Brian Sanders - Nutrient Energy Quotient (NEQ) and Intake Regulation Model (IRM)

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Hey y'all, welcome back to another episode of Metabolic Mindset.
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I've got Brian Sanders on this time, and we're gonna be talking about sort of his background and some papers that he's working on and his book that are all very relevant for metabolism.
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Um and we're just kind of gonna have like a very all over the place conversation, but I'm excited for it.
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So welcome, Brian.
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Thank you.
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Yeah, excited.
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This stuff is my life.
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It's been my life for nine years full time, and I think I've come up with something novel, so I'm publishing some papers, yes.
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Yeah, I felt like I had never read anything like these papers, so I'm excited that we get to talk about it first on the podcast.
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Have you talked about this on other podcasts yet?
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Not really.
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I've talked a high level on some shows, but no, not we haven't delved deep because no one's really read them yet, except for the they're in peer review right now in the journal Metabolic Health, but no one has really read them yet.
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Okay, so like how many eyes have been on it other than mine?
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Uh maybe like five.
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Oh, I felt okay, I feel really special.
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So I was running these by just reading excerpts from this to a friend who's he's semi-nutrition literate.
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Like he's done some nutrition counseling with me, and everything that I was saying made a lot of sense to him.
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And he's done a pro-metabolic diet with me, so I think a lot of this clicks anyway with him.
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But with the general concepts, uh uh, we'll get into it for sure.
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But can you just run people through when you said this is your life?
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Explain why is this your life?
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Why are you a guest on the podcast?
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Yes.
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Well, I mean, I've known you in Austin for many years, and you actually were helping with food lies.
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Remember back in the day, you were helping doing some writing and some editing for the six-part series.
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So nine years ago, I went full-time into this making this series.
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But 13 years ago, I lost both my parents to chronic disease.
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So this was when I was about 30, and they had Alzheimer's and cancer, which a lot of doctors and mainstream people don't recognize as metabolic diseases.
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But in the large majority of times, I think they are, and many doctors I interview believe that they are.
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So I've interviewed about 300 doctors and scientists in that time.
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Not all in nutrition, some in fitness, some in regenerative agriculture, some paleoanthropology, all those types of things, but all to find out how the human body works, how how can we thrive, what do we need to eat, do, live?
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Just answer all these questions.
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So started a podcast called Peak Humans.
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Oh, you have to do it all.
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I think one of my big things is that so many people are just narrowly in their field.
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And I respect these PhDs, way smarter than me.
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You know, they dive deep, they're so smart, and they're doing these crazy experiments, and and then they get stuck on these tiny little mechanisms, or they have a certain bias like going in.
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Like a lot of the bias right now is against red meat and saturated fat, right?
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And cholesterol.
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And this is just kind of a bias for 50 to 70 years.
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And so they go in there like trying to find out why red meat's bad.
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When it's not, it's not bad.
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It's uh everything else you've eaten along with that red meat is a problem, right?
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And red meat gets blamed.
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So they look for the mechanisms like, oh, what about TMAO?
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You know, I watch all the vegan documentaries, and they're like, oh, the TMAO, red meat.
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Like fish raises TMAO way more than meat, and everyone thinks fish is the healthiest thing ever.
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So you know, you're getting caught up in these tiny little mechanisms, and you have to zoom out, you have to look at human history.
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That doesn't mean we need to follow paleo diet necessarily, but it's a great starting point because I interviewed this great PhD.
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Um, he spent his whole career, like 40 years at UC Davis.
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Dave, oh my gosh, now I'm forgetting his name right now.
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But he, evolutionary biologist, just he he's just very famous in his field for fruit doing fruit fly research and talking about aging.
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And he said, all animals, including humans, do best in the environment, the diet and the environment which they evolved.
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Right?
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So it's it's like kind of common knowledge with all animals, but then we think that humans are different somehow, and that we can just eat pasta and cornflakes and we're gonna be healthy when that is absolutely not how we ate for all of human history.
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So it does make sense to I mean, I include pasta every single night, but so like but I do I agree with you.
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Like you wouldn't put a dog like dogs is not it's not gonna thrive on like the busy streets of New York, you know, like on a farm or something like that, eating a dog appropriate diet.
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And just really quickly, I think this is so funny because uh my dog's 15.
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I took him to the vet and the vet was like, How old is this dog?
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And I was like, Oh, he's 15.
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And she goes, He looks like her.
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Yeah, because we eat the same thing.
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Um, he eats like a lot of turkey and chicken and beef, and I feed him eggs, and he's got a sweet potato, and I throw a lot of fruit in there.
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He's got a really varied diet.
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And the first thing she says, like, we did blag lab work on him.
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She goes, He's incredibly healthy and he looks like he's sick.
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So, what are you feeding this dog?
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And I told her what I'm feeding him, and then she goes, He really needs to be on a kibble diet.
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No way.
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That's so classic.
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Where it's you just hear the weirdest, and I listened to one of your podcasts the other day where you said, like, you really just have to apply a level of not just scientific thinking but common sense with some of this stuff.
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And when you say an ancestral way of eating, yeah, that makes total sense.
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That if we've evolved over millennia to do something a certain way, that makes the most sense to follow that pattern rather than go down a completely different trajectory where we only eat seed oils.
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What is this?
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Well, yeah, it's it's funny that people think, oh, now we're finally healthy in 1907 when we invented seed oils.
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Finally, the perfect fat for humans after millions of years if you believe in the normal evolution theory, right?
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Millions of years, and then finally, so uh and also I don't hundred percent believe in everything just ancestral, right?
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You have to check that too with modern science, right?
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So I try not to get in any camp or any one belief and just be open, and then but you can have some guiding principles, and you know, a guiding principle is what we ate for all of history is probably good, and that's whole foods, and that but that's very varied.
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People people lived all around the world in all different climates, all different diets, right?
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And this is why I started zooming out and not getting it to eat any one diet.
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I told you we're playing basketball.
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I'm like, I love the the rapede and the pro-metabolic and all this stuff, but I'm not caught up in that theory either.
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I can take from that, I can take from paleo, take from whole food, whole 30, whatever.
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Take vegetarians.
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Why are vegetarians mostly healthy?
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Right?
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What are they doing?
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You know, there's there's you can be healthy or not healthy on any diet, right?
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It's just like if you're doing it in a bad way.
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So the papers are about that, the series, everything I do is is kind of based around how to not be wrong, how to be the most right.
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Look at all the best evidence from all the doctors and scientists I've interviewed, all the papers, all the conferences I've been doing, just everything, and put it together into something that makes sense and isn't wrong, right?
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It's it's the most right that I can be.
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So I'll just back up real quick before I move on.
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Just so my history.
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So I was 30, I was overweight, you know, I wasn't gigantic.
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I was just kind of tubby, you know, had acid reflux and allergies and joint pain and all this, you know, 25 pounds of fat that I didn't even know I had on me.
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I just, you know, was getting the dad bod like everyone does at 30 and thinks is normal.
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And then I just realized, oh, this is not normal.
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I changed the way I was eating.
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I got rid of most processed foods, started eating more protein, stuff like that, animal foods, and all my problems went away.
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And I lost all this fat, and I've been super healthy ever since.
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Nine years ago, like I said, I went full-time into this, started making the Food Lies series, watched one too many vegan film.
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I got triggered by what the health, you know, these terrible vegan films, and decided I was gonna make my own series, and it's been so long, it's not done yet, it turns into a six art turned into a six-part series.
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And along the way, I've done other things, right?
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So that's yeah, I have the Sapien Center in Austin, I'm writing the papers, writing the book, uh, just doing all kinds of different things along the way.
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So that's my story to start us off.
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And it's a good story.
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I mean, honestly, I feel like you're a true Austinite and that your interests are in like being physically active and being outside and being involved in health and wellness in some sort of way.
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That's hilarious about the what the health documentary.
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I remember going to see that and being so triggered.
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And and first of all, I think about that a lot of times now, and I'll tie this into something else.
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But first, I wanted to know like why is this triggering me so much?
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I'm angry.
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I was like gripping the seat at the theater.
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I was pissed because I remember we went as a group for the gym.
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Um and we went to like a special showing at a for some for something.
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I don't remember.
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Um, but I do remember seeing it in the theater, and I I got so angry.
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And that's important to observe that that it made me that angry.
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Uh a lot of it you could just do a cursory Google search and and it's completely incorrect, by the way.
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It doesn't take a large amount of intelligence to watch that film critically and find a lot of issues with it.
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It was an animal rights act activist film.
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That's what I figured out about a lot of vegans, is they're animal rights activists, and they'll just do whatever they can and make up anything and talk to the one paleoanthropologist in the entire world that thinks that we were plant-based and interview her.
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And that, you know, they did that with game changers too.
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Game changers went on Netflix and was this huge deal.
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It was game.
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Well, yeah, game changers was a more recent one, and they had all these athletes in it, and Arnold Schwarzenegger was in it, and James Cameron produced it, and it was this big deal, and it was just so bogus.
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It was just it's just animal rights or James Cameron.
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I mean, people have different reasons for doing things, but he he also had 140 or 160 million dollars invested in pea protein.
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So he he definitely got on this vegan kind of wagon train and thought there was gonna be some money in it.
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That really brings me down to I feel like one of the reasons why I was so interested just in food lives when I first talked to you about it, because you were so like animated.
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And this was one of our first conversations.
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I I think I had found either your podcast or something, and that's why I went to Sapien Center in the first place.
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But I remember saying, like, oh, can I help you with that in any way?
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And you're like, Yeah, we just we're trying to figure out like the truth.
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Like, I want to know the truth.
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I'm interested in that too.
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Because my username is don't do dogma for a reason.
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And it can appear that I'm quite dogmatic at any given time, but that's usually because I'm obsessed with learning something or I'm obsessed with like learning the framework and what makes it tick.
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But I feel like science, the word science has gotten so manipulated.
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And we think of large organizations like the Heart Association or the Diabetes Association, and people link them inextricably with science or things that the government releases and say, like, okay, well, the FDA came out with this, so it has to be perfectly scientific for a large amount of the time.
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It's not.
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And I feel like the true spirit of science is being continually interested in new information.
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So I like these articles.
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Really quickly, can you just I know you kind of explained what food lies is, but explain like is there an end date for food lies?
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Like, what's going on with food lies?
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And what is food lies about?
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Yeah, so food lies is just the quest for what should humans eat?
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And no one knows the answer, and I don't exactly know the answer.
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Like you said, I I'm just trying not to be wrong.
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And what's the best framework that makes the most sense?
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So that's what food lies is trying to answer.
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It's like, what should we eat?
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And it's super confusing because there's vegans, there's carnivores, there's they're completely opposite, right?
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Everyone's out there telling you completely different things.
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You open up Instagram and they can say exactly opposite things.
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You can open up a scientific journal, it can say opposite things, right?
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So food lies is how to figure out what to eat, how to, you know, and going through it all.
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So six episodes, we start from human history and go way back, and we you know, we find cut marks on bones, you know, from two million, two and a half million years ago.
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We were butchering animals, we created fire, we're hunting.
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Like the animal foods were a huge part of our history as humans, and it changed our guts and our digestive systems and our brains.
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Like it kind of drove us to be human, like the change in our diet.
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It wasn't that we just ate meat, it's like ate meat mate as human and any animal food, too.
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It's not even meat, it's seafood, turtles, lizards, eggs, like oysters, just anything.
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We in all these different environments, we we always got as many animal foods as we could as a foundation of our diet and filled it in with whole foods, because that's all we had around it, right?
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Tubers and fruit, honey, whatever else was around us, berries, some leaves here and there, but not really much.
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Herbs.
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You know, actually, I went with the hunter-gatherers.
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Skip ahead.
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So in in the series, I go to Tanzania and spend time with the Hadza, the Hunter-Gathers, the Maasai, who drink blood and milk and eat meat.
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And yeah, these people are not eating leaves and nuts and seeds that much.
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Sometimes nuts, they'll they'll eat some nuts if they they can, but they're they're going after animals, they're eating the entire animal.
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You know, they're drinking blood, they're drinking raw milk, they're eating the liver.
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The first thing we did when we got with the Huds is they opened up this little dict and gave it, gave me a piece of raw liver, and I ate it.
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And they're like, whoa, this white dude ate it.
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I couldn't believe you would do it.
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Yeah, and it was like covered in guts and slime, and this knife had never been washed, and they like opened it up on a rock.
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So I have a whole nother theory about fiber too.
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I'm not into the fiber narratives.
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I think fiber, every study shows that people who eat more fiber are healthier.
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All that means is more people who eat more whole foods are healthier and they eat less processed foods, right?
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It's not that fiber is magical, it's a non-nutritive substance.
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Of course, it feeds your gut bacteria, and I understand all that.
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But you accidentally, I call it like accidentally get fiber just by eating, you know, a normal whole foods diet, right?
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So we can go into this stuff later.
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But no, no, that's so I'll stop you.
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It's fascinating because I don't have people chase a fiber target at all.
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It it doesn't make sense.
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I I I see so much of these influencers or nutrition people, oh, we're we're we're not hitting our fiber targets, or that we have a lack of fiber problem in America.
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All these crazy things, like this makes no sense.
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It's not a necessary nutrient.
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They yes, they say that your goal is to hit these 30 grams of fiber, but then they also say it's actually not required.
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And then I think it's interesting, all these carnivores over the years, it's been about nine years.
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I remember Dr.
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Sean Baker went on Joe Rogan nine years ago and and kind of introduced carnivore to the world.
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I interviewed him the day before it for food lies, actually.
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And so, yeah, it was kind of random.
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It was like right in LA.
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He was in LA to go on Rogan, and I interviewed him the day before.
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Wow, but that's no one knew what carnivore was until December 7th or 8th, 2017, when when Sean Baker went on.
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But since then, thousands, hundreds of thousands, maybe a million people have done carnivore and they've had zero fiber and had amazing health stories, lost so much weight, all this stuff.
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I don't think zero fiber is the way to go.
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But it's just interesting.
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And your ancestors by no means were looking for a fiber target.
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Like you said, they would just drink.
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So tell tell I want to talk about this on the podcast because I couldn't believe you said this.
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But was it the Hadza or the Maasai that did the honey thing?
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Uh the Hadza or the honey people, yes.
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The Hadza.
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But can you explain how much in one setting?
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Oh, yeah.
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Well, they've been documented drinking up to a liter of honey at a time.
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And so, and even more.
00:16:37.419 --> 00:16:43.259
I think one paper said even more, but they just stopped, they just had an estimate of over a liter at a time.
00:16:43.340 --> 00:16:46.700
And they, I mean, we didn't find a great beehive when I was with them.
00:16:46.779 --> 00:16:55.899
We found just sort of, you know, like a half-empty one, and they were just kind of eating the whole honeycomb and gnawing on it, and then we moved on and continued our hunt.
00:16:56.060 --> 00:17:00.779
But yeah, they of course they're not they're not calorie restricting, they're not thinking about anything.
00:17:00.860 --> 00:17:01.820
That's part of my papers.
00:17:02.139 --> 00:17:06.059
Well, how many of them are diabetic and just obese and and dying of heart disease?
00:17:06.379 --> 00:17:12.379
No, they're they're all like the leanest, healthiest people on earth, and and so and they die from different reasons.
00:17:12.539 --> 00:17:14.939
I mean, people probably know this story, they don't die at 35.
00:17:15.019 --> 00:17:22.779
Like, there's all these bogus stories about our ancestors dying young, and some of this to do with the average age of death, which is infant mortality, right?
00:17:23.019 --> 00:17:25.419
It's way lower on average because of all those deaths.
00:17:25.579 --> 00:17:29.659
They don't they die of infections and accidents and all this other thing.
00:17:29.740 --> 00:17:32.539
I mean, we were hunting with you know a 70-year-old guy.
00:17:32.699 --> 00:17:39.419
He was out there just hunting with us all day, and so yeah, they're all super lean and healthy.
00:17:39.500 --> 00:17:42.459
They all, I mean, also they they're you know moving around all day.
00:17:42.619 --> 00:17:51.740
But also, Herman Ponser, this Harvard scientist who studied the Hadza a lot, found that they actually burn about the same amount of calories as Americans.
00:17:52.139 --> 00:17:53.259
This is the craziest thing.
00:17:53.339 --> 00:17:54.939
There's a whole book about it called Burn.
00:17:55.259 --> 00:17:59.019
Huge, just a mainstream book, probably you know, on some bestseller lists.
00:17:59.099 --> 00:18:00.139
It's called Burn.
00:18:00.379 --> 00:18:05.419
So for the body weight, if you like equate for body weight, they burn the same amount of calories as Westerners.
00:18:05.659 --> 00:18:07.740
Sedentary Westerners, it's increasing, it's insane.
00:18:07.899 --> 00:18:09.339
It's called the constrained energy.
00:18:09.659 --> 00:18:12.059
Uh is that what's called constrained energy theory?
00:18:12.299 --> 00:18:19.099
Uh crazy where they're so efficient at doing it that they actually don't burn more calories than us.
00:18:19.259 --> 00:18:24.459
Or also they yeah, they also they'll go out hunting and then they'll sit around for the rest of the day.
00:18:24.699 --> 00:18:27.419
And like, yeah, their life's like vacation.
00:18:27.579 --> 00:18:31.500
They kind of just hang out by the fire and they're yeah, they just kind of eat meat.
00:18:31.659 --> 00:18:32.859
They actually smoke bushweed.
00:18:32.939 --> 00:18:33.500
It's kind of funny.
00:18:33.579 --> 00:18:40.699
They'll take like receipts, they like find receipts, like pure BPA, and they'll roll joints from bushweed.
00:18:40.859 --> 00:18:46.539
And so we bought them some uh rolling papers made from natural paper.
00:18:46.939 --> 00:18:49.579
We can at least do this in a healthier sort of way.
00:18:49.819 --> 00:18:56.299
Yeah, it's like I don't know what the best gift we can give them is encouraging them to smoke weed, but they they need some help.
00:18:56.619 --> 00:18:58.939
But I don't want to, there's so many loose ends here.
00:18:59.179 --> 00:19:14.299
So they're very healthy, they don't die of chronic disease, they die of infections and accidents, they drink honey if they find it in huge amounts, they eat whatever's around them, they don't go after fiber, they go after animals.
00:19:14.539 --> 00:19:18.379
And this is even when they don't have many animals to hunt.
00:19:18.539 --> 00:19:21.019
For all of history, they had gigantic animals.
00:19:21.179 --> 00:19:37.339
And I now I'm my new hobby is reading all these historic like people who live with hunter-gatherers or people who live traditionally, and these old books from like the 50s and 60s and 70s, when people would go and live with the last remaining people, and they just describe how they lived.
00:19:37.419 --> 00:19:38.779
And it's very interesting.
00:19:38.859 --> 00:19:46.859
But they yeah, they're certainly not eating kale salads, and they're you know, they're going after animals, and they had way bigger animals, right, for all of history.
00:19:47.019 --> 00:19:58.059
And now all of those big animals are in game reserves, and the government you know makes money off safaris, and they give these last remaining hunter-gatherers like a tiny piece of land where they can barely get animals.
00:19:58.459 --> 00:20:00.619
But yet they still get animals every single day.
00:20:00.859 --> 00:20:02.219
Every single day they hunt.
00:20:02.379 --> 00:20:04.379
They they can they're incredible.
00:20:04.459 --> 00:20:06.059
They it's absolutely amazing.
00:20:06.219 --> 00:20:13.979
These guys will see this tiny little bird in a tree and just shoot it, or this tiny little bush baby, and they'll get like this little tiny bush baby and then just eat it.
00:20:14.059 --> 00:20:16.219
Like they'll get baboons, they get whatever they can.
00:20:16.379 --> 00:20:18.859
They're so good at it, and it makes sense.
00:20:19.019 --> 00:20:22.059
Like, this is what we did for all of history.
00:20:22.299 --> 00:20:23.819
We were experts at hunting.
00:20:23.899 --> 00:20:35.500
Now we use our big brains to make AI supercomputers, but we still had big brains, and we used those to track animals, hunt, make tools, find the most delicious berries and honey.
00:20:35.899 --> 00:20:37.259
It's amazing what we could do.
00:20:37.339 --> 00:20:39.899
Like, we were just as smart and we used it for different things.
00:20:39.979 --> 00:20:41.500
So we were not starving.
00:20:41.740 --> 00:20:50.939
We were, and also we were not like just on 30-mile tracks every single day, you know, like some people think they like Herman Ponser.
00:20:51.579 --> 00:20:52.539
Read the book Burn.
00:20:52.619 --> 00:20:56.779
Yeah, they they actually burn about the same amount of calories per day as Westerners.
00:20:57.099 --> 00:21:04.779
And the other story I want to tie up, sorry, before we move on, is that I was talking about fiber and well how I don't really believe the fiber narrative, and but that they have a good microbiome.
00:21:04.939 --> 00:21:10.459
We know that some, you know, the more natural living people, especially hunter gathers, have a really good microbiome.
00:21:10.539 --> 00:21:19.740
That's and they're eating, like I said, the green and yellow guts from from the animal off a rock and the liver.
00:21:19.819 --> 00:21:21.339
And I ate that and felt amazing.
00:21:21.419 --> 00:21:23.500
They're eating off a off the ground.
00:21:23.579 --> 00:21:29.019
They're they're getting the microbiome from their environment and you know, eating dirt basically.
00:21:29.259 --> 00:21:33.740
So it's so interesting that argument, too, because it's multifaceted.
00:21:33.899 --> 00:21:45.419
It could be that they're low cortisol, it could be that they eat a lot of the same foods kind of in repetition without introducing all these like sugar alcohols and chemicals and added things over and over again.
00:21:45.579 --> 00:21:51.899
Like it it it yes, part of it could be the soil and all of that, but it could also just be the simplicity of their diet.
00:21:52.539 --> 00:21:53.979
And and we'll get to that, right?
00:21:54.139 --> 00:21:58.379
It's not processed food, it's simple, they repeat it often.
00:21:58.619 --> 00:22:05.659
Uh they don't take probiotics, they don't take fish oil, um, they don't take supplements, and and they're low stress.
00:22:05.979 --> 00:22:10.619
Like you you you express that I remember you telling me this that they are just hanging out.
00:22:11.019 --> 00:22:12.059
out around the campfire.
00:22:12.219 --> 00:22:19.259
They'll go do their hunt, but it's not like a chaotic people picture like when a child when a lion takes down a gazelle.
00:22:19.500 --> 00:22:24.619
And like you said, that humans were starving and we were having to look for like greens and nuts and seeds.
00:22:24.939 --> 00:22:41.659
And that's not that's not a picture that you get when you came back from visiting with them that they seemed like very low stressed about food and they would just kind of okay I guess we're gonna go for a hunt again and it was just like a daily activity not like oh my god we're gonna die if we can't find X amount of food.
00:22:41.740 --> 00:22:44.139
That's not how they're living they're very low stress.
00:22:44.619 --> 00:22:47.899
And this is yeah confirmed in all the books I've read about them or Dr.
00:22:47.979 --> 00:22:55.179
Bill Schindler friend of mine that studies them for a living and had a TV show about he's he you know he's really epic does kind of research.
00:22:55.339 --> 00:23:02.459
Yeah he's he also he says if we were that close to death if it was that hard we wouldn't be around today.
00:23:02.539 --> 00:23:04.859
Like we are here today because we were thriving.
00:23:05.019 --> 00:23:26.219
It's like he he had a show where he was living like we did thousands of years ago and and he was stressed out like he was not doing well he was cold you know because he it was out of his element and he was with a woman that wasn't his wife and he was saying like the last thing he thought about was anything sexual with this woman.
00:23:26.379 --> 00:23:40.219
Like he was like trying to survive and and so that's when he realized I like how much we were thriving because if we were like what he was doing where it was just live or die day to day we wouldn't still be here.
00:23:40.379 --> 00:23:46.219
We wouldn't have the time or resources to procreate and raise kids and have healthy and all that stuff.
00:23:46.459 --> 00:23:53.579
He he was like wow now I realize we were thriving you know and that's why we're here it's like we knew how to do this stuff.
00:23:53.740 --> 00:23:54.459
We were good at it.
00:23:54.619 --> 00:24:34.859
We got good nutrition and Weston Price saw this you know Weston A price he's yeah kind of a huge influence on me he figured this all out a hundred years ago he went around the world and talked to all and visit all these people who didn't have modern foods yet healthiest people we ever saw full wide mouth all their teeth no cavities and they had all these traditions around pregnancy they would give the women liver and egg yolks or seafood the most nutrient dense things they could find like bone marrow and they would they they knew this in completely separate populations right he visited all these populations had no contact with each other and they all had the same practices.
00:24:35.019 --> 00:25:10.619
So we were thriving we understood nutrition even though we had didn't know about nutrients or calories we just ate what was around us and had instincts and we thrived yeah which I mean kind of takes us into the articles a little bit that we didn't have to receive nutrition counseling like I do all day for people like in most of my nutrition counseling is trying to get people to eat whole foods like to switch more of their diet to real foods that they can look at and go that's a potato and more away from the packaged foods and the fast foods and the highly industrialized and processed foods.
00:25:10.779 --> 00:25:19.259
So I can just sort of start going through these and and pick out pieces but you're calling it the nutrient energy quotient the NEQ NEQ.
00:25:19.579 --> 00:25:35.899
So that's one paper yeah one paper is about NEQ so kind of defining that and it's kind of the theory of everything about nutrition it's well okay to back up a little bit the whole book the book is called the new theory of food and it might be out in a a month.
00:25:36.219 --> 00:25:39.500
And I'm gonna do the audiobook myself and I'm excited.
00:25:39.899 --> 00:25:40.459
Okay cool.
00:25:40.779 --> 00:25:42.299
I think you have a good voice for it.
00:25:42.619 --> 00:25:43.019
Thank you.
00:25:43.179 --> 00:25:46.219
Hopefully yeah I have a good mic I can I feel like I can do it.
00:25:46.459 --> 00:26:07.819
So uh the the the the subtitle of the book is why you keep eating when you don't want to and that that's kind of what we're we're kind of revolving around here right I'm kind of saying for all of history we had natural body composition that was lean and healthy and we had natural health and we lived a long time unless we died from an infection or accident.
00:26:07.979 --> 00:26:11.019
And that was true on and off really for all of history.
00:26:11.179 --> 00:26:19.339
I mean of course there was like the dark ages there was like times we were eating gruel and and all we had was bread or porridge you know and it we weren't doing very well.
00:26:19.979 --> 00:26:27.500
But when we had consistent food, you know, we could just eat what was around us and we were naturally healthy.
00:26:27.579 --> 00:26:29.899
That's even up until like say 1970s.
00:26:30.059 --> 00:26:33.979
I I love in the book I I love using this like a photo of Woodstock.
00:26:34.059 --> 00:26:35.339
Have you seen these photos of Woodstock?
00:26:35.500 --> 00:26:44.459
Or the It's not a bunch of actors yeah it's not like okay let's look at movies from the 70s at all the fit hot actors these are just random people who showed up at Woodstock.
00:26:44.539 --> 00:26:53.419
Every single person is lean and healthy and that's just generally what it was I I have videos of you know 1920s in New York and the people walking by and everyone's fit and healthy.
00:26:53.579 --> 00:27:17.979
So up until around 1980 that's kind of if you look at the obesity charts if you look at a like a graph of it it has kind of a sharp uptick in 1980 and that's right when the dietary guidelines were introduced with the you know 1977 was around then and then 1980 it was all around that time when they made the whole base of the food pyramid the processed grains and stuff like that and kind of more minimizing meat and fat.
00:27:18.459 --> 00:27:27.819
And we were very like you you could just eat what was around you and be sort of naturally healthy.
00:27:27.979 --> 00:27:35.579
And so that's my big question that I'm trying to answer with the NEQ and with the other paper that's about the intake regulation model.
00:27:35.659 --> 00:27:51.099
It's kind of a new model of why people gain fat right when no one wants to it's like we know about calories we've every single nutrition label on earth has the calories on it right this is law that you have to have the calories it's not working right we're getting fatter.
00:27:51.259 --> 00:27:58.299
But and as we know we didn't count calories throughout hill all of history so it's like what why did it work before right?
00:27:58.459 --> 00:28:06.219
And so if we start with NEQ, this is kind of my ultimate way of thinking about it is the nutrient energy quotient.
00:28:06.539 --> 00:28:18.699
So food is four things it's protein vitamins and minerals okay those are your nutrients protein vitamins and minerals nutrients these are bodybuilding foods.
00:28:18.939 --> 00:29:22.779
Weston Price figured this out a hundred years ago I'm quoting him in my book he figured out that there was bodybuilding foods protein vitamins minerals and there was energy foods fats and carbs okay so food is for things protein vitamins and minerals nutrients fats and carbs mostly energy sources of course there are essential fatty acids and good things in fats but generally like fats and carbs are giving you energy for the day right the energy foods power you day to day the bodybuilding foods protein vitamins minerals build your body your organs your hormones your tissues your bones everything is built from these so these are very different types of calories so this is the first thing this is so insane that people just treat all calories as the same people just reduce your calories oh how do you lose weight oh it's just a calorie deficit bro I've seen a thousand million Instagram posts and they're just calorie deficit well you're saying that as if it's just Jim bros saying that and you're minimum every single nutrition organization it's it's really bad.
00:29:22.939 --> 00:29:29.899
And and I don't like to I don't like to put certain professions down or anything like that.
00:29:30.139 --> 00:29:43.019
But let's so let's just take I'm a registered dietitian you have to do twelve hundred clinical hours you have to have a master's degree in dietetics you have to pass a national dietitian exam you have to maintain your credentials with continuing education.
00:29:43.259 --> 00:29:52.139
It's not an easy thing to become a registered dietitian it was very difficult actually I'm glad I'm a dietitian because it's fun for me to do this type of thing.
00:29:53.019 --> 00:29:59.899
But I think this is a huge question that remains unanswered and it's it's even dietitians.
00:30:00.219 --> 00:30:14.139
And as part of my employment I do note review so I review other dietitians' notes and it gives you a sort of insight and it gives you a pulse on like what the other dietitians are learning and discussing and how they're sharing nutrition information.
00:30:14.539 --> 00:30:24.459
And I can't tell you how many times I see a morbidly obese patient and you know all I'm doing is scanning through this and looking at like BMI.
00:30:24.539 --> 00:30:27.339
I'm not like reading this person's personal details or anything like that.
00:30:28.779 --> 00:30:35.659
So morbidly obese BMI and you look at the calorie prescription and it's something like 1200 calories.
00:30:36.299 --> 00:30:36.539
Okay.
00:30:36.939 --> 00:30:50.379
And this is a person that might be like let's take like a 6'2 male okay that's 395 pounds and the nutrition prescription they will that's criminally low it'll be like 1200 calories.
00:30:50.699 --> 00:31:06.219
Because the patient gets on and tells the dietitian like hey I've been doing a 1500 calorie diet and it's not working the very first gut reaction from a lot of healthcare professionals certainly doctors sorry doctors it's just something that I see over and over again.
00:31:06.859 --> 00:31:14.219
Doctors and a lot of dietitians and nutritionists the first thing they'll do is cut the calories down to 1200 and worsen the problem.
00:31:14.699 --> 00:31:24.939
So you're absolutely correct it's not just like a Jim Bro thing though of saying hey calories in calories out and do a less calorie amount if you want to lose fat.
00:31:25.179 --> 00:31:29.500
But it does not work and it's it's rampant.
00:31:29.659 --> 00:31:36.379
Like it's it's 90% of the notes that I review are caloric prescriptions that are horrifically too low.
00:31:36.539 --> 00:31:47.819
So please continue but it's a nightmare and yeah and you can add in on this as well that that's I mean the pro-metabolic people at least they get it it's like you want your metabolism to be better.
00:31:47.899 --> 00:32:01.740
That is a prescription for lowering your metabolism even worse right that is a nightmare to to restrict that weight I mean they're reducing thyroid function you're your body's trying to defend itself and not die.
00:32:01.899 --> 00:32:04.539
So it's it it will push back on that.
00:32:04.699 --> 00:32:10.059
So you so you have to figure out how to get all your nutrients for less calories.
00:32:10.219 --> 00:32:10.539
Right?
00:32:10.619 --> 00:32:19.659
So maybe yes well the pro metabolic I mean you should be even eating more calories and I believe in that and I raise my body temperature and and can eat more calories now.
00:32:19.899 --> 00:32:26.219
Yes because I I learned about this about six years ago luckily I I was open to listening to other opinions.
00:32:26.379 --> 00:34:14.940
So I was you know 13 years ago I was into the low carb world and it worked for me in the beginning and a lot of people do what works for them in the beginning right so I'm like oh carbs are bad I cut carbs I lost weight and then I just you know a lot of my podcasts in the beginning and the first hundred episodes were about that then I realized wait a second this doesn't make sense like I said I don't want to be wrong I need to be accurate I need the truth there's people all across the world eating carbs and being healthy bodybuilders eating tons of carbs and getting shredded so this this theory doesn't really make sense and then I yeah I remember people maybe it was even longer than six years ago putting in the comments be like look up Ray Pete or like learn what about pro-metabolic like what about this and I was like oh wait a second I do have low body temperature I am like waking up in the middle of night kind of cold hands and feet I had all these classic symptoms of lower thyroid lower metabolism just lower metabolic function and I started eating more calories healthy kind like whole food carbs you know real fat from you know animal based fats no seed oils no you know refined grains and all that stuff and I remained lean and ate more and so so part of it is yes you can actually eat more calories and you you can have a healthy metabolism that can burn all those but also if you but if you're you're morbidly obese I would not put someone on a 1200 calorie diet I'm like how like maybe they need call it 2500 I hate even dealing with calories by the way I never think of calories I've never I don't have a scale I don't know anything about calorie I don't have a food scale or a real scale I don't know how much I weigh I have no idea never I have no clue I don't set calorie targets for patients and they're always like well I need to know how many calories I'm like listen I want you to get this amount of protein and I want you to get this amount of carbs and I'm setting like baseline targets for what I want you to achieve.
00:34:15.099 --> 00:34:21.820
And they're like no one's ever done this before like it's like the opposite I love that you're like you eat this much I want you to eat this much.
00:34:21.980 --> 00:34:22.700
That's the way to do it.
00:34:22.860 --> 00:34:35.900
So I'll arbitrarily use 2500 calories and I want someone to eat so maybe yeah we're we're gonna have to eat less to like you want to start using your own body fat right if you're 400 pounds let's start using your own body fat.
00:34:36.059 --> 00:34:57.900
So let's eat less energy right so food is nutrients and it's energy so let's eat less energy and still get high nutrient so like you said lots of protein let's maintain higher protein let's get whole food carbs especially because they they have a volume okay so I'll back up there's two types of satiety I'm really into the satiety thing.
00:34:57.980 --> 00:35:01.900
So losing fat and having good body composition is kind of a battle of hunger.
00:35:01.980 --> 00:35:37.340
So people have probably heard the word satiety right it's it's full fullness so how do you stay full but eat less energy so you can use your own body fat for energy so you there's two ways you so protein and fat you you know like animal foods will have protein and fat and they'll keep you full for a long time they have kind of this long-term satiety and then there's some people more of the plant-based people I kind of understand their thinking this is why I go into other diet camps and learn about them they're into volume eating there's a whole diet called volumetrics you can go on Instagram learn about volume eating it was a whole thing.
00:35:37.420 --> 00:35:57.340
This is what the plant-based people believe in that I've seen these diagrams on social media or whatever they have a stomach and they're like 500 calories of vegetables and their whole stomach's full you know it's a cross section of a stomach a cartoon then it's like 500 calories of meat and the stomach's like half full and it's like 500 calories of fat and the stomach is like one you know tenth full.
00:35:57.579 --> 00:35:59.019
And so that's their theory.
00:35:59.099 --> 00:36:19.019
But we can use both theories there is there's both sides of this there's long-term satiety from true nutrients protein and fat you know healthy fats and there's also gut like filling up your gut so your gut has stretch receptors and it's you know there there's a certain actually volume of food and weight of food that people eat per day.
00:36:19.180 --> 00:36:41.820
I was just looking at some of these studies I I won't get them exactly correct but they they did some studies where people were eating about four pounds of food per day no matter what it was and then they were making they they had one group that was eating like a low lower calorie density foods and which would be you know whole foods and whatever vegetables and potatoes and chicken and stuff.
00:36:41.980 --> 00:37:03.500
And then the other group was eating more processed food so higher caloric density but they both ate four pounds a day it's just the whole food group ate a lot less right so to me even though I hate mentioning calories they still they ate less calories sort of accidentally because your body has stretch receptors and it wants to feel full and so you can use both of these systems.
00:37:03.579 --> 00:37:15.740
So you can eat nutrient dense foods and and get all the nutrients your body needs and you can also eat higher volume foods which would be potatoes you know any whole food really I have so many questions.
00:37:15.900 --> 00:37:39.980
I'm I'm somewhere in between so I listened to your podcast episode with the two pro metabolic folks the more recent one and it irked me massively um just because was it two more pro-metabolic people or was it are you oh are you oh you're talking about the one with Kitty Bloomfield coach and and like client I think yeah no it was Kitty Bloomfield and her um I think it was it was a woman and a man.
00:37:40.220 --> 00:37:44.380
Yeah yeah they built like a they but they have like a system and they train people and stuff.
00:37:44.460 --> 00:37:53.980
Yeah yeah but I took issue with like one of the comments um because I do I do follow a pro-metabolic framework.
00:37:54.059 --> 00:38:42.300
I'm totally a pedophile or whatever you called it uh which is hilarious Ray P the pedophile yeah I think it's so funny but I do not do high fat for for the reason that we're talking about right now where I work with too many people with eating disorders and gut problems and they benefit massively from being able to eat meals that are large that have a lot of like potatoes and like um just root vegetables lots of fruits where they can eat these large meals yeah high volume yeah and it stimulates that that there's a whole gastro reflex where when it gets stimulated that way it pushes other foods through it improves metabolic rate they're they're they're having regular bowel movements so they feel less bloated and disgusting.
00:38:42.460 --> 00:38:52.940
If we have meals that are too high in fat for a lot of different gastric conditions it can delay gastric emptying horrifically and it can cause all sorts of downstream issues.
00:38:53.260 --> 00:39:03.820
So typically I have a calculation where I do 0.25 times their pound in body weight up to 0.4 times their pounds in body weight and that gives me a range of fat.
00:39:04.059 --> 00:39:13.980
And it works it works like clockwork every time I wish I wasn't as good at at my job as I am honestly because like the amount of confidence that it affords is too much.
00:39:15.180 --> 00:39:16.460
It works it just works.
00:39:17.019 --> 00:39:29.420
It works and I'm like listen this is gonna sound stupid dummy simple but like these are the protein carbs and fats here's a list of foods that I want you to enjoy um and I want you to eat as much as you want for the next couple weeks and they go I need a calorie target.
00:39:29.500 --> 00:39:43.099
And I'm like no no no you've got protein carbs and fats here and the most difficult thing for people in the United States what I've what I've picked up from having over a thousand clients is people are eating way too much fat.
00:39:43.820 --> 00:39:50.780
Well this is this goes with what I'm saying and I I don't think the the kitty bloomfield and the the trainer guy believe in high fat at all.
00:39:50.940 --> 00:39:55.740
No when this is what I'm saying it's if you can go different ways.
00:39:55.900 --> 00:40:16.860
So it's the keto people they're going high fat and low carb and the pro metabolic people are going more low fat and high carb but so both you you don't really because a lot of pedophiles will say that you should do high fat and high carb and that's the message that I was getting from the other podcast and I can read it I haven't heard of that one.
00:40:17.180 --> 00:40:39.500
No no no I've never heard people you can't I think you heard wrong because I don't think that people think that they they want you to be moderate fat and they they're very against seed oils and you they they want real fat moderate they want higher carbs and whole food carbs although they'd throw in orange juice which I've seen people gain a lot of weight oh I love it.
00:40:39.660 --> 00:40:46.460
Love it I think I think the pro metabolic stuff is better for lean people or or highly active people.
00:40:46.700 --> 00:40:56.220
And if you're right so but so yeah I've got to but it works really well for weight loss works really really really well for weight loss.
00:40:57.019 --> 00:41:16.539
But yeah I must have misheard because I heard something about just like housing ice cream like real ice cream and I was like you can't do that you can't eat to your paper's point uh which hopefully we can get into a little bit but you cannot eat did you call them nutrient calories or what are the fat and carbs what are you calling those energy calories.
00:41:16.780 --> 00:41:51.260
Energy calories yeah yeah don't eat high energy yeah yeah you can't eat both of them in high quantities you'll get high triglycerides you'll you'll gain weight and that's what I loved about this paper is that it's like clearly breaking down that like hey calories don't so much matter it matters more about like are you getting enough protein are you getting enough of these micronutrients and are you over consuming these energy calories yes that's the idea and and yeah going high carbon high fat is a great way to overconsume the energy calories and yeah you want to burn your own body fat.
00:41:51.340 --> 00:41:54.059
So yeah that's what NEQ is nutrient energy quotient.
00:41:54.140 --> 00:42:18.220
So I made this equation it took forever to figure out but it it's a really simple equation kind of simple where it's not like I I add in all you know my own random stuff it's it's the average daily it's like taking the micronutrients and calculating that the through the daily value because this is what's available at USDA database right you can have any food and it'll tell you every single vitamin and mineral and the daily value of that.
00:42:18.380 --> 00:42:29.019
So I convert that into a number and it's an average right so it's like yes you look at liver and oysters at the top of the list right so they have a high average value of nutrients.
00:42:29.180 --> 00:42:41.019
Then we and we take the protein and then we take the water content not fiber because fiber you can game the system this is kind of what I'm talking about in the beginning where fiber is not your something you're chasing.
00:42:41.260 --> 00:42:43.660
Wholeness intact foods is what you're chasing.
00:42:43.740 --> 00:42:49.180
That's why all the studies show people more fiber are healthier because they're eating more whole foods and therefore less processed foods.
00:42:50.059 --> 00:43:09.980
Can I stop you can I stop you this good point because you can ask people to eat mango or and I'm just gonna I'm gonna just wrecking my friend Mike right now but he he makes dried mangoes you know oh yeah yeah I know and that's a great energy source for this person's about to go do CrossFit for two hours.
00:43:10.220 --> 00:43:23.099
But if I'm giving nutrition advice to a normal average everyday Joe that's only getting 10,000 steps I want them to eat the whole mango for the exact week you're making right now because of the water content.
00:43:23.420 --> 00:43:31.900
Because we don't care if you're getting your daily value of fiber if it takes you eating 10 of those freeze the dried mangoes where you're getting 800 calories.
00:43:32.300 --> 00:43:44.460
Exactly such a good point dried fruit so what trail mix so actually in my NEQ calculation nuts are are really low and people who've read it the few people have read it they're like wait a second I thought almonds were healthy.
00:43:44.940 --> 00:44:13.500
You're taking a dried almond you can eat a cup of dried almonds that's a lot of calories very dense calories okay dried mango and almonds what is that that's trail mix trail mix is for people who are going on a 30 mile hike like you don't need trail mix for the fat guy watching Netflix this is insane the fat guy watching Netflix does not need trail mix he does not need A whole bunch of dried nuts and dried fruit.
00:44:14.140 --> 00:44:20.860
No, no, and I I had a friend ask me, a very active friend, ask me, what should I bring on the trail?
00:44:21.099 --> 00:44:24.140
Because they they were gonna like hike the Appalachian Trail.
00:44:25.099 --> 00:44:30.460
And it was like, he's thinking of bringing like a bag of fruit and like dried meat.
00:44:30.539 --> 00:44:33.579
And I'm going, dude, that's gonna last you like half a day.
00:44:33.740 --> 00:44:39.260
Like you need like a can of coconut oil and trail mix, like a four-pound bag of juice.
00:44:39.500 --> 00:44:40.940
You need dense calories that are light.
00:44:41.019 --> 00:44:42.300
Yeah, you can't be carrying water.
00:44:42.380 --> 00:44:45.980
Like if you carry, it's kind of the opposite of what uh an overweight person needs.
00:44:46.059 --> 00:44:52.780
A overweight person needs the whole fruit, and with the water and intact structure of the food.
00:44:52.940 --> 00:44:53.820
And that's gonna help.
00:44:53.980 --> 00:44:56.140
And that's why this is why GLPs work.
00:44:56.220 --> 00:45:07.260
This is the whole thing why Zempic and all these GLP1 things work, is they are signaling the satiety hormone GLP1 in the system sort of exogenously, right, by just shooting it into themselves.
00:45:07.420 --> 00:45:22.780
But if you're eating a whole apple or a whole potato, your gut is producing GLP1 naturally because it is intact and it there's these increotins, gut incrementins, there's all these other ones like GIP, uh neuropeptid, YY, CCK.
00:45:22.940 --> 00:45:24.059
It gets really nerdy.
00:45:24.140 --> 00:45:41.260
Uh they're in the paper, but it's like these if you're eating real food, it has to break your stomach breaks it down your gut, and all your systems break it down, and it recognizes it as real food, and it sends the right signals to your body that you're full, and there's slower gastric empty, all these things make it why whole foods are good.
00:45:41.340 --> 00:45:47.820
So it's it's like kind of also gives a reason why whole foods are good and why water in foods are good.
00:45:48.140 --> 00:45:54.140
I have a question for you, and it directly um goes against the orange juice, which I so love and hold dear.
00:45:54.460 --> 00:46:00.700
But because the GLP1 signaling, it happens in the large intestine, correct?
00:46:01.099 --> 00:46:03.820
Uh I think it's in the small intestine.
00:46:04.140 --> 00:46:08.220
Okay, but somewhere in this paper it was talking about, and I was like, that is so intriguing.
00:46:08.380 --> 00:46:11.500
Um, it was in one of these papers talking about like good signaling.
00:46:11.740 --> 00:46:14.940
And um Brian, by the way, hasn't read these in a long time.
00:46:15.019 --> 00:46:19.260
It's really impressive because we're just rattling off the formula looking at it.
00:46:19.579 --> 00:46:29.820
But I think there is some truth, some real truth to one, the stomach has to be stimulated in order for the brain to register it as like a large enough meal to allow for satiety.
00:46:30.220 --> 00:46:35.180
But then I think that there has to be a certain amount of stimulation with the lower bowels.
00:46:35.420 --> 00:46:41.820
So I completely disagree with people that say, oh, you can get away with just doing very long term, by the way.
00:46:42.300 --> 00:47:01.579
You can't, I disagree with you can't do honey and orange juice as your only two sources of carbohydrate long term, because I think there's some benefits to what we're saying with like lower gut activation that you would get from things like sweet potato, sourdough bread, foods that are gonna take longer to break apart and have to travel through that entire digestive tract.
00:47:01.900 --> 00:47:03.019
And whole fruit, yeah, yeah.
00:47:03.579 --> 00:47:05.980
Yeah, but with the water content and the fiber.
00:47:06.300 --> 00:47:17.740
Um, and I know it this it's like nutritionist doing a full circle where we're just coming back to like the simplest thing ever of like, can you please just eat things that grow out of the ground and like kill animals, please?
00:47:18.059 --> 00:47:35.260
But it's good because people we've conflated nutrition so much, and they'll look at like a protein bar with 250 ingredients and go, this is healthy, it has 25 grams of protein, and it's got a certain amount of fiber, and it's all just fake fiber, it's just a bunch of fiber thrown at the end.
00:47:35.980 --> 00:47:40.940
And they've done studies to show that it doesn't work if you just add fiber back in.
00:47:41.019 --> 00:47:42.620
This is chapter nine.
00:47:42.780 --> 00:47:49.180
I'm editing chapter nine of my book right now, and it's talking about these studies that you can't just add fiber back in.
00:47:49.340 --> 00:47:54.140
And a protein bar in the NEQ calculation would not score that well.
00:47:54.220 --> 00:47:56.780
It's probably the best processed food, right?
00:47:56.860 --> 00:48:05.019
You know, a clean protein bar, I'd say, would be one of the better processed foods because it does have high protein, but it doesn't have structure, right?
00:48:05.099 --> 00:48:10.140
It doesn't have the water content, it doesn't, it's not a whole food, so it's not gonna score that well.
00:48:10.300 --> 00:48:19.500
So I I should fully explain NEQ before we get lost and the listeners gonna freak out and be like, they didn't tell me what this whole paper was about.
00:48:19.660 --> 00:48:23.820
Uh so it it's an equation that looks at the nutrient to energy ratio, right?
00:48:23.980 --> 00:48:29.180
Nutrient energy quotient, that means like the nutrients divided by energy, basically.
00:48:29.420 --> 00:48:31.579
And it it's just science, right?
00:48:31.660 --> 00:48:33.420
It's it's like I didn't really make this up.
00:48:33.500 --> 00:48:42.140
I had to make the equation work, and it goes on a kind of zero to 150 point scale, and it works for any food.
00:48:42.220 --> 00:48:46.059
It doesn't work for liquids, actually, because liquid it cheats the system.
00:48:46.140 --> 00:48:48.539
But just you're not supposed to just throw out liquids.
00:48:48.620 --> 00:48:51.340
It's for any food because it cheats the system.
00:48:51.420 --> 00:49:04.059
Because in my equation, I mentioned it has water content in the numerator, and that would just throw off the system where soda would or would would do well because it has a lot of water, but it's not structural water, right?
00:49:04.140 --> 00:49:05.900
It's not intact in a food, right?
00:49:05.980 --> 00:49:19.340
So so the scale, if around you want to eat foods around 100, or you want to make your diet a meal around getting a score of 100, or for the week, you want your score to be around 100.
00:49:19.420 --> 00:49:21.820
For the month, for life, you want your score around 100.
00:49:21.980 --> 00:49:25.019
So the foods like oysters are at like 150.
00:49:25.099 --> 00:49:26.860
Actually, they go off the scale 170, I think.
00:49:27.019 --> 00:49:28.220
Liver goes way off the scale.
00:49:28.300 --> 00:49:30.300
It's the only one that goes to like 307.
00:49:30.620 --> 00:49:31.099
I have it.
00:49:31.180 --> 00:49:32.140
Can I read it really quick?
00:49:32.300 --> 00:49:32.620
Yeah.
00:49:32.940 --> 00:49:38.300
Liver 306, the highest, um, in this visual representation put together.
00:49:38.460 --> 00:49:45.340
Um, oyster 159, spinach 157, shrimp 128, mushrooms, pickles, sauerkraut.
00:49:45.500 --> 00:49:49.180
Those are all in the high category being over or equal to 110.
00:49:49.420 --> 00:49:51.420
And then in the Well, also chicken.
00:49:51.660 --> 00:49:53.099
There's other ones in that high.
00:49:53.579 --> 00:49:54.460
Chicken, beef.
00:49:54.620 --> 00:49:57.260
So yeah, it's not and also chicken is in moderate.
00:49:57.500 --> 00:49:58.220
Oh, is it?
00:49:58.460 --> 00:49:58.700
Yeah.
00:49:58.860 --> 00:49:59.099
Yeah.
00:49:59.340 --> 00:50:02.140
Spinach is there's a I hate spinach.
00:50:02.220 --> 00:50:03.340
There's so many oxalates.
00:50:03.420 --> 00:50:04.220
I had oxalate problems.
00:50:04.300 --> 00:50:05.980
I was I was drinking kale and spinach.
00:50:06.300 --> 00:50:11.660
So, but I'm still I'm not gonna make my equation somehow penalize spinach because it has oxalates, right?
00:50:11.740 --> 00:50:13.980
So that's why I'm I'm trying to be unbiased, right?
00:50:14.059 --> 00:50:15.099
This is just what it is.
00:50:15.260 --> 00:50:17.820
If you have a bit of spinach now and then, you're not gonna die.
00:50:17.980 --> 00:50:21.019
It has you know some nutrients, but I just want to throw that in there.
00:50:21.260 --> 00:50:24.620
Oh, could you factor anti-nutrients into this equation?
00:50:24.940 --> 00:50:30.460
One day there'd be a different equation that won't be any cube, but I'm trying to get this published peer-reviewed, right?
00:50:30.620 --> 00:50:33.420
It's in peer review right now, and if I did that, it would not be a good idea.
00:50:33.660 --> 00:50:34.860
Let's make it more complicated.
00:50:35.099 --> 00:50:40.860
But later, yeah, later I think it would be bioavailable nutrients and you'd get penalized for anti-nutrients.
00:50:40.940 --> 00:50:44.460
And some of these nutrients are bound up in the foods and you don't get them.
00:50:44.620 --> 00:50:46.220
Like you're not getting everything in a bean.
00:50:46.539 --> 00:50:54.539
It's like kind of bound up in the fiber and in yeah, that you're not getting all of it, or it's in the the less available form, like beta-carotene compared to retinol.
00:50:54.620 --> 00:50:57.900
Like beta-carotene and carrots, you're not getting the full vitamin A.
00:50:57.980 --> 00:51:04.140
But if you eat something like liver that has the real form, you know, animal-based form of vitamin A, you're getting way more of it.
00:51:04.220 --> 00:51:06.220
So yeah, I'm not factoring all this in.
00:51:06.300 --> 00:51:08.780
That'd be way it it's just too hard to prove.
00:51:09.019 --> 00:51:13.740
So I'm just doing very simple, it's just based on nutrients to energy ratio.
00:51:13.980 --> 00:51:15.900
And so keep keep reading.
00:51:16.220 --> 00:51:17.660
Yeah, I mean, if you know, you know.
00:51:17.820 --> 00:51:35.500
Like if you're one of these people that's done extensive research and you know that there's a lot of oxalates in spinach, you can sort of draw your own opinions from this, but it still illustrates that we're talking about high protein and micronutrients in these top foods, and they're not necessarily high on energy per gram.
00:51:35.740 --> 00:51:40.140
Um, but that doesn't mean you can't eat energy dense foods, some energy dense foods.
00:51:40.300 --> 00:51:55.260
So that's why I'm saying if you're eating mushrooms and sauerkraut and pickles and beef and eggs and uh oysters and shrimp, and then you eat it with some potatoes and some rice and some sourdough, right?
00:51:55.340 --> 00:51:56.620
Then that balances to 100.
00:51:56.860 --> 00:52:01.019
That's the whole point, is that some foods are in the 70s and 80s, some are the 120.
00:52:01.099 --> 00:52:03.740
You don't have to eat egg whites and protein powder, right?
00:52:03.820 --> 00:52:09.180
That's not the goal, is to have like a score of a 140 and just eat egg whites and protein powder.
00:52:09.260 --> 00:52:13.500
The goal is to eat whole foods and to balance them, and it works.
00:52:13.579 --> 00:52:14.380
So keep reading.
00:52:14.620 --> 00:52:15.180
Yeah, yeah.
00:52:15.340 --> 00:52:20.220
So we're into moderate now, carrots, and moderate is 65 to 109 on the score.
00:52:20.380 --> 00:52:26.700
So carrots, chicken breast, blueberries, apple, egg, potato, black beans, and white rice.
00:52:27.340 --> 00:52:39.260
Uh, and then we get into low, which is less than 65, which would be whole wheat bread, cheddar cheese, blueberry muffins, almonds, lucky charms, donuts, granola bar, and potato chips.
00:52:39.740 --> 00:52:43.099
And it's it's great that you mentioned earlier about like almonds.
00:52:43.980 --> 00:52:50.860
I I fight this battle often with people where I'm trying to get a lot of these nuts and seeds out of the diet.
00:52:51.260 --> 00:52:55.340
Um and then you just see if in particular a lot of people come for me for weight loss.
00:52:55.660 --> 00:53:03.500
And if they remove like the blueberry muffins and the almonds and the lucky charms, just the the weight loss happens with without seemingly trying.
00:53:04.220 --> 00:53:04.620
Absolutely.
00:53:05.420 --> 00:53:09.019
None of my clients are really rigorously calorie counting.
00:53:09.099 --> 00:53:12.300
There's a few of them that are kind of obsessed with it and I let them do their thing.
00:53:12.460 --> 00:53:35.180
Um, but for the most part, people get to this really pleasant place where if they're eating a lot of these moderate and high foods, their hunger just sort of regulates itself, and they go, you know, I just eat until I'm full and I'm satisfied, and I don't really think about my weight or the amount of calories I've eaten, and they just lean out over time and get to a healthy place and eat that amount of food.
00:53:35.820 --> 00:53:36.460
That's the whole point.
00:53:36.700 --> 00:53:42.700
So that's the what I said that the subtitle of my book is why you over keep eating when you don't want to.
00:53:42.860 --> 00:53:43.900
And that solves it.
00:53:43.980 --> 00:53:48.620
If you're eating the high to moderate foods, you you just it takes care of itself.
00:53:48.700 --> 00:53:54.620
And that's for all of history, it took care of itself until around 1980, and it's been this sharp uptick since.
00:53:54.780 --> 00:54:06.700
And over that time, since 1980, as obesity and chronic disease has absolutely gone crazy, the the nutrient that the NEQ of people's diets has dropped like crazy, right?
00:54:06.780 --> 00:54:10.700
This the nutrient density, basically, NEQ is a form of nutrient density.
00:54:10.860 --> 00:54:13.900
And that is why they're getting fat and sick.
00:54:14.059 --> 00:54:29.260
It's just the average, if you look, I swear, if you had like magical data of everyone in the US, you would very easily see that, and especially since 1980, that it's maybe right be you know, 1970s, it's like people say, eat what your grandparents ate.
00:54:29.340 --> 00:54:30.140
I believe in that.
00:54:30.220 --> 00:54:36.620
It's like if you just eat what your grandparents ate, they're eating pot roast and carrots and potatoes, you know, like you will be fine.
00:54:36.700 --> 00:54:38.220
That's above 100, right?
00:54:38.300 --> 00:54:42.460
And now people, if you look at if you did their food tracking, they'd be at 70.
00:54:42.620 --> 00:54:48.620
You know, so many people they're eating processed foods, they're eating even like some of these whole foods that they think are healthy.
00:54:48.780 --> 00:54:51.420
I'm just not a fan of all the bread and pasta and stuff like that.
00:54:51.500 --> 00:54:52.220
You you can get away.
00:54:52.460 --> 00:54:55.180
I mean, there's certain you certainly can eat those and still be okay.
00:54:55.340 --> 00:55:12.620
But like if you're you know overweight, people are eating nutrient poor foods, they're eating empty foods, you're eating all these empty calories, and they're their average, I don't care about their calories, I just know their calories are too high because their average is like a 70 on this scale.
00:55:13.019 --> 00:55:17.740
It's so interesting that you say that though, because it becomes nuanced.
00:55:18.059 --> 00:55:26.140
Because I I will meet with clients that are 300 plus pounds, and I know they're only eating 800 calories.
00:55:26.460 --> 00:55:27.500
Oh, well, that's a different story.
00:55:27.579 --> 00:55:33.740
That's what we're talking about before, is that they're they're screwing their metabolism and they're under-eating and their thyroid, and yeah.
00:55:34.140 --> 00:55:34.940
That that too.
00:55:35.099 --> 00:55:41.019
But but we have to be careful too, because um it's not always that they're overeating.
00:55:41.340 --> 00:55:49.660
They're it's it's that you're the point that you were trying to make, I think, is that they're over making the they're overeating the energy calories and they're not getting any of the nutrients, right?
00:55:49.900 --> 00:55:53.019
Yes, but also you the the the client didn't get there.
00:55:53.180 --> 00:55:55.660
This was like a 30-year process, right?
00:55:55.740 --> 00:56:01.180
And then then how say so over 30 years they they gained a hundred pounds, right?
00:56:01.260 --> 00:56:05.420
And they were certainly overeating empty calories during that time.
00:56:05.579 --> 00:56:12.380
And then if you're just trying to drastically cut calories in the wrong way, you can't eat just less of the same bad foods.
00:56:12.700 --> 00:56:13.900
That just doesn't really work.
00:56:14.059 --> 00:56:21.579
And some people, but people will be like, oh bro, I uh you know, I was going to Mexico last year and I cut calories and I lost 20 pounds.
00:56:21.660 --> 00:56:29.980
I'm like, yeah, in the short term, you certainly can eat less of the same bad foods and you'd be hungry and you're you're gonna lose muscle as well.
00:56:30.140 --> 00:56:34.539
You're gonna lower your immune function, you're gonna lower your thyroid function, you're gonna lower everything.
00:56:34.700 --> 00:56:37.820
You can do anything in the short term, but we're talking long term.
00:56:37.900 --> 00:56:45.500
Like for long-term true health, you need to eat high nutrient foods with the you know appropriate amount of energy.
00:56:45.820 --> 00:56:55.180
Yeah, and what I see a lot, a lot, a lot of um, and I just want to make sure I drive this point home, is I'm mostly meeting with overweight clients.
00:56:55.340 --> 00:57:01.260
Um, I do meet with some athletes and I meet with a lot of IBS and and PCOS and whatever.
00:57:01.420 --> 00:57:11.579
Um, most of them are trying to lose weight, and I have some morbidly obese clients, and I guarantee you, all of them for a long period of time have been starving themselves.
00:57:12.059 --> 00:57:19.099
And the view with the American population is that these people are just horrendously overeating, but I promise you it's not the case.
00:57:19.260 --> 00:57:19.980
I I see it.
00:57:20.539 --> 00:57:22.780
Well, they created metabolic damage for 30 years.
00:57:22.860 --> 00:57:23.420
That's kind of my point.
00:57:23.500 --> 00:57:24.300
But keep going, but yeah.
00:57:24.700 --> 00:57:25.500
That's that too.
00:57:25.579 --> 00:57:41.340
But like, you know, I'll I'll have someone where maybe they 10 years ago started with 1,500 calories and now then they went down to 1200, then they went down to 800, and they reach out to a dietitian as like a last itch effort of like, I'm starving to death.
00:57:41.500 --> 00:57:43.420
And it's because they don't understand this.
00:57:43.820 --> 00:57:53.260
And that's why I love this so much, because you can you can just get them eating 900 calories of these nutrient-dense foods, and they'll start losing weight.
00:57:53.420 --> 00:57:56.700
There's not this massive repair to metabolism that has to happen.
00:57:57.099 --> 00:58:02.380
Eventually, you can get someone up to the physiologically appropriate amount of calories, like 2,000.
00:58:02.460 --> 00:58:02.700
Uh-huh.
00:58:02.860 --> 00:58:05.260
And the weight loss will happen even faster.
00:58:05.820 --> 00:58:10.380
But let's say someone was only eating 800 calories, and it's tiny amounts of food, by the way.
00:58:10.460 --> 00:58:17.099
It's like a little tiny blueberry muffin, like a Starbucks latte, and then something like a quarter of a takeout meal.
00:58:17.180 --> 00:58:18.380
And I'm not exaggerating.
00:58:18.460 --> 00:58:20.860
And that's what these morbidly obese people are eating.
00:58:21.820 --> 00:58:23.340
But it's it's no hard.
00:58:24.700 --> 00:58:26.140
It's small quantities of food.
00:58:26.780 --> 00:58:29.820
Um, and yes, it it it reinforces what you're saying.
00:58:30.380 --> 00:58:35.579
Because there's it's all energy calories, very low in actual nutrients and protein.
00:58:35.980 --> 00:58:49.340
And and what's promising about this and what makes me happy and super excited, is that the second you start introducing apples and chicken and beef and maybe a little bit of oysters and just these real food items, it doesn't take much.
00:58:49.500 --> 00:58:55.019
In fact, what I've experienced is like this moderate category, not even the high.
00:58:55.340 --> 00:59:04.140
I can get someone just eating more of the moderate category foods and say they're only eating a thousand calories, but they'll still start to lose the fat.
00:59:04.460 --> 00:59:07.980
Well, their body's finally like, yes, we're getting nutrients.
00:59:08.300 --> 00:59:14.059
We're not in panic mode, we're not high cortisol, high stress, like low thyroid.
00:59:14.220 --> 00:59:18.780
We are getting nutrients, and your body's like, finally, let's get rid of some of this excess fat.
00:59:19.099 --> 00:59:20.539
Yeah, it's fun.
00:59:20.700 --> 00:59:35.340
Well, I just wanted to give you my perspective because like it's it would be great if someone averaged over 100, but I think we could get like most of the American population to a healthier place just getting them in like the 65 to 12 range.
00:59:35.579 --> 00:59:36.940
Well, just getting in the 80s, yes.
00:59:37.019 --> 00:59:39.099
I would say well, yes, most people, okay.
00:59:39.180 --> 00:59:46.300
The people, your clients who are morbidly obese, they probably were eating in the 50s and 60s their entire life or lower.
00:59:46.460 --> 01:00:00.220
Yeah, if they're eating like that standard fast food, all the stuff you mentioned, yeah, they think, oh, I'm just gonna eat a muffin, and then I'm gonna like white knuckle it until lunch, and then I'm gonna eat, oh, I'm gonna eat only a quarter of my lunch, and look at me, you know, I'm the fat guy.
01:00:00.300 --> 01:00:02.220
Look, but look, I'm only eating a little bit, guys.
01:00:02.300 --> 01:00:03.740
I'm gonna save the rest or throw it away.
01:00:04.059 --> 01:00:04.220
Sad.
01:00:04.539 --> 01:00:13.500
And then they yeah, and then they're like, we're starving till dinner, and then they'll like it the yeah, it's not the way to do it, and they're their average is probably still at 40s, 50s.
01:00:13.660 --> 01:00:14.860
It's it's a nightmare.
01:00:15.180 --> 01:00:27.900
Yeah, it's so fun though when you start getting them eating food, and they go, Oh my gosh, like I can eat all day, and they get really excited, and they'll have like I'll tell them, like, eat as many potatoes as you want.
01:00:28.140 --> 01:00:37.099
Like, and Maggie was laughing at this because I go, I had this one client who's really afraid of carbs, really afraid of eating, and I said, Eat as many potatoes as you want.
01:00:37.579 --> 01:00:46.700
And the next week, and she ate so many potatoes, she ate like 30 pounds of potatoes in a week, and then she's like, I'm down a pound and a half.
01:00:47.260 --> 01:00:49.980
And it was just it's really fun as a dietitian.
01:00:50.059 --> 01:01:09.260
Like, this is why you become a dietitian is to like not everyone understands everything, but most dietitians, what they're doing is at least helping people to eat more of the high-quality foods, whether they're vegetarian dietitians or omnivorous vegetarians, whatever they're doing, they're trying to get people to eat more of these high-quality foods.
01:01:09.420 --> 01:01:21.260
And it's really rewarding when they do because people realize they can eat more volume for less calories, and they get more of these energy nutrients, not energy, uh, the protein and micronutrient.
01:01:21.500 --> 01:01:21.980
Nutrient calories.
01:01:22.220 --> 01:01:22.460
Yeah.
01:01:22.700 --> 01:01:23.180
That's it.
01:01:23.340 --> 01:01:26.140
That's that's why I you don't have to get into a diet camp.
01:01:26.300 --> 01:01:27.340
It's like you can eat.
01:01:27.500 --> 01:01:33.579
I also tell people like, okay, if you're Indian and you don't want to eat beef and you eat culturally Indian foods, that's fine.
01:01:33.740 --> 01:01:36.700
You can do the same thing, just you can raise the NEQ of your diet.
01:01:36.860 --> 01:01:50.620
You can just eat more of the protein, you can eat more of the healthier dairy products, more eggs, whatever, you know, and less of the bread, the non, you know, more vegetables, more fruit, you're gonna be good, right?
01:01:50.700 --> 01:01:53.019
This is this works for any diet on earth.
01:01:53.260 --> 01:01:57.740
And so, yeah, that's kind of the main the NEQ paper.
01:01:57.980 --> 01:02:01.420
Did you read the the IRM one, the intake regulation model yet?
01:02:01.660 --> 01:02:02.700
Yeah, I read them all.
01:02:02.940 --> 01:02:03.579
Oh, that's a lot.
01:02:03.820 --> 01:02:14.620
Okay, well, the the processing one, one of them is just a new definition of food processing, which I can quickly cover, which is just why processing is bad and a new way of like categorizing processed foods.
01:02:14.780 --> 01:02:17.180
Because right now, so I you you said lucky charms, right?
01:02:17.260 --> 01:02:28.460
I put lucky charms specifically on purpose because if you you remember the tough study that came out a few years ago and they had Lucky Charms rated higher than ground beef and eggs and um cheese.
01:02:28.700 --> 01:02:29.980
Yeah, which is so funny.
01:02:30.059 --> 01:02:37.099
So it's like this total like vegan nonsense, like plant-based study, and they penalize for saturated fat and all this stuff.
01:02:37.260 --> 01:02:41.500
So I put lucky charms in there where they should be in the like very low category.
01:02:41.820 --> 01:02:44.860
But the point of uh the the processing paper.
01:02:45.019 --> 01:02:50.460
So right now, food processing, it's just like if it was processed, they call it process.
01:02:50.620 --> 01:02:55.900
So it's like ground beef is processed, but it it is just as nutritious as beef.
01:02:56.059 --> 01:02:57.980
Like a sausage, it's a real sausage.
01:02:58.059 --> 01:03:07.980
We've been making sausage for thousands and thousands of years, tens of thousands of years, and it's just you put ground up meat into a casing of collagen, you know, of like an intestine.
01:03:08.220 --> 01:03:10.059
That's there's nothing wrong with that, right?
01:03:10.220 --> 01:03:22.700
Making fermenting bread, like properly fermented sourdough, sauerkraut, kimchi, uh pickles, those are considered products, um cheese, like you're making parmesan cheese.
01:03:22.780 --> 01:03:25.180
That is increasing the nutrient density, right?
01:03:25.340 --> 01:03:26.860
So that is technically processed.
01:03:26.940 --> 01:03:30.380
So all those foods I listed are traditionally prepared foods, right?
01:03:30.460 --> 01:03:31.900
So I made the own category.
01:03:32.059 --> 01:03:34.620
So there's whole foods, which everyone should know.
01:03:34.780 --> 01:03:36.700
They just do not have an ingredient list.
01:03:36.780 --> 01:03:38.700
They are in their whole form, that is it.
01:03:38.780 --> 01:03:40.860
It's a whole food, single ingredient food.
01:03:41.019 --> 01:03:41.900
That's whole food.
01:03:42.059 --> 01:03:45.579
Then there's traditionally prepared foods, which is completely separate.
01:03:45.900 --> 01:03:47.019
They're not processed, right?
01:03:47.099 --> 01:03:48.539
We don't we're not calling them processed.
01:03:48.620 --> 01:03:51.740
They're traditionally prepared, which is how we did it for all of history.
01:03:51.820 --> 01:03:55.420
And they're not adding any empty calories in, right?
01:03:55.579 --> 01:04:04.059
We're not adding these are foods like a traditional yogurt, not a go-urt with a million ingredients and just added sugar and added flavorings.
01:04:04.140 --> 01:04:04.300
Right?
01:04:04.380 --> 01:04:08.380
I'm talking about real yogurt or Greek yogurt, traditionally prepared, right?
01:04:08.860 --> 01:04:18.220
Then we have processed foods, and then it goes down to ultra-process, and we it and how bad a food is is basically how many energy calories have been added in.
01:04:18.460 --> 01:04:18.700
Right?
01:04:18.780 --> 01:04:23.500
So how many empty calories are in that food makes them worse for you.
01:04:23.740 --> 01:04:23.900
Right?
01:04:23.980 --> 01:04:33.260
So no question are you factoring in any of the nutrients that might be taken out, or is the equation specifically just how many energy calories are added?
01:04:33.660 --> 01:04:35.980
Well, it's not really an equation, it's more of just a grouping.
01:04:36.140 --> 01:04:49.579
So a donut is kind of the worst food because it's it's flour, it's like bleached white flour, white sugar, cooked in seed oil, right?
01:04:49.660 --> 01:04:52.539
It's like three ingredients and they're all just devoid of nutrition, right?
01:04:52.700 --> 01:04:54.460
So it's the most empty calories you can get.
01:04:54.700 --> 01:04:55.019
Delicious.
01:04:55.180 --> 01:04:55.820
Donuts are great.
01:04:55.980 --> 01:04:56.860
I don't really eat them.
01:04:57.500 --> 01:04:58.300
Me either.
01:04:58.539 --> 01:05:03.820
They are delicious, but they happen to be zero, just the worst, right?
01:05:03.980 --> 01:05:04.700
Just like a cake.
01:05:04.860 --> 01:05:08.620
You go to like a grocery store and get a cake, just terrible, like gross, right?
01:05:08.700 --> 01:05:09.980
I can't even eat those cakes.
01:05:10.059 --> 01:05:11.340
It's just pure, it's just nothing, right?
01:05:11.420 --> 01:05:12.140
There's no nutrition.
01:05:12.220 --> 01:05:13.019
So that's the worst.
01:05:13.099 --> 01:05:18.460
But you could have a processed food that maybe is lightly processed, like say a traditional sourdough.
01:05:18.700 --> 01:05:21.099
I mean, it's made of flour.
01:05:21.180 --> 01:05:24.380
Hopefully, you get like a good flour that's not covering glyphosate.
01:05:24.700 --> 01:05:28.300
You have like a you know, organic sourdough starter, yeah.
01:05:28.620 --> 01:05:29.420
Yeah, real starter.
01:05:33.980 --> 01:05:42.300
And so that still is higher energy than you know, but you you can fit that into your diet and it and it's it can be perfectly fine, right?
01:05:42.460 --> 01:05:47.900
If that's what you're saying with the donut, um energy dense, nutrient poor.
01:05:48.059 --> 01:05:49.180
I love that terminology.
01:05:49.980 --> 01:05:53.099
Um engineered for hyperpalatability, obviously.
01:05:53.420 --> 01:06:10.700
Just like you know, McDonald's and Kraft Heinz, they have food scientists and testers, and they just they spend millions of dollars and thousands of hours developing the perfect amount of of salts, fats, sweets to make these things just ridiculously hyperpalatable.
01:06:11.180 --> 01:06:17.900
No one's looking in the fridge and going, no one's sitting at their desk at work and going, My God, I could kill someone for an orange right now.
01:06:18.380 --> 01:06:29.980
Like when you're hungry and you're appropriately hungry and the body sending you a stimulus saying I'm hungry, you go in there and the orange looks appealing, but it's not overwhelming your thoughts.
01:06:30.140 --> 01:06:31.740
And that's a good test.
01:06:32.140 --> 01:06:35.900
Have you heard the test of like, would you eat a chicken piece of chicken breast right now?
01:06:36.300 --> 01:06:36.780
There you go.
01:06:37.420 --> 01:06:37.579
Right?
01:06:37.740 --> 01:06:43.900
If you would eat an apple and a and a chicken breast, you know, with a little bit of seasoning on it, that's when you're hungry.
01:06:43.980 --> 01:06:46.140
If if that doesn't sound appealing to you, you're not hungry.
01:06:46.860 --> 01:06:47.980
Yeah, you're bored.
01:06:48.140 --> 01:06:52.220
So Whole Foods, the refined energy contribution is 0%.
01:06:52.860 --> 01:06:54.700
It's a single ingredient, like you said.
01:06:54.860 --> 01:06:55.980
These are easy to spot.
01:06:56.140 --> 01:06:59.180
Steak, eggs, whole fish, apples, leafy greens.
01:06:59.420 --> 01:07:06.860
And the defining characteristics you listed are that they're intact in their structure, their native nutrient energy ratios.
01:07:07.660 --> 01:07:15.579
When you go all the way to the other end of this list and he's got them grouped out, and I really hope to see this just like I would love to see all of this.
01:07:15.740 --> 01:07:23.340
Like, I wish we could calculate in any queue for every food, and we could calculate the category and literally list these.
01:07:23.820 --> 01:07:24.700
I'm making this.
01:07:24.940 --> 01:07:26.220
I'm making an app.
01:07:26.300 --> 01:07:30.220
I'm making a little piece of technology that will help people do this.
01:07:30.380 --> 01:07:35.820
Go to sapien.org, uh, you get on the email list there, and you'll be notified when it's all done.
01:07:35.980 --> 01:07:40.620
Also, I've been sending this to like the government, like HHS, like the whole Bobby Kennedy team.
01:07:40.940 --> 01:07:48.059
I'm like friends with Callie Means who who writes a lot of the bills, and he's like in the White House with you know doing all the food stuff.
01:07:48.300 --> 01:07:52.300
So I've been texting him and emailing him about this paper specifically.
01:07:53.340 --> 01:07:53.820
Good luck.
01:07:53.900 --> 01:08:04.300
I mean, lucky charms will come after you're like be really careful because this will make it so easy for people to make decisions about their health.
01:08:04.460 --> 01:08:09.260
And right now, I promise you, this is not an issue of people being unmotivated.
01:08:09.420 --> 01:08:11.820
Like I The people you see are very motivated.
01:08:11.900 --> 01:08:12.140
Yes.
01:08:12.380 --> 01:08:14.539
Oh my god, they're so motive everyone.
01:08:14.700 --> 01:08:19.659
There's it's a rare client that I get that just doesn't want to be there and is doing nutrition counseling.
01:08:19.819 --> 01:08:24.699
Um, most of them, they're they're eager to understand this stuff and they want the information.
01:08:24.859 --> 01:08:27.819
It's just that they've been getting conflicting information all their life.
01:08:27.979 --> 01:08:30.139
So it's like it it's confusing.
01:08:30.299 --> 01:08:36.219
Um it's like when I tried to take my car to get repairs the other day, and I just got wildly different answers at every place.
01:08:36.380 --> 01:08:37.659
I was like, I have no idea what to do.
01:08:37.899 --> 01:08:39.339
And then you quit, you're like, screw it.
01:08:39.420 --> 01:08:41.339
I'm like, this is how I'm dad.
01:08:42.939 --> 01:08:44.299
Me and my dad fixed it.
01:08:44.380 --> 01:08:45.420
Um that's awesome.
01:08:45.739 --> 01:08:56.859
But if we could get these categories on foods where it's just clearly like a color color-coded system, and it was a bright red label that said ultra process, like good luck getting this through.
01:08:57.019 --> 01:09:03.179
But this is a this is a problem of of us allowing large corporations to just completely own us.
01:09:03.420 --> 01:09:04.699
And it's ridiculous.
01:09:05.099 --> 01:09:05.659
It's insane.
01:09:05.899 --> 01:09:15.339
And maybe it will never be on the food labels and all that, but it's okay because you can have you know the app, or if this information is known, then you have to just do it yourself.
01:09:15.420 --> 01:09:18.619
I think that's what's the the fit big food's not gonna let us do this.
01:09:18.699 --> 01:09:25.739
There's no way I I don't believe that this system will ever be on a package of food, and you're gonna have to just do it yourself.
01:09:25.899 --> 01:09:33.099
Learn about yourself, work with a nutritionist dietitian that knows this stuff, use you know, a calculator that people can use this, it's like open source in a sense.
01:09:33.179 --> 01:09:33.979
I'm just publishing it.
01:09:34.059 --> 01:09:38.219
You can make your own calculators, make your own systems, make your own frameworks.
01:09:38.460 --> 01:09:41.099
You know, I have people print this stuff out and put on their fridge.
01:09:41.179 --> 01:09:47.339
Like I have a uh I have a simple food guide right now on sapien.org that's just the basics, but it's gonna get better.
01:09:47.500 --> 01:09:50.219
Uh but yeah, this is it's it's not you're right.
01:09:50.380 --> 01:09:54.380
So many people are motivated, they just have the wrong information, and that's why I'm doing all this stuff.
01:09:54.699 --> 01:10:01.099
Yeah, and we're gonna help you with a secondary calculator that you can take those results and then put account for like anti-nutrients.
01:10:01.899 --> 01:10:03.179
Yeah, I like that.
01:10:03.500 --> 01:10:06.859
The 2.0 almost like I really like it though.
01:10:07.019 --> 01:10:17.259
I mean, and I think about this, most of the foods that I eat and I'm asking people to eat are in the green category, which are whole foods and traditionally prepared foods.
01:10:17.420 --> 01:10:21.819
And then I allow people to do a little bit of the processed, just a little bit.
01:10:22.299 --> 01:10:24.939
The lightly processed ones, not the like ultra-processed one.
01:10:25.099 --> 01:10:28.219
Yeah, because lightly processed still can fit into your diet too.
01:10:28.619 --> 01:10:34.539
Part of my nutrient-to-energy ratio thing or NEQ, the idea is over a week or a month, right?
01:10:34.619 --> 01:10:41.819
So it's like I eat some ice cream, I like to, you know, go to a party and eat some pizza if that's all there is.
01:10:41.899 --> 01:10:44.219
And you know, I enjoy, I'm not like a crazy person.
01:10:44.299 --> 01:10:48.219
I just know that that's gonna You are you are a crazy person.
01:10:48.380 --> 01:10:49.259
I kind of am not though.
01:10:49.420 --> 01:10:50.539
Uh, you should see me.
01:10:50.619 --> 01:10:57.179
I I I eat like kind of liberally because it fits into my week or my month.
01:10:57.420 --> 01:11:00.460
No, no, like on occasion, I eat liberally.
01:11:00.699 --> 01:11:01.339
On occasion.
01:11:01.579 --> 01:11:06.859
I've never seen you put anything into your body that I wouldn't say is like 100% kosher.
01:11:07.259 --> 01:11:08.699
No, you haven't hung out with me enough.
01:11:08.779 --> 01:11:14.219
No, no, I I am very I'm not like some of these guys that are insane about it.
01:11:14.460 --> 01:11:17.739
I will eat, but I'm that's what I'm saying.
01:11:17.979 --> 01:11:19.659
It it allows for this.
01:11:19.819 --> 01:11:26.139
If you're if you're not, I don't want people stressed out about following this diet to a T and all that stuff.
01:11:26.380 --> 01:11:35.899
Part of this way of eating is that you you just have to have high nutrient density or high NEQ over time, over the week, over the month, right?
01:11:36.059 --> 01:11:41.500
And so I generally eat at home, I make all my meals, they're generally over a hundred, right?
01:11:41.579 --> 01:11:44.219
But maybe they're all like 105, right?
01:11:44.699 --> 01:11:48.939
So I can eat an 85 on the weekends, right?
01:11:49.179 --> 01:11:51.739
But it still works for me because it balances out, right?
01:11:51.819 --> 01:11:54.939
That's so I don't feel trapped, I don't feel restricted.
01:11:55.259 --> 01:11:57.420
I also am very full at all times.
01:11:57.579 --> 01:11:58.859
Like I don't like to snack.
01:11:58.939 --> 01:12:01.019
I haven't had snacks in like eight, nine years.
01:12:01.179 --> 01:12:03.179
Like it's just not interesting to me because I'm full.
01:12:03.259 --> 01:12:06.539
I eat, I don't want to give permission for people to feel full.
01:12:06.699 --> 01:12:07.739
That's kind of what you're doing.
01:12:07.819 --> 01:12:11.500
It's like eat food, don't track calories, eat food, you will be full.
01:12:11.659 --> 01:12:14.380
That's what you people need to not be restricted.
01:12:14.539 --> 01:12:19.979
So many people they don't want to go on diets because they're like, I can never eat ice cream ever again.
01:12:20.219 --> 01:12:21.259
And I understand that.
01:12:21.420 --> 01:12:27.019
Like, and maybe if you're 400 pounds, you shouldn't eat like ice cream and cake for a while.
01:12:27.259 --> 01:12:32.460
But you can get to your goal weight and you can maybe find some other foods that you like that are just as rewarding.
01:12:32.619 --> 01:12:38.779
You can make like I make this uh banana pancake that's just old bananas and eggs.
01:12:38.859 --> 01:12:45.420
Yeah, and then you mash it up, and then you can add some cinnamon and vanilla, and then you can add blueberries on top, maple syrup.
01:12:45.579 --> 01:12:46.539
You can even add ice cream.
01:12:46.619 --> 01:12:47.979
I add ice cream sometimes on top.
01:12:48.059 --> 01:12:49.739
It's insane, it's so good.
01:12:49.899 --> 01:12:57.979
They are it's like whole foods, but yes, it's I'm not thinking it's like healthy that I eat it every day, you know, unless I'm playing beach volleyball.
01:12:58.059 --> 01:12:59.500
I played beach volleyball this morning.
01:12:59.579 --> 01:13:03.659
That is a perfectly reasonable thing to eat after you play beach volleyball for three hours.
01:13:03.899 --> 01:13:04.380
Totally.
01:13:04.539 --> 01:13:24.219
And I mean, I think you could mesh this really well with like standard nutrition education of and and saying, like, hey, let's only allow a certain amount of the diet to be like, and you can this is getting a little dogmatic, but saying like maybe this percentage fat is a general good health guideline, this this percentage carb.
01:13:24.299 --> 01:13:35.500
And I'm talking about for the masses and like this amount of protein, and you can generally tell people how to eat some of these more whole foods and traditionally prepared foods, falling kind of close to those macros.
01:13:35.979 --> 01:13:37.019
And with a lot of things.
01:13:37.179 --> 01:13:41.259
Oh, if people need more help, absolutely, you can get it still fits into the framework.
01:13:41.899 --> 01:13:42.539
Yeah, totally.
01:13:42.859 --> 01:13:44.460
It's just more detail.
01:13:45.259 --> 01:13:52.460
Yeah, and you get a person to a point where every time someone starts with me, they go, Oh my gosh, am I gonna have to track my foods for the rest of my life?
01:13:52.619 --> 01:13:54.299
Absolutely, God know.
01:13:54.779 --> 01:14:00.619
Um, we want to get your brain used to what these calorie and food amounts look like.
01:14:00.779 --> 01:14:08.460
And like I said, I never set a calorie target, but I know, right, when I'm calculating it for them, and I can tell if they're going over or under or whatever.
01:14:08.779 --> 01:14:16.539
But you teach someone what 150 grams of protein looks like, what 200, 300 grams of carbs look like, what 50 grams of fat looks like.
01:14:16.779 --> 01:14:23.099
And then when they're when they've done 12 nutrition appointments with me, they don't even have to log anymore.
01:14:23.259 --> 01:14:24.619
They're just eating.
01:14:24.859 --> 01:14:33.179
And because many of their foods are coming from this whole food and traditionally processed category, they're not thinking at all about logging anymore.
01:14:33.339 --> 01:14:42.699
So it's actually like a version of food freedom where you're not having to log every grain of rice that you're eating and every single gram of fat.
01:14:43.179 --> 01:14:43.819
I love this.
01:14:43.979 --> 01:14:44.380
I love it.
01:14:44.460 --> 01:14:51.579
And that's a third paper because I know we're running out of time, but the third paper kind of just is is a higher level view of all the stuff we've been talking about today.
01:14:51.659 --> 01:14:53.019
It's called the intake regulation model.
01:14:53.259 --> 01:14:54.299
I just call it IRM.
01:14:54.460 --> 01:15:03.420
It's kind of like what you were saying is that you should the body can manage its intake on its own if you give it the right foods.
01:15:03.579 --> 01:15:06.380
Okay, and then that's how it's worked for all of history.
01:15:06.619 --> 01:15:11.019
And we actually have a compensation, comp compensatory mechanisms in our body.
01:15:11.179 --> 01:15:22.059
It's pretty amazing that I can overeat like a lot of calories of you know, my nutrient-dense, like good foods, or you know, I'm eating ice cream, but it's like very quality ice cream, stuff like that, maple syrup.
01:15:22.219 --> 01:15:33.019
I'm it's not like my body is getting exactly 2,600 calories per day or whatever, you know, my BMR and all these calculations are, but your body can compensate a lot, okay?
01:15:33.179 --> 01:15:48.939
And one of the big theories that I actually didn't really put in the paper because it's a little hard to prove, but I'm putting in the book called The New Theory of Food, it's coming out in a month, is that your body should be able to compensate and it can burn off more calories, and it's fine.
01:15:49.019 --> 01:15:49.739
That's how it works.
01:15:49.819 --> 01:15:50.779
You just move more.
01:15:50.939 --> 01:15:58.619
Like that's what was so surprising about the book Burn that I told you about Hern Poncer that found that people burn the same cows as Hunter Gathers.
01:15:58.859 --> 01:16:01.899
It's because if you do a hard workout, then you sit around all day.
01:16:02.059 --> 01:16:08.699
So your your body has yes, so yeah, and if you eat more, yes, you you move more, you have more energy to work out.
01:16:08.779 --> 01:16:10.619
You fidget more, you pace more.
01:16:10.779 --> 01:16:11.339
This is neat.
01:16:11.500 --> 01:16:12.779
And N-E-A-T, right?
01:16:12.939 --> 01:16:15.420
Non-exercise, activity, thermogenesis.
01:16:15.579 --> 01:16:19.420
And this is so your body should be able to compensate, right?
01:16:19.500 --> 01:16:27.019
And so no one, so the kind of the theory of the IRM thing, the third paper, is why people got fat and sick.
01:16:27.099 --> 01:16:32.779
And right now there's a calorie model, there's also the carbohydrate insulin model, which I used to believe in when I was low carb.
01:16:32.859 --> 01:16:36.460
That's just like you eat carbs and they cause like insulin to go up, and that's the problem.
01:16:36.859 --> 01:16:37.579
I don't think that's true.
01:16:37.659 --> 01:16:39.819
There, I mean, this could be possibly true, but there's actually studies.
01:16:39.899 --> 01:16:49.659
Kevin Hall did some studies, this big NI researcher, and they found that they did low carb and low fat, and they both lost the same amount of weight, and everything was controlled, protein was controlled, right?
01:16:49.739 --> 01:16:53.420
So if protein's controlled, that's why I don't even care about carbs and fat that much.
01:16:53.659 --> 01:17:00.460
That uh you could do moderate, you can kind of do moderate carbs, moderate fat, or like a little, you know, whatever you're saying, like a little more carbs, a little less fat.
01:17:00.539 --> 01:17:01.420
Yeah, all that.
01:17:01.659 --> 01:17:14.539
So if you do that, your body will self-regulate and it has ways to raise your metabolism through fidgeting, pacing, all these other things if you eat in a tiny bit much, too much.
01:17:14.779 --> 01:17:26.460
And if you eat processed foods, it throws off the system and you can no longer compensate, and you will slowly gain fat year after year.
01:17:26.619 --> 01:17:32.299
That's kind of like the big theory of like, why are Americans 74% overweight or obese?
01:17:32.460 --> 01:17:35.659
Why is the average female like 5'4 and 172?
01:17:35.899 --> 01:17:36.539
This is crazy.
01:17:36.699 --> 01:17:39.179
Did you see this new post that it's going around on Instagram lately?
01:17:39.339 --> 01:17:42.139
5'4, 172 is the average female.
01:17:42.299 --> 01:17:43.420
Why did that happen?
01:17:43.579 --> 01:17:51.259
Well, it's because you slowly, you didn't want to, no one decided, oh, I just want to be overweight and not look so great, right?
01:17:51.339 --> 01:17:52.699
No one wants to do that.
01:17:52.859 --> 01:17:53.259
Yeah.
01:17:53.420 --> 01:17:56.699
Uh and I know a lot of people who are trying, right?
01:17:56.779 --> 01:18:01.659
And a lot of females are dieting and doing everything they can, but yet it's still happening anyway.
01:18:02.139 --> 01:18:02.699
And why?
01:18:02.859 --> 01:18:07.179
It's because if you cannot eat less of the same bad food, do you your body?
01:18:07.339 --> 01:18:11.579
We we're amazing machines, really.
01:18:11.739 --> 01:18:15.739
Like I don't want to say machines, but we're like this complex system for all of history.
01:18:15.819 --> 01:18:24.859
Every animal on earth got real food, they got these real inputs, their body recognizes them, and they had to do no calorie counting, there was no math necessary.
01:18:25.099 --> 01:18:29.179
But if you are eating processed foods, it doesn't work.
01:18:29.339 --> 01:18:31.339
It breaks the systems in your body.
01:18:31.500 --> 01:18:34.299
Like we're talking about GLP, the hormones, GIP.
01:18:34.460 --> 01:18:49.019
The it, there's so many different ways that it just these processed foods will slowly break your metabolism and you'll slowly overeat over time and without knowing it, and you wake up and you're 30 pounds overweight.
01:18:49.899 --> 01:18:51.500
That's kind of yeah, that's my big theory.
01:18:52.059 --> 01:18:52.619
It's bizarre.
01:18:52.699 --> 01:18:59.099
I mean, I can't I really can't wait to read the book if it's sort of tying a lot of these things together, but it it is bizarre.
01:18:59.259 --> 01:19:11.420
I think after so many years of sort of following a pro-metabolic framework for myself and just seeing s how much healthier I am and how much more I can trust my body and like just sort of eat intuitively and all these things.
01:19:11.659 --> 01:19:16.539
I was telling one of my clients today, I I have not been working out as much lately.
01:19:16.699 --> 01:19:23.659
I was sick for a week, so I like balled with you and Maggie, and then I just got hit with something and I was destroyed for a week.
01:19:24.059 --> 01:19:34.380
And I did a lot of soups and a lot of oranges and stuff and got better, but I was burning significantly less calories, and I just naturally wasn't eating as much.
01:19:34.539 --> 01:19:42.299
It's like my body knew like she's not weightlifting in the mornings anymore, she's not playing basketball, and after a couple days, my intake just slowed.
01:19:42.460 --> 01:19:51.420
And then the last couple days I've really been kicking up the activity, and I walked like 16,000 steps yesterday, and I weightlifted this morning, and it's back like full force.
01:19:51.579 --> 01:19:52.539
The appetite is back.
01:19:52.619 --> 01:19:54.139
I didn't have to change anything.
01:19:54.299 --> 01:19:56.460
I'm not going, oh, should I eat more?
01:19:56.619 --> 01:20:02.619
I'm just waiting for the thyroid to sort of ping me and go, hey man, it's time for more killings.
01:20:02.859 --> 01:20:05.099
And it doesn't matter if it works too in the world.
01:20:05.259 --> 01:20:06.380
The system works.
01:20:06.699 --> 01:20:11.259
The system works, but every animal on earth, it works except for animals we feed.
01:20:11.579 --> 01:20:24.779
You know, the only obese animals are zoo animals or uh like raccoons that eat trash from humans, rats that eat trash and you know, bad food from humans, dogs that eat kibble and human food.
01:20:25.019 --> 01:20:30.299
The only animals on earth that are overweight are humans and those that are fed by humans.
01:20:30.380 --> 01:20:43.819
And it's because it breaks the system, it breaks the tidy, it breaks the natural compensatory systems your body has, and you overeat slowly, like microscopically, even over time, and you don't know.
01:20:43.979 --> 01:20:45.339
And it's energy calories, right?
01:20:45.420 --> 01:20:46.619
You're not overeating protein.
01:20:46.779 --> 01:20:49.899
They've done overfeeding studies on protein, and people don't gain weight.
01:20:50.139 --> 01:20:51.899
They actually, some of them just gain muscle.
01:20:52.059 --> 01:20:58.139
I mean, they might gain weight because it's muscle, but you can yeah, it and also potato diets, right?
01:20:58.299 --> 01:21:02.139
They do potato diets, and people have massive success from those.
01:21:02.299 --> 01:21:13.899
Um and it's because it's unprocessed and you digest it like normal, and the body has a field day with potatoes, it's got electrolytes and carb and a little bit of protein, and it's it's the body knows what it is, so it does its perfect job.
01:21:14.219 --> 01:21:15.259
It's um it's a hack.
01:21:15.339 --> 01:21:17.179
Yeah, the potato hack, people lost a lot of weight.
01:21:17.259 --> 01:21:19.819
And also, 1995 Holt study.
01:21:19.979 --> 01:21:23.019
If you look it up, potatoes were the most satiating food.
01:21:23.179 --> 01:21:26.779
They were number one on the list, most satiating food, full of water, right?
01:21:26.859 --> 01:21:28.219
It's a whole food.
01:21:28.460 --> 01:21:31.019
And yeah, I mean, I wouldn't I wouldn't eat all potatoes.
01:21:31.099 --> 01:21:31.579
It's a good hack.
01:21:31.659 --> 01:21:33.899
Like you can lose weight doing anything, that's the point, right?
01:21:34.139 --> 01:21:39.099
So I would say eat more potatoes in general with nutrient-dense proteins.
01:21:39.579 --> 01:21:43.179
I don't ever, I don't think I've ever capped someone's potato intake.
01:21:43.339 --> 01:21:46.939
I don't know if like I'm just a spokesperson for potatoes with my wife.
01:21:47.500 --> 01:21:49.659
Big potatoes on you're on the payroll.
01:21:49.899 --> 01:21:52.619
Big potato, you gotta watch where those checks are coming from.
01:21:52.939 --> 01:21:58.779
I've never once had someone have negative health consequences from incorporating more fruit and potatoes.
01:21:58.939 --> 01:21:59.579
I don't care about it.
01:21:59.739 --> 01:22:00.939
Unless they're French fries.
01:22:01.420 --> 01:22:01.899
Yes.
01:22:02.059 --> 01:22:02.380
Yep.
01:22:02.460 --> 01:22:02.939
And I'm not sure.
01:22:03.179 --> 01:22:04.460
Do not eat French fries.
01:22:04.699 --> 01:22:06.539
So that's so there's a good one.
01:22:06.779 --> 01:22:09.500
I know we gotta stop, but a whole potato.
01:22:09.739 --> 01:22:14.699
A whole potato, amazing, high satiety, high water, everything's good.
01:22:14.859 --> 01:22:17.899
You french fries, now all of a sudden you're just adding a whole bunch of oil.
01:22:18.139 --> 01:22:26.219
See on top of that, less water, way more calorie dense, and then a potato chip, almost no water in structure, and even more oil.
01:22:26.380 --> 01:22:28.859
So it's super high energy, low nutrient, right?
01:22:28.939 --> 01:22:30.779
So they're they're the opposite ends of the spectrum.
01:22:30.859 --> 01:22:33.819
So potato is fairly high on the list.
01:22:33.899 --> 01:22:38.219
You know, it's not super nutrient dense like shrimp or something, but you know, it's fairly high.
01:22:38.380 --> 01:22:43.259
And then french fries lower, potato chips, bottom of the barrel, one of the worst.
01:22:43.500 --> 01:22:43.979
Yeah.
01:22:44.219 --> 01:22:50.939
And you're combining when you're doing French fries, which I really try to, I don't demonize a lot of foods.
01:22:51.259 --> 01:22:55.259
But if I were, like you said, donuts earlier, for me, that's like french fries.
01:22:55.339 --> 01:22:59.259
And I say, like, hey man, like you can find a better choice than the french fries.
01:22:59.420 --> 01:23:03.339
I feel like you're not really trying if you're eating french fries like seven times a week.
01:23:03.500 --> 01:23:09.979
Like, we can do better, we can get a fruit cup, you can have just another chicken sandwich, but like there's a lot of things better than the french fries.
01:23:10.219 --> 01:23:11.899
Objectively, they're a terrible food.
01:23:11.979 --> 01:23:16.619
And if you're meeting with a dietitian that's telling you to eat french fries, it's time to find another dietitian.
01:23:17.500 --> 01:23:20.219
Because they're very high in carbs and fat at the same time.
01:23:20.779 --> 01:23:27.259
So if we want low triglycerides, you do not ever eat meals that are very high in carbohydrate and fat at the same time.
01:23:27.420 --> 01:23:29.579
And that's a really easy principle to follow.
01:23:29.739 --> 01:23:33.500
It's like some of my meals could be high protein and high fat.
01:23:33.659 --> 01:23:36.219
Other meals could be high protein and high carb.
01:23:36.619 --> 01:23:44.219
And like you said earlier, you can mix and match and you can do a certain carb target or whatever, or you could do a lower carb target, higher fat target.
01:23:44.299 --> 01:23:51.420
But the protein needs to be there in every single meal and one of the energy nutrients, not both.
01:23:52.699 --> 01:23:54.380
Yeah, and it's it's very simple.
01:23:54.619 --> 01:23:55.179
It's so good.
01:23:55.259 --> 01:23:59.019
Yeah, and it's pretty hard in nature, they don't come together.
01:23:59.339 --> 01:24:02.299
Only a few things in nature come together, like nuts.
01:24:02.460 --> 01:24:04.939
Nuts are one of the only foods that are high carbon, high fat.
01:24:05.259 --> 01:24:11.659
And throughout the year, they were only around for a certain small portion of the year, and it was kind of to help people fatten up for winter, actually.
01:24:12.059 --> 01:24:14.380
Bears eat them in mass right before they hibernate.
01:24:14.779 --> 01:24:15.339
Yes.
01:24:16.059 --> 01:24:19.500
I like to tell people that that are eating a lot of nuts and seeds.
01:24:19.579 --> 01:24:20.939
I'm like, all right.
01:24:21.259 --> 01:24:32.059
So we know that bears eat a lot of salmon, which is very high in polyunsaturated fat, and a lot of nuts and seeds right before they hibernate, and they're sleeping for four to five months.
01:24:32.139 --> 01:24:34.059
So, what does that tell us about that food?
01:24:34.219 --> 01:24:44.219
And then when they're active and want to be awake and alert, like during mating season and when they're moving around, they eat a lot of berries and they hunt larger game animals.
01:24:44.299 --> 01:24:45.819
So, like, what are we doing?
01:24:45.979 --> 01:24:59.819
And it's it's you will see people kind of like wake up to that if you talk about foods that might damage or slow the thyroid over time as well, which is why I'm interested in the anti-nutrient component of this and why I'm like kind of pushing it.
01:24:59.979 --> 01:25:01.739
I think this is already fantastic.
01:25:01.899 --> 01:25:23.979
And you I know you're you uh you've got stuff on sapien.org, but it would be really great to get these tools like super finalized and in an app for people because I know so many people that would just off to the races with this, and they would they would achieve that score every single week, and then they'd watch their health just significantly improve over time.
01:25:24.539 --> 01:25:27.420
Well, let's try to I'm gonna try to get it out there as soon as possible.
01:25:27.500 --> 01:25:28.699
I don't know when this is gonna release.
01:25:28.779 --> 01:25:30.299
Maybe you could wait a few weeks.
01:25:30.539 --> 01:25:32.460
Uh but yeah, I'm doing a lot.
01:25:32.539 --> 01:25:36.059
All right, now you just just go to saving.org and get on our list.
01:25:36.139 --> 01:25:37.339
I don't send a lot of emails.
01:25:37.420 --> 01:25:38.460
There's no like spam.
01:25:38.539 --> 01:25:43.659
There's it's just like, I mean, there's a little email sequence, I guess, that just introduces you to my podcast.
01:25:45.500 --> 01:25:47.259
I don't do inundated.
01:25:47.659 --> 01:25:53.579
I'm definitely not into marketing and all that stuff, but I uh yeah, I'm gonna I'm working on this app and it's gonna come out.
01:25:53.659 --> 01:26:03.659
I'm wearing a whole health coverage thing, which is a whole nother topic that I don't need to pitch right now, but even the solution for people who don't want the normal insurance system.
01:26:04.619 --> 01:26:06.380
So that's gonna be incorporated into the app.
01:26:07.099 --> 01:26:20.380
And we're gonna make is we're also gonna make a separate app where it shows the live locations of people who are directly involved in these ultra-processed foods so that we can just come after them as like a whole game.
01:26:22.139 --> 01:26:33.739
And then we'll also there's another app, a security system, where if you're pushing this on people and teaching them about whole foods and traditionally prepared foods, it's a security system for dietitians and health influencers.
01:26:33.899 --> 01:26:48.619
Um, and you know, it's directly against like General Mills and Kraft Heinz, but when you have third app, it's a dating app for people who use the NEQ calculator and are into their health, and then we can match them together.
01:26:48.699 --> 01:26:53.259
That's the we can directly compete with Carnivore Aurelius' dating app.
01:26:53.500 --> 01:26:53.659
Yeah.
01:26:54.299 --> 01:26:55.339
Did you know he has one?
01:26:55.659 --> 01:26:56.859
I think I did hear about that.
01:26:56.939 --> 01:26:57.579
Yeah.
01:26:58.059 --> 01:26:59.579
Anyway, this has been fun.
01:26:59.739 --> 01:27:02.939
So check out what was your website, sapien.org.
01:27:03.099 --> 01:27:09.739
Yeah, sapien.org and food lies on Instagram or X or Facebook if anyone still uses Facebook.
01:27:09.819 --> 01:27:10.779
It's Food Lies.
01:27:11.420 --> 01:27:14.299
And my Instagram handle is Don't Do Dogma.
01:27:14.460 --> 01:27:16.859
And I'm looking up what Brian's Instagram handle is.
01:27:17.099 --> 01:27:17.979
Oh, it's food lies.
01:27:18.059 --> 01:27:19.019
Just search for food lies.
01:27:19.099 --> 01:27:20.939
I'm on any platform as Foodlies.
01:27:21.339 --> 01:27:21.979
There you are.
01:27:22.139 --> 01:27:25.179
Well, your food dot lies on Instagram, so don't lie.
01:27:25.339 --> 01:27:26.299
There's a dot in there.
01:27:26.619 --> 01:27:27.979
I'm assuming people can find me.
01:27:28.059 --> 01:27:31.019
If they just type in food lies, I'm the number one result.
01:27:32.059 --> 01:27:32.699
Wow, yeah.
01:27:32.779 --> 01:27:35.739
You've he's 423,000 followers.
01:27:35.899 --> 01:27:36.699
That's impressive.
01:27:37.500 --> 01:27:38.059
It's real.
01:27:38.219 --> 01:27:41.179
It's real, and I have six pack year-round without trying.
01:27:41.339 --> 01:27:42.299
That's also real.
01:27:42.699 --> 01:27:43.339
You do.
01:27:43.500 --> 01:27:44.859
You've always been healthy.
01:27:45.019 --> 01:27:48.619
Like, I've never looked at you and been like, that guy's carrying excess body fat.
01:27:48.779 --> 01:27:58.139
Like, you're always tan and you're also not, you know how you look at some people that are really built and they're like tired and have bags under their eyes because they've been starving themselves.
01:27:58.699 --> 01:28:05.179
No, I you have you have the opposite of that, where you're like glowing and you're bouncing around and you've got lots of energy.
01:28:05.420 --> 01:28:08.059
So that's how that's actually you know Zayn Greg's?
01:28:08.299 --> 01:28:08.380
Yeah.
01:28:09.979 --> 01:28:10.779
For sure, Zayn's my man.
01:28:11.099 --> 01:28:15.420
I started listening to him because he looked and sounded out.
01:28:15.979 --> 01:28:21.259
Like when you talk to Zane, he's got lots of energy and he's very positive and animated.
01:28:21.339 --> 01:28:23.420
And you're like, what is this man eating?
01:28:23.579 --> 01:28:25.500
And I want he looks great too.
01:28:26.059 --> 01:28:27.099
Well, he does look great.
01:28:27.739 --> 01:28:36.219
Uh but I remember one time we were both uh sort of coming off of that carnivore era, and I think it was at Sapien Center.
01:28:36.299 --> 01:28:44.299
There was like a bowl of watermelon or something, and I was just looking at it, and I was entranced because I just hadn't been eating carbs.
01:28:44.779 --> 01:28:47.979
And my body was like, hey man, you might want to like pick up the watermelon.
01:28:48.299 --> 01:28:53.739
And I think Zayn was watching me and he was like, Hey, uh, do you want some of that?
01:28:56.219 --> 01:28:57.099
No, I can't.
01:28:57.339 --> 01:28:58.539
Oh carnivore.
01:28:58.619 --> 01:29:02.859
And he was like, I think maybe like just have a piece and see what happens.
01:29:03.019 --> 01:29:08.619
And that got us talking, and I was like, Man, I should this should be my mentor because he was talking about how carbs.
01:29:08.699 --> 01:29:13.819
I went to one conference where he's talking about how carbs can help massively with weightlifting, obviously.
01:29:14.859 --> 01:29:24.779
Uh, but he's he's trying to educate women in their 40s and 50s, uh 60s about the importance of carbs and like keeping those in your diet and not doing low carb.
01:29:24.939 --> 01:29:33.739
Uh, but it was a great presentation, and I just in general, you should listen to people that have good reasoning skills and look and feel good.
01:29:33.899 --> 01:29:35.099
Like good results.
01:29:35.899 --> 01:29:36.619
No, he's awesome.
01:29:36.699 --> 01:29:37.819
He's like 50 or something.
01:29:37.979 --> 01:29:40.139
Yeah, he's yeah, yeah, he's great.
01:29:40.219 --> 01:29:41.899
Now, and he believes in all this stuff.
01:29:42.139 --> 01:29:50.619
He he like I I don't think I've talked to him specifically about my papers yet, but I know I've talked to him many times over the years, and he is very in line with this.
01:29:50.859 --> 01:29:52.059
Yeah, he'd love this stuff.
01:29:52.139 --> 01:29:53.739
Y'all y'all should do another podcast.
01:29:53.819 --> 01:29:55.179
He'd absolutely love this.
01:29:55.420 --> 01:29:56.139
Let's do it.
01:29:56.859 --> 01:29:58.539
Anyway, thank you, Brian.
01:29:58.859 --> 01:29:59.819
All right, thank you.
01:29:59.979 --> 01:30:01.019
This is great.
01:30:01.420 --> 01:30:01.819
Bye.