Patriots Postgame Show 9/27: Breaking Down the Patriots Week 3 Loss to the Jaguars

00:00:01
Speaker 1: This is the Patriots postgame show presented by DraftKings. Patriots Nation, welcome to the Patriots postgame show presented by DraftKings.
00:00:22
Speaker 2: Welcome into the Patriots postgame show presented by DraftKings.
00:00:25
Speaker 3: As always, Patriots Hall of Famer Troy Brown-Deuce. I'm Jack. That's Paul. We got Matt, Matt, and Ace behind the scenes.
00:00:32
Speaker 2: Gentlemen, Mike Vrabel's opening press conference said we have to take advantage of bad football, and they did that for the majority of a short tenure.
00:00:39
Speaker 3: And today, they certainly were the bad football, to say the least, Deuce. They were.
00:00:43
Speaker 4: That was, let's just call it what it was.
00:00:45
Speaker 5: It was one of the worst performances I've seen since I've been here. It seemed like things snowballed on them. They had no answer for when The momentum started going against them.
00:00:53
Speaker 4: Drake clearly not comfortable.
00:00:55
Speaker 5: I thought today he was going to bounce back, start to find some kind of stride.
00:00:58
Speaker 4: That is opposite of what happened. Yeah, I mean, Mike said it all. It was a lot of bad football on both sides of the ball. Undisciplined football, untimely penalties, lack of discipline. Decision making was terrible. But I think we can talk about a lot of different elements that fall short today. But really, it gets down until you get your quarterback settled and playing at a level that he played at last year. I don't think the rest of this stuff is going to matter much. Right now, he is not giving them chances to win.
00:01:28
Speaker 3: Yeah, I feel like.
00:01:31
Speaker 6: It was kind of the same thing as we saw the last couple of games that came out kind of hot. you know, defensively got some three and outs and got out the field. And, you know, some of it caused by penalties and stuff like that by Jacksonville. But, you know, and then offensively they came out, I thought, moving the ball down the field. And then the second drive there where– I almost said Mac Jones. It looked like Mac Jones to me a little bit.
00:01:53
Speaker 4: Because it was Mac Jones-esque. The pick at the end of the half.
00:01:56
Speaker 7: Was Mac Jones-like.
00:01:57
Speaker 3: No doubt.
00:01:58
Speaker 6: But then they're going– they're driving the ball really well. And then Drake has this– the ball just comes out of his hands. Like, nobody touched him, nobody near him, and they turned the ball over when they're going in to score points there. And from that point on, the game was pretty much all Jacksonville.
00:02:13
Speaker 2: In that moment, you thought, I'm not quite sure it can get any worse, and it somehow did for the New England Patriots.
00:02:18
Speaker 3: Let's go straight to the good, the bad, and the injured.
00:02:41
Speaker 2: Add me to the bad list. I can't imagine there's going to be much good. Do we have anything, anything at all from you?
00:02:47
Speaker 3: No, no, no.
00:02:48
Speaker 5: I mean, I, you know, a couple of good plays, Marcus Jones, nice interception, you know, but I don't really, that kind of game.
00:02:54
Speaker 4: Yeah, I agree. I don't know if we're going to spend any time. I thought the defensive back showed some physicality, especially early in the game. I thought Carlton Davis was pretty good in this game. I thought he was pretty aggressive defensively. snuffed out a couple of screens. It looked like he was trying to jump them and almost made plays on them. I thought Gabe Ackes flashed a little bit with his athleticism, but nothing was sustained well enough to even earn a spot on the good list to me. This was a bad performance.
00:03:19
Speaker 3: Carlton Davis here, same.
00:03:21
Speaker 6: Made some great plays on some of those little pop passes out to the wide receivers and came up and made some tackles.
00:03:28
Speaker 3: A little bit physical in there.
00:03:29
Speaker 6: In the tackling department for him, but he was still a little bit gimpy getting up on some of those tackles.
00:03:37
Speaker 3: So, I mean, I'd like to see that improve a little bit, but.
00:03:40
Speaker 6: You know, he was the best part of the game, and that's kind of saying a lot for what we thought of the rest of the team.
00:03:46
Speaker 8: Yeah.
00:03:46
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think on the good, you know, before it unraveled, just like you guys said, Marcus Jones, Davis, Akis, last night, like Paul just said, but just not a ton once it gets that ugly.
00:03:56
Speaker 3: Yeah. Just not really any room on that good list.
00:03:59
Speaker 5: No, I mean, we should probably just get right into Drake May. I mean, that's what everybody's going to want to talk about, and that's what the million-dollar question is, is how does a kid go from completing 72% of his passes last year, looking real comfortable, having great downfield accuracy, showing good pocket presence, kind of unraveled to this point that we saw today where he's forcing throws, he's not feeling it, he's not seeing it.
00:04:21
Speaker 4: I mean, it's just we're debating at what point do you pull him.
00:04:24
Speaker 5: I mean, I thought in the fourth was the right time, but what do you do to hit the reset button? on this kid and get him back to zero. You're going to have to do it on the fly. It doesn't get much easier with Buffalo next week, and I'm not sure.
00:04:37
Speaker 4: What the answer is.
00:04:37
Speaker 5: I thought he would start to work through it himself, but clearly this week was another step in the wrong direction, which is just so concerning.
00:04:46
Speaker 3: Troy, what's the first? Sorry, go ahead, Paul.
00:04:49
Speaker 4: No, I'm baffled by a guy with another year of experience in the system seemingly making mistakes that you expected to see, not last year. two years ago as a rookie, um, the throw across the body. Again, you're throwing to a, a tightly covered Efton Chisholm in the end zone at the end of the first half for no reason at all. You throw across your body into coverage. I just don't really understand it. Why he continues to make some of these mistakes that we've seen, um, early on in the season. That's now, what does he get? One touchdown.
00:05:24
Speaker 9: Yeah.
00:05:25
Speaker 4: And now six interceptions. Yeah. And, um, equally as troubling to me is not going to show up in the stat sheet, but I lost track. I think there were three different plays today that he had the ball in his hands and got tackled and did not finish the play with the ball in his hands. Um, the fumbles, uh, are a problem. They were a problem last year. It didn't hurt them because they didn't lose enough of them for it to really matter. But, you know, we had a playoff game against Houston. He fumbled the ball four times. Um, Again, I'll just say the 2026 Patriots will only go anywhere if he turns this around and figures things out. But right now, he looks broken, and they've got to fix him.
00:06:09
Speaker 6: Yeah, and he can't seem to stop the snowball effect. And that's part of being a professional athlete. You've got to be able to stop that and cut it off at some point and turn things around. When you're one of the better players on the football team, that is expected of you. You talked about the football being on the ground. I know three times... Alone, I know the ball was on the ground. I know Jacksonville didn't come up with the ball, but there were three times where they were, like, yelling and screaming that they got the ball.
00:06:34
Speaker 3: So that's an issue.
00:06:36
Speaker 6: You know, and then the unexplainable play where he's throwing the ball to a guy who's covered, an effing chism, that's covered the entire time he comes off the line of scrimmage. You can sell me on that if you're telling me you're throwing.
00:06:50
Speaker 3: That ball to Randy Moss or Gronk.
00:06:52
Speaker 4: Give a chance.
00:06:52
Speaker 3: Somebody like that. Give my guy a chance to make a play. You can sell me on that.
00:06:57
Speaker 6: But, like, you're throwing the ball to Efton Chisholm where he's clearly an awkward, whatever color, that teal blue jersey standing between you and Efton Chisholm. There's really no excuse for that. to throw that ball the way he threw that ball to Chisholm.
00:07:12
Speaker 3: So, yeah. Well, that could have been Randy Mox, Troy.
00:07:14
Speaker 2: I'm not sure the way that ball was placed. Anyone's making a play on that to begin with. That just kind of speaks to how bad and poor that throw was.
00:07:21
Speaker 6: Well, I mean, Travis Hunter was thankful for that gift. So, I mean, it goes on his stats as a good play.
00:07:27
Speaker 4: Yeah, just to Troy's point. It's his first career pick.
00:07:29
Speaker 7: First career. There you go.
00:07:30
Speaker 4: Congratulations. Well, it's just hard. The team didn't really respond, too.
00:07:34
Speaker 5: You know, it's like, and I agree with Troy's point that, like, you know, Drake at a certain point has to, stop the bleeding, turn around and start playing better. But, you know, to me, it felt like the ball came out of his hands, you know, that, that you felt like you left points on the board there.
00:07:47
Speaker 4: You did get a little bit of a bump with.
00:07:49
Speaker 5: Marcus Jones interception where it felt like, all right, this is a little bit of a response, but you know, what was just so distressing where there were so many times during the course of this game where they made bad plays and then they'd make another bad play on top of it. Or, you know, it just, they, they, they could not stop the momentum of everything just continuing to snowball. And, Out of bounds on the kickoff. And, you know, it's just a comedy of errors by the end of the game.
00:08:12
Speaker 7: And it does.
00:08:12
Speaker 4: It just shows you how tenuous things are right now for them. Because you look, the way the game started, you know, it was the Jaguars that were making the mistakes. Really, they get a penalty on the opening kick return. Then they get a penalty on the first play from scrimmage, which paves the way for a nice three and out. Here you go. Troy and Paul needed a fast start. You get the three and out. Now you get the ball. And then you can't move the ball. I think you got one first down, and then you punted. But then you get another three and out. You force another punt. You start to move, and Drake just drops the football. He's trying to make a pass. It looked like he was trying to gear one up downfield. It slips out of his hand. And then that's like this one thing. One bad thing happened, and that was it. That was basically game, set, match. From that point on, Jacksonville dominated the rest of the day. I thought it was competitive back and forth. early on, and then all of a sudden, Drake fumbles, Jags go, I mean, it's one thing to say, well, you just hand them points off turnovers, right? Well, the Jags went like 70 yards. I think it was like, what was that first drive for Jacksonville? Yeah, 62 yards. It's not like they took over. on the doorstep. The Patriots could have come up with a play on defense. You would just force two punts on the first two drives, force another one.
00:09:23
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, they did on drive four where they got the interception.
00:09:26
Speaker 4: They got the pick.
00:09:27
Speaker 3: Yeah, right on the first play of the drive.
00:09:30
Speaker 4: Right, when it looked like it was sort of going downhill quick.
00:09:33
Speaker 6: You got Morgan Moses on a hold-in, and then you get Dobbs on an OPI.
00:09:39
Speaker 9: Yep.
00:09:39
Speaker 6: And that's really a four-point play because now instead of ending up with seven, you end up with three. Those types of plays are costly in these types of games.
00:09:48
Speaker 4: That was probably it because it's 7-0 and Jacksonville gets the ball back and they look like they're going to take control of the game. And then they, they throw the pick. It goes off of the tight ends hands. Marcus Jones makes the pick. You set up on the doorstep. Now you're in the red zone and you can't, you can't come away with seven. And it's like Troy said, it's nothing that Jacksonville did to let, to not let you come away with seven. It's just self-inflicted wounds.
00:10:10
Speaker 5: Yeah.
00:10:11
Speaker 8: Yeah.
00:10:11
Speaker 4: You know, penalties.
00:10:12
Speaker 5: The other sequence that killed me was just, you know, at halftime, I mean, you're down 14 to three, but you're getting the ball and there's an opportunity to make it 14 to 10. You go down, you miss the field goal, and then defense, you've been in the locker room, we've got to pick it up. They allow a freaking 15-play drive.
00:10:27
Speaker 4: You know Mike's mad when he starts talking like that. Don't make me feel angry. He always has that smile on his face, but don't be fooled. He's sneaky negative.
00:10:38
Speaker 3: But that was it.
00:10:38
Speaker 5: I look forward to seeing, or I guess I don't look forward to it, but just what the success rate was because it felt like the Patriots defense had maybe a handful of plays all game where they were successful. Otherwise, it was just Jacksonville dictating things right down the field.
00:10:52
Speaker 2: Drake May, 14 to 2,599 yards, two interceptions, sack three.
00:10:57
Speaker 3: Times, a rating of 48.6.
00:10:59
Speaker 2: I think the most concerning part to me was the demeanor and that snowball effect.
00:11:05
Speaker 3: Couldn't agree more, Jack.
00:11:06
Speaker 2: The lack of response and what's so... I guess I don't even know the word I'm looking for. But on that interception we just showed a short while ago, it's play action, plants the back foot. He looks confident for one of the first times you've seen all season. It looks like he knows where he's going with the football. It looks like he's going to deliver a Drake May throw like we've seen so many times last year. Ball slips out of his hand. You're like, how can this keep happening? And then it just kept getting worse, right? And there was no response. There was no putting their foot down, I say, within the Patriots' offense. And I think to my key to the game, the defense can only hold the rope for only so long. I mean, that second half, I understand you saw some bad from the defense, but they can only, you know, hold on for dear life and try to keep this thing afloat to the best of their ability for so long.
00:11:49
Speaker 4: And I would just say, too, like, you know, something that we talked about during the game, when your defense is predicated on the aggressiveness and all those schemes up front that Zach Kaur is really good at, and I think some of them work today, the difference is you're playing a team that has players that, seen some of those things. And even when you guess right, like there was a huge play on that drive that caused Mike to curse a little bit there earlier. They had a perfect blitz. They get right to Trevor Lawrence. They almost have him. And then he's able to just sort of throw it out to Tootin. Not only it's not a loss of yards, which probably ends the drive... But it ends up being a first down. And here we go. Drive on. And then, you know. So my point is, when you have to rely on the blitz to generate pressure consistently, sometimes you're going to play offenses that have players that can beat those blitzes. And today was one of them. I don't think Trevor Lawrence was outstanding today, but he's good.
00:12:43
Speaker 10: He's a good player.
00:12:44
Speaker 4: And he made some big throws when he had to. And Troy was talking about the receivers getting open on all the big downs. And you thought there was maybe some changes in some of the coverages that Jacksonville did that might have bothered May. I thought there were some changes with some of the stuff the Patriots did, too, because every time they needed to make a play, someone was open seemingly in a seam.
00:13:05
Speaker 6: I would say for the Patriots defense, I thought they would play a little more man defense against the receivers from Jacksonville. But, you know, a lot of the plays, you know, did come on some of the zone stuff, you know, where these guys were just finding holes and the defense there and making plays. Now, I would say in crunch time there when it was coming down to it, when they really had to have it, they were in man coverage, and they couldn't cover Jacoby Myers. And then they couldn't cover Parker Washington in those situations. They didn't even need Brian Thomas today because those guys did it. I mean, the numbers may not be huge numbers, but they picked up those crucial first downs when they needed to keep those drives alive with those two guys making plays. So I really miss Jacoby Myers being in the Patriots uniform.
00:13:46
Speaker 5: I mean, too, how many plays did it feel like they had him and then they didn't have him? And the most famous one being that final run by Trevor Lawrence that he kneeled down on the one where Troy thought he was down.
00:13:54
Speaker 3: It was like, why are you running the quarterback?
00:13:55
Speaker 4: But there's so many times you've got to have him and he just squirts through.
00:13:59
Speaker 6: There were like four guys that would make the tackle.
00:14:01
Speaker 3: And I just turned to you and I just. He's still going. He's still going.
00:14:04
Speaker 7: He's still running.
00:14:05
Speaker 11: Spillane.
00:14:06
Speaker 4: Spillane was one of those today. I thought he had a couple of well-timed blitzes. Just couldn't make the play. Once he got there, I thought he had tootin' for about a five-yard loss on one play that turned into a five-yard gain. They just didn't play well in any phase today. I want to say one thing unrelated to the game specific, but just our postgame show. The NFL has given some sanctions to the amount of highlights that we can show during the postgame show. So we're limited. Normally, Chris does a great job of getting the plays that we're talking about right now, but we can only show 60 seconds of highlights. per NFL rules, which I just want to make sure everybody's like, well, how come they're not showing the plays like we normally do? Because we're not allowed to. So that's the long.
00:14:47
Speaker 3: And short of it.
00:14:48
Speaker 4: There'll be a minute of it. You get 60 seconds. You'll probably see a lot of that interception in the end zone by Travis Hunter.
00:14:54
Speaker 5: Do we really need to show any highlights in this game anyway?
00:14:56
Speaker 4: No, I just want everybody, but I don't want people to think, oh, look at these babies. They lost 35 to 60. They're not showing any highlights. No, we're not allowed to.
00:15:04
Speaker 3: Veteran vision.
00:15:05
Speaker 4: We'd like to watch some of that.
00:15:06
Speaker 3: Fred will tell you.
00:15:08
Speaker 4: I'll tell you what the argument is before the argument even starts. I'll let you know what they're going to be bitching about before it happens.
00:15:13
Speaker 3: What do you think we got on the phone lines right here, Paul?
00:15:15
Speaker 7: Bitching.
00:15:16
Speaker 4: And they should be. Eric, Jake, DJ, you guys should be all wound up. We're here for you. A little therapy session today.
00:15:25
Speaker 3: And we will get to you shortly.
00:15:26
Speaker 2: Trevor Lawrence, just to add some context, 19 of 29, 182 yards, three touchdowns, one interception to Marcus Jones. a rating of 102.9. Jacoby Myers, seven receptions, 64 yards for one touchdown, a long of 14 on eight targets to lead the Jags.
00:15:42
Speaker 3: Jacoby Myers, he made some.
00:15:44
Speaker 2: Of those plays today, specifically on third down, that Patriots fans got used to seeing him make during his time as a New England Patriot.
00:15:50
Speaker 6: Like I just said, the numbers aren't going to be huge for him, but he's going to do all the little things you want him to do, and he's going to move the chains on third downs for you. And that's what you expect from a guy like him, is just to go out and work hard, and exemplify the Patriot way.
00:16:06
Speaker 3: You know, not that he's in the uniform anymore, but, you know.
00:16:09
Speaker 6: He just proved his value. He proved his value today and what he brought to this football team when he was here.
00:16:13
Speaker 5: Yeah, they just weren't able to affect Trevor Lawrence at all. I mean, I love what, you know, Paul's talking about because the four-man blitz, it's just, he's got all day.
00:16:20
Speaker 4: He's comfortable. He got into a rhythm.
00:16:22
Speaker 5: And I just, I thought it was, you know, ironic that when they finally do decide to heat him up with a zero blitz, gets the ball out, Jacoby catches it, squirts up for a first down.
00:16:31
Speaker 12: It's just.
00:16:32
Speaker 5: It's like every button they pushed all day long was the wrong button.
00:16:36
Speaker 6: Yeah, and you saw several times in there where they had free runners on the quarterback. He just stood in there, and he talked about– and, I mean, he delivered the ball the way Mike Rayburn wanted his quarterback to deliver the ball. He just didn't see it for the Patriots. But Trevor Lawrence, give him credit. You know, he stood in the pocket, took a couple of hits here and there, but he delivered strikes to his guys and gave them opportunities to make plays.
00:16:55
Speaker 2: That's a great point, Troy, because I think you have to tip the cap of Trevor Lawrence at some point for standing in on some of those blitzes. We talked about it in the preseason. If you're going to rely on the blitz when you face a good quarterback who can make you pay on that, that's exactly what's going to happen.
00:17:07
Speaker 4: And good receivers that know how to get open. And Jacoby Myers is a guy that Troy knows well. And you saw the smarts, like the game savvy. I don't need to make four moves here. I know he's got to get it out quick. I'm going to settle into a spot. And he did it two or three times. And on that drive that Mike was really hot about, The Jags had it goal to go and got two penalties, not one, two penalties goal to go, and they still converted a touchdown with a great catch by Parker Washington.
00:17:34
Speaker 6: A great catch, back-to-back catches, because the first catch got negated because of the penalty and came back again, threw the ball to him, and he made a heck of a catch there on that one, too, as well, and then got the DPI home marker, but, you know, you declined it because you got a touchdown.
00:17:47
Speaker 2: Well, and keep in mind, that's back-to-back. The one before that, he ran a great route, was open. Trevor Lawrence just didn't hit him in the end zone. Went above his head. So, yeah, Parker Washington had his way right there.
00:17:56
Speaker 3: Any other specifics on the bad list?
00:17:58
Speaker 2: I know we spent a lot of time on the quarterback.
00:18:00
Speaker 4: I think I'm going to let the fans drill who they want to move. I would just say, like, the penalties, you know, Troy talked about after the Marcus Jones interception, Morgan Moses gets a false start. Dobbs follows it up with an OPI. Like, you can't do that. You can't self-destruct. But the end of the first half, Okay, so you throw the pick. You're down 14-3, but you have a chance to get the ball back, and Vrabel's calling timeout. He's trying to get the ball back, and you not once but twice jump offside on defense. Like, that's inexcusable lack of discipline crap.
00:18:33
Speaker 6: No-brainer situation. They call them no-brainer situations for a reason. There's nothing to think about.
00:18:37
Speaker 3: Don't jump.
00:18:38
Speaker 4: That kind of stuff, you know, was really bad. You know, Kyle Williams losing, you know, twice where he is on a kick return. He's out of bounds. Running, you know, he makes a deep ball catch, and he just kind of ran out of bounds.
00:18:52
Speaker 6: Yeah, that kind of stuff, Kyle Williams doing that, you know, just wide open by himself. Easily could have outran those guys to the end zone. But stepped out of bounds. You know, popped Douglas twice on that last drive before the half. We'll talk about that, too, because we can talk about the clock management, too, in those situations and some of the things that went on there. But, you know, he dropped one. Other one, you could say he dropped it. You could say that Drake overthrew it.
00:19:17
Speaker 3: So, wide open. You know, nobody there. So, those are another opportunity to score points there.
00:19:21
Speaker 6: So, just a lot of things I thought they just missed on that– You know, these are the plays they made last year.
00:19:27
Speaker 3: You guys were talking about they made last year.
00:19:28
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think Jacksonville.
00:19:29
Speaker 3: So they're just not making them now.
00:19:30
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think Jacksonville was the better team. Obviously, they were the better team today. I think they are a better team. Based on what I saw today, they are a better team, okay? But there was a path for this game to be more than competitive. And it was a lot of stuff that really didn't have a lot to do with Jacksonville. It had a lot to do with the Patriots making this a blowout. Yeah, yeah. I'd throw Borgalis on there, too.
00:19:49
Speaker 7: Yep, yeah.
00:19:50
Speaker 5: I don't have any faith in him right now. It feels like a coin flip every time he kicks. I know to a certain extent, I've kind of come to this, there's a handful of great kickers that you really trust, and then there's the rest and guys who are kind of up and down. But I think he needs to just get to that point where you can at least trust him to make– inside 50 and then we'll see post 50 but you know just again in that situation where you're coming out and it's like you get a little bit of a drive and you can get some points and maybe and it's just another thing that that knocks you back at the exact wrong time yeah.
00:20:19
Speaker 2: Back-to-back games as well there's one against Steelers yeah and so at some point there's probably going to be a new kicker arriving to you know gotta put some heat on them don't you.
00:20:27
Speaker 6: Yeah yeah can we can we add the Patriots receivers to the bad list too You.
00:20:31
Speaker 2: Can take us wherever you want to.
00:20:35
Speaker 6: You guys are talking during the game about the man-to-man coverage and that type of stuff, and the fact that Jacksonville is not a man-to-man team at all.
00:20:45
Speaker 3: So this is primarily a zone team.
00:20:48
Speaker 6: 80%, 85%, 90% of the time they're playing zone, except for like third and short situations. This game, first down they were playing man, second down they were playing man on these receivers, and they could not get separation. That is a total disrespect to your group that we don't respect you. We're going to change what we do entirely, and we're going to D you up man to man, see if you can get open and beat us and make us change. And they came out and they did it, and they couldn't get open. They couldn't get separation. I think there was a pick on Kyle Williams, right, when he threw the little stop right out to the left side there. That was a pick, I believe. And he ran it back to the four-yard line. That's what he thought was a pick six.
00:21:24
Speaker 4: I thought it was a pick six.
00:21:24
Speaker 3: You have to get into the end zone for it to be a pick six. But, you know, when you're up and your eyes are closed. Here we go again.
00:21:30
Speaker 10: I put it right down.
00:21:31
Speaker 4: What does it matter if it goes to the next play anyway?
00:21:33
Speaker 6: That, to me, if I'm a part of that group, I'm over there steaming right now because we're not performing where we should be performing. This team is doing something that they never do, is play man-to-man defense. And now you're doing it against us, and you're doing it well.
00:21:48
Speaker 3: I'm pissed off.
00:21:49
Speaker 13: Yeah.
00:21:49
Speaker 5: I mean, I think we're going to have a hard time getting through the Drake May criticism this week, but I think the wide receiver and the whole they can't get open and there's no chemistry.
00:21:57
Speaker 4: Protection ain't great either. Let's keep going there, too. Let's call it what it is. I kind of called for, in the pregame show, okay, I'm hearing a lot about improvement here, improvement there, and I'm not calling out any individual guys. It's not a Will Campbell thing, a Morgan Moses thing, or anything else. But I've been hearing a lot about how the protection hasn't been bad. I think they've devoted a lot of resources to make sure the protection hasn't been bad because they don't send a lot of guys out and routes on a consistent basis. So I called for a change in that. Okay, let's see if they can do it. Well, they can't because every time they just went conventional five guys into block, there was trouble. There was trouble in immediate trouble. Josh Heinz Allen was noticeable today. He might have gotten blanked last week in Denver. No pressures, no nothing. He was all over the place today. And again, not under siege for Drake May, but they made him uncomfortable consistently all day. So I think he was part of his problem. I think the protection's part of the problem. Troy illustrated the problems with the receivers not consistently getting open. And then you finally make a catch late in the game when you're getting blown out and your receiver taunts the other guy. Like, this was a disaster. This was a terrible game all around. Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play? Special teams even stunk. They give up a long kick return when the game is, you know, it's like.
00:23:11
Speaker 3: Missed field goal. Missed field goal. Everybody stunk up the place.
00:23:15
Speaker 2: The point on Borgalis, too, You've got Cam Little who almost bangs home a 70. I understand he missed it at the end of the day, but just to that, to have a chance and to know the kicker they have on the other side.
00:23:25
Speaker 4: It's a weapon.
00:23:27
Speaker 3: What is the line in the NFL? What is the line?
00:23:29
Speaker 2: That's two games in a row missing a field goal that you expect him to make.
00:23:33
Speaker 7: Yeah, short ones.
00:23:35
Speaker 4: Like inside of 50, it's got to be 85 plus percent. You can't miss those. And I think that one was inside 40, was it not?
00:23:43
Speaker 3: It might have been 42.
00:23:44
Speaker 4: The missed field goal today?
00:23:45
Speaker 3: I'm not sure.
00:23:47
Speaker 2: The Patriots fans have been blessed with some good kickers. Can you recall, Paul or Troy, your playing experience, anybody here, a situation where your kicker struggles early in the season?
00:23:56
Speaker 3: What is the solution?
00:24:00
Speaker 6: A lot of times it's just on the kicker because it's a mind game with them. Once they miss and they get the yips, the baseball form of the football form of the yips, then it's all in their mind. There's nothing– I've seen coaches like coach the heck out of these guys, do everything with them, and then you start to see these guys.
00:24:16
Speaker 3: That go out.
00:24:18
Speaker 14: And they're doing this, and they're looking at the flags here. They're looking at the flags way at the top of the stadium. They're looking over there at the flags over there, which way they're blowing. Then they're doing this again, you know. It just becomes a mind game with them, and they can never get right. We talked about in the preseason, I played with Scott Sisson, and you guys called him something else, but to me, he was Scott Sisson. Then we had a punter named Pat O'Neal who couldn't really... He got the yips, too. They were rookies together, I believe, and neither one of them can hit the ball. It was the most unbelievable thing you saw. You can't do anything but just stand back and let them try to figure it out, and For those two guys, they never did. And most guys never do. Raw wiser.
00:25:02
Speaker 3: Did I say that right? Yeah, raw wiser.
00:25:04
Speaker 4: Marshall.
00:25:05
Speaker 3: Don't tell anybody.
00:25:06
Speaker 4: He was bad.
00:25:07
Speaker 3: Don't tell anybody. Don't tell anybody else.
00:25:09
Speaker 4: That was bad.
00:25:10
Speaker 3: He was here.
00:25:11
Speaker 7: He never.
00:25:12
Speaker 3: It was that, what, third or fourth round pick for us?
00:25:15
Speaker 4: Yeah, it was a little later.
00:25:17
Speaker 3: Whatever it was, he was a draft pick. He was a drafted kicker.
00:25:19
Speaker 6: He was a drafted kicker. Went out there and never made a single field goal for the New England Patriots. I don't think he ever kicked in a regular season game.
00:25:27
Speaker 4: He never looked right.
00:25:28
Speaker 3: And we wasted a draft pick on him.
00:25:29
Speaker 4: In training camp, we'd watch every day. They end most offensive periods. At the end of the day, they take five, six field goals, whatever. Mike and I would just marvel. He kicks the ball sideways. The ball would go like helicopter. Instead of 12-6, it would be 9-3. I'm like, that.
00:25:47
Speaker 3: Don't look right. This kid was an unbelievable kicker at Marshall.
00:25:50
Speaker 12: Unbelievable.
00:25:50
Speaker 3: That's why he got drafted.
00:25:52
Speaker 4: Such a mental thing.
00:25:52
Speaker 6: And he comes in here and he can't, the ball can't, he better get it off the ground. It wasn't even close to making a field goal. They never kicked a field goal, extra point, anything.
00:26:01
Speaker 3: In the NFL.
00:26:01
Speaker 15: Ever.
00:26:02
Speaker 6: So they just go off the edge, man. They never really come back. So practice squad kicker.
00:26:10
Speaker 12: Yeah.
00:26:11
Speaker 4: Maybe by tomorrow.
00:26:11
Speaker 2: Well, especially, especially when the concern goes back to the preseason.
00:26:15
Speaker 4: Yeah.
00:26:15
Speaker 2: You think that was the Colts game or the Eagles game where he missed that one to win was the Colts, right?
00:26:20
Speaker 4: I block out the preseason.
00:26:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, fair enough. But I'm almost positive it was the Colts game.
00:26:25
Speaker 4: I think he cleaned it up last year after a slow start.
00:26:28
Speaker 5: But, again, it's just you want to have trust in a kicker, and I don't think you have trust in him right now.
00:26:32
Speaker 2: Some more bad. How about third down? Jaguars, 8 for 12. Patriots, 4 for 12 on third down.
00:26:38
Speaker 4: Oh, no, the stats here are not good. Yeah, the offensive third down performance is a continuation. This is three weeks in a row. The defensive one was, again... step back because you're playing an offense that can punch back. This is the first offense you faced. The first game, it was, you know, no Sam Darnold. You know, you see the difference when Sam Darnold, now the Seahawks lost today, but they scored 31 points. You know, that's the difference when you're playing a backup quarterback. Pittsburgh, you know, was just unable to do any of the things that they needed to do offensively. This was the first test, and I don't think the defense was as bad as the offense, but it wasn't good. It wasn't good. Run defense, too. You know, I thought, how many times do we just say, like, geez, they keep getting these five-yard, the easiest five-yard runs you'll see. You know, up the gut. They, you know, both Tootin averaged, yeah, both of them averaged well over four yards a carry today, Tootin and Rodriguez.
00:27:34
Speaker 2: Tootin 15 carries for 73 yards and a touchdown along a 12.
00:27:37
Speaker 4: Yeah, so it wasn't like, oh, he squirted through for a 35-yard run, and that skews the numbers. This was just a methodical four, five yards every carry. So there was nothing that was good today.
00:27:50
Speaker 6: Yeah, I would say that Patriot defense up front, they were soft in the middle. So when Jacksonville wanted to run in the middle, they just kind of knocked them back, and they would get four, five, six yards. Then when they wanted the edge, they got the edge. I mean, it was just simple runs off the edge, nothing fancy, just no edge running. They would get the edge, and then the guy would turn it up, and he would get– 10, 11, 12 yards around the corner.
00:28:10
Speaker 4: And you continue to get some more attrition. You're getting banged up a little bit. Christian Barmore left the game for a short period of time early with a shoulder. He did return. But Greg Van Roten, I don't think, did return. He had a thigh injury in the second quarter replaced by Walter Rouse. So, again, that's part of the protection stuff. I want to be fair. You got a couple of guys banged up on your offensive line. You know, Carlton Davis. It was shaken up. That's the ride. None the worse for where he was right back in the game. But he did come back after missing last week's game. And, again, I thought he was one of the few bright spots. Yeah, I did get the next-gen stats. Those did populate.
00:28:50
Speaker 5: And so, yeah, Jacksonville played about a third main coverage, which, you know, is high for them.
00:28:54
Speaker 4: I'd say higher than their normal.
00:28:56
Speaker 5: The other number that just jumps out to me is Jacksonville having a 47.4 pressure rate, which is astronomically high.
00:29:03
Speaker 3: You have the Patriots pressure rate on there?
00:29:05
Speaker 4: Patriots is 31.3, which is below average. Yeah, so, but again, and I've been, this is three weeks in a row, I'm like, the Patriots, like, they're allowing a lot of pressures on these pass plays, and everybody's telling me how much better the offensive line is, and I'm like, okay, but they're still allowing a lot of pressure, and... I think the whole offense.
00:29:24
Speaker 3: An improvement is not a correction.
00:29:26
Speaker 9: Right.
00:29:27
Speaker 4: And again, you're comparing it to arguably the worst performance you've ever seen in terms of pass protection. That is historically bad, what they did in the Super Bowl. So I think this is... when you have games like this where you get 300 yards and six points, it's not about one thing. We're going to talk about Drake Mayton. He deserves the lion's share of the blame. He's the quarterback. It's ultimately his responsibility to move the ball and score points. But you can't play this bad offensively and have it be about one guy. This is a total breakdown. Another game where they couldn't run the ball at all. Another game where they can't protect the passer consistently. Another game where Troy's receivers can't get open. Troy has been talking about this for three weeks now, and he's dead on. It's a combination of things. It makes it harder. It'd be better if it was just one thing. But when they do get open, Drake misses them. When they're not open and Drake has time, no one's open. Then they drop one.
00:30:21
Speaker 5: Nothing's good. Taking a little deeper, too. 60% man on third down. Drake was 2 of 6 for 30 yards with an interception and 11.1 passer rating against man coverage on third down.
00:30:32
Speaker 3: So what coverage would you play if you were the D.C.? What.
00:30:35
Speaker 4: Would you call it?
00:30:35
Speaker 5: I think they're having trouble separating from right. But, yeah, I'll continue to look through.
00:30:42
Speaker 16: Some of this.
00:30:42
Speaker 3: Until you prove to me something different, then that's what you're going to get. Is that the mindset?
00:30:46
Speaker 6: That's what I'm going to do to you. I'm going to play man coverage on you until you prove to me you can get open. I find some kind of way to hurt us. by playing man coverage.
00:30:57
Speaker 2: And, Troy, I would love if you got some context to what Paul was saying where it isn't just Drake May. I think this is kind of proof that everyone says quarterback, most important position in sports.
00:31:06
Speaker 3: And here we are.
00:31:07
Speaker 2: There's a ton to talk about, but it all feels secondary to Drake May.
00:31:10
Speaker 3: But to your point, Paul, when you're talking about wide receivers.
00:31:13
Speaker 2: That second interception from Drake or Kyle Williams is not a great route.
00:31:16
Speaker 3: And that's where the wide receivers might be letting him down.
00:31:19
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, and I'm looking at Kyle Williams in that particular play. We talked about this in the preseason as well. When this kid is going deep, his releases are unbelievable. You cannot stop him off the line of scrimmage, and he gives you the best release you're ever going to see. When he's not going deep, he gives you what you saw on that particular play, and then at the top of the route, he cannot stop and get out of the break and drive back to the ball. And therefore, the DB is reacting before he does and driving on the play and picking the pass off. So, you know, those are things that Kyle needs to work on and fix. So if they have time to do that kind of stuff. I'm not sure what kind of time they have, but he needs to work on that.
00:31:56
Speaker 2: And just to paint the picture, because unfortunately, like Paul said, we can't show the highlight. What did you see on that one? Was that just that he couldn't get off the ball, slow at the top.
00:32:03
Speaker 16: Of the route?
00:32:03
Speaker 6: Yeah, it wasn't like the guy was hard pressing him, putting hands on him. It was just that he was up there, and then he kind of turned and ran with him as he's driving off the ball. And then you saw like a little irky, jerky type release at the top of the route. He just kind of stumbles at the top or whatever, and not really smooth at the top. and not able to come back to the ball when the ball's in the air.
00:32:24
Speaker 3: And the DB beats him to the point. And that's what I saw.
00:32:27
Speaker 6: So it's just, you know, just stuff that I'm assuming they're giving him a chance to go out there and make a play because nobody else is.
00:32:34
Speaker 16: Right.
00:32:35
Speaker 6: That's why he was in the game. And obviously he's not going deep because of the release. If I'm a DB, I already know he's not going deep. He's doing something like that. So if you study film at all and the release was horrible. And, therefore, I think the DB is just sitting on it waiting for him to come out of the break.
00:32:51
Speaker 3: Where is he going? Inside, outside, or stopping?
00:32:53
Speaker 4: A couple more numbers just kind of confirming what we saw. Patriots rushing four.
00:32:58
Speaker 5: 12 snaps, 8% pressure rate. Trevor Lawrence was 8-11 with two touchdowns and a 134.8 passer rating against four Patriots pass rushers.
00:33:09
Speaker 4: Yeah, so I completely understand why Zach Kord is doing what he's doing. That's what he has to do to manufacture some pressure.
00:33:14
Speaker 15: Yep.
00:33:15
Speaker 4: I don't care how good you are in the back end. You can't cover forever.
00:33:18
Speaker 3: Can't cover forever.
00:33:19
Speaker 6: Even if you're Christian Gonzalez and Carlton Davis trying to cover Parker Washington and Jacoby Myers, you know, today. So which I thought that I thought that our secondary would have the advantage. I mean, covering those guys. But obviously that wasn't the case because they got open when they needed to and kept the sticks moving when they needed when they had to.
00:33:37
Speaker 2: Defensively some preseason concerns already coming to fruition. We're going to get to these calls, a lot to chew on, and I'm sure we are going to get it all here. The phone lines are stacked. Before we get to the calls, let's hear from Legal Seafoods. Legal Seafoods is giving fans a true taste of Boston this season as the official seafood restaurant of the New England Patriots. Pre-game or post-game, get the seafood you love at your local restaurant today. LegalSeafoods.com. Go get some Legal Seafoods. Make yourself feel a little bit better, Patriots fans. We're going to hit the phone lines right now. Christian in L.A. It almost feels right that we are leading off here, and he is the first call. Christian, you are on the Patriots postgame show presented by DraftKings.
00:34:13
Speaker 17: Yeah, hey, you guys. I won't even go through the other two. Hey, you guys. You guys know where I'm going, so there's no need for me to yell. There's no need for me to be bombastic. This is now a guy that hasn't had a good game, a quarterback who hasn't had a good game since before the playoffs. That's all I'll say about Drake May. The regression, he hasn't had a good game since before the playoffs. And the reason that you guys typically give is that, well, he's playing a lot of good defenses. Well, that's a concern. Yes, if he hasn't had a good game since before the playoffs because he's played a lot of good defenses, that's a problem. Secondarily, you're right, Paul. When it's everybody, when it's not just one player, when you're undisciplined, unfocused, And lack of mental toughness, you're right. It's not everybody. It's the coach. So there's, again, something going on with the coach. Maybe he's unfocused because there's something going on in his personal life. I'm not going to say anything else.
00:35:09
Speaker 4: There's a lot to say.
00:35:11
Speaker 17: I could go off, but I'm not.
00:35:13
Speaker 10: No, go on.
00:35:13
Speaker 4: What else could you say?
00:35:15
Speaker 17: I'll talk to you Tuesday.
00:35:16
Speaker 18: Okay.
00:35:17
Speaker 9: All right.
00:35:17
Speaker 3: Thank you, Christian. I could go on, but I won't.
00:35:20
Speaker 4: Well, what else you got to say?
00:35:22
Speaker 3: Nate in Connecticut, what do you got for us?
00:35:25
Speaker 7: Gentlemen.
00:35:26
Speaker 8: What did we just witness with our eyes?
00:35:29
Speaker 18: That was absolute dog shit, I'll.
00:35:31
Speaker 19: Say it here.
00:35:32
Speaker 13: That was terrible.
00:35:34
Speaker 8: But first off, the penalties, right? Back on, great catch.
00:35:37
Speaker 18: Yeah, it's going to be like four-fourths and short.
00:35:40
Speaker 8: Pons the team down 28-3.
00:35:43
Speaker 12: Why would you do that?
00:35:44
Speaker 13: That was a terrible, terrible decision.
00:35:47
Speaker 8: Then we get three off that, but still, we could have gotten a touchdown. And then you think Drake would have learned after that really bad Seahawks interception, back to the end zone. He did it again, targeting Chisholm, and just got picked off.
00:36:03
Speaker 20: It's terrible.
00:36:04
Speaker 8: I'm standing behind Drake May. I do think that he'll bounce back, but it has to happen. I thought this would be the week that things would change. It clearly was not. If this isn't a wake-up call, I don't know what is. Next week versus Buffalo, this has got.
00:36:22
Speaker 11: To be a must-win.
00:36:22
Speaker 8: I think for morale, I think for team, I think we have to have a win-win Next week. Yeah, I think that's all I've got.
00:36:30
Speaker 18: Thank you, guys.
00:36:30
Speaker 3: Appreciate it, Nate.
00:36:31
Speaker 10: Yeah.
00:36:33
Speaker 6: I think it's a must win because it's a division game, too.
00:36:36
Speaker 3: So, I mean, those really count. And you're now two games behind.
00:36:40
Speaker 4: You played three games, and you're already two games behind in the division, right? Three and 0, one and two?
00:36:46
Speaker 20: Yep.
00:36:47
Speaker 21: Yep.
00:36:48
Speaker 4: So, you lose next week. You're four games into the season, three games back.
00:36:51
Speaker 9: Yep.
00:36:52
Speaker 4: A couple of interesting things I'm noticing coming from the locker room too.
00:36:54
Speaker 5: I guess Jared Wilson had cut his hand and there was blood on the football when it slipped out of Drake May's hands. Drake May did not use that as an excuse. He said, I should have held on to it. But I guess Jared Wilson was bleeding all over the football.
00:37:06
Speaker 4: Did someone ask that? I don't know. I can't really discern that. But they have pictures of the ball with blood on it. I'm going to leave my personal comments out of that until I learn more information. Because I'm not using that as an excuse, but But I'm letting everybody know. I don't know if someone asked him, was there blood on the ball? I don't have the information.
00:37:28
Speaker 3: What happened on that play? Why'd you fumble the ball? Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah.
00:37:32
Speaker 5: He was asked if that's why it slipped. He replied, you could say that, but at the same time.
00:37:35
Speaker 4: Okay, so maybe someone saw that there was a lot of blood on the ball. Okay.
00:37:39
Speaker 5: They do have some pictures online of blood on the ball.
00:37:42
Speaker 4: Yeah, and I think we'll hear from Mike Vrabel and Drake May later in the show. Matt Smith will get that stuff together for us, so maybe we'll get to hear some of these comments later.
00:37:51
Speaker 2: Does that make it even more concerning? It's not like you're playing an NFC team next week. You're going up against Josh Allen and the Buffalo Bills to look this poorly.
00:37:59
Speaker 4: I love it. I'll tell you the worst thing about it, and I was telling Mike this when we stepped out because Mike had to get his fourth churro there. My third churro, thank you.
00:38:08
Speaker 7: Whatever, sorry.
00:38:12
Speaker 4: Buffalo played a really bad football game today. Now, they found a way to win in the end, but they were sloppy. We were watching on red zone. They turned the ball over like three times in the first 15, 16, 17 minutes of the game. Too good to play like that consistently. They're going to have their focus a little bit. Hey, we're not quite as good as everybody says we are because they played a bad football game today. Doesn't bode well for next week. Chances are, teams playing at home don't put up two stinkers in a row. Good teams at playing at home don't do that.
00:38:46
Speaker 22: Yeah.
00:38:47
Speaker 6: And with the Patriots possibly down, Barmore, who knows if he's going to return next week, those shoulders or whatever it is, can be tricky about returning next week. So, I mean, another good guy down, you know, for the Patriots. And then, yeah, and Buffalo does a good job, too, with their play calling, where they run the ball and where they pass the ball.
00:39:07
Speaker 3: Josh Allen's an issue.
00:39:09
Speaker 6: You've got to account for him in both passing and running the football. So it'll be a tough task for them next week to get it done. And, again, like you don't want to fall three games behind in your division, you know, because now you're just really shooting yourself in the foot.
00:39:23
Speaker 3: Yeah.
00:39:24
Speaker 4: 15 carries for 45 yards you got out of your primary running game.
00:39:28
Speaker 5: I mean, it's just there's nothing doing it. been nothing doing all year.
00:39:31
Speaker 4: Henderson and Stevenson 15 carries for 45 yards Stevenson 3.1 a carry Henderson 2.9 a carry both of them with a long of 5 nothing no explosive so you get no complimentary aspect to your offense at all because you can't run it running it is just setting up a long yardage situation I just don't know where you go. Nate in Connecticut has faith that it's going to turn around. I don't know where you get that faith based on these three games. Based on the three games we've watched, I don't know how.
00:40:02
Speaker 3: You have faith.
00:40:04
Speaker 6: With your third guard probably coming in now to start for you, I don't know if you're going to run behind him for a better average than 2.2 yards a carry.
00:40:13
Speaker 3: I doubt it. I doubt that very seriously. You got some issues you got to deal with, obviously.
00:40:18
Speaker 5: I mean, I don't want to pull any specific detail out of this game and get too concerned about it, but this is like the second week in a row where I'm kind of getting vibes that Morgan Moses is probably getting towards the.
00:40:28
Speaker 4: End of this thing.
00:40:29
Speaker 3: Yeah, it looks like it.
00:40:31
Speaker 4: Is Caleb Lomo going to be in there sooner than later?
00:40:33
Speaker 2: What you saw at the beginning of the game when the Patriots got stalled out a couple times in those first few drives was Morgan Moses getting beat around the edge.
00:40:39
Speaker 3: And that, to your point, Deuce.
00:40:41
Speaker 4: Trying to slow down a little bit.
00:40:42
Speaker 2: You know, it was just getting beat around the edge. It's not like he was getting overpowered. It was just true speed beating him around the edge in some of those. And that is probably the most concerning part when it comes to Morgan Moses.
00:40:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. Jake in Boston, we're coming to you. Patriots postgame show.
00:40:54
Speaker 12: So on this day, gentlemen, sorry, on the day the season kicked off, Your quarterback dropped news that he was an investor in a non-alcoholic beer, and there was an interview saying how little he liked to drink. One of many sponsor deals for Drake this offseason, certainly more than the improvement put in on his game. If he were my child, I'd be proud, but he's my quarterback, so I'm afraid, like I said before... He doesn't have enough real-life experience to play the most important position in professional sports. And he would have been better served spending those two weeks, instead of going to Japan, maybe in Walpole at the State Pen, getting mentally tough. He's a suburban kid who, again, no real-life adversity. Two parents, upper-middle-class background. So when adversity shows... It's the god-awful body language like we saw at the end of the third quarter. Like, he didn't even look mad. He has not shown any level of emotion. He looks like Eeyore out there, just upset with himself. Woe is me. And it's not Drake versus his head anymore. It's Drake versus this team's horrible karma between the horny coach and the cancel culture owner. It's not really his fault he's got to compete.
00:42:10
Speaker 3: Are you saying if he drank beer? He would play better?
00:42:15
Speaker 4: There are people that... Listen, I'm all for it. You want to spend two hours ripping apart the quarterback? I'm here for you. He's played poor football for the most part for three games. I just don't understand how we take the long road to Grandma's house for things to blame. Like, the coach isn't focused because of his tough offseason, and the quarterback doesn't drink alcoholic beer, so he's not tough enough. He's not mentally strong because he grew up in an upper-middle-class family or whatever. Like, I just don't understand what these things have to do with what you're talking about.
00:42:48
Speaker 3: I think he's saying Drake just didn't get his ass kicked enough as a kid.
00:42:51
Speaker 4: Which, that's all he did as a kid. You know, if you talk to his family.
00:42:57
Speaker 4: Again, I'm here for any and all criticisms of Drake May. I'm the quarterback apologist on this show for the most part. He has been awful. All three games, top to bottom. I mean, there's been pockets of time where he's looked good. Nothing consistent. They haven't moved the ball in any of the three games, and they haven't scored points in any of the three games. You want to rip that? Rip it. I don't understand what that has to do with alcohol. I just don't.
00:43:22
Speaker 2: And the other thing, too, is if you want to critique the amount of football adversity he's gone through, the amount of football he's played, that was a knock on him coming out in the draft. Okay, we can talk about that, but the personal life stuff, and this is just probably a message as the guy who has the steering wheel right now, The first two callers were flirting with it. That one crossed the line. I got a quick trigger. You did this to me. I got a quick trigger now.
00:43:42
Speaker 3: Walk carefully, I will say. How about that?
00:43:43
Speaker 4: I thought he was just going to say, like, I bet he'd like a drink tonight. And then that was kind of a nice ending. But I don't know. It turned into a whole thing.
00:43:49
Speaker 6: Yeah, I would bring Drake a six-pack next week. But you can't have that stuff on NFL properties in the NFL locker room.
00:43:55
Speaker 3: It's against the rules. So you can't do that.
00:43:57
Speaker 4: Oh, maybe I should get that stuff out of my butt light.
00:44:00
Speaker 3: Get out of here.
00:44:02
Speaker 12: Eric.
00:44:03
Speaker 3: Eric, I understand the frustration, but don't make me action here.
00:44:06
Speaker 23: You can take your finger off the trigger.
00:44:08
Speaker 17: You can take your finger off the trigger.
00:44:11
Speaker 4: Guy swearing.
00:44:12
Speaker 23: Yeah, no, no, none of that.
00:44:14
Speaker 20: I think we're coming to the point.
00:44:16
Speaker 7: I don't know.
00:44:17
Speaker 23: Drake May, a schedule merchant. I knew the deep passing statistic that he had last year. I know that weren't going to be attainable for, you know, long-term. You know, teams would catch up. But the regression back to the mean is concerning as far as, the decision-making. Again, obviously, we hit on the receivers. I think, again, it's still early in the season, but it's buyer's remorse, Romeo Dobbs. But the biggest thing I kind of have with the offense is the plays and structure. Obviously, when Drake's able to roll out, obviously he missed pop on that one play down in the red area. But it's just the lack of plays that are in structure that this offense can't seem to connect on offense. And then defensively, I think they weren't, you know, I never was big on the defense.
00:45:01
Speaker 17: I think they're a good defense.
00:45:03
Speaker 23: I don't think they're a great defense.
00:45:05
Speaker 17: But somebody on that defense, somebody's.
00:45:07
Speaker 7: Got to go to the trunk.
00:45:08
Speaker 23: The way those running backs are just putting guys on their bottoms, somebody's got to go to the trunk there on them. I think that was kind of a little bit of egregious. Like I said, they're going to have good games. They're going to have bad games. But for this team not to put... a complete game together in a while is just kind of a little bit concerning. Obviously, like I said, we can hammer down on the quarterback, I think, you know, but some of the guys around him need to help up. Some guys need to step up, but, you know, we went into the season talking about the wide receiver room was an advantage for us heading in, and then just those guys just haven't been able to show up.
00:45:40
Speaker 10: Obviously, A.J.
00:45:41
Speaker 23: Brown isn't there, but, you know, Romeo Dobbs, it's like, if there's not a play out of structure last week, you know, he got his colors big plays in open, but Again, anything in structure just seems like it's got to be high school football for something to happen.
00:45:55
Speaker 17: I'll take it off the line.
00:45:55
Speaker 3: Thank you, guys.
00:45:56
Speaker 7: Appreciate it.
00:45:59
Speaker 3: I'm sorry.
00:45:59
Speaker 6: I need to ask you, what do you mean when you say go to the trunk? I want to make sure we're on the same page here.
00:46:06
Speaker 4: I was trying to figure it out.
00:46:07
Speaker 3: I want to make sure I'm on the same page with you.
00:46:09
Speaker 2: You know, Troy, I end up hanging up on him, but it's probably a good thing.
00:46:12
Speaker 4: I put someone out of their misery. I don't know what we're talking about here. Yeah, so I will say the biggest thing was the very first thing that Eric touched on that has me concerned is like it's not specific to the schedule, but the regression to the mean stuff. And we knew that it wasn't going to be as easy as it was last year.
00:46:31
Speaker 5: But is this the difference? I'm like, the mean is the middle. We're in the bottom right now.
00:46:36
Speaker 3: Correct.
00:46:37
Speaker 6: It is exactly like it was in 2002. The way this team is playing out right now through these first three games, like you just can't ever get in that groove of what you got in 2001 where you just got on the streak and started winning games back to back to back to back to back. Now it's win a game, lose a game. Win a game, lose a game.
00:46:57
Speaker 3: Win the game.
00:46:58
Speaker 6: However this is going to pan out for this football team, it doesn't look like it's going to be consistent like it was last year. It's going to be more like it was in 2002. That's what it's going to be like to me.
00:47:07
Speaker 4: Kind of find myself missing Diggs a little bit here in this game.
00:47:10
Speaker 5: It's just you talk about guys who can separate from man, guys who just had that fiery nature that, you know, I loved hearing Diggs'– And I know that there were other issues, and he kind of tapered off toward the end. And I don't think keeping him was the answer. But today, he would have gotten open a little bit. He might have made some plays that may be broken out of the front.
00:47:26
Speaker 6: And those are the things that quiet a quarterback down, too, as well. Hey, go ahead and just run a curl route. Just run a stop route. Run me an end cut and get open. Run a slant and get open. Let me get into the rhythm of the game as a quarterback. And they don't have that from anybody so far on this football team.
00:47:43
Speaker 9: Yeah.
00:47:44
Speaker 6: That's how you calm a quarterback down is just giving him a simple throw, a simple pattern. You know, nothing he has to read and do all these things besides the one high, two high, whatever it is of his man. Let your receiver go out there and run a simple route for you and pop him on his chest with it.
00:47:59
Speaker 4: Don't you feel like that slant to A.J. Brown was that play?
00:48:02
Speaker 3: Yeah, no doubt.
00:48:04
Speaker 4: All summer, Mike, right? Get it going.
00:48:06
Speaker 7: Boom.
00:48:07
Speaker 4: It's uncoverable. The guy's too big, and they haven't had that. And when he has thrown slants, he hasn't really been accurate. He wasn't accurate on the one that actually got A.J. Brown hurt on, and he certainly wasn't accurate on the one that, even though Dobbs could have caught last week, it's still a ball that's well behind him. Those easy throws, quote-unquote, haven't been easy.
00:48:27
Speaker 5: Do you look at this receiving core different right now? Because I remember in the summer with A.J. Brown in the mix, we felt like, I like their receiving core. I think they've got a really good one. And now it seems like you take the top piece off and nobody can do anything. It shows you the value of having that big dog.
00:48:39
Speaker 7: Yeah.
00:48:41
Speaker 4: Like that's the question. We called it disrespectful.
00:48:44
Speaker 3: Disrespectful, man.
00:48:45
Speaker 4: They're just manning you up. They're not doing anything exotic.
00:48:49
Speaker 6: You can't beat me. We don't play man covers. We're going to do it this week.
00:48:53
Speaker 4: Right, right, right.
00:48:55
Speaker 5: We don't usually like to try, but we think we got you guys.
00:48:59
Speaker 2: Deuce, I can't something about what you said, right? Regression of the mean is supposed to be the middle.
00:49:03
Speaker 4: The mean is the middle.
00:49:04
Speaker 5: This is like regression to a level that we haven't really seen him play this bad this consistently.
00:49:08
Speaker 4: He didn't play like this as a rookie.
00:49:10
Speaker 9: No.
00:49:10
Speaker 3: And something you kept saying.
00:49:12
Speaker 4: It was jittery.
00:49:13
Speaker 11: No.
00:49:14
Speaker 6: Everybody's hopes were through the roof at this time last year.
00:49:17
Speaker 3: Well, not this time. but when he started playing.
00:49:19
Speaker 12: Yeah, yeah.
00:49:19
Speaker 6: You know, their hopes were through the roof when he got in the game and started playing and performing the way he did his rookie year.
00:49:24
Speaker 5: I usually hate that stuff when I went back and looked at him, but it was striking to me.
00:49:28
Speaker 4: I saw some highlights from last year of his best plays.
00:49:30
Speaker 5: Now, these are his best plays, so it's a little bit unfair, but at the same time, it looks like a different guy.
00:49:36
Speaker 4: It looks like a guy who's not concerned with what's going on around him. He's in tune with the offense, and he's delivering the ball on time.
00:49:41
Speaker 3: I can throw this past the booty, and he'll go catch it.
00:49:44
Speaker 4: Today, there was just nothing. And the one thing that Jake in Boston said that I wholeheartedly agreed with was the body language thing. You could see it. He looked like a guy who was probably— It's hard to hide it.
00:49:54
Speaker 3: It's hard.
00:49:55
Speaker 6: When you play out there on the field, you know everybody's watching you, TV, in the stands, whatever.
00:49:59
Speaker 3: They got eyes on you. I know I watch all of that stuff. So, yeah.
00:50:02
Speaker 6: So, like, go back and look at that. Hey, look at Josh McDaniel stepping over Romeo Dolph. I watch all that stuff. It means something to me. You know what I'm saying? So, I watch all of that. And when you see his body language, it's hard to hide. Even though he's probably knowing the cameras are on him, it's hard to hide your body language. And it's telling everybody in this room a lot about how you're feeling right now.
00:50:26
Speaker 3: And probably your teammates, too.
00:50:28
Speaker 2: And that's what's so concerning to me because, Troy, I hope you can add some context as you speak on it because, okay, it's one thing it's Romeo Dobbs, right? That's supposed to be your number two wide receiver coming into the year, right?
00:50:37
Speaker 3: I asked you after that first game, what do you do? What do you say to a guy like that?
00:50:41
Speaker 2: That is supposed to be the leader of not just your offense, of your organization, right, looking like that on the sideline.
00:50:46
Speaker 3: Is there anything you say to him?
00:50:48
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think you saw Mike Vrabel there on the sideline right there after that, what, second interception?
00:50:51
Speaker 3: Second interception. Come on, buddy. Trying to get him to calm down. I couldn't tell.
00:50:56
Speaker 4: I couldn't tell what Breville's message was.
00:50:59
Speaker 6: But then you guys were asking two questions about, did you see tears?
00:51:02
Speaker 3: Was he crying?
00:51:03
Speaker 6: You couldn't really tell what he was doing or what was going on there. But I'm sure as a coach, you're just trying to get him to calm down and to just take it one play at a time at that particular point.
00:51:12
Speaker 3: You're like, don't rush it. Don't force it. Don't do all these things.
00:51:16
Speaker 6: You're not even telling him to let it rip at this point. you're just trying to get him to calm down and come back to the game. And you take the game to them one play at a time. So however, however, Raver was, was, was orating that to him or trying to get that through to him with the words. Like you got, he probably knows him more personally than I do. I was with him that one year, but he's not a very fiery guy, rah, rah type guy. So you got to talk to him in a calm and demeaning way to get him to come back to, to where he needs to be, to have your team have some, some kind of success on the next drive.
00:51:48
Speaker 2: And I was going to ask you what the message to the wide receiver room during this game would be, but I think from everything I've gathered from what you've said, it would be win your one-on-one matchup, and that's just something they couldn't do today.
00:51:56
Speaker 6: We ain't got to dog it.
00:52:00
Speaker 4: Joy, you sound like me.
00:52:02
Speaker 3: You get to freaking get open and catch the ball.
00:52:05
Speaker 4: Potty mouth. Another one, two potty mouths.
00:52:07
Speaker 3: That's not a table ball.
00:52:08
Speaker 4: We're signings over here. You guys in Dayton, Connecticut, the three of you.
00:52:10
Speaker 3: We've got to go to church after this.
00:52:13
Speaker 2: Deuce, and one thing before we go to another caller is you kept saying during the game, right?
00:52:17
Speaker 3: We're talking about when you're coming from up here.
00:52:19
Speaker 4: I know.
00:52:20
Speaker 3: And you want to go back down.
00:52:20
Speaker 2: This is a long way.
00:52:22
Speaker 3: You might just smash through the mean, which is what they've done. You kept saying it feels like you just used all the juice last year.
00:52:27
Speaker 4: The magic juice.
00:52:28
Speaker 5: Where'd the magic juice go? You know, it was like last year. You just had this confidence, and it fed on itself. And, you know, they made plays to earn that. And now it's like the exact opposite. It's like every time something bad happens, you're waiting for something worse to happen. Whereas last year it was, you know, and it's, and it's a different.
00:52:44
Speaker 4: Team, but it's not that much different.
00:52:45
Speaker 5: You know, and that's what it's, I mean, I love this game and that's why it's fascinating to me that this can happen and that a guy like Drake may can look unstoppable at times last year.
00:52:53
Speaker 4: And now like, look like he doesn't know how to play.
00:52:55
Speaker 5: I think you'll get out of this, but man, it's getting tougher and tougher.
00:52:58
Speaker 16: Yeah.
00:52:58
Speaker 3: We, and, and to get back on the whole special teams thing too.
00:53:00
Speaker 9: Yeah.
00:53:01
Speaker 6: It's Kyle Williams returning this kickoff. Like this ball's going out of bounds. You get the ball on the 40. He runs over there, and he catches it at the nine-yard line, I think it was. Somewhere in that episode. Yeah, you got that right. And there was a penalty. I think they got pushed back to the– well, it.
00:53:16
Speaker 3: Wasn't a penalty.
00:53:17
Speaker 6: They got sacked because it was a– was it a fumble snap or something?
00:53:21
Speaker 4: No, he just got killed.
00:53:22
Speaker 3: He just got killed.
00:53:24
Speaker 18: Yeah.
00:53:24
Speaker 3: Well, whatever it was.
00:53:25
Speaker 4: The pass rush was an issue.
00:53:26
Speaker 6: You got a negative play on the first– after making another silly, stupid mistake on a kickoff return, and now you're back on the one-yard line. Those are the kind of things. They just couldn't stop those snowball things from happening. And I think that was after Brayboy had talked to Drake, I believe, right? And none of that stuff seems to do any good because they just keep making bonehead play after bonehead play. And it's just unexplainable right now for me and for Drake May. So I think for the Patriots fans out there, you just got to start praying that things turn around and you know, that A.J.
00:54:03
Speaker 5: Brown's ankle gets better and, you know, the GBR is not too bad.
00:54:09
Speaker 3: They've got to figure it out because it's.
00:54:12
Speaker 4: Going to be at least two more games that you're going to be without. You're definitely without A.J. Brown for at least two more games. So you've got to try to figure this out. I think it's probably close enough.
00:54:20
Speaker 6: You're out with Michael. Michael Wendell is not going to be back probably anytime soon.
00:54:23
Speaker 4: No, never.
00:54:25
Speaker 6: Christian Barmore is probably going to be out, maybe.
00:54:31
Speaker 4: I mean, he came back. We'll see.
00:54:34
Speaker 3: Hopefully we can.
00:54:35
Speaker 4: Have some good news. But the offensive line is an issue in terms of depth. Maybe Ben Brown is more of an option moving forward. Maybe they haven't liked him. I mean, I like him more as a center than a guard, but I don't know. Leave that crap to.
00:54:49
Speaker 3: Jack and his ilk. I don't know.
00:54:53
Speaker 6: Where can you find run blocking? Where can you find pass protection? So these are things that you don't want to be working on during the season. But you have to work on those things. And we talked about this last week, too, as well. How many padded practices can you go when your team is just banged up? So another thing that you have to worry about as a coach. I know you get a certain amount of practices. But can you go full pass Wednesday and Thursday of this week to make sure your pass protection and your run blocking and your short yard is running is where it needs to be. And I don't think you can do that with the amount of injuries that you have, you know, on your defense and up front on your offensive line.
00:55:30
Speaker 3: So the numbers are low.
00:55:32
Speaker 6: If you were trying to save guys to get to the season during the preseason this year. then you're probably going to be doing the same thing during the season, trying to save guys for Sunday as opposed to working on those things.
00:55:43
Speaker 4: It'd be interesting to see if that is the mindset. It'd be interesting if that continues, given if you're 1-3 with Buffalo next week. And you don't have that luxury to be, you know, worrying like the season's coming. You've got to start getting some wins. So you've got to practice.
00:55:58
Speaker 6: Now you've got a serious practice against the push, the tush push or whatever you want to call it.
00:56:04
Speaker 3: They're better than Philly at it. And it's physical.
00:56:06
Speaker 4: So I love to do the red zone stuff and just sort of look at the big picture things. So we're looking at it.
00:56:13
Speaker 3: It's Buffalo.
00:56:13
Speaker 4: And then, you know, you've got the two home games that everybody's already got penciled in for wins, right? It's the Raiders and the Jets after that, Mike? I don't know.
00:56:21
Speaker 18: Right?
00:56:21
Speaker 4: Well, I'm just watching a little of this Raiders-New Orleans game. And not that New Orleans is, you know, any great shakes, but it's 6-3 New Orleans in the early second quarter. And my bigger picture has got nothing to do with the wins or losses, okay? But I'm just watching the Raiders play, and they look more than competent. They look like they have an idea of what's going on. And I just don't know the way the Patriots are playing right now if we can just pencil in wins.
00:56:47
Speaker 22: Oh, yeah.
00:56:48
Speaker 4: I don't care who you're playing. Um, so right now the Raiders, you know, are going to, they're playing to go three, you know, today, you know, you're just like going to overlook that game in a couple of weeks.
00:56:59
Speaker 7: Jets.
00:56:59
Speaker 4: So it's from fight against the Jets. I've been saying all off season added a significant amount of NFL players. They're veterans that are trying to, I think that they brought in a bunch of veterans that are trying to help some of these younger guys learn how to win. Um, they're not going to win a ton of games. They'll probably win five or six games. Um, but they're going to do what they did today in Detroit against a good Lions team. It's 24-24 with two minutes left. Detroit goes down and scores, and the Lions went right down the field and had, I mean, the Jets went right down the field and had a chance to tie it at the end, fell short. I'm not penciling in these wins. Miami, okay, I'll pencil those two in. I'm not penciling in all these other ones.
00:57:39
Speaker 2: Patriots next four at Bills, home against the Raiders, home against the Jets at the Bears. Hey, Troy, I probably got one more snap in me if you're looking for some more line depth. We're going to DJ in Arizona now.
00:57:50
Speaker 3: Sounds good. Going back to the phone lines. DJ, what do you got?
00:57:53
Speaker 24: What is up, everyone? I hope we're all well and good. Even though we lost, I know, I know. But really quick before I get into my take.
00:58:01
Speaker 12: One.
00:58:03
Speaker 24: Everyone that calls in needs to understand you need to watch what you're saying because people are listening in to this, and this is like a family-friendly environment. You can say things, but you can't take it too far. And the second thing, that guy that tried to disrespect Drake May kind of upset me because You don't know the struggles that other people go through. And that's something my mom told me. Like, don't disrespect the grind that other people got to get to to where they are. And he made it to the NFL as a quarterback. So don't say, like, he didn't have because he came up in the suburbs and stuff. That's too much. Like, keep it cordial. But to my take, I will say Andy is a problem. We got to get some pressure on him bringing a kicker. We have to make him feel like his job can be taken. He's a little too loose. And he's missing kicks that should be made.
00:58:49
Speaker 17: Like, I agree with y'all.
00:58:50
Speaker 24: Inside the 50, those have to be made. He missed a chip shot, like, badly. He didn't just miss it. He missed it badly. And then Drake May, I feel like he's just not in his mojo. Like, he lost his mojo, his little swagger. Like, Austin Powers, the little canister, he has to find that drink. it, and get back right to himself. And I think we'll be all right. But my biggest thing that I want to ask you all, do we need to go out? Like let's say we do.
00:59:19
Speaker 17: Bad in this season.
00:59:20
Speaker 24: I'm not predicting the future. But do we need to focus more on O-line than we need to focus on weapons?
00:59:28
Speaker 17: For the offense.
00:59:28
Speaker 24: Cause I feel like we got good weapons. I just feel like we are bad at.
00:59:32
Speaker 20: The old line.
00:59:33
Speaker 24: We can't get no push. We're kind of old. We're kind of beat up. Like what y'all takes on that. I'll take it off the air.
00:59:40
Speaker 7: Go pads.
00:59:40
Speaker 24: Love you guys. Love the show. And thank y'all for what y'all do.
00:59:44
Speaker 6: I would say for me, if I'm picking players, the old line is probably the most important thing to me, uh, uh, ahead of the skill players, because if you can't protect your quarterback, uh, then I don't care who you're throwing to. It's going to be hard for him to stand in the pocket and be able to deliver some good passes and getting guys open. Or if you can't open up holes up front and move people off the ball, your running game is going to struggle if you don't have good offensive alignment to at least give you a crack to be able to slip through. So that to me is like I would definitely try to find– it's hard to find five guys good offensive lineman to put up there. You're always going to have a gap somewhere that you got to kind of help out.
01:00:26
Speaker 3: A little bit here and there.
01:00:27
Speaker 6: Maybe not run behind so much, but you know, I would do everything I could to make sure that offensive line was, you know, somewhat functional and being able to protect my quarterback.
01:00:36
Speaker 4: I mean, it should be better than this. I had my last two first round picks on this.
01:00:39
Speaker 5: They, they gave Elijah Vera Tucker three years, 42 million, 17 million guaranteed. Jared Wilson started all last year at guard. He's moved over to center, which was his natural position. They lost them when you, I mean, they've tried.
01:00:51
Speaker 4: They have two first-round picks and a third-round pick out of their five starters, and one of the other ones is a guy that Mike just accurately pointed. There was a high-money, big-money free agent addition. They should be better than this. You shouldn't have to be providing extra help as consistently as they've done in the first three games to make sure that Drake May is protected. And you absolutely should expect more in the running game.
01:01:15
Speaker 15: Yeah.
01:01:16
Speaker 6: You know, when you talk about when you're paying guys high dollar, yeah, you don't need help. You know, you just, yeah, you need to go out and earn what you're making. So I get that point.
01:01:27
Speaker 2: And to Paul, your point, and then Troy's point, they're getting help. They're helping the offensive line, which means you're keeping in tight ends. You're keeping in running backs. To your point, no one can win in man coverage.
01:01:36
Speaker 3: What do you do?
01:01:37
Speaker 5: It's not a formula for successful offensive football.
01:01:40
Speaker 6: What are you doing out here? So what are we doing? This is professional football. When I say win two as a wide receiver, I'm not talking about three and four yards of separation. That's rarely ever going to happen in this league. If you've got to step on a guy, you're open. So it's up to your quarterback now to step in there and give you something, a ball that only you can catch. So, I mean, expecting to get guys open by three, four, five yards, that's really going to happen unless you're playing some kind of zone defense and you find a hole somewhere. But these guys are usually going to be right on you, and you've got to be able to deliver as a quarterback when that break happens on that route.
01:02:17
Speaker 2: Some emails here. Mack Jones flashbacks from Stefan in Germany. This was an ugly game from the entire team, including coaches embarrassing it in the fourth quarter. The Jags just humiliated the Patriots openly until the Patriots surrendered.
01:02:29
Speaker 3: Going in, I thought the Pats had an outside chance.
01:02:31
Speaker 2: At winning this game, but as it stands, I can't think of any upcoming games that's actually winnable for this team. I'm sure the Patriots are injury-plagued, but that alone can't explain the level of ineptitude shown. If last season had been this way, we could have said, it's his first year, give him time, speak to Vrabel. I'm guessing also probably speaking to Drake May as a starter, but such an implosion is inexcusable. This team looks more like those post-Brady years under Belichick and Mayo than anything we got last season. I am mad beyond words. I couldn't tell, Stefan. That is Stefan from near Frankfurt, Germany. Let's go to Mike in Cincy now. Mike, what do you got for us?
01:03:05
Speaker 17: Hey, how you doing today, fellas?
01:03:06
Speaker 4: Hey, Mike.
01:03:07
Speaker 23: Hey, I think we underestimate the loss of Stephon.
01:03:12
Speaker 17: Diggs and Boutte. I think it's a continuity thing.
01:03:16
Speaker 23: Like, I don't think that Douglas is capable of finding.
01:03:23
Speaker 24: Spots in his own.
01:03:25
Speaker 23: I think that was a Diggs thing.
01:03:26
Speaker 3: Yeah.
01:03:28
Speaker 17: And then I think the only.
01:03:29
Speaker 18: Thing we can do to open it up is to spread it out for the Drake and see everything.
01:03:33
Speaker 17: But I don't know.
01:03:34
Speaker 3: That's all I got. Appreciate you, Mike.
01:03:37
Speaker 6: I think we talked extensively about having Kayshaun and Stephon both being a part of this receiving core and that would have made it a whole lot better than what it is now. You know, I think there was a lot of hope during training camp when those guys were out there all together, you know, and you don't have either one of those guys. And I think they were Drake's favorite targets. But we've talked about that a lot the last– you know, a couple of weeks.
01:03:59
Speaker 7: Yeah.
01:04:00
Speaker 3: You know, I'm now keeping an open mind.
01:04:03
Speaker 2: I was very set in my ways in the upgrades at the wide receiver position. And now, especially even on the topic of Drake May, I'm willing to hear anything. I think in terms of how it's gone early on here. And there's a lot of people who said this stuff. Do they now have points? And are they proven right here early on in the year? Where in a moment like this, you'd pay money for a Stephon Diggs third and eight completion right now.
01:04:27
Speaker 5: I think what I find myself wondering, and I'm not somebody who lamented the loss. You know, Keishon Budi had two catches for 21 yards today. But I do think there's something to be said for the mental aspect of Drake May not knowing.
01:04:40
Speaker 4: These receivers, not trusting these receivers yet.
01:04:41
Speaker 5: So, you know, whereas like just the talent in terms of like when you're looking at the roster, I might look at it.
01:04:46
Speaker 4: And say that's okay.
01:04:47
Speaker 5: But when you really get into the real connections and trust that Drake has, which are intangible things, I think those are two things that do not exist right now for him. We hope that he was developing that chemistry with Romeo Dobbs. It looked like he was in training camp a little bit. I mean, he had, you know, I don't know, over a week where he was making catches and, you know, celebrating throwing the ball in the air.
01:05:06
Speaker 4: It looked like it was all coming on.
01:05:08
Speaker 5: We were all went from small seasick concern to we feel pretty good about this.
01:05:12
Speaker 4: We felt good about the whole thing.
01:05:13
Speaker 5: But I think everything is valid to question right now because it looks completely broken.
01:05:18
Speaker 6: And I think, just trust me, Drake May right now is not feeling very confident about these guys. Because when they didn't get open today, it did nothing to build his confidence in them for next week.
01:05:27
Speaker 4: And when they did get open, he missed them.
01:05:30
Speaker 3: He missed them. Or they dropped it.
01:05:32
Speaker 4: I know that you can say, well, Douglas got his hand up, but he's wide open. Is there any reason that he needs to jump and try to make that catch on that ball? And that's a Sort of a game-changing kind of play. You get a touchdown.
01:05:45
Speaker 3: As a quarterback, you've got to know who you're throwing to.
01:05:47
Speaker 6: If that's Matt Collins, then that catch is made. But it's Pop Douglas, and it's a little too high for Pop Douglas.
01:05:53
Speaker 4: I'm not trying to make excuses for Douglas, but he got open on that play. He got open on the play that got him down there before that.
01:05:59
Speaker 3: He was open on the play before, but he dropped it.
01:06:01
Speaker 4: Yeah, that is true. He did have the drop before that. But I think they need to be better all around. The passing game is, to me, first and foremost on Drake May. I think the protection has let him down at times. I think the receivers have let him down at times. But this is on Drake May. And, again, until he gets fixed, I don't think you're going to see dramatic improvements. Again, I don't know where people are just automatically seeing, well, this is going to turn around. I kind of felt like that today. I thought you'd see a better performance by the offense today.
01:06:32
Speaker 7: You didn't.
01:06:33
Speaker 8: No.
01:06:33
Speaker 4: You didn't. You're going to have to show me.
01:06:35
Speaker 2: And that's what stands out to me. Paul's made the point multiple times now. It's just uncomplimentary. You know, you think about the two throws that are sticking in my brain right now are the Pop Douglas miss, which I personally, in my opinion, that one feels like it's on Drake May. You're talking about, you know, KYP, know your personnel. Then the Mack Hollins in the end zone where his hands aren't, that's a catch that's made last year. And that's a catch where if that's caught, he gets two feet down, two toes down.
01:07:00
Speaker 3: That slim margin is the NFL.
01:07:03
Speaker 4: You know what I mean?
01:07:03
Speaker 2: That's that tight window that he put it right where the defender couldn't get it, but right where his guy could get it, and it wasn't made.
01:07:09
Speaker 3: So it's just uncomplimentary.
01:07:11
Speaker 2: Becca in Norfolk, Massachusetts had the same idea right as we– it was almost fitting. I pull up her email talking about Sellers and Morris on Kayshaun Booty as we start talking about it. So we answered her question for her. And, Troy, you have anything to add there?
01:07:22
Speaker 6: No, I'm just saying, like, you look at– we're watching the highlights here on the red zone as we go along throughout the day. And you see Joe Burrow just lay it up to T.
01:07:29
Speaker 3: Higgins, cover it.
01:07:31
Speaker 6: But he finds a way to make the play, you know, sitting on his butt. Garrett Wilson, you see him just throw the ball down the sideline to him. One-on-one with his guy, he finds a way to get in position to make the catch on his butt at the pylon. So sometimes as a receiver, you've got to take the responsibility of, like, Just throw the ball to me.
01:07:51
Speaker 3: I'll find a way to make the catch for you.
01:07:53
Speaker 4: Geno Smith was 31 for 37 with 300-plus and three touchdowns in that game today. You telling me they have more to offer offensively than the Patriots do?
01:08:01
Speaker 3: No doubt.
01:08:02
Speaker 6: I'm with you on that. Sometimes as a receiver, you've got to put it on yourself. I've got to go ahead and make something happen. I've got to change the course. For my football team. Even like with me, like when I was out, like if I was struggling offensively, I knew I had punt return coming. Like I got to do something on this punt. You know, even like the coach is like, go make something happen. Scar used to always tell me, make something happen. You know what I'm saying? Bring your magic. You know, and then like punt return, I go out there and we, well, we as a team, as a group that's on that punt return team, we go out there and make something happen and hit a big return.
01:08:32
Speaker 3: And then it changes the fortunes of your team. Sorry, real quick.
01:08:35
Speaker 5: I mean, the hard thing, too, is they got 29 points this season, offensive points this season in three games, and there's just been nothing positive to latch on to, to celebrate, to get some momentum going, to feel good about it.
01:08:45
Speaker 4: But there's been nothing. It's been such a grind. There has not been a stretch of any of the three games where you said, well, they got it going.
01:08:52
Speaker 3: 29 points total in three games?
01:08:55
Speaker 6: They averaged 28.8 as an offense last year.
01:08:58
Speaker 4: 10 in the first game, 13 in the second game, 6 today.
01:09:02
Speaker 3: A few times they did, Paul, shot themselves in the foot.
01:09:04
Speaker 4: Yeah, but even that.
01:09:06
Speaker 4: I don't know how you guys feel. When they get in position, it's like a double pass trick play that the wide receiver almost gets sacked. Then he throws it to Travis Hunter. It deflects in the air to Matt Collins for 16 yards. Nothing looks good ever. Aside of the very beginning of the game against Pittsburgh, the first three plays, I think, resulted in first downs against the Steelers last week. And then they fumbled. They have not had very many good drives.
01:09:35
Speaker 9: No.
01:09:35
Speaker 4: Even when they score, it's a slog.
01:09:38
Speaker 3: It's a slog, yeah.
01:09:40
Speaker 4: It's just that they've not looked cohesive in offense in any of the three games.
01:09:44
Speaker 2: Plenty more calls and emails to get to after the break, but we're going to take a short one for halftime here in the Patriots postgame presented by DraftKings.
01:09:52
Speaker 3: We'll be right back. Hope you stay with us.
01:09:53
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Speaker 5: It doesn't necessarily impact the floor of the office.
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01:15:07
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01:15:18
Speaker 4: Building the Next Legacy.
01:15:20
Speaker 5: Guys, usually we pick a play or a player off of this game to build the next legacy around, but not today. Today we're burying the football on this segment. We're going to bury this football, move on from this game, not take anything from it. I think that's the best thing we can do to all feel better for this team. Hopefully hit the reset button for Drake May, but Building the next legacy. It's all about burying this football today.
01:15:40
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01:16:27
Speaker 15: Got to get something off your chest about that game? Call us at 855-PATS-500 or email us at podcast at patriots.com. This is the Patriots Post Game Show presented by DraftKings.
01:16:40
Speaker 2: Welcome back into the Patriots Post Game Show presented by DraftKings. Patriots Hall of Famer Troy Brown. We got Deuce. We got Paul. I'm Jack Webb. We got Matt, Matt, and Ace in there behind the scenes. And you've heard us talk enough. Let's go to Mike Vrabel and hear what he had to say after this Patriots loss.
01:16:57
Speaker 10: What's your concern level with Drake?
01:16:59
Speaker 7: Well, my concern level is very high for this football team. I just want to coach and improve. So I think that's the biggest thing is when you come off a game like that, that you just want to get back and work. There's nothing you can do about it. But we have to take care of the football. I mean, we can't force things. We can't do things in all three phases that, you know, end up, you know, getting it beat. Certainly we have to fix a lot of things.
01:17:30
Speaker 5: His decision making was a strength last year and through the first three games it feels like it has not been.
01:17:37
Speaker 7: It doesn't feel like it hasn't been. We haven't made good decisions with the football. We have to get it fixed. We have to practice. We have to work and get it corrected. Everybody else has to do much better. And it's starting with me. I mean, that's what it, that's how it goes. We starts with me and I got to, I'm going to get guys in there to do the, do the things the way that we need them done and the identity. And, you know, there's going to be mistakes, but you know, there's too many things that get us beat turnovers, not taking advantage of their turnover opportunities, penalties, you know, sudden change things that we're, you know, we're usually good at. And so we'll have to figure out why. And, uh, and do it in a hurry, going on the road to Buffalo.
01:18:23
Speaker 2: You feel like your quarterback is almost like baseball in a slump right now?
01:18:30
Speaker 7: Again, I think he knows what to do. I think we have to do it better. Again, we all want to make plays. We just have to make them good ones. If it's not there, we've got to make a great decision. I think sometimes you can want it too badly, and we can... can't force anything.
01:18:51
Speaker 10: Mike, are you seeing this type of performance in practice?
01:18:55
Speaker 7: I mean, again, I think our practice consistency on all levels, in all three phases, has to improve. I mean, I think that that's just, you know, we feel like the practice execution leads to game reality. You have to build confidence throughout the week, and we have to continue to do that and translate that onto the football field on Sundays.
01:19:17
Speaker 17: Just to be more.
01:19:18
Speaker 7: Specific, the turnovers.
01:19:19
Speaker 5: Have you seen played like we had today, the turnovers in practice?
01:19:23
Speaker 7: No, I mean, I wouldn't say that the ball's been turned over like it was here today in practice.
01:19:28
Speaker 10: Do you think Drake's confidence is shaken?
01:19:31
Speaker 7: I mean, I think you need to ask Drake that. I'm not inside of his. I don't have control of the player's psyche. We're professional football players. We're professional coaches. We have to prepare. We have to be willing to, like we said, prepare to start fast. You have to be also prepared to compete and take advantage of the opportunities, not miss kicks, score touchdowns in the red zone, get red zone stops. It just was everything. It starts with me. I'll have them better prepared. I'm going to I'm going to commit to improving this football team and the guys that we have here. I think it's one day at a time. It's about what we can do to get healthy, what we can do to improve individually and as a football team. That's all we can do. It's going to start with me and my ability to teach, my ability to get the guys in the right spots, and then also have a practice plan that I feel like gives us the best chance to be ready on Sunday.
01:20:49
Speaker 4: I kind of think that could happen next week.
01:20:52
Speaker 2: Gentlemen, anything that stands out after that three-plus minutes of Mike Vrabel postgame?
01:20:57
Speaker 4: Frustration. I feel the frustration.
01:20:58
Speaker 5: I see the frustration, and I understand the frustration based on how his team has played through three weeks.
01:21:04
Speaker 6: Yeah, we all want to make plays, just make good ones. I heard this week also, what else did I hear this week? I heard him also talk about do your job. So it's like you're going back and digging into the archives of things that were said to us when we were teammates by other coaches. So these things are now still coming back to, you know, to him, you know, reiterating those things to his football team because they are the foundation of what makes your football team good you know and kudos to him for like bringing those things up with them what was the last one we just heard just now.
01:21:41
Speaker 4: Well i think someone asked about the quarterback's confidence he's like you could talk to drake about his confidence like which i was kind of surprised about um but right off the top um you know and it's a one of the comments i've seen on twitter too you know like I'm on my urgency for the team. My level of concern for the team is very high. The team is very high. He's pulling no punches. September is an extension of the preseason. This isn't what's going on right now. This is concerning.
01:22:17
Speaker 2: Something that I thought of hearing him talk and just thinking about the quarterback is The way it unraveled today, the way it just turned ugly, right, and just some of the boneheaded mistakes you saw across the board, and we've had a couple callers want to blame.
01:22:31
Speaker 3: The head coach.
01:22:32
Speaker 2: When the head of your– the face of your franchise is playing the way he did today, looking like the way he did today, has the body language the way he did, that seemed to affect everybody across the board. And I think there's something to be said for that in terms of Drake Mays, I guess slump, whatever you want to call it, whatever you want to call this current situation, he's in the lack of confidence.
01:22:56
Speaker 3: And mojo and swagger that we've seen.
01:22:58
Speaker 2: It seems to be affecting everyone across the board.
01:23:00
Speaker 3: At least it did in the second half today. Yeah, it does.
01:23:02
Speaker 6: Like I said, for me, as a player, I'm reading that as, you know, when I'm looking at the leader of my football team coming to the huddle, is he calling these plays with confidence? Is he making eye contact with me the way he should be making contact? Is he giving us like a let's go boys type pep talk before we leave the huddle? All those things mean a lot to your players. If that's all gone and disappeared, then I don't think the players are going to have that type of enthusiasm about going to run those plays. I'll give you an example of when Tom Brady came into the huddle.
01:23:33
Speaker 3: He was ready. He was ready to go.
01:23:36
Speaker 6: Now, we didn't end up winning that game, but The enthusiasm and the level of anticipation of going out and playing well that Tom Brady had when he came into the huddle that first game. What does that do to the program? We know that he's ready, so we know now that we've got to raise our level of play here as receivers, running backs, linemen, or whatever it is, that we've got to go out and lift this young man up so we can go out there and get a win today. And that's what we did. And the same thing. You know, the last drive we had against the Rams in the Super Bowl 36, they said we should take a knee. Tom came into the huddle after Drew Bledsoe told him, like, screw that, go win the game.
01:24:21
Speaker 3: You know what I'm saying? We went out there.
01:24:23
Speaker 6: He called the first play. He called the first play in the huddle, and he called it with confidence. I looked right in his face, and I wanted to see what he looked like.
01:24:30
Speaker 3: And he was ready.
01:24:31
Speaker 6: And at that point, I kind of had a good feeling. that we were going to get ourselves in a position to make that field goal, get ourselves in a field goal range to make a kick there. So that means a lot when you see a quarterback not hanging his head, not slouching over, not looking around, you know, whatever it is, or tears in your eyes, whatever may have happened.
01:24:48
Speaker 3: You know, he didn't have that.
01:24:50
Speaker 6: It was just a look of confidence and his voice sounded like he was a confident man out there running those plays.
01:24:55
Speaker 2: And, you know, obviously your point of reference is the greatest quarterback of all time, so you might not have experienced this. But when it's the opposite, right, when Drake May is– in his own head and in that state that we saw him on the sideline today, staring into the abyss, what is the reverse effect of that?
01:25:09
Speaker 6: Yeah, like I said, you as a team, as a teammate of his, you feel that. Looking at the leader of your football team, you know, not being as vocal with the team or as seem like he's a part of the team.
01:25:24
Speaker 3: You feel it as a player.
01:25:25
Speaker 6: You don't feel like he's confident in what he's doing right now, feel like he's not confident in me maybe, whatever it may be. So you're going to go out and your performance is not going to be where it should be. You're not trying to lift him up as a quarterback either because you just don't see that look of confidence in his body language.
01:25:42
Speaker 2: And you can imagine how this affects a huddle with, Garrett Wilson, I mean Garrett Wilson.
01:25:47
Speaker 12: I wish.
01:25:48
Speaker 3: Sorry.
01:25:50
Speaker 2: Garrett Wilson in his second year moving to center, struggling a little bit. Will Campbell in his second year. Caleb Lomu at times, right, a rookie. Kyle Williams in his second year. This isn't a huddle with veteran receivers like you had last year, right, with Diggs and some of these guys that you could look across and that could almost bring the confidence themselves. Half that huddle is filled with guys who are also, you know, maybe unsure of themselves and to the point of, you know, can I go make a play?
01:26:16
Speaker 22: Yeah.
01:26:16
Speaker 9: Yeah.
01:26:16
Speaker 5: I think that's valid. I mean, I just, I also think that like, I want that. I wanted them today to pick Drake up. Like Drake's had a rough start. People have been all over him for the first couple of games. They wanted to see some of the, you know, team playing up for him and trying to pick him up. And it's just so hard when it's a comedy of errors and you're kind of taking turn. All right, your turn to make a mistake. You know, those kind of games I've seen him plenty over the years, but hopefully he's able to pull himself out and his teammates are able to help pull him out. But, you know, getting that thing with, with digs resonated me a little bit because, Diggs had a swagger to him and he brought in, there was a confidence that he brought to this team last year. And, you know, I think it's going to be interesting to go into Buffalo because it's such a disparity from last year with Diggs and making those plays and into a hostile environment. And, you know, that win, I don't know if that was his coming out parties. I think we heard on the TV today, but it was certainly a big, you know, moment in that team last year where they really came together. I don't know if they can do that again. I really feel right now, like it's a long shot for them to do it again, but it's just interesting to walk in early October again, what different position this team is right now.
01:27:15
Speaker 8: Yeah.
01:27:15
Speaker 3: Great point, Deuce.
01:27:16
Speaker 2: And in that game, when you were coming to Buffalo a year, a year ago, he was on a mission. Stefan Diggs on a mission. He said, just basically give me the ball, do the rest.
01:27:23
Speaker 3: Give me the ball.
01:27:24
Speaker 20: Yeah.
01:27:25
Speaker 6: Give me the ball. Call a play and I'll get open for you. I don't care what the route is. I'll get open for you and throw me the ball. Any pass in my direction is a good throw. Yeah, they certainly need a guy like that right now. We'll, Hear from Drake May.
01:27:36
Speaker 2: Shortly first, let's get a message from our friends at Aaron's, the official lawnmower of the New England Patriots. He's proud to help Patriots fans get back to football. Visit aarons.com to find your Aaron's. Let's hear from the quarterback among some other players after the game.
01:27:52
Speaker 7: You know, I think.
01:27:56
Speaker 27: The ball starts rolling like that. We can't get out of our own way and can't get out of my own way personally. So I've got to look myself in the mirror and look um, and, and take this as a turning point. You know, it's, you know, week three at the same time, we gotta have some fuel and, and realize that, uh, what we're doing out there offensively is, you know, it's unacceptable, unacceptable for, for three weeks. So, um, I gotta, um, you know, start with myself and then leave these guys and we gotta get back after it. Um, yeah, the first one, um, Jared happened to be bleeding on his hand and got the football and was trying to put one to Kyle and um, slipped out of my hand. Um, the second one down there is just forcing it, try to give Chiz a chance, you know, to score and get some momentum, you know, going into halftime and then, um, had a one-on-one matchup backside and, um, you know, shouldn't have probably shouldn't, shouldn't have thrown it.
01:28:53
Speaker 7: Old fashioned ass whooping.
01:28:54
Speaker 3: It is what it is.
01:28:55
Speaker 16: Um, we didn't play well, um, on all three phases, um, Defense, 5-5 in the red zone. We didn't get a stop at all there. We didn't stop the run, so they kept running the ball. Hats off to them. Trevor Lawrence played incredible. We're not going to complain or anything like that. We've got to come together.
01:29:15
Speaker 3: We understand what's ahead of us.
01:29:18
Speaker 16: We've got to hear all the noise or whatever it may be, but I think the main thing for us as a team, we're going to have to ignore all that noise and get back to work. That's the only way we can improve and and try to go get a victory in the world against a really tough opponent in Buffalo.
01:29:31
Speaker 7: Marcus, you've been here through bad days through good days. You obviously know that's a really good coaching staff here, and you've got good players.
01:29:36
Speaker 10: What type of week is this.
01:29:37
Speaker 7: For you guys as far as turning the page to get ready to.
01:29:39
Speaker 6: Go play at Buffalo?
01:29:40
Speaker 16: Yeah, it's definitely a bounce-back week when it comes down to it.
01:29:44
Speaker 22: You know, it definitely challenges the situation of our leadership.
01:29:47
Speaker 7: You know, captains and everything, we know what we have.
01:29:50
Speaker 4: Locker room.
01:29:51
Speaker 7: When it comes down to it, we've got to stick together. We all know that. Like I said, we're going to get back to practice, do the things that we need to do, and then go from there.
01:29:58
Speaker 5: Physically, the right shoulder just going back to the Super Bowl, do you feel like that has any lingering effect.
01:30:05
Speaker 27: This season for you? I like to say when you have that much time off and you get to focus on getting back that you're going out there healthy. You're going to get banged up every now and then, but at the same time, a lot of guys are banged up. Looking forward to Getting back to playing winning football. That's the main thing. And knowing that I'll play a big role in that and taking the bull by its horns.
01:30:28
Speaker 16: You know, as a coach and as a leader, you know, we can't let anything slide. So I'm pretty sure he's going to be extra on all the details this week. He's going to be very animated at practice, but rightfully so. You know, you get your behinds kicked. It's a reality check. You know, we need to check on every single thing and how we're doing. You know, what we're doing in the meeting rooms, what we're doing on our practice field, every single thing has to be addressed. And so not necessarily saying that we were doing anything wrong, but we just need to take it up another level.
01:30:55
Speaker 3: Let's go. Thoughts?
01:30:59
Speaker 4: Drake seems rattled. He seems like, I feel right now. I didn't love the answer to the shoulder question. Is there an issue with the shoulder? Or, you know, you're all banged up. Wait a minute, you got hurt last year in the playoffs. It wasn't serious enough to have surgery, so you had the whole offseason to recover. You sort of left the door open that maybe there is some lingering. I don't think there is, but I think the way he answered the question kind of made you wonder.
01:31:24
Speaker 5: It'll be a follow-up tomorrow, I imagine, on the radio show.
01:31:28
Speaker 4: I don't know. Maybe on my show.
01:31:29
Speaker 18: I agree.
01:31:30
Speaker 3: That was not a great answer.
01:31:31
Speaker 7: Oh, okay.
01:31:32
Speaker 3: That was not a great answer to the question. I'm not alone.
01:31:35
Speaker 6: Yeah, you left the question open to whether or not you feel 100%, whether or not you can put zip on the ball, whether or not you can throw the ball with confidence. So you left that door open to everybody now to, like, come through and, like, are you okay?
01:31:51
Speaker 3: Constantly.
01:31:53
Speaker 6: Bombarding you with those questions about the health of your arm because of the way you've looked so far to the start of the 2026 season.
01:32:01
Speaker 2: I feel like a young quarterback in a press conference, you know, who's, who's feeling a little down that as he gets those questions might realize, you know, maybe a learn, maybe a, maybe a media training learning experience right there for Drake.
01:32:11
Speaker 4: Yeah, perhaps.
01:32:12
Speaker 5: I mean, but it's, it's clear the looks all over his face about how he's feeling right now after the way he played. And you could only, I mean, it's just, It just seems to get harder with each game like this to pull yourself out of it. It feels like the darkness is trying to pull you down to a crappy season, and you've got to fight to try to get back. They were 1-2 last year, but it feels a lot different this year, this 1-2. Even though the second loss to the Steelers was pretty bad with how we played the turnovers and all that too, but this has just been a full team kind of letdown where it's like, take this out and they'd be okay.
01:32:41
Speaker 4: There's no take this out and.
01:32:42
Speaker 3: They'd be okay. He also left the door open too. He opened the door. to the blood on the football thing.
01:32:49
Speaker 4: Yeah, which I thought was kind of odd.
01:32:51
Speaker 3: Yeah.
01:32:52
Speaker 4: But, yeah, just looking at some of the Q & A with that shoulder thing, you know, we heard Mike Reese ask the question, and he gave the answer about, you know, bumps and bruises, everybody's banged up, just got to take the bull by the horns. There was a follow-up to that. Does your shoulder feel as good now as it did before that injury? Yeah, I wouldn't say that there's a problem with my shoulder. Like, isn't the answer to that question, I'm healthy, my shoulder's fine. I wouldn't say there's a problem with my shoulder. I think there's times where you, I think there's times where I think you look back and you look back on the playoff run in that Denver game, and when I took the hit into now, it felt good during training camp and continued to let it loose. Like, I'm left confused as to whether or not part of the reason we're not seeing a lot of zip on the ball is because is physical or not? I don't know. Based on these answers, I don't know. I was one of the ones saying, no, we had the whole year. We had some calls saying he doesn't look healthy. And I'm like, he had the whole year. Like, I don't know. He's not, he's not dismissing it, but I am looking at it more. I'm less concerned of whether or not he's healthy is the fact that he's talking about these things.
01:34:06
Speaker 13: Yeah.
01:34:06
Speaker 4: Well, there's possibilities.
01:34:07
Speaker 5: I think he's just mentally rattled both on the football field and off the football field right now. And, Like, to me, it seemed like he was searching for answers, and he's kind of stumbling over words like he's fighting it.
01:34:17
Speaker 3: Those answers are just too vague for me, man.
01:34:19
Speaker 6: Like, either your arm feels good, either your arm doesn't hurt, or it hurts. Like, for me, like, yeah, I don't feel an issue. I don't feel anything in my shoulder. That's what you should say, like, if that's the case. Right now, you're saying, like, not really sure if my shoulder is hurt. But it feels fine, though. I just don't know if it does.
01:34:42
Speaker 4: I'm less confused as to how he's feeling.
01:34:46
Speaker 20: What?
01:34:46
Speaker 4: To be honest with you, it's like a word salad.
01:34:48
Speaker 2: Deuce, I think you're spot on. I think he's just rattled. I mean, you saw the way he looked out there, both on the field and some of those decisions, and then on the sideline.
01:34:56
Speaker 3: I'm just tying it right to that guy on the podium.
01:34:57
Speaker 4: Right, I'm tying it on the field.
01:34:58
Speaker 5: The guy that's kind of getting rattled on the field and unsure what to do is the same guy that seems like he's getting a little rattled at the podium and not sure what to say.
01:35:07
Speaker 4: I think it all kind of goes hand in hand.
01:35:08
Speaker 2: The way he looked in the sideline, you dropped him behind the microphone. I guess that definitely checks out, right? Let's try to clear some of these phone lines. We're nearing the end of the show. Matthew in Arizona, what do you got for us, Matthew?
01:35:20
Speaker 11: Hey, so I had a lot of time to think. I was waiting for quite a while. But to me, with Drake May, progression isn't linear, but regression is. So I'm a little bit worried about him.
01:35:30
Speaker 13: But my quick hot take is that next game against the Bills, he's looking the way he's looking now. give DeVito the next two games against the Raiders and Jets, bring Drake May back in when the A.J. Brown's ready, whether it's against the Bears or the Dolphins, kind of like the Panthers did with Bryce Young. I don't know about the rest of the team, what they need to work on, but that's just my take on the whole situation.
01:35:53
Speaker 3: All right, Matthew. I apologize, man.
01:35:55
Speaker 2: That was a little jab at me, I think. You said, I've been waiting for a while.
01:35:58
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's on me. You're a better man than I am. I would have hung up.
01:36:03
Speaker 2: We'll get to you sooner next time, Matthew. But who do they go from Bryce Young?
01:36:07
Speaker 3: Who'd they go to? Didn't they have like Andy Dalton or like a veteran guy?
01:36:09
Speaker 4: Yes, it was also his rookie year.
01:36:11
Speaker 15: Yeah.
01:36:12
Speaker 4: Like it's different. It's with three years.
01:36:13
Speaker 3: Three years, yeah.
01:36:14
Speaker 2: And you're... You've got to see, if you're going to think about paying this guy a contract in the offseason, you're keeping him.
01:36:19
Speaker 3: In the ballgame.
01:36:20
Speaker 4: And also, they had a veteran in Andy Dalton. I think it was Andy Dalton. Am I wrong on that? They had a veteran that could go in there and sort of steady the ship a little bit. And they gave Bryce Young a little more time. I don't think people are wondering, is Drake May ready to play yet? That's what the concern was with Bryce Young. He wasn't ready yet. Bryce Young was a rookie... who started day one, and then it didn't go well for a month, and they decided to wait a little while and then give him some time off. Like, if you take the quarterback out now, you're saying you don't know if you have the guy. And I don't think that's the case. I think they think they have the guy, but they have to get him playing better.
01:37:00
Speaker 3: I agree. I agree with that. I couldn't say it any better. Connor, Massachusetts. Don't know where in Massachusetts, but somewhere.
01:37:11
Speaker 12: Connor.
01:37:11
Speaker 20: Connor.
01:37:12
Speaker 3: Conor.
01:37:13
Speaker 4: So you made him wait a long time.
01:37:14
Speaker 3: Conor's a goner.
01:37:15
Speaker 4: Give me a moment to give a little stat here because I think two people on the panel will find this especially interesting.
01:37:21
Speaker 5: Patriots' 29-point loss today was Mike Vrabel's second-largest loss as a head coach. He lost by 34 with the Titans at the Bills in 22. But Drake made six interceptions are the most through three games by a Patriot since Drew Blitzo in 1994.
01:37:32
Speaker 15: 1994.
01:37:32
Speaker 3: Year two.
01:37:32
Speaker 4: What are you going to do?
01:37:33
Speaker 9: Yeah.
01:37:37
Speaker 3: That's your guy, Paul.
01:37:38
Speaker 4: It's Zolak in there.
01:37:40
Speaker 7: It's Zolak.
01:37:40
Speaker 4: Show me something. Let's all add a little of that playmaker right now. He's like 28 touchdowns. He's not going to care though, right?
01:37:47
Speaker 3: He can let it rip now. He had a big arm.
01:37:49
Speaker 4: He also threw for 4,500 yards that year.
01:37:51
Speaker 6: He threw 70 passes against Minnesota.
01:37:55
Speaker 5: Did you ever see Drew's confidence shaken even though he was a guy who would make mistakes?
01:37:59
Speaker 23: Oh, no.
01:38:00
Speaker 4: He needed to have a little more humility with some of the passes he threw.
01:38:03
Speaker 10: My guy, Drew.
01:38:04
Speaker 2: Ron, in New York, you are on the Patriots postgame show presented by DraftKings.
01:38:09
Speaker 20: Hey, guys. Thank you for taking the call. With Drake, I think when you have that superior upper echelon quarterback talent, you expect that guy to elevate the play of those around him.
01:38:21
Speaker 18: Agreed.
01:38:21
Speaker 20: And I think that it's just the opposite with Drake. It's been his play specifically that's been under my single-handedly taking points off the board with these interceptions in the end zone and just these inexplicable turnovers you can't have your best guy the face of your franchise be the one that's consistently putting the team in jeopardy and that just it's becoming more of a trend and i hope that that's something that they can change i have noticed watching him that he appears to be make up his mind where he's going to go with the ball pre-snap and he's not you know using his eyes to manipulate the safeties he looks like he's not sure and and then he tried to double back to spots like the throw late to chisholm the throw late to williams the chisholm just wasn't open in the end so that was a terrible decision.
01:39:04
Speaker 3: But the throw to williams wasn't open before.
01:39:06
Speaker 20: His break you know you can't throw that to him you know taking a step back towards you and then ultimately for you guys Why do we have Reggie Gilliam? Why do we overpay for a fullback if the guy's going to take three snaps in the offensive backfield? And Kevin Baird, can you make a play, please? There's a microphone in front of you after every game, before every game. You're a leader. You've got to do something out on the field, too. I understand he's a great man, a great human being. But when you wear that big C and you get the big contract, you've got to make plays. And we've been getting eaten in the middle of the field. We need that safety play to stand up. Ellison Spillane, they're two good backers, but those guys are out there 50-60 snaps. I mean, it's just too much. There's no depth. They can't play three downs every single rotation. And it's just, it's coming back. These guys are wearing down, especially in that heat today. You can't expect them to continue to play at a high level. So I don't know what the answer is, but I worry. that things are going in the wrong direction here, and I'm just not sure, you know, what they can do to kind of turn it back. I know Daquan Jones wasn't the answer in the run game. And, boy, if it was only an extra $ 500, 000, I would have kept Tonga here. Then, you know, shame on us that that should have happened. But thank you, guys. I appreciate your time.
01:40:18
Speaker 7: Have a good night.
01:40:18
Speaker 3: Appreciate the call, Ron. Thanks for staying with us.
01:40:20
Speaker 4: It's a good point. A lot of good stuff.
01:40:22
Speaker 3: Can't argue with that call right there.
01:40:24
Speaker 7: Really not.
01:40:24
Speaker 3: So a point on with a lot of his comments there.
01:40:27
Speaker 5: As a freshman high school fullback in my favorite position growing up, like, I was expecting a lot more. I was, you know, I just, my first impression too, Reggie Gilliam, is he isn't really like that big sledgehammer fullback type.
01:40:39
Speaker 4: He's, you know, a little bit smaller.
01:40:41
Speaker 3: James Devlin, little like a James Devlin type guy.
01:40:43
Speaker 5: He looks more like the guy who's going to catch more balls and be kind of an H-back, but I just– he hasn't made an impact.
01:40:49
Speaker 3: On the offense.
01:40:50
Speaker 6: Yeah, three snaps a game is something you do with a fullback in the All-Star game.
01:40:55
Speaker 3: So you don't.
01:40:56
Speaker 6: Ruin a guy's career in an All-Star game. You know, you give him like three snaps and see what he can do. So the scouts can see what he can do, you know, and get him on somebody's team or something. So, like, yeah, to pay a guy to come here and be the fullback because that's what you need.
01:41:08
Speaker 2: He talked about getting up in the middle of the field.
01:41:13
Speaker 6: He actually sucked when he played. So I didn't think he was very effective. As a fullback, the few plays that he's been in.
01:41:18
Speaker 22: Yeah.
01:41:19
Speaker 4: And the caller talked about getting eaten up in the middle of the field. He was critical of Bayard. And I wouldn't necessarily put it on Bayard. I think they missed Woodson today, too. But you're starting to see, you know, everybody was so up in arms when Mike Grable was adamant about the lack of depth. You're seeing it. They don't get pressure without blitzing. They're down a couple of guys. You know, in the secondary today, it was Woodson. There's just not a lot. And I think he makes a good point about the linebackers. I think Ellis and Spillane have been active in these first three weeks, but they're asking them to do an awful lot. And I thought Spillane in the second half. overran some plays, missed some tackles. You're starting to see it a little bit. These guys are asked to play almost 100%. It's hard.
01:42:02
Speaker 5: How many of these guys are pressing to now where it's like everything's going wrong?
01:42:05
Speaker 3: Trying to do a little more.
01:42:05
Speaker 4: Somebody's trying to make a play.
01:42:06
Speaker 3: Trying to make that play.
01:42:07
Speaker 4: It goes back to the do your thing.
01:42:08
Speaker 6: You know, and Carlo was spot on, too, about the weather down there. Like we were wondering, all wondering how hot it was, how humid it was. And those guys played a lot of snaps today, chasing and chasing the ball around, trying to get upfield. You know, those things take a toll on you definitely late in the football game. And you can tell when the score just got out of hand. Like, they just couldn't make the plays anymore. Couldn't keep up with Jacksonville anymore in that type of weather. You said in the pregame story. Kevin and San Fran, thanks for staying with us.
01:42:35
Speaker 3: What do you got?
01:42:37
Speaker 18: Hey, listen, I've been on hold for a while, so I've kind of gone through the gamut of emotions up and down and up and down. And I'm going to finish on a little bit of a negative note based on where my thinking is. Number one, Drake may looks horrible. And I think that two things can be true.
01:42:54
Speaker 20: I think his.
01:42:54
Speaker 18: Shoulder is banged up number one, but he also has no confidence in his team because the wide receivers have a catch radius, the size of a toilet lid. And I am literally, there's so many things to complain about this game, but I'm literally like, there is no one there to make a play for him. As bad as he's been, I'm not an apologist for him. I'm not sure whether he's the future or not, but I can tell.
01:43:19
Speaker 17: You this, this team stinks.
01:43:21
Speaker 18: Absolutely stinks. Have a great weekend, guys.
01:43:24
Speaker 20: Take care.
01:43:25
Speaker 4: All right, Kev.
01:43:25
Speaker 10: Have a great weekend. This team stinks.
01:43:29
Speaker 4: Have a great weekend.
01:43:31
Speaker 3: I wish you hadn't hung up.
01:43:33
Speaker 6: There's been a lot of talk about the Patriots need to add some receiver depth, and there's a particular player that is out there that they're talking about trading for.
01:43:41
Speaker 3: So that brings up a good topic for us to talk about.
01:43:44
Speaker 4: Marvin Harrison?
01:43:45
Speaker 3: The Marvin Harrison Jr.
01:43:46
Speaker 21: Trade.
01:43:47
Speaker 6: So whether you think it's good or not. for them to try to go after another wide receiver. I'm not taking your job.
01:43:53
Speaker 9: We did talk about it a little bit during the week, and I do think it would make some sense to try to see, like, there was obviously talent there that allowed him to be, I think, the fourth overall pick or whatever it was.
01:44:06
Speaker 4: He was a top five pick. Maybe it wasn't. Maybe he was third because I think that was Will Campbell's was fourth.
01:44:12
Speaker 7: I don't know. Whatever.
01:44:13
Speaker 4: He was supposed to be a generational wide receiver, and it just hasn't worked. Is it because it's in Arizona and whatever is not a fit? I'd be willing to pick that up. I just don't know what I'd be willing to give up for it because I don't think that this team is in a situation that they can afford to sacrifice many more resources.
01:44:30
Speaker 3: Jack, your thoughts on that? Yeah.
01:44:33
Speaker 7: Well, no.
01:44:33
Speaker 2: If we're swapping roles here, I'll give you my.
01:44:36
Speaker 3: Take on it. I'll just dust off my Hall of Fame credentials here. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:44:41
Speaker 2: Get Webb up and move into the pen. I will say with Marvin Harrison Jr., I'm not sure– with the position the Patriots are in, I don't know if I want to go touch that and be the person who gets to see if Marvin Harrison Jr.
01:44:54
Speaker 3: Can get back on track.
01:44:55
Speaker 2: With the position you're in where you're still rebuilding this thing, if you give up a high pick for that guy and it turns out he is just damaged goods and he is the bust that everyone's kind of labeling him right now, if you add him to this football team and he's still that, I don't know if the juice is worth the squeeze.
01:45:11
Speaker 3: There for me.
01:45:12
Speaker 4: I want to see Drake with A.J. Brown before I make any crazy decisions like that. But, look, I don't know.
01:45:17
Speaker 5: I mean, based on how this team has worked, everything's on the table as you try to find talent and take swings.
01:45:21
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, Troy, the way he gets out of his routes, you know.
01:45:23
Speaker 4: He does have two for 21 in the first half here today. So maybe.
01:45:29
Speaker 3: Big day.
01:45:30
Speaker 6: Yeah, I would just say for me, I think if you can get him for cheap.
01:45:35
Speaker 22: Yeah.
01:45:36
Speaker 6: It's worth having me here in your camp here. So I'm trying to be a part of this football team and to get back on track.
01:45:43
Speaker 3: Define cheap for me in the NFL. I would probably, if it's a.
01:45:49
Speaker 6: you know, fourth round, later pick, you know, maybe somewhere fourth and a fifth or whatever it is, I would not give up anything higher than that, a day one or a day two pick. I would not give that up for him. He just, you know, you're talking about unproven guys on your football team. Now you're adding another one for a steep price. I just would stay away.
01:46:06
Speaker 4: I totally agree with you, and that's why I don't think it would happen because if you're Arizona, how can you turn around and trade a guy that you took in the top five? For a day three pick two years later.
01:46:15
Speaker 3: Well, because he's not helping you.
01:46:17
Speaker 4: No, I know, but you've got to get something for him.
01:46:18
Speaker 3: I know, but you've got to get something for him.
01:46:20
Speaker 6: But I'm saying for Arizona, for them to cut ties with him now, he's not helping you.
01:46:25
Speaker 4: I've got to get something.
01:46:25
Speaker 6: His father is calling you out every single week that he's not catching, touching the football. He was a Hall of Fame football player, was a great football player, calling you out every weekend that his son's not getting the ball. So you're dealing with all those things, and you risk not getting anything for him as opposed to getting.
01:46:43
Speaker 4: Something little for him. Because he's under contract. So he's on your team, and I would rather hold on to him and hope that I can get something out of him than give him away for nothing.
01:46:52
Speaker 3: This is year three?
01:46:54
Speaker 4: Yeah.
01:46:54
Speaker 3: This is year three, and you're still waiting?
01:46:57
Speaker 15: Oh, yeah.
01:46:58
Speaker 3: Different coaching staff.
01:46:58
Speaker 4: If Arizona trades him, I completely understand. It's just not working. We're going to cut ties. We're going to get something. But it's not worth it to me to get nothing for him. A day three pick for a guy who was taken in the top five three years into his career. I'll hold on to them and wait to see if I can figure it out. And if not, then maybe I put them on the market big time in the offseason and see if I can get the highest bidder, you know?
01:47:22
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you're not going to get it during the season, I doubt if you'll get it in the offseason.
01:47:25
Speaker 4: But I'm with you, Troy. If Arizona wants to take a fourth or a fifth-round pick from Marvin Harrison, I'd be highly interested in a trade like that if I were the Patriots right now.
01:47:36
Speaker 2: Jackson, Alabama, our last caller of the day. You've been waiting patiently here for us.
01:47:39
Speaker 3: What do you got?
01:47:41
Speaker 12: Hey guys, how's it going?
01:47:42
Speaker 4: All right.
01:47:44
Speaker 15: Hey, cool.
01:47:44
Speaker 11: I would just want to start.
01:47:45
Speaker 27: Off on saying that how much of an honor it is to be on the same phone call with Troy Brown, literally one of the best.
01:47:52
Speaker 23: Patriots of all time.
01:47:55
Speaker 3: Thank you, sir.
01:47:56
Speaker 24: Kind of what I'm thinking we are missing right now on the team is somebody that's willing to.
01:48:01
Speaker 11: Go out there, play quarterback, catch the ball.
01:48:05
Speaker 24: One, one of the best, Minds on the field. We just don't have that veteran presence. And I feel like that's really.
01:48:12
Speaker 11: Hurting maybe Drake's mindset.
01:48:15
Speaker 18: And and also would like to.
01:48:17
Speaker 24: Ask how Bill would have handled this when you guys were playing and I'll take my answer off here.
01:48:22
Speaker 3: Love you guys. Appreciate it. We love you too.
01:48:25
Speaker 6: How Bill would have handled this situation right now is like you heard Mike talking about burying the football. We actually did that one year. We actually buried the football just to get rid of the past two games that we had played and we were like 0-2 or something. It's like we actually buried the football somewhere out there in front of the bleachers out there on the practice field.
01:48:45
Speaker 10: It could be still in the ground.
01:48:46
Speaker 3: It could be still in the ground somewhere over there.
01:48:48
Speaker 4: Metal detecting.
01:48:48
Speaker 10: All I know.
01:48:49
Speaker 12: So that's.
01:48:50
Speaker 6: Just a symbolism like, oh, bury in the past. What is this time to start anew?
01:48:54
Speaker 3: It actually worked, too.
01:48:55
Speaker 6: I think we started playing well after that. So those are the kind of things that he did to just try to get us back on track. So try to develop a tougher football team. I talked about practicing in pads. We practiced in pads all the time. It was really before they started this whole count on the padded practices. So we were able to go out there in pads and hit each other up, practice on the short yards, goal line, get tougher.
01:49:16
Speaker 3: All those things.
01:49:17
Speaker 6: And we became a physical football team, you know, just practicing on the bill. Because, I mean, you look at the way we played the Rams is to hit them.
01:49:26
Speaker 3: Just whatever it is, whenever you get a chance to hit somebody, just hit them.
01:49:30
Speaker 6: You see these highlights like that with Marshall Falk on the sideline and Vrabel standing beside him and just knocking him on the ground just because he was there. And you exerted your dominance over them by being physical, and they felt it the entire game. So we disrupted them from what they wanted to do, and we became the more physical team. If you can establish your physicalness early in football games, I think you have a good chance of winning, too. And that goes to getting the lead early in the football game.
01:49:56
Speaker 3: So with... Jackson, I think it was from Alabama, and Troy, steal my job here, Deuce.
01:50:00
Speaker 9: Yeah.
01:50:01
Speaker 2: I've got to respond to it first. I can't critique Greg Mayer for doing that. Have a great outro. Two things I want to wrap on just to speak to how tough it was today. I haven't emailed in 10 years from Stephen Halifax, Nova Scotia. He's a loyal listener since the iPod era of podcasting. The iPod era.
01:50:16
Speaker 3: The iPod era. The offense is putrid. That's all. That's how Patriots fans feel.
01:50:19
Speaker 2: You've got guys coming out of the woodworks for 10 years, and then here's another one that stuck out to me, if I can find it here.
01:50:26
Speaker 3: On to Cincinnati.
01:50:26
Speaker 7: Cincinnati.
01:50:27
Speaker 2: From Seth and Boise. That's what it feels like. Just like you talked about Barry the footballer. He said hopefully this is the on-to-Cincinnati game, the wake-up call this team needed.
01:50:38
Speaker 3: What is the first step? I'll ask you, Troy.
01:50:40
Speaker 2: What is the first step to rebuilding this thing as you go up to face the current AFC East Grim Reaper and Josh Allen? What is the first step to fix this thing and hopefully get on the right track for next week?
01:50:51
Speaker 6: Well, the first step right now was just identifying who you have available for you for practice this week. So the state that this team is in right now. And, again, making a decision on is this the right time for us to be in a padded practice with the amount of injuries that we have. Some people might say, yeah, you even heard the head coach say today, like, we got to get this thing turned around quick because we got to go to Buffalo. So, in my opinion right now, it's like, you have to go, you have to go pass because you have to practice pass protection. You have to practice for the run game this week coming up on both sides of the football. So right now you got to sell out for your football team as a coach and make that decision of, yeah, let's go full press. We need to be a tougher football team in all aspects of the game, but you also, you know, you run that risk of maybe getting somebody else hurt in practice, but I'm willing to take that risk as the head coach this week because we got to get going and It's only a 17-game season in the NFL, so every game matters in this league, and we've got to find a way to take advantage of the next few days of practice.
01:51:55
Speaker 2: Final thought from you, Paul. Where does it start this week?
01:51:58
Speaker 4: I think it starts and ends with Drake May. We've got to get him. Mike Rabel and Josh McDaniels need to do everything they can to figure out how to get him comfortable and back to playing the way he played. I'm not talking about the results. I'm just talking about the manner in which he played last year. Poise in the pocket. conviction in his throws and what he's seeing and, and figure it out. But that's that, that to me is the, uh, it has to be the top priority.
01:52:23
Speaker 21: Yeah. Yeah.
01:52:23
Speaker 4: Get back to work.
01:52:24
Speaker 5: I mean, there's no other way around it. You got to go to Buffalo next week. I mean, I said, I loved it earlier just cause let's face it head on. Let's go into face Josh Allen and see what he's got.
01:52:34
Speaker 3: Catch 22. What?
01:52:35
Speaker 15: 10 a.m.
01:52:35
Speaker 2: Tuesday, Thursday Patriots unfiltered middle of the week, starting at 11 a.m. We will see you again. next Sunday at 1145 on the Patriots pregame show. Thank you so much for staying with us. We will see you next week.
01:52:51
Speaker 3: Hey, this is Deuce.
01:52:52
Speaker 4: Thanks for tuning into the show.
01:52:53
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01:53:02
Speaker 4: Everything else that we do here at the Patriots.
01:53:03
Speaker 10: Thanks a lot.