The Mindset Behind a $42.5 Million Settlement | Trent Kelly

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So, welcome to the Elite Mindset Podcast.
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And I want to give a little bit of context, context for why I started this pod podcast, why it's something that I think is really important to me, and why I hope it's something that people find value in.
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Is one of the things that I think about all the time when I drive past cities.
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Every city has like a different cityscape, right?
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Where you, you know, if you've traveled and you've been around cities, whether it's America or other places, you can look at a skyline and you can say, hey, that is the Austin skyline, that is the Dallas skyline, that is the Seattle skyline.
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And what comprises that skyline is these this eclectic combination of buildings that are all very, very different.
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And we kind of take for granted that, we take for granted like these architectural marvels that become a city's cityscape.
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And one of the things I think about all the time, whether it's the Space Needle in Seattle, the Empire State Building in New York, is I think about how that idea started as one person's idea.
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One person said, I'm gonna build a building that looks like this, the Birch Khalifa, whatever it may be.
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And then that one person took that idea and they brought all these people together and they created something that now became like a permanent fixture in an entire community and an entire society.
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And yet it all emanated from one person and one person's thought.
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And if you take that concept and you apply it to everything in life, it's also true.
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Literally every single thing, this microphone that I'm speaking into, the camera that I'm looking at right now, everything emanated from one person thinking something, believing it could happen.
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And then they went and made that a reality.
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And what I am fascinated by, I'm getting I'm energized, I'm inspired by is talking to people who, starting with their mindset, create exceptional outcomes.
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And that's really what this podcast is about.
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Is I've been privileged enough to know a lot of people who've done things like this, done exceptional things, created exceptional outcomes for themselves and for others.
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And yet those conversations, they die on the golf course.
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They die at a dinner table.
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Um, and it's great.
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It's great to have that information.
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But what I want to do is I want to invite people that I know on this podcast, talk to them, understand their mindset, and to share that with other people.
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Um, because I find that it's inspiring, I find that it's motivating for myself, and I think it's something good for us to think about is how do we cultivate a mindset that's gonna help us get the outcomes that we want out of life?
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So I'm excited.
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My first guest is a longtime friend.
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He started off as a client, has become a friend of mine.
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Trent Kelly's a personal injury lawyer based out of Austin, Texas.
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In my opinion, one of the best lawyers in the area.
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Um, and all these things that I just talked about, I feel are true of him.
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So I feel like he's a great person to have as my first guest guest on the podcast.
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So, Trent, welcome.
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Thank you for coming on and being my first guest.
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I appreciate that.
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And I think that's a great introduction.
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Um, I'm honored to be your first guest.
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I value the same things you do.
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I I know we've had a lot of discussions about this off-camera about elite mindset and how people achieve great outcomes through perseverance and originality and really just being themselves, being the true version of themselves.
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Uh, so I'm happy to be here with you today in your first episode to explore those topics and dig into that, like in a general sense, and also talk about how it impacts my practice and what we do at TK Injury Lawyers.
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Awesome.
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Well, let's get going, man.
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So um, and I'm gonna obviously we're gonna talk about stuff that I already know, conversations that we've had, but I want to share this with other people as well.
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Tell me, you know, there's a lot of personal injury lawyers, right?
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You could throw a rock out the window and hit eight personal injury lawyers who are looking for people who are injured to help represent them.
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Anyone in America, especially, knows that that's the case.
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Tell me a little bit about you.
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Like what was your journey?
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How did how did it how did how did you end up here?
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How did you become Trent Kelly, the the personal injury trial lawyer?
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Yeah.
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So I think the story of how I became a lawyer and the story of our firm's success and how we approach cases is really kind of all the same story because it starts with like a small boy growing up in rural Arkansas who had nothing, basically, and who cultivated a chip on his shoulder.
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Because I think from I grew up looking at people who I felt like had unfair advantages because of the position they were born into or the position they they had over others, whether it be monetary or whatever, whatever creates that imbalance of power.
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That's something that has always bothered me from the beginning, as long as I can remember, feeling that there's some kind of injustice in the way uh outcomes are achieved for different people through no fault of their own.
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So I think, I mean, you can talk, my parents would tell you that before I was probably 10 years old, I was already saying I was going to be a lawyer.
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And I think the reason for that is because I saw that one person doing a good job for someone who's in a bad situation has the ability to right the wrongs of that imbalance and bring balance to an otherwise rigged system.
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And I felt called to do that.
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And so uh I went to law school with the idea of being a trial lawyer.
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I never thought about being any other kind of lawyer.
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Um, I was shocked when I got to law school that like 90% of the people I went to law school with were terrified to enter a courtroom.
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You know, like I thought everybody was gonna be a trial lawyer when I went to law school.
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Um, and so when I got there, it was a little jarring to me that you had all these people who were really focused and wanted to learn the information, wanted to become like scholars of the law.
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But very few who had the wherewithal and drive who wanted to actually step into the arena and and fight for people, you know, using that knowledge.
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So I think what I learned in law school was, you know, learning the law is really not that difficult, if I'm being, if I'm being honest.
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I think a lot of people can know the law, especially these days where we have so much access to information online.
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Uh, a lot of principles of law are accessible to lawyers and non-lawyers.
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Anyone with a computer and a search engine can find out a lot of the information you learn in law school.
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So, what separates lawyers, in my opinion, and in particular trial lawyers, uh, when they go into practice is their own personal experiences.
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Like, what guides your moral compass?
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Like, how do you approach a case based on uh is it about the client?
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Is it about you and your ego?
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Is it about your law firm?
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For me, based on my experiences, I approach, I'm very client-focused because the chip that I grew up with on my shoulder, I apply that chip to every case, right?
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And so what separates me in a field of a million screaming lawyers on TV and on billboards is that you don't get someone who just knows the law.
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Because, like I said, that's that's a almost like a commodity.
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What you get is someone who cares deeply about the wrong that has that you've suffered and who's gonna take it and make it personal for them and use the chip that I've been carrying my entire life to refuse to lose, essentially.
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So let me let me just ask some more questions about this chip, right?
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Because a lot of people have a chip on their shoulder.
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Where did that so if I'm understanding what you're saying, it came from basically coming from a rough situation, right?
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Talk to me about that chip.
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What cultivated that chip?
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What went into you developing that chip?
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I know it wasn't as simple as you saw injustices in the world.
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I want to know more about that.
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I want to understand that better.
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Yeah, okay.
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So, like from personal experience, what cultivated the chip was I saw as a child, you know, you you can only focus on the things that you see in front of you.
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Your universe is really small.
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But there were things that were happening to people around me, people going on nice vacations that I couldn't go on, seeing things in the world that I thought I might not might not ever see, you know.
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So it was like, it was this like feeling like when you grow up in a situation like that, especially in a small town where a lot of people don't make it out of that town.
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And I'm not judging that.
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I think small town America is great, and I have a lot of family and friends who still live where I grew up.
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But for me, I felt like there's more to there's more to my story than what's happening here, right?
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And I need to find a way to make that story a reality.
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And so I think the chip was cultivated in that's not gonna happen based on my upbringing, my circumstances, not that's not gonna happen for me.
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I've got to make that happen, right?
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And so I used the disadvantages I had as an advantage, essentially, if that makes sense.
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Like the things that I saw that were like I didn't have that I wanted, that I thought that I I certainly wanted for my children as when they became the age I was at the time.
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Um, I felt like I'm gonna have to work really hard my entire life and separate myself because I come from a from an experience or a background where I'm not going to be given any advantages.
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Yeah.
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You know, I've got to earn all of this.
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And you know, just being candid, right?
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I wouldn't look at you and think that.
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Yeah.
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I wouldn't.
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I would I wouldn't look at you and be like, man, this guy had to go uphill to get where he's at in life.
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Yeah.
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I I mean, I I'll take that as a compliment.
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Thank you.
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Uh but I think if you knew me when I was eight, nine, 10 years old, you would you would get it.
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And you and I have had these conversations, you kind of know that the the granular details of that.
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I'm not gonna go into that, but um, you know, it's it's more about a sense of I am I I'm gonna refuse to let someone else dictate the outcome for me.
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Yeah.
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You know, yeah, and that's how I approach every case.
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I refuse to allow a defense attorney or an adjuster or some person who's sitting in a building somewhere trying to cover the bottom line for a multi-billion dollar corporation to get an advantage and to win a case that I know my clients are entitled to win.
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So I just I just I think that the chip, if you want to call if you want to keep calling it a chip, I don't know, maybe there's a better word for it as we pivot.
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I think chip's a good word.
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As we pivot to this theme, but like it is a it is an embrace embracing discomfort, knowing that like every case, every case, I've been doing this for almost 20 years, every case has something new in it.
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Uh, you're not gonna ever know everything about every law and every case and every situation.
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It's embracing the fact that like I don't, I don't might, I might not know everything when I enter a case, but I know that I'm right.
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And I know that I'm gonna fight like hell to prove that I'm right.
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And if that means that we go to a courtroom, we tee it up with a jury and let a jury decide, then so be it.
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But I'm not gonna sacrifice my comfort, meaning like that we're gonna sell a case quickly and for less money, uh, over my client's success and their ability to get what they're entitled to, which is always obviously gonna create a lot of discomfort for the attorney who's involved because you know it's easy for a personal injury lawyer to sign up a case, especially a good case, and sell it pretty quickly, right?
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I mean, the insurance company knows they owe something.
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Yeah, we see it all the time.
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They know they owe something.
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So uh there's a lot of lawyers who do what I do who might sign up a case and settle it for 10, 20% of what the actual value of the case is because they're afraid of the discomfort, right?
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Like they don't want to go through that process and fight for their client and feel like this may take two years.
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I'm carrying all these case expenses, the the the outcome is uncertain.
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You know what I'm saying?
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They're they're looking at, they're always looking at what are what am I risking personally to continue to fight for this client.
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For me, I take it personally, but it's the opposite way.
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You know, like there's nothing I'm not willing there that I'm not willing to do if if I feel think that we're in the right to fight for that client and to and to grow in the discomfort with them to get the outcome that they deserve.
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I I like I like the theme of discomfort because just personally, one of the things that I can share is like, man, I hate it when negative stuff happens to me.
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I hate it when I have to go through something that's difficult.
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Yeah.
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Um, I think most people would agree with that.
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I don't think that's a unique uh perspective.
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But yet, whenever I look back in my life and I say, like, well, why was I able, why was I able to have a good outcome when there have been good outcomes in my life?
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Almost every single time I can point to like something really negative that like that that like became a motivating factor that taught me a lesson that I needed to learn.
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Um and so what I've learned, I've gotten older, and you, you know, you take your lumps, you have some wins and you have some losses, is I've learned that like when these bad things happen, rather than lament and like feel sorry for myself, how quickly can I pivot to what can I learn from this?
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What can I take from this?
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How can I use this as motivation, as feel whatever it is?
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Like Michael Jordan was famous for being a guy that like he wanted you to talk trash to him because like he'd show, you know, this is a Tuesday night in Milwaukee.
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He can't get it up for playing against, like, like there's no stars on the team at that time, but yet a guy would talk trash to him, and now he's like, I'm gonna go get 60 on you now.
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Now you've given him this motive, right?
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So, like, that's like an exaggeration of what I'm describing.
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So, my question for you is this is a journey, right?
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We talked about growing up in Arkansas, sort of the things that shaped your mindset, gave you this chip on your shoulder.
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What are some of the challenges that you've had in your career, especially early on, that you feel have helped mold you into the person you are now and the capabilities you have now as a trial attorney?
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Yeah, so I mean, I think part of what motivates me as a trial lawyer and how I approach cases is the general mentality of not being afraid of risk.
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And I think like, you know, leaving when I started this law firm, I left a very comfortable position, you know, that a lot of people would have stayed in because I had a good salary and I had a wife and um a baby who was two months old at the time.
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Um but I felt like what was best for my career and my journey and my clients ultimately was for me to take that risk to go out on my own to be able to do things the way that I want them done.
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Um so like I I I just there was no other way for me to handle this other than to take the risk and start my own shop.
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Um and by doing that, I'm able to take risk on my clients that I might be told if I work for someone else that we're not gonna take.
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Does that make sense?
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Yeah, it does.
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So when you're working at a big firm, um even some small firms, I think a lot of it's there, the law firms are hedging their own risk versus their clients' risk.
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What do you mean by that?
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I don't I don't know what you mean by that.
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I mean like time is money, especially in the law, right?
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When you as a lawyer, you have nothing to sell other than your knowledge of the law, your experience, and your time.
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That's it.
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I don't have a product to sell you.
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I that is my product.
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And so there's only a finite amount of that that exists within a law firm, right?
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So that's the intangible part of the risk is you put a lot of time and effort and energy into a case instead of other cases, and you don't get the outcome you want, and the firm loses money on it, right?
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But then there's also tangible risk.
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So it's to work this case up properly, we need to hire these experts, but they're really expensive.
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And the defense attorney is saying he doesn't think we're gonna win, that they think we're gonna they're gonna get a summary judgment on us before trial anyway.
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So we might be out all that money if that happens, if we buy into that bravado, right?
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So I feel like most attorneys are are real scared of that when they, you know, they they love to work up a case until they meet a meet a wall that they have to climb over, or or even worse, if they have to run through a wall, right?
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Because there's no way to get over it.
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And so they take money they shouldn't take for a client because either the intangible risks are too high or the tangible risks are too high, or maybe a combination of both.
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And so what that what that leads to is an outcome that's not anywhere close to what it should be for the client.
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And so the way I look at that is I'm a risk taker.
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Like I my entire life my success has been predicated on risk, whether it was uh, you know, going to law school without any family, you know, no ties to the law whatsoever.
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I didn't have a dad who's a lawyer or an uncle or whomever.
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Like I assumed a lot of debt that my parents couldn't pay, they didn't pay for my law school at the risk, betting on myself that I'm gonna be a good trial lawyer.
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I don't know if you'll relate to this, but like as you're saying this, like, oh, I obviously, you know, I'm listening to you and I'm like, okay, I relate to what you're saying.
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And like a way that I'm I I feel the same way is, you know, I didn't come from much.
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Um, I wouldn't say I grew up poor, but I didn't have much, right?
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And the expectations of me growing up were like, hey, like have a get a solid job, provide for your family, and not quite survive, but like, hey, that that's a good life.
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And and by the way, that is a good life.
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There's nothing wrong with that.
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But I always wanted, I always wanted to like see what I could achieve.
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And I've been driven to like try to be what I can.
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And one of the things when I've thought about risks, and I've been in these moments where I'm like, oh man, I gotta take this plunge or I gotta invest this, or whether it's time or money or effort, whatever it may be, um, you can obviously think about what might happen bad.
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But one of the things that helped me is like, I know what it feels like to have nothing.
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Yeah, I know what it's like, right to be worried how I'm gonna pay rent the next month.
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Sure.
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And you know what?
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I was still happy.
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I'm still happy and I still had buddies I could call and go have a beer, go shoot some hoops with.
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I could still go for a run outside.
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I mean, there's there's so many things that are amazing in life that you can be grateful for, even whenever you know you're not in the best situation.
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That I'm like, okay, if that's my floor, what's the worst that can happen to me?
00:20:01.119 --> 00:20:12.000
And so what that's allowed me to do is like take risks in other situations because I'm not looking at this through this lens of I've got to build some empire, I gotta drive this car or that house.
00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:14.559
Like, that's not my motivation.
00:20:14.799 --> 00:20:20.559
My motivation is saying like, what I can, what am I capable of and how can I make the biggest impact?
00:20:20.720 --> 00:20:24.000
Well, it's about being able to lay your head on the pillow at night and know you gave your best.
00:20:24.160 --> 00:20:26.960
Yeah, you know, yeah, it's what it's like that's powerful stuff.
00:20:27.039 --> 00:20:27.279
Yeah.
00:20:27.519 --> 00:20:36.799
And if and I don't think I could lay my head on my pillow at night and think about the things I'm doing professionally and personally, you know, being a father and a husband and a lawyer.
00:20:37.200 --> 00:20:37.839
Talk to me about that.
00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:38.799
Like, talk to me.
00:20:38.880 --> 00:20:39.759
What does that feel like?
00:20:39.920 --> 00:20:49.359
What is what is you laying your when you lay your head on your pillow and you're like, I feel like I left it all in the field and I gave everything I could.
00:20:49.440 --> 00:20:49.680
Yeah.
00:20:49.839 --> 00:20:51.119
Tell me what does that look like?
00:20:51.200 --> 00:20:52.799
What does that analysis look like in your head?
00:20:52.960 --> 00:20:57.680
Well, I mean, I I'll say this, you know, there's no better feeling, I think.
00:20:57.839 --> 00:20:58.079
Yeah.
00:20:58.319 --> 00:20:59.759
Win, lose, or draw.
00:21:00.000 --> 00:21:44.559
You know, if you if you if you put your best product on the field and you played every down with the like the aggression and tenacity and and spirit and energy you had, and you got whooped, and you got whooped, you know, but you can sleep at night knowing that you didn't hold a punch, that there there wasn't a play that you kept in the book that you could have used that you didn't try, you know, and so I guess for me it's about hard work, but also creativity, you know, in a way, like thinking outside the box with like professionally, thinking like, what have I have I thought about every possible way to achieve the best result in this case?
00:21:44.720 --> 00:21:44.960
Right.
00:21:45.039 --> 00:21:50.799
So there many times, and I'm sure a lot of my colleagues feel the same way.
00:21:51.359 --> 00:21:54.880
Uh, that like I I wake up in the middle of the night thinking about my cases.
00:21:55.119 --> 00:21:55.519
Of course.
00:21:55.759 --> 00:22:04.160
You know, like I wake up, especially when a lot's on The line, like sweating, you know, dreaming about cases.
00:22:04.559 --> 00:22:07.440
Because like I'm that personally invested in it.
00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:15.599
And so there there are times when I think about something in the middle of the night, you know, and that could really be helpful to a case.
00:22:16.000 --> 00:22:25.519
And and it's I gotta remember that for the next day because it's crucial that I use every tool I got in my tool belt to help people.
00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:31.440
And like I said, I mean, I'm this is a being a trial lawyer is not a destination, it's a it's a journey.
00:22:31.599 --> 00:22:36.799
As cliche as that is, I'm learning every day, I'm becoming a different version of myself, hopefully a better version.
00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:48.000
The more experiences I have, whether they're wins or losses or whatever, whatever they are, they go into shape you into the best version of yourself, to your point.
00:22:48.240 --> 00:22:58.640
And I just think like you and I have talked about before, if you've got to be willing to bet on yourself in all situations, right?
00:22:58.960 --> 00:23:23.039
Like if you're walking into a courtroom or a boardroom or an interview for your first job at McDonald's, like if you don't walk in there thinking I'm the person for this job or I'm the person who's here to achieve this result for someone else or for myself today, and that I and by God, I I'm gonna do it or I'm gonna get it, then you shouldn't show up.
00:23:23.279 --> 00:23:28.240
Yeah, who who if you can't believe in yourself, then who's gonna believe you and who's gonna believe in you, right?
00:23:28.400 --> 00:23:28.720
Yeah.
00:23:28.960 --> 00:23:54.079
So I think uh you know, betting on yourself has enormous power in terms of broad stroke, is a lot of people don't achieve the outcomes they want in life, not just cases in a courtroom, but just generally speaking, because they're terrified of if I do bet on myself and I'm wrong, it's scary.
00:23:54.240 --> 00:23:54.960
What's the result?
00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:55.680
It's scary.
00:23:55.839 --> 00:23:57.759
Is it is it I'm I'm homeless?
00:23:58.000 --> 00:24:05.119
Is it uh I lose this big case and$250,000 I've got invested in my own money?
00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:17.680
You know, like is it I my company value goes down uh because I made a bad move here and like I got to answer to a board or my co-owners and and face the music on that?
00:24:17.839 --> 00:24:20.799
I think those are real concerns for sure.
00:24:21.119 --> 00:24:25.680
Like I'm not I'm not downplaying or marginalizing people's fear.
00:24:25.839 --> 00:24:32.799
What I'm saying is to have an elite mindset, I to me, the cornerstone of that is to embrace the fear.
00:24:33.119 --> 00:24:33.680
I agree.
00:24:33.839 --> 00:24:34.799
I agree 100%.
00:24:35.519 --> 00:24:39.519
You just have to accept it as part of your daily life.
00:24:40.079 --> 00:24:47.039
You know, it's like hey, it's like the scene in the in uh The Dark Knight Rises, whenever like uh Batman's fighting Bane.
00:24:47.279 --> 00:24:48.960
This is kind of a dumb analogy.
00:24:49.359 --> 00:24:49.920
This is the third one.
00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:51.519
Yeah, this I don't think I ever got through this.
00:24:51.599 --> 00:24:54.640
I've tried to watch it a couple of times, I think I've fallen asleep, but it's so good, dude.
00:24:54.720 --> 00:24:55.200
You gotta watch it.
00:24:55.359 --> 00:25:03.200
Okay, but there's a scene whenever you know Batman exists in the shadows, and that's like his that's his advantage at fighting, and so he's fighting Bane.
00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:16.000
And I'm not gonna try to do the Bane voice, especially not on camera, but but he like he like starts to use some of his like trickery on Bane, and he's like, uh, I was born in the darkness.
00:25:16.240 --> 00:25:18.079
He goes, I I've embraced it.
00:25:18.160 --> 00:25:25.039
You know, he goes, it wasn't till and he says something to the effect of like like I was so used to, I was actually blinded by the light.
00:25:25.279 --> 00:25:30.799
And that's what made Bane so scary, is like he embraced the darkness.
00:25:31.039 --> 00:25:41.119
And I completely agree with you is like as humans, we're we're very much programmed to be to be fear-aversed, to take the safe way out, yeah.
00:25:41.440 --> 00:25:51.599
And what I've learned time and time and time again is the good stuff, even for the people you admire, the good stuff is on the other side of that fear.
00:25:51.680 --> 00:25:52.880
It I mean, it just is.
00:25:53.839 --> 00:25:58.079
You know, you're talking about going to sleep at night and that it's the best feeling in the world.
00:25:58.240 --> 00:26:03.759
I the the I'm I'm way over my sports analogy quota for the for the episode.
00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:10.400
Okay, but when I when I hear that, I'm gonna tell you something that like it's one of my favorite sports moments of all time, man.
00:26:10.559 --> 00:26:15.599
Kobe Bryant, one of the all-time greatest athletes, all-time elite mindset, I think everyone would agree.
00:26:15.839 --> 00:26:16.799
I think about Kobe all the time.
00:26:16.960 --> 00:26:18.640
Freaking in practicing law.
00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:20.079
Love Kobe.
00:26:20.319 --> 00:26:27.519
There's Kobe died, you know, like, you know, you don't have a con I've never had like a like a connection to celebrities or anything like that.
00:26:27.680 --> 00:26:31.680
When Kobe died, that was like the first celebrity death that just crushed me.
00:26:31.839 --> 00:26:33.200
It just crushed me in every way.
00:26:33.359 --> 00:26:36.319
And I went back and watched his last game against Utah.
00:26:36.559 --> 00:26:38.960
It's a meaningless game, end of the regular season.
00:26:39.039 --> 00:26:39.839
It's his last game.
00:26:39.920 --> 00:26:43.039
He's like, what, 36, 37 years old, something like that.
00:26:43.359 --> 00:26:47.359
Um and it was just one of those nights where everybody came to celebrate him.
00:26:47.440 --> 00:26:52.319
It was on national TV, Snoop Dogg, Shaq is in the audience, everybody's there to bid him farewell.
00:26:52.480 --> 00:27:01.359
He could have got out, got his quiet 23 points, gets got subbed out early, and just waved to the crowd, and everyone would have gave him a standing O.
00:27:01.680 --> 00:27:02.480
What does he do?
00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:12.880
The dude comes out firing like it's game seven of the NBA Finals, scores 63 points, ends up winning, hits the game, like the game-deciding shot on Gordon Hayward.
00:27:13.200 --> 00:27:15.680
And then like they call timeout after that play.
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:16.960
I'll never forget it.
00:27:17.039 --> 00:27:19.680
Uh and maybe somebody can look at it, I don't know.
00:27:19.759 --> 00:27:25.440
But there's a scene where after they call timeout, and this guy's at the end of the rope, man.
00:27:25.519 --> 00:27:28.160
This guy's a champion, and he's he's the old dog.
00:27:28.400 --> 00:27:34.720
And he's sitting on the bench, he's got the towel draped over him, and he's just staring at the ground, and he's completely empty.
00:27:34.880 --> 00:27:37.119
His tank is completely empty.
00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:44.799
I went back and watched that game after he died, and I swear when I see that scene, I get emotional because I'm like, that is what it's about.
00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:48.160
It's about giving everything that you have to give.
00:27:48.720 --> 00:27:51.119
Contracts and dude, the guys made a ton of money.
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:55.759
And as you know, like in every business, there's money to be made and families to get fed, and all that matters.
00:27:55.839 --> 00:28:06.799
I'm not saying it doesn't matter, but like for me, what it's all about is it's about being able to sit on that bench and just be exhausted and say, I did my best, win, lose, or draw, like you said.
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:07.200
That's right.
00:28:07.680 --> 00:28:16.799
And man, I gotta tell you, that feeling feels better than any car I've ever driven in or any house I've ever lived in, or anything.
00:28:16.960 --> 00:28:22.240
That is like that is very, very uh motivating for me.
00:28:22.319 --> 00:28:24.240
And like I love hearing you talk about that.
00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:31.839
It's like one of the reasons why I want to have conversations with people, like, because I know I obviously I know you've known you for a long time, but I want to tell those stories.
00:28:31.920 --> 00:28:34.160
I want to hear those stories, I want to be inspired by those stories.
00:28:34.400 --> 00:28:39.039
Yeah, and I'll say, I'll add something to that too, that I think about differently with Kobe.
00:28:39.200 --> 00:28:46.799
And I talk to my kids about this a lot, is how people want to look at what Kobe was able to achieve.
00:28:47.119 --> 00:28:58.480
And the thing that I think that Kobe embodies the most is this idea of if you just saw him play basketball, you would think, what a gifted individual.
00:28:58.720 --> 00:29:12.079
What a person who just had everything line up for them, who was born into this body and mentality or whatever that could just walk onto a basketball court and dominate any opponent in any situation.
00:29:12.319 --> 00:29:17.200
But the reality is that's that's no, that doesn't exist, right?
00:29:17.440 --> 00:29:26.079
Like that is a packaged form of someone that we see out of our own probably thoughts that we could never achieve that.
00:29:26.160 --> 00:29:30.079
So we have to explain it in a way that doesn't hurt our own egos.
00:29:30.400 --> 00:29:31.440
Yeah, it feels better to think that.
00:29:31.599 --> 00:29:33.920
Yeah, to think like, oh, well, he just had all these abandoned.
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:35.599
If I was six foot six, I could do that too.
00:29:35.839 --> 00:29:36.559
Yeah, could you?
00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:36.880
Right?
00:29:37.440 --> 00:29:38.720
Yeah, no, I couldn't.
00:29:38.960 --> 00:29:52.400
I could, but it the reason I say that is because so much of success in outcomes and life, and however you want to apply it, is all of the work that goes into something when no one's watching.
00:29:52.640 --> 00:29:53.279
It's the grind.
00:29:53.440 --> 00:29:54.720
Yes, it's the grind.
00:29:54.960 --> 00:29:59.680
And like a lot of people just don't have the grind in them.
00:29:59.920 --> 00:30:00.640
They just don't.
00:30:01.200 --> 00:30:03.119
The majority of people don't have it, right?
00:30:03.680 --> 00:30:08.640
Our industry is and because it's uncomfortable, right?
00:30:08.799 --> 00:30:21.759
Yeah, it's uncomfortable to grind, it's uncomfortable to bust your ass, you know, night and day, outwork, try to outsmart everybody, and and not and not know what the outcome's gonna be.
00:30:21.839 --> 00:30:25.119
Because it's not the grind doesn't have an immediate payout.
00:30:25.279 --> 00:30:31.839
Like you don't, you don't get this instant gratification from working harder than someone else.
00:30:32.000 --> 00:30:33.039
That's a long play.
00:30:33.680 --> 00:30:53.440
You know, and I think if Kobe had anything, it was just the the wherewithal to understand that like whether I ever achieve greatness in this game, I'm gonna, I'm damn sure gonna work as hard as I can to make sure I'm the best version of me that steps onto the court.
00:30:53.680 --> 00:31:06.160
And, you know, he famously would say, you know, if you get up an hour before everybody and you you're playing an hour before, and then you stay an hour later, and you then think about how those hours of practice accumulate over a lifetime or a career.
00:31:06.880 --> 00:31:26.799
And so uh whenever one of my kids who don't have thankfully the same pains that I did growing up has some setback or an outcome they don't want, you know, I always or very frequently at least reference Kobe with them and say, like, you got to work harder.
00:31:27.039 --> 00:31:36.319
You know, like these these outcomes that you want, you're you're entitled to those if you believe you're entitled to them and you put the effort in to actually get the result, right?
00:31:36.559 --> 00:31:36.880
Absolutely.
00:31:37.279 --> 00:31:38.799
Those things have to be married together.
00:31:39.039 --> 00:31:41.359
There's no, there's no no one's gonna hand you anything.
00:31:41.519 --> 00:31:43.200
I don't care who you are.
00:31:43.359 --> 00:31:45.279
I mean, maybe there's some exceptions, obviously.
00:31:45.359 --> 00:31:50.240
If you're but you don't want to be one of those, you don't want to be one of the I think if you're one of those exceptions, I think that is a curse.
00:31:50.319 --> 00:31:54.880
And we have so many examples we can look at and say, this person has everything, they're miserable.
00:31:55.039 --> 00:31:55.920
They're miserable.
00:31:56.079 --> 00:31:56.319
Yeah.
00:31:56.559 --> 00:31:59.119
Misery is not something I would wish on anybody, right?
00:31:59.279 --> 00:32:01.200
Like you don't want to be that exception.
00:32:01.440 --> 00:32:07.279
No, you want to know to your to your point earlier, that you gave everything you had that day.
00:32:07.359 --> 00:32:25.039
And when you lay your head down on the pillow at night, largely from exhaustion, but also because of contentment, that you can fall fast asleep without much effort at all because you have nothing that that you're regretful of for the for the actions you took that day.
00:32:25.119 --> 00:32:26.400
I mean, that's the goal, right?
00:32:26.480 --> 00:32:28.000
It's never perfect.
00:32:28.400 --> 00:32:34.160
It's no, I don't think anybody could sit here and and honestly say that, oh yeah, every night I lay my head on my pillow.
00:32:34.240 --> 00:32:35.359
I think I gave 100% today.
00:32:35.680 --> 00:32:37.200
If you say that you're lying.
00:32:37.519 --> 00:32:40.079
But but that it's not about perfection.
00:32:40.160 --> 00:32:46.960
It's about like recognizing perfection, imperfection, rather, and trying to be better the next day.
00:32:47.119 --> 00:33:05.119
Like every day I try to reset my goals and expectations for myself that whatever happened yesterday doesn't define me, whether it was like great or not so great, somewhere in between there, wherever it falls on the gradient, like that that's over, right?
00:33:05.279 --> 00:33:07.039
Like tomorrow is a new day.
00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:11.599
Tomorrow is an and I tell my I always tell my kids, you may do this too.
00:33:11.759 --> 00:33:14.240
I say we need to look at everything as an opportunity.
00:33:15.039 --> 00:33:17.519
You know, like I that's a big word that I use in my kids.
00:33:17.680 --> 00:33:19.119
This is an opportunity.
00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:31.920
And I think that when you're in stressful situations or high-risk situations, or you really want something, and you're you're putting it all on the line, and that creates anxiety or nervousness or whatever.
00:33:32.480 --> 00:33:44.799
Part of what brings me back to being grounded in contentment is to tell myself the reason that you're all worked up about this is because this is an opportunity.
00:33:45.200 --> 00:33:49.039
And like you don't, you're not guaranteed any opportunities in your life.
00:33:49.440 --> 00:33:52.319
You have one right here in front of you, right now.
00:33:52.480 --> 00:33:53.599
Make the most of it.
00:33:54.240 --> 00:33:57.359
It's like uh, I don't know, do you know who Jocko Willink is?
00:33:57.680 --> 00:33:58.000
No.
00:33:58.640 --> 00:34:01.119
Um ex-military guy.
00:34:01.440 --> 00:34:04.799
Now he's like a business consultant.
00:34:05.200 --> 00:34:09.679
Um, he has an ex he has an expression and he he's he has some really good books.
00:34:09.760 --> 00:34:12.960
One is about ownership, fantastic, extreme ownership, one of my favorite books.
00:34:13.119 --> 00:34:16.800
But he has this like story he tells about about the word good.
00:34:16.960 --> 00:34:21.760
And he talked about being in the military and how like when bad things would happen, he would always say good, good.
00:34:22.079 --> 00:34:23.360
And they'd be like, What the heck?
00:34:23.440 --> 00:34:24.239
Why are you saying good?
00:34:24.320 --> 00:34:24.719
This is bad.
00:34:25.039 --> 00:34:25.360
I love that.
00:34:25.679 --> 00:34:26.079
I heard that.
00:34:26.239 --> 00:34:31.280
He'd be like, good, well, now we can get better, like it's raining today, and we can't go on this mission, good.
00:34:31.440 --> 00:34:34.320
Now we can train, or this bad outcome happened, good.
00:34:34.400 --> 00:34:35.519
Now we can learn from that.
00:34:35.679 --> 00:34:44.320
And um that is such a weapon because nobody wakes up saying, I hope it rains today, I have a tea time with all my buddies, I want to go play golf.
00:34:44.480 --> 00:34:49.039
Nobody intuitively says, Well, I'm glad it's raining.
00:34:49.280 --> 00:34:57.199
But like when you can learn to approach the challenges of life and say, Good, good, how do I take from this?
00:34:57.440 --> 00:35:07.199
In my opinion, in my experience, your walking example of that is it becomes a utility that you can now apply to everything.
00:35:07.280 --> 00:35:09.280
And now you're like, okay, bring it on.
00:35:09.360 --> 00:35:12.960
Like, whatever it is, and I mean, granted, I don't want anything bad to happen to me.
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:15.599
I'm not asking for sure catastrophe, right?
00:35:15.760 --> 00:35:22.559
But but whatever it is, I will find the silver lining and I will somehow come out the other side of this strong in that.
00:35:22.639 --> 00:35:27.519
And I think that that's a tool that applies to everything, no matter what you do.
00:35:27.599 --> 00:35:30.320
I think it especially applies to trial lawyers.
00:35:30.639 --> 00:35:34.480
Um, and I think it's I think it's essential for us to teach our kids that.
00:35:34.639 --> 00:35:34.880
Yeah.
00:35:35.280 --> 00:35:37.440
And I think, you know, it's interesting.
00:35:37.679 --> 00:35:39.519
I think I've always been that way.
00:35:39.760 --> 00:35:47.679
You know, when you when you say golf, it kind of jolted this memory into my brain of, you know, did you happen to play college golf or something?
00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:49.119
Uh yeah, a little bit.
00:35:49.440 --> 00:35:50.719
But that's not even what it is.
00:35:50.800 --> 00:35:58.559
It's about being a kid growing up in a small town, and we had a with they we had what they called a country club.
00:35:58.639 --> 00:36:02.320
You know, it's not what you would think about in terms of a country club.
00:36:02.559 --> 00:36:13.119
Uh, you know, it was 11, if anyone knows anything about golf, it's an 11-hole course, which I'm sure you never very few people listening would have ever heard of.
00:36:13.519 --> 00:36:29.760
But all of that aside, it was a place, like I was drawn to golf when I was young, and I think about it sometimes, like from an introspective point of view, like what what drew me to it?
00:36:29.840 --> 00:36:34.000
You know, what did I like about it over all these other sports that I played all throughout my life?
00:36:34.239 --> 00:36:37.840
It was pretty decent at why did I focus on what golf?
00:36:37.920 --> 00:36:41.599
Why, and I think it's because there's extreme ownership in golf.
00:36:42.320 --> 00:36:43.360
You're on an island.
00:36:43.599 --> 00:36:44.960
It's you, buddy.
00:36:45.119 --> 00:36:58.800
You know, it's like it's you and the golf ball and the hole, wherever it might be, and how many times you're gonna have to swat it to get it into the hole, you know, and like there's no one else to blame for whatever happens.
00:36:58.880 --> 00:37:03.679
You don't have a teammate or a coach that you can say, well, I would have done this, but they they did that.
00:37:04.159 --> 00:37:19.599
So a lot of what what maybe what I thought about when you mentioned it earlier about having a tea time rained out, I remember what and I talk at my my oldest son is a golfer, and he's just starting to want to be competitive and play hard and all those things.
00:37:19.920 --> 00:37:21.840
So we talk about this sometimes.
00:37:22.400 --> 00:37:26.079
I remember when I was a kid, maybe 13 years old.
00:37:26.400 --> 00:37:32.559
If it were raining outside, I would say, good, I'm gonna go.
00:37:32.800 --> 00:37:36.400
I know the golf course is empty, it's not closed.
00:37:36.639 --> 00:37:41.599
You were a little juco, it's not it's not lightning, so there's no there's no danger.
00:37:42.400 --> 00:37:52.159
But I'm gonna go play in the rain because I guarantee you there's gonna be a time in my life in the future where I'm in the middle of a golf tournament and it's gonna start raining.
00:37:52.639 --> 00:38:00.719
And I'm gonna have an advantage over all of my competitors who've always just said, Oh, it's raining, I'll just stay home today.
00:38:01.039 --> 00:38:07.760
But isn't it wild, Trent, how that lesson that you learned as a kid it only it only applied to golf in that moment, right?
00:38:07.920 --> 00:38:08.159
Yeah.
00:38:08.400 --> 00:38:10.159
But it now applies to everything.
00:38:10.400 --> 00:38:10.800
That's right.
00:38:10.880 --> 00:38:40.960
And that's why I bring it up, is because I sort of hadn't thought about it that way until you mentioned golf and the conversation we're having now is I do think that I was already thinking about these things back then, and I have modified the what the application of the mindset, but the mindset has remained the same, which is I'm gonna lean into difficult things because running away from them is not gonna benefit me.
00:38:41.679 --> 00:38:45.199
And if anything, it's gonna expose me at some point.
00:38:45.679 --> 00:38:52.639
So I'm gonna deal with it now, even though it might be painful, because later, when it matters, I'll be ready.
00:38:52.880 --> 00:38:55.760
And listen, man, I've known you for a long time.
00:38:56.159 --> 00:39:00.559
And I don't know if I don't know if you're aware of this, but I'm just gonna give you my perspective.
00:39:01.360 --> 00:39:13.519
What you're articulating, this scrappiness and this fight that you have, and this like righteous indignance about injustice, that to me is what makes you different, in my opinion.
00:39:13.599 --> 00:39:14.800
I mean, I work with a lot of lawyers.
00:39:14.880 --> 00:39:19.760
I work with some really talented lawyers, some of the most, some of the best trial lawyers in the country, right?
00:39:20.079 --> 00:39:24.719
And one of the things I've always admired about you is you have this like fight.
00:39:25.360 --> 00:39:31.840
You're like a lot of the there's a lot of scorekeeping with in in in any industry, right?
00:39:31.920 --> 00:39:36.639
I'm not gonna single out legal, but there's a lot of scorekeeping of like, oh, you see what this guy did, you see what that guy did.
00:39:36.800 --> 00:39:39.039
And there's to me, there's a lot of ego in that, as you know.
00:39:39.199 --> 00:39:42.159
And some of it's useful, some of it's there's some utility in that.
00:39:42.400 --> 00:39:51.199
But one thing I really like about you, have always admired about you, Trent, is like you just to use a simple expression, like you keep the main thing, the main thing.
00:39:51.280 --> 00:39:56.960
Like you're just kind of like, whatever, like I can sift through this guy and what that, like I'm focused on this outcome for this client.
00:39:57.039 --> 00:39:59.360
And it's like a singular focus.
00:39:59.519 --> 00:40:11.840
And I think, and and I think that scrappiness and that grinder mindset for right up for right up for for maybe it's a wrong choice of words, but like that to me is something I think is very unique about you.
00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:13.039
Well, thanks.
00:40:13.199 --> 00:40:14.000
I appreciate that.
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:20.079
I I'll take that compliment and I I'll say that I aspire to be what you're describing.
00:40:20.320 --> 00:40:20.800
You are, dude.
00:40:21.039 --> 00:40:21.599
Dude, I know you.
00:40:21.679 --> 00:40:22.480
I know you really well.
00:40:22.639 --> 00:40:31.199
That's I'm telling you that like you got this fight in you that I think makes you uh it makes you uniquely empathetic.
00:40:31.920 --> 00:40:35.280
And it also, you know, let's let's be let's be real.
00:40:35.440 --> 00:40:42.000
Like a lot of there's a lot of lawyers who are very successful who are fantastic businessmen, fantastic marketers.
00:40:42.639 --> 00:40:47.119
God bless fantastic lawyers, fantastic businessmen and fantastic marketers, nothing wrong with that.
00:40:48.159 --> 00:41:07.280
But in legal specifically, and I this applies to other professions as well, but my my experiences in legal is like there's something to be said for like that purist who's like, I'm I'm about the grind, I'm about the outcome, I'm about justice, I'm about my clients.
00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:23.360
And I think that's something you got, and I'm not saying you don't give yourself credit for that, but I think that's something that I don't know if you realize how unique that is about you because like as someone who talks to a lot of lawyers, and I mean I've literally talked to you know 20 lawyers a week in some capacity or another.
00:41:23.440 --> 00:41:24.880
And again, a lot of them are fantastic.
00:41:24.960 --> 00:41:31.199
This is not to besmirch anybody, but like that's something that when I talk to you, I'm like, man, Trent is all about that life, man.
00:41:31.360 --> 00:41:32.320
And I respect it.
00:41:32.400 --> 00:41:34.000
I think it's admirable.
00:41:34.320 --> 00:41:36.800
It's admirable because it's what's right for the client.
00:41:37.039 --> 00:41:38.960
It is what's right for the client.
00:41:39.199 --> 00:41:46.639
And I try to make all my decisions based on that light post of is this best for the client?
00:41:46.960 --> 00:41:52.800
Ultimately, you know, like I said, that that's where the pain and the risk and all those things might scare some other lawyers.
00:41:53.039 --> 00:42:03.280
But for me, I couldn't lay my head on my pillow at night and go to sleep knowing that I sacrificed some outcome for my comfort.
00:42:03.679 --> 00:42:05.199
And so I'm just not gonna do that.
00:42:05.440 --> 00:42:21.199
Now, uh, you know, like you said, there's a lot of lawyers out there who are great marketers and have gotten it can hang a bunch of numbers on the wall because they've cast such a broad net and brought in all these cases.
00:42:21.360 --> 00:42:24.719
And I'm not gonna say anything negative about any particular law firm.
00:42:24.800 --> 00:42:39.679
I would never do that, but I think there's a reality that we have to accept, which is how many cases did they basically give some small amount of effort to because they didn't feel like it was worth their time.
00:42:40.079 --> 00:42:49.199
So they could just get to the big case, you know, like it was like these cases, these individuals are a means to an end.
00:42:49.519 --> 00:42:54.480
And the end is some big number I'm trying to get, some big case I'm trying to get.
00:42:54.719 --> 00:43:03.920
Whereas, no, like the way I look at it, and I couldn't look at it any other way because I I come from that background, like every case is an in and of itself.
00:43:04.159 --> 00:43:09.039
You know, it's like every client has like that's somebody's life hanging in the balance.
00:43:09.280 --> 00:43:09.599
Yes, right.
00:43:09.679 --> 00:43:12.320
This is their worst, and I'll give you one better.
00:43:12.559 --> 00:43:15.039
It's not just their, it's just not an individual.
00:43:15.119 --> 00:43:21.679
It's like this is an individual who is completely vulnerable, and this is the worst, maybe the worst thing they've ever experienced in their life.
00:43:22.079 --> 00:43:26.079
You know, like, and they don't know what to do.
00:43:26.639 --> 00:43:34.719
And they're putting all of that, all of that in your lap and saying we trust you to do what's right for us.
00:43:34.960 --> 00:43:37.280
That's that's an immense amount of responsibility.
00:43:37.519 --> 00:43:39.039
And what does that feel like for you?
00:43:40.000 --> 00:43:42.159
It depends, it depends on the day, I think.
00:43:42.320 --> 00:43:43.760
Honestly, if I'm being honest.
00:43:44.480 --> 00:43:47.199
Uh, some days it feels more manageable than others.
00:43:47.360 --> 00:43:50.480
I mean, I can tell you that the await can be immense.
00:43:50.639 --> 00:43:51.119
Yeah.
00:43:51.360 --> 00:43:59.760
Um, that's why I think that uh a lot of lawyers are sociopaths because they they don't carry that.
00:44:00.239 --> 00:44:00.960
Weight with them.
00:44:01.119 --> 00:44:06.400
And I guess in some ways, like maybe I should be envious of that.
00:44:06.639 --> 00:44:09.039
But I'm I'm clearly I think you know you should be.
00:44:09.199 --> 00:44:11.360
I'm clearly clearly not a sociopath.
00:44:11.440 --> 00:44:11.760
Yeah.
00:44:11.920 --> 00:44:14.960
Uh and I carry it, I carry the weight of all my cases all the time.
00:44:15.280 --> 00:44:16.639
How do you manage that?
00:44:18.800 --> 00:44:20.159
Uh I don't know.
00:44:20.400 --> 00:44:24.559
As carefully as I can while still maintaining the same level of intensity.
00:44:24.800 --> 00:44:26.480
Do you mean not a healthy way?
00:44:26.559 --> 00:44:26.719
Yeah.
00:44:26.880 --> 00:44:27.199
Honestly.
00:44:27.440 --> 00:44:34.079
If I'm being completely transparent, I probably don't carry it as healthily as healthily for myself as I should.
00:44:34.559 --> 00:44:38.639
But to me, it's what I signed up for.
00:44:38.800 --> 00:44:39.440
Yeah.
00:44:39.679 --> 00:44:40.000
You know?
00:44:40.239 --> 00:44:41.199
Yeah, I respect that.
00:44:41.440 --> 00:44:42.480
It's what I signed up for.
00:44:42.559 --> 00:44:44.719
If if you don't like it, get out, get out.
00:44:45.360 --> 00:44:47.840
Or find, I guess, find a different way to cope with it.
00:44:48.000 --> 00:44:49.920
Unfortunately, I think or settle every case.
00:44:50.079 --> 00:44:51.119
Or settle every case.
00:44:51.360 --> 00:44:54.079
And don't have have those pain points that keep you up.
00:44:54.159 --> 00:45:02.159
But I mean, for me, it's like I think that would be uh the the weight that I carry would be heavier if I settled every case.
00:45:02.239 --> 00:45:02.559
Yeah.
00:45:02.800 --> 00:45:03.519
Does that make sense?
00:45:03.760 --> 00:45:04.159
Of course.
00:45:04.320 --> 00:45:13.039
Because it would I would feel you would you would be going to sleep at night the opposite way that we just talked about, where you said I didn't leave it all on the field.
00:45:13.199 --> 00:45:14.719
I didn't give my team their all.
00:45:14.800 --> 00:45:23.920
I I didn't I wasn't, you know, one of my favorite quotes um is what a man can be, he must be.
00:45:24.159 --> 00:45:26.000
And I believe that's the burden.
00:45:26.239 --> 00:45:27.920
That's the burden of every human being.
00:45:28.000 --> 00:45:29.360
It's the burden that we all carry.
00:45:29.440 --> 00:45:31.199
And some of us can be more.
00:45:31.679 --> 00:45:35.199
And listen, nobody's asking you to be more than what you can be.
00:45:35.360 --> 00:45:37.119
It's what you can be, you must be.
00:45:37.199 --> 00:45:47.360
And so to me, what you're describing is like, hey, I know I can, I know I if I give my all, I can create a good outcome or at least sleep at night knowing that I didn't.
00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:49.360
But if you don't do that, that's a curse.
00:45:49.519 --> 00:45:54.159
And that goes back to the people I was talking about before who like you don't want to be these people who are given everything.
00:45:54.320 --> 00:45:58.000
You don't want to be these people who life seems like it's so convenient.
00:45:58.079 --> 00:46:01.840
Um, these Nepo babies that I actually feel sorry for them, right?
00:46:02.000 --> 00:46:07.280
You want to be somebody who's earned your right and can say, hey, I'm making the world around me a better place.
00:46:07.440 --> 00:46:08.320
I'm helping people.
00:46:08.480 --> 00:46:11.440
If not for me, there's less light in this world, right?
00:46:11.679 --> 00:46:13.519
Yeah, I think that's right.
00:46:13.760 --> 00:46:34.960
And I think also carrying that weight and approaching all my cases with the same level of intensity, even though that might affect me mentally and emotionally, you know, on a personal level, it is a is a gift to me in the sense that regardless of the type of case it is, right?
00:46:35.119 --> 00:46:37.039
Because there are different types of cases.
00:46:37.119 --> 00:46:40.159
There are cases where people have suffered greater harms than others.
00:46:40.400 --> 00:46:41.199
That's a fact.
00:46:41.679 --> 00:46:44.079
Not trying to pretend like every case is the same.
00:46:44.719 --> 00:46:59.840
But if you approach a smaller case, a case with less damages, a case where someone's life has not been turned upside down, maybe they they were in a crash and they're certainly hurt and they've had they have damages, they've had to see a doctor, they have injuries.
00:47:00.159 --> 00:47:19.679
If you approach that case differently, fundamentally differently, than you do a massive catastrophic injury case, then I think that you're not as good in the big case as you would be because you're less practiced in the way that you're gonna approach it.
00:47:19.920 --> 00:47:22.000
Well, look, look, that's a perfect segue, right?
00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:30.480
Because, you know, one of the things that's happened recently for you is you recently got a really great outcome in a really big case here in Texas.
00:47:30.800 --> 00:47:34.719
Um I think that's a perfect segue to talk about that.
00:47:34.800 --> 00:47:36.400
I want to know more about that case.
00:47:36.639 --> 00:47:38.079
Tell me a little bit about that case.
00:47:38.159 --> 00:47:42.639
Tell me about some of the challenges of it and like what what what details you can share about if you don't mind.
00:47:42.960 --> 00:47:43.280
Sure.
00:47:43.519 --> 00:47:49.039
So uh this was a partially confidential result.
00:47:49.360 --> 00:47:51.199
So there are things I can't say.
00:47:51.599 --> 00:47:52.880
Um, so I'll put that out there.
00:47:53.119 --> 00:47:56.480
I'm not trying to be uh, I'm not trying to obfuscate anything.
00:47:56.639 --> 00:47:59.199
You know, I'm just uh I'll tell you.
00:47:59.360 --> 00:48:19.920
So I've represented, had the the honor to represent a couple of very nice, deserving women who lost a loved one who was uh a father and a husband in a in a really bad car crash uh that happened here in Texas.
00:48:20.000 --> 00:48:21.840
It was caused by a commercial vehicle.
00:48:22.239 --> 00:48:27.119
Um, and it took almost two and a half years to get that case resolved.
00:48:27.519 --> 00:48:32.559
So you know, I've been carrying that for a long time and walking this path with my clients.
00:48:33.119 --> 00:48:41.920
Um ultimately, based on the work that we did, we were able to get my clients 42 and a half million dollars.
00:48:42.960 --> 00:48:52.320
Um and I'm sure you can guess without me telling you that the insurance company doesn't want to pay forty-two and a half million dollars, regardless of what happened in a case.
00:48:52.719 --> 00:49:08.800
And um, you know, that that result is I'm very proud of that, mostly for my clients, because too often when really awful things happen, people are they're suffering and their damages are minimalized.
00:49:09.280 --> 00:49:16.079
And even a what seems on the surface to be a good result is not the deserve the result that they deserve.
00:49:16.639 --> 00:49:23.039
Um I can say that this is the this is a this is a result.
00:49:23.199 --> 00:49:29.119
Now it's not gonna ever money never brings a person back, it never takes suffering away, it never takes grief.
00:49:29.519 --> 00:49:31.679
Yeah, they would they would gladly trade that money for it.
00:49:31.840 --> 00:49:32.400
Of course they would.
00:49:32.880 --> 00:49:34.719
Yes, yes, absolutely.
00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:47.760
Um but it adds insult to injury literally and figuratively in this case, when basically everything you've known for your life is taken from you.
00:49:48.480 --> 00:49:58.880
And then what's given to you to try to replace that is so minimal that it's like it's not even a real outcome for you.
00:49:59.039 --> 00:50:00.719
Like nothing has changed, you know.
00:50:02.079 --> 00:50:07.519
Really, I tell my clients like really bad things happen to really good people, unfortunately.
00:50:07.760 --> 00:50:11.599
That's just the nature of the world that we live in that happens all the time.
00:50:12.880 --> 00:50:17.039
And it's not my place to undo what's been done.
00:50:17.119 --> 00:50:17.760
I can't do that.
00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:18.960
I wish I could.
00:50:19.519 --> 00:50:35.360
But it is my job to try to go out there and get the best result that is available to us within the judicial system in the United States that can try to add something good from something horrible, right?
00:50:35.519 --> 00:50:48.320
Whether that means um life is a little more comfortable while you grieve or while you recover, or you can send your kids to college and pay for it now, whereas you couldn't do that before.
00:50:48.559 --> 00:51:06.400
I want to there's always to be, at the end of the day, I feel that I brought the value to a case where I I get someone in a really bad situation, I get them as close as I can to where they were before in terms of their medical, physical recovery.
00:51:06.559 --> 00:51:17.920
And then and ultimately in the in the result, whether it be a settlement or a verdict, that it is as close to their true measure to the extent you can quantify these things, right?
00:51:18.239 --> 00:51:20.079
True measure of damages is possible.
00:51:20.400 --> 00:51:35.840
And I'll fight for that until I feel like we're there, you know, and that's that's what happened with this case is very early on in the case, sure, there were there were discussions about much less money.
00:51:36.159 --> 00:51:37.519
There was still a lot of money though.
00:51:37.920 --> 00:51:38.559
A lot of money.
00:51:39.360 --> 00:51:40.719
Were you tempted to take it?
00:51:43.599 --> 00:51:47.280
I was interested in hearing the offers.
00:51:47.440 --> 00:51:48.079
I'll say that.
00:51:48.239 --> 00:52:04.480
You know, like one of the one of the hard things about what we do is when you when you have a situation where it's it feels weird even saying this, where you have the the benefit of not being limited by the resources on the other side, right?
00:52:04.559 --> 00:52:06.159
That was and that was a situation.
00:52:06.559 --> 00:52:07.840
Yeah, that was one of these situations.
00:52:08.000 --> 00:52:10.159
And I'll be, you know, I want to be transparent about that.
00:52:10.239 --> 00:52:32.000
There's a lot of I've had a lot of cases in my career where people have lost a husband or a child or uh uh a brother, what whomever, a significant other, a loved one, and they're a wrongful death beneficiary, they show up and they say, uh, you know, this happened to me, and we investigate that and we put all of our effort and energy into it.
00:52:32.079 --> 00:52:35.840
We lean into it in the ways that we practice that we've talked about already.
00:52:36.159 --> 00:52:42.880
And the result is not what we want because there simply isn't the there aren't the resources on the other side that are available.
00:52:43.280 --> 00:52:59.360
Explain that, if you will, for people who don't understand that, Trent, because I I'll tell you like one of the things you see on social media is you see people like having conversations when something happens, like a McDonald's employee like punches a customer and the comments are like, oh, that's a lawsuit.
00:52:59.519 --> 00:53:11.440
And you're kind of like being in the know to some degree that I am, just from being adjacent to the legal profession or being in the legal profession, is you know, like, hey, like, so anyway, I'll you're the expert here.
00:53:11.760 --> 00:53:16.320
Talk, explain to people what you mean by that, resources on the other side, what that means.
00:53:16.639 --> 00:53:25.280
So, in a normal car crash that let's say doesn't involve a commercial vehicle or a commercial entity at all, let's say it's you, me, I I'm looking at the colour.
00:53:25.440 --> 00:53:26.559
The Toyota Prius.
00:53:26.880 --> 00:53:35.920
We're looking at my phone driving down I-35 and here in Austin, you're stopped because traffic is always stopped, and I and I hit you really hard from behind.
00:53:36.079 --> 00:53:36.400
Okay.
00:53:37.440 --> 00:53:47.119
Basically, unless I'm a wealthy individual that owns multiple vacation homes or expensive boats or things like that, I'm of what we call judgment proof.
00:53:47.199 --> 00:53:49.360
You're not gonna get any money from me ever.
00:53:49.599 --> 00:53:55.039
There's I'm never gonna make the money that you would need to get from me to have a meaningful result.
00:53:55.280 --> 00:53:56.000
Number one.
00:53:56.239 --> 00:54:00.719
And number two, it's all exempt from what we call exempt from judgment.
00:54:00.880 --> 00:54:01.199
Okay.
00:54:01.440 --> 00:54:11.440
So, like a normal job, a couple of cars, you know, a house, even a even a very expensive house if it's homesteaded here in Texas, it's it's just judgment proof.
00:54:11.679 --> 00:54:16.239
Um, so in those situations, you're really looking at how much insurance is there?
00:54:16.480 --> 00:54:27.440
That's your source of recovery, you know, and that's something we don't get to tell juries, by the way, you know, that there's insurance, which I disagree with, like emphatically, and wish I could change that.
00:54:27.840 --> 00:54:30.480
Or imagine the insurance industry has lobbied pretty hard for that law.
00:54:30.719 --> 00:54:33.840
They have a lot of money and they do a really good job with that.
00:54:34.320 --> 00:54:47.840
But it's just one of those injustices that when you walk into a courtroom, not only are you tasked with, as the plaintiff, proving every element of your case, that you have the full burden of everything.
00:54:48.000 --> 00:54:52.000
The defense just has to poke a little hole here and there and they might win, right?
00:54:52.159 --> 00:55:01.199
You got to prove everything, but also you've got to get a jury who's looking at a defendant who might look very sympathetic, who's gonna take the stand and say, you know what?
00:55:01.440 --> 00:55:04.719
I admit that I did it, but I'm so sorry for it.
00:55:04.880 --> 00:55:07.119
And they're like, and they see themselves in that person.
00:55:07.280 --> 00:55:09.920
They think, I don't want to ruin this.
00:55:10.000 --> 00:55:12.960
Like this, this clearly the plaintiff has been damaged.
00:55:13.199 --> 00:55:16.800
But like, do do two harms make a whole?
00:55:16.960 --> 00:55:26.400
You know, am I gonna now ruin this person's life and put some huge number on them that they have to pay to this person and now they're bankrupt and destitute and all those things?
00:55:26.559 --> 00:55:28.239
Like, I think they see themselves in that.
00:55:28.400 --> 00:55:29.920
They go, I could make that mistake.
00:55:30.559 --> 00:55:32.239
I don't want that to happen to me.
00:55:32.400 --> 00:55:32.880
You know?
00:55:33.199 --> 00:55:33.679
Makes sense.
00:55:33.840 --> 00:55:38.480
Uh so I don't want to do it to them because it's like it's almost like self-preservation.
00:55:38.880 --> 00:55:46.159
Uh so it would be very helpful if we could say, hey, by the way, you know, we're here really about Allstate or State Farm, right?
00:55:46.239 --> 00:55:48.320
They they're all the ones paying right in the check.
00:55:48.480 --> 00:55:48.719
Mr.
00:55:48.800 --> 00:55:54.880
Jones here is just sitting here because he I think we just lost we just lost State Farm and Allstate as a potential sponsor.
00:55:55.199 --> 00:55:55.599
Sorry about that.
00:55:55.679 --> 00:55:56.159
Yeah, it's okay.
00:55:56.320 --> 00:55:57.840
I know you were this close.
00:56:00.559 --> 00:56:14.079
Uh you know, but that's a long way of saying if an individual with no assets is driving legally in Texas, they only have to have what's called a 3060 automobile liability policy.
00:56:14.159 --> 00:56:20.000
So what that means is there's up to 30,000 for any individual, up to 60,000 for any occurrence.
00:56:20.159 --> 00:56:30.239
Meaning if there are two people in a car and they're both injured significantly enough, they might pay 60,000 max, because 30 for each person, because no one person can get more than 30.
00:56:30.480 --> 00:56:32.159
You know, 30 times two is 60.
00:56:32.320 --> 00:56:35.199
Now it gets more complicated if you have three people in a car, right?
00:56:35.360 --> 00:56:39.920
Because now no, they can't all get 30 because there's only 60.
00:56:40.000 --> 00:56:44.480
So then the insurance company has to figure out how they're going to divide the money between those three people.
00:56:44.800 --> 00:56:49.440
So these these limitations you're talking about, though, just kind of getting back to the big case, right?
00:56:49.599 --> 00:56:49.920
Yeah.
00:56:50.480 --> 00:56:54.400
If I'm understanding you correctly, those limitations were just not the issue in this case.
00:56:54.639 --> 00:56:55.039
That's right.
00:56:55.280 --> 00:57:01.840
So I've had many cases in my career, unfortunately, where there was a death or a catastrophic injury.
00:57:02.079 --> 00:57:05.920
And the situation I was just describing is our reality.
00:57:06.079 --> 00:57:09.519
You have a person, we've had cases where people are uninsured.
00:57:09.840 --> 00:57:10.800
And there's just nothing.
00:57:10.960 --> 00:57:11.760
There's nothing.
00:57:11.920 --> 00:57:13.760
And there's no way to get it.
00:57:14.079 --> 00:57:20.320
You know, you can see it on TV, maybe on some program that's largely it's all fiction.
00:57:20.480 --> 00:57:21.440
They find some way.
00:57:21.599 --> 00:57:21.920
Yeah.
00:57:22.159 --> 00:57:22.960
Doesn't exist.
00:57:23.119 --> 00:57:29.119
You know, insurance is insurance, and and for ordinary people, that's the only source of recovery.
00:57:29.360 --> 00:57:32.480
So we've had cases, yes, where we've had deaths or catastrophic injuries.
00:57:32.719 --> 00:57:46.800
We've had to tell our clients that we love dearly that there's nothing to get, unfortunately, or it's only$30,000 for your the loss of your loved one, or the or you know, uh, there's only$50,000 or whatever it is.
00:57:47.039 --> 00:57:48.960
What about what about if there's a potential third party?
00:57:49.039 --> 00:57:58.559
Like, so let's just say sure, I get hit by a guy who's uninsured, um, and something really bad happens to me or my family member, god forbid.
00:57:59.039 --> 00:58:09.119
And now, you know, by all by the appearance of it, it's like, well, you don't have a case, this guy didn't have insurance, and now you're you're up a creek.
00:58:09.280 --> 00:58:16.960
But there are situations where there are third parties who can be liable, or there can be a third party to bring into the legal process where there is something to recover.
00:58:17.119 --> 00:58:17.840
Talk to me about that.
00:58:18.000 --> 00:58:20.239
And and and like, do you guys ever deal with that?
00:58:20.320 --> 00:58:22.559
Is that something you're I'm glad you brought that up?
00:58:22.719 --> 00:58:30.000
So that kind of ties back into what we talked about earlier about the energy and thoroughness we put into our cases.
00:58:30.159 --> 00:58:34.239
I think most law firms would do exactly what you're describing initially.
00:58:34.400 --> 00:58:37.119
They would look at it and go, there's not a case here.
00:58:37.280 --> 00:58:40.159
You know, like this driver's uninsured.
00:58:40.320 --> 00:58:49.519
We've now have the crash report, we've talked to the insurance company, they've sent us a letter saying there's no coverage, and they'll drop the case without putting that extra effort in.
00:58:50.159 --> 00:58:54.960
I I would never do that just because I that's just not how I'm wired.
00:58:55.119 --> 00:59:00.239
So I'm immediately looking at that in every case, even if there is insurance, I'm looking at that.
00:59:00.400 --> 00:59:05.360
You know, so some examples would be there's a bad crash.
00:59:05.519 --> 00:59:14.719
I had a case just like this, where uh, you know, a drunk driver hits my client from behind, they only have a$30,000 policy, right?
00:59:14.800 --> 00:59:16.559
Well, where are they coming from?
00:59:17.199 --> 00:59:18.800
Where did they get the alcohol?
00:59:19.199 --> 00:59:20.960
Like why were they overserved?
00:59:21.280 --> 00:59:24.400
Is there a bar that potentially has responsibility for that?
00:59:24.559 --> 00:59:28.559
Do they have a commercial policy that's a million dollars or more, right?
00:59:29.199 --> 00:59:35.039
Uh another situation is someone gets in a bad crash, there's a minimal policy.
00:59:35.280 --> 00:59:38.239
Maybe there's a crashworthiness issue with their vehicle.
00:59:38.400 --> 00:59:43.679
Maybe the airbags didn't deploy, maybe the crumple zones didn't operate properly.
00:59:43.920 --> 00:59:53.920
And if if that had some significant impact on the severity of the injuries that they sustained, there's a potentially a case against.
00:59:54.480 --> 00:59:59.119
Sorry for also Xing out other sponsors, Ford, Chevrolet.
00:59:59.440 --> 00:59:59.679
Yeah.
00:59:59.840 --> 01:00:01.920
You know, who went anyways.
01:00:02.159 --> 01:00:02.400
Yeah.
01:00:02.559 --> 01:00:15.039
I mean, so there are ways to approach cases if you're creative and a hard worker, to potentially, not always, potentially find other sources of of recovery.
01:00:15.119 --> 01:00:16.480
And that's what that's what we do.
01:00:16.719 --> 01:00:29.119
So it sounds like to me, like if I'm in an accident, um where like there's some ambiguity around the liability or the insurance or whatever, which I would imagine is every accident, especially early on, right?
01:00:29.360 --> 01:00:35.920
Uh, that like I really want to make sure I'm hiring somebody who's like not gonna treat me like a number, right?
01:00:36.079 --> 01:00:38.800
Who's gonna sit there and say, all right, we're gonna exhaust this.
01:00:38.960 --> 01:00:46.960
We're gonna exhaust this to see what the value of this case could be, especially when the damages warrant that sort of investigation.
01:00:47.360 --> 01:01:00.880
Yeah, do you think these firms that have thousands of cases and a hundred or more employees that they've got to pay on the payroll every month and uh millions of dollars in advertising every month?
01:01:01.039 --> 01:01:04.480
Do you think they have the time to thoroughly investigate a case?
01:01:04.639 --> 01:01:06.719
I'll leave you to your own conclusion on that.
01:01:09.440 --> 01:01:10.559
I mean, I know the answer to that.
01:01:10.880 --> 01:01:14.079
Yeah, I mean, I mean anybody listening would know the answer, right?
01:01:14.239 --> 01:01:16.159
I mean, like they're gonna charge the bigger.
01:01:17.440 --> 01:01:26.559
Certainly not to the the to the degree the law firm that says, hey, we are going to we're gonna be selective on the cases we take and we're gonna take cases.
01:01:26.719 --> 01:01:29.519
Yeah, the cases we do take, we are going to exhaust.
01:01:29.760 --> 01:01:33.679
Yeah, here's here's here's the fundamental rule at at my law firm.
01:01:34.559 --> 01:01:39.280
And and if you ask anybody, they'll repeat this because I it's my mantra.
01:01:39.360 --> 01:01:41.039
I talk about it over and over again.
01:01:41.280 --> 01:01:46.159
We don't we don't take any case that we can't bring value to.
01:01:47.039 --> 01:01:47.920
Full stop.
01:01:48.960 --> 01:02:06.960
So we're not signing up people like a big law firm might because they meet certain minimum criteria and they're just trying to squeeze cases to get a little bit of money for themselves so they can then turn that money into advertising for the next case they get and then just keep rolling it, right?
01:02:07.199 --> 01:02:09.519
That's that's a lot of firms are built that way.
01:02:09.840 --> 01:02:10.639
We don't do that.
01:02:10.880 --> 01:02:11.199
Facts.
01:02:11.360 --> 01:02:12.639
We don't, we do not do that.
01:02:12.719 --> 01:02:16.000
We do, and maybe to our own detriment, but I will die on that hill.
01:02:16.159 --> 01:02:17.360
We do not do that.
01:02:17.599 --> 01:02:27.280
If somebody calls our law firm and they have a case, we spend time, a lot of time dealing with talking to them, learning the intricacies of their situation.
01:02:27.599 --> 01:02:38.480
And if we believe that that the the injuries or the damages don't warrant attorney representation, we will tell them you don't need a lawyer.
01:02:38.719 --> 01:02:39.920
And here's what else we'll do.
01:02:40.000 --> 01:02:42.480
We'll also spend 30 minutes or more on the phone.
01:02:42.559 --> 01:02:52.480
I've done this so many times in my career, I can't tell you, painting or drawing a roadmap for them, saying, this is what you should do to get maximum value for your case.
01:02:52.559 --> 01:02:58.400
But I'm telling you, if you hired me, you'd just be paying me to do what you can already do.
01:02:58.719 --> 01:03:10.400
And so I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing that I just basically commoditized you and brought you in, ran you through, and took my fee, and then you ended up worse off in the end.
01:03:10.719 --> 01:03:11.920
And you can't do that.
01:03:12.159 --> 01:03:22.480
And so what's happened from that, and you I think you are aware of this, is some of the best reviews and referrals we've ever gotten as a firm are from people we never represented.
01:03:22.800 --> 01:03:23.760
You stole my thunder, dude.
01:03:23.840 --> 01:03:25.599
We never represented 100%, dude.
01:03:25.760 --> 01:03:36.559
And if there's so like, you know, there's a lot of uh there's a lot of things you can say, like we care about our clients, and we fight to the we fight to get the best settlement.
01:03:36.960 --> 01:03:38.239
And a lot of people can say that.
01:03:38.320 --> 01:03:48.719
I'll tell you something that has again, I'm somebody I've worked for with hundreds of law firms throughout the country, uh, you know, and we help them on we help our clients on intake, we help them on their Legion, all this other stuff.
01:03:48.880 --> 01:03:52.960
I'll tell you something that always speaks volumes to me.
01:03:53.199 --> 01:03:58.400
It's when lawyers are willing to spend time on someone who they know can't personally benefit them.
01:03:58.639 --> 01:04:00.400
And I think it's such a good practice.
01:04:00.559 --> 01:04:05.280
I love that you do it for the obvious reasons is hey, people will leave a great review.
01:04:05.440 --> 01:04:18.159
But it's just um it speaks to what the essence of the of your job and your calling is, which is I have legal knowledge and I have a bar license that I can use to extract justice from my clients.
01:04:18.320 --> 01:04:23.440
And even when I can't do that, I'm still gonna show that same commitment to like how they can benefit themselves.
01:04:23.519 --> 01:04:28.320
And I've seen you do it, I've listened to some of the calls we've done, and I'm like, hey man, like like uh this is great.
01:04:28.400 --> 01:04:30.239
And and we've seen those turn into reviews.
01:04:30.400 --> 01:04:38.800
I think it's something it speaks a lot about the integrity you have as an attorney because a lot of attorneys will not a lot of attorneys will not do that.
01:04:39.119 --> 01:04:41.519
To me, it's about respect.
01:04:41.760 --> 01:04:46.079
So it's about like you have to fundamentally, I have fundamental respect for to me.
01:04:46.159 --> 01:04:50.719
I think I think there's two schools of thought like respect is earned or respect is lost.
01:04:50.880 --> 01:04:52.639
I'm a respect is lost person.
01:04:53.199 --> 01:04:54.480
Like I'm gonna respect you.
01:04:54.800 --> 01:04:56.639
Actually, know that as a fact about you.
01:04:56.719 --> 01:04:58.159
You are 100% like that.
01:04:58.480 --> 01:05:01.199
I'm gonna respect you until you prove that I shouldn't.
01:05:01.440 --> 01:05:12.000
And so anybody who calls me who has a question, has an issue, I'm gonna show them the same respect that I'd want someone to show me or my kids or anyone that I care about.
01:05:12.159 --> 01:05:16.639
And that's just fundamental to who I am and the way I'm gonna conduct business.
01:05:17.599 --> 01:05:20.079
Last question, because I know we're running up on time.
01:05:20.880 --> 01:05:31.599
In this, in this, this, this big outcome that you got, and again, you know, like one of the things I when I when I started this podcast and I thought, like, what's my the world doesn't need another podcast.
01:05:31.679 --> 01:05:34.079
Like, why do I why start this podcast?
01:05:34.239 --> 01:05:44.480
Is I thought to myself, well, okay, look, this this podcast is not really about it's not about like trying to be a popular podcast, it's about exploring things that are interesting to me.
01:05:44.559 --> 01:05:50.000
And I think there are people who are interested in this, and what's interesting to me is extraordinary outcomes, right?
01:05:50.079 --> 01:05:50.480
Yeah.
01:05:50.719 --> 01:05:51.840
I think we can both agree.
01:05:52.000 --> 01:06:02.800
And for anyone who's not in this industry, they can I can tell you, as a matter of fact, that getting a$42 million outcome for a client in a personal injury, uh Situation is an extraordinary outcome.
01:06:03.039 --> 01:06:13.199
And I think all the things you talked about, um, about your background, the chip on your shoulder, all of these things, they all contributed to like that, you being able to get that outcome.
01:06:13.760 --> 01:06:20.159
Um, and there's and I think you'd also agree, there's a lot of great trial lawyers out there who get great outcomes all the time for their clients.
01:06:20.480 --> 01:06:26.079
My question for you is on this particular case, what do you think you did?
01:06:26.800 --> 01:06:38.400
That I wouldn't maybe I wouldn't go as far as say no other lawyer would do, but that was unique that that was unique to Trent Kelly, that made you uniquely equipped for the moment that helped you contribute to that outcome.
01:06:38.639 --> 01:06:39.119
Yeah.
01:06:39.360 --> 01:06:44.079
I I think I I've I've been doing a lot of thinking about that, honestly.
01:06:44.320 --> 01:06:51.519
Um it's obviously a few things, but the thing that comes to mind first is I listen to my clients.
01:06:53.199 --> 01:06:58.559
I think that's something that lawyers don't do a lot that is unfortunate.
01:06:58.800 --> 01:07:01.599
But like I really listened to my clients.
01:07:01.840 --> 01:07:10.320
I listened to what they were going through and how they had been harmed and what this loss meant to them and how it changed their lives.
01:07:10.480 --> 01:07:16.239
And I stayed in contact with them all the time, talking about how how's this week?
01:07:16.320 --> 01:07:17.119
How's yesterday?
01:07:17.280 --> 01:07:18.159
How are you doing today?
01:07:18.239 --> 01:07:19.599
You know, like what's going on.
01:07:19.840 --> 01:07:38.480
And so I think the bond that I had with them really um lit a fire under my desire to get this outcome for them, you know, that that I truly was kind of living with them and what they were in the pain that they had, that they were carrying and they still carry.
01:07:38.800 --> 01:07:44.159
I think that's that's part of it, is that I I made it personal, which is hard for me not to do.
01:07:44.400 --> 01:07:55.199
Um, but I think the other part of it is I know if I know anything, I know that I don't know everything.
01:07:55.679 --> 01:08:08.159
And I kept, and with this case, and I and I do believe it had a huge impact on the on the outcome, but I try to do this with every case too, is I never decided on this is how I'm gonna do this.
01:08:08.320 --> 01:08:14.880
I was like, I'm gonna decide every day how I'm gonna do this based on what evidence do I have today?
01:08:14.960 --> 01:08:16.479
What has this expert told me?
01:08:16.640 --> 01:08:21.039
Like it's it's an ever-evolving narrative, I guess.
01:08:21.199 --> 01:08:40.479
It's an error ever-evolving theme of how do I present this so that the defense attorney and the insurance companies truly understand what their, because this is the only language insurance companies speak, what their risk is in this case.
01:08:41.359 --> 01:09:10.159
Um, and so it was about using my judgment, I think, more than anything in those situations to say, you know, based on what I've, this new piece of evidence, I think I'm gonna go this direction with this case because I I I think that the best outcome for my clients rests in focusing on something that could be a really bad day for an insurance company at trial.
01:09:10.319 --> 01:09:13.439
Okay, so I let me give some color to that.
01:09:14.239 --> 01:09:16.960
Um, you know, we were we looked at this case.
01:09:17.039 --> 01:09:23.680
There's lots of crash video and stuff that came from body cam from responding officers, which was very helpful.
01:09:24.000 --> 01:09:27.439
Um, but there were some some question marks that we didn't know.
01:09:27.520 --> 01:09:36.960
And so part of the process in working this case up was trying to fill in as many blanks as we can because, you know, there's sometimes things you don't know may have a drastic impact on a case.
01:09:37.359 --> 01:09:52.319
And so we discovered in this case that this particular driver who was driving this company vehicle and had been entrusted with driving it for years had a horrible driving record.
01:09:53.279 --> 01:10:00.479
And the company, because they didn't follow proper safety practices, didn't even know.
01:10:01.680 --> 01:10:14.560
Like, you know, their safety officer would tell you they had no idea that he had been ticketed multiple times in the past for excessive speeding, in, you know, in excess of 20% of the speed limit.
01:10:14.640 --> 01:10:19.520
So this guy's getting ticketed going 80 miles an hour in a in a 55 or whatever it was.
01:10:19.600 --> 01:10:36.319
You know, it's like these warning signs, you know, that's kind of the theme of the case that I presented is from the defense perspective, you had this opportunity for this not to happen and you disregarded it.
01:10:36.560 --> 01:10:38.079
You had this opportunity.
01:10:38.239 --> 01:10:51.119
This there were 50 opportunities that were laid at your feet that an ordinary prudent person, which is this, you know, basically the standard, would have recognized as like this is this is gonna lead to a bad outcome.
01:10:51.199 --> 01:10:53.600
This something bad's gonna happen to somebody.
01:10:54.000 --> 01:10:56.000
And they ignored it.
01:10:56.239 --> 01:11:00.800
And the ultimate result of that was the loss that my clients suffered.
01:11:01.039 --> 01:11:20.079
And so I just I refused to not make sure that they knew that I was going to find and exploit every opportunity they had to keep my my clients with their dad and and husband for the rest of their lives.
01:11:20.319 --> 01:11:31.359
And that they basically said, we don't care as much about that as we care about our bottom line or doing things this way because it's easier.
01:11:32.239 --> 01:11:48.399
And in and then doing that, they they led to this catastrophic outcome for this family that was 100% avoidable had they simply opened their eyes and looked around and said, Oh, this is probably not good.
01:11:48.640 --> 01:11:52.399
We should probably re-reevaluate this and do this a different way.
01:11:52.640 --> 01:12:07.359
Um, so I I believe that the fact that we were were so thorough in the way that we approached the case, that we that that we were connected with our clients and that we were listening to them and communicating with them all the time.
01:12:07.760 --> 01:12:45.359
And that we just used our judgment and our instincts on which trails to follow, because you can't follow all trails at the same time, led to just an amazing result for my clients, not for not for the defendant, but and a result that that we're proud of, that that our clients feel some they feel some sense of justice, even though, like we said, they can't their loved one can't ever be returned to them, but that they feel like that the the outcome is is somewhere in in whatever way possible measurable to the loss.
01:12:47.039 --> 01:12:47.840
Great answer.
01:12:48.000 --> 01:12:51.359
Well, hey man, I really appreciate you being on the on the podcast.
01:12:51.600 --> 01:12:52.640
I love thank you for having me.
01:12:52.800 --> 01:12:53.439
Yeah, it's been great.
01:12:53.680 --> 01:12:54.319
Yeah, fantastic.
01:12:54.399 --> 01:12:54.960
All right, thanks.
01:12:55.119 --> 01:12:55.520
Yeah.