Five and Dive, Episode 341: Come Sale Away

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Welcome to episode three forty one five
and dive. It is Thursday, January
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fourth. I'm your host, Craig
Goldstein, joined as usual by Patrick Dubuke
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and Jeffrey patron osterro Gentlemen, how
are you doing today? Do you know
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the answer to that? Greg?
Yeah, I mean we are less than
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a week from the annual deadline.
Patrick won't even come on screen significantly less
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than a week. H yeah.
I and plugged my webcams somehow, and
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I don't care. I don't have
anything energy to fix it. I had
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to. It is. We should
know. It is our first podcast of
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twenty twenty four. It is.
It is still technically what is is the
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tenth day of Christmas or whatever?
Technically is still the Christmas season. What
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I'm just saying, my kid has
it is very insistent when in the car
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that she has to listen Frosty the
Snowman multiple times usually, and the only
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version of Frosty the Snowman out on
my phone is by eighties Greenwich Village folk
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trio The Roches, not probably not
familiar to most of the listeners. It's
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modicum of success in the eighties folk. Seeing as my parents are old Hippies.
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I listened to their Christmas album a
lot. It's actually quite interesting.
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They're very New Jersey. But they
have a version of frost the Snowman.
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It's a very weird version of Frosty
the Snowman. But she loves it and
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so I played it multiple times in
the car Seaday. So you're not doing
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grad either. I'm not doing great
either. No, it's nice. I
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you know, we packed up the
tree and everything's gone now. The only
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thing that's left to the Christmas lights, because I'm too lazy to take him
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down, tends to just day out
until July. It just becomes part of
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the decor. Well, like it's
the only lighting we have for the outside
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of our house, so what I
want to be able to see. But
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like, I don't really care for
this time of year, very much like
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that post Christmas where it's just,
you know, there's there's nothing to celebrate
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and there's thing to differentiate the passing
of time. It's it's a bleak It's
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a bleak time, and I wish
I were still thinking. And I'm glad
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the twelve days of Christmas are after
even though it makes no sense right we
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should have that still going it should
be like this sad echo where you're just
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holding on to take it up with
whoever decided on the Christian calendar. My
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man. Well, speaking of the
days of Christmas, I will note that
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the front office executives that we have
that someone control our schedule in our time,
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do not respect the time following the
holiday. To be fair, they're
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not doing much. They right,
they have not done a time, but
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they've done enough that it's been like
we came back from our brief break and
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I there's enough to write a ta
like every day for for a while now,
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and I've well, I skipped one
day, but I've written a little
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bit here. We can start with
our first topic. I guess the most
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active team about teams out there in
this regard shipping up to and out of
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Boston, the Red Sox, after
having a pretty quiet winter up to this
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point made I don't know, is
this a big splash at this point?
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This is a very This is a
very weird player, not like personally but
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just like where he's at in his
career, kind of a weird team with
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Boston and frankly, there's a follow
on trade. It's part of this that
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is the other team is weird in
a very successful way. But we'll start
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with the player. The Red Sox
signed Lucas Giolito two years, thirty nine
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and a half million, an opt
out after the first year. I messaged
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you, Jeffrey, and I said, agent's doing work, and you kind
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of had some pushback a little bit. A little bit, I would not
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have given Lucas Gilido this contract.
It's so it's it's like a very good
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contract for Lucasgilido because one of two
things is going to happen. He is
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going to be good this year and
opt out and get more money, or
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he's gonna be bad this year and
the Red soxsun be on the hook for
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another twenty million. And look,
they need innings. I mean they especially
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need innings after the follow on trade, although I don't know how much that
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affected there, Like who is going
yeah, yeah, I think like ten
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or how it's like their most durable
starter at the moment. For the Gilito
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signing, you got it. At
some point you gotta just somebody's got to
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take the ball every fifth day,
and Lucas Gilito will do that. He
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has been durable, if not good, And again I don't know my overarching
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Well, they kept moving him to
the bulk and Nick Pozzetta, Yeah sure,
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Nick Covetta and like Lucas Gilito is
like the Spider Man pointing meme at
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this point. So that's not great. No, It's like, I don't
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would you would you say it's agents
doing work if Nick Pavetta got yes my
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uh, but maybe he would have
if the Red Sox hadn't for some reason
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manipulated his service time after they traded
for him. Uh. Yeah, I
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don't know what the Red Sox I
think their twenty twenty fourteen is supposed to
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be based on these moves, other
than well under the luxury tax, like
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what is the what is the what's
it? His team, Henry's team is
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interested in killing and bappe. Yes, I made that joke in the documentary,
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like that's what they're because there was
a report coming off this from Chris
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Catillo after the sale trade that they're
continuing to look. They told a free
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agent, I think a prominent free
I don't know a prominent agent. They
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told a free agent that they needed
more money. So it's feeling very Seattle
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in Boston past. Yeah, They've
got an answer for every position. I
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feel like I'm not sure if I
like the answer. It's not a bad
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lineup. Yeah, Like it's good
that every time anyone wants to make a
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statement about the Red Sox, it
ends in like the question, it's not
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a bad I mean like, if
you get second half Tristan Cassas for a
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full season, m if you get
whatever version of Jared Durana is, yeah,
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the occasionally present good version of dur
If Trevor story is healthy and something
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approximating Trevor story, if all these
turn out really well, yeah, And
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again they're also in the Al East. All the Al East is kind of
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a mess, as we talked about
on the last show. I just don't
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it's very it's not confusing. I
can see what they're doing. I just
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don't know if they know what they're
doing. That was the whole thing last
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year, wasn't it. Sorry,
No, it's fine. I was just
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gonna say I I went back and
I wanted to check where we had Alito
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in our top fifty for agents,
and we have him at twenty seven,
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which honestly surprised me. It was
that high, which they're still like some
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like he's more famous than good at
this point in baseball terms, so I
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don't know what the fix is.
Here's the part that interested me when I
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wrote this up. I'm like looking
at Jiliito, and you're right. Obviously
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he takes the ball. He's spent
thirty plus starts in each of the last
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three seasons. He's not that old. He's only twenty nine going into twenty
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twenty four. His ERA last year
was actually better than twenty twenty two.
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It just feels like he had He
was good in the first hat. He
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wasn't good in the first half,
but it was good basically well, I
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mean, he was like good enough. This would be a fine deal if
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they get the White Sox version of
Gilido, which was a three eight e
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er, Sure it was. It
was a three adra one hundred and thirty
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one strikeouts in one hundred and twenty
one innings, you know, three walks
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per nine, which is is elevated, but a very disruptive second half of
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his season between them multiple he went
to Anaheim and so in his sixty three
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and a third innings in Anaheim and
Cleveland, he gave up more home runs
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than he did in the sixty In
the one hundred and twenty one innings.
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You know that he did it with
the White Sox. There's a reason they
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got edgar Quero back. I mean
the reason is the Angels aren't the best
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run organization in the world. But
okay, fine, but I'm just saying,
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Surealdo Lopez returned something because he wasn't
actually bad to that point. He
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had one of the all time like
falling apart two months you know, before
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free agency like this. This,
I guess I just didn't in my head.
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It was like, I know,
he started out okay, and then
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it was just like an awful season
overall the rest that if he had pitched
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the rest of that season at the
three point point eight R, this would
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make total sense. Yeah, but
he gets about this right, Maybe maybe
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a third, maybe it's too close
one or something. But and that's what
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I said, I to me,
it's pricing in the upside. Yeah,
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but if you're if you get the
upside, it's so you've got to replace
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him again next year. I don't
know what they're doing. Four. So
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here's where you're right. So so
let's I I premised my my annow my
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transaction analysis, so we should not
they have no pitch in coming and it's
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like that's why RESL is there.
Yeah, well there's always there's always more
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reasons, but whatever. Yeah,
but I promise my transaction analysis on this
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idea that you kind of have to
pair Giolido and the sale trade. So
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yes, let's talk about the sale
trade real quick, and then we'll kind
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of look at everything holistically. Sale
It's traded to Atlanta, uh sale plus
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seventeen million dollars for von That's it. That's the whole trade. The Red
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Sox have been looking for a second
baseman. I don't know for that long
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a story was the second baseman when
Bogarts was there, But like they went
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through a lot of guys at second
base last year. There were a lot,
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there was a lot of U Chang
in the monitors, a lot of
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Jonathan aras or I don't say sorry
apologies, but like Greg Breslow basically came
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out and said, Ron Grissom is
going to be our second basement. That's
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a choice you can make. It, that's a choice you can make.
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But they're making a choice. At
least I'm fairly confident how a better twenty
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four season than you Chang would have, right, So so that's fine.
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They get six years of Grissom.
Yeah, I got a years of control.
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Well, I mean it's it's relevant
here, I think in isolation,
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before we look at at the whole
thing. In isolation, this is fine.
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As you said with Gilido, like
the Red Sox need innings. We
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don't know if Sale is going to
provide the innings. And frankly, with
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the innings that he provides, sometimes
he looks like old Chris Sale, and
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sometimes he looks like old Chris Sale
right like it just you don't really know
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what you're getting from him on a
start to start or really an inning to
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inning basis. I remember watching some
of his starts. He the first two
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innings, he looks, you said, oh, we got good Chris Sale
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tonight. Third inning rolls around and
it's like, no, you don't.
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So like I don't have a huge
look. I don't love Grissom, but
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I can at least understand this as
a as a move in isolation, they
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want to move, you know,
Okay, so they're paying twenty some They're
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they're sending the money with him.
He was going to get twenty seven million
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this year, though ten million of
it is deferred, so they're basically paying
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his whole contract. I think it
was left five hundred thousands more complicated now
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that with the Braves extension, right, Well, we'll get to we'll get
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to that. Braves love doing complicated
money stuff, at least this off season.
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But for the Red Sox part of
it, they were paying most of
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what he was going to get this
year. But they got Grissom for six
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years and and again, like we
can, we can nitpick Grissom. He
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might not even have the arm to
play a good second base, among other
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things, but like he'll probably hit
a little little Yeah, second division regular.
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Sure, that's about what I would
say. Yeah, he's I think
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he's a fairly one year of this
version of sale for free. Are you
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getting a first division regular? I'm
thinking no. No. I feel like
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they should have probably again, they
very much targeted near term help with Grisham.
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I feel like they could have tried
to pull someone with a little more
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upside, Like clearly Atlanta did not
have a role for Grisham had kind of
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I don't know if they say given
up on him. They were playing corner
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outfield and winter ball and things like
that. Probably saw him as a bench
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piece. If that so for you
know, sale at one ten. That's
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uh, probably was an easy decision
for them. Yeah, I mean the
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Braives. If you look at it
from the Braves side, it's that they
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traded a player they didn't need for
a player they didn't it was going to
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run out of options before they had
a spot for it. Functionally, I'm
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just I'm just glad the Braves actually
traded for a player they're going to keep.
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Like what a novel concept that is. Actually, I like this move
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for Atlantic quite a bit, Like
they clearly they you know, it's it's
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fascinating to see a team this could
be this active, you know, given
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how little they really needed to do
well outside of sale. It's very on
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the fringe. It's just kind of
fascinating because you know, oftentimes a team
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like this, you know, especially
given their recent success, they would just
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they would just sit right uh,
And they can't. They're not the same
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kind of micromanagers that the Dodgers or
Rays are, but they can't really just
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seem to sit. I don't know. I I think I'm a little higher
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on sale than either of you two
because really essentially this is to me like
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a limited version at the glass now
trade That's what I wrote, I know,
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say you're higher than me, and
then you know, I mean,
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I think, but I actually think
like sales pretty good, like I he
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might think, I think there's a
good chance like obviously it's not guaranteed.
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I think there's a good chance that
the Braves are very happy that they have
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Sale for a postseason rotation spot and
for von Gress, then that's a pretty
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good deal to make. I think
that. I think that. I think
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that thing they spec typically did with
the Braves like it raised their ceiling more
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than their floor they being available,
and if he's available and good in the
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playoffs, that gives them a much
stronger overall rotation. That's I I fully
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agree Patrick, like I think it's
a good I think it's a good deal
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for Atlanta, and it's a smart
play to make. You know, again,
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I think what he does for them
in the regular season doesn't matter.
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And which is the same logic as
as the glass Now deal. I think
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he's not only more likely to be
unavailable in postseason, but also more likely
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to come out, Like again,
he come out and you just do not
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know right right or even again,
it's the two innings and the thirty.
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The problem is kind of the other
option is Bryce Elder. Yeah, and
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then I kind of know. I'm
not saying it's not an improvement, right,
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I'm just saying it's it's like,
you know, not only might he
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not be available, but like with
last now you're like, okay, if
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he's available, there's a very strong
likelihood of being young. I think with
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Chris Sale, it's like a coin
flip, sure, and that's why it's
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that's why he is getting two years
and thirty eight million instead of four and
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one ten or whatever. And also, like compared, we're sitting here comparing,
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you know, this contract to the
cheerleader contract. What a difference in
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team option versus the player option makes
right? Yeah, because there is in
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that it's both two thirty eight thirty
nine, but that team option for sale
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looks like something you might actually and
also it's it's functionally also like two twenty
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one for the brace. Okay,
well I don't I don't want to before
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we get into the sale extension and
and what that does I want to What
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I want to compare is what the
Red Sox actually traded, right, because
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this deal wasn't part this extension wasn't
part of that trade or anything like that.
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And I think it's important to note
that the red sox and the reason
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I think this was a dumb kind
of two step, right, right,
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I don't in isolation, I can
kind of get these things. But and
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this is what Jared kind of pointed
out and what I honed in on in
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the TA is you had you had
Chris Sale at one year and twenty seven
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million dollars or twenty seven and a
half with an option for twenty twenty five
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at twenty million dollars. So if
Chris Sale built on last year where he
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made twenty starts, Now they weren't
long starts, but he made twenty starts.
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If he built on that, you
have an option for the following season.
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You know, if he was pretty
good, that is reasonable on a
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reasonable picture, you could almost certainly
trade him at that price for something you've
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swapped out. That ability, that
ability to have him in an option or
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walk away from the money. Right, That's the other part if he's not
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good, is you have the ability
to walk away and pocket the twenty million
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dollars for the downside of Lucas Giolito
having you know, building on his bad
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year, so to speak, and
opting into essentially twenty million dollars for the
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following season. I don't I don't
understand these moves together. Is you've given
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up a ton of leverage over twenty
twenty five basically, and you've also given
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up a ton of upside. Now
you might have raised the floor maybe,
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but arguably like bad Lucas Giolito going
out there and making starts is you know,
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we've talked a lot about like,
you know, the Lance lens or
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I don't want to say Jordan Lyles. Jordan Lyles is probably that Kyle Gibson
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or whatever, not half the half
the Cardinal's rotation, I guess, But
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like, what these guys do is
prevent you from running out your like ORG
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fodder. Yeah, but we saw
the bad version of Gielito last year with
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the Angels and the Guardians, and
honestly it's ORG fodder. It's yeah,
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So like, I don't know that
you're raising now, Look, that's that's
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the worst of the worst scenario in
all likelihood that he does raise your floor.
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But I'm just saying, like,
given that we know that that worst
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of the worst scenario exists, and
it was the most recent version of him
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we've seen yeah, how much like
how much better is bad? Right?
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How much better is bad Lucas Gilido
than Chris Murphy? Chris Murphy exactly page
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I was just on, Yeah,
I don't think twenty million dollars worth?
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Yeah, not risk, I don't
know, you're not even what is the
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again? What the good Lucas Gilidoe? And is the three point eighty r
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A he put up for the Yeah, I mean he went four five right
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when he was good in his before
the pandemic basically at this point, yes,
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well, yes it was. That
was twenty nineteen to twenty twenty one.
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And like the other problem too is
you're you're still because of the sale
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trade. Lucas Gilito is there.
I don't know if he's actually going to
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start opening day, but he's listed
as the number one starter on roster resource
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you're still again, you still have
ten? Or how can Cutter Crawford and
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like Cutter Crawford was okay, Cutter
Crawford was better than Lucas Gielito last year,
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but you know, how much are
you really? You know that going
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forward? I do feel like I
have to Oh no, I see this
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is justin just but just his time
in Chicago before he lost one point two
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wins. This is this is reference
for uh in the last two months of
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the season, but just as hard
to do. He was nearly a three
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wins, three win pitcher. Yeah, so that maybe he made it.
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Look it's the volume, right,
I mean, like, but you so
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again if you look at this line
up, Okay, you got Jared Duran,
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Rafael Devers, Tristan Kassas, Trevor
Story, Yoshida, I forgot Tyler
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O'Neill is here. Tyler O'Neill is
here, Tyler O'Neill is here. Yeah,
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you're your main man. Wyler a
Bray, Betty seventh, Von Grisham,
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a Connor Wong ninth. Like that's
that has some upside that lights it's
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it's I know, people might be
like, you know, is it is
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it? Wiler? Is it?
I've been saying will Yer, that's a
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good I don't ever I know people
have been saying, would say, like,
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who's a bray you? You know? I you know, Von Grissom,
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Connor Wong, Like that last third
is they did this show if they
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don't don't know who a Bray you
is, That's that's true, But like,
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you know, but there, there's
some depth there. They were both
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wrong. It's wheel year will Yer. Okay, well that makes sense,
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that makes sense, but but you
know there's some depth there. Like again,
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we might not love von Grissom,
but like I don't, I think
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he's probably going to be a league
average header. Right, Well, that's
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that's your eight hitter, you know, that's actually you're gonna turn through some
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other opposing starting pitchers. So yeah, so so anyway, but I I
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do think to me, like this
just in in as a paired move,
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signing the Alito and dumping Sale because
the money is pretty close year and a
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year. They just they they locked
themselves into potential downside and and and as
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you said, the upside is if
he's good, he's gone. Uh So
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let's talk about sale. Got we
got It wasn't the Atlanta Braves press release.
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It was Jeff Passing doing I thought
was the one I saw. Oh
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okay, so I guess it was
a press release. He did do a
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long tweet like, so sale gets
extended. It's two years and thirty million,
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very similar money. There's a twenty
twenty six team option. So Atlanta
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understands how they want, you know, how they functionally, just like they
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functionally, just like guaranteed is for
him. For him, it's guarantee twenty
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twenty five at a at a slightly
reduced rate. What I will say is
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my gut reaction is I don't know
that I would want to give up three
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million dollars or I don't know that
the three million dollars that Atlanta saved,
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right, going from a twenty million
dollar team option for twenty twenty five to
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you know, the whatever it's seventeen
million or something like that in twenty twenty
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five is worth locking in that money. Plus Oh, I guess I should
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say the three million dollars they saved
and the option for twenty twenty six is
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worth guaranteeing that year. It's like
ten million dollars. So when you function
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the money factor in the money that
the Red Sox are already kicking in.
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Well, they said the new contract
starts. Oh you're saying, but they
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also took the ten As far as
I understand, and I might be wrong,
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they took the ten million dollars.
Heerred and moved it up. Sure,
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that's it doesn't matter too much for
them. They love they love weird
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accounting tricks. The brace who they
just this off season has just been the
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accountants are unning their money, right
right? Oh, I guess he went
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from twenty seven to seventeen, so
that, right, this is actually free
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for them this year because of the
way that the r Maybe I don't know
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exactly, like I don't know how
they're putting it on paper, but yeah,
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yeah, it's it's something like that. But but I'm just saying,
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like, I don't know that it's
worth locking him in for twenty twenty five.
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I'd rather see what he does and
then if it's worth the three million,
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it's three million dollars. What the
fuck should ATLANTIC care? What's the
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like, what's the scenario where for
sale, like short of him like having
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another arm injury that requires surgery.
I can't really see a scenario where he's
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not getting one eighteen from someone next
chair. I mean, I guess,
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say the world where Lucas Giolito had
the year he had and gets it might
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be true, but the guy threw
fifty less than fifty innings across twenty twenty
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one and twenty twenty two, and
you know was it didn't pitch in twenty
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twenty and he threw one hundred innings
last year. Yeah, well, if
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he throws that one hundred innings,
he's worth it, right, right,
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he is essentially Yeah, I mean
they don't even care. They don't even
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care about his regular season. Sure, but he had an eighty idear,
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I mean he was they're going to
for twenty so he's functionally replacing Freed for
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twenty twenty five. I again,
like, you're talking about thirty six year
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old Chris Sale. I know,
you know, you know, I don't.
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I'm just saying, like I got
check back in October and they want
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a hundred. But I guess my
point is like, if that's the case,
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I'd rather just if that's the case, he'd be worth twenty million,
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and it's fine, and you you
have the option to walk away. Sure
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that That to me is like,
that's worth the optionality and the deciding later.
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It's worth being able to punt that
decision. I don't need to to
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me, I don't need to sign
up for the option of twenty twenty six
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Chris Sale, I you know,
to me, it reminds me a lot
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of like the Dodgers signing when they
signed like Blake's uh Blake trynon and Daniel
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Hudson mid season to one and one
extent like, oh, will guarantee next
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year and get an option? Well, I mean like great, but like
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they both got hurt. Yeah,
you know, and that's your downside,
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and that's one of those things.
No stranger there, you can probably still
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do that in the off season,
right, I would assume. So yeah,
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to me, it's about a coin
flip, like I you know,
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may work for them, may not. Yeah, I look, it might
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work. I'm not saying I said
what, but like my preference is I
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would not I'd I'd value the option
and and if it cost me three million,
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fine because because again, what is
Atlanta spent? Not? No,
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I mean like nothing, like they
don't like everything's locked in, So like
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what's three million and them? I'd
rather find out? I don't know.
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All right, we talked a lot
about Boston and Atlanta. I guess those
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two teams really. Uh so we
can go to our second topic, moving
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to and then immediately leaving Las Vegas. The a's yeah, I believe we're
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back here, but here it was
a slow week and also I can kind
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of believe we're back here. They
don't have Yeah, I'll just run down
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what's what's on our right? Where
are we not in Las Vegas? Necessarily?
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Patrick? Uh, So they were
supposed to have new renderings a month
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ago. Yes, we have not
seen them still. Uh. John Fisher
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has not secured the loan or funding
for his part of the stadium. I
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guess I would just say, like, as long as it like normally,
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I would say, as long as
things like aren't coming up, like as
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long as there aren't news reports on
this, it's likely to get done.
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But I kind of feel the opposite
in this one, like why why don't
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they have renderings? So the issue, I guess and Tim Kawakami had a
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bunch of tweets about this is that
it's unclear if the site changes will require
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it to go through the legislature.
Again, Wait, what it's unclear if
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that the site on the strip is
actually going to happen now because it's Las
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Vegas real estate? Why is it
unclear? Because it's I guess there's changes
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happening to the Las Vegas site,
or there's issues with the construction or such
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as why they haven't put new renderings. They don't know exactly where the stadium
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is going to be or what it
can look like Yet I think if if
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this has to go through the legislature
again, right, politicians, do you
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think it do you think it passes? I don't know. I mean,
379
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also here's here's I will just lock
this up. I would just wrap not
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wrap it up, or wrap up
the the story as it is with Kalakami's
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tweet final comment today on this,
I've been told and I believe that Fisher
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can get it done in Las Vegas
if he fully commits to it financially.
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Some people believe he's not committed.
Some are wondering, we'll see. I
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mean, I guess I would say
not having a loan makes me think he's
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right. He has no actually secured
the money yet, Like, I just
386
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don't know. This is kind of
a mess. I mean, this has
387
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been a kind of a mess or
most of the period in which these negotiations
388
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and the gone on, but now
it's just really a mess. And it's
389
00:29:03.359 --> 00:29:07.880
a weird situation because like I'm editing
Mark Normandy's Fungo for the annual right now.
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Right now is in like right after
we finished recording, uh, and
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it's about this and it's about basically
the precedent that baseball is setting with this
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00:29:17.960 --> 00:29:22.480
move where we haven't had one that
wasn't you know, like Montreal obligated for
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you know, almost fifty years,
and you have you have the Manfred and
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Baseball both committed to having to do
this because they've already put so much effort
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into it and have to say a
face. And also the act of doing
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this is going to set precedent which
they may regret. And so you have
397
00:29:45.240 --> 00:29:49.519
the situation like I don't like,
does is Manfred, you know, compelled
398
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to get this done? Is he
does he have to save Fisher for him,
399
00:29:53.799 --> 00:29:56.839
you know, from himself at this
point, or you know, is
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it worse if he does? It's
really hard to tell. It's such a
401
00:30:00.400 --> 00:30:04.039
this is such a disaster. I
really do think there are a lot of
402
00:30:04.079 --> 00:30:08.960
parallels to when the Giants tried to
go to Tampa and they basically didn't.
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The league basically just say like,
you gotta sell the team to someone who's
404
00:30:12.960 --> 00:30:18.759
gonna keep it in San Francisco.
I mean, they should have done that
405
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:23.000
well right along, But like at
what at what point do they come to
406
00:30:23.079 --> 00:30:27.400
their senses? Right? Like That's
that's what I mean. Like it from
407
00:30:27.519 --> 00:30:30.039
and Forred, it really just kind
of feels like how much egg and how
408
00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:33.079
you know, in which kind does
he want to have on his face when
409
00:30:33.079 --> 00:30:37.920
he when they when they give up
on this. Yeah, I don't see
410
00:30:37.920 --> 00:30:48.920
a way the league doesn't embarrass itself
regardless of outcome. Now, yeah,
411
00:30:48.920 --> 00:30:52.480
but the cenateal side of me still
says they're going to get to Vegas because
412
00:30:52.559 --> 00:30:56.559
you know, that's the worst possible
outcome. I yeah, I think I
413
00:30:56.920 --> 00:31:02.960
I think they probably will because I
don't know, just bad stupid things tend
414
00:31:03.039 --> 00:31:06.559
to continue to have. You can
usually bet on the worst possible, you
415
00:31:06.640 --> 00:31:11.160
know, result, So I guess
the uh, they have to have the
416
00:31:11.279 --> 00:31:18.960
revenue share for the stadium deal done
by January fifteenth. Well that's coming up,
417
00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:22.359
it is, Yeah, It's like
that's like that's that's like the the
418
00:31:22.039 --> 00:31:25.960
I don't know the number of days. That's like the twenty second day of
419
00:31:26.039 --> 00:31:29.640
Christmas. Jeff, Well, it's
after the annuals do so it could be
420
00:31:29.720 --> 00:31:36.240
any time, honestly, Uh,
it is coming up, that is uh
421
00:31:36.359 --> 00:31:40.759
yeah, I mean again, like
it's one of those things where it's like
422
00:31:41.079 --> 00:31:45.119
as Patrick you said, like it's
it's it's probably right to bet on like
423
00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:48.200
the worst possible outcome. But at
the same time, like, is it
424
00:31:48.319 --> 00:31:56.640
also not right to bet on John
Fisher fucking this up? He's kind of
425
00:31:56.759 --> 00:32:02.160
fucked it up at every opportunity.
Is not just going to It's like when
426
00:32:02.200 --> 00:32:07.559
you like it's like doing your doing
the homework for your kid, right,
427
00:32:07.599 --> 00:32:10.240
It's like Manfred is going to fill
out the loan application for I feel like
428
00:32:10.279 --> 00:32:14.559
that's exactly what's going to happen.
It's just the leal friend of the money.
429
00:32:14.599 --> 00:32:19.000
Well. I think it's even more
like like the rich person person person
430
00:32:19.119 --> 00:32:22.079
version of this where it's like it's
like, I'm going to introduce you to
431
00:32:22.200 --> 00:32:25.160
this man who who has the ability
to hire people? Can you like,
432
00:32:25.680 --> 00:32:30.880
can you say hello? It's like
Rob Manfred's like, here's here's a man
433
00:32:31.400 --> 00:32:39.279
from uh Wells Fargo. E can
give you a loan John John John normal
434
00:32:39.400 --> 00:32:46.119
production style, you know what I
mean? Like it's yeah, I don't,
435
00:32:46.160 --> 00:32:53.359
I don't know, but yeah,
it's it does seem what I guess.
436
00:32:53.440 --> 00:32:58.279
My official prediction is this, they
will blow any and all deadlines and
437
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:00.839
it won't matter. Yeah, Okay, I found it. I found the
438
00:33:00.920 --> 00:33:05.960
actual Okay, I think I found
that. Probably we you know this is
439
00:33:06.119 --> 00:33:07.559
this is radio. I had to
go down. I have to go down
440
00:33:07.640 --> 00:33:12.400
like a Twitter Twitter rabbit hole.
I should have done this at a time,
441
00:33:12.559 --> 00:33:17.160
right, but you know, sometimes
it's annual. So it sounds like
442
00:33:17.359 --> 00:33:22.880
the rumor it's doing rumor has it? Now? This from a Bruce Jenkins
443
00:33:22.200 --> 00:33:29.519
quote tweet. He's the San Francisco
Chronicle any quotes tweed. So I guess
444
00:33:29.839 --> 00:33:37.400
that there's a leaked rendering for a
proposed stadium site next to I ninety five
445
00:33:37.480 --> 00:33:40.359
and Henderson, near the Raiders training
facility, so off the strip. Now
446
00:33:40.359 --> 00:33:46.000
at this point, is that not
the area that they bought before they agreed
447
00:33:46.039 --> 00:33:51.200
to this tropic? I don't know. It might. I think maybe we
448
00:33:51.279 --> 00:33:53.240
have like three stadium sites now,
I don't know. I assume like so
449
00:33:53.400 --> 00:34:00.160
this that might be tour of Henderson
to Las Vegas. I'm now just like
450
00:34:00.200 --> 00:34:06.160
Galaxy branding conspiracy theory here. This
will require John if they can get the
451
00:34:06.279 --> 00:34:08.360
same funding through the legislator, this
might require John Fisher to spend even less
452
00:34:08.440 --> 00:34:14.639
of his own money on the new
stadium site. So h just to confirm,
453
00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:17.440
you know, the the premise of
the entire team is that you're getting
454
00:34:17.840 --> 00:34:22.719
tourists to come to the est and
they are asking them to drive out of
455
00:34:22.800 --> 00:34:36.559
town. Okay, right, got
it. How is this gonna I'm very
456
00:34:36.639 --> 00:34:40.840
confused. How is this gonna have
him spend less money? This is gonna
457
00:34:40.840 --> 00:34:44.800
be cheaper to build, right,
It's cheaper to build there, and he
458
00:34:44.880 --> 00:34:46.840
has the same guaranteed funding from the
state. He has suspend his secure a
459
00:34:46.920 --> 00:34:52.239
smaller loan. I would assume mm
hmm, and the revenue sharing will be
460
00:34:52.280 --> 00:34:55.119
the same. But the funding for
the state was for him in Las Vegas.
461
00:34:55.320 --> 00:34:58.480
Yes, so they would have to
I assume that that's why they have
462
00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:00.760
to would have to repass the legislature. Boy, I don't know if that's
463
00:35:00.800 --> 00:35:05.280
gonna I don't know if that's the
plan. I don't know A lot of
464
00:35:05.679 --> 00:35:07.440
here. We don't have to,
but yeah, we do know is there's
465
00:35:07.480 --> 00:35:10.880
no new renderings and he hasn't secured
the loan for the money to build on
466
00:35:10.960 --> 00:35:15.960
the Las Vegas. There's maybe new
renderings, Its just not for Last Vega.
467
00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:20.360
Maybe new renderings. I don't know
who at Tim Blomski is on Twitter.
468
00:35:20.559 --> 00:35:22.280
Okay, fair enough, all right, let's let's take a break,
469
00:35:23.400 --> 00:35:49.000
going back with the less of the
rest of the program. We're back with
470
00:35:49.239 --> 00:35:53.119
our third segment on episode three forty
one of five and dive we're going around
471
00:35:53.159 --> 00:36:00.199
the horn. Uh. The Padres
continue to sign uh overseas player relievers.
472
00:36:00.280 --> 00:36:06.920
I guess uh to to fill out
their bullpen. Uh. Yuki Matsui signed
473
00:36:07.000 --> 00:36:12.320
for twenty eight million dollars over five
years. Uh it is a it is
474
00:36:12.360 --> 00:36:15.639
a Padres deal. I'm not getting
into the ins and outs and what have
475
00:36:15.800 --> 00:36:20.960
you of this one. There's a
there's opt outs, and there's based on
476
00:36:21.199 --> 00:36:25.840
his elbow health than which, to
be fair, so the the there's more
477
00:36:25.960 --> 00:36:32.679
reporting on on Yamamoto's contract with the
Dodgers. It's also like has a ability
478
00:36:32.760 --> 00:36:37.679
to push the con the opt out
a year later based on arm health and
479
00:36:37.760 --> 00:36:43.079
Indians thrown and whatever. Uh.
They also signed uh wu suk go or
480
00:36:43.159 --> 00:36:46.119
is it is it go Wu suck? I mean, yeah, you do
481
00:36:46.239 --> 00:36:50.760
that. I messed that up all
the time. I apologize, uh for
482
00:36:50.920 --> 00:36:55.360
two years and four point five million
dollars. You know, look, I
483
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:02.440
I don't know. Yeah, I
mean that's I again, I am not
484
00:37:02.840 --> 00:37:07.559
particularly convinced he's a major lege quality
reliever, but at that price, there's
485
00:37:07.639 --> 00:37:10.880
certainly some upside there. Yeah,
I think that's pretty fair. Uh.
486
00:37:12.400 --> 00:37:15.480
People there were there was some talk
about him being in the late inning mix.
487
00:37:15.559 --> 00:37:17.320
They haven't decided on the closure yet. I think you know, Swas
488
00:37:17.400 --> 00:37:22.639
is pretty clearly the best. Yeah, it's a weird deal, Like it's
489
00:37:22.679 --> 00:37:29.400
a particularly weird deal from the kb
O side. I don't really understand why
490
00:37:29.639 --> 00:37:34.039
the LG Twins posted him at all. I mean, he is, like
491
00:37:34.119 --> 00:37:36.800
you said, he is, like
not a bad flyer for the padres right
492
00:37:37.199 --> 00:37:38.639
for that price, you know whatever. But also for that price, the
493
00:37:38.679 --> 00:37:43.280
Twins got nine hundred thousand dollars.
I guess if you know he's gonna leave
494
00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:45.840
in two years anyway. Yeah,
it doesn't even cover a single foreign player.
495
00:37:46.280 --> 00:37:51.320
It's it's a it's such a small
amount. And the KBO, you
496
00:37:51.400 --> 00:37:54.599
have to realize, like in the
KBO, every reliever is terrible, is
497
00:37:54.639 --> 00:37:59.239
worse than the other relievers, and
like having an actual good reliever in the
498
00:37:59.320 --> 00:38:04.440
KBO is really hard to do.
So giving up your championship team, giving
499
00:38:04.519 --> 00:38:07.039
up their you know, their closer, the guy who led the league and
500
00:38:07.079 --> 00:38:12.320
saves they must really have not had
much faith in their ability to keep him,
501
00:38:12.400 --> 00:38:15.880
because it feels like he was much
more valuable. Are you not buying
502
00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:19.840
the company line of respecting the players
wishes. I mean they I think they
503
00:38:19.920 --> 00:38:22.159
may have respected the players wishes,
I don't know how happily they did it.
504
00:38:22.920 --> 00:38:30.360
Yeah, there should be parentheses gritted
teeth after that feeling. Did we
505
00:38:30.480 --> 00:38:36.159
talk about Suey on the last one? I don't think so. I mean,
506
00:38:36.280 --> 00:38:38.400
I don't know we talked. I
don't know much about him either,
507
00:38:38.599 --> 00:38:43.679
honestly. Sure, I mean he's
a you know, he's a better he's
508
00:38:43.840 --> 00:38:47.239
more of a track. He's been
a better reliever for longer in a better
509
00:38:47.320 --> 00:38:54.159
league. Basically, sure, and
he could throw strikes that do we need
510
00:38:54.239 --> 00:39:00.440
to mention? I think every every
single discussion of Gobu suk is is uh,
511
00:39:00.000 --> 00:39:06.320
yes, he is the brother in
law of Yeah. I intentionally didn't
512
00:39:06.360 --> 00:39:07.920
put that in either of them comments. Well, it has to be.
513
00:39:08.800 --> 00:39:14.320
It's like the one thing I can
retain because it's mentioned in every single It
514
00:39:15.159 --> 00:39:19.519
is interesting. I was just thinking
about it and obviously somebody like their wedding
515
00:39:19.599 --> 00:39:23.840
picture on Twitter or like, like
what there are there are geographical reasons for
516
00:39:23.960 --> 00:39:29.639
this, but like every single major
kb O or NPB name thus far has
517
00:39:29.679 --> 00:39:37.000
signed in the NL West. Yeah, like it's where where where's the Monaga
518
00:39:37.039 --> 00:39:42.920
gonna end up? Yeah, question
Rockies, right, Rockies. Uh.
519
00:39:44.039 --> 00:39:47.119
In other news, the Red signed
Frankie Montas to a one year deal at
520
00:39:47.159 --> 00:39:53.360
sixteen million dollars. This craig Is
agent's doing work a work. How how
521
00:39:53.440 --> 00:39:59.880
many good seasons? And I'm being
generous on plural. Here has Frankie my
522
00:40:00.599 --> 00:40:04.559
like half of one and then he
got and they got like suspended, right,
523
00:40:05.119 --> 00:40:07.880
So like what I mean, Look, there's like it's arm is arm
524
00:40:07.960 --> 00:40:15.119
talent, right, there's I guess, but they also need to not be
525
00:40:15.239 --> 00:40:20.599
committing a lot of innings to Blake
Blake Lively Jesus non Lively, which might
526
00:40:20.639 --> 00:40:27.199
be the case. You're right,
so I guess it'll be uh, Brandon
527
00:40:27.239 --> 00:40:35.519
Williamson, Brandon Williamson showing another go
well, Montes get hurt or potentially be
528
00:40:35.639 --> 00:40:37.639
bad. Absolutely, but then they're
kind of back where they were when they
529
00:40:37.719 --> 00:40:43.480
started. And like I just look, they can't with their park. They
530
00:40:43.559 --> 00:40:47.639
can't go like this is this is
the this is the Reds tax, the
531
00:40:49.159 --> 00:40:52.159
Great American ballpark tax. Right for
exactly, somebody that's trying to take a
532
00:40:52.199 --> 00:40:54.559
one year pillow contract or reh have
their value, They're gonna want more guaranteed
533
00:40:54.599 --> 00:40:59.719
money to pitch in that park exactly
exactly, and and I think that's that's
534
00:40:59.800 --> 00:41:01.079
part of the value. It's just
wild to me that he got three million
535
00:41:01.119 --> 00:41:06.639
more than least ever Rena Well.
I think I messaged Patrick and I said,
536
00:41:06.639 --> 00:41:08.840
this Luis Severino contract is looking better
and better. I mean, I
537
00:41:08.880 --> 00:41:14.719
mean, I'd still probably rather have
Montess than Gilio. They're honestly well,
538
00:41:15.719 --> 00:41:20.679
gave us forty one homers and put
him in Great American Ballpark. Now Fenway
539
00:41:20.719 --> 00:41:23.960
isn't a great fit for him either
necessarily, but like, why would you
540
00:41:24.039 --> 00:41:28.960
ever go to Great American Ballpark if
you're like even if you know, if
541
00:41:29.000 --> 00:41:32.800
you're in the in the mold of
Lucas Geliedo, right, Like, it's
542
00:41:32.920 --> 00:41:36.880
just such a bad fit. I
mean, Montes can at least miss miss
543
00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:43.119
bats theoretically, right in a way
that would and like he got it.
544
00:41:43.239 --> 00:41:45.920
I think, I don't know,
Yeah, so I don't know. This
545
00:41:45.199 --> 00:41:50.320
This to me was like it's kind
of like everything the Reds are doing,
546
00:41:50.440 --> 00:41:52.159
I'm like, I guess it's fine, Like maybe it's a little more money
547
00:41:52.199 --> 00:41:58.079
than I would have spent. And
also why all of these together, It's
548
00:41:58.159 --> 00:42:01.840
kind of like I feel like all
these one year starting pitcher deals have that
549
00:42:01.960 --> 00:42:06.239
exact same feel to them, right, Like they saw the Flarity deal and
550
00:42:06.239 --> 00:42:07.960
they're like, wow, maybe you
know, at some point we do just
551
00:42:08.039 --> 00:42:15.079
have to justin just yea right,
some of it's the CB changes and on
552
00:42:15.199 --> 00:42:17.679
the new CB A and and stuff
like that, like that qualifying offer keeps
553
00:42:17.719 --> 00:42:21.599
going up to so that becomes the
baseline for a lot of these guys too.
554
00:42:22.599 --> 00:42:24.320
Yeah, you know, it's tough
because we're adjusting with guys like Fran
555
00:42:24.639 --> 00:42:31.239
faking on toss and Jack Flaherty.
But yeah, yeah, so the I
556
00:42:31.360 --> 00:42:37.199
believe Nick Kral said the team is
likely done with major moves just they have
557
00:42:37.320 --> 00:42:40.440
they made any Have they made any
major moves? I mean, m Candle,
558
00:42:44.280 --> 00:42:47.599
they did get I did see U
I think from from cren Rose Frants,
559
00:42:47.920 --> 00:42:52.239
uh, the Reds athletic reporter,
Like you know, he was he
560
00:42:52.360 --> 00:42:55.599
was just tallying up the thing.
But it was it wasn't quite the buzz
561
00:42:55.800 --> 00:43:00.360
that that Kansas City got, but
it was like the Reds have spent hundred
562
00:43:00.360 --> 00:43:02.480
and five million dollars this offseason and
you kind of look around and you're like
563
00:43:04.400 --> 00:43:07.000
for what. Yeah, You're like
you're like, oh, right, they
564
00:43:07.079 --> 00:43:12.960
signed a million you know, Amelia
Pagan. Yeah, for eight million dollars
565
00:43:13.039 --> 00:43:16.280
a year. They signed Nick Martinez
and Nick Martinez I actually think is not
566
00:43:16.360 --> 00:43:20.360
bad probably, but that one's that
makes makes the most sense to me.
567
00:43:20.840 --> 00:43:22.639
It's like Frankie Montas for a year, Like you, how did this all
568
00:43:22.719 --> 00:43:27.280
add up to one hundred five million
dollars? They spent half of another guy
569
00:43:27.320 --> 00:43:30.000
they didn't need. I mean right, this is like me going to the
570
00:43:30.039 --> 00:43:31.840
grocery store. I mean, like, how was all this one hundred and
571
00:43:31.880 --> 00:43:37.360
forty dollars? Right? Yeah?
Read It's like you picked up trimmings and
572
00:43:37.440 --> 00:43:42.519
then it's like, wow, what
is this you Well, I'm at an
573
00:43:42.559 --> 00:43:45.840
olive oil and that's like twenty two
dollars for a bottle, you know.
574
00:43:47.199 --> 00:43:52.000
Uh. The other thing I was
gonna say was was Trent Yeah. I
575
00:43:52.000 --> 00:43:54.719
don't know if you asked him or
he just said crawl was asked, but
576
00:43:54.960 --> 00:43:58.800
they said up. They asked Heim
had a trade Yeah, and he said
577
00:43:58.920 --> 00:44:00.760
like I think he said, like, we're probably done with major moves.
578
00:44:00.760 --> 00:44:04.400
I think that was the response.
Like, and I'm like, you're not,
579
00:44:04.840 --> 00:44:09.079
are you serious? And they started
eight in fielders. Ye, are
580
00:44:09.159 --> 00:44:13.639
you like they have Yeah, they
have eight infielders I get it. I
581
00:44:13.639 --> 00:44:19.079
guess nob Marte triple A. Then
why was he up at the end of
582
00:44:19.159 --> 00:44:22.000
last year? They beat an infielder
at the end of that I mean they
583
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:27.199
didn't really, but they they gotta
trade Jonathan India to to Toronto or something.
584
00:44:27.559 --> 00:44:37.960
Sure, yeah, India is just
not Who's who's the Who's didn't Oh
585
00:44:37.039 --> 00:44:40.679
they signed Isaiah kind of, they
did sign Isaiah. Kind of, We'll
586
00:44:40.760 --> 00:44:45.599
still taking India, I think.
Yeah, yeah, like just keep upgrading,
587
00:44:45.719 --> 00:44:50.440
just you know, right now they're
they're starting third basement per Russer resources
588
00:44:50.519 --> 00:44:58.199
a combination of Calvin Biggio and Santiago
Espinal David Schneiders are starting second base.
589
00:45:00.199 --> 00:45:06.800
Uh so yeah, I think they
can still handle him if uh yeah,
590
00:45:06.800 --> 00:45:10.360
I just I'm like borderline apoplectics the
idea that the Reds just aren't going to
591
00:45:10.400 --> 00:45:14.719
train anyone. I like, I
don't they could start. I cannot steel
592
00:45:14.800 --> 00:45:17.440
Strand back at triple He had a
great start. I mean, look,
593
00:45:17.480 --> 00:45:21.280
there's something to be said for having
the depth and the options to go through,
594
00:45:21.360 --> 00:45:24.280
but like they kind of still do
even if Yeah, and you kind
595
00:45:24.280 --> 00:45:29.760
of also want to find out what
you have with these guys at some point
596
00:45:29.840 --> 00:45:31.360
too. Like right and Carnasia and
Strand, I mean Steer, I think
597
00:45:31.400 --> 00:45:35.840
that's pretty established at this point,
or except we don't know if he can
598
00:45:35.920 --> 00:45:38.119
actually be a left fielder really right, but like in Kanasian, Strand and
599
00:45:38.199 --> 00:45:43.000
Marte and even Elie to an extent, although he's definitely gonna be their starting
600
00:45:43.000 --> 00:45:46.199
shortstop. And can Matt McClain keep
his batting average on baltim play around four
601
00:45:46.280 --> 00:45:50.800
hundred for another year? Can he
actually is he actually a five hundred slug
602
00:45:50.840 --> 00:45:54.679
guy or even like a four to
seventy slug guy, so you know he's
603
00:45:54.719 --> 00:46:00.239
gonna play, I mean playing right. Yeah. I think that it's too
604
00:46:00.280 --> 00:46:01.320
bad. I mean we we I
don't know if we ever talked about the
605
00:46:01.639 --> 00:46:06.320
the Houser trade on here, and
I don't know if we need to,
606
00:46:06.760 --> 00:46:08.719
but it feels like the Brewers,
I need you have to talk about Coleman.
607
00:46:09.280 --> 00:46:13.800
I just feel like the Brewers should
have just traded those guys for Indian
608
00:46:13.840 --> 00:46:17.840
instead, because it feels like such
a good fit and a natural Brewers thing
609
00:46:19.400 --> 00:46:23.559
to buy low and a guy like
this problem. Yeah, yeah, but
610
00:46:23.719 --> 00:46:25.840
yeah, you need you need,
you know, yeah, the reds to
611
00:46:25.960 --> 00:46:30.039
front money, which you know that's
not what they do still like the raised
612
00:46:30.039 --> 00:46:34.119
front money in the trade this year. That's true, it can happen.
613
00:46:35.320 --> 00:46:37.320
It's just a shame that that would
involve the Brewers, like knowing what the
614
00:46:37.360 --> 00:46:40.920
Brewers are doing, which not not
the easiest thing in the world to do,
615
00:46:42.039 --> 00:46:45.880
but it just you know, they've
kept Bryce train starting there, Bryce
616
00:46:46.960 --> 00:46:52.599
Bryce terrang he's there. Yeah,
sorry, I misunderstand. Yeah, yeah,
617
00:46:52.880 --> 00:46:58.360
yeah, yeah, I mean yeah, someone like Howser. I don't
618
00:46:58.360 --> 00:47:00.599
know. I thought the Howser move
was a nice, nice pick up for
619
00:47:01.159 --> 00:47:06.679
the Mets. You know, he's
just in a soak up one hundred twenty
620
00:47:06.719 --> 00:47:12.840
innings somewhere and they're like, fine, number starter right now, So what's
621
00:47:12.880 --> 00:47:17.559
that he's our number three starter right
now? Sure, but you know that's
622
00:47:17.960 --> 00:47:22.360
again like he's I don't know,
maybe maybe it's all been a I guess
623
00:47:22.400 --> 00:47:27.360
there's a chance it's a Central Division
mirage that like he's kind of been like
624
00:47:27.519 --> 00:47:30.079
the third fourth starter for a while
time. Like, I don't know,
625
00:47:30.159 --> 00:47:32.920
he's fine. He's a guy that
Mets wish they had last year more or
626
00:47:34.000 --> 00:47:39.639
less. Yeah. Yeah, uh. Speaking of guys the Mets wish they
627
00:47:39.719 --> 00:47:44.079
had, they signed Harrison Bader to
a one year, ten million dollar deal.
628
00:47:45.000 --> 00:47:47.519
It's fine, it's fine, they
want to move. I very much
629
00:47:47.639 --> 00:47:51.519
like this deal in the sense that
I hate it, but yeah, for
630
00:47:51.599 --> 00:47:53.400
you, I don't have to watch
him, right, that's there's too much
631
00:47:53.400 --> 00:47:57.480
Harrison Bader in my life. We
spent a lot of time in this offseason
632
00:47:57.679 --> 00:48:01.159
trying to decide whether we liked Kermeyer
or Beader better, and they ended up
633
00:48:01.239 --> 00:48:05.800
right next to each other on the
list, and they both got basically the
634
00:48:05.920 --> 00:48:12.440
exact same contract. So I'm glad
that that that verified our feelings about the
635
00:48:12.440 --> 00:48:15.239
subject. Well, you know,
they're the same. Yeah, I mean,
636
00:48:15.280 --> 00:48:19.079
the Mets want to move Nemo to
a corner. They have enough lefties
637
00:48:19.119 --> 00:48:24.199
that can play the outfield to sit
him against tough righty's. It's fine.
638
00:48:24.480 --> 00:48:29.199
It's it's the one year deal.
You know, if Drew Gilbert or Luisa
639
00:48:29.199 --> 00:48:32.159
and Halikunya forced the issue this year, you know you can move them on
640
00:48:32.239 --> 00:48:37.039
a more before it the outfielder role
or short side platoon. It's fine.
641
00:48:37.039 --> 00:48:43.119
It is funny that both Kermeyer and
Bader went to teams that didn't really need
642
00:48:43.400 --> 00:48:45.119
the thing they do last I mean, I mean, I know Neimo is
643
00:48:45.159 --> 00:48:50.320
not you know, it was time
for right and also like they so you're
644
00:48:50.320 --> 00:48:55.079
replacing DJ Stewart's defense with Harrison Baders. That's significant. There's I think there's
645
00:48:55.159 --> 00:49:00.440
been I know there, especially early
on, like the first couple moves moves
646
00:49:00.480 --> 00:49:04.199
of like Joey Wendall and whatever for
for David Sterens, like people were kind
647
00:49:04.199 --> 00:49:07.480
of yeah, there's been a lot
of floor raising there has I just I
648
00:49:08.079 --> 00:49:10.679
it's not exciting. This is something
I should have realized. I am just
649
00:49:10.800 --> 00:49:15.800
going to be watching the Brewers now
and it's it's something I've steadfastly avoided over
650
00:49:15.920 --> 00:49:20.679
the last few years. But I
did save a very Brewers team. Yeah,
651
00:49:20.920 --> 00:49:22.800
I I don't know that it will. I think that's this off season,
652
00:49:23.199 --> 00:49:30.280
and I think the I A expensive
Brewers is going to be I mean,
653
00:49:30.360 --> 00:49:40.000
like it's like dog Brewers with money
is less exciting than Dodgers East,
654
00:49:40.039 --> 00:49:45.039
I guess an aesthetic experience. But
but the Dodgers in a lot of ways
655
00:49:45.039 --> 00:49:51.239
are just the raise with money.
Yeah, but like the Rays are like
656
00:49:52.480 --> 00:49:55.000
because they are the Rais with money, they don't have to do some of
657
00:49:55.119 --> 00:50:00.960
the really aggressive like raise pitching stuff, which is aesthetically unpleasant a unpleasant So
658
00:50:00.079 --> 00:50:05.239
I just think makes a difference.
I Yeah, I'm just saying I think
659
00:50:05.280 --> 00:50:10.199
there's optimism down the line. John
David Stearns does this like signs Austin Adams
660
00:50:10.199 --> 00:50:14.400
and Johann Ramirez for the love of
the game, Like he just wants those
661
00:50:14.559 --> 00:50:19.079
kind of pitchers like can't land their
ship, but occasionally it's good ship,
662
00:50:19.159 --> 00:50:23.800
and like we'll find three decent middle
relievers out of this. But you may
663
00:50:23.880 --> 00:50:28.840
just definitely it's not gonna be a
fun process. They're gonna be losing games
664
00:50:28.880 --> 00:50:31.440
in the sixth inning when they're up
four to two, and yeah, it's
665
00:50:31.519 --> 00:50:35.960
I think the thing that surprised me
the most about the Bait deal is I
666
00:50:36.119 --> 00:50:39.719
just feel like the Phillies should have
been on this, Like the Phillies don't
667
00:50:39.760 --> 00:50:45.320
need another good, better fielder except
that I don't know, I don't have
668
00:50:45.360 --> 00:50:49.960
a lot of faith in Ross,
nor should you, but like also they
669
00:50:50.119 --> 00:50:54.159
just need another Like they just need
a I thought that Zips there's Zips projection
670
00:50:54.239 --> 00:50:58.400
went up today and like it looks
really good and then you just your eyes
671
00:50:58.440 --> 00:51:00.519
go up to the outfield and you're
like, oh, yeah, they just
672
00:51:00.599 --> 00:51:07.480
actually need a good outfielders, like
a two way, three way an outfielder.
673
00:51:08.920 --> 00:51:13.559
Yeah, I mean, well they
were hoping that's what That's what Brandon
674
00:51:13.599 --> 00:51:17.760
Marsh was, right, I mean, yeah, eventually sure, but even
675
00:51:17.840 --> 00:51:22.760
like you know, for all his
playoff for us, like Nick Cassianos for
676
00:51:22.800 --> 00:51:25.719
the other one hundred and sixty two
games, has not been particularly good.
677
00:51:25.920 --> 00:51:32.880
No, he has not been.
Yeah, I mean you look at you
678
00:51:32.960 --> 00:51:38.800
look at the outfield. I can
tell you our our outfield projections, Brandon
679
00:51:38.880 --> 00:51:44.519
Marsh. This is just the RC
plus ninety two, Jake Kiv ninety two,
680
00:51:45.000 --> 00:51:49.800
Yeah, you go, Chris john
Pace seventy two, Johann Rojas seventy
681
00:51:49.880 --> 00:51:54.440
three, Simon Muziati seventy five.
But that's the center for still for the
682
00:51:54.440 --> 00:52:00.840
Phillies lest which I'm not thrilled about. But Nick cast eight cow and then
683
00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:05.719
Kyle Schwarmer's at th But obviously I
can play a little bit of outfield one
684
00:52:06.199 --> 00:52:10.960
six you read you read those off
to me, and I'm not doing like
685
00:52:12.119 --> 00:52:15.719
the the thing we did with like
the Orioles, where that might be low.
686
00:52:16.119 --> 00:52:17.960
Oh right, No, I'm just
saying that, yeah, yeah,
687
00:52:19.480 --> 00:52:22.119
yeah, yeah, Marsh might be
a little better than that, but yeah,
688
00:52:22.519 --> 00:52:24.480
yeah, Marsh, I think Marsh
could be better. I think they
689
00:52:24.800 --> 00:52:30.000
look they can mind some benefit out
of out of platoons in some of this
690
00:52:30.079 --> 00:52:31.719
where it's gonna the actual on field
is going to be a little bit better
691
00:52:31.800 --> 00:52:37.719
because they're not facing kind of their
their achilles heel quite as much. But
692
00:52:37.000 --> 00:52:45.079
like, yeah, I don't I
don't know. Yeah, they I don't
693
00:52:45.079 --> 00:52:52.239
know. Theater could have I don't
know, done something. I guess I
694
00:52:52.320 --> 00:52:59.599
didn't mention West and Wilson is a
ninety. By the way, while we're
695
00:52:59.599 --> 00:53:05.079
on mat former met former Mariner.
Yes, very special. In this podcast,
696
00:53:05.159 --> 00:53:09.599
Chris Flexen signed with the White Sox
faith death. I don't know.
697
00:53:09.760 --> 00:53:14.480
I mean one year, one million. Have we reached the point where moving
698
00:53:14.519 --> 00:53:19.280
from the Rockies to the White Sox
is like one of those natural descending moves.
699
00:53:19.360 --> 00:53:22.519
Now the man got himself a guaranteed
major league contract again, and I
700
00:53:24.119 --> 00:53:30.400
I feel like that. So here's
I'm gonna I'm gonna steal a comment from
701
00:53:30.639 --> 00:53:37.119
I think it was socks Machine,
uh, but like I might have been
702
00:53:37.199 --> 00:53:45.239
Jim Margoulas, Like Chris gets has
turned over like forty percent of this roster.
703
00:53:45.559 --> 00:53:47.800
Yeah, and I don't know that
he's acquired a single good player,
704
00:53:49.639 --> 00:53:52.119
all right. They also I don't. I didn't see who is the best
705
00:53:52.119 --> 00:54:00.320
player. He's acquired Max Saucy.
Yeah, I almost said Poldish on but
706
00:54:00.360 --> 00:54:06.320
it's fine not I mean, like
Nicky Lopez. It's not Saucy. I
707
00:54:06.360 --> 00:54:13.320
didn't like it. It's easily stassy. Chris Flecta is not listed in their
708
00:54:13.360 --> 00:54:19.400
starting rotation lasts. But yeah,
given given who is in it right now,
709
00:54:20.159 --> 00:54:22.199
Patrick, can you name who's in
it? I'm trying to think if
710
00:54:22.239 --> 00:54:25.199
I can the rotation a little.
We did this on a show like a
711
00:54:25.320 --> 00:54:29.599
month ago. I'm pretty sure.
I mean, I know, you know
712
00:54:29.840 --> 00:54:34.599
Cease and and Tussan and oh right, and yeah we did. Son was
713
00:54:34.639 --> 00:54:37.960
the one we didn't remember everyone forgot
was also on the Yeah, that's the
714
00:54:38.000 --> 00:54:42.599
one I would have forgot. Yeah, I forgot again. Yeah, I
715
00:54:42.679 --> 00:54:46.519
mean he won't be for long.
You're right, we have Flexen's Listen is
716
00:54:46.559 --> 00:54:52.599
the long reliever. Sure, sure, I mean you gotta. When you
717
00:54:52.639 --> 00:54:55.000
have a chance to lock down that
position on your one hundred last team,
718
00:54:55.039 --> 00:54:59.599
you gotta do it. Uh.
Speaking of which, we'll go to the
719
00:54:59.639 --> 00:55:04.360
Angels who I actually found out,
you know. Mid segment plug for our
720
00:55:05.280 --> 00:55:10.840
recently launched series from Steven Goldman and
Rob mains the fifty one most dominated teams
721
00:55:12.480 --> 00:55:15.880
of all time. They have inverted
the They did the one on one most
722
00:55:15.960 --> 00:55:20.760
dominant and people were clamoring for more, and so they're doing the fifty one
723
00:55:20.840 --> 00:55:23.800
most dominated teams. In their intro, I found that I did not realize
724
00:55:23.840 --> 00:55:28.400
the Angels have never lost one hundred
games, so the only franchise in Major
725
00:55:28.519 --> 00:55:31.400
League Baseball to never lose one hundred
games. I believe they never lost more
726
00:55:31.440 --> 00:55:35.960
than ninety five. That's off memory. So if that's wrong, that's that's
727
00:55:36.000 --> 00:55:42.280
my fault. But I had no
idea. But regardless, it's a it's
728
00:55:42.320 --> 00:55:45.119
a good series. The most dominant
series is great. Check them both out.
729
00:55:46.679 --> 00:55:51.400
Back to the Angels. They've signed
what Zach Klisak to a major league
730
00:55:51.400 --> 00:55:57.239
deal and Jeffrey agents doing work.
It is agents doing work. Zach Pleisak
731
00:55:57.360 --> 00:56:00.719
got a major leading like I had
fine, give him a give him a
732
00:56:01.239 --> 00:56:06.079
but no, no major league deal. It's like a priority NR. I
733
00:56:06.400 --> 00:56:08.960
right, yeah, yes, What
I love is that Zactly's not going to
734
00:56:09.039 --> 00:56:12.400
meet the deal and then five years, five days later, we still don't
735
00:56:12.400 --> 00:56:15.039
know what it is. You've got
to love those contracts where like nobody bothers.
736
00:56:15.079 --> 00:56:22.880
Nobody, nobody cares. Yeah,
it's just like, yeah, I
737
00:56:22.000 --> 00:56:23.760
do want to mention. By the
way, since we were talking, I
738
00:56:23.840 --> 00:56:30.280
said, deal, uh, details
we're leaking out from U from yamamotos contract.
739
00:56:31.039 --> 00:56:36.400
John Hammond has the crucial stuff perks. Yes, I don't know if
740
00:56:36.400 --> 00:56:39.679
either of you have seen this.
He gets a personal trainer, a physical
741
00:56:39.760 --> 00:56:45.920
therapist, an interpreter, four business
class round trip airline tickets per year eight
742
00:56:46.559 --> 00:56:52.400
hundred dollars max per ticket per round
trip, and then one premium economy round
743
00:56:52.440 --> 00:56:59.880
trip airline ticket to LA for use
by family. Best efforts to make Japanese
744
00:57:00.039 --> 00:57:02.119
it available. But it's I mean, it's Los Angeles. That shouldn't be
745
00:57:02.159 --> 00:57:07.920
that I was gonna say, doesn't
that should be pretty straightforward, I feel
746
00:57:07.960 --> 00:57:15.159
like, but I do like four
business class tickets and one premium economy per
747
00:57:15.239 --> 00:57:21.119
family. How do you feel if
you're the premium economy guy? Like,
748
00:57:21.440 --> 00:57:25.360
come on, I'm on the outs, all right? And so the last
749
00:57:25.400 --> 00:57:32.239
thing do we want to talk about? Wander Franco's arrest. I mean,
750
00:57:32.480 --> 00:57:37.960
it's news. It is news.
It is depressing. Here's what I'm gonna.
751
00:57:37.960 --> 00:57:42.599
I'm gonna. I'm gonna take a
slightly meta tech because I said this
752
00:57:42.719 --> 00:57:49.400
online yesterday. There is there has
been a habit of some segment within the
753
00:57:49.760 --> 00:57:58.599
baseball Twitter community to make a real
effort to talk about like whether the transaction
754
00:57:58.960 --> 00:58:02.000
reporters are are talking about this,
and it's you know, maybe it's not
755
00:58:02.079 --> 00:58:07.519
a great sign that the transaction reporters
are considered the top reporters in baseball,
756
00:58:08.039 --> 00:58:13.639
but they are right, you know, Ken Rosenthal, John Hayman who's hosting
757
00:58:13.960 --> 00:58:19.079
perks from Yamamoto's contract, Jeff Passen, et cetera. Like these guys are
758
00:58:19.119 --> 00:58:24.840
big because they have scoops on transactions. There's been a lot of focus again
759
00:58:24.920 --> 00:58:32.000
in some parts of this community on
whether these guys, like why aren't they
760
00:58:32.440 --> 00:58:37.639
posting about wander Franco, Like why
hasn't Ken Rosenthal posted about wander Franco.
761
00:58:37.800 --> 00:58:42.119
And if you look up his you
know, if you do a search on
762
00:58:42.199 --> 00:58:46.199
Twitter, it's been like since May
of twenty twenty two or something like that
763
00:58:46.679 --> 00:58:51.599
that he has mentioned wander Franco.
It's certainly a long time and maybe that's
764
00:58:51.639 --> 00:58:55.920
a little weird, that's that's fair. I know he's retweeted stuff about it.
765
00:58:57.159 --> 00:59:00.159
I know he has talked about it. On his podcast, but like,
766
00:59:00.679 --> 00:59:02.920
Okay, he hasn't posted about it. That's maybe a little weird.
767
00:59:05.119 --> 00:59:09.159
Ken Rosenthal does not have sources well, Ken Rosenvealt probably does not have sources
768
00:59:09.199 --> 00:59:14.679
in Dominican law enforcement, which is
where this info is coming from. If
769
00:59:14.719 --> 00:59:17.880
you follow the people making these reports, that's generally where it's coming from.
770
00:59:19.639 --> 00:59:23.400
Does Kennon Rosenthal have sources in the
Dominican probably probably on the team side,
771
00:59:24.719 --> 00:59:30.519
but like they're not necessarily in the
know on this, and like maybe he
772
00:59:30.599 --> 00:59:32.199
could be doing more. I don't
know. I don't know the details of
773
00:59:32.280 --> 00:59:38.840
his rolodex or anyone else's. What
I do know is that like ESPN has
774
00:59:38.960 --> 00:59:45.880
been a bit better about covering this
and having information to share. Part of
775
00:59:45.920 --> 00:59:50.599
that is because I think they have
a bigger network of pequal to lean on
776
00:59:50.760 --> 00:59:53.599
in doing this stuff. Alden Gonzalez
knows, has been leading their coverage.
777
00:59:53.639 --> 00:59:57.719
You know, Jeff Passon has been
He's talked about it, but he's mostly
778
00:59:57.800 --> 01:00:02.159
been promoting Alden's work. That's because
they have different strengths, right, they
779
01:00:02.199 --> 01:00:07.599
have different sources, they have different
access to people, and that's where it's
780
01:00:07.639 --> 01:00:10.880
coming from. And and that's why
the people generally leading on breaking news about
781
01:00:10.920 --> 01:00:16.239
this story have been not the traditional
guys because this isn't a this isn't a
782
01:00:16.280 --> 01:00:22.360
traditional news item to cover, right
and if it was in the US,
783
01:00:22.440 --> 01:00:25.159
if it was in the US,
they might because they have that's where their
784
01:00:25.199 --> 01:00:30.079
network is generally located. Is that
is I guess is that unfair as a
785
01:00:30.119 --> 01:00:34.719
way to frame Like, that's that's
why. And like also the other part
786
01:00:34.800 --> 01:00:37.039
is I'd say, like, what
do you want people to say? It's
787
01:00:37.119 --> 01:00:43.119
bad? It looks bad. But
they they represent big brands and as we
788
01:00:43.239 --> 01:00:47.960
saw from Trevor Bauer's re litigiousness,
they are open to getting sued. They
789
01:00:49.039 --> 01:00:52.760
don't want that, their company doesn't
want that. So if they appine on
790
01:00:52.880 --> 01:00:55.880
something, even if they present something
potentially as fact that looks bad, it
791
01:00:57.000 --> 01:01:02.159
can open them up to litigation.
I mean, I think a lot of
792
01:01:02.199 --> 01:01:07.280
it is the decentralization of the news
of sports news now, like there is
793
01:01:07.400 --> 01:01:12.079
no center place, there is no
Cronkite, there's no five o'clock news to
794
01:01:12.199 --> 01:01:15.039
just put this as the main story
of People aren't getting their information that way
795
01:01:15.079 --> 01:01:22.239
anymore. And so yeah, when
you like passon is letting Alden Gonzalez through
796
01:01:22.280 --> 01:01:24.800
the talking, But there is no
place for Alden Gonzalez universally, for everyone
797
01:01:24.840 --> 01:01:28.199
to look at, to do the
talking, to have him be the obvious
798
01:01:28.320 --> 01:01:34.119
front point. So there's you know, because of that, Uh, how
799
01:01:34.159 --> 01:01:38.039
do I say this? Because there
is such a deconstruction of how people are
800
01:01:38.079 --> 01:01:43.480
receiving the news, it does feel
like there's less clarity. But I don't
801
01:01:43.480 --> 01:01:49.880
think that's particularly anybody's fault. It's
just kind of the media landscape. Yeah,
802
01:01:50.119 --> 01:01:52.000
I mean, it's also it's not
it's I mean, like I would
803
01:01:52.000 --> 01:01:58.079
say, Hector Gomez has been leading
this of all the reporters, and he's
804
01:01:58.199 --> 01:02:02.920
previously been he's done transaction reporting and
it's been hit or miss. But he
805
01:02:04.039 --> 01:02:08.519
also has a you know, again, his network is in more more centrally
806
01:02:08.639 --> 01:02:14.119
located at least compared to these other
guys in the Dominican and he's been clearly
807
01:02:14.199 --> 01:02:17.159
getting He's got footage from like law
enforcement stuff. That's where he's getting this
808
01:02:17.280 --> 01:02:21.000
stuff. So he has Look,
it's to me, it's fine to say
809
01:02:21.079 --> 01:02:22.840
like he's got the lead on what
we're doing. The other part of this
810
01:02:23.039 --> 01:02:28.119
is that like transactional reporters and frankly, like a lot of these guys don't
811
01:02:28.159 --> 01:02:31.280
necessarily aren't necessarily passing along the information
in the way that people are understanding it.
812
01:02:31.639 --> 01:02:36.440
You know, people are saying,
like, wander we said Wander Franco's
813
01:02:36.519 --> 01:02:39.199
arrest. He was arrested. He
was arrested for missing you know, for
814
01:02:39.360 --> 01:02:46.199
not showing up for or court date, a court date, not the underlying
815
01:02:46.320 --> 01:02:51.360
investigation that we that all looks really
bad again. Look, we can say
816
01:02:51.440 --> 01:02:54.400
it looks really bad. I don't
know if either I don't really expect I
817
01:02:54.440 --> 01:03:00.280
don't really expect to see Wander Franco
major League baseball again. Personally, Uh,
818
01:03:00.960 --> 01:03:04.679
I don't know, right, And
it's it's have to play out,
819
01:03:05.320 --> 01:03:08.719
and they play out slowly and they
trickle and and you know, it's hard
820
01:03:08.760 --> 01:03:12.840
to say things that are conclusive when
it's not going to be conclusive for a
821
01:03:12.880 --> 01:03:20.360
while, right, and people want
the conclusion and that's the yeah. But
822
01:03:20.679 --> 01:03:22.800
but I guess I don't know.
I'm like, you know, Okay,
823
01:03:22.880 --> 01:03:29.159
So if if John Hammond says things
aren't looking good for Wander Fronco, like,
824
01:03:29.320 --> 01:03:30.360
do we check him off? And
we don't have to, We don't
825
01:03:30.400 --> 01:03:37.199
have to worry about whether he's posting
exactly covered themselves in glory, covering these
826
01:03:37.239 --> 01:03:40.960
issues in the past. Of course
they haven't. It's not really their lane.
827
01:03:42.000 --> 01:03:44.159
Well, so I'm kind of like
I'm glad, like good, don't
828
01:03:44.159 --> 01:03:45.840
talk about it, Like I don't
want to hear from you about it,
829
01:03:45.159 --> 01:03:50.199
you know, like we have a
better system in place for the people who
830
01:03:50.239 --> 01:03:52.920
do talk about it. Yeah,
probably, sure, absolutely, Like,
831
01:03:53.000 --> 01:04:00.679
Look, would I rather you know, get a well reported Katie streng Peace
832
01:04:00.719 --> 01:04:02.199
on this. I would. Again, I don't know if this is something
833
01:04:02.280 --> 01:04:06.840
that that she has the connections and
the ability to pull off. You know,
834
01:04:08.079 --> 01:04:11.239
when these happen in other countries,
it can be really tough, you
835
01:04:11.360 --> 01:04:15.199
know. Yeah, Unfortunately, we've
already invested like ninety percent of sports media
836
01:04:15.239 --> 01:04:18.599
infrastructure into talking hit shows. So
like we're just not prepared to deal with
837
01:04:18.719 --> 01:04:23.960
this. So you're saying we should
get Stephen Stephen A. Smith, Yeah,
838
01:04:24.320 --> 01:04:28.159
talking about this. Look, no, I what I will say is
839
01:04:28.239 --> 01:04:34.199
this again, and I don't want
the the takeaway here is not about the
840
01:04:34.320 --> 01:04:39.639
media. It's just to me,
like I again, he was arrested.
841
01:04:39.760 --> 01:04:45.599
It was for failing to show up
to appear for something. It does again,
842
01:04:45.719 --> 01:04:47.559
it does not look good. I
expect him to get arrested for the
843
01:04:47.679 --> 01:04:53.159
actual underlying investigation that has not happened
yet. It's supposed to be tomorrow,
844
01:04:53.280 --> 01:04:56.280
right is it? Oh? I
think I think that they said they'd have
845
01:04:57.519 --> 01:05:00.320
filaments on Friday. Okay, So
so yeah, and and look, I
846
01:05:00.639 --> 01:05:03.840
guess if you want, if you
want a takeaway again, my sense,
847
01:05:03.960 --> 01:05:08.880
and it's just from reading these reports
that we've seen, like there's no no
848
01:05:09.000 --> 01:05:13.039
inside information here or anything, is
that we don't see wander Franco in the
849
01:05:13.199 --> 01:05:17.599
in the majors. Again, we
don't know, but that's that seems that
850
01:05:17.800 --> 01:05:25.800
seems where it's going beyond that,
I don't know. I I guess I
851
01:05:25.800 --> 01:05:29.519
would say, like I think the
idea of just like not talking, like
852
01:05:29.679 --> 01:05:35.760
making making these people persona non grada
as topics is not the worst approach,
853
01:05:36.280 --> 01:05:41.760
you know, even less than wander
Fronco like Hulu Arias doesn't come up.
854
01:05:42.800 --> 01:05:46.440
He's he's a twenty eight year old
starting pitcher, free agent. Uh,
855
01:05:46.800 --> 01:05:50.159
that doesn't come up. And I
think that's right to be clear, Like
856
01:05:50.280 --> 01:05:58.440
I'm I we should like when when
news of whatever the actual legal situation comes
857
01:05:58.519 --> 01:06:03.079
up, can we talk about itsolutely, But until then we don't. You
858
01:06:03.159 --> 01:06:06.920
know, he's persona nongrada And that's
fine. I mean it's better. You
859
01:06:08.000 --> 01:06:13.239
know, I don't think that these
guys deserve the attention otherwise. I don't
860
01:06:13.280 --> 01:06:15.320
know. Maybe maybe it's fine to
me if people disagree with that. But
861
01:06:15.480 --> 01:06:18.920
like I actually think, like at
least relative to how we covered this before,
862
01:06:19.000 --> 01:06:23.880
which was like these guys would come
back in a week or whatever,
863
01:06:24.400 --> 01:06:29.800
like it's it's a significant, significant
improvement. Maybe that's standing with fan praise.
864
01:06:29.920 --> 01:06:40.519
I don't know any other thoughts.
No, all right, part this
865
01:06:40.639 --> 01:06:45.679
is a this is a tough pivot. Everybody take a We're not gonna take
866
01:06:45.679 --> 01:06:49.400
a break, but just you know, take a take a cleansing breath from
867
01:06:49.440 --> 01:06:54.559
that, because this is this is
a weird, weird pivot. We're moving
868
01:06:54.679 --> 01:06:59.280
to. Thanks. I love it. We talked about this a few times
869
01:06:59.519 --> 01:07:05.320
the Pop Hurt Bowl happened. I'd
say this one better than for pop Tarts
870
01:07:08.199 --> 01:07:15.440
than I ever would have imagined.
They I don't know what I expected.
871
01:07:16.079 --> 01:07:20.280
They put in far more effort to
this than was really necessary for a mid
872
01:07:20.360 --> 01:07:23.679
tier I don't remember who played in
this. I think was Kansas State and
873
01:07:24.039 --> 01:07:28.559
was a mid tier bowl game.
My one quibble would be when I first
874
01:07:28.599 --> 01:07:35.159
saw the the quote unquote edible mascot
emerge from on top of the giant toaster.
875
01:07:35.880 --> 01:07:38.840
I was like, is that actually? Like it does not look edible
876
01:07:38.880 --> 01:07:42.280
to me, But could you have
just taken a bite out of him right
877
01:07:42.320 --> 01:07:45.079
then and there? I feel like
there was an actual costume switch after he
878
01:07:45.119 --> 01:07:46.880
went into the toast. I don't
think I think there was a clip.
879
01:07:46.920 --> 01:07:49.800
I don't think not only was it
a costume switch, is I think it
880
01:07:50.039 --> 01:07:55.119
was prepared. It was set a
prepared pop tart. It's like the prestige,
881
01:07:55.199 --> 01:07:57.880
Yeah, which is smart, Like
it was that's the way to do
882
01:07:57.960 --> 01:08:03.480
it. Yeah, but yeah,
they they really they really went with it
883
01:08:03.760 --> 01:08:09.239
and it gets good. It's one
of those things where I was actually recording
884
01:08:09.440 --> 01:08:13.280
a segment for for all your kids, but like vaguely following it too as
885
01:08:13.320 --> 01:08:15.479
it was happening. It's like one
of those times when like everyone on Twitter
886
01:08:15.600 --> 01:08:20.079
is watching the same thing around sports
Twitter, and just like the the the
887
01:08:20.199 --> 01:08:26.720
jokes are all coming and they're all
pretty good. Yeah. Yeah, No,
888
01:08:26.880 --> 01:08:30.680
it was like there was a brief
moment it was like old old good
889
01:08:30.920 --> 01:08:34.560
Twitter. I think they Yeah,
I think they pulled this off really well.
890
01:08:34.640 --> 01:08:38.319
And I absolutely did not I thought
it was gonna be something weird in
891
01:08:38.680 --> 01:08:43.720
but they leaned into the insanity,
right the person whoever they got, like
892
01:08:43.840 --> 01:08:45.560
I think I told them this feels
like it was like just they pulled someone
893
01:08:45.600 --> 01:08:49.760
from improv everywhere to do inside the
pop Tart costume because they were very like
894
01:08:49.920 --> 01:08:55.359
they they committed to the bit.
Yes, yeah, yeah, there was
895
01:08:55.479 --> 01:08:59.159
like I saw like Roger Sherman,
who speak with the Ringer, like was
896
01:08:59.239 --> 01:09:02.159
on the sideline and like it was
like eat. He was like, is
897
01:09:02.199 --> 01:09:04.439
it weird if I eat a pop
tart in front of you? And they
898
01:09:04.479 --> 01:09:09.079
were like, come here and like
fed him the pop tart, fed him
899
01:09:09.479 --> 01:09:12.279
the pop tart or something. But
yeah, I think you have to go
900
01:09:12.439 --> 01:09:15.800
to the absurdist stuff. I also, like, I do worry that this
901
01:09:15.880 --> 01:09:17.720
is going to start a copycat craze
for some of these ball games. Is
902
01:09:17.720 --> 01:09:21.000
it's not gonna be good? Yeah? Yeah, chase it. Yeah,
903
01:09:21.079 --> 01:09:24.520
everyone's going to chase it, and
it's not very good. Although I do
904
01:09:24.680 --> 01:09:29.079
have to credit the cheese It bowl
held up a sign that said I am
905
01:09:29.159 --> 01:09:34.199
not edible the big cheese It guy. I do also have to shout out
906
01:09:34.319 --> 01:09:40.800
the the art yeah, art up
naked sports, yes or very much on
907
01:09:40.880 --> 01:09:45.079
there for this one. Like the
the the one where it's just the the
908
01:09:45.159 --> 01:09:50.039
one eye is that is just an
incredible Polly. I mean it was like,
909
01:09:50.159 --> 01:09:54.119
wasn't it like bask yad So it's
not like it's an obscure no,
910
01:09:54.359 --> 01:10:00.600
but just the amount of similarity was
really impressive. I don't, Yeah,
911
01:10:00.600 --> 01:10:03.399
Patrick, do you have any any
I just think that you know, yes,
912
01:10:03.479 --> 01:10:06.039
the pop tart was good. I
do think we have a waste of
913
01:10:06.199 --> 01:10:12.680
ways to go to reach Japanese mascot
levels. You know, we have not
914
01:10:12.760 --> 01:10:17.119
reached cheatan levels that the Japanese mascot, the zero year old fairy baby otter
915
01:10:17.520 --> 01:10:20.159
with no gender that wears a turtle
as a hat. Yeah, and that
916
01:10:20.319 --> 01:10:25.279
challenged John on John Oliver to a
fight five years ago. Like we're almost
917
01:10:25.319 --> 01:10:27.439
there, we're getting there, We're
trying to catch up in the race,
918
01:10:27.560 --> 01:10:31.000
but like they still got us.
I mean, I think, well,
919
01:10:31.039 --> 01:10:35.920
the last two most successful mascots we've
seen are this pop this edible pop tart
920
01:10:36.520 --> 01:10:45.000
that apparently looked forward to death,
uh and Gritty Yes, yeah, which
921
01:10:45.119 --> 01:10:51.600
is like I don't I don't want
to apply I guess political leanings, but
922
01:10:51.680 --> 01:10:57.199
it's like an anarch like I don't
like it's like gritty is is I don't
923
01:10:57.279 --> 01:11:02.680
know, chaos or something like.
I guess my point is like it seems
924
01:11:03.279 --> 01:11:12.920
to me to the mascot creators of
the world that we are craving both depressed
925
01:11:13.000 --> 01:11:16.239
and insane mascots. So I think
the key to the mascot, the mascot
926
01:11:16.359 --> 01:11:19.000
needs to be an effigy for us. It needs to be able to do
927
01:11:19.119 --> 01:11:24.840
the things that we are now allowed
to do. Yeah, right, And
928
01:11:25.199 --> 01:11:30.720
you know, there needs to be
a certain amount of violence in the mascot,
929
01:11:30.319 --> 01:11:34.359
either towards itself or towards others.
The pop tart very much like embodies
930
01:11:34.399 --> 01:11:39.920
the Freudian death drive, right right, yeah, yeah, yeah. It
931
01:11:40.039 --> 01:11:43.239
has to represent something in us that
we don't want to admit. Yeah.
932
01:11:43.239 --> 01:11:48.239
And this is like like Blooper not
successful. It's like flesh colored, which
933
01:11:48.279 --> 01:11:53.640
I don't like at all, and
it just spends its day online being snarky,
934
01:11:53.720 --> 01:11:57.079
and it's like we've got that covered. Ye. The other thing is
935
01:11:57.119 --> 01:12:02.119
that mascot needs verbs, right,
You Most mascots do the same thing.
936
01:12:02.560 --> 01:12:06.399
They wear different clothes, but they
performed the same things. You need if
937
01:12:06.439 --> 01:12:11.239
you're going to be an individual mascot, you need to unlock a new verb
938
01:12:12.760 --> 01:12:15.279
the people didn't. You have to. You have to broaden the experience of
939
01:12:15.399 --> 01:12:20.000
mascotry beyond what we've expected. I
will say this is reminding me Patrick.
940
01:12:20.000 --> 01:12:23.520
I don't know if you'll remember this, but I feel like I ended up
941
01:12:23.560 --> 01:12:28.479
on the Wikipedia page for the Mariner
moose. Doesn't that have a little bit
942
01:12:28.479 --> 01:12:32.720
of like a sordid am I making
that up? I don't know, I
943
01:12:32.760 --> 01:12:36.359
don't remember distinct and we can't do
it on air, but I'll have to.
944
01:12:36.520 --> 01:12:39.880
I'll have to. Look. I
feel like there it had a rough
945
01:12:40.079 --> 01:12:45.760
entry or something he did like he
broke he fell off an ATV. That's
946
01:12:45.800 --> 01:12:49.680
what it was. He was roller
skating behind an ATV crashed. Uh.
947
01:12:49.840 --> 01:12:54.359
And the the person inside the moose, which I feel like there needs to
948
01:12:54.399 --> 01:12:58.680
be a word, a better word
for the person inside, a person who
949
01:12:58.800 --> 01:13:04.880
is representing a person fractured his ankle
and dislocated his tibula. So well,
950
01:13:04.920 --> 01:13:10.199
I do having gone back to the
Marin Moose Wikipedia page, I do need
951
01:13:10.279 --> 01:13:15.680
to tell you that this is this
is just a full sentence. The team
952
01:13:15.720 --> 01:13:19.880
had previously held a mascot competition in
nineteen seventy nine in response to the popularity
953
01:13:19.920 --> 01:13:24.000
of the San Diego Chicken. Now
here's the here's the good sentence. The
954
01:13:24.079 --> 01:13:27.880
winner of the competition was Spacey the
Needle, which was a man that wore
955
01:13:27.920 --> 01:13:30.760
a hat resembling the top of the
space needle. Will on stilts, a
956
01:13:30.840 --> 01:13:39.159
man in a diaper took second place. Uh. The maskment tired after only
957
01:13:39.199 --> 01:13:45.800
a few games. Mariner Moose was
originally submitted by a fifth grader at a
958
01:13:46.279 --> 01:13:54.600
nearby elementary school. The runner up
was Seaward the Sea Monster from another elementary.
959
01:13:54.600 --> 01:13:57.039
So they just did an elementary Yes, yeah, I like to think
960
01:13:57.319 --> 01:13:59.760
the kid he got second got five
hundred dollars check, which I think is
961
01:13:59.840 --> 01:14:04.199
more than the person who invented the
Brewers logo. God. Yeah, he
962
01:14:04.359 --> 01:14:09.560
made he made his introduction. His
his introduction was not warmly received, as
963
01:14:09.600 --> 01:14:14.199
Mariners fans repeatedly can't chanted kill the
Moose during the game. That's what it
964
01:14:14.399 --> 01:14:18.239
was. That was my recollection.
That's a rough entry. You can't argue.
965
01:14:18.600 --> 01:14:24.560
But also that's how you yourself in
Lord d then dancing Homeware back to
966
01:14:24.600 --> 01:14:30.359
Springfield. Ye yeah, just Mariners
fans in nineteen ninety chanting kill the Moose.
967
01:14:30.720 --> 01:14:36.640
It was a rough time, not
even a world record attempt. On
968
01:14:36.760 --> 01:14:43.520
May six, for the longest indoor
flight could improve the Moose's reputation. Yeah,
969
01:14:43.840 --> 01:14:46.399
I was a little too old to
be the Moose's target demographic. I
970
01:14:46.479 --> 01:14:51.439
was twelve in nineteen ninety. I
don't remember the Moose at all from my
971
01:14:51.600 --> 01:14:59.039
childhood. You know. Van Scott's
really like, they're so safe. Everybody's
972
01:14:59.039 --> 01:15:03.199
gave me I'll clerk the cup is
there? Uh? It used to be
973
01:15:03.479 --> 01:15:05.680
there. Didn't used to be a
clerk the cub and now there is a
974
01:15:05.720 --> 01:15:11.319
clerk the Cub And nothing has changed
for anyone. No, no impact.
975
01:15:12.680 --> 01:15:15.600
The Philly fanatic is slightly different for
legal reasons now right. No, I
976
01:15:15.680 --> 01:15:18.239
believe they got it back. They
got it back, Okay, I believe
977
01:15:18.319 --> 01:15:24.520
so Yeah, Yeah, I don't. Whatever it is, Philadelphia seems to
978
01:15:24.600 --> 01:15:29.239
understand mascots better than anyone else.
Yeah, or mascots film or they understand
979
01:15:29.239 --> 01:15:34.760
Philadelphia. It's better unless it's a
hitch hiking robot. All right. On
980
01:15:34.880 --> 01:15:38.560
that note, let's go to our
last segment. We have a game.
981
01:15:38.680 --> 01:15:42.000
All right, you'll hate it.
Okay, So what we're going to do
982
01:15:42.079 --> 01:15:45.079
this time, This one's called silver
screen. All you have to do this
983
01:15:45.199 --> 01:15:46.960
is going to be a yes or
no, and you both will guess,
984
01:15:47.079 --> 01:15:49.439
and you know, get a point
if you get it right. You both
985
01:15:49.479 --> 01:15:51.880
get it right, you both get
a point. Oh, I'm going to
986
01:15:51.920 --> 01:15:55.880
give you an actor, and you
just need to tell me if they have
987
01:15:55.960 --> 01:16:00.720
ever portrayed a baseball player in a
movie. So you said, we're both
988
01:16:00.760 --> 01:16:02.279
guessing. Yeah, you're both gonna
guess. I don't care which order,
989
01:16:02.319 --> 01:16:04.720
and we're not gonna We're not gonna
do that organized. But I'm just gonna
990
01:16:04.720 --> 01:16:06.960
give an actor. I will explain
to the actors. Most of these people
991
01:16:08.000 --> 01:16:10.279
should hopefully be people you know.
But you know I'm older than you,
992
01:16:10.319 --> 01:16:13.359
guys, I don't know. Okay, I don't know if your uncultured lads,
993
01:16:13.840 --> 01:16:15.399
But you just need to tell me
if they were in a movie,
994
01:16:15.640 --> 01:16:20.520
if they were played a baseball player
in a movie, and if this player,
995
01:16:20.600 --> 01:16:24.840
if the if the actor is a
baseball player, they need to have
996
01:16:24.920 --> 01:16:30.800
played a player other than themselves.
Some of the movie different baseball players.
997
01:16:30.840 --> 01:16:34.199
Okay, right, right, that's
a Moneyball. Then I'm pretty sure in
998
01:16:34.279 --> 01:16:40.920
Moneyball they had baseball players playing ye, not themselves. Okay, So number
999
01:16:40.960 --> 01:16:47.439
one Dennis Quaid, Yes, yes, yeah, he was in the Rookie
1000
01:16:53.960 --> 01:16:57.640
more than one. I don't think
so, I don't know. I didn't.
1001
01:16:57.680 --> 01:17:00.079
I wasn't super thorough because I'm working
on a book. Paul Rudd.
1002
01:17:02.880 --> 01:17:09.640
No, it's a baseball fan.
Yeah, no, I don't recall he
1003
01:17:10.159 --> 01:17:14.119
was. He was moburg in the
Catcher, was a spy, which seemed
1004
01:17:14.159 --> 01:17:16.319
like was gonna be a good movie. And then like nobody has thought about
1005
01:17:17.199 --> 01:17:28.920
that's right? All right? Uh
number three, Mel Gibson, Yes,
1006
01:17:33.079 --> 01:17:35.560
I don't know why I think he
I think yes, I think yes.
1007
01:17:35.880 --> 01:17:41.880
The answer is no, I almost
went now like I just like, al
1008
01:17:41.960 --> 01:17:47.479
right, Next one, Uh,
allendic if you remember Alan he is thinking,
1009
01:17:49.520 --> 01:17:55.039
Yeah, he's a night's tale come
on. Yeah, uh, I'm
1010
01:17:55.039 --> 01:17:59.000
gonna he doesn't seem like but he
seems like someone who seems like a guy.
1011
01:18:00.159 --> 01:18:01.359
Yeah, yeah, he seems like
a guy that we like very like.
1012
01:18:01.439 --> 01:18:04.319
I'm gonna say, I can see
him in a baseball team. Yeah,
1013
01:18:04.760 --> 01:18:08.760
I can picture that. You were
both correct. He was one of
1014
01:18:08.760 --> 01:18:12.119
the racist dudes in forty two.
Oh that's right, Yes, he was
1015
01:18:12.159 --> 01:18:15.880
the opposing coach that he was.
You're right, Yeah, that was very
1016
01:18:15.039 --> 01:18:21.920
unnerving. All right. Next one, Uh, Seth Green, This feels
1017
01:18:21.960 --> 01:18:27.800
like a trick. This feels like
he was in that Matt LeBlanc Monkey movie.
1018
01:18:27.800 --> 01:18:31.720
So I'm gonna say yes, I'm
gonna say now he was not.
1019
01:18:32.479 --> 01:18:38.640
Oh wow, for Craig, I
feel like he was in a baseball movie.
1020
01:18:38.680 --> 01:18:41.840
I can't remember, you know,
but he wasn't a baseball He wasn't
1021
01:18:41.840 --> 01:18:46.079
a baseball player in that movie.
Yeah, it's too slow to look at
1022
01:18:46.119 --> 01:18:48.920
up. But anyway, Craik tickes
Lee three to two. The next one
1023
01:18:49.800 --> 01:18:57.479
Robert Downeing Jr. Yes, he
said it so fast? Was he?
1024
01:18:58.880 --> 01:19:00.920
I want to say yes, No
he was not. Damn it. For
1025
01:19:01.039 --> 01:19:05.199
some reason, I thought he was
in cop But uh, Matt Damon,
1026
01:19:06.680 --> 01:19:14.680
Matt Damon, No, does it
have to be credited? Patrick, No,
1027
01:19:14.800 --> 01:19:17.520
it's not have to be credited.
Matt Damon does a ton of uncredited
1028
01:19:17.600 --> 01:19:23.520
shit. I'm gonna say, I'm
gonna say yes. Okay, the answer
1029
01:19:23.600 --> 01:19:28.359
is no, Matt Damon. Was
you were? You gleaned Craig. He
1030
01:19:28.520 --> 01:19:33.479
was uncredited in Field Dreams. He
played an extra in the sense that he
1031
01:19:33.680 --> 01:19:38.560
went to the filming of it and
sat in Fenway. He there was a
1032
01:19:38.640 --> 01:19:42.319
Dan Patrick interview. He went he
basically serves an extress so he could just
1033
01:19:42.359 --> 01:19:47.279
go to Penway for a day.
The apparently otherwise, well, he was
1034
01:19:47.319 --> 01:19:49.920
like I think it was Field Dreams. It was like nineteen eighty nine or
1035
01:19:49.960 --> 01:19:54.279
something like. Yeah. Still yeah, no, but he does I mean,
1036
01:19:54.359 --> 01:19:58.119
like even that that he was in
like the Avengers as what like,
1037
01:19:58.560 --> 01:20:03.880
he does stuff like constantly uncredited little
cameo ship, the famous one being euro
1038
01:20:04.039 --> 01:20:15.119
Trip where uh Beverly Hills ninety two
one o was Jason Priestley. Uh yes,
1039
01:20:15.479 --> 01:20:23.640
yeah, no ah, Okay,
I know what I did there.
1040
01:20:23.680 --> 01:20:30.279
Okay, all right, Tom Sizemore, Oh, that's not you saying baseball
1041
01:20:30.319 --> 01:20:34.079
player is a manager. Uh no, he has had to have played.
1042
01:20:36.359 --> 01:20:44.079
It's been an every and I'm gonna
let Jeff go first. I'm gonna say
1043
01:20:44.159 --> 01:20:46.600
now, yeah, I think that's
I think this is a trick question.
1044
01:20:47.520 --> 01:20:50.600
Yeah, I was leaving. No. Also, okay, well he did
1045
01:20:50.760 --> 01:20:57.439
he played the Rose in Hustle.
Okay, sounds like an ESPN TV movie
1046
01:20:57.560 --> 01:21:00.720
or something, yeah something, All
right, Next one, I don't know
1047
01:21:00.760 --> 01:21:05.000
if that's a movie, Patrick,
I counted TV movies. The next one,
1048
01:21:05.079 --> 01:21:13.880
Pete Rose. So you said Pete
Rose had to play. I'm gonna
1049
01:21:13.880 --> 01:21:15.760
say no, I think Pete Rose
is too full of himself to ever play
1050
01:21:15.800 --> 01:21:19.680
someone who's not Pete Rose. I
can say yes, all right, Jeff
1051
01:21:19.720 --> 01:21:23.800
takes the lead four to three,
because he did. He played Ty Cobb
1052
01:21:24.199 --> 01:21:32.479
in bat he played and then no, no, it's Pete Rose played.
1053
01:21:34.479 --> 01:21:39.399
That seems like a thing he would
do. But the other hit king right,
1054
01:21:39.600 --> 01:21:42.760
Yeah, I just tried to.
I didn't want to keep tying,
1055
01:21:42.880 --> 01:21:46.239
so I took a shot though.
All right, next one, Oral Perschiser.
1056
01:21:49.279 --> 01:21:58.560
Yes, I feel like this is
something I should know. I'll say
1057
01:21:58.640 --> 01:22:01.039
yes, you're both in correct.
Or I've never been in the movie.
1058
01:22:03.199 --> 01:22:08.920
Okay, we've done twelve. No, we've done eleven, so we will
1059
01:22:09.000 --> 01:22:12.920
do one more. Okay, Well, now that you've announced that Jeff can
1060
01:22:12.960 --> 01:22:16.560
automatically win like that, just ahead
by one, so I will. I
1061
01:22:16.600 --> 01:22:19.600
will go first, and then you
can he'll go first time. All right,
1062
01:22:19.920 --> 01:22:30.479
So the final one is going to
be Adrian Brody. God. What's
1063
01:22:30.520 --> 01:22:34.039
great is he could have been like
a kid in some whatever like you know
1064
01:22:34.079 --> 01:22:40.560
it's recent. I don't know.
I will tell you. I have no
1065
01:22:40.680 --> 01:22:44.960
idea. I'm just gonna think whatever
the opposite Jeff of what Jeff's uh,
1066
01:22:46.399 --> 01:22:50.800
I'm gonna say yes, then I
will say no. All right, Jeff
1067
01:22:50.840 --> 01:22:55.399
wins, because yes, he was
in Angels in the Outfield. Well,
1068
01:22:55.439 --> 01:22:58.520
you can see stills. You can
see stills of Adrian Brodie wearing a baseball
1069
01:22:58.560 --> 01:23:04.279
uniform running and it is amusing.
It's pretty good. So congratulations to Jeff
1070
01:23:04.439 --> 01:23:08.199
on your movie knowledge. We like
you've been around for so long. I
1071
01:23:08.239 --> 01:23:10.399
felt like it I'd be in one. I thought maybe a little big league.
1072
01:23:10.399 --> 01:23:12.840
But yeah, Jim, we got
We've got enough of these for one
1073
01:23:12.880 --> 01:23:15.840
more, so look forward to it. Great putting that cinema degree to good
1074
01:23:15.920 --> 01:23:20.560
use. All right, well,
thank you both for joining me on this
1075
01:23:20.680 --> 01:23:24.680
episode. Thank you to our listeners
for tuning in to another episode of five
1076
01:23:24.760 --> 01:23:28.159
and Dive brought to you by the
Baseball Perspectives podcast Network. You can get
1077
01:23:28.199 --> 01:23:30.800
in touch with the show at five
and Dive at Baseball Perspectives dot com.
1078
01:23:30.119 --> 01:23:34.279
We are wherever you get your podcast. Search for Baseball Perspective Podcast Network and
1079
01:23:34.359 --> 01:23:38.239
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