WEBVTT
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00:00:08.640Please welcome Justin Wang and host Dante Reminick for a special staple culture sponsored by Capital Layer.
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00:00:09.439Awesome.
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00:00:10.480Hey everyone.
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00:00:11.439Great to be here.
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00:00:12.480My name is Dante.
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00:00:15.439Justin, really, really excited to have you here.
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00:00:23.359I think that what you're building at Capital Layer is fundamentally different than what most people at this conference are focused on.
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00:00:26.160Let's just start with introductions, right?
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00:00:29.920So tell me about yourself and more importantly, tell me about what you're building at Capital Layer.
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00:00:30.640Yeah, for sure.
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00:00:32.799Hi guys, I'm the founder of Capital Layers.
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00:00:37.359We want to reimagine the money movement for global AI supply chain.
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00:00:43.039Funny thing is that the way I say global AI supply chain is because we're based in Taipei, Taiwan.
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00:00:46.24090% of AI infrastructures are actually produced from Taiwan right now.
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00:00:51.280And then interestingly speaking, out of every 10 bucks spending in the US right now, $8 goes to AI infrastructures.
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00:00:58.880So to be able to build a constructed AI data centered right now, 90% of uh equipment infrastructures, all these things are actually coming from Taiwan.
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00:01:04.640And then we have 5% coming from Korea memberships, and then 5% from FAFS, from Europe's, and then et cetera, from US.
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00:01:12.959Just so that I make sure I heard that correctly, out of every $10 that the US is spending, eight of those dollars are going to build AI infrastructure.
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00:01:17.599Yeah, well, a computer is already a trillion dollar industry on a path tour.
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00:01:21.359I think uh Taiwan has been seen as a global phenomenon.
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00:01:25.840Yeah, we're seeing 40% of growth GDP uh by this year already.
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00:01:30.159We have surpassed several countries, become the third largest trading partners to the US.
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00:01:33.120We actually surpassed China and Hong Kong by earlier this year's.
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00:01:37.359So I think what Taiwan and US are doing right now as a global phenomenon.
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00:01:38.400Yeah, absolutely.
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00:01:41.120I mean, I think people talk a lot about AI.
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00:01:48.000People talk a lot about data centers, but you are in the thick of what is necessary to build them, right?
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00:01:56.640We see these huge deals come out all over the internet all the time about, oh, this company just paid $150 billion to NVIDIA or whatever it might be.
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00:02:02.480But I think most people don't think about the piping that actually needs to make that happen, right?
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00:02:08.080So to your point, most of this spending is going through Taiwan in one shape, way, shape, or form.
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00:02:12.159The question then is, how does money move from point A to point B?
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00:02:15.439And I know that you guys are building the infrastructure to actually make that happen.
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00:02:20.639We talk to a lot of people that say, hey, we're doing B2B payments with stable coins or whatever it might be.
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00:02:31.039And I know that you guys are in that adjacent world about payments in the world of AI necessitates you to build Capital Ayer from the ground up.
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00:02:34.879Why doesn't the existing infrastructure work for these types of flows?
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00:02:41.919Well, before we talk about that, I definitely wanted to put more emphasis on why we create Capital Air's first place since last year.
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00:02:45.120I know my family owns semiconductor businesses in Taiwan.
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00:02:48.240We're trading with quite a few known AI supply chain companies.
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00:02:52.080And then the other day, at dinner last year, one of the chairmans came up to me.
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00:02:54.800He's like, Hey, you I know you do stablecoin crypto related.
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00:02:59.919Our department has been getting numerous requests from our suppliers that they want to sit on stable coins.
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00:03:16.400So as we dive further in, we realize that there's actually quite a numbers that love suppliers distributed want to pay in stablecoin, especially the one in Latin America's, Brazil's, and then uh sanction countries that will incorporate into Hong Kong, Singapore, and then use stablecoin to pay off the suppliers.
00:03:16.400 -->
00:03:27.360I mean, obviously, earlier this year, you know, Trump has imposed more sanctions toward tricks manufacturers where you cannot sell to Russia, you cannot sell to China, or numerous countries you can name it.
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00:03:36.080So I think the activity we're seeing for stablecoin right now, especially to Taiwan, I think 60%, 70% of money are actually paid by sanctioned countries, which is nothing wrong.
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00:03:42.479You know, uh as an exporting nations like Taiwan, if you want to pay me a dollar, I will take the dollar and give you the goods and services.
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00:03:47.039So since last year, we have Pornara with fuel for banks in Taiwan already.
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00:03:52.639We're building infrastructure for the banks for them to be able to receive and send stable coins on behalf of the enterprises.
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00:04:03.120So right now we have corner up, also our investors, Gigabyte, Windstrons, and also Penatrons, all these known air supply chain manufacturers are our clients' investors as well.
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00:04:04.960Let's dive more into the product.
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00:04:06.560You and I were talking backstage.
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00:04:08.240You are not in the flow of funds.
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00:04:13.919You are building an operating system for financial institutions to be able to adopt stable coins.
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00:04:16.079Tell us what that means, why it's important.
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00:04:20.879Well, we initially, when we start capital area, we want to get into the B2B payments.
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00:04:22.240I think that's where the juice it is.
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00:04:25.920You know, you make BIFs on top of every transaction from A to Bs.
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00:04:28.639But again, Taiwan is a restricted currency nation.
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00:04:29.439It's not that simple.
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00:04:30.800What does that mean, real quick?
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00:04:37.279So every com every enterprise is every company, there's a capacity of receiving money from external uh countries.
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00:04:49.600So let's say you're you're you're trading at a billion dollars annually, the government will give you roughly about a couple million dollars extra of uh trading trading impact that allows you to receive more good uh USDs on outside of uh Taiwan.
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00:04:55.120So, like I said, Korea and Japan, Taiwan, all these eight pack nations are restricted currency nations.
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00:05:01.519It's not that simple that you want to pay like a billion dollar USD from Brazil to Taiwan and then people can accept it.
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00:05:08.480So, like I said, the way we we look at stable coins are a lot different than a lot of people that are which are attending this conference.
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00:05:12.160We we first we we want to do the B2B payment, we got rejected by the banks.
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00:05:15.439It's like what you are thinking, what you're doing is completely illegal.
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00:05:22.160And then we we quickly pivot to infrastructure operating systems where we actually enable banks to become uh exchange.
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00:05:33.040As in like Taiwan next year, we are gonna bypass all these virtual asset ads where uh where all the banks can do what exchange does custodian, offer-on-rents, good exchanges.
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00:05:45.439So the way I look at Asia banks in the next two, three years is in terms of facing stable coins, is that there are gonna be overtaking all these unregulated exchanges, especially uh the one the one in the AIPAC nations.
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00:05:53.759And if that time comes, a lot of enterprises, if they want to, if they work on the top stablecoin, they will go to the banks instead of going for unregulated exchanges.
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00:05:54.240Yeah.
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00:05:56.800Talk to me about the role that stable coins has.
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00:06:01.920I mean, obviously the US is one of the one of, if not the biggest spender on the world of AI infrastructure.
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00:06:05.040Are stable coins needed for every single flow?
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00:06:12.959Or is the financial infrastructure for very, very tight and important quarters like US to Taiwan and back and forth, is that already established, right?
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00:06:16.800Can US companies trade with Taiwanese companies without the use of stable coins?
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00:06:24.160Or is there a world in which stable coins dominate these types of international flows because they're, you know, at cliche better, faster, cheaper?
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00:06:36.639Yeah, so for the last three decades, Taiwan has been one of the largest OBU account holders for JP Morgan Morgan Standees, obviously, due to decades of manufacturing goods and services from the last few uh you can name it.
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00:06:41.279So until recently, there has been an ongoing discussion for a lot of banks in Taiwan enterprises as well.
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00:06:47.600So Taiwan is the sixth largest US debt holders, and then we are the third largest trading partner to the US.
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00:06:52.560If Genius Ad were gonna get passed, how would that impact Taiwan as a nation, as a country?
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00:07:01.600So as a country of 24 million population uh people on the continents, we started thinking how much B2B payments can be actually paid with stable coins.
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00:07:04.800And frankly speaking, for the last six months, my answer is no.
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00:07:07.680I don't think these suppliers will actually need stablecoins to settles.
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00:07:11.120Because you have to we have to know all these manufacturers they have credit lines.
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00:07:16.639Credit line means that you can pay within 30 days, 90 days, 180 days, or even 364 days.
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00:07:24.800And then to be able to tell you guys if you want to buy goods and services from TSMC, you have to pay two and a half years or three years ahead of time.
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00:07:25.199Yeah.
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00:07:29.600So whether is T plus 0, T plus 20, T plus 100, T plus two years.
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00:07:30.319Two years.
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00:07:31.519It doesn't really matter.
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00:07:36.800In a way, that how these B2B payments will not affect the way we produce goods, manufacture goods.
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00:07:37.360Interesting.
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00:07:39.040I think it's also interesting.
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00:07:43.600You mentioned that Taiwan is, you know, one of the top ten holders of US debt.
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00:07:54.800I think one of the reasons that Americans are really, really excited about stable coins is because you look at a company like Tether, and Tether is the 17th largest holder of US debt behind most US allies.
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00:08:12.879And so I think that, you know, to get Americans excited about this, being able to tout that not only are you doing trade with a country that holds a lot of US debt, but you're doing it with a mechanism that also is a primary contributor to holding US debt, I think is, at least when I talk to people about this, something that gets them really, really excited.
00:08:12.879 -->
00:08:15.199But to your point, it's not always needed, right?
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00:08:23.600So it seems like in really, really tight corridors where there's a lot of financial infrastructure built out, the US, Taiwan being one of them, stable coins aren't really needed.
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00:08:25.839Where are stable coins needed?
00:08:25.839 -->
00:08:28.800You mentioned LATAM, you mentioned some places in Africa.
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00:08:31.120Why are stable coins needed for those routes?
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00:08:33.519Well, you have inflationary nations.
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00:08:41.519If your own current nation, national currencies against USDs are going through high inflations, you're likely going to want to host the USD stable coin, right?
00:08:41.519 -->
00:08:46.559But the cases where Taiwan as a nation, we don't suffer inflation against USD.
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00:08:53.039In fact, on the average of loss tickets, we go from 0.3 to 0.0.8 inflations against USD.
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00:09:01.039Obviously, every inches of fluctuation of new Taiwan dollar against USD, you're literally looking at the billion dollar losses from these manufacturers.
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00:09:01.679Absolutely.
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00:09:10.000So obviously, as a central banks in Taiwan, they're they want to tighten out the fluctuation of volatility between all these two nation currencies.
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00:09:14.799But for the last three, four months, we're invested by all these area suppression companies.
00:09:14.799 -->
00:09:17.600There's few reasons why they want to invest us.
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00:09:20.720We want to export new forms of money movements.
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00:09:28.399So I can say this that I think in the future of AIPC devices, 60-70% of the AI devices will be manufactured in Taiwan.
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00:09:32.960And every device requires compute, inference, all these infrastructure payment tools.
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00:09:42.320If a Taiwanese company sells AIPC to Poland, to Ukraine, this is for example, Eastern Europe, all these devices will require them to pay with compute, right?
00:09:42.320 -->
00:09:51.679So start, and a lot of these Taiwan enterprises start asking themselves, okay, if this USC stablecoins we're gonna get bypassed all these regulations, why can't we leverage on top of it?
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00:10:02.399Because for the last decade or two, a lot of these Taiwanese companies, they're paying roughly about 47% of the local RTP transaction through Europe or Latin America's world, all these different nations.
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00:10:05.600So if this is something that we're actually in discussion right now.
00:10:05.600 -->
00:10:10.799So if you pay stable coin, you can you can get two, three percent cheaper on your compute.
00:10:10.799 -->
00:10:16.399It's possible because essentially all these companies don't have they don't they don't have to suffer what pay the local RTP reels.
00:10:16.399 -->
00:10:23.039So I think this is one of the alternatives that all these Chinese companies, especially AI device manufacturers, are looking into exploring the use cases.
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00:10:29.759We hear a lot of talk in the intersection of stablecoins and AI about tokenized compute, right?
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00:10:32.960Or bringing compute as a commodity on chain.
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00:10:34.000What are your thoughts on that?
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00:10:36.399Well, I think we're still early for that.
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00:10:36.799Absolutely.
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00:10:43.039Um obviously to able to be able to have a tokenized uh computer markets, you you need to have infrastructure, right?
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00:10:47.360So they're still pretty fragmented in terms of data, in terms of data centers right now.
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00:10:55.679We have a lack of electricity and then clean waters to st be to be able to sustain all these hyperscalar or neo-cloud providers and across the world.
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00:11:05.519So before that, I I really don't think how we're gonna be able to make this computer market tangible as a tradable to all these tokenized uh assets on a blockchain level.
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00:11:07.440So I think we're still very early for that.
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00:11:16.720I uh ever since I started working on all these banks uh in Asia, APAC Nation, I've become overly conservative in the way, in a good way that I know what is real, what's gonna happen in the future.
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00:11:23.200So uh in terms of compute market, definitely somebody's gonna wrap that, somebody's gonna tokenize compute, and then somebody's gonna trade with it.
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00:11:25.840That just has always been the way how blockchain traders worked.
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00:11:29.840So if that were happens, I'm looking forward to the the day it comes.
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00:11:45.840Yeah, man, I I think it's good for you too, as someone who rests in the intersection of stable coins and AI, because if tokenized compute is brought on chain, it means that the barriers between that tokenized compute and stable coins become far less than it does between fiat dollars and and standard compute.
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00:11:51.360And if you own that intersection between, which you guys are building out the infrastructure for, you're in a much better position.
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00:11:57.279I want to talk again a little bit more about the intersection between standard banks and stable coins.
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00:12:00.240You went to these banks initially, they're like, don't build a B2B product.
00:12:00.240 -->
00:12:01.759Don't build, don't do B2B payments.
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00:12:06.320And so you pivoted to building out this orchestration layer, or sorry, the the operational layer.
00:12:06.320 -->
00:12:07.440Why is that so hard?
00:12:07.440 -->
00:12:09.919Why is that impossible for banks to do on their own?
00:12:09.919 -->
00:12:11.840Why do they lean on you to make that happen?
00:12:12.159 -->
00:12:15.360Well, first, banks doesn't operate like exchanges.
00:12:15.360 -->
00:12:19.200So, I mean, if obviously you guys know Firebox, Bitcoin, all these custodian providers.
00:12:19.200 -->
00:12:23.919You can't just throw a custodian to the banks and expect them to operate like exchanges does, right?
00:12:23.919 -->
00:12:26.240Well, obviously, banks they don't want order books.
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00:12:30.399They don't want all the trading engine that actually facilitate Bitcoin trading or online offerings.
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00:12:37.679What I care, I think what every bank cares, especially in the APAC region in Japan, Taiwan, that we haven't been in contact with, is enterprises as a client.
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00:12:42.000So they don't want they don't want to lose enterprises to clients over over stable coins.
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00:12:49.120So I think for the next two, three years, an adoption will come where a lot of these Asia APAC banks will have for, I won't say force.
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00:12:57.440They're gonna be matching toward adoptions where are gonna enable stablecoin custodians on and off runs for these retail enterprises clients.
00:12:57.440 -->
00:13:02.559And by that time comes, I believe all these stablecoin use cases will come out.
00:13:02.559 -->
00:13:10.799Because enterprises, especially the one in Asia, they're overly conservative in the way that they will not kick off innovation unless banks enabled it.
00:13:10.799 -->
00:13:15.840So if that day comes, I think we're gonna see a lot of interesting cases, especially the company market inference models.
00:13:15.840 -->
00:13:26.240Uh, like I said, out of uh 10 data centers that is being built in the US and for the next two, three years, six or five or six of them are built by Twinnies, operators, chips, manufacturers, or equipment producers.
00:13:26.240 -->
00:13:35.279So if they were if they were gonna rent out to hyperscalers on all these neo car providers, there's some forms of money movement that they can facilitate leverage on top of stable coins.
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00:13:36.000Interesting.
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00:13:42.159When you see stable coins being used in this context, is there a specific stablecoin?
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00:13:44.960Is there a specific chain that dominates?
00:13:45.200 -->
00:13:45.919Not really.
00:13:45.919 -->
00:13:55.200But as far as we've seen, TRCs, all these old Ethereum chains are they having always been used by a lot of retail and enterprises across Asia.
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00:14:00.480Trons, obviously, you guys know, but I think enterprises, they don't care which chains.
00:14:00.480 -->
00:14:06.159So if my my supplier wants to pay a million USD COT to my bank accounts, I don't care.
00:14:06.159 -->
00:14:07.679I just want to see USD next day.
00:14:07.919 -->
00:14:11.600And is that just because you're off-ramping it immediately and banks will enable that.
00:14:11.679 -->
00:14:13.039So using our assistance.
00:14:13.039 -->
00:14:20.240So I I think interestingly speaking, I think what stablecoins could become the next three to five years would become the infrastructure layers.
00:14:20.240 -->
00:14:24.000I don't think no company would name their company as a stablecoin companies.
00:14:24.159 -->
00:14:24.320Yeah.
00:14:24.559 -->
00:14:32.080Because you're essentially just the willingness of these institutions to accept stable coins and to work with you is purely by demand.
00:14:32.080 -->
00:14:36.720They have people coming to them saying, I want to use stable coins to pay for this.
00:14:36.720 -->
00:14:42.399And so clearly there are people adopting stable coins on whatever chain it might be, whatever stablecoin it might be.
00:14:42.399 -->
00:14:44.639I, and I'm curious to get your thoughts.
00:14:44.639 -->
00:14:58.960I see a world in which someone like you know NVIDIA or one of these large providers, DSMC, whatever it might be, builds out maybe their own stable coins so that they can retain the economics around this, or the institutions that are deeply involved in this so that they can retain the economics around this.
00:14:58.960 -->
00:15:03.919And we see a few large organizations in the space playing around with this idea.
00:15:03.919 -->
00:15:07.279Some of it is public information, others is not.
00:15:07.279 -->
00:15:20.000Do you see a world in which these companies really lean into stable coins beyond just, hey, I want to accept it and immediately off-ramp it, but you know, using it as a treasury asset, maybe launching their own, seeing what they can do with yield or things like that?
00:15:20.320 -->
00:15:31.120I mean, there has there has always been ongoing discussion with us and then banks, especially our client sides, that what enterprise in the future launch their own version of stable coins, you know, I I look forward to that.
00:15:31.120 -->
00:15:35.200If that actually happens, you know, that actually means the major adoptions for stablecoin in general.
00:15:35.200 -->
00:15:42.320But what I'm seeing right now, the way we look at stable coins has always limited to B2B payments, transfer goods and services.
00:15:42.320 -->
00:15:54.480But uh, frankly speaking, last lot I think it's last month, one of the banks of our clients asked us that I mean, invoice invoice financing has always been one of the biggest uh financial sectors in Taiwan.
00:15:54.480 -->
00:15:54.799Yeah.
00:15:54.799 -->
00:15:56.320Obviously, you know the exporting number.
00:15:56.320 -->
00:16:01.200If you export more goods and services, you probably have to borrow more money from the banks, right?
00:16:01.200 -->
00:16:06.080So previously they always borrowed USDs from JPM Work and Morgan Standing in Taiwan.
00:16:06.080 -->
00:16:11.840And then they start asking us that can you guys find out the rates for USDC and USDT?
00:16:11.840 -->
00:16:12.879To lend USDC?
00:16:12.879 -->
00:16:13.120Yeah.
00:16:13.120 -->
00:16:22.720So I think the source of USD has been predominantly by JPM Work and Morgan Standing, all these uh well, Wells Fargo's, all these company uh banks in Taiwan.
00:16:22.720 -->
00:16:32.639And I was in shock that there's actually a bank asking us, can you guys consult with Tether and Circle asking how much rate you're offering to get USD?
00:16:32.639 -->
00:16:43.600And then that blew my mind in the way that stablecoin as a real, as a payment methods, people are actually considering instead of like going through all these uh corresponding banks or foreign banks that are usually based in Taiwan.
00:16:43.919 -->
00:16:45.279That's really, really fascinating.
00:16:45.279 -->
00:16:51.279And do you think it's the same people that want to pay with stable coins that want to receive uh credit in stable coins?
00:16:51.279 -->
00:16:57.600Or do you think that there's a world in which you know someone who pays in fiat still wants credit stables?
00:16:58.080 -->
00:16:58.720Great questions.
00:16:58.720 -->
00:17:16.880So if eight banks in Taiwan borrow USD stable coins from uh one of the companies that's lower rate than World's Fargo, JP Morgan's, they're gonna the moment they get USD T or C or any version of it, they will offer them to USD and then lend the money out to Taiwanese Taiwan AI supplier.
00:17:17.119 -->
00:17:17.519Locally.
00:17:17.759 -->
00:17:18.160Locally.
00:17:18.160 -->
00:17:18.640Okay.
00:17:18.640 -->
00:17:21.200So I think it has been commonly used, right?
00:17:21.200 -->
00:17:26.799A lot of banks in Taiwan they borrow US JPY, Japanese yens from all these Japanese banks that are based in Taiwan.
00:17:26.799 -->
00:17:28.480Same thing goes to USD as well.
00:17:28.480 -->
00:17:36.640If traditionally they have to borrow money from JP Morgan Morgan Stanley or Wells Fargo, now they can actually borrow from issuer of stable coins that offers lower rates.
00:17:36.640 -->
00:17:40.240So imagine that can drastically improve by five to ten percent.
00:17:40.240 -->
00:17:45.599I mean, you're look essentially looking at a $364 billion trading value between Taiwan and China, Taiwan and US.
00:17:45.599 -->
00:17:46.880Can you say that number one more time?
00:17:46.880 -->
00:17:48.799374 billion.
00:17:48.799 -->
00:17:54.480I think I think by the end of this year, we essentially are on track to be $360 billion to $375 billion.
00:17:54.480 -->
00:17:55.200Wow.
00:17:55.200 -->
00:17:55.759That's amazing.
00:17:55.759 -->
00:17:57.039Between US and Taiwan.
00:17:57.039 -->
00:18:04.319So imagine just that the supply chain finance can drastically improve five to ten percent on the money productivities.
00:18:04.319 -->
00:18:09.759So I think the way USC stable the usage of stable coins will apply differently for different nations.
00:18:09.759 -->
00:18:18.880I think to be able to fully apply to Taiwan, I think the use case will be very different than unlike to Lautin, Brazil's, or Africa, all these different nations.
00:18:18.880 -->
00:18:28.079Maybe supply chain finance could be one of the angles where all these stablecoin issuers come into Taiwan, they want to let out as much USD as possible and then get the yield out of this.
00:18:28.079 -->
00:18:31.279So that is one of the interesting cases that I've seen recently.
00:18:31.519 -->
00:18:32.559Let's talk supply chain.
00:18:32.559 -->
00:18:36.000You guys right now are focused at one spot in that supply chain.
00:18:36.000 -->
00:18:42.240How does the buyer of chips or of an AI product get it to the company who manufactures it?
00:18:42.240 -->
00:18:42.720Right.
00:18:42.720 -->
00:18:52.240There's other points in that supply chain that I think stablecoins could be really beneficial, whether it's, you know, paying shippers, paying uh, you know, vendors, whatever it might be.
00:18:52.240 -->
00:18:57.279How do you guys think about going and expanding throughout the AI supply chain?
00:18:57.599 -->
00:19:00.640So our job is not to enable B2B payments.
00:19:00.640 -->
00:19:03.680I mean, we're we're, like I said, restricted currency nations.
00:19:03.680 -->
00:19:04.000Yeah, yeah.
00:19:04.000 -->
00:19:09.680So every dollar that comes to Taiwan has to be monetized and due diligence through all these central banking in Taiwan.
00:19:09.680 -->
00:19:21.920What we're trying to do is creating use cases on top of stable coins where, I mean, imagine out of AI, 10 AI PCs that are gonna be shipping and sell in the US, or six or seven of them are gonna be manufactured in Taiwan.
00:19:21.920 -->
00:19:30.000And then within all these AIPCs, there they're gonna be a default stablecoin wallets enable you to buy inference, to consume computes.
00:19:30.000 -->
00:19:45.279The way we look at money cycles for these AI infra payments instead of AI editing payments are gonna be revolutionary in a way that the day, let's say, for example, Gigabyte received uh it uses $10 USDC, next day it shows up on the Taiwanese bank account.
00:19:45.279 -->
00:19:55.039And then they could use that money, reinvest to their manufacturers or or supply chains, uh you can name it, or produce or build more data centers, essentially.
00:19:55.359 -->
00:20:01.599Do you see the people who want to use stable coins view USDC and USDT as a dollar?
00:20:01.599 -->
00:20:07.519Or do they view it as just a mechanism to be able to send money overseas efficiently?
00:20:07.519 -->
00:20:09.039Like I'm an American.
00:20:09.039 -->
00:20:12.640When I think about USDT and USDC, I hear USD, right?
00:20:12.640 -->
00:20:18.640I see that as a as a you know US currency, or you know, in this case, US debt.
00:20:18.640 -->
00:20:25.359But I think a lot of the world doesn't necessarily associate it with, hey, the US is involved in my transaction in some way, shape, or form.
00:20:25.359 -->
00:20:26.799They just want the money to get there.
00:20:26.799 -->
00:20:33.519How do you think these people view the stable coin, USD or US US, sorry, USDC or USDT in relation to the US?
00:20:33.839 -->
00:20:36.559Well, first, we're not an anti-dollar nation.
00:20:36.559 -->
00:20:37.279Yeah, absolutely.
00:20:37.279 -->
00:20:38.000That's what I'm saying.
00:20:38.000 -->
00:20:38.319Absolutely.
00:20:38.319 -->
00:20:43.039So we, I mean, 95% of trading volumes happens on USD pairs.
00:20:43.039 -->
00:20:48.480So even between Japan and Taiwan or Korea and Taiwan, everything happens on USD.
00:20:48.480 -->
00:20:49.759USD as well, actually.
00:20:49.759 -->
00:21:00.720So if Genius at we're we're gonna get past anytime soon, I think it will forces all these nations to be able to adapt to stable coins and asking and sell, what can I do with it?
00:21:00.720 -->
00:21:08.160So again, it it is already pretty handy and easy to for us to wire money from Taiwan to US or US to Taiwan.
00:21:08.160 -->
00:21:10.160But the question is, can we make it better?
00:21:10.160 -->
00:21:11.359Can we make it more productive?
00:21:11.680 -->
00:21:13.359And can you expand that geography?
00:21:13.359 -->
00:21:17.839Like to your point, I think the US and Taiwan have some pretty good banking infrastructure already, right?
00:21:17.839 -->
00:21:18.640They need to.
00:21:18.880 -->
00:21:25.680Yeah, so I mean, again, like I said, Taiwan produced goods, manufactured goods to across the world, it's not only US.
00:21:25.680 -->
00:21:30.880Out of 10 AIPCs in the future, six of them or seven of them will be produced, manufactured by Taiwanese companies.
00:21:30.880 -->
00:21:36.880If they want to tackle the global audience in terms of payment methods, right next to credit card checkout, there's gonna be stable coins.
00:21:36.960 -->
00:21:37.279Yes.
00:21:37.440 -->
00:21:48.960So the way I look at stable coins would become a strong payment method alongside where a lot of these enterprises will leverage so that they can pay lower fees compared to RTP Rails from all these different nations.
00:21:48.960 -->
00:21:54.079I mean, if there's a hundred million dollars trading volume, I mean buying volumes, you're saving a couple percent.
00:21:54.079 -->
00:21:58.400Essentially, you're adding a couple more million dollars to your balance sheet as a list of companies.
00:21:58.720 -->
00:21:59.839Couple percent adds up when we're talking about.
00:21:59.839 -->
00:22:03.839Talking about 360 billion or whatever number you gave me before.
00:22:04.160 -->
00:22:16.720I think the BDB sector for Taiwan, Taiwan and US are definitely not as strong as the two as other cases compared to Africa or Latin America's, but the interesting use case is something that we're constantly explore with the companies.
00:22:17.200 -->
00:22:23.279What do Taiwanese AI companies and Taiwanese financial institutions that deal with these AI companies?
00:22:23.279 -->
00:22:26.640What do they get right about stable coins when you walk into a room with them?
00:22:26.640 -->
00:22:29.759And what do they get wrong about stable coins when you walk into a room with them?
00:22:30.079 -->
00:22:35.359Well, we we have pitched over 30 plus enterprises, 10 plus different banks.
00:22:35.359 -->
00:22:41.519Banks are very open, as in like they know it's inevitable in a way that this is gonna get passed one way or the others.
00:22:41.519 -->
00:22:44.720But enterprises are overly conservative.
00:22:44.720 -->
00:22:52.640You know, I think I think the way we look at Asia, especially APAC enterprises, their CFO department, financial department, they are hired to be conservative.
00:22:52.799 -->
00:22:53.039Yes.
00:22:53.519 -->
00:22:59.519I don't think there's gonna be a a day where all these CFOs are like, hey, let's use stable coins because it's legal right now.
00:22:59.680 -->
00:22:59.839Yeah.
00:23:00.000 -->
00:23:07.839So it would definitely take time to educate and then really cultivate the notions of this new money movements for these enterprises.
00:23:07.839 -->
00:23:25.119But I think what Capital Air has done very well for the last few months for all these air supply chain companies in Taiwan is that we're we're essentially educating them that the future of payments, not only largely depending on credit card or these uh transaction portals, you guys can actually leverage stablecoin, which is free.
00:23:25.200 -->
00:23:25.440Yeah.
00:23:25.759 -->
00:23:29.759You don't have to settle with this Visa MasterCard or all these local RTP rail.
00:23:29.759 -->
00:23:36.799Even ACH in the US charge uh quite a few fee, quite quite a bit, quite a few bips, actually, compared to a lot of enterprises overseas.
00:23:36.799 -->
00:23:47.039So I don't think stablecoins are gonna hear it's it's gonna overtake all these credit card or fiat transfers, but it will become one of the strongest methods for all these enterprises.
00:23:47.359 -->
00:23:47.680I agree.
00:23:47.680 -->
00:23:55.839I think a lot of the times when people talk about AI, they talk about you know jumping into a rapidly growing business and they view it as a bubble.
00:23:55.839 -->
00:24:04.079But the way I see it is like if you ask yourself not what's gonna change in 10 years and build for it, but what's not going to change in 10 years?
00:24:04.079 -->
00:24:10.720What's not going to change in 10 years is that AI will get better and that people will want that AI cheaper.
00:24:10.880 -->
00:24:11.119Yeah.
00:24:11.279 -->
00:24:14.400And I think that's exactly what you guys are building for.
00:24:14.400 -->
00:24:21.519Is how can I use more AI and how can I get that compute or get the infrastructure that I need in the cheapest way possible?
00:24:21.519 -->
00:24:22.480Is that fair?
00:24:22.799 -->
00:24:23.119Yeah.
00:24:23.119 -->
00:24:38.000Well, if I mean, if you look at an exporting number between Taiwan and US, $300 over a billion dollars, if you can improve the money movement by just by a few percent, essentially you're looking at the largest chunk of uh savings or reinvesting opportunities for these enterprises.
00:24:38.000 -->
00:24:43.200But again, I think we we come from Asia, like Taiwan, where we're fully based in Taipei.
00:24:43.200 -->
00:24:47.839We're more of exploring use cases rather than relying on B2B payment sectors.
00:24:47.839 -->
00:24:54.079Because uh every dollar, like I said, every dollar that flows to Taiwan will be monetized by the central bank of Taiwan as well.
00:24:54.079 -->
00:24:56.240So hopefully we could give out more good news.
00:24:56.240 -->
00:24:56.559Yeah.
00:24:56.559 -->
00:25:00.079I think by next year, I don't wanna blush too much on this.
00:25:00.079 -->
00:25:06.799I think you guys know Company Tex, largest AI expos in the entire planet, will happen next year in type 8.
00:25:07.039 -->
00:25:07.440Amazing.
00:25:07.680 -->
00:25:10.240We are gonna announce something extraordinary with stable coins.
00:25:10.400 -->
00:25:10.960I love that.
00:25:11.200 -->
00:25:13.200So the way you look at payments is gonna change.
00:25:13.200 -->
00:25:15.039The way we use money is gonna change as well.
00:25:15.279 -->
00:25:20.720Listen, let's let's run this back next year and we'll we'll do the big announcement together.
00:25:20.720 -->
00:25:23.119So very, very much appreciate you coming on.
00:25:23.119 -->
00:25:25.119What do you want to leave people with out here?
00:25:25.119 -->
00:25:27.519What should they know about Capital Layer that they don't already?
00:25:27.839 -->
00:25:34.559Yeah, well, we're on a track to work with quite a few data centers that already are gonna be built by Taiwanese suppliers.
00:25:34.559 -->
00:25:48.160And then once these neo-clouds providers are enabling stablecoins as a payment methods, we can re-implement implement it into AI device, which is our investors, big up by Assus, Acer, will penetrate all these AI device producers.
00:25:48.160 -->
00:25:53.519There's gonna be quite interesting collaboration because right now every device has default wallets.
00:25:53.519 -->
00:25:56.640Yeah, and then default wallet will have stablecoin methods and credit cards.
00:25:56.640 -->
00:26:05.519Imagine how many people in Latin Americas or Africa start paying, start consuming computes, all these AI uh Taiwanese data centers using stable coins.
00:26:05.599 -->
00:26:05.759Yeah.
00:26:05.920 -->
00:26:08.000So I think that's gonna be exciting to see.
00:26:08.240 -->
00:26:08.720Amazing.
00:26:08.720 -->
00:26:10.000Thank you so much for coming on.
00:26:10.000 -->
00:26:15.440You and I have about three more hours of questions and answers that I want to throw at you, but we're out of time.
00:26:15.440 -->
00:26:16.400Justin, thank you.
00:26:16.400 -->
00:26:17.680Thank you so much for coming.
00:26:17.680 -->
00:26:20.319I appreciate you answering my barrage of questions.
00:26:20.319 -->
00:26:23.599And like I said, we're gonna we're gonna do this again in a year and catch back up.
00:26:23.839 -->
00:26:24.559I'll see you in Singapore.
00:26:24.799 -->
00:26:25.200Awesome.
00:26:25.200 -->
00:26:25.839Love it.
