WEBVTT
00:00:36.399 --> 00:00:44.560
And I love that story because it's such a great example of what it can look like to approach a conversation with curiosity instead of immediately doing the worst.
00:00:44.640 --> 00:00:47.679
It can really be such a great tool for any difficult conversation.
00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:50.399
So grab a coffee, take a few minutes, and listen in.
00:00:50.560 --> 00:00:51.359
I hope you enjoy.
00:00:51.679 --> 00:00:53.119
Every leader is a little different.
00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:59.920
So the best advice I could give someone is to figure out how you want to show up for that person.
00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:05.599
I really try and now what I've really been working on is is compassionate leadership.
00:01:05.760 --> 00:01:06.879
I mean, I can give you an example.
00:01:07.040 --> 00:01:27.040
So one of the things that I try to do is really really get myself in a space where I'm assuming the most generous thing about that person before I start a conversation, which is so hard for me because there are times when like, you know, someone didn't complete a project or someone was being standoffish or someone didn't come in and do the extra work.
00:01:27.120 --> 00:01:32.879
And I immediately go to, they're lazy, they don't, they didn't even try, they don't care about this.
00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:36.079
It is so easy for me to go to a negative story.
00:01:36.319 --> 00:01:37.280
Yes, it's so true.
00:01:37.439 --> 00:01:40.239
And I think a lot of us it tend to do that, right?
00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:49.599
So what I try and do is get myself into a headspace where I literally write down or say out loud the best assumption that I might have about that person, right?
00:01:50.319 --> 00:01:56.000
In fact, not lazy, maybe this person is really trying their hardest.
00:01:56.400 --> 00:02:00.079
And maybe they really want to do the best they can, right?
00:02:00.239 --> 00:02:01.519
And then going at it from there.
00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:11.680
One of the exercises that I have is is I tell people to like pull out a pen and paper, don't write anything down yet, but take 10 seconds and notice everything blue around you.
00:02:11.840 --> 00:02:13.680
So like notice everything blue.
00:02:13.840 --> 00:02:19.039
And then after the 10 seconds are up, I tell them to pick up their pen and write down everything they saw that was red.
00:02:19.199 --> 00:02:20.960
And then I ask them what's that about?
00:02:21.120 --> 00:02:26.560
And they're like, well, you know, we're focused on something and we miss so many other things.
00:02:26.800 --> 00:02:29.520
The same thing goes for having difficult conversations.
00:02:29.680 --> 00:02:41.520
If you're focused on the wrong, right, and if you're focused on somebody, something hurtful or correcting an action or that sort of thing, you might miss what's actually going on.
00:02:41.680 --> 00:02:42.879
I I'll give you an example.
00:02:43.199 --> 00:02:47.120
I needed them to come in and I needed them to some of their workout hours.
00:02:47.199 --> 00:02:49.680
And you know the military workout and fitness is a big thing, right?
00:02:49.759 --> 00:02:53.919
But the workout hours just weren't conducive that week to some of the mission that we had going on.
00:02:54.080 --> 00:03:00.400
And so I asked for them to cut back on the workout hours during the job, during the like the actual duty hours.
00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:04.400
I said, no, and if you do work out, like please make sure it's consistent.
00:03:04.479 --> 00:03:06.639
And it was the second time I had requested this.
00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:09.759
And I thought we were clear, right?
00:03:10.159 --> 00:03:14.159
And about 10 days went by and she wouldn't talk to me.
00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:15.280
She wouldn't look at me.
00:03:15.439 --> 00:03:17.520
And I knew that there was tension in the air.
00:03:17.680 --> 00:03:19.039
We don't sit that far apart, right?
00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:23.120
And I was like, man, I must have really, you know, I don't know what's going on.
00:03:23.199 --> 00:03:30.240
But then I started getting daily emails about her work activities, like to the to the amount of times that she had changed the printer ink cartridges, right?
00:03:30.400 --> 00:03:32.400
Which is not at all what I had asked for, right?
00:03:32.479 --> 00:03:33.840
So I was like, okay, something.
00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:40.080
And the first part of me, I'm not gonna lie, I was like, okay, we'll let this go on for it's unprofessional, she's wrong, right?
00:03:40.159 --> 00:03:40.960
Like, whatever.
00:03:41.039 --> 00:03:42.960
If she wants to be passive aggressive, let her do it.
00:03:43.039 --> 00:03:45.520
I'll let herself burn out, was my first thought.
00:03:45.680 --> 00:03:49.280
And then I was like, I started reaching out to my inner circle and I was like, what should I do, right?
00:03:49.360 --> 00:03:50.639
And it's my military inner circle.
00:03:50.719 --> 00:03:51.759
Do you know what they told me to do?
00:03:52.000 --> 00:03:52.479
What?
00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:59.759
They were like, you need to discipline her, you need to remind her of her place, you need to make this happen, right?
00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:02.400
This is the standard, she's not meeting it, right?
00:04:02.479 --> 00:04:04.000
That's very much our military culture.
00:04:05.199 --> 00:04:07.919
And I'm sitting there going, but that's not me.
00:04:08.080 --> 00:04:09.680
That's not my style.
00:04:09.840 --> 00:04:10.960
I have never liked that.
00:04:11.039 --> 00:04:12.400
You mentioned avoidance, right?
00:04:12.960 --> 00:04:18.800
I have I have always avoided that type of conversation because it's not the kind of kind of conversation I want to have.
00:04:19.360 --> 00:04:21.759
I don't want to, I don't want to tell somebody that they're wrong.
00:04:21.839 --> 00:04:23.680
What I want to do is have a conversation with them.
00:04:23.759 --> 00:04:25.279
And so this is literally what I did.
00:04:25.439 --> 00:04:37.279
I took a deep breath one morning and I replied to her email, her daily email that she's sending, and I said, Hey, I'm not sure what's been going on lately, but whenever and if you're ready, I'm here if you want to talk.
00:04:37.360 --> 00:04:37.600
Right.
00:04:37.680 --> 00:04:38.879
And she shot her a note back.
00:04:38.959 --> 00:04:40.319
She goes, I'm ready now.
00:04:40.480 --> 00:04:48.480
So we went upstairs somewhere else, and I sat and we sat down and I literally said, Hey, I was like, Okay, do you want to tell me what's been going on?
00:04:48.639 --> 00:04:52.079
I literally asked one question and didn't interrupt her for 15 minutes.
00:04:52.240 --> 00:04:52.720
Wow.
00:04:52.959 --> 00:04:57.600
During that time, she literally said she got to a place where she was like, you know what?
00:04:57.759 --> 00:04:59.680
I'm sorry, I owe you an apology.
00:04:59.839 --> 00:05:03.839
And she really got to a place where she was like, I could do better than that, and I will, right?
00:05:03.920 --> 00:05:06.079
I didn't say it, Sarah.
00:05:06.319 --> 00:05:14.319
And she looked at me after the after she was done, completely uninterrupted, and she looked and she mirrors back to me what I just gave to her.
00:05:14.399 --> 00:05:17.360
She goes, What it what was going on for you during that time?
00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:22.639
My my own direct my own direct report was like, what was going on for you during that time?
00:05:22.800 --> 00:05:24.079
She asked her boss, right?
00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:29.600
Because I just gave her, I held space for her to find to like work through her own learning on this.
00:05:30.240 --> 00:05:31.519
And I said, you know what?
00:05:31.600 --> 00:05:33.120
I was like, gratitude, right?
00:05:33.199 --> 00:05:35.120
One of my big things, thank you for sharing.
00:05:35.279 --> 00:05:37.519
Obviously, there was miscommunication.
00:05:37.600 --> 00:05:40.160
I had no intention of going back and repeating anything, right?
00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:42.800
I was like, blame has no place in this conversation.
00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:45.600
We've already acknowledged that we're gonna do better, right?
00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:46.959
And then I made clear requests.
00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:48.319
What does Brene Brown say?
00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:48.720
Mm-hmm.
00:05:48.879 --> 00:05:53.360
Clear as kind, you know, but you have to also be in an authority to make that, right?
00:05:53.439 --> 00:06:03.680
If I wasn't, if I didn't have the positional or or authorit or the what's in other words the attitude position in order to make it happen, I couldn't make clear requests in the future.
00:06:03.839 --> 00:06:10.000
In the future, what can we do to make sure that this type of communication doesn't take as long for us to get to, right?
00:06:10.160 --> 00:06:13.120
And then we worked through those things together, right?
00:06:13.600 --> 00:06:19.600
We got up and I literally went against all the advice I had been given on how to have a difficult conversation.
00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:28.160
And I maintained a relationship of respect and understanding with somebody who's important to the organization and to me.
00:06:28.399 --> 00:06:34.560
But I didn't stand on the top of the mountain and tell her that she needed to come and join me at the top.
00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:42.160
I literally took a look, assessed that she was probably at base camp, and I needed to come down there so that we could walk up together.
00:06:42.319 --> 00:06:45.279
Like that is a different type of conversation.
00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:52.319
Um, and it is difficult, but it is difficult for me to get into that space to even to even be aware that that was what was going on.
00:06:52.639 --> 00:06:55.199
Thanks for listening to another episode of Lead Into It.
00:06:55.519 --> 00:07:01.839
If you enjoyed this episode, it would mean a lot to me if you would leave a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to help future listeners.
00:07:02.240 --> 00:07:07.360
If you want to learn more about the podcast or me, go to leadintoit.co that's leadintoit.
00:07:08.720 --> 00:07:09.199
Thanks again.
00:00:36.399 --> 00:00:44.560
And I love that story because it's such a great example of what it can look like to approach a conversation with curiosity instead of immediately doing the worst.
00:00:44.640 --> 00:00:47.679
It can really be such a great tool for any difficult conversation.
00:00:47.920 --> 00:00:50.399
So grab a coffee, take a few minutes, and listen in.
00:00:50.560 --> 00:00:51.359
I hope you enjoy.
00:00:51.679 --> 00:00:53.119
Every leader is a little different.
00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:59.920
So the best advice I could give someone is to figure out how you want to show up for that person.
00:01:00.159 --> 00:01:05.599
I really try and now what I've really been working on is is compassionate leadership.
00:01:05.760 --> 00:01:06.879
I mean, I can give you an example.
00:01:07.040 --> 00:01:27.040
So one of the things that I try to do is really really get myself in a space where I'm assuming the most generous thing about that person before I start a conversation, which is so hard for me because there are times when like, you know, someone didn't complete a project or someone was being standoffish or someone didn't come in and do the extra work.
00:01:27.120 --> 00:01:32.879
And I immediately go to, they're lazy, they don't, they didn't even try, they don't care about this.
00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:36.079
It is so easy for me to go to a negative story.
00:01:36.319 --> 00:01:37.280
Yes, it's so true.
00:01:37.439 --> 00:01:40.239
And I think a lot of us it tend to do that, right?
00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:49.599
So what I try and do is get myself into a headspace where I literally write down or say out loud the best assumption that I might have about that person, right?
00:01:50.319 --> 00:01:56.000
In fact, not lazy, maybe this person is really trying their hardest.
00:01:56.400 --> 00:02:00.079
And maybe they really want to do the best they can, right?
00:02:00.239 --> 00:02:01.519
And then going at it from there.
00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:11.680
One of the exercises that I have is is I tell people to like pull out a pen and paper, don't write anything down yet, but take 10 seconds and notice everything blue around you.
00:02:11.840 --> 00:02:13.680
So like notice everything blue.
00:02:13.840 --> 00:02:19.039
And then after the 10 seconds are up, I tell them to pick up their pen and write down everything they saw that was red.
00:02:19.199 --> 00:02:20.960
And then I ask them what's that about?
00:02:21.120 --> 00:02:26.560
And they're like, well, you know, we're focused on something and we miss so many other things.
00:02:26.800 --> 00:02:29.520
The same thing goes for having difficult conversations.
00:02:29.680 --> 00:02:41.520
If you're focused on the wrong, right, and if you're focused on somebody, something hurtful or correcting an action or that sort of thing, you might miss what's actually going on.
00:02:41.680 --> 00:02:42.879
I I'll give you an example.
00:02:43.199 --> 00:02:47.120
I needed them to come in and I needed them to some of their workout hours.
00:02:47.199 --> 00:02:49.680
And you know the military workout and fitness is a big thing, right?
00:02:49.759 --> 00:02:53.919
But the workout hours just weren't conducive that week to some of the mission that we had going on.
00:02:54.080 --> 00:03:00.400
And so I asked for them to cut back on the workout hours during the job, during the like the actual duty hours.
00:03:00.560 --> 00:03:04.400
I said, no, and if you do work out, like please make sure it's consistent.
00:03:04.479 --> 00:03:06.639
And it was the second time I had requested this.
00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:09.759
And I thought we were clear, right?
00:03:10.159 --> 00:03:14.159
And about 10 days went by and she wouldn't talk to me.
00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:15.280
She wouldn't look at me.
00:03:15.439 --> 00:03:17.520
And I knew that there was tension in the air.
00:03:17.680 --> 00:03:19.039
We don't sit that far apart, right?
00:03:19.120 --> 00:03:23.120
And I was like, man, I must have really, you know, I don't know what's going on.
00:03:23.199 --> 00:03:30.240
But then I started getting daily emails about her work activities, like to the to the amount of times that she had changed the printer ink cartridges, right?
00:03:30.400 --> 00:03:32.400
Which is not at all what I had asked for, right?
00:03:32.479 --> 00:03:33.840
So I was like, okay, something.
00:03:34.000 --> 00:03:40.080
And the first part of me, I'm not gonna lie, I was like, okay, we'll let this go on for it's unprofessional, she's wrong, right?
00:03:40.159 --> 00:03:40.960
Like, whatever.
00:03:41.039 --> 00:03:42.960
If she wants to be passive aggressive, let her do it.
00:03:43.039 --> 00:03:45.520
I'll let herself burn out, was my first thought.
00:03:45.680 --> 00:03:49.280
And then I was like, I started reaching out to my inner circle and I was like, what should I do, right?
00:03:49.360 --> 00:03:50.639
And it's my military inner circle.
00:03:50.719 --> 00:03:51.759
Do you know what they told me to do?
00:03:52.000 --> 00:03:52.479
What?
00:03:52.719 --> 00:03:59.759
They were like, you need to discipline her, you need to remind her of her place, you need to make this happen, right?
00:04:00.240 --> 00:04:02.400
This is the standard, she's not meeting it, right?
00:04:02.479 --> 00:04:04.000
That's very much our military culture.
00:04:05.199 --> 00:04:07.919
And I'm sitting there going, but that's not me.
00:04:08.080 --> 00:04:09.680
That's not my style.
00:04:09.840 --> 00:04:10.960
I have never liked that.
00:04:11.039 --> 00:04:12.400
You mentioned avoidance, right?
00:04:12.960 --> 00:04:18.800
I have I have always avoided that type of conversation because it's not the kind of kind of conversation I want to have.
00:04:19.360 --> 00:04:21.759
I don't want to, I don't want to tell somebody that they're wrong.
00:04:21.839 --> 00:04:23.680
What I want to do is have a conversation with them.
00:04:23.759 --> 00:04:25.279
And so this is literally what I did.
00:04:25.439 --> 00:04:37.279
I took a deep breath one morning and I replied to her email, her daily email that she's sending, and I said, Hey, I'm not sure what's been going on lately, but whenever and if you're ready, I'm here if you want to talk.
00:04:37.360 --> 00:04:37.600
Right.
00:04:37.680 --> 00:04:38.879
And she shot her a note back.
00:04:38.959 --> 00:04:40.319
She goes, I'm ready now.
00:04:40.480 --> 00:04:48.480
So we went upstairs somewhere else, and I sat and we sat down and I literally said, Hey, I was like, Okay, do you want to tell me what's been going on?
00:04:48.639 --> 00:04:52.079
I literally asked one question and didn't interrupt her for 15 minutes.
00:04:52.240 --> 00:04:52.720
Wow.
00:04:52.959 --> 00:04:57.600
During that time, she literally said she got to a place where she was like, you know what?
00:04:57.759 --> 00:04:59.680
I'm sorry, I owe you an apology.
00:04:59.839 --> 00:05:03.839
And she really got to a place where she was like, I could do better than that, and I will, right?
00:05:03.920 --> 00:05:06.079
I didn't say it, Sarah.
00:05:06.319 --> 00:05:14.319
And she looked at me after the after she was done, completely uninterrupted, and she looked and she mirrors back to me what I just gave to her.
00:05:14.399 --> 00:05:17.360
She goes, What it what was going on for you during that time?
00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:22.639
My my own direct my own direct report was like, what was going on for you during that time?
00:05:22.800 --> 00:05:24.079
She asked her boss, right?
00:05:24.240 --> 00:05:29.600
Because I just gave her, I held space for her to find to like work through her own learning on this.
00:05:30.240 --> 00:05:31.519
And I said, you know what?
00:05:31.600 --> 00:05:33.120
I was like, gratitude, right?
00:05:33.199 --> 00:05:35.120
One of my big things, thank you for sharing.
00:05:35.279 --> 00:05:37.519
Obviously, there was miscommunication.
00:05:37.600 --> 00:05:40.160
I had no intention of going back and repeating anything, right?
00:05:40.240 --> 00:05:42.800
I was like, blame has no place in this conversation.
00:05:42.879 --> 00:05:45.600
We've already acknowledged that we're gonna do better, right?
00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:46.959
And then I made clear requests.
00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:48.319
What does Brene Brown say?
00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:48.720
Mm-hmm.
00:05:48.879 --> 00:05:53.360
Clear as kind, you know, but you have to also be in an authority to make that, right?
00:05:53.439 --> 00:06:03.680
If I wasn't, if I didn't have the positional or or authorit or the what's in other words the attitude position in order to make it happen, I couldn't make clear requests in the future.
00:06:03.839 --> 00:06:10.000
In the future, what can we do to make sure that this type of communication doesn't take as long for us to get to, right?
00:06:10.160 --> 00:06:13.120
And then we worked through those things together, right?
00:06:13.600 --> 00:06:19.600
We got up and I literally went against all the advice I had been given on how to have a difficult conversation.
00:06:19.839 --> 00:06:28.160
And I maintained a relationship of respect and understanding with somebody who's important to the organization and to me.
00:06:28.399 --> 00:06:34.560
But I didn't stand on the top of the mountain and tell her that she needed to come and join me at the top.
00:06:34.720 --> 00:06:42.160
I literally took a look, assessed that she was probably at base camp, and I needed to come down there so that we could walk up together.
00:06:42.319 --> 00:06:45.279
Like that is a different type of conversation.
00:06:45.439 --> 00:06:52.319
Um, and it is difficult, but it is difficult for me to get into that space to even to even be aware that that was what was going on.
00:06:52.639 --> 00:06:55.199
Thanks for listening to another episode of Lead Into It.
00:06:55.519 --> 00:07:01.839
If you enjoyed this episode, it would mean a lot to me if you would leave a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify to help future listeners.
00:07:02.240 --> 00:07:07.360
If you want to learn more about the podcast or me, go to leadintoit.co that's leadintoit.
00:07:08.720 --> 00:07:09.199
Thanks again.
