*Throwback* Individualism, Anarchism and Sociopathy w/ Josh Neal

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I want to welcome everyone back to the Pekingana Show.
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I'm here with j Neil Janiel right, Jay, Jay's okay,
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you can call me Josh, Josh, Josh Neil.
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What's going on, Josh, Oh, it's going well, it's it's
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a great pleasure to be speaking to you. I have
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to say shout out to my friend Jefferson Lee. H
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he put me on to you because you have this
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great series with Thomas seven seven on like all these
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historical things, and it's just a it's a real it's
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a real public service you two guys do, so kudos
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to you.
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Thank you, and then tomorrow starts the balk the nineteen
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nineties Balkan Wars.
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All right, let's go.
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Yeah, tell everybody a little bit about yourself.
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Well yeah, so, as I said before, I host or
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co host Jefferson Lee Show with my friend Jefferson Lee,
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who's also in this. I write. I have a substack
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Jneil dot substack. I've branded it as Psychopolitics and it's
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mostly essays on psychology and politics, and there's an accompanying
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YouTube channel. My first book with Imperium Press is called
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American Extremist. The Psychology of Political extremism, and I actually
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got a new one coming out with them in a
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few weeks called Understanding Conspiracy Theories. But yeah, for people
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who don't know me, I've been i would say, in
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the radical righte with my name and face out there
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since twenty seventeen, twenty eighteen. I made the switch. I think,
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like for a lot of people I know, we were
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hardcore Trumpists, like very libertarian, but like on that cusp
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of well what used to be called the liberty, like
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the libertarian to a right pipeline. And so I was
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one of those guys. And when when the Seria strikes happened,
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that's when I started to look away from Trump and
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start looking to other things. And then in twenty seventeen,
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obviously that was the ault right. So for people who
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don't know me, that's my background.
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Tell me a little bit about American extremists.
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Yeah, so a little bit of a personal story. I
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was in twenty nineteen. I was involved with some people
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that your audience may be familiar with, people like Richard Spencer,
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so on and so forth, Augustas and Victis. At the time,
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he was running for office at presidential office and remember yeah, yeah,
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and it was wild, great guy, terrible what happened to him?
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He's out, obviously, and so he's back to streaming, you know,
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to your audience, showing your love and affection. He's a
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great guy. But I got docked as a result of
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getting involved with a lot of those people. And I
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had already I came into the alt right because I
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have a background in psychology, maybe you guessed from the
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title of the book, and I went you know, I
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didn't go to the doctoral direction because the kinds of
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questions I was interested in were more political and philosophical
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than like strictly speaking about mental health or whatever social
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science research I guess on today. So I was already
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working on some stuff observations I had over the years.
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But it was really like getting into the radical right
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was like having the veil pulled away from your eyes
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entirely so, and then getting docked as a result of
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that kind of made me have to confront some kind
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of realities. Like when I got into it, I was like, oh, well, Nazis,
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that's not a real thing. That's just like a libtard fantasy.
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And you know, by and large it's not you know,
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it's not like there's a well organized, politically active machine
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that has political, cultural material resources, things like that. Obviously
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that's not happening, but none the less, there are people
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who espouse those views, and they range from totally harmless, tepid,
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you know, contributing members of society who just want the
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trains to run on time, and on the other end
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are actual degenerates, people you wouldn't want to associate yourself with.
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The reality I think, as most people probably know, is
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that really is an extreme, heavily ostracized minority, not just
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by polite society, but even in these kinds of circles.
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You know, I do think we do a really good
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job of self policing, maybe to our detriment, because obviously
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the left doesn't do that at all. They just set
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their freaks loose. So when I came out of that,
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I felt like I had some unique things to say
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about what was wrong with American politics, left right and center,
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and so I kind of wrote the book imagining I'm
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holding someone's hand through a red pill process a very
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you know, not like cutesy memes and gifts like this
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is a little bit more. You're gonna have to take
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some breaks, you have to go back to the corner
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and have them you know, fucking whatever those things in
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boxing that they put when you get when you start
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developing the mouses, they put that huge fucking like think
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or compress on your head like this is a red
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pill like that, but you'll need the compress and everything.
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So it starts off talking about media control, myth, the
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mythological narrativizing as the framework people should be thinking about
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rather than like ideology or so on and so forth.
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And so I carry people through this, you know, here's
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what's you know, here's what myth is. Here's like how
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this kind of psychological framework is influencing your decision making,
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so on and so forth. And I give actual lots
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of citations to that. And then obviously going of the media.
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You know, this is because the basic thesis of the
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book is it's not an original idea. I just really
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kind of beat the hell out of it over the
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course of the book. Is that the liberal establishment is
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genuinely where political violence originates from. Whether it's you know,
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forced integration by gun by military, whether it's Antifa in
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the streets, which is not so much a thing right now,
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whether it's journalists going after you wait, oh, yes, right,
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just yeah, I don't want to speak too soon. Knock
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on wood. So getting people to think, which is very
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easy if you're talking to conservatives, because they already hate
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the government, and they hated the government for like one
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hundred and fifty three hundred years. The Americans have just
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always hated the government, and so it's very easy to
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be like, well, here's here's this persecutory framework, but you
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have to adjust some of the variables because obviously Connink
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runs on his own persecutory framework and it's false, as
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we all know. So that's the basic thesis, and then
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I try to explain how that is. And in some
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cases it's talking about literally I was writing this during
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twenty twenty, so every week i'm like kind of pseudo
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like like almost like a historian of it, like an
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ancient Roman historian, like there were this many black people
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on the street this day, and they busted this many
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heads or whatever. So it's half like okay, philosophical analysis,
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but also half like detailing the actual political violence that
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was happening at that time. I actually think it made
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it even more impactful because it's like here's theoretical stuff,
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here's some nice size sources and citations. And then also,
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here's the video of a black guy stomping on someone's
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head until they're bleeding all over the place. Obviously that's
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not what's in the book. And then taking these people,
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you know, well, here's what's wrong with the left wing
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in America, here's what's wrong with the centrism, liberalism it
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kind of informally, and then what's wrong with the right,
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And a lot of it relies very heavily on kind
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of classical psychoanalytic theories, but it's not all psychoanalysis, and
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as Mike likes to say, the book does take Freud
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back for the right. So I mean, if you have
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if you're allergic to or sensitive to Freud, and obviously
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I understand why people would be. It's very much like
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a different spin on kind of a familiar story.
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One of these days, you've got to come back and
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do an episode just on narrative building, because I mean,
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that's where everything is. And anybody who doesn't realize that
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after the last four years is just not paying attention.
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They're in their ideological box and they're you know, playing
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playing with is them and their friends playing by themselves.
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You know, it's just you and stepped out to look
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around and see exactly what's happening out here. But one
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of the things that I really been looking at lately
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is individualism. And I think it's hard to miss that
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this was. Individualism was a big part of the founding
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of this country. You can see it in the founding documents.
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People will argue that, sure, you know there was individual
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people talked about individual rights, but there was collectives and everything.
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Well sure, okay, yeah, there were collectives and everything, but
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everything always moves left, it seems, so you you sort
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of knew that it wasn't going to last anyone who
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you could look at you you know things, things don't
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get better until they get really, really, really really bad.
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And so there's a section in the book where you
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talk about is after the narrative, part about the narrative,
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it where it's individualism, anarchism, and I think sociopathy. So
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can we get a little bit into you know, like
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what you see as when it comes to individualism, is
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that what you see is that is that what you
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see this society and this culture being all about.
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Yes and no pros and cons on both sides of
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that equation. I mean, Kevin McDonald obviously famously has written
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about this. I think it's pretty uncontroversial to say that
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the Western tradition is the tradition of the individual. However,
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in the same way, to be a liberal in the
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eighteenth century meant something different than to be a liberal today.
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To be an individual in the eighteenth century meant something
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different than it does today. I read a lot. I've
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been reading a lot of San Francis and James Burnham lately,
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and you know, one of the things that San Francis emphasizes, Sorry,
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I just lost my train of thought is that.
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In eighteenth century liberalism is different than liberalism today.
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And then being an individual okay, thank you. So he
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talks about like, for instance, great safe, very good job.
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You know, he talks about okay, you know, there's these
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different types of liberals, and if you were a liberal
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in the eighteenth century, actually, you know, fundamentally, what's distinguishing
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it from today's liberal is all of these restraints and
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considerations and obligations and duties and belongingness and embeddedness. That
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is the background of all this cool, sexy enlightenment liberal
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stuff that we started doing over the last couple hundred years.
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There was a story in the news not so long ago,
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maybe a couple of years ago, someone was trying to
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get Immanuel count canceled because they found his like private
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correspondences where he just talks about racism and hating women
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and stuff like that. And it's like, none of these
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people it was just a foregone conclusion that that that
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whatever they theorized was occurring in a homogeneous European Christian context.
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So same thing with being an individual. You still had
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responsibilities and obligations and duties and and and other things.
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Your individualism was still curtailed by larger social forces, the church,
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the different political organizations, so and so forth at that time,
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and so you still had to fit in society. But
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today it's really the opposite. Society is now increasingly bending
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to accommodate the most extreme individual people who can collectivize
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and then create this political edifice that that makes the
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rest of us conform to them. Where I work, you know,
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I had to accommodate a gender, non whatever kind of person,
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and you know that's their individualism kind of like having
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this warping effect on the social fields around them. Like, well,
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suddenly the rest of us are caught in your madness,
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And that's just part of the equation you said before
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you kind of like hinted at the moldbug line about
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you know, Cthulhu always swimming left. I think that's obviously
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because technology has this corrosive effect on social norms and
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morera's the ultimate consequence or outcome of which is this
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kind of radical liberation from all this social embeddedness going on.
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So today, to be an individual is I mean, I'm
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not the first person to say this. Your audience hopefully
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very well understands this. To be an individual today is
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unlike any probably any kind of person that has ever
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existed in human history. To the point I remember I
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for a short spell, I was a teacher, the university teacher,
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and I remember telling my students like ten years ago,
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like because the hot question I would always get day one,
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like intro psychology classes, like okay, professor deets, what's up
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with all these trans folks?
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Right?
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And then like I'm trying to go through the like
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syllabus and they're like can you make sense of this?
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To me? Like all right, hold on, but like to
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go through that conversation with them and be like, well,
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guess that's not even weird, Like just wait seven years
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and you're going to have people like with prosthetics and
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you're gonna have to start calling them what they want
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or just the the the the the, if you want
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to say. The continuing like revolutionary spirit of this is
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just going to keep bringing new manifestations of this. So
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with regards to the title of that section, Individualism and Sociopathy,
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the argument I make said, effectively, to be like an entrepreneur,
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you know, the Fu Coodian self entrepreneur, to be this
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neoliberal person, to be an American you know extensive air quotes,
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is to be this radically self constructed person with like
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no predecessor, no context, no pretext. It's solipsism. I mean,
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it's every nasty word you've ever heard in a philosophy class,
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but ultimately it's pathological.
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Do you see that as like, particularly a post World
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War two phenomenon where you really start seeing things this
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it all start breaking apart as far as a real
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change and what it means to be an individual.
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Yes, although the seeds of that were very clearly starting
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to show in the fifty sixty years prior to that. So,
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you know, the progressive tradition in the United States at
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the turn of the twentieth century was a Nazi progressive vision.
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To put it indelicately, I mean everything that the Third
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Reich did, not everything, but the things that we mostly
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remember them for, the economic policies and the kind of
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extreme technocratic interest on social policies. That's those are Anglo inventions.
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That's Atlanticist philosophy. Turn of the twentieth century. American and
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Englishmen are looking out at the world and they're seeing
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what we've come to inherit and they're like, oh my god,
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what what the hell do we do about all this?
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And I think there was some kind of attempt to
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shepherd in a new vision of the individual that could,
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you know, protect the white race, to protect white people,
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to protect America, to protect England, the British Isles, to
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protect political sovereignty in European nations, so on, to protect
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the Constitution. I mean, these these things are all synonymous, really,
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It's not like they're separate things. If you want to
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protect the Constitution, if you want to say of America,
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if you want to do the North I almost had
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Norman Rockwell, if you to the George Lincoln Rockwell thing, Well,
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it's all the same thing. But uh yeah, So as
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far as that post war aspect of that, I look
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at the post war order, and this is an argument
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I'm making my upcoming book. There was a slur that
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was very common at that time used by effectively the
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radical right whenever they would talk about the liberal consensus,
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you know, they would talk about, well, that's that's what
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they would call them. It was this consensus view, and
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it had a kind of derogatory uh kind of like
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proto libtard, like if you were the consensus, your your
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you were brainwashed, you were just spouting kind of like
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this new fangled liberal social ideology that had no popularity
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really or history prior to the Second World War. So
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this consensus was the meeting of you know, the dying
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Atlantis sist Empire and this surge of European migration into
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the West, of a very particular type of European from Russia,
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maybe the Pale somewhere over there, and they met in
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the middle. The West had to be saved. We you know,
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the whole European experiment, like twentieth century is like this
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great tragedy of us, just like figuring out new ways
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to just roast each other, and by the middle of
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the twentieth century, how many of us are left, not
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a lot of the good ones. So it's this waning
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Western empire that's bringing in a lot of this well
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as we know now ex Bolshevist you know, or descended
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from Bolshevist types who came in wanted to find a
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place in America, and they found flattering ways to reinforce
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the waning American liberal ideology in a way that made
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sense post you know, San Francis to speak, to invoke
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him one more time, post this managerial revolution, this mass
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managerial revolution. So you know, there's a lot of ideas
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and concepts that emerged at that time that are not
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necessarily related. Maybe if you tried to do a genealogy
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and try to connect these things, like Glenn Beck on
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Fox News with his whiteboard, maybe you couldn't do that.
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But nonetheless they're all talking about the same goal. I
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invoked Fuko before the Entrepreneur of the Self, his idea
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of neoliberalism. This is the new American economic policy post
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World War Two, which the major emphasis of which was
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about this internal kind of psychic development that was supposed
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to be this you know, essential to unlocking this American
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economic engine to fulfilling you know, the old American idea,
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but in a new way, uh, in this new technocratic society.
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And so my inherited wisdom. You know, I'm a little
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bit younger than you. I'm still in my thirties. I
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had my birthday earlier this week. The things I was
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told growing up, that we're good pieces of advice, follow
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your dreams, do it makes you happy. This is like
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the head smashed in, you know, inherited version of of
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like the Fucodian ideas, like you can liberate yourself and
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you can be anything that you want, and all of
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this is like a radical political act, but it's also
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American and bubblah. So I think it's specifically and obviously
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the purpose of this consensus being, you know, how do
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we manage the existing populations while we get this new
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migratory program in place. So I feel like that individualism
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not to get like crazy tinfoil hat is not like
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an intentional thing that was done, like we're going to
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ameliorate or we're gonna anesthetize people while we start moving
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infinity Africans around. I think it was kind of a
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natural development, but the consequences obviously for us have been terrible.
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It's sort of like we've become we're like these radical
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surfs or these radical annuities, walking annuities. Basically, what they
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wanted was a transactional society, and it basically turned us
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into transactional beings. And yeah, nasally, that's part of the
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individuality of it is what what are you contributing to commerce?
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It's what the military is now. I mean, if you
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go to the Navy's website, it will say that they
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are there to protect the you know, the sea lanes
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for commerce in the world, you know, so that it
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can move. And yeah, so I was thinking you were
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One of the things that you had mentioned was how
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even with the individualism of the old, of the previous
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to what we're dealing with now, when you had church,
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when you had family structure, when you had a lot
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of things to keep you grounded, to keep you as
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part of a tight knit I think our our reno
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return to the strong gods something like that. Yeah, and
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that's that's what That's what I was thinking the whole time,
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was the goal of crushing you know, like the Italian
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American society and mutual aid societies, churches, and the family
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is to turn everybody into this radical kind of monetary instrument.
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Basically, yeah, I well, some things to keep in mind
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as you're talking. I've always got the eternal like devil
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angel on one side or the other. I'm a terrible contrarian.
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So as you're talking, I was starting to do a bit,
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a bit of a like a hey man, and that's
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not really fair, right, because I was starting to think, well,
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transaction has always been part of society. You know, the
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internal critic who's like watching us and thinking they're full
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of shit. I'm trying to answer them as I'm listening
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to you, like, there's always been an economic component of society.
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So fundamentally, how is this different, right, Because that's probably
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what someone who's listening to you and disagrees with you
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and me might say, And it's the fundamentally, it's a
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qualitative difference more than anything else. One of the things
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I was thinking of that I think is a really
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good example of what you're talking about, a contempt a
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modern phenomenon is exactly how the red pill manosphere or
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community has ended up like this year, where if you
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listen to or read people in these communities talk about specifically,
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men talk about, you know, why they fail with women,
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or why feminism sucks, or why the world has given
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them a raw deal, so on and so forth. Is
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they start talking about, like they roll out their laundry
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list of things that they expect the woman to bring,
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because it's a it's a tit for tat, you know,
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I want to solve the free loader problem. You know,
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all of these things where well she doesn't you know,
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if she doesn't cook and do this and that and
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have one hundred and seventy thousand dollars or four one
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k and blah blah blah blah. It's like, for one thing,
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it's very feminine because like the whole transactional thing was
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like trying to solve the native sexual inequalities between men
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and women and trying to solve like all of these
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complex social problems fertility, pair bonding, alleviating tribal conflicts, ameliorating
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tribal conflicts, so on and so forth, and so on
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the one hand, you know, qualitatively has it different as
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part of this inversion, the wrong people or have become
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the being counters. Being counting is kind of a womanly thing,
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and I don't mean that in a derogatory sense, like
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you know they mind the domestic life. You know, they're
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very fastidious details in that manner. They make up eighty
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percent of automestic spending, like that's their domain. That's a
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qualitative difference. But now that it's also I was going
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to say this before, it's also much more egotistical, and
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we might as well say egotistical pejoratively egotism. I mean
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we might as well say when I really, when I
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talk about individualism in the book, it's probably better to
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say egotism and extreme radical egotism, which is all about, well,
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ultimately like you're not really interfacing with direct reality because
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you're interfacing first with this buffer of your own self
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aggrandizing bullshit, which the contemporary version of individualism is just
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like constantly throwing It's like a guy just always throwing
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gasoline on the fire so you can come up with
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ever more insane cope, like this guy Will Stancil on Twitter.
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I don't know if you've been watching him. It's like
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it's like we're going on a full business week of
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this and all you're watching is just egotism.
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Yeah, yeah, it's it's remarkable. Well, let's let's talk about this.
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Because we can talk about individualism, we can talk about anarchism,
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but what it crosses over and in your personal life,
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I mean, that can cause enough problems, especially relationship wise
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with your family. But let's cross over into the political. Now,
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when that crosses over into the political, where do we
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end up? What's the path down that road?
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Yeah, well, anarchism is one, you know, expressly political manifestation.
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I have a very small I would say, like maybe
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sub ten percent sympathy for anarchism, but it's not morally
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related to what you typically see from anarchists. I mean,
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most people I think have a It's why we like vigilantes,
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the punisher, the batman, because innately, we all, especially as conservatives,
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I think, have a distrust of society. We have a
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distrust of large groups. We have distrust of things that
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we can't see, smell, taste, touch, hold a cant accountable,
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so on and so forth, for better or for worse,
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and gosh, I don't know where my brain is today.
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But anyway, So the point about anarchism, right, so it's
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it's a little tougher for conservatives, or maybe it's a
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little easier for conservatives. That's what I was getting at.
427
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But nonetheless, like political anarchism, it's it's distinct from individualism,
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and that I think it is more specifically about kind
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of you know, the Ed Dutton mutational loads, spiteful, mutant, sexual,
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deviant situation. Like at bottom, it seems to me that
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anarchism politically is just about protection of I don't know
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what words I can use on your show. I don't
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care the common pizza types. Right, So it's like it's
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effectively like a political organization for pedophiles. I don't think
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there's anything more meaningful to anarchism about that. But then
436
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:09.039
again again it's like, well, how do you even have
437
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like a political block of pedophiles be party participating in
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your democratic society. Well, I think that you have this
439
00:28:15.839 --> 00:28:24.079
continual radical liberation. I don't know if individualism is related
440
00:28:24.079 --> 00:28:28.359
to this, but certainly the criminal as being elevated, you know,
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into a higher moral position than you know, people who
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enforced the law or people who simply follow the law
443
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might not be related to individualism per se, but it's
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you know, this cascading decay of American society.
445
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Well, it's a it's a tool I mean, if we're
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going to talk about Sam Francis, we can talk about
447
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a narco tyranny. And I know a lot of I
448
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know a lot of anarchists, especially a narco capitalists, who
449
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absolutely hate that term because you know, it seeks to
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you know, it makes anarchy look bad. And historically it's
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let's talk about the Spanish Civil War. I could do
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00:29:01.079 --> 00:29:04.920
that for ten to twelve hours. Okay. When I think
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of anarchism, I think of the Spanish Civil War, digging it,
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disint turning nuns and priests. But when you look at
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a society where basically the people in charge are off
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00:29:20.039 --> 00:29:23.319
doing whatever they're doing, like you were just mentioning, but
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they're allowing they can only get away with that, doing
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what they're doing by unleashing the worst dregs of society
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upon the good people and telling the good people they
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can't protect themselves from the dregs of society. And then
461
00:29:40.920 --> 00:29:43.920
if the drugs of society do something really horrible, they
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don't even just like this cop that just these cops
463
00:29:47.240 --> 00:29:50.319
that got jumped in New York a couple of days ago,
464
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and they were the people who did it. Migrants illegals
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were released on wind, noobail. It's all a tool, and
466
00:29:59.279 --> 00:30:02.400
it's anarchy for some and not for others, and definitely
467
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not the kind of anarchy that anarcho capital, a narcho
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capitalist one, at least most of them.
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Yeah, there's a certain like just base conformism that we
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all have as like human people with souls that these
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people don't like. I mean that kind of Look. I
472
00:30:20.759 --> 00:30:23.359
went through an edged lord atheist phase, you know. I
473
00:30:23.359 --> 00:30:26.000
mean I never spit on priests or did anything really terrible,
474
00:30:26.039 --> 00:30:29.480
but you know, I probably said some untoward things towards
475
00:30:29.519 --> 00:30:33.119
our Lord. But like that degree, like we're going to
476
00:30:33.200 --> 00:30:38.039
dig up nuns, We're going to you know, desecrate graves,
477
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:42.640
We're going to just try to innovate new ways to
478
00:30:44.000 --> 00:30:48.599
spit on the normal social institutions around us. That's really
479
00:30:48.680 --> 00:30:52.599
what anarchism tends to be a lot of times. It's
480
00:30:52.680 --> 00:30:56.319
it's that like lack of conformism, like that thoughtless conformism.
481
00:30:56.400 --> 00:30:58.279
I just go to church because it's because it's there,
482
00:30:58.559 --> 00:31:01.480
and I just love Jesus because that's what I do.
483
00:31:01.880 --> 00:31:05.519
Right like this, you're not even contemplating on it. But
484
00:31:05.640 --> 00:31:08.000
as far as like individualism and like what are the
485
00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:13.680
political consequences of that well, I think by and large,
486
00:31:14.039 --> 00:31:19.440
I think the two biggest outcomes are depoliticization, right, because
487
00:31:19.440 --> 00:31:24.119
what if you're an egotist. The kind of persuasive filter
488
00:31:24.720 --> 00:31:27.480
that ultimately matters is like, oh, does this titillate me,
489
00:31:27.559 --> 00:31:29.680
does this interest me? Does this speak to me? Does
490
00:31:29.720 --> 00:31:33.400
this have an immediate application to my my life world
491
00:31:33.440 --> 00:31:37.440
as I perceive it? Whereas like, really political action is
492
00:31:37.440 --> 00:31:41.400
is like extroverted. It's about looking at other people, looking
493
00:31:41.440 --> 00:31:44.519
at the problems of other people in society. It's fundamentally,
494
00:31:44.559 --> 00:31:48.480
I mean, real politics is extraversion. I don't want I
495
00:31:48.519 --> 00:31:50.759
don't want to use psychiatric language and abuse it that way.
496
00:31:51.039 --> 00:31:52.599
You know what I mean, You're not in an agreement.
497
00:31:54.599 --> 00:31:58.720
So on one hand it's it's depoliticization, and then obviously
498
00:31:58.839 --> 00:32:02.519
on the other hand, it's like it's extreme, well not
499
00:32:02.599 --> 00:32:06.200
just identity politics you could say would be part of it,
500
00:32:06.240 --> 00:32:10.680
maybe counterintuitively, but also like single issue voting, like all
501
00:32:10.720 --> 00:32:15.599
this wacky stuff like I only care about voting laws
502
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:20.400
or whatever. I mean, as opposed to like nationalist folkish politics,
503
00:32:20.440 --> 00:32:23.400
where it's like, well, everything is a political question, everything
504
00:32:23.480 --> 00:32:25.599
has to be addressed politically, and we're going to have
505
00:32:25.640 --> 00:32:28.799
a vehicle to put people in those places to do that, right,
506
00:32:29.200 --> 00:32:32.960
like the individuals who are part of the collective and
507
00:32:32.960 --> 00:32:35.640
see them as selves as such and then can function
508
00:32:35.759 --> 00:32:39.119
as individuals in service of the collective. You know, that's
509
00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:42.640
like again part of maybe that's why it's better to
510
00:32:42.640 --> 00:32:46.640
say egotism, because ultimately being an individual is a good thing.
511
00:32:46.640 --> 00:32:51.799
It's who we are, it's our tradition. We couldn't really
512
00:32:51.880 --> 00:32:55.519
abandon it if we tried, and so fundamentally, what's different
513
00:32:55.599 --> 00:33:03.319
is this profoundly psychological dimension to modern life. You have
514
00:33:03.400 --> 00:33:10.240
to have justifications for everything. You know, everything's personalized. You're
515
00:33:10.319 --> 00:33:12.960
encouraged to make everything your self, and that for a
516
00:33:13.000 --> 00:33:15.279
lot of people that means they're politics too, which is
517
00:33:15.279 --> 00:33:16.119
not always a good thing.
518
00:33:17.640 --> 00:33:24.240
I still engage with libertarians online. I know, I'm a masochist,
519
00:33:24.440 --> 00:33:26.559
and you know, one the other day was like, oh,
520
00:33:26.599 --> 00:33:29.160
so you know, what's a bigger what's a bigger issue
521
00:33:29.240 --> 00:33:32.839
than economics? And you know, one of my friends posted up,
522
00:33:33.559 --> 00:33:36.759
you know, drag queens from Viimar and drag queens now
523
00:33:37.519 --> 00:33:40.279
and he's like, oh, oh, I'm scared of the Oh
524
00:33:40.319 --> 00:33:42.200
I'm supposed to be scared of the men dressing up
525
00:33:42.240 --> 00:33:46.039
like women. And that's just that's exactly what it is.
526
00:33:46.079 --> 00:33:48.720
It's the meme of Rome falling, and you know the
527
00:33:48.759 --> 00:33:50.960
guy saying, oh, how does this affect me personally?
528
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:57.599
But it does. It perfects you profoundly personally. I have
529
00:33:57.640 --> 00:34:00.799
a working theory. It's not I'm not totally Maybe I
530
00:34:00.799 --> 00:34:02.400
shouldn't bring it to you, but I'll do it anyway.
531
00:34:03.279 --> 00:34:06.640
It has a lot to do with the explicitly property
532
00:34:06.839 --> 00:34:13.480
focused tradition in I think the Western economic auvoir. If
533
00:34:13.480 --> 00:34:17.199
you want to say this is you know, people like
534
00:34:17.320 --> 00:34:19.719
me who came up six seven years ago when like
535
00:34:19.760 --> 00:34:23.960
the nas bole thing was popular. And the reason why
536
00:34:24.039 --> 00:34:27.599
like people like Keith Woods and whoever are constantly fighting
537
00:34:27.719 --> 00:34:33.239
these accusations of communism is because I think the the
538
00:34:33.400 --> 00:34:38.079
aspect of Western political society which is kind of kind
539
00:34:38.119 --> 00:34:43.280
of like libertarians, but not not strictly limited to them.
540
00:34:43.719 --> 00:34:47.440
The kinds that think of well, they think of America.
541
00:34:47.559 --> 00:34:50.559
What makes America great is its economy. So ultimately there's
542
00:34:50.599 --> 00:34:56.960
this extreme economic preference or privilege over privileging. But they
543
00:34:56.960 --> 00:34:59.199
look at like Adam Smith, and they look at how
544
00:34:59.239 --> 00:35:02.639
we solved the issues of property in the Western canon
545
00:35:02.760 --> 00:35:06.320
as being like definitive to who we are. And you know,
546
00:35:06.360 --> 00:35:09.320
I have a different temperament I actually, I mean outside
547
00:35:09.320 --> 00:35:11.599
of like toothbrushes and things like that, I kind of
548
00:35:11.639 --> 00:35:14.880
don't care so much about property. You kind of figured
549
00:35:14.880 --> 00:35:17.519
those things out, like I don't know, maybe because I
550
00:35:17.559 --> 00:35:18.760
in another life I was a musician.
551
00:35:18.800 --> 00:35:20.639
Well you know, you know what an anarcho capitalist is
552
00:35:20.679 --> 00:35:22.159
going to say, Oh so you don't mind if I
553
00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:23.480
move into your apartment? Right?
554
00:35:24.039 --> 00:35:26.440
Well, and are narco capitalists don't mind if they move
555
00:35:26.519 --> 00:35:30.360
migrants into my apartment? So like fundamentally, you know, yeah.
556
00:35:30.159 --> 00:35:32.920
They really they were so many of them really need
557
00:35:32.960 --> 00:35:36.159
to go fuck themselves. I mean, I mean, I saw
558
00:35:36.599 --> 00:35:38.639
I was going back and forth with a guy today
559
00:35:38.679 --> 00:35:42.239
who was like, like, debate me on Israel. Debate me
560
00:35:42.320 --> 00:35:45.199
on Israel, Debate me on Israel, because I'm like, oh,
561
00:35:45.239 --> 00:35:46.960
I mean, I know the history of Israel and I
562
00:35:47.000 --> 00:35:49.920
know how it was founded and out of the opinion
563
00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:51.800
if you found something on terrorism, you're always going to
564
00:35:51.840 --> 00:35:55.880
have terrorism there. So anyway, but then what did I
565
00:35:56.079 --> 00:35:58.119
what do you find when you go into his tweets
566
00:35:58.639 --> 00:36:02.920
open borders, free trade, and then you know, well, do
567
00:36:02.960 --> 00:36:05.760
you feel the same way about Israel. I mean, so
568
00:36:05.800 --> 00:36:09.639
it's like these libertarian types, they're just oh, well, yeah,
569
00:36:09.960 --> 00:36:12.320
if I say we shouldn't have open borders, that means
570
00:36:12.360 --> 00:36:14.800
that I worship the border patrol, and that means that
571
00:36:14.880 --> 00:36:17.559
I'm a boot liquor whatever did.
572
00:36:19.960 --> 00:36:26.960
Well, yeah, there's They're anachronistic. It's one of the like
573
00:36:27.320 --> 00:36:32.159
most BTFO political ideologies post twenty fifteen, with communism as
574
00:36:32.199 --> 00:36:37.360
a very close second. But ultimately these are materialists, which
575
00:36:37.360 --> 00:36:40.639
I think is related to egotism, which is related to
576
00:36:40.679 --> 00:36:44.599
this obsession with private property mine, you know, delineation of
577
00:36:44.639 --> 00:36:51.400
what is mine, this this over elaborated legal artifice to
578
00:36:51.480 --> 00:36:56.119
define what is mine. I mean, ultimately, in a folkish setting,
579
00:36:56.320 --> 00:37:00.960
these questions answered themselves, right, Like my if I leave
580
00:37:01.079 --> 00:37:04.079
my shirt at my brother's place, like, there's not going
581
00:37:04.119 --> 00:37:07.239
to be World War three because my property, he's holding
582
00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:10.519
my property. It's like it's whatever, I'll see him next week.
583
00:37:10.639 --> 00:37:13.880
It's not the end of the world. Because I think
584
00:37:13.960 --> 00:37:22.239
also there's a certain assumption in a folkish, nationalistic America
585
00:37:22.280 --> 00:37:25.960
first society of like, hey man, I love you, you know,
586
00:37:26.000 --> 00:37:28.760
like we're related to each other, we come from the
587
00:37:28.800 --> 00:37:33.760
same place, probably even literally, but metaphorically, you know, in
588
00:37:33.840 --> 00:37:37.320
terms of the grand myth man myths that animate our lives,
589
00:37:37.360 --> 00:37:43.199
like we're the same and these types of nerdish economic
590
00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:46.960
questions which do need to be solved and at complex societies,
591
00:37:47.039 --> 00:37:49.119
obviously you need to think about those kinds of things.
592
00:37:50.400 --> 00:37:54.320
But it's a fixation. It has a lot to do
593
00:37:54.400 --> 00:37:57.679
with paranoia, I think all of Once we start highlighting
594
00:37:57.719 --> 00:38:01.159
these psychological factors, the types of people become very clear
595
00:38:01.599 --> 00:38:02.159
who they are.
596
00:38:03.679 --> 00:38:08.440
Well, you use the term sociopathy and the header there
597
00:38:08.519 --> 00:38:13.559
under individualism, anarchism, and sociopathy. So when you use sociopathy,
598
00:38:13.559 --> 00:38:14.400
how are you using it?
599
00:38:15.679 --> 00:38:18.400
Yeah? That's so it's one of these funny psychology words
600
00:38:18.400 --> 00:38:24.000
that has a million definitions. I gave my own loose
601
00:38:24.559 --> 00:38:26.679
ish definition in the book. I actually don't have it
602
00:38:26.679 --> 00:38:28.119
in front of me, so I don't remember what I said.
603
00:38:28.679 --> 00:38:29.199
Do you have it?
604
00:38:29.960 --> 00:38:32.639
Yeah, I'm looking for it right now. I can't find it.
605
00:38:32.679 --> 00:38:34.760
But go on, I'll I'll see if I can. I
606
00:38:34.760 --> 00:38:35.679
can spot it, the.
607
00:38:36.360 --> 00:38:38.760
Main thrust, because it's one of those things that like
608
00:38:38.800 --> 00:38:43.559
people confuse with psychopathy, right, and you know there's there.
609
00:38:43.559 --> 00:38:47.400
These are very poorly defined concepts, yet there they do
610
00:38:47.519 --> 00:38:51.000
stand for something, and it means something when you use them.
611
00:38:51.079 --> 00:38:56.239
Psychopathy effectively, we're talking about, you know, in loose colloquial terms,
612
00:38:56.280 --> 00:38:59.960
we're talking about the most dangerous, violent abrace if non
613
00:39:00.079 --> 00:39:01.519
conforming members of society.
614
00:39:01.960 --> 00:39:05.440
Yeah, you have here, Okay, So it says sociopathy as
615
00:39:05.480 --> 00:39:08.480
a concept is poorly defined within the disciplines of psychiatry
616
00:39:08.519 --> 00:39:12.360
and psychology, and owing to its operational weakness, is greatly
617
00:39:12.400 --> 00:39:16.239
abused by the late public and sadly professionals especially often
618
00:39:16.280 --> 00:39:20.559
complated with other somewhat nebulously defined terms such as anti
619
00:39:20.599 --> 00:39:24.679
social and psychopath. Here, sociopath should be understood as an
620
00:39:24.679 --> 00:39:28.880
individual with an impoverished social feeling, often exhibited by the
621
00:39:28.880 --> 00:39:37.360
following characteristics impulsivity, weak ego defenses, narcissism, irresponsibility, callousness, and
622
00:39:37.519 --> 00:39:39.559
attachment related anxiety.
623
00:39:40.360 --> 00:39:45.119
Yeah, I think that covers it, because, if you want
624
00:39:45.119 --> 00:39:50.320
to think in a congenital sense, sociopathy very small representation
625
00:39:50.599 --> 00:39:54.840
in the overall population, not a lot of natural sociopaths,
626
00:39:56.039 --> 00:40:01.360
But we're mass producing people due to this intention to
627
00:40:01.400 --> 00:40:05.079
destroy the family, destroy the community, destroy the nation, religion, borders,
628
00:40:05.119 --> 00:40:07.199
so on and so forth. I mean, if you encourage
629
00:40:07.239 --> 00:40:09.280
people to get divorced. If you encourage people to be
630
00:40:09.320 --> 00:40:14.639
sexually liberated, then that naturally has the consequence of weakening
631
00:40:14.960 --> 00:40:19.480
the social unit we call the family. Children grow up
632
00:40:19.480 --> 00:40:22.719
with fewer resources. Also think of like the crazy psychiatry
633
00:40:22.719 --> 00:40:27.239
fads and child rearing fads over the last hundred years.
634
00:40:27.360 --> 00:40:30.400
Each one's kind of like perverse and dysfunctional in his
635
00:40:30.519 --> 00:40:32.880
own unique way from the one that came before it.
636
00:40:32.920 --> 00:40:35.280
So like, for example, like kids don't sleep with their parents.
637
00:40:36.239 --> 00:40:41.320
You know, you don't nurse the children, you don't you
638
00:40:41.360 --> 00:40:44.679
intentionally ignore the children. And some of these have caveats
639
00:40:44.719 --> 00:40:47.320
like it's appropriate at certain times, under certain conditions for
640
00:40:47.400 --> 00:40:50.280
certain people, et cetera, et cetera. But that's not how
641
00:40:50.320 --> 00:40:53.639
America works, that's not how marketing works. And an idea
642
00:40:54.039 --> 00:40:57.320
is brought to people and we try to do this
643
00:40:57.360 --> 00:41:00.159
one size fits all thing, which is not good. You
644
00:41:00.159 --> 00:41:04.199
get people with these attachment related disorders. Fundamentally, what that
645
00:41:04.320 --> 00:41:09.440
means is while they didn't spend a lot of physical
646
00:41:10.119 --> 00:41:15.480
time with mom and dad, they are on a hormonal,
647
00:41:15.760 --> 00:41:24.920
neurological probably other levels, malnourished, underdeveloped, and there's a very
648
00:41:24.960 --> 00:41:29.679
limited window that infants and small children have to get
649
00:41:29.719 --> 00:41:35.119
these resources. Especially when it comes to social development. It's
650
00:41:35.159 --> 00:41:40.199
really like h five age six, and the trend over
651
00:41:40.199 --> 00:41:44.159
the last fifteen years is to shove as many screens
652
00:41:44.159 --> 00:41:48.360
and images and highly stimulating things at ever younger children,
653
00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:51.639
so they're not socializing with people anyway. Then they go
654
00:41:51.719 --> 00:41:55.000
through a crazy education system that's racially diverse, and blah
655
00:41:55.000 --> 00:41:57.079
blah blah blah blah. What do you have? You have
656
00:41:57.119 --> 00:41:59.440
people who don't know how to develop relationships, who don't
657
00:41:59.480 --> 00:42:03.480
actually on the structural level of their brain. They can't
658
00:42:03.559 --> 00:42:06.280
look at you and see you as a person with
659
00:42:06.320 --> 00:42:09.199
a soul like that. They need to respect the dignity
660
00:42:09.239 --> 00:42:11.320
of like all of these things that are kind of
661
00:42:11.800 --> 00:42:15.159
I think second nature to people who maybe are older,
662
00:42:15.599 --> 00:42:17.840
grew up with a different way of life, had more
663
00:42:18.320 --> 00:42:25.280
like put in more rounds interacting with people. So you
664
00:42:25.400 --> 00:42:28.239
have this mass like phenomenon of kind of like an
665
00:42:28.360 --> 00:42:33.679
artificial sociopathy. People are constantly to invoke the transactional thing
666
00:42:33.719 --> 00:42:37.360
from earlier. They're constantly looking at other people as means
667
00:42:37.760 --> 00:42:41.920
to some other end. They are in a fundamentally exploitative
668
00:42:42.559 --> 00:42:48.320
mode of social interaction, and they are themselves very distressed
669
00:42:48.679 --> 00:42:52.599
and suffering, often to the point of some kind of
670
00:42:52.639 --> 00:43:01.159
addiction or otherwise impairment, fixation, fetish, what have you? Sex, politics, food, tattoos,
671
00:43:01.800 --> 00:43:06.360
all of the above the thing. And I'll close it
672
00:43:06.400 --> 00:43:11.159
off on this. I've got gab fever all night. I apologize, Like,
673
00:43:11.159 --> 00:43:13.679
like I said, I'm a younger guy. I turned thirty eight.
674
00:43:14.199 --> 00:43:17.039
It was very common still is, but when I was younger,
675
00:43:17.599 --> 00:43:22.920
like normal millennial discourse is is this kind of neurotic
676
00:43:23.239 --> 00:43:25.880
of like am I normal? Can you? Can you affirm
677
00:43:25.920 --> 00:43:28.760
that I'm normal? Are you secretly a sociopath? This paranoia
678
00:43:28.840 --> 00:43:31.800
of like what laundry list of mental disorders do you have?
679
00:43:32.599 --> 00:43:34.199
How quickly can I find it out? And then what
680
00:43:34.199 --> 00:43:35.880
are we going to do about it? You know? For
681
00:43:35.960 --> 00:43:37.519
some people will be like let me find out so
682
00:43:37.559 --> 00:43:39.639
I can avoid you, And for other people it's like,
683
00:43:39.679 --> 00:43:43.199
let me find out so that I can never get
684
00:43:43.239 --> 00:43:49.519
away from you? Right Like anyway, point being the sociopathy
685
00:43:49.840 --> 00:43:53.400
like is just the norm almost.
686
00:43:55.159 --> 00:43:58.159
It also seems a lot of people point out that
687
00:43:58.719 --> 00:44:02.719
so many people these days there when they refer to truth,
688
00:44:03.320 --> 00:44:07.679
it's always something subjective, And it seems like if you're
689
00:44:08.039 --> 00:44:12.840
this radical individual, you know, this neoliberal kind of individual,
690
00:44:13.840 --> 00:44:16.559
your morality is going to be based around how anything
691
00:44:16.639 --> 00:44:21.119
affects you. You can't have a universal morality if everyone's
692
00:44:21.159 --> 00:44:21.880
an individual.
693
00:44:23.920 --> 00:44:27.079
You also can't have political organization if everyone's an individual.
694
00:44:27.119 --> 00:44:30.199
So this is even more meaningfully the ultimate political outcome
695
00:44:30.199 --> 00:44:37.679
of individualism. If all justifications, all explanations, any any rationalization
696
00:44:37.800 --> 00:44:41.400
you can offer, has to come specifically from you, your
697
00:44:41.800 --> 00:44:45.039
specific circumstance of life, from the exact moment you were
698
00:44:45.039 --> 00:44:47.719
born until exactly this moment. You can't have reference to
699
00:44:47.719 --> 00:44:51.400
anything else. Like you are atomized. You're one node, but
700
00:44:52.000 --> 00:44:54.760
all of the circuitry around you has been like smashed
701
00:44:54.760 --> 00:44:57.599
with ambers, so you can't plug into the larger network.
702
00:44:58.400 --> 00:45:00.760
And that's very pernicious. I mean, ultimately, with that like
703
00:45:00.840 --> 00:45:05.400
type of lot, the question like how does this affect
704
00:45:05.480 --> 00:45:08.679
you personally? Like that is a persecutor's logic. That is,
705
00:45:08.679 --> 00:45:12.480
someone who that's friend enemy stuff like I don't talk
706
00:45:12.519 --> 00:45:14.599
to you or my brother or my friend or my
707
00:45:14.599 --> 00:45:18.159
neighbor like that. I get involved because I realized that
708
00:45:18.199 --> 00:45:20.960
we're part of the same thing, and there's not really
709
00:45:21.000 --> 00:45:24.880
a conflict or a contradiction between him as an individual
710
00:45:24.920 --> 00:45:29.360
and the social ecology that he's plugged into. Like this
711
00:45:29.400 --> 00:45:33.199
is a big problem with libertarians too, collectivism. Collectivism is
712
00:45:33.199 --> 00:45:37.119
like one of these still remaining boogie words in politics,
713
00:45:37.119 --> 00:45:40.840
and they only really see it with libertarians. But it's
714
00:45:40.880 --> 00:45:43.280
like it's again, it's it has to do with egotism, right,
715
00:45:43.360 --> 00:45:47.599
because there are always collectives. The type of social activity
716
00:45:47.760 --> 00:45:53.440
is ultimately a collectivist activity. So I mean all this
717
00:45:55.000 --> 00:45:58.599
spoils to that. Jefferson Lee would say, as nationalists, the
718
00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:02.760
economic or the the the unit of society is actually
719
00:46:02.840 --> 00:46:05.920
the nation itself, the people, right. But in neoliberal society,
720
00:46:05.920 --> 00:46:08.880
it's just you, not even your kids, not even your
721
00:46:08.880 --> 00:46:11.280
grandparents unless they want to blame you for things, shame
722
00:46:11.320 --> 00:46:11.880
you for things.
723
00:46:13.880 --> 00:46:18.360
But it seems that there is a group, and I
724
00:46:18.679 --> 00:46:22.639
think we know that pretty much down the middle when
725
00:46:22.639 --> 00:46:26.360
it comes to the most important things. You know, Republicans
726
00:46:26.360 --> 00:46:28.360
and Democrats are going to get together. I mean, if
727
00:46:28.360 --> 00:46:31.320
you're if you're having a vote on whether you know
728
00:46:31.639 --> 00:46:37.159
anti semitism is irrational and repugnant, everyone is going to
729
00:46:37.239 --> 00:46:40.079
vote for that. If it's a vote for war, everyone
730
00:46:40.239 --> 00:46:42.599
is going to you know, there's going to be very
731
00:46:42.599 --> 00:46:45.880
few people who are going to to abstain or even
732
00:46:46.000 --> 00:46:50.599
say no. It's always issues that where it's like, oh, well,
733
00:46:51.679 --> 00:46:55.599
it's like to like to financial systems or the two
734
00:46:55.599 --> 00:46:58.039
competing financial systems. Well, no, we're not going to cut
735
00:46:58.079 --> 00:47:00.480
taxes now. Yes, we're going to cut taxes now. It
736
00:47:00.599 --> 00:47:04.679
always seems to be like the things that do cause
737
00:47:04.760 --> 00:47:10.199
the most control or cause the most damage to the
738
00:47:10.280 --> 00:47:15.719
system and the people financially and bodily, war sending kids
739
00:47:15.760 --> 00:47:23.280
off to war for nothing. Those are right down the middle. Okay,
740
00:47:23.400 --> 00:47:27.320
everything's good, we've given you the you're allowed to fight
741
00:47:27.360 --> 00:47:32.000
about this here. But it's the whole elite theory thing too.
742
00:47:32.320 --> 00:47:35.480
You do have some people who get together, five hundred
743
00:47:35.480 --> 00:47:38.599
and thirty five of them, and then you know, stretch
744
00:47:38.639 --> 00:47:41.519
it out a little bit from there, who agree on things.
745
00:47:42.280 --> 00:47:46.719
But when everyone is a radical individual, when everybody's a
746
00:47:46.760 --> 00:47:54.800
neoliberal individual, getting groups to get together to possibly push
747
00:47:54.920 --> 00:48:01.639
back or to even supplant what's existing makes it impossible.
748
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:04.360
It's like they it's like they designed the perfect system.
749
00:48:04.920 --> 00:48:06.519
If it was a hydrae, you wouldn't even know where
750
00:48:06.559 --> 00:48:12.360
to start cutting off heads because yeah, yeah, yeah, so yeah.
751
00:48:12.760 --> 00:48:17.360
The individualism thing also is a great tool for them
752
00:48:17.519 --> 00:48:21.320
because there hundred and fifty million people can't organize against
753
00:48:21.880 --> 00:48:24.239
what is essentially probably what two thousand.
754
00:48:26.199 --> 00:48:27.960
Well, yeah, there's there's a lot of aspects to what
755
00:48:28.000 --> 00:48:28.440
you just said.
756
00:48:30.920 --> 00:48:32.880
What was the devil? What was the angel devil saying
757
00:48:32.920 --> 00:48:39.280
there that I say something to you that made you.
758
00:48:38.559 --> 00:48:41.920
No, I just well, just I always think because as
759
00:48:41.960 --> 00:48:45.119
the older I get, the less psychologically inclined I become,
760
00:48:45.239 --> 00:48:46.519
or in fact, I mean we should say, the more
761
00:48:46.559 --> 00:48:50.320
I think about these types of issues, the less psychology
762
00:48:51.320 --> 00:48:56.559
uh factors into my ultimate kind of analytical process. Not
763
00:48:56.599 --> 00:49:00.679
to say it's unimportant, because it's you know it, it's
764
00:49:00.719 --> 00:49:04.559
explicitly on a psychological battlefield that what you just said
765
00:49:05.199 --> 00:49:08.519
is being waged, right, is by putting you into just
766
00:49:08.679 --> 00:49:12.599
your body and blocking off all of the literally social
767
00:49:12.639 --> 00:49:15.840
resources that make us who we are, like just on
768
00:49:15.920 --> 00:49:21.440
a small level, or been like with the group friends
769
00:49:21.519 --> 00:49:26.079
and then the chat ended or the friend group fell apart,
770
00:49:26.199 --> 00:49:28.719
or maybe you just like checked out for a little
771
00:49:28.719 --> 00:49:32.719
while and you felt like dumber or like less sharp
772
00:49:32.920 --> 00:49:37.800
or less on your less like you normally are, because
773
00:49:37.800 --> 00:49:40.559
actually you're like plugged, you're like plugged into the Avengers.
774
00:49:40.599 --> 00:49:44.199
Like Okay, now I have plus fifteen IQ points because
775
00:49:44.199 --> 00:49:45.840
the guy next to me is a super genius, and
776
00:49:45.880 --> 00:49:48.599
I've absorbed all of his knowledge, right, So, like, so
777
00:49:48.679 --> 00:49:52.760
much of what makes us great, even as individuals, are
778
00:49:52.840 --> 00:49:58.119
the relations that we have. And to impose this program
779
00:49:58.159 --> 00:50:01.920
of individualism is to impose this program of ultimately kind
780
00:50:01.920 --> 00:50:05.599
of psychologism, which makes us all prisoners of our own
781
00:50:06.559 --> 00:50:09.400
fears and anxieties, except for those of you know, people
782
00:50:09.440 --> 00:50:11.960
in the audience who are extroverts and not neurotic. You know,
783
00:50:12.039 --> 00:50:15.280
I hate you. I hope you have a great life,
784
00:50:15.280 --> 00:50:17.639
but I hate you the rest of us, you know,
785
00:50:17.800 --> 00:50:22.559
it's it's this I'm imagining, like the guy on the
786
00:50:22.599 --> 00:50:25.880
train throwing the coal into the into the oven or whatever,
787
00:50:26.000 --> 00:50:28.400
like you've just got it. It's just endless coal. You
788
00:50:28.440 --> 00:50:30.920
can just kind of keep like psychologically, you just have
789
00:50:31.199 --> 00:50:36.440
continual resources to harm yourself because life is difficult. Being
790
00:50:36.440 --> 00:50:38.559
in the body is weird. Nobody gets it right, but
791
00:50:38.639 --> 00:50:42.440
we all come from crazy circumstances. And there's a criminal,
792
00:50:42.519 --> 00:50:45.360
exploitative class at the top of everything. So it's not
793
00:50:45.559 --> 00:50:52.280
exactly you know, rosy pictures, rainbows things like that. However,
794
00:50:52.599 --> 00:50:55.639
there's no devil an angel. I just do like to
795
00:50:55.679 --> 00:50:59.320
emphasize that, you know, this is a program of containment.
796
00:51:00.079 --> 00:51:03.039
These are the parameters through which that gets achieved. And
797
00:51:03.119 --> 00:51:05.920
so yeah, like if you can't get a couple of
798
00:51:05.960 --> 00:51:11.199
people together to flyer or rally or protest or pass
799
00:51:11.280 --> 00:51:15.000
around some kind of petition, I mean those first barriers,
800
00:51:15.159 --> 00:51:17.400
and they're the most important bearers. A lot of the
801
00:51:17.440 --> 00:51:22.000
times are fundamentally psychological, Like seeing myself as a unit
802
00:51:22.119 --> 00:51:26.440
with Peter r. Kenonia's right, Like that's a psychological hurdle
803
00:51:26.639 --> 00:51:31.760
that you have to clear, not expecting. There's the joke
804
00:51:31.800 --> 00:51:36.840
about like you know the guy who like meets hangs
805
00:51:36.880 --> 00:51:39.000
out with his cousin from like Norway or Denmark and
806
00:51:39.039 --> 00:51:41.320
then gets a venmo for like seventy eight cents because
807
00:51:41.360 --> 00:51:43.039
of half of the coffee you drink on the way
808
00:51:43.079 --> 00:51:45.840
to work together. Like that kind of like tit for
809
00:51:45.960 --> 00:51:47.800
tat am I going to get everything out of Peter
810
00:51:48.079 --> 00:51:50.480
that Peter is getting out of me? Like that's not
811
00:51:51.519 --> 00:51:56.840
a normal response. If we're a family of folk, we think, okay,
812
00:51:56.880 --> 00:51:59.639
we're gonna work all this out together. So yeah, I
813
00:51:59.639 --> 00:52:01.599
feel like I'm repeating myself a little bit, but I'll
814
00:52:01.679 --> 00:52:02.239
leave it at bet.
815
00:52:02.800 --> 00:52:05.480
People need to hear that. Let's finish on this.
816
00:52:06.039 --> 00:52:10.679
What's chophobia it's the hatred of the familiar, or fear
817
00:52:10.679 --> 00:52:16.400
of the familiar, maybe even disgust of the familiar. It's
818
00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:21.760
what every Midwesterner, every Midwestern eighteen year old, you know,
819
00:52:21.840 --> 00:52:23.480
just at a fresh out of college who moves to
820
00:52:23.519 --> 00:52:25.599
New York that I've ever met, That's what they're all like,
821
00:52:25.920 --> 00:52:30.000
Oh my god, Wyoming is so terrible. It's like, fuck you,
822
00:52:30.559 --> 00:52:37.400
I'll go there in a second. Let's stright place. It's well,
823
00:52:37.440 --> 00:52:39.960
I say, this is someone who suffers it. Right, Like,
824
00:52:40.079 --> 00:52:43.079
if you want to again, on psychological terms, what is acophobia,
825
00:52:43.119 --> 00:52:48.000
It's high trade openness. Right, you are a novelty oriented person.
826
00:52:48.079 --> 00:52:54.360
You buy your temperament, experience lower levels of disgust at
827
00:52:54.480 --> 00:52:59.480
unfamiliar or things that would typically that trigger discust. Right,
828
00:53:00.000 --> 00:53:03.840
feel less discussed, You're more inclined to experiment, try new things.
829
00:53:03.880 --> 00:53:07.960
You're more novelty seeking. You're probably less neurotic neurotic, meaning
830
00:53:08.000 --> 00:53:11.679
the intensity of negative emotions that you experienced. Like sometimes
831
00:53:11.679 --> 00:53:14.079
we think of neuroticism as just like self attacking, but
832
00:53:14.199 --> 00:53:17.760
it's more like how hot does the engine get when
833
00:53:17.760 --> 00:53:20.400
you're stressed, and if you're very neurotic, well, it gets
834
00:53:20.480 --> 00:53:22.960
very hot, very quickly. And it takes you a very
835
00:53:22.960 --> 00:53:26.920
long time or maybe never to totally decompress, not literally never.
836
00:53:27.199 --> 00:53:29.840
That would be like a very extreme case. Co morbidity
837
00:53:29.920 --> 00:53:33.039
is up to you, huh, but a certain type. But
838
00:53:33.119 --> 00:53:36.119
it's also of the condition that we've inherited. Especially and
839
00:53:36.159 --> 00:53:40.559
I want to emphasize this, it's technologically facilitated. It is
840
00:53:40.599 --> 00:53:45.360
absolutely like you would not see the kind of Jesus
841
00:53:45.440 --> 00:53:48.639
Christ get me if there was not an ease of
842
00:53:48.679 --> 00:53:51.599
the ability to get the fuck out of town. So,
843
00:53:51.840 --> 00:53:55.679
you know, travel being the way that it is, these
844
00:53:55.719 --> 00:54:01.079
things encourage psychological tendencies that have pros and con you know,
845
00:54:02.360 --> 00:54:06.920
I love Peter Gabriel's album that's also his like I'm
846
00:54:06.920 --> 00:54:10.960
a third worldist, you know, screw Whitey album. But it's
847
00:54:11.079 --> 00:54:13.920
great and he's has a great ensemble of musicians and
848
00:54:13.920 --> 00:54:18.239
he's playing this kind of world style and it's interesting
849
00:54:18.280 --> 00:54:26.079
and it's cool, but you can't live there and uh yeah,
850
00:54:26.119 --> 00:54:28.719
I mean the flip side, I guess is auchophelia. And
851
00:54:28.760 --> 00:54:32.039
this might be like the conservative disease of too much
852
00:54:32.199 --> 00:54:37.239
veneration of tradition and too much kind of well to
853
00:54:37.280 --> 00:54:40.719
be crass boot licking right, like the extreme like a
854
00:54:40.760 --> 00:54:44.400
peliac is effectively the boot licker, and the extreme likegophobic
855
00:54:44.880 --> 00:54:46.920
is going to be the you know, the race trader
856
00:54:47.039 --> 00:54:48.039
or just just the trader.
857
00:54:48.960 --> 00:54:51.800
It's funny that that came up because I was saying
858
00:54:51.880 --> 00:54:55.079
on Twitter the other day that like the town I
859
00:54:55.119 --> 00:54:58.199
live in there, I have friends who their families have
860
00:54:58.199 --> 00:55:01.480
been here for two hundred years and they they own
861
00:55:01.719 --> 00:55:05.000
their own land here, they owned businesses here, and even
862
00:55:05.039 --> 00:55:07.559
though you know, they went an hour and twenty minutes
863
00:55:07.559 --> 00:55:09.880
away to go to college, they came back and they
864
00:55:09.920 --> 00:55:12.519
knew they were going to come back because they were
865
00:55:12.559 --> 00:55:16.800
continuing a tradition and continuing continue well a legacy. And
866
00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:18.920
I think it's really interesting to find out that when
867
00:55:18.960 --> 00:55:21.119
you start talking about that to people and you're like,
868
00:55:21.800 --> 00:55:25.199
you know, it's not too late to start do that. Now,
869
00:55:25.559 --> 00:55:28.880
find a plot of land, find something, start building, you know,
870
00:55:29.000 --> 00:55:31.599
start living you know, as Thomas seven seven seven says,
871
00:55:31.599 --> 00:55:36.639
start living historically and teaching, you know, teaching your progeny
872
00:55:36.679 --> 00:55:39.800
how to do that. And did the amount of pushback
873
00:55:39.840 --> 00:55:42.519
that you can get from get from talking like that
874
00:55:42.760 --> 00:55:44.840
is just you know, what if I want my kid,
875
00:55:45.000 --> 00:55:47.480
what if my kid meets somebody, you know, from another state,
876
00:55:47.519 --> 00:55:49.079
you know, and they want to get married with someone
877
00:55:49.159 --> 00:55:53.159
from another state, Well he or she can move there,
878
00:55:53.840 --> 00:55:56.679
you know, could move there if you have ten if
879
00:55:56.679 --> 00:55:58.800
you have ten acres, if you have twenty acres, Why
880
00:55:58.800 --> 00:56:01.400
would you want him to go buy a house. Just
881
00:56:02.039 --> 00:56:04.320
build a house on the property and you know, stay
882
00:56:04.360 --> 00:56:07.800
there and you know, build something and build a legacy
883
00:56:07.840 --> 00:56:10.760
of some sort. When you when you look at Monticello
884
00:56:10.920 --> 00:56:13.159
and Mount Vernon in places like that, I mean, those
885
00:56:13.199 --> 00:56:17.719
were supposed to be legacies, and now they're museums. And
886
00:56:17.840 --> 00:56:20.880
I think Monticello is now a museums awoke of some sort.
887
00:56:21.440 --> 00:56:26.719
And I don't think that's achophelia. I think that's just
888
00:56:26.800 --> 00:56:31.440
the way people have lived and kept order within society
889
00:56:31.599 --> 00:56:37.719
for hundreds and hundreds of years until until we this
890
00:56:37.880 --> 00:56:42.079
technological revolution, but also this individual revolution.
891
00:56:43.440 --> 00:56:45.960
The And they would certainly like to pack. When I
892
00:56:46.000 --> 00:56:47.840
say they, I mean people who are opponents of our
893
00:56:47.880 --> 00:56:51.840
worldview would certainly try to paint that as I mean,
894
00:56:51.880 --> 00:56:54.440
they would take it a step further. Iphelic might be
895
00:56:54.559 --> 00:56:57.199
kind of a sort of polite way, still derogatory ultimately
896
00:56:57.239 --> 00:56:59.239
in this context, but they're going to take that to
897
00:56:59.280 --> 00:57:01.400
the next step. I mean they're just going to accuse
898
00:57:01.480 --> 00:57:04.440
you of being like an in breeder, and then it
899
00:57:04.639 --> 00:57:13.360
immediately becomes some kind of dysgenic, disgusting thing, which ironically
900
00:57:13.440 --> 00:57:17.559
or humorously enough, is like the opposite. You know, the
901
00:57:17.599 --> 00:57:20.960
thing that they're instituting is very much what they're accusing
902
00:57:21.039 --> 00:57:24.639
us of trying to promote. I would just say one thing.
903
00:57:24.679 --> 00:57:26.719
I mean again, it's also part of the political program.
904
00:57:26.719 --> 00:57:29.880
If you de industrialize major parts of the country, it
905
00:57:30.000 --> 00:57:33.280
becomes a less attractive place to live. And what happens
906
00:57:33.280 --> 00:57:36.320
to the people there. They get fat, they become addicts,
907
00:57:36.519 --> 00:57:38.360
they die early, They beat the shit out of their
908
00:57:38.440 --> 00:57:42.559
kids and their wives, They fucking kill people. They turned
909
00:57:42.599 --> 00:57:45.599
the local law enforcement into just bullshit, They turned the
910
00:57:45.599 --> 00:57:49.519
court system into everything decays, and young people grew up,
911
00:57:49.519 --> 00:57:52.880
and that young people who naturally have an inclination to
912
00:57:53.000 --> 00:57:58.559
explore and persevere and test boundaries and are very much
913
00:57:58.599 --> 00:58:01.119
bored with the familiar. Actually in the climate that we're in,
914
00:58:01.840 --> 00:58:04.840
what else are they supposed to feel when they look
915
00:58:04.880 --> 00:58:07.239
at the town they grew up in and know people
916
00:58:07.320 --> 00:58:11.760
either leave or they die. That's you know, that's that's
917
00:58:11.800 --> 00:58:16.119
a political program. And that's also something I think people
918
00:58:16.159 --> 00:58:17.079
don't understand all that.
919
00:58:17.119 --> 00:58:21.159
Well. I talked to friends and I'm like, you know, family,
920
00:58:21.199 --> 00:58:22.679
I wish I would have grown up in a family
921
00:58:22.679 --> 00:58:25.199
that would have put such a great importance on family
922
00:58:25.280 --> 00:58:29.480
and the family, the family land and everything. My my grandmother,
923
00:58:29.960 --> 00:58:32.719
my grandparents had land in Puerto Rico that could have
924
00:58:32.719 --> 00:58:35.519
been handed down, but of course it got sold off
925
00:58:35.559 --> 00:58:38.679
like all boomers do and everything like that. I didn't
926
00:58:38.679 --> 00:58:42.079
want the money I wanted, Yeah, I wanted the legacy.
927
00:58:43.039 --> 00:58:46.800
But the I'm talking to a friend of mine and
928
00:58:46.840 --> 00:58:49.360
saying how important family is, like, well, my parents were
929
00:58:49.360 --> 00:58:51.639
shiit my you know, my mother, my mother was a
930
00:58:51.639 --> 00:58:55.000
piece of shit. And it's like, well, why why do
931
00:58:55.079 --> 00:58:57.639
you think there was some kind of external circumstance. Do
932
00:58:57.679 --> 00:59:01.639
you think they grew up in a in a society
933
00:59:01.719 --> 00:59:06.480
that gave them this mentality that just poison their food,
934
00:59:06.559 --> 00:59:09.159
did all this stuff to them that made them become
935
00:59:10.039 --> 00:59:12.840
become like that? You know, it can all start with you.
936
00:59:13.199 --> 00:59:15.159
And I mean that's yeah.
937
00:59:15.239 --> 00:59:17.440
I don't know if it's trauma induced I hate to
938
00:59:17.519 --> 00:59:22.800
use that word, but or if it's more akin to
939
00:59:22.840 --> 00:59:27.440
this individualism and egotism we're talking about. But you know,
940
00:59:27.960 --> 00:59:31.199
like I not to get too personal. I mean, I
941
00:59:31.239 --> 00:59:33.400
love my family. I'm glad I had the family that
942
00:59:33.440 --> 00:59:35.239
I had. I'm glad I grew up where I grew up.
943
00:59:35.440 --> 00:59:38.039
I like my life, but it wasn't the greatest situation.
944
00:59:38.119 --> 00:59:40.079
But I always felt and this is something I saw
945
00:59:40.119 --> 00:59:42.360
reflected in the people who grew up around me, was
946
00:59:42.400 --> 00:59:44.880
that at a certain age, you look at the people
947
00:59:44.920 --> 00:59:50.320
around you as people who have had to answer the
948
00:59:50.360 --> 00:59:54.440
same challenges of life that you have to answer, and
949
00:59:54.480 --> 00:59:57.960
then you come to understand them in a more human way.
950
00:59:58.760 --> 01:00:01.039
I look back on my parent parents, and of all
951
01:00:01.159 --> 01:00:04.880
the things I'm dissatisfied with now as an adult, I
952
01:00:04.920 --> 01:00:09.360
think back, well, when they were my age, well, they
953
01:00:09.519 --> 01:00:12.280
probably thought the whole world was like constantly on the
954
01:00:12.280 --> 01:00:17.039
precipice of nuclear abomination, you know, like they row. They
955
01:00:17.079 --> 01:00:20.079
really thought that right for decades, they really thought that
956
01:00:20.159 --> 01:00:23.079
it was a real thing. And before that everyone they
957
01:00:23.159 --> 01:00:25.800
knew had had fucking pieces of them blown off in
958
01:00:25.920 --> 01:00:31.679
Vietnam or Korea or w W two uh. And before that,
959
01:00:31.880 --> 01:00:35.920
maybe they grew up poor, and maybe their parents lived
960
01:00:35.960 --> 01:00:39.039
through the there lived through the Great Depression. Maybe they
961
01:00:39.079 --> 01:00:40.920
were immigrants and they came here and they had all
962
01:00:41.000 --> 01:00:45.400
kinds of like generally speaking, you know, like when when
963
01:00:45.480 --> 01:00:49.159
lefties talked about how awful and brutish and violent and
964
01:00:49.280 --> 01:00:53.760
terrible history has been, They're right, it's it's a it's
965
01:00:53.760 --> 01:00:56.360
a rough go. You know. The twentieth century was literally
966
01:00:57.199 --> 01:00:59.280
us just like, how do we fucking kill more? How
967
01:00:59.320 --> 01:01:02.920
do we kill more European people? Industrial baby, let's do it.
968
01:01:04.519 --> 01:01:10.559
Your parents inherited hellscape, grandparents inherited hellescape, your great grandparents.
969
01:01:10.760 --> 01:01:13.280
We've actually, maybe for only a couple of generations, have
970
01:01:13.519 --> 01:01:16.440
kind of had it pretty good where you know, you
971
01:01:16.480 --> 01:01:18.440
didn't have to go through child labor, you didn't have
972
01:01:18.519 --> 01:01:21.840
to like all the things you could. You had an adolescence.
973
01:01:22.280 --> 01:01:24.320
That wasn't the thing. One hundred years ago. There was
974
01:01:24.320 --> 01:01:27.079
no there was no idea of let kids be kids.
975
01:01:27.320 --> 01:01:30.159
Oh don't you know, don't give little timmy too much homework.
976
01:01:30.199 --> 01:01:33.320
There was that idea did not exist. Turn of the century.
977
01:01:33.360 --> 01:01:36.679
Twentieth century British psychiatry was telling parents just short of
978
01:01:36.800 --> 01:01:39.719
beat your kids, it's good for them.
979
01:01:40.280 --> 01:01:40.440
Right.
980
01:01:41.840 --> 01:01:44.440
So this is all a very different thing, and maybe
981
01:01:44.559 --> 01:01:46.599
I'm willing to bet it has more to do with
982
01:01:46.719 --> 01:01:50.840
the psychological dimensions of suffering and trauma that people don't
983
01:01:51.000 --> 01:01:54.599
look at these prior generations, see that humanity and want
984
01:01:54.679 --> 01:01:57.840
to be the torch bear for that tradition. That's where
985
01:01:57.880 --> 01:01:59.800
I ended up. That's where most of the people I
986
01:01:59.880 --> 01:02:03.199
know end it up. And if you want to end
987
01:02:03.320 --> 01:02:06.599
up there too, I think logical questions cool.
988
01:02:06.679 --> 01:02:09.239
All right, remind everybody where they can find your stuff again,
989
01:02:09.280 --> 01:02:10.320
and I'll end the end.
990
01:02:10.199 --> 01:02:14.719
This Jneil dot substack dot com. That's for the Substack
991
01:02:15.119 --> 01:02:21.000
on YouTube, Psychopolitics on X, Psychopolitics with the K, and
992
01:02:21.119 --> 01:02:24.199
then check out Imperium Press for American extremists and then
993
01:02:24.400 --> 01:02:27.880
probably in like three weeks understanding conspiracy theories. And thank
994
01:02:27.920 --> 01:02:30.159
you again so much, Peter for your patience and your
995
01:02:30.320 --> 01:02:30.840
your invitation.
996
01:02:31.000 --> 01:02:34.320
No problem, and come back real soon and we'll talk
997
01:02:34.360 --> 01:02:38.239
about narratives or something like that. Absolutely, thank you, Josh