WEBVTT
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We really wanted it to be the same kind of thing and we're like spiritually aligned in that way.
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So like We always had each other to lean on and root for each other, which I think is what's really great about a writing partner versus going solo.
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You just have this barrier from the world, which is nice.
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Hi.
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I am Merril Branch Mc Tiernan.
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And I'm Ariana McLean, and you're listening to It's All Write,
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A podcast about the writing life and those who live it.
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Many of you probably already know.
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And if you don't know, you should know that Meryl co-wrote and co-produced Katie's mom, which is available for streaming on Tubi and Roku right now.
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And you should definitely watch it.
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because we have the co-writer of said movie.
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About to join us in the studio electronically from LA I'll just, pass it on to Meryl to introduce Tyrrell.
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Tyrrell Shaffner Yes.
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Her name rhymes with mine, who is a the co-parent of Katie's mom.
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a which premiered at Dances with Films where it won the audience award for Best fusion Future.
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Tyrrell Schaffner is a director and storyteller whose work threads the needle between drama, comedy, and romance regularly spotlighting characters on the fringes told from a distinctly female point of view.
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So we're very excited to have her coming in to join us from la.
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Yeah.
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Meryl, I know this has been a long process.
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So when did you start writing this film?
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That would be the year 2015.
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And when did it become available?
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September of 2024.
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Wow.
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So it's been quite a journey.
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It started with we were working together at uh, company making videos for SAT prep.
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And I was writing the scripts.
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She was directing the scripts.
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And we started chatting one day at the water cooler.
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I said that I I had to go online so I could find a way out of my non-monogamous relationship.
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And she thought that was amusing.
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So we went to a movie together.
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We went to see Train Wreck.
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And in the car, on our way to the movie, we started talking about how we had ambitions that were beyond these SAT prep videos.
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And I mentioned that I, I had a not fully formed idea for a feature.
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And so we started meeting up together and decided to co-write the script with the intention that she would direct/ so that was step one.
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And then a lot of other things happened, and here we are.
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Yeah, because you guys.
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You had to raise money.
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that was five years in.
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in, yeah.
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So we had been riding together for five years when we started raising we started raising money after placing in the Nicholl Competition, which is the Oscar.
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it's connected to the Oscars, it's connected to the Oscars and Academy.
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Yeah.
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So we were in the top 5% twice, so we felt like, all right, this is la creme de la creme of screenwriting contests.
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So I think we have something worth pitching.
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Nice.
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So it's been Quite a journey,
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Quite a journey, and I'm really excited to get into it.
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So welcome Tyrrell.
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Thanks for having me.
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It's nice to see both of you.
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Maybe do you wanna give like a little a little synopsis
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Sure.
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It's so funny.
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Normally Meryl and I are together and I'm like, do you wanna pitch it or should I, Meryl, is it okay if I pitch
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can pitch it, you're up.
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So Meryl and I co-wrote Katie's mom a feature comedy that you can watch on Tubi or Roku or rent on Amazon right now.
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And it is about a mom who has an affair with her daughter's boyfriend over Christmas break.
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And the jumping off point for the film really is it's like a modern take on The Graduate told from like a Mrs.
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Robinson like character, but it's really like an inversion of The Graduate in a lot of ways.
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New characters.
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The mom is nurturing and very loving.
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She's very different than Mrs.
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Robinson in the film, but it gives you an idea of the tone that we're going for.
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And yeah that's what it's about.
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It's starring the Very hot and sexy Dina Meyers, correct?
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Yeah, Dina Meyer and Aaron Dominguez.
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So they have a lot of chemistry.
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There's some very sexy scenes in it that I'm really proud of.
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I also directed it and I think, Meryl can speak to this too, but I think we both connected to this story on a personal level.
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'cause we've both dated dubious men.
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And the the guy in the film, he is like a lightning rod in this woman's life, but he is not a great boyfriend, obviously to her daughter.
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He is hooking up with and he doesn't play by the rules in a lot of cool ways, but also in some bad ways.
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So I realized while we were writing and I think while we were writing this particular sex scene that I think is one of the best scenes in the film where they've just hooked they've like orgasms together.
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She's never had that happen to her before, and she feels really connected to him.
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But then she like crashes because the guilt of what she's doing sets in.
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And then she finds out that this guy has been lying to her daughter and goes into full mama bear mode while she's like naked in bed with him.
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So there's a lot going on in the story, but while we were writing that, I was like.
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I think this really captures what the film is about and I can relate to all these different emotions happening at the same time in my own relationships where you're like, have this really passionate affair, but you have, you're dealing with someone who's you know, not the best guy.
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I love when your neighbor our editor said something like, is this about one of your exes?
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And it was like not really, but
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yeah.
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As research, I dated a guy, during Katie's Mom field research that was 10 years younger than me and lived with me'cause he was living in a van.
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And we actually got some good material from him.
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But yeah, it could be him.
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And it was inspired by Meryl came up with the idea and it was inspired by something her ex-boyfriend actually did in college.
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So there's definitely a type of guy out there this person is
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the hobosexual.
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The hobosexual, HOBO, hobosexual and I think there is that type of guy out there.
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He is this like charming marauder, and they can be like great in their own way.
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And the guy that it was initially inspired by was moved to tears at the premier because of how well we captured him.
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Oh wow.
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Okay.
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Wait, I have so many follow up questions.
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But first, so you invited the muse of the film
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To premier?
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We did.
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How did that come about?
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He's still, I actually haven't talked to him lately, but he's still a friend.
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And he'd read actually multiple versions of the script.
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He was there for editorial advice and yeah, he was so excited and proud of us that it actually went through he was someone that I dated about six months after I moved to LA.
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I met him and he had been an actor.
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He'd gone to college for acting and dropped out after he got apart in Saved by the Bell of College Years,
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Oh.
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Oh.
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And then wandered his way around, meeting a lot of women and doing things.
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And while he was with me, he discovered that his true soul was polyamorous and that monogamy was not gonna ever work for him.
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So I'm glad I helped him to find that truth.
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and in turn he helped you write a movie
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me.
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Exactly.
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We helped each other.
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And when I met Terl, this was all going on, And so it was my way of processing what was going on and how this could possibly be.
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Okay.
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Um, yeah.
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You guys were inspired by a myriad of things.
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Yeah.
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But how did you guys go about writing together a script?
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Did you what was that process?
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Yeah.
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Yeah, we've done everything.
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All right.
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Let's give us, give me a give our listeners a couple things you did.
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The first thing that we did was we would meet over rose and Terrell's backyard and talk about scenes that we'd want, and then we would split off and write the scenes and come back together having shared the scenes Do you wanna go into our second way
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of
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this?
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So then we read it out loud.
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Every scene and would then rewrite it, which Meryl hated.
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And then
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is like 12 steps in though.
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that's true.
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And then we got to the point where we were sitting together writing every word together.
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Oh, wow.
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Okay.
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And that was really intense.
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And then, there's this workshop, this directing collective I love called The Sandbox in Los Angeles.
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And it's based on iterative scene development.
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So basically you'll put up a scene with actors in front of other directors and actors and then rehearse it three times and break the scene and get feedback and you watch other directors work too.
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So it's like really good for directing muscles'cause you can go a long time without directing something.
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And it's great for writing too, to see what's working.
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So we did that for the film, over several years,
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we'd already done five or six and I think we'd done five or six drafts by the time we started doing that.
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Right.
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Yeah.
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What was our total, I think 18 maybe.
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drafts, page one, rewrites.
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Oh, I think more than it was a lot.
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It was a lot of rewrite.
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We did everything.
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We did every process and killed so many characters.
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many, really this a whole cemetery of dead characters.
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And yeah, we workshop, we had different work writing workshops that we belong to on our own.
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And we'd bring the scripts to them and yeah, there were certain things that we'd hear and then be like, that's ridiculous.
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And then three years later we're like, you know what?
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That person was right.
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We gotta kill that.
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Okay.
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So you did use.
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Some of your feedback that you received
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Oh, yeah.
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We used a lot of feedback.
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A lot of it we didn't use too.
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It's some, I think some of the art is knowing what to listen to and what not to.
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But yeah, I think, it was like patterns would emerge you know, and it was like gathering data, and you're like, oh, okay.
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Clearly this is a blind spot, or this isn't working.
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There was this beginning scene was like polishing it turd.
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And everyone hated it and then we did it in the sandbox the scene sucks.
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Get rid of this yeah, it was really helpful.
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What's nice I think with having a writing partner is we would have our own discussions or disagreements, but we both love the film and we're shepherding it and we had each other and we really do love the same things.
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Like we love the show girls.
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We really wanted it to be the same kind of thing and we're like spiritually aligned in that way.
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So we always had each other to lean on and root for each other, which I think is what's really great about a writing partner versus going solo.
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You just have this barrier from the world, which is nice.
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Yeah, I think Terrell was really helpful in helping me to see we.
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We have to solve this on our own.
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Like we can't listen like I feel like I'd be like, oh, should we do this?
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Should we do that?
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Like they're saying this and she's they're not solving
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in the family.
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We have to solve.
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Yeah, exactly.
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They can show us what's wrong, but they can't tell us how to solve it.
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Yeah, I'm a big fan of that.
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I'm like, cool.
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Thank you for telling me the problem.
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Do not tell me how to fix it.
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Yeah.
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You can pitch me.
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You can pitch me how to fix it though.
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I just don't like it when people like, it's yours.
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You know what I mean?
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And I try to do that when I give feedback too, hey, I see this issue.
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I'm pitching you an idea, but obviously it's yours to come up with the answer.
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Receiving and getting feedback is a whole art.
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It's really challenging.
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Knowing that you also directed the film and you're also a director.
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How does that play a role in your writing?
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Do you find that those two hats you wear, I guess we could say inform each other at all?
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This is my first time co-writing with somebody like this, and I feel like Meryl and I had this like child,
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Yeah.
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and we're like, it's like pretty wi, and this is one of the longest like relationships I've ever had.
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Seven years working for free on something, basically, and like birthing it into the world.
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So that's, and we barely knew each started working we prior.
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We had known each other at work and thought we were cool like beyond that, didn't know well.
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So that's interesting.
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It was like a arranged marriage,
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Or Yeah.
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Or a one night stand that that turned
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a decade long relationship.
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Yeah.
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And, I write my own stuff that I wanna direct, and I've developed stuff that I.
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I'm directing, but haven't written.
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So it's interesting how they're all different, like with how it materialized in Katie's Mom.
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It's like I was really cognizant of visual moments.
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'Cause Meryl's really good at comedy and dialogue and I just wanted to make sure that, when you're watching it, that there's these visual pillars.
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And we were also trying to, do something that was very producible and then we got carried away, scenes and we had to pull it back.
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But it was like, how do we make sure that this is visually interesting?
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Even though the fireworks are really this love triangle between the mom and the daughter and the boyfriend, just, you wanna have visual stuff going on.
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So that's something I was thinking about from the get go and that I was really glad that, that stuff was there on set because it did feel like it feels like a real movie.
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It doesn't feel like you're stuck in a room.
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Not that, it would've been otherwise, but it was, just thinking about that stuff from the get go, I think was like my director brain more so than my writing brain.
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And how does, I am always curious how you work with the visual on the page with writing.
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If you have a process for that?
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Do you see things and then you're writing it out or one comes before the other?
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I feel like I'm a visual writer.
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Like I see things before I start writing.
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But I know Meryl you've expressed that you don't see that.
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It's more, it more comes to me through the ears.
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The ears.
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Oh,
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more, yeah, more dial.
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I
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I feel like the words being on the page is where it starts.
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And then I can get in this fugue state where it's like really tapping into my mind's eye or my imagination.
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And I feel almost like the words are coming to me from some other plane, which is, and that's always really good that stuff is excellent.
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Lance Black, the guy who wrote like Harvey Milk, he says he literally watches the movie in his head, and I don't do that.
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I'm, I, because I think there's a different, there's the film you write, the film you shoot.
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In the film you edit.
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You have to throw out every version as you go.
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Don't try to make it what it was before.
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Like you have to accept.
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You know what you shot and you have to, and make it in the edit kind of.
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So yeah, I feel like it's almost in my mind's eye, in this weird, liminal space or something where I see it, but I don't see it rendered in like tons of detail where then I get on set I'm like, has to be this way.
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Which I think is good'cause I think it leaves you open to what's in front of you when you get there.
00:14:47.950 --> 00:14:59.529
I think that's what's really, I think amazing about moving image film is it goes through, I like how you said that there's three different films because you're crossing mediums as this thing is being born.
00:14:59.809 --> 00:15:01.399
There's these different evolutions.
00:15:01.450 --> 00:15:02.350
Do you.
00:15:03.549 --> 00:15:09.789
Do you recall any specific things that got cut from each step, like from the writing to the filming?
00:15:09.789 --> 00:15:19.870
And then from the filming to the editing were there scenes that stand out to you or moments or characters that had to cut in addition to your cemetery of lost friends?
00:15:21.340 --> 00:15:23.980
Yeah, there's a cemetery of dead characters that never made it.
00:15:23.980 --> 00:15:25.325
Or an alternative universe when
00:15:26.019 --> 00:15:27.414
Yeah, let's, that's nicer.
00:15:27.504 --> 00:15:30.985
I, and I think that they all do inform what was there.
00:15:30.985 --> 00:15:35.335
I feel like it, it is richer than what because it's been thought up.
00:15:35.384 --> 00:15:40.195
I do feel like the, all the dead people infor there's a history that's there.
00:15:41.335 --> 00:15:41.634
Yeah.
00:15:41.634 --> 00:15:43.345
And we definitely had to kill the babies.
00:15:43.345 --> 00:15:50.850
What was mind blowing to me is that our script was a hundred and five pages max.
00:15:51.595 --> 00:15:52.825
And the rule is a page a minute.
00:15:53.754 --> 00:15:56.095
Final draft or whatever in the screenplay format.
00:15:56.154 --> 00:16:02.894
And then we also had some consistent visual pillar moments that weren't like overwritten because the style of the script was like comedy script.
00:16:02.894 --> 00:16:08.434
And that doesn't really have a lot of it's not like a drama script where it's all these like poetic descriptions, it just doesn't fit.
00:16:08.945 --> 00:16:13.115
So we had straddled a medium there with the visual descriptions, but they weren't super long.
00:16:13.684 --> 00:16:19.845
But then we got into the edit bay and the entire film was two and a half hours long, two hours and 45 minutes
00:16:19.904 --> 00:16:20.235
Okay.
00:16:20.235 --> 00:16:21.375
That's long for a comedy.
00:16:21.375 --> 00:16:21.585
Yeah.
00:16:22.460 --> 00:16:24.465
It's like torture for comedy
00:16:24.659 --> 00:16:26.100
One hour ahead to go.
00:16:26.100 --> 00:16:26.519
Yeah.
00:16:27.375 --> 00:16:34.024
yeah, I think what I learned is like with the drama- comedy, emotions take so long to process.
00:16:34.024 --> 00:16:39.254
It's not like a Friend script where it's super punchy and they're talking super fast or whatever.
00:16:39.884 --> 00:16:40.904
These emotions.
00:16:40.914 --> 00:16:47.695
There's a scene where Nancy, the mom and Katie's mom is going through this car wash after the fallout and getting caught from the affair.
00:16:48.235 --> 00:16:56.085
And she has this like breakdown and I think it's two sentences if that in the screenplay, but then it plays for like 45 seconds in the movie.
00:16:56.894 --> 00:16:59.654
And it's like those kinds of things ended up happening.
00:16:59.715 --> 00:17:02.934
And the actors did really great with the dramatic moments.
00:17:03.509 --> 00:17:04.859
And you have to let them play out.
00:17:04.859 --> 00:17:05.940
You can't clip them.
00:17:05.940 --> 00:17:07.680
That's it's like taking the gold out or whatever.
00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:08.940
So we had to cut an hour.
00:17:08.940 --> 00:17:15.750
We definitely had to kill a lot of babies Some of them I wasn't too sad about, but they just didn't work for whatever reason.
00:17:15.789 --> 00:17:20.894
And some things didn't work because for instance Dina Meyer, who plays Nancy, she's so great.
00:17:21.789 --> 00:17:25.210
We wrote Nancy to be a little bit of a doormat initially.
00:17:25.210 --> 00:17:28.855
And you just, Dina's just you don't believe that she's for one second.
00:17:28.855 --> 00:17:35.454
So there was like one scene at a baby shower where her friends are sort of shitting on her and they had not invited her to this baby shower.
00:17:35.454 --> 00:17:40.285
And she comes in and she gets up the nerve to confront them, but it's like Dina Meyer.
00:17:40.795 --> 00:17:45.555
So like the scene just didn't work because she just, we didn't, and we didn't need it in the end.
00:17:45.585 --> 00:17:46.305
So stuff like that
00:17:46.434 --> 00:17:53.974
Right, and that was a scene we worked so hard on and rewrote so much, but just, yeah, the people who played those characters, it just didn't gel.
00:17:54.799 --> 00:17:55.099
yeah.
00:17:55.099 --> 00:17:58.190
And that's just the film you shoot, versus the film that you wrote.
00:17:58.609 --> 00:18:00.434
And I'm glad that, that scene got cut.
00:18:00.434 --> 00:18:07.575
I, it didn't work for various reasons, but then it, once you started to just whittle it down, rule it down, then it got like painful.
00:18:07.845 --> 00:18:13.315
But yeah, drama comedy is much longer than a page a minute is what I've learned.
00:18:13.855 --> 00:18:15.954
So I'm gonna keep that in mind for the next one.
00:18:22.973 --> 00:18:24.294
What are you working on now?
00:18:24.344 --> 00:18:25.963
Yeah, I'm excited about two projects.
00:18:26.878 --> 00:18:32.919
I just got funding for it's a web series pilot, but hopefully it would be developed into a full comedy series.
00:18:33.499 --> 00:18:46.608
It's inspired by my real life experience, substitute teaching, and it's called Subs and it's like a mockumentary type show, like Party Down in the world of subbing and really, captures the least respected profession in the world.
00:18:47.253 --> 00:18:53.814
But also is set in LA with all these kind of dreamers who are trying to make it big, but also are just like getting shit on daily.
00:18:54.243 --> 00:18:55.294
It's super fun.
00:18:55.703 --> 00:18:59.064
So we're gonna shoot that in the fall, which I'm really excited about.
00:18:59.114 --> 00:19:05.953
Erica Lane wrote that she's a really talented screenwriter that I met at Sundance when Marilyn and I were at Sundance a couple years ago.
00:19:06.403 --> 00:19:08.173
We were also there with Ariana a few
00:19:08.273 --> 00:19:08.364
ago.
00:19:08.368 --> 00:19:08.628
Oh yeah.
00:19:08.804 --> 00:19:09.193
oh yeah.
00:19:09.703 --> 00:19:10.304
Last year.
00:19:10.304 --> 00:19:10.693
Yeah.
00:19:11.068 --> 00:19:12.173
a room with Ariana.
00:19:12.324 --> 00:19:12.653
Oh yeah.
00:19:12.653 --> 00:19:13.433
That was fun.
00:19:14.749 --> 00:19:24.788
And also I just completed my next feature screenplay and that's called I Can't Find My Friends, and it's about three estranged friends in their early forties.
00:19:25.719 --> 00:19:29.318
And their fourth friend, they were like best friends in high school.
00:19:29.368 --> 00:19:32.009
Her dying wish was for them to reunite a burning man.
00:19:32.368 --> 00:19:48.288
And so they go and bring her ashes with them and then crazy shit starts happening, of course, but it's like a female hangover with heart and really fun and also inspired by real life experience going to Burning Man the last three years in a row.
00:19:48.499 --> 00:19:51.739
Hopefully I'll have some news when I Can't Find My Friends soon we'll see.
00:19:52.318 --> 00:19:52.828
Hustling.
00:19:52.828 --> 00:19:53.368
Hustling.
00:19:53.503 --> 00:19:53.864
hustling.
00:19:53.864 --> 00:19:55.453
That is the life out here.
00:19:55.743 --> 00:19:57.124
How do you stay motivated?
00:19:57.539 --> 00:19:59.190
I have an insane drive.
00:19:59.190 --> 00:20:00.450
It's a little psychotic.
00:20:00.539 --> 00:20:01.380
Meryl's seen it.
00:20:03.255 --> 00:20:03.884
Hey, own it.
00:20:03.884 --> 00:20:04.065
You.
00:20:04.065 --> 00:20:04.974
You got the gift.
00:20:05.055 --> 00:20:06.734
You take it and run with it.
00:20:08.109 --> 00:20:13.089
It can be to my own making Katie's Mom was such a fulfilling experience.
00:20:13.190 --> 00:20:14.690
Meryl and I wanted to do something.
00:20:14.690 --> 00:20:19.640
We took this leap of faith, put so much work into it and then did it.
00:20:20.240 --> 00:20:23.029
So I think that was, that's really inspiring and motivating.
00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:33.839
it was also really inspiring to be in creative control while shooting it and making it and to see that like you have that inside of you is like a really motivating factor.
00:20:34.605 --> 00:20:40.335
And I think also the way people responded to the film, like women are just like gaga for the movie.
00:20:40.335 --> 00:20:42.464
They're like, oh my God, I feel so horny afterwards.
00:20:42.464 --> 00:20:44.835
I think it's really delivered what we wanted to deliver.
00:20:45.585 --> 00:20:47.714
And I think that's really also inspiring.
00:20:47.805 --> 00:20:58.490
it's like rewarding to continue to make this type like art tells women's stories, like messy women's stories I think is still really needed.
00:20:58.490 --> 00:21:02.210
So I think those are some motivating factors, that keep it going.
00:21:02.789 --> 00:21:03.990
I hate the blank page.
00:21:03.990 --> 00:21:08.549
That is the worst thing for me in the world So like with, I can't find my friends.
00:21:08.849 --> 00:21:10.710
The hardest part was writing the first draft.
00:21:11.849 --> 00:21:20.615
And what I found is I'm just, I'm in a couple different writers groups through USC where I went to undergrad or like through the sandbox and I'll get in an accountability group.
00:21:21.315 --> 00:21:29.904
I did one right before I went to Burning Man last year for eight weeks, and I wrote almost the full first draft, but I was like, oh, I'm gonna get more stories while I'm there.
00:21:29.904 --> 00:21:31.255
And then I finished it when I got back.
00:21:31.255 --> 00:21:35.125
So I break it out, break it into pieces so it becomes manageable.
00:21:36.115 --> 00:21:36.894
Nice.
00:21:36.894 --> 00:21:40.944
Yeah, Scary.
00:21:41.769 --> 00:21:43.480
Even thinking about it
00:21:43.555 --> 00:21:43.704
It's ew.
00:21:44.695 --> 00:21:45.759
Just say what?
00:21:47.470 --> 00:21:49.420
How do you feel about the blank page, Meryl?
00:21:50.734 --> 00:21:55.325
Weirdly, I write, I start in blank pages when I'm writing fiction.
00:21:55.325 --> 00:21:57.095
Like I don't open up the document.
00:21:57.095 --> 00:22:05.045
I start a new document, which is maybe weird'cause I'm like, I don't wanna see all the rest of it and then I paste it in at some point to a bigger.
00:22:05.765 --> 00:22:10.075
But I feel like I'm a little bit more overwhelmed by a bigger chunk.
00:22:11.575 --> 00:22:21.295
Like having a bigger manuscript is worse to me on some level than being like, I'm just starting on document eight of all my unclosed things.
00:22:21.295 --> 00:22:21.474
And
00:22:22.375 --> 00:22:26.089
so you're like I know you guys are using the word sandbox is a entity or it's a
00:22:26.369 --> 00:22:28.018
but I'm, yeah, like playing in, but you're playing in the
00:22:28.200 --> 00:22:29.240
in the sandbox.
00:22:29.309 --> 00:22:31.259
I think I like writing better than editing.
00:22:32.119 --> 00:22:34.279
I'm like, oh, this is all fresh and new.
00:22:34.279 --> 00:22:34.549
Yeah.
00:22:34.549 --> 00:22:35.809
I like the playing part.
00:22:37.015 --> 00:22:37.305
Then
00:22:37.654 --> 00:22:41.015
Or maybe that's the difference between more of a director versus a writer.
00:22:41.045 --> 00:22:50.224
Because I feel like directors are just inherently like kinetic, like they like to react to things and that's a really strong, like that's important to have that when you're on
00:22:50.482 --> 00:22:50.809
mm-hmm.
00:22:50.845 --> 00:22:51.045
Right,
00:22:51.244 --> 00:22:55.234
like you're reacting to what's in front of you versus building whole worlds
00:22:55.262 --> 00:22:55.575
Right.
00:22:56.359 --> 00:22:57.200
Nothing.
00:22:57.380 --> 00:23:01.009
So that might be a key difference, just temperament or personality.
00:23:01.339 --> 00:23:01.630
Yeah.
00:23:02.234 --> 00:23:14.365
So I'm bouncing quickly back to the series you're working on and how do you find working with other, like when you're not writing and you have to work with a screenwriter, how do you handle that?
00:23:15.634 --> 00:23:18.085
This is my first time, developing material that.
00:23:18.869 --> 00:23:27.549
I'm not writing at all, like that I'm having someone else write and I'm just like talking to them about my experience and, coming up with the episode ideas and bits and stuff.
00:23:28.430 --> 00:23:29.359
It's been interesting.
00:23:29.359 --> 00:23:33.529
I feel like it's forced me to be less in the weeds, which is good.
00:23:34.019 --> 00:23:37.099
Not get, let's retype every sentence together.
00:23:37.309 --> 00:23:48.545
Which is good in a way, I, I have enjoyed it so far a lot, and I feel like it's captured what I wanted to capture and then it's nice to have something like, I can't find my friends, which is like super personal.
00:23:49.144 --> 00:23:50.734
Have that very much be mine.
00:23:50.884 --> 00:23:52.825
So it's, yeah I think it's nice to have them.
00:23:53.789 --> 00:24:02.265
Those different things of ways of doing, but I like all of it, I like also a producer, so I think all of it collaborating is really fun.
00:24:03.055 --> 00:24:07.585
Yeah, I can I can identify with that, That's why I enjoy being a freelancer.
00:24:07.644 --> 00:24:16.255
I wanna turn on different parts of my brain for different projects and it also gives you a chance to see other things through a different lens or with a different light.
00:24:16.255 --> 00:24:24.305
Like I imagine you guys have both spoken to what you've learned from working on Katie's Mom and then you bring that knowledge to your other projects.
00:24:24.545 --> 00:24:29.615
So it all builds and I feel like some people who only have one specific job don't understand that.
00:24:29.615 --> 00:24:33.005
Like, all these things come together and it's, I dunno.
00:24:33.095 --> 00:24:34.144
It is, it's fulfilling.
00:24:34.144 --> 00:24:37.295
It's, and it's also I love a challenge and it sounds like you do too.
00:24:37.295 --> 00:24:38.115
I feel like.
00:24:38.214 --> 00:24:38.664
do, I I do.
00:24:44.924 --> 00:24:48.884
I know you have to head out if there's any last things you wanna share,
00:24:48.934 --> 00:24:52.954
Yeah, so you could watch Katie's Mom for free on Tubi or Roku.
00:24:53.615 --> 00:24:55.775
You can also rent it on Amazon Prime.
00:24:56.345 --> 00:25:01.865
And we'd love for people to go and watch it and then give it a positive rating on IMDB.
00:25:02.204 --> 00:25:12.744
Places like IMDB are not as amenable to female focused content as we would like like My Best Friend's Wedding, which totally influenced Katie's mom.
00:25:12.744 --> 00:25:16.154
It's a classic, one of the best anti romcom romcoms ever.
00:25:16.154 --> 00:25:21.525
It has a 6.4 on IMDB, and that's because IMDB skews male.
00:25:22.349 --> 00:25:24.809
And it also features an unlikable.
00:25:24.960 --> 00:25:27.180
She's amazing, but she's doing awful things.
00:25:27.180 --> 00:25:28.559
Unlikable female lead.
00:25:29.009 --> 00:25:30.619
And that's frustrating.
00:25:31.170 --> 00:25:34.365
The IMDB score then feeds into all these other platforms.
00:25:35.400 --> 00:25:39.250
I was gonna say, most people don't know that you don't think to go rate something on IMDB.
00:25:39.319 --> 00:25:40.194
But that's what's showing up.
00:25:41.490 --> 00:25:48.390
And then, so we have a film that's really aimed at older getting rated in a space that's for younger men.
00:25:49.019 --> 00:25:53.859
And we need really as many like people that love the film to come and rate it as possible.
00:25:53.859 --> 00:25:57.789
And, we just really, appreciate that support.
00:25:58.684 --> 00:26:00.275
Tell your friends about it.
00:26:00.345 --> 00:26:04.160
Women really love this film, so we wanna find our audience as much as possible.
00:26:04.544 --> 00:26:04.814
Yeah.
00:26:04.814 --> 00:26:10.169
And we do need women in all shades of being human.
00:26:10.169 --> 00:26:12.598
Like we're not just certain archetypes.
00:26:12.598 --> 00:26:13.949
There's so much more.
00:26:14.229 --> 00:26:16.189
So that's why I really enjoyed the film.
00:26:16.278 --> 00:26:22.098
It was like nice to see I would say a lot of the characters do things and you're like, no, don't do that.
00:26:22.098 --> 00:26:23.479
Or you're like, yes, do that.
00:26:23.479 --> 00:26:31.159
And so it feels very much like you're seeing real people who have these different facets of specifically I'm thinking of.
00:26:31.743 --> 00:26:41.963
Nancy and Katie our lead female characters just doing things and having life happen, and sometimes you don't make the best choice and that's so relatable.
00:26:42.544 --> 00:26:50.114
And then of course, a sexy scene with a woman who's over 25 is, we need more of that, so kudos.
00:26:50.114 --> 00:26:50.173
Yeah.
00:26:51.125 --> 00:26:51.453
Thank you.
00:26:51.523 --> 00:26:51.814
Yeah.
00:26:51.898 --> 00:26:53.189
I'm so glad you enjoyed that.
00:26:53.338 --> 00:26:54.374
That's we're very proud of it.
00:26:55.865 --> 00:26:56.193
Thank you.
00:27:02.084 --> 00:27:02.983
we have a few more minutes.
00:27:02.983 --> 00:27:10.233
So let's, catch up Meryl was like in Mexico for a month on sabbatical.
00:27:12.138 --> 00:27:15.138
Mexico killed the right j jk.
00:27:16.294 --> 00:27:20.134
Do we, did we have any things that kept us from writing or made us write?
00:27:21.064 --> 00:27:21.513
Yeah.
00:27:21.513 --> 00:27:22.898
Or Or recently.
00:27:24.114 --> 00:27:24.564
I don't know.
00:27:24.564 --> 00:27:28.973
I feel like the fun of summer keeps me from writing.
00:27:29.493 --> 00:27:35.368
'Cause I'm just more interested in living life right now as opposed to processing it.
00:27:35.419 --> 00:27:39.909
However, I have had a few spurts of oh my God, I gotta write this right now.
00:27:40.209 --> 00:27:41.108
Like yesterday.
00:27:41.828 --> 00:27:44.528
What was I, oh, I was listening to a podcast of
00:27:45.669 --> 00:27:46.028
very
00:27:46.088 --> 00:27:46.328
inspiring.
00:27:46.453 --> 00:27:47.558
not, not our podcast.
00:27:47.634 --> 00:28:03.709
I was listening to another podcast and it inspired me to write out my characters as if I'm interviewing them and hearing their stories as a way to see where I want the story to go.
00:28:03.739 --> 00:28:08.709
'cause I was feeling a little I know what I wanna do, but I feel like I'm not quite sure and I thought that was.
00:28:09.084 --> 00:28:10.703
Would be a fun exercise.
00:28:10.778 --> 00:28:11.739
I think that is a fun
00:28:12.473 --> 00:28:20.394
So like literally just first person completely in the head of the character answering questions.
00:28:20.423 --> 00:28:24.054
So I was I started doing that and I was thinking about doing
00:28:25.163 --> 00:28:30.884
So I would say it's all right to take the season off and it's all right to fictional people.
00:28:31.229 --> 00:28:33.538
It's all right if the universe is your daddy.
00:28:33.584 --> 00:28:33.733
Yes.
00:28:36.148 --> 00:28:36.449
not
00:28:36.523 --> 00:28:37.173
Not all right.
00:28:37.453 --> 00:28:38.614
To support ice.
00:28:38.953 --> 00:28:39.223
True
00:28:39.275 --> 00:28:42.453
That We came up with a new thing called Say No to Ice Daddies.
00:28:42.483 --> 00:28:42.693
'cause
00:28:42.693 --> 00:28:42.874
there were
00:28:42.903 --> 00:28:52.669
are these, when we, I went to this pride event and there were these they seemed like they were undercover cops who were trying to pass as a, you.
00:28:54.003 --> 00:28:54.963
A gay man.
00:28:55.229 --> 00:28:55.808
Oh really?
00:28:56.713 --> 00:28:58.064
Wearing like a mesh shirt.
00:28:58.064 --> 00:29:01.903
But he was like hanging out with the cops the whole time and did not even talk to anybody.
00:29:02.023 --> 00:29:04.003
And we were like, that's an ice daddy.
00:29:04.064 --> 00:29:05.828
And we're like, say no to ice daddies.
00:29:06.058 --> 00:29:06.689
I like that.
00:29:06.689 --> 00:29:06.894
That's great.
00:29:06.894 --> 00:29:07.054
So
00:29:07.104 --> 00:29:16.319
new slogan That's a wrap on this episode of, it's All Write.
00:29:16.339 --> 00:29:23.450
You can listen to other episodes on all the streaming podcasts sites.
00:29:23.559 --> 00:29:33.980
Share, like, rate our show, support the show as well as Katie's Mom, which You can stream on Roku, Tubi and Amazon.
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:38.240
There will be links in the show notes if that makes things easier.
00:29:38.529 --> 00:29:39.599
Until next time,
00:29:39.916 --> 00:29:40.757
thanks for listening.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:04.440
We really wanted it to be the same kind of thing and we're like spiritually aligned in that way.
00:00:04.440 --> 00:00:14.105
So like We always had each other to lean on and root for each other, which I think is what's really great about a writing partner versus going solo.
00:00:14.175 --> 00:00:17.375
You just have this barrier from the world, which is nice.
00:00:22.734 --> 00:00:23.094
Hi.
00:00:23.094 --> 00:00:24.385
I am Merril Branch Mc Tiernan.
00:00:24.670 --> 00:00:28.660
And I'm Ariana McLean, and you're listening to It's All Write,
00:00:29.094 --> 00:00:32.125
A podcast about the writing life and those who live it.
00:00:33.299 --> 00:00:34.799
Many of you probably already know.
00:00:34.799 --> 00:00:46.380
And if you don't know, you should know that Meryl co-wrote and co-produced Katie's mom, which is available for streaming on Tubi and Roku right now.
00:00:46.380 --> 00:00:47.789
And you should definitely watch it.
00:00:47.917 --> 00:00:52.520
because we have the co-writer of said movie.
00:00:52.622 --> 00:00:59.506
About to join us in the studio electronically from LA I'll just, pass it on to Meryl to introduce Tyrrell.
00:00:59.805 --> 00:01:01.415
Tyrrell Shaffner Yes.
00:01:01.415 --> 00:01:06.765
Her name rhymes with mine, who is a the co-parent of Katie's mom.
00:01:07.165 --> 00:01:12.507
a which premiered at Dances with Films where it won the audience award for Best fusion Future.
00:01:12.710 --> 00:01:24.331
Tyrrell Schaffner is a director and storyteller whose work threads the needle between drama, comedy, and romance regularly spotlighting characters on the fringes told from a distinctly female point of view.
00:01:24.570 --> 00:01:27.756
So we're very excited to have her coming in to join us from la.
00:01:28.665 --> 00:01:29.176
Yeah.
00:01:29.176 --> 00:01:33.286
Meryl, I know this has been a long process.
00:01:33.335 --> 00:01:35.570
So when did you start writing this film?
00:01:36.090 --> 00:01:41.099
That would be the year 2015.
00:01:41.474 --> 00:01:43.123
And when did it become available?
00:01:43.478 --> 00:01:46.118
September of 2024.
00:01:46.118 --> 00:01:46.179
Wow.
00:01:46.599 --> 00:01:48.308
So it's been quite a journey.
00:01:48.364 --> 00:01:54.804
It started with we were working together at uh, company making videos for SAT prep.
00:01:55.203 --> 00:01:57.004
And I was writing the scripts.
00:01:57.004 --> 00:01:58.623
She was directing the scripts.
00:01:58.733 --> 00:02:01.933
And we started chatting one day at the water cooler.
00:02:02.233 --> 00:02:06.947
I said that I I had to go online so I could find a way out of my non-monogamous relationship.
00:02:07.367 --> 00:02:09.016
And she thought that was amusing.
00:02:09.296 --> 00:02:11.097
So we went to a movie together.
00:02:11.127 --> 00:02:12.356
We went to see Train Wreck.
00:02:12.387 --> 00:02:20.667
And in the car, on our way to the movie, we started talking about how we had ambitions that were beyond these SAT prep videos.
00:02:21.056 --> 00:02:27.477
And I mentioned that I, I had a not fully formed idea for a feature.
00:02:27.776 --> 00:02:36.296
And so we started meeting up together and decided to co-write the script with the intention that she would direct/ so that was step one.
00:02:37.197 --> 00:02:39.926
And then a lot of other things happened, and here we are.
00:02:40.361 --> 00:02:42.072
Yeah, because you guys.
00:02:42.521 --> 00:02:43.782
You had to raise money.
00:02:44.322 --> 00:02:45.431
that was five years in.
00:02:46.586 --> 00:02:46.947
in, yeah.
00:02:46.977 --> 00:02:54.717
So we had been riding together for five years when we started raising we started raising money after placing in the Nicholl Competition, which is the Oscar.
00:02:55.507 --> 00:02:57.817
it's connected to the Oscars, it's connected to the Oscars and Academy.
00:02:57.847 --> 00:02:58.116
Yeah.
00:02:58.116 --> 00:03:04.556
So we were in the top 5% twice, so we felt like, all right, this is la creme de la creme of screenwriting contests.
00:03:04.856 --> 00:03:08.037
So I think we have something worth pitching.
00:03:08.907 --> 00:03:09.537
Nice.
00:03:09.588 --> 00:03:11.299
So it's been Quite a journey,
00:03:11.373 --> 00:03:14.524
Quite a journey, and I'm really excited to get into it.
00:03:14.584 --> 00:03:16.503
So welcome Tyrrell.
00:03:17.223 --> 00:03:18.159
Thanks for having me.
00:03:18.159 --> 00:03:19.330
It's nice to see both of you.
00:03:19.692 --> 00:03:24.227
Maybe do you wanna give like a little a little synopsis
00:03:24.375 --> 00:03:24.637
Sure.
00:03:24.637 --> 00:03:25.176
It's so funny.
00:03:25.176 --> 00:03:31.870
Normally Meryl and I are together and I'm like, do you wanna pitch it or should I, Meryl, is it okay if I pitch
00:03:32.181 --> 00:03:33.201
can pitch it, you're up.
00:03:35.046 --> 00:03:42.377
So Meryl and I co-wrote Katie's mom a feature comedy that you can watch on Tubi or Roku or rent on Amazon right now.
00:03:42.856 --> 00:03:47.727
And it is about a mom who has an affair with her daughter's boyfriend over Christmas break.
00:03:48.942 --> 00:03:55.861
And the jumping off point for the film really is it's like a modern take on The Graduate told from like a Mrs.
00:03:55.861 --> 00:04:01.322
Robinson like character, but it's really like an inversion of The Graduate in a lot of ways.
00:04:01.322 --> 00:04:02.491
New characters.
00:04:02.491 --> 00:04:05.252
The mom is nurturing and very loving.
00:04:05.252 --> 00:04:07.007
She's very different than Mrs.
00:04:07.007 --> 00:04:11.382
Robinson in the film, but it gives you an idea of the tone that we're going for.
00:04:11.382 --> 00:04:13.127
And yeah that's what it's about.
00:04:13.616 --> 00:04:17.637
It's starring the Very hot and sexy Dina Meyers, correct?
00:04:18.177 --> 00:04:20.947
Yeah, Dina Meyer and Aaron Dominguez.
00:04:21.516 --> 00:04:23.706
So they have a lot of chemistry.
00:04:24.226 --> 00:04:27.107
There's some very sexy scenes in it that I'm really proud of.
00:04:27.107 --> 00:04:35.687
I also directed it and I think, Meryl can speak to this too, but I think we both connected to this story on a personal level.
00:04:35.716 --> 00:04:37.447
'cause we've both dated dubious men.
00:04:38.137 --> 00:04:44.076
And the the guy in the film, he is like a lightning rod in this woman's life, but he is not a great boyfriend, obviously to her daughter.
00:04:44.166 --> 00:04:49.997
He is hooking up with and he doesn't play by the rules in a lot of cool ways, but also in some bad ways.
00:04:49.997 --> 00:05:02.146
So I realized while we were writing and I think while we were writing this particular sex scene that I think is one of the best scenes in the film where they've just hooked they've like orgasms together.
00:05:02.552 --> 00:05:05.791
She's never had that happen to her before, and she feels really connected to him.
00:05:05.791 --> 00:05:10.411
But then she like crashes because the guilt of what she's doing sets in.
00:05:10.891 --> 00:05:17.341
And then she finds out that this guy has been lying to her daughter and goes into full mama bear mode while she's like naked in bed with him.
00:05:17.882 --> 00:05:21.471
So there's a lot going on in the story, but while we were writing that, I was like.
00:05:22.492 --> 00:05:35.574
I think this really captures what the film is about and I can relate to all these different emotions happening at the same time in my own relationships where you're like, have this really passionate affair, but you have, you're dealing with someone who's you know, not the best guy.
00:05:37.699 --> 00:05:42.980
I love when your neighbor our editor said something like, is this about one of your exes?
00:05:43.370 --> 00:05:44.990
And it was like not really, but
00:05:44.990 --> 00:05:45.319
yeah.
00:05:45.350 --> 00:05:54.910
As research, I dated a guy, during Katie's Mom field research that was 10 years younger than me and lived with me'cause he was living in a van.
00:05:55.339 --> 00:05:57.230
And we actually got some good material from him.
00:05:57.509 --> 00:05:58.410
But yeah, it could be him.
00:05:58.410 --> 00:06:05.009
And it was inspired by Meryl came up with the idea and it was inspired by something her ex-boyfriend actually did in college.
00:06:05.410 --> 00:06:10.180
So there's definitely a type of guy out there this person is
00:06:10.180 --> 00:06:11.430
the hobosexual.
00:06:11.995 --> 00:06:17.464
The hobosexual, HOBO, hobosexual and I think there is that type of guy out there.
00:06:17.464 --> 00:06:21.545
He is this like charming marauder, and they can be like great in their own way.
00:06:21.834 --> 00:06:27.444
And the guy that it was initially inspired by was moved to tears at the premier because of how well we captured him.
00:06:27.805 --> 00:06:28.404
Oh wow.
00:06:28.435 --> 00:06:28.855
Okay.
00:06:28.855 --> 00:06:30.475
Wait, I have so many follow up questions.
00:06:30.475 --> 00:06:34.139
But first, so you invited the muse of the film
00:06:34.310 --> 00:06:34.531
To premier?
00:06:34.531 --> 00:06:35.089
We did.
00:06:35.269 --> 00:06:36.199
How did that come about?
00:06:36.855 --> 00:06:40.694
He's still, I actually haven't talked to him lately, but he's still a friend.
00:06:40.845 --> 00:06:44.435
And he'd read actually multiple versions of the script.
00:06:44.615 --> 00:06:56.600
He was there for editorial advice and yeah, he was so excited and proud of us that it actually went through he was someone that I dated about six months after I moved to LA.
00:06:56.600 --> 00:06:59.240
I met him and he had been an actor.
00:06:59.240 --> 00:07:04.689
He'd gone to college for acting and dropped out after he got apart in Saved by the Bell of College Years,
00:07:04.740 --> 00:07:04.959
Oh.
00:07:05.290 --> 00:07:05.319
Oh.
00:07:05.709 --> 00:07:10.389
And then wandered his way around, meeting a lot of women and doing things.
00:07:10.420 --> 00:07:20.404
And while he was with me, he discovered that his true soul was polyamorous and that monogamy was not gonna ever work for him.
00:07:20.404 --> 00:07:23.334
So I'm glad I helped him to find that truth.
00:07:23.714 --> 00:07:25.334
and in turn he helped you write a movie
00:07:25.404 --> 00:07:25.824
me.
00:07:25.824 --> 00:07:26.334
Exactly.
00:07:26.334 --> 00:07:27.144
We helped each other.
00:07:27.444 --> 00:07:36.564
And when I met Terl, this was all going on, And so it was my way of processing what was going on and how this could possibly be.
00:07:36.595 --> 00:07:37.285
Okay.
00:07:37.615 --> 00:07:38.305
Um, yeah.
00:07:44.660 --> 00:07:47.839
You guys were inspired by a myriad of things.
00:07:47.839 --> 00:07:47.899
Yeah.
00:07:47.930 --> 00:07:51.720
But how did you guys go about writing together a script?
00:07:51.750 --> 00:07:53.699
Did you what was that process?
00:07:53.730 --> 00:07:53.790
Yeah.
00:07:54.014 --> 00:07:54.764
Yeah, we've done everything.
00:07:55.800 --> 00:07:56.040
All right.
00:07:56.040 --> 00:07:59.725
Let's give us, give me a give our listeners a couple things you did.
00:08:00.300 --> 00:08:15.129
The first thing that we did was we would meet over rose and Terrell's backyard and talk about scenes that we'd want, and then we would split off and write the scenes and come back together having shared the scenes Do you wanna go into our second way
00:08:15.175 --> 00:08:15.235
of
00:08:15.475 --> 00:08:15.564
this?
00:08:16.745 --> 00:08:18.634
So then we read it out loud.
00:08:20.329 --> 00:08:24.410
Every scene and would then rewrite it, which Meryl hated.
00:08:24.410 --> 00:08:25.040
And then
00:08:25.324 --> 00:08:26.600
is like 12 steps in though.
00:08:27.800 --> 00:08:28.610
that's true.
00:08:28.970 --> 00:08:34.370
And then we got to the point where we were sitting together writing every word together.
00:08:34.424 --> 00:08:34.884
Oh, wow.
00:08:34.955 --> 00:08:35.245
Okay.
00:08:35.269 --> 00:08:36.950
And that was really intense.
00:08:37.440 --> 00:08:42.889
And then, there's this workshop, this directing collective I love called The Sandbox in Los Angeles.
00:08:42.889 --> 00:08:45.110
And it's based on iterative scene development.
00:08:45.110 --> 00:08:55.360
So basically you'll put up a scene with actors in front of other directors and actors and then rehearse it three times and break the scene and get feedback and you watch other directors work too.
00:08:55.360 --> 00:08:59.549
So it's like really good for directing muscles'cause you can go a long time without directing something.
00:09:00.009 --> 00:09:02.649
And it's great for writing too, to see what's working.
00:09:03.009 --> 00:09:06.269
So we did that for the film, over several years,
00:09:06.320 --> 00:09:10.370
we'd already done five or six and I think we'd done five or six drafts by the time we started doing that.
00:09:10.370 --> 00:09:10.610
Right.
00:09:10.975 --> 00:09:11.514
Yeah.
00:09:12.110 --> 00:09:14.090
What was our total, I think 18 maybe.
00:09:15.024 --> 00:09:17.184
drafts, page one, rewrites.
00:09:17.215 --> 00:09:22.914
Oh, I think more than it was a lot.
00:09:23.065 --> 00:09:24.054
It was a lot of rewrite.
00:09:24.054 --> 00:09:25.075
We did everything.
00:09:25.075 --> 00:09:28.254
We did every process and killed so many characters.
00:09:28.465 --> 00:09:31.450
many, really this a whole cemetery of dead characters.
00:09:31.750 --> 00:09:36.850
And yeah, we workshop, we had different work writing workshops that we belong to on our own.
00:09:36.850 --> 00:09:43.309
And we'd bring the scripts to them and yeah, there were certain things that we'd hear and then be like, that's ridiculous.
00:09:43.399 --> 00:09:45.320
And then three years later we're like, you know what?
00:09:45.320 --> 00:09:46.309
That person was right.
00:09:46.309 --> 00:09:47.029
We gotta kill that.
00:09:48.024 --> 00:09:48.234
Okay.
00:09:48.234 --> 00:09:48.953
So you did use.
00:09:49.043 --> 00:09:51.033
Some of your feedback that you received
00:09:51.068 --> 00:09:51.489
Oh, yeah.
00:09:51.668 --> 00:09:53.109
We used a lot of feedback.
00:09:53.208 --> 00:09:54.739
A lot of it we didn't use too.
00:09:54.788 --> 00:09:59.024
It's some, I think some of the art is knowing what to listen to and what not to.
00:09:59.519 --> 00:10:04.918
But yeah, I think, it was like patterns would emerge you know, and it was like gathering data, and you're like, oh, okay.
00:10:04.969 --> 00:10:07.849
Clearly this is a blind spot, or this isn't working.
00:10:07.849 --> 00:10:10.513
There was this beginning scene was like polishing it turd.
00:10:10.543 --> 00:10:15.082
And everyone hated it and then we did it in the sandbox the scene sucks.
00:10:16.393 --> 00:10:19.732
Get rid of this yeah, it was really helpful.
00:10:19.773 --> 00:10:30.332
What's nice I think with having a writing partner is we would have our own discussions or disagreements, but we both love the film and we're shepherding it and we had each other and we really do love the same things.
00:10:30.332 --> 00:10:31.682
Like we love the show girls.
00:10:31.682 --> 00:10:36.123
We really wanted it to be the same kind of thing and we're like spiritually aligned in that way.
00:10:36.123 --> 00:10:45.548
So we always had each other to lean on and root for each other, which I think is what's really great about a writing partner versus going solo.
00:10:45.618 --> 00:10:48.817
You just have this barrier from the world, which is nice.
00:10:49.258 --> 00:10:53.508
Yeah, I think Terrell was really helpful in helping me to see we.
00:10:54.187 --> 00:10:55.687
We have to solve this on our own.
00:10:55.687 --> 00:10:59.288
Like we can't listen like I feel like I'd be like, oh, should we do this?
00:10:59.288 --> 00:10:59.857
Should we do that?
00:10:59.857 --> 00:11:02.248
Like they're saying this and she's they're not solving
00:11:03.113 --> 00:11:03.273
in the family.
00:11:03.278 --> 00:11:03.868
We have to solve.
00:11:03.898 --> 00:11:04.798
Yeah, exactly.
00:11:04.947 --> 00:11:07.498
They can show us what's wrong, but they can't tell us how to solve it.
00:11:07.732 --> 00:11:09.082
Yeah, I'm a big fan of that.
00:11:09.293 --> 00:11:10.013
I'm like, cool.
00:11:10.013 --> 00:11:11.153
Thank you for telling me the problem.
00:11:11.153 --> 00:11:11.932
Do not tell me how to fix it.
00:11:11.947 --> 00:11:12.368
Yeah.
00:11:13.081 --> 00:11:14.003
You can pitch me.
00:11:14.003 --> 00:11:15.682
You can pitch me how to fix it though.
00:11:15.682 --> 00:11:18.533
I just don't like it when people like, it's yours.
00:11:18.533 --> 00:11:19.072
You know what I mean?
00:11:19.072 --> 00:11:22.633
And I try to do that when I give feedback too, hey, I see this issue.
00:11:22.633 --> 00:11:26.442
I'm pitching you an idea, but obviously it's yours to come up with the answer.
00:11:27.363 --> 00:11:30.033
Receiving and getting feedback is a whole art.
00:11:30.273 --> 00:11:31.283
It's really challenging.
00:11:36.965 --> 00:11:40.725
Knowing that you also directed the film and you're also a director.
00:11:40.754 --> 00:11:42.884
How does that play a role in your writing?
00:11:42.934 --> 00:11:48.095
Do you find that those two hats you wear, I guess we could say inform each other at all?
00:11:48.394 --> 00:11:53.985
This is my first time co-writing with somebody like this, and I feel like Meryl and I had this like child,
00:11:54.340 --> 00:11:54.629
Yeah.
00:11:54.995 --> 00:11:59.684
and we're like, it's like pretty wi, and this is one of the longest like relationships I've ever had.
00:11:59.735 --> 00:12:05.115
Seven years working for free on something, basically, and like birthing it into the world.
00:12:05.115 --> 00:12:08.565
So that's, and we barely knew each started working we prior.
00:12:09.480 --> 00:12:14.590
We had known each other at work and thought we were cool like beyond that, didn't know well.
00:12:14.590 --> 00:12:15.549
So that's interesting.
00:12:15.580 --> 00:12:17.722
It was like a arranged marriage,
00:12:17.845 --> 00:12:18.245
Or Yeah.
00:12:18.245 --> 00:12:20.294
Or a one night stand that that turned
00:12:20.360 --> 00:12:22.070
a decade long relationship.
00:12:22.085 --> 00:12:22.375
Yeah.
00:12:24.825 --> 00:12:29.394
And, I write my own stuff that I wanna direct, and I've developed stuff that I.
00:12:30.595 --> 00:12:32.034
I'm directing, but haven't written.
00:12:32.034 --> 00:12:35.845
So it's interesting how they're all different, like with how it materialized in Katie's Mom.
00:12:35.845 --> 00:12:38.695
It's like I was really cognizant of visual moments.
00:12:39.654 --> 00:12:47.595
'Cause Meryl's really good at comedy and dialogue and I just wanted to make sure that, when you're watching it, that there's these visual pillars.
00:12:47.595 --> 00:12:53.865
And we were also trying to, do something that was very producible and then we got carried away, scenes and we had to pull it back.
00:12:54.554 --> 00:12:58.394
But it was like, how do we make sure that this is visually interesting?
00:12:58.615 --> 00:13:04.995
Even though the fireworks are really this love triangle between the mom and the daughter and the boyfriend, just, you wanna have visual stuff going on.
00:13:04.995 --> 00:13:15.495
So that's something I was thinking about from the get go and that I was really glad that, that stuff was there on set because it did feel like it feels like a real movie.
00:13:15.495 --> 00:13:17.115
It doesn't feel like you're stuck in a room.
00:13:17.544 --> 00:13:25.445
Not that, it would've been otherwise, but it was, just thinking about that stuff from the get go, I think was like my director brain more so than my writing brain.
00:13:26.159 --> 00:13:32.884
And how does, I am always curious how you work with the visual on the page with writing.
00:13:32.985 --> 00:13:34.524
If you have a process for that?
00:13:34.524 --> 00:13:39.139
Do you see things and then you're writing it out or one comes before the other?
00:13:39.450 --> 00:13:40.889
I feel like I'm a visual writer.
00:13:40.889 --> 00:13:42.690
Like I see things before I start writing.
00:13:42.690 --> 00:13:45.700
But I know Meryl you've expressed that you don't see that.
00:13:46.174 --> 00:13:49.325
It's more, it more comes to me through the ears.
00:13:49.654 --> 00:13:49.924
The ears.
00:13:50.284 --> 00:13:50.434
Oh,
00:13:50.975 --> 00:13:53.014
more, yeah, more dial.
00:13:53.014 --> 00:13:53.105
I
00:13:53.254 --> 00:13:58.424
I feel like the words being on the page is where it starts.
00:13:58.575 --> 00:14:03.585
And then I can get in this fugue state where it's like really tapping into my mind's eye or my imagination.
00:14:03.585 --> 00:14:11.205
And I feel almost like the words are coming to me from some other plane, which is, and that's always really good that stuff is excellent.
00:14:11.965 --> 00:14:18.504
Lance Black, the guy who wrote like Harvey Milk, he says he literally watches the movie in his head, and I don't do that.
00:14:18.504 --> 00:14:21.894
I'm, I, because I think there's a different, there's the film you write, the film you shoot.
00:14:21.924 --> 00:14:22.914
In the film you edit.
00:14:22.914 --> 00:14:25.634
You have to throw out every version as you go.
00:14:25.644 --> 00:14:27.205
Don't try to make it what it was before.
00:14:27.205 --> 00:14:27.899
Like you have to accept.
00:14:28.750 --> 00:14:31.629
You know what you shot and you have to, and make it in the edit kind of.
00:14:32.034 --> 00:14:41.565
So yeah, I feel like it's almost in my mind's eye, in this weird, liminal space or something where I see it, but I don't see it rendered in like tons of detail where then I get on set I'm like, has to be this way.
00:14:42.154 --> 00:14:47.004
Which I think is good'cause I think it leaves you open to what's in front of you when you get there.
00:14:47.950 --> 00:14:59.529
I think that's what's really, I think amazing about moving image film is it goes through, I like how you said that there's three different films because you're crossing mediums as this thing is being born.
00:14:59.809 --> 00:15:01.399
There's these different evolutions.
00:15:01.450 --> 00:15:02.350
Do you.
00:15:03.549 --> 00:15:09.789
Do you recall any specific things that got cut from each step, like from the writing to the filming?
00:15:09.789 --> 00:15:19.870
And then from the filming to the editing were there scenes that stand out to you or moments or characters that had to cut in addition to your cemetery of lost friends?
00:15:21.340 --> 00:15:23.980
Yeah, there's a cemetery of dead characters that never made it.
00:15:23.980 --> 00:15:25.325
Or an alternative universe when
00:15:26.019 --> 00:15:27.414
Yeah, let's, that's nicer.
00:15:27.504 --> 00:15:30.985
I, and I think that they all do inform what was there.
00:15:30.985 --> 00:15:35.335
I feel like it, it is richer than what because it's been thought up.
00:15:35.384 --> 00:15:40.195
I do feel like the, all the dead people infor there's a history that's there.
00:15:41.335 --> 00:15:41.634
Yeah.
00:15:41.634 --> 00:15:43.345
And we definitely had to kill the babies.
00:15:43.345 --> 00:15:50.850
What was mind blowing to me is that our script was a hundred and five pages max.
00:15:51.595 --> 00:15:52.825
And the rule is a page a minute.
00:15:53.754 --> 00:15:56.095
Final draft or whatever in the screenplay format.
00:15:56.154 --> 00:16:02.894
And then we also had some consistent visual pillar moments that weren't like overwritten because the style of the script was like comedy script.
00:16:02.894 --> 00:16:08.434
And that doesn't really have a lot of it's not like a drama script where it's all these like poetic descriptions, it just doesn't fit.
00:16:08.945 --> 00:16:13.115
So we had straddled a medium there with the visual descriptions, but they weren't super long.
00:16:13.684 --> 00:16:19.845
But then we got into the edit bay and the entire film was two and a half hours long, two hours and 45 minutes
00:16:19.904 --> 00:16:20.235
Okay.
00:16:20.235 --> 00:16:21.375
That's long for a comedy.
00:16:21.375 --> 00:16:21.585
Yeah.
00:16:22.460 --> 00:16:24.465
It's like torture for comedy
00:16:24.659 --> 00:16:26.100
One hour ahead to go.
00:16:26.100 --> 00:16:26.519
Yeah.
00:16:27.375 --> 00:16:34.024
yeah, I think what I learned is like with the drama- comedy, emotions take so long to process.
00:16:34.024 --> 00:16:39.254
It's not like a Friend script where it's super punchy and they're talking super fast or whatever.
00:16:39.884 --> 00:16:40.904
These emotions.
00:16:40.914 --> 00:16:47.695
There's a scene where Nancy, the mom and Katie's mom is going through this car wash after the fallout and getting caught from the affair.
00:16:48.235 --> 00:16:56.085
And she has this like breakdown and I think it's two sentences if that in the screenplay, but then it plays for like 45 seconds in the movie.
00:16:56.894 --> 00:16:59.654
And it's like those kinds of things ended up happening.
00:16:59.715 --> 00:17:02.934
And the actors did really great with the dramatic moments.
00:17:03.509 --> 00:17:04.859
And you have to let them play out.
00:17:04.859 --> 00:17:05.940
You can't clip them.
00:17:05.940 --> 00:17:07.680
That's it's like taking the gold out or whatever.
00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:08.940
So we had to cut an hour.
00:17:08.940 --> 00:17:15.750
We definitely had to kill a lot of babies Some of them I wasn't too sad about, but they just didn't work for whatever reason.
00:17:15.789 --> 00:17:20.894
And some things didn't work because for instance Dina Meyer, who plays Nancy, she's so great.
00:17:21.789 --> 00:17:25.210
We wrote Nancy to be a little bit of a doormat initially.
00:17:25.210 --> 00:17:28.855
And you just, Dina's just you don't believe that she's for one second.
00:17:28.855 --> 00:17:35.454
So there was like one scene at a baby shower where her friends are sort of shitting on her and they had not invited her to this baby shower.
00:17:35.454 --> 00:17:40.285
And she comes in and she gets up the nerve to confront them, but it's like Dina Meyer.
00:17:40.795 --> 00:17:45.555
So like the scene just didn't work because she just, we didn't, and we didn't need it in the end.
00:17:45.585 --> 00:17:46.305
So stuff like that
00:17:46.434 --> 00:17:53.974
Right, and that was a scene we worked so hard on and rewrote so much, but just, yeah, the people who played those characters, it just didn't gel.
00:17:54.799 --> 00:17:55.099
yeah.
00:17:55.099 --> 00:17:58.190
And that's just the film you shoot, versus the film that you wrote.
00:17:58.609 --> 00:18:00.434
And I'm glad that, that scene got cut.
00:18:00.434 --> 00:18:07.575
I, it didn't work for various reasons, but then it, once you started to just whittle it down, rule it down, then it got like painful.
00:18:07.845 --> 00:18:13.315
But yeah, drama comedy is much longer than a page a minute is what I've learned.
00:18:13.855 --> 00:18:15.954
So I'm gonna keep that in mind for the next one.
00:18:22.973 --> 00:18:24.294
What are you working on now?
00:18:24.344 --> 00:18:25.963
Yeah, I'm excited about two projects.
00:18:26.878 --> 00:18:32.919
I just got funding for it's a web series pilot, but hopefully it would be developed into a full comedy series.
00:18:33.499 --> 00:18:46.608
It's inspired by my real life experience, substitute teaching, and it's called Subs and it's like a mockumentary type show, like Party Down in the world of subbing and really, captures the least respected profession in the world.
00:18:47.253 --> 00:18:53.814
But also is set in LA with all these kind of dreamers who are trying to make it big, but also are just like getting shit on daily.
00:18:54.243 --> 00:18:55.294
It's super fun.
00:18:55.703 --> 00:18:59.064
So we're gonna shoot that in the fall, which I'm really excited about.
00:18:59.114 --> 00:19:05.953
Erica Lane wrote that she's a really talented screenwriter that I met at Sundance when Marilyn and I were at Sundance a couple years ago.
00:19:06.403 --> 00:19:08.173
We were also there with Ariana a few
00:19:08.273 --> 00:19:08.364
ago.
00:19:08.368 --> 00:19:08.628
Oh yeah.
00:19:08.804 --> 00:19:09.193
oh yeah.
00:19:09.703 --> 00:19:10.304
Last year.
00:19:10.304 --> 00:19:10.693
Yeah.
00:19:11.068 --> 00:19:12.173
a room with Ariana.
00:19:12.324 --> 00:19:12.653
Oh yeah.
00:19:12.653 --> 00:19:13.433
That was fun.
00:19:14.749 --> 00:19:24.788
And also I just completed my next feature screenplay and that's called I Can't Find My Friends, and it's about three estranged friends in their early forties.
00:19:25.719 --> 00:19:29.318
And their fourth friend, they were like best friends in high school.
00:19:29.368 --> 00:19:32.009
Her dying wish was for them to reunite a burning man.
00:19:32.368 --> 00:19:48.288
And so they go and bring her ashes with them and then crazy shit starts happening, of course, but it's like a female hangover with heart and really fun and also inspired by real life experience going to Burning Man the last three years in a row.
00:19:48.499 --> 00:19:51.739
Hopefully I'll have some news when I Can't Find My Friends soon we'll see.
00:19:52.318 --> 00:19:52.828
Hustling.
00:19:52.828 --> 00:19:53.368
Hustling.
00:19:53.503 --> 00:19:53.864
hustling.
00:19:53.864 --> 00:19:55.453
That is the life out here.
00:19:55.743 --> 00:19:57.124
How do you stay motivated?
00:19:57.539 --> 00:19:59.190
I have an insane drive.
00:19:59.190 --> 00:20:00.450
It's a little psychotic.
00:20:00.539 --> 00:20:01.380
Meryl's seen it.
00:20:03.255 --> 00:20:03.884
Hey, own it.
00:20:03.884 --> 00:20:04.065
You.
00:20:04.065 --> 00:20:04.974
You got the gift.
00:20:05.055 --> 00:20:06.734
You take it and run with it.
00:20:08.109 --> 00:20:13.089
It can be to my own making Katie's Mom was such a fulfilling experience.
00:20:13.190 --> 00:20:14.690
Meryl and I wanted to do something.
00:20:14.690 --> 00:20:19.640
We took this leap of faith, put so much work into it and then did it.
00:20:20.240 --> 00:20:23.029
So I think that was, that's really inspiring and motivating.
00:20:23.839 --> 00:20:33.839
it was also really inspiring to be in creative control while shooting it and making it and to see that like you have that inside of you is like a really motivating factor.
00:20:34.605 --> 00:20:40.335
And I think also the way people responded to the film, like women are just like gaga for the movie.
00:20:40.335 --> 00:20:42.464
They're like, oh my God, I feel so horny afterwards.
00:20:42.464 --> 00:20:44.835
I think it's really delivered what we wanted to deliver.
00:20:45.585 --> 00:20:47.714
And I think that's really also inspiring.
00:20:47.805 --> 00:20:58.490
it's like rewarding to continue to make this type like art tells women's stories, like messy women's stories I think is still really needed.
00:20:58.490 --> 00:21:02.210
So I think those are some motivating factors, that keep it going.
00:21:02.789 --> 00:21:03.990
I hate the blank page.
00:21:03.990 --> 00:21:08.549
That is the worst thing for me in the world So like with, I can't find my friends.
00:21:08.849 --> 00:21:10.710
The hardest part was writing the first draft.
00:21:11.849 --> 00:21:20.615
And what I found is I'm just, I'm in a couple different writers groups through USC where I went to undergrad or like through the sandbox and I'll get in an accountability group.
00:21:21.315 --> 00:21:29.904
I did one right before I went to Burning Man last year for eight weeks, and I wrote almost the full first draft, but I was like, oh, I'm gonna get more stories while I'm there.
00:21:29.904 --> 00:21:31.255
And then I finished it when I got back.
00:21:31.255 --> 00:21:35.125
So I break it out, break it into pieces so it becomes manageable.
00:21:36.115 --> 00:21:36.894
Nice.
00:21:36.894 --> 00:21:40.944
Yeah, Scary.
00:21:41.769 --> 00:21:43.480
Even thinking about it
00:21:43.555 --> 00:21:43.704
It's ew.
00:21:44.695 --> 00:21:45.759
Just say what?
00:21:47.470 --> 00:21:49.420
How do you feel about the blank page, Meryl?
00:21:50.734 --> 00:21:55.325
Weirdly, I write, I start in blank pages when I'm writing fiction.
00:21:55.325 --> 00:21:57.095
Like I don't open up the document.
00:21:57.095 --> 00:22:05.045
I start a new document, which is maybe weird'cause I'm like, I don't wanna see all the rest of it and then I paste it in at some point to a bigger.
00:22:05.765 --> 00:22:10.075
But I feel like I'm a little bit more overwhelmed by a bigger chunk.
00:22:11.575 --> 00:22:21.295
Like having a bigger manuscript is worse to me on some level than being like, I'm just starting on document eight of all my unclosed things.
00:22:21.295 --> 00:22:21.474
And
00:22:22.375 --> 00:22:26.089
so you're like I know you guys are using the word sandbox is a entity or it's a
00:22:26.369 --> 00:22:28.018
but I'm, yeah, like playing in, but you're playing in the
00:22:28.200 --> 00:22:29.240
in the sandbox.
00:22:29.309 --> 00:22:31.259
I think I like writing better than editing.
00:22:32.119 --> 00:22:34.279
I'm like, oh, this is all fresh and new.
00:22:34.279 --> 00:22:34.549
Yeah.
00:22:34.549 --> 00:22:35.809
I like the playing part.
00:22:37.015 --> 00:22:37.305
Then
00:22:37.654 --> 00:22:41.015
Or maybe that's the difference between more of a director versus a writer.
00:22:41.045 --> 00:22:50.224
Because I feel like directors are just inherently like kinetic, like they like to react to things and that's a really strong, like that's important to have that when you're on
00:22:50.482 --> 00:22:50.809
mm-hmm.
00:22:50.845 --> 00:22:51.045
Right,
00:22:51.244 --> 00:22:55.234
like you're reacting to what's in front of you versus building whole worlds
00:22:55.262 --> 00:22:55.575
Right.
00:22:56.359 --> 00:22:57.200
Nothing.
00:22:57.380 --> 00:23:01.009
So that might be a key difference, just temperament or personality.
00:23:01.339 --> 00:23:01.630
Yeah.
00:23:02.234 --> 00:23:14.365
So I'm bouncing quickly back to the series you're working on and how do you find working with other, like when you're not writing and you have to work with a screenwriter, how do you handle that?
00:23:15.634 --> 00:23:18.085
This is my first time, developing material that.
00:23:18.869 --> 00:23:27.549
I'm not writing at all, like that I'm having someone else write and I'm just like talking to them about my experience and, coming up with the episode ideas and bits and stuff.
00:23:28.430 --> 00:23:29.359
It's been interesting.
00:23:29.359 --> 00:23:33.529
I feel like it's forced me to be less in the weeds, which is good.
00:23:34.019 --> 00:23:37.099
Not get, let's retype every sentence together.
00:23:37.309 --> 00:23:48.545
Which is good in a way, I, I have enjoyed it so far a lot, and I feel like it's captured what I wanted to capture and then it's nice to have something like, I can't find my friends, which is like super personal.
00:23:49.144 --> 00:23:50.734
Have that very much be mine.
00:23:50.884 --> 00:23:52.825
So it's, yeah I think it's nice to have them.
00:23:53.789 --> 00:24:02.265
Those different things of ways of doing, but I like all of it, I like also a producer, so I think all of it collaborating is really fun.
00:24:03.055 --> 00:24:07.585
Yeah, I can I can identify with that, That's why I enjoy being a freelancer.
00:24:07.644 --> 00:24:16.255
I wanna turn on different parts of my brain for different projects and it also gives you a chance to see other things through a different lens or with a different light.
00:24:16.255 --> 00:24:24.305
Like I imagine you guys have both spoken to what you've learned from working on Katie's Mom and then you bring that knowledge to your other projects.
00:24:24.545 --> 00:24:29.615
So it all builds and I feel like some people who only have one specific job don't understand that.
00:24:29.615 --> 00:24:33.005
Like, all these things come together and it's, I dunno.
00:24:33.095 --> 00:24:34.144
It is, it's fulfilling.
00:24:34.144 --> 00:24:37.295
It's, and it's also I love a challenge and it sounds like you do too.
00:24:37.295 --> 00:24:38.115
I feel like.
00:24:38.214 --> 00:24:38.664
do, I I do.
00:24:44.924 --> 00:24:48.884
I know you have to head out if there's any last things you wanna share,
00:24:48.934 --> 00:24:52.954
Yeah, so you could watch Katie's Mom for free on Tubi or Roku.
00:24:53.615 --> 00:24:55.775
You can also rent it on Amazon Prime.
00:24:56.345 --> 00:25:01.865
And we'd love for people to go and watch it and then give it a positive rating on IMDB.
00:25:02.204 --> 00:25:12.744
Places like IMDB are not as amenable to female focused content as we would like like My Best Friend's Wedding, which totally influenced Katie's mom.
00:25:12.744 --> 00:25:16.154
It's a classic, one of the best anti romcom romcoms ever.
00:25:16.154 --> 00:25:21.525
It has a 6.4 on IMDB, and that's because IMDB skews male.
00:25:22.349 --> 00:25:24.809
And it also features an unlikable.
00:25:24.960 --> 00:25:27.180
She's amazing, but she's doing awful things.
00:25:27.180 --> 00:25:28.559
Unlikable female lead.
00:25:29.009 --> 00:25:30.619
And that's frustrating.
00:25:31.170 --> 00:25:34.365
The IMDB score then feeds into all these other platforms.
00:25:35.400 --> 00:25:39.250
I was gonna say, most people don't know that you don't think to go rate something on IMDB.
00:25:39.319 --> 00:25:40.194
But that's what's showing up.
00:25:41.490 --> 00:25:48.390
And then, so we have a film that's really aimed at older getting rated in a space that's for younger men.
00:25:49.019 --> 00:25:53.859
And we need really as many like people that love the film to come and rate it as possible.
00:25:53.859 --> 00:25:57.789
And, we just really, appreciate that support.
00:25:58.684 --> 00:26:00.275
Tell your friends about it.
00:26:00.345 --> 00:26:04.160
Women really love this film, so we wanna find our audience as much as possible.
00:26:04.544 --> 00:26:04.814
Yeah.
00:26:04.814 --> 00:26:10.169
And we do need women in all shades of being human.
00:26:10.169 --> 00:26:12.598
Like we're not just certain archetypes.
00:26:12.598 --> 00:26:13.949
There's so much more.
00:26:14.229 --> 00:26:16.189
So that's why I really enjoyed the film.
00:26:16.278 --> 00:26:22.098
It was like nice to see I would say a lot of the characters do things and you're like, no, don't do that.
00:26:22.098 --> 00:26:23.479
Or you're like, yes, do that.
00:26:23.479 --> 00:26:31.159
And so it feels very much like you're seeing real people who have these different facets of specifically I'm thinking of.
00:26:31.743 --> 00:26:41.963
Nancy and Katie our lead female characters just doing things and having life happen, and sometimes you don't make the best choice and that's so relatable.
00:26:42.544 --> 00:26:50.114
And then of course, a sexy scene with a woman who's over 25 is, we need more of that, so kudos.
00:26:50.114 --> 00:26:50.173
Yeah.
00:26:51.125 --> 00:26:51.453
Thank you.
00:26:51.523 --> 00:26:51.814
Yeah.
00:26:51.898 --> 00:26:53.189
I'm so glad you enjoyed that.
00:26:53.338 --> 00:26:54.374
That's we're very proud of it.
00:26:55.865 --> 00:26:56.193
Thank you.
00:27:02.084 --> 00:27:02.983
we have a few more minutes.
00:27:02.983 --> 00:27:10.233
So let's, catch up Meryl was like in Mexico for a month on sabbatical.
00:27:12.138 --> 00:27:15.138
Mexico killed the right j jk.
00:27:16.294 --> 00:27:20.134
Do we, did we have any things that kept us from writing or made us write?
00:27:21.064 --> 00:27:21.513
Yeah.
00:27:21.513 --> 00:27:22.898
Or Or recently.
00:27:24.114 --> 00:27:24.564
I don't know.
00:27:24.564 --> 00:27:28.973
I feel like the fun of summer keeps me from writing.
00:27:29.493 --> 00:27:35.368
'Cause I'm just more interested in living life right now as opposed to processing it.
00:27:35.419 --> 00:27:39.909
However, I have had a few spurts of oh my God, I gotta write this right now.
00:27:40.209 --> 00:27:41.108
Like yesterday.
00:27:41.828 --> 00:27:44.528
What was I, oh, I was listening to a podcast of
00:27:45.669 --> 00:27:46.028
very
00:27:46.088 --> 00:27:46.328
inspiring.
00:27:46.453 --> 00:27:47.558
not, not our podcast.
00:27:47.634 --> 00:28:03.709
I was listening to another podcast and it inspired me to write out my characters as if I'm interviewing them and hearing their stories as a way to see where I want the story to go.
00:28:03.739 --> 00:28:08.709
'cause I was feeling a little I know what I wanna do, but I feel like I'm not quite sure and I thought that was.
00:28:09.084 --> 00:28:10.703
Would be a fun exercise.
00:28:10.778 --> 00:28:11.739
I think that is a fun
00:28:12.473 --> 00:28:20.394
So like literally just first person completely in the head of the character answering questions.
00:28:20.423 --> 00:28:24.054
So I was I started doing that and I was thinking about doing
00:28:25.163 --> 00:28:30.884
So I would say it's all right to take the season off and it's all right to fictional people.
00:28:31.229 --> 00:28:33.538
It's all right if the universe is your daddy.
00:28:33.584 --> 00:28:33.733
Yes.
00:28:36.148 --> 00:28:36.449
not
00:28:36.523 --> 00:28:37.173
Not all right.
00:28:37.453 --> 00:28:38.614
To support ice.
00:28:38.953 --> 00:28:39.223
True
00:28:39.275 --> 00:28:42.453
That We came up with a new thing called Say No to Ice Daddies.
00:28:42.483 --> 00:28:42.693
'cause
00:28:42.693 --> 00:28:42.874
there were
00:28:42.903 --> 00:28:52.669
are these, when we, I went to this pride event and there were these they seemed like they were undercover cops who were trying to pass as a, you.
00:28:54.003 --> 00:28:54.963
A gay man.
00:28:55.229 --> 00:28:55.808
Oh really?
00:28:56.713 --> 00:28:58.064
Wearing like a mesh shirt.
00:28:58.064 --> 00:29:01.903
But he was like hanging out with the cops the whole time and did not even talk to anybody.
00:29:02.023 --> 00:29:04.003
And we were like, that's an ice daddy.
00:29:04.064 --> 00:29:05.828
And we're like, say no to ice daddies.
00:29:06.058 --> 00:29:06.689
I like that.
00:29:06.689 --> 00:29:06.894
That's great.
00:29:06.894 --> 00:29:07.054
So
00:29:07.104 --> 00:29:16.319
new slogan That's a wrap on this episode of, it's All Write.
00:29:16.339 --> 00:29:23.450
You can listen to other episodes on all the streaming podcasts sites.
00:29:23.559 --> 00:29:33.980
Share, like, rate our show, support the show as well as Katie's Mom, which You can stream on Roku, Tubi and Amazon.
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:38.240
There will be links in the show notes if that makes things easier.
00:29:38.529 --> 00:29:39.599
Until next time,
00:29:39.916 --> 00:29:40.757
thanks for listening.
