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Welcome to the breakfast leadership show where
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we interview global thought leaders on business leadership and
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life here's your host keynote speaker best-selling
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author and chief burnout officer of the breakfast leadership network michael
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levitt welcome back i've got craig good life online craig how are you fantastic
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thanks for having me here i'm really excited Thanks for being here.
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I'm really looking forward to this conversation.
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So why don't you share a little bit about you and what you're up to,
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and then we'll dive into the conversation.
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Well, the big problem in the world that I'm working to solve is creating jobs
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for people and helping people be able to hire someone who's affordable to do a good job.
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Because as you know, right now in our country, unemployment rates are low.
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And if you look at federal minimum wage, some areas, $7.25 an hour,
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people can't afford to work for that.
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It'd be hard to survive. And for some entrepreneurs building their business,
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some of the listeners right here, they go ahead and they're like,
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I need help, but where do I go?
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I can't afford the minimum, let alone what it takes for someone to make a great living.
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So I help entrepreneurs and people hire from all over the world,
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people where minimum wage is a fantastic wage.
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Because in some places it just is. So that's what I do. That's why I'm here.
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Got about 3,500 employees, 21 different franchise owners.
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And I love, love, huge fan of your podcast because things about leadership,
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leadership is everything.
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Great leadership make organizations great. And the absence of leadership is
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usually the undoing of most organizations.
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Yeah, no, I appreciate that. I know we had discussed a bit in the pre-show just
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about showing up, and you made a really good observation for,
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I think, a lot of people in this world is when we put ourselves out there in
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front of this camera and upload this video to social media or podcast platform or whatever,
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we're doing our best to put the best foot forward.
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But you know what? We all are dealing with challenges. Leaders are showing up
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when they don't feel like it.
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They're beaten down. They've got issues at home.
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Maybe they've got some financial issues going on. Maybe there's a sick loved
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one or competition's bad or they're tossing and turning trying to figure out,
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okay, what is the division that we're going to close because we need to for financial reasons.
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And that's not fun.
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You know, I've been part of many things like that over my career.
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And it's why Tums does so well is because we, you know, people just,
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you know, start tossing those things down like it's Halloween and you're eating
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the stash that your parents cleared for you to eat.
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That's why all the kids are just zombies the next day at school, if they go.
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But just your insights on that, and especially, too, with organizations that are looking to grow.
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Grow and you need people to grow you know we
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haven't ai'd everything yet so we need
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people and a lot of organizations unfortunately just
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can't afford they want to you know i talked to i talked to owners all the time
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and leaders again i want to bring on teams i'd love to pay this person a whole
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lot more than i'm paying but i can't because our revenue and the cost of running
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things are there and i know a lot of leaders you know they're not even taking a salary themselves.
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And they're like, no, I want to bring, I want to bring this person in.
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And I said, sometimes it's like, well, you know what, maybe I'll do it.
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Bring in some people that have that skill set from outside, you know,
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a 40 foot view, you know, look around and see what's available.
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So it's awesome that, that you're doing these services. So what motivated you
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to, you know, to launch this business?
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It was kind of like building an airplane while it was flying.
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So me personally back in a previous life, and there's a lot of hot topics in
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the media right now around national association realtors and this big settlement thing.
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And back in 2017, about the time you started your podcast, I went ahead and
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had a real estate business, sold 203 homes. We were number one in two counties.
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I went ahead and I had a great administrative team who were all from the Philippines.
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I had a thriving business, but what people really was excited about is I had
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nights and weekends off.
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And in 2018, I said, I'm going to create some jobs and I'm going to give entrepreneurs
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weekends off and time with their family back.
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They're going to have affordable leverage. So that's what started me on this journey.
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And we've created some jobs.
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And on the pre-show, we were talking because every one of the guests so far,
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professional, awesome, they know their stuff.
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And when I'm listening to it, I'm probably like most listeners where it's like,
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I'm not that. And while I've managed to do some cool stuff and stuff like that,
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I mean, I know what it's like when it's your, I'm going to give you an example
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from my own world. We've got an organization.
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We finally went ahead and we got to the place where COVID hits and we're like,
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oh no, the world's coming to an end.
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And we had just came through another bad situation with PayPal where it was
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coming to an end. And we finally get on the other side of it,
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and we find out that COVID was actually our element.
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When it was work-from-home jobs, people were willing to take a look at companies
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like ours to help hire remote.
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And we actually started making money, which was kind of cool.
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And then summer of 2021 happened and my house caught fire on 4th of July.
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Crazy. Yeah. And so here's the irony. And this is kind of a funny thing, Michael.
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Our first meeting every Friday morning, I wanted to have everyone fired up.
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I want to have them excited, ready to go, motivated, passionate,
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just that fire. So we called the meeting every Monday morning, fire.
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And our team did this cool intro for the meeting. We met Hurtfully on Zoom.
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The night before, my house catches fire.
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I'm running up and down the street the night before, wearing nothing but a towel
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like a maniac, getting my family out of the house as we watch it, you know.
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And we go back in, we go to bed. And the irony of having to wake up at four
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o'clock in the morning to be in front of everybody at 6 a.m.
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For this meeting called fire.
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And they don't want to hear something that's going to cause them to worry.
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Because your people that work with you, they're friends. They care.
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They want to know. They're compassionate. They're human.
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And if you say my house caught fire last night, they're going to go, whoa, slow down.
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Are you okay let's talk about this and you're going to bring distractions to
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your organization i didn't want to do that and so we had this meeting called
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fire i'm kind of laughing a little bit my own eyes one going oh no we have some
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personal life problems we have to fix,
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so a little bit of irony and the company here it is it's growing
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2021 then right after i
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buy a condo because i'm a smart person need to go ahead and find a place to
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live what happens we cleaned it up there's this drain outside somehow got covered
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it rained really bad the place flooded just so you know insurance companies
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love me by the way in case it wasn't obvious.
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And here again, I didn't tell everyone house caught fire and that I'm living
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with the in-laws, you know, and my family is.
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And now I'm dealing with flood issues and business.
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When you already are doing everything you can, you're doing everything.
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You're exhausting yourself day in and day out. You still have these personal
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problems you got to deal with like a normal human being.
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And me, I'm looking at all the other leaders and going, well,
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they have problems like this, but they don't talk about it and they keep going.
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So that's what I'm going to do.
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So you can see how this is a recipe for success.
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Of course it is. And I think it shows that you're human and not just an autobot
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executive and does this and polished, which is great.
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You can do that, but you had some, what we like to call in psychology world,
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a significant emotional event followed up with another one, and you're like,
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the ship still has to sail.
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Now, we might have to be in a tugboat for a bit while they fix the ship,
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but we're still moving forward. but you making sure the team is aware of it.
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And it's, it's a, it's a fine balance for some people, but, but,
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but it really, it really depends on who the team is.
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And, you know, and everybody, and especially the team of that size, you know,
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You have to kind of level set thing and say, okay, my house caught fire.
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I'm okay. My family's okay. Thankfully, we're relocating.
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Business will continue as usual. There may be some disruptions as I address
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some things, but I will keep it to a minimum so you can continue to do the work
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that you're doing because we all want that.
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I find that work, and even though you hear people complaining about it,
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but work can be a really, really good escape.
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Because a lot of times, unfortunately, I hate hearing this with people.
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It's like, I need an escape from work.
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It's like, well, then you're not enjoying your work if you need to escape it.
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And it's like, so you got to come to grips with that. And okay,
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what is making you want to escape it? Because there might be something you're doing yourself.
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It's easy to blame the company. But you can go to another company.
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And he goes, what? Oh, they're doing the same thing.
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Hmm. Okay. There's something maybe a little closer to home they need to address.
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But when you're going through things like that, it's important in my assessment
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anyway, to let people know what's going on. At the time of this recording,
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just over four weeks from my mom passing away.
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So my brother and I are dealing with estate stuff.
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He works in an industry that he needs to be there, not having a whole lot of
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time off because of the work that he does.
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And my work, of course, is the same thing.
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There's things that deliverables and shows and all that kind of stuff. stuff.
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So for me, it's like, okay, you know, I saw like, for example,
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this interview today, I'm like, all right, awesome.
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You know, and I literally had, you know, half an hour before was filling out
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more paperwork for estate stuff.
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So it's like, okay, good. I get to go do something fun.
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And, you know, it's, it's just one of those things where long story short.
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You got to continue living. Life is very important.
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Work and life should not be a separate thing. You are one entity.
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You up and flow with that. And when you are your true self and you're able to
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do all of that, you can navigate through those peaks and valleys a whole lot
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easier to the point where they're not big peaks and big valleys.
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They're like, yeah, I'm sure, you know, when you're on that call,
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you know, they're talking about, you know, the, you know, your fire call on
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Monday mornings, you know, if you had like any design logo or something like
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that, you're probably looking and going, you know, we should probably change
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the flames in that background drip.
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Cause I got a new idea what flames look like.
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Let's, let's maybe tweak, you know, make that a little bit more blue.
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That's a little more orange and it's doing this thing.
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And even though we don't have smell-o-vision yet, I mean, come on,
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AI, we've had everything else.
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I want to be able to smell an apple pie if I see it on the screen.
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We can't be that far away from it.
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So let's go on that. We're like, okay, yeah, do all your work. Oh, that's cool.
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I want to go, hey, I want a piece of apple pie.
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Boom you know it's and like now like on star trek generation not you know not
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you know having to call uber or something and wait a half an hour and pay 40
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bucks for that slice of pie but just saying everybody says oh it's it's it's
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so much easier to eat out than cook at home i'm like,
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huh yeah don't get me started on that one i saw that the other day and i'm like
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where are you eating because i i haven't come across that but you know should
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have them deter and say okay what's what's going on?
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How can you save so much money eating out? That doesn't make sense.
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But anyhow, long-winded story to say that it's important to let people know, not only from a.
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They get to know you as a leader, but also if you are having difficulties or
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you're struggling a little bit or you're off for a couple of days or something like that, they know.
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So it's not second guessing you're not getting the gossip
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chain rolling you're not getting all of that other stuff going
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on in the background because they see that time and time
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again where people start speculating what's wrong
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you know and and what happens is they come up with their own stories and that
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can infiltrate the culture and all of a sudden your performance so your team
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starts to drop because they think you're closing a division you know like no
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actually we're expanding it
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but but we're just negotiating a lease and we got to keep quiet about it.
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So, you know, kind of like what Disney did when he got acquired all the property in Orlando.
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It's like, don't let anybody know. Cause he, he got that land cheap.
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There you go. Absolutely.
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So what's next? What do you think? And I'm not going to ask,
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what do you see in five years?
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Because five years ago, we certainly didn't see what's happened in the five-year plan.
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I can't predict five months from now, much less five years.
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That's just not an applicable question to ask.
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But where do you see things growing,
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especially in your industry and your field as more
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and more organizations start to realize that the talent pool is on this whole
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big blue thing floating around in the sky and not to limit yourself to just
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your jurisdiction because there's some amazingly talented individuals across
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this planet and you give them an opportunity.
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And like we said in the pre-show you know you're changing
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their lives you know they're they're living
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really well and boy
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does that make me sleep well at night when i can do that that you're
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helping people you know better themselves and in return obviously they're they're
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providing a service to you and your clients and everybody else but where do
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you see things over the next few years yeah after this it's going to be hiring
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people primarily from the philippines to go Go ahead and invent smell-o-vision
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right now, just based on this interaction.
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Because if you and I think it's a good idea, then I think everybody else will too.
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So maybe it's something you got your sound bar, you got your screen,
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you got your smell thing that's just going to make it happen.
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But if I don't go invent that after this, then my next plan is to go ahead and
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work on going ahead and having better basic training for people on how to be
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efficient in their roles and their positions. Because there's some things they
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have to know that's essential information.
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And there's some stuff that's like the nice to have. Some stuff for their position,
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it is like oxygen to the company, baby.
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And you cannot go without it. Some stuff, it's like going to the bathroom. It can wait a little bit.
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It's still important. It needs to happen. It's like taxes.
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And just like taxes and going to the bathroom, if you delay it long enough,
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you're doing a little crap every month, right?
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So it's going ahead and assessing though, what are the important,
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the impatient needs needs of the position and making sure people understand
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that and where they need to be innovative, especially with ourselves as AI comes in.
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Because as you look at what AI is going to bring and all of its capabilities
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and things, there's a lot that it's not going to do. There's a lot of things
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it's not going to replace.
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And I think for a lot of people, especially in our company, it's knowing how
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to work with tools like that to create the best product for the end user,
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whether it's their client or whether it's an actual customer out there.
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But I mean, really, that's the name of the game we're in. Who can provide a
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better experience with a combination of resources at our fingertips?
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And the more you can enable people to do that, the more jobs you create.
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And that's kind of what we do and what we're doing.
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That's beautiful. And I think the experience, I think that's the key word is
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I think about organizations or businesses that I visit and some are generic.
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I'm going to get the same type of service, but there are those few that I will encounter.
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And the more I find them, the more I gravitate to them is it's an experience
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to go there, whether it's to eat something, a coffee shop or an office supply store,
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or, you know, even if I'm picking up something from the computer store,
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you know, it's like, well, I go with a big box one or am I going to go with
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the local guy down the street? Great.
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I'm going to go with the local guy because I know what the impact is.
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It's a shorter supply chain impact type of thing for that individual.
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And they're going to let me know about something comes up or say,
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hey, you know, we got this in and you were looking at it before. Do you want it now?
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And I'm not getting that from a big box store.
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So you're going to go or someone just they care about you more or they make
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you feel about and you care more about them because they care more about you.
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Yeah, and I think that's in this whole thing where...
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I like saying this, the social media has made us more anti-social in a lot of ways.
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I think getting back to the basics of just getting to know people and talking
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with them and understanding what they do.
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I had a conversation yesterday with somebody that's a clinical director in one
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of the big hospital networks that's by me.
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And just having a conversation about what they're seeing right now.
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You know, that, you know, I told them I didn't envy them over the last few years
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because it hasn't been fun for the health care industry, as an example.
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But what are they seeing now? You know, what are some of the challenges they're facing?
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What you know, what how are they approaching it? You know, how are they leveraging technology?
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And even to the point where they were talking about, you know,
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3D implants and they work in a cardiac unit.
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And there's actually a way to do a 3D scan of the heart and,
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you know, the other arteries around and all of that, where they can,
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there's one company apparently that can generate, you know, the 3D part that
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they need to replace within a heart that is identical,
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you know, to that individual.
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Individual but unfortunately yeah it's amazing that
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you can do that it's like this is like we're replacing it with an
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exact same copy of it but the problem is the turnaround time to generate it
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from taking the scan having the company make it and doing that is running six
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to eight weeks and unfortunately a lot of those patients don't last six to eight
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weeks so yeah so all of a sudden and they've got this part,
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it's like, okay, we got it. Okay, the patient is deceased.
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They can't use it because it won't match because it was designed for them.
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And so it's like, well, we got to work on technology to get that turnaround
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a little bit quicker where you can print it in the lab downstairs and have it
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done, you know, and that's, you know, that's.
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You know, just one example of leveraging technology, but, and also,
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you know, taking in that experience where, you know, if a hospital,
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if you are a cardiac patient or need a lung transplant or something like that,
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if there's a hospital network that does that and offers that kind of service
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and an experience on how to deal with that, you're going to gravitate to that
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because you're looking at, okay, I can get a new this within three weeks,
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or I'm going to have to wait six months for this.
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And it's, again, you know, same thing with turnaround on the work that,
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you know, the people that you bring in your team to do.
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It's like, okay, if I do it myself, it's going to take me, you know,
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two or three weeks if I get to it.
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You know, as an executive or a business owner, you're like scrambling because
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you're doing everything.
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You know, pro tip, quit doing everything, entrepreneur.
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Hire that out. Believe me, I know this is difficult for a lot of entrepreneurs
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to hear, but you're not as good as you think you are on everything.
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Everything there's things you're awesome at and there's things you're not
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and I see too many times leaders try to
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do everything and when they do that they're not going to
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be good at anything so figure out what you're not good at delegate that hire
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that out to somebody that's a whole lot better and watch what happens to your
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company yeah that's that's the thing that I've learned and I try to tell people
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and bring people like you on to reiterate that because it's so important for for business growth,
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for you to bring on the right people for the right things you need to get done.
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And it'll grow your business a lot faster than you doing it by yourself, for sure.
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No, I agree. In fact, we went ahead and we hit this early on in our business,
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just to be able to hit our basic, what it takes to find someone you'd call the
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right person, just someone you could bet your business on.
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Right now, numbers, hiring from just the Philippines, just that country,
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we get on average about 15,000 applications per week, just per week.
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We do about 5,000 interviews, just the first interviews per week.
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Just to be able to go ahead and see, is this someone we would trust,
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one of our clients, to bet their company on this person?
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15,000 apply, 5,000 get an interview, less than 200 get a final interview.
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And of those, we hire less than 100.
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Now, when we're hiring from the Philippines, these are people that they are
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taught English from kindergarten.
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These are people who've worked in the call center services. services,
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a lot of times we know we called in, we got some from the Philippines,
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we got frustrated, they replaced it with AI.
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I'm taking those people saying, hey, you work customer service, speaking English.
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Come on over here. Let's train you with some new skills. And we'll have them
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go work with a small business owner where they're able to pay them a more than affordable wage.
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And someone's able to make more than they made in the call center.
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But we have to go through 15,000 people just
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to be able to come out with less than a hundred because it's that hard finding
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the right right person just the right character just with
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the right integrity oh and because they're from the philippines right
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you know internet speed and equipment stuff like that
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but yeah yeah the vetting process is huge and you know it's not just exclusive
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to someone applying to be a vice president of finance for a non-profit it's
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everything and that's important to do it i know I know a lot of candidates,
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you'll get frustrated, but 15,000 resumes landing in the system a week,
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that's going to make the HR team go, ooh.
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Oh yeah, it's nearly 200 people in that division dealing with resumes and interviews
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and stuff like that. Yeah.
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Because the truth is like, if you're just one person going to fill one job,
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you got to go ahead and do everything yourself and use your own best judgment.
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We have to take what other people are going to say. This is their best judgment.
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And these candidates are going to pass most high level executives, best judgment.
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Like when they meet with them, they're going to be impressed.
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They're going to look at their degrees. They're going to look at their experience.
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They're going to look at everything about them and they're going to be able
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to look and say, yes, this is fantastic. person.
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00:24:01,067
It's kind of hard trying to mind read 20 small business owners or CEOs what
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they need and be able to staff to it, but we've kind of been able to do that
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just a little bit. It's kind of like you, Mr.
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CEO of Burnout, who saves people from that. You know the symptoms.
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You know exactly when someone's there, you are the guru of that.
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My team, after doing that many applicants and having that many people to choose
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from, they've been able to become some gurus.
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Yeah it's just you know it's even though another ai
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00:24:28,678
alan iverson hated practice it's just you keep
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00:24:31,518
going at it you get better at it and you know
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that's what you know happened with me with my personal experience with
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my my love-hate relationship with burnout i
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don't love it at all but it definitely created that
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you understand it better than so many others yeah
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it demonstrated over and over again yep exactly
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i know the signs i see it in people i can hear it
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in their voice it's it's as if you know
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i've got some type of special glasses and i can just kind of oh there it is
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right there you know you pick it out like a blue light trying to find fingerprints
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it's like there they are i found them so if you've ever had a guest on your
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podcast they demonstrate all the symptoms if you just let them leave and you
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haven't told them i mean be honest with me it's okay.
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No i know i've i've had somebody that was on
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my show recently and i'm
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00:25:21,778
not going to say anything else because people could try to figure it out but
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00:25:27,698
and i could tell and yeah and i i said well here let you i'm gonna send you
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00:25:32,438
a copy of my book and they said i already bought it i said well did you read
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00:25:37,198
it you know this is kind of being sarcastic with them because i had that relationship,
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00:25:42,978
with them like did did you even open the book up it's it's like i'm the audiobook's
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00:25:46,218
coming i'm I'm getting around to it, but you know, it's like,
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00:25:51,398
if you want to listen to it or I'll just hop on a zoom call, I'll narrate it here.
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00:25:54,498
There. How about that? I'll just do that. We'll have story time.
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00:25:58,858
You know, it's, it's, did you have a hard time reading it or did you have a
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00:26:00,338
hard time understanding it?
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00:26:04,598
Because right now I know we have one of those two problems going on today. Yep.
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00:26:07,978
And a lot of people are there. A lot of people are there. I'm guilty of being
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in that time and time again. Absolutely.
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Of course. and in many cases it happens innocently because you're doing things
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that are right for your business or yourself and just your body goes wait I
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00:26:23,738
need a little break you're like I'll get you one don't worry we'll get a break
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00:26:26,718
soon and you just kind of blow past that you know even.
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00:26:32,615
A real-life example, I was working on some analytics this afternoon and working
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00:26:37,555
on some reports, and I set a timer on my watch, like, okay, in 30 minutes,
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00:26:39,295
get out of your chair and move around.
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00:26:43,555
Well, the alarm went off, I turned it off, and I continued sitting there for another 10 minutes.
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And then afterwards, I got up, I'm like, don't do that.
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00:26:52,175
You know, it was, you know, kind of self-coaching myself. You set that alarm for a reason.
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00:26:57,475
You follow through because it's for your own benefit. I think too often we go,
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00:27:01,235
you know, just a little extra, a little extra, and those little extras start
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00:27:06,255
adding up, and it can be really problematic for leaders and everybody in every walk of life.
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00:27:08,555
So it's food for thought for everybody.
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You know, take care of yourself, speak your truth, be open about the challenges
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00:27:15,955
that you're facing in life, and don't try to do it all.
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00:27:19,635
You know, I think that's the takeaway that I'm getting from our chat today is
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00:27:22,775
just, you know, do those things, and it'll make it easier.
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00:27:27,555
Year it's not going to make it simple there's going to be difficult times but at the end of it,
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00:27:31,435
you're going to be able to be refreshed when you hit that next
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00:27:37,555
stage instead of being completely worn out yeah absolutely all right craig love
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00:27:40,175
this conversation where can people find out more about you and this amazing
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00:27:44,215
work you're doing well there's three people with the same name in the world
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00:27:44,215 -->
00:27:48,055
like me one lives in the uk the other lives in south africa i'm the one in the u.s.
416
00:27:48,795 -->
00:27:51,615
So you can go ahead and hit me up on any form of social
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00:27:51,615 -->
00:27:55,355
media or go to cyberbacker.com and
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00:27:55,355 -->
00:27:59,755
say hi to us there if we can help you in any way shape or form but social media
419
00:27:59,755 -->
00:28:03,095
is the best way to connect and i always love and encourage people to reach out
420
00:28:03,095 -->
00:28:06,435
so we can mastermind and collaborate definitely have that in the show notes
421
00:28:06,435 -->
00:28:10,215
so craig thank you for the amazing work you're doing and thank you so much for
422
00:28:10,215 -->
00:28:14,195
giving some of your time today to chat with us so really appreciate you i appreciate
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00:28:14,195 -->
00:28:14,675
Appreciate that, Michael.
