U.S., you could get I Heart
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Question Mark through our Walmart-exclusive Beautiful Eyes CD. Internationally, it
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was on the Fearless version in Japan. Fun. The Japanese
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stuff for Taylor Swift is always really interesting. Their vinyls
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and everything are always so cool. And I also found
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an interesting tidbit.
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This.
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Song was available as a digital download if you bought
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debut during released week at Best Buy.
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Yes.
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So lots of ways to get this song in the day.
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And it's a good one.
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It's a great one.
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We're fans. All right. Let's dive into the lyrics because
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there's a lot here. There's actually a lot in this one.
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There's actually a lot.
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All right, so verse one. Wish I had concentrated. They
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said love was complicated, but it's something I just fell into,
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and it was overrated. But just look what I created.
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I came out alive, but I'm black and blue. Before
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you ask me if I'm all right, think about what
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I had to do. Yeah.
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Come on, Amy.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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We just need a super cut.
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I just love these verses. I love the rhyme theme.
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There's so much.
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So much rhyming happening.
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Wish I hadn't concentrated. They said love was complicated. It's
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one of those songs that, like, it's a good karaoke
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song because I feel like no matter how you sing it,
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it sounds good.
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Mm-hmm.
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Like, because you just throw, it's like one of those
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songs you just throw out there and you're like, ba-dum-dum.
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And it just works.
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You know what it reminds me of?
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Like an alto range. Yes.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah. Lower, lower range for her is always good.
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It reminds me of Avril Lavigne, Complicated. Yes. Rhyming, complicated
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and frustrated. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Here we've got complicated and overrated.
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Maybe some inspiration. Yeah.
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Hayley Williams.
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Yes.
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Yeah, it's like, if she had concentrated, maybe she wouldn't
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have fallen or fell into this situation. Like, love isn't
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really something you think about, and that can be, like,
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a detriment when it's the wrong person. And I feel
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like that's kind of what this is saying. Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I also think this is a fun conversation song, which
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reminds me a lot of our song, which is funny
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because they're total opposite ends of the spectrum. Our song
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is like a sweet relationship song, and this is obviously
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a breakup. But they have that same sort of conversational
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tone that she's so good at.
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Yeah. What if this is just about the guy from
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Beautiful Eyes?
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This is a continuation. They finally got together.
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Yeah, and it was not great.
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It wasn't good.
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It also is slightly giving serial killer. I came out alive,
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but I'm black and blue. Think about what I had
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to do.
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You know, you're not wrong. OG murder song.
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Just did what I had to.
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I mean, I like that I feel like she's contradicting
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the things people say about love as a whole. Like, Oh,
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you know, love just happens. And she's like... If I'd
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thought about it more, I wouldn't have. Like, you guys
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are lying to me.
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Yeah.
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And I think it's fun. But it also has kind
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of like.
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Like a cynical tone almost.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, it does. Like.
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Which is so funny. We don't hear that on her
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young songs that much.
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Yeah.
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Like, she's always like, we love.
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Like, it's a little cynical. Yeah.
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Okay, so then the chorus is Wake up and smell
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the breakup Fix my heart, put on my makeup Another
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mess I didn't plan And I'll bet you thought you
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beat me Wish you could only see I got an
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I heart question mark Written on the back of my hand.
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I think every time I listen to the song My
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brain wants to fill in Wake up and smell the
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bacon That's funny.
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Uh, yeah, this is very much like a, you have
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to get on with life kind of chorus. Like I'm
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going to wake up and go through my daily routine,
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you know, patch myself back together.
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Um, I.
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Also like this really got kind of like the precursor
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to when they ask if I have a man, I
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can still say, I don't remember. I've got an I
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heart question mark written on the back of my hand.
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Don't know who I love. Ain't got a clue. I
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like that the whole vibe, it's a little messy. And
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then she's like, oh, you thought I'd be pining for you?
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Think again. Like, I'm fine. Like, I'm not great necessarily
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behind closed doors, but in public, I'm great.
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Yeah. Yeah. I will also say, when I was younger,
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it took me way too long to realize what I
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heart question mark meant. because i remember having the moment
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of like oh because she doesn't yeah okay put question
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mark in place of name.
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I heard him here i heard question mark was the
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precursor to spelling is fun yes yes yes i'm still
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upset about that but we're not going to.
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Talk about it we got a few seasons before.
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That one happy to understand that conundrum. But yes.
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I can't get over that people got upset enough about
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it for her to remember.
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Why were people freaking out about it in the first place?
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It was supposed to be a fun song.
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Because they can't spell. It's true. We are in a
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literacy crisis. And it was insulting to those who can't spell.
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I'm just thinking of her quote from the Grammy interview.
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If you guys thought of that. When people mock me,
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I like to use big words that they have to
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look up with a dictionary in order to mock me.
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They can't spell, so they didn't get that one.
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In this course, another mess I didn't play. I can't
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decide if this goes back to, well, I wasn't supposed
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to have a relationship right now, but, you know, we'll
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try it. Because that's almost, it's part of this, you
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know how we were talking about with Beautiful Eyes, where
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it was like, oh, maybe she's, maybe it's someone she's
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not supposed to be with, or like, it's complicated, forbidden love, woo.
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I kind of almost feel like this one was one
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of those times where like, you're like nah I'm gonna
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be single for a while we're good and then it
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happens and you're like oh maybe I'm not actually gonna
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be single right now maybe that's not what's happening.
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Yeah yeah well also like if you're getting into a
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relationship you're expecting it to work out Like, you're not
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going into it expecting it to be a hot mess.
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Especially at, like, 13.
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Like, let's be real.
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So, like, yeah, I didn't really plan for that to
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end that way, but okay.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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Okay, so verse two is, I'd be fine if you
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just walked by, but you had to talk about why.
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You were wrong and I was right. But I can't
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believe you made me sit at home and cry like
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a baby, wait right by the phone every night, And
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now you ask about you and I. There's no you
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and I. Remember what you put me through. I had to.
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You were wrong and I was right?
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Yeah.
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Yeah, that line does not make sense to me. That
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you were wrong and I was right.
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I think it's probably in a manner of, like, you
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know what?
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You're so right. I was wrong.
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Yeah.
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Like a cynical, like... Oh, like sarcasm?
200
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Yeah, and this is, like... This is... Well.
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Yeah, I think that.
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You know what?
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You're so right.
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I was wrong.
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Or the.
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He was clearly trying to make up with her yeah
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or like he was seeking validation for her to just
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like concede and be like oh it's okay you didn't
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do anything wrong and.
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She's like no like he's feeling guilty about you know
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breaking up with her or something and keeps trying to
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like rehash and talk about it and be like because
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he wants her to be like to comfort him right
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so he can like not feel guilty about it and
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she's like I'm not gonna do that like yeah.
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Yeah Or he's just admitting he was wrong and that
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she was right in order to try and get back
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with her. Because I think as the song progresses, it
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becomes pretty clear that he's trying to get back. And
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she's just like, yeah, no. We're good.
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Huh.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I just like the general callous vibe of this verse.
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Of her being like, dude, no. Like, I'm not going
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to keep talking about this with you. You made me
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feel this way and I'm over it. I'm over you. Goodbye.
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Not getting back together. Yep. Like ever. Like ever. Like
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original we were never getting back together. Yes. And I
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also think it gives the notion that at home it sucks, right?
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She's letting herself cry and figure out her stuff at home.
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But she's putting on a strong front in public and
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not letting him get to her in the ways.
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He can see.
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Which, you know, at 13, it's a great thing to do. Maybe, no,
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the timeline doesn't work out, but a girl could want
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it to be about High School Musical 2. I gotta
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go my own way. Boom, boom, boom. What about us?
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What about everything we've been through? But what about us?
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You know I never wanted to hurt you. But what
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about me? I actually watched. What am I supposed to do?
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I will sing the whole thing.
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I like she's kind of reminding him like what he
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put her through to remember what you put me through
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and then like reiterating, you know, this is how I
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felt and this is how crappy it was. So like, no,
247
00:13:38.929 --> 00:13:40.090
we're not getting back together.
248
00:13:40.889 --> 00:13:45.240
Like ever. yeah she's like dude why are you beating
249
00:13:45.279 --> 00:13:48.139
this dead horse like what's why are we going in
250
00:13:48.179 --> 00:13:49.980
these circles like i don't want to participate in this
251
00:13:50.000 --> 00:13:52.159
game yes i'm just gonna.
252
00:13:53.559 --> 00:13:57.179
And sir my i say the old taylor can't come
253
00:13:57.230 --> 00:13:58.049
to the phone right.
254
00:13:57.970 --> 00:14:00.870
Now i just want to be excluded from this narrative.
255
00:14:03.450 --> 00:14:05.870
Um so then the chorus repeats and then we get
256
00:14:05.909 --> 00:14:09.309
our bridge and Which goes, and when you're home all
257
00:14:09.370 --> 00:14:12.330
alone at night, you'll still wonder why you took everything
258
00:14:12.389 --> 00:14:15.659
I had, oh baby. I haven't thought about you and I,
259
00:14:15.649 --> 00:14:19.450
there's no you and I, and I know someday you will.
260
00:14:19.470 --> 00:14:23.860
God, that was almost, the set of lyrics was almost giving,
261
00:14:24.080 --> 00:14:26.679
I know that you know that I know that you know.
262
00:14:26.440 --> 00:14:28.159
That I know that you know that I know.
263
00:14:29.360 --> 00:14:31.399
See, I'm like, they don't know that we know that
264
00:14:31.440 --> 00:14:31.899
I know you.
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00:14:32.450 --> 00:14:35.629
It's just reinforcing he wants her to make him feel
266
00:14:35.690 --> 00:14:40.100
better about himself. At the end of the day, she's like, oh,
267
00:14:40.159 --> 00:14:44.559
you're still wondering why. You're still thinking about it. And
268
00:14:44.820 --> 00:14:49.639
he wants validation or forgiveness. Take whatever pick. He wants
269
00:14:49.679 --> 00:14:52.039
to somehow not feel guilty. And she's like, yeah, I'm
270
00:14:52.090 --> 00:14:54.850
not giving that to you. You have to work through
271
00:14:54.870 --> 00:14:57.169
this on your own, same as I'm doing. Sorry.
272
00:14:57.190 --> 00:15:01.960
So our final chorus has a couple changes in it.
273
00:15:02.460 --> 00:15:05.940
We've got, wake up and smell the breakup. Realize that
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00:15:05.980 --> 00:15:09.279
we won't make up. It didn't go the way you planned.
275
00:15:10.059 --> 00:15:12.240
And you'll know you didn't beat me when you look
276
00:15:12.279 --> 00:15:14.960
down and see I got an I heart question mark
277
00:15:15.080 --> 00:15:17.159
written on the back of my hand. Written on the
278
00:15:17.210 --> 00:15:19.639
back of my hand. An I heart question mark. Yeah,
279
00:15:19.679 --> 00:15:23.950
written on the back of my hand. Yeah, I mean, yeah.
280
00:15:23.990 --> 00:15:26.269
Yeah. Oh. Oh, oh.
281
00:15:27.850 --> 00:15:29.710
I miss Amy's serenadings.
282
00:15:30.470 --> 00:15:31.289
I'm just a girl.
283
00:15:32.809 --> 00:15:36.919
Uh yeah as always I love these little tweaks in
284
00:15:36.940 --> 00:15:43.230
the final chorus it works really well I I think
285
00:15:43.279 --> 00:15:46.610
it's kind of funny too that she's using I mean
286
00:15:47.110 --> 00:15:50.029
we all doodled on our hands oh that was a
287
00:15:50.110 --> 00:15:52.230
thing I don't know if kids still do that but
288
00:15:52.269 --> 00:15:55.590
like we all did it I wish I hope so Like,
289
00:15:55.769 --> 00:15:59.929
I love that she's using that as a statement to
290
00:15:59.970 --> 00:16:02.149
him to almost be like, I hope he sees what
291
00:16:02.169 --> 00:16:03.389
I wrote on my hand and marker.
292
00:16:03.429 --> 00:16:07.980
Yeah. I know he's going to see it. I'm going
293
00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:10.980
to intentionally hand him a note in class so he
294
00:16:11.000 --> 00:16:13.080
sees the note on my hand.
295
00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:16.919
I'm going to conveniently always be going up and using
296
00:16:16.940 --> 00:16:20.139
the pencil sharpener. He's always going to be seeing it.
297
00:16:20.789 --> 00:16:22.409
She throws her pencil on his desk.
298
00:16:22.490 --> 00:16:23.250
Oh, is that my pencil?
299
00:16:23.350 --> 00:16:25.169
Let me... Let me get that. Sorry.
300
00:16:25.590 --> 00:16:26.409
Let me get snap.
301
00:16:26.769 --> 00:16:28.470
I need that. Yes.
302
00:16:29.769 --> 00:16:35.259
She goes in for a handshake.
303
00:16:35.279 --> 00:16:38.460
I need you to walk with me for a sec
304
00:16:38.879 --> 00:16:39.379
on this one.
305
00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:40.440
Okay.
306
00:16:40.519 --> 00:16:44.960
This change in the chorus to me is giving you
307
00:16:44.980 --> 00:16:48.720
broke up with me to see what I do. And
308
00:16:48.740 --> 00:16:51.100
I didn't react how you thought I would. And now
309
00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:53.990
you're like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. No. And I'm
310
00:16:54.019 --> 00:16:56.509
not going to play those games with you. This happened
311
00:16:56.549 --> 00:16:59.389
to me in high school. He dumped me because he
312
00:16:59.429 --> 00:17:01.669
thought I'd like have him out done. I was like, okay.
313
00:17:02.269 --> 00:17:05.069
And then he's like texting my dude friend, having him
314
00:17:05.109 --> 00:17:08.730
out down. Because he's like, she didn't beg for me back.
315
00:17:09.049 --> 00:17:09.410
Yeah.
316
00:17:09.789 --> 00:17:11.890
So that's what this gives the whole, it didn't go
317
00:17:11.930 --> 00:17:14.269
the way you planned. You'll know you didn't beat me. Right.
318
00:17:14.289 --> 00:17:16.009
Cause he wanted to try to get an upper hand.
319
00:17:16.529 --> 00:17:16.730
Yeah.
320
00:17:17.069 --> 00:17:17.769
And it didn't work.
321
00:17:18.250 --> 00:17:20.839
And now she's crawling back and be like, you were right.
322
00:17:22.200 --> 00:17:26.359
And her being like, no. So that's what this gives.
323
00:17:26.740 --> 00:17:30.019
And I love that she's just like, nah, brah.
324
00:17:30.420 --> 00:17:30.819
Bye.
325
00:17:32.279 --> 00:17:35.589
Plenty of fish in the sea. I can pencil anything
326
00:17:35.650 --> 00:17:36.769
in for that question mark.
327
00:17:38.789 --> 00:17:41.049
I think it's the better of the two when it
328
00:17:41.069 --> 00:17:43.750
comes to the new original music on the Beautiful Lies EP.
329
00:17:43.750 --> 00:17:47.190
I do too. I think there's a little more going
330
00:17:47.299 --> 00:17:47.779
on with it.
331
00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:48.839
I think it's more interesting.
332
00:17:48.859 --> 00:17:52.519
Yeah. Both like sonically because it's her in a lower range,
333
00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:55.549
which is fun. It's one of those songs that I
334
00:17:55.569 --> 00:17:57.170
feel like you just grab a guitar and you sing
335
00:17:57.250 --> 00:17:59.569
it and you have a good time. It just like comes,
336
00:18:00.049 --> 00:18:04.390
it rolls off the tongue really well. If that makes sense. Yeah.
337
00:18:04.509 --> 00:18:08.890
When this came out and I was younger, I typically
338
00:18:09.029 --> 00:18:12.960
skipped beautiful eyes and went straight for this one. Um,
339
00:18:13.480 --> 00:18:15.920
I mean, now that I'm older, I like both, but
340
00:18:16.140 --> 00:18:19.680
this one is still my favorite. Um, I think it
341
00:18:19.700 --> 00:18:22.390
just has, I don't know, it has a certain draw
342
00:18:22.450 --> 00:18:22.819
to it.
343
00:18:22.829 --> 00:18:24.170
It does.
344
00:18:26.049 --> 00:18:28.710
I really feel like it should have been on the album. Like,
345
00:18:28.730 --> 00:18:30.390
this is a really strong song.
346
00:18:33.079 --> 00:18:35.079
Maybe they felt like it came on too strong.
347
00:18:36.640 --> 00:18:36.799
Maybe.
348
00:18:36.819 --> 00:18:38.819
Because it is a little bit more aggressive than the
349
00:18:38.859 --> 00:18:40.160
other breakup songs we have.
350
00:18:40.900 --> 00:18:42.000
Yeah, maybe.
351
00:18:42.099 --> 00:18:44.140
Let me remind myself.
352
00:18:44.269 --> 00:18:48.259
It is a little bit more, like, quirky, too, than... Yeah.
353
00:18:48.299 --> 00:18:51.559
It's quirky. And you know, maybe they argue she kind
354
00:18:51.599 --> 00:18:53.809
of hits on some of the themes in like Picture
355
00:18:53.829 --> 00:18:56.609
to Burn and like Should Have Said No.
356
00:18:57.069 --> 00:18:59.589
Yeah, maybe there are like too many breakup songs on
357
00:18:59.650 --> 00:19:00.150
one album.
358
00:19:00.170 --> 00:19:06.569
Or like too many angry leaning breakup songs. Yeah. Because
359
00:19:06.630 --> 00:19:10.609
I feel like you know, Picture to Burn, Should Have
360
00:19:10.630 --> 00:19:14.549
Said No and this are like angry adjacent songs. You know,
361
00:19:14.569 --> 00:19:17.480
Should Have Said No is full anger. But like This
362
00:19:17.539 --> 00:19:20.380
is angry adjacent, I feel like, because it's definitely being, like,
363
00:19:23.049 --> 00:19:25.970
compared to something like Cold As You. Right.
364
00:19:26.630 --> 00:19:28.509
Maybe they were trying to get, like, a good mix
365
00:19:28.970 --> 00:19:31.670
of emotions onto the album.
366
00:19:31.789 --> 00:19:36.190
Yeah. It kind of wouldn't surprise me if, like, misogyny
367
00:19:37.009 --> 00:19:40.049
was happening. And they're like, you're too young for so
368
00:19:40.069 --> 00:19:43.089
many angry songs. Nobody's going to want to listen to that.
369
00:19:43.690 --> 00:19:44.289
Smile more.
370
00:19:44.309 --> 00:19:44.410
Yeah.
371
00:19:45.589 --> 00:19:47.740
Literally though literally.
372
00:19:51.490 --> 00:19:56.130
So yeah yeah but i love this song like it's
373
00:19:56.170 --> 00:19:59.680
just it's fun it's boppy i think it should have
374
00:19:59.700 --> 00:20:01.640
made the cut but to be fair i also feel
375
00:20:01.680 --> 00:20:03.940
that way about message in a bottle i think message
376
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:07.019
in a bottle should have made the og cut mr
377
00:20:07.059 --> 00:20:10.619
perfectly fine should have made the cut like But I
378
00:20:10.650 --> 00:20:13.779
guess maybe that goes to show, in these early albums,
379
00:20:14.299 --> 00:20:18.200
just how little creative control she may have had, right?
380
00:20:18.220 --> 00:20:21.019
I mean, she's been very upfront that, like, they made
381
00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:23.529
her be more country than she wanted to be on
382
00:20:23.569 --> 00:20:28.710
Speak Now. And, like, how they were really dictating some
383
00:20:28.750 --> 00:20:31.049
of the direction that these early albums had.
384
00:20:31.549 --> 00:20:34.349
Yeah, it just goes to show, too, how many strong
385
00:20:34.589 --> 00:20:38.240
songs she had and, like, what a crazy catalog of
386
00:20:38.339 --> 00:20:41.789
music she's got because... a lot of these songs that
387
00:20:41.930 --> 00:20:46.200
never made the cut could have like, there's not a
388
00:20:46.259 --> 00:20:50.099
lot of songs that you're kind of like, yeah.
389
00:20:50.119 --> 00:20:53.420
Cause even rate things like lucky you and permanent marker
390
00:20:53.480 --> 00:20:56.230
and Tennessee blue that like never had official things. You're like,
391
00:20:57.309 --> 00:20:58.190
maybe they should have.
392
00:20:58.569 --> 00:20:58.910
Right.
393
00:20:59.589 --> 00:21:04.849
And she's rare in the fact that we have a
394
00:21:04.869 --> 00:21:07.539
lot more access. I feel like to some of those
395
00:21:08.210 --> 00:21:12.369
unreleased stuff without it being like, Oh, we hacked her, right? Because,
396
00:21:12.390 --> 00:21:14.349
you know, Ariana Grande is currently going through her thing
397
00:21:14.549 --> 00:21:16.470
right now. So many people who have hacked her stuff.
398
00:21:16.849 --> 00:21:19.369
But no, it's just because, right, she was selling CDs
399
00:21:19.430 --> 00:21:22.009
at all of these shows she was doing pre her
400
00:21:22.049 --> 00:21:24.950
signing and all of these demos. And there's just so much, like,
401
00:21:25.089 --> 00:21:29.279
access and availability when it came to having some of it.
402
00:21:30.039 --> 00:21:33.599
And then being like, wow, she's... And that just makes
403
00:21:33.619 --> 00:21:35.819
you wonder all of this stuff that we're never going
404
00:21:35.839 --> 00:21:38.940
to hear and never know about. Like, where did it start?
405
00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:45.049
It's a product of her career going back so far. Because, like,
406
00:21:45.710 --> 00:21:50.049
in the past 10 years or so, like, that's a
407
00:21:50.089 --> 00:21:54.930
vault you're never going to crack. Like, getting unreleased songs
408
00:21:54.970 --> 00:22:01.299
from Taylor Swift now is, like, not... Yeah. But back then,
409
00:22:01.380 --> 00:22:01.839
you could.
410
00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:06.819
They'll end up probably on another, like, Midnight's type of
411
00:22:06.920 --> 00:22:08.859
album if we get them.
412
00:22:10.559 --> 00:22:15.640
Well, and then there's, like, so unlike a lot of people,
413
00:22:16.579 --> 00:22:22.980
she hasn't been revisionist. So, like, I guess she couldn't
414
00:22:23.069 --> 00:22:26.950
necessarily afford to be because of just how quick her
415
00:22:27.029 --> 00:22:31.309
rise came. But, like, Dove Cameron, before Boyfriend blew up,
416
00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:34.839
she had a lot of singles in between that and
417
00:22:34.859 --> 00:22:38.160
the Disneyland era. And many of those were fantastic singles.
418
00:22:38.299 --> 00:22:42.619
Lazy Baby is such a fun song. But because Boyfriend
419
00:22:42.640 --> 00:22:45.539
blew up and that was a very different tone, she
420
00:22:45.599 --> 00:22:48.740
removed all the other ones from Spotify. So that's like a,
421
00:22:48.980 --> 00:22:50.900
if they're on YouTube, you listen to them that way.
422
00:22:51.269 --> 00:22:55.369
Charlie Puth has done it. Like, that's something that happens
423
00:22:55.430 --> 00:22:58.809
because these people spend so long trying to make it happen.
424
00:22:58.849 --> 00:23:01.839
So then that becomes like, quote unquote, lost media in
425
00:23:02.640 --> 00:23:05.440
a way. So it's kind of, I guess what I'm
426
00:23:05.460 --> 00:23:07.440
getting is it's funny to be like, she wasn't really
427
00:23:07.500 --> 00:23:11.269
revisionist like that, right? She hasn't like gotten rid of anything,
428
00:23:11.900 --> 00:23:14.349
but we still kind of have that lost media of like,
429
00:23:15.529 --> 00:23:17.690
the stuff that was on these demos and things she
430
00:23:17.730 --> 00:23:20.210
was performing at festivals while she was still like trying
431
00:23:20.230 --> 00:23:24.349
to get a songwriting deal that we have access to,
432
00:23:24.789 --> 00:23:28.890
but she hasn't tried to like go after people for it, right?
433
00:23:28.910 --> 00:23:31.829
Because if she wanted to, All of, you know, the
434
00:23:31.869 --> 00:23:35.529
lucky you video, you know, like lyric videos on YouTube
435
00:23:35.910 --> 00:23:36.670
would be gone.
436
00:23:37.069 --> 00:23:37.750
Right.
437
00:23:38.230 --> 00:23:41.059
She has the manpower and money to do that now.
438
00:23:41.640 --> 00:23:41.779
Right.
439
00:23:41.799 --> 00:23:46.079
And she doesn't. And I think that's fun. Oh, yeah.
440
00:23:46.299 --> 00:23:46.579
Yeah.
441
00:23:46.940 --> 00:23:50.079
I mean, you got to like respect where you came from. Yeah.
442
00:23:50.299 --> 00:23:54.210
And everybody starts somewhere. So, yeah, that's important to preserve that.
443
00:23:59.549 --> 00:24:02.789
And the cats have it. Let's see where they've spilled
444
00:24:02.829 --> 00:24:05.490
the ink and rearranged the lyrics this time.
445
00:24:07.210 --> 00:24:09.829
This one has some good ones. I feel like this
446
00:24:09.849 --> 00:24:10.349
was a good.
447
00:24:10.369 --> 00:24:12.430
It did.
448
00:24:13.250 --> 00:24:16.630
I went with sit at home and cry like a cat.
449
00:24:17.930 --> 00:24:20.710
And I'm just picturing the cat making all of its
450
00:24:20.769 --> 00:24:25.670
silly trills. And as it looks you and then looks
451
00:24:25.730 --> 00:24:27.529
at something else and then looks back at you and
452
00:24:27.569 --> 00:24:34.119
is like, And I'm like, what?
453
00:24:34.130 --> 00:24:38.000
I had, I got an I heart cats written on
454
00:24:38.019 --> 00:24:38.859
the back of my hand.
455
00:24:39.240 --> 00:24:43.519
I love it. Honestly? Just like, I heart, and then
456
00:24:43.559 --> 00:24:44.680
like a cat sticker.
457
00:24:44.700 --> 00:24:46.880
Or like a little cat face with the whiskers.
458
00:24:46.900 --> 00:24:47.380
Or like a paw.
459
00:24:47.480 --> 00:24:48.039
Ooh, yeah.
460
00:24:48.200 --> 00:24:51.759
A paw, yeah. I like it. All the options. Change
461
00:24:51.799 --> 00:24:55.579
it up every day of the week. Yes. That's fun.
462
00:24:55.880 --> 00:24:59.539
This was a fun one to put cat into. Written
463
00:24:59.720 --> 00:25:05.250
on the back of my cat. I almost, yes, I
464
00:25:05.450 --> 00:25:06.450
almost did that one.
465
00:25:06.470 --> 00:25:12.329
We're writing on cats again. I have, you took every
466
00:25:12.410 --> 00:25:13.230
cat I had.
467
00:25:13.390 --> 00:25:16.720
Oh, baby. He's just a little weird.
468
00:25:17.539 --> 00:25:19.500
No wonder she's so mad at him.
469
00:25:19.920 --> 00:25:20.900
That's why she killed him.
470
00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:25.960
Yeah. Wake up and smell the cat. As the cat
471
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:31.500
breathes the salmon breath into your face. I forget you
472
00:25:31.539 --> 00:25:35.519
don't have a cat sometimes, Carmen. But Amy has a cat, right?
473
00:25:36.160 --> 00:25:38.319
The cat don't mean it. The cat just really likes
474
00:25:38.339 --> 00:25:39.240
to get in your business.
475
00:25:39.799 --> 00:25:40.299
Sure does.
476
00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:41.880
Yeah.
477
00:25:42.259 --> 00:25:43.559
I just wake up in the middle of the night
478
00:25:44.039 --> 00:25:46.849
crawling across. Like, hello.
479
00:25:46.869 --> 00:25:47.009
Oh, gosh.
480
00:25:47.609 --> 00:25:50.750
There are some good ones.
481
00:25:51.589 --> 00:25:51.950
Yeah.
482
00:25:52.390 --> 00:25:52.710
Yeah.
483
00:25:53.829 --> 00:25:59.309
I'm just picturing a cat now, like, waiting by the phone, crying. Like,
484
00:26:00.210 --> 00:26:02.259
you know. All right.
485
00:26:02.950 --> 00:26:05.619
Well, join us next week as we continue in our
486
00:26:05.680 --> 00:26:08.799
debut era with a special bonus episode where we closely
487
00:26:08.880 --> 00:26:12.799
examine I'd Lie, which, in my opinion, existed.
488
00:26:12.819 --> 00:26:16.259
Oh, it existed, but.
489
00:26:16.359 --> 00:26:16.880
It existed.
490
00:26:16.900 --> 00:26:22.839
It's just in what capacity is the question. We would
491
00:26:22.900 --> 00:26:25.000
love to hear from you. So if you have thoughts
492
00:26:25.099 --> 00:26:28.579
on today's department meeting, drop us an email at thetorturedpodcasters
493
00:26:28.660 --> 00:26:32.220
at gmail.com or find us on social media. You can
494
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find us on Facebook at facebook.com backslash thetorturedpodcastersdepartment, on Instagram
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00:26:37.819 --> 00:26:43.289
and YouTube at thetorturedpodcastersdept, on TikTok at torturedpodcasters, and on
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Twitter at torturedpoddept. And if you would like to become
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a department benefactor, you can support the show on Patreon
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at at patreon.com backslash the Torture Podcasters Department. Can't wait
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for next week. It's going to be a wild ride.
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I can't wait to hear it.
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You guys are literally going to enjoy it so much.
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All right.
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Meeting adjourned.
