Episode 81 – Improving Metabolic and Mitochondrial Function Through Ice Baths With Dr. Thomas P. Seager

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Hey, everyone Welcome back to another season of
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data driven health radio.
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this show, we dive deep into how you
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can use data to measure, manage and optimize
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your health with latest science technology.
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If you've got comments, questions or feedback on
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you. And with that said, let's get into
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our next exciting episode.
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Tom Si.
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Good to see you. I'm I'm glad you're
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here. You know, I first
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remember meeting you, this was
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around the Christmas holidays,
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and it I must have been... I don't
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know. 3 or 4 years ago. We had
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dinner at
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The Henry. The Henry. Thank you. And
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we had just gotten connected somehow. I forget
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how. But
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You guys were the Og,
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and you had really in my opinion, brought
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the first real
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ice baths
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to the consumer market now, what better place
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to start a ice bath company than the
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hottest city in North America. Well, this is
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what blew my mind because I'm sitting down
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with eager at dinner and he's like this
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sucker
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will pump ice all through the Arizona summer.
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And it's hot as balls as here, You
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know? We're hitting a hundred and 20. So
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not only was it able to keep up
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outdoors in the Arizona summer, but
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I gotta be honest, I'd I've been in
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this industry for a long time prior.
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And you guys were the first ones that
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kinda broke out
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onto the scene. So
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a lot has changed since then. And
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the concept
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has really exploded since then. But you guys
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are still here, we're in your incredible facility.
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You're still building And you know, what I
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respect most about Morocco and also about you
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personally is
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your commitment to putting out high quality
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information and
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information that's backed by science, and and I
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read all your blog posts and their off
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to do. Yeah. So maybe Tom, what will
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be helpful is,
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I know the origin story because you and
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your your cofounder told it to me over
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dinner, but it's a good 1. So we'd
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love to hear the origin story, and then
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let's go from there. I'd never heard of
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Wim hof.
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I didn't know anything about this ice baths,
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but my former student, Jason S. Mh. He
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invited me to come out and do the
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wim hop breathing and you by all the
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bags of ice it's circle k, and I'd
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been taking cold showers, which made me angry.
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I hate them. And it turns out there's
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some signs behind that too 50 partial. Is
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not the same as whole body, cold water
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immersion. Whole body gets you some dive reflex
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relaxation. Partial we'll never do that for you.
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Your heart rate goes up and it never
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comes back down. So it's no wonder that
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a cold shower makes me angry, but an
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ice bath relaxes me. It's just... I didn't
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know that until I went to my first
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Wim hof. And this is
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20
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18. Yeah. Well, Jason, and I wanted to
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keep this up, especially because in Phoenix, the
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tap water gets up on, like, 90 degrees
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Fahrenheit
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no cold challenge. Right. You get, like, a
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couple of weeks in the winter. And that's
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it.
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But we got sick of buying all the
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ice. You gotta go down to the quickie
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martin. And you gotta get 200 pounds, and
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then you put it in the stock tank,
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and then 15 minutes later, it feels like
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it's all melted. Yep. Because it's a hundred
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and 20 degrees in the backyard.
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So we're both engineers and Jason said well,
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we gotta be able to do this. So
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I got a credit card out, and we
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took some old dorm fridge apart, and we
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bought some parts and We made an insulated
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stock tank and we made ice. We had
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a little party. People came over. They loved
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it. And Jeremy Mu said he wanted to
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buy 1. And so Jason, I kinda looked
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at each other, like, this should really be
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a business. That's the beacon right there my
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me. When people are pulling the product out
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of you Trying to tell you go into
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business. So we did, and I thought it
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was gonna be too a week or something.
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I thought it was gonna be like a
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niche hobby. I'm a university
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professor. I teach engineering at Asu. I didn't
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think I was gonna be running an ice
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bath business,
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but Ben greenfield put us in the boundless
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book.
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And
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people,
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they listen to Ben... If they... If Benson
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says, you gotta get a Morocco, People buy
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Mar because they trust Ben. They know that
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he tried everything under the sun. A guy
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who's gonna put stem cells in his dick.
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You know, is gonna try a lot of
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extreme things when he says this works. His
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audience believes in him. So now we're in
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the boundless book, and the business is picking
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up. Jason and Adrian quit their jobs.
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But something different happened to me.
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I was separated from my wife at the
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time. I'm going out on the dating pool,
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and I'm really self conscious about how I
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look. I'd lost a lot of weight,
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and I said, well, I should be doing
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the blood test. You know I gotta get
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serious about my health. So I got the
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full male panel
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And my Psa came back 7.
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Normal. They said is 4. So I'm looking
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at this lab report. I'm like, oh my
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gosh I'm almost Like, twice. I'm in the
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dangers aren't suppress... Cancer? Is that is that
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what they were? That's what's going through my
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mind. Like, as soon as you take the
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Psa to the Internet. Mh. They're saying way
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you're gonna dia cancer. And you're not? Like,
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all it means is you have an inflamed
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prostate and that can be indicative of prostate
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cancer. But what do I know? Like, I'm
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an engineer. And it says well, you should
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go to your medical doctor and you have
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a prostate exam. You probably have a biopsy
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and I don't wanna do any of that.
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Instead, I started talking to other guys. And
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it turns I'm now 58 at the time,
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I was probably 52.
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Everybody had a prostate story. I was talking
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to guys older than me, some of them
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younger than me. And it's kind of a
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difficult topic, but, you know, I'd say, hey,
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you know, I have a question. Like, I
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just got my Psa back. And Have you
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ever had your Psa tested and all the
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guys older than me had been through something
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and they all had horror stories. I didn't
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wanna go back to centralized medicine and have
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a biopsy that could lead to a sepsis
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infection or false positive.
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So I decided I was gonna do ke
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ketosis and ice baths every dang day. That's
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when I got really serious. I brought my
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Psa down. I'm still doing the same blood
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tests.
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And my testosterone went up through the roof.
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I was like, over 1100 nano per decade,
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purely
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accidental. And when
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I saw that number, and it all... It
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had that, you know, big warning out of
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range too high I thought, I figure out
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what's going on A scientist I'll go to
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the library.
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There was a paper I found from 19
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91.
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And these Japanese study and young men, they
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did ice bath after exercise, which was what
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everybody does. They measured testosterone and lu hormone.
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If you do the ice bath after the
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exercise, the testosterone and the lu hormone that
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stimulates testosterone production you're gon adds, they go
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down. Sure. Everybody
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Yes.
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Acutely at Yeah. But but then I presume...
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It's about... The study was short term. It
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wasn't long term, but it said, if you
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do your cold for recovery,
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you will reduce your testosterone and your lu
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hormone, which is consistent with the other literature,
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consistent with Human advice
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don't do the cold after your workout. Yep.
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At least wait 4 hours because you will
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diminish your your ana antibiotic gains. Your muscle
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gain. I've heard that.
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Well, I wrote up a little article about
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my experience, and Said, look, there's this Japanese
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study. I think this is what's going on.
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Nobody read it. Because nobody's going to Morales
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c forge dot com at this time for
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any kind of advice I was.
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Thank you, Dave. Then we go through
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Covid, and Covid really shut me out of
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the classroom. So
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instead of thinking
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wasn't gonna be kind of a part time
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thing. Everybody goes nuts for at home health.
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Everybody's health conscious.
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And I'm frankly not as busy at Asu
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as I thought I was gonna be because
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of the Covid lockdown.
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Well,
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I poured myself into growing Mo,
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and I kept getting these stories of other
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people
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Dean Hall, head Leukemia, and then he swam
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the entire length of the W River, which
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is cold by the way, and it took
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him 3 weeks, and he came out of
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that river, and add Leukemia anymore. Like all
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of these miraculous
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health transformation stories. I'd write another article, and
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I'd write another article, and
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Google didn't care.
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But then it's post Covid. I'm in iceland.
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I'm traveling now and I'm there with my
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girlfriend, Aj, and I get off the plane.
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And we're gonna see the northern lights. It's
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like December, you know,
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and my phone's blowing up, and it's all
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these text messages telling me, I'm on the
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Joe Rogan show.
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I'm like, what the hell is? I think
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I would be the first person to know
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if I was on Joe Rogan. And so
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I called somebody up, you know, what's? Like,
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what are you talking about? Goes Joe is
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reading your article. Heath about the testosterone,
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liver king just got out for j, You
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know? And now he said Derek moore plates
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more dates, and he's got David Go on
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the show and they're all talking about doing
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the ice bath before the workout for the
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testosterone boot, and he put your
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picture up there. That was all the world
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needed to hear. Once Joe said, I'm doing
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this. It's really hard, and it's working for
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me.
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People started writing to me from all over
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the world about what Still has 1 though.
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Correct? He's got a Morocco. Yeah. And for
267
00:09:38,629 --> 00:09:41,029
20 23, he really... He wouldn't shut up
268
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about it. Like, he had Jim Ga on
269
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his show. Now Jim's a famous comedian, But
270
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Jim is famous for eating junk food. You
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know, like his whole routine is how
272
00:09:51,118 --> 00:09:53,515
unhealthy he is. Mh. So Joe's like, I
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wanna tell you about I fast. They really
274
00:09:54,965 --> 00:09:57,111
work. There, you know, he's talking to the
275
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guide, the anti health comedian
276
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about his health stuff, and you can see
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this in Google trends
278
00:10:03,722 --> 00:10:05,873
searches for cold plunge and ice bath are
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going through the roof. At the time there
280
00:10:08,660 --> 00:10:12,258
were 2 or 3 companies besides us. And
281
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they didn't even make Ice, but there were
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these these sort of innovative companies at the
283
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leading edge. Then you can see it in
284
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20 23, all these Chinese chiller, inflatable tub,
285
00:10:21,921 --> 00:10:22,081
like,
286
00:10:23,359 --> 00:10:25,915
the instagram feed now is is is littered
287
00:10:25,915 --> 00:10:29,387
with them every type barrels and inflatable and
288
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everything under the sun. David, it's given the
289
00:10:31,683 --> 00:10:33,761
industry a really bad name. Sure. Yeah. People
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are starting to call us and ask us
291
00:10:36,333 --> 00:10:36,833
questions
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00:10:37,292 --> 00:10:38,889
about the things that they've seen on other
293
00:10:38,889 --> 00:10:41,286
people's websites as if we were 1 of
294
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the same companies,
295
00:10:42,819 --> 00:10:45,310
So we just wrapped up a study of
296
00:10:45,447 --> 00:10:45,947
warranty,
297
00:10:46,482 --> 00:10:49,031
terms of service and return refund policies in
298
00:10:49,031 --> 00:10:51,101
the Cold Fund industry. Oh, good 1.
299
00:10:51,835 --> 00:10:52,335
It's
300
00:10:52,714 --> 00:10:53,695
stunning. The
301
00:10:54,315 --> 00:10:57,214
market. Yeah. The restock fees, the warranty
302
00:10:57,754 --> 00:10:59,995
exclusions. Like, if you buy from 1 of
303
00:10:59,995 --> 00:11:02,084
our competitors, and it shows up broken.
304
00:11:02,721 --> 00:11:04,633
They will mail you a new part, but
305
00:11:04,633 --> 00:11:06,705
you gotta pay the labor and the shipping
306
00:11:06,705 --> 00:11:08,059
on the part. So you gotta find your
307
00:11:08,059 --> 00:11:10,264
own plumber and your own electrician to install
308
00:11:10,464 --> 00:11:12,378
their broken part. You've decided you're not happy
309
00:11:12,378 --> 00:11:14,133
with that. You can ship it back. For
310
00:11:14,133 --> 00:11:15,488
a refund as long as it's still in
311
00:11:15,488 --> 00:11:17,482
the original packaging. Yeah. I've heard a lot
312
00:11:17,482 --> 00:11:18,838
of these these kinds of like,
313
00:11:20,208 --> 00:11:22,986
Yeah. Because they're all stories basically. Feel about
314
00:11:22,986 --> 00:11:25,050
crap units and stuff like that. That's where
315
00:11:25,050 --> 00:11:27,431
our industry is going sadly. But I spend
316
00:11:27,431 --> 00:11:28,804
my 20 23
317
00:11:29,193 --> 00:11:32,000
writing a book. It's got more than 600
318
00:11:32,057 --> 00:11:32,557
scientific
319
00:11:33,409 --> 00:11:35,398
citations in it, and there's, you know, 13
320
00:11:35,398 --> 00:11:37,466
chapters on all these different aspects.
321
00:11:38,119 --> 00:11:40,217
Including the risks and dangers and the contra
322
00:11:40,516 --> 00:11:43,153
indications and are you working on metabolism? Are
323
00:11:43,153 --> 00:11:44,910
you working on brain health? Or are you
324
00:11:44,910 --> 00:11:48,042
working on sexual performance and function and fertility.
325
00:11:48,441 --> 00:11:51,637
So I spent my 20 23 in the
326
00:11:51,637 --> 00:11:53,395
library, and I probably should have spent to
327
00:11:53,475 --> 00:11:55,718
Deep on Instagram buying a bunch of ads
328
00:11:55,718 --> 00:11:58,025
and doing some sensational claims and things like
329
00:11:58,025 --> 00:12:00,173
that. Well, the content you put out.
330
00:12:01,064 --> 00:12:03,299
I get a ton of stuff coming through
331
00:12:03,299 --> 00:12:03,778
my inbox,
332
00:12:04,496 --> 00:12:06,034
but I read every single 1
333
00:12:06,492 --> 00:12:08,748
because I know it's going to be
334
00:12:09,206 --> 00:12:09,605
objective.
335
00:12:10,179 --> 00:12:10,679
And
336
00:12:11,138 --> 00:12:12,337
it's gonna be well cited,
337
00:12:13,376 --> 00:12:15,054
and it's gonna be information I can trust,
338
00:12:15,293 --> 00:12:16,971
and this is a therapy that I wanna
339
00:12:16,971 --> 00:12:18,590
use beyond health. So
340
00:12:18,904 --> 00:12:20,419
maybe you could have gone and done that,
341
00:12:20,658 --> 00:12:23,131
but I think the... I would've stun it
342
00:12:23,131 --> 00:12:25,205
at Instagram ads. I do too. You know,
343
00:12:25,364 --> 00:12:27,358
But the value of what you're building is
344
00:12:27,358 --> 00:12:28,475
also a compounding asset.
345
00:12:29,127 --> 00:12:31,119
Of all of that information and the brand
346
00:12:31,119 --> 00:12:32,814
and the trust and no 1 else
347
00:12:33,191 --> 00:12:33,669
can really.
348
00:12:34,386 --> 00:12:35,820
People tell me that. They write to me.
349
00:12:36,154 --> 00:12:37,988
And they thank me for putting out these
350
00:12:37,988 --> 00:12:40,062
articles. Thank you. Every time the reason I
351
00:12:40,142 --> 00:12:42,136
I get a nice snow on point. Yep.
352
00:12:42,615 --> 00:12:44,608
That's because I've changed my whole academic career.
353
00:12:44,928 --> 00:12:47,171
I used to be a sustainability guy. I
354
00:12:47,171 --> 00:12:48,362
used to be all about the environment.
355
00:12:48,998 --> 00:12:51,540
And I've changed my focus, and I think
356
00:12:51,540 --> 00:12:53,073
it was really Covid that
357
00:12:53,605 --> 00:12:55,612
redirected me because we have a public health
358
00:12:55,612 --> 00:12:57,687
crisis in this country. You know that life
359
00:12:57,687 --> 00:13:00,342
expectancy in the United States peaked in 20
360
00:13:00,561 --> 00:13:02,955
18. It's not Covid that has driven it
361
00:13:02,955 --> 00:13:04,748
down it was going down
362
00:13:05,127 --> 00:13:08,402
before we hit the pandemic grade. So what
363
00:13:08,402 --> 00:13:10,971
is going on and it's all metabolism. All
364
00:13:10,971 --> 00:13:13,832
the chronic illnesses, all the illnesses that are
365
00:13:13,832 --> 00:13:16,216
associated with aging, all the increased rates of
366
00:13:16,216 --> 00:13:19,809
mortality, They tie back to metabolic dysfunction. You
367
00:13:19,809 --> 00:13:22,203
know, how to fix your metabolism. Well... I
368
00:13:22,203 --> 00:13:23,799
mean, yes, you can eliminate the seed oils,
369
00:13:23,878 --> 00:13:25,155
you can get your sleep right, You can
370
00:13:25,155 --> 00:13:26,831
get your light right. All these things are
371
00:13:26,831 --> 00:13:29,155
fine. But if all you can do is
372
00:13:29,155 --> 00:13:31,942
get into your ice bath 2, 3 minutes
373
00:13:31,942 --> 00:13:33,773
a day. You're gonna build your brown fat.
374
00:13:33,932 --> 00:13:35,938
You're gonna increase your insulin since ti, you're
375
00:13:35,938 --> 00:13:38,570
gonna resolve that metabolic dysfunction. You're gonna stimulate
376
00:13:38,570 --> 00:13:40,724
the bio and you're gonna extend your life.
377
00:13:41,202 --> 00:13:43,834
And that's without diet changes. That's without exercise,
378
00:13:44,153 --> 00:13:45,031
which, by the way,
379
00:13:45,684 --> 00:13:46,742
I recommend
380
00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:49,354
it's just that we don't have the cold
381
00:13:49,354 --> 00:13:51,588
that our bodies are expecting. Instead, we have
382
00:13:51,588 --> 00:13:52,545
heated leather seats.
383
00:13:53,118 --> 00:13:55,900
Yeah. Well, that's a good segue. Because before
384
00:13:55,900 --> 00:13:57,728
this interview, I said, hey, If I'm coming
385
00:13:57,728 --> 00:13:58,682
in this with fresh eyes,
386
00:13:59,477 --> 00:14:01,225
and I wanted to know what are some
387
00:14:01,225 --> 00:14:01,964
of the
388
00:14:02,274 --> 00:14:04,754
the top 5 were the top x I
389
00:14:04,754 --> 00:14:07,475
said to you. Health benefits of who should
390
00:14:07,475 --> 00:14:07,975
use
391
00:14:08,915 --> 00:14:09,654
ice bath
392
00:14:09,970 --> 00:14:11,649
what would those be? You sent me that
393
00:14:11,649 --> 00:14:13,590
list. So I'd love to go through them
394
00:14:13,730 --> 00:14:15,889
briefly and talk about them. But before we
395
00:14:15,889 --> 00:14:17,670
do, I think it's also important
396
00:14:18,143 --> 00:14:19,916
just to make a subtle distinction
397
00:14:20,450 --> 00:14:22,860
between ice baths and
398
00:14:23,394 --> 00:14:23,871
cold plunge.
399
00:14:24,747 --> 00:14:26,815
And so maybe you could just clarify that.
400
00:14:27,069 --> 00:14:29,139
For people because there is a difference. They
401
00:14:29,139 --> 00:14:33,198
both have therapeutic value, but there's a 45
402
00:14:33,198 --> 00:14:33,698
degree
403
00:14:34,153 --> 00:14:34,472
exposure.
404
00:14:35,044 --> 00:14:37,114
You know, and then there's 32 degree exposure.
405
00:14:37,432 --> 00:14:39,285
I think I heard Joe Rogan say that
406
00:14:39,422 --> 00:14:42,049
anything above 38 just isn't that interesting to
407
00:14:42,049 --> 00:14:42,606
him anymore.
408
00:14:43,257 --> 00:14:44,926
That doesn't mean everyone has to go down
409
00:14:44,926 --> 00:14:47,072
to that level. There's incredible stuff that can
410
00:14:47,072 --> 00:14:50,091
happen across the spectrum of those temperatures, but
411
00:14:50,091 --> 00:14:52,173
could you just clarify that for us? There
412
00:14:52,173 --> 00:14:54,406
was a conversation that Joe had with Gary
413
00:14:54,565 --> 00:14:57,116
B. And Gary's is now so well known.
414
00:14:57,276 --> 00:14:59,827
He's got a super popular like podcast himself,
415
00:14:59,986 --> 00:15:02,957
and Gary says to Joe. I haven't seen
416
00:15:02,957 --> 00:15:04,395
a lot of evidence that there, you know,
417
00:15:04,555 --> 00:15:06,712
any benefit from going down to those cold
418
00:15:06,712 --> 00:15:08,390
temperatures. So why do you do it? And
419
00:15:08,470 --> 00:15:08,790
Joe goes?
420
00:15:09,523 --> 00:15:11,754
Because it sucks worse. And I thought... That's
421
00:15:11,754 --> 00:15:13,825
our new marketing tagline line. Right? There. Mar
422
00:15:13,825 --> 00:15:15,977
coast sucks worse, and that's why you should
423
00:15:15,977 --> 00:15:18,861
do it. He's right after you get acclimated,
424
00:15:19,738 --> 00:15:22,688
38 39 is boring. Now when you're first
425
00:15:22,688 --> 00:15:24,442
starting out and it takes about 2 weeks
426
00:15:24,442 --> 00:15:26,131
to build that brown fat and build your
427
00:15:26,131 --> 00:15:28,921
thermal regulation mechanisms. Are, like, it happens pretty
428
00:15:28,921 --> 00:15:32,609
quick. Sure. The fat remodel, your blood vessels
429
00:15:32,747 --> 00:15:33,247
remodel
430
00:15:33,559 --> 00:15:35,314
But after you get acclimated,
431
00:15:36,111 --> 00:15:38,584
40 degrees fahrenheit... It doesn't give you the
432
00:15:38,584 --> 00:15:40,339
same gas reflex. It doesn't give you the
433
00:15:40,339 --> 00:15:41,397
same psychological
434
00:15:41,854 --> 00:15:44,022
shock, you get in there. And Joe is
435
00:15:44,022 --> 00:15:46,412
looking for that fight flight. He's looking for
436
00:15:46,412 --> 00:15:47,550
that parasympathetic
437
00:15:48,245 --> 00:15:49,144
nervous system
438
00:15:49,998 --> 00:15:50,157
activation.
439
00:15:51,208 --> 00:15:53,598
That's what I'm looking for too, and you
440
00:15:53,598 --> 00:15:56,227
need to consistently do it with the ice
441
00:15:56,227 --> 00:15:58,856
chunks floating in the water to get those
442
00:15:58,856 --> 00:16:00,152
psychological benefits
443
00:16:00,464 --> 00:16:01,734
But if all you're trying to do is
444
00:16:01,734 --> 00:16:03,797
reverse your type 2 diabetes, which is huge.
445
00:16:04,035 --> 00:16:05,464
If you're trying to get off the insulin,
446
00:16:06,020 --> 00:16:07,845
then 40 gonna be fine, you can get
447
00:16:07,845 --> 00:16:10,243
a lot of metabolic benefits in the low
448
00:16:10,243 --> 00:16:12,970
forties, and most of these cheap chiller companies
449
00:16:13,106 --> 00:16:14,934
can get down to the... Not outside in
450
00:16:15,253 --> 00:16:17,891
Arizona summer. But if you're inside most of
451
00:16:17,891 --> 00:16:19,243
them can do it and they're cheaper than.
452
00:16:20,197 --> 00:16:23,537
Well, you know, another thing, Tom is, also,
453
00:16:24,411 --> 00:16:26,576
you you mean that a remark from Joe.
454
00:16:26,735 --> 00:16:28,489
It just sucks more. You know what I
455
00:16:28,489 --> 00:16:30,801
mean? Which which implies there is some pain
456
00:16:30,801 --> 00:16:31,598
to go through.
457
00:16:32,236 --> 00:16:33,750
But in my experience,
458
00:16:34,244 --> 00:16:37,117
it actually is a spiritual experience. Yeah.
459
00:16:38,075 --> 00:16:38,575
Because
460
00:16:39,112 --> 00:16:41,767
you are learning how to work with
461
00:16:42,398 --> 00:16:45,015
your own mind. And you are learning how
462
00:16:45,015 --> 00:16:47,578
to regulate your physiology through
463
00:16:47,950 --> 00:16:50,116
an extreme experience. And
464
00:16:50,504 --> 00:16:52,097
1 of the things I learned many years
465
00:16:52,097 --> 00:16:54,508
ago when I was doing intense the pos
466
00:16:54,804 --> 00:16:55,043
meditation.
467
00:16:55,919 --> 00:16:56,419
Was
468
00:16:56,795 --> 00:16:58,728
they taught you how to
469
00:16:59,519 --> 00:17:01,840
sit for very long periods of time, and
470
00:17:01,840 --> 00:17:03,059
you got really physically
471
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:03,840
uncomfortable,
472
00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:04,820
but
473
00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:05,940
you were
474
00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:06,900
trained
475
00:17:07,615 --> 00:17:08,755
to not react
476
00:17:09,215 --> 00:17:10,975
in a positive or negative way. Now, that
477
00:17:10,975 --> 00:17:12,494
doesn't mean you don't feel.
478
00:17:13,134 --> 00:17:14,894
It just doesn't... It means you don't react.
479
00:17:15,055 --> 00:17:17,146
And what that taught me was how to
480
00:17:17,146 --> 00:17:20,250
be in situations in life that were unpleasant,
481
00:17:20,887 --> 00:17:23,036
but not to have to react in a
482
00:17:23,036 --> 00:17:25,424
way that was unpleasant. That's the part you
483
00:17:25,424 --> 00:17:28,141
get to choose. How do you respond? And
484
00:17:28,141 --> 00:17:31,079
in the yoga traditions, they call they call
485
00:17:31,079 --> 00:17:32,055
cold exposure
486
00:17:32,429 --> 00:17:32,929
Ish.
487
00:17:33,461 --> 00:17:35,470
What you probably have heard of, which means
488
00:17:35,859 --> 00:17:37,715
when you can get in that cold
489
00:17:38,092 --> 00:17:38,592
and
490
00:17:39,368 --> 00:17:42,319
get through the shock experience, survive that first
491
00:17:42,319 --> 00:17:45,031
60 seconds a hundred and 20 seconds. They
492
00:17:45,031 --> 00:17:47,032
said If you can survive that,
493
00:17:48,064 --> 00:17:50,684
you can survive any challenge in life. Yep.
494
00:17:51,002 --> 00:17:53,066
You know? So for me, the spiritual experience,
495
00:17:53,304 --> 00:17:54,280
first of all means
496
00:17:54,749 --> 00:17:57,240
Am I able to go mind over matter
497
00:17:57,377 --> 00:18:00,403
on this. You know, that alone is like
498
00:18:00,403 --> 00:18:01,858
a massive, massive
499
00:18:02,314 --> 00:18:02,814
challenge
500
00:18:03,524 --> 00:18:05,779
and experience just to learn how to regulate
501
00:18:05,998 --> 00:18:08,232
yourself through it. But then when you go
502
00:18:08,232 --> 00:18:09,588
to all this crazy shit, you and I
503
00:18:09,588 --> 00:18:11,997
are doing starting companies and jumping off a
504
00:18:11,997 --> 00:18:13,055
cliff with no parachute.
505
00:18:13,990 --> 00:18:14,968
You know, Metaphorically.
506
00:18:15,425 --> 00:18:16,860
Metaphorically, It's like, hey.
507
00:18:17,578 --> 00:18:19,013
I can do that. You know, I can
508
00:18:19,013 --> 00:18:22,314
get through any challenging experience in life. So
509
00:18:22,529 --> 00:18:24,120
even when I go to my place since
510
00:18:24,279 --> 00:18:26,665
Scottsdale, I'll see people of women or a
511
00:18:26,665 --> 00:18:28,176
man approaching the cold plunge,
512
00:18:28,829 --> 00:18:31,403
And they they go through a an experience
513
00:18:31,461 --> 00:18:33,614
where they close their eyes. They center themselves.
514
00:18:34,412 --> 00:18:36,087
They'll maybe even do a little bit of
515
00:18:36,087 --> 00:18:37,842
yoga and some breath work. You know, they're
516
00:18:37,842 --> 00:18:38,342
really
517
00:18:38,734 --> 00:18:41,312
getting out of their head and going inward
518
00:18:41,771 --> 00:18:43,849
to this experience, like, that's the part that
519
00:18:44,009 --> 00:18:45,607
I really geek out on. I think you're
520
00:18:45,607 --> 00:18:47,306
on the right track. That's the psychological.
521
00:18:47,938 --> 00:18:50,082
What I I used to work in infrastructure
522
00:18:50,082 --> 00:18:52,543
resilience, and I still do, do consulting for
523
00:18:52,543 --> 00:18:54,448
the army corps and for the navy. So
524
00:18:54,448 --> 00:18:56,592
it's disaster response and recovery.
525
00:18:57,164 --> 00:18:59,555
I'm much more interested in human resilience. Now,
526
00:18:59,954 --> 00:19:01,788
because the resilience isn't in the concrete or
527
00:19:01,788 --> 00:19:03,940
in the steel or in the dams, it's
528
00:19:03,940 --> 00:19:05,557
in the creative response
529
00:19:05,869 --> 00:19:07,627
to the disaster or to the stress or
530
00:19:07,627 --> 00:19:09,864
to the catastrophe, whatever it is. So I've
531
00:19:09,864 --> 00:19:10,684
gotten really
532
00:19:11,223 --> 00:19:13,241
curious now about psychology
533
00:19:13,874 --> 00:19:15,707
in a way that has surprised me because
534
00:19:15,787 --> 00:19:18,040
I'm a trained civil and environmental
535
00:19:18,497 --> 00:19:18,736
engineer.
536
00:19:19,533 --> 00:19:21,627
I've talked to probably a dozen
537
00:19:22,019 --> 00:19:24,736
super elite athletes, all different sports. So we're
538
00:19:24,736 --> 00:19:25,875
talking golfers,
539
00:19:26,813 --> 00:19:27,053
Nfl,
540
00:19:27,692 --> 00:19:29,310
Ml b. These are people
541
00:19:29,624 --> 00:19:33,049
you know, signing guaranteed multimillion million dollar contracts
542
00:19:33,049 --> 00:19:35,200
playing in the pro bowl, playing in the
543
00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:35,758
Super Bowl,
544
00:19:36,555 --> 00:19:37,988
and they tell me the same thing that
545
00:19:38,068 --> 00:19:38,546
Joseph.
546
00:19:39,118 --> 00:19:42,539
They'll spend what feels like 15 minutes since
547
00:19:42,539 --> 00:19:45,823
probably only like 45 seconds, but staring down
548
00:19:45,880 --> 00:19:47,255
at that Mo.
549
00:19:48,042 --> 00:19:50,899
Seeing that ice. They say the worst part
550
00:19:50,899 --> 00:19:53,462
of the ice bath is the 15 seconds
551
00:19:53,596 --> 00:19:55,517
before they get into the ice bath. Because
552
00:19:55,517 --> 00:19:57,267
we all have this voice inside our head.
553
00:19:57,506 --> 00:19:59,733
Yeah. It says, you know, I I can
554
00:19:59,733 --> 00:20:01,721
probably... I can maybe skip a day. Like,
555
00:20:02,214 --> 00:20:03,811
I don't, I'm not even on Instagram right
556
00:20:03,811 --> 00:20:06,605
now. Nobody's even watching, you know? And this
557
00:20:06,605 --> 00:20:09,079
these are people, like Fred Warner. He makes
558
00:20:09,079 --> 00:20:10,756
12 tackle in the Super Bowl and you
559
00:20:10,756 --> 00:20:12,764
think this guy fearless. Right? He goes,
560
00:20:14,039 --> 00:20:14,539
sometimes
561
00:20:15,155 --> 00:20:17,227
that cold water, like, you know?
562
00:20:18,104 --> 00:20:19,713
Joe calls it his little bit. You know,
563
00:20:19,952 --> 00:20:22,104
it just turns him into a little bitch.
564
00:20:22,343 --> 00:20:24,256
Wow. Well, when Joe was talking to David
565
00:20:24,415 --> 00:20:27,046
Go. And you, stay hard. Right, David, is
566
00:20:27,046 --> 00:20:29,529
like, the brave most courageous person he goes,
567
00:20:30,007 --> 00:20:32,474
there is nothing that will make you question
568
00:20:32,474 --> 00:20:34,863
everything in your life, like cold water.
569
00:20:35,835 --> 00:20:37,515
I didn't know at the time. The data
570
00:20:37,674 --> 00:20:40,654
Go has ren syndrome. Ren syndrome.
571
00:20:41,195 --> 00:20:43,355
Is this like, it's a feedback loop it's
572
00:20:43,355 --> 00:20:44,174
a psycho
573
00:20:45,049 --> 00:20:47,609
physiological over reaction to the cold. So his
574
00:20:47,609 --> 00:20:50,650
months after Go was on humor podcast, and
575
00:20:50,650 --> 00:20:53,210
he posted pictures of his fingers, and they
576
00:20:53,210 --> 00:20:55,216
were chalk white because They had no blood
577
00:20:55,216 --> 00:20:57,598
in him. This is his Ren reaction to
578
00:20:57,598 --> 00:20:59,265
the familiar that. I have a loved 1
579
00:20:59,265 --> 00:21:01,409
who is dealing with that same Yeah. As
580
00:21:01,409 --> 00:21:03,889
do I. A aj used to suffer from
581
00:21:03,889 --> 00:21:06,037
nods, and now there are 2 case studies
582
00:21:06,037 --> 00:21:07,310
even though you would think ren not is
583
00:21:07,310 --> 00:21:09,953
a contra indication to bath, There are 2
584
00:21:09,953 --> 00:21:12,271
case studies. 1 that I've supervised with A
585
00:21:12,271 --> 00:21:14,588
j, and named Mike Mu has also supervised
586
00:21:14,588 --> 00:21:16,846
a woman who runs the high intensity health
587
00:21:16,905 --> 00:21:19,894
podcast. And they both use the bath to
588
00:21:20,112 --> 00:21:23,144
overcome their rey and sure enough, there is
589
00:21:23,144 --> 00:21:25,866
something called exposure there sometimes it's called stress
590
00:21:25,866 --> 00:21:26,366
and
591
00:21:26,820 --> 00:21:29,148
therapy. Mh. Where you... Yeah. You gradually
592
00:21:29,682 --> 00:21:32,566
yourself yourself. Yep. Exactly. That's psychological
593
00:21:33,020 --> 00:21:33,417
benefit.
594
00:21:34,148 --> 00:21:37,173
When you're doing the exposure therapy, you're breaking
595
00:21:37,173 --> 00:21:37,992
this psychological
596
00:21:38,766 --> 00:21:41,234
physiological feedback loop, and then you come out
597
00:21:41,234 --> 00:21:43,971
of the water, Feeling I you've just cheated
598
00:21:44,026 --> 00:21:46,483
death for the people who say, well, I
599
00:21:46,483 --> 00:21:48,702
hate the cold. Gordon Ryan. He's on the
600
00:21:48,781 --> 00:21:50,868
Joe Rogan show. There's something... You need to
601
00:21:50,868 --> 00:21:52,466
know about me. He he's, like, fucking hate
602
00:21:52,466 --> 00:21:54,303
the gold. He was so proud of himself
603
00:21:54,303 --> 00:21:55,501
because he did, like, 45,
604
00:21:55,821 --> 00:21:58,309
and then Joe said, No. You gotta do
605
00:21:58,309 --> 00:22:01,178
33, you know, just like I do. So
606
00:22:01,178 --> 00:22:03,272
he did. And then he got a Costco
607
00:22:03,409 --> 00:22:04,467
because there's something
608
00:22:04,858 --> 00:22:07,872
once you've discovered it, you don't wanna give
609
00:22:07,872 --> 00:22:09,696
it up. You're like, I'm gonna go back.
610
00:22:09,855 --> 00:22:12,552
I'm gonna start every day with that win.
611
00:22:12,964 --> 00:22:14,724
And then everything else in my life seems
612
00:22:14,724 --> 00:22:16,964
like it's nothing. So, you know, getting
613
00:22:17,525 --> 00:22:18,884
down to some of the brass tax here.
614
00:22:19,044 --> 00:22:21,044
You you've hinted at some of the metabolic
615
00:22:21,044 --> 00:22:21,544
benefits
616
00:22:22,098 --> 00:22:24,347
of this. We all know that
617
00:22:25,279 --> 00:22:27,051
metabolic dysfunction is
618
00:22:27,425 --> 00:22:30,025
epidemic. There's different ways to tackle it, but
619
00:22:30,303 --> 00:22:32,053
I asked you. Could you lay out... These
620
00:22:32,053 --> 00:22:32,292
are
621
00:22:33,167 --> 00:22:34,201
Tom Si top 5.
622
00:22:34,996 --> 00:22:37,039
So let's run through them here, Tom and
623
00:22:37,238 --> 00:22:38,351
And the first is
624
00:22:38,907 --> 00:22:40,893
the first reason you'd wanna maybe do this
625
00:22:40,893 --> 00:22:42,347
in the first place is
626
00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:43,380
metabolic
627
00:22:43,992 --> 00:22:46,149
dysfunction. So that could be
628
00:22:46,545 --> 00:22:47,417
insulin resistance.
629
00:22:48,052 --> 00:22:50,747
It could be obesity weight gain. It could
630
00:22:50,747 --> 00:22:51,723
be Pcos
631
00:22:52,269 --> 00:22:54,522
There's lots of things that happen or e
632
00:22:54,580 --> 00:22:56,173
dysfunction. There's lots of things that that really...
633
00:22:56,492 --> 00:22:57,470
The root cause
634
00:22:57,846 --> 00:22:58,346
is
635
00:22:58,802 --> 00:23:02,428
insulin resistant including cancer, including heart disease, including
636
00:23:02,567 --> 00:23:02,806
alzheimer's.
637
00:23:04,083 --> 00:23:06,477
Disease can't exactly right. The big ones origins
638
00:23:06,477 --> 00:23:08,405
and the metabolism. And I've read some of
639
00:23:08,405 --> 00:23:08,644
your
640
00:23:09,362 --> 00:23:11,353
posts before. And, you know, the 1 thing
641
00:23:11,433 --> 00:23:13,903
I've yet to do, which I normally wear
642
00:23:13,903 --> 00:23:14,461
a Cg.
643
00:23:14,953 --> 00:23:17,021
A dex home. Yeah continuous glucose monitor.
644
00:23:17,657 --> 00:23:19,645
But I have not been able to test
645
00:23:19,645 --> 00:23:20,145
that
646
00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:22,190
pre post ice bath, and I don't even
647
00:23:22,190 --> 00:23:24,178
know how quickly you'd you'd see anything.
648
00:23:24,829 --> 00:23:27,089
Know, there's obviously also measurements like
649
00:23:27,390 --> 00:23:28,450
fasting insulin
650
00:23:28,750 --> 00:23:31,329
and hemoglobin 1 a1c. Those... Your testing
651
00:23:31,710 --> 00:23:32,085
more
652
00:23:32,599 --> 00:23:34,763
episodic, like every 3 or 6 months. But
653
00:23:34,897 --> 00:23:37,299
can you help us understand, the mechanisms
654
00:23:37,908 --> 00:23:38,408
biologically
655
00:23:39,749 --> 00:23:41,048
between the cold
656
00:23:41,507 --> 00:23:43,904
and how our body processes some.
657
00:23:45,582 --> 00:23:46,940
Had to learn a lot about insulin. I
658
00:23:46,940 --> 00:23:49,288
didn't want to. Didn't wanna become a metabolism
659
00:23:49,743 --> 00:23:52,211
expert, but it was in 2001 in the
660
00:23:52,211 --> 00:23:52,529
winter,
661
00:23:53,166 --> 00:23:55,394
and my son was very sick. I didn't
662
00:23:55,394 --> 00:23:56,668
know it was wrong. It was 6 years
663
00:23:56,668 --> 00:23:56,827
old.
664
00:23:57,637 --> 00:24:00,253
And my wife called our doctors also our
665
00:24:00,253 --> 00:24:01,442
next door neighbor, you know, because you're in
666
00:24:01,442 --> 00:24:03,266
a small town in Northern New York. And
667
00:24:03,266 --> 00:24:04,955
my wife saying, well, you know, he's
668
00:24:05,263 --> 00:24:07,594
got a fever and he doesn't have any
669
00:24:07,651 --> 00:24:10,278
energy and our pediatrician said he's probably got
670
00:24:10,278 --> 00:24:11,631
the flu. You know, going around, and then
671
00:24:11,631 --> 00:24:13,700
my wife said, and he's peeing the bed
672
00:24:13,700 --> 00:24:14,178
a lot.
673
00:24:15,148 --> 00:24:17,374
And she didn't tell me, but on that
674
00:24:17,374 --> 00:24:19,044
phone call John told her.
675
00:24:19,839 --> 00:24:22,065
Meet me the emergency room right away. Your
676
00:24:22,065 --> 00:24:23,973
son has diabetes and your life is gonna
677
00:24:23,973 --> 00:24:25,979
change. But my wife didn't wanna believe it.
678
00:24:26,378 --> 00:24:28,052
She just said, oh, John says to me
679
00:24:28,052 --> 00:24:30,204
us at the hospital. You know? So we
680
00:24:30,204 --> 00:24:32,436
lived across the street. I carried him over.
681
00:24:33,088 --> 00:24:35,709
And they take them right away. Like, they
682
00:24:35,709 --> 00:24:38,568
admitted him to the pediatric Icu, and I'm
683
00:24:38,568 --> 00:24:39,919
still kind of in the dark like, what's
684
00:24:39,919 --> 00:24:40,316
going on.
685
00:24:41,364 --> 00:24:43,061
John comes up to me with an orange
686
00:24:43,279 --> 00:24:45,512
and a syringe. He says nobody 1 leaves
687
00:24:45,512 --> 00:24:47,746
his hospital until you figure these out. Like,
688
00:24:47,906 --> 00:24:50,065
John, What are you talking about? Goes? This
689
00:24:50,065 --> 00:24:52,128
is an insulin syringe. Your son has diabetes.
690
00:24:52,367 --> 00:24:54,350
That means he doesn't make insulin anymore. You're
691
00:24:54,350 --> 00:24:56,112
gonna be checking his blood sugar you're gonna
692
00:24:56,112 --> 00:24:57,781
be injecting him with this insulin until he
693
00:24:57,781 --> 00:24:58,893
figures out how to do this himself.
694
00:25:00,403 --> 00:25:02,231
I had to read everything. I had to
695
00:25:02,231 --> 00:25:03,915
1 or type 2. This is type 1.
696
00:25:04,153 --> 00:25:06,219
This is not... Like, when we talk about
697
00:25:06,219 --> 00:25:09,158
diabetes being epidemic. That's type 2. Yeah. This
698
00:25:09,158 --> 00:25:09,897
is a
699
00:25:10,270 --> 00:25:13,221
autoimmune disorder in which His own immune system
700
00:25:13,221 --> 00:25:15,306
has attacked the isle cells in his pancreas
701
00:25:15,677 --> 00:25:17,500
that make insulin. He doesn't make it anymore.
702
00:25:17,975 --> 00:25:20,453
He needs to get it exogenous. This is
703
00:25:20,453 --> 00:25:23,081
before Cg. This is before insulin pumps. And
704
00:25:23,081 --> 00:25:24,913
so we gotta to prick his finger. We
705
00:25:24,913 --> 00:25:26,664
learn how to prick his arm. We gotta
706
00:25:26,664 --> 00:25:29,941
give him injections at least 2 sometimes 3
707
00:25:29,941 --> 00:25:33,042
times a day. I kept sc records because
708
00:25:33,042 --> 00:25:34,871
at the time, I just finished my dis.
709
00:25:35,109 --> 00:25:36,858
Right? And I've got my lab no books
710
00:25:36,858 --> 00:25:39,109
and where writing down all his exercise and
711
00:25:39,109 --> 00:25:40,630
all of his injections and things like that.
712
00:25:41,109 --> 00:25:43,130
And Dave, there is no
713
00:25:43,589 --> 00:25:45,845
amount of insulin you can give us 6
714
00:25:45,845 --> 00:25:48,244
year old boy that will prevent an insulin
715
00:25:48,244 --> 00:25:50,724
spike from an Oreo cookie. I had every
716
00:25:50,724 --> 00:25:53,044
food mapped out and the American Diabetes
717
00:25:53,444 --> 00:25:55,214
Association wanted me to believe that he eating
718
00:25:55,214 --> 00:25:57,514
anything he wants. Cupcakes. No problem, birthday cake.
719
00:25:57,673 --> 00:26:00,369
No problem. Whatever he likes breakfast cereal just
720
00:26:00,369 --> 00:26:02,034
feed him to as long as you bolus
721
00:26:02,034 --> 00:26:04,204
for it. But I had the data right
722
00:26:04,204 --> 00:26:06,044
there in our lab books saying,
723
00:26:06,764 --> 00:26:09,565
this is crazy. He's up to 02:20. I'm
724
00:26:09,565 --> 00:26:11,565
not gonna give them another 6 units of
725
00:26:11,565 --> 00:26:13,013
h you know, so that he can have
726
00:26:13,013 --> 00:26:15,479
cinnamon toast crunch. I'm switching this kid to,
727
00:26:15,558 --> 00:26:18,104
like, eggs and whole wheat toast, which he
728
00:26:18,104 --> 00:26:18,342
enjoys.
729
00:26:19,075 --> 00:26:21,075
And then I looked at my daughter who's
730
00:26:21,075 --> 00:26:22,595
2 and a half years younger than him.
731
00:26:23,154 --> 00:26:24,994
And I said, you know, if an Oreo
732
00:26:24,994 --> 00:26:27,315
is doing this to him. What's it do?
733
00:26:27,889 --> 00:26:30,143
Oreos are right out. All of these concentrated
734
00:26:30,441 --> 00:26:33,551
processed carbs, we gave them your diet starts
735
00:26:33,551 --> 00:26:36,124
in the grocery store. And so we eliminated
736
00:26:36,342 --> 00:26:39,539
all of that from the very like start
737
00:26:39,539 --> 00:26:41,208
of the new millennium. Well,
738
00:26:42,162 --> 00:26:43,434
I mean, he grows up. And, of course,
739
00:26:43,593 --> 00:26:45,198
he can take care himself in we get
740
00:26:45,198 --> 00:26:47,108
the pump when we get that technology is
741
00:26:47,108 --> 00:26:49,416
going way through the roof. But what I
742
00:26:49,416 --> 00:26:51,644
learned from that is I could not trust
743
00:26:51,644 --> 00:26:52,303
the diet.
744
00:26:52,774 --> 00:26:54,072
I could not trust the endo.
745
00:26:54,450 --> 00:26:56,205
I could not trust the information that I
746
00:26:56,205 --> 00:26:58,359
was getting from the American diabetes associated that
747
00:26:58,359 --> 00:26:59,796
was making my son sick.
748
00:27:00,528 --> 00:27:03,230
So it was for me the origins of
749
00:27:03,230 --> 00:27:05,853
what they call do your own research, you
750
00:27:05,853 --> 00:27:07,784
know? And that's said der
751
00:27:08,158 --> 00:27:09,032
on Twitter.
752
00:27:09,604 --> 00:27:11,120
But I'm the only thing I trust now.
753
00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:11,837
Sure Yeah.
754
00:27:12,715 --> 00:27:14,868
So this is where I learned about metabolism.
755
00:27:15,028 --> 00:27:17,580
This is where I became my own expert
756
00:27:17,580 --> 00:27:18,617
on insulin.
757
00:27:19,668 --> 00:27:20,144
And then,
758
00:27:21,334 --> 00:27:23,554
aj called me. I was in Texas with
759
00:27:23,554 --> 00:27:26,013
my daughter, and she said, well, I'm having
760
00:27:26,013 --> 00:27:27,362
a lot of abdominal pain.
761
00:27:28,173 --> 00:27:28,492
So, well,
762
00:27:29,210 --> 00:27:30,884
maybe you should go to the emergency room.
763
00:27:31,124 --> 00:27:32,719
She's says, I don't know. Maybe it's just
764
00:27:32,719 --> 00:27:35,032
like a sister or maybe I'm popping an
765
00:27:35,032 --> 00:27:36,467
egg or I, you know, she had all
766
00:27:36,467 --> 00:27:37,026
these excuses.
767
00:27:37,598 --> 00:27:40,135
But she sounded terrible, and I said, you
768
00:27:40,135 --> 00:27:41,403
go to the emergency room I'm going to
769
00:27:41,403 --> 00:27:42,909
the airport. I came back.
770
00:27:43,702 --> 00:27:44,653
She's in there.
771
00:27:45,303 --> 00:27:47,367
And that doctors haven't told her what's wrong.
772
00:27:47,526 --> 00:27:48,399
It's very frightening.
773
00:27:49,034 --> 00:27:50,463
Her case goes all the way up to
774
00:27:50,463 --> 00:27:52,368
the tumor board at the hospital.
775
00:27:53,099 --> 00:27:55,332
They say you have a growth on your
776
00:27:55,332 --> 00:27:56,927
liver. She says, by growth, do you mean
777
00:27:56,927 --> 00:27:58,602
a tumor and they go, yeah.
778
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:00,995
Because you have a history of bleeding disorders
779
00:28:00,995 --> 00:28:02,670
we can operate. The lure is all blood
780
00:28:02,670 --> 00:28:04,204
vessels And if we operate, you just might
781
00:28:04,204 --> 00:28:06,204
bleed out and die. We can't treat it
782
00:28:06,204 --> 00:28:08,445
with radiation, and it won't respond to chemo.
783
00:28:08,845 --> 00:28:10,204
We'd have to kill you with chemo to
784
00:28:10,204 --> 00:28:11,164
kill the tumor.
785
00:28:11,659 --> 00:28:13,497
She said, what, what can you do? They
786
00:28:13,497 --> 00:28:14,856
said, watchful waiting.
787
00:28:15,495 --> 00:28:16,694
They've tumors...
788
00:28:17,253 --> 00:28:19,411
They come from somewhere. They don't just go
789
00:28:19,411 --> 00:28:21,583
away because you... You're gonna have scan every
790
00:28:21,583 --> 00:28:23,419
3 months or something. And so she said,
791
00:28:23,578 --> 00:28:26,292
Tom watchful waiting. That's like a death sentence
792
00:28:26,292 --> 00:28:28,686
for me. I have 4 young daughters. What
793
00:28:28,686 --> 00:28:30,299
am I gonna do? I said you're gonna
794
00:28:30,299 --> 00:28:31,737
do what I did. You're gonna do keto.
795
00:28:31,976 --> 00:28:33,255
You're gonna do ice baths. You're gonna do
796
00:28:33,255 --> 00:28:35,332
a Dean hal. Keto and ice baths. We're
797
00:28:35,332 --> 00:28:36,312
gonna attack this
798
00:28:36,850 --> 00:28:37,330
metabolically.
799
00:28:37,743 --> 00:28:39,572
So she did. She went into keto. She
800
00:28:39,572 --> 00:28:41,321
started going to that ice bath, not every
801
00:28:41,321 --> 00:28:43,548
day, but several times a week and damned
802
00:28:43,548 --> 00:28:45,376
if that tumor didn't shrink.
803
00:28:45,948 --> 00:28:47,142
This is where I had to go to
804
00:28:47,142 --> 00:28:49,394
the library and read Thomas C for work
805
00:28:49,451 --> 00:28:51,919
about the metabolic origins of cancer. Yep. I
806
00:28:51,919 --> 00:28:53,511
had to learn about brown fat, which I
807
00:28:53,511 --> 00:28:56,244
didn't know dang think about Mh. Until, you
808
00:28:56,244 --> 00:28:58,565
know, years after my son was diagnosed.
809
00:28:59,045 --> 00:29:00,085
Well there's a good reason for that.
810
00:29:00,805 --> 00:29:02,404
At the time, my son was diagnosed.
811
00:29:02,979 --> 00:29:05,294
People, medical doctors thought there was no such
812
00:29:05,294 --> 00:29:07,370
thing as brown fat in adult human beings.
813
00:29:07,609 --> 00:29:09,605
They thought, you know, kids have it, but
814
00:29:09,605 --> 00:29:10,803
then you lose it as you get older.
815
00:29:10,882 --> 00:29:11,681
It's just the way it is.
816
00:29:12,734 --> 00:29:15,051
Until a team of doctors in Sweden. This
817
00:29:15,051 --> 00:29:16,410
is like 2007,
818
00:29:16,809 --> 00:29:18,108
they were doing Pet
819
00:29:19,047 --> 00:29:21,480
scans to detect tumors. You
820
00:29:21,779 --> 00:29:22,279
inject
821
00:29:22,580 --> 00:29:24,660
glucose that is dope with radiation, You see
822
00:29:24,660 --> 00:29:26,980
where the glucose is going and because tumors
823
00:29:26,980 --> 00:29:27,480
preferential
824
00:29:28,019 --> 00:29:30,273
uptake glucose you do the scan and you
825
00:29:30,273 --> 00:29:32,271
can locate the tumors. But they saw all
826
00:29:32,271 --> 00:29:34,908
these symmetrical spots on their scans, and they
827
00:29:34,908 --> 00:29:37,225
said, it's not a tumor. What what could
828
00:29:37,225 --> 00:29:40,026
that be? In a fewer than 5 percent
829
00:29:40,026 --> 00:29:42,649
of the scans in Sweden, they were identifying
830
00:29:42,649 --> 00:29:45,613
brown fat because these instrument rooms were cold
831
00:29:45,844 --> 00:29:48,481
So the Sloan Ke Institute, you know, they're
832
00:29:48,481 --> 00:29:50,079
in the United States. Well, maybe we should
833
00:29:50,079 --> 00:29:52,077
go back through all our Pet scans. See
834
00:29:52,077 --> 00:29:53,195
if we can find some of this brown
835
00:29:53,195 --> 00:29:53,355
fat.
836
00:29:54,169 --> 00:29:56,403
It's sort of true by the age of
837
00:29:56,403 --> 00:29:57,041
45,
838
00:29:57,599 --> 00:30:00,471
fewer than 5 percent of American adults still
839
00:30:00,471 --> 00:30:02,319
have brown fat. So you can kinda understand
840
00:30:02,319 --> 00:30:04,391
why the medical doctors Sure. Thought you just
841
00:30:04,391 --> 00:30:06,143
don't have it. But you do have it.
842
00:30:06,382 --> 00:30:09,329
If you get cold. And if you're brown
843
00:30:09,329 --> 00:30:09,966
fats gone,
844
00:30:10,619 --> 00:30:12,799
Problem is it leads to metabolic
845
00:30:13,099 --> 00:30:15,659
dysfunction, the brown fat and the thyroid. They
846
00:30:15,659 --> 00:30:18,220
work together to regulate your metabolism.
847
00:30:18,633 --> 00:30:20,935
The thyroid is speaking to the brown fat
848
00:30:20,935 --> 00:30:22,761
chemically, and the brown fat is speaking to
849
00:30:22,761 --> 00:30:25,699
the thyroid. The thyroid makes thyroid hormone. And
850
00:30:25,699 --> 00:30:27,366
there's lots of different types of thyroid hormone.
851
00:30:27,699 --> 00:30:29,777
But let's overs simplify this as an active
852
00:30:29,777 --> 00:30:32,095
form and an inactive form. It is the
853
00:30:32,095 --> 00:30:34,412
brown fat that converts the less active to
854
00:30:34,412 --> 00:30:36,330
the more active. So the thyroid and the
855
00:30:36,330 --> 00:30:37,643
brown are in constant
856
00:30:38,021 --> 00:30:41,691
communication, brown fat modulate your thyroid function. It
857
00:30:41,691 --> 00:30:45,397
is brown fat that will fix your hyper
858
00:30:45,615 --> 00:30:46,513
or hypo
859
00:30:46,891 --> 00:30:47,391
thyroid,
860
00:30:47,848 --> 00:30:49,603
at least in many cases because if you
861
00:30:49,603 --> 00:30:51,916
got no bra, there's nothing to regulate the
862
00:30:51,916 --> 00:30:53,351
thyroid function. Well,
863
00:30:54,164 --> 00:30:55,859
It took the scientists
864
00:30:56,315 --> 00:30:58,466
years after my son was diagnosed to say
865
00:30:58,466 --> 00:31:00,299
have Brown fat as a thing. And then
866
00:31:00,538 --> 00:31:02,780
Susanna Soul a whole dis. Now in brown
867
00:31:02,780 --> 00:31:04,767
fat. It's like a whole different branch now
868
00:31:04,767 --> 00:31:06,777
of biological or physiological
869
00:31:07,152 --> 00:31:10,013
science, and it is the key to improving
870
00:31:10,013 --> 00:31:11,220
your in and resistance.
871
00:31:11,776 --> 00:31:13,365
It does a few other things too. It's
872
00:31:13,365 --> 00:31:16,567
not just thermo genesis, but it will secret
873
00:31:17,100 --> 00:31:17,600
neuro
874
00:31:18,149 --> 00:31:20,700
d hormones. So brown fat is good for
875
00:31:20,700 --> 00:31:21,099
your brain,
876
00:31:21,816 --> 00:31:25,005
which partly explains why they say breakfast famous
877
00:31:25,005 --> 00:31:26,440
for quoting this, so they didn't make it
878
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:29,789
up Alzheimer's is known as type 3 diabetes.
879
00:31:30,027 --> 00:31:33,438
Yeah. I've it before. Also originates in metabolism.
880
00:31:34,009 --> 00:31:36,723
So the mechanism then is the cold is,
881
00:31:37,281 --> 00:31:40,735
the thermo genesis of the cold is increasing
882
00:31:40,873 --> 00:31:42,070
the brown fat stores.
883
00:31:42,724 --> 00:31:46,813
Which are huge component of proper healthy metabolism,
884
00:31:47,429 --> 00:31:49,742
also re regulates through
885
00:31:50,620 --> 00:31:52,056
interaction with the thyroid.
886
00:31:52,628 --> 00:31:55,411
And so that... That's the primary mechanism then
887
00:31:55,411 --> 00:31:57,103
of of where we get these
888
00:31:57,796 --> 00:31:59,703
metabolic benefits. Can you speak, Tom, a little
889
00:31:59,703 --> 00:32:02,263
bit too. I also have rid that Well,
890
00:32:02,422 --> 00:32:04,493
I guess it's all related because as the
891
00:32:04,493 --> 00:32:05,450
brown fats builds,
892
00:32:06,087 --> 00:32:07,622
the insulin sensitivity
893
00:32:08,078 --> 00:32:08,477
improves,
894
00:32:09,209 --> 00:32:11,759
and that also has a downstream effect just
895
00:32:11,759 --> 00:32:15,345
to body composition improvements. So this is really
896
00:32:15,345 --> 00:32:16,642
interesting because
897
00:32:17,034 --> 00:32:20,783
the cold will remodel your fat. But it's
898
00:32:20,783 --> 00:32:22,617
not actually effective for weight loss. And this
899
00:32:22,617 --> 00:32:24,691
is where b you mentioned that. Your. Life
900
00:32:24,691 --> 00:32:26,445
of a camera you you're were very humorous
901
00:32:26,445 --> 00:32:28,455
about it. But you're like, I'm 50 some.
902
00:32:28,615 --> 00:32:30,370
I'm still. I'm still a fat guy. Yeah.
903
00:32:30,529 --> 00:32:32,444
Right look, If anybody was gonna be all
904
00:32:32,444 --> 00:32:35,013
ripped from cold exposure. That would be me.
905
00:32:35,333 --> 00:32:37,969
But you see me go into the ice...
906
00:32:38,288 --> 00:32:39,886
I'm still a 50 year old fat guy,
907
00:32:40,286 --> 00:32:42,539
and it's kinda tough Guy I wish I
908
00:32:42,539 --> 00:32:43,900
looked like Ben greenfield. You know? I wish
909
00:32:44,059 --> 00:32:45,500
I looked like Mike Mu for goodness sakes,
910
00:32:45,980 --> 00:32:47,980
but I'm never gonna be an Instagram model.
911
00:32:48,140 --> 00:32:49,600
I'm gonna stay a university
912
00:32:50,140 --> 00:32:52,702
professor. And when you do the research, you
913
00:32:52,702 --> 00:32:53,202
find
914
00:32:53,737 --> 00:32:56,282
that yes, cold rev up your metabolism, yes,
915
00:32:56,441 --> 00:32:57,316
cold will burn fat.
916
00:32:58,048 --> 00:33:00,598
But at night, your core body temperature comes
917
00:33:00,598 --> 00:33:03,308
back down. Your metabolism slows back down. Your
918
00:33:03,308 --> 00:33:06,664
body rebuild those fat reserves. It's called a
919
00:33:06,664 --> 00:33:07,164
compensatory
920
00:33:07,695 --> 00:33:10,868
metabolic mechanism. Cool is it's a a good
921
00:33:10,868 --> 00:33:13,168
way to... As an adjunct to a diet
922
00:33:13,168 --> 00:33:15,489
to exercise at cleaning up your diet getting
923
00:33:15,489 --> 00:33:17,080
the processed seed oils out, and that kind
924
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:19,388
of thing. But the first 5 pound you
925
00:33:19,388 --> 00:33:22,252
lose. It's all inflammation. It's all the water
926
00:33:22,252 --> 00:33:25,130
sense. However, it will remodel the fat in
927
00:33:25,130 --> 00:33:28,469
your body from visceral to subcutaneous. So visceral
928
00:33:28,469 --> 00:33:30,695
is the... I color fat. Yeah. So if
929
00:33:30,695 --> 00:33:32,698
you were doing dex scans, you might see
930
00:33:32,698 --> 00:33:35,321
a shift Right. In how the fat is
931
00:33:35,321 --> 00:33:38,341
distributed. And we know that, the visceral is
932
00:33:38,341 --> 00:33:41,305
the most inflammatory. Yep. So although
933
00:33:41,853 --> 00:33:44,160
your net weight will probably stay the same.
934
00:33:44,398 --> 00:33:46,944
It might even increase. Yep. But the cool
935
00:33:46,944 --> 00:33:48,614
thing about the Dex scans is they show
936
00:33:48,614 --> 00:33:51,577
you the fat distribution. Yep. So, okay. That
937
00:33:51,577 --> 00:33:54,530
makes sense. Body scan does not do. So
938
00:33:54,530 --> 00:33:56,127
if you're going a, I don't know lifetime
939
00:33:56,127 --> 00:33:58,122
fitness, and you get the electrodes on your
940
00:33:58,122 --> 00:33:58,921
feet and your hands.
941
00:33:59,653 --> 00:34:02,674
They are using electrical impedance to estimate your
942
00:34:02,674 --> 00:34:05,218
body composition, and they're not calibrated for brown
943
00:34:05,218 --> 00:34:06,888
fat. Yeah. So I have 3 case studies.
944
00:34:07,047 --> 00:34:08,557
1 of them is Chris Get. And if
945
00:34:08,557 --> 00:34:11,193
you follow Chris. He's a body builder. He's
946
00:34:11,193 --> 00:34:13,414
completely ripped. He's in, like, the single digit
947
00:34:13,414 --> 00:34:16,034
body fat. And his in body scanner was
948
00:34:16,034 --> 00:34:18,666
telling him 14 percent. Got a little discouraged.
949
00:34:18,825 --> 00:34:19,934
He sent me a picture. And he's like,
950
00:34:20,014 --> 00:34:21,758
does this seem like 14 percent. I go,
951
00:34:21,837 --> 00:34:22,630
how much have you been in your ice,
952
00:34:22,789 --> 00:34:24,691
Bath like, every day because he's got.
953
00:34:25,579 --> 00:34:27,573
I don't know the body scanner is lying
954
00:34:27,573 --> 00:34:29,726
to you because it's not calibrated for the
955
00:34:29,726 --> 00:34:32,517
brown fat. You get a different impedance, and
956
00:34:32,517 --> 00:34:35,244
it will... You'll see an instant jump And
957
00:34:35,244 --> 00:34:37,244
by instance, I mean, a week after you
958
00:34:37,244 --> 00:34:39,325
start ice baths. Your body scanner will say,
959
00:34:39,644 --> 00:34:41,724
hey, you just gained 2 percent body fat.
960
00:34:42,125 --> 00:34:44,292
No. You didn't. You're fooling your in body
961
00:34:44,292 --> 00:34:45,963
scanner. And I have 3 or 4 case
962
00:34:45,963 --> 00:34:48,112
studies of people that back this up. But
963
00:34:48,112 --> 00:34:50,340
the Dex scan will be much more interesting.
964
00:34:50,673 --> 00:34:52,501
Right on. Yeah, I've seen those changes in
965
00:34:52,501 --> 00:34:54,488
my own body. My first Dex scan, and
966
00:34:54,488 --> 00:34:56,315
it shows you the color coding on here,
967
00:34:56,474 --> 00:34:58,557
and then, like you, I started learning how
968
00:34:58,557 --> 00:35:00,708
to change my diet. And that... That's a
969
00:35:00,708 --> 00:35:01,367
a huge
970
00:35:01,903 --> 00:35:04,315
risk indicator. Is the amount of visceral adipose
971
00:35:04,452 --> 00:35:06,138
tissue. So Okay. So I get all of
972
00:35:06,138 --> 00:35:08,206
that part. I get how the metabolic benefits
973
00:35:08,206 --> 00:35:10,353
work. The next 1 I wanted to ask
974
00:35:10,353 --> 00:35:11,148
you about was,
975
00:35:11,943 --> 00:35:12,659
mood improvement.
976
00:35:13,869 --> 00:35:16,822
Because, again, my experience, you know, you get
977
00:35:16,822 --> 00:35:19,057
in there and you come out and you're,
978
00:35:19,217 --> 00:35:19,377
like,
979
00:35:20,175 --> 00:35:22,650
you're sharp and you're bright and you're clear.
980
00:35:23,382 --> 00:35:25,446
And it's it's just a little high.
981
00:35:26,002 --> 00:35:29,019
And so Yeah. And there's also people I
982
00:35:29,019 --> 00:35:31,561
with who have worked through a lot of
983
00:35:31,561 --> 00:35:32,061
different
984
00:35:32,769 --> 00:35:33,728
Let's just say,
985
00:35:34,367 --> 00:35:35,006
mental health,
986
00:35:35,805 --> 00:35:37,323
conditions, depression, anxiety,
987
00:35:37,802 --> 00:35:39,640
a woman I met recently, mitochondria,
988
00:35:40,610 --> 00:35:42,833
where going through the cold, it was...
989
00:35:43,547 --> 00:35:46,033
She learned how powerful her mind was through
990
00:35:46,168 --> 00:35:48,233
overcoming that experience and was able to be
991
00:35:48,233 --> 00:35:49,838
well, if I can do that. I overcome
992
00:35:49,838 --> 00:35:52,706
this. So Yeah. It's doing something to the
993
00:35:52,706 --> 00:35:53,206
neurotransmitters
994
00:35:53,902 --> 00:35:55,518
and the chemicals
995
00:35:56,213 --> 00:35:59,335
in the brain I've heard numbers thrown around.
996
00:35:59,972 --> 00:36:02,442
Loosely, you can probably correct this on this
997
00:36:02,442 --> 00:36:04,296
about increases in dopamine
998
00:36:04,832 --> 00:36:05,571
and norepinephrine
999
00:36:06,838 --> 00:36:09,382
cat means and stuff like that. What? Can
1000
00:36:09,382 --> 00:36:11,051
you give us a concise way to understand
1001
00:36:11,051 --> 00:36:14,254
what's happening at the neurotransmitter level. The simplest
1002
00:36:15,121 --> 00:36:16,871
explanation is it is hard to be in
1003
00:36:16,871 --> 00:36:18,541
a bad mood when you got 3 times
1004
00:36:18,541 --> 00:36:21,007
the dopamine in your bloodstream as you. I
1005
00:36:21,007 --> 00:36:24,371
mean, people would chase dopamine high like that
1006
00:36:24,371 --> 00:36:25,806
through a lot of illicit means.
1007
00:36:26,604 --> 00:36:28,359
Exactly. And and, you know, it's crazy. I
1008
00:36:28,518 --> 00:36:31,092
I've even read anecdotally, like, people going through
1009
00:36:31,230 --> 00:36:32,122
addiction in recovery,
1010
00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,151
even the the cold bass, like, it helps
1011
00:36:35,151 --> 00:36:37,621
to create that high. Yeah. So what's going
1012
00:36:37,621 --> 00:36:39,787
on there with no transmitter stuff? The the
1013
00:36:39,787 --> 00:36:41,373
first 1 is the nora neurotransmitters like this
1014
00:36:41,373 --> 00:36:43,753
a meat short term takes you out of
1015
00:36:43,753 --> 00:36:44,253
whatever
1016
00:36:44,705 --> 00:36:46,767
monkey was bounce around in your head into
1017
00:36:46,767 --> 00:36:48,690
your present moment. And making you feel good.
1018
00:36:48,849 --> 00:36:51,239
It breaks the bad mood cycle and then
1019
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:53,548
you come out with motivation and energy, and
1020
00:36:53,548 --> 00:36:55,619
that's terrific. And then I read a book
1021
00:36:55,619 --> 00:36:58,021
by Chris Palmer. He was just on Mark
1022
00:36:58,181 --> 00:37:00,010
Bell power podcast. He wrote a book called
1023
00:37:00,090 --> 00:37:03,533
Brain Energy. Chris is a psychiatrist at Harvard
1024
00:37:03,923 --> 00:37:05,439
did a review of brain energy, and I
1025
00:37:05,439 --> 00:37:07,034
put it up on Amazon, and I'm sorry
1026
00:37:07,114 --> 00:37:08,231
Chris. So I only give it 4 out
1027
00:37:08,231 --> 00:37:09,507
of 5 stars because you know I'm like,
1028
00:37:09,587 --> 00:37:10,623
hey, you could have done a little bit
1029
00:37:10,623 --> 00:37:12,378
more in the second half tough crowd, but,
1030
00:37:12,458 --> 00:37:13,096
yeah. Right.
1031
00:37:13,749 --> 00:37:16,226
But what he pointed out is that the
1032
00:37:16,226 --> 00:37:19,183
brain uses 25 to 30 percent of all
1033
00:37:19,183 --> 00:37:20,942
the energy that the body needs. Mh. It
1034
00:37:20,942 --> 00:37:23,675
is the most energy intensive. Of all your
1035
00:37:23,675 --> 00:37:24,234
major organs.
1036
00:37:25,355 --> 00:37:27,514
If your metabolism isn't right? That is if
1037
00:37:27,514 --> 00:37:30,074
the mitochondria and the brain aren't right, and
1038
00:37:30,074 --> 00:37:30,974
you're not processing
1039
00:37:31,275 --> 00:37:33,208
energy well, or course in a bad mood.
1040
00:37:33,527 --> 00:37:35,205
Sure. Because a lot of the things that
1041
00:37:35,205 --> 00:37:37,602
we need to do to manage our negative
1042
00:37:37,602 --> 00:37:39,300
emotions and to manage our anxieties
1043
00:37:39,614 --> 00:37:41,525
they take energy, whether it's
1044
00:37:42,402 --> 00:37:45,588
cognitive behavioral therapy or dialect behavioral therapy or
1045
00:37:45,588 --> 00:37:48,557
cognitive re reframe or all these things that
1046
00:37:48,789 --> 00:37:51,190
Greg Lu and Jonathan Height wrote this book
1047
00:37:51,190 --> 00:37:52,869
called the cod of the American mind, and
1048
00:37:52,950 --> 00:37:55,849
I read it because it's all about universities
1049
00:37:55,989 --> 00:37:57,050
and how
1050
00:37:57,525 --> 00:38:00,641
the universities are now making the students creating
1051
00:38:00,641 --> 00:38:03,197
the conditions in the university that lead to
1052
00:38:03,197 --> 00:38:04,796
these emotional dysfunction.
1053
00:38:05,849 --> 00:38:08,000
Well, if you're gonna do the opposite, If
1054
00:38:08,000 --> 00:38:10,571
you're gonna lead yourself to emotional health, that's
1055
00:38:10,708 --> 00:38:13,815
energetically intensive and Palmer figured out that his
1056
00:38:13,815 --> 00:38:16,003
patients that would not respond to Ss
1057
00:38:16,378 --> 00:38:19,003
that were not responding to talk therapy. They
1058
00:38:19,003 --> 00:38:20,196
sure felt a lot better when they were
1059
00:38:20,196 --> 00:38:22,264
on the ketogenic diet. What he didn't write
1060
00:38:22,264 --> 00:38:23,378
a lot about in his book.
1061
00:38:24,109 --> 00:38:26,109
Is that he was homeless as a child
1062
00:38:26,109 --> 00:38:28,589
for periods because his mother suffered from Schizophrenia.
1063
00:38:28,829 --> 00:38:30,589
He dedicated his book to his mother is
1064
00:38:30,589 --> 00:38:30,909
passed on.
1065
00:38:31,724 --> 00:38:33,319
And you can kinda, I've never met Chris,
1066
00:38:33,638 --> 00:38:35,632
like we've, you know, messaged back and forth
1067
00:38:35,632 --> 00:38:37,068
a little bit, but we've never talked about
1068
00:38:37,068 --> 00:38:39,062
this. But just like me with my son
1069
00:38:39,062 --> 00:38:40,896
and diabetes got me into metabolism.
1070
00:38:41,629 --> 00:38:44,677
You can imagine how Chris feel
1071
00:38:45,052 --> 00:38:45,552
about
1072
00:38:46,644 --> 00:38:49,724
schizophrenia, about an about some of these dead
1073
00:38:49,924 --> 00:38:52,813
they're not just mood disorders. Right? These psychiatric
1074
00:38:53,429 --> 00:38:57,331
disorders. Right? And he has rearranged his approach
1075
00:38:57,331 --> 00:38:58,900
to psychiatry around
1076
00:38:59,337 --> 00:39:01,087
metabolism. And he's not the only 1. There's
1077
00:39:01,087 --> 00:39:03,553
a whole movement now in it. So the
1078
00:39:03,553 --> 00:39:05,914
short term is you get a big boost
1079
00:39:06,114 --> 00:39:08,420
in these neuro neurotransmitters like the nora adrenaline,
1080
00:39:08,898 --> 00:39:12,000
the adrenaline, the dopamine. All that stuff is
1081
00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:12,739
great vas
1082
00:39:13,048 --> 00:39:15,668
And and that's confirmed in the literature. Absolutely.
1083
00:39:15,906 --> 00:39:17,652
Yeah. There's some really good blood here. I'm
1084
00:39:17,652 --> 00:39:20,112
studies on all this. Okay. But longer term.
1085
00:39:20,683 --> 00:39:22,670
You get the metabolic boost that your brain
1086
00:39:22,670 --> 00:39:25,768
needs to do that hard work of managing
1087
00:39:25,768 --> 00:39:28,169
your anxieties and your emotions. So I think
1088
00:39:28,169 --> 00:39:31,445
we're really onto something here when we're talking
1089
00:39:31,445 --> 00:39:33,842
about cold plunge therapy for... I mean, I
1090
00:39:33,842 --> 00:39:35,700
call it mood management. But
1091
00:39:36,172 --> 00:39:39,664
the cases of resolving major depression they keep
1092
00:39:39,664 --> 00:39:41,885
coming at me readers who are telling me
1093
00:39:41,885 --> 00:39:42,838
that nothing worked.
1094
00:39:43,489 --> 00:39:45,170
1 of them... He's gonna come visit us
1095
00:39:45,170 --> 00:39:45,809
in Phoenix.
1096
00:39:46,369 --> 00:39:47,109
He said
1097
00:39:47,489 --> 00:39:49,329
we did a long interview. Who's very vulnerable.
1098
00:39:49,489 --> 00:39:50,849
He said he tried to drown himself in
1099
00:39:50,849 --> 00:39:52,289
the bathtub at Home he lives in Latvia.
1100
00:39:52,624 --> 00:39:54,616
His brother found him interrupted him. He's in
1101
00:39:54,616 --> 00:39:55,811
his twenties he was depressed.
1102
00:39:56,847 --> 00:39:58,201
Well, the bathtub waters warm.
1103
00:39:58,998 --> 00:40:00,845
Next day, You know. This guy got it
1104
00:40:00,845 --> 00:40:02,835
all figured out. He tells his parents. I
1105
00:40:02,835 --> 00:40:04,188
know I feel much better. I'm gonna go
1106
00:40:04,188 --> 00:40:05,701
for a run. You know, I'm gonna go
1107
00:40:05,701 --> 00:40:07,213
jog, and I really wanna take care of
1108
00:40:07,213 --> 00:40:07,532
myself now.
1109
00:40:08,264 --> 00:40:10,972
And dad goes wait a second. Give me
1110
00:40:10,972 --> 00:40:12,883
my shoes. You know, his son's out the
1111
00:40:12,883 --> 00:40:15,431
door, and his dad's like, he's not going
1112
00:40:15,431 --> 00:40:17,359
running. He's going down to the beach. He's
1113
00:40:17,359 --> 00:40:20,656
gonna drown himself. Dad books for the beach
1114
00:40:20,955 --> 00:40:23,672
because he wants to inter seed, and he
1115
00:40:23,672 --> 00:40:25,510
sees his son is already in the water
1116
00:40:25,510 --> 00:40:27,199
when he gets there. Dad close on and
1117
00:40:27,199 --> 00:40:29,188
everything. He's, like, diving into the Baltic,
1118
00:40:30,063 --> 00:40:32,051
and he reaches the sun, Somehow he's gonna
1119
00:40:32,051 --> 00:40:32,528
pull him out.
1120
00:40:33,340 --> 00:40:34,859
And when he gets here go, the sun
1121
00:40:34,859 --> 00:40:37,579
says, I don't wanna die dead. The water
1122
00:40:37,579 --> 00:40:38,300
is cold.
1123
00:40:38,940 --> 00:40:41,280
The warm water and he's depressed
1124
00:40:41,993 --> 00:40:43,827
The cold water, and he gets all this
1125
00:40:43,827 --> 00:40:45,900
energy he gets his ranch, and the dad
1126
00:40:45,900 --> 00:40:48,054
says we will come down to this beach
1127
00:40:48,054 --> 00:40:51,099
every day. We will go swimming together. Well,
1128
00:40:51,179 --> 00:40:53,331
now, he's a product designer. And he's invented
1129
00:40:53,331 --> 00:40:55,086
this this little thing It looks like you
1130
00:40:55,086 --> 00:40:57,319
know, Star Wars Droid or something, you don't
1131
00:40:57,319 --> 00:40:59,552
measure your temperature and how long you're in
1132
00:40:59,552 --> 00:41:01,559
there and stuff, because he's doing it every
1133
00:41:01,559 --> 00:41:03,072
day and he's coming to Phoenix so that
1134
00:41:03,072 --> 00:41:05,303
we can do this research workshop together and
1135
00:41:05,303 --> 00:41:06,896
plan out. Is that the 1 that's coming
1136
00:41:06,896 --> 00:41:09,500
up here? Yeah. Later It'll be on the
1137
00:41:09,619 --> 00:41:11,692
you campus. We're bringing in doctors and patients
1138
00:41:11,692 --> 00:41:13,924
and scientists from are saying. What's the research
1139
00:41:13,924 --> 00:41:15,678
that really needs to be done? Yeah. And
1140
00:41:15,678 --> 00:41:17,352
how do we get the clinicians in touch
1141
00:41:17,352 --> 00:41:18,885
with the scientists? So that we can improve
1142
00:41:18,885 --> 00:41:20,804
the protocols and practice that kind of thing.
1143
00:41:21,444 --> 00:41:21,764
Awesome.
1144
00:41:22,484 --> 00:41:24,664
Just 1 more thing on on the mood
1145
00:41:24,724 --> 00:41:26,164
regulation. I I think that's a nice way
1146
00:41:26,164 --> 00:41:27,464
to kinda, like, su
1147
00:41:28,097 --> 00:41:29,286
sum it all basically.
1148
00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:31,822
But, you know, just waking up in the
1149
00:41:31,822 --> 00:41:33,407
morning and and a lot of people need
1150
00:41:33,407 --> 00:41:35,096
a few cups of coffee and
1151
00:41:35,484 --> 00:41:37,318
And a little... It's it's hard to get
1152
00:41:37,318 --> 00:41:40,509
the engine running sometimes. So, like, I'm just
1153
00:41:40,509 --> 00:41:43,300
that morning kid on Christmas morning. You. I
1154
00:41:43,300 --> 00:41:44,039
don't have an
1155
00:41:44,417 --> 00:41:46,989
by. Right? But, you know, if you could
1156
00:41:46,989 --> 00:41:49,550
do it every morning, You know, how different
1157
00:41:49,550 --> 00:41:52,030
would your days be, you know, I don't
1158
00:41:52,030 --> 00:41:53,630
have access to it at home on a
1159
00:41:53,630 --> 00:41:55,718
daily basis. But Dave you know what you
1160
00:41:55,718 --> 00:41:57,173
need to do. Mh
1161
00:41:57,709 --> 00:42:00,576
that I'm making them right through these walls
1162
00:42:00,576 --> 00:42:02,726
if you want access every morning.
1163
00:42:03,219 --> 00:42:04,655
Then you know what you need to do
1164
00:42:04,655 --> 00:42:06,650
to get it. Well, let's talk business.
1165
00:42:08,804 --> 00:42:10,814
Right off. Well this is why you know,
1166
00:42:10,974 --> 00:42:12,732
me and Jason invented it because we didn't
1167
00:42:12,732 --> 00:42:14,010
wanna do it once a week. Yeah. We
1168
00:42:14,010 --> 00:42:14,969
didn't want it to be an hour and
1169
00:42:14,969 --> 00:42:16,727
a half hour deal. Sometimes you wanna get
1170
00:42:16,727 --> 00:42:18,325
in there and just wanna do, like, 3
1171
00:42:18,325 --> 00:42:18,565
minutes.
1172
00:42:19,139 --> 00:42:20,889
Well, you're not gonna go down to the
1173
00:42:20,889 --> 00:42:22,401
gas station and pick up a hundred and
1174
00:42:22,401 --> 00:42:23,515
50 pounds of ice, so you can do
1175
00:42:23,515 --> 00:42:25,369
a 3 minute ice baths. So
1176
00:42:25,903 --> 00:42:28,211
we needed a machine where we could micro
1177
00:42:28,211 --> 00:42:30,217
dose cold if we wanted to do that
1178
00:42:30,217 --> 00:42:32,210
or do 2 or 3 a day. Yeah.
1179
00:42:32,528 --> 00:42:34,202
It's just getting high on your own supply.
1180
00:42:34,441 --> 00:42:34,600
Yeah.
1181
00:42:35,397 --> 00:42:35,636
Alright.
1182
00:42:36,688 --> 00:42:39,002
So that's 2. We've got mood regulation. We've
1183
00:42:39,002 --> 00:42:40,459
got the metabolic benefits,
1184
00:42:41,635 --> 00:42:43,151
anti aging. Longevity,
1185
00:42:44,123 --> 00:42:46,757
Everyone's nerd out now on, some of the
1186
00:42:46,757 --> 00:42:47,496
new diagnostics
1187
00:42:48,193 --> 00:42:49,949
that are getting pretty good. Yeah. We can
1188
00:42:49,949 --> 00:42:52,358
start to measure biological age. Know you wanna
1189
00:42:52,358 --> 00:42:53,555
keep this under an hour, so I'm gonna
1190
00:42:53,555 --> 00:42:54,992
cut to the chase. They're all crap. Okay.
1191
00:42:55,231 --> 00:42:58,264
Tel me crap, your Dna meth crap, and
1192
00:42:58,264 --> 00:43:00,354
somebody who sells these things who you know,
1193
00:43:00,514 --> 00:43:02,588
has a medical degree and an appointment at
1194
00:43:02,588 --> 00:43:05,143
a more prestigious university than me, and I'm
1195
00:43:05,143 --> 00:43:06,579
not gonna say who these people are, because
1196
00:43:06,579 --> 00:43:08,176
they'll find you on... They'll find me on
1197
00:43:08,335 --> 00:43:10,420
Twitter and troll my butt, but they're all
1198
00:43:10,420 --> 00:43:12,092
crap. And they're crap. I know they're crap
1199
00:43:12,092 --> 00:43:13,763
because I have read the literature.
1200
00:43:14,559 --> 00:43:17,424
Tell them your length and Dna meth. Is
1201
00:43:17,424 --> 00:43:21,906
2 examples. They hardly improve your predicted mortality
1202
00:43:21,906 --> 00:43:24,699
at all. Under fair point, there's no such
1203
00:43:24,699 --> 00:43:25,918
thing as biological
1204
00:43:26,455 --> 00:43:29,589
age if it is not in expected mortality.
1205
00:43:29,829 --> 00:43:31,510
This is what we mean when we say
1206
00:43:31,510 --> 00:43:33,429
biological age. Mh. So you need to have
1207
00:43:33,429 --> 00:43:36,684
the correlation between tel length and expected mortality
1208
00:43:36,805 --> 00:43:39,364
and it just isn't there. However, Patrick Porter.
1209
00:43:39,525 --> 00:43:41,765
He's the brain tab. Patrick. Yeah. Yeah. He
1210
00:43:41,765 --> 00:43:43,765
doesn't do the material. He doesn't, like, take
1211
00:43:43,765 --> 00:43:46,890
a sample of your Dna, your saliva or
1212
00:43:46,890 --> 00:43:49,838
whatever and look for a material marker of
1213
00:43:49,838 --> 00:43:51,432
your age. And there's a good reason.
1214
00:43:52,485 --> 00:43:53,545
Life is
1215
00:43:53,844 --> 00:43:54,164
energetic.
1216
00:43:54,804 --> 00:43:55,304
You
1217
00:43:55,605 --> 00:43:56,425
can only
1218
00:43:56,804 --> 00:43:59,465
detect life as a departure from thermo
1219
00:44:00,164 --> 00:44:02,659
equilibrium. If you wanna get a handle on
1220
00:44:02,659 --> 00:44:06,500
your biological age, measure it energetically, like Patrick
1221
00:44:06,659 --> 00:44:09,994
Porter does. Don't look for it materially. So
1222
00:44:10,193 --> 00:44:12,496
Patrick's, you know, he's measuring the energy that
1223
00:44:12,496 --> 00:44:15,514
your mitochondria are putting out all the theories
1224
00:44:15,514 --> 00:44:17,919
of aging compared to mitochondria
1225
00:44:18,229 --> 00:44:21,586
are crap. They're inferior to the mitochondria theory
1226
00:44:21,586 --> 00:44:23,744
of health. You mitochondria have their own Dna.
1227
00:44:24,063 --> 00:44:25,661
And it's hard to measure the quality of
1228
00:44:25,661 --> 00:44:27,715
those Dna because there can be thousands of
1229
00:44:28,074 --> 00:44:30,072
and a single brown fat cell, for example.
1230
00:44:30,472 --> 00:44:33,109
Your red blood cells. They don't have any
1231
00:44:33,109 --> 00:44:35,107
mitochondria. So you can, like, suck up blood
1232
00:44:35,107 --> 00:44:36,226
sample. And it's not gonna help you with
1233
00:44:36,226 --> 00:44:37,675
a mitochondria assessment.
1234
00:44:38,468 --> 00:44:41,403
Because the mitochondria have their own Dna, and
1235
00:44:41,403 --> 00:44:43,545
nobody told me that, like, Freshman year high
1236
00:44:43,545 --> 00:44:43,704
school,
1237
00:44:44,593 --> 00:44:46,822
you gotta keep track of the quality of
1238
00:44:46,822 --> 00:44:50,347
your mitochondria if you're gonna understand your biological
1239
00:44:50,722 --> 00:44:53,681
age and expected mortality. When you exercise too
1240
00:44:53,681 --> 00:44:55,670
hard. When you eat too many carbs, when
1241
00:44:55,670 --> 00:44:58,534
you mess up your light hygiene, your mitochondria
1242
00:44:58,534 --> 00:45:00,379
will be damaged. And that's okay as long
1243
00:45:00,379 --> 00:45:02,050
as they have time to recover. Mh. Time
1244
00:45:02,050 --> 00:45:03,721
in the dark, time to rest.
1245
00:45:04,358 --> 00:45:05,631
1 of the best things you can do
1246
00:45:05,631 --> 00:45:06,507
for your mitochondria.
1247
00:45:07,159 --> 00:45:10,341
Is cold punch therapy. It stimulates bio genesis.
1248
00:45:10,501 --> 00:45:13,047
It stimulates mit fa. It will upgrade the
1249
00:45:13,047 --> 00:45:15,210
quality of your mitochondria. And because it is
1250
00:45:15,210 --> 00:45:19,189
the mitochondria that process the energy that are
1251
00:45:19,189 --> 00:45:23,048
responsible for this energetic conversion. Look to your
1252
00:45:23,187 --> 00:45:25,742
mitochondria for your anti aging not in the
1253
00:45:25,742 --> 00:45:28,376
nucleus. Yeah. It's the mitochondria that produce the
1254
00:45:28,376 --> 00:45:30,612
energy that take care of the nucleic Dna.
1255
00:45:31,011 --> 00:45:34,710
Okay. So anti aging for me is
1256
00:45:35,324 --> 00:45:38,506
mitochondria therapies. I get into patrick porter neural
1257
00:45:38,506 --> 00:45:40,276
check. And it's the first time I've ever
1258
00:45:40,276 --> 00:45:41,393
been there, and it's during the lockdown downs.
1259
00:45:41,553 --> 00:45:44,027
We're in men Park together. And he's showing
1260
00:45:44,027 --> 00:45:45,943
me all the, you know, Meridian and stuff.
1261
00:45:46,102 --> 00:45:47,633
He goes, Tom, you're doing great. I could
1262
00:45:47,633 --> 00:45:48,909
sell you 1 of these brain tap machines,
1263
00:45:49,068 --> 00:45:50,902
but it wouldn't do any good. Why not
1264
00:45:51,061 --> 00:45:52,496
Patrick. He goes, well, you know I get
1265
00:45:52,576 --> 00:45:54,171
Dave Ash guys in here and they're always
1266
00:45:54,171 --> 00:45:56,179
in the upper eighties, and they're really close
1267
00:45:56,179 --> 00:45:57,536
to. I know I can get him into,
1268
00:45:57,616 --> 00:46:00,410
like, mid nineties, upper nineties. You're already there.
1269
00:46:00,809 --> 00:46:02,965
So I can't really help you. And I
1270
00:46:02,965 --> 00:46:05,613
think he's flattering me. You know, because I
1271
00:46:05,613 --> 00:46:06,965
don't know where. We're just having a good
1272
00:46:06,965 --> 00:46:08,238
time. Here's goes, let me show you 1
1273
00:46:08,238 --> 00:46:10,863
more screen. He goes, you're 32 years old,
1274
00:46:11,340 --> 00:46:11,840
biologically.
1275
00:46:12,548 --> 00:46:15,016
And I'm, you know, 54 or something at
1276
00:46:15,016 --> 00:46:16,448
the time. And I think it's kind of
1277
00:46:16,448 --> 00:46:18,438
a joke then he comes to Phoenix, and
1278
00:46:18,438 --> 00:46:19,791
he text me. He says, you should come
1279
00:46:19,791 --> 00:46:20,825
down You should come to our booth. You
1280
00:46:20,825 --> 00:46:22,113
know you should see what we're doing. I
1281
00:46:22,113 --> 00:46:23,861
see, yeah. Listen me in the neuro check.
1282
00:46:24,338 --> 00:46:26,722
It's been 2 years later. He goes congratulations,
1283
00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:29,288
Tom. You're 30. Right? I'm
1284
00:46:29,839 --> 00:46:31,517
aging. You can do all the stuff so
1285
00:46:31,517 --> 00:46:34,634
his justice is is is the... Basically looking
1286
00:46:34,634 --> 00:46:35,134
at
1287
00:46:35,672 --> 00:46:39,063
mitochondria as a directly case not sampling your
1288
00:46:39,121 --> 00:46:41,834
mitochondria. He's sampling your energy, and it is
1289
00:46:41,834 --> 00:46:44,866
the mitochondria that are responsible for all the
1290
00:46:44,866 --> 00:46:45,366
energy
1291
00:46:45,677 --> 00:46:47,104
order there. Yeah. You do yourself 1 of
1292
00:46:47,104 --> 00:46:48,768
these here. It comes to Phoenix 2 3
1293
00:46:48,768 --> 00:46:49,243
times a,
1294
00:46:50,273 --> 00:46:51,778
year, I would guess because there's so many
1295
00:46:51,778 --> 00:46:53,623
conferences here. Yeah. But I have a neural
1296
00:46:53,623 --> 00:46:55,861
check. We'll hook you up. We'll attach you
1297
00:46:55,861 --> 00:46:58,498
to Patrick software. We'll get a biological age.
1298
00:46:58,898 --> 00:47:00,576
Then we'll get you a. You'll get in
1299
00:47:00,576 --> 00:47:03,230
there every day. And then we'll measure again,
1300
00:47:03,389 --> 00:47:05,309
like 6 weeks later, and we'll see if
1301
00:47:05,309 --> 00:47:07,150
we can't aid you in reverse too. Moment
1302
00:47:07,150 --> 00:47:07,389
into that.
1303
00:47:08,429 --> 00:47:09,789
Alright. So that's number 3,
1304
00:47:10,589 --> 00:47:11,150
anti aging.
1305
00:47:11,884 --> 00:47:13,503
Number 4 is
1306
00:47:14,282 --> 00:47:15,101
brain health
1307
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:17,957
in general. So not necessarily mood, but the
1308
00:47:17,957 --> 00:47:19,336
organ of the brain
1309
00:47:20,128 --> 00:47:21,793
is the next 1 on the list. So...
1310
00:47:22,030 --> 00:47:24,646
We touched on this metabolically, but I'm gonna
1311
00:47:24,646 --> 00:47:27,049
tell you another story. There's a man who
1312
00:47:27,104 --> 00:47:29,675
is faculty member at University of South Florida.
1313
00:47:29,755 --> 00:47:30,795
His name is Joe D.
1314
00:47:31,275 --> 00:47:34,074
He spent 28 years as a navy saturation
1315
00:47:34,074 --> 00:47:35,835
diver, and then he left the service, and
1316
00:47:35,835 --> 00:47:36,795
he got his Phd.
1317
00:47:37,368 --> 00:47:39,349
He got it in hyper medicine, like, it's
1318
00:47:39,349 --> 00:47:41,649
biomedical engineering or something I... But he wanted
1319
00:47:41,649 --> 00:47:43,551
to study Hyper barr because if you spent
1320
00:47:43,551 --> 00:47:47,861
28 years, you know, studying pressure and oxygen
1321
00:47:47,861 --> 00:47:50,330
and dive times, and you'd be pretty curious
1322
00:47:50,330 --> 00:47:54,088
about hyper too. Joe loves his truck. He's
1323
00:47:54,088 --> 00:47:56,481
got like this 19 46
1324
00:47:56,481 --> 00:47:59,672
pickup and he's driving around Florida, and everything
1325
00:47:59,672 --> 00:48:00,869
is great, But you know what they have
1326
00:48:00,869 --> 00:48:03,501
in airbags for a 19 46 pickup truck.
1327
00:48:04,074 --> 00:48:06,231
Nothing. And when you get t bone, your
1328
00:48:06,231 --> 00:48:08,389
head, get smashed up against the side of
1329
00:48:08,389 --> 00:48:10,465
your antique trucking, you don't wake up until
1330
00:48:10,465 --> 00:48:12,498
you're in the hospital, and there's a resident
1331
00:48:12,636 --> 00:48:14,072
like, looking over you saying,
1332
00:48:14,790 --> 00:48:15,109
doctor,
1333
00:48:15,987 --> 00:48:18,401
don't you remember me? I took your class
1334
00:48:18,714 --> 00:48:21,032
He's got traumatic brain injury. He's now gotta
1335
00:48:21,032 --> 00:48:22,949
heal himself. He says I'm gonna use hyper
1336
00:48:22,949 --> 00:48:24,627
barr. I'm gonna use red light, gonna use
1337
00:48:24,627 --> 00:48:26,785
cold punch. He's just throwing everything at it.
1338
00:48:27,119 --> 00:48:29,034
He can't even read the literature anymore because
1339
00:48:29,034 --> 00:48:31,428
his brain's not working right. He's like, anything
1340
00:48:31,428 --> 00:48:33,344
that makes sense to me? I'm gonna try.
1341
00:48:33,663 --> 00:48:35,833
He explained the logic He said, when you
1342
00:48:35,833 --> 00:48:38,647
get in up to your neck, vasoconstriction
1343
00:48:39,025 --> 00:48:41,818
constriction shuts off all of the circulation in
1344
00:48:41,818 --> 00:48:44,065
your legs. Where does the blood go? Right
1345
00:48:44,065 --> 00:48:45,652
up to your brain. Yeah. Because your brain
1346
00:48:45,652 --> 00:48:47,875
still warm. It goes into your core to
1347
00:48:47,875 --> 00:48:49,462
defend your core body temperature, and it goes,
1348
00:48:49,700 --> 00:48:51,684
and it increases the perfusion in the brain.
1349
00:48:52,494 --> 00:48:54,492
I'm trying to get more blood into my
1350
00:48:54,492 --> 00:48:57,049
brain, so I can heal my traumatic brain
1351
00:48:57,049 --> 00:48:59,606
injury. Now he's on Instagram, you doctor Deep
1352
00:48:59,606 --> 00:49:01,878
c spent a hundred dick straight days
1353
00:49:02,255 --> 00:49:05,784
underwater. He's coming to our workshop. Because nobody
1354
00:49:05,842 --> 00:49:06,820
knows more
1355
00:49:07,277 --> 00:49:10,161
about healing traumatic brain injury than the guy
1356
00:49:10,161 --> 00:49:12,786
with the Phd who has lived through it.
1357
00:49:13,025 --> 00:49:15,013
Well, well, you know then stacking it with
1358
00:49:15,013 --> 00:49:17,738
hyper barr too. Yeah. That that is a
1359
00:49:17,738 --> 00:49:18,238
powerful
1360
00:49:18,697 --> 00:49:19,976
combination. Yep. In general.
1361
00:49:20,615 --> 00:49:22,054
You could say though, but what are the
1362
00:49:22,054 --> 00:49:24,291
mechanisms and per the increased perfusion in the
1363
00:49:24,291 --> 00:49:26,539
brain? That's 1. Sure. But it's not just
1364
00:49:26,539 --> 00:49:30,274
that. It's also brain derived neuro factor. It's
1365
00:49:30,274 --> 00:49:31,784
also FGF
1366
00:49:31,784 --> 00:49:34,509
21. There are these neuro protective factors
1367
00:49:34,899 --> 00:49:37,210
that are stimulated when you get cold. And
1368
00:49:37,369 --> 00:49:38,108
I don't
1369
00:49:38,484 --> 00:49:38,984
understand
1370
00:49:39,520 --> 00:49:39,998
why?
1371
00:49:40,556 --> 00:49:42,092
Exactly. The only
1372
00:49:42,483 --> 00:49:44,473
thing that makes sense to me is that
1373
00:49:44,473 --> 00:49:47,019
when you plunge yourself into the cold water,
1374
00:49:47,417 --> 00:49:49,168
your body's like, we're gotta take care of
1375
00:49:49,168 --> 00:49:50,860
the brain here. We you know, we have
1376
00:49:50,860 --> 00:49:53,980
to defend the vital organs. So as a
1377
00:49:53,980 --> 00:49:55,739
story, it sort of makes sense.
1378
00:49:56,380 --> 00:49:58,472
But there's a book barefoot foot to billionaire.
1379
00:49:58,712 --> 00:50:01,686
This is John Hunts, who was a chemical
1380
00:50:02,224 --> 00:50:03,203
engineering entrepreneur.
1381
00:50:03,661 --> 00:50:05,417
And in this book, a friend of mine
1382
00:50:05,417 --> 00:50:06,215
told me I should read it.
1383
00:50:06,949 --> 00:50:09,257
He starts with his, you know, humble beginnings
1384
00:50:09,257 --> 00:50:10,928
back in the thirties. He's born on an
1385
00:50:11,167 --> 00:50:14,908
Indian reservation, But he's got no pulse. He's
1386
00:50:14,908 --> 00:50:16,102
got no breath.
1387
00:50:16,753 --> 00:50:19,537
The doctor gave him up for dead, because
1388
00:50:19,537 --> 00:50:22,003
the doctor's gonna attend to the mom. Right?
1389
00:50:22,322 --> 00:50:24,244
But the mid wife said, I'm gonna bring
1390
00:50:24,244 --> 00:50:25,989
him back to life. What did she do?
1391
00:50:26,148 --> 00:50:28,527
Thermal contrast therapy. She ran them under the
1392
00:50:28,527 --> 00:50:30,035
hot. She ran them under the cold. Under
1393
00:50:30,035 --> 00:50:32,695
the hot? Under the cold. And this
1394
00:50:33,229 --> 00:50:35,456
shocked him into life. He began to breathe.
1395
00:50:35,615 --> 00:50:36,649
He began to cry.
1396
00:50:37,285 --> 00:50:39,607
Hunts wakes up, and he gives like away
1397
00:50:39,607 --> 00:50:41,916
a billion dollars as a adult, you know,
1398
00:50:42,076 --> 00:50:42,894
as a successful
1399
00:50:43,350 --> 00:50:45,739
to a Cancer Institute. But he seemed to
1400
00:50:45,739 --> 00:50:48,704
kinda forget the therapeutic effects of cold because
1401
00:50:48,704 --> 00:50:50,142
he's all looking in the nucleus. He's not
1402
00:50:50,142 --> 00:50:51,741
looking in the mitochondria. He's not looking at
1403
00:50:51,741 --> 00:50:54,138
the metabolism for the orange of cancer. But
1404
00:50:54,218 --> 00:50:55,657
I'm following a story so I go to
1405
00:50:55,657 --> 00:50:59,503
the library. Sure enough. Cold water therapy used
1406
00:50:59,503 --> 00:51:02,133
to be used for infants that had suffered
1407
00:51:02,133 --> 00:51:05,083
a brain injury during birth. You know what
1408
00:51:05,083 --> 00:51:06,634
they used now? Viagra.
1409
00:51:07,170 --> 00:51:11,631
Because viagra promotes vas dilation just like cold
1410
00:51:11,631 --> 00:51:12,667
water therapy will.
1411
00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:15,320
This is why a e dysfunction is 1
1412
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:16,860
of the first clinical markers
1413
00:51:17,239 --> 00:51:18,300
of metabolic
1414
00:51:18,679 --> 00:51:20,920
dysfunction. So you can take the viagra.
1415
00:51:21,333 --> 00:51:22,150
And it will
1416
00:51:22,681 --> 00:51:26,804
promote the mitochondria production of nitric oxide that
1417
00:51:26,804 --> 00:51:28,573
will cause the vas.
1418
00:51:29,199 --> 00:51:31,023
Great. This increases blood flow to the penis,
1419
00:51:31,341 --> 00:51:34,356
and it resolves the e dysfunction. But it
1420
00:51:34,356 --> 00:51:36,577
does it at the expense of the mitochondria,
1421
00:51:36,894 --> 00:51:39,237
not by healing the mitochondria. But
1422
00:51:39,611 --> 00:51:41,758
overcoming the insulin resistance is that's trying to
1423
00:51:41,758 --> 00:51:42,394
protect those damage,
1424
00:51:43,110 --> 00:51:44,859
mitochondria. So 1 of the best things you
1425
00:51:44,859 --> 00:51:47,736
can do for your sexual performance as a
1426
00:51:47,736 --> 00:51:50,360
man is do a program of cold plunge
1427
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:53,302
therapy that improve the mitochondria that produce that
1428
00:51:53,302 --> 00:51:55,304
nitric of that produce the energy for that
1429
00:51:55,304 --> 00:51:58,325
nitric oxide. Well, that segue us into the
1430
00:51:58,325 --> 00:52:00,891
final 1, sexual performance and
1431
00:52:01,504 --> 00:52:02,719
relationship health, and
1432
00:52:03,427 --> 00:52:05,018
I know I've read some of your work
1433
00:52:05,018 --> 00:52:06,154
around testosterone
1434
00:52:06,609 --> 00:52:09,711
increases. Obviously, that's going to increase Lab,
1435
00:52:10,203 --> 00:52:12,110
in men, but you mentioned something before the
1436
00:52:12,110 --> 00:52:13,961
show. You're you're seeing actually,
1437
00:52:14,653 --> 00:52:17,196
even more significant increases in the ladies. This
1438
00:52:17,196 --> 00:52:19,128
is brand new and but brand new. I
1439
00:52:19,128 --> 00:52:20,007
mean, a reader.
1440
00:52:20,566 --> 00:52:23,363
She was a Dallas for Ash conference. Yeah.
1441
00:52:23,523 --> 00:52:25,760
We're there? Yeah. Okay. And, know, she's meeting
1442
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:27,451
all these famous people and that kind of
1443
00:52:27,451 --> 00:52:29,445
thing, but she text me. I'm not at
1444
00:52:29,525 --> 00:52:31,598
Esp conference, and she goes, you know, where
1445
00:52:31,598 --> 00:52:32,794
I, I was hoping to meet you What,
1446
00:52:32,873 --> 00:52:34,787
you're not here, because I wanted to share
1447
00:52:34,787 --> 00:52:37,507
some results. Oh, what are those? She sends
1448
00:52:37,507 --> 00:52:38,461
me her lab reports.
1449
00:52:39,176 --> 00:52:41,822
Now she's had a complete his
1450
00:52:42,435 --> 00:52:43,969
and what's called an oo?
1451
00:52:44,343 --> 00:52:46,430
I can't even pronounce Her over is removed.
1452
00:52:46,589 --> 00:52:46,829
Mh.
1453
00:52:47,467 --> 00:52:49,860
She's 60 years old. She went into surgical
1454
00:52:49,860 --> 00:52:52,252
metal menopause after the surgery, but, of course,
1455
00:52:52,332 --> 00:52:53,768
she would be men menopause at her age
1456
00:52:53,768 --> 00:52:56,592
and she's been on a low dose testosterone
1457
00:52:56,729 --> 00:52:58,717
replacement therapy now for decades.
1458
00:52:59,434 --> 00:53:00,252
And her
1459
00:53:00,627 --> 00:53:02,953
measured testosterone will for ice baths. It was
1460
00:53:02,953 --> 00:53:04,231
kind of on the low end of normal,
1461
00:53:04,471 --> 00:53:06,468
but that's what her physician was trying to
1462
00:53:06,468 --> 00:53:08,465
shoot for. 10 x improvement.
1463
00:53:09,199 --> 00:53:11,830
Like, in more than 10 x from... What
1464
00:53:11,830 --> 00:53:13,505
was it 14 to a hundred and 63
1465
00:53:13,505 --> 00:53:15,738
if I'm remembering this correctly. And she wanted
1466
00:53:15,738 --> 00:53:17,732
to share that. Her estrogen also went up.
1467
00:53:17,971 --> 00:53:19,921
She said, got a meeting with my endo
1468
00:53:20,058 --> 00:53:21,891
on Monday, and I got a feeling that
1469
00:53:21,891 --> 00:53:23,506
they're gonna try and give me off the
1470
00:53:23,564 --> 00:53:23,963
testosterone.
1471
00:53:24,521 --> 00:53:25,715
The pam, how do you feel?
1472
00:53:26,288 --> 00:53:26,606
Great.
1473
00:53:27,163 --> 00:53:29,310
She says, my hair was coming in thicker.
1474
00:53:29,469 --> 00:53:32,333
I have better energy, and Dave I did
1475
00:53:32,333 --> 00:53:34,083
not have the guts to ask her about
1476
00:53:34,083 --> 00:53:37,121
her Lab because we're, like, recording this. Right?
1477
00:53:37,598 --> 00:53:37,996
And
1478
00:53:38,791 --> 00:53:41,417
she's like, it's fine. Well, I posted that.
1479
00:53:42,068 --> 00:53:43,420
And then I got a message from a
1480
00:53:43,420 --> 00:53:46,521
younger woman over is intact. She's 32, and
1481
00:53:46,521 --> 00:53:48,747
she's more concerned about how do I preserve
1482
00:53:48,747 --> 00:53:51,132
my fertility because I'm gonna wanna have kids
1483
00:53:51,132 --> 00:53:52,743
and I'm getting a little older.
1484
00:53:53,223 --> 00:53:54,501
She had her labs done,
1485
00:53:55,140 --> 00:53:56,898
doubled. But when she texted me she said
1486
00:53:56,978 --> 00:53:58,097
I didn't get that much of a boost,
1487
00:53:58,416 --> 00:53:59,695
only 0.5.
1488
00:54:00,268 --> 00:54:01,856
Well, you're united a kingdom they use different
1489
00:54:01,856 --> 00:54:04,237
units. You know, here, I went from 14
1490
00:54:04,237 --> 00:54:05,746
to a hundred and 60. I'm up a
1491
00:54:05,746 --> 00:54:07,493
hundred and 50 units, and she was, like,
1492
00:54:07,651 --> 00:54:09,001
I only increased 0.5.
1493
00:54:09,334 --> 00:54:12,364
But in her units, she went from 0.6
1494
00:54:12,364 --> 00:54:13,320
to 1.1.
1495
00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:14,437
And I figured forget what it was, you
1496
00:54:14,437 --> 00:54:17,307
know, nano mole per milliliter or something. She
1497
00:54:17,307 --> 00:54:20,119
almost doubled. Her estrogen went up 3 times.
1498
00:54:20,440 --> 00:54:22,360
So this says 2 women over the space
1499
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:24,679
of 2 weeks that are sending me their
1500
00:54:24,679 --> 00:54:26,599
lab saying all they changed was ice bath,
1501
00:54:26,934 --> 00:54:28,929
and then they're getting this huge boost in
1502
00:54:28,929 --> 00:54:29,987
their sex hormones.
1503
00:54:30,764 --> 00:54:34,250
Well, that, I think calls for further study
1504
00:54:34,527 --> 00:54:37,071
Where is the study of ice bath and
1505
00:54:37,071 --> 00:54:40,171
serum levels of testosterone and estrogen Possibly do
1506
00:54:40,171 --> 00:54:41,601
that research? Exactly right.
1507
00:54:43,689 --> 00:54:45,922
If only, there was someone setting up a
1508
00:54:45,922 --> 00:54:48,394
thousand square foot lab in Scottsdale,
1509
00:54:49,032 --> 00:54:51,639
Arizona that could, you know, work with me
1510
00:54:51,838 --> 00:54:54,701
to study this question the if there's anybody
1511
00:54:54,701 --> 00:54:57,086
listening to this podcast Yes. Please message me.
1512
00:54:57,723 --> 00:55:00,108
Let's let's close out here, Tom and tell
1513
00:55:00,108 --> 00:55:01,594
us about the research because,
1514
00:55:02,192 --> 00:55:04,982
you've had such a a good broad perspective
1515
00:55:04,982 --> 00:55:07,373
on all the information that's out there. You've
1516
00:55:07,373 --> 00:55:09,207
got the end of 1 case reports coming
1517
00:55:09,207 --> 00:55:12,003
in. You're like, There's something here. Nobody studied
1518
00:55:12,003 --> 00:55:14,566
it. You're probably looking at all the scientific
1519
00:55:14,860 --> 00:55:16,685
literature, you know where the gaps are. You
1520
00:55:16,685 --> 00:55:18,768
know, what gaps really need to be plugged
1521
00:55:18,768 --> 00:55:21,338
to further legit all of this. So,
1522
00:55:22,111 --> 00:55:24,579
like, any good businessman entrepreneur, like, well, I
1523
00:55:24,579 --> 00:55:26,665
guess we're doing it. And so you're kicking
1524
00:55:26,665 --> 00:55:27,781
off AAA
1525
00:55:27,781 --> 00:55:29,876
good businessman. I'm not a good entrepreneur.
1526
00:55:30,332 --> 00:55:32,086
And I don't know that any good businessman
1527
00:55:32,086 --> 00:55:34,333
or I'm checking take initiative to say listen,
1528
00:55:34,652 --> 00:55:35,449
this is a problem.
1529
00:55:36,245 --> 00:55:38,078
I'm gonna fix it. We're gonna do this
1530
00:55:38,078 --> 00:55:40,707
research. So tell us about that. The
1531
00:55:41,344 --> 00:55:43,336
thing we're doing now. I've never talked about
1532
00:55:43,336 --> 00:55:46,250
this in public. I've talked about it with
1533
00:55:46,309 --> 00:55:47,829
some of the people coming to the research
1534
00:55:47,829 --> 00:55:49,589
workshop here's what we're doing now. It is
1535
00:55:49,589 --> 00:55:51,829
called the Cold Plunge Research
1536
00:55:52,389 --> 00:55:55,595
Institute Ci. I just signed the engagement letter
1537
00:55:55,595 --> 00:55:57,985
with a nonprofit attorney here in Arizona. We're
1538
00:55:57,985 --> 00:55:59,976
gonna stand up a 05:01 c 3. It
1539
00:55:59,976 --> 00:56:02,467
is gonna run a cold plunge research conference
1540
00:56:02,699 --> 00:56:05,005
here in Phoenix. We're gonna do it longest
1541
00:56:05,005 --> 00:56:06,438
day of the year because I figured that's
1542
00:56:06,438 --> 00:56:08,585
the best thing to do in June at
1543
00:56:08,585 --> 00:56:09,222
the Sol.
1544
00:56:09,795 --> 00:56:11,635
People will come here. I mean, we'll have
1545
00:56:11,635 --> 00:56:13,554
ice baths so that they can cool off,
1546
00:56:13,715 --> 00:56:16,034
but we'll have university professors. We will have
1547
00:56:16,034 --> 00:56:18,609
clinicians. We'll have patient represented. And we will
1548
00:56:18,609 --> 00:56:21,809
have industry representatives. That includes Mar, But there
1549
00:56:21,809 --> 00:56:22,789
are so many
1550
00:56:23,329 --> 00:56:25,730
bad actors in this business right now.
1551
00:56:26,463 --> 00:56:28,297
Crooks. I don't know if it's illegal, but
1552
00:56:28,376 --> 00:56:30,529
I'm calling them crooks because these are deceptive
1553
00:56:30,529 --> 00:56:32,284
marketing practices. The... And you don't have to
1554
00:56:32,284 --> 00:56:34,516
go very far on reddit to find the
1555
00:56:34,516 --> 00:56:37,871
crooks. To be an industry med member of
1556
00:56:37,871 --> 00:56:40,416
this Cold plunge research institute, you're gonna have
1557
00:56:40,416 --> 00:56:43,293
to meet certain standards, truth and marketing. Truth
1558
00:56:43,293 --> 00:56:45,925
and advertising. Certain safety stands for the performance
1559
00:56:45,925 --> 00:56:49,295
of your equipment. I've talked to Matt K
1560
00:56:49,353 --> 00:56:51,666
from desert Plunge. She's right here in Scottsdale.
1561
00:56:52,159 --> 00:56:54,313
The guy who runs ice bath works. Jeff.
1562
00:56:54,473 --> 00:56:55,989
He's flying down to Phoenix, so he can
1563
00:56:55,989 --> 00:56:58,563
talk to Matt, and I... About what's the
1564
00:56:58,702 --> 00:57:00,891
industry role in this research
1565
00:57:01,269 --> 00:57:03,024
institute. And, of course, I want you to
1566
00:57:03,024 --> 00:57:04,061
come in. I want you to come to
1567
00:57:04,061 --> 00:57:05,656
the conference. I want you to do a
1568
00:57:05,656 --> 00:57:07,251
presentation about what heads up is doing. I
1569
00:57:07,251 --> 00:57:09,266
want you to help guide this non nonprofit
1570
00:57:09,498 --> 00:57:11,563
and this is gonna put some distance between
1571
00:57:11,563 --> 00:57:12,222
the business
1572
00:57:12,594 --> 00:57:15,294
and the science. People are still gonna say.
1573
00:57:15,691 --> 00:57:17,040
He's just saying that because he wants to...
1574
00:57:17,374 --> 00:57:19,605
Sell ice baths, and there's no way for
1575
00:57:19,605 --> 00:57:20,424
me to really
1576
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:22,634
butt that because I do sell ice baths,
1577
00:57:22,873 --> 00:57:24,786
but they have the order of operations wrong.
1578
00:57:25,199 --> 00:57:27,377
It's not that I started doing the science
1579
00:57:27,516 --> 00:57:29,514
because I wanted to sell the baths. After
1580
00:57:29,673 --> 00:57:31,911
I did the science, I realized we've got
1581
00:57:31,911 --> 00:57:34,400
to sell these back We have to make
1582
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:37,032
this available to people, and we're still the
1583
00:57:37,032 --> 00:57:39,983
only commercially available ice bath company in North
1584
00:57:40,143 --> 00:57:42,376
America that actually makes ice.
1585
00:57:43,189 --> 00:57:44,088
It would be
1586
00:57:44,546 --> 00:57:47,818
unethical of me to not start an ice
1587
00:57:47,818 --> 00:57:50,132
bath company. People can say, well, why is
1588
00:57:50,132 --> 00:57:51,170
it so expensive?
1589
00:57:51,823 --> 00:57:53,099
Maybe it's so expensive because I don't know
1590
00:57:53,179 --> 00:57:55,093
I'm doing. Maybe it's so expensive because I'm
1591
00:57:55,093 --> 00:57:57,805
a university professor instead of a real, you
1592
00:57:57,805 --> 00:57:58,943
know, manufacturing
1593
00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:00,836
engineer. If it's too much,
1594
00:58:01,489 --> 00:58:03,242
Matt from desert Plunge makes a good product
1595
00:58:03,242 --> 00:58:05,074
and he's an honest guy. You can get
1596
00:58:05,074 --> 00:58:06,667
1 of these less expensive units. So you
1597
00:58:06,667 --> 00:58:08,260
don't have to get ripped off doing it.
1598
00:58:08,675 --> 00:58:11,715
But we sell convenience and we sell ice.
1599
00:58:12,035 --> 00:58:13,894
So there's a segment of the market
1600
00:58:14,275 --> 00:58:15,795
that isn't so price sensitive.
1601
00:58:16,288 --> 00:58:19,470
They just want the best, and that's the
1602
00:58:19,470 --> 00:58:21,299
market that for right now we're trying to
1603
00:58:21,299 --> 00:58:23,129
serve. I love it. And like you said,
1604
00:58:23,367 --> 00:58:26,271
there will be other trust and reputable companies
1605
00:58:26,329 --> 00:58:28,562
that you can go to, and you're not
1606
00:58:28,562 --> 00:58:29,940
gonna have some poor
1607
00:58:30,636 --> 00:58:32,869
innocent person out there who reads about how
1608
00:58:32,869 --> 00:58:33,746
this can help them.
1609
00:58:34,399 --> 00:58:36,470
And finds a product and gets ripped off.
1610
00:58:36,788 --> 00:58:39,816
Right. That should never happen. Exactly right. So
1611
00:58:39,816 --> 00:58:42,922
there's at least some quality control, and there's
1612
00:58:42,922 --> 00:58:45,403
some trust and some authenticity built into it?
1613
00:58:45,562 --> 00:58:46,913
And what are you do trust the Fda
1614
00:58:46,913 --> 00:58:49,320
to regulate this? Trust the Cdc's
1615
00:58:49,933 --> 00:58:52,253
advice we have lost the trust in the
1616
00:58:52,253 --> 00:58:52,753
government
1617
00:58:53,206 --> 00:58:54,875
institutions that are supposed to be protecting our
1618
00:58:54,875 --> 00:58:56,464
health, and now we look to Joe Rogan.
1619
00:58:56,782 --> 00:58:59,403
And so since the Fda is incapable of
1620
00:58:59,403 --> 00:59:02,050
doing it. In this Cdc is useless. We've
1621
00:59:02,050 --> 00:59:05,003
got to do this ourselves, get reliable information
1622
00:59:05,003 --> 00:59:07,239
out to people that they can verify for
1623
00:59:07,239 --> 00:59:09,726
their n equals 1 self. I don't give
1624
00:59:09,726 --> 00:59:12,033
a crap with the peer reviewed, double blind,
1625
00:59:12,192 --> 00:59:14,896
you know, randomized controlled study that showed up
1626
00:59:14,896 --> 00:59:17,463
in the Lance that said, because nothing matters
1627
00:59:17,463 --> 00:59:20,579
more than your n equals 1 experience, you
1628
00:59:20,579 --> 00:59:22,336
need the tools to figure out what works
1629
00:59:22,336 --> 00:59:24,662
for you. Not worked for, you know, some
1630
00:59:24,820 --> 00:59:27,520
Japanese cohort of 23 year old college students
1631
00:59:27,520 --> 00:59:29,187
that they got on an exercise bike in
1632
00:59:29,187 --> 00:59:31,648
19 91. You gotta run your own study
1633
00:59:31,648 --> 00:59:34,074
on your own self to get reliable
1634
00:59:34,375 --> 00:59:35,414
information about you.
1635
00:59:36,054 --> 00:59:37,335
Took the words right out of my mouth
1636
00:59:37,414 --> 00:59:39,594
Tom. That's why we started heads up. That's
1637
00:59:39,734 --> 00:59:41,175
like, how the hell doing Know if anything's
1638
00:59:41,175 --> 00:59:42,868
working for me. Where's is the data? There
1639
00:59:42,868 --> 00:59:43,584
you go. So,
1640
00:59:44,380 --> 00:59:47,084
it's been awesome ride watching you guys grow.
1641
00:59:47,482 --> 00:59:49,605
Thanks. I'm excited to see you next week
1642
00:59:49,724 --> 00:59:51,319
Is it next weekend with the research? Yeah.
1643
00:59:51,798 --> 00:59:54,110
Okay. And keep doing the work you do,
1644
00:59:54,190 --> 00:59:56,583
man? Awesome nice. Yeah. Appreciate you brother. Yeah.
1645
00:59:56,742 --> 00:59:58,497
Yeah. It's been a pleasure. Yeah. Thanks, guys.
1646
00:59:58,976 --> 00:59:59,056
Alright.
1647
01:00:02,559 --> 01:00:05,016
Thank you for listening to data driven health
1648
01:00:05,016 --> 01:00:05,516
radio.
1649
01:00:06,681 --> 01:00:06,815
To