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I'd like to welcome Sam Eden, who is the founder of Mindability Business Coaching, a global business coach for HR and talent professionals, a best-selling author, a keynote speaker, and the host of Mind Ability Matters.
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In the last five years, she and her team have helped over 260 founders build six, seven, and eight figure businesses.
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Sam, thank you so much for being here.
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Before we get into anything else, I'd really like for you to walk us through your career journey and how you got here.
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Oh Laura, you did a great job.
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And thank you.
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It's lovely to be here.
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So yeah, I have found myself building HR and talent businesses over the last 26 years.
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And my goodness, I wish there was so much collaboration as we have now.
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But I come at it from a very different point of view.
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I'm a commercial beast first and foremost.
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So I had to learn the world of HR.
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You know, what's going on for a CHRO?
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What are their battles and how can I be a real ally to them?
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So that allowed me to build and collaborate with my first HR talent business, as I said, over 26 years ago.
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So fast forward today, as you said, I've helped build over 260 HR and talent businesses, and I've had the real privilege of being able to do that across the UK, USA, Canada.
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We've had clients in Australia, New Zealand, Kenya, some really interesting and wonderful places.
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We fundamentally believe that without these great consultants, the world of work will not change.
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We need that inspiration and a different way of thinking to move the dial forward.
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So it's it's a better world of work for all of us.
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I love that.
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And what an interesting career to get into.
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It's definitely not one of those things that when you're going off to university, you say, I want to be that when I grow up one day.
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So tell me how did you find this path for yourself?
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Do you know what is actually a really funny story?
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So I'd been in several other businesses, either I'd own them or I'd been a shareholder, and I'd actually got one HR consultancy right up in the search rankings of all my team had because I worked in in an SEO organization and was shareholder and partner there.
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And for one reason and another, I left the business and this organisation said, Sam, can you come work with us?
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And I went, Absolutely not.
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The last thing you want is me as a disruptive employee.
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So they offered me a shareholding, and that was the start of my journey, really, where I learnt what HR did.
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And I often do these talks all around the world where, you know, I I kind of use my bushish kind of slightly awkwardness to say, you know, I used to see this big door with the word personnel written on it, and you know, there's these beings behind it, and I had no idea what they did in corporate.
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And so I learned what they did and how tough they had it.
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It became a bit of a mission when we were selling the services into them.
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How can we make you look good?
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And then when the pandemic struck, I'd always wanted to build mindability.
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I brought it forward by five years, and I really felt that HRs were leading the world of work.
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I know that they're getting battered a lot today, but that's all part of the change we're going through.
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So yeah, that's a little bit about my journey and how I ended up here.
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So I like that you mentioned they're getting battered right now, because that was the next question that I was gonna ask you.
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So a couple topics on that.
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So, firstly, what is HR versus the misconceptions about HR?
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Because great question.
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There's a lot of talk out there of, you know, is HR relevant?
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What do they actually do?
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So share with us what is it.
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Okay, and thank you for asking that question.
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I love it.
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So, yeah, you're right.
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Let's start with the misconception that they are the party organizers, they are there to buy all the Christmas and holiday gifts, that they're there once leadership has decided to go the route that they were advised not to go by HR to clear up the mess.
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So I think that's what's they're not, and that's how they're being widely used, not all over the place, because in some organizations what they're doing really well is this workforce planning.
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You know, we live in a very different world, right?
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And that world, the AI tools or the methodology we're using today is going to change tomorrow.
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So now those are more of a transformational role.
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It's kind of how do we work with AI?
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How do we change the world of work?
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We know that communication between the generations is very, very different to one another.
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I mean, when I talk to my stepson, I love him dearly, and literally sometimes I need a dictionary.
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So I have no idea what he's just said to me.
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So they've dealing with that generational aspect and the different aspirations of that.
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So I think the workforce planning, staying relevant, being able to pivot, be agile, that's some of the great work now that HRs are doing.
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So they are there before the decision's being made rather than after a decision's being made.
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Yeah, and I love that you shared all that because even working in corporate, I'm surrounded by people that don't have any idea about what HR is.
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It's just where you go when you're in trouble, right?
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Or it's to your point for the party.
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Yeah, exactly.
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And oh, it's only HR.
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Oh, we'll make that decision and tell them afterwards.
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So HRs are also becoming some of the best salespeople on the planet.
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Come work here before.
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Actually, know to the CEO and CFO, COO.
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This is why we need to be in the conversation now before you decide to make that decision, because we can help you not only save money and cost, save time, get the right people in the right seat, and bring your commercial plans to life.
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I love everything about what you're saying because my passion and my focus is related to that Gen Z population that is entering the workforce and having a difficult time adjusting to the workforce in a lot of ways.
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And I love that of your thought on bringing HR into the conversation ever because there's so many folks that are paying for the problem of raising these, that bringing in this talent the proper way or speaking to them the proper way.
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It's such a waste of money.
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My goodness.
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One is that, and let's call it, you know, the generation before me.
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I know I look old, but honestly, the generation before me would be like, hey, 30 years in corporate, whoopy-doo, now I've got the gold clock or the Rolex watch.
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It's like, I don't want the freaking Rolex watch or the clock.
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I want freedom.
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I want to be able to work when I want to work.
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I want to be able to call my hours.
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I want work that's really interesting.
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Now, if I'm saying that as my generation who's enlightened, can you imagine what the next not just two, three, four, five generations want out of the workplace?
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And they're gonna get it.
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And good luck to them because we need to change things.
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Yeah, I love that.
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And they're the first generation that's actually vocalizing it in a way where people are listening to it.
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So I have a lot of hope and inspiration and aspirations for the next set of talent that's that's coming up.
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Absolutely.
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Me too.
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Want to talk about more of your company, your focus.
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And I know that you work on a global scale.
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So I'd love to hear more on how does HR, your focus, the talent and whatnot, change from country to country or region to region.
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Do you know I get asked this question a lot, and I think it's a really interesting one.
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What I tend to find is most people think, huh, you know, this region is better than us, or we're there's never we're better than this region.
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And that's the thing I like.
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It's it's more aspirational.
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But here's the thing: what is true is the challenge is the same across the board.
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However, what we're seeing, because obviously in my world, we're but helping people to build businesses.
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Things aren't priced, in my opinion, right in the UK.
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You know, we really work with our clients to make sure that they are selling at their worth and to be able to sell that value piece rather than be a race to the bottom.
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I think we're Brits and hate, I can say this, we're very good at being very apologetic and not asking for for our worth.
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And then again, there are parts in the States as well, where we're seeing that the pricing will be very different.
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And maybe some of the challenges will be different.
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And then, Laura, obviously you need to take into account sectors.
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So globally, we're seeing some sectors that are doing way better than us.
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Our clients who are in healthcare, biotech, fintech, globally are doing really well.
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But also those, again, on a global basis, who are retail, hospitality, not so much right now.
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Sam, you mentioned one thing really important that I struggle with myself.
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And I think a lot of people, and I know that there's conversations on women are bad at this, and yeah.
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I think definitely, but in general, I think it's something that a lot of people struggle with is defining your value when you are creating your own business.
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So, how do you approach that?
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Because it's so hard, and I'm so guilty too, of just, oh, it's okay, I'll lower my price.
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It's okay, it's not okay.
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It's not okay.
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And I love this question.
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This is one of my favorite questions, especially for women, because we are all so guilty of it, right?
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I've been guilty of it, still am, and sometimes, you know, I'm challenged by my own team with it.
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And here's the thing, I always ask everyone, what was the impact you had in corporate?
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What were those times that you sat at the table and you were the only one who stood up for X?
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When you look at a growing organization that you were part of, how many of those employees did you hire personally?
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And how did that help grow the business?
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That time the CEO made a really bad decision and you gave the advice and they did it anyway.
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How much was you coming in to clear up that mess, save the business?
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How much of you invested in your own personal development?
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That's your worth.
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I love that.
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I need to internalize that for my own conversations this week.
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Absolutely.
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But that's a good way to think about it.
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It's because when you're creating your own business, your only status quo is against yourself, right?
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So that's correct.
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And so when you think back to a point where you had other data points to react off of it, suddenly becomes a little bit more simple.
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Exactly.
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And the reason why I'm so emotive about it is I will kind of want to take you back to that part where you remember where your shoulders were broad and you were, you know, kind of standing firm with it, because that kind of emotion will take you through to you having the peer-to-peer conversation with you clients, for you selling your worth.
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And when you hear an objection, because six times out of seven, an objection can be overturned.
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It's curiosity.
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But we accept that objection as a no rather than, hey, I'm just curious.
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Help me to buy from you.
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Mm-hmm.
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Mm-hmm.
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And kind of going back to myself, because I completely resonate with this as an entrepreneur, it was so easy to talk about those things and sell those things when they were a product or a service that you were responsible for representing.
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But suddenly when you're representing yourself, the confidence just isn't there in the same way.
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Why can we talk about products and services in a way that they're so attractive and easy to sell and you can defend?
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And then when it's yourself, you're like, I don't know.
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Laura, I love and I absolutely agree.
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But here's the thing: do you want to work with that person?
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Right?
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Because now we have a choice.
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And I think this is the thing.
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When you're an employee, if anything goes wrong, your whole world falls apart, right?
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That one source of income has gone.
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Do you know what?
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If we fall out with a client, as long as we leave with good grace and dignity, so what?
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There's another client just around the corner.
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Right.
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And when we're having these prospect calls, as far as I'm concerned, I am seeing if I want to work with you.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, that is true.
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It's just a mind shift change, which is why I really like the title of your company.
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Mind ability, right?
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Because you help us think different about it.
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So I want to talk a little bit about the types of founders and entrepreneurs that come to your company to get advice, to get support.
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What are those sort of qualities that make those founders create a successful HR brand?
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Great question.
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A lot of the time it's that belief of understand my outcome.
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And Laura, the the mechanical side of it is I want to replace my corporate income, right?
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I think the logical, the this is where I want to be.
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I know we've had a couple of conversations, but for me, it's outcome-based.
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You know, what is the outcome you want to get for your business?
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And I'll give you some examples.
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I actually want to have five holidays a year.
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I'm a single mum and I've got to put my kid through university.
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I want the extension on the house.
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I want insert here.
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And that's the outcome we're working toward because you can visualize that.
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So when I look at the commonality in terms of who they are, they want to build a business.
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Now that business might be them as a solopreneur, it might be that they have a bunch of 1099s, or they want to recruit and have full time.
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That's their decision and prerogative.
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But they all have a clear outcome and focus, and that's that they want to build a business, not have a hobby.
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There's so much of that commonality.
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Are most of them scared?
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Absolutely.
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Do most of them get frustrated and have ups and downs?
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Yeah, they're human beings.
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And they have a desire to get to this point.
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Mm-hmm.
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Mm-hmm.
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So when you work with your clients, how are you helping them to visualize that?
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Because I know there's so many visualization techniques that are out there.
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I right behind where we're talking is I have my huge vision board that is behind me every single day.
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And I actually work on it once a quarter, and which is really nice that it's not changing as much as it used to, because I used to change it so frequently, but now I just kind of like will pick something off and put something back on.
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So what are your visualization techniques that you work with your clients on?
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So firstly, I love the techniques that you've explained.
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For me, I hadn't realized till the other day.
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Side note, I've since I was about eight or nine, I've kept what I call book book.
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And every single book I've read, I have recorded.
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And I have their title, the author, and the month in which I finished it.
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It's quite sad.
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It is relevant to this conversation in that that visualization comes from my conversation with them because I want it to sit here in their heart as they're working.
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Because that head and heart alignment, and it's not woo, you know, we all have instinct.
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We're animals at the end of the day, and I want them to work with that.
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Then comes the commercial sense side of it, which is okay, let's now take your business and your services and let's start to map that out.
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And we'll just work it back.
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Because if we can work it back and you hold that, Lori, you're clearly a visual person, so for you it goes on your board.
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For me, it's up here in my mind what I'm trying to visualize.
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And I talk about it constantly with my friends.
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So it keeps it alive, it's a presence for me.
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So however someone visualizes what they want, we work that way.
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But for me, it's also important that not only do they visualize it, they commercialise it.
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Mm-hmm.
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Mm-hmm.
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And that's the second phase, right?
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And probably the part that moves it from an idea, a dream, to reality.
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Exactly.
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So now let's put the hard work in.
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Because the most successful businesses, Laura, they're boring.
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You know, I love having fun.
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I'm actually quite a calm person, although I'm a big extrovert and network.
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Yeah, you are.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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But the thing for me is in order to be successful, it's the systems, the processes, and having everything mapped out so you can analyze it.
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And I do that on a frequent basis.
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I drive the team and myself nuts because it's, you know, okay, this is working.
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This is not.
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Where do we pivot, change, move?
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Mm-hmm.
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Well, it has created tremendous success for entrepreneurs that you worked with.
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So do you want to share with us some examples of people that you've taken through the process and what can they expect on the other side of working with you?
00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:03.840
Yeah, absolutely.
00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:08.159
So we built over the last five or six years our mastermind program.
00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:15.519
The feedback we get the whole time is it's we're commercial again, going back to that word, we're commercializing their dreams.
00:16:15.679 --> 00:16:18.000
We're putting the systems and processes in place.
00:16:18.159 --> 00:16:26.799
We're helping them not only to sell, but then to cross-sell and upsell and be better account managers, to analyse everything, to understand when they pull the levers in their business.
00:16:26.960 --> 00:16:31.120
So not only are their own CEOs, they're their own COOs and CFOs.
00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:34.960
So what has that led to your question in terms of them being successful?
00:16:35.120 --> 00:16:40.320
So we've had one client who came through the mastermind last year, fresh out of corporate, not a single client.
00:16:40.480 --> 00:16:43.600
She got her first$30,000 a month contract.
00:16:43.840 --> 00:16:45.919
We had another again, fresh out of corporate.
00:16:46.000 --> 00:16:48.559
She had no clients, she left after 10 weeks with five.
00:16:48.720 --> 00:16:54.240
We've had others who just stalled and needed to come through to be able to reignite themselves.
00:16:54.320 --> 00:16:59.200
And we had one who really has stayed close to my heart and I'm still good friends with them today.
00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:00.799
Had a business and I had no idea.
00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:03.759
The husband and wife's business, they'd been in business for 10 years.
00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:07.519
I had no idea how bad things and business was.
00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:12.079
By the end of it, we'd helped generate over$250,000 after the 10 weeks.
00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:17.200
Their business was back on track, but the most important thing, they had belief in their business again as well.
00:17:17.680 --> 00:17:19.200
To me, it was just a beautiful thing.
00:17:19.279 --> 00:17:22.480
It wasn't just that we'd done what we were paid to do.
00:17:22.960 --> 00:17:26.960
We were able to help them keep that momentum and keep that mindset going.
00:17:27.359 --> 00:17:27.680
Yeah.
00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:43.200
And I love that you keep repeating the word mindset because I know in building my own business, sometimes having someone that you could talk to work things through, they unlock that one little thing that makes all of the difference for how you move ahead.
00:17:43.359 --> 00:17:49.440
And it's great to work with someone that's done it one, two dozens of times that you're like, you know what?
00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:54.559
If I work with them better often than not, I will have a success because of it.
00:17:54.880 --> 00:17:55.440
Absolutely.
00:17:55.519 --> 00:17:56.960
And you know, it's really interesting.
00:17:57.039 --> 00:18:00.480
I did an exercise this morning, didn't have a good day yesterday.
00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.039
You know, and I think we need to be real about this, right?
00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:09.279
You know, just because you've had a business for years and it's gone well and you've had multiple businesses, doesn't mean every day is sunshine and roses.
00:18:09.519 --> 00:18:09.920
It's not.
00:18:10.079 --> 00:18:11.680
They're not bunny rabbits every day.
00:18:11.839 --> 00:18:13.359
Yesterday was one of those awful days.
00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:14.000
And do you know what?
00:18:14.079 --> 00:18:16.640
I woke up this morning and I did something different.
00:18:16.799 --> 00:18:19.440
I went for a walk and I felt my energy was good.
00:18:19.680 --> 00:18:22.240
Everyone I walk past said, good morning, how are you?
00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:24.880
And even the ones that didn't, I still said good morning.
00:18:25.119 --> 00:18:27.839
And so much of that is what this is about.
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:30.000
Yes, you need the systems and processes.
00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:41.519
Yes, you need to the understanding of the questions to ask, because we're in a consultative cell, when to close and how to close, and then how to cross-sell and upsell and protect that client relationship.
00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:47.359
But a lot of it comes from our own energy and how we are and how we show up.
00:18:47.519 --> 00:18:51.680
You know, if we show up as just another consultant, then we're vanilla, right?
00:18:51.759 --> 00:19:00.559
But if we come in with great energy and we're asking the right questions and we can see the prospect, all these light bulb moments going off, of course they're going to want to work with us.
00:19:00.720 --> 00:19:03.599
And then, you know, we've got the fun of negotiating the investment.
00:19:03.680 --> 00:19:04.720
I never say price.
00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:06.799
We then go to, you know, talk about that.
00:19:06.960 --> 00:19:08.720
And again, that's all about collaboration.
00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:10.400
It's nothing we need to be scared about.
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:10.960
Mm-hmm.
00:19:11.039 --> 00:19:11.519
Mm-hmm.
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:22.079
And there's so many people that I hear that say, okay, well, you have to have this one script, this one recipe for having those client conversations or winning business, whatever it is.
00:19:22.319 --> 00:19:28.880
But to your point, it's really about what is your mindset, what is your energy that you bring forward to what you do?
00:19:29.039 --> 00:19:35.200
Because at the end of the day, people are buying you the belief in you, the energy, the change that you bring.
00:19:35.359 --> 00:19:37.920
And you could put whatever words to that.
00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:40.720
If you don't have that, who's gonna want that?
00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:47.839
Who's gonna want to invest or pay forward in someone where it doesn't have an inspiring energy attached to it?
00:19:48.079 --> 00:19:48.720
Absolutely.
00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:53.039
And you know, we can all turn up and be be vanilla, but that's not what people want.
00:19:53.119 --> 00:19:55.440
You know, they want to be challenged, they want that.
00:19:55.599 --> 00:19:56.400
Interesting point.
00:19:56.480 --> 00:19:57.680
I hadn't thought of that.
00:19:57.839 --> 00:19:58.240
Mm-hmm.
00:19:58.319 --> 00:19:58.720
Mm-hmm.
00:19:58.960 --> 00:20:00.000
Yeah, definitely.
00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:04.000
So I want to talk about you've done so many things with your life.
00:20:04.160 --> 00:20:10.000
You're like have lived like 20 lives like a cat over here with the amount of stuff that you're doing.
00:20:10.160 --> 00:20:11.440
I'm trying to keep up.
00:20:11.599 --> 00:20:17.519
But so tell me a little bit more on the trouble with the pink wheelbarrels.
00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:20.960
So, for all the good businesses you have, you always have a bad one.
00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:22.160
I love shopping, right?
00:20:22.319 --> 00:20:23.519
Absolutely love shopping.
00:20:23.599 --> 00:20:26.799
And there was a time where I did a lot outside, etc.
00:20:27.039 --> 00:20:30.400
So I thought, why not have an online retail business?
00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:32.160
So we got an online retail business.
00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:40.079
I got investors, I got investment, and thank goodness I know how to build businesses and I can really, you know, forecast ahead and look at the cash flow.
00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:43.839
So the business sold was an online gardening retail shop, right?
00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:50.960
Laura, I had no understanding why people didn't buy pink wheelbarrows as in terms of the online retail shops.
00:20:51.119 --> 00:20:53.920
I could not get these pink wheelbarrows in fast enough.
00:20:54.000 --> 00:21:00.240
And because we were a new business and it was Christmas, I had to wrap these frickin' wheelbarrows myself.
00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:03.039
I don't know if you've ever had to try to wrap a pink wheelbarrow.
00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:04.640
I'm telling you now, it's painful.
00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:11.599
My entire house, my kitchen, my sitting room, my dining room, bedrooms, landings, everywhere had pink wheelbarrows.
00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:13.359
We could not get them in quick enough.
00:21:13.519 --> 00:21:19.359
However, what we realized going into the new year was within six months we'd run out of runway.
00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:25.680
So rather than it the business actually fail, we sold the stock, we wound it up, so no one lost any money.
00:21:25.839 --> 00:21:28.319
So for me, that was kind of like my one failure.
00:21:28.400 --> 00:21:47.759
And I really wanted to write a book that was funny, but where there are a bunch of entrepreneurs who gave their views and perspectives, and we also got a bank into to be able to say, okay, so if you're an entrepreneur coming to us and wanting investment, these this is what you need to do, and some really interesting stories around that as well.
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:50.319
So I kind of thought, well, what's the best title for this?
00:21:50.480 --> 00:21:54.799
Trouble with pink wheelbarrows, because that was a real problem for me.
00:21:54.880 --> 00:21:55.039
Yeah.
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:58.799
And it's really grabbed the attention and imagination of people ever since.
00:21:58.960 --> 00:21:59.759
I love that because.
00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:09.119
Because I think that sometimes what leaders don't do well enough is omitting when they have made mistakes in the past, right?
00:22:09.440 --> 00:22:19.519
But I don't know any good leaders that haven't made bad mistakes in the past and normally have built something really successful because of it.
00:22:19.680 --> 00:22:24.960
So do you think that you could have built what you had now without this disaster?
00:22:25.279 --> 00:22:26.640
No, absolutely not.
00:22:26.799 --> 00:22:32.400
Because there were so many lessons, time, ego, you know, just pushing through when we thought we could do it.
00:22:32.559 --> 00:22:38.319
And luckily, when I had more time the new year, excuse me, I was able to look at it and say, do you know what this isn't working?
00:22:38.720 --> 00:22:42.240
Let's make a tough decision before it becomes a financial problem.
00:22:42.720 --> 00:22:46.319
So I often think, what is the worst thing in your life that could happen for you?
00:22:46.480 --> 00:22:48.720
Be that you know personal or commercial.
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:52.000
Commercially, it's having a business that fails, right?
00:22:52.160 --> 00:22:57.119
But we all need that business that fails or things that fail for us to learn from.
00:22:57.279 --> 00:22:59.680
Even if it's something small, you know, what's the learning from that?
00:22:59.759 --> 00:23:00.400
What do I take?
00:23:00.559 --> 00:23:01.039
Move on.
00:23:01.200 --> 00:23:03.519
So absolutely, would I be here today without it?
00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:03.920
No.
00:23:04.079 --> 00:23:06.720
And I certainly wouldn't have a best-selling book as a result.
00:23:06.880 --> 00:23:07.279
Mm-hmm.
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:07.839
Mm-hmm.
00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:08.880
How amazing.
00:23:09.039 --> 00:23:15.920
I love that lesson because when you are an entrepreneur, it is so hard not to be so hard on yourself every day.
00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:16.559
Absolutely.
00:23:16.720 --> 00:23:20.480
Um, I also like what you said of you knew when to pull out too.
00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:20.880
Yeah.
00:23:21.039 --> 00:23:37.920
And I think that's important where people do get stuck is I think that there's a difference between trying so hard at something and being persistent and diligent and seeing something through, and then actually knowing where, okay, I need to pivot, I need to step back, I need to change.
00:23:38.079 --> 00:23:38.319
Yeah.
00:23:38.559 --> 00:23:45.599
So do you work with your founders on navigating some of those directional places of where their business should go?
00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:46.559
Absolutely.
00:23:46.880 --> 00:23:55.680
So often what we see is what the founder thinks the business is going to be in the first year is very different by the end of year one.
00:23:56.400 --> 00:24:02.319
Because the momentum has gone in a maybe a completely different direction that they're really enjoying.
00:24:02.480 --> 00:24:04.720
And there's always things that they say, do you know what?
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:06.000
I don't want to do that anymore.
00:24:06.079 --> 00:24:08.079
And that goes out the window as well.
00:24:08.319 --> 00:24:11.680
I think this fluidity and pivoting is really important.
00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:16.079
Agility now in today's world is a skill that we all need to have.
00:24:16.240 --> 00:24:18.079
So don't be afraid of it, embrace it.
00:24:18.240 --> 00:24:18.640
Mm-hmm.
00:24:18.720 --> 00:24:19.119
Mm-hmm.
00:24:19.359 --> 00:24:24.480
So, Sam, I'm gonna get into some things that I did not prepare you for at all.
00:24:24.720 --> 00:24:25.039
Okay.
00:24:25.279 --> 00:24:27.680
So we're gonna have some rapid fire questions.
00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:28.400
Love it.
00:24:28.559 --> 00:24:32.400
And I need you to give me your gut reaction to things.
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:33.680
Okay, can't overthink it.
00:24:33.839 --> 00:24:35.759
I'm not gonna familize what comes out of my mouth.
00:24:35.920 --> 00:24:36.319
Yeah, yeah.
00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:37.519
I don't think you are.
00:24:37.839 --> 00:24:41.119
Some people on here, I need to be worried that they're gonna fabricate things.
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:42.079
I don't think that's you.
00:24:42.400 --> 00:24:42.720
No.
00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:43.279
Okay.
00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:44.000
Okay.
00:24:44.319 --> 00:24:45.920
The first job you've ever had.
00:24:46.319 --> 00:24:48.720
Typing pool uh at KPMG.
00:24:48.960 --> 00:24:53.359
The thing HR consultants say that make you want to scream.
00:24:53.599 --> 00:24:54.799
I'm just an HR.
00:24:55.359 --> 00:24:55.680
Okay.
00:24:56.000 --> 00:24:57.200
Yes, good one.
00:24:57.519 --> 00:25:01.839
Best piece of advice you ever ignored and then you regretted.
00:25:02.160 --> 00:25:04.079
Best piece of advice I ever ignored.
00:25:04.240 --> 00:25:06.240
Don't celebrate the wins before they happen.
00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:07.920
Oh, my preach.
00:25:08.079 --> 00:25:09.680
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
00:25:09.920 --> 00:25:10.240
Yeah.
00:25:10.480 --> 00:25:21.920
So I can tell you, one of my businesses, yeah, I went out really young, early mid-20s, took a mate out, took a tour champagne bar, celebrated, because I'd got a verbal agreement and a contract.
00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:22.400
Guess what?
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:24.240
Next day, Laura didn't win the contract.
00:25:24.319 --> 00:25:24.480
Yeah.
00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:28.079
And one of those lessons that you need just to happen to you.
00:25:28.400 --> 00:25:29.039
Fin there.
00:25:29.200 --> 00:25:30.799
So thank you so much, Sam.
00:25:30.960 --> 00:25:35.039
You have built such an incredible business and you are a LinkedIn queen.
00:25:35.279 --> 00:25:37.759
So we will continue to stay updated there.
00:25:37.920 --> 00:25:42.720
All your information will be in the show notes and really appreciate your time that you spent with us.
00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:43.359
So thank you.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:15.599
I'd like to welcome Sam Eden, who is the founder of Mindability Business Coaching, a global business coach for HR and talent professionals, a best-selling author, a keynote speaker, and the host of Mind Ability Matters.
00:00:15.839 --> 00:00:24.559
In the last five years, she and her team have helped over 260 founders build six, seven, and eight figure businesses.
00:00:24.879 --> 00:00:27.120
Sam, thank you so much for being here.
00:00:27.280 --> 00:00:33.439
Before we get into anything else, I'd really like for you to walk us through your career journey and how you got here.
00:00:33.679 --> 00:00:35.280
Oh Laura, you did a great job.
00:00:35.359 --> 00:00:36.000
And thank you.
00:00:36.079 --> 00:00:37.359
It's lovely to be here.
00:00:37.520 --> 00:00:44.000
So yeah, I have found myself building HR and talent businesses over the last 26 years.
00:00:44.159 --> 00:00:48.320
And my goodness, I wish there was so much collaboration as we have now.
00:00:48.479 --> 00:00:50.640
But I come at it from a very different point of view.
00:00:50.799 --> 00:00:53.359
I'm a commercial beast first and foremost.
00:00:53.520 --> 00:00:56.240
So I had to learn the world of HR.
00:00:56.399 --> 00:00:58.719
You know, what's going on for a CHRO?
00:00:58.960 --> 00:01:02.240
What are their battles and how can I be a real ally to them?
00:01:02.399 --> 00:01:09.519
So that allowed me to build and collaborate with my first HR talent business, as I said, over 26 years ago.
00:01:09.680 --> 00:01:20.719
So fast forward today, as you said, I've helped build over 260 HR and talent businesses, and I've had the real privilege of being able to do that across the UK, USA, Canada.
00:01:20.879 --> 00:01:25.920
We've had clients in Australia, New Zealand, Kenya, some really interesting and wonderful places.
00:01:26.159 --> 00:01:30.719
We fundamentally believe that without these great consultants, the world of work will not change.
00:01:30.879 --> 00:01:35.280
We need that inspiration and a different way of thinking to move the dial forward.
00:01:35.359 --> 00:01:37.359
So it's it's a better world of work for all of us.
00:01:37.599 --> 00:01:38.079
I love that.
00:01:38.159 --> 00:01:40.799
And what an interesting career to get into.
00:01:40.879 --> 00:01:47.200
It's definitely not one of those things that when you're going off to university, you say, I want to be that when I grow up one day.
00:01:47.359 --> 00:01:52.319
So tell me how did you find this path for yourself?
00:01:52.560 --> 00:01:54.719
Do you know what is actually a really funny story?
00:01:54.879 --> 00:02:10.479
So I'd been in several other businesses, either I'd own them or I'd been a shareholder, and I'd actually got one HR consultancy right up in the search rankings of all my team had because I worked in in an SEO organization and was shareholder and partner there.
00:02:10.639 --> 00:02:16.719
And for one reason and another, I left the business and this organisation said, Sam, can you come work with us?
00:02:16.960 --> 00:02:18.719
And I went, Absolutely not.
00:02:18.879 --> 00:02:21.840
The last thing you want is me as a disruptive employee.
00:02:22.000 --> 00:02:29.199
So they offered me a shareholding, and that was the start of my journey, really, where I learnt what HR did.
00:02:29.280 --> 00:02:45.919
And I often do these talks all around the world where, you know, I I kind of use my bushish kind of slightly awkwardness to say, you know, I used to see this big door with the word personnel written on it, and you know, there's these beings behind it, and I had no idea what they did in corporate.
00:02:46.159 --> 00:02:49.360
And so I learned what they did and how tough they had it.
00:02:49.599 --> 00:02:52.960
It became a bit of a mission when we were selling the services into them.
00:02:53.120 --> 00:02:54.479
How can we make you look good?
00:02:54.639 --> 00:02:58.240
And then when the pandemic struck, I'd always wanted to build mindability.
00:02:58.319 --> 00:03:04.719
I brought it forward by five years, and I really felt that HRs were leading the world of work.
00:03:04.879 --> 00:03:09.120
I know that they're getting battered a lot today, but that's all part of the change we're going through.
00:03:09.360 --> 00:03:13.039
So yeah, that's a little bit about my journey and how I ended up here.
00:03:13.280 --> 00:03:18.560
So I like that you mentioned they're getting battered right now, because that was the next question that I was gonna ask you.
00:03:18.719 --> 00:03:20.879
So a couple topics on that.
00:03:21.120 --> 00:03:26.960
So, firstly, what is HR versus the misconceptions about HR?
00:03:27.120 --> 00:03:28.240
Because great question.
00:03:28.479 --> 00:03:31.759
There's a lot of talk out there of, you know, is HR relevant?
00:03:31.840 --> 00:03:33.120
What do they actually do?
00:03:33.199 --> 00:03:35.280
So share with us what is it.
00:03:35.599 --> 00:03:37.759
Okay, and thank you for asking that question.
00:03:37.840 --> 00:03:38.400
I love it.
00:03:38.560 --> 00:03:39.599
So, yeah, you're right.
00:03:39.680 --> 00:03:55.840
Let's start with the misconception that they are the party organizers, they are there to buy all the Christmas and holiday gifts, that they're there once leadership has decided to go the route that they were advised not to go by HR to clear up the mess.
00:03:56.000 --> 00:04:06.319
So I think that's what's they're not, and that's how they're being widely used, not all over the place, because in some organizations what they're doing really well is this workforce planning.
00:04:06.479 --> 00:04:09.039
You know, we live in a very different world, right?
00:04:09.199 --> 00:04:14.879
And that world, the AI tools or the methodology we're using today is going to change tomorrow.
00:04:15.039 --> 00:04:18.399
So now those are more of a transformational role.
00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.279
It's kind of how do we work with AI?
00:04:21.439 --> 00:04:23.360
How do we change the world of work?
00:04:23.519 --> 00:04:29.040
We know that communication between the generations is very, very different to one another.
00:04:29.199 --> 00:04:34.079
I mean, when I talk to my stepson, I love him dearly, and literally sometimes I need a dictionary.
00:04:34.160 --> 00:04:35.920
So I have no idea what he's just said to me.
00:04:36.079 --> 00:04:41.519
So they've dealing with that generational aspect and the different aspirations of that.
00:04:41.839 --> 00:04:50.319
So I think the workforce planning, staying relevant, being able to pivot, be agile, that's some of the great work now that HRs are doing.
00:04:50.399 --> 00:04:56.000
So they are there before the decision's being made rather than after a decision's being made.
00:04:56.240 --> 00:05:04.959
Yeah, and I love that you shared all that because even working in corporate, I'm surrounded by people that don't have any idea about what HR is.
00:05:05.040 --> 00:05:07.439
It's just where you go when you're in trouble, right?
00:05:07.759 --> 00:05:09.839
Or it's to your point for the party.
00:05:10.160 --> 00:05:11.279
Yeah, exactly.
00:05:11.360 --> 00:05:12.879
And oh, it's only HR.
00:05:12.959 --> 00:05:15.199
Oh, we'll make that decision and tell them afterwards.
00:05:15.439 --> 00:05:20.240
So HRs are also becoming some of the best salespeople on the planet.
00:05:20.399 --> 00:05:21.600
Come work here before.
00:05:21.759 --> 00:05:25.279
Actually, know to the CEO and CFO, COO.
00:05:25.680 --> 00:05:39.519
This is why we need to be in the conversation now before you decide to make that decision, because we can help you not only save money and cost, save time, get the right people in the right seat, and bring your commercial plans to life.
00:05:40.399 --> 00:05:54.959
I love everything about what you're saying because my passion and my focus is related to that Gen Z population that is entering the workforce and having a difficult time adjusting to the workforce in a lot of ways.
00:05:55.120 --> 00:06:09.120
And I love that of your thought on bringing HR into the conversation ever because there's so many folks that are paying for the problem of raising these, that bringing in this talent the proper way or speaking to them the proper way.
00:06:09.199 --> 00:06:10.480
It's such a waste of money.
00:06:10.639 --> 00:06:11.279
My goodness.
00:06:11.519 --> 00:06:15.680
One is that, and let's call it, you know, the generation before me.
00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:23.680
I know I look old, but honestly, the generation before me would be like, hey, 30 years in corporate, whoopy-doo, now I've got the gold clock or the Rolex watch.
00:06:23.759 --> 00:06:26.399
It's like, I don't want the freaking Rolex watch or the clock.
00:06:26.480 --> 00:06:27.199
I want freedom.
00:06:27.360 --> 00:06:29.360
I want to be able to work when I want to work.
00:06:29.519 --> 00:06:31.360
I want to be able to call my hours.
00:06:31.519 --> 00:06:33.439
I want work that's really interesting.
00:06:33.600 --> 00:06:43.759
Now, if I'm saying that as my generation who's enlightened, can you imagine what the next not just two, three, four, five generations want out of the workplace?
00:06:43.920 --> 00:06:44.879
And they're gonna get it.
00:06:44.959 --> 00:06:47.600
And good luck to them because we need to change things.
00:06:47.839 --> 00:06:48.879
Yeah, I love that.
00:06:48.959 --> 00:06:55.680
And they're the first generation that's actually vocalizing it in a way where people are listening to it.
00:06:55.839 --> 00:07:02.000
So I have a lot of hope and inspiration and aspirations for the next set of talent that's that's coming up.
00:07:02.079 --> 00:07:02.480
Absolutely.
00:07:02.720 --> 00:07:03.120
Me too.
00:07:03.360 --> 00:07:06.720
Want to talk about more of your company, your focus.
00:07:06.800 --> 00:07:09.199
And I know that you work on a global scale.
00:07:09.519 --> 00:07:18.959
So I'd love to hear more on how does HR, your focus, the talent and whatnot, change from country to country or region to region.
00:07:19.199 --> 00:07:23.519
Do you know I get asked this question a lot, and I think it's a really interesting one.
00:07:23.680 --> 00:07:31.279
What I tend to find is most people think, huh, you know, this region is better than us, or we're there's never we're better than this region.
00:07:31.360 --> 00:07:32.639
And that's the thing I like.
00:07:32.720 --> 00:07:34.240
It's it's more aspirational.
00:07:34.399 --> 00:07:39.199
But here's the thing: what is true is the challenge is the same across the board.
00:07:39.360 --> 00:07:44.160
However, what we're seeing, because obviously in my world, we're but helping people to build businesses.
00:07:44.399 --> 00:07:48.639
Things aren't priced, in my opinion, right in the UK.
00:07:48.879 --> 00:07:57.519
You know, we really work with our clients to make sure that they are selling at their worth and to be able to sell that value piece rather than be a race to the bottom.
00:07:57.680 --> 00:08:03.439
I think we're Brits and hate, I can say this, we're very good at being very apologetic and not asking for for our worth.
00:08:03.600 --> 00:08:08.240
And then again, there are parts in the States as well, where we're seeing that the pricing will be very different.
00:08:08.399 --> 00:08:10.639
And maybe some of the challenges will be different.
00:08:10.720 --> 00:08:13.920
And then, Laura, obviously you need to take into account sectors.
00:08:14.079 --> 00:08:18.000
So globally, we're seeing some sectors that are doing way better than us.
00:08:18.160 --> 00:08:22.639
Our clients who are in healthcare, biotech, fintech, globally are doing really well.
00:08:22.800 --> 00:08:28.560
But also those, again, on a global basis, who are retail, hospitality, not so much right now.
00:08:28.800 --> 00:08:32.960
Sam, you mentioned one thing really important that I struggle with myself.
00:08:33.039 --> 00:08:39.440
And I think a lot of people, and I know that there's conversations on women are bad at this, and yeah.
00:08:40.159 --> 00:08:50.080
I think definitely, but in general, I think it's something that a lot of people struggle with is defining your value when you are creating your own business.
00:08:50.240 --> 00:08:51.919
So, how do you approach that?
00:08:52.080 --> 00:08:57.919
Because it's so hard, and I'm so guilty too, of just, oh, it's okay, I'll lower my price.
00:08:58.000 --> 00:09:00.080
It's okay, it's not okay.
00:09:00.480 --> 00:09:01.759
It's not okay.
00:09:02.000 --> 00:09:03.840
And I love this question.
00:09:04.000 --> 00:09:09.919
This is one of my favorite questions, especially for women, because we are all so guilty of it, right?
00:09:10.000 --> 00:09:14.480
I've been guilty of it, still am, and sometimes, you know, I'm challenged by my own team with it.
00:09:14.639 --> 00:09:18.960
And here's the thing, I always ask everyone, what was the impact you had in corporate?
00:09:19.120 --> 00:09:24.000
What were those times that you sat at the table and you were the only one who stood up for X?
00:09:24.159 --> 00:09:31.279
When you look at a growing organization that you were part of, how many of those employees did you hire personally?
00:09:31.440 --> 00:09:33.360
And how did that help grow the business?
00:09:33.600 --> 00:09:38.879
That time the CEO made a really bad decision and you gave the advice and they did it anyway.
00:09:39.039 --> 00:09:42.879
How much was you coming in to clear up that mess, save the business?
00:09:43.039 --> 00:09:46.639
How much of you invested in your own personal development?
00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:48.480
That's your worth.
00:09:48.720 --> 00:09:49.279
I love that.
00:09:49.360 --> 00:09:53.519
I need to internalize that for my own conversations this week.
00:09:53.759 --> 00:09:54.399
Absolutely.
00:09:54.559 --> 00:09:56.080
But that's a good way to think about it.
00:09:56.320 --> 00:10:02.399
It's because when you're creating your own business, your only status quo is against yourself, right?
00:10:02.480 --> 00:10:03.279
So that's correct.
00:10:03.679 --> 00:10:11.360
And so when you think back to a point where you had other data points to react off of it, suddenly becomes a little bit more simple.
00:10:11.679 --> 00:10:12.240
Exactly.
00:10:12.399 --> 00:10:32.320
And the reason why I'm so emotive about it is I will kind of want to take you back to that part where you remember where your shoulders were broad and you were, you know, kind of standing firm with it, because that kind of emotion will take you through to you having the peer-to-peer conversation with you clients, for you selling your worth.
00:10:32.480 --> 00:10:38.240
And when you hear an objection, because six times out of seven, an objection can be overturned.
00:10:38.399 --> 00:10:39.600
It's curiosity.
00:10:39.759 --> 00:10:45.759
But we accept that objection as a no rather than, hey, I'm just curious.
00:10:45.919 --> 00:10:47.440
Help me to buy from you.
00:10:47.679 --> 00:10:48.159
Mm-hmm.
00:10:48.320 --> 00:10:48.720
Mm-hmm.
00:10:48.960 --> 00:11:02.879
And kind of going back to myself, because I completely resonate with this as an entrepreneur, it was so easy to talk about those things and sell those things when they were a product or a service that you were responsible for representing.
00:11:03.120 --> 00:11:08.080
But suddenly when you're representing yourself, the confidence just isn't there in the same way.
00:11:08.240 --> 00:11:14.960
Why can we talk about products and services in a way that they're so attractive and easy to sell and you can defend?
00:11:15.120 --> 00:11:17.919
And then when it's yourself, you're like, I don't know.
00:11:18.080 --> 00:11:20.320
Laura, I love and I absolutely agree.
00:11:20.399 --> 00:11:23.759
But here's the thing: do you want to work with that person?
00:11:23.919 --> 00:11:24.159
Right?
00:11:24.320 --> 00:11:25.840
Because now we have a choice.
00:11:26.000 --> 00:11:27.440
And I think this is the thing.
00:11:27.600 --> 00:11:33.120
When you're an employee, if anything goes wrong, your whole world falls apart, right?
00:11:33.279 --> 00:11:35.360
That one source of income has gone.
00:11:35.519 --> 00:11:36.159
Do you know what?
00:11:36.320 --> 00:11:40.879
If we fall out with a client, as long as we leave with good grace and dignity, so what?
00:11:40.960 --> 00:11:42.639
There's another client just around the corner.
00:11:42.799 --> 00:11:42.960
Right.
00:11:43.360 --> 00:11:48.799
And when we're having these prospect calls, as far as I'm concerned, I am seeing if I want to work with you.
00:11:49.039 --> 00:11:49.200
Yeah.
00:11:49.360 --> 00:11:50.320
Yeah, that is true.
00:11:50.480 --> 00:11:55.279
It's just a mind shift change, which is why I really like the title of your company.
00:11:55.519 --> 00:11:56.639
Mind ability, right?
00:11:56.799 --> 00:11:59.279
Because you help us think different about it.
00:11:59.519 --> 00:12:10.080
So I want to talk a little bit about the types of founders and entrepreneurs that come to your company to get advice, to get support.
00:12:10.320 --> 00:12:16.559
What are those sort of qualities that make those founders create a successful HR brand?
00:12:16.960 --> 00:12:17.600
Great question.
00:12:17.840 --> 00:12:21.519
A lot of the time it's that belief of understand my outcome.
00:12:21.679 --> 00:12:26.799
And Laura, the the mechanical side of it is I want to replace my corporate income, right?
00:12:26.960 --> 00:12:29.840
I think the logical, the this is where I want to be.
00:12:30.000 --> 00:12:33.440
I know we've had a couple of conversations, but for me, it's outcome-based.
00:12:33.519 --> 00:12:35.840
You know, what is the outcome you want to get for your business?
00:12:35.919 --> 00:12:37.440
And I'll give you some examples.
00:12:37.679 --> 00:12:39.440
I actually want to have five holidays a year.
00:12:39.600 --> 00:12:42.399
I'm a single mum and I've got to put my kid through university.
00:12:43.279 --> 00:12:45.279
I want the extension on the house.
00:12:45.440 --> 00:12:47.200
I want insert here.
00:12:47.279 --> 00:12:50.879
And that's the outcome we're working toward because you can visualize that.
00:12:51.039 --> 00:12:56.240
So when I look at the commonality in terms of who they are, they want to build a business.
00:12:56.320 --> 00:13:03.759
Now that business might be them as a solopreneur, it might be that they have a bunch of 1099s, or they want to recruit and have full time.
00:13:04.000 --> 00:13:05.759
That's their decision and prerogative.
00:13:05.919 --> 00:13:11.679
But they all have a clear outcome and focus, and that's that they want to build a business, not have a hobby.
00:13:11.840 --> 00:13:13.759
There's so much of that commonality.
00:13:13.919 --> 00:13:15.120
Are most of them scared?
00:13:15.360 --> 00:13:16.080
Absolutely.
00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:19.120
Do most of them get frustrated and have ups and downs?
00:13:19.360 --> 00:13:20.639
Yeah, they're human beings.
00:13:20.799 --> 00:13:23.360
And they have a desire to get to this point.
00:13:23.759 --> 00:13:24.159
Mm-hmm.
00:13:24.320 --> 00:13:24.799
Mm-hmm.
00:13:25.120 --> 00:13:29.679
So when you work with your clients, how are you helping them to visualize that?
00:13:29.840 --> 00:13:33.679
Because I know there's so many visualization techniques that are out there.
00:13:33.919 --> 00:13:40.960
I right behind where we're talking is I have my huge vision board that is behind me every single day.
00:13:41.039 --> 00:13:54.399
And I actually work on it once a quarter, and which is really nice that it's not changing as much as it used to, because I used to change it so frequently, but now I just kind of like will pick something off and put something back on.
00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:59.120
So what are your visualization techniques that you work with your clients on?
00:13:59.360 --> 00:14:02.799
So firstly, I love the techniques that you've explained.
00:14:02.960 --> 00:14:05.120
For me, I hadn't realized till the other day.
00:14:05.360 --> 00:14:09.919
Side note, I've since I was about eight or nine, I've kept what I call book book.
00:14:10.000 --> 00:14:12.960
And every single book I've read, I have recorded.
00:14:13.039 --> 00:14:16.320
And I have their title, the author, and the month in which I finished it.
00:14:16.399 --> 00:14:17.279
It's quite sad.
00:14:17.519 --> 00:14:26.559
It is relevant to this conversation in that that visualization comes from my conversation with them because I want it to sit here in their heart as they're working.
00:14:26.720 --> 00:14:31.039
Because that head and heart alignment, and it's not woo, you know, we all have instinct.
00:14:31.120 --> 00:14:34.240
We're animals at the end of the day, and I want them to work with that.
00:14:34.399 --> 00:14:43.519
Then comes the commercial sense side of it, which is okay, let's now take your business and your services and let's start to map that out.
00:14:43.600 --> 00:14:45.039
And we'll just work it back.
00:14:45.279 --> 00:14:51.759
Because if we can work it back and you hold that, Lori, you're clearly a visual person, so for you it goes on your board.
00:14:51.919 --> 00:14:55.039
For me, it's up here in my mind what I'm trying to visualize.
00:14:55.120 --> 00:14:57.600
And I talk about it constantly with my friends.
00:14:57.759 --> 00:15:00.799
So it keeps it alive, it's a presence for me.
00:15:01.039 --> 00:15:05.440
So however someone visualizes what they want, we work that way.
00:15:05.679 --> 00:15:10.399
But for me, it's also important that not only do they visualize it, they commercialise it.
00:15:10.639 --> 00:15:11.039
Mm-hmm.
00:15:11.120 --> 00:15:11.519
Mm-hmm.
00:15:11.679 --> 00:15:13.519
And that's the second phase, right?
00:15:13.679 --> 00:15:18.559
And probably the part that moves it from an idea, a dream, to reality.
00:15:18.879 --> 00:15:19.440
Exactly.
00:15:19.600 --> 00:15:21.840
So now let's put the hard work in.
00:15:22.000 --> 00:15:25.039
Because the most successful businesses, Laura, they're boring.
00:15:25.200 --> 00:15:26.399
You know, I love having fun.
00:15:26.480 --> 00:15:29.840
I'm actually quite a calm person, although I'm a big extrovert and network.
00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:30.799
Yeah, you are.
00:15:30.960 --> 00:15:31.279
Yeah.
00:15:31.519 --> 00:15:31.919
Yeah.
00:15:32.159 --> 00:15:40.000
But the thing for me is in order to be successful, it's the systems, the processes, and having everything mapped out so you can analyze it.
00:15:40.159 --> 00:15:41.679
And I do that on a frequent basis.
00:15:41.759 --> 00:15:45.919
I drive the team and myself nuts because it's, you know, okay, this is working.
00:15:46.000 --> 00:15:46.480
This is not.
00:15:46.559 --> 00:15:48.720
Where do we pivot, change, move?
00:15:48.879 --> 00:15:49.279
Mm-hmm.
00:15:49.519 --> 00:15:53.759
Well, it has created tremendous success for entrepreneurs that you worked with.
00:15:53.840 --> 00:16:02.399
So do you want to share with us some examples of people that you've taken through the process and what can they expect on the other side of working with you?
00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:03.840
Yeah, absolutely.
00:16:04.080 --> 00:16:08.159
So we built over the last five or six years our mastermind program.
00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:15.519
The feedback we get the whole time is it's we're commercial again, going back to that word, we're commercializing their dreams.
00:16:15.679 --> 00:16:18.000
We're putting the systems and processes in place.
00:16:18.159 --> 00:16:26.799
We're helping them not only to sell, but then to cross-sell and upsell and be better account managers, to analyse everything, to understand when they pull the levers in their business.
00:16:26.960 --> 00:16:31.120
So not only are their own CEOs, they're their own COOs and CFOs.
00:16:31.200 --> 00:16:34.960
So what has that led to your question in terms of them being successful?
00:16:35.120 --> 00:16:40.320
So we've had one client who came through the mastermind last year, fresh out of corporate, not a single client.
00:16:40.480 --> 00:16:43.600
She got her first$30,000 a month contract.
00:16:43.840 --> 00:16:45.919
We had another again, fresh out of corporate.
00:16:46.000 --> 00:16:48.559
She had no clients, she left after 10 weeks with five.
00:16:48.720 --> 00:16:54.240
We've had others who just stalled and needed to come through to be able to reignite themselves.
00:16:54.320 --> 00:16:59.200
And we had one who really has stayed close to my heart and I'm still good friends with them today.
00:16:59.440 --> 00:17:00.799
Had a business and I had no idea.
00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:03.759
The husband and wife's business, they'd been in business for 10 years.
00:17:03.919 --> 00:17:07.519
I had no idea how bad things and business was.
00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:12.079
By the end of it, we'd helped generate over$250,000 after the 10 weeks.
00:17:12.240 --> 00:17:17.200
Their business was back on track, but the most important thing, they had belief in their business again as well.
00:17:17.680 --> 00:17:19.200
To me, it was just a beautiful thing.
00:17:19.279 --> 00:17:22.480
It wasn't just that we'd done what we were paid to do.
00:17:22.960 --> 00:17:26.960
We were able to help them keep that momentum and keep that mindset going.
00:17:27.359 --> 00:17:27.680
Yeah.
00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:43.200
And I love that you keep repeating the word mindset because I know in building my own business, sometimes having someone that you could talk to work things through, they unlock that one little thing that makes all of the difference for how you move ahead.
00:17:43.359 --> 00:17:49.440
And it's great to work with someone that's done it one, two dozens of times that you're like, you know what?
00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:54.559
If I work with them better often than not, I will have a success because of it.
00:17:54.880 --> 00:17:55.440
Absolutely.
00:17:55.519 --> 00:17:56.960
And you know, it's really interesting.
00:17:57.039 --> 00:18:00.480
I did an exercise this morning, didn't have a good day yesterday.
00:18:00.640 --> 00:18:03.039
You know, and I think we need to be real about this, right?
00:18:03.200 --> 00:18:09.279
You know, just because you've had a business for years and it's gone well and you've had multiple businesses, doesn't mean every day is sunshine and roses.
00:18:09.519 --> 00:18:09.920
It's not.
00:18:10.079 --> 00:18:11.680
They're not bunny rabbits every day.
00:18:11.839 --> 00:18:13.359
Yesterday was one of those awful days.
00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:14.000
And do you know what?
00:18:14.079 --> 00:18:16.640
I woke up this morning and I did something different.
00:18:16.799 --> 00:18:19.440
I went for a walk and I felt my energy was good.
00:18:19.680 --> 00:18:22.240
Everyone I walk past said, good morning, how are you?
00:18:22.400 --> 00:18:24.880
And even the ones that didn't, I still said good morning.
00:18:25.119 --> 00:18:27.839
And so much of that is what this is about.
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:30.000
Yes, you need the systems and processes.
00:18:30.160 --> 00:18:41.519
Yes, you need to the understanding of the questions to ask, because we're in a consultative cell, when to close and how to close, and then how to cross-sell and upsell and protect that client relationship.
00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:47.359
But a lot of it comes from our own energy and how we are and how we show up.
00:18:47.519 --> 00:18:51.680
You know, if we show up as just another consultant, then we're vanilla, right?
00:18:51.759 --> 00:19:00.559
But if we come in with great energy and we're asking the right questions and we can see the prospect, all these light bulb moments going off, of course they're going to want to work with us.
00:19:00.720 --> 00:19:03.599
And then, you know, we've got the fun of negotiating the investment.
00:19:03.680 --> 00:19:04.720
I never say price.
00:19:04.799 --> 00:19:06.799
We then go to, you know, talk about that.
00:19:06.960 --> 00:19:08.720
And again, that's all about collaboration.
00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:10.400
It's nothing we need to be scared about.
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:10.960
Mm-hmm.
00:19:11.039 --> 00:19:11.519
Mm-hmm.
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:22.079
And there's so many people that I hear that say, okay, well, you have to have this one script, this one recipe for having those client conversations or winning business, whatever it is.
00:19:22.319 --> 00:19:28.880
But to your point, it's really about what is your mindset, what is your energy that you bring forward to what you do?
00:19:29.039 --> 00:19:35.200
Because at the end of the day, people are buying you the belief in you, the energy, the change that you bring.
00:19:35.359 --> 00:19:37.920
And you could put whatever words to that.
00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:40.720
If you don't have that, who's gonna want that?
00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:47.839
Who's gonna want to invest or pay forward in someone where it doesn't have an inspiring energy attached to it?
00:19:48.079 --> 00:19:48.720
Absolutely.
00:19:48.880 --> 00:19:53.039
And you know, we can all turn up and be be vanilla, but that's not what people want.
00:19:53.119 --> 00:19:55.440
You know, they want to be challenged, they want that.
00:19:55.599 --> 00:19:56.400
Interesting point.
00:19:56.480 --> 00:19:57.680
I hadn't thought of that.
00:19:57.839 --> 00:19:58.240
Mm-hmm.
00:19:58.319 --> 00:19:58.720
Mm-hmm.
00:19:58.960 --> 00:20:00.000
Yeah, definitely.
00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:04.000
So I want to talk about you've done so many things with your life.
00:20:04.160 --> 00:20:10.000
You're like have lived like 20 lives like a cat over here with the amount of stuff that you're doing.
00:20:10.160 --> 00:20:11.440
I'm trying to keep up.
00:20:11.599 --> 00:20:17.519
But so tell me a little bit more on the trouble with the pink wheelbarrels.
00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:20.960
So, for all the good businesses you have, you always have a bad one.
00:20:21.119 --> 00:20:22.160
I love shopping, right?
00:20:22.319 --> 00:20:23.519
Absolutely love shopping.
00:20:23.599 --> 00:20:26.799
And there was a time where I did a lot outside, etc.
00:20:27.039 --> 00:20:30.400
So I thought, why not have an online retail business?
00:20:30.559 --> 00:20:32.160
So we got an online retail business.
00:20:32.319 --> 00:20:40.079
I got investors, I got investment, and thank goodness I know how to build businesses and I can really, you know, forecast ahead and look at the cash flow.
00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:43.839
So the business sold was an online gardening retail shop, right?
00:20:44.000 --> 00:20:50.960
Laura, I had no understanding why people didn't buy pink wheelbarrows as in terms of the online retail shops.
00:20:51.119 --> 00:20:53.920
I could not get these pink wheelbarrows in fast enough.
00:20:54.000 --> 00:21:00.240
And because we were a new business and it was Christmas, I had to wrap these frickin' wheelbarrows myself.
00:21:00.400 --> 00:21:03.039
I don't know if you've ever had to try to wrap a pink wheelbarrow.
00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:04.640
I'm telling you now, it's painful.
00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:11.599
My entire house, my kitchen, my sitting room, my dining room, bedrooms, landings, everywhere had pink wheelbarrows.
00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:13.359
We could not get them in quick enough.
00:21:13.519 --> 00:21:19.359
However, what we realized going into the new year was within six months we'd run out of runway.
00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:25.680
So rather than it the business actually fail, we sold the stock, we wound it up, so no one lost any money.
00:21:25.839 --> 00:21:28.319
So for me, that was kind of like my one failure.
00:21:28.400 --> 00:21:47.759
And I really wanted to write a book that was funny, but where there are a bunch of entrepreneurs who gave their views and perspectives, and we also got a bank into to be able to say, okay, so if you're an entrepreneur coming to us and wanting investment, these this is what you need to do, and some really interesting stories around that as well.
00:21:48.000 --> 00:21:50.319
So I kind of thought, well, what's the best title for this?
00:21:50.480 --> 00:21:54.799
Trouble with pink wheelbarrows, because that was a real problem for me.
00:21:54.880 --> 00:21:55.039
Yeah.
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:58.799
And it's really grabbed the attention and imagination of people ever since.
00:21:58.960 --> 00:21:59.759
I love that because.
00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:09.119
Because I think that sometimes what leaders don't do well enough is omitting when they have made mistakes in the past, right?
00:22:09.440 --> 00:22:19.519
But I don't know any good leaders that haven't made bad mistakes in the past and normally have built something really successful because of it.
00:22:19.680 --> 00:22:24.960
So do you think that you could have built what you had now without this disaster?
00:22:25.279 --> 00:22:26.640
No, absolutely not.
00:22:26.799 --> 00:22:32.400
Because there were so many lessons, time, ego, you know, just pushing through when we thought we could do it.
00:22:32.559 --> 00:22:38.319
And luckily, when I had more time the new year, excuse me, I was able to look at it and say, do you know what this isn't working?
00:22:38.720 --> 00:22:42.240
Let's make a tough decision before it becomes a financial problem.
00:22:42.720 --> 00:22:46.319
So I often think, what is the worst thing in your life that could happen for you?
00:22:46.480 --> 00:22:48.720
Be that you know personal or commercial.
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:52.000
Commercially, it's having a business that fails, right?
00:22:52.160 --> 00:22:57.119
But we all need that business that fails or things that fail for us to learn from.
00:22:57.279 --> 00:22:59.680
Even if it's something small, you know, what's the learning from that?
00:22:59.759 --> 00:23:00.400
What do I take?
00:23:00.559 --> 00:23:01.039
Move on.
00:23:01.200 --> 00:23:03.519
So absolutely, would I be here today without it?
00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:03.920
No.
00:23:04.079 --> 00:23:06.720
And I certainly wouldn't have a best-selling book as a result.
00:23:06.880 --> 00:23:07.279
Mm-hmm.
00:23:07.359 --> 00:23:07.839
Mm-hmm.
00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:08.880
How amazing.
00:23:09.039 --> 00:23:15.920
I love that lesson because when you are an entrepreneur, it is so hard not to be so hard on yourself every day.
00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:16.559
Absolutely.
00:23:16.720 --> 00:23:20.480
Um, I also like what you said of you knew when to pull out too.
00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:20.880
Yeah.
00:23:21.039 --> 00:23:37.920
And I think that's important where people do get stuck is I think that there's a difference between trying so hard at something and being persistent and diligent and seeing something through, and then actually knowing where, okay, I need to pivot, I need to step back, I need to change.
00:23:38.079 --> 00:23:38.319
Yeah.
00:23:38.559 --> 00:23:45.599
So do you work with your founders on navigating some of those directional places of where their business should go?
00:23:45.839 --> 00:23:46.559
Absolutely.
00:23:46.880 --> 00:23:55.680
So often what we see is what the founder thinks the business is going to be in the first year is very different by the end of year one.
00:23:56.400 --> 00:24:02.319
Because the momentum has gone in a maybe a completely different direction that they're really enjoying.
00:24:02.480 --> 00:24:04.720
And there's always things that they say, do you know what?
00:24:04.799 --> 00:24:06.000
I don't want to do that anymore.
00:24:06.079 --> 00:24:08.079
And that goes out the window as well.
00:24:08.319 --> 00:24:11.680
I think this fluidity and pivoting is really important.
00:24:11.920 --> 00:24:16.079
Agility now in today's world is a skill that we all need to have.
00:24:16.240 --> 00:24:18.079
So don't be afraid of it, embrace it.
00:24:18.240 --> 00:24:18.640
Mm-hmm.
00:24:18.720 --> 00:24:19.119
Mm-hmm.
00:24:19.359 --> 00:24:24.480
So, Sam, I'm gonna get into some things that I did not prepare you for at all.
00:24:24.720 --> 00:24:25.039
Okay.
00:24:25.279 --> 00:24:27.680
So we're gonna have some rapid fire questions.
00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:28.400
Love it.
00:24:28.559 --> 00:24:32.400
And I need you to give me your gut reaction to things.
00:24:32.559 --> 00:24:33.680
Okay, can't overthink it.
00:24:33.839 --> 00:24:35.759
I'm not gonna familize what comes out of my mouth.
00:24:35.920 --> 00:24:36.319
Yeah, yeah.
00:24:36.480 --> 00:24:37.519
I don't think you are.
00:24:37.839 --> 00:24:41.119
Some people on here, I need to be worried that they're gonna fabricate things.
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:42.079
I don't think that's you.
00:24:42.400 --> 00:24:42.720
No.
00:24:42.960 --> 00:24:43.279
Okay.
00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:44.000
Okay.
00:24:44.319 --> 00:24:45.920
The first job you've ever had.
00:24:46.319 --> 00:24:48.720
Typing pool uh at KPMG.
00:24:48.960 --> 00:24:53.359
The thing HR consultants say that make you want to scream.
00:24:53.599 --> 00:24:54.799
I'm just an HR.
00:24:55.359 --> 00:24:55.680
Okay.
00:24:56.000 --> 00:24:57.200
Yes, good one.
00:24:57.519 --> 00:25:01.839
Best piece of advice you ever ignored and then you regretted.
00:25:02.160 --> 00:25:04.079
Best piece of advice I ever ignored.
00:25:04.240 --> 00:25:06.240
Don't celebrate the wins before they happen.
00:25:06.480 --> 00:25:07.920
Oh, my preach.
00:25:08.079 --> 00:25:09.680
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
00:25:09.920 --> 00:25:10.240
Yeah.
00:25:10.480 --> 00:25:21.920
So I can tell you, one of my businesses, yeah, I went out really young, early mid-20s, took a mate out, took a tour champagne bar, celebrated, because I'd got a verbal agreement and a contract.
00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:22.400
Guess what?
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:24.240
Next day, Laura didn't win the contract.
00:25:24.319 --> 00:25:24.480
Yeah.
00:25:24.720 --> 00:25:28.079
And one of those lessons that you need just to happen to you.
00:25:28.400 --> 00:25:29.039
Fin there.
00:25:29.200 --> 00:25:30.799
So thank you so much, Sam.
00:25:30.960 --> 00:25:35.039
You have built such an incredible business and you are a LinkedIn queen.
00:25:35.279 --> 00:25:37.759
So we will continue to stay updated there.
00:25:37.920 --> 00:25:42.720
All your information will be in the show notes and really appreciate your time that you spent with us.
00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:43.359
So thank you.
