Oceanside’s Water Explained with Arrowsmith Water Service chair Scott Harrison

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You're listening to Nonpartisan Hacks Pulse Edition, our locally focused series where we zoom in on how the big systems land right here on Vancouver Island.
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I'm Sean Wood, a counselor with the city of Parksville.
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And I'm Joel Grenz, also a Parksville City Counselor.
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Today we're talking about the one thing everybody in Oceanside has an opinion about by roughly the second week of July: water.
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If you live here, you know how this summer went.
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Level two conservation on May the 1st, level 3 on June the 1st, and then a full watering ban starting July 3rd.
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Brown lawns and a lot of people asking the same reasonable question.
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If we live in a rainforest, why are we being told to turn the sprinklers off?
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And the answer turns out to be more interesting than it didn't rain much.
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It involves a dam that almost nobody has actually seen, a provincial license that dictates how much water has to stay stay in the Englishman River for the fish, and a joint venture agreement three local governments signed back in the 90s.
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Which is why we've got someone here who sits right in the middle of all of it.
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Our guest today is Scott Harrison, two-term counselor with the town of Qualicum Beach and chair of the Aerosmith Water Service.
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That's the joint venture between the town of Qualicum Beach, Parksville, and the Regional District of Nanaimo that owns and operates the Aerosmith Dam.
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And before we get going, the standard disclaimer the view here is our views here are our own.
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They don't represent the official position of the city of Parksville, the town of Qualicam Beach, the regional district of Nanaimo, the Aerosmith Service Park.
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Scott, welcome to non-partisan hacks.
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That was very fast, Joel.
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I'll try to keep up with that.
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I'm trying to keep up with you.
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And I'll just say for the record, too, I have seen the dam.
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Yeah, actually.
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Yeah, yeah.
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We went to the dam together.
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When I was thinking about this conversation, one of the things I was thinking is that there's essentially two groups of people.
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One of them is much larger than the other, but the larger group is most normal folks, and especially in Parksville and the regional district who say development is causing a water shortage because they understandably correlate the growth in all the condos with the sudden annual reoccurrence of these pretty strict restrictions.
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And then you have some elected officials that say, no, the situation with water is fine.
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And we don't have to worry about it too much.
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We just have to make some long-term investments.
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Yeah, are you going to square that circle for us?
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The problem is that both of them are right, and both of them are not quite right.
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But it's just a little bit more complicated than that.
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And where I'd want to go is direct the conversation in the long run more towards the overriding issue, which is climate change.
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And this is the start of the impacts of climate change on our infrastructure.
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But I think maybe also give some folks the understanding of what the different components are of how did we get here in terms of the infrastructure.
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Okay.
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Did you bring those components of how you get here?
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Yeah, yeah.
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So um I I think you're right to hearken back to the 1990s when everyone got together and said, we're gonna create a dam to ensure the Englishman River has sufficient flow.
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And that was great.
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And Because at the time, the Englishman River was at there would be times a year where it wasn't flowing.
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Absolutely.
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Right.
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Yeah, and and I think you know uh nostalgia sometimes gives us rose-colored lenses when we look back the past.
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There were issues with the water levels historically and and could get to the point where there's actually almost nothing, almost nothing left.
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Um so it was necessary for the fish, it was necessary for the habitat, and that's great.
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And around 2000 the dam was built and everything went online.
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Uh the issue, though, is that there were a lot of assumptions made based on, in good faith, on the information they had at the time.
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Um so one thing just off the top of my head would would be the volume of snow in the Manow Smith area in the snowpack.
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So how much water is in that snowpack?
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And what we did is we had, I think it was three different measuring stations.
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And you'd make a reasonable inference with this much area, with the gauges saying there's this much snow, we should have this much water, right?
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And that's all above board.
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There's no one trying to cut corners on that.
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And then this much snow equals this much water.
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Yeah.
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And so everything is reasonable above board.
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And as only recently, we actually were able to use more modern technology, it was called LIDAR, uh, which is basically like radar, except you're using lasers to bounce lasers off the ground, and it'll tell you exactly how much snow is in the ground when you're flying over that area.
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And that was a grant done with the uh I think I can't remember which funding stream it was exactly.
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Trevor Burrus, Jr.
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People really want to know.
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Uh which grant funding stream that was, Sean?
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How can you tell?
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I used to spend some time in academia.
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Was it a shirt grant or was it an indifferent funding stream?
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Uh but uh but to be fair, so it was a provincial grant, it just ran out.
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And that was a few years ago.
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Like that was that was recent.
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Yeah, it's in the last five weeks.
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Recently, yeah.
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So it was only five years ago we got the first measurements with this new technology.
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And it basically showed that there is somewhere between 25 percent less to 50 percent less, depending on where you are, snow than we expected, or water volume in the snow, I should say more precisely.
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And so the volume of water in the mountain is less than we expected.
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That's one thing.
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Right.
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Uh second thing is just generally or or now because of climate change?
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Aaron Powell, I I think I would assume that it would be generally.
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Um I I would assume that the composition of the snow hasn't radically changed.
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But where I grew up, because I grew up in the north.
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I grew up in Prince George.
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Yeah, right.
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And there are different types of snow.
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Yes.
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Yes.
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So that's a definitely a thing.
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Aaron Powell Snow is not just snow everywhere.
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Yeah.
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There are different kinds, yeah.
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Yeah.
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So uh but uh I I don't have enough information to definitively say no, but I doubt that.
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You don't know the specific grant, and you don't know.
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Why are you on here?
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Oh my god.
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I bribed Sean with coffee.
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Um but uh but sort of so that's one thing is that we have a little bit less snow in the mountain.
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Uh another thing, too, is the timing of because of global warming, the timing of when spring starts.
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Right.
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And so if you look at the dates when the dam starts to overflow uh and the dam has a set capacity, after that, all the water just streams down into the river.
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It like spills over.
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It spills over.
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So certain times of year when we do get a fair bit of rain in our region.
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Uh and certain times a year the dam is spilling, and that's we get that in the reports that AWS puts out.
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Uh the dam is spilling.
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And that means that's water potentially that could be captured in the dam and stored for later, but it's actually spilling.
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But we just don't have the capacity for it.
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And uh I mean that's a very much an engineering question as uh how do you would you increase that?
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I'm not sure you actually could in that location.
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Uh it's actually something the city of Parksville is looking at.
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I know, I I've read your studies.
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There's multiple uh multiple approaches.
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Yeah.
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Um but uh what's happening in the last few years is the date where you have that overflow is starting earlier and earlier.
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Um so this year where we had one of the earliest stage four, we also had the dam overflowing basically on February the first week of February, uh, which is the earliest ever uh in the history of the dam.
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Trevor Burrus Because we had a average warm winter and less snow.
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There was also a lot of rain and a very warm spring.
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And so it just started all melting all at once.
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And so that meant that there was a lot of water flowing earlier in the year, which is great at that time of year, but you pay for it later on.
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Yeah.
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Um should have been snow, but it wasn't.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And so maybe 20 years ago, um, you do have you know about 1.5 degrees less of global warming.
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Uh you will have that later start of spring.
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Uh and the melt starts a little bit later.
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Um so that's another factor which is sort of more recent, and again, this is climate change derived.
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Um I think another thing too to maybe mention is that actually we should go there, stay with historical.
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The historical record, too.
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Uh, this is based on conversation I had with previous town staff to uh our presentation.
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So the town of Qualcomm Beach staff.
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Town of Qualcomm Beach staff is engineers.
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Engineer's name was Bob Weir.
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Expert.
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He was the keeper of knowledge for all things AWS because he worked for the town for well over 30 years.
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Yeah.
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And previously worked for the city of Parksville before that, by the way.
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Yeah, wealth of knowledge.
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He he definitely has all the history on all this in in our region.
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And if I'm getting the quote wrong, Bob, please don't hold it against me.
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But uh basically he said that when the province came up with the original operating rule, um there wasn't a solid scientific basis.
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So one thing I will give you Well, we need to dive into what the operating operating rule is.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Yeah.
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Because maybe maybe we need to back up a step around the water restrictions piece.
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So we've got these conservation measures that that have kicked in this year, they kick in many years.
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Uh that restrict the amount of water you can use for outdoor water use, right?
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So you can't water your lawn, you can't maybe uh hose off your driveway, things like that.
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Um that is dictated by Ultimately it's the province.
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Okay.
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Um the province is basically to say um you have to go to this level of restriction, which is why Qualcomm is in Parksville.
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Yeah, yeah.
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So about Qualcomm Beach.
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So Qualcomm Beach, uh the province could do that to us if they wanted to.
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But they don't.
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But they don't.
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Uh why do they in Parksville?
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So uh that's tied into the provisional operating rule, as you noted.
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Yeah.
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And this is all sort of loops into one conversation where initially there was a flow rate that wasn't really determined in terms of what the fish need, uh what is based on a sort of a scientific analysis of So for the provisional operating rule, the POR uh is i is speaks to the flow in the river, right?
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So the So it's the one originally it was one point six uh meters cubed per second, I believe, at the Englishman at the measuring point, and then it subsequently was given a temporary reprieve to one point zero, and only recently they've allowed it to go down to zero point eight.
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Right.
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Um that is the the flow rate in the river during the the times on the operating of the dam.
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So uh you've got your cup of water.
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I I try to use this here.
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Yeah, no, I'm oh I'm I was gonna use it as a uh have a sip, go for it.
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I was gonna use it as a as a visual aid.
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Okay, by all means, sorry, I just had a little something in my throat.
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Yeah, you've got your cup of water, yeah.
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And every winter the cup fills up and and even spills actually, water spills off the edge of it.
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Uh and then certain times of year, so uh uh is it June, I believe, June 1st to uh end of September, there is permission from the province to use the water in the cup.
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Because the province owns this water.
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Yeah.
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All water is ultimately provincial.
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All water is owned by the province.
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And so the province says you may fill this cup every winter, and then during the dry season, you may use the water in the cup, uh, but you can only use uh you can use some of it for drinking, but most of it has to actually be used by fish.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And that's that's the other thing too, is that I think people think that all the water behind the dam is used by consumption.
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Right.
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And when you look at um, say the ERWS, which I don't sit on, so I'm just going off of the reports.
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I'm done at the Englishman River Water Water Service.
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Yeah.
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Um you look at how much water is actually being consumed by the service, um, when there's saying done.
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If there's no underlying natural flow, like say there the the river would be bone dry uh if we didn't have the dam uh helping us out, then the amount of consumption is about one tenth of um so depending on where this if it's one point zero, it's usually about 0.1 is that would be used by consumption of humans in City Parksville and also Nunus Bay area.
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And so that tiny fraction goes to the humans and then everything else is flowing down the river and creating an environment for fish and environmental needs.
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And I haven't seen in a staff report from uh City of Parksville staff where they actually break down the exact ratio for in an average year the dam will be X percent fish, X percent people.
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But I'd like to Ten percent seems to come up.
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I I'd ballpark it.
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I'd I'd probably ballpark it around like 75, 25.
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Okay.
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Um just because when there's half flow, then uh if half of it is natural flow and half of it is the dam, then there's a larger percentage which is being consumed.
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Right.
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See, that's where it gets complicated because it's not just the water in the cup.
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Yeah.
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But this is the water that is being stored and over the winter and is being released during the summer.
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Yeah.
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Uh but the summer generally there's also other water still flowing in the river, so it's not cup water.
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Yeah, it's not it's not a hundred percent dam, it's a mixture.
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Yeah.
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Um so but generally during that season, so just to nail down the provisional operating rule, during the the times when we are using the cup water, so the water and the dam, during those times, the flow rate determines what stage of water conservation measures have to be enacted.
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And this is dictated by the province, it's in legislation, and it says that if it goes below a certain threshold, now you need to go to the next stage.
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And if it goes below another threshold, you need to go to the next stage.
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Um, because it's it's reducing the amount of that cup water that is being used by the city of Parksville and in Spay, and uh leaving more of that cup water for the uh the fish habitat.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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No, that that is true.
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It it it uh the ratio shifts over time, but and it's dictated by the flow, not by the use.
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Yeah, yeah.
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So that I think the other thing that people just don't maybe get their head uh it's hard to get your head wrapped around is that the water conservation measures aren't based on how much water is being used, but it's based on how much water is flowing down the river.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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And and because you have a dam that's uh essentially overflowing earlier um and you do have drier summers, uh the dam isn't quite built to purpose anymore.
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Right.
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And that's more again, this is climate change driven.
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Um there's a non-zero impact of development, obviously.
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And that's that's a fair comment.
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Right.
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But if you look at again the volume being consumed by the fish and the volume being sued by the people, um you consider there's probably I haven't seen an exact number, so I'm guessing somewhere between I I've seen numbers for the ERWS between fifteen and twenty thousand for the total number of users.
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Do you guys because I don't sit on that.
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Do you know the total number of users in this service?
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Total number of users.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Uh yeah, well, it'll be a combination of city of Parksville.
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It gets again, I guess, even more complicated because you have the city of Parksville plus you have Area E, Nanus.
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Yeah, but not all of it.
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And not all of it.
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And uh the water during the dry seasons is also supplemented by well water and aquifer water during those during those times as well.
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So it gets really complicated.
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I think in the ERWS uh it reported mentioned about s one-sixth of the water comes from the aquifer in the noose.
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About 30 percent comes from the aquifer in Parksville, and the rest all comes from the dam.
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And it's like some I think it's around 60 percent comes from the dam.
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Um so overall.
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Yeah.
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But then if you look in the in the dry season, it kind of reverses where where uh a significant proportion of the water comes from the wells and less comes from the river.
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But that that is the same time of year when there is a huge increase in water use.
00:15:32.799 --> 00:15:32.960
Yeah.
00:15:33.200 --> 00:15:40.240
So during the during the during the winter, the the water use is very, very low, and during the summer it's very, very high.
00:15:40.399 --> 00:15:40.720
Yeah.
00:15:41.200 --> 00:15:49.600
Because because people are watering their lawns and and it's not raining, and so people are using water outdoors, and that's where there's more water use.
00:15:49.759 --> 00:15:57.200
And uh and that that is really the big, if you look at graphs, there's like a big chunk difference between summer and winter.
00:15:57.360 --> 00:15:57.519
Yeah.
00:15:57.759 --> 00:15:58.879
It's almost like double.
00:15:59.279 --> 00:16:00.320
And also outdoor to indoor.
00:16:00.480 --> 00:16:01.039
Maybe even more than double.
00:16:01.120 --> 00:16:01.919
I have to double check the graphs.
00:16:02.399 --> 00:16:06.000
What are cities and towns in BC or across the country?
00:16:06.159 --> 00:16:08.799
What are we legislated to provide for water?
00:16:08.960 --> 00:16:15.840
Uh we're legislated to provide, and the taxpayers are paying for, indoor water use, health hygiene fire suppression is what they pay for.
00:16:15.919 --> 00:16:17.600
It's kind of what we're legislated to provide.
00:16:17.759 --> 00:16:18.000
Yeah.
00:16:18.240 --> 00:16:22.320
Are we legislated to provide infinite amounts of outdoor water?
00:16:22.559 --> 00:16:26.720
Um what is that what is that what the agreement is between people who are paying for their own.
00:16:26.960 --> 00:16:34.559
I I wouldn't I wouldn't suggest what the legislative requirements are, but I will speak to the way the town because I do know historically how the town has priced water.
00:16:34.960 --> 00:16:47.919
Uh and again, talking to Bob Weir, he told me that the peak water use for the town was actually in the 1990s and the late 80s and the early 90s is when we were using the most water in absolute volume, even though our population is now about 3,000 more.
00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:49.440
Treated, treated water.
00:16:49.679 --> 00:16:57.759
And uh the reason for that from our water service was that back then we had a maximum billable amount, and if you went over, it was free.
00:16:58.000 --> 00:16:58.320
Oh.
00:16:58.799 --> 00:17:08.720
So you could leave your sprinkler on when you got home from work at lunch, and granted, most of it just evaporates into the air on a hot summer day, but you know, uh you just do that because it's convenient.
00:17:09.119 --> 00:17:11.119
This is treated water that people are using on their grass.
00:17:11.440 --> 00:17:14.160
Yeah, this is potable drinking water that is normal water from our service.
00:17:14.480 --> 00:17:20.559
Um and the tech at that time there'd be not kind of water timers as complex as they are now or irrigation systems.
00:17:21.440 --> 00:17:28.480
You got the little s circling round sprinklers and the water through the wave and and the wave too back and forth.
00:17:28.799 --> 00:17:33.839
And Sean has been working on actually that yeah, he's been working on holy articles.
00:17:34.079 --> 00:17:35.200
I was really excited to pull that over.
00:17:35.519 --> 00:17:36.720
Can you do the horses walking?
00:17:38.720 --> 00:17:44.480
And uh but yeah, so that was actually um, we we nailed it.
00:17:44.880 --> 00:17:45.200
Wow.
00:17:45.359 --> 00:17:46.880
Uh a man of many talents.
00:17:47.039 --> 00:17:48.960
Um I'm not that guy from Police Academy.
00:17:49.119 --> 00:17:50.559
He was super good at that.
00:17:52.079 --> 00:17:55.920
Uh meanwhile, I'm the guy for the micro machines commercial who speaks too fast.
00:17:56.480 --> 00:18:04.240
Um so it it is something where um per capita water usage is actually shifting over time.
00:18:04.319 --> 00:18:11.599
Um so yeah, here's a stat I saw, and I I I saw it and I haven't verified it again, so hopefully I'm not incorrect on this.
00:18:11.759 --> 00:18:19.359
But my understanding is that Nanaimo has added 30,000 people to their population without actually increasing the overall water use.
00:18:19.839 --> 00:18:30.000
And that speaks to how much more efficient our fixtures are and and outdoor irrigation systems, all this all become more refined with leaks.
00:18:30.400 --> 00:18:33.200
The biggest factor though would probably be housing typology.
00:18:33.599 --> 00:18:48.720
And I'm not saying this as an advocate for one form or another of types of building, but uh the PWL study did show uh that say you have uh two-acre acreage where you have one acre of grass on your property and it's a retired couple with no kids.
00:18:48.960 --> 00:19:00.559
So for a two-person household with an acre of grass compared to an apartment, that you're not considering the landscaping in the building, but you're just looking at that one uh unit, um, it's a roughly 15 times ratio for water usage.
00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:01.119
Right.
00:19:01.359 --> 00:19:10.319
Um so as Nanaimo densifies, that per capita water usage will start to decline because you're not doing sort of rural acreages that are very water hungry.
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:10.720
Right.
00:19:10.960 --> 00:19:17.759
Um Yeah, I think people don't realize that it's it when you think about it, it makes sense, but it may be it's not the first thing you think of.
00:19:17.920 --> 00:19:24.799
But when most of the water that would be used by a typical single-family home would be outdoor water.
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:25.119
Yeah.
00:19:25.279 --> 00:19:26.240
It's about a three-to-one ratio.
00:19:27.519 --> 00:19:28.720
But you're watering the lawn.
00:19:28.799 --> 00:19:33.279
Uh and especially if you're running a lawn sprinkler system for a couple hours a night.
00:19:33.359 --> 00:19:38.400
Well, imagine doing the same in your house, like I'm turning on the faucet and just leaving it on for like hours.
00:19:38.960 --> 00:19:44.000
But also one thing to consider is people's uh kind of how they grew up and so their background.
00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:53.440
And so all three of us probably had a single family detach as we grew up, but people who grew up in a city, they may have grown up in an apartment or a condo or a townhome.
00:19:53.599 --> 00:20:01.759
Um but here on the island, it used to be quite rural, and people who have been here for years and years and years, they're used to single family detached, and that's what people live in.
00:20:01.839 --> 00:20:16.160
Yeah, we do not live in condos or apartments, but um we've had a lot of immigration, and city of Parksville, town of Qualcomm Beach are not in charge of immigration, but we have had a lot of immigration in the country, and that pushes housing prices up.
00:20:16.319 --> 00:20:24.400
And when we have a limited amount of space for those single family detached, which all of us would probably prefer to live in, then that housing gets more dense.
00:20:24.480 --> 00:20:24.799
Yeah.
00:20:25.119 --> 00:20:35.599
And we can either not build dense housing here in the city of Parksville and kind of not do our part for the team, and that dense housing will have to be built somewhere else.
00:20:35.759 --> 00:20:39.519
But if everybody does a little bit, it's kind of a team effort for housing.
00:20:39.839 --> 00:20:48.000
Well, the real thing too is that um I think in terms of and now we're expanding more into housing more broadly, but I think it's a good conversation because it loops into water usage.
00:20:48.160 --> 00:20:55.440
Um, is that uh because there's a little point I'm gonna bring up later about um possible El Nino impacts and long-term climate change impacts.
00:20:55.599 --> 00:20:59.759
But um I do think one of the things we want to think about is teasing the El Nino conversation for later.
00:21:00.079 --> 00:21:00.319
I know.
00:21:00.720 --> 00:21:01.359
Stay tuned, folks.
00:21:01.680 --> 00:21:04.400
It's like there's like four people who are super jazzed about that.
00:21:04.640 --> 00:21:16.400
Um But uh uh I think we should be thinking about you know, what are our demographics, how are they changing, and what is the type of housing our citizens are gonna need in 10 to 15 years?
00:21:16.559 --> 00:21:31.599
Uh and the answer can't just be all single-family home ranchers that are one-story, three-bedroom, eighteen hundred to two thousand square foot ranchers, which is sort of the housing stock Qualcomm Beach built en masse in the 1980s, uh, because that's about half our housing stock was built in the 80s.
00:21:31.839 --> 00:21:35.200
So you have growth rates in the 80s of 35% in five years.
00:21:35.440 --> 00:21:35.759
Wow.
00:21:35.920 --> 00:21:38.480
Um, and that's with without incorporating anything.
00:21:38.720 --> 00:21:40.079
That's just growth, baby.
00:21:40.480 --> 00:21:46.559
Uh so Qualcomm Beach in 76 was like 2100 people, and by uh 91, I think it was six thousand.
00:21:46.880 --> 00:21:48.079
And then it added Wow.
00:21:48.720 --> 00:21:51.279
So what we're seeing now is like nothing compared to then.
00:21:51.599 --> 00:21:59.519
Yeah, so when people complain about growth rates in Parksell and Qualcomm Beach, like please look at the census data from the 80s and realize even at the peak of Parksil's growth.
00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:04.000
And in the last census, you guys grew just over 10%, and we grew by 4.6%.
00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:07.680
But uh man oh man, the 80s there was a lot of growth happening.
00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:07.920
Yeah.
00:22:08.079 --> 00:22:16.480
Um but what was being built back then, especially for our community, less so for Parksville, um, but more for qual Kambichi was uh retired couples' homes.
00:22:16.720 --> 00:22:16.880
Right.
00:22:17.039 --> 00:22:17.119
Right?
00:22:17.279 --> 00:22:18.799
Uh retiree housing.
00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:23.200
Uh and as a result, it's for young retirees.
00:22:23.440 --> 00:22:25.839
And there's a school of gerontology in Japan.
00:22:25.920 --> 00:22:30.960
I remember reading an economist article about how they divide seniors into two age groups.
00:22:31.119 --> 00:22:36.319
And the direct translation of the Japanese is young, old, and old, old, which is not exactly how people want to think of themselves.
00:22:36.640 --> 00:22:37.759
Young, old and old, old.
00:22:38.319 --> 00:22:40.000
So yeah, that's an awkward translation.
00:22:41.119 --> 00:22:43.359
Uh Department of Vernazie Department.
00:22:44.079 --> 00:22:46.799
So, you know, maybe there's a nicer way of phrasing it.
00:22:46.880 --> 00:22:50.799
But um essentially, obviously a 60-year-old is very different from an 85-year-old.
00:22:50.880 --> 00:22:54.000
Aaron Powell Early stage retirees and later stage retirees.
00:22:54.319 --> 00:23:04.400
And so what we're seeing in Oceanside post since 2001, for the Oceanside area as a whole, almost all the population growth, actually, all the population growth has been Citizen 60 or over.
00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:08.319
Um so the under-60 population has remained relatively constant.
00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:14.079
And every population gain we have are essentially seniors or semi-retetirees.
00:23:14.160 --> 00:23:17.519
Trevor Burrus, Jr.: One of the warmest places in Canada, but the real estate's cheaper than Victoria.
00:23:17.599 --> 00:23:23.680
Trevor Burrus, Jr.: And the baby boom demographics lend itself to, you know, if you're a retirement Mecca, uh, do you like golf?
00:23:23.839 --> 00:23:25.279
Boy, do we have something for you?
00:23:25.599 --> 00:23:28.480
Welcome to Qualcomm Beach, where we own how many golf courses now?
00:23:28.799 --> 00:23:30.000
Two and counting.
00:23:30.160 --> 00:23:30.799
Yeah.
00:23:31.519 --> 00:23:34.079
Parksville doesn't own nearly enough golf courses yet.
00:23:34.799 --> 00:23:38.000
Are there lots for sale, Scott, in the in the latest one that you guys bought?
00:23:38.640 --> 00:23:40.319
Yeah, there's and available.
00:23:40.799 --> 00:23:45.680
Um we could have a long discussion about all things in Google Crest, but I would like to.
00:23:46.720 --> 00:23:48.079
Yeah, we won't digress to that.
00:23:48.559 --> 00:24:07.200
The other thing, too, I think, to bring into this is around expectations, which Sean brought up is when people come over from other parts of the country uh or even other parts of the province to retire here or move here, the expectations around uh the climate that they've moved into may not be the same as what they came from.
00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:15.759
So I moved here from Ladner, and uh pretty much any time of year, I could stick my finger in the ground in the front yard and hit water, right?
00:24:15.920 --> 00:24:18.240
Like it's so wet because you're you're in a delta there.
00:24:18.559 --> 00:24:32.799
Uh you come here and during we live in a rain shadow here in in Parksville, and during the summer, there's not a lot of rain falling from the sky, and the soil and the ground conditions are such that it really drains very quickly.
00:24:33.279 --> 00:24:50.960
So to try to keep a w a lawn green is takes a lot more water here than it would in Ladner, and or you know, I've if you've moved here from Ontario, like Sean or or Manitoba, where it's very green a lot of the year, maybe the whole year it's green.
00:24:51.039 --> 00:24:55.920
Maybe you don't need to do much to water your lawn during at all to keep it green.
00:24:56.160 --> 00:24:58.480
Here you're gonna have to use a lot of water to do that.
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:09.200
Uh I I there was recently a photo posted on Facebook of uh it looked like an aerial photo of Parksville in the 60s, and it actually looked very brown.
00:25:09.599 --> 00:25:10.799
Look at did you see that photo?
00:25:11.200 --> 00:25:11.519
Summertime.
00:25:11.680 --> 00:25:11.920
Summertime.
00:25:12.559 --> 00:25:31.039
Yeah, so it looked very brown and actually looked like there are fewer trees generally in the Parksville area, like that sort of it kind of looked over the community park and a bunch of area, looked like there are fewer trees, much browner uh grass, and and uh so it it seems to me like, yeah, well, do we live in a rainforest in Parksville exactly?
00:25:31.200 --> 00:25:39.119
Is it it's quite dry during the rainforest is a very different uh ecosystem than single family homes with grass.
00:25:39.359 --> 00:25:39.599
Right.
00:25:39.839 --> 00:25:40.720
Yeah, too to your point.
00:25:41.759 --> 00:25:42.160
Uh yeah.
00:25:42.319 --> 00:25:46.000
Well, it it's also too um, you know, what happens to a lot of rainforest when you clear it out?
00:25:46.079 --> 00:25:46.720
It dries out.
00:25:46.799 --> 00:25:48.079
Uh the land dries out quite quickly.
00:25:48.240 --> 00:25:48.400
Yeah.
00:25:48.559 --> 00:25:50.880
Um and grass doesn't grow as quick as you'd like it to.
00:25:51.039 --> 00:25:54.400
Um it's part of the reason why deforestation can lead to desertification.
00:25:54.640 --> 00:25:54.880
Right.
00:25:55.039 --> 00:25:57.119
Um but that's a whole other conversation too.
00:25:57.279 --> 00:25:59.680
Um and I don't want to forget about El Nino for the four people.
00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:01.839
Okay, I mean we we did we did tease this.
00:26:02.160 --> 00:26:03.759
Okay, so I should probably talk about this too.
00:26:03.839 --> 00:26:07.839
So this year we're headed for what's probably the largest El Nino event in recorded history.
00:26:08.160 --> 00:26:08.960
Super El Nino.
00:26:09.279 --> 00:26:10.079
A super El Nino.
00:26:10.319 --> 00:26:10.400
Yeah.
00:26:10.559 --> 00:26:12.480
Um and for folks who don't know, I had to look this up.
00:26:12.559 --> 00:26:24.079
I I vaguely remember my kit as a child watching Sarion Live, Chris Farley in a uh topless, of course, as Chris Farley always was um with a hula skirt saying I'm El Nino, which is Spanish for the Nino.
00:26:24.640 --> 00:26:41.279
Uh but what El Nino actually was, so it was uh a bunch of fishermen uh off the coast of Chile and Peru uh several decades ago, and they noticed right around Christmas time that the fish they'd normally be catching had migrated significantly, and that's because of a warming event.
00:26:41.680 --> 00:26:43.519
Um and so is why did it cause?
00:26:43.680 --> 00:26:46.720
Well, because of El Nino Jesus, because of sweet baby Jesus.
00:26:46.880 --> 00:26:49.039
Um and that's where the term comes from.
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:51.039
And uh but isn't there also La Niña?
00:26:51.519 --> 00:26:52.799
And La Niña is the opposite of that.
00:26:52.960 --> 00:26:53.119
Okay.
00:26:53.359 --> 00:27:00.240
And what El Nino is is a warming basically along the equator off the Pacific, and it has significant impacts on weather.
00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:05.599
So the state of California can get deluges um and very strong storms.
00:27:05.759 --> 00:27:08.799
It impacts uh the formation of hurricanes in the Atlantic.
00:27:08.960 --> 00:27:11.279
There are fewer hurricanes when you have a very strong El Nino.
00:27:11.519 --> 00:27:27.039
And then I was doing research last night at those ungodly hours of like one in the morning, and uh the economists and the weather network both have projections for this winter of the El Nino event if it goes through as is expected, which right now it's on track to, of a high pressure event all winter long.
00:27:27.519 --> 00:27:27.759
Wow.
00:27:27.920 --> 00:27:28.000
Yeah.
00:27:28.240 --> 00:27:33.440
And then uh I looked at another source called climatedata.ca and it says, no, no, and it's gonna be very, very wet all winter long.
00:27:33.599 --> 00:27:37.359
Um a high pressure event will probably cause a significant reduction in precipitation.
00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:41.839
Um so I'm not in a position to say what weather we are gonna get.
00:27:42.000 --> 00:27:46.480
But because the economists are we had you on to predict what the weather is going to be the next year.
00:27:48.799 --> 00:27:49.519
We have like a map here.
00:27:49.599 --> 00:27:50.640
Can we get like a green screen?
00:27:50.880 --> 00:27:51.279
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:27:51.839 --> 00:27:54.799
Um it's also too like what it like what do Canadians love to talk about?
00:27:55.039 --> 00:27:57.279
Uh the weather uh ad nauseum.
00:27:57.440 --> 00:28:04.319
Um but if I'm assuming the weather network and the economist uh are pretty reputable with their sources, um their science is pretty accurate.
00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:11.359
So if we have a prolonged high pressure event in the wintertime and we have less precipitation, that'll mean they'll have less snow in the snowbank.
00:28:11.680 --> 00:28:12.079
Blue sky.
00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:26.480
Um and then potentially as well with global warming, you're also going to have that early melt and the early overflow, even with that like we saw this year with uh because I know Sean, you're very uh attentive to this, the low snowpack, and then also too, on top of that, it's melting sooner because things are warmer.
00:28:26.559 --> 00:28:26.799
Yep.
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:31.839
So there's a precautionary principle, I think, too, like when we're talking about development too, more broadly.
00:28:32.000 --> 00:28:34.960
Um we can't grow endlessly in this area.
00:28:35.200 --> 00:28:38.000
Um we're gonna have to invest because of climate change.
00:28:38.559 --> 00:28:50.799
But if we are gonna be considering development, it should be a sort of an intentional thing of what do the citizens of our communities need and what is the impact sort of like per household on tree loss, water consumption.
00:28:51.039 --> 00:28:55.839
Um how does this line up with the provision of services like public transportation and other things?
00:28:56.160 --> 00:28:58.000
Our amenities and walking distance.
00:28:58.319 --> 00:29:01.680
Um so if you have a grocery store, that's a great place to put density.
00:29:01.920 --> 00:29:10.480
Um if you're in a suburban neighborhood, I would argue again, this is starting to touch on local politics in Qualican Beach, but I'd argue that's not a great place for density.
00:29:10.559 --> 00:29:16.559
Um because uh if you have a lot of services in proximity to density, you can walk to everything.
00:29:16.799 --> 00:29:18.559
And that means you don't have to use a car.
00:29:19.200 --> 00:29:36.720
But not just that, it it s saves the the local government money too, because all those pipes that are required to pipe water and take the water away in pipes, yeah, uh and uh all the road infrastructure, lighting, sidewalks, all that stuff costs more money to exactly.
00:29:36.799 --> 00:29:42.240
So if you have more of the density concentrated in certain areas, then you can save money for the whole community.
00:29:42.720 --> 00:29:49.440
And I think I think to the point, maybe for some of the folks who are opposed to development in certain parks, so I think there's a bit of a a swing.
00:29:49.680 --> 00:29:52.319
Um good conversation is where do we contain it?
00:29:52.559 --> 00:29:58.160
Um so whatever that boundary is, and I'm not saying what right or wrong, I'm not in a position to say that for several reasons.
00:29:58.400 --> 00:30:05.039
But I do think that like on the one hand, I think people underestimate the benefits of density and how that impacts their taxation.
00:30:05.279 --> 00:30:09.440
Um so for example, the East Village in Qualicam Beach, some people object to us as aesthetics.
00:30:09.599 --> 00:30:16.319
Aesthetically, I can understand the conversation that you don't like it very much, but it also reduces your taxes by 3% every year in perpetuity.
00:30:16.880 --> 00:30:25.599
So, you know, there's a give and take because you have more value in the building, um, you do get more property taxes, which again keeps down the cost of tax increases.
00:30:25.839 --> 00:30:33.039
And for both our communities, a lot of folks are on fixed incomes and they can defer, but for some reason, a lot of folks they're you know, baby boomers were.
00:30:54.079 --> 00:31:02.640
You know, the three percent property tax, I guess, reduction-ish on future property tax increases.
00:31:03.119 --> 00:31:05.200
Do larger cities see that?
00:31:05.519 --> 00:31:13.440
Because we see everyone, every city, every municipality, their property taxes go up, even if you're Burnaby or somewhere with huge towers.
00:31:13.599 --> 00:31:18.640
So, you know, uh I'm gonna kind of have my NIMBY glasses on right now.
00:31:18.880 --> 00:31:19.279
No, that's fair.
00:31:19.440 --> 00:31:22.240
We need to you know it's a good uh is that a thing?
00:31:22.400 --> 00:31:26.240
Because we should steal man it for housing, housing needs.
00:31:26.400 --> 00:31:28.880
Uh I've asked Blaine, our planner.
00:31:28.960 --> 00:31:30.400
I'm like, well, whose needs?
00:31:30.640 --> 00:31:39.119
Because with my NIMBY glasses on, uh, I have no needs for more housing and more traffic and more stress on my healthcare system here in the city of Parksville.
00:31:39.279 --> 00:31:39.920
I have none.
00:31:40.160 --> 00:31:50.319
Uh workforce businesses would like some more affordable housing for frontline workers who can't afford the average$950,000 single family detached.
00:31:50.480 --> 00:31:53.599
But what housing needs do we have that are already here?
00:31:53.839 --> 00:31:55.680
We already live here and we love where we live.
00:31:55.839 --> 00:31:57.680
We we have no more housing needs, thank you.
00:31:58.160 --> 00:32:03.759
I I would caution folks to look at the number of the percentage of renters who spend more than 30% of your pretext income on.
00:32:03.920 --> 00:32:04.079
Sure.
00:32:04.799 --> 00:32:05.359
It's expensive.
00:32:05.599 --> 00:32:07.279
Um if you're building market housing.
00:32:07.599 --> 00:32:13.519
Oh, yeah, no, but if you look at the share of the population, now you compare Qualcomm Beach is worse than Parksville, um, by a little.
00:32:13.680 --> 00:32:15.920
We're 53.3, I think, in the last census.
00:32:16.160 --> 00:32:18.640
Now, 53.3 is worse than Vancouver.
00:32:18.799 --> 00:32:22.559
It's worse than Victoria, it's worse than New York City, it's worse than San Francisco.
00:32:23.039 --> 00:32:26.160
Um you're talking about percent of income spent on rent.
00:32:28.960 --> 00:32:29.119
Sure.
00:32:29.359 --> 00:32:35.200
So the percentage of renters are spending too much in Qualicum Beach is the third worst in BC of any community.
00:32:35.359 --> 00:32:36.799
So there's about 200 municipalities.
00:32:36.880 --> 00:32:38.640
So we're in that top one and a half.
00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:45.039
If we live in Hawaii, the Hawaii of Canada, can we build our way out of that and see those rents come down?
00:32:45.759 --> 00:32:46.960
Not likely.
00:32:47.680 --> 00:32:52.160
Um I I think you can stabilize the market though.
00:32:52.640 --> 00:32:55.920
Well, but this is this is getting really far afield, but it's a good conversation.
00:32:56.160 --> 00:33:02.160
Um but I I I do think that the folks who say just build, build, build, and it'll become affordable.
00:33:02.720 --> 00:33:06.319
No, but it you'll stave off uh escalation.
00:33:06.559 --> 00:33:12.480
The other thing too, I know Joel and I were speaking before the podcast is what is the future population growth in our area?
00:33:13.200 --> 00:33:22.400
And um when you look through the buyer surveys for the Vancouver Island Real Estate Board, so they used to publish they used to have an archive of it on their website, which is great, uh, because they've been doing it for about 15 years.
00:33:22.880 --> 00:33:31.839
And for folks who fill in the survey, so it's self-selected, so caveat about the data source, but it's about a fifth or so or a quarter of folks who buy homes in our area.
00:33:32.079 --> 00:33:37.279
And every year you see the same pattern that it's overwhelmingly folks from Vancouver and Victoria.
00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:40.880
It's about 75% of folks who buy homes here for the first time.
00:33:41.519 --> 00:33:46.480
And then you have a few folks from out of province and much fewer folks from other countries.
00:33:46.960 --> 00:33:49.920
Um again, that's Parksville, Qualcomm Beach.
00:33:50.160 --> 00:33:51.519
Yeah, this is Parksville Qualicam Beach.
00:33:51.599 --> 00:33:59.440
So uh it's called Area 5 on that study on the Vireb reports, uh, which correlates to Parksville, Qualicam Beach, the oceanside area.
00:33:59.680 --> 00:33:59.839
Right.
00:34:00.160 --> 00:34:18.400
Um and the interesting thing Joel and I were talking about is well what happens because we've seen the baby boom, and we're in we're a perfect community for a lot of 60-year-old retirees or semi-retired folks, uh folks who can work remotely for you know 20 hours a week and uh play some golf and uh go drive around.
00:34:18.880 --> 00:34:31.920
Uh but the the age at which people are coming here, that sort of fifty-five to sixty five range, is now going to start being the Gen X, which is a huge population uh uh valley in terms of demographics.
00:34:32.400 --> 00:34:33.840
I turned fifty five on Christmas Eve.
00:34:34.079 --> 00:34:35.519
Yeah, well Merry Christmas.
00:34:37.039 --> 00:34:40.000
See, that's what I get that's what I've had my whole life is my birthday.
00:34:40.159 --> 00:34:40.960
I get Merry Christmas.
00:34:41.199 --> 00:34:42.880
This time you get a senior's discount.
00:34:43.199 --> 00:34:45.280
At Fields in Parksville, 10%.
00:34:45.760 --> 00:34:46.639
Fields, I think, is gone.
00:34:47.039 --> 00:34:47.920
I know, so not that one.
00:34:48.079 --> 00:34:48.719
No more discount.
00:34:48.880 --> 00:34:49.039
Yeah.
00:34:49.280 --> 00:34:49.760
Oh geez.
00:34:50.079 --> 00:34:50.719
We interrupted Scott.
00:34:50.880 --> 00:34:51.039
Go ahead.
00:34:51.119 --> 00:34:51.599
Oh no, that's okay.
00:34:52.079 --> 00:34:57.519
But it's to the point is um, you know, folks who are sort of our age, we're middle-aged.
00:34:57.760 --> 00:34:59.840
Midway point in life lost in a darkened wood.
00:35:00.000 --> 00:35:02.800
Um sorry, that's the opening line of Dante's divine comedy for folks.
00:35:03.039 --> 00:35:04.719
Uh but um He's a literature student, yeah.
00:35:04.880 --> 00:35:05.599
Yeah, a millennial student.
00:35:06.079 --> 00:35:07.280
Uh so I had to throw that in.
00:35:07.599 --> 00:35:12.320
Uh but uh uh we're all sort of middle-aged guys who are on a podcast.
00:35:12.639 --> 00:35:14.800
On a podcast, very much for like the cliche.
00:35:15.199 --> 00:35:21.360
And uh we're all elder, like elder millennial to young gen X is sort of our niche.
00:35:21.599 --> 00:35:21.840
Right.
00:35:22.000 --> 00:35:23.840
Um and there aren't as many of us.
00:35:24.000 --> 00:35:25.519
There are there are quite a few millennials.
00:35:25.599 --> 00:35:25.840
Yeah.
00:35:26.000 --> 00:35:29.679
Uh not as many Gen Xers and not as many in our demographic.
00:35:29.920 --> 00:35:38.320
And not only I'm where you're getting here is not only are there uh is there there's not as many of that generation that may move here, yeah.
00:35:38.480 --> 00:35:47.280
Uh, but I'll add to that is I wonder whether the future generations will follow previous generations in their migration patterns generally.
00:35:47.519 --> 00:35:57.199
Uh are people of uh the coming generations going to move to Parksville from other places when they retire, or are they just gonna stay in the communities that they were in before?
00:35:57.519 --> 00:36:07.440
Um Yeah, well one thing I'd say to sort of uh uh precisely echo that is that a lot of the population, just stability of our country, let alone growth, has come from immigration from overseas.
00:36:07.599 --> 00:36:07.920
Yep.
00:36:08.239 --> 00:36:12.079
And uh I lived in Korea for a year uh teaching English.
00:36:12.320 --> 00:36:20.960
Uh I would say we don't have a lot of folks from who are first generation Canadians coming from Asia moving to Parksville or Qualican Beach right now.
00:36:21.119 --> 00:36:22.719
That might change the future, I don't know.
00:36:22.880 --> 00:36:24.320
But right now it's not sort of the standard.
00:36:24.400 --> 00:36:26.719
And the standard is that you move in with your kids.
00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:27.039
Yeah.
00:36:27.199 --> 00:36:31.840
So the most cultures would have yeah, would have multiple generational households.
00:36:31.920 --> 00:36:32.079
Yeah.
00:36:32.400 --> 00:36:34.559
Uh and so that could change.
00:36:34.719 --> 00:36:35.840
So that's another factor.
00:36:36.079 --> 00:36:39.519
So I think you're going in the direction of the Yeah, yeah.
00:36:39.599 --> 00:36:44.719
So it's also too, it's not only do we have reduced population growth because of Gen Xers just being a smaller demographic.
00:36:44.800 --> 00:36:44.960
Yeah.
00:36:45.199 --> 00:36:58.880
But also, too, as the composition becomes increasingly first generation Canadians, that will also have potentially a reduced demand because folks aren't looking to move into a retirement community, they're looking to move in with their kids, yeah, maybe somewhere in this suburbs of a city.
00:36:59.119 --> 00:37:03.280
Um, so and this is all hypothetical, like it's a bit arm waving, we don't have solid data.
00:37:03.519 --> 00:37:19.280
There was actually a uh healthcare summit last year in November in Nanaimo, and the keynote was a demographer uh from UBC, and I specifically asked him about the long-term implications of uh large number of folks coming from Asia and BC.
00:37:19.679 --> 00:37:22.480
And that's sort of like you know, increasingly the population in Vancouver.
00:37:22.559 --> 00:37:29.760
There's a huge uh well, there's several languages in Vancouver, but huge percentage of the population do not speak English as their first language.
00:37:29.920 --> 00:37:33.840
Um how does that impact the mid-island demography in the future?
00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:36.400
And he just basically said that's an excellent question.
00:37:36.559 --> 00:37:37.840
And uh don't know.
00:37:38.400 --> 00:37:45.039
By the way, sidebar, is it his study that was used by the province to create the housing needs report?
00:37:45.440 --> 00:37:46.719
No, no, no, that's a different guy.
00:37:46.960 --> 00:37:56.480
Okay, because there was a UBC study that was used to project forward the housing needs, which then the city of Parksville and town of Qualcomm Beach had to use to create their housing needs reports, which is what's being used to also.
00:37:56.960 --> 00:38:01.840
Yeah, so that prof was uh the UBC prof there is Tom Davidson who's involved with the province for setting that up.
00:38:02.079 --> 00:38:02.239
Right.
00:38:02.719 --> 00:38:05.679
Um and he's a Harvard-trained line economist specialist.
00:38:05.840 --> 00:38:13.519
Um and also Little Spatzelhall was involved, and one other gentleman who I'm familiar with from like Blue Sky Twitter.
00:38:13.760 --> 00:38:17.920
Uh I'm no longer on Twitter now because you know, the owner.
00:38:18.159 --> 00:38:22.639
But uh yeah, there's there were a few different data scientists, but they're different folks.
00:38:22.880 --> 00:38:26.639
Um but I would say too, like folks are really interested in housing policy.
00:38:26.719 --> 00:38:28.800
Uh uh Tom Davidoff is a good follow.
00:38:28.960 --> 00:38:29.039
Right.
00:38:29.360 --> 00:38:31.280
Um he's he's very knowledgeable on the subject.
00:38:31.440 --> 00:38:36.880
Whether or not I agree with all his positions, it's still uh good to engage with someone who's very well versed in the subject.
00:38:36.960 --> 00:38:37.119
Trevor Burrus, Jr.
00:38:37.199 --> 00:38:50.639
And the reason we're talking about housing needs and demographics is we're looking down the road in the future, and that all water is obviously a pretty good resource that has to do with those housing needs and the demographics and managing growth, which we do at our local government.
00:38:50.880 --> 00:38:51.119
Yeah, yeah.
00:38:51.199 --> 00:38:54.880
I I would suggest this this does sort of loop it all into the end.
00:38:54.960 --> 00:38:57.920
But it the idea is that what type of homes are you building?
00:38:58.079 --> 00:38:59.440
How many of them are you gonna build?
00:38:59.599 --> 00:39:02.960
And then that can help you project how much water you need to provide.
00:39:03.199 --> 00:39:11.280
And then especially for the ERWS, so this is more part less qualicum beach, because we have sort of our own system now, but um long term, who knows?
00:39:11.360 --> 00:39:14.800
Uh if we overbuild, there could be impacts on the aquifer.
00:39:15.199 --> 00:39:22.159
Uh but uh it does sort of suggest how much uh water storage do you need to invest in?
00:39:22.320 --> 00:39:27.280
Uh how much uh do you have to invest in terms of those water processing plant as well?
00:39:27.440 --> 00:39:34.719
Um I know the PWL report, if you have a high growth scenario, uh Parksville would have to expand their water treatment plant by 20 in the 2040s.
00:39:35.039 --> 00:39:36.800
Which it's built to be expanded.
00:39:37.360 --> 00:39:42.960
Yeah, so the treatment plant in Parksville is built to be able to double its current capacity.
00:39:43.440 --> 00:39:52.400
Uh last I checked, we are behind where it was projected at the time that we we would be in terms of the water use.
00:39:52.639 --> 00:40:00.480
And so we are actually, which is great if we're kind of a little bit slower to need that second doubling of capacity.
00:40:00.880 --> 00:40:02.880
Uh and that's just the processing of the water.
00:40:02.960 --> 00:40:04.639
That's not the storage of the water and all that.
00:40:04.800 --> 00:40:05.599
But just that's the same thing.
00:40:06.320 --> 00:40:06.880
That's a great point.
00:40:07.039 --> 00:40:07.119
Yeah.
00:40:07.360 --> 00:40:14.239
Uh it's a great point that we have to separate the storage and the processing because those are two different sort of lenses and two different pieces of infrastructure.
00:40:14.480 --> 00:40:14.719
Yeah.
00:40:15.280 --> 00:40:17.760
And that also is another thing that gets that gets confusing.
00:40:18.159 --> 00:40:18.719
Oh, absolutely.
00:40:19.039 --> 00:40:30.320
Yeah, and I think that the to kind of now circle this all back is we have these watering restrictions that happen every year, and they are dictated by the flow in the river.
00:40:30.480 --> 00:40:36.639
We have a dam, we have a uh we have uh an aquifer well pump system as well.
00:40:36.800 --> 00:40:44.239
And those are the two kind of main ways we get water in the city of Parksville and the the uh Nanus uh area E.
00:40:44.639 --> 00:41:01.039
Uh and and the good news is I think that um you know Murray uh Walters, who's the RDN's engineer on this, uh he he, in his opinion, uh this is a meeting like last week that Sean was in uh on the RDN and I was tuning in like I usually do.
00:41:01.280 --> 00:41:07.199
And he said that uh we have a robust and resilient water system in the city of Parksville and the news.
00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:13.599
Um but City of Parksville has done a bunch of work on this file.
00:41:13.679 --> 00:41:20.559
And maybe I'll toss it to Sean if you wanted to go into any of that, the KDL study that that Scott's alluded to and where all that's headed.
00:41:20.800 --> 00:41:24.320
I mean, this the study is online for everyone to to look at.
00:41:24.559 --> 00:41:36.559
Uh one thing that really sticks out that our CAO said to me um is that the systems that we're talking about is for delivering treated drinking water to homes for domestic use.
00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:38.320
This is what we built.
00:41:38.559 --> 00:41:46.239
Um we do not have a system that can deliver if everyone is running their sprinklers during the summer where it is very dry.
00:41:46.800 --> 00:41:55.119
We do not have a system that can actually deliver that amount of simultaneous water to everyone's property if everyone is running a sprinkler in their single family detachment.
00:41:55.360 --> 00:41:56.239
We never have, really, right?
00:41:56.880 --> 00:41:58.239
We do not have that system.
00:41:58.480 --> 00:42:04.400
The just the diameter of the pipes to deliver that water uh doesn't exist.
00:42:04.800 --> 00:42:20.800
And I also, you know, since it's treated water, uh pretend it's like gold coming out of the tap that has been perfected for human consumption that you are spreading on your hedges or your grass or you know, veggie gardens.
00:42:21.039 --> 00:42:22.719
Can you keep that stuff alive?
00:42:23.039 --> 00:42:30.000
Lawns notwithstanding in the summertime, yes, with restrictions, you can keep your mature gardens and your veggie gardens alive.
00:42:30.239 --> 00:42:37.360
Um but it is not a system to deliver uh green lawns for everyone all summer.
00:42:37.519 --> 00:42:47.920
And that is part of I think what kind of needs to be understood with what we have with a robust system for delivering health, hygiene, and fire suppression.
00:42:48.079 --> 00:42:57.920
We have lots for fire suppression and for health and hygiene for domestic water use inside your home with the treated water that is like gold coming out of your tap.
00:42:58.400 --> 00:43:07.840
Um there are rebates for cisterns, there are rebates for uh water storage, so you can capture some of the water that comes down all year.
00:43:08.000 --> 00:43:19.760
You're sitting on a property right now that's about 0.42 of an acre in the RDN area G, and I have uh 500 gallons over there, and those are 50 gallon times three.
00:43:19.920 --> 00:43:25.679
I kind of have 650 gallons of capture, rainwater capture equipment here on this property.
00:43:26.000 --> 00:43:26.400
Untreated.
00:43:26.719 --> 00:43:33.199
Untreated, and the grass or my hedges, or whatever it is that we use it for, uh hens, they don't care.
00:43:33.360 --> 00:43:35.840
It's great water that comes out of the sky.
00:43:36.000 --> 00:43:54.239
Uh, but that is something that I think people have grown up with being able to use infinite amounts of outdoor water use, and that is not the system that has been built, and it is not fair to have everyone pay for such a system where there's infinite amounts of outdoor water use.
00:43:54.320 --> 00:43:57.440
Um, and so I think that's really key to this entire issue.
00:43:57.760 --> 00:43:59.679
And then just remembering one thing I forgot to add.
00:44:00.719 --> 00:44:14.880
As uh something that folks if the data source is public and folks might not always want access, is there is provincial observation wells that monitor the groundwater level in multiple locations all through oceanside.
00:44:15.199 --> 00:44:18.880
Uh there's uh probably about two dozen uh that are set up.
00:44:19.119 --> 00:44:24.480
And last night I again middle of the night I was uh printing out copies of the actual water level in Parksville.
00:44:24.800 --> 00:44:25.360
You brought visual aids.
00:44:25.760 --> 00:44:26.400
I brought visual aids.
00:44:26.559 --> 00:44:29.199
I know I'm trying to be organized, and then I just got distracted.
00:44:29.519 --> 00:44:39.920
Um but uh the all the graphs show there's basically three wells, two wells in Parksville proper, and one is close to the corner of Church Road and the Alberny Highway.
00:44:40.400 --> 00:44:56.320
Um and the one that's uh in Springwood Park uh shows that uh when you put in the ERWS around 2019, basically it went from about 10 meters underground for where the water is to about six meters.
00:44:56.719 --> 00:45:00.000
And so you went up by four meters, and going up is good because it means you have more water.
00:45:00.159 --> 00:45:00.400
Right.
00:45:00.559 --> 00:45:00.719
Right?
00:45:00.880 --> 00:45:14.480
Uh so the the the take home is that when the city put in the water treatment plant and the um ERWS system, that there's less reliance on the well water of the aquifer, and the aquifer has been recovering.
00:45:14.880 --> 00:45:15.599
And there's a huge rebound.
00:45:16.320 --> 00:45:19.760
Um and so and then there's one at Trill Drive.
00:45:19.920 --> 00:45:24.400
Um it's basically level the last few years, and it's a huge rebound again.
00:45:24.480 --> 00:45:27.039
Um this case it's only about a meter and a half.
00:45:27.199 --> 00:45:29.280
Uh and the last one, the Alberni Church.
00:45:29.519 --> 00:45:30.320
Scott brought graphs.
00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:31.039
I brought graphs.
00:45:31.360 --> 00:45:32.639
We can maybe put these in after.
00:45:33.119 --> 00:45:34.400
Um hold them up to the camera.
00:45:34.880 --> 00:45:36.880
And we can describe them for the video audio portion.
00:45:37.280 --> 00:45:39.760
We can provide links uh to people to the same graphs.
00:45:40.000 --> 00:45:42.000
And we might be able to do better than that on the on the video.
00:45:42.079 --> 00:45:42.400
We'll see.
00:45:42.719 --> 00:45:55.280
Uh but there's also two, the last one for parcel is the Church Albernie Drive, uh and the uh Alberny Highway rather, and that is sort of declining right now in the last couple of years, but it is still significantly higher than the historical low points, which is around 2010.
00:45:55.599 --> 00:46:07.199
Um so you know, the it's not saying that we should be blasé about water, but I think sometimes uh folks get uh caught up in seeing this early stage four and thinking there's no water in the ground.
00:46:07.360 --> 00:46:07.519
Right.
00:46:07.760 --> 00:46:11.280
And there actually is more water in the ground than there was five years ago.
00:46:11.599 --> 00:46:18.960
Um it's not to say that we should abuse that, but it is to say that it's it's not a crisis in terms of the aquifer right now for the city of Parksville.
00:46:19.360 --> 00:46:23.039
And city of Qual town of Qualcommich is basically the same thing, it's basically level.
00:46:23.199 --> 00:46:32.480
Um and historical records show it was in the past we actually had a lower water level in the ground, um largely because we were more wasteful, honestly.
00:46:33.039 --> 00:46:50.480
Yeah, I think it s uh important context too is that technology is improving, uh things are getting better in terms of our ability to measure all this, things are getting better in terms of our ability to manage the resource and use uh, you know, new studies are coming out, science is progressing.
00:46:50.639 --> 00:47:15.280
Uh so things are uh are improving and but we do need to be careful and and it's important that um the city of Parksville, town of Qualcomm Beach, the regional district, that we continue doing good governance of these very valuable resources and that we have um uh that we're careful stewards of of everything that you know, water, energy, all these things that we should be careful with.
00:47:15.360 --> 00:47:24.960
And I would say too, as someone who's elected for the town of Qualcomm Beach historically, um I interact on the AWS with City of Parksville staff.
00:47:25.280 --> 00:47:28.639
And uh I have found them to be incredibly professional.
00:47:28.719 --> 00:47:32.480
Uh they m know exactly what they're doing, they're very thoughtful too.
00:47:32.639 --> 00:47:45.440
I remember having a long conversation about the first time they really introduced serious water restrictions during an election, I think it was eight years ago now, um, and how much they had debated, like, okay, well, the water level requires it, but do we want to do this or not?
00:47:46.239 --> 00:47:59.920
Um Yeah, one little anecdote on that was uh was because the watering restrictions are dictated by the province and the flow in the river, we did have a situation where in September the province required the city to go to stage four watering restrictions.
00:48:00.000 --> 00:48:00.079
Yeah.
00:48:00.400 --> 00:48:03.199
And it was literally raining at the time.
00:48:03.599 --> 00:48:04.400
Yeah, I remember that.
00:48:04.559 --> 00:48:06.000
Yeah, that was that was awkward.
00:48:06.239 --> 00:48:07.599
I remember talking about it.
00:48:08.639 --> 00:48:09.199
People are confused.
00:48:09.280 --> 00:48:12.079
Like, why are we having these watering restrictions when it's raining?
00:48:12.239 --> 00:48:18.960
And uh, well, the answer is it's the flow rate in the river and it's a pretty binary decision that the province makes on that or dictates.
00:48:19.440 --> 00:48:19.519
Yeah.
00:48:19.679 --> 00:48:33.440
Um but but it is something too, and and just for me, that's sort of the final point is that, you know, um, and I'm not trying to say that we need to develop everything or we need to have whatever limitless amount of business, and I'm certainly very skeptical about the idea of data centers in their area.
00:48:33.760 --> 00:48:48.239
But um I I do think that if you had imagine a scenario where the city of Parksville a decade ago said, and Ninous Bay as well, said we're gonna do an absolute moratorium on all growth, and nothing was built ten years ago, would you have water restrictions?
00:48:48.320 --> 00:48:49.840
And for me, unqualified answer is yes.
00:48:50.000 --> 00:48:50.159
Right.
00:48:50.320 --> 00:48:52.400
But the question is only maybe two weeks later.
00:48:52.960 --> 00:49:03.440
Well, we how many water restrictions are there right now on uh how much water you use it on your you when you have a shower or a tub or brush your teeth or cook with.
00:49:03.760 --> 00:49:04.400
Still zero.
00:49:04.800 --> 00:49:06.480
For uh still zero.
00:49:06.800 --> 00:49:07.119
Still zero.
00:49:08.400 --> 00:49:11.920
For us, though, our restrictions are just like please don't water your lawns in the day, thanks.
00:49:12.719 --> 00:49:13.599
In Qualkazeech.
00:49:13.840 --> 00:49:15.360
Yeah, in Qualcomm Beach, because we just have stage one.
00:49:15.440 --> 00:49:17.840
So beach is definitely a different scenario.
00:49:18.079 --> 00:49:23.360
And I think that's also something that maybe people in Parksville would look at Qualcomm Beach and like, wow, they've look at these green lawns.
00:49:23.599 --> 00:49:23.840
Yeah.
00:49:24.239 --> 00:49:28.559
And and it's it's hard because um and I I know I did an imperfect job today.
00:49:28.719 --> 00:49:34.960
And for folks who maybe don't come away with this with a clear idea of what I was trying to get at, I apologize if that's you know, that's my shortcoming.
00:49:35.039 --> 00:49:38.880
But um I do feel that it is a complex issue in your defense there, Scott.
00:49:39.519 --> 00:49:52.159
But I do feel that there's a bit of an informational void that's um, you know, I I think I'm not trying to critique anyone in Parksville in particular, but I think there's a lot of information that needs to be absorbed to understand why we are where we are.
00:49:52.400 --> 00:49:58.960
And when we don't provide information as local governments, folks will make reasonable inferences based on the information they have.
00:49:59.360 --> 00:50:00.960
There's always room to improve communications.
00:50:01.360 --> 00:50:07.840
And Scott, for yourself, uh never let uh perfection be the enemy of good for whatever you brought to the podcast today.
00:50:08.159 --> 00:50:22.559
Um, all of that being said today, uh I had uh I was gonna go up to Mount Kane, which we go up to kind of every year, and the weekend we had booked up there, it was closed in February at Mount Kane, which typically has great snow.
00:50:22.800 --> 00:50:28.400
And so that's when I really uh started to pay attention to snowpack, and this is the worst snowpack year we've ever had.
00:50:28.480 --> 00:50:33.920
I'd like to see us plan ahead for a zero snowpack year, which I think all of us around the table think that's good planning.
00:50:34.000 --> 00:50:39.280
Uh Shelton and Healy Lakes would provide more upland water storage, is kind of what I lean towards.
00:50:39.519 --> 00:50:42.159
Um and so uh we're paying attention to it.
00:50:42.239 --> 00:50:43.280
It's a complicated issue.
00:50:43.440 --> 00:50:44.960
Communications can definitely be improved.
00:50:45.119 --> 00:50:45.199
Yeah.
00:50:45.440 --> 00:50:47.519
Scott, thank you so much for being on the show today with us.
00:50:47.599 --> 00:50:48.079
We appreciate it.
00:50:48.320 --> 00:50:49.119
Thank you very much, gentlemen.
00:50:49.199 --> 00:50:50.239
I really appreciate being here.
00:50:50.320 --> 00:50:55.280
It's great to be surrounded by uh some very intelligent men who uh work hard for their communications.
00:50:55.599 --> 00:50:57.679
Look his way when you say intelligence, not me.
00:51:01.360 --> 00:51:12.719
Well, yeah, if if you want to go deeper uh with on these issues, the Aerosmith Water Service and Englishman Water River Water Service uh both report publicly through the City of Parksville website.
00:51:12.800 --> 00:51:14.800
So people should know that's parksville.ca.
00:51:15.280 --> 00:51:24.000
Uh and also the RDN has their website with some Team Water Smart uh program information as well for folks that are interested in learning more about these topics.
00:51:24.320 --> 00:51:26.239
And communication can always be improved.
00:51:26.320 --> 00:51:31.760
I'm not reading the script right now, Joel, uh, but part of what we do here on the podcast is to improve that communication.
00:51:31.920 --> 00:51:35.599
We're gonna try to get Murray uh from the RDN on the podcast as well.
00:51:35.760 --> 00:51:36.079
Yep.
00:51:36.239 --> 00:51:38.400
Um, and so that is part of what we do here at the podcast.
00:51:38.559 --> 00:51:40.559
Scott, thank you so much for being on the show.
00:51:40.719 --> 00:51:42.079
Appreciate you making some time for us.
00:51:42.239 --> 00:51:43.440
I appreciate you, gentlemen, very much.
00:51:43.519 --> 00:51:44.000
Thank you so much.
00:51:44.159 --> 00:51:47.199
Until next time, take care of yourself and your community.