Csaba Toth
Rachel: [00:00:00] Hi there, this is Rachel Stone introducing transform your leadership, all elements of leadership, but especially transformational leadership, which includes learning to be a coach when you're a leader. All coaches are leaders, but not all leaders are coaches. And my mission is to help solve that. I hope you enjoy.
I'm going to introduce my fabulous guest speaker Csaba Toth and he's the founder of ICQ Global. And I just want you to tell people out there who might not met you before, what would you like to say to introduce yourself, please?
Csaba: The short version is that. I talk about uncommon sense, it sounds a bit familiar, yet unusual because I think personal and cultural differences are clashes of common senses. And often we have this feeling that people have no common sense and they're annoying and we don't realize that probably they feel the same way about us.
And that's the problem that often we rely on common sense and good intention, and it can backfire in our personal or professional life as well, having said that, it's really difficult to optimize something that we cannot see. And let's be honest, most [00:01:00] people use their smartphone much better than they can use their mindset.
Rachel: Good point. Very good point.
Csaba: That's the problem with that. We don't learn about this at school and then we start guessing. We make assumptions. We keep repeating those ideas until we just believe them and that's when it goes wrong. So I wanted to get better. Get along with, first of all, myself and also other people, and I thought there must be a blueprint.
There must be something tangible. And it turned out that there is something, and ICQ Global was built on that.
Rachel: The way that I met you was that your partner and colleague Kasha, was at a networking event and I said, oh, I'm a coach. And she said, oh, we've got a tool that can help coaches.
And she said it's based along the principles of DISC profiling. And I was fairly familiar with DISC profiling at the time, but I was not prepared for the extra level that comes in with ICQ global disc profiling. And that takes the extra dimension of that cognitive diversity and also the fact that there is not only individual profiles that you can do, but you can assess a team on those three [00:02:00] factors that really underpin how well a team gets on and their results. And I really love the way that you describe these three invisible forces. So could you please just tell us a little bit for those people who aren't familiar about the Growth Zone tool that I've used and how those three forces are something that's so powerful.
Csaba: The first one that you mentioned was Global Disc, and that is about cognitive diversity going into the three layers of the identity, what we do, how and why, and that's pretty important because it's missing from most psychomatic assessments, but 95% of our actions are driven by values and beliefs we are not even aware of, but we think that we are so objective and logical.
That's not exactly true. We know our own habits and the narratives that we created and the choices we made to support those narratives. So we collected some evidence that, yes, might not be, or at least maybe it's not that resourceful. But what you mentioned, cognitive diversity is the only layer of diversity that has proven benefit in terms of performance.
That's the immune system of a team, the invisible force, and that's the annoying part. When [00:03:00] two people disagree, that's the defining line between just diversity or inclusion, success or disaster. That is just the potential because we can see the same situation from different perspectives. Now, can we make it work?
That's a different question. And this is what growth zone is about. It measures psychological safety and motivational drivers. The other two invisible forces that make or break a team that measures the quality of culture. Team dynamics. What's the point in putting really smart people in the team hoping to create synergy if they just clash?
Now, if you look at the research, 60 to 80% of all problems in the company happen for three reasons. Clash of values, clash of personalities, and poor leadership. And they all stem from the same source. People don't understand themselves and others.
So how can we make it more tangible? How can we make it more practical and uncomplicated?
And that's the purpose of those assessments.
Rachel: I was so delighted that I could prove this point so dramatically when I did one of these exercises on a company that I was working with. Everybody did [00:04:00] their own individual disc profile and they worked in agricultural sector producing manufacturing food where they are constantly assessed at short notice to reach a standard.
So the stress levels are high. They can have an inspector come in at very short notice, and they have to demonstrate extremely high levels of hygiene traceability, accountability for the food supply. The environment was very stressful very regularly. And there were quite a few conflicts within the team and I knew that they were under duress and that was bringing out these traits in people. But what I wasn't prepared for when we did the factors of individuals in the team, we found that there were literally two camps. We had the profile of people who were really high C -attention to detail, quite guarded, very accuracy driven, really afraid of being wrong.. Their big fear is to be wrong, especially in a public arena. That was three quarters of the people in the team, and then the other quarter of the people in the team were those high D characteristics where they want [00:05:00] quick answers, they want very little information, they want to take action.
They're results driven, and so we had these two opposing camps in the team. There was no S profile. Looking after their wellbeing and there was no I profile doing all the lovely small talk and bonding the team together and all of that stuff. So we had a potentially very toxic team, especially in the environment with the short notice and high impact duress that was happening.
First of all did all the individual profiles and then we put people in the room and I said, all those people with an I stand over there, all those people, High D, stand over there and we could see, and then we unpacked all of the characteristics. But at the same time, we also did the growth zone profile and we found that there were high levels of stress.
Everybody anonymously did the assessment and we could see all of the lines in the questions. We unpacked those one at a time and we could see how they could move forward. We discussed all of those factors and the different ways people interact. We had a happy result afterwards. But without those two tools, if I'd have just gone in there with an off the [00:06:00] shelf development program that was just about leadership and development, we wouldn't have unpacked any of those things.
Csaba: Yeah.
Rachel: This is why I like talking to you, Csaba, because you made me really think when you said most leadership training and development and executive coaching is normally a waste of time. Could you just unpack that for the listeners? What makes you say that?
Csaba: Whatever I say is research based.
That was research done by the MIT Slow Management review in 2024, and they wanted to understand how come most leadership training programs fail the clients, why they're losing money. And then the result was that, first of all, they were not measuring the impact on the people who met the most, which is the team.
There was nothing about it. How many times, for example, the leaders attend courses do you learn about inclusive behaviors and maybe the leaders think that I'm so inclusive. How do you know? Because if your team doesn't feel included, you are not inclusive. It's that simple!
You might think that you're doing the right thing, but have you measured the impact on the people who matter the most? And the other thing was that they didn't measure the [00:07:00] trajectory of the career of the leader. Often the evaluation was based on how informative or entertaining the program was.
And some of the leaders said that they chose the program based on the packaging. Fantastic. And that's the problem.
Rachel: Could you just say the name of that research again? 'Cause it might be very interesting for our audience to look that up actually. So the piece of research that you've mentioned was, what was that again?
Csaba: MIT Slow Management Review.
Rachel: So anybody out there who's thinking about purchasing leadership development or coaching, please have a look at that review and then think about how would you measure the impact? Are all the programs out there that people are offering data driven? And can people stand by the return on the investment?
Can they stand up and say let's measure the effectiveness. That's what really drew me to this tool, because I've got a high C component in my profile. I'm quite driven by data and numbers, and I'm thinking, yeah, I want to be able to say I can prove the return on investment. So thanks for sharing that.
And what's really interesting is, and I want to share this because it's about something that I learned the other week. I have to have CPD. You are [00:08:00] very quality driven. You support all of your coaches that work under your banner. And we did our assessment on how effectively I could report back to the group of all my peers who are also highly skilled training practitioners in this growth zone: ICQ global disc profiling.
And in this scenario I fed back and debriefed a profile assessment to one of my colleagues and everybody in the group was watching me. We were being filmed and you were watching me and just tell people what happens there.
Csaba: First of all, you did it. That's the whole point.
And the other thing is that, we have to create a psychologically safe environment, but that doesn't mean that it's comfortable.
And often that is the problem, that people think that physical comfort equals psychological safety. And that's a problem. 'Cause if you have the wrong definition, it creates the wrong expectations. And people feel that, oh, if I'm not comfortable, I'm not safe. That's not true. Growth requires the right amount of friction.
So it can be uncomfortable, but very positive. And it takes courage. And that's exactly what you had when you [00:09:00] just volunteered that. Yep. I do it. And the person that you did the debriefing to was pretty much the exact opposite of your profile.
Rachel: That's right.
Csaba: Which is even more challenging.
Rachel: Yeah.
Csaba: So ideally, I know that the plan was to adopt your style.
And try to bridge that mindset gap to make it even more efficient. But we know that under pressure, we just amplify who we are, and that's exactly what we saw. And I think despite everything you did amazingly.
Rachel: What I wanted to talk about this for was because, like you've just said, everybody thinks they're being inclusive.
Everybody has an imagining that they're a good leader. I thought that I could deliver this effectively, but in that environment, under those conditions, my traits of under duress came to the surface, and what I wanted to do effectively was to make my colleague like me. In that where everybody was staring at me and watching this practice, we are all peers, we're all equally qualified, and I just felt I wanted her to like me in that scenario.
And I didn't adapt myself to meet her needs. And I think this must happen day [00:10:00] in, day out all day with leaders in a scenario, especially when the pressure's on, our least effective traits come to the surface. And we do have to work so hard to learn to know ourselves and to be very present in that moment and adapt our style to meet the people's style, who we are working with in order to get the best outta them.
I was in the car after that assessment and I laughed because I thought I spend most of my time helping other people to do this. But under that pressure. I was totally not in the moment because I wanted to impress you and I wanted to impress the group, I wanted to help the group learn.
I defaulted to my natural traits, which didn't suit the person who was receiving their debriefs. That's quite interesting. We've talked about this before you and I together and in Covey's book, Seven Habits of Highly Affective People, he talks about having a diagnosis before you solve a problem. And in a lot of instances, people have an off the shelf coaching program, a one size fits all approach, and many coaches pick their programs [00:11:00] up and deliver them, regardless of whether they're suited to that problem solving that you're supposed to be working with that client with. And many leaders have a one size fits all approach and they deliver their leadership in that style.
But this is where the ICQ global techniques can make you stand out in the crowd and help you to become an even better leader, can't they?
Csaba: That's exactly the point that it depends on the focus. Because as soon as we focus on ourselves, there's a lot of pressure. We feel stressed, and then we have to protect ourselves.
And if you look at your profile, then immediately, if I'm under pressure, I have to be liked. But that's exactly why, as a coach, you cannot take deeper than you've ever been to. And that's why we are practitioners. That's why we have to go through this and their focus should be on the client.
Nothing else matters. How can I serve that person in front of me? Doesn't matter if other people like me or not. Not in the business of pleasing people, but serving them. And as a leader, as a coach, sometimes you have to say something, you have to ask a difficult question because ultimately it is serving the person.
Therefore, [00:12:00] if I don't do it, I'm not serving them. I'm being selfish and it's all about me. I think nowadays a lot of people do that. First of all, there are a lot of clients who want attention instead of solution. We don't work with those people, but also there are a lot of coaches who deliver solutions for those people. So they have to be extra nice. And, that's about being a paid friend.
But as a leader or coach, I believe that we should serve people.
Rachel: And I think this piece of continuing professional development I did under your umbrella. It was so revealing to me, and I often laugh because I'm I like the truth.
And on a couple occasions you have made me cry and that's been good because I've got a little bit uncomfortable and I've done some learning, but in a really good way. And also I think, the truth is the truth. And in so many organizations, as people rise to the top, people don't tell the people in the top places the truth. And they just don't get to hear what they need to hear, which is why it's good to bring an independent outside person in to be a catalyst for change, but you need evidence in order to prove that you've got something that you can solve together.
And that's why I really like having [00:13:00] tools to do that. Some key messages then if I'm selling glasses to people and someone comes in for a new pair of glasses. I don't say to them, oh, yes, I've got the answer for you You can have my glasses. I don't say that.
I will do a diagnosis process. If you're going to become an even better leader, we need to diagnose where you are at. Totally understand where your personality preferences are, what social conditioning has affected you in terms of your behaviors, how you would choose to behave, how you have had to behave.
Find out that from the very detailed report, and then work on your best bits and utilize those and become aware of your less desirable bits. In that situation, I was trying to give her my glasses in that scenario, I. And this is the wonderful thing about becoming an even better leader. It really starts with understanding yourself first. And also in my personal life, I've had a few issues and this process has helped me with that as well.
with that as well. Been a real year of change for me and learning. And even despite all of that under duress, those traits came [00:14:00] in. But I'm so aware of that now. And is there anything else you'd like to say about the process of either becoming a coach in the ICQ global community? Is there anything you'd like to say out there for any coaches listening?
Csaba: Sometimes people might think that I'm controversial, but I don't think so.
Rachel: It's quite a controversial thing to say that most training and coaching doesn't work. But you're not saying that as an opinion.
You are saying that based in evidence. And I wanted to stir up a bit of excitement around having you as my guest today. But is there something you'd like to say to anybody who might be a coach who might be thinking, oh, perhaps I need these tools.
Csaba: I think sometimes again, it goes back to the fact that we have to serve people, and that's the reason why I do the webinar every single month and I present the data. That even though companies spend insane amount of money on these programs.
Burnout rate is skyrocketing. As sharply as employee engagement is plummeting. Clearly something is not working. But if people are under the impression that, oh, people love my workshop, so it works. No, that just means that you entertain people. You didn't serve them. It's not the same [00:15:00] thing. Look at the data.
When it comes to people, guessing is not an option. And that's why I think that there's a huge gap in the market, and that is data-driven leadership and team coaching.
And
development. I had that feedback so many times when people said that after three sessions we made much more progress than with years of therapy.
And that feedback keeps coming back because once you make something visible, you turn invisible gut feelings into visible and applicable insight. It's a whole new level. The problem is that often we try to solve a problem that is not the real issue, and then you don't get the results that you are hoping for.
If you treat the symptom, that's not ideal. But if you go the root cause of the problem, you get exponentially better results and that's exactly what we do. So in terms of coaching, I think that is the highest level for experts: data driven, up to date solutions.
Rachel: It's really felt like before, and I've been coaching since 2012, I was in a room with a curtains drawn and now I've got these tools and they operate in this way, it feels like I've pulled the curtain back and I can look round the room in a much better light, [00:16:00] and it's really been helpful.
And so with regards to the next webinar that you've got coming up people can look out for that on your LinkedIn page, and Kasha also posts it as well. And the other thing I'd like to say is, for anybody that's taken time to listen to this today and wants to get in touch and they'd like to reach out to either Csaba or myself, please do connect.
Thanks ever so much for coming into my life and supporting me with my coaching journey and for being quite stern with me, when I've needed it, but also being a really great support and for being on this podcast with me.
Thank you so much and I'll see you again soon.
Csaba: Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to be a partner.
Rachel: Thank you.
Rachel: [00:00:00] Hi there, this is Rachel Stone introducing transform your leadership, all elements of leadership, but especially transformational leadership, which includes learning to be a coach when you're a leader. All coaches are leaders, but not all leaders are coaches. And my mission is to help solve that. I hope you enjoy.
I'm going to introduce my fabulous guest speaker Csaba Toth and he's the founder of ICQ Global. And I just want you to tell people out there who might not met you before, what would you like to say to introduce yourself, please?
Csaba: The short version is that. I talk about uncommon sense, it sounds a bit familiar, yet unusual because I think personal and cultural differences are clashes of common senses. And often we have this feeling that people have no common sense and they're annoying and we don't realize that probably they feel the same way about us.
And that's the problem that often we rely on common sense and good intention, and it can backfire in our personal or professional life as well, having said that, it's really difficult to optimize something that we cannot see. And let's be honest, most [00:01:00] people use their smartphone much better than they can use their mindset.
Rachel: Good point. Very good point.
Csaba: That's the problem with that. We don't learn about this at school and then we start guessing. We make assumptions. We keep repeating those ideas until we just believe them and that's when it goes wrong. So I wanted to get better. Get along with, first of all, myself and also other people, and I thought there must be a blueprint.
There must be something tangible. And it turned out that there is something, and ICQ Global was built on that.
Rachel: The way that I met you was that your partner and colleague Kasha, was at a networking event and I said, oh, I'm a coach. And she said, oh, we've got a tool that can help coaches.
And she said it's based along the principles of DISC profiling. And I was fairly familiar with DISC profiling at the time, but I was not prepared for the extra level that comes in with ICQ global disc profiling. And that takes the extra dimension of that cognitive diversity and also the fact that there is not only individual profiles that you can do, but you can assess a team on those three [00:02:00] factors that really underpin how well a team gets on and their results. And I really love the way that you describe these three invisible forces. So could you please just tell us a little bit for those people who aren't familiar about the Growth Zone tool that I've used and how those three forces are something that's so powerful.
Csaba: The first one that you mentioned was Global Disc, and that is about cognitive diversity going into the three layers of the identity, what we do, how and why, and that's pretty important because it's missing from most psychomatic assessments, but 95% of our actions are driven by values and beliefs we are not even aware of, but we think that we are so objective and logical.
That's not exactly true. We know our own habits and the narratives that we created and the choices we made to support those narratives. So we collected some evidence that, yes, might not be, or at least maybe it's not that resourceful. But what you mentioned, cognitive diversity is the only layer of diversity that has proven benefit in terms of performance.
That's the immune system of a team, the invisible force, and that's the annoying part. When [00:03:00] two people disagree, that's the defining line between just diversity or inclusion, success or disaster. That is just the potential because we can see the same situation from different perspectives. Now, can we make it work?
That's a different question. And this is what growth zone is about. It measures psychological safety and motivational drivers. The other two invisible forces that make or break a team that measures the quality of culture. Team dynamics. What's the point in putting really smart people in the team hoping to create synergy if they just clash?
Now, if you look at the research, 60 to 80% of all problems in the company happen for three reasons. Clash of values, clash of personalities, and poor leadership. And they all stem from the same source. People don't understand themselves and others.
So how can we make it more tangible? How can we make it more practical and uncomplicated?
And that's the purpose of those assessments.
Rachel: I was so delighted that I could prove this point so dramatically when I did one of these exercises on a company that I was working with. Everybody did [00:04:00] their own individual disc profile and they worked in agricultural sector producing manufacturing food where they are constantly assessed at short notice to reach a standard.
So the stress levels are high. They can have an inspector come in at very short notice, and they have to demonstrate extremely high levels of hygiene traceability, accountability for the food supply. The environment was very stressful very regularly. And there were quite a few conflicts within the team and I knew that they were under duress and that was bringing out these traits in people. But what I wasn't prepared for when we did the factors of individuals in the team, we found that there were literally two camps. We had the profile of people who were really high C -attention to detail, quite guarded, very accuracy driven, really afraid of being wrong.. Their big fear is to be wrong, especially in a public arena. That was three quarters of the people in the team, and then the other quarter of the people in the team were those high D characteristics where they want [00:05:00] quick answers, they want very little information, they want to take action.
They're results driven, and so we had these two opposing camps in the team. There was no S profile. Looking after their wellbeing and there was no I profile doing all the lovely small talk and bonding the team together and all of that stuff. So we had a potentially very toxic team, especially in the environment with the short notice and high impact duress that was happening.
First of all did all the individual profiles and then we put people in the room and I said, all those people with an I stand over there, all those people, High D, stand over there and we could see, and then we unpacked all of the characteristics. But at the same time, we also did the growth zone profile and we found that there were high levels of stress.
Everybody anonymously did the assessment and we could see all of the lines in the questions. We unpacked those one at a time and we could see how they could move forward. We discussed all of those factors and the different ways people interact. We had a happy result afterwards. But without those two tools, if I'd have just gone in there with an off the [00:06:00] shelf development program that was just about leadership and development, we wouldn't have unpacked any of those things.
Csaba: Yeah.
Rachel: This is why I like talking to you, Csaba, because you made me really think when you said most leadership training and development and executive coaching is normally a waste of time. Could you just unpack that for the listeners? What makes you say that?
Csaba: Whatever I say is research based.
That was research done by the MIT Slow Management review in 2024, and they wanted to understand how come most leadership training programs fail the clients, why they're losing money. And then the result was that, first of all, they were not measuring the impact on the people who met the most, which is the team.
There was nothing about it. How many times, for example, the leaders attend courses do you learn about inclusive behaviors and maybe the leaders think that I'm so inclusive. How do you know? Because if your team doesn't feel included, you are not inclusive. It's that simple!
You might think that you're doing the right thing, but have you measured the impact on the people who matter the most? And the other thing was that they didn't measure the [00:07:00] trajectory of the career of the leader. Often the evaluation was based on how informative or entertaining the program was.
And some of the leaders said that they chose the program based on the packaging. Fantastic. And that's the problem.
Rachel: Could you just say the name of that research again? 'Cause it might be very interesting for our audience to look that up actually. So the piece of research that you've mentioned was, what was that again?
Csaba: MIT Slow Management Review.
Rachel: So anybody out there who's thinking about purchasing leadership development or coaching, please have a look at that review and then think about how would you measure the impact? Are all the programs out there that people are offering data driven? And can people stand by the return on the investment?
Can they stand up and say let's measure the effectiveness. That's what really drew me to this tool, because I've got a high C component in my profile. I'm quite driven by data and numbers, and I'm thinking, yeah, I want to be able to say I can prove the return on investment. So thanks for sharing that.
And what's really interesting is, and I want to share this because it's about something that I learned the other week. I have to have CPD. You are [00:08:00] very quality driven. You support all of your coaches that work under your banner. And we did our assessment on how effectively I could report back to the group of all my peers who are also highly skilled training practitioners in this growth zone: ICQ global disc profiling.
And in this scenario I fed back and debriefed a profile assessment to one of my colleagues and everybody in the group was watching me. We were being filmed and you were watching me and just tell people what happens there.
Csaba: First of all, you did it. That's the whole point.
And the other thing is that, we have to create a psychologically safe environment, but that doesn't mean that it's comfortable.
And often that is the problem, that people think that physical comfort equals psychological safety. And that's a problem. 'Cause if you have the wrong definition, it creates the wrong expectations. And people feel that, oh, if I'm not comfortable, I'm not safe. That's not true. Growth requires the right amount of friction.
So it can be uncomfortable, but very positive. And it takes courage. And that's exactly what you had when you [00:09:00] just volunteered that. Yep. I do it. And the person that you did the debriefing to was pretty much the exact opposite of your profile.
Rachel: That's right.
Csaba: Which is even more challenging.
Rachel: Yeah.
Csaba: So ideally, I know that the plan was to adopt your style.
And try to bridge that mindset gap to make it even more efficient. But we know that under pressure, we just amplify who we are, and that's exactly what we saw. And I think despite everything you did amazingly.
Rachel: What I wanted to talk about this for was because, like you've just said, everybody thinks they're being inclusive.
Everybody has an imagining that they're a good leader. I thought that I could deliver this effectively, but in that environment, under those conditions, my traits of under duress came to the surface, and what I wanted to do effectively was to make my colleague like me. In that where everybody was staring at me and watching this practice, we are all peers, we're all equally qualified, and I just felt I wanted her to like me in that scenario.
And I didn't adapt myself to meet her needs. And I think this must happen day [00:10:00] in, day out all day with leaders in a scenario, especially when the pressure's on, our least effective traits come to the surface. And we do have to work so hard to learn to know ourselves and to be very present in that moment and adapt our style to meet the people's style, who we are working with in order to get the best outta them.
I was in the car after that assessment and I laughed because I thought I spend most of my time helping other people to do this. But under that pressure. I was totally not in the moment because I wanted to impress you and I wanted to impress the group, I wanted to help the group learn.
I defaulted to my natural traits, which didn't suit the person who was receiving their debriefs. That's quite interesting. We've talked about this before you and I together and in Covey's book, Seven Habits of Highly Affective People, he talks about having a diagnosis before you solve a problem. And in a lot of instances, people have an off the shelf coaching program, a one size fits all approach, and many coaches pick their programs [00:11:00] up and deliver them, regardless of whether they're suited to that problem solving that you're supposed to be working with that client with. And many leaders have a one size fits all approach and they deliver their leadership in that style.
But this is where the ICQ global techniques can make you stand out in the crowd and help you to become an even better leader, can't they?
Csaba: That's exactly the point that it depends on the focus. Because as soon as we focus on ourselves, there's a lot of pressure. We feel stressed, and then we have to protect ourselves.
And if you look at your profile, then immediately, if I'm under pressure, I have to be liked. But that's exactly why, as a coach, you cannot take deeper than you've ever been to. And that's why we are practitioners. That's why we have to go through this and their focus should be on the client.
Nothing else matters. How can I serve that person in front of me? Doesn't matter if other people like me or not. Not in the business of pleasing people, but serving them. And as a leader, as a coach, sometimes you have to say something, you have to ask a difficult question because ultimately it is serving the person.
Therefore, [00:12:00] if I don't do it, I'm not serving them. I'm being selfish and it's all about me. I think nowadays a lot of people do that. First of all, there are a lot of clients who want attention instead of solution. We don't work with those people, but also there are a lot of coaches who deliver solutions for those people. So they have to be extra nice. And, that's about being a paid friend.
But as a leader or coach, I believe that we should serve people.
Rachel: And I think this piece of continuing professional development I did under your umbrella. It was so revealing to me, and I often laugh because I'm I like the truth.
And on a couple occasions you have made me cry and that's been good because I've got a little bit uncomfortable and I've done some learning, but in a really good way. And also I think, the truth is the truth. And in so many organizations, as people rise to the top, people don't tell the people in the top places the truth. And they just don't get to hear what they need to hear, which is why it's good to bring an independent outside person in to be a catalyst for change, but you need evidence in order to prove that you've got something that you can solve together.
And that's why I really like having [00:13:00] tools to do that. Some key messages then if I'm selling glasses to people and someone comes in for a new pair of glasses. I don't say to them, oh, yes, I've got the answer for you You can have my glasses. I don't say that.
I will do a diagnosis process. If you're going to become an even better leader, we need to diagnose where you are at. Totally understand where your personality preferences are, what social conditioning has affected you in terms of your behaviors, how you would choose to behave, how you have had to behave.
Find out that from the very detailed report, and then work on your best bits and utilize those and become aware of your less desirable bits. In that situation, I was trying to give her my glasses in that scenario, I. And this is the wonderful thing about becoming an even better leader. It really starts with understanding yourself first. And also in my personal life, I've had a few issues and this process has helped me with that as well.
with that as well. Been a real year of change for me and learning. And even despite all of that under duress, those traits came [00:14:00] in. But I'm so aware of that now. And is there anything else you'd like to say about the process of either becoming a coach in the ICQ global community? Is there anything you'd like to say out there for any coaches listening?
Csaba: Sometimes people might think that I'm controversial, but I don't think so.
Rachel: It's quite a controversial thing to say that most training and coaching doesn't work. But you're not saying that as an opinion.
You are saying that based in evidence. And I wanted to stir up a bit of excitement around having you as my guest today. But is there something you'd like to say to anybody who might be a coach who might be thinking, oh, perhaps I need these tools.
Csaba: I think sometimes again, it goes back to the fact that we have to serve people, and that's the reason why I do the webinar every single month and I present the data. That even though companies spend insane amount of money on these programs.
Burnout rate is skyrocketing. As sharply as employee engagement is plummeting. Clearly something is not working. But if people are under the impression that, oh, people love my workshop, so it works. No, that just means that you entertain people. You didn't serve them. It's not the same [00:15:00] thing. Look at the data.
When it comes to people, guessing is not an option. And that's why I think that there's a huge gap in the market, and that is data-driven leadership and team coaching.
And
development. I had that feedback so many times when people said that after three sessions we made much more progress than with years of therapy.
And that feedback keeps coming back because once you make something visible, you turn invisible gut feelings into visible and applicable insight. It's a whole new level. The problem is that often we try to solve a problem that is not the real issue, and then you don't get the results that you are hoping for.
If you treat the symptom, that's not ideal. But if you go the root cause of the problem, you get exponentially better results and that's exactly what we do. So in terms of coaching, I think that is the highest level for experts: data driven, up to date solutions.
Rachel: It's really felt like before, and I've been coaching since 2012, I was in a room with a curtains drawn and now I've got these tools and they operate in this way, it feels like I've pulled the curtain back and I can look round the room in a much better light, [00:16:00] and it's really been helpful.
And so with regards to the next webinar that you've got coming up people can look out for that on your LinkedIn page, and Kasha also posts it as well. And the other thing I'd like to say is, for anybody that's taken time to listen to this today and wants to get in touch and they'd like to reach out to either Csaba or myself, please do connect.
Thanks ever so much for coming into my life and supporting me with my coaching journey and for being quite stern with me, when I've needed it, but also being a really great support and for being on this podcast with me.
Thank you so much and I'll see you again soon.
Csaba: Thank you so much. It's a pleasure to be a partner.
Rachel: Thank you.
