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Welcome to the Table Talk Podcast.
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My name is Dre Clark, and I'm the discipleship pastor here at the table.
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And I am joined today by Dr.
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Bill Stewart, our lead pastor.
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And we are so glad that you've joined us as we sit down and just take some time to talk about what we're learning together as a church.
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Bill, great message this Sunday.
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We're in our series to the ends of the earth, and you're just continuing along the story and really telling three stories kind of within the story of Acts.
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And so go ahead and just uh give us the highlights from this week.
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You know, kind of bring us back and point out um some of the things that you want us to remember uh from this Sunday.
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Yeah, so the passage that we looked at was uh probably if people are familiar with it would know it's the story of Paul and Silas in jail, in the Philippian jail.
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Um but what we what I did with the message was talked about three stories of three people that we see in that that text of scripture.
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And so the first story is an unfinished story, that's the story of the slave girl.
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Uh the second story is the story of suffering, which is is Paul's story, thinking through the events of him being thrown into jail and the unfair trial and treatment and all that kind of stuff.
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And then the last story is the story of the jailer, which is a story of salvation, you know, where you know he sees that Paul and the uh prisoners hadn't left.
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And so he said, What must I do to be saved?
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And Paul said, believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.
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So the story of salvation.
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Yeah, famous verse for sure.
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That he has a lot of discussion around it, too.
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Yeah, and so I love how you kind of brought us through.
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Um, you know, I think you're right.
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We often take this story and we we pull out the interesting one and we kind of skip over the ones like, oh, that was an interesting point.
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But really kind of seeing, like, hey, no, these events, really three life-changing kind of events and pulling out some principles was really good.
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Uh, I think too, um, whenever I think of this passage as well, it's, you know, it's why, why is uh, you know, Luke telling the story this way?
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And I find it interesting because the story that's going on really is the same story that we saw back in his first part of the letter.
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This is stuff that Jesus was doing.
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You know, Jesus was casting out the demons.
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He was about healing, he was about bringing this message of salvation.
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He's the Messiah.
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And then you see in Acts, Peter begins to pick it up, and now we see Paul um continuing along this story and reminding us um this is what the big story's been about.
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Like God is is coming into your lives and he is noticing um the unnoticed.
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He wants to finish your story with it, he wants to bring you from your past to somewhere.
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He wants to come into your suffering, and really his aim is salvation.
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So I love um, you know, how you emphasize just a story that we quickly go over.
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So um any more things from this week as far as you know, stuck out to you?
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Well, we want to get to the question, what's behind the scene?
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But if if you were to kind of say, um, you know, here's kind of the main point out of these three stories, was there one that kind of resonated more with you as you were uh preaching uh this Sunday?
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Well, I mean, the first one's really interesting, but I'm gonna save that for the next question as far as like what's going on behind the scenes.
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Yeah.
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But I think the story of suffering was really interesting to think about, to think through.
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And I explained it in the message.
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Like, I I don't know if everybody's this way, but certainly I have been with that part, you know, Paul and Silas in jail and singing.
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It's like you just get this picture that they're sitting around a campfire, you know, late at night.
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Yeah.
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But that's not what it was.
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And then to think about the place of singing in suffering and songs in suffering.
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Um, it's just really, really kind of fascinating to think about that on multiple levels, you know, certainly from the spiritual level and what it does for us, but then even um, which I didn't talk about, but like the psychology of singing and songs in the midst of you know, grief or sadness or depression and all that kind of stuff.
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So to me, like that was the one see a logical thing that happens.
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If I had like two hours, like I would dive in and just talk about music and suffering and the the connection between those two things that shows up there.
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So yeah, no, um uh I remember I read a book about the Mississippi Delta and it was talking about uh it's called Getting the Blues.
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It was this idea of like how um in suffering song comes into that and can really restore us.
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I mean, I guess it's a very physiological reaction itself.
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Yeah, that's what I mean.
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I didn't I didn't talk about this at all, but like another illustration of this time-tested method of dealing with suffering, you think about like slavery and slave singing and stuff like that.
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I mean, there's like a it's you see this all over the place.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, yeah.
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I find that's really fascinating too, because what you said, it's not this kumbaya moment.
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Um, this is uh they were beaten, you know, and and most of the time, if you had someone that was like in a street fight of that level, like they're going to the hospital.
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They might still go to jail, but they're gonna go to the hospital and then jail.
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That's not the world they're in.
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You know, they're uh sitting in there with all of their trauma, you know, physical trauma in there um, you know, singing as a way to respond.
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So yeah, really interesting story.
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Um, and then kind of yeah, bookmarked by these two other stories.
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So let's let's get to it.
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So you the kind of flow for this week, really bringing out the the narrative, bringing about these three different kinds of instances and tying them together and pointing out some application.
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But um, what's behind the scene?
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How'd you come to this?
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Give us a little bit of what you were thinking as you were preparing for this week.
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Yeah, so uh, you know, from my perspective in starting the preparation process, doing my study and stuff like that.
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I mean, I, you know, I thought, okay, here's this like very familiar story, a relatively familiar story, story I've heard, you know, since the time that I was a little kid.
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So it's like, well, I want to I want to make sure that I don't just sort of regurgitate things that I think I know if I don't really know them.
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And so I was just really going through the process of of observing the passage, and I really got stuck on the story of the girl.
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Yeah.
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Um, because we know so very little.
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And like that's a I mean, I talked about it in the message a little bit.
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Like, I want to ask all kinds of questions about like how she got to where she was, then what happened afterwards.
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Like, there's no resolution to that story.
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And so that's where like I just started thinking about her story.
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It's like, man, like why don't we know more about her story?
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Like, what's her story?
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And then I thought, well, you know what?
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We also have the story of two other people, it was really three other people, but I kind of focused on Paul as opposed to Paul and Silas, but you could lump them together as a unit, really.
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Um, and so like there's a story, and then the story of the the Philippian jailer, too.
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And so I was like, okay, that's how we're gonna put the pieces of the message together, and then just like I want to encourage people to think about the the circumstances of their life right now and how you know what their story might be described as.
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And so, can I develop these stories in such a way that gets people to think about the circumstances of their life and you know, maybe through that to learn to trust God in the midst of whatever the circumstances are and however they would describe their story.
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So that's really how the message came about.
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It really started with that first girl that we don't know her story, and it's like, why don't we know your story?
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Yeah, well, and and really you think about like go into like the reality of the historicity of this, like her life change.
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Like there's a whole whole like meaning that that we can skip over and kind of rush through, and we miss kind of the point too.
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I mean, the the point is not just here's what happened.
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Um, it's that what is happening is what God has always been about, um, which is life change, uh, which is, you know, in this first story, like he he wants to see stories that that that um that are in the middle of the, you know, the the power of the world, as it be, you know, uh that God wants to come in and he he this is what God is up to.
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Um and God was up to this, you know, all the way back in the Old Testament.
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Jesus carries on the work of the Father, and like we said earlier, then Peter's picking it up, the missions, and this is what we're to be about.
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So I think whenever we skip past these stories, we kind of forget like this is the calling of Christianity as we're to come through and uh we're to, you know, see the kingdom break down the powers of this world.
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We're gonna see the kingdom come into the pain and brokenness.
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We're gonna see the kingdom of God um bring us purpose uh towards salvation, towards restoration.
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Yeah.
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And this is uh kind of reminded me this this week of here's the heart behind all this.
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So um, yeah, a story that I would say is, oh, that's a bookmarking, you know, that's that's just how the story's being told.
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Um, it really is a good reminder of this is what our faith is about.
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You know, we're seeing like real life change.
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So I love that you've you brought that to the surface and uh and kind of brought through.
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And and you you did.
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There's there's a lot of a lot of stuff around, you know, Paul and Silas, um, and then even the jailer too.
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And so I I want to know how did you decide as you're kind of there's a lot you could have talked about.
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So how did you decide um kind of behind the scenes of of what to kind of do a nod to and what to really spend time on?
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Because there's a lot of things, like you said earlier, that you could have really spent a lot more time on.
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And so give us a little kind of behind the scenes as you're kind of balancing these stories and and bringing out why did you want to bring out the stuff you brought out?
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Yeah, that's a good question.
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I think you know, doing it speaking as often as I do, and uh having done it as long as I do, I don't often find myself in a situation where like I know I can't say all this stuff.
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But this was one where I was like, I know I can't say all this stuff.
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Yeah.
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Because there is so much here that that you could talk about.
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Um I in it, like I I think really what helped me to focus on the things that I I wanted to talk about is really thinking through the life circumstance of people in our congregation.
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And I think you know, so for the people that were here in the service, I mean they might have noticed that I got a little bit emotional, which happens every once in a while.
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But a a a big reason for that is that I can see the faces of people in the audience that you know, others in the audience can't see each other because they're looking at me.
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And like sometimes like when you I think when you touch on subjects like we did in this message, like it really touches people.
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And you know, like there are some people who are dealing with life circumstances that they don't understand and they have no idea where God is taking them or the meaning of those things.
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And so it's like, man, I know that this can resonate with these people, and I know there are people in our church that are are suffering.
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And and I think as you I don't know, like in the service, like I feel like I I don't know, I can sense their their pain sometimes, you know, and that's what's really hard as a a speaker.
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And then, but I hope that we all walked away with um encouragement and hope in the midst of the frustrations that we're we're going through.
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Yeah.
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No, I mean, I think these themes of trust and rejoice.
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I mean, that that that applies to so many different stages and circumstances, you know, where we're all constantly being challenged to do I need to trust God with this.
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And I think there's there's real stuff, you know.
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People, our faith comes into real messy lives.
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Um, and then yeah, that that reminder of too if we can rejoice because we are trusting God and what God has done and will do in that reminder.
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And I yeah, I think that that tie is is into all of these stories.
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I mean, this is this is real life, people that are experiencing Jesus back in the Old Testament or back in the New Testament, back in the early days of the church, they're experiencing Jesus and in a way too, like we're in the same story.
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You know, we're we're we're in the same, but we all have these different moments.
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And so um, I thought that that really came forward well as a very just effective message and and a good reminder for everybody that's either in suffering or going into suffering.
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You know, what's the old saying?
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You're either coming from suffering, you're in it, or you're about to go into it.
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Um, and uh, but God's not finished, He's He's up to something.
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And just that reminder really came out this week.
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Yeah.
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Well, I want to end with kind of along these lines.
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So I want to ask a real practical question uh from the message today.
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And it this is, you know, what's often called a theodicy, you know, kind of a why question, you know, and I know there's not a lot of answers to this, but but as you pastor and as you, you know, even looking at a message like this and you're preparing for it, um, you know, you know the burden of a pastor's, you know the sufferings and things people are going through, you know where the stories seem unfinished, um, you know the journey that, you know, people that are following Christ often takes us to.
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So I'm not really looking for just the the theological answer necessarily, but but really trying to ask, how does God um and why is God using suffering and how does he use it to bring about um what he's doing in us?
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So so kind of why do we see um stories of suffering?
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Why do we see um these moments of kind of unfinished stories?
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Why isn't God just saying, okay, you're saved, you've you've trusted in me, and let's zap you up to heaven.
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Um, why does God let us sit with these stories, sit with the unfinished?
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Oh man, like I feel like we could probably talk for a long time about that, right?
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Like developing a theology of suffering.
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But you know, God has chosen to work in the world in a certain way, and we may wish that God would do something different, but we live in a fallen world.
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And and and so it's in everything there is fallenness, right?
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And so there are all kinds of things that we experience that it's not because we did something wrong, um, you know, we didn't cause it, but we experience it because the world is a fallen place, and so it could be accidents, um, it could be sicknesses and stuff like that.
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And yes, we desperately want God to stop those things, keep the accident from happening, heal the person who is sick.
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And he does sometimes, but he doesn't always.
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And I think in the midst of all of the experiences that we go through, it is an opportunity to develop our faith and trust in God.
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Recognizing that well, there can be an end to a specific suffering that we experience here on this earth, but our ultimate the ultimate end of our experience of suffering is not going to come until eternity.
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And that's the hope that we have in Jesus is that one day everything is going to be made new and suffering will end once and for all.
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Um, and until that day, I think that's where we just keep our eyes on Jesus.
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You know, um Hebrews 12.
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Let's keep our eyes fixed on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross.
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Let's consider him who endured such suffering so that we would not really realize our just keep following.
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Even in the in the in the midst of the questions, in the midst of the sometimes we may go through doubts and things like that, in the midst of incredibly difficult circumstances, like just keep following.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I I think, you know, even kind of going back to the text, you know, we see, you know, Paul and Paul Paul is going to use this by the way.
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This story is going to become monumental in his life.
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I mean, you look at all the letters he's going to write, he's going to refer back to his moments in prison, his moments of being beaten.
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And and God does have a plan for it.
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But I really think it's interesting too that right at the end of the story, you do have the jailer who comes to faith.
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And we often argue in this text about um, what does belief mean here?
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You know, and you kind of covered that a little bit.
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And I think that's where a lot of the literature goes to.
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But I think that because it's because the story right before the belief is kind of uh set up with this idea of suffering, I think the question may be better understood is um why do we believe in him?
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Is and really the understanding that it's not just that that we're looking to believe in someone, even the demons believe in shudder, right?
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But it's that the belief in Jesus is a, it's a why question.
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And the reason why is because of what he is doing and what he has done and what we are, you know, why we trust him.
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Um we trust because he is Lord, he's the one in control.
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And so I think that part of suffering should bring us to a place.
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So I think part of the reason maybe God allows it, and what I'm hearing you say is that because God is going to um use it to bring us to a place of dependency, use us to bring us to a place of of deeper faith.
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Um maybe not understanding, uh, but trust.
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Yeah, and I I've talked about this before in a previous message.
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Um the way that we handle suffering can be used by God as that maybe that pathway that leads somebody else to faith in Christ.
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Like it's the way that we handle suffering as believers that should be different, like tangibly different.
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You know, uh was it first Peter that says, you know, you should be ready to give a reason for the hope that you have, like so it kind of underscores the idea that people are gonna ask you about it.
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And maybe one of the ways in which, or one of the reasons that people would ask about the hope that we have is because it's evident in our sufferings.
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So then you like go back and think about it like in this text.
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So Paul singing doesn't leave.
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So he there's a way that he's handling his suffering that causes the jailer to be like, hey, this is different.
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I want that.
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Yeah, what do I have to do to be saved?
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And that's that was the that was what he saw was Paul's handling of it.
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Yeah, how he handled how he dealt with the suffering that he was going through.
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Because everybody suffers, you know, Christians and non-Christians.
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Like this is because we're in a fallen world, like you said earlier, like suffering is a part of life.
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Every, every faith, every worldview has to deal with the reality that it's there.
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But to your point, it's not so much of, you know, is it the reality, but are what are we gonna do with the reality?
00:17:54.079 --> 00:17:57.039
And that's where Jesus says, I've done something and I am doing something.
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So it's are we gonna trust our means or the world's means to stop suffering, or are we gonna trust the one who can ultimately fix it?
00:18:03.359 --> 00:18:06.400
And so we as Christians have a different perspective of it.
00:18:06.559 --> 00:18:08.880
Um, we have a uh hope in in it.
00:18:08.960 --> 00:18:12.559
And so um I think that's that's where our faith is demonstrated.
00:18:12.640 --> 00:18:18.160
Um and so yeah, I don't think it's just that, oh, Paul and Silas are gonna suffer more, but I mean everyone's going through this.
00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:22.640
This is the reality of a broken world, but how we do it is what God is interested in.
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And that's what he's gonna use.
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And so once again, he clearly Paul sees this as a formative moment.
00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:26.880
Yeah.
00:18:27.039 --> 00:18:37.359
Um, I was telling someone earlier that, you know, once you get this passage, the passage is right before they have this Jerusalem council, and then they kind of have this little, this little fight and this conflict, and they develop their plan.
00:18:37.680 --> 00:18:51.119
And this whole narrative is based on verse six, where God's like, okay, you you made your plan and you and you got the basics down, you understand the assignment, but you just thought that you were gonna do this, and you thought you were gonna go, and the Holy Spirit stops him and sends them in a whole different way.
00:18:51.279 --> 00:18:53.119
And I think that that's also what God's doing.
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God is is doing his, he's got a plan for us, he knows um how to lead us, he knows what's best for us.
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And sometimes that isn't the most pleasant ways, but he knows what is gonna be used and his sovereignty is there.
00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:14.720
And so it's it really suffering is um, I can see Paul and Silas saying, well, if we the Holy Spirit have just sent us where we wanted to go, yeah, you know, um because really quickly things get bad for them.
00:19:15.200 --> 00:19:33.279
Um but then at the end of that, once again, it's God brings about his plan and salvation and and uh in and really that one verse changes the trajectory of history, the fact that they're going through this, they don't see it at the time, but what they're going through, God is gonna use to really from this moment forward change history and how Christianity is spreading.
00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:37.680
Um and so yeah, so we may not understand suffering, but we can trust God in it.
00:19:37.839 --> 00:19:38.000
Yeah.
00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:38.720
Wonderful.
00:19:38.880 --> 00:19:40.400
Well, anything else from this sermon?
00:19:40.480 --> 00:19:45.359
Um, you know, a lot of a lot of uh good pastoral moments, a lot of good um takeaways.
00:19:45.440 --> 00:19:51.759
I think there's a lot behind the scenes that we could have talked about, but anything else, kind of final words you want to say commenting on this past Sunday?
00:19:53.359 --> 00:20:01.599
You know, I I I do just uh maybe to comment on the passages that I referenced at the end of each point.
00:20:02.640 --> 00:20:07.039
Um, so two of them were from the book of Romans.
00:20:07.119 --> 00:20:14.240
So Paul's writing, you know, regardless of the circumstances of your life, know that nothing separates us from God's love.
00:20:14.319 --> 00:20:15.440
That's so important.
00:20:16.240 --> 00:20:24.880
Um but then the second one is knowing that the temporary suffering that we go through is nothing in comparison to the glory that will be revealed.
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.279
Yeah, so the the end is coming.
00:20:27.359 --> 00:20:32.160
I think I think that's a huge should be a huge comfort and encouragement to us.
00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:32.400
Yeah.
00:20:32.640 --> 00:20:33.359
Yeah, it gets better.
00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:34.240
God's got a plan.
00:20:34.319 --> 00:20:36.720
He's not just leaving us out there without a purpose in it.
00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:37.680
So wonderful.
00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:39.440
Great point, great reminders this week.
00:20:39.519 --> 00:20:45.039
Whether our story is unfinished, whether our story um is in the middle of some pain, um, God is bringing about salvation.
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He's up to something, and and and if we're in him, we can trust him in that.
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And uh better days are ahead.
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Just gotta wait for him and hope.
00:20:53.519 --> 00:20:54.400
Uh, great message.
00:20:54.559 --> 00:20:56.960
Thanks again for listening to the Table Talk podcast.
00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:59.440
Uh, we hope you join us next week as we have another episode.
00:20:59.519 --> 00:21:08.240
And if you're not already connected with the Table Community Church, uh we just want to take a moment, invite you to come check us out on Sunday at 9 or 10 30 here in North Fort Worth.
00:21:08.319 --> 00:21:09.359
Uh, thanks again for listening.
00:21:09.440 --> 00:21:10.319
We hope you have a great week.
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Thank you, Pastor Bill, for being here.
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:12.240
See ya.
00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:12.640
Thanks.
00:00:09.039 --> 00:00:10.880
Welcome to the Table Talk Podcast.
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My name is Dre Clark, and I'm the discipleship pastor here at the table.
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And I am joined today by Dr.
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Bill Stewart, our lead pastor.
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And we are so glad that you've joined us as we sit down and just take some time to talk about what we're learning together as a church.
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Bill, great message this Sunday.
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We're in our series to the ends of the earth, and you're just continuing along the story and really telling three stories kind of within the story of Acts.
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And so go ahead and just uh give us the highlights from this week.
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You know, kind of bring us back and point out um some of the things that you want us to remember uh from this Sunday.
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Yeah, so the passage that we looked at was uh probably if people are familiar with it would know it's the story of Paul and Silas in jail, in the Philippian jail.
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Um but what we what I did with the message was talked about three stories of three people that we see in that that text of scripture.
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And so the first story is an unfinished story, that's the story of the slave girl.
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Uh the second story is the story of suffering, which is is Paul's story, thinking through the events of him being thrown into jail and the unfair trial and treatment and all that kind of stuff.
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And then the last story is the story of the jailer, which is a story of salvation, you know, where you know he sees that Paul and the uh prisoners hadn't left.
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And so he said, What must I do to be saved?
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And Paul said, believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.
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So the story of salvation.
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Yeah, famous verse for sure.
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That he has a lot of discussion around it, too.
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Yeah, and so I love how you kind of brought us through.
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Um, you know, I think you're right.
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We often take this story and we we pull out the interesting one and we kind of skip over the ones like, oh, that was an interesting point.
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But really kind of seeing, like, hey, no, these events, really three life-changing kind of events and pulling out some principles was really good.
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Uh, I think too, um, whenever I think of this passage as well, it's, you know, it's why, why is uh, you know, Luke telling the story this way?
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And I find it interesting because the story that's going on really is the same story that we saw back in his first part of the letter.
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This is stuff that Jesus was doing.
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You know, Jesus was casting out the demons.
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He was about healing, he was about bringing this message of salvation.
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He's the Messiah.
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And then you see in Acts, Peter begins to pick it up, and now we see Paul um continuing along this story and reminding us um this is what the big story's been about.
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Like God is is coming into your lives and he is noticing um the unnoticed.
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He wants to finish your story with it, he wants to bring you from your past to somewhere.
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He wants to come into your suffering, and really his aim is salvation.
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So I love um, you know, how you emphasize just a story that we quickly go over.
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So um any more things from this week as far as you know, stuck out to you?
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Well, we want to get to the question, what's behind the scene?
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But if if you were to kind of say, um, you know, here's kind of the main point out of these three stories, was there one that kind of resonated more with you as you were uh preaching uh this Sunday?
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Well, I mean, the first one's really interesting, but I'm gonna save that for the next question as far as like what's going on behind the scenes.
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Yeah.
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But I think the story of suffering was really interesting to think about, to think through.
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And I explained it in the message.
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Like, I I don't know if everybody's this way, but certainly I have been with that part, you know, Paul and Silas in jail and singing.
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It's like you just get this picture that they're sitting around a campfire, you know, late at night.
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Yeah.
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But that's not what it was.
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And then to think about the place of singing in suffering and songs in suffering.
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Um, it's just really, really kind of fascinating to think about that on multiple levels, you know, certainly from the spiritual level and what it does for us, but then even um, which I didn't talk about, but like the psychology of singing and songs in the midst of you know, grief or sadness or depression and all that kind of stuff.
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So to me, like that was the one see a logical thing that happens.
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If I had like two hours, like I would dive in and just talk about music and suffering and the the connection between those two things that shows up there.
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So yeah, no, um uh I remember I read a book about the Mississippi Delta and it was talking about uh it's called Getting the Blues.
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It was this idea of like how um in suffering song comes into that and can really restore us.
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I mean, I guess it's a very physiological reaction itself.
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Yeah, that's what I mean.
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I didn't I didn't talk about this at all, but like another illustration of this time-tested method of dealing with suffering, you think about like slavery and slave singing and stuff like that.
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I mean, there's like a it's you see this all over the place.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, yeah.
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I find that's really fascinating too, because what you said, it's not this kumbaya moment.
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Um, this is uh they were beaten, you know, and and most of the time, if you had someone that was like in a street fight of that level, like they're going to the hospital.
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They might still go to jail, but they're gonna go to the hospital and then jail.
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That's not the world they're in.
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You know, they're uh sitting in there with all of their trauma, you know, physical trauma in there um, you know, singing as a way to respond.
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So yeah, really interesting story.
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Um, and then kind of yeah, bookmarked by these two other stories.
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So let's let's get to it.
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So you the kind of flow for this week, really bringing out the the narrative, bringing about these three different kinds of instances and tying them together and pointing out some application.
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But um, what's behind the scene?
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How'd you come to this?
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Give us a little bit of what you were thinking as you were preparing for this week.
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Yeah, so uh, you know, from my perspective in starting the preparation process, doing my study and stuff like that.
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I mean, I, you know, I thought, okay, here's this like very familiar story, a relatively familiar story, story I've heard, you know, since the time that I was a little kid.
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So it's like, well, I want to I want to make sure that I don't just sort of regurgitate things that I think I know if I don't really know them.
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And so I was just really going through the process of of observing the passage, and I really got stuck on the story of the girl.
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Yeah.
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Um, because we know so very little.
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And like that's a I mean, I talked about it in the message a little bit.
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Like, I want to ask all kinds of questions about like how she got to where she was, then what happened afterwards.
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Like, there's no resolution to that story.
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And so that's where like I just started thinking about her story.
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It's like, man, like why don't we know more about her story?
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Like, what's her story?
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And then I thought, well, you know what?
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We also have the story of two other people, it was really three other people, but I kind of focused on Paul as opposed to Paul and Silas, but you could lump them together as a unit, really.
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Um, and so like there's a story, and then the story of the the Philippian jailer, too.
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And so I was like, okay, that's how we're gonna put the pieces of the message together, and then just like I want to encourage people to think about the the circumstances of their life right now and how you know what their story might be described as.
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And so, can I develop these stories in such a way that gets people to think about the circumstances of their life and you know, maybe through that to learn to trust God in the midst of whatever the circumstances are and however they would describe their story.
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So that's really how the message came about.
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It really started with that first girl that we don't know her story, and it's like, why don't we know your story?
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Yeah, well, and and really you think about like go into like the reality of the historicity of this, like her life change.
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Like there's a whole whole like meaning that that we can skip over and kind of rush through, and we miss kind of the point too.
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I mean, the the point is not just here's what happened.
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Um, it's that what is happening is what God has always been about, um, which is life change, uh, which is, you know, in this first story, like he he wants to see stories that that that um that are in the middle of the, you know, the the power of the world, as it be, you know, uh that God wants to come in and he he this is what God is up to.
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Um and God was up to this, you know, all the way back in the Old Testament.
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Jesus carries on the work of the Father, and like we said earlier, then Peter's picking it up, the missions, and this is what we're to be about.
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So I think whenever we skip past these stories, we kind of forget like this is the calling of Christianity as we're to come through and uh we're to, you know, see the kingdom break down the powers of this world.
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We're gonna see the kingdom come into the pain and brokenness.
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We're gonna see the kingdom of God um bring us purpose uh towards salvation, towards restoration.
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Yeah.
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And this is uh kind of reminded me this this week of here's the heart behind all this.
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So um, yeah, a story that I would say is, oh, that's a bookmarking, you know, that's that's just how the story's being told.
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Um, it really is a good reminder of this is what our faith is about.
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You know, we're seeing like real life change.
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So I love that you've you brought that to the surface and uh and kind of brought through.
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And and you you did.
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There's there's a lot of a lot of stuff around, you know, Paul and Silas, um, and then even the jailer too.
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And so I I want to know how did you decide as you're kind of there's a lot you could have talked about.
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So how did you decide um kind of behind the scenes of of what to kind of do a nod to and what to really spend time on?
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Because there's a lot of things, like you said earlier, that you could have really spent a lot more time on.
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And so give us a little kind of behind the scenes as you're kind of balancing these stories and and bringing out why did you want to bring out the stuff you brought out?
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Yeah, that's a good question.
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I think you know, doing it speaking as often as I do, and uh having done it as long as I do, I don't often find myself in a situation where like I know I can't say all this stuff.
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But this was one where I was like, I know I can't say all this stuff.
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Yeah.
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Because there is so much here that that you could talk about.
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Um I in it, like I I think really what helped me to focus on the things that I I wanted to talk about is really thinking through the life circumstance of people in our congregation.
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And I think you know, so for the people that were here in the service, I mean they might have noticed that I got a little bit emotional, which happens every once in a while.
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But a a a big reason for that is that I can see the faces of people in the audience that you know, others in the audience can't see each other because they're looking at me.
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And like sometimes like when you I think when you touch on subjects like we did in this message, like it really touches people.
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And you know, like there are some people who are dealing with life circumstances that they don't understand and they have no idea where God is taking them or the meaning of those things.
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And so it's like, man, I know that this can resonate with these people, and I know there are people in our church that are are suffering.
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And and I think as you I don't know, like in the service, like I feel like I I don't know, I can sense their their pain sometimes, you know, and that's what's really hard as a a speaker.
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And then, but I hope that we all walked away with um encouragement and hope in the midst of the frustrations that we're we're going through.
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Yeah.
00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:52.879
No, I mean, I think these themes of trust and rejoice.
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I mean, that that that applies to so many different stages and circumstances, you know, where we're all constantly being challenged to do I need to trust God with this.
00:11:01.919 --> 00:11:03.840
And I think there's there's real stuff, you know.
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People, our faith comes into real messy lives.
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Um, and then yeah, that that reminder of too if we can rejoice because we are trusting God and what God has done and will do in that reminder.
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And I yeah, I think that that tie is is into all of these stories.
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I mean, this is this is real life, people that are experiencing Jesus back in the Old Testament or back in the New Testament, back in the early days of the church, they're experiencing Jesus and in a way too, like we're in the same story.
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You know, we're we're we're in the same, but we all have these different moments.
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And so um, I thought that that really came forward well as a very just effective message and and a good reminder for everybody that's either in suffering or going into suffering.
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You know, what's the old saying?
00:11:40.879 --> 00:11:43.840
You're either coming from suffering, you're in it, or you're about to go into it.
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Um, and uh, but God's not finished, He's He's up to something.
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And just that reminder really came out this week.
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Yeah.
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Well, I want to end with kind of along these lines.
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So I want to ask a real practical question uh from the message today.
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And it this is, you know, what's often called a theodicy, you know, kind of a why question, you know, and I know there's not a lot of answers to this, but but as you pastor and as you, you know, even looking at a message like this and you're preparing for it, um, you know, you know the burden of a pastor's, you know the sufferings and things people are going through, you know where the stories seem unfinished, um, you know the journey that, you know, people that are following Christ often takes us to.
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So I'm not really looking for just the the theological answer necessarily, but but really trying to ask, how does God um and why is God using suffering and how does he use it to bring about um what he's doing in us?
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So so kind of why do we see um stories of suffering?
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Why do we see um these moments of kind of unfinished stories?
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Why isn't God just saying, okay, you're saved, you've you've trusted in me, and let's zap you up to heaven.
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Um, why does God let us sit with these stories, sit with the unfinished?
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Oh man, like I feel like we could probably talk for a long time about that, right?
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Like developing a theology of suffering.
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But you know, God has chosen to work in the world in a certain way, and we may wish that God would do something different, but we live in a fallen world.
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And and and so it's in everything there is fallenness, right?
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And so there are all kinds of things that we experience that it's not because we did something wrong, um, you know, we didn't cause it, but we experience it because the world is a fallen place, and so it could be accidents, um, it could be sicknesses and stuff like that.
00:13:38.720 --> 00:13:46.080
And yes, we desperately want God to stop those things, keep the accident from happening, heal the person who is sick.
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And he does sometimes, but he doesn't always.
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And I think in the midst of all of the experiences that we go through, it is an opportunity to develop our faith and trust in God.
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Recognizing that well, there can be an end to a specific suffering that we experience here on this earth, but our ultimate the ultimate end of our experience of suffering is not going to come until eternity.
00:14:18.960 --> 00:14:26.639
And that's the hope that we have in Jesus is that one day everything is going to be made new and suffering will end once and for all.
00:14:27.120 --> 00:14:33.679
Um, and until that day, I think that's where we just keep our eyes on Jesus.
00:14:33.919 --> 00:14:36.639
You know, um Hebrews 12.
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Let's keep our eyes fixed on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross.
00:14:43.039 --> 00:14:50.080
Let's consider him who endured such suffering so that we would not really realize our just keep following.
00:14:50.480 --> 00:15:01.279
Even in the in the in the midst of the questions, in the midst of the sometimes we may go through doubts and things like that, in the midst of incredibly difficult circumstances, like just keep following.
00:15:01.519 --> 00:15:01.759
Yeah.
00:15:02.159 --> 00:15:02.399
Yeah.
00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:09.679
I I think, you know, even kind of going back to the text, you know, we see, you know, Paul and Paul Paul is going to use this by the way.
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This story is going to become monumental in his life.
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I mean, you look at all the letters he's going to write, he's going to refer back to his moments in prison, his moments of being beaten.
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And and God does have a plan for it.
00:15:19.519 --> 00:15:25.360
But I really think it's interesting too that right at the end of the story, you do have the jailer who comes to faith.
00:15:25.440 --> 00:15:29.600
And we often argue in this text about um, what does belief mean here?
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You know, and you kind of covered that a little bit.
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And I think that's where a lot of the literature goes to.
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But I think that because it's because the story right before the belief is kind of uh set up with this idea of suffering, I think the question may be better understood is um why do we believe in him?
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Is and really the understanding that it's not just that that we're looking to believe in someone, even the demons believe in shudder, right?
00:15:53.279 --> 00:15:56.720
But it's that the belief in Jesus is a, it's a why question.
00:15:56.879 --> 00:16:02.399
And the reason why is because of what he is doing and what he has done and what we are, you know, why we trust him.
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Um we trust because he is Lord, he's the one in control.
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And so I think that part of suffering should bring us to a place.
00:16:08.799 --> 00:16:20.080
So I think part of the reason maybe God allows it, and what I'm hearing you say is that because God is going to um use it to bring us to a place of dependency, use us to bring us to a place of of deeper faith.
00:16:20.240 --> 00:16:23.840
Um maybe not understanding, uh, but trust.
00:16:24.399 --> 00:16:27.759
Yeah, and I I've talked about this before in a previous message.
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Um the way that we handle suffering can be used by God as that maybe that pathway that leads somebody else to faith in Christ.
00:16:41.200 --> 00:16:47.440
Like it's the way that we handle suffering as believers that should be different, like tangibly different.
00:16:47.919 --> 00:16:57.840
You know, uh was it first Peter that says, you know, you should be ready to give a reason for the hope that you have, like so it kind of underscores the idea that people are gonna ask you about it.
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And maybe one of the ways in which, or one of the reasons that people would ask about the hope that we have is because it's evident in our sufferings.
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So then you like go back and think about it like in this text.
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So Paul singing doesn't leave.
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So he there's a way that he's handling his suffering that causes the jailer to be like, hey, this is different.
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I want that.
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Yeah, what do I have to do to be saved?
00:17:27.119 --> 00:17:31.519
And that's that was the that was what he saw was Paul's handling of it.
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Yeah, how he handled how he dealt with the suffering that he was going through.
00:17:35.519 --> 00:17:38.559
Because everybody suffers, you know, Christians and non-Christians.
00:17:38.640 --> 00:17:43.759
Like this is because we're in a fallen world, like you said earlier, like suffering is a part of life.
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Every, every faith, every worldview has to deal with the reality that it's there.
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But to your point, it's not so much of, you know, is it the reality, but are what are we gonna do with the reality?
00:17:54.079 --> 00:17:57.039
And that's where Jesus says, I've done something and I am doing something.
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So it's are we gonna trust our means or the world's means to stop suffering, or are we gonna trust the one who can ultimately fix it?
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And so we as Christians have a different perspective of it.
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Um, we have a uh hope in in it.
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And so um I think that's that's where our faith is demonstrated.
00:18:12.640 --> 00:18:18.160
Um and so yeah, I don't think it's just that, oh, Paul and Silas are gonna suffer more, but I mean everyone's going through this.
00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:22.640
This is the reality of a broken world, but how we do it is what God is interested in.
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And that's what he's gonna use.
00:18:23.680 --> 00:18:26.480
And so once again, he clearly Paul sees this as a formative moment.
00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:26.880
Yeah.
00:18:27.039 --> 00:18:37.359
Um, I was telling someone earlier that, you know, once you get this passage, the passage is right before they have this Jerusalem council, and then they kind of have this little, this little fight and this conflict, and they develop their plan.
00:18:37.680 --> 00:18:51.119
And this whole narrative is based on verse six, where God's like, okay, you you made your plan and you and you got the basics down, you understand the assignment, but you just thought that you were gonna do this, and you thought you were gonna go, and the Holy Spirit stops him and sends them in a whole different way.
00:18:51.279 --> 00:18:53.119
And I think that that's also what God's doing.
00:18:53.279 --> 00:18:59.119
God is is doing his, he's got a plan for us, he knows um how to lead us, he knows what's best for us.
00:18:59.200 --> 00:19:04.640
And sometimes that isn't the most pleasant ways, but he knows what is gonna be used and his sovereignty is there.
00:19:04.720 --> 00:19:14.720
And so it's it really suffering is um, I can see Paul and Silas saying, well, if we the Holy Spirit have just sent us where we wanted to go, yeah, you know, um because really quickly things get bad for them.
00:19:15.200 --> 00:19:33.279
Um but then at the end of that, once again, it's God brings about his plan and salvation and and uh in and really that one verse changes the trajectory of history, the fact that they're going through this, they don't see it at the time, but what they're going through, God is gonna use to really from this moment forward change history and how Christianity is spreading.
00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:37.680
Um and so yeah, so we may not understand suffering, but we can trust God in it.
00:19:37.839 --> 00:19:38.000
Yeah.
00:19:38.240 --> 00:19:38.720
Wonderful.
00:19:38.880 --> 00:19:40.400
Well, anything else from this sermon?
00:19:40.480 --> 00:19:45.359
Um, you know, a lot of a lot of uh good pastoral moments, a lot of good um takeaways.
00:19:45.440 --> 00:19:51.759
I think there's a lot behind the scenes that we could have talked about, but anything else, kind of final words you want to say commenting on this past Sunday?
00:19:53.359 --> 00:20:01.599
You know, I I I do just uh maybe to comment on the passages that I referenced at the end of each point.
00:20:02.640 --> 00:20:07.039
Um, so two of them were from the book of Romans.
00:20:07.119 --> 00:20:14.240
So Paul's writing, you know, regardless of the circumstances of your life, know that nothing separates us from God's love.
00:20:14.319 --> 00:20:15.440
That's so important.
00:20:16.240 --> 00:20:24.880
Um but then the second one is knowing that the temporary suffering that we go through is nothing in comparison to the glory that will be revealed.
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:27.279
Yeah, so the the end is coming.
00:20:27.359 --> 00:20:32.160
I think I think that's a huge should be a huge comfort and encouragement to us.
00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:32.400
Yeah.
00:20:32.640 --> 00:20:33.359
Yeah, it gets better.
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God's got a plan.
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He's not just leaving us out there without a purpose in it.
00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:37.680
So wonderful.
00:20:37.839 --> 00:20:39.440
Great point, great reminders this week.
00:20:39.519 --> 00:20:45.039
Whether our story is unfinished, whether our story um is in the middle of some pain, um, God is bringing about salvation.
00:20:45.119 --> 00:20:49.200
He's up to something, and and and if we're in him, we can trust him in that.
00:20:49.359 --> 00:20:51.039
And uh better days are ahead.
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Just gotta wait for him and hope.
00:20:53.519 --> 00:20:54.400
Uh, great message.
00:20:54.559 --> 00:20:56.960
Thanks again for listening to the Table Talk podcast.
00:20:57.039 --> 00:20:59.440
Uh, we hope you join us next week as we have another episode.
00:20:59.519 --> 00:21:08.240
And if you're not already connected with the Table Community Church, uh we just want to take a moment, invite you to come check us out on Sunday at 9 or 10 30 here in North Fort Worth.
00:21:08.319 --> 00:21:09.359
Uh, thanks again for listening.
00:21:09.440 --> 00:21:10.319
We hope you have a great week.
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Thank you, Pastor Bill, for being here.
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:12.240
See ya.
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Thanks.