WEBVTT
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The Ruger SFA R is one of the trim is
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threeh eight Modern sporting rifles available more power but lighter
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in the field and range. See how light it is
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at Ruger dot com.
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Oh, we're just talking about guns, guns and more gun
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I'm Tom Gresham. This is gun talk. We're at the
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Shot Show. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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We do this every year and it's still fun after
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all these years.
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I'm having a ball. We're at the Caldwell booth. They're
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letting us hang out over there. The probably the biggest
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news in the gun world. I mean, we got you know,
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a lot of new products everything that's all fun talk about.
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But in terms of the thing that people are talking
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about a lot is the tax going away on suppressors
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and SBRs. And yeah no, we didn't get rid of
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the whole NFA like we wanted, but hey, stay tuned.
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You never know what's going to happen with that.
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Well, right now we're joined by Dave Matheeny, Dave from
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Silencer Shop. The questions you're getting of, Okay, the tax
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is gone on buying suppressors, What does that mean?
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How are things changing?
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You know?
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I really I think this just opens up basically the
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next golden age of suppressors. In my opinion, it's like
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you've got super low weights right now. You're still looking
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at two or three day day weights even with the volume.
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Well talk about that, what kind of volume increasing you guys?
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Oh, this is this is crazy.
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We've already processed I would say just over a quarter
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of the forums we did for all of last year, and.
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Last year was a big year. We're halfway into the
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first month. I know the year.
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This is it is nutty.
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And now you say there's other stuff that we didn't expect,
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Like I and maybe we should have, but I didn't
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expect the surgeon form ones. It's like people are one
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is that's when you make your own SBR or silencer,
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and it's a people are doing those like crazy.
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But we're seeing tens.
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Of thousands of those making their own suppressors.
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Yeah, you make one of your garage file a Form
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one no tax WHOA, Okay, it's a there's a lot
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of experimentation I think going on right now. I think
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we'll see a lot of advancement this.
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I'm just gonna say, there's gonna be some un but
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there are some really clever people. Oh yeah, and a
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lot of time times the innovation comes out of some guys.
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Go that's right, somebody who had an idea, but they
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never really did it because of the just the passle
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right now, no tax, very little weight.
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This is going to be the Golden Ages, the next
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gold nag.
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But you still have to register your suppress. Yes, so
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we talk about that.
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That has not changed. We did file a lawsuit.
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We're suing a Department of Justice basically over this to
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try to get them completely removed.
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The idea being that this was originally a tax law. Yes,
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and if there's no tax, there shouldn't be a law.
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That's right.
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That's pretty much the basis.
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That is the basis.
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Yes, okay, so that could take a while with lawsuits.
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That's that's right.
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That's really it's it's we're committed to it. We're looking
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at this as like a multi year process, but it's
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a it's moving though. We also didn't expect a partner
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of Justice to fight it quite as aggressively as they had.
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Where I was going to go, it's good, you know,
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on the one hand, the Department of Justice is doing
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some really good things on the gun side, segment side,
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but they're really digging in their heels and NFA and
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this thing. I'm actually scheduled to talk to Harmey Dillon
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in a couple of days, and I'm gonna ask her.
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I said, you know, what's going on? Why is DOJ
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hanging in there like this? Why don't we just agree
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that we don't need to have any restrictions on suppressors
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in the cars. Yeah, I'll look forward to finding out.
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What she said.
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Yeah, I am too.
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It's a and we we knew that they would have
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that interstate commerce argument in their back pocket that they
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could pull out.
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And that's kind of a track part.
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That's the catch all that they use forever they did,
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and it's totally bogus. And I will tell you, I
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think the Supreme Court is about tired of it.
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Oh, I agree with that. It's being overused, right, It's
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it's being applied to everything. They can justify anything if
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anything moves from state to state, not even.
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If the product moved, if the materials that used to
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make the product you ever moved across the state line,
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they say, yep, that's federal.
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Now, yeah, we're we got control of that.
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Yeah, that's exactly right.
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Okay, So let's go all the way back to suppressors. Well,
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first of all, let's back up silence shop. Tell people
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about your company.
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Yes, I mean really, that's our whole objective is to
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make the silencer buying process as simple as possible. Okay, right,
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and that's right now, that's you know, Let's get your
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forms in, get them submitted, have as minimal weight as possible,
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no tax, and let's grow this market.
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Somebody's never bought a suppressor, Explain to them what is involved.
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I want, I want to buy a suppressor. What am
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I going to have to do?
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The process is actually really straightforward. We've got kiosks all
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over the country. Go through the Kiosk one time, and
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gun stores you go through the Kiosk one time. That's
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a one time deal ever, and then we essentially will
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review your paperwork.
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We'll handle the.
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Submissioned atf the finger printing. The finger printing's done at
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the Kiosk. Photograph that's that's actually done through our mobile app.
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We have a new version of the Kiosk that we
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will do that as well. But you have to update
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the photo every year so the boat laps the better options,
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so you don't have to go to a kiosk Peria Pasu,
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are you just making it easy that the goal is
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make this easy. Let's get us get these forms submitted.
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This grow the industry, and then we can put political
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pressure on people in Congress.
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There you go to make more people that have them,
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and the more people that want them, the more people
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are going to speak out. And now you're speaking with
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a lot more people behind you who you're going into court.
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This zero dollar tax thing could not have happened fifteen
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years ago. The market was too small. Now they're getting
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them out of the NFA. Give it another ten to
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fifteen years that can handle. That will happen legislatively if
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we don't win in the courts.
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Is it true that in some European countries the pressures
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are just like on hangtags?
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Yes, only just on the wall. There's nothing to it. Yep.
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I go hunting all over the place, can I tell you? You
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go outside the US and they have a horrible time
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getting guns. But as soon as they get the gun,
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they buy the silencer over the counter from a hardware store.
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And these things are like ten bucks, and some of
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them are impressive.
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No kidding, Yeah, all right, So if they're ten bucks there,
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why are they six hundred dollars here?
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I think a lot of it is the process. It's NFA.
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It is an artificial barried entry, right, which is going
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to drive down volumes and drive up price.
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Okay, So I think what I hear you saying is
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if we get to the point where we can drive
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up volume, then we can drive down price.
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And I don't think we'll ever get the ten dollars,
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but I think will be half of where we are really.
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Oh yeah, it will be priced way less than where
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it currently is. It's just a lot of Look at
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the overhead all these companies have in managing the process.
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Right, Well, okay, talk about that, because the companies that
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are making them, they have to track every single unit
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and have to keep records on them for ATF.
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Yeah, and it's not just keeping records, it's registering with
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ATF and telling ATF every time it moves. So when
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they manufacture one, they have to file a Form two
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with the ATF to tell them they manufactured it. When
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they send it a distributor, they file a Form three
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and wait for an approval before they can mail it
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to the distributor. Then the distributor has to file another
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Form three, wait for an approval, wait for it to
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get to the customs.
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An enormous amount of overhead.
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So so then the ATF supposedly knows where these cans
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are at any given time.
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Right, It's that's it's a register.
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Good because we need to know where mufflers are.
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A hundred percent. I feel safer if they knew where
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all the mufflers were.
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Okay, you know, you could literally, we're gonna say this,
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you could literally unscrew the muffler from your Brigs and
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Stratton lawnmower and screw it onto your gun.
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And it would be effective.
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And it would be effective.
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Yeah, and it would be a suppressor, it would be
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a expressor, and it would kill your accuracy.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, there's some other side that there's a problem. Yeah,
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it's not really a suppressure. But in terms of okay,
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at this basic form a suppressure is just a muffler,
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that's right. But and I'm gonna hand this off to you,
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we are now seeing advances in technology and suppressures.
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That's amazing.
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Oh yeah, three D printing.
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If you had asked me five, six, seven years ago,
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if we had kind of hit the limit of what
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suppressure would do could do?
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I would have thought yes.
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Other than like you know, feature stuff, mounting systems were
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still improving.
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H Modular stuff was still getting better.
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But as far as quietness blowback, have you seen ambient suppressors?
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So ambient just came out this year.
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You can, like mag dump through a can that's quiet
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with low black blow back pressure and then grab the
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can with your bare hand.
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And just that that's right? How does it not get hut?
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Seriously, I do not understand, but I've shot them and
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they are magical. Still kind of expensive, right, it's not
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your mass market product, but for law enforcement imagine those guys,
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that's a game changer.
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Oh yeah yeah, or and military military too.
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You know, you go full auto, there's nothing and you
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can just grab it, unscrew it with your bare hand.
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And trust me, people don't do this at home. You
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try that with a regular.
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Spressor, you'll get a brand.
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You will brand yourself because they get hot. It'll burn you.
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That's a fact.
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Yeah.
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What else do people need to know about what's going
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on with the suppressors and silencers now?
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You know?
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Really it's just what we're seeing is so many new
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entrants into the market. That is driving innovation from the
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new from these new companies, but it's also driving the
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existing companies to renovate again, right.
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Competition does that.
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So I think we'll see a lot of a lot
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of really cool stuff coming out of the big existing
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manufacturers we already are. I'm not, yeah, but it's a
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like I said, I think we're on the verge of
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another another golden agent side.
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What's that going to mean for Silencer Shop?
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Honestly, I have For us, we'll just stay kind of
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committed to what our goal has always been.
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Let's make this as simple as possible. Rights.
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That's your gig is it is making it easy? I mean,
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and you're selling suppressors absolutely, yeses, but you just make
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it easy for people to do it, that's right. Do
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people need to have a trust now?
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You know?
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I would recommend that they do for possession?
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Yeah, So you want to have you Bias Holncer, your wife,
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your kids, whoever's using it, they want to use it independently.
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A trust is the way to get all members of
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the trust. So anybody who's a member of the trust
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use it. Do you help with that?
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One hundred percent? Yeah?
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And for most people, I'd recommend going with a single
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shot trust, which is only the main buyer has to
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get fingerprinted, photographed. Then after they get approved, they can
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add anybody and they want on to it. Got you,
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super flexible, super easy. It's as easy as an individual
249
00:10:16.840 --> 00:10:18.919
with all the benefits of a trust. What's the website
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00:10:19.120 --> 00:10:20.399
silencershop dot com?
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That hard to do? Huh? Silencer Shop?
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That's right, that's right.
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Hey, thank you so much. I appreciate it. That right.
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Thank you.
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Have a good show, Yeah you too. All right, don't
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go far, We'll be right back at the shot show.
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Want the latest and guns, gear and shooting infos straight
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into your inbox. Sign up for the Gun Talk newsletter.
266
00:11:20.440 --> 00:11:24.879
Get insider access to reviews, exclusive deals, training tips, and
267
00:11:24.919 --> 00:11:28.559
the hottest stories from the range, delivered every week. Don't
268
00:11:28.600 --> 00:11:31.759
miss out on the news and offers every shooter needs
269
00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:34.919
to know. It's fast, free and easy. Sign up today
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00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:42.840
at gun talk dot com. That's gun talk dot com.
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When someone leaves you their gun collection, you may want
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00:11:46.279 --> 00:11:49.399
a few. What do you do with the rest? How
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00:11:49.440 --> 00:11:50.440
do you sell them?
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Who do you call? Well?
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I call Johnny Durry at Durry's Guns. Whether you're selling
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one gun or five hundred. They'll tell you what it's
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worth and write you a check, simple, quick, easy, fair.
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I trust Dory's Guns.
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00:12:07.080 --> 00:12:13.240
Give them a call Dourysguns dot com. Put all your
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00:12:13.240 --> 00:12:16.120
gear on the ch'iciry and then roll around on the ground. Now,
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00:12:16.159 --> 00:12:18.440
get up all your gear that's on the ground. That's
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what you're not going to have in a fight.
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Gun Talks should be in your podcast feed. Check out
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gun talk Nation.
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What's it like to be blown up?
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00:12:25.480 --> 00:12:28.120
You know, if it's like C four, it's almost like
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00:12:28.159 --> 00:12:29.440
a smack hunting.
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00:12:29.759 --> 00:12:32.799
Yeah, we talk about that too. On your crosshairs, I
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00:12:32.960 --> 00:12:35.840
like a thin crosshair A you're really dating yourself by
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calling things cross hairs. You're redical whatever.
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Have some fun and stay informed with the gun Talk podcast.
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You know, there are a lot of tinkers in the business,
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and a lot of people call themselves guns so a
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lot of people who should not call themselves gunsmith's. That's
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just the reality of the deal. Sorry, guys, it's just
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what it is. I bother way, I'm Tom Grescher. We
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were at the Shots Show, we're at the call Rub.
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We appreciate you staying here with us because we're trying
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to talk to as many people as we can. And
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yet we talked to manufacturers where we talk to people
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who are just in the business and do interesting things.
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All right, Jerry McNally, tell me what Sonoran Desert Institute is.
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00:13:23.679 --> 00:13:26.519
Yeah, so, Tom, thanks for having me on. First off,
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00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:30.879
But Snoring Desert Institute is a online gunsmithing program. So
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we take the skills and tools and techniques of a
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gunsmith and put that in somebody's living room so they
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can learn right where they're at, rather than having to
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go to a.
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Brick and mortar school.
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How long you been doing that.
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We've had the gunsmithing program for about twenty six years now,
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so we started back in two thousand.
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Yep.
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We've taught some other things along the way. That has
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always been a popular one for us, and we're actually
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with twenty twenty six starting out, we're actually launching a
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nice new revamp to our program.
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So how did it get started?
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A couple of couple of guys got together and said, hey,
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we want to do a trades based program and we
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want to take it outside of the four walls.
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And you know, with enough beer, you can come up
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with a good idea. Well, all right, So the obvious questions,
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because somebody really learned to be a gunsmith with online.
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Training, absolutely yes, you know, with what happened with COVID,
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I actually come from an on ground school. I used
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to run an on ground school as well. COVID opened
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my eyes. My school was closed for eight months.
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Okay.
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And so with the creativity and some of the things
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out in the marketplace now, think about Amazon deliveries, think
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about Zoom, think about some of these things that we
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now have. Yeah, we didn't have before, We didn't have
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before or weren't mainstream before. We absolutely can do this
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now because we can put that classroom in their living
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room and that lab there too.
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Who is learning to be a gunsmith? Who wants to
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do this these days?
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Yeah, you know, it's it's it's interesting. A lot of veterans,
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veteran myself, okay, okay, a lot of veterans are doing it.
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It's a great way for them to have an outlet
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that's a hands on outlet to go out and make
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a living for their families. In the future, we're seeing
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the younger generation get into it as well. You know,
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I've had a number of students and graduates come through there,
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played the video games. Now I want to build a No,
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I would never have thought about. Oh, it's amazing, it's amazing.
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Interesting. All right.
349
00:15:32.480 --> 00:15:36.360
So what's the market like out there, job market for
350
00:15:36.440 --> 00:15:37.519
a gunsmith these days.
351
00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:40.279
Yeah, it's an interesting market. There's there's kind of three avenues.
352
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Think about any time you've got to maintain something. So really,
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a gunsmith's just a mechanic for firearm right right. So
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you think about your your law enforcement military population. You've
355
00:15:50.000 --> 00:15:52.399
got all these law enforcement departments that have to have
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some kind of trained individual taking.
357
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Care of them.
358
00:15:55.679 --> 00:15:58.360
Yeah, an armorer, a gunsmith taking care of those things. Okay,
359
00:15:58.759 --> 00:16:02.000
You've got your your manufacturers that are building all this stuff.
360
00:16:02.000 --> 00:16:07.360
They've got to have a warranty repair department or customization department,
361
00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:10.240
right right, So you've got gunsmith's there, and then you've
362
00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:13.039
got you know, the ranges and the local retail stores
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that are providing that service to the end customer. And frankly,
364
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it's that that we're in that world where a lot
365
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:22.399
of people have these great tools, they don't always know
366
00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:25.360
how to maintain them. You know, I'm not a carboncadica.
367
00:16:25.639 --> 00:16:28.279
I take my card to somebody and I'm the world's worst.
368
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:30.240
Everybody who listen to this or knows I am not
369
00:16:30.279 --> 00:16:31.799
a gunsmith. I'm not a mechanic.
370
00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:32.240
You know.
371
00:16:32.240 --> 00:16:34.519
When I pick up a screwdriver, my friends called nine
372
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one one it's that bad.
373
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Yep.
374
00:16:35.960 --> 00:16:40.000
So it's like, okay, I need a gunsmith. Yeah, you know, partypically,
375
00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:42.840
I am the guy who brings him the box and hey,
376
00:16:42.879 --> 00:16:43.919
look all these parts here.
377
00:16:43.919 --> 00:16:45.159
We used to be a gun. Could you put it
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00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:45.919
back together for me?
379
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Exactly?
380
00:16:46.440 --> 00:16:48.000
I'm that guy exactly. Yeah.
381
00:16:48.039 --> 00:16:50.519
And so we've If you think about all the new
382
00:16:50.600 --> 00:16:53.519
gun owners and all of the sales of firearms over
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00:16:53.519 --> 00:16:56.360
the last twenty thirty years that we've got data on,
384
00:16:57.000 --> 00:16:59.519
it just continues to grow. Well, the cool thing about
385
00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:03.720
firearms is in most cases there's been a limited few models,
386
00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:06.799
but in most cases they were designed to be to
387
00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:10.160
live forever, and so you replace some parts in them, Yes,
388
00:17:10.160 --> 00:17:13.519
but they're designed to go on forever, so they need
389
00:17:13.559 --> 00:17:16.359
to be maintained and it takes those skilled trades people
390
00:17:16.359 --> 00:17:16.720
to do that.
391
00:17:16.880 --> 00:17:18.960
I tell people, I say, look, name me a number
392
00:17:19.079 --> 00:17:24.519
another consumer product, maybe hand tools that you buy with
393
00:17:24.599 --> 00:17:28.240
the absolute expectation that it will outlive you. You can use
394
00:17:28.279 --> 00:17:31.359
it continuously and you expect it to outlive you. And
395
00:17:31.400 --> 00:17:34.000
with firearms, that's just like, well, yeah, of course exactly,
396
00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:35.599
I'll be able to hand this down to my kids
397
00:17:35.599 --> 00:17:36.240
and grandkids.
398
00:17:36.319 --> 00:17:38.400
Yeah. Watches maybe the only other one thing I can
399
00:17:38.440 --> 00:17:38.720
think of it.
400
00:17:38.920 --> 00:17:41.480
But you can only do that if you take care
401
00:17:41.480 --> 00:17:41.799
of them.
402
00:17:41.799 --> 00:17:42.119
Correct.
403
00:17:42.960 --> 00:17:47.759
So I mean, all right, what about custom gunsmithing? Can
404
00:17:47.799 --> 00:17:50.720
you enter at this level and then work your way
405
00:17:50.720 --> 00:17:52.920
into becoming a true custom gunsmith?
406
00:17:52.960 --> 00:17:54.200
Absolutely? Absolutely?
407
00:17:54.200 --> 00:17:56.920
You know, custom gunsmithing is is a desire to do
408
00:17:57.000 --> 00:18:00.759
something different in the market, right, and then the the
409
00:18:00.799 --> 00:18:04.480
audacity to to just have the repetition to build it to.
410
00:18:04.440 --> 00:18:06.839
Say I can do something that other people aren't doing.
411
00:18:07.000 --> 00:18:07.240
Yep.
412
00:18:07.359 --> 00:18:10.119
And you see a lot of great gunsmiths out there
413
00:18:10.119 --> 00:18:13.920
that are custom custom gunsmiths that were overnight successes when
414
00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:15.759
really they've been doing it for thirty years building.
415
00:18:15.799 --> 00:18:16.519
Well, yes, that's so.
416
00:18:16.559 --> 00:18:18.720
I'd never heard of him before. Yeah, well he was
417
00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:21.279
doing it. You just didn't hurt and you could especially
418
00:18:21.359 --> 00:18:26.119
you say, I'm a nineteen eleven. I do find bolt
419
00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:30.240
action rifles. Whatever the area is that it is interesting
420
00:18:30.240 --> 00:18:30.599
to you.
421
00:18:31.119 --> 00:18:33.160
Yeah, and even some of the other processes. You know,
422
00:18:33.200 --> 00:18:37.440
we're seeing kind of a twist in the industry. You know,
423
00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:40.119
there was a big push the last probably decade and
424
00:18:40.160 --> 00:18:43.400
a half where getting more people into the trees. Well,
425
00:18:43.400 --> 00:18:45.400
now they've got that feel and that taste for it,
426
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:47.480
and now that's that. How do we customize them, how
427
00:18:47.480 --> 00:18:50.599
do we make them better? You know? It finishes, it's
428
00:18:51.000 --> 00:18:52.680
it's all these kind of things, and these all these
429
00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:54.400
little niches that you can get into.
430
00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:57.160
I mean, anything from a trigger job to a Sarah
431
00:18:57.200 --> 00:19:00.839
Coot correct finish. It's just whatever. And saw the numbers
432
00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:02.359
last week and this as I have put out, they
433
00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:07.039
said there now are five hundred million guns in America.
434
00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:09.920
That's a good number. It's a good started number, you know,
435
00:19:10.119 --> 00:19:12.759
but we'd like to double that. But that's okay. But
436
00:19:12.880 --> 00:19:14.640
five hundred million guns, that means there's a lot of
437
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:15.599
people have guns that.
438
00:19:15.640 --> 00:19:18.079
Need work well, and keep in mind that doesn't count
439
00:19:18.079 --> 00:19:21.519
in any of the muzzleoders. Oh and those are all
440
00:19:21.519 --> 00:19:23.720
the same concepts, so you still need a smith.
441
00:19:23.519 --> 00:19:25.599
To take care of those. Oh. Interesting, So the numbers
442
00:19:25.640 --> 00:19:26.640
get way bigger, all.
443
00:19:26.599 --> 00:19:29.119
Right, So what does somebody need to start off? They said?
444
00:19:29.119 --> 00:19:31.519
Okay, I'm interested. I wanted to sign on to this.
445
00:19:32.039 --> 00:19:34.759
What do I need to do? The easiest way? Jump
446
00:19:34.799 --> 00:19:35.920
on SDI dot edu.
447
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:39.200
Fill up the contact form there and say you you're
448
00:19:39.240 --> 00:19:43.000
interested in the program? Yesdi dot edu correct, and somebody
449
00:19:43.000 --> 00:19:45.799
will get in contact with you. Other than that, we
450
00:19:45.880 --> 00:19:48.839
assume I assume that my students coming to me don't
451
00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:50.720
know anything. So we're going to try to start you
452
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:52.319
at the ground level and work you up.
453
00:19:52.559 --> 00:19:54.920
Okay, do you need Do they need to have tools
454
00:19:54.960 --> 00:19:56.480
when they start? Are you going to get them started
455
00:19:56.480 --> 00:19:58.160
from there? We're gonna get them started from there. We
456
00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:00.279
send out tools with each of the classes. There is
457
00:20:00.279 --> 00:20:03.400
a small shopping list with our programs. Sure, you know,
458
00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:07.440
basic stuff, makes sense, stuff they likely already have laying around, right,
459
00:20:08.079 --> 00:20:09.759
But we're going to get them taken care of and
460
00:20:09.759 --> 00:20:12.279
get the tools that they need. And then depending on
461
00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:13.920
what part of the industry they want to go into.
462
00:20:13.960 --> 00:20:15.680
They're going to build on top of that as they
463
00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:16.079
go through.
464
00:20:16.319 --> 00:20:18.240
So I got my pipe on. It's to help. That's
465
00:20:18.240 --> 00:20:21.799
a start. Like I say, you don't want.
466
00:20:21.680 --> 00:20:23.759
Me working on your gun or my gun or anybody
467
00:20:23.759 --> 00:20:24.440
else's gun.
468
00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:24.880
You know.
469
00:20:25.119 --> 00:20:27.960
But most people are, or atleast a lot of people
470
00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:30.920
are like me, don't have that in mechanical ability. But
471
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:32.440
there are a lot of people who are tinkers who
472
00:20:32.519 --> 00:20:34.720
love doing stuff and they like guns, and they could
473
00:20:34.759 --> 00:20:39.039
take that mechanical interest in their interesting guns. Put it together,
474
00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:41.480
you two can become a gunsmith exactly.
475
00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:42.279
That is so cool.
476
00:20:42.279 --> 00:20:43.839
You don't have to go someplace and do it now,
477
00:20:44.039 --> 00:20:47.119
you don't what's the timeline when you start to finish?
478
00:20:47.319 --> 00:20:48.599
So depending on the program.
479
00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:53.079
We've got a pistol smithing program, a handgun specialist program
480
00:20:53.079 --> 00:20:56.839
that is as short as twenty weeks. We've our other
481
00:20:56.880 --> 00:20:59.799
programs get into the eight months sixteen month range. Just
482
00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:01.680
on what courses you take.
483
00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:04.079
Okay, interesting, what's the cost?
484
00:21:04.480 --> 00:21:05.200
Great question.
485
00:21:05.400 --> 00:21:08.319
I'm not going to quote something that's wrong, but SDI
486
00:21:08.920 --> 00:21:09.680
has all of that.
487
00:21:10.440 --> 00:21:13.359
So you know what you're getting into when you start. Okay,
488
00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:19.680
good deal. SDI Edu Sonoran Desert Institute. All right, got
489
00:21:19.720 --> 00:21:22.880
that you can become a gunsmith. That is so cool
490
00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:25.640
because and I love the idea of your working with veterans,
491
00:21:25.640 --> 00:21:27.119
because there are a lot of veterans who say, you know,
492
00:21:27.920 --> 00:21:29.119
I'm not sure what I want to do.
493
00:21:29.119 --> 00:21:31.359
Now, Oh I can do that. I like guns.
494
00:21:31.400 --> 00:21:33.480
I like this stuff absolutely.
495
00:21:33.640 --> 00:21:36.720
And another one, another big population that we have is
496
00:21:36.759 --> 00:21:39.319
those what's that second career, what's that thing that I
497
00:21:39.359 --> 00:21:42.559
want to do that you know, it's not like a
498
00:21:42.640 --> 00:21:44.039
car mechanic where maybe you're working.
499
00:21:44.559 --> 00:21:46.839
I was a firefighter, I'm a cop. I'm done.
500
00:21:46.880 --> 00:21:48.799
I've done that thing. What am I going to do next?
501
00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:51.839
Maybe this is the thing. Yeah, Hey, thanks for sharing this.
502
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:53.640
This is great. Absolutely, thanks for having me on.
503
00:21:53.720 --> 00:21:56.359
Congratulations, this is a great project. I love I love
504
00:21:56.359 --> 00:21:57.160
what you're doing here.
505
00:21:57.319 --> 00:21:58.960
Thanks timing sdi e Edu.
506
00:21:59.400 --> 00:22:02.440
All right, don't I'm Tom Gresham. This is gun talk.
507
00:22:02.480 --> 00:22:05.440
We're at the cald Will both here. We appreciate those folks.
508
00:22:05.440 --> 00:22:08.119
They're awfully nice. You gotta go check out that clay coup.
509
00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:11.720
If they they've got it's silly, goofy and fun and
510
00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:22.039
you're gonna want one. Well, obviously this is recorded We're
511
00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:24.680
at the Shots show in Las Vegas, and the show
512
00:22:24.759 --> 00:22:29.000
runs Thursday to Friday, so when you hear this, it'll
513
00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:31.119
actually be like four or five days after the fact.
514
00:22:31.759 --> 00:22:37.119
But because it is Tuesday today, I want to mention
515
00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:40.240
something's going on or actually just happened, and we just
516
00:22:40.279 --> 00:22:42.240
happened to bring in the right guy for that. Koaches
517
00:22:42.279 --> 00:22:45.960
Morris Joneses, Joneses right now, second memo Foundation Legal director.
518
00:22:46.359 --> 00:22:48.480
Yes, the director of legal Research and Education.
519
00:22:48.599 --> 00:22:50.640
Oh okay, it's a long, a long thing there. Okay,
520
00:22:50.680 --> 00:22:52.160
I get a second, a minute of attorney.
521
00:22:52.200 --> 00:22:53.880
Okay, how's that there?
522
00:22:53.880 --> 00:22:57.839
It goes all right, So something happened today in the
523
00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:00.400
Supreme Court. I'm gonna get out of your way explaining
524
00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:01.400
what was going on here.
525
00:23:01.480 --> 00:23:03.319
Sure, So I got up bright and early along with
526
00:23:03.359 --> 00:23:05.319
the other people in the field this morning to listen
527
00:23:05.359 --> 00:23:07.279
to the oral arguments in Wolford v.
528
00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:08.000
Lopez.
529
00:23:08.079 --> 00:23:11.279
And that is the case concerning Hawaii's what we call
530
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:14.839
the Vampire Rule, but more properly is known as the
531
00:23:14.880 --> 00:23:17.559
default rule, which is that if you have a carry permit,
532
00:23:17.839 --> 00:23:20.039
you can't carry on a private business held open to
533
00:23:20.079 --> 00:23:22.400
the public unless they have a sign saying you can,
534
00:23:22.519 --> 00:23:25.279
or they otherwise invite you. So as you may understand this,
535
00:23:25.359 --> 00:23:28.119
effectively bands carry everywhere grocery stores.
536
00:23:28.279 --> 00:23:29.839
Yeah, let's talk about that, because it does.
537
00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:33.559
In fact, basically you can't carry in Hawaii any place
538
00:23:33.599 --> 00:23:35.720
that doesn't have a sign that says conzulit care you
539
00:23:35.799 --> 00:23:36.680
welcome here.
540
00:23:37.160 --> 00:23:39.680
Good correct or if you get other consents. So Hawaii
541
00:23:39.759 --> 00:23:42.279
does allow you can stand outside yo, hey I have
542
00:23:42.319 --> 00:23:42.599
a gun.
543
00:23:42.680 --> 00:23:43.279
Can I come in?
544
00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:44.680
Good luck with.
545
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:48.559
Exactly that's going to go overwell, So it is basically
546
00:23:48.759 --> 00:23:51.039
a band. They say, well we have cozuok car. Yeah,
547
00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:52.680
but you can't go anywhere with it. You can't do
548
00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:56.240
anything with it. And in most states it's the other
549
00:23:56.279 --> 00:23:59.880
way around, where you can go everywhere unless it is
550
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:00.599
we're hev it.
551
00:24:00.759 --> 00:24:01.039
Yeah.
552
00:24:01.119 --> 00:24:04.359
In fact, it was in all states until Bruin, so
553
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:07.000
after brewing reacty.
554
00:24:07.079 --> 00:24:07.359
Yeah.
555
00:24:07.400 --> 00:24:09.920
So the first state to pass this law and then
556
00:24:09.960 --> 00:24:12.799
others copied it was New York and Governor Hokeel was
557
00:24:12.880 --> 00:24:15.720
literally asked where are people going to be allowed to carry?
558
00:24:15.720 --> 00:24:18.319
And she said, and I quote, I guess some streets
559
00:24:18.319 --> 00:24:21.119
and sidewalks, maybe the street is what she said. So
560
00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:26.039
the intention of these laws is to discourage you from
561
00:24:26.039 --> 00:24:27.759
exercising your right to carry, because if you can't carry
562
00:24:27.759 --> 00:24:30.279
at the Starbucks or the grocery store or the or
563
00:24:30.319 --> 00:24:32.799
whatever else, all these businesses held over to the public,
564
00:24:32.839 --> 00:24:36.039
that's where people go most of the time. Is private
565
00:24:36.519 --> 00:24:38.759
property held open to the public, that's where we spend
566
00:24:38.799 --> 00:24:41.200
most of our time, other than parks and such.
567
00:24:41.240 --> 00:24:44.039
So it is effectively designed.
568
00:24:44.039 --> 00:24:45.960
And there will be people who will say, well, if
569
00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:48.119
it's a private business, I should be able to keep
570
00:24:48.119 --> 00:24:50.200
people from carrying, right.
571
00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:53.720
Yeah, absolutely, So we don't content if the private business
572
00:24:53.759 --> 00:24:56.400
owner wants to not allow you to carry. That's the
573
00:24:56.440 --> 00:24:59.079
final word they get, the final say. Our problem is
574
00:24:59.119 --> 00:25:02.079
the government can't I'm in and exercise that right for
575
00:25:02.119 --> 00:25:04.519
them and say, oh, we're going to switch the default.
576
00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:07.440
So that's Hawaii's argument. Basically, they say, oh no, we're
577
00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:10.200
not re infringing the Second Amendment. We're just saying that
578
00:25:10.440 --> 00:25:13.400
we respect property rights and if the property owner wants
579
00:25:13.400 --> 00:25:15.440
to allow guns, they just have to say so. But
580
00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:18.359
this would never pass in any other context. I couldn't
581
00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:21.599
imagine First Amendment. Yeah, so that's and that came up
582
00:25:21.640 --> 00:25:25.039
in today's oral arguments. Imagine if one of the justices
583
00:25:25.079 --> 00:25:27.000
asked if it was a racial based one say, oh no,
584
00:25:27.279 --> 00:25:29.680
we don't. We don't dislike black people. We're just gonna
585
00:25:29.680 --> 00:25:31.559
have a law where they can't enter unless you give
586
00:25:31.920 --> 00:25:32.960
affirmative consent.
587
00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:35.599
That's not it'd be ridiculous.
588
00:25:35.640 --> 00:25:36.319
So it's only for.
589
00:25:36.279 --> 00:25:39.000
The Second Amendment. And it's funny you mentioned that we're
590
00:25:39.000 --> 00:25:40.920
gonna spit. People are going to where are you going
591
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:41.480
with this? Tom?
592
00:25:42.000 --> 00:25:45.240
Actually, one of the arguments that Hawaii is making is
593
00:25:45.279 --> 00:25:48.759
they're referring back to a Louisiana law which was designed
594
00:25:49.160 --> 00:25:51.400
to be used against blacks.
595
00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:51.920
Yeah.
596
00:25:51.960 --> 00:25:54.920
So in eighteen sixty five, Louisiana, which was then the
597
00:25:54.960 --> 00:25:57.559
defeated territory of Louisiana, it wasn't even a state because
598
00:25:57.559 --> 00:26:00.720
it was a former state in rebellion, they passed a
599
00:26:00.799 --> 00:26:05.680
law basically saying that freedmen cannot carry in private businesses
600
00:26:05.680 --> 00:26:07.799
held open to the public unless they get consent. So
601
00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:10.440
that was, I guess, an original vampire rule, and it
602
00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:13.240
only applied to freedman, and the governor later admitted it
603
00:26:13.279 --> 00:26:15.160
was only ever intended to apply to freeman as part
604
00:26:15.200 --> 00:26:19.119
of their Black codes. And astonishingly, today Hawaii argued that
605
00:26:19.319 --> 00:26:20.240
while black codes are.
606
00:26:20.240 --> 00:26:22.160
Racist, that law was one of the good ones.
607
00:26:22.400 --> 00:26:24.960
They literally it that was one of the good racist laws.
608
00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:28.319
Yeah, they say it's not racist because the Reconstruction Congress
609
00:26:28.359 --> 00:26:31.720
didn't affirmatively strike it down. But of course just because
610
00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:33.559
they overlooked something, it doesn't mean it's not right.
611
00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:35.839
Were you able to listen in on the arguments to yes,
612
00:26:35.880 --> 00:26:37.359
I listened to the whole thing. All right, what was
613
00:26:37.400 --> 00:26:41.039
your and look, we understand it is treacherous to say
614
00:26:41.200 --> 00:26:42.960
this is what I think is going on what the
615
00:26:43.000 --> 00:26:45.519
court might do, but you do kind of get a sense,
616
00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:47.720
at least some of the justices had they were reacting
617
00:26:47.759 --> 00:26:48.519
to the arguments.
618
00:26:48.880 --> 00:26:49.160
Yeah.
619
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:52.640
So I think, as you say, it's always risky to predict.
620
00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:55.480
That said, I can say with as much confidence as
621
00:26:55.480 --> 00:26:57.799
I can in making a prediction, so I could still
622
00:26:57.839 --> 00:26:58.200
be wrong.
623
00:26:58.400 --> 00:26:59.920
I think there's going to be a six to three case.
624
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:00.839
I think we're gonna win.
625
00:27:01.079 --> 00:27:04.319
There's an outside, very narrow chance that maybe we peel
626
00:27:04.319 --> 00:27:06.319
off Kagan seven to two on us.
627
00:27:06.960 --> 00:27:08.519
I'm not saying it's likely, it's.
628
00:27:08.319 --> 00:27:10.559
Not likely, but she did have a couple of questions
629
00:27:10.599 --> 00:27:13.160
there to Hawaii, which makes me think a narrow concurrence,
630
00:27:13.160 --> 00:27:14.400
not that she's going to go as far as the
631
00:27:14.440 --> 00:27:17.759
conservatives but a narrow concurrence is maybe possible.
632
00:27:17.839 --> 00:27:19.759
I don't hold me to that. I think six to
633
00:27:19.799 --> 00:27:20.720
three is more likely.
634
00:27:21.160 --> 00:27:24.359
Bottom line it for us, what would a win and
635
00:27:24.480 --> 00:27:25.480
this case mean.
636
00:27:26.160 --> 00:27:30.400
So most the most narrow possible ruling, which unfortunately might
637
00:27:30.440 --> 00:27:32.799
be the most likely, the Supreme Court just says no
638
00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:35.440
vampire rules Hawaii can't pass this off, but goes no further,
639
00:27:35.559 --> 00:27:38.599
So this very worst abuse is killed off in these
640
00:27:38.599 --> 00:27:41.720
states can't do it anymore. I'm hopeful that the Supreme
641
00:27:41.759 --> 00:27:44.640
Court will see all these other cases on sensitive places
642
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:46.440
and say, you know what, we need to go a
643
00:27:46.519 --> 00:27:49.759
little bit further and better define when you can and
644
00:27:49.839 --> 00:27:51.599
can't have these gun free zones.
645
00:27:51.640 --> 00:27:51.880
You know.
646
00:27:52.200 --> 00:27:55.079
So I'm hoping they go even though this wasn't strictly
647
00:27:55.119 --> 00:27:56.119
a sensitive.
648
00:27:55.680 --> 00:27:57.839
Place's case because I dealt with this default rule.
649
00:27:58.079 --> 00:28:01.039
I'm hoping they'll give more guidance and go broader than
650
00:28:01.279 --> 00:28:03.400
just the narrow question of this case, because otherwise we're
651
00:28:03.440 --> 00:28:05.640
going to have lots more for them to decide very soon.
652
00:28:05.759 --> 00:28:07.160
Let me take a quick break here. We're going to
653
00:28:07.240 --> 00:28:07.519
come back.
654
00:28:07.519 --> 00:28:10.359
We're going to describe or explain what you're talking about
655
00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:13.839
the sensitive places, because that has another one of the
656
00:28:13.960 --> 00:28:18.400
Ruin reactions if you will, because the gun band states
657
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:21.279
once Bruin was passed, they said, well, yeah, well what's
658
00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:22.440
this We're going to show you.
659
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:23.960
Well, now we're having to fight that battle.
660
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:27.240
We're talking with coaches Morris from the Second Foundation. I'm
661
00:28:27.279 --> 00:28:29.960
Tom Gresham. This is gun talk. We'll be right back.
662
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664
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Looking for real talk about guns, gear and the shooting lifestyle,
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then tune into gun Talk Nation. Each week, your host,
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me Ryan Gresham sits down with industry insiders, trainers, and
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won't hear anywhere else. Whether it's the latest innovations, pro
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available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
695
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All right, we're in the belly of the beast.
696
00:30:56.759 --> 00:31:00.519
I meant the shots show for nine hundred thousand square
697
00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:04.160
feet of guns and guns stuff here. Coach is Morris
698
00:31:04.240 --> 00:31:06.920
joints just right now from the second moment foundation your
699
00:31:07.119 --> 00:31:08.480
first shut show.
700
00:31:08.640 --> 00:31:11.279
It is, and I am positively overwhelmed. I don't know
701
00:31:11.319 --> 00:31:12.880
where to begin. I don't know what to do.
702
00:31:13.079 --> 00:31:15.920
So well, you're gonna figured out in about ten years.
703
00:31:16.519 --> 00:31:17.000
Good good.
704
00:31:17.000 --> 00:31:18.599
At least there's a lad at the end of the tunnel.
705
00:31:18.599 --> 00:31:21.160
But it's amazing. I mean you basically you just kind
706
00:31:21.200 --> 00:31:25.519
of walked into just a little bit of it so far.
707
00:31:26.200 --> 00:31:27.759
You have no idea how large this is.
708
00:31:27.759 --> 00:31:31.079
Now, I don't It goes on and on. As large
709
00:31:31.119 --> 00:31:33.240
as this hall is where we are, there are many
710
00:31:33.279 --> 00:31:37.279
other halls like this. That's insane. There's another floor below
711
00:31:37.359 --> 00:31:40.359
us full. You got the law enforcement section over there,
712
00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:43.319
which is massive, and now they've opened a bridge. It
713
00:31:43.319 --> 00:31:46.799
goes across to an annex, and then you've got Caesar's
714
00:31:46.839 --> 00:31:50.400
Palace and we've expanded into that. I tell people that
715
00:31:50.400 --> 00:31:52.720
it's like trying to describe the Grand Canyon to someone
716
00:31:52.759 --> 00:31:53.519
who's never seen it.
717
00:31:53.519 --> 00:31:55.519
It's incredibly If I didn't know any better, I'd say
718
00:31:55.519 --> 00:31:56.480
guns are pretty popular.
719
00:31:56.599 --> 00:31:59.599
Huh yeah, yeah, I think it's unbelievable.
720
00:32:00.400 --> 00:32:02.640
My only advice to you is to just remember it
721
00:32:02.720 --> 00:32:05.119
is a marathon, not a sprint, and you can wear
722
00:32:05.160 --> 00:32:10.079
yourself out. You're in the desert, it's dry hydrate, and
723
00:32:10.279 --> 00:32:13.640
just you know, because shot shoe will beat you up.
724
00:32:14.480 --> 00:32:15.400
I can tell already.
725
00:32:15.400 --> 00:32:17.000
I've only been here a couple hours, but I can
726
00:32:17.039 --> 00:32:18.079
tell that that's the case.
727
00:32:18.119 --> 00:32:19.319
But thanks, I'll do my best.
728
00:32:19.559 --> 00:32:21.680
Okay. So where we left this story.
729
00:32:22.119 --> 00:32:26.839
You mentioned something about sensitive places cases. Where does that
730
00:32:26.960 --> 00:32:28.119
phrase come from?
731
00:32:28.160 --> 00:32:28.400
Sure?
732
00:32:28.599 --> 00:32:32.799
So in Heller, when the Supreme Court first finally, definitively
733
00:32:32.839 --> 00:32:35.960
recognized that the Second Amendment protects an individual right, they
734
00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:38.680
also had this throwaway line, Well it's not so throw away,
735
00:32:38.680 --> 00:32:42.920
but they had a line about all these permissively presumptively
736
00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:47.480
lawful measures, and one of them was, you know, banning
737
00:32:47.559 --> 00:32:51.319
carrie in government buildings and schools and other sensitive places.
738
00:32:51.519 --> 00:32:53.400
So that's where the whole thing comes from, is that
739
00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:57.319
Supreme Court said there's something called sensitive places where carrie
740
00:32:57.319 --> 00:33:00.240
can be restricted, that are exempted from the gen role
741
00:33:00.319 --> 00:33:03.640
right to public carry. And what's happened now is states
742
00:33:03.680 --> 00:33:06.279
have because of Bruin, these same states that didn't want
743
00:33:06.319 --> 00:33:08.960
to issue permits are now going crazy with that.
744
00:33:08.960 --> 00:33:11.400
They're just saying that everything Bruin says, all right, you
745
00:33:11.519 --> 00:33:14.839
have to issue permits. Yeah, they said, okay, we can
746
00:33:14.920 --> 00:33:18.640
issue permits, but we don't like concealed carry. So we're
747
00:33:18.680 --> 00:33:22.400
going to name basically the universe as a sensitive place
748
00:33:23.079 --> 00:33:24.440
where we can prohibit it carry.
749
00:33:24.599 --> 00:33:25.119
Absolutely.
750
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:30.279
Yeah, that's it, and I do mean everything, So parks, playgrounds,
751
00:33:30.480 --> 00:33:33.000
any place that serves alcohol, even if you're not drinking.
752
00:33:33.119 --> 00:33:35.880
Time Times Square, they just said the all of Times
753
00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:41.880
Square is a sensitive place. Zoos, museums, stadiums, libraries, I.
754
00:33:41.839 --> 00:33:42.759
Can't think of all of them.
755
00:33:42.759 --> 00:33:46.200
There's when we sued California over it in maybe bonta
756
00:33:46.319 --> 00:33:49.160
saff case similar to the Wolford case, there was twenty
757
00:33:49.200 --> 00:33:52.359
six categories of places, plus the vampire rule, which is
758
00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:56.839
its own categories. So they they've basically narrowed it down
759
00:33:56.920 --> 00:33:59.960
to just some streets and sidewalks, so you can care
760
00:34:00.240 --> 00:34:01.880
if you want to go out for a walk and
761
00:34:01.960 --> 00:34:02.960
don't actually want to go.
762
00:34:02.920 --> 00:34:03.960
Anywhere in particular.
763
00:34:04.039 --> 00:34:09.519
I suppose it's a ban on Caucio Carrie effectively, Yes.
764
00:34:09.320 --> 00:34:11.039
They make it pointless, so you don't bother.
765
00:34:11.199 --> 00:34:12.559
That's what are we doing about that?
766
00:34:12.840 --> 00:34:15.320
So SAFF and others have sued in a case called
767
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:18.880
maybe Bonta, and other cases like Coons and against New.
768
00:34:18.840 --> 00:34:20.079
Jersey's are a number of cases.
769
00:34:20.079 --> 00:34:23.199
There's a number of cases, and we've had some mixed success.
770
00:34:23.239 --> 00:34:26.760
So other than in Hawaii, we've killed the vampire rule everywhere.
771
00:34:26.800 --> 00:34:29.239
Just this morning, as Wolford was being argued, the Fourth
772
00:34:29.280 --> 00:34:33.440
Circuit also said that the vampire rule Maryland's is unconstitutional.
773
00:34:33.519 --> 00:34:36.559
Really yeah, And unfortunately the rest of the ruling was garbage.
774
00:34:36.599 --> 00:34:38.559
I will cover it once I'm home from shot show.
775
00:34:38.639 --> 00:34:41.400
But they upheld most of the rest of the places.
776
00:34:41.440 --> 00:34:45.079
But so SAFF has had mixed success in California, we
777
00:34:45.400 --> 00:34:49.280
got a number of places and enjoined, including shared parking lots,
778
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:53.280
banks and a few other public transportation and a few others.
779
00:34:53.639 --> 00:34:56.400
But right now we're really waiting on the Third Circuit
780
00:34:56.440 --> 00:34:58.960
because they're taking the Coons case on bongk and they're
781
00:34:59.039 --> 00:35:01.679
much more conservative. What case is that that's a New
782
00:35:01.760 --> 00:35:04.639
Jersey's ban on sensitive place.
783
00:35:04.840 --> 00:35:06.760
Suppose it's sensitive place, okay.
784
00:35:06.719 --> 00:35:09.119
And so they'll create a circumsplit most likely, and then
785
00:35:09.159 --> 00:35:11.840
the Supreme Court will unless they give some good guidance
786
00:35:11.840 --> 00:35:14.360
in Woolford like I'm hoping for, we'll have to decide
787
00:35:14.400 --> 00:35:16.199
these issues.
788
00:35:16.440 --> 00:35:19.239
It is frustrating to those of us who are not
789
00:35:19.440 --> 00:35:20.840
lawyers and don't work with this.
790
00:35:21.400 --> 00:35:23.679
How slowly this stuff moves.
791
00:35:23.960 --> 00:35:25.480
I'm a lawyer, and it's frustrating to me.
792
00:35:25.880 --> 00:35:28.239
I live in California, so it's not like I'm off
793
00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:29.519
in Montana or something.
794
00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:30.159
Who cares.
795
00:35:30.199 --> 00:35:31.400
We'll get to when we get to it. No, this
796
00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:32.559
directly affects me.
797
00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:35.719
I can't legally take my daughter to a playground without
798
00:35:35.760 --> 00:35:37.280
caring right now. I have a three year old and
799
00:35:37.320 --> 00:35:40.639
that's absurd, you know. So believe me, I'm angry about it,
800
00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:43.639
and I get so frustrated with how the courts are.
801
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:45.960
So that's not a lawyer thing. That's anybody who cares
802
00:35:46.000 --> 00:35:47.400
about their rights should be frustrated.
803
00:35:47.599 --> 00:35:50.760
Okay, So we got another case that the Supreme Court's
804
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:52.960
going to hear this year, Secondmendment case.
805
00:35:53.079 --> 00:35:53.599
What is that?
806
00:35:53.920 --> 00:35:55.679
So that's Hamani usb HARMANI.
807
00:35:55.719 --> 00:35:59.199
It's a criminal case and that concerns a well, the
808
00:35:59.199 --> 00:36:02.599
simplest form of it is, he's a marijuana user who
809
00:36:02.719 --> 00:36:04.480
was caught in possession of a gun and the government
810
00:36:04.519 --> 00:36:07.239
saying they can disarma it. The more longer story is
811
00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:10.119
the government chose the most ridiculous case, like this guy
812
00:36:10.119 --> 00:36:14.480
supposedly has ties to Iranian terrorists, he's a drug dealer,
813
00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:16.920
all this stuff, so it's not just a simple marijuana
814
00:36:16.960 --> 00:36:17.920
and that's what they did.
815
00:36:17.960 --> 00:36:23.239
They want the most the least attractive defendant in this,
816
00:36:23.679 --> 00:36:26.159
so they say, well, how could you possibly be in
817
00:36:26.199 --> 00:36:29.159
favor of this guy, who's such a bad guy being
818
00:36:29.199 --> 00:36:29.920
able to have a gun.
819
00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:32.400
You go, yeah, but we understand what you're doing here.
820
00:36:32.480 --> 00:36:36.599
Yeah, they actually made sure this was the case that
821
00:36:36.719 --> 00:36:39.519
moved forward when there were other more sympathetic people.
822
00:36:39.719 --> 00:36:41.679
Yes, and they did that on purpose. And part of
823
00:36:41.719 --> 00:36:45.199
what our amicist brief argues, because we've just we're working
824
00:36:45.199 --> 00:36:47.119
on one now that we're going to submit next week,
825
00:36:47.599 --> 00:36:51.239
is that the court should ignore all these other things,
826
00:36:51.280 --> 00:36:53.960
so that the government's brief opens by talking about these
827
00:36:53.960 --> 00:36:56.760
ties Tyran, this drug dealing. The problem is they've only
828
00:36:56.840 --> 00:36:59.159
charged him with possession of a gun while being a
829
00:36:59.199 --> 00:37:01.519
marijuana user, so they talk about all this Ething else
830
00:37:01.519 --> 00:37:04.599
is they never charged him, so maybe he is an
831
00:37:04.599 --> 00:37:05.320
Iranian tearest.
832
00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:05.760
I don't know.
833
00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:07.440
But they haven't charged him with it, So if they
834
00:37:07.519 --> 00:37:09.119
wanted to charge him with that, they could have and
835
00:37:09.199 --> 00:37:09.639
they didn't.
836
00:37:09.719 --> 00:37:12.199
So in the United States, if you are a user
837
00:37:12.360 --> 00:37:14.840
of marijuana, you are prohibited from owning a gun.
838
00:37:15.199 --> 00:37:17.440
Yes, if you are currently a user of the drug
839
00:37:17.519 --> 00:37:21.159
or addicted to any controlled substance, which includes marijuana, even
840
00:37:21.199 --> 00:37:23.880
if it's legal in their state, you may not possess firearm.
841
00:37:23.880 --> 00:37:26.840
Now I understand that just this morning they put out
842
00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:29.679
a proposed rule making that would narrow that definition. I
843
00:37:29.719 --> 00:37:32.880
haven't read it all yet, but that could dramatically change things.
844
00:37:32.880 --> 00:37:35.760
This has been a crazy newsday while I'm at shot Show.
845
00:37:35.840 --> 00:37:37.039
Yeah, the first day.
846
00:37:36.920 --> 00:37:39.880
Of shot Show on the Tuesday, which people will hear
847
00:37:39.920 --> 00:37:43.280
this on Sunday and after that. And actually there may
848
00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:45.320
be more information there and they could follow you on
849
00:37:45.679 --> 00:37:48.159
X yes over there, because you're posting a lot of
850
00:37:48.159 --> 00:37:50.000
information all the time. I'm trying to pick it up
851
00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:52.559
and do as much as i can because this stuff
852
00:37:52.639 --> 00:37:56.480
is happening daily at this point, it's pretty crazy. And also,
853
00:37:56.519 --> 00:37:59.039
of course go to saf dot org. You've got a
854
00:37:59.079 --> 00:38:01.880
lot of informational bears. Second me, that's good stuff. Tell
855
00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:04.639
you what another thing that we're working on right now
856
00:38:05.280 --> 00:38:11.440
is getting more people involved because what you're doing it's worthwhile.
857
00:38:11.599 --> 00:38:13.400
It takes a long time, but it really takes a
858
00:38:13.400 --> 00:38:15.519
lot of money. Yeah, I mean, it's just like it's
859
00:38:15.559 --> 00:38:18.239
a crazy amount of money it takes to do these cases.
860
00:38:19.440 --> 00:38:21.519
The best way for people to support that as what
861
00:38:21.880 --> 00:38:24.320
join SAFF. Donate to SAFF.
862
00:38:24.880 --> 00:38:28.960
You absolutely, I encourage you to join SAFF and and
863
00:38:29.079 --> 00:38:31.400
follow our work. But the most important thing you can
864
00:38:31.480 --> 00:38:34.719
do besides supporting us selfishly is talk to your friends
865
00:38:34.760 --> 00:38:39.760
about this. We're seeing how politics influences as Virginia is
866
00:38:40.119 --> 00:38:42.039
about to become California.
867
00:38:41.519 --> 00:38:42.280
Because of election.
868
00:38:42.440 --> 00:38:44.800
So SAFF does its best on the court fronts.
869
00:38:45.079 --> 00:38:47.119
But try and put me out of work, try and
870
00:38:47.119 --> 00:38:49.119
stop these loss from tasting so.
871
00:38:49.079 --> 00:38:51.119
We don't need right, so we don't need If we
872
00:38:51.159 --> 00:38:54.800
win elections, none of it matters. We're gonna win everything else.
873
00:38:54.800 --> 00:38:56.559
Hold on, we'll be right back here. We're talking with
874
00:38:56.639 --> 00:38:59.119
coach this Morris from the Second Moment Foundation. I'm Tom
875
00:38:59.159 --> 00:39:01.719
Gresham is is gun talk.
876
00:39:07.559 --> 00:39:09.960
Back whether they were talking with Katis morros coasis.
877
00:39:10.599 --> 00:39:13.079
We have a number of cases that have been appealed
878
00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:17.000
to the US Supreme Court, second Miditic cases, I mean,
879
00:39:17.039 --> 00:39:18.599
it's not like one or two, it's like a whole
880
00:39:19.000 --> 00:39:22.599
passl of them, and they keep getting continued or they're
881
00:39:22.639 --> 00:39:24.880
doing conferences on them, and just like it feels like
882
00:39:24.880 --> 00:39:26.679
they're kicking a can down the road.
883
00:39:27.079 --> 00:39:30.000
Yeah, and it's frustrating because, especially for us at the
884
00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:33.239
Second Amendment Foundation, we have five pending cer petitions, so
885
00:39:33.400 --> 00:39:36.800
every week we wake up and find out if they're
886
00:39:36.840 --> 00:39:40.159
going to execute us or not deny review. Just this
887
00:39:40.239 --> 00:39:42.280
morning they not to any of our cases, but they
888
00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:46.480
did deny a couple of cases concerning whether fraud from
889
00:39:46.639 --> 00:39:49.119
fifteen years ago or something with Zurka. I think is
890
00:39:49.159 --> 00:39:51.599
the case is enough to disarm someone, and they didn't
891
00:39:51.679 --> 00:39:54.679
take that case. So so far, they keep punting on
892
00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:58.079
the big issues, which to us are the assault weapons cases,
893
00:39:58.679 --> 00:40:03.519
eighteen to twenty bands, and finally the public transportation carry band,
894
00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:06.760
which we're also doing. So we'll just have to see
895
00:40:06.800 --> 00:40:08.599
what they do and don't decide to take.
896
00:40:08.800 --> 00:40:12.360
Aren't we almost at the end of the season when
897
00:40:12.400 --> 00:40:13.880
they will accept the case.
898
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:15.719
Yeah, I can't remember the exact date.
899
00:40:15.760 --> 00:40:17.920
I think it might be this week's conference is the
900
00:40:17.960 --> 00:40:19.880
last chance to accept it for this term.
901
00:40:19.960 --> 00:40:22.519
That doesn't mean the cases are denied, they.
902
00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:25.760
Might hold them longer and grant them later for next term.
903
00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:29.199
They might hold them over the summer and grant them later.
904
00:40:29.280 --> 00:40:31.280
That's rare, but they do do it from time to time,
905
00:40:31.519 --> 00:40:33.920
and that's important to Californians because one of the cases,
906
00:40:33.920 --> 00:40:36.519
although it's not a SAFF case, is Duncan Vibano with
907
00:40:36.559 --> 00:40:40.239
my old colleagues server at CRPA, and that case concerns
908
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:42.960
Californian's magazine ban and that one's important because if that
909
00:40:43.079 --> 00:40:46.239
judgment becomes final. It's currently stayed pending this cert petition,
910
00:40:46.280 --> 00:40:48.119
but if it becomes final, people like me are going
911
00:40:48.159 --> 00:40:49.920
to have to turn in our magazines that are over
912
00:40:49.960 --> 00:40:52.440
ten rounds that we got during Freedom Week. So in
913
00:40:52.519 --> 00:40:55.239
Saf's a Meekis brief, I literally told the Supreme Court, Hey,
914
00:40:55.559 --> 00:40:57.119
even if you don't want to grant this case, maybe
915
00:40:57.159 --> 00:40:59.639
you want another one, just hold it forever until you
916
00:40:59.719 --> 00:41:00.800
decide case.
917
00:41:00.559 --> 00:41:04.360
Okay, Because there was a weird one week window when
918
00:41:04.440 --> 00:41:07.760
it was legal for Californians to buy standard capacity magazines
919
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:10.280
and they bought them by the millions, maybe by the
920
00:41:10.320 --> 00:41:13.960
tens of millions, and they're perfectly illegal for you to
921
00:41:14.000 --> 00:41:14.559
have now.
922
00:41:14.719 --> 00:41:18.000
Yes, but that could go away and you could end yes.
923
00:41:18.119 --> 00:41:21.639
So if the Duncan ruling becomes final, then those become illegal.
924
00:41:21.760 --> 00:41:24.719
We'll probably get some window of time from California DJ
925
00:41:24.800 --> 00:41:26.760
where they tell us either turn them in, take them
926
00:41:26.760 --> 00:41:28.039
out of state, or destroy them.
927
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:30.519
You know, they'll probably give us thirty to ninety days.
928
00:41:30.639 --> 00:41:32.800
But the point is we don't want this decision to
929
00:41:32.800 --> 00:41:35.159
become final. The Supreme Court either has to intervene or
930
00:41:35.239 --> 00:41:38.199
has to hold the case until they decide a similar case.
931
00:41:38.239 --> 00:41:41.159
And these cases that they're holding onto right now, they
932
00:41:41.199 --> 00:41:43.800
have not decided. They haven't gotten rid of them, have
933
00:41:43.920 --> 00:41:47.159
denied them, but they haven't accepted them. Do they have
934
00:41:47.199 --> 00:41:49.360
to take an affirmative action to carry them over?
935
00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:52.280
I don't know what the exact rules are, and the
936
00:41:52.599 --> 00:41:54.000
Supreme Court rules are always confusing.
937
00:41:54.159 --> 00:41:55.039
I'll have to look that up for you.
938
00:41:55.039 --> 00:41:56.360
I don't want to give you a bad answer, but
939
00:41:56.599 --> 00:41:58.320
I think they can just hold them over the summer
940
00:41:58.360 --> 00:42:00.719
without any spence. If they don't deny grant them, then
941
00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:01.639
they just stay on the docket.
942
00:42:01.679 --> 00:42:04.079
Because Justice Kevanaugh said a year ago, he says, world,
943
00:42:04.079 --> 00:42:06.679
we're gonna have to take up second min of cases
944
00:42:06.679 --> 00:42:09.960
in the next term or two. Well, this was the term,
945
00:42:10.119 --> 00:42:13.880
so next term would be the two. I mean, I
946
00:42:13.920 --> 00:42:16.920
know we can't exactly hold him to that, but it's
947
00:42:16.960 --> 00:42:18.159
something that we're all thinking about.
948
00:42:18.360 --> 00:42:20.519
Yes, and I think he did mean this is going
949
00:42:20.559 --> 00:42:23.119
to be sooner rather than later. So it probably won't
950
00:42:23.159 --> 00:42:25.079
be this year now, but hopefully it'll be next year.
951
00:42:25.719 --> 00:42:28.719
And he was talking specifically about AR fifteen cases, so
952
00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:31.239
we'll have to see what they decide to do.
953
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:32.679
We're very hopeful that they'll Finally.
954
00:42:33.000 --> 00:42:34.440
The thing is none of us wants to talk about
955
00:42:34.480 --> 00:42:37.800
out loud, is we're all watching the clock because Justice
956
00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:42.199
Clarence Thomas may retire at some point. He's getting older.
957
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:44.880
May you know who knows what's going on? I mean,
958
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:46.400
and we definitely want him there.
959
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:48.760
We do want him there for that, but I would
960
00:42:48.840 --> 00:42:51.400
encourage Justice Thomas to take a long, hard look at
961
00:42:51.519 --> 00:42:53.440
Justice Jackson and ask if that's what he wants to
962
00:42:53.480 --> 00:42:54.559
replace him someday.
963
00:42:54.880 --> 00:42:57.239
So he's got it to don't even get me started.
964
00:42:57.280 --> 00:42:57.760
He's got it.
965
00:42:57.800 --> 00:43:00.840
I hope him and Justice Alito get serious thoughts for retiring,
966
00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:02.559
not because we don't love them. We do love them,
967
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:05.760
but we want them replaced by solid conservatives before the
968
00:43:05.800 --> 00:43:06.440
Senate is.
969
00:43:06.440 --> 00:43:09.000
Up for election, excellent point courses, Boris, thank you so much.
970
00:43:09.119 --> 00:43:11.639
Sayf dot org, SAF dot org for a second un
971
00:43:11.719 --> 00:43:13.480
Foundation and if you're not a member of shame on
972
00:43:13.559 --> 00:43:14.360
you need to join.
973
00:43:14.440 --> 00:43:15.320
I'm just going to say that.
974
00:43:15.320 --> 00:43:17.360
That's me, not him saying that, because I'm believe in
975
00:43:17.400 --> 00:43:18.039
it that much.
976
00:43:18.360 --> 00:43:21.039
Thank you, everybody. We appreciate you being here. We are
977
00:43:21.119 --> 00:43:23.440
having a ball at the Shot Show. Tay you what.
978
00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:25.800
Next week we'll bring you more from the Shot Show
979
00:43:25.840 --> 00:43:28.880
because there's a whole lot more to cover. I'm time, Gresha.
980
00:43:29.000 --> 00:43:31.039
This is gun Dog. Go ahead and do some shooting
981
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:32.719
and be safe out there.
1
00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:02.799
The Ruger SFA R is one of the trim is
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threeh eight Modern sporting rifles available more power but lighter
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in the field and range. See how light it is
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at Ruger dot com.
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Oh, we're just talking about guns, guns and more gun
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I'm Tom Gresham. This is gun talk. We're at the
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Shot Show. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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We do this every year and it's still fun after
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all these years.
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I'm having a ball. We're at the Caldwell booth. They're
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letting us hang out over there. The probably the biggest
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news in the gun world. I mean, we got you know,
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a lot of new products everything that's all fun talk about.
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But in terms of the thing that people are talking
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about a lot is the tax going away on suppressors
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and SBRs. And yeah no, we didn't get rid of
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the whole NFA like we wanted, but hey, stay tuned.
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You never know what's going to happen with that.
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Well, right now we're joined by Dave Matheeny, Dave from
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Silencer Shop. The questions you're getting of, Okay, the tax
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is gone on buying suppressors, What does that mean?
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How are things changing?
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You know?
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I really I think this just opens up basically the
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next golden age of suppressors. In my opinion, it's like
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you've got super low weights right now. You're still looking
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at two or three day day weights even with the volume.
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Well talk about that, what kind of volume increasing you guys?
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Oh, this is this is crazy.
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We've already processed I would say just over a quarter
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of the forums we did for all of last year, and.
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Last year was a big year. We're halfway into the
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first month. I know the year.
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This is it is nutty.
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And now you say there's other stuff that we didn't expect,
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Like I and maybe we should have, but I didn't
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expect the surgeon form ones. It's like people are one
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is that's when you make your own SBR or silencer,
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and it's a people are doing those like crazy.
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But we're seeing tens.
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Of thousands of those making their own suppressors.
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Yeah, you make one of your garage file a Form
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one no tax WHOA, Okay, it's a there's a lot
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of experimentation I think going on right now. I think
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we'll see a lot of advancement this.
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I'm just gonna say, there's gonna be some un but
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there are some really clever people. Oh yeah, and a
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lot of time times the innovation comes out of some guys.
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Go that's right, somebody who had an idea, but they
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never really did it because of the just the passle
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right now, no tax, very little weight.
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This is going to be the Golden Ages, the next
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gold nag.
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But you still have to register your suppress. Yes, so
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we talk about that.
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That has not changed. We did file a lawsuit.
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We're suing a Department of Justice basically over this to
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try to get them completely removed.
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The idea being that this was originally a tax law. Yes,
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and if there's no tax, there shouldn't be a law.
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That's right.
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That's pretty much the basis.
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That is the basis.
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Yes, okay, so that could take a while with lawsuits.
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That's that's right.
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That's really it's it's we're committed to it. We're looking
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at this as like a multi year process, but it's
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a it's moving though. We also didn't expect a partner
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of Justice to fight it quite as aggressively as they had.
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Where I was going to go, it's good, you know,
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on the one hand, the Department of Justice is doing
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some really good things on the gun side, segment side,
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but they're really digging in their heels and NFA and
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this thing. I'm actually scheduled to talk to Harmey Dillon
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in a couple of days, and I'm gonna ask her.
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I said, you know, what's going on? Why is DOJ
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hanging in there like this? Why don't we just agree
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that we don't need to have any restrictions on suppressors
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in the cars. Yeah, I'll look forward to finding out.
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What she said.
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Yeah, I am too.
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It's a and we we knew that they would have
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that interstate commerce argument in their back pocket that they
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could pull out.
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And that's kind of a track part.
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That's the catch all that they use forever they did,
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and it's totally bogus. And I will tell you, I
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think the Supreme Court is about tired of it.
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Oh, I agree with that. It's being overused, right, It's
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it's being applied to everything. They can justify anything if
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anything moves from state to state, not even.
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If the product moved, if the materials that used to
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make the product you ever moved across the state line,
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they say, yep, that's federal.
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Now, yeah, we're we got control of that.
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Yeah, that's exactly right.
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Okay, So let's go all the way back to suppressors. Well,
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first of all, let's back up silence shop. Tell people
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about your company.
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Yes, I mean really, that's our whole objective is to
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make the silencer buying process as simple as possible. Okay, right,
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and that's right now, that's you know, Let's get your
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forms in, get them submitted, have as minimal weight as possible,
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no tax, and let's grow this market.
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Somebody's never bought a suppressor, Explain to them what is involved.
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I want, I want to buy a suppressor. What am
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I going to have to do?
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The process is actually really straightforward. We've got kiosks all
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over the country. Go through the Kiosk one time, and
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gun stores you go through the Kiosk one time. That's
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a one time deal ever, and then we essentially will
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review your paperwork.
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We'll handle the.
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Submissioned atf the finger printing. The finger printing's done at
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the Kiosk. Photograph that's that's actually done through our mobile app.
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We have a new version of the Kiosk that we
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will do that as well. But you have to update
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the photo every year so the boat laps the better options,
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so you don't have to go to a kiosk Peria Pasu,
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are you just making it easy that the goal is
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make this easy. Let's get us get these forms submitted.
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This grow the industry, and then we can put political
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pressure on people in Congress.
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There you go to make more people that have them,
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and the more people that want them, the more people
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are going to speak out. And now you're speaking with
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a lot more people behind you who you're going into court.
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This zero dollar tax thing could not have happened fifteen
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years ago. The market was too small. Now they're getting
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them out of the NFA. Give it another ten to
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fifteen years that can handle. That will happen legislatively if
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we don't win in the courts.
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Is it true that in some European countries the pressures
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are just like on hangtags?
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Yes, only just on the wall. There's nothing to it. Yep.
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I go hunting all over the place, can I tell you? You
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go outside the US and they have a horrible time
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getting guns. But as soon as they get the gun,
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they buy the silencer over the counter from a hardware store.
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And these things are like ten bucks, and some of
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them are impressive.
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No kidding, Yeah, all right, So if they're ten bucks there,
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why are they six hundred dollars here?
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I think a lot of it is the process. It's NFA.
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It is an artificial barried entry, right, which is going
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to drive down volumes and drive up price.
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Okay, So I think what I hear you saying is
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if we get to the point where we can drive
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up volume, then we can drive down price.
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And I don't think we'll ever get the ten dollars,
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but I think will be half of where we are really.
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Oh yeah, it will be priced way less than where
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it currently is. It's just a lot of Look at
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the overhead all these companies have in managing the process.
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Right, Well, okay, talk about that, because the companies that
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are making them, they have to track every single unit
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and have to keep records on them for ATF.
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Yeah, and it's not just keeping records, it's registering with
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ATF and telling ATF every time it moves. So when
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they manufacture one, they have to file a Form two
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with the ATF to tell them they manufactured it. When
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they send it a distributor, they file a Form three
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and wait for an approval before they can mail it
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to the distributor. Then the distributor has to file another
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Form three, wait for an approval, wait for it to
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get to the customs.
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An enormous amount of overhead.
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So so then the ATF supposedly knows where these cans
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are at any given time.
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Right, It's that's it's a register.
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Good because we need to know where mufflers are.
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A hundred percent. I feel safer if they knew where
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all the mufflers were.
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Okay, you know, you could literally, we're gonna say this,
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you could literally unscrew the muffler from your Brigs and
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Stratton lawnmower and screw it onto your gun.
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And it would be effective.
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And it would be effective.
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Yeah, and it would be a suppressor, it would be
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a expressor, and it would kill your accuracy.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, there's some other side that there's a problem. Yeah,
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it's not really a suppressure. But in terms of okay,
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at this basic form a suppressure is just a muffler,
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that's right. But and I'm gonna hand this off to you,
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we are now seeing advances in technology and suppressures.
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That's amazing.
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Oh yeah, three D printing.
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If you had asked me five, six, seven years ago,
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if we had kind of hit the limit of what
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suppressure would do could do?
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I would have thought yes.
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Other than like you know, feature stuff, mounting systems were
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still improving.
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H Modular stuff was still getting better.
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But as far as quietness blowback, have you seen ambient suppressors?
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So ambient just came out this year.
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You can, like mag dump through a can that's quiet
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with low black blow back pressure and then grab the
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can with your bare hand.
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And just that that's right? How does it not get hut?
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Seriously, I do not understand, but I've shot them and
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they are magical. Still kind of expensive, right, it's not
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your mass market product, but for law enforcement imagine those guys,
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that's a game changer.
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Oh yeah yeah, or and military military too.
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You know, you go full auto, there's nothing and you
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can just grab it, unscrew it with your bare hand.
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And trust me, people don't do this at home. You
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try that with a regular.
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Spressor, you'll get a brand.
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You will brand yourself because they get hot. It'll burn you.
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That's a fact.
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Yeah.
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What else do people need to know about what's going
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on with the suppressors and silencers now?
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You know?
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Really it's just what we're seeing is so many new
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entrants into the market. That is driving innovation from the
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new from these new companies, but it's also driving the
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existing companies to renovate again, right.
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Competition does that.
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So I think we'll see a lot of a lot
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of really cool stuff coming out of the big existing
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manufacturers we already are. I'm not, yeah, but it's a
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like I said, I think we're on the verge of
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another another golden agent side.
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What's that going to mean for Silencer Shop?
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Honestly, I have For us, we'll just stay kind of
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committed to what our goal has always been.
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Let's make this as simple as possible. Rights.
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That's your gig is it is making it easy? I mean,
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and you're selling suppressors absolutely, yeses, but you just make
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it easy for people to do it, that's right. Do
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people need to have a trust now?
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You know?
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I would recommend that they do for possession?
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Yeah, So you want to have you Bias Holncer, your wife,
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your kids, whoever's using it, they want to use it independently.
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A trust is the way to get all members of
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the trust. So anybody who's a member of the trust
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use it. Do you help with that?
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One hundred percent? Yeah?
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And for most people, I'd recommend going with a single
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shot trust, which is only the main buyer has to
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get fingerprinted, photographed. Then after they get approved, they can
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add anybody and they want on to it. Got you,
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super flexible, super easy. It's as easy as an individual
249
00:10:16.840 --> 00:10:18.919
with all the benefits of a trust. What's the website
250
00:10:19.120 --> 00:10:20.399
silencershop dot com?
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That hard to do? Huh? Silencer Shop?
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That's right, that's right.
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Hey, thank you so much. I appreciate it. That right.
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Thank you.
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Have a good show, Yeah you too. All right, don't
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go far, We'll be right back at the shot show.
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is the rifle you grab, whether it's deer camp, the
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Want the latest and guns, gear and shooting infos straight
265
00:11:17.279 --> 00:11:20.200
into your inbox. Sign up for the Gun Talk newsletter.
266
00:11:20.440 --> 00:11:24.879
Get insider access to reviews, exclusive deals, training tips, and
267
00:11:24.919 --> 00:11:28.559
the hottest stories from the range, delivered every week. Don't
268
00:11:28.600 --> 00:11:31.759
miss out on the news and offers every shooter needs
269
00:11:31.759 --> 00:11:34.919
to know. It's fast, free and easy. Sign up today
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00:11:34.960 --> 00:11:42.840
at gun talk dot com. That's gun talk dot com.
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When someone leaves you their gun collection, you may want
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00:11:46.279 --> 00:11:49.399
a few. What do you do with the rest? How
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00:11:49.440 --> 00:11:50.440
do you sell them?
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Who do you call? Well?
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I call Johnny Durry at Durry's Guns. Whether you're selling
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one gun or five hundred. They'll tell you what it's
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worth and write you a check, simple, quick, easy, fair.
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I trust Dory's Guns.
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00:12:07.080 --> 00:12:13.240
Give them a call Dourysguns dot com. Put all your
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00:12:13.240 --> 00:12:16.120
gear on the ch'iciry and then roll around on the ground. Now,
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00:12:16.159 --> 00:12:18.440
get up all your gear that's on the ground. That's
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what you're not going to have in a fight.
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Gun Talks should be in your podcast feed. Check out
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gun talk Nation.
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What's it like to be blown up?
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00:12:25.480 --> 00:12:28.120
You know, if it's like C four, it's almost like
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00:12:28.159 --> 00:12:29.440
a smack hunting.
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00:12:29.759 --> 00:12:32.799
Yeah, we talk about that too. On your crosshairs, I
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00:12:32.960 --> 00:12:35.840
like a thin crosshair A you're really dating yourself by
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calling things cross hairs. You're redical whatever.
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Have some fun and stay informed with the gun Talk podcast.
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You know, there are a lot of tinkers in the business,
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and a lot of people call themselves guns so a
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lot of people who should not call themselves gunsmith's. That's
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just the reality of the deal. Sorry, guys, it's just
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what it is. I bother way, I'm Tom Grescher. We
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were at the Shots Show, we're at the call Rub.
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We appreciate you staying here with us because we're trying
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to talk to as many people as we can. And
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yet we talked to manufacturers where we talk to people
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who are just in the business and do interesting things.
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All right, Jerry McNally, tell me what Sonoran Desert Institute is.
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00:13:23.679 --> 00:13:26.519
Yeah, so, Tom, thanks for having me on. First off,
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00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:30.879
But Snoring Desert Institute is a online gunsmithing program. So
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we take the skills and tools and techniques of a
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gunsmith and put that in somebody's living room so they
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can learn right where they're at, rather than having to
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go to a.
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Brick and mortar school.
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How long you been doing that.
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We've had the gunsmithing program for about twenty six years now,
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so we started back in two thousand.
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Yep.
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We've taught some other things along the way. That has
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always been a popular one for us, and we're actually
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with twenty twenty six starting out, we're actually launching a
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nice new revamp to our program.
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So how did it get started?
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A couple of couple of guys got together and said, hey,
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we want to do a trades based program and we
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want to take it outside of the four walls.
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And you know, with enough beer, you can come up
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with a good idea. Well, all right, So the obvious questions,
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because somebody really learned to be a gunsmith with online.
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Training, absolutely yes, you know, with what happened with COVID,
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I actually come from an on ground school. I used
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to run an on ground school as well. COVID opened
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my eyes. My school was closed for eight months.
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Okay.
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And so with the creativity and some of the things
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out in the marketplace now, think about Amazon deliveries, think
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about Zoom, think about some of these things that we
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now have. Yeah, we didn't have before, We didn't have
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before or weren't mainstream before. We absolutely can do this
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now because we can put that classroom in their living
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room and that lab there too.
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Who is learning to be a gunsmith? Who wants to
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do this these days?
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Yeah, you know, it's it's it's interesting. A lot of veterans,
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veteran myself, okay, okay, a lot of veterans are doing it.
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It's a great way for them to have an outlet
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that's a hands on outlet to go out and make
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a living for their families. In the future, we're seeing
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the younger generation get into it as well. You know,
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I've had a number of students and graduates come through there,
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played the video games. Now I want to build a No,
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I would never have thought about. Oh, it's amazing, it's amazing.
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Interesting. All right.
349
00:15:32.480 --> 00:15:36.360
So what's the market like out there, job market for
350
00:15:36.440 --> 00:15:37.519
a gunsmith these days.
351
00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:40.279
Yeah, it's an interesting market. There's there's kind of three avenues.
352
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Think about any time you've got to maintain something. So really,
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00:15:43.480 --> 00:15:46.279
a gunsmith's just a mechanic for firearm right right. So
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00:15:46.759 --> 00:15:50.000
you think about your your law enforcement military population. You've
355
00:15:50.000 --> 00:15:52.399
got all these law enforcement departments that have to have
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some kind of trained individual taking.
357
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Care of them.
358
00:15:55.679 --> 00:15:58.360
Yeah, an armorer, a gunsmith taking care of those things. Okay,
359
00:15:58.759 --> 00:16:02.000
You've got your your manufacturers that are building all this stuff.
360
00:16:02.000 --> 00:16:07.360
They've got to have a warranty repair department or customization department,
361
00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:10.240
right right, So you've got gunsmith's there, and then you've
362
00:16:10.240 --> 00:16:13.039
got you know, the ranges and the local retail stores
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that are providing that service to the end customer. And frankly,
364
00:16:17.759 --> 00:16:19.759
it's that that we're in that world where a lot
365
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:22.399
of people have these great tools, they don't always know
366
00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:25.360
how to maintain them. You know, I'm not a carboncadica.
367
00:16:25.639 --> 00:16:28.279
I take my card to somebody and I'm the world's worst.
368
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:30.240
Everybody who listen to this or knows I am not
369
00:16:30.279 --> 00:16:31.799
a gunsmith. I'm not a mechanic.
370
00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:32.240
You know.
371
00:16:32.240 --> 00:16:34.519
When I pick up a screwdriver, my friends called nine
372
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one one it's that bad.
373
00:16:35.679 --> 00:16:35.919
Yep.
374
00:16:35.960 --> 00:16:40.000
So it's like, okay, I need a gunsmith. Yeah, you know, partypically,
375
00:16:40.200 --> 00:16:42.840
I am the guy who brings him the box and hey,
376
00:16:42.879 --> 00:16:43.919
look all these parts here.
377
00:16:43.919 --> 00:16:45.159
We used to be a gun. Could you put it
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00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:45.919
back together for me?
379
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Exactly?
380
00:16:46.440 --> 00:16:48.000
I'm that guy exactly. Yeah.
381
00:16:48.039 --> 00:16:50.519
And so we've If you think about all the new
382
00:16:50.600 --> 00:16:53.519
gun owners and all of the sales of firearms over
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00:16:53.519 --> 00:16:56.360
the last twenty thirty years that we've got data on,
384
00:16:57.000 --> 00:16:59.519
it just continues to grow. Well, the cool thing about
385
00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:03.720
firearms is in most cases there's been a limited few models,
386
00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:06.799
but in most cases they were designed to be to
387
00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:10.160
live forever, and so you replace some parts in them, Yes,
388
00:17:10.160 --> 00:17:13.519
but they're designed to go on forever, so they need
389
00:17:13.559 --> 00:17:16.359
to be maintained and it takes those skilled trades people
390
00:17:16.359 --> 00:17:16.720
to do that.
391
00:17:16.880 --> 00:17:18.960
I tell people, I say, look, name me a number
392
00:17:19.079 --> 00:17:24.519
another consumer product, maybe hand tools that you buy with
393
00:17:24.599 --> 00:17:28.240
the absolute expectation that it will outlive you. You can use
394
00:17:28.279 --> 00:17:31.359
it continuously and you expect it to outlive you. And
395
00:17:31.400 --> 00:17:34.000
with firearms, that's just like, well, yeah, of course exactly,
396
00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:35.599
I'll be able to hand this down to my kids
397
00:17:35.599 --> 00:17:36.240
and grandkids.
398
00:17:36.319 --> 00:17:38.400
Yeah. Watches maybe the only other one thing I can
399
00:17:38.440 --> 00:17:38.720
think of it.
400
00:17:38.920 --> 00:17:41.480
But you can only do that if you take care
401
00:17:41.480 --> 00:17:41.799
of them.
402
00:17:41.799 --> 00:17:42.119
Correct.
403
00:17:42.960 --> 00:17:47.759
So I mean, all right, what about custom gunsmithing? Can
404
00:17:47.799 --> 00:17:50.720
you enter at this level and then work your way
405
00:17:50.720 --> 00:17:52.920
into becoming a true custom gunsmith?
406
00:17:52.960 --> 00:17:54.200
Absolutely? Absolutely?
407
00:17:54.200 --> 00:17:56.920
You know, custom gunsmithing is is a desire to do
408
00:17:57.000 --> 00:18:00.759
something different in the market, right, and then the the
409
00:18:00.799 --> 00:18:04.480
audacity to to just have the repetition to build it to.
410
00:18:04.440 --> 00:18:06.839
Say I can do something that other people aren't doing.
411
00:18:07.000 --> 00:18:07.240
Yep.
412
00:18:07.359 --> 00:18:10.119
And you see a lot of great gunsmiths out there
413
00:18:10.119 --> 00:18:13.920
that are custom custom gunsmiths that were overnight successes when
414
00:18:13.960 --> 00:18:15.759
really they've been doing it for thirty years building.
415
00:18:15.799 --> 00:18:16.519
Well, yes, that's so.
416
00:18:16.559 --> 00:18:18.720
I'd never heard of him before. Yeah, well he was
417
00:18:18.720 --> 00:18:21.279
doing it. You just didn't hurt and you could especially
418
00:18:21.359 --> 00:18:26.119
you say, I'm a nineteen eleven. I do find bolt
419
00:18:26.160 --> 00:18:30.240
action rifles. Whatever the area is that it is interesting
420
00:18:30.240 --> 00:18:30.599
to you.
421
00:18:31.119 --> 00:18:33.160
Yeah, and even some of the other processes. You know,
422
00:18:33.200 --> 00:18:37.440
we're seeing kind of a twist in the industry. You know,
423
00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:40.119
there was a big push the last probably decade and
424
00:18:40.160 --> 00:18:43.400
a half where getting more people into the trees. Well,
425
00:18:43.400 --> 00:18:45.400
now they've got that feel and that taste for it,
426
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:47.480
and now that's that. How do we customize them, how
427
00:18:47.480 --> 00:18:50.599
do we make them better? You know? It finishes, it's
428
00:18:51.000 --> 00:18:52.680
it's all these kind of things, and these all these
429
00:18:52.720 --> 00:18:54.400
little niches that you can get into.
430
00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:57.160
I mean, anything from a trigger job to a Sarah
431
00:18:57.200 --> 00:19:00.839
Coot correct finish. It's just whatever. And saw the numbers
432
00:19:00.880 --> 00:19:02.359
last week and this as I have put out, they
433
00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:07.039
said there now are five hundred million guns in America.
434
00:19:07.960 --> 00:19:09.920
That's a good number. It's a good started number, you know,
435
00:19:10.119 --> 00:19:12.759
but we'd like to double that. But that's okay. But
436
00:19:12.880 --> 00:19:14.640
five hundred million guns, that means there's a lot of
437
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:15.599
people have guns that.
438
00:19:15.640 --> 00:19:18.079
Need work well, and keep in mind that doesn't count
439
00:19:18.079 --> 00:19:21.519
in any of the muzzleoders. Oh and those are all
440
00:19:21.519 --> 00:19:23.720
the same concepts, so you still need a smith.
441
00:19:23.519 --> 00:19:25.599
To take care of those. Oh. Interesting, So the numbers
442
00:19:25.640 --> 00:19:26.640
get way bigger, all.
443
00:19:26.599 --> 00:19:29.119
Right, So what does somebody need to start off? They said?
444
00:19:29.119 --> 00:19:31.519
Okay, I'm interested. I wanted to sign on to this.
445
00:19:32.039 --> 00:19:34.759
What do I need to do? The easiest way? Jump
446
00:19:34.799 --> 00:19:35.920
on SDI dot edu.
447
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:39.200
Fill up the contact form there and say you you're
448
00:19:39.240 --> 00:19:43.000
interested in the program? Yesdi dot edu correct, and somebody
449
00:19:43.000 --> 00:19:45.799
will get in contact with you. Other than that, we
450
00:19:45.880 --> 00:19:48.839
assume I assume that my students coming to me don't
451
00:19:48.839 --> 00:19:50.720
know anything. So we're going to try to start you
452
00:19:50.759 --> 00:19:52.319
at the ground level and work you up.
453
00:19:52.559 --> 00:19:54.920
Okay, do you need Do they need to have tools
454
00:19:54.960 --> 00:19:56.480
when they start? Are you going to get them started
455
00:19:56.480 --> 00:19:58.160
from there? We're gonna get them started from there. We
456
00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:00.279
send out tools with each of the classes. There is
457
00:20:00.279 --> 00:20:03.400
a small shopping list with our programs. Sure, you know,
458
00:20:03.799 --> 00:20:07.440
basic stuff, makes sense, stuff they likely already have laying around, right,
459
00:20:08.079 --> 00:20:09.759
But we're going to get them taken care of and
460
00:20:09.759 --> 00:20:12.279
get the tools that they need. And then depending on
461
00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:13.920
what part of the industry they want to go into.
462
00:20:13.960 --> 00:20:15.680
They're going to build on top of that as they
463
00:20:15.680 --> 00:20:16.079
go through.
464
00:20:16.319 --> 00:20:18.240
So I got my pipe on. It's to help. That's
465
00:20:18.240 --> 00:20:21.799
a start. Like I say, you don't want.
466
00:20:21.680 --> 00:20:23.759
Me working on your gun or my gun or anybody
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00:20:23.759 --> 00:20:24.440
else's gun.
468
00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:24.880
You know.
469
00:20:25.119 --> 00:20:27.960
But most people are, or atleast a lot of people
470
00:20:27.960 --> 00:20:30.920
are like me, don't have that in mechanical ability. But
471
00:20:30.960 --> 00:20:32.440
there are a lot of people who are tinkers who
472
00:20:32.519 --> 00:20:34.720
love doing stuff and they like guns, and they could
473
00:20:34.759 --> 00:20:39.039
take that mechanical interest in their interesting guns. Put it together,
474
00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:41.480
you two can become a gunsmith exactly.
475
00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:42.279
That is so cool.
476
00:20:42.279 --> 00:20:43.839
You don't have to go someplace and do it now,
477
00:20:44.039 --> 00:20:47.119
you don't what's the timeline when you start to finish?
478
00:20:47.319 --> 00:20:48.599
So depending on the program.
479
00:20:48.920 --> 00:20:53.079
We've got a pistol smithing program, a handgun specialist program
480
00:20:53.079 --> 00:20:56.839
that is as short as twenty weeks. We've our other
481
00:20:56.880 --> 00:20:59.799
programs get into the eight months sixteen month range. Just
482
00:21:00.279 --> 00:21:01.680
on what courses you take.
483
00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:04.079
Okay, interesting, what's the cost?
484
00:21:04.480 --> 00:21:05.200
Great question.
485
00:21:05.400 --> 00:21:08.319
I'm not going to quote something that's wrong, but SDI
486
00:21:08.920 --> 00:21:09.680
has all of that.
487
00:21:10.440 --> 00:21:13.359
So you know what you're getting into when you start. Okay,
488
00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:19.680
good deal. SDI Edu Sonoran Desert Institute. All right, got
489
00:21:19.720 --> 00:21:22.880
that you can become a gunsmith. That is so cool
490
00:21:22.880 --> 00:21:25.640
because and I love the idea of your working with veterans,
491
00:21:25.640 --> 00:21:27.119
because there are a lot of veterans who say, you know,
492
00:21:27.920 --> 00:21:29.119
I'm not sure what I want to do.
493
00:21:29.119 --> 00:21:31.359
Now, Oh I can do that. I like guns.
494
00:21:31.400 --> 00:21:33.480
I like this stuff absolutely.
495
00:21:33.640 --> 00:21:36.720
And another one, another big population that we have is
496
00:21:36.759 --> 00:21:39.319
those what's that second career, what's that thing that I
497
00:21:39.359 --> 00:21:42.559
want to do that you know, it's not like a
498
00:21:42.640 --> 00:21:44.039
car mechanic where maybe you're working.
499
00:21:44.559 --> 00:21:46.839
I was a firefighter, I'm a cop. I'm done.
500
00:21:46.880 --> 00:21:48.799
I've done that thing. What am I going to do next?
501
00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:51.839
Maybe this is the thing. Yeah, Hey, thanks for sharing this.
502
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:53.640
This is great. Absolutely, thanks for having me on.
503
00:21:53.720 --> 00:21:56.359
Congratulations, this is a great project. I love I love
504
00:21:56.359 --> 00:21:57.160
what you're doing here.
505
00:21:57.319 --> 00:21:58.960
Thanks timing sdi e Edu.
506
00:21:59.400 --> 00:22:02.440
All right, don't I'm Tom Gresham. This is gun talk.
507
00:22:02.480 --> 00:22:05.440
We're at the cald Will both here. We appreciate those folks.
508
00:22:05.440 --> 00:22:08.119
They're awfully nice. You gotta go check out that clay coup.
509
00:22:08.200 --> 00:22:11.720
If they they've got it's silly, goofy and fun and
510
00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:22.039
you're gonna want one. Well, obviously this is recorded We're
511
00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:24.680
at the Shots show in Las Vegas, and the show
512
00:22:24.759 --> 00:22:29.000
runs Thursday to Friday, so when you hear this, it'll
513
00:22:29.000 --> 00:22:31.119
actually be like four or five days after the fact.
514
00:22:31.759 --> 00:22:37.119
But because it is Tuesday today, I want to mention
515
00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:40.240
something's going on or actually just happened, and we just
516
00:22:40.279 --> 00:22:42.240
happened to bring in the right guy for that. Koaches
517
00:22:42.279 --> 00:22:45.960
Morris Joneses, Joneses right now, second memo Foundation Legal director.
518
00:22:46.359 --> 00:22:48.480
Yes, the director of legal Research and Education.
519
00:22:48.599 --> 00:22:50.640
Oh okay, it's a long, a long thing there. Okay,
520
00:22:50.680 --> 00:22:52.160
I get a second, a minute of attorney.
521
00:22:52.200 --> 00:22:53.880
Okay, how's that there?
522
00:22:53.880 --> 00:22:57.839
It goes all right, So something happened today in the
523
00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:00.400
Supreme Court. I'm gonna get out of your way explaining
524
00:23:00.440 --> 00:23:01.400
what was going on here.
525
00:23:01.480 --> 00:23:03.319
Sure, So I got up bright and early along with
526
00:23:03.359 --> 00:23:05.319
the other people in the field this morning to listen
527
00:23:05.359 --> 00:23:07.279
to the oral arguments in Wolford v.
528
00:23:07.440 --> 00:23:08.000
Lopez.
529
00:23:08.079 --> 00:23:11.279
And that is the case concerning Hawaii's what we call
530
00:23:11.359 --> 00:23:14.839
the Vampire Rule, but more properly is known as the
531
00:23:14.880 --> 00:23:17.559
default rule, which is that if you have a carry permit,
532
00:23:17.839 --> 00:23:20.039
you can't carry on a private business held open to
533
00:23:20.079 --> 00:23:22.400
the public unless they have a sign saying you can,
534
00:23:22.519 --> 00:23:25.279
or they otherwise invite you. So as you may understand this,
535
00:23:25.359 --> 00:23:28.119
effectively bands carry everywhere grocery stores.
536
00:23:28.279 --> 00:23:29.839
Yeah, let's talk about that, because it does.
537
00:23:29.920 --> 00:23:33.559
In fact, basically you can't carry in Hawaii any place
538
00:23:33.599 --> 00:23:35.720
that doesn't have a sign that says conzulit care you
539
00:23:35.799 --> 00:23:36.680
welcome here.
540
00:23:37.160 --> 00:23:39.680
Good correct or if you get other consents. So Hawaii
541
00:23:39.759 --> 00:23:42.279
does allow you can stand outside yo, hey I have
542
00:23:42.319 --> 00:23:42.599
a gun.
543
00:23:42.680 --> 00:23:43.279
Can I come in?
544
00:23:44.079 --> 00:23:44.680
Good luck with.
545
00:23:45.119 --> 00:23:48.559
Exactly that's going to go overwell, So it is basically
546
00:23:48.759 --> 00:23:51.039
a band. They say, well we have cozuok car. Yeah,
547
00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:52.680
but you can't go anywhere with it. You can't do
548
00:23:52.680 --> 00:23:56.240
anything with it. And in most states it's the other
549
00:23:56.279 --> 00:23:59.880
way around, where you can go everywhere unless it is
550
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:00.599
we're hev it.
551
00:24:00.759 --> 00:24:01.039
Yeah.
552
00:24:01.119 --> 00:24:04.359
In fact, it was in all states until Bruin, so
553
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:07.000
after brewing reacty.
554
00:24:07.079 --> 00:24:07.359
Yeah.
555
00:24:07.400 --> 00:24:09.920
So the first state to pass this law and then
556
00:24:09.960 --> 00:24:12.799
others copied it was New York and Governor Hokeel was
557
00:24:12.880 --> 00:24:15.720
literally asked where are people going to be allowed to carry?
558
00:24:15.720 --> 00:24:18.319
And she said, and I quote, I guess some streets
559
00:24:18.319 --> 00:24:21.119
and sidewalks, maybe the street is what she said. So
560
00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:26.039
the intention of these laws is to discourage you from
561
00:24:26.039 --> 00:24:27.759
exercising your right to carry, because if you can't carry
562
00:24:27.759 --> 00:24:30.279
at the Starbucks or the grocery store or the or
563
00:24:30.319 --> 00:24:32.799
whatever else, all these businesses held over to the public,
564
00:24:32.839 --> 00:24:36.039
that's where people go most of the time. Is private
565
00:24:36.519 --> 00:24:38.759
property held open to the public, that's where we spend
566
00:24:38.799 --> 00:24:41.200
most of our time, other than parks and such.
567
00:24:41.240 --> 00:24:44.039
So it is effectively designed.
568
00:24:44.039 --> 00:24:45.960
And there will be people who will say, well, if
569
00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:48.119
it's a private business, I should be able to keep
570
00:24:48.119 --> 00:24:50.200
people from carrying, right.
571
00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:53.720
Yeah, absolutely, So we don't content if the private business
572
00:24:53.759 --> 00:24:56.400
owner wants to not allow you to carry. That's the
573
00:24:56.440 --> 00:24:59.079
final word they get, the final say. Our problem is
574
00:24:59.119 --> 00:25:02.079
the government can't I'm in and exercise that right for
575
00:25:02.119 --> 00:25:04.519
them and say, oh, we're going to switch the default.
576
00:25:04.599 --> 00:25:07.440
So that's Hawaii's argument. Basically, they say, oh no, we're
577
00:25:07.440 --> 00:25:10.200
not re infringing the Second Amendment. We're just saying that
578
00:25:10.440 --> 00:25:13.400
we respect property rights and if the property owner wants
579
00:25:13.400 --> 00:25:15.440
to allow guns, they just have to say so. But
580
00:25:15.519 --> 00:25:18.359
this would never pass in any other context. I couldn't
581
00:25:18.759 --> 00:25:21.599
imagine First Amendment. Yeah, so that's and that came up
582
00:25:21.640 --> 00:25:25.039
in today's oral arguments. Imagine if one of the justices
583
00:25:25.079 --> 00:25:27.000
asked if it was a racial based one say, oh no,
584
00:25:27.279 --> 00:25:29.680
we don't. We don't dislike black people. We're just gonna
585
00:25:29.680 --> 00:25:31.559
have a law where they can't enter unless you give
586
00:25:31.920 --> 00:25:32.960
affirmative consent.
587
00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:35.599
That's not it'd be ridiculous.
588
00:25:35.640 --> 00:25:36.319
So it's only for.
589
00:25:36.279 --> 00:25:39.000
The Second Amendment. And it's funny you mentioned that we're
590
00:25:39.000 --> 00:25:40.920
gonna spit. People are going to where are you going
591
00:25:40.960 --> 00:25:41.480
with this? Tom?
592
00:25:42.000 --> 00:25:45.240
Actually, one of the arguments that Hawaii is making is
593
00:25:45.279 --> 00:25:48.759
they're referring back to a Louisiana law which was designed
594
00:25:49.160 --> 00:25:51.400
to be used against blacks.
595
00:25:51.599 --> 00:25:51.920
Yeah.
596
00:25:51.960 --> 00:25:54.920
So in eighteen sixty five, Louisiana, which was then the
597
00:25:54.960 --> 00:25:57.559
defeated territory of Louisiana, it wasn't even a state because
598
00:25:57.559 --> 00:26:00.720
it was a former state in rebellion, they passed a
599
00:26:00.799 --> 00:26:05.680
law basically saying that freedmen cannot carry in private businesses
600
00:26:05.680 --> 00:26:07.799
held open to the public unless they get consent. So
601
00:26:07.839 --> 00:26:10.440
that was, I guess, an original vampire rule, and it
602
00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:13.240
only applied to freedman, and the governor later admitted it
603
00:26:13.279 --> 00:26:15.160
was only ever intended to apply to freeman as part
604
00:26:15.200 --> 00:26:19.119
of their Black codes. And astonishingly, today Hawaii argued that
605
00:26:19.319 --> 00:26:20.240
while black codes are.
606
00:26:20.240 --> 00:26:22.160
Racist, that law was one of the good ones.
607
00:26:22.400 --> 00:26:24.960
They literally it that was one of the good racist laws.
608
00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:28.319
Yeah, they say it's not racist because the Reconstruction Congress
609
00:26:28.359 --> 00:26:31.720
didn't affirmatively strike it down. But of course just because
610
00:26:31.720 --> 00:26:33.559
they overlooked something, it doesn't mean it's not right.
611
00:26:33.680 --> 00:26:35.839
Were you able to listen in on the arguments to yes,
612
00:26:35.880 --> 00:26:37.359
I listened to the whole thing. All right, what was
613
00:26:37.400 --> 00:26:41.039
your and look, we understand it is treacherous to say
614
00:26:41.200 --> 00:26:42.960
this is what I think is going on what the
615
00:26:43.000 --> 00:26:45.519
court might do, but you do kind of get a sense,
616
00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:47.720
at least some of the justices had they were reacting
617
00:26:47.759 --> 00:26:48.519
to the arguments.
618
00:26:48.880 --> 00:26:49.160
Yeah.
619
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:52.640
So I think, as you say, it's always risky to predict.
620
00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:55.480
That said, I can say with as much confidence as
621
00:26:55.480 --> 00:26:57.799
I can in making a prediction, so I could still
622
00:26:57.839 --> 00:26:58.200
be wrong.
623
00:26:58.400 --> 00:26:59.920
I think there's going to be a six to three case.
624
00:27:00.000 --> 00:27:00.839
I think we're gonna win.
625
00:27:01.079 --> 00:27:04.319
There's an outside, very narrow chance that maybe we peel
626
00:27:04.319 --> 00:27:06.319
off Kagan seven to two on us.
627
00:27:06.960 --> 00:27:08.519
I'm not saying it's likely, it's.
628
00:27:08.319 --> 00:27:10.559
Not likely, but she did have a couple of questions
629
00:27:10.599 --> 00:27:13.160
there to Hawaii, which makes me think a narrow concurrence,
630
00:27:13.160 --> 00:27:14.400
not that she's going to go as far as the
631
00:27:14.440 --> 00:27:17.759
conservatives but a narrow concurrence is maybe possible.
632
00:27:17.839 --> 00:27:19.759
I don't hold me to that. I think six to
633
00:27:19.799 --> 00:27:20.720
three is more likely.
634
00:27:21.160 --> 00:27:24.359
Bottom line it for us, what would a win and
635
00:27:24.480 --> 00:27:25.480
this case mean.
636
00:27:26.160 --> 00:27:30.400
So most the most narrow possible ruling, which unfortunately might
637
00:27:30.440 --> 00:27:32.799
be the most likely, the Supreme Court just says no
638
00:27:32.960 --> 00:27:35.440
vampire rules Hawaii can't pass this off, but goes no further,
639
00:27:35.559 --> 00:27:38.599
So this very worst abuse is killed off in these
640
00:27:38.599 --> 00:27:41.720
states can't do it anymore. I'm hopeful that the Supreme
641
00:27:41.759 --> 00:27:44.640
Court will see all these other cases on sensitive places
642
00:27:44.880 --> 00:27:46.440
and say, you know what, we need to go a
643
00:27:46.519 --> 00:27:49.759
little bit further and better define when you can and
644
00:27:49.839 --> 00:27:51.599
can't have these gun free zones.
645
00:27:51.640 --> 00:27:51.880
You know.
646
00:27:52.200 --> 00:27:55.079
So I'm hoping they go even though this wasn't strictly
647
00:27:55.119 --> 00:27:56.119
a sensitive.
648
00:27:55.680 --> 00:27:57.839
Place's case because I dealt with this default rule.
649
00:27:58.079 --> 00:28:01.039
I'm hoping they'll give more guidance and go broader than
650
00:28:01.279 --> 00:28:03.400
just the narrow question of this case, because otherwise we're
651
00:28:03.440 --> 00:28:05.640
going to have lots more for them to decide very soon.
652
00:28:05.759 --> 00:28:07.160
Let me take a quick break here. We're going to
653
00:28:07.240 --> 00:28:07.519
come back.
654
00:28:07.519 --> 00:28:10.359
We're going to describe or explain what you're talking about
655
00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:13.839
the sensitive places, because that has another one of the
656
00:28:13.960 --> 00:28:18.400
Ruin reactions if you will, because the gun band states
657
00:28:18.559 --> 00:28:21.279
once Bruin was passed, they said, well, yeah, well what's
658
00:28:21.440 --> 00:28:22.440
this We're going to show you.
659
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:23.960
Well, now we're having to fight that battle.
660
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:27.240
We're talking with coaches Morris from the Second Foundation. I'm
661
00:28:27.279 --> 00:28:29.960
Tom Gresham. This is gun talk. We'll be right back.
662
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664
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666
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669
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Looking for real talk about guns, gear and the shooting lifestyle,
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then tune into gun Talk Nation. Each week, your host,
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won't hear anywhere else. Whether it's the latest innovations, pro
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available on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts.
695
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All right, we're in the belly of the beast.
696
00:30:56.759 --> 00:31:00.519
I meant the shots show for nine hundred thousand square
697
00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:04.160
feet of guns and guns stuff here. Coach is Morris
698
00:31:04.240 --> 00:31:06.920
joints just right now from the second moment foundation your
699
00:31:07.119 --> 00:31:08.480
first shut show.
700
00:31:08.640 --> 00:31:11.279
It is, and I am positively overwhelmed. I don't know
701
00:31:11.319 --> 00:31:12.880
where to begin. I don't know what to do.
702
00:31:13.079 --> 00:31:15.920
So well, you're gonna figured out in about ten years.
703
00:31:16.519 --> 00:31:17.000
Good good.
704
00:31:17.000 --> 00:31:18.599
At least there's a lad at the end of the tunnel.
705
00:31:18.599 --> 00:31:21.160
But it's amazing. I mean you basically you just kind
706
00:31:21.200 --> 00:31:25.519
of walked into just a little bit of it so far.
707
00:31:26.200 --> 00:31:27.759
You have no idea how large this is.
708
00:31:27.759 --> 00:31:31.079
Now, I don't It goes on and on. As large
709
00:31:31.119 --> 00:31:33.240
as this hall is where we are, there are many
710
00:31:33.279 --> 00:31:37.279
other halls like this. That's insane. There's another floor below
711
00:31:37.359 --> 00:31:40.359
us full. You got the law enforcement section over there,
712
00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:43.319
which is massive, and now they've opened a bridge. It
713
00:31:43.319 --> 00:31:46.799
goes across to an annex, and then you've got Caesar's
714
00:31:46.839 --> 00:31:50.400
Palace and we've expanded into that. I tell people that
715
00:31:50.400 --> 00:31:52.720
it's like trying to describe the Grand Canyon to someone
716
00:31:52.759 --> 00:31:53.519
who's never seen it.
717
00:31:53.519 --> 00:31:55.519
It's incredibly If I didn't know any better, I'd say
718
00:31:55.519 --> 00:31:56.480
guns are pretty popular.
719
00:31:56.599 --> 00:31:59.599
Huh yeah, yeah, I think it's unbelievable.
720
00:32:00.400 --> 00:32:02.640
My only advice to you is to just remember it
721
00:32:02.720 --> 00:32:05.119
is a marathon, not a sprint, and you can wear
722
00:32:05.160 --> 00:32:10.079
yourself out. You're in the desert, it's dry hydrate, and
723
00:32:10.279 --> 00:32:13.640
just you know, because shot shoe will beat you up.
724
00:32:14.480 --> 00:32:15.400
I can tell already.
725
00:32:15.400 --> 00:32:17.000
I've only been here a couple hours, but I can
726
00:32:17.039 --> 00:32:18.079
tell that that's the case.
727
00:32:18.119 --> 00:32:19.319
But thanks, I'll do my best.
728
00:32:19.559 --> 00:32:21.680
Okay. So where we left this story.
729
00:32:22.119 --> 00:32:26.839
You mentioned something about sensitive places cases. Where does that
730
00:32:26.960 --> 00:32:28.119
phrase come from?
731
00:32:28.160 --> 00:32:28.400
Sure?
732
00:32:28.599 --> 00:32:32.799
So in Heller, when the Supreme Court first finally, definitively
733
00:32:32.839 --> 00:32:35.960
recognized that the Second Amendment protects an individual right, they
734
00:32:36.000 --> 00:32:38.680
also had this throwaway line, Well it's not so throw away,
735
00:32:38.680 --> 00:32:42.920
but they had a line about all these permissively presumptively
736
00:32:43.000 --> 00:32:47.480
lawful measures, and one of them was, you know, banning
737
00:32:47.559 --> 00:32:51.319
carrie in government buildings and schools and other sensitive places.
738
00:32:51.519 --> 00:32:53.400
So that's where the whole thing comes from, is that
739
00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:57.319
Supreme Court said there's something called sensitive places where carrie
740
00:32:57.319 --> 00:33:00.240
can be restricted, that are exempted from the gen role
741
00:33:00.319 --> 00:33:03.640
right to public carry. And what's happened now is states
742
00:33:03.680 --> 00:33:06.279
have because of Bruin, these same states that didn't want
743
00:33:06.319 --> 00:33:08.960
to issue permits are now going crazy with that.
744
00:33:08.960 --> 00:33:11.400
They're just saying that everything Bruin says, all right, you
745
00:33:11.519 --> 00:33:14.839
have to issue permits. Yeah, they said, okay, we can
746
00:33:14.920 --> 00:33:18.640
issue permits, but we don't like concealed carry. So we're
747
00:33:18.680 --> 00:33:22.400
going to name basically the universe as a sensitive place
748
00:33:23.079 --> 00:33:24.440
where we can prohibit it carry.
749
00:33:24.599 --> 00:33:25.119
Absolutely.
750
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:30.279
Yeah, that's it, and I do mean everything, So parks, playgrounds,
751
00:33:30.480 --> 00:33:33.000
any place that serves alcohol, even if you're not drinking.
752
00:33:33.119 --> 00:33:35.880
Time Times Square, they just said the all of Times
753
00:33:35.880 --> 00:33:41.880
Square is a sensitive place. Zoos, museums, stadiums, libraries, I.
754
00:33:41.839 --> 00:33:42.759
Can't think of all of them.
755
00:33:42.759 --> 00:33:46.200
There's when we sued California over it in maybe bonta
756
00:33:46.319 --> 00:33:49.160
saff case similar to the Wolford case, there was twenty
757
00:33:49.200 --> 00:33:52.359
six categories of places, plus the vampire rule, which is
758
00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:56.839
its own categories. So they they've basically narrowed it down
759
00:33:56.920 --> 00:33:59.960
to just some streets and sidewalks, so you can care
760
00:34:00.240 --> 00:34:01.880
if you want to go out for a walk and
761
00:34:01.960 --> 00:34:02.960
don't actually want to go.
762
00:34:02.920 --> 00:34:03.960
Anywhere in particular.
763
00:34:04.039 --> 00:34:09.519
I suppose it's a ban on Caucio Carrie effectively, Yes.
764
00:34:09.320 --> 00:34:11.039
They make it pointless, so you don't bother.
765
00:34:11.199 --> 00:34:12.559
That's what are we doing about that?
766
00:34:12.840 --> 00:34:15.320
So SAFF and others have sued in a case called
767
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:18.880
maybe Bonta, and other cases like Coons and against New.
768
00:34:18.840 --> 00:34:20.079
Jersey's are a number of cases.
769
00:34:20.079 --> 00:34:23.199
There's a number of cases, and we've had some mixed success.
770
00:34:23.239 --> 00:34:26.760
So other than in Hawaii, we've killed the vampire rule everywhere.
771
00:34:26.800 --> 00:34:29.239
Just this morning, as Wolford was being argued, the Fourth
772
00:34:29.280 --> 00:34:33.440
Circuit also said that the vampire rule Maryland's is unconstitutional.
773
00:34:33.519 --> 00:34:36.559
Really yeah, And unfortunately the rest of the ruling was garbage.
774
00:34:36.599 --> 00:34:38.559
I will cover it once I'm home from shot show.
775
00:34:38.639 --> 00:34:41.400
But they upheld most of the rest of the places.
776
00:34:41.440 --> 00:34:45.079
But so SAFF has had mixed success in California, we
777
00:34:45.400 --> 00:34:49.280
got a number of places and enjoined, including shared parking lots,
778
00:34:49.360 --> 00:34:53.280
banks and a few other public transportation and a few others.
779
00:34:53.639 --> 00:34:56.400
But right now we're really waiting on the Third Circuit
780
00:34:56.440 --> 00:34:58.960
because they're taking the Coons case on bongk and they're
781
00:34:59.039 --> 00:35:01.679
much more conservative. What case is that that's a New
782
00:35:01.760 --> 00:35:04.639
Jersey's ban on sensitive place.
783
00:35:04.840 --> 00:35:06.760
Suppose it's sensitive place, okay.
784
00:35:06.719 --> 00:35:09.119
And so they'll create a circumsplit most likely, and then
785
00:35:09.159 --> 00:35:11.840
the Supreme Court will unless they give some good guidance
786
00:35:11.840 --> 00:35:14.360
in Woolford like I'm hoping for, we'll have to decide
787
00:35:14.400 --> 00:35:16.199
these issues.
788
00:35:16.440 --> 00:35:19.239
It is frustrating to those of us who are not
789
00:35:19.440 --> 00:35:20.840
lawyers and don't work with this.
790
00:35:21.400 --> 00:35:23.679
How slowly this stuff moves.
791
00:35:23.960 --> 00:35:25.480
I'm a lawyer, and it's frustrating to me.
792
00:35:25.880 --> 00:35:28.239
I live in California, so it's not like I'm off
793
00:35:28.280 --> 00:35:29.519
in Montana or something.
794
00:35:29.760 --> 00:35:30.159
Who cares.
795
00:35:30.199 --> 00:35:31.400
We'll get to when we get to it. No, this
796
00:35:31.480 --> 00:35:32.559
directly affects me.
797
00:35:32.920 --> 00:35:35.719
I can't legally take my daughter to a playground without
798
00:35:35.760 --> 00:35:37.280
caring right now. I have a three year old and
799
00:35:37.320 --> 00:35:40.639
that's absurd, you know. So believe me, I'm angry about it,
800
00:35:40.880 --> 00:35:43.639
and I get so frustrated with how the courts are.
801
00:35:43.679 --> 00:35:45.960
So that's not a lawyer thing. That's anybody who cares
802
00:35:46.000 --> 00:35:47.400
about their rights should be frustrated.
803
00:35:47.599 --> 00:35:50.760
Okay, So we got another case that the Supreme Court's
804
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:52.960
going to hear this year, Secondmendment case.
805
00:35:53.079 --> 00:35:53.599
What is that?
806
00:35:53.920 --> 00:35:55.679
So that's Hamani usb HARMANI.
807
00:35:55.719 --> 00:35:59.199
It's a criminal case and that concerns a well, the
808
00:35:59.199 --> 00:36:02.599
simplest form of it is, he's a marijuana user who
809
00:36:02.719 --> 00:36:04.480
was caught in possession of a gun and the government
810
00:36:04.519 --> 00:36:07.239
saying they can disarma it. The more longer story is
811
00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:10.119
the government chose the most ridiculous case, like this guy
812
00:36:10.119 --> 00:36:14.480
supposedly has ties to Iranian terrorists, he's a drug dealer,
813
00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:16.920
all this stuff, so it's not just a simple marijuana
814
00:36:16.960 --> 00:36:17.920
and that's what they did.
815
00:36:17.960 --> 00:36:23.239
They want the most the least attractive defendant in this,
816
00:36:23.679 --> 00:36:26.159
so they say, well, how could you possibly be in
817
00:36:26.199 --> 00:36:29.159
favor of this guy, who's such a bad guy being
818
00:36:29.199 --> 00:36:29.920
able to have a gun.
819
00:36:30.000 --> 00:36:32.400
You go, yeah, but we understand what you're doing here.
820
00:36:32.480 --> 00:36:36.599
Yeah, they actually made sure this was the case that
821
00:36:36.719 --> 00:36:39.519
moved forward when there were other more sympathetic people.
822
00:36:39.719 --> 00:36:41.679
Yes, and they did that on purpose. And part of
823
00:36:41.719 --> 00:36:45.199
what our amicist brief argues, because we've just we're working
824
00:36:45.199 --> 00:36:47.119
on one now that we're going to submit next week,
825
00:36:47.599 --> 00:36:51.239
is that the court should ignore all these other things,
826
00:36:51.280 --> 00:36:53.960
so that the government's brief opens by talking about these
827
00:36:53.960 --> 00:36:56.760
ties Tyran, this drug dealing. The problem is they've only
828
00:36:56.840 --> 00:36:59.159
charged him with possession of a gun while being a
829
00:36:59.199 --> 00:37:01.519
marijuana user, so they talk about all this Ething else
830
00:37:01.519 --> 00:37:04.599
is they never charged him, so maybe he is an
831
00:37:04.599 --> 00:37:05.320
Iranian tearest.
832
00:37:05.400 --> 00:37:05.760
I don't know.
833
00:37:06.000 --> 00:37:07.440
But they haven't charged him with it, So if they
834
00:37:07.519 --> 00:37:09.119
wanted to charge him with that, they could have and
835
00:37:09.199 --> 00:37:09.639
they didn't.
836
00:37:09.719 --> 00:37:12.199
So in the United States, if you are a user
837
00:37:12.360 --> 00:37:14.840
of marijuana, you are prohibited from owning a gun.
838
00:37:15.199 --> 00:37:17.440
Yes, if you are currently a user of the drug
839
00:37:17.519 --> 00:37:21.159
or addicted to any controlled substance, which includes marijuana, even
840
00:37:21.199 --> 00:37:23.880
if it's legal in their state, you may not possess firearm.
841
00:37:23.880 --> 00:37:26.840
Now I understand that just this morning they put out
842
00:37:26.840 --> 00:37:29.679
a proposed rule making that would narrow that definition. I
843
00:37:29.719 --> 00:37:32.880
haven't read it all yet, but that could dramatically change things.
844
00:37:32.880 --> 00:37:35.760
This has been a crazy newsday while I'm at shot Show.
845
00:37:35.840 --> 00:37:37.039
Yeah, the first day.
846
00:37:36.920 --> 00:37:39.880
Of shot Show on the Tuesday, which people will hear
847
00:37:39.920 --> 00:37:43.280
this on Sunday and after that. And actually there may
848
00:37:43.280 --> 00:37:45.320
be more information there and they could follow you on
849
00:37:45.679 --> 00:37:48.159
X yes over there, because you're posting a lot of
850
00:37:48.159 --> 00:37:50.000
information all the time. I'm trying to pick it up
851
00:37:50.000 --> 00:37:52.559
and do as much as i can because this stuff
852
00:37:52.639 --> 00:37:56.480
is happening daily at this point, it's pretty crazy. And also,
853
00:37:56.519 --> 00:37:59.039
of course go to saf dot org. You've got a
854
00:37:59.079 --> 00:38:01.880
lot of informational bears. Second me, that's good stuff. Tell
855
00:38:01.880 --> 00:38:04.639
you what another thing that we're working on right now
856
00:38:05.280 --> 00:38:11.440
is getting more people involved because what you're doing it's worthwhile.
857
00:38:11.599 --> 00:38:13.400
It takes a long time, but it really takes a
858
00:38:13.400 --> 00:38:15.519
lot of money. Yeah, I mean, it's just like it's
859
00:38:15.559 --> 00:38:18.239
a crazy amount of money it takes to do these cases.
860
00:38:19.440 --> 00:38:21.519
The best way for people to support that as what
861
00:38:21.880 --> 00:38:24.320
join SAFF. Donate to SAFF.
862
00:38:24.880 --> 00:38:28.960
You absolutely, I encourage you to join SAFF and and
863
00:38:29.079 --> 00:38:31.400
follow our work. But the most important thing you can
864
00:38:31.480 --> 00:38:34.719
do besides supporting us selfishly is talk to your friends
865
00:38:34.760 --> 00:38:39.760
about this. We're seeing how politics influences as Virginia is
866
00:38:40.119 --> 00:38:42.039
about to become California.
867
00:38:41.519 --> 00:38:42.280
Because of election.
868
00:38:42.440 --> 00:38:44.800
So SAFF does its best on the court fronts.
869
00:38:45.079 --> 00:38:47.119
But try and put me out of work, try and
870
00:38:47.119 --> 00:38:49.119
stop these loss from tasting so.
871
00:38:49.079 --> 00:38:51.119
We don't need right, so we don't need If we
872
00:38:51.159 --> 00:38:54.800
win elections, none of it matters. We're gonna win everything else.
873
00:38:54.800 --> 00:38:56.559
Hold on, we'll be right back here. We're talking with
874
00:38:56.639 --> 00:38:59.119
coach this Morris from the Second Moment Foundation. I'm Tom
875
00:38:59.159 --> 00:39:01.719
Gresham is is gun talk.
876
00:39:07.559 --> 00:39:09.960
Back whether they were talking with Katis morros coasis.
877
00:39:10.599 --> 00:39:13.079
We have a number of cases that have been appealed
878
00:39:13.119 --> 00:39:17.000
to the US Supreme Court, second Miditic cases, I mean,
879
00:39:17.039 --> 00:39:18.599
it's not like one or two, it's like a whole
880
00:39:19.000 --> 00:39:22.599
passl of them, and they keep getting continued or they're
881
00:39:22.639 --> 00:39:24.880
doing conferences on them, and just like it feels like
882
00:39:24.880 --> 00:39:26.679
they're kicking a can down the road.
883
00:39:27.079 --> 00:39:30.000
Yeah, and it's frustrating because, especially for us at the
884
00:39:30.000 --> 00:39:33.239
Second Amendment Foundation, we have five pending cer petitions, so
885
00:39:33.400 --> 00:39:36.800
every week we wake up and find out if they're
886
00:39:36.840 --> 00:39:40.159
going to execute us or not deny review. Just this
887
00:39:40.239 --> 00:39:42.280
morning they not to any of our cases, but they
888
00:39:42.280 --> 00:39:46.480
did deny a couple of cases concerning whether fraud from
889
00:39:46.639 --> 00:39:49.119
fifteen years ago or something with Zurka. I think is
890
00:39:49.159 --> 00:39:51.599
the case is enough to disarm someone, and they didn't
891
00:39:51.679 --> 00:39:54.679
take that case. So so far, they keep punting on
892
00:39:54.719 --> 00:39:58.079
the big issues, which to us are the assault weapons cases,
893
00:39:58.679 --> 00:40:03.519
eighteen to twenty bands, and finally the public transportation carry band,
894
00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:06.760
which we're also doing. So we'll just have to see
895
00:40:06.800 --> 00:40:08.599
what they do and don't decide to take.
896
00:40:08.800 --> 00:40:12.360
Aren't we almost at the end of the season when
897
00:40:12.400 --> 00:40:13.880
they will accept the case.
898
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:15.719
Yeah, I can't remember the exact date.
899
00:40:15.760 --> 00:40:17.920
I think it might be this week's conference is the
900
00:40:17.960 --> 00:40:19.880
last chance to accept it for this term.
901
00:40:19.960 --> 00:40:22.519
That doesn't mean the cases are denied, they.
902
00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:25.760
Might hold them longer and grant them later for next term.
903
00:40:26.239 --> 00:40:29.199
They might hold them over the summer and grant them later.
904
00:40:29.280 --> 00:40:31.280
That's rare, but they do do it from time to time,
905
00:40:31.519 --> 00:40:33.920
and that's important to Californians because one of the cases,
906
00:40:33.920 --> 00:40:36.519
although it's not a SAFF case, is Duncan Vibano with
907
00:40:36.559 --> 00:40:40.239
my old colleagues server at CRPA, and that case concerns
908
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:42.960
Californian's magazine ban and that one's important because if that
909
00:40:43.079 --> 00:40:46.239
judgment becomes final. It's currently stayed pending this cert petition,
910
00:40:46.280 --> 00:40:48.119
but if it becomes final, people like me are going
911
00:40:48.159 --> 00:40:49.920
to have to turn in our magazines that are over
912
00:40:49.960 --> 00:40:52.440
ten rounds that we got during Freedom Week. So in
913
00:40:52.519 --> 00:40:55.239
Saf's a Meekis brief, I literally told the Supreme Court, Hey,
914
00:40:55.559 --> 00:40:57.119
even if you don't want to grant this case, maybe
915
00:40:57.159 --> 00:40:59.639
you want another one, just hold it forever until you
916
00:40:59.719 --> 00:41:00.800
decide case.
917
00:41:00.559 --> 00:41:04.360
Okay, Because there was a weird one week window when
918
00:41:04.440 --> 00:41:07.760
it was legal for Californians to buy standard capacity magazines
919
00:41:08.000 --> 00:41:10.280
and they bought them by the millions, maybe by the
920
00:41:10.320 --> 00:41:13.960
tens of millions, and they're perfectly illegal for you to
921
00:41:14.000 --> 00:41:14.559
have now.
922
00:41:14.719 --> 00:41:18.000
Yes, but that could go away and you could end yes.
923
00:41:18.119 --> 00:41:21.639
So if the Duncan ruling becomes final, then those become illegal.
924
00:41:21.760 --> 00:41:24.719
We'll probably get some window of time from California DJ
925
00:41:24.800 --> 00:41:26.760
where they tell us either turn them in, take them
926
00:41:26.760 --> 00:41:28.039
out of state, or destroy them.
927
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:30.519
You know, they'll probably give us thirty to ninety days.
928
00:41:30.639 --> 00:41:32.800
But the point is we don't want this decision to
929
00:41:32.800 --> 00:41:35.159
become final. The Supreme Court either has to intervene or
930
00:41:35.239 --> 00:41:38.199
has to hold the case until they decide a similar case.
931
00:41:38.239 --> 00:41:41.159
And these cases that they're holding onto right now, they
932
00:41:41.199 --> 00:41:43.800
have not decided. They haven't gotten rid of them, have
933
00:41:43.920 --> 00:41:47.159
denied them, but they haven't accepted them. Do they have
934
00:41:47.199 --> 00:41:49.360
to take an affirmative action to carry them over?
935
00:41:50.239 --> 00:41:52.280
I don't know what the exact rules are, and the
936
00:41:52.599 --> 00:41:54.000
Supreme Court rules are always confusing.
937
00:41:54.159 --> 00:41:55.039
I'll have to look that up for you.
938
00:41:55.039 --> 00:41:56.360
I don't want to give you a bad answer, but
939
00:41:56.599 --> 00:41:58.320
I think they can just hold them over the summer
940
00:41:58.360 --> 00:42:00.719
without any spence. If they don't deny grant them, then
941
00:42:00.719 --> 00:42:01.639
they just stay on the docket.
942
00:42:01.679 --> 00:42:04.079
Because Justice Kevanaugh said a year ago, he says, world,
943
00:42:04.079 --> 00:42:06.679
we're gonna have to take up second min of cases
944
00:42:06.679 --> 00:42:09.960
in the next term or two. Well, this was the term,
945
00:42:10.119 --> 00:42:13.880
so next term would be the two. I mean, I
946
00:42:13.920 --> 00:42:16.920
know we can't exactly hold him to that, but it's
947
00:42:16.960 --> 00:42:18.159
something that we're all thinking about.
948
00:42:18.360 --> 00:42:20.519
Yes, and I think he did mean this is going
949
00:42:20.559 --> 00:42:23.119
to be sooner rather than later. So it probably won't
950
00:42:23.159 --> 00:42:25.079
be this year now, but hopefully it'll be next year.
951
00:42:25.719 --> 00:42:28.719
And he was talking specifically about AR fifteen cases, so
952
00:42:28.800 --> 00:42:31.239
we'll have to see what they decide to do.
953
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:32.679
We're very hopeful that they'll Finally.
954
00:42:33.000 --> 00:42:34.440
The thing is none of us wants to talk about
955
00:42:34.480 --> 00:42:37.800
out loud, is we're all watching the clock because Justice
956
00:42:37.880 --> 00:42:42.199
Clarence Thomas may retire at some point. He's getting older.
957
00:42:42.800 --> 00:42:44.880
May you know who knows what's going on? I mean,
958
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:46.400
and we definitely want him there.
959
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:48.760
We do want him there for that, but I would
960
00:42:48.840 --> 00:42:51.400
encourage Justice Thomas to take a long, hard look at
961
00:42:51.519 --> 00:42:53.440
Justice Jackson and ask if that's what he wants to
962
00:42:53.480 --> 00:42:54.559
replace him someday.
963
00:42:54.880 --> 00:42:57.239
So he's got it to don't even get me started.
964
00:42:57.280 --> 00:42:57.760
He's got it.
965
00:42:57.800 --> 00:43:00.840
I hope him and Justice Alito get serious thoughts for retiring,
966
00:43:00.880 --> 00:43:02.559
not because we don't love them. We do love them,
967
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:05.760
but we want them replaced by solid conservatives before the
968
00:43:05.800 --> 00:43:06.440
Senate is.
969
00:43:06.440 --> 00:43:09.000
Up for election, excellent point courses, Boris, thank you so much.
970
00:43:09.119 --> 00:43:11.639
Sayf dot org, SAF dot org for a second un
971
00:43:11.719 --> 00:43:13.480
Foundation and if you're not a member of shame on
972
00:43:13.559 --> 00:43:14.360
you need to join.
973
00:43:14.440 --> 00:43:15.320
I'm just going to say that.
974
00:43:15.320 --> 00:43:17.360
That's me, not him saying that, because I'm believe in
975
00:43:17.400 --> 00:43:18.039
it that much.
976
00:43:18.360 --> 00:43:21.039
Thank you, everybody. We appreciate you being here. We are
977
00:43:21.119 --> 00:43:23.440
having a ball at the Shot Show. Tay you what.
978
00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:25.800
Next week we'll bring you more from the Shot Show
979
00:43:25.840 --> 00:43:28.880
because there's a whole lot more to cover. I'm time, Gresha.
980
00:43:29.000 --> 00:43:31.039
This is gun Dog. Go ahead and do some shooting
981
00:43:31.280 --> 00:43:32.719
and be safe out there.
