Scripture Matters Podcast — S2E10 — Providence Matters

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He had already started packing.
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The new job meant a better salary, a new city, and an opportunity he had been praying about for months.
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The interviews had gone exceptionally well.
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His family was so excited in his mind that the decision was practically made.
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And then the phone rang.
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We're sorry.
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The position is no longer available.
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Just like that, the door slammed shut.
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He was disappointed, angry if we're being truthful about it, and maybe most of all, confused.
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Because he had prayed about this.
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He had asked God for direction.
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And this certainly didn't feel like an answer.
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Three weeks later, at 2 17 a.m., his phone rang again.
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This time it was his mother.
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His father had collapsed.
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The ambulance was already on its way.
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And because that move never happened, he was only 12 minutes away.
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And not 600 miles.
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So he reached the hospital before they ever took his father into surgery.
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And for a few minutes, the two of them were all alone.
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That's right.
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There were things that needed to be said.
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Things that had probably needed to be said for years.
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I love you.
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I'm proud of you.
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I'm sorry.
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His father never came home from the hospital.
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And in the weeks that followed, that son kept thinking about two phone calls.
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One that felt like a terrible disappointment.
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And another that actually made him grateful that he had never left.
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He could not stop wondering.
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Was that just coincidence?
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Or was there something happening in his life that he could not see at the time?
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And if God was working, how could he possibly know?
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Good folks, that question is so much bigger than one man, one job, or one hospital room.
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Because sooner or later, most of us look back at something in our lives and wonder the very same thing.
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The question was that God?
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Today, we're going to talk about that.
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Because Providence Matters.
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Right here on the Scripture Matters Podcast.
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You've tuned in to the Scripture Matters Podcast, produced and published in cooperation with the Waters Road Church of Christ.
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Looking for a church home in the Houston area that lovingly stands upon God's word?
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Waters Road is the place where you belong.
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If you need more information about the Waters Road Church of Christ, check out their website at www.wrcopc.org.
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We'd like to thank each of you who helped make this podcast possible.
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Especially the prayerful support of our wives and families.
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And now, good folks, let's get back to another episode of the Scripture Matters Podcast.
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It's time again for the Scripture Matters Podcast.
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And listen, if this is your first time joining us, I'm Jonathan Sanford.
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I am blessed to serve as the pulpit minister for the good brethren of the Waters Road Church of Christ.
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And across the screen from me at this time is a man who brings joy everywhere he goes, and occasionally a little trouble.
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Only when you're involved, Jonathan.
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Folks, my name is Cliff Thompson, and I'm blessed to be one of the shepherds at Waters Road, as well as one of the adult Bible class teachers.
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Now, in fact, speaking of trouble, Jonathan, each Wednesday night, I see what I can stir up in our classroom study, the book of Revelation.
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Yeah, you remember the little Elvis song?
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I think it said something like, if you're looking for trouble, well, you've come to the right place.
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And maybe it is that Elvis, because you've been teaching Revelation for so long, maybe Elvis came to your Revelation class.
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Brother, listen, it's so good to be back with you again.
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And good folks for you out there today.
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We are genuinely grateful that you've chosen and to hang out with us too.
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Always a pleasure to be with you, my friend.
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Folks, we certainly are, whether you're watching us today on YouTube or Facebook or maybe listening through one of our many podcast platforms.
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We are truly grateful to have you all with us.
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And Cliff, before we get this car too warmed up, I really want to mention briefly here what happened with last week's episode, Peace Matters.
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You know, as of today, that conversation has been viewed more than 11,000 times.
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And Jonathan, that is incredibly encouraging.
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We're so grateful for every single person who took the time to watch, listen, comment, and especially share that episode.
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Yeah, we really are.
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And good folks, I just want to say this the right way because you know the number, that's not what we're all about.
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Um, I know you agree with that, Cliff.
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No, sir, it's not.
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We're not sitting down every week trying to chase views or or see how big we can make a number look like on a screen.
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That isn't the purpose of the Scripture Matters podcast.
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That's so true, Jonathan.
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But when you see an episode reach more than 11,000 folks, it does tell you that the conversation is traveling.
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Exactly.
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And that we're just being honest with you, good folks, that encourages Cliff and myself because so much of that reach is only possible because of you.
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You're sharing these episodes, you're sending them to your friends, you're putting the links out on your social media accounts, you're even telling somebody, hey, take a few moments and give this a watch.
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And every time that you do that, good folks, this program is reaching somebody that Cliff and I uh would have never reached without you.
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And we do not take that for granted, folks.
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No, the fact that you believe these conversations are worth passing along, oh man, it means a great deal to both of us.
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So thank you sincerely.
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Yes.
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And if today's conversation helps you, challenges you, or gives you something worth thinking about, do the same thing.
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Like the episode, follow or subscribe if you haven't done so already, and especially take a moment to share it with somebody else.
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And if something we discuss raises a question or gives you something you want us to explore further, we always enjoy hearing from you.
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That interaction is part of what makes this program feel like an actual conversation instead of just the two of us simply talking into cameras.
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That's right.
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Now, brother, last week we spent our time talking about peace.
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Peace with God, peace with others, and peace within.
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Yes, sometimes, Jonathan, the circumstances are still messy.
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You know, sometimes the questions are still there, and sometimes you simply don't know yet how things are going to turn out.
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And that's where today's conversation gets really interesting to me.
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Because sometimes we eventually look back at those seasons of life and begin to see certain moments differently than we did while we were living through them.
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A decision, maybe a delay, a person who showed up, a plan that didn't happen the way we expected.
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Was that God?
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Or was it simply coincidence?
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Well, strap in because I think this episode is gonna make a lot of us do some thinking.
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Jonathan, when we ask, was that God or was it simply coincidence?
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That's where I think Christians have to be very careful.
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We believe God is actively involved in his creation, but we also don't want to claim that we know something God has never actually revealed to us.
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Yeah, Cliff, and both sides of that matter.
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You know, I don't want to picture God as creating this world and then just stepping away from it as though everything is just running right along independently of him.
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But I also don't want to think that every unusual thing that happens in my life and immediately announce, hey, God did that.
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Because providence isn't faint, it isn't the idea that everything is predetermined, and human beings are powerless participants in whatever happens.
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No, scripture holds us responsible for our choices, and we still choose, uh, we still obey, we still pray, we still work, we still have to exercise wisdom.
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Yeah, and at the same time, God's able to accomplish his purpose while human beings are making genuine choices and remaining responsible for those choices.
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Which is one reason, brother, that this conversation, man, it can get complicated pretty quickly.
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Yes, it can.
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Because sometimes when Christians hear us say that God is working, well, they they assume that we must be talking about a miracle.
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And providence and miracles are not necessarily the same thing, Jonathan.
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No, let's just take for a moment Jesus calming the storm.
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Okay, you remember those disciples?
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They're in that boat, and the storm is raging.
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Jesus speaks, and the wind and the sea obey him.
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Nobody needs to debate, brother, whether something supernatural just happened.
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That was unmistakably miraculous, Jonathan.
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But God does not have to do something like that every time he accomplishes his purpose.
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No, and that's the distinction here.
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God can accomplish something through circumstances that from our perspective look completely ordinary.
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And that was one of the things I kept coming back to, Jonathan, while we were working through this.
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God's hand may be working without God's hand being visible revealed to us.
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I love that because it immediately, it immediately makes me think of Esther.
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Oh, brother, me too, Jonathan.
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It's amazing because you don't have a series of visible miracles in Esther where everybody's watching knows I there it is.
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God just acted.
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And yet, Jonathan, when you see how that story develops, his providential hand is so difficult to miss.
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Yeah, brother.
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In fact, I've always found it amazing when you consider that the name of God, it's never mentioned in the in the book we know of Esther.
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And yet, look at what happens.
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Esther becomes a queen.
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Mordecai uncovers the plot against the king, his loyalty gets recorded, and at least then for a time, nothing seems to come from it.
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Until later, when the king cannot sleep.
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And the royal records, they're brought out.
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And Mordecai's actions are remembered at precisely the moment when that information becomes significant.
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Now, if we could just drop ourselves into any one of those moments while it was actually happened, none of it necessarily screams something extraordinary is taking place.
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A king can't sleep.
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Jonathan, it's one of the most powerful verses in the entire Bible.
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Who knows whether you have not come to the kingdom for such a time as this?
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Those two words.
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Who knows?
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I think those two words matter enormously when we talk about providence.
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Because Mordecai recognizes what may be happening without pretending God privately revealed every detail to him.
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That's it, Cliff.
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He doesn't say, Esther, God, he told me exactly why you're queen.
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He can see her position, he can see the crisis, he can see the opportunity in front of her, and his language, I love it.
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It still leaves room for humility.
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Again, who knows?
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And Jonathan, notice something else here.
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Esther still had to act.
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Yes.
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I mean, God's providence does not eliminate Esther's responsibility.
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She has a decision to make.
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She has to certainly exercise courage if you know the story.
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She can do what is right, or she could simply refuse.
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And that's why I think we have to reject this idea that Providence somehow removes human responsibility.
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It doesn't.
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God can work through circumstances while people are still accountable for the choices that they make.
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And that becomes extremely practical because listen, brother, we've both heard somebody say, hey, God opened this door for me.
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So, hey, that's gotta be what God wants, right?
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Yes, sir.
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Many times, Jonathan.
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But an open door, listen to us, brethren.
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An open door is not automatically divine approval.
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And that's the distinction, brother, that I have really wanted people to remember.
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Yes, sir.
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If something requires me to violate what God has already revealed in his word, I cannot turn around and call that opportunity God's providence.
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Yeah, circumstances don't get to overrule scripture.
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No, God's providence will never require us to believe that God acted contrary to his own nature or his revealed word.
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So if I say, hey, I know what the Bible says, but hey, you wouldn't believe how perfectly all this just fell into place.
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Jonathan, you better go back to the first half of that sentence.
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Yeah.
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Because the part where you said, I know what the Bible says, it just settled the matter.
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Yeah, sometimes we can make an open door do an awful lot of theological heavy lifting.
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Yeah, we sure can.
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And I think that's where Mordecai's language becomes so healthy for us in this conversation.
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He sees circumstances that may very well reflect God's providential work, but he still has enough humility to say.
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Yeah, who knows?
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And maybe Christians would speak more carefully about providence if those two words showed up in our vocabulary a little more often.
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Because sometimes it is only later that we look back and see how circumstances, choices, opportunities, and even difficult moments came together in ways we simply could not see while we were living through them.
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We always say hindsight is 2020.
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Well, hindsight may be 2020, but hindsight does not make me God.
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And maybe that's the real challenge there, Jonathan.
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We don't have to explain every event in our lives in order to trust the God who sees the entire picture.
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Which brings us to honestly where this conversation gets very personal.
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Esther is scripture.
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We know that.
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We're allowed to see her story from beginning to end.
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But um you out there, me, Cliff, all of us, we we don't get an inspired book explaining why things happened in Jonathan Sanford or Cliff Thompson or your life.
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So when I pray about something, and then a door opens or close, or circumstances suddenly come together in ways I never expected.
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How certain should I be when I say God did that?
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And brother, I think that may be one of the most important questions we can ask about this subject called providence.
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And scripture itself may give us a better way to talk about that, Jonathan, than the way we sometimes do.
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Oh, I think it does.
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We've already heard Mordecai say, Who knows?
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But there's another little word in the New Testament that I think belongs right beside it.
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You're thinking about Philemon, aren't you, brother?
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That's right.
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You know me all too well.
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Yes, um, we know Paul is writing about Onesimus, and in Philemon chapter 15, he says, For this perhaps is why he was parted from you for a while, that you might have him back forever.
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There it is, Jonathan.
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Perhaps.
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Yes, sir.
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And brother, that word matters.
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It really, really matters.
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Paul can see what happened, he can see how Onesimus came into his life, he can see that spiritual change that that followed, but he still doesn't tell Philemon, well, I know exactly why God allowed all this to happen.
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You know, he recognizes what may have happened and been God providential working without pretending God had revealed every detail of it to him.
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And brother, that should humble us.
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Mordecai says, Who knows?
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Paul says, Perhaps, yet sometimes we look at one circumstance in our life and speak as though God handed us the complete explanation.
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So, what you're saying, Jonathan, is that I can believe God is working without claiming that I Know precisely how he is working.
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That's uh that's the balance, brother.
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Perhaps isn't unbelief.
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What it is, is refusing to claim knowledge that God hasn't given me.
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And Jonathan, prayer is where that balance becomes very, very practical.
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I pray about something, and then something happens that looks very much like the thing I was asking God to provide.
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Oh man, I've had those moments.
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I'm I'm not going to become so afraid of saying too much that I refuse to thank God when that help comes.
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Neither am I, Jonathan.
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Gratitude and presumptions are two very different things.
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Yeah, let's think about it this way.
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If I pray for help and help comes my way, I can thank God.
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If I pray for an opportunity to serve and an opportunity to serve appears, I can thank God.
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Humility, brother, does not require me to treat every blessing like it must have just been some accident.
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But I can be grateful without claiming I know everything God did behind the scene.
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And brother, you had a statement when we were preparing for this, uh, even before we started this season.
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You had a statement in your thought process that I desperately hope that you would share with our audience.
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Well, folks, when you believe God has answered your prayer, let his providence increase your trust in him without increasing your arrogance.
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That is a million-dollar statement, brother.
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I'd give you a standing ovation if I could.
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Thank you, brother.
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Because what you said there in that statement is so important.
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Let his providence increase your trust without increasing your arrogance.
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And why?
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Because trust says, I am thankful and I believe God has cared for me.
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Now, arrogance says, Well, I know exactly what God did, why he did it, and what every part of it means.
00:24:37.359 --> 00:24:48.480
And there's uh quite truthfully, brother, there's another reason that humility matters here because sometimes we misread circumstances.
00:24:48.880 --> 00:24:50.559
We certainly can, Jonathan.
00:24:50.799 --> 00:24:59.759
Now, we've probably both at one point in our life or two or three or more, walked through a door thinking, well, God opened this.
00:25:00.559 --> 00:25:06.240
And months later, um, wondered why in the world did we ever walk through that door?
00:25:06.400 --> 00:25:11.519
Oh, Jonathan, I think I may have found one or two of those doors myself, brother.
00:25:11.839 --> 00:25:12.480
Me too.
00:25:12.720 --> 00:25:19.119
And here's the thing: maybe the door wasn't the problem.
00:25:20.240 --> 00:25:25.359
Maybe our interpretation of the door was actually the problem.
00:25:25.599 --> 00:25:29.599
Yeah, because you know, circumstances have to be interpreted.
00:25:29.759 --> 00:25:31.920
Scripture is revealed truth.
00:25:32.079 --> 00:25:32.400
Amen.
00:25:32.799 --> 00:25:36.400
Circumstances don't come with inspired footnotes.
00:25:36.640 --> 00:25:38.240
No, I like that, brother.
00:25:38.319 --> 00:25:41.039
You you are, as I say, in fuego today.
00:25:41.119 --> 00:25:42.319
You're on fire.
00:25:43.519 --> 00:25:51.759
Here's the thing: God's word gives me certainty about what he has revealed.
00:25:52.000 --> 00:25:53.200
Yes, it does.
00:25:53.519 --> 00:26:00.079
My reading of circumstances requires humility.
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:04.160
And Jonathan, that brings us back to those two expressions.
00:26:04.720 --> 00:26:05.839
Who knows?
00:26:06.160 --> 00:26:18.400
Perhaps see, confidence in God without pretending we possess his perspective.
00:26:18.720 --> 00:26:22.000
But brother, there's a harder side to this.
00:26:22.240 --> 00:26:23.359
I imagine there is.
00:26:23.920 --> 00:26:30.880
It's one thing to talk about providence when I pray and something happens that I'm very thankful for.
00:26:31.279 --> 00:26:38.799
But Jonathan, what do I do when Providence, when it happens, man, is painful.
00:26:40.160 --> 00:26:44.640
That's where, brother, I'm gonna be honest with everybody out there today.
00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:48.240
That's where this subject can get rather painful.
00:26:49.039 --> 00:26:50.640
We've got to be careful here.
00:26:50.799 --> 00:26:53.680
Listen, folks, please hear Cliff and I on this.
00:26:53.759 --> 00:27:02.160
We've got to be careful because some of the worst things Christians have ever said about Providence, brother.
00:27:02.400 --> 00:27:07.200
I've witnessed this, and I'm sure you have as well.
00:27:08.400 --> 00:27:13.119
Have been said to people who are already hurting.
00:27:13.599 --> 00:27:16.079
Oh, Jonathan, I have too.
00:27:16.319 --> 00:27:23.680
And I must admit to everyone out there, I get a little emotional when I think about it.
00:27:24.319 --> 00:27:35.839
You know, somebody is grieving, their world has just fallen apart, and almost immediately somebody feels the need to explain it to them.
00:27:36.160 --> 00:27:40.880
I can picture this playing out in my mind, Cliff.
00:27:42.079 --> 00:27:50.400
Usually they will begin with a sentence that sounds a little something like this.
00:27:52.720 --> 00:27:59.920
Well, brother, the reality is everything happens for a reason.
00:28:00.640 --> 00:28:16.319
Now, yes, Jonathan, I'll admit there are those times where these words may truly be intended to comfort someone, but in that moment, it can actually make the pain considerably worse.
00:28:16.720 --> 00:28:27.759
Yes, especially if what we are really implying is God directly caused this terrible thing to happen.
00:28:28.000 --> 00:28:31.920
He had some hidden reason for doing it.
00:28:32.240 --> 00:28:36.160
Folks, let me say this very, very clearly.
00:28:36.400 --> 00:28:42.000
Scripture has never, nor will it ever, give us the right to say that.
00:28:42.640 --> 00:28:43.680
Yeah, brother.
00:28:43.920 --> 00:28:48.960
Sometimes the reason something happens is because somebody sinned.
00:28:49.279 --> 00:28:52.559
Uh, maybe somebody acted selfishly.
00:28:53.119 --> 00:28:54.079
Here's one for you.
00:28:54.240 --> 00:28:56.160
Somebody made a terrible decision.
00:28:56.400 --> 00:28:57.839
Yeah, exactly.
00:28:58.400 --> 00:29:01.119
And this is where Joseph.
00:29:01.839 --> 00:29:05.039
We spent a long time, I preached about this last year.
00:29:05.279 --> 00:29:09.839
This is where Joseph helps us enormously.
00:29:10.319 --> 00:29:24.480
At the end of Genesis, he looks at his very brothers who sold him into slavery, and he says, You meant evil against me, but God meant it for good.
00:29:25.039 --> 00:29:30.799
Same events, but Jonathan, don't you agree that we see two very different intentions?
00:29:31.039 --> 00:29:31.759
Yes, Cliff.
00:29:31.839 --> 00:29:34.240
And that's what I don't want us to miss here.
00:29:34.640 --> 00:29:38.960
Joseph never calls what his brothers did good.
00:29:39.200 --> 00:29:44.799
No, their betrayal was very evil, and they were responsible for it.
00:29:45.039 --> 00:29:49.440
But their evil did not prevent God from accomplishing good.
00:29:49.759 --> 00:29:50.799
And there it is.
00:29:52.000 --> 00:29:57.440
And maybe we need to say this as plainly as we possibly can.
00:29:58.000 --> 00:30:04.000
God caused it and God used it are not always the same statement.
00:30:04.240 --> 00:30:07.039
No, that's an important distinction, Jonathan.
00:30:07.279 --> 00:30:22.079
I think it absolutely is essential in this case, because God does not have to become the author of evil in order to be sovereign over a situation that evil has created.
00:30:22.640 --> 00:30:24.480
Jonathan, you and I taught it.
00:30:24.559 --> 00:30:28.880
And brother, that helps us understand Romans 8:28 correctly.
00:30:29.119 --> 00:30:30.400
Amen to that.
00:30:30.880 --> 00:30:44.720
Paul says, and we know that for those who love God, all things work together for good for those who are called according to his purpose.
00:30:45.039 --> 00:30:52.400
And I think it's important, folks, listen, notice, he did not say that all things are good.
00:30:52.720 --> 00:30:52.960
No.
00:30:53.200 --> 00:30:57.359
Because the reality, folks, is that pain is still pain.
00:30:59.440 --> 00:31:02.400
And a tragedy is still a tragedy.
00:31:02.720 --> 00:31:10.799
But the good news, brother, is that none of those things put God in check, mate.
00:31:10.960 --> 00:31:12.000
Yeah, Jonathan.
00:31:12.160 --> 00:31:15.119
Life can hurt us in ways we never saw coming.
00:31:15.279 --> 00:31:21.759
And yet, God is still able to work through circumstances he never morally approved.
00:31:22.000 --> 00:31:30.799
So maybe when something painful happens, the faithful response isn't, I know exactly why God did this.
00:31:31.119 --> 00:31:41.200
Yeah, instead, Jonathan, we need to say, I don't know exactly what God is doing, but I know who God is, and I will remain faithful to him.
00:31:41.519 --> 00:31:42.400
Yeah, brother.
00:31:42.720 --> 00:31:52.079
The reality is, providence, it does not promise me that everything painful is always gonna make perfect sense.
00:31:53.359 --> 00:31:56.480
God didn't promise me an explanation.
00:31:56.720 --> 00:31:58.480
That's very true, Jonathan.
00:31:58.640 --> 00:32:02.160
But the good news is God gave us something better than that.
00:32:02.319 --> 00:32:02.880
Amen.
00:32:03.200 --> 00:32:04.240
Confidence.
00:32:04.640 --> 00:32:10.640
Confidence that God's not absence simply because you cannot see what he's doing.
00:32:10.960 --> 00:32:20.960
Cliff, that takes, in all honesty, that takes our thoughts right back to that man that we met at the beginning of today's conversation.
00:32:21.200 --> 00:32:22.160
Yes, Jonathan.
00:32:22.240 --> 00:32:34.160
You know, when I think back to the man we spoke of, the job that disappeared, the phone call that came from his mother, those final moments with his father.
00:32:34.400 --> 00:32:35.039
Wow.
00:32:35.519 --> 00:32:36.799
Wow, brother.
00:32:38.160 --> 00:32:45.200
I really think we have to come back to the same humility we've talked about throughout today's conversation, Jonathan.
00:32:45.599 --> 00:32:47.680
I I certainly agree with you, Cliff.
00:32:47.920 --> 00:33:01.119
And and when we talk about that humility, I think there are two questions that we must put side by side.
00:33:01.599 --> 00:33:02.559
All right, Jonathan.
00:33:02.640 --> 00:33:03.359
Let's hear them.
00:33:03.839 --> 00:33:17.039
First, could this man look back and and thank God that he was still close enough to reach that hospital before his father passed away?
00:33:17.279 --> 00:33:18.400
So absolutely.
00:33:18.640 --> 00:33:23.759
And that one hits home with me, Jonathan, because we've talked about this before.
00:33:24.000 --> 00:33:27.200
I tried to reach my own father before he passed away.
00:33:27.359 --> 00:33:27.680
Yeah.
00:33:28.079 --> 00:33:33.279
So putting myself in this man's shoes, yes, without hesitation.
00:33:33.599 --> 00:33:37.839
He could thank God that he was able to spend those final moments with his father.
00:33:38.079 --> 00:33:39.839
All right, so that was question number one.
00:33:40.000 --> 00:33:42.640
Here is question uh dos.
00:33:43.119 --> 00:33:44.720
We'll call it that today.
00:33:45.119 --> 00:33:48.799
And good folks, uh, don't answer this one too quickly.
00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:50.000
I want you to think about it.
00:33:50.160 --> 00:33:51.920
Soak it in for just a moment.
00:33:52.880 --> 00:34:06.400
Could that same man, could that same man say with equal certainty, God took that job away because he knew my father was gonna die?
00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:15.920
You almost want to say yes, because looking backwards, uh all those dots seem to connect perfectly.
00:34:16.159 --> 00:34:17.360
Yeah, they really do.
00:34:18.239 --> 00:34:24.719
But when you slow down and you think about it, Jonathan, you have to say no.
00:34:25.440 --> 00:34:28.639
He couldn't say that with the same certainty.
00:34:29.039 --> 00:34:33.119
And that distinction is so big here.
00:34:33.920 --> 00:34:51.599
He can know he was there, he can know he is thankful, but he cannot know that God prevented that job specifically because his father was gonna die.
00:34:52.079 --> 00:34:56.159
Right, because Jonathan, God never revealed that to him.
00:34:56.400 --> 00:35:04.719
No, and and the problem is we can move from gratitude to certainty awfully fast.
00:35:04.960 --> 00:35:06.000
Yes, we can.
00:35:06.400 --> 00:35:18.000
We we just got to be careful here because thank God I was there, and I know exactly why God closed that door, are two very different statements.
00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:26.079
One is gratitude, and the other is an explanation that we just honestly were never given.
00:35:26.320 --> 00:35:28.960
And that's where humility matters, Jonathan.
00:35:29.280 --> 00:35:43.840
God's providence doesn't mean we can always see God's hand, it means we can trust his hand, even when we cannot see it, and we don't have to turn every coincidence into a divine message.
00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:45.679
Amen, brother.
00:35:46.320 --> 00:35:56.159
I know God's character, I trust his word, and and ultimately he sees what I just cannot see.
00:35:56.719 --> 00:35:57.920
Who knows?
00:35:59.039 --> 00:36:11.039
Perhaps trust without arrogance and confidence in God without pretending he possesses his perspective.
00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:12.639
Wow.
00:36:13.840 --> 00:36:16.079
Well, good folks, uh, that's gonna do it.
00:36:16.159 --> 00:36:17.360
Our time is up.
00:36:17.840 --> 00:36:21.199
This is gone by like uh second.
00:36:21.840 --> 00:36:38.239
Um, but before we go, listen, just remember next Friday at 3:30 p.m., Lord willing, Cliff and I will turn our minds toward another subject that hits pretty close to home.
00:36:38.480 --> 00:36:43.840
Yeah, Jonathan, it's hard to believe, but only three episodes remain in season two.
00:36:44.079 --> 00:36:53.920
So in episode 11, we're gonna ask, what does following Christ look like when obedience gets difficult?
00:36:54.639 --> 00:36:58.719
Inconvenience or simply exhausting?
00:36:59.119 --> 00:37:01.360
Wow, that inconvenient moment.
00:37:01.519 --> 00:37:02.079
Wow.
00:37:02.880 --> 00:37:11.679
Next week, our conversation is going to be entitled Faithfulness Matters.
00:37:12.000 --> 00:37:15.119
And we hope y'all be right back with us here.
00:37:15.360 --> 00:37:18.480
Until then, though, this is Jonathan Sanford.
00:37:18.639 --> 00:37:20.159
And I'm Cliff Thompson.
00:37:20.320 --> 00:37:23.840
Reminding all of you out there, as always, to stay grounded.
00:37:24.079 --> 00:37:25.519
Folks, stay focused.
00:37:25.760 --> 00:37:31.199
And remember, good folks, Scripture Matters.
00:37:31.519 --> 00:37:32.800
Goodbye, everybody.
00:37:32.960 --> 00:37:33.679
Thank y'all.
00:37:33.920 --> 00:37:38.320
Thanks for spending part of your day with us on the Scripture Matters Podcast.
00:37:38.480 --> 00:37:42.559
We'll be back with a new conversation every Friday at 3.30 p.m.
00:37:42.880 --> 00:37:46.880
on YouTube, Facebook, and all major podcast platforms.
00:37:47.599 --> 00:37:51.039
Until then, may the word guide you and your week.
00:37:51.119 --> 00:37:54.559
And as always, remember Scripture Matter.