WEBVTT
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War is immoral, poverty is immoral,
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racism is immoral,
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police brutality is immoral,
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oppression is immoral,
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genocide is immoral,
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imperialism is immoral.
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This country represents all those things.
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Imagine living in a space the size of
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a standard elevator for ten years straight
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alone.
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This week's guest, now free,
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was incarcerated for being an
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anti-fascist,
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an early sign of what's happening and
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what's still to come.
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This is awkward and this is your global
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warning.
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Don't forget to like, comment, subscribe,
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and super fan it for exclusive extras.
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And if you buy a GW shirt,
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you get an on-air and a social media
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shout-out.
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Plus,
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twenty-five percent goes to One People's
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Project,
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a charitable org committed to fighting
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fascism.
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Usually I'll go live on Fridays,
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drop the interview on Friday,
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but this is Halloween week,
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so live Wednesday, interview out Thursday.
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This week's guest on the Global Warning
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Show is Eric King, a vegan anarchist,
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anti-fascist activist who was imprisoned
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in two thousand fourteen for acts of
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solidarity with the Ferguson uprising.
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He threw a Molotov cocktail at an empty
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congressional building and spent a decade
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in a six by nine cell with virtually
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no connection to the outside world.
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For the next fifteen minutes,
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we'll be discussing why he got that
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treatment,
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the nature of his work outside and inside
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the walls,
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and what the future holds for him and
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us.
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So, Eric, thank you for joining me.
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I know everyone wants to hear about what
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you did, your arrest,
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your time behind bars.
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I usually wouldn't even ask about that,
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but your case was and is so public
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that I will.
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But let's start with who you are.
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What does it mean to be an anarchist?
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And from that perspective,
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give me the state of the state today
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and how that relates to movements across
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the globe.
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To me, firstly, good to see you.
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To me,
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being an anarchist means that I believe in
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a world without hierarchical structures to
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where we can develop our own communities,
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our own ways of living without being above
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or below anyone else,
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a world without domination.
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And where is the state of the world
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today?
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Bad.
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things don't look good like on the micro
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level things have never looked more
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beautiful with all the mutual aid groups i
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see in solidarity and like community
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coming together on the macro level it's
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terrifying and it looks like uh it just
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looks like a snowball of hell just coming
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down on everybody and i say that for
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a place of immense privilege
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Well, well said all of that.
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So before we get into anarchy a tiny
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bit, did you see this coming?
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Did you did your past experience your time
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away?
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Yeah, that face tells me yes.
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Yeah,
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because like the same shit they're doing
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right now is what they're doing in prison
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in two thousand sixteen and seventeen.
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Like word for word.
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So, yeah, it just seemed like, all right,
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well, we're not paying attention then.
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So it's going to come home now.
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Yeah, exactly.
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And I remember early two thousands being
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in D.C.
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protesting the George first George W.
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Bush presidency.
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And I remember thinking it can't get worse
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than this.
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And it is so much worse than this.
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And also.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I mean, indisputably worse.
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And and and like he Trump may be
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as as unintelligent as George W. Bush.
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and maybe more mean-spirited.
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The other thing about anarchy that I
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always think about,
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which is the exact opposite of what
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liberals typically believe, is humanism.
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People think of anarchy as chaos,
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as mayhem,
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because of the misrepresentation of that
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word in propaganda and every other form of
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TV propaganda, whatever.
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That's not the case.
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As you said, it's anti-hierarchical.
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No one should be above someone else.
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And you talked about today's micro level
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mutual aid networks, the growth of,
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we're seeing all over the country,
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whether it's tracking ICE, blocking ICE,
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feeding
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you know,
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communities setting up their own health
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care systems.
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How does you know,
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what is the relationship between anarchy
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or anarchism and the way you're describing
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this microcosm,
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the way certain communities are starting
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to live within this fascist macro
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situation?
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So jumping into that, firstly,
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I think we do an immense disservice to
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ourselves by playing off the fascists as
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just like idiots.
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Like, oh, he's so dumb.
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That's what the media fed us that crap.
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Like, oh, look how dumb he is.
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He's a big goof.
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Meanwhile,
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bro is getting ready to send in gosh
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damn National Guard to destroy
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marginalized communities.
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So no, let's not.
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These idiots want us to think he's just
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a silly boy.
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He is not a silly boy.
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They know what they're doing.
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But as far as the mutual aid stuff,
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the tenets of anarchism are built on that,
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that we give what you have,
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take what you need,
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but we are a community together and you
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can decide where you want to put your
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spoons, what means the most to you.
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You don't have to be everything to
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everyone,
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but you can give yourself and you should
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give what you can to your community
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because you would want that back to you.
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That's mutual aid.
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I share with you what I have.
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You share with me what you have,
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whether it's skills, resources, talents,
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and then we can develop that way as
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opposed to exploiting and commodifying
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each other.
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Yeah.
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Beautifully said.
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And that's why we were on a panel
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recently, earlier in October,
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and of all the people,
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you got me the most heated.
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which is hilarious because you and I were
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probably, and Scott Campbell,
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were probably the most similar.
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And the reason is because I felt like
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I needed to defend abolition for all
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abolitionists everywhere.
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And what we discovered,
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at least what I felt like came out
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of that, was, again,
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this humanism and mutual aid and community
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defense, these are integral to both.
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I think they work interchangeably almost.
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And as so many people have said,
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you can't say a cab and be pro
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capitalism.
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You can't be an abolitionist and be pro
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capitalism because the prison industrial
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complex and the military industrial
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complex integrate integral to that
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capitalist system and inextricably
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connected.
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Yeah.
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Well, thank you.
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Your your your opinion means the world to
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me.
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So tell me what you're doing these days
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other than showing up on panels,
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doing interviews, which, by the way,
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is a form of activism.
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You are spreading a critically important
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message at a critically important time.
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But tell me,
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what's your day to day like?
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What other work that you can share behind
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the scenes or public that, you know,
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that's keeping you busy and helping our
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society today.
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Yeah.
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And I do see value in like because
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I have to be so above ground right
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now because I am so like I'm on
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federal probation.
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Like if all I can do is at
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least like try to get people to give
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a shit about prisoners for half a second,
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then that's good enough for me.
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My day to day, I'm a paralegal.
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So my day to day is like I'm
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literally working on people.
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You can't see my office.
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I got four screens up right now working
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on people's defense cases to try to keep
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homies out of prison.
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i love that so that's and it's all
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people that can't afford private lawyers
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so i work for like those organizations um
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and that's my day-to-day because you got
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to put your if your ethics aren't in
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action then they aren't your ethics
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they're your talking points totally um and
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i don't have time for that one for
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one second i don't know i love that
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but
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I hear, I mean, probably not,
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but whatever.
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So to that point, actually,
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the timing was perfect.
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There's this vibe,
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both in abolitionist circles and in
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anarchist circles,
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and maybe even in workers' rights union,
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which is so antithetical,
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that people like me should do everything
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for free.
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And, you know, on that to that point,
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I've had a lot of formerly incarcerated
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people in the past tell me the reason
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I trust you and typically not other people
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who, you know,
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tend to look like you have the privilege
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that you do is because you aren't earning
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a profit.
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I know for sure that you are doing
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this out of the goodness of your heart.
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But then.
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As time changed or as time went on
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and it became harder and harder for me
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to earn a living,
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even doing this type of work that you're
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doing,
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it turned into a critically important way
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for me to keep my home,
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keep my kids fed and have access to
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health care.
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So I don't have insurance through my work.
00:09:30.244 --> 00:09:33.445
But the reason you asked about cursing is
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because this is
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I'm trying to earn an income talking to
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people who, you know,
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are anti-capitalist like me.
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So we're going to do the best we
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can.
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And that's what I say to my wife.
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She's a nurse,
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which she does is also super important.
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You know,
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and I do the best that I can
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in this crazy world with a crazy mind.
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know and we also all exist within
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capitalism like you didn't develop this
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system you still have to feed your kids
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you still gotta eat so like as long
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as you're earning a living without
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exploiting others like there's no qualms
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and like someone having to work hard or
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having to do what it takes to make
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money you gotta eat i'm really yeah i'm
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really glad to hear you say that i
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think people um in our community look up
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to you and that is really important oh
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yeah you're very modest i appreciate that
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about you too um but but you know
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Listen, I know about freeganism, right?
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And obviously, so do you.
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And I'm not against that at all.
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Like,
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vegans who eat meat out of garbage cans
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because it's already,
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the animal's already been killed,
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the food's been wasted.
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That's not...
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you know,
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that's not a conflict at all to me,
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but not everyone can live that way.
00:10:48.272 --> 00:10:49.452
And if you have, you know,
00:10:49.472 --> 00:10:51.193
and if you have two kids,
00:10:51.214 --> 00:10:53.696
you got a shelter and things you,
00:10:53.796 --> 00:10:56.418
you do need to find opportunities to do,
00:10:56.998 --> 00:10:58.139
to do different things.
00:10:58.219 --> 00:10:58.460
Right.
00:10:58.580 --> 00:11:00.181
I spent all those years on the streets
00:11:00.221 --> 00:11:02.201
and then I met my wife who had
00:11:02.261 --> 00:11:03.962
two young daughters and that was it.
00:11:04.062 --> 00:11:04.524
I, you know,
00:11:05.104 --> 00:11:06.865
No longer was that going to be my
00:11:06.945 --> 00:11:08.764
method of activism,
00:11:08.804 --> 00:11:11.446
like direct action and the type of stuff
00:11:11.485 --> 00:11:12.785
that got you put away.
00:11:12.846 --> 00:11:15.307
So on that note, let's get there.
00:11:15.647 --> 00:11:16.606
Let's talk about it.
00:11:16.706 --> 00:11:18.567
As much as you're comfortable sharing,
00:11:18.586 --> 00:11:20.467
you've had a little bit more time to
00:11:20.508 --> 00:11:21.008
reflect.
00:11:21.327 --> 00:11:23.168
You've been doing interviews since the
00:11:23.349 --> 00:11:24.668
second you got out.
00:11:24.708 --> 00:11:26.208
Your story is, it's true.
00:11:26.908 --> 00:11:28.070
There's a reason for it.
00:11:29.269 --> 00:11:30.851
It's not even just what you did.
00:11:30.932 --> 00:11:32.214
It's what it stood for.
00:11:32.293 --> 00:11:34.535
It's what the amount of time you got.
00:11:34.636 --> 00:11:37.759
It reminds me of Jessica Resnicek just
00:11:37.799 --> 00:11:40.624
because of the time and how completely
00:11:40.703 --> 00:11:43.988
inappropriate it is according to the
00:11:44.107 --> 00:11:45.149
action.
00:11:45.528 --> 00:11:46.551
And just for the record,
00:11:46.671 --> 00:11:48.393
I don't believe in prisons at all.
00:11:49.653 --> 00:11:52.655
I've spent a lot of time on transitional
00:11:52.716 --> 00:11:55.716
services working in not supermax,
00:11:55.736 --> 00:11:58.359
but in maximum security prisons as well as
00:11:58.458 --> 00:11:58.979
outside.
00:11:59.318 --> 00:12:01.039
And one of the coolest things that they
00:12:01.059 --> 00:12:02.240
do is what you're doing.
00:12:02.280 --> 00:12:03.841
So I just want to commend you again
00:12:04.121 --> 00:12:05.202
for the work that you're doing,
00:12:05.243 --> 00:12:07.604
trying to keep other people out of prison.
00:12:08.264 --> 00:12:09.164
Very important.
00:12:09.384 --> 00:12:11.226
Now, tell me what you did.
00:12:11.287 --> 00:12:13.067
Tell me what it was like in prison
00:12:13.168 --> 00:12:14.690
and tell me what it's like coming out.
00:12:14.710 --> 00:12:17.511
Because one story that is told over and
00:12:17.572 --> 00:12:20.174
over again is how hard it is to
00:12:20.335 --> 00:12:21.235
find work,
00:12:21.296 --> 00:12:25.339
to get to all of your probation
00:12:25.558 --> 00:12:26.220
appearances,
00:12:26.279 --> 00:12:29.162
to adhere to all the insane rules that
00:12:29.263 --> 00:12:31.323
are applied to people who are formerly
00:12:31.364 --> 00:12:32.085
incarcerated.
00:12:33.089 --> 00:12:33.328
Yeah,
00:12:33.369 --> 00:12:36.090
so just bouncing real quick before I
00:12:36.110 --> 00:12:36.629
answer.
00:12:36.649 --> 00:12:38.110
I really wish Jessica had taken a
00:12:38.171 --> 00:12:39.770
different approach and not gone with the
00:12:39.791 --> 00:12:41.011
I'm going to intentionally get arrested
00:12:41.032 --> 00:12:41.392
approach.
00:12:41.932 --> 00:12:43.692
I think that is a bad tactic that
00:12:43.712 --> 00:12:45.332
the Catholic workers do sometimes,
00:12:45.873 --> 00:12:47.413
and I don't think it serves the movement
00:12:47.494 --> 00:12:49.173
or the community well to just serve up
00:12:49.193 --> 00:12:50.514
martyrs for the pigs to butcher.
00:12:51.615 --> 00:12:53.035
I think she could have done really,
00:12:53.076 --> 00:12:53.676
really great stuff.
00:12:53.696 --> 00:12:54.996
She's obviously got an immense heart,
00:12:55.456 --> 00:12:56.797
and I just wish their tactic was
00:12:56.817 --> 00:12:57.177
different.
00:12:57.238 --> 00:12:58.378
Make the feds do their job.
00:12:58.977 --> 00:12:59.839
Make them find you.
00:13:00.119 --> 00:13:01.620
We don't need to turn ourselves over for
00:13:01.720 --> 00:13:02.519
ethical statements.
00:13:02.840 --> 00:13:04.120
That's just a personality thing.
00:13:04.441 --> 00:13:05.581
All love and respect to Jessica.
00:13:05.600 --> 00:13:06.682
Totally.
00:13:07.282 --> 00:13:09.721
but yeah i'm with you it makes sense
00:13:09.761 --> 00:13:11.802
prison sucks i hate it um getting out
00:13:11.822 --> 00:13:13.263
of prison is even more hard because you
00:13:13.283 --> 00:13:14.883
don't always have the resources available
00:13:15.783 --> 00:13:17.903
i i was very blessed that as an
00:13:18.124 --> 00:13:19.844
active member of the anarchist community
00:13:19.884 --> 00:13:21.924
my people look out for me um i
00:13:21.985 --> 00:13:24.144
have lots of support getting out but
00:13:24.184 --> 00:13:26.846
things like mental health care are often
00:13:26.905 --> 00:13:28.245
left on the side when it comes to
00:13:28.265 --> 00:13:30.365
folks being released we forget that they
00:13:30.385 --> 00:13:31.686
have trauma we forget that they have
00:13:31.706 --> 00:13:33.167
immense triggers we forget that they're
00:13:33.187 --> 00:13:34.126
going to make mistakes
00:13:34.767 --> 00:13:36.769
that they're gonna have paranoias, angers,
00:13:36.869 --> 00:13:37.288
fears.
00:13:37.690 --> 00:13:38.890
And we do this stuff,
00:13:38.931 --> 00:13:41.173
we tone shame them, we anger shame them,
00:13:41.212 --> 00:13:42.293
we action shame them,
00:13:42.754 --> 00:13:44.876
as opposed to having open hearts and open
00:13:44.917 --> 00:13:47.099
minds that someone might just need time to
00:13:47.158 --> 00:13:48.559
heal, to get stuff off of them,
00:13:48.600 --> 00:13:50.120
to develop as a human again.
00:13:50.942 --> 00:13:52.302
And so for me,
00:13:52.364 --> 00:13:54.024
having access to that has been the best
00:13:54.065 --> 00:13:56.447
ticket that in mental health medicine.
00:13:56.466 --> 00:13:57.989
So I don't effing lose it on every
00:13:58.009 --> 00:14:00.250
single person that makes me mad.
00:14:00.711 --> 00:14:01.972
I've been getting tone pleased all week,
00:14:01.993 --> 00:14:02.312
by the way,
00:14:02.332 --> 00:14:03.413
people trying to hit me up saying,
00:14:03.774 --> 00:14:05.095
I don't like what you're saying,
00:14:05.596 --> 00:14:07.378
as opposed to like going after the things
00:14:07.398 --> 00:14:08.278
that I'm talking about.
00:14:09.852 --> 00:14:10.653
I got some of that.
00:14:11.513 --> 00:14:13.313
I got some of that.
00:14:13.333 --> 00:14:14.894
What did he just say on that panel?
00:14:15.214 --> 00:14:16.453
You booked that guy?
00:14:16.573 --> 00:14:17.335
Yes, I did.
00:14:17.914 --> 00:14:19.695
You're going to get mad at me for
00:14:19.715 --> 00:14:21.154
calling out people for being dangerous but
00:14:21.195 --> 00:14:22.775
not get mad about the dangerous behaviors?
00:14:22.796 --> 00:14:23.696
Shut up.
00:14:23.975 --> 00:14:24.456
Shut up.
00:14:24.556 --> 00:14:26.176
I've been fighting Nazis for ten straight
00:14:26.196 --> 00:14:26.375
years.
00:14:26.395 --> 00:14:27.537
You want to talk to me about words?
00:14:27.897 --> 00:14:28.336
Go to hell.
00:14:28.356 --> 00:14:29.856
I hate these old babies.
00:14:29.917 --> 00:14:31.937
And when you say that, you mean literally.
00:14:31.957 --> 00:14:32.857
Yeah.
00:14:32.957 --> 00:14:34.057
Not just figuratively.
00:14:34.258 --> 00:14:35.638
Yeah, these dudes aren't playing inside.
00:14:35.658 --> 00:14:36.958
You're not going to have little debates.
00:14:37.958 --> 00:14:39.639
I don't like your ethics, mister.
00:14:39.659 --> 00:14:40.899
You're not doing that.
00:14:40.919 --> 00:14:44.280
You better boot up.
00:14:44.321 --> 00:14:46.201
So when I get out and I see
00:14:46.221 --> 00:14:48.523
this almost like anarcho,
00:14:49.582 --> 00:14:51.004
how do I say this without sounding macho?
00:14:51.384 --> 00:14:52.464
Weakness, softness,
00:14:52.984 --> 00:14:55.105
to where now we can't engage with each
00:14:55.164 --> 00:14:56.605
other and I can't critique you.
00:14:56.644 --> 00:14:57.725
I can't be angry with you.
00:14:58.485 --> 00:15:00.005
In my mind, that lifts us up.
00:15:00.046 --> 00:15:01.126
It encourages us to be better.
00:15:01.985 --> 00:15:02.907
If I tell you like, bro,
00:15:02.927 --> 00:15:04.648
you're really doing this and it's slimy,
00:15:05.168 --> 00:15:06.349
that gives you a chance to either do
00:15:06.369 --> 00:15:07.629
better or call me out or tell me
00:15:07.649 --> 00:15:08.110
to shut up.
00:15:09.812 --> 00:15:10.072
Totally.
00:15:10.091 --> 00:15:11.732
We need to hold each other accountable.
00:15:12.212 --> 00:15:12.514
Yeah.
00:15:12.553 --> 00:15:13.774
And that includes calling out bad
00:15:13.794 --> 00:15:14.154
behavior.
00:15:14.174 --> 00:15:15.436
That includes being honest with each
00:15:15.515 --> 00:15:15.716
other.
00:15:16.336 --> 00:15:18.658
And that's something I don't want to say
00:15:18.677 --> 00:15:19.239
I miss from prison,
00:15:19.259 --> 00:15:20.298
but that's something I'm glad I brought
00:15:20.339 --> 00:15:20.759
home with me.
00:15:22.421 --> 00:15:22.600
Yeah.
00:15:22.620 --> 00:15:23.140
But yeah, prison sucks.
00:15:23.160 --> 00:15:23.682
Don't go to prison.
00:15:24.605 --> 00:15:25.505
don't go to prison.
00:15:25.907 --> 00:15:26.126
Um,
00:15:26.268 --> 00:15:30.192
and so many lessons just from going there
00:15:30.313 --> 00:15:32.076
in, in the capacity that I did,
00:15:32.176 --> 00:15:32.957
you know, um,
00:15:33.018 --> 00:15:34.700
sitting down and meeting with people,
00:15:35.140 --> 00:15:37.004
you know, my experience, um,
00:15:38.686 --> 00:15:40.427
Everyone who knew I was doing this was
00:15:40.488 --> 00:15:41.750
like, aren't you afraid?
00:15:42.049 --> 00:15:43.130
They're killers.
00:15:43.511 --> 00:15:44.893
Well, actually, most of them aren't.
00:15:45.474 --> 00:15:47.076
The vast majority of people there are for
00:15:47.135 --> 00:15:48.957
nonviolent offenses to begin with.
00:15:48.977 --> 00:15:50.539
And even if they are there for violent
00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:51.320
offenses, so what?
00:15:51.480 --> 00:15:52.020
Exactly.
00:15:52.061 --> 00:15:52.701
Exactly.
00:15:52.861 --> 00:15:54.923
Irrelevant is what I was about to say.
00:15:55.245 --> 00:15:56.886
Yeah, we're on the same page as usual.
00:15:57.267 --> 00:15:59.649
But like, no, that's not what happened.
00:15:59.809 --> 00:16:00.691
They were amazing.
00:16:00.751 --> 00:16:02.333
If anything, they were protective.
00:16:02.394 --> 00:16:03.154
They hugged me.
00:16:03.576 --> 00:16:05.879
What wasn't safe was when I needed to
00:16:05.919 --> 00:16:07.743
go to the bathroom and the guards sent
00:16:07.763 --> 00:16:10.466
me in the wrong direction intentionally.
00:16:10.846 --> 00:16:11.808
They're the problem.
00:16:12.750 --> 00:16:12.971
So...
00:16:14.272 --> 00:16:15.591
Yeah, exactly.
00:16:15.932 --> 00:16:19.073
On that note, my old show,
00:16:19.153 --> 00:16:20.254
The Awkward Interviews,
00:16:20.313 --> 00:16:22.835
very impressive branding there,
00:16:23.154 --> 00:16:24.394
very creative.
00:16:25.316 --> 00:16:26.775
Those shows were an hour long,
00:16:26.816 --> 00:16:29.697
and I don't think that's the move anymore.
00:16:30.476 --> 00:16:31.738
I'm trying to keep these short.
00:16:31.918 --> 00:16:33.258
I could talk to you forever,
00:16:33.577 --> 00:16:35.219
but I can't for that purpose.
00:16:35.259 --> 00:16:38.639
So let's close with something that I don't
00:16:38.759 --> 00:16:39.159
ask you.
00:16:39.980 --> 00:16:41.360
what's on your mind right now?
00:16:41.421 --> 00:16:43.461
What do you want my audience to know?
00:16:43.961 --> 00:16:44.461
And again,
00:16:44.861 --> 00:16:47.903
my audience is partially anarchist,
00:16:48.024 --> 00:16:49.965
very abolitionist at this point,
00:16:50.004 --> 00:16:52.426
but also a ton of liberals who are
00:16:52.466 --> 00:16:54.606
the most well-intentioned people in the
00:16:54.687 --> 00:16:55.647
world, I feel like,
00:16:55.667 --> 00:16:58.469
but are so misinformed most of the time.
00:16:59.149 --> 00:17:01.009
And particularly about the intricate
00:17:01.049 --> 00:17:01.509
details,
00:17:01.549 --> 00:17:03.130
particularly about people like us,
00:17:03.191 --> 00:17:07.413
particularly about the methods of praxis
00:17:07.432 --> 00:17:08.272
that are effective.
00:17:09.266 --> 00:17:11.647
So two things that I'll close with.
00:17:11.847 --> 00:17:11.988
One,
00:17:12.407 --> 00:17:14.849
whenever we hear the term nonviolent
00:17:14.890 --> 00:17:15.950
offenders, liberals,
00:17:16.371 --> 00:17:17.711
I hope you realize that that is a
00:17:17.912 --> 00:17:20.272
government term to describe men and women
00:17:20.353 --> 00:17:22.114
who were not taught impulse control,
00:17:22.153 --> 00:17:23.615
who were not taught how to manage
00:17:23.934 --> 00:17:24.836
difficult emotions,
00:17:24.855 --> 00:17:26.336
who were not given the love and support
00:17:26.356 --> 00:17:27.237
they needed as children.
00:17:27.597 --> 00:17:29.078
That is a failing of capitalism.
00:17:29.659 --> 00:17:31.380
That is because these people's parents had
00:17:31.420 --> 00:17:33.162
to commodify themselves as opposed to
00:17:33.201 --> 00:17:34.923
giving their kids the education,
00:17:34.962 --> 00:17:36.344
love and mental health care they needed.
00:17:36.663 --> 00:17:37.785
That's us failing them,
00:17:38.046 --> 00:17:39.386
not them failing the society.
00:17:39.807 --> 00:17:40.307
But secondly,
00:17:40.366 --> 00:17:41.909
please don't let our enemies control the
00:17:41.929 --> 00:17:42.308
narrative.
00:17:42.749 --> 00:17:44.590
Please don't let CNN, Fox News,
00:17:44.611 --> 00:17:46.192
the government control how you feel about
00:17:46.632 --> 00:17:49.374
migrants or immigrants or Antifa.
00:17:49.815 --> 00:17:51.816
These are government terms used to divide
00:17:51.875 --> 00:17:53.297
us so that we're paying attention instead
00:17:53.336 --> 00:17:56.059
to what are they doing as opposed to
00:17:56.119 --> 00:17:57.520
what the hell are they doing?
00:17:58.280 --> 00:18:00.001
Those are terms meant to divide us and
00:18:00.061 --> 00:18:01.803
crush us so that we're bickering with each
00:18:01.863 --> 00:18:03.824
other and trying to make excuses for the
00:18:03.844 --> 00:18:04.943
government's bad behavior.
00:18:05.443 --> 00:18:07.744
There's no such thing as a bad Antifa.
00:18:08.006 --> 00:18:09.605
There's no such thing as a bad migrant.
00:18:09.685 --> 00:18:11.507
What there is is bad fascists.
00:18:12.146 --> 00:18:14.067
And do not let the people that hate
00:18:14.087 --> 00:18:15.588
you determine how you view others.
00:18:15.868 --> 00:18:17.690
Their terminology cannot be how you view
00:18:17.710 --> 00:18:18.049
the world.
00:18:18.609 --> 00:18:19.151
Love and respect.
00:18:20.131 --> 00:18:21.791
As we say in hip hop, kill it.
00:18:22.730 --> 00:18:24.511
Well said, man.
00:18:25.874 --> 00:18:26.834
That was beautiful.
00:18:27.474 --> 00:18:28.996
I appreciate you coming on.
00:18:29.656 --> 00:18:32.159
And if I wasn't booked through twenty
00:18:32.199 --> 00:18:32.838
twenty seven,
00:18:32.878 --> 00:18:34.299
I would tell you you can come back
00:18:35.020 --> 00:18:36.122
over and over and over.
00:18:36.662 --> 00:18:38.103
I will say that if anything,
00:18:38.584 --> 00:18:42.146
anything comes up and we need to get
00:18:42.406 --> 00:18:43.607
a certain message out there,
00:18:43.647 --> 00:18:46.369
God forbid they target you again in a
00:18:46.410 --> 00:18:47.451
really direct way.
00:18:47.671 --> 00:18:48.791
I'm here for you.
00:18:48.971 --> 00:18:50.353
Let these liberals know if they ever want
00:18:50.393 --> 00:18:50.753
to debate,
00:18:50.773 --> 00:18:52.255
I'm available on any platform ever.
00:18:52.910 --> 00:18:53.970
Actually, that too.
00:18:54.770 --> 00:18:55.250
Please.
00:18:55.770 --> 00:18:57.971
You're making a mistake preaching to the
00:18:58.010 --> 00:19:00.392
choir, yelling or screaming into the void,
00:19:00.412 --> 00:19:02.012
the vacuum, whatever you want to call it.
00:19:02.032 --> 00:19:03.073
Where are they?
00:19:03.573 --> 00:19:05.874
Yeah.
00:19:05.913 --> 00:19:06.193
Yeah.
00:19:06.294 --> 00:19:08.013
I mean, it shouldn't be my show.
00:19:08.114 --> 00:19:10.954
It should be their show where they're
00:19:11.474 --> 00:19:13.736
exploring and expanding their minds.
00:19:13.796 --> 00:19:16.135
So that is a challenge to any of
00:19:16.175 --> 00:19:17.876
you who are watching and have your own
00:19:17.916 --> 00:19:18.257
show.
00:19:18.457 --> 00:19:19.196
Invite Eric.
00:19:19.237 --> 00:19:20.637
And if you need me to connect you,
00:19:21.038 --> 00:19:21.438
will do.
00:19:23.740 --> 00:19:25.362
On that note, yeah, happy Halloween.
00:19:25.382 --> 00:19:25.481
Peace.
00:19:25.501 --> 00:19:25.662
Peace.
00:19:28.324 --> 00:19:29.605
War is immoral.
00:19:29.885 --> 00:19:31.106
Poverty is immoral.
00:19:31.406 --> 00:19:32.667
Racism is immoral.
00:19:32.948 --> 00:19:34.670
Police brutality is immoral.
00:19:34.869 --> 00:19:35.990
Oppression is immoral.
00:19:36.230 --> 00:19:37.412
Genocide is immoral.
00:19:37.632 --> 00:19:38.893
Imperialism is immoral.
00:19:39.272 --> 00:19:41.474
This country represents all those things.
00:00:00.296 --> 00:00:03.097
War is immoral, poverty is immoral,
00:00:03.378 --> 00:00:04.679
racism is immoral,
00:00:04.918 --> 00:00:06.620
police brutality is immoral,
00:00:06.860 --> 00:00:07.980
oppression is immoral,
00:00:08.201 --> 00:00:09.401
genocide is immoral,
00:00:09.621 --> 00:00:11.003
imperialism is immoral.
00:00:11.243 --> 00:00:13.464
This country represents all those things.
00:00:17.388 --> 00:00:19.551
Imagine living in a space the size of
00:00:19.591 --> 00:00:22.376
a standard elevator for ten years straight
00:00:22.475 --> 00:00:22.896
alone.
00:00:23.718 --> 00:00:25.320
This week's guest, now free,
00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:26.882
was incarcerated for being an
00:00:26.961 --> 00:00:27.903
anti-fascist,
00:00:28.403 --> 00:00:30.246
an early sign of what's happening and
00:00:30.286 --> 00:00:31.228
what's still to come.
00:00:31.789 --> 00:00:33.671
This is awkward and this is your global
00:00:33.712 --> 00:00:34.072
warning.
00:00:34.713 --> 00:00:37.094
Don't forget to like, comment, subscribe,
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fascism.
00:00:50.798 --> 00:00:53.560
Usually I'll go live on Fridays,
00:00:54.600 --> 00:00:56.021
drop the interview on Friday,
00:00:56.042 --> 00:00:57.323
but this is Halloween week,
00:00:57.343 --> 00:01:00.024
so live Wednesday, interview out Thursday.
00:01:00.526 --> 00:01:02.426
This week's guest on the Global Warning
00:01:02.447 --> 00:01:04.968
Show is Eric King, a vegan anarchist,
00:01:05.108 --> 00:01:07.430
anti-fascist activist who was imprisoned
00:01:07.471 --> 00:01:09.793
in two thousand fourteen for acts of
00:01:09.832 --> 00:01:11.935
solidarity with the Ferguson uprising.
00:01:12.415 --> 00:01:14.757
He threw a Molotov cocktail at an empty
00:01:14.816 --> 00:01:17.259
congressional building and spent a decade
00:01:17.319 --> 00:01:19.560
in a six by nine cell with virtually
00:01:19.640 --> 00:01:21.421
no connection to the outside world.
00:01:22.042 --> 00:01:23.283
For the next fifteen minutes,
00:01:23.322 --> 00:01:25.043
we'll be discussing why he got that
00:01:25.084 --> 00:01:25.543
treatment,
00:01:25.864 --> 00:01:28.046
the nature of his work outside and inside
00:01:28.085 --> 00:01:28.626
the walls,
00:01:28.746 --> 00:01:30.347
and what the future holds for him and
00:01:30.427 --> 00:01:30.647
us.
00:01:31.108 --> 00:01:32.930
So, Eric, thank you for joining me.
00:01:33.150 --> 00:01:34.950
I know everyone wants to hear about what
00:01:34.971 --> 00:01:36.152
you did, your arrest,
00:01:36.171 --> 00:01:37.433
your time behind bars.
00:01:37.972 --> 00:01:39.655
I usually wouldn't even ask about that,
00:01:39.694 --> 00:01:41.716
but your case was and is so public
00:01:41.736 --> 00:01:42.337
that I will.
00:01:42.677 --> 00:01:44.058
But let's start with who you are.
00:01:44.998 --> 00:01:48.081
What does it mean to be an anarchist?
00:01:48.361 --> 00:01:49.503
And from that perspective,
00:01:49.924 --> 00:01:51.865
give me the state of the state today
00:01:52.006 --> 00:01:53.807
and how that relates to movements across
00:01:53.826 --> 00:01:54.287
the globe.
00:01:55.198 --> 00:01:57.301
To me, firstly, good to see you.
00:01:58.322 --> 00:01:58.662
To me,
00:01:58.683 --> 00:02:00.525
being an anarchist means that I believe in
00:02:01.266 --> 00:02:03.608
a world without hierarchical structures to
00:02:03.628 --> 00:02:05.709
where we can develop our own communities,
00:02:05.849 --> 00:02:08.112
our own ways of living without being above
00:02:08.233 --> 00:02:09.373
or below anyone else,
00:02:10.014 --> 00:02:12.356
a world without domination.
00:02:12.777 --> 00:02:14.520
And where is the state of the world
00:02:14.560 --> 00:02:14.900
today?
00:02:15.381 --> 00:02:15.760
Bad.
00:02:17.643 --> 00:02:19.403
things don't look good like on the micro
00:02:19.463 --> 00:02:20.843
level things have never looked more
00:02:20.883 --> 00:02:22.764
beautiful with all the mutual aid groups i
00:02:22.805 --> 00:02:24.925
see in solidarity and like community
00:02:24.965 --> 00:02:27.485
coming together on the macro level it's
00:02:27.526 --> 00:02:30.606
terrifying and it looks like uh it just
00:02:30.627 --> 00:02:32.548
looks like a snowball of hell just coming
00:02:32.587 --> 00:02:34.709
down on everybody and i say that for
00:02:34.729 --> 00:02:35.788
a place of immense privilege
00:02:37.062 --> 00:02:38.742
Well, well said all of that.
00:02:39.944 --> 00:02:43.067
So before we get into anarchy a tiny
00:02:43.106 --> 00:02:46.110
bit, did you see this coming?
00:02:46.610 --> 00:02:49.233
Did you did your past experience your time
00:02:49.272 --> 00:02:49.772
away?
00:02:49.973 --> 00:02:52.194
Yeah, that face tells me yes.
00:02:52.514 --> 00:02:52.615
Yeah,
00:02:52.655 --> 00:02:53.977
because like the same shit they're doing
00:02:54.016 --> 00:02:55.478
right now is what they're doing in prison
00:02:55.518 --> 00:02:56.998
in two thousand sixteen and seventeen.
00:02:57.019 --> 00:02:58.439
Like word for word.
00:02:59.140 --> 00:03:01.402
So, yeah, it just seemed like, all right,
00:03:01.462 --> 00:03:03.365
well, we're not paying attention then.
00:03:03.425 --> 00:03:04.506
So it's going to come home now.
00:03:05.289 --> 00:03:06.270
Yeah, exactly.
00:03:06.370 --> 00:03:10.031
And I remember early two thousands being
00:03:10.091 --> 00:03:10.951
in D.C.
00:03:12.192 --> 00:03:14.633
protesting the George first George W.
00:03:14.693 --> 00:03:16.332
Bush presidency.
00:03:17.193 --> 00:03:20.274
And I remember thinking it can't get worse
00:03:20.294 --> 00:03:20.834
than this.
00:03:21.313 --> 00:03:23.014
And it is so much worse than this.
00:03:23.955 --> 00:03:24.414
And also.
00:03:24.715 --> 00:03:24.995
Yeah.
00:03:25.134 --> 00:03:25.415
Yeah.
00:03:25.575 --> 00:03:27.376
I mean, indisputably worse.
00:03:27.536 --> 00:03:30.317
And and and like he Trump may be
00:03:30.377 --> 00:03:33.717
as as unintelligent as George W. Bush.
00:03:34.497 --> 00:03:37.598
and maybe more mean-spirited.
00:03:40.020 --> 00:03:41.979
The other thing about anarchy that I
00:03:42.120 --> 00:03:42.919
always think about,
00:03:42.960 --> 00:03:44.800
which is the exact opposite of what
00:03:44.860 --> 00:03:47.782
liberals typically believe, is humanism.
00:03:48.222 --> 00:03:50.562
People think of anarchy as chaos,
00:03:50.622 --> 00:03:51.461
as mayhem,
00:03:51.502 --> 00:03:54.342
because of the misrepresentation of that
00:03:54.402 --> 00:03:57.123
word in propaganda and every other form of
00:03:57.503 --> 00:03:59.126
TV propaganda, whatever.
00:04:00.086 --> 00:04:01.127
That's not the case.
00:04:01.447 --> 00:04:03.788
As you said, it's anti-hierarchical.
00:04:04.169 --> 00:04:05.931
No one should be above someone else.
00:04:06.431 --> 00:04:11.014
And you talked about today's micro level
00:04:11.536 --> 00:04:13.837
mutual aid networks, the growth of,
00:04:14.318 --> 00:04:15.799
we're seeing all over the country,
00:04:15.818 --> 00:04:18.261
whether it's tracking ICE, blocking ICE,
00:04:18.360 --> 00:04:18.781
feeding
00:04:19.401 --> 00:04:19.742
you know,
00:04:19.802 --> 00:04:21.845
communities setting up their own health
00:04:21.884 --> 00:04:24.127
care systems.
00:04:24.146 --> 00:04:25.908
How does you know,
00:04:26.769 --> 00:04:29.192
what is the relationship between anarchy
00:04:29.632 --> 00:04:33.677
or anarchism and the way you're describing
00:04:33.716 --> 00:04:34.557
this microcosm,
00:04:34.577 --> 00:04:36.459
the way certain communities are starting
00:04:36.500 --> 00:04:40.764
to live within this fascist macro
00:04:41.324 --> 00:04:41.946
situation?
00:04:42.613 --> 00:04:44.636
So jumping into that, firstly,
00:04:44.795 --> 00:04:46.576
I think we do an immense disservice to
00:04:47.197 --> 00:04:49.540
ourselves by playing off the fascists as
00:04:49.660 --> 00:04:50.380
just like idiots.
00:04:50.401 --> 00:04:51.461
Like, oh, he's so dumb.
00:04:51.482 --> 00:04:53.463
That's what the media fed us that crap.
00:04:53.502 --> 00:04:54.824
Like, oh, look how dumb he is.
00:04:54.845 --> 00:04:55.564
He's a big goof.
00:04:55.904 --> 00:04:56.305
Meanwhile,
00:04:56.326 --> 00:04:57.867
bro is getting ready to send in gosh
00:04:57.887 --> 00:05:00.129
damn National Guard to destroy
00:05:00.168 --> 00:05:01.050
marginalized communities.
00:05:01.449 --> 00:05:02.290
So no, let's not.
00:05:02.870 --> 00:05:04.211
These idiots want us to think he's just
00:05:04.273 --> 00:05:04.833
a silly boy.
00:05:04.872 --> 00:05:05.934
He is not a silly boy.
00:05:08.696 --> 00:05:09.416
They know what they're doing.
00:05:10.495 --> 00:05:12.036
But as far as the mutual aid stuff,
00:05:12.956 --> 00:05:15.237
the tenets of anarchism are built on that,
00:05:15.778 --> 00:05:18.459
that we give what you have,
00:05:18.579 --> 00:05:19.418
take what you need,
00:05:19.838 --> 00:05:22.060
but we are a community together and you
00:05:22.100 --> 00:05:23.540
can decide where you want to put your
00:05:23.600 --> 00:05:25.341
spoons, what means the most to you.
00:05:25.841 --> 00:05:27.483
You don't have to be everything to
00:05:27.562 --> 00:05:28.043
everyone,
00:05:28.382 --> 00:05:30.264
but you can give yourself and you should
00:05:30.303 --> 00:05:32.004
give what you can to your community
00:05:32.345 --> 00:05:34.305
because you would want that back to you.
00:05:34.324 --> 00:05:35.425
That's mutual aid.
00:05:35.966 --> 00:05:37.387
I share with you what I have.
00:05:37.726 --> 00:05:39.127
You share with me what you have,
00:05:39.166 --> 00:05:41.567
whether it's skills, resources, talents,
00:05:42.129 --> 00:05:44.269
and then we can develop that way as
00:05:44.329 --> 00:05:46.310
opposed to exploiting and commodifying
00:05:46.350 --> 00:05:47.430
each other.
00:05:47.591 --> 00:05:47.790
Yeah.
00:05:48.634 --> 00:05:49.514
Beautifully said.
00:05:50.696 --> 00:05:54.177
And that's why we were on a panel
00:05:54.336 --> 00:05:56.538
recently, earlier in October,
00:05:57.557 --> 00:06:00.519
and of all the people,
00:06:01.319 --> 00:06:03.480
you got me the most heated.
00:06:03.839 --> 00:06:06.661
which is hilarious because you and I were
00:06:06.721 --> 00:06:08.702
probably, and Scott Campbell,
00:06:08.742 --> 00:06:10.264
were probably the most similar.
00:06:10.845 --> 00:06:14.466
And the reason is because I felt like
00:06:14.526 --> 00:06:17.228
I needed to defend abolition for all
00:06:17.309 --> 00:06:18.649
abolitionists everywhere.
00:06:20.050 --> 00:06:21.232
And what we discovered,
00:06:21.372 --> 00:06:23.973
at least what I felt like came out
00:06:24.012 --> 00:06:25.954
of that, was, again,
00:06:25.975 --> 00:06:30.158
this humanism and mutual aid and community
00:06:30.197 --> 00:06:32.559
defense, these are integral to both.
00:06:33.920 --> 00:06:36.281
I think they work interchangeably almost.
00:06:36.401 --> 00:06:38.002
And as so many people have said,
00:06:39.024 --> 00:06:40.865
you can't say a cab and be pro
00:06:40.925 --> 00:06:41.665
capitalism.
00:06:41.805 --> 00:06:44.387
You can't be an abolitionist and be pro
00:06:44.427 --> 00:06:46.870
capitalism because the prison industrial
00:06:46.910 --> 00:06:49.812
complex and the military industrial
00:06:49.851 --> 00:06:53.175
complex integrate integral to that
00:06:53.214 --> 00:06:55.716
capitalist system and inextricably
00:06:55.737 --> 00:06:56.197
connected.
00:06:58.245 --> 00:07:01.166
Yeah.
00:07:01.206 --> 00:07:01.887
Well, thank you.
00:07:02.007 --> 00:07:05.267
Your your your opinion means the world to
00:07:05.307 --> 00:07:05.427
me.
00:07:05.507 --> 00:07:07.668
So tell me what you're doing these days
00:07:07.788 --> 00:07:09.687
other than showing up on panels,
00:07:09.728 --> 00:07:11.488
doing interviews, which, by the way,
00:07:12.088 --> 00:07:13.749
is a form of activism.
00:07:14.009 --> 00:07:15.810
You are spreading a critically important
00:07:15.850 --> 00:07:17.750
message at a critically important time.
00:07:18.069 --> 00:07:18.550
But tell me,
00:07:18.670 --> 00:07:19.891
what's your day to day like?
00:07:19.930 --> 00:07:23.110
What other work that you can share behind
00:07:23.151 --> 00:07:25.692
the scenes or public that, you know,
00:07:26.430 --> 00:07:28.420
that's keeping you busy and helping our
00:07:28.461 --> 00:07:29.345
society today.
00:07:29.963 --> 00:07:30.202
Yeah.
00:07:30.283 --> 00:07:31.985
And I do see value in like because
00:07:32.084 --> 00:07:33.685
I have to be so above ground right
00:07:33.725 --> 00:07:35.728
now because I am so like I'm on
00:07:35.747 --> 00:07:36.668
federal probation.
00:07:36.769 --> 00:07:38.531
Like if all I can do is at
00:07:38.550 --> 00:07:40.052
least like try to get people to give
00:07:40.072 --> 00:07:41.894
a shit about prisoners for half a second,
00:07:41.934 --> 00:07:42.954
then that's good enough for me.
00:07:44.375 --> 00:07:46.197
My day to day, I'm a paralegal.
00:07:46.798 --> 00:07:48.399
So my day to day is like I'm
00:07:48.439 --> 00:07:49.420
literally working on people.
00:07:49.581 --> 00:07:50.521
You can't see my office.
00:07:50.541 --> 00:07:53.343
I got four screens up right now working
00:07:53.363 --> 00:07:55.266
on people's defense cases to try to keep
00:07:55.286 --> 00:07:56.045
homies out of prison.
00:07:56.807 --> 00:07:59.108
i love that so that's and it's all
00:07:59.149 --> 00:08:00.870
people that can't afford private lawyers
00:08:00.911 --> 00:08:04.113
so i work for like those organizations um
00:08:04.413 --> 00:08:05.694
and that's my day-to-day because you got
00:08:05.714 --> 00:08:07.495
to put your if your ethics aren't in
00:08:07.617 --> 00:08:08.778
action then they aren't your ethics
00:08:08.798 --> 00:08:11.339
they're your talking points totally um and
00:08:11.379 --> 00:08:13.120
i don't have time for that one for
00:08:13.221 --> 00:08:15.202
one second i don't know i love that
00:08:15.223 --> 00:08:15.502
but
00:08:16.973 --> 00:08:19.634
I hear, I mean, probably not,
00:08:19.654 --> 00:08:21.615
but whatever.
00:08:23.415 --> 00:08:24.776
So to that point, actually,
00:08:24.797 --> 00:08:25.937
the timing was perfect.
00:08:27.237 --> 00:08:29.237
There's this vibe,
00:08:29.898 --> 00:08:32.339
both in abolitionist circles and in
00:08:32.438 --> 00:08:33.278
anarchist circles,
00:08:33.318 --> 00:08:37.039
and maybe even in workers' rights union,
00:08:37.440 --> 00:08:39.260
which is so antithetical,
00:08:39.821 --> 00:08:42.442
that people like me should do everything
00:08:42.481 --> 00:08:42.981
for free.
00:08:44.342 --> 00:08:47.804
And, you know, on that to that point,
00:08:47.945 --> 00:08:49.966
I've had a lot of formerly incarcerated
00:08:50.025 --> 00:08:52.668
people in the past tell me the reason
00:08:52.768 --> 00:08:55.448
I trust you and typically not other people
00:08:55.489 --> 00:08:56.309
who, you know,
00:08:56.509 --> 00:08:58.270
tend to look like you have the privilege
00:08:58.291 --> 00:09:00.971
that you do is because you aren't earning
00:09:01.072 --> 00:09:01.572
a profit.
00:09:01.732 --> 00:09:03.754
I know for sure that you are doing
00:09:03.793 --> 00:09:05.514
this out of the goodness of your heart.
00:09:05.975 --> 00:09:06.375
But then.
00:09:07.155 --> 00:09:09.576
As time changed or as time went on
00:09:09.976 --> 00:09:12.317
and it became harder and harder for me
00:09:12.398 --> 00:09:13.998
to earn a living,
00:09:14.479 --> 00:09:16.359
even doing this type of work that you're
00:09:16.399 --> 00:09:16.759
doing,
00:09:17.240 --> 00:09:21.640
it turned into a critically important way
00:09:21.681 --> 00:09:23.381
for me to keep my home,
00:09:23.461 --> 00:09:26.163
keep my kids fed and have access to
00:09:26.202 --> 00:09:26.743
health care.
00:09:27.062 --> 00:09:30.203
So I don't have insurance through my work.
00:09:30.244 --> 00:09:33.445
But the reason you asked about cursing is
00:09:33.485 --> 00:09:34.905
because this is
00:09:35.816 --> 00:09:37.976
I'm trying to earn an income talking to
00:09:37.996 --> 00:09:39.437
people who, you know,
00:09:39.677 --> 00:09:41.577
are anti-capitalist like me.
00:09:41.658 --> 00:09:43.057
So we're going to do the best we
00:09:43.077 --> 00:09:43.339
can.
00:09:43.418 --> 00:09:44.839
And that's what I say to my wife.
00:09:45.599 --> 00:09:46.299
She's a nurse,
00:09:46.320 --> 00:09:48.460
which she does is also super important.
00:09:50.260 --> 00:09:50.541
You know,
00:09:50.681 --> 00:09:53.101
and I do the best that I can
00:09:53.461 --> 00:09:55.682
in this crazy world with a crazy mind.
00:09:56.721 --> 00:09:59.023
know and we also all exist within
00:09:59.062 --> 00:10:01.144
capitalism like you didn't develop this
00:10:01.183 --> 00:10:02.684
system you still have to feed your kids
00:10:02.725 --> 00:10:04.686
you still gotta eat so like as long
00:10:04.725 --> 00:10:06.086
as you're earning a living without
00:10:06.126 --> 00:10:08.188
exploiting others like there's no qualms
00:10:08.249 --> 00:10:09.750
and like someone having to work hard or
00:10:09.769 --> 00:10:10.870
having to do what it takes to make
00:10:10.910 --> 00:10:13.552
money you gotta eat i'm really yeah i'm
00:10:13.591 --> 00:10:15.192
really glad to hear you say that i
00:10:15.232 --> 00:10:17.855
think people um in our community look up
00:10:17.894 --> 00:10:20.376
to you and that is really important oh
00:10:21.096 --> 00:10:23.639
yeah you're very modest i appreciate that
00:10:23.658 --> 00:10:26.120
about you too um but but you know
00:10:27.541 --> 00:10:30.023
Listen, I know about freeganism, right?
00:10:30.102 --> 00:10:31.283
And obviously, so do you.
00:10:31.523 --> 00:10:33.703
And I'm not against that at all.
00:10:33.783 --> 00:10:34.065
Like,
00:10:34.404 --> 00:10:36.546
vegans who eat meat out of garbage cans
00:10:36.605 --> 00:10:38.586
because it's already,
00:10:38.826 --> 00:10:40.427
the animal's already been killed,
00:10:40.467 --> 00:10:41.788
the food's been wasted.
00:10:42.408 --> 00:10:43.129
That's not...
00:10:43.668 --> 00:10:43.908
you know,
00:10:44.048 --> 00:10:46.071
that's not a conflict at all to me,
00:10:46.451 --> 00:10:48.251
but not everyone can live that way.
00:10:48.272 --> 00:10:49.452
And if you have, you know,
00:10:49.472 --> 00:10:51.193
and if you have two kids,
00:10:51.214 --> 00:10:53.696
you got a shelter and things you,
00:10:53.796 --> 00:10:56.418
you do need to find opportunities to do,
00:10:56.998 --> 00:10:58.139
to do different things.
00:10:58.219 --> 00:10:58.460
Right.
00:10:58.580 --> 00:11:00.181
I spent all those years on the streets
00:11:00.221 --> 00:11:02.201
and then I met my wife who had
00:11:02.261 --> 00:11:03.962
two young daughters and that was it.
00:11:04.062 --> 00:11:04.524
I, you know,
00:11:05.104 --> 00:11:06.865
No longer was that going to be my
00:11:06.945 --> 00:11:08.764
method of activism,
00:11:08.804 --> 00:11:11.446
like direct action and the type of stuff
00:11:11.485 --> 00:11:12.785
that got you put away.
00:11:12.846 --> 00:11:15.307
So on that note, let's get there.
00:11:15.647 --> 00:11:16.606
Let's talk about it.
00:11:16.706 --> 00:11:18.567
As much as you're comfortable sharing,
00:11:18.586 --> 00:11:20.467
you've had a little bit more time to
00:11:20.508 --> 00:11:21.008
reflect.
00:11:21.327 --> 00:11:23.168
You've been doing interviews since the
00:11:23.349 --> 00:11:24.668
second you got out.
00:11:24.708 --> 00:11:26.208
Your story is, it's true.
00:11:26.908 --> 00:11:28.070
There's a reason for it.
00:11:29.269 --> 00:11:30.851
It's not even just what you did.
00:11:30.932 --> 00:11:32.214
It's what it stood for.
00:11:32.293 --> 00:11:34.535
It's what the amount of time you got.
00:11:34.636 --> 00:11:37.759
It reminds me of Jessica Resnicek just
00:11:37.799 --> 00:11:40.624
because of the time and how completely
00:11:40.703 --> 00:11:43.988
inappropriate it is according to the
00:11:44.107 --> 00:11:45.149
action.
00:11:45.528 --> 00:11:46.551
And just for the record,
00:11:46.671 --> 00:11:48.393
I don't believe in prisons at all.
00:11:49.653 --> 00:11:52.655
I've spent a lot of time on transitional
00:11:52.716 --> 00:11:55.716
services working in not supermax,
00:11:55.736 --> 00:11:58.359
but in maximum security prisons as well as
00:11:58.458 --> 00:11:58.979
outside.
00:11:59.318 --> 00:12:01.039
And one of the coolest things that they
00:12:01.059 --> 00:12:02.240
do is what you're doing.
00:12:02.280 --> 00:12:03.841
So I just want to commend you again
00:12:04.121 --> 00:12:05.202
for the work that you're doing,
00:12:05.243 --> 00:12:07.604
trying to keep other people out of prison.
00:12:08.264 --> 00:12:09.164
Very important.
00:12:09.384 --> 00:12:11.226
Now, tell me what you did.
00:12:11.287 --> 00:12:13.067
Tell me what it was like in prison
00:12:13.168 --> 00:12:14.690
and tell me what it's like coming out.
00:12:14.710 --> 00:12:17.511
Because one story that is told over and
00:12:17.572 --> 00:12:20.174
over again is how hard it is to
00:12:20.335 --> 00:12:21.235
find work,
00:12:21.296 --> 00:12:25.339
to get to all of your probation
00:12:25.558 --> 00:12:26.220
appearances,
00:12:26.279 --> 00:12:29.162
to adhere to all the insane rules that
00:12:29.263 --> 00:12:31.323
are applied to people who are formerly
00:12:31.364 --> 00:12:32.085
incarcerated.
00:12:33.089 --> 00:12:33.328
Yeah,
00:12:33.369 --> 00:12:36.090
so just bouncing real quick before I
00:12:36.110 --> 00:12:36.629
answer.
00:12:36.649 --> 00:12:38.110
I really wish Jessica had taken a
00:12:38.171 --> 00:12:39.770
different approach and not gone with the
00:12:39.791 --> 00:12:41.011
I'm going to intentionally get arrested
00:12:41.032 --> 00:12:41.392
approach.
00:12:41.932 --> 00:12:43.692
I think that is a bad tactic that
00:12:43.712 --> 00:12:45.332
the Catholic workers do sometimes,
00:12:45.873 --> 00:12:47.413
and I don't think it serves the movement
00:12:47.494 --> 00:12:49.173
or the community well to just serve up
00:12:49.193 --> 00:12:50.514
martyrs for the pigs to butcher.
00:12:51.615 --> 00:12:53.035
I think she could have done really,
00:12:53.076 --> 00:12:53.676
really great stuff.
00:12:53.696 --> 00:12:54.996
She's obviously got an immense heart,
00:12:55.456 --> 00:12:56.797
and I just wish their tactic was
00:12:56.817 --> 00:12:57.177
different.
00:12:57.238 --> 00:12:58.378
Make the feds do their job.
00:12:58.977 --> 00:12:59.839
Make them find you.
00:13:00.119 --> 00:13:01.620
We don't need to turn ourselves over for
00:13:01.720 --> 00:13:02.519
ethical statements.
00:13:02.840 --> 00:13:04.120
That's just a personality thing.
00:13:04.441 --> 00:13:05.581
All love and respect to Jessica.
00:13:05.600 --> 00:13:06.682
Totally.
00:13:07.282 --> 00:13:09.721
but yeah i'm with you it makes sense
00:13:09.761 --> 00:13:11.802
prison sucks i hate it um getting out
00:13:11.822 --> 00:13:13.263
of prison is even more hard because you
00:13:13.283 --> 00:13:14.883
don't always have the resources available
00:13:15.783 --> 00:13:17.903
i i was very blessed that as an
00:13:18.124 --> 00:13:19.844
active member of the anarchist community
00:13:19.884 --> 00:13:21.924
my people look out for me um i
00:13:21.985 --> 00:13:24.144
have lots of support getting out but
00:13:24.184 --> 00:13:26.846
things like mental health care are often
00:13:26.905 --> 00:13:28.245
left on the side when it comes to
00:13:28.265 --> 00:13:30.365
folks being released we forget that they
00:13:30.385 --> 00:13:31.686
have trauma we forget that they have
00:13:31.706 --> 00:13:33.167
immense triggers we forget that they're
00:13:33.187 --> 00:13:34.126
going to make mistakes
00:13:34.767 --> 00:13:36.769
that they're gonna have paranoias, angers,
00:13:36.869 --> 00:13:37.288
fears.
00:13:37.690 --> 00:13:38.890
And we do this stuff,
00:13:38.931 --> 00:13:41.173
we tone shame them, we anger shame them,
00:13:41.212 --> 00:13:42.293
we action shame them,
00:13:42.754 --> 00:13:44.876
as opposed to having open hearts and open
00:13:44.917 --> 00:13:47.099
minds that someone might just need time to
00:13:47.158 --> 00:13:48.559
heal, to get stuff off of them,
00:13:48.600 --> 00:13:50.120
to develop as a human again.
00:13:50.942 --> 00:13:52.302
And so for me,
00:13:52.364 --> 00:13:54.024
having access to that has been the best
00:13:54.065 --> 00:13:56.447
ticket that in mental health medicine.
00:13:56.466 --> 00:13:57.989
So I don't effing lose it on every
00:13:58.009 --> 00:14:00.250
single person that makes me mad.
00:14:00.711 --> 00:14:01.972
I've been getting tone pleased all week,
00:14:01.993 --> 00:14:02.312
by the way,
00:14:02.332 --> 00:14:03.413
people trying to hit me up saying,
00:14:03.774 --> 00:14:05.095
I don't like what you're saying,
00:14:05.596 --> 00:14:07.378
as opposed to like going after the things
00:14:07.398 --> 00:14:08.278
that I'm talking about.
00:14:09.852 --> 00:14:10.653
I got some of that.
00:14:11.513 --> 00:14:13.313
I got some of that.
00:14:13.333 --> 00:14:14.894
What did he just say on that panel?
00:14:15.214 --> 00:14:16.453
You booked that guy?
00:14:16.573 --> 00:14:17.335
Yes, I did.
00:14:17.914 --> 00:14:19.695
You're going to get mad at me for
00:14:19.715 --> 00:14:21.154
calling out people for being dangerous but
00:14:21.195 --> 00:14:22.775
not get mad about the dangerous behaviors?
00:14:22.796 --> 00:14:23.696
Shut up.
00:14:23.975 --> 00:14:24.456
Shut up.
00:14:24.556 --> 00:14:26.176
I've been fighting Nazis for ten straight
00:14:26.196 --> 00:14:26.375
years.
00:14:26.395 --> 00:14:27.537
You want to talk to me about words?
00:14:27.897 --> 00:14:28.336
Go to hell.
00:14:28.356 --> 00:14:29.856
I hate these old babies.
00:14:29.917 --> 00:14:31.937
And when you say that, you mean literally.
00:14:31.957 --> 00:14:32.857
Yeah.
00:14:32.957 --> 00:14:34.057
Not just figuratively.
00:14:34.258 --> 00:14:35.638
Yeah, these dudes aren't playing inside.
00:14:35.658 --> 00:14:36.958
You're not going to have little debates.
00:14:37.958 --> 00:14:39.639
I don't like your ethics, mister.
00:14:39.659 --> 00:14:40.899
You're not doing that.
00:14:40.919 --> 00:14:44.280
You better boot up.
00:14:44.321 --> 00:14:46.201
So when I get out and I see
00:14:46.221 --> 00:14:48.523
this almost like anarcho,
00:14:49.582 --> 00:14:51.004
how do I say this without sounding macho?
00:14:51.384 --> 00:14:52.464
Weakness, softness,
00:14:52.984 --> 00:14:55.105
to where now we can't engage with each
00:14:55.164 --> 00:14:56.605
other and I can't critique you.
00:14:56.644 --> 00:14:57.725
I can't be angry with you.
00:14:58.485 --> 00:15:00.005
In my mind, that lifts us up.
00:15:00.046 --> 00:15:01.126
It encourages us to be better.
00:15:01.985 --> 00:15:02.907
If I tell you like, bro,
00:15:02.927 --> 00:15:04.648
you're really doing this and it's slimy,
00:15:05.168 --> 00:15:06.349
that gives you a chance to either do
00:15:06.369 --> 00:15:07.629
better or call me out or tell me
00:15:07.649 --> 00:15:08.110
to shut up.
00:15:09.812 --> 00:15:10.072
Totally.
00:15:10.091 --> 00:15:11.732
We need to hold each other accountable.
00:15:12.212 --> 00:15:12.514
Yeah.
00:15:12.553 --> 00:15:13.774
And that includes calling out bad
00:15:13.794 --> 00:15:14.154
behavior.
00:15:14.174 --> 00:15:15.436
That includes being honest with each
00:15:15.515 --> 00:15:15.716
other.
00:15:16.336 --> 00:15:18.658
And that's something I don't want to say
00:15:18.677 --> 00:15:19.239
I miss from prison,
00:15:19.259 --> 00:15:20.298
but that's something I'm glad I brought
00:15:20.339 --> 00:15:20.759
home with me.
00:15:22.421 --> 00:15:22.600
Yeah.
00:15:22.620 --> 00:15:23.140
But yeah, prison sucks.
00:15:23.160 --> 00:15:23.682
Don't go to prison.
00:15:24.605 --> 00:15:25.505
don't go to prison.
00:15:25.907 --> 00:15:26.126
Um,
00:15:26.268 --> 00:15:30.192
and so many lessons just from going there
00:15:30.313 --> 00:15:32.076
in, in the capacity that I did,
00:15:32.176 --> 00:15:32.957
you know, um,
00:15:33.018 --> 00:15:34.700
sitting down and meeting with people,
00:15:35.140 --> 00:15:37.004
you know, my experience, um,
00:15:38.686 --> 00:15:40.427
Everyone who knew I was doing this was
00:15:40.488 --> 00:15:41.750
like, aren't you afraid?
00:15:42.049 --> 00:15:43.130
They're killers.
00:15:43.511 --> 00:15:44.893
Well, actually, most of them aren't.
00:15:45.474 --> 00:15:47.076
The vast majority of people there are for
00:15:47.135 --> 00:15:48.957
nonviolent offenses to begin with.
00:15:48.977 --> 00:15:50.539
And even if they are there for violent
00:15:50.559 --> 00:15:51.320
offenses, so what?
00:15:51.480 --> 00:15:52.020
Exactly.
00:15:52.061 --> 00:15:52.701
Exactly.
00:15:52.861 --> 00:15:54.923
Irrelevant is what I was about to say.
00:15:55.245 --> 00:15:56.886
Yeah, we're on the same page as usual.
00:15:57.267 --> 00:15:59.649
But like, no, that's not what happened.
00:15:59.809 --> 00:16:00.691
They were amazing.
00:16:00.751 --> 00:16:02.333
If anything, they were protective.
00:16:02.394 --> 00:16:03.154
They hugged me.
00:16:03.576 --> 00:16:05.879
What wasn't safe was when I needed to
00:16:05.919 --> 00:16:07.743
go to the bathroom and the guards sent
00:16:07.763 --> 00:16:10.466
me in the wrong direction intentionally.
00:16:10.846 --> 00:16:11.808
They're the problem.
00:16:12.750 --> 00:16:12.971
So...
00:16:14.272 --> 00:16:15.591
Yeah, exactly.
00:16:15.932 --> 00:16:19.073
On that note, my old show,
00:16:19.153 --> 00:16:20.254
The Awkward Interviews,
00:16:20.313 --> 00:16:22.835
very impressive branding there,
00:16:23.154 --> 00:16:24.394
very creative.
00:16:25.316 --> 00:16:26.775
Those shows were an hour long,
00:16:26.816 --> 00:16:29.697
and I don't think that's the move anymore.
00:16:30.476 --> 00:16:31.738
I'm trying to keep these short.
00:16:31.918 --> 00:16:33.258
I could talk to you forever,
00:16:33.577 --> 00:16:35.219
but I can't for that purpose.
00:16:35.259 --> 00:16:38.639
So let's close with something that I don't
00:16:38.759 --> 00:16:39.159
ask you.
00:16:39.980 --> 00:16:41.360
what's on your mind right now?
00:16:41.421 --> 00:16:43.461
What do you want my audience to know?
00:16:43.961 --> 00:16:44.461
And again,
00:16:44.861 --> 00:16:47.903
my audience is partially anarchist,
00:16:48.024 --> 00:16:49.965
very abolitionist at this point,
00:16:50.004 --> 00:16:52.426
but also a ton of liberals who are
00:16:52.466 --> 00:16:54.606
the most well-intentioned people in the
00:16:54.687 --> 00:16:55.647
world, I feel like,
00:16:55.667 --> 00:16:58.469
but are so misinformed most of the time.
00:16:59.149 --> 00:17:01.009
And particularly about the intricate
00:17:01.049 --> 00:17:01.509
details,
00:17:01.549 --> 00:17:03.130
particularly about people like us,
00:17:03.191 --> 00:17:07.413
particularly about the methods of praxis
00:17:07.432 --> 00:17:08.272
that are effective.
00:17:09.266 --> 00:17:11.647
So two things that I'll close with.
00:17:11.847 --> 00:17:11.988
One,
00:17:12.407 --> 00:17:14.849
whenever we hear the term nonviolent
00:17:14.890 --> 00:17:15.950
offenders, liberals,
00:17:16.371 --> 00:17:17.711
I hope you realize that that is a
00:17:17.912 --> 00:17:20.272
government term to describe men and women
00:17:20.353 --> 00:17:22.114
who were not taught impulse control,
00:17:22.153 --> 00:17:23.615
who were not taught how to manage
00:17:23.934 --> 00:17:24.836
difficult emotions,
00:17:24.855 --> 00:17:26.336
who were not given the love and support
00:17:26.356 --> 00:17:27.237
they needed as children.
00:17:27.597 --> 00:17:29.078
That is a failing of capitalism.
00:17:29.659 --> 00:17:31.380
That is because these people's parents had
00:17:31.420 --> 00:17:33.162
to commodify themselves as opposed to
00:17:33.201 --> 00:17:34.923
giving their kids the education,
00:17:34.962 --> 00:17:36.344
love and mental health care they needed.
00:17:36.663 --> 00:17:37.785
That's us failing them,
00:17:38.046 --> 00:17:39.386
not them failing the society.
00:17:39.807 --> 00:17:40.307
But secondly,
00:17:40.366 --> 00:17:41.909
please don't let our enemies control the
00:17:41.929 --> 00:17:42.308
narrative.
00:17:42.749 --> 00:17:44.590
Please don't let CNN, Fox News,
00:17:44.611 --> 00:17:46.192
the government control how you feel about
00:17:46.632 --> 00:17:49.374
migrants or immigrants or Antifa.
00:17:49.815 --> 00:17:51.816
These are government terms used to divide
00:17:51.875 --> 00:17:53.297
us so that we're paying attention instead
00:17:53.336 --> 00:17:56.059
to what are they doing as opposed to
00:17:56.119 --> 00:17:57.520
what the hell are they doing?
00:17:58.280 --> 00:18:00.001
Those are terms meant to divide us and
00:18:00.061 --> 00:18:01.803
crush us so that we're bickering with each
00:18:01.863 --> 00:18:03.824
other and trying to make excuses for the
00:18:03.844 --> 00:18:04.943
government's bad behavior.
00:18:05.443 --> 00:18:07.744
There's no such thing as a bad Antifa.
00:18:08.006 --> 00:18:09.605
There's no such thing as a bad migrant.
00:18:09.685 --> 00:18:11.507
What there is is bad fascists.
00:18:12.146 --> 00:18:14.067
And do not let the people that hate
00:18:14.087 --> 00:18:15.588
you determine how you view others.
00:18:15.868 --> 00:18:17.690
Their terminology cannot be how you view
00:18:17.710 --> 00:18:18.049
the world.
00:18:18.609 --> 00:18:19.151
Love and respect.
00:18:20.131 --> 00:18:21.791
As we say in hip hop, kill it.
00:18:22.730 --> 00:18:24.511
Well said, man.
00:18:25.874 --> 00:18:26.834
That was beautiful.
00:18:27.474 --> 00:18:28.996
I appreciate you coming on.
00:18:29.656 --> 00:18:32.159
And if I wasn't booked through twenty
00:18:32.199 --> 00:18:32.838
twenty seven,
00:18:32.878 --> 00:18:34.299
I would tell you you can come back
00:18:35.020 --> 00:18:36.122
over and over and over.
00:18:36.662 --> 00:18:38.103
I will say that if anything,
00:18:38.584 --> 00:18:42.146
anything comes up and we need to get
00:18:42.406 --> 00:18:43.607
a certain message out there,
00:18:43.647 --> 00:18:46.369
God forbid they target you again in a
00:18:46.410 --> 00:18:47.451
really direct way.
00:18:47.671 --> 00:18:48.791
I'm here for you.
00:18:48.971 --> 00:18:50.353
Let these liberals know if they ever want
00:18:50.393 --> 00:18:50.753
to debate,
00:18:50.773 --> 00:18:52.255
I'm available on any platform ever.
00:18:52.910 --> 00:18:53.970
Actually, that too.
00:18:54.770 --> 00:18:55.250
Please.
00:18:55.770 --> 00:18:57.971
You're making a mistake preaching to the
00:18:58.010 --> 00:19:00.392
choir, yelling or screaming into the void,
00:19:00.412 --> 00:19:02.012
the vacuum, whatever you want to call it.
00:19:02.032 --> 00:19:03.073
Where are they?
00:19:03.573 --> 00:19:05.874
Yeah.
00:19:05.913 --> 00:19:06.193
Yeah.
00:19:06.294 --> 00:19:08.013
I mean, it shouldn't be my show.
00:19:08.114 --> 00:19:10.954
It should be their show where they're
00:19:11.474 --> 00:19:13.736
exploring and expanding their minds.
00:19:13.796 --> 00:19:16.135
So that is a challenge to any of
00:19:16.175 --> 00:19:17.876
you who are watching and have your own
00:19:17.916 --> 00:19:18.257
show.
00:19:18.457 --> 00:19:19.196
Invite Eric.
00:19:19.237 --> 00:19:20.637
And if you need me to connect you,
00:19:21.038 --> 00:19:21.438
will do.
00:19:23.740 --> 00:19:25.362
On that note, yeah, happy Halloween.
00:19:25.382 --> 00:19:25.481
Peace.
00:19:25.501 --> 00:19:25.662
Peace.
00:19:28.324 --> 00:19:29.605
War is immoral.
00:19:29.885 --> 00:19:31.106
Poverty is immoral.
00:19:31.406 --> 00:19:32.667
Racism is immoral.
00:19:32.948 --> 00:19:34.670
Police brutality is immoral.
00:19:34.869 --> 00:19:35.990
Oppression is immoral.
00:19:36.230 --> 00:19:37.412
Genocide is immoral.
00:19:37.632 --> 00:19:38.893
Imperialism is immoral.
00:19:39.272 --> 00:19:41.474
This country represents all those things.
