Ep. 86 - Machine Control Secrets for Grading and Utilities with Matt Gillett

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Hey guys, welcome to the Blue Collar Business Podcast where we discuss the realest, rawest, most relevant stories and strategies behind building every corner of a blue-collar business.
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I'm your host, Sy Kirby, and I want to help you what it took me, trial and error, and a whole lot of money to learn.
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The information that no one in this industry is willing to share.
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Whether you're under that shade tree or have your hard hat on, let's expand your toolbox.
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Guys, welcome back to another episode of the Blue Collar Business Podcast, brought to you and sponsored today by Paidwort Support.
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Check them out at paydordsupport.com.
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As you guys know, Ben and the team over there are amazing when it comes to civil takeoffs, civil quantification, anything on the front of house, your, you know, maybe your first commercial job, and you really want some extra eyes on it and have an understanding of what that job is before you sign that contract, get with paydirdsupport.com.
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They can also not just on the takeoff quantification part, they can also build you a model for what's going on within that job.
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And especially you guys that are just tipping your toe in the commercial world, they're a great asset and resource to reach out to.
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Guys, I have been a fan of this gentleman for a little while on LinkedIn.
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Uh, today is a very, I think you guys will carry on a few laughs in today's.
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The similar stories that we were just sharing in the green room was kind of uncanny.
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Um the length of time, how we did it, the trials and tribulations, it's all there.
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And it's the things that you guys are facing every day.
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And I hope to shed some light through today's episode.
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Um, gentlemen is a founder and ex I'm sorry, founder and executive manager of Gillette Excavating, established in 2015.
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Started from absolutely nothing.
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I know I have a feeling how that feels, feller.
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Um, scaled the company from a solo operation to a full service, heavy civil construction firm.
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Um, they they started out on a little bit of fine grading, utility, you dirt work guys, stay tuned.
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We're we're talking about you guys today.
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And one of the other conversations that I'm really excited to share with our guests today is all about GPS guided equipment.
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We haven't had that conversation on the show in a little bit, and I know it's such a um uh just a general question for everybody in our industry.
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Do it, don't do it.
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Who, who, what, what brand do you select?
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What equipment do you go with?
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Why, how, when, all of that.
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And so I'm excited to get get into that.
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Furthermore, Matt Gillette, Gillette excavating, straight up out of the upland of Michigan.
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Thank you for joining me today, big dog.
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Thanks for having me, man.
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Appreciate it.
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No, we were uh guys, we were talking just super briefly in the green room, and man, Matt was literally talking about my story.
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He seemed like I was I was sharing his story, and it was just so similar.
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We're about it's got about a year on me in business and obviously a totally different area of the country, um, but very similar size.
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It sounds um very similar in job scopes as well.
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Matt, if you wouldn't mind giving us a little bit of a background of uh you can take us as far back as you'd like, but um give us a little background to what Gillette Excavating started from and what it is today.
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Yeah, so I mean, I was telling me earlier, I was 19 years old when I pulled the uh LLC filings for this thing.
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Um really I did it because I told my dad, like, hey man, I I love you, dad, but I want to do something different and I think I can run a business better than you, right?
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So the whole young kid knowing better than dad.
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Um, so I started this thing in 19, uh slowly raised through, you know, built it up from the ground up, made made a lot of mistakes, like a lot of people do, right?
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Uh, especially the founders, right?
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The founders are the ones that have their hearts in it.
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You know, we we started off with a you know, I literally had$500 for my name in a rotted out pickup truck.
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And next thing I know, I'm doing 10-acre site development at 20 years old and and thinking I own the world, right?
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Um, you know, and we we built it up and so we we kind of went from doing some residential, kind of playing around in the site market um to jumping into fine grading.
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Uh that's where we really cut our teeth and and I think we did very well there, uh, but we grew past what that market was allowed to basically provide us.
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Um so then we jumped back into commercial.
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Uh, had a great mentor um get me into underground, civil underground.
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Uh, we had, I don't know, a couple years into getting into you know large commercial, medium commercial, underground, and subdivisions, you know, residential development underground.
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And then last two years we've been really trying to develop our dirt dirt side.
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You know, we had a mass grading slash kind of getting back into the fine grading a little bit, but more high scale.
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So you know, it sounds very similar in markets, doing kind of the similar thing as well.
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Obviously, pipe guy did the dirt thing for three years that really we cut our teeth and learned some really hard, valuable lessons.
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And as you know, they're very expensive in that world.
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Um, but man, it's so funny you say I had a mentor, and we talk about this all the time, and I don't think we shine enough light on when you're making these big pivots, have somebody that's done it before and talk a little bit about, you know, don't have to drop any names or anything like that, but having that mentor to call and go, hey man, because I've done it too.
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No shame.
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Hey man, what is this you just sent me?
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I I'm I'm looking at these set of prints, I want to bid it, I want to do it.
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I I know it's waterline, I can put it in the ground, but make this make sense to me.
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And um, uh, you know, talk a little bit about that that mentor that helped you get into this trade.
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So to start off, and I think it's important to say our my mentor, uh he he didn't know me from Adam, right?
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He he gave me a little edge drain job that me and a couple of guys knocked out in in record time, and the guy's like, Man, these kids, these kids hustle.
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And and at that time, I think it was probably these kids are you know pretty dumb, but man, they're fighting through it, right?
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And we we did, I don't know, a few jobs for him.
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He ended up retiring, and he says, Hey, I I wanna I don't want to sell you this business because he was tied to the union.
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He goes, I wanna I want to be a consultant for you and I want to help you build your underground side deal.
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So I mean, I we talk three times a day.
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I mean, this guy is super close.
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I you know, he's almost like a relative, like a father in some sort.
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Um, but he's just he's he's probably the the best main line digger in Michigan that I know of.
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I mean, he is the most efficient that I've ever met, and we gotten really lucky to be able to bounce ideas off of and and learn how to put in pipe from I mean, a guy who has a reputation that is unrivaled in the east side of Michigan.
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So it's awesome.
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So take us through that, and I'm gonna assume a huge difference between me and you in uh frost depth.
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I'm assuming like 18 inches is our frost line here.
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I'm assuming no water lines going in the ground up there at three feet deep, eh?
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Yeah, no, no, no, not unless you want them to break.
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Uh so Michigan, like we're putting water main in five and a half foot berry, six and a half foot berry.
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Um, so it's you know, our frost lines right around there, you know, and this year was a testament to that.
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I think we were digging an open field, not a roadway, but a snow covered field, and the frost is four and a half foot deep.
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So we were it when it gets cold in Michigan, it gets cold.
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We were, I guess unfortunate, but fortunate we had a nice cold winter, you know, good for the snowmobilers, but bad for the dirt eyes.
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Do you, I guess every excavation guy, do you guys do snow removal in the winter?
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No, I did it one year and I said never again.
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You know, it's funny.
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I did the same thing on the public side of things.
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Um, like, hey, let me come plow your commercial lot.
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Well, now we just do it for two very select clients that have some commercial property, and um it's been blessed to have that for the last couple of years.
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But yeah, no, the snow removal thing ain't for me, but I figured up there you guys would have snow for a couple of months at a time.
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But um no, where I was going with the the depth thing is you know, hearing your mentors' efficiencies, like what uh most generally everything on average up there is going to be a little bit deeper, which creates some um problematic procedures when you're putting in just pipe.
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And when you're brand new, I could only imagine um, just like myself walking out there, I knew how to put a pipe in the ground, but did I know how to do it the most efficient?
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It's cost saving and safe for people to get in and out of the hole.
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No, I didn't.
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And I had to learn from either people literally walking up job supers, you know, on these commercial sites.
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Hey man, you gonna bench that out?
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Well, yeah, man, I I apologize.
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That's that's we we don't tolerate that here.
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And so I had to really raise my expectations.
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But you know, when you're you're so fearful uh out on those first couple of underground uh jobs, and you were sharing there briefly about you know one of your first jobs.
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I if you wouldn't mind kind of talking about like you, you you dove right off in it, dude.
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You didn't just you know the fine grading, but you know, that first major job for you that kind of elevated you into the commercial world.
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Yeah, so I mean, you're talking the first year, the first year I was in business, I did take a job working for a local underground company.
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That's kind of where I cut my teeth.
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I was a loader operator for most of the year.
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And I think I got, I don't know, 30 days into a seat of a mainline digger, and then I got laid off for winter layoff.
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But man, I'm not gonna do this.
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I'm not gonna sit and do nothing, right?
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I'm not, I'm gonna build what I started.
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And it just somehow relationship after you know meeting a couple of guys and and you know, my desire to build something.
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I met this customer and we got a 10-acre commercial site development on TM.
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And then it was one of those, like, you know, you people get their lucky breaks, right?
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And you you see, you know, bigger companies like, man, them guys are lucky, right?
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They might get their lucky breaks later in life.
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I got mine early in life, and maybe only one or two of them, right?
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So we got, I mean, the we sent them a bill and the guy writes check the same day or next day, right?
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I mean, as a 20-year-old that I was renting all my equipment, I had three employees at that time, and they were part-time employees, right?
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We I mean, you didn't have enough work to keep full-time guys in the beginning.
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Um, and I I mean, I still look back at those pictures today.
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I mean, there's pictures of us putting storm sewer in in the middle of winter, and here I am, a 20-year-old kid that mainline dug for 30 days, never even shot grades on a pipe or knew what invert meant, right?
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And I'm putting a whole storm sewer system and digging attention pond and putting a building pad in, and you know, the the mistakes I made, right?
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The mistakes I made and the what I learned, right, was just great.
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And it was what I mean, what an awesome job to do it, right?
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T and M couldn't have couldn't have had a better opportunity to learn.
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It was like the only time we were able to get that.
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See what I was gonna say.
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I've been in it 10 years and I ain't never had no 10 acre on a T and M.
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Like man, gosh was literally giving and man, you were destined to make it.
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I mean, honestly, what an opportunity to start out with.
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But at the same time, kudos to you, man.
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20 years old, what a light of desire.
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That guy didn't just um obviously some see some punk kid, he saw something in you and look at you now, like the what you've done with that opportunity.
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And um, man, the the 20 years old, rocking and rolling, here you are, and you're not worried about winter layoff that year.
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You're you're you're literally taking it.
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So fine grading, you move from there and you kind of you said fine grading market.
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Is that like literally what I'm thinking?
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Jobs done, backfill of curb, or talk me through that.
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Well, how was that transition?
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So we were doing, I remember we were doing this little underground job for one of my competitors, and this guy pulls up in a white pickup, like, hey man, you got a dozer?
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Yeah, I got a dozer.
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Well, you need grading?
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He goes, Yeah, I got a parking lot that I need graded.
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We we we're a paver.
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And I didn't know this guy, I didn't give him a bit.
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He goes, I'll give you, I'll give you four grand to go go grade it.
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Well, okay, cool.
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Well, I wasn't doing nothing on Friday and Saturday.
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Let's go make four grand, right?
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So I go grade this parking lot and I was there by myself.
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And then the guy says up and goes, Man, I love what you do, I love your work ethic.
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Be my fine grade guy, right?
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And from there on out, we were fine grading for three or four different pavers across uh southeast Michigan, and that's what we were doing.
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We were we were fine graded, we would grade 60,000, 70,000 square foot with a D5 dozer and a couple of guys checking grade with string line, and that's that's what that's how we made it.
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That's what we made our profit on.
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So you go grade a job for 15, 20 cents a square foot, and you could do 60,000 square foot in a day, you're you're doing all right, you know, a little dozer.
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Yeah, wow, and uh we cut our teeth on too.
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I'm not saying it's without without you know trials and tribulations.
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Like uh one of my favorite pavers, we we do a lot of partner paving with them now.
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Um one of their foremans.
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I remember him grabbing me by my ear, like physically grabbing my ear, dragging me around the site and saying, dude, you screwed that up, you screwed that up, go fix it.
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And it it made us one of the and I'm not you know, ego aside, we were one of the probably premier grading guys in that area, but it was because of me.
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It was a non-repeatable system because fine grading was a skill that you either got it or you don't, and that's why we scaled past it.
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You know, we call that a reference term is blue topping down here, getting ready for asphalt.
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And anybody that's listened to this that's ever pushed a cubic yard of material, they know how picky asphalt guys and how picky concrete guys are.
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So if you're going around grading out and getting this ready for asphalt, you're doing something, dude, and doing four companies at a time.
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Yeah.
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And so you said string lines and check and grade.
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I mean, that's how we always did it back in the day.
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Like when we first started, GPS was like this super high-level conversation, even more than it is now.
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Like it was unobtainable for guys like me and you in before the early 20s, you know, 2020s there, and and they started coming out with some products that made a little bit more affordable sense.
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But at the same time, like I'm assuming, did you enter the GPS world during the fine grading world?
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That was my big question there.
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Okay.
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Yep.
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Yeah.
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So when we entered uh and I'll call it machine control realm, when we entered a machine control realm, it was probably my second year in in the paving sector.
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And what we did instead of GPS, we did UTF.
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So we did uh total station guided grading uh for the tolerance because our tolerance were typically plus or minus quarter, three-eighths of an inch.
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Uh, so we ran a UTS system on our D5, and I would go out there with my little yeah, UTS rover, and I would go out and I would, you know, topo the entire lot and build a 3D file on the the tablet in the field, and then we would go bang it out and grade it.
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And it took our grading up from like, I think we were doing anywhere from 40 to 65,000 square foot, you know, with string line to 80 to 120,000 square foot in a day.
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With at least one one less guy, I would assume as well.
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One less guy.
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Yeah, well, we put that other guy in an excavator ripping ash flow out, so we're using them somewhere else making money.
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Yeah.
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And on top of that, I didn't have to be in the seat.
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Yep.
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That's where I was literally that's literally where I was going next, is like, yeah, where what kind of a rocket launch after that?
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I I you said you earlier made earlier mention that you kind of um moved away from the fine grading when obviously this this is about when underground's really starting to take off for you, I'm assuming, as well.
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Right there.
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And then obviously you've already had machine control.
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Um, did you have any machine control excavators indicate anything like that on on your underground side of things?
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Uh not at not at that point.
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We did end up getting uh a 245 John Deere has 3D earthworks on it.
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Um, and specifically, it's actually not for the pipe side, it's we use it uh primarily just for grading tight lots where you can't get a dozer in.
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You know, we do like there's a point where we were doing a ton of condos uh where they stuff them in and you got 10 feet, 12 feet, and and you know, in between them.
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So our 245 will fit in in there, and you can just grade out for sidewalks using GPS, and it was it was baller, it worked great.
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Pipe sign, I got a little old school mentality.
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I'm uh well, I can grade faster than that machine, so we're gonna pound some pipe in.
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So, you know, it's funny, and that's kind of I was kind of hoping you would say that is that's exactly what we're kind of seeing down here.
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We're we don't have any we had an eye machine on the dozer and the earthwork side of things, but never on the excavator side of things for the pipe guys, always basin rover, very traditional.
00:18:01.599 --> 00:18:09.839
Um, but at the same time, we've demoed a couple of these fully auto machines, and for pipe, I'm like, man, dude, I get it.
00:18:09.920 --> 00:18:15.359
It's it's like finite, but man, does that not just slow you down like crazy?
00:18:15.519 --> 00:18:18.559
And so we've been kind of going back and forth.
00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:34.000
Um, but I do uh I will kind of throw a shameless plug here for CHC Nav, this GPS stuff that we've been using, we've got it bolted on our 210, and it is two sensors straight to the iPad, two pucks.
00:18:34.079 --> 00:18:36.240
It's super simple, real-time elevation.
00:18:36.400 --> 00:18:45.279
And I will tell you, I have seen gains and benefits um with one guy in the tracco, but he's still got to operate.
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:53.839
He's got a line now that you know indicate makes a little bit more sense, in my opinion, than having a fully auto excavator.
00:18:53.920 --> 00:18:54.720
Is it precise?
00:18:54.880 --> 00:18:56.000
No argument there.
00:18:56.160 --> 00:19:01.440
Uh, I I get all that, but we've been precise for so long without it.
00:19:01.599 --> 00:19:03.440
I don't want it slowing me down.
00:19:03.599 --> 00:19:05.200
You can't keep it in fully auto.
00:19:05.440 --> 00:19:08.240
So that's kind of my argument there with excavators.
00:19:08.559 --> 00:19:11.440
But um what brand did you go with?
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.240
Just by so I I'm a trimble guy.
00:19:14.319 --> 00:19:20.400
I I start I tried TopCon for a year, and we ended up actually selling all of our Trimble gear to go to TopCon.
00:19:20.640 --> 00:19:22.960
And I said, hey, no, this ain't working for us.
00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:25.119
Our customer support, it was okay.
00:19:25.279 --> 00:19:30.079
I like my sales rep, but Topcon itself wasn't wasn't doing what we needed to.
00:19:30.240 --> 00:19:32.960
So we switched back to Trimble and we went all in in Triple.
00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:36.799
I think we got two fully automated GPS auto dozers.
00:19:36.960 --> 00:19:43.039
Uh, you got a 3D excavator, I got another cab kit coming for a dozer uh probably two months.
00:19:43.200 --> 00:19:47.200
Um, and then we're probably gonna, depending on how we're doing our dirt true.
00:19:47.279 --> 00:19:48.319
I'm still trying to figure that out.
00:19:48.400 --> 00:19:52.000
We might end up going indicate only on the excavators, just so we know where we're at.
00:19:52.079 --> 00:19:55.519
And that's you know, to go back on your point, indicate only.
00:19:55.599 --> 00:19:59.759
You don't you don't want to take the autos away to where you eliminate the skill.
00:19:59.920 --> 00:20:07.279
You need the skill, but you you have the autos there to make a good operator look better, not a bad operator look okay.
00:20:07.440 --> 00:20:20.000
And that's I'm I'm a big proponent of you know, even my my new dozer operators, we throw them on a D6R four-way blade for a year and say, hey, you got to fine grade with this, you know, and they do, dude.
00:20:20.240 --> 00:20:28.400
I in your money ahead in your training program doing that because having GPS only operators, like there's a time and a place for it.
00:20:28.480 --> 00:20:38.319
But I had that iMachine, and I'll tell you, I probably only use that machine 20 minutes out of the 3,000 hours that was in our fleet that under the GPS, just to say I did it.
00:20:38.400 --> 00:20:46.960
Like when I get in it, it's therapeutic almost for me to design build a pad, and like it's not even something you're really thinking about and checking great.
00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:48.720
And but it that's the way you started.
00:20:48.799 --> 00:20:52.400
Like, that's that's the uh in my opinion, and probably yours, Matt.
00:20:52.559 --> 00:20:55.759
Shared here, like you have to learn in your seat.
00:20:55.839 --> 00:21:01.759
It's not your hands, it's second nature, you should see it, feel it, and and and know it.
00:21:02.000 --> 00:21:11.279
So you can uh not just trust this GPS system, but you can also verify it when you're like, man, that pass just looks completely different than the rest.
00:21:11.440 --> 00:21:11.839
Why?
00:21:12.160 --> 00:21:17.279
Oh well, this tenth, whatever, we we can go off into, but you've got to.
00:21:17.440 --> 00:21:30.000
I think there's such a race where I was going with all this, is there's such a race to uh import this 18-year-old straight out of high school directly into that machine, and he should just be able to be proficient day one.
00:21:30.480 --> 00:21:34.319
I don't think we're ever gonna get away in our trade from training.
00:21:34.720 --> 00:21:41.200
Like I'm sorry, especially pipe guys, like it's just not going to happen.
00:21:41.359 --> 00:21:52.000
So, in my opinion, I think we need to be a little bit more focused on uh training as an operator rather than just having the machine do it for them, right?
00:21:52.160 --> 00:21:58.960
As owners, we're sitting here trying to navigate so many different styles of um.
00:22:00.400 --> 00:22:03.039
You've got the younger generation, you've got this older generation.
00:22:03.119 --> 00:22:06.079
And this older generation doesn't want anything to do with GPS.
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:12.160
Some of them have dealt with it a little bit, but this younger generation coming in, obviously, they've already been on a tablet.
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:13.839
It's much easier to transfer.
00:22:14.000 --> 00:22:16.160
But there has to be some type of fine line.
00:22:16.240 --> 00:22:37.839
And I'd love to hear your input on this because that fine line for me is you have to have some type of grade base knowledge, uh, no pun intended there, but literally just baseline knowledge of how that equipment operates before we start worrying about a specific task uh for profitability, et cetera.
00:22:38.000 --> 00:22:43.440
Like you have got to have spent some time, number one, to ensure that nobody's going to get hurt.
00:22:43.680 --> 00:22:49.359
Like I get it, we can put all these walls and these ceilings and all this stuff on this excavator.
00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:58.960
But if that guy doesn't have a freaking clue what he's doing and never been on a job site for more than a week or two, let's not stick them in a 80,000 pound, oh, it might kill somebody in a swipe.
00:22:59.200 --> 00:23:03.759
Like, we just need to have a little bit more thinking knowledge than that, in my opinion.
00:23:03.839 --> 00:23:05.039
What's your thoughts?
00:23:05.279 --> 00:23:06.640
Yeah, no, I totally agree.
00:23:06.799 --> 00:23:10.880
I think, you know, for for us, like there's there's two takes on this, right?
00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:19.839
One, my take is like you went to Con Expo, you've seen how everybody's got efense now, everybody's got they're they're jamming tech into these excavators.
00:23:19.920 --> 00:23:23.200
And I had a salesman walk walk up to me and he says, Hey, what do you think about all this tech?
00:23:23.279 --> 00:23:26.319
I'm like, dude, great, it's just something to go wrong.
00:23:26.400 --> 00:23:28.160
And I mean, real operators don't need it.
00:23:28.240 --> 00:23:31.599
And I and you know, of course, everybody laughs when you say real operators, right?
00:23:31.680 --> 00:23:38.160
But at the at the end of the day, this trade, one, it can't go anywhere, right?
00:23:38.240 --> 00:23:43.119
We we have a need for qualified skilled operators with this.
00:23:43.519 --> 00:23:52.640
If we don't fill that gap and fill like pass the knowledge on, then there's gonna be two things that happen.
00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:57.839
One, the lack, there's gonna be a lack of quality, and project cost is gonna skyrocket.
00:23:58.400 --> 00:24:06.319
The second thing is the guys that have the skilled trade, the guys that invested in your people and training them the right way, are gonna make a ton of money.
00:24:06.559 --> 00:24:09.119
I mean, and that and that's just the simple fact of it.
00:24:09.440 --> 00:24:13.920
So you kind of got two roads to go down.
00:24:14.000 --> 00:24:16.559
You're at a crossroad, right, when it comes to technology.
00:24:16.799 --> 00:24:26.160
You can either buy the technology, which is gonna come the machines anyways, now you can buy the technology and force it down the guy's throat and say, Hey, Mr.
00:24:26.319 --> 00:24:28.000
18-year-old, come on in here.
00:24:28.240 --> 00:24:34.799
Or you can do the hard thing and say, it's gonna take you five years to be a qualified operator and you're starting in a shovel.
00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:49.119
And in my opinion, the guys who have and excuse my language when I say this, but when you have the balls to say that you're starting with a shovel and you're I'm not accepting anything less, and that is our standard, you're going to be the supreme contractor in the area 100%.
00:24:49.759 --> 00:25:03.599
Not only that, dude, the best operator on the site is also the best spotter because he spent absolutely years swamping for somebody and understands the visual line sight from that operator.
00:25:03.759 --> 00:25:08.240
Like we can see it here, but if he's got a small hump in front of him, he can see it.
00:25:08.319 --> 00:25:09.279
No, you're not done.
00:25:09.440 --> 00:25:11.680
Clean it all off so he can see what he's doing.
00:25:11.839 --> 00:25:19.759
And until you've spent time in both situations, like everybody wants to be a daggum dirt guy and an operator and being a dozer tomorrow.
00:25:20.000 --> 00:25:21.839
And I it drives me crazy.
00:25:21.920 --> 00:25:29.839
Everybody wants to jump out there on a pipe crew and be the main line digging guy and don't understand any of the responsibilities that it takes.
00:25:30.079 --> 00:25:32.799
And you know what you said, you're right.
00:25:32.880 --> 00:25:40.720
I was at Con Expo, man, and I was seeing what I'm seeing, and I tell this to people all the time, they give me crap about running a little bit newer gear.
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:43.200
And I keep everything with under warranty.
00:25:43.359 --> 00:25:45.920
And um, man, I can't work on nothing.
00:25:46.079 --> 00:25:46.799
Like, can I?
00:25:46.960 --> 00:25:48.480
Yeah, can I die e something?
00:25:48.640 --> 00:25:48.960
Absolutely.
00:25:49.200 --> 00:25:50.079
Can I change a hose?
00:25:50.160 --> 00:25:50.640
Can I do that?
00:25:50.799 --> 00:25:51.680
Absolutely.
00:25:52.079 --> 00:26:00.720
But man, I cannot tell you how upset it makes me to make a payment every month and have to go work on something at the same time.
00:26:00.960 --> 00:26:03.200
It infuriates me.
00:26:03.279 --> 00:26:04.880
It's that should not happen.
00:26:05.119 --> 00:26:09.839
And so now, you know, uh, let me get not above my skis here in front of my skis.
00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:19.039
You were saying, like, yeah, I I am kind of excited, but at the same time, there's this like, yeah, just something else I gotta pay for to go wrong.
00:26:19.200 --> 00:26:25.039
And they're not building machines like they were, let alone 10 years ago when we started.
00:26:25.519 --> 00:26:27.359
Talk about 20 years ago.
00:26:27.680 --> 00:26:37.200
All of our influences that are older than us in the 50s, 60s, and 70s, they're gonna sit there and go, no, you need to go buy the cheapest machine you possibly can.
00:26:37.440 --> 00:26:42.720
And as long as it's got good life in it for what you're doing, repair it and fix it, etc.
00:26:43.119 --> 00:26:43.519
Yeah.
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:44.000
Uh-oh.
00:26:44.160 --> 00:26:53.359
Okay, go find me a machine pre-death, pre-EGR, pre-all the crap where I could actually work on it and when I'm done with it, it can go back to work.
00:26:53.519 --> 00:26:59.599
Find me that machine because that that's not a machine that you you you can own and operate.
00:26:59.680 --> 00:27:02.400
That there's dinosaurs out there and unicorns out there.
00:27:02.480 --> 00:27:03.279
I totally get that.
00:27:03.359 --> 00:27:11.039
But what I'm trying to get at is that no matter what, in the last 15 years, you've got to have them come out and plug into something, anyways.
00:27:11.279 --> 00:27:13.200
Make it their freaking problem.
00:27:13.359 --> 00:27:18.720
They're making a machine just for five years, literally to stay under the warranty.
00:27:18.799 --> 00:27:31.359
They're not making a machine like our grandfathers and our dads used to be able to go out, go down to the dealer, buy something for five years, and know that you're six through nine, I'm gonna make my money with that excavator.
00:27:31.519 --> 00:27:33.359
They ain't making that unit anymore.
00:27:33.519 --> 00:27:36.400
You can't keep it alive that long, in my opinion.
00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:43.279
Don't get me wrong, we're very, we're very equipment maintenance heavy, daily checklists, like we don't play.
00:27:43.359 --> 00:27:50.880
But at the same time, you can do all of that, have the dealer service it at 500,000, all the way to 4,000 warranty.
00:27:51.359 --> 00:27:58.079
You do have a nice machine at the end of that, but downtime, in my opinion, and I'd love to hear your opinion here, Matt.
00:27:58.240 --> 00:28:00.240
Downtime's my biggest fear.
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:10.079
Like, I can't it drives me crazy because it's not just the repair in the machine, guys, and I know we've been over this on the show, but it's the freaking two days of labor.
00:28:10.160 --> 00:28:13.440
You got a whole crew standing around waiting on the rental to get there.
00:28:13.599 --> 00:28:18.240
You got to get this machine worked on, and you got to get a rental there to get production going again.
00:28:18.400 --> 00:28:23.039
It's an extremely costly expense in our world.
00:28:23.200 --> 00:28:24.480
Matt, what's your take?
00:28:24.799 --> 00:28:42.480
Yeah, you got to be jumping out of this chair right now because so I've been preaching downtime for years, and and unfortunately, I was the mentality that I wanted to buy cheap and get into a machine at a lesser payment so we could be able to afford to build and grow as we needed to.
00:28:42.640 --> 00:28:53.119
I mean, you're you're talking to a company that three years ago we only owned one excavator and it was a 14-ton excavator, and now we own two 50-ton excavators and five dozers or six dozers, right?
00:28:53.200 --> 00:28:55.839
Like you don't buy all brand new stuff doing that, right?
00:28:55.920 --> 00:29:00.880
Like you kind of got to go to the Richie Brother auction and pick up a piece of junk once in a while.
00:29:01.119 --> 00:29:07.200
But you know, it afforded us to do that to set the footprint that we now have, and we're in the same boat.
00:29:07.279 --> 00:29:19.200
Like, we're we're pricing out brand new iron because it is cheaper for me to have a brand new iron than it is to pay my two mechanics, which I love my mechanics, but at the end of the day, cost is cost.
00:29:19.440 --> 00:29:21.359
The killer is the downtime.
00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:26.400
So let's say if a pipe crew is gonna make ten thousand dollars a day or fifteen thousand dollars a day, right?
00:29:27.119 --> 00:29:29.759
In that machine, your mainline digger breaks down.
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:36.240
It is not a four, three, four, or five thousand dollar repair, it is a twenty thousand dollar repair, right?
00:29:36.319 --> 00:29:39.039
Because you're losing what you could have made.
00:29:39.200 --> 00:29:48.559
Plus, if you're gonna keep your guys paid that day, you're gonna have to pay pay them payroll, you know, and it's it goes the same with you know equipment downtime as it is with reworks.
00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:56.960
The money lost sitting is more expensive than the payment if you take it over a day by day.
00:30:53.949 --> 00:30:55.869
No, I completely agree with you, dude.
00:30:56.029 --> 00:30:59.470
And I'm take my main lane mainline digger.
00:30:59.709 --> 00:31:02.909
I'm dealing with this exact scenario right now.
00:31:03.069 --> 00:31:05.549
I got a 360 kamatsu.
00:31:05.629 --> 00:31:07.549
It's got 6,100 hours on it.
00:31:07.709 --> 00:31:12.829
I bought it, it was a Richie Brothers pickup when we were starting to move off into this earth moving lane.
00:31:12.909 --> 00:31:17.629
I needed a larger excavator to properly move cut and fill operations in and out of the side.
00:31:17.709 --> 00:31:21.470
Anyways, long story short, it's got 6,100 hours on it.
00:31:21.869 --> 00:31:27.149
The guys are sitting there going, boss, we'll make it happen this year, but you're looking.
00:31:27.230 --> 00:31:34.909
I mean, we do daily equipment sheets, and they remind me, they'll send them to my email, hey, this still ain't fixed, this little thing, that little thing.
00:31:34.990 --> 00:31:40.269
And it's all a bunch of knickknacky stuff, but it will all lead to a major downtime item.
00:31:40.429 --> 00:31:43.869
And big iron means big problems, means big money.
00:31:44.029 --> 00:31:46.509
There is no lie about that in this business.
00:31:46.669 --> 00:31:51.230
And so I'm sitting here going, okay, I got a 6,000 hour tracco.
00:31:51.470 --> 00:31:54.429
Will it do the same job as the new tracco?
00:31:54.750 --> 00:31:56.029
Absolutely it will.
00:31:56.269 --> 00:32:05.389
But let me just run this scenario down for you guys when me and Matt are talking about 6,000-hour uh tracco, three, 80,000-pound tracco.
00:32:05.549 --> 00:32:07.230
Will it dig water, sewer, and storm?
00:32:07.389 --> 00:32:10.029
Absolutely no problem in a in a subdivision.
00:32:10.349 --> 00:32:18.029
But when it does go down, and she's going to probably go down at some point this year, not by any abuse.
00:32:18.109 --> 00:32:21.149
I'm just talking general wear and tear, it's 6,000 hours.
00:32:21.309 --> 00:32:24.829
When she goes down, that is not, that's across state lines.
00:32:24.909 --> 00:32:27.069
So I got to find a way to get it to a shop.
00:32:27.149 --> 00:32:30.589
And we don't really have many local shops that work on old iron anymore.
00:32:30.669 --> 00:32:32.029
They're not a thing anymore.
00:32:32.189 --> 00:32:34.269
It's basically the dealer or bust.
00:32:34.429 --> 00:32:38.109
So I've either got to pay the dealer to come out or find a third-party guy.
00:32:38.189 --> 00:32:38.509
Yep.
00:32:38.589 --> 00:32:39.789
Uh, shout out to Heave.
00:32:39.869 --> 00:32:41.629
I could use Heave, Alex, there you go.
00:32:41.789 --> 00:32:48.829
But at the same time, I it's not just the$15,000 repair with this big iron I've got to deal with.
00:32:48.990 --> 00:33:01.709
I got to find another digger the same size that's$10,000 a month or$15,000 a month to get up there, run the two weeks or maybe the four weeks, or maybe the month, or whatever it takes until that repair is done.
00:33:02.029 --> 00:33:09.149
And I've also got to pay labor downtime two or three times while this is all happening and taking place.
00:33:09.309 --> 00:33:11.230
So that you okay, let's just be fair.
00:33:11.309 --> 00:33:15.789
Matt, would you say on that$15,000 repair rental all in 30K?
00:33:16.589 --> 00:33:17.470
Oh, easily.
00:33:17.629 --> 00:33:18.429
All day long.
00:33:18.750 --> 00:33:18.990
Okay.
00:33:19.230 --> 00:33:22.269
So how much how much would your payment be on an expeditor, though?
00:33:22.509 --> 00:33:22.990
Here we go.
00:33:23.470 --> 00:33:26.189
How like a part is$30,000 pay your monthly?
00:33:26.509 --> 00:33:28.990
So I I see it every day.
00:33:29.470 --> 00:33:34.189
So I'm sitting here kind of giddy because I knew this answer was uh this question was coming.
00:33:34.429 --> 00:33:38.829
Because at the same time, I can take$1,400 extra dollars a month.
00:33:38.990 --> 00:33:41.549
I'm still making a payment on the$66,000 hours.
00:33:41.629 --> 00:33:43.789
It's not much, but it is it is a payment.
00:33:43.869 --> 00:33:47.629
It's$1,400 extra a month, and I can have me a brand new unit.
00:33:47.789 --> 00:33:50.349
The guys are gonna be jumping for joy.
00:33:50.509 --> 00:33:54.509
They're my and and that's another thing that's a whole different off in the weeds.
00:33:54.669 --> 00:33:57.549
You got to keep your guys happy, keep them in newer iron, they love it.
00:33:57.709 --> 00:34:06.349
But at the same time, that$1,400 over 12 months, they have all the PM agreements, they have all the warranty.
00:34:06.589 --> 00:34:12.510
Anything that happens this year during my main season goes down, it's on them, has nothing to do with me.
00:34:12.590 --> 00:34:13.389
And guess what?
00:34:13.550 --> 00:34:17.230
We know they're piling a crap load of technology in them, anyways.
00:34:17.389 --> 00:34:19.630
Something's almost bound to happen, man.
00:34:19.869 --> 00:34:21.309
And so put it on there.
00:34:21.470 --> 00:34:26.030
So I can take a uh, let's say$60,$18,$17,000.
00:34:26.110 --> 00:34:36.510
So check my math there, guys, a$17,000, break it up over 12 months and get rid of the repair and maintenance item, or I can just roll the roll the dice.
00:34:36.590 --> 00:34:38.429
The guys aren't gonna be as happy, of course.
00:34:38.510 --> 00:34:42.110
They're in this old thing that air conditioner don't keep up, etc., etc.
00:34:42.429 --> 00:34:44.190
So, what would you do in that situation?
00:34:44.429 --> 00:34:45.949
Would you roll the dice?
00:34:46.110 --> 00:34:48.750
And uh, don't get me wrong, I know what me and Matt have done.
00:34:48.829 --> 00:34:49.630
We've done it before.
00:34:49.710 --> 00:34:56.110
We have rolled the dice on old iron and we've dealt with the experience of man, I freaking knew what I was gonna do.
00:34:56.190 --> 00:35:01.150
And here we are sitting, and everybody's calling me, and the track goes down, and we just shut the whole job site down.
00:35:01.309 --> 00:35:09.630
And then we feel even worse because we knew we could have done something about it, and so that's literally the scenario I'm living right now, dude.
00:35:10.110 --> 00:35:15.630
Yep, and the only caveat that I would say to that is we've been in business 10 years, right?
00:35:15.710 --> 00:35:19.390
I I'm lucky to have a six, eight-month backlog.
00:35:19.630 --> 00:35:25.789
Um, guys, the guys that are in this first, second, third, maybe even fourth year, guys.
00:35:26.030 --> 00:35:27.550
Maybe new iron isn't it?
00:35:27.630 --> 00:35:37.230
You need maybe you need a light payment to get you through the light times, or maybe you guys got to do an RPO system where you're renting, and if you hey, I got that six-month backlog, okay.
00:35:37.390 --> 00:35:38.829
Now let's buy this thing.
00:35:39.150 --> 00:35:40.750
Because it's very easy.
00:35:40.910 --> 00:35:42.750
I mean, Cat wants to give you credit, right?
00:35:42.829 --> 00:35:49.230
John Deere wants to give you credit, they want you to buy equipment, so it's very easy to get underwater payments, right?
00:35:49.390 --> 00:36:00.030
And that was, I mean, I'm sure the story is gonna come up, but I made I made a decision when my kid was born, and that was one of the reasons why.
00:36:00.829 --> 00:36:07.150
No, literally, Todd, expand on that because uh pretty impactful little story.
00:36:07.309 --> 00:36:11.950
Um, as business owners, a lot of people listening to this show.
00:36:12.030 --> 00:36:17.470
If you're not an entrepreneur, you won't get what he's fixing to say because I've been in those moments.
00:36:17.550 --> 00:36:18.590
I've been in those shoes.
00:36:18.750 --> 00:36:27.550
It hit me pretty hard when he said it because I I was there and um it only took me a couple extra extra ones to realize it.
00:36:27.710 --> 00:36:30.430
But uh please share share that story if you don't mind.
00:36:30.750 --> 00:36:34.350
Yeah, so and I'm gonna start off and give a little context on the story.
00:36:34.510 --> 00:36:40.030
So 2021, we were doing right around 1.4, 1.5 million dollars a year.
00:36:40.190 --> 00:36:43.630
Um, and then 2000, so it's uh 2020.
00:36:43.789 --> 00:36:50.350
2021, we were able to line up somewhere close to three million dollars in the work.
00:36:50.670 --> 00:37:02.269
Well, same thing when I was talking to the payments, you can have all the work you want, but if you don't have the cash flow coming in and the checks declaring, those payments aren't gonna do you any good.
00:37:02.350 --> 00:37:10.350
They're boat anchors, so we ended up having$1.8 million uh late pay us 180 days, which you know put us in a terrible spot.
00:37:10.510 --> 00:37:12.350
And we spent years rebuilding.
00:37:12.510 --> 00:37:16.110
Um, so we I got married in 21, beautiful wife.
00:37:16.269 --> 00:37:18.110
Uh, very, very lucky to have her.
00:37:18.190 --> 00:37:20.910
She's actually my office manager in my company.
00:37:21.150 --> 00:37:23.630
And at 22, we had our first kid.
00:37:23.950 --> 00:37:31.230
Um, the day my kid was born, and I remember you know, people that have a kid, you know, you they have the kid, then you got to step out for a minute.
00:37:31.390 --> 00:37:33.230
Um, I walked down to the front of the hospital.
00:37:33.309 --> 00:37:37.870
I called my dealership and I said, All right, we're selling seven pieces of equipment, and then I fired 10 people that day.
00:37:37.950 --> 00:37:41.550
I mean, before I even walked back up to see my kid again.
00:37:41.710 --> 00:37:45.550
And that was my life-changing moment because I was being drowned.
00:37:45.630 --> 00:37:53.870
I was I was being held down by this anchor, equipment payments, bad people, um, you know, dead weight.
00:37:54.190 --> 00:38:01.070
And there's a certain point where, like, okay, I wanted to be a nice boss, I want to build a culture, but man, what's it worth?
00:38:01.309 --> 00:38:09.550
And now, now being four years into my my kid's life, now I can look at we know what the real mission is, right?
00:38:09.630 --> 00:38:15.630
The real mission is your family, the real mission is your kids, your wife, your friends, your mom and dad.
00:38:15.950 --> 00:38:17.950
This business is a side mission, right?
00:38:18.030 --> 00:38:20.030
Don't don't let it consume your life.
00:38:20.190 --> 00:38:24.750
And that was one of the big things is hey, these payments, they're consuming my life.
00:38:24.910 --> 00:38:27.470
These this dead weight guys, they're consuming my life.
00:38:27.710 --> 00:38:29.630
We gotta, we gotta cleanse.
00:38:30.910 --> 00:38:32.430
So impactful.
00:38:32.750 --> 00:38:35.710
I did the same thing uh in 2023.
00:38:36.110 --> 00:38:41.390
Uh in 24, we had a small layoff, not a small layoff, I laid off six guys right there.
00:38:41.470 --> 00:38:45.789
That's not small to me for an operation that's you know 30 or 20 in size.
00:38:45.950 --> 00:38:57.950
Like, you know, Matt, and you probably can agree with this because it sounds like we got caught up in the same thing and it was caught up in owning equipment and uh having people rather than making money.
00:38:58.110 --> 00:39:04.190
And it's so easy, like it's so easy in our line of work for what you just said, man.
00:39:04.269 --> 00:39:11.070
In our industry, everybody and our overhead lines, guys, are ridiculous.
00:39:11.230 --> 00:39:22.750
Like, we we decided to pick the most capital-intensive and the most overhead heavy business to operate out of any of the subcontractors, in my opinion, on a commercial site.
00:39:22.910 --> 00:39:31.150
Like the amount of iron that we have to have, it's doubled like a skid steer when you bought it in 2015 compared to what you're buying now, it boggles your mind.
00:39:31.309 --> 00:39:31.870
I bought it for six.
00:39:32.350 --> 00:39:32.829
Makes you cry.
00:39:33.390 --> 00:39:34.510
It does, dude.
00:39:34.750 --> 00:39:39.150
59,000, all the bells and whistles and 16 AC and heat.
00:39:39.230 --> 00:39:40.990
Buddy, I thought I was top of the world.
00:39:41.230 --> 00:39:52.430
When we we traded in our uh D3 model Caterpillar and got one of these 265s, 120 something plus thousand dollars, and I about fell over.
00:39:52.670 --> 00:39:54.990
I couldn't believe it just in a 10-year span.
00:39:55.309 --> 00:40:10.110
And so um no man, I completely want to say thank you for sharing that because there is so many moments in our walks, walks of faith, walks with our with our family.
00:40:10.350 --> 00:40:11.390
You're exactly right.
00:40:11.550 --> 00:40:16.990
We get so caught up, and it's so easy, even good people, like people that you would never guess.
00:40:17.150 --> 00:40:19.870
Like, you just get caught up, you're supporting this team.
00:40:20.030 --> 00:40:23.150
You have so many people reaching out to you all day long.
00:40:23.309 --> 00:40:26.750
All you're doing is fixing and band-aiding, fixing and band-aiding.
00:40:27.390 --> 00:40:35.230
And at the end of the day, you know, you finally get to the weekend, and you know, here comes Friday, and this has happened so many times.
00:40:35.470 --> 00:40:37.309
We just had the best week we've ever had.
00:40:37.470 --> 00:40:38.510
I want to celebrate it.
00:40:38.590 --> 00:40:43.309
Woo-hoo! But I never missed any ball games, I've never missed any of that.
00:40:43.390 --> 00:40:58.510
But if I didn't do something perfect at not perfect, but necessarily, you know, on track at home, and maybe I missed something that was important to the family, well then my beautiful wife would be not as uh intrigued as I guess I would be, you know?
00:40:58.670 --> 00:41:02.030
And that's where I was leading this into, man, working with your wife.
00:41:02.269 --> 00:41:06.990
Like uh we did a four-part mini-series here on the show that helped a lot of people.
00:41:07.150 --> 00:41:09.630
We were very vulnerable, it's not easy.
00:41:09.710 --> 00:41:16.269
We talked from sex life all the way to how do you do business and kids, like all of it.
00:41:16.430 --> 00:41:21.630
And it was uh very freeing, relieving, I guess you would see.
00:41:22.030 --> 00:41:27.870
Honestly, I learned so much about my wife during those four days, and I learned some things about myself.
00:41:28.030 --> 00:41:36.430
But man, talk about the dichotomy of working with the missus and uh how challenging it can be, but how rewarding it can be as well.
00:41:36.750 --> 00:41:37.470
Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:41:37.630 --> 00:41:39.470
Challenging is definitely the word for it, right?
00:41:39.630 --> 00:41:42.910
I mean, is anybody that anybody that doesn't know?
00:41:43.070 --> 00:41:50.190
I mean, you know, I I love my wife, and she is an amazing mother, she's an amazing wife, and she's amazing at what she does.
00:41:50.269 --> 00:41:54.829
She's uh she runs the office, she runs HR, and she just she does a great job at it.
00:41:55.070 --> 00:42:01.470
But also at the same time, there are boundaries that you have to be respected outside of the home.
00:42:01.710 --> 00:42:07.550
And in the workplace, you know, when we decided this a long time ago, we are not husband and wife in the workplace.
00:42:07.630 --> 00:42:14.430
Now, doesn't mean I'm not gonna go up down the office and give my wife a kiss, but that means I am 100% principal owner of this company.
00:42:14.590 --> 00:42:16.829
If I tell you to do something, it's getting done.
00:42:17.070 --> 00:42:19.550
And that was that's a hard bullet for people to swallow.
00:42:19.630 --> 00:42:26.510
I mean, even for us, it caused a lot of aminosity in our in our you know, because we were dating when we started working together.
00:42:26.590 --> 00:42:30.030
Um, dating first and then she came in, so to clear that up.
00:42:30.269 --> 00:42:35.390
Uh so when we got married, it was yeah, obviously easier, right?
00:42:35.470 --> 00:42:36.750
Because now she's invested, right?
00:42:36.829 --> 00:42:38.990
And she's part of the family, she's part of the business.
00:42:39.150 --> 00:42:42.030
Um, but in the beginning, it was tough to separate that.
00:42:42.110 --> 00:42:57.390
And even me, I mean, well, you know, I was young, I was just a baby, you know, and trying to trying to decipher how to navigate this business with someone I absolutely loved and adored, but I had to tell her, like, I need you, I need you to do your job.
00:42:57.710 --> 00:43:00.110
And she needed me to do my job.
00:43:00.190 --> 00:43:01.390
Like, it wasn't one-sided.
00:43:01.550 --> 00:43:04.110
Like, she needed me to be an owner, she needed me, man.
00:43:04.350 --> 00:43:08.829
We have broken systems, we need to fix them, you know, and okay, let's get it done.
00:43:08.990 --> 00:43:09.309
Right.
00:43:09.470 --> 00:43:13.309
And then you, you know, even to this day, man, you're not following the process.
00:43:13.470 --> 00:43:14.350
Follow the process.
00:43:14.430 --> 00:43:14.829
Cool.
00:43:14.990 --> 00:43:15.470
Thank you.
00:43:15.710 --> 00:43:17.230
Anyway, let's get on it, right?
00:43:17.550 --> 00:43:18.110
I know you do.
00:43:18.350 --> 00:43:18.829
Put it on for me.
00:43:18.910 --> 00:43:19.150
I'll be right back.
00:43:21.309 --> 00:43:30.190
Um, the transition we have been making over the last two to three years in 23, man, I had seven crews.
00:43:30.350 --> 00:43:34.030
We were going gangbusters, we had all the work running out our ears.
00:43:34.190 --> 00:43:39.630
Don't get me wrong, it helps to be in one of the fastest growing places in the country.
00:43:39.789 --> 00:43:52.350
But the one thing I absolutely sucked at, don't get me wrong, we had minimalistic systems, minimalistic procedure, um, core values that were understood, but never really read aloud.
00:43:52.510 --> 00:43:55.630
Um, we were just broken straight up.
00:43:55.950 --> 00:43:57.630
And that was my fault.
00:43:57.870 --> 00:43:59.550
That really sucked for me to hear.
00:43:59.710 --> 00:44:01.870
And I thought, you know, man, we're killing it.
00:44:01.950 --> 00:44:07.230
We got all these people, we're doing things, we got all the equipment, we're just rock and rolling, we're doing millions, hey, yeah, yeah.
00:44:07.550 --> 00:44:11.150
And then all of a sudden, you finally, I don't I don't know what the light switch was.
00:44:11.309 --> 00:44:22.829
Maybe the last person going, Hey, I'm I'm done here, or whether it was um my CPA, more or less than anybody, looking at me and going, Hey, you suck at business.
00:44:22.990 --> 00:44:24.269
You're an incredible tradesman.
00:44:24.430 --> 00:44:27.230
You have all the work coming out of your ears, there's no doubt.
00:44:27.390 --> 00:44:28.910
But you suck at business.
00:44:29.070 --> 00:44:30.590
I'm gonna help you get better.
00:44:30.750 --> 00:44:37.309
And it was those key mentors and key influences that didn't give up on me and went, hey man, do you even know what this is?
00:44:38.030 --> 00:44:41.789
No, actually, nobody's ever took the time to teach me and make me understand.
00:44:41.870 --> 00:44:42.990
I'll learn from you.
00:44:43.230 --> 00:44:48.990
And you know, from there, this was roughly four ish years ago.
00:44:49.230 --> 00:44:54.350
I really started working on me and really started working on me as a manager, learning.
00:44:54.829 --> 00:45:02.030
To be a leader, learning to be a manager, but also to working on systems and processes and disciplines within my own self.
00:45:02.269 --> 00:45:04.269
People only want to follow a true leader.
00:45:04.350 --> 00:45:12.350
And I wasn't acting like a true leader and had to the big man humbled me straight at my knees in 24, 25.
00:45:12.430 --> 00:45:28.030
And of course, this year was uh incredible rebuild years and then the systems and the things that uh it's just an encouragement is what I'm trying to get at is yeah, were those two to three years incredibly savagely, brutally hard?
00:45:28.269 --> 00:45:32.510
Absolutely it was, and most of the time it's the owner going, Yeah, I let that slide.
00:45:32.590 --> 00:45:33.870
Oh, I created that problem.
00:45:34.030 --> 00:45:39.470
Oh, I'm sorry, I said this that one time, and they take it for absolute concrete.
00:45:39.789 --> 00:45:47.150
But to really peel back not just the band-aids, but go to the core of the problem and go, why does this happen?
00:45:47.390 --> 00:45:52.590
Well, the estimator, da da da da da da, and that creates this problem in production.
00:45:52.670 --> 00:45:56.590
And by the time it gets to accounting, well, then why don't we start up here with estimation?
00:45:56.670 --> 00:46:11.870
Hey, show me why this occurs and really diving into these individualized problems that actually create seven or eight more problems for you, but it took time and with an exceptional team that didn't give up.
00:46:12.110 --> 00:46:20.750
And dude, talk a little bit about systems and processes because you want to talk about a guy that loves to step out of line with processes and his own procedures.
00:46:20.990 --> 00:46:24.910
We're so quick to just go, and it's for you, not for me.
00:46:25.070 --> 00:46:30.910
You know, I'm doing this to get that next job or whatever we want to tell ourselves in our heads as owners.
00:46:31.150 --> 00:46:44.590
But like, truly talk about those systems and good on good on missus for absolutely just hammering you, hey, this is broken, we need to fix this, and somebody that you love and care about telling you that you receive that totally different.
00:46:45.150 --> 00:46:45.550
Yeah.
00:46:45.789 --> 00:46:52.190
So I'm gonna touch before we get on systems process, I want to touch on something you brought up two times now, and I absolutely love it.
00:46:52.510 --> 00:46:54.990
So with equipment, right?
00:46:55.390 --> 00:46:57.950
And you said it with when you're running seven crews.
00:46:58.110 --> 00:47:00.829
I run seven crews and I have all this equipment.
00:47:01.070 --> 00:47:06.910
The biggest problem with this trade is ego, and you need to leave your ego at the door, right?
00:47:06.990 --> 00:47:15.390
If you want to be successful, you need to check your ego at the door and learn one, we're all in this together, right?
00:47:15.550 --> 00:47:23.309
And that's either you and your employees, you and your wife, you and your fellow contractor, your competitors, we're all in this together, right?
00:47:23.390 --> 00:47:25.550
And we're all dealing with the same stuff.
00:47:25.789 --> 00:47:29.630
But the other side of the fact is the iron's pig iron, right?
00:47:29.789 --> 00:47:30.910
We can get rid of it anytime.
00:47:30.990 --> 00:47:33.950
Like I buy off-road haul trucks for a job and I sell them at the end of the job.
00:47:34.110 --> 00:47:36.829
I don't care to have off-road haul trucks, I don't care to have excavators.
00:47:37.070 --> 00:47:38.190
It's pig iron.
00:47:38.590 --> 00:47:44.829
So the one the one thing I want to bring up, dude, you gotta you gotta leave the ego at the alignment and uh leave that door.
00:47:45.150 --> 00:47:48.990
But with this, ties directly into systems and processes.
00:47:49.150 --> 00:47:50.110
We have a systems process.
00:47:50.350 --> 00:47:57.070
Right before I jumped on this call, I have a truck driver walk in and goes, hey man, you didn't shovel out the box when you drove that sunlight the other day.
00:47:57.789 --> 00:48:03.309
And you know what I was gonna say is I was gonna make up an excuse and I was like, you're absolutely right.
00:48:03.470 --> 00:48:03.950
I'm sorry.
00:48:04.110 --> 00:48:06.190
Next time I'll shovel your box out.
00:48:06.750 --> 00:48:15.789
And with that, you cannot have a systematic and procedural company without leaving the ego at the door.
00:48:15.950 --> 00:48:21.309
Because when you're wrong, you have to show humility and say, brother, I made a mistake.
00:48:21.470 --> 00:48:23.710
I'm gonna go fix it, I'm gonna go make it right.
00:48:23.950 --> 00:48:28.269
And so with that, procedures and systems, life-changing.
00:48:28.510 --> 00:48:38.269
If you can get around the ability to take one, accountability and check your ego, and two, you got to look into the root cause.
00:48:38.350 --> 00:48:45.070
And sometimes that root cause, like when you're smaller, that root cause is gonna be you, you know, and I hate to be that way, but it was me.
00:48:45.309 --> 00:48:59.150
I made a lot of mistakes and we we lost a lot of profits from you know myself either not following a process that we had, which you know, up until two years ago, we really didn't have any processes, or not following any sort of processes, we didn't have them.
00:48:59.470 --> 00:49:02.829
And now we're at the point where I mean, we even had an email today.
00:49:02.910 --> 00:49:13.470
Unfortunately, we had to uh sever waves with an employee, and we got great feedback off it because we stuck to a procedure of how we were terminating the person.
00:49:13.630 --> 00:49:18.350
And one of them, one of our part of our procedure is we're gonna do it with kindness and we're gonna do it with clarity.
00:49:18.510 --> 00:49:22.030
We're gonna let you know everything that we're basing our decision off of.
00:49:22.190 --> 00:49:23.710
And they came back with feedback.
00:49:23.870 --> 00:49:30.430
Well, yeah, because of this, and because of that, we're like, man, the first thing we did when they walked out the door was fire up an email.
00:49:30.510 --> 00:49:31.710
We have to change some procedures.
00:49:31.789 --> 00:49:34.269
We are we have broken procedures we need to fix.
00:49:34.510 --> 00:49:37.550
And you know, does it make the situation any better?
00:49:37.710 --> 00:49:44.110
No, it's still a bad situation, but he has clarity, he knows what to do in his next position.
00:49:44.350 --> 00:49:48.269
We have clarity, we know how to fix it so we can prevent this in the future.
00:49:48.590 --> 00:49:53.789
And everything becomes smoother, clearer, and well functioning at that point, you know.
00:49:53.870 --> 00:49:58.030
Like I said, Pat, unfortunate story to tell, but it's real, man.
00:49:58.110 --> 00:50:01.070
I mean, those are the those are the bad things that nobody likes to do.
00:50:01.230 --> 00:50:07.950
And thank God for procedure, it got me through it because unfortunately, I'm I'm terrible at that stuff.
00:50:08.269 --> 00:50:16.430
No, dude, love, love the realness because I'm I'm so glad you drove that point home because you're exactly right.
00:50:16.590 --> 00:50:27.710
Um, in my opinion, I think this uh this trade and subcontract industry is literally ego-filled and ego-driven majority of the time.
00:50:27.870 --> 00:50:34.030
And majority companies that people see, there's not many owners that just like what we're doing, man.
00:50:34.190 --> 00:50:39.230
We're sitting here talking about all the mistakes and experience that we've gained over the last 10 years.
00:50:39.309 --> 00:50:42.030
There's not many people in our industry willing to do this.
00:50:42.190 --> 00:50:45.789
Number one, to even put them on sales as a public display.
00:50:45.950 --> 00:50:55.309
But if I can help one person not do what I did to get where I'm at, buddy, they're gonna be 10 times ahead of me and they're gonna be able to help me in 10 years.
00:50:55.550 --> 00:51:03.950
Like, but the other thing I want just kind of a small little add-on to that ego point before we go down the systems rabbit hole here.
00:51:04.190 --> 00:51:11.870
You know, it seems like about year seven, year eight, systems, in my experience, were more important.
00:51:11.950 --> 00:51:21.550
And more and more business owners that I talk to and entrepreneurs, especially in the trade space, they hit that seven, eight year, they figured out how to make a million rev.
00:51:21.630 --> 00:51:27.150
They're figuring out how to stay alive, they're figuring out how to pay their bills, pay all their taxes, all their stuff.
00:51:27.470 --> 00:51:35.150
But once they get to this point, they're like, it's this weird feeling, and uh I have a feeling you've probably experienced it as well.
00:51:35.309 --> 00:51:39.870
They almost start feeling like they're losing the grip on the business and they're getting replaced.
00:51:39.950 --> 00:51:45.710
And like, well, if this is in place and that's in place, well, what how are you gonna need my you know input?
00:51:46.190 --> 00:51:50.350
Or if you guys round table this, well, how am I gonna know what's happening?
00:51:50.510 --> 00:51:54.670
Well, if you check your dang reports, silly, you you'll see what's happening.
00:51:54.829 --> 00:52:27.710
And if you're doing your job and concentrated on being that leader manager, CEO, ops manager, whatever your title is, if you're more concerned with doing that and having your team provide you information, what I'm trying to get at is I I said it a couple episodes ago, and I I think I came off a little strong, but I literally said the whole point of being an entrepreneur is to be replaced and to have a business running efficiently without you being there every minute of the day.
00:52:27.789 --> 00:52:29.070
That's the whole point.
00:52:29.309 --> 00:52:38.430
But I think as entrepreneurs like me and you, Matt, we sit here and we we navigate our journey, but then there comes a point that it all gets different for us.
00:52:38.590 --> 00:52:41.150
Everything gets nobody prepared us for this.
00:52:41.390 --> 00:52:45.150
We just feel our are starting to feel comfortable about what we got going on.
00:52:45.309 --> 00:52:50.190
And here's this whole new level that we're not even ready for.
00:52:50.430 --> 00:52:51.550
And you know what?
00:52:51.950 --> 00:52:59.630
It's that weird revenue jumps as you start jumping revenue, but it's all about systems and processes and procedures.
00:52:59.789 --> 00:53:04.829
Yes, owner guys, we love to step outside of our own processes and procedures.
00:53:04.910 --> 00:53:07.070
But Matt, you're exactly freaking right.
00:53:07.230 --> 00:53:17.870
The amount of respect I have gained during this procedural change going, damn, we put that system together and I flat busted it, dude.
00:53:18.030 --> 00:53:22.430
I just didn't even, I was just old side doing it the old way.
00:53:22.670 --> 00:53:23.870
Guys, I apologize.
00:53:24.030 --> 00:53:25.390
Can you coach me through this?
00:53:25.470 --> 00:53:26.590
What's my first step?
00:53:26.829 --> 00:53:32.670
Navigate me through this so I understand the process to ensure that I in line with the team.
00:53:32.910 --> 00:53:38.750
Because a lot of these owners, man, especially those ego-filled owners, well, the team's over here and I'm here.
00:53:38.990 --> 00:53:40.829
That's not how it's supposed to work.
00:53:40.910 --> 00:53:50.430
You got to have I owner buy-in to elevate this team, and you're serving and supporting them, is how it's supposed to be.
00:53:50.590 --> 00:53:57.630
And just like myself, didn't quite understand all that because it was coming at me so fast while everything was growing, I lost people.
00:53:57.870 --> 00:54:07.390
Good dang people, Matt, over it that if I would have had a system and a processing plate, that wouldn't even have been a thing to begin with, of why they left.
00:54:07.630 --> 00:54:20.430
And so, anyways, man, no, I'm so glad you you highlighted that because I do believe this industry is filled with nothing but egotistical um maniac to get them where they're at, to be honest with you.
00:54:20.590 --> 00:54:26.910
But the guys like myself and yourself that are sitting down going, man, I've really screwed this up a couple of different ways.
00:54:26.990 --> 00:54:30.430
And and here's what I would probably do different and look at different.
00:54:30.510 --> 00:54:32.590
And you know, you said even back to equipment.
00:54:32.670 --> 00:54:38.990
I know we got a little far off into equipment, but RPOs, like these guys don't even know what an RPO is, what that option is.
00:54:39.230 --> 00:54:50.750
But again, to what you said earlier was if you've got six months of backlog, if you've got three months of backlog, and I through all of this equipment and people conversation today, sales is everything.
00:54:50.910 --> 00:54:52.910
Don't, don't navigate off of that.
00:54:53.070 --> 00:54:56.269
You gotta have sales before you can have people and equipment.
00:54:56.430 --> 00:55:05.550
And as you're going along this hamster wheel of death, you're gonna step off that for a second and just worry about all production or worry about all estimating.
00:55:05.630 --> 00:55:06.750
It all has to move.
00:55:06.910 --> 00:55:12.030
The team has to move, and you need to support and serve that team as they move all together.
00:55:12.269 --> 00:55:14.269
It may not be as fast as you want, Mr.
00:55:14.350 --> 00:55:14.990
Owner Man.
00:55:15.150 --> 00:55:16.269
Trust me, I wanted to go.
00:55:16.350 --> 00:55:17.950
We I know what the problem is now.
00:55:18.110 --> 00:55:19.710
We're not stopping until we fix.
00:55:19.950 --> 00:55:21.309
Push, push, push, push.
00:55:21.470 --> 00:55:22.910
You're gonna drive your team away.
00:55:23.070 --> 00:55:26.110
You've got to do it together, one step at a time.
00:55:26.350 --> 00:55:27.630
And you, Mr.
00:55:27.789 --> 00:55:37.070
Owner Man, have got to build every brick and every piece of wood to them stairwell because it is excruciating, excruciatingly hard.
00:55:37.309 --> 00:55:41.950
But the the amount of reward on the other side, and Matt, I'll let you kind of take it from here.
00:55:42.110 --> 00:55:58.910
When you walk out to that job in this process or system you have been begging for, and it's now implemented, and you're three or six months down the line, and you see the results or feel the results, or something's happening around you, and you're like, oh, you have that epiphany.
00:55:58.990 --> 00:56:06.030
You're like, oh my God, that used to not happen without me doing this, this, and this, and it's just here and it's happening.
00:56:06.269 --> 00:56:14.190
And and talk about a little bit of the other side of the reward for your people, job sites, projects, profitability, et cetera.
00:56:14.430 --> 00:56:14.910
Oh, yeah.
00:56:14.990 --> 00:56:15.230
Yeah.
00:56:15.309 --> 00:56:23.470
I mean, it's it's without saying, like, you know, everybody starts this out because they're either good at operating or they really want to do it, right?
00:56:23.870 --> 00:56:37.870
And you know, to go back to one thing you said, like, yeah, when I stepped out of the field, and let's say stepped out of the field, when I stepped out of an operating position and I started letting other people do it, like my purpose was lost.
00:56:38.030 --> 00:56:46.910
But was it more interesting to kind of analyze was that the employees' purpose were they gained purpose, right?
00:56:47.230 --> 00:56:56.430
They gained responsibility, and with that, like you know, systems and processes, you know, are like the tip of the iceberg, right?
00:56:56.590 --> 00:57:04.910
And for me, it was giving the guy like it was the leash to give the crew so they could be on their own, right?
00:57:05.150 --> 00:57:12.110
So we could train them to start walking next to us, and without the systems and processes to do that, it was trust.
00:57:12.190 --> 00:57:16.030
And then when they screw up because you're an owner, you're going to get emotional about it.
00:57:16.190 --> 00:57:19.070
When you get emotional about it, you make bad decisions.
00:57:19.390 --> 00:57:22.350
Now we have a system about okay, you made a mistake.
00:57:22.430 --> 00:57:23.789
Here's how we're gonna fix it.
00:57:24.030 --> 00:57:27.230
All right, it, you know, was it was it you know deliberate?
00:57:27.390 --> 00:57:29.789
Here's how we're gonna here's how we're gonna handle that, right?
00:57:29.950 --> 00:57:32.910
And there's no emotion in it, it's just calm, cool, collective.
00:57:33.070 --> 00:57:34.670
You know, and that's what the people need.
00:57:34.750 --> 00:57:39.789
They need they need to see the owner in their court supporting them.
00:57:39.870 --> 00:57:50.190
And need to they need to know what's expected of them, what's expected of them, how you know, if they do screw up, is it the end of the world for them, or is there opportunity for reform?
00:57:50.590 --> 00:58:04.030
You know, and as soon as you lay that out for them, as soon as you have this roadmap for your guys and they can follow it and say, okay, this is what I need to do to be successful, now your profitability goes up.
00:58:04.269 --> 00:58:08.670
Now your time frees up and you can start bidding work, more work.
00:58:08.829 --> 00:58:18.269
You can start developing other sides of the company, uh, investing you know, your time elsewhere, or you know, we talked about the most important thing spend it with your family.
00:58:18.430 --> 00:58:22.110
I worked 100 hours a week for five, six years straight.
00:58:22.590 --> 00:58:28.110
And I mean, there's times I hadn't seen my brother, sister, my mom and dad for two months, three months.
00:58:28.269 --> 00:58:29.309
I'm working.
00:58:29.710 --> 00:58:35.950
You know, it allows you to do the things that we were brought on earth to be able to do.
00:58:36.110 --> 00:58:40.190
And that's like I like I said before, the main mission, right?
00:58:40.350 --> 00:58:50.190
The family, the life, the the the you know, vacations with your friends, you know, you you can't do that when it all lands out of your head.
00:58:50.269 --> 00:58:59.150
And the only way that you get away from that is systems and processes, or fight it, fight it and pray to God your neck doesn't break when you hit the wall.
00:58:59.309 --> 00:58:59.630
Cool.
00:58:59.789 --> 00:59:04.430
We don't, that's just not that's everybody understood that it's respect, right?
00:59:04.910 --> 00:59:11.470
But how do you deal with people problems out there in the field when it should be a pretty systematic thing, right?
00:59:11.550 --> 00:59:16.910
And I'm not talking about, hey, this dude screwed up on an estimate or this dude used the wrong bucket.
00:59:17.070 --> 00:59:19.309
I'm talking about the dude that used the wrong bucket.
00:59:19.390 --> 00:59:20.910
How does he feel when he's going?
00:59:21.150 --> 00:59:24.350
If that's a part of my leadership, I care about how that man feels.
00:59:24.510 --> 00:59:29.150
I've got to navigate a workable solution past this point.
00:59:29.230 --> 00:59:44.430
Now, if if it's something, what I tell my guys all the time, if it's something that reoccurred twice, three times, same exact result from whatever's happening, there needs to be and it's negative towards us.
00:59:44.590 --> 00:59:45.789
We have got to change that.
00:59:45.950 --> 00:59:48.430
There is no reason it should continue two to three times.
00:59:48.590 --> 00:59:52.350
If it's a total accident, cool, it shed light on something.
00:59:52.670 --> 00:59:55.789
But um man.
00:59:58.030 --> 00:59:59.789
I just absolutely blanked again.
00:59:59.870 --> 01:00:00.829
I'm so sorry, brother.
01:00:00.910 --> 01:00:01.710
That's twice now.
01:00:01.870 --> 01:00:05.070
I've read two different I've read two different messages.
01:00:07.870 --> 01:00:13.630
Anyways, um there'd be another little edit at a minute here.
01:00:13.789 --> 01:00:15.390
Um that's where I was going.
01:00:15.550 --> 01:00:16.910
Jeep as tits, man.
01:00:16.990 --> 01:00:18.030
I'm so sorry.
01:00:18.350 --> 01:00:37.230
Um, nah, dude, the core values is where what I where I was trying to land back at is when you're going out to a job site, we came up with um, so we pay our guys off.
01:00:37.309 --> 01:00:40.510
I know it's a little different up there winter, but we work through the winter.
01:00:40.670 --> 01:00:46.670
So we give them from before Christmas, like the 23rd, until the Monday after New Year's.
01:00:46.750 --> 01:00:48.590
Nobody really does anything in the utility world.
01:00:48.670 --> 01:00:52.670
And as you know, takes an ex inspector to make any money in our world.
01:00:52.829 --> 01:00:53.710
They gotta be there.
01:00:53.870 --> 01:00:55.789
Federal holidays, they use all their time.
01:00:55.950 --> 01:01:03.309
So it's and at any point in the entire year, if there's gonna be family around, it's usually gonna be around that time, right?
01:01:03.470 --> 01:01:07.789
So as long as we have a year, that's somewhat of their bonus.
01:01:07.950 --> 01:01:10.350
Hey, go sit at home for two weeks, love you.
01:01:10.510 --> 01:01:12.110
We'll see you when you get back.
01:01:12.350 --> 01:01:18.990
Every the last two years, I have sent out these goal sheets 15 things professional, personal.
01:01:19.070 --> 01:01:20.350
I learned so much.
01:01:20.510 --> 01:01:26.269
Some things I don't want to learn about my business, but I'm glad they told me that I've got to fix because I don't want to lose people, right?
01:01:26.510 --> 01:01:32.350
But at the same time, dude, first hour, first day we're back, everybody's all relaxed.
01:01:32.510 --> 01:01:34.910
Hey guys, here's our seven core values.
01:01:35.070 --> 01:01:36.910
Let's talk about them individually.
01:01:37.150 --> 01:01:38.670
And families first.
01:01:39.070 --> 01:01:48.750
Um accountability drives excellence, safety uh drives, I can go on and on, but what it has done for me, I said all of that to say this.
01:01:48.910 --> 01:01:54.590
What it has done for me walking out to a job site and talking to a superintendent who made a bad decision.
01:01:54.670 --> 01:02:00.670
It's not a bad person, made a bad decision through the day, or even a labor hand made a bad decision.
01:02:00.910 --> 01:02:09.950
Hey man, is that uh teamwork builds excellence, or is that family first or or any of these?
01:02:10.190 --> 01:02:20.510
Like, can you point me in any uh core value that you agreed with me in front of the entire company that this is who we are, this is who we represent.
01:02:20.750 --> 01:02:21.870
What's going on, man?
01:02:22.030 --> 01:02:23.710
Is there something more that I don't realize?
01:02:23.789 --> 01:02:29.630
Number one, number two, hey, if it's not, and the response I've had, Matt, has been crazy.
01:02:29.870 --> 01:02:31.630
Man, you're right, boss.
01:02:31.789 --> 01:02:32.430
You're right.
01:02:32.510 --> 01:02:33.870
That's that's not who I am.
01:02:34.030 --> 01:02:34.990
I apologize.
01:02:35.150 --> 01:02:45.630
Like, even from guys that are like super stone cold, old head, rough around the edges, like they're even buying into it because I'm being so intentional with it, right?
01:02:45.789 --> 01:02:47.470
I'm also trying to carry it out.
01:02:47.630 --> 01:02:51.230
I'm revisiting it every month at our monthly get-togethers.
01:02:51.390 --> 01:02:53.950
We cook them breakfast every first Monday of the month.
01:02:54.030 --> 01:03:01.470
We talk about some housekeeping issues, but we also talk and shine a little light on somebody that has been providing the core values in a good way.
01:03:01.710 --> 01:03:08.829
It's a negative, it's a great tool to have there when a negative situation arises, but you also have to have some positive reinforcement.
01:03:08.990 --> 01:03:14.430
So if there's one system, you guys are sitting there scratching your heads, you don't know what me and Matt are talking about.
01:03:14.590 --> 01:03:26.750
If there's one system I can encourage you to do right now is make seven, even five, five core values of who the people at your business represent.
01:03:26.910 --> 01:03:27.789
What do they represent?
01:03:27.950 --> 01:03:29.470
What are you trying to do together?
01:03:29.630 --> 01:03:31.550
And watch what it'll do for your business.
01:03:31.630 --> 01:03:40.190
We can talk about production and estimation, and we can talk about all of that fine-tooth comb and every piece of rock and dirt.
01:03:40.269 --> 01:03:43.309
But at the end of the day, like Matt said, what's most important?
01:03:43.470 --> 01:03:48.750
It's you, your family, and also the families that you support and pouring back into them.
01:03:48.990 --> 01:04:00.750
And so that has been the major, major one for just dealing with little problems that really aren't that big of a deal, but need corrective change in order for profitability.
01:04:00.829 --> 01:04:09.150
And that's what they're all the systems and processes, they all need to understand that you guys control our profitability out there in the field.
01:04:09.390 --> 01:04:17.550
We, as the office, serve you, but at the same time, you serve back with information so we can track and understand these projects from your point of view.
01:04:17.710 --> 01:04:25.150
So I said a lot there, and that's probably a little bit to unpack, but maybe is there one system, maybe outside of core values, you may just agree there.
01:04:25.309 --> 01:04:31.309
Is there one system you would encourage these guys to nail down right now and stop what you're doing?
01:04:31.390 --> 01:04:32.430
It's too important.
01:04:32.990 --> 01:04:33.789
Absolutely.
01:04:34.030 --> 01:04:40.670
My favorite system we ever uh implemented is our first 30 and our last 30, how you start today and how you end the day.
01:04:40.910 --> 01:04:42.350
It is the same.
01:04:42.670 --> 01:04:53.230
Or, you know, so we got it's it's different for the pipe crew versus the mechanics versus the office versus the superintendents, but everybody's got their expected first 30, last 30.
01:04:53.390 --> 01:05:03.230
Our our crews, our dirt crews and pipe crews, you know, you're supposed to start the day by showing a form in plan in writing, right?
01:05:03.390 --> 01:05:04.990
That you've submitted the night before.
01:05:05.150 --> 01:05:06.510
And then we'll get to that in a minute.
01:05:06.750 --> 01:05:10.190
But you'll you'll you're supposed to have a meeting on site, right?
01:05:10.350 --> 01:05:11.950
Say, hey, this is what we're doing.
01:05:12.030 --> 01:05:13.550
You know, John, this is what you're doing.
01:05:13.710 --> 01:05:15.950
Dave, this is what you're doing, Zach, this is what you're doing.
01:05:16.110 --> 01:05:18.910
And then these are our production goals that we're doing for the day here.
01:05:19.070 --> 01:05:20.430
We're gonna talk about safety.
01:05:20.590 --> 01:05:35.630
We're gonna talk about here's the tools and stuff you need that you might not be privy to, and then it goes to you do your pre or your equipment pre-check and inspections, clean the windshields on the or clean the windows on windshields on the machines, and then you go to work.
01:05:35.789 --> 01:05:36.590
That's your first 30.
01:05:36.670 --> 01:05:48.510
Your last 30 is we clean up the site, we park the equipment, we fuel and grease the equipment, park it in an organized manner, and the foreman is supposed to submit a plan to our you know, company chat for that job.
01:05:48.670 --> 01:05:54.030
He's supposed to submit a written plan by the end of the day so the guys know what they're supposed to do the next day.
01:05:54.190 --> 01:06:00.269
And I watched that system be broke just-I mean, just last week, right?
01:06:00.430 --> 01:06:07.870
And I and I came on the site, just happened to come on the site for a seven o'clock meeting with a foreman, and I says, 'Hey, anybody know what they're doing?
01:06:08.030 --> 01:06:08.510
Let's know.
01:06:08.590 --> 01:06:09.870
You didn't do the meeting.
01:06:10.030 --> 01:06:12.110
Like this is not what we do, right?
01:06:12.190 --> 01:06:14.590
And the day turned to crap, no production.
01:06:14.750 --> 01:06:22.510
We had a rework, you know, equipment had a malfunction on it that we didn't catch, and all that stuff catches up to you.
01:06:22.670 --> 01:06:24.269
So our first three, last 30.
01:06:24.590 --> 01:06:30.670
If you start the day good and end the day preparing for tomorrow, you are setting yourself up for success.
01:06:30.910 --> 01:06:37.309
And that is by far the most important procedure that we have in our company.
01:06:38.510 --> 01:06:39.789
That's incredible, man.
01:06:39.950 --> 01:06:40.670
That's incredible.
01:06:40.829 --> 01:06:42.990
I may even steal it to be honest with you.
01:06:43.630 --> 01:06:45.789
Yeah, I'm I'm willing to share it.
01:06:45.870 --> 01:06:51.550
You can you can share it up on the community as well, because you know everything with me is pretty open book.
01:06:51.630 --> 01:06:54.350
We, you know, to go back in your core values, our core values.
01:06:54.750 --> 01:06:55.230
Is right there.
01:06:55.309 --> 01:07:01.070
It's uh humility, communication, integrity, and uh quality and safety.
01:07:01.309 --> 01:07:08.110
And to go back in your conversation, you know, like we talked, we had to you know part ways with an employee today.
01:07:08.350 --> 01:07:16.590
We had I had to make the decision because the the situation affected somebody else and it had lying involved.
01:07:16.910 --> 01:07:21.789
So we were terminating on the basis of integrity, right?
01:07:22.030 --> 01:07:28.750
The person that it affected, the guy lied to them too and affected their life in a negative manner outside of this organization.
01:07:29.789 --> 01:07:40.269
So I sat there weighing, like, right, we're gonna we're gonna fire this guy based on a uh you know value um you know misalignment, right?
01:07:40.510 --> 01:07:46.430
But what does it say to me now that I know what's going on, if I don't go back and help that person outside of our organization?
01:07:46.910 --> 01:07:53.630
And when you live your core values and you demonstrate to your people, your people are going to follow to a T.
01:07:54.190 --> 01:07:58.910
And when you do pick your core values, guys, I mean, maybe I said it wrong.
01:07:59.070 --> 01:08:02.269
I I still don't think the first three, last three is the most important.
01:08:02.430 --> 01:08:05.150
Them core values, we hire and fire based on them.
01:08:05.630 --> 01:08:07.550
And they are absolutely amazing.
01:08:07.630 --> 01:08:13.470
They're who we are, and you know, it it's not only when we built them, it's not who I am, it's who I want to be.
01:08:13.550 --> 01:08:16.829
Who do I what do I want to build this company to and what is important?
01:08:17.309 --> 01:08:18.750
And no ego.
01:08:18.829 --> 01:08:20.109
I said it before, humility.
01:08:20.269 --> 01:08:22.430
Leave the ego at the door, you know.
01:08:22.750 --> 01:08:32.590
So don't be afraid to get out of your comfort zone and and hey, maybe I don't like the version of me right now, so we can build different, you know what I mean?
01:08:32.909 --> 01:08:34.510
Just starts today, buddy.
01:08:34.670 --> 01:08:37.710
Just starts by making a different decision for a different result.
01:08:37.949 --> 01:08:40.909
One last question for you, buddy, before we get out of here.
01:08:41.149 --> 01:08:43.869
Um, ask every single episode.
01:08:43.949 --> 01:08:45.710
I think we're like 85 or 86.
01:08:45.789 --> 01:08:47.229
It's incrazy, man.
01:08:47.309 --> 01:08:50.989
We're encroaching on 100 episodes very, very quickly.
01:08:51.229 --> 01:08:54.189
Got a little something coming for you guys too for the 100th episode.
01:08:54.350 --> 01:08:55.789
So be staying tuned.
01:08:56.029 --> 01:09:07.229
Um, man, what's the takeaway maybe for you yourself back at 20 years old making or running 100 hours a week, or maybe somebody on your crew that you're seeing is like checking out just a little bit.
01:09:07.390 --> 01:09:13.550
What's the takeaway for those guys that are just mentally, physically, emotionally, they're just stuck in the mud?
01:09:13.710 --> 01:09:15.869
Something in life, maybe some at work.
01:09:16.590 --> 01:09:25.230
Give them a little bit of uh advice to get past this hurdle in life, as you've obviously scaled a few of them, just like me.
01:09:26.029 --> 01:09:30.350
Yeah, so anybody that wants to look me up, I'm on LinkedIn.
01:09:30.590 --> 01:09:32.750
Um, I'll be honest with you.
01:09:34.510 --> 01:09:38.670
I was going through our toughest time and I shared the stories raw on LinkedIn.
01:09:38.989 --> 01:09:45.069
Um, you know, there's there's stories of us talking about the 2021-2022 episode.
01:09:45.150 --> 01:09:50.989
There's stories of talking about me sinking an excavator and losing 50,000, 60,000,$70,000 on that.
01:09:51.230 --> 01:09:54.510
Um and what I gained from it was insight.
01:09:54.590 --> 01:09:57.949
I gained friends that I never thought I'd ever meet.
01:09:58.029 --> 01:10:06.510
You know, I I have the opportunity to be able to do great things because I communicate in an open way.
01:10:06.750 --> 01:10:12.670
And you know, with that, you're not alone, right?
01:10:12.829 --> 01:10:15.150
And we've talked about this in the green room.
01:10:15.390 --> 01:10:32.510
You know, you go through these hard times, and as a business owner, there is isolation in the way you feel, and the feeling shouldn't be that, but it is, and just remember that there's guys like me, and I look like I might have got it figured out and I don't, right?
01:10:32.670 --> 01:10:36.029
Sai, you you might look like you got it figured out and you got it figured out.
01:10:36.270 --> 01:10:36.989
No, sir.
01:10:38.270 --> 01:10:41.550
So we're and go back to the comment I made earlier.
01:10:41.630 --> 01:10:42.829
We're all in this together, right?
01:10:43.069 --> 01:10:50.989
Lean on people, lead on a friend, and yeah, maybe your friends at home aren't business owners, get on LinkedIn, talk to people, share your story.
01:10:51.230 --> 01:11:01.710
You wouldn't believe how much reverence there is in communicating with people that are going through the same thing you're doing.
01:11:01.869 --> 01:11:05.949
And while it may help you, it's probably gonna help them just as much.
01:11:07.150 --> 01:11:09.390
I would have to agree, man.
01:11:09.550 --> 01:11:18.750
The amount of people that we've that I've helped literally through the podcast, through the YouTube, or that's the whole reason I put myself out there is these amazing, just like you, man.
01:11:18.829 --> 01:11:22.350
You know, we had never really spoken up until this point other than LinkedIn.
01:11:22.430 --> 01:11:23.230
That's where I found you.
01:11:23.310 --> 01:11:31.069
And guys, if you're not on LinkedIn, here's another episode of the year, me talking about you need to be on LinkedIn.
01:11:31.230 --> 01:11:34.510
Um, it's a weapon as a business owner, it really is.
01:11:34.750 --> 01:11:36.510
But you're exactly right.
01:11:36.670 --> 01:11:40.270
It is a different demographic for sure.
01:11:40.430 --> 01:11:49.710
There is much more of an inclusive entrepreneurial mindset on there than there is on any other social or interest platform that I have found as well.
01:11:49.869 --> 01:11:57.230
You know, I've been daily posting this year on LinkedIn for my personal account, personal things I'm going through.
01:11:57.390 --> 01:12:02.829
Um, you know, my kids, my family, but also too, Sharon wins, but also Sharon fails.
01:12:02.909 --> 01:12:11.310
But no, I've I've read, um, and honestly, one of those posts literally was like, dude, this is my guy.
01:12:11.470 --> 01:12:14.110
This guy right here, don't give a damn.
01:12:14.270 --> 01:12:17.390
He's throwing it right out there, take it or leave it.
01:12:17.550 --> 01:12:18.590
This is my experience.
01:12:18.750 --> 01:12:21.710
I'm like, and since then, that's probably been a year or plus go.
01:12:21.949 --> 01:12:24.909
I was like, we gotta get and and and finally we're here, man.
01:12:24.989 --> 01:12:32.829
And what an incredible episode it was from just some small hourly insight from us talking, man.
01:12:32.989 --> 01:12:36.110
I really appreciate your time joining us today.
01:12:36.270 --> 01:12:38.350
Uh, where can we find you other than LinkedIn?
01:12:38.430 --> 01:12:39.630
You're a great follow on LinkedIn.
01:12:39.710 --> 01:12:41.949
Is there any other place that we're skipping over here?
01:12:42.270 --> 01:12:43.710
You know, I'm I'm on LinkedIn.
01:12:43.789 --> 01:12:45.470
I don't do a whole lot on Facebook.
01:12:45.630 --> 01:12:50.029
Um, yeah, you can you can follow the company on Facebook, Instagram, stuff like that.
01:12:50.190 --> 01:12:54.270
But LinkedIn, if you want to know the raw and the real, LinkedIn is our deal.
01:12:54.430 --> 01:13:02.350
Um, that's that's where I share the trials and the tribulations, the wins, the losses, and that's where you're gonna get the real, you know.
01:13:02.510 --> 01:13:04.909
Besides, come up to Michigan, drive up.
01:13:05.069 --> 01:13:10.190
If I'm not in the office, I'm on a job site, ask the secretary, and I'll give you an address.
01:13:10.590 --> 01:13:11.630
There you go.
01:13:11.789 --> 01:13:20.350
Well, we may uh our plan here over the next 12 to 24 months is to get out and about uh with the YouTube channel.
01:13:20.510 --> 01:13:38.590
And if you would have us literally come spend a couple of days, see what the difference is up there in Michigan compared to Florida or Arkansas or California, all over, but just the insight that would help the younger us now starting at I couldn't imagine starting at 23 and doing it all over again with what they're facing.
01:13:38.750 --> 01:13:39.949
And it's scary, man.
01:13:40.029 --> 01:13:40.590
It really is.
01:13:40.750 --> 01:13:44.909
And they just keep jumping into that 84 months, kids to your payment by God.
01:13:45.230 --> 01:13:55.069
And I'm like, guys, I'm telling you, uh, anyways, I will I will keep being here every single week with you guys with a new guest every single week.
01:13:55.230 --> 01:13:57.470
Yeah, there is a solo episode coming up.
01:13:57.710 --> 01:13:59.949
Shoot your questions in uh directly for me.
01:14:00.029 --> 01:14:03.949
I'll be reading those uh aloud on an episode coming here shortly.
01:14:04.029 --> 01:14:07.150
Uh that will be before uh probably after episode 100.
01:14:07.230 --> 01:14:08.270
So you've got some time.
01:14:08.430 --> 01:14:14.110
Just want to shout out our steel toe members that support the uh podcast behind the scenes.
01:14:14.270 --> 01:14:17.390
And again, shout out our sponsor, PadertSupport.com.
01:14:17.470 --> 01:14:20.590
Go check out for takeoff and quantification services.
01:14:20.750 --> 01:14:25.869
Guys, from all the support that we've had on this show, Matt, thank you again so much for being our guest.
01:14:26.029 --> 01:14:29.230
I can't tell you guys how much I appreciate it.
01:14:29.390 --> 01:14:40.909
Hearing your bits and peace, wherever you're at in the world, hearing how this show has affected you, how it's helped somebody else, or you have used this to send to somebody else.
01:14:41.069 --> 01:14:42.190
Man, this was my buddy.
01:14:42.270 --> 01:14:43.869
This is exactly what they talked about.
01:14:44.029 --> 01:14:45.470
Send it to them, share it out.
01:14:45.630 --> 01:14:48.909
It's only going to help the show and help more people at the end of the day.
01:14:48.989 --> 01:14:58.989
And that's the ultimate goal, is to, as you just witnessed and heard for the last hour and 15 minutes, is me and Matt sitting here going, ha ha, don't do all this crap.
01:14:59.069 --> 01:15:03.150
We done listen to us, start in year two, start in year one.
01:15:03.310 --> 01:15:10.510
And and there is resources nowadays to get plugged in to ensure that you're moving the correct way in business.
01:15:10.590 --> 01:15:18.670
And it's never correct, it's your specific way with the most amount of knowledge and education that you can have until you gain the experience.
01:15:18.829 --> 01:15:25.310
So, guys, uh until then, I really appreciate over the all the overwhelming support from YouTube.
01:15:25.390 --> 01:15:34.350
If you're listening to us, uh, we've got a huge bunch of you that are uh on Spotify and are very dedicated weekly listeners.
01:15:34.430 --> 01:15:35.789
I appreciate you guys so much.
01:15:35.869 --> 01:15:39.550
And until next time, we'll catch you next week, Wednesday at 5 a.m.
01:15:39.789 --> 01:15:40.829
Y'all be good.
01:15:41.550 --> 01:15:50.750
If you've enjoyed this episode, be sure to give it a like, share it with the fellas, check out our website to send us any questions and comments about your experience in the blue collar business.
01:15:50.909 --> 01:15:52.110
Who do you want to hear from?
01:15:52.270 --> 01:15:53.230
Send them our way.
01:15:53.470 --> 01:15:56.909
We'll do our best to answer any questions you may have.
01:15:57.230 --> 01:15:58.989
Till next time, guys.