Chris Mader: and welcome back to the MTA podcast where we focus on leadership, growth, personal development. Today, gang, we have an amazing guest who I had the opportunity to meet about two years ago. And so I wanna take back, I wanna go back to January of 2024. I was asked to keynote at a company called Zeek Tech out in Northern California to talk about behavior change, improving your outcomes, improving your skills, doing some sales and recruiter training. Did this amazing talk and little did I know This other gentleman was also asked to keynote that day. And wow, was I in for a surprise. ⁓ Robert Paylor is here today and ⁓ he went to ⁓ UC Berkeley and he played rugby. He's now an inspirational speaker, a published author, and recently a new dad. He wrote a book called Paralyzed to Powerful, came out last May. And I got to tell you again, his story of resilience, faith, identity, radical positivity is one you're wanna carry with you. Rob, I cannot thank you enough for taking the time to be on the show today.
Robert Paylor: I'm so thrilled for it, Chris. Thank you for having me.
Chris Mader: Yeah, absolutely. yeah, we were introduced to a mutual friend, John Stewart, who is the CEO of Zeek Tech, an IT staffing company out there in Northern California. And, ⁓ you know, John, if anybody knows John, there's a podcast episode with John, he was a previous guest on show. John is an interesting character. Tell me just how you got to meet John and how John kidnapped you that day to have you come in and speak to his team.
Robert Paylor: Absolutely. So I got I got introduced to John through another John who works for Zeek Tech, and just such a great group of guys. And this this john Bianchi is his name, my my john who introduced me to john Stewart, ⁓ hunting buddy, best friend and everything. And just really like Italian American personalities always bubble and everyone loves him. And ⁓ then just somehow through the grapevine of this connection, get connected over to Zeek Tech and John Stewart, which has been another wonderful relationship watching the Superbowl together and going out to get lunch and just have great conversations. It's been, it was so much fun to go share that experience together at that event a couple of years ago, but then just continue to relation relationships. Been a lot of fun. Yeah.
Chris Mader: Yeah, that's awesome. And it was funny because you were introduced as ⁓ a college rugby player and I think it was playing the national championship. And I'm hearing this introduction and I'm like, wow, I'm really excited to talk to another college athlete, hear their story of resilience. And I'm like, this is exciting, but I wanna take back for the people that have yet to meet you or hear your story. Just take me back all the way back to freshman year, like how you heard about the rugby program at UC Berkeley. ⁓
Robert Paylor: questions.
Chris Mader: and just kind of take me from there up until the national championship game.
Robert Paylor: Yeah, really interesting journey because rugby is not a very popular sport in America. It exists in some pockets. Like I'm from the Sacramento Valley. It's actually quite popular over here in Sacramento and the Bay area as well over in San Francisco. lot going on there too. Some in Southern California. And then you see it in like these little pockets of Indiana thinking what the heck? Why are you guys playing rugby out here? And then a little bit in New England. But other than that, it's pretty just much blank. You don't see a lot of these pockets.
Chris Mader: Yeah, it's nichey. Yeah, it's a niche. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: Yeah, it's very niche. ⁓ So I show up to Jesuit High School in Sacramento, and they have the most successful rugby program in the high school level in America. I think it's 11 national championships that they're at. It's amazing. And the culture is rooted into the school. So you're walking around, and people are throwing a rugby ball around at practice and they've got their short shorts.
Chris Mader: So explain that a little further. Talk to me about the rugby. I've had the opportunity to travel the world a little bit, Ireland, Asia Pacific, and I've watched rugby. Just talk about the culture of rugby, like what it's like to be a player in that, just in that sphere. Talk to us about
Robert Paylor: the best, the best sports culture that there is. ⁓ number one, it's amazing how global it is, you know, here into the States, if Detroit's playing Tampa Bay, we call it the world championship over there. have a genuine world championship and, it's, really fun how you have these rivalries and in, rugby, it's unique that on the field, I mean, they'll be tearing each other apart for 90 minutes, but
Chris Mader: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: Afterwards, they all meet up at a pub or a bar wherever they are. And, ⁓ you know, they'll be having some drinks together and sharing stories. the sport really brought them together where I feel like in kind of that American football culture with our contact sports, you're just kind of mortal enemies. And if a Raiders fan sees a 49ers fan, they just know that they're not going to mix and rugby, you know, during the match, you'll have your exchanges and you'll have some fun with it. But afterwards.
Chris Mader: Yes. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: It really brings you all together. think that's what's such a cool part about this sport. It really brings you together.
Chris Mader: Yeah, yeah, I appreciate explaining that for people that aren't as familiar with it, because I got a taste of it because I did travel internationally and met some feats from, you know, New Zealand, Australia, and they, you know, you go to a sports bar, you're watching rugby. And so I was watching like the All Blacks. I'm like, ⁓ this is a cool sport, you know, and I do think that I used to think that hockey had a pretty similar culture. think rugby is even I think you're even tougher in rugby. I think there's a camaraderie. It's even stronger. I mean, I think hockey is amazing, but
Robert Paylor: Yeah.
Chris Mader: I do agree for the people I've met from rugby, including yourself, it's a really cool group of people you get to associate with. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: It is amazing. And like with how tough a sport it is. mean, I'm talking full contact, no pads, 90 minutes, just to halftime in between for 10, 15 minutes there to kind of cool off. You're really going at each other. But then after that, to be able to just hang out and, you know, and like have a great time is such something is really unique. You don't see it.
Chris Mader: Yeah. All right. Yeah, no, you don't. All right, so I cut you off. you're in high school, you're in this amazing program, you're about colleges, so yeah, sorry, continue.
Robert Paylor: Totally. So the sport culture here at Jesuit is so focused on rugby. I'm playing football, basketball, baseball, growing up, going to Jesuit high school, do football, which was my thing. I really thought I was going to shoot for this lane to go play for a D1 school here in the States and, uh, you know, kind of see what happens from there from a football perspective. play basketball and I'm just a measly six foot five. I'm a little guy compared to these basketball standards. We had guys on the class above us. One was 6'10", another guy was 6'8", and they weren't just bodies. These guys could ball. They both went on to go play for D1 schools. And I'm thinking, even if I make this team another year, like, I might just ride the pine. And I don't want to be like a prima donna, but I didn't want to ride the pine. I wasn't willing to put in that much effort for not a really strong chance of being a starter. And then that's when my friends are like, try out rugby. You're great in contact. got a real knack for it. And this is a serious program we have here. We're bringing in some serious hardware, but we're also sending people to serious schools like UC Berkeley being the most natural pipeline from Judgert High School over there for rugby. So I was like, you know what? I'm going to do it. I'm going to take this leap of faith. One of the best decisions I ever made. I just fall in love with this game. And I'm good at it. get MVP my first year playing. We won a national championship that year on our varsity team. My junior and my senior years then were runner up for best in the nation. I'm team captain. We're doing having some real success. And eventually my shoulder gets tapped to go play for UC Berkeley, the most successful rugby program in collegiate rugby history here in the States. Now the program has been playing since 1882, I believe. It is the oldest varsity sport over at Cal and it used to be like the big games of Cal versus Stanford were rugby game and you'd have tens of thousands of people cheering us on. So you want to talk about rugby being rooted into the sports culture. is no bigger than at Cal, a true bonafide division one athletic experience, but it's quite difficult. We've had 34 national championships in about 45 years.
Chris Mader: Right. Very cool. It's insane.
Robert Paylor: I think the only team that has more hardware than Cal rugby is the Harlem Globetrotters. And for who don't know their kids are rigged. we're doing pretty good. Yeah, exactly. So I show up freshman year. I'm kind of putting in work, doing my time. Everybody on this team was an all-American. They're the captain of their teams in high school. You got to earn your keep. But by my sophomore year, there was a person in my position who had graduated.
Chris Mader: Yeah, yeah, I know. I was gonna say it's better in the Yankees. mean, 27, 28, it's crazy. Yeah, that's crazy.
Robert Paylor: I play lock, there's two locks on the field and one of these spots was open and I decided I'm going to give it everything I've got. And I got it. I put in a lot of work over the summer in the weight room and throughout that fall season. But once it came time to play, I was just a sure starter for this team. Number one in the nation. And then eventually we get ready to compete for a national championship.
Chris Mader: Yeah, and I wanna talk about that. and I saw, know, in your talk when I was in California, I saw the photos. I mean, you're just a big, big dude, you know, and big, strong and lean. So yeah, I mean, let's, you know, I wanna talk about, you know, May, was it May 6th, 2017. So it's Collegiate Rugby National Championship. And you are literally like living your dream, right? You're a national champion in high school, captain, UC Berkeley. You're in the, here you are again.
Robert Paylor: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: And you're obviously just, I know that feeling as a college athlete, you're fired up, right? And you're just ready to go. But then something happened. And so if we put people that don't know the story, just take us through the incident.
Robert Paylor: Yeah, so we're playing Arkansas State. We're feeling very confident going into this game and what would become our 32nd international championship in the program's history. I'm thinking this is going to be the best day of my life. I mean, these are the moments that you dream of as an athlete to be on national television competing for the most important game of the year. And I'm thinking this is going to be the day that my legacy is made because when you win a national championship, you're not just the national champion for the day. You are regarded as a national champion for the rest of your life. I wanted this. And we felt very good about getting this win because Arkansas State has never won a national championship before. And we're going for number 32. So ⁓ it was very early on in this game that I'm competing in what's called a mall, which is when the bigger guys we group up in one unit and then we push to advance the ball and the defense's job has come straight in. try to stop us from moving forward. It's a boiler room. It's where the big guys thrive and I was a big guy. Six five, 245 pounds. I'm on this field to move people. Just moving people that don't want to move and we're just five meters out from scoring. I'm practically drooling here on this field thing and let's go Rob drive this thing in. But then as I do that, these opposing players start making these illegal moves and the referee's not calling anything. So first three players coming from the side of the mall, which are all in fractions. You can't do that, but the ref's not calling it. And then their number eight binds me to headlock. So he's got my chin pinned down to my chest. Now, normally in rugby, that is an automatic yellow or red card. If you do that, you're gone from the game. There's no questions asked, but the ref's not calling it. And as he's got my head pinned down like that, another player chops me down by my legs. So I start falling down. And he continues to torque me down by my neck. I can't get my head up. I remember I just closed my eyes. I grip my teeth. What happens is my body's going down and forward. So my head makes impact with the ground. And as my body goes forward, my face rolls against my chest, literally nose into my sternum. I feel this god awful snap in my neck and then just poof. Can't move anything. Can't feel anything. Totally.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: clear and conscious, just as conscious as aware as I am right now, but completely numb and motionless from my collarbone down and my thoughts are running wild. I knew immediately what happened. I knew that I broke my neck. I knew that it was a spinal cord injury and that these injuries are catastrophic and they're chronic and 99 times out of a hundred, they don't get any better.
Chris Mader: Yeah. All right. Yep. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I mean, it was a nightmare. And I just couldn't wake up. I remember just kind of thinking like, okay, the rest of my life, I'm pretty much going to be in a chair, power chair that I can't even move myself. Maybe I'll get pointed to watch some TV. I'll get pointed to, you know, go look outside sit on the patio and the weather is nice. My mom will spoon feed me help me shower help me do everything. One day she's gonna die. And then I will just be sitting here alone without meaning and horribly depressed. just, didn't see a lot of ways around that. And eventually my fears aren't really calmed down. They're only heightened. I get structured off the field. We go over to the hospital. We take a series of medical imaging. My doctor comes back and he's got a bad look on his face. He said, Robert, what happened to you is bad. really bad. And the reality is you'll never walk again. You'll never move your hands. And we're going to do our best so that one day you can do something like pick up a piece of pizza and bring it to your face. And if you can do that, you made it you beat all the odds. And then he says that he recommends a spinal fusion surgery to me. So he explains that the disk in between my C five and C six vertebrae ruptured into my spinal cord. I also had fracturing at the C5 and C6 vertebrae. So that damage that was done to my spine might only continue to increase unless we perform an emergency spinal fusion surgery. He says my best chance at recovery, but it's potentially life threatening surgery. I might not wake up and I have one hour to make a decision. So my faith is very important to me. And as I'm trying to get my affairs together, I'm thinking I need to bring a priest into the room. to give me the sacrament of anointing the sick. I'm Catholic and it's kind of like, it's your last rites really. I'm trying to get, ⁓ what I'm doing is thinking if I die, I want to be cleansed for heaven. But if I live, I want to really intentionally invite God into this journey. So I call my spiritual director to get a priest into the room. Cause he wasn't in the area, but he gave me this piece of advice that just changed everything for me. And it gave me so much power and what should have been a powerless situation. And he said, Robert, throughout this journey, there's going to be so much that you can't control. But the one thing you'll always have control over is your mindset. So your positivity, your ambition, your willingness to take this challenge on and fight it every day is up to you. This injury can't take that away from you. So I got to think in that moment, I didn't have a lot. I didn't have the odds on my side. I didn't have a doctor saying that everything was going to be okay. And I didn't have signs of life in my body.
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: But I had this ability to make a decision. And we all have this ability to make a decision to keep moving forward, regardless of what our circumstances. So just by realizing I have this little thing that I can focus on, I can start pushing out that fear, pushing out that anxiety for a little bit. So I could clear that fog and have some mental clarity. I need to go into the surgery. I need to give myself the best odds at this recovery. My brother held a phone in front of me so I could FaceTime my best friends, let them know I love them. I don't know if I'm going to wake up, but I love them. And he sent a group text to my rugby teammates and to a religious retreat group I did in high school. A priest comes in, received the sacrament, say my prayers with my family. I get rolled into the operating room. They put that gas mask over my face. They say, count down from a hundred. I think I made it to 97. And then it was lights out. And that concluded that day for me.
Chris Mader: And you are 18 years old? You're 27 years old. Yeah, mean, yeah. And so, I mean, we're talking about mindset. And I don't know if there's another human being I've met that has a greater mindset than you. And I really mean that. And I've met a lot of really successful people in life because you come out of surgery and then you're in the hospital for a year. And so we talk about that moment of darkness, of sitting in the hospital, last rites.
Robert Paylor: 20, young, young.
Chris Mader: you get that kernel of, hope, right? Like maybe I can overcome this. But then 365 days of being in the hospital, how do you, you how does one, you talk about mental toughness, like this is a side of mental toughness, nobody talks about everybody has a bad day, right? mean, this day is the darkest day you could have had, but, or one can experience, but like, then you have to grind for a year and now five years and 10 years, like.
Robert Paylor: Thank This is...
Chris Mader: How do you continue to keep that mindset given the challenges that you still experience each day?
Robert Paylor: Yeah, so much of it is just like taking that step just like deciding you're going to win today. And ⁓ you talk about mental toughness. Cal rugby has a glossary of terms for words like mental toughness. So we have a shared definition. I think theirs is beautiful. And they describe mental toughness as the ability to focus on the next most important thing. I think it's a great definition. think it really helps us to win the day and then sustain that long-term momentum because we're just focusing on what's the next most important thing when you can live that way. It's amazing what you can achieve in a rugby context. What that meant is let's say someone passes the ball to me. I drop it forward, knock on to the other team. It's a turnover. The mentally weak thing to do would just be wrapped up in that failure that you just had. You know, you're punching your fist in the dirt. You're all angry. But then the guy's got the ball in front of you and you're not reacting because you're so focused on what happened in the past. The mentally tough thing to do focusing on the next post important thing would be like, okay, mistake happened. I'm pushing that out immediately. What do I need to focus on right now? Other team has the ball. We need to stop them. Now when you think of where I was in this hospital, I could focus on, my gosh, I lost so much. There's so much that I can't do. And trust me, those, those temptations and all that negativity was constantly swirling around me. There are many times when it did work its way into my mindset, but when I had a job to do very clearly, I could say control your mindset, Robert, make that decision to keep moving forward. What's the next most important thing I need to start getting this tube up my nose into my stomach so I can start eating something because I haven't eaten anything for the last three days. I it's 3 a.m. and my respiratory therapist is coming in to help me pump down on my lungs so I can.
Chris Mader: Yep.
Robert Paylor: beat this pneumonia, which I got, I got double pneumonia and I couldn't even cough. So I almost died, but I'm thinking like control your mindset. What's the next most important thing? This treatment. If I don't do it, I'm going to die. So I just kept pushing through there, but I think what that allows you to do is start building some momentum. You start getting these wins. And I think long-term success is not about motivation because motivation is fleeting. It's good for that first step, but doesn't really sustain you very long-term. It's momentum.
Chris Mader: on.
Robert Paylor: that you're really looking for. And as you start building that momentum, the ball keeps rolling. It can slow down if you don't keep it going, but it's a lot easier to take that 50th step than it is to take that first step. And I think it's that first realization of I'm going to be mentally tough here. I'm going to focus on the next most important thing is you start getting those wins. You start getting some pride. You start getting some momentum and it gets a lot easier as time goes on to keep that going.
Chris Mader: Yeah. So, you know, athlete to athlete, it's, all, we all, we, when we chase rugby or baseball or any sport, we all realize there's going to be a day we stop playing, right? We play as long as we can, cause we love it. And some people can play through high school or college and there's a professional opportunity or whatever that is. And, you know, for athletes, the day comes where either you decide or it's decided for you, right? And so for you is decided for you, ⁓ in one plan, it's, just incredibly unfortunate, but Are you familiar with the, I didn't ask you this before, the story of the Chinese farmer? Are you familiar with that story? Oh, Robert, you have to, this is something, this is a good takeaway for our listeners. It's about perspective. And the thing when I, like as an example, like when I met you, you can go one of two ways with the perspective of the incident. And the story of the Chinese farmer is basically this. Long story short is this. Chinese farmer loses his rice field.
Robert Paylor: I'm not. Yeah.
Chris Mader: And somebody in the village comes by and says, you know, that's terrible. You lost your rice field. He goes, maybe. And then his son goes out and gets a bunch of Mustangs, wild Mustangs. And they come back to replow the field and they go, ⁓ my God, your son found like 12 horses to plow the field. That's incredible. And he goes, maybe. And the next day, the son's trying to train the horse. He falls off the horse, breaks his leg. Somebody goes, ⁓ my God, it's terrible. They broke his leg. And the father goes, maybe. And then the Chinese army comes by because they're at war to take the son to war. And they can't take him because he has a broken leg. And the people in the village goes, that's incredible. Like, your son didn't even have to go to war. And he goes, maybe. And so like the story is, I heard it from Tom Brady once, right? Who was, you know, Super Bowl quarterback, Northern California guy, right? From the New England Patriots. I heard him tell the story once. It's the story that the bad things that happen in life aren't always bad. And the good things that happen in life aren't always good. And it's a perspective we have. And I mean, there's no, there's no.
Robert Paylor: Yeah. Mm. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: story Robert in life when I met you in California a couple years ago, we have this identity about being an athlete. I know you have, you still have it. You had it, you still have, know you have it, because I've heard you talk. But ⁓ I want you to talk to the audience and all the athletes out there, because a lot of the people listening to the show are former athletes. How you continue to, when you go, because we'll talk about your book and you do keynote speaking, and it's very powerful when you talk. You've built your keynote around this question, what paralyzes you?
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: So I want you to talk to the audience about that because in that moment, right, you lost your ability to play the sport, which was incredibly meaningful to you. And then you had to redefine yourself. So talk to the audience just about, know, when you do have the opportunity to talk to people, what paralyzes you and what that means to you and what it means to the people you talk to.
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that what paralyzes your question is so unique. Because when you look at me, nobody can see my full body right now, but I'm in a wheelchair. And I've spent almost nine years in this wheelchair. When you look at me, it's very clear that I am paralyzed in this physical sense. But I think all of us are paralyzed by something you just can't see it. It's mental. It's emotional. Think anxiety. Think grief. Think indecision or change, think fear of failure, fear of the unknown. I think all of these things are just as crippling and just as paralyzing as any kind of physical paralysis. So what I want to get people to start thinking of what is that thing that's paralyzing me? What's it that's holding me back? And in doing that, I've now made it my life's purpose in sharing these tools. that have helped me through my journey of paralysis that can help all of us overcome those things that are paralyzing us mentally or emotionally. Now, when it comes to, you know, that athlete, that person who's trying to think like, how do I keep moving forward? Because when you're an athlete, I think things are pretty clear and defined. You know, you have a coach, you're in this program, lot, there's a lot of direction there. ⁓ you know, need to hit the weight room more. You're lacking a little bit here. You need to work on that strength. Maybe we can use this strength you already have in this unique way to be able to give you an athletic advantage. And you see, you know, okay, here I am playing you sports. And then I want to go to this high school and go to this college and then play professionally in this league. Like things are pretty defined, but after that you start losing that mental clarity. And with losing that mental clarity and that, that mission that you were on, lose your purpose. And when you lose your purpose, things just feel.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: completely directionless. that was maybe my biggest hurdle throughout all of this was finding a new purpose. My purpose was being the best athlete I can possibly be. I'm a very optimistic guy, but I knew that I was never going to play rugby again. I needed to find something new. And it came to me uniquely through this injury, which I thought had taken everything away from me. Over time, I started to find that it gave me so much more than it took away.
Chris Mader: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: What happened was a few days after my injury, my best friend's mom started up a GoFundMe campaign to help pay for my rehab expenses. As I'm sure you can imagine, breaking your neck is not a good financial decision. It's very expensive. We needed help. So as this GoFundMe campaign was started, we got this incredible drove of support ⁓ with financial contributions. It changed my life. I would not be where I am today if it weren't for the financial support that we received. But what helped me equally was this emotional, this mental support that I was receiving through these messages of encouragement, people confiding in me some incredibly difficult things that they were going through. For example, some people are saying, Robert, I'm battling stage four cancer. I'm measuring my time in weeks, months, but I look at you take on this journey with such faith and such perseverance. You're giving me hope. Thank you. Where people are like, Robert, I just lost a son or a daughter. I'm going through the most difficult thing I've ever gone through right now. But through witnessing you take on your challenge every day, you're helping me take on mine. Thank you. And I'm starting to see how this injury really gave me something. It gave me an ability to help people in a way that I never would have had if I didn't break my neck. And as I further go down this lane of sharing updates of my progress, getting more active on social media. And then starting to speak and write this book, the messages keep coming in and I've found my purpose. And I remember I gave my first speech is what it really locked in for me. I was over at UC Berkeley. I'd come back after a year of being in the hospital and I was speaking to a sports management class over there at Cal. First talk, you know, it's about 20 minutes long. ⁓ I have the notes like right in front of me on my lap doing my thing and, ⁓ I loved it.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. ⁓
Robert Paylor: I was laughing, crying, standing ovation, people coming up to me afterwards, everyone shaking my hand telling me how much it helped them. I go back to my dorm room and I'm like, this is it. This is my purpose. This is what I'm here to do. And it's so much more meaningful to me than anything I've ever done. mean, honestly, Chris, if I could go back, you know, and change what happened to me, I wouldn't. And I just couldn't because I have an impact now.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: that I just never would have had if this injury didn't happen to me. So you got to find that purpose. And I think it needs to be a selfless purpose too. If you're just serving yourself, you're not going to want to get up every day. It's just like your teammates, when you're pushing for your teammates, you're pushing so much harder than if you're just doing it for yourself. Find that selfless purpose in your life and whatever you were doing in the past and athletics or whatever journey you were going on, you won't even want back because you'll be so enraptured and just excited about what you're doing now.
Chris Mader: No, your level of humility is incredible. And it's no wonder you're a captain of the sports teams you play, a captain of your household now too, with Carson and your baby. We'll talk about that in a second. But the last thing I want to talk about, I mean, you publicly forgave the player in this incident. you talked about, again, athletes sometimes you try to get an edge and things like that, but it was clear that they were, some of the players were putting illegal moves on, cetera, but you've publicly forgiven that person. And so,
Robert Paylor: That's right. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: Why does that matter to you?
Robert Paylor: ⁓ it's a decision that was really made for me. And I think that's something we often confuse about forgiveness is that it's not just about removing guilt from the person who did wrong. It's about removing those negative attachments from the person who was wronged. And I needed that. This was maybe the most difficult mental hurdle that I had to overcome throughout my entire recovery process, because at first I didn't really know exactly what had happened. The game footage taken from NBC was from the press box. was just this weird angle where we couldn't see exactly what had happened. And in these malls, there's so many contact points. It's all very fast. It's hard to know just exactly what happened. But here I am laying in this hospital. And in the days following the match, there was this evidence that started to produce itself from different angles that I was clearly bound into a headlock and driven to the ground. by my neck completely Illegal and really the sole cause for my injury if you took that headlock away I would have been fine, but if you kept it it didn't matter what else was going on. I'm gonna break my neck every single time So I'm sitting here in this hospital. I can't eat anything. I can't breathe. I have double pneumonia. I can't cough
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I'm losing two pounds a day. lost 60 pounds in one month and my doctors are telling me almost every day that I might not survive. And I'm not going through this because I did something stupid. No, I was looking to achieve greatness in my life. And it wasn't just like a total fluke accident that caused this either. No, someone broke the laws of our game. And because of it, I'm laying here in this hospital bed. I might never even get out of it. So I say this not to take pot shots at this guy. But just to explain the rage that I was really feeling, I mean, it was something incredibly difficult to shake. ⁓ It came down, I think, initially to a question of morals for me. Like I said, my faith is very important. And I was taught that you forgive everyone in every instance, no matter how hard it is. And I think, you know what, I know that's the answer. I don't want it to be the answer. But I know it's what it is. I can't change what's in my heart, but
Chris Mader: Yeah, it's powerful. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I can choose what I say. And I would decided, I'm going to say that I forgive this person, whether I feel it internally or not. So people would ask me, Robert, what do you think about this guy? What's your take? And I would say, I forgive him. And I wish him well, even though deep within me, there's still a lot of negativity and hatred. I chose to say those words. And I think what was so wonderful about that and why I recommend everyone do do this is
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I think we just think our feelings have to dictate our actions and what we say all the time, but we have that ability to control our mindset, right? To focus on the next most important thing and be mentally tough. We can do that. And as, as I wasn't giving more words of negativity to this, I let time run its course to where that hatred could slowly burn out that animosity. I wasn't putting more fuel on that fire. I was just letting it slowly burn out. So over the course.
Chris Mader: Right.
Robert Paylor: of I'd say maybe two to three years, eventually my heart started to caught up with my mind. And I could say 100 % of the time, I truly forgive this person. And I could feel it like I mean it from the depths of my soul. ⁓ That's maybe one of the most important decisions I made throughout this whole journey, because it just kept me looking forward. I wasn't looking behind myself in the past, I'm looking forward because that's where I'm going. So I think forgiveness is one of those very few generalities in life that just
Chris Mader: Yeah, amazing. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: always applies because it's not about that person. It's about us and being able to move forward. So make that choice and you will be better for it.
Chris Mader: Yeah, everything you talk about is choices, Robert. mean, change is a choice. Your mindset's a choice for gives us everything's a choice, right? It's so it's fascinating to hear to listen to you. And so all right, so let's talk about your book a little bit. So paying it forward. So I started my business three years ago and meet a guy named Casey Jaycox and he does nothing but help me and I get to meet you. And I was telling I was writing a book and you're like, I got to write a book. And then I published a book and then I'm like.
Robert Paylor: Hmm? Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: Bro, we're gonna help you publish a book. We start talking about your book and you get your book out, which is, and by the way, less than 1 % of people that start a book finish it. So you are already, you're in the top 1 % in so many categories, my friend. ⁓ It's a true stat, yeah. So I wanna hear about the book. ⁓ you know, people are hearing your story. What are they gonna learn in the book? Like what is, what gets deeper in the book that people don't always get on social or cool podcasts? Like what are they gonna get on the
Robert Paylor: Yeah. Wow, that's amazing. Yeah, I spent four years five years on this book. I mean, it was a journey. So I dumped my entire heart and soul into this thing thinking, I broke my neck once I'm not going to do it again. This is the book. This is this is me taking at the time eight years of battling quadriplegia and putting it into that story and lessons that you can take into your life. I think so often when people read a book like this, they expect to just learn more about the author, learn more about me. I wanted there to be that component, but what I really wanted them to be surprised by was how they're learning more about themselves. So the way I structured this book is part memoir, part self-help. This story is guided along chronologically by my story, but each chapter is a tool that you can use to overcome. in overcoming what paralyzes you while that chapter is connected to the story. They both move across the story very seamlessly. So we think of like chapter one, I'm talking about the day of my injury going into every single detail of what happened and what was on my mind. That's what I'm talking about. Make a decision. How do you make that decision to keep moving forward and control your mindset, then building a foundation, then creating a vision. It's all 15 chapters, 15 tools.
Chris Mader: Got it. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: that I want to give someone, but starting with that question that I start my speeches out with, what paralyzes you? What's stopping you from being your best? Really taking some mental inventory there. So I want the story to inspire and I want people to be motivated by that, but it all comes back to these tools and how you need to use these to overcome that things that's paralyzing you. It's just been amazing because keynote speaking isn't very scalable. I'm not going to give
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: keynote speeches, just one-on-one to folks. It's more of an audience type thing, but this book is an ability for me to be able to share my story with anyone in the world and even greater depth than my speeches actually are. And I did an audio book as well, which I narrated myself and I think is always really fun to hear from the author from those. it's just, I've loved to see those stories of people being going through tough moments or trying to reach new heights.
Chris Mader: Sure. Absolutely.
Robert Paylor: and be able to play a role in that through this book. It's just been one of the most wonderful things I've ever done.
Chris Mader: Yeah, I do think and I agree it's it's an amazing book what you've done the work you're doing is incredible because as a coach I I do find that people get stuck in their own way and the what paralyzes you is I think everybody in this world has something that's holding them back from making that decision whether it's a relationship a job anything they're trying to pursue So what are some of the common things you get after you get to talk to people? Whether it's at the event itself
Robert Paylor: Thank you. Yeah. I'm sorry. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: or a month or two a year later, what's some of the most common cool pieces of feedback? Pump your tires a little bit. What are the cool things you hear and how you change somebody's life?
Robert Paylor: I think one of the biggest ways is perspective. You mentioned perspective as a very important theme earlier with the story that you shared of the Chinese farmer. I think perspective is the key to happiness. think it's maybe the single greatest mindset tool that we all have at our disposal. And I think that's maybe the single greatest piece of feedback that I receive on how someone's perspective is just completely changed for the rest of their life after reading this book. It is so often our perspectives are so warped. think social media has a really large role in this. We spend so much time looking up at the people who seemingly have more than us compared to what we're going through. And we think our life's pretty rough. I don't think we spend enough time looking at those people who would give literally anything in their life to be in our situation instead of their own. I look back at my own experiences and the challenges that I've overcome, but I try to spend way more time looking outside of myself. The saying is true. There's always someone out there going through a more difficult situation than you always every case. And this phrase that I've used to help me build a better perspective of my life that I recommend everybody use is compared to what? So I'll think I'm tired, but compared to what? There's a lot that I'm going through right now, but compared to what there's so much they can do and there's so much they do have. So
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I don't want us dismissing our challenges. Don't take it too far and just completely ignore your challenges. If we do that, the challenge will never go away. What that statement is meant to do is just put our challenges into perspective to help us realize that what we go through can be overcome. And there's so much that we can achieve. So there's that popular saying that comparison is the thief of joy. That can be true, but I think in those cases, you're just using it wrong.
Chris Mader: It's awesome. Yeah. Right.
Robert Paylor: That's when we're looking up, but spend more time looking outside of yourself for the people who would give a lot to be in your spot. And you won't start finding that these challenges that I was so worried about can totally be overcome. And I find you just find yourself realizing I was complaining way too much about my life. I need to spend that actual mental energy that I have focusing on what I do have and what I can do because we are just so lucky, but perspective is a really powerful tool.
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: And that's something I just try to hammer in with every conversation, every chapter of this book, drill that in to really build a strong perspective.
Chris Mader: Yeah, it's awesome. Amazing. So yeah, this reference to Casey. And so I find out a few months ago that you're about to be a dad. And I you know, you wrote the book and I'm like, I got to get Rob around the podcast. And I was literally thinking about you. And then I saw that you guys had a baby boy. And it's my understanding, if I get this right, Carson, your wife was pregnant on Good Friday. The due date came back Christmas Day. So you talk about faith, right? I you talk about stars aligning. It's incredible. But I had I had to
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Chris Mader: I told you, I think it was four days after your son was born, I called Casey, I mean Casey, the quarterback dad cast. There's a new dad. You gotta talk to my buddy, you have to talk to this guy. And I heard you obviously on his show and it was incredible. And I'm glad you met Casey, because Casey was good to me and it was a very small gift I can give him is introducing you to him because you were a new dad. So talk to us about fatherhood and Carson and your son. And I guess his name's Robert, but not Robert Jr. So let's talk about that a bit, your fatherhood.
Robert Paylor: Yeah. It's just been the most amazing thing that ever happened to me. first, my wife and I didn't know if it would even be possible. When you have a spinal cord injury, your odds of being able to have a biological child go way down. In my situation, I'm talking like 3 % or less for just a lifetime of trying. we were kind of thinking, boy, we need to be intentional about trying to have a child before we were planning on it.
Chris Mader: ⁓ wow, wow.
Robert Paylor: because this could be a real journey for us. so, you know, we kind of there's all these like these trackers and things that you can have nowadays. ⁓ lot of folks I didn't I didn't really know this just infertility is just it's a it can be a really big problem for a lot of people. And so we benefited from the advancement of technology that there's been in this space. And then we find the news we get the positive test on Good Friday, which is amazing. And then as you said,
Chris Mader: Yeah, yeah. Insane. So great.
Robert Paylor: due date of Christmas Day. I'm thinking total like, okay, that's a lot of coincidences for this to be a coincidence, you know, just, think just, just really showing like this, this child is such a gift from God in our lives as is what that showed me. So just filled with so much excitement and gratitude. ⁓ First child on both sides of our family, first grandbaby. So he is so spoiled. This little kid.
Chris Mader: So wild. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Awesome. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: And we didn't know what his gender was throughout the entire pregnancy. know, it was, was a game time. Yeah. We were so surprised. It was, mean, just absolutely elated and everything. And he carries the name Robert that I have, ⁓ which is really more of a tip of the cap to my grandfather. ⁓ My grandfather, amazing person, grew up in foster homes, went to the Marines, GI Bill to get an education, just completely changed the paler name and the family tree.
Chris Mader: So you're surprised? Yeah, I love that. for you. ⁓ that's amazing.
Robert Paylor: American dream type of story. you know, so our little guy here carries that forward. ⁓
Chris Mader: Very cool. I've met your wife. She's also a college athlete, if I'm not mistaken, correct. And so ⁓ who does he look like? Who does Robert look like? He'd look like you look like your wife. What does he look like? What are the baby photos?
Robert Paylor: Yeah, she is. Chris, he looks like exactly like me. He's like a twin. I give my wife a hard time. I'll be like, no, it's not all like me. You know, the little like black circle that you have in the middle of your eye, like they're the same color on you and the child. I give her a hard time. But no, like we just compare him to the baby photos and ⁓ they're very difficult to distinguish. It's been wonderful. Yeah.
Chris Mader: ⁓ my goodness, that's awesome. That's so great. That's incredible. ⁓ my God. That's awesome. That's so great, man. I'm so happy for you guys. mean, like I said, I got to meet you and your wife a couple of years ago and just incredible people and ⁓ your love affair, the love story is incredible and it continues to flourish. I'm so happy for your success in business. Your book's incredible. ⁓ I listened to it by the way. I didn't read, I listened to it. I did hear your voice and it was cool. ⁓ And the keynote that I experienced, mean, man, I've been around the block. I've listened to...
Robert Paylor: Thank you. Yeah.
Chris Mader: know, Simon Sinek, and I've seen some really powerful speakers in person and I didn't expect, I didn't expect what happened that day. I didn't know I was gonna meet you, I didn't know your story, and it did change my perspective. I mean, that's the word, you know, the bad days you have, I'm like, wow, this guy has gone through all of this and look how positive he is and look what he's doing for people and everybody in the room was impacted. I'm like, he has to, and that's why I said, you have to write a book, you have to bring this message to the world and I know you're.
Robert Paylor: Move. Please. Yeah.
Chris Mader: I know you're doing it successfully and have had some incredible keynotes and things. where can people find you? mean, listen, gang, if I haven't said enough, bringing Robert in will give teams perspective, will help the leaders improve their mindset. Anybody on the team just on what is possible, right? Not what is impossible, what is possible. So just explain where people can find you on social media. If they wanna find you, where can they find you?
Robert Paylor: Totally. So for speaking stuff website, robertpaylor.com and that's a pretty comprehensive place of just where to find all the different links, ⁓ social media everywhere, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, LinkedIn, X. Just look up Robert Paylor. I kind of have a monopoly on the name. There's not too many of us out there. ⁓ I try to be really generous with just posting regularly education on spinal cord injuries, motivating messages. And every day as I'm working out, I do a quick video of me in that workout. So I believe if I'm not mistaken today is 3,273 days since my injury. I keep that day counter there to just be like 3,200 plus days later. I'm not quitting and you don't have to either. So I want to give that boost to people's mental diets right there on social media. And I like what I also really try to do is just reply to everything.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: So whenever anybody sends me a message and needs some encouragement or has a question to try and answer all that. And then the book, course, Paralyzed Powerful is ⁓ everywhere books are sold.
Chris Mader: Well, spoiler alert folks, you I know Robert, you know, he needs a wheelchair most days, but he is, he can get up and he's moving around and you have a level of mental and physical strength. My friend that I is, is, is unmatched. It's, it's incredibly inspirational. I'm glad you're in my life. I'm glad we met. say that. Yeah. Anything we met, anything we didn't talk about today, Robert, that you, ⁓ you wish we, any other topics we want to talk about, we didn't talk about before I let you go.
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Likewise, Chris. Boy, mean, maybe a closing message or just some thoughts on success and what does success look like. This is maybe the topic I've thought about the most. And I think it just kind of like ties a ribbon around my story and I think everybody's story and just overcoming challenges in our lives. You know, when I first got hurt, my goal on day one was to be wheelchair independent.
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: to be walking with a walker crutches, a cane or nothing at all. didn't care. I just wanted to stand up from my wheelchair again, one day and then never sit back down in it again. And I've had amazing rehab progress. I can walk 500 yards. I've had basically a full return in my upper body. I mean, here I am. I'm talking like an Italian moving my hands everywhere in this conversation. It's amazing. None of it was supposed to happen. One step would have been a miracle. 500 yards is out of this world, but
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I haven't achieved that goal that I set on day one. And the statistics say I will never achieve that goal. The stats say I will fight to get out of my wheelchair for the rest of my life and it just won't happen. And I got to think if that's the case, does that mean that I've failed? Does that mean that I am a failure? I think the answer is absolutely not. And it's not just because of those physical outcomes. I think it's the internals. I have joy, meaning and gratitude in my life. I wake up every single day and I'm excited to take on this day. And this challenge didn't beat me, not because I've had physical progress, but because I love my life. And I have a wife who I love and a son who I'd give anything for and this mission to inspire people and help them through their challenges in a way that I never would have had if I didn't break my neck. So when I think it comes to that true success, things will be difficult in life. And things might not turn out the way that you initially planned on those goals that you set on day one, but don't let that ever stop you from having that joy, meaning and gratitude in your life. Push for that and all those pieces are going to fall together. So those are kind of some final thoughts. And just like as you go out in your lives to take that with you and know like where your success really lies.
Chris Mader: Thank you for that. January, 2024 is the day I won't forget and April of 2026. I will not forget this conversation, Robert. can't thank you enough generosity for your time, for the message you bring. And again, any of my listeners get the book for sure. And if you have a team, no better keynote speaker than Robert Payless. So Robert, thank you for being here today. You're a good man. And I can't wait till I get to talk to you again and see you again soon.
Robert Paylor: Made my day, Chris. Thank you so much.
Chris Mader: You're awesome. Thanks, Robert.
Robert Paylor: I'm so thrilled for it, Chris. Thank you for having me.
Chris Mader: Yeah, absolutely. yeah, we were introduced to a mutual friend, John Stewart, who is the CEO of Zeek Tech, an IT staffing company out there in Northern California. And, ⁓ you know, John, if anybody knows John, there's a podcast episode with John, he was a previous guest on show. John is an interesting character. Tell me just how you got to meet John and how John kidnapped you that day to have you come in and speak to his team.
Robert Paylor: Absolutely. So I got I got introduced to John through another John who works for Zeek Tech, and just such a great group of guys. And this this john Bianchi is his name, my my john who introduced me to john Stewart, ⁓ hunting buddy, best friend and everything. And just really like Italian American personalities always bubble and everyone loves him. And ⁓ then just somehow through the grapevine of this connection, get connected over to Zeek Tech and John Stewart, which has been another wonderful relationship watching the Superbowl together and going out to get lunch and just have great conversations. It's been, it was so much fun to go share that experience together at that event a couple of years ago, but then just continue to relation relationships. Been a lot of fun. Yeah.
Chris Mader: Yeah, that's awesome. And it was funny because you were introduced as ⁓ a college rugby player and I think it was playing the national championship. And I'm hearing this introduction and I'm like, wow, I'm really excited to talk to another college athlete, hear their story of resilience. And I'm like, this is exciting, but I wanna take back for the people that have yet to meet you or hear your story. Just take me back all the way back to freshman year, like how you heard about the rugby program at UC Berkeley. ⁓
Robert Paylor: questions.
Chris Mader: and just kind of take me from there up until the national championship game.
Robert Paylor: Yeah, really interesting journey because rugby is not a very popular sport in America. It exists in some pockets. Like I'm from the Sacramento Valley. It's actually quite popular over here in Sacramento and the Bay area as well over in San Francisco. lot going on there too. Some in Southern California. And then you see it in like these little pockets of Indiana thinking what the heck? Why are you guys playing rugby out here? And then a little bit in New England. But other than that, it's pretty just much blank. You don't see a lot of these pockets.
Chris Mader: Yeah, it's nichey. Yeah, it's a niche. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: Yeah, it's very niche. ⁓ So I show up to Jesuit High School in Sacramento, and they have the most successful rugby program in the high school level in America. I think it's 11 national championships that they're at. It's amazing. And the culture is rooted into the school. So you're walking around, and people are throwing a rugby ball around at practice and they've got their short shorts.
Chris Mader: So explain that a little further. Talk to me about the rugby. I've had the opportunity to travel the world a little bit, Ireland, Asia Pacific, and I've watched rugby. Just talk about the culture of rugby, like what it's like to be a player in that, just in that sphere. Talk to us about
Robert Paylor: the best, the best sports culture that there is. ⁓ number one, it's amazing how global it is, you know, here into the States, if Detroit's playing Tampa Bay, we call it the world championship over there. have a genuine world championship and, it's, really fun how you have these rivalries and in, rugby, it's unique that on the field, I mean, they'll be tearing each other apart for 90 minutes, but
Chris Mader: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: Afterwards, they all meet up at a pub or a bar wherever they are. And, ⁓ you know, they'll be having some drinks together and sharing stories. the sport really brought them together where I feel like in kind of that American football culture with our contact sports, you're just kind of mortal enemies. And if a Raiders fan sees a 49ers fan, they just know that they're not going to mix and rugby, you know, during the match, you'll have your exchanges and you'll have some fun with it. But afterwards.
Chris Mader: Yes. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: It really brings you all together. think that's what's such a cool part about this sport. It really brings you together.
Chris Mader: Yeah, yeah, I appreciate explaining that for people that aren't as familiar with it, because I got a taste of it because I did travel internationally and met some feats from, you know, New Zealand, Australia, and they, you know, you go to a sports bar, you're watching rugby. And so I was watching like the All Blacks. I'm like, ⁓ this is a cool sport, you know, and I do think that I used to think that hockey had a pretty similar culture. think rugby is even I think you're even tougher in rugby. I think there's a camaraderie. It's even stronger. I mean, I think hockey is amazing, but
Robert Paylor: Yeah.
Chris Mader: I do agree for the people I've met from rugby, including yourself, it's a really cool group of people you get to associate with. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: It is amazing. And like with how tough a sport it is. mean, I'm talking full contact, no pads, 90 minutes, just to halftime in between for 10, 15 minutes there to kind of cool off. You're really going at each other. But then after that, to be able to just hang out and, you know, and like have a great time is such something is really unique. You don't see it.
Chris Mader: Yeah. All right. Yeah, no, you don't. All right, so I cut you off. you're in high school, you're in this amazing program, you're about colleges, so yeah, sorry, continue.
Robert Paylor: Totally. So the sport culture here at Jesuit is so focused on rugby. I'm playing football, basketball, baseball, growing up, going to Jesuit high school, do football, which was my thing. I really thought I was going to shoot for this lane to go play for a D1 school here in the States and, uh, you know, kind of see what happens from there from a football perspective. play basketball and I'm just a measly six foot five. I'm a little guy compared to these basketball standards. We had guys on the class above us. One was 6'10", another guy was 6'8", and they weren't just bodies. These guys could ball. They both went on to go play for D1 schools. And I'm thinking, even if I make this team another year, like, I might just ride the pine. And I don't want to be like a prima donna, but I didn't want to ride the pine. I wasn't willing to put in that much effort for not a really strong chance of being a starter. And then that's when my friends are like, try out rugby. You're great in contact. got a real knack for it. And this is a serious program we have here. We're bringing in some serious hardware, but we're also sending people to serious schools like UC Berkeley being the most natural pipeline from Judgert High School over there for rugby. So I was like, you know what? I'm going to do it. I'm going to take this leap of faith. One of the best decisions I ever made. I just fall in love with this game. And I'm good at it. get MVP my first year playing. We won a national championship that year on our varsity team. My junior and my senior years then were runner up for best in the nation. I'm team captain. We're doing having some real success. And eventually my shoulder gets tapped to go play for UC Berkeley, the most successful rugby program in collegiate rugby history here in the States. Now the program has been playing since 1882, I believe. It is the oldest varsity sport over at Cal and it used to be like the big games of Cal versus Stanford were rugby game and you'd have tens of thousands of people cheering us on. So you want to talk about rugby being rooted into the sports culture. is no bigger than at Cal, a true bonafide division one athletic experience, but it's quite difficult. We've had 34 national championships in about 45 years.
Chris Mader: Right. Very cool. It's insane.
Robert Paylor: I think the only team that has more hardware than Cal rugby is the Harlem Globetrotters. And for who don't know their kids are rigged. we're doing pretty good. Yeah, exactly. So I show up freshman year. I'm kind of putting in work, doing my time. Everybody on this team was an all-American. They're the captain of their teams in high school. You got to earn your keep. But by my sophomore year, there was a person in my position who had graduated.
Chris Mader: Yeah, yeah, I know. I was gonna say it's better in the Yankees. mean, 27, 28, it's crazy. Yeah, that's crazy.
Robert Paylor: I play lock, there's two locks on the field and one of these spots was open and I decided I'm going to give it everything I've got. And I got it. I put in a lot of work over the summer in the weight room and throughout that fall season. But once it came time to play, I was just a sure starter for this team. Number one in the nation. And then eventually we get ready to compete for a national championship.
Chris Mader: Yeah, and I wanna talk about that. and I saw, know, in your talk when I was in California, I saw the photos. I mean, you're just a big, big dude, you know, and big, strong and lean. So yeah, I mean, let's, you know, I wanna talk about, you know, May, was it May 6th, 2017. So it's Collegiate Rugby National Championship. And you are literally like living your dream, right? You're a national champion in high school, captain, UC Berkeley. You're in the, here you are again.
Robert Paylor: Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: And you're obviously just, I know that feeling as a college athlete, you're fired up, right? And you're just ready to go. But then something happened. And so if we put people that don't know the story, just take us through the incident.
Robert Paylor: Yeah, so we're playing Arkansas State. We're feeling very confident going into this game and what would become our 32nd international championship in the program's history. I'm thinking this is going to be the best day of my life. I mean, these are the moments that you dream of as an athlete to be on national television competing for the most important game of the year. And I'm thinking this is going to be the day that my legacy is made because when you win a national championship, you're not just the national champion for the day. You are regarded as a national champion for the rest of your life. I wanted this. And we felt very good about getting this win because Arkansas State has never won a national championship before. And we're going for number 32. So ⁓ it was very early on in this game that I'm competing in what's called a mall, which is when the bigger guys we group up in one unit and then we push to advance the ball and the defense's job has come straight in. try to stop us from moving forward. It's a boiler room. It's where the big guys thrive and I was a big guy. Six five, 245 pounds. I'm on this field to move people. Just moving people that don't want to move and we're just five meters out from scoring. I'm practically drooling here on this field thing and let's go Rob drive this thing in. But then as I do that, these opposing players start making these illegal moves and the referee's not calling anything. So first three players coming from the side of the mall, which are all in fractions. You can't do that, but the ref's not calling it. And then their number eight binds me to headlock. So he's got my chin pinned down to my chest. Now, normally in rugby, that is an automatic yellow or red card. If you do that, you're gone from the game. There's no questions asked, but the ref's not calling it. And as he's got my head pinned down like that, another player chops me down by my legs. So I start falling down. And he continues to torque me down by my neck. I can't get my head up. I remember I just closed my eyes. I grip my teeth. What happens is my body's going down and forward. So my head makes impact with the ground. And as my body goes forward, my face rolls against my chest, literally nose into my sternum. I feel this god awful snap in my neck and then just poof. Can't move anything. Can't feel anything. Totally.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: clear and conscious, just as conscious as aware as I am right now, but completely numb and motionless from my collarbone down and my thoughts are running wild. I knew immediately what happened. I knew that I broke my neck. I knew that it was a spinal cord injury and that these injuries are catastrophic and they're chronic and 99 times out of a hundred, they don't get any better.
Chris Mader: Yeah. All right. Yep. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I mean, it was a nightmare. And I just couldn't wake up. I remember just kind of thinking like, okay, the rest of my life, I'm pretty much going to be in a chair, power chair that I can't even move myself. Maybe I'll get pointed to watch some TV. I'll get pointed to, you know, go look outside sit on the patio and the weather is nice. My mom will spoon feed me help me shower help me do everything. One day she's gonna die. And then I will just be sitting here alone without meaning and horribly depressed. just, didn't see a lot of ways around that. And eventually my fears aren't really calmed down. They're only heightened. I get structured off the field. We go over to the hospital. We take a series of medical imaging. My doctor comes back and he's got a bad look on his face. He said, Robert, what happened to you is bad. really bad. And the reality is you'll never walk again. You'll never move your hands. And we're going to do our best so that one day you can do something like pick up a piece of pizza and bring it to your face. And if you can do that, you made it you beat all the odds. And then he says that he recommends a spinal fusion surgery to me. So he explains that the disk in between my C five and C six vertebrae ruptured into my spinal cord. I also had fracturing at the C5 and C6 vertebrae. So that damage that was done to my spine might only continue to increase unless we perform an emergency spinal fusion surgery. He says my best chance at recovery, but it's potentially life threatening surgery. I might not wake up and I have one hour to make a decision. So my faith is very important to me. And as I'm trying to get my affairs together, I'm thinking I need to bring a priest into the room. to give me the sacrament of anointing the sick. I'm Catholic and it's kind of like, it's your last rites really. I'm trying to get, ⁓ what I'm doing is thinking if I die, I want to be cleansed for heaven. But if I live, I want to really intentionally invite God into this journey. So I call my spiritual director to get a priest into the room. Cause he wasn't in the area, but he gave me this piece of advice that just changed everything for me. And it gave me so much power and what should have been a powerless situation. And he said, Robert, throughout this journey, there's going to be so much that you can't control. But the one thing you'll always have control over is your mindset. So your positivity, your ambition, your willingness to take this challenge on and fight it every day is up to you. This injury can't take that away from you. So I got to think in that moment, I didn't have a lot. I didn't have the odds on my side. I didn't have a doctor saying that everything was going to be okay. And I didn't have signs of life in my body.
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: But I had this ability to make a decision. And we all have this ability to make a decision to keep moving forward, regardless of what our circumstances. So just by realizing I have this little thing that I can focus on, I can start pushing out that fear, pushing out that anxiety for a little bit. So I could clear that fog and have some mental clarity. I need to go into the surgery. I need to give myself the best odds at this recovery. My brother held a phone in front of me so I could FaceTime my best friends, let them know I love them. I don't know if I'm going to wake up, but I love them. And he sent a group text to my rugby teammates and to a religious retreat group I did in high school. A priest comes in, received the sacrament, say my prayers with my family. I get rolled into the operating room. They put that gas mask over my face. They say, count down from a hundred. I think I made it to 97. And then it was lights out. And that concluded that day for me.
Chris Mader: And you are 18 years old? You're 27 years old. Yeah, mean, yeah. And so, I mean, we're talking about mindset. And I don't know if there's another human being I've met that has a greater mindset than you. And I really mean that. And I've met a lot of really successful people in life because you come out of surgery and then you're in the hospital for a year. And so we talk about that moment of darkness, of sitting in the hospital, last rites.
Robert Paylor: 20, young, young.
Chris Mader: you get that kernel of, hope, right? Like maybe I can overcome this. But then 365 days of being in the hospital, how do you, you how does one, you talk about mental toughness, like this is a side of mental toughness, nobody talks about everybody has a bad day, right? mean, this day is the darkest day you could have had, but, or one can experience, but like, then you have to grind for a year and now five years and 10 years, like.
Robert Paylor: Thank This is...
Chris Mader: How do you continue to keep that mindset given the challenges that you still experience each day?
Robert Paylor: Yeah, so much of it is just like taking that step just like deciding you're going to win today. And ⁓ you talk about mental toughness. Cal rugby has a glossary of terms for words like mental toughness. So we have a shared definition. I think theirs is beautiful. And they describe mental toughness as the ability to focus on the next most important thing. I think it's a great definition. think it really helps us to win the day and then sustain that long-term momentum because we're just focusing on what's the next most important thing when you can live that way. It's amazing what you can achieve in a rugby context. What that meant is let's say someone passes the ball to me. I drop it forward, knock on to the other team. It's a turnover. The mentally weak thing to do would just be wrapped up in that failure that you just had. You know, you're punching your fist in the dirt. You're all angry. But then the guy's got the ball in front of you and you're not reacting because you're so focused on what happened in the past. The mentally tough thing to do focusing on the next post important thing would be like, okay, mistake happened. I'm pushing that out immediately. What do I need to focus on right now? Other team has the ball. We need to stop them. Now when you think of where I was in this hospital, I could focus on, my gosh, I lost so much. There's so much that I can't do. And trust me, those, those temptations and all that negativity was constantly swirling around me. There are many times when it did work its way into my mindset, but when I had a job to do very clearly, I could say control your mindset, Robert, make that decision to keep moving forward. What's the next most important thing I need to start getting this tube up my nose into my stomach so I can start eating something because I haven't eaten anything for the last three days. I it's 3 a.m. and my respiratory therapist is coming in to help me pump down on my lungs so I can.
Chris Mader: Yep.
Robert Paylor: beat this pneumonia, which I got, I got double pneumonia and I couldn't even cough. So I almost died, but I'm thinking like control your mindset. What's the next most important thing? This treatment. If I don't do it, I'm going to die. So I just kept pushing through there, but I think what that allows you to do is start building some momentum. You start getting these wins. And I think long-term success is not about motivation because motivation is fleeting. It's good for that first step, but doesn't really sustain you very long-term. It's momentum.
Chris Mader: on.
Robert Paylor: that you're really looking for. And as you start building that momentum, the ball keeps rolling. It can slow down if you don't keep it going, but it's a lot easier to take that 50th step than it is to take that first step. And I think it's that first realization of I'm going to be mentally tough here. I'm going to focus on the next most important thing is you start getting those wins. You start getting some pride. You start getting some momentum and it gets a lot easier as time goes on to keep that going.
Chris Mader: Yeah. So, you know, athlete to athlete, it's, all, we all, we, when we chase rugby or baseball or any sport, we all realize there's going to be a day we stop playing, right? We play as long as we can, cause we love it. And some people can play through high school or college and there's a professional opportunity or whatever that is. And, you know, for athletes, the day comes where either you decide or it's decided for you, right? And so for you is decided for you, ⁓ in one plan, it's, just incredibly unfortunate, but Are you familiar with the, I didn't ask you this before, the story of the Chinese farmer? Are you familiar with that story? Oh, Robert, you have to, this is something, this is a good takeaway for our listeners. It's about perspective. And the thing when I, like as an example, like when I met you, you can go one of two ways with the perspective of the incident. And the story of the Chinese farmer is basically this. Long story short is this. Chinese farmer loses his rice field.
Robert Paylor: I'm not. Yeah.
Chris Mader: And somebody in the village comes by and says, you know, that's terrible. You lost your rice field. He goes, maybe. And then his son goes out and gets a bunch of Mustangs, wild Mustangs. And they come back to replow the field and they go, ⁓ my God, your son found like 12 horses to plow the field. That's incredible. And he goes, maybe. And the next day, the son's trying to train the horse. He falls off the horse, breaks his leg. Somebody goes, ⁓ my God, it's terrible. They broke his leg. And the father goes, maybe. And then the Chinese army comes by because they're at war to take the son to war. And they can't take him because he has a broken leg. And the people in the village goes, that's incredible. Like, your son didn't even have to go to war. And he goes, maybe. And so like the story is, I heard it from Tom Brady once, right? Who was, you know, Super Bowl quarterback, Northern California guy, right? From the New England Patriots. I heard him tell the story once. It's the story that the bad things that happen in life aren't always bad. And the good things that happen in life aren't always good. And it's a perspective we have. And I mean, there's no, there's no.
Robert Paylor: Yeah. Mm. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: story Robert in life when I met you in California a couple years ago, we have this identity about being an athlete. I know you have, you still have it. You had it, you still have, know you have it, because I've heard you talk. But ⁓ I want you to talk to the audience and all the athletes out there, because a lot of the people listening to the show are former athletes. How you continue to, when you go, because we'll talk about your book and you do keynote speaking, and it's very powerful when you talk. You've built your keynote around this question, what paralyzes you?
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: So I want you to talk to the audience about that because in that moment, right, you lost your ability to play the sport, which was incredibly meaningful to you. And then you had to redefine yourself. So talk to the audience just about, know, when you do have the opportunity to talk to people, what paralyzes you and what that means to you and what it means to the people you talk to.
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that what paralyzes your question is so unique. Because when you look at me, nobody can see my full body right now, but I'm in a wheelchair. And I've spent almost nine years in this wheelchair. When you look at me, it's very clear that I am paralyzed in this physical sense. But I think all of us are paralyzed by something you just can't see it. It's mental. It's emotional. Think anxiety. Think grief. Think indecision or change, think fear of failure, fear of the unknown. I think all of these things are just as crippling and just as paralyzing as any kind of physical paralysis. So what I want to get people to start thinking of what is that thing that's paralyzing me? What's it that's holding me back? And in doing that, I've now made it my life's purpose in sharing these tools. that have helped me through my journey of paralysis that can help all of us overcome those things that are paralyzing us mentally or emotionally. Now, when it comes to, you know, that athlete, that person who's trying to think like, how do I keep moving forward? Because when you're an athlete, I think things are pretty clear and defined. You know, you have a coach, you're in this program, lot, there's a lot of direction there. ⁓ you know, need to hit the weight room more. You're lacking a little bit here. You need to work on that strength. Maybe we can use this strength you already have in this unique way to be able to give you an athletic advantage. And you see, you know, okay, here I am playing you sports. And then I want to go to this high school and go to this college and then play professionally in this league. Like things are pretty defined, but after that you start losing that mental clarity. And with losing that mental clarity and that, that mission that you were on, lose your purpose. And when you lose your purpose, things just feel.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: completely directionless. that was maybe my biggest hurdle throughout all of this was finding a new purpose. My purpose was being the best athlete I can possibly be. I'm a very optimistic guy, but I knew that I was never going to play rugby again. I needed to find something new. And it came to me uniquely through this injury, which I thought had taken everything away from me. Over time, I started to find that it gave me so much more than it took away.
Chris Mader: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: What happened was a few days after my injury, my best friend's mom started up a GoFundMe campaign to help pay for my rehab expenses. As I'm sure you can imagine, breaking your neck is not a good financial decision. It's very expensive. We needed help. So as this GoFundMe campaign was started, we got this incredible drove of support ⁓ with financial contributions. It changed my life. I would not be where I am today if it weren't for the financial support that we received. But what helped me equally was this emotional, this mental support that I was receiving through these messages of encouragement, people confiding in me some incredibly difficult things that they were going through. For example, some people are saying, Robert, I'm battling stage four cancer. I'm measuring my time in weeks, months, but I look at you take on this journey with such faith and such perseverance. You're giving me hope. Thank you. Where people are like, Robert, I just lost a son or a daughter. I'm going through the most difficult thing I've ever gone through right now. But through witnessing you take on your challenge every day, you're helping me take on mine. Thank you. And I'm starting to see how this injury really gave me something. It gave me an ability to help people in a way that I never would have had if I didn't break my neck. And as I further go down this lane of sharing updates of my progress, getting more active on social media. And then starting to speak and write this book, the messages keep coming in and I've found my purpose. And I remember I gave my first speech is what it really locked in for me. I was over at UC Berkeley. I'd come back after a year of being in the hospital and I was speaking to a sports management class over there at Cal. First talk, you know, it's about 20 minutes long. ⁓ I have the notes like right in front of me on my lap doing my thing and, ⁓ I loved it.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. ⁓
Robert Paylor: I was laughing, crying, standing ovation, people coming up to me afterwards, everyone shaking my hand telling me how much it helped them. I go back to my dorm room and I'm like, this is it. This is my purpose. This is what I'm here to do. And it's so much more meaningful to me than anything I've ever done. mean, honestly, Chris, if I could go back, you know, and change what happened to me, I wouldn't. And I just couldn't because I have an impact now.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: that I just never would have had if this injury didn't happen to me. So you got to find that purpose. And I think it needs to be a selfless purpose too. If you're just serving yourself, you're not going to want to get up every day. It's just like your teammates, when you're pushing for your teammates, you're pushing so much harder than if you're just doing it for yourself. Find that selfless purpose in your life and whatever you were doing in the past and athletics or whatever journey you were going on, you won't even want back because you'll be so enraptured and just excited about what you're doing now.
Chris Mader: No, your level of humility is incredible. And it's no wonder you're a captain of the sports teams you play, a captain of your household now too, with Carson and your baby. We'll talk about that in a second. But the last thing I want to talk about, I mean, you publicly forgave the player in this incident. you talked about, again, athletes sometimes you try to get an edge and things like that, but it was clear that they were, some of the players were putting illegal moves on, cetera, but you've publicly forgiven that person. And so,
Robert Paylor: That's right. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: Why does that matter to you?
Robert Paylor: ⁓ it's a decision that was really made for me. And I think that's something we often confuse about forgiveness is that it's not just about removing guilt from the person who did wrong. It's about removing those negative attachments from the person who was wronged. And I needed that. This was maybe the most difficult mental hurdle that I had to overcome throughout my entire recovery process, because at first I didn't really know exactly what had happened. The game footage taken from NBC was from the press box. was just this weird angle where we couldn't see exactly what had happened. And in these malls, there's so many contact points. It's all very fast. It's hard to know just exactly what happened. But here I am laying in this hospital. And in the days following the match, there was this evidence that started to produce itself from different angles that I was clearly bound into a headlock and driven to the ground. by my neck completely Illegal and really the sole cause for my injury if you took that headlock away I would have been fine, but if you kept it it didn't matter what else was going on. I'm gonna break my neck every single time So I'm sitting here in this hospital. I can't eat anything. I can't breathe. I have double pneumonia. I can't cough
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I'm losing two pounds a day. lost 60 pounds in one month and my doctors are telling me almost every day that I might not survive. And I'm not going through this because I did something stupid. No, I was looking to achieve greatness in my life. And it wasn't just like a total fluke accident that caused this either. No, someone broke the laws of our game. And because of it, I'm laying here in this hospital bed. I might never even get out of it. So I say this not to take pot shots at this guy. But just to explain the rage that I was really feeling, I mean, it was something incredibly difficult to shake. ⁓ It came down, I think, initially to a question of morals for me. Like I said, my faith is very important. And I was taught that you forgive everyone in every instance, no matter how hard it is. And I think, you know what, I know that's the answer. I don't want it to be the answer. But I know it's what it is. I can't change what's in my heart, but
Chris Mader: Yeah, it's powerful. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I can choose what I say. And I would decided, I'm going to say that I forgive this person, whether I feel it internally or not. So people would ask me, Robert, what do you think about this guy? What's your take? And I would say, I forgive him. And I wish him well, even though deep within me, there's still a lot of negativity and hatred. I chose to say those words. And I think what was so wonderful about that and why I recommend everyone do do this is
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I think we just think our feelings have to dictate our actions and what we say all the time, but we have that ability to control our mindset, right? To focus on the next most important thing and be mentally tough. We can do that. And as, as I wasn't giving more words of negativity to this, I let time run its course to where that hatred could slowly burn out that animosity. I wasn't putting more fuel on that fire. I was just letting it slowly burn out. So over the course.
Chris Mader: Right.
Robert Paylor: of I'd say maybe two to three years, eventually my heart started to caught up with my mind. And I could say 100 % of the time, I truly forgive this person. And I could feel it like I mean it from the depths of my soul. ⁓ That's maybe one of the most important decisions I made throughout this whole journey, because it just kept me looking forward. I wasn't looking behind myself in the past, I'm looking forward because that's where I'm going. So I think forgiveness is one of those very few generalities in life that just
Chris Mader: Yeah, amazing. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: always applies because it's not about that person. It's about us and being able to move forward. So make that choice and you will be better for it.
Chris Mader: Yeah, everything you talk about is choices, Robert. mean, change is a choice. Your mindset's a choice for gives us everything's a choice, right? It's so it's fascinating to hear to listen to you. And so all right, so let's talk about your book a little bit. So paying it forward. So I started my business three years ago and meet a guy named Casey Jaycox and he does nothing but help me and I get to meet you. And I was telling I was writing a book and you're like, I got to write a book. And then I published a book and then I'm like.
Robert Paylor: Hmm? Yeah. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: Bro, we're gonna help you publish a book. We start talking about your book and you get your book out, which is, and by the way, less than 1 % of people that start a book finish it. So you are already, you're in the top 1 % in so many categories, my friend. ⁓ It's a true stat, yeah. So I wanna hear about the book. ⁓ you know, people are hearing your story. What are they gonna learn in the book? Like what is, what gets deeper in the book that people don't always get on social or cool podcasts? Like what are they gonna get on the
Robert Paylor: Yeah. Wow, that's amazing. Yeah, I spent four years five years on this book. I mean, it was a journey. So I dumped my entire heart and soul into this thing thinking, I broke my neck once I'm not going to do it again. This is the book. This is this is me taking at the time eight years of battling quadriplegia and putting it into that story and lessons that you can take into your life. I think so often when people read a book like this, they expect to just learn more about the author, learn more about me. I wanted there to be that component, but what I really wanted them to be surprised by was how they're learning more about themselves. So the way I structured this book is part memoir, part self-help. This story is guided along chronologically by my story, but each chapter is a tool that you can use to overcome. in overcoming what paralyzes you while that chapter is connected to the story. They both move across the story very seamlessly. So we think of like chapter one, I'm talking about the day of my injury going into every single detail of what happened and what was on my mind. That's what I'm talking about. Make a decision. How do you make that decision to keep moving forward and control your mindset, then building a foundation, then creating a vision. It's all 15 chapters, 15 tools.
Chris Mader: Got it. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: that I want to give someone, but starting with that question that I start my speeches out with, what paralyzes you? What's stopping you from being your best? Really taking some mental inventory there. So I want the story to inspire and I want people to be motivated by that, but it all comes back to these tools and how you need to use these to overcome that things that's paralyzing you. It's just been amazing because keynote speaking isn't very scalable. I'm not going to give
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: keynote speeches, just one-on-one to folks. It's more of an audience type thing, but this book is an ability for me to be able to share my story with anyone in the world and even greater depth than my speeches actually are. And I did an audio book as well, which I narrated myself and I think is always really fun to hear from the author from those. it's just, I've loved to see those stories of people being going through tough moments or trying to reach new heights.
Chris Mader: Sure. Absolutely.
Robert Paylor: and be able to play a role in that through this book. It's just been one of the most wonderful things I've ever done.
Chris Mader: Yeah, I do think and I agree it's it's an amazing book what you've done the work you're doing is incredible because as a coach I I do find that people get stuck in their own way and the what paralyzes you is I think everybody in this world has something that's holding them back from making that decision whether it's a relationship a job anything they're trying to pursue So what are some of the common things you get after you get to talk to people? Whether it's at the event itself
Robert Paylor: Thank you. Yeah. I'm sorry. Mm-hmm.
Chris Mader: or a month or two a year later, what's some of the most common cool pieces of feedback? Pump your tires a little bit. What are the cool things you hear and how you change somebody's life?
Robert Paylor: I think one of the biggest ways is perspective. You mentioned perspective as a very important theme earlier with the story that you shared of the Chinese farmer. I think perspective is the key to happiness. think it's maybe the single greatest mindset tool that we all have at our disposal. And I think that's maybe the single greatest piece of feedback that I receive on how someone's perspective is just completely changed for the rest of their life after reading this book. It is so often our perspectives are so warped. think social media has a really large role in this. We spend so much time looking up at the people who seemingly have more than us compared to what we're going through. And we think our life's pretty rough. I don't think we spend enough time looking at those people who would give literally anything in their life to be in our situation instead of their own. I look back at my own experiences and the challenges that I've overcome, but I try to spend way more time looking outside of myself. The saying is true. There's always someone out there going through a more difficult situation than you always every case. And this phrase that I've used to help me build a better perspective of my life that I recommend everybody use is compared to what? So I'll think I'm tired, but compared to what? There's a lot that I'm going through right now, but compared to what there's so much they can do and there's so much they do have. So
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I don't want us dismissing our challenges. Don't take it too far and just completely ignore your challenges. If we do that, the challenge will never go away. What that statement is meant to do is just put our challenges into perspective to help us realize that what we go through can be overcome. And there's so much that we can achieve. So there's that popular saying that comparison is the thief of joy. That can be true, but I think in those cases, you're just using it wrong.
Chris Mader: It's awesome. Yeah. Right.
Robert Paylor: That's when we're looking up, but spend more time looking outside of yourself for the people who would give a lot to be in your spot. And you won't start finding that these challenges that I was so worried about can totally be overcome. And I find you just find yourself realizing I was complaining way too much about my life. I need to spend that actual mental energy that I have focusing on what I do have and what I can do because we are just so lucky, but perspective is a really powerful tool.
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: And that's something I just try to hammer in with every conversation, every chapter of this book, drill that in to really build a strong perspective.
Chris Mader: Yeah, it's awesome. Amazing. So yeah, this reference to Casey. And so I find out a few months ago that you're about to be a dad. And I you know, you wrote the book and I'm like, I got to get Rob around the podcast. And I was literally thinking about you. And then I saw that you guys had a baby boy. And it's my understanding, if I get this right, Carson, your wife was pregnant on Good Friday. The due date came back Christmas Day. So you talk about faith, right? I you talk about stars aligning. It's incredible. But I had I had to
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yes. Yeah.
Chris Mader: I told you, I think it was four days after your son was born, I called Casey, I mean Casey, the quarterback dad cast. There's a new dad. You gotta talk to my buddy, you have to talk to this guy. And I heard you obviously on his show and it was incredible. And I'm glad you met Casey, because Casey was good to me and it was a very small gift I can give him is introducing you to him because you were a new dad. So talk to us about fatherhood and Carson and your son. And I guess his name's Robert, but not Robert Jr. So let's talk about that a bit, your fatherhood.
Robert Paylor: Yeah. It's just been the most amazing thing that ever happened to me. first, my wife and I didn't know if it would even be possible. When you have a spinal cord injury, your odds of being able to have a biological child go way down. In my situation, I'm talking like 3 % or less for just a lifetime of trying. we were kind of thinking, boy, we need to be intentional about trying to have a child before we were planning on it.
Chris Mader: ⁓ wow, wow.
Robert Paylor: because this could be a real journey for us. so, you know, we kind of there's all these like these trackers and things that you can have nowadays. ⁓ lot of folks I didn't I didn't really know this just infertility is just it's a it can be a really big problem for a lot of people. And so we benefited from the advancement of technology that there's been in this space. And then we find the news we get the positive test on Good Friday, which is amazing. And then as you said,
Chris Mader: Yeah, yeah. Insane. So great.
Robert Paylor: due date of Christmas Day. I'm thinking total like, okay, that's a lot of coincidences for this to be a coincidence, you know, just, think just, just really showing like this, this child is such a gift from God in our lives as is what that showed me. So just filled with so much excitement and gratitude. ⁓ First child on both sides of our family, first grandbaby. So he is so spoiled. This little kid.
Chris Mader: So wild. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Awesome. Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: And we didn't know what his gender was throughout the entire pregnancy. know, it was, was a game time. Yeah. We were so surprised. It was, mean, just absolutely elated and everything. And he carries the name Robert that I have, ⁓ which is really more of a tip of the cap to my grandfather. ⁓ My grandfather, amazing person, grew up in foster homes, went to the Marines, GI Bill to get an education, just completely changed the paler name and the family tree.
Chris Mader: So you're surprised? Yeah, I love that. for you. ⁓ that's amazing.
Robert Paylor: American dream type of story. you know, so our little guy here carries that forward. ⁓
Chris Mader: Very cool. I've met your wife. She's also a college athlete, if I'm not mistaken, correct. And so ⁓ who does he look like? Who does Robert look like? He'd look like you look like your wife. What does he look like? What are the baby photos?
Robert Paylor: Yeah, she is. Chris, he looks like exactly like me. He's like a twin. I give my wife a hard time. I'll be like, no, it's not all like me. You know, the little like black circle that you have in the middle of your eye, like they're the same color on you and the child. I give her a hard time. But no, like we just compare him to the baby photos and ⁓ they're very difficult to distinguish. It's been wonderful. Yeah.
Chris Mader: ⁓ my goodness, that's awesome. That's so great. That's incredible. ⁓ my God. That's awesome. That's so great, man. I'm so happy for you guys. mean, like I said, I got to meet you and your wife a couple of years ago and just incredible people and ⁓ your love affair, the love story is incredible and it continues to flourish. I'm so happy for your success in business. Your book's incredible. ⁓ I listened to it by the way. I didn't read, I listened to it. I did hear your voice and it was cool. ⁓ And the keynote that I experienced, mean, man, I've been around the block. I've listened to...
Robert Paylor: Thank you. Yeah.
Chris Mader: know, Simon Sinek, and I've seen some really powerful speakers in person and I didn't expect, I didn't expect what happened that day. I didn't know I was gonna meet you, I didn't know your story, and it did change my perspective. I mean, that's the word, you know, the bad days you have, I'm like, wow, this guy has gone through all of this and look how positive he is and look what he's doing for people and everybody in the room was impacted. I'm like, he has to, and that's why I said, you have to write a book, you have to bring this message to the world and I know you're.
Robert Paylor: Move. Please. Yeah.
Chris Mader: I know you're doing it successfully and have had some incredible keynotes and things. where can people find you? mean, listen, gang, if I haven't said enough, bringing Robert in will give teams perspective, will help the leaders improve their mindset. Anybody on the team just on what is possible, right? Not what is impossible, what is possible. So just explain where people can find you on social media. If they wanna find you, where can they find you?
Robert Paylor: Totally. So for speaking stuff website, robertpaylor.com and that's a pretty comprehensive place of just where to find all the different links, ⁓ social media everywhere, Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, LinkedIn, X. Just look up Robert Paylor. I kind of have a monopoly on the name. There's not too many of us out there. ⁓ I try to be really generous with just posting regularly education on spinal cord injuries, motivating messages. And every day as I'm working out, I do a quick video of me in that workout. So I believe if I'm not mistaken today is 3,273 days since my injury. I keep that day counter there to just be like 3,200 plus days later. I'm not quitting and you don't have to either. So I want to give that boost to people's mental diets right there on social media. And I like what I also really try to do is just reply to everything.
Chris Mader: Yeah. Yeah.
Robert Paylor: So whenever anybody sends me a message and needs some encouragement or has a question to try and answer all that. And then the book, course, Paralyzed Powerful is ⁓ everywhere books are sold.
Chris Mader: Well, spoiler alert folks, you I know Robert, you know, he needs a wheelchair most days, but he is, he can get up and he's moving around and you have a level of mental and physical strength. My friend that I is, is, is unmatched. It's, it's incredibly inspirational. I'm glad you're in my life. I'm glad we met. say that. Yeah. Anything we met, anything we didn't talk about today, Robert, that you, ⁓ you wish we, any other topics we want to talk about, we didn't talk about before I let you go.
Robert Paylor: Mm-hmm. Likewise, Chris. Boy, mean, maybe a closing message or just some thoughts on success and what does success look like. This is maybe the topic I've thought about the most. And I think it just kind of like ties a ribbon around my story and I think everybody's story and just overcoming challenges in our lives. You know, when I first got hurt, my goal on day one was to be wheelchair independent.
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: to be walking with a walker crutches, a cane or nothing at all. didn't care. I just wanted to stand up from my wheelchair again, one day and then never sit back down in it again. And I've had amazing rehab progress. I can walk 500 yards. I've had basically a full return in my upper body. I mean, here I am. I'm talking like an Italian moving my hands everywhere in this conversation. It's amazing. None of it was supposed to happen. One step would have been a miracle. 500 yards is out of this world, but
Chris Mader: Yeah.
Robert Paylor: I haven't achieved that goal that I set on day one. And the statistics say I will never achieve that goal. The stats say I will fight to get out of my wheelchair for the rest of my life and it just won't happen. And I got to think if that's the case, does that mean that I've failed? Does that mean that I am a failure? I think the answer is absolutely not. And it's not just because of those physical outcomes. I think it's the internals. I have joy, meaning and gratitude in my life. I wake up every single day and I'm excited to take on this day. And this challenge didn't beat me, not because I've had physical progress, but because I love my life. And I have a wife who I love and a son who I'd give anything for and this mission to inspire people and help them through their challenges in a way that I never would have had if I didn't break my neck. So when I think it comes to that true success, things will be difficult in life. And things might not turn out the way that you initially planned on those goals that you set on day one, but don't let that ever stop you from having that joy, meaning and gratitude in your life. Push for that and all those pieces are going to fall together. So those are kind of some final thoughts. And just like as you go out in your lives to take that with you and know like where your success really lies.
Chris Mader: Thank you for that. January, 2024 is the day I won't forget and April of 2026. I will not forget this conversation, Robert. can't thank you enough generosity for your time, for the message you bring. And again, any of my listeners get the book for sure. And if you have a team, no better keynote speaker than Robert Payless. So Robert, thank you for being here today. You're a good man. And I can't wait till I get to talk to you again and see you again soon.
Robert Paylor: Made my day, Chris. Thank you so much.
Chris Mader: You're awesome. Thanks, Robert.
