This is the Head Rush Podcast with Paul Frase.
Welcome to the Head Rush Podcast. I'm Paul Frase, and I played eleven years in the NFL. And at the Head Rush Podcast, we talk about everything related to brain trauma and brain health and wellness. We focus on traumatic brain injuries sustained through repeated head impacts, RHI, and repeated blast exposure, RBE, for our men and women who serve in the armed forces. We discuss chronic traumatic encephalopathy, CTE, and we cover how brain injuries can and will cause mental health issues such as depression, addiction, lack of executive function, memory loss, even suicide ideation, as well as degenerative neurological issues. Our mantra is how to cope and find hope, and we focus our energy on finding therapies and sharing hope through education and by raising awareness. And please like, subscribe, and share, if you will. It will help us reach our goal of helping people suffering with traumatic brain injury. Our guest today is Roderick Walker.
Now, Roderick grew up in Irving, Texas and was a standout running back at Irving Nimitz High School.
Were you guys considered pretty good?
We were pretty good. I know at one point we were... our schedule was considered, um, like, in the top five or top ten-
Right
... in the nation.
Yeah.
You know, because we played the, the Duncanville High Schools, we played DeSoto High School, so-
Right
... we played a lot of, uh, a lot of top guys, a lot of top teams, uh, at that time. So our schedule kind of reflected it.
Yeah. Cool. Awesome.
And I grew up, I grew up in Dallas. Uh, I lived-- I grew up in West Dallas and just went to school in Irving.
Oh. Roderick played at the University of Texas from nineteen ninety-one to ninety-four and led Texas in rushing in nineteen ninety-four. And, uh, after football, Roderick built a second chapter around leadership, camps, advocacy, coaching, and community work. Um, a huge welcome to you, Roderick. Thank you so much for being a-- joining us on the Head Rush podcast.
Absolutely. Thank you for having me. Uh, I look forward to, uh, uh, just hanging out with you guys here today and, and, and getting some awareness, right?
Exactly. Exactly. I grew up in New Hampshire. We had about, uh, we had about eleven guys make it to the NFL in the past a hundred years from New Hampshire, right? So a little bit different. You guys probably had eleven guys from your high school over the pa-- But, um, you, you would have been considered a five-star athlete right now because, uh, back, back in the early nineties, you, and I know you don't like to brag on yourself, but you were number two in the nation,
uh, uh, uh, recruited running back. Is that, is that correct?
That is correct. That is correct. I had, had a great career in high school. I got moved up to varsity my freshman year for the last three games, and I think in those three games, I had close to seven hundred yards. Um, and then obviously my sophomore year, I had about fifteen hundred yards. My junior year, well over two thousand yards.
Wow.
Uh, and a lot of touchdowns. I led the state, obviously, in rushing and, and in touchdowns. And then my senior year, I broke my ankle first play, first game, so I never played my senior year in high school.
Okay.
And, uh, but with-- just because of those accolades, and I guess, you know, in high-- in college, they, they recruit you on potential.
Right.
And, and I, I guess I had a, a little upside to, uh, recovering from the injury and then being, you know, on someone's team. When I was injured, I woke up in the hospital hall with a cast up to my, up to my hip and,
you know, very depressed, very depressed. And then all of a sudden this guy comes into my hospital room, and it's Roger Staubach. And, and he was just like, "Hey, man, don't worry about it. You know, you're gonna get over this injury." And I remember him asking me, "So what do you wanna do? What are your goals,
you know, as your-- for your freshman year in college?" And I said, "Well, I would like to win the Heisman Trophy as a freshman." And he looked at me and he said, "Well, I think you can do it
if you go to Navy."
And I said, "Well,
might not do it then."
Oh, no.
Well-
Uh, but after that, after that, man, the phone started ringing off the hook in the, in the hospital room. Seems like he just sparked everything. He came in and shook my hand, and we took pictures together. He was the first person to sign my cast.
Yeah.
And, and then after he left, it was Lou Holtz calling.
Oh, wow.
And Donahue from UCLA calling, and then Oklahoma State and all the Florida, Florida State and Miami schools. And it just became a snowball, which also helped boost my confidence, uh, because, of course, I'm seventeen years old with a cast up to my hip, and I think that my career is over. And it just lit a little fire under me. I think I started doing leg lifts in the bed with my cast on at that stage.
Right.
That's awesome. So, so I wa- I was gonna ask you, what, what does a young man who is not even into- ... real adulthood and has been, uh, touted as number two in the country, possibly number one in the country, what does that do to you, um, um, and what happens?
I would say...
I don't-- I can't say that it was difficult
because,
you know, again, I'm, I'm not the one to really just, you know, brag on myself. But, you know, I, I was--
Even my mom would call her sisters and, "Hey, Rodrick had a great game. He had five touchdowns." And, and I would be walking through the living room while she's doing that. And I remember one time when I was like, "No, Mama, just, you know..."
Mm-hmm.
And she's like, this is what she said, "Child, he don't even want me to tell you how good he is. He just, just wanna just keep playing football." But Paul, so many different sportscasters, uh, from the sports news stations in local Dallas area, I would come home from football practice and they would just be parked in front of the house, um, ready to do an interview, uh, sometimes without me even knowing it because I've been at school all day. So I'm not knowing that when I get home that, you know, there's gonna be news media in front of the house. And-- But that, that whole process was a, was a nice one. It was cool. It was fun. It allowed me to
just be, you know, my own self. I, I, I was not as vocal as-- I can't say vo-- I wasn't the rah-rah guy.
Right.
I wasn't, I wasn't-- I would-- I, I'm gonna clap my hands and say, "Let's go," but I wasn't the leader from the standpoint of the cheers and the rah-rah. I just did it from, from, from my play, and I did just try to encourage people or other teammates that were maybe struggling with something or we didn't-- you know, my linemen needed a lift because they didn't-- they felt like they didn't do the right blocks, uh, for a certain play. I was just the one that just gonna just go lift them up and say, "Don't worry about it. We'll get them next time."
Yeah.
Um, so it wasn't really a lot of pressure on me. Even though going into my senior year, I only needed,
uh, fifteen hundred yards to have the state five-eight rushing record-
Mm-hmm.
-I looked at that and was like, "Oh, yeah, we-- that's gonna be a piece of cake. We're gonna get there." You know?
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Uh, but no, I, I think that, you know, from the standpoint of just me being who I was, how, how I was raised with my mom and my dad, uh, just
being humble and loving the game and enjoying the game-
Mm-hmm.
-I think that's what really just kept me in line.
That, that, that is awesome. That, that kind of, uh, works right into what you're doing now. I mean, you're, you're, you're, you're of service. You were of service of your teammates back in high school. You just wanted to lift them up and make everybody better around you. And, uh, you know, and you were one of the best, and you probably had rights to brag, but we all know that guy. You know?
Yes, sir.
Some-somebody is, is that good and they, and they know it and they tell you about it. I'm like, "Uh." But you, you get a lot more mileage ab-out of what, you know, how you lifted, uh... It's, it's, it's like, uh, all boats rise in a rising tide. You know? It's-
Oh, yeah.
I'm just like you. You brought the tide up, you know?
Yes, sir. There was a newspaper article that came out,
um, beginning of my senior year before I broke my ankle. Uh, the Dallas Morning News, I think it was, and they, they did an article, and it was the entire sports section. And the headline said, "Who is the best running back in the state of Texas?" And it was a Q, like a Q and A. So that was the question. And the A, the answer, it said, "Rodrick Walker is the most unassuming person in public, but makes loud noise on the field."
Mm.
And
so even with me being exactly like that, not ever sharing that, it was noticeable just from the outside, um, looking in with other people-
Mm.
-with other media, with other teammates, with other coaches. Uh, it was, it was just, it's funny to-- for me to say it out loud and then remember that that newspaper article actually said that I was quiet, I was humble, but on the field, you know, we're trying to terrorize the world.
You, you're so loud.
I love it. So, so how, how do you, how do you deal with an injury like that? Uh, obviously something was in your gut to, uh-- that, that you were able to come back because that... Did you break both the tib-fib type of ankle break or-
My, my foot was actually turned completely the other direction.
Ooh.
Yeah. So for me to even just look at that and see that laying on the field, you know, I... My coach came up to me immediately and I said, "Coach, what's wrong?" And he said, "Oh, it's just dislocated, son. Don't worry about it. It's just dislocated." So when I got to the hospital, you know, they came out and said it the best way it could. And as I'm going, I got to the hospital, the doctor came in, Paul, and he said, "So, uh, I hear you're this, you know, this great running back. What do you wanna do after you get outta here?" And I said, "I wanna go back to the game and watch my team win." And he said, "Oh, Mr. Walker,
you're gonna be here for about two weeks."
Wow.
And I was like, "Why? It's only dislocated." And he said, "No, sir. You know, you broke the small bone in your leg. Your, your ligaments and tendons are all torn and-
Wow
... and, you know, so we have to put a plate and nine screws, uh, in that, in that thing."
Oh, my.
So
that humbled me even more, 'cause I thought it was just dislocated like my coach said. But, you know, of course, our coach tried to make the best of the situation so I don't panic. And, um, so that's, that, that was that day. And it was tough. I, I came home
and not really feeling depressed. I know the moment I, I got depressed. I know the moment. We had PTA at my high school maybe
a week after me getting out of surgery. They were doing PTA meetings, and the team,
I think at this particular time, the team was going, was supposed to be there for something. I can't remember, like, to introduce everybody to the PTA, uh, uh, committee.
Mm-hmm.
And so I asked my mom, "I wanna go, you know, to the PTA meeting." And, and
she said, "No, son, you know, just relax. You know, just relax." And I said, "No, Mama, I wanna go. I wanna go. I wanna go." And she said, "No, son, you just, just relax and take it easy." And I remember saying,
um, "I don't get to go anywhere with this stupid cast."
Mm.
And I started crying.
Mm.
I'm getting emotional now.
Mm.
But-
Mm
...
um, she was just being a mom, right? Looking out for me. And my dad said
, "Come on, let, let the little boy go. Let the little boy go."
Yeah.
And they took me to that PTA meeting, and
we walked in, and there was a big applause, and everybody was happy. And that was kind of like
spiraling down-
Mm
... for a moment, and then walking into that room, and I was back up-
Mm-hmm
... because I was in my, in my element, you know, with my teammates and coaches.
So
it was tough,
really and truly, at that moment for, for those few days. I had family members, my uncle, um, he was my dad, that my dad's brother, he's a pastor. And he came over
another day, and I, all I did was lay on the couch. I never really got up for anything but to use the restroom. And I remember him coming over, and he walked in with those... He said, "Come on, give me, give me these crutches. Get up. Let's go for a walk." And I was like, "I don't really feel like going for a walk."
Mm.
He got me out of the house. We walked all the way down
my street,
and all he did was talk to me.
We didn't even talk about football.
Mm.
We was just talking about stuff. But it got me out of the house. It got me in my neighborhood. And then after that, I just started doing it on my own. I just started getting out of the house on my own, um,
taking my crutches across the street
to go see what my friends were doing. And that really helped get me back mentally,
um, on the game. I was still getting calls from college coaches. I was still doing that part. But at the same time, you know, I was missing the whole season.
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Brainwell program, which is also part of the Millennium Health Center. Uh, Dr. Mark Gordon, you've seen him on Joe Rogan and even on our show, the Head Rush podcast. Um,
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I was walking in the hallway, going to lunch, and my head coach walked in the hallway and he says, "Son, I got this letter right here saying that you've been misbehaving in school and just, just jacking off and, and, and kidding around and not taking things seriously." And I was like, "Coach, I, I promise you I haven't. I promise I haven't." He said, "Well, read what they wrote to me." And it was-
... a letter from the Whataburger All-Star Committee saying that they would like for me to play in the Whataburger All-Star Game that year. And I must have,
by now I'm off my crutches, I must have ran down that school hall way, screaming and jumping and, you know, that was the same coach who said it was just a dislocated ankle, right? Um,
man, but that's-- that moment, that moment I was climbing the mountain again.
Yeah.
I remember when I got that letter, I said, "Oh, after school today, I'm, I'm going to go work on
route running," because they wanted me to play slot in the game, because they didn't want me to put a lot of pressure on my ankle-
Mm-hmm
... uh, right out of surgery. Because the, the, uh, the game was gonna be in June.
You know, at the end of the school year. So I, I remember just going right outside after, at the end of school and getting my, getting my gym clothes on and catching punts and throws and just having fun, man, just being a kid again out there on the football field. And it just started taking off again from there.
That, uh, that is, that is, uh, an amazing...
look back on the power of team.
Uh,
you're to be commended but because you put the team above self,
you know? And you-
Yes, sir
... you really did. And, um, I, I, I just feel it in your, your attitude and your, um...
and the way you express how much you missed
the teammates and being part of that, that team. And, uh,
that, that's pretty powerful. Now,
l- let me ask you a question. I, I don't think it was all
Peachey Keen or Rose's, uh, uh, getting back on the field.
Uh, I think you... did you struggle a little bit getting back on? I mean, obviously you said you, you were off your crutches and you were starting to get a little mobile, but in... did you play in that All-Star game?
I played. Yes, sir.
Oh my gosh.
I played. I played in that game, North versus South. Uh-
How many months after that was it? Was it the, uh, after the injury?
So the injury was in September.
Yeah.
The game was in June.
Oh my God. Okay.
Yeah. I wore a cast up to my hip for three months, and then they cut it down below my knee and I had to wear that for another six to eight weeks.
Mm-hmm.
So I, I, I went on my recruiting trip to Notre Dame December 4th. I remember going on my recruiting trip. I got my cast off maybe three days before then.
Did a...
I wasn't doing anything quick. I was just walking with a limp at that time, and rehab was, was, was the next phase of, of it. So I actually went on a recruiting trip, or a few of them, early after getting the cast off. And the difficult part about it was me trusting that it's healed.
Mm-hmm.
The doctors told me, the, the, my, um,
my rehab doctors told me, my coaches told me, "Hey, you're healed." And it was just me being a running back, right? I stop fast and I go fast. I cut, make these cuts, and I was just scared to do it. I was nervous to do it. And any little pain, any little pain that I may had, and it wasn't little pain-
Mm-hmm
... but any pain that I had, I was like, "Oh man, it's not healed. There's something wrong." That's when I learned about scar tissue and that being, you know, something that could be, uh, helping with the pain or... And then just really just trusting what the doctor said.
Mm-hmm.
They said it's healed. I have a plate with screws. Go back and get these X-rays, and they're saying, "See? All good." And I just had to just keep believing that because... and, and reassuring myself that I am healed. I am healed. So, you know, I'm still scared to go all out with my moves-
Mm-hmm
... but, you know, slow motion things or just doing things at a different pace until I got comfortable. In that game, though, when we had that game, oh, I was wide open.
Oh, really?
I wasn't even thinking about it. I wasn't even thinking about it.
That's awesome. Well, did, did you have struggles getting back on track with the academics and the physical rebound? Um, obviously you had a big bump in your confidence in June at that All-Star game.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, did you go right into, uh, University of Texas that next year?
Yes, sir. I did. And right in and came in and, and again, full speed.
No one knew that I had, other than, you know, the coaches, but other teammates, they didn't know what I had just went through. And I wasn't gonna tell them because I didn't want that to be a crutch on myself, no pun intended. I didn't want that to be a crutch, uh-
Mm-hmm
... on myself. So I just, I just did what everybody else did. Now, I did have to do extra rehab. At the end of practice, I had to go through some different things other than just leaving and going home. I had to, I had to curl the tile under my feet with my toes and do the alphabet with your-
Uh-huh
... ankle and your foot, you know?
Oh, yeah.
Just strengthening, just strengthening those muscles and ligaments and tendons, uh, in that ankle and lower leg. So
I think that really was the only difference between myself and my current Texans teammates.
Mm-hmm.
And, and then, you know, they would just... you know, everybody was in there or a few people was always in the training room, right? Uh, but no one really knew what I had went through.
Yeah. Well, a- again, that's a, that's a testament to, to your your gut, uh, you know, how you wanted to succeed on the football field and get back.
Yes,
sir.
Um, you, um, you've had some very pres- prestigious awards. You actually led the University of Texas in, in your junior year in rushing. Is-- was that-
It was my senior year.
It was your senior year?
Yes, sir.
That-
Yeah
... that must have been pretty exciting to, uh-
Yeah, and I, I know, uh, again, we don't start out
as let that be the goal, right?
Right. Right.
I remember
the first two or three games we played, I remember playing Pitt and then, uh, TCU and another team, and Priest Holmes and myself, another great running back-
Mm-hmm
... we both were having 100-yard games together.
Oh, wow.
And, and the headlines came out, "Walker and Priest could be the first duo since whatever year-"
Yeah
... "at the University of Texas to, uh, have a 1,000-yard rushing." And, you know, we... It didn't-- that didn't happen just because of, you know, we had a coach that was
different.
Yes.
And he was just like, "One of you have to put the other one on the bench. One of you ha-"
Oh.
And yeah, it was, it was, it was weird. But anyway, yes, I had, uh, I mean, I had a great line, man. I had, I had, um, Dan Neil, Blake Brockermeyer-
Mm-hmm
... you know, both first rounders. And they used to open up some holes for me, brother.
Yeah.
And we used to have a lot of fun. I-- there was one season, I, I think it was my junior year, where every third down, the entire season, Paul-
Uh-huh
... every third down, I got the ball on a screen play.
Really?
Yeah. It was, it was weird again. You know, we, we were talking about a certain coach here.
Yeah.
But
I remember against Texas Tech, third and 24, and everybody is saying, "Watch Walker on the screen. Watch Walker on the screen."
I picked up 21 yards-
Oh.
... on that game. So, uh, yeah, again, I led, I led UT in receiving, like, catches-
Mm-hmm
... I think at one point-
Mm-hmm
... as a running back.
Right.
And so it was, it was,
again, you know, being the lead rusher or leading the team in rushing was nothing that I set out to do, you know?
Right.
Setting out to win games and helping the team win, yes, absolutely. How we did it, you know, I don't care how we did it.
Right.
You know, it just was, you know, fortunate enough that it, it, it fell my way that I was the leading rusher.
This episode of the Head Rush podcast is brought to you by the Patrick Richa CTE Awareness Foundation. Their goal is the-- to spread awareness about the dangers of RHI, repetitive head impacts, after losing their son, Patrick, to CTE. Sadly, there are too many like Patrick that have lost their families, jobs, and sometimes their lives. And this foundation is working hard to stop the devastation than c-- that can come from not protecting the brain. This foundation provides parents of school-aged children with information about the dangers of sports, concussive sports, and activities which involve head trauma.
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Okay, so we are the Head Rush podcast, and we do talk about brain health and wellness.
Mm-hmm.
Um,
what-- have, have you had experience with concussions? Obviously, as a running back, back in those days, you, you used your helmet to r- uh, ran-- run people over at times. Or did you, like a Barry Sanders, uh... You know, I, I, I remember Barry Sanders. I was supposed to be in the, uh, B gap, and I ended up in the A gap, but I literally went to grab Barry Sanders, and he was just... he was not there.
And he, and he ended up going 43 yards and, uh, almost scored a touchdown. Oh my gosh.
He disappeared on you.
Yeah. Yes, he did.
Yeah, I was considered a scat back. Um,
you know, I, I really, really loved running in between the tackles.
Mm.
You know, and that a lot of people, because of my speed, would consider me, you know, give him the toss and let him run outside and beat everybody-
Right
... to the sideline, right? But, you know, just like I know,
these linebackers are just as fast as running backs.
Yeah.
You know? And the one guy that hit me the hardest, and he's probably hitting a d-- there's a lot of people that can say this- ... was Quentin Corriott.
Mm.
And Quentin Corriott, man, he laid me out one time, knocked my helmet off. And as I'm going to the ground with my helmet off, Kevin Smith, this was when they were at A&M, Kevin Smith, who played with the Cowboys,
I think he saw me with the helmet off and just saw a target, and he beamed his helmet right into the side of my face as I was going down.
Yeah.
And I got up after that play, Paul,
seeing all the stars in the galaxy.
Mm-hmm.
I picked up my helmet, and I put my helmet on, and it was too big.
Hmm.
And I didn't know why. But I heard the ref saying, "Walker, Walker, twenty-four, twenty-four." I turned around, he was tossing me my pads. He knocked the pads out of my helmet. So I'm
connecting ear pads and everything in, well, as I'm walking back to the huddle. The quarterback
called the same play,
and I said, in the huddle, I said, "Peter, you gotta change the play. You gotta change the play." He says, "What?" I said, "Change the play." He said, "I'm not changing the play." He didn't know how I was feeling.
Anyway, as we're walking to the line of scrimmage, all you hear is me saying, "Peter, change the play. Peter, change the play. Peter..." And next thing you know, he hikes the ball,
comes Corriott again, but at this time, I created the quarterback slide,
and that's exactly what I did. I, I ran up to him and just slid like I was going into second base or something. And, uh, I was like-
You knew, you knew what you were in for if you took him on. Oh, my-
I knew it was coming. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Uh, so yes, uh, I've had
a lot of contact with the head or, you know, I... not me personally using it, but people tackling me, right?
Right, right.
Um, leading with their head on my helmet and things like that. And I've actually been hit pretty hard to where I didn't get hit in the head, just in the body to where my body kind of collapsed, right, and just, just shook the brain, I would say.
Hmm.
Just like being in a car
and, you know, the car that hits your car doesn't hit you, but
still can get the concussion.
Uh-huh. Mm-hmm.
Uh, so yes, sir, there's been a, there's been a, a few of those in my career.
So I'm, I've
kind of evolved o-over the p-past eighteen months of, uh, there... these kids don't need to hit at seven years old.
Um, that's just what I feel because the brain is not fully developed and so on and so forth.
Yes, sir.
I've gotta believe you've seen a big change in safety. I hope you've seen a big change in safety and less, less hitting in high school and grade school and all that stuff. Um, how, uh, how has the game changed since you've been, you know, off the field and then coaching and so on and so forth?
It changed a lot. And there's a, uh, organization here in Austin, Texas called Xtreme Flag Football.
Um, Xtreme Flag Football,
you wear helmets and shoulder pads,
and down below is flags.
Mm-hmm.
So for the first ten yards, you can make contact. You can't tackle, just warm them up. Can't take them to the ground.
Right.
And after ten yards, it's only flag pulling. You can only pull the flags.
Okay.
And this is
a way... they designed this to help eliminate long distance... you know, the safety at this league, you know, you got that athlete that's coming from fifteen yards back ready to blow up, uh, the most fragile kid on the team, right?
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
So that's why this organization teaches you how to, um, properly tackle and block without using your head.
Mm-hmm.
You know, that's their mission, the head out of the game. Head... it used to be heads up.
Right.
Now it's head out.
Head out, okay.
Yeah.
Got it.
So it's changed. I've seen this organization help kids and youth take that knowledge. You know, these coaches are taught and prepared to teach these kids the proper way to tackle. You can't just go willy-nilly and say, "Run this play, go tackle him." First, they teach you how to tackle-
Right
... and block with your head out of the game. So when you started going to middle school, you're very aware of how to protect yourself, and you can pass that information and knowledge on to, uh, other teammates.
Right.
So it's definitely changed drastically since we played because, you know, spearing, uh, and, you know, leading with the face mask on the chest, you know, it can hurt the tackler, and it can hurt the person carrying the ball.
Right.
So it's definitely changed so much, and I'm so glad because, you know,
the game has become even more physical, more violent. You know, kids are stronger these days. They're bigger.
Right.
There's more, uh, ways to get stronger, uh, using the... with the equipment that we have today. So yeah, I'm definitely, uh, proud of everything. And of course, everyone doesn't know. Not everyone knows still how to, how to tackle or block properly without using your head, but there's always, you know, a good coach somewhere on the team that's teaching the defense, uh, you know, the best way to do that.
Yeah. Well, that, that, that's important. That's so important because, uh, obviously the... not every kid is, is going to, um, go into college. And very, very few go, go on to the NFL. There's only-- there's still only two hundred and twenty-four or twenty-eight guys drafted each year, and then probably another three or four hundred get the, get the opportunity. Um,
so that's, that's encouraging to hear that. Um, how, how are the parents, uh, receiving that? Do they argue with you, you know, "Let's just play football," or do they, uh, do s- do they actually understand their children-- their, their kids' brain health and wellness depends on these safer techniques?
Oh, the parents are one hundred thousand percent bought in.
Good.
You know, first of all, these are the same parents that says, "I really don't want my kid to play this sport."
Mm.
You know, but, you know, the kid wants to play, and it's usually the moms, of course, that are being protective of their kid. Dads, you know, he's the rah-rah guy. He's played before and wants to see his son play now, right? Um, but yes, the parents are very, um, uh, accepting of the coaches being certified. These coaches just can't come out and coach. They have to go through a certification-
Good
... to be trained the proper way in order to, to do this.
Good. That- that's, that's powerful and, and that's, it's, it's, it's needed. Um, um- If you or someone you love is living with Parkinson's, MS, or symptoms associated with CTE, this is worth knowing. Ambio Life Sciences offers a novel alternative medicine called ibogaine and operates the only ibogaine clinic in the world for people with neurodegenerative disorders.
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Um, I need you to tell me what really, uh, really grabs your heart. And, and I know you, you, you have community involvement. Um, you work with-- I think you have your own foundation, right? Uh, or-
Yes, sir. I have the Roderick Walker Foundation.
Yeah. K-
And we, we raise money for the Boys and Girls Club, Central Texas Food Bank, um, battered and abused women and children. Uh, we're assisting with the Arthritis Foundation, with the NFL Alumni Association. And currently, I'm doing a,
a celebrity golf tournament
for, um, the veterans in November,
and it's called the Veterans Fairways Classic. It's gonna be the inaugural for, for that. So I'm, I'm just excited to be doing all of these things, you know,
just to help the less fortunate,
you know, help those that, that are in need. And being able to do that, Paul, really, really, really warms my heart. I love being able to provide for people who just really can't provide for themselves.
Mm.
I'm a product of Head Start, if you're ever familiar with that, growing up as a kid. And there's an organization here, Child Inc, and the Head Start program, and I just spoke with them yesterday, and they want to do something, um, to help raise funds for their organization. There's another organization called Operation Turkey, and they do things all over the country with feeding families during Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays.
Mm.
So I'm gonna do a, a, a casino night with them coming up here soon with the Roderick Walker Foundation. So, man, I'm just really, really trying to be all over the place. I want to be all over the place with helping organizations and other charities raise money for their own individual needs.
Tell us where to find... Is it the roderickwalkerfoundation.com? Dot-
Yep, the roderickwalkerfoundation.org. And-
Dot org
... the name is R-O-D-R-I-C-K, Roderick.
Roderick, I, I want, I want to have you back, and we're, we're gonna talk about all that stuff and leave the football out of it. The football was a-- I, I love your story. It's a powerful story about-
Thank you
... um, resilience and, uh, and, uh, fortitude. And you're helping kids now, helping families. Uh, you're doing so much for the community, um, uh, through your foundation. So that is awesome.
Thank you, brother.
Uh, we always like to leave the-- our listeners with a word of hope. Can you give us a word of hope?
Absolutely. I-- A word of hope... Listen, I always tell people, I tell kids, "Everything is not gonna be perfect," right? There's gonna be some, some decisions that you make that can make you go down, right? You curve down. But at that very moment, it's not over. You can curve right back up, starting with your thoughts, right? Like, "I made a mistake." You know, "I didn't study hard enough to, to make a good grade on a test." Or, you know, "I just got in trouble with the law," right? "I stole some candy out of the store and now the police are involved," right?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, that's a little heavier, but you can still curve up because
as long as you're trying to improve your life and be better, you can always say, when you say, "Man, I messed up," that's automatically admitting that you did something that you weren't supposed to do, and you start to, you start to incline right there. You're going right back up. Now, are you gonna have to face some consequences while you're trying to curve up? Absolutely, right? But if you cons- continue to strive for greatness... I, I ask people, "How you feeling? How you doing?" And they say, "Good." And I say, "Well, why settle for good when greatness is available," right? Every morning you wake up, you have the choice to make, it's gonna be a good day or a great day.
You have that choice. Now, after that, it's the steps that you take on a daily basis. When you, when you go to the corner store and you see that guy or girl or kid walking behind you, hold the door open for them, right?
Mm-hmm.
Hold the door open for your teacher. Hold the door open for the classmate, right?
Mm-hmm.
And that, those positive, small, little positive moves or changes, it just, it just helps you
be continuous at doing those great little things, great small little tidbits that just can form the rest of your life.
Mm-hmm.
So I always tell people, even though you may have done something that made you a setback, right? I'm at, I'm at a university that's a Division Three school, and these kids go through everything that-
Uh-huh
... you probably wouldn't go through at a big time Division One university. So I have to help them understand that right, right now, you're at Last Chance University, and we need for you to
figure out what you need to do to get out of here, right?
Mm-hmm.
We wanna see you go Division Two, Division, Division One.
Mm-hmm.
So we have to continue to curve up. The mistakes that we're making right now, let's just curve up from those mistakes.
That's awesome. Every, every kid, uh, should have a Roderick Walker as a coach because that's, that's pretty powerful. And, uh-
Thank you, brother.
Yeah. Well, thank you. It's be- been a pleasure getting to know you more. And, uh, yeah, we've gotta have you back and we'll, we'll absolutely talk about the, the foundation more and what you're... I love that philosophy. I'm like, I'm getting chills right now. That was a good word of hope. Thank you. Thank you.
It's been awesome and, um, I love what you guys are doing and the awareness that you're trying to bring, uh, regarding the sport. And again, you know, Paul, anything I can do to help, you-
Awesome
... you can reach out to me anytime.
Awesome. If you ever, uh, uh, uh, see Tony Brackins, say hey for me. I appreciate it.
I promise I will. I might just give him a call and tell him.
Hey, we-- may- maybe we'll have him on the Head Rush podcast and give a little preaching.
Oh, yeah. Yeah, let's do that. Let's do that.
All right, brother.
He's gonna, he's gonna make, he's gonna make both of us curve up.
I, I need it, so that's awesome. Good, good stuff. Thank you, Roderick.
All right. Thank you very much. I appreciate you guys.
All right. Take care. Bye.
All right. Bye-bye.
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Welcome to the Head Rush Podcast. I'm Paul Frase, and I played eleven years in the NFL. And at the Head Rush Podcast, we talk about everything related to brain trauma and brain health and wellness. We focus on traumatic brain injuries sustained through repeated head impacts, RHI, and repeated blast exposure, RBE, for our men and women who serve in the armed forces. We discuss chronic traumatic encephalopathy, CTE, and we cover how brain injuries can and will cause mental health issues such as depression, addiction, lack of executive function, memory loss, even suicide ideation, as well as degenerative neurological issues. Our mantra is how to cope and find hope, and we focus our energy on finding therapies and sharing hope through education and by raising awareness. And please like, subscribe, and share, if you will. It will help us reach our goal of helping people suffering with traumatic brain injury. Our guest today is Roderick Walker.
Now, Roderick grew up in Irving, Texas and was a standout running back at Irving Nimitz High School.
Were you guys considered pretty good?
We were pretty good. I know at one point we were... our schedule was considered, um, like, in the top five or top ten-
Right
... in the nation.
Yeah.
You know, because we played the, the Duncanville High Schools, we played DeSoto High School, so-
Right
... we played a lot of, uh, a lot of top guys, a lot of top teams, uh, at that time. So our schedule kind of reflected it.
Yeah. Cool. Awesome.
And I grew up, I grew up in Dallas. Uh, I lived-- I grew up in West Dallas and just went to school in Irving.
Oh. Roderick played at the University of Texas from nineteen ninety-one to ninety-four and led Texas in rushing in nineteen ninety-four. And, uh, after football, Roderick built a second chapter around leadership, camps, advocacy, coaching, and community work. Um, a huge welcome to you, Roderick. Thank you so much for being a-- joining us on the Head Rush podcast.
Absolutely. Thank you for having me. Uh, I look forward to, uh, uh, just hanging out with you guys here today and, and, and getting some awareness, right?
Exactly. Exactly. I grew up in New Hampshire. We had about, uh, we had about eleven guys make it to the NFL in the past a hundred years from New Hampshire, right? So a little bit different. You guys probably had eleven guys from your high school over the pa-- But, um, you, you would have been considered a five-star athlete right now because, uh, back, back in the early nineties, you, and I know you don't like to brag on yourself, but you were number two in the nation,
uh, uh, uh, recruited running back. Is that, is that correct?
That is correct. That is correct. I had, had a great career in high school. I got moved up to varsity my freshman year for the last three games, and I think in those three games, I had close to seven hundred yards. Um, and then obviously my sophomore year, I had about fifteen hundred yards. My junior year, well over two thousand yards.
Wow.
Uh, and a lot of touchdowns. I led the state, obviously, in rushing and, and in touchdowns. And then my senior year, I broke my ankle first play, first game, so I never played my senior year in high school.
Okay.
And, uh, but with-- just because of those accolades, and I guess, you know, in high-- in college, they, they recruit you on potential.
Right.
And, and I, I guess I had a, a little upside to, uh, recovering from the injury and then being, you know, on someone's team. When I was injured, I woke up in the hospital hall with a cast up to my, up to my hip and,
you know, very depressed, very depressed. And then all of a sudden this guy comes into my hospital room, and it's Roger Staubach. And, and he was just like, "Hey, man, don't worry about it. You know, you're gonna get over this injury." And I remember him asking me, "So what do you wanna do? What are your goals,
you know, as your-- for your freshman year in college?" And I said, "Well, I would like to win the Heisman Trophy as a freshman." And he looked at me and he said, "Well, I think you can do it
if you go to Navy."
And I said, "Well,
might not do it then."
Oh, no.
Well-
Uh, but after that, after that, man, the phone started ringing off the hook in the, in the hospital room. Seems like he just sparked everything. He came in and shook my hand, and we took pictures together. He was the first person to sign my cast.
Yeah.
And, and then after he left, it was Lou Holtz calling.
Oh, wow.
And Donahue from UCLA calling, and then Oklahoma State and all the Florida, Florida State and Miami schools. And it just became a snowball, which also helped boost my confidence, uh, because, of course, I'm seventeen years old with a cast up to my hip, and I think that my career is over. And it just lit a little fire under me. I think I started doing leg lifts in the bed with my cast on at that stage.
Right.
That's awesome. So, so I wa- I was gonna ask you, what, what does a young man who is not even into- ... real adulthood and has been, uh, touted as number two in the country, possibly number one in the country, what does that do to you, um, um, and what happens?
I would say...
I don't-- I can't say that it was difficult
because,
you know, again, I'm, I'm not the one to really just, you know, brag on myself. But, you know, I, I was--
Even my mom would call her sisters and, "Hey, Rodrick had a great game. He had five touchdowns." And, and I would be walking through the living room while she's doing that. And I remember one time when I was like, "No, Mama, just, you know..."
Mm-hmm.
And she's like, this is what she said, "Child, he don't even want me to tell you how good he is. He just, just wanna just keep playing football." But Paul, so many different sportscasters, uh, from the sports news stations in local Dallas area, I would come home from football practice and they would just be parked in front of the house, um, ready to do an interview, uh, sometimes without me even knowing it because I've been at school all day. So I'm not knowing that when I get home that, you know, there's gonna be news media in front of the house. And-- But that, that whole process was a, was a nice one. It was cool. It was fun. It allowed me to
just be, you know, my own self. I, I, I was not as vocal as-- I can't say vo-- I wasn't the rah-rah guy.
Right.
I wasn't, I wasn't-- I would-- I, I'm gonna clap my hands and say, "Let's go," but I wasn't the leader from the standpoint of the cheers and the rah-rah. I just did it from, from, from my play, and I did just try to encourage people or other teammates that were maybe struggling with something or we didn't-- you know, my linemen needed a lift because they didn't-- they felt like they didn't do the right blocks, uh, for a certain play. I was just the one that just gonna just go lift them up and say, "Don't worry about it. We'll get them next time."
Yeah.
Um, so it wasn't really a lot of pressure on me. Even though going into my senior year, I only needed,
uh, fifteen hundred yards to have the state five-eight rushing record-
Mm-hmm.
-I looked at that and was like, "Oh, yeah, we-- that's gonna be a piece of cake. We're gonna get there." You know?
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Uh, but no, I, I think that, you know, from the standpoint of just me being who I was, how, how I was raised with my mom and my dad, uh, just
being humble and loving the game and enjoying the game-
Mm-hmm.
-I think that's what really just kept me in line.
That, that, that is awesome. That, that kind of, uh, works right into what you're doing now. I mean, you're, you're, you're, you're of service. You were of service of your teammates back in high school. You just wanted to lift them up and make everybody better around you. And, uh, you know, and you were one of the best, and you probably had rights to brag, but we all know that guy. You know?
Yes, sir.
Some-somebody is, is that good and they, and they know it and they tell you about it. I'm like, "Uh." But you, you get a lot more mileage ab-out of what, you know, how you lifted, uh... It's, it's, it's like, uh, all boats rise in a rising tide. You know? It's-
Oh, yeah.
I'm just like you. You brought the tide up, you know?
Yes, sir. There was a newspaper article that came out,
um, beginning of my senior year before I broke my ankle. Uh, the Dallas Morning News, I think it was, and they, they did an article, and it was the entire sports section. And the headline said, "Who is the best running back in the state of Texas?" And it was a Q, like a Q and A. So that was the question. And the A, the answer, it said, "Rodrick Walker is the most unassuming person in public, but makes loud noise on the field."
Mm.
And
so even with me being exactly like that, not ever sharing that, it was noticeable just from the outside, um, looking in with other people-
Mm.
-with other media, with other teammates, with other coaches. Uh, it was, it was just, it's funny to-- for me to say it out loud and then remember that that newspaper article actually said that I was quiet, I was humble, but on the field, you know, we're trying to terrorize the world.
You, you're so loud.
I love it. So, so how, how do you, how do you deal with an injury like that? Uh, obviously something was in your gut to, uh-- that, that you were able to come back because that... Did you break both the tib-fib type of ankle break or-
My, my foot was actually turned completely the other direction.
Ooh.
Yeah. So for me to even just look at that and see that laying on the field, you know, I... My coach came up to me immediately and I said, "Coach, what's wrong?" And he said, "Oh, it's just dislocated, son. Don't worry about it. It's just dislocated." So when I got to the hospital, you know, they came out and said it the best way it could. And as I'm going, I got to the hospital, the doctor came in, Paul, and he said, "So, uh, I hear you're this, you know, this great running back. What do you wanna do after you get outta here?" And I said, "I wanna go back to the game and watch my team win." And he said, "Oh, Mr. Walker,
you're gonna be here for about two weeks."
Wow.
And I was like, "Why? It's only dislocated." And he said, "No, sir. You know, you broke the small bone in your leg. Your, your ligaments and tendons are all torn and-
Wow
... and, you know, so we have to put a plate and nine screws, uh, in that, in that thing."
Oh, my.
So
that humbled me even more, 'cause I thought it was just dislocated like my coach said. But, you know, of course, our coach tried to make the best of the situation so I don't panic. And, um, so that's, that, that was that day. And it was tough. I, I came home
and not really feeling depressed. I know the moment I, I got depressed. I know the moment. We had PTA at my high school maybe
a week after me getting out of surgery. They were doing PTA meetings, and the team,
I think at this particular time, the team was going, was supposed to be there for something. I can't remember, like, to introduce everybody to the PTA, uh, uh, committee.
Mm-hmm.
And so I asked my mom, "I wanna go, you know, to the PTA meeting." And, and
she said, "No, son, you know, just relax. You know, just relax." And I said, "No, Mama, I wanna go. I wanna go. I wanna go." And she said, "No, son, you just, just relax and take it easy." And I remember saying,
um, "I don't get to go anywhere with this stupid cast."
Mm.
And I started crying.
Mm.
I'm getting emotional now.
Mm.
But-
Mm
...
um, she was just being a mom, right? Looking out for me. And my dad said
, "Come on, let, let the little boy go. Let the little boy go."
Yeah.
And they took me to that PTA meeting, and
we walked in, and there was a big applause, and everybody was happy. And that was kind of like
spiraling down-
Mm
... for a moment, and then walking into that room, and I was back up-
Mm-hmm
... because I was in my, in my element, you know, with my teammates and coaches.
So
it was tough,
really and truly, at that moment for, for those few days. I had family members, my uncle, um, he was my dad, that my dad's brother, he's a pastor. And he came over
another day, and I, all I did was lay on the couch. I never really got up for anything but to use the restroom. And I remember him coming over, and he walked in with those... He said, "Come on, give me, give me these crutches. Get up. Let's go for a walk." And I was like, "I don't really feel like going for a walk."
Mm.
He got me out of the house. We walked all the way down
my street,
and all he did was talk to me.
We didn't even talk about football.
Mm.
We was just talking about stuff. But it got me out of the house. It got me in my neighborhood. And then after that, I just started doing it on my own. I just started getting out of the house on my own, um,
taking my crutches across the street
to go see what my friends were doing. And that really helped get me back mentally,
um, on the game. I was still getting calls from college coaches. I was still doing that part. But at the same time, you know, I was missing the whole season.
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I was walking in the hallway, going to lunch, and my head coach walked in the hallway and he says, "Son, I got this letter right here saying that you've been misbehaving in school and just, just jacking off and, and, and kidding around and not taking things seriously." And I was like, "Coach, I, I promise you I haven't. I promise I haven't." He said, "Well, read what they wrote to me." And it was-
... a letter from the Whataburger All-Star Committee saying that they would like for me to play in the Whataburger All-Star Game that year. And I must have,
by now I'm off my crutches, I must have ran down that school hall way, screaming and jumping and, you know, that was the same coach who said it was just a dislocated ankle, right? Um,
man, but that's-- that moment, that moment I was climbing the mountain again.
Yeah.
I remember when I got that letter, I said, "Oh, after school today, I'm, I'm going to go work on
route running," because they wanted me to play slot in the game, because they didn't want me to put a lot of pressure on my ankle-
Mm-hmm
... uh, right out of surgery. Because the, the, uh, the game was gonna be in June.
You know, at the end of the school year. So I, I remember just going right outside after, at the end of school and getting my, getting my gym clothes on and catching punts and throws and just having fun, man, just being a kid again out there on the football field. And it just started taking off again from there.
That, uh, that is, that is, uh, an amazing...
look back on the power of team.
Uh,
you're to be commended but because you put the team above self,
you know? And you-
Yes, sir
... you really did. And, um, I, I, I just feel it in your, your attitude and your, um...
and the way you express how much you missed
the teammates and being part of that, that team. And, uh,
that, that's pretty powerful. Now,
l- let me ask you a question. I, I don't think it was all
Peachey Keen or Rose's, uh, uh, getting back on the field.
Uh, I think you... did you struggle a little bit getting back on? I mean, obviously you said you, you were off your crutches and you were starting to get a little mobile, but in... did you play in that All-Star game?
I played. Yes, sir.
Oh my gosh.
I played. I played in that game, North versus South. Uh-
How many months after that was it? Was it the, uh, after the injury?
So the injury was in September.
Yeah.
The game was in June.
Oh my God. Okay.
Yeah. I wore a cast up to my hip for three months, and then they cut it down below my knee and I had to wear that for another six to eight weeks.
Mm-hmm.
So I, I, I went on my recruiting trip to Notre Dame December 4th. I remember going on my recruiting trip. I got my cast off maybe three days before then.
Did a...
I wasn't doing anything quick. I was just walking with a limp at that time, and rehab was, was, was the next phase of, of it. So I actually went on a recruiting trip, or a few of them, early after getting the cast off. And the difficult part about it was me trusting that it's healed.
Mm-hmm.
The doctors told me, the, the, my, um,
my rehab doctors told me, my coaches told me, "Hey, you're healed." And it was just me being a running back, right? I stop fast and I go fast. I cut, make these cuts, and I was just scared to do it. I was nervous to do it. And any little pain, any little pain that I may had, and it wasn't little pain-
Mm-hmm
... but any pain that I had, I was like, "Oh man, it's not healed. There's something wrong." That's when I learned about scar tissue and that being, you know, something that could be, uh, helping with the pain or... And then just really just trusting what the doctor said.
Mm-hmm.
They said it's healed. I have a plate with screws. Go back and get these X-rays, and they're saying, "See? All good." And I just had to just keep believing that because... and, and reassuring myself that I am healed. I am healed. So, you know, I'm still scared to go all out with my moves-
Mm-hmm
... but, you know, slow motion things or just doing things at a different pace until I got comfortable. In that game, though, when we had that game, oh, I was wide open.
Oh, really?
I wasn't even thinking about it. I wasn't even thinking about it.
That's awesome. Well, did, did you have struggles getting back on track with the academics and the physical rebound? Um, obviously you had a big bump in your confidence in June at that All-Star game.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, did you go right into, uh, University of Texas that next year?
Yes, sir. I did. And right in and came in and, and again, full speed.
No one knew that I had, other than, you know, the coaches, but other teammates, they didn't know what I had just went through. And I wasn't gonna tell them because I didn't want that to be a crutch on myself, no pun intended. I didn't want that to be a crutch, uh-
Mm-hmm
... on myself. So I just, I just did what everybody else did. Now, I did have to do extra rehab. At the end of practice, I had to go through some different things other than just leaving and going home. I had to, I had to curl the tile under my feet with my toes and do the alphabet with your-
Uh-huh
... ankle and your foot, you know?
Oh, yeah.
Just strengthening, just strengthening those muscles and ligaments and tendons, uh, in that ankle and lower leg. So
I think that really was the only difference between myself and my current Texans teammates.
Mm-hmm.
And, and then, you know, they would just... you know, everybody was in there or a few people was always in the training room, right? Uh, but no one really knew what I had went through.
Yeah. Well, a- again, that's a, that's a testament to, to your your gut, uh, you know, how you wanted to succeed on the football field and get back.
Yes,
sir.
Um, you, um, you've had some very pres- prestigious awards. You actually led the University of Texas in, in your junior year in rushing. Is-- was that-
It was my senior year.
It was your senior year?
Yes, sir.
That-
Yeah
... that must have been pretty exciting to, uh-
Yeah, and I, I know, uh, again, we don't start out
as let that be the goal, right?
Right. Right.
I remember
the first two or three games we played, I remember playing Pitt and then, uh, TCU and another team, and Priest Holmes and myself, another great running back-
Mm-hmm
... we both were having 100-yard games together.
Oh, wow.
And, and the headlines came out, "Walker and Priest could be the first duo since whatever year-"
Yeah
... "at the University of Texas to, uh, have a 1,000-yard rushing." And, you know, we... It didn't-- that didn't happen just because of, you know, we had a coach that was
different.
Yes.
And he was just like, "One of you have to put the other one on the bench. One of you ha-"
Oh.
And yeah, it was, it was, it was weird. But anyway, yes, I had, uh, I mean, I had a great line, man. I had, I had, um, Dan Neil, Blake Brockermeyer-
Mm-hmm
... you know, both first rounders. And they used to open up some holes for me, brother.
Yeah.
And we used to have a lot of fun. I-- there was one season, I, I think it was my junior year, where every third down, the entire season, Paul-
Uh-huh
... every third down, I got the ball on a screen play.
Really?
Yeah. It was, it was weird again. You know, we, we were talking about a certain coach here.
Yeah.
But
I remember against Texas Tech, third and 24, and everybody is saying, "Watch Walker on the screen. Watch Walker on the screen."
I picked up 21 yards-
Oh.
... on that game. So, uh, yeah, again, I led, I led UT in receiving, like, catches-
Mm-hmm
... I think at one point-
Mm-hmm
... as a running back.
Right.
And so it was, it was,
again, you know, being the lead rusher or leading the team in rushing was nothing that I set out to do, you know?
Right.
Setting out to win games and helping the team win, yes, absolutely. How we did it, you know, I don't care how we did it.
Right.
You know, it just was, you know, fortunate enough that it, it, it fell my way that I was the leading rusher.
This episode of the Head Rush podcast is brought to you by the Patrick Richa CTE Awareness Foundation. Their goal is the-- to spread awareness about the dangers of RHI, repetitive head impacts, after losing their son, Patrick, to CTE. Sadly, there are too many like Patrick that have lost their families, jobs, and sometimes their lives. And this foundation is working hard to stop the devastation than c-- that can come from not protecting the brain. This foundation provides parents of school-aged children with information about the dangers of sports, concussive sports, and activities which involve head trauma.
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... stopcte.org.
Okay, so we are the Head Rush podcast, and we do talk about brain health and wellness.
Mm-hmm.
Um,
what-- have, have you had experience with concussions? Obviously, as a running back, back in those days, you, you used your helmet to r- uh, ran-- run people over at times. Or did you, like a Barry Sanders, uh... You know, I, I, I remember Barry Sanders. I was supposed to be in the, uh, B gap, and I ended up in the A gap, but I literally went to grab Barry Sanders, and he was just... he was not there.
And he, and he ended up going 43 yards and, uh, almost scored a touchdown. Oh my gosh.
He disappeared on you.
Yeah. Yes, he did.
Yeah, I was considered a scat back. Um,
you know, I, I really, really loved running in between the tackles.
Mm.
You know, and that a lot of people, because of my speed, would consider me, you know, give him the toss and let him run outside and beat everybody-
Right
... to the sideline, right? But, you know, just like I know,
these linebackers are just as fast as running backs.
Yeah.
You know? And the one guy that hit me the hardest, and he's probably hitting a d-- there's a lot of people that can say this- ... was Quentin Corriott.
Mm.
And Quentin Corriott, man, he laid me out one time, knocked my helmet off. And as I'm going to the ground with my helmet off, Kevin Smith, this was when they were at A&M, Kevin Smith, who played with the Cowboys,
I think he saw me with the helmet off and just saw a target, and he beamed his helmet right into the side of my face as I was going down.
Yeah.
And I got up after that play, Paul,
seeing all the stars in the galaxy.
Mm-hmm.
I picked up my helmet, and I put my helmet on, and it was too big.
Hmm.
And I didn't know why. But I heard the ref saying, "Walker, Walker, twenty-four, twenty-four." I turned around, he was tossing me my pads. He knocked the pads out of my helmet. So I'm
connecting ear pads and everything in, well, as I'm walking back to the huddle. The quarterback
called the same play,
and I said, in the huddle, I said, "Peter, you gotta change the play. You gotta change the play." He says, "What?" I said, "Change the play." He said, "I'm not changing the play." He didn't know how I was feeling.
Anyway, as we're walking to the line of scrimmage, all you hear is me saying, "Peter, change the play. Peter, change the play. Peter..." And next thing you know, he hikes the ball,
comes Corriott again, but at this time, I created the quarterback slide,
and that's exactly what I did. I, I ran up to him and just slid like I was going into second base or something. And, uh, I was like-
You knew, you knew what you were in for if you took him on. Oh, my-
I knew it was coming. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. Uh, so yes, uh, I've had
a lot of contact with the head or, you know, I... not me personally using it, but people tackling me, right?
Right, right.
Um, leading with their head on my helmet and things like that. And I've actually been hit pretty hard to where I didn't get hit in the head, just in the body to where my body kind of collapsed, right, and just, just shook the brain, I would say.
Hmm.
Just like being in a car
and, you know, the car that hits your car doesn't hit you, but
still can get the concussion.
Uh-huh. Mm-hmm.
Uh, so yes, sir, there's been a, there's been a, a few of those in my career.
So I'm, I've
kind of evolved o-over the p-past eighteen months of, uh, there... these kids don't need to hit at seven years old.
Um, that's just what I feel because the brain is not fully developed and so on and so forth.
Yes, sir.
I've gotta believe you've seen a big change in safety. I hope you've seen a big change in safety and less, less hitting in high school and grade school and all that stuff. Um, how, uh, how has the game changed since you've been, you know, off the field and then coaching and so on and so forth?
It changed a lot. And there's a, uh, organization here in Austin, Texas called Xtreme Flag Football.
Um, Xtreme Flag Football,
you wear helmets and shoulder pads,
and down below is flags.
Mm-hmm.
So for the first ten yards, you can make contact. You can't tackle, just warm them up. Can't take them to the ground.
Right.
And after ten yards, it's only flag pulling. You can only pull the flags.
Okay.
And this is
a way... they designed this to help eliminate long distance... you know, the safety at this league, you know, you got that athlete that's coming from fifteen yards back ready to blow up, uh, the most fragile kid on the team, right?
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
So that's why this organization teaches you how to, um, properly tackle and block without using your head.
Mm-hmm.
You know, that's their mission, the head out of the game. Head... it used to be heads up.
Right.
Now it's head out.
Head out, okay.
Yeah.
Got it.
So it's changed. I've seen this organization help kids and youth take that knowledge. You know, these coaches are taught and prepared to teach these kids the proper way to tackle. You can't just go willy-nilly and say, "Run this play, go tackle him." First, they teach you how to tackle-
Right
... and block with your head out of the game. So when you started going to middle school, you're very aware of how to protect yourself, and you can pass that information and knowledge on to, uh, other teammates.
Right.
So it's definitely changed drastically since we played because, you know, spearing, uh, and, you know, leading with the face mask on the chest, you know, it can hurt the tackler, and it can hurt the person carrying the ball.
Right.
So it's definitely changed so much, and I'm so glad because, you know,
the game has become even more physical, more violent. You know, kids are stronger these days. They're bigger.
Right.
There's more, uh, ways to get stronger, uh, using the... with the equipment that we have today. So yeah, I'm definitely, uh, proud of everything. And of course, everyone doesn't know. Not everyone knows still how to, how to tackle or block properly without using your head, but there's always, you know, a good coach somewhere on the team that's teaching the defense, uh, you know, the best way to do that.
Yeah. Well, that, that, that's important. That's so important because, uh, obviously the... not every kid is, is going to, um, go into college. And very, very few go, go on to the NFL. There's only-- there's still only two hundred and twenty-four or twenty-eight guys drafted each year, and then probably another three or four hundred get the, get the opportunity. Um,
so that's, that's encouraging to hear that. Um, how, how are the parents, uh, receiving that? Do they argue with you, you know, "Let's just play football," or do they, uh, do s- do they actually understand their children-- their, their kids' brain health and wellness depends on these safer techniques?
Oh, the parents are one hundred thousand percent bought in.
Good.
You know, first of all, these are the same parents that says, "I really don't want my kid to play this sport."
Mm.
You know, but, you know, the kid wants to play, and it's usually the moms, of course, that are being protective of their kid. Dads, you know, he's the rah-rah guy. He's played before and wants to see his son play now, right? Um, but yes, the parents are very, um, uh, accepting of the coaches being certified. These coaches just can't come out and coach. They have to go through a certification-
Good
... to be trained the proper way in order to, to do this.
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Um, I need you to tell me what really, uh, really grabs your heart. And, and I know you, you, you have community involvement. Um, you work with-- I think you have your own foundation, right? Uh, or-
Yes, sir. I have the Roderick Walker Foundation.
Yeah. K-
And we, we raise money for the Boys and Girls Club, Central Texas Food Bank, um, battered and abused women and children. Uh, we're assisting with the Arthritis Foundation, with the NFL Alumni Association. And currently, I'm doing a,
a celebrity golf tournament
for, um, the veterans in November,
and it's called the Veterans Fairways Classic. It's gonna be the inaugural for, for that. So I'm, I'm just excited to be doing all of these things, you know,
just to help the less fortunate,
you know, help those that, that are in need. And being able to do that, Paul, really, really, really warms my heart. I love being able to provide for people who just really can't provide for themselves.
Mm.
I'm a product of Head Start, if you're ever familiar with that, growing up as a kid. And there's an organization here, Child Inc, and the Head Start program, and I just spoke with them yesterday, and they want to do something, um, to help raise funds for their organization. There's another organization called Operation Turkey, and they do things all over the country with feeding families during Thanksgiving and Christmas holidays.
Mm.
So I'm gonna do a, a, a casino night with them coming up here soon with the Roderick Walker Foundation. So, man, I'm just really, really trying to be all over the place. I want to be all over the place with helping organizations and other charities raise money for their own individual needs.
Tell us where to find... Is it the roderickwalkerfoundation.com? Dot-
Yep, the roderickwalkerfoundation.org. And-
Dot org
... the name is R-O-D-R-I-C-K, Roderick.
Roderick, I, I want, I want to have you back, and we're, we're gonna talk about all that stuff and leave the football out of it. The football was a-- I, I love your story. It's a powerful story about-
Thank you
... um, resilience and, uh, and, uh, fortitude. And you're helping kids now, helping families. Uh, you're doing so much for the community, um, uh, through your foundation. So that is awesome.
Thank you, brother.
Uh, we always like to leave the-- our listeners with a word of hope. Can you give us a word of hope?
Absolutely. I-- A word of hope... Listen, I always tell people, I tell kids, "Everything is not gonna be perfect," right? There's gonna be some, some decisions that you make that can make you go down, right? You curve down. But at that very moment, it's not over. You can curve right back up, starting with your thoughts, right? Like, "I made a mistake." You know, "I didn't study hard enough to, to make a good grade on a test." Or, you know, "I just got in trouble with the law," right? "I stole some candy out of the store and now the police are involved," right?
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, that's a little heavier, but you can still curve up because
as long as you're trying to improve your life and be better, you can always say, when you say, "Man, I messed up," that's automatically admitting that you did something that you weren't supposed to do, and you start to, you start to incline right there. You're going right back up. Now, are you gonna have to face some consequences while you're trying to curve up? Absolutely, right? But if you cons- continue to strive for greatness... I, I ask people, "How you feeling? How you doing?" And they say, "Good." And I say, "Well, why settle for good when greatness is available," right? Every morning you wake up, you have the choice to make, it's gonna be a good day or a great day.
You have that choice. Now, after that, it's the steps that you take on a daily basis. When you, when you go to the corner store and you see that guy or girl or kid walking behind you, hold the door open for them, right?
Mm-hmm.
Hold the door open for your teacher. Hold the door open for the classmate, right?
Mm-hmm.
And that, those positive, small, little positive moves or changes, it just, it just helps you
be continuous at doing those great little things, great small little tidbits that just can form the rest of your life.
Mm-hmm.
So I always tell people, even though you may have done something that made you a setback, right? I'm at, I'm at a university that's a Division Three school, and these kids go through everything that-
Uh-huh
... you probably wouldn't go through at a big time Division One university. So I have to help them understand that right, right now, you're at Last Chance University, and we need for you to
figure out what you need to do to get out of here, right?
Mm-hmm.
We wanna see you go Division Two, Division, Division One.
Mm-hmm.
So we have to continue to curve up. The mistakes that we're making right now, let's just curve up from those mistakes.
That's awesome. Every, every kid, uh, should have a Roderick Walker as a coach because that's, that's pretty powerful. And, uh-
Thank you, brother.
Yeah. Well, thank you. It's be- been a pleasure getting to know you more. And, uh, yeah, we've gotta have you back and we'll, we'll absolutely talk about the, the foundation more and what you're... I love that philosophy. I'm like, I'm getting chills right now. That was a good word of hope. Thank you. Thank you.
It's been awesome and, um, I love what you guys are doing and the awareness that you're trying to bring, uh, regarding the sport. And again, you know, Paul, anything I can do to help, you-
Awesome
... you can reach out to me anytime.
Awesome. If you ever, uh, uh, uh, see Tony Brackins, say hey for me. I appreciate it.
I promise I will. I might just give him a call and tell him.
Hey, we-- may- maybe we'll have him on the Head Rush podcast and give a little preaching.
Oh, yeah. Yeah, let's do that. Let's do that.
All right, brother.
He's gonna, he's gonna make, he's gonna make both of us curve up.
I, I need it, so that's awesome. Good, good stuff. Thank you, Roderick.
All right. Thank you very much. I appreciate you guys.
All right. Take care. Bye.
All right. Bye-bye.
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