Transcript:
Gina Gemberling: [00:00:01] I think it’s really important to look at the organization as a whole, look at the talent that you have within, see what you can do with that talent, find the strength of your individuals that are with you and have years invested with your organization and how you could rearrange just to make things a little bit more seamless.
Adam Stoker: [00:00:20] Hello, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the Destination Marketing Podcast. We are in our first episode of a several-part series here. We have taken the show on the road to Arkansas. Really, really excited to be here. Our first stop is here in Little Rock, Arkansas. We are with our friend Gina Gemberling. She's the president and CEO of Little Rock. We are really excited to chat with you, Gina. Thank you for joining us.
Gina Gemberling: [00:00:49] Well, we're glad you're here and you made the capital city your first stop in Arkansas.
Adam Stoker: [00:00:53] We did. I tell you, we just got done with an amazing lunch at the Clinton Presidential Library. Is it Table 42? Is that the name of the restaurant?
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:02] Correct. Table 42.
Adam Stoker: [00:01:03] Oh, man. Between the food and the dessert, I don't know how we're still eyes open having this conversation.
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:11] I agree. For those three desserts, you have to test each one for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:01:15] Well, we're already getting a glimpse of the southern hospitality here in Arkansas and really appreciate you hosting us.
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:22] Well, thanks again for coming.
Adam Stoker: [00:01:23] Absolutely.
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:24] Yeah.
Adam Stones: [00:01:25] Well, let's dive in. We've got a couple of questions we like to ask everybody at the beginning of each show. I know you've been struggling to come up with an answer for this one. But I'm going to ask you anyway. I want to see what you came up with. What is your dream destination, Gina? If you could go anywhere in the world, where would it be?
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:41] Dream destination? Well, that's tough for me. I'm one of those workaholics. I'm one that when you take a vacation, it's harder to get back into the swing of things so I take very few vacations. But for me, it's just putting me on a beach. Sit me on a beach with a cold, frosty beverage in my hand and all is good.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:02] Important question on that then. On this beach, do we have phone service or do we not have phone service?
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:07] No, we do have phone service. We have to have phone service.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:13] You want a beach, but you want a beach that you can still be
reached at.
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:14] Exactly. With good internet as well for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:18] I like it. Okay. A beach anywhere. Why the beach? Why is that a place where you feel drawn?
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:25] I think just being from the Midwest all of my life and born and raised in the Midwest. Anytime we can see the ocean, it's always a little special, and it has to be that ocean breeze, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:37] I like it. Okay. What about a trip that you went on, whether it was as a kid or as an adult, that really stands out as a core memory for you?
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:46] I'd have to say growing up, our family had a lake house in southeast Missouri, like Wappapello had been in the family for about 70 years now. We spent our summers growing up there at the lake and at the lake house. Friends and family would come in and visit us throughout the summer. Our family still meets there currently on a regular basis. It's been a special place since I was for as long as I can remember.
Adam Stoker: [00:03:11] What makes it special? I know it's been in the family for 70 years. What activities did you do there? What memories did you make there?
Gina Gemberling: [00:3:18] We were out water skiing and tubing every day. I learned how to ski when I was five. I was swallowing by the age of nine or ten. I cannot say I've skied for several years now. But I'm past that time of my life. But we did all the water recreation all summer long.
Adam Stoker: [00:03:36] Well, I can tell that is a special place for you because I'm foreshadowing a little bit here. But you shared with us that played a part in you choosing Little Rock as a place to land. Maybe what I'd love to have you do is give us a little bit of your background and what led you here to Little Rock.
Gina Gemberling: [00:03:53] Okay, sure. Well, this might take a while. I've spent many years in the hospitality industry. I started spending about three or four years in the hotel industry and sales. Went to work for the Springfield, Illinois Convention and Visitors Bureau in late 1993 as an entry-level salesperson. Did a lot of their lead generation, worked my way up through that organization, spent some time as senior sales, director of sales, spent some time in the servicing realm, and also over both the sales and marketing department. I was there for 24 years. My last I’d say four years, I believe. I did live there. I was the leader of that organization as director of the Springfield Illinois Convention and Business Bureau.
Adam Stoker: [00:04:35] Really saw every job and role within the organization by the time you left, didn't you?
Gina Gemberling: [00:04:41] Exactly. Knew where all the bodies were buried, per see. Making a jump at that point in my career, after 24 years at one organization, a lot of thought went into that decision to make a move. At that point in my career, I just thought, if you're ever going to do it, now is the time to do it. I saw the posting here in Little Rock for the vice president of sales and services. I came on board in January of ‘18 in that role. We had about 15 members of that department. Just to put some comparisons to it, my budget here and just the sales role at the Little Rock convention and visitors bureau was about the same. If not, a little bit larger budget than the whole budget of my past destination.
Adam Stoker: [00:05:29] A little more flexibility in this role to be able to execute on some of the things that you want to because there's obviously more budget to play with.
Gina Gemberling: [00:05:36] Correct, correct. Then during COVID, we did a little bit of reorganization. Gretchen Hall, who was our CEO at the time, merged the sales and marketing divisions. Since I had a background in both, I was promoted to senior VP of both sales and marketing. Then as most people in our industry know, it was in late January that Gretchen sprung the news on us that she was moving on to Destinations International. At that time, I assume the role of president and CEO here at the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau.
Adam Stoker: [00:06:06] Yeah. I'm excited to reconnect with Gretchen because she was one of our early interviewees here on the show and really enjoyed getting to know her and excited for her to be at DI. The good news is that it paved the way for you to take the next step and be the CEO of this organization so kind of a win-win for the two of you.
Gina Gemberling: [00:06:24] Well, I guess I still don't know if it was a win on my side. But in the long run, I guess it is. Part of my reasoning decision process of moving to Little Rock was working for Gretchen as CEO. Just going through the interview process with her and learning more about the organization, the funding sources here, just everything that the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau has to offer that's a little bit different than most standard convention and visitors bureaus.
Adam Stoker: [00:06:51] Yeah, I'm excited to get into that today because I know there is a lot of uniqueness here in the way that the Little Rock CVB is run and funded and operated so it will be an interesting discussion. Before we do, a good friend of mine actually works at Springfield, Illinois, and he's a shared acquaintance of the two of us. I know Scott listens to the show. I've got to tell him hi. I know that you guys were able to work together for a while. What was it like to work with Scott?
Gina Gemberling: [00:07:21] We worked together. He was part of our hotel community early on in my days at Springfield Convention and Visitors Bureau. Then he worked for Illinois Hotel Lodging Association. We always had a close partnership, always respected Scott and had a good relationship with him for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:07:37] Great, great. Well, Scott, if you're listening, it's good to hear your connections out there on the show. But coming back to this, Gina, one of the things that I would like to do before we maybe dive into the unique things you're working on here in Little Rock, give us the overview of little rock as a destination, what makes it special, what makes it unique. Obviously, you get a lot of visitors here. Tourism is really important to this community. Why do people choose Little Rock as their destination?
Gina Gemberling: [00:08:07] You can tell just by walking in our downtown area that the city itself cares a lot about tourism. Just in the infrastructure that's along our riverfront from our Statehouse Convention Center, that's attached to the Marriott Hotel and then Corners on one end. Then we have the Robinson Center, which is our performing arts center with meeting space, and a conference center on the back, which is connected to our DoubleTree Hotel. Just that infrastructure alone along and it is right along the Riverfront Park, which is scenic right along the Arkansas River. That Markham Street takes you right into President Clinton Avenue which takes you through our entertainment district and straight down into the Clinton Library.
Adam Gemberling: [00:08:46] Great. As a destination, you're deciding between Little Rock and several other probably, I don't know, middle-of-the-country destinations that you would go to or Midwest destinations, what is it that you feel like is the difference maker for people to choose Little Rock?
Gina Gemberling: [00:09:05] Little Rock sitting right on the Arkansas River. We have a great downtown area. Everything is just walkable from our entertainment district to our sites and attractions. The President Clinton Library is also right in our downtown area. But one thing that really makes us, I think, unique is our cycling and our outdoor recreation is right within our urban core. You can jump on the Arkansas Trail right in our downtown area that will take you right out to the beautiful parts of Little Rock. You're right, it's still in the middle of the city.
Adam Stoker: [00:09:38] Yeah. I saw that this morning. For those listening, we actually had the opportunity to take a little tour of Little Rock today and some of the unique parts of Little Rock. That same trail that you're talking about goes all the way out to a park we drove out to just outside of town. It's amazing that this interconnected trail system is there and gives so much flexibility for travelers if they want to walk, if they want a bike, and not have to worry about safety in a lot of the trails that they're on because cars are nowhere near them in some of these cases.
Gina Gemberling: [00:10:10] Correct. Just in our downtown area alone, we have three bridges that are pedestrian bridges. Then I believe this morning, you're fortunate to go out to our big damn bridge, which is over a mile long. It's the largest, longest pedestrian bridge in the United States.
Adam Stoker: [00:10:25] Amazing. Yeah. The bridges actually, as Colby and I. Colby is my business partner. For those listening, he goes on a lot of these trips with me as we drove through the bridges were some of the most fascinating parts for us. They are very ornate, very unique, and also very different from each other. Each bridge is a fingerprint almost, where it's really unique. I thought that was an interesting asset from a tourism perspective.
Gina Gemberling: [00:10:51] Correct. Another note is that here at the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureaus, we wear several hats in the community. One of those is the lighting of the bridges. We are in control of the colors that are on the bridge. Doc, our senior engineer here at the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau, you say, Doc, I want those bridges green or your favorite color, and he can change them just right from his iPhone.
Adam Stoker: [00:11:15] Bliss, who took us around this morning, shared an amazing story that just before the Russian invasion of Ukraine, she had some members of dignitaries or something like that from Ukraine here visiting. You guys actually had them in a meeting room and lit up the bridge with the Ukrainian flag colors. She said she got an emotional reaction even from some of the attendees with their patriotism and pride for their country to see that lit up on the bridge in Arkansas. What an amazing opportunity for you guys to build one more touchpoint, one more connection with whatever group or travelers coming in to light up a bridge like that. That is such a unique asset.
Gina Gemberling: [00:12:04] It is. Our national regional conventions, when we let them pick their color or their association's colors and their branding, and we can change those downtown bridges, really makes those conventions and those convention attendees feel special, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:12:21] Well, let’s talk a little bit about what makes your organization here in Little Rock really unique. One of the things that you told me is how you operate so many of the assets. You don't outsource that to management groups or other organizations. But your convention center and the amphitheater that you have here and so much more. You guys operate on your own. Tell me, first of all, how did that come about, and then what's it like to have 100 employees and to operate all of these venues?
Gina Gemberling: [00:12:53] I'll go back to, I think I was six months into my position here in Little Rock. I remember Gretchen Hall at the time, she wanted to know how I was feeling about things and sent over a list of questions. One of them was, what's your biggest surprise about the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau? My response back to her is, I had no idea when I came here what a powerhouse our organization really is in the destination. I go back to that every day. We do manage the Statehouse Convention Center, which is about 220,000 square feet of space. We also manage the Robinson Center, which is a performing arts center. That's where our Broadway shows and most of that type of entertainment take place in downtown Little Rock, as well as it has a conference center on the back.
We also manage the Amphitheater, which is an outdoor theater that overlooks the Arkansas River, as well as Ottenheimer Hall, which is a food hall in the River Market district. In addition to that, we also manage several of the parking garages in the downtown area. We do that. Several of those, we do for the city of Little Rock. That is also all those little pieces that put together a convention package. Of course, as I mentioned earlier, I grew up in the sales world. Conventions and meetings in the sales side are always near and dear to my heart. But it really helps to put those packages together that we do have control over all those facilities.
Adam Stoker: [00:14:18] Yeah, that was one of the fascinating things when you told me that you operate all of these different assets, is you are now controlling so much more of the visitor experience, and any time you hand off. From one organization to another, you always have that fear of like, are they going to deliver on our expectations? I think a lot of destinations do a great job of training their hospitality staff and making sure that the experience is as seamless as possible. But I think it’s unavoidable that you're going to have some difficulties in those hand-offs. With you being able to operate the entire experience chain for these events that come in, I think it is something that's a differentiator. It probably makes a big difference in the visitor experience. Would you agree with that?
Gina Gemberling: [00:15:05] Most definitely. In our convention sales and service team, they are based here at our Cromwell Building, which is our administrative building here in downtown Little Rock. But also, our event operations team is on the same floor. They are able to work. They work hand in hand on all of our conventions and meetings coming in that are using any of our facilities and our hotels.
Adam Stoker: [00:15:26] Great, great. Now, it is wonderful in theory the idea of being able to control that and manage that all on your own or as an organization. But of course, everybody in the country right now is struggling with the labor market and it's no different for you. It's been difficult for you guys to find employees. Tell me how you as an organization are combating that issue of the labor market and the difficulty to find good people to be within your organization.
Gina Gemberling: [00:15:57] Of course, during COVID, unfortunately, many of our frontline service workers were the ones that were the first to be furloughed during the COVID Pandemic, obviously because our buildings were dark, they were empty. That has been one of our biggest difficulties coming back. I always say tourism came back with a vengeance. Our buildings have been busy all year and very busy. Our staff, our hearts and our thank you’s go out to all of them for keeping the buildings running on fewer people as we are still trying to recoup all of those employees and bring employees back and get us to the staffing levels we need to.
Earlier this year, about a couple of months ago, we did create a new position under our marketing team. It is a director of community engagement. Part of that position will be working with the workforce and helping us identify different workforce and other areas where we can attract more potential employees.
Adam Stoker: [00:16:54] Yeah. You told me about a study that you had done that also really helped. Do you mind sharing a little bit about that study and what the outcome of it was?
Gina Gemberling: [00:17:02] Sure. One thing that will set the tone and let you know a little bit more about the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau is about every three to five years, we go through a full salary compensation study. It's not just our team calling around other convention and visitors bureaus to find out their salary ranges and that thing. We actually hire an outside firm. They look at every position in our organization. They make sure the grade class codes are correct. They make sure there exempt versus non-exempt and where they should fit, as well as looking at those salary levels and make sure we're competitive in the marketplace to bring employees and that we are offering the benefits that we should attract the type of employees we want to represent Little Rock. We just completed that study.
We announced it to our employees last week. It's a tough exercise because you have to look at the whole organization. You look at the actual positions, not the individuals. It was interesting to go through. This is my first year going through that exercise. In the long run, I do think it makes us a stronger organization and is a big benefit to our employees.
Adam Stoker: [00:18:10] It's really interesting to me what you did. I want to talk about the nuts and bolts of it so those listening might be able to try to duplicate that effort in their destination. First of all, you had to go out to RFP to find a partner to help you do this study, is that right?
Gina Gemberling: [00:18:26] Correct. We went out to RFP middle of last year. We did start this process probably fall of last year. It's taken a while. It's a lengthy process. But I think, in the long run, it is well worth our time and energy for sure. The third-party looked at everything as far as, I mentioned earlier, each individual position, some, look at it from a local or regional area. When it comes to a lot of our sales and marketing folks or our executive team, they actually look rely a lot on destinations international and the International Association of Venue Managers for their compensation studies and what is happening around the whole United States to make sure we are attracting quality employees for our organization.
Adam Stoker: [00:19:10] At the end of that process, this third-party organization that you hired, basically gave you for these positions, this is what the salary should be if you want to be competitive as an organization.
Gina Gemberling: [00:19:21] Exactly.
Adam Stoker: [00:19:22] Once they did that, did you then take that study and say, okay, we're just going to follow these findings? Or did you have any rebuttal or was it like meeting in the middle? Then how did you actually roll that out and communicate it to your team?
Gina Gemberling: [00:19:37] We did go back and forth a little bit on some different positions. Possibly the job description did not portray everything that that position did. There were some we had to go back and forth on, as well as positions non-exempt versus exempt. The process was several months. But we did complete it. We rolled it out to our team last week. Everyone received anyone that had any change in pay grade, or change in their salary structure, they all received a letter from our organization.
Adam Stoker: [00:20:08] It's great. Most employees were pretty happy with this study.
Gina Gemberling: [00:20:12] I think so. I think so. Unfortunately, you cannot make everyone happy unfortunately. But for the most part, a lot of it touched our people working in our buildings, our frontline service staff. Knowing that Amazon locally is hiring anywhere from $17 to $20 an hour, we knew we needed to be more competitive in that market in that area. I think we were able to with our other benefit packages and everything else that we offer, I think we offer a nice place to work, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:20:44] Any advice for other destinations thinking about doing something like this?
Gina Gemberling: [00:20:48] I'd be welcome to take any calls. Feel free to contact me directly. I will even share with you our RFP, as well as our proposal and why we ended up choosing the company we chose.
Adam Stoker: [00:21:01] Great, great. Let's shift gears a little bit. One of the things that are happening in the industry right now is there's so much movement of people going from one destination to another, from one job to another. Most of the time when they're making these changes, they have big shoes to fill. For you, when you came in and Gretchen decided to go to Destinations International, you then, of course, had some big shoes to fill. What advice would you give to people that have made a move and are trying to make their way in a new role and make sure that they are learning from what was done before, but also balance that with what you see that needs to be done and make sure that you're as good as possible in your new role?
Gina Gemberling: [00:21:46] Gretchen's announcement to us in late January was definitely a surprise to all. When I came to Little Rock, this is not what I expected, nor was it what I was seeking to do, quite honestly. But she and I have a great relationship. Going through, we had a couple of months during the transition time. I'm fortunate that she still is here in Little Rock and we remain dear friends and are able to she's always here for me to bounce things off of. But looking back to our transition months, she made it well-known to me that this is your ship now. You run this ship the way you see fit. There are going to be some things that you want to change. She said it's not going to hurt my feelings. It's always good to try new things and to look at things in a different way.
The hardest thing for me, I believe in this position right now is just getting to know a lot of the players locally. Gretchen was from Little Rock. She was born and bred here so she knew a lot of the players and spent eleven years in that CEO role here after she had been with the organization ten years prior to that. That is probably my biggest challenge at this point.
Adam Stoker: [00:22:53] Yeah.
Gina Gemberling: [00:22:53] Yeah.
Adam Stoker: [00:22:54] Then advice for people that are going through the same thing, what would you suggest as far as approach maybe before you enter the role and from a research perspective or whatever, and then how to balance the perception of the past with the view of the future?
Gina Gemberling: [00:23:12] I will go back to when I came on board as the VP of Sales and Service. I think it’s really important to look at the organization as a whole, look at the talent that you have within, see what you can do with that talent, and find the strengths of your individuals that are with you and have spent some years invested with your organization and how you could rearrange just make things a little bit more seamless. At the same time, I think it's important just to take your time, not rush into any decisions. I've spent the last few months really reviewing different titles within the organization and how we can make things better.
Adam Stoker: [00:23:48] I like it. I'm going to shift gears again. I guess we'll do that a lot today. But Little Rock has such a unique name in my mind and it provides the opportunity for some real recognizable marketing strategies and copy. We're sitting here in this conference room. I'm seeing your marketing campaign all over the walls here. I'm going to quote one of them here. If you're big on local art, you're big on Little Rock. Then another one says, if you're big on history, you're big on Little Rock. It's got the picture of the Central High School that's such an icon in American history. You've got this campaign. If you're big on this, then you're big on Little Rock. Tell me about the opportunities that come from having a name like Little Rock and allows you to play off of that and have a clever campaign like this. What do you do to market Little Rock?
Gina Gemberling: [00:24:49] This campaign, Big on Little Rock actually was first launched in the ‘80s. It was not only an outward marketing campaign, but it was also a feel-good pride in the community amongst locals at that time. About two years ago, right before pre-pandemic, actually, I want to say it was about a week or two before the pandemic hit that we did bring Big on Little Rock back. After many discovery sessions and conversations with our local community, and our advertising agencies, we felt there were lags there and it was a good time to bring it back. We're going through a little bit of a transition with it right now. That will be announced here in the next couple of weeks and showcased in the next couple of weeks. But we are definitely going to stay Big on Little Rock.
Adam Stoker: [00:25:31] Nice. It's interesting because I had asked you the question before of how do you know what to change. How do you know what not to change when you're coming into a new role? You obviously came in as this campaign had been prepared and developed. You elected to stay with the Big on Little Rock campaign. I like that because it's not, I just want to do my own thing, or I want to have my own thing. I feel like you saw the assets that were valuable and continued with those assets. Tell me a little bit about, like, as you evaluated that campaign when you came in, what made you decide to say, yeah, let's continue with that and make it a key part of where we go from here?
Gina Gemberling: [00:26:09] Well, back to a couple of years ago when we launched a campaign, I was part of that decision process, so I already had a little buy-in for sure. Big on Little Rock was my boat a couple of years ago when we did make the switch from Life is Better with a Southern Accent. But I do believe in consistency. We had only a couple of years of Big on Little Rock that we had actually out in the market that I believe you need the consistency and the consistent messaging and branding.
Adam Stoker: [00:26:36] Great. What do you feel like you're the proudest of the work that you've done here in your organization?
Gina Gemberling: [00:26:43] What I feel I'm most proud of is the sales and marketing efforts and a little bit more of the focus that I bring with my sales and marketing background. Of course, as I mentioned earlier, we are a powerhouse in our destination. Those buildings we manage and operate, of course, are a huge piece of the puzzle. But also, our sales and marketing focus in our sales and marketing efforts. I believe what I can bring to the table is my background in sales and marketing.
Adam Stoker: [00:27:10] I like it. Well, one of the things that Bliss mentioned to us today on our tour is that meetings are back with a vengeance, right? You're getting a lot of calls and bookings. But she said the distance between the booking and the actual event is much shorter. People are booking pretty close to right before the event. To me, that almost says, thank goodness we control the entire experience chain if people are asking us to plan these events in a very short period of time.
Gina Gemberling: [00:27:39] Exactly. We work so closely with our Marriott Hotel that's connected with the Statehouse Convention Center and our DoubleTree connected to the Robinson Center. We are all within our staff meet at least once or twice a week, just our internal teams together. We are just one voice out there. It makes it easier when these groups are booking such short term that we already have those communications put in place.
Adam Stoker: [00:28:01] Great. Well, Gina, this has been amazing. As I said, I really appreciate your hospitality. Is there anything that I haven't asked you in this conversation that you think our listeners would benefit from?
Gina Gemberling: [00:28:13] The one thing that surprised me when I came to Little Rock and actually all of my friends from the Midwest, from the Illinois area, Chicago, Kansas City, when they've all come to visit. At first, they said, why little Rock? Now that they've come to visit, they have grown fond of our city and our destination. We are more of a cosmopolitan city than many might think. We are a very artsy city. We do have the sculpture garden of dozens of sculptures right on our riverfront, as well as you'll see the art and sculptures and murals sprinkled all around our destination. I do believe that Little Rock has just so much more to offer than a lot of people think. So we invite everyone to come to visit us here in Little Rock.
Adam Stoker: [00:28:54] Okay. Come check it out. Come see the difference, maybe from what your perception hasn't been of Little Rock before. Because I personally can also say this city and I've been here for a day. I'm going to be here for another day. But this city is already much more amazing than I anticipated. Thanks, Gina, for sharing a little bit about your experience here with Little Rock. If people want to learn more about you, about your destination, what's the best way for them to do so?
Gina Gemberling: [00:29:21] Our destination, of course, is our website, littlerock.com. You can find me on our website and shoot me an email or give me a call at any time.
Adam Stoker: [00:29:29] Great. Thanks again for your time.
Gina Gemberling: [00:29:30] All right. Thanks so much.
Adam Stoker: [00:29:32] Thanks, everybody, for listening. If you enjoyed today's show, please don't forget to leave us a rating or a review. It really helps us to continue to bring you excellent guests like Gina. Thanks, everybody, and we'll talk to you next week.
[End of transcript]
Gina Gemberling: [00:00:01] I think it’s really important to look at the organization as a whole, look at the talent that you have within, see what you can do with that talent, find the strength of your individuals that are with you and have years invested with your organization and how you could rearrange just to make things a little bit more seamless.
Adam Stoker: [00:00:20] Hello, everyone, and welcome to another episode of the Destination Marketing Podcast. We are in our first episode of a several-part series here. We have taken the show on the road to Arkansas. Really, really excited to be here. Our first stop is here in Little Rock, Arkansas. We are with our friend Gina Gemberling. She's the president and CEO of Little Rock. We are really excited to chat with you, Gina. Thank you for joining us.
Gina Gemberling: [00:00:49] Well, we're glad you're here and you made the capital city your first stop in Arkansas.
Adam Stoker: [00:00:53] We did. I tell you, we just got done with an amazing lunch at the Clinton Presidential Library. Is it Table 42? Is that the name of the restaurant?
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:02] Correct. Table 42.
Adam Stoker: [00:01:03] Oh, man. Between the food and the dessert, I don't know how we're still eyes open having this conversation.
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:11] I agree. For those three desserts, you have to test each one for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:01:15] Well, we're already getting a glimpse of the southern hospitality here in Arkansas and really appreciate you hosting us.
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:22] Well, thanks again for coming.
Adam Stoker: [00:01:23] Absolutely.
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:24] Yeah.
Adam Stones: [00:01:25] Well, let's dive in. We've got a couple of questions we like to ask everybody at the beginning of each show. I know you've been struggling to come up with an answer for this one. But I'm going to ask you anyway. I want to see what you came up with. What is your dream destination, Gina? If you could go anywhere in the world, where would it be?
Gina Gemberling: [00:01:41] Dream destination? Well, that's tough for me. I'm one of those workaholics. I'm one that when you take a vacation, it's harder to get back into the swing of things so I take very few vacations. But for me, it's just putting me on a beach. Sit me on a beach with a cold, frosty beverage in my hand and all is good.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:02] Important question on that then. On this beach, do we have phone service or do we not have phone service?
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:07] No, we do have phone service. We have to have phone service.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:13] You want a beach, but you want a beach that you can still be
reached at.
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:14] Exactly. With good internet as well for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:18] I like it. Okay. A beach anywhere. Why the beach? Why is that a place where you feel drawn?
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:25] I think just being from the Midwest all of my life and born and raised in the Midwest. Anytime we can see the ocean, it's always a little special, and it has to be that ocean breeze, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:02:37] I like it. Okay. What about a trip that you went on, whether it was as a kid or as an adult, that really stands out as a core memory for you?
Gina Gemberling: [00:02:46] I'd have to say growing up, our family had a lake house in southeast Missouri, like Wappapello had been in the family for about 70 years now. We spent our summers growing up there at the lake and at the lake house. Friends and family would come in and visit us throughout the summer. Our family still meets there currently on a regular basis. It's been a special place since I was for as long as I can remember.
Adam Stoker: [00:03:11] What makes it special? I know it's been in the family for 70 years. What activities did you do there? What memories did you make there?
Gina Gemberling: [00:3:18] We were out water skiing and tubing every day. I learned how to ski when I was five. I was swallowing by the age of nine or ten. I cannot say I've skied for several years now. But I'm past that time of my life. But we did all the water recreation all summer long.
Adam Stoker: [00:03:36] Well, I can tell that is a special place for you because I'm foreshadowing a little bit here. But you shared with us that played a part in you choosing Little Rock as a place to land. Maybe what I'd love to have you do is give us a little bit of your background and what led you here to Little Rock.
Gina Gemberling: [00:03:53] Okay, sure. Well, this might take a while. I've spent many years in the hospitality industry. I started spending about three or four years in the hotel industry and sales. Went to work for the Springfield, Illinois Convention and Visitors Bureau in late 1993 as an entry-level salesperson. Did a lot of their lead generation, worked my way up through that organization, spent some time as senior sales, director of sales, spent some time in the servicing realm, and also over both the sales and marketing department. I was there for 24 years. My last I’d say four years, I believe. I did live there. I was the leader of that organization as director of the Springfield Illinois Convention and Business Bureau.
Adam Stoker: [00:04:35] Really saw every job and role within the organization by the time you left, didn't you?
Gina Gemberling: [00:04:41] Exactly. Knew where all the bodies were buried, per see. Making a jump at that point in my career, after 24 years at one organization, a lot of thought went into that decision to make a move. At that point in my career, I just thought, if you're ever going to do it, now is the time to do it. I saw the posting here in Little Rock for the vice president of sales and services. I came on board in January of ‘18 in that role. We had about 15 members of that department. Just to put some comparisons to it, my budget here and just the sales role at the Little Rock convention and visitors bureau was about the same. If not, a little bit larger budget than the whole budget of my past destination.
Adam Stoker: [00:05:29] A little more flexibility in this role to be able to execute on some of the things that you want to because there's obviously more budget to play with.
Gina Gemberling: [00:05:36] Correct, correct. Then during COVID, we did a little bit of reorganization. Gretchen Hall, who was our CEO at the time, merged the sales and marketing divisions. Since I had a background in both, I was promoted to senior VP of both sales and marketing. Then as most people in our industry know, it was in late January that Gretchen sprung the news on us that she was moving on to Destinations International. At that time, I assume the role of president and CEO here at the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau.
Adam Stoker: [00:06:06] Yeah. I'm excited to reconnect with Gretchen because she was one of our early interviewees here on the show and really enjoyed getting to know her and excited for her to be at DI. The good news is that it paved the way for you to take the next step and be the CEO of this organization so kind of a win-win for the two of you.
Gina Gemberling: [00:06:24] Well, I guess I still don't know if it was a win on my side. But in the long run, I guess it is. Part of my reasoning decision process of moving to Little Rock was working for Gretchen as CEO. Just going through the interview process with her and learning more about the organization, the funding sources here, just everything that the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau has to offer that's a little bit different than most standard convention and visitors bureaus.
Adam Stoker: [00:06:51] Yeah, I'm excited to get into that today because I know there is a lot of uniqueness here in the way that the Little Rock CVB is run and funded and operated so it will be an interesting discussion. Before we do, a good friend of mine actually works at Springfield, Illinois, and he's a shared acquaintance of the two of us. I know Scott listens to the show. I've got to tell him hi. I know that you guys were able to work together for a while. What was it like to work with Scott?
Gina Gemberling: [00:07:21] We worked together. He was part of our hotel community early on in my days at Springfield Convention and Visitors Bureau. Then he worked for Illinois Hotel Lodging Association. We always had a close partnership, always respected Scott and had a good relationship with him for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:07:37] Great, great. Well, Scott, if you're listening, it's good to hear your connections out there on the show. But coming back to this, Gina, one of the things that I would like to do before we maybe dive into the unique things you're working on here in Little Rock, give us the overview of little rock as a destination, what makes it special, what makes it unique. Obviously, you get a lot of visitors here. Tourism is really important to this community. Why do people choose Little Rock as their destination?
Gina Gemberling: [00:08:07] You can tell just by walking in our downtown area that the city itself cares a lot about tourism. Just in the infrastructure that's along our riverfront from our Statehouse Convention Center, that's attached to the Marriott Hotel and then Corners on one end. Then we have the Robinson Center, which is our performing arts center with meeting space, and a conference center on the back, which is connected to our DoubleTree Hotel. Just that infrastructure alone along and it is right along the Riverfront Park, which is scenic right along the Arkansas River. That Markham Street takes you right into President Clinton Avenue which takes you through our entertainment district and straight down into the Clinton Library.
Adam Gemberling: [00:08:46] Great. As a destination, you're deciding between Little Rock and several other probably, I don't know, middle-of-the-country destinations that you would go to or Midwest destinations, what is it that you feel like is the difference maker for people to choose Little Rock?
Gina Gemberling: [00:09:05] Little Rock sitting right on the Arkansas River. We have a great downtown area. Everything is just walkable from our entertainment district to our sites and attractions. The President Clinton Library is also right in our downtown area. But one thing that really makes us, I think, unique is our cycling and our outdoor recreation is right within our urban core. You can jump on the Arkansas Trail right in our downtown area that will take you right out to the beautiful parts of Little Rock. You're right, it's still in the middle of the city.
Adam Stoker: [00:09:38] Yeah. I saw that this morning. For those listening, we actually had the opportunity to take a little tour of Little Rock today and some of the unique parts of Little Rock. That same trail that you're talking about goes all the way out to a park we drove out to just outside of town. It's amazing that this interconnected trail system is there and gives so much flexibility for travelers if they want to walk, if they want a bike, and not have to worry about safety in a lot of the trails that they're on because cars are nowhere near them in some of these cases.
Gina Gemberling: [00:10:10] Correct. Just in our downtown area alone, we have three bridges that are pedestrian bridges. Then I believe this morning, you're fortunate to go out to our big damn bridge, which is over a mile long. It's the largest, longest pedestrian bridge in the United States.
Adam Stoker: [00:10:25] Amazing. Yeah. The bridges actually, as Colby and I. Colby is my business partner. For those listening, he goes on a lot of these trips with me as we drove through the bridges were some of the most fascinating parts for us. They are very ornate, very unique, and also very different from each other. Each bridge is a fingerprint almost, where it's really unique. I thought that was an interesting asset from a tourism perspective.
Gina Gemberling: [00:10:51] Correct. Another note is that here at the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureaus, we wear several hats in the community. One of those is the lighting of the bridges. We are in control of the colors that are on the bridge. Doc, our senior engineer here at the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau, you say, Doc, I want those bridges green or your favorite color, and he can change them just right from his iPhone.
Adam Stoker: [00:11:15] Bliss, who took us around this morning, shared an amazing story that just before the Russian invasion of Ukraine, she had some members of dignitaries or something like that from Ukraine here visiting. You guys actually had them in a meeting room and lit up the bridge with the Ukrainian flag colors. She said she got an emotional reaction even from some of the attendees with their patriotism and pride for their country to see that lit up on the bridge in Arkansas. What an amazing opportunity for you guys to build one more touchpoint, one more connection with whatever group or travelers coming in to light up a bridge like that. That is such a unique asset.
Gina Gemberling: [00:12:04] It is. Our national regional conventions, when we let them pick their color or their association's colors and their branding, and we can change those downtown bridges, really makes those conventions and those convention attendees feel special, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:12:21] Well, let’s talk a little bit about what makes your organization here in Little Rock really unique. One of the things that you told me is how you operate so many of the assets. You don't outsource that to management groups or other organizations. But your convention center and the amphitheater that you have here and so much more. You guys operate on your own. Tell me, first of all, how did that come about, and then what's it like to have 100 employees and to operate all of these venues?
Gina Gemberling: [00:12:53] I'll go back to, I think I was six months into my position here in Little Rock. I remember Gretchen Hall at the time, she wanted to know how I was feeling about things and sent over a list of questions. One of them was, what's your biggest surprise about the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau? My response back to her is, I had no idea when I came here what a powerhouse our organization really is in the destination. I go back to that every day. We do manage the Statehouse Convention Center, which is about 220,000 square feet of space. We also manage the Robinson Center, which is a performing arts center. That's where our Broadway shows and most of that type of entertainment take place in downtown Little Rock, as well as it has a conference center on the back.
We also manage the Amphitheater, which is an outdoor theater that overlooks the Arkansas River, as well as Ottenheimer Hall, which is a food hall in the River Market district. In addition to that, we also manage several of the parking garages in the downtown area. We do that. Several of those, we do for the city of Little Rock. That is also all those little pieces that put together a convention package. Of course, as I mentioned earlier, I grew up in the sales world. Conventions and meetings in the sales side are always near and dear to my heart. But it really helps to put those packages together that we do have control over all those facilities.
Adam Stoker: [00:14:18] Yeah, that was one of the fascinating things when you told me that you operate all of these different assets, is you are now controlling so much more of the visitor experience, and any time you hand off. From one organization to another, you always have that fear of like, are they going to deliver on our expectations? I think a lot of destinations do a great job of training their hospitality staff and making sure that the experience is as seamless as possible. But I think it’s unavoidable that you're going to have some difficulties in those hand-offs. With you being able to operate the entire experience chain for these events that come in, I think it is something that's a differentiator. It probably makes a big difference in the visitor experience. Would you agree with that?
Gina Gemberling: [00:15:05] Most definitely. In our convention sales and service team, they are based here at our Cromwell Building, which is our administrative building here in downtown Little Rock. But also, our event operations team is on the same floor. They are able to work. They work hand in hand on all of our conventions and meetings coming in that are using any of our facilities and our hotels.
Adam Stoker: [00:15:26] Great, great. Now, it is wonderful in theory the idea of being able to control that and manage that all on your own or as an organization. But of course, everybody in the country right now is struggling with the labor market and it's no different for you. It's been difficult for you guys to find employees. Tell me how you as an organization are combating that issue of the labor market and the difficulty to find good people to be within your organization.
Gina Gemberling: [00:15:57] Of course, during COVID, unfortunately, many of our frontline service workers were the ones that were the first to be furloughed during the COVID Pandemic, obviously because our buildings were dark, they were empty. That has been one of our biggest difficulties coming back. I always say tourism came back with a vengeance. Our buildings have been busy all year and very busy. Our staff, our hearts and our thank you’s go out to all of them for keeping the buildings running on fewer people as we are still trying to recoup all of those employees and bring employees back and get us to the staffing levels we need to.
Earlier this year, about a couple of months ago, we did create a new position under our marketing team. It is a director of community engagement. Part of that position will be working with the workforce and helping us identify different workforce and other areas where we can attract more potential employees.
Adam Stoker: [00:16:54] Yeah. You told me about a study that you had done that also really helped. Do you mind sharing a little bit about that study and what the outcome of it was?
Gina Gemberling: [00:17:02] Sure. One thing that will set the tone and let you know a little bit more about the Little Rock Convention and Visitors Bureau is about every three to five years, we go through a full salary compensation study. It's not just our team calling around other convention and visitors bureaus to find out their salary ranges and that thing. We actually hire an outside firm. They look at every position in our organization. They make sure the grade class codes are correct. They make sure there exempt versus non-exempt and where they should fit, as well as looking at those salary levels and make sure we're competitive in the marketplace to bring employees and that we are offering the benefits that we should attract the type of employees we want to represent Little Rock. We just completed that study.
We announced it to our employees last week. It's a tough exercise because you have to look at the whole organization. You look at the actual positions, not the individuals. It was interesting to go through. This is my first year going through that exercise. In the long run, I do think it makes us a stronger organization and is a big benefit to our employees.
Adam Stoker: [00:18:10] It's really interesting to me what you did. I want to talk about the nuts and bolts of it so those listening might be able to try to duplicate that effort in their destination. First of all, you had to go out to RFP to find a partner to help you do this study, is that right?
Gina Gemberling: [00:18:26] Correct. We went out to RFP middle of last year. We did start this process probably fall of last year. It's taken a while. It's a lengthy process. But I think, in the long run, it is well worth our time and energy for sure. The third-party looked at everything as far as, I mentioned earlier, each individual position, some, look at it from a local or regional area. When it comes to a lot of our sales and marketing folks or our executive team, they actually look rely a lot on destinations international and the International Association of Venue Managers for their compensation studies and what is happening around the whole United States to make sure we are attracting quality employees for our organization.
Adam Stoker: [00:19:10] At the end of that process, this third-party organization that you hired, basically gave you for these positions, this is what the salary should be if you want to be competitive as an organization.
Gina Gemberling: [00:19:21] Exactly.
Adam Stoker: [00:19:22] Once they did that, did you then take that study and say, okay, we're just going to follow these findings? Or did you have any rebuttal or was it like meeting in the middle? Then how did you actually roll that out and communicate it to your team?
Gina Gemberling: [00:19:37] We did go back and forth a little bit on some different positions. Possibly the job description did not portray everything that that position did. There were some we had to go back and forth on, as well as positions non-exempt versus exempt. The process was several months. But we did complete it. We rolled it out to our team last week. Everyone received anyone that had any change in pay grade, or change in their salary structure, they all received a letter from our organization.
Adam Stoker: [00:20:08] It's great. Most employees were pretty happy with this study.
Gina Gemberling: [00:20:12] I think so. I think so. Unfortunately, you cannot make everyone happy unfortunately. But for the most part, a lot of it touched our people working in our buildings, our frontline service staff. Knowing that Amazon locally is hiring anywhere from $17 to $20 an hour, we knew we needed to be more competitive in that market in that area. I think we were able to with our other benefit packages and everything else that we offer, I think we offer a nice place to work, for sure.
Adam Stoker: [00:20:44] Any advice for other destinations thinking about doing something like this?
Gina Gemberling: [00:20:48] I'd be welcome to take any calls. Feel free to contact me directly. I will even share with you our RFP, as well as our proposal and why we ended up choosing the company we chose.
Adam Stoker: [00:21:01] Great, great. Let's shift gears a little bit. One of the things that are happening in the industry right now is there's so much movement of people going from one destination to another, from one job to another. Most of the time when they're making these changes, they have big shoes to fill. For you, when you came in and Gretchen decided to go to Destinations International, you then, of course, had some big shoes to fill. What advice would you give to people that have made a move and are trying to make their way in a new role and make sure that they are learning from what was done before, but also balance that with what you see that needs to be done and make sure that you're as good as possible in your new role?
Gina Gemberling: [00:21:46] Gretchen's announcement to us in late January was definitely a surprise to all. When I came to Little Rock, this is not what I expected, nor was it what I was seeking to do, quite honestly. But she and I have a great relationship. Going through, we had a couple of months during the transition time. I'm fortunate that she still is here in Little Rock and we remain dear friends and are able to she's always here for me to bounce things off of. But looking back to our transition months, she made it well-known to me that this is your ship now. You run this ship the way you see fit. There are going to be some things that you want to change. She said it's not going to hurt my feelings. It's always good to try new things and to look at things in a different way.
The hardest thing for me, I believe in this position right now is just getting to know a lot of the players locally. Gretchen was from Little Rock. She was born and bred here so she knew a lot of the players and spent eleven years in that CEO role here after she had been with the organization ten years prior to that. That is probably my biggest challenge at this point.
Adam Stoker: [00:22:53] Yeah.
Gina Gemberling: [00:22:53] Yeah.
Adam Stoker: [00:22:54] Then advice for people that are going through the same thing, what would you suggest as far as approach maybe before you enter the role and from a research perspective or whatever, and then how to balance the perception of the past with the view of the future?
Gina Gemberling: [00:23:12] I will go back to when I came on board as the VP of Sales and Service. I think it’s really important to look at the organization as a whole, look at the talent that you have within, see what you can do with that talent, and find the strengths of your individuals that are with you and have spent some years invested with your organization and how you could rearrange just make things a little bit more seamless. At the same time, I think it's important just to take your time, not rush into any decisions. I've spent the last few months really reviewing different titles within the organization and how we can make things better.
Adam Stoker: [00:23:48] I like it. I'm going to shift gears again. I guess we'll do that a lot today. But Little Rock has such a unique name in my mind and it provides the opportunity for some real recognizable marketing strategies and copy. We're sitting here in this conference room. I'm seeing your marketing campaign all over the walls here. I'm going to quote one of them here. If you're big on local art, you're big on Little Rock. Then another one says, if you're big on history, you're big on Little Rock. It's got the picture of the Central High School that's such an icon in American history. You've got this campaign. If you're big on this, then you're big on Little Rock. Tell me about the opportunities that come from having a name like Little Rock and allows you to play off of that and have a clever campaign like this. What do you do to market Little Rock?
Gina Gemberling: [00:24:49] This campaign, Big on Little Rock actually was first launched in the ‘80s. It was not only an outward marketing campaign, but it was also a feel-good pride in the community amongst locals at that time. About two years ago, right before pre-pandemic, actually, I want to say it was about a week or two before the pandemic hit that we did bring Big on Little Rock back. After many discovery sessions and conversations with our local community, and our advertising agencies, we felt there were lags there and it was a good time to bring it back. We're going through a little bit of a transition with it right now. That will be announced here in the next couple of weeks and showcased in the next couple of weeks. But we are definitely going to stay Big on Little Rock.
Adam Stoker: [00:25:31] Nice. It's interesting because I had asked you the question before of how do you know what to change. How do you know what not to change when you're coming into a new role? You obviously came in as this campaign had been prepared and developed. You elected to stay with the Big on Little Rock campaign. I like that because it's not, I just want to do my own thing, or I want to have my own thing. I feel like you saw the assets that were valuable and continued with those assets. Tell me a little bit about, like, as you evaluated that campaign when you came in, what made you decide to say, yeah, let's continue with that and make it a key part of where we go from here?
Gina Gemberling: [00:26:09] Well, back to a couple of years ago when we launched a campaign, I was part of that decision process, so I already had a little buy-in for sure. Big on Little Rock was my boat a couple of years ago when we did make the switch from Life is Better with a Southern Accent. But I do believe in consistency. We had only a couple of years of Big on Little Rock that we had actually out in the market that I believe you need the consistency and the consistent messaging and branding.
Adam Stoker: [00:26:36] Great. What do you feel like you're the proudest of the work that you've done here in your organization?
Gina Gemberling: [00:26:43] What I feel I'm most proud of is the sales and marketing efforts and a little bit more of the focus that I bring with my sales and marketing background. Of course, as I mentioned earlier, we are a powerhouse in our destination. Those buildings we manage and operate, of course, are a huge piece of the puzzle. But also, our sales and marketing focus in our sales and marketing efforts. I believe what I can bring to the table is my background in sales and marketing.
Adam Stoker: [00:27:10] I like it. Well, one of the things that Bliss mentioned to us today on our tour is that meetings are back with a vengeance, right? You're getting a lot of calls and bookings. But she said the distance between the booking and the actual event is much shorter. People are booking pretty close to right before the event. To me, that almost says, thank goodness we control the entire experience chain if people are asking us to plan these events in a very short period of time.
Gina Gemberling: [00:27:39] Exactly. We work so closely with our Marriott Hotel that's connected with the Statehouse Convention Center and our DoubleTree connected to the Robinson Center. We are all within our staff meet at least once or twice a week, just our internal teams together. We are just one voice out there. It makes it easier when these groups are booking such short term that we already have those communications put in place.
Adam Stoker: [00:28:01] Great. Well, Gina, this has been amazing. As I said, I really appreciate your hospitality. Is there anything that I haven't asked you in this conversation that you think our listeners would benefit from?
Gina Gemberling: [00:28:13] The one thing that surprised me when I came to Little Rock and actually all of my friends from the Midwest, from the Illinois area, Chicago, Kansas City, when they've all come to visit. At first, they said, why little Rock? Now that they've come to visit, they have grown fond of our city and our destination. We are more of a cosmopolitan city than many might think. We are a very artsy city. We do have the sculpture garden of dozens of sculptures right on our riverfront, as well as you'll see the art and sculptures and murals sprinkled all around our destination. I do believe that Little Rock has just so much more to offer than a lot of people think. So we invite everyone to come to visit us here in Little Rock.
Adam Stoker: [00:28:54] Okay. Come check it out. Come see the difference, maybe from what your perception hasn't been of Little Rock before. Because I personally can also say this city and I've been here for a day. I'm going to be here for another day. But this city is already much more amazing than I anticipated. Thanks, Gina, for sharing a little bit about your experience here with Little Rock. If people want to learn more about you, about your destination, what's the best way for them to do so?
Gina Gemberling: [00:29:21] Our destination, of course, is our website, littlerock.com. You can find me on our website and shoot me an email or give me a call at any time.
Adam Stoker: [00:29:29] Great. Thanks again for your time.
Gina Gemberling: [00:29:30] All right. Thanks so much.
Adam Stoker: [00:29:32] Thanks, everybody, for listening. If you enjoyed today's show, please don't forget to leave us a rating or a review. It really helps us to continue to bring you excellent guests like Gina. Thanks, everybody, and we'll talk to you next week.
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