WEBVTT
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Hey everybody.
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Welcome back to another episode of Between Sessions with Berries.
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I'm very excited to have our guest today.
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Dr.
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Lisa Lovelace is actually a dear friend of mine.
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So I'm excited.
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Sometimes I get guests on here that I just love.
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I'm so excited to see her because we like talk back and forth, but we never get to spend a lot of time together.
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So I'm really excited to have Lisa here with us today.
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Dr.
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Lisa Lovelace is a licensed clinical psychologist in Minnesota, New York, Wisconsin, and SciPact.
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She's the founder of Synergy e Therapy, an online collective of therapists and trainees across the country.
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Dr.
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Lisa has been teaching therapists how to build online therapy group practices since before COVID, even before, I mean, way before that, even.
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I mean, 2014.
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She's also an author, a nonprofit co-founder for suicide prevention in Minnesota, and a consultant.
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Synergy e-therapy has been organically recognized by Forbes.
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I love this.
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I tell everybody now.
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Well, I have a friend that's been in Forbes is a featured Forbes.
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Organically recognized by Forbes for the past three years in many best of categories.
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It's proof that little fish can swim in big waters and be seen.
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I love that.
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I love it.
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Thank you.
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What's it?
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The best of teen therapist, online therapist practice, like all kinds of stuff, right?
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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We've had child and teen, we've had CBT, we've had lots of things.
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Yeah.
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Just organically.
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I have to just Google it myself to be like, oh, it's a new year.
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Did they recognize us again?
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And I'm like, oh yeah, they did.
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Oh my gosh.
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I love it.
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If you go to her website, it's like a banner across the top.
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I'm like, that looks so cool.
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It's like that's amazing.
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Yes, it's amazing.
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Thank you.
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Thank you for having me.
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I, of course, I was talking to you, and whenever I'm in Florida seeing you and hanging out.
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So it's super nice to be able to do our professional lives together.
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So thanks for having me.
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You're welcome.
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So excited to have you here.
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So there's so much, even before this episode, Lisa and I are like, what should we even talk about?
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Because there's literally a thousand things we could talk about with you guys.
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Because Lisa does it all.
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She runs this huge online group practice.
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But the big thing right now that we thought would be exciting to talk about really is what's changed with online spaces now since COVID.
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What are you seeing, Lisa?
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Let's talk about the trends, what's happening, how you're pivoting as a owner of a huge group practice.
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Let's just like dig into all of that.
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Dive into it.
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Yeah.
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Well, I think it's a great topic because I think people are seeing the shift now.
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Before COVID, it was really in person.
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Nobody really did online therapy or telemental health.
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Then we were, obviously.
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And then COVID happened, unfortunately.
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The only thing that came out of that entire awful time period was the rise of telemetal health or acceptance of being able to see clients online.
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And it wasn't so unethical or illegal or all the things we used to get told, which it wasn't.
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It was just a mode of operating.
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We don't touch our clients, so there's no real need to have that in-person thing happening.
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So it's like we were in a fog during COVID, everyone's hurrying up getting online, and then online was huge.
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And so we saw a huge rise in big companies, big businesses, big financial companies, venture capital really started getting involved into different EAPs, insurances.
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You know, we're seeing all this now.
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So now, you know, six years after it began, even just maybe last year, I'd say, we started to kind of see a shift in who's running clinics now, even in our hometowns.
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There's different insurances that are buying out clinics that used to be a mom and pop group owner, and they get really big and they merge, and you just like every day you're like seeing a new thing in the newspaper online in your local community of like, wait, so and so used to own that, and now it turned into a big thing.
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But that's what happens is you grow and then you sell, and then it's a financial thing, right?
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But for some of us, we're mom and pop shops, and it's like, oh, and there goes another one.
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Oh, yeah.
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Right.
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So a lot of us, like group practice owners, do band together.
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At least here in Minnesota, there's a group of us, and we meet several times on Zoom and support each other, and we all do things a little differently and get to know each other and nice try to support each other's passions and business models and things like that, and give each other tips and tricks and things.
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But just nationally, we're seeing it change so much that so many people went into private practice on their own right after school because you could join this and join this and join this, and that's fine and that's great for people, it works for people.
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And then sometimes over the years, you're like, this isn't working for me anymore, or I don't like it, or it's not how I want it to be, or I don't agree with something from any of the big companies that are out there.
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I just personally have been seeing a shift of people are applying a lot more to the mom and pop groups again.
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Oh, really?
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Oh, interesting.
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There was like a wall, there was a huge like COVID boom.
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Like I'd have like 300 applications a month, and I'm like, oh, this is too much.
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And then there was a huge dip.
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Probably around 2023, 24.
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It was like, oh, where's everybody go?
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And group practices were like, I can't find really good employees anymore, or 1099 contractors.
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Now we're seeing it kind of come again.
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So it was kind of like this, then it did this, and now we're seeing it kind of come back around.
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So that's one trend that I'm noticing.
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And especially, I guess, with the VC firms.
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I guess maybe they made it look real easy to just be in private practice by yourself.
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And essentially you're working for them as a group practice instead of these mom and pop group practices.
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But the problems that come with that is they change the rules on you midway.
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They can.
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Yeah, you know, things can change that no longer serve you.
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Right.
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And we all have to decide.
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Yeah, like where do we want to work, who we want to work with, work for.
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And sometimes it's you're gonna make choices based on ease.
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If you have chronic medical conditions, if you're just really needing to go where there's the best payout, and other people are like, I want to be local, or everyone has to choose.
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Everybody's gonna have just you know their opinions, but there's really no right or wrong.
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It's a really big place.
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We all have our space, businesses and capitalism, that's where we live, right?
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Like everybody can start something and it you want it to do well, but you also want it to serve the people that you're working with or for.
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And so I think that the changes that keep happening, even just insurance changes or the VC changes, it makes it harder for group practices to kind of survive.
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Yeah.
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And I consult a lot with group practice owners about people who are like, I am paying them more than I pay myself, or they need to close up because the financials don't work anymore.
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And the way that I started years ago was more of like a membership/slash collective kind of hybrid-y group, but not really, it's a little weird.
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It's like not really fitting into either category.
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It's a little collective and it's got some elements of a group.
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But I made that decision without knowing anything.
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And now looking back, I'm like, oh, that was a good decision for me and for the therapists that are in the collective or the group practice because they are feeling in charge and also they can charge what they want, but they also have support and they can come in under our contracts.
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They get a shmorvus board of like, you can choose what you're want, like choose your own adventure.
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And so they're happy and they really enjoy that kind of like independence with also coaching and mentoring and collaborative nature, but not too much.
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So I feel like now this is where things are going a lot for a lot of traditional group practices that are really struggling because people have expectations of I want$100 an hour.
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And it's like for an insurance group, that's not always possible, especially for an in-person practice.
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If they own at least a whole building, it's not possible, right?
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All the time.
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So I think things are definitely changing in how you can structure something and how you can work with different therapists, or for therapists looking to join something, like maybe there's something different out there that you can still earn a good living, but you also can be a part of something.
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So I've seen a lot of like co-ops being started, memberships being started, collectives being started, whether it's a group owned, owned by all the players that are in the collective or just owned by one owner.
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So there's a lot of interesting things out there now that there weren't at all like a decade ago.
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And I was gonna say, I mean, maybe you could elaborate on those different types of models a little bit more.
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Because I know you have a Facebook group and we'll put it in here.
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And I know you work with an attorney, a healthcare attorney, David, that does a ton of consulting around this stuff with you.
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And I know you're gonna be talking about it more, but I'd love if you could touch on a little bit like what is a collective versus a membership?
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If somebody's listening to this, even a group practice owner that's like, gosh, I need to like get with the times and maybe get a little more innovative with what I'm offering, like just like a brief, like what are the differences in those kinds of models?
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Even before going into that, because there's so much of like I've always told people don't limit yourself to what you could come up with because you could come up with something totally different.
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I think we sandwich ourselves into what is already there, that legally you can do a lot of things that are just maybe new and novel.
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So, like, you got an idea, like talk about it with a lawyer in your state and see if it can be legally done and that it works financially for you too.
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So the traditional group practice, whether it's online or in person, it's a building in person and it's a name on the building, and you usually employ the people who want to work there as a W-2.
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We see this in bigger community mental health centers and clinics and things like that, where you're a W-2.
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You come in, you get your employee information.
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Maybe there's benefits or not, maybe there's stipends for this or not.
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It just depends on the group.
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And that's your W-2 employer.
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They pay your payroll taxes, you work for them, they give you clients, they do marketing, they do billing.
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It's a lot of work and a lot of time and a lot of money that goes out.
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I think number one is people don't always realize the group owners are not raking in the box.
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I have to tell you.
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I believe it.
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I mean, I think you even said to me one time, like, Kim, why don't you start a group?
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Like, you could have a group so easy.
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I was like, hell no.
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You were like, not a chance.
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Am I doing that to myself?
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Nightmare.
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And it is for many people, but it works for you.
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I know you've got a great system and it works great for you.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Yeah, but it's not for everybody.
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You have to want to kind of work all the time.
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Yeah.
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You can get to a point, you know, where you have resistance and whatever, but it is a lot of work.
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And the hope is that you do make an income from your group.
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You want to make 25K extra, 100K extra, 200k extra from your group practice, and maybe even more.
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But it's not passive income, it's a lot of work.
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It's a lot of people moving parts from payroll to lawyers to whatever, right?
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So that's your traditional group practice.
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And some of them are struggling more than others these days.
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Then you have something that's like a membership, right?
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You have to kind of figure out well, what would the membership fee be?
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But maybe it's anywhere from$150 to$500 a month that you want to start something that's like a central hub, and maybe different people's independent practices can be seen from that.
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Maybe they get different tiers of what they can get in the membership.
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Maybe you can get supervision in a certain tier part of your membership, or maybe you get to join insurance contracts if that's something they have that you can bill under their tax ID and they take care of the insurance.
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Sometimes you'll hear now like the managed services like organizations, like the MSOs, and they're not gonna do the therapy, but they're gonna do the administrative work.
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So it's kind of like it's kind of like that in a way.
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We're gonna take care of all this for you.
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A lot of physicians have those types of groups.
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Oh, interesting.
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It's like a MSO.
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I know I'm not a lawyer, so don't quote me like this, but I'm just I know what I know and I know what I don't know.
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And so it's like you could do a membership.
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Of course, you need to figure out what you're gonna offer, what are your expenses, and what price point do you need people to buy in.
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But you don't really have a commission split or you don't have to worry about payroll that way or whatever it might be.
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It's just kind of like people joining in and collectively.
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Then there's like a collective, that's kind of what I am.
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I'm a little hybrid-y, like I said, I'm kind of a group and I'm kind of a collective.
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I should call it a group elective.
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I don't know.
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It's it's like a it's like a marketing services agreement, right?
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Okay it's hey, you're gonna kind of have a really low membership fee, and also there's gonna be a really high commission payout.
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You take your own clients, you see who you want to see, you work who you want to work however long you want, and there's like zero control.
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My practice as the collective is like collaborating with you as your own independent practice, right?
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So it's Kim Tolson LLC is collaborating with Synergy eTherapy.
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Very similar to like if you were to work for any of the EAPs that you're a contractor for, right?
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It's kind of the same idea.
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Not a lot of control over what you do.
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There's co-ops.
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I don't know as much about them.
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I know there's some people posting a lot in Facebook groups about co-ops where they're turning theirs into a co-op.
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So it's a cooperation and everybody is a member, so they all put in financially towards it, and then they all get out financially from it, right?
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Yeah, I don't know if that sounds really complicated because you gotta have like a mother and somebody running the ship or a captain, you gotta have somebody, otherwise it's like you have too many cooks in the kitchen.
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I don't know how that goes.
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But there's all these options, right?
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And then there's probably 10 others that we just haven't thought of yet that somebody will and we'll come up with it.
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It's a way for mom and pop, local therapists to be together and to do something that runs what they want to do with the therapy, but they're running a business in kind of the background, they're not doing it alone.
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Yeah, so interesting.
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So, do you think that these newer models?
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I mean, maybe they're not newer, they're just new to me, but these like more innovative kind of models are more attractive to maybe newer clinicians that are out there and maybe encouraging them to want to join one of these options instead of maybe doing a solo practice or even like a big tech option?
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Right.
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I think so.
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I'm starting to see it more and more just in the last year.
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Here in Minnesota, there's been some two very big insurances that are close to new practices.
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Luckily, we're in them.
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So we have a lot of therapists, seasoned therapists that have their own private practice that are like, can I just join your collective so I can join some EAPs and join some insurances?
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And I'm like, of course.
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You know, I obviously I know them or I vet them.
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But I'm like, of course.
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And that's one way to kind of work together and help other people to be able to see clients in the community that they can't through their own practice.
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And so I think that it's not always our choice.
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We're running into different obstacles that we weren't running into before.
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Yeah.
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Like especially these closed panels.
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Yeah, closed panels or different contracts that we might have, workers' comp or fit personal injury contracts that I get at better rates we can negotiate because we have some SciPAC psychologists, we have different therapists all over the country who are really good at doing assessment for PTSD and different things like that.
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So it's like I can get a good, good rate in the twos or above for like a master's level person that's not always heard of, right?
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So I'm like, well, we have doctorate and we have masters, so hey, we have so many people and I negotiate, and that's what I love to do is work on behalf of the clinicians.
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I always say in my group, they're my boss.
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Yeah, I'm not their boss.
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Yeah, I love that.
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They're my boss, each one of them.
00:16:46.759 --> 00:16:48.680
And so I'm like, what do you need from me?
00:16:48.840 --> 00:16:50.360
What can I do to make your life better?
00:16:50.519 --> 00:16:51.560
How can I help you?
00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:53.639
And like they're always like, huh?
00:16:54.759 --> 00:16:58.039
And I like send emails with like, here's what I'm thinking for the year.
00:16:58.200 --> 00:16:58.759
What do you like?
00:16:58.840 --> 00:16:59.399
What do you need?
00:16:59.480 --> 00:17:02.200
And people are always like, This is so refreshing or it's so nice.
00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:13.799
So I I do think that people are coming back around to like some of the mom and pop stuff because they're maybe realizing that some of the bigger things are not serving them as well anymore.
00:17:13.879 --> 00:17:24.680
It doesn't mean that they're not or that they're not helpful in some ways, but I am seeing as just kind of the trends where it was before really high in COVID, then it took a dip with everyone joining.
00:17:24.839 --> 00:17:32.200
And now people are missing the collaboration and they're missing the coaching and kind of the interpersonal stuff that comes along.
00:17:32.519 --> 00:17:35.240
And then there's other reasons people might want to join too.
00:17:35.319 --> 00:17:38.839
Like they can't get into insurance or they don't like the fees or rates with something.
00:17:39.160 --> 00:17:48.839
One thing that I'm doing lately because there's so many changes with lots of stuff going on out there in the world that you guys on Facebook might read about.
00:17:49.160 --> 00:17:52.120
We're not gonna get into it, but y'all know what we're talking about.
00:17:52.759 --> 00:17:54.839
Is I'm already in different insurances.
00:17:55.000 --> 00:17:58.839
Why can't I get into optimum and Aetna and Cigna?
00:17:59.079 --> 00:18:03.640
And I'm already in the like blue cross, and we're already in certain states with uh optum and Aetna.
00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:15.400
So why can't I, if I have national therapists, like they're licensed in 10 places or they live in different places, why can't I go ahead and get contracts like that and just start to add people under us like that?
00:18:15.799 --> 00:18:23.880
And I'm like asked my credentialing company, and they're like, sure, here's what you do with this one, and here's how it works with this one, and how many days and what's needed.
00:18:24.039 --> 00:18:30.839
And I'm like, oh, that doesn't sound so bad, or like you just need to add the license or add the states, and you don't need this or that, you know.
00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:32.279
It wasn't so complicated.
00:18:32.359 --> 00:18:34.039
So I'm like, gonna start that.
00:18:34.359 --> 00:18:40.599
I have it locally, and I have some other things locally to different states, but I'm gonna kind of see can I start to do that?
00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:45.000
Where if I have a therapist from one state and another therapist from another, they can come under that.
00:18:45.079 --> 00:18:46.680
We just need to add the state or something.
00:18:46.759 --> 00:18:48.039
So oh, interesting.
00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:52.359
I know, and that goes into like our multi-state course that we created a long time ago.
00:18:52.440 --> 00:18:59.960
Is like therapists need to know it's not just get insurance contracts in different states, but like you have to know the state laws, you have to know how that works.
00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:02.120
And Kim and I created a course years ago.
00:19:02.279 --> 00:19:10.839
I digress, but yes, yes, we did to help therapists that wanted to branch out and be multi-state or group practices that wanted to be multi-state, like Lisa's, right, for sure.
00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:13.400
It's we'll we'll link it down below if you guys want to check it out.
00:19:13.559 --> 00:19:15.960
It's perfect, it's a really helpful course.
00:19:16.200 --> 00:19:17.559
Yeah, so that's so innovative.
00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:25.559
So, what I'm hearing you say that like one, you're totally different than maybe a VC back to group practice that somebody's working for because you actually care.
00:19:25.799 --> 00:19:26.839
I mean, not that they don't care.
00:19:26.920 --> 00:19:27.559
I don't want to say that.
00:19:27.640 --> 00:19:30.759
We don't want to get troubled with anybody, but you actually care.
00:19:31.000 --> 00:19:32.839
I know them, I know them all.
00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:34.039
I know their lives.
00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:40.680
Yeah, like I know when somebody has a baby, I know when someone in their family passes away, I know when they're kind of struggling.
00:19:40.759 --> 00:19:43.079
So I don't hear from them in a while, and I'm like, how's it going?
00:19:43.240 --> 00:19:46.680
Or, you know, we have summits every year that we've had in person.
00:19:46.759 --> 00:19:50.359
So I literally get to hug them and see them, whoever comes.
00:19:50.440 --> 00:19:54.680
And I have true, real joy in friendship and relationships with them all.
00:19:54.920 --> 00:19:58.359
I don't have to have anybody in the collective if I don't want to.
00:19:58.440 --> 00:20:03.799
It's not that like, oh, I have 3,000 people on a wait list from Georgia, so I'm just gonna take anybody.
00:20:04.039 --> 00:20:05.160
It doesn't work that way.
00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:10.359
So I really get to choose who I really enjoy, who's ethical, who's a good person.
00:20:10.759 --> 00:20:13.799
Just seems like a person that's just easy to get along with.
00:20:13.880 --> 00:20:17.160
There's zero drama, none at all ever.
00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:26.039
And so it's really a joy to be able to like be friends with my colleagues because, like I said, they're my bosses.
00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:27.480
Yeah, I love that.
00:20:27.640 --> 00:20:30.759
And I actually got to go to one of Lisa's summits, which was so fun.
00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:34.759
We rode one of those double bikes on the broadwalk of Hollywood beach.
00:20:38.599 --> 00:20:42.759
Yeah, it was really fun, but I could see the culture, is what I'm saying.
00:20:42.839 --> 00:20:45.079
Like I could see that you've nurtured that a lot.
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:54.599
And I think maybe somebody listening to this that is a group practice owner that's worried about clinicians leaving and going, I mean, that is that unique thing that you're offering.
00:20:54.839 --> 00:21:03.960
If you can nurture and really help your employees or whatever they are to you, depending on what model you have, establish themselves and have a career and feel comfortable with you.
00:21:04.039 --> 00:21:08.759
You know, if you can get that culture going, I think that helps with the success of a group practice.
00:21:09.000 --> 00:21:09.240
Yeah.
00:21:09.480 --> 00:21:10.359
I think so too.
00:21:10.519 --> 00:21:11.319
I help people.
00:21:11.400 --> 00:21:18.759
So if you're struggling as a solo practitioner or you want to figure out what you want to join, or you want to figure out how to expand, I'm happy to help.
00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:24.200
I'm not a lawyer, I'm not an accountant, but like I know enough to be dangerous and at least give you pointers.
00:21:24.519 --> 00:21:24.839
Yeah.
00:21:25.000 --> 00:21:29.000
Well, I know you've helped hundreds and hundreds of therapists build out their group practices.
00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:30.440
So it's amazing.
00:21:30.680 --> 00:21:31.319
Yeah.
00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:35.079
So what can therapists do to sustain themselves?
00:21:35.240 --> 00:21:40.759
Is the answer join a group practice that offers all the bells and whistles so you don't have to like figure it all out on your own?
00:21:40.839 --> 00:21:42.279
Or what do you think about that?
00:21:42.440 --> 00:21:42.920
Yeah.
00:21:43.160 --> 00:21:44.120
Maybe, yeah.
00:21:44.519 --> 00:21:45.480
For some of you.
00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:48.039
For some of you, it might be more of a collective.
00:21:48.200 --> 00:22:00.120
For some of you, it might just be your own solo practice in person, rent an office and get your own insurance contracts and be totally on your own that way and just kind of join some consultation groups.
00:22:00.359 --> 00:22:17.559
There's no right or wrong, but I want people to really think about what makes them thrive and what makes you burn out less fast, and what gives you joy, and what gives you financial freedom, and what kinds of things maybe you want to diversify.
00:22:17.640 --> 00:22:20.440
I mean, Kim is the diversification queen.
00:22:21.160 --> 00:22:22.680
I'm like, what are you doing today?
00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:25.799
She's like, 12 things, what like no big deal.
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:27.000
I don't know how you do it.
00:22:27.400 --> 00:22:30.680
And I do a lot too, but I do I think you far surpass me.
00:22:30.759 --> 00:22:33.880
So it's like you have to know what makes you thrive and tick.
00:22:34.039 --> 00:22:36.359
And so it could be any one of these things.
00:22:36.519 --> 00:22:38.279
There's no real right or wrong.
00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:43.079
Your friend might tell you what's right or wrong, or your colleagues on Facebook are sure gonna have opinions.
00:22:43.160 --> 00:22:43.400
Yeah.
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:45.160
But you get to decide for yourself.
00:22:45.240 --> 00:22:53.559
And I think that's the biggest takeaway is like try something out for a little bit and see if try your own solo practice, see if you can get an insurance contract.
00:22:53.720 --> 00:22:58.359
Try some of the VC groups if you want, try a local group practice or join a collective.
00:22:58.599 --> 00:22:59.240
Try it out.
00:22:59.400 --> 00:23:00.759
You can always change, you know.
00:23:00.839 --> 00:23:01.000
Yeah.
00:23:01.240 --> 00:23:04.200
Yeah, it's kind of frustrating or hard if somebody comes in and out.
00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:07.880
But think about it and really process it and give it a try.
00:23:08.120 --> 00:23:09.319
Yeah, absolutely.
00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:09.799
Yeah.
00:23:09.960 --> 00:23:16.200
And if you are working in a situation that changes all of a sudden, you can pivot.
00:23:16.359 --> 00:23:18.599
I mean, there's so many options.
00:23:18.920 --> 00:23:20.039
You can pivot, you know.
00:23:20.279 --> 00:23:33.559
If you don't like it anymore, just do your due diligence with your clients and make sure everybody's transitioning, however, you're going to transition people, whether it's to solo group or VC company, whatever you're going to do, and make sure that your clients are taken care of.
00:23:33.640 --> 00:23:41.799
And also, if you guys need extra support, there's lots of us that help coach and mentor give consultation in lots of different ways.
00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:43.880
You don't have to rewrite the wheel.
00:23:44.279 --> 00:23:48.120
A lot of us have already ridden that truck or that boat.
00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:49.559
Like tap into all of us.
00:23:49.640 --> 00:23:56.039
We have lots of knowledge and what didn't work, what did work, and we can at least help you maybe avoid some pitfalls or what to think about.
00:23:56.200 --> 00:23:57.400
Could be pitfalls.
00:23:57.640 --> 00:23:58.359
Absolutely.
00:23:58.680 --> 00:24:00.440
And could you could you share?
00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:04.680
Because we also like to talk about on this podcast, like the entrepreneurial side of this stuff.
00:24:04.839 --> 00:24:05.640
So could you share?
00:24:05.720 --> 00:24:16.440
I mean, aside from being a mom of two and having a husband and all that that you do, you're such a great, like, mother and wife and caretaker and all that.
00:24:16.599 --> 00:24:18.200
And then you've got your practice.
00:24:18.359 --> 00:24:24.440
You've also got this entrepreneurial side where you've got courses and a Facebook group and coaching that you do.
00:24:24.680 --> 00:24:27.160
Maybe you could talk about your courses and what they are.
00:24:27.319 --> 00:24:39.319
And we'd have to get all into like how'd you develop them and all that stuff, but just like what are they and how do they help therapists that might be listening to this and want to build their own model of a group practice like you're talking about?
00:24:39.480 --> 00:24:40.120
Yeah.
00:24:40.519 --> 00:24:40.920
Yeah.
00:24:41.079 --> 00:24:42.200
I think thank you.
00:24:42.279 --> 00:24:42.519
Yes.
00:24:42.680 --> 00:24:45.079
I have all those other roles in my life.
00:24:45.240 --> 00:24:51.880
And I'm sure somebody in my family would prefer that I, you know, add somebody that can actually like pick up my stuff.
00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:54.519
You should see my office and clean up a little bit.
00:24:54.839 --> 00:24:56.519
Or maybe, you know, cook dinners.
00:24:56.599 --> 00:24:56.920
I don't know.
00:24:57.000 --> 00:24:57.960
We don't do that anymore.
00:24:58.200 --> 00:24:59.400
Uh, you have to pick and choose.
00:24:59.640 --> 00:25:01.799
I mean, come on, what do they expect from you?
00:25:02.039 --> 00:25:03.400
I know, I don't know.
00:25:03.799 --> 00:25:05.720
Thank Godness I have an amazing husband.
00:25:05.880 --> 00:25:07.640
He is uh so great and supportive.
00:25:07.799 --> 00:25:09.319
But I have courses, you know.
00:25:09.400 --> 00:25:15.559
I wrote a book when I was grieving about bubble breathing and for kids and emotion regulation.
00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:20.279
I have a local charity nonprofit here called Shout Out Loud for Suicide Prevention.
00:25:20.440 --> 00:25:22.519
We do stuff all year, every year.
00:25:22.759 --> 00:25:30.519
And so the courses I created pretty much right around COVID time when people kept asking the same things and needing consultation.
00:25:30.599 --> 00:25:33.880
And I was like, you know what, let me just develop an on-demand course.
00:25:34.200 --> 00:25:39.720
I have lots of different options for just what to think about in building an online group practice.
00:25:39.880 --> 00:25:44.519
I have things with privacy policy people that help me at the beginning create my policies.
00:25:44.599 --> 00:25:49.720
I have different lawyers that are talking about things that you might want to think about.
00:25:50.680 --> 00:25:54.200
I have the multi-state course with you that we put together.
00:25:54.680 --> 00:26:01.880
I have like a mini course that just kind of gives you accounting and legal and like my whole like um spider web.
00:26:02.039 --> 00:26:06.120
It's like here's the spider web of all the different parts of building an online practice.
00:26:06.279 --> 00:26:08.519
I don't uh I don't remember what I called it at this point.
00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:10.440
And then I have like the whole shebang.
00:26:10.599 --> 00:26:15.240
There's like three hours of marketing your practice, or there's stuff about hiring virtual assistants.
00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:17.079
It's kind of like everything in it.
00:26:17.240 --> 00:26:17.480
Yeah.
00:26:17.640 --> 00:26:25.960
I just want people to kind of know a little bit about a lot of things, and then they can go and run with it and open up their own or get consultation.
00:26:26.120 --> 00:26:32.359
It kind of cuts down a lot of the work for them if they want to build their own in-person or online practice at this point.
00:26:32.440 --> 00:26:37.319
Everybody's basically online, so it's not as unique and as special as it used to be, you know?
00:26:37.640 --> 00:26:44.440
So it's like, oh, even I went and got a little office for my synergy therapist here in Minneapolis and down in YZM, Minnesota.
00:26:44.519 --> 00:26:44.839
Yeah.
00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:45.480
Yeah.
00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:51.000
I just curious what made you make that decision after being an online therapist for so long.
00:26:51.160 --> 00:26:53.160
I mean, maybe that would be helpful to the listeners too.
00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:53.480
Yeah.
00:26:53.720 --> 00:26:57.079
Because you I mean, online, I mean, that was like your thing with your practice.
00:26:57.400 --> 00:26:59.720
That was the thing, and now I'm pivoting.
00:26:59.799 --> 00:27:00.440
You know why?
00:27:00.680 --> 00:27:02.519
Because times are changing, girl.
00:27:02.759 --> 00:27:04.039
Like I have to pivot.
00:27:04.120 --> 00:27:12.120
And this is what I want everybody to realize is like synergy e-therapy and it's e-therapy, which a therapy is what I called it in 2016, because there wasn't anything.
00:27:12.200 --> 00:27:12.839
I didn't know anything.
00:27:12.920 --> 00:27:13.160
Yeah.
00:27:13.400 --> 00:27:14.839
Would I call it something different now?
00:27:15.000 --> 00:27:18.839
Probably, because nobody realizes there's an E there and what's the E mean and whatever.
00:27:19.079 --> 00:27:21.240
But yeah, so I'm like, you know what?
00:27:21.319 --> 00:27:31.240
There were a lot of therapists in my group that were no longer being able to get into some of the better EAPs that paid better, sent a lot more clients, and they're like, All right, do you have an in-person office?
00:27:31.319 --> 00:27:32.599
And we're like, no, no, no.
00:27:32.759 --> 00:27:44.519
So I'm like, okay, well, I'm seeing times are changing, and we have an in-person address, but it wasn't a place that people were seeing clients, like my dad and sister-in-law, and my brother's office.
00:27:44.599 --> 00:27:48.599
You know, it's like it's I could if I needed to, but it's not the space that we're gonna see clients.
00:27:48.839 --> 00:27:49.720
I think it's time.
00:27:49.880 --> 00:27:52.920
Like, how do I want to spend my marketing dollars?
00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:55.319
What do I think is gonna be a good return on investment?
00:27:55.559 --> 00:27:58.039
What do I think is gonna be good for my therapists?
00:27:58.120 --> 00:27:59.960
And it's amongst a co-working space.
00:28:00.039 --> 00:28:02.680
So we have our own office in this beautiful space.
00:28:02.920 --> 00:28:04.039
They have a conference room.
00:28:04.120 --> 00:28:05.000
We did our summit there.
00:28:05.079 --> 00:28:09.960
It's right on the lake in Minnesota, and it's down in this cute town with lots of restaurants and shops.
00:28:10.039 --> 00:28:24.920
And I'm like, this is dangerous, but it's also really fun, and it's networking, and it's kind of like the resurgence of some in-person, and it allows my therapist a chance to be in office without having to spend their own time leasing it or whatnot.
00:28:25.079 --> 00:28:33.799
They do pay into it based on how many days they want to join the co-working space in the office we have, so it's not free to them, but it's part of a membership, right?
00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:37.480
This is part of the collective membership hybrid e-group model that I created.
00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:38.519
So it's very cool.
00:28:38.680 --> 00:28:39.400
They are loving it.
00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:44.519
I have two therapists so far that are taken up three days a week, and I'll just keep telling people more.
00:28:44.599 --> 00:28:55.559
And they're in our insurance contracts, and it's like, here's all the things you can do, and we can try to get them into different EAPs that send clients and get them more and more gross that they want.
00:28:55.640 --> 00:28:57.720
So it's you can't stick to your guns all the time.
00:28:57.799 --> 00:29:00.920
I can't just be like, what happened to me being the only one online?
00:29:01.079 --> 00:29:01.640
You know, yeah.
00:29:01.799 --> 00:29:06.039
No, now it's not that exciting, and everybody wants to go back in person, you know, kind of thing.
00:29:06.200 --> 00:29:08.039
So I'm giving it an option.
00:29:08.359 --> 00:29:09.319
Oh, that's so cool.
00:29:09.480 --> 00:29:11.400
Now, do you think you'll put it in other states?
00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:13.559
Because you're you have clinicians in how many states?
00:29:13.720 --> 00:29:14.599
I can't even remember.
00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:19.720
It's 40 substates, licensed in 45, I'm sure, states.
00:29:19.799 --> 00:29:20.839
I'm sure it's out there.
00:29:21.319 --> 00:29:23.400
But physically, I I don't know.
00:29:23.480 --> 00:29:25.400
I have to actually do that math.
00:29:25.559 --> 00:29:27.720
I would say probably 20 different states.
00:29:28.279 --> 00:29:34.200
And then some of the therapists on their own, because it's their own practice, they are getting an office space to rent here and there.
00:29:34.359 --> 00:29:39.240
So they are still doing it under Synergy's umbrella, but they have an in-person office.
00:29:39.319 --> 00:29:42.200
So we have an in-person addendum intake form, right?
00:29:42.279 --> 00:29:45.640
Of like understanding like this is theirs, this is ours.
00:29:45.799 --> 00:29:49.240
So keeping everything nice and legal and you know how it is.
00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:58.519
But yeah, I think some of them are dipping their toes into getting some in-person time, not like renting it by the hour or by a day in their state.
00:29:58.759 --> 00:30:03.720
Synergy has office space to rent in South Carolina.
00:30:04.039 --> 00:30:04.599
Oh, right.
00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:04.839
Okay.
00:30:05.160 --> 00:30:07.079
Because some of our insurance contracts are there.
00:30:07.160 --> 00:30:14.680
So like we can actually book some rooms in two different areas in South Carolina if we wanted to, but we do have to pay for that extra.
00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:18.759
So I have two addresses there that are physical spaces and we have to just rent it.
00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:30.359
So like maybe I'm thinking like if there's a place where there's a lot of therapists and we need a synergy office there, that's but people are so spread out, and that's the problem.
00:30:31.559 --> 00:30:31.720
Yeah.
00:30:31.880 --> 00:30:32.359
So I don't know.
00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:32.839
We'll see.
00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:34.680
I'm gonna start here and see how it goes.
00:30:34.759 --> 00:30:40.440
I might like maybe get another one in a different city in Minnesota and just kind of see how it goes here.
00:30:40.599 --> 00:30:41.079
Yeah.
00:30:41.319 --> 00:30:42.839
Yeah, that's so interesting.
00:30:43.000 --> 00:30:43.559
Oh my gosh.
00:30:43.720 --> 00:30:43.960
Yeah.
00:30:44.120 --> 00:30:48.680
The other thing I just want to talk about before we run is the technology, the technology piece.
00:30:48.759 --> 00:30:54.279
Since this is the berries podcast, you know, a lot of times we always want to say, like, are you using technology at all?
00:30:54.440 --> 00:31:01.480
Are you using AI to help you like run this whole intricate system that you're doing or for note-taking, documentation, anything like that?
00:31:01.559 --> 00:31:05.880
We love to just hear how people are using AI in their businesses.
00:31:06.200 --> 00:31:11.720
Well, ironically, I am using berries, but I began using berries.
00:31:12.200 --> 00:31:15.240
Was I using berries before you were using berries?
00:31:15.319 --> 00:31:16.599
Or was I using berries?
00:31:17.079 --> 00:31:17.799
I don't know.
00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:19.559
After you were using berries?
00:31:19.720 --> 00:31:20.200
I've not sure.
00:31:20.440 --> 00:31:21.240
I don't remember.
00:31:21.799 --> 00:31:25.799
I tried out years ago, a year or two ago.
00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:30.519
I don't know how long it was, but I tried out several note-taking ones.
00:31:30.839 --> 00:31:33.240
And I was like, eh, I didn't like this, I didn't like that.
00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:38.120
And I landed on berries and I talked to the owners who I just adore.
00:31:38.279 --> 00:31:43.960
They're just so kind and nice and very therapist-oriented and just great people.
00:31:44.120 --> 00:31:51.000
And I was like, Well, the technology works right for me because you can put it on in the background, but go into any application.
00:31:51.480 --> 00:31:57.160
And it was so easy to do that, and they've just expanded so much in all their offerings inside of berries.
00:31:57.240 --> 00:32:02.039
So then I'm doing it and I'm like, hey, you guys in my group, I'm like, you should try this.
00:32:02.279 --> 00:32:04.120
And then like they tried it.
00:32:04.279 --> 00:32:12.599
There's probably at least 10 of them, I think seven to ten or something like that, that are using berries now, and they're like, I will never go back.
00:32:14.599 --> 00:32:17.079
You know, like I, you know, it's so good.
00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:20.519
And it like, it's key, it just oh, it's so good.
00:32:20.680 --> 00:32:25.799
I think it's really good for interns or students to really learn how to write notes, learn what needs to be in there.
00:32:25.960 --> 00:32:30.519
But for licensed clinicians who already have done this for decades, it's like, no, this is helpful.
00:32:30.680 --> 00:32:36.920
Yeah, let's get the treatment plan, let's just consult with AI, let's get the diagnoses, let's see what's going on.
00:32:37.079 --> 00:32:39.640
We use it for so many more things than therapy.
00:32:39.799 --> 00:32:48.039
Yeah, you know, workers' comp, or if you just need a certain templated form, but you can't run it in the background due to some contracts we have, we can't have it.
00:32:48.279 --> 00:32:54.440
You can at least put some content information in there and it'll spit it out in the note in the way that you need it.
00:32:54.680 --> 00:32:56.680
There's just so many ways to use it.
00:32:56.759 --> 00:33:01.319
So berries is what we're using, and I'm not even saying that because I'm on this punk.
00:33:01.880 --> 00:33:04.599
I'm like, we didn't pay her to say that for real.
00:33:04.839 --> 00:33:10.279
No, I get paid none to say this, but it's because I really, I really like it.
00:33:10.440 --> 00:33:13.079
I really like it, and I used a lot and I didn't like many of them.
00:33:13.400 --> 00:33:13.799
I love that.
00:33:13.960 --> 00:33:21.000
And then I mean, Chat GPT has been my friend, my best friend for a little while here when I'm like struggling with something.
00:33:21.079 --> 00:33:22.519
Can you put this a certain way?
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:23.079
Yeah.
00:33:23.319 --> 00:33:25.799
I know people are using like Claude and whatever.
00:33:25.880 --> 00:33:28.599
I'm also using in Gmail.
00:33:28.759 --> 00:33:31.400
If people don't know about it, it's called Google Studio.
00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:37.319
If you have Google Workspace, it's an AI thing that is helping me to answer and reply to emails.
00:33:37.400 --> 00:33:45.640
It doesn't send it, but it auto-replies in my voice with stuff I've said at any point in time in my email.
00:33:45.799 --> 00:33:46.039
Yeah.
00:33:46.279 --> 00:33:50.680
And I'm like, oh my god, it'll say something like, like just something crazy.
00:33:50.759 --> 00:33:53.799
Like, I'm like, oh my God, I remember that from forever ago.
00:33:53.880 --> 00:34:02.519
Or it'll pull in like an EAP number or a fax number or my gosh, from anything it saw in my emails from forever ago.
00:34:02.759 --> 00:34:09.559
And that has been super helpful because you know me, I'm always trying to figure out how I can clone myself and I yet to do it.
00:34:09.880 --> 00:34:13.400
And I'm just figuring out how and who's gonna help.
00:34:13.480 --> 00:34:23.400
And I still think I need an actual human beings to do the things I need, but I also want to really automate a lot of stuff if I can that is you know gonna be helpful.
00:34:23.559 --> 00:34:25.960
So I'm using it, I'm not great at it.
00:34:26.039 --> 00:34:31.239
So I don't know, like you are a wizard in AI, but I'm learning from you, and then you'll tell me something.
00:34:31.319 --> 00:34:32.839
I'm like, I don't even know what you're saying.
00:34:33.079 --> 00:34:34.599
Just I don't even know.
00:34:34.920 --> 00:34:38.199
You're like do what?
00:34:38.359 --> 00:34:39.239
Tell it to say what?
00:34:39.399 --> 00:34:40.279
Like, never mind.
00:34:41.079 --> 00:34:42.439
Too complicated.
00:34:44.279 --> 00:34:46.599
So, you know, you are so good for this.
00:34:46.679 --> 00:34:56.759
So people want to use AI, like you have so many clubs and memberships, and it's you make it so easy of like this is what they can do if they want social media or whatever.
00:34:56.919 --> 00:35:01.559
I'm sure my VA is doing something with AI for social media or trying to put stuff together.
00:35:01.639 --> 00:35:04.759
We use Canva AI or different things like that, you know.
00:35:04.839 --> 00:35:07.079
So as much as we can, that feels good for us.
00:35:07.799 --> 00:35:08.279
Nice.
00:35:08.519 --> 00:35:09.159
Love that.
00:35:09.399 --> 00:35:13.719
Now, as a group practice owner, you said seven or ten of your clinicians.
00:35:13.879 --> 00:35:15.799
Now, are you giving them berries?
00:35:15.879 --> 00:35:18.599
Is that like a perk or do they do berries on their own?
00:35:18.759 --> 00:35:21.879
Like I just wonder like the strategy for group practice owners with that sort of thing.
00:35:22.279 --> 00:35:22.439
Yeah.
00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:26.039
Well, I know that you can purchase berries as a group.
00:35:26.119 --> 00:35:31.879
You'll just need to talk to the owners to figure out like how many people you have and all the pricing.
00:35:31.959 --> 00:35:33.000
I couldn't tell anybody.
00:35:33.079 --> 00:35:34.039
I'm sure it's different.
00:35:34.199 --> 00:35:34.519
Yeah.
00:35:34.839 --> 00:35:40.039
But right now, what I have is like a coupon for the therapist in my group.
00:35:40.119 --> 00:35:46.919
So they have to still pay for it on their own, but they do get a discount from being in Synergy, which is really nice.
00:35:47.159 --> 00:35:47.639
Oh, nice.
00:35:47.799 --> 00:35:48.039
Okay.
00:35:48.279 --> 00:35:49.959
So I'm not paying for it.
00:35:50.119 --> 00:35:52.519
I have to be careful with all the things I would pay for.
00:35:52.599 --> 00:36:02.519
But if you're like a W-2 group and you do want to pay for things, this could be really good, especially for your chart audits and for insurance, very all that stuff that insurance needs.
00:36:02.679 --> 00:36:05.719
So they do group like portals.
00:36:05.879 --> 00:36:09.799
I'm sure they'll come up with something that meets your needs with what you need.
00:36:09.959 --> 00:36:10.839
Kind of like they did.
00:36:11.000 --> 00:36:11.559
Yeah, for me.
00:36:11.719 --> 00:36:14.359
They're really flexible, like, oh, we could try this or try that.
00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:14.599
Yeah.
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:24.919
Because you know, being in Synergy, yeah, I want people to be like, there's lots of reasons to join the Synergy group or collective and look at all these things, you know, that they get.
00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:26.039
So yeah.
00:36:26.279 --> 00:36:26.519
Cool.
00:36:26.599 --> 00:36:29.319
Yeah, I wasn't sure how you were using it or or offering it.
00:36:29.479 --> 00:36:31.319
I've heard a lot of different variations on that.
00:36:31.399 --> 00:36:32.599
So I'm already super curious.
00:36:33.079 --> 00:36:33.799
That's so cool, right?
00:36:34.039 --> 00:36:35.559
They can do what they want with it.
00:36:35.879 --> 00:36:37.000
Yeah, it's very cool.
00:36:37.159 --> 00:36:37.399
Yeah.
00:36:37.559 --> 00:36:37.879
Yeah.
00:36:38.119 --> 00:36:40.599
I mean, some people are like what you said with interns and stuff.
00:36:40.679 --> 00:36:44.359
They're like, I don't want my interns to use it, but I want the clinicians to use it, or right.
00:36:44.599 --> 00:36:46.679
We use it for supervision, like that kind of thing.
00:36:46.759 --> 00:36:51.959
So it's interesting to hear how different practices their takes on it, really.
00:36:52.119 --> 00:36:53.159
Yeah, it's just neat.
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:53.959
It's neat to hear.
00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:54.359
Yeah.
00:36:54.599 --> 00:36:57.079
Well, thank you so much for coming today.
00:36:57.319 --> 00:36:58.679
How do people find you?
00:36:58.919 --> 00:37:02.039
They want to like join your Facebook group or take your courses.
00:37:02.199 --> 00:37:03.479
Where do they go to find you?
00:37:03.959 --> 00:37:09.879
So the main one I moderate and kind of rehashing a little bit is how to build an online therapy group practice.
00:37:10.199 --> 00:37:14.919
I don't know when this podcast will come out, but it might be titled something a little different at that point.
00:37:15.079 --> 00:37:25.399
But I have two others therapists looking to join a group practice, and that's very organic-y, like just therapists that are looking to join a group practice, and group practice is looking to hire.
00:37:25.559 --> 00:37:30.359
There's the telehealth providers group, which is kind of everybody and it's really all over the world, really.
00:37:30.439 --> 00:37:33.239
It's not too much movement in there like the other two.
00:37:33.479 --> 00:37:37.079
And then my website, synergyetherapy.com.
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:42.359
You can email me, dr lisa dr l Isa at synergyetherapy.com.
00:37:42.519 --> 00:37:45.079
I do answer all my emails eventually.
00:37:45.479 --> 00:37:47.799
She does now, but we're working on that.
00:37:48.039 --> 00:37:49.399
We're working on that.
00:37:49.719 --> 00:37:51.799
I got it down for 500 to 200.
00:37:52.039 --> 00:37:52.679
So I'm great.
00:37:52.839 --> 00:37:53.719
Um, very happy.
00:37:53.879 --> 00:37:56.359
Yeah, so you can just reach out that way.
00:37:56.599 --> 00:38:00.439
Of course, follow us on social media at Synergy ETherapy.
00:38:00.599 --> 00:38:02.679
It's Instagram, I'm on LinkedIn.
00:38:02.839 --> 00:38:06.519
If you like more business networking that way, we have a synergy there too.
00:38:06.919 --> 00:38:07.159
Nice.
00:38:07.719 --> 00:38:08.839
Yeah, lots of ways.
00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:14.439
And I'm here to help and answer any questions and provide any guidance I can.
00:38:14.759 --> 00:38:16.119
Thank you so much.
00:38:16.359 --> 00:38:17.000
Thank you.
00:38:17.239 --> 00:38:18.519
Always fun talking to you.
00:38:18.759 --> 00:38:19.319
You too.
00:38:23.799 --> 00:38:29.159
Between sessions is brought to you by Barries because clinicians deserve support too.
00:38:29.479 --> 00:38:34.519
To learn how berries can help you streamline your notes, reduce stress, and make space for what matters most.
00:38:34.839 --> 00:38:36.759
Visit hayberries.com.
00:00:27.479 --> 00:00:28.119
Hey everybody.
00:00:28.199 --> 00:00:31.559
Welcome back to another episode of Between Sessions with Berries.
00:00:31.640 --> 00:00:33.399
I'm very excited to have our guest today.
00:00:33.560 --> 00:00:33.879
Dr.
00:00:33.960 --> 00:00:36.519
Lisa Lovelace is actually a dear friend of mine.
00:00:36.599 --> 00:00:37.320
So I'm excited.
00:00:37.399 --> 00:00:39.960
Sometimes I get guests on here that I just love.
00:00:40.119 --> 00:00:44.599
I'm so excited to see her because we like talk back and forth, but we never get to spend a lot of time together.
00:00:44.679 --> 00:00:46.920
So I'm really excited to have Lisa here with us today.
00:00:47.239 --> 00:00:47.479
Dr.
00:00:47.640 --> 00:00:54.599
Lisa Lovelace is a licensed clinical psychologist in Minnesota, New York, Wisconsin, and SciPact.
00:00:54.840 --> 00:01:00.920
She's the founder of Synergy e Therapy, an online collective of therapists and trainees across the country.
00:01:01.159 --> 00:01:01.480
Dr.
00:01:01.640 --> 00:01:09.799
Lisa has been teaching therapists how to build online therapy group practices since before COVID, even before, I mean, way before that, even.
00:01:09.879 --> 00:01:10.920
I mean, 2014.
00:01:11.159 --> 00:01:17.640
She's also an author, a nonprofit co-founder for suicide prevention in Minnesota, and a consultant.
00:01:17.959 --> 00:01:22.599
Synergy e-therapy has been organically recognized by Forbes.
00:01:23.000 --> 00:01:23.560
I love this.
00:01:23.640 --> 00:01:24.439
I tell everybody now.
00:01:24.599 --> 00:01:27.079
Well, I have a friend that's been in Forbes is a featured Forbes.
00:01:27.319 --> 00:01:32.519
Organically recognized by Forbes for the past three years in many best of categories.
00:01:32.679 --> 00:01:37.159
It's proof that little fish can swim in big waters and be seen.
00:01:47.959 --> 00:01:48.519
I love that.
00:01:49.719 --> 00:01:50.199
I love it.
00:01:50.359 --> 00:01:50.759
Thank you.
00:01:50.920 --> 00:01:51.399
What's it?
00:01:51.479 --> 00:01:55.479
The best of teen therapist, online therapist practice, like all kinds of stuff, right?
00:01:55.640 --> 00:01:55.959
Yeah.
00:01:56.119 --> 00:01:56.439
Yeah.
00:01:56.599 --> 00:02:00.839
We've had child and teen, we've had CBT, we've had lots of things.
00:02:00.920 --> 00:02:01.399
Yeah.
00:02:01.719 --> 00:02:02.679
Just organically.
00:02:02.839 --> 00:02:05.479
I have to just Google it myself to be like, oh, it's a new year.
00:02:05.559 --> 00:02:06.839
Did they recognize us again?
00:02:06.920 --> 00:02:08.199
And I'm like, oh yeah, they did.
00:02:08.439 --> 00:02:09.159
Oh my gosh.
00:02:09.319 --> 00:02:09.800
I love it.
00:02:09.960 --> 00:02:12.199
If you go to her website, it's like a banner across the top.
00:02:12.280 --> 00:02:13.719
I'm like, that looks so cool.
00:02:13.879 --> 00:02:15.640
It's like that's amazing.
00:02:15.960 --> 00:02:17.240
Yes, it's amazing.
00:02:17.400 --> 00:02:17.879
Thank you.
00:02:18.199 --> 00:02:19.159
Thank you for having me.
00:02:19.319 --> 00:02:24.199
I, of course, I was talking to you, and whenever I'm in Florida seeing you and hanging out.
00:02:24.360 --> 00:02:28.280
So it's super nice to be able to do our professional lives together.
00:02:28.439 --> 00:02:29.159
So thanks for having me.
00:02:29.960 --> 00:02:30.280
You're welcome.
00:02:30.439 --> 00:02:31.560
So excited to have you here.
00:02:31.800 --> 00:02:36.520
So there's so much, even before this episode, Lisa and I are like, what should we even talk about?
00:02:36.600 --> 00:02:39.320
Because there's literally a thousand things we could talk about with you guys.
00:02:39.400 --> 00:02:40.439
Because Lisa does it all.
00:02:40.520 --> 00:02:42.840
She runs this huge online group practice.
00:02:43.159 --> 00:02:51.080
But the big thing right now that we thought would be exciting to talk about really is what's changed with online spaces now since COVID.
00:02:51.240 --> 00:02:52.439
What are you seeing, Lisa?
00:02:52.600 --> 00:03:00.600
Let's talk about the trends, what's happening, how you're pivoting as a owner of a huge group practice.
00:03:00.760 --> 00:03:02.280
Let's just like dig into all of that.
00:03:02.439 --> 00:03:03.159
Dive into it.
00:03:03.320 --> 00:03:03.560
Yeah.
00:03:03.879 --> 00:03:08.520
Well, I think it's a great topic because I think people are seeing the shift now.
00:03:09.159 --> 00:03:11.320
Before COVID, it was really in person.
00:03:11.480 --> 00:03:14.520
Nobody really did online therapy or telemental health.
00:03:14.760 --> 00:03:16.520
Then we were, obviously.
00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:19.640
And then COVID happened, unfortunately.
00:03:19.879 --> 00:03:30.280
The only thing that came out of that entire awful time period was the rise of telemetal health or acceptance of being able to see clients online.
00:03:30.439 --> 00:03:36.520
And it wasn't so unethical or illegal or all the things we used to get told, which it wasn't.
00:03:36.600 --> 00:03:38.280
It was just a mode of operating.
00:03:38.439 --> 00:03:43.480
We don't touch our clients, so there's no real need to have that in-person thing happening.
00:03:43.640 --> 00:03:49.159
So it's like we were in a fog during COVID, everyone's hurrying up getting online, and then online was huge.
00:03:49.320 --> 00:04:00.600
And so we saw a huge rise in big companies, big businesses, big financial companies, venture capital really started getting involved into different EAPs, insurances.
00:04:00.680 --> 00:04:02.200
You know, we're seeing all this now.
00:04:02.360 --> 00:04:14.760
So now, you know, six years after it began, even just maybe last year, I'd say, we started to kind of see a shift in who's running clinics now, even in our hometowns.
00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:31.959
There's different insurances that are buying out clinics that used to be a mom and pop group owner, and they get really big and they merge, and you just like every day you're like seeing a new thing in the newspaper online in your local community of like, wait, so and so used to own that, and now it turned into a big thing.
00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:37.719
But that's what happens is you grow and then you sell, and then it's a financial thing, right?
00:04:38.040 --> 00:04:43.079
But for some of us, we're mom and pop shops, and it's like, oh, and there goes another one.
00:04:43.879 --> 00:04:44.519
Oh, yeah.
00:04:44.840 --> 00:04:45.160
Right.
00:04:45.400 --> 00:04:49.079
So a lot of us, like group practice owners, do band together.
00:04:49.240 --> 00:05:05.319
At least here in Minnesota, there's a group of us, and we meet several times on Zoom and support each other, and we all do things a little differently and get to know each other and nice try to support each other's passions and business models and things like that, and give each other tips and tricks and things.
00:05:05.560 --> 00:05:19.960
But just nationally, we're seeing it change so much that so many people went into private practice on their own right after school because you could join this and join this and join this, and that's fine and that's great for people, it works for people.
00:05:20.199 --> 00:05:31.800
And then sometimes over the years, you're like, this isn't working for me anymore, or I don't like it, or it's not how I want it to be, or I don't agree with something from any of the big companies that are out there.
00:05:32.040 --> 00:05:37.400
I just personally have been seeing a shift of people are applying a lot more to the mom and pop groups again.
00:05:37.639 --> 00:05:38.120
Oh, really?
00:05:38.280 --> 00:05:39.000
Oh, interesting.
00:05:39.160 --> 00:05:42.199
There was like a wall, there was a huge like COVID boom.
00:05:42.280 --> 00:05:46.840
Like I'd have like 300 applications a month, and I'm like, oh, this is too much.
00:05:47.079 --> 00:05:48.759
And then there was a huge dip.
00:05:48.920 --> 00:05:51.319
Probably around 2023, 24.
00:05:51.400 --> 00:05:53.160
It was like, oh, where's everybody go?
00:05:53.240 --> 00:05:59.480
And group practices were like, I can't find really good employees anymore, or 1099 contractors.
00:05:59.720 --> 00:06:01.560
Now we're seeing it kind of come again.
00:06:01.639 --> 00:06:06.360
So it was kind of like this, then it did this, and now we're seeing it kind of come back around.
00:06:06.439 --> 00:06:09.319
So that's one trend that I'm noticing.
00:06:09.879 --> 00:06:12.600
And especially, I guess, with the VC firms.
00:06:12.759 --> 00:06:16.759
I guess maybe they made it look real easy to just be in private practice by yourself.
00:06:16.840 --> 00:06:21.800
And essentially you're working for them as a group practice instead of these mom and pop group practices.
00:06:22.040 --> 00:06:26.120
But the problems that come with that is they change the rules on you midway.
00:06:26.280 --> 00:06:26.680
They can.
00:06:26.759 --> 00:06:30.439
Yeah, you know, things can change that no longer serve you.
00:06:30.680 --> 00:06:31.000
Right.
00:06:31.160 --> 00:06:32.600
And we all have to decide.
00:06:32.759 --> 00:06:37.079
Yeah, like where do we want to work, who we want to work with, work for.
00:06:37.400 --> 00:06:40.600
And sometimes it's you're gonna make choices based on ease.
00:06:40.759 --> 00:06:50.199
If you have chronic medical conditions, if you're just really needing to go where there's the best payout, and other people are like, I want to be local, or everyone has to choose.
00:06:50.439 --> 00:06:54.439
Everybody's gonna have just you know their opinions, but there's really no right or wrong.
00:06:54.680 --> 00:06:55.879
It's a really big place.
00:06:55.960 --> 00:07:00.120
We all have our space, businesses and capitalism, that's where we live, right?
00:07:00.199 --> 00:07:08.600
Like everybody can start something and it you want it to do well, but you also want it to serve the people that you're working with or for.
00:07:09.160 --> 00:07:21.319
And so I think that the changes that keep happening, even just insurance changes or the VC changes, it makes it harder for group practices to kind of survive.
00:07:21.480 --> 00:07:21.639
Yeah.
00:07:21.800 --> 00:07:31.639
And I consult a lot with group practice owners about people who are like, I am paying them more than I pay myself, or they need to close up because the financials don't work anymore.
00:07:32.199 --> 00:07:40.600
And the way that I started years ago was more of like a membership/slash collective kind of hybrid-y group, but not really, it's a little weird.
00:07:40.680 --> 00:07:43.720
It's like not really fitting into either category.
00:07:43.800 --> 00:07:46.600
It's a little collective and it's got some elements of a group.
00:07:46.759 --> 00:07:49.560
But I made that decision without knowing anything.
00:07:49.720 --> 00:08:05.480
And now looking back, I'm like, oh, that was a good decision for me and for the therapists that are in the collective or the group practice because they are feeling in charge and also they can charge what they want, but they also have support and they can come in under our contracts.
00:08:05.639 --> 00:08:09.639
They get a shmorvus board of like, you can choose what you're want, like choose your own adventure.
00:08:09.879 --> 00:08:18.600
And so they're happy and they really enjoy that kind of like independence with also coaching and mentoring and collaborative nature, but not too much.
00:08:18.920 --> 00:08:29.960
So I feel like now this is where things are going a lot for a lot of traditional group practices that are really struggling because people have expectations of I want$100 an hour.
00:08:30.120 --> 00:08:35.159
And it's like for an insurance group, that's not always possible, especially for an in-person practice.
00:08:35.240 --> 00:08:37.879
If they own at least a whole building, it's not possible, right?
00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:38.600
All the time.
00:08:39.000 --> 00:08:55.159
So I think things are definitely changing in how you can structure something and how you can work with different therapists, or for therapists looking to join something, like maybe there's something different out there that you can still earn a good living, but you also can be a part of something.
00:08:55.319 --> 00:09:07.639
So I've seen a lot of like co-ops being started, memberships being started, collectives being started, whether it's a group owned, owned by all the players that are in the collective or just owned by one owner.
00:09:07.799 --> 00:09:13.480
So there's a lot of interesting things out there now that there weren't at all like a decade ago.
00:09:13.720 --> 00:09:17.960
And I was gonna say, I mean, maybe you could elaborate on those different types of models a little bit more.
00:09:18.039 --> 00:09:20.680
Because I know you have a Facebook group and we'll put it in here.
00:09:20.759 --> 00:09:27.960
And I know you work with an attorney, a healthcare attorney, David, that does a ton of consulting around this stuff with you.
00:09:28.200 --> 00:09:33.720
And I know you're gonna be talking about it more, but I'd love if you could touch on a little bit like what is a collective versus a membership?
00:09:33.879 --> 00:09:45.799
If somebody's listening to this, even a group practice owner that's like, gosh, I need to like get with the times and maybe get a little more innovative with what I'm offering, like just like a brief, like what are the differences in those kinds of models?
00:09:46.120 --> 00:09:56.919
Even before going into that, because there's so much of like I've always told people don't limit yourself to what you could come up with because you could come up with something totally different.
00:09:57.080 --> 00:10:04.440
I think we sandwich ourselves into what is already there, that legally you can do a lot of things that are just maybe new and novel.
00:10:04.519 --> 00:10:13.480
So, like, you got an idea, like talk about it with a lawyer in your state and see if it can be legally done and that it works financially for you too.
00:10:13.720 --> 00:10:27.159
So the traditional group practice, whether it's online or in person, it's a building in person and it's a name on the building, and you usually employ the people who want to work there as a W-2.
00:10:27.480 --> 00:10:32.680
We see this in bigger community mental health centers and clinics and things like that, where you're a W-2.
00:10:32.919 --> 00:10:36.200
You come in, you get your employee information.
00:10:36.360 --> 00:10:39.639
Maybe there's benefits or not, maybe there's stipends for this or not.
00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:41.399
It just depends on the group.
00:10:41.720 --> 00:10:43.639
And that's your W-2 employer.
00:10:43.720 --> 00:10:49.560
They pay your payroll taxes, you work for them, they give you clients, they do marketing, they do billing.
00:10:49.720 --> 00:10:53.080
It's a lot of work and a lot of time and a lot of money that goes out.
00:10:53.159 --> 00:10:58.600
I think number one is people don't always realize the group owners are not raking in the box.
00:10:58.759 --> 00:10:59.879
I have to tell you.
00:11:00.840 --> 00:11:01.960
I believe it.
00:11:02.279 --> 00:11:05.960
I mean, I think you even said to me one time, like, Kim, why don't you start a group?
00:11:06.039 --> 00:11:07.320
Like, you could have a group so easy.
00:11:07.480 --> 00:11:09.159
I was like, hell no.
00:11:10.360 --> 00:11:12.039
You were like, not a chance.
00:11:12.279 --> 00:11:13.240
Am I doing that to myself?
00:11:13.799 --> 00:11:14.680
Nightmare.
00:11:15.320 --> 00:11:17.879
And it is for many people, but it works for you.
00:11:17.960 --> 00:11:20.120
I know you've got a great system and it works great for you.
00:11:20.360 --> 00:11:21.159
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:11:21.320 --> 00:11:23.159
Yeah, but it's not for everybody.
00:11:23.320 --> 00:11:25.560
You have to want to kind of work all the time.
00:11:25.720 --> 00:11:25.960
Yeah.
00:11:26.120 --> 00:11:30.919
You can get to a point, you know, where you have resistance and whatever, but it is a lot of work.
00:11:31.000 --> 00:11:34.120
And the hope is that you do make an income from your group.
00:11:34.360 --> 00:11:41.080
You want to make 25K extra, 100K extra, 200k extra from your group practice, and maybe even more.
00:11:41.399 --> 00:11:43.879
But it's not passive income, it's a lot of work.
00:11:43.960 --> 00:11:47.480
It's a lot of people moving parts from payroll to lawyers to whatever, right?
00:11:47.560 --> 00:11:49.480
So that's your traditional group practice.
00:11:49.799 --> 00:11:53.159
And some of them are struggling more than others these days.
00:11:53.399 --> 00:11:56.360
Then you have something that's like a membership, right?
00:11:56.919 --> 00:12:00.039
You have to kind of figure out well, what would the membership fee be?
00:12:00.120 --> 00:12:11.320
But maybe it's anywhere from$150 to$500 a month that you want to start something that's like a central hub, and maybe different people's independent practices can be seen from that.
00:12:11.560 --> 00:12:14.600
Maybe they get different tiers of what they can get in the membership.
00:12:14.759 --> 00:12:26.600
Maybe you can get supervision in a certain tier part of your membership, or maybe you get to join insurance contracts if that's something they have that you can bill under their tax ID and they take care of the insurance.
00:12:26.840 --> 00:12:37.879
Sometimes you'll hear now like the managed services like organizations, like the MSOs, and they're not gonna do the therapy, but they're gonna do the administrative work.
00:12:37.960 --> 00:12:40.680
So it's kind of like it's kind of like that in a way.
00:12:40.840 --> 00:12:42.279
We're gonna take care of all this for you.
00:12:42.360 --> 00:12:44.120
A lot of physicians have those types of groups.
00:12:44.279 --> 00:12:45.000
Oh, interesting.
00:12:45.240 --> 00:12:46.600
It's like a MSO.
00:12:46.680 --> 00:12:51.560
I know I'm not a lawyer, so don't quote me like this, but I'm just I know what I know and I know what I don't know.
00:12:51.799 --> 00:12:53.799
And so it's like you could do a membership.
00:12:53.960 --> 00:12:59.560
Of course, you need to figure out what you're gonna offer, what are your expenses, and what price point do you need people to buy in.
00:12:59.720 --> 00:13:06.440
But you don't really have a commission split or you don't have to worry about payroll that way or whatever it might be.
00:13:06.680 --> 00:13:10.200
It's just kind of like people joining in and collectively.
00:13:10.440 --> 00:13:13.399
Then there's like a collective, that's kind of what I am.
00:13:13.480 --> 00:13:17.399
I'm a little hybrid-y, like I said, I'm kind of a group and I'm kind of a collective.
00:13:18.039 --> 00:13:20.840
I should call it a group elective.
00:13:23.560 --> 00:13:24.200
I don't know.
00:13:24.360 --> 00:13:27.480
It's it's like a it's like a marketing services agreement, right?
00:13:27.560 --> 00:13:35.799
Okay it's hey, you're gonna kind of have a really low membership fee, and also there's gonna be a really high commission payout.
00:13:35.960 --> 00:13:42.039
You take your own clients, you see who you want to see, you work who you want to work however long you want, and there's like zero control.
00:13:42.680 --> 00:13:49.000
My practice as the collective is like collaborating with you as your own independent practice, right?
00:13:49.080 --> 00:13:53.560
So it's Kim Tolson LLC is collaborating with Synergy eTherapy.
00:13:53.799 --> 00:13:59.320
Very similar to like if you were to work for any of the EAPs that you're a contractor for, right?
00:13:59.399 --> 00:14:00.840
It's kind of the same idea.
00:14:01.560 --> 00:14:03.159
Not a lot of control over what you do.
00:14:03.320 --> 00:14:04.200
There's co-ops.
00:14:04.279 --> 00:14:05.799
I don't know as much about them.
00:14:05.960 --> 00:14:10.840
I know there's some people posting a lot in Facebook groups about co-ops where they're turning theirs into a co-op.
00:14:11.080 --> 00:14:19.399
So it's a cooperation and everybody is a member, so they all put in financially towards it, and then they all get out financially from it, right?
00:14:19.560 --> 00:14:31.799
Yeah, I don't know if that sounds really complicated because you gotta have like a mother and somebody running the ship or a captain, you gotta have somebody, otherwise it's like you have too many cooks in the kitchen.
00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:32.680
I don't know how that goes.
00:14:33.399 --> 00:14:35.080
But there's all these options, right?
00:14:35.159 --> 00:14:40.600
And then there's probably 10 others that we just haven't thought of yet that somebody will and we'll come up with it.
00:14:40.680 --> 00:14:53.000
It's a way for mom and pop, local therapists to be together and to do something that runs what they want to do with the therapy, but they're running a business in kind of the background, they're not doing it alone.
00:14:53.879 --> 00:14:55.799
Yeah, so interesting.
00:14:56.120 --> 00:14:59.000
So, do you think that these newer models?
00:14:59.080 --> 00:15:16.360
I mean, maybe they're not newer, they're just new to me, but these like more innovative kind of models are more attractive to maybe newer clinicians that are out there and maybe encouraging them to want to join one of these options instead of maybe doing a solo practice or even like a big tech option?
00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:17.320
Right.
00:15:17.560 --> 00:15:18.279
I think so.
00:15:18.440 --> 00:15:22.279
I'm starting to see it more and more just in the last year.
00:15:22.840 --> 00:15:29.159
Here in Minnesota, there's been some two very big insurances that are close to new practices.
00:15:29.560 --> 00:15:30.840
Luckily, we're in them.
00:15:31.000 --> 00:15:40.440
So we have a lot of therapists, seasoned therapists that have their own private practice that are like, can I just join your collective so I can join some EAPs and join some insurances?
00:15:40.519 --> 00:15:41.399
And I'm like, of course.
00:15:41.480 --> 00:15:43.720
You know, I obviously I know them or I vet them.
00:15:43.960 --> 00:15:45.000
But I'm like, of course.
00:15:45.159 --> 00:15:53.639
And that's one way to kind of work together and help other people to be able to see clients in the community that they can't through their own practice.
00:15:53.799 --> 00:15:57.080
And so I think that it's not always our choice.
00:15:57.159 --> 00:16:01.879
We're running into different obstacles that we weren't running into before.
00:16:02.120 --> 00:16:02.680
Yeah.
00:16:03.080 --> 00:16:05.000
Like especially these closed panels.
00:16:05.399 --> 00:16:23.000
Yeah, closed panels or different contracts that we might have, workers' comp or fit personal injury contracts that I get at better rates we can negotiate because we have some SciPAC psychologists, we have different therapists all over the country who are really good at doing assessment for PTSD and different things like that.
00:16:23.159 --> 00:16:30.440
So it's like I can get a good, good rate in the twos or above for like a master's level person that's not always heard of, right?
00:16:30.519 --> 00:16:39.480
So I'm like, well, we have doctorate and we have masters, so hey, we have so many people and I negotiate, and that's what I love to do is work on behalf of the clinicians.
00:16:39.560 --> 00:16:42.279
I always say in my group, they're my boss.
00:16:42.440 --> 00:16:43.799
Yeah, I'm not their boss.
00:16:44.039 --> 00:16:45.080
Yeah, I love that.
00:16:45.240 --> 00:16:46.600
They're my boss, each one of them.
00:16:46.759 --> 00:16:48.680
And so I'm like, what do you need from me?
00:16:48.840 --> 00:16:50.360
What can I do to make your life better?
00:16:50.519 --> 00:16:51.560
How can I help you?
00:16:51.720 --> 00:16:53.639
And like they're always like, huh?
00:16:54.759 --> 00:16:58.039
And I like send emails with like, here's what I'm thinking for the year.
00:16:58.200 --> 00:16:58.759
What do you like?
00:16:58.840 --> 00:16:59.399
What do you need?
00:16:59.480 --> 00:17:02.200
And people are always like, This is so refreshing or it's so nice.
00:17:02.840 --> 00:17:13.799
So I I do think that people are coming back around to like some of the mom and pop stuff because they're maybe realizing that some of the bigger things are not serving them as well anymore.
00:17:13.879 --> 00:17:24.680
It doesn't mean that they're not or that they're not helpful in some ways, but I am seeing as just kind of the trends where it was before really high in COVID, then it took a dip with everyone joining.
00:17:24.839 --> 00:17:32.200
And now people are missing the collaboration and they're missing the coaching and kind of the interpersonal stuff that comes along.
00:17:32.519 --> 00:17:35.240
And then there's other reasons people might want to join too.
00:17:35.319 --> 00:17:38.839
Like they can't get into insurance or they don't like the fees or rates with something.
00:17:39.160 --> 00:17:48.839
One thing that I'm doing lately because there's so many changes with lots of stuff going on out there in the world that you guys on Facebook might read about.
00:17:49.160 --> 00:17:52.120
We're not gonna get into it, but y'all know what we're talking about.
00:17:52.759 --> 00:17:54.839
Is I'm already in different insurances.
00:17:55.000 --> 00:17:58.839
Why can't I get into optimum and Aetna and Cigna?
00:17:59.079 --> 00:18:03.640
And I'm already in the like blue cross, and we're already in certain states with uh optum and Aetna.
00:18:03.799 --> 00:18:15.400
So why can't I, if I have national therapists, like they're licensed in 10 places or they live in different places, why can't I go ahead and get contracts like that and just start to add people under us like that?
00:18:15.799 --> 00:18:23.880
And I'm like asked my credentialing company, and they're like, sure, here's what you do with this one, and here's how it works with this one, and how many days and what's needed.
00:18:24.039 --> 00:18:30.839
And I'm like, oh, that doesn't sound so bad, or like you just need to add the license or add the states, and you don't need this or that, you know.
00:18:31.240 --> 00:18:32.279
It wasn't so complicated.
00:18:32.359 --> 00:18:34.039
So I'm like, gonna start that.
00:18:34.359 --> 00:18:40.599
I have it locally, and I have some other things locally to different states, but I'm gonna kind of see can I start to do that?
00:18:40.680 --> 00:18:45.000
Where if I have a therapist from one state and another therapist from another, they can come under that.
00:18:45.079 --> 00:18:46.680
We just need to add the state or something.
00:18:46.759 --> 00:18:48.039
So oh, interesting.
00:18:48.279 --> 00:18:52.359
I know, and that goes into like our multi-state course that we created a long time ago.
00:18:52.440 --> 00:18:59.960
Is like therapists need to know it's not just get insurance contracts in different states, but like you have to know the state laws, you have to know how that works.
00:19:00.039 --> 00:19:02.120
And Kim and I created a course years ago.
00:19:02.279 --> 00:19:10.839
I digress, but yes, yes, we did to help therapists that wanted to branch out and be multi-state or group practices that wanted to be multi-state, like Lisa's, right, for sure.
00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:13.400
It's we'll we'll link it down below if you guys want to check it out.
00:19:13.559 --> 00:19:15.960
It's perfect, it's a really helpful course.
00:19:16.200 --> 00:19:17.559
Yeah, so that's so innovative.
00:19:17.640 --> 00:19:25.559
So, what I'm hearing you say that like one, you're totally different than maybe a VC back to group practice that somebody's working for because you actually care.
00:19:25.799 --> 00:19:26.839
I mean, not that they don't care.
00:19:26.920 --> 00:19:27.559
I don't want to say that.
00:19:27.640 --> 00:19:30.759
We don't want to get troubled with anybody, but you actually care.
00:19:31.000 --> 00:19:32.839
I know them, I know them all.
00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:34.039
I know their lives.
00:19:34.200 --> 00:19:40.680
Yeah, like I know when somebody has a baby, I know when someone in their family passes away, I know when they're kind of struggling.
00:19:40.759 --> 00:19:43.079
So I don't hear from them in a while, and I'm like, how's it going?
00:19:43.240 --> 00:19:46.680
Or, you know, we have summits every year that we've had in person.
00:19:46.759 --> 00:19:50.359
So I literally get to hug them and see them, whoever comes.
00:19:50.440 --> 00:19:54.680
And I have true, real joy in friendship and relationships with them all.
00:19:54.920 --> 00:19:58.359
I don't have to have anybody in the collective if I don't want to.
00:19:58.440 --> 00:20:03.799
It's not that like, oh, I have 3,000 people on a wait list from Georgia, so I'm just gonna take anybody.
00:20:04.039 --> 00:20:05.160
It doesn't work that way.
00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:10.359
So I really get to choose who I really enjoy, who's ethical, who's a good person.
00:20:10.759 --> 00:20:13.799
Just seems like a person that's just easy to get along with.
00:20:13.880 --> 00:20:17.160
There's zero drama, none at all ever.
00:20:17.400 --> 00:20:26.039
And so it's really a joy to be able to like be friends with my colleagues because, like I said, they're my bosses.
00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:27.480
Yeah, I love that.
00:20:27.640 --> 00:20:30.759
And I actually got to go to one of Lisa's summits, which was so fun.
00:20:31.000 --> 00:20:34.759
We rode one of those double bikes on the broadwalk of Hollywood beach.
00:20:38.599 --> 00:20:42.759
Yeah, it was really fun, but I could see the culture, is what I'm saying.
00:20:42.839 --> 00:20:45.079
Like I could see that you've nurtured that a lot.
00:20:45.240 --> 00:20:54.599
And I think maybe somebody listening to this that is a group practice owner that's worried about clinicians leaving and going, I mean, that is that unique thing that you're offering.
00:20:54.839 --> 00:21:03.960
If you can nurture and really help your employees or whatever they are to you, depending on what model you have, establish themselves and have a career and feel comfortable with you.
00:21:04.039 --> 00:21:08.759
You know, if you can get that culture going, I think that helps with the success of a group practice.
00:21:09.000 --> 00:21:09.240
Yeah.
00:21:09.480 --> 00:21:10.359
I think so too.
00:21:10.519 --> 00:21:11.319
I help people.
00:21:11.400 --> 00:21:18.759
So if you're struggling as a solo practitioner or you want to figure out what you want to join, or you want to figure out how to expand, I'm happy to help.
00:21:18.839 --> 00:21:24.200
I'm not a lawyer, I'm not an accountant, but like I know enough to be dangerous and at least give you pointers.
00:21:24.519 --> 00:21:24.839
Yeah.
00:21:25.000 --> 00:21:29.000
Well, I know you've helped hundreds and hundreds of therapists build out their group practices.
00:21:29.240 --> 00:21:30.440
So it's amazing.
00:21:30.680 --> 00:21:31.319
Yeah.
00:21:31.640 --> 00:21:35.079
So what can therapists do to sustain themselves?
00:21:35.240 --> 00:21:40.759
Is the answer join a group practice that offers all the bells and whistles so you don't have to like figure it all out on your own?
00:21:40.839 --> 00:21:42.279
Or what do you think about that?
00:21:42.440 --> 00:21:42.920
Yeah.
00:21:43.160 --> 00:21:44.120
Maybe, yeah.
00:21:44.519 --> 00:21:45.480
For some of you.
00:21:45.720 --> 00:21:48.039
For some of you, it might be more of a collective.
00:21:48.200 --> 00:22:00.120
For some of you, it might just be your own solo practice in person, rent an office and get your own insurance contracts and be totally on your own that way and just kind of join some consultation groups.
00:22:00.359 --> 00:22:17.559
There's no right or wrong, but I want people to really think about what makes them thrive and what makes you burn out less fast, and what gives you joy, and what gives you financial freedom, and what kinds of things maybe you want to diversify.
00:22:17.640 --> 00:22:20.440
I mean, Kim is the diversification queen.
00:22:21.160 --> 00:22:22.680
I'm like, what are you doing today?
00:22:22.920 --> 00:22:25.799
She's like, 12 things, what like no big deal.
00:22:26.039 --> 00:22:27.000
I don't know how you do it.
00:22:27.400 --> 00:22:30.680
And I do a lot too, but I do I think you far surpass me.
00:22:30.759 --> 00:22:33.880
So it's like you have to know what makes you thrive and tick.
00:22:34.039 --> 00:22:36.359
And so it could be any one of these things.
00:22:36.519 --> 00:22:38.279
There's no real right or wrong.
00:22:38.440 --> 00:22:43.079
Your friend might tell you what's right or wrong, or your colleagues on Facebook are sure gonna have opinions.
00:22:43.160 --> 00:22:43.400
Yeah.
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:45.160
But you get to decide for yourself.
00:22:45.240 --> 00:22:53.559
And I think that's the biggest takeaway is like try something out for a little bit and see if try your own solo practice, see if you can get an insurance contract.
00:22:53.720 --> 00:22:58.359
Try some of the VC groups if you want, try a local group practice or join a collective.
00:22:58.599 --> 00:22:59.240
Try it out.
00:22:59.400 --> 00:23:00.759
You can always change, you know.
00:23:00.839 --> 00:23:01.000
Yeah.
00:23:01.240 --> 00:23:04.200
Yeah, it's kind of frustrating or hard if somebody comes in and out.
00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:07.880
But think about it and really process it and give it a try.
00:23:08.120 --> 00:23:09.319
Yeah, absolutely.
00:23:09.480 --> 00:23:09.799
Yeah.
00:23:09.960 --> 00:23:16.200
And if you are working in a situation that changes all of a sudden, you can pivot.
00:23:16.359 --> 00:23:18.599
I mean, there's so many options.
00:23:18.920 --> 00:23:20.039
You can pivot, you know.
00:23:20.279 --> 00:23:33.559
If you don't like it anymore, just do your due diligence with your clients and make sure everybody's transitioning, however, you're going to transition people, whether it's to solo group or VC company, whatever you're going to do, and make sure that your clients are taken care of.
00:23:33.640 --> 00:23:41.799
And also, if you guys need extra support, there's lots of us that help coach and mentor give consultation in lots of different ways.
00:23:42.039 --> 00:23:43.880
You don't have to rewrite the wheel.
00:23:44.279 --> 00:23:48.120
A lot of us have already ridden that truck or that boat.
00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:49.559
Like tap into all of us.
00:23:49.640 --> 00:23:56.039
We have lots of knowledge and what didn't work, what did work, and we can at least help you maybe avoid some pitfalls or what to think about.
00:23:56.200 --> 00:23:57.400
Could be pitfalls.
00:23:57.640 --> 00:23:58.359
Absolutely.
00:23:58.680 --> 00:24:00.440
And could you could you share?
00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:04.680
Because we also like to talk about on this podcast, like the entrepreneurial side of this stuff.
00:24:04.839 --> 00:24:05.640
So could you share?
00:24:05.720 --> 00:24:16.440
I mean, aside from being a mom of two and having a husband and all that that you do, you're such a great, like, mother and wife and caretaker and all that.
00:24:16.599 --> 00:24:18.200
And then you've got your practice.
00:24:18.359 --> 00:24:24.440
You've also got this entrepreneurial side where you've got courses and a Facebook group and coaching that you do.
00:24:24.680 --> 00:24:27.160
Maybe you could talk about your courses and what they are.
00:24:27.319 --> 00:24:39.319
And we'd have to get all into like how'd you develop them and all that stuff, but just like what are they and how do they help therapists that might be listening to this and want to build their own model of a group practice like you're talking about?
00:24:39.480 --> 00:24:40.120
Yeah.
00:24:40.519 --> 00:24:40.920
Yeah.
00:24:41.079 --> 00:24:42.200
I think thank you.
00:24:42.279 --> 00:24:42.519
Yes.
00:24:42.680 --> 00:24:45.079
I have all those other roles in my life.
00:24:45.240 --> 00:24:51.880
And I'm sure somebody in my family would prefer that I, you know, add somebody that can actually like pick up my stuff.
00:24:52.039 --> 00:24:54.519
You should see my office and clean up a little bit.
00:24:54.839 --> 00:24:56.519
Or maybe, you know, cook dinners.
00:24:56.599 --> 00:24:56.920
I don't know.
00:24:57.000 --> 00:24:57.960
We don't do that anymore.
00:24:58.200 --> 00:24:59.400
Uh, you have to pick and choose.
00:24:59.640 --> 00:25:01.799
I mean, come on, what do they expect from you?
00:25:02.039 --> 00:25:03.400
I know, I don't know.
00:25:03.799 --> 00:25:05.720
Thank Godness I have an amazing husband.
00:25:05.880 --> 00:25:07.640
He is uh so great and supportive.
00:25:07.799 --> 00:25:09.319
But I have courses, you know.
00:25:09.400 --> 00:25:15.559
I wrote a book when I was grieving about bubble breathing and for kids and emotion regulation.
00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:20.279
I have a local charity nonprofit here called Shout Out Loud for Suicide Prevention.
00:25:20.440 --> 00:25:22.519
We do stuff all year, every year.
00:25:22.759 --> 00:25:30.519
And so the courses I created pretty much right around COVID time when people kept asking the same things and needing consultation.
00:25:30.599 --> 00:25:33.880
And I was like, you know what, let me just develop an on-demand course.
00:25:34.200 --> 00:25:39.720
I have lots of different options for just what to think about in building an online group practice.
00:25:39.880 --> 00:25:44.519
I have things with privacy policy people that help me at the beginning create my policies.
00:25:44.599 --> 00:25:49.720
I have different lawyers that are talking about things that you might want to think about.
00:25:50.680 --> 00:25:54.200
I have the multi-state course with you that we put together.
00:25:54.680 --> 00:26:01.880
I have like a mini course that just kind of gives you accounting and legal and like my whole like um spider web.
00:26:02.039 --> 00:26:06.120
It's like here's the spider web of all the different parts of building an online practice.
00:26:06.279 --> 00:26:08.519
I don't uh I don't remember what I called it at this point.
00:26:08.920 --> 00:26:10.440
And then I have like the whole shebang.
00:26:10.599 --> 00:26:15.240
There's like three hours of marketing your practice, or there's stuff about hiring virtual assistants.
00:26:15.319 --> 00:26:17.079
It's kind of like everything in it.
00:26:17.240 --> 00:26:17.480
Yeah.
00:26:17.640 --> 00:26:25.960
I just want people to kind of know a little bit about a lot of things, and then they can go and run with it and open up their own or get consultation.
00:26:26.120 --> 00:26:32.359
It kind of cuts down a lot of the work for them if they want to build their own in-person or online practice at this point.
00:26:32.440 --> 00:26:37.319
Everybody's basically online, so it's not as unique and as special as it used to be, you know?
00:26:37.640 --> 00:26:44.440
So it's like, oh, even I went and got a little office for my synergy therapist here in Minneapolis and down in YZM, Minnesota.
00:26:44.519 --> 00:26:44.839
Yeah.
00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:45.480
Yeah.
00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:51.000
I just curious what made you make that decision after being an online therapist for so long.
00:26:51.160 --> 00:26:53.160
I mean, maybe that would be helpful to the listeners too.
00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:53.480
Yeah.
00:26:53.720 --> 00:26:57.079
Because you I mean, online, I mean, that was like your thing with your practice.
00:26:57.400 --> 00:26:59.720
That was the thing, and now I'm pivoting.
00:26:59.799 --> 00:27:00.440
You know why?
00:27:00.680 --> 00:27:02.519
Because times are changing, girl.
00:27:02.759 --> 00:27:04.039
Like I have to pivot.
00:27:04.120 --> 00:27:12.120
And this is what I want everybody to realize is like synergy e-therapy and it's e-therapy, which a therapy is what I called it in 2016, because there wasn't anything.
00:27:12.200 --> 00:27:12.839
I didn't know anything.
00:27:12.920 --> 00:27:13.160
Yeah.
00:27:13.400 --> 00:27:14.839
Would I call it something different now?
00:27:15.000 --> 00:27:18.839
Probably, because nobody realizes there's an E there and what's the E mean and whatever.
00:27:19.079 --> 00:27:21.240
But yeah, so I'm like, you know what?
00:27:21.319 --> 00:27:31.240
There were a lot of therapists in my group that were no longer being able to get into some of the better EAPs that paid better, sent a lot more clients, and they're like, All right, do you have an in-person office?
00:27:31.319 --> 00:27:32.599
And we're like, no, no, no.
00:27:32.759 --> 00:27:44.519
So I'm like, okay, well, I'm seeing times are changing, and we have an in-person address, but it wasn't a place that people were seeing clients, like my dad and sister-in-law, and my brother's office.
00:27:44.599 --> 00:27:48.599
You know, it's like it's I could if I needed to, but it's not the space that we're gonna see clients.
00:27:48.839 --> 00:27:49.720
I think it's time.
00:27:49.880 --> 00:27:52.920
Like, how do I want to spend my marketing dollars?
00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:55.319
What do I think is gonna be a good return on investment?
00:27:55.559 --> 00:27:58.039
What do I think is gonna be good for my therapists?
00:27:58.120 --> 00:27:59.960
And it's amongst a co-working space.
00:28:00.039 --> 00:28:02.680
So we have our own office in this beautiful space.
00:28:02.920 --> 00:28:04.039
They have a conference room.
00:28:04.120 --> 00:28:05.000
We did our summit there.
00:28:05.079 --> 00:28:09.960
It's right on the lake in Minnesota, and it's down in this cute town with lots of restaurants and shops.
00:28:10.039 --> 00:28:24.920
And I'm like, this is dangerous, but it's also really fun, and it's networking, and it's kind of like the resurgence of some in-person, and it allows my therapist a chance to be in office without having to spend their own time leasing it or whatnot.
00:28:25.079 --> 00:28:33.799
They do pay into it based on how many days they want to join the co-working space in the office we have, so it's not free to them, but it's part of a membership, right?
00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:37.480
This is part of the collective membership hybrid e-group model that I created.
00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:38.519
So it's very cool.
00:28:38.680 --> 00:28:39.400
They are loving it.
00:28:39.480 --> 00:28:44.519
I have two therapists so far that are taken up three days a week, and I'll just keep telling people more.
00:28:44.599 --> 00:28:55.559
And they're in our insurance contracts, and it's like, here's all the things you can do, and we can try to get them into different EAPs that send clients and get them more and more gross that they want.
00:28:55.640 --> 00:28:57.720
So it's you can't stick to your guns all the time.
00:28:57.799 --> 00:29:00.920
I can't just be like, what happened to me being the only one online?
00:29:01.079 --> 00:29:01.640
You know, yeah.
00:29:01.799 --> 00:29:06.039
No, now it's not that exciting, and everybody wants to go back in person, you know, kind of thing.
00:29:06.200 --> 00:29:08.039
So I'm giving it an option.
00:29:08.359 --> 00:29:09.319
Oh, that's so cool.
00:29:09.480 --> 00:29:11.400
Now, do you think you'll put it in other states?
00:29:11.480 --> 00:29:13.559
Because you're you have clinicians in how many states?
00:29:13.720 --> 00:29:14.599
I can't even remember.
00:29:14.680 --> 00:29:19.720
It's 40 substates, licensed in 45, I'm sure, states.
00:29:19.799 --> 00:29:20.839
I'm sure it's out there.
00:29:21.319 --> 00:29:23.400
But physically, I I don't know.
00:29:23.480 --> 00:29:25.400
I have to actually do that math.
00:29:25.559 --> 00:29:27.720
I would say probably 20 different states.
00:29:28.279 --> 00:29:34.200
And then some of the therapists on their own, because it's their own practice, they are getting an office space to rent here and there.
00:29:34.359 --> 00:29:39.240
So they are still doing it under Synergy's umbrella, but they have an in-person office.
00:29:39.319 --> 00:29:42.200
So we have an in-person addendum intake form, right?
00:29:42.279 --> 00:29:45.640
Of like understanding like this is theirs, this is ours.
00:29:45.799 --> 00:29:49.240
So keeping everything nice and legal and you know how it is.
00:29:49.400 --> 00:29:58.519
But yeah, I think some of them are dipping their toes into getting some in-person time, not like renting it by the hour or by a day in their state.
00:29:58.759 --> 00:30:03.720
Synergy has office space to rent in South Carolina.
00:30:04.039 --> 00:30:04.599
Oh, right.
00:30:04.680 --> 00:30:04.839
Okay.
00:30:05.160 --> 00:30:07.079
Because some of our insurance contracts are there.
00:30:07.160 --> 00:30:14.680
So like we can actually book some rooms in two different areas in South Carolina if we wanted to, but we do have to pay for that extra.
00:30:14.920 --> 00:30:18.759
So I have two addresses there that are physical spaces and we have to just rent it.
00:30:18.920 --> 00:30:30.359
So like maybe I'm thinking like if there's a place where there's a lot of therapists and we need a synergy office there, that's but people are so spread out, and that's the problem.
00:30:31.559 --> 00:30:31.720
Yeah.
00:30:31.880 --> 00:30:32.359
So I don't know.
00:30:32.519 --> 00:30:32.839
We'll see.
00:30:33.160 --> 00:30:34.680
I'm gonna start here and see how it goes.
00:30:34.759 --> 00:30:40.440
I might like maybe get another one in a different city in Minnesota and just kind of see how it goes here.
00:30:40.599 --> 00:30:41.079
Yeah.
00:30:41.319 --> 00:30:42.839
Yeah, that's so interesting.
00:30:43.000 --> 00:30:43.559
Oh my gosh.
00:30:43.720 --> 00:30:43.960
Yeah.
00:30:44.120 --> 00:30:48.680
The other thing I just want to talk about before we run is the technology, the technology piece.
00:30:48.759 --> 00:30:54.279
Since this is the berries podcast, you know, a lot of times we always want to say, like, are you using technology at all?
00:30:54.440 --> 00:31:01.480
Are you using AI to help you like run this whole intricate system that you're doing or for note-taking, documentation, anything like that?
00:31:01.559 --> 00:31:05.880
We love to just hear how people are using AI in their businesses.
00:31:06.200 --> 00:31:11.720
Well, ironically, I am using berries, but I began using berries.
00:31:12.200 --> 00:31:15.240
Was I using berries before you were using berries?
00:31:15.319 --> 00:31:16.599
Or was I using berries?
00:31:17.079 --> 00:31:17.799
I don't know.
00:31:18.200 --> 00:31:19.559
After you were using berries?
00:31:19.720 --> 00:31:20.200
I've not sure.
00:31:20.440 --> 00:31:21.240
I don't remember.
00:31:21.799 --> 00:31:25.799
I tried out years ago, a year or two ago.
00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:30.519
I don't know how long it was, but I tried out several note-taking ones.
00:31:30.839 --> 00:31:33.240
And I was like, eh, I didn't like this, I didn't like that.
00:31:33.400 --> 00:31:38.120
And I landed on berries and I talked to the owners who I just adore.
00:31:38.279 --> 00:31:43.960
They're just so kind and nice and very therapist-oriented and just great people.
00:31:44.120 --> 00:31:51.000
And I was like, Well, the technology works right for me because you can put it on in the background, but go into any application.
00:31:51.480 --> 00:31:57.160
And it was so easy to do that, and they've just expanded so much in all their offerings inside of berries.
00:31:57.240 --> 00:32:02.039
So then I'm doing it and I'm like, hey, you guys in my group, I'm like, you should try this.
00:32:02.279 --> 00:32:04.120
And then like they tried it.
00:32:04.279 --> 00:32:12.599
There's probably at least 10 of them, I think seven to ten or something like that, that are using berries now, and they're like, I will never go back.
00:32:14.599 --> 00:32:17.079
You know, like I, you know, it's so good.
00:32:17.160 --> 00:32:20.519
And it like, it's key, it just oh, it's so good.
00:32:20.680 --> 00:32:25.799
I think it's really good for interns or students to really learn how to write notes, learn what needs to be in there.
00:32:25.960 --> 00:32:30.519
But for licensed clinicians who already have done this for decades, it's like, no, this is helpful.
00:32:30.680 --> 00:32:36.920
Yeah, let's get the treatment plan, let's just consult with AI, let's get the diagnoses, let's see what's going on.
00:32:37.079 --> 00:32:39.640
We use it for so many more things than therapy.
00:32:39.799 --> 00:32:48.039
Yeah, you know, workers' comp, or if you just need a certain templated form, but you can't run it in the background due to some contracts we have, we can't have it.
00:32:48.279 --> 00:32:54.440
You can at least put some content information in there and it'll spit it out in the note in the way that you need it.
00:32:54.680 --> 00:32:56.680
There's just so many ways to use it.
00:32:56.759 --> 00:33:01.319
So berries is what we're using, and I'm not even saying that because I'm on this punk.
00:33:01.880 --> 00:33:04.599
I'm like, we didn't pay her to say that for real.
00:33:04.839 --> 00:33:10.279
No, I get paid none to say this, but it's because I really, I really like it.
00:33:10.440 --> 00:33:13.079
I really like it, and I used a lot and I didn't like many of them.
00:33:13.400 --> 00:33:13.799
I love that.
00:33:13.960 --> 00:33:21.000
And then I mean, Chat GPT has been my friend, my best friend for a little while here when I'm like struggling with something.
00:33:21.079 --> 00:33:22.519
Can you put this a certain way?
00:33:22.759 --> 00:33:23.079
Yeah.
00:33:23.319 --> 00:33:25.799
I know people are using like Claude and whatever.
00:33:25.880 --> 00:33:28.599
I'm also using in Gmail.
00:33:28.759 --> 00:33:31.400
If people don't know about it, it's called Google Studio.
00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:37.319
If you have Google Workspace, it's an AI thing that is helping me to answer and reply to emails.
00:33:37.400 --> 00:33:45.640
It doesn't send it, but it auto-replies in my voice with stuff I've said at any point in time in my email.
00:33:45.799 --> 00:33:46.039
Yeah.
00:33:46.279 --> 00:33:50.680
And I'm like, oh my god, it'll say something like, like just something crazy.
00:33:50.759 --> 00:33:53.799
Like, I'm like, oh my God, I remember that from forever ago.
00:33:53.880 --> 00:34:02.519
Or it'll pull in like an EAP number or a fax number or my gosh, from anything it saw in my emails from forever ago.
00:34:02.759 --> 00:34:09.559
And that has been super helpful because you know me, I'm always trying to figure out how I can clone myself and I yet to do it.
00:34:09.880 --> 00:34:13.400
And I'm just figuring out how and who's gonna help.
00:34:13.480 --> 00:34:23.400
And I still think I need an actual human beings to do the things I need, but I also want to really automate a lot of stuff if I can that is you know gonna be helpful.
00:34:23.559 --> 00:34:25.960
So I'm using it, I'm not great at it.
00:34:26.039 --> 00:34:31.239
So I don't know, like you are a wizard in AI, but I'm learning from you, and then you'll tell me something.
00:34:31.319 --> 00:34:32.839
I'm like, I don't even know what you're saying.
00:34:33.079 --> 00:34:34.599
Just I don't even know.
00:34:34.920 --> 00:34:38.199
You're like do what?
00:34:38.359 --> 00:34:39.239
Tell it to say what?
00:34:39.399 --> 00:34:40.279
Like, never mind.
00:34:41.079 --> 00:34:42.439
Too complicated.
00:34:44.279 --> 00:34:46.599
So, you know, you are so good for this.
00:34:46.679 --> 00:34:56.759
So people want to use AI, like you have so many clubs and memberships, and it's you make it so easy of like this is what they can do if they want social media or whatever.
00:34:56.919 --> 00:35:01.559
I'm sure my VA is doing something with AI for social media or trying to put stuff together.
00:35:01.639 --> 00:35:04.759
We use Canva AI or different things like that, you know.
00:35:04.839 --> 00:35:07.079
So as much as we can, that feels good for us.
00:35:07.799 --> 00:35:08.279
Nice.
00:35:08.519 --> 00:35:09.159
Love that.
00:35:09.399 --> 00:35:13.719
Now, as a group practice owner, you said seven or ten of your clinicians.
00:35:13.879 --> 00:35:15.799
Now, are you giving them berries?
00:35:15.879 --> 00:35:18.599
Is that like a perk or do they do berries on their own?
00:35:18.759 --> 00:35:21.879
Like I just wonder like the strategy for group practice owners with that sort of thing.
00:35:22.279 --> 00:35:22.439
Yeah.
00:35:22.679 --> 00:35:26.039
Well, I know that you can purchase berries as a group.
00:35:26.119 --> 00:35:31.879
You'll just need to talk to the owners to figure out like how many people you have and all the pricing.
00:35:31.959 --> 00:35:33.000
I couldn't tell anybody.
00:35:33.079 --> 00:35:34.039
I'm sure it's different.
00:35:34.199 --> 00:35:34.519
Yeah.
00:35:34.839 --> 00:35:40.039
But right now, what I have is like a coupon for the therapist in my group.
00:35:40.119 --> 00:35:46.919
So they have to still pay for it on their own, but they do get a discount from being in Synergy, which is really nice.
00:35:47.159 --> 00:35:47.639
Oh, nice.
00:35:47.799 --> 00:35:48.039
Okay.
00:35:48.279 --> 00:35:49.959
So I'm not paying for it.
00:35:50.119 --> 00:35:52.519
I have to be careful with all the things I would pay for.
00:35:52.599 --> 00:36:02.519
But if you're like a W-2 group and you do want to pay for things, this could be really good, especially for your chart audits and for insurance, very all that stuff that insurance needs.
00:36:02.679 --> 00:36:05.719
So they do group like portals.
00:36:05.879 --> 00:36:09.799
I'm sure they'll come up with something that meets your needs with what you need.
00:36:09.959 --> 00:36:10.839
Kind of like they did.
00:36:11.000 --> 00:36:11.559
Yeah, for me.
00:36:11.719 --> 00:36:14.359
They're really flexible, like, oh, we could try this or try that.
00:36:14.519 --> 00:36:14.599
Yeah.
00:36:15.000 --> 00:36:24.919
Because you know, being in Synergy, yeah, I want people to be like, there's lots of reasons to join the Synergy group or collective and look at all these things, you know, that they get.
00:36:25.079 --> 00:36:26.039
So yeah.
00:36:26.279 --> 00:36:26.519
Cool.
00:36:26.599 --> 00:36:29.319
Yeah, I wasn't sure how you were using it or or offering it.
00:36:29.479 --> 00:36:31.319
I've heard a lot of different variations on that.
00:36:31.399 --> 00:36:32.599
So I'm already super curious.
00:36:33.079 --> 00:36:33.799
That's so cool, right?
00:36:34.039 --> 00:36:35.559
They can do what they want with it.
00:36:35.879 --> 00:36:37.000
Yeah, it's very cool.
00:36:37.159 --> 00:36:37.399
Yeah.
00:36:37.559 --> 00:36:37.879
Yeah.
00:36:38.119 --> 00:36:40.599
I mean, some people are like what you said with interns and stuff.
00:36:40.679 --> 00:36:44.359
They're like, I don't want my interns to use it, but I want the clinicians to use it, or right.
00:36:44.599 --> 00:36:46.679
We use it for supervision, like that kind of thing.
00:36:46.759 --> 00:36:51.959
So it's interesting to hear how different practices their takes on it, really.
00:36:52.119 --> 00:36:53.159
Yeah, it's just neat.
00:36:53.239 --> 00:36:53.959
It's neat to hear.
00:36:54.039 --> 00:36:54.359
Yeah.
00:36:54.599 --> 00:36:57.079
Well, thank you so much for coming today.
00:36:57.319 --> 00:36:58.679
How do people find you?
00:36:58.919 --> 00:37:02.039
They want to like join your Facebook group or take your courses.
00:37:02.199 --> 00:37:03.479
Where do they go to find you?
00:37:03.959 --> 00:37:09.879
So the main one I moderate and kind of rehashing a little bit is how to build an online therapy group practice.
00:37:10.199 --> 00:37:14.919
I don't know when this podcast will come out, but it might be titled something a little different at that point.
00:37:15.079 --> 00:37:25.399
But I have two others therapists looking to join a group practice, and that's very organic-y, like just therapists that are looking to join a group practice, and group practice is looking to hire.
00:37:25.559 --> 00:37:30.359
There's the telehealth providers group, which is kind of everybody and it's really all over the world, really.
00:37:30.439 --> 00:37:33.239
It's not too much movement in there like the other two.
00:37:33.479 --> 00:37:37.079
And then my website, synergyetherapy.com.
00:37:37.239 --> 00:37:42.359
You can email me, dr lisa dr l Isa at synergyetherapy.com.
00:37:42.519 --> 00:37:45.079
I do answer all my emails eventually.
00:37:45.479 --> 00:37:47.799
She does now, but we're working on that.
00:37:48.039 --> 00:37:49.399
We're working on that.
00:37:49.719 --> 00:37:51.799
I got it down for 500 to 200.
00:37:52.039 --> 00:37:52.679
So I'm great.
00:37:52.839 --> 00:37:53.719
Um, very happy.
00:37:53.879 --> 00:37:56.359
Yeah, so you can just reach out that way.
00:37:56.599 --> 00:38:00.439
Of course, follow us on social media at Synergy ETherapy.
00:38:00.599 --> 00:38:02.679
It's Instagram, I'm on LinkedIn.
00:38:02.839 --> 00:38:06.519
If you like more business networking that way, we have a synergy there too.
00:38:06.919 --> 00:38:07.159
Nice.
00:38:07.719 --> 00:38:08.839
Yeah, lots of ways.
00:38:09.000 --> 00:38:14.439
And I'm here to help and answer any questions and provide any guidance I can.
00:38:14.759 --> 00:38:16.119
Thank you so much.
00:38:16.359 --> 00:38:17.000
Thank you.
00:38:17.239 --> 00:38:18.519
Always fun talking to you.
00:38:18.759 --> 00:38:19.319
You too.
00:38:23.799 --> 00:38:29.159
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