1
00:00:08,060 --> 00:00:13,200
Wherever there are shadows, there are people ready to kick at the darkness until it bleeds daylight.
2
00:00:14,140 --> 00:00:17,860
This is Bleeding Daylight with your host, Rodney Olsen.
3
00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:22,180
Welcome to Bleeding Daylight.
4
00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:23,560
I'm so glad you're listening.
5
00:00:24,420 --> 00:00:30,320
There are hundreds more inspirational episodes waiting for you at bleedingdaylight.net.
6
00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:37,200
Please find and follow Bleeding Daylight on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and YouTube.
7
00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:39,120
I'd love to connect with you there.
8
00:00:41,060 --> 00:00:47,280
Many of the things we believe about ourselves and the world are formed when we're very young.
9
00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:53,800
So how does trauma alter our perceptions about who we are and what's possible in our lives?
10
00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:58,380
Is there a way to heal the scars and move towards a better future?
11
00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:01,520
Today's guest has lived that story.
12
00:01:09,590 --> 00:01:13,250
Today's guest is one I've been genuinely looking forward to meeting.
13
00:01:13,490 --> 00:01:17,890
Brian Gray has spent 20 years helping the very people he used to be.
14
00:01:18,370 --> 00:01:23,130
Addicts, inmates, troubled kids, because he lived every bit of that himself.
15
00:01:23,470 --> 00:01:27,910
He's the author of a rap sheet to resume, finding blessing in brokenness.
16
00:01:28,110 --> 00:01:31,450
A raw and honest account of his story so far.
17
00:01:32,130 --> 00:01:42,690
This isn't a tidy redemption story, it's childhood trauma, addiction by 15, a marriage that fell apart, jail and then a moment on a beach in Hawaii that changed everything.
18
00:01:43,350 --> 00:01:51,070
Today he runs residential care for at-risk youth and together with his wife a transitional home for women in recovery and their kids.
19
00:01:51,770 --> 00:01:54,070
His message is simple but it hits hard.
20
00:01:54,490 --> 00:01:58,350
Your past may explain you but it doesn't have to imprison you.
21
00:01:58,970 --> 00:02:00,950
Brian welcome to Bleeding Daylight.
22
00:02:01,190 --> 00:02:02,010
Pleasure to be here.
23
00:02:02,390 --> 00:02:14,110
One of the things I've observed from many of the people that I've spoken with is that helping others to overcome the very things that have tripped them up in the past is part of their own healing.
24
00:02:14,310 --> 00:02:16,110
Have you found that to be the case for you?
25
00:02:16,450 --> 00:02:18,030
Oh absolutely 100%.
26
00:02:18,030 --> 00:02:19,850
Ultimately the healer is Jesus.
27
00:02:20,490 --> 00:02:29,370
The thing is though is that a lot of us that come from traumatized broken pasts, we have a real hard time comprehending the love of God and for me in particular the Father's heart.
28
00:02:29,830 --> 00:02:39,930
And so my journey has really taken me to the place where it's like I have an understanding, at least much better than I ever did before, ever thought I could of the Father's heart and his love for me.
29
00:02:40,490 --> 00:02:46,070
Sometimes a moment in life can be so powerful that it plays a huge part in shaping our lives.
30
00:02:46,110 --> 00:02:48,870
So I'm wondering if we can jump back for a moment.
31
00:02:48,970 --> 00:02:51,950
Tell me about that pivotal moment for you as a four-year-old.
32
00:02:52,510 --> 00:03:02,870
Yeah so I think that one of the things that gets missed in people that enter into recovery is the lies that form the foundation of their lives and their belief system.
33
00:03:03,310 --> 00:03:04,730
And mine began when I was four.
34
00:03:05,130 --> 00:03:10,910
It was a time back in about 1969 I was playing with my best friend Jeffrey Carpenter at his house.
35
00:03:11,290 --> 00:03:12,270
I'd been out for the day.
36
00:03:12,330 --> 00:03:17,050
My mother's rule at the time was like you're out, you're not going to track mud in and out of the house all day.
37
00:03:17,190 --> 00:03:19,410
And so I was down playing Cowboys and Indians with him.
38
00:03:19,690 --> 00:03:27,450
We were just playing with cap guns and everything and all of a sudden his brother came onto the porch and said, with a big huge gun, he said, this gun is real and I'm gonna kill you.
39
00:03:27,930 --> 00:03:30,410
And I was four and I believed him 100%.
40
00:03:30,410 --> 00:03:31,230
He scared me.
41
00:03:31,410 --> 00:03:34,890
And so I ran as fast as I could and he and his friends were chasing me.
42
00:03:35,350 --> 00:03:39,530
And in retrospect I can remember looking back and seeing the spring where the ping-pong ball went.
43
00:03:39,930 --> 00:03:44,370
And so I wasn't really going to be shot but I believed I was going to be shot and I was going to die.
44
00:03:44,570 --> 00:03:49,110
I got to my house, banged on the screen door, which was locked, and screamed, mommy, mommy, let me in.
45
00:03:49,210 --> 00:03:50,590
They're gonna kill me, they're gonna kill me.
46
00:03:50,790 --> 00:03:53,990
And she came to the door and said, go, go fight your own battles.
47
00:03:54,290 --> 00:03:56,790
And I turned around and the boys were gone, obviously.
48
00:03:57,090 --> 00:04:04,710
But in that moment, that thought, you're on your own, you're by yourself, you fight your own battles, that stuck really, really deep.
49
00:04:04,870 --> 00:04:11,430
And I spent the next several decades either fighting my own battles or creating my own battles to prove to myself that I could fight them.
50
00:04:11,730 --> 00:04:21,590
My family fell apart over the course of the next decade or so and I ended up living on my own at 14, living in a house actually with three completed walls that my father was building.
51
00:04:21,990 --> 00:04:23,030
My parents got divorced.
52
00:04:23,170 --> 00:04:24,970
My father went kind of crazy and left.
53
00:04:25,110 --> 00:04:27,050
My mother left and I was by myself.
54
00:04:27,330 --> 00:04:29,230
And so by the time I was 15, I was an addict.
55
00:04:29,490 --> 00:04:31,010
Life just spiraled from there.
56
00:04:31,130 --> 00:04:37,470
It wasn't until after just broken relationships, a broken marriage, I found myself in prison for five years.
57
00:04:37,890 --> 00:04:42,010
I found myself on a beach in Hawaii at the end of my rope.
58
00:04:42,510 --> 00:04:45,490
There was a guy on the berm just above the beach.
59
00:04:45,930 --> 00:04:52,050
I'd been making a lot of noise after doing a bunch of things and he had a shotgun in his hand and I would just decided, you know what, I'm done.
60
00:04:52,450 --> 00:04:53,790
I'm absolutely done.
61
00:04:54,010 --> 00:04:57,570
And I charged him screaming, shoot me, trying to get him to kill me.
62
00:04:57,710 --> 00:04:58,930
Now he fired the gun.
63
00:04:59,230 --> 00:05:00,710
Now I don't know why I didn't get hit.
64
00:05:00,770 --> 00:05:01,810
I thought I got hit at first.
65
00:05:01,850 --> 00:05:02,770
I fell down on the ground.
66
00:05:02,830 --> 00:05:03,690
I thought I was dead.
67
00:05:03,850 --> 00:05:10,850
And I heard not really an audible voice but as close to an audible voice as you could get without there actually being one.
68
00:05:10,850 --> 00:05:12,470
This is the last time.
69
00:05:12,730 --> 00:05:14,470
I knew that it was God.
70
00:05:14,710 --> 00:05:16,370
There was no question in my mind.
71
00:05:16,470 --> 00:05:19,570
And I thought at that time, like, I'm done.
72
00:05:19,790 --> 00:05:20,990
I'm sick and tired of you.
73
00:05:21,090 --> 00:05:22,390
I've saved you enough times.
74
00:05:22,450 --> 00:05:25,850
And my lord, he saved me so many times looking back.
75
00:05:26,010 --> 00:05:28,510
But I'm done and this is the last time.
76
00:05:28,610 --> 00:05:29,750
Next time I'm taking you out.
77
00:05:29,950 --> 00:05:31,110
Which may have been true.
78
00:05:31,430 --> 00:05:47,030
But it was when they took me back to jail and I'm sitting in there in a holding cell that I realized that it took me back and I had that memory of the time at Jeffrey Carpenter's house and he showed me that go fight your own battles meant this is the last time you fight your own battles.
79
00:05:47,390 --> 00:05:52,250
As miraculous as it was, I charged a guy with a shotgun and didn't get hit.
80
00:05:52,490 --> 00:05:55,430
That's a miracle in itself and I can't say how that happened.
81
00:05:55,670 --> 00:06:04,430
But what I do know is after 20 years of trying to stop drinking, I tried to stop drinking not long after I realized I was a full-blown alcoholic.
82
00:06:04,810 --> 00:06:06,610
Which like I said was about 15.
83
00:06:07,050 --> 00:06:11,710
But after 20 years I tried everything to get clean and sober and nothing worked.
84
00:06:11,810 --> 00:06:12,850
I just couldn't do it.
85
00:06:12,890 --> 00:06:13,830
I was in bondage.
86
00:06:13,970 --> 00:06:20,650
But I was delivered on that moment on that beach and I never ever have had a desire for a drink or a drug ever since then.
87
00:06:21,030 --> 00:06:23,010
And that was my Romans 12 1 and 2 moment.
88
00:06:23,110 --> 00:06:32,250
I offered my body as a living sacrifice for that was my reasonable worship and I entered into not being conformed to the ways of the world and in the transformation of my mind.
89
00:06:32,430 --> 00:06:36,070
I never looked back and my life was transformed from that moment.
90
00:06:36,250 --> 00:06:39,090
I've continued to walk out that transformation ever since.
91
00:06:39,450 --> 00:06:43,290
And a large part of that like you said has been in helping other people.
92
00:06:43,550 --> 00:06:47,270
I've learned my love for them and I've learned my father's love for me.
93
00:06:47,650 --> 00:06:56,090
It must have been quite amazing and almost hard to believe when finally you didn't just have someone in your corner.
94
00:06:56,270 --> 00:07:00,030
You had the creator of the universe saying to you, I'm in your corner.
95
00:07:00,490 --> 00:07:02,290
You don't have to fight your own battles anymore.
96
00:07:02,730 --> 00:07:04,110
I'm here for you.
97
00:07:04,650 --> 00:07:12,750
Tell me a little bit more about that and what it was like for you having to think through someone is finally fighting for me.
98
00:07:12,810 --> 00:07:14,210
That's a really good question.
99
00:07:14,370 --> 00:07:19,810
It also takes me back to like somewhere around the time before the incident with Jeffrey Carpenter.
100
00:07:20,030 --> 00:07:34,330
I was out in my yard at night looking up at the stars and the sky was perfectly clear looking up at the Milky Way and just having this sense that wow just absolute complete total awe.
101
00:07:34,470 --> 00:07:41,090
Although I couldn't have articulated it then but just a revelation that somebody created all this.
102
00:07:41,730 --> 00:07:43,990
It's just this is just too big.
103
00:07:44,190 --> 00:07:49,630
You know if you'd asked me what I was thinking or feeling at the time at four I couldn't have told you but I remember that moment.
104
00:07:50,170 --> 00:08:00,410
It was at that moment when I realized that God was like the one in my corner that I also remembered that moment and it was just like this is the creator of the universe.
105
00:08:00,410 --> 00:08:01,310
This is God.
106
00:08:01,310 --> 00:08:04,850
Of course I'd heard about Jesus and things like that.
107
00:08:04,970 --> 00:08:13,370
I'd been to church a few times and raised in a Catholic Church initially and I was an altar boy and I got kicked out of catechism for asking too many questions.
108
00:08:13,870 --> 00:08:32,309
I've been fighting against the God that I've been hearing about and they were like you know I talk about different people in my life that represented Christ you know not with words but with deeds and they just exhibited the fruit of the Spirit and I just realized that oh my gosh you've been trying to talk to me all this time and I just haven't been listening.
109
00:08:32,850 --> 00:08:33,809
It was a relief.
110
00:08:34,030 --> 00:08:43,490
It was just overwhelming peace even though I'm laying on the floor in a holding cell it was just a revelation that it's like I think it's gonna be okay now.
111
00:08:44,570 --> 00:08:54,710
You're saying there that it's kind of hard to believe that God has been speaking to you all this time has been trying to get through to you and you haven't been listening.
112
00:08:54,850 --> 00:09:09,650
I'm sure that a lot of the young people that you've been working alongside they're not hearing that either and it's hard to convince them that not only are you in their corner but the God that created the universe is in their corner.
113
00:09:09,970 --> 00:09:16,330
So how do you start to communicate that to someone who has never known anyone in their corner in the past?
114
00:09:16,850 --> 00:09:19,350
Well I work with children between the ages of 11 and
115
00:09:19,350 --> 00:09:26,130
18 and they are a complete spectrum of intellectual capacity and so there are
116
00:09:26,130 --> 00:09:29,450
some kids that I can sit down and have a meaningful conversation with and I'll
117
00:09:29,450 --> 00:09:32,750
give them like an apologetic argument and I love to tell them that it took
118
00:09:32,750 --> 00:09:37,750
something to the tune of 1,500 software engineers to write three billion lines
119
00:09:37,750 --> 00:09:43,150
of binary code ones and zeros to run Google and it takes something to the
120
00:09:43,150 --> 00:09:49,170
tune of three of two billion lines of quaternary code for amino acids to run a
121
00:09:49,170 --> 00:09:51,310
cell weighing like a ten thousandth of a gram.
122
00:09:51,510 --> 00:10:06,950
You would never say that Google was just created and came into a being out of nowhere so then how could you possibly think that something more complicated would be and so the ones that are kind of a little bit more intellectual go like huh yeah seed planted.
123
00:10:07,610 --> 00:10:17,350
Other kids I just have to be that person in their life that won't give up on them no matter what they do and they do some pretty crazy things.
124
00:10:19,150 --> 00:10:27,770
And so it's a question of like enduring love and solid apologetic arguments when they come up against it and they say there's no such thing as God I don't believe in God.
125
00:10:28,130 --> 00:10:40,670
You took us back to that time when you were a four-year-old and your mother said go and fight your own battles and of course it wasn't just the only thing there was a demonstration of that in the way that she was leaving you to be on your own.
126
00:10:41,110 --> 00:10:45,110
But I imagine that there's a number of triggers for the kids that you're working with.
127
00:10:45,610 --> 00:11:01,950
What are some of the things that have sent them down the path that has taken them to where they are now because no one decides that they're going to act in a way that is going to bring them undone and yet we see destructive behavior again and again.
128
00:11:02,050 --> 00:11:06,470
What are some of the things that you have encountered with some of the kids that you've been working with?
129
00:11:07,030 --> 00:11:19,450
We call it dependent neglect meaning that some way somehow but usually in multiple ways a child has not had what a child needs to come into the world and develop into a just a functioning human being.
130
00:11:19,970 --> 00:11:25,890
A lot of these kids have been completely abandoned many of them their parents are addicted to drugs and alcohol.
131
00:11:26,310 --> 00:11:34,030
We have a fentanyl crisis in the world right now where people are OD'ing and dying in droves you know so we have kids like that.
132
00:11:34,370 --> 00:11:41,010
We have kids that are beaten and they've been abused but they've never been disciplined which is a huge one.
133
00:11:41,310 --> 00:11:51,030
It's heartbreaking to hear their stories but then what a lot of people don't realize is that a dependent neglected child quite often doesn't look like a cuddly bunny that needs love.
134
00:11:51,330 --> 00:11:56,310
They do need love but that cuddly bunny it looks more like a snapping turtle a lot of times.
135
00:11:56,510 --> 00:12:03,450
A lot of the kids because of where they've been from because of neglect they become very hostile very aggressive and violent sometimes.
136
00:12:03,870 --> 00:12:07,410
We have to love them through that so the specific issues are
137
00:12:07,410 --> 00:12:11,390
some of them have not gotten food some of them have not gone to school a lot of
138
00:12:11,390 --> 00:12:16,070
them have been beaten and then they have had really really really bad examples of
139
00:12:16,070 --> 00:12:19,410
what it means to be a man or a woman in the world and so they've got a
140
00:12:19,410 --> 00:12:24,750
completely twisted worldview of what they were created to be as a human being
141
00:12:24,750 --> 00:12:28,470
on earth and what is the proper relationship between themselves and other
142
00:12:28,470 --> 00:12:30,030
people never mind God.
143
00:12:30,810 --> 00:12:46,310
Is there a sense for some of these young people that they haven't been taught how to behave in a way that we feel is acceptable and so therefore society is expecting something from them that they can't possibly deliver because they've never been taught that way.
144
00:12:46,770 --> 00:12:48,850
That's 100% correct and
145
00:12:48,850 --> 00:12:52,490
the key is it takes a lot a lot of patience because the thing about a
146
00:12:52,490 --> 00:12:57,490
teenager is as anybody that's been a teenager knows a lot of us that was the
147
00:12:57,490 --> 00:13:01,730
smartest point in our life when we knew the most about everything right and so
148
00:13:01,730 --> 00:13:06,150
they think they've got it figured out they have absolutely no clue whatsoever
149
00:13:06,150 --> 00:13:10,850
and so to come against a person that is like knows much better than I do because
150
00:13:10,850 --> 00:13:14,450
I'm old they're just like oh you're old you don't know anything don't even talk
151
00:13:14,450 --> 00:13:18,830
to me there's an absolute deficit in some of the most basic things that a
152
00:13:18,830 --> 00:13:23,810
two-year-old learns like just respect for other people don't hit don't take
153
00:13:23,810 --> 00:13:27,730
other things just because you don't have it and they do doesn't mean that it's
154
00:13:27,730 --> 00:13:31,390
like the fact that you can steal it doesn't mean it's your right to do you
155
00:13:31,390 --> 00:13:36,070
know I think a lot of people naturally because we were just taught the basics
156
00:13:36,070 --> 00:13:40,030
at a young age like no that's right that's wrong do it because it's right
157
00:13:40,030 --> 00:13:44,250
not because you can is a really big one people that have not gotten the basic
158
00:13:44,250 --> 00:13:47,710
needs that they need like food and shelter and health care and and just
159
00:13:47,710 --> 00:13:53,050
basic human needs they grow up with a mindset of I have to just take it I am
160
00:13:53,050 --> 00:13:57,430
on my own I am fighting my own battle so if you're gonna leave your wallet
161
00:13:57,430 --> 00:14:01,570
sitting there and I can take it I'm going to because I can and you were too
162
00:14:01,570 --> 00:14:05,310
dumb to protect it kids grow up with a mindset like that and then they end up in jails.
163
00:14:05,310 --> 00:14:09,670
I know that a lot of people within churches would want to be
164
00:14:09,670 --> 00:14:15,170
helping young people like this but oftentimes I imagine they don't have the
165
00:14:15,170 --> 00:14:20,810
tools to do so they don't have the understanding how can we start to help
166
00:14:20,810 --> 00:14:25,850
churches understand that there is a way to help young people who are in this
167
00:14:25,850 --> 00:14:31,010
sort of crisis the first thing is to understand that there's often a fine
168
00:14:31,010 --> 00:14:37,250
line between magical thinking and faith what I mean by that is magical thinking
169
00:14:37,250 --> 00:14:41,250
is just like automatic I'm just gonna pray for somebody and then they're just
170
00:14:41,250 --> 00:14:45,710
gonna be fixed sometimes that happens clearly in my case I think I had a
171
00:14:45,710 --> 00:14:49,670
grandmother who had been praying for me for years that I believe actually led me
172
00:14:49,670 --> 00:14:54,550
to that point on that beach there was a miraculous instant deliverance and those
173
00:14:54,550 --> 00:14:59,690
things are real God does miracles but in Matthew chapter 24 speaking about the
174
00:14:59,690 --> 00:15:04,490
end of the age right it talks about the love of many will grow cold but he that
175
00:15:04,490 --> 00:15:09,490
endures to the end will be saved and I think a lot of people separate those
176
00:15:09,490 --> 00:15:13,130
verses into like well I don't I want to be loving but then I have to endure and
177
00:15:13,130 --> 00:15:16,850
dig a bunker and survive or whatever is going to come and what it really comes
178
00:15:16,850 --> 00:15:21,710
down to is enduring love for one we need people that are going to have the
179
00:15:21,710 --> 00:15:27,250
capacity to endure with these children because they will stretch every single
180
00:15:27,250 --> 00:15:31,550
bit of everything that's in anyone that tries to reach out to them and work with
181
00:15:31,550 --> 00:15:36,790
them and that's where Romans 3 5 through 8 comes in there's tribulation which is
182
00:15:36,790 --> 00:15:42,130
the ellipsis in Greek which means pressure and perseverance perseverance
183
00:15:42,130 --> 00:15:47,130
produces character and character hope and that hope doesn't disappoint and I
184
00:15:47,130 --> 00:15:51,650
think that we have to understand that there is a need but it's like that need
185
00:15:51,650 --> 00:15:57,570
isn't just because God wants to help these children God is going to use these
186
00:15:57,570 --> 00:16:02,390
children to transform us people that are willing to go into working with these
187
00:16:02,390 --> 00:16:05,650
kids with that mindset at the beginning have a much better chance of succeeding
188
00:16:05,650 --> 00:16:11,190
but these children will push every single button because the belief the deep
189
00:16:11,190 --> 00:16:15,970
belief is at their core because this is what they've been taught is I'm going to
190
00:16:15,970 --> 00:16:21,730
be rejected I'm going to be unlovable therefore the anticipation the tension
191
00:16:21,730 --> 00:16:25,710
of living in this place where it's like subconsciously I know I'm going to be
192
00:16:25,710 --> 00:16:29,710
rejected it's better to just do something and get rejected right off the
193
00:16:29,710 --> 00:16:33,810
bat and get it over with and move on and go back to what I know.
194
00:16:33,810 --> 00:16:38,470
We know that it can be difficult for young people to understand that someone is in their
195
00:16:38,470 --> 00:16:43,530
corner and it can be difficult for those people who are trying to work with them
196
00:16:43,530 --> 00:16:48,510
and yet we look to the scripture and we see that while it was that we were still
197
00:16:48,510 --> 00:16:55,690
sinners Christ died for us and was prepared to go to the cross for us if we
198
00:16:55,690 --> 00:17:00,290
want to be more like Jesus I suppose we've got to expect that those that
199
00:17:00,290 --> 00:17:06,210
we're trying to love may not necessarily reciprocate that love or in a way that we can understand it.
200
00:17:06,210 --> 00:17:11,310
Absolutely and that's where in first Corinthians 3 Paul
201
00:17:11,310 --> 00:17:15,190
talks about I planted a polis watered one plants one waters the one that
202
00:17:15,190 --> 00:17:19,550
plants and waters are the same and the one part that I think a lot of people
203
00:17:19,550 --> 00:17:24,670
miss and don't like is they are nothing but only God who gives the increase a
204
00:17:24,670 --> 00:17:29,150
lot of times people will enter into ministry with the most broken and
205
00:17:29,150 --> 00:17:34,250
confuse faithfulness with success they're not synonyms we're called to be
206
00:17:34,250 --> 00:17:39,910
faithful servants meaning we plant and we water in faith and trust that God
207
00:17:39,910 --> 00:17:44,010
will give the increase and I can say that having worked with kids for 20
208
00:17:44,010 --> 00:17:47,930
years more often than not it's probably going to be about five years at least
209
00:17:47,930 --> 00:17:52,150
before God gives an increase but when I look at the seeds that were planted in my
210
00:17:52,150 --> 00:17:56,970
life at my worst points in my life when I was a youth looking back and realizing
211
00:17:56,970 --> 00:18:02,110
that it's like those are the people that really really truly impacted my life
212
00:18:02,110 --> 00:18:06,350
those are the people that faithfully planted in water even though I did not
213
00:18:06,350 --> 00:18:11,350
give them any reason whatsoever why it should have any hope that I would be transformed.
214
00:18:11,350 --> 00:18:15,690
You get to work with a number of kids and now together with
215
00:18:15,690 --> 00:18:20,490
your wife you're helping women who are in recovery and their kids but there's
216
00:18:20,490 --> 00:18:25,330
only a certain number of people that you can reach personally is that part of
217
00:18:25,330 --> 00:18:29,950
your reasoning for writing rap sheet to resume so that you can actually put
218
00:18:29,950 --> 00:18:35,250
practical steps in the hands of even more people.
219
00:18:35,250 --> 00:18:40,950
Yes I mean that is the reason why I wrote rap sheet to resume I want people that maybe walk the path similar
220
00:18:40,950 --> 00:18:45,230
to mine they think that they're too broken to be able to be of any use to
221
00:18:45,230 --> 00:18:50,270
anybody you know and are just settling for less spiritually and in terms of the
222
00:18:50,270 --> 00:18:54,810
purpose that God created them for I wrote it for people that are working
223
00:18:54,810 --> 00:18:59,370
with dependent neglected children it's just broken populations inmates addicts
224
00:18:59,370 --> 00:19:03,470
maybe somebody wants to and they don't know how so there's some practical tools
225
00:19:03,470 --> 00:19:06,490
in there and then it's also for people that are actively engaged and
226
00:19:06,490 --> 00:19:10,150
struggling and thinking like oh my gosh I mean why am I even doing this there's
227
00:19:10,150 --> 00:19:14,010
no fruit here I've got to get out those would be like people that are actively
228
00:19:14,010 --> 00:19:18,070
fostering or maybe working in dependent neglected care and I've gotten some
229
00:19:18,070 --> 00:19:22,770
feedback from people in all those areas the book is in a jail in Hawaii the one
230
00:19:22,770 --> 00:19:26,490
that I was in a lot of the inmates in there saying like thank you this is so
231
00:19:26,490 --> 00:19:30,610
good it makes perfect sense I'm actually starting to understand God people that
232
00:19:30,610 --> 00:19:34,790
have worked in foster care saying that while I wish I had this when I was a
233
00:19:34,790 --> 00:19:38,970
foster parent and then people that are actually working in the field with
234
00:19:38,970 --> 00:19:43,210
residential care just saying this is the best book I've read this is so helpful I
235
00:19:43,210 --> 00:19:46,950
really feel like I was led by the Lord to do it and I was directed by the Lord
236
00:19:46,950 --> 00:19:51,230
because it just happened so easily so my hope is it just helps people I don't
237
00:19:51,230 --> 00:19:56,190
think I'm never gonna make any money on it 3% of authors make a living by
238
00:19:56,190 --> 00:20:00,090
writing books you don't write a book to make money you write a book because you
239
00:20:00,090 --> 00:20:04,070
want to change lives and that's why I wrote rap sheet to resume.
240
00:20:04,070 --> 00:20:09,470
It doesn't come from theory but rather lived experience how important is that the
241
00:20:09,470 --> 00:20:14,910
reality of that for those who are reading those words knowing that these are things that you've lived through.
242
00:20:14,910 --> 00:20:18,910
It's important it's valuable but I
243
00:20:18,910 --> 00:20:22,690
don't want to make it sound like you have to have the same types of
244
00:20:22,690 --> 00:20:27,030
experiences to reach out to people because let's face it I knew how to mess
245
00:20:27,030 --> 00:20:30,650
things up I knew how to mess my life up and what I didn't know is how to live
246
00:20:30,650 --> 00:20:35,250
successfully for some reason people want to have a radical testimony and people
247
00:20:35,250 --> 00:20:39,770
say oh I wish I had a testimony like yours and I'm like no you don't I wish I
248
00:20:39,770 --> 00:20:42,990
had a testimony like yours you know speaking to a person that's like comes
249
00:20:42,990 --> 00:20:46,850
from a Christian family that is rooted and grounded in Christ and in the word
250
00:20:46,850 --> 00:20:50,970
and raising their kids the way they should it just amazes me and I'm
251
00:20:50,970 --> 00:20:55,450
fascinated by those people so we need both we need people that have been there
252
00:20:55,450 --> 00:20:59,350
and done that so to speak and have come out of it but we also need people who
253
00:20:59,350 --> 00:21:04,030
just know how to live a life the way God created us to live it without having to make all the mistakes and have all the sin.
254
00:21:04,030 --> 00:21:10,750
It must be incredibly joyful for you
255
00:21:10,750 --> 00:21:18,250
to take someone who has had a difficult start to life maybe has dabbled in abuse
256
00:21:18,250 --> 00:21:25,190
of various substances and yet you bring them to a better place but even more
257
00:21:25,190 --> 00:21:30,650
than that to introduce them to the Creator to introduce them to God what's
258
00:21:30,650 --> 00:21:35,530
that like when the lights suddenly switch on for some of those young people and
259
00:21:35,530 --> 00:21:40,350
they start to say I want to explore more of this God you're talking about.
260
00:21:40,350 --> 00:21:43,070
Well. I guess I could give you an example of one of the kids that I worked about and
261
00:21:43,070 --> 00:21:47,810
that I wrote about I call him a yelk the yelk is a part of an egg that nourishes
262
00:21:47,810 --> 00:21:53,630
the ovum as it's in development he came to us when he was 14 years old he had
263
00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:58,890
been abused he had been in a foster home his mother had OD'd and died on drugs his
264
00:21:58,890 --> 00:22:03,270
father had been missing since his birth nobody knew where he was his foster
265
00:22:03,270 --> 00:22:07,470
brother had poured lighter fluid on his arm and lit it on fire he's completely
266
00:22:07,470 --> 00:22:12,710
traumatized on top of that he was on the spectrum for autism brilliant brilliant
267
00:22:12,710 --> 00:22:17,410
brilliant kid but at the same time emotionally and socially just very
268
00:22:17,410 --> 00:22:22,090
regressed when he came in he looked like a friendly Barney that's the best
269
00:22:22,090 --> 00:22:26,630
character that I could compare him to just happy smiling sweet one of those
270
00:22:26,630 --> 00:22:30,730
kids you just want to hug as soon as you meet him it didn't take us long to find
271
00:22:30,730 --> 00:22:35,890
out that Barney had a dark side so he would hear the word no get told
272
00:22:35,890 --> 00:22:41,490
something he couldn't do and he would scream and he had this almost glass
273
00:22:41,490 --> 00:22:46,630
shattering scream that would just go on for hours and hours and hours and we
274
00:22:46,630 --> 00:22:50,830
have ten boys in each cottage at the home that I work in there are times when
275
00:22:50,830 --> 00:22:53,990
we had to clear the boys out and take them outside because they were so
276
00:22:53,990 --> 00:22:57,950
triggered they all wanted to kill him but he would just scream and scream for
277
00:22:57,950 --> 00:23:01,830
hours and he would just get angry and he would break things and he would just
278
00:23:01,830 --> 00:23:06,630
throw things at me and he was an atheist when he came in and we were given Bibles
279
00:23:06,630 --> 00:23:10,250
and he would throw Bibles at me I've been personally hit just me not my
280
00:23:10,250 --> 00:23:14,950
co-workers but with three Bibles three fans if I like caught on to him I would
281
00:23:14,950 --> 00:23:18,590
open his door when he'd be screaming and I would like open it and then shut it and
282
00:23:18,590 --> 00:23:22,010
then let whatever he was going to throw hit the door then go ahead and try to
283
00:23:22,010 --> 00:23:27,250
talk to him this just went on for years we have a 12-week program that a kid
284
00:23:27,250 --> 00:23:31,810
can conceivably get put in and complete the program in 12 weeks so we have 11
285
00:23:31,810 --> 00:23:34,930
year olds that do it and they move on to foster care they go home
286
00:23:34,930 --> 00:23:39,550
Yelp took three years the last Bible that he threw at me he ripped up and it
287
00:23:39,550 --> 00:23:42,930
was around Christmas time and we have a Christmas tree contest with all the
288
00:23:42,930 --> 00:23:47,070
different cottages so I went and I cut out the scriptures of Luke the Christmas
289
00:23:47,070 --> 00:23:51,090
story out of Luke and I pasted them on cards and it set the theme for our
290
00:23:51,090 --> 00:23:57,230
Christmas tree and his cottage won that year so it's kind of like God causes all
291
00:23:57,230 --> 00:24:02,110
things to work together for good right he would do the craziest things one time
292
00:24:02,110 --> 00:24:05,790
he took all his clothes off and stripped down and we have security cameras
293
00:24:05,790 --> 00:24:09,610
everywhere except in the bedrooms in the bathrooms right for the common areas so
294
00:24:09,610 --> 00:24:14,970
he stripped down and I look on cameras in my office and here he is dancing in the
295
00:24:14,970 --> 00:24:19,390
middle of the day room buck naked and it was just like what are you doing and he
296
00:24:19,390 --> 00:24:23,510
was trying to make us think he was crazy one of his last incidents was he got a
297
00:24:23,510 --> 00:24:27,790
hold of his medication side effect sheets and they're treating it for ADHD
298
00:24:27,790 --> 00:24:31,590
all these kids are over medicated but he got a hold of his medication side
299
00:24:31,590 --> 00:24:36,690
effect sheet and he scripted an Emmy award-winning stroke we went into his
300
00:24:36,690 --> 00:24:41,030
room we looked at him and he was on the floor he wasn't moving his eyes were
301
00:24:41,030 --> 00:24:44,310
rolling in the back of his head and we thought he was having a seizure or
302
00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:49,150
something I called the ambulance the EMS crew came they're like oh okay we're
303
00:24:49,150 --> 00:24:51,950
gonna take him we have to take him to the Children's Hospital not the regular
304
00:24:51,950 --> 00:24:55,690
ER we don't know what's going on so they came and they took him the emergency
305
00:24:55,690 --> 00:24:59,750
department he faked them out they sent him to another hospital you know about
306
00:24:59,750 --> 00:25:03,490
two hours away for a complete neurological workup they got done with
307
00:25:03,490 --> 00:25:07,130
a neurological workup their neurologist said I'm not really sure what happened
308
00:25:07,130 --> 00:25:11,030
it might have been some type of seizure just keep your eye on more like okay I
309
00:25:11,710 --> 00:25:14,710
used to tell him when he would get violent and you would throw things at me
310
00:25:14,710 --> 00:25:18,170
I would say stop yell girl shoot that's what you're doing you're just putting a
311
00:25:18,170 --> 00:25:21,230
gun to your head and threatening to shoot yourself you're hurting yourself
312
00:25:21,230 --> 00:25:25,850
and he would just go ah whatever and then finally the very last incident
313
00:25:25,850 --> 00:25:30,050
after the stroke incident this is like three years into it he was in the day
314
00:25:30,050 --> 00:25:33,630
room he was angry he picked up a chair he was going to throw it at me and I
315
00:25:33,630 --> 00:25:38,530
just looked at him and he goes I know I know stop or I'll shoot I'm like good
316
00:25:39,910 --> 00:25:45,290
and then he put the chair down went in his room and he tried to do his glass
317
00:25:45,290 --> 00:25:51,210
breaking scream and his voice cracked and he opens the door and he's like this
318
00:25:51,210 --> 00:25:55,570
blankety blank blank blank stuff right here right now and I'm like oh no what's
319
00:25:55,570 --> 00:26:00,470
he gonna do now he went and he sat down at the table because one biggest
320
00:26:00,470 --> 00:26:04,750
consequence there is a 24-hour grounding where you have 24 hours you have to sit
321
00:26:04,750 --> 00:26:08,430
at a table and read write color or draw and you can't talk to anybody or play
322
00:26:08,430 --> 00:26:12,750
games or anything else right and so he sat down at the table and he served his
323
00:26:12,750 --> 00:26:17,910
grounding and then that was it he was done and then he went off to our
324
00:26:17,910 --> 00:26:22,710
independent living cottage and he went on a mission trip to Mississippi and
325
00:26:23,230 --> 00:26:28,110
then he started doing the slides in church and then he even started learning
326
00:26:28,110 --> 00:26:32,990
percussion and playing on the worship team in church he left as an adult he's
327
00:26:32,990 --> 00:26:37,830
going to college and learning how to code do computer programming and to be
328
00:26:37,830 --> 00:26:42,550
a software engineer at one point I was talking to a new staff and explaining
329
00:26:42,550 --> 00:26:48,070
why we don't give up on the kids and I was using Yelp as an example Yelp came
330
00:26:48,070 --> 00:26:51,890
over and he was talking to us and he said yeah yeah yeah he's like I did all
331
00:26:51,890 --> 00:26:56,130
those things and we're talking about the feign stroke and he said I think the
332
00:26:56,130 --> 00:27:01,650
best thing that really got him is when I peed my pants but my point be it is like
333
00:27:01,650 --> 00:27:06,310
this is a kid that was like a couple of days in working with them mostly would
334
00:27:06,310 --> 00:27:10,870
be like he doesn't belong here there is no hope for this child he's disrupting
335
00:27:10,870 --> 00:27:14,890
all the other children we've got to get him out of here and the reality is
336
00:27:14,890 --> 00:27:18,490
he's one of our most successful cases so far since I've been working at this
337
00:27:18,490 --> 00:27:22,970
particular place for the last five years.
338
00:27:22,970 --> 00:27:28,970
Obviously when you look back on your own history there's a very dark section there and I'm wondering have you had the
339
00:27:28,970 --> 00:27:32,750
opportunity to connect with some of those people that were in your past maybe
340
00:27:32,750 --> 00:27:38,450
those other inmates in the prison or other troubled kids or addicts around the
341
00:27:38,450 --> 00:27:43,930
time and what do they make of the change in you?
342
00:27:43,930 --> 00:27:50,950
A lot of the people that I was in jail with are off in prison doing long sentences or they're dead a
343
00:27:50,950 --> 00:27:55,790
lot of them are dead I'm over 60 and you can't live that kind of lifestyle using
344
00:27:55,790 --> 00:27:59,930
drugs and alcohol and being wild there's a joke that they have on Kauai where I
345
00:27:59,930 --> 00:28:04,090
was from that there are no old addicts are no old junkies you know because they
346
00:28:04,090 --> 00:28:08,730
die off and that's absolutely true there are people that like me have
347
00:28:08,730 --> 00:28:12,850
changed their life and moved on and done really well my wife and I ran a
348
00:28:12,850 --> 00:28:16,950
transition house for 12 years after that on Kauai where we took furloughed
349
00:28:16,950 --> 00:28:20,310
inmates meaning they're not completely out of the system they're still under the
350
00:28:20,310 --> 00:28:24,110
jurisdiction of the jail into our home and we lived with five to ten of them
351
00:28:24,110 --> 00:28:28,370
and sometimes their children for 12 years there are several of them that had
352
00:28:28,370 --> 00:28:33,310
really really have done well one is a teacher at a high school one at his own
353
00:28:33,310 --> 00:28:37,470
contracting business and was building homes he died of a heart attack a couple
354
00:28:37,470 --> 00:28:42,150
of years ago he's one of my best friends the last girl in our house she actually
355
00:28:42,150 --> 00:28:46,830
was running a program for the homeless for the county there are people that
356
00:28:46,830 --> 00:28:52,330
have succeeded I was just there on Kauai to perform my son's wedding about a
357
00:28:52,330 --> 00:28:56,130
month ago we always go into the jail and I saw some of the people that had been
358
00:28:56,130 --> 00:28:59,870
there when I was there and they had my book and they were saying I get it now I
359
00:28:59,870 --> 00:29:04,790
get it now and it's just like well I hope you do I really hope you do the
360
00:29:04,790 --> 00:29:08,770
percentages are still low for people that go down this path and it really
361
00:29:08,770 --> 00:29:12,990
comes down to there's something that's got to happen that causes a person to be
362
00:29:12,990 --> 00:29:17,390
receptive where they weren't receptive before that takes a miracle.
363
00:29:17,390 --> 00:29:22,130
Brian I want to thank you for what you're doing for those people who are still walking down
364
00:29:22,130 --> 00:29:26,930
the path that you did all those years ago and the way that you continue to
365
00:29:26,930 --> 00:29:31,230
persevere I want to thank you for the book you've written rap sheet to resume
366
00:29:31,230 --> 00:29:35,670
that's going to help so many more people I will put links in the show notes at
367
00:29:35,670 --> 00:29:40,390
bleeding daylight net so that people can find you easily and connect with you
368
00:29:40,390 --> 00:29:45,190
but I want to thank you especially for spending time with me today on Bleeding Daylight.
369
00:29:45,190 --> 00:29:50,930
It's been a pleasure thank you so much for having me.
370
00:29:50,930 --> 00:29:55,070
Thank you for listening to bleeding daylight please help us to shine more light into the
371
00:29:55,070 --> 00:29:59,250
darkness by sharing this episode with others for further details and more
372
00:29:59,250 --> 00:30:02,190
episodes please visit bleedingdaylight.net
00:00:08,060 --> 00:00:13,200
Wherever there are shadows, there are people ready to kick at the darkness until it bleeds daylight.
2
00:00:14,140 --> 00:00:17,860
This is Bleeding Daylight with your host, Rodney Olsen.
3
00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:22,180
Welcome to Bleeding Daylight.
4
00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:23,560
I'm so glad you're listening.
5
00:00:24,420 --> 00:00:30,320
There are hundreds more inspirational episodes waiting for you at bleedingdaylight.net.
6
00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:37,200
Please find and follow Bleeding Daylight on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok and YouTube.
7
00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:39,120
I'd love to connect with you there.
8
00:00:41,060 --> 00:00:47,280
Many of the things we believe about ourselves and the world are formed when we're very young.
9
00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:53,800
So how does trauma alter our perceptions about who we are and what's possible in our lives?
10
00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:58,380
Is there a way to heal the scars and move towards a better future?
11
00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:01,520
Today's guest has lived that story.
12
00:01:09,590 --> 00:01:13,250
Today's guest is one I've been genuinely looking forward to meeting.
13
00:01:13,490 --> 00:01:17,890
Brian Gray has spent 20 years helping the very people he used to be.
14
00:01:18,370 --> 00:01:23,130
Addicts, inmates, troubled kids, because he lived every bit of that himself.
15
00:01:23,470 --> 00:01:27,910
He's the author of a rap sheet to resume, finding blessing in brokenness.
16
00:01:28,110 --> 00:01:31,450
A raw and honest account of his story so far.
17
00:01:32,130 --> 00:01:42,690
This isn't a tidy redemption story, it's childhood trauma, addiction by 15, a marriage that fell apart, jail and then a moment on a beach in Hawaii that changed everything.
18
00:01:43,350 --> 00:01:51,070
Today he runs residential care for at-risk youth and together with his wife a transitional home for women in recovery and their kids.
19
00:01:51,770 --> 00:01:54,070
His message is simple but it hits hard.
20
00:01:54,490 --> 00:01:58,350
Your past may explain you but it doesn't have to imprison you.
21
00:01:58,970 --> 00:02:00,950
Brian welcome to Bleeding Daylight.
22
00:02:01,190 --> 00:02:02,010
Pleasure to be here.
23
00:02:02,390 --> 00:02:14,110
One of the things I've observed from many of the people that I've spoken with is that helping others to overcome the very things that have tripped them up in the past is part of their own healing.
24
00:02:14,310 --> 00:02:16,110
Have you found that to be the case for you?
25
00:02:16,450 --> 00:02:18,030
Oh absolutely 100%.
26
00:02:18,030 --> 00:02:19,850
Ultimately the healer is Jesus.
27
00:02:20,490 --> 00:02:29,370
The thing is though is that a lot of us that come from traumatized broken pasts, we have a real hard time comprehending the love of God and for me in particular the Father's heart.
28
00:02:29,830 --> 00:02:39,930
And so my journey has really taken me to the place where it's like I have an understanding, at least much better than I ever did before, ever thought I could of the Father's heart and his love for me.
29
00:02:40,490 --> 00:02:46,070
Sometimes a moment in life can be so powerful that it plays a huge part in shaping our lives.
30
00:02:46,110 --> 00:02:48,870
So I'm wondering if we can jump back for a moment.
31
00:02:48,970 --> 00:02:51,950
Tell me about that pivotal moment for you as a four-year-old.
32
00:02:52,510 --> 00:03:02,870
Yeah so I think that one of the things that gets missed in people that enter into recovery is the lies that form the foundation of their lives and their belief system.
33
00:03:03,310 --> 00:03:04,730
And mine began when I was four.
34
00:03:05,130 --> 00:03:10,910
It was a time back in about 1969 I was playing with my best friend Jeffrey Carpenter at his house.
35
00:03:11,290 --> 00:03:12,270
I'd been out for the day.
36
00:03:12,330 --> 00:03:17,050
My mother's rule at the time was like you're out, you're not going to track mud in and out of the house all day.
37
00:03:17,190 --> 00:03:19,410
And so I was down playing Cowboys and Indians with him.
38
00:03:19,690 --> 00:03:27,450
We were just playing with cap guns and everything and all of a sudden his brother came onto the porch and said, with a big huge gun, he said, this gun is real and I'm gonna kill you.
39
00:03:27,930 --> 00:03:30,410
And I was four and I believed him 100%.
40
00:03:30,410 --> 00:03:31,230
He scared me.
41
00:03:31,410 --> 00:03:34,890
And so I ran as fast as I could and he and his friends were chasing me.
42
00:03:35,350 --> 00:03:39,530
And in retrospect I can remember looking back and seeing the spring where the ping-pong ball went.
43
00:03:39,930 --> 00:03:44,370
And so I wasn't really going to be shot but I believed I was going to be shot and I was going to die.
44
00:03:44,570 --> 00:03:49,110
I got to my house, banged on the screen door, which was locked, and screamed, mommy, mommy, let me in.
45
00:03:49,210 --> 00:03:50,590
They're gonna kill me, they're gonna kill me.
46
00:03:50,790 --> 00:03:53,990
And she came to the door and said, go, go fight your own battles.
47
00:03:54,290 --> 00:03:56,790
And I turned around and the boys were gone, obviously.
48
00:03:57,090 --> 00:04:04,710
But in that moment, that thought, you're on your own, you're by yourself, you fight your own battles, that stuck really, really deep.
49
00:04:04,870 --> 00:04:11,430
And I spent the next several decades either fighting my own battles or creating my own battles to prove to myself that I could fight them.
50
00:04:11,730 --> 00:04:21,590
My family fell apart over the course of the next decade or so and I ended up living on my own at 14, living in a house actually with three completed walls that my father was building.
51
00:04:21,990 --> 00:04:23,030
My parents got divorced.
52
00:04:23,170 --> 00:04:24,970
My father went kind of crazy and left.
53
00:04:25,110 --> 00:04:27,050
My mother left and I was by myself.
54
00:04:27,330 --> 00:04:29,230
And so by the time I was 15, I was an addict.
55
00:04:29,490 --> 00:04:31,010
Life just spiraled from there.
56
00:04:31,130 --> 00:04:37,470
It wasn't until after just broken relationships, a broken marriage, I found myself in prison for five years.
57
00:04:37,890 --> 00:04:42,010
I found myself on a beach in Hawaii at the end of my rope.
58
00:04:42,510 --> 00:04:45,490
There was a guy on the berm just above the beach.
59
00:04:45,930 --> 00:04:52,050
I'd been making a lot of noise after doing a bunch of things and he had a shotgun in his hand and I would just decided, you know what, I'm done.
60
00:04:52,450 --> 00:04:53,790
I'm absolutely done.
61
00:04:54,010 --> 00:04:57,570
And I charged him screaming, shoot me, trying to get him to kill me.
62
00:04:57,710 --> 00:04:58,930
Now he fired the gun.
63
00:04:59,230 --> 00:05:00,710
Now I don't know why I didn't get hit.
64
00:05:00,770 --> 00:05:01,810
I thought I got hit at first.
65
00:05:01,850 --> 00:05:02,770
I fell down on the ground.
66
00:05:02,830 --> 00:05:03,690
I thought I was dead.
67
00:05:03,850 --> 00:05:10,850
And I heard not really an audible voice but as close to an audible voice as you could get without there actually being one.
68
00:05:10,850 --> 00:05:12,470
This is the last time.
69
00:05:12,730 --> 00:05:14,470
I knew that it was God.
70
00:05:14,710 --> 00:05:16,370
There was no question in my mind.
71
00:05:16,470 --> 00:05:19,570
And I thought at that time, like, I'm done.
72
00:05:19,790 --> 00:05:20,990
I'm sick and tired of you.
73
00:05:21,090 --> 00:05:22,390
I've saved you enough times.
74
00:05:22,450 --> 00:05:25,850
And my lord, he saved me so many times looking back.
75
00:05:26,010 --> 00:05:28,510
But I'm done and this is the last time.
76
00:05:28,610 --> 00:05:29,750
Next time I'm taking you out.
77
00:05:29,950 --> 00:05:31,110
Which may have been true.
78
00:05:31,430 --> 00:05:47,030
But it was when they took me back to jail and I'm sitting in there in a holding cell that I realized that it took me back and I had that memory of the time at Jeffrey Carpenter's house and he showed me that go fight your own battles meant this is the last time you fight your own battles.
79
00:05:47,390 --> 00:05:52,250
As miraculous as it was, I charged a guy with a shotgun and didn't get hit.
80
00:05:52,490 --> 00:05:55,430
That's a miracle in itself and I can't say how that happened.
81
00:05:55,670 --> 00:06:04,430
But what I do know is after 20 years of trying to stop drinking, I tried to stop drinking not long after I realized I was a full-blown alcoholic.
82
00:06:04,810 --> 00:06:06,610
Which like I said was about 15.
83
00:06:07,050 --> 00:06:11,710
But after 20 years I tried everything to get clean and sober and nothing worked.
84
00:06:11,810 --> 00:06:12,850
I just couldn't do it.
85
00:06:12,890 --> 00:06:13,830
I was in bondage.
86
00:06:13,970 --> 00:06:20,650
But I was delivered on that moment on that beach and I never ever have had a desire for a drink or a drug ever since then.
87
00:06:21,030 --> 00:06:23,010
And that was my Romans 12 1 and 2 moment.
88
00:06:23,110 --> 00:06:32,250
I offered my body as a living sacrifice for that was my reasonable worship and I entered into not being conformed to the ways of the world and in the transformation of my mind.
89
00:06:32,430 --> 00:06:36,070
I never looked back and my life was transformed from that moment.
90
00:06:36,250 --> 00:06:39,090
I've continued to walk out that transformation ever since.
91
00:06:39,450 --> 00:06:43,290
And a large part of that like you said has been in helping other people.
92
00:06:43,550 --> 00:06:47,270
I've learned my love for them and I've learned my father's love for me.
93
00:06:47,650 --> 00:06:56,090
It must have been quite amazing and almost hard to believe when finally you didn't just have someone in your corner.
94
00:06:56,270 --> 00:07:00,030
You had the creator of the universe saying to you, I'm in your corner.
95
00:07:00,490 --> 00:07:02,290
You don't have to fight your own battles anymore.
96
00:07:02,730 --> 00:07:04,110
I'm here for you.
97
00:07:04,650 --> 00:07:12,750
Tell me a little bit more about that and what it was like for you having to think through someone is finally fighting for me.
98
00:07:12,810 --> 00:07:14,210
That's a really good question.
99
00:07:14,370 --> 00:07:19,810
It also takes me back to like somewhere around the time before the incident with Jeffrey Carpenter.
100
00:07:20,030 --> 00:07:34,330
I was out in my yard at night looking up at the stars and the sky was perfectly clear looking up at the Milky Way and just having this sense that wow just absolute complete total awe.
101
00:07:34,470 --> 00:07:41,090
Although I couldn't have articulated it then but just a revelation that somebody created all this.
102
00:07:41,730 --> 00:07:43,990
It's just this is just too big.
103
00:07:44,190 --> 00:07:49,630
You know if you'd asked me what I was thinking or feeling at the time at four I couldn't have told you but I remember that moment.
104
00:07:50,170 --> 00:08:00,410
It was at that moment when I realized that God was like the one in my corner that I also remembered that moment and it was just like this is the creator of the universe.
105
00:08:00,410 --> 00:08:01,310
This is God.
106
00:08:01,310 --> 00:08:04,850
Of course I'd heard about Jesus and things like that.
107
00:08:04,970 --> 00:08:13,370
I'd been to church a few times and raised in a Catholic Church initially and I was an altar boy and I got kicked out of catechism for asking too many questions.
108
00:08:13,870 --> 00:08:32,309
I've been fighting against the God that I've been hearing about and they were like you know I talk about different people in my life that represented Christ you know not with words but with deeds and they just exhibited the fruit of the Spirit and I just realized that oh my gosh you've been trying to talk to me all this time and I just haven't been listening.
109
00:08:32,850 --> 00:08:33,809
It was a relief.
110
00:08:34,030 --> 00:08:43,490
It was just overwhelming peace even though I'm laying on the floor in a holding cell it was just a revelation that it's like I think it's gonna be okay now.
111
00:08:44,570 --> 00:08:54,710
You're saying there that it's kind of hard to believe that God has been speaking to you all this time has been trying to get through to you and you haven't been listening.
112
00:08:54,850 --> 00:09:09,650
I'm sure that a lot of the young people that you've been working alongside they're not hearing that either and it's hard to convince them that not only are you in their corner but the God that created the universe is in their corner.
113
00:09:09,970 --> 00:09:16,330
So how do you start to communicate that to someone who has never known anyone in their corner in the past?
114
00:09:16,850 --> 00:09:19,350
Well I work with children between the ages of 11 and
115
00:09:19,350 --> 00:09:26,130
18 and they are a complete spectrum of intellectual capacity and so there are
116
00:09:26,130 --> 00:09:29,450
some kids that I can sit down and have a meaningful conversation with and I'll
117
00:09:29,450 --> 00:09:32,750
give them like an apologetic argument and I love to tell them that it took
118
00:09:32,750 --> 00:09:37,750
something to the tune of 1,500 software engineers to write three billion lines
119
00:09:37,750 --> 00:09:43,150
of binary code ones and zeros to run Google and it takes something to the
120
00:09:43,150 --> 00:09:49,170
tune of three of two billion lines of quaternary code for amino acids to run a
121
00:09:49,170 --> 00:09:51,310
cell weighing like a ten thousandth of a gram.
122
00:09:51,510 --> 00:10:06,950
You would never say that Google was just created and came into a being out of nowhere so then how could you possibly think that something more complicated would be and so the ones that are kind of a little bit more intellectual go like huh yeah seed planted.
123
00:10:07,610 --> 00:10:17,350
Other kids I just have to be that person in their life that won't give up on them no matter what they do and they do some pretty crazy things.
124
00:10:19,150 --> 00:10:27,770
And so it's a question of like enduring love and solid apologetic arguments when they come up against it and they say there's no such thing as God I don't believe in God.
125
00:10:28,130 --> 00:10:40,670
You took us back to that time when you were a four-year-old and your mother said go and fight your own battles and of course it wasn't just the only thing there was a demonstration of that in the way that she was leaving you to be on your own.
126
00:10:41,110 --> 00:10:45,110
But I imagine that there's a number of triggers for the kids that you're working with.
127
00:10:45,610 --> 00:11:01,950
What are some of the things that have sent them down the path that has taken them to where they are now because no one decides that they're going to act in a way that is going to bring them undone and yet we see destructive behavior again and again.
128
00:11:02,050 --> 00:11:06,470
What are some of the things that you have encountered with some of the kids that you've been working with?
129
00:11:07,030 --> 00:11:19,450
We call it dependent neglect meaning that some way somehow but usually in multiple ways a child has not had what a child needs to come into the world and develop into a just a functioning human being.
130
00:11:19,970 --> 00:11:25,890
A lot of these kids have been completely abandoned many of them their parents are addicted to drugs and alcohol.
131
00:11:26,310 --> 00:11:34,030
We have a fentanyl crisis in the world right now where people are OD'ing and dying in droves you know so we have kids like that.
132
00:11:34,370 --> 00:11:41,010
We have kids that are beaten and they've been abused but they've never been disciplined which is a huge one.
133
00:11:41,310 --> 00:11:51,030
It's heartbreaking to hear their stories but then what a lot of people don't realize is that a dependent neglected child quite often doesn't look like a cuddly bunny that needs love.
134
00:11:51,330 --> 00:11:56,310
They do need love but that cuddly bunny it looks more like a snapping turtle a lot of times.
135
00:11:56,510 --> 00:12:03,450
A lot of the kids because of where they've been from because of neglect they become very hostile very aggressive and violent sometimes.
136
00:12:03,870 --> 00:12:07,410
We have to love them through that so the specific issues are
137
00:12:07,410 --> 00:12:11,390
some of them have not gotten food some of them have not gone to school a lot of
138
00:12:11,390 --> 00:12:16,070
them have been beaten and then they have had really really really bad examples of
139
00:12:16,070 --> 00:12:19,410
what it means to be a man or a woman in the world and so they've got a
140
00:12:19,410 --> 00:12:24,750
completely twisted worldview of what they were created to be as a human being
141
00:12:24,750 --> 00:12:28,470
on earth and what is the proper relationship between themselves and other
142
00:12:28,470 --> 00:12:30,030
people never mind God.
143
00:12:30,810 --> 00:12:46,310
Is there a sense for some of these young people that they haven't been taught how to behave in a way that we feel is acceptable and so therefore society is expecting something from them that they can't possibly deliver because they've never been taught that way.
144
00:12:46,770 --> 00:12:48,850
That's 100% correct and
145
00:12:48,850 --> 00:12:52,490
the key is it takes a lot a lot of patience because the thing about a
146
00:12:52,490 --> 00:12:57,490
teenager is as anybody that's been a teenager knows a lot of us that was the
147
00:12:57,490 --> 00:13:01,730
smartest point in our life when we knew the most about everything right and so
148
00:13:01,730 --> 00:13:06,150
they think they've got it figured out they have absolutely no clue whatsoever
149
00:13:06,150 --> 00:13:10,850
and so to come against a person that is like knows much better than I do because
150
00:13:10,850 --> 00:13:14,450
I'm old they're just like oh you're old you don't know anything don't even talk
151
00:13:14,450 --> 00:13:18,830
to me there's an absolute deficit in some of the most basic things that a
152
00:13:18,830 --> 00:13:23,810
two-year-old learns like just respect for other people don't hit don't take
153
00:13:23,810 --> 00:13:27,730
other things just because you don't have it and they do doesn't mean that it's
154
00:13:27,730 --> 00:13:31,390
like the fact that you can steal it doesn't mean it's your right to do you
155
00:13:31,390 --> 00:13:36,070
know I think a lot of people naturally because we were just taught the basics
156
00:13:36,070 --> 00:13:40,030
at a young age like no that's right that's wrong do it because it's right
157
00:13:40,030 --> 00:13:44,250
not because you can is a really big one people that have not gotten the basic
158
00:13:44,250 --> 00:13:47,710
needs that they need like food and shelter and health care and and just
159
00:13:47,710 --> 00:13:53,050
basic human needs they grow up with a mindset of I have to just take it I am
160
00:13:53,050 --> 00:13:57,430
on my own I am fighting my own battle so if you're gonna leave your wallet
161
00:13:57,430 --> 00:14:01,570
sitting there and I can take it I'm going to because I can and you were too
162
00:14:01,570 --> 00:14:05,310
dumb to protect it kids grow up with a mindset like that and then they end up in jails.
163
00:14:05,310 --> 00:14:09,670
I know that a lot of people within churches would want to be
164
00:14:09,670 --> 00:14:15,170
helping young people like this but oftentimes I imagine they don't have the
165
00:14:15,170 --> 00:14:20,810
tools to do so they don't have the understanding how can we start to help
166
00:14:20,810 --> 00:14:25,850
churches understand that there is a way to help young people who are in this
167
00:14:25,850 --> 00:14:31,010
sort of crisis the first thing is to understand that there's often a fine
168
00:14:31,010 --> 00:14:37,250
line between magical thinking and faith what I mean by that is magical thinking
169
00:14:37,250 --> 00:14:41,250
is just like automatic I'm just gonna pray for somebody and then they're just
170
00:14:41,250 --> 00:14:45,710
gonna be fixed sometimes that happens clearly in my case I think I had a
171
00:14:45,710 --> 00:14:49,670
grandmother who had been praying for me for years that I believe actually led me
172
00:14:49,670 --> 00:14:54,550
to that point on that beach there was a miraculous instant deliverance and those
173
00:14:54,550 --> 00:14:59,690
things are real God does miracles but in Matthew chapter 24 speaking about the
174
00:14:59,690 --> 00:15:04,490
end of the age right it talks about the love of many will grow cold but he that
175
00:15:04,490 --> 00:15:09,490
endures to the end will be saved and I think a lot of people separate those
176
00:15:09,490 --> 00:15:13,130
verses into like well I don't I want to be loving but then I have to endure and
177
00:15:13,130 --> 00:15:16,850
dig a bunker and survive or whatever is going to come and what it really comes
178
00:15:16,850 --> 00:15:21,710
down to is enduring love for one we need people that are going to have the
179
00:15:21,710 --> 00:15:27,250
capacity to endure with these children because they will stretch every single
180
00:15:27,250 --> 00:15:31,550
bit of everything that's in anyone that tries to reach out to them and work with
181
00:15:31,550 --> 00:15:36,790
them and that's where Romans 3 5 through 8 comes in there's tribulation which is
182
00:15:36,790 --> 00:15:42,130
the ellipsis in Greek which means pressure and perseverance perseverance
183
00:15:42,130 --> 00:15:47,130
produces character and character hope and that hope doesn't disappoint and I
184
00:15:47,130 --> 00:15:51,650
think that we have to understand that there is a need but it's like that need
185
00:15:51,650 --> 00:15:57,570
isn't just because God wants to help these children God is going to use these
186
00:15:57,570 --> 00:16:02,390
children to transform us people that are willing to go into working with these
187
00:16:02,390 --> 00:16:05,650
kids with that mindset at the beginning have a much better chance of succeeding
188
00:16:05,650 --> 00:16:11,190
but these children will push every single button because the belief the deep
189
00:16:11,190 --> 00:16:15,970
belief is at their core because this is what they've been taught is I'm going to
190
00:16:15,970 --> 00:16:21,730
be rejected I'm going to be unlovable therefore the anticipation the tension
191
00:16:21,730 --> 00:16:25,710
of living in this place where it's like subconsciously I know I'm going to be
192
00:16:25,710 --> 00:16:29,710
rejected it's better to just do something and get rejected right off the
193
00:16:29,710 --> 00:16:33,810
bat and get it over with and move on and go back to what I know.
194
00:16:33,810 --> 00:16:38,470
We know that it can be difficult for young people to understand that someone is in their
195
00:16:38,470 --> 00:16:43,530
corner and it can be difficult for those people who are trying to work with them
196
00:16:43,530 --> 00:16:48,510
and yet we look to the scripture and we see that while it was that we were still
197
00:16:48,510 --> 00:16:55,690
sinners Christ died for us and was prepared to go to the cross for us if we
198
00:16:55,690 --> 00:17:00,290
want to be more like Jesus I suppose we've got to expect that those that
199
00:17:00,290 --> 00:17:06,210
we're trying to love may not necessarily reciprocate that love or in a way that we can understand it.
200
00:17:06,210 --> 00:17:11,310
Absolutely and that's where in first Corinthians 3 Paul
201
00:17:11,310 --> 00:17:15,190
talks about I planted a polis watered one plants one waters the one that
202
00:17:15,190 --> 00:17:19,550
plants and waters are the same and the one part that I think a lot of people
203
00:17:19,550 --> 00:17:24,670
miss and don't like is they are nothing but only God who gives the increase a
204
00:17:24,670 --> 00:17:29,150
lot of times people will enter into ministry with the most broken and
205
00:17:29,150 --> 00:17:34,250
confuse faithfulness with success they're not synonyms we're called to be
206
00:17:34,250 --> 00:17:39,910
faithful servants meaning we plant and we water in faith and trust that God
207
00:17:39,910 --> 00:17:44,010
will give the increase and I can say that having worked with kids for 20
208
00:17:44,010 --> 00:17:47,930
years more often than not it's probably going to be about five years at least
209
00:17:47,930 --> 00:17:52,150
before God gives an increase but when I look at the seeds that were planted in my
210
00:17:52,150 --> 00:17:56,970
life at my worst points in my life when I was a youth looking back and realizing
211
00:17:56,970 --> 00:18:02,110
that it's like those are the people that really really truly impacted my life
212
00:18:02,110 --> 00:18:06,350
those are the people that faithfully planted in water even though I did not
213
00:18:06,350 --> 00:18:11,350
give them any reason whatsoever why it should have any hope that I would be transformed.
214
00:18:11,350 --> 00:18:15,690
You get to work with a number of kids and now together with
215
00:18:15,690 --> 00:18:20,490
your wife you're helping women who are in recovery and their kids but there's
216
00:18:20,490 --> 00:18:25,330
only a certain number of people that you can reach personally is that part of
217
00:18:25,330 --> 00:18:29,950
your reasoning for writing rap sheet to resume so that you can actually put
218
00:18:29,950 --> 00:18:35,250
practical steps in the hands of even more people.
219
00:18:35,250 --> 00:18:40,950
Yes I mean that is the reason why I wrote rap sheet to resume I want people that maybe walk the path similar
220
00:18:40,950 --> 00:18:45,230
to mine they think that they're too broken to be able to be of any use to
221
00:18:45,230 --> 00:18:50,270
anybody you know and are just settling for less spiritually and in terms of the
222
00:18:50,270 --> 00:18:54,810
purpose that God created them for I wrote it for people that are working
223
00:18:54,810 --> 00:18:59,370
with dependent neglected children it's just broken populations inmates addicts
224
00:18:59,370 --> 00:19:03,470
maybe somebody wants to and they don't know how so there's some practical tools
225
00:19:03,470 --> 00:19:06,490
in there and then it's also for people that are actively engaged and
226
00:19:06,490 --> 00:19:10,150
struggling and thinking like oh my gosh I mean why am I even doing this there's
227
00:19:10,150 --> 00:19:14,010
no fruit here I've got to get out those would be like people that are actively
228
00:19:14,010 --> 00:19:18,070
fostering or maybe working in dependent neglected care and I've gotten some
229
00:19:18,070 --> 00:19:22,770
feedback from people in all those areas the book is in a jail in Hawaii the one
230
00:19:22,770 --> 00:19:26,490
that I was in a lot of the inmates in there saying like thank you this is so
231
00:19:26,490 --> 00:19:30,610
good it makes perfect sense I'm actually starting to understand God people that
232
00:19:30,610 --> 00:19:34,790
have worked in foster care saying that while I wish I had this when I was a
233
00:19:34,790 --> 00:19:38,970
foster parent and then people that are actually working in the field with
234
00:19:38,970 --> 00:19:43,210
residential care just saying this is the best book I've read this is so helpful I
235
00:19:43,210 --> 00:19:46,950
really feel like I was led by the Lord to do it and I was directed by the Lord
236
00:19:46,950 --> 00:19:51,230
because it just happened so easily so my hope is it just helps people I don't
237
00:19:51,230 --> 00:19:56,190
think I'm never gonna make any money on it 3% of authors make a living by
238
00:19:56,190 --> 00:20:00,090
writing books you don't write a book to make money you write a book because you
239
00:20:00,090 --> 00:20:04,070
want to change lives and that's why I wrote rap sheet to resume.
240
00:20:04,070 --> 00:20:09,470
It doesn't come from theory but rather lived experience how important is that the
241
00:20:09,470 --> 00:20:14,910
reality of that for those who are reading those words knowing that these are things that you've lived through.
242
00:20:14,910 --> 00:20:18,910
It's important it's valuable but I
243
00:20:18,910 --> 00:20:22,690
don't want to make it sound like you have to have the same types of
244
00:20:22,690 --> 00:20:27,030
experiences to reach out to people because let's face it I knew how to mess
245
00:20:27,030 --> 00:20:30,650
things up I knew how to mess my life up and what I didn't know is how to live
246
00:20:30,650 --> 00:20:35,250
successfully for some reason people want to have a radical testimony and people
247
00:20:35,250 --> 00:20:39,770
say oh I wish I had a testimony like yours and I'm like no you don't I wish I
248
00:20:39,770 --> 00:20:42,990
had a testimony like yours you know speaking to a person that's like comes
249
00:20:42,990 --> 00:20:46,850
from a Christian family that is rooted and grounded in Christ and in the word
250
00:20:46,850 --> 00:20:50,970
and raising their kids the way they should it just amazes me and I'm
251
00:20:50,970 --> 00:20:55,450
fascinated by those people so we need both we need people that have been there
252
00:20:55,450 --> 00:20:59,350
and done that so to speak and have come out of it but we also need people who
253
00:20:59,350 --> 00:21:04,030
just know how to live a life the way God created us to live it without having to make all the mistakes and have all the sin.
254
00:21:04,030 --> 00:21:10,750
It must be incredibly joyful for you
255
00:21:10,750 --> 00:21:18,250
to take someone who has had a difficult start to life maybe has dabbled in abuse
256
00:21:18,250 --> 00:21:25,190
of various substances and yet you bring them to a better place but even more
257
00:21:25,190 --> 00:21:30,650
than that to introduce them to the Creator to introduce them to God what's
258
00:21:30,650 --> 00:21:35,530
that like when the lights suddenly switch on for some of those young people and
259
00:21:35,530 --> 00:21:40,350
they start to say I want to explore more of this God you're talking about.
260
00:21:40,350 --> 00:21:43,070
Well. I guess I could give you an example of one of the kids that I worked about and
261
00:21:43,070 --> 00:21:47,810
that I wrote about I call him a yelk the yelk is a part of an egg that nourishes
262
00:21:47,810 --> 00:21:53,630
the ovum as it's in development he came to us when he was 14 years old he had
263
00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:58,890
been abused he had been in a foster home his mother had OD'd and died on drugs his
264
00:21:58,890 --> 00:22:03,270
father had been missing since his birth nobody knew where he was his foster
265
00:22:03,270 --> 00:22:07,470
brother had poured lighter fluid on his arm and lit it on fire he's completely
266
00:22:07,470 --> 00:22:12,710
traumatized on top of that he was on the spectrum for autism brilliant brilliant
267
00:22:12,710 --> 00:22:17,410
brilliant kid but at the same time emotionally and socially just very
268
00:22:17,410 --> 00:22:22,090
regressed when he came in he looked like a friendly Barney that's the best
269
00:22:22,090 --> 00:22:26,630
character that I could compare him to just happy smiling sweet one of those
270
00:22:26,630 --> 00:22:30,730
kids you just want to hug as soon as you meet him it didn't take us long to find
271
00:22:30,730 --> 00:22:35,890
out that Barney had a dark side so he would hear the word no get told
272
00:22:35,890 --> 00:22:41,490
something he couldn't do and he would scream and he had this almost glass
273
00:22:41,490 --> 00:22:46,630
shattering scream that would just go on for hours and hours and hours and we
274
00:22:46,630 --> 00:22:50,830
have ten boys in each cottage at the home that I work in there are times when
275
00:22:50,830 --> 00:22:53,990
we had to clear the boys out and take them outside because they were so
276
00:22:53,990 --> 00:22:57,950
triggered they all wanted to kill him but he would just scream and scream for
277
00:22:57,950 --> 00:23:01,830
hours and he would just get angry and he would break things and he would just
278
00:23:01,830 --> 00:23:06,630
throw things at me and he was an atheist when he came in and we were given Bibles
279
00:23:06,630 --> 00:23:10,250
and he would throw Bibles at me I've been personally hit just me not my
280
00:23:10,250 --> 00:23:14,950
co-workers but with three Bibles three fans if I like caught on to him I would
281
00:23:14,950 --> 00:23:18,590
open his door when he'd be screaming and I would like open it and then shut it and
282
00:23:18,590 --> 00:23:22,010
then let whatever he was going to throw hit the door then go ahead and try to
283
00:23:22,010 --> 00:23:27,250
talk to him this just went on for years we have a 12-week program that a kid
284
00:23:27,250 --> 00:23:31,810
can conceivably get put in and complete the program in 12 weeks so we have 11
285
00:23:31,810 --> 00:23:34,930
year olds that do it and they move on to foster care they go home
286
00:23:34,930 --> 00:23:39,550
Yelp took three years the last Bible that he threw at me he ripped up and it
287
00:23:39,550 --> 00:23:42,930
was around Christmas time and we have a Christmas tree contest with all the
288
00:23:42,930 --> 00:23:47,070
different cottages so I went and I cut out the scriptures of Luke the Christmas
289
00:23:47,070 --> 00:23:51,090
story out of Luke and I pasted them on cards and it set the theme for our
290
00:23:51,090 --> 00:23:57,230
Christmas tree and his cottage won that year so it's kind of like God causes all
291
00:23:57,230 --> 00:24:02,110
things to work together for good right he would do the craziest things one time
292
00:24:02,110 --> 00:24:05,790
he took all his clothes off and stripped down and we have security cameras
293
00:24:05,790 --> 00:24:09,610
everywhere except in the bedrooms in the bathrooms right for the common areas so
294
00:24:09,610 --> 00:24:14,970
he stripped down and I look on cameras in my office and here he is dancing in the
295
00:24:14,970 --> 00:24:19,390
middle of the day room buck naked and it was just like what are you doing and he
296
00:24:19,390 --> 00:24:23,510
was trying to make us think he was crazy one of his last incidents was he got a
297
00:24:23,510 --> 00:24:27,790
hold of his medication side effect sheets and they're treating it for ADHD
298
00:24:27,790 --> 00:24:31,590
all these kids are over medicated but he got a hold of his medication side
299
00:24:31,590 --> 00:24:36,690
effect sheet and he scripted an Emmy award-winning stroke we went into his
300
00:24:36,690 --> 00:24:41,030
room we looked at him and he was on the floor he wasn't moving his eyes were
301
00:24:41,030 --> 00:24:44,310
rolling in the back of his head and we thought he was having a seizure or
302
00:24:44,310 --> 00:24:49,150
something I called the ambulance the EMS crew came they're like oh okay we're
303
00:24:49,150 --> 00:24:51,950
gonna take him we have to take him to the Children's Hospital not the regular
304
00:24:51,950 --> 00:24:55,690
ER we don't know what's going on so they came and they took him the emergency
305
00:24:55,690 --> 00:24:59,750
department he faked them out they sent him to another hospital you know about
306
00:24:59,750 --> 00:25:03,490
two hours away for a complete neurological workup they got done with
307
00:25:03,490 --> 00:25:07,130
a neurological workup their neurologist said I'm not really sure what happened
308
00:25:07,130 --> 00:25:11,030
it might have been some type of seizure just keep your eye on more like okay I
309
00:25:11,710 --> 00:25:14,710
used to tell him when he would get violent and you would throw things at me
310
00:25:14,710 --> 00:25:18,170
I would say stop yell girl shoot that's what you're doing you're just putting a
311
00:25:18,170 --> 00:25:21,230
gun to your head and threatening to shoot yourself you're hurting yourself
312
00:25:21,230 --> 00:25:25,850
and he would just go ah whatever and then finally the very last incident
313
00:25:25,850 --> 00:25:30,050
after the stroke incident this is like three years into it he was in the day
314
00:25:30,050 --> 00:25:33,630
room he was angry he picked up a chair he was going to throw it at me and I
315
00:25:33,630 --> 00:25:38,530
just looked at him and he goes I know I know stop or I'll shoot I'm like good
316
00:25:39,910 --> 00:25:45,290
and then he put the chair down went in his room and he tried to do his glass
317
00:25:45,290 --> 00:25:51,210
breaking scream and his voice cracked and he opens the door and he's like this
318
00:25:51,210 --> 00:25:55,570
blankety blank blank blank stuff right here right now and I'm like oh no what's
319
00:25:55,570 --> 00:26:00,470
he gonna do now he went and he sat down at the table because one biggest
320
00:26:00,470 --> 00:26:04,750
consequence there is a 24-hour grounding where you have 24 hours you have to sit
321
00:26:04,750 --> 00:26:08,430
at a table and read write color or draw and you can't talk to anybody or play
322
00:26:08,430 --> 00:26:12,750
games or anything else right and so he sat down at the table and he served his
323
00:26:12,750 --> 00:26:17,910
grounding and then that was it he was done and then he went off to our
324
00:26:17,910 --> 00:26:22,710
independent living cottage and he went on a mission trip to Mississippi and
325
00:26:23,230 --> 00:26:28,110
then he started doing the slides in church and then he even started learning
326
00:26:28,110 --> 00:26:32,990
percussion and playing on the worship team in church he left as an adult he's
327
00:26:32,990 --> 00:26:37,830
going to college and learning how to code do computer programming and to be
328
00:26:37,830 --> 00:26:42,550
a software engineer at one point I was talking to a new staff and explaining
329
00:26:42,550 --> 00:26:48,070
why we don't give up on the kids and I was using Yelp as an example Yelp came
330
00:26:48,070 --> 00:26:51,890
over and he was talking to us and he said yeah yeah yeah he's like I did all
331
00:26:51,890 --> 00:26:56,130
those things and we're talking about the feign stroke and he said I think the
332
00:26:56,130 --> 00:27:01,650
best thing that really got him is when I peed my pants but my point be it is like
333
00:27:01,650 --> 00:27:06,310
this is a kid that was like a couple of days in working with them mostly would
334
00:27:06,310 --> 00:27:10,870
be like he doesn't belong here there is no hope for this child he's disrupting
335
00:27:10,870 --> 00:27:14,890
all the other children we've got to get him out of here and the reality is
336
00:27:14,890 --> 00:27:18,490
he's one of our most successful cases so far since I've been working at this
337
00:27:18,490 --> 00:27:22,970
particular place for the last five years.
338
00:27:22,970 --> 00:27:28,970
Obviously when you look back on your own history there's a very dark section there and I'm wondering have you had the
339
00:27:28,970 --> 00:27:32,750
opportunity to connect with some of those people that were in your past maybe
340
00:27:32,750 --> 00:27:38,450
those other inmates in the prison or other troubled kids or addicts around the
341
00:27:38,450 --> 00:27:43,930
time and what do they make of the change in you?
342
00:27:43,930 --> 00:27:50,950
A lot of the people that I was in jail with are off in prison doing long sentences or they're dead a
343
00:27:50,950 --> 00:27:55,790
lot of them are dead I'm over 60 and you can't live that kind of lifestyle using
344
00:27:55,790 --> 00:27:59,930
drugs and alcohol and being wild there's a joke that they have on Kauai where I
345
00:27:59,930 --> 00:28:04,090
was from that there are no old addicts are no old junkies you know because they
346
00:28:04,090 --> 00:28:08,730
die off and that's absolutely true there are people that like me have
347
00:28:08,730 --> 00:28:12,850
changed their life and moved on and done really well my wife and I ran a
348
00:28:12,850 --> 00:28:16,950
transition house for 12 years after that on Kauai where we took furloughed
349
00:28:16,950 --> 00:28:20,310
inmates meaning they're not completely out of the system they're still under the
350
00:28:20,310 --> 00:28:24,110
jurisdiction of the jail into our home and we lived with five to ten of them
351
00:28:24,110 --> 00:28:28,370
and sometimes their children for 12 years there are several of them that had
352
00:28:28,370 --> 00:28:33,310
really really have done well one is a teacher at a high school one at his own
353
00:28:33,310 --> 00:28:37,470
contracting business and was building homes he died of a heart attack a couple
354
00:28:37,470 --> 00:28:42,150
of years ago he's one of my best friends the last girl in our house she actually
355
00:28:42,150 --> 00:28:46,830
was running a program for the homeless for the county there are people that
356
00:28:46,830 --> 00:28:52,330
have succeeded I was just there on Kauai to perform my son's wedding about a
357
00:28:52,330 --> 00:28:56,130
month ago we always go into the jail and I saw some of the people that had been
358
00:28:56,130 --> 00:28:59,870
there when I was there and they had my book and they were saying I get it now I
359
00:28:59,870 --> 00:29:04,790
get it now and it's just like well I hope you do I really hope you do the
360
00:29:04,790 --> 00:29:08,770
percentages are still low for people that go down this path and it really
361
00:29:08,770 --> 00:29:12,990
comes down to there's something that's got to happen that causes a person to be
362
00:29:12,990 --> 00:29:17,390
receptive where they weren't receptive before that takes a miracle.
363
00:29:17,390 --> 00:29:22,130
Brian I want to thank you for what you're doing for those people who are still walking down
364
00:29:22,130 --> 00:29:26,930
the path that you did all those years ago and the way that you continue to
365
00:29:26,930 --> 00:29:31,230
persevere I want to thank you for the book you've written rap sheet to resume
366
00:29:31,230 --> 00:29:35,670
that's going to help so many more people I will put links in the show notes at
367
00:29:35,670 --> 00:29:40,390
bleeding daylight net so that people can find you easily and connect with you
368
00:29:40,390 --> 00:29:45,190
but I want to thank you especially for spending time with me today on Bleeding Daylight.
369
00:29:45,190 --> 00:29:50,930
It's been a pleasure thank you so much for having me.
370
00:29:50,930 --> 00:29:55,070
Thank you for listening to bleeding daylight please help us to shine more light into the
371
00:29:55,070 --> 00:29:59,250
darkness by sharing this episode with others for further details and more
372
00:29:59,250 --> 00:30:02,190
episodes please visit bleedingdaylight.net
