The Cold War: America's Forgotten Conflict

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Good morning.
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I'm Larry Zilliox, Director of Culinary Services here at the Warrior Retreat at Bull Run, and this week we're continuing our series on military-themed museums here in the Northern Virginia area.
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We've previously done the Marine Corps Museum and the Army Museum and I'm really excited to have our guest, gary Powers Jr, who's the chairman of the Cold War Museum, and probably most of our listeners have not heard of the Cold War Museum and that may be in part because we have listeners all over the world.
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The most surprising thing to me the other day that I saw in our statistics was that 5% of our listeners are in Germany, and I don't know why.
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I'm thinking maybe service members that are stationed there, but the Cold War Museum is located at Vint Hill in Warrington, virginia, which is Fauquier County.
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It's right close to us here.
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It's been there for a good while and I have been out there at least four times.
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Our warriors will go and take tours, but I love to go.
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It's fascinating.
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This Vent Hill, which is an old Army base, is fascinating in and of itself.
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Gary, welcome to the podcast.
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Well, Larry, thank you very much for having me on.
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It's a pleasure to be here.
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You have a wonderful facility and I'm looking forward to talking shop with you about Cold War history and why we did the Cold War Museum Well, that was really kind of.
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My very first question was how did the idea for the Cold War Museum come up?
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Back in 1992, I moved to Virginia from California.
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Okay.
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I'm doing my graduate degree at George Mason University in public administration, nonprofit management, I start to give lectures in the Northern Virginia area on the U-2 incident.
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My dad, gary Powers, u-2 pilot, shot down May 1st of 1960 over the Soviet Union.
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I'm going into classrooms, I'm giving a talk on the U-2 incident.
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I get blank stares from the kids.
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They think I'm there to talk about the U-2 rock band.
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And so I'm realizing hey, something has to be done to preserve Cold War history.
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Then, through the research I've done over the last 40 plus years to find out the truth of what my father went through, I realized that he's famous, he's in the history books, he's gotten accolades posthumously for his participation in the Cold War U2 program, but that there were hundreds of thousands of other men and women, our veterans, who fought, sacrificed, some of who died during the Cold War time period the Cold War was not always cold that they were not getting the recognition that I thought they deserved for helping to win the Cold War between 45 and 91.
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So you combine those two aspects of educating the kids, honoring the veterans, and we founded the Cold War Museum in 1996 to honor veterans, preserve history, educate future generations.
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Wow.
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Well, I can say it's located at Vent Hill and I think what's fascinating about Vent Hill it's not just any old military base.
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So tell our listeners a little bit about the background of Vent Hill and how it came to be so important in World War II.
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Oh sure.
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Well, Vent V-I-N-T Hill H-I-L-L, v-i-n-t Hill H-I-L-L.
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Vent.
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Hill Farms was the original farm location owned by a farmer and his family back in the World War II era.
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He was a ham radio operator and he would be able to pick up signals from Japan, from Germany, from Italy, from other countries around the world.
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So he invites one of his friends over one night for a cigar and a bourbon and he says hey, general, so-and-so, guess what I can pick up on my shortwave radio.
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So the general, his eyes get really wide because he's hearing German and or Italian taxi cab stands and Japanese signals and he's thinking what is going on here?
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We need to have this location as a listening post to pick up international signals to monitor our enemies during World War II.
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So they reach a deal.
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I think they sell it to the farmer, sells it to the government for about $120,000 in 1942.
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So that was a chunk of change.
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Yeah, and Vent Hill Farm Station was birthed.
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So Vint Hill Farm Station was active from World War II up through about 1997.
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In World War II it was monitoring the Japanese, the German, the Italians.
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In the Cold War it was monitoring Russia, china and everybody else.
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They had lots of antennas on the property.
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Many pointed at Washington DC to pick up the embassy communications.
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In addition, for whatever reason the topography, the granite soil composition it's a natural receiver.
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So it would pick up international signals from around the world and during the Cold War that was very important to find out what our enemies were doing.
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So it was functional between 1942-43 to 1997.
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It was housed and staffed by members of NSA, cia and Army Security Agency, asa.
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It was known as the listening post number one and so that's what it did.
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It listened to things around the world.
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It was closed in 97, a BRAC Base Realignment and Closure Act.
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It sat vacant for a few years.
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Then the governor of Virginia in the early 2000s basically said we have to do something with this property.
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They created the Vent Hill Economic Development Authority.
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It was chaired by Ike Broadus who is one of the owners of the brewery on site, the old Busthead Brewery.
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He came from a real estate background in Northern Virginia.
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I happen to have known Ike because my mother-in-law worked for him back in the 2000 era small world syndrome and he was able to put this board and commission together.
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They redeveloped the properties.
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They sold off some sections.
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Now there's homes, there's vacant land for real estate investors.
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There's winery, a brewery, the Cold War Museum, there's a pizza place and some other small shops.
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There's a covert cafe and there's a fine dining restaurant that's just come online the last few months, so it's really grown over the last 12, 15 years.
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It's a great place.
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It's actually a Warrington address, but it's right next to Gainesville.
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Yeah.
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So Warrington's still another 20 minutes away from where we're located.
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Yeah, that's the postal designation, correct, warrington.
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Yeah, you get the idea and you start the museum and you say we've got to educate the, because it's sort of there's just a time gap there In textbooks it's barely mentioned.
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It's kind of in between World War II and Korea and then Vietnam, and really not much about the Cold War is taught or understood.
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So you now have to go about gathering artifacts.
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And how did that work?
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Where did you get your?
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Because I've seen the collection and it is amazing.
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There's not, it's a small space, but it's jam-packed with really cool stuff and a lot of very fascinating stuff about vin hill, the listening station too.
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But how did you acquire all the?
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artifacts.
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Well, back in 96, when I founded the museum, I started reaching out to friends, associates.
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I'm in the DC area, living in Fairfax City, I'm able to talk to retired military veterans and I'm able to meet some very interesting people.
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So I start getting the word out and at first, back in 96, I'm thinking it's going to take three years to build fundraise 3 million bucks shouldn't be too hard to do.
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It took 15 years to get brick and mortar when we located at Vent Hill, virginia.
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But during that 15-year time period we started to collect and gather as many Cold War artifacts as we could find, some off eBay, some off donations from veterans, some off people who worked or lived in Europe during the Cold War time period that had amassed collections and we just got the word out.
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So, as a result of getting the word out and through the help of our board of directors and friends and associates, we have acquired items from members, crew members of the USS Liberty incident, the USS Pueblo incident, overhead reconnaissance platforms such as the U of flags, banners, regalia, uniforms, uniforms East German, west German, american, russian, you name it From the Cold War time period.
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We have uniforms of that period for various countries around the world, so we've amassed this collection.
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It is in a 2,000-square-foot museum space currently and we have two storage facility units down the street, so we've been growing on site.
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We are looking for people to help with our efforts.
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If any of your listeners have an interest in supporting our efforts helping our efforts, volunteering you can go to coldwarorg to find out more about our efforts and to contact me through that platform.
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Well, listeners, that's the webpage.
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It's coldwarorg.
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I want everybody to go there, check it out.
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Look at the times when the museum is open.
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It's not open every day, so make sure you just don't show up.
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But see the times and you're going to see a button on there that says donate.
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My regular listeners know that every time I talk about a nonprofit, I'm telling you to donate, and I'm sure you're out there going, hey, I.
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You know we can't donate to everybody, I understand that, but this is important because they're the only ones that are doing it.
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Okay, so if this goes away, there's going to be this void in history that will just sort of evaporate and I'm sure the collection will just go back to.
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You know people who've loaned things or be sold off or God forbid in bankruptcy or just nightmarish things about some incredible artifacts that are on display, and so please consider, give you know five bucks, 10 bucks, 100 bucks, $1,000, $10,000, build a new building for them.
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Whatever you can do, hit that donate button and give your support and find a way to get over there and see it, and I guarantee you, if you get over there and see it, you'll even donate more, because it's surprising that you walk in and it's small and then there's the upstairs area.
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But when you're done and you leave you can't believe how much time you spent there, because it's just one cool thing after another and some are big, big uniforms, big equipment, and some things are really small and every artifact has an amazing story and the calm docents that are there volunteering.
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You kind of walk away getting the feeling that some of these guys probably old CIA hands.
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They've been in the IC community for a while and they know what they're talking about and they know their history and they lived it.
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You know they were there on the ground.
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They were in East Germany and West Germany and all over, and for sure you definitely don't want to miss it.
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Yeah, some of our docents actually worked at Vent Hill.
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Oh, so they have that institutional knowledge of working on base during the Cold War time period.
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Another docent is currently in the IC community and will be retiring shortly so he can put more time into the museum Nice A couple of the other items that we have that are very unique in displays.
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We have a room dedicated to Vent Hill and the history from World War II until it closed.
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Beetle Bailey, the comic strip, was created at Vent Hill.
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Wow, because the soldier who was stationed there ended up being the artist of Beetle Bailey.
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One of those little trivia knowledge things.
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Wow.
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We have some items from Civil Defense.
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We were able to save and salvage the civil defense headquarters for Washington DC back about 20 years ago before people went in and just took everything.
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We were able to get permission from Fairfax County.
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The headquarters was located in Lorton, virginia, on the site of the old jail facility.
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It was the civil defense headquarters for DC.
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So we walk in and it's as if they turned off the lights and walked away.
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Books were open to certain pages, coffee cups and cigarettes were still in the ashtrays.
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There was no more coffee, it evaporated.
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But it was just as if they locked the door and walked away.
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So we were able to collect and save and salvage the entire entity of the Civil Defense Headquarters for DC.
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So we have the Bert the Turtle duck and cover, original audio tapes and video tapes Not even video reel-to-reel tapes at the time.
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We have the nuclear fallout shelter plans.
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We have all of the things from PEPCO and Washington Gas, fbi, cia, the things that were in their individual booths.
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In case of a natural disaster or heaven forbid, a nuclear war, that would have been the primary communication center for Washington DC to coordinate the aftermath.
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So that's one of the exhibits.
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We have An exhibit on the U-2 incident.
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You know, dad was a U-2 pilot shot down.
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Of course wanted to keep his memory alive, but it's not the Gary Powers Museum.
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Back 25 years ago or so, when I founded it, some people thought, oh, you're doing this for your dad.
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Well, yes, I did it for my dad, but I did it for the hundreds of thousands of other men and women who fought, sacrificed, some of which who died during this time period, that were not being recognized for their service to our country.
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So there is a small section on DAD, but there's also sections on overhead reconnaissance, u-2 program, sr-71 program.
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As we go upstairs we have an area on Area 51 because that was the test site for the U-2, the SR-71, the F-117 stealth and whatever they're flying out there today the SR-71, the F-117 stealth and whatever they're flying out there today.
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We have a section on Soviet and American subs, a section on American and Soviet missiles and then, of course, the flags, the banners, the regalia, the uniforms.
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One of the unique items we have is a Stasi headquarters sign from the Stasi headquarters in Berlin that someone acquired when the wall fell, yeah, and it ended up in our collection.
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We have a piece of the U-2 shot down over Cuba during the Cuban Missile Crisis, piloted by Major Rudolph Anderson.
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He died in that shoot down.
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That was the second shoot down to happen.
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Dad was the first U-2 to be shot down over the Soviet Union.
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Major Anderson's U-2 over Cuba during the Cuban Missile Crisis was the second.
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Then there were five more shot down over mainland China during the 60s.
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They were flown by some unit called the Black Cat Program, taiwanese pilots that were trained by the CIA to overfly China, and so we have some of their items and artifacts and desk plaques and awards.
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That tells that story.
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So we have a very eclectic collection of Cold War military intelligence, social aspects of the Cold War.
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I do want to talk a little bit about your dad.
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Listeners would probably recognize his name from the Spielberg Tom Hanks movie Bridge of Spies, which was not so much a movie about your dad but about the lawyer who the government asked to help free your dad, which was it was a great movie.
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And I got to say I got to tell you this story Pre-release of the movie, my wife and I were invited over there to Fairfax for the screening that the museum did and it's in this really nice theater where you can you can get your meal there and take it into the theater and everything.
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And we were really excited to go because one after the movie, you and the granddaughter of the attorney featured the Tom Hanks character were going to do a Q&A and I knew it was going to be good.
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So we got some food and we were sitting up kind of high and then all of a sudden this group of guys come in with wives and the wives like sit, like over here and they've got buckets of beer and they're sitting next to us and just having a grand old time and I'm like, oh man, who are these guys, you know?
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And then, before the movie started, the head of the YouTube pilots Association gets up and, as talk, talks about the movie and YouTube pilots, and he says, oh, and we're very excited to have some YouTube pilots in the audience today, and it's these guys that stand up next to us.
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I had no idea.
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It was really something.
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It was a fantastic movie.
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And so what was it like consulting on the movie about your dad?
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Well, let me give a little background and then I'll go into the movie aspect of it.
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Growing up in Southern California, I was aware that my father was shot down, imprisoned and eventually exchanged for a Soviet spy.
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This happened a few years before I was born.
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I was born when he came home.
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My father dies in a helicopter crash in 1977.
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I'm 12 years old at the time.
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Now he was flying for a traffic helicopter in Los Angeles right Correct KNBC News Station, channel 4, or News Channel 4 at the time.
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And I remember flying with him and hiking and biking and fishing, all the normal father-son things.
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But people would ask for his autograph.
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He'd go to air shows.
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I'd fly with him to the Reno air races and so I was aware that he was a pilot and that people wanted his autograph and that he was in a history book.
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But I just thought that was normal.
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I thought everybody's dad went through this.
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I just didn't understand the significance of what he went through until he died.
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So he dies in 77, very introverted throughout high school because I don't want to talk about it.
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People ask me questions I don't know the answers to.
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So in college I'm curious.
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I want to find out the truth of what my father went through.
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He's controversial.
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There are conspiracy theories about him and the U2 incident.
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So I want to find out the truth of what he went through.
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So I know how to answer questions.
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Well, that led to the creation of the Cold War Museum.
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Then that led to the things I'm doing now lecturing, writing and teaching Cold War history.
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I have six or seven books published.
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I have one on Cold War Virginia.
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I've got three on my father, one of which is a graphic novel.
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I have a graphic novel out on the Berlin Airlift and I'm currently working on Cold War California.
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So that's what keeps me busy currently.
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In addition, I lecture every chance I get.
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So if one of your listeners has a venue, either nationally or internationally, where I can come out and give a talk on Cold War history and or the U2 incident, please send me an email through my contact page at garypowerscom or through coldwarorg.
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So that leads up to 2014.
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I get rumors, start to hear rumors that Spielberg and Hanks are going to do a movie that will portray my father.
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I'm thinking at the time that's not going to happen.
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Then I get confirmation it's going to happen.
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I'm able to get in touch with their producer, mark Platt.
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Mark Platt and I talked for an hour in July of 2014.
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At the end of the conversation, mark basically says to me Mr Powers, you're very knowledgeable on the Cold War, the U2 incident, what your father went through.
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How would you like to consult for the film?
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Well, yes, that would be really nice.
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Sure, thank you.
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So I get the contract.
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I'm reading through it.
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I'm to answer questions, be on set as invited, provide photographs from my family in the 50s that they can Photoshop, provide audio tapes of my father that he recorded in the 60s.
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That way they can listen to him in his own words as to what he went through.
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And at the very end of the contract, the last paragraph basically says they don't have to listen to me.
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Okay, so I talked to some friends, I talked to my sister, and I figure it's more important to be a part of the production, try to steer them in the right direction.
00:21:11.846 --> 00:21:15.747
Had I walked away, I'd have had no say whatsoever.
00:21:15.747 --> 00:21:18.409
So I am very glad that I did sign the contract.
00:21:18.740 --> 00:21:29.826
It was an honor and a privilege to work with Spielberg and Hanks, the lighting crews, the makeup, the hairstylist, the props, the wardrobe Just see how a Hollywood movie is made from behind the scenes.
00:21:29.826 --> 00:21:31.048
Awesome experience.
00:21:31.048 --> 00:21:32.150
It's quite a bit, isn't it?
00:21:32.150 --> 00:21:33.631
Oh yeah, so much goes into it.
00:21:33.631 --> 00:21:34.531
You just don't understand.
00:21:34.531 --> 00:21:43.540
Yeah, meeting Austin Stoll, the young man who portrayed my father Meeting.
00:21:43.560 --> 00:21:43.641
Mark.
00:21:43.661 --> 00:21:46.851
Reliance who portrayed Rudolph Abel meeting the other cast and characters in the film.
00:21:46.851 --> 00:21:48.306
It was just a wonderful experience.
00:21:48.306 --> 00:21:51.368
The overall movie we definitely like.
00:21:51.368 --> 00:22:00.131
The big picture is historically accurate, but it's Hollywood so you have to remember the details are not 100% correct.
00:22:00.131 --> 00:22:10.734
The big picture is accurate U2 incident, cold War time period, soviet Union, capture of Rudolph Ab Ebel, shoot down of dad, the exchange of the Gliniker Bridge all very accurately portrayed.
00:22:10.734 --> 00:22:17.133
But only the people on the bridge know what happened, know where they were standing, know what was said.
00:22:17.133 --> 00:22:23.404
So Spielberg and his team have to recreate this using their genius to bring this scene to life, create this using their genius to bring this scene to life.
00:22:23.404 --> 00:22:30.750
The Gliniker Bridge in Potsdam, germany, is where the exchange took place and it's also where they filmed the exchange scene.
00:22:30.750 --> 00:22:32.451
So that is historically accurate.
00:22:32.451 --> 00:22:46.865
Other places they used a place in Poland for the Berlin Wall scene, so again, not historically accurate for the locations but on the big screen you don't know the difference and it's a wonderful movie.
00:22:46.924 --> 00:22:48.328
Yeah, I encourage everybody to watch the movie.
00:22:48.328 --> 00:22:50.233
It's very entertaining.
00:22:50.233 --> 00:22:55.291
Of course, anything that Spielberg and Tom Hanks do is going to be first class, for sure.
00:22:55.901 --> 00:23:07.707
And you can get copies of it DVDs and Blu-ray off of eBay, sometimes on the streaming services, as well as Netflix and Showtime will also show it on occasion.
00:23:08.480 --> 00:23:10.448
What are the future plans for the museum?
00:23:11.460 --> 00:23:13.468
Future plans for the Cold War Museum.
00:23:13.468 --> 00:23:15.807
We are looking to grow on site.
00:23:15.807 --> 00:23:26.971
My board of directors recently, in the last year, has how do I want to say this authorized me to look for a like-minded institution to merge with or partner with.
00:23:28.320 --> 00:23:35.904
We would like to stay in Virginia because, this is where you know, it's just very close to Washington DC and all the Cold War history.
00:23:35.904 --> 00:23:49.003
But there are several other museums around the country that have a Cold War focus and we're trying to see if we are able to merge partner war focus and we're trying to see if we are able to merge partner work together to keep this history alive.
00:23:49.003 --> 00:23:50.307
I do not have a money board.
00:23:50.307 --> 00:24:18.067
I have a functional board that volunteers and helps out a retired U-2 pilot, a retired SR-71 pilot, a retired brigadier general, a leading real estate company owner out of the Tyson's Corner area, a nonprofit management expert, myself, a retired CIA person and a retired ambassador that used to serve or be stationed in Vietnam the first US ambassador to open that up.
00:24:18.067 --> 00:24:19.772
So we have eight people on our board.
00:24:20.621 --> 00:24:22.445
But we are hand-to-mouth.
00:24:22.445 --> 00:24:24.171
We function on donations.
00:24:24.171 --> 00:24:34.924
We do a monthly lecture series via Zoom that you will pay for a ticket and then listen to these Cold War experts or historians or participants talk about their history.
00:24:34.924 --> 00:24:44.113
We do two major fundraising events throughout the year, one in December, one in May Give Local Piedmont, which is for the Piedmont area.
00:24:44.113 --> 00:24:48.605
One in May Give Local Piedmont, which is for the Piedmont area, warrington, virginia, and then Giving Tuesday.
00:24:48.605 --> 00:24:52.752
Giving Tuesday is in December and Give Local Piedmont is in May.
00:24:52.752 --> 00:24:54.123
So those are the two major fundraisers.
00:24:54.123 --> 00:25:03.227
Between the fundraising between the donations, between the private tours that we offer for a small fee, that's what keeps the doors open.
00:25:03.227 --> 00:25:06.673
We're open on the weekends, staffed by volunteers.
00:25:06.673 --> 00:25:12.211
We would love to find an angel to help move our efforts forward more quickly.
00:25:12.211 --> 00:25:21.749
Sure, but it's just a matter of the outreach, getting people interested and promoting our efforts as where we can, just like this program today.
00:25:22.009 --> 00:25:29.746
Yeah, well, listeners, there it is, it's coldwarorg and desperately need donations.
00:25:29.746 --> 00:25:33.051
So visit that webpage, give what you can.
00:25:33.051 --> 00:25:40.049
It's really important and we want to keep the museum open for forever.
00:25:40.049 --> 00:25:45.307
Really, there's not going to be a time when people don't need to know about this.
00:25:45.307 --> 00:25:53.955
It's an important time in history and it's gone unnoticed for too long.
00:25:53.955 --> 00:26:04.711
And if you're in the Northern Virginia area, please think about a weekend Saturday trip out to the Cold War Museum in Vint Hill.
00:26:04.711 --> 00:26:09.644
If you're in DC, it's a nice ride right out 66.
00:26:09.644 --> 00:26:26.155
You can see all the beautiful data centers they're building and then you'll get out into the country a little bit, and there's plenty to do out here, but you can easily spend three or four hours in there, yeah, or longer, really.
00:26:26.839 --> 00:26:31.352
And so, if you do make it out, I'm there on occasion.
00:26:31.352 --> 00:26:41.692
But if you want to do a group tour midweek, just send us an email through our website and either I or one of the docents will respond and select a date that you can come in midweek to visit.
00:26:41.692 --> 00:26:46.903
The date that you can come in midweek to visit.
00:26:46.903 --> 00:26:54.523
We are opened on the weekends to the public, from 11 am to 4 pm on Saturdays, 1 pm to 4 pm on Sundays and then by appointment for private groups and people who can't make it on a weekend.
00:26:54.523 --> 00:27:01.805
Some of the recent groups we've had include the Benjamin School out of West Palm Beach, florida.
00:27:01.805 --> 00:27:06.994
That's where some very well-known celebrities' children go.
00:27:06.994 --> 00:27:19.814
We've had a group from the CIA Alumni Association came out and visited, along with General Clapper who was head of what's called National Defense, national Intelligence.
00:27:19.814 --> 00:27:45.740
We've had some groups from the State Department Mm-hmm.
00:27:45.759 --> 00:27:51.376
You said, larry, that's very important is that we have to understand Cold War history In order to understand what we're happening today right in our world, with Ukraine and even in Gaza.
00:27:51.376 --> 00:28:06.548
Those have Cold War connections With the Ukraine, war, putin, the East, america and everybody else, the West and the surrogate country where it's taking place, ukraine, just like Vietnam, just like Korea, just like Afghanistan.
00:28:06.548 --> 00:28:10.270
So that's a playbook out of the Cold War that's repeating itself right now.
00:28:10.270 --> 00:28:14.471
As far as Gaza goes, we know that's biblical times.
00:28:14.471 --> 00:28:20.369
There have been a conflict there for thousands of years, but in 1947, israel became a state.
00:28:20.369 --> 00:28:27.925
That is a Cold War event and from that moment on, palestine did not get statehood, and there have been confrontations ever since.
00:28:27.925 --> 00:28:29.810
That has now resulted in what we have in Gaza.
00:28:29.810 --> 00:28:33.569
Yeah, so there's always a connection to the Cold War in current history.
00:28:33.880 --> 00:28:37.559
Yeah, and I think there's some very strong parallels to China as well.
00:28:37.559 --> 00:28:40.048
Oh yes, Cold War now is China.
00:28:40.048 --> 00:28:41.050
Yeah for sure.
00:28:41.339 --> 00:28:43.241
I like to say it's Cold War 2.0.
00:28:43.241 --> 00:28:50.446
Yep, russia, yes, they're a threat because they have nuclear weapons, but China is the long-term adversary.
00:28:50.446 --> 00:29:03.896
They are looking at the moon, they are looking at South China Sea, they have the largest military in the world and they are thinking in terms of hundreds and thousands of years in the future, and not just years or decades.
00:29:04.076 --> 00:29:10.162
Yeah, so that makes the museum important.
00:29:10.162 --> 00:29:13.185
So everybody, get out there as quickly as you can and see it and enjoy it.
00:29:13.185 --> 00:29:19.155
I guarantee you you will, Until then, go to coldwarorg and donate.
00:29:19.155 --> 00:29:23.045
And you know, Gary, I can't thank you enough for coming out.
00:29:23.045 --> 00:29:32.346
I know you're en route somewhere and you made a point to stop off and record this with us, and we really, really appreciate it.
00:29:32.708 --> 00:29:32.868
Well.
00:29:32.868 --> 00:29:33.451
Thank you, larry.
00:29:33.451 --> 00:29:39.010
It's an honor and a privilege to be here, and I would highly recommend that your listeners also date to your cause.
00:29:39.010 --> 00:29:43.852
This facility is awesome and it really helps the wounded warriors coming back from battle.
00:29:44.152 --> 00:29:45.145
Yeah, thank you.
00:29:45.145 --> 00:29:49.767
So, listeners, we'll have another episode next Monday morning at 0500.
00:29:49.767 --> 00:29:53.097
You can find us on all the major podcast platforms.