What Does It Really Mean to Build Wealth? | MENtality with Ebuka, Banky W, Kunmi Demuren & Tayo Awogboro

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On today's episode of Mentality with Ebuka, we discuss wealth creation.
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For many young Nigerian men, wealth creation is not just ambition, it is survival and responsibility.
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With my co-host Banky W, as well as entrepreneur, oil and gas and mining expert Tayo Awoboro, and venture capitalist and all-around entrepreneur Kumi Demorin.
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This season of mentality with Abuka is brought to you by Schweppes and the Glen Leavett.
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I mean, there's whiskey, there's trips, there's water.
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It's five o'clock somewhere.
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Or maybe this is how people that have wealth, this is how they act.
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Let me begin advice.
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Let me get the water on ice cream.
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Are you drinking water too?
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Uh no.
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No, but this is very interesting because I was there's always this talk about how you know rich people dress.
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And I like the fact that we have both represented in it.
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So it doesn't, whatever you want to live towards.
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Indeed.
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And who is the guy that is saying has only one t-shirt?
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Mark Zuckerberg.
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Absolutely.
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Do those things matter?
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Sorry, we're talking.
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Let me let me introduce you first of all.
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We're talking wealth creation today, and I think this is a very important conversation to have for a lot of you viewers.
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Um it has nothing to do with anything sensitive.
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Um, or maybe they can get sensitive in some in some way, because well, we might even touch on like wealth distribution and how Nigeria has its own um issues with that.
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But generally, I think it's one conversation you all want to pay attention to because uh we like money, let's be honest with ourselves, and even I want to learn today about how you know I can do better.
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And we have two people who know how to do it because they have done it.
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You want to do the honors.
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Uh heady shout to my mentor, my mentor.
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All right, ladies and gentlemen, welcome to our guests for today.
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You know, when you just see them, you know, say all right, they cry.
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Uh, they're they're fantastic people, and it's an honor to welcome you both to the show.
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We have Mr.
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Tayo Awoboro, who has 20 years in business in oil and gas and mining, and is doing phenomenally well, doing great things as a relatively young man, you know, early 40s.
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Yeah, and um, to my right, I call him my original mentor because when I was originally an engineering student in faraway upstate New York, he was the person that had gone before me and gone to a uh an also illustrious engineering student.
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I beg.
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I know they're watching.
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Um, but we have Mr.
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Kumi DeMoran here, who is a phenomenal businessman, investor, uh, across many different sectors and has registered a lot of success.
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So it's an honor to have you both on the show.
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Welcome, welcome, welcome.
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Thanks for having me.
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We know you're both very busy, so thank you for taking time out to come and speak with us.
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Time is money.
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Indeed.
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Indeed.
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First question anything for your voice because you know they say very derogatory, yeah, but it's also very funny.
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They said Nigeria should be renamed Abekistan.
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Hi, yes, um, because all that's what you hear everywhere now, yeah, and it's a sign of the times, which is why this conversation is very important because people need to know how to get out of this rut that we're in or that we found ourselves in, where it feels like people are trying to figure out you know, how do we do this thing or how do we hack?
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Not even necessarily wealth now, just making money even and standing firm on our feet.
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And a lot of men feel the pressure more because we've had this conversation a lot on this show, this provider tag that we carry, which means the burden is heavy on guys to be able to do things a certain way.
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Yeah, and I think I just want to start with the thought process and the mindset that a lot of people have, because most times they say these things are mindset.
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Yeah, if you can we can we have them maybe just give us a 30-second, one minute just context on their what they do and what they do, and just give us a little bit of insights as to their business journey, and then we can get into the mindset, just so that people who are watching because the thing about people like this is that they are not loud.
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So people might like it.
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So people might come in the channel and be like, who did they bring?
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Be careful.
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So if you don't mind like sharing, just actually yeah, give us a peek into your world, like what are some of the things that you do that you've invested in?
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What's some of the success that you've had just for a minute, and then we can we can get into it.
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Do we have all day?
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Yeah, yeah.
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No, thanks, thanks, Banks, and uh Abel Kai.
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Really great seeing you guys here again.
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Um, thanks for inviting us.
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This is really such an important uh uh discussion topic um because it cuts across, and we really need to start reshaping the thinking of the young generation.
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Um, because I'm a chemical engineer by training.
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A lot of people don't believe that because I've just ventured into business.
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Everything else.
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And you know, but once upon a time, I used to be in lab coats in the US doing RD.
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Um, so I learned to build things at a very, very early stage of my career.
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Um, taking ideas and taking it all the way through into commercial viable products.
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Uh so I thought um experience was very, very valuable.
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Um, so did chemical engineering, worked in the US for about 10 years, and then um sometime around 20 uh 7008, during the recession in the US, just said to myself, hey, listen, there's many massive opportunities in Nigeria.
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Um, and you know, we could leverage some of the experiences we've had.
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And so um teamed up with my uh partner, um, shout out to Bumi Aki Amidji, who was back there in Michigan, you know, building systems.
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He had a lot of IPs then.
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You know, in fact, when he was a junior in his third year in university, he already had about 300 people that he hired.
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Wow.
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Created a company right in university and hired 300 people, and it was the only black person.
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Oh, wow.
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In Fireway, Michigan.
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So, I mean, I saw the success stories and I'm like, listen, we could replicate this multiple times in Africa, right?
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I mean, US, you know, you're optimizing, you know, for the 1%, going from 99% to 100%.
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Meanwhile, in Africa, there's massive opportunities of broken systems that uh, you know, that needs fixing.
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So we came, we teamed up, we came back to Nigeria and you know, um, we started building companies, companies that solve problems around data and payment systems.
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Because the truth of the matter is, you know, if you want to do research, get into business, you need data.
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But there isn't just you know availability of data anywhere that's credible.
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You could ask the same question to three different people who work in the same place, they'll give you two different sets of data.
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Right?
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So, how how do you create a uh single source of truth data systems, you know, and also that's we got into that business, of course, payment systems, because you know, frankly, you do work and then after you deliver the work, the guy doesn't want to pay you.
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So, how do you get away from the honor system and begging people and you know, and just have some automated system where it says, hey, we agree to this, once I do my part, the money hits my account.
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You know, but it it starts with you know system building and you had to go and build at infrastructure level with the payment systems in Nigeria.
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So we started out very, very early.
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When was that even a thing?
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Right.
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And um, you know, fast forward, we're very, you know, we had some success.
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Um, and then the question was how do we then um empower other people to start doing the same things?
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Because yes, you can be you know good and great and successful by yourself, but you know that a tree doesn't make it for us, right?
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So, how do you empower other people to do the same thing?
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So you actually now build an ecosystem, right?
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And that's actually, you know, I tell people that's more insurance for yourself.
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Because if you have other people that surround you that are successful, there's less likely they're gonna be wiped out by you know a um uh recession event, for example.
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So we set out looking for young people, started with people that worked with us, who we knew and we trusted, and we saw their competence and we saw their potential, and we just backed them with capital.
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And so Greenhouse Capital was born.
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And you know, today we have about 65 companies in the portfolio doing everything from FinTech.
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Sorry, you say you say 65 company.
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It's not bread that you have to say 65 companies, 65 companies um uh across uh some 12 or 13 countries in Africa.
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So um is it something that's still going on?
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It is still going.
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Because these are the kind of things that people if they're watching are gonna be like, oh, how do I, you know, what's going on?
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It's a going concern, you know, companies in Nigeria, in Kenya, South Africa, in Dubai.
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Um, and we've had a lot of different successes.
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So not just locally grown companies doing things in their localities, but they've started in Nigeria, for example, and then they've expanded into Kenya.
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They've started in South Africa and now they're in um you know in Ghana, or companies in Nigeria also investing in in Qatar, right?
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So um a lot of you know successes.
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That's amazing.
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Thanks.
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Thae, if you give us a bit of yours.
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Okay.
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Um, so I'm by trade, um, I'm an economist.
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Um, that's what I studied in school and university.
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And then um from there I transitioned into commodities.
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Um, I started as an oil trader, so I worked in a company which you know, Owando.
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Okay.
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So I was there for like uh eight years.
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Um I ended up being like the head trader in the UK um office, and then I left to set up to help um somebody set up his UK and um Swiss uh trading business, a company called ITEO.
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So I was there for like three, four years.
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Wow.
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And then um I started my own business in 2015 um with a Swiss trading company.
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Um we started doing oil uh terminals business.
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Um we ran that for like three, four years, but then they decided to leave Nigeria.
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So my partner and I took over the business.
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Um we've been running it ever since together.
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Um, but you know, uh oil and gas, it's very heavily regulated in Nigeria and it's something that the government controls a lot.
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And it was just becoming a bit frustrating for us because we had you know ideas and wanted to go in a different direction, and we're not able to express ourselves the way we wanted.
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So we decided to diversify into the mineral sector because we said, you know, what's going to be the end of oil?
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It's gonna be minerals.
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So we might as well get in there as soon as possible and learn it because when you want to pivot to a new business, it takes you time.
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You first need to learn, then you need to master before you can even really bring out the confidence in yourself to start expressing yourself and doing what you want to do.
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So we got in there, learned early mistakes, invested a lot.
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So we were basically putting our uh oil profits into our mineral business.
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Um, because there's not data, as he says.
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Data is very hard to get.
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And you know, what we saw is that Nigeria is quite well mineralized when we talk about you know, mineral sector, critical minerals.
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Very well mineralized.
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Probably the most diverse in terms of mineralization in Africa.
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But where we struggle is how much do we have in terms of quantity?
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So, what we try to do is, at least in our own small little ecosystem, try to de-risk as many assets as possible, try to know how much value is in the ground before we do start to extract.
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So we're focused on precious metals, gold, uh, and then industrial metals, um, tin, lead, zinc, and then a little bit of silver and copper.
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Um, so that's where we are, and then we're looking at some cold chain um because we feel like there's a real gap in Nigeria in terms of you know food preservation and all of that.
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So we're looking at that and taking that quite seriously.
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So that's me in a nutshell.
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Amazing.
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That's some serious money.
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No, just no, and I think what what I gleaned from both situations or both scenarios is the fact that you guys have done things that weren't easy.
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I'm trying to use very simple terms here.
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Yeah, and it's not very often you find people who are not scared to try things, and most times when you speak with people who have been successful in some way, you always find that it does the ability to conquer that fear or take a risk.
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Yeah, and we hear that a lot.
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Um, so is the mindset, which was the first question I wanted to ask, where you know, where does that mindset come from?
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And I'm gonna ask this as a Nigerian because Nigerians see people who are wealthy and automatically believe there's some privilege or you had some insurance to fall back on anyway, which is why they in their situation cannot take certain risks.
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So, where does the mindset come from?
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Insurance or not, or fallback plan or not?
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Is there a mindset that needs to be had to get to that point where you can say, okay, I want to start this journey, you know, to be successful, to be wealthy?
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Um but I need to start thinking a certain way, regardless of what the risks are or the pitfalls might be.
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If you know, I don't know if I'm making sense, but the mindset shift that needs to happen, regardless of whatever the cover might look like.
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Because we wouldn't not many people believe in the grass to create story, right?
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Yeah, I guess is what I'm asking.
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Yeah.
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No, um that's that's uh that's a billion-dollar question is you know, what's that mentality that can catapult you from being an income earner to a wealth builder?
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Right, and because you don't see too many of the success stories of people starting from scratch, or smartly people think, oh, you just need to, you know, to uh get one contract, know one politician, you know.
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Well, that's those are the stories we hear, right?
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One contract and and you know, boom, I mean you actually don't even need to be accountable for it, and you know, you just arrive, right?
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Um, but but the truth of the matter is most sustainable businesses have a they have a pathway, there's a roadmap, and you can't escape that.
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First of all, you need to have this um big thinking mentality.
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Um, you know, what you're building, what you're doing has to be able to serve, you know, uh it has to be able to serve beyond just your own locality if you're looking for real skill, right?
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Because really skill is what determines business success long term.
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The other thing for me is discipline.
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And for me, discipline is that one is key.
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You have to a lot of people you know say they want wealth, but they can't do the work, the hard work that requires you to obtain wealth and sustain wealth.
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It is real hard work.
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It is waking up when you don't want to, is you know, doing the right thing at the right time, whether you feel like you feel like or not, is getting up and and building when people are lazy.
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It is, you know, putting your heart and soul into something whenever they are complaining.
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You know, it is showing up when everybody has left the room.
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You know, those things and consistency, you have to do it day in and day out.
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That's how you build through the DNA that then creates wealth.
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So for me, you know, discipline is key.
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There's also the timing element because you can have a great idea, you gotta have all the discipline in the world, but your ideas are just too early.
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Yeah.
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And so what do you do in that time?
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Right?
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A lot of people just give up and say, oh, well, you know, um, I'm just unlucky and all.
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But you know, if you read a lot of the stories of great men that have built systems, I mean, even in the US, the Carnegie's and the um, you know, um, the Rockefellers and the Fords, I mean, they had a thousand failures because their technologies and their ideas were too early for the time, but they didn't give up, right?
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You have to have that big thinking mentality, you have to be able to transition transition from thinking from days into decades.
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Right?
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So I have a question, and maybe you can loop it into what you're about to say because you uh started uh working, like you said you're working for Owando, um, and you when you graduated university, there's this there's this idea that you know I go to school so that I can get a great job.
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I can't win that degree.
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You know what I'm saying?
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So when do you switch the thinking from earning salary to owning to equity to assets?
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Like what what was the moment that made you say, ah, you know what?
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I I can go beyond just going to work nine to five every day working for somebody into owning something for myself.
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And I want to be clear that the entrepreneurship lifestyle is not for everybody, it's not for everybody, it comes with its own you know, heartaches and challenges.
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Yeah, but for the people that that think that it's for them, tell me what that was like for you.
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Like was it a shift or was it each that's always been a good thing?
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You would have said earning your salary and I made that decision at like 12 years old.
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Really?
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Yeah, I was sitting, I was sitting on a I was in a car ride.
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We're going to the village with one of my uncles, and he was he was the owner of a bank.
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So he was just like talking to me about what do I want.
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That's a different level.
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So he was like asking me, What do you want to be, and all those things, and you know, he just blew my mind just how big, you know, and his the his vision of the world and everything.
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And I just decided that day and there I wanted to be a businessman.
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And you know, um, I think the most important thing to have that wealth is the resilience.
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Because, as you said, you know, all shapes and sizes, different seasons, you'll see it in business, and you have to be able to weather all those storms.
00:17:25.680 --> 00:17:26.319
That's one.
00:17:26.480 --> 00:17:30.160
Two, you know, what my parents told me earlier is go with your passion.
00:17:30.480 --> 00:17:33.039
Because when things are bad, you still stick with it.
00:17:33.279 --> 00:17:35.440
When you don't care about something, it's just about the money.
00:17:35.599 --> 00:17:38.559
The reason the minute things don't look good, you're out the door.
00:17:38.880 --> 00:17:39.119
Right?
00:17:39.200 --> 00:17:44.880
But if you're passionate about something, you'll just keep trying and trying and trying until you get to where you want to get to.
00:17:45.119 --> 00:17:45.680
Uh, yeah.
00:17:45.759 --> 00:17:48.079
So the resilience for me is the most important thing.
00:17:48.319 --> 00:17:53.440
Um, trying to think outside of the box is the most a very important trait.
00:17:53.920 --> 00:17:59.200
Um, but that takes time, and you know, you have to give yourself the confidence to get there.
00:17:59.279 --> 00:17:59.440
Yeah.
00:18:00.400 --> 00:18:05.039
I think it's very interesting what you said there because we had an earlier episode on mentorship.
00:18:05.519 --> 00:18:14.400
And I think that strikes me on that note of the kind of people you surround yourself with, or even as a parent now, the kind of people you surround your children with.
00:18:14.480 --> 00:18:14.880
Yeah.
00:18:15.039 --> 00:18:18.079
Um, an uncle saying something sparks something, yeah.
00:18:18.319 --> 00:18:20.480
Family friend doing something sparks something.
00:18:20.559 --> 00:18:20.720
Yeah.
00:18:20.960 --> 00:18:24.400
And mentorship is not until the person is carrying you along everywhere.
00:18:24.480 --> 00:18:28.880
Sometimes it's just those moments where you're like, oh and you had a shift.
00:18:29.279 --> 00:18:30.960
And I think that was just very interesting.
00:18:31.039 --> 00:18:35.839
But I wanted to ask about you know this, because I like to keep things realistic with Nigeria, right?
00:18:35.920 --> 00:18:41.920
It's where it feels like we are we there's a belief that things are stacked against you here.
00:18:43.119 --> 00:18:45.920
Um maybe even start with you now.
00:18:46.000 --> 00:18:52.799
Because we're in an industry, we all hear about this mining thing, but it just feels very we the stories are here.
00:18:53.119 --> 00:18:55.200
Oh, the Chinese have captured Safara.
00:18:55.359 --> 00:19:02.240
Yeah, the Chinese have captured all these mines, and even if you're gonna go, you have to get all of these licenses and state governments are in the way.
00:19:02.400 --> 00:19:08.559
I hear a lot of stories about how it works, but you've gone in, in spite of all of that.
00:19:08.720 --> 00:19:12.400
So it's like how do you decide?
00:19:12.960 --> 00:19:20.079
You know, I wanted to rule off a very quick statistic here about just the mindset of men.
00:19:20.319 --> 00:19:26.559
So for a lot of young people in Nigeria, the belief is statistically unlikely to succeed to be wealthy, right?
00:19:26.960 --> 00:19:29.440
And we all talk about this connection mentality we have here.
00:19:29.519 --> 00:19:31.039
Uh, who will help you?
00:19:31.279 --> 00:19:36.319
You know, three of the richest Nigerians are worth it at 83 million Nigerians.
00:19:36.640 --> 00:19:37.200
Yeah.
00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:45.839
When you have that sort of society where there's a belief that it can never be made or I can never surmount on that level, you surmounted that.
00:19:45.920 --> 00:19:47.680
You've also sort of diversified into things.
00:19:47.920 --> 00:19:51.119
You've gone from tech, you are doing food, you're farming, you know.
00:19:51.359 --> 00:19:55.599
It's like, how do you get to that point where you're almost like nothing is impossible?
00:19:55.839 --> 00:20:01.200
So, like, you know, I would like to speak on the first thing that you said, which is like the lack of belief in Nigeria.
00:20:01.359 --> 00:20:07.920
I think one thing, I think we underestimate the psychological effect lack of light has had on Nigerians.
00:20:08.880 --> 00:20:09.039
Right?
00:20:10.880 --> 00:20:15.039
Over over decades, you think about it, people every day your TV goes off.
00:20:15.119 --> 00:20:16.799
So why would you believe that it would stay on?
00:20:18.160 --> 00:20:21.759
So I think that in the long term has affected people and their belief system.
00:20:22.079 --> 00:20:28.240
But for me, like, as you said, like maybe I had some advantages in life, but you have to make the most of what you get.
00:20:28.559 --> 00:20:28.799
Right?
00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:34.720
So it was always, even though you get a head start in life, it's what you make of it, right?
00:20:35.039 --> 00:20:40.240
I've had friends that have had better opportunities and have not made anything of it.
00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:41.920
So it's really how you attack life.
00:20:42.319 --> 00:20:43.039
Come on, what do you think?
00:20:43.200 --> 00:20:44.720
No, I I think uh it's pot on.
00:20:44.799 --> 00:20:54.960
I think, you know, being at uh being a VC, I get to see a lot of different people um, you know, come and pitch and have business ideas.
00:20:55.200 --> 00:21:03.359
And very often the formula for success is not the person who has privilege or who has the best ideas.
00:21:03.599 --> 00:21:07.440
It's often about things like hunger, right?
00:21:07.680 --> 00:21:09.039
Things like humility.
00:21:09.839 --> 00:21:19.519
And those for for us, when we looked at the data, are the formula that actually would keep you um going and possibly successful long term.
00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:20.799
And where do you get most of this?
00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:22.799
It's from the guys who are not privileged.
00:21:23.119 --> 00:21:30.079
I mean, I often say, listen, my driver's kid probably has a huge advantage from a hunger standpoint by my own kids.
00:21:31.119 --> 00:21:36.480
So if I was to put both of if I was to give both of them opportunities, who would I back with capital?
00:21:36.640 --> 00:21:38.319
Like I see if you are saying, hmm, yeah.
00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:41.119
Absolutely.
00:21:41.200 --> 00:21:46.559
I mean, you can't compare the hot the hustling mentality of somebody who's hawking on the road, you know.
00:21:46.799 --> 00:21:48.480
But does that does that translate to success?
00:21:48.720 --> 00:21:56.559
Absolutely, because the discipline, and that's where discipline comes in resilience, resilience, grits to be anything in Nigeria.
00:21:56.640 --> 00:21:59.039
Nigeria is not rice and beans, it's tough.
00:21:59.279 --> 00:22:03.839
I mean, the Policies are stacked up against you, the environment is hostile and toxic.
00:22:04.000 --> 00:22:06.720
You need somebody who's already lived that every single day.
00:22:07.279 --> 00:22:21.920
So, can you point to because the the thing that I know that we're going to get is people will be like, eh, you know, you easily for you to say that because your children are not never going to struggle for food, or you know what I mean?
00:22:22.079 --> 00:22:32.799
So especially because you've had experience where you've invested in a bunch of companies, can you give us like do grass-to-grace stories really exist in Nigeria?
00:22:33.279 --> 00:22:38.880
Is it possible for somebody off of the strength of their ideas and their humility and their hard work and their resilience?
00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:54.720
Yeah, is it possible for somebody to start from nothing and build to a point where somebody like you sees it and says, This is worth backing, and you back it, and then it so does that exist in your in your portfolio of companies?
00:22:54.960 --> 00:22:55.119
Absolutely.
00:22:55.359 --> 00:22:58.000
And we have a couple, not just one, not just two, not just three.
00:22:58.400 --> 00:23:00.319
Um, you know, we have companies.
00:23:00.480 --> 00:23:10.720
I mean, there's about four unicorns in Nigeria, as you know, and we backed at least uh two of them, one with cash and the other with mentorship, and they're doing extremely well.
00:23:10.799 --> 00:23:14.400
And these guys didn't, you know, they were not born with a silver spoon in their mouth.
00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:17.599
And today they're they're over a billion dollars in valuation.
00:23:17.759 --> 00:23:27.039
So it exists, and there are many, many more beyond you know, just those unicorns that are worth a hundred million dollars that are worth 10 million dollars that are worth in the same Nigeria.
00:23:27.759 --> 00:23:34.640
You know, the thing that's you know, I often tell people is don't be deceived by the hype because true wealth whispers.
00:23:35.119 --> 00:23:35.599
Yeah, right?
00:23:35.759 --> 00:23:37.599
Poverty noise.
00:23:37.759 --> 00:23:39.200
Yeah, can you say that line?
00:23:40.400 --> 00:23:42.480
There's a lot of noise, too much noise.
00:23:45.200 --> 00:23:50.000
True wealth whispers, poverty makes sense that will be said very, very clearly.
00:23:50.160 --> 00:23:50.720
Sorry, go on.
00:23:51.359 --> 00:23:55.039
So so it a lot of what you I'm not shooting anybody, but I might be.
00:23:55.920 --> 00:24:08.960
Um a lot of what you don't see um are people who are making it in the background quietly, who are building systems, who are running systems that a lot of the consumers that are majority depend on every day.
00:24:09.039 --> 00:24:12.480
Yeah, and you have to decide and pick what side you want to be on.
00:24:12.640 --> 00:24:14.799
Do you want to be a consumer or do you want to be a producer?
00:24:14.960 --> 00:24:19.359
I mean, even this show with social media content, I mean, there's millions of people that will be consuming it.
00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:22.000
The question is, are you part of the guys producing it?
00:24:22.160 --> 00:24:22.400
Right.
00:24:22.559 --> 00:24:22.799
Right?
00:24:22.880 --> 00:24:30.160
And there are a lot of people doing it quietly with humility, particularly people who have seen, you know, poverty and hunger.
00:24:30.240 --> 00:24:30.400
Yeah.
00:24:30.640 --> 00:24:30.960
Right?
00:24:31.119 --> 00:24:32.960
And don't want to ever return to it.
00:24:33.359 --> 00:24:33.599
Right.
00:24:33.680 --> 00:24:38.720
But of course, I'm not saying that that is the general norm because you need guidance, you need structure.
00:24:38.799 --> 00:24:39.119
Yeah.
00:24:39.279 --> 00:24:49.599
Um, you know, we've we've seen you know, people who have come um being successful, but because they didn't have the right value system and all, they squandered it and they went right back to where they came from.
00:24:49.920 --> 00:24:50.240
Right.
00:24:50.400 --> 00:24:57.519
So you also need that kind of you know, the the values, the mentorship to be able to manage success.
00:24:57.680 --> 00:24:58.079
Yeah, yeah.
00:24:58.240 --> 00:25:00.000
But it is possible and it's happening every day.
00:25:00.079 --> 00:25:10.079
Yeah, even on the oil and gas side, on the downstream side, a lot of the owners of big oil and gas uh downstream companies today, they were truck drivers before.
00:25:10.640 --> 00:25:10.880
Really?
00:25:11.119 --> 00:25:12.079
Yes, yes.
00:25:12.400 --> 00:25:12.960
Really?
00:25:13.200 --> 00:25:14.000
A lot of them.
00:25:14.880 --> 00:25:15.599
Are you serious?
00:25:15.920 --> 00:25:16.880
Yes, right?
00:25:17.119 --> 00:25:21.279
So you cannot tell me that rights to riches, yes, they call them baranders.
00:25:21.599 --> 00:25:26.000
So they sell they sell tickets a hawk, and those guys, they're owners of the companies today.
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:27.200
So rights to riches exist.
00:25:27.839 --> 00:25:31.359
What you don't see in Nigeria is rich people having rich kids.
00:25:31.920 --> 00:25:35.519
What a big really one like this.
00:25:35.680 --> 00:25:39.519
How many times unless, like, okay, let well, unless but who's just saying the wealth?
00:25:39.759 --> 00:25:45.920
It's actually it's actually very controversial because the richest Nigerian guys are rich kids, Dangote or Ted Ola Boa.
00:25:46.240 --> 00:25:49.200
Yes, they are, but they are normally compared to their friends.
00:25:49.359 --> 00:25:52.160
Most of their friends came from wealth and didn't do anything with the wealth.
00:25:52.240 --> 00:25:53.599
Your friends are just catching screens, right?
00:25:54.160 --> 00:25:54.720
Sorry, sorry.
00:25:55.039 --> 00:25:56.160
That's an interesting point.
00:25:56.319 --> 00:25:56.799
Yeah, yeah.
00:25:56.880 --> 00:26:03.039
And and you know, to to um Tyo's point, uh, that's really one of the issues that we have in Africa in general.
00:26:03.440 --> 00:26:14.720
You can't really point to more than a handful of companies that are owned by Africans that have survived more than 50 years, just 50 years, correct, that are 100% owned by Africans.
00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:19.359
The ones that you see that are over 50 years are multinationals, yeah, Lebanese and Indian businesses.
00:26:19.680 --> 00:26:21.519
I didn't want to mention names, but you don't have that in Iran.
00:26:21.759 --> 00:26:22.400
So why is that?
00:26:22.559 --> 00:26:34.960
Why, why, why have we why have we not been able to transition wealth and to build sustainable companies and sustainable systems where we can point to something that has lasted the test of time?
00:26:35.119 --> 00:26:42.079
What is it about us that ends up failing somewhere along the way in trying to sustain these systems?
00:26:42.319 --> 00:26:57.039
I couldn't tell you categorically, but I would say our polygamous culture plays a role because what you're going to do is I was not expecting a million ways to answer that, but that is not what I think about.
00:26:57.599 --> 00:27:00.720
Most of us we come from like one or two generations of polygamy, right?
00:27:01.039 --> 00:27:03.759
One of your grandfathers or somebody would have had two wives, right?
00:27:03.839 --> 00:27:07.039
So when you grow up in that environment, trust is a wives and a cocky, right?
00:27:07.200 --> 00:27:10.880
Don't tell these people this, don't tell these people that so in Nigeria we don't trust.
00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:15.759
You know, one thing I like about this industry is that he's so open, he's so open to ideas and everything.
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:17.920
I don't get that with most Nigerian businessmen.
00:27:18.000 --> 00:27:20.079
They don't want to tell you anything, they want to hide the ideas.
00:27:20.319 --> 00:27:20.960
That one is very true.
00:27:21.119 --> 00:27:24.799
And then you don't collaborate, you don't learn new things, you just stay where you are.
00:27:25.039 --> 00:27:27.440
So, you know, I think it's a lack of trust.
00:27:28.079 --> 00:27:37.599
What do you think, I think also um, with the older generation, just because of how they earn their wealth, they're usually just stuck in the traditional ways of doing things.
00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:42.480
And as you know, you know, if anything, technology has taught us that things change all the time.
00:27:42.559 --> 00:27:44.720
Yeah, you have to constantly keep learning.
00:27:44.799 --> 00:27:47.039
Yeah, you have to be building systems around you.
00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:55.440
So I think the lack of building systems, the lack of embracing new ideas has just naturally allowed some of these really great companies to just die out.
00:27:55.599 --> 00:27:57.119
And it's just a natural transition.
00:27:57.279 --> 00:28:02.720
You go from, you know, um uh back in the day, the walkman, you know, it doesn't exist anymore.
00:28:03.039 --> 00:28:03.359
Blackberry.
00:28:03.599 --> 00:28:04.160
The Blackberry.
00:28:04.480 --> 00:28:11.119
And you know, so yeah, these things will naturally go extinct if you're not on the you know, kind of cutting edge of innovation.
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:23.599
I like that you've gone there because that was actually my next question to you in particular, because you worked in this VC space and tech is the way the world is changing, you know, like AI is about to finish all of us.
00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:25.440
We don't even know what to do anymore.
00:28:25.680 --> 00:28:32.640
You know, I we know that we and we keep hearing all of this talk about uh Africa being the next frontier.
00:28:32.799 --> 00:28:34.640
I'm being tired of hearing that, you know.
00:28:35.119 --> 00:28:40.880
And we talked about how wealth doesn't seem to be sustainable, but there's also the question of why isn't wealth spreading.
00:28:42.160 --> 00:28:51.119
And the catalyst we've heard a lot is tech might be that catalyst because we're going to leapfrog a lot of these other bars because tech levels the playing field.
00:28:51.200 --> 00:29:01.119
Yeah, we've seen a lot of startups here in Nigeria, but it's still not on it's on a level where you know it's doing enough.
00:29:02.319 --> 00:29:09.279
But I guess my question is you know, there's we we have the largest youth population on the continent, and maybe I don't know about the world, but at least on the continent we do.
00:29:09.519 --> 00:29:14.480
So the the human capital is there for things to start shifting.
00:29:14.640 --> 00:29:15.680
What are some of the trends?
00:29:15.759 --> 00:29:19.839
If I'm a young person now who's trying to say, okay, where am I going to be looking at?
00:29:20.000 --> 00:29:27.200
Because there's a there's a tendency for I don't say Nigerians, for people to want to do things because it has worked.
00:29:27.359 --> 00:29:28.319
Everybody now goes to that.
00:29:28.960 --> 00:29:34.000
Ah, 19 they sell all of us are going to go and mining straight to Australia.
00:29:35.200 --> 00:29:39.440
How do we what's the way to make money in the coming years?
00:29:41.839 --> 00:29:42.400
Back in the days.
00:29:42.640 --> 00:29:45.839
As a young man, if I'm watching, I just want to hear ah, this is what I should start looking at.
00:29:46.240 --> 00:29:49.759
And then we understand, okay, I need to be disciplined, I need to be resilient, I need to wait two, three, five years.
00:29:49.839 --> 00:29:50.799
But what am I waiting for?
00:29:51.200 --> 00:30:04.880
Yeah, and and if I can if I can piggyback and just add something onto this question, how does a young person today or I should say, how do you train your mind to recognize the opportunity?
00:30:05.440 --> 00:30:10.880
How do you decipher that this is a problem that needs to be like, are you watching trends?
00:30:11.119 --> 00:30:13.039
Are you seeing inefficiencies in society?
00:30:13.119 --> 00:30:19.359
Like, because people are going to tune into this show from people that have created wealth, looking for what's the playbook?
00:30:19.440 --> 00:30:20.720
Like, how do I approach this?
00:30:20.799 --> 00:30:31.759
I'm a young person today, I'm humble, I'm hardworking, I'm going to be resilient, I'm going to do all of these, I'm going to be consistent, but how do I even know you know what pathway?
00:30:32.079 --> 00:30:33.759
Where do I how do I get into it?
00:30:33.839 --> 00:30:34.880
Like, what am I looking for?
00:30:34.960 --> 00:30:38.240
How do I how does my mind know where to to focus on?
00:30:38.400 --> 00:30:40.960
Yeah, this is also a very complex uh question.
00:30:41.279 --> 00:30:44.720
I know I'm sorry because if we had the answers, then we'll all be billionaires, right?
00:30:45.279 --> 00:30:47.119
Um I thought I was going to get the answer.
00:30:51.440 --> 00:30:52.640
Mentality with every card.
00:30:54.960 --> 00:30:56.240
So I found the key.
00:30:57.680 --> 00:30:59.839
The truth of the matter is that there's no one single answer.
00:30:59.920 --> 00:31:02.640
You know, it's also it also depends on the scenario and the situation.
00:31:02.799 --> 00:31:04.640
But I'll just try to give some some scenarios.
00:31:04.799 --> 00:31:05.039
Okay.
00:31:05.279 --> 00:31:12.720
So um, first things first, and I get that question all the time when we mention a lot of young people, you know, and the question is that listen, do I go to university?
00:31:12.880 --> 00:31:13.920
Do I go to school?
00:31:14.000 --> 00:31:16.880
Yeah, do I just you know uh do a course on the side?
00:31:17.039 --> 00:31:19.279
Do I focus on a vacation on a vocation?
00:31:19.599 --> 00:31:20.720
True, you know, questions.
00:31:21.039 --> 00:31:23.440
And you know, there's no right or wrong answer.
00:31:23.599 --> 00:31:31.839
I think one thing I usually just advise young people is whatever you're doing, make sure it is somewhat tech enabled.
00:31:32.640 --> 00:31:37.359
So you can be in construction, but are you using construction tech?
00:31:38.079 --> 00:31:44.640
Are you still tying those reback cables by hand, or is it some type of device with a gun that can tie it up in three seconds?
00:31:44.880 --> 00:31:50.720
So instead of you know spending half a day doing like you know, just a small area, you can do it in 10 minutes.
00:31:52.480 --> 00:31:54.240
Whatever you're doing, make sure it's tech and need.
00:31:54.640 --> 00:31:56.240
Make sure it's no matter because it's inevitable.
00:31:56.480 --> 00:31:58.240
Absolutely, even in entertainments, right?
00:31:58.319 --> 00:32:03.200
In the creatives, tech is just an enhancer of value and a multiplier.
00:32:03.359 --> 00:32:14.960
So I told you, whatever you need to do, whatever your passion is, make sure there is that tech angle that can because it's only with tech that you can, you know, get the advantage for the future and scale, right?
00:32:15.200 --> 00:32:31.359
Yeah, so that's that's that's a very, very good one because I I'm in a space where I keep feeling like I don't know if I need tech enablements or if I'm gonna even lose my job completely because of what AI is doing.
00:32:31.519 --> 00:32:36.079
And we hear a lot that media is one of the first to be threatened with this, you know.
00:32:36.640 --> 00:32:39.200
And I keep wondering what that looks like for someone like me.
00:32:40.079 --> 00:32:47.119
Or engineers, I even hear sometimes like do we really need maybe we just need someone in an office pushing buttons, everything else is gonna be done by people.
00:32:47.359 --> 00:32:49.519
So is that not is that not scary?
00:32:49.920 --> 00:32:55.680
Yeah, I mean, it is for the future of the world, but you know, here is my take on it, right?
00:32:55.920 --> 00:33:02.160
Um I don't usually bother myself with things I can't control, right?
00:33:02.319 --> 00:33:04.559
So, what the world is going to be is going to be.
00:33:04.720 --> 00:33:08.000
Um, but I just take little nuggets of the areas I can control.
00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:12.799
For example, with what you talk about, you know, with AI disrupting media, yeah.
00:33:12.960 --> 00:33:17.119
You know, you can have um, you know, an AI version of yourself, right?
00:33:17.359 --> 00:33:20.960
Doing the show without you, and then someone's writing the script, and probably even better.
00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:22.400
AI is smarter and better.
00:33:22.960 --> 00:33:24.559
It's just gonna be it won't be stammering.
00:33:25.039 --> 00:33:25.599
Exactly.
00:33:25.920 --> 00:33:29.279
Better than the three, looking better, better, right?
00:33:29.599 --> 00:33:31.039
The shape of Will be sharp, absolutely.
00:33:31.599 --> 00:33:33.279
It's just good and big, right?
00:33:34.319 --> 00:33:42.400
But but you could use that as to your advantage to help you um you know do more with less, right?
00:33:42.480 --> 00:33:44.480
And that's what I think technology allows you to do.
00:33:44.799 --> 00:33:49.440
It allows you to multiply yourself, it allows you to be the best version of yourself, right?
00:33:49.599 --> 00:33:56.880
It allows you to you know get away from the mundane things that will take time and start focusing on the more strategic things that actually create value.
00:33:56.960 --> 00:33:57.680
Yeah, right.
00:33:57.839 --> 00:34:02.880
So if you're going to write the script for this show for the next 10 episodes, hey, I can do it for you in 10 minutes.
00:34:03.119 --> 00:34:10.079
Or less if you have a fast computer and the data works, right?
00:34:10.239 --> 00:34:24.880
But but uh but that advantage now um gives you more to be able to take to producers and sponsors, yeah, because now you can walk in and say I have a 24 um episode uh package ready to go, right?
00:34:25.119 --> 00:34:27.519
And that puts more money in your pockets, yeah, right.
00:34:27.599 --> 00:34:32.239
So I look at it as it being an enabler, a multiplier of value, yeah.
00:34:32.400 --> 00:34:38.159
Um, and yeah, and just obviously being open, uh talking to people, seeing what things are doing.
00:34:38.320 --> 00:34:41.440
Because once again, if you're an island, you are going to fail by yourself.
00:34:41.679 --> 00:34:42.480
Yeah, right.
00:34:42.559 --> 00:34:50.719
Yeah, so I mean, uh, I would just what I would add to that is like with technology, you're it's you're right, it's scary.
00:34:51.039 --> 00:34:53.679
But I think the way I look at it, life is just about perspective.
00:34:53.840 --> 00:35:04.239
We in Africa, we have the advantage of seeing it play out in the rest of the world, kind of like how COVID played out, and obviously our COVID experience was much better than the rest of the world, right?
00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:08.079
So we don't have to practice AI the same way everybody does, right?
00:35:08.159 --> 00:35:11.760
We have some time to just learn and see what works, what doesn't work.
00:35:12.079 --> 00:35:14.400
And with brilliant guys like this, I'm sure we'll be fine.
00:35:16.400 --> 00:35:22.159
You guys, you guys are both in businesses that still I believe requires manpower.
00:35:22.239 --> 00:35:27.920
You are in agriculture farming, you are doing mining, these are things that um require people still.
00:35:28.719 --> 00:35:34.880
But they're also sectors that I'm gonna go into government now, unfortunately.
00:35:36.400 --> 00:35:48.719
Because for the guy who's trying to make money, there's a lot of complaints about policies, and you know, do we really know where this thing is going to be by the time I start it now and they decide oh we're not doing this thing again, and all my investments are gone.
00:35:49.119 --> 00:35:56.320
You know, I don't know a lot about the mining sector, but the the little I know, it feels very nobody knows what's happening there.
00:35:56.480 --> 00:35:58.719
Yeah, we just hear stories, yeah, yeah.
00:35:59.199 --> 00:36:04.800
With farming as well or agriculture, it's everybody keeps saying, yes, it's the future.
00:36:05.119 --> 00:36:13.360
It's what is gonna get Nigeria out of this rut, but nobody still seems to be very deliberate about making it work.
00:36:14.239 --> 00:36:25.360
Um, so the young guy there who's who wants to farm, for example, can't be bothered because let me just go to Lagos and be an influencer because that one seems more you know plausible.
00:36:25.760 --> 00:36:34.079
You know, so I guess my question is you know, there are people who want to do some of these things, but they are overwhelmed by the fact that there's no clear-cut way to go about it, you know.
00:36:34.239 --> 00:36:36.000
So I guess it's to go back to the mind setting.
00:36:36.159 --> 00:36:43.039
So with mining on like oil and gas, like there's been less investment over the decades.
00:36:43.519 --> 00:36:45.920
So oil and gas has too many laws, also.
00:36:46.079 --> 00:36:46.800
So maybe that one is even.
00:36:47.280 --> 00:36:50.559
Yeah, but even oil and gas is more sophisticated in terms of technology, right?
00:36:50.719 --> 00:36:53.760
Mining is not as sophisticated, it's coming up.
00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:58.559
So mining by nature hires a lot more people, right?
00:36:58.719 --> 00:37:02.159
Because you know, you're offshore on the rig, everything is kind of automated.
00:37:02.320 --> 00:37:07.199
Whereas with mining, you need people to actually help you excavate, do different things.
00:37:07.280 --> 00:37:09.280
So it's a big, a big employer.
00:37:09.599 --> 00:37:22.400
I think what we would like to see is maybe more organization and more direction in terms of which way the government wants to go and maybe investment in in data, you know, what minerals does the government have, and they can that it's now easier to attract investors.
00:37:22.480 --> 00:37:29.519
Yeah, so but when you don't have data, you know, you're dependent on basically Nigerians like us to go and do the exploration, right?
00:37:29.599 --> 00:37:32.960
We go and we find these minerals ourselves before we produce them.
00:37:33.119 --> 00:37:35.440
You find young people who are very interested in mining?
00:37:35.760 --> 00:37:36.880
Loads, loads.
00:37:37.119 --> 00:37:40.320
Everybody wants to be in it right now, everybody, right?
00:37:40.800 --> 00:37:46.960
Because you think about your electronic vehicle, your solar panel, everything is mineral, it's everything is and we have it in Nigeria.
00:37:51.360 --> 00:37:52.400
When do we start talking red?
00:37:52.960 --> 00:37:55.360
But it takes time, it's not a quick, it's not a quick thing.
00:37:55.440 --> 00:37:57.280
And in Nigeria, we like quick wins, yeah.
00:37:57.519 --> 00:38:01.679
So that's why you don't see the traction because one, two years people have not seen money, they're out the door.
00:38:01.920 --> 00:38:04.480
And mining, you gotta be there three, four, five, six years.
00:38:05.039 --> 00:38:06.960
How do you do agriculture without lights?
00:38:09.280 --> 00:38:10.159
And bad roads.
00:38:11.360 --> 00:38:14.320
I've always said we I don't know that we necessarily have a problem with the planting.
00:38:14.480 --> 00:38:15.840
No, yeah, that's the least of the problem.
00:38:16.320 --> 00:38:18.960
Distribution, storage, all those things, infrastructure.
00:38:19.519 --> 00:38:23.280
I mean, I know you have stuff outside of here as well, but it's like, why would you go into a sector like that?
00:38:23.360 --> 00:38:24.639
That just feels yeah.
00:38:24.960 --> 00:38:30.159
I mean, to your point about the the deck stacked against you in agriculture, there's a lot of that, right?
00:38:30.320 --> 00:38:47.119
You know, and um my own foreign to agriculture was actually by accident, we're trying to solve another problem in terms of uh uh building commodity exchanges, and yes, that's more platform IT, you have a marketplace, people come and buy and sell, they sell USD, you deliver it.
00:38:47.360 --> 00:38:51.679
Question is that what goes on the commodity on the platform itself, where is the commodity?
00:38:52.239 --> 00:38:52.559
Right?
00:38:52.719 --> 00:39:01.280
So, in order to solve that, we then have to go one step below to again say, okay, how come we don't even have consistent supply of these things?
00:39:01.440 --> 00:39:05.039
And even when they're supplied, it's not consistent quality, right?
00:39:05.199 --> 00:39:13.920
And then you kind of can we use our you know tech mindset, disruptive creative mindset to go and disrupt that uh that industry.
00:39:14.079 --> 00:39:16.079
So that's actually how it all started, you know.
00:39:16.400 --> 00:39:20.400
And you know, I but I can tell you for a fact, it's not for a lack of trying.
00:39:21.199 --> 00:39:27.360
There's just there's just some you know structural issues, and there's some things that the government needs to do.
00:39:27.519 --> 00:39:37.199
I mean, there's a place for some there well actually uh there's there's a place for private capital, yeah, right, but there's also a place for infrastructure that government needs to do.
00:39:37.280 --> 00:39:38.480
For I'll give you this for example.
00:39:38.559 --> 00:39:46.639
I mean, we're we're doing a project in Kenya right now, so um, many thousand hectares, you know, uh farmland, farming rice, soya, and and the likes.
00:39:46.880 --> 00:39:53.280
And um in Kenya, for example, you have large continuous land together.
00:39:53.519 --> 00:40:00.079
Because if you don't have your land together and you have small fragments, you cannot do something called mechanized large-scale commercial farming.
00:40:00.320 --> 00:40:01.599
That's where the real money is.
00:40:02.159 --> 00:40:05.679
You know, some of the remoteest people, think about wealth creation, our farmers, yeah.
00:40:05.760 --> 00:40:08.079
You know the South Africa, those are the guys that find private jets.
00:40:08.320 --> 00:40:10.239
Yes, go to Idleho, right?
00:40:10.320 --> 00:40:13.840
Those are the guys that men, you know, that whole belt.
00:40:14.079 --> 00:40:19.679
They are billionaires, but they're only able to do that because they have the economies of scale.
00:40:19.760 --> 00:40:21.199
Yes, I know you're saying who are.
00:40:22.880 --> 00:40:28.000
I mean, and agriculture, unfortunately, in Africa has been done the same way as our grandfathers.
00:40:28.079 --> 00:40:30.639
Yeah, no one's thinking about how do we take it to the next level.
00:40:30.719 --> 00:40:38.239
So, first things first is you must actually have the that large parcel of land, and that is more of a government thing, right?
00:40:38.400 --> 00:40:41.920
How much money can do you have to go and you know amass or aggregate land?
00:40:42.000 --> 00:40:43.119
That's all your capital now.
00:40:43.199 --> 00:40:45.199
Yeah, you can't buy seed, you can't do anything.
00:40:45.280 --> 00:40:55.199
So, in most countries where this works, the government has already taken care of that, giving you land, not just regular land, but then arable land, irrigatable land, there's water already there.
00:40:55.440 --> 00:40:59.280
And then they are now coming and say, Okay, you know, Ibuka, how much of it do you want?
00:40:59.519 --> 00:41:04.239
1,000 uh hectares, banky, take 2,000 hectares, you know, Tayo, take 500 hectares.
00:41:19.119 --> 00:41:20.559
We're also on the same side.
00:41:21.280 --> 00:41:24.239
We are drinking water, you know, water is life.
00:41:25.119 --> 00:41:29.840
So, so you know, those are the things that would definitely help the agricultural revolution, right?
00:41:29.920 --> 00:41:40.159
If you then have you know almost like um land as a service, you just go there, you come, bring your seed, bring your inputs, you wait for harvest, and that's it.
00:41:40.320 --> 00:41:43.039
But there's maybe like 20 other things in between what I've just said.
00:41:43.119 --> 00:41:43.280
Sure.
00:41:43.440 --> 00:41:44.960
So land is one, right?
00:41:45.280 --> 00:41:47.840
You have to have water because you can't do rainfed.
00:41:48.000 --> 00:41:52.559
We pray in the morning, let rain fall, dry season, wet season.
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:58.400
Um like nobody talks about wet or white season, uh wet or dry season in in the west.
00:41:58.559 --> 00:41:59.599
They farm all year round.
00:41:59.679 --> 00:42:01.280
Yeah, and these guys even have four seasons.
00:42:01.440 --> 00:42:05.519
Yeah, they do have winter, they do this, and they still do, yeah.
00:42:05.760 --> 00:42:08.239
Because you hear, oh, it's a balloon season.
00:42:08.480 --> 00:42:08.800
Exactly.
00:42:08.960 --> 00:42:12.079
It's mango season after mango season is over, you know.
00:42:17.440 --> 00:42:18.239
Exactly, exactly.
00:42:18.400 --> 00:42:23.599
And you can't build you know sustained by culture system when you have seasonality, yeah.
00:42:23.760 --> 00:42:25.760
It also affects the volatility of prices.
00:42:25.920 --> 00:42:26.079
Sure.
00:42:26.239 --> 00:42:37.199
And I, you know, I've you know been advising governments and I say, listen, all these metrics that all your ministers of finance and economic advisors are given, the average common man does not care.
00:42:37.280 --> 00:42:40.880
Yeah, what they see is something called food inflation, yeah.
00:42:41.039 --> 00:42:47.679
And they get that when they go to the market, which is daily price and tomato yesterday was 10 naira, but now it's 50 naira.
00:42:47.840 --> 00:42:50.800
Yeah, that is how they can connect and relate to the economy.
00:42:51.280 --> 00:43:02.400
But the only way you can keep tomatoes at 10 naira is if you can actually produce those tomatoes in quote unquote in season when it's really cheap and preserve it for six, nine, twelve months.
00:43:02.559 --> 00:43:02.880
Wow.
00:43:03.039 --> 00:43:05.199
So that you don't have shocks in those prices.
00:43:06.079 --> 00:43:10.079
And in fact, you know, so there's something called you know, um, reserves, right?
00:43:10.239 --> 00:43:11.760
Your national food reserve.
00:43:11.920 --> 00:43:16.559
The US is one of the masters that it's I mean, they just even did it with oil and gas.
00:43:16.880 --> 00:43:18.559
You're having all these problems with uh production.
00:43:20.000 --> 00:43:25.519
Open 20 million uh barrels, you know, and it keeps the prices stable, right?
00:43:25.760 --> 00:43:29.760
That's what most countries actually ought to do to keep prices for food.
00:43:29.840 --> 00:43:36.239
That's why food is uh is relatively stable in Europe and because they have grain reserves, they have perishable reserves.
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:42.800
So if you have a bad farming season, which sometimes you cannot control because it's nature, that shouldn't you know.
00:43:44.719 --> 00:43:46.480
Millions of people are suffering because of that.
00:43:46.559 --> 00:43:50.960
Yeah, the idea that tomato can even be stored for Nigerians is that uh uh exactly tomatoes poisoned.
00:43:51.119 --> 00:43:53.679
No, no, no, and that's it.
00:43:54.239 --> 00:43:59.840
And that's where technology comes in, yeah, that's where tech is important because tech is not the government or it's not the private.
00:44:00.159 --> 00:44:01.199
Sorry, I know you wanted to ask a question.
00:44:01.280 --> 00:44:01.920
No, no, no, no.
00:44:02.320 --> 00:44:06.159
This thing you're talking about now, is it on government or is it on both, both.
00:44:06.239 --> 00:44:08.719
So both people have a role to play, right?
00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:10.239
So and is there money there?
00:44:10.400 --> 00:44:18.320
Because that's if I give you some some numbers, I think you will run away and stop and quit this uh podcast.
00:44:18.480 --> 00:44:19.440
I think I'm ready.
00:44:19.599 --> 00:44:25.840
I think we lose four billion dollars a year of actually waste.
00:44:26.159 --> 00:44:27.599
It's now nine billion.
00:44:27.679 --> 00:44:32.159
Wow, Nigeria loses nine billion dollars in post-harvest losses.
00:44:32.320 --> 00:44:32.480
Yes.
00:44:32.800 --> 00:44:33.679
You know what that means?
00:44:33.920 --> 00:44:38.559
It means that for everything that we produce, nine billion of it cannot be monetized.
00:44:38.800 --> 00:44:44.639
Now, that number to just put in perspective is something like 60% of everything a farm gets.
00:44:44.880 --> 00:44:46.000
So a guy has suffered.
00:44:46.159 --> 00:44:47.519
So we're just consuming 40.
00:44:47.760 --> 00:44:48.079
Correct.
00:44:48.159 --> 00:44:48.719
Yeah, right.
00:44:48.880 --> 00:44:57.039
So the guy has suffered to plant and he gets 10 tomatoes, but he can only make money from four because those six will never reach the market.
00:44:57.440 --> 00:44:57.760
Okay.
00:44:57.920 --> 00:44:59.039
And let me put it in perspective.
00:45:00.079 --> 00:45:00.800
That's actually crazy.
00:45:02.079 --> 00:45:06.239
Governments to say, listen, this is probably one of the main issues for food inflation.
00:45:06.559 --> 00:45:08.320
Because I'll give you an example.
00:45:08.480 --> 00:45:18.079
If the guy plants and is planning for 10 tomatoes, in his mind, he says those two 10 tomatoes are one naira each.
00:45:18.239 --> 00:45:25.280
So he's expecting 10 naira at the end of the harvest because that's what he needs to be able to go back and plant for the second season.
00:45:25.360 --> 00:45:25.599
Yeah.
00:45:25.760 --> 00:45:29.119
If he's only able to get four naira, a he cannot.
00:45:29.280 --> 00:45:30.320
So what does the guy do?
00:45:30.480 --> 00:45:32.320
He increases the price of tomatoes for one.
00:45:33.519 --> 00:45:33.760
Correct.
00:45:33.840 --> 00:45:38.719
So that he's able to make 12 and he puts 10 back in and asks two for his family.
00:45:39.519 --> 00:45:43.280
It's not that the guy wants to be bad or wicked, it is the reality of groundwater.
00:45:43.760 --> 00:45:47.280
This is where now the governments need to come in to fix those gaps.
00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:52.239
Because if I know that I can get 10 naira for my 10 tomatoes, I don't need to increase the prices.
00:45:52.480 --> 00:45:52.719
Yeah.
00:45:53.360 --> 00:45:55.840
And you don't need to plan for a bad day.
00:45:56.159 --> 00:45:56.400
Correct.
00:45:56.880 --> 00:45:57.119
Correct.
00:45:57.199 --> 00:45:58.079
Because it's consistent.
00:45:58.320 --> 00:46:15.599
So my question, uh, and this is kind of pivoting a little bit, but a lot of times the the feedback that you hear from people when you have conversations like this is you know, we are talking about wins and success and you know what all that means.
00:46:15.679 --> 00:46:21.039
But I found in my life that I've probably learned more from my failures than I have from my wins.
00:46:21.119 --> 00:46:21.360
Yeah.
00:46:21.679 --> 00:46:29.920
So it's it's times that life has knocked me off my feet, and I have to pick up the pieces and sorry, you continue because I wasn't even come to you.
00:46:30.000 --> 00:46:33.519
Because you said if you have started many businesses, we're going to run a story.
00:46:35.840 --> 00:46:37.360
I don't have an opinion about anything.
00:46:37.440 --> 00:46:38.159
I can't even talk about it.
00:46:38.320 --> 00:46:39.360
Because you're lucky a risk taker.
00:46:39.440 --> 00:46:40.079
You've you've done things.
00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:41.599
Oh, go on, go back.
00:46:42.159 --> 00:46:44.000
You see, this question is born out of trauma.
00:46:46.079 --> 00:46:51.440
Well, I've learned a lot through you know, when life has really knocked me off of my feet.
00:46:52.000 --> 00:46:56.719
So I would like if you'd both want to kind of give us an insight into that.
00:46:56.800 --> 00:47:11.119
And if you if you are at liberty to tell us a real experience, give us an example of sometime you have you worked on something that and it just didn't pan out, and how you're able to say, you know what, okay, we go again another day.
00:47:11.360 --> 00:47:13.760
Okay, before I even do that, I'll let Hayo go on this one.
00:47:13.840 --> 00:47:16.000
Okay, but I just want to just even throw something out.
00:47:16.079 --> 00:47:20.000
Also, for our viewers, you know, as a VC, you get a lot of people that come to pitch to you.
00:47:20.079 --> 00:47:21.360
Yeah, you're about to get more.
00:47:21.440 --> 00:47:22.079
Let me just tell you.
00:47:23.440 --> 00:47:33.920
And and uh, you know, one of the misconceptions um is that you need to appear perfect, you know, and so we ask questions like okay, you know, give me an instance where you fail.
00:47:34.159 --> 00:47:35.760
That's oh, I've never failed before.
00:47:35.920 --> 00:47:37.039
You know, everything is perfect.
00:47:37.599 --> 00:47:40.480
What investors are actually looking for, and this is our philosophy.
00:47:40.719 --> 00:47:49.360
The more failures you can tell me and you can uh demonstrate, and of course, tell me what you've learned from it, yeah, the more I'm more likely to invest in you.
00:47:49.519 --> 00:47:49.840
Why?
00:47:50.079 --> 00:47:55.199
Because you cannot, you have shown me that you are not going to use my money to experiment.
00:47:56.159 --> 00:47:56.639
You get what I mean?
00:47:56.800 --> 00:48:12.800
You've learned the hardware, you've learned the hardware, and it's less likely that you will actually put my own capital at risk because you have a lot of learnings under your belt, and so that's why it's really important that these failures and these learnings are extremely important, because not just failing, but what you do with it the next time around.
00:48:13.039 --> 00:48:15.599
But you know, let's uh tie up on this.
00:48:15.760 --> 00:48:36.000
Uh I think the first day of business, my business uh partner and I lost 750 million nair cheesy on day one, day one day one, and uh yeah, and uh this was in 2015.
00:48:39.039 --> 00:48:45.119
We had we had brought we wanted to bought in 2015 dollar was was three yes 200 and something.
00:48:45.440 --> 00:48:47.039
Wow, 300 that is a lot of money.
00:48:47.280 --> 00:48:51.280
We we raised money to buy uh an asset in Nigeria from uh from Amcon.
00:48:51.599 --> 00:48:53.840
I'm actually shaking that's a lot of money.
00:48:54.079 --> 00:48:56.079
And uh we brought the money in.
00:48:56.239 --> 00:49:02.559
Uh, we're meant to acquire the asset, and then they turned around and said, sorry, they they can't sell it to us anymore.
00:49:02.639 --> 00:49:08.960
But we had brought the money in and changed it to Naira, and Naira devalued from that's when it went from 150 to 360.
00:49:09.039 --> 00:49:09.760
Yes, yeah.
00:49:09.920 --> 00:49:12.320
So we had to go to Geneva to explain ourselves.
00:49:12.480 --> 00:49:15.039
Well, you can imagine the blasting that we received.
00:49:15.199 --> 00:49:15.760
Oh wow!
00:49:15.920 --> 00:49:20.480
But uh, we took a year and a half to recover the money, and we did.
00:49:20.719 --> 00:49:22.960
So you recovered it by earning money in other people.
00:49:23.280 --> 00:49:27.440
By doing more, but yeah, but yeah, by they gave us more money to trade to trade out the loss.
00:49:27.599 --> 00:49:28.480
So you can't pay this.
00:49:28.639 --> 00:49:30.880
You can't say please say sorry, yeah.
00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:34.880
But uh sorry it was it was a big learning curve.
00:49:35.119 --> 00:49:45.440
Um, and it just you know, trying to resolve the matter, we had to go and meet government officials, engages, senate, presidency, everywhere.
00:49:45.599 --> 00:49:48.800
And you know, going through that experience was was hell.
00:49:49.920 --> 00:49:54.159
Uh it it had it it it devastated me.
00:49:54.320 --> 00:49:58.559
But you know, my partner and I we we rolled up our sleeves and we got through it.
00:49:58.639 --> 00:50:08.079
And you know, that whole process opened so many doors for us, and those are relationships that we're leveraging today, you know, in the presidency or in government, whatever.
00:50:08.159 --> 00:50:17.360
Um I'm not saying I know those people, but you know, those are those are relationships that we got we cultivated from from you know from a loss situation.
00:50:17.599 --> 00:50:20.000
From flipping flipping flipping the story.
00:50:20.239 --> 00:50:20.719
That is crazy.
00:50:20.960 --> 00:50:21.840
Wow, that is crazy.
00:50:22.159 --> 00:50:23.760
I will just disappear.
00:50:24.320 --> 00:50:25.440
750 million.
00:50:25.760 --> 00:50:26.159
Yeah, yeah.
00:50:26.400 --> 00:50:34.719
And you know, this these types of uh failures and losses are actually quite common when you're you know, especially with early stage businesses, right?
00:50:34.960 --> 00:50:43.199
And you also have to make a decision as a VC or an investor, are you willing to back that individual beyond just the loss?
00:50:43.360 --> 00:50:47.280
Um, you know, usually it's like you know, if you lose in life, don't lose the lesson.
00:50:47.599 --> 00:50:55.840
So the lesson is more important because what you can then do, and you know, in in you know, um in our VC, we have companies that we backed.
00:50:56.239 --> 00:51:02.400
The deck was fantastic, strategy was great, the team was great, we piloted everything was wonderful.
00:51:02.559 --> 00:51:08.000
But then once they uh deployed and went live, something went off.
00:51:08.159 --> 00:51:15.440
Either there was a uh government policy change that now rendered the business completely useless, or a similar business launch.
00:51:17.519 --> 00:51:27.039
Competition came, someone you know that is bigger and stronger, and I said there's always going to be someone that is bigger and stronger and finer and better than you, you know, throw money at the problem and you're out, right?
00:51:27.119 --> 00:51:28.239
All your projections are out.
00:51:28.559 --> 00:51:40.639
Now, what typically then happens, and you know, we have a lot of like hackathons and things like that, and um, you know, uh demo days to allow these companies to actually fail, but then you know, we have some type of push into our system.
00:51:40.880 --> 00:51:48.320
So, what typically happens is if you go to the market and you fail, you can't just lock in your failure because when you give up, you've locked in the failure.
00:51:48.480 --> 00:52:03.440
What you then we then do is we look at the whole um uh uh scenario, the person, the team, if there was value in that entrepreneur, if they had the right mindset, if they had the right hunger, but maybe the timing was off.
00:52:03.679 --> 00:52:07.360
We then take that person, we pair them up with other people that have failed.
00:52:07.519 --> 00:52:17.039
You know, sometimes the best way to pivot is to come out of your comfort zone, be exposed to somebody or something slightly different from you, and then go and rebuild again.
00:52:17.199 --> 00:52:18.559
Go back to the drawing board.
00:52:19.679 --> 00:52:24.800
Nine out of ten times, what the product you then come back with the second time is way better than the first time.
00:52:25.360 --> 00:52:30.400
That's why usually I don't I usually don't have faith in the first uh business propositions or ventures.
00:52:30.559 --> 00:52:34.800
If we back them, I'm only backing them because I know they couldn't come back for 2.0.
00:52:34.960 --> 00:52:36.960
Because 2.0 is always better and sweeter.
00:52:37.199 --> 00:52:39.599
Because you've learned lessons, absolutely, absolutely.
00:52:39.920 --> 00:52:41.920
You know when they say the house always wins.
00:52:43.360 --> 00:52:44.639
That's it right there.
00:52:45.519 --> 00:52:46.480
Yeah, very good.
00:52:46.559 --> 00:52:55.760
So, yeah, so I I mean it's your point about the the lessons in failure, very valuable, especially if you're surrounded with the right people.
00:52:55.840 --> 00:52:57.360
So your ecosystem is very important.
00:52:57.440 --> 00:53:03.440
Yeah, you know, I always tell people like that there are two things in life that will change where you are today and where you're gonna be in the next five years.
00:53:03.599 --> 00:53:04.400
Only two things.
00:53:04.559 --> 00:53:06.639
Every other thing falls under these two things.
00:53:07.360 --> 00:53:08.079
Are you ready for it?
00:53:08.239 --> 00:53:08.719
We're already, sir.
00:53:08.800 --> 00:53:12.559
Only let me open my notes that can change your life today, today, today.
00:53:12.719 --> 00:53:16.559
You pass this standard, you know, open your notes versus the next five years.
00:53:16.800 --> 00:53:23.519
Number one is in the knowledge you acquire in that time, so the things you're exposed to.
00:53:23.920 --> 00:53:30.880
Number two is in the people that you surround yourself in, so it's knowledge and people.
00:53:31.519 --> 00:53:38.800
Everything else, hard worker, prayer, discipline, all falls in in one of those two buckets.
00:53:39.039 --> 00:53:40.800
Yeah, I agree.
00:53:41.199 --> 00:53:50.639
So your journey to success, if you really want to change, if you're not happy with where you are today in your life, examine those two things.
00:53:51.119 --> 00:54:02.159
You either need to change and switch how you acquire knowledge or what you are acquiring as knowledge instead of scrolling up and down, to you need to change your environment.
00:54:02.559 --> 00:54:06.639
Because at the end of the day, you know, they often say that you are the average of the five people around you.
00:54:07.679 --> 00:54:11.199
So if you really want to up your game, you may need to want to take a look at that.
00:54:11.440 --> 00:54:12.800
That's why I'll be trying to hang out with you.
00:54:14.639 --> 00:54:16.000
You can't be doing no new friends.
00:54:18.800 --> 00:54:29.440
Just okay, you are on the circle because you're actually going to increase my average, but it's really important, and you know, you spoke about something about mentorship and all of that.
00:54:29.679 --> 00:54:37.599
It you know, the thing about wealthy people is that once you are around them, the chances of you to fail is extremely low.
00:54:37.760 --> 00:54:48.400
Yeah, because the rich and the wealthy always want to keep their circle, so even if you are going to fall a little bit, they would keep it because you can't come and be standing out by the way.
00:54:49.760 --> 00:54:57.760
If we're out of the hungry person here, we're applying it, we're trying to plan a trip to go to the south of France, no, no, they can't they can't even allow you to do that.
00:54:58.960 --> 00:55:04.559
You get so so the chances of your success if you're hanging out with successful people is extremely high.
00:55:04.800 --> 00:55:07.840
That's why you told people together.
00:55:08.000 --> 00:55:10.320
You get what I need, right?
00:55:10.480 --> 00:55:13.039
So do everything you can, even if you're an intern.
00:55:13.440 --> 00:55:14.239
How do we get to this?
00:55:14.480 --> 00:55:15.519
How do we find these friends?
00:55:16.239 --> 00:55:17.199
Let me ask you a couple questions.
00:55:18.559 --> 00:55:19.360
I don't know what it is.
00:55:19.519 --> 00:55:20.559
Nice to meet you.
00:55:22.000 --> 00:55:23.519
But it's seriously, like, I'm okay.
00:55:23.679 --> 00:55:25.760
Let me talk for the guy now who's 25.
00:55:25.840 --> 00:55:31.199
Yeah, I have great ideas, I have no wealthy friends, I don't even have access to these people.
00:55:31.360 --> 00:55:35.679
I've attended a few pitching, like big situations, nothing has really worked.
00:55:35.760 --> 00:55:38.400
All I have in my account is like maybe 380k.
00:55:38.800 --> 00:55:40.159
Let me give you a classic example.
00:55:40.320 --> 00:55:40.800
What do I do?
00:55:40.960 --> 00:55:41.280
Correct.
00:55:41.440 --> 00:55:42.639
Because this is the story of a lot of people.
00:55:42.719 --> 00:55:44.639
So let me let me know how 380k.
00:55:44.880 --> 00:55:45.519
Yes, yes, yes, yes.
00:55:45.679 --> 00:55:48.159
But they feel like there's no it's not possible.
00:55:48.639 --> 00:55:50.880
We're talking 750 million now, they are completely confused.
00:55:51.119 --> 00:55:51.519
Yeah, yeah.
00:55:51.840 --> 00:55:53.760
Because how will I ever reach again?
00:55:53.920 --> 00:55:55.360
Yeah, too many zeros.
00:55:55.519 --> 00:55:59.760
I mean, there was a girl that trended because she finally hit a million naira in her account.
00:55:59.920 --> 00:56:07.119
Wow, she's in her mid-20s, and it was a whole thing on Twitter because people were like, and the replies were very interesting because a lot of people could relate.
00:56:07.199 --> 00:56:09.440
Yeah, you saw comments like one day it'll be my turn.
00:56:09.679 --> 00:56:11.440
Yes, these are graduates, yeah.
00:56:12.159 --> 00:56:16.559
So for them, it's 200k, but I want to succeed.
00:56:16.800 --> 00:56:18.239
Yes, yeah.
00:56:21.119 --> 00:56:23.920
So when I when I was sitting there, yeah, people shaking their heads.
00:56:25.519 --> 00:56:36.079
Um, so um let me try to let me try to put it like, and of course, you know, for the viewers who are watching and who are asking these questions themselves, you know, how is this possible?
00:56:36.559 --> 00:56:49.280
One pathway could be this, and I always tell people you should try to master a skill and then try to work to gain experience.
00:56:49.519 --> 00:56:52.559
There is always that dignity when you work for other people.
00:56:52.639 --> 00:56:58.719
In fact, it's how you work for other people, the diligence, the things you build, that's what you're going to use for your own business.
00:56:59.280 --> 00:57:02.079
You can't be a bad worker and be a good business owner.
00:57:03.119 --> 00:57:03.199
Right?
00:57:03.519 --> 00:57:14.559
So the first things first is master a skill, which means that education part, and it could be formal schooling or informal, and there are a lot of informal ways today, yeah.
00:57:14.719 --> 00:57:25.039
And then go and look for that internship, even if the internship is paying nothing, but be very, very particular about the reputation of where you're working and the people there that you're working with.
00:57:25.119 --> 00:57:27.360
Because remember, people is that other formula.
00:57:27.519 --> 00:57:28.239
Yeah, yes.
00:57:28.480 --> 00:57:44.079
Once you do that enough and you are diligent, and people find out that you know you're you're you're a hard worker, you're you deliver, very naturally you are going to be endeared to some of these folks who can change your life, who can give you an opportunity.
00:57:44.239 --> 00:57:45.360
And you have to be persistent.
00:57:45.440 --> 00:57:46.239
You can't be shy.
00:57:46.320 --> 00:57:49.760
See, yeah, when you are in poverty, there's nothing to lose, there's no shaming, there's nothing.
00:57:50.239 --> 00:57:50.400
Right?
00:57:50.559 --> 00:57:53.440
And so I'll tell you, you know, some examples.
00:57:54.239 --> 00:58:03.440
The people that have actually mentored and eventually, you know, they've become really successful, and I took a chance on, were the least likely people.
00:58:03.599 --> 00:58:07.920
They came to a conference, uh, you know, or an event.
00:58:08.000 --> 00:58:15.519
I was a panelist, you know, it was free free admission, but they made it a point to attend.
00:58:15.840 --> 00:58:36.719
And then when the panel session was over, they went and they chased and they came and they wanted the card and all of that, which a lot of people do, but they didn't stop at that messaging, you know, voice notes, sending me things they're doing, trying to find out where next I'm going to be, trying to volunteer for free, right?
00:58:36.880 --> 00:58:39.440
And after a while, people will take notice.
00:58:40.000 --> 00:58:41.119
And then I'm like, you know what?
00:58:41.199 --> 00:58:47.519
If this guy can do this and is not even getting anything, I can imagine what he would be if I just gave him a small opportunity.
00:58:47.840 --> 00:58:50.000
A lot of the people, it is that greet, that hunger.
00:58:50.079 --> 00:58:50.719
There's no shame.
00:58:51.199 --> 00:58:56.800
And that's sometimes that's what the person on the other side is waiting for, is looking for.
00:58:56.880 --> 00:59:00.719
Yeah, because life is not easy, business has a lot of ups and downs.
00:59:00.960 --> 00:59:03.840
I need that person who's not going to be ashamed, yeah.
00:59:04.079 --> 00:59:06.400
You know, because he failed yesterday to try again the next day.
00:59:06.480 --> 00:59:12.800
Yeah, so it's this small traits you know to me that matter that you need to build and you need to be consistent on.
00:59:13.119 --> 00:59:14.639
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:59:14.960 --> 00:59:15.599
I love this.
00:59:16.079 --> 00:59:18.800
This episode is for you.
00:59:22.559 --> 00:59:23.599
That was that was very well.
00:59:24.320 --> 00:59:42.719
And I'm I'm very uh happy with the way you put it because a lot of what we're doing here is we're trying to help people in whatever strait uh it is, but I think more importantly, you have people who are sort of lost or feel like there's no way out.
00:59:42.800 --> 00:59:58.159
Yeah, as we guess we have viewers from all of all over the world, but I mean, speaking in uh immediate environment, there's a certain mindset which I mentioned earlier about you know the odds are just completely stacked against you and there's no way out, and that's why I think that was very important.
00:59:58.239 --> 01:00:09.760
But I I like what you mentioned about speaking of mindset, there's also a mindset of handouts here, which we also need to start disabusing.
01:00:10.559 --> 01:00:12.639
And we can kind of see where it comes from, sadly.
01:00:12.719 --> 01:00:16.960
There's a believer once my boy enter that position, you know it's a good thing.
01:00:17.039 --> 01:00:25.519
It doesn't show me I'm sick, you know, and we also sort of celebrate wealth a certain way, nobody's really asking questions about how did this guy make it.
01:00:25.760 --> 01:00:28.880
You just yeah, this guy in a commission and a don't blow, it don't blow.
01:00:29.760 --> 01:00:30.400
That's all it takes.
01:00:30.719 --> 01:00:32.000
All things are forgiven.
01:00:32.800 --> 01:00:38.320
The reminder that there's hard work that has to be a part of this story.
01:00:38.639 --> 01:00:44.960
You actually have to push for it when I tell people that I never thought I was gonna be doing TV.
01:00:45.039 --> 01:00:46.480
I had no idea how this thing works.
01:00:46.800 --> 01:00:56.239
I was a freaking lawyer in Abuja, I came to Lagos where everything else happened, and all I did was attend events and introduce myself to people and wear very tight suits because I thought I was way too much.
01:00:56.559 --> 01:01:02.719
I am but I did it, and I just keep going, oh yeah, my name is 24-year-old.
01:01:02.880 --> 01:01:03.760
But what is your problem?
01:01:03.840 --> 01:01:14.559
Yeah, but it's it's little things like that, just keep showing up at the risk of sounding old and saying in our time and you know the generation now, but it's the truth.
01:01:14.639 --> 01:01:19.920
There's also I guess social media has also made it that way where you believe it can just happen.
01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:23.199
Yeah, it might for a few people, but it doesn't always work that way.
01:01:23.280 --> 01:01:28.719
You know, you also actually work at things, yeah, yeah, of course, you know, do the do the work.
01:01:28.960 --> 01:01:30.639
Yeah, I guess is the general message.
01:01:30.719 --> 01:01:31.760
I don't know if you had something to say.
01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:43.840
I I was just gonna kind of say that um you said something now that I think is very important, which is you were talking about how how you chose the people that you end up mentoring.
01:01:44.320 --> 01:02:01.119
Because we've had an episode on mentoring, and the mentor always chooses the mentees, and you will always choose the person that is working, you will always choose the person that is adding value, you will always choose the person that is is showing like they're hungry, they're resilient, they're they're both.
01:02:01.360 --> 01:02:02.719
Because you don't want to be wasting your time on someone.
01:02:03.280 --> 01:02:11.920
Because you don't want to pour into somebody that's gonna you're a businessman, you want a return on your investment, even if it's time and wisdom, you want to have time, time is money, right?
01:02:12.000 --> 01:02:13.199
So you want that return.
01:02:13.440 --> 01:02:19.760
So for me, I think the lesson is first of all, whatever your hands find to do, do well.
01:02:20.000 --> 01:02:24.000
Correct, is he that is faithful in little that will eventually be given much.
01:02:24.239 --> 01:02:27.840
If you're a bad worker, you will never be a great owner.
01:02:28.000 --> 01:02:37.360
Yeah, so you have to start with stewarding where you are and the opportunities that you're given and adding value and delivering over and above the call of duty.
01:02:37.920 --> 01:02:50.239
And then that's what makes somebody like you who is in a position to be a destiny helper or an investor, whatever term you want to use, to now look and say, Oh, uh this person is doing all of this for free or for little to nothing.
01:02:50.480 --> 01:02:54.000
If I give them an opportunity, this can be a great story.
01:02:54.559 --> 01:03:04.480
And I think that's the lesson for most people that are watching this because you you don't it you never really go from zero to everything overnight.
01:03:04.960 --> 01:03:13.599
It is a series of intentional, uh uh consequential decisions and steps that you make with what is in front.
01:03:13.760 --> 01:03:19.440
God never gives us everything we need for the whole journey, no, but you see that next step, you can take that step.
01:03:20.000 --> 01:03:24.480
And it's in being faithful in that that things start to line up in your favor.
01:03:24.719 --> 01:03:27.519
So, and this has been a great, a great conversation for me.
01:03:28.000 --> 01:03:30.079
I see, I've I have my notes.
01:03:30.239 --> 01:03:34.800
Whatever you are doing, make sure it's tech enabled, enabled, you know.
01:03:34.960 --> 01:03:42.159
Um, knowledge and people, yeah, you know, you're gonna be a result of the knowledge that you acquire and the people that you surround yourself.
01:03:42.400 --> 01:03:46.320
Baba, I don't take notes, I don't come here to say anything, I was came here to learn.
01:03:46.559 --> 01:03:49.920
I want to put you guys on the spot a bit, yeah, starting with you.
01:03:50.079 --> 01:03:53.920
Um because people drink up to that.
01:03:54.239 --> 01:04:02.400
There's a belief globally, Nigeria, yes, but that you can't be wealthy without compromising your principles.
01:04:02.719 --> 01:04:09.039
And I'm not saying make money or do start a business and do well, but be wealthy without compromising your principles.
01:04:09.199 --> 01:04:12.880
It's getting louder now and amplified with what we see in America, let's be honest.
01:04:13.280 --> 01:04:19.679
You know, we're seeing all of the besides even a whole other topic, but it's like you know, proximity to power.
01:04:20.639 --> 01:04:23.920
We saw for the first time a president of the United States was being inaugurated.
01:04:24.000 --> 01:04:31.039
We saw the lineup of the tech billionaires, you know, who's capturing the media in America now with all of these people, you know.
01:04:31.360 --> 01:04:43.920
You need to things you believe in to keep the wealth or to even get there, you have to start being a certain way or do certain things or accept certain things or compromise and things.
01:04:44.079 --> 01:04:53.280
So I don't want to boost, but it's the belief of everybody who looks from the outside saying there's no clean, wealthy person.
01:04:53.840 --> 01:05:04.159
So for someone who Nigerians are very religious, we like to go to church to pray, but for some reason we know how to balance the thank you, Jesus, and also teeth in the woods.
01:05:04.639 --> 01:05:07.360
I don't know why, but we've perfected that.
01:05:07.519 --> 01:05:08.400
Is that not yeah?
01:05:08.800 --> 01:05:10.159
I'm not even asking the person if that's true.
01:05:10.400 --> 01:05:11.360
Isn't that the right notion?
01:05:11.599 --> 01:05:20.960
I don't think you need to compromise on your values, but I would tell you one thing about most successful people they're extremely ruthless, extremely, they don't waste time.
01:05:21.280 --> 01:05:28.880
Once they've made their decision, it's that's it, and there's no second chances, it is what it is.
01:05:29.039 --> 01:05:30.639
You are going for it in that moment, yeah.
01:05:30.880 --> 01:05:35.199
Um, so I would say uh that ruthlessness needs to be there.
01:05:35.599 --> 01:05:45.440
You don't need to compromise your values, but if you don't want to I think once you take in a position, that's it.
01:05:45.599 --> 01:05:52.400
You can't change your mind, no matter what, no matter how you feel, no matter how it looks, you have to just make that be a little less human, you see.
01:05:52.559 --> 01:05:57.280
Yes, if you want to report that level, I don't just allow me.
01:05:57.599 --> 01:05:59.760
Yeah, I think so, and then you need to be.
01:06:00.239 --> 01:06:08.559
Able to be like Jesus Christ when he went and sat in the desert, and everybody was doubting him and saying this and saying that and temptation came.
01:06:08.719 --> 01:06:12.800
You got to be ready for that season if you want to be wealthy and not compromise your malice.
01:06:13.039 --> 01:06:13.440
Yes.
01:06:13.679 --> 01:06:19.760
And you've got to embrace it because you will have that if you want to be, and it will be the making or the breaking of you.
01:06:20.480 --> 01:06:21.199
So yeah.
01:06:21.440 --> 01:06:24.719
Well, I I may I just say voice don't come now.
01:06:26.400 --> 01:06:27.280
Are you compromised?
01:06:29.360 --> 01:06:31.440
It's actually a very, very relevant question.
01:06:31.679 --> 01:06:33.599
Yeah, we struggle with every single day.
01:06:33.760 --> 01:06:33.920
Yeah.
01:06:34.239 --> 01:06:36.000
And in fact, I was hoping you were not going to bring this up.
01:06:36.320 --> 01:06:38.719
But this is the most controversial part.
01:06:38.880 --> 01:06:39.119
Okay.
01:06:39.280 --> 01:06:44.079
Um, and you know, truth be told, let's just be open and honest and call his speed his speed.
01:06:44.320 --> 01:06:49.360
Um, if you're running a small business, you can be a pastor and run it successfully.
01:06:49.519 --> 01:06:50.880
No, because you are just in your corner.
01:06:50.960 --> 01:06:52.559
Yeah, there's no threats to anything.
01:06:53.199 --> 01:06:57.039
You're not disrupting any once you're doing big business skill, my brother.
01:06:57.360 --> 01:06:57.920
They're going to pick it.
01:06:58.400 --> 01:07:00.079
That's why I say globally Nigeria.
01:07:00.880 --> 01:07:01.360
Global, global.
01:07:01.519 --> 01:07:08.079
And I've had experience in different countries, in East Africa, in um in the US.
01:07:08.480 --> 01:07:09.519
It's it's everywhere.
01:07:09.599 --> 01:07:09.920
Yeah.
01:07:10.079 --> 01:07:20.079
Um, and you know, so usually what we advise are portfolio companies and all, because you know, like I said, once you're if you're under a million-dollar company, not a problem, you can do whatever.
01:07:20.239 --> 01:07:25.599
Once you start to hit 10 million, 100 million dollars, you're on the reader of governments.
01:07:25.920 --> 01:07:27.840
I mean, you're on the speed dial of the president.
01:07:28.239 --> 01:07:28.559
Wow.
01:07:28.639 --> 01:07:28.800
Yeah.
01:07:29.039 --> 01:07:32.400
And they need you to do certain things for their own political agenda.
01:07:32.639 --> 01:07:34.079
If not, you're gone.
01:07:34.800 --> 01:07:39.840
Just like this, so yeah, and the whole thing about sticking to your values and all is good and great.
01:07:39.920 --> 01:07:48.239
But when you have 20 other people that are looking to take your place instantly and do worse, so it's not a very like cut and dry type of decision.
01:07:48.400 --> 01:07:55.039
What I what I usually advise our guys is listen, build your company on policy, not politics.
01:07:55.199 --> 01:07:56.960
Yeah, that's why right?
01:07:57.119 --> 01:07:59.199
And there's the two there's a huge difference.
01:07:59.440 --> 01:08:03.360
Building your business on politics, not politics.
01:08:03.840 --> 01:08:09.519
Because politics comes and goes seasons, but policies last for a while.
01:08:09.599 --> 01:08:13.920
I mean, if you look at the big giants in Nigeria, that guy has been there.
01:08:18.800 --> 01:08:21.359
It's very the one the president is very quick.
01:08:21.600 --> 01:08:24.880
That's because you take one picture with one at night, another one in the morning.
01:08:25.199 --> 01:08:26.079
Absolutely, absolutely.
01:08:26.159 --> 01:08:34.640
And those are really smart businessmen who understand these concepts, and that's the only way you can endure beyond the current political realities.
01:08:34.960 --> 01:08:38.079
You have to build based on policy, yeah, not politics.
01:08:40.000 --> 01:08:46.960
You're going to meet those things, even if you're sitting in your corner and manning your business, they're going to go day or day, they will come and visit you.
01:08:47.279 --> 01:08:57.359
You see, when you get to a point where you are too big to fail, yeah, when you have monopolistic advantage, where if you sneeze, you know, have the economy shakes.
01:08:57.600 --> 01:08:59.840
You are not doing business for yourself by yourself.
01:09:00.239 --> 01:09:00.640
Yeah, okay.
01:09:01.119 --> 01:09:04.560
You are part of a fabric with vulnerabilities.
01:09:04.800 --> 01:09:10.399
And so you need to understand the risks that come come with it, but also the alignment.
01:09:10.479 --> 01:09:14.319
And I think it takes wisdom and emotional intelligence to be able to navigate it.
01:09:15.520 --> 01:09:16.319
I don't want to say more than that.
01:09:16.560 --> 01:09:17.279
I'll be in trouble.
01:09:17.680 --> 01:09:19.600
Let's not let's not explore further.
01:09:20.479 --> 01:09:23.600
Let's let's let's let's wrap this up with uh live original moment.
01:09:23.840 --> 01:09:29.600
And um, we've got I saw this on social media, and I just wanted you guys to chime in on it.
01:09:29.760 --> 01:09:32.159
Um, it says black tax is real.
01:09:33.199 --> 01:09:35.600
Every time I make a move, 10 hands are reaching out.
01:09:36.000 --> 01:09:44.159
So, how do you balance being a good son/slash brother with the need to actually build your own original wealth without going broke?
01:09:44.399 --> 01:09:48.720
For those who don't know, black tax is like the whole community.
01:09:49.039 --> 01:09:52.239
Once you have the person that hammers has to carry everybody along, basically.
01:09:52.479 --> 01:09:56.239
And we've seen scenarios where it's been controversial.
01:09:56.399 --> 01:10:06.720
Uh, I'm trying to remember the footballer now who talked about the fact that the moment he signed his contract, a Nigerian footballer, everybody back home was waiting.
01:10:07.039 --> 01:10:13.359
Because you have you are the one that is going to now make us come out of this poverty, and his cousins and uncles and brothers, and it's 30, 40 people.
01:10:14.159 --> 01:10:17.359
And it's kind of unique to black people, apparently.
01:10:17.680 --> 01:10:30.880
So trying to build a business successfully and grow to wealth, I guess is what he's saying, is you have to deal with you're making profit and you can't put back in the business because there's all of these other people that you have to sort of list with you.
01:10:31.359 --> 01:10:34.159
So I guess the question is, and that is a lot of people's stories.
01:10:34.239 --> 01:10:36.479
So how do you scale?
01:10:36.720 --> 01:10:37.119
How do you scale?
01:10:37.199 --> 01:10:37.600
How do you manage?
01:10:38.079 --> 01:10:44.000
How do you grow wealth in a unique situation like this where black tax exists?
01:10:44.640 --> 01:10:46.319
I think heavy question.
01:10:47.359 --> 01:10:56.880
I think when you try and because I think the the the question relates to mentorship and how do you treat the people around you and all of that, right?
01:10:57.359 --> 01:11:01.920
Even family members, true, parents, siblings, they're waiting.
01:11:02.159 --> 01:11:03.680
Church, church, community.
01:11:04.000 --> 01:11:06.079
I think I think first thing you just have to shine eye.
01:11:06.399 --> 01:11:07.119
That's the first thing.
01:11:07.199 --> 01:11:15.359
And then second of all, um when it comes to helping people, my philosophy is I will teach you how to fish.
01:11:15.439 --> 01:11:16.720
I won't give you fish.
01:11:17.039 --> 01:11:24.000
I'll give you the values, learn the business, I'll show you what I know so you can create value for yourself.
01:11:24.319 --> 01:11:26.720
But handouts, seldom.
01:11:26.960 --> 01:11:30.399
Um, we do it, we have to do it, it's our culture.
01:11:30.720 --> 01:11:37.840
But we're not helping you really because we are just giving you money today, it's gone tomorrow.
01:11:38.079 --> 01:11:41.680
But if you know what to do to make money tomorrow, you'll be of value.
01:11:41.840 --> 01:11:49.760
And if you know how to make money in a certain way, you can always replicate it in other industries and other ways, so long as you have that design and ambition.
01:11:49.920 --> 01:11:52.000
So that's how I navigate that.
01:11:52.079 --> 01:12:05.600
But it's not easy, and especially now that we're cashless, in terms of you know, everything is on card, you go, you park the car, the guy helps you get a parking spot, you want to give him one thousand nine, but you don't have one thousand nine, and the guy's looking at you like one thousand is what they know possible.
01:12:06.560 --> 01:12:07.680
Well, exactly, exactly.
01:12:08.079 --> 01:12:12.399
Definitely is it so you know it's it's it's tough, it's tough for people.
01:12:12.640 --> 01:12:13.359
It is very tough.
01:12:13.600 --> 01:12:19.199
I mean, I'll say it's it's part of our culture to be able to reach out and help to pull people up with you.
01:12:19.359 --> 01:12:24.159
In fact, I think it's one of your biggest insurance when everybody around you is somewhat okay.
01:12:24.319 --> 01:12:26.000
But you can rest easily beat.
01:12:26.239 --> 01:12:26.960
Yeah, right.
01:12:27.199 --> 01:12:36.880
But uh to Tara's point, I am you know the whole notion of you know teaching them how to fish versus you know giving them a fish is one um smart way.
01:12:36.960 --> 01:12:40.000
It's not as easy as you think because people just want now, right?
01:12:40.159 --> 01:12:45.039
I want to, you know, I need this to buy to recharge my phone or to pay my rent tomorrow.
01:12:45.359 --> 01:12:48.399
Don't give me a job where I have to wait for six months to get something, right?
01:12:48.560 --> 01:12:49.840
So you have to kind of balance it out.
01:12:49.920 --> 01:12:54.720
But I'd say you you need to approach it with some sort of structure.
01:12:54.960 --> 01:12:56.880
And you know, I'll just give some examples.
01:12:56.960 --> 01:13:08.720
I mean, most of the foundations, even here, keeping it local, you know, Dangote Foundation, Boa Foundation, MTM Foundation, there's a reason why they create those things, right?
01:13:08.880 --> 01:13:12.159
And it's hey, allow me to make money first.
01:13:12.880 --> 01:13:24.399
Once I've made, I take a portion and I set up this other structure that caters for your immediate short-term needs as long as your medium to long-term needs that makes you independent.
01:13:24.800 --> 01:13:27.119
And all the greats did it, you know.
01:13:27.279 --> 01:13:32.079
Uh Gates, he had to build Microsoft first before he did Gates Foundation.
01:13:32.159 --> 01:13:32.479
Yeah.
01:13:32.800 --> 01:13:36.159
Rockefeller built his wealth, built Rockefeller Foundation.
01:13:36.399 --> 01:13:38.720
Ford built his wealth, built for foundation.
01:13:38.800 --> 01:13:42.079
Which is why I tell people, yeah, you want to do foundation and foundation, but you have to make the money first.
01:13:42.159 --> 01:13:43.840
Yeah, yes, right, to sustain the foundation.
01:13:44.159 --> 01:13:49.279
In making it, you create that structure that then allows you to be able to help those people.
01:13:49.439 --> 01:13:51.760
If you don't have that structure, it could be a mess.
01:13:51.840 --> 01:13:53.920
You could drown even in your generosity.
01:13:55.039 --> 01:14:01.600
I guess you also need to build a almost back to what she said about you know, you have to be able to say no.
01:14:02.560 --> 01:14:10.000
Sadly, um, because black tax doesn't even wait for wealth, it just waits for perceived success.
01:14:10.319 --> 01:14:11.039
Correct.
01:14:11.359 --> 01:14:14.640
You that just ah, you at this Banky, where are this for YouTube?
01:14:14.960 --> 01:14:15.760
Let me don't do it.
01:14:15.840 --> 01:14:24.079
You know, black taxes, but you can't please you can't see black tax your way out of yeah, you know, I don't know.
01:14:24.159 --> 01:14:25.279
I don't even want to out of it.
01:14:25.439 --> 01:14:30.479
But it's just for Banky, for example, that example, for you to even abstract yourself, right?
01:14:30.560 --> 01:14:36.960
And you know, it happens to me, you know, um, my guy, I need well, listen, I have this foundation that caters to it.
01:14:37.119 --> 01:14:38.800
So you even remove yourself a bit.
01:14:39.279 --> 01:14:41.680
They go and then they go in, they go through the process.
01:14:41.920 --> 01:14:43.119
Some cousins won't listen to that one.
01:14:43.439 --> 01:14:49.840
But you know, once again, you're but it's better than saying no outright because you know sometimes can be taken differently.
01:14:50.000 --> 01:14:51.600
It's always better to say, okay, no problem.
01:14:51.680 --> 01:14:53.680
I hear you, um, I feel you.
01:14:53.840 --> 01:14:55.760
There is this other thing that can help you.
01:14:55.840 --> 01:15:01.680
I'm funding it for people like you, for situations like you, and then you kind of sort of remove yourself a bit, you know.
01:15:01.920 --> 01:15:03.039
Can I ask you a question?
01:15:03.279 --> 01:15:05.760
Because I also feel like that's a bad trait of mine.
01:15:05.920 --> 01:15:09.199
Like, I hate saying no, so I never say no to anybody in business.
01:15:09.439 --> 01:15:10.000
Oh, correct.
01:15:10.159 --> 01:15:13.039
I'll I'll find that say ignorance.
01:15:15.199 --> 01:15:20.640
But I always try and be like, okay, I didn't say no, and my business partner will be the one to be like, no.
01:15:21.039 --> 01:15:23.439
I try not to be so good cop back up, yes.
01:15:23.520 --> 01:15:24.640
Yeah, so you're the bad cop.
01:15:25.920 --> 01:15:30.159
I'm definitely the bad cop most times, but in terms of favors, I'll be yeah, I'm I'm the good cop.
01:15:30.399 --> 01:15:32.000
Yeah, do you say no easily?
01:15:32.079 --> 01:15:33.840
Um is that important for business?
01:15:34.000 --> 01:15:36.399
It so you have to also kind of balance it out.
01:15:36.479 --> 01:15:36.800
Yeah, yeah.
01:15:36.960 --> 01:15:44.560
Is what you're saying no for going to help to sustain a platform that then helps you say yes later to many more people, right?
01:15:44.800 --> 01:15:50.000
Um, because the truth that matters is like there are people that have a situation right now, someone is in a hospital, they are dying.
01:15:50.319 --> 01:15:52.479
You can't say no to that, yeah, right?
01:15:52.720 --> 01:15:58.560
Someone has someone is in a fix and they need this intervention right now because it's going to make a huge difference in their life.
01:15:58.640 --> 01:15:59.920
You have to evaluate these things, yeah.
01:16:00.000 --> 01:16:01.600
So it's not a clean yes or no.
01:16:01.760 --> 01:16:12.239
You evaluate the situation for someone who's just saying, Hey, my guy, I need a job, I need and then that's more patients, they're not dying tomorrow, and it's better to put them on a structured path, you know, for independence.
01:16:12.800 --> 01:16:15.119
So that's kind of like you know how I balance it out.
01:16:15.199 --> 01:16:21.039
I wanted your answer on that black tax because you were, I mean, you are public facing, yeah.
01:16:21.199 --> 01:16:26.159
Because I kind of go through that as well, where if you are trying to say no, they say I just see your video.
01:16:26.479 --> 01:16:30.079
Yeah, so there's a some there's assumed wealth.
01:16:31.199 --> 01:16:32.720
You can't so say no is even harder.
01:16:32.880 --> 01:16:35.119
So, how have you and you've been doing this for two decades?
01:16:35.199 --> 01:16:40.560
How have you handled I I can't lie, it's very tough, and no matter what you do, it's never enough.
01:16:41.359 --> 01:16:50.399
There are times that my wife or my business partner at Sunday will tell you that the most frequent line item in my transaction alerts is hardship assistance.
01:16:50.640 --> 01:16:55.199
Wow, because it's just especially if you if you now make mistakes and say you are doing poly.
01:16:55.520 --> 01:16:56.399
I don't want to finish it.
01:16:57.199 --> 01:17:09.840
But you just some people just see you as an ATM machine, and every need that they have, every urgent situation, sometimes they'll even make things up, and it's just it doesn't stop.
01:17:10.560 --> 01:17:29.119
Um, and you do the best that you can do, but I think uh you you have to learn that first of all, you said it don't drown in your generosity um and just set your priorities right, focus on building first, then build a structure for supporting people and use that structure.
01:17:29.279 --> 01:17:37.760
It's not as easy as it sounds because especially when you're somebody like me, who a lot of people have access to, it just doesn't stop.
01:17:38.399 --> 01:17:48.319
So you have to make peace with the fact that you are not the messiah, you are not God, you can't solve every problem that exists in their world.
01:17:48.640 --> 01:18:02.239
But what you you have to balance that with this idea that givers really never lack, and most at least most of the, or I would dare say even all of the successful people that I know are incredible givers.
01:18:02.720 --> 01:18:17.199
Like you you give a lot, it may it may not be on the surface like like handouts, like you say, but you you do give obviously like I know the family that you come from, and I know that it's one of the ethos that the family, you know, and my family as well.
01:18:17.279 --> 01:18:20.720
Like that's we you you grow up knowing that that's what we do.
01:18:20.880 --> 01:18:25.840
We give, we we we pray for success, but you're you're being blessed to be a blessing.
01:18:26.399 --> 01:18:33.199
So you just it's just finding the balance as as much as you can, and I'm still it's still something that I'm struggling navigating.
01:18:33.279 --> 01:18:36.720
So I don't even know that I'm in the right position to answer it definitively.
01:18:37.119 --> 01:18:44.319
I do know that you have to get the right balance of stewardship and generosity.
01:18:44.560 --> 01:18:58.399
Yeah, so stewarding the success that you have so that you can sustain it, and then generosity where you are giving to the people around you that need it or giving to even people that you don't know, a lot of giving that I do, most people will never even hear about.
01:18:58.880 --> 01:19:03.279
But you it's that dance, it's the two legs that you're standing on.
01:19:03.439 --> 01:19:10.880
One is stewardship and being wise about your finances, your planning, and what you and the things you're investing in and how you're saving and reinvesting.
01:19:11.039 --> 01:19:14.479
And the other leg is giving, and you can't have one without the other.
01:19:15.119 --> 01:19:17.840
Easier said than done, but I'm I'm I'm doing the best that I can.
01:19:18.079 --> 01:19:19.600
About to conclude, but your question just came to me.
01:19:19.680 --> 01:19:22.159
Now I don't know if you can answer this in one sentence or two sentences.
01:19:22.399 --> 01:19:23.119
No, we may go answer.
01:19:23.279 --> 01:19:23.840
See, the people have gone.
01:19:25.119 --> 01:19:25.920
Okay, go ahead.
01:19:26.399 --> 01:19:40.319
And we've kind of touched on it before, but I just wanted this for the viewers for clarity, because there's like I said, Nigerians love their church, their must, people are very religious, but there's also this belief that you know being religious and wealth don't necessarily go together.
01:19:40.560 --> 01:19:45.199
For someone like you, how do you reconcile the need to be successful?
01:19:45.359 --> 01:19:47.199
Yeah, and you know, chasing wealth.
01:19:47.279 --> 01:19:52.319
I don't know if you are, yeah, and also being a man who's saying okay.
01:19:52.640 --> 01:19:58.399
You need to be pious and modest in your ways to be seen as righteous.
01:19:58.640 --> 01:20:03.199
Yeah, so I think that unfortunately, over time I said two sentences.
01:20:03.600 --> 01:20:04.399
Go on, go on, go on, go on.
01:20:04.720 --> 01:20:05.920
Oh, sorry, sorry.
01:20:06.159 --> 01:20:06.960
Real quick answer.
01:20:07.680 --> 01:20:08.720
How do I shorten this?
01:20:09.279 --> 01:20:18.159
The truth is that I I think my personal opinion, the gospel has been corrupted in many spaces.
01:20:18.479 --> 01:20:18.960
Fantastic.
01:20:19.199 --> 01:20:24.159
The prosperity gospel is wrong, which is like it's very transactional.
01:20:24.239 --> 01:20:25.439
Give me, give me, give me, give me.
01:20:25.520 --> 01:20:26.319
That's all it is.
01:20:26.560 --> 01:20:34.640
But also the poverty gospel is also wrong, where just wait until you die and go to heaven and then just suffer your entire life.
01:20:34.800 --> 01:20:38.640
I don't believe in either of those models of the gospel.
01:20:38.800 --> 01:20:49.119
I believe that there's a provision gospel that God is going to provide everything that I need to bless me and my family so that I can do the best be a blessing to other people.
01:20:49.279 --> 01:20:54.720
So the Bible says, I wish above all things that you will prosper and be in good health, even as your soul prospers.
01:20:54.880 --> 01:20:59.680
So God wants, I mean, Abraham was wealthy, Isaac was wealthy, Jacob was wealthy.
01:20:59.840 --> 01:21:01.359
The disciples left what they were doing.
01:21:01.520 --> 01:21:05.279
How many of us can quit everything for three years?
01:21:05.840 --> 01:21:06.960
They were business owners.
01:21:07.039 --> 01:21:11.760
This is Peter had boats that you know that's it speaks to business structure.
01:21:13.760 --> 01:21:17.199
And by the way, fishing was like the wealth of the day.
01:21:17.359 --> 01:21:25.840
So these people were people who had businesses, who had structure, who had employees, and that's what Jesus needed somewhere to preach.
01:21:26.000 --> 01:21:30.239
He had to go to the businessman that owned the boat, say, Let me put your boat out a little bit, let me stand here.
01:21:30.319 --> 01:21:35.439
So God blesses us to put us in positions where he can use us as vessels.
01:21:35.520 --> 01:21:37.199
So that's my belief.
01:21:37.279 --> 01:21:51.279
Now I don't think that we should make it this materialistic, obsessive thing where money ceases to become an excellent tool, it now becomes your master or your god, which I think we've gotten it wrong if we're taking that.
01:21:51.359 --> 01:21:54.079
But I also don't think that we are meant to be poor.
01:21:54.399 --> 01:21:56.079
That's not God's plan for my life.
01:21:56.159 --> 01:21:56.960
In Jesus' name.
01:21:58.239 --> 01:22:02.159
And on this few points of mine, but that's what I would say.
01:22:02.640 --> 01:22:03.520
That's our show, guys.
01:22:03.680 --> 01:22:05.840
This is one of those shows where I don't feel like I need a conclusion.
01:22:06.720 --> 01:22:07.920
Just take what you can.
01:22:08.079 --> 01:22:10.399
Watch it 10 times and write your notes.
01:22:10.640 --> 01:22:12.000
Thank you very much, Tanya.
01:22:12.079 --> 01:22:13.119
Thank you very much, Kumi.
01:22:13.520 --> 01:22:14.079
What the show?
01:22:14.399 --> 01:22:14.800
Oh, man.
01:22:15.039 --> 01:22:16.880
Hopefully, you guys have learned a lot from this.
01:22:17.039 --> 01:22:17.359
Thank you.
01:22:17.520 --> 01:22:19.680
Drop your comments, share this with everybody you know.
01:22:19.760 --> 01:22:22.479
At this is not even a men's show now, this is a human show.
01:22:22.640 --> 01:22:23.119
Yeah, man.
01:22:23.279 --> 01:22:27.600
Your mothers, your sisters, everybody needs to learn from this, and I I it's been very, very impressive.
01:22:27.760 --> 01:22:29.680
And thank you, Banky, as well.
01:22:32.079 --> 01:22:33.680
Bankie will drop it his notes in the comments.
01:22:35.920 --> 01:22:38.640
Thanks, uh mentality with Abuka.
01:22:38.800 --> 01:22:39.279
Cheers, man.
01:22:39.439 --> 01:22:47.920
Cheers, thank you, guys, cheers, yes, yes, I think great show.
01:22:48.800 --> 01:22:50.800
Great show, thank you.
01:22:51.279 --> 01:22:54.479
Okay, don't forget to let me hang in the fall.
01:22:58.239 --> 01:23:04.720
This season of mentality with Abuka is brought to you by Schweppes and the Glen Lee Vet.