The Forensic Interviewer: What Interviewing 1,000 Kids Taught Her

WEBVTT
00:00:00.959 --> 00:00:09.039
To that ad step, where every story matters, every life has meaning, and every conversation brings us one step closer to understanding.
00:00:09.279 --> 00:00:13.919
Translating chaos into clarity, one moment, one story at a time.
00:00:19.120 --> 00:00:20.640
Welcome back to that adds up.
00:00:20.800 --> 00:00:24.320
I'm Christina Ritchie, and today we are sitting down with Tori.
00:00:24.640 --> 00:00:28.320
And Tori is the director of forensic investigations.
00:00:28.719 --> 00:00:29.280
Is that correct?
00:00:29.519 --> 00:00:30.960
Director of Forensic Services.
00:00:31.199 --> 00:00:33.600
Director of Forensic Services.
00:00:34.000 --> 00:00:42.320
And she has actually interviewed over a thousand children who are making outcries about different types of abuse.
00:00:42.640 --> 00:00:55.280
And before we get into what she has learned from that and the things and the takeaways that even parents would probably love to know from you, I want to start with who was little Tori.
00:00:55.840 --> 00:00:56.640
Annoying.
00:00:56.880 --> 00:00:57.200
Really?
00:00:57.359 --> 00:00:57.679
Yes.
00:00:57.759 --> 00:00:58.399
Oh my God.
00:00:58.479 --> 00:01:01.759
I talked more as a kid than I do now, which is saying something.
00:01:01.920 --> 00:01:02.240
Really?
00:01:02.479 --> 00:01:02.719
Yes.
00:01:03.039 --> 00:01:08.719
Like people that know me now, like even kids I introduced myself to, I tell them, like, oh, I can talk to a rock.
00:01:08.879 --> 00:01:10.159
Because I can talk a lot.
00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:12.319
As a kid, I didn't ever shut up.
00:01:12.480 --> 00:01:14.159
Like I was bouncing off the walls.
00:01:14.319 --> 00:01:17.599
I was into everything, questioning everything.
00:01:17.840 --> 00:01:19.599
I was a lot to handle as a kid.
00:01:19.680 --> 00:01:20.159
I was busy.
00:01:20.319 --> 00:01:23.359
When you had something that was like overwhelming, who did you go talk to?
00:01:23.519 --> 00:01:25.439
So I talked a lot to my mom and my dad.
00:01:25.519 --> 00:01:30.319
Um, my grandparents were also like our caregivers for after school, summers, things like that.
00:01:30.480 --> 00:01:33.439
And so they were the people that were around very consistently for us.
00:01:33.680 --> 00:01:34.000
Nice.
00:01:34.159 --> 00:01:37.760
When something was overwhelming for you, who was your safest person to talk to?
00:01:38.000 --> 00:01:40.719
You know, it kind of depends on what the overwhelmingness was.
00:01:40.879 --> 00:01:44.640
A lot of it was my dad, with it's kind of different than like my mom.
00:01:44.799 --> 00:01:45.760
It depends on the situation.
00:01:45.840 --> 00:01:50.159
If it was like friendship style stuff, I'll go to my mom because that's a little bit more of the emotional side of it.
00:01:50.239 --> 00:01:57.200
I'd go to my dad for the other things that are just like frustrating or like sports style things.
00:01:57.359 --> 00:01:59.359
That's like, so I've separated between the two of them.
00:01:59.519 --> 00:02:00.719
So two parent households?
00:02:00.799 --> 00:02:00.959
Yes.
00:02:01.120 --> 00:02:02.239
Are your parents still together now?
00:02:02.400 --> 00:02:04.560
So my dad actually passed away when I was 15.
00:02:04.719 --> 00:02:07.760
And so that's kind of what led me into what I do now.
00:02:07.920 --> 00:02:09.759
So, but he passed away suddenly when I was 15.
00:02:09.919 --> 00:02:11.919
So my parents were together up until that time.
00:02:12.000 --> 00:02:14.639
So now it's been 16 and a half years.
00:02:14.800 --> 00:02:16.400
But my mom and I are still very close.
00:02:16.479 --> 00:02:20.560
I've got a younger brother, older sister, very close with both of them in our own ways.
00:02:20.719 --> 00:02:22.639
We still know each other like siblings.
00:02:22.960 --> 00:02:27.759
But I'll I'll hide some stuff for them if I need to.
00:02:29.199 --> 00:02:44.560
If you were close with both parents and you kind of went to each one for different things, was there ever a time that you felt like some of your, you know, personality traits or the fact that you like to talk too much, was that always just like cultivated and encouraged?
00:02:44.639 --> 00:02:46.159
Were you always allowed to ask questions?
00:02:46.400 --> 00:02:48.960
Or sometimes was that not a thing for you?
00:02:49.199 --> 00:02:50.960
So it really depended on the situation.
00:02:51.199 --> 00:02:52.159
My dad went through a lot.
00:02:52.240 --> 00:03:00.960
And so if he was having like an off day, it's one of those like, let's not talk, let's just not hang out with my siblings and let's not engage in certain conversations.
00:03:01.120 --> 00:03:04.719
But otherwise, like if I had a question, my mom and my dad would explain it.
00:03:04.879 --> 00:03:15.759
And so my mom's also very thorough in the sense of if there's like an issue or a conversation we're discussing, we don't want to stop until there's some kind of resolution to that discussion.
00:03:16.000 --> 00:03:16.960
Wow, that's awesome.
00:03:17.120 --> 00:03:17.280
Okay.
00:03:17.520 --> 00:03:19.840
I had a dad that always encouraged me to ask questions.
00:03:19.919 --> 00:03:24.879
And so I'm never scared to ask anybody questions, which is probably why we're sitting here right now, honestly.
00:03:25.120 --> 00:03:28.800
Because I I've just, my dad always told me that asking questions is how you learn.
00:03:28.879 --> 00:03:29.039
Yeah.
00:03:29.199 --> 00:03:29.360
Right.
00:03:29.520 --> 00:03:31.439
And I was a very talkative kid too, go figure.
00:03:31.599 --> 00:03:31.759
Yeah.
00:03:32.080 --> 00:03:34.400
I was always, always talking.
00:03:34.719 --> 00:03:37.199
Just out of curiosity with that.
00:03:37.680 --> 00:03:44.719
Was there ever an environment where you were scrutinized for asking too many questions or talking too much?
00:03:44.960 --> 00:03:45.520
School.
00:03:45.680 --> 00:03:46.000
Really?
00:03:46.159 --> 00:03:46.639
What happened?
00:03:46.960 --> 00:03:51.039
So I would talk a lot during class because I got bored very, very easily.
00:03:51.199 --> 00:03:55.759
So like I would do my homework and then I would start asking questions to the teacher, and then I'd be like, I don't feel good.
00:03:55.840 --> 00:03:57.360
So I'd go to the nurse's office to take a nap.
00:03:57.599 --> 00:03:57.919
Oh wow.
00:03:58.080 --> 00:04:04.960
So I got, they had to move different classrooms, like me around in the classroom with I couldn't sit next to certain friends, but also like I'm friends with everybody.
00:04:05.039 --> 00:04:06.400
So like I'll talk to anybody.
00:04:06.560 --> 00:04:08.159
So I did have that issue.
00:04:08.400 --> 00:04:09.680
I wouldn't say necessarily an issue.
00:04:09.840 --> 00:04:10.719
That was a challenge.
00:04:10.879 --> 00:04:11.199
Mm-hmm.
00:04:11.360 --> 00:04:12.800
The first few years of elementary school.
00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:17.120
And then by middle school, like the teachers kind of knew like that's just who you are.
00:04:17.199 --> 00:04:18.319
Like you're gonna be a talker.
00:04:18.399 --> 00:04:21.920
But if you give me a task, like that'll stop me from talking to move into it.
00:04:22.160 --> 00:04:28.000
Um yeah, school is probably the place I would be scrutinized the most about over talking.
00:04:28.160 --> 00:04:30.879
Now, was it mainly teachers or was it students too?
00:04:31.519 --> 00:04:35.360
Um, mainly teachers because the students, like, I would be done with my work.
00:04:35.439 --> 00:04:37.279
So like I just want to know what are you doing on the weekends?
00:04:37.360 --> 00:04:38.480
What are you, where'd you get your shoes?
00:04:38.560 --> 00:04:38.959
What about this?
00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:40.800
What are we doing for the basketball game later?
00:04:40.959 --> 00:04:46.160
And the teachers would get onto me because other people weren't done with their work, but they wanted to engage in conversation.
00:04:46.240 --> 00:04:51.360
Like sometimes my friends now just kind of look at me like, shh, just stop.
00:04:51.519 --> 00:04:55.759
My husband has a rule with me that I'm not allowed to talk to him for the first like hour after he wakes up.
00:04:55.839 --> 00:04:56.800
Oh, that's my husband too.
00:04:56.879 --> 00:04:57.519
I'm not allowed to.
00:04:57.600 --> 00:05:01.439
And I'm like, So thankfully, my little daughter, she's just like me.
00:05:01.519 --> 00:05:04.319
We're two peas in a pod on we don't stop talking.
00:05:04.480 --> 00:05:06.480
Yeah, I have some of those too.
00:05:06.879 --> 00:05:07.439
That's amazing.
00:05:07.600 --> 00:05:10.000
My husband's like 20 minutes, but after he wakes up, you don't talk.
00:05:10.480 --> 00:05:13.360
Yeah, no, with him, my husband with law enforcement, he switches nights and days.
00:05:13.519 --> 00:05:15.680
So his schedule is so messed up sometimes.
00:05:15.839 --> 00:05:17.759
He's like, uh, you're too chipper in the morning.
00:05:17.920 --> 00:05:19.120
Like, yeah, because it's 7 a.m.
00:05:19.279 --> 00:05:20.079
I've been up since five.
00:05:20.160 --> 00:05:21.360
Yeah, I've had two hours to wake up.
00:05:21.439 --> 00:05:22.720
I've had a cup of coffee if I need to.
00:05:22.800 --> 00:05:25.120
If the kids didn't sleep, like, come on, buckaroo, let's go.
00:05:25.279 --> 00:05:26.240
Yeah, that's amazing.
00:05:26.399 --> 00:05:27.920
Now, what did your parents do for a living?
00:05:28.079 --> 00:05:30.319
They worked in like healthcare with the billing department.
00:05:30.480 --> 00:05:32.560
Okay, couldn't tell you much more than that.
00:05:32.720 --> 00:05:35.600
It was a lot of numbers, and I would hear a lot of different conversations.
00:05:35.680 --> 00:05:37.519
I'm like, that sounds horrible.
00:05:37.759 --> 00:05:38.480
Sounds really boring.
00:05:38.639 --> 00:05:39.360
It sounds terrible.
00:05:39.439 --> 00:05:40.560
Like it's a lot of math.
00:05:40.639 --> 00:05:41.519
I love math.
00:05:41.759 --> 00:05:45.120
I don't want to sit behind a desk like that and do the same thing over and over.
00:05:45.279 --> 00:05:48.319
And my mom still talks about reconciliations and this and that.
00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:52.480
I'm like, You're like, I like the human reconciliations, not like numbers.
00:05:52.720 --> 00:05:55.519
Yeah, like do you need me to let you go so you can finish that?
00:05:55.600 --> 00:05:58.000
Because you are way too in the weeds with this conversation right now.
00:05:58.160 --> 00:05:58.480
Yeah.
00:05:58.720 --> 00:05:59.360
Oh my gosh.
00:05:59.519 --> 00:06:05.519
Now, did you and either one of your parents have like similarities and things that you were interested in outside of what they were doing before?
00:06:05.920 --> 00:06:06.319
Oh, yeah.
00:06:06.399 --> 00:06:06.639
Yeah.
00:06:06.720 --> 00:06:08.800
Like why, like what was very common in your family?
00:06:09.040 --> 00:06:10.560
So sports was a big common thing.
00:06:10.639 --> 00:06:10.800
Okay.
00:06:10.959 --> 00:06:13.199
So my mom, um, growing up, she played softball.
00:06:13.360 --> 00:06:15.839
My dad did gymnastics, which is different.
00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:18.560
Um, so he encouraged us to do gymnastics.
00:06:18.720 --> 00:06:19.519
We did that as a kid.
00:06:19.680 --> 00:06:20.399
Did you like it?
00:06:20.639 --> 00:06:21.199
Loved it.
00:06:21.360 --> 00:06:21.680
Yeah.
00:06:21.839 --> 00:06:25.199
But he was always very cautious because he broke his neck doing gymnastics.
00:06:25.360 --> 00:06:26.079
Oh my God.
00:06:26.240 --> 00:06:27.279
Yes, when he was in high school.
00:06:27.439 --> 00:06:32.959
So he was always um, he would go to all of our practices to help make sure, like, are you doing your forms correctly?
00:06:33.040 --> 00:06:34.399
So we're not getting hurt.
00:06:34.560 --> 00:06:39.519
Um, but then they were at every single basketball game, volleyball game, football game for my brother.
00:06:39.759 --> 00:06:43.199
My sister did golf for a short stint, like that didn't last long.
00:06:43.439 --> 00:06:51.519
But when we did play softball, soccer, every single event, my dad was a coach um for years in elementary school.
00:06:51.920 --> 00:06:57.920
So a lot of similarities with the sports, um, and then like holiday style stuff with my mom.
00:06:58.079 --> 00:07:01.759
So, like, we're really big into fall decorations and Christmas decorations.
00:07:01.839 --> 00:07:11.120
So, like, that would be our time to like just kind of like you don't have to talk, but like you're just together and you're in the environment, you're in like making the memories together.
00:07:11.360 --> 00:07:11.759
Sure.
00:07:12.000 --> 00:07:14.240
So now, how about your dad?
00:07:14.319 --> 00:07:16.800
Was he equally as into like tradition and holiday nostalgia?
00:07:17.120 --> 00:07:17.199
No.
00:07:17.360 --> 00:07:17.519
No.
00:07:17.759 --> 00:07:23.120
No, it was all he was into it because my mom was into it, but my mom was the one that decorated everything that put it up, took it down.
00:07:23.279 --> 00:07:25.680
Um, the only thing he was really into is like Christmas.
00:07:25.759 --> 00:07:28.399
He has a tree that was uh, she loved Star Trek.
00:07:28.560 --> 00:07:28.800
Interesting.
00:07:28.959 --> 00:07:31.680
I could never get into it, the point it ears weirds me out.
00:07:32.079 --> 00:07:33.120
But he loved it.
00:07:33.199 --> 00:07:34.720
So, like, still has a Star Trek tree.
00:07:34.800 --> 00:07:38.000
So my mom, still to this day, every year she puts up a Star Trek tree for him.
00:07:38.079 --> 00:07:46.000
Oh, and with all the different ornaments and he would get like that was his one of his gifts from us every year was a new ornament to go on the tree when Hallmark continued to make them.
00:07:46.160 --> 00:07:51.680
Sometimes they didn't, you had to adjust, but he was doing it just because like we enjoyed it.
00:07:51.920 --> 00:07:53.759
And so you were 15 when he passed away.
00:07:53.920 --> 00:07:54.160
Yes.
00:07:54.319 --> 00:07:55.439
Was it a sickness?
00:07:55.680 --> 00:07:56.879
No, it was a car accident.
00:07:57.360 --> 00:08:01.120
Oh my gosh, where were you when this happened?
00:08:01.360 --> 00:08:02.160
I was there.
00:08:02.720 --> 00:08:07.040
You weren't so it's kind of a different, like a different situation to explain.
00:08:07.120 --> 00:08:10.000
I was not in the car, but I witnessed everything that occurred.
00:08:10.399 --> 00:08:10.800
Yeah.
00:08:11.120 --> 00:08:12.079
Can we go into that?
00:08:12.319 --> 00:08:20.879
Yeah, so he had a lot of issues and like he struggled a lot as a kid, and that's why I was saying some of his bad days, like he would get angry very easily.
00:08:21.040 --> 00:08:21.199
Okay.
00:08:21.360 --> 00:08:23.839
And like there was a lot of yelling and things like that.
00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:26.160
So it's kind of like, yeah, we're just gonna let it happen today.
00:08:26.240 --> 00:08:36.720
So it was uh a yelling conversation, and it was just a freak accident that happened on a street, and I was actually outside the car that saw it, and so I was the first one to him when all that happened.
00:08:36.960 --> 00:08:38.879
So it was just one of those things.
00:08:38.960 --> 00:08:44.320
Like, I was really glad my brother and my sister weren't they my brother was not there.
00:08:44.480 --> 00:08:47.200
I think my sister showed up, but I was the one that like saw it.
00:08:47.279 --> 00:08:49.759
So I'm really glad for their sake they didn't see all that.
00:08:49.919 --> 00:08:51.279
My mom was there also.
00:08:51.600 --> 00:08:57.919
Um, which obviously you know how that is with your spouse, but just very sudden.
00:08:58.000 --> 00:09:01.120
Um, did not just single a single vehicle accident?
00:09:01.279 --> 00:09:01.919
Yeah.
00:09:02.159 --> 00:09:02.399
Yeah.
00:09:02.559 --> 00:09:05.360
So a single vehicle with him not in a vehicle.
00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:07.360
And so as a kid, I was 15.
00:09:07.519 --> 00:09:13.200
It's like I like thinking about it, you don't think the harsh reality of like, oh my gosh, this is something that could end somebody's life.
00:09:13.279 --> 00:09:14.639
You're like, oh, they're they're okay.
00:09:14.799 --> 00:09:18.799
Like he was like he was kind of not talking, but like making noises.
00:09:18.960 --> 00:09:20.000
He was alert, he was there.
00:09:20.080 --> 00:09:23.200
Like when I was standing there with him, I was talking to him, things like that.
00:09:23.360 --> 00:09:28.720
So I remember going to the hospital with my mom, and my sister ended up leaving, my brother ended up leaving.
00:09:28.799 --> 00:09:30.960
And so I went to the hospital with my mom and my uncle.
00:09:31.120 --> 00:09:35.440
And I'm like the one of I'm just gonna keep talking, just like, hey, everything's gonna be okay.
00:09:35.519 --> 00:09:38.399
We're gonna plan this, we're gonna do this, like, this is what we're gonna do.
00:09:38.480 --> 00:09:39.840
Like, if I need to stay with him, I can't.
00:09:39.919 --> 00:09:40.960
If you need to stay with him, you can.
00:09:41.039 --> 00:09:43.200
Like, my uncle can take me home, not a big deal.
00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:47.360
And then, like, not thinking they took us into like this family room right up front.
00:09:47.519 --> 00:09:50.480
I'm just like, okay, cool, the doctor's bots can talk to us.
00:09:50.639 --> 00:09:54.559
And like, I kind of saw my mom like start to adjust.
00:09:54.639 --> 00:09:58.320
I'm like, maybe this isn't the best thing that's happening.
00:09:58.799 --> 00:10:04.080
So when the doctor comes in, I remember her starting to explain the injuries to my mom, like what he went through, da da da.
00:10:04.240 --> 00:10:08.080
And I just remember my mom stopping, she's like, Is my husband alive?
00:10:08.480 --> 00:10:12.080
And the doctor told her, and I was like, Wait, what?
00:10:13.200 --> 00:10:18.799
So that was a hard thing, but it was then being there when the doctor told my sister, my brother.
00:10:18.960 --> 00:10:19.360
Oh man.
00:10:19.759 --> 00:10:24.159
Um, this is one of the few things I will ever get choked up about.
00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:31.039
But it's a silver lining in my life, as horrible as I was to witness and go through.
00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:34.480
I'm very big on, I'm not gonna let it define anything.
00:10:34.639 --> 00:10:35.919
And so I I've never told anybody this.
00:10:36.000 --> 00:10:38.879
So whenever I went back to go see him, my mom asked, like, hey, do you want me to go with you?
00:10:38.960 --> 00:10:39.919
I was like, nope, not at all.
00:10:40.000 --> 00:10:41.840
Like, I'm gonna go by myself.
00:10:42.240 --> 00:10:48.879
So I go back there, and so like just talking to him, telling him stuff, and I was like, I promise you, I will take care of everybody.
00:10:49.519 --> 00:10:52.480
So and here we are, 16 years later.
00:10:52.960 --> 00:10:55.039
Have you always been the one to take care of everybody?
00:10:55.279 --> 00:10:55.600
Yeah.
00:10:56.399 --> 00:10:57.440
When did that start?
00:10:58.879 --> 00:11:07.120
Um I would say younger, but I like to take care of everybody because I like to be like involved with everybody, if that makes sense.
00:11:07.279 --> 00:11:21.200
Like I'm always cautious of overstepping, but I enjoy feeling needed to be in like to help with my brother, to help with my sister, to help with my mom, my dad, friends, kids, neighbors, all that.
00:11:21.279 --> 00:11:22.720
Like, if you need help, like call me.
00:11:22.879 --> 00:11:25.120
I'll come over, I'll I'll do whatever you need me to do.
00:11:25.279 --> 00:11:27.679
Um, so younger age definitely started.
00:11:27.840 --> 00:11:28.639
Are you the oldest?
00:11:28.799 --> 00:11:29.360
I'm the middle.
00:11:29.519 --> 00:11:30.240
You're the middle child.
00:11:30.399 --> 00:11:30.799
I'm the middle.
00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:33.120
So I always joke that I'm the kid that gets forgotten about.
00:11:34.080 --> 00:11:36.879
But my sister's four years older, and my brother's four years younger.
00:11:37.039 --> 00:11:38.080
So I'm like dead middle.
00:11:38.559 --> 00:11:39.279
You were dead middle.
00:11:39.600 --> 00:11:40.000
Wow.
00:11:40.240 --> 00:11:40.720
Yep.
00:11:40.960 --> 00:11:46.320
How interesting is it that you weren't the oldest child, but you still felt like your older, is it your older sister and younger brother?
00:11:46.799 --> 00:11:49.519
Your older sister was your responsibility in some way.
00:11:49.759 --> 00:11:52.799
So my mom always jokes that she's more introverted than I am.
00:11:52.879 --> 00:11:56.080
So anytime, like growing up, I'd be like four or five years old.
00:11:56.240 --> 00:12:00.720
She would take me up to like the food counter with her because she knows I'll talk to the people for her.
00:12:00.879 --> 00:12:02.879
So she would tell me what she wants and I would order for her.
00:12:03.039 --> 00:12:06.159
Or she'd be like, hey, go ask mom and dad this, and I would just go do it.
00:12:06.240 --> 00:12:10.399
So my mom always jokes, like, yeah, she always sent you to do her, like her her errands.
00:12:10.559 --> 00:12:12.799
I'm like, yeah, because she knew how to talk and I would do it.
00:12:12.879 --> 00:12:14.159
I didn't have an issue with it.
00:12:14.399 --> 00:12:16.080
What kind of student were you?
00:12:16.639 --> 00:12:17.120
Good.
00:12:17.360 --> 00:12:20.240
Like all the way through, even after your dad's passing?
00:12:20.399 --> 00:12:21.039
Yeah.
00:12:22.559 --> 00:12:27.200
I'm sitting here just like listening and thinking, my dad also went through a whole lot.
00:12:27.600 --> 00:12:32.159
Um, when my dad was 15, both of his parents committed suicide two weeks from apart from each other at Christmas time.
00:12:32.639 --> 00:12:33.919
My dad's the one that found both of them.
00:12:34.240 --> 00:12:35.120
Oh my gosh.
00:12:35.440 --> 00:12:42.000
And my dad was also moody, angry, um, like the whole time growing up.
00:12:42.159 --> 00:12:44.559
And I kind of took on the same role as the lightning rod, right?
00:12:44.639 --> 00:12:47.519
So I was the one that like knew how to like shift his mood.
00:12:47.600 --> 00:12:52.799
I knew what to do or say in order to like make it better or calm him down or same thing like you're saying, like just ignore him.
00:12:53.039 --> 00:13:02.879
I think it's one of those things where you're like, you know the difference between the sound of angry footsteps going down the hallway versus in a good mood footsteps going down the hallway.
00:13:03.039 --> 00:13:14.960
And it kind of creates that hypervigilance, you know, to where I don't know about you, but like for me, I can walk into any room and I can scan immediately and I know who's in a good mood, who's in a bad mood, who's safe, who's not.
00:13:15.279 --> 00:13:18.879
Well, and I like also paying attention to who's being sincere, who's being fake.
00:13:19.120 --> 00:13:20.080
What are you hiding?
00:13:20.240 --> 00:13:22.639
Like there's something going, like, don't lie to me, what's going on?
00:13:22.799 --> 00:13:24.399
Yeah, authenticity is so important to me.
00:13:24.639 --> 00:13:28.000
Like the yes, like 100% ever since that, it's like, hey, what's wrong?
00:13:28.080 --> 00:13:28.960
You're having an off day.
00:13:29.360 --> 00:13:30.320
People like, no, no, I'm good.
00:13:30.399 --> 00:13:31.759
I'm like, okay, come on now.
00:13:31.840 --> 00:13:32.399
Don't lie to me.
00:13:32.559 --> 00:13:33.120
Right, right, right.
00:13:33.360 --> 00:13:33.759
Talk to me.
00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:36.480
I can see something physically changing about your appearance.
00:13:36.799 --> 00:13:37.440
What is going on?
00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:42.639
Whether it's your like your shoulders stinking forward or your just your face is not as lit up as it normally is.
00:13:42.799 --> 00:13:45.039
Like sometimes it's just like, I'm just tired.
00:13:45.279 --> 00:13:47.279
Other times it's like, it's just been a hard time.
00:13:47.360 --> 00:13:47.759
Cool.
00:13:47.919 --> 00:13:49.360
Then talk to me when you feel up to it.
00:13:49.440 --> 00:13:50.720
Don't feel like you have to.
00:13:51.039 --> 00:13:52.559
And where do you think that that started?
00:13:52.720 --> 00:13:56.240
Do you think that that has something to do with how your dad was?
00:13:56.799 --> 00:14:00.879
So as I mentioned earlier, my dad's the reason I got into this field.
00:14:01.200 --> 00:14:04.720
Um, like I said, growing up, like you can always kind of be like, That's just dad.
00:14:04.799 --> 00:14:16.720
Like, he's in a mood, he's in a bad mood, my mom will handle it, and then like they'll argue, they won't talk, and then like I'm the one to break the ice because I'm a lot like my dad in that sense of like, hey, like just random talking.
00:14:16.799 --> 00:14:20.879
Like, let's just go for a drive, let's go do things and like just spend time together.
00:14:21.120 --> 00:14:25.519
Um, so after he passed, like I said, very sudden, was not expecting at all.
00:14:25.759 --> 00:14:27.919
Um, so I spoke at his funeral.
00:14:28.000 --> 00:14:29.279
That was like a lot of closure.
00:14:30.080 --> 00:14:35.600
And then as time went on, like my sister was in college at this point.
00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:36.960
My brother was 11.
00:14:37.039 --> 00:14:40.960
And so my mom didn't really have too many people to turn to to talk about certain things.
00:14:41.200 --> 00:14:46.240
And I always I'm under the belief when people pass, like, don't pretend like they didn't exist.
00:14:46.399 --> 00:14:48.960
Yeah, talk about them, keep their memory alive, keep their spirit alive.
00:14:49.120 --> 00:14:50.399
Like, that's what they would want you to do.
00:14:50.559 --> 00:14:52.879
And so, like, I would talk to her about my dad, things like that.
00:14:53.039 --> 00:15:01.279
And she would make little comments here and there about like, well, your dad was acting this way, different medications, or your dad was acting this way because he was dealing with a lot of stuff.
00:15:01.360 --> 00:15:03.360
And finally, one day I was like, what are you talking about?
00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:04.639
Like what he was dealing with.
00:15:04.879 --> 00:15:16.159
So I didn't know he was in therapy, and so I didn't know he was seeing doctors for different thoughts that he was having of like just not feeling good enough, like like just the defeat.
00:15:16.320 --> 00:15:19.679
Um, found out that he had been a victim of sexual abuse as a kid.
00:15:20.399 --> 00:15:27.679
And he never was believed, he never got the help, which turned into everything that he was experiencing.
00:15:27.840 --> 00:15:33.679
So if he got a poor report at work, it was I'm the worst person ever, I can't do anything better.
00:15:33.840 --> 00:15:36.399
And my mom's there like trying to support him.
00:15:36.879 --> 00:15:37.519
No, you are.
00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:38.799
You're really good at what this is.
00:15:38.879 --> 00:15:40.799
You're a great father, you're a great husband.
00:15:40.960 --> 00:15:43.279
And it just he couldn't ever get over that.
00:15:43.679 --> 00:16:00.000
Um, and so when she told me that, that's what kind of made my decision of, well, when I go into college, I'm gonna go into psychology because I want to understand his brain, why his brain was telling him these things because he was taking medication for depression and anxiety, and it it just like it wasn't helping.
00:16:00.240 --> 00:16:10.559
So ended up going into the psychology field behind it, and then realizing like he deserved more, he deserves the help.
00:16:11.039 --> 00:16:12.559
Little Tori deserved that.
00:16:12.639 --> 00:16:14.399
Yeah, my sister deserves deserved that.
00:16:14.480 --> 00:16:17.759
My brother, my mom, our friends, our family, like they deserved it.
00:16:17.840 --> 00:16:18.960
Like at the ripple effect.
00:16:19.120 --> 00:16:19.600
Yes.
00:16:19.840 --> 00:16:20.480
Yeah.
00:16:22.000 --> 00:16:23.679
But look what you do with that.
00:16:23.840 --> 00:16:29.279
Yeah, turn it around to the silver lining of I don't want anybody else to feel like they don't have anybody to turn to.
00:16:29.440 --> 00:16:32.320
Even with my job, I'm not able to say I believe them or I don't believe them.
00:16:32.639 --> 00:16:36.639
But it's just being that safe space to know like you could talk about whatever you want.
00:16:36.799 --> 00:16:38.320
Um, my dad never had that.
00:16:38.559 --> 00:16:52.159
It it was embarrassment, it was shame, it was guilt, it was so many different barriers that he was facing that he never felt like he could share his story and that it's okay that other people are going through this, also.
00:16:52.879 --> 00:16:54.879
You never experienced emotional safety.
00:16:55.120 --> 00:16:55.440
No.
00:16:56.159 --> 00:16:58.480
And then you became the adult your dad needed.
00:16:59.360 --> 00:17:00.320
Sometimes, yeah.
00:17:01.600 --> 00:17:04.559
Because him and my mom, they talked about a lot about like deep conversations.
00:17:04.720 --> 00:17:07.680
They like they had a very healthy relationship when it was healthy.
00:17:08.000 --> 00:17:13.519
And then when he was struggling, she was doing everything she could to fight for him to show him he was worth it.
00:17:13.759 --> 00:17:14.960
But I mean professionally.
00:17:15.119 --> 00:17:15.519
Oh yeah.
00:17:16.079 --> 00:17:19.839
What you do for a living now is exactly what your dad needed.
00:17:20.880 --> 00:17:23.680
You became the adult your dad needed as a kid.
00:17:24.000 --> 00:17:24.160
Yep.
00:17:24.640 --> 00:17:25.440
This full circle.
00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:26.799
That's amazing.
00:17:26.960 --> 00:17:27.200
Yeah.
00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:28.559
Wow.
00:17:30.000 --> 00:17:36.559
That that is like all in the field for me because I'm gonna cry talking about this.
00:17:36.960 --> 00:17:38.640
That's like such a thing for me.
00:17:38.720 --> 00:17:48.720
Is like if I could have gone back to the day that my dad found his parents, he didn't have that, you know.
00:17:48.960 --> 00:17:59.759
And that breaks my heart so much because I'm like, he just needed somebody, he needed somebody to listen, not to like make any kind of a determined determination for him on how he should handle it.
00:17:59.839 --> 00:18:01.920
He just needed that emotional safety.
00:18:02.079 --> 00:18:06.400
And luckily, he had his grandmother who he eventually moved in with.
00:18:06.559 --> 00:18:10.880
Um, like a year and a half-ish later, he moved in with his grandma Julia.
00:18:11.200 --> 00:18:16.000
And she was the very first person who ever could demonstrate emotional safety for my dad.
00:18:16.319 --> 00:18:21.839
One day my dad came home and he was so drunk I couldn't make it up the stairs because he was out doing all the behaviors, right?
00:18:21.920 --> 00:18:25.279
After finding your parents both deceased, self-inflicted.
00:18:25.440 --> 00:18:26.720
You're going to have those behaviors.
00:18:26.880 --> 00:18:29.440
Nobody to talk to, nobody to counsel him through it.
00:18:29.599 --> 00:18:30.480
Great family, though.
00:18:30.559 --> 00:18:32.240
Like my dad really does come from a great family.
00:18:32.319 --> 00:18:35.440
I was just there like two weekends ago about to see that whole side of the family.
00:18:35.519 --> 00:18:37.599
They're just the most precious humans ever.
00:18:38.000 --> 00:18:41.519
But he still didn't have any like professional help, and he was a boy.
00:18:41.599 --> 00:18:42.880
And he's a 15-year-old boy.
00:18:42.960 --> 00:18:44.960
His brother's off in the Navy, he's by himself.
00:18:45.200 --> 00:18:48.160
And both parents are now gone, literally 12 days apart from each other.
00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:51.039
His mom was December 15th, dad was December 27th.
00:18:51.440 --> 00:18:53.440
Very close, right around Christmas.
00:18:53.680 --> 00:19:03.039
So then he ends up moving in with his grandma Julia, comes home that night so drunk he can't make up his stairs, wakes up the next morning, he's got a pillow underneath his head, a blanket on top of him, and his grandma's asleep with him on those stairs.
00:19:04.000 --> 00:19:09.599
Two weekends ago, I got to go to that house and see that staircase in person.
00:19:09.680 --> 00:19:16.799
And that was amazing because that staircase, that moment of emotional safety, changed my dad's entire life.
00:19:17.039 --> 00:19:26.000
I'm fully confident, like my dad would not have become the man who was successful enough to adopt a child, which is me, had he not had that experience.
00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:32.160
And yeah, a lot of those other behaviors and things, all of the trauma that he like my dad's still till this day, my dad will be 80 next month.
00:19:32.240 --> 00:19:34.880
My dad's never been to therapy ever in his life.
00:19:35.200 --> 00:19:46.000
But, you know, that experience, that one experience, and experiencing somebody who is safe for him, you know, when he opened his eyes that morning, he was just like, I can't hurt her anymore.
00:19:46.240 --> 00:19:47.839
I have to change my behavior.
00:19:48.079 --> 00:19:55.920
I'm confident that that's what made him become a successful human being because he wanted to make Grandma Julia proud and he wanted to do right by her and he couldn't hurt her anymore.
00:19:56.079 --> 00:19:56.559
Yep.
00:19:56.799 --> 00:20:02.640
But when he was 19, so just like a year and a half later, he came in and found her deceased in the kitchen.
00:20:02.799 --> 00:20:03.200
Oh my god.
00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:04.640
So he lost his safety.
00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:06.000
It was gone, you know.
00:20:06.240 --> 00:20:08.079
But like I said, he did have good family.
00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:10.400
He had a friend who was amazing.
00:20:10.480 --> 00:20:15.759
And when my dad got a really good job opportunity all the way in California, he's from Minnesota.
00:20:15.839 --> 00:20:18.960
And his friend was like, I know he's not gonna go by himself.
00:20:19.119 --> 00:20:20.079
I'm going with him.
00:20:20.240 --> 00:20:23.200
And his friend packed up his life and moved with my dad to California.
00:20:23.519 --> 00:20:23.680
Wow.
00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:24.640
Isn't that crazy?
00:20:24.880 --> 00:20:26.559
So he was really lucky in that aspect.
00:20:26.640 --> 00:20:33.839
And then what breaks my heart is to think of people who don't have that, who don't have a good family support system or any friends or any of that.
00:20:33.920 --> 00:20:35.200
My dad had some amazing friends.
00:20:35.279 --> 00:20:36.160
They're still amazing friends.
00:20:36.240 --> 00:20:36.400
Yeah.
00:20:36.640 --> 00:20:44.559
I got to go out to to breakfast with two friends that have been my dad's friends since they were they were 15 years old, right around the time my dad's parents passed away.
00:20:44.720 --> 00:20:56.000
And like have breakfast with those men and like talk to them about my dad as a kid, and you know, like says a lot too about like what kind of people they are and what kind of person my dad is, because my dad's kept friends for 65 years.
00:20:56.160 --> 00:20:59.759
That's a long time for friendship, you know, but they're more like family.
00:20:59.839 --> 00:21:05.759
So like you're like my uncle, uncles, maybe this was an amazing experience.
00:21:06.160 --> 00:21:13.359
So, how is it that you became so good at creating emotional safety?
00:21:13.519 --> 00:21:20.079
Was this education or was this from your own personal experiences, combination of both?
00:21:20.400 --> 00:21:23.119
So, are you talking about like professionally like now?
00:21:23.359 --> 00:21:24.400
Yeah, because you do that.
00:21:24.480 --> 00:21:28.640
That's like that's your job is to create that emotional safety, right?
00:21:28.720 --> 00:21:33.440
Like to make it to where kids feel comfortable enough where they can tell you what happened.
00:21:33.680 --> 00:21:38.160
Yeah, so I think it goes to personal experience of like not forcing.
00:21:38.240 --> 00:21:41.759
I didn't know anything about that growing up with my dad until after he was gone.
00:21:41.920 --> 00:21:44.400
And so then it's like, oh, that stuff makes sense now.
00:21:44.559 --> 00:21:49.200
Like, no wonder you were so protective about us going to friends' houses or things about it.
00:21:50.559 --> 00:21:51.680
Yeah, exactly.
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:52.160
Yeah.
00:21:52.319 --> 00:21:59.759
And so then just through all my degrees, and then I worked at MHGD for a while, and so you're hearing people.
00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:05.440
People's story and similar things of they were not nobody met them where they were at.
00:22:05.519 --> 00:22:07.920
It was always forcing them, and this is where you should be.
00:22:08.400 --> 00:22:14.160
And so understanding, like for me, whatever he passed, nobody forced me and told me this is how you should act.
00:22:14.240 --> 00:22:15.279
This is what you should be doing.
00:22:15.359 --> 00:22:16.799
This is how you should be grieving.
00:22:17.200 --> 00:22:22.160
Because I'm very different of like compartmentalized, move on.
00:22:22.400 --> 00:22:24.799
I can't do anything to bring somebody back.
00:22:25.119 --> 00:22:29.039
I can grieve, I can cry certain things, but you gotta move on from it.
00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:30.079
Where do you think that came from?
00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:31.279
Where'd you learn that?
00:22:31.440 --> 00:22:33.119
Uh generally, I don't know.
00:22:33.359 --> 00:22:37.200
Because my mom is like, I always joke with her, and when she watches this, hi mom, sorry.
00:22:37.680 --> 00:22:40.319
Anytime she starts crying, she goes, I know the water works.
00:22:40.559 --> 00:22:41.680
I'm like, it's okay.
00:22:41.839 --> 00:22:42.799
She's very emotional.
00:22:42.960 --> 00:22:45.519
I am not emotional, like at all.
00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:51.839
And my dad was not very emotional in that sense either, of like it was just kind of like ignore things.
00:22:51.920 --> 00:22:54.000
So I'm not sure where I got that from.
00:22:54.240 --> 00:22:56.480
Ignore things, compartmentalize.
00:22:58.559 --> 00:22:59.359
Yeah, yeah.
00:22:59.759 --> 00:23:01.039
Maybe a little bit.
00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:01.839
Yeah.
00:23:02.319 --> 00:23:03.839
Same, you know, same thing.
00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:05.359
Kind of come see, come talk.
00:23:05.759 --> 00:23:06.160
Makes sense.
00:23:06.319 --> 00:23:06.480
Yeah.
00:23:06.720 --> 00:23:12.079
Did dad like dismiss it or just like minimize usually or just minimization?
00:23:12.400 --> 00:23:16.160
It's a lot of minimization of just like, okay, we're not gonna talk about that right now.
00:23:16.240 --> 00:23:17.200
We'll talk about that later.
00:23:17.440 --> 00:23:21.359
Yeah, it sounds like that might be and my mom's like the opposite of like, no, we're like I talked about the resolution.
00:23:21.519 --> 00:23:22.559
No, we're gonna talk about this.
00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:27.359
I need like right here, right now, I need to know how things end, like with this situation.
00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:28.319
Where do we stand?
00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:29.599
I need to know where we stand.
00:23:29.680 --> 00:23:32.880
I need to know what they're at the conclusion of like, hey, I'm going out with my friends.
00:23:32.960 --> 00:23:33.759
She goes, Okay, where are you going?
00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:34.559
What time are you gonna be back?
00:23:34.640 --> 00:23:35.279
Who are you with?
00:23:35.359 --> 00:23:36.960
And I'm like, this, this, this, this, and this.
00:23:37.119 --> 00:23:37.759
She's like, okay.
00:23:37.839 --> 00:23:40.240
Otherwise, I told my dad, it's like, hey, can I go to a friend's house?
00:23:40.400 --> 00:23:41.440
What'd your mom say?
00:23:41.680 --> 00:23:42.559
She said yes.
00:23:42.799 --> 00:23:43.440
All right.
00:23:43.920 --> 00:23:49.759
It's interesting that you brought up the thing about like going to friends' houses because that was actually a question that I've been wanting to ask you.
00:23:49.920 --> 00:23:58.240
As somebody who has interviewed over a thousand children, what are your particular thoughts on sleepovers and things like that?
00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:01.680
So I've heard a lot of stuff in talking to kids.
00:24:01.839 --> 00:24:04.240
And not to say that every situation it's gonna happen.
00:24:04.480 --> 00:24:09.599
I can't control everything that my kids do, but I'm gonna do what I can as a parent to protect them.
00:24:09.839 --> 00:24:13.920
Most of the time when children are sexually abused in particular, it's by somebody you know.
00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:15.599
Rarely is it by somebody you don't know.
00:24:15.759 --> 00:24:32.079
And so I think of situations of I don't want my kid to be put in a situation that there's pe that they feel peer pressured or that something happens, not to say it's by another family member or it's a friend's caregivers or a friend's sibling or a friend.
00:24:32.319 --> 00:24:37.759
So sleepover-wise, my husband and I've decided, like, yeah, our kids aren't gonna go over for sleepovers.
00:24:37.920 --> 00:24:39.279
You stay there till midnight, that's fine.
00:24:39.359 --> 00:24:40.319
Call me, I'll come pick you up.
00:24:40.400 --> 00:24:42.000
And then I'll drop you back off in the morning.
00:24:42.079 --> 00:24:42.799
That's okay.
00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:52.000
But that's just my comfortability as a parent of I want to help as much as I can in situations, but I know I can't control all of them.
00:24:52.160 --> 00:24:56.240
Because stuff doesn't just happen at sleepovers, it happens everywhere.
00:24:56.880 --> 00:25:00.480
What's the most common scenario that you hear in these interviews?
00:25:00.640 --> 00:25:03.200
As far as like, is there is there a lot of commonality?
00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:07.039
Is there a lot of things where you're like, yep, hear this one all the time?
00:25:07.359 --> 00:25:09.920
I wouldn't say that because every situation is different.
00:25:10.079 --> 00:25:12.640
Every kid I talked to is very different.
00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:22.559
Some of the situations might be similar in the sense of like, oh, they were at their house or they were on a vacation or they were on a camping trip or something like that.
00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:41.119
But it's different reasons that somehow they ended up being alone with somebody else, or that they had no idea and the trust and the so the commonality between all of it is that I hear from people is children are more likely to be sexually abused by somebody they know and somebody they trust.
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:58.880
So that's where you get a lot of red flags put up because as a kid, you're taught stranger danger, like, oh, don't like, don't go talk to that person, which still like don't go up to random people all the time, but it's people that groom children and people that groom adults to be able to have access to those kids.
00:25:59.119 --> 00:26:01.599
Can you define grooming for those that are watching that don't know?
00:26:01.839 --> 00:26:26.160
Yeah, so grooming is basically like you are identifying a potential victim, not saying it's going to be a victim, um, but it could be a child that has some adverse things going on in their life, whether it's a single parent or parent, both parents at work and they're very busy, or it could be financial, it could be just access to a kid with coach, pastor, step parent, sibling, whatever the relationship might be, when you're identifying a child.
00:26:26.319 --> 00:26:32.799
So then it's you kind of start forming a relationship with a kid, whether it's uh just a friendly relationship of, hey, how's your day going?
00:26:32.880 --> 00:26:33.359
How are things?
00:26:33.519 --> 00:26:34.319
How is this?
00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:37.599
Uh yeah, I'll take you to soccer practice, I'll pick you up from that.
00:26:37.680 --> 00:26:41.279
Let's go some ice cream after soccer practice, after baseball, whatever it might be.
00:26:41.440 --> 00:26:44.720
And so they're getting that kiddo kind of just used to being around them.
00:26:44.880 --> 00:26:46.319
Um like desensitizing them.
00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:56.720
Yeah, desensitizing them to this person, but also you're learning to trust them because it's like, hey, some secrecy can come in of like, don't tell your mom I took you for ice cream afterwards because she's not gonna let me pick you up anymore from school.
00:26:57.119 --> 00:27:02.799
Or don't tell your grandma that I let you have a gumball after dinner.
00:27:03.039 --> 00:27:03.680
Things like that.
00:27:03.759 --> 00:27:06.960
So it creates some kind of secrecy within the relationship.
00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:15.519
But also while this person is doing these things with these kids, they're doing it with the adults because they're having to like desensitize you to them having access to their kid.
00:27:15.680 --> 00:27:18.640
Like, no, you're so busy, you've got five other kids at home.
00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:23.440
Like, let me, you're a single dad, let me go pick up your kid for you, let me bring him home on my way home.
00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:31.359
So it's getting you used to this is a trusted person in your household or in your family or in your inner circle that these kids can be around.
00:27:31.519 --> 00:27:45.279
And then it's they start doing the simple physical touches of the hugs and the high fives, things that just get you used to their actual touch, and then the secrecy continues, and then potentially it could lead to sexual things that happen.
00:27:45.519 --> 00:27:51.039
And then it goes back to, well, you might have enjoyed it, or this is gonna be your fault as much as my fault.
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:54.480
This is gonna be who's gonna believe you versus me.
00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:58.319
Is anybody gonna believe that I did this because of where I stand in the community?
00:27:58.480 --> 00:28:03.519
Or are you having behavioral issues and I'm the one that's trying to get you out of these behavioral issues?
00:28:04.079 --> 00:28:11.920
So there's a lot that happens with grooming, but the biggest shock that kind of like your face showed is a lot of people don't think that perpetrators groom adults.
00:28:12.079 --> 00:28:13.119
No, that shocked me.
00:28:13.440 --> 00:28:15.519
I'm sitting here going, that makes so much sense.
00:28:16.319 --> 00:28:23.200
And the other thing that kind of hit me too was like they're like baiting the adults with relief.
00:28:23.359 --> 00:28:23.839
Yeah.
00:28:24.079 --> 00:28:26.319
Like, here, let me take something off your plate.
00:28:26.720 --> 00:28:30.400
Here, this kid, you know, you're so busy, they need some individual attention.
00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:31.119
I got you.
00:28:31.200 --> 00:28:32.640
Let me pick them up from school for you.
00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:35.920
And it could be like there's some cases I've worked where there was zero grooming at all.
00:28:36.000 --> 00:28:36.799
Like it just happened.
00:28:37.039 --> 00:28:41.519
There's cases I've worked where grooming's been over years before anything sexual ever happened.
00:28:41.759 --> 00:28:43.680
Years before something happened.
00:28:44.400 --> 00:28:45.039
Wow.
00:28:46.559 --> 00:28:52.640
That's so much like calculated, pre, you know, oh my gosh, premeditated.
00:28:52.720 --> 00:28:56.400
And so with that, like my red flags go off so often with certain things.
00:28:56.559 --> 00:28:59.279
Like my daughter comes home from school and she goes, Mama, I got this from school.
00:28:59.359 --> 00:28:59.920
I'm like, how come?
00:29:00.079 --> 00:29:00.720
Who gave you got that?
00:29:00.880 --> 00:29:01.359
Who gave you that?
00:29:01.519 --> 00:29:02.880
Did everybody get that or did just you get that?
00:29:02.960 --> 00:29:04.480
How come you got this gift?
00:29:04.720 --> 00:29:07.279
So I'm like questioning my kids on a lot of stuff.
00:29:07.440 --> 00:29:13.519
And my husband, God bless in all the time, he looks at me, he's like, simmer down there, like it's it's innocent.
00:29:13.680 --> 00:29:14.640
Like, let it be innocent.
00:29:14.799 --> 00:29:15.440
Like, you're right.
00:29:15.519 --> 00:29:16.640
I need to let it be innocent.
00:29:17.119 --> 00:29:18.640
Well, that's a good question for you, too.
00:29:18.799 --> 00:29:22.640
Is like, how often do you see your job following you home with your own children?
00:29:22.960 --> 00:29:28.319
So I am very good about compartmentalizing what I heard at work and not taking home from work.
00:29:28.480 --> 00:29:35.200
So I've got a five-year-old or almost five-year-old in a few weeks, and then a three and a half-year-old and a almost a one-year-old.
00:29:35.440 --> 00:29:38.720
So a five-year-old, she is my mini interviewer.
00:29:38.799 --> 00:29:40.720
Like, she will be like, Thanks for correcting me, mama.
00:29:41.039 --> 00:29:44.160
Like, she'll ask me a question, you know, this, this, or something different.
00:29:44.319 --> 00:29:46.400
I'm like, my girl, she's learning.
00:29:47.039 --> 00:29:50.559
Um, so she has gotten really big about like, Mama, tell me about your day.
00:29:50.720 --> 00:29:51.680
Tell me everything you did.
00:29:51.839 --> 00:29:53.119
Tell me about talking to kids today.
00:29:53.200 --> 00:29:56.400
And I just have to tell her, like, hey, nope, I can't tell you about the kids I talked to.
00:29:56.480 --> 00:29:57.359
I just talked to kids.
00:29:57.519 --> 00:29:59.440
And then she like, did you help them?
00:29:59.680 --> 00:30:02.079
I'm not sure if I helped them or not, but I talked to them a lot.
00:30:02.240 --> 00:30:07.359
And so it's then tried to tell a five-year-old about my job without telling it too much.
00:30:07.440 --> 00:30:19.920
But like just the mentality of it of you, I don't think you can get away from everything that you hear because it does impact you of certain things of if my kid doesn't want to go sit on Santa's lap, I'm not gonna go make them sit on Santa's lap.
00:30:20.000 --> 00:30:20.480
That's okay.
00:30:20.640 --> 00:30:24.720
Because if you they're uncomfortable with something or they don't want to, I'm not gonna force anything with you.
00:30:24.880 --> 00:30:28.400
But also, I'm very big on the communication with them of talk to me.
00:30:28.559 --> 00:30:31.920
Like, we're going through the big feelings and big emotions stage right now.
00:30:32.559 --> 00:30:33.759
Talk to me about what's going on.
00:30:33.839 --> 00:30:39.359
Let's not freak out, let's not scream, yell, like use your words to articulate things with me.
00:30:39.599 --> 00:30:45.440
So, like body parts, both my kids that can talk, they know their anatomical parts, that's what they call them.
00:30:45.680 --> 00:30:47.759
Yeah, they don't have like funky names for them.
00:30:47.920 --> 00:30:52.400
No, how do you feel about that when a parent will use a different word?
00:30:53.039 --> 00:30:53.759
To each his own.
00:30:53.839 --> 00:30:58.880
There's teenagers I talk to that refuse to say like penis and vagina because they think like that's super disturbing.
00:30:58.960 --> 00:30:59.680
And that's okay.
00:30:59.839 --> 00:31:05.279
Like, you use whatever you can use as long as that like a caregiver and a kid, you understand what they're talking about.
00:31:05.440 --> 00:31:05.680
Sure.
00:31:05.839 --> 00:31:10.240
So, like if you call it their cookie, know what they mean by if they're saying they're cookie.
00:31:10.400 --> 00:31:13.200
So if you're like, I have no idea what that is, ask them.
00:31:13.440 --> 00:31:20.319
So if they don't want to call it penis and vagina, to each his own, that's okay as long as you know what they're talking about.
00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:32.640
At what age are is appropriate for you to start having that kind of a conversation where you're telling them, you know, this is, you know, nobody should touch you here, nobody should see you that and how should you have that conversation?
00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:38.079
So, me personally, I've had that conversation with my kids since they've started to verbalize things.
00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:50.160
So, like if they take baths together, it's like, nope, you wash your body, you wash your body, you don't wash each other's body, or like potty training was a big one with like, hey, if you need help wiping at school, the teachers are the one to wipe you.
00:31:50.240 --> 00:31:51.279
This is how they should wipe you.
00:31:51.359 --> 00:31:53.839
Nobody's supposed to take pictures or videos of you.
00:31:54.079 --> 00:31:56.000
And like, right now, it's very common.
00:31:56.160 --> 00:31:57.920
Someone be like, hey, I need to tell you a secret.
00:31:58.079 --> 00:32:03.519
If you tell it to my five-year-old, she'll stop and look at you and say, We don't keep secrets, we have fun surprises.
00:32:03.759 --> 00:32:06.240
So it's already instilling in them different verbiage.
00:32:06.319 --> 00:32:11.119
And to know that, like, talking about your penis and your vagina or your butt are not, it's not inappropriate.
00:32:11.200 --> 00:32:13.200
There's just a time and a place to do it.
00:32:13.440 --> 00:32:19.759
Because granted, we had the issue still whenever we taught my five-year-old, it's a cute funny story.
00:32:19.920 --> 00:32:37.200
So I ended up going to dinner with my CEO and then like some of my other admin and then some other coworkers and my two kids at Mama Cita's, and we're sitting there and Charlotte, my five-year-old, is like, you have vagina, you have vagina, you have a vagina, going walking around the table, tell everybody what they have.
00:32:37.440 --> 00:32:40.880
Gets to my CEO and goes, You have a penis, you have vagina.
00:32:41.039 --> 00:32:43.279
I kept walking around, I'm like mortified.
00:32:43.680 --> 00:32:53.599
Just like, any anybody walking, like, people are laughing around us because then my son also screamed at like a table of firefighters, was like, Daddy, I'm like, Y'all are not his father, I promise.
00:32:53.759 --> 00:32:56.720
Like, so it was an event with both kids.
00:32:57.039 --> 00:33:03.920
But it was kind of funny because then like my CEO made a comment and was like, Well, at least you know they're your kids, like they know their body parts.
00:33:04.079 --> 00:33:05.359
Well, it's Tori's kids.
00:33:05.440 --> 00:33:11.039
I'm like, Yep, they know their body parts, but like then it's teaching them like you don't need to tell everybody else what they have their body parts as.
00:33:11.279 --> 00:33:11.839
Right.
00:33:12.160 --> 00:33:13.200
Oh my gosh.
00:33:13.440 --> 00:33:16.000
I would have laughed my butt off for that, though.
00:33:16.079 --> 00:33:16.960
That would have been so funny.
00:33:17.039 --> 00:33:18.000
And it would have been your kids.
00:33:18.079 --> 00:33:19.519
If anybody's kids, 100%.
00:33:19.920 --> 00:33:22.079
So I tell them, like, hey, at school, you don't need to talk about it.
00:33:22.160 --> 00:33:23.279
You don't need to tell people about it.
00:33:23.359 --> 00:33:24.880
We don't show anybody about it.
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:30.559
But if something's wrong with it, you tell a grown-up, you tell your teacher, or you tell one of like the directors.
00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:33.759
Those are who you talk to about it, you don't need to tell your friends about it.
00:33:33.839 --> 00:33:34.079
Yeah.
00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:37.680
Like otherwise, it's you don't need to go teach them what they have on their body.
00:33:37.839 --> 00:33:42.160
Let that be their caregivers' role to teach them and like how they want to teach them.
00:33:42.400 --> 00:33:42.640
Yeah.
00:33:42.880 --> 00:33:43.839
Not how I teach you.
00:33:44.079 --> 00:33:51.440
What do you think your job has changed about the way that you choose to parent your children?
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:56.880
The awareness, because with, like I mentioned, my husband's law enforcement.
00:33:56.960 --> 00:33:59.839
So both of us see and hear kind of the worst of the worst stuff.
00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:02.720
So, like, we just kind of like side-eye each other.
00:34:02.799 --> 00:34:04.799
Like, is should we let this happen right now?
00:34:04.880 --> 00:34:05.759
Should we not let this happen?
00:34:06.000 --> 00:34:24.239
Like, so just being very hyper-vigilant with them, with other kids, with other adults around the kids to help alleviate any concerns of like, oh well, hey, like, for instance, my daughter the other day, she fell, she like hit her head, and we got to school, and they're like, hey, what happened?
00:34:24.320 --> 00:34:25.920
I'm like, kiddo, you tell them what happened.
00:34:26.000 --> 00:34:27.199
And so she told them everything that happened.
00:34:27.280 --> 00:34:30.960
I'm like, I don't want it to be my words, I want it to be your words of what happened.
00:34:31.280 --> 00:34:37.039
So it's just just being very aware of situations and different marks and bruises and changes on their body.
00:34:38.000 --> 00:34:38.400
I don't know.
00:34:38.559 --> 00:34:45.119
It's just very different being aware of, and probably too aware to where like you get too stressed out about it, like going to a park.
00:34:45.280 --> 00:34:47.760
You think worst case, like, okay, where are both my kids at?
00:34:47.920 --> 00:34:50.000
Could somebody somebody could walk up from over here and do something?
00:34:50.079 --> 00:34:52.719
Something had happened in this tunnel that I can't see you in.
00:34:52.800 --> 00:34:58.320
So don't go play in this tunnel, go play over here, but be careful with the bigger kids because they might run you over, you might get hurt.
00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:00.639
Too much overthinking as a parent now.
00:35:00.800 --> 00:35:02.559
You've been doing this since before you had kids, right?
00:35:02.719 --> 00:35:02.960
Yes.
00:35:03.039 --> 00:35:05.360
Yeah, almost not uh eight and a half years now.
00:35:05.679 --> 00:35:08.559
Did that have any impact on whether or not you wanted to have children?
00:35:08.800 --> 00:35:09.199
Not at all.
00:35:09.440 --> 00:35:09.679
Really?
00:35:10.800 --> 00:35:10.960
No.
00:35:11.280 --> 00:35:12.639
I've always wanted kids.
00:35:12.800 --> 00:35:21.360
We love like having our kids, our big family, and like seeing them interact with each other now because it's also the thought of like, I can't live life in fear.
00:35:21.519 --> 00:35:21.760
Right.
00:35:21.840 --> 00:35:28.480
Um, I can't control everything as much as I want to, as much as I want to keep my babies in a bubble and safe and protected.
00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:29.519
I can't.
00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:37.440
But I can only do as much as I can and instill and teach them as much as I can to be aware of their surroundings, but not detrimental to them.
00:35:37.760 --> 00:35:43.199
Now, what is something that you think a lot of parents should know that they commonly miss?
00:35:43.440 --> 00:35:45.119
That's a hard question because it can be anything.
00:35:45.280 --> 00:35:49.679
It can be behavioral changes, it can be just nothing changes.
00:35:49.920 --> 00:35:51.760
It's just a norm for people.
00:35:51.920 --> 00:35:58.800
The biggest thing that we see is that parents are uncomfortable having certain conversations with their kid.
00:35:58.880 --> 00:36:03.599
Like we're talking about body parts, body safety, telling people nobody's supposed to look at or take pictures.
00:36:03.840 --> 00:36:05.760
Don't take pictures and send them online.
00:36:06.320 --> 00:36:18.480
Because if you're not teaching your kid how you want to about their body or their body safety, somebody else is going to teach them, and it's not gonna be the right information for them to help keep them safe.
00:36:20.000 --> 00:36:29.360
What is something that your experience has taught you that most parents worry about, but it has like caused you to worry less about it?
00:36:29.599 --> 00:36:30.719
Stranger danger.
00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:34.159
Yeah, that makes so much sense after what you said a minute ago.
00:36:34.320 --> 00:36:35.280
Stranger danger, 100%.
00:36:35.840 --> 00:36:37.840
Because it's not stranger, it's usually somebody close.
00:36:38.000 --> 00:36:38.719
Yes, most often.
00:36:38.880 --> 00:36:46.559
If it is like stranger danger, there's a greater chance for different things to happen with kiddos, but definitely stranger danger.
00:36:46.880 --> 00:36:48.960
What is the proper thing to do?
00:36:49.119 --> 00:36:57.760
Like if you feel like maybe your child says something to you, or if you maybe haven't said anything, but maybe you're noticing these things, like the hey, real changes and things like that.
00:36:57.920 --> 00:37:04.000
What's the very first thing a parent should do in that type of a situation if they think something might be going on with their kid?
00:37:04.880 --> 00:37:09.599
Look at themselves in the mirror first and see their emotions.
00:37:09.920 --> 00:37:17.039
Because children, if there is something going on and you're emotional going to them with it, they're gonna be less not, I don't say less likely.
00:37:17.119 --> 00:37:22.800
There's gonna be some concerns for them to tell possibly tell you things that are happening because of they don't want to hurt your feelings.
00:37:22.880 --> 00:37:25.519
They don't want to make you have to go through certain things.
00:37:25.760 --> 00:37:36.400
Um so just kind of like okay, take a deep breath, gather yourself, group, group yourself, and then ask them, like, hey, I've seen some behavior changes.
00:37:36.559 --> 00:37:37.679
Talk to me, what's going on?
00:37:38.239 --> 00:37:43.679
And a kid might not want to talk about it, and you keep always asking him, like, are there things that have happened like you just don't want to talk about right now?
00:37:44.320 --> 00:37:47.119
Because that's an open door for it's a yes, it's maybe a no.
00:37:47.519 --> 00:37:54.960
Um, if it's different things that have been said to them, make a DFPS report, make a law enforcement report.
00:37:55.519 --> 00:38:08.320
Because as a parent before starting this job, as a person, if so if a kid came up and told me, if my niece had told me, or if another friend's kid had said, like, hey, so-and-so hurt me, I'd be like, What do you mean so-and-so hurt you?
00:38:08.400 --> 00:38:09.119
Like, what happened?
00:38:09.199 --> 00:38:18.400
I'm gonna go handle this, I'm gonna go talk to this person, which then could put somebody on the defensive of like, no, no, no, I don't want you to get in trouble because you might go hurt somebody because of me.
00:38:18.800 --> 00:38:32.000
So it's really taking that emotional step back and knowing, like, I'm gonna let somebody else ask these questions because they might not want to tell me as much because they're afraid of that emotional connection of how it might impact them, their family, their life, moving forward.
00:38:32.320 --> 00:38:34.639
So make the calls.
00:38:36.079 --> 00:38:42.559
The child can be worried about putting their parent in danger if they especially something's happening to them, right?
00:38:42.719 --> 00:38:46.400
Like they could think, like, oh, well, that person could hurt my mommy too, and I don't want her to go see anything.
00:38:46.480 --> 00:38:51.199
And sometimes there's the threats of like, I'm gonna hurt your sister, I'm gonna hurt your dad, I'm gonna hurt your mom, I'm gonna hurt your dogs.
00:38:51.360 --> 00:38:51.519
Wow.
00:38:51.679 --> 00:38:54.960
Or if you tell anybody, like, this is your fault because you enjoyed it.
00:38:55.119 --> 00:38:57.840
You asked me to do these things, you wanted me to do these things.
00:38:58.079 --> 00:39:02.960
Or like if it's physical abuse stuff, it could be like, well, I was reacting to your bad behavior.
00:39:03.840 --> 00:39:07.360
So, like, kind of the like the mind manipulation game back to the kiddos.
00:39:09.920 --> 00:39:17.920
What is the ratio that you see as far as only physical abuse versus sexual abuse?
00:39:18.079 --> 00:39:20.239
Is there one you see more often than the next?
00:39:20.559 --> 00:39:23.840
So sexual abuse is what we deal with more often than physical abuse.
00:39:24.159 --> 00:39:29.920
And is that just because CPS doesn't hand you ones with the child abuse?
00:39:30.079 --> 00:39:32.320
There's a physical abuse part, or do they give you all of them?
00:39:32.480 --> 00:39:37.599
We have a certain physical abuse like criteria laid out in our within our memorandum of understanding.
00:39:37.840 --> 00:39:38.960
So we follow that.
00:39:39.199 --> 00:39:47.199
Like we will interview for any surviving children of a child fatality, any sexual abuse, whether it's at risk or like a disclosure of abuse.
00:39:47.440 --> 00:39:50.880
Physical abuse has to be above certain thresholds to meet Texas family code.
00:39:50.960 --> 00:39:52.159
So what are those thresholds?
00:39:52.320 --> 00:39:53.119
I would want to know.
00:39:53.440 --> 00:40:03.119
So if it's like um severe burns, marks, bruises outside of corporal punishment, um, towards like excessive punishment of like their whole butt cheeks being black, excessive.
00:40:03.199 --> 00:40:09.360
If you've got like a bruised ear and it goes up until they're like into their head, that's a difficult place to bruise on your body.
00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:13.679
So also taking into consideration the child's age, their development status.
00:40:13.760 --> 00:40:19.920
Do you have a teenager that's on the spectrum and so they're not able to articulate certain things, or are they development delayed?
00:40:20.159 --> 00:40:24.800
That can all be taken into consideration for these physical abuse cases to come in.
00:40:25.119 --> 00:40:32.559
Um it could be the younger kids with their just the caregivers reacted.
00:40:32.800 --> 00:40:39.679
It might be that they something happened and they have a mark across their head, but it was they ran into a door instead.
00:40:39.920 --> 00:40:46.000
So it just is certain, is more information that needs to be gathered before bringing some of these cases in.
00:40:46.239 --> 00:40:48.480
Even with the sexual abuse ones as well.
00:40:50.159 --> 00:41:07.840
I can't imagine like if I had a case come in and I, for whatever reason, like knew, like just intuitively, that something's happening to this child, and then nothing ends up happening because I don't get that outcry or sufficient enough evidence.
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:09.599
How do you handle a situation like that?
00:41:09.840 --> 00:41:12.480
So as an interviewer, I'm not able to have an opinion.
00:41:12.639 --> 00:41:19.599
So I'm not able to say, like, I believe this kid or I don't believe this kid, or like there's more to it, um, or like, hey, this kid shut down at this point.
00:41:19.840 --> 00:41:21.039
I think there's something more.
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:22.559
I'm not able to make that opinion.
00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:23.840
But you can in your own head.
00:41:24.079 --> 00:41:33.199
In my own head, I can think those things, but I'm not gonna like say them out loud because in that place, even though I can think those things, I'm not in that role at that time.
00:41:33.280 --> 00:41:35.440
Like an interviewer Tory at this time.
00:41:35.679 --> 00:41:38.960
Right now, this kid's telling me and I'm meeting them where they're at, they're saying nothing happened.
00:41:39.039 --> 00:41:40.880
And I'm like, okay, thanks for talking to me today.
00:41:41.039 --> 00:41:42.159
I appreciate you talking to me.
00:41:42.320 --> 00:41:45.519
If there's ever anything you like want to come back and talk to me about, you're welcome to.
00:41:45.760 --> 00:41:48.480
To make that kid feel comfortable of I'm not gonna force you to talk.
00:41:48.719 --> 00:41:51.039
Like if you need a break, that's fine.
00:41:51.199 --> 00:41:59.920
Like, I'm not I'm not gonna force you because it's forcing a kid to talk when they're not ready is not victim-centered and it's not trauma-informed for that kid at all.
00:42:00.079 --> 00:42:00.320
Right.
00:42:00.480 --> 00:42:00.880
Totally.
00:42:01.519 --> 00:42:12.320
I'm just more curious about, I guess, when you just have that feeling and you say, say you just like for whatever reason, you're just like, I know more is going on.
00:42:12.400 --> 00:42:15.039
And now you can't say that, I can't verbalize that.
00:42:15.360 --> 00:42:24.639
But what happens inside of you when you're just like, I I couldn't get the outcry, I couldn't help them, I want to help them, but I just couldn't.
00:42:24.719 --> 00:42:26.480
Like, do you how does that affect you?
00:42:26.800 --> 00:42:45.360
So after each interview, I do feel like I help a kid because I provided you that open space to talk and you were able to talk about whatever you wanted to, whether you talked about your soccer game, you talked about the sexual abuse, physical abuse, witnessing the murder, whatever you talked about is what you wanted to talk about.
00:42:45.519 --> 00:42:50.159
And I I provided you an open kind of arena to talk about whatever you wanted to.
00:42:50.320 --> 00:42:59.599
So I have had a lot of kids, not a lot of kids, I have had some situations where kids come back for subsequent interviews to talk to me and they're like, I didn't say X, Y, and Z previously because of this.
00:42:59.840 --> 00:43:01.519
Now I'm here to tell you all this.
00:43:01.679 --> 00:43:08.079
And so it's just having that open space for them and knowing that that's the best that I can do at that time.
00:43:08.159 --> 00:43:10.719
And that's what I have to learn to be okay with.
00:43:10.960 --> 00:43:13.519
Otherwise, there's ones that you will lose sleep at night about.
00:43:13.760 --> 00:43:16.960
Does that come natural for you or is that something that you learned in training?
00:43:17.119 --> 00:43:17.920
It's training.
00:43:18.079 --> 00:43:18.400
Really?
00:43:18.719 --> 00:43:24.719
Because the naturally as humans, we're curious, we want to know, and we want to insert our opinions and our thoughts and our feelings into certain things.
00:43:24.800 --> 00:43:27.840
And as an interviewer, I'm not able to do any of that stuff.
00:43:28.079 --> 00:43:37.599
Like if you're crying, we'd be like, hey, talk to me about your emotions, here's some tissues, more victim-centered than that, but not, oh my gosh, how come you're feeling this way?
00:43:37.679 --> 00:43:42.000
It's I don't want you to think that I'm judging you or making you feel a type of way on anything.
00:43:42.239 --> 00:43:46.079
Well, and I think that you probably are really good at not making somebody feel shame.
00:43:46.159 --> 00:43:49.840
Like you, you're probably excellent at like taking that feeling off the table.
00:43:50.079 --> 00:43:54.719
Yeah, and I'll tell kids um teenagers a lot more is like, hey, like, I don't judge kids for anything in this room.
00:43:54.880 --> 00:43:57.920
I've heard a lot of stuff, I've had a lot of stuff happen in this room.
00:43:58.079 --> 00:43:59.119
I'm not gonna judge you for it.
00:43:59.199 --> 00:44:05.440
And so, like, if the Kid cusses, I cuss intentionally to help them know like this is more of an open space.
00:44:05.599 --> 00:44:09.679
And they see me still as an authority figure because I'm an adult sitting there talking to them.
00:44:09.840 --> 00:44:23.760
But I try to really tell them like we give them the rules, we give them our instructions, things like that, just to give them a little bit more control over their narrative of what they want to share, because they might not have had any control over the abuse that they may or may not have like been through.
00:44:23.920 --> 00:44:24.239
Right.
00:44:25.119 --> 00:44:29.679
Now I had the privilege of watching you testify on a case one time.
00:44:30.079 --> 00:44:35.119
And I just remember whenever you got done just being like, I love her.
00:44:36.079 --> 00:44:37.440
I need to be friends with her.
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:38.000
I love her.
00:44:38.239 --> 00:44:40.800
So I'm so curious because I'm sure that you have to do that a lot, right?
00:44:40.880 --> 00:44:42.639
With your job, are you going into court often?
00:44:42.800 --> 00:44:44.159
I I do testify pretty often.
00:44:44.239 --> 00:44:44.559
Yes.
00:44:44.719 --> 00:44:47.280
And how many cases would you say you've testified in?
00:44:47.599 --> 00:44:48.000
A lot.
00:44:48.239 --> 00:44:49.440
Between civil and criminal.
00:44:49.599 --> 00:44:53.760
Um, because criminal, I've testified as expert outcry and like a fact witness before.
00:44:53.920 --> 00:44:57.440
Civil, I've testified in like divorce hearings or custody hearings.
00:44:57.679 --> 00:44:57.920
Really?
00:44:58.079 --> 00:44:59.119
In divorce hearings?
00:44:59.280 --> 00:44:59.599
Yep.
00:44:59.760 --> 00:45:00.159
Why?
00:45:00.320 --> 00:45:14.800
Um, if there's concern of like abuse from one parent and they don't have access to our forensic interview, they want to bring in the interviewer to disclose X, Y, and Z information that was said from that child during the interview to help with their going through a divorce and custody at the same time.
00:45:14.960 --> 00:45:18.639
This is why this caregiver should not have access to this kid.
00:45:18.960 --> 00:45:19.599
Wow.
00:45:20.320 --> 00:45:22.320
But I'm the weirder that loves testifying.
00:45:22.559 --> 00:45:25.599
I can see that I saw that energy in you.
00:45:25.679 --> 00:45:29.440
I'm like, this girl, no, like she is in her element right now.
00:45:29.519 --> 00:45:29.840
I love it.
00:45:29.920 --> 00:45:37.840
And more so because I see it as like any platform I have access to that I can educate on child abuse and forensic interviewing, I love it.
00:45:37.920 --> 00:45:39.920
Because before this job, I knew nothing about it.
00:45:40.079 --> 00:45:45.440
Like, obviously, it's like, yeah, you're a mandated reporter, not understanding what happens after I make a report.
00:45:45.599 --> 00:45:45.920
Yeah.
00:45:46.079 --> 00:45:47.280
Like, you don't know anything about that.
00:45:47.360 --> 00:45:50.559
So any chance I can get to educate and explain, I love it.
00:45:50.719 --> 00:45:51.039
Yeah.
00:45:51.119 --> 00:45:58.000
And that's what I see as testifying because I'm a neutral party of you can try to criticize what I did in the interview, how I asked questions, things like that.
00:45:58.159 --> 00:45:58.960
Absolutely.
00:45:59.280 --> 00:46:02.559
But I'm not able to say I believe this kid or I don't believe this kid.
00:46:02.719 --> 00:46:04.480
I'm a neutral witness at this point.
00:46:04.639 --> 00:46:07.440
And that really takes so much of the pressure off of you right there.
00:46:08.000 --> 00:46:10.639
Now, do you guys follow, is it called the peace method?
00:46:10.880 --> 00:46:13.199
So we follow this in my structure narrative process.
00:46:13.440 --> 00:46:14.880
Can you explain a little bit about what that means?
00:46:15.119 --> 00:46:17.840
Yeah, so that's our method here in Texas that we follow.
00:46:18.079 --> 00:46:23.920
So we are membership agencies with CEC Texas, and I'm on the faculty for teaching forensic interviewing.
00:46:24.079 --> 00:46:25.280
That's what I leave for this week.
00:46:25.360 --> 00:46:32.960
And so that basically like it goes through rapport, event narrative practice, because how we talk in the room is very different than how you talk outside of the room.
00:46:33.199 --> 00:46:43.519
So it's event narrative practice, then it's going into our rules and our instructions in the room, obtaining truth, lie, and an oath from the kid, and then introduction topic, detail gathering.
00:46:43.679 --> 00:46:51.280
For us, we go through body safety with every single child, regardless of the situation that they came in there for, and that can look different with every kid.
00:46:51.519 --> 00:46:53.920
Sometimes it's very specific, sometimes it's more global.
00:46:54.079 --> 00:46:58.079
And then it's the closure of thanking the kid for talking to you because they don't have to talk to you.
00:46:58.159 --> 00:47:01.440
They can leave at any point they want, and I'm not gonna stop you.
00:47:01.679 --> 00:47:06.480
I have never found somebody that doesn't say you are the best at your job.
00:47:06.880 --> 00:47:07.760
Never one time.
00:47:08.159 --> 00:47:13.039
Like if your name happens to get mentioned, everybody's like, oh, dude, she's the shit.
00:47:13.199 --> 00:47:13.760
Every time.
00:47:13.920 --> 00:47:14.239
Okay.
00:47:14.480 --> 00:47:18.239
So I want to know what do you think it is that makes you so good at what you do?
00:47:18.480 --> 00:47:19.920
Honestly, I don't think so.
00:47:20.159 --> 00:47:21.599
I don't think I'm better than anybody else.
00:47:21.760 --> 00:47:25.199
The girls I supervise, I think they're better than me because they're younger.
00:47:25.360 --> 00:47:34.159
They have different takes and lenses on different things, they can pivot just as well as I can, but they might not have to ask certain questions where I'm like, okay, kid, what does that mean?
00:47:34.320 --> 00:47:35.920
Like, they might already know what that means.
00:47:36.079 --> 00:47:37.760
They're just clarifying it with the kid.
00:47:38.000 --> 00:47:41.119
So I think with investigators, I've done it for so long.
00:47:41.280 --> 00:47:45.920
I've been a consistent person doing it for them to where they know my style.
00:47:46.000 --> 00:47:50.880
They know how I'm gonna ask questions, they know, like, oh great, we're getting to body safety.
00:47:50.960 --> 00:47:51.360
Here it comes.
00:47:51.440 --> 00:47:54.559
Like, Tori's gonna ask these questions, and who knows what's gonna happen.
00:47:54.719 --> 00:47:58.800
Um, it's kind of like a running joke, like maybe a can of worms, I'm not sure.
00:47:59.119 --> 00:48:02.239
But I think I'm just a consistent person for them at this point.
00:48:02.559 --> 00:48:06.239
And I think that's it.
00:48:06.559 --> 00:48:12.159
I can tell you that one particular investigator who's been doing this a very long time.
00:48:13.119 --> 00:48:16.400
I know that he always made sure that you were the one that did his interviews.
00:48:16.639 --> 00:48:19.039
There's certain interviews I will for sure do.
00:48:19.199 --> 00:48:23.519
Um, one, because maybe my girls haven't done this type of interview before, and that's okay.
00:48:23.599 --> 00:48:29.519
Like they want to be able to see it first, or maybe CSAM needs to be presented to this kiddo, and I've done it before.
00:48:29.840 --> 00:48:33.280
So, or certain like situations like that one sounds interesting.
00:48:33.360 --> 00:48:35.519
I need to know more about this, and I want to do that one.
00:48:35.679 --> 00:48:39.360
For a while, I was a singular interviewer in certain aspects.
00:48:39.599 --> 00:48:46.480
With we had people transitioning roles within our agency, or that we're smaller agencies, so a lot of our roles are hybrid.
00:48:46.639 --> 00:48:52.400
So it's like, yeah, you're stuck with me as your interviewer for a while because I'm I'm really it right now, especially during COVID.
00:48:52.639 --> 00:48:57.840
That was a whole different time of doing them in masks and all across everybody.
00:48:57.920 --> 00:48:59.199
That was a whole different time.
00:48:59.440 --> 00:49:03.199
Oh, yeah, because like the kid can't really read your facial expressions in a mask.
00:49:03.360 --> 00:49:07.920
So at first we ended up doing masks and then we moved our chairs where we were six feet apart.
00:49:08.079 --> 00:49:12.800
So then we would ask the caregivers, like, are you okay if we take our mask off in the room?
00:49:12.960 --> 00:49:14.559
If we're six feet apart, like absolutely.
00:49:14.639 --> 00:49:16.239
So you I'd put it on before I leave the room.
00:49:16.320 --> 00:49:19.039
If I took a break, put it on, had it on when I walked back in.
00:49:19.280 --> 00:49:25.840
Because we did not want to necessarily do virtual forensic interviews because you can't really, you don't know what's on the other side of that.
00:49:25.920 --> 00:49:27.599
Is there somebody sitting on the backside of the computer?
00:49:28.079 --> 00:49:30.800
Uh are they in the room where maybe the abuse had occurred?
00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:38.960
So we were taking we were doing whatever we could to help mitigate that issue during COVID to have that kid still in person, but keep them safe as well while we're doing it.
00:49:39.360 --> 00:49:44.000
I don't think people really understand and realize how common child sexual abuse is.
00:49:44.159 --> 00:49:45.599
Can you give me the statistics on that?
00:49:45.840 --> 00:49:51.679
So they change as more studies come out, but an average is like one in 10 kids before they're 18 will be exposed to sexual abuse.
00:49:51.920 --> 00:49:53.599
And key defines sexual abuse?
00:49:53.840 --> 00:50:05.519
Yeah, so that can be witnessing something happen with like something sexual happen with another person, them being sexualized with something touching or penetration of their body, or them having to do that to somebody else's body.
00:50:07.039 --> 00:50:10.320
How about like exposure to pornography at a young age?
00:50:10.719 --> 00:50:13.119
Dear Lord, social media is terrible.
00:50:13.440 --> 00:50:15.199
Like, terrible.
00:50:15.440 --> 00:50:20.559
More often than not, if I ask a kid about like, hey, have you ever seen pictures or videos of somebody with no clothes on?
00:50:20.719 --> 00:50:22.880
I'm waiting for the oh, Snapchat.
00:50:23.199 --> 00:50:23.760
Really?
00:50:23.920 --> 00:50:30.159
It is horrible with the amount of times I hear that Snapchat is something that they've seen a random because they don't have their account as private.
00:50:30.239 --> 00:50:34.400
So somebody randomly sends their message, hi, they respond back, and then here's all a set of penis.
00:50:35.280 --> 00:50:35.920
Yeah.
00:50:36.239 --> 00:50:38.880
Or Discord is another really big one that's coming about.
00:50:39.119 --> 00:50:53.119
That's how kids are getting into some of the ways they're getting into the dark web is through all these different chats and all these different extremists groups that are now bringing these kids in and exploiting somebody of, well, a 15-year-old boy just sent a picture of his body to somebody else.
00:50:53.280 --> 00:50:56.400
Now they're like, give me all this money or I'm gonna send it to your Instagram followers.
00:50:56.719 --> 00:50:58.079
I know somebody that that happened to.
00:50:58.559 --> 00:51:00.960
I have a friend whose child that they got that exact message.
00:51:01.280 --> 00:51:07.679
Like, we've had different things with Instagram, with Discord, with Snapchat, with random emails that are being sent about things.
00:51:07.920 --> 00:51:11.519
And it's just they think it's somebody their age that they're talking to, and it's it's not.
00:51:11.760 --> 00:51:24.639
It turns out that it's some 52-year-old female out of a different state or out of the country, and now their images are out there, and then there's a lot of other shame and guilt that goes with I should have known better, or why did I do that?
00:51:24.960 --> 00:51:26.400
Don't should on me.
00:51:26.559 --> 00:51:27.760
I hate the word should.
00:51:27.840 --> 00:51:29.599
I try not to use it as often as possible.
00:51:29.760 --> 00:51:30.719
Don't should on me.
00:51:30.800 --> 00:51:32.639
It's associated with shame for the most part.
00:51:32.800 --> 00:51:32.960
Yep.
00:51:33.119 --> 00:51:34.400
Kids should be in a car seat.
00:51:34.480 --> 00:51:35.119
I'll give you that one.
00:51:35.199 --> 00:51:35.599
Yep.
00:51:35.840 --> 00:51:38.639
And if your kids are not in a car seat, you should be ashamed.
00:51:38.719 --> 00:51:40.159
However, definitely please follow that.
00:51:40.239 --> 00:51:42.480
Otherwise, there will be a DFES report called in for that one.
00:51:42.639 --> 00:51:43.039
For real.
00:51:43.199 --> 00:51:43.440
Yes.
00:51:43.599 --> 00:51:51.039
But yeah, no, we see it a lot more at young ages of kids being exposed to stuff through unsupervised access on phones or tablets and devices.
00:51:51.280 --> 00:52:01.519
But also, when you have your parents that are very proactive and they have all the parental controls on these phones, kids are just really advanced in technology and they can get around those.
00:52:01.679 --> 00:52:03.119
They know the different apps to download.
00:52:03.199 --> 00:52:06.719
There's one app in particular that's like it looks like a calculator on your phone.
00:52:06.960 --> 00:52:08.800
And it it literally just looks like a calculator.
00:52:08.880 --> 00:52:09.760
You can use it as a calculator.
00:52:09.840 --> 00:52:13.920
But if you type in the right equation, whatever it is, it'll open up a different app.
00:52:14.239 --> 00:52:14.880
It takes you to it.
00:52:15.039 --> 00:52:15.840
What's the name of this app?
00:52:15.920 --> 00:52:16.320
So I can't.
00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:17.519
I don't remember the name of it.
00:52:17.760 --> 00:52:21.280
But it's you have to have their what is their equation to be able to get into that.
00:52:22.239 --> 00:52:24.000
Oh, and there's different apps.
00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:26.320
Like you can make an app look like anything else.
00:52:26.719 --> 00:52:29.840
Or you think you're monitoring, you're doing as much as you can as a parent.
00:52:30.000 --> 00:52:32.320
You're and you're like, oh, they downloaded a calculator.
00:52:32.480 --> 00:52:32.800
Okay.
00:52:33.199 --> 00:52:35.199
But it's hidden for these other things.
00:52:35.440 --> 00:52:42.000
And some of these other apps, like Telegram, are not very warrant-friendly, I've heard from law enforcement.
00:52:42.079 --> 00:52:46.079
So like you have to have a specific URL for that chat to be able to access it.
00:52:46.159 --> 00:52:50.000
If you don't have that URL, you just have their account name, you're not getting anything.
00:52:50.960 --> 00:52:54.559
Oh my gosh, the calculator has my mind blown right now.
00:52:54.960 --> 00:52:59.360
There is so much that's gone, like so many different apps, and like kids teach me about new apps all the time.
00:52:59.519 --> 00:53:04.639
So, what can a parent do to like protect their kid, not give them a phone, like ever?
00:53:04.719 --> 00:53:05.840
Like what age is that?
00:53:06.000 --> 00:53:06.800
They're gonna get a phone.
00:53:06.880 --> 00:53:09.199
They're gonna access their friend's phone, they're gonna access it now.
00:53:09.280 --> 00:53:11.119
They have all these tablets and laptops at school.
00:53:11.280 --> 00:53:12.000
Oh, it drives me nuts.
00:53:12.480 --> 00:53:13.360
They're gonna access stuff.
00:53:13.440 --> 00:53:15.119
Like kids are really smart.
00:53:15.280 --> 00:53:20.000
And so it's not setting certain parameters on your kid, it's having the conversations with your kids.
00:53:20.239 --> 00:53:28.000
There's scary people out there in the world that want to hurt you, that want to do different things, like you have to be careful and opening that line of communication.
00:53:28.079 --> 00:53:31.599
So if something ever happened to those kids, they know you're a safe person.
00:53:31.840 --> 00:53:36.000
I can come and I can tell you, like, I messed up and you're not gonna blow a gasket on me.
00:53:36.239 --> 00:53:41.679
Like you're gonna support me, and you you might be disappointed in what happened, but you're gonna support me and we're gonna fix it.
00:53:42.000 --> 00:53:44.880
See, I think that that's the key right there.
00:53:45.280 --> 00:53:49.599
Because I can tell you my dad is my best friend in the whole entire world, okay?
00:53:49.840 --> 00:53:50.880
Love my dad.
00:53:51.119 --> 00:53:53.519
I can call and talk to my dad about anything.
00:53:53.760 --> 00:53:55.360
Something goes wrong, I want to call my dad.
00:53:55.519 --> 00:53:57.280
Something goes right, I want to call my dad.
00:53:57.519 --> 00:54:00.559
Anything happens, that's my first phone call.
00:54:00.719 --> 00:54:01.440
Love my husband.
00:54:01.519 --> 00:54:02.880
He's also gonna be the second phone call.
00:54:02.960 --> 00:54:07.280
But my dad's gonna be my first phone call, always and forever until his last breath.
00:54:07.599 --> 00:54:12.400
So that for me is what I think parents need to be for their kids.
00:54:12.800 --> 00:54:20.480
Or they at least they need one person in their life that is that emotional safe place where they can come to them and they're not scared that they're gonna get yelled at, lectured.
00:54:20.800 --> 00:54:22.400
Also, like advice.
00:54:22.559 --> 00:54:24.559
I think lots of times parents mean really well.
00:54:24.719 --> 00:54:29.199
And every time a kid comes to them with something difficult, they just want to tell them how to fix it or fix it for them.
00:54:29.440 --> 00:54:33.519
But that doesn't give that, you know, here, like, let me just listen to you.
00:54:33.599 --> 00:54:35.760
Sometimes we want a hug and sometimes we want help.
00:54:35.920 --> 00:54:41.440
Well, and when the kid comes up to you, they're already feeling the shame, they're already feeling the disappointment, like they know they messed up.
00:54:41.519 --> 00:54:43.920
They don't need that validation right now that they messed up.
00:54:44.079 --> 00:54:48.239
They need to kind of like you say, like, just kind of like, let me just melt in your arms.
00:54:48.320 --> 00:54:49.519
Like, yeah, I need help.
00:54:49.760 --> 00:54:50.239
Yes.
00:54:50.400 --> 00:54:53.840
I just, I just need to talk about it and things suck right now.
00:54:53.920 --> 00:55:00.079
And I want things to suck right now, and I don't want you to tell me, oh, it'll be fine, yeah, and dismiss and minimize and push it down.
00:55:00.320 --> 00:55:01.360
Cause for them, it's not fine.
00:55:01.519 --> 00:55:01.760
Right.
00:55:01.920 --> 00:55:06.480
Like everybody's, and this is what I have to think of a lot with interviews, everybody's trauma is different.
00:55:06.719 --> 00:55:11.360
The worst thing that's happened to you is might be different than what I'm thinking is the worst thing that's happened to you.
00:55:11.519 --> 00:55:17.920
Like, if a kid has been sexually abused for years, I'm thinking maybe the worst, most brutal time is the worst one that happened.
00:55:18.000 --> 00:55:22.159
And the kid's like, no, it's the very first time that it ever happened because how could they ever do this to me?
00:55:22.639 --> 00:55:24.639
So, like, it makes you read about like rethinking.
00:55:24.800 --> 00:55:29.360
You're like, So, as like with interviewing, not making assumptions on anything, even in personal life.
00:55:29.440 --> 00:55:39.599
Like, don't make assumptions that this kid is dismissive of their behavior with sending these pictures because ask them how they're feeling about it, especially as kids.
00:55:39.760 --> 00:55:42.559
They're so used to adults just kind of brushing them off.
00:55:42.639 --> 00:55:44.239
Like, you should have known better, you should have done that.
00:55:44.320 --> 00:55:45.440
I gotta go fix your problem again.
00:55:45.679 --> 00:55:48.000
I think so much of that was boomer generation, too.
00:55:48.079 --> 00:55:51.679
I saw a lot, I hear stories all the time from adults, right?
00:55:51.760 --> 00:55:56.320
And the majority of these adults we had on this podcast, for example, have boomer parents.
00:55:56.559 --> 00:55:57.599
I even had boomer parents.
00:55:57.679 --> 00:55:59.599
My parents adopted me and they were older when they adopted me.
00:55:59.679 --> 00:56:01.760
So my dad's almost 80 and I'm 39.
00:56:02.079 --> 00:56:09.760
But that boomer generation, they were raised with so much shame, you know, and so they kind of like pass it on to the Gen Xers for the most part.
00:56:10.000 --> 00:56:13.360
And it was this like, we don't talk about it, everything's closed off.
00:56:13.519 --> 00:56:20.480
And so then, like, finally, I think we got to the millennials, and millennials are like, eh-ain't doing that anymore, you know, like not happening.
00:56:20.639 --> 00:56:27.199
And I think we're like the first generation that has really told our kids, like, we're trying to become that emotional safe place.
00:56:27.280 --> 00:56:33.280
I'm sure that that's changed the world of what you do significantly compared to 50 years ago.
00:56:33.519 --> 00:56:33.760
Yeah.
00:56:34.000 --> 00:56:41.119
No, there's a lot of times that like I'll hear advocates talking about like, well, the caregiver has also said they were a victim years ago, but nothing happened.
00:56:41.280 --> 00:56:47.280
And so they're very hyper-vigilant of their child, and so very supportive, very protective.
00:56:47.599 --> 00:56:53.679
Or the other side of it's where they're like, Well, we handled mine within the family, we're just gonna handle it within the family.
00:56:54.000 --> 00:56:58.079
So it's a different mindset of like you said, it was we don't talk about it.
00:56:58.239 --> 00:57:00.079
You handle it, you deal with it, and you move on.
00:57:00.239 --> 00:57:04.559
And that's like the generation my dad was of like, you don't you don't talk about it, figure it out, move on.
00:57:04.719 --> 00:57:08.320
If it impacts you, then I guess you're like man up.
00:57:09.039 --> 00:57:10.480
And how damaging is that?
00:57:10.639 --> 00:57:11.199
Exactly.
00:57:11.440 --> 00:57:13.119
That's so damaging.
00:57:13.519 --> 00:57:14.480
Because then what happens?
00:57:14.559 --> 00:57:15.519
They implode, right?
00:57:15.599 --> 00:57:17.199
Like they can't handle it a lot of the times.
00:57:17.440 --> 00:57:22.719
I mean, some people, you know, use that and launch themselves and become super successful, all the things.
00:57:22.960 --> 00:57:36.239
But then you've got the other half of the coin and the people that are internalizing all of this and never had an outlet for it, and just like what happened with your dad, just constantly beating himself up and the self-worth issues that come along with that, and that just breaks my heart.
00:57:36.320 --> 00:57:42.559
Because it's like if he could have talked about it and gotten some of that out, release a little pressure on that pressure cooker, maybe he'd still be here right now.
00:57:42.800 --> 00:57:53.760
Well, and like I forget which study it was, but there's a research article out there that talks about disclosure with average age of disclosure and like how off, like how likely is somebody should make a disclosure.
00:57:54.079 --> 00:58:00.159
And if like out of 10 people that have been a victim of abuse, six of them will die and never say anything.
00:58:00.559 --> 00:58:01.760
Oh my gosh.
00:58:02.000 --> 00:58:06.559
60% of people die without ever disclosing abuse.
00:58:08.000 --> 00:58:08.320
Yeah.
00:58:08.480 --> 00:58:10.400
And I'm I've it's from a few years ago.
00:58:10.480 --> 00:58:17.440
So there might be some different articles that like counteract that of like, no, now it's only 40%, or that's still too many, but it's still too many.
00:58:17.679 --> 00:58:29.199
It's and that's where some of these different thoughts get like everybody's now saying they were victims, or like nobody's saying they were victims, and it's trying to put these movements together and different conversations about it.
00:58:29.360 --> 00:58:40.800
It's just it needs to be just a conversation with your kid, with kids in your lives, and knowing that it's okay to talk about this stuff, it's not it's not your fault, or it's not shameful, or it's not dirty.
00:58:40.960 --> 00:58:41.920
It's okay to say these words.
00:58:42.079 --> 00:58:48.719
What are your thoughts on when parents do say we're just gonna handle this in the family?
00:58:49.039 --> 00:58:50.639
Not able to have those thoughts on it.
00:58:51.920 --> 00:58:52.239
Okay.
00:58:53.840 --> 00:59:03.039
What about I can say my experience, I've heard parents say like we were just gonna handle this within the family, um, and our law enforcement is handling it.
00:59:03.360 --> 00:59:03.599
Right.
00:59:03.760 --> 00:59:07.679
In my experience, that's what I've I've heard in the cases that I've been a part of.
00:59:08.239 --> 00:59:10.320
Well, yeah, because it's already been brought to that point.
00:59:10.880 --> 00:59:23.280
But as far as like just statistically speaking, so I don't know statistically speaking, just because if law enforcement doesn't know about it, can they like can they do much research about it?
00:59:23.360 --> 00:59:36.239
It could be self-reported studies that these victims are coming forward and talking about yes, they were victimized, but it could be are they some of that 60% that's gonna say they were not victimized, or are they going to say that they were victimized and this is how it's handled?
00:59:37.039 --> 00:59:39.840
What's the statute of limitations for child sexual abuse?
00:59:40.159 --> 00:59:41.440
There is no statute now at this point.
00:59:41.599 --> 00:59:42.159
Oh good.
00:59:42.480 --> 00:59:45.440
I want to say it changed early 2000s.
00:59:45.599 --> 00:59:55.280
Um it before early 2000s, it was like if it was after 1980s, somewhere around there, that they could still prosecute.
00:59:55.440 --> 01:00:02.320
Now, after early 2000s, it's it can be prosecuted now, 15 years, it can be prosecuted.
01:00:02.719 --> 01:00:09.440
It just still blows my mind that there used to be one, like, oh, you better hurry up and say something, otherwise your opportunity is gonna disappear.
01:00:09.679 --> 01:00:15.199
Yeah, because like there's even cases like law enforcement will call me on and they will be like, Hey, can you help get them into therapy?
01:00:15.280 --> 01:00:17.440
Can you help get them X, Y, and Z resources?
01:00:17.519 --> 01:00:26.239
And I'll connect them with our advocates, and the advocates will get the referral sent over for the counseling services for them because they were still they're adults now, but they were children during this.
01:00:26.320 --> 01:00:31.519
So they'll still sometimes staff these cases with us to see what else we can kind of help with.
01:00:31.840 --> 01:00:36.559
Where do you think the biggest efficiency is in the system when it comes to child sexual abuse victims?
01:00:36.880 --> 01:00:38.320
Unlimited funds for our partners.
01:00:39.599 --> 01:00:52.719
They're run ragged, they're run thin all throughout the state, um, even outside of the state, of the manpower to make sure they want to investigate these cases as thoroughly as they can, and sometimes they don't have the resources to do it.
01:00:54.719 --> 01:00:59.199
I know that the shelters are always full, they're understaffed, they're underfunded.
01:01:00.639 --> 01:01:09.920
And we wonder why we have such a large population of moms that stay in abusive relationships and can't get out, right?
01:01:10.159 --> 01:01:11.199
They have nowhere to go.
01:01:11.280 --> 01:01:23.360
So, like, what's supposed to happen when you have a mom, three kids, the guy is financially supporting them, she doesn't have a way to support her three kids by herself, the shelters are all full.
01:01:23.599 --> 01:01:28.639
Like you're saying, if there was more funding available, then she would have the option to leave.
01:01:28.719 --> 01:01:34.239
And I think so much of that too goes back to like she's not there because she has to be, she's there because she wants to be.
01:01:35.039 --> 01:01:35.440
Right.
01:01:35.599 --> 01:01:38.159
Or she's has the ability to be there at this point, right?
01:01:38.320 --> 01:02:00.559
Because it could be that they were able to get they they didn't have a ride, they didn't have any way to get to a shelter or get to an appointment or get to counseling, but having the resources to be able to help get these kids to their counseling appointments, to their medical exams, to court prep, to these different things to like prep for the possibility of this child not having to face an offender in court.
01:02:01.920 --> 01:02:05.440
I can't imagine what that's like as a child having to face an offender in court.
01:02:06.800 --> 01:02:08.480
Just, oh my gosh.
01:02:10.000 --> 01:02:14.480
That just, oh my gosh, I can't even the amount of bravery that that would take for a kid.
01:02:14.639 --> 01:02:18.719
How do you prepare a child that's about to go into court against that person?
01:02:19.039 --> 01:02:24.239
So I've never actually prepared the kiddos since I typically after an interview, I don't have interactions with them again.
01:02:24.400 --> 01:02:28.159
Um, I typically see them at court and they'll come say hi to me and I'll ask them, like, hey, how's school?
01:02:28.239 --> 01:02:29.280
How's your basketball game?
01:02:29.360 --> 01:02:29.760
How's this?
01:02:29.840 --> 01:02:31.599
Like, oh my gosh, you've grown so tall now.
01:02:31.760 --> 01:02:37.280
But not asking them about the case, not talking about anything personal in the sense of clear to get brought up.
01:02:37.519 --> 01:02:38.960
Is it something we talked about in our interview?
01:02:39.119 --> 01:02:42.960
I don't want to bring any of that stuff up because we're not in that role at this point.
01:02:43.119 --> 01:02:45.440
Um, and that's not my job to follow up with you.
01:02:45.599 --> 01:02:51.199
That's our advocate's job and provide the resources and the the comfort and the understanding of the justice system.
01:02:51.760 --> 01:02:58.320
Um, so they we work with some really great prosecutors, though.
01:02:58.480 --> 01:03:01.280
Like they I've seen them in action.
01:03:01.519 --> 01:03:02.320
They are great.
01:03:02.480 --> 01:03:04.800
So we um, because we cover a few different counties.
01:03:04.880 --> 01:03:13.440
So we work with multiple district attorneys' offices, but consistently they will prepare with these kids as long as they need, as many times as they need, help them feel comfortable.
01:03:13.519 --> 01:03:17.440
I've seen them do walkthroughs of the courtroom before, um, even with our interviewers.
01:03:17.519 --> 01:03:20.880
If they're newer to testify, they're like, Do you want to go see the courtroom so you know where you'll be sitting?
01:03:21.039 --> 01:03:22.000
Do you know where the jury's at?
01:03:22.079 --> 01:03:23.360
So you can make sure to look at them.
01:03:23.519 --> 01:03:34.079
Um, so they're very patient and understanding of these children and these adults that are potentially testifying for the kid on this case, for them to understand.
01:03:34.880 --> 01:03:37.440
Like, not everybody's gonna react the same way on the stand.
01:03:37.519 --> 01:03:43.679
Like, meet this kid where they're at, um, ultimately knowing like this is something that it unfortunately has to happen.
01:03:44.159 --> 01:03:48.079
You keep saying that one little phrase, I want to hit that for a second.
01:03:48.320 --> 01:03:49.440
Meet them where they're at.
01:03:49.760 --> 01:03:53.360
That's a big one for me, just because of the staircase story I told you earlier.
01:03:53.519 --> 01:03:54.559
That's what she did.
01:03:54.719 --> 01:03:57.280
She met my dad where he was at and what he needed, right?
01:03:58.000 --> 01:04:02.960
Who, when you were a kid and you were going through something hard, who was it that met you where you were at?
01:04:03.679 --> 01:04:05.840
I would say both my parents, both of them equally.
01:04:06.000 --> 01:04:06.239
Yeah.
01:04:06.480 --> 01:04:14.079
I interviewed a man that had a life sentence in prison, and then tattoo artist who shot his mom's boyfriend, and like all these things.
01:04:14.239 --> 01:04:20.320
And you hear their stories and you go back to the beginning, and you're just like, well, you make sense, right?
01:04:20.480 --> 01:04:37.599
And then here you are, and you make so much sense because you're, you know, your your dad passes away, and then you find out about what happened to your father, and you're like, I'm not gonna let another kid experience what my dad experienced without somebody there to just let them talk about it.
01:04:38.480 --> 01:04:42.480
I guess because you're not emotional, like you said, like you're really good at compartmentalizing.
01:04:42.639 --> 01:04:47.360
I think naturally for me, my the hardest part for me would be like, I would want to like cross over an advocate role.
01:04:47.840 --> 01:04:49.199
How do you do that?
01:04:49.440 --> 01:05:00.320
Um, I can think of one interview in particular that not that it hit a nerve, but it connect, I connected more with this kid because we're sitting there, we're talking, and all of a sudden this kid just kind of breaks down crying, and I was like, What's wrong?
01:05:00.480 --> 01:05:01.280
What's wrong, buddy?
01:05:01.760 --> 01:05:03.519
I just want to know my dad's proud of me.
01:05:04.079 --> 01:05:06.880
And I had no idea that his father had passed away recently.
01:05:07.119 --> 01:05:10.079
So, like with that one, it's just like a hey, like, what do you mean by that?
01:05:10.159 --> 01:05:11.840
And he explained it to me, and I didn't know that.
01:05:12.000 --> 01:05:15.119
So, like, it struck that nerve of like I was young when it happened.
01:05:15.199 --> 01:05:17.599
So I was like, hey, buddy, I'm sure your dad's proud of you.
01:05:17.679 --> 01:05:39.920
That like was I stayed within my realm as an interviewer, but I was able to explain to this young, young child sitting there, I understand you're having this feeling, but I think for me, the advocate side, they are some special human beings and they deserve their pillow to be cold every night and the front row parking spot in the shade.
01:05:40.000 --> 01:05:40.880
They deserve all those things.
01:05:41.199 --> 01:05:45.760
As an interviewer, I'm in the limelight all the time because I get people get to watch what I do.
01:05:45.840 --> 01:05:54.000
They're behind the scenes to help keep these families going and their resources and connections and following up with them on their good days or bad days in between.
01:05:54.239 --> 01:06:04.719
And so as an interviewer, it's knowing like at the end of the The most important thing is I remain neutral and keep the space open for this kid.
01:06:04.880 --> 01:06:08.000
If I cross this boundary, there's no going back to that.
01:06:08.239 --> 01:06:10.400
So knowing like I have my job to do.
01:06:10.639 --> 01:06:14.559
If I if I'm not able to do my job, I should not be in that interview at that time.
01:06:14.719 --> 01:06:21.679
So if you had like a really hard case that you're like, I just, I can't, like, I can't do child fatality after child fatality.
01:06:21.840 --> 01:06:25.039
Like, I'm not gonna have my girls do a child fatality without me there.
01:06:25.360 --> 01:06:30.480
Because I want them to feel the support to be able to react afterwards if they need to.
01:06:30.719 --> 01:06:34.400
And knowing like for those two hours you're talking to that kid, nothing else matters.
01:06:34.480 --> 01:06:37.039
Whether it's personal, it's professional, nothing else matters.
01:06:37.280 --> 01:06:38.960
That kid is what's important in there.
01:06:39.119 --> 01:06:41.679
Because sometimes all you have is one chance with the kid.
01:06:43.119 --> 01:06:50.400
So when you say that you're doing these child fatalities, are you talking about interviewing the siblings who were present during this or something?
01:06:50.639 --> 01:06:50.960
It could be.
01:06:51.039 --> 01:06:52.320
It's just any child fatality.
01:06:52.400 --> 01:06:57.760
If there's, say, for instance, car accidents, medical deaths, potential homicides, whatever it might be.
01:06:57.920 --> 01:07:01.199
Um, like drownings, things like that.
01:07:01.280 --> 01:07:03.599
It's just more so for like supervision style stuff.
01:07:03.679 --> 01:07:06.320
Um, or it could be for like criminal charges.
01:07:06.480 --> 01:07:09.599
And so it's any of the surviving children's, whether they were there or not.
01:07:09.840 --> 01:07:11.760
Um, depending on the situation.
01:07:11.920 --> 01:07:18.639
Sometimes there is some absolute, like, there's some very, very clear documentation on certain things with medical stuff with kiddos.
01:07:18.960 --> 01:07:23.119
Um, and then it's a conversation with the partners that my team does.
01:07:23.440 --> 01:07:29.920
Is it beneficial for the kid to come in and talk about these things, or do y'all have enough information from documentation as of right now?
01:07:31.360 --> 01:07:38.880
How often do you have a parent that loses their shit in your in your office?
01:07:39.039 --> 01:07:39.440
Does that happen?
01:07:39.760 --> 01:07:40.960
Where's the wood to knock on?
01:07:41.039 --> 01:07:42.480
We have not had it in a while.
01:07:42.639 --> 01:07:42.960
Okay.
01:07:43.119 --> 01:07:46.480
A lot of the times it's the parents that want to be in the room with us while we're talking.
01:07:46.559 --> 01:07:48.719
Um, and so it's just educating them, like, I'm so sorry.
01:07:48.800 --> 01:07:57.440
And our protocol is you're not able to be in there, and our advocate is able to then go in later and explain to them this is the reason that we don't have parents in the interview room with us.
01:07:57.599 --> 01:08:02.079
It's the only other person that's allowed in that forensic interview room would be interpreters if we needed them.
01:08:02.239 --> 01:08:03.760
But otherwise, it's just me and the kid.
01:08:03.840 --> 01:08:05.519
And that's the hardest part with the parents.
01:08:05.760 --> 01:08:08.000
And how long does that interview typically last for?
01:08:08.239 --> 01:08:10.079
Girl, that oh, that can depend.
01:08:10.159 --> 01:08:14.880
I've walked in, I've had a kid respectfully and disrespectfully tell me, like, no, F you, I'm not talking.
01:08:14.960 --> 01:08:16.000
Like, that would have been valid.
01:08:16.399 --> 01:08:17.279
Like, valid, that's fine.
01:08:17.359 --> 01:08:18.079
Yeah, that would have been mean.
01:08:18.159 --> 01:08:20.079
And then I'll ask them, like, how come you don't want to talk?
01:08:20.239 --> 01:08:20.880
What's going on?
01:08:20.960 --> 01:08:23.279
To know, like, are there any coaching concerns for my team?
01:08:23.439 --> 01:08:28.560
Are there any concerns for, well, I don't want to talk to you today because I've got a sports game later today, and that's what I need to get to that.
01:08:28.640 --> 01:08:29.760
I can't miss too much school.
01:08:29.920 --> 01:08:31.359
Okay, we're meeting the kid where they're at.
01:08:31.439 --> 01:08:33.520
Of you want to pick a different day, that's cool.
01:08:33.760 --> 01:08:38.720
Um, I've talked to a kid for between two different days for like eight hours.
01:08:39.359 --> 01:08:45.920
So it it really just depends on what their situation is, what all they want to talk about, what all we need to talk about and discuss.
01:08:46.319 --> 01:08:47.359
It really varies.
01:08:47.439 --> 01:08:55.760
Typically, it's between like an hour and a half and two hours for older kiddos, or for kind of just depends because you might have a kid that gets in there and they're like, hey, no bullshit.
01:08:55.840 --> 01:08:57.680
Like, I don't, I don't care to get to know you.
01:08:57.760 --> 01:08:59.199
Like, let's just get into what I'm here for.
01:08:59.359 --> 01:08:59.680
Wow.
01:08:59.840 --> 01:09:00.640
Cool, let's do it.
01:09:00.720 --> 01:09:02.000
I'm that's fine with me.
01:09:02.159 --> 01:09:08.960
Or you have the kiddo that you need to sit there and you need to build a lot more rapport with them and or learn how they speak, learning if they have any speech delays.
01:09:09.119 --> 01:09:13.039
Are they echolalian and they're gonna repeat the last thing that you say for answers?
01:09:13.279 --> 01:09:14.479
Are they just shy?
01:09:14.720 --> 01:09:17.279
Do they are they do they need some time to warm up to you?
01:09:17.520 --> 01:09:19.520
Did you learn all of that kind of stuff in training?
01:09:19.680 --> 01:09:20.159
Yep.
01:09:20.640 --> 01:09:22.479
I want this training.
01:09:23.119 --> 01:09:27.520
Okay, talk to me about what what educational stuff, what was the path to get to do what you do today?
01:09:27.680 --> 01:09:29.359
Well, I have a bachelor's degree in psychology.
01:09:29.520 --> 01:09:30.000
Same check.
01:09:30.079 --> 01:09:31.840
I I have a bachelor's degree in criminal justice.
01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:32.159
Nice.
01:09:32.239 --> 01:09:33.119
You got two bachelor's?
01:09:33.279 --> 01:09:34.479
Like you just like double majored them?
01:09:34.560 --> 01:09:35.279
I double majored.
01:09:35.359 --> 01:09:38.079
I was an overachiever and did it three and a half years to get out of college.
01:09:38.159 --> 01:09:38.319
Yeah.
01:09:38.479 --> 01:09:40.159
And then I went in to get my master's.
01:09:40.239 --> 01:09:43.119
So I have a master's in criminology in Florida State.
01:09:43.279 --> 01:09:45.520
And then I worked at MHED for a few years.
01:09:45.600 --> 01:09:49.760
I did MCOT for a while, and that was where you did all like the homicidal, suicidal, psychotic.
01:09:50.159 --> 01:09:55.119
Worked with a lot of really great psychiatrists that helped me understand, like, and even our ER staff.
01:09:55.199 --> 01:09:56.399
I still work with some of them now.
01:09:56.560 --> 01:10:06.159
So, like, we're just learned a lot from MHD with the clients, with the other coworkers of knowing where my resources are, what can I ask?
01:10:06.239 --> 01:10:06.880
What can't I ask?
01:10:06.960 --> 01:10:12.800
And that's where I really learned to start interviewing people because of having to talk to them about like I can't go up to you and be like, Are you psychotic?
01:10:13.039 --> 01:10:14.800
Because you might be like, What's that mean?
01:10:14.880 --> 01:10:15.680
Or whatnot.
01:10:15.920 --> 01:10:17.439
Well, I'm not gonna ask you, are you homicidal?
01:10:17.520 --> 01:10:18.640
Because then maybe you'll attack me.
01:10:18.800 --> 01:10:21.760
I gotta figure out a different way to ask these questions to gather the information.
01:10:22.000 --> 01:10:23.119
So did that for a while.
01:10:23.199 --> 01:10:24.720
And then I ended up finding this job.
01:10:24.800 --> 01:10:28.880
And then I started off as an interviewer and an advocate to where I was doing interviews and working with a student.
01:10:29.199 --> 01:10:30.239
So you can do both.
01:10:30.479 --> 01:10:31.359
So I was.
01:10:31.840 --> 01:10:32.800
We have roles.
01:10:32.880 --> 01:10:35.760
So we have our forensic specialist and our family specialist.
01:10:35.840 --> 01:10:39.520
So we're dual role, but you will never be like both roles on the same case.
01:10:39.760 --> 01:10:40.640
Oh, that makes sense.
01:10:40.800 --> 01:10:48.640
So um, but if we need like, hey, I need my bilingual advocate, but I need a Spanish-speaking interviewer, we can move people around.
01:10:48.720 --> 01:10:57.359
Or we have the luxury of we have multiple bilingual folks at our agency, which is absolutely incredible because you don't have to pay for translation services or interpreter services.
01:10:57.439 --> 01:10:58.880
It's ugh, they're a godsend.
01:10:59.359 --> 01:11:09.840
Um, so go through all of our different block trainings for CAC Texas where they teach you about interviewing and the reason we ask questions the way we do of don't ever ask anybody why, um, because that sounds accusatory.
01:11:10.000 --> 01:11:11.199
Ask somebody how come that happened.
01:11:11.439 --> 01:11:15.920
Sounds a lot more inviting of why did you wear those shoes today versus how come you wore those shoes today?
01:11:16.079 --> 01:11:17.920
It's a whole different tone to it.
01:11:18.159 --> 01:11:23.199
Went through a lot of different training, just a lot, a lot, a lot of training over the years.
01:11:23.359 --> 01:11:25.760
My CV is like five plus pages long.
01:11:26.000 --> 01:11:26.880
I like the challenges.
01:11:26.960 --> 01:11:35.600
I'm training in a different modality also to be able to know like a different national modality of how do they do it versus how does Texas do it and similar to it.
01:11:35.760 --> 01:11:42.960
And then I ended up about two years ago, I ended up getting on our membership agency, CAC Texas faculty.
01:11:43.039 --> 01:11:59.039
So I would help review um forensic interviews with like the people in training and help them while they're doing their mock interviews because that is terrifying of you're like, am I following the process, but I have to ask questions and gather details, and it's you're you're a baby interviewer, you have no idea what you're doing at this point, and you're like, I'm gonna do it.
01:11:59.119 --> 01:12:04.399
But then seeing their growth from block one to block two, and they were showing their interviews, you're like, girl, you did the thing.
01:12:04.479 --> 01:12:05.439
I told you you could do it.
01:12:05.520 --> 01:12:08.720
And then learning how to prep for court, going to outside trainings.
01:12:08.960 --> 01:12:11.760
So now I actually teach forensic interviewing.
01:12:12.000 --> 01:12:12.640
New people coming in.
01:12:12.720 --> 01:12:13.840
So it's like a full circle moment.
01:12:14.000 --> 01:12:17.600
So now some of the people I work with on faculty, they actually trained me.
01:12:17.760 --> 01:12:24.000
So it's nice to like come full circle with where I started, where I'm at, and just like the like I love interviewing.
01:12:24.079 --> 01:12:28.479
I will talk about it's flying blue in the face because of how different it is and how exciting.
01:12:28.720 --> 01:12:32.479
Not every interview is the same way, and it probably is not gonna go how you think it might go.
01:12:33.119 --> 01:12:41.680
How do you separate yourself from like when you know you're having a conversation with a child and like like intuitively, like I said, you know something has happened?
01:12:41.760 --> 01:12:48.640
How do you separate yourself to the point of not not only not asking leading questions?
01:12:48.800 --> 01:12:58.960
I know you can't ask any type of leading question, but not making any type of predetermined thought, even in your own head, that something did or didn't happen this way or that way.
01:12:59.119 --> 01:13:00.720
Like, how do you separate yourself from that?
01:13:00.880 --> 01:13:06.479
A lot of training because you don't want to have any kind of implicit bias that I'm only gonna ask you questions about this one thing.
01:13:06.640 --> 01:13:14.560
There always needs to be an alternative hypothesis because there's potentially something that happened with more than one person or it didn't happen the way that you think it did.
01:13:14.800 --> 01:13:19.680
So the best way that I do it with my head is that kind of picture it like a movie clip in your head.
01:13:19.840 --> 01:13:24.399
Like a kid's telling you about a narrative and you're starting back at the beginning and you're trying to walk yourself through it.
01:13:24.479 --> 01:13:26.479
So you get this whole video clip in your head.
01:13:26.560 --> 01:13:29.439
And if there's a gap, well, that's the information I need to gather.
01:13:29.680 --> 01:13:30.479
Fascinating.
01:13:30.720 --> 01:13:31.359
Yeah.
01:13:31.920 --> 01:13:36.560
Can you take these classes without like being in the field?
01:13:36.800 --> 01:13:43.279
Because I just, I'm so I love the whole interviewing and understanding human behavior stuff.
01:13:43.520 --> 01:13:43.920
I love it.
01:13:44.000 --> 01:13:48.640
And then it's also like with developmental status of kids, you're not gonna talk to the four-year-old like you do the eight-year-old.
01:13:48.720 --> 01:13:48.800
Right.
01:13:48.880 --> 01:13:51.279
You're not gonna talk to an eight-year-old the same way you do an 11-year-old.
01:13:51.439 --> 01:13:57.199
But similarly, I've talked to a three-year-old the same way I've talked to an eight-year-old before because they were so advanced developmentally.
01:13:57.439 --> 01:14:02.880
It depends on their school, their family, their communication style, like any, any of those things.
01:14:03.199 --> 01:14:08.479
So that's why I truly enjoy my job because every kid is different.
01:14:08.720 --> 01:14:12.880
Like, it's not a cookie cutter case ever.
01:14:13.199 --> 01:14:14.640
Like it's every day.
01:14:14.720 --> 01:14:16.159
Yeah, every day you walk into something new.
01:14:16.319 --> 01:14:19.680
And like kids teach me about so much stuff, and like I hate it now that I'm getting older.
01:14:19.760 --> 01:14:21.439
They're like, oh yeah, listen to throwback music.
01:14:21.680 --> 01:14:22.479
Yeah, tell me about it.
01:14:22.640 --> 01:14:23.680
Oh, like little weight.
01:14:23.840 --> 01:14:26.239
I'm like, don't you dare say you use throwback at this time.
01:14:26.319 --> 01:14:27.520
And they're like, Yeah, tea pain.
01:14:27.680 --> 01:14:29.920
I'm like, ha ha ha ha, these are frightened words, kids.
01:14:30.000 --> 01:14:33.840
But like learning different things of what interests these kids now, what are they into?
01:14:34.640 --> 01:14:43.279
And they're like, they love to explain those things and talk about themselves in that sense of like they're the experts in their lives, let them be the experts in their lives.
01:14:43.439 --> 01:14:56.239
When parents start becoming curious and they think that they know their child better than their child knows themselves, it causes that child a lot of times to not trust themselves and then eventually resent their parent for thinking that they know them better.
01:14:56.319 --> 01:14:59.039
And it's like we have to let them be the author of their own life.
01:14:59.199 --> 01:14:59.680
Yeah.
01:15:00.000 --> 01:15:02.239
Only you know why you do things.
01:15:02.399 --> 01:15:03.600
I don't know why you do things.
01:15:03.680 --> 01:15:06.159
I could have my assumptions, but who is that serving?
01:15:06.560 --> 01:15:07.199
I want to know from you.
01:15:07.279 --> 01:15:08.159
I want to become curious.
01:15:08.239 --> 01:15:10.560
I want to understand like why do you do what you do?
01:15:10.720 --> 01:15:13.680
Because there could be five different reasons why you have the same behavior that I do.
01:15:13.760 --> 01:15:14.960
It'd be completely different.
01:15:15.359 --> 01:15:20.159
You know, it doesn't make it the same motivation and an internal reality, just the same behavior.
01:15:20.319 --> 01:15:20.720
Yes.
01:15:20.880 --> 01:15:22.640
That's why I'm fascinated with human behavior.
01:15:23.119 --> 01:15:23.840
Love it, you know.
01:15:24.000 --> 01:15:26.560
So, like, how come?
01:15:27.199 --> 01:15:27.760
How come?
01:15:28.239 --> 01:15:28.479
How come?
01:15:28.640 --> 01:15:31.199
Yeah, no, if you start telling people, tell me more about it, talk to me about it.
01:15:31.359 --> 01:15:37.439
Like an open-ended narrative allows people to explain more of their situation, their story, their whatever they want to talk about, their day.
01:15:37.600 --> 01:15:38.640
Tell me about your day at school.
01:15:38.800 --> 01:15:39.439
Oh, it's good.
01:15:39.600 --> 01:15:40.720
Tell me everything you did.
01:15:41.039 --> 01:15:44.800
What's the number one rule when you're speaking to a child or an adult?
01:15:44.880 --> 01:15:46.159
It doesn't have to be a child.
01:15:46.399 --> 01:15:54.960
Speaking to somebody, and say you want to make sure that you don't say something in this conversation that's going to like automatically shut them down.
01:15:55.039 --> 01:15:57.039
Like, like you're saying, open-ended questions, right?
01:15:57.199 --> 01:16:02.079
How do you keep in the back of your mind to keep it open-ended without it like drawing a closure?
01:16:02.479 --> 01:16:05.119
So the biggest one is like, oh, tell me about that.
01:16:05.359 --> 01:16:12.880
Or if like if they have a differing opinion than you, that can happen a lot during meetings, or it can happen during with your kids, with your spouse.
01:16:12.960 --> 01:16:15.840
It's like, tell me the reason you're thinking that.
01:16:16.000 --> 01:16:18.239
Or tell me, tell me how come you feel that way.
01:16:18.399 --> 01:16:23.199
Because then it opens up that I want to understand you before I give you my opinion and my thoughts on it.
01:16:23.279 --> 01:16:31.600
Because that might change my opinions and my thoughts if you're like, well, I did this because tell me, tell me the reason you left the clothes in the washer.
01:16:31.760 --> 01:16:38.960
Well, because I got distracted, because then I started doing the kids and I left it in the washer, or I was doing the dishes and then da-da-da, and I forgot to come back and do it.
01:16:39.199 --> 01:16:41.680
That's different than me thinking you're just lazy, you didn't do it.
01:16:41.840 --> 01:16:42.319
Totally.
01:16:42.560 --> 01:16:46.000
So it just helps you understand more of the narrative behind situations.
01:16:46.239 --> 01:16:49.199
Well, I think it gives you more empathy and compassion too, right?
01:16:49.279 --> 01:16:59.119
Because if you're just assuming, oh, well, maybe he's being passive aggressive because I didn't make his coffee this morning, so he didn't want to go transfer the laundry for me like I asked him to, and then you come at him with an attitude about it.
01:16:59.279 --> 01:17:01.359
He's like, nah, dude, I just completely forgot.
01:17:01.439 --> 01:17:01.600
Right.
01:17:02.479 --> 01:17:04.960
Everybody's so different of like, I overthink things.
01:17:05.119 --> 01:17:10.319
My husband, not that he under thinks it, but like sometimes I'm like, dude, read the room, like, what?
01:17:10.720 --> 01:17:12.000
Or he's like, why don't you sit down?
01:17:12.079 --> 01:17:16.000
I'm like, because this needs to be done, this, this, this, this, this, and like, if I'll sit down after that.
01:17:16.159 --> 01:17:17.520
And he's like sitting down already.
01:17:17.680 --> 01:17:18.800
I'm like, okay, whatever.
01:17:18.880 --> 01:17:20.560
It'll be faster if I do it myself.
01:17:20.800 --> 01:17:21.119
Uh-huh.
01:17:21.439 --> 01:17:25.600
Have you always been the type of person that needs to do it themselves in order to make sure they get stubb?
01:17:25.840 --> 01:17:30.079
I'm trying not to be because I need to do better about delegating things, especially.
01:17:30.159 --> 01:17:36.960
I think having kids has really taught me that because my kids want to help so much, and kids love feeling like they're helping you.
01:17:37.119 --> 01:17:40.159
So I'm like, yeah, you can help me put the dishes away.
01:17:40.319 --> 01:17:41.920
It takes me 20 minutes longer.
01:17:42.079 --> 01:17:44.239
Yeah, I would love your help to fold these towels.
01:17:44.399 --> 01:17:46.239
I'm gonna have to refold before I put them away.
01:17:46.399 --> 01:17:46.640
100%.
01:17:46.960 --> 01:17:47.760
I'd love your help.
01:17:47.920 --> 01:17:50.640
But it's making them feel important and then feel included.
01:17:50.960 --> 01:17:53.600
They're narrating their learning experience also.
01:17:53.840 --> 01:17:54.239
Totally.
01:17:54.399 --> 01:17:57.920
And making them just feel like they're a part of it instead of you taking that from them.
01:17:58.079 --> 01:18:00.640
Because if you just do everything for them all the time, they never learn.
01:18:00.720 --> 01:18:00.960
Yeah.
01:18:01.039 --> 01:18:01.279
Right?
01:18:01.359 --> 01:18:02.319
They have to learn at some point.
01:18:02.479 --> 01:18:06.239
Well, and I think now, like my five-year-old, she loves to make her bed.
01:18:06.479 --> 01:18:10.159
Because I taught her, I was like, hey, we turn our clothes right side out when you put them in the laundry basket.
01:18:10.319 --> 01:18:11.760
We make our bed every morning.
01:18:12.000 --> 01:18:15.920
So now she'll wake up the morning, she straightens out her bed, puts all of her stuffed animals there, and she goes, I made my bed.
01:18:16.000 --> 01:18:17.119
Oh thanks, babe.
01:18:17.279 --> 01:18:18.000
Oh, I got a good question.
01:18:18.560 --> 01:18:19.359
I love good questions.
01:18:19.600 --> 01:18:30.239
Oh how do you listen to understand instead of listen to respond in a conversation with your child?
01:18:31.119 --> 01:18:32.399
That's a hard one.
01:18:33.279 --> 01:18:40.800
So personally, when it's my personal kids, I'm listening, like take a deep breath before you react.
01:18:40.880 --> 01:18:44.560
I'm learning that one still of like something frustrates you, don't react to that.
01:18:45.119 --> 01:18:47.199
Take a deep breath before you go through anything.
01:18:47.680 --> 01:18:48.399
Open narrative.
01:18:48.960 --> 01:18:49.600
Tell me about it.
01:18:50.159 --> 01:18:51.840
How come you're having big emotions right now?
01:18:52.399 --> 01:18:54.319
What's making you feel this way right now?
01:18:54.880 --> 01:18:58.479
Because then it's like making them of like, well, I just want you.
01:18:58.560 --> 01:19:00.239
Okay, what about me do you want?
01:19:00.479 --> 01:19:01.359
What's going on?
01:19:01.520 --> 01:19:03.199
How come you're feeling this way right now?
01:19:03.520 --> 01:19:10.159
Slowing them down with that open narrative is really helping with the free response for the kids.
01:19:10.479 --> 01:19:13.199
Now, how about when you're in an interview Tory?
01:19:13.760 --> 01:19:14.479
Interview Tory.
01:19:14.960 --> 01:19:18.159
So when I'm like if you're the kid, I'm sitting there and I'm talking to you.
01:19:18.239 --> 01:19:23.119
Like, I'm looking at you, I'm engaging with you, but in my brain, I'm picturing everything you're explaining.
01:19:23.279 --> 01:19:33.920
So you don't have enough time to like feel what they're telling you in the sense of like you're not feeling, I'm not gonna feel any shame, guilt, blame, any of those things with these kids.
01:19:34.079 --> 01:19:40.319
I'm understanding the information you're presenting to me, and I've got five different things that I'm thinking I could ask you, depending on how you answer this question.
01:19:40.479 --> 01:19:44.720
And trying to remember, okay, sticky note that question for later, sticky note that question for you later.
01:19:44.960 --> 01:19:49.359
You mentioned this, I need to circle back to that in the correct time within the sequence of events.
01:19:49.520 --> 01:19:54.319
So like you're so busy mentally while you're sitting in that room, you're like, what have I missed?
01:19:54.560 --> 01:20:03.439
So, like sometimes walking out of like a two-hour interview, you are absolutely exhausted because there's so much thought that goes into I need this information, how do I ask the question?
01:20:03.520 --> 01:20:10.000
How do I get to that topic to be able to ask that information instead of being like, hey, so I see that you're wearing a mic, tell me about it.
01:20:10.239 --> 01:20:11.359
We can do that, yeah.
01:20:11.439 --> 01:20:12.800
But then it's like I'm attacked, right?
01:20:13.039 --> 01:20:13.920
What's a better way of doing that?
01:20:14.079 --> 01:20:17.760
Like, yeah, tell me about making videos, tell me about do this, tell me about the videos.
01:20:18.479 --> 01:20:18.720
Wow.
01:20:18.960 --> 01:20:24.800
So it's it's a mental game to have to like make it a very fluid conversation as much as we can with kids.
01:20:25.039 --> 01:20:31.760
Um so it's being aware of how could they answer these questions?
01:20:31.920 --> 01:20:35.119
Could could I ask them like, oh, can you tell me about this?
01:20:35.840 --> 01:20:36.159
No.
01:20:37.760 --> 01:20:38.079
Okay.
01:20:38.479 --> 01:20:42.880
Because I asked a can you question, so that's like an inviting response versus, hey, tell me about this.
01:20:44.079 --> 01:20:47.840
And what if you have a highly autonomous child that's like, don't tell me what to do, bitch.
01:20:47.920 --> 01:20:48.399
Now what?
01:20:48.560 --> 01:20:51.840
So I've had to be like, just ask me the questions you want to ask me.
01:20:51.920 --> 01:20:53.840
And I'm like, well, I can't do that.
01:20:54.159 --> 01:20:58.319
And so then I'll explain to them typically with the kiddos like that that are a little spicy with teenage.
01:20:59.119 --> 01:21:01.840
I love them because there's they're misunderstood sometimes.
01:21:02.159 --> 01:21:03.039
I'm so lowly.
01:21:03.119 --> 01:21:03.279
Yeah.
01:21:03.439 --> 01:21:04.800
They're like, this kid is so disrespectful.
01:21:04.960 --> 01:21:05.439
And I'm like, no.
01:21:06.000 --> 01:21:08.479
This child wants to be able to have their own voice and their own things.
01:21:08.640 --> 01:21:10.640
Like, you can have whatever you want in this room.
01:21:10.720 --> 01:21:11.119
That's okay.
01:21:11.199 --> 01:21:11.279
Yeah.
01:21:11.840 --> 01:21:12.319
You want to act.
01:21:12.640 --> 01:21:14.399
If you want to have an attitude, have an attitude.
01:21:14.479 --> 01:21:15.359
Just be respectful of me.
01:21:15.439 --> 01:21:15.840
I don't care.
01:21:15.920 --> 01:21:16.159
Yeah.
01:21:16.399 --> 01:21:20.399
Um, so I just then I go into it with kids, like, this is the reason I ask so many questions.
01:21:20.479 --> 01:21:24.720
This is the way I ask the questions, and this is how come like we're doing this right now.
01:21:24.880 --> 01:21:27.119
If you don't want to do this, the door's right there.
01:21:27.279 --> 01:21:27.680
That's okay.
01:21:27.840 --> 01:21:28.880
You do not have to talk to me at all.
01:21:29.039 --> 01:21:30.319
And then now all of a sudden they want to talk.
01:21:30.560 --> 01:21:33.279
So sometimes, yeah, sometimes kids are like, I'm just done for the day.
01:21:33.439 --> 01:21:33.760
Cool.
01:21:34.000 --> 01:21:36.800
You tell your parent when you're ready to come back and you come back and talk to me.
01:21:36.880 --> 01:21:39.359
Or they're like, Yeah, this is BSML.
01:21:39.680 --> 01:21:39.920
Cool.
01:21:40.479 --> 01:21:41.359
That's fine.
01:21:41.760 --> 01:21:45.520
Or the kids are just crying by the end of it, and they're like, Thank you so much for like being patient.
01:21:46.079 --> 01:21:46.399
Absolutely.
01:21:46.479 --> 01:21:47.760
Is there anything else we should talk about?
01:21:49.279 --> 01:21:49.920
Wow.
01:21:51.439 --> 01:21:52.079
All right.
01:21:52.800 --> 01:21:53.840
Last question.
01:21:54.000 --> 01:21:54.720
I love it.
01:22:02.159 --> 01:22:03.920
Are you thinking about how to say it correctly?
01:22:04.159 --> 01:22:04.640
I am.
01:22:05.119 --> 01:22:08.319
Look at you over there observing an interviewer.
01:22:08.560 --> 01:22:12.880
I'm trying to like put all my thoughts into that question the right way.
01:22:13.199 --> 01:22:23.039
I want to know if your dad was still alive, if he's standing here right now and you had 60 seconds to tell him what you're doing.
01:22:23.439 --> 01:22:24.960
What would you say to him?
01:22:27.840 --> 01:22:29.840
Honestly, I don't think I'd talk to him about work.
01:22:30.319 --> 01:22:30.560
Really?
01:22:31.600 --> 01:22:32.399
Tell him about my kids.
01:22:32.800 --> 01:22:34.960
Tell him about my cows, my husband.
01:22:35.680 --> 01:22:38.479
Um I don't talk about work.
01:22:38.960 --> 01:22:47.920
I don't Honestly, I'd probably spend some of that time playing music for him because he always loved to do like the embarrassing dad dances.
01:22:48.399 --> 01:22:49.760
Like just saying that one more time.
01:22:50.239 --> 01:22:50.560
Yeah.
01:22:50.800 --> 01:22:51.199
Yep.
01:22:53.439 --> 01:22:57.439
What do you think he would say if he knew what you ended up doing for a living?
01:22:57.760 --> 01:22:58.880
Oh, he'd tell me he's proud.
01:22:59.760 --> 01:23:00.319
Absolutely.
01:23:00.560 --> 01:23:06.800
My mom tells me all the time, she always talks about how proud he would be of what I'm doing and how proud she is of what I'm doing.
01:23:07.359 --> 01:23:10.159
And like it's and in my head, I'm like, it's my job.
01:23:10.319 --> 01:23:11.920
Like it's nothing less.
01:23:12.159 --> 01:23:15.439
Like that's kind of the expectation, the threshold of I'm gonna do it no matter what.
01:23:16.479 --> 01:23:17.439
I think he'd be proud of it.
01:23:18.000 --> 01:23:19.760
I think he'd be beyond proud.
01:23:20.560 --> 01:23:23.119
I think he would just be like, That's my girl.
01:23:23.760 --> 01:23:24.159
Yeah.
01:23:24.399 --> 01:23:43.359
I think he would be team Tory all the way, and I think he would be honored to know that his little girl, because of something that happened to him, became that adult that he would have needed.
01:23:44.399 --> 01:23:45.680
Like that's legacy.
01:23:46.159 --> 01:23:47.279
You created the legacy.
01:23:47.359 --> 01:23:48.560
Do you realize that?
01:23:49.680 --> 01:23:52.640
I'm not big on like the self-acknowledgement.
01:23:53.359 --> 01:23:54.079
Just saying.
01:23:54.720 --> 01:23:57.520
No, I just let be able to tell him like I'm proud of you.
01:23:57.920 --> 01:23:59.760
No hard feelings, nothing.
01:24:00.960 --> 01:24:01.840
Okay, one more question.
01:24:01.920 --> 01:24:02.560
I said that was the last one.
01:24:02.640 --> 01:24:03.039
It's not gonna be a good thing.
01:24:03.199 --> 01:24:04.479
It's okay, it happens all the time in the interviews.
01:24:04.560 --> 01:24:05.359
You remember different stuff.
01:24:05.520 --> 01:24:07.840
Catching up on little nuggets that were dropped earlier.
01:24:08.000 --> 01:24:09.279
Yeah, it happens.
01:24:10.079 --> 01:24:11.439
You said that you were not emotional.
01:24:11.600 --> 01:24:12.880
Have you always been that way?
01:24:14.399 --> 01:24:16.640
Um, I would say yes.
01:24:16.880 --> 01:24:22.159
It's gotten a I don't want to say it's gotten a lot more noticeable since doing this job.
01:24:22.720 --> 01:24:25.359
Because of like, I'll joke to my husband sometimes.
01:24:25.439 --> 01:24:27.520
I'm like, do you want interviewer Tory or do you want wife Tory?
01:24:27.680 --> 01:24:28.720
Which one do you want right now?
01:24:28.800 --> 01:24:34.239
Because do you need me to hear out the entire situation or do you need my my thoughts and opinions on this?
01:24:34.479 --> 01:24:36.399
And he's like, I don't want interviewer Tory.
01:24:36.640 --> 01:24:37.279
Stop talking.
01:24:37.600 --> 01:24:37.920
Okay.
01:24:38.239 --> 01:24:39.199
I can't control that.
01:24:39.439 --> 01:24:49.920
But it definitely impacts if somebody comes to me with something personal, like I'm not gonna, like, if you're if you start crying, I automatically go into interview mode, like, okay, talk to me about it.
01:24:50.000 --> 01:24:50.560
Like, what's going on?
01:24:50.640 --> 01:24:53.119
Tell me about your emotions, how can I help this situation?
01:24:54.640 --> 01:25:00.239
The laughter, I've always been like big personality with laughing and joking, those are the emotions you're gonna see.
01:25:00.399 --> 01:25:06.239
You're not gonna see the sadness, the like defeat, the different things.
01:25:06.560 --> 01:25:07.760
Like, that doesn't define me.
01:25:08.479 --> 01:25:09.039
Why?
01:25:10.000 --> 01:25:10.880
How come?
01:25:11.520 --> 01:25:12.800
Great question.
01:25:13.279 --> 01:25:18.720
So, in my head, like there is so much shit that's in this world.
01:25:19.279 --> 01:25:20.800
I don't want to let that define me.
01:25:20.960 --> 01:25:28.720
I want to be happy, I want to enjoy life, I want to enjoy the people I'm around and be a person that when somebody walks in the room, hey, how was your vacation?
01:25:28.880 --> 01:25:29.359
How is this?
01:25:29.439 --> 01:25:31.039
Not because I'm nosy and I'm annoying.
01:25:31.119 --> 01:25:32.319
Sometimes it's because of those things.
01:25:32.479 --> 01:25:33.600
Girl, don't even lie right now.
01:25:34.079 --> 01:25:35.279
Sometimes it's because of those things.
01:25:35.359 --> 01:25:35.600
Yes.
01:25:35.760 --> 01:25:37.199
But it's because I want you to feel special.
01:25:37.359 --> 01:25:38.159
I want you to feel important.
01:25:38.239 --> 01:25:40.880
I don't want you to walk in and be like, oh, Tori's in a mood today.
01:25:41.039 --> 01:25:41.279
Yeah.
01:25:41.439 --> 01:25:44.720
Like, I want you to be like, I walked into Cap and like she's just friendly.
01:25:44.960 --> 01:25:45.600
Yeah.
01:25:46.079 --> 01:25:46.960
Can I get your snap?
01:25:47.039 --> 01:25:47.199
Drink.
01:25:47.279 --> 01:25:47.680
They're right there.
01:25:47.760 --> 01:25:48.239
What's going on?
01:25:48.399 --> 01:25:50.079
That's special and important thing.
01:25:50.239 --> 01:25:53.039
So many people just want to feel special and important.
01:25:53.279 --> 01:25:55.840
And that's exactly like what I live by.
01:25:56.000 --> 01:26:00.640
Is I want everybody in every interaction with me to walk away feeling special and important.
01:26:00.960 --> 01:26:01.439
Always.
01:26:01.600 --> 01:26:04.960
I don't ever want to be the person that makes you second guess who you are.
01:26:05.039 --> 01:26:05.279
Yep.
01:26:05.439 --> 01:26:09.199
Or that if you're okay, I want you to feel safe with me.
01:26:09.279 --> 01:26:14.079
And and I every day I'm trying to be better at making sure that people feel safe with me.
01:26:14.159 --> 01:26:20.399
And I know there's been so many times where I was not that person for somebody, even my own children.
01:26:20.640 --> 01:26:22.640
I made a lot of very questionable decisions.
01:26:22.720 --> 01:26:24.079
I was a very young mom.
01:26:24.239 --> 01:26:28.239
I was a mom that married some very questionable people.
01:26:28.399 --> 01:26:30.640
Luckily, nothing bad ever happened to my children.
01:26:30.720 --> 01:26:34.880
And I feel like I'm so lucky that nothing happened like that to my kids.
01:26:35.119 --> 01:26:38.800
Because I definitely put them in situations where it very well could have.
01:26:38.960 --> 01:26:46.880
I know that lots of times moms get with these guys and they repeat that pattern over and over again.
01:26:46.960 --> 01:26:52.319
And next thing you know, there's a child being molested in the home, or like it's just, oh my gosh.
01:26:52.479 --> 01:26:55.039
And I could tell you as a young mom, I had no idea those statistics.
01:26:55.439 --> 01:26:56.479
I had no idea.
01:26:56.720 --> 01:26:58.079
It's not what you're thinking about as a mother.
01:26:58.159 --> 01:27:00.239
You're thinking that this person loves me, loves my kids.
01:27:00.399 --> 01:27:02.560
They they want to have those connections.
01:27:02.720 --> 01:27:08.960
And it's not putting the blame on the parents because as a parent, you're doing the best that you can with what you're given and what what you have.
01:27:09.199 --> 01:27:09.840
Right.
01:27:10.479 --> 01:27:15.520
And unfortunately, sometimes your best still creates negative impact and you have to own it.
01:27:15.920 --> 01:27:17.840
You can't just be like, oh, well, it was my best.
01:27:17.920 --> 01:27:19.680
So I don't have to take any accountability.
01:27:19.840 --> 01:27:22.960
I did do my best, but honestly, I probably still could have done better.
01:27:23.439 --> 01:27:28.560
And not only could I have done better, but my best still caused a bunch of trauma for my kids.
01:27:28.800 --> 01:27:32.079
My decisions still caused a bunch of trauma for my kids.
01:27:32.239 --> 01:27:34.319
And a lot of the times I was being very selfish.
01:27:34.800 --> 01:27:42.800
A lot of the times I was way too worried about me feeling loved and not wanting to put my kids in daycare and having to go get a job.
01:27:42.880 --> 01:27:45.119
So for me, it was like, oh, well, you know this.
01:27:45.279 --> 01:27:51.520
And I realized that because when I started making my own money, that's when I had the I don't have to be here anymore.
01:27:51.680 --> 01:27:51.840
Yeah.
01:27:52.000 --> 01:27:53.199
And that's when I left.
01:27:53.439 --> 01:27:59.600
And so that's a feeling that I want for every mom that's in a domestic violence situation of you don't have to.
01:28:00.159 --> 01:28:03.279
Be there because there are resources that can help you out of this.
01:28:03.439 --> 01:28:09.439
And without funding those resources, like you were talking about, those moms are trapped and they have nowhere to go.
01:28:09.600 --> 01:28:16.960
And they have to decide between do I put up with this abuse or do I and have a roof over my kids' head and food in their bellies?
01:28:17.279 --> 01:28:20.640
Or do I leave and end up homeless in a vehicle with my children?
01:28:20.720 --> 01:28:23.119
And then DFPS comes in and takes away my children.
01:28:23.199 --> 01:28:25.600
And then now we're separated and they have even more trauma.
01:28:25.760 --> 01:28:26.000
Yep.
01:28:26.159 --> 01:28:30.239
And then lots of times, unfortunately, I've seen this happen a bunch.
01:28:30.880 --> 01:28:38.880
Domestic violence situation happens, kids end up being removed because they witnessed the domestic violence and mom is only staying for that reason.
01:28:39.279 --> 01:28:43.920
The hardest thing that a parent or that a domestic violence survivor can do is make the decision to leave.
01:28:44.079 --> 01:28:44.560
It's hard.
01:28:44.720 --> 01:28:46.079
It's the hardest decision they can make.
01:28:46.159 --> 01:28:48.720
And then it comes to do they have the resources to do it now.
01:28:48.880 --> 01:28:49.039
Yeah.
01:28:49.199 --> 01:28:53.119
Because when they make that decision, that's a time critical thought.
01:28:53.520 --> 01:28:56.399
Because if something changes, that thought could change.
01:28:56.640 --> 01:28:59.199
I feel like that's where our biggest hole is in our system.
01:28:59.840 --> 01:29:16.960
I feel like I feel like so much of the problem and issue that we have in our society, again on my soapbox for a second, is that single moms don't have enough support for when and not financially.
01:29:17.119 --> 01:29:26.880
And so when we have all of these single moms, you look at statistics on single moms and domestic violence and kids that are growing up in poverty and like all of these things.
01:29:27.199 --> 01:29:28.720
I'm just going, hello.
01:29:28.960 --> 01:29:37.840
Like we know where the problems are starting, but why aren't we putting our money where our mouth is and fixing it at the why aren't we going to the leak?
01:29:38.000 --> 01:29:41.680
Why are we just like getting towels and cleaning up the water on top?
01:29:41.840 --> 01:29:43.600
Like, where's the leak in the pipe?
01:29:43.760 --> 01:29:45.439
Can we please solve that problem?
01:29:45.840 --> 01:29:49.920
Because so many people are just drowning and it's not, it's not okay.
01:29:50.079 --> 01:29:56.720
And then what happens to those kids when they grow up while they're sitting here talking to me about how they shot their mom's boyfriend?
01:29:56.800 --> 01:29:57.039
Yeah.
01:29:57.279 --> 01:29:58.960
Or how they did a life sentence.
01:29:59.119 --> 01:30:01.439
Because what was the thing that they saw in the home?
01:30:01.600 --> 01:30:05.279
They witnessed violence, they were sexually abused.
01:30:05.760 --> 01:30:15.039
It's the same story, it seems like different characters in the story, little bits of different here and there, but that seems to be a common denominator in a lot of these stories.
01:30:15.279 --> 01:30:17.520
It's different adverse childhood experiences, absolutely.
01:30:17.680 --> 01:30:17.920
Yeah.
01:30:18.000 --> 01:30:22.000
And it's like follow the experience and what are we producing and how do we minimize this?
01:30:22.159 --> 01:30:24.399
Well, we've got a big problem with mental health for sure.
01:30:25.039 --> 01:30:28.159
And we've got so why why do we have such a problem with it?
01:30:28.319 --> 01:30:29.840
Because it's not safe to talk about.
01:30:31.680 --> 01:30:32.720
There's so much shame.
01:30:33.760 --> 01:30:40.640
Just in general with mental health, there's a lot that's not just with sexual abuse or abuse in general, it's saying you're struggling.
01:30:40.960 --> 01:30:42.159
You're supposed to have it all together.
01:30:42.399 --> 01:30:42.720
Right.
01:30:43.680 --> 01:30:46.560
And that is hurting our society, I feel like.
01:30:47.279 --> 01:30:51.760
You need to feel safe, safe to struggle, safe to say it out loud.
01:30:52.479 --> 01:30:54.960
And I think that's where you know people aren't gonna judge you on it.
01:30:55.199 --> 01:30:55.359
Right.
01:30:55.439 --> 01:30:59.199
And I think that's where you became so good at your job.
01:30:59.520 --> 01:31:02.319
It's because you know how to create that safety for people.
01:31:02.800 --> 01:31:06.640
And when you have that safety, you know who else I think is really freaking good at that?
01:31:07.039 --> 01:31:07.439
It's Greg.
01:31:08.079 --> 01:31:08.720
Longabah.
01:31:09.039 --> 01:31:09.520
Oh boy.
01:31:09.680 --> 01:31:10.159
Yeah.
01:31:10.399 --> 01:31:13.359
That man, he's coming on, guys, don't worry.
01:31:13.680 --> 01:31:24.479
I think that the reason that man gets an unusual amount of confessions from criminals is because he is so good at creating an emotionally safe environment.
01:31:24.800 --> 01:31:26.159
It's a passion behind it.
01:31:26.800 --> 01:31:27.359
For sure.
01:31:27.520 --> 01:31:27.840
Yeah.
01:31:28.079 --> 01:31:31.439
Being genuine and like people sniff out when you're being disingenuous.
01:31:31.600 --> 01:31:31.840
Totally.
01:31:32.079 --> 01:31:37.199
When you're trying to put on a fake facade and like especially kids, they sniff that stuff out real quick.
01:31:37.359 --> 01:31:38.399
And you're like, why do you care?
01:31:38.560 --> 01:31:39.119
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:31:39.359 --> 01:31:40.079
What's wrong with you?
01:31:40.319 --> 01:31:40.640
Totally.
01:31:40.800 --> 01:31:44.880
Or I've had kids like, what the hell happened to you that you want to do this all day, every day?
01:31:45.039 --> 01:31:48.239
And I'm like, I I enjoy talking to kids.
01:31:48.399 --> 01:31:49.840
Like, I'm not lying to you on that.
01:31:50.079 --> 01:31:55.600
Not gonna go through my whole stuff because we're here about you, buckaroo, but you know, kids absolutely being genuine.
01:31:55.760 --> 01:32:00.079
So if you're not emotional, uh mainly you're not an emotional person, really.
01:32:00.319 --> 01:32:02.560
I used to be very much so like that, by the way.
01:32:02.800 --> 01:32:12.239
I was, and I was the like, I was the kid that very much so don't tell me what to do.
01:32:12.479 --> 01:32:20.800
I was the I was what you called the spicy kid that would come into your room if there, if I was in there for any reason, I'd be like, I don't I remember my parents took me to counseling one time.
01:32:20.880 --> 01:32:21.039
Uh-huh.
01:32:21.199 --> 01:32:21.439
Okay.
01:32:22.000 --> 01:32:24.079
I was behavior central.
01:32:24.239 --> 01:32:27.600
Like my behavior changed from sixth grade into seventh grade, night and day.
01:32:27.760 --> 01:32:36.960
I went from being the square kid that was like holding my Bible up to kids and reading it on the bus because they were bullying another child to sneaking out, doing drugs, having sex at 13.
01:32:37.119 --> 01:32:40.159
Like I was like, not just smoking weed, I was doing ecstasy.
01:32:40.239 --> 01:32:42.159
Like I went off the deep end.
01:32:42.239 --> 01:32:42.560
Okay.
01:32:43.119 --> 01:32:46.239
And my parents are like, what is going on?
01:32:46.399 --> 01:32:48.800
And then one night I told my friend I was gonna kill myself.
01:32:48.880 --> 01:32:50.479
And so she ended up calling the police.
01:32:50.640 --> 01:32:53.840
The police came, I had to go wake my parents up, explain to them why the police was there.
01:32:54.000 --> 01:32:54.640
That sucked.
01:32:54.720 --> 01:33:00.399
And then they made them take me down to um like a you know, mental hospital for an evaluation.
01:33:00.479 --> 01:33:00.560
Yeah.
01:33:00.720 --> 01:33:04.239
Well, I had already been told by the kids at school what you had to say in order to let them make them let you go.
01:33:04.319 --> 01:33:05.439
You have to have a plan, right?
01:33:05.520 --> 01:33:06.159
Like all the things.
01:33:06.319 --> 01:33:09.840
So I knew what to say and not to say so I could leave because you are not locking me in here.
01:33:10.000 --> 01:33:11.840
Yeah, that is not going to happen.
01:33:12.000 --> 01:33:12.479
Yeah.
01:33:12.720 --> 01:33:13.439
So whatever.
01:33:13.600 --> 01:33:15.840
Well, my parents are to take me to counseling.
01:33:17.119 --> 01:33:18.319
That was cute.
01:33:18.560 --> 01:33:21.439
They drive me up to this counselor's office.
01:33:21.680 --> 01:33:24.000
And I just remember, like, they're like, okay, it's time to go in.
01:33:24.159 --> 01:33:25.680
I'm like, I am not going in there.
01:33:25.840 --> 01:33:28.079
I am not talking about feelings.
01:33:29.039 --> 01:33:29.920
What feelings?
01:33:30.079 --> 01:33:32.479
I'm not talking about feelings, you know, something happening.
01:33:32.720 --> 01:33:35.840
And so I remember my dad gets out, my dad was driving, and like he goes and gets the counselor.
01:33:35.920 --> 01:33:37.920
I'm sitting in the front seat, and they bring the counselor down.
01:33:38.000 --> 01:33:39.840
I remember like there was like a hill for some reason.
01:33:39.920 --> 01:33:44.159
I feel like there was a hill here, and they like bring her down the hill, and she's like knocking on my window trying to talk to me.
01:33:44.239 --> 01:33:45.039
And I went like this.
01:33:45.199 --> 01:33:46.159
I wouldn't even look at her.
01:33:46.319 --> 01:33:48.880
I was just like middle finger, not talking to you.
01:33:49.119 --> 01:33:50.479
You guys are wasting my time.
01:33:50.640 --> 01:33:52.479
Can we hurry up and leave already?
01:33:52.720 --> 01:33:54.479
And that was never gonna work for me.
01:33:54.560 --> 01:33:58.079
And then, like, ironically enough, I have my bachelor's in psychology, uh-huh.
01:33:58.239 --> 01:34:01.600
And I'm like all into therapy and all the things and human behavior now.
01:34:01.760 --> 01:34:02.159
Yep.
01:34:02.399 --> 01:34:04.800
But I was most definitely the hot and cold child.
01:34:04.960 --> 01:34:07.359
You were absolutely not gonna get me emotional.
01:34:07.600 --> 01:34:08.399
Absolutely not.
01:34:08.479 --> 01:34:09.760
It was not gonna happen.
01:34:10.000 --> 01:34:15.279
I hated the feeling of being vulnerable, and that's what it was about.
01:34:15.760 --> 01:34:17.199
Yes, very scary.
01:34:17.359 --> 01:34:19.039
And if I let you know how I feel.
01:34:19.279 --> 01:34:21.119
Oh, I have a question for you now.
01:34:21.359 --> 01:34:21.920
Love it.
01:34:22.079 --> 01:34:24.560
Oh I did some digging on this on myself.
01:34:24.640 --> 01:34:26.800
I'm so curious if we're like on this.
01:34:27.520 --> 01:34:28.880
Oh, okay.
01:34:31.359 --> 01:34:41.279
Do you are you a are you comfortable with letting anybody know that you are excited or disappointed about anything, or do you try to minimize those emotions too?
01:34:41.439 --> 01:34:42.560
It depends on what it is.
01:34:42.880 --> 01:34:44.640
Professionally, I don't mind.
01:34:44.800 --> 01:34:46.159
Personally, I don't like it.
01:34:46.399 --> 01:34:47.439
Girl, me too.
01:34:47.600 --> 01:34:50.399
I don't like this self-acknowledgement, like personally at all.
01:34:50.560 --> 01:34:54.079
Professionally, it's kind of like the thank you, I appreciate it.
01:34:54.159 --> 01:34:56.640
But like personally, I'm like, mmm, detour the topic.
01:34:56.720 --> 01:34:57.600
Let's move away from that.
01:34:57.760 --> 01:34:58.800
Yeah, I hate recognition.
01:34:59.359 --> 01:35:00.319
I hate recognition.
01:35:00.479 --> 01:35:00.640
Yeah.
01:35:00.720 --> 01:35:04.479
I didn't go to my own college graduation because I don't even want to walk across a stupid stage.
01:35:04.640 --> 01:35:06.000
Yeah, I went for that one for my mom.
01:35:06.159 --> 01:35:06.399
Yeah.
01:35:06.560 --> 01:35:08.000
Okay, I called my dad.
01:35:08.159 --> 01:35:11.840
I called my dad because my parents were not there at my high school graduation.
01:35:11.920 --> 01:35:12.079
Uh-huh.
01:35:12.239 --> 01:35:14.640
When I was 14, my birth mom showed up in my high school, right?
01:35:14.880 --> 01:35:17.359
And for two years, my parents tried to control a relationship.
01:35:17.439 --> 01:35:22.399
They didn't want me really talking to her, so I was only allowed to talk to her on Sundays for 15 minutes with my dad listening on the phone.
01:35:22.560 --> 01:35:34.640
So instead of actually obeying those rules, I was going to school and I was calling from the payphone, my friends' cell phones, going to places after school, calling her, calling, or calling, or eventually she got a 1800 number, so it was free to call her from the payphone at school.
01:35:34.720 --> 01:35:36.159
I was talking to her all day, every day.
01:35:36.319 --> 01:35:40.159
And then about two years into that, I snuck out one day to see her.
01:35:40.319 --> 01:35:41.119
I got caught.
01:35:41.279 --> 01:35:49.359
And so when I got caught, my dad said, if you'll just be honest with me and tell me where you were and who you were with, I won't throw anybody in jail.
01:35:49.439 --> 01:35:50.319
I won't take away your phone.
01:35:50.479 --> 01:35:51.359
I won't take away your car.
01:35:51.520 --> 01:35:52.239
So I was honest.
01:35:52.319 --> 01:35:54.399
I told him, and that was all not true.
01:35:54.720 --> 01:35:58.479
Took away my phone, took away my car, threatened to put my friend that drove me in jail.
01:35:58.560 --> 01:36:01.840
And then next thing you know, he's trying to put a restraining order against my birth mom.
01:36:01.920 --> 01:36:02.159
Uh-huh.
01:36:02.319 --> 01:36:05.439
So when I found out about the restraining order, she could answer the phone because they had already filed.
01:36:05.520 --> 01:36:06.319
So I was trying to call her.
01:36:06.399 --> 01:36:06.960
She wasn't answering.
01:36:07.039 --> 01:36:07.760
I called my grandma.
01:36:07.840 --> 01:36:10.800
She's the one that told me, like, oh, you don't know, don't know what.
01:36:10.880 --> 01:36:11.920
They filed a restraining order.
01:36:12.000 --> 01:36:12.720
She can't answer the phone.
01:36:12.880 --> 01:36:15.439
And I'm like, absolutely not.
01:36:15.680 --> 01:36:18.000
And so you know the court system.
01:36:18.079 --> 01:36:21.600
And what I'm about to say is gonna have every red flag in you go off.
01:36:21.680 --> 01:36:25.920
But I swear to God, I have proof to back it up, and it's the craziest thing ever.
01:36:26.159 --> 01:36:30.319
Um, I hired my own attorney who was actually just a public defender.
01:36:30.399 --> 01:36:36.159
So it really didn't involve any hiring, but like I went down to the courthouse and I was like, I need an attorney, and they're like, second floor.
01:36:36.239 --> 01:36:38.159
So I went up there as public defender's office.
01:36:38.399 --> 01:36:41.359
They see how many the little green paper, fill out your stuff, your income, your charges.
01:36:41.439 --> 01:36:42.479
I'm like, I'm never arrested.
01:36:42.560 --> 01:36:43.359
I don't know what the hell this is.
01:36:43.520 --> 01:36:44.319
Go give it back to them.
01:36:44.399 --> 01:36:45.760
They're like, let me go get my boss.
01:36:46.000 --> 01:36:53.279
Guy comes in, I sit down, I'm telling him everything that's going on, and I'm like, listen, I am willing to throw my parents under the bus for whatever the heck I have to.
01:36:53.520 --> 01:36:58.079
Like, I I yeah, you cannot like leave me without help here.
01:36:58.159 --> 01:36:58.479
Uh-huh.
01:36:58.800 --> 01:37:06.399
And um, so the uh the guy was like, Okay, you know, this is a new attorney in our office, she will help you.
01:37:06.560 --> 01:37:10.239
But the rule is like your parents can't know that you're doing any of this.
01:37:10.319 --> 01:37:11.520
And I'm like, okay, Don.
01:37:11.920 --> 01:37:16.079
And so for a month, my parents had no clue I even knew that we had a court date coming up.
01:37:16.239 --> 01:37:21.520
And then court sh court came and um the judge gave custody to my birth mother when I was six.
01:37:21.760 --> 01:37:22.079
Oh wow.
01:37:22.640 --> 01:37:24.319
Yeah, it was wild.
01:37:24.560 --> 01:37:30.000
So I moved in with my birth mom at 16, and I went no contact with my with my parents and I had to talk to them.
01:37:30.159 --> 01:37:33.600
Well, in that year, I graduated and I did not invite them to my graduation.
01:37:33.760 --> 01:37:38.399
And education was very important, especially to my dad.
01:37:38.479 --> 01:37:38.720
Uh-huh.
01:37:38.880 --> 01:37:43.119
My mom always told me, she was like, education is the one thing that nobody can ever take away from you, you know.
01:37:43.279 --> 01:37:48.159
But my dad was always like, Go, Christina, like, big into any of my accomplishments.
01:37:48.319 --> 01:37:51.039
He took those on as his own accomplishments, right?
01:37:51.199 --> 01:37:57.600
So when I graduated college, I called him and I was like, I will fly, because I graduated from a college in Virginia.
01:37:57.680 --> 01:37:59.039
I will fly to Virginia.
01:37:59.199 --> 01:38:00.720
I will fly you to Virginia with me.
01:38:00.880 --> 01:38:01.439
Like, we can go.
01:38:01.600 --> 01:38:03.840
My dad's like, you don't have to do that for me.
01:38:03.920 --> 01:38:06.239
Oh, I'm just happy that you did it for you.
01:38:06.399 --> 01:38:07.520
Like, I don't have to go.
01:38:07.600 --> 01:38:08.960
If you don't want to go, I don't want to go.
01:38:09.119 --> 01:38:10.640
But I hate recognition.
01:38:10.800 --> 01:38:12.159
I don't like awards.
01:38:12.560 --> 01:38:16.239
I understand that sometimes it comes with the job and it's just kind of like, oh yeah, thanks.
01:38:16.319 --> 01:38:17.359
Okay, can I get off stage now?
01:38:17.520 --> 01:38:17.760
Thank you.
01:38:17.920 --> 01:38:23.199
And it was funny because growing up, my dad put me through voice lessons from a very young age.
01:38:23.760 --> 01:38:26.880
So I was always forced to perform constantly.
01:38:26.960 --> 01:38:30.079
And then as soon as I was adult, I'm like, nope, I'm out.
01:38:30.319 --> 01:38:31.600
I have a background character.
01:38:31.760 --> 01:38:33.119
I don't want to be on stage.
01:38:33.199 --> 01:38:34.399
I hate that feeling.
01:38:34.560 --> 01:38:37.199
So it's funny because you also don't like recognition.
01:38:37.760 --> 01:38:43.840
And but I've got a big personality and I will always wear like colorful clothes or stuff that like catches your attention.
01:38:44.000 --> 01:38:45.760
And then it's like, oh hide in the background, I'm good.
01:38:45.920 --> 01:38:46.640
Dude, that's me.
01:38:46.800 --> 01:38:48.079
Like, that's me.
01:38:48.159 --> 01:38:50.319
How do you what do you do when you go to a party?
01:38:50.960 --> 01:38:51.840
Um, it depends.
01:38:51.920 --> 01:38:53.760
If I know people, like social butterfly.
01:38:53.840 --> 01:38:54.000
Yeah.
01:38:54.079 --> 01:38:56.479
If I don't know people, I want to sit in the back and I want to watch everybody.
01:38:56.640 --> 01:38:56.880
Yeah.
01:38:57.039 --> 01:38:59.920
I want to get to know like who's I I want to start learning.
01:39:00.000 --> 01:39:01.039
Like, who do you like?
01:39:01.199 --> 01:39:01.920
Who do you not like?
01:39:02.000 --> 01:39:03.359
What are the interactions?
01:39:03.600 --> 01:39:04.960
What's what's the vibe here?
01:39:05.119 --> 01:39:05.760
Bro, that's me.
01:39:06.239 --> 01:39:08.560
I want to know that before I go engage in conversations.
01:39:08.720 --> 01:39:10.000
That is a hundred percent.
01:39:10.560 --> 01:39:11.359
That's wild.
01:39:11.520 --> 01:39:12.399
That's exactly what I do.
01:39:12.800 --> 01:39:15.119
Or I'm really bad, like RBF while I sit there and do it.
01:39:15.199 --> 01:39:17.359
So then I'm I look very unapproachable.
01:39:17.520 --> 01:39:17.760
Right.
01:39:18.079 --> 01:39:19.760
So that's a poor girl.
01:39:19.920 --> 01:39:20.479
She's very brutal.
01:39:20.640 --> 01:39:23.600
But like people all the time are like, you just look mad or like you look like you're busy.
01:39:23.680 --> 01:39:26.079
I'm like, no, this is I'm sorry, this is my interested face.
01:39:26.239 --> 01:39:28.560
Like I'm studying humans right now.
01:39:28.800 --> 01:39:29.039
Yeah.
01:39:29.199 --> 01:39:30.079
Yeah, I can't help it.
01:39:30.159 --> 01:39:31.199
That's exactly what I do.
01:39:31.439 --> 01:39:33.600
Or I'll just like scroll my phone.
01:39:33.680 --> 01:39:34.880
Like those are the two things.
01:39:35.119 --> 01:39:37.279
But I'm listening to everything while I'm scrolling.
01:39:38.000 --> 01:39:38.399
Yes.
01:39:38.800 --> 01:39:39.119
Okay.
01:39:39.920 --> 01:39:48.399
So fascinating because on that exact point of, especially when I was a kid, I wonder if you did this when your dad passed away.
01:39:48.479 --> 01:39:52.399
Because this is absolutely how I acted when all of that shit was going on with me.
01:39:53.600 --> 01:39:54.880
Nothing would bother me.
01:39:55.039 --> 01:39:55.760
I'm fine.
01:39:56.000 --> 01:39:56.880
I'm totally fine.
01:39:56.960 --> 01:39:59.840
Like you're not gonna know if something really gets to me.
01:40:00.000 --> 01:40:01.760
I'm not gonna let you have that power over me.
01:40:01.840 --> 01:40:03.199
I'm not gonna let you see me cry.
01:40:03.359 --> 01:40:04.960
I'm not gonna let you see that you got me.
01:40:05.279 --> 01:40:07.279
Everything to me is just like, oh, it's not a big deal.
01:40:07.359 --> 01:40:15.439
And that carried over into my adult life when I got cheated on or when there was something super chaotic going on in my life.
01:40:15.600 --> 01:40:17.039
I was always the one that could handle it.
01:40:17.119 --> 01:40:17.920
Christina can handle it.
01:40:18.000 --> 01:40:18.800
Christina can handle it.
01:40:19.039 --> 01:40:19.920
Was that you?
01:40:20.319 --> 01:40:24.000
Um, so more so now as an old adult than as a teenager.
01:40:24.159 --> 01:40:28.239
Because as a teenager, it's like I could handle what I could handle, but I wasn't around in certain things.
01:40:28.399 --> 01:40:36.239
I was so busy with sports still and school and my younger brother and like my mom's, like there's a lot still going on now as an adult.
01:40:36.399 --> 01:40:37.920
I don't like telling people no.
01:40:38.079 --> 01:40:39.840
Like, if you're like, hey, could you do this for me?
01:40:40.000 --> 01:40:40.800
Absolutely.
01:40:41.039 --> 01:40:43.680
And then I'm over here, like in my head, I'm like, how are you gonna get this all done?
01:40:43.920 --> 01:40:45.359
Like, no, I'll get it done, not a big deal.
01:40:45.520 --> 01:40:46.000
Why?
01:40:46.399 --> 01:40:46.800
How come?
01:40:46.880 --> 01:40:48.560
I don't have it, I'm gonna get good at that.
01:40:48.880 --> 01:40:49.680
How come?
01:40:50.319 --> 01:40:56.720
I strive to be somebody who's dependable for others, and like I've in my brain, I'm like, if I tell you no, that makes me not dependable.
01:40:56.960 --> 01:40:57.359
Ooh.
01:40:58.079 --> 01:41:00.000
What is it about the dependability for you?
01:41:00.239 --> 01:41:01.199
It's consistency.
01:41:01.279 --> 01:41:04.479
It's knowing like if I ask you to do something, you're gonna be able to get it done, you're gonna do it.
01:41:04.560 --> 01:41:05.680
I don't have to remind you about it.
01:41:05.760 --> 01:41:07.359
I don't have to follow up with you about it.
01:41:07.520 --> 01:41:10.880
It's I've asked you one time and I I I trust I know you're gonna get it done.
01:41:11.439 --> 01:41:13.359
Who is the dependable one for you growing up?
01:41:14.560 --> 01:41:15.119
My mom.
01:41:15.840 --> 01:41:16.880
And she's still there today.
01:41:18.319 --> 01:41:19.119
That's amazing.
01:41:19.279 --> 01:41:19.520
Yep.
01:41:20.319 --> 01:41:21.760
Even now she'll like call me randomly.
01:41:21.840 --> 01:41:23.920
She's like, hey, I got your kids this, X, Y, and Z at the store.
01:41:24.000 --> 01:41:24.960
And I'm like, oh thanks.
01:41:25.039 --> 01:41:25.840
I didn't think about it.
01:41:26.159 --> 01:41:27.439
And she's the dependable one anytime.
01:41:27.520 --> 01:41:28.079
I call for childcare.
01:41:28.159 --> 01:41:29.039
I'm like, hey, could you do this?
01:41:29.119 --> 01:41:30.079
She goes, absolutely bring them.
01:41:30.560 --> 01:41:31.840
Do you send your kids a daycare?
01:41:32.000 --> 01:41:32.560
Yes.
01:41:35.920 --> 01:41:37.279
They all know what I do.
01:41:38.239 --> 01:41:41.039
Um, so I would make sure they were dude.
01:41:41.199 --> 01:41:43.279
I'd be like, hey, by the way, do you know what I do for a living?
01:41:43.520 --> 01:41:52.560
So before I've had them on a different daycare, I ended up switching to a new daycare just for um it was less expensive, but also like a little bit more amenities for the kids.
01:41:52.720 --> 01:41:57.359
With my five-year-old is very, very advanced, like developmentally.
01:41:57.600 --> 01:41:59.520
She is a rock star.
01:41:59.760 --> 01:42:05.359
Digging through the DFPS website for all the daycares, I'm reading through every single citation that you've ever gotten, every single report you've ever gotten.
01:42:05.600 --> 01:42:06.239
Of course you are.
01:42:06.479 --> 01:42:15.119
Um, like that's what I'm reading through to know, like, okay, is it little, is it small minor things, or is it that the kid fell out of a high tier, or is it that a kid was left alone on the playground?
01:42:15.359 --> 01:42:17.439
Like, we're gonna dig through those things.
01:42:17.520 --> 01:42:21.039
If it's like, oh, there was a spoon on the floor when you walked into a room.
01:42:21.279 --> 01:42:22.640
Okay, maybe that dropped.
01:42:22.880 --> 01:42:24.239
Not a big deal.
01:42:24.960 --> 01:42:31.279
But also with my three-year-olds learning it, almost five-year-old, I interview her every day when she gets home from school.
01:42:31.520 --> 01:42:32.720
Tell me about this, tell me about that.
01:42:32.960 --> 01:42:35.039
Like, tell me about your teachers, tell me about your day.
01:42:35.199 --> 01:42:39.279
And so, like when she goes to bed at night, before she goes to bed, she goes, Can I tell you about my day already?
01:42:39.359 --> 01:42:55.600
I'm like, Yeah, she goes, So I got there, I ate breakfast, she goes through her entire event narrative of her day to the point where she tells me what kids got in trouble, how what they did to get in trouble, what the teachers' reactions were, when the teachers left during the day, who took her to the bathroom, who she sat by, who she took her nap by.
01:42:55.680 --> 01:42:57.439
Like, she is giving me a play-by-play.
01:42:57.600 --> 01:43:02.239
And then I'm raising a little nosy girl because she tells me about her brother's day and her sister's day.
01:43:02.319 --> 01:43:04.560
Oh no! Because she's like, I'm checking in on them throughout the day.
01:43:04.720 --> 01:43:12.960
Like, if I walk by their room, she'll open their room to check on my baby, or she'll walk by the room to open, to check on how my son's doing to make sure he's not having a bad day.
01:43:13.199 --> 01:43:17.119
Or like if they're playing outside together, my two older ones, like, how's your day, Bubba?
01:43:17.359 --> 01:43:21.520
And she's talking with him to make sure and go ask the teachers, is he behaving today?
01:43:22.079 --> 01:43:22.560
Wow.
01:43:22.880 --> 01:43:24.079
She's my little interviewer.
01:43:24.560 --> 01:43:24.880
Wow.
01:43:25.039 --> 01:43:29.680
And that's interesting because you were the sibling that took care of everybody, and here your daughter is doing the same.
01:43:30.800 --> 01:43:38.239
And it sounds like the hypervigilance is there too, but this has been curated in a very different way than it was with you.
01:43:38.560 --> 01:43:39.600
It's fascinating.
01:43:39.760 --> 01:43:40.000
Yeah.
01:43:40.239 --> 01:43:40.960
Pretty cool.
01:43:41.199 --> 01:43:47.279
I know we're gonna butt heads if she becomes a teenager of like, mom, stop asking me questions, but you know, if I still early, she can't get mad at me.
01:43:47.359 --> 01:43:48.319
I've always done this.
01:43:48.560 --> 01:43:49.600
Well, you know, it's funny.
01:43:49.680 --> 01:43:51.279
My my husband actually said something the other day.
01:43:51.359 --> 01:43:56.880
We were talking about, you know, being the kid where the grandparent was like asking all the annoying questions.
01:43:57.920 --> 01:44:11.359
And I'm curious for you because if you are a non-emotional person, how is it that you are you able to take yourself from the superficial how was your day questions into the deeper emotional stuff with your children?
01:44:11.680 --> 01:44:11.920
Yes.
01:44:12.079 --> 01:44:14.960
So like I'll typically ask them, like, hey, tell me about your day.
01:44:15.199 --> 01:44:18.960
And then they'll tell me, like, oh, I got in trouble or I did this, or X, Y, and Z happen.
01:44:19.039 --> 01:44:21.039
I'm like, hey, talk to you about it how come you got in trouble?
01:44:21.199 --> 01:44:24.960
What and so I like to do that one-on-one with them, like before they go to bed.
01:44:25.039 --> 01:44:32.079
So that way it's not chiming in of like, I don't want to hear about Bubba's day from my oldest, I don't want to hear about my oldest day from my youngest or my middle.
01:44:32.399 --> 01:44:37.680
I want them to be able to use their words to tell me about it so I get their emotions behind it, but then we can problem solve.
01:44:37.840 --> 01:44:40.319
Like, hey, like my oldest is so excited.
01:44:40.479 --> 01:44:46.239
She has new friends that just started her class, and we've been talking through inclusion and making sure like you're inviting people to play with you.
01:44:46.319 --> 01:44:52.239
And she was so proud of herself when she came home yesterday that she got a play in her centers with one of these kids.
01:44:52.479 --> 01:44:55.439
And I was like, you know, just makes your mama heart happy.
01:44:55.680 --> 01:44:58.479
Like, like, that's the stuff that I want to teach my kids.
01:44:58.640 --> 01:45:01.760
Like the innocence behind, like, they're just so excited to be a new friend.
01:45:01.920 --> 01:45:03.279
Well, thank you so much for being here today.
01:45:03.840 --> 01:45:04.479
Thank you for having me.
01:45:04.640 --> 01:45:05.520
This has been wonderful.
01:45:05.680 --> 01:45:06.319
I was so excited.
01:45:06.399 --> 01:45:07.920
Like, I told you I couldn't sleep last night.
01:45:08.000 --> 01:45:13.760
I was so excited about doing this interview, and you did such a great job being the interviewed instead of the interviewer.
01:45:14.079 --> 01:45:16.880
It's hard to sit here and not be like, oh, yeah, I can ask you that question too.
01:45:17.039 --> 01:45:19.600
But I mean, go for it.
01:45:19.680 --> 01:45:21.359
I think it's interesting, honestly.
01:45:21.520 --> 01:45:25.359
I would I would love to continue this conversation and even bring you back some other time.
01:45:25.439 --> 01:45:28.800
I think it'd be really, really interesting to see what kind of comments and stuff that we get.
01:45:29.039 --> 01:45:29.520
I'd love to.
01:45:29.680 --> 01:45:38.399
Anytime questions from parents, I'm sure they'll have a ton of questions on how they can, you know, better protect their children without it being coming control, right?
01:45:38.800 --> 01:45:40.399
So thanks so much for being here.
01:45:40.560 --> 01:45:42.239
We will catch you guys next time.