Xena (& Gabrielle) The Warrior Princess (with Sara Century)

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[UNKNOWN]: Because we both know I have many skills.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's gonna smell like fish for days.
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[UNKNOWN]: Hello, hi, and how are you?
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[UNKNOWN]: Welcome back to another episode of our adventure.
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[UNKNOWN]: As always, I'm your host, Dr. Caldinance.
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[UNKNOWN]: This is video episode five.
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[UNKNOWN]: Zena, the warrior princess of queer retrospective with Sarah Centrie.
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[UNKNOWN]: Hello, hi, and how are you?
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[UNKNOWN]: Welcome back to another episode of Referential.
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[UNKNOWN]: Thank you so much for listening.
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[UNKNOWN]: I am as always, your many skilled hosts, Dr. Khaled Denaz, and I'm going to keep the pre-ample very short this go around, because this episode is already long enough as you can see on your feed.
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[UNKNOWN]: I am joined by returning guest Sarah Centrie to talk about one of our favorite TV shows of all time, Zina, the Warrior Princess.
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[UNKNOWN]: We offer up a queer retrospective on the 90s TV show as well as a plea for rear praisele, because as we go on to argue and as you will go on to listen,
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[UNKNOWN]: really, really, really, really think that you should give it a shot if you haven't already.
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[UNKNOWN]: So, without much further ado, I give you Zina and Gabrielle, the warrior princess with Sarah Century.
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[UNKNOWN]: I will catch you back here at the end, um, enjoy.
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[UNKNOWN]: Sarah's entry on with me.
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[UNKNOWN]: We are here.
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[UNKNOWN]: Okay, I'm not actually gonna end out.
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[UNKNOWN]: So we're gonna start with the basics cuz just like we could backstage Just before we hit record.
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[UNKNOWN]: I was just having a little slight panic attack about like I don't know how we're gonna do this There's so much I want to say there's so much to say but we'll get to that first of all Sarah.
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[UNKNOWN]: Hi.
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[UNKNOWN]: How are you?
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[UNKNOWN]: I'm great, and I'm sure we'll find many, many meandering thoughts about Zina, because that's what we're here to talk about today.
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[UNKNOWN]: Nobody ever invites me anywhere to talk about Zina.
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[UNKNOWN]: People are usually like, please stop talking about Zina.
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[UNKNOWN]: So this is like, I've dreamed of this day.
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[UNKNOWN]: I think it is.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's been long in the world.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's like I've been very excited.
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[UNKNOWN]: I was looking back at like the blue sky thread that when I was live watching Zena and responding to it and then like it was seven months ago when I said okay I will have Sarah sentry on to talk about this and we agreed on this.
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[UNKNOWN]: So it's been a second.
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[UNKNOWN]: This is something we were talking about yesterday about how like we are those kinds of people who like we have a plan but it must be perfect and then it will take us forever to get this
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but I mentioned that to mention you a no Sarah obviously she was a previous guess.
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[UNKNOWN]: She came along to talk about the sorry I need to double check your pros are she They right she heard but yeah, I'm oh she heard totally chill with a yeah, cool, and I'm whatever you want I truly don't care
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[UNKNOWN]: We had her on a few episodes by a year ago or so today where we're talking about Agatha all along and I Featured on her podcast best issue ever to talk about Wonder Woman issue.
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[UNKNOWN]: I want to say 32 maybe maybe not Mindy mayor So we've got to think it's just you know what read from 20 to 32 actually of George Perez run that is our recommendation always
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, we definitely say that in the episode.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, so that was our little crossover.
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[UNKNOWN]: And now we decided to bring it back.
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[UNKNOWN]: We're doing another crossover.
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[UNKNOWN]: I just featured on Best Issue Ever yesterday we recorded the episode, but we were talking about Angela and Sarah from Marvel, Angela Asgardisassin.
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[UNKNOWN]: And in return, I feel like I tricked Sarah.
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[UNKNOWN]: I was like, you know what we're gonna do.
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[UNKNOWN]: You have to come in here and maybe talk to me for six hours.
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[UNKNOWN]: Oh no, it's my greatest dream come true.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, and we connected over this because I will obviously I knew you probably liked you know, but like I didn't know you're love for it until I Radically decided to rewatch it a few months back just like all the binge.
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[UNKNOWN]: I sometimes love a big bench, and Zena was like something that I had a slight memory of liking as a child
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[UNKNOWN]: And I knew of its status as like a cult classic, but it was always something I wanted to return to and I attempted to like a few years back, but I wasn't ready.
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[UNKNOWN]: And then you and I, I'm trying to remember which was the episode of Post.
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[UNKNOWN]: I think it was when I was like, okay, it took me 21 episodes to like Gabrielle.
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[UNKNOWN]: And I think you were like, that's correct.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, she's annoying.
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[UNKNOWN]: But soon she will be the hero you need.
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[UNKNOWN]: Let's maybe start there at the basics, then tell me about your relationship to see that.
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[UNKNOWN]: Why do you look?
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[UNKNOWN]: Actually, you know what, maybe before you do that.
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[UNKNOWN]: Tell me how are you?
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[UNKNOWN]: I wanna know what's going on with you.
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[UNKNOWN]: He's going on with Best Issue, however.
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[UNKNOWN]: Fuck that, fuck that guy, whoever said that.
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[UNKNOWN]: He wasn't real.
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[UNKNOWN]: He was going on with you.
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[UNKNOWN]: Tell me what Best Issue, everyone you have stored up.
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[UNKNOWN]: Let's come in up.
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[UNKNOWN]: I know you're also writing a comic right now.
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[UNKNOWN]: That looks to go.
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[UNKNOWN]: I want you to plug that from the start.
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[UNKNOWN]: We have to talk about it.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, that's correct.
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[UNKNOWN]: I do so many things.
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[UNKNOWN]: So I just not too long ago released a Z.
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[UNKNOWN]: And I do a lot of Z.
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[UNKNOWN]: And one of which just now was the Hitchcock Z. I basically just talk about 13 different Hitchcock movies in a few episodes of his show.
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[UNKNOWN]: I loved it.
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[UNKNOWN]: I love writing about movies.
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[UNKNOWN]: I have also done one about lesbian vampires which will come up today and then before that I get one on the screen franchise Which is going to get a new printing through microcosm sometime around October I believe so fortunately some of them are getting published by other people I do still have copies of it with the original handmade cover So if anybody wants to pick those up go to my website.
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[UNKNOWN]: You'll find the links
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[UNKNOWN]: I do the Forgotten Five with Alex Segura, which is a superhero comic kind of independent style, and we tried to do long-form storytelling with that.
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[UNKNOWN]: So that's been kind of a wild ride.
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[UNKNOWN]: We had to start with web comics because we weren't getting a ton of publisher interests that we found to be workable like we want to do this long-term, and so finding anybody to like back a long-term comic is not easy in 2020, so it's right, like you get five or like you know.
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[UNKNOWN]: Maybe ten.
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[UNKNOWN]: Exactly.
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[UNKNOWN]: So we were like, well we don't want to do that.
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[UNKNOWN]: We want to get characters that people can actually invest in.
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[UNKNOWN]: So we did.
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[UNKNOWN]: So there's that that's patreon.com slash the forgotten five if you want to follow that.
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[UNKNOWN]: And then of course I have the best issue ever podcast, which I'm sure you listen to this podcast.
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[UNKNOWN]: You were on their talking about Wonder Woman as we mentioned, so there's those things and then there's a bunch of things besides I do photo video work, so I'm constantly working on projects, I'm working on the documentary and then whenever I finish that I'm doing another documentary, those are like self-funded projects, you can if you live in the Midwest, hire me to do things that are paperwork, but I do a lot of personal projects too just to keep my skills like raise a shot.
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[UNKNOWN]: I have many skills.
06:46.871 --> 06:53.156
[UNKNOWN]: And my rabbit is by my feet right now, so, I just, my feet, because she was just staring up at me.
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[UNKNOWN]: Like, where are you talking about?
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[UNKNOWN]: I have rabbit.
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[UNKNOWN]: There's an eddy have rabbits and a cat or two and it's all three cats and it's very lovely.
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[UNKNOWN]: I was going to say, and there was also has been discussion of Zina Zina in the work someday.
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[UNKNOWN]: Thank you so much for bringing that up.
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[UNKNOWN]: I forget the things that I'm doing, so yeah, I'm doing a bunch of X-Men Zians right now, actually as well.
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[UNKNOWN]: So I'm working on that and I've been doing a lot of research.
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[UNKNOWN]: I've been bouncing between like three Zians.
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[UNKNOWN]: So it's kind of hard to tell which one's going to be the next one.
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[UNKNOWN]: The other one is like a Liz Taylor Zian doesn't see
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[UNKNOWN]: I would like that one.
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[UNKNOWN]: I would like that one.
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[UNKNOWN]: So I was having a discussion in the other day about Elizabeth Taylor and just like the idea of her femininity and then the girlhood and then also the annoyingness, you know, just like she's very annoying and the same way the way that all like meshed up into this weird star persona.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
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[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I love her.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and she gets so weird.
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[UNKNOWN]: I think the thing with her is is that she was such a star that it is Her point like when she gets away from MGM and she's just making her own decisions She makes the wildest choices anybody has ever made like some of her movies One of our last few great stars, her easiest secret these really just came out there like after while god bless her
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, weird old movie is in the 70s.
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[UNKNOWN]: You're just like lady, but I have a great time And actually I just got finished watching her in the taming of the shrew which I had avoided for a long time because of obvious reasons perhaps Yeah, but I Watch it and I was like she's so goddamn punk in this movie this rock.
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[UNKNOWN]: So I don't know.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's actually really good even times where I'm like I don't know if I could watch that I want to
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[UNKNOWN]: even one of the last emovis that she was in and I was just like as a child, she's clearly like incredible in everything she's in.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, that's something we're just like magnetic.
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[UNKNOWN]: I remember, so we took me to like the Hacksploitation kind of era of Betty Davis's career.
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[UNKNOWN]: Love Hacksploitation.
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[UNKNOWN]: Truly troll John Crawford got bless you.
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[UNKNOWN]: What does that movie she did like very late or wrong when she was just like an evil nanny Did I ring out there something or like it was like talking to these movies like we did late or on in her career That's when we're watching.
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[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I'll look into the notes at some point as an evil hag You like that was always really fun, but everybody got in on it almost we got a Shelley Winters Whoever slew on TV.
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[UNKNOWN]: That's a really good stupid movie
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[UNKNOWN]: Hexploitation is fun, like a lot of people got one.
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[UNKNOWN]: I honestly like Amy Madigan today is the contender for the Oscar, and that's a Hexploitation film.
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[UNKNOWN]: Let me come on out.
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[UNKNOWN]: That's right, that's right.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's a great one.
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[UNKNOWN]: She's fantastic in it and got down there.
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[UNKNOWN]: There you go.
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[UNKNOWN]: Give it genre film and Oscar.
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[UNKNOWN]: You won't, but it's fun.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, shout out to sinners.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, shout out to sinners, my god.
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[UNKNOWN]: Delay, what a movie.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, I'm glad you're doing well.
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[UNKNOWN]: I meant you were talking earlier about also how like you're moving house.
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[UNKNOWN]: You're looking for a place to say are you looking for a place And I am also similarly looking at my boxes right now.
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[UNKNOWN]: I'm gonna be moving home So you might be the last podcast that record before I move you're in my gosh.
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[UNKNOWN]: I know you can so if you hear it the sounds of the streets It's my house saying goodbye to all
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[UNKNOWN]: Oh, yeah, but I understand that stress everything just seems like all of a sudden is up in the air and like I have to just find a way to make it make sense So I can totally yeah, it's hard because it's like people have done this before right like people do this But it does get very difficult, especially when you have pets and stuff like I know you have a cat Oh, I don't know if like Alaska a queen in LA
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[UNKNOWN]: Um, but I think that it gets a little bit more difficult.
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[UNKNOWN]: And you've got lives depending on you at that point.
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[UNKNOWN]: So that makes it a little bit more stressful.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I'm just like trying to make sense of the other day.
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[UNKNOWN]: I almost had a breakdown because I have to figure out the council tax situation.
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[UNKNOWN]: I was just like, I don't know what this is.
10:41.668 --> 10:42.949
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know how I did this before.
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[UNKNOWN]: And I have to do it again.
10:43.890 --> 10:45.271
[UNKNOWN]: I did eventually figure it out.
10:45.311 --> 10:48.293
[UNKNOWN]: Basically, I just need to like call Victor who for this recording.
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[UNKNOWN]: I have trapped in a seller somewhere to get him as far away from us as possible.
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[UNKNOWN]: And I just have to have him calm me down and be like, okay, this is how you do something.
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[UNKNOWN]: Like a human being, you stupid stuff.
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[UNKNOWN]: Sorry, though, I'm just watching Zena is at the moment, straddling bakas for those who don't know.
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[UNKNOWN]: I decided to put on the free VTV Pluto TV station, which is airing Zena 247, and we're at a really weird point of season.
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[UNKNOWN]: I think six.
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[UNKNOWN]: or five or whatever it is.
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[UNKNOWN]: Interesting, interesting, Lucy Lawless cannot dance.
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[UNKNOWN]: God bless her.
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[UNKNOWN]: That's not a gift.
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[UNKNOWN]: And she doesn't have to.
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[UNKNOWN]: They put her in a belly shirt and let her go.
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[UNKNOWN]: That's all we did, really.
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[UNKNOWN]: But okay, like we said earlier, you are here today, specifically to talk to me about Zina, the Warrior Princess, a television show that premiered in 1995, created by Rob Tappert and the Sam Ramey.
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[UNKNOWN]: And then I think later on, R.J.
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[UNKNOWN]: I want to say Stewart.
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[UNKNOWN]: came on as a executive producer, and then it featured the talents of people like Naila Dixon, who was a customer, and Liz Friedman, who was a writer, and just many, many more.
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[UNKNOWN]: Some of these names that I mentioned, you might have heard of because they went on to create
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[UNKNOWN]: a footprint in the film and television industry.
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[UNKNOWN]: Now, I digs in, obviously, as the customer, who we might know, from accepting and Oscar on stage for Lord of the Rings, the amount of people who loaded the rings, a pill for it from Zina.
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[UNKNOWN]: I think there was something in the research of this, which I wanna actually make sure to shout out just wanderings as Zina video, which was really helpful to get me like, properly refresh on this series as I was preparing for this episode.
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[UNKNOWN]: But it really like struck me the way the impact that the show has had on the industry and the way that it's really not credited for it.
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[UNKNOWN]: But tell me before we get into all of that, what is your relationship with Zina?
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[UNKNOWN]: Where did you come across it?
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[UNKNOWN]: And what does it mean to you today?
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[UNKNOWN]: So I would have been about 12 years old whenever Zina first hit the air.
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[UNKNOWN]: So at that time, I cannot emphasize enough how much there was not anything like it to Hercules is about as close as you would get.
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[UNKNOWN]: But that was obviously a very male centric show.
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[UNKNOWN]: They even considered not doing as Zina show.
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[UNKNOWN]: Their first pitch for a follow-up was Jason and the goddamned Argonauts.
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[UNKNOWN]: Can you believe how shitty the world would be if we had gotten that instead of Zina?
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[UNKNOWN]: But Zina tested through the roof.
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[UNKNOWN]: She was introduced to her Achilles as a villain, so that was even a little bit earlier than I was 12.
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[UNKNOWN]: I got to see that, but she was reintroduced via her own show.
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[UNKNOWN]: And to me, I mean, I'm gay, I think I should mention that right now.
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[UNKNOWN]: Let's get that out of the way.
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[UNKNOWN]: She's going to be a queer episode with a queer perspective on Zina and you're welcome because I had a look through the podcast archives And there's not many of that.
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[UNKNOWN]: So here we go Seriously, I do wonder sometimes I'm like, uh, no, I don't know.
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[UNKNOWN]: I don't want to go too far and be like, why are you podcasting about Zina?
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[UNKNOWN]: My beloved Zina and it's just like well you should but I also am like, yeah You would think that way more queer people would be the ones
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[UNKNOWN]: Still covering it because most people who I know who have actually taken the time to watch Zina are queer people for sure That's kind of a bin diagram of my interest my friends interests and like yeah Network TV of the 90s, but is a groundbreaking show I think at this time it was I believe from what I remember This was like the highest drinking show.
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[UNKNOWN]: I remember watching this in an interview
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[UNKNOWN]: Like during the time it was some late night interview.
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[UNKNOWN]: I don't know how true that is I've not been able to confirm it because kind of looking over TV records of that time is not super easy I guess yeah, yeah, but I would say that by the end of it's for a season It had overtaken her killies in the rating.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yes, I saw like oh that was just Kevin Sorbo that was a shot at you directly.
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[UNKNOWN]: I just want you to know And now he's like this
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[UNKNOWN]: Surely, it is the inciting incident.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's so funny.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's a story.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
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[UNKNOWN]: Anyway, we got it.
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[UNKNOWN]: I do think for a while it was extremely successful.
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[UNKNOWN]: At least for those first three seasons, it was really up there in the ratings.
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[UNKNOWN]: But I can't confirm that.
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[UNKNOWN]: Maybe future college will pop in here and tell you guys.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I think at a certain point it had overtaken Baywatch and that's huge and the 90's because that was globally like the most watch show for a really long time.
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[UNKNOWN]: And you know, those episodes are still available for you to watch today.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, they are very accessible.
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[UNKNOWN]: Well, Zena is, I think, extremely difficult to get a hold of.
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[UNKNOWN]: And I really do wonder why that is.
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[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, for a while, it like existed in some streaming channels.
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[UNKNOWN]: They're not that early on.
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[UNKNOWN]: It's like in the tens.
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[UNKNOWN]: And then it just sort of like seemed to have disappeared the closer we got now.
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[UNKNOWN]: And it's really hard to track down.
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[UNKNOWN]: I don't really know why that is.
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[UNKNOWN]: I think there is like maybe we should get into this now because I think this is a good point to talk about like the legacy of Zina perhaps because I think something that was going to pick up on what you were saying is that it's the queer people in your circle who you know hold that show in reverence or have given it the chance today to watch it.
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[UNKNOWN]: And I think as I was looking at just the research and all the writings about Zina, it was mainly like Zina took a place within queer academia that I think was really interesting that's working with pop culture studies not show remain being talked about to today and I think there's like a queer academic sort of bent that's also like keeping that alive.
16:19.406 --> 16:24.750
[UNKNOWN]: I know that there was a Zina conference I think last year and a book was released collecting some of the work about that.
16:24.850 --> 16:25.210
[UNKNOWN]: So, you
16:25.210 --> 16:31.376
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's interesting that it has managed to maintain at a certain point when I was watching the season I was looking back at some of the things that I wrote down.
16:31.616 --> 16:37.883
[UNKNOWN]: And I was like wondering if the closest comparison I can make to Zena is obviously buffier.
16:38.798 --> 16:43.943
[UNKNOWN]: But Buffy's position in the culture today is so very different than Zina.
16:44.123 --> 16:49.308
[UNKNOWN]: And I really wonder if that's because Buffy has more of a heterosexual bent to it.
16:49.588 --> 17:00.578
[UNKNOWN]: And if the queerness of Zina kind of took it out of contention and also all the other kind of like sort of sandal camp signifiers had kind of like taken away from like these critics who are doing retrospectives about these TV shows.
17:00.698 --> 17:01.198
[UNKNOWN]: And then what do you see?
17:01.218 --> 17:05.860
[UNKNOWN]: They're like willing to forgive the camp of Buffy, I guess.
17:05.940 --> 17:08.921
[UNKNOWN]: Like the kind of silly 90s camp that you see there.
17:09.081 --> 17:13.623
[UNKNOWN]: But they don't seem to really be willing to extend that to Zina for the most part.
17:13.983 --> 17:17.765
[UNKNOWN]: And I find that to be pretty silly because the camp is fun.
17:17.905 --> 17:19.546
[UNKNOWN]: And like, here's the thing about this show.
17:19.646 --> 17:20.226
[UNKNOWN]: It's funny.
17:20.466 --> 17:22.527
[UNKNOWN]: It pokes fun in itself all of the time.
17:22.787 --> 17:29.092
[UNKNOWN]: Every chance it gets frankly like it has whole episodes that are just funny humor episodes.
17:29.332 --> 17:33.776
[UNKNOWN]: I don't think that this is a show that takes itself seriously and I think that that's really nice.
17:33.996 --> 17:45.825
[UNKNOWN]: It has very serious moments, but overall, as much as it's kind of like a bleak subject matter because of this story of a woman who's committed atrocities and she must go on her redemption cycle.
17:46.245 --> 17:52.886
[UNKNOWN]: It is also, it's more down to earth than that most of the time and I think that that's kind of what saves it.
17:53.046 --> 18:00.668
[UNKNOWN]: I also think it's just honestly way more well made than people have ever given it credit for people say it's silly people say that it's cheesy.
18:00.688 --> 18:04.129
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know that latter fight with coolest young things.
18:04.249 --> 18:08.409
[UNKNOWN]: If you're watching wuxia films like why is this a deal breaker?
18:08.489 --> 18:10.490
[UNKNOWN]: This stuff's fun, like why?
18:11.030 --> 18:11.590
[UNKNOWN]: Why don't you like it?
18:11.590 --> 18:13.391
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, I think it's a huge credit to Zeta.
18:13.671 --> 18:17.934
[UNKNOWN]: This don't work in district as it exists today, largely exists because of Zena.
18:18.014 --> 18:24.818
[UNKNOWN]: I think that is something that people have directly credited to Zena, just because of the stunt work and the innovations of the fighting choreography.
18:25.018 --> 18:40.546
[UNKNOWN]: And even like the shooting of that choreography and bringing all those techniques of Hong Kong we should film to the modern day, but then adapting them with more, like the Western filmmaking practices and creating something new, that had a ripple effect, that like this contactress
18:41.547 --> 18:43.549
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, you know, and when I was working.
18:43.609 --> 18:45.690
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, truly revolutionized the industry.
18:45.790 --> 18:47.932
[UNKNOWN]: Lord of the Rings would not have happened without Zena.
18:48.072 --> 18:56.478
[UNKNOWN]: Aside from the fact that it was in New Zealand, a lot of the talent in Zena, which I think we were first earlier went on to Lord of the Rings to work on that project.
18:56.899 --> 19:00.281
[UNKNOWN]: The impact that it has had, like the material, actual impact.
19:00.501 --> 19:05.365
[UNKNOWN]: I think is like really under-discussed, under-appreciate, under-recognized.
19:05.465 --> 19:10.829
[UNKNOWN]: I think you're totally right that it's because there is such a strong queer read of them.
19:11.029 --> 19:14.732
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that, honestly, to this day, people are pretty uncomfortable with it.
19:14.792 --> 19:20.816
[UNKNOWN]: Like, they want to have, like, Buffy's attached to it, dude, like, throughout the entirety of Buffy.
19:20.896 --> 19:26.280
[UNKNOWN]: Like, there's moments where she goes through break-ups, but she's never really single all that often.
19:26.360 --> 19:27.941
[UNKNOWN]: It doesn't really happen.
19:28.321 --> 19:30.623
[UNKNOWN]: It's like glimpses, but not for long.
19:30.943 --> 19:40.887
[UNKNOWN]: And so she's kind of always connected to someone who in my opinion often is dragging her down like what else does Riley do, but drag this woman down, right?
19:41.367 --> 19:45.269
[UNKNOWN]: It's just kind of angel too, put angel on the bucket too.
19:46.149 --> 19:51.014
[UNKNOWN]: Angel who's like your 30 year old boyfriend, you know, like this just, it's all weird.
19:51.334 --> 19:52.575
[UNKNOWN]: But I mean, it's fine.
19:52.595 --> 19:52.975
[UNKNOWN]: Whatever.
19:53.055 --> 19:53.616
[UNKNOWN]: It's buffy.
19:53.716 --> 19:58.300
[UNKNOWN]: And like I don't want to use this as an example to air the things that I don't like about buffy.
19:58.320 --> 20:05.527
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but I do think that there's something about like the fact that even if you don't do a sapphic read of them.
20:05.787 --> 20:14.271
[UNKNOWN]: you would have to say, well, this is like a very strong platonic relationship that takes precedence over a romantic relationship.
20:14.411 --> 20:20.373
[UNKNOWN]: And then if you were going to read them as straight, they still don't give too much a fuck about the men, right?
20:20.473 --> 20:26.236
[UNKNOWN]: So like, I think that all of those things kind of make them be too challenging for a lot of
20:26.376 --> 20:26.757
[UNKNOWN]: people.
20:27.037 --> 20:29.540
[UNKNOWN]: And I know that people would argue with me, right?
20:29.580 --> 20:46.758
[UNKNOWN]: Like it's like if you said this and you were like you just don't like it because it's so gay Like people will argue with you, but it's like kind of I think you're right like I Did women and women like even if we take the gay thing, I think like you were saying it's worth underlining that which is that they're women
20:47.038 --> 20:48.700
[UNKNOWN]: Also, it's a story about two women.
20:48.820 --> 20:52.002
[UNKNOWN]: They're at the center of every single episode, even one of those words.
20:52.183 --> 20:53.784
[UNKNOWN]: It's just like that's the center of story.
20:53.804 --> 20:58.188
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that is something that people like to describe it or like to ignore it like to overlook.
20:58.448 --> 20:58.648
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
20:58.728 --> 21:03.713
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know where I actually picked this up, but there's a bit of a controversy apparently with a Zina community a few years back.
21:03.873 --> 21:22.637
[UNKNOWN]: because there was a list of, I think lesbian romances or queer female lead romances in television and Zena was excluded from there and then the author made a note of that fact by saying Zena was excluded because they don't give credits to subtext or to writers who didn't have the balls to take it there.
21:22.717 --> 21:25.158
[UNKNOWN]: This was obviously a someone who didn't watch Zena, I think.
21:25.218 --> 21:26.018
[UNKNOWN]: I didn't understand that.
21:26.038 --> 21:27.058
[UNKNOWN]: This is how I feel.
21:27.178 --> 21:37.842
[UNKNOWN]: Is I think that it's one of those things where people now couldn't possibly have the time even have the concept that subtext would be a necessary thing because there were no queer characters on TV.
21:37.862 --> 21:43.004
[UNKNOWN]: There were, but literally, you have books that will compile the queer characters.
21:43.084 --> 21:46.525
[UNKNOWN]: They go back decades and decades to get a book links cover.
21:47.005 --> 21:47.485
[UNKNOWN]: It's right.
21:47.505 --> 21:49.487
[UNKNOWN]: I'll give you a brief rundown actually right now.
21:49.527 --> 22:04.058
[UNKNOWN]: This Zena came out nine years before the L word Yeah, if you want to use that as like a metric willing grace was I believe Ellen coming out was I think three years after Zena and at the point Ellen was being blacklisted in the industry.
22:04.218 --> 22:13.285
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, then there was let me think the I think the first on air female Let's be in romantic kiss had happened in the early 90s.
22:13.345 --> 22:15.487
[UNKNOWN]: I think about three or four years prior to Zena
22:15.827 --> 22:17.968
[UNKNOWN]: on I want to say LA Law or LA District.
22:18.328 --> 22:20.389
[UNKNOWN]: There was also, I forget what it is.
22:20.489 --> 22:21.550
[UNKNOWN]: Be a little rosanne.
22:21.710 --> 22:22.630
[UNKNOWN]: Rosanne happened.
22:22.730 --> 22:24.511
[UNKNOWN]: I believe Mary was hitting me.
22:24.831 --> 22:25.051
[UNKNOWN]: Mm-hmm.
22:25.111 --> 22:33.555
[UNKNOWN]: There was a scene where Rosanne was kissing another woman and that episode aired with a disclaimer to audiences two, three years before Zena ever came on air.
22:33.755 --> 22:36.756
[UNKNOWN]: So like, it wasn't just that there were no queer characters.
22:36.956 --> 22:37.777
[UNKNOWN]: They were not allowed.
22:38.277 --> 22:58.372
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, there was no queerness allowed on television that was like a censorship thing going importantly Liz Friedman is out lesbian and was at the time and so you have somebody who's working behind the scenes and you also have script writers who if not queer themselves were very very receptive and embracing of the queer subjects.
22:58.492 --> 23:08.098
[UNKNOWN]: So I think that that's all important because I think people go, oh, well, it's not actually gay and it's just like, it is though, like, I don't know.
23:08.118 --> 23:09.618
[UNKNOWN]: I have a hard time with that.
23:09.658 --> 23:13.120
[UNKNOWN]: People will give me shit and be like, oh, it's so subtextual.
23:13.341 --> 23:24.467
[UNKNOWN]: And I'm like, how subtextual is the ring where literally Zina has to save Gabrielle's life by kissing her and like waking her up as if her prints, right?
23:24.587 --> 23:25.287
[UNKNOWN]: Or like, how?
23:25.307 --> 23:27.849
[UNKNOWN]: They call each other so many frequently on the show.
23:27.989 --> 23:29.410
[UNKNOWN]: They have a soulmate theme.
23:30.130 --> 23:33.992
[UNKNOWN]: They're literally talking about, I mean, they always take baths together.
23:34.012 --> 23:38.075
[UNKNOWN]: There's many jokes if there's no heterosexual explanation for this.
23:38.475 --> 23:38.915
[UNKNOWN]: Agreed.
23:39.155 --> 23:45.378
[UNKNOWN]: But there's also just like so much to the relationship that it's like at a certain point.
23:45.559 --> 23:46.759
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, the Sappho.
23:46.859 --> 23:51.122
[UNKNOWN]: Zina goes, I have to get Gabrielle this poem from Sappho for her birthday.
23:51.162 --> 23:52.502
[UNKNOWN]: It's her favorite poem.
23:53.883 --> 23:55.924
[UNKNOWN]: It's affordable for me and I believe in Cena.
23:56.064 --> 23:59.224
[UNKNOWN]: There's a moment when I look at you and no speeches left in me.
23:59.264 --> 24:00.084
[UNKNOWN]: My tongue breaks.
24:00.305 --> 24:06.586
[UNKNOWN]: Then fire races under my skin and I tremble and grow pale, for I'm dying of such a love, or so it's.
24:06.646 --> 24:08.146
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, that's not it.
24:08.186 --> 24:12.187
[UNKNOWN]: It wasn't even attempting to just come across close to the line to titulate.
24:12.247 --> 24:13.968
[UNKNOWN]: It never felt like that to me.
24:13.988 --> 24:21.530
[UNKNOWN]: I think that maybe because of the trappings of the show as a fantasy sci-fi during the early 90s, women were being dressed to be palatable for the male gaze.
24:21.730 --> 24:23.650
[UNKNOWN]: A lot of the show was being shot through the male gaze.
24:23.910 --> 24:38.928
[UNKNOWN]: You know, I think in the history of the show there has been only two women directors maybe three and all of its episodes You know, it's not uncommon for the time on the but yeah, yes, we were talking about this earlier Like there is a lot of things happening in the zena stew that can be read as problematic
24:39.108 --> 24:50.613
[UNKNOWN]: But I'd always resist that idea of subtext as not being as valid as main text, especially because given the restrictions of the time, this is the only way the story could exist in this way.
24:50.813 --> 25:01.797
[UNKNOWN]: So I just think of it as a revolutionary feat to be able to do it in a way where you have managed to make the romantic aspect of these two's relationship in arguable without tripping the sensors.
25:01.957 --> 25:03.678
[UNKNOWN]: There's something truly artful about that.
25:03.758 --> 25:09.820
[UNKNOWN]: And I think this is coming for me as a perspective from someone who comes from a specific culture where the censorship is so heavy, though.
25:09.860 --> 25:13.341
[UNKNOWN]: The subtext in queer relationships is non-existent.
25:13.381 --> 25:15.782
[UNKNOWN]: The subtext in our opinion is not existent.
25:15.802 --> 25:18.143
[UNKNOWN]: So I see how artful the management of it is.
25:18.283 --> 25:19.403
[UNKNOWN]: I see that as almost a feature.
25:19.603 --> 25:20.663
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, it's wild.
25:20.723 --> 25:25.645
[UNKNOWN]: It's like, okay, so like, it's problematic to watch things before the year 2000 or something.
25:25.705 --> 25:29.046
[UNKNOWN]: Like, I don't quite understand what the point of that is.
25:29.166 --> 25:41.109
[UNKNOWN]: I also find it to be really strange because of its incredible influence on slash thick and like fan fiction and how that series that affair between those two.
25:41.309 --> 25:43.451
[UNKNOWN]: really comes to life in fan fiction.
25:43.511 --> 25:46.573
[UNKNOWN]: You know, you get to see so much of their relationship.
25:46.733 --> 25:50.075
[UNKNOWN]: And so whenever I was a kid, I'd watch Zina obviously.
25:50.175 --> 25:55.179
[UNKNOWN]: And then I would read a lot of this fan fiction, often it's very erotic, but not always.
25:55.439 --> 25:58.861
[UNKNOWN]: But as a young queer person, what the hell else was there for me, right?
25:58.961 --> 26:02.364
[UNKNOWN]: So there is this incredible gateway that this series opened.
26:02.584 --> 26:06.725
[UNKNOWN]: I often don't really know how to separate myself entirely from this series.
26:06.785 --> 26:13.787
[UNKNOWN]: It's like finding the X-Men where it's like, I don't really know who I'd be now if I didn't love this so much, right?
26:13.827 --> 26:20.709
[UNKNOWN]: Like, I loved it so much as a kid whenever I was struggling to have hope or anything in my life, right?
26:20.789 --> 26:23.410
[UNKNOWN]: So finding stuff like this was really important.
26:23.610 --> 26:35.539
[UNKNOWN]: That's why I always find it to be strange when people are just like, oh, but it's all subtext and it's just like, I don't know that it is gang like we're going to talk about some real gayship like this.
26:35.699 --> 26:37.821
[UNKNOWN]: I think let's talk about that again.
26:37.961 --> 26:48.810
[UNKNOWN]: I think because like what you were saying really describes, I think how much of service Zena was for the queer community because like this is one way that you met other queer women, you know?
26:48.910 --> 26:49.430
[UNKNOWN]: You were even that
26:49.550 --> 26:51.011
[UNKNOWN]: they existed at all.
26:51.031 --> 26:56.494
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, because I had been living in rural Missouri and then I was living in Fort Collins, Colorado.
26:56.655 --> 27:05.460
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, Fort Collins is a bigger city now than it was, but like, these were not happening places where people weren't gonna hate crime.
27:05.480 --> 27:11.744
[UNKNOWN]: You're as, you know, like, and I know that we have a lot of similar problems and different problems today, right?
27:11.824 --> 27:17.708
[UNKNOWN]: But it's also just like the fact that we collectively kind of know that queer people exist,
27:17.948 --> 27:18.148
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
27:18.168 --> 27:20.811
[UNKNOWN]: But doesn't I totally different realm than where I was at?
27:20.871 --> 27:21.551
[UNKNOWN]: It's a good.
27:21.571 --> 27:21.792
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
27:21.972 --> 27:23.613
[UNKNOWN]: Not as a shift in paradigm.
27:23.653 --> 27:27.116
[UNKNOWN]: People, I think, talk mockingly about the quote-unquote glee effect, which I do.
27:27.277 --> 27:27.917
[UNKNOWN]: It's not a thing.
27:27.957 --> 27:31.480
[UNKNOWN]: But like that list, it's, you know, the world was different before.
27:31.520 --> 27:33.342
[UNKNOWN]: Well, in grace, it was different before.
27:33.362 --> 27:33.582
[UNKNOWN]: It glee.
27:33.602 --> 27:34.103
[UNKNOWN]: People did it.
27:34.183 --> 27:35.264
[UNKNOWN]: No creepy people existed.
27:35.284 --> 27:35.404
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
27:35.584 --> 27:38.086
[UNKNOWN]: There was no, there was no language for it.
27:38.106 --> 27:40.008
[UNKNOWN]: There was no imagination for it.
27:40.108 --> 27:43.191
[UNKNOWN]: So something like Xeno performed such a great service.
27:43.231 --> 27:44.352
[UNKNOWN]: And also like physically.
27:44.492 --> 27:55.759
[UNKNOWN]: materially, there were xenoconventions, you know, this was a culture that spawned a fan of that was extremely fervent and that also wanted to connect with one another because of the queerness of it.
27:55.879 --> 28:00.142
[UNKNOWN]: And it established queer communities truly physically to this day.
28:00.422 --> 28:06.245
[UNKNOWN]: And that is a feat that not many other TV shows period can say they achieved that.
28:06.285 --> 28:08.647
[UNKNOWN]: That is something you can say start corrected that, right?
28:08.847 --> 28:11.849
[UNKNOWN]: Like maybe Star Wars kind of did that, but like
28:13.908 --> 28:14.689
[UNKNOWN]: I don't really agree.
28:14.809 --> 28:18.532
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, I think the Zina doesn't get the credit it deserves.
28:18.713 --> 28:21.896
[UNKNOWN]: I just also think it's really well scripted for the most part.
28:21.996 --> 28:26.400
[UNKNOWN]: People definitely don't give it any credit for that either, but the dialogues incredible.
28:26.500 --> 28:33.206
[UNKNOWN]: There are so many lines that these two speak that either just stay with me forever because of how heart felt they are or
28:33.987 --> 28:50.380
[UNKNOWN]: because of how silly and funny they are like there's just so many quotable moments in this show and I don't know I do always find it kind of rough that people don't show it more affection just based on the fact that A. I have so much affection for this show like I'm carrying a lot.
28:51.281 --> 28:52.642
[UNKNOWN]: for everybody on that.
28:52.782 --> 28:54.202
[UNKNOWN]: Affection, it is good.
28:54.422 --> 29:04.847
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I also just want to make a point when you mentioned the writing, it may be think about how, another, I think, big feature of the show is where it occupies, just in terms of the context of the time in television.
29:05.027 --> 29:20.693
[UNKNOWN]: It starts off as a non-serialized, almost just episode of the week monster of the week show, that ends up turning into one that incorporates a serialized long-form storyline, and that was in response to the shift of the culture of television, where that was starting to happen.
29:21.053 --> 29:21.494
[UNKNOWN]: media.
29:21.594 --> 29:26.458
[UNKNOWN]: And so you can see it also adapting and changing itself as part of that evolution in TV.
29:26.558 --> 29:29.961
[UNKNOWN]: And I think, yeah, it straddles that boundary in the history of television.
29:30.002 --> 29:36.948
[UNKNOWN]: So it makes for like a really fascinating case when you see how like the writer has managed to shape their story in their world to like the new format of the medium.
29:36.968 --> 29:57.987
[UNKNOWN]: Totally the way that they did syndication was unheard of like this was a whole new realm as far as TV went They made these shows and then they were like go ahead and license them from us So local networks would individually license them and so they'd have something to fill certain hours of TV Which is why you can watch xenon Saturdays or like whatever right?
29:58.127 --> 30:02.952
[UNKNOWN]: So that kind of syndication was brand new too people all of a sudden and really once again
30:03.192 --> 30:12.919
[UNKNOWN]: rural areas could access this TV series that normally would have been on something like USA or TNT, something you needed like a cable subscription for.
30:13.099 --> 30:19.943
[UNKNOWN]: So like weirdly again, like as a really, really poor kid, like this was something that actually was accessible to me.
30:20.124 --> 30:26.328
[UNKNOWN]: And it's impossible for me to even put full words to how influential this was.
30:26.848 --> 30:27.429
[UNKNOWN]: in my life.
30:27.629 --> 30:28.630
[UNKNOWN]: Like I loved this.
30:28.730 --> 30:30.091
[UNKNOWN]: I still love this today.
30:30.111 --> 30:33.754
[UNKNOWN]: You know, we can engage with a lot of the complicated aspects of it.
30:33.854 --> 30:41.541
[UNKNOWN]: But it never makes me not love the show because I think you've mentioned how really kind of pure hearted it is for the most part.
30:41.681 --> 30:43.603
[UNKNOWN]: I would say that there's certain exceptions.
30:44.143 --> 30:46.104
[UNKNOWN]: for the most part overwhelmingly.
30:46.144 --> 30:55.607
[UNKNOWN]: This is like a show about redemption and helping other people and even like the problematic moment seems more like stumbling blocks for the most part.
30:55.647 --> 30:57.528
[UNKNOWN]: Again, there's some exceptions to that.
30:57.728 --> 31:04.691
[UNKNOWN]: But I don't know, it's something that I feel like I'm always willing to work out with this show and be like, why didn't you question this the first time you saw it?
31:04.711 --> 31:07.972
[UNKNOWN]: Are you questioning enough now in like things along those lines?
31:08.272 --> 31:25.198
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I think earlier I was talking about the India arc specifically in the show and because there's an episode that calls the controversy and my specific approach towards what I was watching it where I just found myself not being cynical about it, not being kind of mean in my reaction towards it.
31:25.338 --> 31:33.401
[UNKNOWN]: I could see the problems, I could think about the problems, I could see where they came from, but I think because there's something about the show where I understand it has like a very almost humanist.
31:33.661 --> 31:49.202
[UNKNOWN]: Undercurrent throughout it, the well-intentioned aspect of it makes me kind of want to receive the moments where it dips into problematic aspects and makes me actually think about how they're trying to engage with it because it always feels like they're trying to engage with it, like I said, with an open heart and with like the idea of learning.
31:49.422 --> 32:09.142
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's something like very commendable because I'll tell you someone who I guess is a pop culture enthusiasts in critic I end up watching a lot of things that are gleefully problematic you know if we want to bring up friends friends was gleefully problematic towards trans people towards gay people early on also like slightly antagonistic towards black people
32:09.322 --> 32:27.829
[UNKNOWN]: And I say that because I just recently read a story where Gabrielle Union had publicly talked about how the friend's writers took a front to something she said, noting the lack of black characters and friends by going back into the scripts and trying to highlight every time a black character spoke on the show just to show her like no see like that.
32:28.630 --> 32:35.896
[UNKNOWN]: And there was like a gleeful, almost antagonism in those shows that I don't really get in Zina.
32:35.936 --> 32:46.145
[UNKNOWN]: Where Zina feels like even when it went to India and Vishnu popped up and like all that stuff, it felt like it was trying to engage with it and like to like show people what this culture is and like the beauty of it.
32:46.265 --> 32:47.106
[UNKNOWN]: So yeah, I'm sympathetic.
32:47.707 --> 32:54.157
[UNKNOWN]: They definitely, I mean, again, like, we're not solving equality issues here with our defendant.
32:54.517 --> 32:55.579
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, exactly.
32:55.659 --> 33:02.169
[UNKNOWN]: But while they actually have interracial relationships on here, that was at the time a rarity on TV.
33:02.890 --> 33:12.233
[UNKNOWN]: It wasn't unheard of, but it was still a rarity, like you look over TV history and it's just like yeah, of course And like the 60s we had a kiss, you know, I'm star track.
33:12.273 --> 33:22.037
[UNKNOWN]: We have like these moments throughout There's like films and things like that, but for the most part It was still pretty rare for a lot of actors to even be getting work.
33:22.217 --> 33:29.119
[UNKNOWN]: It's ridiculous how Overwhelmingly and insistently white Hollywood was and is yeah
33:29.579 --> 33:33.784
[UNKNOWN]: Um, like with exceptions, but it just, it's been that way for a long time.
33:33.944 --> 33:47.579
[UNKNOWN]: And so you have a show like Zina, and once again, not free from criticism, but definitely is trying to maybe dart building the bridge and hopefully other people can continue it and be a little bit less problem.
33:48.520 --> 33:52.061
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and I will say also like very receptive to criticism.
33:52.201 --> 34:07.345
[UNKNOWN]: I've been looking back at some of the statements from the cast and the crew towards things as like time went on and They'd been very like open towards it be like yeah, that was a bad idea And this is why we did it, but it came across wrong and I really respect that because that has become more and more of a rarity understandably
34:07.785 --> 34:14.691
[UNKNOWN]: I think somewhat, because when there's a bit of an angry hoard at you these days, it can be hard to figure out the correct thing to say.
34:14.932 --> 34:22.659
[UNKNOWN]: But like the way that Rob Tapper and just like everyone associated with that show managed to read that needle has been, I think, really remarkable.
34:22.779 --> 34:27.183
[UNKNOWN]: And I think is something that more people should look at and try and emulate.
34:27.743 --> 34:43.812
[UNKNOWN]: The way that Lucy lawless response to criticism is almost it just gives you evidence of why everybody loves this woman so much like yeah she's hot yeah she's charismatic but for a long time she's been really good about actually listening and showing
34:44.192 --> 35:00.843
[UNKNOWN]: kindness and care to fans and just being there for the fun of it, you know, and having a good sense of humor about the role and her status as, you know, you know, like a lot of people have let stuff like that really break them down and people call it cheesy and she's like, I like a bit of cheese or whatever.
35:01.103 --> 35:02.844
[UNKNOWN]: And I just think that that's great.
35:02.964 --> 35:11.089
[UNKNOWN]: You never really do get the feeling that they're being intentionally hurtful and definitely I've heard them come back and be like, really don't know or thinking here.
35:12.730 --> 35:19.740
[UNKNOWN]: Especially with the last two episodes which are a travesty, but it's like, yeah, well you can get there.
35:19.760 --> 35:28.853
[UNKNOWN]: I remember Lucy Law is saying something to the effect of I'm playing a silly show, but I didn't realize how connected especially a lot of queer people were to what we were doing.
35:29.253 --> 35:33.975
[UNKNOWN]: And so watching Zina die and it'd be kind of like, oh, and it's over.
35:33.995 --> 35:36.096
[UNKNOWN]: It was hard for them.
35:36.416 --> 35:41.659
[UNKNOWN]: And so yeah, her whole response to even that was just really kind of admirable.
35:41.719 --> 35:43.659
[UNKNOWN]: I don't think a lot of people are that receptive.
35:43.980 --> 35:51.723
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not that receptive to criticism for the most part, but I try to be about like she just has like an ungodly level of grace frankly.
35:52.143 --> 36:17.780
[UNKNOWN]: There is an element in, especially the years since of how she's like occupied the position of what she's a custodian for this role and for the legacy of the show in like a really beautiful way I came across the story about how she was in the deathbed of the lifelong Zeta fan to share that moment because she understood how much they valued the show and how much like it factor into people's life and like to this day she talks about it and you know, she holds it up and also shout out to Rene Connor who I think does the same thing has been also a wonderful custodian.
36:17.860 --> 36:19.100
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, she's incredible.
36:19.280 --> 36:22.881
[UNKNOWN]: It's like a hard to even find words for how good she is and how fun she is.
36:22.962 --> 36:33.224
[UNKNOWN]: Renee O'Connor's humor is out of control It's honestly heartbreaking that she didn't have a lot of lead-up roles after this because of how funny she is and how care is Yeah, she is on this show.
36:33.425 --> 36:35.025
[UNKNOWN]: We should not work without Renee.
36:35.305 --> 36:36.145
[UNKNOWN]: It wouldn't work without her.
36:36.165 --> 36:41.727
[UNKNOWN]: I was going to say it would not work Just as we were saying Sarah is really important to Angela.
36:41.747 --> 36:41.807
[UNKNOWN]: Yes
36:42.147 --> 36:44.291
[UNKNOWN]: This would not work without Gabrielle.
36:44.391 --> 36:55.128
[UNKNOWN]: The relationship between those two is the point and I think that there's even something that the writers and like the show runners are kind of like we started to realize that a certain point that that was the point and
36:56.828 --> 36:58.608
[UNKNOWN]: can be of any help to you, so please.
36:59.829 --> 37:02.809
[UNKNOWN]: I'm just just directing you, but you're my source Gabrielle.
37:03.350 --> 37:07.471
[UNKNOWN]: When I reach down inside myself and do things that I'm not capable of, it's because of you.
37:07.891 --> 37:10.931
[UNKNOWN]: Don't you know that by now, it's just see this one through together.
37:11.011 --> 37:11.592
[UNKNOWN]: All right.
37:11.652 --> 37:13.752
[UNKNOWN]: What else is going on in their lives?
37:14.052 --> 37:20.794
[UNKNOWN]: They will travel on with each other, which is always funny, because they'll meet these dudes, and they have like a romance through the episode.
37:20.894 --> 37:23.735
[UNKNOWN]: And then they're just like, well, I guess the most important thing to me is go and
37:26.256 --> 37:35.784
[UNKNOWN]: I started thinking of it as a boiling water and it felt like the lesbian water got a bit too bubbly and they were like, it was just like a cold and a sexual water and it's like NBCCBS doesn't care.
37:35.804 --> 37:36.304
[UNKNOWN]: That's fine.
37:36.324 --> 37:36.745
[UNKNOWN]: That's fine guys.
37:37.665 --> 37:43.750
[UNKNOWN]: So Lucy Loll is always says like when she watches it back now, she's like, oh my god, what is she doing with all these men?
37:43.850 --> 37:45.271
[UNKNOWN]: Where these men come from?
37:45.431 --> 37:47.873
[UNKNOWN]: Which I find hilarious, of course, as a lesbian.
37:47.893 --> 37:49.033
[UNKNOWN]: I'm delighted by that.
37:49.114 --> 37:59.001
[UNKNOWN]: But I, whenever I watch it, I'm just like, you guys just seem like you have the most functional polyamorous relations that I have witnessed on television ever frankly.
37:59.061 --> 38:01.843
[UNKNOWN]: So yeah, they're just like Harley and Ivy.
38:01.983 --> 38:02.243
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
38:02.523 --> 38:03.104
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, yes.
38:03.204 --> 38:04.045
[UNKNOWN]: Like we're primaries.
38:04.065 --> 38:04.865
[UNKNOWN]: The other view are fun.
38:05.205 --> 38:05.746
[UNKNOWN]: And thank you.
38:06.366 --> 38:07.027
[UNKNOWN]: But like we're done.
38:08.468 --> 38:12.492
[UNKNOWN]: We're gone now and so you're kind of her dad.
38:12.672 --> 38:27.665
[UNKNOWN]: So let's not do this that was weird I can't believe that that never got retconned out or anything like it was just kind of like we're just gonna leave that thread hanging Huh like I kind of figured at some point somebody would like Dan Slatt applied it and be like and you Like the brother
38:32.029 --> 38:34.811
[UNKNOWN]: I guess we're doing like background, what you need to know about Zida.
38:34.871 --> 38:38.393
[UNKNOWN]: You could talk a bit also about like how it falls in line with like the swords.
38:38.473 --> 38:40.855
[UNKNOWN]: And I guess we did touch on this little bit when we talked about we should film.
38:40.895 --> 38:45.298
[UNKNOWN]: But like it's a sword and sandals found like we're saying that was something that is very rare at the time.
38:45.358 --> 38:47.900
[UNKNOWN]: So I'm glad I really we need that genre back.
38:49.220 --> 38:55.382
[UNKNOWN]: I've been writing sort and sorcery meets horror for a minute and it's really god damn fun.
38:55.422 --> 39:02.324
[UNKNOWN]: Like I think more people should be doing this stuff and doing Xena tributes because nobody else is doing it.
39:02.384 --> 39:05.265
[UNKNOWN]: They keep like saying they're going to mess around with a remake at some point.
39:05.285 --> 39:08.266
[UNKNOWN]: They're probably just going to make it to stupid in game of their own style.
39:08.807 --> 39:11.227
[UNKNOWN]: I was wondering if I should bring that out port that would be like to early.
39:11.247 --> 39:12.388
[UNKNOWN]: But like, yeah, let's talk about it.
39:12.428 --> 39:14.868
[UNKNOWN]: What do you feel like about Xena remake?
39:14.888 --> 39:16.089
[UNKNOWN]: You seem negative on it.
39:16.109 --> 39:16.429
[UNKNOWN]: That's a bit
39:16.909 --> 39:24.795
[UNKNOWN]: So not necessarily, right, but like it would really depend on the creative team I think and it would really depend on someone actually likeings, you know?
39:24.955 --> 39:31.599
[UNKNOWN]: I feel like what a woman has the constant problem of people who don't like that character work on her to define her or dumbking.
39:32.120 --> 39:35.182
[UNKNOWN]: And I'm sorry, I had something in my throat.
39:35.302 --> 39:35.662
[UNKNOWN]: I'm sorry.
39:35.702 --> 39:36.143
[UNKNOWN]: I'm sorry.
39:36.163 --> 39:37.323
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know what that was.
39:37.544 --> 39:39.125
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know what that was.
39:39.145 --> 39:40.285
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know what that was.
39:40.346 --> 39:41.066
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know what that was.
39:41.106 --> 39:44.528
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, no, so live and let live, I guess.
39:45.689 --> 39:47.311
[UNKNOWN]: But yeah, no, I think was like Xena.
39:47.491 --> 40:11.910
[UNKNOWN]: I love the continuation in the comics and I think that we should focus on getting good comics out there before we focus on literally anything else because it is a franchise that is just sitting there on the table And if you wanted to do anything with it, I would think that comics would be the place to start and to kind of like be like, okay, let's build some buzz around this also I'm pitching this only because I think I should be the writer of it.
40:12.290 --> 40:20.354
[UNKNOWN]: And I keep saying this and I feel like if I just keep saying it, someone will be like, oh my god, of course I have faith that you should write this.
40:20.694 --> 40:23.575
[UNKNOWN]: I support you, I believe this should happen.
40:23.595 --> 40:25.596
[UNKNOWN]: Does Dynamite still have the rights?
40:25.696 --> 40:26.937
[UNKNOWN]: Do we know who do I need to yell at?
40:27.017 --> 40:27.717
[UNKNOWN]: I think it's dope.
40:27.777 --> 40:28.557
[UNKNOWN]: Are you in the room?
40:28.577 --> 40:29.238
[UNKNOWN]: Well, who is it?
40:29.318 --> 40:30.198
[UNKNOWN]: I think it's Dynamite.
40:30.558 --> 40:33.160
[UNKNOWN]: I've been so confused about this for so long.
40:33.180 --> 40:38.223
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but there has been a good run of xenocomics when we were talking about doing best issue ever.
40:38.403 --> 40:44.327
[UNKNOWN]: I read some of the Vita Ayala run and I really enjoyed that and I love that they decided to bring in discord.
40:44.727 --> 40:45.607
[UNKNOWN]: Look, Zina.
40:45.808 --> 40:47.168
[UNKNOWN]: I'm tired of being jerked around.
40:47.389 --> 40:49.270
[UNKNOWN]: You gave me some advice to jerk you around.
40:49.690 --> 40:50.530
[UNKNOWN]: I was like great.
40:50.570 --> 40:51.550
[UNKNOWN]: That was fun.
40:51.650 --> 40:52.971
[UNKNOWN]: She never got a plot.
40:52.991 --> 40:54.171
[UNKNOWN]: Oh my god.
40:54.491 --> 40:56.111
[UNKNOWN]: I was like, Vida.
40:56.192 --> 40:59.592
[UNKNOWN]: My fellow actual series Zina fan.
40:59.652 --> 41:06.574
[UNKNOWN]: Vida gets a Vida gets a- You brought in the character that you would bring in for sure.
41:06.974 --> 41:07.854
[UNKNOWN]: That's great.
41:08.194 --> 41:09.015
[UNKNOWN]: I appreciate it.
41:09.455 --> 41:11.495
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know what I would do immediately.
41:11.675 --> 41:15.316
[UNKNOWN]: I would probably have to do a bring her back from the dead story.
41:19.937 --> 41:22.779
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know if you're fair, fair, fair, fair, fair, like, save the pitch.
41:22.839 --> 41:27.101
[UNKNOWN]: I will say that to talk about the idea of rebooting it or remaking it.
41:27.161 --> 41:30.063
[UNKNOWN]: I always feel like I would love a Zena movie.
41:30.343 --> 41:33.345
[UNKNOWN]: I feel like that was something that I think at the end of the show.
41:33.405 --> 41:34.726
[UNKNOWN]: They were thinking about doing.
41:34.906 --> 41:39.548
[UNKNOWN]: And I really wish they ended up figuring it out, especially like, you know, a lot of talk.
41:39.949 --> 41:42.170
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, friend and need is not great.
41:42.590 --> 41:43.951
[UNKNOWN]: Visually, it's great.
41:44.151 --> 41:47.333
[UNKNOWN]: It shows you that Zena could support a movie of that way.
41:47.473 --> 41:48.153
[UNKNOWN]: You know what I mean?
41:48.254 --> 41:52.076
[UNKNOWN]: It showed you the potential of Zena on the big screen because those feel like big screen adventures.
41:52.296 --> 41:53.657
[UNKNOWN]: So that's such a regret.
41:53.717 --> 41:57.339
[UNKNOWN]: I would like something, so okay, I'll give you my pitch for Zena Movie.
41:57.419 --> 42:06.705
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, I think what we need to do is we have Lucy Lawless and Gabrielle there, but in the future, Zena's back, we don't need to explain that mystical stuff.
42:06.825 --> 42:12.469
[UNKNOWN]: And like finally, Zena may be recounts the story in detail of what happened to her brother.
42:12.509 --> 42:14.991
[UNKNOWN]: And we get like early warlord years leading up
42:17.272 --> 42:18.013
[UNKNOWN]: That's my pitch.
42:18.093 --> 42:22.398
[UNKNOWN]: And that way we can recast, start with someone new, you know, someone young and then.
42:22.538 --> 42:25.441
[UNKNOWN]: Well, still having the old.
42:25.521 --> 42:27.043
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, we have the old school.
42:27.063 --> 42:28.184
[UNKNOWN]: We finished the story.
42:28.284 --> 42:30.607
[UNKNOWN]: And then we can relaunch into a new Zena.
42:30.767 --> 42:32.369
[UNKNOWN]: Perhaps maybe possibly not.
42:32.529 --> 42:33.770
[UNKNOWN]: Or you could just start it over.
42:33.830 --> 42:34.811
[UNKNOWN]: Just do more of this.
42:34.851 --> 42:35.352
[UNKNOWN]: I don't care.
42:35.372 --> 42:37.034
[UNKNOWN]: I want more Zeta in my life.
42:37.114 --> 42:38.295
[UNKNOWN]: And I feel like we just deserve it.
42:38.455 --> 42:40.616
[UNKNOWN]: I want someone who understands camp.
42:41.056 --> 42:44.618
[UNKNOWN]: I want someone who understands camp that's not Ryan Murphy.
42:44.758 --> 42:46.859
[UNKNOWN]: They're the opposite of Ryan Murphy, right?
42:47.119 --> 42:50.661
[UNKNOWN]: Like as much as this man does understand camp, he goes far too far.
42:50.821 --> 42:51.922
[UNKNOWN]: And so, what does he understand?
42:51.942 --> 42:52.842
[UNKNOWN]: Doesn't he understand?
42:52.862 --> 42:53.703
[UNKNOWN]: Doesn't he understand that?
42:53.723 --> 42:58.725
[UNKNOWN]: Doesn't just act like, because he's there or something, like, I'm not a hundred person.
42:58.745 --> 42:59.826
[UNKNOWN]: He's my theory on Ryan Murphy.
42:59.846 --> 43:01.647
[UNKNOWN]: I think he watched Pink Thumb and goes once.
43:02.047 --> 43:03.087
[UNKNOWN]: One time in his life.
43:03.388 --> 43:05.028
[UNKNOWN]: And then was like, yeah, I can do this.
43:08.210 --> 43:35.047
[UNKNOWN]: And now we're all like trying to deal with it, you know, it becomes camp because of that I think and then it also becomes camp because he has this incredible neck for finding all of the most beautiful middle aged women in the world we've got Sarah Paulson we've I mean Sharon Stone is no longer middle aged but like we've got a lot of like older beautiful women in really strong leading roles and I think that that's basically how it becomes camp is they are like leading.
43:35.227 --> 43:46.353
[UNKNOWN]: I see I think the trick with that is like no one in Hollywood wants to hire anyone over the age of 30 and he's just like I'll do it and we can't just clap for him for doing that the gaze are all like good job
43:47.782 --> 43:49.783
[UNKNOWN]: But we did let it get too far.
43:49.863 --> 43:50.283
[UNKNOWN]: We did.
43:50.323 --> 43:53.043
[UNKNOWN]: This is like when people say, well, Tyler Perry hires black people.
43:53.204 --> 43:54.544
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, that's not enough.
43:54.684 --> 43:55.624
[UNKNOWN]: We need more now.
43:55.644 --> 43:56.244
[UNKNOWN]: We need more.
43:56.404 --> 43:57.045
[UNKNOWN]: We need better.
43:57.065 --> 43:57.465
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
43:57.825 --> 44:01.706
[UNKNOWN]: I know there was like a Zina reboot in discussion a few years back then that I'm not going anywhere.
44:01.926 --> 44:06.767
[UNKNOWN]: And I'm really glad that the statements seem to be like, they just no one seems to be getting the correct tone.
44:06.787 --> 44:07.948
[UNKNOWN]: For Zina, I know.
44:07.968 --> 44:09.008
[UNKNOWN]: I understand it.
44:09.128 --> 44:09.588
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
44:10.128 --> 44:12.369
[UNKNOWN]: Again, I'm available like,
44:12.629 --> 44:14.851
[UNKNOWN]: Get Sarah to show her, you'd be great, you'd be great.
44:14.891 --> 44:18.874
[UNKNOWN]: But let's get to say, I do think that we are maybe primed in this moment.
44:18.954 --> 44:21.056
[UNKNOWN]: We are launching a Zina retrospective.
44:21.136 --> 44:24.919
[UNKNOWN]: It is time for people to re-appraise to re-look at Zina.
44:24.959 --> 44:28.142
[UNKNOWN]: You all into Y2K, you're all into the 1990s.
44:28.382 --> 44:29.142
[UNKNOWN]: Look at Zina.
44:29.202 --> 44:33.586
[UNKNOWN]: You like, DJ cams again, like you're into all of this nonsense.
44:33.706 --> 44:37.989
[UNKNOWN]: Polaroids, you're wearing skirts on jeans or whatever it is that you're doing.
44:38.009 --> 44:42.672
[UNKNOWN]: They're trying to bring back jinkos, you should be bringing back Xena Warrior Princess.
44:43.292 --> 44:45.013
[UNKNOWN]: You can guess an old who was there.
44:45.934 --> 44:48.595
[UNKNOWN]: All of you, Gen Z's wearing business casual in the club.
44:48.735 --> 44:52.938
[UNKNOWN]: I see you, and I'm telling you, watch Xena, trust me, okay?
44:53.198 --> 44:54.159
[UNKNOWN]: It'll be worth your time.
44:54.219 --> 44:56.100
[UNKNOWN]: We've, oh God, we've been talking an hour already.
44:56.560 --> 44:57.641
[UNKNOWN]: We're all those been talking about.
44:57.801 --> 45:00.683
[UNKNOWN]: We're just on our goddamn soapbox with this.
45:01.103 --> 45:03.945
[UNKNOWN]: It's just like, what did you think could possibly happen?
45:04.306 --> 45:06.527
[UNKNOWN]: Of course, this is just the soapbox hour.
45:06.647 --> 45:09.109
[UNKNOWN]: Also, you didn't just flash that Zena shirt.
45:09.329 --> 45:10.430
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's so good.
45:10.590 --> 45:11.670
[UNKNOWN]: It's just so beautiful.
45:11.911 --> 45:12.371
[UNKNOWN]: It's so good.
45:12.391 --> 45:15.713
[UNKNOWN]: I need to get me to get for y'all shirt shout out to whatever Etsy shop I got this from.
45:15.753 --> 45:19.656
[UNKNOWN]: They have a cool list of shirts that I saw like on tea public or something.
45:19.676 --> 45:19.856
[UNKNOWN]: I was
45:19.876 --> 45:23.063
[UNKNOWN]: I was looking for an Aphrodite shirt and I couldn't find one.
45:23.163 --> 45:24.986
[UNKNOWN]: So that's the thing that there's no Aphrodite shirt.
45:25.007 --> 45:26.550
[UNKNOWN]: You know what I want, I want to hope shirt.
45:28.810 --> 45:53.665
[UNKNOWN]: with her that awful band was you would want to hope sure that is so good whenever she's covered in like glue or whatever yeah I can see I can see I want that I want one of the 90s hip-hop shirts where there's like a lot of faces Gabby's Pope face and it's like a whole person that hurts the top of her I might make this you know what this will be merch you know you and I will fit in the profits this will be on an ever press store near you I promise you this
45:53.945 --> 46:00.771
[UNKNOWN]: I think we should actually start a business where we're making actually good Zena shirts because like there's not enough great ones.
46:00.791 --> 46:03.653
[UNKNOWN]: There's some pretty decent ones, but there's not enough great ones.
46:03.813 --> 46:04.994
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I completely agree.
46:05.054 --> 46:06.455
[UNKNOWN]: We need new Zena shirts.
46:06.495 --> 46:08.997
[UNKNOWN]: Also the other thing I think is they're not enough merch out there.
46:09.017 --> 46:10.218
[UNKNOWN]: We need more Zena merch.
46:10.519 --> 46:13.841
[UNKNOWN]: We should get one with them kissing that says roommates under it.
46:15.602 --> 46:17.263
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, sorry, go ahead.
46:17.303 --> 46:18.083
[UNKNOWN]: Subtextual.
46:18.223 --> 46:19.423
[UNKNOWN]: We'll just say, like, subtextual.
46:19.623 --> 46:20.243
[UNKNOWN]: So we've been talking.
46:20.263 --> 46:22.904
[UNKNOWN]: We've given you in a one hour intro on Zena, I'm so sorry.
46:23.144 --> 46:26.965
[UNKNOWN]: Maybe now we should give you a brief rundown of what is the history of Zena?
46:27.045 --> 46:27.826
[UNKNOWN]: What is Zena?
46:28.106 --> 46:28.906
[UNKNOWN]: Who is this woman?
46:29.006 --> 46:29.546
[UNKNOWN]: Who is she?
46:29.686 --> 46:30.246
[UNKNOWN]: Who is she?
46:30.387 --> 46:31.587
[UNKNOWN]: And what is this TV show?
46:31.627 --> 46:34.088
[UNKNOWN]: What happens in the series overall?
46:34.768 --> 46:41.710
[UNKNOWN]: Should we attempt to do, let's say, a quick one paragraph recap and then try and get in the granular from, say, from the start to the end.
46:42.090 --> 46:48.295
[UNKNOWN]: Sure, I'll start, it goes in a time of ancient, you are a monster, in a time of ancient gods.
46:48.355 --> 46:50.316
[UNKNOWN]: It's a turmoil, right out for a year.
46:50.496 --> 47:10.812
[UNKNOWN]: It's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's
47:11.486 --> 47:13.089
[UNKNOWN]: forms in the heat of battle.
47:13.109 --> 47:14.551
[UNKNOWN]: I love how you just have that.
47:14.571 --> 47:15.172
[UNKNOWN]: There's no notes.
47:15.232 --> 47:15.933
[UNKNOWN]: I just want you to know.
47:15.953 --> 47:17.255
[UNKNOWN]: We just let it play.
47:17.295 --> 47:17.615
[UNKNOWN]: Hang.
47:19.242 --> 47:21.263
[UNKNOWN]: I just want you to know there were no notes on the table.
47:21.323 --> 47:22.464
[UNKNOWN]: Sarah just had that in her.
47:22.484 --> 47:23.645
[UNKNOWN]: So it just came out.
47:23.805 --> 47:32.470
[UNKNOWN]: All right, shall we start with the power, the passion, the beauty, the gorgeous taste, the hair, the bangs, the lines.
47:32.770 --> 47:35.432
[UNKNOWN]: Is that incredible boob knife that you have?
47:35.652 --> 47:37.834
[UNKNOWN]: Oh my god, that boob knife.
47:38.314 --> 47:39.235
[UNKNOWN]: I love the boobie.
47:39.255 --> 47:40.575
[UNKNOWN]: You can't even see it coming.
47:40.595 --> 47:41.376
[UNKNOWN]: She has so many knives.
47:41.396 --> 47:44.278
[UNKNOWN]: And then Gabrielle tries to have one and she sucks at it.
47:44.378 --> 47:44.678
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
47:44.818 --> 47:45.758
[UNKNOWN]: So they gave her a stick.
47:46.198 --> 47:49.079
[UNKNOWN]: God bless you, no, no, no, you get a stick.
47:49.099 --> 47:50.819
[UNKNOWN]: You should start with a stick, okay?
47:50.839 --> 47:53.700
[UNKNOWN]: God bless Gabrielle.
47:53.820 --> 47:56.040
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, let's give the beef overview of them.
47:56.200 --> 47:58.201
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, Zena, Zena, the warrior princess.
47:58.221 --> 47:59.741
[UNKNOWN]: We said in the time, they should type of a lot.
47:59.801 --> 48:00.421
[UNKNOWN]: But who is Zena?
48:00.441 --> 48:01.321
[UNKNOWN]: You start a soft set.
48:01.562 --> 48:03.542
[UNKNOWN]: One paragraph I want from you is your challenge.
48:03.702 --> 48:04.722
[UNKNOWN]: You're the expert, this is your challenge.
48:04.742 --> 48:08.143
[UNKNOWN]: You got one paragraph to tell me the story of Zena, the warrior princess, go.
48:20.923 --> 48:26.247
[UNKNOWN]: Well, Zina did a whole bunch of fucked up shit to a bunch of people and people are pissed.
48:26.267 --> 48:32.611
[UNKNOWN]: It turns out nobody wants to hang out with her anymore because she's been kind of a dick for kind of a long time.
48:32.811 --> 48:35.073
[UNKNOWN]: And so her family's just owned her.
48:35.233 --> 48:41.157
[UNKNOWN]: But she goes in Hercules and hooks up with Eolas as a prank.
48:41.517 --> 48:46.381
[UNKNOWN]: And then fights Hercules because she wants to be a liberal bad for no reason.
48:46.601 --> 48:47.942
[UNKNOWN]: I just want to know, A.O.L.S.
48:48.242 --> 48:57.366
[UNKNOWN]: is the oldest looking young man I have ever seen in my god blessed man, but Michael Hurst, he's got the crow's feet and you're just like, aren't you like 23?
48:57.446 --> 48:57.586
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
48:57.766 --> 49:04.690
[UNKNOWN]: He's meant to be like 16 or something and I was like, sister, no, god, that's a secret face of I've ever seen.
49:04.710 --> 49:05.510
[UNKNOWN]: Anyway, as you were.
49:05.670 --> 49:12.718
[UNKNOWN]: Seriously, I mean, this man has gone on to simply become a silver fox, but he is always wearing his vest.
49:12.978 --> 49:14.620
[UNKNOWN]: He's her Achilles' best friend.
49:14.660 --> 49:16.702
[UNKNOWN]: That'll give you a little context.
49:16.722 --> 49:18.825
[UNKNOWN]: And she tries to fight a Hercules.
49:18.845 --> 49:23.790
[UNKNOWN]: She's beaten, but she's immensely popular because Lucy Wallace is smoking hot.
49:25.692 --> 49:29.055
[UNKNOWN]: And so everybody just wants to see Lucy Lawl is back on the screen.
49:29.095 --> 49:35.120
[UNKNOWN]: She comes back for a little redemption arc in Hercules There's three episodes of Hercules where she's getting redeemed by Hercules.
49:35.180 --> 49:40.805
[UNKNOWN]: It's pretty paternalistic there for a second But then they decide to just before you do Please spin off.
49:41.085 --> 49:50.073
[UNKNOWN]: I was just going to say about those three episodes of Hercules I just want to give a brief review It's a point said as you were And then they're just once
49:53.317 --> 49:54.177
[UNKNOWN]: I know how you feel.
49:54.397 --> 49:58.299
[UNKNOWN]: They go on to do a spin-off of Hercules.
49:58.439 --> 50:02.980
[UNKNOWN]: First, they pitch Jason in the Argonauts, which is the most bullshit idea anybody ever had.
50:03.200 --> 50:08.362
[UNKNOWN]: If you want to watch Jason in the Argonaut, you've got to watch the one that Ray Harry has and did the animation for Goddamnit.
50:08.542 --> 50:11.683
[UNKNOWN]: And then you do, instead Zina perhaps.
50:11.903 --> 50:16.425
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, everybody loves Super Hot, Lucy Lawless, and she seems really personable and great.
50:16.545 --> 50:18.066
[UNKNOWN]: So we want to hang out with her more.
50:18.146 --> 50:18.966
[UNKNOWN]: Let's give her a show.
50:19.386 --> 50:20.226
[UNKNOWN]: as you wish.
50:20.247 --> 50:22.968
[UNKNOWN]: So we have Gina, the warrior princess.
50:23.068 --> 50:24.629
[UNKNOWN]: So she is on a redemption arc.
50:24.649 --> 50:26.570
[UNKNOWN]: She has fucked up bad.
50:26.790 --> 50:31.152
[UNKNOWN]: And so she has to go through and my name is Earl style.
50:31.513 --> 50:38.276
[UNKNOWN]: I'm trying to undo all of the legitimate atrocities she has committed because I think that has to look that reference.
50:38.656 --> 50:39.397
[UNKNOWN]: My goodness.
50:39.597 --> 50:41.198
[UNKNOWN]: My name is Earl Jesus.
50:41.218 --> 50:42.639
[UNKNOWN]: I haven't thought of that name in years.
50:47.542 --> 50:52.307
[UNKNOWN]: We got to go deep into TV to like understand the roots of Zina.
50:52.427 --> 50:58.234
[UNKNOWN]: So she ends up going on to me to the love of her goddamn life Gabrielle.
50:58.554 --> 50:59.976
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not getting out for this village life.
51:00.436 --> 51:01.878
[UNKNOWN]: I was born to just so much more.
51:02.218 --> 51:19.480
[UNKNOWN]: First episode of Zina Gabrielle is there whenever there's I mean everywhere Zina goes there's Ruffian's causing problems and so she walks up and says something so hot and so amazing and then they go oh Well we'll go ahead and fight you anyway and she's like well that's wonderful I'd love to beat the shit out of you so she does
51:19.961 --> 51:25.488
[UNKNOWN]: And then Gabrielle's like, oh shit, I'm going with you, fuck my life.
51:25.728 --> 51:28.612
[UNKNOWN]: I really don't want anything to do with this town anymore.
51:28.632 --> 51:34.559
[UNKNOWN]: I always wanted to be a bard who's traveling with like a beautiful warrior, maybe, and I can write on your heart.
51:34.599 --> 51:37.042
[UNKNOWN]: I'm being forced into a heterosexual marriage.
51:37.122 --> 51:38.264
[UNKNOWN]: I do not want to do that.
51:38.284 --> 51:39.045
[UNKNOWN]: So I will make it.
51:39.125 --> 51:45.032
[UNKNOWN]: Maybe we can kiss sometimes, I don't know, but long time it doesn't happen.
51:45.152 --> 51:49.317
[UNKNOWN]: So my head can't infer all of this is just that Zena's like, no, I've got to be redeemed.
51:49.357 --> 51:50.318
[UNKNOWN]: I've got a tone.
51:50.338 --> 51:51.900
[UNKNOWN]: You don't deserve this Gabrielle.
51:51.920 --> 51:53.341
[UNKNOWN]: I've got too much going on.
51:53.421 --> 51:54.503
[UNKNOWN]: And then Gabrielle's like,
51:55.158 --> 51:59.081
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not gonna, I was gonna actually say I have a headcat in too about this in my head.
51:59.242 --> 52:03.005
[UNKNOWN]: I like to think that as soon as Nina's saved Gabrielle, they had sex.
52:03.245 --> 52:07.429
[UNKNOWN]: And then the whole process afterwards when Gabrielle was trying to like just follow her.
52:07.449 --> 52:10.271
[UNKNOWN]: Nina's just like, goddammit, I had to sleep with the virgin.
52:10.351 --> 52:11.192
[UNKNOWN]: I just had to do it.
52:11.292 --> 52:14.015
[UNKNOWN]: as you're trying to get rid of her, but then Gabrielle succeeds in the end.
52:14.095 --> 52:15.476
[UNKNOWN]: But we just don't see those parts.
52:15.676 --> 52:23.424
[UNKNOWN]: Gabrielle is so dedicated to tapping that as, and it is like out of control how dedicated she is.
52:23.584 --> 52:27.548
[UNKNOWN]: She never let a man get close enough to do her, at least not that kind of do her.
52:27.788 --> 52:30.011
[UNKNOWN]: But a young innocent looking girl like me,
52:30.571 --> 52:32.471
[UNKNOWN]: I'll catch her totally off guard.
52:32.491 --> 52:37.293
[UNKNOWN]: She wants much more than this provincial life.
52:37.373 --> 52:37.913
[UNKNOWN]: Exactly.
52:38.033 --> 52:41.314
[UNKNOWN]: So they go on to become beautiful soulmates.
52:41.414 --> 52:43.354
[UNKNOWN]: And it's the greatest left story of all time.
52:43.474 --> 52:45.795
[UNKNOWN]: Zina ends up at the end of this series.
52:45.855 --> 52:47.095
[UNKNOWN]: I'll spoil this.
52:47.115 --> 52:48.135
[UNKNOWN]: And she dies.
52:48.295 --> 52:50.036
[UNKNOWN]: Gabrielle kind of, electrically.
52:50.056 --> 52:51.096
[UNKNOWN]: Place, I guess.
52:51.256 --> 52:53.396
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Zina dies a little lot.
52:53.416 --> 52:54.957
[UNKNOWN]: So that's another thing maybe to mention.
52:54.977 --> 52:57.737
[UNKNOWN]: And this was like, she's died five times in this series.
52:57.877 --> 53:00.258
[UNKNOWN]: So she'll be back in our hearts.
53:00.518 --> 53:04.979
[UNKNOWN]: but I'm not 100% there's some other stuff that happens.
53:05.179 --> 53:07.240
[UNKNOWN]: It's six seasons of 30 episode.
53:07.340 --> 53:11.381
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but do you have anything to add because that was chaos?
53:11.421 --> 53:12.241
[UNKNOWN]: No, I think that's great.
53:12.261 --> 53:13.641
[UNKNOWN]: You stopped at the perfect point.
53:13.721 --> 53:18.643
[UNKNOWN]: I think and then subsequently this is the continuing adventures of Zina and Gabriel.
53:18.723 --> 53:28.025
[UNKNOWN]: Leading up to the end where Zina decides to go to Japan because she has another secret ex-girlfriend who she owes a favor and then she dies and then like you said, Gabrielle, as at that point
53:28.725 --> 53:41.038
[UNKNOWN]: transformed from that little girl who was just tagging along into Zina's warrior apprentice and then successor and a lover roommate, whatever recipient of a gift from Sappho.
53:41.058 --> 53:42.219
[UNKNOWN]: Long time companion.
53:42.239 --> 53:43.640
[UNKNOWN]: A long time companion.
53:43.801 --> 53:45.342
[UNKNOWN]: Friends of Dorothy perhaps.
53:46.243 --> 53:53.385
[UNKNOWN]: and she's returning to Greece on a boat with the ghost of Zina at her side, holding her ashes to return the back to her home to go rest next to her father.
53:53.405 --> 53:53.885
[UNKNOWN]: So, the end.
53:53.925 --> 53:56.766
[UNKNOWN]: And Zina's like, I will always love you, Gabrielle.
53:56.966 --> 53:59.927
[UNKNOWN]: And then Gabrielle, like, me too Zina, you'll always be with me.
54:00.027 --> 54:03.408
[UNKNOWN]: And you're just like, God, you know, I do say that to my roommate, it's all the time.
54:03.568 --> 54:07.009
[UNKNOWN]: All the time, like, truly, that's subtext, you know, subtext.
54:07.129 --> 54:08.250
[UNKNOWN]: Don't text, what are you talking about?
54:08.330 --> 54:15.452
[UNKNOWN]: Gay, gay, gay, gay, yes, and the Gabrielle returns and that is how we end the series.
54:19.092 --> 54:25.796
[UNKNOWN]: Sarah and I, the way we have tried to, I guess, manage this is I gave Sarah an assignment.
54:25.956 --> 54:31.999
[UNKNOWN]: I said, I would like you to bring me two episodes that you love, that you feel to
54:36.762 --> 54:48.311
[UNKNOWN]: and you picked two choices and I picked two choices as well but I feel the same way and we're going to present them to you and we're going to use those as a kind of a tap poll for the continuing adventures of Zena and also to argue this is why you should watch it.
54:48.371 --> 54:57.477
[UNKNOWN]: These are all the amazing things about the show and I think the choices we made actually are really great because they provide a really wide spectrum of what the show is and what the show can do.
54:57.857 --> 55:02.561
[UNKNOWN]: One other thing I want to say is one thing I really appreciate about the show as I was watching it.
55:02.601 --> 55:04.242
[UNKNOWN]: I was surprised by how quickly
55:05.523 --> 55:09.104
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, specifically with like long running shows like this, especially from this era.
55:09.244 --> 55:10.904
[UNKNOWN]: It's sometimes it takes a season and a half.
55:10.984 --> 55:13.404
[UNKNOWN]: I think by episode, I don't know, maybe eight.
55:13.684 --> 55:15.325
[UNKNOWN]: Zina was the show, you know?
55:15.585 --> 55:17.845
[UNKNOWN]: Obviously we're encouraging everybody to watch this.
55:18.085 --> 55:21.286
[UNKNOWN]: People seem to this episode of that world preclude you from enjoying the series.
55:21.426 --> 55:22.666
[UNKNOWN]: But hopefully we'll hype it up enough.
55:22.866 --> 55:25.527
[UNKNOWN]: That maybe I can, I thought I was joking about this yesterday.
55:25.547 --> 55:26.427
[UNKNOWN]: I was just like, you know what?
55:26.607 --> 55:27.407
[UNKNOWN]: This is Loki.
55:27.587 --> 55:33.128
[UNKNOWN]: Secretly, my pitch to try and get you all to pay Sarah and I to do an episode by episode recap podcast.
55:34.508 --> 55:36.970
[UNKNOWN]: If you want to pay us for that, please, please.
55:37.170 --> 55:38.331
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not asking.
55:38.391 --> 55:40.313
[UNKNOWN]: I'm begging you.
55:40.353 --> 55:42.234
[UNKNOWN]: Give us cash money and we'll do it.
55:42.374 --> 55:43.315
[UNKNOWN]: We'll do it.
55:43.355 --> 55:45.797
[UNKNOWN]: We will do it from what I guess what you want us to do it.
55:45.937 --> 55:46.277
[UNKNOWN]: You do.
55:46.397 --> 55:48.079
[UNKNOWN]: It's a museum.
55:48.139 --> 55:50.741
[UNKNOWN]: All you do is sign a check over to us and we do things.
55:53.072 --> 56:06.245
[UNKNOWN]: But yes, before we get into our episodes election, they did have one last question to you a little contextualizing question I wanted to ask you how do you feel about Zina in the legacy of action female stars?
56:06.385 --> 56:09.308
[UNKNOWN]: I would just to name out a few I'm thinking of people like Ripley.
56:09.428 --> 56:11.450
[UNKNOWN]: I'm thinking of Sarah Connor Janeway.
56:11.471 --> 56:12.331
[UNKNOWN]: I'm thinking of Scully.
56:12.552 --> 56:15.415
[UNKNOWN]: She came after them and then obviously after that
56:15.995 --> 56:22.437
[UNKNOWN]: we have the MCU world awaiting us and Scarlett popping in as our next action star that obviously have stuff like salt.
56:22.457 --> 56:24.937
[UNKNOWN]: But basically I think she fits an interesting way in that continuum.
56:25.017 --> 56:27.178
[UNKNOWN]: I did kind of want to prod your brain about that alone.
56:27.318 --> 56:42.242
[UNKNOWN]: In some pretty important stuff like I think that for instance like the Harley Quinn and the Birds of Prey movie had really good action sequences that were character specific and kind of humorous which I think is like something that Zina, I mean I would have a hard time imagining that they
56:45.483 --> 56:47.325
[UNKNOWN]: of how character specific it is.
56:47.445 --> 56:50.949
[UNKNOWN]: Like every fight scene matters because of who is fighting more.
56:51.089 --> 56:59.717
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that that's very true, was Zina, because you have Zina, who obviously is the star, is obviously the prime fighter, but Gabrielle obviously gets in on that.
56:59.757 --> 57:01.599
[UNKNOWN]: There's a ton of women on this show.
57:01.739 --> 57:05.603
[UNKNOWN]: A lot of them are in these really high drama action sequences.
57:05.763 --> 57:05.983
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
57:06.063 --> 57:06.964
[UNKNOWN]: It's unbelievable.
57:07.024 --> 57:11.608
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, in the 90s, sexism is a deep ongoing forever thing.
57:11.668 --> 57:12.789
[UNKNOWN]: It almost feels like so.
57:13.129 --> 57:14.870
[UNKNOWN]: I hope not, but it's just rough.
57:14.950 --> 57:17.873
[UNKNOWN]: But you look back and it's not better by any stretch.
57:17.933 --> 57:22.116
[UNKNOWN]: But it shows like, you know, characters like Ripley were so huge.
57:22.316 --> 57:27.240
[UNKNOWN]: And for me, like growing up, you see these like action heroes, and it really does matter, I think.
57:27.440 --> 57:28.241
[UNKNOWN]: So that's good.
57:28.541 --> 57:33.365
[UNKNOWN]: And the approach of always having fight scenes happening, we have our dramatic moments.
57:33.425 --> 57:35.967
[UNKNOWN]: They found great actors who were able to do both.
57:36.227 --> 57:40.010
[UNKNOWN]: And then they also have really solid people who are working behind the scenes.
57:40.290 --> 57:43.953
[UNKNOWN]: Lucy law listed a lot of her own, but also a lot of help with that.
57:44.113 --> 57:46.895
[UNKNOWN]: The way that those fight scenes come together is really incredible.
57:47.195 --> 57:53.677
[UNKNOWN]: It's another thing where I'm like, I don't think we give them enough credit because the Hercules fight scenes are nowhere nearly as engaging.
57:53.877 --> 57:59.018
[UNKNOWN]: So I think that they really have kind of honed their craft on this show and made it look good.
57:59.278 --> 58:01.758
[UNKNOWN]: It's easy fight scenes, but it looks good.
58:02.118 --> 58:05.959
[UNKNOWN]: Every episode has a fighting choreography set piece where like something interesting will happen.
58:06.219 --> 58:08.600
[UNKNOWN]: They're throwing a baby and that wouldn't happen.
58:09.970 --> 58:10.991
[UNKNOWN]: They're throwing a baby.
58:11.051 --> 58:12.292
[UNKNOWN]: They're jumping on logs.
58:12.312 --> 58:13.793
[UNKNOWN]: They're fighting from trees.
58:13.913 --> 58:15.274
[UNKNOWN]: They're fighting while flying.
58:15.314 --> 58:15.514
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
58:15.634 --> 58:18.857
[UNKNOWN]: Every single episode is something interesting is being attempted.
58:18.997 --> 58:21.919
[UNKNOWN]: To me, I was just like stunned by the creativity of all these choreographers.
58:21.939 --> 58:23.140
[UNKNOWN]: How like they just kept managing.
58:23.160 --> 58:25.222
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, this is reason why I show like this kept innovating.
58:25.302 --> 58:28.084
[UNKNOWN]: I like imagining just like the work of fight choreography.
58:28.284 --> 58:30.306
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, no, it's just amazing how they do that.
58:30.406 --> 58:33.489
[UNKNOWN]: I do also want to say I guess on that action star.
58:33.609 --> 58:46.700
[UNKNOWN]: I think compared to those characters, I mean, maybe Scully and Janeway are a different situation, but I think there's something about the fact that Xena was a long running show that it allowed Xena as an action figure.
58:46.980 --> 59:04.345
[UNKNOWN]: to challenge the notions of that in interesting ways because I think there has been some discussion, but like the richness of Zina, but also like you cannot watch the show and say that's all she is and also the way like that richness operates in relation to her femininity as well, and like how she wields it.
59:04.405 --> 59:06.626
[UNKNOWN]: She is butch though and it's nice.
59:06.886 --> 59:09.268
[UNKNOWN]: You just, I mean, it's nice to see.
59:09.348 --> 59:17.292
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, the queers exist, like I wanna see more, but it's complicated, it seems with her when it comes to gender and sexuality.
59:17.332 --> 59:21.674
[UNKNOWN]: I would say that, that always comes across as complicated as a character.
59:21.694 --> 59:23.255
[UNKNOWN]: That's kind of a recurring theme.
59:23.375 --> 59:24.696
[UNKNOWN]: She's not like other girls.
59:24.736 --> 59:28.858
[UNKNOWN]: Like Gabrielle laughs at a certain point is like, well, you know, seeing us not like other girls.
59:30.199 --> 59:31.780
[UNKNOWN]: You're just like Gabrielle.
59:32.100 --> 59:33.201
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, all right.
59:33.401 --> 59:34.382
[UNKNOWN]: You want to go fishing again.
59:34.402 --> 59:34.802
[UNKNOWN]: I see you.
59:34.882 --> 59:51.113
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I guess I mentioned that specifically to be like I think just because the length of the time and all the different ways she occupy the role of an action star it allowed ultimately for more ways for us to imagine how the female action star can be in media, you know?
59:51.194 --> 59:58.559
[UNKNOWN]: I feel like we have representations like for better or worse black widow like salt like all whoever like Arya Stark let's say it was
59:59.420 --> 01:00:17.360
[UNKNOWN]: You know who occupy like these roles in different ways and different sort of presentations gender presentations as well Yeah, I think that's something you should credit to Zena because it's been here for a while and it did that Yeah, she is but it's fun to have those butch moments with her where like Gabrielle is so chatty and kind of the person who's just walking through being like
01:00:17.440 --> 01:00:28.371
[UNKNOWN]: Wow, I really love being in these new places and having a good time and like wearing her skirts and all of this and then Zina, of course, still in a skirt, like still very feminine and very beautiful.
01:00:28.451 --> 01:00:40.002
[UNKNOWN]: But you have her responses to Gabrielle being like, like, our Gabrielle and just kind of an unearthly, interesting kind of style of response, I think.
01:00:40.362 --> 01:00:47.765
[UNKNOWN]: But so loving to Gabrielle and so and always thinking about how she's going to take care of the people around her and this way They find really interesting.
01:00:47.925 --> 01:00:53.087
[UNKNOWN]: So I love Zina, but the bushness is important like it's good It's awesome.
01:00:53.287 --> 01:01:06.092
[UNKNOWN]: I am glad that she doesn't come across in any other way I got also the way the Zina is built like the way that Lucy lawless is built She looks like she could take you in a fight like the physical presence is a thing
01:01:06.192 --> 01:01:14.352
[UNKNOWN]: She's muscular, you know, obviously she's still like a slim woman, but it's also a different way that a woman has been presenting on our television screen than how it's been before.
01:01:14.373 --> 01:01:15.175
[UNKNOWN]: Huge boobs!
01:01:16.242 --> 01:01:21.668
[UNKNOWN]: huge boobs, but also like shoulders and like muscles, and that's different, you know, you didn't really see that.
01:01:21.728 --> 01:01:29.676
[UNKNOWN]: And also you didn't see someone who is also that much, but also like walking around and skirt, you know, like there was some interesting things happening all over there.
01:01:29.836 --> 01:01:37.123
[UNKNOWN]: That's, I think that was a point worth making, but all that preamble out of the way, shall we get now to our list of, what do I want to call it?
01:01:37.363 --> 01:01:38.625
[UNKNOWN]: Our, our xenorex,
01:01:38.985 --> 01:01:45.189
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's almost to greatest hits, but there's way too many episodes we leave off for it to truly be the greatest hit.
01:01:45.429 --> 01:01:46.470
[UNKNOWN]: I agonized.
01:01:46.510 --> 01:01:47.911
[UNKNOWN]: There's so many episodes.
01:01:47.991 --> 01:01:51.193
[UNKNOWN]: It's like, how did we get out of this without choosing Calisto?
01:01:51.333 --> 01:01:52.494
[UNKNOWN]: But here's what I'll say.
01:01:52.554 --> 01:01:53.195
[UNKNOWN]: I'll say spoiler.
01:01:53.675 --> 01:01:57.677
[UNKNOWN]: Calisto is in the best episode of her killies.
01:01:57.918 --> 01:01:59.459
[UNKNOWN]: So, enjoy that.
01:01:59.559 --> 01:01:59.799
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:01:59.959 --> 01:02:01.620
[UNKNOWN]: And that episode was also not that great.
01:02:01.640 --> 01:02:02.500
[UNKNOWN]: I'm just gonna say that.
01:02:02.580 --> 01:02:03.061
[UNKNOWN]: It's fine.
01:02:03.201 --> 01:02:04.942
[UNKNOWN]: She saves it, but oh my God.
01:02:05.002 --> 01:02:07.223
[UNKNOWN]: Her Achilles, we gave you all the ingredients.
01:02:07.623 --> 01:02:08.783
[UNKNOWN]: What is wrong with you people?
01:02:08.804 --> 01:02:09.904
[UNKNOWN]: Anyway, besides the point, okay.
01:02:10.765 --> 01:02:14.346
[UNKNOWN]: reveal to us Sarah your first pick.
01:02:18.739 --> 01:02:23.764
[UNKNOWN]: That would be hooves in Harlitz, which I think is about the eighth episode of the series.
01:02:23.784 --> 01:02:34.634
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not sure exactly what number it is, where shit gets real gay and I take it with a grain of salt because the first episode to me is gay as hell.
01:02:34.634 --> 01:02:37.796
[UNKNOWN]: extremely gay, extremely gay.
01:02:37.996 --> 01:02:39.778
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, it's not so dissimilar, right?
01:02:39.818 --> 01:02:58.491
[UNKNOWN]: Her experience in that first episode, not so dissimilar to any queer person living in a small town who doesn't believe that they'll ever be understood is like, maybe we don't have Zina that we follow specifically out of that town, but we do follow the promise of a more interesting life to another place.
01:02:58.751 --> 01:03:03.014
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that that's why Gabrielle from the beginning to the end, quite to dig.
01:03:03.334 --> 01:03:05.395
[UNKNOWN]: We got to come up with some hand signals or something.
01:03:05.935 --> 01:03:09.417
[UNKNOWN]: And I, this was obviously the utmost praise.
01:03:09.977 --> 01:03:11.998
[UNKNOWN]: And it was an complimentary bracket.
01:03:12.018 --> 01:03:12.738
[UNKNOWN]: So complimentary.
01:03:13.119 --> 01:03:16.760
[UNKNOWN]: Very complimentary and also often how I refer to myself.
01:03:17.240 --> 01:03:19.501
[UNKNOWN]: But I relate to Gabrielle.
01:03:19.561 --> 01:03:26.145
[UNKNOWN]: So once we get to this place because I think at the beginning, they don't quite know what's going to happen with Gabrielle, right?
01:03:26.185 --> 01:03:31.447
[UNKNOWN]: Like it seems like they're giving themselves a lot of room to be able to write her out of the show.
01:03:31.687 --> 01:03:48.884
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but then it's like by the time you start to kind of go through they're like, okay, what are we going to do with her because she can't always and here's what I really respect about this show, too, is that they get to that place and they go, oh, let's give her something to do then during these fight scenes instead of just being the damsel and okay.
01:03:48.944 --> 01:03:53.429
[UNKNOWN]: to like Star Trek next generation, six seasons to get Troy something to do.
01:03:53.509 --> 01:03:53.829
[UNKNOWN]: Right?
01:03:53.909 --> 01:03:55.831
[UNKNOWN]: So they were like, let's give her a pants.
01:03:56.011 --> 01:03:58.133
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, suddenly she could run around with a gun.
01:03:58.294 --> 01:03:58.794
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:03:58.954 --> 01:04:00.676
[UNKNOWN]: It was just like once that happens.
01:04:00.716 --> 01:04:05.060
[UNKNOWN]: Now I am not criticizing cleavage era Troy because that was formative.
01:04:05.961 --> 01:04:35.232
[UNKNOWN]: But I am going to say that once Gabrielle joins the Amazon's, which is what happens in this episode, all bets are off, she gets so good, and this is where I think one of the most pivotal moments in her entire trajectory, because so far we haven't seen that much of Zina's trajectory other than she shows up, she tries to do good, you know, we get way more into her story as time goes on, but she means this is a moment where Gabrielle changes, she becomes a different person here, and like more actualize.
01:04:35.432 --> 01:04:36.312
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, exactly.
01:04:36.332 --> 01:04:51.758
[UNKNOWN]: I think you really picked up on, as I was rewatching it, I had that frustration with Gabrielle, where I was just like, are you gonna loan wolf and cup this and like have her be like the annoying child and I feel like they were playing around with that like you were saying they didn't really know what they were exactly going to do with her.
01:04:51.878 --> 01:04:57.920
[UNKNOWN]: I feel like, but yeah, I think the Amazon princess arc and also kind of just say I'm really excited that you pick this because it means we get to talk Amazon.
01:04:57.940 --> 01:05:04.703
[UNKNOWN]: It would be good to talk about, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah
01:05:05.692 --> 01:05:08.094
[UNKNOWN]: Every time it says the name Daniel McCormick.
01:05:08.154 --> 01:05:12.876
[UNKNOWN]: I'm like, this is gonna be a good episode I can't so happy.
01:05:12.956 --> 01:05:18.359
[UNKNOWN]: She is really amazing the actress definitely is really tremendous I'm so glad that she stuck with us for so long.
01:05:18.399 --> 01:05:18.800
[UNKNOWN]: She's great.
01:05:18.860 --> 01:05:22.041
[UNKNOWN]: I remember when she first popped up I was like, oh, you've got something.
01:05:22.061 --> 01:05:25.003
[UNKNOWN]: I really hope you come back She ended up becoming the longest running Amazon.
01:05:25.063 --> 01:05:26.624
[UNKNOWN]: I think I think so to have a habit of just
01:05:26.684 --> 01:05:29.206
[UNKNOWN]: killing the Amazon's or just like getting rid of them.
01:05:29.386 --> 01:05:31.887
[UNKNOWN]: And so I'm really glad that she actually stuck around in the beginning part of the plot.
01:05:31.967 --> 01:05:33.348
[UNKNOWN]: So who's in Harlitz?
01:05:33.688 --> 01:05:52.079
[UNKNOWN]: Basic story is Gabrielle saves an Amazon princess and then accidentally doesn't save her but like puts her life in the line to try and save her and in her dying breath, the Amazon princess gives her something called the right of cast which is basically your princess now and also you have to avenge me.
01:05:52.179 --> 01:06:06.309
[UNKNOWN]: This also, I think, hits for the long running story arc with Gabrielle, where it's like her negotiating with the idea of past Phism and the idea of beginning a warrior and also her role as the companion of a warrior as the bard and what that might change her.
01:06:06.569 --> 01:06:12.133
[UNKNOWN]: And how much she wants it to change her, but also like this is the first episode where she sees I guess the fact that it's a double edge sword.
01:06:12.413 --> 01:06:34.757
[UNKNOWN]: that becomes a long running storyline with Gabrielle that while I think in the last final seasons it takes some interesting turns and ends up I will say like in the last run kind of just being I guess summarized in a way that makes me kind of feel like it was just a bit rushed they needed to get to a point but the plot line that I love the most you know on this rewatch technically first watch because I forgot all about
01:06:35.317 --> 01:06:54.269
[UNKNOWN]: Most of it I really resonated with Gabrielle and that was like kind of shocking to me because I don't think I loved Gabrielle when I watched the show growing up I remember finding her a bit annoying when I watched those earlier episodes and it took short hair Gabrielle Which is when I remember having actual memories for me to really gravitate to her I actually one of the first episodes I ever watched of the show.
01:06:54.349 --> 01:06:58.351
[UNKNOWN]: It's the one where Gabrielle takes the move to awards I'm not a pacifist.
01:06:58.451 --> 01:07:04.095
[UNKNOWN]: I am a lawyer now after the NDR when Kila Stowe scost That episode rocks
01:07:05.836 --> 01:07:13.981
[UNKNOWN]: When I tell you like possibly contender for one of my favorite scenes, when Gabrielle makes that choice to be like, no, for Zina, I am a warrior and crosses that line.
01:07:14.021 --> 01:07:17.803
[UNKNOWN]: That was a culmination of such intricate and beautiful story work.
01:07:17.823 --> 01:07:19.925
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, you were talking about this earlier about the scripting.
01:07:20.085 --> 01:07:24.567
[UNKNOWN]: The writing of this show when it's touching, specifically that story are, I think it's like truly beautiful.
01:07:24.747 --> 01:07:26.188
[UNKNOWN]: You saved me Zina.
01:07:26.288 --> 01:07:29.010
[UNKNOWN]: She says in that episode, it's just so beautiful.
01:07:29.150 --> 01:07:33.312
[UNKNOWN]: It's the great love story of historically accurate ancient Greece.
01:07:38.154 --> 01:07:43.296
[UNKNOWN]: I want to talk about this because I was thinking about how interesting the Amazon's are for Gabrielle.
01:07:43.356 --> 01:07:45.417
[UNKNOWN]: And of course I have much to say about pacifism.
01:07:45.457 --> 01:07:49.158
[UNKNOWN]: I think that pacifism is one of the greatest, most misunderstood things that people
01:07:49.578 --> 01:07:50.078
[UNKNOWN]: talk about.
01:07:50.158 --> 01:07:55.479
[UNKNOWN]: People always assume that if you're a pacifist, that means that you will not fight someone who comes at you, right?
01:07:55.679 --> 01:07:58.300
[UNKNOWN]: And like, that's not necessarily always the case.
01:07:58.360 --> 01:08:01.141
[UNKNOWN]: I don't think I think that pacifism is really complicated.
01:08:01.361 --> 01:08:06.722
[UNKNOWN]: It entails a lot of trying not to revert to violence, so easily as we often do, right?
01:08:06.942 --> 01:08:12.303
[UNKNOWN]: There's a lot to say about pacifism that I don't think is very well encompassed in genre.
01:08:12.823 --> 01:08:15.044
[UNKNOWN]: TV and comics, etc.
01:08:15.144 --> 01:08:25.990
[UNKNOWN]: But I also think that Gabrielle actually trying pacifism and her continued attempts to try pacifism are incredibly interesting.
01:08:26.050 --> 01:08:32.354
[UNKNOWN]: And that's where, as I say, who's in Harlem is where she, I love Gabrielle before when she's just the annoying sidekick.
01:08:33.354 --> 01:08:35.316
[UNKNOWN]: this is where she becomes a character.
01:08:35.376 --> 01:08:36.997
[UNKNOWN]: This is where it's like, oh shit.
01:08:37.017 --> 01:08:42.781
[UNKNOWN]: So even if Zina dies, the Gabrielle show could happen because she's a character now.
01:08:42.961 --> 01:08:47.465
[UNKNOWN]: And it's not necessarily related to the fact that now she's learning a violence, right?
01:08:47.505 --> 01:08:52.448
[UNKNOWN]: Because she's been kind of urging Zina to train her and Zina's like, absolutely the fuck not.
01:08:52.468 --> 01:08:54.109
[UNKNOWN]: It's like, I'm not doing that.
01:08:54.410 --> 01:08:59.534
[UNKNOWN]: And she wants to be trained because she's like, I keep doing nothing while you're being attacked.
01:08:59.594 --> 01:09:00.014
[UNKNOWN]: It feels
01:09:00.194 --> 01:09:00.614
[UNKNOWN]: weird.
01:09:00.775 --> 01:09:02.677
[UNKNOWN]: And so she wants to do that.
01:09:02.797 --> 01:09:06.441
[UNKNOWN]: But she never really feels good about murder.
01:09:06.501 --> 01:09:08.703
[UNKNOWN]: Like she never feels good about this stuff.
01:09:08.783 --> 01:09:10.165
[UNKNOWN]: And Zina doesn't either.
01:09:10.385 --> 01:09:15.350
[UNKNOWN]: And so the fact that their lives do kind of start to overlap in this way.
01:09:15.510 --> 01:09:17.973
[UNKNOWN]: And that violence is one of the parts of that.
01:09:18.133 --> 01:09:21.717
[UNKNOWN]: I think is what makes them such a complicated and interesting couple.
01:09:21.977 --> 01:09:38.789
[UNKNOWN]: And once again, you can view them as friends or whatever, but two people who are passionately dedicated to one another, I think that it's interesting how they start to influence each other as time goes on because Nina becomes much more peaceful as time goes on due to her interactions with Gabrielle.
01:09:38.950 --> 01:09:43.093
[UNKNOWN]: And she says Gabrielle is this person who I look up to, Gabrielle's the best person I've ever met.
01:09:43.313 --> 01:09:47.296
[UNKNOWN]: And even when she's disappointed in Gabrielle, they do come back to each other.
01:09:50.878 --> 01:09:53.039
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, Gabrielle gets really gay here.
01:09:53.180 --> 01:09:56.942
[UNKNOWN]: She joins the Amazon's, what could be gayer than that?
01:09:57.122 --> 01:09:59.303
[UNKNOWN]: And she has the centaur.
01:09:59.403 --> 01:10:01.664
[UNKNOWN]: Centaur's are supposed to be the masculine men.
01:10:01.684 --> 01:10:05.907
[UNKNOWN]: And like, Amazon's are the, you know, slightly masculine women.
01:10:06.227 --> 01:10:09.629
[UNKNOWN]: And they've been budding heads for quite a long time.
01:10:09.689 --> 01:10:13.311
[UNKNOWN]: And nobody remembers the origins of it, but we just hate each other whatever.
01:10:13.931 --> 01:10:19.875
[UNKNOWN]: And so men hate women, men have remarks, women are from Venus or whatever is happening here.
01:10:20.635 --> 01:10:21.275
[UNKNOWN]: guys.
01:10:21.335 --> 01:10:24.716
[UNKNOWN]: This is like pretty reflective, but it's fun, it's fun.
01:10:24.876 --> 01:10:27.597
[UNKNOWN]: So the princess who died they believe that the centaur's did it.
01:10:27.717 --> 01:10:45.422
[UNKNOWN]: Now naturally we know from where we're standing that it's actually this bullshit warlord who's just trying to exploit the situation is almost like people who start wars usually stand a profit from them and it can't carry the person you don't like that you think is to blame for it.
01:10:45.562 --> 01:10:45.982
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know.
01:10:46.002 --> 01:10:46.082
[UNKNOWN]: So
01:10:46.102 --> 01:10:49.904
[UNKNOWN]: So that's one of the messages, perhaps, of this episode.
01:10:50.504 --> 01:10:52.965
[UNKNOWN]: Gabrielle has to join the Amazon's.
01:10:53.165 --> 01:10:59.348
[UNKNOWN]: And then she has to take vengeance on the person, or revenge on the person who, apparently.
01:10:59.388 --> 01:11:00.189
[UNKNOWN]: I love that.
01:11:00.209 --> 01:11:01.349
[UNKNOWN]: Revengeance is great.
01:11:01.389 --> 01:11:02.470
[UNKNOWN]: Who killed the princess?
01:11:02.810 --> 01:11:04.691
[UNKNOWN]: Or she gets killed basically.
01:11:04.911 --> 01:11:07.452
[UNKNOWN]: But she's like, I don't want to kill anybody.
01:11:07.472 --> 01:11:09.433
[UNKNOWN]: We're only eight episodes in.
01:11:09.473 --> 01:11:11.974
[UNKNOWN]: We have to be at least 15 or 16 episodes.
01:11:11.994 --> 01:11:12.294
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:11:12.334 --> 01:11:12.595
[UNKNOWN]: Right.
01:11:12.615 --> 01:11:13.295
[UNKNOWN]: Kill somebody.
01:11:13.315 --> 01:11:14.756
[UNKNOWN]: We're trying to get this indication.
01:11:14.776 --> 01:11:15.496
[UNKNOWN]: You're not going to die.
01:11:15.816 --> 01:11:25.026
[UNKNOWN]: her losing her virginity and her killing a person are like these weird overlying themes that just kind of follow her and tell these things happen.
01:11:25.186 --> 01:11:30.892
[UNKNOWN]: It's very interesting like she brings up the virgin constantly and she brings up never having killed somebody.
01:11:31.293 --> 01:11:32.434
[UNKNOWN]: Those are not the same thing.
01:11:32.594 --> 01:11:36.819
[UNKNOWN]: But it's interesting how how comfortable they are, right?
01:11:37.399 --> 01:11:44.529
[UNKNOWN]: Like in this series, I digress, who's in highlight the reason that I chose it is because it's a brilliant Gabrielle spotlight.
01:11:44.710 --> 01:11:47.614
[UNKNOWN]: Obviously, Zina does detective work and saves the day.
01:11:47.854 --> 01:11:54.003
[UNKNOWN]: What I really love about this is that Zina and Gabrielle have this beautiful polyamorous relationship.
01:11:54.283 --> 01:12:04.150
[UNKNOWN]: to the point that every time Gabrielle is just like, I'm gonna hang out with all of them, because Nina's like, well, I don't do anything I wouldn't do and just like, walks off to solve a mystery.
01:12:04.190 --> 01:12:06.471
[UNKNOWN]: And she's like, let me go, let me go for a favor.
01:12:06.591 --> 01:12:07.792
[UNKNOWN]: Maybe don't kill them all.
01:12:07.952 --> 01:12:09.453
[UNKNOWN]: Like, Zina has in the past.
01:12:10.094 --> 01:12:12.555
[UNKNOWN]: I think that's also because Nina seems so killed many.
01:12:12.775 --> 01:12:14.056
[UNKNOWN]: She's killed many in Amazon.
01:12:14.116 --> 01:12:15.337
[UNKNOWN]: Let's not forget that.
01:12:15.997 --> 01:12:28.205
[UNKNOWN]: You're not an Amazon, but you know our way is I love that because I'm like that's how we're so fucking gay Everything about this episode to me is very very homosexual But it's like you're not a lesbian, but bisexual you're bisexual you know
01:12:30.237 --> 01:12:33.178
[UNKNOWN]: If you've done this before, what are your, he is affinity.
01:12:33.558 --> 01:12:37.018
[UNKNOWN]: So, Ebony ends up falling in love with this centaur.
01:12:37.058 --> 01:12:39.299
[UNKNOWN]: They actually have a really sweet relationship.
01:12:39.619 --> 01:12:49.201
[UNKNOWN]: Until they gave birth, she gives birth to the most disgusting creature that has ever been depicted on television at the close the episode and stop for a day or two.
01:12:49.221 --> 01:12:50.201
[UNKNOWN]: What the fuck was that?
01:12:51.162 --> 01:12:52.522
[UNKNOWN]: Topper, Rahm Ramey.
01:12:53.888 --> 01:12:55.069
[UNKNOWN]: I will not forgive that.
01:12:55.109 --> 01:12:59.931
[UNKNOWN]: We need to talk about this because if it's just going to be left hanging, I don't know how we're going to move on.
01:12:59.951 --> 01:13:02.272
[UNKNOWN]: There's a centaur baby being burst.
01:13:02.353 --> 01:13:05.434
[UNKNOWN]: That's also the episode where Zina invented midwife a reeds.
01:13:05.474 --> 01:13:06.875
[UNKNOWN]: Zina invented a lot of things.
01:13:06.975 --> 01:13:08.576
[UNKNOWN]: She invented electricity.
01:13:08.656 --> 01:13:09.756
[UNKNOWN]: She has like a diet.
01:13:09.836 --> 01:13:11.577
[UNKNOWN]: And she invented electricity.
01:13:11.597 --> 01:13:12.598
[UNKNOWN]: So there you have it.
01:13:12.858 --> 01:13:15.081
[UNKNOWN]: She like invent medicine and becoming a doctor.
01:13:15.101 --> 01:13:16.262
[UNKNOWN]: He's like, Oh, look at that.
01:13:16.302 --> 01:13:19.265
[UNKNOWN]: I just invented doing a triage Look at that.
01:13:19.306 --> 01:13:21.027
[UNKNOWN]: I just invented splints, I guess.
01:13:21.128 --> 01:13:21.688
[UNKNOWN]: She did.
01:13:21.949 --> 01:13:25.733
[UNKNOWN]: It was just like I just invented bedside matter She is truly tremendous.
01:13:25.753 --> 01:13:28.456
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Zeno where your princess invented the internet.
01:13:28.977 --> 01:13:29.958
[UNKNOWN]: I have many skills
01:13:31.659 --> 01:13:53.129
[UNKNOWN]: Actually, this is a point because I want to get back to Hoops and Harla's because I did the conversation specifically about like violence, paying some things in my head, but I do think maybe this is a good point for us to talk about quote-unquote 10 years ago when Zina was bad to explain whenever the show wants to talk about Zina's past it's 10 years ago They were like whatever it was it was 10 years ago
01:13:54.672 --> 01:14:02.014
[UNKNOWN]: There is an unintended consequence, which is if you try to put all the stuff she did in these flashbacks in a timeline, it's impossible.
01:14:02.174 --> 01:14:03.754
[UNKNOWN]: It's humanly impossible.
01:14:04.214 --> 01:14:05.395
[UNKNOWN]: I actually took some notes.
01:14:05.575 --> 01:14:07.835
[UNKNOWN]: Let me see if I can give a brief overview.
01:14:07.955 --> 01:14:19.398
[UNKNOWN]: There was a specific year where I remember laughing a lot about this where she got pregnant, but also she went to China while pregnant, and then she went from China back to like Iran to like have the baby.
01:14:24.759 --> 01:14:25.640
[UNKNOWN]: Truly amazing.
01:14:25.660 --> 01:14:32.325
[UNKNOWN]: She has a girlfriend in China and is on seasers, but with a girlfriend too.
01:14:32.345 --> 01:14:37.109
[UNKNOWN]: She's also fucking hell in of Troy She does fuck hell in of Troy.
01:14:37.169 --> 01:14:40.251
[UNKNOWN]: You're like, who does she girl like really?
01:14:40.772 --> 01:14:42.053
[UNKNOWN]: Her travels are many
01:14:42.233 --> 01:14:43.734
[UNKNOWN]: who's Cleopatra eventually.
01:14:43.754 --> 01:14:43.994
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:14:44.115 --> 01:14:46.136
[UNKNOWN]: That is one of my favorite things about Zina.
01:14:46.196 --> 01:14:52.902
[UNKNOWN]: Is that all of the villains are just someone that Zina has a bad history with right before these show started and she became good.
01:14:52.942 --> 01:14:57.826
[UNKNOWN]: That is so wonderfully camped to me, but it's such a great engine because it means that you get like right a story.
01:14:57.866 --> 01:15:00.188
[UNKNOWN]: You have a reason why this person is there and hates her.
01:15:00.308 --> 01:15:01.329
[UNKNOWN]: It just works so well.
01:15:01.489 --> 01:15:02.229
[UNKNOWN]: Love that so well.
01:15:02.249 --> 01:15:03.170
[UNKNOWN]: It does.
01:15:03.270 --> 01:15:08.435
[UNKNOWN]: Why this person hates and has incredible sexual tension with her which is basically all of her villains.
01:15:08.475 --> 01:15:08.755
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:15:08.835 --> 01:15:10.356
[UNKNOWN]: We got Draco for a hot sex.
01:15:10.376 --> 01:15:11.237
[UNKNOWN]: Fucking Draco just kidding.
01:15:12.811 --> 01:15:14.012
[UNKNOWN]: But let's give a brief overview.
01:15:14.032 --> 01:15:15.092
[UNKNOWN]: We can't actually cover everything.
01:15:15.112 --> 01:15:21.836
[UNKNOWN]: What can you give me, be a greatest hits in your opinion of all the things that like evil Zina did from when she accidentally got her brother killed and then decided to take the army that she raised and then go and become a warlord.
01:15:21.856 --> 01:15:23.177
[UNKNOWN]: Well, the funniest thing she does is hockey always.
01:15:23.197 --> 01:15:31.762
[UNKNOWN]: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
01:15:32.986 --> 01:15:33.807
[UNKNOWN]: so that's good.
01:15:34.508 --> 01:15:39.053
[UNKNOWN]: So even as an evil person, there was some good in the final two episodes.
01:15:39.073 --> 01:15:42.658
[UNKNOWN]: There's like a mushroom cloud situation happening there and you're just lying.
01:15:42.678 --> 01:15:44.580
[UNKNOWN]: There was a mushroom cloud situation.
01:15:44.600 --> 01:15:51.569
[UNKNOWN]: I believe there was also like she turned a bunch of I want to say Chinese army into stone at a certain point as well.
01:15:52.239 --> 01:15:59.381
[UNKNOWN]: Maybe the worst thing that she does is still doing the herrom dances, but these other atrocities are quite big.
01:15:59.421 --> 01:15:59.981
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, I didn't know.
01:16:00.001 --> 01:16:03.002
[UNKNOWN]: I think fucking barrias was a great match.
01:16:03.082 --> 01:16:03.842
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, good point.
01:16:04.962 --> 01:16:10.364
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, or that one boring dad that she almost has sex with and then she's like, I can't be here.
01:16:10.404 --> 01:16:11.384
[UNKNOWN]: I've got to go in.
01:16:11.444 --> 01:16:14.565
[UNKNOWN]: It's very early on in the series, but he's such a boring dad.
01:16:15.945 --> 01:16:30.054
[UNKNOWN]: he's like you should know but that boring and he's just like oh well you should give up being Zina and raise my kids with me or whatever and she's like I would love to but I actually just met this blonde girl and I gotta go goodbye.
01:16:30.675 --> 01:16:35.358
[UNKNOWN]: I'm teaching her to like fight and finger it is what it is it is having fun I can't do this.
01:16:36.908 --> 01:16:38.408
[UNKNOWN]: Yato Zita has a story life.
01:16:38.608 --> 01:16:39.749
[UNKNOWN]: I guess we'll get to it.
01:16:40.209 --> 01:16:40.909
[UNKNOWN]: It's wild.
01:16:41.149 --> 01:16:43.949
[UNKNOWN]: She kills colistos whole family at some point.
01:16:43.969 --> 01:16:44.910
[UNKNOWN]: She burns the village.
01:16:44.950 --> 01:16:46.350
[UNKNOWN]: She gets her legs broken.
01:16:46.370 --> 01:16:47.890
[UNKNOWN]: She's fucks Caesar.
01:16:48.050 --> 01:16:49.430
[UNKNOWN]: She's betrayed by Caesar.
01:16:49.650 --> 01:16:51.031
[UNKNOWN]: She goes to Ireland.
01:16:51.691 --> 01:16:53.551
[UNKNOWN]: Traveled with Budica at some point.
01:16:53.771 --> 01:16:54.171
[UNKNOWN]: Oh yeah.
01:16:54.191 --> 01:16:57.212
[UNKNOWN]: Budicea sees me a couple of slaves taught her magic.
01:16:57.472 --> 01:16:59.452
[UNKNOWN]: Unfortunately, a lot has happened.
01:16:59.892 --> 01:17:03.613
[UNKNOWN]: There was a black guy called Marcus that she was with that was the greatest level for life.
01:17:03.893 --> 01:17:08.296
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, for one episode and he's really fun.
01:17:08.356 --> 01:17:09.257
[UNKNOWN]: I liked that guy.
01:17:09.277 --> 01:17:12.339
[UNKNOWN]: I wish that they didn't kill him at the end I was like he's really cute.
01:17:12.439 --> 01:17:21.965
[UNKNOWN]: We have these ciphers that we don't really enjoy in Zeefers like okay Whatever they died it doesn't matter, but I think Marcus they at least take time and care With that character.
01:17:21.985 --> 01:17:23.326
[UNKNOWN]: He's compelling.
01:17:23.386 --> 01:17:29.650
[UNKNOWN]: They have like a fun like they work together kind of reverite romance I'm not sure, but I could have been
01:17:30.191 --> 01:17:32.713
[UNKNOWN]: If they brought him back, it is like a shame.
01:17:32.753 --> 01:17:45.347
[UNKNOWN]: Also like that early era of Zena was when they were still like having a lot of boyfriends of the week to try and like pair them off This is during the era when they were like, okay, maybe we can still pretend they're heterosexual before they're really truly bound to that Actually, this is a question.
01:17:45.367 --> 01:17:48.550
[UNKNOWN]: Who is your least favorite boyfriend of the week either Zena or Gabrielle?
01:17:48.770 --> 01:17:50.051
[UNKNOWN]: Oh gosh.
01:17:50.291 --> 01:17:53.293
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, in that first season, they've got some rough ones.
01:17:53.433 --> 01:18:02.560
[UNKNOWN]: The dude who, like, the Titans episode where everything is that weirdly abusive, therupple of the Titans.
01:18:02.880 --> 01:18:06.462
[UNKNOWN]: And then you have the guy, he's pretty useless.
01:18:06.663 --> 01:18:15.989
[UNKNOWN]: One of the early ones who I think is kind of funny is the one in the death episode where he's just like, oh no, like, whenever death comes back, I'm going to have to die because I'm terminally
01:18:16.509 --> 01:18:26.196
[UNKNOWN]: So I guess you'll never be able to lose your virginity in a me better go lose it to Zina warrior princess instead There was also the one what is it when Gabrielle was in university?
01:18:26.216 --> 01:18:27.757
[UNKNOWN]: It was like a flashback episode.
01:18:27.777 --> 01:18:28.977
[UNKNOWN]: That guy is so useless.
01:18:29.157 --> 01:18:32.640
[UNKNOWN]: Is it Aristotle was she like all those having sex with her stop amazing
01:18:33.640 --> 01:18:37.263
[UNKNOWN]: And you're just like, of course you would find the most annoying dude.
01:18:37.283 --> 01:18:43.486
[UNKNOWN]: But I do feel like at this time Gabrielle's really just flailing and trying to find some the red of heterosexuality to follow.
01:18:43.546 --> 01:18:50.211
[UNKNOWN]: To the point that she then has a recurring romance with that guy, verticus or whatever, who gets killed.
01:18:50.511 --> 01:18:51.511
[UNKNOWN]: I don't approve of that.
01:18:51.591 --> 01:18:52.692
[UNKNOWN]: Bye, Calisto.
01:18:52.832 --> 01:18:57.875
[UNKNOWN]: So we can say that Calisto is many things, but she is an ally because she killed verticus.
01:18:57.975 --> 01:19:00.817
[UNKNOWN]: I longed to be whaling over the body of your friend.
01:19:00.957 --> 01:19:02.138
[UNKNOWN]: Well, it's not going to happen.
01:19:02.498 --> 01:19:06.861
[UNKNOWN]: Well, she's an ally right up until she undergoes conversion therapy in her last few of that.
01:19:06.961 --> 01:19:09.722
[UNKNOWN]: It does happen that definitely does happen.
01:19:10.122 --> 01:19:10.763
[UNKNOWN]: Unfortunately.
01:19:10.783 --> 01:19:15.565
[UNKNOWN]: When she's first showing up, she's like, fuck this guy, I shit Zina and Gabrielle.
01:19:15.745 --> 01:19:21.749
[UNKNOWN]: And she's also the person who's the most likely to call them gay to their faces because that entire series.
01:19:21.849 --> 01:19:25.931
[UNKNOWN]: She's constantly being like, yeah, Zina, where's your friend for life?
01:19:26.091 --> 01:19:29.813
[UNKNOWN]: And that's what they would call a roommate back then, historically.
01:19:32.240 --> 01:19:34.582
[UNKNOWN]: She's a glycism, it will get to glycism.
01:19:34.662 --> 01:19:44.468
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, this episode, we have Effony, who's like, get fucked, Gabrielle, like hates Gabrielle because she wants to be the princess.
01:19:44.608 --> 01:19:49.752
[UNKNOWN]: And she's just like, wow, I've been out here working my ass off for like a million goddamn years.
01:19:49.852 --> 01:19:52.454
[UNKNOWN]: And this asshole just walks in and becomes the princess.
01:19:52.474 --> 01:19:53.774
[UNKNOWN]: And she doesn't even know how to fight.
01:19:53.935 --> 01:19:58.538
[UNKNOWN]: This lady sucks, and Gabrielle's just like, well, I'm sure I'll charm you in the end.
01:19:59.158 --> 01:20:01.000
[UNKNOWN]: And so they eventually become friends.
01:20:01.140 --> 01:20:11.188
[UNKNOWN]: You did just make me think of the fact that there's an element of this episode where they're tipping their hat towards Diana of Themyskira, a little bit, because I feel like they knew this was something they'll have to eventually later on in the series.
01:20:11.409 --> 01:20:16.273
[UNKNOWN]: We have a character that was like a doppelganger who's in a name Princess Diana, which I thought was fantastic.
01:20:16.333 --> 01:20:17.394
[UNKNOWN]: Great job.
01:20:17.614 --> 01:20:18.295
[UNKNOWN]: Love a reference.
01:20:19.215 --> 01:20:29.297
[UNKNOWN]: I love that they brought in the Amazon's really early as well and really make the relevance and important to the world There's a tone they are important to seeing us back story, but there's a mythology to them There is a structure to them.
01:20:29.377 --> 01:20:45.660
[UNKNOWN]: I think as you watch this show and they return to the Amazon's on and off I think it's really fun how in different regions you can tell the Amazon's address differently Sometimes problematically, but I thought that was a really interesting acute touch I know there was a while where they almost commissioned an Amazon spin-off for the show Amazon hi
01:20:46.200 --> 01:20:50.462
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, and that starred Selma Blair as a student who was transported to the past.
01:20:50.622 --> 01:20:51.663
[UNKNOWN]: You can watch the pilot.
01:20:51.723 --> 01:20:52.063
[UNKNOWN]: You can't.
01:20:52.123 --> 01:20:52.924
[UNKNOWN]: It's horrible.
01:20:53.084 --> 01:20:53.964
[UNKNOWN]: It's so bad.
01:20:54.464 --> 01:20:56.946
[UNKNOWN]: I think it was also incorporated in the show later on in the season.
01:20:56.986 --> 01:20:57.566
[UNKNOWN]: It's like so bad.
01:20:57.586 --> 01:21:00.808
[UNKNOWN]: But also it has, I do remember her name, but she's also one of the Amazon's.
01:21:00.988 --> 01:21:02.489
[UNKNOWN]: Like the lead from far escape the woman.
01:21:02.509 --> 01:21:03.289
[UNKNOWN]: You don't have to talk about?
01:21:03.429 --> 01:21:05.130
[UNKNOWN]: Is it, you're not talking about Jean and Torres?
01:21:05.290 --> 01:21:05.570
[UNKNOWN]: No, no.
01:21:05.730 --> 01:21:06.351
[UNKNOWN]: Is it far escape?
01:21:06.531 --> 01:21:07.491
[UNKNOWN]: I'm like, no far escape.
01:21:07.711 --> 01:21:08.752
[UNKNOWN]: It's the Australian show.
01:21:08.772 --> 01:21:10.373
[UNKNOWN]: Don't think I watched far escape that mind.
01:21:10.393 --> 01:21:10.813
[UNKNOWN]: Just so I...
01:21:11.153 --> 01:21:12.854
[UNKNOWN]: Fair enough, I attempted for escape.
01:21:12.934 --> 01:21:15.876
[UNKNOWN]: I was recommended to attempt park it, but I just couldn't really do it.
01:21:15.896 --> 01:21:18.878
[UNKNOWN]: I space space stuff What is too spacey?
01:21:18.898 --> 01:21:25.161
[UNKNOWN]: It just doesn't flare my imagination in that way, which is why like Angela Which we talked about in your episode of Best of Shuever.
01:21:25.322 --> 01:21:29.624
[UNKNOWN]: She's space, but also she's like myths I like the myth aspect is what actually gets me.
01:21:29.804 --> 01:21:32.026
[UNKNOWN]: I like that too, but like space stuff I don't get it.
01:21:32.106 --> 01:21:35.087
[UNKNOWN]: The only thing I space I love is Galaxy Quest, so that's mainly because the
01:21:39.390 --> 01:21:44.254
[UNKNOWN]: Meanwhile, I have been getting into space opera lately because I have a friend who's a huge sci-fi fan.
01:21:44.374 --> 01:21:48.678
[UNKNOWN]: And he is always giving me great recommendations that I would never read on my own.
01:21:48.758 --> 01:21:51.080
[UNKNOWN]: And so I've been like, okay, I'm gonna look into this.
01:21:51.260 --> 01:21:55.743
[UNKNOWN]: And then I found out that basically what he's into is space opera, which is the fun.
01:21:55.783 --> 01:22:00.407
[UNKNOWN]: I think Galaxy Quest would almost be space opera because there's a lot of jokes in there.
01:22:00.607 --> 01:22:03.069
[UNKNOWN]: So I've been doing a lot of space opera and it's been fun.
01:22:03.249 --> 01:22:05.211
[UNKNOWN]: So I'll say that, but yeah, it's been a minute.
01:22:05.311 --> 01:22:07.273
[UNKNOWN]: I don't naturally read sci-fi.
01:22:07.733 --> 01:22:12.615
[UNKNOWN]: Well, please give me some wrecks of things you like because it's something that like, I like to find more things in that world that I love.
01:22:12.755 --> 01:22:14.536
[UNKNOWN]: If you find something you love, please pass it on to me.
01:22:14.636 --> 01:22:28.103
[UNKNOWN]: Well, to return to the Amazon's though, the topic of violence, which you brought up earlier, you write very much the conception and the representation, like the depiction of the idea of past phism was very like a rudimentary, let's say, reductive.
01:22:28.283 --> 01:22:30.025
[UNKNOWN]: And it's just like, I could forgive that a little bit.
01:22:30.045 --> 01:22:30.987
[UNKNOWN]: They're doing shorthand.
01:22:31.187 --> 01:22:35.533
[UNKNOWN]: I don't think there's been a lot of, like you said, good representation of what actually positivism is in media.
01:22:35.633 --> 01:22:44.425
[UNKNOWN]: But I think the interpretation they use served the purpose of the storyline about the violence, the show really engages with the topic of violence a lot.
01:22:44.625 --> 01:22:46.145
[UNKNOWN]: that is something I really responded to.
01:22:46.225 --> 01:23:00.970
[UNKNOWN]: It does question the fact that Zina is violent, you know, there's a lot of points in the story where you can see that Zina is gleeful doing active violence and that she is always really at the tip of tipping over, you know, back into villainy.
01:23:01.090 --> 01:23:03.130
[UNKNOWN]: I really love the fact that we're certain episodes.
01:23:03.210 --> 01:23:09.732
[UNKNOWN]: She had an army gather around her the way she used to and she comes very close to becoming a warlord and like Gabrielle is there to pull
01:23:12.348 --> 01:23:18.334
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but I also love the way that it interrogates the idea of nonviolence as well with Gabrielle.
01:23:18.435 --> 01:23:23.980
[UNKNOWN]: I think about the China story arc when that's like part of the rift, almost that they bring on.
01:23:24.000 --> 01:23:29.787
[UNKNOWN]: I want to say season three, the episode the debt, which honorable mention was going to be on my list, but no spoilers.
01:23:30.447 --> 01:23:48.626
[UNKNOWN]: The depth where Vina goes to China to avenge her old mentor by killing the mentor's child and then Gabrielle betrays her by basically making sure that she's unable to do that and getting her arrested and so on But like that's the betrayal and it makes us also question if Zina actually should kill this fucker because he was horrible
01:23:48.846 --> 01:24:06.613
[UNKNOWN]: You know, it makes us aligned with her and it really puts us in difficult situations as a viewer the show really operates taking a very intelligent level on that I'm not sure how I like how they ended up tying up that storyline at the end of the show if you take that because like we said Zina dies at the end and the idea that like, you know, the only way she could redeem herself is through such an act
01:24:06.773 --> 01:24:11.694
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know whether I truly love that as an idea, but I really appreciate the engagement without throughout, you know?
01:24:11.874 --> 01:24:15.636
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I think the way that they interrogate that stuff is always really interesting.
01:24:15.696 --> 01:24:23.758
[UNKNOWN]: They wanted to give Gabrielle Warrior of Peace a shot, give her these tools that weren't harmful, she couldn't.
01:24:23.938 --> 01:24:28.260
[UNKNOWN]: blow dust and somebody's face and make them sleep here or something like that.
01:24:28.340 --> 01:24:35.584
[UNKNOWN]: So these are all very non-leasal things and it's after she's killed somebody and she's just like, look, I can't do this anymore.
01:24:35.644 --> 01:24:41.347
[UNKNOWN]: This is making me not even want to travel with you because the pinches are torture, right?
01:24:42.147 --> 01:24:43.948
[UNKNOWN]: you torture people like every episode.
01:24:43.968 --> 01:24:44.188
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:24:44.328 --> 01:24:49.009
[UNKNOWN]: That idea that there is a justifiable torture is definitely all over this series.
01:24:49.149 --> 01:24:56.292
[UNKNOWN]: Gabrielle's warrior of peace arc ends entirely because Lucy Lawless at the time was either injured or pregnant.
01:24:56.312 --> 01:25:01.013
[UNKNOWN]: I don't remember she had to take a couple of breaks from the show one for a pregnancy one for injury.
01:25:01.193 --> 01:25:04.154
[UNKNOWN]: I believe it was the injury that she did on like the J. Leno show.
01:25:04.174 --> 01:25:06.495
[UNKNOWN]: She like tried to mount a horse and stroke her leg.
01:25:06.696 --> 01:25:10.938
[UNKNOWN]: So Gabrielle has to immediately jump into a more violent scene.
01:25:10.978 --> 01:25:13.419
[UNKNOWN]: Because otherwise we have no fight scenes, right?
01:25:13.479 --> 01:25:14.859
[UNKNOWN]: I think they could have worked around that.
01:25:14.899 --> 01:25:16.940
[UNKNOWN]: And then later in the show, she's pregnant.
01:25:17.360 --> 01:25:20.182
[UNKNOWN]: Well, like they really get her embracing the fighter.
01:25:20.222 --> 01:25:21.502
[UNKNOWN]: But yeah, no, that is like a pattern.
01:25:21.522 --> 01:25:22.723
[UNKNOWN]: This is just what happened in the world.
01:25:22.783 --> 01:25:24.043
[UNKNOWN]: And that's impact of the story.
01:25:24.164 --> 01:25:26.845
[UNKNOWN]: I do think they like really handled it elegantly for the most part.
01:25:26.885 --> 01:25:27.225
[UNKNOWN]: They did.
01:25:27.485 --> 01:25:29.546
[UNKNOWN]: more than a lot of people have done.
01:25:29.566 --> 01:25:36.388
[UNKNOWN]: They're viewing with more dignity because I think a lot of times people go, oh, you're anti-violet, you're a coward.
01:25:36.968 --> 01:25:37.548
[UNKNOWN]: That's it.
01:25:37.768 --> 01:25:39.689
[UNKNOWN]: I just don't want to fight frankly lately.
01:25:39.709 --> 01:25:44.891
[UNKNOWN]: I was really into the reading of the way that Zina treats Gabrielle is kind of
01:25:45.691 --> 01:25:47.312
[UNKNOWN]: you know like I'm protecting you.
01:25:47.352 --> 01:25:48.534
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not going to help you.
01:25:48.734 --> 01:26:08.091
[UNKNOWN]: You have to be a little baby and then you'll and the I mean here's a big one who for like the queers of tax trading here is like how often she is just like why don't you go home and marry that dude or whatever and you're just like that is so brutal and exactly the kind of thing my first girlfriend would have said to me so
01:26:08.571 --> 01:26:14.933
[UNKNOWN]: but it is kind of how she views her over the first season and then over time Gabrielle becomes completely integral to her.
01:26:15.053 --> 01:26:19.114
[UNKNOWN]: The way to separate them then becomes the rift where Gabrielle has betrayed Zina.
01:26:19.594 --> 01:26:23.635
[UNKNOWN]: Like has great reasons for doing it and eventually they bang it out, right?
01:26:23.675 --> 01:26:24.596
[UNKNOWN]: Like that's the end of that.
01:26:27.017 --> 01:26:28.238
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, eventually they bang it up.
01:26:28.358 --> 01:26:47.215
[UNKNOWN]: The way that these two communicate with each other, the way that their lives merge, despite having these very opposite viewpoints, I guess, and experiences, I always find to be very beautiful because they are able to see each other's point of view so well and so clearly without actually
01:26:47.755 --> 01:26:51.758
[UNKNOWN]: so much changing their lives that they aren't recognizable as themselves.
01:26:51.858 --> 01:26:55.221
[UNKNOWN]: They both use each other to find themselves in a lot of ways.
01:26:55.281 --> 01:26:56.361
[UNKNOWN]: That's beautiful.
01:26:56.441 --> 01:26:59.163
[UNKNOWN]: That's about one of the best things you could do in a relationship.
01:26:59.223 --> 01:27:04.167
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that like when the stories at its best, they do that while also remaining uncompromising with who they are.
01:27:04.227 --> 01:27:28.711
[UNKNOWN]: You know, they never like blur each other like you said they learn off of each other and then a really beautiful way the depiction of just like the tenderness and that relationship but also like the steel and like the brutality of their love for each other and their dedication but also like all the ways that it can be fucked up the show operates with that on a lot of different levels and it's always it is the heart of the show they realized it and they really ran with it and I'm so glad that they did yeah.
01:27:28.871 --> 01:27:32.273
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, is there anything else we want to say about who's in Harlitz?
01:27:32.453 --> 01:27:36.636
[UNKNOWN]: Well, eventually at the end, we discovered that the centers were not guilty.
01:27:36.676 --> 01:27:45.662
[UNKNOWN]: It was the corporate warlord asshole guy, Dr. Huffillin Man, and he was taken out very quickly by our friend Zina.
01:27:45.802 --> 01:27:51.085
[UNKNOWN]: But what is the most important is is that now Gabrielle is a warrior princess herself.
01:27:51.365 --> 01:27:53.406
[UNKNOWN]: Forever, that just keeps coming up.
01:27:53.446 --> 01:27:56.368
[UNKNOWN]: She tries to stop being an Amazon several times.
01:27:56.588 --> 01:27:57.369
[UNKNOWN]: It never takes.
01:27:57.749 --> 01:27:59.130
[UNKNOWN]: She loves the Amazon.
01:27:59.250 --> 01:28:01.331
[UNKNOWN]: She goes and hangs out with them all at the time.
01:28:01.531 --> 01:28:02.672
[UNKNOWN]: Effony comes around.
01:28:02.872 --> 01:28:04.833
[UNKNOWN]: Effony is termed by Gabrielle.
01:28:05.113 --> 01:28:06.714
[UNKNOWN]: Is termed by the Centaur.
01:28:07.014 --> 01:28:10.296
[UNKNOWN]: And unfortunately, we're going to lose some of our friends along the way.
01:28:10.496 --> 01:28:14.219
[UNKNOWN]: But Gabrielle does keep going back to the Amazon.
01:28:14.279 --> 01:28:16.060
[UNKNOWN]: Like, you see it whenever Zina dies.
01:28:16.340 --> 01:28:18.941
[UNKNOWN]: She's like, I will just join the Amazon's.
01:28:19.041 --> 01:28:23.664
[UNKNOWN]: And it's like, well, you would find the first place that you could the most easiest find a girlfriend.
01:28:23.744 --> 01:28:24.604
[UNKNOWN]: That's for sure.
01:28:27.366 --> 01:28:30.989
[UNKNOWN]: Whenever Zena dies, I'm going to go see Tena and Sarah live.
01:28:31.009 --> 01:28:34.131
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, exactly.
01:28:34.151 --> 01:28:37.513
[UNKNOWN]: And she has a beautiful, delightful, wonderful moments.
01:28:37.593 --> 01:28:42.917
[UNKNOWN]: And then she has a moment when she's trying to learn the staff swing and she just keeps smacking herself in the face.
01:28:43.037 --> 01:28:46.039
[UNKNOWN]: She has that moment where she's like, oh, no, I don't want to dance.
01:28:46.099 --> 01:28:47.080
[UNKNOWN]: And then she's like, yeah,
01:28:48.395 --> 01:28:51.437
[UNKNOWN]: like five seconds later, Gabrielle probably gets drunk.
01:28:51.477 --> 01:28:54.659
[UNKNOWN]: That's not canonical, but I'm just gonna say probably happens here.
01:28:54.919 --> 01:29:02.483
[UNKNOWN]: And I just think that the sweetness between Zina and Gabrielle is also very clear because Zina's just like, okay, well, you have fun.
01:29:02.503 --> 01:29:09.728
[UNKNOWN]: I'm gonna go do the work, I guess, but I don't want to sleep around the Amazon because I kind of hate me because I keep killing them.
01:29:10.048 --> 01:29:10.308
[UNKNOWN]: Well, let's
01:29:10.468 --> 01:29:16.391
[UNKNOWN]: I hope you have your friends, that's like the friendship thing where they encourage each other to go on missions.
01:29:16.431 --> 01:29:18.692
[UNKNOWN]: I think it's a very beautiful and healthy.
01:29:18.892 --> 01:29:24.555
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I was going to say also on that point to talk a bit about like the relationship of Zina and the Amazon.
01:29:24.635 --> 01:29:30.678
[UNKNOWN]: We talked a bit Gabrielle, but I think this also is the first instance that points us to the fact that there is a history between Zina.
01:29:30.718 --> 01:29:34.180
[UNKNOWN]: There's an ex-girlfriend in the past as there always is who died for Zina.
01:29:35.338 --> 01:29:43.264
[UNKNOWN]: as they all do, you know, and Latzina has a history from her warlord days and I think what the end of developing also for that history is really interesting.
01:29:43.464 --> 01:29:48.888
[UNKNOWN]: One of Zina's major archivillins ends up being someone affiliated with the Amazon's.
01:29:48.988 --> 01:29:53.811
[UNKNOWN]: Actually, this is the question I want to ask now before we transition to my choice, okay?
01:29:53.951 --> 01:29:56.853
[UNKNOWN]: Who is the worst ex-girlfriend?
01:29:57.034 --> 01:29:58.094
[UNKNOWN]: I think you already know.
01:29:58.435 --> 01:29:59.555
[UNKNOWN]: You tell me.
01:29:59.836 --> 01:30:00.596
[UNKNOWN]: You say it out loud.
01:30:00.696 --> 01:30:02.277
[UNKNOWN]: No, I actually think you
01:30:03.418 --> 01:30:08.742
[UNKNOWN]: Well, I'm gonna say God unfortunately, I'm forgetting her name, but she's gonna come up in my episode.
01:30:08.762 --> 01:30:11.384
[UNKNOWN]: Ooh, okay, I see you.
01:30:11.404 --> 01:30:13.445
[UNKNOWN]: She's kind of ex-girlfriendy almost.
01:30:13.485 --> 01:30:13.765
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:30:13.785 --> 01:30:15.166
[UNKNOWN]: Altie, Altie, Altie.
01:30:15.287 --> 01:30:15.447
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:30:15.587 --> 01:30:16.027
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you.
01:30:16.207 --> 01:30:18.229
[UNKNOWN]: Altie's a little ex-girlfriendy.
01:30:18.249 --> 01:30:19.149
[UNKNOWN]: And oh, she is.
01:30:19.249 --> 01:30:19.950
[UNKNOWN]: Of course she is.
01:30:20.070 --> 01:30:24.213
[UNKNOWN]: Very like, I slept with this maniac one time and she will not leave me alone.
01:30:24.333 --> 01:30:26.234
[UNKNOWN]: She keeps showing up to things.
01:30:26.455 --> 01:30:28.076
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know what the deal is.
01:30:28.716 --> 01:30:32.838
[UNKNOWN]: She keeps telling me I will make you feel all the pain that you felt before if you leave me.
01:30:32.898 --> 01:30:33.579
[UNKNOWN]: It's a lot.
01:30:33.699 --> 01:30:34.459
[UNKNOWN]: It's intense.
01:30:34.619 --> 01:30:34.920
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:30:35.060 --> 01:30:36.260
[UNKNOWN]: I think there's some episodes.
01:30:36.280 --> 01:30:42.044
[UNKNOWN]: There's some moments of her that I do like, but I just kind of found I don't know something about her just never really vibe with me.
01:30:42.064 --> 01:30:43.224
[UNKNOWN]: She kind of was just like annoying.
01:30:43.304 --> 01:30:44.565
[UNKNOWN]: I hate it the way she talked.
01:30:44.705 --> 01:30:46.967
[UNKNOWN]: and I hate it that we are laughing a bit too much.
01:30:47.207 --> 01:30:48.628
[UNKNOWN]: It's like, bring back the list.
01:30:48.688 --> 01:30:50.850
[UNKNOWN]: That's usually how I do it in a variety of altias.
01:30:50.870 --> 01:30:52.992
[UNKNOWN]: I'm like, bring back Hudson, like, where's she?
01:30:53.012 --> 01:30:54.613
[UNKNOWN]: It's like, why her?
01:30:54.693 --> 01:31:00.298
[UNKNOWN]: Like, I get people probably liked her and also it means that the Amazon is probably pop up and you like to write the Amazon.
01:31:00.318 --> 01:31:04.141
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, altias never my favorite, but actually, my choice is different.
01:31:04.201 --> 01:31:08.105
[UNKNOWN]: It's a character that I actually like, but I don't like how her story ended up playing out.
01:31:08.265 --> 01:31:10.306
[UNKNOWN]: I think there was a lot of potential that was left on the table.
01:31:10.547 --> 01:31:12.088
[UNKNOWN]: My choice will be in a jarra.
01:31:12.248 --> 01:31:16.250
[UNKNOWN]: That's the person who was on the boat, right?
01:31:16.390 --> 01:31:17.010
[UNKNOWN]: Is that correct?
01:31:17.090 --> 01:31:22.812
[UNKNOWN]: Nejara is the priestess lady who like Gabrielle's ex-girlfriend for a while.
01:31:23.212 --> 01:31:23.732
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:31:24.012 --> 01:31:26.793
[UNKNOWN]: She's the one who's a religious fanatic who hears voices.
01:31:26.833 --> 01:31:29.855
[UNKNOWN]: She's like Gabrielle, I just want to be around you.
01:31:30.055 --> 01:31:34.396
[UNKNOWN]: All of the time, single-white female style and Gabrielle's like, this sounds cool.
01:31:34.416 --> 01:31:38.558
[UNKNOWN]: Like us, like Zena has been telling me to go home for like three seasons.
01:31:39.318 --> 01:31:49.263
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, this is like when we went to like girlfriend of the weak status now, and she's basically like a Xena Alt Zena sort of what if Zena was like a religious fanatic.
01:31:49.303 --> 01:31:56.006
[UNKNOWN]: She's meant to serve the role of offering a path that Gabrielle could possibly take Whether that being betrayed, but I really like the conception of her character.
01:31:56.026 --> 01:32:01.468
[UNKNOWN]: I choose them being locked up and disposed of she could have really probably emerged as one of them Maybe even Callisto status.
01:32:01.488 --> 01:32:03.169
[UNKNOWN]: She could have been like Gabrielle's Callisto
01:32:03.589 --> 01:32:06.652
[UNKNOWN]: Seriously, that's what it looked like they were building too.
01:32:06.712 --> 01:32:08.273
[UNKNOWN]: They were like, okay, cool.
01:32:08.313 --> 01:32:11.676
[UNKNOWN]: They have sexual tension and now she's really pissed at her.
01:32:11.796 --> 01:32:14.098
[UNKNOWN]: So I think they just lost the actress.
01:32:14.198 --> 01:32:17.320
[UNKNOWN]: I think the actress just ended up going to like the mentalists or something.
01:32:17.340 --> 01:32:19.342
[UNKNOWN]: That happened during the interview.
01:32:19.362 --> 01:32:22.945
[UNKNOWN]: Because there's a lot of actors who can't just hang out in New Zealand forever.
01:32:23.065 --> 01:32:27.548
[UNKNOWN]: So a lot of the cast that sticks around is always in New Zealand because they live there.
01:32:27.969 --> 01:32:30.531
[UNKNOWN]: So lots of local actors getting word.
01:32:30.731 --> 01:32:40.496
[UNKNOWN]: One of my favorite activities is just to look at like the goons and the thugs and just to see if they're like the same person for like that episode I started recognizing them after a while that was really fun for me.
01:32:40.516 --> 01:32:43.658
[UNKNOWN]: You're like oh you use the same 30 extras.
01:32:43.758 --> 01:32:44.658
[UNKNOWN]: I love this.
01:32:44.978 --> 01:32:45.498
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:32:45.739 --> 01:32:46.039
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:32:46.239 --> 01:32:48.000
[UNKNOWN]: So on to my pick.
01:32:53.005 --> 01:32:55.366
[UNKNOWN]: Girls just want to have fun season 2.
01:32:55.626 --> 01:33:21.672
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, so to give you the brief description This is Zena does buffie two years before buffie came out kind of basically Zena and Gabrielle are walking along in the woods of Boccus they hear about the fact that a lot of girls have gone missing from the village that we could assume is near this What's they go in they had to investigate and then Joccer pops up Joccer by the way is a character
01:33:22.672 --> 01:33:24.160
[UNKNOWN]: So far he's there moving on.
01:33:25.383 --> 01:33:38.910
[UNKNOWN]: He's a dude who's kind of silly played admirably by I forget his name Ted Ramey played admirably by Ted Ravey Who's very funny very charming he is either loved or hated by the fandom I don't particularly hate him.
01:33:38.990 --> 01:33:40.050
[UNKNOWN]: I don't particularly love him.
01:33:40.131 --> 01:33:52.477
[UNKNOWN]: He's fine He's just annoying when he just comes in and gets all male around them and it seems very like he's breaking up Like it'll be a moment where you're like Shirley now seen a Gabrielle Lucas and then he's like burp a burp a burp a
01:33:53.057 --> 01:33:55.908
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, he just pops in like this idiot.
01:33:55.928 --> 01:33:56.992
[UNKNOWN]: Nina's like, leave.
01:33:57.880 --> 01:34:00.181
[UNKNOWN]: It's just like an instant cold shower, a pops-up on this screen.
01:34:00.201 --> 01:34:03.422
[UNKNOWN]: But he pops up, he says, he is, I guess they're to help them.
01:34:03.622 --> 01:34:13.245
[UNKNOWN]: And they realize that, okay, if Boccus is here, that means that what we need to do to defeat this proto vampire demon creator, what we need is Orfius and his liar.
01:34:13.345 --> 01:34:20.367
[UNKNOWN]: And guess what, Joccer has Orfius in a little bag, because Orfius, if you know the myth, was consumed by the Boccus until he was just a head.
01:34:20.547 --> 01:34:23.888
[UNKNOWN]: Then they go, so I just remembered the song in this episode.
01:34:24.208 --> 01:34:28.549
[UNKNOWN]: Come on, come on, you want to my love if you've got a thing to apply.
01:34:29.229 --> 01:34:30.489
[UNKNOWN]: That song is criminal.
01:34:30.850 --> 01:34:33.190
[UNKNOWN]: They go to a queer dance party.
01:34:33.490 --> 01:34:37.571
[UNKNOWN]: And Gabrielle is overlooking the dancing happening.
01:34:37.751 --> 01:34:41.272
[UNKNOWN]: And then Joccer's just like, oh, you want to like go do this.
01:34:41.372 --> 01:34:43.732
[UNKNOWN]: And she's like shut the fuck up.
01:34:43.872 --> 01:34:49.294
[UNKNOWN]: And like goes down to join the queer dance party, where she becomes a lesbian vampire.
01:34:49.594 --> 01:34:50.954
[UNKNOWN]: That actually all happened, too.
01:34:51.094 --> 01:34:53.816
[UNKNOWN]: It does, she starts transforming into a vampire.
01:34:53.876 --> 01:34:54.577
[UNKNOWN]: A Bokai.
01:34:54.717 --> 01:34:58.960
[UNKNOWN]: I just also want to note, by the way, this episode is like wild.
01:34:59.201 --> 01:35:02.103
[UNKNOWN]: It is edited in the most wild way.
01:35:02.183 --> 01:35:05.506
[UNKNOWN]: It is acted in the like weirdest, it's like drag.
01:35:05.526 --> 01:35:12.131
[UNKNOWN]: G-I-Horpies, the legend of Orfias, like, it was being in the colors.
01:35:12.211 --> 01:35:18.597
[UNKNOWN]: There's Arabic music at some point, while sexy dancing is happening, there's a rap, ah, there's like, woo!
01:35:18.617 --> 01:35:20.018
[UNKNOWN]: There's a rap group.
01:35:20.598 --> 01:35:21.960
[UNKNOWN]: There's a wrap.
01:35:22.200 --> 01:35:23.081
[UNKNOWN]: There's a wrap.
01:35:23.441 --> 01:35:25.082
[UNKNOWN]: There's a wrap.
01:35:26.384 --> 01:35:28.305
[UNKNOWN]: I can say anything more.
01:35:28.646 --> 01:35:33.350
[UNKNOWN]: I will be playing it at some point around here I just want you to experience this wrap with me.
01:35:33.550 --> 01:35:35.272
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, have we all gotten through that together?
01:35:35.352 --> 01:35:36.293
[UNKNOWN]: Let's be boxed with me
01:35:37.245 --> 01:36:04.670
[UNKNOWN]: So basically, as Gabrielle gets turned into a lesbian vampire killer, she's traveling with them and then as they're trying to investigate figure out this Gabrielle obviously turns into a back eye and then start attacking them and it's all scary and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah and then Zina goes to try and save her, but then the only way she could save her is if she becomes a back eye if they kiss, it's basically that it's like well, I guess also tough to kiss you on the neck.
01:36:04.810 --> 01:36:05.090
[UNKNOWN]: Yes,
01:36:05.370 --> 01:36:11.114
[UNKNOWN]: And then there's like this really amazing sexual shock of xenotransforming into a vampire.
01:36:11.255 --> 01:36:15.178
[UNKNOWN]: Oh my god, those those contacts those eye contacts they have on them.
01:36:15.398 --> 01:36:16.799
[UNKNOWN]: This lick back hair by the way.
01:36:16.859 --> 01:36:21.482
[UNKNOWN]: For some reason all the vampires just suddenly have like yellow and red eyes and slick back hair.
01:36:22.743 --> 01:36:25.144
[UNKNOWN]: And it's so fun and so stupid, it's so cowb.
01:36:25.204 --> 01:36:25.504
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:36:25.564 --> 01:36:33.228
[UNKNOWN]: There is an interesting precursor to buffy scene where there's two innocent women who are walking, they are being approached by men who are asking them.
01:36:33.328 --> 01:36:35.509
[UNKNOWN]: But then they turned out to be the villains, really.
01:36:35.609 --> 01:36:40.051
[UNKNOWN]: And they turned into vampires and then they attacked them and they said, Darlah, who, Darlah?
01:36:40.171 --> 01:36:59.662
[UNKNOWN]: We did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena, did it for Xena,
01:36:59.762 --> 01:37:18.336
[UNKNOWN]: At the end, Zina turns into a vampire that but she manages to kill Bakai in this kind of insane fight by the all the fights This is truly when I think they invented wire food, which is I believe the term that they coined for some of the fight choreography on Zita that you might end up remembering for a crouching tiger hidden dragon Yes, influence.
01:37:18.556 --> 01:37:19.877
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, clock it mama
01:37:21.665 --> 01:37:41.711
[UNKNOWN]: But yeah, I picked this episode because as I was watching this in my watch like I was oh this will burn and memory into my whole This is like Take so many different weird sort of list in my head like it feels me with so much joy This is what I really love about our lists by the way is that they kind of give us different flavors of Zina
01:37:41.851 --> 01:38:11.538
[UNKNOWN]: There's a lot of different flavors of Zina and this gives you like the campy kind of funny kind of silly But also really like intricate and fun fantastic fight choreography Interesting editing this is when they really were like oh, let's play around with the filming of this show That's how much some interesting shots if I said the show around episode 9 becomes Zina warrior princess I think this is when this show takes up to being oh, this is what Zina warrior princess is truly We have reached the peak form and then from then on we're on like a golden run for like two three seasons
01:38:11.738 --> 01:38:12.138
[UNKNOWN]: I say.
01:38:13.038 --> 01:38:13.418
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:38:13.579 --> 01:38:17.039
[UNKNOWN]: No, this episode is great and I have everybody should watch it.
01:38:17.140 --> 01:38:21.501
[UNKNOWN]: If you're doing a Halloween episode, people are always leaving Zina out of their marathons.
01:38:21.561 --> 01:38:25.762
[UNKNOWN]: If you're on Halloween and you're like, what Halloween episode should I watch?
01:38:26.162 --> 01:38:26.582
[UNKNOWN]: Watch.
01:38:26.742 --> 01:38:32.964
[UNKNOWN]: The love being vampire episode of Zina Danube is so good and it's so influential.
01:38:33.124 --> 01:38:36.705
[UNKNOWN]: It is so important to me because this is definitely
01:38:36.905 --> 01:38:43.147
[UNKNOWN]: I talk about episode one, Gabrielle's gay out the gate, but like, oh my god, she's gay here.
01:38:43.207 --> 01:38:47.048
[UNKNOWN]: To the point that she's just like, my dude, go away.
01:38:47.228 --> 01:38:49.469
[UNKNOWN]: I'm going to go dance with these ladies.
01:38:49.489 --> 01:38:50.169
[UNKNOWN]: She's in a case.
01:38:50.469 --> 01:38:53.310
[UNKNOWN]: She's in a gay lesbian bar, dad's saying.
01:38:53.430 --> 01:38:55.531
[UNKNOWN]: And she's like, interesting.
01:38:57.171 --> 01:39:02.655
[UNKNOWN]: And it's just like this reminds me of the Amazon's and it's just like, oh, but we're in a different world now.
01:39:02.735 --> 01:39:07.678
[UNKNOWN]: We're doing this kind of exploitation film now Gabrielle and it is so fun.
01:39:07.839 --> 01:39:15.164
[UNKNOWN]: But Zina is so in love with Gabrielle in this episode and she's just like, okay, I hope you're having fun with your new friends.
01:39:15.244 --> 01:39:21.648
[UNKNOWN]: She's way more jealous about it than she is with the Amazon's because this is toxic and she's just like, okay,
01:39:25.971 --> 01:39:28.812
[UNKNOWN]: sensual way possible masterpiece.
01:39:29.693 --> 01:39:32.434
[UNKNOWN]: It's truly like I, yeah, words fail me.
01:39:32.514 --> 01:39:36.256
[UNKNOWN]: This is such an amazing episode that really truly has to be like witnessed.
01:39:36.436 --> 01:39:39.678
[UNKNOWN]: You have to behold it and it's like a insane thing.
01:39:39.818 --> 01:39:45.000
[UNKNOWN]: Like it's an insane product to think like you made this and like this is 1990, probably seven.
01:39:45.060 --> 01:39:47.962
[UNKNOWN]: It's got right by the sensors like somehow.
01:39:48.922 --> 01:40:03.683
[UNKNOWN]: Not even just like the stencils not even the fact like yes, it is like a very queer episode It's also just like an insanely put together episode just like what was the thought process of like deciding to do these weird Flashing edits of people's eyes and like jolting about it's so
01:40:03.683 --> 01:40:04.403
[UNKNOWN]: So amazing.
01:40:04.463 --> 01:40:11.445
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's like, first of all, you're saving on budget a lot with this, because they spent all of their budget on the CGI harpies, of course.
01:40:11.585 --> 01:40:15.086
[UNKNOWN]: And trying to make Orpheus look like you didn't have a body attached to them.
01:40:15.186 --> 01:40:16.047
[UNKNOWN]: Didn't work great.
01:40:16.347 --> 01:40:18.227
[UNKNOWN]: But this is, I'm not too good for anything.
01:40:18.267 --> 01:40:19.488
[UNKNOWN]: This is like how I feel.
01:40:19.568 --> 01:40:22.749
[UNKNOWN]: Now people are like, oh, these are bad effects on anything else.
01:40:22.809 --> 01:40:26.170
[UNKNOWN]: And I'm like, I'm just not too good for it because I was raised on this.
01:40:26.370 --> 01:40:27.930
[UNKNOWN]: And I got to say they're doing great.
01:40:28.170 --> 01:40:30.911
[UNKNOWN]: These harpies are literally the harpies that, if you say it,
01:40:33.652 --> 01:40:38.497
[UNKNOWN]: That's what sort of like, uh, God, uh, Bruce Banner, Betty Ross.
01:40:38.797 --> 01:40:40.419
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, oh, yeah, he's in my mind.
01:40:40.859 --> 01:40:42.861
[UNKNOWN]: Those are the two harpies that I acknowledge.
01:40:43.061 --> 01:40:43.522
[UNKNOWN]: That's it.
01:40:43.582 --> 01:40:44.403
[UNKNOWN]: Shout out to Al.
01:40:45.143 --> 01:40:46.825
[UNKNOWN]: But yes, I agree with you that point.
01:40:46.845 --> 01:40:48.026
[UNKNOWN]: That doesn't hit me either.
01:40:48.186 --> 01:40:49.668
[UNKNOWN]: I was a kid raised on charmed.
01:40:49.808 --> 01:40:52.210
[UNKNOWN]: So if you want to talk about CGI, I'd like to really gutter.
01:40:52.451 --> 01:40:52.791
[UNKNOWN]: gutter.
01:40:52.951 --> 01:40:54.594
[UNKNOWN]: And so that doesn't really like impact me.
01:40:54.614 --> 01:40:55.195
[UNKNOWN]: I don't care.
01:40:55.275 --> 01:41:03.829
[UNKNOWN]: I kind of find it charming, looking at like these weird Diablo ass sort of graphics of the harpies, they don't look good, but they are to me extremely charming to see how they managed it.
01:41:03.949 --> 01:41:05.392
[UNKNOWN]: And it's like, why are they here?
01:41:06.427 --> 01:41:10.029
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, we have the Bach guy like we have like nine other plots going right now.
01:41:10.049 --> 01:41:10.869
[UNKNOWN]: What are you doing?
01:41:10.929 --> 01:41:27.876
[UNKNOWN]: But that's the beauty is that they never stop throwing plots and it's very river day in that way So like the way the river deal just throws nine thousand things into every day How dare you There's no serial killer gene on Zena Sarah.
01:41:28.036 --> 01:41:29.677
[UNKNOWN]: There's no serial killer gene here.
01:41:29.697 --> 01:41:31.638
[UNKNOWN]: Don't you dare not in my house
01:41:32.518 --> 01:41:38.820
[UNKNOWN]: Like we started here and then we're way the fuck over there by the end and that is why but Zina does tie it together better.
01:41:38.880 --> 01:41:50.904
[UNKNOWN]: I'll say it does By the end of this it's just well, I guess they're off to do whatever it is that they do whenever the camera's not pointed at them The name Gabrielle writing this horse off into the middle distance.
01:41:51.365 --> 01:41:51.385
[UNKNOWN]: I
01:41:52.985 --> 01:41:55.529
[UNKNOWN]: There are essays written about this episode.
01:41:55.569 --> 01:41:59.816
[UNKNOWN]: I'm actually going to like just let me just give you the proper references right here because I have it open.
01:41:59.977 --> 01:42:00.538
[UNKNOWN]: Where is it?
01:42:00.618 --> 01:42:03.723
[UNKNOWN]: Scott Dammit, everything's so disorganized in my life Jesus.
01:42:05.032 --> 01:42:16.894
[UNKNOWN]: So there is a really fun book called Classical Receptions that impact the Zena Warrior Princess edited by Amanda Potter and any strong that I really like been enjoying the Fakado.
01:42:16.934 --> 01:42:18.315
[UNKNOWN]: I'm gonna put this on my list.
01:42:18.435 --> 01:42:19.115
[UNKNOWN]: Please do.
01:42:19.155 --> 01:42:20.335
[UNKNOWN]: It just came out last year.
01:42:20.355 --> 01:42:22.095
[UNKNOWN]: It covers that episode frequently.
01:42:22.295 --> 01:42:23.456
[UNKNOWN]: And it's just like always fascinating.
01:42:23.476 --> 01:42:28.417
[UNKNOWN]: Carpipity is actually this is maybe a good opportunity for us to discuss which we obviously discuss already.
01:42:28.437 --> 01:42:31.577
[UNKNOWN]: But the idea of Zena as a gay icon specifically.
01:42:31.617 --> 01:42:34.618
[UNKNOWN]: Can you give me a bit of your pontificating on that?
01:42:34.818 --> 01:42:44.523
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, it's hard for me to totally say the effect that she had and the show had on everyone in general.
01:42:44.703 --> 01:42:47.584
[UNKNOWN]: But I would say for me, absolutely gay icon.
01:42:47.644 --> 01:42:52.046
[UNKNOWN]: This is something that I can't untie with like me discovering.
01:42:52.126 --> 01:42:52.847
[UNKNOWN]: I was gay.
01:42:52.947 --> 01:42:54.567
[UNKNOWN]: It's almost like this kind of...
01:42:54.888 --> 01:42:57.669
[UNKNOWN]: I can't untie the X-Men from my childhood.
01:42:57.809 --> 01:43:01.731
[UNKNOWN]: I cannot untie Zina from me being like a tween who was just...
01:43:01.751 --> 01:43:01.951
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:43:02.031 --> 01:43:06.976
[UNKNOWN]: like, I sure am different from everybody for some reason, not sure why.
01:43:07.096 --> 01:43:09.438
[UNKNOWN]: And then you have like, you're going through the list in your head.
01:43:09.458 --> 01:43:11.480
[UNKNOWN]: You're like, well, we're like, super poor.
01:43:11.540 --> 01:43:13.882
[UNKNOWN]: Like, there's like all of this happening at home.
01:43:13.942 --> 01:43:15.784
[UNKNOWN]: And maybe that's why I'm so weird.
01:43:15.864 --> 01:43:19.547
[UNKNOWN]: And then you're just like, all of a sudden it goes in a time.
01:43:21.669 --> 01:43:23.891
[UNKNOWN]: and you're just like, this show's so good.
01:43:23.911 --> 01:43:32.338
[UNKNOWN]: I wonder what's going on with me that I think that this show is so amazing because I also found out that people didn't care as much about the story as I did after that.
01:43:32.778 --> 01:43:36.361
[UNKNOWN]: I loved Zena and people would be like, oh yeah, totally.
01:43:36.381 --> 01:43:40.465
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I saw a few episodes of that and I'm just like, I saw every episode.
01:43:42.038 --> 01:44:05.490
[UNKNOWN]: I watched her time it's on, I don't care if I already saw the episode or not, because I was just that obsessed, but it was also something I could watch with like my grandma right I'm having like my queer section will awakening is like a twin and like my grandma is just like she likes to see women on television because she's like a feminist I guess right so it kind of was good to watch it with more people I guess, but
01:44:05.930 --> 01:44:14.898
[UNKNOWN]: It's never been something I talked about with like a girlfriend or something like I never have met anybody I think that like love to this series as much as I do.
01:44:14.918 --> 01:44:28.351
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I think it just has to be iconic We've talked about how it was dismissed a lot and how it is like underrated and dismissed But I can't imagine because now we look back on it and people go yeah, I was super gay and it's just like yeah
01:44:29.051 --> 01:44:30.292
[UNKNOWN]: it was, you're right.
01:44:30.432 --> 01:44:31.712
[UNKNOWN]: But it was really impactful.
01:44:31.812 --> 01:44:36.994
[UNKNOWN]: We've not mentioned this episode yet, but Karen Dior, who was a drag performer.
01:44:37.114 --> 01:44:41.016
[UNKNOWN]: I believe also a trans woman who was featured in the episode Ms. Fibilis.
01:44:41.256 --> 01:44:51.320
[UNKNOWN]: She passed away since the episode is aired, but during her life, she was a big advocate of an activist discussing HIV, living with HIV, and that episode featured a kiss
01:44:51.520 --> 01:44:56.762
[UNKNOWN]: between Zena and Karen Dior, and it was known that Karen Dior had HIV at the time.
01:44:56.802 --> 01:45:02.304
[UNKNOWN]: That was also something that was a big step to do in the early 90s, if we could bring back context of the time, like the things that the show did.
01:45:02.324 --> 01:45:11.107
[UNKNOWN]: We also mentioned the Zena conventions being sort of a spot where queer women, I think also a nice say queer men as well, or just queer people in general managed to flock together.
01:45:11.247 --> 01:45:13.728
[UNKNOWN]: I think stuff like the Zena retreats.
01:45:14.208 --> 01:45:35.333
[UNKNOWN]: as well as like a big on-clave for, I believe, majority queer people who identify as women, but also it's just a queer space for people the show and the cast have been involved in a multitude of initiatives for queer people and have raised millions of dollars and pounds for queer communities and queer youth and trans youth.
01:45:35.573 --> 01:45:38.336
[UNKNOWN]: Like I said, the impact is actually material.
01:45:38.477 --> 01:45:40.659
[UNKNOWN]: You can feel it and the effort is also material.
01:45:40.780 --> 01:45:41.841
[UNKNOWN]: Alexis our cat.
01:45:42.021 --> 01:45:47.668
[UNKNOWN]: Like, yeah, yes, like a lot of queer cast members, a lot of people who are recurring characters.
01:45:47.788 --> 01:45:51.292
[UNKNOWN]: We have a very queer colligula as a result, right?
01:45:51.333 --> 01:45:51.513
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:45:51.753 --> 01:45:55.757
[UNKNOWN]: And that is maybe like the only time I could think of very clear curriculum.
01:45:55.937 --> 01:46:00.121
[UNKNOWN]: The show was really, when we say Revolutionary, we're not just throwing that term out, you know?
01:46:00.261 --> 01:46:06.567
[UNKNOWN]: And people do about things like this show truly had a lot of firsts and opened a lot of doors for a lot of communities.
01:46:06.687 --> 01:46:12.433
[UNKNOWN]: Sometimes I struggle when we talk about things that are gay and to think about, yes, they mean a lot to gay people, but what impact?
01:46:12.473 --> 01:46:16.616
[UNKNOWN]: they actually had a like the material, physical, world and life of gay people today.
01:46:16.896 --> 01:46:19.318
[UNKNOWN]: That's not really a critique that you can broach with Zina.
01:46:19.398 --> 01:46:34.848
[UNKNOWN]: Because Zina, from I think very early on, I'd say, from 1995 when the first season premiered and they were like featured on the Glad stage, they've been advocates and actual allies the way that we actually mean that term, you know, people who are in the front lines actually doing things.
01:46:35.068 --> 01:46:37.289
[UNKNOWN]: And so yeah, the show is iconic.
01:46:37.409 --> 01:46:39.731
[UNKNOWN]: Zina is a gay icon, Gabrielle is a gay icon.
01:46:39.751 --> 01:46:41.092
[UNKNOWN]: I actually created bikewares.
01:46:41.292 --> 01:46:44.176
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, yes, and involve careers in the cast and crew.
01:46:44.276 --> 01:46:48.282
[UNKNOWN]: This show is really important in the history of queerness, actually.
01:46:48.383 --> 01:46:53.430
[UNKNOWN]: Whether it gets that respect to depreciation or not, it was an inflection point that caused a lot of change.
01:46:53.590 --> 01:46:56.555
[UNKNOWN]: It's unfortunately doesn't get recognized for that, but that is something that we need to highlight.
01:46:56.735 --> 01:46:57.155
[UNKNOWN]: I agree.
01:46:57.435 --> 01:46:58.336
[UNKNOWN]: I totally agree.
01:46:58.456 --> 01:46:59.976
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, it was huge for me.
01:47:00.137 --> 01:47:00.577
[UNKNOWN]: I can't.
01:47:00.897 --> 01:47:03.498
[UNKNOWN]: It's there's just almost nowhere.
01:47:03.558 --> 01:47:08.240
[UNKNOWN]: I feel like I failed to like answer the question of what it actually means to me.
01:47:08.280 --> 01:47:11.922
[UNKNOWN]: They're not this episode because it is such a big subject.
01:47:12.082 --> 01:47:18.705
[UNKNOWN]: It is hard to divorce myself from the girl who was so meek and closeted.
01:47:18.805 --> 01:47:21.986
[UNKNOWN]: I mean during the time that this like I wasn't speaking,
01:47:25.868 --> 01:47:33.410
[UNKNOWN]: And then you see something like this and it's like that didn't fix my problems, but it made me be like, oh, there's something to strive for.
01:47:33.430 --> 01:47:34.350
[UNKNOWN]: I want to be an artist.
01:47:34.410 --> 01:47:35.111
[UNKNOWN]: I want to do this.
01:47:35.191 --> 01:47:35.871
[UNKNOWN]: I want to do that.
01:47:35.991 --> 01:47:37.631
[UNKNOWN]: I would love to be a traveling bard.
01:47:38.432 --> 01:47:39.312
[UNKNOWN]: This is what I want.
01:47:39.432 --> 01:47:43.753
[UNKNOWN]: And I feel like I take on very strong Gabrielle personality or something like that.
01:47:43.853 --> 01:47:52.015
[UNKNOWN]: So characters like this character like Poison Ivy from Batman TAS, like these are characters that I am printed on really hard as a kid.
01:47:52.075 --> 01:47:53.836
[UNKNOWN]: And I'm glad I did frankly.
01:47:54.036 --> 01:47:55.358
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I should have that too with you.
01:47:55.398 --> 01:47:56.719
[UNKNOWN]: I think maybe like in different ways.
01:47:57.020 --> 01:48:02.307
[UNKNOWN]: I watched this in the Middle East in like a very small country that was also very, very straight.
01:48:02.387 --> 01:48:12.860
[UNKNOWN]: I didn't have anyone queer around me and I watched the edited form of the show where they tried to exercise as much of the queer stuff as possible, but you know, because like we're saying about it's so intrinsic.
01:48:13.020 --> 01:48:13.681
[UNKNOWN]: to the show.
01:48:13.861 --> 01:48:15.522
[UNKNOWN]: It was a space for me to see queerness.
01:48:15.602 --> 01:48:21.827
[UNKNOWN]: I think hands down this is probably one of the first times I ever saw queer women but just queer people full stop as a young kid.
01:48:21.847 --> 01:48:23.669
[UNKNOWN]: I can't really this show when it came out.
01:48:23.889 --> 01:48:25.290
[UNKNOWN]: I was two years old.
01:48:25.510 --> 01:48:28.132
[UNKNOWN]: I came on it when a lot of it has been out there.
01:48:28.292 --> 01:48:34.918
[UNKNOWN]: When you were saying you struggle to try and put into words what this show means to you as a queer person.
01:48:35.178 --> 01:48:39.061
[UNKNOWN]: I feel that as well too but I think like it brought me to this point.
01:48:39.901 --> 01:48:51.429
[UNKNOWN]: You know, like you're saying you take on a lot of the characters and like I can see a lot of like the concern with doing good, you know, the idea of being of service is something that really taught me and shaped me and that I carry with me to this day.
01:48:51.449 --> 01:48:57.533
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, this brought me to who I am in this moment to show is a big factor in my personality and what I am and what I do.
01:48:57.713 --> 01:49:00.375
[UNKNOWN]: And I don't doubt that that's probably the same way for a lot of people.
01:49:00.655 --> 01:49:07.381
[UNKNOWN]: and it can be for a lot more people, even though you know it's been decades since it came out and since it's ended, it still can serve that purpose.
01:49:07.481 --> 01:49:10.804
[UNKNOWN]: The story is the like valuable and beautiful and fun and stupid.
01:49:10.965 --> 01:49:12.426
[UNKNOWN]: I don't give you like so much.
01:49:12.526 --> 01:49:13.587
[UNKNOWN]: Put this back on streaming.
01:49:13.607 --> 01:49:14.388
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, damn it.
01:49:15.168 --> 01:49:16.750
[UNKNOWN]: Mr. Paramount, you own everything.
01:49:16.970 --> 01:49:17.670
[UNKNOWN]: this word of God.
01:49:17.790 --> 01:49:33.017
[UNKNOWN]: Like they put it on, you know, many of the Instagram real where it'll be like, can you believe in the 90s, you know, where your princess did this with like the here comes Miss Infobless episode and it's just like, yeah, and it's so wonderful that that was something that I was raised with.
01:49:33.838 --> 01:49:48.849
[UNKNOWN]: I don't even think as a kid, I even cognitive, you know, I was just, I'm seeing all of this first of all strong women leads, like I'm seeing queerness that I might not totally recognize as queerness right away, but it starts to be dawn on you as time goes on.
01:49:49.210 --> 01:49:51.191
[UNKNOWN]: Think God, I watch something like that.
01:49:51.311 --> 01:50:00.799
[UNKNOWN]: Think God, I wasn't sucked into like horrible turf narratives or something because I didn't watch any positive or I didn't meet, you know, any trans people or something like that.
01:50:03.408 --> 01:50:04.061
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:50:05.692 --> 01:50:09.413
[UNKNOWN]: Those girls, I'm sorry, you're San Francisco, you're in San Francisco.
01:50:09.593 --> 01:50:13.434
[UNKNOWN]: Not a single queer, one Asian person in this series.
01:50:13.534 --> 01:50:14.754
[UNKNOWN]: What is wrong with those people?
01:50:14.774 --> 01:50:15.834
[UNKNOWN]: That's our goal.
01:50:15.854 --> 01:50:16.834
[UNKNOWN]: What's happening here?
01:50:16.954 --> 01:50:25.116
[UNKNOWN]: And Zena hasn't been because there's actually plenty of side characters, people who are even recurring characters, who are, yeah, not white people.
01:50:25.396 --> 01:50:26.516
[UNKNOWN]: Also, thank God for that.
01:50:26.556 --> 01:50:33.117
[UNKNOWN]: But it's why I hold in bidders the fact that they stole Zena's position as the show with the longest running female lead.
01:50:36.879 --> 01:50:38.059
[UNKNOWN]: That's wrong.
01:50:38.079 --> 01:50:38.480
[UNKNOWN]: That's wrong.
01:50:38.500 --> 01:50:38.980
[UNKNOWN]: That's wrong.
01:50:39.100 --> 01:50:39.700
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
01:50:39.760 --> 01:50:40.781
[UNKNOWN]: It was Nina.
01:50:40.841 --> 01:50:43.663
[UNKNOWN]: Come on.
01:50:43.763 --> 01:50:44.003
[UNKNOWN]: Okay.
01:50:44.023 --> 01:50:44.223
[UNKNOWN]: Sorry.
01:50:44.243 --> 01:50:44.843
[UNKNOWN]: I trusted you.
01:50:44.863 --> 01:50:45.604
[UNKNOWN]: You were saying no.
01:50:45.684 --> 01:50:45.864
[UNKNOWN]: No.
01:50:45.984 --> 01:50:48.025
[UNKNOWN]: I think that this episode is incredible.
01:50:48.185 --> 01:50:54.789
[UNKNOWN]: And when we're talking about the importance to queer people, I think that there's much more to say than we could possibly say in this episode.
01:50:54.889 --> 01:50:58.151
[UNKNOWN]: But I do also think that this episode is gay as fuck.
01:50:58.271 --> 01:51:00.552
[UNKNOWN]: And I hope that you all enjoy watching it.
01:51:02.213 --> 01:51:03.995
[UNKNOWN]: Please do, please watch it.
01:51:04.095 --> 01:51:04.616
[UNKNOWN]: I beg you.
01:51:04.756 --> 01:51:05.617
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, moving on.
01:51:05.637 --> 01:51:06.778
[UNKNOWN]: It's been my interest.
01:51:06.918 --> 01:51:08.659
[UNKNOWN]: My lesbian vampire is the end.
01:51:08.779 --> 01:51:15.565
[UNKNOWN]: So I bring it up immediately because I think that this is the first lesbian vampire I ever saw so it comes right up
01:51:17.299 --> 01:51:19.841
[UNKNOWN]: That is amazing, I hope that's amazing.
01:51:19.901 --> 01:51:22.802
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, shall we move on to the next selection?
01:51:22.822 --> 01:51:26.144
[UNKNOWN]: Should I do mine because yours comes later in the timeline?
01:51:26.244 --> 01:51:26.544
[UNKNOWN]: Indeed.
01:51:26.624 --> 01:51:30.306
[UNKNOWN]: But before I do that, I want to give you, because this is my last selection.
01:51:30.386 --> 01:51:35.669
[UNKNOWN]: I want to give you some of my honorable mentions, don't say any of them is your final selection.
01:51:35.789 --> 01:51:41.072
[UNKNOWN]: So with my honorable mentions, I considered putting in aides of March.
01:51:41.492 --> 01:51:44.374
[UNKNOWN]: I considered, I love me a little Caesar plot,
01:51:45.214 --> 01:51:58.232
[UNKNOWN]: That's like the prophecy, you know, we have like, oh, truly, like if you want to talk about lesbian, fucking enduring, fucking Sappho, poem, ass, romance, just like that whole, I'd so much amazing.
01:51:58.352 --> 01:52:01.497
[UNKNOWN]: I can't tell people to watch it because I think you need a lot more of the show before you get into there.
01:52:01.957 --> 01:52:02.317
[UNKNOWN]: Good point.
01:52:02.417 --> 01:52:11.401
[UNKNOWN]: I also considered, is there a doctor in the house where there's an events medicine, but I also think that's like a great Gabrielle episode.
01:52:11.521 --> 01:52:12.361
[UNKNOWN]: It's so good.
01:52:12.621 --> 01:52:13.962
[UNKNOWN]: That's a really good episode.
01:52:14.042 --> 01:52:14.922
[UNKNOWN]: It's a really good episode.
01:52:14.942 --> 01:52:16.203
[UNKNOWN]: That's season one as well.
01:52:16.223 --> 01:52:19.364
[UNKNOWN]: I think towards the later is that maybe the last episode of season one.
01:52:19.604 --> 01:52:21.505
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, I think that that's how they wrap it up.
01:52:21.585 --> 01:52:22.185
[UNKNOWN]: And it's so great.
01:52:22.205 --> 01:52:35.289
[UNKNOWN]: Like it also brings all these questions that we've been talking about like the idea of violence, past-fism, soulmate, the role of Venus as a healer, the potential that she could have in this world, but also all the bad things she thought like it's a beautiful episode, also amazing writing on that episode.
01:52:35.349 --> 01:52:42.892
[UNKNOWN]: What else did I missamphibilis, which we mentioned earlier, I also considered, wait, I just want to make sure I get the name right because of.
01:52:43.512 --> 01:52:49.078
[UNKNOWN]: I also considered quest and depth as well the depth I thought like those are good runs.
01:52:49.318 --> 01:52:50.780
[UNKNOWN]: I also thought married with fish sticks
01:52:51.444 --> 01:52:51.804
[UNKNOWN]: It's good.
01:52:52.105 --> 01:52:52.645
[UNKNOWN]: I like that one.
01:52:53.185 --> 01:52:57.308
[UNKNOWN]: That is a demonic episode, but I think it is.
01:52:57.328 --> 01:53:04.193
[UNKNOWN]: So horrendous episode, but you get discord, you get Aphrodite, you get a really weird dream sequences.
01:53:04.413 --> 01:53:06.595
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but I think it's like categorically bad.
01:53:06.715 --> 01:53:15.802
[UNKNOWN]: That's kind of why I wanted to put it in there, because I thought maybe a representation of Zeta at what I think is like a true Nadir is like good, because you still get things out of it.
01:53:15.822 --> 01:53:19.364
[UNKNOWN]: It's still a fun episode, but my actual final choice is
01:53:25.407 --> 01:53:27.809
[UNKNOWN]: a day in the life, another season two episode.
01:53:28.029 --> 01:53:28.670
[UNKNOWN]: Yay!
01:53:28.730 --> 01:53:30.031
[UNKNOWN]: A classic, I think.
01:53:30.071 --> 01:53:31.352
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, this is classic.
01:53:31.632 --> 01:53:38.938
[UNKNOWN]: Easily, if you were going to recommend somebody just watch episode of Zina, this is easily the very best ones, I think.
01:53:39.099 --> 01:53:40.520
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, really accessible.
01:53:40.660 --> 01:53:41.180
[UNKNOWN]: It's fun.
01:53:41.200 --> 01:53:44.163
[UNKNOWN]: It gives you a good insight on the relate.
01:53:44.183 --> 01:53:48.847
[UNKNOWN]: It's basically a relationship, I wanted Zina and Gabrielle episode, the focus on those two.
01:53:49.047 --> 01:53:49.688
[UNKNOWN]: And I love this.
01:53:49.788 --> 01:53:52.490
[UNKNOWN]: Basically, the premise of this episode is that it's kind of a quiet,
01:53:52.630 --> 01:53:53.170
[UNKNOWN]: adventure.
01:53:53.330 --> 01:53:55.451
[UNKNOWN]: A quiet day is kind of a chill out episode.
01:53:55.471 --> 01:54:05.812
[UNKNOWN]: It's a hangout episode and you get to see Zina and Gabriela get into little couple fights while they try to decide between whether they're going to save the village from a giant or save someone else.
01:54:05.952 --> 01:54:06.552
[UNKNOWN]: It's really fun.
01:54:06.692 --> 01:54:08.673
[UNKNOWN]: They're like a prank war escalating.
01:54:08.753 --> 01:54:11.733
[UNKNOWN]: I love these little character moments where like they're like playing a guessing game.
01:54:11.833 --> 01:54:14.774
[UNKNOWN]: Zina has someone in mind and Gabriela's trying to do a guess it with questions.
01:54:14.974 --> 01:54:16.054
[UNKNOWN]: It's not really much happens
01:54:21.115 --> 01:54:22.316
[UNKNOWN]: It's like really endearing.
01:54:22.396 --> 01:54:35.710
[UNKNOWN]: I think it's a really comforting episode and I think also it's part of the golden I'd say peak period of Zena where like they were just like hitting it out of the park episode after episode and also We mentioned this before, but Renee O'Connor and Zena are very funny
01:54:36.210 --> 01:54:38.111
[UNKNOWN]: She likes the light too.
01:54:38.131 --> 01:54:39.592
[UNKNOWN]: They're like really funny.
01:54:39.733 --> 01:54:41.234
[UNKNOWN]: They are so unique actresses.
01:54:41.514 --> 01:54:41.794
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:54:41.914 --> 01:54:44.656
[UNKNOWN]: And when they get to like flex that phone, it's just really delightful.
01:54:44.776 --> 01:54:47.138
[UNKNOWN]: Is that also the episode with the bath scene?
01:54:47.358 --> 01:54:48.098
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:54:48.239 --> 01:54:48.459
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:54:48.739 --> 01:54:49.900
[UNKNOWN]: Also speaking of gay.
01:54:49.920 --> 01:54:50.920
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, come on now.
01:54:51.181 --> 01:54:53.742
[UNKNOWN]: Are you sitting on the soap?
01:54:54.463 --> 01:54:56.885
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I was wondering where that was.
01:54:59.502 --> 01:55:14.405
[UNKNOWN]: amazing amazing it also the episodes starts with like padding on their clothes on wishes and then like it pans into them having a little swim and the sea and that is just like oh naughty not I'm like oh my god the show needs to stop flirting with me like my god
01:55:15.327 --> 01:55:16.208
[UNKNOWN]: It's really hot.
01:55:16.248 --> 01:55:18.690
[UNKNOWN]: Lots of fish jokes a lot of fish jokes.
01:55:18.871 --> 01:55:21.434
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, I use it Meera episode as well.
01:55:21.454 --> 01:55:21.954
[UNKNOWN]: Remind me.
01:55:22.034 --> 01:55:25.739
[UNKNOWN]: Meera Mina Mina her name is I think oh my god.
01:55:25.919 --> 01:55:26.740
[UNKNOWN]: All right.
01:55:26.780 --> 01:55:29.463
[UNKNOWN]: We are love this icon She's incredible.
01:55:29.683 --> 01:55:35.330
[UNKNOWN]: Oh my god, and you know what incorporating a fan into a TV show, but it's not horrible
01:55:35.550 --> 01:55:41.159
[UNKNOWN]: A lot of other, I'd say sci-fi shows were spot to their fandom and I think really cool ways.
01:55:41.239 --> 01:55:45.846
[UNKNOWN]: They incorporated this basically fan girl of Zina, not Gabrielle, that's very specific.
01:55:47.297 --> 01:56:07.064
[UNKNOWN]: who's just like wanting to fall in the ground while her boyfriend falls in love with Zina and Zina really does not want to deal with that because she's a lesbian Yeah, we're talking about how they have to share a cookware and I was Zina you threw our best cooking knife into a person like last week and it's just like you two are married you're just married
01:56:07.424 --> 01:56:11.809
[UNKNOWN]: Zina has IBS since she uses Gabrielle Scrolls and it's a whole thing.
01:56:11.929 --> 01:56:12.910
[UNKNOWN]: It's amazing guys.
01:56:12.990 --> 01:56:13.771
[UNKNOWN]: It's so funny.
01:56:13.791 --> 01:56:17.975
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, there's no straight man in this episode if they're both silly and crazy.
01:56:18.115 --> 01:56:19.957
[UNKNOWN]: Everybody involved it is really fun.
01:56:20.057 --> 01:56:22.760
[UNKNOWN]: Mina, the actress, that place I'm so glad I really loved her.
01:56:22.940 --> 01:56:25.723
[UNKNOWN]: I love whenever she cough up, she provides such a great energy.
01:56:26.023 --> 01:56:27.484
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, she's incredible.
01:56:27.604 --> 01:56:29.144
[UNKNOWN]: She's a really fun character.
01:56:29.204 --> 01:56:30.725
[UNKNOWN]: I love it when she pops up too.
01:56:30.845 --> 01:56:33.426
[UNKNOWN]: Are there always really funny silly episodes?
01:56:33.486 --> 01:56:42.330
[UNKNOWN]: This is not a character that's brought in for serious character development whatsoever, but that kind of the benefit of her every time you see her.
01:56:42.350 --> 01:56:43.971
[UNKNOWN]: You're like, we're in for a treat.
01:56:44.411 --> 01:56:46.132
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, so we're just having a fun time.
01:56:46.273 --> 01:56:50.396
[UNKNOWN]: Also, she's extremely gay and she basically is there on a mission.
01:56:50.436 --> 01:56:51.637
[UNKNOWN]: Like, I believe anything.
01:56:51.697 --> 01:56:53.258
[UNKNOWN]: To be like, it's text, right?
01:56:53.318 --> 01:56:54.299
[UNKNOWN]: We're gonna make it text.
01:56:54.359 --> 01:56:56.001
[UNKNOWN]: I'm gonna make a bunch of lesbian jokes.
01:56:56.201 --> 01:56:57.482
[UNKNOWN]: And you're just gonna have to deal with it.
01:56:57.562 --> 01:56:58.242
[UNKNOWN]: And it's amazing.
01:56:58.262 --> 01:57:00.004
[UNKNOWN]: Like, she's really pushing up against it.
01:57:00.124 --> 01:57:00.885
[UNKNOWN]: It's so good.
01:57:00.905 --> 01:57:02.126
[UNKNOWN]: She's so delightful.
01:57:02.226 --> 01:57:04.107
[UNKNOWN]: And that act is also really recognizable to me.
01:57:04.207 --> 01:57:06.249
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know where she's popped up in, but I've seen her in something else.
01:57:06.269 --> 01:57:07.470
[UNKNOWN]: But yeah, she's just like, yeah.
01:57:07.830 --> 01:57:08.451
[UNKNOWN]: She's a great.
01:57:08.571 --> 01:57:14.855
[UNKNOWN]: I also really love when Gabrielle is just like, well, her boyfriend's in love with you I guess I'll have to straighten that out too.
01:57:14.935 --> 01:57:22.399
[UNKNOWN]: I'm just like, why you and Gabrielle's like, because I do the sensitive Chats Like I can do them too.
01:57:22.539 --> 01:57:23.580
[UNKNOWN]: I can do them too.
01:57:23.600 --> 01:57:24.421
[UNKNOWN]: I have hearts
01:57:26.492 --> 01:57:30.053
[UNKNOWN]: Like a little bruiser, it's so stupid, it's so funny, like you can't do talking.
01:57:30.073 --> 01:57:34.874
[UNKNOWN]: Hush, you too are so married, I can't believe how married you are.
01:57:34.994 --> 01:57:36.755
[UNKNOWN]: This is the marriage episode.
01:57:37.075 --> 01:57:53.780
[UNKNOWN]: Another runner-up perhaps in sickness and in hell, where they're having the gross part of living outside, they both have rashes and grosses happening, and they're just like, this is disgusting, and they're mad at each other, they don't want to hug or anything, because they're sweaty and disgusting,
01:57:54.200 --> 01:58:00.561
[UNKNOWN]: But ever seen it like also in this episode, there's the eel moment, which is like actually a real eel that they belong at Poor Renee O'Connor.
01:58:01.022 --> 01:58:06.443
[UNKNOWN]: You see her actual true reaction when the show like really what like just wanted to be gross and fun.
01:58:06.643 --> 01:58:08.063
[UNKNOWN]: I love the show so much Sarah.
01:58:08.403 --> 01:58:09.223
[UNKNOWN]: People should watch this show.
01:58:09.243 --> 01:58:09.863
[UNKNOWN]: Thanks for watching.
01:58:09.883 --> 01:58:10.644
[UNKNOWN]: Thanks for watching.
01:58:10.824 --> 01:58:14.565
[UNKNOWN]: In Signition and Hell also has the incredible line which I have never forgotten.
01:58:14.585 --> 01:58:14.745
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
01:58:14.785 --> 01:58:17.185
[UNKNOWN]: Nina walks up to somebody and says, all right, come here.
01:58:17.245 --> 01:58:19.226
[UNKNOWN]: He doesn't move and she says, don't be shy.
01:58:19.246 --> 01:58:20.246
[UNKNOWN]: Your mother sure wasn't.
01:58:20.326 --> 01:58:21.146
[UNKNOWN]: And I'm like, what the fuck?
01:58:26.647 --> 01:58:27.307
[UNKNOWN]: Amazing.
01:58:27.487 --> 01:58:28.888
[UNKNOWN]: I love that.
01:58:28.968 --> 01:58:31.911
[UNKNOWN]: I will say it turns out challenging convention in norms.
01:58:32.191 --> 01:58:34.553
[UNKNOWN]: I think they're disgusting They're funny.
01:58:34.693 --> 01:58:35.954
[UNKNOWN]: They're being stupid.
01:58:36.074 --> 01:58:41.739
[UNKNOWN]: They're also annoying with each other like they are being unpleasant fun female characters
01:58:41.979 --> 01:58:44.181
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, they're having a couple's fights.
01:58:44.262 --> 01:58:46.324
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, and you're not rooting for any of them.
01:58:46.344 --> 01:58:49.247
[UNKNOWN]: You're just enjoying them being really annoying with each other.
01:58:49.327 --> 01:58:49.908
[UNKNOWN]: And you know what?
01:58:50.008 --> 01:58:57.796
[UNKNOWN]: Like, I hope this day ensued you so that you can go have a heroic epic again because this is like the shitty episode between those.
01:59:00.369 --> 01:59:13.121
[UNKNOWN]: I just have like such respect for actors who are really willing to be like fuck my ego I will do whatever you want me to do I know and Lucy Lawless and Renee O'Connor are so tremendous about like I think it's really a Conor's physical humor is out of control.
01:59:13.542 --> 01:59:24.412
[UNKNOWN]: It's just so good while we're on this I just would like to take a moment because we're now talking about comedy and Zena I think this is the opportunity time for us to bring in auticles the one the only my baby
01:59:25.012 --> 01:59:27.414
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, he's so handsome, isn't he?
01:59:27.655 --> 01:59:28.856
[UNKNOWN]: Like, oh, my man.
01:59:28.876 --> 01:59:32.719
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, my man, I love him so he'll never know.
01:59:33.519 --> 01:59:35.561
[UNKNOWN]: He has this beautiful mustache.
01:59:35.881 --> 01:59:37.262
[UNKNOWN]: I love him so much.
01:59:37.383 --> 01:59:43.908
[UNKNOWN]: He's also one of the parts where you start to realize how gay Zena is because she's not really going for him so much.
01:59:43.948 --> 01:59:45.129
[UNKNOWN]: She's like, we had a thing.
01:59:45.329 --> 01:59:48.812
[UNKNOWN]: But then also, whenever Zena dies and they have to kiss.
01:59:49.152 --> 01:59:52.175
[UNKNOWN]: And he's like, hey, ladies, what was going on in here?
01:59:54.056 --> 01:59:56.238
[UNKNOWN]: There's a certain point when Zina dies, of course she does a lot.
01:59:56.359 --> 01:59:58.481
[UNKNOWN]: And then she inhabits authentically his body.
01:59:58.501 --> 02:00:01.043
[UNKNOWN]: This was during I believe Lucy Lawless's pregnancy era.
02:00:01.063 --> 02:00:01.303
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:00:01.363 --> 02:00:04.527
[UNKNOWN]: This is when Zina and Gabrielle share their first on-screen kiss.
02:00:04.827 --> 02:00:06.769
[UNKNOWN]: And it's through all of the places, but it's like, yeah, great.
02:00:07.069 --> 02:00:07.349
[UNKNOWN]: Clever.
02:00:07.389 --> 02:00:07.590
[UNKNOWN]: Clever.
02:00:07.630 --> 02:00:08.410
[UNKNOWN]: I love authentically.
02:00:08.470 --> 02:00:14.877
[UNKNOWN]: I just wanted to take a moment to just lust after Bruce Campbell because that man, that man, oh my man, my man, my man.
02:00:16.418 --> 02:00:19.081
[UNKNOWN]: And he's funny and he's smart.
02:00:19.501 --> 02:00:23.065
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, yeah, he's like such a great guy And I just love this guy.
02:00:23.465 --> 02:00:25.467
[UNKNOWN]: I just want to take a moment to say that he's a blast.
02:00:25.528 --> 02:00:31.213
[UNKNOWN]: He is and I believe just recently came out with news that he has Cancer but they're managing it.
02:00:31.333 --> 02:00:31.994
[UNKNOWN]: So just send it.
02:00:32.034 --> 02:00:32.655
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I'm asking now
02:00:33.335 --> 02:00:34.617
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, don't attack.
02:00:35.077 --> 02:00:35.558
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, God.
02:00:36.418 --> 02:00:41.143
[UNKNOWN]: Himans, Lucy Lollas do great on Ash and the evil dead together.
02:00:41.163 --> 02:00:42.624
[UNKNOWN]: So I've never seen that.
02:00:42.765 --> 02:00:43.946
[UNKNOWN]: They're real fun together.
02:00:44.046 --> 02:00:45.187
[UNKNOWN]: Should I watch that show?
02:00:45.207 --> 02:00:47.829
[UNKNOWN]: It's just because like zombies zombies.
02:00:48.470 --> 02:00:51.833
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not my favorite don't age great, but I think you'll have a lot of fun.
02:00:52.133 --> 02:00:53.435
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, I will have fun.
02:00:53.495 --> 02:00:56.858
[UNKNOWN]: I watched it and it was just so in your face all of the time.
02:00:56.998 --> 02:01:02.403
[UNKNOWN]: I almost feel like that might have been the last truly, and this is, you might want to cut this part.
02:01:02.463 --> 02:01:07.808
[UNKNOWN]: That might be the last truly great Sam Ramey that we get because it's very like bananas.
02:01:07.908 --> 02:01:09.449
[UNKNOWN]: No, no, we're standing behind this.
02:01:09.790 --> 02:01:10.190
[UNKNOWN]: It's true.
02:01:10.370 --> 02:01:11.031
[UNKNOWN]: It's true.
02:01:11.151 --> 02:01:12.292
[UNKNOWN]: Sam, pull up.
02:01:12.952 --> 02:01:18.097
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I just want to go see Centelles, so I don't know, but I think Sam, maybe let's shake things up a little bit.
02:01:18.117 --> 02:01:19.998
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
02:01:20.259 --> 02:01:20.879
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, okay.
02:01:20.939 --> 02:01:26.164
[UNKNOWN]: So, not was my second choice, which I believe are Alaska's circling me right now.
02:01:26.184 --> 02:01:27.245
[UNKNOWN]: She really wants attention.
02:01:27.445 --> 02:01:28.386
[UNKNOWN]: Hi, baby.
02:01:28.446 --> 02:01:33.550
[UNKNOWN]: My cat, Kiyoko just came like bolting down the stairs, like a little weirdo, so yeah.
02:01:33.590 --> 02:01:34.411
[UNKNOWN]: It's something happened.
02:01:34.451 --> 02:01:35.071
[UNKNOWN]: What is wrong?
02:01:35.131 --> 02:01:37.213
[UNKNOWN]: Like the, did we say something?
02:01:37.233 --> 02:01:39.335
[UNKNOWN]: Um, cats are like, hey.
02:01:39.515 --> 02:01:43.057
[UNKNOWN]: Well, my cat is homophobic, so I think she's upset with me talking about Zena.
02:01:43.197 --> 02:01:45.398
[UNKNOWN]: She's just like, enough of this dyke nonsense.
02:01:45.779 --> 02:01:52.403
[UNKNOWN]: The other way I think is in love with me, and I'm not sure if that makes her gay, but she definitely is weird and love with me.
02:01:52.523 --> 02:01:53.263
[UNKNOWN]: What are you doing over there?
02:01:53.283 --> 02:01:54.284
[UNKNOWN]: She's just like, soulmates?
02:01:54.544 --> 02:01:55.585
[UNKNOWN]: I'll be your Gabrielle.
02:01:55.965 --> 02:02:01.248
[UNKNOWN]: She'll hangs off my neck like all of the time, and I'm just like, ha ha ha, that's not cute.
02:02:01.388 --> 02:02:03.709
[UNKNOWN]: Like, I can barely breathe, but this is adorable.
02:02:05.030 --> 02:02:05.911
[UNKNOWN]: That is really cute.
02:02:05.931 --> 02:02:07.052
[UNKNOWN]: My cat never like does that.
02:02:07.072 --> 02:02:19.661
[UNKNOWN]: She just sort of I think because I'm a bit too 80 I just move around a lot that she doesn't love she wants to be scary like a little baby like over my shoulders She just like hangs off here and I'll be like wilder and I'll tolerate them.
02:02:19.881 --> 02:02:25.346
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, she's way too much I say enjoy it because whenever I try I get like a little slant
02:02:25.958 --> 02:02:31.302
[UNKNOWN]: Well, my other cats can't do it because they're huge and Kyoko's just real small, so that's why she fits right now.
02:02:31.923 --> 02:02:32.764
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, back to it.
02:02:32.904 --> 02:02:36.487
[UNKNOWN]: Alright, so a lot has happened since the day in the life.
02:02:36.687 --> 02:02:38.288
[UNKNOWN]: Do we want to actually know before we do that?
02:02:38.308 --> 02:02:41.411
[UNKNOWN]: Can you give me before you reveal your final selection?
02:02:41.971 --> 02:02:44.413
[UNKNOWN]: List of honorable mentions just off the top of your head.
02:02:44.553 --> 02:02:45.474
[UNKNOWN]: Stuff that you consider.
02:02:45.694 --> 02:02:49.056
[UNKNOWN]: a lot more on your list most definitely.
02:02:49.196 --> 02:02:58.540
[UNKNOWN]: There's one where Gabrielle dresses like Xena that's really fun and then there's one where Gabrielle is slowly dying from a poison and Xena like takes on an entire army.
02:02:58.580 --> 02:03:00.481
[UNKNOWN]: I think it might be called like one against an army.
02:03:00.501 --> 02:03:01.441
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, that's a great one.
02:03:01.581 --> 02:03:03.243
[UNKNOWN]: We'll love that episode.
02:03:03.443 --> 02:03:04.524
[UNKNOWN]: Oh my god, it's so good.
02:03:04.664 --> 02:03:10.649
[UNKNOWN]: I love in the season six, which has kind of a few weird sleeper hit banger episodes.
02:03:10.889 --> 02:03:16.274
[UNKNOWN]: So one where they end up in like a watery cave and she's just like my home is with you, Zena.
02:03:16.314 --> 02:03:18.196
[UNKNOWN]: Like, you know, very beautiful moment.
02:03:18.476 --> 02:03:21.079
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, yes, when the Amazon's come back.
02:03:21.099 --> 02:03:22.380
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, episode just air.
02:03:22.560 --> 02:03:24.402
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I love that episode.
02:03:24.462 --> 02:03:26.003
[UNKNOWN]: Those right before the Ryan Golds.
02:03:26.103 --> 02:03:28.725
[UNKNOWN]: I love the wrangle, that might be in there too.
02:03:28.845 --> 02:03:30.186
[UNKNOWN]: The wrangle's really good.
02:03:30.286 --> 02:03:35.271
[UNKNOWN]: It's like Norse mythology, but it's also because Nina's literally Prince Charming in this.
02:03:35.471 --> 02:03:36.732
[UNKNOWN]: It's really beautiful.
02:03:36.832 --> 02:03:37.372
[UNKNOWN]: It's great.
02:03:37.392 --> 02:03:43.037
[UNKNOWN]: Season six is wild because they have a few like, oh yeah, for sure, straight stuff, things happening.
02:03:43.217 --> 02:03:48.862
[UNKNOWN]: But for the most part, this is where they kind of stop fucking around and they're just like, they're just married.
02:03:48.942 --> 02:03:50.503
[UNKNOWN]: She's getting herself up on ones.
02:03:50.603 --> 02:03:52.725
[UNKNOWN]: They're just married and then of course.
02:03:53.145 --> 02:04:08.037
[UNKNOWN]: They have the greatest episode of all time, I think, which is... A friend did wait?
02:04:08.057 --> 02:04:08.517
[UNKNOWN]: No.
02:04:09.077 --> 02:04:11.359
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I mean, you did say something.
02:04:11.379 --> 02:04:15.222
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, well, all right, well, I chose WinFate's Collide.
02:04:15.382 --> 02:04:19.205
[UNKNOWN]: And this, I would say, is where it could have ended.
02:04:19.265 --> 02:04:19.806
[UNKNOWN]: The finale.
02:04:23.208 --> 02:04:49.077
[UNKNOWN]: that so much we mostly could have just ended right here because the story is basically even if they are ripped apart via timeline like the space time continuum these two will always find each other and they will always be so horny for each other regardless of where they are who they are how things have changed for them what circumstances are happening these two still wouldn't
02:04:51.988 --> 02:04:56.271
[UNKNOWN]: I think it is that I have got my entire life, my whole life.
02:04:56.472 --> 02:05:00.314
[UNKNOWN]: And like I just find it very, very endearing and romantic.
02:05:00.475 --> 02:05:02.496
[UNKNOWN]: This episode is really well written.
02:05:03.157 --> 02:05:04.958
[UNKNOWN]: Caesar shows up to the fates.
02:05:05.218 --> 02:05:05.959
[UNKNOWN]: Caesar's a mother.
02:05:05.979 --> 02:05:06.319
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:05:06.339 --> 02:05:08.160
[UNKNOWN]: So he shows up and he's just playing by?
02:05:08.340 --> 02:05:08.641
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.
02:05:08.821 --> 02:05:09.702
[UNKNOWN]: Played by?
02:05:10.082 --> 02:05:11.783
[UNKNOWN]: It's Mr. none.
02:05:11.843 --> 02:05:13.985
[UNKNOWN]: I thought he said he's by and I was like, yes.
02:05:14.025 --> 02:05:14.265
[UNKNOWN]: No.
02:05:16.086 --> 02:05:18.768
[UNKNOWN]: But he is played by Carl Urban.
02:05:20.297 --> 02:05:24.839
[UNKNOWN]: through her mother, but also these and incredible cubid on this series.
02:05:24.859 --> 02:05:26.120
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, and he's also Ishmael.
02:05:26.260 --> 02:05:27.201
[UNKNOWN]: Multiple rules.
02:05:27.361 --> 02:05:29.382
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I, let's take my cat out of here.
02:05:29.682 --> 02:05:31.203
[UNKNOWN]: My cat's free cat is here.
02:05:31.223 --> 02:05:32.223
[UNKNOWN]: OK, chocolate.
02:05:32.824 --> 02:05:34.004
[UNKNOWN]: Why are they so feisty?
02:05:34.024 --> 02:05:36.245
[UNKNOWN]: My cat is suddenly just like playing and shit.
02:05:36.265 --> 02:05:37.366
[UNKNOWN]: Like, put it in bed.
02:05:37.806 --> 02:05:38.587
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:05:38.627 --> 02:05:40.408
[UNKNOWN]: Chocolate is like never allowed down here.
02:05:40.428 --> 02:05:42.529
[UNKNOWN]: Because she'll scream right into the microphone.
02:05:42.669 --> 02:05:43.529
[UNKNOWN]: And so same her.
02:05:43.569 --> 02:05:44.510
[UNKNOWN]: I was like, oh, no.
02:05:44.590 --> 02:05:46.411
[UNKNOWN]: Like, he'll go, you're like, oh, that's cute.
02:05:46.451 --> 02:05:48.392
[UNKNOWN]: And then chocolate shows up and you're like, no, no, no, no.
02:05:49.593 --> 02:05:54.817
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, you are on Caesar has shown up to the three fades.
02:05:54.857 --> 02:06:01.143
[UNKNOWN]: They have their loom of time, the world, whatever, and he says, what if I just fuck everything up?
02:06:01.323 --> 02:06:01.963
[UNKNOWN]: Can't stop me.
02:06:02.404 --> 02:06:03.124
[UNKNOWN]: And so he does.
02:06:03.425 --> 02:06:04.485
[UNKNOWN]: And they can't stop him.
02:06:04.606 --> 02:06:15.095
[UNKNOWN]: But what ends up happening is he's just like, okay, if I went back in time and I didn't betray Zena aka Franchor Ligs crucifier and we've heard a die, which is what he does.
02:06:15.615 --> 02:06:18.576
[UNKNOWN]: and also ruined her relationship with the hot lady.
02:06:18.656 --> 02:06:21.417
[UNKNOWN]: But anyway, he's like, if only I hadn't done that.
02:06:21.698 --> 02:06:26.039
[UNKNOWN]: So he goes back in time and he's like, actually Zayn, I think you're so cool and great.
02:06:26.119 --> 02:06:27.500
[UNKNOWN]: And we can rule together.
02:06:27.560 --> 02:06:28.941
[UNKNOWN]: And I won't betray you ever.
02:06:28.981 --> 02:06:30.261
[UNKNOWN]: I would never do that.
02:06:30.481 --> 02:06:32.342
[UNKNOWN]: So they end up getting married.
02:06:32.362 --> 02:06:33.682
[UNKNOWN]: They take over Rome.
02:06:34.023 --> 02:06:35.003
[UNKNOWN]: They're ruthless.
02:06:35.023 --> 02:06:35.963
[UNKNOWN]: They're beautiful.
02:06:36.023 --> 02:06:37.424
[UNKNOWN]: They're super hot together.
02:06:37.744 --> 02:06:44.527
[UNKNOWN]: But there is a play happening written by a playwright that Zayn has heard a little bit about.
02:06:45.067 --> 02:06:48.810
[UNKNOWN]: Her name's Gabrielle, so I'm gonna go check out this play.
02:06:48.850 --> 02:06:53.072
[UNKNOWN]: I guess And he's doing his stuff with evil villain lady.
02:06:53.253 --> 02:07:04.160
[UNKNOWN]: He's off having an authority and they're conspiring still because even though he's done all of this He's like, oh, turns out that scene is losing interest in me actually
02:07:04.660 --> 02:07:25.211
[UNKNOWN]: And what dignifies that more than the fact that she goes to see this play, the Gabrielle does, and then at the end of the play, she's socializing casually with this woman, and they are so into each other, I can't believe that this is on TV and that they're still trying to play this as these characters are straight.
02:07:25.351 --> 02:07:28.032
[UNKNOWN]: because they are in love immediately.
02:07:28.072 --> 02:07:29.613
[UNKNOWN]: And they're talking about love.
02:07:29.633 --> 02:07:33.115
[UNKNOWN]: Zena's just like, do you really believe that love can redeem you?
02:07:33.135 --> 02:07:35.556
[UNKNOWN]: And Gabrielle's like, yeah, of course, baby.
02:07:37.097 --> 02:07:38.378
[UNKNOWN]: I would love to redeem you.
02:07:38.398 --> 02:07:43.460
[UNKNOWN]: And so they have like instant immediate incredible chemistry.
02:07:43.520 --> 02:07:44.881
[UNKNOWN]: This script is incredible.
02:07:45.301 --> 02:07:48.163
[UNKNOWN]: And of course, hygings continue.
02:07:48.244 --> 02:07:49.985
[UNKNOWN]: Caesar betrays Zina.
02:07:50.225 --> 02:07:52.447
[UNKNOWN]: Allty is like trying to kill Zina.
02:07:52.567 --> 02:07:54.709
[UNKNOWN]: But Zina, you can see the future in a way.
02:07:54.909 --> 02:07:56.610
[UNKNOWN]: Allty, we should know, is a shamanist.
02:07:56.670 --> 02:07:59.112
[UNKNOWN]: And she can see different timelines kind of sometimes.
02:07:59.132 --> 02:08:01.434
[UNKNOWN]: So she figures out kind of what's happening.
02:08:01.454 --> 02:08:03.135
[UNKNOWN]: And that is in the background.
02:08:03.255 --> 02:08:03.476
[UNKNOWN]: Go on.
02:08:03.496 --> 02:08:08.640
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, basically like Gabrielle, I believe it's thrown into prison or is it Zina?
02:08:08.680 --> 02:08:10.761
[UNKNOWN]: I think it's Gabrielle is thrown into prison.
02:08:10.781 --> 02:08:11.442
[UNKNOWN]: First, yeah.
02:08:11.682 --> 02:08:14.965
[UNKNOWN]: because they're just like stop making eyes at my wife.
02:08:16.085 --> 02:08:18.407
[UNKNOWN]: So they throw her into jail for being gay.
02:08:18.807 --> 02:08:19.828
[UNKNOWN]: And they give her a haircut.
02:08:19.848 --> 02:08:20.869
[UNKNOWN]: Don't forget the haircut.
02:08:20.889 --> 02:08:22.690
[UNKNOWN]: They give her a haircut.
02:08:22.730 --> 02:08:23.531
[UNKNOWN]: I forgot about that.
02:08:23.571 --> 02:08:23.811
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:08:23.891 --> 02:08:25.112
[UNKNOWN]: So that all happens.
02:08:25.292 --> 02:08:29.195
[UNKNOWN]: And then Zena's just like, I will do absolutely anything.
02:08:29.336 --> 02:08:32.378
[UNKNOWN]: To get this right because I must be with Gabrielle.
02:08:32.698 --> 02:08:46.345
[UNKNOWN]: And by the end of it, you see all of the times and the threads of fate all over the place, but what happens at the very end, they're together again, and they're writing the horse along, and they're just like, okay, well, I guess we go off to our next adventure.
02:08:46.485 --> 02:08:59.292
[UNKNOWN]: That's a very wonderful platonic ending to this absolute unbelievable love story that we just witnessed, but I'm glad that the episode ends where they have found each other, because that to me is something that's so beautiful about these two.
02:08:59.712 --> 02:09:17.403
[UNKNOWN]: That we see them in different times and in different realities multiple times they will always find each other and so I think that that's gorgeous and I also love that Zina wouldn't have kept putting up with Caesar shit because that's also something she's betrayed by him but here she's kind of like I'm not that into you.
02:09:17.443 --> 02:09:23.327
[UNKNOWN]: I guess I'm going to like look at what my options are and these theatrical showings
02:09:23.547 --> 02:09:41.038
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, I just want to highlight at the end the way that we get into the opera timeline is when Zina is basically getting crucified again because Caesar decides that she betrayed him and also Altie basically was in jail but then he lets her out and then she kills him and so he's dead but Zina's still getting crucified at that point.
02:09:41.218 --> 02:09:44.620
[UNKNOWN]: Gabriel somehow finds her way to the fates, I guess temple and
02:09:44.700 --> 02:09:46.901
[UNKNOWN]: she sees that their loom is all messed up.
02:09:47.121 --> 02:09:49.122
[UNKNOWN]: She decides that she's going to set it on fire.
02:09:49.182 --> 02:09:53.624
[UNKNOWN]: They warn her that you can't do that because if you do the, you know, you'll destroy the world maybe.
02:09:53.704 --> 02:09:56.305
[UNKNOWN]: And she's just like, well, without Zina, that's fine.
02:09:57.026 --> 02:10:03.249
[UNKNOWN]: So she sets it on fire and that kind of resets the timeline to, like you said, they find themselves in a misty forest.
02:10:03.329 --> 02:10:05.050
[UNKNOWN]: It's very beautiful and romantic.
02:10:05.070 --> 02:10:10.032
[UNKNOWN]: And they remember it all and then Zina and Gabrielle right away to their next adventure.
02:10:10.312 --> 02:10:12.733
[UNKNOWN]: The end, the series ends right there.
02:10:12.934 --> 02:10:18.597
[UNKNOWN]: Gabrielle says, at a certain point, Zena, when I'm with you, this emptiness that I felt my entire life is gone.
02:10:20.198 --> 02:10:21.038
[UNKNOWN]: And that's why.
02:10:21.058 --> 02:10:24.780
[UNKNOWN]: Truly, like lines, gems, posters, this would have been a beautiful ending.
02:10:24.860 --> 02:10:31.864
[UNKNOWN]: I'm not mad at people who are like, I stop here because as far as I'm concerned, the rest is a suggestion or an alt world or something.
02:10:32.004 --> 02:10:32.664
[UNKNOWN]: I accept that.
02:10:32.725 --> 02:10:33.885
[UNKNOWN]: But I think this would have been a great ending.
02:10:33.905 --> 02:10:36.647
[UNKNOWN]: I think the episode after it is the Sappho episode as well.
02:10:36.787 --> 02:10:37.407
[UNKNOWN]: Which is fun.
02:10:37.567 --> 02:10:38.888
[UNKNOWN]: It's like great post script one.
02:10:39.068 --> 02:10:40.369
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, after Dany forever.
02:10:40.629 --> 02:10:49.616
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I also really love you pick this up because in terms of a finale, I think it works a lot better for a lot of reasons as a finale, but like one of the reasons because like it has a lot of like these old faces.
02:10:49.736 --> 02:10:53.238
[UNKNOWN]: You'll like you said you get Carl Urban, you get all tea back, you know, she's on my favorite.
02:10:53.258 --> 02:10:55.320
[UNKNOWN]: It's nice to see her at that point of the storyline.
02:10:55.340 --> 02:10:56.340
[UNKNOWN]: Jocks are had died.
02:10:56.360 --> 02:10:58.562
[UNKNOWN]: So you get Jocks are back in a little cameo role.
02:10:58.782 --> 02:11:00.182
[UNKNOWN]: get brutis back as well.
02:11:00.362 --> 02:11:07.024
[UNKNOWN]: It's nice that they also nod towards the Caesar storyline in arc because that ends up becoming arguably why Zena becomes Zena.
02:11:07.084 --> 02:11:12.425
[UNKNOWN]: That's like such a significant part of her 10 years ago history that returning to it at the end feels appropriate.
02:11:12.485 --> 02:11:19.386
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah in general, this episode I wouldn't necessarily recommend it until people have watched a bit more of Zena just because it's right at the end.
02:11:19.446 --> 02:11:21.547
[UNKNOWN]: It's a great finale, but I would recommend it as well.
02:11:21.587 --> 02:11:22.107
[UNKNOWN]: I think you're right.
02:11:22.147 --> 02:11:23.127
[UNKNOWN]: I'm really glad you brought it up.
02:11:23.187 --> 02:11:23.907
[UNKNOWN]: This is where we should event
02:11:24.167 --> 02:11:30.150
[UNKNOWN]: and also I guess this leads us to maybe briefly talk about what are feelings about the finale.
02:11:30.210 --> 02:11:36.033
[UNKNOWN]: Do you want to tell me why you don't like the finale and you'd prefer it if we ended with when fades come on?
02:11:36.433 --> 02:11:37.754
[UNKNOWN]: The pan flute, right?
02:11:37.774 --> 02:11:40.575
[UNKNOWN]: They're constantly like an Asian person appears and it's just like
02:11:44.948 --> 02:11:46.648
[UNKNOWN]: You know, I will give the finale one thing.
02:11:46.908 --> 02:11:55.070
[UNKNOWN]: Aside from the fact that it's beautifully shot, you know, they really tried to make an effort to reference and pay honor to like those Hong Kong films that, you know, the samurai, I would as well.
02:11:55.310 --> 02:12:03.192
[UNKNOWN]: And it was cool to see Gabrielle become the warrior and like fight and using his moves, and learn how to use his chakra as well.
02:12:03.252 --> 02:12:07.033
[UNKNOWN]: Finally, after all this time, we see Zina has taught her the pinch as well.
02:12:07.153 --> 02:12:10.754
[UNKNOWN]: Even though I do, like I said before, I think it was like a rushed part to that conclusion.
02:12:10.774 --> 02:12:13.815
[UNKNOWN]: I could see why that is where Gabrielle's story ended.
02:12:15.335 --> 02:12:26.541
[UNKNOWN]: Really brutally and violently and then she stops Gabrielle from resurrecting her because if she does then all the other souls That the reason that she dies will get lost.
02:12:26.681 --> 02:12:28.382
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, basically she would not be redeemed.
02:12:28.402 --> 02:12:32.364
[UNKNOWN]: I really like that scene where the villagers were attacking her She was dressed like a drunk guy.
02:12:32.384 --> 02:12:33.325
[UNKNOWN]: I thought that was really funny
02:12:33.585 --> 02:12:35.347
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, that was funny.
02:12:35.527 --> 02:12:38.370
[UNKNOWN]: I like that they're definitely married in this.
02:12:38.431 --> 02:12:42.956
[UNKNOWN]: This is in a time to leave her and just to be like, this is my thing.
02:12:43.036 --> 02:12:47.000
[UNKNOWN]: I got to go do this and Gabrielle is just okay, see you there on my way.
02:12:48.842 --> 02:13:15.488
[UNKNOWN]: Like I'm coming anyway, I don't give a shit and so you see them be very I don't know They're just in love with each other by this time and I think that that is a beautiful thing If you're a shipper of these two, I would say that the finale is always gonna be worth watching We also have a really cool ex girlfriend of Zena who shows up and is pretty canonically her ex like it's not Like I said they didn't say it, but she's her ex That's pretty clear.
02:13:15.808 --> 02:13:17.488
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, there's romantic relationship.
02:13:17.528 --> 02:13:17.768
[UNKNOWN]: We know
02:13:20.249 --> 02:13:24.051
[UNKNOWN]: What's happening here, but yeah, so there's good to it definitely.
02:13:24.191 --> 02:13:39.538
[UNKNOWN]: I wouldn't say that it's one to totally skip, but I do think that after you watch something like when fates collide or even if you wanted to talk about the episode where Gabriel is leading the Amazon's for a whole episode and she gets to run around to be an action hero, that's really fun.
02:13:39.858 --> 02:13:43.260
[UNKNOWN]: the episode where she says if she dies, she wants to be buried.
02:13:43.300 --> 02:13:44.420
[UNKNOWN]: Where is Nina's buried?
02:13:44.460 --> 02:13:47.362
[UNKNOWN]: You know, these are all really beautiful episodes.
02:13:47.622 --> 02:13:49.983
[UNKNOWN]: I would say that they work much better.
02:13:50.183 --> 02:13:55.766
[UNKNOWN]: And then they also get to issue some of the problematic aspects of this finale, which is nice.
02:13:55.986 --> 02:13:57.306
[UNKNOWN]: But they didn't end it that way.
02:13:57.347 --> 02:13:58.167
[UNKNOWN]: They ended it with this.
02:13:58.487 --> 02:14:04.310
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I was going to say, and we haven't brought this up yet, but barrier gaze, this is when the trope is finally like reached to call late.
02:14:04.350 --> 02:14:06.952
[UNKNOWN]: And we talked about how important this show was to the gay community.
02:14:07.032 --> 02:14:08.813
[UNKNOWN]: This show ended in 2001, I believe.
02:14:08.853 --> 02:14:12.475
[UNKNOWN]: This is around the time when we were starting to have those conversations, not even yet.
02:14:12.575 --> 02:14:16.577
[UNKNOWN]: We really start to have that conversation, I think, around the 100 publicly in the mainstream.
02:14:16.657 --> 02:14:17.438
[UNKNOWN]: But like, I
02:14:17.978 --> 02:14:21.419
[UNKNOWN]: In the critical, I say circles, well, people discussing the show and also the fan of the show.
02:14:21.519 --> 02:14:26.161
[UNKNOWN]: I was something that people recognized and were ready to support it with the fact that, you know, the show went there.
02:14:26.301 --> 02:14:29.522
[UNKNOWN]: There's an aspect of me that I kind of appreciate.
02:14:30.362 --> 02:14:41.906
[UNKNOWN]: I don't like that Zena dies in the end, but when I was reading some of the commentary by Tapper and just some of the cast and crew about why they made that choice, I was most convinced by the argument of we're trying to do a Greek tragedy, right?
02:14:42.006 --> 02:14:45.987
[UNKNOWN]: We wanted to end it with a bit of sweet tragedy and I was like, okay, that could convince me.
02:14:46.507 --> 02:14:47.428
[UNKNOWN]: Maybe a little bit.
02:14:47.508 --> 02:15:13.248
[UNKNOWN]: I feel like if that was done in a better way that I could have swallowed the fact that Zina died in the end I mean not to get too granular into the details about this episode There's little things like the way the broadcast version and it'll cutting this image of Zina as it goes with Gabrielle and it'll adding a very sad tone to it I think obviously going to Asia and then having her giving Gabrielle a tattoo on her back and doing a little gaysia kind of we talked about how we can be
02:15:16.170 --> 02:15:19.333
[UNKNOWN]: This one felt like, yeah, I will still maintain that.
02:15:19.693 --> 02:15:27.680
[UNKNOWN]: This one felt like it was a lot to try and swallow, specifically the brutality as well with which Zina died, she was beheaded, you know?
02:15:27.841 --> 02:15:35.988
[UNKNOWN]: It was truly horrible and gruesome and it felt unnecessary, it felt like for a character who's such a champion and such an icon, a feminist icon.
02:15:36.108 --> 02:15:38.849
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, just say that to have that happen like that.
02:15:39.069 --> 02:15:40.109
[UNKNOWN]: Just felt insulting.
02:15:40.129 --> 02:15:40.929
[UNKNOWN]: It felt really hurtful.
02:15:40.949 --> 02:15:41.889
[UNKNOWN]: I don't even think it's insulting.
02:15:41.909 --> 02:15:42.749
[UNKNOWN]: It felt hurtful, you know.
02:15:42.769 --> 02:15:45.270
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, Hercules didn't have to die at the end of his series.
02:15:45.330 --> 02:15:46.550
[UNKNOWN]: I don't know why he needed it.
02:15:46.710 --> 02:15:52.632
[UNKNOWN]: Also, yeah, of course, the overwhelming Orientalism of this episode is just kind of overpowering.
02:15:52.772 --> 02:16:02.994
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, the whole idea that five episodes or 10 episodes ago, we had had this whole arc with them, where no matter where we are, whoever we become, we will find each other and hear it's just like,
02:16:03.254 --> 02:16:08.778
[UNKNOWN]: Well, actually Zina died, and so they acknowledge their relationship.
02:16:08.838 --> 02:16:16.783
[UNKNOWN]: I think the most here, they go kind of out of their way to be like these two are married, and then they go, but one of them thereby must die.
02:16:16.923 --> 02:16:19.525
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that that's kind of the lesbian vampire thing.
02:16:19.605 --> 02:16:19.925
[UNKNOWN]: That's the
02:16:25.647 --> 02:16:38.278
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, and I will say like since this episode was aired and three actions came out years later, some of I don't see lawless specifically expressed regret about the choice to make it and has told people hey ignore it if you don't like it.
02:16:38.418 --> 02:16:39.939
[UNKNOWN]: It's fine, which often I do.
02:16:39.959 --> 02:16:40.200
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:16:40.956 --> 02:16:41.536
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, same.
02:16:42.397 --> 02:16:44.398
[UNKNOWN]: I kind of like also it's very balsy.
02:16:44.458 --> 02:16:50.042
[UNKNOWN]: There's an element about me that like can look at such a balsy move like some factor of respect, you know?
02:16:50.082 --> 02:16:59.187
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, this is where I have to say that I actually enjoyed the ending of killing Eve and everybody wants to kill me over this, but I was like, look, it's just it's kind of good.
02:16:59.367 --> 02:17:01.449
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, I know that you're mad about it.
02:17:01.509 --> 02:17:03.510
[UNKNOWN]: I get it, but it's kind of good.
02:17:03.710 --> 02:17:08.251
[UNKNOWN]: I didn't enjoy it, but personally, I enjoyed the fact that Killingy was ended because they need to end this.
02:17:08.411 --> 02:17:11.992
[UNKNOWN]: It was over by now, it was like, look, it was the same thing too.
02:17:12.332 --> 02:17:18.353
[UNKNOWN]: There was the same finale, three seasons in a row, so we need to have this series end now.
02:17:18.553 --> 02:17:21.234
[UNKNOWN]: I think they're not on a fun note, but what I mean?
02:17:21.334 --> 02:17:25.815
[UNKNOWN]: They went out on like a memorable note, you know, but yeah, Zina didn't necessarily need to send it.
02:17:25.835 --> 02:17:26.775
[UNKNOWN]: I completely agree with you.
02:17:26.835 --> 02:17:29.755
[UNKNOWN]: I think you picked the correct finale with when Fates collide.
02:17:29.916 --> 02:17:31.876
[UNKNOWN]: I think that's the ending of this series, yeah.
02:17:32.216 --> 02:17:45.420
[UNKNOWN]: truly, even if like Zena does get a reboot or like they get a continuation or whatever, I could seriously see them ignoring this completely or like explain it get away really quickly and without any pushback from fandom or anything like that.
02:17:45.540 --> 02:17:54.983
[UNKNOWN]: Also, that's like the other thing Zena has died so many times and was it revived so many times that it felt like there was an arbitrary reason and to show that does arbitrary reasons a lot but like they feel better.
02:17:55.123 --> 02:17:57.104
[UNKNOWN]: You know, this one just felt like they stapled it on.
02:17:57.284 --> 02:17:58.364
[UNKNOWN]: I could be like I said slightly
02:18:01.605 --> 02:18:21.607
[UNKNOWN]: And so in their heads this was not the end and then they just never got the opportunity to do that Which is why I think the thing that you said about there's potential in it in the world of comics to keep going and if you really got the full support of the cast and the crew and the writers How if we even got like some of the writers back to write some comics so just finishing the story or adding another chapter to the story I think that'd be fantastic
02:18:21.747 --> 02:18:31.712
[UNKNOWN]: One thing I will say is that I do like like I said like the arc that Gabrielle goes on from like barred to warrior, even though I would have preferred understanding of both as being married to each other and the potential of that.
02:18:31.872 --> 02:18:33.552
[UNKNOWN]: I do in terms of symmetry.
02:18:33.793 --> 02:18:37.494
[UNKNOWN]: I like the idea by the end Gabrielle becomes the warrior princess.
02:18:37.614 --> 02:18:38.435
[UNKNOWN]: I like that as a fake.
02:18:38.455 --> 02:18:41.176
[UNKNOWN]: I think she could have become another warrior princess next to Zeta.
02:18:41.316 --> 02:18:43.517
[UNKNOWN]: But I kind of like that in the end she does train her.
02:18:43.537 --> 02:18:45.758
[UNKNOWN]: You know what I mean like Gabrielle rises so that's standard.
02:18:45.878 --> 02:18:46.438
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah.
02:18:46.518 --> 02:18:49.501
[UNKNOWN]: It's just really difficult, you know, it's a tough experience.
02:18:49.521 --> 02:18:50.201
[UNKNOWN]: It was a tough watch.
02:18:50.241 --> 02:18:51.922
[UNKNOWN]: I remember right before I was getting to it.
02:18:52.042 --> 02:18:53.083
[UNKNOWN]: You warned me about it.
02:18:53.203 --> 02:18:56.125
[UNKNOWN]: I got so many warnings about steel yourself for this finale.
02:18:56.145 --> 02:18:58.286
[UNKNOWN]: He was like, Sarah, why are we in Japan?
02:18:58.307 --> 02:19:01.369
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, I was so confused.
02:19:01.389 --> 02:19:02.850
[UNKNOWN]: We were suddenly in Japan.
02:19:03.030 --> 02:19:04.351
[UNKNOWN]: Why was the negation?
02:19:04.451 --> 02:19:04.791
[UNKNOWN]: I'm sorry.
02:19:04.811 --> 02:19:05.231
[UNKNOWN]: I can't do.
02:19:05.291 --> 02:19:06.252
[UNKNOWN]: I can't open up this wound.
02:19:06.752 --> 02:19:25.564
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I think unfortunately Zena is a show that has some really great episodes, it also has some really awful episodes, not many, but some, and unfortunately ended on bad notes, you know, which was always the risk, but the good news about it is that you don't have to let it end there for you.
02:19:25.764 --> 02:19:26.124
[UNKNOWN]: That's right.
02:19:26.284 --> 02:19:27.685
[UNKNOWN]: And move on, Zena lives.
02:19:27.985 --> 02:19:30.646
[UNKNOWN]: The world of fan fiction is there for you.
02:19:30.706 --> 02:19:38.307
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, if anything, because I say comics are the place for Zina but if anything, fan fiction is kept Zina alive in a very real way.
02:19:38.628 --> 02:19:41.308
[UNKNOWN]: Does it mean that the reason why like our cover of our own exists?
02:19:41.508 --> 02:19:51.931
[UNKNOWN]: From what I understand, because it's not by any means the first thing that was creating flash-fick, but from what I understand for lesbians, it really is kind of the first flash-fick.
02:19:52.051 --> 02:19:56.592
[UNKNOWN]: Because once again, my entire experience of the Zina fan fiction world was as a
02:19:58.532 --> 02:20:00.093
[UNKNOWN]: So that's all I've got.
02:20:00.253 --> 02:20:01.914
[UNKNOWN]: I can only say what I went through.
02:20:02.074 --> 02:20:03.995
[UNKNOWN]: I know that there's like so much difference.
02:20:04.115 --> 02:20:05.876
[UNKNOWN]: Slash fictions out there.
02:20:06.076 --> 02:20:08.257
[UNKNOWN]: I know that conquer was like a big one.
02:20:08.277 --> 02:20:08.557
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:20:08.577 --> 02:20:11.139
[UNKNOWN]: It became like such a significant part of what Zina was.
02:20:11.239 --> 02:20:16.521
[UNKNOWN]: Some of the people who became really popular writing pat fiction ended up coming on to the show to write in later seasons.
02:20:16.721 --> 02:20:17.362
[UNKNOWN]: Totally correct.
02:20:17.402 --> 02:20:24.225
[UNKNOWN]: I think some of our favorite episodes of the later, because basically we didn't mention this before, but it was a showrunner change around season five.
02:20:24.405 --> 02:20:28.288
[UNKNOWN]: that did change the tone a little bit and fans responded to that.
02:20:28.489 --> 02:20:32.532
[UNKNOWN]: Actually, this was a question where we're talking about worse ex-boyfriends, right?
02:20:32.632 --> 02:20:33.633
[UNKNOWN]: I didn't give my answer.
02:20:33.833 --> 02:20:37.236
[UNKNOWN]: My answer was going to be the Joccer Sun when they do the time skip.
02:20:37.396 --> 02:20:41.340
[UNKNOWN]: Joccer has a Sun who's like sexy that they try to kind of pair with Gabrielle.
02:20:41.360 --> 02:20:43.301
[UNKNOWN]: This was like, oh, I forgot about that.
02:20:43.401 --> 02:20:43.862
[UNKNOWN]: Good day.
02:20:44.082 --> 02:20:48.805
[UNKNOWN]: It was this year after we established that, no, they're wives, so why are we doing this now?
02:20:49.005 --> 02:20:55.569
[UNKNOWN]: I will give respect to the fact, once they themselves discovered that wasn't working, they quickly were just like, actually, no, never mind.
02:20:55.609 --> 02:20:56.390
[UNKNOWN]: Let's go to Safo.
02:20:56.430 --> 02:20:57.070
[UNKNOWN]: You know, truly.
02:20:57.090 --> 02:20:58.151
[UNKNOWN]: You're done.
02:20:58.611 --> 02:21:00.212
[UNKNOWN]: And I respect, of course, correct.
02:21:00.272 --> 02:21:00.852
[UNKNOWN]: I really do.
02:21:00.933 --> 02:21:01.213
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:21:01.293 --> 02:21:02.233
[UNKNOWN]: You watch one phase glad.
02:21:02.253 --> 02:21:05.936
[UNKNOWN]: I think that was a really good for episode spread of Zina, that we gave.
02:21:06.136 --> 02:21:06.336
[UNKNOWN]: You.
02:21:06.616 --> 02:21:08.519
[UNKNOWN]: And we didn't cover all of it.
02:21:08.699 --> 02:21:10.922
[UNKNOWN]: There's so much we didn't talk about the list of it.
02:21:10.982 --> 02:21:15.788
[UNKNOWN]: We talked about Calisto, Aphrodite, Livia.
02:21:15.888 --> 02:21:20.234
[UNKNOWN]: These are all incredible, incredible characters.
02:21:20.474 --> 02:21:23.618
[UNKNOWN]: So you've got your assignment, folks.
02:21:23.718 --> 02:21:25.220
[UNKNOWN]: Like, who watches, you know?
02:21:25.600 --> 02:21:26.080
[UNKNOWN]: But you know what?
02:21:26.100 --> 02:21:30.502
[UNKNOWN]: Can I just say like we cannot end this episode without at least like five ten minutes on Kalisto?
02:21:30.582 --> 02:21:33.383
[UNKNOWN]: I know we're running up against the limit, but I'm gonna make space.
02:21:33.443 --> 02:21:33.923
[UNKNOWN]: I don't care.
02:21:34.123 --> 02:21:35.524
[UNKNOWN]: I'm gonna hate myself when I'm editing this.
02:21:35.564 --> 02:21:37.505
[UNKNOWN]: However, Kama, we must discuss Kalisto.
02:21:37.545 --> 02:21:38.965
[UNKNOWN]: Just give me like some feelings.
02:21:39.285 --> 02:21:39.565
[UNKNOWN]: Go.
02:21:39.765 --> 02:21:41.726
[UNKNOWN]: So she's a young kid.
02:21:42.226 --> 02:21:44.587
[UNKNOWN]: Zena plays almost an opposite role.
02:21:44.787 --> 02:21:47.108
[UNKNOWN]: So she's almost like the anti-gabriel, right?
02:21:47.188 --> 02:21:48.649
[UNKNOWN]: So you have- She's safe.
02:21:48.889 --> 02:21:49.269
[UNKNOWN]: If you will.
02:21:49.589 --> 02:21:54.931
[UNKNOWN]: yet in many ways Gabrielle Seasonan is inspired by her heroic journey.
02:21:55.011 --> 02:21:57.031
[UNKNOWN]: Callisto saw the very worst of Zina.
02:21:57.111 --> 02:22:01.633
[UNKNOWN]: Zina came to her small town, much as she went to Gabrielle's.
02:22:01.793 --> 02:22:03.093
[UNKNOWN]: She killed her family.
02:22:03.313 --> 02:22:06.334
[UNKNOWN]: And Callisto was much younger than Gabrielle is the time.
02:22:06.674 --> 02:22:11.396
[UNKNOWN]: And she just watches this demon woman cut her mom and her sisters down.
02:22:11.696 --> 02:22:12.156
[UNKNOWN]: And she
02:22:13.076 --> 02:22:17.859
[UNKNOWN]: Never gets over it because also it turns out that this woman is super hot.
02:22:17.939 --> 02:22:20.481
[UNKNOWN]: So she has some real conflicting feelings.
02:22:20.501 --> 02:22:28.447
[UNKNOWN]: So we go through where they are flirt fighting all of the times Zina's not really but Calisto for sure is.
02:22:28.607 --> 02:22:31.409
[UNKNOWN]: So we get Calisto poisoning people.
02:22:31.489 --> 02:22:33.250
[UNKNOWN]: She like shoots Zina.
02:22:33.370 --> 02:22:35.932
[UNKNOWN]: I think with an arrow that's poisoned in the episode.
02:22:36.132 --> 02:22:38.413
[UNKNOWN]: And that's where we'll have to pretend to be Zina
02:22:41.175 --> 02:23:03.873
[UNKNOWN]: shows up that way very like sneaky yeah and also like she was pretending to be Zina on her first introduction as well and setting fire to village that's right she's killing people yes she's like I'm Zina I'm not redeemable I'm evil yeah yeah and people are like no Zina we heard that you're out here killing people in Zina's like I'm fucking damn it what's going on then I'm a brunette I'm a brunette I'm a brunette
02:23:04.453 --> 02:23:05.715
[UNKNOWN]: This person doesn't yoga.
02:23:05.735 --> 02:23:07.838
[UNKNOWN]: This is how it's like completely different.
02:23:07.858 --> 02:23:09.119
[UNKNOWN]: Shout out to Hudson like.
02:23:09.219 --> 02:23:12.363
[UNKNOWN]: It can be, she's started corrupted but I just want to take a moment.
02:23:12.403 --> 02:23:13.805
[UNKNOWN]: Hudson like was tremendous.
02:23:13.845 --> 02:23:16.729
[UNKNOWN]: I believe this is the last role she did before she changed careers.
02:23:16.849 --> 02:23:22.096
[UNKNOWN]: But like my god, we lost something from the television industry because she was really amazing.
02:23:22.156 --> 02:23:32.001
[UNKNOWN]: her interviews are so classic, highly recommend even whenever I was a teenager and I was subscribed to the Zina magazine, which is that's how gay I am.
02:23:32.582 --> 02:23:37.965
[UNKNOWN]: She would have interviews that were just like, it seems kind of like Callisto sort of wants to fuck Zina, right?
02:23:38.665 --> 02:23:41.166
[UNKNOWN]: You're just like, yeah, it does seem like that.
02:23:41.407 --> 02:23:44.328
[UNKNOWN]: It's interesting that the actor who's playing her has now said that.
02:23:44.668 --> 02:23:48.350
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I mean, we're talking about like a massive hippie, and like totally.
02:23:48.490 --> 02:23:51.091
[UNKNOWN]: So not like Calisto and such significant ways.
02:23:51.452 --> 02:23:57.495
[UNKNOWN]: One thing she has been doing over the past couple years leading yoga workshops during the Zina retreat convention things.
02:23:57.535 --> 02:23:59.536
[UNKNOWN]: And I think that's like, God, what a goddess.
02:23:59.636 --> 02:24:00.476
[UNKNOWN]: I love her so much.
02:24:00.776 --> 02:24:01.837
[UNKNOWN]: She's a recurring character.
02:24:01.837 --> 02:24:06.304
[UNKNOWN]: She's the best, and she's always had a great deal of fun with her role on Zina's Seams.
02:24:06.624 --> 02:24:13.895
[UNKNOWN]: And I mean, who else could have played Callisto the way that she does, because she just seems to very much relish the role so deeply.
02:24:13.955 --> 02:24:16.839
[UNKNOWN]: I'll tell you who Lucy Lawless for a couple of episodes.
02:24:17.740 --> 02:24:19.120
[UNKNOWN]: That's absolutely correct.
02:24:19.341 --> 02:24:22.882
[UNKNOWN]: Every time Kalisto shows up, she is having the goddamn time of her life.
02:24:22.942 --> 02:24:27.083
[UNKNOWN]: She does a great act of ally shit by killing Perticus Gabrielle's one night husband.
02:24:27.223 --> 02:24:28.183
[UNKNOWN]: Thanks for helping out.
02:24:28.223 --> 02:24:29.223
[UNKNOWN]: You have monster.
02:24:29.243 --> 02:24:30.304
[UNKNOWN]: You are indeed.
02:24:30.324 --> 02:24:31.724
[UNKNOWN]: You are indeed.
02:24:32.484 --> 02:24:35.985
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you for helping the clear community in such a great way.
02:24:36.005 --> 02:24:37.286
[UNKNOWN]: I appreciate you.
02:24:37.306 --> 02:24:41.227
[UNKNOWN]: I just also, she impregnated Zina.
02:24:41.367 --> 02:24:45.328
[UNKNOWN]: She straight up knocks her up and then Gabrielle's like, I'm the dad actually.
02:24:46.045 --> 02:24:51.774
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, I was 20 years later, Karen would do it with Jean Grey, sure, but she did it first, okay?
02:24:51.854 --> 02:24:54.919
[UNKNOWN]: Hudson was for Zina, did it first, okay?
02:24:55.240 --> 02:25:00.648
[UNKNOWN]: Zina did it first, it's like, the Simpson's did it joke, but it's like, Zina did it, and like that's it.
02:25:01.309 --> 02:25:02.930
[UNKNOWN]: For John or TV, that's real.
02:25:03.250 --> 02:25:03.951
[UNKNOWN]: It is so real.
02:25:04.011 --> 02:25:04.631
[UNKNOWN]: Like, come on.
02:25:04.711 --> 02:25:04.992
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:25:05.032 --> 02:25:06.593
[UNKNOWN]: Basically, Calisto is a queen.
02:25:06.673 --> 02:25:09.695
[UNKNOWN]: Every time she shows up, she's like, all eyes on Calisto.
02:25:09.715 --> 02:25:11.776
[UNKNOWN]: We don't give a shit about what else is going on.
02:25:11.896 --> 02:25:27.047
[UNKNOWN]: She has one of the greatest moments of anything where everybody is like, well, now you get to be part of the gods, because you've got the Heinz blood dagger, and she turns around, stab, strife, and is like, I wouldn't be a part of any glove that would have me as a member, and then just leaves and you're like, what the fuck?
02:25:28.267 --> 02:25:39.171
[UNKNOWN]: That's what we thought her goal was, so she's a wild card and then unfortunately it definitely goes off the rails at a certain point where it's like she's an angel She's a demon like whatever that's nonsense.
02:25:39.191 --> 02:25:54.095
[UNKNOWN]: It gets a bit weird towards the end They don't know what they're doing with her at that point, but yeah in the beginning she's too good and they told such a good story with her That when they bring her back they're kind of like ever diminishing returns like as little like although I will say I do think it took
02:25:54.415 --> 02:25:55.536
[UNKNOWN]: up until demon.
02:25:55.756 --> 02:25:58.479
[UNKNOWN]: After demon is when she completely loses me.
02:25:58.579 --> 02:26:04.465
[UNKNOWN]: Before then, I agree with these diminishing returns after I think the first three trilogy episode that the body swam?
02:26:04.485 --> 02:26:09.850
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, after the evil Amazon is there and the last one is like fighting each other.
02:26:11.691 --> 02:26:14.414
[UNKNOWN]: Can we just say the biggest flop of all villains?
02:26:16.218 --> 02:26:19.239
[UNKNOWN]: She's so bad at it, though, like, what is this?
02:26:19.539 --> 02:26:22.420
[UNKNOWN]: No, Gabrielle, I'm put in the zone queen.
02:26:22.440 --> 02:26:23.540
[UNKNOWN]: And she's so bad.
02:26:23.720 --> 02:26:26.901
[UNKNOWN]: I almost thought of bringing her up as worse, possible ex-girlfriend.
02:26:27.421 --> 02:26:29.762
[UNKNOWN]: And that's another Gabrielle ex, almost.
02:26:29.782 --> 02:26:30.622
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, but yeah.
02:26:31.082 --> 02:26:33.063
[UNKNOWN]: And maybe like Zena, a little bit sometimes.
02:26:33.203 --> 02:26:36.984
[UNKNOWN]: But the role of Killa Stowe is an interesting force multiplier.
02:26:37.024 --> 02:26:41.605
[UNKNOWN]: They're like shifts the dynamic of everybody whenever she pops up, because Gabrielle hates her.
02:26:41.725 --> 02:26:42.345
[UNKNOWN]: Gabrielle,
02:26:42.385 --> 02:26:44.546
[UNKNOWN]: who so far we understand as like the pacifist.
02:26:44.746 --> 02:26:47.307
[UNKNOWN]: Obviously, Kulis still killed her husband that she liked for one day.
02:26:47.787 --> 02:26:55.410
[UNKNOWN]: And that like triggers the vengeance aspect of Gabrielle and really complicates her character in just in way, especially in relation to this whole like pacifist thing because Kulis does the exception.
02:26:55.510 --> 02:26:56.470
[UNKNOWN]: She's always the exception.
02:26:56.770 --> 02:27:08.635
[UNKNOWN]: And you can't help but feel that's in part because of the threat that she poses her relationship with Zina because even though it's like specifically subtext and I think it's not there not because of the queerness of it but because of how it might complicate the story.
02:27:08.655 --> 02:27:09.115
[UNKNOWN]: But there is like,
02:27:09.215 --> 02:27:11.277
[UNKNOWN]: sexual dynamic to Calisto and Zena.
02:27:11.397 --> 02:27:16.480
[UNKNOWN]: You know, aside from the fact that they're basically meant to be like Angel and dark side or whatever it is to each character.
02:27:16.500 --> 02:27:18.341
[UNKNOWN]: There's also in there into play something.
02:27:18.442 --> 02:27:22.965
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, sexual and fucked up, specifically because of like the trauma that Zena has visited upon her life.
02:27:23.045 --> 02:27:24.766
[UNKNOWN]: And Zena also hates Calisto.
02:27:25.066 --> 02:27:43.602
[UNKNOWN]: Even though she wants to be redeemed for the actions that she's done that harm people like Clisto, but the way that forces Zeta to have some confrontations about what is goodness, what is badness, what is my responsibility to actually the people that I've hurt, what is risk, aversion, and risk management, and a harm mitigation, you know, with Clisto, the ethics of it.
02:27:43.682 --> 02:28:02.633
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, and the fact that Calisto herself is correct, like how would you ever look at a girl who had her whole family chopped down right in front of her and had to smell burning bodies of her friend neighbors, how would you ever tell that person that they should find forgiveness in their heart because now this person feels bad about it.
02:28:02.773 --> 02:28:03.013
[UNKNOWN]: So
02:28:03.273 --> 02:28:04.514
[UNKNOWN]: that she asks directly.
02:28:04.574 --> 02:28:07.975
[UNKNOWN]: She has seen and have you ever been tried for your crimes and it's true.
02:28:08.295 --> 02:28:08.776
[UNKNOWN]: She has it.
02:28:08.956 --> 02:28:12.017
[UNKNOWN]: She has just decided she's going to do good now and okay, great.
02:28:12.117 --> 02:28:14.898
[UNKNOWN]: Well, have you been tried for your crimes and you killed her family?
02:28:14.978 --> 02:28:15.138
[UNKNOWN]: Yep.
02:28:15.359 --> 02:28:20.581
[UNKNOWN]: She's part of the redemption arc in that there is always going to be a person who will never forgive your ask.
02:28:21.121 --> 02:28:21.701
[UNKNOWN]: that you did.
02:28:22.001 --> 02:28:23.002
[UNKNOWN]: And it's great.
02:28:23.122 --> 02:28:25.623
[UNKNOWN]: I mean, that's she's part of the story.
02:28:25.743 --> 02:28:35.366
[UNKNOWN]: Without colistos, Zina isn't as successful as a redemption narrative because the only reason it works is that ultimately they do come to see eye to eye kind of.
02:28:36.626 --> 02:28:37.407
[UNKNOWN]: It's complicated.
02:28:37.527 --> 02:28:46.930
[UNKNOWN]: But yeah, she's like one of the points of the story as much as Gabrielle is because as I say, they serve opposite sides of the same lesson that Zina has to learn.
02:28:47.270 --> 02:29:02.497
[UNKNOWN]: Hmm, and I think of all the characters that pop up as almost alt Zina are that are meant to basically be a refraction of Zina Calisto Hands far the most interesting successful attempt at that ends up developing into like something really like fascinating and interesting and also like
02:29:02.717 --> 02:29:19.905
[UNKNOWN]: The way that Hudson plays her, there's a manic kind of insanity, but also because Hudson obviously said she wants on to become a yoga instructor and teacher, but also was a dancer and the way we talked about how important the choreography and the stunt work is the show, but the way that Hudson moves her body is because Zina is kind of a browser.
02:29:20.105 --> 02:29:20.285
[UNKNOWN]: Right?
02:29:20.305 --> 02:29:22.426
[UNKNOWN]: Like, she kind of moves with real power.
02:29:22.446 --> 02:29:23.826
[UNKNOWN]: There's such power in her movements.
02:29:23.866 --> 02:29:28.887
[UNKNOWN]: Well, Hudson, there's like an elegant, that's kind of adds a bit of a Harley Quinn, kind of maniacal energy to it.
02:29:28.907 --> 02:29:31.608
[UNKNOWN]: That is just so fun in this world specifically.
02:29:31.768 --> 02:29:32.648
[UNKNOWN]: She's fantastic.
02:29:32.748 --> 02:29:39.550
[UNKNOWN]: And the old reason we didn't talk about her is because for me, her episodes are a bit too plot relevant for me to give us a casual recommendation.
02:29:39.710 --> 02:29:41.871
[UNKNOWN]: Even though I think she's obviously one of the highlights.
02:29:42.111 --> 02:29:47.272
[UNKNOWN]: And if I had to do a list, if I think if we both had to do a list of at least five, she'd be in their at least twice.
02:29:48.223 --> 02:29:49.765
[UNKNOWN]: Right, who is the best villain?
02:29:49.985 --> 02:29:51.427
[UNKNOWN]: Callisto, hands down.
02:29:51.687 --> 02:29:52.247
[UNKNOWN]: Hands down.
02:29:52.508 --> 02:29:57.953
[UNKNOWN]: She is the archetypal Xena main gallery villain, you know, she is her Joker.
02:29:58.074 --> 02:30:03.639
[UNKNOWN]: She is her, God, I was trying to figure who who Wonder Woman is, Veronica, but she haplachita.
02:30:03.659 --> 02:30:04.320
[UNKNOWN]: She's her kid.
02:30:04.580 --> 02:30:05.701
[UNKNOWN]: You know, it's cool.
02:30:05.762 --> 02:30:06.282
[UNKNOWN]: It's cool.
02:30:07.283 --> 02:30:08.044
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, oh my god.
02:30:08.064 --> 02:30:08.464
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you.
02:30:08.664 --> 02:30:09.225
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, you're right.
02:30:09.245 --> 02:30:10.026
[UNKNOWN]: She's her cheetah.
02:30:10.106 --> 02:30:11.247
[UNKNOWN]: She's her lex luther.
02:30:11.287 --> 02:30:12.448
[UNKNOWN]: She's so incredibly important.
02:30:12.528 --> 02:30:21.096
[UNKNOWN]: And also when you look at the actual spread of her on the show, she's in there that much as to have such an impact on the story, but also just on the fandom.
02:30:23.879 --> 02:30:24.860
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, you're the best.
02:30:24.960 --> 02:30:26.120
[UNKNOWN]: You did great with this.
02:30:26.180 --> 02:30:28.942
[UNKNOWN]: You did better than anybody ever could have expected you to do.
02:30:29.042 --> 02:30:29.222
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.
02:30:29.242 --> 02:30:31.584
[UNKNOWN]: You made yourself an icon in three episodes.
02:30:31.604 --> 02:30:32.224
[UNKNOWN]: Like I don't know.
02:30:32.264 --> 02:30:32.964
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, it's magic.
02:30:33.044 --> 02:30:39.628
[UNKNOWN]: We talked a bit earlier about the way that some aspects of the show are a bit quote unquote bootleg and how people might struggle with the CGI and all that stuff.
02:30:39.668 --> 02:30:40.349
[UNKNOWN]: And it's true.
02:30:40.389 --> 02:30:43.791
[UNKNOWN]: They had a very limited budget for significant portions of the show.
02:30:44.031 --> 02:30:44.731
[UNKNOWN]: 20 episodes.
02:30:44.791 --> 02:30:47.493
[UNKNOWN]: Sometimes you're going to have to do a bottle episode here and there, whatever.
02:30:47.633 --> 02:30:50.655
[UNKNOWN]: Sometimes the end is going to have to be in the mirror or in the water or something.
02:30:50.675 --> 02:30:51.215
[UNKNOWN]: She's not moving.
02:30:51.335 --> 02:30:51.975
[UNKNOWN]: And that's fine.
02:30:52.155 --> 02:30:54.876
[UNKNOWN]: But the things that they managed to achieve is just like amazing.
02:30:55.096 --> 02:30:56.417
[UNKNOWN]: Can't come out of the bin off well done.
02:30:56.537 --> 02:30:57.097
[UNKNOWN]: Well done, guys.
02:30:57.157 --> 02:30:57.817
[UNKNOWN]: You did a good job.
02:30:57.897 --> 02:30:58.698
[UNKNOWN]: I'm sure you know this already.
02:30:58.878 --> 02:31:08.001
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, my closing note too is that we also didn't choose an Aphrodite episode because she doesn't have any single focus episodes where truly it's an Aphrodite episode.
02:31:08.061 --> 02:31:10.221
[UNKNOWN]: She's mostly a really good recurring character.
02:31:10.402 --> 02:31:12.742
[UNKNOWN]: But she's great.
02:31:12.762 --> 02:31:14.123
[UNKNOWN]: So check out some Aphrodite too.
02:31:14.243 --> 02:31:14.643
[UNKNOWN]: And Eric.
02:31:14.683 --> 02:31:24.765
[UNKNOWN]: I honestly watch the whole show, but if you want to jump around, also pick up some areas, because Kevin Smith may rest in peace, he passed away soon, after the end of the show.
02:31:25.125 --> 02:31:30.407
[UNKNOWN]: But he was a tremendous, really charismatic actor, and also, I think we talked about this earlier, maybe off air.
02:31:30.507 --> 02:31:35.428
[UNKNOWN]: I'm sorry to put your business out there, but if Aphrodite was your sexual awakening, I say Kevin Smith is mine.
02:31:35.448 --> 02:31:40.849
[UNKNOWN]: It's like the flip side, like we both got the Aries Aphrodite dynamic, it's very Aries Libra.
02:31:42.385 --> 02:31:44.367
[UNKNOWN]: also this old areas had a farm.
02:31:44.528 --> 02:31:46.090
[UNKNOWN]: I think is a fun one too.
02:31:46.130 --> 02:31:47.211
[UNKNOWN]: It's like late at the end.
02:31:47.471 --> 02:31:49.013
[UNKNOWN]: It is such a great one.
02:31:49.454 --> 02:31:55.761
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, it's like late, but it is probably my favorite episode of his because he's Dearing in that one.
02:31:55.801 --> 02:31:56.702
[UNKNOWN]: I think he's really fun.
02:31:56.843 --> 02:31:57.944
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah, yeah, I agree.
02:31:58.204 --> 02:31:58.965
[UNKNOWN]: Uh, God.
02:31:59.165 --> 02:31:59.866
[UNKNOWN]: May he rest.
02:31:59.886 --> 02:32:00.487
[UNKNOWN]: Peace be out.
02:32:00.587 --> 02:32:04.773
[UNKNOWN]: We tried our best, we gave you three hours a bit of Zina.
02:32:04.993 --> 02:32:06.235
[UNKNOWN]: We didn't cover everything.
02:32:06.375 --> 02:32:14.507
[UNKNOWN]: There is so much to say, there is so much I could still say, and I'm sure you could still say, but I hope that this Zina so fulfilled some of the aspirations.
02:32:14.547 --> 02:32:15.789
[UNKNOWN]: I know I had a really great time.
02:32:15.829 --> 02:32:16.570
[UNKNOWN]: How did you find this era?
02:32:17.442 --> 02:32:23.184
[UNKNOWN]: Oh, I mean, yeah, it's like, well, we could end here or we do a hundred-hour episode.
02:32:23.244 --> 02:32:23.684
[UNKNOWN]: Absolutely.
02:32:24.024 --> 02:32:26.145
[UNKNOWN]: And so I think that we'll stop at three.
02:32:26.265 --> 02:32:28.085
[UNKNOWN]: But of course I love talking to you.
02:32:28.165 --> 02:32:32.187
[UNKNOWN]: We had a preamble yesterday where we were talking about Angela and Sarah.
02:32:32.347 --> 02:32:36.288
[UNKNOWN]: And so I think that that was an incredible preamble to this conversation.
02:32:36.488 --> 02:32:42.270
[UNKNOWN]: Also, I really appreciate, first of all, seeing your beautiful face, seeing your beautiful Zina T-shirt.
02:32:42.730 --> 02:33:00.533
[UNKNOWN]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no
02:33:01.694 --> 02:33:05.877
[UNKNOWN]: you'll be beautiful, you'll be poetic, you know, you'll have a great time.
02:33:05.957 --> 02:33:11.420
[UNKNOWN]: Yes, I hope everybody takes that from Zina because I think she really gave me that a lot.
02:33:11.561 --> 02:33:22.268
[UNKNOWN]: So I am glad that she is still continuing to be something that is relevant of talking about and that people will hopefully go revisit despite the fact that it's available literally goddamn nowhere.
02:33:22.948 --> 02:33:37.375
[UNKNOWN]: By the DVDs, I guarantee you if you go to a charity shop, there'll be some Zeta DVDs somewhere because they're always ours I got every season of Hercules, I got every season of Zeta, I got like a charity shop Yeah, you need to get rid of those Hercules seasons, I'm not gonna forget that, but I'm gonna let it go
02:33:39.029 --> 02:33:41.450
[UNKNOWN]: Well, yeah, don't get yourself Zina enjoy yourself.
02:33:41.470 --> 02:33:44.651
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you so much, Sarah, for coming on with me to do this.
02:33:44.671 --> 02:33:46.131
[UNKNOWN]: See this, I can't believe we did it.
02:33:46.171 --> 02:33:50.973
[UNKNOWN]: But as I said earlier in this podcast, maybe like five hours ago, I don't remember when I'm not kidding.
02:33:51.133 --> 02:33:52.833
[UNKNOWN]: We launched a Patreon recently.
02:33:52.953 --> 02:33:54.774
[UNKNOWN]: So I'm gonna put that as a stretch goal.
02:33:54.814 --> 02:33:55.494
[UNKNOWN]: You give us money.
02:33:55.694 --> 02:33:58.735
[UNKNOWN]: We will do a Zina episode by episode podcast.
02:33:58.835 --> 02:34:01.916
[UNKNOWN]: I will somehow scam Sarah into doing this, but I need to pay her.
02:34:02.116 --> 02:34:03.616
[UNKNOWN]: I need to pay her to do this, okay?
02:34:03.656 --> 02:34:05.157
[UNKNOWN]: And you need to pay me to pay us.
02:34:05.537 --> 02:34:06.460
[UNKNOWN]: Okay, I'm not kidding.
02:34:06.520 --> 02:34:07.141
[UNKNOWN]: I want to do that.
02:34:07.161 --> 02:34:12.273
[UNKNOWN]: You can figure out all kinds of alternative ways of paying us, for instance, you could just compliment just heavily.
02:34:12.353 --> 02:34:12.994
[UNKNOWN]: I'll take that too.
02:34:14.367 --> 02:34:18.188
[UNKNOWN]: But at the meantime, please, please, please check out Sarah's best issue ever.
02:34:18.208 --> 02:34:33.711
[UNKNOWN]: I will be linking also her most recent project with Alex Sigour, the Forgotten Five and the show notes at I am also going to make sure to link her zines because they're a fantastic And we need to pressure her into making sure the zina episode comes out sooner rather than later, okay?
02:34:34.311 --> 02:34:35.232
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you again, Sarah.
02:34:35.272 --> 02:34:35.792
[UNKNOWN]: Let's say bye.
02:34:35.812 --> 02:34:36.572
[UNKNOWN]: I say bye, Sarah.
02:34:36.612 --> 02:34:37.232
[UNKNOWN]: Goodbye.
02:34:43.906 --> 02:34:52.670
[UNKNOWN]: And that was the episode, thank you so much for listening, you could find Sarah on Instagram at Sarah's Century and on her website www.SarahSentry.com.
02:34:53.050 --> 02:35:01.334
[UNKNOWN]: There you'll be able to find her zines and check out the first chapter of her comic book with Alex Sigoura, the Forgotten Five, that will all be linked in the show notes.
02:35:01.814 --> 02:35:06.576
[UNKNOWN]: Also I'd like to say a massive thank you to Layla and Victor who helped with the edit of this episode.
02:35:06.996 --> 02:35:15.625
[UNKNOWN]: If you are listening to the audio only, the video version made by Victor will be up soon after on our YouTube page, so go head over there and subscribe.
02:35:16.065 --> 02:35:21.971
[UNKNOWN]: In the meantime, you can also support us to keep going by subscribing to our newly launched Patreon.
02:35:22.311 --> 02:35:44.086
[UNKNOWN]: That will be linked in the show notes as will my social media at also perp, where you can share your thoughts on this episode or you can just leave us a 5 star rating and review or like if you're watching on YouTube and Let a friend know if you enjoyed the episode as I said everything mentioned here will also be linked in these show notes as always.
02:35:44.446 --> 02:35:46.407
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you so much for lending us your ears.
02:35:46.887 --> 02:35:49.709
[UNKNOWN]: We'll catch you here later until then be good.
02:35:50.410 --> 02:35:50.790
[UNKNOWN]: Goodbye.