Episode 37: Learning how to wine and dine with Caroline Conner

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You're listening to Profiles in Franceformation, the podcast where we hear from inspiring people who have pursued their dream of moving to France, we learn about why they moved, how they overcame the challenges they faced and what they love and hate about living in.
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I hope that hearing their stories can help you to pursue your dreams and maybe your very own transformation.
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I'm your host Allison Grant Lounes.
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And I'm here to tell you my guests followed their dreams and you can follow yours too.
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It starts today.
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Welcome to episode 37 of profiles and transf.
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I'm your host Allison Grant Lounes, and in this episode, my guest is Caroline Connor also known as Wine Dine Caroline, a Lyon based British American wine expert, who went from winning the Oxford Cambridge blind wine tasting competition.
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When she was in school to starting a career in food and wine in France.
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Becoming a WSET level four while sharing her passion for Francis wine industry, Caroline is currently sharing her passion for gourmet food and fine wine by hosting the Terroir podcast, running wine tastings of Lyon and organizing a week long astronomy and wine retreat.
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To invite us to experience Francis spooned wine capital in style.
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Welcome Caroline.
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All right.
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Hi Caroline.
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Thanks for being here with me today.
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Hi Allison.
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Thank you so much for having me.
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So why don't we start by telling me a little bit about you and how you ended up.
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Living in Lyon.
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Well, it's a funny story because it's pretty mundane.
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I, I'm American.
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I'm from California originally, but I actually had lived in England for almost a decade.
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I moved to London when I was 16 and was there for a long time.
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And.
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I went back to America and I wasn't really vibing with San Francisco, which is where I grew up in the, in the burbs there.
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And I came back to Paris the summer, of my 30th birthday.
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And you know, I'm 30.
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I don't have a job.
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I don't have a man.
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I have nothing.
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I'm just like, oh, what am I doing with my life?
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I'm in Paris, but living on my dad's couch and I didn't really have a good time.
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In that summer, I did a two week intensive French class here in Lyon because I wanted to visit some friends in the Alps.
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So I guess the real reason I came to Lyon was because it was close to the Alps and I had some friends there, but, I was here and I was just like, huh, I.
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I like this and, and it's weird because those two weeks it was a canicule.
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It was 2017.
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You remember that?
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Like crazy canicule.
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Oh yeah, yeah.
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Mm-hmm and it was super, super hot.
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So I didn't do anything.
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I didn't do anything.
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I didn't do anything towards me.
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I didn't eat anywhere.
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Good.
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I didn't do anything, but I was just here and I was like, Ooh, this place feels good to me.
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And you know, it's, it's between burgundy and the Rhone and I'm in the wine business.
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So I might as well try it out here and see if I can get a job.
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So I moved here for no reason.
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basically.
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Cool.
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So at what point did you know that you wanted to stay and did you have any idea what you would end up doing in Lyon I tried to get jobs in wine, but my French wasn't good enough.
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And the wine jobs aren't really here.
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You know, the wine jobs are more in the wine regions and the kind of wine jobs there are here.
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like being, you know, being an agent and selling wine to restaurants and stuff.
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You know, you, I could do that now because I know everybody and I'm connected, but like as a new person, you can't do that kind of job.
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And so it took me a little while I decided to just commit to the all really, and I actually ended up buying an apartment because.
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More easier than renting, cuz no one would speak to me because I was not French and we all know what that's like getting housing and in Lyon it's, I think it's worse than Paris.
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Maybe I it's really bad.
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And so I basically like bought this apartment.
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I just went gungho I just went for it.
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I, I really committed.
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And it was.
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It was awesome.
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I loved it.
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I, it just really worked out, you know, I made a lot of really great friends.
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I, I fell in love with this city, and I started a business doing wine tourism because there weren't really a lot of options available in English in the city.
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There were actually none, really, so, mm.
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So I'm still doing that.
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I do wine tastings.
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I'm scaling that back now and moving more into luxury multi-day culinary and wine retreats.
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So that is really fun.
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Yeah.
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So when Americans come to Lyon and they want to learn about French food and wine, what do they.
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Like, where are they coming from?
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Cause I, I took my parents.
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I took my mom on a wine tasting, in the Loire Valley when my parents were in France in the spring.
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And one of the things that she said was really interesting was how much knowledge she, or how much she learned about wine that she didn't know, like even having done tastings in Napa valley and at different places.
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Like there's a lot more of.
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Like pedagogical approach to wine and food, I think in when you do that kind of stuff in France.
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So what are your guests sort of coming to France knowing, and what are they looking for when they're doing these tastings and going to these fancy restaurants that we don't really have in the us?
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That's a really interesting question.
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I mean, I think, I do think that it, you know, like Paris, it's hard to, it's hard to do it right.
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Here, because there's not a lot of resources in English.
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Paris has a couple good websites like Paris by mouth and timeout Paris in English where you can find good restaurants.
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We don't have anything like that here.
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So if you're a tourist, It can be really tough because our restaurants are tiny and you have to book and you need to know what you're doing.
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Like if you don't know, you could easily go to a crappy restaurant that's right next to a really good restaurant.
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And they look exactly the same.
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Right.
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And I know we have that a lot in Paris too, but I think people come here cuz they've heard it's the culinary capital.
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What does that mean?
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Right.
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That means really this like legacy of, of in the 20th century, like Paul Bo COO.
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And it's all tied with like the Michelin guide and all this stuff really from the 20th century.
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But.
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We have this, this legacy, especially from the second half of the 20th century of, you know, having really great restaurants in Lyon.
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And it's a thing that's known in throughout France too.
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So French people know, and there are more restaurants here per person than anywhere else in France, including, Paris.
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So there's like, there's like one restaurant, every 300 people that live here, which is funny.
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And yeah, there are a lot of restaurants here.
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They're all tiny though.
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And so I think, you know, the Americans come here wanting something.
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Innovative and so traditional and just something that's really good and like really well executed and fresh and seasonal that that's certainly what you, what you get, right.
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If you, if you do it right.
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In terms of wine, I think that.
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The rules here are really specific, you know, the appellation system where everything is labeled by place name.
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And so a lot of Americans that even might be quite knowledgeable about American wines.
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They won't necessarily understand quite how that system works.
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And so they come here and they get a big lesson in really the regulations of how wine is produced here and how it's labeled.
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And, and that's something we talk about a lot in my tastings.
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You know, we are lucky right here to.
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Right in between a bunch of different wine regions.
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, so when I'm teaching people, I'm usually working with wines from the Northern Rhone, I'm working with wines from Beaujolais wines, from burgundy and, you know, the ardash Savoie.
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I, I stick within, you know, two hour radius general.
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We have a lot of options.
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Yeah.
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In those two hours.
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There's a lot.
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Yeah.
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I know, I know.
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Yeah.
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We went, I went to Lyon for the first time, actually in 2020.
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I had never, I had never been, and we took the opportunity when we couldn't travel back to the us that summer, to do a little tour of the south of France and Northern Italy.
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And we spent a couple of days in Lyon and it was really nice and we ate at one of the Bocuse, brass reef.
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Mm-hmm That was really good.
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So the interesting thing about that for people who don't know is that they have four, right in Lyon that are the brasseries and they're north, south, east, and west.
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And they do specialties from those four regions of France.
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So I think we went to the south one and we had, I had something, duck.
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From, like the, Toulouse region tends to be like magret de canard and things like that.
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I forget what my husband had, but it was really, it was really good.
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Yeah.
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Definitely.
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One of the fanciest meals that I've ever had because that's that like, I'm, I'm not super into, or I haven't been into the really nice Michelin, almost quality restaurants.
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Well, we need to change that.
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You need to come here and let's go to a Michelin star restaurant.
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I know, I know, I love that.
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I would love that.
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It hasn't, it hasn't been in my budget until it's, you know, it's one of those things to, if you, this is a good tip for everybody.
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And then I would like to circle back and talk a little bit about Paul Bocuse, cuz it's really, he's really an interesting character in the, in the culinary scene, you know, in worldwide, but particularly here, If you wanna die at Michelin star restaurants and you really can't afford to do dinner, go for lunch and lunch is gonna be a lot better value.
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You'll get a set menu, probably three or five courses.
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Most Michelin star places.
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You are gonna be getting a set menu anyway.
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So you need prepare for that.
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And.
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You know, and, and see it as a special occasion.
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It's not for everybody.
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I love it.
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I do it, probably more frequently than I should.
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I'd say I go to a Michelin star restaurant three or four times a year, which is a lot, most people.
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Yeah.
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Don't this year I actually did go to the, the two star restaurant in, uh , which is the sort of beautiful hilly, area, right outside of Lyon, which was Paul Bocuse's, flagship restaurant that had three stars until he died and now they only have two and they always do that so mean, But it basically is this beautiful restaurant really fancy, crazy, super.
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I mean, we, we spent each spent like 600 euros each, including the wine.
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It was wild.
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Oh, wow.
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But it was, it was something I will, would never do again if I have to pay for it, but I will totally do it.
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If you wanna take me there.
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But it was, you know, once an election.
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It's great.
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And then, so there's that restaurant is like the big, main Bocuse one.
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Then there's the four ones that you talked about, the brasseries and those are really nice, but they're not, they're not Michelin star and they're, and they're a little more traditional.
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And my favorite of those is the ERY list, but that's also our local cuisine cause we're up in the east France.
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And then.
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There is the Institute Bocuse.
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So this is the school that he created.
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And, and in my opinion, the school is really what makes Lyon so cool today because basically anybody who's, anybody here studied there, or they studied, they trained with someone who studied there, but for the most part chefs from all over the world, come to Lyon.
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To study at the Institute Bocuse and then they stay cuz they love it.
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And they open up restaurants.
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So there's so many cool young foreign chefs and French chefs, but foreign chefs too, who are in Lyon, who are doing their bad thing and having a great time, a lot of 'em are women.
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So we have like a lot of amazing female chefs, in this city that are foreign women, which is just like super cool, I think is super, super cool.
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And it means.
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There's really a lot of, and they're all part of this like little network, everybody kinda knows each other and they've all trained for the same people.
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And like, you know, no, I know everybody too, but no, I don't.
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I know a lot of 'em though.
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And it's, it's just really vibrant and innovative and fun and cool.
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And it's that excites me a million times more than going to like a typical French restaurant.
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Like I wanna see what the younger people are doing.
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I wanna see what the foreign people are doing after they come here and train.
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I wanna see that kind of cool stuff.
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And so we have.
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We have so many great restaurants here.
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But you definitely, yeah.
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You gotta be in the now I think . Yeah.
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So it sounds to me like when you're looking at choosing a restaurant or where you're looking at choosing like a place to take people, you're really looking at who the chefs are and what the restaurants, like almost like what their mission is.
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Yeah.
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You know what their.
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If they're trying something experimental, if they're doing, you know, different type, like different types of cuisine, much more so than, I mean, my way of doing it is.
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Looking at the menu to see if there's something that sounds good to me and looking at Google reviews and like not a sophisticated way to do that.
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Google is Google is good.
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I think Google is good.
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Google reviews are fine.
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Like if you put like res restaurants open, you know, blah, blah, blah, and you'll, you'll get good stuff.
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And I think the good stuff is highly reviewed.
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So I do think Google is useful.
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I never look at a menu because I don't care.
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I mean, I'll, I'll, I can eat something delicious at any on any menu.
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I'm not very picky, but.
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I, I mostly for me, it's word of mouth.
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Like I am, you know, I'm in this scene now.
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I'm like, I'm kind, it's kind of funny.
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I'm actually kind of an influencer at the moment, which is like really recently I've started getting invited to stuff.
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I dunno if you've seen that on Instagram.
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It's crazy.
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It's it's.
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And so now I'm like in the scene with these like Lyon food influencers, which is so funny.
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So, I like these people I followed for years right now, my friends, which is kind of cool, but they, you know, I'm finding out about openings through that.
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And, and my Instagram is definitely a place where.
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I see what they're talking about.
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So I have like a list.
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If you look at my Google maps, I have pins everywhere of the places that I wanna go to.
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And the hard part is there's so many new places I wanna go that, you know, I, there's also places I wanna go back to and I, I already eat out too much anyway.
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So, it's definitely challenging cuz there's so many good options and you know, we just have such great food.
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Yeah.
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And now I, when I follow you on Instagram at winedinecaroline, which we'll put in the, we'll put the link in the show notes, you know, I watch a lot of your videos where, you know, you're talking about wine and then you're talking about like, sometimes you're cooking.
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And so you have that training as, you know, as a,, as a chef, right.
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And.
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You know, for me, one of the things that, one of the things that's hard is like, when you go to great restaurants like this, and then you have to like, I'm, I cook fine, but I'm not like, great.
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And then you have to go home and like, eat your own boring food.
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oh, no.
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Well, I think, I think learning how to cook is a skill that everyone could probably, Benefit from.
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But yeah, I studied at the Cordon Bleu in London, after university and I, and I've worked always in food and wine more on the wine side, but I am actually really, I'm starting, I sometimes I get the urge to go further into food and then go back into wine.
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And I think I'm gonna move into more of a food phase coming up.
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But I have.
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The Cordon Bleu diploma in cuisine and patisserie, and then I also have my wine and spirits, education trust level four diploma.
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So that means nothing to civilians, but in the wine industry, it's a pretty big deal.
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So I do know what I'm talking about.
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In both cases.
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Yeah.
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So I, I do love, you know, I love giving people.
00:14:02.956 --> 00:14:03.466
Advice.
00:14:03.466 --> 00:14:09.076
Although I will tell everybody, if you DM me on Instagram and ask me for recommendations, it is annoying.
00:14:09.556 --> 00:14:14.296
like, yeah, like sign up for a wine tasting and I will make you reservations, you know?
00:14:14.426 --> 00:14:16.250
So I actually have a pretty standard script now.
00:14:16.250 --> 00:14:17.691
I'm like, Hey, thanks for reaching out.
00:14:17.691 --> 00:14:19.280
I'd be happy to make you some bookings.
00:14:19.341 --> 00:14:22.010
This is my fee for concierge services, you know, like I'm.
00:14:22.041 --> 00:14:22.160
Yeah.
00:14:22.821 --> 00:14:23.451
I'm busy.
00:14:23.500 --> 00:14:27.716
, I, I think it is, it is one of those things I I'm so friendly in my email list too.
00:14:27.716 --> 00:14:30.806
You know, I, I send out emails, you know, once or twice a week.
00:14:31.025 --> 00:14:31.245
And.
00:14:31.385 --> 00:14:38.556
My email is, I'm very casual with my email list and they, and so I think people think that we're real life, best friends, and I'm like, we, we can be come visit me.
00:14:38.556 --> 00:14:38.645
Yeah.
00:14:38.650 --> 00:14:41.846
We'll be real life, best friends, but , don't just hit me up for free work, you know?
00:14:42.196 --> 00:14:42.485
Yeah.
00:14:42.535 --> 00:14:42.865
Yeah.
00:14:42.865 --> 00:14:43.765
It's also my job.
00:14:43.765 --> 00:14:43.975
Yeah.
00:14:44.086 --> 00:14:44.936
I, I have the same.
00:14:45.145 --> 00:14:45.355
I have.
00:14:45.360 --> 00:14:45.985
I'm sure you do.
00:14:45.990 --> 00:14:46.255
Yeah.
00:14:48.841 --> 00:14:54.900
Which is hard because , on the one hand, , I think the reason both of us do our work is because we really love it and we really wanna help people.
00:14:55.140 --> 00:15:03.196
And it's fun to us, but at the same time, it is work mm-hmm , you know, but I'm consuming, you know, we gotta pay, gotta pay for those Michelin star restaurants somehow.
00:15:03.916 --> 00:15:04.155
Amen.
00:15:04.155 --> 00:15:09.446
I, I do have an offer and this is something that, that I do, occasionally where people can take me out to.
00:15:10.100 --> 00:15:11.475
So , that's gonna happen on Monday.
00:15:11.475 --> 00:15:17.895
I've got a family who are not this Monday, next Monday who are visiting and like the timing doesn't really work out for them to do a tasting.
00:15:18.375 --> 00:15:23.025
And so they're gonna take me to a fancy restaurant and I'm gonna talk to them about wine and they're just gonna pay for my meal.
00:15:23.025 --> 00:15:24.196
And that works for me.
00:15:24.196 --> 00:15:26.865
You know, that sounds like a great deal to me.
00:15:26.956 --> 00:15:27.556
It's great.
00:15:27.885 --> 00:15:28.316
I love it.
00:15:28.485 --> 00:15:30.696
So, no, it's, it's always fun.
00:15:30.696 --> 00:15:32.495
I, you know, we do really.
00:15:33.155 --> 00:15:35.525
We do have a good, I mean, I certainly have a great lifestyle here.
00:15:35.525 --> 00:15:36.725
You know, I, I go to the market.
00:15:36.725 --> 00:15:36.785
Yeah.
00:15:36.785 --> 00:15:40.025
And this is something I think people, people always ask me like, oh, is it like this in Paris?
00:15:40.025 --> 00:15:40.416
The market?
00:15:40.416 --> 00:15:41.196
I'm like, not really.
00:15:41.196 --> 00:15:42.696
We have, I have a farmer's market.
00:15:42.696 --> 00:15:46.806
That's every single day, except for Monday, like on my block, like that's not normal.
00:15:47.135 --> 00:15:48.186
That's not normal in France.
00:15:48.191 --> 00:15:49.296
That's not normal in Paris.
00:15:49.301 --> 00:15:51.066
There are markets in Paris.
00:15:51.066 --> 00:15:55.926
I think there's like the mache, uh, Del might be every day, but I don't know if there's any other ones.
00:15:56.135 --> 00:15:56.735
It's rare.
00:15:57.321 --> 00:15:59.091
To have markets that frequently.
00:15:59.461 --> 00:16:04.051
And so it's a really, it's a really, you know, big privilege to be here and just have access to such good food.
00:16:04.120 --> 00:16:07.110
And the, and the produce is coming from an hour away from here.
00:16:07.110 --> 00:16:10.951
You know, my, the two farms that I purchased from for the most part are both less than an hour from here.
00:16:11.201 --> 00:16:11.711
Oh, wow.
00:16:11.801 --> 00:16:12.100
Yeah.
00:16:12.105 --> 00:16:24.576
I think historically the market in Paris was at Les Halles, which is now a monstrosity of a mall and I think all the restaurants go out to Vanji, which is, in the south of Paris.
00:16:24.785 --> 00:16:37.235
Mm-hmm , probably about 40, 40 minutes from the center of Paris by, you know, white van . But, yeah, I've never been, I've never been there, so I don't know, probably be a cool place to visit, but a lot of this stuff probably would, a lot of that stuff probably comes from around here.
00:16:37.535 --> 00:16:38.975
You know, it probably does.
00:16:38.975 --> 00:16:40.946
I know we get a lot of produce from the Loire.
00:16:41.056 --> 00:16:46.206
Mm-hmm obviously Lyon is on the opposite side of France, so you probably don't go have to go as far, but yeah.
00:16:46.995 --> 00:16:51.701
Yeah, but you're not getting things like, like apricots from the Loire are you probably for the, probably coming from drum?
00:16:51.880 --> 00:16:52.150
Yeah.
00:16:52.150 --> 00:16:52.451
Down here.
00:16:52.451 --> 00:16:52.841
I dunno.
00:16:53.030 --> 00:16:53.711
Yeah, probably.
00:16:54.581 --> 00:17:08.500
But, we, we do have, you know, I think one of the reasons why it's famous for being such a big food city, historically, even before Paul Bocuse, was that we are at this crossroads, you know, where there's the two rivers, the stone and the Rowan who meet in the middle.
00:17:08.800 --> 00:17:10.270
We're right at the edge of the Alps.
00:17:10.421 --> 00:17:14.171
You can see Mont Blanc from the top of the hill that I live on on a clear day.
00:17:14.461 --> 00:17:15.780
We're very close to Provence.
00:17:16.050 --> 00:17:20.340
We're very close to the Auvergne, which has like some of the best cheeses and meats and like the lentils.
00:17:20.340 --> 00:17:23.040
And there's just a lot of really good.
00:17:23.851 --> 00:17:29.925
terroir here, you know, terroir is this, this concept in France that the place makes a big difference to the quality of the ingredients.
00:17:29.925 --> 00:17:38.409
And that is a wine concept, but it's also lentils, you know, lentils come from the Auvergne and, and they they're from Puy, they're like a special lentil, right.
00:17:38.409 --> 00:17:40.209
That come from this special volcanic soil.
00:17:40.209 --> 00:17:42.409
And that's why, that's why they're protected.
00:17:42.788 --> 00:17:43.538
That's so cool.
00:17:43.749 --> 00:17:49.068
I started paying so much more attention to this stuff recently, because yeah, we did.
00:17:49.098 --> 00:18:00.848
So our team did a wine tasting with Caroline virtually, in, in April, I think, to celebrate them, working with me, for my team, working with me for a year.
00:18:01.148 --> 00:18:07.689
And so it was a lot of fun and we had a couple of, we had three different bottles and we talked through all of the different.
00:18:08.138 --> 00:18:10.808
Taste that we can taste in the wine.
00:18:10.808 --> 00:18:17.838
And, we talked a little bit about pairing, I think, wine with food, but I've started to notice so much more.
00:18:18.328 --> 00:18:23.068
I started going to this wine bar in Paris that I really like too with a friend of mine and.
00:18:23.603 --> 00:18:38.212
You know, people, the, when you order wine in a place like that, or with somebody who's really knowledgeable and you, you know, they'll serve you a Sharky tree board and like, say, oh, well you wanna drink this wine with like, try that, you know, try that cheese right after you try this wine.
00:18:38.212 --> 00:18:42.272
And you talk about this a little bit in your terroir podcast as well with things.
00:18:42.857 --> 00:18:43.817
Grow together.
00:18:43.847 --> 00:18:44.718
Go together.
00:18:44.718 --> 00:18:44.958
Yeah.
00:18:45.008 --> 00:18:45.498
Exactly.
00:18:46.657 --> 00:18:48.307
yeah, so it's really interesting.
00:18:48.307 --> 00:18:54.087
I've started paying a lot more attention to , you know, where things come from relative to each other and trying them together.
00:18:54.432 --> 00:18:55.905
And, and we see that a lot.
00:18:55.905 --> 00:18:58.125
Like I know in our tasting we had a Sancerre right?
00:18:58.415 --> 00:19:00.776
Mm-hmm and Sancerre is a Sauvignon Blanc from the Loire.
00:19:00.776 --> 00:19:04.425
And it goes really, really well with, the go cheese, the fresh go cheeses that, that come from the LA.
00:19:04.685 --> 00:19:07.266
And, you know, it's not a hard and fast world, but it's, it's in Europe.
00:19:07.266 --> 00:19:07.776
Certainly.
00:19:07.780 --> 00:19:15.895
You know, we can remember that a lot of these wine styles evolved locally with their local cuisine, you know, so they're, they're made to, to be together, but, yeah.
00:19:15.895 --> 00:19:17.486
Thanks for plugging the terroir podcast.
00:19:17.486 --> 00:19:20.516
We, we have a lot of fun talking about French food and wine it's me and Emily Monaco.
00:19:21.086 --> 00:19:22.726
Who's a food journalist, but you.
00:19:23.215 --> 00:19:28.046
I think why in education is something that can be really empowering.
00:19:28.645 --> 00:19:31.976
And it is this thing that has a lot of anxiety surrounding it.
00:19:32.113 --> 00:19:36.449
And I really try to make it easy for people.
00:19:36.449 --> 00:19:36.509
Yeah.
00:19:36.513 --> 00:19:44.068
And I think it's, especially if you're young, if you wanna, you know, be in some, some corporate structure, if you're a woman, if you're a person of color, having a little bit of wine vocab.
00:19:44.673 --> 00:19:46.834
Can really help you in your career.
00:19:46.834 --> 00:19:48.243
It can help you with your in-laws.
00:19:48.243 --> 00:19:54.763
It can help you feel like, well, it can help you, you know, just navigate restaurants more easily and it's delicious and it's fun and it's kind of a rabbit hole.
00:19:54.769 --> 00:19:57.253
Once you start getting into it, it's really easy to get into it.
00:19:57.624 --> 00:20:03.713
Yeah, but it is, it's something that, you know, I, when I do tastings, I do feel like people learn a lot in.
00:20:04.328 --> 00:20:18.699
I think is one thing that does make me, different, you know, I think a lot of times we do wine tastings, especially when we're visiting a wine region, we taste 10 of the same Napa cab and you're like, okay, well, those tasted the same, you know, and when I do it, we taste wines that are really different, so we can try to develop your palette.
00:20:19.088 --> 00:20:19.848
So that's something, yeah.
00:20:20.574 --> 00:20:22.433
I wanna do more larger scale tasting.
00:20:22.433 --> 00:20:29.003
So I'm looking, I'm hoping to do like more corporate events this year and maybe come up to Paris, any sort of Anglophone stuff, maybe Geneva.
00:20:29.064 --> 00:20:30.564
So that's one of the projects that I have for this year.
00:20:30.564 --> 00:20:31.554
I'm a project person.
00:20:31.708 --> 00:20:32.788
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:20:33.013 --> 00:20:34.634
I'm always moving . Yeah.
00:20:34.638 --> 00:20:41.094
And I see sometimes like when you do your tastings, I see the pictures on Instagram and some people will have like six wine glasses.
00:20:41.634 --> 00:20:49.574
Yeah, I, I like to do comparative tasting, so we do comparative tasting and that allows us to really, hone in on, on how to taste.
00:20:49.574 --> 00:20:49.634
Yeah.
00:20:50.294 --> 00:20:51.644
And that's what people don't do.
00:20:51.703 --> 00:21:02.901
And so I actually, I actually learned about wine when I was doing my undergrad at Oxford and I did competitive blind wine tasting, which was this comparative tasting where we'd have, you know, six, 12 wines in front of us and it is how you learn fastest.
00:21:03.201 --> 00:21:10.250
So, yeah, I love when I do my big events, when I do my, my tastings, we are doing comparative tasting and we are, we are really.
00:21:10.354 --> 00:21:14.871
Getting deep quickly, and it's, it's a faster way to learn and it looks cool.
00:21:14.871 --> 00:21:14.931
Yeah.
00:21:15.077 --> 00:21:15.887
Yeah, it does.
00:21:15.978 --> 00:21:16.488
It does.
00:21:16.488 --> 00:21:21.617
And I was going to ask you about that because I know that you won Oxford, Oxford.
00:21:21.763 --> 00:21:24.703
Comparative blind wine tasting event.
00:21:24.703 --> 00:21:27.163
And that sort of did that sort of launch your career?
00:21:27.284 --> 00:21:28.693
It did yeah.
00:21:28.814 --> 00:21:29.114
Yeah.
00:21:29.114 --> 00:21:34.138
So in 2009, I was top taster at the varsity match, which is between Oxford and Cambridge.
00:21:34.648 --> 00:21:39.394
And that's judged by, Hugh Johnson and chances, Robinson who really big deal in the UK.
00:21:39.814 --> 00:21:40.864
And it really did launch my career.
00:21:40.864 --> 00:21:41.374
Absolutely.
00:21:41.523 --> 00:21:41.763
Yeah.
00:21:41.794 --> 00:21:46.894
And there's a lot of us in the industry actually, who did this very particular qualification or not qualification this particular club.
00:21:46.894 --> 00:21:48.814
It wasn't like my, my degree was an archeology.
00:21:48.814 --> 00:21:49.114
It wasn.
00:21:49.773 --> 00:21:50.163
My degree.
00:21:50.163 --> 00:21:50.284
Yeah.
00:21:50.483 --> 00:21:54.364
I was going to ask, like, how did you get to the point where you were winning this?
00:21:54.854 --> 00:21:55.963
We tasted a lot.
00:21:55.993 --> 00:21:58.993
I tasted a lot of wine and like, yeah, I was in the club for two years.
00:21:58.993 --> 00:22:00.554
I didn't compete in my first year.
00:22:01.193 --> 00:22:02.933
But in my second year I was really good at it.
00:22:02.933 --> 00:22:05.753
I mean, I, yeah, obviously like you have to guess what it was hard.
00:22:05.753 --> 00:22:08.453
I'm I'm really outta practice, blind tasting, but I used to be a wizard.
00:22:08.661 --> 00:22:09.141
Cool.
00:22:09.260 --> 00:22:10.760
Yeah, it was pretty, it was pretty cool.
00:22:11.330 --> 00:22:12.290
Yeah, we did not.
00:22:12.290 --> 00:22:12.351
We.
00:22:13.596 --> 00:22:16.145
I did not go to a school that had competitive wine tasting.
00:22:16.145 --> 00:22:21.365
I went to a school that had most people don't of beer, really just Oxford and Cambridge.
00:22:21.425 --> 00:22:27.002
I'm pretty sure like Harvard tried to get in it and they were like, no, because the American kids can't drink and they're under well, yeah, that's true.
00:22:27.182 --> 00:22:27.573
That's true.
00:22:27.577 --> 00:22:27.673
True.
00:22:27.873 --> 00:22:29.808
Cause we were, I was like 19, right?
00:22:30.048 --> 00:22:30.378
Yeah.
00:22:30.618 --> 00:22:30.979
That's crazy.
00:22:31.009 --> 00:22:31.278
Yeah.
00:22:31.278 --> 00:22:36.056
If you can't, if you can't start your first year, then you don't develop the skills by.
00:22:36.199 --> 00:22:36.558
Your last year.
00:22:36.909 --> 00:22:41.584
I think, I almost wonder if it's actually it just wouldn't be fair pitching all the undergrads against well, and there were graduate students as well.
00:22:41.584 --> 00:22:43.354
It wasn't just young people on the team.
00:22:43.874 --> 00:22:45.074
But most of us were undergrads.
00:22:45.453 --> 00:22:48.574
I have dreamed of going back and doing a master's and doing it again, but I don't think they'd let me do it.
00:22:48.903 --> 00:22:50.374
Cuz I have all the qualifications now.
00:22:51.098 --> 00:22:52.294
I don't think they'd compete.
00:22:53.134 --> 00:22:55.683
I could like be in the club, but I couldn't be on the team.
00:22:55.683 --> 00:22:55.834
I'm.
00:22:56.272 --> 00:22:59.002
Yeah, you can't be a professional to be amateur.
00:22:59.512 --> 00:23:00.442
Yeah, exactly.
00:23:00.442 --> 00:23:08.702
But, honestly that set me up in a way that nothing else would have, like, I entered into the wine industry with a lot higher level of knowledge than most people do.
00:23:09.272 --> 00:23:12.813
And then when it came time to do my qualifications, I bashed them out really quickly.
00:23:12.813 --> 00:23:18.108
So I had my wine set for fi four, by the time I was like 25, which is really young for that.
00:23:18.226 --> 00:23:18.526
Yeah.
00:23:18.715 --> 00:23:19.165
Cool.
00:23:19.306 --> 00:23:19.756
Cool.
00:24:06.135 --> 00:24:12.496
So aside from, aside from the wine and the culinary aspect, what are the things that you really enjoy about living in France?
00:24:12.736 --> 00:24:19.125
Well, I'm, I'm actually starting in, I think for five years, you know, but the pandemic basically wiped out two years of our lives.
00:24:19.131 --> 00:24:19.395
Right.
00:24:19.589 --> 00:24:23.369
I'm starting to make French friends for the first time.
00:24:23.970 --> 00:24:27.660
Cause that, yeah, not the, I I've had a couple French friends, but there are people who speak English.
00:24:28.079 --> 00:24:33.509
I'm starting to be at a point where I can socialize in French and it's really opening up my, my life in amazing ways.
00:24:33.990 --> 00:24:35.640
And it feels really exciting.
00:24:35.640 --> 00:24:38.730
So I love living here for a lot of reasons.
00:24:38.730 --> 00:24:40.079
I love traveling around France.
00:24:40.109 --> 00:24:43.200
I have a car, I go, I I'm out and about a lot.
00:24:43.204 --> 00:24:44.039
I'm in the countryside.
00:24:44.039 --> 00:24:45.059
I was in Provence in the ores.
00:24:45.299 --> 00:24:47.190
Recently I go to Beaujolais all the time.
00:24:47.529 --> 00:24:53.140
I do think one thing about being down here as opposed to Paris too, is we just have a lot of different stuff that's really close by.
00:24:53.440 --> 00:25:00.212
And I guess Paris, you have Normandy and the Loire are pretty close in champagne, but you know, this country has so much variety.
00:25:00.647 --> 00:25:01.788
And so much beauty.
00:25:01.788 --> 00:25:12.580
And I think most, you know, Americans particularly do not see that because they just go to Paris or they go to Paris, they get a bus to Normandy, they look at some beaches and then they come back, you know, they might go down to Provence and that's great.
00:25:12.580 --> 00:25:17.691
And it's different, but there's so many places in this, in this country that are, are hidden, like the Auvergne, you know?
00:25:17.740 --> 00:25:25.330
And I love Theo van, the dine that's English, people go to the dine, but, Americans not so much, but it's, it's such a beautiful country.
00:25:25.474 --> 00:25:25.894
Oh yeah.
00:25:26.134 --> 00:25:26.315
Yeah.
00:25:26.315 --> 00:25:31.674
My parents were here in, well in France, in, in April for the school vacation.
00:25:31.674 --> 00:25:34.644
And we took them cuz they've been to Paris a couple times, but they've never been out.
00:25:34.644 --> 00:25:36.595
Like the farthest they've gone is Versailles right.
00:25:36.595 --> 00:25:44.575
So mm-hmm we took them, we took them to, we took them to Normandy we went around, we went through Brittany, , I don't know if a lot of Americans go into Brittany.
00:25:44.964 --> 00:25:45.565
Bri's amazing.
00:25:46.434 --> 00:25:47.515
I love Brittany.
00:25:47.557 --> 00:25:49.116
I, I have projects.
00:25:49.616 --> 00:25:50.396
Will happen in Bri.
00:25:50.906 --> 00:25:51.057
love it.
00:25:51.057 --> 00:25:51.686
I'm a project.
00:25:51.926 --> 00:25:52.856
I'm a project girl too.
00:25:52.856 --> 00:25:53.396
Yeah, you are.
00:25:53.396 --> 00:25:55.666
You're well we're all going into this retreat life, right?
00:25:56.057 --> 00:25:56.747
I know.
00:25:56.987 --> 00:25:57.307
I know.
00:25:57.767 --> 00:26:01.217
I actually, oh, I'm working on my business plan for that.
00:26:01.487 --> 00:26:03.737
Can you posted I'll I'll do my list.
00:26:03.977 --> 00:26:05.116
I can, I can curate your seller.
00:26:05.146 --> 00:26:05.477
Yeah.
00:26:05.666 --> 00:26:14.547
I'm I actually really think that, you know, one of my calling at this point is to share my love of this place with people through obviously food and wine.
00:26:15.116 --> 00:26:21.176
And, you know, I'm, I'm, I know there's a lot of us, particularly again, Americans who are obsessed with France, but I'm uniquely positioned cause I live here.
00:26:21.289 --> 00:26:21.440
Right.
00:26:21.440 --> 00:26:21.769
You know?
00:26:21.769 --> 00:26:23.900
And so I'm doing my first.
00:26:24.112 --> 00:26:26.721
luxury food and wine retreat in Lyon at the end of October.
00:26:26.721 --> 00:26:29.152
And that I would love to get some of the expats who live in Paris to come.
00:26:29.152 --> 00:26:31.852
I'm the ones who don't know anything about ne like that would be so cool.
00:26:31.852 --> 00:26:31.912
Yeah.
00:26:32.251 --> 00:26:34.981
But I'm also, you know, right now I have three Americans who've signed up.
00:26:34.987 --> 00:26:42.001
I need, I definitely am hoping to get a few more people, just be really small and intimate, and then I'm gonna do a gourmet ski week as well in Cheel.
00:26:42.007 --> 00:26:43.616
Oh, And, awesome.
00:26:43.826 --> 00:26:44.636
That's gonna be amazing.
00:26:44.636 --> 00:26:47.126
And then we're gonna go to Chateauneuf de Pape in may.
00:26:47.126 --> 00:26:49.826
So there's gonna be three retreats this year, at least.
00:26:50.386 --> 00:26:55.759
And that feels like a really positive and cool direction for my business that I'm, I'm really excited about, but it's different.
00:26:55.759 --> 00:26:57.890
It's, they're hard to sell cause they're expensive, you know?
00:26:58.180 --> 00:26:59.509
Yeah, yeah, of course.
00:26:59.930 --> 00:27:04.069
But I mean, I feel like one of the things that has been really good and you notice.
00:27:04.930 --> 00:27:06.309
Americans who move to France.
00:27:06.359 --> 00:27:09.089
We go into a lot of the same industries, right?
00:27:09.150 --> 00:27:16.450
Mm-hmm , there are a lot of people who come specifically to go into food and wine and pastry and, you know, there, there are quite a bunch.
00:27:17.150 --> 00:27:19.460
Obviously there are people who go into travel.
00:27:19.464 --> 00:27:26.150
There are people who go into English teaching, we kind of tend to flock towards the same industries that then serve either.
00:27:26.599 --> 00:27:38.359
Tourists who come or the, or the expat community mm-hmm . But one of the things that, yeah, I just think is so great for anybody who either lives in France or is visiting is yeah.
00:27:38.365 --> 00:27:44.992
Building up that knowledge about food and the appreciation for food and wine and understanding of it.
00:27:44.992 --> 00:27:49.156
, not just as something to eat, but mm-hmm as.
00:27:49.285 --> 00:27:58.855
A culture and we don't, we don't have the same relationship with food in the us that we do in France as something that can be, you know, beautiful and for pleasure.
00:27:59.035 --> 00:28:02.515
And we have a much more like utilitarian.
00:28:03.579 --> 00:28:05.589
And I think there are it's regional in America too.
00:28:05.589 --> 00:28:08.980
And I think there are communities that really care a lot about their food in America.
00:28:09.099 --> 00:28:09.250
Right.
00:28:09.490 --> 00:28:10.180
And everywhere.
00:28:10.180 --> 00:28:13.240
But here it's just, you know, it's older.
00:28:13.450 --> 00:28:16.990
We have these traditions that are ancient and that's really cool.
00:28:16.990 --> 00:28:21.579
And we have, you know, there's a lot and Emily and I talk about this a lot on a podcast, but there's a lot of.
00:28:21.711 --> 00:28:25.521
There's a lot of, you know, mythology around the French agriculture.
00:28:25.521 --> 00:28:26.481
I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.
00:28:26.481 --> 00:28:28.372
There is, there is big agribusiness here.
00:28:28.852 --> 00:28:32.451
There are mass produced things, but it's not the same scale as it is in America.
00:28:32.481 --> 00:28:32.541
Yeah.
00:28:32.541 --> 00:28:33.471
It's not as bad.
00:28:33.801 --> 00:28:41.251
And there's also a lot of, of small family farms that, that succeed in the thrive and, like the people I buy my vegetables from, in my fruit.
00:28:41.342 --> 00:28:41.551
Yeah.
00:28:41.971 --> 00:28:46.132
All that stuff is, is, you know, it's not crazy mass produced garbage and I.
00:28:46.896 --> 00:28:51.636
We also have an awareness of smaller scale here.
00:28:51.636 --> 00:28:57.136
So I actually, it's not out yet, but maybe by the time this comes out, it will be at my next YouTube video is about my local wine region.
00:28:57.797 --> 00:28:59.057
K my like hyperlocal one.
00:28:59.326 --> 00:29:00.047
Nobody knows about it.
00:29:00.436 --> 00:29:02.237
You probably never even seen it in Paris.
00:29:02.326 --> 00:29:06.646
Mm-hmm so only, I think there's only two producers that are even in Paris, much less exporting internationally.
00:29:06.826 --> 00:29:07.067
Right.
00:29:07.126 --> 00:29:10.217
And when I talked to the producers where they're like, oh, so like, why don't you export?
00:29:10.426 --> 00:29:13.217
And I remember coming at this and asking, she's like, why would I export?
00:29:13.217 --> 00:29:13.906
I don't have to.
00:29:14.551 --> 00:29:22.142
Like everybody, all my wine gets drunk locally and then taking it further, you know, especially for these little regions, sustainability is super important.
00:29:22.142 --> 00:29:31.892
French people do care a lot about sustainability and exporting is actually completely unsustainable sending shipping heavy glass bottles around the world, not sustainable.
00:29:32.251 --> 00:29:37.622
And so people choose not to export, not only because they don't need to, but because it's not good for the planet.
00:29:37.622 --> 00:29:37.682
Yeah.
00:29:38.251 --> 00:29:39.281
And so, well, we, you.
00:29:39.737 --> 00:29:43.646
We can live this super hyperlocal, hyper hyperlocal, experience.
00:29:43.646 --> 00:29:47.967
And that to me is, is a direction that feels really healthy to me.
00:29:47.967 --> 00:29:48.957
It feels really good to me.
00:29:48.957 --> 00:29:53.811
I would love to, you know, move to the countryside and, and grow my own vegetables one day.
00:29:54.261 --> 00:29:56.041
And I'm getting closer to that.
00:29:56.047 --> 00:29:59.761
As I, as I shop in this way, like 90% of my food comes from the farmer's market.
00:29:59.761 --> 00:30:02.582
And I do not mean I really go to the grocery store for toothpaste and toilet.
00:30:03.692 --> 00:30:06.152
Hm, but that's a fantasy and most people don't get to do that.
00:30:06.541 --> 00:30:11.198
Even people that live here, if they have normal day jobs, they're not going to the market on Tuesday, you know, whereas I can, I can do whatever I want.
00:30:13.932 --> 00:30:14.321
yeah.
00:30:14.326 --> 00:30:14.342
Yeah.
00:30:14.694 --> 00:30:15.565
Well, that's interesting.
00:30:15.565 --> 00:30:18.954
And I was going to ask you about this in your Facebook group too.
00:30:19.005 --> 00:30:25.470
Because I went to I'm in the us hardly, and I brought back a suitcase full wine mm-hmm , as I tend to do.
00:30:25.920 --> 00:30:32.265
And, then I went to the liquor store, and I was like, you know what, I'm gonna check out the French wine and see if there's anything I know.
00:30:32.315 --> 00:30:35.765
And it's really interesting to me because I didn't recognize anything.
00:30:36.075 --> 00:30:37.480
There were no bottles.
00:30:38.319 --> 00:30:39.579
I've even seen in my local.
00:30:39.579 --> 00:30:42.430
I mean, I live in, I live right outside of Paris.
00:30:42.430 --> 00:30:44.019
I go to the big grocery stores.
00:30:44.019 --> 00:30:45.250
Mm-hmm I do most of my shopping there.
00:30:45.849 --> 00:30:49.359
So I, you know, I do for the moment get mass produced stuff.
00:30:49.359 --> 00:30:55.029
Although eventually I want to be growing my own vegetables in a little garden and somewhere in, in Brittany as well.
00:30:55.660 --> 00:30:58.119
But yeah, it was really interesting to me.
00:30:58.119 --> 00:31:01.089
And I was going to ask about what gets exported is it.
00:31:01.238 --> 00:31:03.698
The crap that French people won't drink.
00:31:03.698 --> 00:31:07.298
Is it like just the big producers that have so much extra?
00:31:07.298 --> 00:31:12.722
Is it a second label where, one label gets sold in France and one label gets exported.
00:31:12.722 --> 00:31:16.113
I'm curious if, if you have any thoughts to that, I'm gonna say no, no.
00:31:16.113 --> 00:31:16.623
And yes.
00:31:17.042 --> 00:31:20.522
So no everything get everything at every level gets export, exported.
00:31:20.522 --> 00:31:21.123
Very good wines.
00:31:21.123 --> 00:31:21.663
Get exported.
00:31:21.962 --> 00:31:22.173
Yeah.
00:31:22.222 --> 00:31:25.692
Extremely expensive wines, extremely, inexpensive, but great wines get exported.
00:31:26.113 --> 00:31:29.323
The, you know, being exported is, is about prestige as well.
00:31:29.893 --> 00:31:32.053
So there are a lot of people who really focus on the export market.
00:31:32.432 --> 00:31:32.522
Right.
00:31:32.942 --> 00:31:35.853
And there, there is great wine that is exported at all.
00:31:35.853 --> 00:31:41.073
Tiers of production, small, medium, large, the good stuff does not just stay here for sure.
00:31:41.133 --> 00:31:41.972
That is not true.
00:31:42.492 --> 00:31:46.843
You're gonna have the most, the best markets are for French wine.
00:31:46.843 --> 00:31:47.982
I'd say, are the us.
00:31:48.137 --> 00:31:53.821
The UK, Belgium, the Netherlands, you know, China, Hong Kong, Tokyo, places like that.
00:31:53.821 --> 00:32:01.147
I mean, there's French wine all over the world, but the, in terms of like the second label, that's entirely possible, it's entirely possible.
00:32:01.153 --> 00:32:03.097
I mean, they will have different back labels for sure.
00:32:03.367 --> 00:32:04.617
And on a larger scale.
00:32:05.001 --> 00:32:12.484
for like a mass, you know, more mass produced one, you, you probably would have a different label for the us market just because they would've done different market research to see what sells.
00:32:12.490 --> 00:32:17.345
But I would say, most people don't have a different front label, but they, they have to have a different back label.
00:32:18.095 --> 00:32:18.384
Yeah.
00:32:18.384 --> 00:32:18.385
Okay.
00:32:19.144 --> 00:32:21.125
But no, there, there is a lot of good French women.
00:32:21.305 --> 00:32:24.365
I, I, I don't know what you're in Massachusetts, right?
00:32:24.934 --> 00:32:25.204
Yeah.
00:32:25.474 --> 00:32:29.525
I don't know if that's one of the more difficult states, but you know, the liquor store, isn't the best place to buy wine necessarily.
00:32:29.525 --> 00:32:34.565
Like the best thing to do is to find a wine shop, but not everybody has access to a wine shop, you know?
00:32:34.625 --> 00:32:34.954
Right.
00:32:35.525 --> 00:32:35.825
Yeah.
00:32:35.829 --> 00:32:41.154
And I don't know, because in, in Massachusetts we have to buy law, have to buy alcohol at a liquor store.
00:32:41.154 --> 00:32:41.184
Okay.
00:32:41.464 --> 00:32:46.055
But I don't know if there are stores that specialize in just wine.
00:32:46.105 --> 00:32:47.394
There definitely are.
00:32:47.454 --> 00:32:48.055
Nice.
00:32:48.105 --> 00:32:49.575
I know there are nice wine shops in Boston.
00:32:50.295 --> 00:32:50.654
Yeah.
00:32:50.654 --> 00:32:55.210
And in Cambridge, that definitely exists, but they probably are liquor stores as well.
00:32:55.214 --> 00:32:55.900
They probably have liquor.
00:32:55.900 --> 00:32:56.140
Right.
00:32:56.680 --> 00:33:06.180
But you know, I know that not everybody has, has that privilege to have, you know, a wine merchant, which is unfortunate because cuz that's a really great relationship to foster, but wine.com is a really good resource.
00:33:06.450 --> 00:33:07.650
You know, they have really good wine.
00:33:07.650 --> 00:33:08.160
They have a lot of power.
00:33:09.134 --> 00:33:10.575
And so they get really good deals.
00:33:10.575 --> 00:33:12.134
You know, they don't only have mass produced stuff.
00:33:12.134 --> 00:33:15.315
They also work with a lot of producers that are smaller, that I respect a lot.
00:33:15.315 --> 00:33:17.664
So, there's nothing wrong with buying your wine.
00:33:18.670 --> 00:33:18.970
Yeah.
00:33:19.140 --> 00:33:19.410
Yeah.
00:33:19.529 --> 00:33:21.119
But then, you know, it's harder to know what's good.
00:33:22.109 --> 00:33:22.380
Yeah.
00:33:22.380 --> 00:33:31.660
Well, that's the thing, when I was looking and I, I didn't have to buy anything because like I said, I brought, I brought some back, but, yeah, I was trying to look at like the different Appalachians and see what I recognized.
00:33:31.660 --> 00:33:41.289
And obviously like they have like Côte du Rhone and they have, you know, Beaujolais and they had Chateauneuf du Pape mm-hmm are the ones that I knew, but then you look at the hyper local.
00:33:41.605 --> 00:33:50.137
Appalachian and it wasn't really anything that I recognized, but I'm not obviously nearly as knowledgeable as, someone in the industry.
00:33:50.137 --> 00:33:56.907
So I don't know, , you know, I tend to know the common stuff, you know, I mean, at a wine shop, you're dealing with someone whose job it is to help you and, and who knows their stock.
00:33:56.907 --> 00:33:58.167
And they're not trying, they're not trying to screw you.
00:33:58.167 --> 00:33:58.738
They are trying.
00:33:58.917 --> 00:33:59.008
Yeah.
00:33:59.008 --> 00:33:59.728
Yeah, no, no.
00:33:59.847 --> 00:34:02.218
You know, I think a lot of people go, they're trying to gimme to buy so well, like yeah.
00:34:02.218 --> 00:34:04.018
You walked in there to buy something, buy something, you know?
00:34:04.407 --> 00:34:04.498
Yeah.
00:34:04.498 --> 00:34:05.667
But they, but be honest about your price point.
00:34:06.498 --> 00:34:08.507
Be honest about your price point and then ask for help.
00:34:08.987 --> 00:34:13.597
But, You know, it's a loaded thing, and this is the thing, this is the thing is like, it's a big, it's a big world and is scary.
00:34:13.597 --> 00:34:15.728
And so it's important to educate yourself a little bit.
00:34:15.757 --> 00:34:18.427
If you like it, if you don't care who cares, you know, like I'm yeah.
00:34:18.427 --> 00:34:23.108
People are always like, oh, like, you know, feel like I have so much, you know, there's so much pressure to know about wine.
00:34:23.112 --> 00:34:24.788
I'm like, is there, like, where does that come from?
00:34:24.788 --> 00:34:26.460
Because I don't go to your job.
00:34:26.460 --> 00:34:30.829
And you're an architect and feel guilty that I don't know about architecture, you know?
00:34:31.710 --> 00:34:32.550
Like, I'm not an architect.
00:34:32.550 --> 00:34:32.610
Yeah.
00:34:32.610 --> 00:34:36.989
Like I know what a, I know what a flying butcher is, but like , that's about it.
00:34:37.650 --> 00:34:51.630
And you know, so I think, I think we need to let go a little bit of that wine and anxiety, but if you love wine and if you love food, then it does benefit you to learn a little bit, And the best way to do that is to, you know, go to a good wine bar, chat with the bartender, go to vineyards, come visit me and, and do tastings here.
00:34:51.630 --> 00:34:56.789
Come do do tours in France, but there is also, I do just wanna say there is also excellent wine everywhere.
00:34:56.849 --> 00:34:58.230
There's excellent wine in the states.
00:34:58.650 --> 00:34:59.639
There's excellent wine.
00:34:59.670 --> 00:35:00.780
There's excellent wine in England now.
00:35:00.780 --> 00:35:02.190
I mean, there's good wine all over the country.
00:35:02.190 --> 00:35:03.300
There's, there's all over the world.
00:35:03.329 --> 00:35:04.260
There's good wine in Mexico.
00:35:04.264 --> 00:35:10.199
There's obviously Chilli and Argentina more famous regions, but there is a lot of good wine out there and French wine is not the best.
00:35:10.199 --> 00:35:11.340
It's just very good.
00:35:11.730 --> 00:35:12.719
There is no best.
00:35:13.380 --> 00:35:15.630
There is, excellent wine across the board throughout the world.
00:35:15.635 --> 00:35:16.889
It it's easier to make good wine.
00:35:16.889 --> 00:35:18.269
Now we understand wine making a lot better.
00:35:18.269 --> 00:35:19.650
We have really good technology for it.
00:35:20.010 --> 00:35:21.480
We understand viticulture better.
00:35:21.480 --> 00:35:24.449
We, you know, wine, wine making is wine is better now than it used to be.
00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:24.900
For sure.
00:35:24.983 --> 00:35:25.253
Yeah.
00:35:25.369 --> 00:35:25.820
Cool.
00:35:25.972 --> 00:35:33.983
So tell me a little bit about, you know, as you've been living in Lyon for five years and sort of getting involved in.
00:35:34.568 --> 00:35:35.918
You know, it's starting your business.
00:35:35.918 --> 00:35:38.637
Obviously the pandemic, made things very difficult.
00:35:38.907 --> 00:35:48.757
But aside from COVID what have been some of the challenges that you've faced in sort of getting established and setting up and, and learning how to live in France?
00:35:49.478 --> 00:35:49.597
Damn.
00:35:49.603 --> 00:35:51.878
I mean, honestly, get good accountants.
00:35:52.297 --> 00:35:53.407
If you wanna have a business.
00:35:53.407 --> 00:36:00.248
And honestly, even if you don't, if you're American, you need to have accountants here because, because America is really annoying about tax, it's actually not France's fault.
00:36:00.253 --> 00:36:00.878
It's America.
00:36:01.407 --> 00:36:03.447
That requires you to file when you don't live there.
00:36:03.452 --> 00:36:04.318
No one else does that.
00:36:04.322 --> 00:36:06.268
Like French people in America don't file taxes in France.
00:36:06.898 --> 00:36:08.277
Nobody does except for the Americans abroad.
00:36:08.487 --> 00:36:09.507
So get good accountants.
00:36:09.507 --> 00:36:11.398
That's something, I'm sure Allison can recommend.
00:36:11.818 --> 00:36:13.498
And that mm-hmm . That is a big one.
00:36:13.538 --> 00:36:15.157
Also get a relocation agent.
00:36:15.163 --> 00:36:16.277
It's impossible to find housing.
00:36:16.867 --> 00:36:18.248
And I know you help people find housing.
00:36:18.248 --> 00:36:18.518
Right?
00:36:19.268 --> 00:36:21.818
I don't do no very much in housing.
00:36:22.148 --> 00:36:24.628
I, I refer on for housing because yeah.
00:36:24.697 --> 00:36:25.748
It's yeah, it's, it's hard.
00:36:25.748 --> 00:36:27.907
And that's its own full-time job, basically.
00:36:27.907 --> 00:36:33.217
It's so hard and it's because you know, it comes out of good reasons because tenants have rights here.
00:36:33.405 --> 00:36:33.585
Yeah.
00:36:33.585 --> 00:36:34.844
So landlords can't kick you out.
00:36:34.844 --> 00:36:37.675
And so you need to basically prove to them that you have.
00:36:38.204 --> 00:36:40.485
You are consistent in that you have a consistent job.
00:36:40.485 --> 00:36:42.675
And a lot of the times as expats, when we move here, we don't have that.
00:36:42.675 --> 00:36:42.764
Right.
00:36:42.945 --> 00:36:43.605
And so they don't care.
00:36:43.605 --> 00:36:45.074
They don't care if you're like, well, I have six months rent.
00:36:45.074 --> 00:36:45.405
They don't care.
00:36:45.764 --> 00:36:47.474
They're like, well, what's gonna happen in six months.
00:36:47.474 --> 00:36:48.195
Right, right.
00:36:48.344 --> 00:36:51.349
When it's winter and we can't kick you out, you can't kick people out in the winter, you know?
00:36:51.349 --> 00:36:53.094
So landlords have a lot of liability.
00:36:53.690 --> 00:36:58.280
And so I think a relocation agent is, is the best thing to do.
00:36:58.670 --> 00:37:00.469
Also look at you a bank account, they'll get your phone.
00:37:00.650 --> 00:37:02.480
There's a chicken and egg thing with bank account and phone.
00:37:02.480 --> 00:37:03.739
You can't get a bank account without a phone number.
00:37:03.739 --> 00:37:05.150
You can't get a phone number without a bank account.
00:37:05.389 --> 00:37:06.199
You can't get a bank account.
00:37:06.199 --> 00:37:08.510
If you're an American, that is all because of this weird.
00:37:08.539 --> 00:37:10.820
They don't wanna do the extra work on your yeah.
00:37:11.210 --> 00:37:11.960
Your file.
00:37:11.960 --> 00:37:13.789
And so it's really hard to get a bank account as American.
00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:19.369
And so these are the things that if you wanna come here, like just, you know, it's not.
00:37:20.335 --> 00:37:21.894
I think that's the thing it's not cheap.
00:37:21.894 --> 00:37:24.085
It's not cheap to move halfway around the world.
00:37:24.085 --> 00:37:26.605
It's not cheap to settle in a new country if you want to do it.
00:37:26.777 --> 00:37:27.168
Right.
00:37:27.257 --> 00:37:27.318
Yeah.
00:37:27.978 --> 00:37:35.148
And you can save yourself so much frustration if you pay for that, a relocation agent and that service, and it's still going to be frustrating.
00:37:35.777 --> 00:37:35.927
Yeah.
00:37:35.927 --> 00:37:38.898
I, I didn't and I, and I wish I had, I really do.
00:37:38.958 --> 00:37:39.077
Yeah.
00:37:39.648 --> 00:37:39.978
Yeah.
00:37:40.038 --> 00:37:43.128
I mean, I came here as a student and I was very lucky in that.
00:37:43.588 --> 00:37:45.297
I got help from my university.
00:37:45.297 --> 00:37:48.628
I asked them if they had extra housing or if they could point me to something.
00:37:48.628 --> 00:38:05.018
And so I was lucky in that I got that, little boost for the first year, but yeah, it was very, it was very complicated and I mean, there, there are things that you need to know, like, so for example, like to solve the bank account versus, you know, phone problem, like now you can open a live account and you.
00:38:06.007 --> 00:38:12.858
You know, you can use a Belgian IAnd to get your, to get your phone and things like that, that you might, but still need a French.
00:38:13.128 --> 00:38:14.507
You do still need a French bagel account.
00:38:14.927 --> 00:38:15.467
Yeah, you do.
00:38:15.467 --> 00:38:19.668
In order to like settle here, you know, they, they, they are very protectionist.
00:38:20.068 --> 00:38:20.307
I think.
00:38:21.253 --> 00:38:24.793
And they can't, you know, they can be assholes like that reputation is real.
00:38:24.793 --> 00:38:26.952
And I know it's about politeness and stuff.
00:38:26.952 --> 00:38:32.273
And often like we are inadvertently rude and whatever, but like people can be really rude and they, they can be very stubborn.
00:38:32.822 --> 00:38:35.072
I really dislike the, how they use the word.
00:38:35.072 --> 00:38:36.842
No, as a answer to everything.
00:38:36.842 --> 00:38:39.813
Like everything's impossible here, but it's not a real, no.
00:38:40.083 --> 00:38:45.702
And so there's this long drawn out boring dance, of trying to get what you need to get outta someone.
00:38:45.943 --> 00:38:46.693
And I'm not very good at.
00:38:47.788 --> 00:38:50.487
So I find that excruciating about this culture.
00:38:50.487 --> 00:38:53.434
I find, I think that they are, oh, French bashing.
00:38:53.434 --> 00:39:12.760
I think they're, I think they're pretty closeminded, mm-hmm I think that French people are very much, conditioned into valuing normativity overall else and being normal and towing the line and being, you know, being just what's expected of you and as an American and also as just the person that I am, , that's not ever gonna work for me.
00:39:13.210 --> 00:39:13.269
Yeah.
00:39:13.269 --> 00:39:14.409
But because I'm not French.
00:39:14.784 --> 00:39:15.655
I don't worry about it.
00:39:15.655 --> 00:39:18.505
I think a lot of women particularly move here and they try to be French.
00:39:18.565 --> 00:39:19.914
And they're like, this is how you be French.
00:39:19.914 --> 00:39:21.295
Like how you dress like a French go, blah, blah.
00:39:21.295 --> 00:39:22.735
I'm like, have you have met any French women?
00:39:23.065 --> 00:39:23.605
Like, no.
00:39:24.324 --> 00:39:24.445
Yeah.
00:39:24.445 --> 00:39:25.585
And why are you trying to be this?
00:39:25.585 --> 00:39:26.755
Why are you trying to be a myth?
00:39:26.784 --> 00:39:28.494
Why are you trying to be an ideal?
00:39:28.677 --> 00:39:28.858
right.
00:39:29.668 --> 00:39:31.827
My being here is a gift.
00:39:31.827 --> 00:39:35.818
It means I don't have to be the perfect American woman because I'm not dealing with that crap anymore.
00:39:35.822 --> 00:39:39.358
And it means I don't have to be the perfect French woman because I never will be because I'm not French.
00:39:40.356 --> 00:39:42.367
So I wouldn't move here and try to be all Frenchy.
00:39:42.367 --> 00:39:43.987
Like you're not French get over it.
00:39:44.737 --> 00:39:45.097
. Yeah.
00:39:45.396 --> 00:39:45.697
Yeah.
00:39:45.697 --> 00:39:51.213
And I mean, I think there's a, an influencer, you know, American in Paris that , yeah.
00:39:51.213 --> 00:39:58.472
Tries to promote this idea of, you know, French style and French dress and like, you know, the lifestyle of.
00:39:59.688 --> 00:40:02.568
I don't know, go of, of a mythical person, you know?
00:40:02.568 --> 00:40:02.838
Right.
00:40:02.838 --> 00:40:03.168
Yeah.
00:40:03.197 --> 00:40:03.978
Yeah, exactly.
00:40:03.978 --> 00:40:05.268
I think, I think you've nailed it.
00:40:05.327 --> 00:40:08.538
And I also find that really irritating.
00:40:08.987 --> 00:40:09.152
Yeah, definitely.
00:40:09.152 --> 00:40:14.237
But yeah, I have been really in the past couple years, I've leaned into being the American.
00:40:14.387 --> 00:40:14.478
Yeah.
00:40:14.478 --> 00:40:16.938
I used to care more about making sure that.
00:40:17.192 --> 00:40:21.911
I spoke really well and taking it, taking things on me.
00:40:22.192 --> 00:40:26.081
If I had a conflict with somebody , oh, it must be because I'm American.
00:40:26.081 --> 00:40:27.552
It's something that I don't understand.
00:40:27.552 --> 00:40:29.626
Or , there's this cultural difference or something.
00:40:30.137 --> 00:40:33.047
And now I'm like, you know what?
00:40:33.467 --> 00:40:35.746
No, that's not, that's not all on me.
00:40:35.956 --> 00:40:36.137
Yeah.
00:40:36.547 --> 00:40:37.056
Absolutely.
00:40:37.056 --> 00:40:37.447
Absolutely.
00:40:37.447 --> 00:40:39.786
I have, I, I don't have a lot of patience for.
00:40:40.416 --> 00:40:42.606
For the French people that like mock me for being American.
00:40:42.612 --> 00:40:44.166
I'm like, how many languages do you speak?
00:40:44.407 --> 00:40:44.617
Yeah.
00:40:44.617 --> 00:40:51.266
Tell me, yeah, old, old lady who like, or if I'm like talking on the phone and I know we talk loudly Americans talk loudly, you can hear an American from miles away.
00:40:51.567 --> 00:40:56.907
If I'm on the phone in the street and someone gives me a dirty look, I will clap back a little, be like, how many languages do you speak?
00:40:57.597 --> 00:40:59.606
Let me know, I'll wait, you know?
00:40:59.666 --> 00:40:59.876
Yeah.
00:41:00.277 --> 00:41:01.626
I had a girl the other day.
00:41:01.657 --> 00:41:02.646
Oh, this was funny.
00:41:02.956 --> 00:41:04.007
I was at a wine tasting.
00:41:04.056 --> 00:41:04.652
It was like a party.
00:41:04.652 --> 00:41:09.061
It was like a wine, it was a promotional event for, the wines of Corsica, which were excellent by the way.
00:41:09.431 --> 00:41:14.532
Really, I had a cor I had a Corkin rose on vacation and I was like, they were super impressed.
00:41:14.532 --> 00:41:14.742
Yeah.
00:41:14.742 --> 00:41:16.541
They make a lot of rose, but, so this event was super fun.
00:41:16.541 --> 00:41:17.112
It was really great.
00:41:17.112 --> 00:41:20.157
And like, I, I cross paths with this, this couple.
00:41:20.157 --> 00:41:22.467
And the dude was like, oh my God, wine, Caroline.
00:41:22.467 --> 00:41:23.306
I follow you, blah, blah.
00:41:23.306 --> 00:41:23.996
You follow me back.
00:41:23.996 --> 00:41:25.317
Like I have a wine show and I we'd never met before.
00:41:25.317 --> 00:41:26.336
He's like fangirling over me.
00:41:26.336 --> 00:41:27.146
It was really cute.
00:41:27.416 --> 00:41:28.586
And his girlfriend was just sitting there.
00:41:29.637 --> 00:41:34.797
Like giving me this evil look just being, and she was like, Ugh, this girl was so mousey and pointless.
00:41:34.797 --> 00:41:39.327
And I was like, no wonder you hate me girl, because , I'm everything you're not.
00:41:39.536 --> 00:41:42.666
But then it was funny because then her boyfriend went off to talk to someone else.
00:41:42.666 --> 00:41:45.666
And this other guy was talking to us . And I draw my business card to this guy.
00:41:45.907 --> 00:41:49.476
Who's also in the wine business and this girl is trying to make me feel bad about it.
00:41:49.927 --> 00:41:52.056
And like, literally like trying to make me feel like I'm not polite.
00:41:52.061 --> 00:41:53.556
And I'm like, who's not being polite here.
00:41:54.007 --> 00:41:55.387
And I literally I'm like, yeah, how.
00:41:56.041 --> 00:41:56.672
Are you an entrepreneur?
00:41:56.762 --> 00:41:57.271
Oh no.
00:41:57.632 --> 00:42:00.121
And I was like, oh yeah, well, French people are allergic to money.
00:42:00.422 --> 00:42:01.501
I literally, I was a little drunk.
00:42:01.891 --> 00:42:02.371
I was tipsy.
00:42:02.371 --> 00:42:02.762
I was tipsy.
00:42:02.762 --> 00:42:05.282
I was like, yeah, French people are allergic to money and I love making money.
00:42:05.282 --> 00:42:09.362
So I'm never gonna feel bad about giving my business card to someone and not shut her right up.
00:42:10.021 --> 00:42:10.592
It was pretty funny.
00:42:10.597 --> 00:42:10.652
Yeah.
00:42:11.237 --> 00:42:14.277
Yeah, but I, I do like, I like clapping back when they're being rude.
00:42:14.409 --> 00:42:14.710
Yeah.
00:42:14.889 --> 00:42:26.440
And she's probably, I mean, she's probably making like 1800 euros a month, whatever business I yours.
00:42:28.045 --> 00:42:28.704
But it was just funny.
00:42:28.704 --> 00:42:29.869
I was like, yeah, I love money.
00:42:29.929 --> 00:42:30.710
Well, I wanna make money.
00:42:30.710 --> 00:42:32.900
Of course I'm gonna throw my card down and French people.
00:42:33.139 --> 00:42:33.619
Definitely.
00:42:33.619 --> 00:42:41.480
I think don't, I think ambitious French people exist obviously, but they are rare and it is kind of beaten outta them when they're kids and they move to America.
00:42:42.530 --> 00:42:42.769
Yeah.
00:42:43.130 --> 00:42:49.869
You know, or they, or they succeed and they become entrepreneurs, but I think it's a lot harder for them culturally to, I think it's really hard for people.
00:42:49.869 --> 00:42:51.340
There's definitely a sheep mentality.
00:42:51.639 --> 00:43:05.130
I find, well, I mean, I've noticed in the schools, like starting from a very young age, you know, equality in the French school system is kind of like, you know, shave the, shave the heads that, that the expression doesn't work as well in English as it doesn't French.
00:43:05.130 --> 00:43:05.369
That's funny.
00:43:05.375 --> 00:43:09.690
Like, you know, cut off the heads that go that, like that rise go that rise.
00:43:09.690 --> 00:43:10.230
Yeah.
00:43:10.230 --> 00:43:10.231
Yeah.
00:43:10.260 --> 00:43:12.809
Like, you know, shave everybody to the same level.
00:43:13.019 --> 00:43:13.230
Yeah.
00:43:13.349 --> 00:43:16.199
Everybody has to be the same, which means that nobody can be excellent.
00:43:16.260 --> 00:43:16.349
You.
00:43:16.818 --> 00:43:17.237
Right.
00:43:17.507 --> 00:43:17.807
Yeah.
00:43:17.807 --> 00:43:27.838
And the kids who are very bright are, you know, either bored in school or, you know, there's, there's some kind of fault finding with them to, to cut down their self esteem.
00:43:28.983 --> 00:43:33.592
And I've noticed that like, I, when I first got to France, I was, well, you can never get elementary.
00:43:33.952 --> 00:43:34.253
Right?
00:43:34.523 --> 00:43:37.853
You can never like no one ever gets all the points.
00:43:37.882 --> 00:43:42.023
You're never, you're never good enough, but you also, you have to be in the box.
00:43:42.023 --> 00:43:44.213
You have to be, you have to tow the line.
00:43:44.663 --> 00:43:45.293
And I hate that.
00:43:45.293 --> 00:43:46.222
I don't tow the line ever.
00:43:46.253 --> 00:43:46.643
Fuck that.
00:43:46.853 --> 00:43:47.152
Sorry.
00:43:47.422 --> 00:43:47.813
Right.
00:43:47.932 --> 00:43:55.342
And I mean, the thing is like, so yeah, in the grading system, like it's out of 2020 is for God, 19 is for the king.
00:43:55.681 --> 00:43:57.472
So, oh gosh.
00:43:57.681 --> 00:44:02.481
18 is for the le president de la République yeah, I've heard you can never go above 17.
00:44:03.181 --> 00:44:03.911
Yeah, basically.
00:44:03.911 --> 00:44:06.501
Yeah, basically, which isn't exactly true.
00:44:06.512 --> 00:44:08.132
There are kids every year and it's funny.
00:44:08.161 --> 00:44:14.731
Cause you know, we just had the, we just had the back and, and the, the results from the back, got oh and published everyone's results.
00:44:14.731 --> 00:44:14.882
Right.
00:44:14.882 --> 00:44:15.931
They publish all the kids' results.
00:44:15.961 --> 00:44:16.802
So, you know exactly.
00:44:17.342 --> 00:44:20.882
How you did compared to Timmy who sits next to you, which I think is so cruel.
00:44:20.987 --> 00:44:30.862
Well, even, even starting in elementary school, it's gone away a little bit, but 10 years ago when I was teaching, the kids would tell me in second, third grade, , oh, so, and so is the best in the class.
00:44:30.867 --> 00:44:33.748
They would have ranking, we didn't know our class rank until.
00:44:34.438 --> 00:44:36.538
The end of the year for every year of high school.
00:44:36.538 --> 00:44:44.847
And then I think senior year, when it mattered for graduation, we did it by quarter or something, but it was not a thing that existed before.
00:44:44.907 --> 00:44:46.438
I don't remember ever knowing.
00:44:46.438 --> 00:44:46.708
Oh, cool.
00:44:46.978 --> 00:44:53.518
Ever knowing what my friends grades were, unless we talked about like specific things, we didn't talk about our, yeah.
00:44:53.878 --> 00:44:55.438
And that was ne it was never published.
00:44:55.438 --> 00:44:56.728
It was never something that I cared about.
00:44:56.818 --> 00:44:57.478
They care about it a lot.
00:44:58.467 --> 00:45:05.338
And I think it really does have huge implications for how they develop their sense of self and their ability to make mistakes.
00:45:05.338 --> 00:45:08.518
French people never wanna speak English because they're afraid of making mistakes.
00:45:08.518 --> 00:45:09.777
They're terrified of making mistakes.
00:45:09.782 --> 00:45:10.978
It gets beaten outta them when they're kids.
00:45:11.307 --> 00:45:14.907
And I think that's really, really unfortunate and it really does stifle innovation and free thinking.
00:45:15.152 --> 00:45:15.422
Yeah.
00:45:15.659 --> 00:45:16.800
Yeah, but I love it here.
00:45:16.800 --> 00:45:17.460
I really do.
00:45:17.460 --> 00:45:17.730
Sorry.
00:45:17.730 --> 00:45:20.099
French people who are listening, not hashtag, not all French people.
00:45:20.539 --> 00:45:21.469
I do love it here.
00:45:21.469 --> 00:45:24.827
I do take a lot of pleasure in living in this beautiful city.
00:45:24.827 --> 00:45:30.226
I mean the only so beautiful and, and just, you know, I'm obsessed with it, so, yeah.
00:45:30.242 --> 00:45:30.670
Cool.
00:45:30.753 --> 00:45:32.722
So, what would you recommend somebody who.
00:45:33.518 --> 00:45:43.398
Coming to France and coming to Lyon, what would you recommend that people visit or do I know there's so much, we talked about so many things and obviously, honestly, one of the answers right now to dinner.
00:45:43.487 --> 00:45:43.668
Yeah.
00:45:43.668 --> 00:45:44.628
Take me out to dinner.
00:45:44.938 --> 00:45:46.858
You gotta walk around the old town, the old town's beautiful.
00:45:46.858 --> 00:45:48.688
The medieval old town do a little walking tour.
00:45:48.927 --> 00:45:51.418
Go up to the Basilica, go to the lay Phu.
00:45:51.568 --> 00:45:54.768
That is the, that is the like layout.
00:45:54.768 --> 00:45:57.898
The halls for P is really cool market, covered market.
00:45:57.898 --> 00:45:59.668
Go to an open air market, do a cooking class.
00:46:00.297 --> 00:46:02.097
Ask me for my concierge services.
00:46:02.097 --> 00:46:03.538
I'll make you some restaurant reservations.
00:46:03.635 --> 00:46:04.355
It's a great city.
00:46:04.414 --> 00:46:05.284
It's so beautiful.
00:46:05.284 --> 00:46:08.824
You know, just wandering, walking, walk a lot, walking in Leola is the best.
00:46:08.855 --> 00:46:09.965
It's such a pretty place.
00:46:09.965 --> 00:46:10.954
It's really easy to get around.
00:46:10.954 --> 00:46:11.614
It's not that big.
00:46:11.824 --> 00:46:13.954
It's like, you know, you get anywhere in like a half an hour.
00:46:14.092 --> 00:46:14.902
That's pretty charming.
00:46:14.931 --> 00:46:15.472
Pretty charming.
00:46:15.472 --> 00:46:17.211
We call it tie human it's human sized.
00:46:17.347 --> 00:46:17.588
Yeah.
00:46:17.755 --> 00:46:17.994
Yeah.
00:46:18.264 --> 00:46:18.505
Yeah.
00:46:18.505 --> 00:46:20.394
It's a beautiful, it's a beautiful city.
00:46:20.394 --> 00:46:20.454
Yeah.
00:46:20.724 --> 00:46:21.545
It's a beautiful city.
00:46:22.264 --> 00:46:25.594
And what would be your advice for somebody who might be thinking about moving to.
00:46:26.570 --> 00:46:31.900
How are you, to help with the visa stuff and get a relocation agent and, and adjust your expectations.
00:46:32.019 --> 00:46:32.530
It's hard.
00:46:32.679 --> 00:46:33.909
And it takes a long time to learn.
00:46:33.940 --> 00:46:36.309
This is also, it takes a long time to learn a new language.
00:46:36.639 --> 00:46:37.179
So yeah.
00:46:37.480 --> 00:46:38.409
Give yourself some grace.
00:46:38.409 --> 00:46:39.280
You don't have to be perfect.
00:46:39.280 --> 00:46:44.409
It will take you five or seven or 10 years to, to be fluent and fluency doesn't mean it like what is fluent mean?
00:46:44.409 --> 00:46:45.639
There's always gonna be things I don't understand.
00:46:45.639 --> 00:46:47.590
There's always gonna be references, jokes, stuff like that.
00:46:47.590 --> 00:46:48.250
That's hard for me.
00:46:48.670 --> 00:46:49.480
I, I don't care.
00:46:49.880 --> 00:46:50.925
Don't try to be French.
00:46:50.954 --> 00:46:51.525
You're not French.
00:46:51.840 --> 00:46:52.110
Yeah.
00:46:52.469 --> 00:46:52.800
Yeah.
00:46:52.889 --> 00:46:58.139
Embrace being an expat and look at places that aren't in Paris, you might be surprised at what you find.
00:46:58.320 --> 00:46:58.710
Cool.
00:46:58.710 --> 00:47:01.349
Well, thank you so much for joining me.
00:47:01.559 --> 00:47:04.199
Thank you so much for, I know.
00:47:06.788 --> 00:47:08.378
Can I direct people from where to find me.
00:47:08.378 --> 00:47:12.347
I know I've, I've been plugging myself this whole time, but, yes, please do.
00:47:12.347 --> 00:47:17.387
We will add it in the, we, it in the notes as well on the website so people can links there.
00:47:17.748 --> 00:47:21.257
I'm w Caroline on Instagram and on Facebook and on YouTube.
00:47:21.503 --> 00:47:23.663
And on Pinterest, although I'm not very active there.
00:47:23.972 --> 00:47:25.023
Instagram's my big one.
00:47:25.023 --> 00:47:25.862
I post a lot.
00:47:25.862 --> 00:47:26.762
I post a lot of stories.
00:47:26.762 --> 00:47:28.112
I post a lot about my fun life here.
00:47:28.353 --> 00:47:34.262
I also have the teir podcast with my friend, Emily, and I'm hosting this amazing retreat at the end of October.
00:47:34.262 --> 00:47:39.012
If you wanna come, it's basically gonna be drunk summer camp for adults in October.
00:47:39.018 --> 00:47:40.693
Like we're gonna do day trips to the vineyards.
00:47:40.693 --> 00:47:43.382
We're gonna have a Bocuse hold day devoted to Paul Bocuse.
00:47:43.762 --> 00:47:44.813
We're gonna stay in a five star hotel.
00:47:44.813 --> 00:47:46.762
It's gonna be fabulous and delicious.
00:47:46.768 --> 00:47:49.833
So, I still have a couple spots left for that and I would love to see you.
00:47:50.250 --> 00:47:50.489
Cool.
00:47:50.489 --> 00:47:55.320
Well, I hope that some people sign up because that sounds really awesome to me.
00:47:55.320 --> 00:47:56.309
Yeah, me too.
00:47:56.786 --> 00:47:58.197
Thank you so much.
00:47:58.300 --> 00:47:58.570
Thank you.
00:48:06.155 --> 00:48:10.585
Thanks for listening to this episode of Profiles in Franceformation with Allison Grant Lounes.
00:48:10.954 --> 00:48:14.585
If you liked this episode, please like subscribe and share on social media.
00:48:15.215 --> 00:48:17.045
I'll see you next time for a new episode.
00:48:17.050 --> 00:48:20.375
And in the meantime, I hope we've inspired you today to pursue your dreams.
00:48:20.405 --> 00:48:27.545
No matter how big or small, remember the way you bring your own dreams into reality is by believing in yourself and taking small steps towards your.
00:48:28.429 --> 00:48:29.960
Start today, start now.
00:48:30.320 --> 00:48:34.869
And à bientôt.