Greg Kelley (The Wrongful Conviction that allowed a Predator to Roam Free) - Episode 458

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the Behind the Shield podcast with the CEO and
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founder, Francisco Morales. Welcome to episode
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458 of Behind the Shield podcast. As always,
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my name is James Geering, and this week it is
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my absolute honor to welcome on the show, Greg
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Kelly. Now, this is such an important conversation
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for a multitude of reasons, and you will hear
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this story is pertaining ultimately to law enforcement,
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but there are parallels in fire, in EMS, in medicine.
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When we are... charged or we have the responsibility
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of people's lives we can either save them improve
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them or we have the power to destroy them whether
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we make a bad call in medicine whether we don't
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find someone on the fire or whether we use poor
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ethics in law enforcement in investigation and
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greg's courageous story is a prime example of
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that as a promising high school athlete he was
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falsely accused of sexual abuse of a child There
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are two tragedies in this. Firstly, Greg was
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convicted, saw three years in prison, and then
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an additional three years while his legal team
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fought for his complete innocence. The second
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part of this tragedy is for six years, the true
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offender roamed free and ultimately committed
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other sexual assaults. So this is such a powerful
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conversation and Greg is so courageous in telling
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it because it must be haunting and having to
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recount it again must be traumatic. So I admire
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him for stepping up to tell us, the first responder
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of the community, his story. It is beautifully
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portrayed in the documentary Outcry, but I was
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lucky enough to get him on here as well. But
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this is a cautionary tale for all of us, whether
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it's hiring practices and standards, whether
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it's training and whether it's us, ownership.
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When we deviate from the ethics, from the mission
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of what we're supposed to do when we're wearing
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the badge, we destroy lives. So I hope you listen
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to this all the way through. I hope you have
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the humility to learn from it and understand
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that it isn't pointing fingers or throwing stones
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in a glass house. It's learning from a tragic
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domino effect of poor decisions and lack of professionalism
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that almost destroyed multiple lives in the process.
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So before we get to that conversation, as I say
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every week, please just take a moment and go
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to whichever app you listen to this on. Subscribe
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to the show. Leave feedback. I love reading your
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feedback. And leave a rating. Every five -star
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rating truly elevates this podcast, making it
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easier and easier for others to find. And this
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is a free library of over 450 episodes now. And
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all I ask in return is that you help share. help
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share these incredible men and women's stories
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so I can get them to everyone else who needs
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to hear them. So with that being said, I introduce
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to you Greg Kelly. Enjoy. So Greg, I want to
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start by saying thank you so much for taking
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the time to come on the show. I watched Outcry
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a while ago. I literally rewatched it the last
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couple of days. So it's kind of surreal. I was
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telling my wife this the other day, like when
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I'm watching someone on a show and then immediately
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get to interview them like this. So thank you
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for taking the time to come on today. Absolutely.
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Thank you for having me. So for people listening,
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where on planet Earth are we finding you today?
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I'm currently in Leander, Texas, the north. city
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of Austin, Texas. I grew up here all my life,
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born and raised Leander, Texas. I'm currently
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here on break from college. I got one more year
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of college and continue to, I got four more years
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to play football and continue that journey and
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that career. But yeah, I'm in my hometown. Beautiful.
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Yeah. And you say just just finish the final.
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So I appreciate you taking some time out. Yeah.
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All right. Well, then, chronologically speaking,
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starting at the very beginning, tell me about
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where you were born and tell me your family dynamic,
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what your parents did and how many siblings.
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Yeah. So, of course, I was born here in Leander,
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Texas, actually in Georgetown, Texas. It's ironic
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because Georgetown, Texas is also a city where,
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you know, a chapter of my life. opened up that
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I didn't necessarily ask for and but it did and
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but I was born in Georgetown is right next to
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Leander but I grew up in Leander I went to school
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in Leander made friends you know and and had
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older brothers had four older brothers all athletes
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I actually have a sister she she lives in another
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state but we're close two parents a mother and
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father and you know both parents love Their kids
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very much worked very hard to make sure that
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their kids are well off and what they needed
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to be successful. And I grew up playing sports,
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you know. Grew up in middle school playing multiple
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different sports, basketball, football, a little
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bit of baseball. And then went into, you know,
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high school at Leander High School my freshman
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year. Actually, my eighth grade year in middle
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school, I became friends with a girl named Gabri
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Anderson. And she it's a funny story. We actually
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were friends and we met in math class. And I
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wasn't always, you know, the best student in
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eighth grade just because, you know, I had dyslexia
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and I was suffering from distractions. And I
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just really didn't necessarily focus on school
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that much, you know, in eighth grade. I just
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wanted to play sports. But she's incredibly smart.
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And we would always, you know, just so happen
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to sit next to each other in math class. And
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I figured out really quick that she was super
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smart. And I asked her for help multiple times.
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I really didn't ask for help. I probably just
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cheated off of her. But we got to talking a lot,
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man, and we grew a liking for each other and
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we both thought we were cute and we became friends.
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And I think that we were kind of in the friend
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zone for a little while as we went to Slitterbond,
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which is a water park here in Texas, together
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with friends and stuff like that. But ninth grade
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year came around and I got the courage to finally
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ask her out. And, you know, she pretty much told
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me that. I'll give you a chance. I'll go out
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with you. And that just led on to us, man, falling
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in love. And we grew up in high school together.
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She was the dance captain of her dance team.
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And I was playing football and I got really serious
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with football to a point where I wanted to go
00:11:07.950 --> 00:11:11.289
to college and play. And so I ended up going
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to college or I ended up playing football up
00:11:14.870 --> 00:11:17.879
to a point where I got a scholarship. to go to
00:11:17.879 --> 00:11:19.980
college. I got multiple different scholarships
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to go to college and junior year came around
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and one of the most terrible, you know, horrendous,
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nightmarish things happened where I got accused
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of a crime I didn't do. Not just a crime I didn't
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do, but one of the most frowned upon crimes,
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hated crimes in the history of humanity. And
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I was an 18 -year -old kid with a whole future
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ahead of him that did not know how to take it
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because I just didn't live a life where I was
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expected to get accused of something. And it
00:12:00.820 --> 00:12:08.139
was a tragedy because I was so focused on going
00:12:08.139 --> 00:12:13.769
to football, gaining the respect. people to make
00:12:13.769 --> 00:12:16.909
it out of Leander and go make something of myself.
00:12:18.409 --> 00:12:22.269
And a few things along the line happened with
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my family being medically ill to put me in a
00:12:24.830 --> 00:12:28.009
position to live in a house where I had to live
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a year before an accusation was made about me.
00:12:32.809 --> 00:12:35.309
And so for eight months I lived in that house,
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which was ran by, you know, it was an in -home
00:12:37.330 --> 00:12:40.690
daycare. And I had to do that because both my
00:12:40.690 --> 00:12:42.190
parents were medically ill and they couldn't
00:12:42.190 --> 00:12:45.029
take care of me. But eight months into that,
00:12:45.230 --> 00:12:48.750
I moved out. And a month later after I moved
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out of that house, I was accused of this crime.
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Well, going back, because obviously we'll get
00:12:56.590 --> 00:12:58.889
deep into that in a little bit. But going back
00:12:58.889 --> 00:13:02.990
before, I think, you know, one of the most incredible
00:13:02.990 --> 00:13:05.409
things is as a freshman, you were playing on
00:13:05.409 --> 00:13:08.809
a varsity team. Have I got that right? So freshman
00:13:08.809 --> 00:13:10.789
year, kind of. I mean, freshman year at the end
00:13:10.789 --> 00:13:12.690
of the year, I got pulled up for varsity playoffs.
00:13:12.990 --> 00:13:15.850
But my sophomore and my junior year, I had to
00:13:15.850 --> 00:13:18.029
fill some shoes. I had to step into some shoes
00:13:18.029 --> 00:13:21.750
and play in the varsity level. Right. So before
00:13:21.750 --> 00:13:24.070
we even get into the outcry and obviously the
00:13:24.070 --> 00:13:27.029
heart -wrenching story that followed after that,
00:13:27.230 --> 00:13:30.210
what was it when you look back now mentally and
00:13:30.210 --> 00:13:33.850
physically that carried you on that trajectory
00:13:33.850 --> 00:13:39.200
to being such a phenomenal athlete? Um, I just
00:13:39.200 --> 00:13:42.139
think, you know, a little bit of just natural
00:13:42.139 --> 00:13:45.679
born talent got me to to the door, I guess you
00:13:45.679 --> 00:13:48.620
could say, and got some heads turning. You know,
00:13:48.620 --> 00:13:51.539
I was always a little bit bigger physically than
00:13:51.539 --> 00:13:54.480
everybody else. And another part was just my
00:13:54.480 --> 00:13:56.879
work ethic. I loved being in the gym. I loved
00:13:56.879 --> 00:14:00.700
working out. I felt like that was a that was
00:14:00.700 --> 00:14:04.740
a release for me as far as getting away from,
00:14:04.759 --> 00:14:08.330
you know. Like I said, I struggled with dyslexia
00:14:08.330 --> 00:14:14.490
and a little bit of ADHD. And I that was a little
00:14:14.490 --> 00:14:17.289
bit of, you know, me finding my norm, which was
00:14:17.289 --> 00:14:20.970
in the gym, you know, getting better. And I knew
00:14:20.970 --> 00:14:25.049
that at the time I didn't know how great I could
00:14:25.049 --> 00:14:27.970
be at academics until I applied myself, until
00:14:27.970 --> 00:14:30.629
I actually believed in myself and had confidence
00:14:30.629 --> 00:14:35.120
and courage to step out of. all the excuses I
00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:37.779
was making for myself with dyslexia and all that
00:14:37.779 --> 00:14:41.600
until, you know, until I actually, you know,
00:14:41.600 --> 00:14:44.940
got down to it and figured it out and just busting
00:14:44.940 --> 00:14:48.340
my butt to make it work. And so I had every excuse
00:14:48.340 --> 00:14:50.820
in the book academically. So I try to fill the
00:14:50.820 --> 00:14:54.360
void with working out as much as I can. And that
00:14:54.360 --> 00:14:56.139
helped me in a sense, it got me more athletic
00:14:56.139 --> 00:14:59.960
and turned a lot of heads. But yeah, I got to
00:14:59.960 --> 00:15:01.600
a point where I figured out I was pretty good
00:15:01.600 --> 00:15:04.110
at football. you know, my freshman year. And
00:15:04.110 --> 00:15:06.409
I wanted to take advantage of it to make it to
00:15:06.409 --> 00:15:10.309
college. Now, your mom was obviously an immigrant,
00:15:10.350 --> 00:15:13.409
just like I am in the U .S. When you look back
00:15:13.409 --> 00:15:17.029
now, because obviously as we talk about the story
00:15:17.029 --> 00:15:20.409
and your mindset when you're accused of this,
00:15:20.490 --> 00:15:23.730
and obviously there were so many people around
00:15:23.730 --> 00:15:25.450
you that abandoned together too, but your specific
00:15:25.450 --> 00:15:28.059
mindset that got you through that. Kept your
00:15:28.059 --> 00:15:30.519
nose clean while you were in prison, while you
00:15:30.519 --> 00:15:33.019
were serving the sentence of a crime that you
00:15:33.019 --> 00:15:38.200
didn't commit. It seemed to be you had this kind
00:15:38.200 --> 00:15:41.080
of resilience and you were accused at 17 years
00:15:41.080 --> 00:15:43.179
old. So we're talking about a very, very young
00:15:43.179 --> 00:15:46.740
mind at that point. What was it about your family
00:15:46.740 --> 00:15:50.779
dynamic that fostered that kind of mindset, that
00:15:50.779 --> 00:15:53.120
kindness, compassion, resilience that you seem
00:15:53.120 --> 00:16:00.019
to have? I would have to say my mother. The kindness
00:16:00.019 --> 00:16:04.480
and the compassion and the patience that I feel
00:16:04.480 --> 00:16:07.539
like sometimes I surprise myself with in stressful
00:16:07.539 --> 00:16:13.059
situations comes from my mother. If anybody gets
00:16:13.059 --> 00:16:16.240
to know her or anybody knows her, she's a woman
00:16:16.240 --> 00:16:19.899
of faith. First and foremost, she's a woman of
00:16:19.899 --> 00:16:22.320
faith. And I think her faith and the things she's
00:16:22.320 --> 00:16:26.470
learned with her faith has brought her to be
00:16:26.470 --> 00:16:29.990
that type of human. And having a mother like
00:16:29.990 --> 00:16:32.590
that, that instilled that into me and her boys,
00:16:32.809 --> 00:16:36.330
I believe got me through some of the toughest
00:16:36.330 --> 00:16:40.049
times in my life. And going into this situation,
00:16:40.350 --> 00:16:43.450
you know, with the resilience and the perseverance
00:16:43.450 --> 00:16:47.429
of not just the mental aspect of going through
00:16:47.429 --> 00:16:51.370
such a nightmare, but the physical aspect of
00:16:51.370 --> 00:16:55.100
continuing to look ahead in the future. To understand
00:16:55.100 --> 00:16:57.360
that what's happening to me is not, it's not,
00:16:57.440 --> 00:17:01.100
it's not, it doesn't have to necessarily make
00:17:01.100 --> 00:17:04.299
me into a bitter person. It doesn't necessarily
00:17:04.299 --> 00:17:09.240
have to make me into, you know, what people expect
00:17:09.240 --> 00:17:12.319
me to become, which is an angry, bitter person
00:17:12.319 --> 00:17:16.380
who hates cops and hates judges and hates DAs.
00:17:16.400 --> 00:17:19.539
That's not who I am at all. I just know that
00:17:19.539 --> 00:17:22.980
we have a sin nature as human beings. And sometimes.
00:17:23.660 --> 00:17:26.660
We can be a piece of crap. And there are some
00:17:26.660 --> 00:17:28.859
people out there that don't necessarily have
00:17:28.859 --> 00:17:33.079
right intentions. But, you know, it doesn't spoil
00:17:33.079 --> 00:17:36.119
the rest of them. And so I chose to understand
00:17:36.119 --> 00:17:40.220
that what's happening to me is evil and I'm going
00:17:40.220 --> 00:17:44.619
to combat it with good. And so here I am today.
00:17:44.799 --> 00:17:49.319
So we won. Absolutely. Well, one more thing before
00:17:49.319 --> 00:17:52.220
we kind of start on that journey then. You obviously
00:17:52.220 --> 00:17:53.880
were very good at football that, you know, you
00:17:53.880 --> 00:17:56.559
were enjoying sports. Were there any other career
00:17:56.559 --> 00:17:58.819
aspirations that you were thinking about in high
00:17:58.819 --> 00:18:01.579
school age or was it focused on college and maybe
00:18:01.579 --> 00:18:07.140
professional sports? No, it was up in the air.
00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:10.240
I mean, I mean, at one point I was thinking about
00:18:10.240 --> 00:18:12.279
being a firefighter. You know, I was thinking
00:18:12.279 --> 00:18:17.700
about being a police officer. The idea of being
00:18:17.700 --> 00:18:21.160
a SWAT officer. uh was something that was juggling
00:18:21.160 --> 00:18:23.920
in my head and and uh I just wanted to do something
00:18:23.920 --> 00:18:26.980
that was really cool and fun you know and I wanted
00:18:26.980 --> 00:18:31.940
I was thinking about um you know being uh definitely
00:18:31.940 --> 00:18:33.460
a football player I wanted to see where that
00:18:33.460 --> 00:18:36.839
that can't that that went um and the professional
00:18:36.839 --> 00:18:39.380
side of course I mean that's every college football
00:18:39.380 --> 00:18:41.519
player's aspiration is to get to the next level
00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:45.000
but no it was just up in the air I mean I didn't
00:18:45.000 --> 00:18:46.720
necessarily know I wanted what I wanted to do
00:18:46.720 --> 00:18:49.390
yet Beautiful. Well, that would have been a good
00:18:49.390 --> 00:18:54.650
profession too. Yeah. So, prefacing the story,
00:18:54.849 --> 00:18:59.470
I had an absolute micro -dose of what, not so
00:18:59.470 --> 00:19:01.430
much you, but what your family went through.
00:19:01.490 --> 00:19:03.970
My son had a micro -dose of what you went through.
00:19:04.690 --> 00:19:07.190
Just in the fact that he was in middle school
00:19:07.190 --> 00:19:11.849
as well. At school, basically, there was some
00:19:11.849 --> 00:19:14.529
stuff going on. I'm divorced now and in his mother's
00:19:14.529 --> 00:19:17.890
house, there was kind of turmoil there. He was
00:19:17.890 --> 00:19:19.750
going through a kind of, you know, low patch,
00:19:19.950 --> 00:19:22.950
was in a class one day, was kind of crying. The
00:19:22.950 --> 00:19:26.089
next thing, without communicating with me at
00:19:26.089 --> 00:19:28.750
all, he was put in a psych facility for three
00:19:28.750 --> 00:19:32.210
days, saying, like, basically took his interpretation
00:19:32.210 --> 00:19:34.890
of being sad into he's going to shoot up the
00:19:34.890 --> 00:19:38.190
school, which is a complete disregard from any
00:19:38.190 --> 00:19:40.869
of the protocols the school has. And this was
00:19:40.869 --> 00:19:43.089
basically a law enforcement officer that made
00:19:43.089 --> 00:19:46.609
this decision. This whole project is dedicated
00:19:46.609 --> 00:19:50.210
to kindness, compassion, you know, getting people
00:19:50.210 --> 00:19:52.210
out of pain, trying to keep people, you know,
00:19:52.210 --> 00:19:54.829
from going down a path that ends up taking their
00:19:54.829 --> 00:19:57.329
life. You know, that's what this is about. And
00:19:57.329 --> 00:19:59.809
I tell the stories of great police officers,
00:19:59.910 --> 00:20:01.529
tell the stories of great firefighters, but I
00:20:01.529 --> 00:20:03.970
also importantly tell the stories of the shitty
00:20:03.970 --> 00:20:08.170
ones because those are the ones, their one complacency
00:20:08.170 --> 00:20:11.109
or arrogance or whatever it is leads to people
00:20:11.109 --> 00:20:13.599
losing their lives, losing their freedom. And
00:20:13.599 --> 00:20:15.440
even children, because I witnessed other children
00:20:15.440 --> 00:20:17.259
cycle through this facility while we were there
00:20:17.259 --> 00:20:21.880
as well. So, like I said, an absolute microdose.
00:20:21.880 --> 00:20:25.279
But knowing just how three days tore me up as
00:20:25.279 --> 00:20:27.640
a parent, I can't imagine, you know, the pain
00:20:27.640 --> 00:20:29.259
that your family went through, what Gabriel went
00:20:29.259 --> 00:20:30.799
through, and obviously what you went through.
00:20:30.900 --> 00:20:33.440
So, I just want to preface that with this conversation.
00:20:33.519 --> 00:20:35.839
Like, you know, this is an important conversation
00:20:35.839 --> 00:20:39.539
for two reasons. One, to highlight. The impact
00:20:39.539 --> 00:20:43.859
one shitty decision can make on a person, an
00:20:43.859 --> 00:20:49.579
entire microcosm of someone. But also, this ends
00:20:49.579 --> 00:20:52.920
well. But there are so many people in prison
00:20:52.920 --> 00:20:55.059
right now that didn't have what we're going to
00:20:55.059 --> 00:20:58.599
see, that tribe that banded around them, that
00:20:58.599 --> 00:21:00.799
are still in prison. And the Innocence Project
00:21:00.799 --> 00:21:02.680
sends me texts every day of all these different
00:21:02.680 --> 00:21:06.299
people that they're fighting for. With you, you're
00:21:06.299 --> 00:21:09.019
a successful high school athlete. You're with
00:21:09.019 --> 00:21:11.039
your middle school sweetheart. You know, your
00:21:11.039 --> 00:21:13.460
aspirations are maybe even one day entering one
00:21:13.460 --> 00:21:18.220
of our professions. Your mother is fighting a
00:21:18.220 --> 00:21:23.279
tumor. Your father's had a stroke. So they want
00:21:23.279 --> 00:21:26.119
to keep you at school. So you end up staying
00:21:26.119 --> 00:21:29.799
with a friend, Jonathan McCarty. And as you mentioned,
00:21:29.839 --> 00:21:33.400
in that house, there was a daycare. So lead me
00:21:33.400 --> 00:21:36.099
through. the kind of the building up to that
00:21:36.099 --> 00:21:38.279
what it was like initially in the house and then
00:21:38.279 --> 00:21:40.480
obviously we'll get to the the outcry and then
00:21:40.480 --> 00:21:45.319
move on from there okay yeah um of course you
00:21:45.319 --> 00:21:48.779
know my parents my sophomore year the end of
00:21:48.779 --> 00:21:51.599
my sophomore year in high school my parents suffered
00:21:51.599 --> 00:21:54.920
from two medical conditions my mom developed
00:21:54.920 --> 00:21:58.920
brain tumors And my dad had a bad stroke, a very
00:21:58.920 --> 00:22:01.799
severe stroke. And this happened. These both
00:22:01.799 --> 00:22:03.920
happened within the same month of each other.
00:22:04.619 --> 00:22:08.519
I had not been driving yet. I didn't have a car.
00:22:08.599 --> 00:22:11.519
I didn't have a license. I was just playing football,
00:22:11.680 --> 00:22:15.299
going to school. And my dad was taking me every
00:22:15.299 --> 00:22:17.559
morning. And we lived out in the country. So
00:22:17.559 --> 00:22:20.240
I was about maybe 20, 25 minutes away from the
00:22:20.240 --> 00:22:25.569
school. So, I mean, I had no. no way to get to
00:22:25.569 --> 00:22:29.170
school. And, um, you know, I was obligated to
00:22:29.170 --> 00:22:31.130
get to school because I was a football player
00:22:31.130 --> 00:22:33.089
and needed to watch film and need to work out,
00:22:33.150 --> 00:22:37.930
um, before school time, you know? And so I, uh,
00:22:38.009 --> 00:22:42.730
a buddy of mine, Jonathan McCarty, um, he was
00:22:42.730 --> 00:22:45.109
like my backup in football. Uh, we were also
00:22:45.109 --> 00:22:46.710
friends too. I mean, we've been friends since
00:22:46.710 --> 00:22:51.150
middle school, um, and his house. was an in -home
00:22:51.150 --> 00:22:53.809
daycare and his mother was very welcoming to
00:22:53.809 --> 00:22:56.869
the athletes in the Leander area to come in,
00:22:56.910 --> 00:22:59.849
you know, and hang out, play Xbox and and eat
00:22:59.849 --> 00:23:02.450
pizza rolls and do that type of thing, you know,
00:23:02.450 --> 00:23:05.789
and she was just real welcoming. And and so that's
00:23:05.789 --> 00:23:08.009
how I knew of her and the house and Jonathan.
00:23:08.170 --> 00:23:11.630
And so when Jonathan offered, hey, come stay
00:23:11.630 --> 00:23:14.750
at my house until your parents get better so
00:23:14.750 --> 00:23:16.609
you can be closer to the school, it's five minutes
00:23:16.609 --> 00:23:22.079
away. It was something to consider. And so I
00:23:22.079 --> 00:23:24.619
then, you know, talked to Shama and his mother
00:23:24.619 --> 00:23:28.119
and she she welcomed me in. And I told my parents
00:23:28.119 --> 00:23:30.420
and I told my mom and my dad and they agreed
00:23:30.420 --> 00:23:33.660
to it. And so I started living there. And so
00:23:33.660 --> 00:23:35.420
while I was living there, of course, I was closer
00:23:35.420 --> 00:23:37.299
to school and I was able to play football and
00:23:37.299 --> 00:23:40.160
go to school and do that sort of thing and continue
00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:44.880
with my football career to go to college. But
00:23:44.880 --> 00:23:47.640
it was weird because. When I lived there, I just
00:23:47.640 --> 00:23:49.599
started seeing another side of Jonathan that
00:23:49.599 --> 00:23:51.660
I didn't expect, you know, not the side that
00:23:51.660 --> 00:23:54.799
I knew him of whenever I wasn't living with him.
00:23:55.000 --> 00:23:56.960
He was actually going down a pretty bad path.
00:23:58.059 --> 00:24:02.359
A few months in, he started using drugs and he
00:24:02.359 --> 00:24:05.059
started bringing people to the house that I wasn't
00:24:05.059 --> 00:24:07.539
comfortable being around with what I wanted to
00:24:07.539 --> 00:24:12.039
do in my future. And he started bringing people
00:24:12.039 --> 00:24:14.440
to the house that his parents weren't comfortable
00:24:14.440 --> 00:24:18.380
with. And it was a few months in where Jonathan,
00:24:18.519 --> 00:24:21.359
you know, I remember this morning where I was
00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:24.220
getting ready to go to school. And of course,
00:24:24.240 --> 00:24:27.160
you know, I was being able, I was able to use
00:24:27.160 --> 00:24:31.279
one of the family cars to get to school and go
00:24:31.279 --> 00:24:34.940
to work. And so, but one of the obligations,
00:24:35.079 --> 00:24:38.200
the stipulations to that is I had to take Jonathan
00:24:38.200 --> 00:24:40.799
to school, you know, and take him wherever he
00:24:40.799 --> 00:24:44.160
needed to go if he needed to go somewhere. And
00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:46.920
I said, cool. So we were getting ready to go
00:24:46.920 --> 00:24:49.279
to school. And I was getting my backpack. And
00:24:49.279 --> 00:24:51.220
I actually remember walking down the stairs one
00:24:51.220 --> 00:24:55.940
time. And there was a big altercation. And Shama,
00:24:56.059 --> 00:24:58.880
his mother, was yelling at him. And she was holding
00:24:58.880 --> 00:25:01.380
a backpack. And in the backpack was a big Ziploc
00:25:01.380 --> 00:25:07.380
bag of marijuana. And so he was a 16 -year -old
00:25:07.380 --> 00:25:11.420
kid with about, I mean, half a pound of marijuana.
00:25:14.139 --> 00:25:17.000
So I was like, man, what's going on? He's actually
00:25:17.000 --> 00:25:20.240
selling it. He's become a drug dealer now. And
00:25:20.240 --> 00:25:23.279
so that's just not the Jonathan that I knew when
00:25:23.279 --> 00:25:27.099
I moved in. And I think that was a product of
00:25:27.099 --> 00:25:29.200
the people he started bringing over to the house,
00:25:29.259 --> 00:25:34.059
which were local drug dealers. And he got in
00:25:34.059 --> 00:25:37.140
trouble for it. But that was the start. And I
00:25:37.140 --> 00:25:38.779
say that story because that was the start where
00:25:38.779 --> 00:25:41.539
I started feeling uncomfortable living in that
00:25:41.539 --> 00:25:46.119
house. A few weeks later, he got caught with
00:25:46.119 --> 00:25:49.940
Xanax pills. He got caught with Molly. He got
00:25:49.940 --> 00:25:53.619
caught with just harder drugs. And they got to
00:25:53.619 --> 00:25:55.319
a point where I just started feeling so uncomfortable,
00:25:55.579 --> 00:25:58.240
even though I care for Shama and his father,
00:25:58.299 --> 00:26:03.579
Ralph, very, very nice people. I just didn't
00:26:03.579 --> 00:26:05.720
want to live in that house anymore. I actually,
00:26:05.819 --> 00:26:08.799
my mom was on the urge of getting better. She
00:26:08.799 --> 00:26:13.079
had surgery, her tumors. were shrinking. I mean,
00:26:13.160 --> 00:26:16.599
it was, it was a successful surgery. And so my
00:26:16.599 --> 00:26:19.859
dad was still going through rehab and he was
00:26:19.859 --> 00:26:21.480
not getting better. He would have to stay through
00:26:21.480 --> 00:26:24.099
rehab. And so, but my mom was able to go back
00:26:24.099 --> 00:26:27.099
home about eight months in to me living in that
00:26:27.099 --> 00:26:30.220
house. This was now going towards the end of
00:26:30.220 --> 00:26:36.279
my junior year. Um, and I remember going to my
00:26:36.279 --> 00:26:37.839
mom and said, mom, I want to come back home.
00:26:37.960 --> 00:26:39.519
I can't, I don't feel comfortable here anymore.
00:26:40.299 --> 00:26:45.619
Um, I'm going to college next year. And she said,
00:26:45.799 --> 00:26:49.680
come home, come home. And I go, I come back home
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:54.380
and I've been home for about a month. And now
00:26:54.380 --> 00:26:57.420
it's already summertime. And during the summer,
00:26:57.480 --> 00:26:59.339
the high school holds this summer strength and
00:26:59.339 --> 00:27:02.119
conditioning camp where all the athletes have
00:27:02.119 --> 00:27:04.559
an opportunity to continue to work out at the
00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:08.940
high school and do drills over the summer. And
00:27:08.940 --> 00:27:13.779
I was getting out of that camp. around 8 a .m.
00:27:14.599 --> 00:27:18.079
or actually 10 a .m. And I had a bunch of phone
00:27:18.079 --> 00:27:20.099
calls. This was already a month after I moved
00:27:20.099 --> 00:27:21.559
out of the house. I was living with my parents.
00:27:21.660 --> 00:27:25.079
I had my own car at the time. And I got out and
00:27:25.079 --> 00:27:26.799
I checked my phone and I got a bunch of missed
00:27:26.799 --> 00:27:31.980
calls from my brother, Marlon. And he says, call
00:27:31.980 --> 00:27:34.519
me immediately on a text message. So I call him.
00:27:35.480 --> 00:27:37.759
And he immediately says, hey, where are you?
00:27:37.839 --> 00:27:40.019
If you're coming to Shama's, don't come to Shama's.
00:27:40.059 --> 00:27:41.339
And I remember telling him, I was like, hey,
00:27:41.380 --> 00:27:43.079
I haven't been there in a month. What's going
00:27:43.079 --> 00:27:48.440
on? And he said, well, there's a father of one
00:27:48.440 --> 00:27:53.160
of the kids here stating that you sexually abused
00:27:53.160 --> 00:27:57.640
him. And like I always say, I thought my brother
00:27:57.640 --> 00:27:59.640
was joking with me when he first said that. I
00:27:59.640 --> 00:28:01.099
couldn't believe him. That's just something you
00:28:01.099 --> 00:28:05.470
don't expect to hear. Or be joked about. I mean,
00:28:05.490 --> 00:28:08.210
it was terrible. When he told me, I was like,
00:28:08.250 --> 00:28:11.809
man, quit joking with me. But I realized he wasn't
00:28:11.809 --> 00:28:15.569
joking. Things got really serious. And I remember
00:28:15.569 --> 00:28:19.549
my heart just sinking down to my stomach because
00:28:19.549 --> 00:28:22.730
this accusation has now just become real. I'm
00:28:22.730 --> 00:28:25.869
being accused of this. But the thing is, there
00:28:25.869 --> 00:28:28.109
was a huge question mark on my head because I
00:28:28.109 --> 00:28:31.099
didn't know what was going on. And I remember
00:28:31.099 --> 00:28:33.079
telling him I want to go I want to come over
00:28:33.079 --> 00:28:34.339
to the house I want to get out of the bottom
00:28:34.339 --> 00:28:36.180
of this. I want to know why I'm being accused
00:28:36.180 --> 00:28:39.940
of this and He says not a good idea man. They're
00:28:39.940 --> 00:28:43.799
they're really mad and just go home and I'll
00:28:43.799 --> 00:28:46.240
figure it out. I'll see what's going on I'll
00:28:46.240 --> 00:28:48.079
see why you know, you're being accused of it
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:52.079
and why they're saying your name and and Things
00:28:52.079 --> 00:28:55.339
went on and we figured out that the kid said
00:28:55.339 --> 00:29:02.410
that Greg did this to him and I was stuck in
00:29:02.410 --> 00:29:04.390
such a hopeless situation because I wanted to
00:29:04.390 --> 00:29:07.450
figure out why I was being accused of this. And
00:29:07.450 --> 00:29:11.150
I just wasn't getting answers. So for three weeks,
00:29:11.390 --> 00:29:16.569
I sat there. I couldn't communicate with the
00:29:16.569 --> 00:29:19.150
accuser. I'm an accuser as a child. And I couldn't
00:29:19.150 --> 00:29:22.029
communicate with his father because my brother
00:29:22.029 --> 00:29:25.809
wasn't allowing me to. And I was also being recommended
00:29:25.809 --> 00:29:27.609
at that time. By that time, I had an attorney
00:29:27.609 --> 00:29:31.930
because... These accusations that were being
00:29:31.930 --> 00:29:35.390
put on me were actually real. And so I was like,
00:29:35.470 --> 00:29:40.289
oh, my gosh. I then told my attorney and my attorney
00:29:40.289 --> 00:29:42.529
said, just, you know, we'll see how it plays
00:29:42.529 --> 00:29:46.369
out. It took three weeks for the victim's parents
00:29:46.369 --> 00:29:50.529
to finally go to the police. And I thought that
00:29:50.529 --> 00:29:55.250
was actually pretty strange. I thought that was
00:29:55.250 --> 00:29:59.259
really strange. And so. Sitting at my mother's
00:29:59.259 --> 00:30:02.319
house, my mom's like, I remember telling my mom
00:30:02.319 --> 00:30:04.900
the same day I was getting accused. And I was
00:30:04.900 --> 00:30:06.859
scared to tell my mom because she was already
00:30:06.859 --> 00:30:10.079
emotionally unbalanced. But I had to tell her
00:30:10.079 --> 00:30:11.839
and keep her in the loop while it's going on.
00:30:12.259 --> 00:30:16.700
But for three weeks, man, I sat there just completely
00:30:16.700 --> 00:30:19.299
on the edge, didn't know what was going on. And
00:30:19.299 --> 00:30:20.819
during that three weeks, I had to continue to
00:30:20.819 --> 00:30:23.519
go work out and go live normal life while this
00:30:23.519 --> 00:30:25.720
accusation was being floated around in the air.
00:30:26.539 --> 00:30:28.119
And I was just trying to get down to the bottom
00:30:28.119 --> 00:30:32.500
of it. But then I go to the police and I remember
00:30:32.500 --> 00:30:34.539
my attorney telling me that they went to the
00:30:34.539 --> 00:30:38.279
police and the police officer and my attorney
00:30:38.279 --> 00:30:44.019
are communicating with each other. And they about
00:30:44.019 --> 00:30:46.299
I think about two weeks after they went to the
00:30:46.299 --> 00:30:49.019
police about almost about a little bit over a
00:30:49.019 --> 00:30:52.539
month now that I've been accused out of nowhere,
00:30:52.660 --> 00:30:57.920
out of nowhere. I remember. getting a call from
00:30:57.920 --> 00:31:00.660
my attorney this is in the middle of summer and
00:31:00.660 --> 00:31:02.819
she said that there's a warrant out for your
00:31:02.819 --> 00:31:10.839
arrest and I mean now I just I I can't even remember
00:31:10.839 --> 00:31:14.339
the feelings I felt then I remember um going
00:31:14.339 --> 00:31:18.720
and sitting in her office and I just had a bunch
00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:21.440
of questions for her I said why am I being why
00:31:21.440 --> 00:31:23.359
am I being arrested for this what do I do are
00:31:23.359 --> 00:31:25.140
they going to come and handcuff me like what
00:31:26.519 --> 00:31:32.119
And she said, you know, this child accused you
00:31:32.119 --> 00:31:36.579
and that's all they need to arrest you. And I
00:31:36.579 --> 00:31:38.680
just that's not right. That's not right. Why?
00:31:38.759 --> 00:31:40.559
Why wasn't there an investigation? Why can't
00:31:40.559 --> 00:31:43.140
we get down to the truth before they go and smear
00:31:43.140 --> 00:31:47.799
my name into the whole world without an investigation,
00:31:48.119 --> 00:31:50.019
without an opportunity to prove that I didn't
00:31:50.019 --> 00:31:53.880
do it? And that's just how the system works.
00:31:55.509 --> 00:31:59.130
And that absolutely sickened me, you know, as
00:31:59.130 --> 00:32:02.450
the person, as the victim, you know, in this
00:32:02.450 --> 00:32:05.069
situation and the child is still a victim. But
00:32:05.069 --> 00:32:07.369
at the same time, when you when you go and target
00:32:07.369 --> 00:32:10.230
somebody and you go get the wrong guy, they become
00:32:10.230 --> 00:32:13.009
a victim. And like you said, there's consequences
00:32:13.009 --> 00:32:18.069
to that. And the next, you know, three to six
00:32:18.069 --> 00:32:23.829
years of my life were consequences to that. And.
00:32:24.539 --> 00:32:27.319
I remember my attorney advising me at that moment
00:32:27.319 --> 00:32:32.259
to go and turn myself in or they would come and
00:32:32.259 --> 00:32:38.859
handcuff me at practice or at school or at work
00:32:38.859 --> 00:32:44.579
because I was working at the time. And I told
00:32:44.579 --> 00:32:48.279
her, I said, I can't do it. I said, I can't go
00:32:48.279 --> 00:32:51.140
in there. Does that mean that I'm going to say
00:32:51.140 --> 00:32:52.640
to the world that I did it because I didn't do
00:32:52.640 --> 00:32:55.769
it? It doesn't mean that you did it, Greg. It's
00:32:55.769 --> 00:32:57.910
just showing that you're going to go in there
00:32:57.910 --> 00:33:00.769
and it's already done. They're going to come.
00:33:00.869 --> 00:33:03.029
The warrant's already issued. I didn't know anything
00:33:03.029 --> 00:33:05.930
about anything. I didn't know the judicial system.
00:33:06.130 --> 00:33:07.750
I didn't know the justice system, how it worked.
00:33:09.650 --> 00:33:11.950
And what's crazy, the funny thing is, is that
00:33:11.950 --> 00:33:13.990
whenever I was looking for an attorney after
00:33:13.990 --> 00:33:15.630
I was being accused before I went to Patricia
00:33:15.630 --> 00:33:18.210
Cummings, I didn't even know where to get to
00:33:18.210 --> 00:33:20.289
get an attorney. I didn't know where to find
00:33:20.289 --> 00:33:23.930
them. You know, I didn't live a life where. I
00:33:23.930 --> 00:33:28.890
needed an attorney. And so I turned myself in
00:33:28.890 --> 00:33:33.970
that terrible morning. And I spent 16 hours,
00:33:34.069 --> 00:33:37.950
man, in booking. 16 hours just sitting there.
00:33:38.470 --> 00:33:42.170
And I remember in booking, about eight hours
00:33:42.170 --> 00:33:44.230
in, I was sitting on the bench. I was watching
00:33:44.230 --> 00:33:49.930
TV, waiting for my family to be able to gather
00:33:49.930 --> 00:33:53.380
up the money that it would take. which was $5
00:33:53.380 --> 00:33:58.799
,000 cash to bond me out. It was a $50 ,000 bond.
00:34:00.019 --> 00:34:04.880
And I remember sitting in there waiting and waiting,
00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:06.960
and I called my mom like four times, and I just
00:34:06.960 --> 00:34:09.500
told her, get me out of here. Get me out of here.
00:34:09.699 --> 00:34:13.099
And about eight hours in, there's already news
00:34:13.099 --> 00:34:16.599
reports on TV about, you know, Leander High School,
00:34:16.760 --> 00:34:19.440
Central Texas football star getting arrested
00:34:19.440 --> 00:34:24.170
of aggravated sexual assault of a child. And,
00:34:24.170 --> 00:34:30.190
you know, I just I was looking at that and I
00:34:30.190 --> 00:34:33.230
just felt like and I was a huge laughingstock
00:34:33.230 --> 00:34:38.849
of the whole county that I was just being I couldn't
00:34:38.849 --> 00:34:40.869
help it. You know, I was in a helpless situation
00:34:40.869 --> 00:34:44.889
where sitting there and all these lies being
00:34:44.889 --> 00:34:47.989
made about me and this this this crap being thrown
00:34:47.989 --> 00:34:51.920
on my name and. And then now I'm expecting like,
00:34:51.940 --> 00:34:53.880
man, what's going to happen next with my scholarships?
00:34:53.960 --> 00:34:55.460
And I'm completely scared. I don't know what
00:34:55.460 --> 00:34:59.820
to expect next. And I was more so worried about
00:34:59.820 --> 00:35:03.320
that than all the other people around me looking
00:35:03.320 --> 00:35:05.900
at the same TV screen that I'm looking at. And
00:35:05.900 --> 00:35:07.699
they're looking at me like, holy crap, you're
00:35:07.699 --> 00:35:13.039
the guy that's on the TV. And then they put me
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:17.579
in a holding cell. um, by myself while the news
00:35:17.579 --> 00:35:19.059
was, was happening. I mean, they didn't even,
00:35:19.059 --> 00:35:21.420
they didn't even change the channel, you know,
00:35:21.460 --> 00:35:24.219
uh, the police officers didn't even change the
00:35:24.219 --> 00:35:30.840
channel. And so, um, 16 hours later, I got bonded
00:35:30.840 --> 00:35:35.119
out. And then it was, uh, after that, it was,
00:35:35.119 --> 00:35:42.119
uh, led to, um, man, me being expelled out of
00:35:42.119 --> 00:35:45.909
the school district for one. Uh, my scholarships
00:35:45.909 --> 00:35:48.510
being stripped from me. I was all over every
00:35:48.510 --> 00:35:52.469
major news network in central Texas as being
00:35:52.469 --> 00:35:58.670
painted a monster. Um, and, uh, life seemed like
00:35:58.670 --> 00:36:01.130
it was over. I felt like I was in a, I felt like
00:36:01.130 --> 00:36:03.530
I was in groundhog day, just reliving a nightmare
00:36:03.530 --> 00:36:10.110
every morning I woke up. And, um, I got to a,
00:36:10.110 --> 00:36:11.989
I got to a point, man, where I just didn't want
00:36:11.989 --> 00:36:15.599
to get out of bed anymore. I just, It was it
00:36:15.599 --> 00:36:17.519
was the toughest situation because I didn't know
00:36:17.519 --> 00:36:20.480
how to handle it, you know, and if it wasn't
00:36:20.480 --> 00:36:23.519
for specifically that time, if it wasn't for
00:36:23.519 --> 00:36:29.880
my now wife, Gabri, telling me she believes in
00:36:29.880 --> 00:36:32.019
me and we're going to fight and all these other
00:36:32.019 --> 00:36:35.460
people like my family gathering around me to
00:36:35.460 --> 00:36:38.039
support me, then I don't know if I would have
00:36:38.039 --> 00:36:40.460
been here today talking to you. I mean, honestly,
00:36:40.599 --> 00:36:47.960
it was so tough. And so. But when you thought
00:36:47.960 --> 00:36:51.159
that it couldn't get any worse, it did. You know,
00:36:51.179 --> 00:36:56.139
one month later, after being released, going
00:36:56.139 --> 00:37:00.380
to an alternative school, I was in juvie. They
00:37:00.380 --> 00:37:02.219
sent me to juvie. They kicked me out of the district.
00:37:03.539 --> 00:37:07.840
I had to wear a military uniform because I was
00:37:07.840 --> 00:37:10.480
in a military -based little boot camp thing.
00:37:13.860 --> 00:37:18.239
I, one month later, I remember getting a call
00:37:18.239 --> 00:37:22.760
from my attorney stating that there's another
00:37:22.760 --> 00:37:31.400
accusation about me. And, dude, I mean, now it
00:37:31.400 --> 00:37:33.780
felt like this was just a huge big misunderstanding
00:37:33.780 --> 00:37:36.940
or something's being made up or somebody's being
00:37:36.940 --> 00:37:39.619
coached or somebody's targeting me. There's somebody
00:37:39.619 --> 00:37:42.320
who really doesn't like me out there. Because
00:37:42.320 --> 00:37:46.599
I just couldn't understand it. And I said, well,
00:37:46.639 --> 00:37:49.659
what's going on now? And they're saying there's
00:37:49.659 --> 00:37:54.500
a separate kid saying that you did it. And I
00:37:54.500 --> 00:37:57.019
was like, but I didn't do it. I didn't do anything.
00:37:58.079 --> 00:38:04.159
And now she's telling me that I got now turn
00:38:04.159 --> 00:38:11.059
myself in again. And this was like the day before.
00:38:12.219 --> 00:38:15.460
Um, you know, I, I, I, uh, I was going to school
00:38:15.460 --> 00:38:17.699
and I was actually in school. I had a report
00:38:17.699 --> 00:38:21.900
to school and I was, you know, telling my family
00:38:21.900 --> 00:38:24.840
that I needed to, uh, the situation that I'm
00:38:24.840 --> 00:38:27.739
going through. And I actually got arrested in
00:38:27.739 --> 00:38:31.679
class, um, at the alternative school that I was
00:38:31.679 --> 00:38:37.619
at that came and handcuffed me in class, slapped
00:38:37.619 --> 00:38:43.230
handcuffs on me in front of everybody. And took
00:38:43.230 --> 00:38:46.789
me away to the Williamson County Jail for the
00:38:46.789 --> 00:38:51.070
second time. And went through everything that
00:38:51.070 --> 00:38:53.789
I went through the first time. I'm on the news
00:38:53.789 --> 00:38:59.650
again, 16 hours in booking. Had to pay more money
00:38:59.650 --> 00:39:06.469
now to get me out. And then after that, after
00:39:06.469 --> 00:39:09.730
I got out, I was demanding answers. I was so
00:39:09.730 --> 00:39:12.869
broken. I told my attorney, I remember telling
00:39:12.869 --> 00:39:14.329
my attorney, I said, we need to get down to the
00:39:14.329 --> 00:39:15.849
bottom of this and you need to go to work for
00:39:15.849 --> 00:39:18.650
me. Like you need to literally figure this out
00:39:18.650 --> 00:39:21.469
and you need to go prove to them that I didn't
00:39:21.469 --> 00:39:28.610
do it. And, you know, then it led to a one year
00:39:28.610 --> 00:39:33.469
waiting game of nothing, of literally nothing.
00:39:33.769 --> 00:39:36.349
Like there was no findings. There was no advancement
00:39:36.349 --> 00:39:39.670
in the case. I kept asking my attorney, Patricia
00:39:39.670 --> 00:39:44.250
Cummings, what's next? What's next? Has it been
00:39:44.250 --> 00:39:47.050
resolved yet? If they did get assaulted, did
00:39:47.050 --> 00:39:49.329
they get the right guy? Did they figure out that
00:39:49.329 --> 00:39:52.389
it was all being made up lie? What's going on?
00:39:52.429 --> 00:39:55.909
Give me answers. But there was no answers. There's
00:39:55.909 --> 00:40:05.469
nothing. And it came to a time where it's about.
00:40:06.119 --> 00:40:10.360
approaching the summer of 2014 and Patricia calls
00:40:10.360 --> 00:40:13.380
me and saying that I'm getting indicted by a
00:40:13.380 --> 00:40:17.380
Williamson County grand jury. And what it means
00:40:17.380 --> 00:40:20.000
to be indicted is that you're about to go to
00:40:20.000 --> 00:40:26.780
trial. The prosecution has persuaded these people
00:40:26.780 --> 00:40:33.780
to allow them to go to trial and potentially
00:40:33.780 --> 00:40:37.579
they're Their their goal is to convict you of
00:40:37.579 --> 00:40:46.440
this crime. And so I and I told Patricia, what's
00:40:46.440 --> 00:40:49.760
next? What are we doing next? Like, I don't want
00:40:49.760 --> 00:40:52.239
to go. I don't I don't need to go to trial. They
00:40:52.239 --> 00:40:55.000
need to continue to figure this out. They need
00:40:55.000 --> 00:40:59.619
to figure this out. Who did it? And of course,
00:40:59.619 --> 00:41:05.150
no answers. And. She ended up telling me we have
00:41:05.150 --> 00:41:09.309
to go to trial. And it just didn't seem real,
00:41:09.429 --> 00:41:13.309
man. Like, the nightmare got worse. The nightmare
00:41:13.309 --> 00:41:17.429
got worse. Now I'm actually, actually, the reality
00:41:17.429 --> 00:41:21.949
of me going to prison has now become real. And,
00:41:21.969 --> 00:41:26.090
well, I mean, what can I do? I mean, I already
00:41:26.090 --> 00:41:30.670
felt like my life was out of my control. It honestly
00:41:30.670 --> 00:41:33.079
did not feel like I was in America. It did not
00:41:33.079 --> 00:41:37.079
feel like I was in the land of the free, that
00:41:37.079 --> 00:41:39.019
I was not an American citizen. I literally felt
00:41:39.019 --> 00:41:41.300
like I was in a communist country. Like everything
00:41:41.300 --> 00:41:49.079
was out of my control. And it, dude, I mean,
00:41:49.119 --> 00:41:55.099
just a nightmare. And we ended up going to trial.
00:41:55.239 --> 00:41:59.239
Long story short, you know, ended up going to
00:41:59.239 --> 00:42:04.780
trial. The trial lasted like seven days. And
00:42:04.780 --> 00:42:07.639
before trial, this is a thing a lot of people
00:42:07.639 --> 00:42:10.760
talk about and ask about because it just shows
00:42:10.760 --> 00:42:15.300
you what type of circus act that Williamson County
00:42:15.300 --> 00:42:21.199
tried to pull in this situation. It shows you
00:42:21.199 --> 00:42:25.179
what type of justice system we have and we allow
00:42:25.179 --> 00:42:31.369
to have here in America that somebody who's being
00:42:31.369 --> 00:42:34.869
accused of super aggravated sexual assault of
00:42:34.869 --> 00:42:38.369
a child. So much so that the DA's office is so
00:42:38.369 --> 00:42:42.670
convinced that he did it that he's willing to
00:42:42.670 --> 00:42:45.110
sit him and his family down in a room, send his
00:42:45.110 --> 00:42:48.050
own attorney into a room with him before they
00:42:48.050 --> 00:42:52.989
go and get a grand jury and offer him a plea
00:42:52.989 --> 00:42:59.679
deal to five years probation and certain amount
00:42:59.679 --> 00:43:03.179
of fines, a certain amount of days in jail, a
00:43:03.179 --> 00:43:07.519
lifetime sex registration to a crime that is
00:43:07.519 --> 00:43:14.920
25 to 99 years every day, day for day, no parole.
00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:18.579
The most frowned upon crime in humanity. It's
00:43:18.579 --> 00:43:21.239
worse than murder in some cases. I mean, you
00:43:21.239 --> 00:43:23.079
last longer as a murderer in prison than you
00:43:23.079 --> 00:43:28.260
do a child molester. And so At that point, man,
00:43:28.320 --> 00:43:30.860
sitting there with my attorney, I was so angry
00:43:30.860 --> 00:43:34.079
that I wanted to go and tell them they can go
00:43:34.079 --> 00:43:36.760
and shove that five years up. You know where?
00:43:36.880 --> 00:43:40.579
I mean, that's stupid. You know, that's so disrespectful.
00:43:41.000 --> 00:43:44.659
I mean, you're trying to ruin my life and you
00:43:44.659 --> 00:43:46.079
say, hey, man, you can get out of it, though.
00:43:46.679 --> 00:43:49.480
Take this five years. We believe you did it.
00:43:50.340 --> 00:43:53.530
Now, if you really believe I did it. What kind
00:43:53.530 --> 00:43:56.130
of justice is that to a victim that you believe
00:43:56.130 --> 00:44:01.909
was sexually assaulted? Like I get it if you're
00:44:01.909 --> 00:44:05.409
stupid enough to go and and and if you're evil
00:44:05.409 --> 00:44:10.269
enough to go ruin my life Then I guess you know,
00:44:10.329 --> 00:44:12.630
you don't care enough to go and actually seek
00:44:12.630 --> 00:44:14.550
justice for victims that were actually sexually
00:44:14.550 --> 00:44:18.730
assaulted and that's the kind of America that
00:44:18.730 --> 00:44:26.679
we live in and Now, man, sitting there with my
00:44:26.679 --> 00:44:30.940
mom in that room the day before my trial, before
00:44:30.940 --> 00:44:37.139
my grand jury, I was sitting there and my attorney
00:44:37.139 --> 00:44:39.179
comes in and tells me what the DA wants to do.
00:44:39.940 --> 00:44:44.639
And of course, the crazy thing is that I was
00:44:44.639 --> 00:44:49.840
so scared. I was so scared to go to trial that.
00:44:50.429 --> 00:44:53.650
In a county that was targeting me, not only in
00:44:53.650 --> 00:44:58.550
a county that has a historical history of wrongfully
00:44:58.550 --> 00:45:01.650
convicting people, like the Michael Morton case
00:45:01.650 --> 00:45:05.889
and a few other cases, 98 % conviction rate.
00:45:06.090 --> 00:45:09.110
I mean, they're sending people to prison for
00:45:09.110 --> 00:45:13.650
marijuana charges in Williamson County. And so
00:45:13.650 --> 00:45:16.570
I remember looking at my mom. The crazy thing
00:45:16.570 --> 00:45:19.329
is that I was actually thinking about it. I was
00:45:19.329 --> 00:45:21.690
thinking about it. I was thinking about looking
00:45:21.690 --> 00:45:25.409
at my broken mother crying, you know, completely
00:45:25.409 --> 00:45:30.210
afraid, telling me, you know, I'm afraid that
00:45:30.210 --> 00:45:32.750
they're going to take you away, Greg. I'm afraid.
00:45:33.190 --> 00:45:37.909
And seeing her looking at me almost makes you
00:45:37.909 --> 00:45:41.090
want to do it, you know? Take the plea deal,
00:45:41.170 --> 00:45:43.730
you mean? Yeah, almost makes you want to take
00:45:43.730 --> 00:45:50.960
the plea deal. I remember calling Gabri. She's
00:45:50.960 --> 00:45:54.380
in L .A. at the time. Oh, not in L .A. She was
00:45:54.380 --> 00:45:56.900
actually doing something that didn't require
00:45:56.900 --> 00:46:01.719
going there, but being there. But and she out
00:46:01.719 --> 00:46:06.039
of nowhere, man, just became a fighter, more
00:46:06.039 --> 00:46:08.800
of a fighter than I was at the time. She she
00:46:08.800 --> 00:46:11.199
kind of kicked my butt into gear and she said,
00:46:11.300 --> 00:46:13.280
we're going to continue to fight for this. I
00:46:13.280 --> 00:46:18.179
know what you're feeling right now, but. You're
00:46:18.179 --> 00:46:20.760
gonna be free like you this is gonna get cleared
00:46:20.760 --> 00:46:26.659
up now she believed more than I did at the time
00:46:26.659 --> 00:46:29.400
because you know, she's such a strong person,
00:46:29.579 --> 00:46:33.139
but I End up saying no I end up saying I'm going
00:46:33.139 --> 00:46:37.159
to try out. I'm fighting for my life and I go
00:46:37.159 --> 00:46:42.820
to trial One week of just tough trial man Felt
00:46:42.820 --> 00:46:46.820
like a lot a lot of time was going good And the
00:46:46.820 --> 00:46:51.059
reason why I was going good is because there
00:46:51.059 --> 00:46:54.519
was nothing. There's absolutely nothing to tie
00:46:54.519 --> 00:46:57.599
me to this case. It was it was like it was what
00:46:57.599 --> 00:47:01.039
it was. It was a one week of just trying to paint
00:47:01.039 --> 00:47:07.760
a picture of, you know, every attempt to prove
00:47:07.760 --> 00:47:09.880
Greg didn't do this, but you didn't have the
00:47:09.880 --> 00:47:14.260
evidence. It was really just a big debate and.
00:47:14.969 --> 00:47:19.550
persuasive game a lot of hypothetical situations
00:47:19.550 --> 00:47:27.289
you know this and that and at the end of it man
00:47:27.289 --> 00:47:33.030
we we sat there and it was it was about the sixth
00:47:33.030 --> 00:47:38.449
day of the trial and the jury went off and oh
00:47:38.449 --> 00:47:40.789
the kind of you know so much stuff has happened
00:47:40.789 --> 00:47:43.289
it's hard for me to think back on no take your
00:47:43.289 --> 00:47:47.369
time But during the trial, one of the key things
00:47:47.369 --> 00:47:56.329
that really just stood out to a lot of people
00:47:56.329 --> 00:47:58.710
was, you know, I was saying earlier that I was
00:47:58.710 --> 00:48:02.590
accused of one kid and then a month later I was
00:48:02.590 --> 00:48:05.190
accused of another because another kid apparently
00:48:05.190 --> 00:48:08.369
gave an outcry. You know, another kid actually
00:48:08.369 --> 00:48:12.329
apparently came forward. And told his parents
00:48:12.329 --> 00:48:16.050
that I sexually assaulted him. But that wasn't
00:48:16.050 --> 00:48:18.829
the case. Actually, the kid never came forward
00:48:18.829 --> 00:48:20.769
and told his parents that I sexually assaulted
00:48:20.769 --> 00:48:26.929
him. What happened was that we found out in trial
00:48:26.929 --> 00:48:31.210
that the detective, after I was accused of the
00:48:31.210 --> 00:48:37.409
first kid and arrested, that same detective brought
00:48:37.409 --> 00:48:41.480
it upon himself to go and call. specific people
00:48:41.480 --> 00:48:46.920
in the daycare, specific parents, and tell them
00:48:46.920 --> 00:48:50.579
immediately that, you know, this guy has been
00:48:50.579 --> 00:48:52.420
sexually assaulting kids in a daycare and we
00:48:52.420 --> 00:48:54.239
want to make sure that your kid was not sexually
00:48:54.239 --> 00:49:01.500
assaulted. And he then brings this kid, this
00:49:01.500 --> 00:49:04.360
kid made no outcry to his parents, then brings
00:49:04.360 --> 00:49:08.539
this kid to the Children's Advocacy Center. which
00:49:08.539 --> 00:49:12.219
is a center, of course, where kids sit down and
00:49:12.219 --> 00:49:15.719
get interviewed by trained professionals to give
00:49:15.719 --> 00:49:19.400
outcries, forensic interviewers to give outcries
00:49:19.400 --> 00:49:21.579
and accounts for anything that has been done
00:49:21.579 --> 00:49:29.980
to them sexually, physically, emotionally. And
00:49:29.980 --> 00:49:33.460
the interviewer is interviewing that second kid,
00:49:33.539 --> 00:49:37.420
right? And the kid's saying nothing. You know,
00:49:37.420 --> 00:49:40.059
the kid is just acting normal, not giving an
00:49:40.059 --> 00:49:42.119
outcry, not saying anything happened to him.
00:49:44.139 --> 00:49:50.739
And then the detective in trial, we showed this,
00:49:50.880 --> 00:49:55.059
but the detective walks in, you know, with a
00:49:55.059 --> 00:49:58.519
gun on his hip. He's not even in a uniform and
00:49:58.519 --> 00:50:00.559
tells the forensic interviewer to get out of
00:50:00.559 --> 00:50:03.420
the room. He's going to take it from here. And
00:50:03.420 --> 00:50:06.719
he starts. interviewing and i say interviewing
00:50:06.719 --> 00:50:12.219
lightly he starts interrogating this kid um asking
00:50:12.219 --> 00:50:15.179
leading questions and telling him you're going
00:50:15.179 --> 00:50:17.280
to tell me what your mother said you're so so
00:50:17.280 --> 00:50:20.360
you know so i heard you know what did what did
00:50:20.360 --> 00:50:22.860
greg make you do you know did greg make you put
00:50:22.860 --> 00:50:25.860
lotion on his penis yes or no and this is a child
00:50:25.860 --> 00:50:29.570
that has no concept of being abused at all and
00:50:29.570 --> 00:50:32.269
now a police officer is introducing all these
00:50:32.269 --> 00:50:36.230
sexual images to a perfectly innocent child correct
00:50:36.230 --> 00:50:42.329
and sitting there the kid is saying no you know
00:50:42.329 --> 00:50:44.670
that's that's the crazy part is the kid is actually
00:50:44.670 --> 00:50:46.590
understanding what the police officer is saying
00:50:46.590 --> 00:50:53.570
and the kid is saying no no no and finally you
00:50:53.570 --> 00:50:57.730
know basic psychology would I mean you can see
00:50:57.730 --> 00:51:00.050
it if you have your own child, but if you know
00:51:00.050 --> 00:51:03.349
a Kid says no multiple times and it's not what
00:51:03.349 --> 00:51:05.530
you want to hear. He's noticing. It's not what
00:51:05.530 --> 00:51:07.670
you want to hear He's gonna eventually say the
00:51:07.670 --> 00:51:12.389
opposite which is yes to please you To get out
00:51:12.389 --> 00:51:15.449
of a stressful Uncomfortable situation and that's
00:51:15.449 --> 00:51:17.769
what happened in this video was the kid said
00:51:17.769 --> 00:51:20.030
okay knows not the correct answer. I should probably
00:51:20.030 --> 00:51:27.960
say yes and Said yes and It was a wrap. You know,
00:51:28.039 --> 00:51:30.519
the police officer said, all right, we're done
00:51:30.519 --> 00:51:34.460
here. And then this is the crazy. This is another
00:51:34.460 --> 00:51:37.139
crazy part that we found out post trial in innocence
00:51:37.139 --> 00:51:42.360
hearing. We'll get to later on. But he he then
00:51:42.360 --> 00:51:44.800
gathered that information, that second outcry.
00:51:46.380 --> 00:51:50.619
And goes to a judge that same day, goes to a
00:51:50.619 --> 00:51:52.840
judge. At the time, she was an assistant district
00:51:52.840 --> 00:51:56.619
attorney, but. She is now a judge, but goes over
00:51:56.619 --> 00:52:01.440
and asks for advice if this is enough to get
00:52:01.440 --> 00:52:06.219
a second arrest warrant for Greg Kelly. And she
00:52:06.219 --> 00:52:09.639
saw it and she said she advises him not to do
00:52:09.639 --> 00:52:13.960
it. This is incorrect. This is not good policing.
00:52:14.099 --> 00:52:18.619
This is not good investigation. This is not this
00:52:18.619 --> 00:52:21.840
is not right. And he ends up doing it anyways.
00:52:24.120 --> 00:52:29.619
So now going to the trial back in July of 2014,
00:52:30.019 --> 00:52:38.039
the second kid in trial gets on stand and all
00:52:38.039 --> 00:52:42.380
of the kids, both of the kids' interviews and
00:52:42.380 --> 00:52:45.199
testimonies were done by closed circuit television
00:52:45.199 --> 00:52:49.500
in a whole other courtroom. And we thought that
00:52:49.500 --> 00:52:52.760
was strange because that actually did not provide.
00:52:53.449 --> 00:52:56.050
a situation where the kids could actually properly
00:52:56.050 --> 00:52:58.690
identify me as the person who did this to them
00:52:58.690 --> 00:53:02.230
and that we come to realize is a key component
00:53:02.230 --> 00:53:05.530
and actually finding the right guy because that
00:53:05.530 --> 00:53:09.070
issue actually was brought up later on and became
00:53:09.070 --> 00:53:13.070
one of the the key staples to what went wrong
00:53:13.070 --> 00:53:15.989
in this case everything went wrong in this case
00:53:15.989 --> 00:53:19.670
yeah exactly everything went wrong but identification
00:53:21.289 --> 00:53:23.329
Out of all cases, this is probably one of the
00:53:23.329 --> 00:53:29.670
biggest ones because during description of the
00:53:29.670 --> 00:53:33.489
assailant is one thing. The description of the
00:53:33.489 --> 00:53:36.829
assailant is one thing, but one thing that the
00:53:36.829 --> 00:53:40.050
police officer did not do in this whole situation
00:53:40.050 --> 00:53:45.730
from initial outcry of the first child to trial.
00:53:46.400 --> 00:53:48.679
One thing he didn't do, and if you watch enough
00:53:48.679 --> 00:53:51.920
Law and Order and CSI, you can even figure out
00:53:51.920 --> 00:53:55.500
that what you do whenever a kid seems confused
00:53:55.500 --> 00:54:00.219
is you put pictures in front of him and you point
00:54:00.219 --> 00:54:02.840
and you say, hey, who did this to you? Who is
00:54:02.840 --> 00:54:06.980
Greg? Show me Greg. Who is Greg? Never did that.
00:54:07.039 --> 00:54:08.760
Because I could call myself Greg and go and rob
00:54:08.760 --> 00:54:13.420
a bank and say, oh, Greg did it. Yeah. And who
00:54:13.420 --> 00:54:19.960
is Greg? And so that never happened. They automatically
00:54:19.960 --> 00:54:24.179
assumed Greg was me when the description of Greg
00:54:24.179 --> 00:54:29.960
didn't fit me at all. The place that the kid
00:54:29.960 --> 00:54:32.320
was saying that this happened was not my room,
00:54:32.400 --> 00:54:35.099
was not the description of my room. It was Jonathan's
00:54:35.099 --> 00:54:38.619
room. And just for people, just to put this in
00:54:38.619 --> 00:54:40.340
right now, so for people listening that haven't
00:54:40.340 --> 00:54:42.119
seen Outcry, and as you mentioned, it's a very
00:54:42.119 --> 00:54:45.420
important thing, all the interviews, our video
00:54:45.420 --> 00:54:47.860
they're all there so this is not like third -hand
00:54:47.860 --> 00:54:50.159
information you as a viewer get to see each of
00:54:50.159 --> 00:54:51.900
these interrogations each of these interviews
00:54:51.900 --> 00:54:55.219
each of these outcries but jonathan mccarty and
00:54:55.219 --> 00:55:00.659
you at that time looked almost identical yeah
00:55:00.659 --> 00:55:05.800
yeah so to touch on that um jonathan and i i
00:55:05.800 --> 00:55:07.800
mean we were we were really good friends and
00:55:07.800 --> 00:55:09.760
he he was younger than me he was one year younger
00:55:09.760 --> 00:55:12.119
than me but a lot of people always thought that
00:55:12.119 --> 00:55:14.440
he was my little brother I mean, everybody's
00:55:14.440 --> 00:55:15.940
like, oh, is that your little brother? Man, y
00:55:15.940 --> 00:55:19.420
'all look alike, you know. And I mean, being
00:55:19.420 --> 00:55:21.659
his really good friend, I mean, it was pretty
00:55:21.659 --> 00:55:23.960
cool being kind of like his older brother, you
00:55:23.960 --> 00:55:27.199
know. And I'm the youngest. I didn't have a younger
00:55:27.199 --> 00:55:29.119
brother. So it was cool having that, you know.
00:55:29.760 --> 00:55:37.059
But yeah, I mean, now that, you know, it transcended
00:55:37.059 --> 00:55:39.880
into this, it was like, man, that's crazy that.
00:55:41.070 --> 00:55:43.230
I look back on it and a lot of people thought
00:55:43.230 --> 00:55:45.510
we were brothers because we look so much alike.
00:55:46.469 --> 00:55:49.710
And, you know, I didn't think much of it until,
00:55:49.789 --> 00:55:53.329
you know, I was accused. And the description
00:55:53.329 --> 00:55:57.809
of what the first child is saying is matching
00:55:57.809 --> 00:56:02.550
Jonathan. What he was wearing, his room, and
00:56:02.550 --> 00:56:06.750
his vocabulary, you know. You know, Jonathan
00:56:06.750 --> 00:56:09.409
used a certain word that the kid said that the
00:56:09.409 --> 00:56:13.340
assailant said. which was boss. And Jonathan
00:56:13.340 --> 00:56:18.000
would tell the kids that, you know, he was the
00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:24.719
boss in the house. And so kind of ending my trial,
00:56:24.900 --> 00:56:29.280
the second kid actually gets on stand and everything
00:56:29.280 --> 00:56:32.019
that he was forced to say in the interview at
00:56:32.019 --> 00:56:36.139
the Children's Advocacy Center, he actually recanted
00:56:36.139 --> 00:56:39.670
on stand and said nothing happened to him. Which
00:56:39.670 --> 00:56:42.570
I thought was incredible as well. I mean, firstly,
00:56:42.889 --> 00:56:48.030
the kid was swayed. But secondly, that child
00:56:48.030 --> 00:56:51.369
and obviously that family, you know, because
00:56:51.369 --> 00:56:53.150
at one point the parents must have been like,
00:56:53.210 --> 00:56:55.929
oh, maybe my kid was, you know, molested. But
00:56:55.929 --> 00:56:59.570
for that family unit to be like, no, this didn't
00:56:59.570 --> 00:57:01.889
happen. You know, we trust our child and we're
00:57:01.889 --> 00:57:03.369
not going to stand up there and falsely accuse
00:57:03.369 --> 00:57:05.909
someone of something that, as you said, was basically
00:57:05.909 --> 00:57:10.940
solicited. Yeah. No, I think I think it was it
00:57:10.940 --> 00:57:15.039
was very insightful for a lot of people. I mean,
00:57:15.039 --> 00:57:20.820
it it provided, you know, if I felt any any type
00:57:20.820 --> 00:57:25.860
of little type of justice and the the process
00:57:25.860 --> 00:57:29.579
I was going through in trial was I was so happy
00:57:29.579 --> 00:57:32.460
that the truth is coming out, you know, with
00:57:32.460 --> 00:57:37.260
the second kid recanting and. I give me a little
00:57:37.260 --> 00:57:41.079
bit of sigh of relief, but the first kid, he
00:57:41.079 --> 00:57:45.099
was so brainwashed and so coaching that I did
00:57:45.099 --> 00:57:48.480
this to him. Because you got to know that for
00:57:48.480 --> 00:57:51.079
a whole year leading up to a trial when the police
00:57:51.079 --> 00:57:52.579
officer should have been doing an investigation,
00:57:53.059 --> 00:57:55.880
record has actually proved that this kid was
00:57:55.880 --> 00:57:59.000
going through, going to a therapist every other
00:57:59.000 --> 00:58:04.880
day, reliving what happened to him by a therapist.
00:58:05.420 --> 00:58:07.340
A therapist asking him, hey, how's it going?
00:58:07.460 --> 00:58:09.980
How are you taking that stuff that happened with
00:58:09.980 --> 00:58:13.019
Greg? And just kind of putting that in his head
00:58:13.019 --> 00:58:18.179
every day up until the trial. And that's a brainwashing
00:58:18.179 --> 00:58:22.619
technique. That's a technique to make up something.
00:58:22.980 --> 00:58:25.619
I'm not saying that this accusation was made
00:58:25.619 --> 00:58:29.920
up, but it's a technique. to put something into
00:58:29.920 --> 00:58:32.579
this kid's head and make it stick because you
00:58:32.579 --> 00:58:36.519
know that this kid is at an age where, I mean,
00:58:36.599 --> 00:58:41.579
imagination is everything to him. And multiple
00:58:41.579 --> 00:58:45.119
psychologists, you know, it's a learning point
00:58:45.119 --> 00:58:50.260
for forensic psychology and, you know, child
00:58:50.260 --> 00:58:54.530
psychology that... If you're going to be a forensic
00:58:54.530 --> 00:58:56.929
interviewer, if you're going to be involved with
00:58:56.929 --> 00:59:00.610
child psychology, it is probably the most important
00:59:00.610 --> 00:59:04.289
psychology because you have the ability to either
00:59:04.289 --> 00:59:09.849
inspire a kid or completely ruin his life from
00:59:09.849 --> 00:59:13.610
here on out. Well, they had that one moment where
00:59:13.610 --> 00:59:15.190
they talked about one of the studies that was
00:59:15.190 --> 00:59:19.630
in the 70s or 80s. And they videoed a physician
00:59:19.630 --> 00:59:22.150
doing a pediatric wellness check, basically.
00:59:22.829 --> 00:59:25.730
And then they did a lot of that suggestive interviewing.
00:59:26.469 --> 00:59:28.829
So they asked the first time, you know, what
00:59:28.829 --> 00:59:30.349
happened? Did they touch you anywhere? No, no,
00:59:30.369 --> 00:59:31.809
no. They just measured my arm, took my blood
00:59:31.809 --> 00:59:33.849
pressure, listened to my heart. And then they
00:59:33.849 --> 00:59:35.909
did some suggestive interviewing. The kid went
00:59:35.909 --> 00:59:39.670
away, came back, did interviewing again. And
00:59:39.670 --> 00:59:42.480
this time... the story was completely warped.
00:59:42.480 --> 00:59:44.420
The Dutch, you know, the doctor touched my pee
00:59:44.420 --> 00:59:46.659
pee and all this kind of stuff. And it was fascinating,
00:59:46.840 --> 00:59:48.800
you know? So, and then, and then you look at
00:59:48.800 --> 00:59:51.099
some of the cases that they feature, you mentioned,
00:59:51.219 --> 00:59:54.539
where are we? Michael Morton, you know, and being
00:59:54.539 --> 00:59:56.360
accused of murdering his wife. And then there's
00:59:56.360 --> 01:00:00.239
that one famous daycare that was accused of satanic
01:00:00.239 --> 01:00:02.440
rituals. And that's, it ended up being the same
01:00:02.440 --> 01:00:05.320
thing. So as, as myself, you know, being very,
01:00:05.460 --> 01:00:09.400
very uneducated in that world, it was, it was,
01:00:09.789 --> 01:00:14.670
horrific to watch how an adult can manipulate
01:00:14.670 --> 01:00:17.150
the mind of a child and basically orchestrate
01:00:17.150 --> 01:00:21.489
a completely false um reality in that poor child's
01:00:21.489 --> 01:00:25.650
mind absolutely absolutely yeah and i think i
01:00:25.650 --> 01:00:27.670
think it was very insightful to a lot of people
01:00:27.670 --> 01:00:31.070
um and i was even in belief of this before this
01:00:31.070 --> 01:00:34.409
happened to me but um you know a lot of people
01:00:34.409 --> 01:00:39.699
if you know i'm not um naive to The comments
01:00:39.699 --> 01:00:42.179
and the Facebook posts and the social media of
01:00:42.179 --> 01:00:44.059
me being painted as a monster during this whole
01:00:44.059 --> 01:00:46.500
process. I mean, I saw it, you know, I saw me.
01:00:46.579 --> 01:00:49.300
I couldn't escape it. But a lot of a lot of a
01:00:49.300 --> 01:00:51.940
lot of things that people said that I saw that
01:00:51.940 --> 01:00:55.079
was repeating itself was four year olds don't
01:00:55.079 --> 01:00:57.940
lie. Four year olds can't lie. He's not just
01:00:57.940 --> 01:01:01.820
going to make this up. Greg did it. And I said,
01:01:01.880 --> 01:01:03.659
well, hold on a second. If you knew what I just
01:01:03.659 --> 01:01:08.480
learned, then you would understand that. A child
01:01:08.480 --> 01:01:11.159
is susceptible to being coached. A child is susceptible
01:01:11.159 --> 01:01:15.820
to believing these false realities. And he can
01:01:15.820 --> 01:01:19.519
be brainwashed to believe situations that didn't
01:01:19.519 --> 01:01:22.980
really play out the way it did. And that's exactly
01:01:22.980 --> 01:01:25.039
what happened here. And, you know, there's a
01:01:25.039 --> 01:01:28.039
lot of studies that, like I said, you know, you're
01:01:28.039 --> 01:01:30.059
fascinated by it. And it was very insightful
01:01:30.059 --> 01:01:33.199
to me because it gave me hope to continue to
01:01:33.199 --> 01:01:35.469
fight too. Well, just before we kind of move
01:01:35.469 --> 01:01:39.190
on, one thing I think that gets lost when they're
01:01:39.190 --> 01:01:40.969
like, you know, like you said, believe the child,
01:01:41.050 --> 01:01:45.409
believe the child, is I think, you know, everyone
01:01:45.409 --> 01:01:47.329
would agree that we believe that that poor child
01:01:47.329 --> 01:01:51.650
was abused, it seems like. But while you accuse
01:01:51.650 --> 01:01:55.909
and chase the wrong person, the person who did
01:01:55.909 --> 01:01:58.269
it is out there to continue their predatory race.
01:01:58.650 --> 01:02:02.139
So, if you get so focused on... oh, no, no, no,
01:02:02.139 --> 01:02:05.219
the child's completely right, then you're completely
01:02:05.219 --> 01:02:07.699
ignoring the fact that if you are wrong, which
01:02:07.699 --> 01:02:10.119
has happened in so many cases, and even, like
01:02:10.119 --> 01:02:11.639
I said, the Michael Morton where they found some
01:02:11.639 --> 01:02:14.639
guy that had killed other people too, that other
01:02:14.639 --> 01:02:17.480
person is free to kill, to rape, to abuse, to
01:02:17.480 --> 01:02:21.400
whatever it is. So that is a huge, huge, I think,
01:02:21.420 --> 01:02:24.099
you know, takeaway from this is that if you get
01:02:24.099 --> 01:02:27.059
too myopic in your investigation, you completely
01:02:27.059 --> 01:02:30.780
negate the possibility. of a repeat and obviously
01:02:30.780 --> 01:02:32.380
we'll get to that where that was exactly the
01:02:32.380 --> 01:02:36.420
case here too yeah absolutely you know that that's
01:02:36.420 --> 01:02:38.800
the thing that's that's tunnel vision 100 you
01:02:38.800 --> 01:02:40.840
know when you when you get tunnel vision and
01:02:40.840 --> 01:02:43.679
you want to fully focus and target one person
01:02:43.679 --> 01:02:47.159
that you have come to believe i don't know if
01:02:47.159 --> 01:02:48.699
he believed i did it or not i don't i don't know
01:02:48.699 --> 01:02:50.300
to this day if he believes i did it or not but
01:02:50.300 --> 01:02:53.199
i know one thing is that he completely targeted
01:02:53.199 --> 01:02:55.260
me to be the person and only person through his
01:02:55.260 --> 01:02:59.880
actions and his investigation to not and interview,
01:03:00.119 --> 01:03:04.320
investigate, or look for somebody else that was
01:03:04.320 --> 01:03:07.099
constantly and actually lived in that house at
01:03:07.099 --> 01:03:09.679
the time. I don't know if he knew that I moved
01:03:09.679 --> 01:03:12.380
out a month prior to me, to this accusation coming
01:03:12.380 --> 01:03:14.639
about. I didn't know if he knew that or not because,
01:03:14.719 --> 01:03:18.900
well, and what makes me believe that is we found
01:03:18.900 --> 01:03:21.039
out that he never actually went to the detective,
01:03:21.360 --> 01:03:23.460
Chris Daly, the Cedar Park Police Department,
01:03:23.539 --> 01:03:26.849
never actually went to the house. to do an investigation
01:03:26.849 --> 01:03:29.329
didn't take pictures didn't interview anybody
01:03:29.329 --> 01:03:32.849
living in that house didn't do the basic necessities
01:03:32.849 --> 01:03:35.909
that it takes to be a law enforcement officer
01:03:35.909 --> 01:03:39.190
to be a detective like i said i i don't know
01:03:39.190 --> 01:03:41.230
anything i didn't i didn't get a degree in criminal
01:03:41.230 --> 01:03:43.510
justice but i know enough to go to the freaking
01:03:43.510 --> 01:03:45.750
crime scene yeah well i mean i think that's a
01:03:45.750 --> 01:03:47.469
very important thing to stay on just for a moment
01:03:47.469 --> 01:03:51.590
so it was um because jonathan had brothers as
01:03:51.590 --> 01:03:53.920
well didn't they they had also been in trouble
01:03:53.920 --> 01:03:55.420
with the law. And I'm not saying any of them
01:03:55.420 --> 01:03:57.920
were responsible in any way, shape or form. Was
01:03:57.920 --> 01:04:01.179
his dad living in the house too? He was, yeah.
01:04:01.360 --> 01:04:04.059
Okay. So you've got multiple males, even if you've
01:04:04.059 --> 01:04:05.539
got the age description, whatever, you've got
01:04:05.539 --> 01:04:07.360
multiple males. It seemed like, you know, it
01:04:07.360 --> 01:04:11.139
was a firm he that did this and they didn't visit
01:04:11.139 --> 01:04:14.059
the residence. He didn't interview any of these
01:04:14.059 --> 01:04:17.059
other people. So, I mean, I'm a firefighter.
01:04:17.059 --> 01:04:19.619
I have no idea about the world of law enforcement
01:04:19.619 --> 01:04:21.460
other than the few kind of interactions that
01:04:21.460 --> 01:04:24.659
I have. But I think everyone can agree that the,
01:04:24.780 --> 01:04:27.300
you know, policing 101 is that you eliminate
01:04:27.300 --> 01:04:30.079
suspects by interviewing, by, you know, taking
01:04:30.079 --> 01:04:32.840
photos and descriptions. And, you know, if it
01:04:32.840 --> 01:04:35.719
was done next to a tree, then it probably wasn't
01:04:35.719 --> 01:04:37.599
in the house. You know what I mean? So you figure
01:04:37.599 --> 01:04:40.699
out the location too. The fact that they took
01:04:40.699 --> 01:04:45.239
this poor little boy's word for the name Greg
01:04:45.239 --> 01:04:48.420
without identifying faces, without eliminating
01:04:48.420 --> 01:04:51.769
other people in the house. And I think people,
01:04:51.769 --> 01:04:53.070
you know, all the way up through the judicial
01:04:53.070 --> 01:04:56.070
ladder said the same thing. The worst example
01:04:56.070 --> 01:04:59.989
of policing they'd ever seen. Absolutely. And
01:04:59.989 --> 01:05:04.969
you know, the crazy part is that the accusation
01:05:04.969 --> 01:05:07.590
was that Greg did this to me. It wasn't Greg
01:05:07.590 --> 01:05:11.550
Kelly. It wasn't Greg who's six foot one, tan
01:05:11.550 --> 01:05:15.050
skin, football player, that wears this clothes.
01:05:15.190 --> 01:05:19.130
No, it was Greg that did this to me. And he was
01:05:19.130 --> 01:05:21.570
wearing this, which was SpongeBob pajama pants.
01:05:21.730 --> 01:05:24.889
It was in this place, this room with the trophies.
01:05:25.349 --> 01:05:31.329
Right. And the descriptions of Greg actually
01:05:31.329 --> 01:05:35.530
matched Jonathan. So, like I said, detective
01:05:35.530 --> 01:05:37.710
one on one, if I didn't need to go to college
01:05:37.710 --> 01:05:40.869
to be a detective, but if the description is
01:05:40.869 --> 01:05:43.940
not matching the name. then I'm going to now
01:05:43.940 --> 01:05:45.940
look at all, like you said, all the possible
01:05:45.940 --> 01:05:50.460
suspects in the house to find who Greg is to
01:05:50.460 --> 01:05:55.119
this child. And so, and touch on a little bit
01:05:55.119 --> 01:05:59.039
of what you said earlier about, man, like the
01:05:59.039 --> 01:06:01.079
repercussions and the consequences that happen
01:06:01.079 --> 01:06:05.780
to not going and getting the right guy. I mean,
01:06:05.800 --> 01:06:10.360
if you watch Outcry, other people got raped.
01:06:10.960 --> 01:06:14.159
drugged and raped by this guy. I mean, it's a
01:06:14.159 --> 01:06:17.820
perfect storm. When you don't seek justice the
01:06:17.820 --> 01:06:20.699
first time, not only do you ruin somebody's life,
01:06:20.780 --> 01:06:25.320
but more people's life gets ruined. And it's
01:06:25.320 --> 01:06:27.719
all at the cost of getting that notch on your
01:06:27.719 --> 01:06:31.260
belt and sustaining the conviction rate of a
01:06:31.260 --> 01:06:35.539
98 % conviction rate in Williamson County. Yeah.
01:06:35.619 --> 01:06:38.699
That's why. Well, you had the second outcry was
01:06:38.699 --> 01:06:42.679
revoked. So I'm assuming then you got off scot
01:06:42.679 --> 01:06:44.199
-free and then you went on to live happily ever
01:06:44.199 --> 01:06:51.280
after. Not at all. Not at all. I wish, man. Actually,
01:06:51.360 --> 01:06:54.219
you know what? I don't know, man, because, you
01:06:54.219 --> 01:06:56.900
know, looking back at it, as crazy as it sounds,
01:06:57.840 --> 01:07:01.480
if you just think about it, just imagine it for
01:07:01.480 --> 01:07:05.900
a second. I went to trial, seven days. fought
01:07:05.900 --> 01:07:11.539
like hell, but would I be innocent? You know
01:07:11.539 --> 01:07:14.139
what I mean? Or would I be classified as OJ Simpson?
01:07:15.320 --> 01:07:18.920
That's something that I, uh, I think of every
01:07:18.920 --> 01:07:21.800
day is that I got accused of all this, but the
01:07:21.800 --> 01:07:25.880
DA and the police officers, man, painted, painted
01:07:25.880 --> 01:07:29.659
me to be a complete monster and persuade the
01:07:29.659 --> 01:07:36.199
court of public opinion to Put in doubt You know
01:07:36.199 --> 01:07:39.380
I mean to completely put this big -ass crap mark
01:07:39.380 --> 01:07:43.800
on my name and if I you know if I went to trial
01:07:43.800 --> 01:07:47.579
and got proven not guilty you still gotta also
01:07:47.579 --> 01:07:53.719
You know taking the fact that I wouldn't have
01:07:53.719 --> 01:07:56.900
been Innocent and I guess you could say I say
01:07:56.900 --> 01:07:59.480
those and I put that in quotations because in
01:07:59.480 --> 01:08:02.809
today's law an American law is that when you
01:08:02.809 --> 01:08:04.530
go to trial and you get not guilty, it's not
01:08:04.530 --> 01:08:07.130
the same thing as being innocent. I mean, I would
01:08:07.130 --> 01:08:09.429
have, I would have went off to college and who
01:08:09.429 --> 01:08:11.469
knows? I mean, every, you know, I would have
01:08:11.469 --> 01:08:13.829
been in, I would have ran into somebody that
01:08:13.829 --> 01:08:17.270
said, you know what? You're that guy that may
01:08:17.270 --> 01:08:21.949
or may not have done it, you know? But now I
01:08:21.949 --> 01:08:24.470
can declare to the world that I am actually innocent.
01:08:24.630 --> 01:08:27.810
And I had nine judges telling me that I was actually
01:08:27.810 --> 01:08:29.789
innocent. I fought like hell and proved that
01:08:29.789 --> 01:08:32.819
I didn't do this. And I've been exonerated. I've
01:08:32.819 --> 01:08:37.020
exonerated myself from these charges. My record
01:08:37.020 --> 01:08:41.260
has been cleared. And so looking back at it,
01:08:41.340 --> 01:08:45.819
I mean, it's crazy to say, do I wish that I was,
01:08:45.880 --> 01:08:50.020
you know, deemed not guilty at trial? I mean,
01:08:50.020 --> 01:08:52.079
I can't answer that, dude. I mean, I don't know
01:08:52.079 --> 01:08:56.119
what my life would have been if I walked away
01:08:56.119 --> 01:09:00.020
from that courtroom that day. It's a tough, tough.
01:09:00.560 --> 01:09:02.380
tough paradigm and a tough thing to think about.
01:09:02.460 --> 01:09:07.359
And so, um, I'm, I'm completely blessed now.
01:09:07.500 --> 01:09:10.060
I mean, I have a wonderful life, wonderful wife.
01:09:10.300 --> 01:09:13.720
Um, you know, I'm getting ahead of myself, but,
01:09:13.720 --> 01:09:16.619
uh, but I'm so excited about it, um, that I can't
01:09:16.619 --> 01:09:19.579
hold it in. But, uh, I, uh, no, man, I mean,
01:09:19.600 --> 01:09:24.960
I got convicted in July, 2007, 2014 of a super
01:09:24.960 --> 01:09:27.880
aggravated sexual assault of a child. And, um,
01:09:28.579 --> 01:09:31.699
Now, what happened after the trial going into
01:09:31.699 --> 01:09:36.560
the sentencing phase is something that a lot
01:09:36.560 --> 01:09:40.359
of people need to know because it, again, paints
01:09:40.359 --> 01:09:43.939
an image of our judicial system and how it works.
01:09:45.260 --> 01:09:47.779
A lot of people don't know this because it's
01:09:47.779 --> 01:09:53.340
not sexy for Hollywood to put this into law and
01:09:53.340 --> 01:09:57.279
order or CSI. When you go into a sentencing phase,
01:09:57.500 --> 01:10:01.880
after you're deemed guilty, I mean, your hand
01:10:01.880 --> 01:10:04.720
tied behind your back, you're handcuffed. I mean,
01:10:04.720 --> 01:10:06.340
you're going to prison no matter what. Something's
01:10:06.340 --> 01:10:07.600
happening. You're getting sentenced to something.
01:10:09.260 --> 01:10:12.840
I just got wrongfully convicted. And I had to
01:10:12.840 --> 01:10:14.840
spend a night in jail. And the very next day,
01:10:14.960 --> 01:10:20.159
I get put into a room with my family before the
01:10:20.159 --> 01:10:23.060
sentencing phase. I have to walk right back out
01:10:23.060 --> 01:10:26.119
to everybody who just witnessed. me getting convicted
01:10:26.119 --> 01:10:32.439
and sit there and figure out the fate of the
01:10:32.439 --> 01:10:37.020
rest of my life. And I'm sitting in that room,
01:10:37.140 --> 01:10:40.819
this little separate room with my family before
01:10:40.819 --> 01:10:44.819
I get pulled out to the sentencing hearing. And
01:10:44.819 --> 01:10:51.579
my attorney walks in and she tells me that the
01:10:51.579 --> 01:10:52.960
judge, before we go out there, I want to tell
01:10:52.960 --> 01:10:56.270
you something. But the judge and the DA has come
01:10:56.270 --> 01:11:01.550
to an agreement that if you accept the minimum
01:11:01.550 --> 01:11:06.930
of 25 years without parole, then and you have
01:11:06.930 --> 01:11:09.170
to waive your right to appeal this trial. That's
01:11:09.170 --> 01:11:11.369
the catch. You got to waive your right to appeal
01:11:11.369 --> 01:11:14.829
this trial. Then you will get the minimum of
01:11:14.829 --> 01:11:19.729
25 years. Yeah. And then she specifically says
01:11:19.729 --> 01:11:21.409
this is how she said it word for word. I'll never
01:11:21.409 --> 01:11:27.199
forget this. She told me, or Greg, you can go
01:11:27.199 --> 01:11:29.760
out to the same jury that convicted you and get
01:11:29.760 --> 01:11:34.460
anywhere between 25 to 99. Now, talk about a
01:11:34.460 --> 01:11:37.760
play on words, dude. Talk about a play on words.
01:11:37.920 --> 01:11:41.619
I mean, get put in that situation and be told
01:11:41.619 --> 01:11:43.779
that. You know what I mean? Same jury that just
01:11:43.779 --> 01:11:46.520
convicted you. And they can give you any number
01:11:46.520 --> 01:11:51.159
between 25 to 99 without parole. I mean, just
01:11:51.159 --> 01:11:54.609
jury. And this is the prosecutor. I'm sorry,
01:11:54.670 --> 01:11:57.970
just to say, so this is your lawyer who also
01:11:57.970 --> 01:12:02.270
hadn't asked why no one had mentioned the fact
01:12:02.270 --> 01:12:04.189
that you guys looked together, who also hadn't
01:12:04.189 --> 01:12:06.869
asked why it wasn't the house investigated. I
01:12:06.869 --> 01:12:10.149
mean, all these areas. So after the fact, we
01:12:10.149 --> 01:12:15.850
realized that she, as a defense lawyer, had dropped
01:12:15.850 --> 01:12:18.250
the ball in so many areas as well. And again,
01:12:18.310 --> 01:12:20.880
appeared to just... one of the closest case and
01:12:20.880 --> 01:12:24.039
move on with her life yeah it got to that point
01:12:24.039 --> 01:12:28.899
for her um after fifty thousand dollars that
01:12:28.899 --> 01:12:32.560
we paid her you know sold my house i mean my
01:12:32.560 --> 01:12:35.079
mom sold the house that i grew up in to pay for
01:12:35.079 --> 01:12:40.960
her 20 something years of memories you know gone
01:12:40.960 --> 01:12:43.520
to fight for my life and pay this for this woman
01:12:43.520 --> 01:12:47.119
to fight for my life gone and she just wants
01:12:47.119 --> 01:12:54.539
to close it up and move on And, yeah, man, she
01:12:54.539 --> 01:12:59.619
told me that. And I, again, caught in a situation,
01:12:59.800 --> 01:13:02.319
caught in this decision that I don't want to
01:13:02.319 --> 01:13:05.579
make anymore. You know, I specifically remember
01:13:05.579 --> 01:13:07.399
telling my family that I don't want to make decisions
01:13:07.399 --> 01:13:10.159
anymore. You decide for me. Because apparently
01:13:10.159 --> 01:13:12.600
I'm not making the right ones anymore. You know,
01:13:12.600 --> 01:13:14.319
like, crap, I'm at this situation where I just
01:13:14.319 --> 01:13:19.010
feel like everything's out of my control. And
01:13:19.010 --> 01:13:24.689
I'm scared to make the next decision. And I tell
01:13:24.689 --> 01:13:26.770
my brother, I said, man, choose for me. I said,
01:13:26.810 --> 01:13:31.630
you know, get out at 44 years old or spend the
01:13:31.630 --> 01:13:38.970
rest of my life and die in prison. And the crazy
01:13:38.970 --> 01:13:42.409
part is Patricia nonchalantly said, we don't
01:13:42.409 --> 01:13:46.289
have much time to decide this. Yeah, like five
01:13:46.289 --> 01:13:48.539
minutes. Five minutes. Because she's got to get
01:13:48.539 --> 01:13:54.800
to Starbucks. Yeah, five minutes, man. And, man,
01:13:54.800 --> 01:14:00.619
we ended up deciding that I would, for the sake
01:14:00.619 --> 01:14:02.600
of me getting out and seeing my family again
01:14:02.600 --> 01:14:08.260
and tasting freedom in this lifetime, I would
01:14:08.260 --> 01:14:12.180
get out at 44. For a crime you didn't commit.
01:14:12.960 --> 01:14:16.180
For a crime I didn't commit. Talk about just.
01:14:17.410 --> 01:14:20.770
living a nightmare. I mean, just imagine being
01:14:20.770 --> 01:14:23.289
in a nightmare like that, man. And you can't
01:14:23.289 --> 01:14:26.050
wake up. You can't wake up. It's, it's real.
01:14:26.229 --> 01:14:32.529
And so, um, I, uh, I go out there and, and I
01:14:32.529 --> 01:14:34.789
get, I get sentenced to 25 years. I got a sign
01:14:34.789 --> 01:14:39.329
of paper and I waved to my family goodbye. And
01:14:39.329 --> 01:14:42.029
I just, I blow a kiss cause I thank them so much.
01:14:44.090 --> 01:14:47.000
Sorry, man. I'm getting emotional. I just think
01:14:47.000 --> 01:14:50.460
of so much. Man, I've probably told this story
01:14:50.460 --> 01:14:59.520
a thousand times. But I think of so much. I get
01:14:59.520 --> 01:15:08.520
sent off to prison for 25 years. Yeah. Well,
01:15:08.539 --> 01:15:11.140
don't apologize for getting emotional, man. I
01:15:11.140 --> 01:15:13.279
say I can't imagine. Like I told you, I had that
01:15:13.279 --> 01:15:16.680
microcosm of my 12 -year -old child being locked
01:15:16.680 --> 01:15:18.699
away in a room where they took his shoelaces
01:15:18.699 --> 01:15:25.600
and completely at the cause of horrendous policing.
01:15:25.760 --> 01:15:28.739
So I have that minute kind of version of it.
01:15:29.239 --> 01:15:32.960
What I really want to ask, and it wasn't something
01:15:32.960 --> 01:15:36.180
that was really expanded on in the documentary,
01:15:36.260 --> 01:15:41.569
is anyone who kind of knows... street level the
01:15:41.569 --> 01:15:44.470
worst thing you could possibly be in prison is
01:15:44.470 --> 01:15:48.289
probably a law enforcement officer and or a pedophile
01:15:48.289 --> 01:15:53.329
accused pedophile so you're there now you go
01:15:53.329 --> 01:15:56.869
into prison innocent of your crime but you're
01:15:56.869 --> 01:15:59.229
not going there as an armed robber or someone
01:15:59.229 --> 01:16:01.810
who beat up a cop or anything that might be admired
01:16:01.810 --> 01:16:06.130
in prison you're going in as a sex offender so
01:16:06.970 --> 01:16:09.289
what what was that like i don't mean like oh
01:16:09.289 --> 01:16:10.729
that must be really hard i mean like you know
01:16:10.729 --> 01:16:15.390
seriously how how hard was it to to a stay alive
01:16:15.390 --> 01:16:20.390
and b not then create a situation where you're
01:16:20.390 --> 01:16:22.550
accused of something that actually would be a
01:16:22.550 --> 01:16:26.869
crime and now complicates the whole issue yeah
01:16:26.869 --> 01:16:32.270
man um you know going into prison like i said
01:16:32.270 --> 01:16:35.609
i said this before um in different interviews
01:16:35.609 --> 01:16:40.619
but Dude, it's going into prison as a child molester.
01:16:40.840 --> 01:16:44.199
You don't last years. The life expectancy is
01:16:44.199 --> 01:16:48.239
not years. It's days. They don't want you there.
01:16:48.319 --> 01:16:50.579
You're the scum of the earth. You don't deserve
01:16:50.579 --> 01:16:54.479
to take another breath. And I think all of us
01:16:54.479 --> 01:16:57.560
who care about children and love children and
01:16:57.560 --> 01:17:01.960
maybe have a child, deep down on some level,
01:17:02.039 --> 01:17:11.039
we agree, right? but being Painted as that man
01:17:11.039 --> 01:17:15.899
when you're not and You just want to go play
01:17:15.899 --> 01:17:19.079
football and have a girlfriend and go to college
01:17:19.079 --> 01:17:23.359
And just go live a normal life Being painted
01:17:23.359 --> 01:17:26.500
that going into an environment, which is a world
01:17:26.500 --> 01:17:30.199
inside of a world prison is not What we think
01:17:30.199 --> 01:17:33.319
it is, you know, I mean on some halfway level.
01:17:33.399 --> 01:17:38.439
It's what you see on movies but Prison in itself
01:17:38.439 --> 01:17:43.720
is a tricky place man to be as a child molester
01:17:43.720 --> 01:17:47.180
because Every day you gotta you gotta watch your
01:17:47.180 --> 01:17:49.300
back You gotta see what you do when you guys
01:17:49.300 --> 01:17:51.020
see where you go and you guys see what you say
01:17:51.020 --> 01:17:56.380
and How you conduct yourself will determine ultimately
01:17:56.380 --> 01:18:01.460
your fate in prison and what I mean by that is
01:18:02.890 --> 01:18:07.069
I had to become the most adherent to my surroundings
01:18:07.069 --> 01:18:11.670
as possible to make it through that place. I
01:18:11.670 --> 01:18:14.670
had to figure out who not to become friends with,
01:18:14.789 --> 01:18:20.449
who not to talk to, where to go, what to do.
01:18:21.970 --> 01:18:26.970
Did I run into challenges? I did. Did I have
01:18:26.970 --> 01:18:32.489
to defend myself? I did. Absolutely blessed not
01:18:32.489 --> 01:18:38.149
to be killed and stabbed and scarred. You know,
01:18:38.149 --> 01:18:43.989
I'm maimed for life. I'm blessed because I've
01:18:43.989 --> 01:18:47.250
witnessed so much of that, you know, in there.
01:18:47.569 --> 01:18:51.029
I've witnessed people's life being taken from
01:18:51.029 --> 01:18:54.270
them because of what they've done. And that could
01:18:54.270 --> 01:18:58.550
have been me, you know. But for some reason,
01:18:58.590 --> 01:19:00.930
man, there was a hedge of protection over me.
01:19:01.449 --> 01:19:04.170
Where that didn't happen to me. You know, and
01:19:04.170 --> 01:19:05.810
that's where that's where my faith comes in.
01:19:05.890 --> 01:19:07.350
You know, that's where I believe that there was
01:19:07.350 --> 01:19:11.909
a higher power looking over me, man. And. You
01:19:11.909 --> 01:19:17.029
know. I mean, how do you equip an 18 year old
01:19:17.029 --> 01:19:21.189
man to go into that environment? You know, how
01:19:21.189 --> 01:19:26.149
do you how do you do that? And. I am absolutely
01:19:26.149 --> 01:19:29.430
blessed and lucky that I was able to get through
01:19:29.430 --> 01:19:33.739
that because. 99 of people don't if that's either
01:19:33.739 --> 01:19:38.920
being killed um committing suicide a lot of that
01:19:38.920 --> 01:19:44.960
too or finally getting released but you're really
01:19:44.960 --> 01:19:47.979
not free you know what i mean like that place
01:19:47.979 --> 01:19:54.199
has messed you up so much emotionally um mentally
01:19:54.199 --> 01:19:59.000
where you're now back in freedom but you know
01:19:59.000 --> 01:20:04.189
it's just You're too scarred. And for three years,
01:20:04.329 --> 01:20:10.529
I had to fight the mental warfare that was going
01:20:10.529 --> 01:20:13.689
on in my head, the physical warfare, the spiritual
01:20:13.689 --> 01:20:16.770
warfare. And each and every day, I had to get
01:20:16.770 --> 01:20:20.850
up out of bed. And this is where the next thing
01:20:20.850 --> 01:20:22.689
I'm going to say is something that I had to do
01:20:22.689 --> 01:20:25.210
each and every day. I had to make the choice
01:20:25.210 --> 01:20:29.210
to keep living. You know what I mean? Because
01:20:29.210 --> 01:20:31.569
I could have easily just started existing. I
01:20:31.569 --> 01:20:33.090
could have easily just started going through
01:20:33.090 --> 01:20:36.289
the motions and just, you know what I mean, existed
01:20:36.289 --> 01:20:41.470
until my demise, until I died, you know. But
01:20:41.470 --> 01:20:44.149
I chose every day to continue to better myself
01:20:44.149 --> 01:20:47.390
and put myself into situations where I could
01:20:47.390 --> 01:20:50.310
be the most successful in the circumstances that
01:20:50.310 --> 01:20:53.750
I was going through. I put myself through college
01:20:53.750 --> 01:20:58.979
and prison. I put myself on a unit. That gave
01:20:58.979 --> 01:21:02.800
you the opportunities to go to college I put
01:21:02.800 --> 01:21:05.399
myself on a unit where I could work and learn
01:21:05.399 --> 01:21:08.739
trades Which the trades I learned in prison I
01:21:08.739 --> 01:21:11.859
created a business with out in the world Yeah,
01:21:11.880 --> 01:21:13.979
I mean I put myself through those and I made
01:21:13.979 --> 01:21:17.420
a decision to continue to live life You know
01:21:17.420 --> 01:21:21.319
and not give up and I had a support group. I
01:21:21.319 --> 01:21:24.939
had a family I had perfect strangers write me
01:21:24.939 --> 01:21:31.550
every day reminding me of who I am, what's going
01:21:31.550 --> 01:21:34.630
to happen, and that I'm eventually going to be
01:21:34.630 --> 01:21:40.909
free. And that's what drove me, man. I mean,
01:21:40.930 --> 01:21:44.409
that's what kept me alive. The love of my wife
01:21:44.409 --> 01:21:47.590
kept me alive. It kept my heart beating. You
01:21:47.590 --> 01:21:49.890
know what I mean? My heart could have died, man.
01:21:49.930 --> 01:21:55.170
I could have became a person, a totally different
01:21:55.170 --> 01:21:59.560
person that I came in. You know? That place has
01:21:59.560 --> 01:22:02.739
so much hate that it could have made you into
01:22:02.739 --> 01:22:05.739
a person that you don't want to be around anymore.
01:22:06.520 --> 01:22:10.420
A person that makes a bunch of excuses. A person
01:22:10.420 --> 01:22:14.239
that is racist. I mean, there's so much racism
01:22:14.239 --> 01:22:18.100
in prison. I mean, color is everything in prison.
01:22:18.500 --> 01:22:21.420
And when you live in a world where color is everything,
01:22:21.680 --> 01:22:24.520
there's going to be a lot of dysfunction. And
01:22:24.520 --> 01:22:28.199
that's how it is in there. Your color determines
01:22:28.199 --> 01:22:32.100
your respect. And I thank God that I separated
01:22:32.100 --> 01:22:38.779
myself from that dogma. And I continue to fill
01:22:38.779 --> 01:22:41.260
myself up with things that are going to make
01:22:41.260 --> 01:22:46.279
me successful. And, you know, going into the
01:22:46.279 --> 01:22:52.979
prison system at 18 years old, I, man, I just.
01:22:53.659 --> 01:22:56.439
Just think back on it, man. There's a lot of
01:22:56.439 --> 01:22:58.399
situations where I will remember for the rest
01:22:58.399 --> 01:23:01.060
of my life that have shaped me into the person
01:23:01.060 --> 01:23:04.279
that I am today. Faith -wise, strength -wise,
01:23:04.460 --> 01:23:10.420
appreciating freedom, going without for so long
01:23:10.420 --> 01:23:12.479
that now that I have it, it's just like, man,
01:23:12.600 --> 01:23:14.539
dude, it's awesome to have it. Hopping in my
01:23:14.539 --> 01:23:17.140
truck and going to a park and walking my dog.
01:23:17.520 --> 01:23:19.760
Those are things that you daydream about in prison.
01:23:20.220 --> 01:23:23.039
You know what I mean? Being able to... have dinner
01:23:23.039 --> 01:23:25.739
with my mom and sit down at a table and have
01:23:25.739 --> 01:23:27.920
dinner with my family those are things that you
01:23:27.920 --> 01:23:30.140
daydream about in prison and those are situations
01:23:30.140 --> 01:23:34.220
that i will never take for granted for the rest
01:23:34.220 --> 01:23:39.819
of my life and so that uh that's that's where
01:23:39.819 --> 01:23:42.239
i'm at on it man i mean for three years three
01:23:42.239 --> 01:23:48.439
years it uh it was a nightmare and um yeah man
01:23:48.439 --> 01:23:51.850
a lot of fighting a lot of fighting I mean, if
01:23:51.850 --> 01:23:53.529
you watch the documentary, there was a lot of
01:23:53.529 --> 01:23:56.489
stuff that we had to jump and hurdles we had
01:23:56.489 --> 01:24:01.770
to jump and overcome. Yeah, man. Yeah, well,
01:24:01.869 --> 01:24:03.710
thank you for that perspective. I mean, it must
01:24:03.710 --> 01:24:07.689
have been horrendous. And I've had people from
01:24:07.689 --> 01:24:10.609
corrections facilities in the US. I've had people
01:24:10.609 --> 01:24:12.630
from Norway. And I'm always kind of curious on
01:24:12.630 --> 01:24:16.229
how we can do every element of life better. Not
01:24:16.229 --> 01:24:18.949
throwing shit at the way people do it now, but
01:24:18.949 --> 01:24:21.800
it's like... There are places all over the planet
01:24:21.800 --> 01:24:23.720
that do things really well. Norway's prisons
01:24:23.720 --> 01:24:26.659
are actually excellent for rehabilitation, and
01:24:26.659 --> 01:24:30.420
their reoffender rate is extremely low. And you
01:24:30.420 --> 01:24:33.579
hear about the predatory, the racial element,
01:24:33.720 --> 01:24:36.739
the drugs within the prison, the fact that you're
01:24:36.739 --> 01:24:39.899
locked in a box, which is not exactly good for
01:24:39.899 --> 01:24:42.300
the human spirit. And I think last year, this
01:24:42.300 --> 01:24:44.800
planet has had a little taste of, you know...
01:24:46.310 --> 01:24:49.149
an insight into what it must be like in prison
01:24:49.149 --> 01:24:51.229
and they all hated it so there we go clearly
01:24:51.229 --> 01:24:54.090
it's not a very rehabilitative you know experience
01:24:54.090 --> 01:24:57.170
um one thing when you were talking to kate and
01:24:57.170 --> 01:24:58.810
i want to say thank you to kate casey for connecting
01:24:58.810 --> 01:25:00.630
us as well i listened to your interview with
01:25:00.630 --> 01:25:05.470
her um you had the gentleman jake bryden kind
01:25:05.470 --> 01:25:09.149
of pop up out of nowhere and be one of the voices
01:25:09.149 --> 01:25:13.090
to petition for your innocence now what was interesting
01:25:13.090 --> 01:25:17.970
to me is that when Kate asked how Jake came into
01:25:17.970 --> 01:25:20.390
your life. It involved Kay Bree's father. So
01:25:20.390 --> 01:25:22.369
I think that's a very important story to tell
01:25:22.369 --> 01:25:26.189
that how you can be a mentor figure and a respected
01:25:26.189 --> 01:25:30.670
member of society, not from affluence or political
01:25:30.670 --> 01:25:34.829
stature, but as a human being to the point where
01:25:34.829 --> 01:25:38.289
that can invoke trust on other people. So kind
01:25:38.289 --> 01:25:39.850
of tell me about that story if you wouldn't mind.
01:25:40.550 --> 01:25:45.090
Yeah. So. Jake Bryden, I had no idea who he was.
01:25:45.250 --> 01:25:48.350
You know, Jake became a very influential and
01:25:48.350 --> 01:25:51.470
essential voice in my story for fighting for
01:25:51.470 --> 01:25:55.829
my life. He came up out of nowhere like three,
01:25:55.909 --> 01:25:58.850
three days after I was convicted. You know, right
01:25:58.850 --> 01:26:02.250
after I was convicted, he was just a normal guy
01:26:02.250 --> 01:26:06.869
who owned a business here in central Texas area.
01:26:07.550 --> 01:26:11.090
And he was just at home and just watching the
01:26:11.090 --> 01:26:14.949
news. He had heard about the Greg Kelly case
01:26:14.949 --> 01:26:17.770
and the things that were going on in it and how
01:26:17.770 --> 01:26:21.630
it was transpiring and stuff like that. So he
01:26:21.630 --> 01:26:25.890
he saw like that dreadful day of me being convicted
01:26:25.890 --> 01:26:27.930
and it was all over his blast all over the news.
01:26:28.329 --> 01:26:30.989
But when I was being convicted, he also saw his
01:26:30.989 --> 01:26:36.250
old leadership coach on the news standing next
01:26:36.250 --> 01:26:40.189
to Greg Kelly supporting him, you know. And Jake
01:26:40.189 --> 01:26:43.470
was so influenced by David Anderson, who is now
01:26:43.470 --> 01:26:46.569
my father -in -law. But he was so influenced
01:26:46.569 --> 01:26:49.510
by him and so impacted by him growing up through
01:26:49.510 --> 01:26:52.050
high school that Dave is the type of guy that
01:26:52.050 --> 01:26:55.909
will imprint on people and people will remember
01:26:55.909 --> 01:27:04.090
him for the rest of their life. And so Jake immediately
01:27:04.090 --> 01:27:09.460
called David and said, hey. um, what's going
01:27:09.460 --> 01:27:11.159
on with this Greg Kelly thing. I saw that, you
01:27:11.159 --> 01:27:13.180
know, you're, you're supporting him and, and,
01:27:13.260 --> 01:27:16.000
you know, he's dating your daughter. And, uh,
01:27:16.180 --> 01:27:18.039
you know, I can't remember word for word, the
01:27:18.039 --> 01:27:20.680
conversation that they had, but it, it was something
01:27:20.680 --> 01:27:23.819
along the line as, um, David, you know, does
01:27:23.819 --> 01:27:26.159
support, does support me. And he believes in
01:27:26.159 --> 01:27:28.399
me. And he told Jake that Greg didn't do it.
01:27:28.439 --> 01:27:31.140
And he's, he's being targeted. And there was
01:27:31.140 --> 01:27:33.939
a big mishandling of justice that happened here,
01:27:34.000 --> 01:27:39.409
Jake. And, you know, and Jake, then was put in
01:27:39.409 --> 01:27:41.810
a situation where it was like, okay, this guy
01:27:41.810 --> 01:27:46.489
that I respect so much is standing up for this
01:27:46.489 --> 01:27:49.270
guy who was being painted as a monster. Something
01:27:49.270 --> 01:27:51.250
just doesn't seem right. You know, why would
01:27:51.250 --> 01:27:55.189
somebody do that? And so, um, Jake went in and
01:27:55.189 --> 01:27:57.569
did his own investigation and did his own searching
01:27:57.569 --> 01:28:02.250
and researching and, um, ended up calling, you
01:28:02.250 --> 01:28:04.930
know, David back and was like, Hey, I'm going
01:28:04.930 --> 01:28:07.260
to fight for Greg too. You know, something's
01:28:07.260 --> 01:28:09.380
in my soul that needs to fight for Greg. Just
01:28:09.380 --> 01:28:12.479
learning about the case and what Greg went through,
01:28:12.640 --> 01:28:16.979
I got to fight for him too. And Jake then calls
01:28:16.979 --> 01:28:19.960
my mom, my broken mother. You know what I mean?
01:28:20.000 --> 01:28:22.439
Just witnessed her son get torn away from her.
01:28:23.260 --> 01:28:27.699
My mom's crying, dude, at home. And Jake calls
01:28:27.699 --> 01:28:32.300
my mom. And actually, Jake doesn't call my mom.
01:28:32.359 --> 01:28:38.430
He calls my brother Doug. And Doug runs into
01:28:38.430 --> 01:28:41.310
my mom's room and said, hey, mom, this guy named
01:28:41.310 --> 01:28:43.189
Jake Bryden's on the phone. He wants to help
01:28:43.189 --> 01:28:51.189
Greg. Like he wants to help Greg. And we, my
01:28:51.189 --> 01:28:53.970
mom just couldn't believe it because that whole,
01:28:54.090 --> 01:28:56.109
for three days straight, she was fasting and
01:28:56.109 --> 01:28:58.970
praying for a miracle, you know, for an angel
01:28:58.970 --> 01:29:04.289
to come and save my life. um that answered her
01:29:04.289 --> 01:29:09.090
prayer man i mean you know jake then that same
01:29:09.090 --> 01:29:12.949
day or the next day goes to radio shack grabs
01:29:12.949 --> 01:29:15.970
a megaphone pulls down his tailgate in the middle
01:29:15.970 --> 01:29:17.989
of the high school parking lot and gets a rally
01:29:17.989 --> 01:29:22.390
going you know gets a rally going and starts
01:29:22.390 --> 01:29:26.670
just going at it man i mean jake you know we
01:29:26.670 --> 01:29:28.369
got we gave him a nickname called the mouth of
01:29:28.369 --> 01:29:32.600
the south Because his voice, I mean, the way
01:29:32.600 --> 01:29:34.500
he talks, I mean, he should be a public speaker.
01:29:34.640 --> 01:29:39.380
I mean, dude's phenomenal. But he got up and
01:29:39.380 --> 01:29:43.260
did, I believe, what no man would ever do for
01:29:43.260 --> 01:29:47.420
another man, which is stand up and fight for
01:29:47.420 --> 01:29:53.340
him when all the odds are against him. And he
01:29:53.340 --> 01:29:56.180
didn't know me. He had no obligation to do that.
01:29:56.699 --> 01:30:01.319
But he did. And that then. developed into continuing
01:30:01.319 --> 01:30:06.899
to fight for three years. Jake took the social
01:30:06.899 --> 01:30:11.439
media. He held rallies. You know, he fought like
01:30:11.439 --> 01:30:18.380
hell for me. And now to this day, you know, you
01:30:18.380 --> 01:30:24.520
know, back in January of 2019 or January 2020,
01:30:24.819 --> 01:30:28.260
Jake ended up marrying me and Gabri. you know
01:30:28.260 --> 01:30:30.500
officiating the marriage not marrying both of
01:30:30.500 --> 01:30:34.619
you yeah it wasn't a weird three -way marriage
01:30:34.619 --> 01:30:37.479
yeah no no three -way marriage but officiating
01:30:37.479 --> 01:30:42.199
the marriage and uh you know because i it felt
01:30:42.199 --> 01:30:49.159
fitting you know and so yeah man it jake uh we
01:30:49.159 --> 01:30:51.619
like to believe sometimes you know jake is an
01:30:51.619 --> 01:30:54.939
angel that came out of nowhere man but When I
01:30:54.939 --> 01:30:57.720
said an outcry, when he starts opening up his
01:30:57.720 --> 01:31:01.260
mouth to save my life, clearly he's not an angel.
01:31:02.500 --> 01:31:05.920
So that's what starts unfolding is you have all
01:31:05.920 --> 01:31:12.069
these just terrible professionals. So whether
01:31:12.069 --> 01:31:14.270
it's the investigating officer, whether it's
01:31:14.270 --> 01:31:16.109
the sheriff, whether it's your defense attorney,
01:31:16.369 --> 01:31:20.529
even some of the DA as well, I think, at the
01:31:20.529 --> 01:31:23.689
time. So there's all these figures of people
01:31:23.689 --> 01:31:26.449
that just have no ownership of their profession,
01:31:26.550 --> 01:31:29.229
but then don't have the courage and humility
01:31:29.229 --> 01:31:31.859
to say, you know what, we screwed up. Now we're
01:31:31.859 --> 01:31:34.520
going to take the time to review this case, undo
01:31:34.520 --> 01:31:37.720
the damage. It was just stand by your screw up.
01:31:38.060 --> 01:31:41.119
And, you know, my career and my ego is more important
01:31:41.119 --> 01:31:43.500
than this guy we just sent into prison for 25
01:31:43.500 --> 01:31:45.800
years that may get stabbed in two days and, you
01:31:45.800 --> 01:31:49.220
know, never walk out again. But then, as I said,
01:31:49.300 --> 01:31:51.479
you have these amazing figures, you know, coming
01:31:51.479 --> 01:31:53.479
in. Obviously, Gabriel and her family stood by
01:31:53.479 --> 01:31:56.260
you and you had Jake. But then another guy who
01:31:56.260 --> 01:31:58.020
I would actually love to get on the show as well
01:31:58.020 --> 01:32:02.329
was Keith Hampton. So tell me about, again, how
01:32:02.329 --> 01:32:04.829
you found him, and then let's talk about the
01:32:04.829 --> 01:32:08.069
end of that initial three -year physically being
01:32:08.069 --> 01:32:13.229
in prison. Yeah, so Keith actually, after I was
01:32:13.229 --> 01:32:16.270
convicted, Keith was immediately recommended
01:32:16.270 --> 01:32:22.590
to me by Patricia Cummings, the same attorney
01:32:22.590 --> 01:32:25.989
that was conflicted and ineffective. She requested
01:32:25.989 --> 01:32:29.590
her good friend Keith. to represent me as my
01:32:29.590 --> 01:32:34.829
appeal attorney. And, um, the process of me appealing
01:32:34.829 --> 01:32:37.529
my trial was completely waived. That was part
01:32:37.529 --> 01:32:40.970
of that 25 years. Right. And so, um, there was
01:32:40.970 --> 01:32:43.090
no hope to appeal what happened in the trial.
01:32:43.189 --> 01:32:45.670
So the only hope that we had was to find new
01:32:45.670 --> 01:32:47.590
evidence that would prove that I was innocent.
01:32:48.670 --> 01:32:52.210
And in some sense, it was really, it was, it
01:32:52.210 --> 01:32:54.270
was a long, long waiting game, but we really
01:32:54.270 --> 01:32:56.630
didn't have to reach far for new evidence because
01:32:57.130 --> 01:32:59.689
These stones we turned over were right in front
01:32:59.689 --> 01:33:01.489
of us the whole time that the police department
01:33:01.489 --> 01:33:04.810
never wanted to turn over. I mean, simple things,
01:33:04.869 --> 01:33:06.869
man, is get my freaking phone and figure out
01:33:06.869 --> 01:33:11.510
where I was the day that the, you know, crime
01:33:11.510 --> 01:33:20.229
happened. I was 50 miles away. And so Keith got
01:33:20.229 --> 01:33:23.289
introduced through Patricia and it was about
01:33:23.289 --> 01:33:27.760
three years. Of waiting, it was more so waiting
01:33:27.760 --> 01:33:30.739
for a court date. It was waiting to actually
01:33:30.739 --> 01:33:34.659
get in front of judges to fight and prove that
01:33:34.659 --> 01:33:38.279
I didn't do this to show the evidence. And it
01:33:38.279 --> 01:33:42.640
was being it was hard to do because we had to
01:33:42.640 --> 01:33:46.119
jump over the hurdle of the current DA's office.
01:33:46.939 --> 01:33:50.020
I mean, while during that three year process
01:33:50.020 --> 01:33:55.729
of fighting after I was convicted about. Two
01:33:55.729 --> 01:33:59.430
years of that, the same DA's office that convicted
01:33:59.430 --> 01:34:01.949
me was still in office and I would not want to
01:34:01.949 --> 01:34:06.630
see the new evidence that my attorney found that
01:34:06.630 --> 01:34:08.670
would prove that I didn't do this. That would
01:34:08.670 --> 01:34:10.470
prove that they were wrong because, again, they
01:34:10.470 --> 01:34:12.909
don't want to be proven wrong. Yeah, because
01:34:12.909 --> 01:34:15.770
they know they didn't do the investigation. They
01:34:15.770 --> 01:34:17.449
know that there's evidence out there that proves
01:34:17.449 --> 01:34:20.569
that I didn't do it. So, of course, they're going
01:34:20.569 --> 01:34:23.670
to shut down any attempt by my attorney to be
01:34:23.670 --> 01:34:29.149
proven wrong. And so I remember my attorney telling
01:34:29.149 --> 01:34:33.310
me and Jake telling me, too, that just literally
01:34:33.310 --> 01:34:36.949
just two months after I was convicted, Keith
01:34:36.949 --> 01:34:40.270
Hampton wanted to march into Judge, not Judge,
01:34:40.350 --> 01:34:44.569
DA Jana Doody's office and say, hey, I got enough
01:34:44.569 --> 01:34:46.369
evidence to prove to you that Greg didn't do
01:34:46.369 --> 01:34:53.420
this. Just two months. And she. And just kind
01:34:53.420 --> 01:34:54.859
of, I don't know, maybe she was having a good
01:34:54.859 --> 01:34:56.359
day. She said, I'll have a meeting with you.
01:34:57.659 --> 01:35:01.159
And Keith couldn't even get to slide six on his
01:35:01.159 --> 01:35:06.180
PowerPoint before Janet Doody says, get out of
01:35:06.180 --> 01:35:09.380
my office. You know, I mean, shuts it down and
01:35:09.380 --> 01:35:12.140
says, I don't care if you show me a video of
01:35:12.140 --> 01:35:13.600
somebody else doing it. Greg's not getting out
01:35:13.600 --> 01:35:16.220
of prison unless there was somebody else living
01:35:16.220 --> 01:35:18.100
in that house that looks like Greg. And then,
01:35:18.100 --> 01:35:21.770
you know, Keith was like, uh -huh, uh -huh. And
01:35:21.770 --> 01:35:26.569
he's like, and his name was, you know, Gregory
01:35:26.569 --> 01:35:28.430
Raymond Kelly, then we have nothing to talk about
01:35:28.430 --> 01:35:34.430
here. You know? Mm -hmm. And Keith was like,
01:35:34.569 --> 01:35:38.909
okay, I know what's happening here. I know the
01:35:38.909 --> 01:35:44.069
game you're playing. And so Keith then tells
01:35:44.069 --> 01:35:49.529
Jake, okay, we got to do this the hard way. We
01:35:49.529 --> 01:35:51.329
we end up having go through the courts and we
01:35:51.329 --> 01:35:53.149
had to wait man. We had to wait and wait and
01:35:53.149 --> 01:35:56.329
wait and wait and When there was a perfectly
01:35:56.329 --> 01:36:00.770
capable DA's office to you know, right or wrong
01:36:00.770 --> 01:36:08.170
and In the process about two years That's the
01:36:08.170 --> 01:36:13.489
crazy thing about people that are crazy and People
01:36:13.489 --> 01:36:16.399
that and it's sad. I mean, it's sad. I mean People
01:36:16.399 --> 01:36:18.739
that are crazy and people that do bad things
01:36:18.739 --> 01:36:22.199
in this life, they have to live with the decisions
01:36:22.199 --> 01:36:25.060
that they make. You know what I mean? They have
01:36:25.060 --> 01:36:29.699
so many skeletons in their closet that two years
01:36:29.699 --> 01:36:32.659
later, while I was waiting in the court system
01:36:32.659 --> 01:36:40.279
to get a date, first of all, a new DA comes into
01:36:40.279 --> 01:36:42.399
town because Sean Dick wins the re -election.
01:36:43.789 --> 01:36:48.729
Before that, Judge Donna, I mean, Janet Doody
01:36:48.729 --> 01:36:54.949
ends up like getting charged with contempt of
01:36:54.949 --> 01:36:57.930
court and like a previous murder trial and this
01:36:57.930 --> 01:37:00.390
and that. And she's pretty much just making a
01:37:00.390 --> 01:37:03.529
fool of herself and ending her career, you know,
01:37:03.529 --> 01:37:10.250
showing herself to be unfit. And she ends up
01:37:10.250 --> 01:37:14.430
getting disbarred. and has to do like two days
01:37:14.430 --> 01:37:17.149
in jail or something for her her contentment
01:37:17.149 --> 01:37:20.989
court and then the uh the da's office position
01:37:20.989 --> 01:37:23.510
the williams county da's office completely vacant
01:37:23.510 --> 01:37:27.369
for somebody to to take after re -election and
01:37:27.369 --> 01:37:32.670
sean digg a district attorney out of you know
01:37:32.670 --> 01:37:35.510
austin travis county ends up winning the the
01:37:35.510 --> 01:37:39.789
re -election and um the second day man of his
01:37:39.789 --> 01:37:43.270
while he was in office He allowed Keith to come
01:37:43.270 --> 01:37:47.850
in and show what he has to prove that I'm innocent.
01:37:49.390 --> 01:37:55.470
And this was after, you know, we lost in the
01:37:55.470 --> 01:37:59.470
in the first circuit court. You know, in my case,
01:37:59.569 --> 01:38:01.510
judge didn't want to see it. Judge didn't want
01:38:01.510 --> 01:38:03.590
to hear it. You know, we were kind of losing
01:38:03.590 --> 01:38:07.350
hope. And and out of nowhere, man, Sean Dick
01:38:07.350 --> 01:38:09.529
wanted to have a meeting with Keith Hampton and
01:38:09.529 --> 01:38:12.890
listen to what he has. This is the new DA of
01:38:12.890 --> 01:38:14.729
Williamson County. And he seems like another
01:38:14.729 --> 01:38:17.670
good figure that comes in. And he wasn't from,
01:38:17.729 --> 01:38:19.350
you know, obviously from the footage that we
01:38:19.350 --> 01:38:21.909
saw. It wasn't like, hey, I'm Sean. I'm totally
01:38:21.909 --> 01:38:24.630
pro -Greg and we're going to get him out. He
01:38:24.630 --> 01:38:27.289
was very middle of the road. But he said, if
01:38:27.289 --> 01:38:29.390
there's a chance that this guy might be wrongfully
01:38:29.390 --> 01:38:32.060
convicted, why wouldn't I? review the case and
01:38:32.060 --> 01:38:34.020
that's all anyone wants it's just a fair shot
01:38:34.020 --> 01:38:36.300
at a review and that's what you asked for the
01:38:36.300 --> 01:38:39.460
three or two years prior and you were just told
01:38:39.460 --> 01:38:42.460
to to go away which is just disgusting so he
01:38:42.460 --> 01:38:45.680
seemed to me as you know again a viewer to be
01:38:45.680 --> 01:38:50.859
a very middle -of -the -road fair man who is
01:38:50.859 --> 01:38:52.500
probably very very good in the position that
01:38:52.500 --> 01:38:55.720
he sits in now absolutely you know he's the type
01:38:55.720 --> 01:38:58.100
of guy that every county should have as a da
01:38:59.159 --> 01:39:01.720
was a guy who is simply just seeking the truth
01:39:01.720 --> 01:39:04.500
you know what i mean there's no there's no reputation
01:39:04.500 --> 01:39:08.420
to withhold right i mean there is no promotion
01:39:08.420 --> 01:39:10.399
like he's trying to be a judge i mean who knows
01:39:10.399 --> 01:39:12.640
maybe he does but i know he's trying to earn
01:39:12.640 --> 01:39:16.100
it the right way with what he did that's the
01:39:16.100 --> 01:39:19.380
kind of judge that you want though man you want
01:39:19.380 --> 01:39:22.840
a fair judge that just seeks the truth just getting
01:39:22.840 --> 01:39:28.119
down to the truth and so Going into it, man,
01:39:28.239 --> 01:39:33.619
Sean Dick sits down with my attorney and just
01:39:33.619 --> 01:39:37.199
a few hours ends up getting out of the meeting
01:39:37.199 --> 01:39:41.039
and calls the Texas Rangers to get involved and
01:39:41.039 --> 01:39:49.939
reopen Greg Kelly's case. And I remember getting
01:39:49.939 --> 01:39:55.479
visited by a Texas Ranger in prison. And then
01:39:55.479 --> 01:39:58.760
a few short months later, I was bench warranted
01:39:58.760 --> 01:40:02.279
back to Williamson County. And this was the action
01:40:02.279 --> 01:40:04.939
that we had been praying and fighting for, was
01:40:04.939 --> 01:40:07.399
to get back to Williamson County, get an innocence
01:40:07.399 --> 01:40:11.180
of evidence hearing, to prove all the evidence
01:40:11.180 --> 01:40:13.579
and show all the evidence in a hearing that we
01:40:13.579 --> 01:40:20.210
gathered post -trial, and to get me home. I was
01:40:20.210 --> 01:40:25.869
bench warranted back in June of 2017 and waited
01:40:25.869 --> 01:40:29.590
until like August of 2017 to have my hearing.
01:40:30.050 --> 01:40:38.409
And we it was August 2nd. The hearing started
01:40:38.409 --> 01:40:43.010
in a three day hearing. And it was just a bunch
01:40:43.010 --> 01:40:46.449
of, you know, evidence being brought forward
01:40:46.449 --> 01:40:50.010
proving that I was. nowhere near the crime scene
01:40:50.010 --> 01:40:54.390
when it happened uh through my phone um proven
01:40:54.390 --> 01:40:56.789
you know it was a lot of things that were collected
01:40:56.789 --> 01:40:59.529
on jonathan's laptop to you know that i showed
01:40:59.529 --> 01:41:03.430
a lot of uh images that would be classified as
01:41:03.430 --> 01:41:06.390
child pornography um the fact that you weren't
01:41:06.390 --> 01:41:08.430
in the house that the day that the accusation
01:41:08.430 --> 01:41:11.390
was made things like that i was not in the house
01:41:11.390 --> 01:41:13.529
when the accusation was made jonathan was in
01:41:13.529 --> 01:41:16.609
the house when the accusation was made uh child
01:41:16.609 --> 01:41:21.250
pornography on his his cell phone, rumors of
01:41:21.250 --> 01:41:27.390
him wearing the clothes. You know what I mean?
01:41:27.489 --> 01:41:31.010
I guess you could say testimonies and eyewitness
01:41:31.010 --> 01:41:33.590
accounts of him wearing the clothes that the
01:41:33.590 --> 01:41:37.430
victim said the assailant wore while he was abused.
01:41:40.310 --> 01:41:44.210
And then also what's really, really messed up
01:41:44.210 --> 01:41:49.359
is The victim was not actually in the courtroom
01:41:49.359 --> 01:41:51.680
and was able to testify, but Jonathan actually
01:41:51.680 --> 01:41:56.840
drugged and raped a girl, an underage girl in
01:41:56.840 --> 01:42:02.340
a different county. And like I said, that's an
01:42:02.340 --> 01:42:04.859
example of what happens when you don't put the
01:42:04.859 --> 01:42:10.699
right guy in prison. And so after really tough
01:42:10.699 --> 01:42:14.149
three days of... And this is in the same exact
01:42:14.149 --> 01:42:16.409
courtroom, man. Not in the same county, not just
01:42:16.409 --> 01:42:17.829
in the same county. It's in the same county,
01:42:17.890 --> 01:42:20.170
but it's the exact same courtroom that my life
01:42:20.170 --> 01:42:23.289
was taken away from me. You know, different judge
01:42:23.289 --> 01:42:27.850
this time. And there's 12 courtrooms and I was
01:42:27.850 --> 01:42:31.750
in that one. That's crazy. And so sitting there
01:42:31.750 --> 01:42:34.229
at the end of it, I thought I was going to get
01:42:34.229 --> 01:42:36.229
released. I thought I was going to be on an appeal
01:42:36.229 --> 01:42:37.649
bond because that's what we were fighting for.
01:42:37.710 --> 01:42:39.569
It wasn't to prove I was innocent. I mean, there
01:42:39.569 --> 01:42:41.350
was no way to prove I was innocent right then
01:42:41.350 --> 01:42:44.600
and there because that has to be done at a higher
01:42:44.600 --> 01:42:46.659
court, which is the Court of Criminal Appeals.
01:42:46.699 --> 01:42:49.260
That's how it is in the state of Texas. They're
01:42:49.260 --> 01:42:52.279
actually start trying to change that where, you
01:42:52.279 --> 01:42:56.340
know, circuit courts, district judges can actually
01:42:56.340 --> 01:42:58.420
declare you innocent and exonerate you without
01:42:58.420 --> 01:43:00.840
having to go to the higher court to get approval.
01:43:03.060 --> 01:43:07.039
But that hearing was just simply to present the
01:43:07.039 --> 01:43:11.800
new evidence. First and foremost, The goal was
01:43:11.800 --> 01:43:16.140
to have the judge agree to the claims that we
01:43:16.140 --> 01:43:21.560
were bringing forward. And secondary was to get
01:43:21.560 --> 01:43:24.479
an appeal bond to get me released while I waited
01:43:24.479 --> 01:43:27.039
for the process for the CCA, the Court of Criminal
01:43:27.039 --> 01:43:28.739
Appeals, the highest criminal court in the state
01:43:28.739 --> 01:43:32.100
of Texas, to make the ultimate decision of three
01:43:32.100 --> 01:43:36.880
decisions. Getting exonerated, getting retried,
01:43:36.880 --> 01:43:43.430
or going back to prison. And, you know, after
01:43:43.430 --> 01:43:48.689
three days of being going through all that, man,
01:43:48.770 --> 01:43:53.609
not only was it hard for me to kind of rewatch
01:43:53.609 --> 01:43:59.770
the same detective be exposed of his wrongdoings
01:43:59.770 --> 01:44:01.949
and all the things he could have done, you know
01:44:01.949 --> 01:44:04.869
what I mean? And then what was really sickening
01:44:04.869 --> 01:44:08.470
was seeing him make every excuse in the world.
01:44:09.119 --> 01:44:12.539
why he believed that he was acting in good faith.
01:44:13.539 --> 01:44:16.239
And it just, it goes to show you, it's a testament,
01:44:16.439 --> 01:44:21.039
you know, and a byproduct of his training and
01:44:21.039 --> 01:44:25.779
the leader and the department. And of course,
01:44:25.779 --> 01:44:27.800
if you watch the documentary, you kind of get
01:44:27.800 --> 01:44:32.100
a taste of, you know, Sean Mannix, the chief
01:44:32.100 --> 01:44:34.859
of police in Cedar Park, you know, the arrogance
01:44:34.859 --> 01:44:38.409
and how he conducts himself and how. Pretty much
01:44:38.409 --> 01:44:43.550
he thinks his crap doesn't stink. And, you know,
01:44:43.569 --> 01:44:46.970
that was the guy he was taught by. And so on
01:44:46.970 --> 01:44:51.050
some level, I expect, you know, somebody who's
01:44:51.050 --> 01:44:56.050
trying to make stupid look smart. And, like,
01:44:56.069 --> 01:44:58.270
that's ultimately what happened, man, is there
01:44:58.270 --> 01:45:00.090
was a lot of I don't recalls and I don't knows.
01:45:01.050 --> 01:45:02.810
You know, when you have that, dude, you don't
01:45:02.810 --> 01:45:04.829
deserve to wear a badge. Well, and it's something
01:45:04.829 --> 01:45:07.880
I talk about a lot. on here because that's exactly
01:45:07.880 --> 01:45:11.619
if you don't hold the bar when you hire people
01:45:11.619 --> 01:45:13.800
and then you don't hold the bar within that department
01:45:13.800 --> 01:45:17.100
at ranks you know year by year whether it's training
01:45:17.100 --> 01:45:19.699
wise whether it's physical fitness wise you know
01:45:19.699 --> 01:45:24.199
whatever it is that's what terrifies me the last
01:45:24.199 --> 01:45:26.239
place i worked there was an element of that we
01:45:26.239 --> 01:45:28.539
were in fire not law enforcement so it wouldn't
01:45:28.539 --> 01:45:29.899
be that someone would be wrongfully collected
01:45:29.899 --> 01:45:32.300
convicted it would be that someone would die
01:45:32.810 --> 01:45:35.750
They would die in a fire, die in a mass shooting,
01:45:35.909 --> 01:45:38.789
whatever it was, because that complacency was
01:45:38.789 --> 01:45:42.890
allowed to foster from the top down. So this
01:45:42.890 --> 01:45:45.149
is such an important thing for people to see.
01:45:45.210 --> 01:45:48.350
And I encourage everyone to watch Outcry. But
01:45:48.350 --> 01:45:50.869
this is exactly it. This is this. What happened
01:45:50.869 --> 01:45:54.810
to you is what I talk about so often. If we don't
01:45:54.810 --> 01:45:57.729
hold ourselves accountable individually and as
01:45:57.729 --> 01:46:01.949
a department, people die. Children go to psych
01:46:01.949 --> 01:46:04.829
facilities that shouldn't go. High school kids
01:46:04.829 --> 01:46:07.229
end up in prison. And, you know, again, just
01:46:07.229 --> 01:46:09.869
to underline, this story, which we're going to
01:46:09.869 --> 01:46:11.130
wrap up in a second, so I know you've got to
01:46:11.130 --> 01:46:13.850
go in a moment, has a happy ending somewhat,
01:46:13.930 --> 01:46:16.069
apart from obviously you carry what happened
01:46:16.069 --> 01:46:19.289
with you. But there are so many people that didn't
01:46:19.289 --> 01:46:22.210
have that, you know, group that are still in
01:46:22.210 --> 01:46:25.130
prison now or are dead, like some of the people
01:46:25.130 --> 01:46:28.010
I've had on the show. There's one gentleman whose
01:46:28.010 --> 01:46:31.119
son drew. you know, passed because of a really,
01:46:31.199 --> 01:46:33.420
really shitty paramedic and some other medical
01:46:33.420 --> 01:46:37.380
malpractice. You know, this is it. This is why
01:46:37.380 --> 01:46:42.500
we have to hold our own bar so high. So you ended
01:46:42.500 --> 01:46:44.739
up, and there's so much more, but obviously people
01:46:44.739 --> 01:46:47.399
can watch the documentary. You ended up getting
01:46:47.399 --> 01:46:51.260
to the point where you were physically not in
01:46:51.260 --> 01:46:54.960
prison anymore, but now you're waiting for that
01:46:54.960 --> 01:46:57.159
claim, as you said, of innocence or returning
01:46:57.159 --> 01:47:01.229
to prison. And for three years, every Wednesday,
01:47:01.289 --> 01:47:06.210
you had to check a website to see if you had
01:47:06.210 --> 01:47:09.609
your freedom back or not. So talk to me about
01:47:09.609 --> 01:47:13.989
being physically free, but not being free, what
01:47:13.989 --> 01:47:16.470
that mindset was like for you. And then let's
01:47:16.470 --> 01:47:19.310
walk through to finally getting that and where
01:47:19.310 --> 01:47:23.970
you and Gabriel, your future from here on in.
01:47:25.069 --> 01:47:29.199
Yeah, so after that, After the three days of
01:47:29.199 --> 01:47:33.359
that hearing to prove all the evidence of my
01:47:33.359 --> 01:47:35.979
innocence, I eventually, two weeks later, I had
01:47:35.979 --> 01:47:38.659
to spend two weeks in jail after that hearing
01:47:38.659 --> 01:47:44.479
for the judge to make the right decision either
01:47:44.479 --> 01:47:48.260
to let me out and wait for the CCA's decision
01:47:48.260 --> 01:47:50.859
or I have to sit in jail. You know, and to think
01:47:50.859 --> 01:47:53.079
back on it, how long it took for the CCA to finally
01:47:53.079 --> 01:47:54.840
make a decision. If I was in jail for that amount
01:47:54.840 --> 01:47:56.960
of time, God, county jail is totally different
01:47:56.960 --> 01:47:59.619
than prison. I mean, county jail sucks. I mean,
01:47:59.640 --> 01:48:01.760
prison, you can actually, you know, make best
01:48:01.760 --> 01:48:04.100
of what you got. But county jail, you just it's
01:48:04.100 --> 01:48:06.819
just a waiting game. So I had to wait about two
01:48:06.819 --> 01:48:11.199
weeks. And then, man, the day came where it was
01:48:11.199 --> 01:48:16.359
August 22nd, 2017. You know, Keith Hampton. Now
01:48:16.359 --> 01:48:18.039
I get I get called to go to an attorney visit
01:48:18.039 --> 01:48:21.829
by the sheriff. A sheriff comes and gets me from
01:48:21.829 --> 01:48:25.829
my cell and he walks me down to the visitation
01:48:25.829 --> 01:48:30.289
room, not in cuffs, not handcuffed. Normally,
01:48:30.449 --> 01:48:34.149
I get handcuffed, but not in cuffs. I go down
01:48:34.149 --> 01:48:36.789
to the attorney visit room and I walk in that
01:48:36.789 --> 01:48:39.729
little booth and there's a little glass and I'm
01:48:39.729 --> 01:48:41.930
waiting for what's going on. And I have a really
01:48:41.930 --> 01:48:44.109
good feeling of what I know is about to happen.
01:48:44.590 --> 01:48:49.550
And Keith Hampton, my attorney, walks in. And
01:48:49.550 --> 01:48:51.510
says, hey, man, you see what this paper is right
01:48:51.510 --> 01:48:54.649
here? And I look at it and I read it and it says
01:48:54.649 --> 01:48:59.090
the immediate release of Greg Kelly. And I just
01:48:59.090 --> 01:49:03.630
broke down crying and it just it felt so good
01:49:03.630 --> 01:49:07.770
knowing that I'm about to go home. And I remember
01:49:07.770 --> 01:49:10.010
me and Keith took a picture with each other right
01:49:10.010 --> 01:49:14.210
then and there. I still have it. And then he
01:49:14.210 --> 01:49:16.449
came up and followed me up to my cell to help
01:49:16.449 --> 01:49:20.520
me. gather up my things and put them in a trash
01:49:20.520 --> 01:49:25.880
bag, walk down to the back door of the county
01:49:25.880 --> 01:49:29.560
jail where apparently a bunch of people were
01:49:29.560 --> 01:49:31.600
waiting, you know, people that wanted to see
01:49:31.600 --> 01:49:35.180
me get released and news and media and family
01:49:35.180 --> 01:49:37.659
and friends, all the people I went to high school
01:49:37.659 --> 01:49:41.060
with that believed in me were all waiting, you
01:49:41.060 --> 01:49:44.380
know, for me to be released and be rejoined to
01:49:44.380 --> 01:49:50.300
society. And Um, I, I eventually do. And it was
01:49:50.300 --> 01:49:51.739
just an awesome moment because I immediately
01:49:51.739 --> 01:49:53.699
went, I immediately went to Jake Bryden's house.
01:49:54.180 --> 01:49:58.899
Um, and we, uh, we had barbecue and we went surfing
01:49:58.899 --> 01:50:02.739
and we went wake surfing on a lake. And I just,
01:50:02.779 --> 01:50:05.119
you know, I just enjoy, I wanted to do what being
01:50:05.119 --> 01:50:09.520
free meant and went out there and just had an
01:50:09.520 --> 01:50:13.239
awesome time. But, but, you know, eventually
01:50:13.239 --> 01:50:17.560
all good days come to an end. And that emotionally
01:50:17.560 --> 01:50:21.699
high that I was feeling and coming down and I
01:50:21.699 --> 01:50:28.319
then went into a process of waiting for, you
01:50:28.319 --> 01:50:31.760
know, it was actually 80 something. It was like
01:50:31.760 --> 01:50:33.220
I can't remember the exact number, but it was
01:50:33.220 --> 01:50:38.979
like 80 something weeks of having to check a
01:50:38.979 --> 01:50:46.020
website to see what the CCA. is going to decide
01:50:46.020 --> 01:50:49.800
on my case and you could one of those verdicts
01:50:49.800 --> 01:50:52.800
could be you pack your stuff back into a trash
01:50:52.800 --> 01:50:54.699
bag you walk back through that door and you go
01:50:54.699 --> 01:50:58.640
back to your cell yeah i mean that was that was
01:50:58.640 --> 01:51:01.039
a reality man the the three decisions would have
01:51:01.039 --> 01:51:07.439
been exoneration you know free trial or go back
01:51:07.439 --> 01:51:09.680
to prison for the remainder of your sentence
01:51:10.720 --> 01:51:13.300
So being released and being rejoined with my
01:51:13.300 --> 01:51:18.560
family, it felt like, it felt great, man. I mean,
01:51:18.560 --> 01:51:22.180
but the thing about that is, you said it earlier,
01:51:22.239 --> 01:51:25.220
is that I wasn't actually free. You know, what
01:51:25.220 --> 01:51:28.539
it means to be free, it surpasses far more than
01:51:28.539 --> 01:51:31.460
just being physically able to experience freedom.
01:51:31.840 --> 01:51:34.579
It's about knowing that you are free. You know
01:51:34.579 --> 01:51:36.779
what I mean? It's about knowing that you have
01:51:36.779 --> 01:51:41.329
the liberties to enjoy freedom. Like get a job,
01:51:41.409 --> 01:51:44.590
you know what I mean? Have a car, get a mortgage,
01:51:44.869 --> 01:51:48.010
you know what I mean? Do all these things, own
01:51:48.010 --> 01:51:49.829
a gun. I mean, I couldn't even go get a gun if
01:51:49.829 --> 01:51:52.489
I wanted to, you know what I mean? Like I, it
01:51:52.489 --> 01:51:56.449
was, I was still a felon on probation or not
01:51:56.449 --> 01:51:59.590
probation on an appeal bond. So technically,
01:51:59.649 --> 01:52:02.090
if you go during that process, I was still an
01:52:02.090 --> 01:52:04.449
inmate at the wind unit in Huntsville, Texas,
01:52:04.649 --> 01:52:10.250
you know, but I was relieved on bond. And so
01:52:10.250 --> 01:52:13.590
during that whole process, every dinner that
01:52:13.590 --> 01:52:16.810
I had with my family, they were great. I mean,
01:52:16.829 --> 01:52:19.310
every family dinner that I had, I wanted to have,
01:52:19.489 --> 01:52:23.029
even though I was physically there enjoying the
01:52:23.029 --> 01:52:25.550
presence of the people I love, they were still
01:52:25.550 --> 01:52:29.970
a dark cloud over me. You know what I mean? That
01:52:29.970 --> 01:52:34.750
a big weight, that a thorn, I guess you can say
01:52:34.750 --> 01:52:36.609
a thorn that stuck in my side, like where man,
01:52:36.670 --> 01:52:39.640
oh my gosh, I could. I could literally go back
01:52:39.640 --> 01:52:44.920
tomorrow, you know. And every Wednesday, the
01:52:44.920 --> 01:52:48.119
documentary crew would show up at my house with
01:52:48.119 --> 01:52:52.760
Starbucks. And, you know, to make the situation
01:52:52.760 --> 01:52:55.939
a little bit better, you know, just to sit down
01:52:55.939 --> 01:53:00.640
and out of all things, out of all ways to check
01:53:00.640 --> 01:53:04.380
your fate for the rest of your life, you do it
01:53:04.380 --> 01:53:06.420
on a little freaking phone and you refresh a
01:53:06.420 --> 01:53:10.670
page on the Internet. And you just refresh this
01:53:10.670 --> 01:53:14.210
list, you know, every Wednesday at 9 a .m. to
01:53:14.210 --> 01:53:17.350
see what the decision was for the CCA. And that
01:53:17.350 --> 01:53:19.930
happened Wednesday after Wednesday after Wednesday
01:53:19.930 --> 01:53:22.630
for 80 something Wednesdays. And if you watch
01:53:22.630 --> 01:53:25.170
the documentary, you can actually tell the time
01:53:25.170 --> 01:53:28.149
span of that time by how my hair was growing
01:53:28.149 --> 01:53:31.289
because I decided to grow my hair out that whole
01:53:31.289 --> 01:53:33.510
time. And I didn't do that for the documentary.
01:53:33.569 --> 01:53:35.789
I just did it because I was bald for three years.
01:53:36.519 --> 01:53:38.960
And they cut my hair short every, you know, and
01:53:38.960 --> 01:53:41.880
I have short hair now, but I wanted to just grow
01:53:41.880 --> 01:53:44.659
my hair out because I wanted to. And so you could
01:53:44.659 --> 01:53:47.800
tell how long it was during that time span. And
01:53:47.800 --> 01:53:52.140
I, man, it was so tough because every Tuesday
01:53:52.140 --> 01:53:54.800
I couldn't eat, every Tuesday night, every Monday
01:53:54.800 --> 01:53:57.359
or Wednesday morning I couldn't eat. I just,
01:53:57.439 --> 01:53:59.300
there was a pit in my stomach that today could
01:53:59.300 --> 01:54:03.810
go really bad or it could go really good. But
01:54:03.810 --> 01:54:07.829
naturally, you're scared. You doubt. It hasn't
01:54:07.829 --> 01:54:10.609
gone good most of the time for the past three
01:54:10.609 --> 01:54:17.409
years. The crazy thing, man, is that every time
01:54:17.409 --> 01:54:22.430
I refresh the page and I didn't see my name on
01:54:22.430 --> 01:54:24.949
the list, it was like at the end of the day,
01:54:24.989 --> 01:54:27.850
you're like, man, I guess no news is good news.
01:54:28.170 --> 01:54:31.050
I have another week. You know what I mean? I
01:54:31.050 --> 01:54:34.229
have another week. I have another week. But it
01:54:34.229 --> 01:54:37.970
came down to that day, man, where my stress was
01:54:37.970 --> 01:54:41.750
at an all -time high because a little insight
01:54:41.750 --> 01:54:46.369
about the actual Wednesday in New York City in
01:54:46.369 --> 01:54:48.930
our small little studio apartment. Gabriel was
01:54:48.930 --> 01:54:50.850
up there. The reason why we're up there is because
01:54:50.850 --> 01:54:52.369
Gabriel was up there doing a dance scholarship,
01:54:52.489 --> 01:54:56.109
and I decided to follow her up there. And we're
01:54:56.109 --> 01:54:58.010
in a little studio in New York City, Manhattan.
01:54:59.369 --> 01:55:01.569
uh, the documentary crew would come up every
01:55:01.569 --> 01:55:03.550
Wednesday to, cause that was the, that was the
01:55:03.550 --> 01:55:05.670
shot. I mean, that was the, that was the shot
01:55:05.670 --> 01:55:07.810
they needed. That was the ending to the story,
01:55:07.890 --> 01:55:10.670
you know, what's going to happen to Greg Kelly.
01:55:10.770 --> 01:55:15.170
So they needed to get that shot. And so being
01:55:15.170 --> 01:55:17.350
in that little stereo studio apartment that week
01:55:17.350 --> 01:55:19.609
that I got, you know, that the decision was made,
01:55:19.689 --> 01:55:23.050
it was a very monumental week because stress
01:55:23.050 --> 01:55:25.550
was at the all time high because the week before
01:55:25.550 --> 01:55:29.130
that, this specific case in Texas where This
01:55:29.130 --> 01:55:31.829
guy's on death row trying to fight for his life.
01:55:31.970 --> 01:55:35.630
His name is Rodney Reed. The CCA has declared
01:55:35.630 --> 01:55:40.050
a stay of execution for him. Well, this case,
01:55:40.090 --> 01:55:44.050
the Rodney Reed case has developed into a national
01:55:44.050 --> 01:55:46.550
public case where people like Kim Kardashian
01:55:46.550 --> 01:55:50.050
has backed him for his innocence. Right. And
01:55:50.050 --> 01:55:53.310
non -involvement in the crime with all the evidence
01:55:53.310 --> 01:55:55.850
that that proves that he maybe could have not
01:55:55.850 --> 01:56:01.819
done this. The CCA still paves the way and gives
01:56:01.819 --> 01:56:03.939
the green light for him to get executed on the
01:56:03.939 --> 01:56:06.859
day that he needs to get executed. And personally,
01:56:06.920 --> 01:56:10.920
personally, myself, I did not believe that he
01:56:10.920 --> 01:56:13.199
should have been executed on that day. I believe
01:56:13.199 --> 01:56:15.159
that they should have paused his case and look
01:56:15.159 --> 01:56:18.420
into it a little bit more. But seeing that and
01:56:18.420 --> 01:56:20.420
a person who's actually waiting for a decision
01:56:20.420 --> 01:56:23.800
by the CCA, seeing that I was completely scared
01:56:23.800 --> 01:56:26.489
to death because now. This thing's running in
01:56:26.489 --> 01:56:28.869
my head where it's like, man, if they're going
01:56:28.869 --> 01:56:30.409
to go and pave the way for this guy to go get
01:56:30.409 --> 01:56:31.890
executed, I don't think they're going to lose
01:56:31.890 --> 01:56:33.729
a night of sleep if they go send somebody back
01:56:33.729 --> 01:56:38.770
to prison. So I live in Texas, man. I live in
01:56:38.770 --> 01:56:41.829
a very conservative state where, you know, their
01:56:41.829 --> 01:56:43.750
reputation is if you're going to do it anywhere,
01:56:43.850 --> 01:56:47.170
don't do it in Texas. Don't don't mess with Texas.
01:56:48.069 --> 01:56:53.369
And so I'm like, dude, man, I like, man. Doubt,
01:56:53.369 --> 01:56:56.390
you know, I mean, doubt, doubt, doubt. And I
01:56:56.390 --> 01:57:02.289
refresh that page on November 6th of 2019. And
01:57:02.289 --> 01:57:06.210
man, I'm at the top of the list. And if you want
01:57:06.210 --> 01:57:07.710
to be anywhere on that list, you want to be on
01:57:07.710 --> 01:57:11.789
the top because the subcategory of relief of
01:57:11.789 --> 01:57:14.289
granted is on the top of that list. And when
01:57:14.289 --> 01:57:16.449
relief has been granted, it means that there
01:57:16.449 --> 01:57:19.100
has been relief to your claims. they have agreed
01:57:19.100 --> 01:57:21.239
to them now i don't know which claims they agreed
01:57:21.239 --> 01:57:24.500
to but when i clicked on it i knew at that moment
01:57:24.500 --> 01:57:27.699
before i clicked on that link right before that
01:57:27.699 --> 01:57:29.800
relief link right there i've already been granted
01:57:29.800 --> 01:57:32.460
relief that eliminates me going back to prison
01:57:32.460 --> 01:57:34.619
now i didn't know if i'm going to be exonerated
01:57:34.619 --> 01:57:38.380
or if they're going to retry me and i click on
01:57:38.380 --> 01:57:42.199
it and all six of my claims say relief relief
01:57:42.199 --> 01:57:45.479
relief relief relief and i look at the last one
01:57:45.479 --> 01:57:48.250
which is the sixth one and the actual innocence
01:57:48.250 --> 01:57:51.310
claim. And I don't know if you know the history
01:57:51.310 --> 01:57:53.750
about the actual innocence claim, but, you know,
01:57:53.869 --> 01:57:57.369
getting the state of Texas to agree that you're
01:57:57.369 --> 01:58:00.390
actually innocent is like giving a bear a bath.
01:58:00.630 --> 01:58:02.909
It just doesn't happen. You know what I mean?
01:58:02.989 --> 01:58:07.569
And so I think my case went down in history as
01:58:07.569 --> 01:58:12.329
one of the first cases to actually ever be declared
01:58:12.329 --> 01:58:15.939
actually innocent and exonerated. um, without
01:58:15.939 --> 01:58:21.619
DNA evidence, you know? And so that was very
01:58:21.619 --> 01:58:24.340
monumental, um, in the state of Texas, because
01:58:24.340 --> 01:58:26.880
it just shows you what, all the things that went
01:58:26.880 --> 01:58:29.960
wrong in this case, you know, from the start
01:58:29.960 --> 01:58:33.659
to the end and all the things that were brought
01:58:33.659 --> 01:58:38.079
to light, um, all the terrible things that happened
01:58:38.079 --> 01:58:41.460
in the process, you know, judge, you know, judge,
01:58:41.479 --> 01:58:46.260
uh, or not judge, um, Janet Doody. the xda she
01:58:46.260 --> 01:58:50.840
uh she killed herself you know jonathan mccarty
01:58:50.840 --> 01:58:56.659
drugged and raped more victims i went to prison
01:58:56.659 --> 01:59:02.699
for three years um a lot of terrible things man
01:59:02.699 --> 01:59:07.220
and but if you look back on it a lot of people
01:59:07.220 --> 01:59:10.659
ask me you know would i would you ever have moved
01:59:10.659 --> 01:59:17.689
into that house And immediately, I would say,
01:59:17.750 --> 01:59:22.890
hell no, right? Hail to the no. I mean, if you
01:59:22.890 --> 01:59:25.770
told me that, hey, man, do you want to go through
01:59:25.770 --> 01:59:28.270
all this? You want to live this nightmare for
01:59:28.270 --> 01:59:32.350
three years? Nope, I'm going to avoid that. But
01:59:32.350 --> 01:59:34.810
at the same time, that's not how the world works.
01:59:34.829 --> 01:59:36.350
That's not how life works, right? I mean, you
01:59:36.350 --> 01:59:38.689
go through a really crappy situation. You literally
01:59:38.689 --> 01:59:42.829
get put in the gates of hell. You know, you get
01:59:42.829 --> 01:59:44.189
told you have to go through this and make it
01:59:44.189 --> 01:59:48.729
to the other side. And I was placed and plopped
01:59:48.729 --> 01:59:50.770
right in the middle of, you know, the gates of
01:59:50.770 --> 01:59:53.550
hell and had to go through all of it. And to
01:59:53.550 --> 01:59:55.909
this day, you know, it's made me into the man
01:59:55.909 --> 01:59:58.770
that I am today. And I love the man that I am
01:59:58.770 --> 02:00:01.989
today. I'm a husband. I'm a football player.
02:00:02.050 --> 02:00:09.590
I'm a college athlete. But, you know, a lot of
02:00:09.590 --> 02:00:12.689
people that go through my situation, Don't see
02:00:12.689 --> 02:00:16.949
this side. One, either they're killed, they give
02:00:16.949 --> 02:00:20.250
up or they spend the rest of their time in prison
02:00:20.250 --> 02:00:25.630
because they gave up. You know, I'm very fortunate
02:00:25.630 --> 02:00:28.170
that I had the family and the support group that
02:00:28.170 --> 02:00:31.909
I had. I had I had the faith that I have because
02:00:31.909 --> 02:00:35.210
I feel like my faith is my foundation. The things
02:00:35.210 --> 02:00:38.890
I learned along the way that made me strong.
02:00:39.659 --> 02:00:43.659
And now that all waterfalls into the other challenges,
02:00:43.699 --> 02:00:45.779
the small little tiny challenges that I have
02:00:45.779 --> 02:00:48.060
for the rest of my life compared to the grand
02:00:48.060 --> 02:00:50.420
scale of things that I had to endure from the
02:00:50.420 --> 02:00:56.840
age of 18 to 23 years old. Yeah, I mean, dude,
02:00:57.079 --> 02:01:01.020
there's nothing that could compare. So I think
02:01:01.020 --> 02:01:04.680
it's given me a perspective to enjoy freedom
02:01:04.680 --> 02:01:09.899
for the rest of my life. Yeah. Well, Greg, I
02:01:09.899 --> 02:01:13.600
just want to say thank you. I mean, the documentary,
02:01:13.979 --> 02:01:16.899
not only your story, but I got to say the documentary
02:01:16.899 --> 02:01:19.800
itself is one of the most beautiful pieces of
02:01:19.800 --> 02:01:21.460
television I've ever watched. I know they're
02:01:21.460 --> 02:01:24.079
nominated for an Emmy. Is that right? Yeah, I
02:01:24.079 --> 02:01:25.819
just got nominated last week for an Emmy. Much
02:01:25.819 --> 02:01:28.300
deserved. I mean, I'm a huge documentary fan.
02:01:28.479 --> 02:01:30.880
That's probably why Kate and I get on well, too.
02:01:31.159 --> 02:01:34.039
But, you know, it was incredible. But it shows,
02:01:34.420 --> 02:01:37.369
like I said, the ripple effect. of the wrong
02:01:37.369 --> 02:01:39.890
people in the wrong positions who don't have
02:01:39.890 --> 02:01:43.329
the humility and ownership to realize they screwed
02:01:43.329 --> 02:01:46.670
up because we all screw up and fix their mistakes
02:01:46.670 --> 02:01:49.369
and and you know that you're living the ripple
02:01:49.369 --> 02:01:51.770
effect but i just want to say thank you for also
02:01:51.770 --> 02:01:54.689
being so courageous telling your story and you
02:01:54.689 --> 02:01:57.130
know the the elements of it there's so much for
02:01:57.130 --> 02:02:00.109
people listening to learn from it's a huge cautionary
02:02:00.109 --> 02:02:02.050
tale for all of us in the uniform professions
02:02:02.050 --> 02:02:05.869
as parents i mean you know so many elements but
02:02:06.489 --> 02:02:08.750
I hope now that your story can help advocate
02:02:08.750 --> 02:02:10.829
for other people in the same situations, whether
02:02:10.829 --> 02:02:13.090
it's preventative or whether it's reactive and
02:02:13.090 --> 02:02:15.010
help some other people that are in there. But
02:02:15.010 --> 02:02:17.510
thank you so, so much for being so generous with
02:02:17.510 --> 02:02:20.649
your time today. Man, thank you. I appreciate
02:02:20.649 --> 02:02:22.050
it, James. Thanks for having me.