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Welcome to the Voncast show. Today. I had a really special guest.
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We've been trying to do this podcast
for like a couple of years. The
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first couple of times you did it, it was over the phone and it
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was really bad reception, and I
had to do it. I don't know,
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it's really bad reception pretty much,
and like wait to try over and
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over, and two years later,
we're in the same room. I'm with
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Nora. How's it going. I'm
so excited we're actually in the same room.
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I know, it's so weird.
I'm just so used to the zoom
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calls or the phone calls on Fridays. Yeah. No, this is good.
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I'm doing good. I'm happy to
have this conversation. Me too,
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Me too. How you been I'm
good. Yeah, I'm good. I'm
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like grounded and balanced and nice.
Nice. Yeah, me too, sort
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of. I did like some stuff
inventory last night of like my life and
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just what I can do to I
don't know, work on stuff. Yeah.
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So it's it's Persian New Year.
Oh, happy person year, thank
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you, thank you. So the
first day of spring. So it's it'll
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be like on this year it falls
on Sunday. And so I've been in
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a place of like new, new
beginnings, new, you know, like
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I feel like I'm on my own
timeline a little bit, and so yes,
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very similar, I've been in a
place of like reflection and like regrounding,
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and so today I'm good, good, good, this morning, I'm
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good. Right. Yeah, So
well that said, tell us beefy about
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who you are what you do.
So I am a creative consultant and anti
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capitalist business coach. Basically my whole
thing is helping creative people be able to
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live off their creativity in a way
where they keep their financial control, they
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keep their creative their creative vision,
their creative products, but are also able
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to do good in the world.
I like that. I think that's why
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I started working with you. I
think I read what you've done before,
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and it's cool. We're like in
the same wave length of like what we
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believe in and everything or beliefs are
pretty similar to aligned and I like that
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a lot. You've been helping me
pretty much with like the what it's called
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branding, right, like the marketing
aspect of just music and podcasting and figuring
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out like oh my Nietzsche niche niche
is right. Yeah, I really appreciate
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that it's been helpful a lot,
just with everything. I mean, it's
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cool to just like you podcasting and
music, but then to like kind of
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put it all together and packages of
brand is really cool. Well, thank
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you. I appreciate it. Yeah, for sure. I think I think
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part of it is, like I
think a big part of what I do
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is helping people or like not you
know, under like white supremacist capitalism,
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we learn that we have to compartmentalize
who we are, right, and so
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I think a big part of what
I do is help people figure out how
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they can show up wholly and authentically. Yeah, because that's what people connect
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to. We don't connect to parts
of things, we connect to whole beings,
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and so that's a big part.
It's kind of the values alignment.
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Yeah, I noticed too, I
was compartmentalizing, like what I was doing.
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It was like this is me,
this is like the podcast, and
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this is on the right hand side, it is the music. But there's
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like one person. Yeah, it's
interesting. Yeah. So okay, so
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let's take it back early days that
you're born Iran, right, and you
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lived but Iran, Iran, you
lived in three continents before you're three,
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Okay, and what was going on
in Iran and in the area at the
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time. So I was born during
the US instigated Iran Iraq war, okay,
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and so literally like the night I
was born, the United States had
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given Saddam Hussein weapons to use against
the Iranian people. And so that's kind
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of the chaos I was born into. So when people ask me like why
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do you why are you the way
you are? Like, I was forced
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to be like I was born into
chaos. But so we left as refugees.
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We left the refugees of the war, and so lived on three continents
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before I was three, and then
land it in La where I've grown up.
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Right, you know the thing like
I think the like the media portrays
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You're in a lot of areas places
in that like Middle East, right,
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and like a certain light, what's
the culture like outside of like what's kind
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of portrayed in the news, Like
what's it like the food and everything?
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Oh my god? So where and
I can only you know, Middle East
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is such a diverse I can only
speak for like Persians, right, Persians
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very warm all about hospitality if you
and you know what, Like I throw
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events, right, I produce events, and so much of my Persian upbringing
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is what informs the way I host
spaces for people. Like if you come
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to one of my events, it's
just as if you're coming to my house,
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and so I will make sure that
you've eaten, that you're drinking something,
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that you've met someone that you you
know, Like if you ever come
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to a Persian party, there's no
like sitting. Oh really, one of
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the aunties will come. They'll grab
you by the hand, they'll pull you
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up there. Make sure that you're
dancing. Okay, dancing too. Oh,
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it's food, it's family, it's
dancing. It's a lot of like
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art and storytelling bit for us.
And so yeah, I think a lot
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of what I do is is like
deeply culturally rooted in me. That's really
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cool. Reminds me of similarly Filipino
culture, where they do they make you
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eat food and if you say no, you're to get a little offended.
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Oh my god, it's you will
eat a whole plate. And my grandmother
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used to still go but you didn't
eat anything, and then put more food
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on your plate. My grandma never
said I love you, but my grandma
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used to always say you didn't eat
enough. Interesting, and that was like
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the love language is food. Yeah. Interesting, I heard like in certain
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Asian cultures. I don't think Filipinos
those like I made some I cut up
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some fruit for you your foods ready. It's interesting. The cut fruit thing
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is totally a Persian thing. Also
really Oh yeah, my dad never said
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I love you, but my dad, if I was like studying, would
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cut up fruit and bring it to
my room. And I don't think Filipinos
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do that. But was there a
particular kind of fruit or like, was
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there a significance? Is just the
fruit, like I could it fruit for
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you? It's just like nourishment,
Okay, it's yeah, and I think
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it's also yeah, it's like caregiving. Yeah yeah, interesting. Cool.
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So you moved to La Glendale,
right has a very special place in my
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heart. That's yeah, that's like
okay, so Panorama, Like my cousin
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like suggested, I wrap right,
And I met friends in Glendelle because I
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got dropped off on my Auntie's during
like the day while my mom worked,
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and I met friends there and we
all made a little rap group, my
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first little rap group, or not
my first little rap group, our first
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little rap group. Yeah, so
we would like hang out, we'd walk
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around like Americana not Americana sorry,
like the Glendell got Away your third floor
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and just like walk around freestyle and
all that stuff. Like I don't know
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where Glendelle you grew up, but
like I know Gena's Taco was like the
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mall. Yeah, those are like
really memorable place. I grew up right
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like a block away from Brand okay, and so we used to walk to
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so before the Americana, there was
the Marketplace. Before the marketplace, there
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was the Exchange. Yeah yeah,
and so like we used to go to
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Porto's before Porto's had like a crazy
line Rafy's for Persian food. Yeah.
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No, that was definitely my stomping
grounds before we moved. That was like
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me, I mean, it was
like a really cool place before very Kana,
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before it became like really high traffic, like a lot of like I
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don't know other people, but I
used to work at that Pan Express,
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you know, I got fired from
it. It's weird it's not there anymore,
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but there was that pacsend there.
Yep. Wow, I wonder if
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you, like, I don't think
we're anything to each other, but it's
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so weird that we just like know
the same areas same places. Yeah,
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so what was it like going to
school there? It was cool, you
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know, I was the only Persian
kid I knew, Okay, so there
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was a little bit for me of
like cultural navigating. My mother was like
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super super strict, and I think
it pushed me into like more. I
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mean, I was a good kid. I was smart, like I wasn't
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doing anything crazy. But I think
my mom was like so worried in her
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like immigrant anxiety. It pushed me
to maybe do some things I shouldn't have.
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But it was I don't know,
Glenda. I really loved growing up
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in Glendale, and I think it's
really interesting to watch the way it's like
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when we were moving in there was
like a reverse there was like a white
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flight happening, so it was all
like immigrants and working class folks, and
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then now there's kind of a reverse
gentrification. It's an interesting like community to
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look at to see how like the
demographics are changing. At first, I
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thought you were Armenian because of your
last name. I get that, oh
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not to soon, but I might
be playing, you know, But yeah,
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I think it was Raffi's place there. But yeah, so and then
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from Glendale, where did you move
to. So we moved to Beverly Hills
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when I was fifteen because my mother
thought that being around Persian Jews would save
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me. It did not, and
it probably pushed me further into all the
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things that she was afraid that I
was doing. Yeah, Beverly Hills for
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me was a total culture shock.
They didn't know what to do with me.
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I didn't know what to do with
them. I did not want to
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be there. A lot of the
stereotypes are true, and so for me,
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it was also where I saw really
firsthand what like wealth and privilege look
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like in practice, and how that
was so different than what me and my
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friends growing up had experienced. I
was like, oh, like this is
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the wealth gap, and I thowt
it like really really firsthand. Wow.
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Interesting Like Beverly Hills when I remember, I would think of, like,
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I don't know, just the TV
shows and just I always associated oh it's
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a really nice area or the drive
and everything. So you went to high
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school there? Like did you continue
going to school after high school? So
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I went to U SEE Santa Cruz
after I graduated nice, which was really
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like the best place, like really
chill, super chill, like super political,
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really grounded. I was like,
how far away can I get from
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home? Like literally looked at a
map and was like, cool, Santa
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Cruz. I wasn't going to get
into Berkeley. I was like Santa And
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so I went to U see Santa
Cruz and lived there for a while.
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That's where I started doing a lot
of my like more structured organizing work and
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gang intervention abolition work. And then
I from there started moving around a bit,
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and I lived in Costaca, I
moved to New York, I lived
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in Liberia and kind of like bounced
around. So in school, were there
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particular subjects that you exceled at?
I was, yeah, I mean I've
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always been a good student. I
thought I was going to be a marine
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biologist, and I took one oceanography
class and failed miserably and was like,
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cool, guess I'm not doing the
sciences. But the UC Santa Cruz we
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had like an ethnic not ethnic studies, a community studies program that was all
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about like history of social movements.
That was cool for me. I took
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some history of consciousness classes about like
political theory, and you know, I
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was into that stuff. And then
I ended up with a degree in psychology.
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Nice there was just me and I
saw going around like people our age.
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Like for some reason they thought like
they wanted to be marine biologists.
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That was like a thing. Yeah, like that was like the cool thing
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to do. I don't know where
it came from, but like that was
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like the It was because I saw
Free Willy when I was little. Oh
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maybe that's why I remember Free Willy. Oh my god, that show.
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That movie gave me so much feels. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I cried.
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Yeah, I'm not sure if I
cried, but I do remember that
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though. For sure. That was
a really good movie. I forgot what
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happened. Like there was a couple, right, I think they made like
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two. I think I think Willie
got free so I hope so what he
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did. But yeah, like when
I think, okay, when I think
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of Santa you see Santa Cruz or
it's UC Santa Cruz, right, people
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are taking mushrooms into forest or something. That was definitely happening. Yeah.
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Yeah, there was a lot of
like midnight drum circles like go find the
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fairies at night and like, yeah, there was a lot of that kind
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of stuff. Yeah, that's where
the boardwalk is too, right, Yes,
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remember that commercial, like the there
was like a commercial for the Santa
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Cruz boardwalk, like it was like
the nineties. I'm going down surfing,
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so surfing USA there was like that, Yeah, I don't know, good
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time. So you ended up in
Liberia? How did that happen? So
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what happened was I was doing gang
intervention abolition work in Santa Cruz and basically
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nobody wanted to fund this, and
some of the like big foundations would say
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things like, no, we can't
give you money because you're gonna go start
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a cartel because I mean literally right, because we were doing very like grassroots,
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working with people who had paroled or
for you know whatever, very very
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grassroots. And so I was like, all right, bet let me go
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get a master's degree that will validate
to you that I'm not going to run
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away with your money, Like I'll
play this kind of game til I get
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a piece of paper. So I
ended up in New York in an international
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affairs program to get my masters.
And then the New School was like,
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well, you have to go do
an internship somewhere like do a Field City.
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And the only program that they offered
that dealt with youth and conflict was
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in Liberia. So I ended up
in Liberia completely by accident, and then
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I met a rapper and everyone was
like, oh, this guy's like Tupac,
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and I was like, I'm from
LA. You can't, like,
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you can't just call that's that's a
bold state. Yeah, that's a bolt.
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But he was that guy and like
his politics were really like aligned with
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mine, and fans really like resonated
with him. And so long story short,
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I got peer pressured into managing him. How is managing an artist?
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Ah, I mean it's complicated,
right, Like what does a manager do
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it? I guess different things.
So what I was doing, and I
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think it's different for different artists,
But what I was doing was helping him
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think about what his big picture vision
was, like what does success look like
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for you? And honestly, it's
a lot of what I do now when
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I'm like consulting with my clients is
what does success look like for you?
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What do you want to achieve?
And then let's come up with a strategy
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to achieve it. And then as
a manager, I was also doing a
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lot of like negotiations and trying to
build and bring in new business for him
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and things like that, which was
at that time really interesting because the industry
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in Liberia was really young and undeveloped, and so I had a lot of
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read them to kind of make mistakes
and learn, but also for us to
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build up the kind of industry that
I think we wanted to create, which
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was cool, right, interesting?
I mean, was there a big holdershot
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going to Liberia? Yes? Yeah, like superficially, it's very It's not
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different from US culture because there's such
a long history and there's but definitely like
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subtleties where I was like, oh, oh, I think I understand,
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but I don't. And also all
the dynamics of being like a non white
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but also Westerner but also a woman. But like just looking at how my
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power showed up in the space was
very complicated. Sometimes. How did you
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get into gain intervention and that type
of work? What made you want to
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pursue that path? Growing up?
That's what my you know, that's like
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what my friends were doing, right, and I would the guys I was
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dating were doing, you know,
like it was just and because I think
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I came from such a different partly, I think being smart kind of protected
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me because the homies were always like
nope, Nora's the smart one, like
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don't let Nora touch that. Don't. Like there was a you know,
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there was like protection around that.
And then also coming from a family system
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where like school was my only option, like I had no my mom was
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like, you are going to school, Like that's it grades. There's a
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lot of pressure that way. And
I think even just on a personal level,
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I understood from a really young age
that school was going to be my
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only way out of my family and
like into my freedom. Right. So
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I was like saving up for college
since I was like six, Oh my
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goodness, Like other kids would take
birthday money and like buy toys and I
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was like, nope, go into
my own college fund. Wow. But
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that's how So when I was able
to go to Santa Cruz and like see
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how my social location compared to other
people's and like have a power analysis and
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all that kind of stuff, it
was my way of like staying connected to
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my community, but also giving back
with like the privilege that I had at
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that point. Right, My uncles
weren't a gang. They came here from
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the Philippines around like nineties, moved
to Panoramic City, Filipinos. I think
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they did it because protection, you
know, it was I think at the
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time there was lots of gang like
tension between certain ethnic groups. Yep.
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Yeah, they tried to get out, didn't work. I think their house
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got shot out. But they're okay. But my grandma the next couple of
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days shipped them out that the Philippines
lay low. That's like the move like
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I heard a lot of like Filipinos
do that, like when they get bus
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there's something some trouble. They were
the Philippines for a couple of years to
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cool off. Yeah. Interesting,
Okay, that makes sense. So going
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back to Libery and everything, like
what transitioned to you from like just managing
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an artist to deciding, hey,
I want to become like a creative consultant.
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I got so Liberia was great,
and also I got really really burnt
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out, and so I spent three
years with that artist. I think reached
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a peak of how much I could
do for him. Like as a as
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an as a manager, you can't
ever want more for your artists than the
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artist wants for themselves. And so
that's when I think our vision just wasn't
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as aligned as it was. And
then Ebola hit and I was burnt out
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and there wasn't much I could do. So I came back to the States,
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had no idea what I wanted to
do, and then people started asking
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me for help. And so that's
kind of where the consulting started to build
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out. And I think this way, I actually get to do more.
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I also don't like babysitting, and
management is a lot of babysitting. But
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so this way I think I can
I feel like I have more impact than
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working just with one artist. That
makes sense. What did your family think
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of you pursuing this path or Liberia
becoming like this? You know, uh
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manager, I'm pretty sure they might
have had different expectations for like what you
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wanted to do. What they wanted
you to do? Oh for sure,
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do for your career for sure.
So by like Persian traditional Persian standards,
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I should have been a doctor,
lawyer, engineer, yeah right, like
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immigrant child. And I'm also the
oldest, so like high standard. But
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I have always been a little unconventional
and so I like to I joke around
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with my mom that I like trained
her from the beginning that I was going
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to do my own thing, and
so they never stopped me, but they
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didn't actively support me. They didn't
understand it. My extended family definitely was
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like really confused. But I think
now they see that, like now it
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makes sense to them, makes sense. Yeah, but yeah, like there's
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no frame of reference for the kind
of work that I do, right,
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I think for Filipinos, I think
our thing was like, Okay, be
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a nurse. That's like the safest
path. It's like the you know,
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you get help, benefits and throw
and k and like it's good money,
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start a family and everything. I
was never a physical I was no one
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ever told me to be a nurse. But it's a lot of like subtle
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hints. You know, your uncle, your aunt, they do this and
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that. You know, I don't
like needles. I'm scared of needles.
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I don't like the side of blood, not like a lot of blood.
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So couldn't do that. And it
was just I don't know, it was
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tough. I think just like I
don't know figure out what I wanted to
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do. It seemed like a lot
of family members kind of like had their
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stuff together and yeah, I mean
I wanted to pursue music and whatnot,
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so go to college and you know
and everything. And I think now they're
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just glad I work at like a
place that they know that like it's a
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good place to work at and they're
Okay, well you're not doing that,
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You're not doing like bad stufficated in
the past. Do whatever you want.
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Yeah, I mean I think about
like as children of immigrants, right,
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Like our parents gave up so much
and so they're not they didn't have the
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luxury and privilege to think about Like
my dad is an artist. My dad
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in Iran was like a professor,
he was teaching, he was doing like
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art show like and then he came
here and like as a salesperson in downtown
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La, right, So like he
literally gave up his creative dreams to take
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care of two kids. And you
know, and so then for us,
307
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as like the first generation, they're
not thinking about go follow your heart.
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They're thinking about be safe, be
stable, be good because they're still in
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that survival mentality, right, And
so I think with my family anyways,
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it was once my mom and my
dad doesn't care. But like my mom,
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00:21:53.279 --> 00:21:59.160
once she realized that, like,
I'm not in survival mode, then
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it made her more comfortable with me
doing things that really there's no blueprint for,
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Like I don't know any other Persians
who do what I do oh okay,
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Like, and when we find each
other in the creative field, it's
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like wait what, oh my god, like and so there's no blueprint.
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So it's also been kind of this
mode of figuring out as I go and
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like building community and learning from from
whoever is kind of around me. Right,
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yeah, man, that's really that's
really cool that you put it that
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way. Look in hindsight, now, I mean I was I had resentment
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towards like that mentality and like my
family members for like not actively supporting me.
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But as I get older, I
realized, Okay, like that's all
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you knew, you know, And
and like my parents had me at a
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really young age, and I know
they had the sacrifice a lot. Yeah
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you're young parents, and I have
like more empathy towards you know, upbringing
325
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and just everything else and makes me
kind of not want to have kids.
326
00:23:02.519 --> 00:23:06.680
Oh my god. Yeah, I
just like selfish ice know that I don't
327
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think I'll be responsible. I'm just
being very bluntly honest. I don't know.
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I mean I don't think I can
do it. I think parenting is
329
00:23:15.599 --> 00:23:18.000
like tough. I mean, sometimes
you know, things happen and sometimes it's
330
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out of your control it, it
happens. But me, I am proactively
331
00:23:26.480 --> 00:23:30.480
working on not having kids because it's
just I don't know, maybe it feels
332
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like for me like I didn't have
a quote unquote childhood, Like so I'm
333
00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:40.359
like living like that inner child in
me. It's like I'm doing my thing.
334
00:23:40.359 --> 00:23:42.960
I'm still a kid, you know. Yeah, but uh yeah,
335
00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:47.200
you know, it's just it's tough. And I I get you know,
336
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salute them for what they did and
just you know, they did their best.
337
00:23:49.519 --> 00:23:53.759
And I'm as person's thirty four,
I can say, like, you
338
00:23:53.759 --> 00:23:56.079
know, I appreciate what they did. You know, may at the time
339
00:23:56.079 --> 00:24:00.279
I didn't get it, and you
know, they did their best. Right.
340
00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:03.160
I Mean I think about I don't
want kids. Yeah, I'm like
341
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the best auntie. Yeah your kids
will ever have yeah yeah. And then
342
00:24:06.720 --> 00:24:11.519
and I think people have children for
the wrong reasons and yeah, So I
343
00:24:11.519 --> 00:24:14.160
mean we can have a whole conversation
about not having kids. But I'm with
344
00:24:14.200 --> 00:24:17.480
you, Yeah, I'm with you. And I sometimes I wonder if my
345
00:24:17.599 --> 00:24:21.279
mom had a choice to have kids, which right, because that's what you
346
00:24:21.319 --> 00:24:23.279
did. You got married, you
had kids, Like it wasn't a thought
347
00:24:23.319 --> 00:24:26.880
that she was allowed to have to
not have children, and I wonder if
348
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situations had been different, would she
had which she had consciously chosen to have.
349
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Yeah, you know, I get
met I can make that choice,
350
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but a generation ago, a lot
of people couldn't so. But yeah,
351
00:24:38.920 --> 00:24:42.359
no, not for me. For
my parents, it was they got my
352
00:24:42.400 --> 00:24:48.400
mom got pregnant, then they got
married. Philippines is very traditionally Roman Catholic,
353
00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:55.119
one of our like relatives as a
priest, and even even my dad's
354
00:24:55.119 --> 00:24:56.480
mom. No, no, they're
too young to get married. They're like
355
00:24:56.519 --> 00:25:00.400
freaking seventeen twenty. But I think
they want to to like uphold the tradition.
356
00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:03.599
So I think I married. Anyways, it didn't last very long,
357
00:25:04.119 --> 00:25:08.279
but you know, I did their
best. You know, sometimes they trip
358
00:25:08.279 --> 00:25:11.440
out like damn, like my dad
and why we're doing this at this age
359
00:25:11.440 --> 00:25:18.000
and I'm doing this at this like
I don't know. Sometimes I feel guilty
360
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:19.160
because they're like, oh my god, like they're doing this and I'm like
361
00:25:19.799 --> 00:25:23.400
doing X, Y and Z,
and they're like, you know, doing
362
00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:27.920
productive things and I'm not, you
know, And sometimes it weighs on me.
363
00:25:27.960 --> 00:25:30.880
When I was younger, it waited
on me a lot, But now
364
00:25:30.039 --> 00:25:33.680
you know, it is what it
is. Yeah, but I mean I
365
00:25:33.759 --> 00:25:38.000
also think like it's a different definition
of productivity, right, Like we have
366
00:25:38.359 --> 00:25:44.279
time and energy to like focus on
dreams and take care of our mental health
367
00:25:44.480 --> 00:25:48.160
and you know things that like my
parents definitely couldn't do. I was doing,
368
00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:52.880
like really not yeah, other other
things. What am I doing?
369
00:25:52.920 --> 00:25:56.920
You know? Like yeah, no, they didn't make spreads. Yeah,
370
00:25:57.640 --> 00:26:02.039
they were making spreads, you know
what I'm saying. But yeah, that
371
00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:04.160
was fun. Actually, that's one
thing I took from that whole experience.
372
00:26:04.160 --> 00:26:07.920
Sometimes I make spread just for the
fun of it. Yeah. My friend
373
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:11.960
just came home, like after twenty
years. I don't want to see that
374
00:26:11.000 --> 00:26:17.079
ship man, you know. Yeah. I actually been interviewing him soon.
375
00:26:17.759 --> 00:26:21.920
He's Vietnamese. He just got out
and uh he's changed his life around,
376
00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:26.000
you know. So HEERRM and I
talked. He's willing to like have a
377
00:26:26.000 --> 00:26:30.079
conversation about just like what he learned
in there, not so much of like
378
00:26:30.160 --> 00:26:33.359
what he did, but just like
the transformation part. Yeah yeah, okay,
379
00:26:33.400 --> 00:26:40.279
so I attracted Where were we?
Yeah? Okay, so you transition
380
00:26:40.359 --> 00:26:44.400
from that So like you said you
were earlier, you know, like you
381
00:26:44.440 --> 00:26:48.160
went to Liberia and uh, there's
like different power structures your woman in your
382
00:26:48.279 --> 00:26:56.039
field, Like what obstacles and challenges
do you face that your male counterparts may
383
00:26:56.119 --> 00:27:03.880
not like what, yeah, they're
a lot yeah time? Like how long
384
00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:11.480
hungry? I think, first and
foremost, there are certain assumptions that men
385
00:27:11.680 --> 00:27:17.960
make about and this is talking strictly
like binary, right, but like men
386
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:23.160
make about how women should behave and
when women don't behave according to their expected
387
00:27:23.319 --> 00:27:30.119
gender roles, were perceived as bitchy, nasty, aggressive, like all those,
388
00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:33.440
and then that makes it hard to
do business right. So it's things
389
00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:38.440
like I'm in I'm negotiating a multie, you know, like a big contract,
390
00:27:38.839 --> 00:27:42.559
and the guy I'm negotiating against,
who has never negotiated against a woman,
391
00:27:44.200 --> 00:27:48.359
is telling me to smile and be
nicer. Or walking into a studio
392
00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:52.960
where I might be the only woman, and the guy dapts everybody up,
393
00:27:52.240 --> 00:27:57.000
assumes I'm someone's girlfriend and ignores me. But I'm the person that they're supposed
394
00:27:57.000 --> 00:28:00.240
to meet with, right, And
so it's all the kind of preconceived notions
395
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:04.880
that men carry and not just men, because then you know, women also
396
00:28:04.880 --> 00:28:08.480
suffer from patriarchy, and so sometimes
as women we carry that out against each
397
00:28:08.480 --> 00:28:15.480
other as well. So it's things
like that because both like creative industries,
398
00:28:15.599 --> 00:28:26.880
entrepreneurship consulting, are all such relationship
driven businesses. The multiple layers of relationship
399
00:28:26.920 --> 00:28:30.839
building and never knowing if someone is
like really trying to build a relationship with
400
00:28:30.880 --> 00:28:36.599
you, or they're trying to get
at you and they're using business as you
401
00:28:36.640 --> 00:28:40.000
know, or if when someone says
like, hey, let's meet at the
402
00:28:40.039 --> 00:28:44.359
studio, is it really trying to
meet at the studio or are you trying
403
00:28:44.359 --> 00:28:48.559
to get you know, it's and
so these it's like the mental gymnastics that
404
00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:53.279
women have to do all the time
that men don't have to think about.
405
00:28:53.319 --> 00:28:56.160
You don't have to think twice about, hey, yeah, let's just meet
406
00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:00.519
in my hotel room before a show. You don't have to think twice that
407
00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:03.599
that might be a setup or a
ruse or whatever. And then if something
408
00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.599
were to happen, you don't have
to worry that you're gonna get blamed right
409
00:29:07.799 --> 00:29:10.000
for well, why did you go
and you should have known better? But
410
00:29:10.039 --> 00:29:11.720
also then risking will maybe you miss
out on a big deal, you know,
411
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:18.279
right, It's all of that.
It's all the kind of extra work
412
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:23.359
that we have to do as women
that then can that has real life implications
413
00:29:23.359 --> 00:29:27.599
in terms of opportunities contracts, right, business deals, this, that and
414
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:33.759
the end. Yeah. I just
think the whole like gang with them using
415
00:29:33.799 --> 00:29:37.279
like business really tacky. It's really
really gross. Like when I have,
416
00:29:37.400 --> 00:29:38.559
like, you know, when I
meet women for the first time, you
417
00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:41.000
are like really cool. I had
to say, hey, straight up,
418
00:29:41.039 --> 00:29:44.319
like I'm not trying to get you. We're friends, Like I think you're
419
00:29:44.319 --> 00:29:47.319
cute whatever, but like whatever,
but I'm not going to try to like
420
00:29:47.400 --> 00:29:48.680
cross that line. I just want
to let you know. And they're like,
421
00:29:48.680 --> 00:29:52.279
oh my god, I really appreciate
it, and it just goes smoothly
422
00:29:52.279 --> 00:29:57.039
from there because there's no like wondering. I don't like that feeling. So
423
00:29:57.079 --> 00:30:00.240
I like to just put it out
there like, hey, you know,
424
00:30:02.440 --> 00:30:06.200
I just want to let you know, friends cool, I'm not trying to
425
00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:08.640
do anything weird, and it just
really it's I think it's good on both
426
00:30:08.680 --> 00:30:17.480
parties. Yeah, so let's see. Okay, culture Fix what is that?
427
00:30:17.640 --> 00:30:21.960
I love? Culture Fix? Okay. So culture Fix is a global
428
00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:26.359
network of artists, entrepreneurs, activists
who use their platforms for social impact.
429
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:32.880
I co founded it with Natalie Crue
eight years ago now on Twitter. We
430
00:30:32.960 --> 00:30:37.680
met on Twitter during a Twitter chat. Natalie has since left and is doing
431
00:30:37.720 --> 00:30:42.200
amazing work in the meta space with
like NFTs and things like that. But
432
00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:48.839
so Culture Fix really is a space
for artists and creatives who are doing work
433
00:30:48.920 --> 00:30:52.240
that we're told is too radical,
too different, There's there's no audience for
434
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:56.319
this. It's too niche to find
each other, support each other, exchange
435
00:30:56.359 --> 00:31:00.839
resources. So we do a lot
of creative collaborations. We do educational workshops.
436
00:31:02.359 --> 00:31:04.920
We just started a discord that I'm
super excited about. We have a
437
00:31:06.079 --> 00:31:11.440
short Reads book club that's all books
and articles under one hundred pages, because
438
00:31:11.440 --> 00:31:15.200
who has time to read whole books
on political theory when you're working a job,
439
00:31:15.240 --> 00:31:18.279
surviving a pandemic, taking care of
people X, Y, and z.
440
00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:23.000
And so it really is a space
for people to connect and create,
441
00:31:23.880 --> 00:31:29.920
with the basic understanding being that our
struggles are interconnected and we have enough to
442
00:31:29.920 --> 00:31:33.240
succeed, and so the more we
support each other, the more we create
443
00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:38.240
kind of a global good impact.
Something that we discussed in our previous attempt
444
00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:42.880
for podcasting is that but was that
abundance mentality? Like, yeah, what's
445
00:31:42.920 --> 00:31:48.000
that? Is that? Right?
Abundance mentality versus what's the opposite of it,
446
00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:52.200
scarcity or right, Like I mean, growing up rapping, I always
447
00:31:52.240 --> 00:31:55.880
thought, oh, I have to
be the best, and like I have
448
00:31:55.960 --> 00:31:59.680
to I have to like be number
one, and everyone else like fuck them
449
00:31:59.799 --> 00:32:04.279
kind of thing. There's always that
mentality I think, just ingrained. I
450
00:32:04.319 --> 00:32:07.559
don't know if it's competition. I
don't know if it's for the sake of
451
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:13.359
competition. I don't know if it's
if it's a reaction due to insecurity.
452
00:32:14.200 --> 00:32:19.359
But I noticed a few years ago
they're like, hey, this is not
453
00:32:19.480 --> 00:32:22.920
my lane. I don't I don't
like this, right, you know,
454
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:24.680
I don't. I don't care.
Like I mean, it's cool, like
455
00:32:24.720 --> 00:32:29.319
I have that title, but just
on going back and forth and just the
456
00:32:30.200 --> 00:32:34.119
competition maybe I don't know, like
that's not me And that's why I start
457
00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:36.720
rapping like that because I felt like
why am I doing this? It's not
458
00:32:36.799 --> 00:32:40.319
even fun anymore. But talk to
us about just like the scarcity mentality and
459
00:32:40.319 --> 00:32:45.279
abundance mentality and how it kind of
just affects like hip hop or just in
460
00:32:45.359 --> 00:32:51.680
general anything. Yeah, I mean
under again, like under capitalism, we're
461
00:32:52.039 --> 00:32:55.200
conditioned to believe that the things we
value the most are the most scarce.
462
00:32:55.440 --> 00:33:00.400
Yeah, and this isn't just like
money, it's also things like love.
463
00:33:00.440 --> 00:33:02.920
We treat love like a transaction,
or we treat supporting other. If I
464
00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:07.880
support you too much, you're not
gonna like you're gonna take something away from
465
00:33:07.880 --> 00:33:12.240
me. And these are all they're
false, like they're false constructs. And
466
00:33:12.319 --> 00:33:15.640
so when we come from that place
of that scarcity mindset that there's not enough
467
00:33:15.720 --> 00:33:20.880
so I have to hoard it for
myself, or that barrel of crabs mentality
468
00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:22.960
right where I gotta like step on
you to get on top because you might
469
00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:29.039
take away from me, those are
not real, Like that's not real.
470
00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:31.279
Those are things that we've been told
or true, and so we make them
471
00:33:31.319 --> 00:33:36.200
true by kind of acting that way. The flip of that is this abundance
472
00:33:36.319 --> 00:33:40.480
mentality, which is we have everything
we need to succeed me. It's low
473
00:33:40.519 --> 00:33:45.599
if for folks who are like familiar
with polyamory, it's kind of a polyamorous
474
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:49.319
mentality, like there is enough for
all of us, and me giving to
475
00:33:49.359 --> 00:33:52.279
you doesn't take away from what I
have for myself or what I can give
476
00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:58.079
to someone else. And so in
this construct, the more we support each
477
00:33:58.079 --> 00:34:01.000
other, the more we all win, and it allows for collaboration and interdependence
478
00:34:01.039 --> 00:34:06.079
and cross pollination. And we see
that are you know, from a political
479
00:34:06.119 --> 00:34:12.119
perspective, our struggles are interconnected.
From a business or marketing perspective, our
480
00:34:12.199 --> 00:34:16.039
success is interconnected. From a community
perspective, are like looking out for each
481
00:34:16.039 --> 00:34:21.079
other, you know, we all
win and so it's just a different way
482
00:34:21.119 --> 00:34:25.119
I think of valuing people and interacting
with one another. Yeah, I like
483
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:29.760
that a lot better. I feel
like, yeah, there's playing a room
484
00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:32.840
to succeed and just we don't have
to, like, I don't know,
485
00:34:34.039 --> 00:34:36.440
step on each other to like you're
on top. I think a lot of
486
00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:39.039
you know, I think everyone has
like it's like a pyramid almost right,
487
00:34:39.119 --> 00:34:42.599
like, oh, there's going to
be one. I think the higher you
488
00:34:42.639 --> 00:34:45.880
go, the less space theres for
people. But I think there's different levels
489
00:34:45.880 --> 00:34:50.119
of success. I learned that from
you in Stow. Just like there's different
490
00:34:50.199 --> 00:34:52.960
levels. You don't have to like
be mega drake famous. It's like maybe
491
00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:54.920
that's not what everyone wants to be. I don't want to be like that.
492
00:34:55.280 --> 00:34:59.840
I want to go to a grocery
store and like shop in piece.
493
00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:01.079
I don't want to you know,
like I want to you know, it's
494
00:35:01.159 --> 00:35:05.840
nice when I was younger, maybe
that was cool, like when you're I
495
00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:07.960
was younger. Oh, I want
to be famous, but like seeing now
496
00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:13.480
what we've seen on social media,
like just you know, people of like
497
00:35:14.440 --> 00:35:17.239
celebrities, like what they have to
deal with on social media and everything they're
498
00:35:17.280 --> 00:35:21.719
getting stock they're getting there, I
just sleep. I don't want that,
499
00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:23.320
you know. I want to be
able to, like, you know,
500
00:35:23.400 --> 00:35:27.840
make money off of what I do, live comfortably. But I want like
501
00:35:27.880 --> 00:35:30.679
my own privacy, which is also
I think something you and I have talked
502
00:35:30.679 --> 00:35:36.599
a lot about, which is protecting
your like mental health is like personal well
503
00:35:36.639 --> 00:35:40.159
being is just as much part of
the definition of success that we can create,
504
00:35:42.400 --> 00:35:45.039
where like it doesn't. It's not
just how much money you make or
505
00:35:45.079 --> 00:35:47.559
how many streams you have, but
like what's the quality of life and getting
506
00:35:47.639 --> 00:35:52.360
to create what you want. I
heard, well, everyone listening to this
507
00:35:52.360 --> 00:35:55.639
probably knows Eminem, but I heard
the like he can't even go out without
508
00:35:55.679 --> 00:36:00.440
like security detail he's too famous.
Like I mean, he has all the
509
00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:02.519
money, but he can't. It'll
be tough. I enjoy just like that,
510
00:36:04.480 --> 00:36:07.360
you know, like just going out
as a regular person without getting a
511
00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:08.280
bunch of people. Oh my god, Heylen, how's it going? You
512
00:36:08.320 --> 00:36:12.559
know? So, yeah, there's
like that too, or it's like,
513
00:36:12.880 --> 00:36:16.079
I don't know, I don't know
if I mean, it's like if we
514
00:36:16.159 --> 00:36:22.840
start the question of what kind of
life do I want to lead, and
515
00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:27.079
then you build your business plan from
there, and then you develop your creative
516
00:36:27.119 --> 00:36:30.199
strategy from there, it's a different
approach than like, oh, I need
517
00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:35.559
to make like X million dollars or
this. You know, it changes kind
518
00:36:35.559 --> 00:36:40.360
of your whole relationship to your work. That then work becomes part of your
519
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:45.280
life versus your living to work,
which most of us don't want to do.
520
00:36:45.320 --> 00:36:50.519
And I would argue that a lot
of the people who do like live
521
00:36:50.599 --> 00:36:55.039
to work are running away from other
things and it's an ego thing. But
522
00:36:55.159 --> 00:36:59.119
yeah, yeah, we can kind
of create the kind of lives we want
523
00:36:59.159 --> 00:37:05.480
to live. Yeah, so I
know. On your Twitter bio it says
524
00:37:05.719 --> 00:37:09.760
anti capitalist Business Coach for Creative entrepreneurs
Hip, Hop and Mental Health from a
525
00:37:09.800 --> 00:37:15.400
global perspective. What in your opinion, how is capitalism flawed and how does
526
00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:20.440
it type to hip hop and mental
health. So the simple answer is,
527
00:37:20.559 --> 00:37:25.400
I think capitalism. Capitalism will always
put profit over people, right, And
528
00:37:25.480 --> 00:37:30.880
as long as you put profit over
people, people will suffer, right,
529
00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:35.159
And we're seeing that right, Like, I legitimately don't know anyone who's like,
530
00:37:35.320 --> 00:37:38.440
really really okay. Right now,
we're more than two years into a
531
00:37:38.480 --> 00:37:45.159
pandemic. There's at least forty active
conflicts happening around the world. Outside of
532
00:37:45.159 --> 00:37:49.360
the big ones, we have loved
ones who are incarcerated, people can't afford
533
00:37:49.400 --> 00:37:53.119
gas or how is it like the
world is fucked and under capitalism, we're
534
00:37:53.159 --> 00:37:57.519
told to just keep going. This
is our new normal. It's right.
535
00:37:57.559 --> 00:38:00.679
It's like that meme where everything's on
fire, the guys like just sitting there
536
00:38:00.719 --> 00:38:10.880
drinking his tea and so. And
I think hip hop oftentimes upholds capitalist values,
537
00:38:12.920 --> 00:38:17.719
especially now as like hip hop has
become more mainstream. Sometimes I think
538
00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:21.480
about the ways that hip hop has
been co opted, and is hip hop
539
00:38:21.559 --> 00:38:25.880
still hip hop if it's no longer
challenging or questioning systems of power as it
540
00:38:25.960 --> 00:38:31.840
once was doing, is now kind
of complicit in some of these things that
541
00:38:32.039 --> 00:38:38.639
thirty years ago it was challenging and
criticizing. So that, to me is
542
00:38:38.679 --> 00:38:43.599
the kind of intersection capitalism is making
us all sick and hip hop is kind
543
00:38:43.599 --> 00:38:46.119
of in some ways can be not
all hip hop, right, and like
544
00:38:46.199 --> 00:38:50.559
around the world hip hop is very
very different. But if we're looking at
545
00:38:50.599 --> 00:38:54.719
like mainstream hip hop in the US, I think there's an argument to be
546
00:38:54.760 --> 00:39:02.039
made for how complicit hip hop is
in this like uphold of consumerism and capitalism.
547
00:39:02.159 --> 00:39:05.880
Yeah, definitely, And you know
it's weird. With consumerism, I'm
548
00:39:05.960 --> 00:39:08.480
learning I realize just like self inventory
with time, Like sometimes a lot of
549
00:39:08.519 --> 00:39:13.159
times I buy stuff for ju,
stuff that cost plenty so I can feel
550
00:39:13.159 --> 00:39:15.639
better, right, Like, oh, like I'm stressed out, I'm going
551
00:39:15.679 --> 00:39:21.039
to get sushi or get fucked up
or like oh, you know, like
552
00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:22.800
I feel a lot better if I
like got this to X, Y and
553
00:39:22.960 --> 00:39:27.360
Z, you know, and something. I'm kind of realizing like, oh,
554
00:39:27.480 --> 00:39:30.760
okay, that's that's what that is. Sorry, no, no,
555
00:39:30.760 --> 00:39:34.599
I was just gonna it makes me
think about. It's something that Tupac used
556
00:39:34.639 --> 00:39:38.840
to talk about, is this idea
of conspicuous consumption that in a world,
557
00:39:38.960 --> 00:39:44.719
especially for people of color, where
we've been told like we're not worth shit,
558
00:39:45.719 --> 00:39:51.440
we've under capitalism been conditioned to buy
things and buy things publicly and visibly
559
00:39:52.119 --> 00:39:55.000
because we've been conditioned to think that
that's where our worth is. Oh,
560
00:39:55.079 --> 00:40:00.559
look at the fancy car, my
jewelry or these shoes or this name or
561
00:40:00.559 --> 00:40:07.400
whatever, because we think that wealth
will literally like buy our acceptance under these
562
00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:13.079
systems of oppression. And so again
it's like the way that we're gaslighting ourselves,
563
00:40:13.119 --> 00:40:16.440
right, We're playing these tricks or
doing these mental gymnastics to make life
564
00:40:16.559 --> 00:40:23.159
under a harmful system, a painful
system manageable. But then it doesn't work
565
00:40:23.199 --> 00:40:28.960
because no amount of like fancy jewelry
is going to make up for the microaggressions
566
00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:31.679
you're experiencing at work. So I
think these are some of the things.
567
00:40:31.960 --> 00:40:36.159
And so part of what I do
is, as like from the anti capitalist
568
00:40:36.360 --> 00:40:40.280
perspective, is helping people think about
what it looks like for them to operate
569
00:40:40.440 --> 00:40:46.440
kind of free of those systems or
imagining yeah, that different ways are actually
570
00:40:46.519 --> 00:40:51.199
possible. Right. I'll get back
into the hip hop at mental health in
571
00:40:51.239 --> 00:40:53.440
a bit. But so what you
do, what you still do where I
572
00:40:53.480 --> 00:40:58.079
realize like what I really know like
a brand, right, Like you have
573
00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:00.800
to find what is your brand?
Oh? Sorry, what is your brand?
574
00:41:00.840 --> 00:41:02.199
I thought, like when I think
a brand, I think of like
575
00:41:02.440 --> 00:41:07.599
you know, designer like companies.
I just thought, for maybe I don't
576
00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:12.679
know, ten to fifteen years of
making rapping that I just got to make
577
00:41:12.760 --> 00:41:20.480
music. Rights it, make music, keep doing it. Eventually you're like
578
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:23.480
get to some it's some like very
vague goal like I'm gonna get to the
579
00:41:23.480 --> 00:41:28.280
top one day, you know,
without realizing what a brand is and how
580
00:41:29.239 --> 00:41:32.719
much of an impact like that can
make aside from just making music. So
581
00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:37.480
what is a brand? And like
how do you I don't know, show
582
00:41:37.719 --> 00:41:40.840
clients like what their brand is or
what their niche is. Yeah, and
583
00:41:40.880 --> 00:41:45.320
shout out to Stowe, who's my
co host at office hours with Nora and
584
00:41:45.360 --> 00:41:52.119
Stoe. So I think, and
I think especially now right like if we
585
00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:55.880
looked I don't know, like fifty
sixty years ago, the way that people
586
00:41:55.960 --> 00:42:02.000
consumed information came from a few standards
sources. So there was a kind of
587
00:42:02.039 --> 00:42:07.199
acceptance of the limited exposure that you
would have to something, and so the
588
00:42:07.320 --> 00:42:10.920
narratives were easily controlled. And so
you saw I don't know, a commercial,
589
00:42:12.079 --> 00:42:14.920
you saw Coca Cola commercial. Everybody
was like with their family, they
590
00:42:14.920 --> 00:42:16.239
were drinking, they were so happy, and you're like, cool, that's
591
00:42:16.280 --> 00:42:22.000
like the Coca Cola vibe. And
that's the brand association we start to make.
592
00:42:22.440 --> 00:42:25.599
I think now, because we have
so many different platforms and so many
593
00:42:25.599 --> 00:42:34.199
different channels through which we're consuming information, people want more context and so branding
594
00:42:34.480 --> 00:42:38.199
now, especially for like independence or
like smaller, smaller kind of creatives or
595
00:42:38.320 --> 00:42:45.239
entrepreneurs, it's about context and connection, and so the brand is nothing more
596
00:42:45.280 --> 00:42:47.800
than like your reputation and your personality. Okay, that makes a lot of
597
00:42:47.920 --> 00:42:52.639
sense. It's like how you show
up. It's how you're vulnerable, it's
598
00:42:52.719 --> 00:42:55.320
how you know. Sometimes it is, as much as I hate to admit
599
00:42:55.320 --> 00:42:59.760
it, the way we look,
because that can you know if I walked
600
00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:04.159
around with like a mohawk and purple
hair, that would communicate something to you,
601
00:43:04.480 --> 00:43:08.199
like punk music, right, Like
we make interpretations, right, but
602
00:43:08.280 --> 00:43:13.519
it's not. I think people focus
a lot on like what's my font,
603
00:43:13.639 --> 00:43:16.280
what's my color? But like that
has no personality, it has no soul.
604
00:43:16.880 --> 00:43:21.760
Versus like when we get on a
podcast together, how are we talking
605
00:43:21.840 --> 00:43:24.119
or what's the energy? What kind
of words are we using? It's it's
606
00:43:24.159 --> 00:43:29.639
how we show up and hold space
for the people in our communities and communities
607
00:43:29.679 --> 00:43:34.119
being your customers or your clients or
your fan base. So yeah, it's
608
00:43:34.360 --> 00:43:39.400
branding is really about just authentic connection
and personality because if you over time over
609
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:43.079
sessions, I think with me,
it's like harm reduction is one. Yes,
610
00:43:43.159 --> 00:43:45.880
that's like you know pretty much people
are going to use drug alcohol,
611
00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:51.000
might as well educate them, like
with how to do it in a safer
612
00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:53.920
way? Is where does that sound? But especially today going on as like
613
00:43:53.960 --> 00:43:59.400
a lot of overdoses because of fentannel. It's what that is. People don't
614
00:43:59.440 --> 00:44:06.000
know. It's it's just like synthetic
opioid. It was originally made for like
615
00:44:06.320 --> 00:44:08.800
you know, people that cancer a
lot of pain, but now it's mass
616
00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:14.480
marketed and it's been somehow over the
years been put in a lot of drugs
617
00:44:14.920 --> 00:44:17.360
like cocaine for sure, is everything
in general, And now there's place like
618
00:44:17.400 --> 00:44:22.280
end Overdose or just a lot of
nonprofits that provide fen and all test strips
619
00:44:22.599 --> 00:44:25.719
which can tell you like you know, we put whatever you have into the
620
00:44:25.719 --> 00:44:29.639
strip, it will tell you if
it has PenTile or not, and that
621
00:44:29.639 --> 00:44:34.360
can really help prevent overdoses and deaths. That and like you know, how
622
00:44:34.400 --> 00:44:38.239
to show how to look for signs
of like someone is about the overdose or
623
00:44:38.280 --> 00:44:42.360
just like you know, their pupils
or their heart rate and like what to
624
00:44:42.440 --> 00:44:46.679
do. I believe in California,
if you call nine one one some oh
625
00:44:46.760 --> 00:44:49.800
dude, you're not gonna get You're
I don't think it'll get charged. You
626
00:44:49.800 --> 00:44:53.480
don't get in trouble. So there's
there's something then, just like you know,
627
00:44:53.519 --> 00:44:58.480
empathy and compassionate people who use,
because it's not like some people don't
628
00:44:58.559 --> 00:45:00.679
use just to like do what they've
feel like they have to, like chemical
629
00:45:00.679 --> 00:45:06.480
stuff, and just all about the
destigmatization of just drug users in general,
630
00:45:07.079 --> 00:45:13.280
that mental health. It's obvious enough
mental health is really important, that kind
631
00:45:13.320 --> 00:45:16.400
of stuff. Yeah, So I
just want to like uplift what you just
632
00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:22.039
said. That testing strips are really
easy to get and super safe, like
633
00:45:22.039 --> 00:45:25.400
like literally life savers. You can
also get narcan really easily arcanto, which
634
00:45:25.440 --> 00:45:30.280
is if someone does have an overdose, it's like almost a quick reversal yea.
635
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:32.239
And there's tons of places where you
can get that for free, and
636
00:45:32.360 --> 00:45:37.400
especially now like you really should test
everything. But so this makes me really
637
00:45:37.440 --> 00:45:43.239
happy because when we first started working
together, you were so against talking about
638
00:45:43.400 --> 00:45:46.599
any of these things. Yeah,
and so now like it is I think
639
00:45:46.599 --> 00:45:51.599
part of what makes your voice so
unique that you're talking about the harm reduction,
640
00:45:51.679 --> 00:45:53.599
you're talking about the mental health,
and you're talking about it in ways
641
00:45:54.119 --> 00:45:58.800
that is very different than like how
I would talk about it or how someone
642
00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:02.079
else. And I think that is
what makes someone because you know you've heard
643
00:46:02.159 --> 00:46:07.679
me say this before. People.
Music, art, even our like affiliation
644
00:46:07.800 --> 00:46:10.280
with brands, is an emotional thing, right, our favorite artists. We
645
00:46:10.320 --> 00:46:15.400
don't like our favorite artists because they're
fucking great rappers. We like them because
646
00:46:15.760 --> 00:46:19.239
oh I like I like this person, or they make me feel good about
647
00:46:19.239 --> 00:46:22.119
myself or whatever. And so it's
been really dope to watch you lean into
648
00:46:22.159 --> 00:46:25.880
these things that like a year and
a half ago, you were definitely shying
649
00:46:25.880 --> 00:46:29.880
away from. Yeah, I think
a lot of it was just I don't
650
00:46:29.880 --> 00:46:30.800
know what people think, but I
was like, this is me. I
651
00:46:30.800 --> 00:46:35.159
think a lot of it was honestly
my family, but like, I don't
652
00:46:35.159 --> 00:46:37.920
think that have Instagram. Well some
of them do, but like my uncle's
653
00:46:37.960 --> 00:46:39.039
clear to say anything. You know, that's cool. I like what you're
654
00:46:39.079 --> 00:46:43.880
doing, but I'm only on social
media, which is great. My dad,
655
00:46:43.920 --> 00:46:45.719
I am. I think you try
to add me on like Facebook,
656
00:46:45.760 --> 00:46:49.559
I don't know you found oh we
have mutual friends as like our my cousband
657
00:46:49.639 --> 00:46:52.639
mutual friend. But I don't.
My rule is I don't add family members
658
00:46:52.679 --> 00:46:57.280
on Facebook just because like we're not
friends or family, you know. I
659
00:46:57.400 --> 00:47:00.320
like to keep that, you know, divine come up with like a family
660
00:47:00.440 --> 00:47:06.360
app. Yeah, you could just
keep it separate. Yeah, I don't
661
00:47:06.360 --> 00:47:08.280
know. I know a lot of
my family uses Facebook to communicate. I
662
00:47:08.400 --> 00:47:13.119
use it for other reasons like make
memes and like shit posts and just don't
663
00:47:13.159 --> 00:47:15.320
they get it. I think they
always be like, what is he doing?
664
00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:17.039
You know, for them, it's
very serious. Okay, here's a
665
00:47:17.039 --> 00:47:21.639
picture of like, you know,
like our fiftieth family gathering. Here's richer
666
00:47:21.639 --> 00:47:22.800
of me and my grandson, that
kind of stuff. I don't use it
667
00:47:22.840 --> 00:47:27.760
for that. I am very selective
of who I ad just because I post
668
00:47:27.800 --> 00:47:30.000
stuff there that like I don't want
everyone to know. So there's that.
669
00:47:30.880 --> 00:47:34.519
But yeah, I was kind of
worried about like what my family would think.
670
00:47:34.559 --> 00:47:37.519
I think, deep down I think
that was my thing because I always
671
00:47:37.559 --> 00:47:42.599
felt like I was so like outside
of just like what their expectations were.
672
00:47:42.880 --> 00:47:45.679
I don't want to like make it
worse, but I'm not honestly like looking
673
00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:52.119
at it from a big perspective.
I'm not really promoting anything negative. I'm
674
00:47:52.119 --> 00:47:55.679
not no, so I think that's
well, you know, I'll beat me.
675
00:47:57.039 --> 00:48:00.360
You know, my mom recently seen
my tattoo. She's cool with it.
676
00:48:00.440 --> 00:48:02.840
My dad's cool with it. She
says, as long as you don't
677
00:48:02.840 --> 00:48:07.159
get it below your elbow. But
I'm gonna do it because I don't know
678
00:48:07.159 --> 00:48:12.039
that for you, if you notice
reverse psychology, how it is with your
679
00:48:12.039 --> 00:48:15.199
mom or your family, Like if
they tell you not to do something,
680
00:48:15.639 --> 00:48:17.079
you'll do it. I don't know
how it is. But like for me,
681
00:48:17.199 --> 00:48:21.920
I feel like one mom says don't
do this, X, Y,
682
00:48:21.960 --> 00:48:25.119
and Z, I think subconsciously I
want to rebel against that and do it.
683
00:48:27.079 --> 00:48:30.280
I don't know, you have like
a in psychology, they'll call it
684
00:48:30.320 --> 00:48:35.239
like an automatic note, you know. For me, like I understand that
685
00:48:35.280 --> 00:48:38.920
when my mom says, like my
mom has aversion to tattoos, not because
686
00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:45.599
there's anything inherently wrong with tattoos,
but it's her conditioning coming from Iran that
687
00:48:45.679 --> 00:48:51.199
like only criminals got tattoos, and
she just hasn't been able to unlearn that.
688
00:48:52.119 --> 00:48:54.679
Or We've been having a lot of
talk lately about drugs and there's a
689
00:48:54.719 --> 00:49:00.920
lot of research being done with like
ketamine for depression and MDM for depression and
690
00:49:00.960 --> 00:49:02.679
things like that. My mom's a
mental health she's like a therapist. Oh,
691
00:49:04.079 --> 00:49:09.480
but she's like no drugs never.
But it's not because she's consciously reacting
692
00:49:09.519 --> 00:49:15.199
to like new research. It's her
conditioning from like a gazillion years ago.
693
00:49:15.679 --> 00:49:21.760
So I've learned not to take her
and like the I don't really take the
694
00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:23.840
rest of my family seriously at all, but like my mom is the one
695
00:49:23.840 --> 00:49:29.440
where I'm like, uh, you
trigger me. But it's just stuff that
696
00:49:29.480 --> 00:49:34.239
she has to unlearn, right.
I mean, like I could have told
697
00:49:34.280 --> 00:49:36.840
you like ten years ago that you
can use keny for depression. I don't
698
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:37.960
know why that was a big fucking
deal, Dude, I told you,
699
00:49:38.039 --> 00:49:40.960
I told you. MDMA does that, bro, Like that's why people take
700
00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:43.760
it, bro, That's why I
took it all the time. Broad fucking
701
00:49:43.760 --> 00:49:46.039
world so much, dude, Like
holy shit, Like, I'm glad I
702
00:49:46.079 --> 00:49:50.039
had good pills of poke balls,
but fuck, dude, I just I
703
00:49:50.079 --> 00:49:52.199
don't know. I'm glad I'm like
able to like have a like I can
704
00:49:52.320 --> 00:49:55.880
like talk and everything because there was
that big Oh my god, I put
705
00:49:55.880 --> 00:50:00.519
holes in your brain, you pull
like harm reduction, like, oh,
706
00:50:00.639 --> 00:50:01.920
you take ten pills a fucking holding
your b beIN. What the fuck,
707
00:50:02.000 --> 00:50:06.079
dude, Like I take Well,
I'm not gonna say that, but like,
708
00:50:06.639 --> 00:50:07.760
is that that's the kind of stuff, right, like oh, you
709
00:50:07.800 --> 00:50:12.719
try just want your hooked, No, not really, like you don't get
710
00:50:12.760 --> 00:50:15.639
hooked for the first time smoking heroin. Like I just fucking threw up,
711
00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:17.159
and it was like, oh,
okay, that was weird. It was
712
00:50:17.199 --> 00:50:22.079
the conditional like, oh, it's
kind of cool because I think for me,
713
00:50:22.519 --> 00:50:24.320
I want, okay, cocain is
too early, I want to mellow
714
00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:28.400
out. And I took it and
I just it was kind of weird.
715
00:50:28.400 --> 00:50:30.079
I almost threw up, you know, I did throw up, and then
716
00:50:30.280 --> 00:50:35.760
okay, I'm never doing that again. But then like slowly but surely,
717
00:50:36.239 --> 00:50:37.320
it kept up on me, and
I realized, oh, fuck, Like
718
00:50:37.360 --> 00:50:42.000
this is different because I was so
used to just taking stimulants that when I
719
00:50:42.039 --> 00:50:47.199
started taking like donners or opiates that
when you try to stop, it's kind
720
00:50:47.199 --> 00:50:52.360
of it's not intense because your body
goes to like physical withdrawals, which is
721
00:50:52.400 --> 00:50:59.880
something again like harm reduction stuff.
You should know if you know, if
722
00:50:59.880 --> 00:51:02.280
you are friends or you do it, they're like, it's a lot different,
723
00:51:02.719 --> 00:51:06.440
you're gonna feel like shit kind of
stuff as opposed to them saying,
724
00:51:06.440 --> 00:51:07.840
oh, just say no, right, But then like for the people who
725
00:51:07.880 --> 00:51:13.880
do it, they're just labeled as
like I mean, there's a lot of
726
00:51:13.920 --> 00:51:22.679
also like virtue signaling and moral like
peacocking around drug, and a lot of
727
00:51:22.679 --> 00:51:27.840
that I think is rooted in puritanical
ideas of like what's good and what's bad
728
00:51:27.960 --> 00:51:30.960
and what and you know, like
we can trace the history of drug is
729
00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:34.000
a super racist in the US,
and like there's all this stuff around it.
730
00:51:35.519 --> 00:51:37.440
But I think you're right that,
like, as with any kind of
731
00:51:37.519 --> 00:51:42.599
abstinence education, you create like just
say no, which doesn't work and also
732
00:51:42.639 --> 00:51:45.800
doesn't teach people how to learn how
different stuff. And this is true if
733
00:51:45.800 --> 00:51:50.280
we're talking about sugar coffee, like
anything, right, how it impacts your
734
00:51:50.320 --> 00:51:52.320
body and what you need to do
to protect yourself and then protect the people
735
00:51:52.320 --> 00:51:57.480
that you love. Because we know
that the just say no shit, they're
736
00:51:57.559 --> 00:52:02.119
like magically backfired. Know it's weird, it's back I really I've seen it
737
00:52:02.159 --> 00:52:07.119
at the CVS, Like there's kids
like or high school people like manning it.
738
00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:10.199
I don't know, I want to
check that table. But like but
739
00:52:10.239 --> 00:52:13.360
I was like, you know what
I said, I'm like, you know
740
00:52:13.440 --> 00:52:17.800
what, They're coming from a different
aspect. I think maybe the goal is
741
00:52:17.840 --> 00:52:22.719
the same as to like not want
people to like overdose and everything, but
742
00:52:22.320 --> 00:52:24.920
we go out in different ways.
That's their thing, this is my thing.
743
00:52:24.960 --> 00:52:28.639
I'm not going to like harass them
for it. But it's back.
744
00:52:28.719 --> 00:52:31.800
I don't know what their new thing
is. But yeah, I think there's
745
00:52:31.840 --> 00:52:35.559
that one meme where it's like,
oh, like you feel the dear line.
746
00:52:35.639 --> 00:52:39.159
You know, we feel them because
that and like that weird commercial where
747
00:52:39.199 --> 00:52:44.440
like it's your brain on drugs and
like it was like pan fry and there
748
00:52:44.519 --> 00:52:49.079
was that person's deflate on the couch. Yeah, I don't know. I
749
00:52:49.119 --> 00:52:52.000
mean like I used to kind of
like demonize that stuff too, and so
750
00:52:52.039 --> 00:52:54.280
I try, oh, it's not
like so bad. And I kind of
751
00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:58.280
saw people in different lives who do
it. And again there's a lot of
752
00:52:58.320 --> 00:53:04.000
people, maybe people you don't even
know your coworkers, family friends take drugs
753
00:53:04.000 --> 00:53:07.880
and have normal lives. But then
there's also people that like take it and
754
00:53:07.960 --> 00:53:12.719
just like gets low on proportion,
and you know, I don't know,
755
00:53:12.840 --> 00:53:16.400
I just feel like for me,
when people were like shame me for it,
756
00:53:16.480 --> 00:53:20.639
I doubled down and it's like kind
of distanced myself. I think that's
757
00:53:20.639 --> 00:53:23.400
something that like we should be mindful
of when we're dealing with you know,
758
00:53:23.440 --> 00:53:27.360
people are not lives that you know
may need help, but like we kind
759
00:53:27.360 --> 00:53:30.599
of pull a fucking intervention when they
don't even know it, you know,
760
00:53:30.639 --> 00:53:36.239
and like shame them and everything.
And you know, it's like a moral
761
00:53:36.320 --> 00:53:37.840
thing. But I think a lot
of people people do that because they want
762
00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:42.360
to feel right, but they're not
considering what that person feels like because what
763
00:53:42.400 --> 00:53:45.920
they're gonna do is they're gonna like
avoids you even more. And with all
764
00:53:45.920 --> 00:53:50.000
this stuff in the drugs now they
might you know Odi, you know,
765
00:53:51.039 --> 00:53:54.440
so yeah that kind of stuff.
Yeah, it's not effective. Yeah,
766
00:53:54.880 --> 00:53:59.320
I mean it's effective in making it's
effective in making it like worse, but
767
00:53:59.360 --> 00:54:04.920
not better. What you're doing is
like talking to you know, clients about
768
00:54:05.519 --> 00:54:13.039
branding and everything where social media comes
into play. Like we are people,
769
00:54:13.719 --> 00:54:17.960
entrepreneurs whatever. They use social media
like a benchmark, right, like the
770
00:54:19.239 --> 00:54:27.400
likes, engagement views. They use
it as like a benchmark to for their
771
00:54:27.599 --> 00:54:31.960
self worth or like if they're they're
worth as an artist, right, can
772
00:54:31.960 --> 00:54:37.679
you talk to us about that?
I mean, I think it's just what
773
00:54:37.719 --> 00:54:42.199
you said, right. People judge
their own value based on how many streams
774
00:54:42.199 --> 00:54:44.920
they got, how many likes they
got, how many comments they got.
775
00:54:45.719 --> 00:54:49.480
But it's a false measure, right, right, it doesn't actually mean anything.
776
00:54:49.519 --> 00:54:53.559
And you can have fans who never
follow you on Instagram, but they
777
00:54:54.199 --> 00:54:58.639
open every email you send or they
talk about you to other people. And
778
00:54:58.679 --> 00:55:01.280
you can have people who like everything
that you post, but they never show
779
00:55:01.360 --> 00:55:07.119
up to a show. And so
again, like if we remember that social
780
00:55:07.159 --> 00:55:13.440
media does not exist to support your
business really so no, so like Instagram,
781
00:55:13.840 --> 00:55:19.039
Yeah, yeah, like Instagram,
instagram purpose is not to boost you
782
00:55:19.159 --> 00:55:23.079
or amplify you. And we can
complain about algorithms all day, but Instagram
783
00:55:23.119 --> 00:55:28.159
exists to get you to keep going
to the app and opening the app.
784
00:55:28.239 --> 00:55:30.840
Right, the more times you open
the app, the more money they make
785
00:55:30.920 --> 00:55:34.840
because they have more users and they
have more activity. And then the more
786
00:55:35.360 --> 00:55:37.280
the algorithm is difficult for you,
the more you're gonna buy ads, and
787
00:55:37.280 --> 00:55:40.679
so that's more money in their pockets. Right, So, like, if
788
00:55:40.719 --> 00:55:46.960
we understand that while social media is
a tool, it's purpose is always going
789
00:55:47.039 --> 00:55:51.239
to be to make money for the
company, right, not your company,
790
00:55:51.559 --> 00:55:57.679
their own company. Then I think
it becomes important for because then we get
791
00:55:57.679 --> 00:56:00.440
into that place of like critical self
judgment. Right, howk Uan has a
792
00:56:00.440 --> 00:56:04.480
million streams and I only have twenty
four. How come so and so do
793
00:56:04.719 --> 00:56:07.360
this? Or they did this and
they went viral, So let me try
794
00:56:07.360 --> 00:56:14.599
that too, And we start comparing
ourselves to falsehoods without seeing the full picture
795
00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:19.679
of anything anyway. And so that's
that mental health piece right right. And
796
00:56:19.760 --> 00:56:23.760
so I think if you focus on
building genuine direct relationships with your customers or
797
00:56:23.800 --> 00:56:29.000
your clients. I'm huge on newsletters. I think everybody should have a newsletter,
798
00:56:29.119 --> 00:56:32.000
even if you only have three subscribers. That's like back in the day
799
00:56:32.239 --> 00:56:36.519
we used to write notes and pass
notes in class. Like your newsletter is
800
00:56:36.519 --> 00:56:39.400
like passing notes to your friends,
and you can build it out that way.
801
00:56:39.440 --> 00:56:45.599
And so I think it's just important
to remember that social media is not
802
00:56:45.719 --> 00:56:50.639
a reflection or a measure of anything, right. And I have time this
803
00:56:50.760 --> 00:56:52.199
back to earlier when I said hip
hop and mental health like what I do.
804
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:55.519
Sometimes I definitely feel that way.
Like a lot of times I know
805
00:56:55.639 --> 00:57:01.719
that Instagram definitely has been reducing your
visibility over the years, and the option
806
00:57:02.199 --> 00:57:08.639
of buying or promoting your ads for
money has more prominent. I've seen more
807
00:57:08.679 --> 00:57:14.559
sponsored posts. I did it before
too, and like it's I think I
808
00:57:14.599 --> 00:57:16.519
did it just you know, see
what it was like. And there was
809
00:57:16.559 --> 00:57:21.440
like that false sense of, oh, I feel better about myself because I
810
00:57:21.440 --> 00:57:23.519
have more views, because I have
more likes. I mean, you know,
811
00:57:23.559 --> 00:57:25.840
I'm not gonna lie. It's cool. It's a little dobamine hit,
812
00:57:25.960 --> 00:57:31.480
you know, but you know,
when they I don't know, just when
813
00:57:31.519 --> 00:57:36.480
you rely on that too much,
it can really have an impact on your
814
00:57:36.599 --> 00:57:42.320
like feeling of self worth as like
an artist entrepreneur. And yeah, definitely,
815
00:57:42.440 --> 00:57:45.519
like it's just something to be mindful
of. I mean a lot of
816
00:57:45.599 --> 00:57:47.039
us tend to do it, but
now when I do it, I try
817
00:57:47.039 --> 00:57:51.880
to like have a dialogue on my
head. Okay, this is like they're
818
00:57:51.920 --> 00:57:54.880
doing their own thing, like they're
you know, maybe it's their only job,
819
00:57:54.880 --> 00:57:58.199
but there are only things to make
music, so obviously they have more
820
00:57:58.199 --> 00:58:00.400
content, or they have more time
or I don't even know the time.
821
00:58:00.400 --> 00:58:02.159
It's like, so why would I
even't care? Let me just focus on
822
00:58:02.199 --> 00:58:06.719
me. And also too. I've
said it before in previous episodes, where
823
00:58:06.800 --> 00:58:09.440
social media is like a highlight reel. Right, this is not real life.
824
00:58:09.480 --> 00:58:14.800
I mean we post the best pictures, the coolest things, you know,
825
00:58:15.519 --> 00:58:17.400
not so much day to day stuff, but like, you know,
826
00:58:17.480 --> 00:58:22.360
but we're conditioned to think this is
like every day. We're conditioned to think
827
00:58:22.440 --> 00:58:25.639
like stuff happens in one minute or
like this person blew up quote unquote overnight
828
00:58:27.000 --> 00:58:30.039
when this person's been working at it
for like ten plus years. Yes,
829
00:58:30.440 --> 00:58:34.000
right, And the other part of
it is just real quick like and there's
830
00:58:34.079 --> 00:58:37.960
been so much written about this about
how addictive social media is, but we
831
00:58:38.000 --> 00:58:42.440
don't realize that we're addicted to it. And so there is you know,
832
00:58:42.599 --> 00:58:46.079
like you mentioned the dopamute hit,
there is something really real when you realize
833
00:58:46.079 --> 00:58:50.800
that you're like, wait, why
did I open this? Why I've been
834
00:58:50.840 --> 00:58:54.199
scrolling mindlessly? Like, And so
there's real kind of mental health effects.
835
00:58:54.599 --> 00:59:00.639
And so if we're not careful about
setting really clear boundaries and being hyper kind
836
00:59:00.639 --> 00:59:05.239
of vigilant or hyper conscious of like, my value is not in these likes
837
00:59:05.280 --> 00:59:07.559
and this is not the place where
I'm gonna find connection or whatever it might
838
00:59:07.599 --> 00:59:10.559
be, it can become easy to
get caught up in it without realizing that
839
00:59:10.559 --> 00:59:14.599
they were caught up in it.
And I have so much empathy for the
840
00:59:14.639 --> 00:59:16.880
younger generation because we did growing up. I think for us it was like
841
00:59:16.920 --> 00:59:21.960
MySpace, right, that was like
the bigging okay zanga live journal. That
842
00:59:22.119 --> 00:59:24.400
was like the beginning of it.
I think at the time Facebook was a
843
00:59:24.400 --> 00:59:28.679
bit nerdy because you have to have
like not everyone could have it, only
844
00:59:28.800 --> 00:59:30.960
like people with the eed you could
have it. But I don't know how
845
00:59:31.000 --> 00:59:36.559
they deal with like all this stuff, you know it cyberbully and just all
846
00:59:36.599 --> 00:59:40.039
this stuff going on, Like I
don't know, it must be tough for
847
00:59:40.079 --> 00:59:45.920
them. Yeah, you know,
I don't know, it's tough because for
848
00:59:45.960 --> 00:59:47.400
me, I don't know how you
can do it. Like I remember I
849
00:59:47.440 --> 00:59:52.119
was going to post something on TikTok
and my friend she does TikTok, and
850
00:59:52.159 --> 00:59:53.800
she goes and I was, oh, you want to do this because she
851
00:59:53.840 --> 00:59:58.400
thought it was a good idea this
video I made. But then she are
852
00:59:58.400 --> 01:00:01.360
you ready for just like a bunch
of people just like being really fucking mean
853
01:00:01.400 --> 01:00:05.960
to you, just saying like really
fucked up shit on the comments because that's
854
01:00:05.960 --> 01:00:07.880
what they do. And I'm like, you know what, No, I'm
855
01:00:07.880 --> 01:00:10.559
not, let's not post it.
I don't know, you know, like
856
01:00:12.679 --> 01:00:14.960
I'm not once argue online. I've
done in the past, but just like
857
01:00:14.960 --> 01:00:17.679
I've seen how I don't end of
the day just feel like burnt out and
858
01:00:17.719 --> 01:00:22.920
you're arguing with people on the internet
you never meet. There's like I was
859
01:00:22.960 --> 01:00:27.440
part of these meeting pages and people
would just like take it personal and everything,
860
01:00:27.480 --> 01:00:30.599
and it was just kind of like
really silly, but you're like protecting
861
01:00:30.599 --> 01:00:34.280
your ego at the same time,
and it's just I don't know, man,
862
01:00:34.280 --> 01:00:36.840
it's really tough. And I think
social media is great as a tool,
863
01:00:36.840 --> 01:00:39.320
like you said, but it shouldn't
be like your whole life kind of
864
01:00:39.360 --> 01:00:44.119
thing. And it can be easily
I mean for younger people who may not
865
01:00:44.280 --> 01:00:47.800
like understand and everything, and this
might be like the whole world to them,
866
01:00:47.840 --> 01:00:50.800
you know. And I mean,
and I say this to someone,
867
01:00:50.840 --> 01:00:54.079
I love Twitter, but knowing when
to be like dude, not my monkey,
868
01:00:54.199 --> 01:00:58.599
not my circus, not my bad
and like, yeah, making sure
869
01:00:58.599 --> 01:01:02.239
that you stay connected in ways that
feel good. Right. So newsletters,
870
01:01:02.599 --> 01:01:06.599
right, like those are the ones
I've seen. I think a lot of
871
01:01:06.719 --> 01:01:08.880
us know newsletters, but we don't
even realize they are. Let's say we
872
01:01:08.960 --> 01:01:13.599
go to like a website where we
shot close at Oh, here's your you
873
01:01:13.639 --> 01:01:15.639
know, here's your email, or
give us your email. We'll give you
874
01:01:15.679 --> 01:01:21.280
like fifteen percent or something. Those
newsletters, right, yes, talk to
875
01:01:21.360 --> 01:01:24.880
us more about like what newsletters can
do for artists and everything. So there's
876
01:01:24.880 --> 01:01:29.639
definitely that right where it's like,
here's more you bought for me, so
877
01:01:29.760 --> 01:01:34.559
like buy more, and buy more
and buy more. But for businesses or
878
01:01:34.679 --> 01:01:39.719
musicians or different kinds of like entrepreneurs, newsletter can be a direct way to
879
01:01:39.960 --> 01:01:44.440
communicate with your audience and show them
all the things that they don't know.
880
01:01:44.559 --> 01:01:50.800
Goes into running a podcast or producing
an albums or you know, it becomes
881
01:01:50.880 --> 01:01:53.320
so you want to think about what
is your audience value. And in the
882
01:01:53.360 --> 01:01:58.000
example that you shared, like there's
financial value, right, people want discounts
883
01:01:58.039 --> 01:02:02.719
and savings, But for artists or
businesses, the value might be in information,
884
01:02:04.400 --> 01:02:07.000
or the value might be in community, or the value might be in
885
01:02:07.199 --> 01:02:10.159
entertainment. And so your newsletter can
really be whatever you want it to be.
886
01:02:10.239 --> 01:02:15.119
Mine often shares like tips, I
share a favorite song, I share
887
01:02:15.119 --> 01:02:20.239
a bunch of resources, and then
if I'm like doing an offering and so
888
01:02:20.400 --> 01:02:24.800
like it's your newsletter is really just
another way for you to communicate with folks,
889
01:02:24.840 --> 01:02:29.280
but on your terms, there's no
algorithm. In the meantime, there's
890
01:02:29.320 --> 01:02:35.519
no character limit, there's no your
your pen pals, right with your with
891
01:02:35.599 --> 01:02:37.639
the people who have decided that they
want to connect with you in this way.
892
01:02:37.920 --> 01:02:39.880
Right? Do you open your emails
a lot? Like? Do you
893
01:02:39.880 --> 01:02:46.280
have a lot of unready email messages? I try really really hard to answer
894
01:02:46.280 --> 01:02:52.280
my emails. Sometimes I'll like read
it mark is unread because it makes me
895
01:02:52.360 --> 01:02:57.000
really anxious. But lately I've been
unsubscribing to things and that's felt really good.
896
01:02:59.119 --> 01:03:04.199
Yeah I have thirty one thousand,
but yeah, but most of them
897
01:03:04.360 --> 01:03:08.800
are just like you said, over
time, I substracted stores for discounts and
898
01:03:08.960 --> 01:03:15.559
just Facebook notifications, Instagram notifications.
You give that about four or five years.
899
01:03:15.760 --> 01:03:17.199
That's what they're doing thousand. You
know, it looks like that's why
900
01:03:17.199 --> 01:03:20.239
I don't know, Like, maybe
is there a way to delete everything?
901
01:03:20.760 --> 01:03:25.039
Also? I already do that.
Don't get notifications for anything, not on
902
01:03:25.079 --> 01:03:30.519
my phone, not on my email, not like nothing. I should do
903
01:03:30.559 --> 01:03:34.039
that because it takes a lot of
space. It takes a space. It
904
01:03:34.079 --> 01:03:39.000
also like interrupts my life all the
time. Look at that is wild.
905
01:03:39.159 --> 01:03:43.679
I think it just yeah, I
don't even know. Yeah, you can't
906
01:03:43.719 --> 01:03:47.320
see this, but like literally the
man has over three thousand thirty one.
907
01:03:49.559 --> 01:03:52.719
Yeah that's yeah, No, that's
a delete all. How do you delete
908
01:03:52.760 --> 01:03:54.960
all? I have no idea,
yes, because it's pretty hard, Like
909
01:03:55.320 --> 01:03:59.719
you can edit, right, I
think you can do this. There's got
910
01:03:59.719 --> 01:04:02.199
to be like little box at the
top. Okay, last time, one
911
01:04:02.280 --> 01:04:06.000
time I was I was fucking Zam. I was off Zan's. I deleted
912
01:04:06.000 --> 01:04:10.400
like five hundred pictures on my phone. This was back in the day.
913
01:04:10.639 --> 01:04:13.280
No, no, I wanted to
because I needed space. This was back
914
01:04:13.320 --> 01:04:16.039
in the day when you couldn't like
its delete one by one. Yeah,
915
01:04:16.079 --> 01:04:20.960
but I was on Xanax and like
time flies when you're on Honestly though,
916
01:04:21.039 --> 01:04:26.400
like cleaning out my phone is a
really relaxing thing sometimes really, and I'm
917
01:04:26.440 --> 01:04:30.840
like when I'm not on xan X, but like there's something about like purging
918
01:04:30.039 --> 01:04:33.800
and deleting and like letting go of
or emails from like six years ago,
919
01:04:33.800 --> 01:04:38.000
I'm never going to follow up on
this. I could just delete and like,
920
01:04:38.840 --> 01:04:43.599
yeah, I only checked my email
to see if that one uh adult
921
01:04:43.679 --> 01:04:46.280
actress hit me up for the podcast, because it was so crazy because I
922
01:04:46.320 --> 01:04:48.960
thought, oh wow, she'll never
respond. But I was like, you
923
01:04:48.960 --> 01:04:50.800
know, let me give it a
shot. Let me do it in a
924
01:04:50.800 --> 01:04:56.000
professional way and not going to DM
some dumb shit. Let me do an
925
01:04:56.000 --> 01:05:00.039
email because on her thing says like
booking or info. Here's email. Hey,
926
01:05:00.079 --> 01:05:04.320
what's it goings on? I have
a podcast speaks about X, Y
927
01:05:04.360 --> 01:05:10.239
and Z. I think you know
I follow you on social media. We
928
01:05:10.320 --> 01:05:14.719
have similar like passions of like mental
health, social justice, harmon reduction.
929
01:05:15.440 --> 01:05:17.800
Would you be open to doing a
podcast that kind of stuff? Like,
930
01:05:18.079 --> 01:05:25.199
I think it's cool that I see
Southeast uh, Southeast Asian American doing what
931
01:05:25.239 --> 01:05:27.360
you do, because usually it's just
like a stick here like a lot of
932
01:05:27.440 --> 01:05:30.719
East Asian and uh. And I
was surprised that same nature, responding,
933
01:05:30.760 --> 01:05:33.719
oh, oh my gosh, that's
so cool. Yeah, that's really cool
934
01:05:34.840 --> 01:05:40.440
and and yeah, that's the only
time I check my email that and just
935
01:05:40.480 --> 01:05:47.440
like random stuff because mostly it's it's
like Uber eats order something. Yeah.
936
01:05:47.519 --> 01:05:51.559
So one of the projects I work
on is Den Music Fest, and we're
937
01:05:51.599 --> 01:05:56.639
an independent hip hop festival where We
don't look at your social media following,
938
01:05:56.679 --> 01:06:00.320
we don't look at your streaming numbers, we don't you to submit to perform,
939
01:06:00.360 --> 01:06:03.440
we don't do pay to play.
But it really is a platform where
940
01:06:03.440 --> 01:06:08.360
we try to give independent artists a
stage and help people discover new music,
941
01:06:08.400 --> 01:06:12.440
because most people by the time they're
thirty stop looking for new music, and
942
01:06:12.480 --> 01:06:15.480
so we try to make it really
easy to discover dope artists. Right,
943
01:06:16.679 --> 01:06:21.239
I probably, and these are people
who have submitted to perform. I probably
944
01:06:21.320 --> 01:06:26.119
have a fifty percent response rate to
people who have submitted to perform. So
945
01:06:26.159 --> 01:06:30.159
I email them and I say,
hey, we'd love to have you perform.
946
01:06:30.519 --> 01:06:32.920
Can you respond? And then we
never hear back. And maybe I'm
947
01:06:32.920 --> 01:06:35.079
getting ghosted, which is fine.
Maybe you don't want to perform, you
948
01:06:35.119 --> 01:06:41.039
don't want to tell me, like
whatever. But I think this is something
949
01:06:41.159 --> 01:06:46.760
as artists, especially who get so
caught up in making music and like checking
950
01:06:46.840 --> 01:06:51.239
email and respond And I get it, like I'm I total. You know,
951
01:06:51.320 --> 01:06:55.440
it'll take me three months sometimes to
respond to an email that takes like
952
01:06:55.559 --> 01:07:00.400
ten minutes of work. But like
checking email and being responsive is one of
953
01:07:00.440 --> 01:07:03.960
the most simple things you can do
to make sure that you're not missing out
954
01:07:04.000 --> 01:07:08.639
on things because people are still emailing. Someone was like, nah, email
955
01:07:08.679 --> 01:07:14.559
is so email is not dead like
around, especially when you have like discord
956
01:07:14.679 --> 01:07:18.760
outages and Instagram outages and Twitter is
down. Like email has been around since
957
01:07:19.760 --> 01:07:26.519
like the eighties. Yeah, like
will continue to be around. And so
958
01:07:26.599 --> 01:07:30.320
I think as it's just such a
you know, like you check your text
959
01:07:30.360 --> 01:07:33.039
messages, you check your DMS,
y'all, just check your emails. Yeah,
960
01:07:33.559 --> 01:07:36.199
I have to lead a lot of
my emails. I don't know how
961
01:07:36.239 --> 01:07:40.719
to do it. Maybe maybe you
said it world like you should call againness
962
01:07:40.719 --> 01:07:44.119
and see if there's like a world
record. Maybe I can get some No,
963
01:07:44.159 --> 01:07:46.000
I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm
totally kidding, And I can leave
964
01:07:46.000 --> 01:07:48.599
my emails. But yeah, it's
a lot. It's overwhelming, so I
965
01:07:48.599 --> 01:07:50.800
don't look at it. Yeah,
it's a lot. I just looked at
966
01:07:50.840 --> 01:07:57.639
it right now. Anxiety written so
well, Like, I think what's cool
967
01:07:57.679 --> 01:08:01.440
about social media is sometimes you can
get in touch with you know, uh,
968
01:08:02.079 --> 01:08:08.360
people like you look up to listen
to, which is really cool.
969
01:08:08.440 --> 01:08:11.920
I think that's something that we growing
up have never been able to do.
970
01:08:12.159 --> 01:08:16.399
Maybe back then I was like those
like that fan club right or whatever,
971
01:08:17.840 --> 01:08:24.720
you can do that. But now
it's like almost everybody is accessible. If
972
01:08:24.760 --> 01:08:28.520
one word is to reach out,
like what when would you use a direct
973
01:08:28.560 --> 01:08:30.279
message on Instagram? And when would
you use an email? Do you have
974
01:08:30.319 --> 01:08:35.560
any I think it? I don't
know. In some ways, I think
975
01:08:35.560 --> 01:08:42.560
they're interchangeable. What's more important is
because you can be disrespectful in an email,
976
01:08:42.640 --> 01:08:46.079
right, and you could be mad
respectful in a DM. So I
977
01:08:46.079 --> 01:08:50.760
think if people have if they say
like email me, don't DM me,
978
01:08:51.319 --> 01:08:56.199
or if they have an email address, like use what people have what their
979
01:08:56.199 --> 01:09:00.359
preferred method of communication is. But
if there's no like clear thing like my
980
01:09:00.720 --> 01:09:04.600
on all my socials, my dms
are always open. So I'm giving you
981
01:09:04.640 --> 01:09:08.800
permission to DM me, but be
respectful. I think what's more important is
982
01:09:10.079 --> 01:09:15.720
making sure that you send a thoughtful
message, which means like greet people by
983
01:09:15.800 --> 01:09:20.319
name and introduce them, introduce yourself
and carry the mental load of like making
984
01:09:20.319 --> 01:09:27.640
that connection happen. Don't spam people
send, do not send unsolicited links.
985
01:09:27.880 --> 01:09:30.560
I check out my music? Yeah, oh my god, or thinks you're
986
01:09:30.600 --> 01:09:33.520
being slick? Hey, how are
you? I want to help you?
987
01:09:33.640 --> 01:09:38.960
Here's my link? No? No, yeah, you know what really it
988
01:09:39.000 --> 01:09:43.199
really it's one of mine too,
because sometimes I'm dming. Your girls are
989
01:09:43.199 --> 01:09:47.920
saying memes or whatever or whatever I
see like that airplane paper airplane notification.
990
01:09:48.039 --> 01:09:50.920
Oh my god, it's hurt.
No, it's a fucking guy. I'm
991
01:09:50.920 --> 01:09:55.199
like, what the fuck? Bro
like playing with your emotions. Yeah,
992
01:09:55.279 --> 01:09:59.800
it's just it's really deceiving it.
Really, I'm like offended by it.
993
01:10:00.079 --> 01:10:02.800
What I do I put them on
general and mute them because dude, that's
994
01:10:02.840 --> 01:10:06.920
not cool because I feel like,
here's my thing. But I mean,
995
01:10:06.960 --> 01:10:10.520
okay, I have empathy to it
too, because that's why I did when
996
01:10:10.560 --> 01:10:14.239
I started off right right. But
these people are like, we're into it
997
01:10:14.319 --> 01:10:16.439
like X amount of years man,
you know. And for me it's like,
998
01:10:16.840 --> 01:10:19.760
I know you make music because I
added you. If I want to
999
01:10:19.800 --> 01:10:24.000
check out music, I would I
see it on my timeline. Please don't
1000
01:10:24.000 --> 01:10:26.319
go on my dms. That's a
very for me. It's a very sacred
1001
01:10:26.359 --> 01:10:30.680
place like that's a very like for
friends. Yeah, it's invasive. It's
1002
01:10:30.680 --> 01:10:38.520
for friends people I know having actual
conversations with, and it's just really unprofessional.
1003
01:10:38.560 --> 01:10:40.520
I feel like, and I you
know, I can't blame them if
1004
01:10:40.520 --> 01:10:43.640
they don't know, but maybe they'll
find out one day, you know,
1005
01:10:44.119 --> 01:10:46.720
but it just really really upsets me. And if that's even more when they
1006
01:10:46.720 --> 01:10:49.640
say, hey, check out my
music, share my stuff, but they
1007
01:10:49.640 --> 01:10:53.880
don't reciprocate that, right, And
I don't know if that's me being pitted,
1008
01:10:53.960 --> 01:10:57.119
just be being like courteous, like, dude, you know I did
1009
01:10:57.119 --> 01:10:59.960
that for you. I think it
would be nice if you would hear this.
1010
01:11:00.560 --> 01:11:01.720
Well, this goes back to what
we were talking about earlier, right,
1011
01:11:01.760 --> 01:11:06.039
if they were to lead with supporting
you, right, And this is
1012
01:11:06.039 --> 01:11:10.560
where like artists have to think.
For like, if you know you have
1013
01:11:10.600 --> 01:11:13.800
an album released coming, and you
know you're gonna make asks for people in
1014
01:11:13.840 --> 01:11:17.560
a month, then you should start
now by nurturing and cultivating those relationships.
1015
01:11:17.920 --> 01:11:21.720
So if they share your podcast or
they amplify your music, or they share
1016
01:11:21.760 --> 01:11:26.239
your memes or whatever it is,
and then so you're gonna see that,
1017
01:11:26.279 --> 01:11:30.199
you're gonna take notice, you're gonna
remember it then a month from and then
1018
01:11:30.199 --> 01:11:32.880
you're probably gonna reach out and be
like, yo, thank you. Now
1019
01:11:33.800 --> 01:11:39.520
you've opened the communication pathway and then
they can make an ask about Hey,
1020
01:11:39.520 --> 01:11:42.399
I'm releasing a project, can I
share it with you? No? And
1021
01:11:42.399 --> 01:11:44.560
then you can say no, yeah, but you know what I mean.
1022
01:11:44.880 --> 01:11:48.920
Then it changes the whole dynamic versus
I'm gonna come in, I haven't talked
1023
01:11:48.960 --> 01:11:51.479
to you and forever, I'm going
to ask you to do work on my
1024
01:11:51.600 --> 01:11:57.840
behalf without even acknowledging anything. Like
y'all see how one sided that is.
1025
01:11:58.079 --> 01:12:02.000
Yeah, it's and I think too
make a connection because you want to and
1026
01:12:02.039 --> 01:12:06.479
not because you think that will advance
you in your ladder of success or whatever.
1027
01:12:09.119 --> 01:12:12.000
Yeah, I just really attacking.
I can we can tell, people
1028
01:12:12.039 --> 01:12:15.560
can tell when people are really you
know, because yeah, I don't know,
1029
01:12:15.199 --> 01:12:18.039
you're not slick. People think they're
so slick. Hey, I was
1030
01:12:18.039 --> 01:12:23.039
thinking about you. And also here's
my thing. I want to know,
1031
01:12:23.239 --> 01:12:28.119
like your audience, your audience is
smart. Yeah, and definitely the people
1032
01:12:28.439 --> 01:12:31.680
that are like collaborators and colleagues are
smart. So a lot of you are
1033
01:12:31.680 --> 01:12:34.720
not as slick as you think you're
being when you're spamming folks. And also
1034
01:12:34.720 --> 01:12:40.720
to what I realized, it's okay
if like your friends aren't necessarily always your
1035
01:12:40.720 --> 01:12:44.119
fans or your audience, and that's
what you gotta be okay with it,
1036
01:12:44.159 --> 01:12:46.399
because like I don't expect my friends
to listen to my music. Mind do
1037
01:12:46.439 --> 01:12:51.479
It's really cool. Sometimes awkward because
we're in the same car, but yeah,
1038
01:12:51.479 --> 01:12:57.000
it's okay, Like you have people
just your friends and your fans,
1039
01:12:57.000 --> 01:13:00.279
and it's not always interchangeable and stuff. I know. Yeah, no,
1040
01:13:00.560 --> 01:13:05.840
I think that's an important distinction,
Like you can support me. Hey,
1041
01:13:05.920 --> 01:13:09.560
Nora, how's it going? How
you know? I saw you had this
1042
01:13:09.600 --> 01:13:12.720
thing. How are you feeling?
What do you need without having to support
1043
01:13:12.880 --> 01:13:16.239
my output or my product? Right, Like that's two separate things for sure.
1044
01:13:17.039 --> 01:13:19.199
That's kind of weird sometimes when my
friends ask me, oh, like
1045
01:13:19.359 --> 01:13:23.399
cool song, Oh thanks, I
guess it's like, I mean, I'm
1046
01:13:23.399 --> 01:13:26.560
still getting used to it. But
for me, it's like, dude,
1047
01:13:26.600 --> 01:13:28.479
we're friends. You don't have to
like. I mean, it's cool if
1048
01:13:28.479 --> 01:13:30.279
you do, but I wouldn't look
down up. Oh how come you didn't.
1049
01:13:30.479 --> 01:13:32.439
We're not best friends anymore, you
know, Like right, yeah,
1050
01:13:34.000 --> 01:13:41.720
okay, so we've going on a
little tangent. Okay, so with them,
1051
01:13:41.880 --> 01:13:44.760
Yeah, so talk about comparisons.
How it can really like mess up
1052
01:13:44.800 --> 01:13:48.239
your mental health and how like I
don't know if you can get become petty
1053
01:13:48.319 --> 01:13:51.760
people you have petty over it.
They send like subliminal tweets and everything.
1054
01:13:51.800 --> 01:13:57.000
I'm just I don't know. I
think it's a lot of it is guys
1055
01:13:57.079 --> 01:14:00.600
under competition. I think a lot
of it is oh, yeah, you
1056
01:14:00.640 --> 01:14:02.399
know, I'm just keeping you know, keeping in your story trup. Now
1057
01:14:02.439 --> 01:14:05.279
you're just in security. I mean
it's cool to a degree, but it's
1058
01:14:05.319 --> 01:14:09.199
like looking at it that way.
I mean, I don't know. Is
1059
01:14:09.239 --> 01:14:11.640
it competition. Maybe you feel like, oh, maybe I can, like,
1060
01:14:12.199 --> 01:14:14.840
you know, I want to be
part of it or just reply.
1061
01:14:15.000 --> 01:14:19.279
But sometimes I really feel like,
hey, it's a great you know yeah,
1062
01:14:19.399 --> 01:14:25.439
Or it's like a desire to exert
control over someone or to like flex
1063
01:14:25.520 --> 01:14:29.359
power because you somehow feel like you've
lost path. Yeah, you know.
1064
01:14:29.520 --> 01:14:36.640
I My thing about like social media
debates is I'm not ever interested in change.
1065
01:14:36.760 --> 01:14:41.119
Like you might say something, if
you say something publicly, I feel
1066
01:14:41.159 --> 01:14:45.439
like it's fair game to reply to
you publicly. I'm not interested actually in
1067
01:14:45.560 --> 01:14:49.760
changing your mind. I think that
it's important for people to see like a
1068
01:14:49.840 --> 01:14:56.039
counter narrative to whatever nonsense someone is
saying, or for people to know that
1069
01:14:56.199 --> 01:15:00.439
like I'm a safe space even though
everyone is like upholding this really problematic view
1070
01:15:00.520 --> 01:15:08.520
or what you know. But like
I don't feel I've learned for my own,
1071
01:15:08.680 --> 01:15:11.880
like I don't have to say something
to everything because I'm also like,
1072
01:15:12.199 --> 01:15:14.600
you know, I'm like a bit
of a but like there's a warrior in
1073
01:15:14.640 --> 01:15:17.279
me that's like ready to fight battles
all the time, and I'm like can't,
1074
01:15:17.359 --> 01:15:20.520
Like that's not sustainable for me,
so giving myself permission to like step
1075
01:15:20.560 --> 01:15:25.239
away. Also, there's one thing
that really upsets me when I see on
1076
01:15:25.279 --> 01:15:29.319
social media. I'll tell you off
camera, off air, but okay,
1077
01:15:29.359 --> 01:15:31.920
so oh I'm so curious. Yeah, okay, there's like one there's I
1078
01:15:31.960 --> 01:15:35.720
mean, there's a lot of things. There's one thing they'll really I'll infringe
1079
01:15:35.720 --> 01:15:40.760
you for that shit, but okay, pitfalls of being a perfection in your
1080
01:15:40.760 --> 01:15:42.560
craft. I think I was too. I think a lot of us are
1081
01:15:42.600 --> 01:15:45.039
like rappers or whatever, like,
oh, I want like the best thing
1082
01:15:45.119 --> 01:15:46.960
to come out, so I'm gonna
take a bunch of time to it.
1083
01:15:47.920 --> 01:15:50.880
You know. I think in behind
it looks cool, that sounds good,
1084
01:15:50.960 --> 01:15:54.359
right, you want to take your
time to it. But if you take
1085
01:15:54.399 --> 01:15:58.960
too much time from it and you're
afraid to release it, like you'll never
1086
01:16:00.079 --> 01:16:03.119
yeah true, I mean, does
that happen a lot with your clients,
1087
01:16:03.920 --> 01:16:10.760
for sure. Yeah, but I
think perfectionism is often a mask for anxiety
1088
01:16:11.239 --> 01:16:15.319
or like imposters, it's like figuring
out what is the what is the perfectionism
1089
01:16:15.399 --> 01:16:20.039
about? And we often, again
as like people of color, as women,
1090
01:16:20.079 --> 01:16:25.319
as queer folks, there's extra pressure
for us to be perfect because our
1091
01:16:25.359 --> 01:16:30.319
mistakes then reflect on all women or
all you know this, that and the
1092
01:16:30.359 --> 01:16:34.039
other versus like straight white dudes are
allowed to fail all the time and people
1093
01:16:34.039 --> 01:16:38.000
are like, no, it's fine, you get a second chance. So
1094
01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:42.720
there's like an extra burden on us. And because I think we oftentimes feel
1095
01:16:42.760 --> 01:16:45.239
like we have less resources, so
we get only one shot. You know.
1096
01:16:46.439 --> 01:16:50.000
All the irony of Eminem talking about
that is really funny to me,
1097
01:16:50.000 --> 01:17:00.640
and he says you only get anyways. But yeah, I think realize that
1098
01:17:00.680 --> 01:17:04.840
perfection is not real and that by
the time you get to a point that
1099
01:17:04.920 --> 01:17:09.800
you feel perfect enough, someone else
has already done what you've wanted to do
1100
01:17:10.279 --> 01:17:14.960
imperfectly. But it's actually in the
like imperfection that people connect and bond with
1101
01:17:15.000 --> 01:17:19.560
your right, like perfection is not
is not accessible, it's not friendly,
1102
01:17:19.600 --> 01:17:24.119
Like no one wants to be friends
with the perfect kid, and so it's
1103
01:17:24.159 --> 01:17:28.039
in allowing yourself to be vulnerable that
actually people will connect and relate to you.
1104
01:17:28.439 --> 01:17:31.199
I think I just thought of something, the whole perfection thing. Maybe
1105
01:17:31.239 --> 01:17:38.840
why a lot of rappers want a
perfection thing they like see Naws, that
1106
01:17:38.840 --> 01:17:43.079
that illmatic thing. Oh that was
first album, five mics, you know.
1107
01:17:43.119 --> 01:17:46.479
I think maybe that's why people live
up to this standard. And I
1108
01:17:46.560 --> 01:17:49.199
realized a few years ago, I'm
a fucking nos bro. I'm not fucking
1109
01:17:49.239 --> 01:17:51.600
I'm not jay Z. I'm I'm
not trying JD kids. I'm trying to
1110
01:17:51.680 --> 01:17:56.039
me bro like I think a long
time we wanted to be. I want
1111
01:17:56.079 --> 01:17:58.800
to wrap like them. But I'm
not aggressive, dude. I'm not like
1112
01:17:58.840 --> 01:18:01.079
that, not in that sense.
I'm I'm not like. That's not me.
1113
01:18:01.199 --> 01:18:05.800
And I realized, I want you
know, that's not me. Do
1114
01:18:05.840 --> 01:18:10.319
you know what it is too?
It's like there's so much that's invisible.
1115
01:18:10.520 --> 01:18:13.880
There's so much of that labor that's
invisible. Like, do you really think
1116
01:18:13.880 --> 01:18:17.239
that jay Z is sitting by himself
writing bars like in Marci projects. No,
1117
01:18:17.319 --> 01:18:21.000
He's got a whole fucking team of
writers and producers and people around him
1118
01:18:21.239 --> 01:18:25.560
who may or may not be credited, but who are like making these greatest
1119
01:18:25.560 --> 01:18:29.680
albums, And because for those of
us who came up in that era of
1120
01:18:29.800 --> 01:18:33.680
hip hop, there's so much that
we didn't know, and so we're comparing
1121
01:18:33.720 --> 01:18:41.479
ourselves to a standard that isn't necessarily
a real standard. And now we're like,
1122
01:18:41.600 --> 01:18:44.640
oh, wait, Dre wrote that
verse for so and so or so
1123
01:18:44.680 --> 01:18:50.199
and so did like oh ghostwriters.
And now that it's becoming more mainstream knowledge,
1124
01:18:50.840 --> 01:18:54.439
I think a lot of folks are
having a hard time making that like
1125
01:18:54.520 --> 01:19:00.680
adjustment in their heads because the professionals, right, like the mainstream artist are
1126
01:19:00.680 --> 01:19:03.079
not working by themselves. But yet
here we are on the independent scene,
1127
01:19:03.399 --> 01:19:08.159
really proud of the fact that,
oh I got here by myself, and
1128
01:19:08.199 --> 01:19:12.319
it backfires. And so it's also
part of like not being afraid to ask
1129
01:19:12.359 --> 01:19:17.680
for help, because that's important right
Also too, I think I identify with
1130
01:19:17.760 --> 01:19:24.319
this, I've shared it with you. Self sabotage, fear of success,
1131
01:19:24.840 --> 01:19:28.399
like I don't know, talk to
us about what maybe your clients go through,
1132
01:19:28.520 --> 01:19:32.560
or like what you've observed. Yeah
no, And I think I think
1133
01:19:32.600 --> 01:19:39.760
perfectionism is also a form of self
sabotage, right where we if I do
1134
01:19:39.840 --> 01:19:45.239
my very best and things don't work
out, then I'm like, fuck,
1135
01:19:45.720 --> 01:19:49.359
I'm there must be like this isn't
good enough. But if I wait until
1136
01:19:49.359 --> 01:19:54.039
the last minute, or I procrastinate, or I take a shortcut, then
1137
01:19:54.079 --> 01:19:56.399
if things don't go well, I
haven't out to be like, oh,
1138
01:19:56.439 --> 01:20:00.319
it's not because the song wasn't good, It's because I just didn't have time
1139
01:20:00.359 --> 01:20:05.159
to promote it, right, Like
you give yourself a scapegoat, And I
1140
01:20:05.159 --> 01:20:09.439
think that's one of the ways that
people self sabotage all the time, or
1141
01:20:09.600 --> 01:20:13.319
they you know, a million things. And this is the part where this
1142
01:20:13.359 --> 01:20:16.560
happens a lot. And like with
my clients that I work with, oftentimes
1143
01:20:16.560 --> 01:20:21.520
people know what they're supposed to do. It's these like psychosocial barriers that keep
1144
01:20:21.560 --> 01:20:25.520
them from doing it. And so
a lot of our work. I have
1145
01:20:25.560 --> 01:20:29.359
a client who calls me her business
therapist, which I'm not a therapist,
1146
01:20:29.439 --> 01:20:34.359
but like we can't separate our personal
stuff from our professional or political right,
1147
01:20:34.439 --> 01:20:40.880
like the three exists together, and
so addressing that is just as important to
1148
01:20:40.920 --> 01:20:45.079
your business success as is like having
a marketing plan or a business plan or
1149
01:20:45.079 --> 01:20:47.880
all that other stuff. You can't
separate them. What are some things like
1150
01:20:48.000 --> 01:20:54.760
general suggestions you can like get to
someone who you've observed maybe is like oh
1151
01:20:54.840 --> 01:21:01.039
says mean self sabotaging or just or
professionists would be I think just starting don't
1152
01:21:01.119 --> 01:21:05.239
judge yourself for it, but starting
to reflect on why, Like what is
1153
01:21:05.279 --> 01:21:11.159
this protecting you from? How is
this helping you? Kind of catching the
1154
01:21:11.199 --> 01:21:15.520
ways that you're tricking yourself because sometimes
we're so used to doing it we don't
1155
01:21:15.520 --> 01:21:17.760
even become so like that awareness,
I think is the first step. I
1156
01:21:17.800 --> 01:21:20.880
think everyone should see a therapist,
Like even if you don't think you need
1157
01:21:20.920 --> 01:21:27.399
one, it's good to just check
in. And then I think focusing,
1158
01:21:28.199 --> 01:21:32.039
so like I recommend a shine page
to everyone, Like we're so focused on
1159
01:21:32.079 --> 01:21:34.840
the things that don't go well,
but make sure you have a place where
1160
01:21:34.880 --> 01:21:38.960
you're celebrating. I call it my
shine page, right, like a page
1161
01:21:38.960 --> 01:21:44.560
in my journal where all the things
I fucking succeeded, Like this podcast interview
1162
01:21:44.560 --> 01:21:46.119
today is going to go in my
journal. Is something great that I did?
1163
01:21:46.159 --> 01:21:49.880
And next time I doubt myself or
I feel insecure, I go to
1164
01:21:49.960 --> 01:21:55.720
my shine page and I just gas
myself up. Because our brains will play
1165
01:21:55.720 --> 01:21:59.479
tricks on us to make us forget
or make us doubt ourselves. So having
1166
01:21:59.520 --> 01:22:02.359
something to handible in visible, physical
that you can see that says no.
1167
01:22:02.439 --> 01:22:05.920
But look, here's a whole list
of dope things that you've done and accomplished.
1168
01:22:06.439 --> 01:22:12.199
Then fact checks the false thoughts that
your brain is having. Yeah,
1169
01:22:12.319 --> 01:22:15.199
I noticed, I like tricking myself. Yeah, I really, I think
1170
01:22:15.199 --> 01:22:17.880
I do, because like I have
these dialogues in my head like if I
1171
01:22:17.920 --> 01:22:20.800
do X, Y and Z,
I don't know, it's like it's it's
1172
01:22:20.840 --> 01:22:24.359
I don't know. I think I
know I do it, but I just
1173
01:22:24.439 --> 01:22:27.680
let it happen. Oh you know, that's yeah. So I'm trying to
1174
01:22:27.880 --> 01:22:31.159
be more mindful of that, of
that narrative in my head or just certain
1175
01:22:31.159 --> 01:22:34.000
triggers though, like, oh,
you know, but it's interesting. I
1176
01:22:34.039 --> 01:22:36.800
like the shine page. You suggested
it to me last time. I'm started
1177
01:22:36.920 --> 01:22:41.199
doing it. Are you doing it? I did it a couple of days
1178
01:22:41.199 --> 01:22:45.279
ago. Cool. Yeah, And
I think it's really good because we just
1179
01:22:45.319 --> 01:22:48.439
tend to really just think about the
bad stuff, you know, And I
1180
01:22:48.479 --> 01:22:53.720
think it's I don't know, it's
cool to a degree, but it's not
1181
01:22:53.800 --> 01:22:59.199
balanced, right, you know.
So self care for artists it's a very
1182
01:22:59.399 --> 01:23:04.439
broad term, but do you have
any suggestions for like creatives or entrepreneurs,
1183
01:23:04.720 --> 01:23:06.920
you know, being always told to
like, oh, you got to grind,
1184
01:23:06.960 --> 01:23:12.159
you gotta keep working, and you
get burnt out eventually. I think
1185
01:23:12.199 --> 01:23:17.000
the most important thing is that you
should take a break before you ever need
1186
01:23:17.039 --> 01:23:21.359
a break. A lot of us
wait till we're like burnt out and then
1187
01:23:21.399 --> 01:23:27.119
we stop. And that's because of
what you write grind culture hustlement, Like
1188
01:23:27.199 --> 01:23:31.560
y'all, that shit is so fucking
toxic, Like no one succeeds that way,
1189
01:23:31.920 --> 01:23:35.680
and it's actually not the way success
happened, Like it's false mythology,
1190
01:23:35.720 --> 01:23:40.840
but it gets us to work and
work and produce, and it's fucking exhausting.
1191
01:23:40.960 --> 01:23:45.039
So like, give yourself time to
take a break before you ever need
1192
01:23:45.079 --> 01:23:49.800
a break. Like make that just
as important to you as like working out
1193
01:23:50.000 --> 01:23:57.239
or recording or mixing or posting on
social media or whatever it is. Yeah,
1194
01:23:57.239 --> 01:24:00.039
I think that's really important. And
then to remember that taking a break
1195
01:24:00.079 --> 01:24:02.840
is actually good for your business.
Like I know that there's a fear that
1196
01:24:02.880 --> 01:24:08.560
if if I take a day off, like my creative work is going to
1197
01:24:08.640 --> 01:24:14.319
stop, but like even bodybuilders need
a rest day, right, and so
1198
01:24:14.800 --> 01:24:19.439
giving realizing that taking a break is
actually good for you. I think those
1199
01:24:19.600 --> 01:24:23.520
are probably the two biggest things I
would tell folks, right, I think
1200
01:24:23.560 --> 01:24:27.079
for I think too, it's kind
of weird how I'm not sure if it's
1201
01:24:27.079 --> 01:24:30.760
true, but I feel like Instagram, like again, we're going by social
1202
01:24:30.800 --> 01:24:34.279
media use a lot of us.
It's what you use to like talk to
1203
01:24:34.279 --> 01:24:39.479
other people or engage. I think
they like lower your visibility if you don't
1204
01:24:39.479 --> 01:24:42.199
post a lot, so you're kind
of forced to maybe post often. I
1205
01:24:42.199 --> 01:24:45.319
don't know if that's true or not. That's a I mean, I don't
1206
01:24:45.319 --> 01:24:50.000
know because I've stopped kind of tracking
the algorithm. But isn't that crazy that
1207
01:24:50.159 --> 01:24:57.880
like a tech app is controlling our
behavior? Rather than us being like what
1208
01:24:57.920 --> 01:25:00.600
do I need? What do I
want? What feel good to me?
1209
01:25:01.000 --> 01:25:06.720
A robotic algorithm is telling us what
we should do. Yeah, it's it's
1210
01:25:06.760 --> 01:25:12.479
a little black mirror. Yeah,
I mean, I think, Yeah,
1211
01:25:12.479 --> 01:25:15.279
I think I think for us,
like, oh, if you want these
1212
01:25:15.880 --> 01:25:19.960
like engagements, views, we have
to consistently post. Yeah, I mean
1213
01:25:20.000 --> 01:25:28.239
it's also sorry, it's also you
as a creative, as a small business,
1214
01:25:28.279 --> 01:25:32.840
as an entrepreneur. You like Instagram. I don't want to say should
1215
01:25:32.880 --> 01:25:38.760
not, but does not have to
be where you're growing your business. There's
1216
01:25:38.840 --> 01:25:43.119
so many other ways, and so
thinking about like this goes back to really
1217
01:25:43.199 --> 01:25:45.960
understanding like who's your niche, what
do they want? Where are they and
1218
01:25:46.000 --> 01:25:49.960
then you can get creative about ways
to connect and grow so that you don't
1219
01:25:50.039 --> 01:25:56.359
have to fall because Instagram is not
an effective tool for like it's not a
1220
01:25:56.520 --> 01:25:59.600
Their goal is not to get you
in front of new customers. Their goal
1221
01:25:59.680 --> 01:26:01.960
is to get you to as we
talked about, buy ads and keep coming
1222
01:26:02.000 --> 01:26:09.680
back to the app. And so
that's like a big thinking broadly about when
1223
01:26:09.720 --> 01:26:14.159
you're developing your business plan or your
creative strategy, to make sure that your
1224
01:26:14.239 --> 01:26:21.319
self care is embedded in that plan. Right, So we've talked about just
1225
01:26:21.319 --> 01:26:26.199
amounts of health and like just anxiety
in general. Do you have any suggestions
1226
01:26:26.279 --> 01:26:31.119
or exercises for when anxiety general anxiety
does strike. I think I have a
1227
01:26:31.159 --> 01:26:38.159
lot, all from personal experience.
So first and foremost, like, there's
1228
01:26:38.199 --> 01:26:43.119
no shame in taking medication, there's
no shame in talking to a mental health
1229
01:26:43.159 --> 01:26:47.039
expert. And my dms are always
open if folks need help finding a therapist
1230
01:26:47.199 --> 01:26:53.520
or like accessing things, I'll help
you find someone because I think we're also
1231
01:26:53.640 --> 01:26:55.880
used to just being anxious and we're
like, oh, I'll just deal with
1232
01:26:55.920 --> 01:27:00.960
it myself. But like that's a
real brain thing that sometimes you can't like
1233
01:27:00.039 --> 01:27:05.840
outthink your brain right, and so
yeah, like no shame if you need
1234
01:27:05.880 --> 01:27:13.039
to get medicated or you're taking medication. Like we're killing that stigma in a
1235
01:27:13.159 --> 01:27:16.079
practical way. I think that thing
for me that's been most helpful when my
1236
01:27:16.119 --> 01:27:23.199
anxiety comes up is to one recognize
it as anxiety and then ask myself what
1237
01:27:23.239 --> 01:27:27.199
am I really upset about? And
is this now or is this old?
1238
01:27:27.239 --> 01:27:30.159
Like sometimes I'm like, oh,
this is from the time I was three
1239
01:27:30.239 --> 01:27:34.880
years old and we immigrated and I
had and then now like as a full
1240
01:27:34.880 --> 01:27:39.199
grown adult, that trauma is coming
back in the form of anxiety. So
1241
01:27:40.720 --> 01:27:45.359
stopping kind of like allowing myself to
feel and explore it and then deciding,
1242
01:27:45.399 --> 01:27:48.600
Okay, I have time to deal
with this now or I'll come back to
1243
01:27:48.680 --> 01:27:53.840
it later. I think for a
long time I had been taught to like
1244
01:27:54.920 --> 01:27:57.680
push it away and ignore it,
and the more I ignored my anxiety,
1245
01:27:57.680 --> 01:28:00.600
the worse it got. And so
now learning to like stop and kind of
1246
01:28:00.680 --> 01:28:04.640
lean into the feelings for me has
been really helpful. But I know it's
1247
01:28:04.680 --> 01:28:09.119
it's different every it's a general thing. Yeah, I think addressing it it's
1248
01:28:09.119 --> 01:28:15.680
good. Yeah, I think for
me, I would get anxiety before going
1249
01:28:15.720 --> 01:28:18.880
to work at my new job,
and I questioned myself, like, how
1250
01:28:18.920 --> 01:28:21.960
come you get this anxiety? And
I realized, Oh, because my previous
1251
01:28:23.039 --> 01:28:27.920
job I didn't like it. I
didn't like it. I don't think the
1252
01:28:27.960 --> 01:28:30.680
managers and I got along. I
just was not my kind of work.
1253
01:28:30.840 --> 01:28:35.119
So I noticed maybe I associated that
to my new job, which I eventually
1254
01:28:35.279 --> 01:28:41.039
got got rid of. It's pretty
good stuff like that, Yeah, exactly,
1255
01:28:42.159 --> 01:28:45.960
and just I don't know, helps
a lot. It's a crazy thing,
1256
01:28:45.479 --> 01:28:49.399
it's a wild thing. Let me
not say crazy. But not everything
1257
01:28:49.439 --> 01:28:54.199
we think is actually true, and
not everything we feel is actually real,
1258
01:28:54.760 --> 01:29:00.760
and so like just learning to question
and explore it can be really helpful.
1259
01:29:00.960 --> 01:29:04.479
Yeah, it took me a while
or I didn't realize this maybe until I
1260
01:29:04.520 --> 01:29:08.479
read it that, like, maybe
all our thoughts aren't real. I mean
1261
01:29:08.479 --> 01:29:10.920
that they can be. I mean
it's no way, but a lot of
1262
01:29:10.920 --> 01:29:15.720
times we have a hard time distinguishing
it, or we just ruminate or just
1263
01:29:15.760 --> 01:29:19.199
focus on this one like a few
negative thoughts and then it can really affect
1264
01:29:19.199 --> 01:29:24.560
like our mindset and everything. So
it's good to be mindful of that stuff
1265
01:29:24.600 --> 01:29:29.800
and it goes a long way.
I think that's about That's about it.
1266
01:29:29.840 --> 01:29:32.239
Pretty much cool, went through everything. Thank you so much for this conversation.
1267
01:29:32.319 --> 01:29:36.039
This is so fun, which I
really appreciate it. Again, I'm
1268
01:29:36.119 --> 01:29:40.720
so glad we have to do this
because before over the phone, this is
1269
01:29:40.920 --> 01:29:44.319
you know, it was during the
pandemic. This was the first time I
1270
01:29:44.319 --> 01:29:48.359
started reaching out to people to do
podcasts outside of just like being in the
1271
01:29:48.359 --> 01:29:51.520
same room. Before I was just
all of them were in the same room.
1272
01:29:51.600 --> 01:29:56.680
So I was still figuring out the
technology thing and it was just really
1273
01:29:56.720 --> 01:30:00.399
tough sometimes and I'm glad we got
to rectify it and just do this here
1274
01:30:00.600 --> 01:30:03.720
me too. Yeah, thank you
for having me awesome. Where can we
1275
01:30:03.840 --> 01:30:09.840
find you on social media and your
websites and all that stuff, Norah Raheemian
1276
01:30:09.920 --> 01:30:15.920
on everything N O R A R
A H I M I A N that's
1277
01:30:15.920 --> 01:30:17.560
my link tree, that's my Twitter, that's my Instagram, that's my cash
1278
01:30:17.600 --> 01:30:21.880
app, that's my Venmo, that's
all the things, and yeah, my
1279
01:30:21.960 --> 01:30:27.319
dams are always open reach out for
consult or, some mental health resources or
1280
01:30:27.319 --> 01:30:29.840
anything else y'all need. Oh,
by the way, thank you so much
1281
01:30:30.000 --> 01:30:35.840
because in our previous session, I
realized, like my ability to produce work
1282
01:30:35.880 --> 01:30:41.039
as a podcaster or like making music
does not equivally who I am, and
1283
01:30:41.119 --> 01:30:44.159
that like it, I'm more than
that. Hell yeah, you know because
1284
01:30:44.159 --> 01:30:46.199
for the longest time, I feel
like that was my identity. I'm a
1285
01:30:46.279 --> 01:30:51.159
rapper. I'm gonna do this,
and when I'm not producing or like getting
1286
01:30:51.199 --> 01:30:58.119
the desired expectations, I feel bad
about myself. So I'm feeling less bad.
1287
01:30:58.359 --> 01:31:00.359
So thank you so much. That's
amazing. Appreciate it. Okay,
1288
01:31:00.439 --> 01:31:02.279
that's about it. Thank you so
much. Ye
1
00:00:05.320 --> 00:00:08.679
Welcome to the Voncast show. Today. I had a really special guest.
2
00:00:09.039 --> 00:00:13.160
We've been trying to do this podcast
for like a couple of years. The
3
00:00:13.199 --> 00:00:16.839
first couple of times you did it, it was over the phone and it
4
00:00:16.879 --> 00:00:20.039
was really bad reception, and I
had to do it. I don't know,
5
00:00:20.079 --> 00:00:23.960
it's really bad reception pretty much,
and like wait to try over and
6
00:00:24.000 --> 00:00:27.199
over, and two years later,
we're in the same room. I'm with
7
00:00:27.280 --> 00:00:30.320
Nora. How's it going. I'm
so excited we're actually in the same room.
8
00:00:30.440 --> 00:00:32.399
I know, it's so weird.
I'm just so used to the zoom
9
00:00:32.439 --> 00:00:35.960
calls or the phone calls on Fridays. Yeah. No, this is good.
10
00:00:36.000 --> 00:00:38.439
I'm doing good. I'm happy to
have this conversation. Me too,
11
00:00:38.799 --> 00:00:43.960
Me too. How you been I'm
good. Yeah, I'm good. I'm
12
00:00:44.000 --> 00:00:48.640
like grounded and balanced and nice.
Nice. Yeah, me too, sort
13
00:00:48.679 --> 00:00:51.920
of. I did like some stuff
inventory last night of like my life and
14
00:00:52.000 --> 00:00:56.920
just what I can do to I
don't know, work on stuff. Yeah.
15
00:00:56.960 --> 00:01:00.520
So it's it's Persian New Year.
Oh, happy person year, thank
16
00:01:00.600 --> 00:01:03.159
you, thank you. So the
first day of spring. So it's it'll
17
00:01:03.159 --> 00:01:07.959
be like on this year it falls
on Sunday. And so I've been in
18
00:01:07.959 --> 00:01:11.640
a place of like new, new
beginnings, new, you know, like
19
00:01:11.640 --> 00:01:15.920
I feel like I'm on my own
timeline a little bit, and so yes,
20
00:01:15.120 --> 00:01:19.879
very similar, I've been in a
place of like reflection and like regrounding,
21
00:01:19.959 --> 00:01:23.079
and so today I'm good, good, good, this morning, I'm
22
00:01:23.079 --> 00:01:30.359
good. Right. Yeah, So
well that said, tell us beefy about
23
00:01:30.359 --> 00:01:36.000
who you are what you do.
So I am a creative consultant and anti
24
00:01:36.040 --> 00:01:42.159
capitalist business coach. Basically my whole
thing is helping creative people be able to
25
00:01:42.200 --> 00:01:47.200
live off their creativity in a way
where they keep their financial control, they
26
00:01:47.280 --> 00:01:52.359
keep their creative their creative vision,
their creative products, but are also able
27
00:01:52.439 --> 00:01:55.840
to do good in the world.
I like that. I think that's why
28
00:01:56.439 --> 00:01:59.439
I started working with you. I
think I read what you've done before,
29
00:01:59.439 --> 00:02:01.799
and it's cool. We're like in
the same wave length of like what we
30
00:02:02.200 --> 00:02:06.519
believe in and everything or beliefs are
pretty similar to aligned and I like that
31
00:02:06.599 --> 00:02:10.080
a lot. You've been helping me
pretty much with like the what it's called
32
00:02:10.159 --> 00:02:15.159
branding, right, like the marketing
aspect of just music and podcasting and figuring
33
00:02:15.159 --> 00:02:21.439
out like oh my Nietzsche niche niche
is right. Yeah, I really appreciate
34
00:02:21.479 --> 00:02:24.560
that it's been helpful a lot,
just with everything. I mean, it's
35
00:02:24.599 --> 00:02:28.759
cool to just like you podcasting and
music, but then to like kind of
36
00:02:28.800 --> 00:02:32.000
put it all together and packages of
brand is really cool. Well, thank
37
00:02:32.039 --> 00:02:35.680
you. I appreciate it. Yeah, for sure. I think I think
38
00:02:35.719 --> 00:02:38.120
part of it is, like I
think a big part of what I do
39
00:02:38.240 --> 00:02:46.400
is helping people or like not you
know, under like white supremacist capitalism,
40
00:02:46.560 --> 00:02:49.400
we learn that we have to compartmentalize
who we are, right, and so
41
00:02:49.439 --> 00:02:52.000
I think a big part of what
I do is help people figure out how
42
00:02:52.000 --> 00:02:54.400
they can show up wholly and authentically. Yeah, because that's what people connect
43
00:02:54.439 --> 00:02:58.199
to. We don't connect to parts
of things, we connect to whole beings,
44
00:02:58.240 --> 00:03:00.360
and so that's a big part.
It's kind of the values alignment.
45
00:03:00.520 --> 00:03:04.639
Yeah, I noticed too, I
was compartmentalizing, like what I was doing.
46
00:03:04.680 --> 00:03:07.000
It was like this is me,
this is like the podcast, and
47
00:03:07.039 --> 00:03:09.240
this is on the right hand side, it is the music. But there's
48
00:03:09.400 --> 00:03:14.120
like one person. Yeah, it's
interesting. Yeah. So okay, so
49
00:03:14.240 --> 00:03:19.840
let's take it back early days that
you're born Iran, right, and you
50
00:03:19.960 --> 00:03:24.960
lived but Iran, Iran, you
lived in three continents before you're three,
51
00:03:25.360 --> 00:03:29.319
Okay, and what was going on
in Iran and in the area at the
52
00:03:29.360 --> 00:03:34.599
time. So I was born during
the US instigated Iran Iraq war, okay,
53
00:03:35.080 --> 00:03:38.159
and so literally like the night I
was born, the United States had
54
00:03:38.159 --> 00:03:45.080
given Saddam Hussein weapons to use against
the Iranian people. And so that's kind
55
00:03:45.080 --> 00:03:46.879
of the chaos I was born into. So when people ask me like why
56
00:03:46.879 --> 00:03:50.919
do you why are you the way
you are? Like, I was forced
57
00:03:50.919 --> 00:03:53.840
to be like I was born into
chaos. But so we left as refugees.
58
00:03:53.879 --> 00:03:58.840
We left the refugees of the war, and so lived on three continents
59
00:03:58.840 --> 00:04:00.520
before I was three, and then
land it in La where I've grown up.
60
00:04:00.759 --> 00:04:08.039
Right, you know the thing like
I think the like the media portrays
61
00:04:08.120 --> 00:04:11.520
You're in a lot of areas places
in that like Middle East, right,
62
00:04:11.639 --> 00:04:15.719
and like a certain light, what's
the culture like outside of like what's kind
63
00:04:15.759 --> 00:04:17.920
of portrayed in the news, Like
what's it like the food and everything?
64
00:04:18.000 --> 00:04:21.920
Oh my god? So where and
I can only you know, Middle East
65
00:04:21.959 --> 00:04:28.399
is such a diverse I can only
speak for like Persians, right, Persians
66
00:04:28.560 --> 00:04:32.519
very warm all about hospitality if you
and you know what, Like I throw
67
00:04:32.560 --> 00:04:38.439
events, right, I produce events, and so much of my Persian upbringing
68
00:04:39.079 --> 00:04:43.199
is what informs the way I host
spaces for people. Like if you come
69
00:04:43.240 --> 00:04:46.680
to one of my events, it's
just as if you're coming to my house,
70
00:04:46.720 --> 00:04:49.240
and so I will make sure that
you've eaten, that you're drinking something,
71
00:04:49.319 --> 00:04:53.399
that you've met someone that you you
know, Like if you ever come
72
00:04:53.439 --> 00:04:56.560
to a Persian party, there's no
like sitting. Oh really, one of
73
00:04:56.560 --> 00:04:59.120
the aunties will come. They'll grab
you by the hand, they'll pull you
74
00:04:59.199 --> 00:05:01.600
up there. Make sure that you're
dancing. Okay, dancing too. Oh,
75
00:05:01.759 --> 00:05:05.720
it's food, it's family, it's
dancing. It's a lot of like
76
00:05:05.959 --> 00:05:12.000
art and storytelling bit for us.
And so yeah, I think a lot
77
00:05:12.000 --> 00:05:15.079
of what I do is is like
deeply culturally rooted in me. That's really
78
00:05:15.079 --> 00:05:19.759
cool. Reminds me of similarly Filipino
culture, where they do they make you
79
00:05:19.879 --> 00:05:23.279
eat food and if you say no, you're to get a little offended.
80
00:05:23.399 --> 00:05:26.879
Oh my god, it's you will
eat a whole plate. And my grandmother
81
00:05:27.000 --> 00:05:30.439
used to still go but you didn't
eat anything, and then put more food
82
00:05:30.480 --> 00:05:32.480
on your plate. My grandma never
said I love you, but my grandma
83
00:05:32.560 --> 00:05:35.360
used to always say you didn't eat
enough. Interesting, and that was like
84
00:05:35.399 --> 00:05:39.920
the love language is food. Yeah. Interesting, I heard like in certain
85
00:05:40.079 --> 00:05:44.399
Asian cultures. I don't think Filipinos
those like I made some I cut up
86
00:05:44.439 --> 00:05:49.279
some fruit for you your foods ready. It's interesting. The cut fruit thing
87
00:05:49.360 --> 00:05:53.759
is totally a Persian thing. Also
really Oh yeah, my dad never said
88
00:05:53.759 --> 00:05:56.519
I love you, but my dad, if I was like studying, would
89
00:05:56.519 --> 00:05:59.920
cut up fruit and bring it to
my room. And I don't think Filipinos
90
00:06:00.120 --> 00:06:02.240
do that. But was there a
particular kind of fruit or like, was
91
00:06:02.240 --> 00:06:04.560
there a significance? Is just the
fruit, like I could it fruit for
92
00:06:04.600 --> 00:06:09.680
you? It's just like nourishment,
Okay, it's yeah, and I think
93
00:06:09.680 --> 00:06:15.399
it's also yeah, it's like caregiving. Yeah yeah, interesting. Cool.
94
00:06:16.040 --> 00:06:20.680
So you moved to La Glendale,
right has a very special place in my
95
00:06:20.759 --> 00:06:27.199
heart. That's yeah, that's like
okay, so Panorama, Like my cousin
96
00:06:27.800 --> 00:06:30.360
like suggested, I wrap right,
And I met friends in Glendelle because I
97
00:06:30.360 --> 00:06:33.800
got dropped off on my Auntie's during
like the day while my mom worked,
98
00:06:34.600 --> 00:06:39.160
and I met friends there and we
all made a little rap group, my
99
00:06:39.240 --> 00:06:42.160
first little rap group, or not
my first little rap group, our first
100
00:06:42.199 --> 00:06:45.959
little rap group. Yeah, so
we would like hang out, we'd walk
101
00:06:46.000 --> 00:06:50.240
around like Americana not Americana sorry,
like the Glendell got Away your third floor
102
00:06:50.600 --> 00:06:55.360
and just like walk around freestyle and
all that stuff. Like I don't know
103
00:06:55.439 --> 00:07:00.000
where Glendelle you grew up, but
like I know Gena's Taco was like the
104
00:07:00.079 --> 00:07:06.480
mall. Yeah, those are like
really memorable place. I grew up right
105
00:07:06.560 --> 00:07:10.920
like a block away from Brand okay, and so we used to walk to
106
00:07:11.439 --> 00:07:15.240
so before the Americana, there was
the Marketplace. Before the marketplace, there
107
00:07:15.279 --> 00:07:18.000
was the Exchange. Yeah yeah,
and so like we used to go to
108
00:07:18.040 --> 00:07:25.480
Porto's before Porto's had like a crazy
line Rafy's for Persian food. Yeah.
109
00:07:25.639 --> 00:07:29.199
No, that was definitely my stomping
grounds before we moved. That was like
110
00:07:29.680 --> 00:07:31.680
me, I mean, it was
like a really cool place before very Kana,
111
00:07:31.759 --> 00:07:35.480
before it became like really high traffic, like a lot of like I
112
00:07:35.480 --> 00:07:40.439
don't know other people, but I
used to work at that Pan Express,
113
00:07:40.759 --> 00:07:45.439
you know, I got fired from
it. It's weird it's not there anymore,
114
00:07:45.600 --> 00:07:47.360
but there was that pacsend there.
Yep. Wow, I wonder if
115
00:07:47.319 --> 00:07:50.560
you, like, I don't think
we're anything to each other, but it's
116
00:07:50.600 --> 00:07:56.920
so weird that we just like know
the same areas same places. Yeah,
117
00:07:56.959 --> 00:08:01.079
so what was it like going to
school there? It was cool, you
118
00:08:01.079 --> 00:08:05.120
know, I was the only Persian
kid I knew, Okay, so there
119
00:08:05.160 --> 00:08:09.879
was a little bit for me of
like cultural navigating. My mother was like
120
00:08:11.040 --> 00:08:15.639
super super strict, and I think
it pushed me into like more. I
121
00:08:15.639 --> 00:08:16.839
mean, I was a good kid. I was smart, like I wasn't
122
00:08:16.879 --> 00:08:22.800
doing anything crazy. But I think
my mom was like so worried in her
123
00:08:22.839 --> 00:08:28.480
like immigrant anxiety. It pushed me
to maybe do some things I shouldn't have.
124
00:08:30.680 --> 00:08:33.600
But it was I don't know,
Glenda. I really loved growing up
125
00:08:33.639 --> 00:08:35.279
in Glendale, and I think it's
really interesting to watch the way it's like
126
00:08:35.600 --> 00:08:39.240
when we were moving in there was
like a reverse there was like a white
127
00:08:39.279 --> 00:08:43.919
flight happening, so it was all
like immigrants and working class folks, and
128
00:08:43.960 --> 00:08:48.519
then now there's kind of a reverse
gentrification. It's an interesting like community to
129
00:08:48.559 --> 00:08:52.840
look at to see how like the
demographics are changing. At first, I
130
00:08:52.879 --> 00:08:58.679
thought you were Armenian because of your
last name. I get that, oh
131
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not to soon, but I might
be playing, you know, But yeah,
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I think it was Raffi's place there. But yeah, so and then
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from Glendale, where did you move
to. So we moved to Beverly Hills
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when I was fifteen because my mother
thought that being around Persian Jews would save
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me. It did not, and
it probably pushed me further into all the
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things that she was afraid that I
was doing. Yeah, Beverly Hills for
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me was a total culture shock.
They didn't know what to do with me.
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I didn't know what to do with
them. I did not want to
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be there. A lot of the
stereotypes are true, and so for me,
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it was also where I saw really
firsthand what like wealth and privilege look
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like in practice, and how that
was so different than what me and my
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friends growing up had experienced. I
was like, oh, like this is
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the wealth gap, and I thowt
it like really really firsthand. Wow.
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Interesting Like Beverly Hills when I remember, I would think of, like,
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I don't know, just the TV
shows and just I always associated oh it's
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a really nice area or the drive
and everything. So you went to high
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school there? Like did you continue
going to school after high school? So
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I went to U SEE Santa Cruz
after I graduated nice, which was really
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like the best place, like really
chill, super chill, like super political,
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really grounded. I was like,
how far away can I get from
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home? Like literally looked at a
map and was like, cool, Santa
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Cruz. I wasn't going to get
into Berkeley. I was like Santa And
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so I went to U see Santa
Cruz and lived there for a while.
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That's where I started doing a lot
of my like more structured organizing work and
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gang intervention abolition work. And then
I from there started moving around a bit,
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and I lived in Costaca, I
moved to New York, I lived
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in Liberia and kind of like bounced
around. So in school, were there
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particular subjects that you exceled at?
I was, yeah, I mean I've
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always been a good student. I
thought I was going to be a marine
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biologist, and I took one oceanography
class and failed miserably and was like,
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cool, guess I'm not doing the
sciences. But the UC Santa Cruz we
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had like an ethnic not ethnic studies, a community studies program that was all
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about like history of social movements.
That was cool for me. I took
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some history of consciousness classes about like
political theory, and you know, I
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was into that stuff. And then
I ended up with a degree in psychology.
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Nice there was just me and I
saw going around like people our age.
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Like for some reason they thought like
they wanted to be marine biologists.
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That was like a thing. Yeah, like that was like the cool thing
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to do. I don't know where
it came from, but like that was
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like the It was because I saw
Free Willy when I was little. Oh
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maybe that's why I remember Free Willy. Oh my god, that show.
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That movie gave me so much feels. Yeah, I'm pretty sure I cried.
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Yeah, I'm not sure if I
cried, but I do remember that
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though. For sure. That was
a really good movie. I forgot what
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happened. Like there was a couple, right, I think they made like
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two. I think I think Willie
got free so I hope so what he
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did. But yeah, like when
I think, okay, when I think
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of Santa you see Santa Cruz or
it's UC Santa Cruz, right, people
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are taking mushrooms into forest or something. That was definitely happening. Yeah.
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Yeah, there was a lot of
like midnight drum circles like go find the
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fairies at night and like, yeah, there was a lot of that kind
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of stuff. Yeah, that's where
the boardwalk is too, right, Yes,
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remember that commercial, like the there
was like a commercial for the Santa
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Cruz boardwalk, like it was like
the nineties. I'm going down surfing,
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so surfing USA there was like that, Yeah, I don't know, good
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time. So you ended up in
Liberia? How did that happen? So
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what happened was I was doing gang
intervention abolition work in Santa Cruz and basically
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nobody wanted to fund this, and
some of the like big foundations would say
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things like, no, we can't
give you money because you're gonna go start
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a cartel because I mean literally right, because we were doing very like grassroots,
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working with people who had paroled or
for you know whatever, very very
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grassroots. And so I was like, all right, bet let me go
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get a master's degree that will validate
to you that I'm not going to run
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away with your money, Like I'll
play this kind of game til I get
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a piece of paper. So I
ended up in New York in an international
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affairs program to get my masters.
And then the New School was like,
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well, you have to go do
an internship somewhere like do a Field City.
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And the only program that they offered
that dealt with youth and conflict was
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in Liberia. So I ended up
in Liberia completely by accident, and then
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I met a rapper and everyone was
like, oh, this guy's like Tupac,
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and I was like, I'm from
LA. You can't, like,
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you can't just call that's that's a
bold state. Yeah, that's a bolt.
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00:13:56.840 --> 00:14:03.279
But he was that guy and like
his politics were really like aligned with
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mine, and fans really like resonated
with him. And so long story short,
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I got peer pressured into managing him. How is managing an artist?
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Ah, I mean it's complicated,
right, Like what does a manager do
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00:14:18.799 --> 00:14:22.480
it? I guess different things.
So what I was doing, and I
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think it's different for different artists,
But what I was doing was helping him
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think about what his big picture vision
was, like what does success look like
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for you? And honestly, it's
a lot of what I do now when
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I'm like consulting with my clients is
what does success look like for you?
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What do you want to achieve?
And then let's come up with a strategy
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to achieve it. And then as
a manager, I was also doing a
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lot of like negotiations and trying to
build and bring in new business for him
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and things like that, which was
at that time really interesting because the industry
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in Liberia was really young and undeveloped, and so I had a lot of
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read them to kind of make mistakes
and learn, but also for us to
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00:15:03.399 --> 00:15:05.639
build up the kind of industry that
I think we wanted to create, which
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was cool, right, interesting?
I mean, was there a big holdershot
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going to Liberia? Yes? Yeah, like superficially, it's very It's not
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different from US culture because there's such
a long history and there's but definitely like
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subtleties where I was like, oh, oh, I think I understand,
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but I don't. And also all
the dynamics of being like a non white
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but also Westerner but also a woman. But like just looking at how my
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power showed up in the space was
very complicated. Sometimes. How did you
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get into gain intervention and that type
of work? What made you want to
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pursue that path? Growing up?
That's what my you know, that's like
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what my friends were doing, right, and I would the guys I was
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dating were doing, you know,
like it was just and because I think
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I came from such a different partly, I think being smart kind of protected
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me because the homies were always like
nope, Nora's the smart one, like
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don't let Nora touch that. Don't. Like there was a you know,
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there was like protection around that.
And then also coming from a family system
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where like school was my only option, like I had no my mom was
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like, you are going to school, Like that's it grades. There's a
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lot of pressure that way. And
I think even just on a personal level,
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I understood from a really young age
that school was going to be my
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only way out of my family and
like into my freedom. Right. So
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I was like saving up for college
since I was like six, Oh my
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goodness, Like other kids would take
birthday money and like buy toys and I
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00:16:45.799 --> 00:16:48.639
was like, nope, go into
my own college fund. Wow. But
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that's how So when I was able
to go to Santa Cruz and like see
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how my social location compared to other
people's and like have a power analysis and
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all that kind of stuff, it
was my way of like staying connected to
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my community, but also giving back
with like the privilege that I had at
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that point. Right, My uncles
weren't a gang. They came here from
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the Philippines around like nineties, moved
to Panoramic City, Filipinos. I think
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they did it because protection, you
know, it was I think at the
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time there was lots of gang like
tension between certain ethnic groups. Yep.
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Yeah, they tried to get out, didn't work. I think their house
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got shot out. But they're okay. But my grandma the next couple of
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days shipped them out that the Philippines
lay low. That's like the move like
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I heard a lot of like Filipinos
do that, like when they get bus
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there's something some trouble. They were
the Philippines for a couple of years to
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cool off. Yeah. Interesting,
Okay, that makes sense. So going
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back to Libery and everything, like
what transitioned to you from like just managing
257
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an artist to deciding, hey,
I want to become like a creative consultant.
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I got so Liberia was great,
and also I got really really burnt
259
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out, and so I spent three
years with that artist. I think reached
260
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a peak of how much I could
do for him. Like as a as
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an as a manager, you can't
ever want more for your artists than the
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artist wants for themselves. And so
that's when I think our vision just wasn't
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as aligned as it was. And
then Ebola hit and I was burnt out
264
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and there wasn't much I could do. So I came back to the States,
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had no idea what I wanted to
do, and then people started asking
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me for help. And so that's
kind of where the consulting started to build
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out. And I think this way, I actually get to do more.
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I also don't like babysitting, and
management is a lot of babysitting. But
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so this way I think I can
I feel like I have more impact than
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working just with one artist. That
makes sense. What did your family think
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of you pursuing this path or Liberia
becoming like this? You know, uh
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manager, I'm pretty sure they might
have had different expectations for like what you
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wanted to do. What they wanted
you to do? Oh for sure,
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do for your career for sure.
So by like Persian traditional Persian standards,
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I should have been a doctor,
lawyer, engineer, yeah right, like
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immigrant child. And I'm also the
oldest, so like high standard. But
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I have always been a little unconventional
and so I like to I joke around
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with my mom that I like trained
her from the beginning that I was going
279
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to do my own thing, and
so they never stopped me, but they
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didn't actively support me. They didn't
understand it. My extended family definitely was
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like really confused. But I think
now they see that, like now it
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makes sense to them, makes sense. Yeah, but yeah, like there's
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no frame of reference for the kind
of work that I do, right,
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I think for Filipinos, I think
our thing was like, Okay, be
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a nurse. That's like the safest
path. It's like the you know,
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you get help, benefits and throw
and k and like it's good money,
287
00:20:12.880 --> 00:20:18.240
start a family and everything. I
was never a physical I was no one
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00:20:18.279 --> 00:20:19.720
ever told me to be a nurse. But it's a lot of like subtle
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00:20:19.799 --> 00:20:23.160
hints. You know, your uncle, your aunt, they do this and
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00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:29.000
that. You know, I don't
like needles. I'm scared of needles.
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I don't like the side of blood, not like a lot of blood.
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So couldn't do that. And it
was just I don't know, it was
293
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tough. I think just like I
don't know figure out what I wanted to
294
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do. It seemed like a lot
of family members kind of like had their
295
00:20:44.599 --> 00:20:48.000
stuff together and yeah, I mean
I wanted to pursue music and whatnot,
296
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so go to college and you know
and everything. And I think now they're
297
00:20:55.160 --> 00:20:57.319
just glad I work at like a
place that they know that like it's a
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00:20:57.319 --> 00:21:00.599
good place to work at and they're
Okay, well you're not doing that,
299
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You're not doing like bad stufficated in
the past. Do whatever you want.
300
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Yeah, I mean I think about
like as children of immigrants, right,
301
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Like our parents gave up so much
and so they're not they didn't have the
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luxury and privilege to think about Like
my dad is an artist. My dad
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in Iran was like a professor,
he was teaching, he was doing like
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00:21:22.160 --> 00:21:26.079
art show like and then he came
here and like as a salesperson in downtown
305
00:21:26.279 --> 00:21:30.480
La, right, So like he
literally gave up his creative dreams to take
306
00:21:30.519 --> 00:21:34.599
care of two kids. And you
know, and so then for us,
307
00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:40.160
as like the first generation, they're
not thinking about go follow your heart.
308
00:21:40.240 --> 00:21:45.400
They're thinking about be safe, be
stable, be good because they're still in
309
00:21:45.400 --> 00:21:48.920
that survival mentality, right, And
so I think with my family anyways,
310
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it was once my mom and my
dad doesn't care. But like my mom,
311
00:21:53.279 --> 00:21:59.160
once she realized that, like,
I'm not in survival mode, then
312
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it made her more comfortable with me
doing things that really there's no blueprint for,
313
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Like I don't know any other Persians
who do what I do oh okay,
314
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Like, and when we find each
other in the creative field, it's
315
00:22:10.319 --> 00:22:15.079
like wait what, oh my god, like and so there's no blueprint.
316
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So it's also been kind of this
mode of figuring out as I go and
317
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like building community and learning from from
whoever is kind of around me. Right,
318
00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:29.359
yeah, man, that's really that's
really cool that you put it that
319
00:22:29.400 --> 00:22:33.880
way. Look in hindsight, now, I mean I was I had resentment
320
00:22:33.920 --> 00:22:38.160
towards like that mentality and like my
family members for like not actively supporting me.
321
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But as I get older, I
realized, Okay, like that's all
322
00:22:41.079 --> 00:22:45.599
you knew, you know, And
and like my parents had me at a
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really young age, and I know
they had the sacrifice a lot. Yeah
324
00:22:49.960 --> 00:22:57.359
you're young parents, and I have
like more empathy towards you know, upbringing
325
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and just everything else and makes me
kind of not want to have kids.
326
00:23:02.519 --> 00:23:06.680
Oh my god. Yeah, I
just like selfish ice know that I don't
327
00:23:06.680 --> 00:23:11.680
think I'll be responsible. I'm just
being very bluntly honest. I don't know.
328
00:23:11.799 --> 00:23:15.559
I mean I don't think I can
do it. I think parenting is
329
00:23:15.599 --> 00:23:18.000
like tough. I mean, sometimes
you know, things happen and sometimes it's
330
00:23:18.000 --> 00:23:25.480
out of your control it, it
happens. But me, I am proactively
331
00:23:26.480 --> 00:23:30.480
working on not having kids because it's
just I don't know, maybe it feels
332
00:23:30.519 --> 00:23:36.160
like for me like I didn't have
a quote unquote childhood, Like so I'm
333
00:23:36.160 --> 00:23:40.359
like living like that inner child in
me. It's like I'm doing my thing.
334
00:23:40.359 --> 00:23:42.960
I'm still a kid, you know. Yeah, but uh yeah,
335
00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:47.200
you know, it's just it's tough. And I I get you know,
336
00:23:47.279 --> 00:23:49.400
salute them for what they did and
just you know, they did their best.
337
00:23:49.519 --> 00:23:53.759
And I'm as person's thirty four,
I can say, like, you
338
00:23:53.759 --> 00:23:56.079
know, I appreciate what they did. You know, may at the time
339
00:23:56.079 --> 00:24:00.279
I didn't get it, and you
know, they did their best. Right.
340
00:24:00.519 --> 00:24:03.160
I Mean I think about I don't
want kids. Yeah, I'm like
341
00:24:03.200 --> 00:24:06.640
the best auntie. Yeah your kids
will ever have yeah yeah. And then
342
00:24:06.720 --> 00:24:11.519
and I think people have children for
the wrong reasons and yeah, So I
343
00:24:11.519 --> 00:24:14.160
mean we can have a whole conversation
about not having kids. But I'm with
344
00:24:14.200 --> 00:24:17.480
you, Yeah, I'm with you. And I sometimes I wonder if my
345
00:24:17.599 --> 00:24:21.279
mom had a choice to have kids, which right, because that's what you
346
00:24:21.319 --> 00:24:23.279
did. You got married, you
had kids, Like it wasn't a thought
347
00:24:23.319 --> 00:24:26.880
that she was allowed to have to
not have children, and I wonder if
348
00:24:27.200 --> 00:24:33.559
situations had been different, would she
had which she had consciously chosen to have.
349
00:24:33.279 --> 00:24:36.400
Yeah, you know, I get
met I can make that choice,
350
00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:38.839
but a generation ago, a lot
of people couldn't so. But yeah,
351
00:24:38.920 --> 00:24:42.359
no, not for me. For
my parents, it was they got my
352
00:24:42.400 --> 00:24:48.400
mom got pregnant, then they got
married. Philippines is very traditionally Roman Catholic,
353
00:24:48.480 --> 00:24:55.119
one of our like relatives as a
priest, and even even my dad's
354
00:24:55.119 --> 00:24:56.480
mom. No, no, they're
too young to get married. They're like
355
00:24:56.519 --> 00:25:00.400
freaking seventeen twenty. But I think
they want to to like uphold the tradition.
356
00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:03.599
So I think I married. Anyways, it didn't last very long,
357
00:25:04.119 --> 00:25:08.279
but you know, I did their
best. You know, sometimes they trip
358
00:25:08.279 --> 00:25:11.440
out like damn, like my dad
and why we're doing this at this age
359
00:25:11.440 --> 00:25:18.000
and I'm doing this at this like
I don't know. Sometimes I feel guilty
360
00:25:18.000 --> 00:25:19.160
because they're like, oh my god, like they're doing this and I'm like
361
00:25:19.799 --> 00:25:23.400
doing X, Y and Z,
and they're like, you know, doing
362
00:25:25.000 --> 00:25:27.920
productive things and I'm not, you
know, And sometimes it weighs on me.
363
00:25:27.960 --> 00:25:30.880
When I was younger, it waited
on me a lot, But now
364
00:25:30.039 --> 00:25:33.680
you know, it is what it
is. Yeah, but I mean I
365
00:25:33.759 --> 00:25:38.000
also think like it's a different definition
of productivity, right, Like we have
366
00:25:38.359 --> 00:25:44.279
time and energy to like focus on
dreams and take care of our mental health
367
00:25:44.480 --> 00:25:48.160
and you know things that like my
parents definitely couldn't do. I was doing,
368
00:25:48.200 --> 00:25:52.880
like really not yeah, other other
things. What am I doing?
369
00:25:52.920 --> 00:25:56.920
You know? Like yeah, no, they didn't make spreads. Yeah,
370
00:25:57.640 --> 00:26:02.039
they were making spreads, you know
what I'm saying. But yeah, that
371
00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:04.160
was fun. Actually, that's one
thing I took from that whole experience.
372
00:26:04.160 --> 00:26:07.920
Sometimes I make spread just for the
fun of it. Yeah. My friend
373
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:11.960
just came home, like after twenty
years. I don't want to see that
374
00:26:11.000 --> 00:26:17.079
ship man, you know. Yeah. I actually been interviewing him soon.
375
00:26:17.759 --> 00:26:21.920
He's Vietnamese. He just got out
and uh he's changed his life around,
376
00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:26.000
you know. So HEERRM and I
talked. He's willing to like have a
377
00:26:26.000 --> 00:26:30.079
conversation about just like what he learned
in there, not so much of like
378
00:26:30.160 --> 00:26:33.359
what he did, but just like
the transformation part. Yeah yeah, okay,
379
00:26:33.400 --> 00:26:40.279
so I attracted Where were we?
Yeah? Okay, so you transition
380
00:26:40.359 --> 00:26:44.400
from that So like you said you
were earlier, you know, like you
381
00:26:44.440 --> 00:26:48.160
went to Liberia and uh, there's
like different power structures your woman in your
382
00:26:48.279 --> 00:26:56.039
field, Like what obstacles and challenges
do you face that your male counterparts may
383
00:26:56.119 --> 00:27:03.880
not like what, yeah, they're
a lot yeah time? Like how long
384
00:27:03.920 --> 00:27:11.480
hungry? I think, first and
foremost, there are certain assumptions that men
385
00:27:11.680 --> 00:27:17.960
make about and this is talking strictly
like binary, right, but like men
386
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:23.160
make about how women should behave and
when women don't behave according to their expected
387
00:27:23.319 --> 00:27:30.119
gender roles, were perceived as bitchy, nasty, aggressive, like all those,
388
00:27:30.160 --> 00:27:33.440
and then that makes it hard to
do business right. So it's things
389
00:27:33.480 --> 00:27:38.440
like I'm in I'm negotiating a multie, you know, like a big contract,
390
00:27:38.839 --> 00:27:42.559
and the guy I'm negotiating against,
who has never negotiated against a woman,
391
00:27:44.200 --> 00:27:48.359
is telling me to smile and be
nicer. Or walking into a studio
392
00:27:48.400 --> 00:27:52.960
where I might be the only woman, and the guy dapts everybody up,
393
00:27:52.240 --> 00:27:57.000
assumes I'm someone's girlfriend and ignores me. But I'm the person that they're supposed
394
00:27:57.000 --> 00:28:00.240
to meet with, right, And
so it's all the kind of preconceived notions
395
00:28:00.400 --> 00:28:04.880
that men carry and not just men, because then you know, women also
396
00:28:04.880 --> 00:28:08.480
suffer from patriarchy, and so sometimes
as women we carry that out against each
397
00:28:08.480 --> 00:28:15.480
other as well. So it's things
like that because both like creative industries,
398
00:28:15.599 --> 00:28:26.880
entrepreneurship consulting, are all such relationship
driven businesses. The multiple layers of relationship
399
00:28:26.920 --> 00:28:30.839
building and never knowing if someone is
like really trying to build a relationship with
400
00:28:30.880 --> 00:28:36.599
you, or they're trying to get
at you and they're using business as you
401
00:28:36.640 --> 00:28:40.000
know, or if when someone says
like, hey, let's meet at the
402
00:28:40.039 --> 00:28:44.359
studio, is it really trying to
meet at the studio or are you trying
403
00:28:44.359 --> 00:28:48.559
to get you know, it's and
so these it's like the mental gymnastics that
404
00:28:48.720 --> 00:28:53.279
women have to do all the time
that men don't have to think about.
405
00:28:53.319 --> 00:28:56.160
You don't have to think twice about, hey, yeah, let's just meet
406
00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:00.519
in my hotel room before a show. You don't have to think twice that
407
00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:03.599
that might be a setup or a
ruse or whatever. And then if something
408
00:29:03.640 --> 00:29:07.599
were to happen, you don't have
to worry that you're gonna get blamed right
409
00:29:07.799 --> 00:29:10.000
for well, why did you go
and you should have known better? But
410
00:29:10.039 --> 00:29:11.720
also then risking will maybe you miss
out on a big deal, you know,
411
00:29:12.079 --> 00:29:18.279
right, It's all of that.
It's all the kind of extra work
412
00:29:18.680 --> 00:29:23.359
that we have to do as women
that then can that has real life implications
413
00:29:23.359 --> 00:29:27.599
in terms of opportunities contracts, right, business deals, this, that and
414
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:33.759
the end. Yeah. I just
think the whole like gang with them using
415
00:29:33.799 --> 00:29:37.279
like business really tacky. It's really
really gross. Like when I have,
416
00:29:37.400 --> 00:29:38.559
like, you know, when I
meet women for the first time, you
417
00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:41.000
are like really cool. I had
to say, hey, straight up,
418
00:29:41.039 --> 00:29:44.319
like I'm not trying to get you. We're friends, Like I think you're
419
00:29:44.319 --> 00:29:47.319
cute whatever, but like whatever,
but I'm not going to try to like
420
00:29:47.400 --> 00:29:48.680
cross that line. I just want
to let you know. And they're like,
421
00:29:48.680 --> 00:29:52.279
oh my god, I really appreciate
it, and it just goes smoothly
422
00:29:52.279 --> 00:29:57.039
from there because there's no like wondering. I don't like that feeling. So
423
00:29:57.079 --> 00:30:00.240
I like to just put it out
there like, hey, you know,
424
00:30:02.440 --> 00:30:06.200
I just want to let you know, friends cool, I'm not trying to
425
00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:08.640
do anything weird, and it just
really it's I think it's good on both
426
00:30:08.680 --> 00:30:17.480
parties. Yeah, so let's see. Okay, culture Fix what is that?
427
00:30:17.640 --> 00:30:21.960
I love? Culture Fix? Okay. So culture Fix is a global
428
00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:26.359
network of artists, entrepreneurs, activists
who use their platforms for social impact.
429
00:30:26.839 --> 00:30:32.880
I co founded it with Natalie Crue
eight years ago now on Twitter. We
430
00:30:32.960 --> 00:30:37.680
met on Twitter during a Twitter chat. Natalie has since left and is doing
431
00:30:37.720 --> 00:30:42.200
amazing work in the meta space with
like NFTs and things like that. But
432
00:30:42.359 --> 00:30:48.839
so Culture Fix really is a space
for artists and creatives who are doing work
433
00:30:48.920 --> 00:30:52.240
that we're told is too radical,
too different, There's there's no audience for
434
00:30:52.279 --> 00:30:56.319
this. It's too niche to find
each other, support each other, exchange
435
00:30:56.359 --> 00:31:00.839
resources. So we do a lot
of creative collaborations. We do educational workshops.
436
00:31:02.359 --> 00:31:04.920
We just started a discord that I'm
super excited about. We have a
437
00:31:06.079 --> 00:31:11.440
short Reads book club that's all books
and articles under one hundred pages, because
438
00:31:11.440 --> 00:31:15.200
who has time to read whole books
on political theory when you're working a job,
439
00:31:15.240 --> 00:31:18.279
surviving a pandemic, taking care of
people X, Y, and z.
440
00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:23.000
And so it really is a space
for people to connect and create,
441
00:31:23.880 --> 00:31:29.920
with the basic understanding being that our
struggles are interconnected and we have enough to
442
00:31:29.920 --> 00:31:33.240
succeed, and so the more we
support each other, the more we create
443
00:31:33.359 --> 00:31:38.240
kind of a global good impact.
Something that we discussed in our previous attempt
444
00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:42.880
for podcasting is that but was that
abundance mentality? Like, yeah, what's
445
00:31:42.920 --> 00:31:48.000
that? Is that? Right?
Abundance mentality versus what's the opposite of it,
446
00:31:48.079 --> 00:31:52.200
scarcity or right, Like I mean, growing up rapping, I always
447
00:31:52.240 --> 00:31:55.880
thought, oh, I have to
be the best, and like I have
448
00:31:55.960 --> 00:31:59.680
to I have to like be number
one, and everyone else like fuck them
449
00:31:59.799 --> 00:32:04.279
kind of thing. There's always that
mentality I think, just ingrained. I
450
00:32:04.319 --> 00:32:07.559
don't know if it's competition. I
don't know if it's for the sake of
451
00:32:07.559 --> 00:32:13.359
competition. I don't know if it's
if it's a reaction due to insecurity.
452
00:32:14.200 --> 00:32:19.359
But I noticed a few years ago
they're like, hey, this is not
453
00:32:19.480 --> 00:32:22.920
my lane. I don't I don't
like this, right, you know,
454
00:32:22.960 --> 00:32:24.680
I don't. I don't care.
Like I mean, it's cool, like
455
00:32:24.720 --> 00:32:29.319
I have that title, but just
on going back and forth and just the
456
00:32:30.200 --> 00:32:34.119
competition maybe I don't know, like
that's not me And that's why I start
457
00:32:34.160 --> 00:32:36.720
rapping like that because I felt like
why am I doing this? It's not
458
00:32:36.799 --> 00:32:40.319
even fun anymore. But talk to
us about just like the scarcity mentality and
459
00:32:40.319 --> 00:32:45.279
abundance mentality and how it kind of
just affects like hip hop or just in
460
00:32:45.359 --> 00:32:51.680
general anything. Yeah, I mean
under again, like under capitalism, we're
461
00:32:52.039 --> 00:32:55.200
conditioned to believe that the things we
value the most are the most scarce.
462
00:32:55.440 --> 00:33:00.400
Yeah, and this isn't just like
money, it's also things like love.
463
00:33:00.440 --> 00:33:02.920
We treat love like a transaction,
or we treat supporting other. If I
464
00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:07.880
support you too much, you're not
gonna like you're gonna take something away from
465
00:33:07.880 --> 00:33:12.240
me. And these are all they're
false, like they're false constructs. And
466
00:33:12.319 --> 00:33:15.640
so when we come from that place
of that scarcity mindset that there's not enough
467
00:33:15.720 --> 00:33:20.880
so I have to hoard it for
myself, or that barrel of crabs mentality
468
00:33:20.960 --> 00:33:22.960
right where I gotta like step on
you to get on top because you might
469
00:33:23.000 --> 00:33:29.039
take away from me, those are
not real, Like that's not real.
470
00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:31.279
Those are things that we've been told
or true, and so we make them
471
00:33:31.319 --> 00:33:36.200
true by kind of acting that way. The flip of that is this abundance
472
00:33:36.319 --> 00:33:40.480
mentality, which is we have everything
we need to succeed me. It's low
473
00:33:40.519 --> 00:33:45.599
if for folks who are like familiar
with polyamory, it's kind of a polyamorous
474
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:49.319
mentality, like there is enough for
all of us, and me giving to
475
00:33:49.359 --> 00:33:52.279
you doesn't take away from what I
have for myself or what I can give
476
00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:58.079
to someone else. And so in
this construct, the more we support each
477
00:33:58.079 --> 00:34:01.000
other, the more we all win, and it allows for collaboration and interdependence
478
00:34:01.039 --> 00:34:06.079
and cross pollination. And we see
that are you know, from a political
479
00:34:06.119 --> 00:34:12.119
perspective, our struggles are interconnected.
From a business or marketing perspective, our
480
00:34:12.199 --> 00:34:16.039
success is interconnected. From a community
perspective, are like looking out for each
481
00:34:16.039 --> 00:34:21.079
other, you know, we all
win and so it's just a different way
482
00:34:21.119 --> 00:34:25.119
I think of valuing people and interacting
with one another. Yeah, I like
483
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:29.760
that a lot better. I feel
like, yeah, there's playing a room
484
00:34:29.840 --> 00:34:32.840
to succeed and just we don't have
to, like, I don't know,
485
00:34:34.039 --> 00:34:36.440
step on each other to like you're
on top. I think a lot of
486
00:34:36.519 --> 00:34:39.039
you know, I think everyone has
like it's like a pyramid almost right,
487
00:34:39.119 --> 00:34:42.599
like, oh, there's going to
be one. I think the higher you
488
00:34:42.639 --> 00:34:45.880
go, the less space theres for
people. But I think there's different levels
489
00:34:45.880 --> 00:34:50.119
of success. I learned that from
you in Stow. Just like there's different
490
00:34:50.199 --> 00:34:52.960
levels. You don't have to like
be mega drake famous. It's like maybe
491
00:34:52.960 --> 00:34:54.920
that's not what everyone wants to be. I don't want to be like that.
492
00:34:55.280 --> 00:34:59.840
I want to go to a grocery
store and like shop in piece.
493
00:35:00.199 --> 00:35:01.079
I don't want to you know,
like I want to you know, it's
494
00:35:01.159 --> 00:35:05.840
nice when I was younger, maybe
that was cool, like when you're I
495
00:35:05.880 --> 00:35:07.960
was younger. Oh, I want
to be famous, but like seeing now
496
00:35:08.000 --> 00:35:13.480
what we've seen on social media,
like just you know, people of like
497
00:35:14.440 --> 00:35:17.239
celebrities, like what they have to
deal with on social media and everything they're
498
00:35:17.280 --> 00:35:21.719
getting stock they're getting there, I
just sleep. I don't want that,
499
00:35:22.280 --> 00:35:23.320
you know. I want to be
able to, like, you know,
500
00:35:23.400 --> 00:35:27.840
make money off of what I do, live comfortably. But I want like
501
00:35:27.880 --> 00:35:30.679
my own privacy, which is also
I think something you and I have talked
502
00:35:30.679 --> 00:35:36.599
a lot about, which is protecting
your like mental health is like personal well
503
00:35:36.639 --> 00:35:40.159
being is just as much part of
the definition of success that we can create,
504
00:35:42.400 --> 00:35:45.039
where like it doesn't. It's not
just how much money you make or
505
00:35:45.079 --> 00:35:47.559
how many streams you have, but
like what's the quality of life and getting
506
00:35:47.639 --> 00:35:52.360
to create what you want. I
heard, well, everyone listening to this
507
00:35:52.360 --> 00:35:55.639
probably knows Eminem, but I heard
the like he can't even go out without
508
00:35:55.679 --> 00:36:00.440
like security detail he's too famous.
Like I mean, he has all the
509
00:36:00.440 --> 00:36:02.519
money, but he can't. It'll
be tough. I enjoy just like that,
510
00:36:04.480 --> 00:36:07.360
you know, like just going out
as a regular person without getting a
511
00:36:07.360 --> 00:36:08.280
bunch of people. Oh my god, Heylen, how's it going? You
512
00:36:08.320 --> 00:36:12.559
know? So, yeah, there's
like that too, or it's like,
513
00:36:12.880 --> 00:36:16.079
I don't know, I don't know
if I mean, it's like if we
514
00:36:16.159 --> 00:36:22.840
start the question of what kind of
life do I want to lead, and
515
00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:27.079
then you build your business plan from
there, and then you develop your creative
516
00:36:27.119 --> 00:36:30.199
strategy from there, it's a different
approach than like, oh, I need
517
00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:35.559
to make like X million dollars or
this. You know, it changes kind
518
00:36:35.559 --> 00:36:40.360
of your whole relationship to your work. That then work becomes part of your
519
00:36:40.480 --> 00:36:45.280
life versus your living to work,
which most of us don't want to do.
520
00:36:45.320 --> 00:36:50.519
And I would argue that a lot
of the people who do like live
521
00:36:50.599 --> 00:36:55.039
to work are running away from other
things and it's an ego thing. But
522
00:36:55.159 --> 00:36:59.119
yeah, yeah, we can kind
of create the kind of lives we want
523
00:36:59.159 --> 00:37:05.480
to live. Yeah, so I
know. On your Twitter bio it says
524
00:37:05.719 --> 00:37:09.760
anti capitalist Business Coach for Creative entrepreneurs
Hip, Hop and Mental Health from a
525
00:37:09.800 --> 00:37:15.400
global perspective. What in your opinion, how is capitalism flawed and how does
526
00:37:15.440 --> 00:37:20.440
it type to hip hop and mental
health. So the simple answer is,
527
00:37:20.559 --> 00:37:25.400
I think capitalism. Capitalism will always
put profit over people, right, And
528
00:37:25.480 --> 00:37:30.880
as long as you put profit over
people, people will suffer, right,
529
00:37:30.000 --> 00:37:35.159
And we're seeing that right, Like, I legitimately don't know anyone who's like,
530
00:37:35.320 --> 00:37:38.440
really really okay. Right now,
we're more than two years into a
531
00:37:38.480 --> 00:37:45.159
pandemic. There's at least forty active
conflicts happening around the world. Outside of
532
00:37:45.159 --> 00:37:49.360
the big ones, we have loved
ones who are incarcerated, people can't afford
533
00:37:49.400 --> 00:37:53.119
gas or how is it like the
world is fucked and under capitalism, we're
534
00:37:53.159 --> 00:37:57.519
told to just keep going. This
is our new normal. It's right.
535
00:37:57.559 --> 00:38:00.679
It's like that meme where everything's on
fire, the guys like just sitting there
536
00:38:00.719 --> 00:38:10.880
drinking his tea and so. And
I think hip hop oftentimes upholds capitalist values,
537
00:38:12.920 --> 00:38:17.719
especially now as like hip hop has
become more mainstream. Sometimes I think
538
00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:21.480
about the ways that hip hop has
been co opted, and is hip hop
539
00:38:21.559 --> 00:38:25.880
still hip hop if it's no longer
challenging or questioning systems of power as it
540
00:38:25.960 --> 00:38:31.840
once was doing, is now kind
of complicit in some of these things that
541
00:38:32.039 --> 00:38:38.639
thirty years ago it was challenging and
criticizing. So that, to me is
542
00:38:38.679 --> 00:38:43.599
the kind of intersection capitalism is making
us all sick and hip hop is kind
543
00:38:43.599 --> 00:38:46.119
of in some ways can be not
all hip hop, right, and like
544
00:38:46.199 --> 00:38:50.559
around the world hip hop is very
very different. But if we're looking at
545
00:38:50.599 --> 00:38:54.719
like mainstream hip hop in the US, I think there's an argument to be
546
00:38:54.760 --> 00:39:02.039
made for how complicit hip hop is
in this like uphold of consumerism and capitalism.
547
00:39:02.159 --> 00:39:05.880
Yeah, definitely, And you know
it's weird. With consumerism, I'm
548
00:39:05.960 --> 00:39:08.480
learning I realize just like self inventory
with time, Like sometimes a lot of
549
00:39:08.519 --> 00:39:13.159
times I buy stuff for ju,
stuff that cost plenty so I can feel
550
00:39:13.159 --> 00:39:15.639
better, right, Like, oh, like I'm stressed out, I'm going
551
00:39:15.679 --> 00:39:21.039
to get sushi or get fucked up
or like oh, you know, like
552
00:39:21.079 --> 00:39:22.800
I feel a lot better if I
like got this to X, Y and
553
00:39:22.960 --> 00:39:27.360
Z, you know, and something. I'm kind of realizing like, oh,
554
00:39:27.480 --> 00:39:30.760
okay, that's that's what that is. Sorry, no, no,
555
00:39:30.760 --> 00:39:34.599
I was just gonna it makes me
think about. It's something that Tupac used
556
00:39:34.639 --> 00:39:38.840
to talk about, is this idea
of conspicuous consumption that in a world,
557
00:39:38.960 --> 00:39:44.719
especially for people of color, where
we've been told like we're not worth shit,
558
00:39:45.719 --> 00:39:51.440
we've under capitalism been conditioned to buy
things and buy things publicly and visibly
559
00:39:52.119 --> 00:39:55.000
because we've been conditioned to think that
that's where our worth is. Oh,
560
00:39:55.079 --> 00:40:00.559
look at the fancy car, my
jewelry or these shoes or this name or
561
00:40:00.559 --> 00:40:07.400
whatever, because we think that wealth
will literally like buy our acceptance under these
562
00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:13.079
systems of oppression. And so again
it's like the way that we're gaslighting ourselves,
563
00:40:13.119 --> 00:40:16.440
right, We're playing these tricks or
doing these mental gymnastics to make life
564
00:40:16.559 --> 00:40:23.159
under a harmful system, a painful
system manageable. But then it doesn't work
565
00:40:23.199 --> 00:40:28.960
because no amount of like fancy jewelry
is going to make up for the microaggressions
566
00:40:28.960 --> 00:40:31.679
you're experiencing at work. So I
think these are some of the things.
567
00:40:31.960 --> 00:40:36.159
And so part of what I do
is, as like from the anti capitalist
568
00:40:36.360 --> 00:40:40.280
perspective, is helping people think about
what it looks like for them to operate
569
00:40:40.440 --> 00:40:46.440
kind of free of those systems or
imagining yeah, that different ways are actually
570
00:40:46.519 --> 00:40:51.199
possible. Right. I'll get back
into the hip hop at mental health in
571
00:40:51.239 --> 00:40:53.440
a bit. But so what you
do, what you still do where I
572
00:40:53.480 --> 00:40:58.079
realize like what I really know like
a brand, right, Like you have
573
00:40:58.159 --> 00:41:00.800
to find what is your brand?
Oh? Sorry, what is your brand?
574
00:41:00.840 --> 00:41:02.199
I thought, like when I think
a brand, I think of like
575
00:41:02.440 --> 00:41:07.599
you know, designer like companies.
I just thought, for maybe I don't
576
00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:12.679
know, ten to fifteen years of
making rapping that I just got to make
577
00:41:12.760 --> 00:41:20.480
music. Rights it, make music, keep doing it. Eventually you're like
578
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:23.480
get to some it's some like very
vague goal like I'm gonna get to the
579
00:41:23.480 --> 00:41:28.280
top one day, you know,
without realizing what a brand is and how
580
00:41:29.239 --> 00:41:32.719
much of an impact like that can
make aside from just making music. So
581
00:41:34.000 --> 00:41:37.480
what is a brand? And like
how do you I don't know, show
582
00:41:37.719 --> 00:41:40.840
clients like what their brand is or
what their niche is. Yeah, and
583
00:41:40.880 --> 00:41:45.320
shout out to Stowe, who's my
co host at office hours with Nora and
584
00:41:45.360 --> 00:41:52.119
Stoe. So I think, and
I think especially now right like if we
585
00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:55.880
looked I don't know, like fifty
sixty years ago, the way that people
586
00:41:55.960 --> 00:42:02.000
consumed information came from a few standards
sources. So there was a kind of
587
00:42:02.039 --> 00:42:07.199
acceptance of the limited exposure that you
would have to something, and so the
588
00:42:07.320 --> 00:42:10.920
narratives were easily controlled. And so
you saw I don't know, a commercial,
589
00:42:12.079 --> 00:42:14.920
you saw Coca Cola commercial. Everybody
was like with their family, they
590
00:42:14.920 --> 00:42:16.239
were drinking, they were so happy, and you're like, cool, that's
591
00:42:16.280 --> 00:42:22.000
like the Coca Cola vibe. And
that's the brand association we start to make.
592
00:42:22.440 --> 00:42:25.599
I think now, because we have
so many different platforms and so many
593
00:42:25.599 --> 00:42:34.199
different channels through which we're consuming information, people want more context and so branding
594
00:42:34.480 --> 00:42:38.199
now, especially for like independence or
like smaller, smaller kind of creatives or
595
00:42:38.320 --> 00:42:45.239
entrepreneurs, it's about context and connection, and so the brand is nothing more
596
00:42:45.280 --> 00:42:47.800
than like your reputation and your personality. Okay, that makes a lot of
597
00:42:47.920 --> 00:42:52.639
sense. It's like how you show
up. It's how you're vulnerable, it's
598
00:42:52.719 --> 00:42:55.320
how you know. Sometimes it is, as much as I hate to admit
599
00:42:55.320 --> 00:42:59.760
it, the way we look,
because that can you know if I walked
600
00:42:59.760 --> 00:43:04.159
around with like a mohawk and purple
hair, that would communicate something to you,
601
00:43:04.480 --> 00:43:08.199
like punk music, right, Like
we make interpretations, right, but
602
00:43:08.280 --> 00:43:13.519
it's not. I think people focus
a lot on like what's my font,
603
00:43:13.639 --> 00:43:16.280
what's my color? But like that
has no personality, it has no soul.
604
00:43:16.880 --> 00:43:21.760
Versus like when we get on a
podcast together, how are we talking
605
00:43:21.840 --> 00:43:24.119
or what's the energy? What kind
of words are we using? It's it's
606
00:43:24.159 --> 00:43:29.639
how we show up and hold space
for the people in our communities and communities
607
00:43:29.679 --> 00:43:34.119
being your customers or your clients or
your fan base. So yeah, it's
608
00:43:34.360 --> 00:43:39.400
branding is really about just authentic connection
and personality because if you over time over
609
00:43:39.480 --> 00:43:43.079
sessions, I think with me,
it's like harm reduction is one. Yes,
610
00:43:43.159 --> 00:43:45.880
that's like you know pretty much people
are going to use drug alcohol,
611
00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:51.000
might as well educate them, like
with how to do it in a safer
612
00:43:51.039 --> 00:43:53.920
way? Is where does that sound? But especially today going on as like
613
00:43:53.960 --> 00:43:59.400
a lot of overdoses because of fentannel. It's what that is. People don't
614
00:43:59.440 --> 00:44:06.000
know. It's it's just like synthetic
opioid. It was originally made for like
615
00:44:06.320 --> 00:44:08.800
you know, people that cancer a
lot of pain, but now it's mass
616
00:44:08.800 --> 00:44:14.480
marketed and it's been somehow over the
years been put in a lot of drugs
617
00:44:14.920 --> 00:44:17.360
like cocaine for sure, is everything
in general, And now there's place like
618
00:44:17.400 --> 00:44:22.280
end Overdose or just a lot of
nonprofits that provide fen and all test strips
619
00:44:22.599 --> 00:44:25.719
which can tell you like you know, we put whatever you have into the
620
00:44:25.719 --> 00:44:29.639
strip, it will tell you if
it has PenTile or not, and that
621
00:44:29.639 --> 00:44:34.360
can really help prevent overdoses and deaths. That and like you know, how
622
00:44:34.400 --> 00:44:38.239
to show how to look for signs
of like someone is about the overdose or
623
00:44:38.280 --> 00:44:42.360
just like you know, their pupils
or their heart rate and like what to
624
00:44:42.440 --> 00:44:46.679
do. I believe in California,
if you call nine one one some oh
625
00:44:46.760 --> 00:44:49.800
dude, you're not gonna get You're
I don't think it'll get charged. You
626
00:44:49.800 --> 00:44:53.480
don't get in trouble. So there's
there's something then, just like you know,
627
00:44:53.519 --> 00:44:58.480
empathy and compassionate people who use,
because it's not like some people don't
628
00:44:58.559 --> 00:45:00.679
use just to like do what they've
feel like they have to, like chemical
629
00:45:00.679 --> 00:45:06.480
stuff, and just all about the
destigmatization of just drug users in general,
630
00:45:07.079 --> 00:45:13.280
that mental health. It's obvious enough
mental health is really important, that kind
631
00:45:13.320 --> 00:45:16.400
of stuff. Yeah, So I
just want to like uplift what you just
632
00:45:16.440 --> 00:45:22.039
said. That testing strips are really
easy to get and super safe, like
633
00:45:22.039 --> 00:45:25.400
like literally life savers. You can
also get narcan really easily arcanto, which
634
00:45:25.440 --> 00:45:30.280
is if someone does have an overdose, it's like almost a quick reversal yea.
635
00:45:30.960 --> 00:45:32.239
And there's tons of places where you
can get that for free, and
636
00:45:32.360 --> 00:45:37.400
especially now like you really should test
everything. But so this makes me really
637
00:45:37.440 --> 00:45:43.239
happy because when we first started working
together, you were so against talking about
638
00:45:43.400 --> 00:45:46.599
any of these things. Yeah,
and so now like it is I think
639
00:45:46.599 --> 00:45:51.599
part of what makes your voice so
unique that you're talking about the harm reduction,
640
00:45:51.679 --> 00:45:53.599
you're talking about the mental health,
and you're talking about it in ways
641
00:45:54.119 --> 00:45:58.800
that is very different than like how
I would talk about it or how someone
642
00:45:58.800 --> 00:46:02.079
else. And I think that is
what makes someone because you know you've heard
643
00:46:02.159 --> 00:46:07.679
me say this before. People.
Music, art, even our like affiliation
644
00:46:07.800 --> 00:46:10.280
with brands, is an emotional thing, right, our favorite artists. We
645
00:46:10.320 --> 00:46:15.400
don't like our favorite artists because they're
fucking great rappers. We like them because
646
00:46:15.760 --> 00:46:19.239
oh I like I like this person, or they make me feel good about
647
00:46:19.239 --> 00:46:22.119
myself or whatever. And so it's
been really dope to watch you lean into
648
00:46:22.159 --> 00:46:25.880
these things that like a year and
a half ago, you were definitely shying
649
00:46:25.880 --> 00:46:29.880
away from. Yeah, I think
a lot of it was just I don't
650
00:46:29.880 --> 00:46:30.800
know what people think, but I
was like, this is me. I
651
00:46:30.800 --> 00:46:35.159
think a lot of it was honestly
my family, but like, I don't
652
00:46:35.159 --> 00:46:37.920
think that have Instagram. Well some
of them do, but like my uncle's
653
00:46:37.960 --> 00:46:39.039
clear to say anything. You know, that's cool. I like what you're
654
00:46:39.079 --> 00:46:43.880
doing, but I'm only on social
media, which is great. My dad,
655
00:46:43.920 --> 00:46:45.719
I am. I think you try
to add me on like Facebook,
656
00:46:45.760 --> 00:46:49.559
I don't know you found oh we
have mutual friends as like our my cousband
657
00:46:49.639 --> 00:46:52.639
mutual friend. But I don't.
My rule is I don't add family members
658
00:46:52.679 --> 00:46:57.280
on Facebook just because like we're not
friends or family, you know. I
659
00:46:57.400 --> 00:47:00.320
like to keep that, you know, divine come up with like a family
660
00:47:00.440 --> 00:47:06.360
app. Yeah, you could just
keep it separate. Yeah, I don't
661
00:47:06.360 --> 00:47:08.280
know. I know a lot of
my family uses Facebook to communicate. I
662
00:47:08.400 --> 00:47:13.119
use it for other reasons like make
memes and like shit posts and just don't
663
00:47:13.159 --> 00:47:15.320
they get it. I think they
always be like, what is he doing?
664
00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:17.039
You know, for them, it's
very serious. Okay, here's a
665
00:47:17.039 --> 00:47:21.639
picture of like, you know,
like our fiftieth family gathering. Here's richer
666
00:47:21.639 --> 00:47:22.800
of me and my grandson, that
kind of stuff. I don't use it
667
00:47:22.840 --> 00:47:27.760
for that. I am very selective
of who I ad just because I post
668
00:47:27.800 --> 00:47:30.000
stuff there that like I don't want
everyone to know. So there's that.
669
00:47:30.880 --> 00:47:34.519
But yeah, I was kind of
worried about like what my family would think.
670
00:47:34.559 --> 00:47:37.519
I think, deep down I think
that was my thing because I always
671
00:47:37.559 --> 00:47:42.599
felt like I was so like outside
of just like what their expectations were.
672
00:47:42.880 --> 00:47:45.679
I don't want to like make it
worse, but I'm not honestly like looking
673
00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:52.119
at it from a big perspective.
I'm not really promoting anything negative. I'm
674
00:47:52.119 --> 00:47:55.679
not no, so I think that's
well, you know, I'll beat me.
675
00:47:57.039 --> 00:48:00.360
You know, my mom recently seen
my tattoo. She's cool with it.
676
00:48:00.440 --> 00:48:02.840
My dad's cool with it. She
says, as long as you don't
677
00:48:02.840 --> 00:48:07.159
get it below your elbow. But
I'm gonna do it because I don't know
678
00:48:07.159 --> 00:48:12.039
that for you, if you notice
reverse psychology, how it is with your
679
00:48:12.039 --> 00:48:15.199
mom or your family, Like if
they tell you not to do something,
680
00:48:15.639 --> 00:48:17.079
you'll do it. I don't know
how it is. But like for me,
681
00:48:17.199 --> 00:48:21.920
I feel like one mom says don't
do this, X, Y,
682
00:48:21.960 --> 00:48:25.119
and Z, I think subconsciously I
want to rebel against that and do it.
683
00:48:27.079 --> 00:48:30.280
I don't know, you have like
a in psychology, they'll call it
684
00:48:30.320 --> 00:48:35.239
like an automatic note, you know. For me, like I understand that
685
00:48:35.280 --> 00:48:38.920
when my mom says, like my
mom has aversion to tattoos, not because
686
00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:45.599
there's anything inherently wrong with tattoos,
but it's her conditioning coming from Iran that
687
00:48:45.679 --> 00:48:51.199
like only criminals got tattoos, and
she just hasn't been able to unlearn that.
688
00:48:52.119 --> 00:48:54.679
Or We've been having a lot of
talk lately about drugs and there's a
689
00:48:54.719 --> 00:49:00.920
lot of research being done with like
ketamine for depression and MDM for depression and
690
00:49:00.960 --> 00:49:02.679
things like that. My mom's a
mental health she's like a therapist. Oh,
691
00:49:04.079 --> 00:49:09.480
but she's like no drugs never.
But it's not because she's consciously reacting
692
00:49:09.519 --> 00:49:15.199
to like new research. It's her
conditioning from like a gazillion years ago.
693
00:49:15.679 --> 00:49:21.760
So I've learned not to take her
and like the I don't really take the
694
00:49:21.760 --> 00:49:23.840
rest of my family seriously at all, but like my mom is the one
695
00:49:23.840 --> 00:49:29.440
where I'm like, uh, you
trigger me. But it's just stuff that
696
00:49:29.480 --> 00:49:34.239
she has to unlearn, right.
I mean, like I could have told
697
00:49:34.280 --> 00:49:36.840
you like ten years ago that you
can use keny for depression. I don't
698
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:37.960
know why that was a big fucking
deal, Dude, I told you,
699
00:49:38.039 --> 00:49:40.960
I told you. MDMA does that, bro, Like that's why people take
700
00:49:42.000 --> 00:49:43.760
it, bro, That's why I
took it all the time. Broad fucking
701
00:49:43.760 --> 00:49:46.039
world so much, dude, Like
holy shit, Like, I'm glad I
702
00:49:46.079 --> 00:49:50.039
had good pills of poke balls,
but fuck, dude, I just I
703
00:49:50.079 --> 00:49:52.199
don't know. I'm glad I'm like
able to like have a like I can
704
00:49:52.320 --> 00:49:55.880
like talk and everything because there was
that big Oh my god, I put
705
00:49:55.880 --> 00:50:00.519
holes in your brain, you pull
like harm reduction, like, oh,
706
00:50:00.639 --> 00:50:01.920
you take ten pills a fucking holding
your b beIN. What the fuck,
707
00:50:02.000 --> 00:50:06.079
dude, Like I take Well,
I'm not gonna say that, but like,
708
00:50:06.639 --> 00:50:07.760
is that that's the kind of stuff, right, like oh, you
709
00:50:07.800 --> 00:50:12.719
try just want your hooked, No, not really, like you don't get
710
00:50:12.760 --> 00:50:15.639
hooked for the first time smoking heroin. Like I just fucking threw up,
711
00:50:15.679 --> 00:50:17.159
and it was like, oh,
okay, that was weird. It was
712
00:50:17.199 --> 00:50:22.079
the conditional like, oh, it's
kind of cool because I think for me,
713
00:50:22.519 --> 00:50:24.320
I want, okay, cocain is
too early, I want to mellow
714
00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:28.400
out. And I took it and
I just it was kind of weird.
715
00:50:28.400 --> 00:50:30.079
I almost threw up, you know, I did throw up, and then
716
00:50:30.280 --> 00:50:35.760
okay, I'm never doing that again. But then like slowly but surely,
717
00:50:36.239 --> 00:50:37.320
it kept up on me, and
I realized, oh, fuck, Like
718
00:50:37.360 --> 00:50:42.000
this is different because I was so
used to just taking stimulants that when I
719
00:50:42.039 --> 00:50:47.199
started taking like donners or opiates that
when you try to stop, it's kind
720
00:50:47.199 --> 00:50:52.360
of it's not intense because your body
goes to like physical withdrawals, which is
721
00:50:52.400 --> 00:50:59.880
something again like harm reduction stuff.
You should know if you know, if
722
00:50:59.880 --> 00:51:02.280
you are friends or you do it, they're like, it's a lot different,
723
00:51:02.719 --> 00:51:06.440
you're gonna feel like shit kind of
stuff as opposed to them saying,
724
00:51:06.440 --> 00:51:07.840
oh, just say no, right, But then like for the people who
725
00:51:07.880 --> 00:51:13.880
do it, they're just labeled as
like I mean, there's a lot of
726
00:51:13.920 --> 00:51:22.679
also like virtue signaling and moral like
peacocking around drug, and a lot of
727
00:51:22.679 --> 00:51:27.840
that I think is rooted in puritanical
ideas of like what's good and what's bad
728
00:51:27.960 --> 00:51:30.960
and what and you know, like
we can trace the history of drug is
729
00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:34.000
a super racist in the US,
and like there's all this stuff around it.
730
00:51:35.519 --> 00:51:37.440
But I think you're right that,
like, as with any kind of
731
00:51:37.519 --> 00:51:42.599
abstinence education, you create like just
say no, which doesn't work and also
732
00:51:42.639 --> 00:51:45.800
doesn't teach people how to learn how
different stuff. And this is true if
733
00:51:45.800 --> 00:51:50.280
we're talking about sugar coffee, like
anything, right, how it impacts your
734
00:51:50.320 --> 00:51:52.320
body and what you need to do
to protect yourself and then protect the people
735
00:51:52.320 --> 00:51:57.480
that you love. Because we know
that the just say no shit, they're
736
00:51:57.559 --> 00:52:02.119
like magically backfired. Know it's weird, it's back I really I've seen it
737
00:52:02.159 --> 00:52:07.119
at the CVS, Like there's kids
like or high school people like manning it.
738
00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:10.199
I don't know, I want to
check that table. But like but
739
00:52:10.239 --> 00:52:13.360
I was like, you know what
I said, I'm like, you know
740
00:52:13.440 --> 00:52:17.800
what, They're coming from a different
aspect. I think maybe the goal is
741
00:52:17.840 --> 00:52:22.719
the same as to like not want
people to like overdose and everything, but
742
00:52:22.320 --> 00:52:24.920
we go out in different ways.
That's their thing, this is my thing.
743
00:52:24.960 --> 00:52:28.639
I'm not going to like harass them
for it. But it's back.
744
00:52:28.719 --> 00:52:31.800
I don't know what their new thing
is. But yeah, I think there's
745
00:52:31.840 --> 00:52:35.559
that one meme where it's like,
oh, like you feel the dear line.
746
00:52:35.639 --> 00:52:39.159
You know, we feel them because
that and like that weird commercial where
747
00:52:39.199 --> 00:52:44.440
like it's your brain on drugs and
like it was like pan fry and there
748
00:52:44.519 --> 00:52:49.079
was that person's deflate on the couch. Yeah, I don't know. I
749
00:52:49.119 --> 00:52:52.000
mean like I used to kind of
like demonize that stuff too, and so
750
00:52:52.039 --> 00:52:54.280
I try, oh, it's not
like so bad. And I kind of
751
00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:58.280
saw people in different lives who do
it. And again there's a lot of
752
00:52:58.320 --> 00:53:04.000
people, maybe people you don't even
know your coworkers, family friends take drugs
753
00:53:04.000 --> 00:53:07.880
and have normal lives. But then
there's also people that like take it and
754
00:53:07.960 --> 00:53:12.719
just like gets low on proportion,
and you know, I don't know,
755
00:53:12.840 --> 00:53:16.400
I just feel like for me,
when people were like shame me for it,
756
00:53:16.480 --> 00:53:20.639
I doubled down and it's like kind
of distanced myself. I think that's
757
00:53:20.639 --> 00:53:23.400
something that like we should be mindful
of when we're dealing with you know,
758
00:53:23.440 --> 00:53:27.360
people are not lives that you know
may need help, but like we kind
759
00:53:27.360 --> 00:53:30.599
of pull a fucking intervention when they
don't even know it, you know,
760
00:53:30.639 --> 00:53:36.239
and like shame them and everything.
And you know, it's like a moral
761
00:53:36.320 --> 00:53:37.840
thing. But I think a lot
of people people do that because they want
762
00:53:37.840 --> 00:53:42.360
to feel right, but they're not
considering what that person feels like because what
763
00:53:42.400 --> 00:53:45.920
they're gonna do is they're gonna like
avoids you even more. And with all
764
00:53:45.920 --> 00:53:50.000
this stuff in the drugs now they
might you know Odi, you know,
765
00:53:51.039 --> 00:53:54.440
so yeah that kind of stuff.
Yeah, it's not effective. Yeah,
766
00:53:54.880 --> 00:53:59.320
I mean it's effective in making it's
effective in making it like worse, but
767
00:53:59.360 --> 00:54:04.920
not better. What you're doing is
like talking to you know, clients about
768
00:54:05.519 --> 00:54:13.039
branding and everything where social media comes
into play. Like we are people,
769
00:54:13.719 --> 00:54:17.960
entrepreneurs whatever. They use social media
like a benchmark, right, like the
770
00:54:19.239 --> 00:54:27.400
likes, engagement views. They use
it as like a benchmark to for their
771
00:54:27.599 --> 00:54:31.960
self worth or like if they're they're
worth as an artist, right, can
772
00:54:31.960 --> 00:54:37.679
you talk to us about that?
I mean, I think it's just what
773
00:54:37.719 --> 00:54:42.199
you said, right. People judge
their own value based on how many streams
774
00:54:42.199 --> 00:54:44.920
they got, how many likes they
got, how many comments they got.
775
00:54:45.719 --> 00:54:49.480
But it's a false measure, right, right, it doesn't actually mean anything.
776
00:54:49.519 --> 00:54:53.559
And you can have fans who never
follow you on Instagram, but they
777
00:54:54.199 --> 00:54:58.639
open every email you send or they
talk about you to other people. And
778
00:54:58.679 --> 00:55:01.280
you can have people who like everything
that you post, but they never show
779
00:55:01.360 --> 00:55:07.119
up to a show. And so
again, like if we remember that social
780
00:55:07.159 --> 00:55:13.440
media does not exist to support your
business really so no, so like Instagram,
781
00:55:13.840 --> 00:55:19.039
Yeah, yeah, like Instagram,
instagram purpose is not to boost you
782
00:55:19.159 --> 00:55:23.079
or amplify you. And we can
complain about algorithms all day, but Instagram
783
00:55:23.119 --> 00:55:28.159
exists to get you to keep going
to the app and opening the app.
784
00:55:28.239 --> 00:55:30.840
Right, the more times you open
the app, the more money they make
785
00:55:30.920 --> 00:55:34.840
because they have more users and they
have more activity. And then the more
786
00:55:35.360 --> 00:55:37.280
the algorithm is difficult for you,
the more you're gonna buy ads, and
787
00:55:37.280 --> 00:55:40.679
so that's more money in their pockets. Right, So, like, if
788
00:55:40.719 --> 00:55:46.960
we understand that while social media is
a tool, it's purpose is always going
789
00:55:47.039 --> 00:55:51.239
to be to make money for the
company, right, not your company,
790
00:55:51.559 --> 00:55:57.679
their own company. Then I think
it becomes important for because then we get
791
00:55:57.679 --> 00:56:00.440
into that place of like critical self
judgment. Right, howk Uan has a
792
00:56:00.440 --> 00:56:04.480
million streams and I only have twenty
four. How come so and so do
793
00:56:04.719 --> 00:56:07.360
this? Or they did this and
they went viral, So let me try
794
00:56:07.360 --> 00:56:14.599
that too, And we start comparing
ourselves to falsehoods without seeing the full picture
795
00:56:14.639 --> 00:56:19.679
of anything anyway. And so that's
that mental health piece right right. And
796
00:56:19.760 --> 00:56:23.760
so I think if you focus on
building genuine direct relationships with your customers or
797
00:56:23.800 --> 00:56:29.000
your clients. I'm huge on newsletters. I think everybody should have a newsletter,
798
00:56:29.119 --> 00:56:32.000
even if you only have three subscribers. That's like back in the day
799
00:56:32.239 --> 00:56:36.519
we used to write notes and pass
notes in class. Like your newsletter is
800
00:56:36.519 --> 00:56:39.400
like passing notes to your friends,
and you can build it out that way.
801
00:56:39.440 --> 00:56:45.599
And so I think it's just important
to remember that social media is not
802
00:56:45.719 --> 00:56:50.639
a reflection or a measure of anything, right. And I have time this
803
00:56:50.760 --> 00:56:52.199
back to earlier when I said hip
hop and mental health like what I do.
804
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:55.519
Sometimes I definitely feel that way.
Like a lot of times I know
805
00:56:55.639 --> 00:57:01.719
that Instagram definitely has been reducing your
visibility over the years, and the option
806
00:57:02.199 --> 00:57:08.639
of buying or promoting your ads for
money has more prominent. I've seen more
807
00:57:08.679 --> 00:57:14.559
sponsored posts. I did it before
too, and like it's I think I
808
00:57:14.599 --> 00:57:16.519
did it just you know, see
what it was like. And there was
809
00:57:16.559 --> 00:57:21.440
like that false sense of, oh, I feel better about myself because I
810
00:57:21.440 --> 00:57:23.519
have more views, because I have
more likes. I mean, you know,
811
00:57:23.559 --> 00:57:25.840
I'm not gonna lie. It's cool. It's a little dobamine hit,
812
00:57:25.960 --> 00:57:31.480
you know, but you know,
when they I don't know, just when
813
00:57:31.519 --> 00:57:36.480
you rely on that too much,
it can really have an impact on your
814
00:57:36.599 --> 00:57:42.320
like feeling of self worth as like
an artist entrepreneur. And yeah, definitely,
815
00:57:42.440 --> 00:57:45.519
like it's just something to be mindful
of. I mean a lot of
816
00:57:45.599 --> 00:57:47.039
us tend to do it, but
now when I do it, I try
817
00:57:47.039 --> 00:57:51.880
to like have a dialogue on my
head. Okay, this is like they're
818
00:57:51.920 --> 00:57:54.880
doing their own thing, like they're
you know, maybe it's their only job,
819
00:57:54.880 --> 00:57:58.199
but there are only things to make
music, so obviously they have more
820
00:57:58.199 --> 00:58:00.400
content, or they have more time
or I don't even know the time.
821
00:58:00.400 --> 00:58:02.159
It's like, so why would I
even't care? Let me just focus on
822
00:58:02.199 --> 00:58:06.719
me. And also too. I've
said it before in previous episodes, where
823
00:58:06.800 --> 00:58:09.440
social media is like a highlight reel. Right, this is not real life.
824
00:58:09.480 --> 00:58:14.800
I mean we post the best pictures, the coolest things, you know,
825
00:58:15.519 --> 00:58:17.400
not so much day to day stuff, but like, you know,
826
00:58:17.480 --> 00:58:22.360
but we're conditioned to think this is
like every day. We're conditioned to think
827
00:58:22.440 --> 00:58:25.639
like stuff happens in one minute or
like this person blew up quote unquote overnight
828
00:58:27.000 --> 00:58:30.039
when this person's been working at it
for like ten plus years. Yes,
829
00:58:30.440 --> 00:58:34.000
right, And the other part of
it is just real quick like and there's
830
00:58:34.079 --> 00:58:37.960
been so much written about this about
how addictive social media is, but we
831
00:58:38.000 --> 00:58:42.440
don't realize that we're addicted to it. And so there is you know,
832
00:58:42.599 --> 00:58:46.079
like you mentioned the dopamute hit,
there is something really real when you realize
833
00:58:46.079 --> 00:58:50.800
that you're like, wait, why
did I open this? Why I've been
834
00:58:50.840 --> 00:58:54.199
scrolling mindlessly? Like, And so
there's real kind of mental health effects.
835
00:58:54.599 --> 00:59:00.639
And so if we're not careful about
setting really clear boundaries and being hyper kind
836
00:59:00.639 --> 00:59:05.239
of vigilant or hyper conscious of like, my value is not in these likes
837
00:59:05.280 --> 00:59:07.559
and this is not the place where
I'm gonna find connection or whatever it might
838
00:59:07.599 --> 00:59:10.559
be, it can become easy to
get caught up in it without realizing that
839
00:59:10.559 --> 00:59:14.599
they were caught up in it.
And I have so much empathy for the
840
00:59:14.639 --> 00:59:16.880
younger generation because we did growing up. I think for us it was like
841
00:59:16.920 --> 00:59:21.960
MySpace, right, that was like
the bigging okay zanga live journal. That
842
00:59:22.119 --> 00:59:24.400
was like the beginning of it.
I think at the time Facebook was a
843
00:59:24.400 --> 00:59:28.679
bit nerdy because you have to have
like not everyone could have it, only
844
00:59:28.800 --> 00:59:30.960
like people with the eed you could
have it. But I don't know how
845
00:59:31.000 --> 00:59:36.559
they deal with like all this stuff, you know it cyberbully and just all
846
00:59:36.599 --> 00:59:40.039
this stuff going on, Like I
don't know, it must be tough for
847
00:59:40.079 --> 00:59:45.920
them. Yeah, you know,
I don't know, it's tough because for
848
00:59:45.960 --> 00:59:47.400
me, I don't know how you
can do it. Like I remember I
849
00:59:47.440 --> 00:59:52.119
was going to post something on TikTok
and my friend she does TikTok, and
850
00:59:52.159 --> 00:59:53.800
she goes and I was, oh, you want to do this because she
851
00:59:53.840 --> 00:59:58.400
thought it was a good idea this
video I made. But then she are
852
00:59:58.400 --> 01:00:01.360
you ready for just like a bunch
of people just like being really fucking mean
853
01:00:01.400 --> 01:00:05.960
to you, just saying like really
fucked up shit on the comments because that's
854
01:00:05.960 --> 01:00:07.880
what they do. And I'm like, you know what, No, I'm
855
01:00:07.880 --> 01:00:10.559
not, let's not post it.
I don't know, you know, like
856
01:00:12.679 --> 01:00:14.960
I'm not once argue online. I've
done in the past, but just like
857
01:00:14.960 --> 01:00:17.679
I've seen how I don't end of
the day just feel like burnt out and
858
01:00:17.719 --> 01:00:22.920
you're arguing with people on the internet
you never meet. There's like I was
859
01:00:22.960 --> 01:00:27.440
part of these meeting pages and people
would just like take it personal and everything,
860
01:00:27.480 --> 01:00:30.599
and it was just kind of like
really silly, but you're like protecting
861
01:00:30.599 --> 01:00:34.280
your ego at the same time,
and it's just I don't know, man,
862
01:00:34.280 --> 01:00:36.840
it's really tough. And I think
social media is great as a tool,
863
01:00:36.840 --> 01:00:39.320
like you said, but it shouldn't
be like your whole life kind of
864
01:00:39.360 --> 01:00:44.119
thing. And it can be easily
I mean for younger people who may not
865
01:00:44.280 --> 01:00:47.800
like understand and everything, and this
might be like the whole world to them,
866
01:00:47.840 --> 01:00:50.800
you know. And I mean,
and I say this to someone,
867
01:00:50.840 --> 01:00:54.079
I love Twitter, but knowing when
to be like dude, not my monkey,
868
01:00:54.199 --> 01:00:58.599
not my circus, not my bad
and like, yeah, making sure
869
01:00:58.599 --> 01:01:02.239
that you stay connected in ways that
feel good. Right. So newsletters,
870
01:01:02.599 --> 01:01:06.599
right, like those are the ones
I've seen. I think a lot of
871
01:01:06.719 --> 01:01:08.880
us know newsletters, but we don't
even realize they are. Let's say we
872
01:01:08.960 --> 01:01:13.599
go to like a website where we
shot close at Oh, here's your you
873
01:01:13.639 --> 01:01:15.639
know, here's your email, or
give us your email. We'll give you
874
01:01:15.679 --> 01:01:21.280
like fifteen percent or something. Those
newsletters, right, yes, talk to
875
01:01:21.360 --> 01:01:24.880
us more about like what newsletters can
do for artists and everything. So there's
876
01:01:24.880 --> 01:01:29.639
definitely that right where it's like,
here's more you bought for me, so
877
01:01:29.760 --> 01:01:34.559
like buy more, and buy more
and buy more. But for businesses or
878
01:01:34.679 --> 01:01:39.719
musicians or different kinds of like entrepreneurs, newsletter can be a direct way to
879
01:01:39.960 --> 01:01:44.440
communicate with your audience and show them
all the things that they don't know.
880
01:01:44.559 --> 01:01:50.800
Goes into running a podcast or producing
an albums or you know, it becomes
881
01:01:50.880 --> 01:01:53.320
so you want to think about what
is your audience value. And in the
882
01:01:53.360 --> 01:01:58.000
example that you shared, like there's
financial value, right, people want discounts
883
01:01:58.039 --> 01:02:02.719
and savings, But for artists or
businesses, the value might be in information,
884
01:02:04.400 --> 01:02:07.000
or the value might be in community, or the value might be in
885
01:02:07.199 --> 01:02:10.159
entertainment. And so your newsletter can
really be whatever you want it to be.
886
01:02:10.239 --> 01:02:15.119
Mine often shares like tips, I
share a favorite song, I share
887
01:02:15.119 --> 01:02:20.239
a bunch of resources, and then
if I'm like doing an offering and so
888
01:02:20.400 --> 01:02:24.800
like it's your newsletter is really just
another way for you to communicate with folks,
889
01:02:24.840 --> 01:02:29.280
but on your terms, there's no
algorithm. In the meantime, there's
890
01:02:29.320 --> 01:02:35.519
no character limit, there's no your
your pen pals, right with your with
891
01:02:35.599 --> 01:02:37.639
the people who have decided that they
want to connect with you in this way.
892
01:02:37.920 --> 01:02:39.880
Right? Do you open your emails
a lot? Like? Do you
893
01:02:39.880 --> 01:02:46.280
have a lot of unready email messages? I try really really hard to answer
894
01:02:46.280 --> 01:02:52.280
my emails. Sometimes I'll like read
it mark is unread because it makes me
895
01:02:52.360 --> 01:02:57.000
really anxious. But lately I've been
unsubscribing to things and that's felt really good.
896
01:02:59.119 --> 01:03:04.199
Yeah I have thirty one thousand,
but yeah, but most of them
897
01:03:04.360 --> 01:03:08.800
are just like you said, over
time, I substracted stores for discounts and
898
01:03:08.960 --> 01:03:15.559
just Facebook notifications, Instagram notifications.
You give that about four or five years.
899
01:03:15.760 --> 01:03:17.199
That's what they're doing thousand. You
know, it looks like that's why
900
01:03:17.199 --> 01:03:20.239
I don't know, Like, maybe
is there a way to delete everything?
901
01:03:20.760 --> 01:03:25.039
Also? I already do that.
Don't get notifications for anything, not on
902
01:03:25.079 --> 01:03:30.519
my phone, not on my email, not like nothing. I should do
903
01:03:30.559 --> 01:03:34.039
that because it takes a lot of
space. It takes a space. It
904
01:03:34.079 --> 01:03:39.000
also like interrupts my life all the
time. Look at that is wild.
905
01:03:39.159 --> 01:03:43.679
I think it just yeah, I
don't even know. Yeah, you can't
906
01:03:43.719 --> 01:03:47.320
see this, but like literally the
man has over three thousand thirty one.
907
01:03:49.559 --> 01:03:52.719
Yeah that's yeah, No, that's
a delete all. How do you delete
908
01:03:52.760 --> 01:03:54.960
all? I have no idea,
yes, because it's pretty hard, Like
909
01:03:55.320 --> 01:03:59.719
you can edit, right, I
think you can do this. There's got
910
01:03:59.719 --> 01:04:02.199
to be like little box at the
top. Okay, last time, one
911
01:04:02.280 --> 01:04:06.000
time I was I was fucking Zam. I was off Zan's. I deleted
912
01:04:06.000 --> 01:04:10.400
like five hundred pictures on my phone. This was back in the day.
913
01:04:10.639 --> 01:04:13.280
No, no, I wanted to
because I needed space. This was back
914
01:04:13.320 --> 01:04:16.039
in the day when you couldn't like
its delete one by one. Yeah,
915
01:04:16.079 --> 01:04:20.960
but I was on Xanax and like
time flies when you're on Honestly though,
916
01:04:21.039 --> 01:04:26.400
like cleaning out my phone is a
really relaxing thing sometimes really, and I'm
917
01:04:26.440 --> 01:04:30.840
like when I'm not on xan X, but like there's something about like purging
918
01:04:30.039 --> 01:04:33.800
and deleting and like letting go of
or emails from like six years ago,
919
01:04:33.800 --> 01:04:38.000
I'm never going to follow up on
this. I could just delete and like,
920
01:04:38.840 --> 01:04:43.599
yeah, I only checked my email
to see if that one uh adult
921
01:04:43.679 --> 01:04:46.280
actress hit me up for the podcast, because it was so crazy because I
922
01:04:46.320 --> 01:04:48.960
thought, oh wow, she'll never
respond. But I was like, you
923
01:04:48.960 --> 01:04:50.800
know, let me give it a
shot. Let me do it in a
924
01:04:50.800 --> 01:04:56.000
professional way and not going to DM
some dumb shit. Let me do an
925
01:04:56.000 --> 01:05:00.039
email because on her thing says like
booking or info. Here's email. Hey,
926
01:05:00.079 --> 01:05:04.320
what's it goings on? I have
a podcast speaks about X, Y
927
01:05:04.360 --> 01:05:10.239
and Z. I think you know
I follow you on social media. We
928
01:05:10.320 --> 01:05:14.719
have similar like passions of like mental
health, social justice, harmon reduction.
929
01:05:15.440 --> 01:05:17.800
Would you be open to doing a
podcast that kind of stuff? Like,
930
01:05:18.079 --> 01:05:25.199
I think it's cool that I see
Southeast uh, Southeast Asian American doing what
931
01:05:25.239 --> 01:05:27.360
you do, because usually it's just
like a stick here like a lot of
932
01:05:27.440 --> 01:05:30.719
East Asian and uh. And I
was surprised that same nature, responding,
933
01:05:30.760 --> 01:05:33.719
oh, oh my gosh, that's
so cool. Yeah, that's really cool
934
01:05:34.840 --> 01:05:40.440
and and yeah, that's the only
time I check my email that and just
935
01:05:40.480 --> 01:05:47.440
like random stuff because mostly it's it's
like Uber eats order something. Yeah.
936
01:05:47.519 --> 01:05:51.559
So one of the projects I work
on is Den Music Fest, and we're
937
01:05:51.599 --> 01:05:56.639
an independent hip hop festival where We
don't look at your social media following,
938
01:05:56.679 --> 01:06:00.320
we don't look at your streaming numbers, we don't you to submit to perform,
939
01:06:00.360 --> 01:06:03.440
we don't do pay to play.
But it really is a platform where
940
01:06:03.440 --> 01:06:08.360
we try to give independent artists a
stage and help people discover new music,
941
01:06:08.400 --> 01:06:12.440
because most people by the time they're
thirty stop looking for new music, and
942
01:06:12.480 --> 01:06:15.480
so we try to make it really
easy to discover dope artists. Right,
943
01:06:16.679 --> 01:06:21.239
I probably, and these are people
who have submitted to perform. I probably
944
01:06:21.320 --> 01:06:26.119
have a fifty percent response rate to
people who have submitted to perform. So
945
01:06:26.159 --> 01:06:30.159
I email them and I say,
hey, we'd love to have you perform.
946
01:06:30.519 --> 01:06:32.920
Can you respond? And then we
never hear back. And maybe I'm
947
01:06:32.920 --> 01:06:35.079
getting ghosted, which is fine.
Maybe you don't want to perform, you
948
01:06:35.119 --> 01:06:41.039
don't want to tell me, like
whatever. But I think this is something
949
01:06:41.159 --> 01:06:46.760
as artists, especially who get so
caught up in making music and like checking
950
01:06:46.840 --> 01:06:51.239
email and respond And I get it, like I'm I total. You know,
951
01:06:51.320 --> 01:06:55.440
it'll take me three months sometimes to
respond to an email that takes like
952
01:06:55.559 --> 01:07:00.400
ten minutes of work. But like
checking email and being responsive is one of
953
01:07:00.440 --> 01:07:03.960
the most simple things you can do
to make sure that you're not missing out
954
01:07:04.000 --> 01:07:08.639
on things because people are still emailing. Someone was like, nah, email
955
01:07:08.679 --> 01:07:14.559
is so email is not dead like
around, especially when you have like discord
956
01:07:14.679 --> 01:07:18.760
outages and Instagram outages and Twitter is
down. Like email has been around since
957
01:07:19.760 --> 01:07:26.519
like the eighties. Yeah, like
will continue to be around. And so
958
01:07:26.599 --> 01:07:30.320
I think as it's just such a
you know, like you check your text
959
01:07:30.360 --> 01:07:33.039
messages, you check your DMS,
y'all, just check your emails. Yeah,
960
01:07:33.559 --> 01:07:36.199
I have to lead a lot of
my emails. I don't know how
961
01:07:36.239 --> 01:07:40.719
to do it. Maybe maybe you
said it world like you should call againness
962
01:07:40.719 --> 01:07:44.119
and see if there's like a world
record. Maybe I can get some No,
963
01:07:44.159 --> 01:07:46.000
I'm kidding. I'm kidding. I'm
totally kidding, And I can leave
964
01:07:46.000 --> 01:07:48.599
my emails. But yeah, it's
a lot. It's overwhelming, so I
965
01:07:48.599 --> 01:07:50.800
don't look at it. Yeah,
it's a lot. I just looked at
966
01:07:50.840 --> 01:07:57.639
it right now. Anxiety written so
well, Like, I think what's cool
967
01:07:57.679 --> 01:08:01.440
about social media is sometimes you can
get in touch with you know, uh,
968
01:08:02.079 --> 01:08:08.360
people like you look up to listen
to, which is really cool.
969
01:08:08.440 --> 01:08:11.920
I think that's something that we growing
up have never been able to do.
970
01:08:12.159 --> 01:08:16.399
Maybe back then I was like those
like that fan club right or whatever,
971
01:08:17.840 --> 01:08:24.720
you can do that. But now
it's like almost everybody is accessible. If
972
01:08:24.760 --> 01:08:28.520
one word is to reach out,
like what when would you use a direct
973
01:08:28.560 --> 01:08:30.279
message on Instagram? And when would
you use an email? Do you have
974
01:08:30.319 --> 01:08:35.560
any I think it? I don't
know. In some ways, I think
975
01:08:35.560 --> 01:08:42.560
they're interchangeable. What's more important is
because you can be disrespectful in an email,
976
01:08:42.640 --> 01:08:46.079
right, and you could be mad
respectful in a DM. So I
977
01:08:46.079 --> 01:08:50.760
think if people have if they say
like email me, don't DM me,
978
01:08:51.319 --> 01:08:56.199
or if they have an email address, like use what people have what their
979
01:08:56.199 --> 01:09:00.359
preferred method of communication is. But
if there's no like clear thing like my
980
01:09:00.720 --> 01:09:04.600
on all my socials, my dms
are always open. So I'm giving you
981
01:09:04.640 --> 01:09:08.800
permission to DM me, but be
respectful. I think what's more important is
982
01:09:10.079 --> 01:09:15.720
making sure that you send a thoughtful
message, which means like greet people by
983
01:09:15.800 --> 01:09:20.319
name and introduce them, introduce yourself
and carry the mental load of like making
984
01:09:20.319 --> 01:09:27.640
that connection happen. Don't spam people
send, do not send unsolicited links.
985
01:09:27.880 --> 01:09:30.560
I check out my music? Yeah, oh my god, or thinks you're
986
01:09:30.600 --> 01:09:33.520
being slick? Hey, how are
you? I want to help you?
987
01:09:33.640 --> 01:09:38.960
Here's my link? No? No, yeah, you know what really it
988
01:09:39.000 --> 01:09:43.199
really it's one of mine too,
because sometimes I'm dming. Your girls are
989
01:09:43.199 --> 01:09:47.920
saying memes or whatever or whatever I
see like that airplane paper airplane notification.
990
01:09:48.039 --> 01:09:50.920
Oh my god, it's hurt.
No, it's a fucking guy. I'm
991
01:09:50.920 --> 01:09:55.199
like, what the fuck? Bro
like playing with your emotions. Yeah,
992
01:09:55.279 --> 01:09:59.800
it's just it's really deceiving it.
Really, I'm like offended by it.
993
01:10:00.079 --> 01:10:02.800
What I do I put them on
general and mute them because dude, that's
994
01:10:02.840 --> 01:10:06.920
not cool because I feel like,
here's my thing. But I mean,
995
01:10:06.960 --> 01:10:10.520
okay, I have empathy to it
too, because that's why I did when
996
01:10:10.560 --> 01:10:14.239
I started off right right. But
these people are like, we're into it
997
01:10:14.319 --> 01:10:16.439
like X amount of years man,
you know. And for me it's like,
998
01:10:16.840 --> 01:10:19.760
I know you make music because I
added you. If I want to
999
01:10:19.800 --> 01:10:24.000
check out music, I would I
see it on my timeline. Please don't
1000
01:10:24.000 --> 01:10:26.319
go on my dms. That's a
very for me. It's a very sacred
1001
01:10:26.359 --> 01:10:30.680
place like that's a very like for
friends. Yeah, it's invasive. It's
1002
01:10:30.680 --> 01:10:38.520
for friends people I know having actual
conversations with, and it's just really unprofessional.
1003
01:10:38.560 --> 01:10:40.520
I feel like, and I you
know, I can't blame them if
1004
01:10:40.520 --> 01:10:43.640
they don't know, but maybe they'll
find out one day, you know,
1005
01:10:44.119 --> 01:10:46.720
but it just really really upsets me. And if that's even more when they
1006
01:10:46.720 --> 01:10:49.640
say, hey, check out my
music, share my stuff, but they
1007
01:10:49.640 --> 01:10:53.880
don't reciprocate that, right, And
I don't know if that's me being pitted,
1008
01:10:53.960 --> 01:10:57.119
just be being like courteous, like, dude, you know I did
1009
01:10:57.119 --> 01:10:59.960
that for you. I think it
would be nice if you would hear this.
1010
01:11:00.560 --> 01:11:01.720
Well, this goes back to what
we were talking about earlier, right,
1011
01:11:01.760 --> 01:11:06.039
if they were to lead with supporting
you, right, And this is
1012
01:11:06.039 --> 01:11:10.560
where like artists have to think.
For like, if you know you have
1013
01:11:10.600 --> 01:11:13.800
an album released coming, and you
know you're gonna make asks for people in
1014
01:11:13.840 --> 01:11:17.560
a month, then you should start
now by nurturing and cultivating those relationships.
1015
01:11:17.920 --> 01:11:21.720
So if they share your podcast or
they amplify your music, or they share
1016
01:11:21.760 --> 01:11:26.239
your memes or whatever it is,
and then so you're gonna see that,
1017
01:11:26.279 --> 01:11:30.199
you're gonna take notice, you're gonna
remember it then a month from and then
1018
01:11:30.199 --> 01:11:32.880
you're probably gonna reach out and be
like, yo, thank you. Now
1019
01:11:33.800 --> 01:11:39.520
you've opened the communication pathway and then
they can make an ask about Hey,
1020
01:11:39.520 --> 01:11:42.399
I'm releasing a project, can I
share it with you? No? And
1021
01:11:42.399 --> 01:11:44.560
then you can say no, yeah, but you know what I mean.
1022
01:11:44.880 --> 01:11:48.920
Then it changes the whole dynamic versus
I'm gonna come in, I haven't talked
1023
01:11:48.960 --> 01:11:51.479
to you and forever, I'm going
to ask you to do work on my
1024
01:11:51.600 --> 01:11:57.840
behalf without even acknowledging anything. Like
y'all see how one sided that is.
1025
01:11:58.079 --> 01:12:02.000
Yeah, it's and I think too
make a connection because you want to and
1026
01:12:02.039 --> 01:12:06.479
not because you think that will advance
you in your ladder of success or whatever.
1027
01:12:09.119 --> 01:12:12.000
Yeah, I just really attacking.
I can we can tell, people
1028
01:12:12.039 --> 01:12:15.560
can tell when people are really you
know, because yeah, I don't know,
1029
01:12:15.199 --> 01:12:18.039
you're not slick. People think they're
so slick. Hey, I was
1030
01:12:18.039 --> 01:12:23.039
thinking about you. And also here's
my thing. I want to know,
1031
01:12:23.239 --> 01:12:28.119
like your audience, your audience is
smart. Yeah, and definitely the people
1032
01:12:28.439 --> 01:12:31.680
that are like collaborators and colleagues are
smart. So a lot of you are
1033
01:12:31.680 --> 01:12:34.720
not as slick as you think you're
being when you're spamming folks. And also
1034
01:12:34.720 --> 01:12:40.720
to what I realized, it's okay
if like your friends aren't necessarily always your
1035
01:12:40.720 --> 01:12:44.119
fans or your audience, and that's
what you gotta be okay with it,
1036
01:12:44.159 --> 01:12:46.399
because like I don't expect my friends
to listen to my music. Mind do
1037
01:12:46.439 --> 01:12:51.479
It's really cool. Sometimes awkward because
we're in the same car, but yeah,
1038
01:12:51.479 --> 01:12:57.000
it's okay, Like you have people
just your friends and your fans,
1039
01:12:57.000 --> 01:13:00.279
and it's not always interchangeable and stuff. I know. Yeah, no,
1040
01:13:00.560 --> 01:13:05.840
I think that's an important distinction,
Like you can support me. Hey,
1041
01:13:05.920 --> 01:13:09.560
Nora, how's it going? How
you know? I saw you had this
1042
01:13:09.600 --> 01:13:12.720
thing. How are you feeling?
What do you need without having to support
1043
01:13:12.880 --> 01:13:16.239
my output or my product? Right, Like that's two separate things for sure.
1044
01:13:17.039 --> 01:13:19.199
That's kind of weird sometimes when my
friends ask me, oh, like
1045
01:13:19.359 --> 01:13:23.399
cool song, Oh thanks, I
guess it's like, I mean, I'm
1046
01:13:23.399 --> 01:13:26.560
still getting used to it. But
for me, it's like, dude,
1047
01:13:26.600 --> 01:13:28.479
we're friends. You don't have to
like. I mean, it's cool if
1048
01:13:28.479 --> 01:13:30.279
you do, but I wouldn't look
down up. Oh how come you didn't.
1049
01:13:30.479 --> 01:13:32.439
We're not best friends anymore, you
know, Like right, yeah,
1050
01:13:34.000 --> 01:13:41.720
okay, so we've going on a
little tangent. Okay, so with them,
1051
01:13:41.880 --> 01:13:44.760
Yeah, so talk about comparisons.
How it can really like mess up
1052
01:13:44.800 --> 01:13:48.239
your mental health and how like I
don't know if you can get become petty
1053
01:13:48.319 --> 01:13:51.760
people you have petty over it.
They send like subliminal tweets and everything.
1054
01:13:51.800 --> 01:13:57.000
I'm just I don't know. I
think it's a lot of it is guys
1055
01:13:57.079 --> 01:14:00.600
under competition. I think a lot
of it is oh, yeah, you
1056
01:14:00.640 --> 01:14:02.399
know, I'm just keeping you know, keeping in your story trup. Now
1057
01:14:02.439 --> 01:14:05.279
you're just in security. I mean
it's cool to a degree, but it's
1058
01:14:05.319 --> 01:14:09.199
like looking at it that way.
I mean, I don't know. Is
1059
01:14:09.239 --> 01:14:11.640
it competition. Maybe you feel like, oh, maybe I can, like,
1060
01:14:12.199 --> 01:14:14.840
you know, I want to be
part of it or just reply.
1061
01:14:15.000 --> 01:14:19.279
But sometimes I really feel like,
hey, it's a great you know yeah,
1062
01:14:19.399 --> 01:14:25.439
Or it's like a desire to exert
control over someone or to like flex
1063
01:14:25.520 --> 01:14:29.359
power because you somehow feel like you've
lost path. Yeah, you know.
1064
01:14:29.520 --> 01:14:36.640
I My thing about like social media
debates is I'm not ever interested in change.
1065
01:14:36.760 --> 01:14:41.119
Like you might say something, if
you say something publicly, I feel
1066
01:14:41.159 --> 01:14:45.439
like it's fair game to reply to
you publicly. I'm not interested actually in
1067
01:14:45.560 --> 01:14:49.760
changing your mind. I think that
it's important for people to see like a
1068
01:14:49.840 --> 01:14:56.039
counter narrative to whatever nonsense someone is
saying, or for people to know that
1069
01:14:56.199 --> 01:15:00.439
like I'm a safe space even though
everyone is like upholding this really problematic view
1070
01:15:00.520 --> 01:15:08.520
or what you know. But like
I don't feel I've learned for my own,
1071
01:15:08.680 --> 01:15:11.880
like I don't have to say something
to everything because I'm also like,
1072
01:15:12.199 --> 01:15:14.600
you know, I'm like a bit
of a but like there's a warrior in
1073
01:15:14.640 --> 01:15:17.279
me that's like ready to fight battles
all the time, and I'm like can't,
1074
01:15:17.359 --> 01:15:20.520
Like that's not sustainable for me,
so giving myself permission to like step
1075
01:15:20.560 --> 01:15:25.239
away. Also, there's one thing
that really upsets me when I see on
1076
01:15:25.279 --> 01:15:29.319
social media. I'll tell you off
camera, off air, but okay,
1077
01:15:29.359 --> 01:15:31.920
so oh I'm so curious. Yeah, okay, there's like one there's I
1078
01:15:31.960 --> 01:15:35.720
mean, there's a lot of things. There's one thing they'll really I'll infringe
1079
01:15:35.720 --> 01:15:40.760
you for that shit, but okay, pitfalls of being a perfection in your
1080
01:15:40.760 --> 01:15:42.560
craft. I think I was too. I think a lot of us are
1081
01:15:42.600 --> 01:15:45.039
like rappers or whatever, like,
oh, I want like the best thing
1082
01:15:45.119 --> 01:15:46.960
to come out, so I'm gonna
take a bunch of time to it.
1083
01:15:47.920 --> 01:15:50.880
You know. I think in behind
it looks cool, that sounds good,
1084
01:15:50.960 --> 01:15:54.359
right, you want to take your
time to it. But if you take
1085
01:15:54.399 --> 01:15:58.960
too much time from it and you're
afraid to release it, like you'll never
1086
01:16:00.079 --> 01:16:03.119
yeah true, I mean, does
that happen a lot with your clients,
1087
01:16:03.920 --> 01:16:10.760
for sure. Yeah, but I
think perfectionism is often a mask for anxiety
1088
01:16:11.239 --> 01:16:15.319
or like imposters, it's like figuring
out what is the what is the perfectionism
1089
01:16:15.399 --> 01:16:20.039
about? And we often, again
as like people of color, as women,
1090
01:16:20.079 --> 01:16:25.319
as queer folks, there's extra pressure
for us to be perfect because our
1091
01:16:25.359 --> 01:16:30.319
mistakes then reflect on all women or
all you know this, that and the
1092
01:16:30.359 --> 01:16:34.039
other versus like straight white dudes are
allowed to fail all the time and people
1093
01:16:34.039 --> 01:16:38.000
are like, no, it's fine, you get a second chance. So
1094
01:16:38.039 --> 01:16:42.720
there's like an extra burden on us. And because I think we oftentimes feel
1095
01:16:42.760 --> 01:16:45.239
like we have less resources, so
we get only one shot. You know.
1096
01:16:46.439 --> 01:16:50.000
All the irony of Eminem talking about
that is really funny to me,
1097
01:16:50.000 --> 01:17:00.640
and he says you only get anyways. But yeah, I think realize that
1098
01:17:00.680 --> 01:17:04.840
perfection is not real and that by
the time you get to a point that
1099
01:17:04.920 --> 01:17:09.800
you feel perfect enough, someone else
has already done what you've wanted to do
1100
01:17:10.279 --> 01:17:14.960
imperfectly. But it's actually in the
like imperfection that people connect and bond with
1101
01:17:15.000 --> 01:17:19.560
your right, like perfection is not
is not accessible, it's not friendly,
1102
01:17:19.600 --> 01:17:24.119
Like no one wants to be friends
with the perfect kid, and so it's
1103
01:17:24.159 --> 01:17:28.039
in allowing yourself to be vulnerable that
actually people will connect and relate to you.
1104
01:17:28.439 --> 01:17:31.199
I think I just thought of something, the whole perfection thing. Maybe
1105
01:17:31.239 --> 01:17:38.840
why a lot of rappers want a
perfection thing they like see Naws, that
1106
01:17:38.840 --> 01:17:43.079
that illmatic thing. Oh that was
first album, five mics, you know.
1107
01:17:43.119 --> 01:17:46.479
I think maybe that's why people live
up to this standard. And I
1108
01:17:46.560 --> 01:17:49.199
realized a few years ago, I'm
a fucking nos bro. I'm not fucking
1109
01:17:49.239 --> 01:17:51.600
I'm not jay Z. I'm I'm
not trying JD kids. I'm trying to
1110
01:17:51.680 --> 01:17:56.039
me bro like I think a long
time we wanted to be. I want
1111
01:17:56.079 --> 01:17:58.800
to wrap like them. But I'm
not aggressive, dude. I'm not like
1112
01:17:58.840 --> 01:18:01.079
that, not in that sense.
I'm I'm not like. That's not me.
1113
01:18:01.199 --> 01:18:05.800
And I realized, I want you
know, that's not me. Do
1114
01:18:05.840 --> 01:18:10.319
you know what it is too?
It's like there's so much that's invisible.
1115
01:18:10.520 --> 01:18:13.880
There's so much of that labor that's
invisible. Like, do you really think
1116
01:18:13.880 --> 01:18:17.239
that jay Z is sitting by himself
writing bars like in Marci projects. No,
1117
01:18:17.319 --> 01:18:21.000
He's got a whole fucking team of
writers and producers and people around him
1118
01:18:21.239 --> 01:18:25.560
who may or may not be credited, but who are like making these greatest
1119
01:18:25.560 --> 01:18:29.680
albums, And because for those of
us who came up in that era of
1120
01:18:29.800 --> 01:18:33.680
hip hop, there's so much that
we didn't know, and so we're comparing
1121
01:18:33.720 --> 01:18:41.479
ourselves to a standard that isn't necessarily
a real standard. And now we're like,
1122
01:18:41.600 --> 01:18:44.640
oh, wait, Dre wrote that
verse for so and so or so
1123
01:18:44.680 --> 01:18:50.199
and so did like oh ghostwriters.
And now that it's becoming more mainstream knowledge,
1124
01:18:50.840 --> 01:18:54.439
I think a lot of folks are
having a hard time making that like
1125
01:18:54.520 --> 01:19:00.680
adjustment in their heads because the professionals, right, like the mainstream artist are
1126
01:19:00.680 --> 01:19:03.079
not working by themselves. But yet
here we are on the independent scene,
1127
01:19:03.399 --> 01:19:08.159
really proud of the fact that,
oh I got here by myself, and
1128
01:19:08.199 --> 01:19:12.319
it backfires. And so it's also
part of like not being afraid to ask
1129
01:19:12.359 --> 01:19:17.680
for help, because that's important right
Also too, I think I identify with
1130
01:19:17.760 --> 01:19:24.319
this, I've shared it with you. Self sabotage, fear of success,
1131
01:19:24.840 --> 01:19:28.399
like I don't know, talk to
us about what maybe your clients go through,
1132
01:19:28.520 --> 01:19:32.560
or like what you've observed. Yeah
no, And I think I think
1133
01:19:32.600 --> 01:19:39.760
perfectionism is also a form of self
sabotage, right where we if I do
1134
01:19:39.840 --> 01:19:45.239
my very best and things don't work
out, then I'm like, fuck,
1135
01:19:45.720 --> 01:19:49.359
I'm there must be like this isn't
good enough. But if I wait until
1136
01:19:49.359 --> 01:19:54.039
the last minute, or I procrastinate, or I take a shortcut, then
1137
01:19:54.079 --> 01:19:56.399
if things don't go well, I
haven't out to be like, oh,
1138
01:19:56.439 --> 01:20:00.319
it's not because the song wasn't good, It's because I just didn't have time
1139
01:20:00.359 --> 01:20:05.159
to promote it, right, Like
you give yourself a scapegoat, And I
1140
01:20:05.159 --> 01:20:09.439
think that's one of the ways that
people self sabotage all the time, or
1141
01:20:09.600 --> 01:20:13.319
they you know, a million things. And this is the part where this
1142
01:20:13.359 --> 01:20:16.560
happens a lot. And like with
my clients that I work with, oftentimes
1143
01:20:16.560 --> 01:20:21.520
people know what they're supposed to do. It's these like psychosocial barriers that keep
1144
01:20:21.560 --> 01:20:25.520
them from doing it. And so
a lot of our work. I have
1145
01:20:25.560 --> 01:20:29.359
a client who calls me her business
therapist, which I'm not a therapist,
1146
01:20:29.439 --> 01:20:34.359
but like we can't separate our personal
stuff from our professional or political right,
1147
01:20:34.439 --> 01:20:40.880
like the three exists together, and
so addressing that is just as important to
1148
01:20:40.920 --> 01:20:45.079
your business success as is like having
a marketing plan or a business plan or
1149
01:20:45.079 --> 01:20:47.880
all that other stuff. You can't
separate them. What are some things like
1150
01:20:48.000 --> 01:20:54.760
general suggestions you can like get to
someone who you've observed maybe is like oh
1151
01:20:54.840 --> 01:21:01.039
says mean self sabotaging or just or
professionists would be I think just starting don't
1152
01:21:01.119 --> 01:21:05.239
judge yourself for it, but starting
to reflect on why, Like what is
1153
01:21:05.279 --> 01:21:11.159
this protecting you from? How is
this helping you? Kind of catching the
1154
01:21:11.199 --> 01:21:15.520
ways that you're tricking yourself because sometimes
we're so used to doing it we don't
1155
01:21:15.520 --> 01:21:17.760
even become so like that awareness,
I think is the first step. I
1156
01:21:17.800 --> 01:21:20.880
think everyone should see a therapist,
Like even if you don't think you need
1157
01:21:20.920 --> 01:21:27.399
one, it's good to just check
in. And then I think focusing,
1158
01:21:28.199 --> 01:21:32.039
so like I recommend a shine page
to everyone, Like we're so focused on
1159
01:21:32.079 --> 01:21:34.840
the things that don't go well,
but make sure you have a place where
1160
01:21:34.880 --> 01:21:38.960
you're celebrating. I call it my
shine page, right, like a page
1161
01:21:38.960 --> 01:21:44.560
in my journal where all the things
I fucking succeeded, Like this podcast interview
1162
01:21:44.560 --> 01:21:46.119
today is going to go in my
journal. Is something great that I did?
1163
01:21:46.159 --> 01:21:49.880
And next time I doubt myself or
I feel insecure, I go to
1164
01:21:49.960 --> 01:21:55.720
my shine page and I just gas
myself up. Because our brains will play
1165
01:21:55.720 --> 01:21:59.479
tricks on us to make us forget
or make us doubt ourselves. So having
1166
01:21:59.520 --> 01:22:02.359
something to handible in visible, physical
that you can see that says no.
1167
01:22:02.439 --> 01:22:05.920
But look, here's a whole list
of dope things that you've done and accomplished.
1168
01:22:06.439 --> 01:22:12.199
Then fact checks the false thoughts that
your brain is having. Yeah,
1169
01:22:12.319 --> 01:22:15.199
I noticed, I like tricking myself. Yeah, I really, I think
1170
01:22:15.199 --> 01:22:17.880
I do, because like I have
these dialogues in my head like if I
1171
01:22:17.920 --> 01:22:20.800
do X, Y and Z,
I don't know, it's like it's it's
1172
01:22:20.840 --> 01:22:24.359
I don't know. I think I
know I do it, but I just
1173
01:22:24.439 --> 01:22:27.680
let it happen. Oh you know, that's yeah. So I'm trying to
1174
01:22:27.880 --> 01:22:31.159
be more mindful of that, of
that narrative in my head or just certain
1175
01:22:31.159 --> 01:22:34.000
triggers though, like, oh,
you know, but it's interesting. I
1176
01:22:34.039 --> 01:22:36.800
like the shine page. You suggested
it to me last time. I'm started
1177
01:22:36.920 --> 01:22:41.199
doing it. Are you doing it? I did it a couple of days
1178
01:22:41.199 --> 01:22:45.279
ago. Cool. Yeah, And
I think it's really good because we just
1179
01:22:45.319 --> 01:22:48.439
tend to really just think about the
bad stuff, you know, And I
1180
01:22:48.479 --> 01:22:53.720
think it's I don't know, it's
cool to a degree, but it's not
1181
01:22:53.800 --> 01:22:59.199
balanced, right, you know.
So self care for artists it's a very
1182
01:22:59.399 --> 01:23:04.439
broad term, but do you have
any suggestions for like creatives or entrepreneurs,
1183
01:23:04.720 --> 01:23:06.920
you know, being always told to
like, oh, you got to grind,
1184
01:23:06.960 --> 01:23:12.159
you gotta keep working, and you
get burnt out eventually. I think
1185
01:23:12.199 --> 01:23:17.000
the most important thing is that you
should take a break before you ever need
1186
01:23:17.039 --> 01:23:21.359
a break. A lot of us
wait till we're like burnt out and then
1187
01:23:21.399 --> 01:23:27.119
we stop. And that's because of
what you write grind culture hustlement, Like
1188
01:23:27.199 --> 01:23:31.560
y'all, that shit is so fucking
toxic, Like no one succeeds that way,
1189
01:23:31.920 --> 01:23:35.680
and it's actually not the way success
happened, Like it's false mythology,
1190
01:23:35.720 --> 01:23:40.840
but it gets us to work and
work and produce, and it's fucking exhausting.
1191
01:23:40.960 --> 01:23:45.039
So like, give yourself time to
take a break before you ever need
1192
01:23:45.079 --> 01:23:49.800
a break. Like make that just
as important to you as like working out
1193
01:23:50.000 --> 01:23:57.239
or recording or mixing or posting on
social media or whatever it is. Yeah,
1194
01:23:57.239 --> 01:24:00.039
I think that's really important. And
then to remember that taking a break
1195
01:24:00.079 --> 01:24:02.840
is actually good for your business.
Like I know that there's a fear that
1196
01:24:02.880 --> 01:24:08.560
if if I take a day off, like my creative work is going to
1197
01:24:08.640 --> 01:24:14.319
stop, but like even bodybuilders need
a rest day, right, and so
1198
01:24:14.800 --> 01:24:19.439
giving realizing that taking a break is
actually good for you. I think those
1199
01:24:19.600 --> 01:24:23.520
are probably the two biggest things I
would tell folks, right, I think
1200
01:24:23.560 --> 01:24:27.079
for I think too, it's kind
of weird how I'm not sure if it's
1201
01:24:27.079 --> 01:24:30.760
true, but I feel like Instagram, like again, we're going by social
1202
01:24:30.800 --> 01:24:34.279
media use a lot of us.
It's what you use to like talk to
1203
01:24:34.279 --> 01:24:39.479
other people or engage. I think
they like lower your visibility if you don't
1204
01:24:39.479 --> 01:24:42.199
post a lot, so you're kind
of forced to maybe post often. I
1205
01:24:42.199 --> 01:24:45.319
don't know if that's true or not. That's a I mean, I don't
1206
01:24:45.319 --> 01:24:50.000
know because I've stopped kind of tracking
the algorithm. But isn't that crazy that
1207
01:24:50.159 --> 01:24:57.880
like a tech app is controlling our
behavior? Rather than us being like what
1208
01:24:57.920 --> 01:25:00.600
do I need? What do I
want? What feel good to me?
1209
01:25:01.000 --> 01:25:06.720
A robotic algorithm is telling us what
we should do. Yeah, it's it's
1210
01:25:06.760 --> 01:25:12.479
a little black mirror. Yeah,
I mean, I think, Yeah,
1211
01:25:12.479 --> 01:25:15.279
I think I think for us,
like, oh, if you want these
1212
01:25:15.880 --> 01:25:19.960
like engagements, views, we have
to consistently post. Yeah, I mean
1213
01:25:20.000 --> 01:25:28.239
it's also sorry, it's also you
as a creative, as a small business,
1214
01:25:28.279 --> 01:25:32.840
as an entrepreneur. You like Instagram. I don't want to say should
1215
01:25:32.880 --> 01:25:38.760
not, but does not have to
be where you're growing your business. There's
1216
01:25:38.840 --> 01:25:43.119
so many other ways, and so
thinking about like this goes back to really
1217
01:25:43.199 --> 01:25:45.960
understanding like who's your niche, what
do they want? Where are they and
1218
01:25:46.000 --> 01:25:49.960
then you can get creative about ways
to connect and grow so that you don't
1219
01:25:50.039 --> 01:25:56.359
have to fall because Instagram is not
an effective tool for like it's not a
1220
01:25:56.520 --> 01:25:59.600
Their goal is not to get you
in front of new customers. Their goal
1221
01:25:59.680 --> 01:26:01.960
is to get you to as we
talked about, buy ads and keep coming
1222
01:26:02.000 --> 01:26:09.680
back to the app. And so
that's like a big thinking broadly about when
1223
01:26:09.720 --> 01:26:14.159
you're developing your business plan or your
creative strategy, to make sure that your
1224
01:26:14.239 --> 01:26:21.319
self care is embedded in that plan. Right, So we've talked about just
1225
01:26:21.319 --> 01:26:26.199
amounts of health and like just anxiety
in general. Do you have any suggestions
1226
01:26:26.279 --> 01:26:31.119
or exercises for when anxiety general anxiety
does strike. I think I have a
1227
01:26:31.159 --> 01:26:38.159
lot, all from personal experience.
So first and foremost, like, there's
1228
01:26:38.199 --> 01:26:43.119
no shame in taking medication, there's
no shame in talking to a mental health
1229
01:26:43.159 --> 01:26:47.039
expert. And my dms are always
open if folks need help finding a therapist
1230
01:26:47.199 --> 01:26:53.520
or like accessing things, I'll help
you find someone because I think we're also
1231
01:26:53.640 --> 01:26:55.880
used to just being anxious and we're
like, oh, I'll just deal with
1232
01:26:55.920 --> 01:27:00.960
it myself. But like that's a
real brain thing that sometimes you can't like
1233
01:27:00.039 --> 01:27:05.840
outthink your brain right, and so
yeah, like no shame if you need
1234
01:27:05.880 --> 01:27:13.039
to get medicated or you're taking medication. Like we're killing that stigma in a
1235
01:27:13.159 --> 01:27:16.079
practical way. I think that thing
for me that's been most helpful when my
1236
01:27:16.119 --> 01:27:23.199
anxiety comes up is to one recognize
it as anxiety and then ask myself what
1237
01:27:23.239 --> 01:27:27.199
am I really upset about? And
is this now or is this old?
1238
01:27:27.239 --> 01:27:30.159
Like sometimes I'm like, oh,
this is from the time I was three
1239
01:27:30.239 --> 01:27:34.880
years old and we immigrated and I
had and then now like as a full
1240
01:27:34.880 --> 01:27:39.199
grown adult, that trauma is coming
back in the form of anxiety. So
1241
01:27:40.720 --> 01:27:45.359
stopping kind of like allowing myself to
feel and explore it and then deciding,
1242
01:27:45.399 --> 01:27:48.600
Okay, I have time to deal
with this now or I'll come back to
1243
01:27:48.680 --> 01:27:53.840
it later. I think for a
long time I had been taught to like
1244
01:27:54.920 --> 01:27:57.680
push it away and ignore it,
and the more I ignored my anxiety,
1245
01:27:57.680 --> 01:28:00.600
the worse it got. And so
now learning to like stop and kind of
1246
01:28:00.680 --> 01:28:04.640
lean into the feelings for me has
been really helpful. But I know it's
1247
01:28:04.680 --> 01:28:09.119
it's different every it's a general thing. Yeah, I think addressing it it's
1248
01:28:09.119 --> 01:28:15.680
good. Yeah, I think for
me, I would get anxiety before going
1249
01:28:15.720 --> 01:28:18.880
to work at my new job,
and I questioned myself, like, how
1250
01:28:18.920 --> 01:28:21.960
come you get this anxiety? And
I realized, Oh, because my previous
1251
01:28:23.039 --> 01:28:27.920
job I didn't like it. I
didn't like it. I don't think the
1252
01:28:27.960 --> 01:28:30.680
managers and I got along. I
just was not my kind of work.
1253
01:28:30.840 --> 01:28:35.119
So I noticed maybe I associated that
to my new job, which I eventually
1254
01:28:35.279 --> 01:28:41.039
got got rid of. It's pretty
good stuff like that, Yeah, exactly,
1255
01:28:42.159 --> 01:28:45.960
and just I don't know, helps
a lot. It's a crazy thing,
1256
01:28:45.479 --> 01:28:49.399
it's a wild thing. Let me
not say crazy. But not everything
1257
01:28:49.439 --> 01:28:54.199
we think is actually true, and
not everything we feel is actually real,
1258
01:28:54.760 --> 01:29:00.760
and so like just learning to question
and explore it can be really helpful.
1259
01:29:00.960 --> 01:29:04.479
Yeah, it took me a while
or I didn't realize this maybe until I
1260
01:29:04.520 --> 01:29:08.479
read it that, like, maybe
all our thoughts aren't real. I mean
1261
01:29:08.479 --> 01:29:10.920
that they can be. I mean
it's no way, but a lot of
1262
01:29:10.920 --> 01:29:15.720
times we have a hard time distinguishing
it, or we just ruminate or just
1263
01:29:15.760 --> 01:29:19.199
focus on this one like a few
negative thoughts and then it can really affect
1264
01:29:19.199 --> 01:29:24.560
like our mindset and everything. So
it's good to be mindful of that stuff
1265
01:29:24.600 --> 01:29:29.800
and it goes a long way.
I think that's about That's about it.
1266
01:29:29.840 --> 01:29:32.239
Pretty much cool, went through everything. Thank you so much for this conversation.
1267
01:29:32.319 --> 01:29:36.039
This is so fun, which I
really appreciate it. Again, I'm
1268
01:29:36.119 --> 01:29:40.720
so glad we have to do this
because before over the phone, this is
1269
01:29:40.920 --> 01:29:44.319
you know, it was during the
pandemic. This was the first time I
1270
01:29:44.319 --> 01:29:48.359
started reaching out to people to do
podcasts outside of just like being in the
1271
01:29:48.359 --> 01:29:51.520
same room. Before I was just
all of them were in the same room.
1272
01:29:51.600 --> 01:29:56.680
So I was still figuring out the
technology thing and it was just really
1273
01:29:56.720 --> 01:30:00.399
tough sometimes and I'm glad we got
to rectify it and just do this here
1274
01:30:00.600 --> 01:30:03.720
me too. Yeah, thank you
for having me awesome. Where can we
1275
01:30:03.840 --> 01:30:09.840
find you on social media and your
websites and all that stuff, Norah Raheemian
1276
01:30:09.920 --> 01:30:15.920
on everything N O R A R
A H I M I A N that's
1277
01:30:15.920 --> 01:30:17.560
my link tree, that's my Twitter, that's my Instagram, that's my cash
1278
01:30:17.600 --> 01:30:21.880
app, that's my Venmo, that's
all the things, and yeah, my
1279
01:30:21.960 --> 01:30:27.319
dams are always open reach out for
consult or, some mental health resources or
1280
01:30:27.319 --> 01:30:29.840
anything else y'all need. Oh,
by the way, thank you so much
1281
01:30:30.000 --> 01:30:35.840
because in our previous session, I
realized, like my ability to produce work
1282
01:30:35.880 --> 01:30:41.039
as a podcaster or like making music
does not equivally who I am, and
1283
01:30:41.119 --> 01:30:44.159
that like it, I'm more than
that. Hell yeah, you know because
1284
01:30:44.159 --> 01:30:46.199
for the longest time, I feel
like that was my identity. I'm a
1285
01:30:46.279 --> 01:30:51.159
rapper. I'm gonna do this,
and when I'm not producing or like getting
1286
01:30:51.199 --> 01:30:58.119
the desired expectations, I feel bad
about myself. So I'm feeling less bad.
1287
01:30:58.359 --> 01:31:00.359
So thank you so much. That's
amazing. Appreciate it. Okay,
1288
01:31:00.439 --> 01:31:02.279
that's about it. Thank you so
much. Ye
