From Smart Kitchens to Smart Menus with Guest Host Jason Berkowtiz

The Digital Restaurant Apr 25 2025
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Carl: [00:00:00] Happy Monday. We're [00:00:05] back. The digital restaurant is here, and yes, again, I have a brand new co-host [00:00:10] with me, a good friend. I don't know how many years you and I have known each other, Jason, but it's been a few [00:00:15] and everyone always associates me with this industry and books. But [00:00:20] Jason, you were the person that brought my attention to one of my industry favorites out there. Which is [00:00:25] very amusing is Please Don't Sleep with the Host. But it's such a good book. [00:00:30] And there are some laugh out loud moments in there, but at its heart is [00:00:35] hospitality, which is a word I often associate with you, Jason, in, in terms of everything that you bring
and [00:00:40] so, really pleased to have you here. We've got a ton. Of questions that we thought we could go through. We [00:00:45] only go through five on the show, so, why don't we get into it because I know you, the idea of the [00:00:50] smart kitchen has been talked about in number of different circles recently.
Q1 Qu launches smart kitchen tech
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Carl: I think taco Bell [00:00:55] talked about it with their NVIDIA relationship and how they can create more of a smart GM type of [00:01:00] mindset. But this one was about Q and I think they talked about this at RLC and [00:01:05] this idea of the smart kitchen. So hold on a sec. We're talking about a POS creating [00:01:10] smart kitchens, what's going on here?
Jason: Yeah. Right. What's going on is you have this [00:01:15] POS company, which is pretty much the heart or the brain, some people would [00:01:20] say, of a restaurant 
and so the connecting out to all these other different areas. We've got the [00:01:25] KDS, that is pretty much becoming synonymous with some pss. And now we have [00:01:30] monitoring systems in the kitchen and so. What this is doing is basically putting these [00:01:35] sensors around in your different equipment, refrigerators that's letting you [00:01:40] know how it's performing. Maybe there's a seal that's gone out [00:01:45] and you're leaking all of this cool, energy. Maybe something's breaking down. [00:01:50] It's also helping you with preventative maintenance. As an operator [00:01:55] for years, longtime restaurant operator, when I would go into a company, one of the [00:02:00] first things that I would put in place is say, what's our repair and maintenance plan?
Because. [00:02:05] By getting ahead of this, you are not only saving on cost [00:02:10] savings, energy savings, you're avoiding the headache of things going down, [00:02:15] right? It's this amazing stat of equipment downtime costs an [00:02:20] industry average of $46 billion in lost money [00:02:25] according to 86 repairs, state of the industry report.
. So what Q [00:02:30] is doing is starting to connect all of this together and saying, this matters.
You're [00:02:35] coming to us for a solution. We're already a brain. We're already storing information, we're already [00:02:40] communicating critical information to you. 
Well, let's connect to these different sensors. 
[00:02:45] And, , populate this and, you know, other companies have been doing [00:02:50] this connected, fresh or whatnot, and you've got 86 repairs and repair and maintenance.
I [00:02:55] appreciate that This is really starting to grow into the fold as a conversation, because [00:03:00] like I said, it's not only dollars, it's headaches. 
Carl: They've always approached things from a cloud [00:03:05] infrastructure standpoint and this kind of spirit of inter dependability between different [00:03:10] systems.
And if you build in a open fashion. You can therefore create seamless [00:03:15] connections between different data points. And so like you say, the sensors themselves, I mean we were putting [00:03:20] those into fridges at Kitchen United, but how those sensors are then linked into the [00:03:25] wider system and how you can create this overall holistic web of [00:03:30] decision support systems that I think is really compelling. And of course the piece that was [00:03:35] also I think attached to this news or certainly very close to it, was the fact that they acquired Four [00:03:40] Top recently. Yeah. And I don't think Q's been one of those kind of companies that's gone out and acquired lots of companies.
[00:03:45] So, Dar Bates, who's the former CEO of for Top, he's joined a third Chief products [00:03:50] officer. My goodness is he one of the smartest people in this space. And he really believes in this [00:03:55] idea of tying together data points and being able to imply a level of artificial intelligence [00:04:00] across that to support an operation, which of course was the genesis behind the idea, I [00:04:05] think of Fort Up.
And so really thrilled for him and Ben Pryor and the team that have gone into [00:04:10] Q now, because I think it's going to enable Q to just think beyond just the [00:04:15] front of the house and now extend their capabilities into the back of house as well. 
Jason: I'm excited to see [00:04:20] where this is gonna go. This is one of those things that is a [00:04:25] real thorn. Once you equipment goes down, you really look like the cost. So [00:04:30] I think it's great. 
Q2 - Reflecting on the disruptions that weren't
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Jason: Onto something that you were talking about [00:04:35] the restaurant disruptors that [00:04:40] weren't, we all get excited and then it comes into
time of action. Talk to us [00:04:45] about this. 
Carl: Yeah. Joe Kowski put out this article - he encouraged us to [00:04:50] rewind a bit. Right. Remember that, that kind of golden era of restaurant disruption [00:04:55] hype. Zoom Pizza, cooking pies in moving trucks and Amazon restaurants.
Going head [00:05:00] to head with Uber Eats and Ghost Kitchens, replacing every storefront and in-home chefs [00:05:05] launching apps from their living rooms. He covered it all in this really good article on restaurant business online, [00:05:10] and it really gave us a sharp look back at this particular theme. And, it's a time [00:05:15] capsule worth opening because.
For me, if you think about the funding that [00:05:20] came into many of these businesses, the bold claims, the amount of press buzz, many of them have [00:05:25] actually flamed out, right? Or have pivoted hard.
And so if we go through some of those examples that he [00:05:30] put into the article there, he talks about. Amazon restaurants, which of course launched in [00:05:35] 2015, but it was shot down four years later, despite it having free delivery from [00:05:40] prime members and this kind of massive footprint. The logistical powerhouse that is Amazon, they [00:05:45] couldn't keep up with the competitive chaos of third party delivery.
And according to some [00:05:50] accounts, their. Own spirit of working with other partners. Restaurants in this case, [00:05:55] perhaps created some tensions that actually restaurants weren't having anything to do with you. Then [00:06:00] think about Zoom Pizza right now. Zoom Pizza had $375 million from SoftBank. It's one of [00:06:05] those SoftBank investments, and of course they had all those mobile oven trucks.
They had one. [00:06:10] Fatal floor, though the cheese kept on sliding off the pizza when the trucks hit a pump. Right? Remember those [00:06:15] articles? So they closed their business in 2020 , didn't stop companies like wonder [00:06:20] that are still around from trying that whole approach, 
you don't see much of that [00:06:25] happening right now. And then a subject I know close to my heart, ghost Kitchens, 
once seen as the delivery only [00:06:30] future folks , have now thought, well, do we need a storefront just to stay [00:06:35] alive in a ghost kitchen setup? And I think that of course, is where Wonder come to the fore as well, because [00:06:40] they fall into that camp a little bit. But I think the lesson that was learned, certainly post the [00:06:45] pandemic, is that restaurants
don't just survive and delivery alone, at least in a [00:06:50] normal world. I think those that have built themselves up to be a true [00:06:55] e-commerce business. One of my favorites out there right now is Goop Kitchen. I dunno whether you've ever [00:07:00] had deliveries from them, but love the way they go about their business, both using Ghost Kitchens and [00:07:05] obviously the celebrity brand of Gwyneth Paltrow.
You see how that does come together? [00:07:10] But they built that without having to build it on top of a current restaurant business [00:07:15] model, and I think that allows them to be able to design the business structure in the most appropriate way. [00:07:20] Then the other one that Joe mentioned was in-home kitchens. Think Airbnb, but [00:07:25] for food cooked by your neighbor, which sounds cool until you start running into health code [00:07:30] red tape.
Right. And there are places in California, which we've seen this start to actually have some [00:07:35] laws like I think it's called M-E-H-K-O, I dunno what it stands for, but it's [00:07:40] allowing certain folks in California to be able to do it, but many other places haven't necessarily [00:07:45] got through that kind of regulation barrier yet.
So. It's easy to knock these [00:07:50] disruptions that have perhaps failed and I think Joe's take on it really is that it's [00:07:55] incredibly hard to reinvent the restaurant. It's a messy, operationally [00:08:00] complex, emotionally human business, 
and tech may be able to streamline aspects of it, but [00:08:05] replacing it outright is much harder. And the largest story here is that it's more about [00:08:10] disruption versus adaptation and the pandemic forced every [00:08:15] restaurant to adapt overnight, hopefully a quick plug. This thing helped a few folks, [00:08:20] but it really made us crave practical tech over kind of flashy [00:08:25] moonshots, and it's reminded us that the experience still matters, even in [00:08:30] a digital world.
That said. Disruptors absolutely still have their place. They [00:08:35] challenge the standard norms. I still think that our restaurant executive pool out there remains [00:08:40] lukewarm on tech in general. Largely, I think because they've been raised with their heart in [00:08:45] hospitality and they haven't yet seen how tech improves hospitality in physical [00:08:50] and in digital environments.
That doesn't mean it can't be done, but we've gotta stop thinking [00:08:55] of tech as these point solutions and really start thinking more about outcome focused [00:09:00] enhancements. And a great experience isn't really delivered by a [00:09:05] machine, but through a smile and warmth and all the things that you train through your business, right?
[00:09:10] And so, I don't know, may, maybe the future here isn't built in just one big leap or some big disruption [00:09:15] but perhaps it's gonna come through small, helpful adjustments that stick. I don't [00:09:20] want disruption to stop.
I just wanted to help in iterative areas. What's your take? You've been [00:09:25] observing this over the years. Are you in a similar mindset? 
Jason: Wise people have said under capitalization is one of the [00:09:30] biggest barriers to a startup, to growing. And in some cases with disruptors, over [00:09:35] capitalization becomes a problem.
And in some of the players in the ghost kitchen world [00:09:40] and across globe, that we're expanding aggressively you look under the hood and sometimes [00:09:45] there was a lot of money. That allowed a lot of inefficiency 
growth in [00:09:50] sales and capturing the market at all costs. Well, if you're not really understanding how you're making it [00:09:55] better along the way, and you're not running a little bit tight to the chest and looking at your own metrics, [00:10:00] then that can be a problem as well. And so I love disruption when it has enough [00:10:05] money to be able to push through, but not so much that, they're not [00:10:10] necessity is the mother of invention, right?
And at the end of the day, I still think we go back to [00:10:15] that same old question of like, so what?
This is great. This is changing things. This is [00:10:20] building things. So what does that mean for me? Am I getting my food faster? [00:10:25] Is it tasting better? Is someone being treated better? Is it more [00:10:30] sustainable? What's the so what behind it? And [00:10:35] just to jump real quickly, I love the disruption on the robots that you had talked recently as well, [00:10:40] and the idea that humans are better at salting chips, [00:10:45] right than robots are so.
But that might [00:10:50] lead to another innovation, and we'll talk about that in a little bit as well with one of these articles. So yeah, I'm a fan [00:10:55] of disruption. I like it to have a little bit of, I like guardrails though some form of [00:11:00] guardrails so you can stay measured along the way. 
Q3. Chipotle sales turn negative
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Carl: Let's talk [00:11:05] about one of, the top seven of companies that have really excelled when it comes [00:11:10] to the digital experience. Whether it be their digital make lines, some of their [00:11:15] investments in automation , but their sales have just turned negative for [00:11:20] the first time since what, 2020?
What, what's going on with Chipotle? 
Jason: Yeah. So since [00:11:25] 2020, it's the first time that they're seeing the sales dip. And recently on the quarterly [00:11:30] report, they were saying, their outlook's looking great to, to improve [00:11:35] in the back half of the year. But at the same time they're looking at basics and looking at how they can [00:11:40] improve it.
And one of the things that they talked about is throughput. And I [00:11:45] always talk about throughput, right? How many people can you move through the line at a time? I [00:11:50] love it. I geek out of this conversation , I would sit there with the timer and the clicker. Do we put somebody out [00:11:55] front do you do a line buster?
Do you give them a taste of something? So anyways, throughput first, [00:12:00] first check average really matters. And what they're doing is they're going back [00:12:05] to training and they're gonna focus on the hospitality. 'cause at the end of the day, like you talked about[00:12:10] 
somebody feels the training, the feel good. So part of increasing their [00:12:15] sales is making sure that everyone's saying thank you and that everyone's feeling [00:12:20] appreciated. Something that was interesting about Chipotle, I'm in the online training world. They [00:12:25] were great, dove deep into online learning management systems, which I'm a huge fan [00:12:30] of and they still are.
But they even pulled back a little bit and said, what we can't forget is the shoulder to [00:12:35] shoulder and the in-person I. And how much It's still a people [00:12:40] business and hospitality is a people business. So a little bit of the training, a [00:12:45] little bit of the blending, and they're doing this with throughput and what they're doing is now they're also bringing [00:12:50] back some efficiency they brought out before the auto avocado, which you had heard about [00:12:55] and the digital make line previously didn't do so well.
They moved it back to [00:13:00] r and d. Well, they're bringing this back out and the auto avocado helps. [00:13:05] Helps the associates peel avocados, and the digital make line is literally this [00:13:10] machine underneath the make line that creates the bowls and salads. Leverage [00:13:15] gravity, right? That can drop into the bowl, leaving burritos [00:13:20] and tacos and other things that are a little bit more delicate, human [00:13:25] focused, leaving the space for the team members to build those.
Here's [00:13:30] what I like about it. You've got hospitality, you've got throughput, you've got the human [00:13:35] connection, you've got training, and they're doing these tools. They're bringing these tools back out [00:13:40] that are taking care of some of the jobs that [00:13:45] are freeing up the team members to do what they do best or to spend time with people and [00:13:50] communicating with them as they move down the line.
They'll still there, they're still smiling, they're still talking to people [00:13:55] while building the burritos. They're not having to sit back there and peel the avocados. [00:14:00] We will see where it goes. I love when technology supports the [00:14:05] human experience. I mean, look, my business is in training humans and [00:14:10] I'm all about helping restaurants run efficiently.
I love when you minimize the [00:14:15] prep or the problem areas and you bring automation to help 'em. And you [00:14:20] still let people be people and be part of the whole and typo experience. So that's a couple of the things [00:14:25] that Chipotle's doing. We've got a lot of factors that are coming into play.
You've got the market, what they were talking [00:14:30] about is this isn't just Chipotle, this is across the board. Consumer spending, consumer confidence [00:14:35] is down. So they've got some other headwinds that you've talked about and we all talk about, [00:14:40] but at the end of the day, what can they control?
They can control how you feel when you walk in and what's the [00:14:45] efficiency of the situation. What do you think? 
Carl: And they're moving into Mexico, right? And they're building out more [00:14:50] representation in the Middle East so that those, so is that disruption, 
Jason: is that going back?
What's totally, how's that [00:14:55] story gonna play out? 
Carl: Oh, well, who knows? But here's the thing that goes through my mind, and I'm curious [00:15:00] because I've never had someone on the podcast with me that is such a expert in operations and [00:15:05] training, right? And when you think about your days back at AKA or relative to Chipotle and [00:15:10] the amount of units they've got.
The importance of the quality of the [00:15:15] trainer that's provided, and therefore the inconsistency that sometimes can happen. [00:15:20] In a way, I think where technology can help, right? Because in that sense you've got the technology [00:15:25] ensuring that there's a consistent form of delivery, but the relationship between the two [00:15:30] humans is the way in which that information can get conveyed in a very much more pliable, easy [00:15:35] to grasp manner.
What's your take on that? How do you blend humans and technology [00:15:40] together so that you do get a consistent training experience across a network? 
Jason: Everyone wants to know two [00:15:45] things I.
What's my job? What's my expectation and how am I doing? And if you can [00:15:50] leverage modern tools to set the training so that across the board it's consistently laid out [00:15:55] in every store, there's not institutional knowledge, or we do it one way here and not another way over [00:16:00] here. When you're a larger, organization, set what the expectation is and [00:16:05] then allow the in-person validation of it.
The feedback. So where does tech [00:16:10] do. In training or online tools, everyone gets the same video up [00:16:15] front. Everyone gets the same way of learning that this is how you do something. [00:16:20] This is the way we peel the avocado. This is the way we do it, and the [00:16:25] checkbox that they've actually been taught this. As many times we know in an organization people will [00:16:30] say, I never learned that.
Traditionally, it's, I show you, you practice, [00:16:35] then you show me. Well, if we can have I show you, be scalable and [00:16:40] digitized, then we've removed the need for additional hourly employees.
We [00:16:45] freed up the trainer to spend time working on the line or with other people. We've set a standard of [00:16:50] consistency and we've still included one of the most important pieces, which is now [00:16:55] validate and show me how you're doing it and let's do it together. So it's a blend, [00:17:00] which I absolutely love and I can tell you.
[00:17:05] So do the team members that you wanna have working for you.
Q4. Menu Engineering Crack through Nutritional Personalization and a new diner trends report
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Jason: [00:17:10] Cracking menu engineering through nutritional personalization. So what this is coming off is [00:17:15] a new diner trends report that recently just came out and we got [00:17:20] excited talking about it, knew that we needed to throw this in, take it away. 
Carl: Yeah, [00:17:25] really interesting one, a new trend report that for once doesn't come from McKinsey or [00:17:30] techno, but it might just be one of those kind of richer data sets on real time data behavior that I've seen for a [00:17:35] while.
And it's let me bring it up here 'cause I think it will bring this to life a little bit it's from a company called Every [00:17:40] Bite and it explores how over a million diners are interacting with restaurant [00:17:45] menus in a way that looks and feels a lot like shopping on Amazon.
Except this time it's for your next meal, [00:17:50] and it's not your typical kinda loyalty or order data. It's all pre click behavior. [00:17:55] The swipes, filters and drop-offs that happen before anyone taps order [00:18:00] now. . Let's go to this slide here, the [00:18:05] Diners Journey. The numbers here were really interesting to me. This actually came from a McKinsey report. The [00:18:10] 70% of diners abandoned a menu if they can't find what they want within minutes, [00:18:15] now it's a bit of loose. How many minutes are we talking? But I think the point is that it's not necessarily [00:18:20] always about price or convenience.
It's about this discovery friction, right? When you look to the number [00:18:25] to the right there, the 25%, it says 25% increased conversion. [00:18:30] When restaurants analyze the data from first touch and [00:18:35] the little graphic on the right there is really interesting, right? Because we as an industry have typically looked [00:18:40] at this from the angle of how much someone chooses to purchase.
But in an [00:18:45] e-commerce world, , there are so many different data points as to the amount of time that someone [00:18:50] spends on a particular page looking at a certain area of the page where they actually glide the [00:18:55] mouse cursor over, right? And this whole ability to be able to analyze that [00:19:00] level of data gives you insights about the way in which your business is [00:19:05] operated.
Some of the smart menu operators that are using every byte have [00:19:10] seen, they said like a 400% increase in order click-through rates, and perhaps more impressively [00:19:15] a repeat visit rate of 46% for guests who have interacted with a menu that's [00:19:20] given them that personalized menu experience.
Let me go onto page, [00:19:25] let's think 14 here. I. And just to set the scene in the data that this, in this [00:19:30] report is covering over a million diners 375,000 diners that have [00:19:35] set a preference.
And you can see here the representation over the time of day of which [00:19:40] those engagements have actually happened and the variety of different restaurants where this has actually [00:19:45] occurred. It starts breaking this down into the different diner [00:19:50] profiles and their nutritional and allergen preferences as you'll see here.
So, [00:19:55] for example, a lot of diners would actually select their menu. [00:20:00] Filtering by protein or carbohydrates. And for those that perhaps have allergens and [00:20:05] concerns from that angle, they'll actually select a menu whereby they say, I don't want any [00:20:10] items with wheat in or dairy. 
So what does that really mean? Why is any of this particularly interesting? [00:20:15] Well, 33 million diners in the US [00:20:20] have an allergy, or I have some interest in being able to have a nutritionally specific type of [00:20:25] meal.
When you think about that's like one in 10 people in the us. So [00:20:30] in that sense we're intolerant a lot really over here in the States, aren't we? And so [00:20:35] when you think about that, it really tells you we've gotta take this into account. The thing that [00:20:40] I wasn't aware of was then on this page here, when you talk about restaurant loyalty, [00:20:45] because 
if you treat a diner that has food allergies, right? By giving them the ability [00:20:50] to be able to see what items perhaps could cause them concern, they're far more likely [00:20:55] to come back and eat with you again in future. Which really stood out for me.
If [00:21:00] we go down to slide 23 here, what the report then goes to do is to start to [00:21:05] show how those different diners then choose to eat and perhaps even [00:21:10] more pertinently where there are overlapping allergens. So, for example, for wheat free diners, look [00:21:15] at this. 28% of the time, a wheat free diner is also combining that [00:21:20] concern with dairy.
, with this type of data, and when it comes back to seeing [00:21:25] this, it should help your culinary teams be able to design the right type of menus, [00:21:30] and
it starts talking about cracking the salad coat. So what it [00:21:35] means by that is if you can start to understand the way in which your customers are ordering your [00:21:40] salads. So for example, if the, if there's 53% of the base proteins are chicken [00:21:45] put amongst the top removed proteins include chicken and egg and chickpea, then [00:21:50] that's gonna help you make sure that the salads that you are actually servicing up to your customers
are addressing that [00:21:55] most common concern. So we very rarely talked about this type of [00:22:00] data set here on the show, and I thought it was just a really interesting representation. What was your takeaways? I know you took a [00:22:05] look at this as well. 
Jason: Just think about a couple things in ordering. Number one is how much [00:22:10] quicker that you can get to a decision just by filtering things out and [00:22:15] being able to say, this is what I want, or I don't eat. Boom. And then you're able to hand it off because [00:22:20] eventually the, it's like hot potato. You're holding the rock too long and you [00:22:25] feel, uncomfortable about it.
Carl: Yeah, totally. On your first point again, thinking about [00:22:30] e-commerce type of metrics. It's almost like the bounce rate, right?
The ability for you to be able to [00:22:35] understand where do you lose someone? Which page of your website do they say, you know what, I give up, I go away. That [00:22:40] insight would be huge. 
Jason: Something at the Madera group that we used to work on, which was saying, who in the [00:22:45] party was going to say, but I don't eat that, and then they have the veto vote [00:22:50] of not going to your restaurant or not ordering online. On the other side of it, [00:22:55] value engineering. Absolutely. If it's these [00:23:00] two combinations that go together. How can we have fun creating more options for [00:23:05] those combinations that are similar enough that you feel like you're taking care of, but you wanna come [00:23:10] back as a repeat guest.
Because what do we wanna do in fast casual and quick service? We wanna get [00:23:15] you back weekly at the minimum . 
Q5. How can tech makes restaurants be more sustainable?
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Carl: So [00:23:20] let's go on to question five, Jason. Because yes, this is a one that I'm super passionate about. We haven't [00:23:25] talked about it much actually on the show, but I think it's came up in this particular article about the [00:23:30] theme of sustainability and the fact that our industry has a major role to play [00:23:35] with it.
But actually, how can technology play a role in supporting us become perhaps a little [00:23:40] bit more sustainability focused. 
Jason: Yeah and so it talks about how restaurants are [00:23:45] using technology to advance, sustainability. And it even goes so far as to [00:23:50] say and why it's not enough. I love blending low tech and high tech [00:23:55] always.
And with that, I remember when I was moving on to manager and [00:24:00] the GM walks me through and goes, every time you walk through the kitchen in the morning, I want you to look in the [00:24:05] garbage. I want you to continue to look in the garbage and see how much of that tuna came off that [00:24:10] should have stayed on.
How much of that, you know that apple got cut aside from the [00:24:15] core and food waste is what, 22 to 23 billion [00:24:20] pounds of food are wasted each year. Just think about that, right? It's [00:24:25] absolutely insane. What either gets wasted because it [00:24:30] wasn't served or what gets tossed off the plate. So we've got great companies that are [00:24:35] working on this.
You've got clear cogs, which you know, was part of the newsletter. Our friends over there that [00:24:40] shout out to Matt Wampler. Shout out to Matt Wampler 3.8 million to help [00:24:45] restaurants with predictive analytics. How much bread do I make in the afternoon? This [00:24:50] stuff really matters and it's helping on food waste.
It's helping on labor waste. You [00:24:55] have Kim over at Copia, which is doing great things with trying to [00:25:00] help you figure out where your waste is, as well as find places to take it and then [00:25:05] to find the tax benefit of this to offset the cost of it. So, if [00:25:10] you are gonna waste, let's figure out ways of feeding the community you have.
What we talked about at the top with [00:25:15] q energy systems. This is a huge waste. This is a huge data [00:25:20] suck. Water conservation systems. We have Wendy's rolled out. This it's a smarter [00:25:25] dishwasher saving like 47% per [00:25:30] cycle. The one that does get me is packaging. I still, I [00:25:35] struggle, Carl. I wanna order from my local places. Sometimes we can't [00:25:40] sit there. I take it to go and it's just killing me, [00:25:45] throwing out what is recycled and I can't do anything with it.
The packaging [00:25:50] I still want, and I know it's arbitrary and call me crazy. I'm excited for somebody to introduce the little [00:25:55] subscription service I take my container. I wash it, I give it back. Sure. [00:26:00] There's operational problems. Sure they have to wash it themselves, but how do we get that going as a [00:26:05] subscription service where we can share the waste.
Carl: In the first book we, we talked about, I think it was a company called Loop [00:26:10] Delivery out of Oregon that had this set up with local companies where you could , have your [00:26:15] items picked up almost like your trays picked up by the delivery driver on the [00:26:20] next journey, right?
Yeah. And I call upon the door dashes and the [00:26:25] Uber eat to this world to really own this one too, because they [00:26:30] are benefiting, I think, from this new delivery ecosystem that we're part of. We [00:26:35] know that more and more restaurants, as they crack the code on delivery are going to have more [00:26:40] packaging expenditure, and therefore we know that waste is going to be somewhat higher.
The [00:26:45] one benefit to your point at the start about food waste is that in, in a way, when you're eating [00:26:50] at home, you may might not finish the whole thing, but it can go into the fridge for lunch the [00:26:55] next day. That is actually a positive and I think we need to find [00:27:00] ways to actually perhaps think about encouraging that, how can you perhaps now not just [00:27:05] order dinner, but order lunch for the next day?
Jason: Yeah. And some people are bringing their own to-go containers [00:27:10] to, to eat at their local restaurant 'cause they know that they're gonna have to take some home and [00:27:15] some people are letting them do it. So I like that there are some real innovations in tech.
I [00:27:20] like the conversations happening. As with everything, the more that we iterate on it, [00:27:25] hopefully the more cost effective, it'll become more tangible and just becomes, part of it. [00:27:30] Who knows? Maybe you and I have kicked something off here with DoorDash. Let's get it going. 
[00:27:35] 
About ArrowUP Training
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Carl: Before we finish up today, Jason, the great thing that's come through in a lot of your answers [00:27:40] is just how value centric a leader you are and how you do lead with your heart forward in a lot of things. [00:27:45] Tell me a bit about Arrow Up. What are you guys doing there? How do you differentiate yourself from others?[00:27:50] 
Who are you trying to help? 
Jason: I appreciate this opportunity. So yeah, I'm a longtime restaurant operator [00:27:55] from, burger King at 14 up to COO and partner for the Madera Group and other large [00:28:00] locations. And we started Air up six years ago to help, as I said before, help every employee [00:28:05] out there know what their expectation is and see how they're doing.
So we provide online [00:28:10] training that helps restaurants satisfy compliance, level up their teams and develop [00:28:15] supervisors into leaders. 
Because training is, one of the number one [00:28:20] requests of operators out there and the small to mid-level that I love. We work with, [00:28:25] look, we do anti-harassment, safety compliance, we do all that and that's our bread and butter. And [00:28:30] we work with a lot of large organizations. I think if we can build.
And bring this [00:28:35] masterclass Restaurant one oh ones the basics to all of these mom and pops and [00:28:40] mid-level markets out there. It's gonna be awesome. And look, restaurants are America's number [00:28:45] one north America, probably most people's first job. Let's set 'em up for success. [00:28:50] Success. Let's teach 'em what it means to enter the workplace.
So I think if we [00:28:55] train and support. The people and the restaurants will attract [00:29:00] the ones we wanna work alongside. And restaurants are the heartbeat of the community.
That's my [00:29:05] mission. 
Carl: Well said my friend. It's always a pleasure. How do people get in touch with you if [00:29:10] they would like to learn more? 
Jason: Yeah there's our website, arrow up training.com. [00:29:15] Reach out to me jason@arrowuptraining.com spelled like it [00:29:20] sounds and LinkedIn. Jason d Berkowitz. I got a cousin, Jason Berkowitz, who's on there and [00:29:25] a couple other Jason Berkowitz's.
So I'm Jason d Berkowitz, and let's talk, let's [00:29:30] connect. Let's geek out. 
Carl: Sounds good. Well, thank you for geeking out with me today. It's been a real [00:29:35] privilege. And for those of you that have listened in through to the end, we appreciate you.
Please leave your comments below. Any [00:29:40] questions that you got for Jason or myself, we'll get back to you. But until next time, thanks Alyssa. Alyssa. 
[00:29:45] The Digital Restaurant Podcast is available for you to follow and subscribe wherever [00:29:50] you listen to your podcasts. Watch us, rate us and subscribe to the digital [00:29:55] restaurant on YouTube and follow along on all our social media digital restaurant channels. [00:30:00] Thanks for listening.