469 | How Auctions Really Work: The Hybrids, Negotiations & Courageously Uncomfortable Reserve Prices - Chat with Justin Nickerson

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Alright, folks, welcome back to the Property Couch podcast and have we got a great episode for you?
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Today we are interviewing an auctioneer at the pinnacle of his game band and he talks all about the art of auctioning.
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What else do we cover?
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Bryce, you also gives us an insight into that.
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You know dealing or fighting, that emotional feeling you get when you're actually bidding or selling at auction.
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So some absolute gold there and hang around to the end of the show.
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And what's making Property News?
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We just give you a little bit of an update in terms of what's happening around auction clearance rates around the country.
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Oh, lots to cover folks, let's rip into the show.
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Welcome to the Property Couch where, each week, you get to listen to two of Australia's leading property and money experts Bryce Holdaway, co-host of Location Location, location Australia on Foxtel's Lifestyle Channel and co-host of Escape from the City on the ABC.
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And Ben Kingsley, chair of Property Investors Council of Australia and a back-to-back winner of the Property Investment Advisor of the Year Award, and both are partners of the multi-award winning Empower Wealth, co-creators of Moor, the Freelife Style Design app, as well as bestselling authors of the Armchair Guide to Property Investing and Make Money Simple Again.
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Stay tuned as they bring you the Insiders Guide to Property Finance and Money Management All right folks.
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Welcome back to the Property Couch podcast and welcome back to you, mate.
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How are you?
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Mate, I'm terrific, and you.
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I'm doing good, mate.
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If you haven't looked at today being Thursday, the 23rd of November, mate, we are well and truly in the shadows of the end of the year.
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We are.
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And, importantly, for our listeners.
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Ben, we are in the shadows of summer series and have we got some incredible guests lined up this year.
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I'm super excited to bring some stories of transformation.
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Yeah, look, we obviously love this time of the year.
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It's a time of year where we can focus on really how we organise our finances, and then also some great stories about people who are having success both with money management but also with their property stories.
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There are some really great property stories that we want to share in there as well, so that's property investment mastery that we're exploring as well.
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So, folks, as you start to think towards Christmas pudding, getting the caravan on the back, going for a long break down south wherever you are up north in some cases, ben, I suppose I'm bringing my Perth lingo there Get your podcast queued up because there's going to be some rippers.
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But today we've got a ripper show too.
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Ben, we've got a very special guest.
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We are talking to one of the professionals in the real estate game who is at the top of the mountain when it comes to auctioneering and gives us some incredible insights.
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That because the challenge when you talk to an auctioneer, ben, is to try and get them to obviously display their skills in their craft and what they're passionate about from the seller side.
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But we want to actually hear some of the gold from the buyer side and we're certainly excited to say that that's going to happen today.
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But before we get there, I'm going to go to my mindset minute theme today Ben Jim Rowne.
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I've been listening and watching to a ton of Jim Rowne stuff because my two I reckon my two personal growth heroes are Jim Rowne's Exiglera and their old school.
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With some incredible wisdom, jim Rowne, the farmer from Idaho, can hear his voice.
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It's so iconic, right?
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But he's got the saying, ben, that things don't just happen, they happen just.
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And I've thought about that, I've used that a lot and I speak about it with my wife because it's kind of just like sometimes it's not this random axe, sometimes things are part of a destiny, part of a bigger plan, a bunch of synchronicities that come along that you think that might look random, but they're not.
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So he says it best when he says things don't just happen, they happen just.
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And so why am I bringing up, ben?
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I feel like there's another one that one of our friends, peter Kooleesos, said in this particular lane where you can flip it and spin it.
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It was at the Pippa Conference 2023,.
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You were there, ben, and he said this you don't wait to buy a real estate, you buy a real estate and wait.
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Ha, let that land.
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And just shout out to Veronica who put that across my bow, veronica Morgan, that is, but you don't wait to buy a real estate, you buy a real estate and wait.
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And so, as I reflected on that for our audience today, ben, sadly, most people won't be financially successful because of the simplicity of that.
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I think it must be something else, but it is just as simple as that.
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We got a reminder recently, listened to the Jan Summers episode, which is my favorite, ben, because of just the significance of my journey around.
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Everything was sparked through Jan, and it could have been her saying this very thing you don't wait to buy a real estate, you buy a real estate and wait.
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And that is it, folks.
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That is the game.
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It's funny, bryce, and last week, literally last Friday, I was thinking of this particular point.
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You're either a real estate buyer or you're not, and it's the same sort of context in the sense that you're either a real estate owner or buyer or you're not, and so that comes back to that action point.
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So yeah, I mean it's just, I get into these Twitter or X feeds and I see all these people that are telling us about the challenges and all of that.
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You know it's rigged, the system's rigged.
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There's too much.
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You know the government needs to do something about it.
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You know someone else needs to fix my problem.
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You're either a real estate owner or you're not.
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You're not, I like it.
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469 episodes later, Ben, I can summarize our thesis on this right Spend less than you earn.
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Invest the difference and wait.
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You don't have to listen to anything else.
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Make action.
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There we go.
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That's it.
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We are super excited to have our very special guest today.
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As I said before, his name is Justin Nickerson.
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Next cut to the interview you and I recently had with Justin Alright, Ben, we've got a very special guest today on the Property Couch we are chatting with Justin Nickerson.
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He is the director of Apollo Auctions, the largest auctioneering business in Australasia, overseeing more than 6,000 auctions in 2022.
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Fresh from speaking at the 25th anniversary of ARIC, which is Australasia's largest real estate conference, and he's formally recognized as the leading auctioneer across Australasia, he brings a refreshing understanding to the modern challenges facing the real estate industry in 2023.
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Justin is the only Australian to win the Australasian Auctioneer of the Year three times in the history of the award.
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He's also a five-time winner of the REIQ Auctioneer of the Year award, again being the only auctioneer in the state to achieve the distinction.
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Justin was also the winner of the inaugural Australasian Auctioneering Competition at ARIC in 2018.
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He works hand in hand with some of Australasia's leading real estate businesses on an auctioneering and coaching level.
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Welcome to the Property Couch Justin.
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Thanks for having me.
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I only just realized how many times Australasia got mentioned there in that first intro, but good to know, so I appreciate you having me.
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Well, it's fair to say there's a reasonable pedigree to your background professionally, which we'll get to know shortly.
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And yes, it did test my abilities to say Australasia, so I think everyone will pick that up.
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Before we do get into your professional background, we'd like to start with all of our guests on the podcast, just to get to know them through money back story.
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So we're interested to know what were the conversations that you had growing up with your parents, perhaps over the dinner table, what you saw around money.
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Yeah it is.
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It's a really good question.
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I think my parents instilled from a pretty early age the importance of all kind of work equaling money.
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That money is not something that you just receive or gets handed to you.
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It comes off the back of an action or something you do.
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So, like most kids growing up in the, I won't give away my age here, but giving away many years ago I had the Commonwealth Bank SuperSaver account that you sort of put your dollar or two dollars in every week and that kind of taught you that the accumulation of money really and the power of that.
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But like most people, I had the chores that resulted in money.
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I remember one of my chores was weeding the backyard.
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So if I weeded the backyard I'd get a bit of pocket money to there.
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So, I think they were very big on the building that basis of if you want something, you have to work towards it.
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It doesn't just get handed to you or you just don't go and buy instantly and have that instant gratification reward.
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So that was a big thing, I guess, a foundational lesson that got sort of taught to me early on and something that we're trying to pass on now.
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I've got a three year old daughter and she's just started doing chores now and she feeds the dog and gets a silver coin, or a similar coin, as she calls it, but it's a silver coin and we're trying to teach her.
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When you get to a certain number of silver coins you can exchange up for a gold coin and so on and so forth.
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So we're at the coffee shop this morning, ashley, she pulled out of three silver coins and, much to her disappointment, it didn't result in a gold coin.
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But that was a good lesson for her this morning.
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So we'll see what that translates and looks like in 20 or so years time.
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So, justin, that built out some sort of building habits around behavioural.
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Were there any other brothers and sisters in the household and did they develop a sort of similar understanding of the value of money and a bit of delayed gratification like you did?
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Yeah, very much so I've got an older sister and a younger brother as well, and we're probably all the similar mindset around that.
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I think none of us really are probably materialistic people.
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You know that will probably spend money for the sake of it, I guess, as you accumulate more money, that it becomes much harder for that delay gratification thing to be in place.
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It's easy to have delay gratification when you can't afford to buy something.
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When you can afford to buy it.
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It's much, much more challenging.
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And it's a resource that my wife would no doubt say that I probably struggle with it a little bit, that if I see something I generally want it and want it quickly.
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So I think, on a big level, big purchases and significant things.
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You know that importance of talking through decisions, making sure you really want something before you go and sort of set a plan to achieve it.
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That's probably consistent through myself and both my siblings as well.
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And did you have a money system in terms of as you started earning money?
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We'll talk about your real estate career in a minute but did you sort of have a system of managing money in terms of as you're growing up and your savings habits and how you look after your money?
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Yeah, I think we had a kind of scribe, a spreadsheet that you sort of recorded how much money you were saving, and that I'm watching that go, and then you pull out the statements and see what the interest that you had on the money was there.
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So that was probably the most basic and RK system that I had around it and again that early lesson for me was just around accumulation.
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You know you have X and then if you work hard and you don't frivolously spend it, you know in eight weeks time X becomes Y and then Y gives you the capacity to build into Z and kind of so on and so forth.
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And I think when you're you know you're early twenties or your teens or even earlier than that.
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That's different to what it looks like when you become, you know, an adult or a responsible adult, but the lesson and the basic premise of it is definitely still the same.
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Do you remember the first time you discovered the power of compounding?
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I think I'm going to travel memory, so fight against me in these situations.
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But there was one where where I'd saved and I had basically was like a salary sacrifice, where I had a certain amount of money that went into kind of a kind of term deposit sort of account and it's one that was direct evident in my pay.
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So I didn't worry about it and I actually forgot about it for 18 months or so and then circle back, found it and then realized, you know, by me just not even consciously thinking about it and putting it there, plus the bank, you know, playing their part of their role.
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It's amazing how what I became what it was.
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So that was a really kind of basic, basic lesson of that and I think you know the more that this stuff gets taught earlier on, the better.
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Financial literacy is such an important thing for when you come into your particularly a late teen, early adult years, because you know it's the first time you really come into access with money and at that stage you can do a lot with that.
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But if it takes you a decade to work it out, you're sort of starting behind the eight or a lot of ways.
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Yeah, where did?
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Can you remember the spark for getting your own property started, justin?
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Was it early when you started becoming independent, having your first job, or was there?
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Was there a period where you just wanted to spend the money?
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Where can you remember the pivot towards okay, buying property for yourself became a priority.
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Yeah, I'd never.
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I'd never really thought about it.
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It hadn't ever really sort of crossed crossed my mind.
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I was very fortunate, my.
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When I grew up, we we all my parents owned every house we lived in.
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So I'd never had an experience around renting in terms of my parents renting.
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When I first left home, I rented for a big period there.
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So that was kind of experience as to how rentals work.
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And the thing that really struck me was the limited control that you have.
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You know, you you want to put a picture up on the wall and you kind of feel bad about creating a hole there.
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You want to change the floor, the floor plan, the layout, anything substantial, and you either need permission or you can't do it, whereas when you it's your home, you can do as you like.
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And that was the biggest thing that probably spurred me towards wanting to own rather than rent.
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It wasn't so much that I'm not, I'm paying money and it's not going to pay off mortgage or anything.
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It was more that, hey, if it's my home, I can feel like it's my home and I can do as I as I please with it.
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When I first came out of school, I was doing business degree and working for the AFL and I spent a bit of time in central and North Queensland and we moved to.
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I moved to Mackay and I was pretty young I was probably on the 18 or 19 to live in Mackay for a period of time and the rental prices in Mackay at that stage were really really high because they had the mining boom, people coming in, fly, fly, fly, fly workers coming in and out, so the rentals were quite expensive Whereas the property prices hadn't quite caught up yet.
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So purely from a financial point of view it just made better sense to to buy something rather than rent it.
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And, thankfully, a bit of support for my parents, which I was very lucky to have and I understand and appreciate not everyone has that, but I was certainly lucky enough to have that manage to buy a property time to pretty well on the side of a boom, made a, made a bit of money out of it, thought, how easy is this?
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You know you just buy a house and it goes up a lot of value and then you sell it and you have more money which I can.
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I had to build back on the second one.
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So it was a repeat story that one, but that was my first thing and then even that sort of sparked a bit of a love affair or curiosity around real estate.
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You know how a real estate agent does their job, how the negotiation process unfolds, the positioning of a buyer, positioning of a seller, you know all that.
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And then it's kind of sparked a curiosity that probably still lives to this day so funny how things work and fates sort of intertwined.
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But that was my first kind of really launch into into property and in North Queens, out of all places, Well, you've given us a segue to talk about your spark into real estate, but before we go there, can you, can you, tell us a little bit about that second property?
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It sounds like you had a look, like you had a smoke on your face there, so is there something interesting there?
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Yeah, I don't like telling this story as much as I like telling the first one, but I think you're going to earn your losses as much as you earn your wins.
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So I bought a property back, like moved back to wartime so home for me was in the North side of Brisbane bought a property back here when I came back after selling the one in Mackay and it was, you know, it's up over the North side of Brisbane it had a bit of a water glimpse.
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So that kind of really grabbed me and I've always, even to today, like a view is really important to me in terms of property decisions, I mean in terms of PPRs, but having something to look at, whether it be a water, ocean, city, hinterland, something that's that's a really important thing to me.
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And this, this property, had a view of the water which kind of really grabbed me in.
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The problem was I had to buy for Savlo owner, which can either work out really well or really badly, and for me it turned out to be the second one.
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She just refused basically to negotiate.
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The price was the price.
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I was emotionally invested and had very little kind of self control or negotiation skills at that point in time.
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So I accepted her price she wouldn't allow me to build a pest, which I also accepted.
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Yeah.
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So all these, lessons that you know you learn later on.
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Another house was falling down or anything but so now for a board.
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it realized there were some issues there that needed rectifying, so it cost cost me a bit of money, but it was also timing.
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I just bought it at a bad time near the GFC when I came to sell it.
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You know, a couple of years later lost money on it, let alone stamp duties, repayments, money put into it like all of that.
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So yeah, good lesson.
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You know, if I think, if I, if I'd sold that one at a win as well, I probably would have made my mistake on the third one, because at some point you need to get your confidence shook to to really understand the realities of it.
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But both of them were good lessons in a way, as to the upside and the downside.
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But also, you know, when you do make big decisions you've got to really be careful and think through it and try and fight that emotional brain as much as you can.
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Justin, I'm interested in your view on how you see property as a wealth creation vehicle, because you you are in the game as an agent, meaning that transactions are how you earn a living, and yet you've experienced property, you've seen your parents, you've had an experience.
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On the second one, do you what's your, what's your worldview on real estate as a place to park your income and hold properties in in perpetuity?
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Because a lot of your peers see as it is something that I'll get to next year, whereas but they're at the coal face of the greatest show in our view on in the investment landscape.
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So do you what's your sort of 10, 20 year view of property, separate to your ability to earn an income from property?
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Yeah, I'm probably not as, not as advanced in my thinking of this as some of other people that you know contemporaries that typically do a lot of work with, but my understanding of it has always just been that I think I like investing in things that you can touch and feel, and a property you can touch and feel when it's present.
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That's always been, for me, the biggest.
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The biggest thing it's drew me to properly, rather than shares or things that are you can't physically touch them and certainly have no impact.
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So for me, it's things like you know, property or businesses.
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You know you can have an impact upon those kinds of things, the things where I feel like there's some semblance of control.
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But also I can touch it and feel it and that's why, for me, crypto like I might understand that crypto would be a four out of 100 or 400,000, it's very limited, but that's always been the thing that I really struggled with is I can't.
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I can't touch it and feel it.
00:19:20.150 --> 00:19:21.784
Therefore, I don't feel connected to it.
00:19:22.800 --> 00:19:42.820
So I think property for most people should be a really central or integral part of your strategy, and it's also one of the rare things that you can, you can invest into and enjoy the benefit of it while you do it, and particularly probably recently, now that you know our family's starting to grow and probably more on the let's enjoy it side of it than a pure great financial decision.
00:19:42.820 --> 00:19:57.281
But I think the two can coexist and run run side by side, and I think the ability of what property can do for a variety of purposes and means is really unmatched by pretty much any other investment and people.
00:19:57.281 --> 00:20:00.971
Again, this this is the semblance of understanding is so important.
00:20:00.971 --> 00:20:10.097
I think the other thing that's always run sort of be ran home to me from my own mindset is that if I'm in, like you said, I'm at the cop being an oxy.
00:20:10.097 --> 00:20:12.865
I'm at the cold face of negotiating all the time.
00:20:12.865 --> 00:20:15.552
You know we effectively negotiate from living with buyers and sellers.
00:20:16.100 --> 00:20:16.160
If.
00:20:16.241 --> 00:20:22.228
I'm going to help and advise people to make decisions at certain point at times I have to be living and breathing that existence as well.
00:20:22.228 --> 00:20:28.988
So if I'm telling people, hey, this is how you should, you know, buy a property, I, when I try my property, should be living and breathing that.
00:20:28.988 --> 00:20:41.230
And if you are someone who's at the cold face and you're an agent and you've never been bored or sold, it's important you have that experience, because lived experience is the best experience for you to be able to pass on, pass advice on.
00:20:41.230 --> 00:20:46.432
So for me, if property wasn't a big part of my life yet I made my living from it I'd feel fraudulent.
00:20:46.432 --> 00:20:52.625
So it's important for me to keep relevant for my own experiences, to be able to sort of represent that in the job that I do.
00:20:53.900 --> 00:21:09.212
Well, justin, you're speaking to the converted here, so it's an easy conversation that the three of us are having, but it's a nice little segue in terms of telling us the story about how you got in and moved across from sounds like you're working for the AFL, moving into to real estate.
00:21:09.212 --> 00:21:14.665
So tell us that little, that little journey to to obviously then becoming one of Australia's preeminent auctioneers.
00:21:16.826 --> 00:21:18.653
Yeah, it seems like a long time ago now.
00:21:18.653 --> 00:21:21.785
It probably isn't in terms of years, but it does seem like a long time ago.
00:21:21.960 --> 00:21:23.306
So when I was working for the AFL.
00:21:23.306 --> 00:21:32.052
I enjoyed it but always probably saw it as a limited career path in terms of what I wanted out of life and what was most important to me.
00:21:32.052 --> 00:21:37.412
So came to the junction after a couple of years in North Queensland to sort of decide what I wanted to do.
00:21:37.412 --> 00:21:42.312
What I knew I wanted to do, like like a lot of people, is I wanted to wear nice clothes.
00:21:42.312 --> 00:21:50.148
I wanted to play an important role in whatever that role looked like and at some point drive a nice car or live in a nice house.
00:21:51.041 --> 00:21:58.950
And honestly, if you want to do those things and you don't have a degree behind you, 99 times out of 100, the answer tends to be real estate, rightly or wrongly.
00:21:58.950 --> 00:22:02.890
So we we joke that real estate a lot of times is a second chance occupation.
00:22:02.890 --> 00:22:07.391
It's usually the occupation you do when your first occupation hasn't exactly gone to, gone to plan.
00:22:07.391 --> 00:22:16.144
I think there's very few people unless you're a generational real estate agent that come through year 10 or year 11 and say I cannot wait to graduate so I can get out there and start selling form sixes.
00:22:17.041 --> 00:22:18.946
Like it's not really the it's.
00:22:19.026 --> 00:22:20.730
it's sort of like that hasn't worked out.
00:22:20.730 --> 00:22:26.332
It was a pretty easy barrier to entry in this one and I can earn reasonably good money if I'm good at it.
00:22:26.332 --> 00:22:29.769
So therefore, I'm going to give the crack and that's, that's undoubtedly what attracted me.
00:22:29.769 --> 00:22:50.127
I came back, decided you know, whatever my boots were, I became an agent for three years, which was really important for me as a grounding for what I do now, because it gives you not only a fun, a foundational understanding of buying and selling property, but, most importantly, it gives you an insight as to how agents think.
00:22:50.127 --> 00:23:00.628
And our client base as auctioneers is agents, not the general public the general public, maybe, who pays us and who we come into contact with, but our repeat client basis, agents, that's who our relationships are with.
00:23:00.628 --> 00:23:10.162
So for me to be the best in my role, I need to understand how an agent thinks, what pressures they under, how do they feel about this, how they feel about that, and that's become.
00:23:10.162 --> 00:23:15.085
That was a really valuable thing After that kind of three years of being an agent.
00:23:15.245 --> 00:23:17.231
I'd seen auctions, I'd seen auctioneers.
00:23:18.181 --> 00:23:21.690
I thought that's the sort of path I really want to kind of pursue and go down.
00:23:22.480 --> 00:23:30.830
I was fortunate enough to come in, come into contact with a really good auctioneer at the time, a guy called Jason Andrew who was my sort of first mentor.
00:23:30.830 --> 00:23:44.114
He ran an auctioneering course that was kind of a thinly veiled recruitment recruitment course but did its job and at the end of that made the decision to join become a full-time auctioneer.
00:23:44.114 --> 00:24:02.410
So it was interesting because you mentioned my parents and I bring this up to my parents a lot but they actually wrote me a letter telling me not to, or not telling me not to, expressing their concern that my three years of investment as an agent and the skills were going to go to waste on space and going to be starting again, which was a fair point at the time.
00:24:02.410 --> 00:24:06.951
And look, in the first six months or a year of my career they'll probably be right.
00:24:06.951 --> 00:24:14.888
But then, like everything, if you work at it for hard enough, for long enough, you know you'll eventually sort of turn in your favor and that's kind of what transpired.
00:24:15.960 --> 00:24:16.925
Where did that resolve come from?
00:24:16.925 --> 00:24:21.412
Because, from my observation, auctioneering is definitely not for everyone.
00:24:21.412 --> 00:24:31.215
It's a public speaking role and you've got to be, you've got to improvise, you've got to be quick on your feet and you've got to have a healthy amount of swag, all right.
00:24:31.215 --> 00:24:37.417
So where did you find the resolve to go?
00:24:37.417 --> 00:24:38.540
Because that's pretty powerful.
00:24:38.540 --> 00:24:44.313
Mum and Dad writing you a letter to say are you sure do you want to put it into reverse and go back to that?
00:24:44.313 --> 00:24:46.107
That requires some resolve.
00:24:46.107 --> 00:24:47.343
What did you lean on?
00:24:47.343 --> 00:24:51.206
Clearly, there was this guy who's probably trained you that you could act as a mentor.
00:24:51.206 --> 00:24:55.875
But in some of those sort of dark mental moments, how did you navigate that?
00:24:57.592 --> 00:25:10.578
Well, he was a great mentor in terms of teaching me skills, but he was also, I guess, a bit of a North Star to show this is what your life could look like if you stick at it, and that was probably really important.
00:25:10.578 --> 00:25:28.255
Like, we talk about visible role models all the time, One of the challenges our occupation has is a lack of female representation, and I always come back to the fact that we don't have enough visible female role models as auctioneers to then inspire the next generation to sort of keep going and coming through.
00:25:28.255 --> 00:25:34.894
Like I think if you look at them till is there a great example right Female soccer in Australia or female football, depending on what you call.
00:25:34.894 --> 00:25:41.595
It is gonna be a really good shape for the next decade, because now there's a visible role model or a team of visible role models to say I wanna be like that person.
00:25:42.130 --> 00:25:48.437
So, for me, jason played a really important role, literally teaching me, but also guiding me, just by who he was and his presence.
00:25:48.437 --> 00:25:49.752
You know, I'm a dad.
00:25:49.752 --> 00:25:51.772
I've always got your best interests at heart.
00:25:51.772 --> 00:25:59.540
They weren't the best for you, and the best for me at that stage they were probably right, probably was not to deviate off the path that I had.
00:25:59.540 --> 00:26:05.375
They rightfully pointed out that I'd done the hard yards, in that I sort of started to come into a little bit of success while I was trying to steer off this.
00:26:06.010 --> 00:26:19.435
The thing that I kept coming back to, though, was that it's funny around public speaking, because I didn't like public speaking at school even coming out of school was unnatural, or a foreign public speaker never did debating never did anything of that.
00:26:19.435 --> 00:26:20.795
In fact, I didn't really enjoy it.
00:26:20.795 --> 00:26:34.038
What I loved, though, is negotiation, and that's what kept drawing me in is that if you're an auctioneer yeah, we do auctions and we call a lot, you know, absolutely, and the call is important, but what's really important to our role is negotiation.
00:26:34.038 --> 00:26:40.897
The most fulfilling auctions are not the ones where you have lots of bidding and they sell past reserve and you knock it down and you look like a hero.
00:26:40.897 --> 00:26:49.175
The ones that they're really fulfilling are the ones where you're in a back room for 30 minutes, 40 minutes, 50 minutes, helping an agent drag a deal across the line between a seller and a buyer.
00:26:49.175 --> 00:26:50.596
That's actually the most rewarding ones.
00:26:50.596 --> 00:27:02.438
And that's what I just kept coming back to was I feel like I can be good at this and I feel like if I keep working out, I'll get the opportunity to do this a lot, which exactly kind of what's manifested itself now.
00:27:02.438 --> 00:27:05.999
So, yeah, it took a lot of hard work.
00:27:06.210 --> 00:27:07.435
The swagger thing, I'd argue.
00:27:07.435 --> 00:27:09.355
I probably still don't have swagger.
00:27:09.355 --> 00:27:09.832
I think it's.
00:27:09.832 --> 00:27:14.396
I have confidence in what I do, but confidence, you know, for me it comes after skill, not before.
00:27:14.396 --> 00:27:18.755
So it took a long time to get that confidence, but I definitely think you need to.
00:27:18.755 --> 00:27:22.299
You need there's two things you need to be as a good auctioneer.
00:27:22.299 --> 00:27:28.035
One is you need to be able to count, like that's a basic skill, like if you can't add up, auctioneering is probably just not for you.
00:27:28.035 --> 00:27:30.356
And the other one is your right price.
00:27:30.356 --> 00:27:30.838
You identify.
00:27:30.838 --> 00:27:31.854
You're gonna be quick on your feet.
00:27:31.854 --> 00:27:38.874
If you can have a quick wit or a quick ability to think on your feet and respond, then you can just about learn everything else other than counting.
00:27:39.790 --> 00:27:46.520
And that's probably the attribute that I've always had, even if it was buried deep beneath at that stage.
00:27:46.520 --> 00:27:57.474
I've always, I guess, been pretty quick in my mind to be able to respond to things or to think on my feet, and as I become an auctioneer and growing, that served me kind of really well and become, I guess, one of my hallmarks.
00:27:58.297 --> 00:27:59.040
I've seen you in action.
00:27:59.040 --> 00:28:10.938
I mean the swagger comes from the confidence in your own ability, right, and I think that it's just my observation of you and it's only from an outsider is it's just, it's a healthy swagger, right?
00:28:10.938 --> 00:28:13.377
So I mean that a positive.
00:28:13.377 --> 00:28:26.257
What I found interesting is what you just said is is a, and it's really refreshing is that a, an auctioneer, is remunerated from getting the deal done and moving on to the next one.
00:28:26.257 --> 00:28:34.263
And yet you, you, you said that you get most joy by sticking around and making that negotiation happen.
00:28:34.390 --> 00:28:43.911
So I guess that's probably for anyone who's listening to this cause we most of our audiences from the buy side, but there are some listing agents that listen to us, I think.
00:28:43.911 --> 00:29:00.533
I think there's some some success leave includes there, you, you, you are in the battlefield enjoying the craft of the negotiation, and then you let the scoreboard take care of itself later, which is, which is nice, cause I guess it could be easy for an auctioneer to get caught up in.
00:29:00.533 --> 00:29:06.918
I've got my nine o'clock one, I've got my 12, 31, I've got my three and just keep moving, and it's a results based business.
00:29:06.918 --> 00:29:07.954
So that's nice and refreshing.
00:29:08.470 --> 00:29:09.554
There's two things I'll say on that.
00:29:09.554 --> 00:29:10.498
I'm sorry to cut you off.
00:29:10.498 --> 00:29:15.974
The first thing is we say to auctioneers all the time that having a great call is important, but what will?
00:29:15.974 --> 00:29:17.770
What will keep agents booking you time off?
00:29:17.770 --> 00:29:20.159
The time is when you can help get a deal across the line.
00:29:20.159 --> 00:29:21.335
They wouldn't have done their own.
00:29:21.335 --> 00:29:24.916
That's the actual, really integral part, Cause that results in them getting paid.
00:29:24.916 --> 00:29:25.813
They feel good about it.
00:29:25.813 --> 00:29:27.934
They feel good about it, they, they re-engage us.
00:29:28.830 --> 00:29:39.679
The second thing is that you, you know, if you looked at the Saturday so last Saturday, for example, I had 15 auctions on Saturday If I sat down in the morning and thought about the factor of 15 auctions, that becomes overpowering.
00:29:39.770 --> 00:29:42.980
And also you start thinking about I'm not going to make it here, I'll be late to this one.
00:29:42.980 --> 00:29:51.278
You know my, my thought process always around, that is that I'm present at the auction from the moment that I'm driving to it to the moment I leave for it.
00:29:51.278 --> 00:29:53.418
That auction is the one that's the most important one.
00:29:53.418 --> 00:30:10.717
The next one will be there when I get to the next one, Cause if I go into an auction thinking about my next auction, that happens after that one and I've got a 28 minute travel time to that and it's, you know, that's going to influence the way I behave in terms of treating buyers, treating sellers, the speed of my call, those kinds of things.
00:30:10.717 --> 00:30:16.659
So you just have to be present for the one that's right there and let the next one be present when it's time for that one to present itself.
00:30:17.670 --> 00:30:19.016
So, justin, I mean a credit to you.
00:30:19.016 --> 00:30:23.439
I mean, if we know the Queensland market, it's not a big auction market, right?
00:30:23.439 --> 00:30:25.497
So it's, you know, like where is Victoria?
00:30:25.497 --> 00:30:34.839
Melbourne is pretty much the capital of auctions, followed by Sydney, and then obviously we know that Queensland, brisbane and Adelaide are starting to do a few more auctions these days.
00:30:34.839 --> 00:30:41.753
So credit to you in terms of becoming, you know, a mastery of your craft in a smaller market to be able to do that.
00:30:41.753 --> 00:30:45.592
I want to sort of dig into a couple of things I want to talk about.
00:30:45.592 --> 00:30:48.251
Who are your customers Like?
00:30:48.251 --> 00:30:52.156
Who's the audience that you're most focused in on when you're doing an auction?
00:30:52.156 --> 00:30:54.918
So if you can explain that to our community, that would be great.
00:30:54.918 --> 00:31:02.598
And then I'd love to know about what are the advantages in terms of taking a property to auction as opposed to a private treaty sale.
00:31:04.070 --> 00:31:05.436
Yeah, just to go back to your first point.
00:31:05.436 --> 00:31:08.659
There you mentioned, ben, around Brisbane being an auction market or not.
00:31:08.659 --> 00:31:13.856
So much we probably I probably benefited from that from the early stages of my career.
00:31:13.856 --> 00:31:17.898
Auctions were tough in Brisbane and when auctions are tough, it teaches you two things.
00:31:17.898 --> 00:31:26.357
The first thing is it teaches you to negotiate, because if I just went out the front and yelled out numbers and didn't negotiate, I'd have a very short shelf life and we wouldn't sell much.
00:31:26.357 --> 00:31:31.116
The second thing is it actually influences the type of auctioneer that you are.
00:31:31.116 --> 00:31:41.115
So you'll find auctioneers out of particularly out of Queensland who generally have less speed to them but better pattern commentary because they're used to less bids.
00:31:41.156 --> 00:31:44.619
Coming In centres where they get a lot of bidding all the time.
00:31:44.619 --> 00:31:52.597
Auctioneers become reliant on that and when they need, when they go to an auction where there's not a lot of bidding, they kind of get caught a little bit Like my bids aren't coming, what do I do?
00:31:52.597 --> 00:31:58.098
Whereas we come from a place where you don't have heaps and heaps of bidding.
00:31:58.098 --> 00:32:02.463
So therefore you can kind of you're probably more versatile in the way that you adjust to your style.
00:32:02.463 --> 00:32:04.415
So it's interesting where you start.
00:32:04.570 --> 00:32:12.216
We see a lot of hallmarks of auctioneers, particularly in auctioneering competitions, have their style based on the environment they come out of, in terms of who our customer is.
00:32:12.216 --> 00:32:14.637
Our customer, undoubtedly is agents.
00:32:14.637 --> 00:32:18.100
So it's again, it's a weird environment that we have.
00:32:18.100 --> 00:32:20.498
The person that pays us is not always our customer.
00:32:20.498 --> 00:32:27.237
So quite often, or most of the time, the vendor will pay us through the agency, but the vendor will pay us directly from the source.
00:32:27.730 --> 00:32:29.417
But our customer is agents.
00:32:29.417 --> 00:32:34.617
So it's not that we pitch directly to the living rooms to get them to employ us.
00:32:34.617 --> 00:32:38.334
We pitch to agents to go to living rooms to get them to employ us.
00:32:38.334 --> 00:32:44.919
So our marketing, our strategy, our social media is really geared towards agents.
00:32:44.919 --> 00:32:49.415
We do have some clients that direct us sorry, request us directly.
00:32:49.415 --> 00:32:55.057
So they'll go to an agency that we don't particularly work for or with and say, look, I really want this person, this guy.
00:32:55.057 --> 00:32:58.612
So I don't care who you usually use, I don't want them.
00:32:58.612 --> 00:33:04.300
I want this person because I've seen them and that's probably having more and more since auctions have become more widespread in 2021.
00:33:04.300 --> 00:33:12.053
And I think the thing we say to vendors is who handles your auction is pretty important in the scheme of things.
00:33:13.390 --> 00:33:16.517
Firstly, their ability to negotiate, but also secondly, purely as an auctioneer.
00:33:16.517 --> 00:33:19.778
The average closing bid on an auction is $2,500.
00:33:19.778 --> 00:33:28.494
So if you choose incorrectly as an auctioneer, you choose the wrong one, and they can't get one more bid for you because they're either not that committed or not that skillful.
00:33:28.494 --> 00:33:32.641
That's cost you $2,500 at least, at least straightaway.
00:33:32.641 --> 00:33:46.572
So I think the depth of research we put around it to say, hey, I don't care who you usually use, this is the person I want because they're gonna be the best representation of all my property In terms of the biggest advantages Can I just jump in?
00:33:46.593 --> 00:34:04.719
there, justin, just before we go into the advantages, it's pretty important for the community to know because obviously we're national that in some cases in some markets there are specialist agents that are employed, like you, who run a separate business, that come in and do the role for a branded selling agency.
00:34:04.719 --> 00:34:10.559
But in other cases, some of the larger agencies also have their own in-house auctioneers as well.
00:34:10.559 --> 00:34:29.273
So you can see from Justin's commentary that he is one of those specialists who come in and works with different agents and that's why his community and his value community is obviously being signed up by that selling agent who's using an external auctioneer, such as yourself, to be able to do that work.
00:34:30.389 --> 00:34:33.574
Yeah, I think that there's specialists through Australia and New Zealand.
00:34:33.574 --> 00:34:36.499
There's specialists in every state and territory.
00:34:36.499 --> 00:34:41.238
And the point that I would make around that is it's very hard to be great at two things.
00:34:41.238 --> 00:34:43.834
It's very hard to be a great agent and be a great auctioneer.
00:34:43.834 --> 00:34:46.775
A they're different skill sets, but B they also need time.
00:34:48.030 --> 00:34:51.197
Last week, as I mentioned, so last week I did 41 auctions across the week.
00:34:51.197 --> 00:35:05.277
That's 41 different scenarios where I had to deliver a property description, an introduction, negotiate, field, bidding, you know, and then the rest of the week was spent delivering training sessions around auctions how they work this way.
00:35:05.277 --> 00:35:05.858
You should do that.
00:35:05.858 --> 00:35:07.597
This is what happens when a buyer asks you this question.
00:35:07.597 --> 00:35:09.557
This is what happens when a seller pushes back on this.
00:35:09.557 --> 00:35:14.818
My whole week and my whole existence extrapolator, over 10 years has been around auctions.
00:35:14.818 --> 00:35:37.823
So I think when the choice comes down to it, you know, I think it's very difficult for a seller to say to someone what they want, but when it comes down to it, would you rather have someone who specializes and does it for a living, or someone who's done one auction the last month, like there's a specialist and then there's someone who does it?
00:35:37.844 --> 00:35:38.209
as a whole week.
00:35:38.209 --> 00:35:39.474
That's the master of peace coming out.
00:35:39.474 --> 00:35:41.954
That's right, yeah, exactly, and it's the same with any occupation.
00:35:42.869 --> 00:35:48.460
I won't compare ourselves to heart surgeons or anything of that nature, as much as I'd love to think that maybe that's a swagger price that comes through.
00:35:48.460 --> 00:35:50.577
But you know, think about your dentist, right?
00:35:50.577 --> 00:35:54.179
Would you rather go to a dentist to practice dentistry for 10 or 15 years?
00:35:54.179 --> 00:35:56.438
They do it all in, you know, every day and every day.
00:35:56.438 --> 00:36:00.517
Or do you go to your GP and he says oh yeah, and I do some dentistry on the side.
00:36:00.517 --> 00:36:04.836
I did it in, I did a filling last month, so I'll do another one for you next week.
00:36:04.836 --> 00:36:08.999
It's a bit cheaper, you know like you go to the dentist every single time.
00:36:08.999 --> 00:36:11.336
So I just think that's you know.
00:36:11.336 --> 00:36:12.280
And obviously I'm biased.
00:36:12.280 --> 00:36:14.979
It's unquestionable that I'm biased in this situation.
00:36:14.979 --> 00:36:25.836
But we devote our life to auctions and I would struggle to see how someone can perform as well if they haven't done the same when it comes to advantages for auction.
00:36:25.836 --> 00:36:27.751
Look, how long do you have, ben.
00:36:27.791 --> 00:36:31.697
I think you know my fundamental belief is two things.
00:36:31.697 --> 00:36:34.659
Firstly, it's that not every property should go to auction.
00:36:34.659 --> 00:36:36.773
It should be.
00:36:36.773 --> 00:36:40.137
You should understand as a listing agent or a seller.
00:36:40.137 --> 00:36:45.838
You should understand both methods of sale and have it explained to you and then choose the one that you think is most appropriate.
00:36:45.838 --> 00:36:53.474
The second thing is that you either give the buyers a day they can buy the property on or a price they can buy for.
00:36:53.474 --> 00:37:02.778
So there's been, since the market has really kicked on, you know, through probably early parts of COVID and beyond, we've had a rise when we call the hybrids.
00:37:02.778 --> 00:37:13.476
So the hybrids are the ones that sit in the middle, which is kind of like the for sale contact agent, price per negotiation, like they're no price marketing strategies but they're not actually auctions.
00:37:13.476 --> 00:37:18.875
And I always say, look, we ask a cheeky question, that's can you be half pregnant?
00:37:18.875 --> 00:37:20.132
And you can't.
00:37:20.132 --> 00:37:21.637
You're either pregnant or you're not pregnant.
00:37:21.637 --> 00:37:27.157
And I just think it's those, the hybrids, the ones that sit in the middle of the ones, that probably should go one direction or the other.
00:37:27.157 --> 00:37:31.117
We either say to the buyers hey, look, if you pay X amount you can buy it.
00:37:31.117 --> 00:37:37.137
Or we say to the buyers if you come along with this day and you're the high speeder, she and my seller agrees you can buy it.
00:37:37.137 --> 00:37:38.957
So we're giving them something to work for.
00:37:39.050 --> 00:37:41.117
But the biggest advantage I think with auction is twofold.
00:37:41.117 --> 00:37:44.259
Number one, it's that it changes because there's no price.
00:37:44.259 --> 00:37:46.418
It changes the thought process of buyers.
00:37:46.418 --> 00:37:50.972
So, rather than it being price and logic based, it's no.
00:37:50.972 --> 00:37:52.277
Price is emotion based.
00:37:52.277 --> 00:38:01.735
So buyers think emotionally first and justify it with logic, not the other way around, which is so important because emotion is the primary driver in real estate transactions.
00:38:01.735 --> 00:38:04.396
The second part is that it maximizes competition.
00:38:04.396 --> 00:38:14.635
Face to face competition is the strongest way of getting elicting the best price out, so that no price marketing strategy puts them into to a face to face competitive environment.
00:38:14.635 --> 00:38:25.036
And we say to sellers all the time an agent's job is really simple it's to find and retain a buyer who's emotionally engaged on a property and then placed in a situation where they're in competition.
00:38:25.036 --> 00:38:26.119
That's it.
00:38:26.119 --> 00:38:31.018
So that should be our strategy we're geared towards and the benefit from a buyer is transparency.
00:38:31.018 --> 00:38:34.314
You can see who you're up against and make decisions accordingly.
00:38:35.718 --> 00:38:37.413
I think there's a bit of gold there for our audience.
00:38:37.413 --> 00:38:37.876
Just to get a.
00:38:37.876 --> 00:38:47.309
You just got an insider's view on what the auctioneering process is from the seller side, and so you know the wave of emotion that you're up against as a buyer.
00:38:47.309 --> 00:38:48.335
So that's really important.
00:38:48.335 --> 00:38:52.800
Hey, justin, you said 15 auctions on Saturday.
00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:56.378
So I'm sitting here going how's that logistically possible?
00:38:56.378 --> 00:39:08.798
I think you know there's what 12 hours of sunlight in a day, but you're not working all 12 hours, so it's probably eight prime hours a day and you've got travel and you want to be engaged and you negotiate, because that's the fun stuff you love.
00:39:08.798 --> 00:39:15.635
Can you give us a little hint and understanding on how does that logistically work 15 auctions in a day for you?
00:39:16.570 --> 00:39:23.834
First, I'm guessing you guys are a little bit further south where I'm in Brisbane, so we get a little bit more sunlight here, because this is kind of God's own country up here so we probably stay
00:39:23.855 --> 00:39:24.557
13 hours.
00:39:24.677 --> 00:39:27.474
Yeah, so well.
00:39:27.474 --> 00:39:31.997
Firstly, our first auction for a Saturday traditionally is 8am, so 8am is our first auction of the day.
00:39:31.997 --> 00:39:46.700
Last Saturday, my last one was at 6.30pm and in that period we had one event of three auctions in a room that were three in, three in one, and then the rest fitted in between eight o'clock and 6.30.
00:39:46.700 --> 00:39:52.238
So traditionally, depending on travel times, we're kind of hourly with our auctions.
00:39:52.238 --> 00:39:57.557
If we're in the same suburb, occasion will be a little bit shorter than that, but most of the time it's sort of on the hour.
00:39:57.557 --> 00:40:05.177
So if you work through and go eight, nine, 10, 11, 12, one, two, three, four, five, six, that's 11 spots that you have already.
00:40:05.177 --> 00:40:10.528
We had then out to 6.30 so we could get pick up another spot, which is 12, we have one with three in there.
00:40:10.528 --> 00:40:17.099
So 15 is probably an unusually high one, but Saturday's traditionally usually is 12.
00:40:17.099 --> 00:40:19.517
That's kind of the number that's most common.
00:40:20.610 --> 00:40:26.601
Back in the heady days of 2021, when the market was just on fire, two things happened.
00:40:26.601 --> 00:40:29.960
Number one is that auctions were really fast.
00:40:29.960 --> 00:40:33.820
So what slows you down in an auction's negotiation?
00:40:33.820 --> 00:40:35.075
That's the bit that takes time.
00:40:35.075 --> 00:40:40.515
The auctions themselves are really more than sort of 10 or 12 minutes of bidding, so they're actually really fast.
00:40:40.515 --> 00:40:44.157
So 2021, a lot of the time, who were doing auctions even tighter than that.
00:40:44.157 --> 00:40:51.976
We were sort of fitting into getting to 18 or 19 auctions on a Saturday because there was so much frenzy and activity that they were really fast.
00:40:51.976 --> 00:40:57.614
So you get in, there'd be no negotiation, you'd sell it, you'd get in the car, you'd go to your next one and off you went.
00:40:57.614 --> 00:41:04.275
We're now in a period again where negotiations come back to the fore, so we're having to slow the auctions down, lead more time between them.
00:41:04.275 --> 00:41:12.615
But yeah, it's always a balancing act between maximizing your value on a Saturday but also making sure that you're not running late to an auction, which is not a good look.
00:41:13.410 --> 00:41:17.958
You must be sucking your thumb in the corner in the fetal position on Saturday nights, though.
00:41:17.958 --> 00:41:30.237
If you're doing 18 auctions in a day, last thing you want to do is talk, cause when you're in a performance-based business like you are, boy, one hour of performance-based is like three hours elsewhere, so you multiply that by the amount of auctions you're having.
00:41:30.237 --> 00:41:34.454
Chances are it's not your peak conversational state with your wife on a Saturday night.
00:41:35.289 --> 00:41:36.536
Yeah, I think she's got used to that.
00:41:36.911 --> 00:41:58.278
I think she knew what she was in for when we first met, so that was the case, but funny because in 2021, I remember saying multiple times in my life I'd come home on a Saturday and I'd be less tired than I usually would, because it's just energized when you have a lot of bidding and it's frenzied and it's past reserves and it's that's actually really what's draining is negotiation.
00:41:58.470 --> 00:41:59.775
That's mentally draining.
00:41:59.775 --> 00:42:06.398
So I could have, if I have seven auctions, for example, on a day, and there's six of them, I'd date negotiations for a long period of time.
00:42:06.398 --> 00:42:11.059
That's more draining than 15 auctions where they fly past reserve unquestionably.
00:42:11.059 --> 00:42:14.460
So that's the bit that really sort of gets you.
00:42:14.460 --> 00:42:18.476
So 2021 was kind of a funny one that you'd sort of come home and be energized.
00:42:18.476 --> 00:42:28.155
I do remember, though, a couple of times I'd go to sleep and I'd be thinking I was calling an auction, like I'd be doing terms and conditions in my sleep and, like you know, it's just in my head because you've done it so many times that day.
00:42:28.155 --> 00:42:30.117
It was a really fun, really fun time.
00:42:31.450 --> 00:42:39.117
Justin, I want to move the conversation along in terms of talking about you know, getting that insider's view of auctioneering as well.
00:42:39.117 --> 00:42:49.577
I want to look at you, know how you discuss setting a reserve price and then you know what are some of the bidding strategies that you see out there.
00:42:49.577 --> 00:42:58.280
I mean, having done so many auctions, people's tactics around their approach to bidding, Because you know, I remember what you said earlier.
00:42:58.280 --> 00:43:03.838
You know, in most cases, as a buyer, you're fighting that emotional feeling is what you said.
00:43:03.838 --> 00:43:05.101
That is true.
00:43:05.101 --> 00:43:11.796
If you've got an emotional attachment to the property, your job is to get that emotion into a higher price for your client.
00:43:11.796 --> 00:43:19.340
Take us through reserve price setting for auctions and then, ultimately, some of the bidding strategies that you see out there.
00:43:19.340 --> 00:43:21.811
Yeah, Reserve, sets.
00:43:23.376 --> 00:43:32.373
They're a bit funny that in most of the states, in Australia in particular, the legislation is really clear where it says that it's often subject to reserve price and the seller's approval.
00:43:32.373 --> 00:43:42.218
Reserve prices in a lot of states don't mean a lot, because you're still going to seek your seller's approval, irrespective of where you get to, whether you're above it, below it or at it, as it may be.
00:43:42.218 --> 00:43:50.276
Look out, advice around reserves to sellers is always the fact that, look, most sellers will set an aspirational reserve.
00:43:50.276 --> 00:44:06.199
What you need to be is courageously uncomfortable with your reserve, to set it at a figure that you're not over the moon that you would sell it for, but you would sell it at that because that just allows that if we have a momentum-based auction, we can get the property on the market quickly and allow that momentum to carry it away.
00:44:06.199 --> 00:44:09.677
We don't prematurely call things on the market either.
00:44:09.677 --> 00:44:15.061
We will call it on the market when it's appropriate to, and it's best strategy to, not the moment we hit a reserve.
00:44:15.061 --> 00:44:18.059
There's a very clear distinction around that.
00:44:18.059 --> 00:44:22.717
What a lot of sellers will do is they'll think, oh, we're setting a really high reserve, we can always come down on the day.
00:44:22.717 --> 00:44:25.238
What they're doing is deferring their decision-making to the day.
00:44:25.829 --> 00:44:34.001
The problem with doing that is that what can happen is you have an auction, you have some competitive bidding, you pull up at the level that the reserve probably should have been, but it's not because it's aspirational.
00:44:34.001 --> 00:44:35.576
You go inside and speak to the owner.
00:44:35.576 --> 00:44:40.501
You spend 15 minutes getting the reserve down to the level that it should have been initially.
00:44:40.501 --> 00:44:45.515
You walk back outside and it's like trying to jumpstart a car the energy's gone out of it.
00:44:45.515 --> 00:44:52.539
You may start again, but if it does, it's probably not going to run at full capacity and you lost that momentum which is most important to critical auction.
00:44:52.539 --> 00:44:56.157
There's a large degree of trust when it comes to reserve sets.
00:44:56.157 --> 00:45:14.139
The seller has to trust the agent and the agent has to trust us that the communication lines are going to stay open and we'll use it as a strategy, not just to basically hey, they've set a reserve million dollars, we've got two million dollars, let's just sell it and pack up and go home.
00:45:14.179 --> 00:45:15.463
That's a very short choice.
00:45:15.463 --> 00:45:17.677
I think there's a real gold in that for sure.
00:45:18.010 --> 00:45:41.135
There needs to be some trust that you're able to demonstrate to your clients that you said look, here was a reserve, we set it a million, but we ended up at 1.13, or here's a reserve, we set it 2.2, because the fear that all vendors would have is the incentive for the agent to drop the hammer early is greater than the, because you're getting a percentage of every thousand dollars over.
00:45:41.135 --> 00:45:50.677
It's a lot of money to the seller and not so much to the agent once they get to their core price.
00:45:50.677 --> 00:45:56.041
I think for you I'd imagine there's a lot of demonstrating hey, we called it here, but we got this.
00:45:56.041 --> 00:45:58.778
We called it here but we got this, just to give them that confidence.
00:45:59.371 --> 00:46:05.210
Yeah, we have one like this last week and I won't reveal what the reserve was, but we had four down registered bidders.
00:46:05.210 --> 00:46:08.259
It was a really, really landmark property up on the Gold Coast.
00:46:08.259 --> 00:46:09.954
It's Queensland's most viewed property.
00:46:09.954 --> 00:46:14.557
For three weeks we call the property on the market at 7.0 million and 50,.
00:46:14.557 --> 00:46:16.961
Eventual sale process 7.3.
00:46:16.961 --> 00:46:20.256
Our reserve was significantly, significantly lower than that.
00:46:23.269 --> 00:46:24.780
The agent had come to me early in the auction.
00:46:24.780 --> 00:46:25.747
He'd checked with the owner.
00:46:25.747 --> 00:46:29.320
The owner had said, yet called on me to ready, he'd let me know that, but we didn't need to.
00:46:29.320 --> 00:46:35.436
There was no need to prematurely call on the market in that instance, because calling on the market is a tool to elect more bidding.
00:46:35.436 --> 00:46:40.179
No use using that tool prematurely, like keeping your back pocket until you need it.
00:46:40.179 --> 00:46:40.640
You need to.
00:46:42.452 --> 00:46:53.101
That's how you demonstrate that the great thing about that seller was that the seller originally wanted to set his reserve at 7, but we explained the benefit of setting it at a much lower level.
00:46:53.101 --> 00:46:57.242
He was in sales and he understood it and he said, yep, well, I trust you guys.
00:46:57.242 --> 00:46:58.769
I trust you're going to come and talk to me.
00:46:58.769 --> 00:47:00.422
I trust that you're saying the right thing.
00:47:00.422 --> 00:47:01.470
You won't call on prematurely.
00:47:01.470 --> 00:47:06.041
So let's set it at the low level, which he did, and it played out perfectly.
00:47:06.041 --> 00:47:15.170
So if he'd set a reserve of eight, for example, that auction would have pulled up, would have had to stop converse and unquestionably would have sold it for less.
00:47:15.170 --> 00:47:17.336
So, yeah, it is about trust.
00:47:17.336 --> 00:47:20.693
So much of it's about trust when it comes to bidding strategies.
00:47:20.693 --> 00:47:27.525
I could do this for an hour talk about bidding strategies, but we actually just released a video on our website around.
00:47:27.525 --> 00:47:30.134
It's a five or six minute video around different bidding strategies.
00:47:30.134 --> 00:47:32.800
You're having to share if that's a value to your listeners.
00:47:33.570 --> 00:47:37.641
It talks about what we see in the top five tips to bidding and winning an auction.
00:47:37.641 --> 00:47:52.942
I know people are not inclined to take my advice but because they think I work for the seller, which I absolutely do but I also say I'm not compensated on the outcome, so I've got no skin in this game that I desperately need to buy and buy it to get paid.
00:47:52.942 --> 00:48:00.555
I just see buyers from time to time make common mistakes or common good strategy players to actually secure properties.
00:48:00.555 --> 00:48:04.378
The first one that we say that's so important is have a strategy.
00:48:04.378 --> 00:48:12.378
If you go in without a strategy you'll just get swallowed up and you'll go kind of what happened and it'll all be a horrible experience for you.
00:48:12.378 --> 00:48:29.238
This is a really big deal when you buy a property, like in the terms of the most stressful things in your life, I think the number one is probably the death of someone close to you or a family member, then it's probably having a child, then it's probably getting married or getting divorced and then below that it's buying a home or selling a home.
00:48:29.238 --> 00:48:32.818
So the terms of stressful environments, it's right up there.
00:48:32.818 --> 00:48:34.394
Don't leave it to chance.
00:48:34.394 --> 00:48:36.669
It's not a strategy.
00:48:36.669 --> 00:48:38.556
And seeing back and waiting is not a strategy.
00:48:38.556 --> 00:48:42.038
It's like trying to win the lotto without buying a ticket.
00:48:42.038 --> 00:48:43.597
It can't work.
00:48:43.597 --> 00:48:46.077
It just cannot work, so don't do it.
00:48:47.613 --> 00:48:53.172
One of my favorite statistics around this is that 68% of times the opening bidder buys the property.
00:48:53.172 --> 00:49:06.693
So wholly and solely my place in the first bid, you put yourself in the majority chance to buy it, rather than minority, because that buys usually either the most aggressive, the most confident, or they're acting like it.
00:49:06.693 --> 00:49:12.155
So don't be afraid to start the bidding, because what happens is two things.
00:49:12.155 --> 00:49:16.000
One is that you get your nerves out because you've done the unknown.
00:49:16.000 --> 00:49:18.675
Now You've placed your opening bid, you're often, often, going.
00:49:18.675 --> 00:49:24.875
The second thing is your best chance of buying that property for as cheap as possible is by limiting your competition.
00:49:24.875 --> 00:49:29.961
So by bidding you intimidate your competition and they may then get frightened and back off.
00:49:29.961 --> 00:49:37.213
If you wait, all you do is give them a free swing to get comfortable and confident, which is going to push the price up.
00:49:37.213 --> 00:49:40.055
So that's the starting spot.
00:49:40.175 --> 00:49:41.318
We talked about three figures.
00:49:41.318 --> 00:49:43.615
You go into an auction, there should be three figures in your mind.
00:49:43.615 --> 00:49:45.755
The first one is your dream figure.
00:49:45.755 --> 00:49:48.017
So that's the price that you don't think you'll buy for there.
00:49:48.017 --> 00:49:53.478
But you'll be over the moon if you're bored of that number, and that might be the number that you start off at to get things going.
00:49:53.478 --> 00:50:04.059
The next number is the fair number, so that's where, based upon research, recent sales valuations, whatever else it might be, that's the number that you think it would likely sell for.
00:50:04.059 --> 00:50:10.095
And then the last one is the absolute, which is your number, where, if it goes a dollar more than that, you are tapped out.
00:50:10.095 --> 00:50:16.550
And then, as soon as you have those three numbers, just build your strategy inside of those three numbers and execute there.
00:50:16.550 --> 00:50:21.135
And if it goes beyond your absolute, then that's what happens, like, but at least you've tried.
00:50:21.135 --> 00:50:25.111
If you go in and go, what is going to wait and wait and wait, and wait and wait and wait what?
00:50:25.131 --> 00:50:26.878
all traditionally happened is you'll wait for the perfect time.
00:50:26.878 --> 00:50:27.593
It'll never happen.
00:50:27.593 --> 00:50:30.777
You'll hand your paddle back at the end of the auction and kind of go what happened?
00:50:31.479 --> 00:50:35.938
Yeah, so you said you could go on for hours and you've got five.
00:50:35.938 --> 00:50:40.922
Give us, give us another one, so we can give the audience a little insight there too.
00:50:40.922 --> 00:50:42.296
So the first one's have a strategy.
00:50:42.296 --> 00:50:43.052
What's the second one?
00:50:43.814 --> 00:50:45.298
I'm going to have to go with memory here.
00:50:45.298 --> 00:50:55.698
I don't remember all five, I'll have to refer to the video, but we had a property recently that we bid on and we try to put as much of this strategy in a plan happened to about that experience as well.
00:50:55.698 --> 00:50:59.980
But the biggest one, I think the most advanced advantage strategy is bidding quickly.
00:50:59.980 --> 00:51:07.735
So if you were to do nothing else, just bid quickly, and it doesn't have to be ginormous amounts, it doesn't have to be, you know, huge increments.
00:51:07.735 --> 00:51:09.961
But bidding quickly does two things.
00:51:09.961 --> 00:51:13.077
Number one, it gives the impression that you're not going to stop.
00:51:13.077 --> 00:51:16.798
You just not even phased about what's going on.
00:51:16.798 --> 00:51:22.869
You're bidding quickly which can send an impression to everyone else like, hey, they just want this, they're not going to stop.
00:51:22.869 --> 00:51:26.780
The second thing it does is it pushes the decisions onto the other party.
00:51:27.670 --> 00:51:29.798
So everyone's stressed at auctions.
00:51:29.798 --> 00:51:32.739
You know, agents are stressed, sellers are stressed, buyers are stressed.
00:51:32.739 --> 00:51:37.797
Even when I was bidding in auction, I feel like I've been around more auctions the most I was stressed bidding in an auction.
00:51:37.797 --> 00:51:42.713
So someone that does it for the first time or doesn't want to be seven years, of course the stress levels are going to be high.
00:51:42.713 --> 00:51:50.771
The person who's under the least amount of stress, or the buyer who's under the least amount of stress during an auction is the highest bidder, because they're already in front.
00:51:50.771 --> 00:51:55.961
So everyone else has to do something else to change that positioning.
00:51:55.961 --> 00:52:01.602
So spend as much time in the least stressful position as you can and put the stress back on everyone else.
00:52:01.910 --> 00:52:07.777
So what that looks like is that if you get into a bidding war with somebody else, you know they're talking about oh, should we bid, Should we not be?
00:52:07.777 --> 00:52:12.481
You're talking at the same time with your partner or, internally, you know, if they bid, I'm going to bid.
00:52:12.481 --> 00:52:14.957
And they go okay, 50, bank 50.
00:52:14.957 --> 00:52:16.994
The decision's back on them again.
00:52:16.994 --> 00:52:19.536
They're like, oh gee, should we bid, Should we not bid?
00:52:19.536 --> 00:52:21.099
And you're talking about the same time Should we not bid?
00:52:21.099 --> 00:52:24.604
Okay, we'll go one more, 50, bank, 50.
00:52:24.604 --> 00:52:25.492
Back onto them again.
00:52:26.070 --> 00:52:31.432
So the decision just continually puts back on their shoulders and that stress can become overpowering.
00:52:31.432 --> 00:52:33.338
Where they feel like, A, he's not stopping.
00:52:33.338 --> 00:52:37.941
B you know we're sick of this stress and having to decide every time.
00:52:37.941 --> 00:52:41.980
We'll just tap out, or they'll do what you want as a buyer, which is they'll weaken their number.
00:52:41.980 --> 00:52:44.316
Oh well, we'll go 10.
00:52:44.316 --> 00:52:51.721
That's like putting a big bit of blood in front of a great white right, Like if someone goes 10, you know you should just be on that straightaway.
00:52:51.721 --> 00:52:59.356
Like just chew that up and stick with your 50, you know 50, and then they're just like, oh well, yeah, this is never going to end, and then they might just bow out.
00:52:59.356 --> 00:53:01.876
So, yeah, the best advice would be quickly.
00:53:01.876 --> 00:53:02.760
That's the biggest one.
00:53:03.692 --> 00:53:10.077
Well, as a buyer's agent, I would agree with that and I see that quite often, and all of what you said is true.
00:53:10.077 --> 00:53:18.773
But as a buyer's agent, I'm like it actually gives me a ton of intel on them because you know, as you say, the stress position.
00:53:18.773 --> 00:53:21.640
I want to know what's happening to them under the stress position.
00:53:21.640 --> 00:53:22.702
They're looking at each other.
00:53:22.702 --> 00:53:24.056
I want to know those sideward looks.
00:53:24.056 --> 00:53:26.599
I want to know when they're getting close to their upper limit.
00:53:26.599 --> 00:53:32.262
I'm actually using that as a strategic advantage to try and get inside their head, which ordinarily I can't.
00:53:32.262 --> 00:53:35.960
So, hey, listen, as a buyer's agent, I love to stand at the front.
00:53:35.960 --> 00:53:40.160
I love to stand on one of the auctioneer's shoulders so I can actually see what you see.
00:53:40.160 --> 00:53:45.001
How do you feel about buyers and their positions and their preferred positions?
00:53:45.001 --> 00:53:46.315
Is that annoying to you?
00:53:47.753 --> 00:53:54.736
Well, I've got personal space issues, bryce, so definitely would make me uncomfortable to cheer for I'll explain the shoulder.
00:53:55.510 --> 00:53:56.756
I'm 10 metres away from you.
00:53:56.756 --> 00:53:59.820
I'm not sitting in your pocket, but I actually want to see the POV that you have.
00:53:59.820 --> 00:54:01.275
Is that how you feel about that?
00:54:02.070 --> 00:54:12.298
Yeah, I think as a buyer, you want as much data around your decision making as you can, and if you can't see the other buyers, you're lacking a really crucial part, because you reference to their earlier Bryce, and it's so true.
00:54:12.298 --> 00:54:17.014
There's so many triggers that people give off that can tell whether they're going to keep going or not.
00:54:17.014 --> 00:54:19.675
You want to be watching those triggers.
00:54:19.675 --> 00:54:21.737
So, as an auctioneer, I'm watching them for various things.
00:54:21.737 --> 00:54:30.459
A big one for me is that if we're starting to go and I can see someone starting to fidget with their paddle, or they look for their paddle, that's an indication they're likely to bid again.
00:54:30.459 --> 00:54:34.858
There's the one where they put the brochure up to cover their mouth.
00:54:34.858 --> 00:54:38.137
Like the American Gridiron coach, they put it up to cover their conversation.
00:54:38.137 --> 00:54:40.970
As soon as you're having any conversation, the game's over.
00:54:40.970 --> 00:54:43.940
I know that you're talking about whether you're going to re-engage or not.
00:54:43.940 --> 00:54:47.780
I know you're not putting it up there to say, gee, this auctioneer is bloody good, isn't he?
00:54:47.780 --> 00:54:50.637
I know that the conversation is around your bidding strategy.
00:54:50.637 --> 00:54:53.346
So I want to get as much.
00:54:53.487 --> 00:54:55.876
As an auctioneer, I want as much of that data as I can.
00:54:55.876 --> 00:55:00.155
As a buyer, you should be trying to do that as well, so I positioned.
00:55:00.155 --> 00:55:08.663
If it was me, and when we said we did this position, I said we'd line aside on a side where you can look back across the whole crowd to see what's going on.
00:55:08.663 --> 00:55:20.423
Elevation is always good as a buyer as well, because elevation gives you a better bird's eye view of everything and also it just allows you to evaluate the situation all the way throughout.
00:55:20.423 --> 00:55:25.896
So look, I think from your perspective as a buyer's agent, you've got invested interest where you want to secure it for your client.
00:55:25.896 --> 00:55:29.679
Any advantage you can have inside the scope of the law you should be taking that.
00:55:29.679 --> 00:55:30.842
Yeah, absolutely.
00:55:32.092 --> 00:55:34.717
I do not want my competition to be a mystery to them.
00:55:34.717 --> 00:55:35.499
I need to know that.
00:55:35.499 --> 00:55:39.195
I need to see their eyeballs, I need to know who they are, I need to know what the conversation is they're having.
00:55:39.195 --> 00:55:51.559
So if we pivot to memorable auctions, justin two that I want to flag with you the largest we talked about before we recorded, so it'd be nice to talk to that for our audience.
00:55:51.559 --> 00:55:57.794
So the largest price you've received and the most bizarre or interesting auction that you've experienced.
00:55:58.692 --> 00:56:02.221
You know, probably both of these are inside the last six weeks.
00:56:02.221 --> 00:56:06.919
That could just be because my memory is terrible, so maybe that's my point of reference is the last couple of months.
00:56:06.919 --> 00:56:12.681
But the largest one is the one that we just saw recently for 24.8 million under the hammer.
00:56:12.681 --> 00:56:24.143
That probably was in Southport, a McMillan court, not a traditionally amazing auction where huge bidding war broke out, so on and so forth.
00:56:24.143 --> 00:56:28.981
What we had is really one party, that it was a negotiation to sort of get them to the right position.
00:56:28.981 --> 00:56:30.896
It took some time but it got there eventually.
00:56:30.896 --> 00:56:32.535
So that was very rewarding.
00:56:32.535 --> 00:56:49.936
From that, it was also rewarding because our company, one of our team, had broken the record about three weeks before, four weeks before 24 million, so to be able to sort of nick it back you know, the record back gave me a lot of firepower and ammunition to be able to fire back at him.
00:56:51.211 --> 00:56:57.554
So that was probably personally rewarding the craziest auction.
00:56:57.554 --> 00:57:02.931
I reckon we had one about three or four weeks ago Now.
00:57:02.931 --> 00:57:10.403
It was a property interest me and the owner bravely decided to run a no reserve auction.
00:57:10.403 --> 00:57:13.137
And it had been some years since I've done a no reserve auction.
00:57:13.137 --> 00:57:17.394
I didn't feel at the start of my career but it's been some years because it's a big leap of faith to do that.
00:57:17.394 --> 00:57:23.536
You know you kind of go straight to the worst case scenario, which is that it could be selling my property for a dollar or a thousand dollars.
00:57:23.536 --> 00:57:26.356
But we've got to say the market always catches you.
00:57:26.356 --> 00:57:30.499
So this property interest me had been destroyed by squatters.
00:57:30.499 --> 00:57:32.073
And I say destroyed.
00:57:32.073 --> 00:57:32.856
It was destroyed.
00:57:32.970 --> 00:57:36.478
It might have been the worst home that I've ever been in in terms of its condition internally.
00:57:36.478 --> 00:57:37.922
Walls ripped out.
00:57:37.922 --> 00:57:39.514
Like we caught an open plan because you could.
00:57:39.514 --> 00:57:43.438
There wasn't a wall so you could literally see the whole house from from there.
00:57:43.438 --> 00:57:45.273
There was no back door.
00:57:45.273 --> 00:57:49.740
So you know Breeze is easily coming through because there's no back door.
00:57:49.740 --> 00:57:52.237
So they launched with a no reserve auction.
00:57:52.237 --> 00:57:58.499
They called it Queensland's worst house and no reserve auction Really brilliant marketing strategy that the agent and the agency put into place.
00:57:58.499 --> 00:58:03.559
We were met on the day with 161 registered bidders for this auction.
00:58:03.559 --> 00:58:08.501
So 161 registered bidders couldn't park within a kilometer of the home.
00:58:08.501 --> 00:58:10.202
Like there was no car parks.
00:58:10.202 --> 00:58:16.420
Every news, every news crew was there A few hundred people, they'd run a sausage sizzle for the local lions.
00:58:17.070 --> 00:58:19.316
Like they'd done a really good job, marketing it.
00:58:20.778 --> 00:58:24.278
Popcorn was there, like it was a really like kind of a carnival atmosphere.
00:58:24.278 --> 00:58:33.420
Valuation I think it come in pre-oction around the 400, from my understanding and we opened up the dollar bid, as you kind of do.
00:58:33.420 --> 00:58:44.181
So someone bid a dollar, so we're, we're on the market immediately at a dollar, straight away, and eventually it sold for $494,700.
00:58:44.181 --> 00:58:54.202
And the funny thing was the under bidder was the $1 bidder, so he started a dollar and he was out at four, nine, four and a half basically.
00:58:54.751 --> 00:59:07.340
So, but it was just it was crazy Like sea of people, bids coming in, bids coming in from all angles, like TV cameras in the way, like it was just a real kind of circus and bizarre auction.
00:59:07.340 --> 00:59:12.316
And it's funny because you know you do that auction and it's such a, you know, adrenaline rush and it's it's going.
00:59:12.316 --> 00:59:14.206
Then you drive to your next one an hour later.
00:59:14.206 --> 00:59:19.852
And then that one, there was 10 people there and one bidder and so they would get over life right, Like you know.
00:59:19.852 --> 00:59:23.422
And funny, that one at Macmillan, macmillan court, $24.8 million.
00:59:23.422 --> 00:59:27.210
The one I did after that was a unit at the back of Ashmore for $420,000.
00:59:27.210 --> 00:59:27.856
Got paid the same.
00:59:27.856 --> 00:59:33.141
So I started to do my job equally as well at both of them.
00:59:33.141 --> 00:59:36.419
But yeah, just part of the quirk of being an auctioneer, I suppose.
00:59:37.250 --> 00:59:40.544
So does that help with the emotion of your craft?
00:59:40.544 --> 00:59:47.730
Then, because that's interesting, right, you go to a 24.8 and you just said I get paid the same at the 24.8 that I do for the one in Ashmore.
00:59:47.730 --> 00:59:52.106
It's probably unique for you because I'm I'm interested to know.
00:59:52.106 --> 00:59:54.133
I personally haven't turned up to an auction.
00:59:54.133 --> 00:59:57.532
That 24 million, so what, what?
00:59:57.532 --> 00:59:58.355
What are like?
00:59:58.355 --> 01:00:02.233
It's not like you've got your typical buyer, I mean, are they?
01:00:02.233 --> 01:00:09.036
Is there any nuances that that people wouldn't understand that you have to deal with bidders?
01:00:09.036 --> 01:00:11.798
It sounds like you only had one or two right that 24.8?
01:00:11.798 --> 01:00:11.798
.
01:00:12.130 --> 01:00:13.936
Yeah, they're pretty, they're pretty similar.
01:00:13.936 --> 01:00:16.380
The two biggest differences we're doing prestige stuff.
01:00:16.380 --> 01:00:18.390
We've been lucky enough to do a bit of prestige stuff this year.
01:00:18.390 --> 01:00:25.661
We've had a couple in the sort of 13 to 15 million bracket as well, quite a few in the sort of six to 10 bracket.
01:00:25.661 --> 01:00:27.108
There's two big nuances.
01:00:27.108 --> 01:00:34.023
The first one is is that the there's much more secrecy around the kind of higher end stuff.
01:00:34.023 --> 01:00:40.396
So quite often if we talk to media, which we do a lot, we've got to be a little more careful around what we disclose.
01:00:40.396 --> 01:00:48.459
We very rarely, if heaven, will, disclose who the buyer was that's not a place to do that who the seller was, like all those circumstances there.
01:00:48.459 --> 01:00:56.340
You know you'll get the campaign reports and you'll recognize a few names in there looking at what a property like you know and but you just, you just have to sort of put in the vault.
01:00:56.789 --> 01:01:02.998
So, whereas in the lower end properties, no one really kind of cares who the seller of the buyer is really and what your time.
01:01:02.998 --> 01:01:10.256
The biggest difference, though, as we've found, is that with traditional auctions, most people stop bidding because they run out of money.
01:01:10.829 --> 01:01:29.898
So the underbidder will stop because they just simply can't afford it or their approval is to a certain number With higher end auctions and high net worth individuals, is the underbidder's traditionally stopped because they don't want it enough, and that's a really small difference, but it's a really large when it when it comes to engaging with people.
01:01:29.898 --> 01:01:35.300
So when someone is out because they can't afford it, they're out and there's no nuance to that.
01:01:35.300 --> 01:01:39.271
Like we buy this, we can't afford to settle, like that's a pretty.
01:01:39.271 --> 01:01:46.701
When someone is out because they don't want it enough, it's then trying to appeal to the fact that, hey, you might be able to find another one.
01:01:46.701 --> 01:01:48.356
Here's the unique selling points of it.
01:01:48.356 --> 01:01:50.074
Here's what drew you in the first place.
01:01:50.074 --> 01:01:51.557
Those kinds of things.
01:01:51.557 --> 01:01:52.902
There's a bit more subtlety to that.
01:01:52.902 --> 01:01:54.253
So that's probably the biggest difference.
01:01:54.693 --> 01:01:57.421
But we, we maintain look, we get, we get paid the same.
01:01:57.421 --> 01:02:00.258
It's the same with the 8am auction versus the 6 30pm auction.
01:02:00.258 --> 01:02:05.340
The vendor who's paying me at 8am is, you know, paying me the same as the vendor at 6 30.
01:02:05.340 --> 01:02:10.780
So I'm going to have the same energy, mindset, approach, focus, determination for all of them.
01:02:10.780 --> 01:02:12.890
I can't just think, oh, I had a big day.
01:02:12.890 --> 01:02:16.876
So I'll just take it a little bit easier on this one, because they're paying the same as what someone was first up in the morning.
01:02:17.650 --> 01:02:24.972
Justin, you've given an awesome insight into the buying decision behavior, just in sort of high net worth versus.
01:02:24.972 --> 01:02:27.480
You know that affordability story at the lower end.
01:02:27.480 --> 01:02:52.382
Take us through when, when an auction is passed in, that's ultimately where you've got to keep tension on the sale through your underbitter, and obviously the person who is the highest bidder gets the opportunity, the first opportunity, to say no, right, so their job is to slow down their decisions and know as much as possible to cool off and hopefully bring the underbitter into a rational mindset that says no, I don't really need it as much.
01:02:52.382 --> 01:03:03.079
So take us through that art form in terms of how quickly you need to try and move to get the, to get the highest bidder to a no, because that's the legal obligation you need to do versus.
01:03:03.079 --> 01:03:07.719
Obviously you know trying to keep that underbitter interested so you can keep the price moving higher.
01:03:09.088 --> 01:03:12.180
Yeah, and this is one of the quirks of not having national legislation.
01:03:12.180 --> 01:03:15.597
So what you described there is is completely true.
01:03:15.597 --> 01:03:19.608
In New South Wales, Victoria as well, Queensland there's no first rights negotiate for the high speeder.
01:03:20.112 --> 01:03:22.262
So the second that we yeah, the second we pass in.
01:03:22.262 --> 01:03:26.523
In Queensland it's open slather for every party to throw whatever they like in it.
01:03:26.523 --> 01:03:31.780
Whether they be high speed or under bidder, subject to sale person, everyone gets equal rights at that point in time.
01:03:31.780 --> 01:03:38.976
So I guess it probably makes it a little bit simpler, particularly in those states that do have it is you sort of can really paint to the buyer.
01:03:38.976 --> 01:03:40.519
Your window is now.
01:03:40.519 --> 01:03:44.787
You either buy it or you walk away and don't look back because you're in that window.
01:03:44.787 --> 01:03:47.517
Now why would you want to sacrifice that window and then try and buy it?
01:03:47.517 --> 01:03:59.596
And that's why in every state we we try and pause auctions to make a negotiation happen rather than pass them in and make one happen behind closed doors, because it also protects the seller with the contract terms.
01:03:59.596 --> 01:04:06.918
So in Queensland you can negotiate with any registered bidder for two business days after the auction, but the buyers aren't obliged to do that.
01:04:06.918 --> 01:04:14.750
So if you're a savvy buyer in Queensland, if you were negotiating during auction and it passes in, if you're smart, you'll walk up and say how am I going to continue negotiation?
01:04:14.750 --> 01:04:18.476
But I want to cool him off period in the contract now and you can legally do that.
01:04:18.670 --> 01:04:21.919
So yeah, in New South Wales it's a little bit different because of that positioning.
01:04:21.919 --> 01:04:28.335
What we say is we've already revealed in most of the time the negotiation, that number that will buy the property to the highest bidder.
01:04:28.335 --> 01:04:29.720
They've already declined that.
01:04:29.720 --> 01:04:40.280
Go and have that conversation again because it's an official one, and just understand that if their answer is anything other than yes, their first ride is over and then we can take it out to the masses.
01:04:40.280 --> 01:04:45.582
So yeah, it's funny, we'd call auctions in Coolinganna and the border of Coolinganna and Tweed Head.
01:04:45.582 --> 01:04:49.592
So we'll do bigger events where three of them are Queensland, two of them are New South Wales.
01:04:49.592 --> 01:04:56.539
You're sort of oscillating between one vendor bid, multiple vendor bids, no rights to negotiate first rights to negotiate price guides no price guides.
01:04:56.539 --> 01:05:01.139
I think the day we all have national legislation will be a big win for everybody, I reckon.
01:05:01.599 --> 01:05:03.363
Wouldn't it be it would be.
01:05:04.472 --> 01:05:05.336
It would be indeed yeah.
01:05:06.390 --> 01:05:06.954
We're about to.
01:05:06.954 --> 01:05:15.157
We're getting very close, because we're going to do a role play where you're actually going to swap hats and you're going to take your auctioneers hat off and you're going to buy your buyers, put your buyers hat on.
01:05:15.157 --> 01:05:22.103
So we'll get to that shortly, but before we do, the last question in this lane for me is technology Online bidding platforms.
01:05:22.103 --> 01:05:25.820
Obviously, there was a way that you had to pivot through COVID.
01:05:25.820 --> 01:05:28.235
Now everyone can come back on site.
01:05:28.235 --> 01:05:38.104
What role do you think online bidding platforms are going to play in a non-pandemic way going forward?
01:05:38.104 --> 01:05:48.360
Do you think that the art of trying to get people on site is always going to be the preferred method, or do you think that more and more auctions will go online?
01:05:49.472 --> 01:05:54.503
Yeah, I think the pandemic dragged us kicking and screaming into the 21st century.
01:05:54.503 --> 01:06:01.903
Like we were really archaic with what we were doing with technology, like even to a point where our registration forms are still on paper.
01:06:01.903 --> 01:06:12.829
We had handled a plastic paddle, like taking away the damage to the planet, like those things are pretty basic right, like that's kind of original, kind of 1960s, 1970s operations.
01:06:12.829 --> 01:06:17.662
So the pandemic definitely brought us kicking and screaming into the 21st century.
01:06:17.662 --> 01:06:20.358
I think the biggest direction now is the provision of choice.
01:06:20.358 --> 01:06:24.460
So in a world where we can choose how we do most things.
01:06:24.460 --> 01:06:29.294
So if you want to go, if you're not going to Woolies, you order online and Woolies you get them to come to you.
01:06:29.294 --> 01:06:31.996
Like 10 years ago that would have been a novel concept.
01:06:31.996 --> 01:06:33.039
You know to do that.
01:06:33.039 --> 01:06:34.974
You don't want to go down to the restaurant?
01:06:34.974 --> 01:06:37.595
That's okay, you order, you bring it to the restaurant, we'll come to you.
01:06:37.595 --> 01:06:39.550
So we've got to.
01:06:39.550 --> 01:06:50.898
I think we've got to be more versatile around that and acknowledge to buyers and say, okay, we're going to try and work with you around the way that you want to consume this auction, either as a buyer or as a spectator.
01:06:51.510 --> 01:06:52.996
So on-site auctions are great.
01:06:52.996 --> 01:06:54.394
Everyone always says about the auction.
01:06:54.394 --> 01:06:55.438
On-site is great.
01:06:55.438 --> 01:06:56.512
It's the emotional buyer.
01:06:56.512 --> 01:06:58.358
But there's drawbacks to on-site auctions.
01:06:58.358 --> 01:07:06.416
On-site auctions you open the weather conditions wind, rain, extreme sun You're open to neighborhood disputes.
01:07:06.416 --> 01:07:13.175
So the neighbor next door who decides to it's the appropriate time to clean his Harley or get his chainsaw out.
01:07:13.175 --> 01:07:15.180
That happens more times than you'd think.
01:07:15.180 --> 01:07:24.172
The dog behind the little yappy dog who doesn't like the fact there's 40 people in the backyard and the other one starts barking all the way through the auction, which creates doubt and the mind of the buyers.
01:07:24.172 --> 01:07:25.737
And I don't know what you're dealing with that every day.
01:07:26.950 --> 01:07:30.019
There's all these factors that come into play when you're not in a controlled environment.
01:07:30.019 --> 01:07:39.278
In-room auctions give you control, but you lose the neighbors attending Neighbors aren't going to give their car a drive to an RSL to go watch it.
01:07:39.278 --> 01:07:43.459
And then you've got the pure online auctions, which some people have adopted.
01:07:43.459 --> 01:07:53.296
Pure online auctions give you total control, but we preach auctions are about engaging the community in transparency, and it probably runs away from those two things.
01:07:53.296 --> 01:07:57.039
So I think the best solution is provision of choice.
01:07:57.390 --> 01:08:15.276
So if we want to do this auction on-site, or in-rooms for that matter, that's great, but we're also going to stream it and we're going to distribute that link out to the neighbors and to the people so that if they feel like, hey, you know what, I don't really want to walk down the street today and watch it, I'm just going to sit on my couch and watch the auction they can still have the same experience to do that.
01:08:15.276 --> 01:08:25.114
And the buyer doesn't want to be present because they don't trust themselves emotionally or they feel like they're in a stressful environment, that they can watch it and then bid over the telephone.
01:08:25.114 --> 01:08:29.320
So they're not penalized for not being there, but they can still participate.
01:08:29.320 --> 01:08:31.216
So for me, it just comes back to choice.
01:08:31.216 --> 01:08:33.917
Let's give everyone as much choice as we can.
01:08:33.917 --> 01:08:35.198
We're now living a world of choice.
01:08:35.198 --> 01:08:37.954
Let's not be the archaic ones that aren't giving anyone choice.
01:08:38.936 --> 01:08:39.198
Nice.
01:08:39.198 --> 01:08:40.680
All right, we're going to pivot, mate.
01:08:40.680 --> 01:08:42.889
We're going to ask you to take off your auctioneer's hat.
01:08:42.889 --> 01:08:53.733
We're going to take off your being on the side of the seller's hat and where this is the conversation that I framed up with you before this chat, justin and you said you were keen to play.
01:08:53.733 --> 01:09:00.056
Your wife pulled and I know it's a recent lived experience for you, so we're excited about this but your wife pulls you aside.
01:09:00.056 --> 01:09:03.217
She says this is the property.
01:09:03.217 --> 01:09:10.917
Whatever you do, I know you're a legend in your field, mate, I know you've got all this, but whatever you do, do not miss it.
01:09:10.917 --> 01:09:15.257
Do not miss this property, and you have to buy it at auction.
01:09:15.257 --> 01:09:16.301
Talk us through.
01:09:16.301 --> 01:09:24.833
You've told us that you'd have a strategy and you'd bid quickly, so tell us a couple of other things that you're going to do to make sure that you don't disappoint your wife and miss this property.
01:09:26.192 --> 01:09:26.833
On this occasion.
01:09:26.833 --> 01:09:40.380
I think firstly and this is the advice we give and I'll always have auctioneer's hat on, so even if it's a little small hat under my bigger buyer's hat, the auctioneer hat is kind of a fix to my head, so it's hard to read that one.
01:09:40.380 --> 01:09:48.701
So pride comes before a fall, so don't let pride get in the way of you buying a property, and it happens all the time.
01:09:48.701 --> 01:09:53.775
So that can be ego, that can be lack of understanding, that can be wanting to win at all costs.
01:09:53.775 --> 01:09:57.679
We say that there's kind of two objectives, right.
01:09:57.679 --> 01:10:01.059
So this, putting myself in that scenario, I've got two objectives walking to that auction.
01:10:01.059 --> 01:10:02.673
Primary objective buy the property.
01:10:02.673 --> 01:10:08.234
Secondary objective try and buy it for as cheaply as possible, Try and save as much money as I can.
01:10:08.234 --> 01:10:14.176
Never let the secondary objective overtake the first one, and we see this with buyers a lot.
01:10:14.176 --> 01:10:22.177
They'll walk in more paralyzed by the thought of, oh, I don't want to pay too much, than realizing that I actually got into the first thing, which is buy it.
01:10:22.177 --> 01:10:32.002
Now, whether they like it or not, and whether I liked it or not and this is certainly my lived experience whether I like it or not, the seller has the asset that I want.
01:10:34.094 --> 01:10:36.079
So we talk about negotiations in real estate.
01:10:36.079 --> 01:10:38.859
So negotiations in real estate will be called a partially fixed negotiation.
01:10:38.859 --> 01:10:42.619
So what I mean by that is, one side is fixed in what they're offering.
01:10:42.619 --> 01:10:44.534
The other side is variable or partial.
01:10:44.534 --> 01:10:49.662
So most negotiations are totally variable or negotiations.
01:10:49.662 --> 01:10:56.844
So this party changes what they're offering and you go backwards and forwards In a negotiation between a seller and a buyer.
01:10:56.844 --> 01:10:58.289
What the seller has doesn't change.
01:10:58.289 --> 01:11:00.130
That stays consistent.
01:11:00.130 --> 01:11:05.970
So I've got to understand and recognize that if I want to buy it, they have what I want.
01:11:05.970 --> 01:11:13.390
Therefore, the owners is on me to satisfy them, not the other way around, Because they've already satisfied me by providing the property that I want.
01:11:13.390 --> 01:11:15.710
I've got to satisfy them when it comes to price.
01:11:15.710 --> 01:11:22.400
Now, yes, I'm going to try and work with them and yes, I'm going to try I'm going to try Australia to try and discover what their lowest price is, all that kind of stuff.
01:11:22.400 --> 01:11:28.298
But the owners is on me to satisfy them Because if nothing changes, they continue to hold the asset that I wanted.
01:11:29.230 --> 01:11:31.177
This is exactly what happened in our negotiation.
01:11:31.177 --> 01:11:32.949
So we came into the auction.
01:11:32.949 --> 01:11:35.599
So if you want me to step straight into it now, you've got another leading question.
01:11:35.599 --> 01:11:40.800
But we came into an auction, we had a plan around figures that we would go to.
01:11:40.800 --> 01:11:56.498
We'd done our ducks in a row with the bank, we hadn't had a huge amount of involvement throughout the campaign with the agents and probably, if I had my time again, we may have pushed harder to make an offer prior to the auction, Because I think offers prior to auction as a buyer are really valuable.
01:11:57.832 --> 01:12:00.983
Most buyers want to keep their cards close to their chest.
01:12:00.983 --> 01:12:04.617
I'm not going to tell the agent anything, Because if I show I'm keen, that'll be used against me.
01:12:04.617 --> 01:12:06.034
It's actually the opposite.
01:12:06.034 --> 01:12:12.682
So if you can make an offer A, it puts you in one A position for communication to run through you.
01:12:12.682 --> 01:12:15.198
Secondly, the benefit of an offer is twofold.
01:12:15.198 --> 01:12:17.096
Number one is you might buy it Great.
01:12:17.096 --> 01:12:30.976
Number two is it may help the seller understand the market more, and the frustration we have a lot is that every buyer wants the seller to understand the market and be realistic and reasonable, but most of them don't want to play their part in doing that.
01:12:31.949 --> 01:12:33.715
So I had a friend of mine.
01:12:33.715 --> 01:12:35.461
I was on the phone once to a mate of mine.
01:12:35.461 --> 01:12:38.739
I was complaining about the traffic, which is like a lived experience every day for me.
01:12:38.739 --> 01:12:40.958
So I was complaining about the traffic between the Gold Coast and Brisbane.
01:12:40.958 --> 01:12:42.894
I said, oh, this traffic so bad.
01:12:42.894 --> 01:12:44.518
He said, aren't you in your car?
01:12:44.518 --> 01:12:46.261
I said yeah, and he said well, you are the traffic.
01:12:46.261 --> 01:12:48.657
I was like actually that's a really good point.
01:12:48.657 --> 01:12:54.954
So this is what buyers have got to think is their job as the buyer is to get the seller to understand the market.
01:12:54.954 --> 01:13:03.078
You're the market, so you need to show them the market or else they're not going to understand it because you haven't played your part in helping you understand it.
01:13:03.078 --> 01:13:09.936
You can't sit back and hold your cards close to the chest and then blame them for not understanding the market when you haven't done your part in there.
01:13:09.936 --> 01:13:11.353
So how much time again.
01:13:11.353 --> 01:13:13.940
I probably would have made an offer prior to auction.
01:13:13.940 --> 01:13:17.779
So good learning experience to sort of do for next time for that.
01:13:18.230 --> 01:13:19.996
But we came into the auction ready to go.
01:13:19.996 --> 01:13:25.362
I was going to start the bidding but someone beat me to the punch in starting it.
01:13:25.362 --> 01:13:29.581
So obviously, listen to our video and took the advice on board.
01:13:29.581 --> 01:13:32.578
But then I employed the bidding quickly strategy.
01:13:32.578 --> 01:13:35.076
So they bid, we bid.
01:13:35.076 --> 01:13:37.672
They then dropped out Someone else.
01:13:37.672 --> 01:13:40.400
Bid, we bid, they bid, we bid.
01:13:40.400 --> 01:13:45.402
And then I could see that they were having long family discussions around every bid.
01:13:45.402 --> 01:13:49.457
So I just sort of said to my wife, like when is it going to keep going to a number?
01:13:49.457 --> 01:13:50.639
You're good, yeah, we're fine.
01:13:50.639 --> 01:13:51.621
And we just did that.
01:13:51.621 --> 01:13:53.423
We ended up pulling a fair bit short of our number.
01:13:53.423 --> 01:13:54.432
We're at paused.
01:13:56.190 --> 01:13:58.198
We subsequently increased our offer during the auction.
01:13:58.198 --> 01:13:59.454
Wasn't enough to buy it.
01:13:59.454 --> 01:14:13.738
We then negotiated for a brief period, for a few days after the auction, but couldn't hit upon a number that appeased the sellers and therefore they exercised their rights to rent it out, which is entirely their rights.
01:14:13.738 --> 01:14:19.417
Like I don't have any will towards them, If I was my property, I want to get as much as I can.
01:14:19.417 --> 01:14:27.359
If I didn't hit that number, I'd exercise my plan B, Though they had the asset that we wanted the owners on us to appease them to get to the number.
01:14:27.359 --> 01:14:29.537
We didn't want to do that or couldn't do that.
01:14:29.537 --> 01:14:31.636
Therefore they retain the asset and that's fine.
01:14:31.636 --> 01:14:34.556
So yeah, that's where I said I don't know where your definition of success is.
01:14:34.556 --> 01:14:35.500
We were the highest bidder.
01:14:35.500 --> 01:14:42.399
We were probably successful in some of the strategies we deployed, but not ultimately successful in that it's going to be our home.
01:14:42.399 --> 01:14:44.608
So there you go.
01:14:45.070 --> 01:14:46.355
So what's the next part of the story then?
01:14:46.355 --> 01:14:50.257
Is it waiting for them to blink, or are you looking for another property?
01:14:52.150 --> 01:14:54.118
To be continued is probably the next part of the story.
01:14:54.118 --> 01:14:56.217
So we weren't really looking.
01:14:56.217 --> 01:14:59.637
It just kind of ticked a lot of boxes for us at this point in time.
01:14:59.637 --> 01:15:07.563
So we're probably now passive buyers that if the right one came up we might be ready to just sort of move.
01:15:07.563 --> 01:15:13.257
Funny, my broker actually emailed me this morning and said hey, you want to keep this thing open and you know you always where there's life there's hope, right.
01:15:13.277 --> 01:15:14.399
So just keep it open.
01:15:14.399 --> 01:15:15.440
You never know, you never know.
01:15:15.440 --> 01:15:31.900
But yeah, we're probably now more passive than what we were, so we'll probably sit and wait and they've put a tenant in for at least six to 12 months, so that'll probably defer a decision where they come back to the market at that point in time and whether we're still there and ready to go at that point in time.
01:15:31.900 --> 01:15:33.636
So, yeah, to be continued.
01:15:33.636 --> 01:15:36.739
So we'll see what the next, the sequel, is in the trilogy.
01:15:37.612 --> 01:15:53.251
Well, you're the best type of buyer in terms of you're controlling the emotional element of that by being, you know, to your point, I'm not looking, but if something ticks a lot of our boxes then I can potentially move into the, into the go zone.
01:15:53.251 --> 01:16:00.163
And to your point I mean, ultimately you were in total control of the outcome, other than paying a price.
01:16:00.163 --> 01:16:05.649
You didn't feel like you know, coming back to your point before, I didn't need it that much.
01:16:05.649 --> 01:16:06.210
You know what I mean.
01:16:06.210 --> 01:16:09.681
Like you had a ceiling in terms of what that looked like, so.
01:16:09.681 --> 01:16:13.208
So I think you know, from my point of view, that's.
01:16:13.208 --> 01:16:13.911
That's the way.
01:16:14.351 --> 01:16:22.170
As you get more settled in property and you go through this journey of decades like Bruce and I have, that's the type of buy you can become.
01:16:22.170 --> 01:16:23.907
Like I'm not looking to move.
01:16:23.907 --> 01:16:34.148
But I tell you what if one of those really great properties up the road comes up for sale, I'm going to, I'm just going to do a little bit of you know paperwork and and see what the numbers sort of suggest.
01:16:34.148 --> 01:16:50.059
So we were looking, but you know, ultimately we might be in a position because any principal place of residence at home, I've got to tell you that's, that's a, that's a lovely asset to own, you know, from a capital gains point of view and also from a tax point of view as well.
01:16:50.059 --> 01:16:52.309
Right, it's a great way to create wealth.
01:16:52.784 --> 01:17:10.619
It also comes off the back of that, and you know we've learned that from some of the best agencies in New, and I say you know they just keep going back to their high new, high net worth individuals and they just they just buy these assets for 10 million 12 and they just know that in 10, 15 years time they're going to be selling them for 20 or 25, you know some of the easiest passive money they're ever going to make.
01:17:10.619 --> 01:17:13.512
So I think you know there's some logic in.
01:17:13.512 --> 01:17:17.654
You know that idea of always being open minded, which sounds like you are, justin.
01:17:17.654 --> 01:17:21.259
So you know, to be continued, as you say.
01:17:21.520 --> 01:17:24.190
Yeah, and I think I'd like to think I'm.
01:17:24.190 --> 01:17:27.779
Most sellers dream by like I don't get paralyzed by paying too much.
01:17:27.779 --> 01:17:34.859
I don't think I'd ever sit in the lounge room a month after the property settles and look at a view and go I wish I'd saved 50 grand here.
01:17:34.859 --> 01:17:41.859
Like for me it's if you can afford to do it and you like it within reason, then do it and don't get paralyzed on there.
01:17:41.859 --> 01:17:43.779
I don't have a typically around negotiation.
01:17:44.523 --> 01:17:52.693
If I've, from being involved and exposed to so many negotiations it's taught me anything it's don't get so hell bent that you have to win a negotiation.
01:17:52.693 --> 01:17:54.340
You know win, win is fine.
01:17:54.340 --> 01:17:57.400
Like, if you have a win in the seller feels good about it, then that's OK too.
01:17:57.400 --> 01:18:06.140
You don't need to leave the other person negotiation demoralized and you know bitter like that that's actually probably rarely a good long term strategy towards things.
01:18:06.140 --> 01:18:09.099
So you know, wherever possible, be as open and sure as possible.
01:18:09.099 --> 01:18:13.849
Be as open and transparent as you can Explain your reasoning and if it just doesn't work, it doesn't work.
01:18:13.849 --> 01:18:19.086
But yeah, I think when you said this story before about you know my wife saying we've got to have this home.
01:18:19.086 --> 01:18:20.149
It's actually the opposite price.
01:18:20.149 --> 01:18:21.618
I'm more likely to be one to come home.
01:18:21.921 --> 01:18:24.269
So I really want this and she'll get dragged along for the ride.
01:18:24.400 --> 01:18:26.268
So yeah, we'll see.
01:18:26.560 --> 01:18:29.829
Well, usually when there's a motion involved, there's always buyers regret.
01:18:29.829 --> 01:18:33.850
There's going to be buyers regret with, now that we've got it, maybe we pay too much.
01:18:33.850 --> 01:18:35.806
So you'll have that moment of buyers regret.
01:18:35.806 --> 01:18:40.845
But on the other side of it, if you miss out, there will be that oh we missed it, I wish we had a got it.
01:18:40.845 --> 01:18:42.185
There's this none.
01:18:42.185 --> 01:18:47.247
You'll never have that equal playing ground in terms of when you're, when you've got an emotional attachment to an asset.
01:18:47.247 --> 01:18:48.725
It's just just the way it's going to be.
01:18:49.900 --> 01:18:50.100
Yes.
01:18:51.640 --> 01:18:54.248
Well, justin, congratulations on a couple of things.
01:18:54.248 --> 01:18:57.789
One is for getting the opportunity to speak at Eric this year.
01:18:57.789 --> 01:19:09.592
So I've been going for the last decade, and so they don't invite people onto the stage who are not great at their craft, so that's a, that's a clue for the rise that you've had as a, as a practitioner.
01:19:09.592 --> 01:19:10.403
So well done on that.
01:19:10.403 --> 01:19:35.127
Congratulations on your, the business and the, the relationships that you've built to get yourself in the position that you're in and I guess, from our perspective, thanks for coming on and sharing some of the inside is insights to what it is to be on at the peak of the mountain for your craft and to get some insights for our, for our people on the buyer side, to have a have a view of what that looks like.
01:19:35.199 --> 01:19:55.859
But I personally think that you're probably in one of the one of the best lanes of real estate in my view, because you get to, you get to do something that you love across a whole cross section of property types and building relationships.
01:19:55.859 --> 01:20:04.622
So you don't necessarily have to be in the lounge rooms and doing the listing, presentations and some of the the big prospecting challenges that come to the agents of that level.
01:20:04.622 --> 01:20:10.760
You just get to prospect to and build relationships with agents and then and then turn up on game day on Saturday.
01:20:10.760 --> 01:20:14.725
So I think that's it's a real position I'm sure you're really grateful to be in.
01:20:14.725 --> 01:20:19.425
But, on behalf of everyone here on the property catch, thanks for sharing your insights.
01:20:20.220 --> 01:20:21.524
Yeah, thanks for guys, really enjoyed it.
01:20:22.306 --> 01:20:25.480
Thanks, justin, you're through Well.
01:20:25.480 --> 01:20:36.329
There you go, ben, some some very, very powerful insights from someone who is spending a lot of time dedicated to their craft and understanding what the game of auction auctioneering is.
01:20:36.329 --> 01:20:49.650
But for our listeners, you got a very rare little insight there into what, what is going on on that side of the fence, so you can arm yourself better when you're bidding against a skilled auctioneer like Justin Ben.
01:20:50.421 --> 01:20:51.284
Oh, just terrific.
01:20:51.284 --> 01:21:06.574
I mean, ultimately I could listen to Justin quite a lot because I think he's he's very comfortable, he's he speaks well and he's not trying to make it something that it's not like he's not trying to be a hype merchant.
01:21:06.574 --> 01:21:15.319
So, yeah, you've really got an insider's view there on the art of auctioning and how that plays out, and and from both sides of the fence.
01:21:15.319 --> 01:21:20.391
So I found that to be a wonderful insight and I'll certainly be listening again.
01:21:20.391 --> 01:21:25.627
You know, even like you and I, we're students of life, we're students of property.
01:21:25.627 --> 01:21:25.989
We're not.
01:21:25.989 --> 01:21:29.500
You know we're, we're striving for mastery, but we will never get there.
01:21:29.500 --> 01:21:35.739
Anyone who's always knows that, and so that's just another piece of knowledge that we'll be able to bring.
01:21:35.739 --> 01:21:38.210
You know, I directly learned something about.
01:21:38.210 --> 01:21:43.340
You know that the final bidder doesn't have the first right of refusal in Queensland.
01:21:43.340 --> 01:21:44.545
I did not know that.
01:21:44.545 --> 01:21:50.907
So you know, there's an example of an, you know, of a learning listen from just talking to Justin today.
01:21:51.922 --> 01:21:53.228
I agree, mate.
01:21:53.228 --> 01:21:55.739
I've been to scores and scores of auctions.
01:21:55.739 --> 01:21:59.980
I've bid at scores and scores of auctions and my lips were closed.
01:21:59.980 --> 01:22:01.539
My ears were in full tune there.
01:22:01.539 --> 01:22:07.720
If someone, someone who's that good at his craft, I'd be mad not to be hanging on every word that he had.
01:22:07.720 --> 01:22:31.005
So, justin, thanks for joining us today and I think our hopefully our audience got a huge benefit from your insights as we sort of wind down, ben, but it's auction season is going to really peak again as we come out into the new year, so it's good for people to marinate on those thoughts and percolate on them over the Christmas New Year breaks, that they can get themselves prepped if they need to buy an auction.
01:22:31.005 --> 01:22:41.400
Hey, my life hack today, ben, is I actually want to crowdsource something from our audience so we might put, we might put some social content out on our platforms.
01:22:41.621 --> 01:22:56.386
But one of the frustrations I've always had with podcasts is I'm driving, I'm walking, I'm somewhere where it's not convenient, but someone drops a truth bomb or some nugget of wisdom.
01:22:56.386 --> 01:23:06.940
I mean, imagine you've just listened to our episode right now and Justin just said something that was just like an aha epiphany for you and you go oh, how am I actually going to capture that.
01:23:06.940 --> 01:23:10.109
I'm just driving at the moment or I'm just not convenient to write it down.
01:23:10.109 --> 01:23:15.501
Well, I was recently listening to no Secret to Our Own and it's been.
01:23:15.501 --> 01:23:25.565
Morgan Housel is one of my favorite people to have a speak into my life right now and he was being interviewed on the Tim Ferriss podcast because he's got his new book out the same as ever.
01:23:25.565 --> 01:23:30.211
And he made this suggestion and it was so stupidly simple.
01:23:30.211 --> 01:23:32.327
I just went oh, why don't I think of that?
01:23:32.327 --> 01:23:33.663
So I want to share it with the audience.
01:23:33.663 --> 01:23:41.810
And it was simple as this Once you're listening to a podcast and someone says something that you all you do is screenshot it at the point that they said it, ben.
01:23:41.900 --> 01:23:51.351
So if they did it on ours, and something that Justin said at the 27 minute 13, second mark, to screenshot it at that point automatically goes into your photos.
01:23:51.351 --> 01:24:07.470
And then when you're in a position where you can actually go down because I do carry a journal, it's a Jim Rowne journal, ben I'll show everyone it's the Jim Rowne journal and I write and this is for people who are watching on YouTube any great idea I have, I just write it down.
01:24:07.470 --> 01:24:21.913
So what I can actually do is then I can go back to the screenshot rewind when I'm sitting down, listen to it again, write it down and then I preserve that thought that can easily be lost in the cloud of stuff going on in the day.
01:24:21.913 --> 01:24:27.768
So it was so painfully simple and obvious and I was kicking myself thinking why didn't I think of it before?
01:24:27.768 --> 01:24:32.868
Some people might have already been doing that, ben, for those of you who have the same a-ha as me, hopefully that helps.
01:24:32.940 --> 01:24:35.663
But here's what I want to crowd source, ben, what do you do?
01:24:35.663 --> 01:24:45.050
What are people who are listening to us do when they have a podcast in their ears and it's not convenient for them to be able to write it down or jot down the note?
01:24:45.050 --> 01:24:52.034
What do you actually do to say that I'd love to share those in upcoming podcasts?
01:24:52.034 --> 01:24:58.545
Given, we are a podcast Ben, we are talking to a podcast community who love a podcast, so we really want to share.
01:24:58.545 --> 01:25:00.222
So what's your hack?
01:25:00.222 --> 01:25:06.654
Folks around capturing the insights that you get on podcasts when it's not convenient?
01:25:06.654 --> 01:25:07.904
So hopefully-.
01:25:07.960 --> 01:25:09.184
That's a challenge, because you're right.
01:25:09.184 --> 01:25:14.033
If you're driving or riding a bike or running an operating machinery, we don't advise you to stop.
01:25:14.033 --> 01:25:17.609
We do advise you to stop, but not try and do it at the same time.
01:25:18.081 --> 01:25:18.864
Do two things at once.
01:25:18.864 --> 01:25:19.606
So that is true.
01:25:19.606 --> 01:25:25.045
I mean, on Audible there's a thing called a clip and that clip will be 15 seconds and you can write your notes on that.
01:25:25.045 --> 01:25:27.887
So you do have time to just stop and take that piece.
01:25:27.887 --> 01:25:37.543
But you're right, I haven't seen I know there's been a recent upgrade to podcasts on Apple, but I haven't sort of done a deep dive in terms of some of the new features Bookmarkers, don't they?
01:25:38.619 --> 01:25:40.215
They should have a I should double check that if they've got the-.
01:25:41.882 --> 01:25:45.451
But hopefully our community might reach out to us and tell us exactly what's happening there.
01:25:45.451 --> 01:25:55.211
But there's no doubt that obviously that's a great way to capture those little bits of gold and you do a great job of putting them all into writing into your journal.
01:25:55.771 --> 01:25:57.845
Yeah, there we go, or what's making property?
01:25:57.904 --> 01:25:58.547
news, ben.
01:25:58.547 --> 01:26:00.425
I think it's important.
01:26:00.425 --> 01:26:03.710
We've got one sort of episode left before we go into summer series.
01:26:03.710 --> 01:26:08.412
So what's happening in the auction market is a good segue from today's show.
01:26:08.412 --> 01:26:16.828
And we did see that the combined capital cities last weekend had the lowest preliminary clearance rate in the last 32 weeks.
01:26:16.828 --> 01:26:26.284
So even though so what we are seeing definitely at the moment is an increase in volume, so increase in supply and that and what?
01:26:26.364 --> 01:26:42.029
Obviously what we've been talking about a lot is how much of that supply is being absorbed, because at the moment that's going to determine price movements in the short term over the next three to six months in terms of how much buyer demand is in there.
01:26:42.029 --> 01:26:49.707
And at the moment we know that that absorption has been there, so that buyer demand is there and it's meeting that supply side.
01:26:49.707 --> 01:27:05.811
But there's certainly markets like Sydney and Melbourne, canberra, hobart where that sort of buyer demand is starting to now be challenged, so that can potentially represent further buying opportunities in the medium term.
01:27:05.811 --> 01:27:07.626
But that's just an indication of that.
01:27:07.626 --> 01:27:12.905
So we're seeing auction clearance rates in those markets being a bit challenged, certainly Sydney and Melbourne.
01:27:12.905 --> 01:27:28.773
I don't really care too much about the auction clearance rates in Brisbane or Adelaide or other markets like Canberra and Perth, because they're just not materially significant, so they don't have any sort of great reliability around where their sort of activity is in the market.
01:27:28.773 --> 01:27:31.547
Just a one to be aware of.
01:27:31.547 --> 01:27:42.359
We'll do, obviously, a big property outlook update in February next year, but it's very clear that some of those markets are starting to lose a bit of their momentum.
01:27:42.359 --> 01:27:57.854
Now, if I'm also a buyer and I'm thinking about Christmas market and some of those properties aren't selling during Christmas, those sellers, those vendors there's going to be a few of those vendors who are going to be out there who are going to say I just want to see the back end of that.
01:27:57.854 --> 01:28:11.087
So I think that for the first time in probably as long as I can think of Bryce, where there's going to be some good buying opportunities over Christmas, new Year, because people I think vendors expectations are going to be lowered.
01:28:11.087 --> 01:28:23.934
So if you're thinking about buying over this next period of time, you can't do this in Adelaide, you can't do this in Perth they are still red hot markets and Brisbane is also red hot markets.
01:28:23.934 --> 01:28:25.265
So you can't do those in those markets.
01:28:25.265 --> 01:28:42.148
But in the other markets you can have a look at what's been hanging around on the market and look at the land content, look at reliable and durable and those types of properties you want to Bryce's point on Peter Kallises point, you just want to buy, hold and wait in terms of how those particular markets play out.
01:28:42.148 --> 01:28:48.451
So that's the emerging story in terms of what's happening from a price trend point of view.
01:28:50.739 --> 01:28:53.728
And the other large story that came out this week Bryce was.
01:28:53.728 --> 01:29:03.012
On Sunday the Paloche, a government up in Queensland, you know sort of she's decided to boost the first homeowner's grant.
01:29:03.012 --> 01:29:08.850
So it's now $30,000 if you're buying or building a new property.
01:29:08.850 --> 01:29:10.873
Not, it's not existing property.
01:29:10.873 --> 01:29:15.030
But there's been a lot of debate around how that helps the market.
01:29:15.030 --> 01:29:16.806
It just raises prices for everyone else.
01:29:16.806 --> 01:29:22.810
Yeah, that's potentially true, but ultimately we're still a strong believer that we love to see people get into property.
01:29:22.810 --> 01:29:33.310
So there's a counterbalance to that and they're arguing with the mining royalty taxes increases they're able to do this for first home buyers in the Queensland market.
01:29:33.310 --> 01:29:39.886
And who would have guessed Bryce were coming into an election year next year for and you know that government is in a little bit of trouble.
01:29:39.886 --> 01:29:44.470
So I think you know they're trying to buy some boats with a policy like this.
01:29:45.220 --> 01:29:46.384
Knocked me over with a feather, mate.
01:29:46.384 --> 01:29:47.307
I wouldn't believe that much.
01:29:47.307 --> 01:29:48.645
You'd said that, so very good.
01:29:48.645 --> 01:29:54.164
Well, hopefully, folks, you've agreed that that's been an action pack show today with a lot of really great content.
01:29:54.164 --> 01:30:00.373
So again, thank you to our guest interviewer today, which was Justin Nickerson.
01:30:00.373 --> 01:30:07.527
But, mate, last week, next week, as you said, is the penultimate episode before we go into summer series and we've got a ripper.
01:30:07.527 --> 01:30:15.007
We're talking about what money means to people and it's we've got some really awesome insights to share, so we want to make sure people stick around for that.
01:30:15.007 --> 01:30:16.324
But, mate, until next week.
01:30:17.300 --> 01:30:23.685
Knowledge is empowering, but only if you act on it, because, bryce, you're either a property owner or you're not.
01:30:23.685 --> 01:30:25.765
Oh, nice one.
01:30:25.784 --> 01:30:26.306
Variation.
01:30:26.306 --> 01:30:26.627
Love it.
01:30:26.627 --> 01:30:27.430
See you next week, folks.
01:30:27.430 --> 01:30:30.680
Hey folks, bryce, here again.
01:30:30.680 --> 01:30:34.750
I just wanted to catch you real quick before you go.
01:30:35.380 --> 01:30:56.368
If you're new to our community, I want to encourage you to listen to our very first 20 episodes, as the concepts we share in EPS One through 20 are foundational principles, pillars and frameworks that you need to know for you to get the best value from our content week to week on our show, my little tip is to listen to it at one and a half speed.
01:30:57.300 --> 01:31:02.907
Now, for those of you that are time poor and don't have the option to go back to the beginning, don't worry, because we've got you covered as well.
01:31:03.699 --> 01:31:13.189
We've created a binge guide that summarized these foundational episodes into one easy-to-digest booklet so that you can get up to speed super fast.
01:31:13.189 --> 01:31:22.030
So go to the show description on whatever device you're listening to now and simply click on the first 20 episodes link to download it straight away.
01:31:22.030 --> 01:31:38.945
Oh and, by the way, whilst you're there, you'll find a few extra goodies for you, including a link to download our lifestyle by design app more, the home of Wealthspeed and Wealthcock, and our hugely popular MoneySmart's money management system, as well as how to get free copies of our bestselling books.
01:31:38.945 --> 01:31:54.451
Now, just a reminder that anything we cover on this podcast is not considered to be financial advice, and we certainly recommend that you seek out expert advice tailored to your unique circumstances, and everything we talk about is general in nature.
01:31:54.451 --> 01:32:04.100
Folks, I want to encourage you again to click on the show description, wherever you are listening, to access all the free goodies we have for you Until next week.