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Welcome to the Leadership Variations Unfiltered podcast, where each limited run series tackles the leadership problems no one is naming.
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How women in STEM actually succeed, why leadership fads always fail, and where talent strategy breaks down when the stakes are the highest.
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Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, folks.
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I am Amy Blade and Chateau, leadership consultant and coach to Women in STEM, and your host of Leadership Variations Unfiltered Podcast.
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In this first limited series, Cracking the Code, from underestimated to undeniable, we spotlight women leaders in STEM who've risen to senior roles, often without the recognition they so deserve.
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Today's guest is Dr.
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Wanda Toro Torini, a trailblazing leader who's built and rebuilt success on her own terms.
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She began her career at Novartist, where she led national sales initiatives, helped launch blockbuster therapies, and earn multiple Presence Club Awards.
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But Wanda did not stop there.
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She went on to found two high-impact companies, Bullseye Innovations and Rocket Fuel Inc., developing her first in-market platforms that transitioned how healthcare professionals, or I've learned HCPs, engage with technology and commercial teams.
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As an entrepreneur, she spearheaded multimillion dollar sales strategies, led high-performing teams, and became a trusted advisor for life science organizations navigating growth, innovation, and physician engagement.
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Years later, Wanda made the rare but powerful decision to return to corporate life.
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Now serving as a top-performing rare disease specialist at another top 10 multi-billion dollar global pharma company, bringing with her not just the commercial excellence, but her hard-won wisdom.
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Wanda's story isn't about just starting over.
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It's about knowing when to pivot, how to honor your own evolution, and why defining success is sometimes the boldest leadership move of all.
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For women in STEM navigating reinvention, her journey is a powerful reminder.
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Your leadership doesn't have to look traditional to be undeniable.
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Welcome, Wanda.
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Thank you for having me.
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That was awesome.
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Can you just like travel around with me and just introduce me?
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I thought I'd like you to travel around with me.
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I'm in awe.
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Are you ready to jump in?
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I am ready.
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I'm ready.
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I'm really kind of sad.
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You are the closer of what's been a really amazing series.
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I've heard amazing things.
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Thank you for having me and including me.
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Many people don't know is Wanda is also a dear, dear friend and someone I look up to and just have admired for many, many years.
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I had to throw that in.
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Thank you.
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Thank you.
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Okay, let's start with what you built as an inventor, leader, and entrepreneur.
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Tell them, as an entrepreneur, something you built that you were the most proud of, and that you'd really like other people to understand about that chapter of your leadership.
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It's interesting.
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So I am very proud that I left a very comfortable corporate position to just try being an entrepreneur.
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I felt like when I was at Novartis, I was really blessed with a great team that recognized that I was always problem solving.
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I always needed something new to try.
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I got bored very easily and they took care of me very well.
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I had the opportunity to, like you said, launch multiple amazing oncology products, learn from some amazing people because I was a pharmacist.
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And when I got my PharmD, I did my fellowship and I had the opportunity to do a fellowship within a pharmaceutical company, which was a very unusual thing at the time for a healthcare professional to learn marketing and business.
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I pretty much thought I was always going to work at a hospital as a pharmacist.
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And in my soul, I really wanted to run a business.
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And I'm kind of going back a little bit, but it kind of sets the stage in the sense of when I was a pharmacist, I actually wanted to own my own pharmacy, my own shop.
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And then the big Walgreens and CVSs were taking over all of the mom and pop shops.
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And it wound up not really being a thing anymore to do that.
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But it was interesting because when I reflected back, I'm like, wow, that was like from college.
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I wanted to do something entrepreneurial.
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When I was looking for my fellowship opportunities, my dean was like, You're gonna get in.
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You're gonna get in wherever you want.
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I heard you've been doing really great, great work.
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And I was like, that's cool.
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And he was like, You don't seem excited.
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And I'm like, well, okay, this is I know this sounds like ungrateful and kind of weird, but yeah, I'm a science nerd and all of that stuff, but I'm also theatrical.
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I was like, I have this whole creative side to my persona, and I just feel like working in the ER and critical care, which is what I was going to be doing, is not going to satisfy that.
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And he said, Well, I have an interesting proposition.
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Novartis is exploring bringing in a PharmD in their marketing team for oncology to kind of help them understand oncologists how to market to them, how to educate them, et cetera.
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And I was like, sign me up.
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So I interviewed, it was one of the hardest interviews in my entire life, by the way.
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And I got in.
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But my point is that they took great care of me.
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But as I started listening to myself, I really believe like when you get nervous or upset, or like your body tells you when there's friction in your life, right?
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And a lot of times because of the outside messages that we've had from our parents or from other people, like you're gonna be awesome, Wanda.
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Then I felt like I was doing things more for them than for me.
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But what happens is that your body will tell you when you're not doing the right thing.
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And I know that you probably coach people on this, but it took me a long time to kind of recognize because the coaches that I had within corporate were coaching me to serve their needs, right?
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Within their organization.
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I don't think it was really well developed back then, where I feel like people and managers are a little bit more aware of kind of coaching the person and actually finding satisfaction and developing them and helping somebody get to where they're meant to be.
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That wasn't how it was before, right?
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Before it was like, we're gonna get you to where we need you to be.
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And so there came to a certain point where I was being coached amazingly, but it was for their purposes and not for mine.
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And I knew that I was going to a leadership position where I would be managing a team.
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And I thought, I don't want to be a grumpy manager.
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Like I know that as a manager, like you're actually you have the privilege of being able to influence people's lives and make them feel like they're working frictionless, right?
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But if I'm experiencing friction, then it would be very difficult for me to authentically do that for others.
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And so I realized that in order for me to be a good leader, whatever I was going to do, that I needed to follow my dream.
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So I would say to answer your question the long way, is that one of the things I'm most proud of is breaking that comfort and starting my own business.
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And I owned that business for 19 years.
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I technically consider myself, I still own one of the businesses.
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So it's still 20 years for that one.
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But for 19 years and tactically, I did a lot of things.
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I invented a lot of processes and procedures.
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And I say invented in the sense that I allowed my creativity to kind of meet my problem solving and create solutions to problems that didn't exist, right?
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I kind of start my solution building from almost like a visionary dreamer sort of mindset.
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Like I don't think of the restrictions first.
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I think of like, what if?
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Like what would be like the most awesomest thing?
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And then I apply the restrictions and figure out how to mold it according to that.
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So I did a lot of that process-wise for organizations, lots of pharmaceutical companies.
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And then I invented a texting application that solved a major problem.
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We won't get into it right now, but it was a big leap.
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I spent a lot of my personal profits on doing something that was like my dream.
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I was like, what if, what if we had something that allowed an audience to text for information and I could get their lead?
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And that was, yeah, 17 years ago, 17 years ago that I invented that.
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But anyway, so I'm proud.
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But when you think of like all these things, the biggest thing is being proud of listening to myself, I guess.
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And that doesn't happen consistently.
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Like I can say that now, but there were times where I was doing a lot of not listening to myself.
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But the biggest thing is being able to catch yourself and realize, like, whoa, okay, there's something wrong.
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It's not just about stress, because stress could be good stress, right?
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Like you could be working towards something that you really love, and it's stressful, but it's not depressing.
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It's interesting to kind of understand the nuances of your feelings.
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One of the biggest things is it's difficult to claim your brilliance.
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One, if you don't know what your brilliance is.
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The identity question.
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Yeah.
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And with time, I developed the understanding that there were a lot of different things that were influencing my identity.
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It could be either, and most of the time, is other people's expectations of you, right?
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As you evolve in life, and you may wind up being really good at one particular thing, but being good at something doesn't mean that that is your unique brilliance, by the way.
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You should be good at a lot.
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I was unfortunately good at a lot of things that didn't feed my soul.
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Like I just so happen to be really good at them.
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Right?
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That's so interesting, Wanda.
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I am constantly telling the women that I'm coaching, just because you're really good at something doesn't mean that's your next step.
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You want to be very purposeful in your development and just company, you said something so important.
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The company thinks, wow, this is a great opportunity.
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You want to think about is this the opportunity to use your words, feeds your soul.
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Fantastic.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And honestly, like I didn't get here like figuring it out myself.
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This is why I'm a huge proponent of tapping into experts, right?
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Yep.
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And even if, for example, even if you're a marketing expert to actually tap into another marketing expert because other people see you differently, right?
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They can give you feedback that's not clouded by your past experiences or what other people may have said to you or whatever.
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Like they see you as you are now.
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So I worked with, well, one, having you as a wonderful friend, it really helps.
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But you connected me with some awesome psychologists as well.
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IO psychologists, and I've worked with several different executive coaches while I was an entrepreneur and have kept some of those coaches while I transitioned back into corporate because I feel like it helps me stay grounded to what my personal goals are, right?
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Not the goals of the company when it was my own company.
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It would be these influences.
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It's one big thing where my father would always say to me since I was little, keep your eye on the carrot.
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It's like, keep your eye on the carrot, Wanda, keep your eye on the carrot.
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And it was very motivating to me.
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And he meant it really well.
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I mean, the word perseverance was this like constant like term that was used in our family and such.
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But what I had recognized in working with the coach is that mantra of keep your eye on the carrot also brought in these blinders.
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I remember the coach saying to me, So, what happens when a donkey is following the carrot?
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They're missing everything that they're passing by, and they never get to the carrot, by the way.
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So it's always there, always there.
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And what happened is I realized that as much as that was very motivating, that term was motivating for me, and a lot of my perseverance comes from that mindset that my parents gave me.
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I realized that I couldn't celebrate successes because I was always keeping my eye on the carrot.
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The donkey never gets the carrot, it just keeps on going.
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And by the way, misses all the awesome things that are happening along the way, which was something that I was doing, you know, as well.
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So it's interesting.
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I highly recommend folks to work with an expert, work with an expert like yourself to so that they can actually understand what their unique brilliance is, and then they can hold on to it and claim it.
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Thank you for saying that, but there's all different kinds of experts that are out there that might suit, you know, what your particular need is too.
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Absolutely.
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Absolutely.
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Yeah, and especially with running a business, I was constantly tapping into experts for all sorts of things, and it really accelerated my growth, which led me to actually start my company Rocket Fuel, because Rocket Fuel was really about acceleration, right?
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Being able to help other entrepreneurs tap into experts so that they could accelerate their growth and kind of sharing that it's okay to do that, right?
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So I would say I didn't find my first coach didn't come into my life until 10 years, like real coach, 10 years into me being an entrepreneur.
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And part of that problem, and I call that a problem because I should have had a coach way earlier in my career.
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But part of that problem was people saying, like, you got this, you're smart, you can figure it out.
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So what happens is that it kind of feels like a failure if I couldn't figure it out.
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So like getting help was in my brain, like admitting that I couldn't figure it out.
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But actually, oh, yes.
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I am so glad you said that because we women, this is a huge topic with women, even more than men.
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Men have their old boys' network, they're always helping each other and pulling each other.
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We women think we have to do it all ourselves.
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We have to do it.
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We're proving ourselves constantly.
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First, help one another.
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Secondly, find where our resources are.
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And thirdly, the coaching.
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I'm so glad we're talking about this too, because with the coaching, the coach directs our resources, the coach asks us questions that help us dig deeper to find out, well, what is the purpose?
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Where are we going?
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And by the way, how are we going to measure success?
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Because there's nothing wrong that you waited for a while to get to that point, you know, because you allowed yourself to form that identity.
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But getting there faster would have allowed you to, you know, figure out, well, how am I going to measure this?
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You know, and what we measure is what gets done.
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If we don't measure it, then we don't get it done.
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So it's your story about the donkey and the carrot isn't the perfect one.
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Yeah.
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There's no milestone.
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And the thing is, you have to be able to kind of like set what that milestone is along, you know, you have your bigger, your further GPS destination, right?
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But there need to be those like rest stops where you're like, exactly.
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I kind of made this and I made that.
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And you know that you're on your way.
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All right.
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I'm gonna jump into another topic.
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So I want to know about the courage to step away from your entrepreneurship and what it was like and to re-entering corporate life after 19 years, you said.
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And how did you come to see this for yourself as a strategic decision, not a you know, retreat?
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I mean, I see it as a, you know, really brave and intentional leadership move, but I want to know like, how did you frame it for yourself?
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Yeah, so I do want to be authentic, honest about like the journal.
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Please, unfiltered, Wanda.
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We're unfiltered here.
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Yeah, unfiltered.
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It sucked, right?
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Because when I started my business, I was single.
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I was in this process of kind of discovering who I was, you know, understanding what my unique brilliance was, which is this journey.
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And it was a very like self-focused kind of journey.
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I love helping people, I'm an empath, all of these things, but that's what my life was, right?
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My baby was my business, and I was very proud of my independence and all the things that I had accomplished.
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And like I was the one that invented catch words in my software program, and I built it from scratch, and I hired the techie people and all these things, and it was like my my thing.
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And then I met my husband, right?
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Then there are like shared decisions, right?
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There's the influence of like, okay, well, you know, along with this journey, which was amazing and extremely satisfying, there are a lot of ups and downs.
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It's a roller coaster, and you have to be willing to ride that roller coaster.
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And by the way, I was an adrenaline junkie, so I'm like, yeah, let's do this.
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I can handle it.
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So life evolves and your priorities evolve.
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And it's hard because I felt like there were things that were still undone, right?
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It's like, ah, but there's a sacrifice.
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If I like obsessed about finishing this thing, that by the way, keeping my eye on the carrot, in reality, my brain would have never been satisfied with achieving an endpoint.
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Like I recognize that now, and I still have to remind myself, right?
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I know personality-wise, like there would have never been like an end point at that point that would have been good enough.
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But I had to make decisions along the way, and then it's like, okay, I got married and I realized I want children.
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And this is something that's yes, sure, we raise families together as man and wife, or wife and wife, or man and man, or whatever, right?
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But as a woman, I had to recognize that I needed to actually incubate this child, right?
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Like I'm incubating this business and I'm physically having to incubate this child, and I need to make some sacrifices, I need to make some choices.
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And so it had been like this whole process of starting to kind of balance, balance, balance, balance after COVID, and it was fine, but after COVID, it was really hard because I was pregnant with my son during COVID.
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So it was just like, oh my gosh, I had a baby during COVID at 49, by the way.
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So I was like nuts.
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And my business had to change because my business model completely depended on live events, by the way, at that moment.
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So it was super traumatic and it was very, very tumultuous several years.
00:19:59.759 --> 00:20:08.640
And what I recognize is like sometimes you get to the point where you're trying to hold on so much because you are a successful person, right?
00:20:08.880 --> 00:20:11.839
Like, oh, people say great things about me.
00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:19.200
Like, if I don't succeed at this, that means all the things that I ever did just freaking go out the window.
00:20:19.359 --> 00:20:20.720
That's how it feels.
00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:23.440
It doesn't happen that way, ladies.
00:20:23.680 --> 00:20:24.960
That is not the case.
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:25.680
Thank you.
00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:28.880
You are still all those other things.
00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:30.880
But at the moment, it didn't feel that way.
00:20:31.039 --> 00:20:38.079
It felt like if I say no to this and drop this, that means I'm a failure.
00:20:38.319 --> 00:20:39.279
But I held on.
00:20:39.359 --> 00:20:40.799
I held on way too long.
00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:45.039
I should have just like been like, I need this like break to kind of think.
00:20:45.440 --> 00:20:46.960
And I finally made that decision.
00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:48.240
And it wasn't difficult.
00:20:48.480 --> 00:20:52.559
I'm proud of myself that I did finally make the decision in retrospect.
00:20:52.640 --> 00:20:58.240
I probably should have made that decision earlier, but my ego was holding on to it.
00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:01.680
It was just kind of like, I'm supposed to be a successful person.
00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:02.559
What happened?
00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:04.640
Like I couldn't recover from COVID.
00:21:04.799 --> 00:21:05.519
What happened?
00:21:05.680 --> 00:21:09.119
And then all of a sudden, I'm not where my GPS was sending me.
00:21:09.200 --> 00:21:10.559
Like I'm over here, right?
00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:14.319
Once again, losing sight that it's a journey, right?
00:21:14.640 --> 00:21:25.519
And I was looking at it, I'm like, I'm over here thinking like I can never get back, or I can never change, you know, to another destination that I might also really love.
00:21:25.920 --> 00:21:27.680
So there was a lot of turmoil there.
00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:50.799
So I feel like the success of the transition is one having done it, but then also recognizing that I needed a lot of coaching help to get me through the transition so that I can remember like what my brilliance was, right?
00:21:51.039 --> 00:22:04.960
So that I can have somebody else help me remember that I am talented and I do have all of these things to offer and I made a decision because of the circumstances that made sense at that point.
00:22:05.119 --> 00:22:08.400
Now I have stability, financial stability in my life.
00:22:08.559 --> 00:22:09.519
I could be a better mom.
00:22:09.680 --> 00:22:10.799
I could be a better wife.
00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:18.960
And I can also be a better visionary and problem solver, which is how I identify myself.
00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:27.599
I recognize that being entrepreneurial doesn't necessarily mean that you're your own boss.
00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:28.960
So how are you?
00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:29.680
Oh, sorry.
00:22:29.839 --> 00:22:30.079
Go ahead.
00:22:30.319 --> 00:22:31.200
Yeah, no, no.
00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:36.319
And then I could still be entrepreneurial as I return back to corporate.
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:43.759
And so I'm excited about actually, I mean, I have to realize like I did a lot of entrepreneurial things on my wallet.
00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:55.039
And now if I can apply all those things that I've learned, one in healthcare for the benefit of patients, which I love because I was originally a PharmD, right?
00:22:55.119 --> 00:23:04.240
So to be able to return to healthcare, but to be able to have financial backing to actually, you know, deliver some things that can have huge impact.
00:23:04.400 --> 00:23:06.240
I'm really excited about that.
00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:25.920
So that was my honest kind of like there's good and bad to the whole thing, but I chose to keep ownership of who I am and what my identity is because I think I looked at corporate in the past as something that was stealing away from my identity.
00:23:26.319 --> 00:23:28.400
And that's because I didn't know myself.
00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:43.680
So you found your identity in your entrepreneurial endeavor, and you were able to take your wisdom that you learned from that and re-infuse it into what you're doing now in corporate and still be able to feed your soul.
00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:44.880
Exactly.
00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:54.079
So you're having it all in terms of your family without burning yourself out or feeling like you have to do it in a way that society dictates for you.
00:23:54.400 --> 00:23:55.839
Yes, yes, yes.
00:23:56.000 --> 00:24:04.720
And now I get the opportunity to look at, you know, I still have my software that I would like to see be used more.
00:24:04.960 --> 00:24:12.000
And so now I realize, well, I'm okay with actually finding the right partner to kind of carry that torch.
00:24:12.240 --> 00:24:14.559
And before it was like, no, this is my baby.
00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:20.960
I have to, you know, and so there's an evolution, there's an evolution to that whole process.
00:24:21.519 --> 00:24:26.960
But identity, and I know that you do a lot of work in helping people kind of understand that.
00:24:27.119 --> 00:24:36.559
I think that's really critical because you want to make decisions that are true to who you are, and then you get less emotional friction as a result.
00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:44.160
It's a redefinition and a letting go of the things that were, as you described it, your ego.
00:24:44.240 --> 00:24:52.400
And now it's a maturity and a finding out how you can in this more mature place.
00:24:52.880 --> 00:24:55.759
I love your euphemism, the carrot that stick.
00:24:55.839 --> 00:25:08.960
And now it's you're kind of going forward, still having a vision and using all your brilliance, but you get to see what's along the sides as you go, and no one's telling you where to go.
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:12.240
It's not someone else's vision anymore, it's Wanda's vision.
00:25:12.480 --> 00:25:12.799
Yeah.
00:25:12.960 --> 00:25:26.400
And that's what's interesting, like in corporate, and once again, you could probably speak to this, but I feel like you know, 20, 30 years ago, the development of people was just very different.
00:25:26.640 --> 00:25:33.440
And so I felt like the development was really like, how do we make you fit into our thing?
00:25:33.839 --> 00:25:38.480
And not like, hey, let's help you figure out like what's your jam?
00:25:38.640 --> 00:25:40.640
Like, what's your rocket fuel, right?
00:25:40.799 --> 00:25:43.039
And then how can it serve us?
00:25:43.279 --> 00:25:45.200
But don't wait for somebody to do that.
00:25:45.279 --> 00:25:57.200
Like, take ownership yourself because then you'll find those opportunities that you'll really flourish in because you're realizing that it's matching your unique brilliance.
00:25:58.000 --> 00:25:58.720
Beautiful.
00:25:58.880 --> 00:25:59.759
Well said.
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:06.799
Well, we're coming to the very end, and I always end with the same thing, what I call the undeniable take.
00:26:06.960 --> 00:26:13.279
So, what is one truth that you give to the woman who's ready to lead, but still being underestimated?
00:26:13.440 --> 00:26:18.960
So she's the one who knows she's got it, but hasn't cracked the code like you clearly have.
00:26:19.279 --> 00:26:22.720
What do you want her to know and maybe carry forward from you?
00:26:23.279 --> 00:26:52.079
I guess the biggest thing is that your value is defined by how you feel about yourself, not about how others if you feel like other people are underestimating you, I think there's an opportunity to reflect on whether you're truly expressing your brilliance and awesomeness as well as you could be.
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:58.640
And then if not, if you are and it's not recognized, then you go somewhere where you're recognized.
00:26:58.960 --> 00:27:22.319
But when you're feeling underestimated, when you're feeling, you know, a little worried about your confidence, then I find it very helpful to reflect on the evidence of your successes, whether it's documenting them, whether it's taking a moment to look back and say, hey, I did this and I did that.
00:27:22.480 --> 00:27:26.400
And why do I feel like I should be treated like I'm awesome?
00:27:26.559 --> 00:27:28.400
Is because, oh, I am.
00:27:28.559 --> 00:27:29.839
It's not a pump up.
00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:41.039
This is where, like, it's not just about like fluffing yourself up with mindset, because sometimes you could fluff yourself up too much, and your capability isn't matching that yet, right?
00:27:41.279 --> 00:27:50.880
It's great to be like, I could be this, and I really look forward to like doing all the things so that I can get to that goal, right?
00:27:51.920 --> 00:28:03.599
So recognize where you are in that confidence game and collect evidence for yourself to ensure that you're not underestimating yourself.
00:28:03.920 --> 00:28:08.240
And then I feel like that starts to kind of translate to other people.
00:28:09.599 --> 00:28:10.559
Well said.
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:12.640
Thank you so much, Wanda.
00:28:13.039 --> 00:28:18.000
And this closes us out for this episode of Cracking the Code.
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:19.759
Thank you so much.
00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:28.640
Thanks for joining.
00:28:28.799 --> 00:28:32.640
For more unfiltered advice and tools that drive real business value.
00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:37.119
Subscribe to our newsletter, connect on LinkedIn, or book a consult.
00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:41.119
Because leadership development fails or we solve the wrong problems.
00:28:41.359 --> 00:28:42.799
Find all links below.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:08.240
Welcome to the Leadership Variations Unfiltered podcast, where each limited run series tackles the leadership problems no one is naming.
00:00:08.400 --> 00:00:17.760
How women in STEM actually succeed, why leadership fads always fail, and where talent strategy breaks down when the stakes are the highest.
00:00:19.519 --> 00:00:22.239
Good morning, good afternoon, good evening, folks.
00:00:22.480 --> 00:00:31.280
I am Amy Blade and Chateau, leadership consultant and coach to Women in STEM, and your host of Leadership Variations Unfiltered Podcast.
00:00:31.519 --> 00:00:43.840
In this first limited series, Cracking the Code, from underestimated to undeniable, we spotlight women leaders in STEM who've risen to senior roles, often without the recognition they so deserve.
00:00:44.159 --> 00:00:45.679
Today's guest is Dr.
00:00:45.840 --> 00:00:52.560
Wanda Toro Torini, a trailblazing leader who's built and rebuilt success on her own terms.
00:00:52.799 --> 00:01:02.159
She began her career at Novartist, where she led national sales initiatives, helped launch blockbuster therapies, and earn multiple Presence Club Awards.
00:01:02.320 --> 00:01:04.480
But Wanda did not stop there.
00:01:04.799 --> 00:01:20.400
She went on to found two high-impact companies, Bullseye Innovations and Rocket Fuel Inc., developing her first in-market platforms that transitioned how healthcare professionals, or I've learned HCPs, engage with technology and commercial teams.
00:01:20.640 --> 00:01:33.519
As an entrepreneur, she spearheaded multimillion dollar sales strategies, led high-performing teams, and became a trusted advisor for life science organizations navigating growth, innovation, and physician engagement.
00:01:34.000 --> 00:01:38.879
Years later, Wanda made the rare but powerful decision to return to corporate life.
00:01:39.760 --> 00:01:51.120
Now serving as a top-performing rare disease specialist at another top 10 multi-billion dollar global pharma company, bringing with her not just the commercial excellence, but her hard-won wisdom.
00:01:51.680 --> 00:01:54.959
Wanda's story isn't about just starting over.
00:01:55.280 --> 00:02:06.000
It's about knowing when to pivot, how to honor your own evolution, and why defining success is sometimes the boldest leadership move of all.
00:02:06.400 --> 00:02:12.000
For women in STEM navigating reinvention, her journey is a powerful reminder.
00:02:12.400 --> 00:02:16.879
Your leadership doesn't have to look traditional to be undeniable.
00:02:17.280 --> 00:02:18.800
Welcome, Wanda.
00:02:19.680 --> 00:02:21.199
Thank you for having me.
00:02:21.280 --> 00:02:21.919
That was awesome.
00:02:22.000 --> 00:02:25.199
Can you just like travel around with me and just introduce me?
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I thought I'd like you to travel around with me.
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I'm in awe.
00:02:30.639 --> 00:02:32.400
Are you ready to jump in?
00:02:32.639 --> 00:02:33.439
I am ready.
00:02:33.599 --> 00:02:34.639
I'm ready.
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I'm really kind of sad.
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You are the closer of what's been a really amazing series.
00:02:41.680 --> 00:02:42.800
I've heard amazing things.
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Thank you for having me and including me.
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Many people don't know is Wanda is also a dear, dear friend and someone I look up to and just have admired for many, many years.
00:02:56.560 --> 00:02:57.919
I had to throw that in.
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Thank you.
00:02:58.879 --> 00:02:59.360
Thank you.
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Okay, let's start with what you built as an inventor, leader, and entrepreneur.
00:03:05.840 --> 00:03:16.080
Tell them, as an entrepreneur, something you built that you were the most proud of, and that you'd really like other people to understand about that chapter of your leadership.
00:03:16.479 --> 00:03:18.080
It's interesting.
00:03:18.639 --> 00:03:29.599
So I am very proud that I left a very comfortable corporate position to just try being an entrepreneur.
00:03:29.759 --> 00:03:38.000
I felt like when I was at Novartis, I was really blessed with a great team that recognized that I was always problem solving.
00:03:38.240 --> 00:03:40.560
I always needed something new to try.
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I got bored very easily and they took care of me very well.
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I had the opportunity to, like you said, launch multiple amazing oncology products, learn from some amazing people because I was a pharmacist.
00:03:54.159 --> 00:04:08.159
And when I got my PharmD, I did my fellowship and I had the opportunity to do a fellowship within a pharmaceutical company, which was a very unusual thing at the time for a healthcare professional to learn marketing and business.
00:04:08.319 --> 00:04:12.400
I pretty much thought I was always going to work at a hospital as a pharmacist.
00:04:12.639 --> 00:04:16.560
And in my soul, I really wanted to run a business.
00:04:16.639 --> 00:04:25.600
And I'm kind of going back a little bit, but it kind of sets the stage in the sense of when I was a pharmacist, I actually wanted to own my own pharmacy, my own shop.
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And then the big Walgreens and CVSs were taking over all of the mom and pop shops.
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And it wound up not really being a thing anymore to do that.
00:04:35.519 --> 00:04:40.000
But it was interesting because when I reflected back, I'm like, wow, that was like from college.
00:04:40.079 --> 00:04:42.160
I wanted to do something entrepreneurial.
00:04:42.319 --> 00:04:47.360
When I was looking for my fellowship opportunities, my dean was like, You're gonna get in.
00:04:47.680 --> 00:04:49.040
You're gonna get in wherever you want.
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I heard you've been doing really great, great work.
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And I was like, that's cool.
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And he was like, You don't seem excited.
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And I'm like, well, okay, this is I know this sounds like ungrateful and kind of weird, but yeah, I'm a science nerd and all of that stuff, but I'm also theatrical.
00:05:05.120 --> 00:05:15.360
I was like, I have this whole creative side to my persona, and I just feel like working in the ER and critical care, which is what I was going to be doing, is not going to satisfy that.
00:05:15.519 --> 00:05:18.079
And he said, Well, I have an interesting proposition.
00:05:18.319 --> 00:05:32.639
Novartis is exploring bringing in a PharmD in their marketing team for oncology to kind of help them understand oncologists how to market to them, how to educate them, et cetera.
00:05:32.800 --> 00:05:34.879
And I was like, sign me up.
00:05:34.959 --> 00:05:40.079
So I interviewed, it was one of the hardest interviews in my entire life, by the way.
00:05:40.480 --> 00:05:41.360
And I got in.
00:05:41.439 --> 00:05:44.319
But my point is that they took great care of me.
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But as I started listening to myself, I really believe like when you get nervous or upset, or like your body tells you when there's friction in your life, right?
00:05:58.959 --> 00:06:08.000
And a lot of times because of the outside messages that we've had from our parents or from other people, like you're gonna be awesome, Wanda.
00:06:08.639 --> 00:06:12.240
Then I felt like I was doing things more for them than for me.
00:06:12.399 --> 00:06:18.560
But what happens is that your body will tell you when you're not doing the right thing.
00:06:18.720 --> 00:06:30.959
And I know that you probably coach people on this, but it took me a long time to kind of recognize because the coaches that I had within corporate were coaching me to serve their needs, right?
00:06:31.360 --> 00:06:32.879
Within their organization.
00:06:33.279 --> 00:06:46.720
I don't think it was really well developed back then, where I feel like people and managers are a little bit more aware of kind of coaching the person and actually finding satisfaction and developing them and helping somebody get to where they're meant to be.
00:06:46.879 --> 00:06:48.959
That wasn't how it was before, right?
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Before it was like, we're gonna get you to where we need you to be.
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And so there came to a certain point where I was being coached amazingly, but it was for their purposes and not for mine.
00:06:58.879 --> 00:07:04.720
And I knew that I was going to a leadership position where I would be managing a team.
00:07:04.879 --> 00:07:08.240
And I thought, I don't want to be a grumpy manager.
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Like I know that as a manager, like you're actually you have the privilege of being able to influence people's lives and make them feel like they're working frictionless, right?
00:07:19.600 --> 00:07:25.839
But if I'm experiencing friction, then it would be very difficult for me to authentically do that for others.
00:07:25.920 --> 00:07:33.279
And so I realized that in order for me to be a good leader, whatever I was going to do, that I needed to follow my dream.
00:07:33.439 --> 00:07:43.759
So I would say to answer your question the long way, is that one of the things I'm most proud of is breaking that comfort and starting my own business.
00:07:43.839 --> 00:07:46.560
And I owned that business for 19 years.
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I technically consider myself, I still own one of the businesses.
00:07:50.800 --> 00:07:52.879
So it's still 20 years for that one.
00:07:53.120 --> 00:07:57.680
But for 19 years and tactically, I did a lot of things.
00:07:57.759 --> 00:08:00.399
I invented a lot of processes and procedures.
00:08:00.480 --> 00:08:10.399
And I say invented in the sense that I allowed my creativity to kind of meet my problem solving and create solutions to problems that didn't exist, right?
00:08:10.639 --> 00:08:18.000
I kind of start my solution building from almost like a visionary dreamer sort of mindset.
00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:20.399
Like I don't think of the restrictions first.
00:08:20.560 --> 00:08:22.000
I think of like, what if?
00:08:22.079 --> 00:08:24.399
Like what would be like the most awesomest thing?
00:08:24.639 --> 00:08:30.079
And then I apply the restrictions and figure out how to mold it according to that.
00:08:30.240 --> 00:08:36.320
So I did a lot of that process-wise for organizations, lots of pharmaceutical companies.
00:08:36.480 --> 00:08:41.519
And then I invented a texting application that solved a major problem.
00:08:41.600 --> 00:08:44.080
We won't get into it right now, but it was a big leap.
00:08:44.159 --> 00:08:48.480
I spent a lot of my personal profits on doing something that was like my dream.
00:08:48.639 --> 00:08:57.600
I was like, what if, what if we had something that allowed an audience to text for information and I could get their lead?
00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:01.919
And that was, yeah, 17 years ago, 17 years ago that I invented that.
00:09:02.159 --> 00:09:03.919
But anyway, so I'm proud.
00:09:04.000 --> 00:09:10.799
But when you think of like all these things, the biggest thing is being proud of listening to myself, I guess.
00:09:11.120 --> 00:09:14.159
And that doesn't happen consistently.
00:09:14.399 --> 00:09:21.120
Like I can say that now, but there were times where I was doing a lot of not listening to myself.
00:09:21.440 --> 00:09:28.240
But the biggest thing is being able to catch yourself and realize, like, whoa, okay, there's something wrong.
00:09:28.480 --> 00:09:31.840
It's not just about stress, because stress could be good stress, right?
00:09:32.000 --> 00:09:38.799
Like you could be working towards something that you really love, and it's stressful, but it's not depressing.
00:09:38.879 --> 00:09:42.320
It's interesting to kind of understand the nuances of your feelings.
00:09:42.559 --> 00:09:46.080
One of the biggest things is it's difficult to claim your brilliance.
00:09:46.159 --> 00:09:49.679
One, if you don't know what your brilliance is.
00:09:50.480 --> 00:09:52.159
The identity question.
00:09:52.480 --> 00:09:53.120
Yeah.
00:09:53.440 --> 00:10:00.399
And with time, I developed the understanding that there were a lot of different things that were influencing my identity.
00:10:00.639 --> 00:10:06.080
It could be either, and most of the time, is other people's expectations of you, right?
00:10:06.320 --> 00:10:17.120
As you evolve in life, and you may wind up being really good at one particular thing, but being good at something doesn't mean that that is your unique brilliance, by the way.
00:10:18.399 --> 00:10:20.799
You should be good at a lot.
00:10:20.960 --> 00:10:26.399
I was unfortunately good at a lot of things that didn't feed my soul.
00:10:26.559 --> 00:10:29.039
Like I just so happen to be really good at them.
00:10:29.679 --> 00:10:30.159
Right?
00:10:30.480 --> 00:10:32.159
That's so interesting, Wanda.
00:10:32.240 --> 00:10:39.279
I am constantly telling the women that I'm coaching, just because you're really good at something doesn't mean that's your next step.
00:10:39.440 --> 00:10:45.519
You want to be very purposeful in your development and just company, you said something so important.
00:10:45.759 --> 00:10:48.720
The company thinks, wow, this is a great opportunity.
00:10:48.879 --> 00:10:54.720
You want to think about is this the opportunity to use your words, feeds your soul.
00:10:54.960 --> 00:10:55.840
Fantastic.
00:10:56.480 --> 00:10:57.279
Yeah, yeah.
00:10:57.440 --> 00:11:01.679
And honestly, like I didn't get here like figuring it out myself.
00:11:01.840 --> 00:11:06.399
This is why I'm a huge proponent of tapping into experts, right?
00:11:06.480 --> 00:11:06.799
Yep.
00:11:06.960 --> 00:11:16.720
And even if, for example, even if you're a marketing expert to actually tap into another marketing expert because other people see you differently, right?
00:11:16.879 --> 00:11:24.320
They can give you feedback that's not clouded by your past experiences or what other people may have said to you or whatever.
00:11:24.480 --> 00:11:26.720
Like they see you as you are now.
00:11:27.120 --> 00:11:32.720
So I worked with, well, one, having you as a wonderful friend, it really helps.
00:11:32.960 --> 00:11:36.240
But you connected me with some awesome psychologists as well.
00:11:36.399 --> 00:11:53.360
IO psychologists, and I've worked with several different executive coaches while I was an entrepreneur and have kept some of those coaches while I transitioned back into corporate because I feel like it helps me stay grounded to what my personal goals are, right?
00:11:53.600 --> 00:11:57.759
Not the goals of the company when it was my own company.
00:11:58.000 --> 00:12:01.039
It would be these influences.
00:12:01.120 --> 00:12:07.679
It's one big thing where my father would always say to me since I was little, keep your eye on the carrot.
00:12:07.840 --> 00:12:11.039
It's like, keep your eye on the carrot, Wanda, keep your eye on the carrot.
00:12:11.200 --> 00:12:12.879
And it was very motivating to me.
00:12:12.960 --> 00:12:14.399
And he meant it really well.
00:12:14.559 --> 00:12:21.120
I mean, the word perseverance was this like constant like term that was used in our family and such.
00:12:21.440 --> 00:12:32.080
But what I had recognized in working with the coach is that mantra of keep your eye on the carrot also brought in these blinders.
00:12:33.759 --> 00:12:40.399
I remember the coach saying to me, So, what happens when a donkey is following the carrot?
00:12:41.039 --> 00:12:46.000
They're missing everything that they're passing by, and they never get to the carrot, by the way.
00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:48.320
So it's always there, always there.
00:12:48.480 --> 00:12:59.679
And what happened is I realized that as much as that was very motivating, that term was motivating for me, and a lot of my perseverance comes from that mindset that my parents gave me.
00:13:00.080 --> 00:13:06.000
I realized that I couldn't celebrate successes because I was always keeping my eye on the carrot.
00:13:06.240 --> 00:13:10.080
The donkey never gets the carrot, it just keeps on going.
00:13:10.399 --> 00:13:19.279
And by the way, misses all the awesome things that are happening along the way, which was something that I was doing, you know, as well.
00:13:19.679 --> 00:13:21.200
So it's interesting.
00:13:21.440 --> 00:13:33.519
I highly recommend folks to work with an expert, work with an expert like yourself to so that they can actually understand what their unique brilliance is, and then they can hold on to it and claim it.
00:13:33.840 --> 00:13:42.080
Thank you for saying that, but there's all different kinds of experts that are out there that might suit, you know, what your particular need is too.
00:13:42.399 --> 00:13:43.039
Absolutely.
00:13:43.279 --> 00:13:44.000
Absolutely.
00:13:44.240 --> 00:13:59.440
Yeah, and especially with running a business, I was constantly tapping into experts for all sorts of things, and it really accelerated my growth, which led me to actually start my company Rocket Fuel, because Rocket Fuel was really about acceleration, right?
00:13:59.519 --> 00:14:09.200
Being able to help other entrepreneurs tap into experts so that they could accelerate their growth and kind of sharing that it's okay to do that, right?
00:14:09.360 --> 00:14:20.399
So I would say I didn't find my first coach didn't come into my life until 10 years, like real coach, 10 years into me being an entrepreneur.
00:14:20.639 --> 00:14:28.000
And part of that problem, and I call that a problem because I should have had a coach way earlier in my career.
00:14:28.159 --> 00:14:35.360
But part of that problem was people saying, like, you got this, you're smart, you can figure it out.
00:14:35.519 --> 00:14:41.440
So what happens is that it kind of feels like a failure if I couldn't figure it out.
00:14:41.759 --> 00:14:48.320
So like getting help was in my brain, like admitting that I couldn't figure it out.
00:14:48.559 --> 00:14:50.720
But actually, oh, yes.
00:14:51.120 --> 00:14:58.240
I am so glad you said that because we women, this is a huge topic with women, even more than men.
00:14:58.399 --> 00:15:02.080
Men have their old boys' network, they're always helping each other and pulling each other.
00:15:02.240 --> 00:15:05.600
We women think we have to do it all ourselves.
00:15:05.759 --> 00:15:06.559
We have to do it.
00:15:06.639 --> 00:15:08.480
We're proving ourselves constantly.
00:15:08.639 --> 00:15:10.240
First, help one another.
00:15:10.480 --> 00:15:14.000
Secondly, find where our resources are.
00:15:14.320 --> 00:15:16.000
And thirdly, the coaching.
00:15:16.080 --> 00:15:28.559
I'm so glad we're talking about this too, because with the coaching, the coach directs our resources, the coach asks us questions that help us dig deeper to find out, well, what is the purpose?
00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:29.519
Where are we going?
00:15:29.679 --> 00:15:32.399
And by the way, how are we going to measure success?
00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:39.279
Because there's nothing wrong that you waited for a while to get to that point, you know, because you allowed yourself to form that identity.
00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:45.519
But getting there faster would have allowed you to, you know, figure out, well, how am I going to measure this?
00:15:45.679 --> 00:15:48.639
You know, and what we measure is what gets done.
00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:51.919
If we don't measure it, then we don't get it done.
00:15:52.080 --> 00:15:55.600
So it's your story about the donkey and the carrot isn't the perfect one.
00:15:55.840 --> 00:15:56.159
Yeah.
00:15:56.399 --> 00:15:57.440
There's no milestone.
00:15:57.519 --> 00:16:06.480
And the thing is, you have to be able to kind of like set what that milestone is along, you know, you have your bigger, your further GPS destination, right?
00:16:06.559 --> 00:16:09.600
But there need to be those like rest stops where you're like, exactly.
00:16:09.759 --> 00:16:11.440
I kind of made this and I made that.
00:16:11.519 --> 00:16:13.519
And you know that you're on your way.
00:16:13.759 --> 00:16:14.000
All right.
00:16:14.080 --> 00:16:16.320
I'm gonna jump into another topic.
00:16:16.480 --> 00:16:27.600
So I want to know about the courage to step away from your entrepreneurship and what it was like and to re-entering corporate life after 19 years, you said.
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:35.200
And how did you come to see this for yourself as a strategic decision, not a you know, retreat?
00:16:35.360 --> 00:16:42.960
I mean, I see it as a, you know, really brave and intentional leadership move, but I want to know like, how did you frame it for yourself?
00:16:43.279 --> 00:16:48.399
Yeah, so I do want to be authentic, honest about like the journal.
00:16:48.799 --> 00:16:50.080
Please, unfiltered, Wanda.
00:16:50.399 --> 00:16:51.600
We're unfiltered here.
00:16:52.080 --> 00:16:53.440
Yeah, unfiltered.
00:16:53.600 --> 00:16:54.879
It sucked, right?
00:16:55.120 --> 00:16:59.840
Because when I started my business, I was single.
00:17:00.639 --> 00:17:10.960
I was in this process of kind of discovering who I was, you know, understanding what my unique brilliance was, which is this journey.
00:17:11.119 --> 00:17:15.039
And it was a very like self-focused kind of journey.
00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:21.680
I love helping people, I'm an empath, all of these things, but that's what my life was, right?
00:17:21.839 --> 00:17:28.799
My baby was my business, and I was very proud of my independence and all the things that I had accomplished.
00:17:28.960 --> 00:17:41.119
And like I was the one that invented catch words in my software program, and I built it from scratch, and I hired the techie people and all these things, and it was like my my thing.
00:17:41.359 --> 00:17:44.640
And then I met my husband, right?
00:17:44.880 --> 00:17:48.079
Then there are like shared decisions, right?
00:17:48.160 --> 00:17:59.119
There's the influence of like, okay, well, you know, along with this journey, which was amazing and extremely satisfying, there are a lot of ups and downs.
00:17:59.200 --> 00:18:05.200
It's a roller coaster, and you have to be willing to ride that roller coaster.
00:18:05.359 --> 00:18:09.359
And by the way, I was an adrenaline junkie, so I'm like, yeah, let's do this.
00:18:09.440 --> 00:18:10.480
I can handle it.
00:18:10.799 --> 00:18:15.359
So life evolves and your priorities evolve.
00:18:15.599 --> 00:18:22.160
And it's hard because I felt like there were things that were still undone, right?
00:18:22.480 --> 00:18:25.279
It's like, ah, but there's a sacrifice.
00:18:25.359 --> 00:18:36.240
If I like obsessed about finishing this thing, that by the way, keeping my eye on the carrot, in reality, my brain would have never been satisfied with achieving an endpoint.
00:18:36.480 --> 00:18:40.400
Like I recognize that now, and I still have to remind myself, right?
00:18:40.640 --> 00:18:47.920
I know personality-wise, like there would have never been like an end point at that point that would have been good enough.
00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:53.599
But I had to make decisions along the way, and then it's like, okay, I got married and I realized I want children.
00:18:53.680 --> 00:19:03.920
And this is something that's yes, sure, we raise families together as man and wife, or wife and wife, or man and man, or whatever, right?
00:19:04.559 --> 00:19:12.000
But as a woman, I had to recognize that I needed to actually incubate this child, right?
00:19:12.079 --> 00:19:23.839
Like I'm incubating this business and I'm physically having to incubate this child, and I need to make some sacrifices, I need to make some choices.
00:19:24.079 --> 00:19:39.039
And so it had been like this whole process of starting to kind of balance, balance, balance, balance after COVID, and it was fine, but after COVID, it was really hard because I was pregnant with my son during COVID.
00:19:39.200 --> 00:19:44.960
So it was just like, oh my gosh, I had a baby during COVID at 49, by the way.
00:19:45.119 --> 00:19:47.200
So I was like nuts.
00:19:47.440 --> 00:19:54.400
And my business had to change because my business model completely depended on live events, by the way, at that moment.
00:19:54.799 --> 00:19:59.599
So it was super traumatic and it was very, very tumultuous several years.
00:19:59.759 --> 00:20:08.640
And what I recognize is like sometimes you get to the point where you're trying to hold on so much because you are a successful person, right?
00:20:08.880 --> 00:20:11.839
Like, oh, people say great things about me.
00:20:12.000 --> 00:20:19.200
Like, if I don't succeed at this, that means all the things that I ever did just freaking go out the window.
00:20:19.359 --> 00:20:20.720
That's how it feels.
00:20:20.960 --> 00:20:23.440
It doesn't happen that way, ladies.
00:20:23.680 --> 00:20:24.960
That is not the case.
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:25.680
Thank you.
00:20:26.880 --> 00:20:28.880
You are still all those other things.
00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:30.880
But at the moment, it didn't feel that way.
00:20:31.039 --> 00:20:38.079
It felt like if I say no to this and drop this, that means I'm a failure.
00:20:38.319 --> 00:20:39.279
But I held on.
00:20:39.359 --> 00:20:40.799
I held on way too long.
00:20:40.960 --> 00:20:45.039
I should have just like been like, I need this like break to kind of think.
00:20:45.440 --> 00:20:46.960
And I finally made that decision.
00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:48.240
And it wasn't difficult.
00:20:48.480 --> 00:20:52.559
I'm proud of myself that I did finally make the decision in retrospect.
00:20:52.640 --> 00:20:58.240
I probably should have made that decision earlier, but my ego was holding on to it.
00:20:58.480 --> 00:21:01.680
It was just kind of like, I'm supposed to be a successful person.
00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:02.559
What happened?
00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:04.640
Like I couldn't recover from COVID.
00:21:04.799 --> 00:21:05.519
What happened?
00:21:05.680 --> 00:21:09.119
And then all of a sudden, I'm not where my GPS was sending me.
00:21:09.200 --> 00:21:10.559
Like I'm over here, right?
00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:14.319
Once again, losing sight that it's a journey, right?
00:21:14.640 --> 00:21:25.519
And I was looking at it, I'm like, I'm over here thinking like I can never get back, or I can never change, you know, to another destination that I might also really love.
00:21:25.920 --> 00:21:27.680
So there was a lot of turmoil there.
00:21:27.839 --> 00:21:50.799
So I feel like the success of the transition is one having done it, but then also recognizing that I needed a lot of coaching help to get me through the transition so that I can remember like what my brilliance was, right?
00:21:51.039 --> 00:22:04.960
So that I can have somebody else help me remember that I am talented and I do have all of these things to offer and I made a decision because of the circumstances that made sense at that point.
00:22:05.119 --> 00:22:08.400
Now I have stability, financial stability in my life.
00:22:08.559 --> 00:22:09.519
I could be a better mom.
00:22:09.680 --> 00:22:10.799
I could be a better wife.
00:22:10.960 --> 00:22:18.960
And I can also be a better visionary and problem solver, which is how I identify myself.
00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:27.599
I recognize that being entrepreneurial doesn't necessarily mean that you're your own boss.
00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:28.960
So how are you?
00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:29.680
Oh, sorry.
00:22:29.839 --> 00:22:30.079
Go ahead.
00:22:30.319 --> 00:22:31.200
Yeah, no, no.
00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:36.319
And then I could still be entrepreneurial as I return back to corporate.
00:22:36.480 --> 00:22:43.759
And so I'm excited about actually, I mean, I have to realize like I did a lot of entrepreneurial things on my wallet.
00:22:43.920 --> 00:22:55.039
And now if I can apply all those things that I've learned, one in healthcare for the benefit of patients, which I love because I was originally a PharmD, right?
00:22:55.119 --> 00:23:04.240
So to be able to return to healthcare, but to be able to have financial backing to actually, you know, deliver some things that can have huge impact.
00:23:04.400 --> 00:23:06.240
I'm really excited about that.
00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:25.920
So that was my honest kind of like there's good and bad to the whole thing, but I chose to keep ownership of who I am and what my identity is because I think I looked at corporate in the past as something that was stealing away from my identity.
00:23:26.319 --> 00:23:28.400
And that's because I didn't know myself.
00:23:28.640 --> 00:23:43.680
So you found your identity in your entrepreneurial endeavor, and you were able to take your wisdom that you learned from that and re-infuse it into what you're doing now in corporate and still be able to feed your soul.
00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:44.880
Exactly.
00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:54.079
So you're having it all in terms of your family without burning yourself out or feeling like you have to do it in a way that society dictates for you.
00:23:54.400 --> 00:23:55.839
Yes, yes, yes.
00:23:56.000 --> 00:24:04.720
And now I get the opportunity to look at, you know, I still have my software that I would like to see be used more.
00:24:04.960 --> 00:24:12.000
And so now I realize, well, I'm okay with actually finding the right partner to kind of carry that torch.
00:24:12.240 --> 00:24:14.559
And before it was like, no, this is my baby.
00:24:14.640 --> 00:24:20.960
I have to, you know, and so there's an evolution, there's an evolution to that whole process.
00:24:21.519 --> 00:24:26.960
But identity, and I know that you do a lot of work in helping people kind of understand that.
00:24:27.119 --> 00:24:36.559
I think that's really critical because you want to make decisions that are true to who you are, and then you get less emotional friction as a result.
00:24:37.119 --> 00:24:44.160
It's a redefinition and a letting go of the things that were, as you described it, your ego.
00:24:44.240 --> 00:24:52.400
And now it's a maturity and a finding out how you can in this more mature place.
00:24:52.880 --> 00:24:55.759
I love your euphemism, the carrot that stick.
00:24:55.839 --> 00:25:08.960
And now it's you're kind of going forward, still having a vision and using all your brilliance, but you get to see what's along the sides as you go, and no one's telling you where to go.
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:12.240
It's not someone else's vision anymore, it's Wanda's vision.
00:25:12.480 --> 00:25:12.799
Yeah.
00:25:12.960 --> 00:25:26.400
And that's what's interesting, like in corporate, and once again, you could probably speak to this, but I feel like you know, 20, 30 years ago, the development of people was just very different.
00:25:26.640 --> 00:25:33.440
And so I felt like the development was really like, how do we make you fit into our thing?
00:25:33.839 --> 00:25:38.480
And not like, hey, let's help you figure out like what's your jam?
00:25:38.640 --> 00:25:40.640
Like, what's your rocket fuel, right?
00:25:40.799 --> 00:25:43.039
And then how can it serve us?
00:25:43.279 --> 00:25:45.200
But don't wait for somebody to do that.
00:25:45.279 --> 00:25:57.200
Like, take ownership yourself because then you'll find those opportunities that you'll really flourish in because you're realizing that it's matching your unique brilliance.
00:25:58.000 --> 00:25:58.720
Beautiful.
00:25:58.880 --> 00:25:59.759
Well said.
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:06.799
Well, we're coming to the very end, and I always end with the same thing, what I call the undeniable take.
00:26:06.960 --> 00:26:13.279
So, what is one truth that you give to the woman who's ready to lead, but still being underestimated?
00:26:13.440 --> 00:26:18.960
So she's the one who knows she's got it, but hasn't cracked the code like you clearly have.
00:26:19.279 --> 00:26:22.720
What do you want her to know and maybe carry forward from you?
00:26:23.279 --> 00:26:52.079
I guess the biggest thing is that your value is defined by how you feel about yourself, not about how others if you feel like other people are underestimating you, I think there's an opportunity to reflect on whether you're truly expressing your brilliance and awesomeness as well as you could be.
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:58.640
And then if not, if you are and it's not recognized, then you go somewhere where you're recognized.
00:26:58.960 --> 00:27:22.319
But when you're feeling underestimated, when you're feeling, you know, a little worried about your confidence, then I find it very helpful to reflect on the evidence of your successes, whether it's documenting them, whether it's taking a moment to look back and say, hey, I did this and I did that.
00:27:22.480 --> 00:27:26.400
And why do I feel like I should be treated like I'm awesome?
00:27:26.559 --> 00:27:28.400
Is because, oh, I am.
00:27:28.559 --> 00:27:29.839
It's not a pump up.
00:27:30.079 --> 00:27:41.039
This is where, like, it's not just about like fluffing yourself up with mindset, because sometimes you could fluff yourself up too much, and your capability isn't matching that yet, right?
00:27:41.279 --> 00:27:50.880
It's great to be like, I could be this, and I really look forward to like doing all the things so that I can get to that goal, right?
00:27:51.920 --> 00:28:03.599
So recognize where you are in that confidence game and collect evidence for yourself to ensure that you're not underestimating yourself.
00:28:03.920 --> 00:28:08.240
And then I feel like that starts to kind of translate to other people.
00:28:09.599 --> 00:28:10.559
Well said.
00:28:10.960 --> 00:28:12.640
Thank you so much, Wanda.
00:28:13.039 --> 00:28:18.000
And this closes us out for this episode of Cracking the Code.
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:19.759
Thank you so much.
00:28:27.200 --> 00:28:28.640
Thanks for joining.
00:28:28.799 --> 00:28:32.640
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