WEBVTT
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Jill, we're entrepreneurial.
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We disrupt shit.
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We're not gonna follow an agenda." And I said,"You do not want to disrupt yourselves.
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That is, you know, you're acting like a child." Like no.
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Yes, dis- yes, disrupt your competitor, disrupt the industry.
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Don't disrupt yourselves.
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That's ridiculous.
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Welcome to The Scalability Code, the podcast that helps you get out of the sh*t show and start growing your business.
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And now for your host, Matt Haney.
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Here we are, folks, another episode of"The Scalability Code." Today, I'm joined by Jill Young.
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Jill, I've followed you.
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I've seen you on the internet.
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Um, I know you have an incredible following, and I love that you're in the great state of Texas.
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So Jill, thanks for joining us, uh, today on"The Scalability Code."
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Well, thank you for having me, Matt.
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Maybe you've seen me blowing bubbles or dancing or something like that.
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That's usually when people...
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I have seen, your personality in action and, uh, your, your energy is, is infectious, so that's awesome.
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Well, we start the same way.
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Uh, every episode we start off the same way with kind of a two-part question.
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Uh, one is like, tell, tell us about your entrepreneurial journey, um, a- and kind of how you got to where you are today.
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And, and this is really a chance for you to go back and sort of relive and rethink some of the ways and things that you may not have talked about or think or...
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'Cause those, those tidbits are helpful.
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So that's the first part.
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And then the second part is, talk about someone that influenced you as an entrepreneur.
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Someone that, you know, that got you that bug going, got that fire going, and maybe that person leads you into your journey.
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This one is easy for me, Matt.
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It's at the, it's just right at the forefront of my brain.
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My entrepreneurial influencer was my dad.
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I grew up in an entrepreneurial family.
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Dad had several different businesses.
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Th-the term serial entrepreneur was not around back then, but he was, and, uh, it, it was all throughout our family.
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My, um, grandparents on both sides were builders, entrepreneurs, um, top salespeople, if you will, which is, you know, one of the greatest skills of an entrepreneur.
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And so I don't even know what it feels like to catch the bug because it is installed in me.
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Uh, m-my, uh, dad had...
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He was a master electrician, and he had, um, he had an electrical contracting company.
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And the day I was born, he was over on a job in Ogden, Utah, on the Dee Event Center.
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He was wiring the Dee Event Center and the hospitals across the street.
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So he's like,"I'm just gonna go check on a job real fast."
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Yeah.
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That's awesome.
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and then here I am
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was like,"What?"
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Yeah, exactly.
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"I'm gonna check on a job real fast." And he comes over and You know, here, those were the days where the father could not be in the room, and then it's like,"Ta-da, here's your baby girl." And we were-- I was attached to him from that very moment.
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I have many memories of going with him to um, his, his CPA and his attorney for all of, you know, the different businesses, and just so grateful to him because every time I would go with him or, um, be inside the business with him, I asked questions, questions, questions, questions, and he always paused to answer, or he would ask the professional to answer, uh, and, and talk to this little girl who was, um, who was growing.
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And where in those days, you know, little girls, little children, period, could just be ignored, and he didn't.
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He didn't.
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So that was my, that was my bug.
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That's awesome.
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Did you grow up in Utah?
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I did, yep.
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a huge Utah fan.
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I lived there for four years, met my wife there, got married there, anniversary all the time.
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So beautiful place, wonderful people.
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Absolutely gorgeous.
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Whenever I fly back,'cause I have a lot of family there, I will say,"There are my mountains.
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Hello, mountains.
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Did you miss me?
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I missed you."
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Salt Lake is, is-- Salt Lake Valley is a, is a special, special place.
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Just gorgeous.
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that's awesome.
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So you've been around entrepreneurship your whole life, which is amazing.
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You'd be surprised how many times I hear that, and I also hear the opposite, which is,"Oh, I didn't grow up with entrepreneurs.
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I didn't know I was going to become one.
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My parents did this, my parents did that, and then I met this person, and it transformed my career or their career." So I love, I love hearing all the, the different places of that.
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Um, and I love that your dad was your mentor and the person that you followed and that, uh, sounds like an incredible man and role model, um, to, to, to follow along.
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Well, tell me about your entrepreneurial journey.
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Obviously, your dad was impactful, uh, and those around you, but how did you sort of progress to where you are today in terms of entrepreneurship?
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this is a lovely story also because I was also...
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Can I swear on this podcast?
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and ten percent.
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Awesome.
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Because I was also just a little bit of a shit, you know?
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Just a little shit.
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So, uh, I, uh, I grew up in the family business.
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I, you know, here I am a teenager, and I'm looking around going,"You guys don't know what the heck you're doing
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Yeah.
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What was the business?
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The business that I was in mostly was childcare centers, and, uh, but we also had a wedding center, the electrical contracting company.
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Um, my dad was also an inventor.
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So whenever I get the chance, I like to say he's the patent holder on the electronic trailer hitch locator and ball cover.
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I mean, think of what a really cool name there is.
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nobody can say that.
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That's amazing.
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We still hold the patent, baby.
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He-- There's f- there's probably 30 patents on things that he's invented.
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And so childcare was the industry, and I was, I just...
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You know, like a lot of teenagers, you look at things in a simple way and go,"Well, why are we doing that?
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That's dumb.
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We should do that." Um, over the years, I convinced my parents to let me run the schools, and I did, and I still was irritated that we didn't know how to do it right.
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Uh, so I left the family business, and I went to work for big companies.
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Big companies where I thought,"Ah, this is where, this is where you- we will know what to do." I got into the big companies, and I had kind of the same attitude of like,"No, that is not right.
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Why are we doing that?
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That's ridiculous." Now, all of that has served me.
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I ho- hopefully I'm not a little shit anymore.
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But it served
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a big shit.
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You're just like a bigger version.
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Yeah.
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Thanks, Matt.
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That's funny.
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That's funny.
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I like it.
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Uh, sometimes my clients will say,"Gosh, Jill, you're being an ass today." And I'm like,"Well,
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welcome.
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think, yes, you did not hire a half-assed coach.
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You hired the whole ass." Like, I am gonna, I'm gonna help you with this.
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Now I, I have a style where I do it with lightheartedness and love and funny and...
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But it still gets the job done.
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So I left this entrepreneurial world to go out and find out how we really do it, how business really works.
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I got an MBA, I worked for some big companies, and then I'm like,"Oh, actually, we did know what we were doing back in, in the family business." As it turns out, we knew, uh, we knew what we were doing.
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We didn't have words for it.
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We clearly didn't have a system that we were running on.
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And the first time I read the book Traction, um, I cried.
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Uh, and, and it wasn't because it was so beautiful, and like all laid out so perfectly.
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Um, now I do have some nerdy friends who cried because it was written so beautifully.
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But I cried for,"Oh my gosh, if we would've had this in the family business." And Matt, this is the same stuff that you talk about, is the founder-led companies.
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And Dad was the founder, but he...
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My mom was an indentured servant, essentially.
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And it was like, uh, she's dabbling in this and dabbling in that, and then all the kids, right?
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All the kids are working there.
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And I- I'm, I don't mean any disrespect because we all had, we clearly had choices.
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But also when there was a big decision to be made, Dad wasn't working in the company, but Dad would say yes or no.
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But he didn't, you know, he, he
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buck stops somewhere.
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Yeah, genius in the middle.
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Um, the genius with 1,000 helpers.
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Um, that, that's, that's how
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mentioned something I wanna, I wanna tag onto, and I have been an entrepreneur pretty much my entire career, and one of my clients, my EOS clients that I worked with in, in 2024, um, and through last year was acquired by Accenture.
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So, um, I got, and am still running a, an integration of in- integrating that company into Accenture.
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It's been fascinating.
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Jill, they have 700,000 employees at Accenture.
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There are people on top of people on top of people.
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And you said something about your experience in big business that made you realize, turns out the entrepreneur, you know, the shit show they live in, they still get it done, right?
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I talk to my clients about being dysfunctionally functional.
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I'm like,"Let's not forget the fact that we are functional.
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Yes, there's a little bit of dysfunction, but we are, we are functioning, and there's a little bit of dysfunction in all of it." But I tell you that because I got to see behind the scenes now in a big...
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one of the biggest com- companies in the world, they're still figuring it out.
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They're literally, like, still figuring it out every day.
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The difference between our clients is entrepreneurs can turn the steering wheel and see a somewhat immediate reaction.
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In these bigger businesses, you, you make a turn, it may be six, 12, 18, 24, 36 months before you know if the strategy you implemented is actually being effective, and that's tough.
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That's tough.
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It-- for me, when I'm used to working with entrepreneurs, they're like,"We're gonna go left.
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We're going left," and, and then you go with it.
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But did you see that in these big businesses?
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Is that maybe what brought you back to entrepreneurship, was the bureaucracy or, or any of the, you know...
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I don't know.
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What, what made you say,"I don't wanna go work.
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I got an MBA.
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I'm in big business now, and I wanna go backwards," quote-unquote?
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There's, there's something that's coming to me.
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Uh, I, I love the phrase that until a question is asked, the answer doesn't exist.
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Hmm.
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So I don't know if anyone has ever asked me that before, and now here's the answer that I'm like,"Oh my gosh, I see it now." So thank you for asking'cause now I get to see my own story.
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Um, it really was the spirit of entrepreneurialism that was missing.
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Wow.
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So well said.
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the ownership, the, the, the pride, the excitement, the if we don't get this done, our customer will be so sad.
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Like ooh.
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And you just feel it.
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Uh, ironically, I work with some really big businesses right now, publicly traded businesses, um, and we're running on EOS
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Yeah.
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And if we don't-- Uh, it's not like, you know, it's not like we're shouting it from the rooftops, but because there is this entrepreneurial human in the center that wants all this stuff to happen, even inside big businesses, there's some really good shit happening, and it's flowing, and it's flowing fast, and we can see the change because there is that energy there.
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So I'm wondering right now, I'm like, I'm wondering if we have that entrepreneurial energy in those businesses, can we keep everything we love about entrepreneurial companies, that spirit, the, the culture, the connection, um, the innovation, and still have some discipline that comes with the bigger b- the bigger company?
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That's so well said.
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I love it, I love it, I love it.
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Well, um, couple things.
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Obviously, you are a very successful EOS implementer, which I love.
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Um, I have a question that I ask, um, all the EOS implementers I bring on, which is, um, can you, can you give me some tips, tricks or, or knowledge around how, uh, you get EOS to stick one or two levels down below the leadership team?
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I, as a fractional integrator, uh, deal with that a lot and some of, you know, getting it down to the bottom is very difficult.
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Um, so I'd love to hear if you have any, any experience or opinions on that.
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Hmm, for sure.
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Well, first of all, big shout out for my friends Beth and Marissa.
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Beth Fahey, Marissa Smith.
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They just released a book called"Roll Out." I know you're aware of that.
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So read the book because it's really, really great.
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Uh, uh, so here's a couple of things that come to me as I, I think I've done 1,300 sessions, 100 implementations.
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So just, you know, uh, it's still anecdotal evidence, but there you go.
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Uh, one of them is it is imperative that the leadership team is all fully committed to getting it rolled out throughout the company.
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And one of the, one of the phrases that I use to help with that is, it, it, it's kind of funny and people laugh, but every company runs on a system.
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Every department, every team, every work team, every shift, you run on a system.
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Everyone.
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It's just that do we want that to be an intentional system where everything is flowing, or do we want it to be chaotic and disjointed?
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'Cause like you said, are, are we functionally dysfunctional?
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What did you say?
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Dysfunctionally, but we're still functioning
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There's, there's...
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Oh, yeah.
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That-- So we, we want to be intentional with this system that we're running on.
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I was just on the phone this morning with an integrator, and he's saying,"Hey, what I'm finding is they have 12 locations and they're all running the same scorecard at each location." It's just so simple like that.
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He goes,"Some, some locations are starting to call these numbers different things." He goes,"I think that's really dangerous." And I'm like,"Yes, you're right.
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Nice work.
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You see it.
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It's dangerous." We've all got to speak the same language.
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But if he wasn't dedicated to that, if he's n-'cause he's the integrator, he's-- if he's not looking for that, he's gonna, he's gonna go,"Well, now I, I want him to have some autonomy over there," and,"Oh, that's not a, that's not a big deal.
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That's a little deal." But it's the little deals that are the big deals.
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So the leadership team has to be absolutely committed to this.
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Yes.
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Pull that one string on the sweater and all of a sudden everything starts to unravel.
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You let that one metric become, uh, vague or not descript, all of a sudden you
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about it.
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Mm-hmm.
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you give autonomy and, and creative liberty to things that aren't supposed to be autonomous or creative.
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They're supposed to be defined and known.
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right.
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I had a, a visionary the other day that, um, he got a, he got a, a, a Jill youn- a Coach Jill talking to, you know?
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He got a Coach Jill talking to,'cause he, he had three rocks, and he completed one out of three rocks, and he had said,"No, I wanna do this.
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I'm gonna do it.
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It's, it's great.
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I'm, uh..." And then he was laughing in the session, and we're light-hearted.
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He goes,"It's not a big, it's not a big deal.
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One of three rocks.
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It's not these two things, these two rocks.
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I'm gonna get it.
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They're gonna be done in a couple of days.
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They're gon-" You know, and he started to do this.
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And I'm like,"The reason it's a big deal is because you just set the bar for the rest of the company.
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You just said to the whole entire company, starting with your leadership team, that 33% completion on our highest priorities that we've agreed to is your bar.
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So that's where the problem is." And he wa- you know, he was like,"Oh."
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did you get to have that conversation in session or
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Oh, yeah.
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Oh, yeah.
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Right in front of everybody.
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Yeah.
00:16:28.779 --> 00:16:38.970
And it's a great-- I mean, I have it all the time and, and I always feel like as the integrator, um, the m- the expectations on me are higher than everyone else because they are...
00:16:39.350 --> 00:16:51.009
I mean, I feel like if I don't set my milestones accordingly, if I'm not very intentional about what smart looks like for myself, how can I even begin to do that for the people that I work or that, that work with us?
00:16:51.009 --> 00:17:00.220
Because they're looking at me not as an opportunity to judge, but certainly as the person who's supposed to have their shit together and know exactly how to do it.
00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:03.360
And if you're not leading by example, then guess what?
00:17:03.389 --> 00:17:07.849
We are not leading by example, and it's perfectly obvious to everyone else in the room when that doesn't happen.
00:17:08.359 --> 00:17:08.910
That's awesome.
00:17:09.019 --> 00:17:09.630
I love that.
00:17:10.019 --> 00:17:14.980
what do you think the hardest part about managing people and/or a team?
00:17:15.200 --> 00:17:19.490
Like, where do you see the hardest challenge around managing people?
00:17:20.016 --> 00:17:23.365
Well, the, the hardest challenge is inside the human.
00:17:24.226 --> 00:17:28.336
The, the tools, we've got, we've got tons of simple tools.
00:17:28.776 --> 00:17:38.935
The tools will just, like, they just say,"This is the thing, and that is the thing." I mean, they're so simple that the information, the data is right there in front of your face.
00:17:39.605 --> 00:17:48.516
We even have two checklists, a leadership checklist and a management checklist that says,"If you're doing these five things, you're good." Um, but the hardest part is inside.
00:17:49.246 --> 00:18:00.276
Um, our in- our own inner work as a human to, to say the truth to other human beings.
00:18:00.455 --> 00:18:01.195
Hmm.
00:18:01.605 --> 00:18:02.046
So
00:18:02.246 --> 00:18:08.125
share what we are seeing, to share what we are feeling to another human being.
00:18:08.675 --> 00:18:09.806
That's the hardest thing.
00:18:09.925 --> 00:18:12.935
being candid, being direct, being honest, is that what you're saying is hard?
00:18:13.336 --> 00:18:19.635
Or, um, sharing some praise or some encouragement or asking a question.
00:18:19.945 --> 00:18:34.016
"Was I clear when I made that request of you?" Um,"Matt, are you happy in this role?" I mean, uh, the-- it's, it's our, it's our fear, um, it's our fear of connection.
00:18:34.385 --> 00:18:35.705
Right.
00:18:35.736 --> 00:18:36.375
of connection.
00:18:36.625 --> 00:18:50.355
Now, there's this, there's this, um, epidemic of loneliness, isolation, uh,'cause there's some kind of fear right here that we do not want to really open up and connect.
00:18:50.885 --> 00:18:57.346
And if you can really open up and connect, then it's easier for you to be a manager.
00:18:58.105 --> 00:18:59.576
Uh, and there's a difference.
00:18:59.746 --> 00:19:05.675
There's, there's a difference between someone who is just very jovial and excited and social.
00:19:06.586 --> 00:19:15.905
Uh, I'm not saying, you know, they always make the best types of managers, but the, it's the best types of managers are people who really do wanna connect, and they care about their people.
00:19:16.355 --> 00:19:17.715
And, and it's hard.
00:19:17.766 --> 00:19:20.006
It's hard for people to open up and feel safe.
00:19:20.726 --> 00:19:22.346
It's fascinating you say that.
00:19:22.346 --> 00:19:36.816
Literally this week I'm helping a leadership team and two people below the leaders, one specific leader and his team break down that barrier because there's a little bit of distrust amongst the team, and I'm kind of getting triangulated around.
00:19:37.046 --> 00:19:43.826
As the integrator, I'm stepping in, helping the leader of the department navigate these interpersonal challenges that he's having with his team.
00:19:44.405 --> 00:19:50.935
And, you know, I, I, I said just what you said to him, which is,"Hey, you need to be honest and open with these people.
00:19:51.066 --> 00:19:54.695
If you're feeling a lack of trust, they're certainly feeling it.
00:19:55.215 --> 00:20:07.145
And if they're not, we need to have a conversation around that." But to your point, being vulnerable and honest and humble and, and one of the, the, um, core values of this company is lead with positive intention.
00:20:08.066 --> 00:20:21.020
Meaning be a leader that's saying,"I'm doing this for the reason of being positive, not to be critical and judgmental." And our visionary pulled out that core value during an L10 and it was like,"Whoa!"
00:20:21.601 --> 00:20:22.161
Great.
00:20:22.161 --> 00:20:22.330
That's
00:20:22.391 --> 00:20:25.290
it came up and I was-- And it was so well-timed.
00:20:25.490 --> 00:20:26.401
So well-timed.
00:20:26.921 --> 00:20:38.141
But, um, it goes back to what you're saying about, about sharing those feelings and being honest, um, which is really special when you can get there and when you're not there first, for me, it's really obvious.
00:20:38.441 --> 00:20:42.941
So I want to ask you, you spend a lot of your time coaching coaches, right?
00:20:42.941 --> 00:20:46.141
You spend time with people teaching them to be better leaders.
00:20:47.060 --> 00:20:53.181
How-- I mean, it, it, it sounds like that's a core value of yours, which is, is being honest and open or, or something along those lines.
00:20:53.500 --> 00:20:57.770
Tell me how you weave that into, you know, your coaching practice when you're teaching others.
00:20:58.121 --> 00:21:07.730
the open and honest when you're one-on-one, which is a lot of the work that I do now, um, with leaders, coaches.
00:21:08.480 --> 00:21:11.611
Um, young leaders are really fun to coach, right?
00:21:11.611 --> 00:21:13.151
Young, high-potential leaders.
00:21:13.931 --> 00:21:21.240
Uh, when you're coaching one-on-one, it's a lot easier for people to be vulnerable, open, and honest.
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:23.611
So a lot of what I do is listening.
00:21:24.240 --> 00:21:27.800
Listening, um, asking questions.
00:21:28.480 --> 00:21:31.840
Um, the accountability piece.
00:21:32.351 --> 00:21:34.590
I have a definition that I love of accountability.
00:21:34.590 --> 00:21:37.951
It's, uh, reminding someone of what they've already agreed to.
00:21:39.451 --> 00:21:39.990
Mm-hmm.
00:21:40.131 --> 00:21:42.941
Reminding someone of what they've already agreed to.
00:21:43.330 --> 00:21:48.010
So one-on-one vulnerability, open and honest, that's, that's the whole thing.
00:21:48.010 --> 00:21:49.300
That's why people hire me.
00:21:49.800 --> 00:21:56.691
A lot of times they don't feel like they can be entirely open and honest anywhere else in their life.
00:21:57.300 --> 00:22:06.351
Coaches, you know, we can hold that space where someone can say things, even be honest with themselves while I'm, while I'm listening to them.
00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:11.961
The tricky part for open and honest comes in when you get a team environment.
00:22:12.661 --> 00:22:28.471
'Cause if we think about it, Matt, if you are-- if here you are and you're walking through the forest and, uh, you know, five people are coming at you, if we just think about our hindbrain or our lizard brain, you don't know how you need to protect yourself.
00:22:28.840 --> 00:22:34.230
So clearly, you're gonna put up all of your defenses and really make sure you're safe before you take those down.
00:22:34.830 --> 00:22:45.631
That's why team d- team functionality, team health, um, especially me- my work as an EOS implementer, is so much different than one-on-one work.
00:22:46.590 --> 00:22:58.090
Uh, this is where we really have to work to br- take down those defenses to get open and honest, and it takes some skill and some time and some willingness.
00:22:58.681 --> 00:22:59.010
Yep.
00:22:59.131 --> 00:23:03.510
But it's, uh, yeah, it's, it's different in the one-on-one coaching than it is in the team coaching, for
00:23:03.851 --> 00:23:05.513
You are listening to the Scalability Code.
00:23:05.513 --> 00:23:13.683
I'm your host, Matt Haney, founder of Sinclair Ventures, and we help visionary entrepreneurs like you get out of the shit show and focus on growing your business.
00:23:13.823 --> 00:23:20.222
We offer fractional COO and leadership coaching services that free up that brain of yours to focus on what's next.
00:23:20.712 --> 00:23:22.452
Learn more about us at SinclairVentures.
00:23:22.452 --> 00:23:22.803
com.
00:23:22.823 --> 00:23:23.442
Now back to it.
00:23:24.525 --> 00:23:42.005
I know you've written a book around courage And it sounds like what you're saying, uh, the courage mindset over fear is, is to your point you were just saying, you know, being courageous to, to, to say that and, and, and find out what the answer is.
00:23:42.424 --> 00:23:43.865
Uh, you talk about that in the book.
00:23:44.255 --> 00:23:46.424
Um, you mentioned there's three principles.
00:23:46.424 --> 00:23:47.974
Tell us the three principles in the book.
00:23:48.755 --> 00:23:54.545
Um, so I wrote this book, um, back in, I think it was 2018, so it was a while ago.
00:23:55.234 --> 00:24:01.144
And, uh, you know, my, my EOS practice was, um, full.
00:24:01.174 --> 00:24:04.234
I'd, I'd done 500 sessions at that time.
00:24:04.234 --> 00:24:07.805
At this point, at the recording of this podcast, I've done 1,300.
00:24:07.805 --> 00:24:08.924
That's kinda crazy.
00:24:08.974 --> 00:24:09.444
Wow.
00:24:09.994 --> 00:24:12.505
Uh, like, where does life, where, where does,
00:24:12.605 --> 00:24:13.694
Where do we go?
00:24:13.845 --> 00:24:14.275
Yeah.
00:24:14.375 --> 00:24:15.005
Where did we go?
00:24:15.005 --> 00:24:16.795
So 500 sessions is a lot.
00:24:16.845 --> 00:24:21.255
In fact, in EOS, once you've hit 500 sessions, you're an expert EOS implementer.
00:24:21.674 --> 00:24:24.384
This was before there was even a designation like that.
00:24:24.855 --> 00:24:33.625
So I had done 500 sessions, and I had a, got a phone call from somebody that was a referral, and he said,"Jill, listen, my whole industry uses EOS.
00:24:34.355 --> 00:24:35.474
It's awesome.
00:24:35.474 --> 00:24:36.484
It's incredible.
00:24:36.484 --> 00:24:37.355
We're gonna use it.
00:24:37.654 --> 00:24:40.505
But can you tell me why it won't work?"
00:24:41.355 --> 00:24:41.964
Ah.
00:24:42.125 --> 00:24:46.535
"Wow." And that question just stayed with me for a few months.
00:24:46.535 --> 00:24:47.914
It would not leave me.
00:24:48.134 --> 00:24:51.634
'Cause I had clearly had some implementations that didn't work.
00:24:52.154 --> 00:24:59.684
So I started asking the other implementers, doing my own research, and over the course of a year, I wrote this book in answer to that question.
00:24:59.714 --> 00:25:04.474
It's called"The Courage Advantage," and it's why it doesn't work.
00:25:04.525 --> 00:25:06.075
So here's the three things.
00:25:06.575 --> 00:25:23.365
Um, uh, companies that fail to implement a system, I will even just kinda expand it to any system is, we have, um, we don't have the courage to be disciplined To be disciplined.
00:25:23.724 --> 00:25:36.464
I was working with a more of a startup kind of, you know, kinda fast and flashy company just, uh, just a few months ago, and they just were not running good level 10 meetings.
00:25:36.464 --> 00:25:41.375
They were, you know, just level 10 meetings start to feel like, oh, they're just too structured.
00:25:41.775 --> 00:25:45.775
And one of the guys goes,"Jill, we're entrepreneurial.
00:25:45.775 --> 00:25:47.464
We disrupt shit.
00:25:47.494 --> 00:25:53.335
We're not gonna follow an agenda." And I said,"You do not want to disrupt yourselves.
00:25:53.914 --> 00:25:57.894
That is, you know, you're acting like a child." Like no.
00:25:58.224 --> 00:26:02.934
Yes, dis- yes, disrupt your competitor, disrupt the industry.
00:26:03.615 --> 00:26:04.575
Don't disrupt yourselves.
00:26:04.974 --> 00:26:06.224
That's ridiculous.
00:26:06.595 --> 00:26:18.285
Anyway, so it's the courage to be disciplined and encourage to stay in your seat, courage to not say anything, and write it down and save it for the issues list.
00:26:18.615 --> 00:26:24.394
Courage to b- be disciplined, but not just with your time, um, but also with your thoughts.
00:26:25.355 --> 00:26:26.484
Disciplined with your thoughts.
00:26:27.184 --> 00:26:30.654
And I think I'm gonna s- I'm gonna jump in because the next one is my favorite.
00:26:31.325 --> 00:26:40.305
And I think, um, you and I both love being fun and not taking ourselves too seriously, and lighten up is one of them.
00:26:40.345 --> 00:26:47.535
Have-- That's one of-- Which, by the way, everyone that says,"Oh, EOS is so corporate," that is such horseshit.
00:26:47.765 --> 00:26:57.875
I can promise you that EOS is not that, and the structure and discipline does not have to be rigid and, and, you know, just tightened down.
00:26:57.875 --> 00:26:58.835
You can have fun.
00:26:58.914 --> 00:26:59.464
Tell us.
00:27:00.184 --> 00:27:01.954
It's, um, it's actually mandatory.
00:27:02.265 --> 00:27:06.755
If you come to my session room, it's one of our objectives for the whole day is that we're gonna have fun.
00:27:07.154 --> 00:27:11.924
If I feel like you're not having fun, you have to talk to this mechanical hot dog who makes fun of you.
00:27:12.335 --> 00:27:13.775
I mean, it's really a lot of fun.
00:27:14.085 --> 00:27:19.345
Now, I, I clearly like to have fun in my life, but that's not why we're doing it.
00:27:20.035 --> 00:27:31.755
The courage to lighten up comes from this principle in our brain that if, if we have a white-knuckle grip, just absolutely stressed out about everything, we can only see...
00:27:31.755 --> 00:27:34.105
This, this comes from science, not just from Jill.
00:27:34.444 --> 00:27:37.265
We, uh, you can't even see into your peripheral.
00:27:37.674 --> 00:27:45.454
Your whole body rearranges itself for fear and anxiety and danger, and you can only see what's in front of you.
00:27:45.454 --> 00:27:47.144
Your brain is being conservative.
00:27:47.904 --> 00:28:00.775
When I help my teams lighten up, which is what I found in the book, we don't take ourselves so seriously We lighten up a little bit, your brain starts to widen up and you can get curious.
00:28:01.154 --> 00:28:02.575
And you can say,"What if we do that?
00:28:02.575 --> 00:28:09.575
And what if we do that?" And when there's a mistake made, I have a team that calls it a Bob Ross event.
00:28:09.974 --> 00:28:14.105
They're like,"We're just gonna Bob Ross that."'Cause what did Bob Ross do in his paintings?
00:28:14.434 --> 00:28:18.325
When he made a mistake, he's like,"Oh, I'm just-- That's a happy little accident.
00:28:18.355 --> 00:28:19.555
What can we do to
00:28:19.575 --> 00:28:20.424
What can we do?
00:28:20.525 --> 00:28:21.535
we Bob Rossed it.
00:28:21.625 --> 00:28:25.694
So lighten up your language, lighten up your reflections.
00:28:25.934 --> 00:28:40.595
It's such a good thing to teach, to teach visionaries because I know from my experience that most of, a lot of them feel this need to be all-knowing and, and they, they have this,"Well, I'm the visionary.
00:28:40.595 --> 00:28:41.204
It's my company.
00:28:41.204 --> 00:28:41.815
I started it.
00:28:41.865 --> 00:28:51.954
Everyone looks for me to have the answer." And it, it ties into sort of vulnerability and humility and lightening up and not having to feel like you have to have the answer.
00:28:52.105 --> 00:28:53.444
That's why you have a leadership team.
00:28:53.694 --> 00:28:55.045
That's why you have people around you.
00:28:55.454 --> 00:28:59.934
You know, some of the best leaders I've ever worked around and under say,"I don't know the answer.
00:29:00.184 --> 00:29:01.815
Let's all of us figure it out.
00:29:02.194 --> 00:29:04.734
Stop looking at me to have all the answers.
00:29:04.795 --> 00:29:06.115
You're here to help us.
00:29:06.295 --> 00:29:14.670
We're all part of it." Um, and to that point of lightening up, you have to be willing to be in that vulnerable space to say Okay, I don't know.
00:29:14.890 --> 00:29:16.880
Because that's, that's hard.
00:29:17.069 --> 00:29:25.309
It's really hard to not take yourself too seriously and to lighten up around the people that you've brought in to help grow your business or that you lead.
00:29:26.115 --> 00:29:26.414
Yeah.
00:29:26.694 --> 00:29:26.805
Yeah.
00:29:26.805 --> 00:29:26.835
Mm-hmm.
00:29:26.835 --> 00:29:26.875
Mm-hmm.
00:29:26.984 --> 00:29:27.085
Yeah.
00:29:27.085 --> 00:29:32.365
And, uh, um, uh, these, these entrepreneurs that we serve and that we are, right?
00:29:32.664 --> 00:29:34.615
Like I am an entrepreneur, so are you.
00:29:34.615 --> 00:29:41.744
Uh, a lot of us have, uh, um, I think, uh, the book"Drive" talks about it.
00:29:41.924 --> 00:29:45.674
Beckman, Doug, Douglas, Douglas Beckman.
00:29:46.184 --> 00:29:46.404
Oh,
00:29:46.410 --> 00:29:46.759
Okay.
00:29:46.809 --> 00:29:47.549
We'll go with it.
00:29:47.549 --> 00:29:47.799
We'll go
00:29:48.005 --> 00:29:55.234
Yeah,"Drive." Uh, they talk about a gene in there, a, a D2 gene that we have for just drive.
00:29:55.265 --> 00:30:04.505
And along with that often comes this irrational weight of responsibility, um, this tendency to isolate.
00:30:05.375 --> 00:30:14.984
Um, uh, we d- we don't take criticism very, very kindly, um, as it, as it will help us.
00:30:15.674 --> 00:30:39.779
Uh, and I found that a lot of leaders that I coach, a lot of visionaries that I coach, when they do some inner work in here, they find that some of these more heavy, um, or kind of a darker energy elements to this drive, to this gene, this entrepreneurial gene can be lightened up when they do a little bit of their inner work.
00:30:40.190 --> 00:30:46.869
Journaling, meditation, therapy, a coach, uh, uh, a peer group.
00:30:46.940 --> 00:30:49.490
Oh, a peer group is so nice.
00:30:49.829 --> 00:30:53.049
So it's this operation stuff that we're talking about.
00:30:53.170 --> 00:30:54.200
Absolutely, yes.
00:30:54.940 --> 00:31:06.990
And if, if our, if you and me included, beautiful visionary entrepreneurs will do a little bit of our own inner work, think life can lighten up just
00:31:07.309 --> 00:31:07.710
it's so
00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:09.690
the extent where we can really enjoy it.
00:31:09.799 --> 00:31:10.920
Yes, so true.
00:31:10.920 --> 00:31:16.309
I, I, uh, I always famously tell everyone that I've been in therapy, couples therapy with my wife.
00:31:16.309 --> 00:31:20.019
We've been married almost 20-- We've been married 20 years, together for 25 years.
00:31:20.509 --> 00:31:32.970
And some of the best, you know, life lessons have come from that session of just communication and, and, and, and doing that inner work and working on yourself so that you can be a better spouse and a better leader and a better parent and so and so.
00:31:33.450 --> 00:31:40.250
And I'm a big proponent of, of that, that inner work and that self-work because, uh, it, it just simply makes you happier.
00:31:40.549 --> 00:31:43.519
Um, and I definitely know it makes you be a better leader.
00:31:44.119 --> 00:31:44.339
Yeah.
00:31:44.579 --> 00:31:47.089
A, a lot of times we do talk about it like that.
00:31:47.089 --> 00:31:51.380
Therapy or coaching helps you be a better, and then you list off all of your roles.
00:31:51.380 --> 00:31:52.230
You just did it, right?
00:31:52.369 --> 00:31:54.960
Husband, father, te- teacher, coach, coach Aus.
00:31:55.119 --> 00:32:02.450
So you're like,"Ooh, I'm gonna invest in that so I can be better for everybody else." But also, number one, better for yourself.
00:32:03.039 --> 00:32:04.609
Like, live with yourself.
00:32:05.009 --> 00:32:11.049
There, there are things I've been doing for the last 10 years that I thought were self-care, and it was, I was actually punishing myself.
00:32:11.680 --> 00:32:12.109
Like, what?
00:32:12.549 --> 00:32:15.099
But'cause, just'cause I ju- I just didn't really think about it.
00:32:15.099 --> 00:32:16.470
I wasn't aware.
00:32:16.779 --> 00:32:20.170
So yeah, that, that awareness of who I am
00:32:20.480 --> 00:32:33.059
Oh, I think it-- awareness and, and, and humility are two of the best skills that I think any visionary, any leader, any person can, can embrace, and it just-- it, it makes a huge, huge difference.
00:32:33.460 --> 00:32:57.109
Okay, I want you to think back to your last session, could have been this week, um, or last couple sessions, where you saw an interaction between a visionary and an integrator that wasn't working, wasn't healthy, or something that you felt like, wow, I'm gonna have to address this either in person or outside of the session with these two because it's affecting the rest of the team.
00:32:58.359 --> 00:32:58.579
Yeah.
00:32:58.759 --> 00:33:00.200
Well, this one, this one's easy.
00:33:00.609 --> 00:33:05.359
Um, it's a newer team, and I have not taught this team the same page meeting.
00:33:05.829 --> 00:33:21.539
So when they came in, uh, the visionary and integrator starting to go back and forth are, uh, healthy discussion and debate, which is lovely, but I got to watch this little tennis match from the leadership team like you da, da, da, da, da, da, da.
00:33:21.849 --> 00:33:25.849
And it's just a, it's a, it's a waste of time.
00:33:26.279 --> 00:33:29.019
Um, they're not bringing a clear vision in.
00:33:29.019 --> 00:33:32.680
They're-- we're using our session to, for them to get on the same page.
00:33:33.029 --> 00:33:34.220
So that one was easy.
00:33:34.220 --> 00:33:41.769
I'm like,"Oh, so I get to teach you guys the same page meeting thing right now." So we've got a little Zoom call scheduled for tomorrow.
00:33:41.869 --> 00:33:45.509
Oh, that's great, and, and that's-- what an opportunity for them.
00:33:45.740 --> 00:33:55.799
I mean, uh, I mean, seriously, if you-- if you're not having that conversation, um, you're, you're not-- you're not living the-- you're not living the best way you could as a leader.
00:33:56.039 --> 00:34:03.940
And I also think that same page meeting, what I tell folks is it, it, it allows you to have a disarming conversation about things that need to happen.
00:34:04.259 --> 00:34:07.009
I know it's on my calendar, you know it's on yours.
00:34:07.390 --> 00:34:11.159
We know the intent of that is for us to literally get on the same page.
00:34:11.670 --> 00:34:13.659
What an opportunity to write those things down.
00:34:13.900 --> 00:34:17.929
P- I always say share your screen, get it out there, let's go through it.
00:34:17.929 --> 00:34:35.880
Because if you write it down and you know it needs to happen and you share your screen, you're more likely to get it out and not say,"Oh, I'm not gonna talk about this one'cause this one's hard, so we're just gonna, we're just gonna leave that down here." Share your screen, get it out there, say what needs to be said, and, and continue to move forward.
00:34:35.880 --> 00:34:40.010
What a great opportunity to, to teach them something that's gonna impact them.
00:34:40.286 --> 00:35:04.507
Anytime I, uh, an integrator will call me or a visionary will call me, and they're like,"I'm, we're having a hard time in this partnership," my very first question is,"When was your last same page meeting?" And 100% of the time, okay, 1,300 sessions in, 100 companies in, 100% of the time it was either canceled, they forgot about it.
00:35:04.827 --> 00:35:06.376
They, they were like,"Well, we did...
00:35:06.376 --> 00:35:07.047
We didn't have any.
00:35:07.047 --> 00:35:08.476
We talk every day.
00:35:08.507 --> 00:35:11.547
You know, ho, ho, ho, we talk every day." Yeah, that's it.
00:35:11.847 --> 00:35:13.737
So just have your same page meetings.
00:35:13.737 --> 00:35:15.947
It fixes 90% of the issues.
00:35:16.177 --> 00:35:16.567
cool.
00:35:16.597 --> 00:35:21.106
All right, last question around EOS, one of my favorites, um, around tools.
00:35:21.137 --> 00:35:25.536
Everyone knows the tools, not everyone, but those of us in the EOS world know the tools.
00:35:26.126 --> 00:35:37.836
So I, I, I want you to think about either one, one of the tools that you deliver really well, that you feel like,"I, Jill, am very good at teaching this tool." Could be same page meeting, but I'm not gonna let you use that
00:35:37.967 --> 00:35:38.347
No.
00:35:38.746 --> 00:35:38.956
No.
00:35:39.197 --> 00:35:47.266
and then also, um, maybe the hardest one to, to, to move across the line in terms of just getting it to be effective with a team.
00:35:47.487 --> 00:35:51.416
So the one you're best at and maybe the one that is the hardest.
00:35:52.467 --> 00:35:54.336
So, uh, this is interesting.
00:35:54.336 --> 00:36:00.456
I've never been asked the tool I'm best at,'cause I ha- I haven't ever l- really thought about what is the best
00:36:00.967 --> 00:36:01.876
I'll give you an example.
00:36:01.967 --> 00:36:07.367
I was in a session the other day, and I saw someone deliver the cash flow drivers in a way that I'd never seen it before.
00:36:07.396 --> 00:36:13.726
Obviously, the way that they were able to bring it together and tie it together, for me, I was like,"That's really special.
00:36:13.817 --> 00:36:14.516
Really special."
00:36:15.166 --> 00:36:15.597
Yep.
00:36:15.927 --> 00:36:22.317
So, uh, I think I really love teaching the how we discover core values.
00:36:22.317 --> 00:36:27.617
That's a really fun one to do, and it really opens people's eyes.
00:36:28.126 --> 00:36:41.356
I think at the beginning, even though my clients are prepared when they come to the sessions, I think at the beginning they really do feel like core values are just gonna be for the back of the T-shirts, you know, and the coffee mug and the website.
00:36:41.427 --> 00:36:44.106
on the-- Just fills a block.
00:36:44.407 --> 00:36:45.067
the website.
00:36:45.067 --> 00:36:46.887
This is how we get clients.
00:36:47.047 --> 00:36:58.447
Uh, so that's really fun to, um, to walk them through some mindsets of why these core values are at the center of everything we're gonna do.
00:36:58.927 --> 00:37:02.856
And when they see the big picture like that, I really like the aha moments.
00:37:02.987 --> 00:37:03.617
That's so great.
00:37:03.617 --> 00:37:04.896
I've never heard someone say that.
00:37:04.927 --> 00:37:11.697
I mean, obviously, I've been in session and seen it and know the impact of it, but I haven't heard an EOS implementer say that's a...
00:37:11.856 --> 00:37:13.097
I mean, it's like a duh.
00:37:13.097 --> 00:37:13.987
I'm saying it out loud.
00:37:13.987 --> 00:37:15.396
Of course, that would be impactful.
00:37:15.396 --> 00:37:17.106
But the fact that you're able to pull
00:37:17.177 --> 00:37:19.266
And it's really fun, it's really fun to teach.
00:37:19.266 --> 00:37:26.936
Now, the facilitation of this is hard and you, like, it-- This is, you know, why you don't hire a half-assed
00:37:27.027 --> 00:37:28.047
That's exactly right.
00:37:28.617 --> 00:37:34.836
can get really tricky, and the energy of the room can get so positive.
00:37:36.106 --> 00:37:36.547
See, okay?
00:37:36.547 --> 00:37:37.757
Now, I'm a positive coach.
00:37:37.987 --> 00:37:47.896
The energy of the room can get so positive that the exercise can g- run away with the positivity, and then we're not carrying the weight of what we're really going to do with these.
00:37:48.336 --> 00:37:53.657
So, uh, that's, that's another thing that I'm like,"Hmm, I guess I'm pretty...
00:37:53.657 --> 00:38:08.137
Yeah, I'm pretty good at that," is bringing it back to,"Now, you do know we're gonna fire people if they are not these things." And then they have to have a really hard conversation with themselves like,"Will we fire people around it?" Yeah.
00:38:08.472 --> 00:38:09.822
Yes, we absolutely will.
00:38:09.851 --> 00:38:20.391
I, I did it last year with a client, a high performer in the company, and multiple times we kept coming back to the fact that they were, you know, not leading with the best of intentions, and it was a very clear one.
00:38:20.672 --> 00:38:21.391
Very clear one.
00:38:21.391 --> 00:38:21.862
That's awesome.
00:38:21.891 --> 00:38:23.612
Okay, which is the hardest?
00:38:23.641 --> 00:38:29.521
What do you think one of the most challenging tools to get down or, or where you feel like people may struggle?
00:38:29.521 --> 00:38:33.402
Maybe it's not hardest for you to teach it, but it's one that comes up as a sticky point.
00:38:34.197 --> 00:38:37.646
The, the struggling one is the accountability chart.
00:38:38.867 --> 00:38:46.686
Clients will consistently struggle with that if w- if me, as the coach, if I'm not on top of it all the time.
00:38:47.327 --> 00:38:55.536
A couple of things that they, uh, that they do that are squirrely is they will find someone that they really like and they wanna hire them and then create the seat for them.
00:38:56.126 --> 00:38:58.177
Or they c- wanna create...
00:38:58.177 --> 00:39:04.007
They're like,"Oh, Matt says he's ready for a promotion, so we gotta create a seat for him." And I'm like,"Eh.
00:39:04.867 --> 00:39:11.956
Eh." Um, so that's, that's one that I just gotta stay on top of all the time.
00:39:12.052 --> 00:39:15.581
also feel like people love to change the accountability chart.
00:39:15.581 --> 00:39:17.101
It kinda goes off of what you're saying.
00:39:17.101 --> 00:39:24.771
It's like-- And this is a question, and, and everyone has a, I think, a different answer, but how often should, should we be, like, changing it?
00:39:24.862 --> 00:39:33.952
Because I think there are people that can leave an accountability chart in place for too long, and then there's certainly people that can change the accountability chart when the changing of the winds.
00:39:34.577 --> 00:39:34.927
Mm-hmm.
00:39:35.617 --> 00:39:35.827
Yeah.
00:39:36.146 --> 00:39:43.686
Well, it need, it sh- it shifts as often as it needs to, but if we're looking at our five leadership abilities, one of those is structure.
00:39:44.137 --> 00:39:47.056
So we want to make sure we have the right structure.
00:39:47.376 --> 00:39:49.907
If the structure is not working, you gotta change it.
00:39:50.827 --> 00:39:53.186
Here's what I will say also with that, though.
00:39:53.237 --> 00:39:59.297
Some teams are structure happy, and they'll go,"Oh, let's change the structure.
00:39:59.297 --> 00:40:04.507
That will fix our issues," when really they're just not having hard conversations with people.
00:40:05.117 --> 00:40:05.847
They're, uh...
00:40:05.927 --> 00:40:13.657
So structure is sometimes a tool that I see my teams go,"Oh, maybe we'll just add a seat." Okay.
00:40:13.657 --> 00:40:17.777
That's add a seat'cause this guy doesn't wanna do his stuff, so we just add a seat.
00:40:17.871 --> 00:40:18.512
move it around.
00:40:18.817 --> 00:40:20.586
Have a hard conversation with this guy.
00:40:21.217 --> 00:40:24.297
Um, or let's, let's restructure.
00:40:24.297 --> 00:40:26.496
Let's move this pres- person under here.
00:40:26.786 --> 00:40:35.496
So sometimes when I see them wanting to use the accountability chart tool to not be courageous, then I'll go,"Timeout.
00:40:35.726 --> 00:40:36.737
Is it process?
00:40:37.317 --> 00:40:39.317
Is, do we have the right people in the right seat?
00:40:39.367 --> 00:40:51.706
Have we been really great managers to, you know, this event?" Um, and then that sometimes will slow down the structure, changes that sometimes happen too fast.
00:40:52.246 --> 00:40:56.677
And then there's teams who do not want to change their structure, and then
00:40:56.702 --> 00:40:57.172
all.
00:40:57.452 --> 00:40:58.992
And don't-- And then we're not changing it.
00:40:58.992 --> 00:40:59.891
We're not changing it at
00:41:00.686 --> 00:41:00.936
Yep.
00:41:01.146 --> 00:41:06.507
And then I'm like,"Ooh, look, it's a leadership ability." I have the five leadership abilities across the top of my whiteboard.
00:41:06.507 --> 00:41:08.407
I'm like,"It's one of the leadership abilities.
00:41:08.407 --> 00:41:09.666
It might be time.
00:41:10.016 --> 00:41:11.746
We may have outgrown this structure.
00:41:12.556 --> 00:41:18.427
Where we were at$5 million is not where we're gonna get to at 50 million." I know you're a big, a big fan of that.
00:41:18.467 --> 00:41:22.467
Okay.
00:41:22.472 --> 00:41:23.742
And it should be a profound moment.
00:41:23.742 --> 00:41:25.351
It should be something that sticks out to you.
00:41:25.472 --> 00:41:46.762
Um, you know, there's people we come across that give and, and sound advice, and I'm curious if you can pull out some sound advice that you were given either in a good time or a bad time or something that stuck out to you that said,"Hey, this is really good advice, um, I've received from somebody." And, and how-- And do you pass that on, on a regular basis?
00:41:47.297 --> 00:41:47.516
Hmm.
00:41:47.516 --> 00:41:47.626
Mm.
00:41:47.887 --> 00:41:48.447
Yes.
00:41:48.527 --> 00:41:49.646
Uh, this is great.
00:41:49.847 --> 00:41:56.126
When I was, um, when-- Just before I was an EOS implementer, I was president of a CPA firm.
00:41:56.532 --> 00:41:56.922
Oh, wow.
00:41:56.922 --> 00:41:57.362
Okay.
00:41:57.387 --> 00:42:00.867
We were growing and growing and growing, but also hitting the ceiling.
00:42:01.416 --> 00:42:11.146
And my next-door neighbor, on a particularly hard day for me, my business next-door neighbor came outside and he sat next to me.
00:42:11.146 --> 00:42:15.507
I was sitting on the curb,'cause it was one of those days where you just walk out and sit down on the curb.
00:42:16.246 --> 00:42:24.217
And he, he said to me, you know, as I was throwing him my pity party of how life isn't fair and...
00:42:24.987 --> 00:42:28.907
I said,"I'm not very good at this, running a business.
00:42:28.936 --> 00:42:34.556
I guess I'm just not very good at this." And he said to me, this is the best advice.
00:42:34.556 --> 00:42:38.166
He said,"Jill, there is nothing wrong with you.
00:42:39.126 --> 00:42:46.856
There is something wrong with your system." And I love to share that, especially, you know, if visionaries are listening to this podcast.
00:42:47.516 --> 00:42:50.536
Visionaries, there is nothing wrong with you.
00:42:51.286 --> 00:42:59.706
Uh, sometimes EOS is known or there's some, there's some strains of EOS where people will do visionary shaming.
00:43:00.007 --> 00:43:02.117
Like,"Ooh, you don't know how to run a company.
00:43:02.157 --> 00:43:05.456
I have to run it for you." And I, and I feel it.
00:43:05.597 --> 00:43:06.237
I feel it.
00:43:06.237 --> 00:43:07.416
My visionaries feel it.
00:43:07.416 --> 00:43:09.237
And it's like,"No, pause.
00:43:09.606 --> 00:43:11.516
There is nothing wrong with you.
00:43:12.487 --> 00:43:15.016
There's everything right with you.
00:43:15.527 --> 00:43:35.987
There's just something wrong with your system." You, visionary, are brilliant and amazing and capable, and we would-- none of us would be here without you taking a risk and, uh, and being en-enthused about this product or service we're taking to the world for good.
00:43:36.396 --> 00:43:42.396
None of you visionaries wake up and go,"Ooh, I hope to be a hard ass today, and I hope to be,
00:43:42.621 --> 00:43:44.032
Incredibly difficult to be around.
00:43:44.032 --> 00:43:45.061
No, no one says that.
00:43:45.237 --> 00:43:45.606
No.
00:43:45.827 --> 00:43:46.347
No.
00:43:46.376 --> 00:43:47.427
You're amazing.
00:43:47.496 --> 00:43:50.586
So that first line of advice, there's nothing wrong with you.
00:43:51.367 --> 00:43:56.367
And maybe there's something wrong with your system if you're not flourishing, if your life isn't flourishing.
00:43:56.757 --> 00:43:57.356
That's awesome.
00:43:57.666 --> 00:43:58.217
That's awesome.
00:43:58.217 --> 00:43:58.936
Very well said.
00:43:58.936 --> 00:44:03.056
And, you know, we all have our uniquenesses, but I do love what you said about visionaries.
00:44:03.056 --> 00:44:07.887
I talk about it all the time, which is this person's doing their job coming up with 100 ideas.
00:44:07.967 --> 00:44:08.947
That's what they're supposed to.
00:44:08.987 --> 00:44:19.036
It's our job to create a system to-- that we can see those and implement those and push the ones that aren't so great to the, you know, to the back and get the ones that are good to the front.
00:44:19.336 --> 00:44:20.117
That's their job.
00:44:20.117 --> 00:44:21.797
That's what makes them unique and special.
00:44:21.797 --> 00:44:22.947
There's nothing wrong with them.
00:44:23.237 --> 00:44:26.927
We just need to create a system and, and around them, which is
00:44:27.271 --> 00:44:27.961
That's right.
00:44:28.141 --> 00:44:28.711
That's right.
00:44:28.911 --> 00:44:33.112
I have a fun tool that I hand out to my visionaries, and I invented it.
00:44:33.152 --> 00:44:35.472
I'm an artist and a creator myself.
00:44:36.001 --> 00:44:37.081
So here's the tool.
00:44:37.112 --> 00:44:38.942
It's called the Hallucination Journal.
00:44:40.521 --> 00:44:42.001
Yep, it's the best.
00:44:42.391 --> 00:44:51.411
In EOS, we say vision is at the top of the model, traction is at the bottom of the model, and it's by design because vision without traction is just hallucination.
00:44:51.952 --> 00:44:58.581
And then I wait for people to laugh because it's really fun, but sometimes saying that gives hallucination a bad rap.
00:44:58.996 --> 00:44:59.536
Right.
00:44:59.842 --> 00:45:00.132
hand it...
00:45:00.461 --> 00:45:01.961
We need to hallucinate.
00:45:02.146 --> 00:45:02.586
Yeah.
00:45:02.786 --> 00:45:03.297
Yep.
00:45:03.501 --> 00:45:19.041
out these hallucination journals to the visionaries, and the rule is you're only allowed to hallucinate, like put all of your crazy ideas in here, all of your amazing, wonderful, life-changing ideas in this journal, but you can't execute on any of them.
00:45:19.851 --> 00:45:24.952
And what this journal does then is it keeps this hallucination journal is safe.
00:45:25.322 --> 00:45:35.811
I can go in there and think about a hotdog stand, a new version of purple paint, anything I want to, and it's actually a creative exercise to keep visionaries
00:45:36.186 --> 00:45:36.436
It's a
00:45:36.592 --> 00:45:37.492
Now, in the event-
00:45:38.056 --> 00:45:40.626
a safe space to put all your crazy-ass thoughts.
00:45:41.106 --> 00:45:44.226
Um, and I'm, I'm quick to not shut those thoughts down.
00:45:44.536 --> 00:46:00.137
I think I see some people like they-- that, that hallucinization, hallucination comes out and people are like,"Meh." I'm like, I try to be very intentional about my body language, about my response, about the way I'm delivering it, because I don't wanna create a scenario where, uh, people are encouraged to not do that.
00:46:00.186 --> 00:46:01.097
It's quite the opposite.
00:46:01.327 --> 00:46:05.206
Like somebody that had a quote unquote terrible idea, turns out, guess what?
00:46:05.237 --> 00:46:06.646
It was a really badass idea.
00:46:06.907 --> 00:46:09.496
We just needed to get it forward, and they thought it was a terrible one.
00:46:09.496 --> 00:46:10.396
I'm glad they brought it up.
00:46:10.396 --> 00:46:11.197
We never would've been here.
00:46:11.922 --> 00:46:12.472
That's right.
00:46:12.641 --> 00:46:13.121
That's right.
00:46:13.842 --> 00:46:23.481
And then if you do have an idea that ends up into your hallucination journal that you're like,"This is really good," you have to ceremoniously rip the pages out of the journal and put them somewhere else.
00:46:23.626 --> 00:46:24.336
That's cool.
00:46:24.561 --> 00:46:26.331
you always do- It's really fun.
00:46:26.331 --> 00:46:28.561
It's, it's a lot of fun, for sure.
00:46:28.677 --> 00:46:31.237
Jill, I, I have thoroughly enjoyed this.
00:46:31.266 --> 00:46:32.797
Um, I loved having you.
00:46:32.827 --> 00:46:39.246
I love your energy, um, I love your wisdom, and I love that you're, uh, the badass you are,'cause it's fun to watch.
00:46:39.246 --> 00:46:40.356
It's fun to be around.
00:46:40.737 --> 00:46:45.036
And, um, you're, you're a, a great human and a great role model to a lot of us.
00:46:45.036 --> 00:46:49.487
So Thank you for being so, uh, so fun and, and lighthearted.
00:46:50.472 --> 00:46:52.351
You're welcome for being so much fun.
00:46:52.351 --> 00:46:53.652
That's, that's awesome.
00:46:53.652 --> 00:46:54.132
I'll, I'll
00:46:54.356 --> 00:47:00.996
I look forward to seeing you next time I'm up in Dallas, either at one of the EOS events or just up seeing folks.
00:47:00.996 --> 00:47:04.387
But, um, wanted to thank you for joining us today on The Scalability Code.
00:47:04.762 --> 00:47:05.541
Perfect.
00:47:05.592 --> 00:47:07.572
Thank you for having me, Matt.
00:47:07.902 --> 00:47:09.972
Thank you for listening to The Scalability Code.
00:47:10.001 --> 00:47:15.492
If you made it this far, please follow the show on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:47:15.594 --> 00:47:17.335
Let's get out of the sh*t show together.
00:47:17.364 --> 00:47:19.824
We'll see you next time on The Scalability Code.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.669
Jill, we're entrepreneurial.
00:00:02.669 --> 00:00:04.360
We disrupt shit.
00:00:04.389 --> 00:00:10.230
We're not gonna follow an agenda." And I said,"You do not want to disrupt yourselves.
00:00:10.810 --> 00:00:14.789
That is, you know, you're acting like a child." Like no.
00:00:15.119 --> 00:00:19.829
Yes, dis- yes, disrupt your competitor, disrupt the industry.
00:00:20.510 --> 00:00:21.469
Don't disrupt yourselves.
00:00:21.870 --> 00:00:23.120
That's ridiculous.
00:00:23.489 --> 00:00:29.519
Welcome to The Scalability Code, the podcast that helps you get out of the sh*t show and start growing your business.
00:00:29.699 --> 00:00:32.310
And now for your host, Matt Haney.
00:00:32.359 --> 00:00:37.280
Here we are, folks, another episode of"The Scalability Code." Today, I'm joined by Jill Young.
00:00:37.369 --> 00:00:39.049
Jill, I've followed you.
00:00:39.079 --> 00:00:40.729
I've seen you on the internet.
00:00:40.799 --> 00:00:45.200
Um, I know you have an incredible following, and I love that you're in the great state of Texas.
00:00:45.200 --> 00:00:48.159
So Jill, thanks for joining us, uh, today on"The Scalability Code."
00:00:48.619 --> 00:00:50.420
Well, thank you for having me, Matt.
00:00:50.450 --> 00:00:54.219
Maybe you've seen me blowing bubbles or dancing or something like that.
00:00:54.219 --> 00:00:55.649
That's usually when people...
00:00:56.149 --> 00:01:03.399
I have seen, your personality in action and, uh, your, your energy is, is infectious, so that's awesome.
00:01:03.869 --> 00:01:05.299
Well, we start the same way.
00:01:05.519 --> 00:01:09.409
Uh, every episode we start off the same way with kind of a two-part question.
00:01:09.780 --> 00:01:17.480
Uh, one is like, tell, tell us about your entrepreneurial journey, um, a- and kind of how you got to where you are today.
00:01:17.510 --> 00:01:24.400
And, and this is really a chance for you to go back and sort of relive and rethink some of the ways and things that you may not have talked about or think or...
00:01:24.400 --> 00:01:26.620
'Cause those, those tidbits are helpful.
00:01:26.829 --> 00:01:27.840
So that's the first part.
00:01:28.060 --> 00:01:31.819
And then the second part is, talk about someone that influenced you as an entrepreneur.
00:01:31.939 --> 00:01:40.370
Someone that, you know, that got you that bug going, got that fire going, and maybe that person leads you into your journey.
00:01:40.579 --> 00:01:42.170
This one is easy for me, Matt.
00:01:42.209 --> 00:01:45.989
It's at the, it's just right at the forefront of my brain.
00:01:46.379 --> 00:01:49.590
My entrepreneurial influencer was my dad.
00:01:49.870 --> 00:01:51.930
I grew up in an entrepreneurial family.
00:01:52.269 --> 00:01:55.640
Dad had several different businesses.
00:01:56.150 --> 00:02:04.980
Th-the term serial entrepreneur was not around back then, but he was, and, uh, it, it was all throughout our family.
00:02:05.010 --> 00:02:17.250
My, um, grandparents on both sides were builders, entrepreneurs, um, top salespeople, if you will, which is, you know, one of the greatest skills of an entrepreneur.
00:02:17.969 --> 00:02:25.219
And so I don't even know what it feels like to catch the bug because it is installed in me.
00:02:25.680 --> 00:02:28.620
Uh, m-my, uh, dad had...
00:02:28.810 --> 00:02:34.069
He was a master electrician, and he had, um, he had an electrical contracting company.
00:02:34.069 --> 00:02:41.129
And the day I was born, he was over on a job in Ogden, Utah, on the Dee Event Center.
00:02:41.129 --> 00:02:44.669
He was wiring the Dee Event Center and the hospitals across the street.
00:02:44.669 --> 00:02:47.250
So he's like,"I'm just gonna go check on a job real fast."
00:02:47.780 --> 00:02:48.189
Yeah.
00:02:48.289 --> 00:02:48.810
That's awesome.
00:02:48.949 --> 00:02:49.919
and then here I am
00:02:49.930 --> 00:02:50.740
was like,"What?"
00:02:51.199 --> 00:02:51.960
Yeah, exactly.
00:02:51.960 --> 00:03:04.835
"I'm gonna check on a job real fast." And he comes over and You know, here, those were the days where the father could not be in the room, and then it's like,"Ta-da, here's your baby girl." And we were-- I was attached to him from that very moment.
00:03:05.224 --> 00:03:40.435
I have many memories of going with him to um, his, his CPA and his attorney for all of, you know, the different businesses, and just so grateful to him because every time I would go with him or, um, be inside the business with him, I asked questions, questions, questions, questions, and he always paused to answer, or he would ask the professional to answer, uh, and, and talk to this little girl who was, um, who was growing.
00:03:40.664 --> 00:03:48.004
And where in those days, you know, little girls, little children, period, could just be ignored, and he didn't.
00:03:48.115 --> 00:03:48.585
He didn't.
00:03:48.585 --> 00:03:50.375
So that was my, that was my bug.
00:03:51.139 --> 00:03:51.599
That's awesome.
00:03:51.599 --> 00:03:52.699
Did you grow up in Utah?
00:03:53.224 --> 00:03:54.104
I did, yep.
00:03:54.150 --> 00:03:55.090
a huge Utah fan.
00:03:55.090 --> 00:04:00.129
I lived there for four years, met my wife there, got married there, anniversary all the time.
00:04:00.129 --> 00:04:02.439
So beautiful place, wonderful people.
00:04:02.655 --> 00:04:04.264
Absolutely gorgeous.
00:04:04.264 --> 00:04:08.544
Whenever I fly back,'cause I have a lot of family there, I will say,"There are my mountains.
00:04:08.544 --> 00:04:09.465
Hello, mountains.
00:04:09.465 --> 00:04:10.215
Did you miss me?
00:04:10.215 --> 00:04:11.115
I missed you."
00:04:11.530 --> 00:04:15.389
Salt Lake is, is-- Salt Lake Valley is a, is a special, special place.
00:04:15.784 --> 00:04:16.644
Just gorgeous.
00:04:17.149 --> 00:04:17.600
that's awesome.
00:04:17.600 --> 00:04:20.720
So you've been around entrepreneurship your whole life, which is amazing.
00:04:20.720 --> 00:04:27.670
You'd be surprised how many times I hear that, and I also hear the opposite, which is,"Oh, I didn't grow up with entrepreneurs.
00:04:27.699 --> 00:04:29.639
I didn't know I was going to become one.
00:04:30.000 --> 00:04:39.699
My parents did this, my parents did that, and then I met this person, and it transformed my career or their career." So I love, I love hearing all the, the different places of that.
00:04:40.100 --> 00:04:49.290
Um, and I love that your dad was your mentor and the person that you followed and that, uh, sounds like an incredible man and role model, um, to, to, to follow along.
00:04:49.639 --> 00:04:52.209
Well, tell me about your entrepreneurial journey.
00:04:52.310 --> 00:04:59.870
Obviously, your dad was impactful, uh, and those around you, but how did you sort of progress to where you are today in terms of entrepreneurship?
00:05:00.495 --> 00:05:03.464
this is a lovely story also because I was also...
00:05:03.694 --> 00:05:05.115
Can I swear on this podcast?
00:05:05.430 --> 00:05:06.250
and ten percent.
00:05:06.295 --> 00:05:06.644
Awesome.
00:05:06.865 --> 00:05:09.634
Because I was also just a little bit of a shit, you know?
00:05:09.675 --> 00:05:10.504
Just a little shit.
00:05:10.595 --> 00:05:15.305
So, uh, I, uh, I grew up in the family business.
00:05:15.665 --> 00:05:20.975
I, you know, here I am a teenager, and I'm looking around going,"You guys don't know what the heck you're doing
00:05:21.399 --> 00:05:21.778
Yeah.
00:05:21.928 --> 00:05:22.829
What was the business?
00:05:23.365 --> 00:05:32.154
The business that I was in mostly was childcare centers, and, uh, but we also had a wedding center, the electrical contracting company.
00:05:32.694 --> 00:05:34.725
Um, my dad was also an inventor.
00:05:35.615 --> 00:05:41.725
So whenever I get the chance, I like to say he's the patent holder on the electronic trailer hitch locator and ball cover.
00:05:41.824 --> 00:05:44.694
I mean, think of what a really cool name there is.
00:05:44.750 --> 00:05:46.610
nobody can say that.
00:05:46.889 --> 00:05:47.889
That's amazing.
00:05:48.370 --> 00:05:50.029
We still hold the patent, baby.
00:05:50.029 --> 00:05:54.790
He-- There's f- there's probably 30 patents on things that he's invented.
00:05:55.399 --> 00:06:01.060
And so childcare was the industry, and I was, I just...
00:06:01.060 --> 00:06:05.250
You know, like a lot of teenagers, you look at things in a simple way and go,"Well, why are we doing that?
00:06:05.250 --> 00:06:05.889
That's dumb.
00:06:05.889 --> 00:06:17.560
We should do that." Um, over the years, I convinced my parents to let me run the schools, and I did, and I still was irritated that we didn't know how to do it right.
00:06:19.209 --> 00:06:25.000
Uh, so I left the family business, and I went to work for big companies.
00:06:25.290 --> 00:06:38.120
Big companies where I thought,"Ah, this is where, this is where you- we will know what to do." I got into the big companies, and I had kind of the same attitude of like,"No, that is not right.
00:06:38.180 --> 00:06:38.949
Why are we doing that?
00:06:38.949 --> 00:06:42.079
That's ridiculous." Now, all of that has served me.
00:06:42.310 --> 00:06:44.410
I ho- hopefully I'm not a little shit anymore.
00:06:44.889 --> 00:06:45.629
But it served
00:06:45.699 --> 00:06:46.379
a big shit.
00:06:46.379 --> 00:06:47.870
You're just like a bigger version.
00:06:47.920 --> 00:06:49.029
Yeah.
00:06:49.189 --> 00:06:49.970
Thanks, Matt.
00:06:49.970 --> 00:06:50.860
That's funny.
00:06:51.449 --> 00:06:52.050
That's funny.
00:06:52.050 --> 00:06:52.639
I like it.
00:06:53.290 --> 00:06:59.199
Uh, sometimes my clients will say,"Gosh, Jill, you're being an ass today." And I'm like,"Well,
00:06:59.240 --> 00:06:59.829
welcome.
00:07:00.259 --> 00:07:03.589
think, yes, you did not hire a half-assed coach.
00:07:03.860 --> 00:07:09.040
You hired the whole ass." Like, I am gonna, I'm gonna help you with this.
00:07:09.350 --> 00:07:14.189
Now I, I have a style where I do it with lightheartedness and love and funny and...
00:07:14.500 --> 00:07:15.829
But it still gets the job done.
00:07:16.100 --> 00:07:22.540
So I left this entrepreneurial world to go out and find out how we really do it, how business really works.
00:07:22.949 --> 00:07:36.980
I got an MBA, I worked for some big companies, and then I'm like,"Oh, actually, we did know what we were doing back in, in the family business." As it turns out, we knew, uh, we knew what we were doing.
00:07:36.980 --> 00:07:38.360
We didn't have words for it.
00:07:38.689 --> 00:07:41.439
We clearly didn't have a system that we were running on.
00:07:41.870 --> 00:07:46.399
And the first time I read the book Traction, um, I cried.
00:07:47.139 --> 00:07:54.149
Uh, and, and it wasn't because it was so beautiful, and like all laid out so perfectly.
00:07:54.720 --> 00:07:58.500
Um, now I do have some nerdy friends who cried because it was written so beautifully.
00:07:59.129 --> 00:08:10.339
But I cried for,"Oh my gosh, if we would've had this in the family business." And Matt, this is the same stuff that you talk about, is the founder-led companies.
00:08:10.730 --> 00:08:14.699
And Dad was the founder, but he...
00:08:14.730 --> 00:08:18.110
My mom was an indentured servant, essentially.
00:08:18.110 --> 00:08:23.000
And it was like, uh, she's dabbling in this and dabbling in that, and then all the kids, right?
00:08:23.040 --> 00:08:24.639
All the kids are working there.
00:08:25.339 --> 00:08:31.529
And I- I'm, I don't mean any disrespect because we all had, we clearly had choices.
00:08:32.220 --> 00:08:39.190
But also when there was a big decision to be made, Dad wasn't working in the company, but Dad would say yes or no.
00:08:39.639 --> 00:08:41.110
But he didn't, you know, he, he
00:08:41.169 --> 00:08:42.570
buck stops somewhere.
00:08:42.835 --> 00:08:44.424
Yeah, genius in the middle.
00:08:44.985 --> 00:08:47.674
Um, the genius with 1,000 helpers.
00:08:48.134 --> 00:08:50.315
Um, that, that's, that's how
00:08:50.365 --> 00:09:03.735
mentioned something I wanna, I wanna tag onto, and I have been an entrepreneur pretty much my entire career, and one of my clients, my EOS clients that I worked with in, in 2024, um, and through last year was acquired by Accenture.
00:09:04.325 --> 00:09:10.455
So, um, I got, and am still running a, an integration of in- integrating that company into Accenture.
00:09:11.024 --> 00:09:12.904
It's been fascinating.
00:09:13.424 --> 00:09:16.544
Jill, they have 700,000 employees at Accenture.
00:09:17.455 --> 00:09:19.965
There are people on top of people on top of people.
00:09:20.365 --> 00:09:31.254
And you said something about your experience in big business that made you realize, turns out the entrepreneur, you know, the shit show they live in, they still get it done, right?
00:09:31.554 --> 00:09:34.615
I talk to my clients about being dysfunctionally functional.
00:09:34.985 --> 00:09:38.414
I'm like,"Let's not forget the fact that we are functional.
00:09:38.605 --> 00:09:49.605
Yes, there's a little bit of dysfunction, but we are, we are functioning, and there's a little bit of dysfunction in all of it." But I tell you that because I got to see behind the scenes now in a big...
00:09:49.884 --> 00:09:53.184
one of the biggest com- companies in the world, they're still figuring it out.
00:09:53.394 --> 00:09:56.875
They're literally, like, still figuring it out every day.
00:09:57.154 --> 00:10:03.365
The difference between our clients is entrepreneurs can turn the steering wheel and see a somewhat immediate reaction.
00:10:03.705 --> 00:10:15.745
In these bigger businesses, you, you make a turn, it may be six, 12, 18, 24, 36 months before you know if the strategy you implemented is actually being effective, and that's tough.
00:10:15.845 --> 00:10:16.544
That's tough.
00:10:16.595 --> 00:10:20.404
It-- for me, when I'm used to working with entrepreneurs, they're like,"We're gonna go left.
00:10:20.575 --> 00:10:23.375
We're going left," and, and then you go with it.
00:10:23.434 --> 00:10:25.695
But did you see that in these big businesses?
00:10:25.695 --> 00:10:31.485
Is that maybe what brought you back to entrepreneurship, was the bureaucracy or, or any of the, you know...
00:10:32.375 --> 00:10:32.654
I don't know.
00:10:32.654 --> 00:10:34.434
What, what made you say,"I don't wanna go work.
00:10:34.465 --> 00:10:35.325
I got an MBA.
00:10:35.774 --> 00:10:38.634
I'm in big business now, and I wanna go backwards," quote-unquote?
00:10:39.034 --> 00:10:41.154
There's, there's something that's coming to me.
00:10:41.345 --> 00:10:46.894
Uh, I, I love the phrase that until a question is asked, the answer doesn't exist.
00:10:47.304 --> 00:10:47.955
Hmm.
00:10:48.065 --> 00:10:58.404
So I don't know if anyone has ever asked me that before, and now here's the answer that I'm like,"Oh my gosh, I see it now." So thank you for asking'cause now I get to see my own story.
00:10:59.095 --> 00:11:04.174
Um, it really was the spirit of entrepreneurialism that was missing.
00:11:04.924 --> 00:11:05.294
Wow.
00:11:05.294 --> 00:11:06.195
So well said.
00:11:06.615 --> 00:11:15.894
the ownership, the, the, the pride, the excitement, the if we don't get this done, our customer will be so sad.
00:11:16.085 --> 00:11:16.544
Like ooh.
00:11:17.105 --> 00:11:18.235
And you just feel it.
00:11:19.024 --> 00:11:27.815
Uh, ironically, I work with some really big businesses right now, publicly traded businesses, um, and we're running on EOS
00:11:28.024 --> 00:11:28.394
Yeah.
00:11:28.934 --> 00:11:51.884
And if we don't-- Uh, it's not like, you know, it's not like we're shouting it from the rooftops, but because there is this entrepreneurial human in the center that wants all this stuff to happen, even inside big businesses, there's some really good shit happening, and it's flowing, and it's flowing fast, and we can see the change because there is that energy there.
00:11:52.335 --> 00:12:15.985
So I'm wondering right now, I'm like, I'm wondering if we have that entrepreneurial energy in those businesses, can we keep everything we love about entrepreneurial companies, that spirit, the, the culture, the connection, um, the innovation, and still have some discipline that comes with the bigger b- the bigger company?
00:12:16.654 --> 00:12:17.554
That's so well said.
00:12:17.585 --> 00:12:18.985
I love it, I love it, I love it.
00:12:19.245 --> 00:12:21.195
Well, um, couple things.
00:12:21.195 --> 00:12:25.875
Obviously, you are a very successful EOS implementer, which I love.
00:12:26.294 --> 00:12:41.195
Um, I have a question that I ask, um, all the EOS implementers I bring on, which is, um, can you, can you give me some tips, tricks or, or knowledge around how, uh, you get EOS to stick one or two levels down below the leadership team?
00:12:41.375 --> 00:12:48.394
I, as a fractional integrator, uh, deal with that a lot and some of, you know, getting it down to the bottom is very difficult.
00:12:48.835 --> 00:12:52.225
Um, so I'd love to hear if you have any, any experience or opinions on that.
00:12:52.855 --> 00:12:53.745
Hmm, for sure.
00:12:54.134 --> 00:12:57.565
Well, first of all, big shout out for my friends Beth and Marissa.
00:12:57.565 --> 00:12:59.414
Beth Fahey, Marissa Smith.
00:12:59.414 --> 00:13:02.654
They just released a book called"Roll Out." I know you're aware of that.
00:13:03.205 --> 00:13:06.504
So read the book because it's really, really great.
00:13:07.894 --> 00:13:15.914
Uh, uh, so here's a couple of things that come to me as I, I think I've done 1,300 sessions, 100 implementations.
00:13:16.264 --> 00:13:20.764
So just, you know, uh, it's still anecdotal evidence, but there you go.
00:13:21.404 --> 00:13:31.985
Uh, one of them is it is imperative that the leadership team is all fully committed to getting it rolled out throughout the company.
00:13:32.754 --> 00:13:44.085
And one of the, one of the phrases that I use to help with that is, it, it, it's kind of funny and people laugh, but every company runs on a system.
00:13:45.154 --> 00:13:52.615
Every department, every team, every work team, every shift, you run on a system.
00:13:53.054 --> 00:13:54.024
Everyone.
00:13:54.754 --> 00:14:02.875
It's just that do we want that to be an intentional system where everything is flowing, or do we want it to be chaotic and disjointed?
00:14:03.225 --> 00:14:06.434
'Cause like you said, are, are we functionally dysfunctional?
00:14:06.465 --> 00:14:06.934
What did you say?
00:14:06.934 --> 00:14:08.865
Dysfunctionally, but we're still functioning
00:14:09.284 --> 00:14:10.034
There's, there's...
00:14:10.230 --> 00:14:10.929
Oh, yeah.
00:14:10.929 --> 00:14:15.870
That-- So we, we want to be intentional with this system that we're running on.
00:14:16.179 --> 00:14:27.379
I was just on the phone this morning with an integrator, and he's saying,"Hey, what I'm finding is they have 12 locations and they're all running the same scorecard at each location." It's just so simple like that.
00:14:27.409 --> 00:14:35.889
He goes,"Some, some locations are starting to call these numbers different things." He goes,"I think that's really dangerous." And I'm like,"Yes, you're right.
00:14:36.029 --> 00:14:36.840
Nice work.
00:14:36.840 --> 00:14:37.269
You see it.
00:14:37.299 --> 00:14:41.169
It's dangerous." We've all got to speak the same language.
00:14:41.379 --> 00:14:54.250
But if he wasn't dedicated to that, if he's n-'cause he's the integrator, he's-- if he's not looking for that, he's gonna, he's gonna go,"Well, now I, I want him to have some autonomy over there," and,"Oh, that's not a, that's not a big deal.
00:14:54.250 --> 00:14:57.830
That's a little deal." But it's the little deals that are the big deals.
00:14:57.830 --> 00:15:01.659
So the leadership team has to be absolutely committed to this.
00:15:02.019 --> 00:15:02.649
Yes.
00:15:02.740 --> 00:15:06.990
Pull that one string on the sweater and all of a sudden everything starts to unravel.
00:15:07.350 --> 00:15:13.070
You let that one metric become, uh, vague or not descript, all of a sudden you
00:15:13.269 --> 00:15:13.779
about it.
00:15:13.779 --> 00:15:14.399
Mm-hmm.
00:15:14.679 --> 00:15:20.110
you give autonomy and, and creative liberty to things that aren't supposed to be autonomous or creative.
00:15:20.419 --> 00:15:21.980
They're supposed to be defined and known.
00:15:22.120 --> 00:15:22.330
right.
00:15:22.860 --> 00:15:32.149
I had a, a visionary the other day that, um, he got a, he got a, a, a Jill youn- a Coach Jill talking to, you know?
00:15:32.149 --> 00:15:42.490
He got a Coach Jill talking to,'cause he, he had three rocks, and he completed one out of three rocks, and he had said,"No, I wanna do this.
00:15:42.490 --> 00:15:43.269
I'm gonna do it.
00:15:43.269 --> 00:15:44.330
It's, it's great.
00:15:44.330 --> 00:15:48.370
I'm, uh..." And then he was laughing in the session, and we're light-hearted.
00:15:48.370 --> 00:15:51.539
He goes,"It's not a big, it's not a big deal.
00:15:52.409 --> 00:15:53.379
One of three rocks.
00:15:53.379 --> 00:15:55.429
It's not these two things, these two rocks.
00:15:55.779 --> 00:15:56.419
I'm gonna get it.
00:15:56.419 --> 00:15:58.259
They're gonna be done in a couple of days.
00:15:58.259 --> 00:15:59.850
They're gon-" You know, and he started to do this.
00:16:00.529 --> 00:16:05.659
And I'm like,"The reason it's a big deal is because you just set the bar for the rest of the company.
00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:17.419
You just said to the whole entire company, starting with your leadership team, that 33% completion on our highest priorities that we've agreed to is your bar.
00:16:17.610 --> 00:16:21.850
So that's where the problem is." And he wa- you know, he was like,"Oh."
00:16:22.070 --> 00:16:25.139
did you get to have that conversation in session or
00:16:25.350 --> 00:16:25.759
Oh, yeah.
00:16:26.419 --> 00:16:26.840
Oh, yeah.
00:16:26.990 --> 00:16:28.009
Right in front of everybody.
00:16:28.330 --> 00:16:28.460
Yeah.
00:16:28.779 --> 00:16:38.970
And it's a great-- I mean, I have it all the time and, and I always feel like as the integrator, um, the m- the expectations on me are higher than everyone else because they are...
00:16:39.350 --> 00:16:51.009
I mean, I feel like if I don't set my milestones accordingly, if I'm not very intentional about what smart looks like for myself, how can I even begin to do that for the people that I work or that, that work with us?
00:16:51.009 --> 00:17:00.220
Because they're looking at me not as an opportunity to judge, but certainly as the person who's supposed to have their shit together and know exactly how to do it.
00:17:00.600 --> 00:17:03.360
And if you're not leading by example, then guess what?
00:17:03.389 --> 00:17:07.849
We are not leading by example, and it's perfectly obvious to everyone else in the room when that doesn't happen.
00:17:08.359 --> 00:17:08.910
That's awesome.
00:17:09.019 --> 00:17:09.630
I love that.
00:17:10.019 --> 00:17:14.980
what do you think the hardest part about managing people and/or a team?
00:17:15.200 --> 00:17:19.490
Like, where do you see the hardest challenge around managing people?
00:17:20.016 --> 00:17:23.365
Well, the, the hardest challenge is inside the human.
00:17:24.226 --> 00:17:28.336
The, the tools, we've got, we've got tons of simple tools.
00:17:28.776 --> 00:17:38.935
The tools will just, like, they just say,"This is the thing, and that is the thing." I mean, they're so simple that the information, the data is right there in front of your face.
00:17:39.605 --> 00:17:48.516
We even have two checklists, a leadership checklist and a management checklist that says,"If you're doing these five things, you're good." Um, but the hardest part is inside.
00:17:49.246 --> 00:18:00.276
Um, our in- our own inner work as a human to, to say the truth to other human beings.
00:18:00.455 --> 00:18:01.195
Hmm.
00:18:01.605 --> 00:18:02.046
So
00:18:02.246 --> 00:18:08.125
share what we are seeing, to share what we are feeling to another human being.
00:18:08.675 --> 00:18:09.806
That's the hardest thing.
00:18:09.925 --> 00:18:12.935
being candid, being direct, being honest, is that what you're saying is hard?
00:18:13.336 --> 00:18:19.635
Or, um, sharing some praise or some encouragement or asking a question.
00:18:19.945 --> 00:18:34.016
"Was I clear when I made that request of you?" Um,"Matt, are you happy in this role?" I mean, uh, the-- it's, it's our, it's our fear, um, it's our fear of connection.
00:18:34.385 --> 00:18:35.705
Right.
00:18:35.736 --> 00:18:36.375
of connection.
00:18:36.625 --> 00:18:50.355
Now, there's this, there's this, um, epidemic of loneliness, isolation, uh,'cause there's some kind of fear right here that we do not want to really open up and connect.
00:18:50.885 --> 00:18:57.346
And if you can really open up and connect, then it's easier for you to be a manager.
00:18:58.105 --> 00:18:59.576
Uh, and there's a difference.
00:18:59.746 --> 00:19:05.675
There's, there's a difference between someone who is just very jovial and excited and social.
00:19:06.586 --> 00:19:15.905
Uh, I'm not saying, you know, they always make the best types of managers, but the, it's the best types of managers are people who really do wanna connect, and they care about their people.
00:19:16.355 --> 00:19:17.715
And, and it's hard.
00:19:17.766 --> 00:19:20.006
It's hard for people to open up and feel safe.
00:19:20.726 --> 00:19:22.346
It's fascinating you say that.
00:19:22.346 --> 00:19:36.816
Literally this week I'm helping a leadership team and two people below the leaders, one specific leader and his team break down that barrier because there's a little bit of distrust amongst the team, and I'm kind of getting triangulated around.
00:19:37.046 --> 00:19:43.826
As the integrator, I'm stepping in, helping the leader of the department navigate these interpersonal challenges that he's having with his team.
00:19:44.405 --> 00:19:50.935
And, you know, I, I, I said just what you said to him, which is,"Hey, you need to be honest and open with these people.
00:19:51.066 --> 00:19:54.695
If you're feeling a lack of trust, they're certainly feeling it.
00:19:55.215 --> 00:20:07.145
And if they're not, we need to have a conversation around that." But to your point, being vulnerable and honest and humble and, and one of the, the, um, core values of this company is lead with positive intention.
00:20:08.066 --> 00:20:21.020
Meaning be a leader that's saying,"I'm doing this for the reason of being positive, not to be critical and judgmental." And our visionary pulled out that core value during an L10 and it was like,"Whoa!"
00:20:21.601 --> 00:20:22.161
Great.
00:20:22.161 --> 00:20:22.330
That's
00:20:22.391 --> 00:20:25.290
it came up and I was-- And it was so well-timed.
00:20:25.490 --> 00:20:26.401
So well-timed.
00:20:26.921 --> 00:20:38.141
But, um, it goes back to what you're saying about, about sharing those feelings and being honest, um, which is really special when you can get there and when you're not there first, for me, it's really obvious.
00:20:38.441 --> 00:20:42.941
So I want to ask you, you spend a lot of your time coaching coaches, right?
00:20:42.941 --> 00:20:46.141
You spend time with people teaching them to be better leaders.
00:20:47.060 --> 00:20:53.181
How-- I mean, it, it, it sounds like that's a core value of yours, which is, is being honest and open or, or something along those lines.
00:20:53.500 --> 00:20:57.770
Tell me how you weave that into, you know, your coaching practice when you're teaching others.
00:20:58.121 --> 00:21:07.730
the open and honest when you're one-on-one, which is a lot of the work that I do now, um, with leaders, coaches.
00:21:08.480 --> 00:21:11.611
Um, young leaders are really fun to coach, right?
00:21:11.611 --> 00:21:13.151
Young, high-potential leaders.
00:21:13.931 --> 00:21:21.240
Uh, when you're coaching one-on-one, it's a lot easier for people to be vulnerable, open, and honest.
00:21:21.240 --> 00:21:23.611
So a lot of what I do is listening.
00:21:24.240 --> 00:21:27.800
Listening, um, asking questions.
00:21:28.480 --> 00:21:31.840
Um, the accountability piece.
00:21:32.351 --> 00:21:34.590
I have a definition that I love of accountability.
00:21:34.590 --> 00:21:37.951
It's, uh, reminding someone of what they've already agreed to.
00:21:39.451 --> 00:21:39.990
Mm-hmm.
00:21:40.131 --> 00:21:42.941
Reminding someone of what they've already agreed to.
00:21:43.330 --> 00:21:48.010
So one-on-one vulnerability, open and honest, that's, that's the whole thing.
00:21:48.010 --> 00:21:49.300
That's why people hire me.
00:21:49.800 --> 00:21:56.691
A lot of times they don't feel like they can be entirely open and honest anywhere else in their life.
00:21:57.300 --> 00:22:06.351
Coaches, you know, we can hold that space where someone can say things, even be honest with themselves while I'm, while I'm listening to them.
00:22:07.240 --> 00:22:11.961
The tricky part for open and honest comes in when you get a team environment.
00:22:12.661 --> 00:22:28.471
'Cause if we think about it, Matt, if you are-- if here you are and you're walking through the forest and, uh, you know, five people are coming at you, if we just think about our hindbrain or our lizard brain, you don't know how you need to protect yourself.
00:22:28.840 --> 00:22:34.230
So clearly, you're gonna put up all of your defenses and really make sure you're safe before you take those down.
00:22:34.830 --> 00:22:45.631
That's why team d- team functionality, team health, um, especially me- my work as an EOS implementer, is so much different than one-on-one work.
00:22:46.590 --> 00:22:58.090
Uh, this is where we really have to work to br- take down those defenses to get open and honest, and it takes some skill and some time and some willingness.
00:22:58.681 --> 00:22:59.010
Yep.
00:22:59.131 --> 00:23:03.510
But it's, uh, yeah, it's, it's different in the one-on-one coaching than it is in the team coaching, for
00:23:03.851 --> 00:23:05.513
You are listening to the Scalability Code.
00:23:05.513 --> 00:23:13.683
I'm your host, Matt Haney, founder of Sinclair Ventures, and we help visionary entrepreneurs like you get out of the shit show and focus on growing your business.
00:23:13.823 --> 00:23:20.222
We offer fractional COO and leadership coaching services that free up that brain of yours to focus on what's next.
00:23:20.712 --> 00:23:22.452
Learn more about us at SinclairVentures.
00:23:22.452 --> 00:23:22.803
com.
00:23:22.823 --> 00:23:23.442
Now back to it.
00:23:24.525 --> 00:23:42.005
I know you've written a book around courage And it sounds like what you're saying, uh, the courage mindset over fear is, is to your point you were just saying, you know, being courageous to, to, to say that and, and, and find out what the answer is.
00:23:42.424 --> 00:23:43.865
Uh, you talk about that in the book.
00:23:44.255 --> 00:23:46.424
Um, you mentioned there's three principles.
00:23:46.424 --> 00:23:47.974
Tell us the three principles in the book.
00:23:48.755 --> 00:23:54.545
Um, so I wrote this book, um, back in, I think it was 2018, so it was a while ago.
00:23:55.234 --> 00:24:01.144
And, uh, you know, my, my EOS practice was, um, full.
00:24:01.174 --> 00:24:04.234
I'd, I'd done 500 sessions at that time.
00:24:04.234 --> 00:24:07.805
At this point, at the recording of this podcast, I've done 1,300.
00:24:07.805 --> 00:24:08.924
That's kinda crazy.
00:24:08.974 --> 00:24:09.444
Wow.
00:24:09.994 --> 00:24:12.505
Uh, like, where does life, where, where does,
00:24:12.605 --> 00:24:13.694
Where do we go?
00:24:13.845 --> 00:24:14.275
Yeah.
00:24:14.375 --> 00:24:15.005
Where did we go?
00:24:15.005 --> 00:24:16.795
So 500 sessions is a lot.
00:24:16.845 --> 00:24:21.255
In fact, in EOS, once you've hit 500 sessions, you're an expert EOS implementer.
00:24:21.674 --> 00:24:24.384
This was before there was even a designation like that.
00:24:24.855 --> 00:24:33.625
So I had done 500 sessions, and I had a, got a phone call from somebody that was a referral, and he said,"Jill, listen, my whole industry uses EOS.
00:24:34.355 --> 00:24:35.474
It's awesome.
00:24:35.474 --> 00:24:36.484
It's incredible.
00:24:36.484 --> 00:24:37.355
We're gonna use it.
00:24:37.654 --> 00:24:40.505
But can you tell me why it won't work?"
00:24:41.355 --> 00:24:41.964
Ah.
00:24:42.125 --> 00:24:46.535
"Wow." And that question just stayed with me for a few months.
00:24:46.535 --> 00:24:47.914
It would not leave me.
00:24:48.134 --> 00:24:51.634
'Cause I had clearly had some implementations that didn't work.
00:24:52.154 --> 00:24:59.684
So I started asking the other implementers, doing my own research, and over the course of a year, I wrote this book in answer to that question.
00:24:59.714 --> 00:25:04.474
It's called"The Courage Advantage," and it's why it doesn't work.
00:25:04.525 --> 00:25:06.075
So here's the three things.
00:25:06.575 --> 00:25:23.365
Um, uh, companies that fail to implement a system, I will even just kinda expand it to any system is, we have, um, we don't have the courage to be disciplined To be disciplined.
00:25:23.724 --> 00:25:36.464
I was working with a more of a startup kind of, you know, kinda fast and flashy company just, uh, just a few months ago, and they just were not running good level 10 meetings.
00:25:36.464 --> 00:25:41.375
They were, you know, just level 10 meetings start to feel like, oh, they're just too structured.
00:25:41.775 --> 00:25:45.775
And one of the guys goes,"Jill, we're entrepreneurial.
00:25:45.775 --> 00:25:47.464
We disrupt shit.
00:25:47.494 --> 00:25:53.335
We're not gonna follow an agenda." And I said,"You do not want to disrupt yourselves.
00:25:53.914 --> 00:25:57.894
That is, you know, you're acting like a child." Like no.
00:25:58.224 --> 00:26:02.934
Yes, dis- yes, disrupt your competitor, disrupt the industry.
00:26:03.615 --> 00:26:04.575
Don't disrupt yourselves.
00:26:04.974 --> 00:26:06.224
That's ridiculous.
00:26:06.595 --> 00:26:18.285
Anyway, so it's the courage to be disciplined and encourage to stay in your seat, courage to not say anything, and write it down and save it for the issues list.
00:26:18.615 --> 00:26:24.394
Courage to b- be disciplined, but not just with your time, um, but also with your thoughts.
00:26:25.355 --> 00:26:26.484
Disciplined with your thoughts.
00:26:27.184 --> 00:26:30.654
And I think I'm gonna s- I'm gonna jump in because the next one is my favorite.
00:26:31.325 --> 00:26:40.305
And I think, um, you and I both love being fun and not taking ourselves too seriously, and lighten up is one of them.
00:26:40.345 --> 00:26:47.535
Have-- That's one of-- Which, by the way, everyone that says,"Oh, EOS is so corporate," that is such horseshit.
00:26:47.765 --> 00:26:57.875
I can promise you that EOS is not that, and the structure and discipline does not have to be rigid and, and, you know, just tightened down.
00:26:57.875 --> 00:26:58.835
You can have fun.
00:26:58.914 --> 00:26:59.464
Tell us.
00:27:00.184 --> 00:27:01.954
It's, um, it's actually mandatory.
00:27:02.265 --> 00:27:06.755
If you come to my session room, it's one of our objectives for the whole day is that we're gonna have fun.
00:27:07.154 --> 00:27:11.924
If I feel like you're not having fun, you have to talk to this mechanical hot dog who makes fun of you.
00:27:12.335 --> 00:27:13.775
I mean, it's really a lot of fun.
00:27:14.085 --> 00:27:19.345
Now, I, I clearly like to have fun in my life, but that's not why we're doing it.
00:27:20.035 --> 00:27:31.755
The courage to lighten up comes from this principle in our brain that if, if we have a white-knuckle grip, just absolutely stressed out about everything, we can only see...
00:27:31.755 --> 00:27:34.105
This, this comes from science, not just from Jill.
00:27:34.444 --> 00:27:37.265
We, uh, you can't even see into your peripheral.
00:27:37.674 --> 00:27:45.454
Your whole body rearranges itself for fear and anxiety and danger, and you can only see what's in front of you.
00:27:45.454 --> 00:27:47.144
Your brain is being conservative.
00:27:47.904 --> 00:28:00.775
When I help my teams lighten up, which is what I found in the book, we don't take ourselves so seriously We lighten up a little bit, your brain starts to widen up and you can get curious.
00:28:01.154 --> 00:28:02.575
And you can say,"What if we do that?
00:28:02.575 --> 00:28:09.575
And what if we do that?" And when there's a mistake made, I have a team that calls it a Bob Ross event.
00:28:09.974 --> 00:28:14.105
They're like,"We're just gonna Bob Ross that."'Cause what did Bob Ross do in his paintings?
00:28:14.434 --> 00:28:18.325
When he made a mistake, he's like,"Oh, I'm just-- That's a happy little accident.
00:28:18.355 --> 00:28:19.555
What can we do to
00:28:19.575 --> 00:28:20.424
What can we do?
00:28:20.525 --> 00:28:21.535
we Bob Rossed it.
00:28:21.625 --> 00:28:25.694
So lighten up your language, lighten up your reflections.
00:28:25.934 --> 00:28:40.595
It's such a good thing to teach, to teach visionaries because I know from my experience that most of, a lot of them feel this need to be all-knowing and, and they, they have this,"Well, I'm the visionary.
00:28:40.595 --> 00:28:41.204
It's my company.
00:28:41.204 --> 00:28:41.815
I started it.
00:28:41.865 --> 00:28:51.954
Everyone looks for me to have the answer." And it, it ties into sort of vulnerability and humility and lightening up and not having to feel like you have to have the answer.
00:28:52.105 --> 00:28:53.444
That's why you have a leadership team.
00:28:53.694 --> 00:28:55.045
That's why you have people around you.
00:28:55.454 --> 00:28:59.934
You know, some of the best leaders I've ever worked around and under say,"I don't know the answer.
00:29:00.184 --> 00:29:01.815
Let's all of us figure it out.
00:29:02.194 --> 00:29:04.734
Stop looking at me to have all the answers.
00:29:04.795 --> 00:29:06.115
You're here to help us.
00:29:06.295 --> 00:29:14.670
We're all part of it." Um, and to that point of lightening up, you have to be willing to be in that vulnerable space to say Okay, I don't know.
00:29:14.890 --> 00:29:16.880
Because that's, that's hard.
00:29:17.069 --> 00:29:25.309
It's really hard to not take yourself too seriously and to lighten up around the people that you've brought in to help grow your business or that you lead.
00:29:26.115 --> 00:29:26.414
Yeah.
00:29:26.694 --> 00:29:26.805
Yeah.
00:29:26.805 --> 00:29:26.835
Mm-hmm.
00:29:26.835 --> 00:29:26.875
Mm-hmm.
00:29:26.984 --> 00:29:27.085
Yeah.
00:29:27.085 --> 00:29:32.365
And, uh, um, uh, these, these entrepreneurs that we serve and that we are, right?
00:29:32.664 --> 00:29:34.615
Like I am an entrepreneur, so are you.
00:29:34.615 --> 00:29:41.744
Uh, a lot of us have, uh, um, I think, uh, the book"Drive" talks about it.
00:29:41.924 --> 00:29:45.674
Beckman, Doug, Douglas, Douglas Beckman.
00:29:46.184 --> 00:29:46.404
Oh,
00:29:46.410 --> 00:29:46.759
Okay.
00:29:46.809 --> 00:29:47.549
We'll go with it.
00:29:47.549 --> 00:29:47.799
We'll go
00:29:48.005 --> 00:29:55.234
Yeah,"Drive." Uh, they talk about a gene in there, a, a D2 gene that we have for just drive.
00:29:55.265 --> 00:30:04.505
And along with that often comes this irrational weight of responsibility, um, this tendency to isolate.
00:30:05.375 --> 00:30:14.984
Um, uh, we d- we don't take criticism very, very kindly, um, as it, as it will help us.
00:30:15.674 --> 00:30:39.779
Uh, and I found that a lot of leaders that I coach, a lot of visionaries that I coach, when they do some inner work in here, they find that some of these more heavy, um, or kind of a darker energy elements to this drive, to this gene, this entrepreneurial gene can be lightened up when they do a little bit of their inner work.
00:30:40.190 --> 00:30:46.869
Journaling, meditation, therapy, a coach, uh, uh, a peer group.
00:30:46.940 --> 00:30:49.490
Oh, a peer group is so nice.
00:30:49.829 --> 00:30:53.049
So it's this operation stuff that we're talking about.
00:30:53.170 --> 00:30:54.200
Absolutely, yes.
00:30:54.940 --> 00:31:06.990
And if, if our, if you and me included, beautiful visionary entrepreneurs will do a little bit of our own inner work, think life can lighten up just
00:31:07.309 --> 00:31:07.710
it's so
00:31:07.720 --> 00:31:09.690
the extent where we can really enjoy it.
00:31:09.799 --> 00:31:10.920
Yes, so true.
00:31:10.920 --> 00:31:16.309
I, I, uh, I always famously tell everyone that I've been in therapy, couples therapy with my wife.
00:31:16.309 --> 00:31:20.019
We've been married almost 20-- We've been married 20 years, together for 25 years.
00:31:20.509 --> 00:31:32.970
And some of the best, you know, life lessons have come from that session of just communication and, and, and, and doing that inner work and working on yourself so that you can be a better spouse and a better leader and a better parent and so and so.
00:31:33.450 --> 00:31:40.250
And I'm a big proponent of, of that, that inner work and that self-work because, uh, it, it just simply makes you happier.
00:31:40.549 --> 00:31:43.519
Um, and I definitely know it makes you be a better leader.
00:31:44.119 --> 00:31:44.339
Yeah.
00:31:44.579 --> 00:31:47.089
A, a lot of times we do talk about it like that.
00:31:47.089 --> 00:31:51.380
Therapy or coaching helps you be a better, and then you list off all of your roles.
00:31:51.380 --> 00:31:52.230
You just did it, right?
00:31:52.369 --> 00:31:54.960
Husband, father, te- teacher, coach, coach Aus.
00:31:55.119 --> 00:32:02.450
So you're like,"Ooh, I'm gonna invest in that so I can be better for everybody else." But also, number one, better for yourself.
00:32:03.039 --> 00:32:04.609
Like, live with yourself.
00:32:05.009 --> 00:32:11.049
There, there are things I've been doing for the last 10 years that I thought were self-care, and it was, I was actually punishing myself.
00:32:11.680 --> 00:32:12.109
Like, what?
00:32:12.549 --> 00:32:15.099
But'cause, just'cause I ju- I just didn't really think about it.
00:32:15.099 --> 00:32:16.470
I wasn't aware.
00:32:16.779 --> 00:32:20.170
So yeah, that, that awareness of who I am
00:32:20.480 --> 00:32:33.059
Oh, I think it-- awareness and, and, and humility are two of the best skills that I think any visionary, any leader, any person can, can embrace, and it just-- it, it makes a huge, huge difference.
00:32:33.460 --> 00:32:57.109
Okay, I want you to think back to your last session, could have been this week, um, or last couple sessions, where you saw an interaction between a visionary and an integrator that wasn't working, wasn't healthy, or something that you felt like, wow, I'm gonna have to address this either in person or outside of the session with these two because it's affecting the rest of the team.
00:32:58.359 --> 00:32:58.579
Yeah.
00:32:58.759 --> 00:33:00.200
Well, this one, this one's easy.
00:33:00.609 --> 00:33:05.359
Um, it's a newer team, and I have not taught this team the same page meeting.
00:33:05.829 --> 00:33:21.539
So when they came in, uh, the visionary and integrator starting to go back and forth are, uh, healthy discussion and debate, which is lovely, but I got to watch this little tennis match from the leadership team like you da, da, da, da, da, da, da.
00:33:21.849 --> 00:33:25.849
And it's just a, it's a, it's a waste of time.
00:33:26.279 --> 00:33:29.019
Um, they're not bringing a clear vision in.
00:33:29.019 --> 00:33:32.680
They're-- we're using our session to, for them to get on the same page.
00:33:33.029 --> 00:33:34.220
So that one was easy.
00:33:34.220 --> 00:33:41.769
I'm like,"Oh, so I get to teach you guys the same page meeting thing right now." So we've got a little Zoom call scheduled for tomorrow.
00:33:41.869 --> 00:33:45.509
Oh, that's great, and, and that's-- what an opportunity for them.
00:33:45.740 --> 00:33:55.799
I mean, uh, I mean, seriously, if you-- if you're not having that conversation, um, you're, you're not-- you're not living the-- you're not living the best way you could as a leader.
00:33:56.039 --> 00:34:03.940
And I also think that same page meeting, what I tell folks is it, it, it allows you to have a disarming conversation about things that need to happen.
00:34:04.259 --> 00:34:07.009
I know it's on my calendar, you know it's on yours.
00:34:07.390 --> 00:34:11.159
We know the intent of that is for us to literally get on the same page.
00:34:11.670 --> 00:34:13.659
What an opportunity to write those things down.
00:34:13.900 --> 00:34:17.929
P- I always say share your screen, get it out there, let's go through it.
00:34:17.929 --> 00:34:35.880
Because if you write it down and you know it needs to happen and you share your screen, you're more likely to get it out and not say,"Oh, I'm not gonna talk about this one'cause this one's hard, so we're just gonna, we're just gonna leave that down here." Share your screen, get it out there, say what needs to be said, and, and continue to move forward.
00:34:35.880 --> 00:34:40.010
What a great opportunity to, to teach them something that's gonna impact them.
00:34:40.286 --> 00:35:04.507
Anytime I, uh, an integrator will call me or a visionary will call me, and they're like,"I'm, we're having a hard time in this partnership," my very first question is,"When was your last same page meeting?" And 100% of the time, okay, 1,300 sessions in, 100 companies in, 100% of the time it was either canceled, they forgot about it.
00:35:04.827 --> 00:35:06.376
They, they were like,"Well, we did...
00:35:06.376 --> 00:35:07.047
We didn't have any.
00:35:07.047 --> 00:35:08.476
We talk every day.
00:35:08.507 --> 00:35:11.547
You know, ho, ho, ho, we talk every day." Yeah, that's it.
00:35:11.847 --> 00:35:13.737
So just have your same page meetings.
00:35:13.737 --> 00:35:15.947
It fixes 90% of the issues.
00:35:16.177 --> 00:35:16.567
cool.
00:35:16.597 --> 00:35:21.106
All right, last question around EOS, one of my favorites, um, around tools.
00:35:21.137 --> 00:35:25.536
Everyone knows the tools, not everyone, but those of us in the EOS world know the tools.
00:35:26.126 --> 00:35:37.836
So I, I, I want you to think about either one, one of the tools that you deliver really well, that you feel like,"I, Jill, am very good at teaching this tool." Could be same page meeting, but I'm not gonna let you use that
00:35:37.967 --> 00:35:38.347
No.
00:35:38.746 --> 00:35:38.956
No.
00:35:39.197 --> 00:35:47.266
and then also, um, maybe the hardest one to, to, to move across the line in terms of just getting it to be effective with a team.
00:35:47.487 --> 00:35:51.416
So the one you're best at and maybe the one that is the hardest.
00:35:52.467 --> 00:35:54.336
So, uh, this is interesting.
00:35:54.336 --> 00:36:00.456
I've never been asked the tool I'm best at,'cause I ha- I haven't ever l- really thought about what is the best
00:36:00.967 --> 00:36:01.876
I'll give you an example.
00:36:01.967 --> 00:36:07.367
I was in a session the other day, and I saw someone deliver the cash flow drivers in a way that I'd never seen it before.
00:36:07.396 --> 00:36:13.726
Obviously, the way that they were able to bring it together and tie it together, for me, I was like,"That's really special.
00:36:13.817 --> 00:36:14.516
Really special."
00:36:15.166 --> 00:36:15.597
Yep.
00:36:15.927 --> 00:36:22.317
So, uh, I think I really love teaching the how we discover core values.
00:36:22.317 --> 00:36:27.617
That's a really fun one to do, and it really opens people's eyes.
00:36:28.126 --> 00:36:41.356
I think at the beginning, even though my clients are prepared when they come to the sessions, I think at the beginning they really do feel like core values are just gonna be for the back of the T-shirts, you know, and the coffee mug and the website.
00:36:41.427 --> 00:36:44.106
on the-- Just fills a block.
00:36:44.407 --> 00:36:45.067
the website.
00:36:45.067 --> 00:36:46.887
This is how we get clients.
00:36:47.047 --> 00:36:58.447
Uh, so that's really fun to, um, to walk them through some mindsets of why these core values are at the center of everything we're gonna do.
00:36:58.927 --> 00:37:02.856
And when they see the big picture like that, I really like the aha moments.
00:37:02.987 --> 00:37:03.617
That's so great.
00:37:03.617 --> 00:37:04.896
I've never heard someone say that.
00:37:04.927 --> 00:37:11.697
I mean, obviously, I've been in session and seen it and know the impact of it, but I haven't heard an EOS implementer say that's a...
00:37:11.856 --> 00:37:13.097
I mean, it's like a duh.
00:37:13.097 --> 00:37:13.987
I'm saying it out loud.
00:37:13.987 --> 00:37:15.396
Of course, that would be impactful.
00:37:15.396 --> 00:37:17.106
But the fact that you're able to pull
00:37:17.177 --> 00:37:19.266
And it's really fun, it's really fun to teach.
00:37:19.266 --> 00:37:26.936
Now, the facilitation of this is hard and you, like, it-- This is, you know, why you don't hire a half-assed
00:37:27.027 --> 00:37:28.047
That's exactly right.
00:37:28.617 --> 00:37:34.836
can get really tricky, and the energy of the room can get so positive.
00:37:36.106 --> 00:37:36.547
See, okay?
00:37:36.547 --> 00:37:37.757
Now, I'm a positive coach.
00:37:37.987 --> 00:37:47.896
The energy of the room can get so positive that the exercise can g- run away with the positivity, and then we're not carrying the weight of what we're really going to do with these.
00:37:48.336 --> 00:37:53.657
So, uh, that's, that's another thing that I'm like,"Hmm, I guess I'm pretty...
00:37:53.657 --> 00:38:08.137
Yeah, I'm pretty good at that," is bringing it back to,"Now, you do know we're gonna fire people if they are not these things." And then they have to have a really hard conversation with themselves like,"Will we fire people around it?" Yeah.
00:38:08.472 --> 00:38:09.822
Yes, we absolutely will.
00:38:09.851 --> 00:38:20.391
I, I did it last year with a client, a high performer in the company, and multiple times we kept coming back to the fact that they were, you know, not leading with the best of intentions, and it was a very clear one.
00:38:20.672 --> 00:38:21.391
Very clear one.
00:38:21.391 --> 00:38:21.862
That's awesome.
00:38:21.891 --> 00:38:23.612
Okay, which is the hardest?
00:38:23.641 --> 00:38:29.521
What do you think one of the most challenging tools to get down or, or where you feel like people may struggle?
00:38:29.521 --> 00:38:33.402
Maybe it's not hardest for you to teach it, but it's one that comes up as a sticky point.
00:38:34.197 --> 00:38:37.646
The, the struggling one is the accountability chart.
00:38:38.867 --> 00:38:46.686
Clients will consistently struggle with that if w- if me, as the coach, if I'm not on top of it all the time.
00:38:47.327 --> 00:38:55.536
A couple of things that they, uh, that they do that are squirrely is they will find someone that they really like and they wanna hire them and then create the seat for them.
00:38:56.126 --> 00:38:58.177
Or they c- wanna create...
00:38:58.177 --> 00:39:04.007
They're like,"Oh, Matt says he's ready for a promotion, so we gotta create a seat for him." And I'm like,"Eh.
00:39:04.867 --> 00:39:11.956
Eh." Um, so that's, that's one that I just gotta stay on top of all the time.
00:39:12.052 --> 00:39:15.581
also feel like people love to change the accountability chart.
00:39:15.581 --> 00:39:17.101
It kinda goes off of what you're saying.
00:39:17.101 --> 00:39:24.771
It's like-- And this is a question, and, and everyone has a, I think, a different answer, but how often should, should we be, like, changing it?
00:39:24.862 --> 00:39:33.952
Because I think there are people that can leave an accountability chart in place for too long, and then there's certainly people that can change the accountability chart when the changing of the winds.
00:39:34.577 --> 00:39:34.927
Mm-hmm.
00:39:35.617 --> 00:39:35.827
Yeah.
00:39:36.146 --> 00:39:43.686
Well, it need, it sh- it shifts as often as it needs to, but if we're looking at our five leadership abilities, one of those is structure.
00:39:44.137 --> 00:39:47.056
So we want to make sure we have the right structure.
00:39:47.376 --> 00:39:49.907
If the structure is not working, you gotta change it.
00:39:50.827 --> 00:39:53.186
Here's what I will say also with that, though.
00:39:53.237 --> 00:39:59.297
Some teams are structure happy, and they'll go,"Oh, let's change the structure.
00:39:59.297 --> 00:40:04.507
That will fix our issues," when really they're just not having hard conversations with people.
00:40:05.117 --> 00:40:05.847
They're, uh...
00:40:05.927 --> 00:40:13.657
So structure is sometimes a tool that I see my teams go,"Oh, maybe we'll just add a seat." Okay.
00:40:13.657 --> 00:40:17.777
That's add a seat'cause this guy doesn't wanna do his stuff, so we just add a seat.
00:40:17.871 --> 00:40:18.512
move it around.
00:40:18.817 --> 00:40:20.586
Have a hard conversation with this guy.
00:40:21.217 --> 00:40:24.297
Um, or let's, let's restructure.
00:40:24.297 --> 00:40:26.496
Let's move this pres- person under here.
00:40:26.786 --> 00:40:35.496
So sometimes when I see them wanting to use the accountability chart tool to not be courageous, then I'll go,"Timeout.
00:40:35.726 --> 00:40:36.737
Is it process?
00:40:37.317 --> 00:40:39.317
Is, do we have the right people in the right seat?
00:40:39.367 --> 00:40:51.706
Have we been really great managers to, you know, this event?" Um, and then that sometimes will slow down the structure, changes that sometimes happen too fast.
00:40:52.246 --> 00:40:56.677
And then there's teams who do not want to change their structure, and then
00:40:56.702 --> 00:40:57.172
all.
00:40:57.452 --> 00:40:58.992
And don't-- And then we're not changing it.
00:40:58.992 --> 00:40:59.891
We're not changing it at
00:41:00.686 --> 00:41:00.936
Yep.
00:41:01.146 --> 00:41:06.507
And then I'm like,"Ooh, look, it's a leadership ability." I have the five leadership abilities across the top of my whiteboard.
00:41:06.507 --> 00:41:08.407
I'm like,"It's one of the leadership abilities.
00:41:08.407 --> 00:41:09.666
It might be time.
00:41:10.016 --> 00:41:11.746
We may have outgrown this structure.
00:41:12.556 --> 00:41:18.427
Where we were at$5 million is not where we're gonna get to at 50 million." I know you're a big, a big fan of that.
00:41:18.467 --> 00:41:22.467
Okay.
00:41:22.472 --> 00:41:23.742
And it should be a profound moment.
00:41:23.742 --> 00:41:25.351
It should be something that sticks out to you.
00:41:25.472 --> 00:41:46.762
Um, you know, there's people we come across that give and, and sound advice, and I'm curious if you can pull out some sound advice that you were given either in a good time or a bad time or something that stuck out to you that said,"Hey, this is really good advice, um, I've received from somebody." And, and how-- And do you pass that on, on a regular basis?
00:41:47.297 --> 00:41:47.516
Hmm.
00:41:47.516 --> 00:41:47.626
Mm.
00:41:47.887 --> 00:41:48.447
Yes.
00:41:48.527 --> 00:41:49.646
Uh, this is great.
00:41:49.847 --> 00:41:56.126
When I was, um, when-- Just before I was an EOS implementer, I was president of a CPA firm.
00:41:56.532 --> 00:41:56.922
Oh, wow.
00:41:56.922 --> 00:41:57.362
Okay.
00:41:57.387 --> 00:42:00.867
We were growing and growing and growing, but also hitting the ceiling.
00:42:01.416 --> 00:42:11.146
And my next-door neighbor, on a particularly hard day for me, my business next-door neighbor came outside and he sat next to me.
00:42:11.146 --> 00:42:15.507
I was sitting on the curb,'cause it was one of those days where you just walk out and sit down on the curb.
00:42:16.246 --> 00:42:24.217
And he, he said to me, you know, as I was throwing him my pity party of how life isn't fair and...
00:42:24.987 --> 00:42:28.907
I said,"I'm not very good at this, running a business.
00:42:28.936 --> 00:42:34.556
I guess I'm just not very good at this." And he said to me, this is the best advice.
00:42:34.556 --> 00:42:38.166
He said,"Jill, there is nothing wrong with you.
00:42:39.126 --> 00:42:46.856
There is something wrong with your system." And I love to share that, especially, you know, if visionaries are listening to this podcast.
00:42:47.516 --> 00:42:50.536
Visionaries, there is nothing wrong with you.
00:42:51.286 --> 00:42:59.706
Uh, sometimes EOS is known or there's some, there's some strains of EOS where people will do visionary shaming.
00:43:00.007 --> 00:43:02.117
Like,"Ooh, you don't know how to run a company.
00:43:02.157 --> 00:43:05.456
I have to run it for you." And I, and I feel it.
00:43:05.597 --> 00:43:06.237
I feel it.
00:43:06.237 --> 00:43:07.416
My visionaries feel it.
00:43:07.416 --> 00:43:09.237
And it's like,"No, pause.
00:43:09.606 --> 00:43:11.516
There is nothing wrong with you.
00:43:12.487 --> 00:43:15.016
There's everything right with you.
00:43:15.527 --> 00:43:35.987
There's just something wrong with your system." You, visionary, are brilliant and amazing and capable, and we would-- none of us would be here without you taking a risk and, uh, and being en-enthused about this product or service we're taking to the world for good.
00:43:36.396 --> 00:43:42.396
None of you visionaries wake up and go,"Ooh, I hope to be a hard ass today, and I hope to be,
00:43:42.621 --> 00:43:44.032
Incredibly difficult to be around.
00:43:44.032 --> 00:43:45.061
No, no one says that.
00:43:45.237 --> 00:43:45.606
No.
00:43:45.827 --> 00:43:46.347
No.
00:43:46.376 --> 00:43:47.427
You're amazing.
00:43:47.496 --> 00:43:50.586
So that first line of advice, there's nothing wrong with you.
00:43:51.367 --> 00:43:56.367
And maybe there's something wrong with your system if you're not flourishing, if your life isn't flourishing.
00:43:56.757 --> 00:43:57.356
That's awesome.
00:43:57.666 --> 00:43:58.217
That's awesome.
00:43:58.217 --> 00:43:58.936
Very well said.
00:43:58.936 --> 00:44:03.056
And, you know, we all have our uniquenesses, but I do love what you said about visionaries.
00:44:03.056 --> 00:44:07.887
I talk about it all the time, which is this person's doing their job coming up with 100 ideas.
00:44:07.967 --> 00:44:08.947
That's what they're supposed to.
00:44:08.987 --> 00:44:19.036
It's our job to create a system to-- that we can see those and implement those and push the ones that aren't so great to the, you know, to the back and get the ones that are good to the front.
00:44:19.336 --> 00:44:20.117
That's their job.
00:44:20.117 --> 00:44:21.797
That's what makes them unique and special.
00:44:21.797 --> 00:44:22.947
There's nothing wrong with them.
00:44:23.237 --> 00:44:26.927
We just need to create a system and, and around them, which is
00:44:27.271 --> 00:44:27.961
That's right.
00:44:28.141 --> 00:44:28.711
That's right.
00:44:28.911 --> 00:44:33.112
I have a fun tool that I hand out to my visionaries, and I invented it.
00:44:33.152 --> 00:44:35.472
I'm an artist and a creator myself.
00:44:36.001 --> 00:44:37.081
So here's the tool.
00:44:37.112 --> 00:44:38.942
It's called the Hallucination Journal.
00:44:40.521 --> 00:44:42.001
Yep, it's the best.
00:44:42.391 --> 00:44:51.411
In EOS, we say vision is at the top of the model, traction is at the bottom of the model, and it's by design because vision without traction is just hallucination.
00:44:51.952 --> 00:44:58.581
And then I wait for people to laugh because it's really fun, but sometimes saying that gives hallucination a bad rap.
00:44:58.996 --> 00:44:59.536
Right.
00:44:59.842 --> 00:45:00.132
hand it...
00:45:00.461 --> 00:45:01.961
We need to hallucinate.
00:45:02.146 --> 00:45:02.586
Yeah.
00:45:02.786 --> 00:45:03.297
Yep.
00:45:03.501 --> 00:45:19.041
out these hallucination journals to the visionaries, and the rule is you're only allowed to hallucinate, like put all of your crazy ideas in here, all of your amazing, wonderful, life-changing ideas in this journal, but you can't execute on any of them.
00:45:19.851 --> 00:45:24.952
And what this journal does then is it keeps this hallucination journal is safe.
00:45:25.322 --> 00:45:35.811
I can go in there and think about a hotdog stand, a new version of purple paint, anything I want to, and it's actually a creative exercise to keep visionaries
00:45:36.186 --> 00:45:36.436
It's a
00:45:36.592 --> 00:45:37.492
Now, in the event-
00:45:38.056 --> 00:45:40.626
a safe space to put all your crazy-ass thoughts.
00:45:41.106 --> 00:45:44.226
Um, and I'm, I'm quick to not shut those thoughts down.
00:45:44.536 --> 00:46:00.137
I think I see some people like they-- that, that hallucinization, hallucination comes out and people are like,"Meh." I'm like, I try to be very intentional about my body language, about my response, about the way I'm delivering it, because I don't wanna create a scenario where, uh, people are encouraged to not do that.
00:46:00.186 --> 00:46:01.097
It's quite the opposite.
00:46:01.327 --> 00:46:05.206
Like somebody that had a quote unquote terrible idea, turns out, guess what?
00:46:05.237 --> 00:46:06.646
It was a really badass idea.
00:46:06.907 --> 00:46:09.496
We just needed to get it forward, and they thought it was a terrible one.
00:46:09.496 --> 00:46:10.396
I'm glad they brought it up.
00:46:10.396 --> 00:46:11.197
We never would've been here.
00:46:11.922 --> 00:46:12.472
That's right.
00:46:12.641 --> 00:46:13.121
That's right.
00:46:13.842 --> 00:46:23.481
And then if you do have an idea that ends up into your hallucination journal that you're like,"This is really good," you have to ceremoniously rip the pages out of the journal and put them somewhere else.
00:46:23.626 --> 00:46:24.336
That's cool.
00:46:24.561 --> 00:46:26.331
you always do- It's really fun.
00:46:26.331 --> 00:46:28.561
It's, it's a lot of fun, for sure.
00:46:28.677 --> 00:46:31.237
Jill, I, I have thoroughly enjoyed this.
00:46:31.266 --> 00:46:32.797
Um, I loved having you.
00:46:32.827 --> 00:46:39.246
I love your energy, um, I love your wisdom, and I love that you're, uh, the badass you are,'cause it's fun to watch.
00:46:39.246 --> 00:46:40.356
It's fun to be around.
00:46:40.737 --> 00:46:45.036
And, um, you're, you're a, a great human and a great role model to a lot of us.
00:46:45.036 --> 00:46:49.487
So Thank you for being so, uh, so fun and, and lighthearted.
00:46:50.472 --> 00:46:52.351
You're welcome for being so much fun.
00:46:52.351 --> 00:46:53.652
That's, that's awesome.
00:46:53.652 --> 00:46:54.132
I'll, I'll
00:46:54.356 --> 00:47:00.996
I look forward to seeing you next time I'm up in Dallas, either at one of the EOS events or just up seeing folks.
00:47:00.996 --> 00:47:04.387
But, um, wanted to thank you for joining us today on The Scalability Code.
00:47:04.762 --> 00:47:05.541
Perfect.
00:47:05.592 --> 00:47:07.572
Thank you for having me, Matt.
00:47:07.902 --> 00:47:09.972
Thank you for listening to The Scalability Code.
00:47:10.001 --> 00:47:15.492
If you made it this far, please follow the show on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts.
00:47:15.594 --> 00:47:17.335
Let's get out of the sh*t show together.
00:47:17.364 --> 00:47:19.824
We'll see you next time on The Scalability Code.
