Radical Transparency: Cara Kirsch’s Mission to Fix Healthcare Benefits

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Welcome, everyone, to the Triple Margin Freedom Podcast, the podcast designed
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for entrepreneurs and leaders who are on the move.
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My name is Mark Mathia, and I'm in studio today with Kara Kirsch of The Kirsch Group.
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Kara, I am so excited to talk to you because it feels like you're doing something
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radically different in the insurance industry.
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Yes. Well, thank you, Mark, for having me today. I'm really excited for this
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conversation, too. And yes, radical, radical transparency is one of the words
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we use to describe the work we do.
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Yeah, and I love that because transparency obviously is a big word in health care.
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It's becoming a big word in a lot of different things. But as you establish
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the curse group, and we have a little bit of history, so I want to get through
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some of your history because as an entrepreneur, you're exceptional and your story is wonderful.
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But let's talk about this transparency because I think it's something we should double click on.
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When you talk about transparency in healthcare, what does that look like?
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What makes the curse group different when it comes to transparency?
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Yeah. So, Mark, you've been in HR in your career.
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And so do you remember years ago when retirement plans,
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were under fire because the advisors that were advising employers on those retirement
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plans weren't being sort of forthcoming about the fees and the funds that they were selling? Yes.
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And then there was a bunch of litigation and then now there is governance that
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requires advisors to disclose and not have conflicts of interest or misaligned
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incentives. Okay. You remember that? Yes.
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And so now companies are very well adept with retirement plan fiduciary responsibility.
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They know what they have to do and advisors serve as co-fiduciaries so they
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can't take any misaligned incentives and there can't be conflicts of interest.
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Employee benefits other health and welfare plans, medical, dental, vision.
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Brokers don't have to basically toe the line on that same fiduciary responsibility.
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The Kirsch Group does that and more. We don't take incentives.
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We don't take bonuses from insurance carriers or vendors.
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We disclose any luxury that we have, which isn't many. But like,
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for example, I participate in a consultant roundtable with one of our partners
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and I go to two meetings a year.
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I'd say the value of the hotel and the flight is I pay for my own flight,
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but they pay for my hotel. Okay.
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And that we always stay somewhere nice. So I always disclose that.
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But we disclose everything, and most brokers aren't disclosing in the way that
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the Consolidated Appropriations Act recalled for them to do.
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And they don't stand as a fiduciary.
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So transparency is a buzzword, and most employers aren't concerned about it yet.
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But litigation is coming similar
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to the retirement plan world that will require them to care about it.
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And so the Kirsch Group is radically transparent in how we teach our clients,
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in how we get paid, in how we serve the vendors in the market. Wow.
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Yeah. And we are not one bit afraid of what that may or may not mean for us as we grow.
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And so there could be a time when I have to add an additional element of fiduciary
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responsibility as things change, or I could get challenged by someone and we will pivot.
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That's okay. For right now, we are a co-fiduciary. We stand with our clients
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and the things we do, and we don't take anything that would keep us from doing
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the right thing always for our clients, which is what fiduciary responsibility is all about.
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Yeah, Tara, I love that so much. And, you know, I have to say,
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I've worked with you in past lives. Yeah.
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And I've always found you've always been that transparent, and you've always been one of those.
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I don't know if it's, I mean this in the best of terms. You're gritty.
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You'll get the rates as best you can. And, you know, everyone who knows,
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who sat in that seat of trying to get a health care program for an organization,
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both midsize, I would say 50 people or higher to large organizations,
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know the impact a couple health cases can have on the entire group.
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Absolutely. And that increase has a huge impact on the entire,
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well, on the organization's ability to attract and retain.
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You've always been a fighter. You've been in there and really fought hard for
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us. Is it just in your DNA? Yes.
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Where'd that come from? Just ask my parents. My mom says a lot,
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like, you know, once I was told by a leader, it was on my way out of the organization.
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He said, well, you're a level 10 all the time. Can you be a four?
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Oh, okay. And, you know, this is not to say that 10's the best number, right? 10 is just Kara.
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Yeah. So whatever number you are is the number you are. Right.
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But for me, that does describe me well.
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And it just means that I'm constantly thinking, I'm constantly trying,
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I'm constantly challenging.
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I left the meeting that day and I called my mother, who is my best friend,
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and I said, Mom, they want me to be a, they said, can you be a four?
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And she said and I quote baby you've never been a four in your life and so that
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it does it is just inside of me and the other thing is because I grew up in
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poverty I care a lot about.
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The the the public the people yeah you know the people that are building the
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widgets for the manufacturing company the people that are delivering health
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care services to the sickest the people that are providing community services
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to our most vulnerable community
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members and citizens the people who sit in commissioner chairs,
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you know all of that is really important to me and it takes time to teach people
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why that should be important to them but grit has always been part of me.
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I've been through lots of things in my life that have caused me to have to buckle
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up and move forward. And thankfully, by the grace of God, I'm able to do that.
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That's brilliant. And a level 10 with radical integrity. See,
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that's unique. So I was onto something.
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Yeah, because that's exactly what you want on your side, especially if you sit
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in that seat as a, you know, whether it's a chief human resource officer,
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maybe chief financial officer, or whoever's in charge of the benefits at the time,
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that is so important.
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So let's take a step back a little bit because I already liked how this is framed.
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Tell me a little about your entrepreneurial journey and kind of how you got
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to the Curse Group today.
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Yeah, so entrepreneurship has been in my family for five generations.
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My mom is an entrepreneur. My brother, my grandfather was an entrepreneur.
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His brothers were entrepreneurs.
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You know, it started with my great-grandfather delivering milk.
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He was a milk delivery man for himself.
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And fast forward to today for me my first,
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dip into the entrepreneurial pool i'll say was when i formed the ignite women
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in insurance conference that was 10 years ago,
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and so that was really my way of saying how can i make the community of insurance
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better for women in terms of creating content and leadership,
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tactics and networking tactics and brand tactics for that group to use That
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group started with 70 people.
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Now there's 350 women attending that conference. And in 2027,
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we will be hosting our 10th event.
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And that group has actually broadened its scope.
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Tell us about that. So it was women in insurance. So think about employee benefits,
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insurance companies, insurance brokers, anyone who touched that.
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In 2023, it was rebranded for women in business because I had so many businesswomen
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coming who had participated or heard about the event. We're like,
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hey, this isn't about insurance. You're
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not sitting around having riveting conversations about underwriting.
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This is about women working together. Yes. And so it was rebranded and it's
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been tremendously successful since then. In the past couple of years,
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we've actually had a lot of businesses that are now sponsors beyond insurance companies, etc.
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And so, and it has an accompanying podcast where I feature women who not only
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are participating in the conference as a speaker or panelist,
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but also women that I meet in the community that I want to elevate.
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And so that was my first toe dip in. Yep.
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And then in 2025, when I was terminated from my job, I thought to myself,
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okay, I'm going to try this.
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If I don't, I'll probably kick myself in and that's not okay.
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So I launched the Kirsch Group December 2nd, 2025 on the heels of being terminated
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from my job after a 30-year career being a very high contributor and decided,
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you know what, I'm going to try to build this from a different place.
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And that different place is a place of intention. and what i mean is the kirsch
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group is mighty and we are intentional about how we grow,
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in most broker firms today their teams are stretched incredibly thin and that
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leads to lack of time with your clients lack of accuracy lack of ability to
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do innovative things which we need desperately as costs go up,
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and so our firm will grow very intentionally whereas our counterparts at other
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firms may have 20 clients, our teams will have 10.
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Okay. And that's very intentional. And it's because, first of all,
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I want our employees to have a life.
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You know, I gave up a lot of my life in sacrifice. That's a crazy thought, Kira. Right.
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But I'm not doing that. I am not going to be the leader that stretches my people thin.
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We offer remote work. We offer 12 weeks of paid maternity leave.
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We offer employer-paid long-term disability. We offer unlimited PTO.
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We trust our people and when we say we trust them we're not micromanaging them
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yeah when they make a mistake we're not throwing the the wall at them,
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we're sitting with them to teach them and that is the culture that i will build
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and am building today yeah even before we are five years old and i'll be blessed
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to be able to say someday that we're five years old but
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those things are really important to me the flip side of that what will our clients feel mm-hmm.
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They will feel compassion and support and expertise differently than they feel
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it with the big firms. Yeah.
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So we have all the same resources that everyone has just delivered in a more compassionate way.
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You know, and I was going to ask that because when you are as intentional as
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you are and as you're building your organization,
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sometimes that limits the size and scope of who you can work with what i heard
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you just say is there's no limit there is no limit there is no limit and,
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the clients that we're working with now my largest client is 6 000 employees
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wow so there are people who recognize the thought leadership coming from the
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kirsch group is very different yes than everyone else,
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and so you add in that layer of, wait a minute, Kara's going to stand with us.
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She's not one bit afraid to take a call from an employee. Most brokers will
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say, yeah, we don't take employee calls.
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She's not one bit afraid to help an employee who's got a child that's going
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through outpatient mental health, who now has a network issue to solve that.
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That is work we do. And that is work all of my employees will be very comfortable
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in saying to our clients, yeah, have Joe give me a call. I'm happy to help them.
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That's a differentiator. Yeah, it really is. So, we have really robust tech stacks, which I love.
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We are efficient with tech, different than our competitors. So,
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while our competitors are trying to do things manually with a group of people
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and just burning and churning, we're not doing that. We're finding the right tech.
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And we're investing in that as we go. So it's exciting.
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But I will tell you that I haven't won deals this year because of my passion.
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Okay. So one of the deals I didn't get, they said, you know,
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you're just a little too passionate.
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Now, I would think that you would want someone who's passionate on your side.
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But for women, we do have to approach things differently than our male counterparts.
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And so gender does affect how we grow.
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The other thing is that women don't sponsor one another the ways that men do.
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So for all the female CFOs that are in my network, they're not thinking of,
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you know what, how can I get Kara in here?
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How can I get Kara in there? I'm having to teach them how to do that.
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Whereas men will be around wherever and say, oh, yeah, you need somebody for that. Mark's your guy.
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And next thing you know, Mark's got a contract with somebody that he didn't know.
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Women are just now learning how to do that more effectively.
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And there have been women this year that have really stood for me.
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And I'm so grateful. And men too.
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But that is something that we have to be more careful about.
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Because in my mind, I'm thinking, so you didn't hire me because I'm not smart.
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You didn't hire me because I'm not an expert. You didn't hire me because I can't provide tech stack.
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You hired me because I was too passionate. You didn't hire me because I was
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too passionate. Just think about that.
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It's crazy. I mean, it's hard for me to fathom. It was the reality and it's
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not the first time. Yeah.
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Well, and I will tell you that I'm fortunate to work with several female CEOs.
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And often I hear that. And so we often balance how do we kind of make the appropriated
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adjustments without losing that spark?
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Yeah. Because that passion is a strength. Yes. And without that strength,
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I mean, you're doing something radically different. How can you be anything
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less than radical? Yeah, totally.
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Totally. But that's the case for any new business. Yes. I think sometimes companies
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forget when they were small.
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And they were asking someone, or I shouldn't even say small,
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when they first started. Yes.
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Because I don't view us as small. I view us as powerful. Yes.
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You know, you get expertise in a powerful way and it's not a startup.
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Yes. This is 30 years of experience that you get on your site. Absolutely.
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But I think companies that are bigger think, well, they forget.
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Like somebody had to work with you.
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Somebody had to believe in your idea. Right. And so how are you paying it forward
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with companies like ours and being intentional like that?
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It's not a forever deal. Right. You could hire us for a year and be like,
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yeah, Curse Group didn't deliver. That's not going to be the case.
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But take a chance. You've got nothing to lose. Costs are going up no matter what.
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So you can either have someone who can really get in the weeds with you and
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help you figure it out, or you can continue to do it the same old way. And guess what?
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You're going to come back to me in two years and say, Kara, you were right.
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We're in a shitty situation now, so we really need your help. Yes, exactly.
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And I'm going to be like, join the club because you're on a wait list now.
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Yep. And a very interesting point because health insurance is that way. Yes.
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And it will because it doesn't take a whole lot of movement in the negative
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zone to really spike those rates.
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And that's outside of the things, what do I want to say, you can control or
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the government regulations that come down, programs that get administered.
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All of that has an impact.
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You know, I found even as now, you know,
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having been an entrepreneur and grown a business and then worked for a larger
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organization and grown that organization and now coming back out as an entrepreneur,
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healthcare, it's a real deal, Cara.
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I mean, it is the real deal. It's one of the most important investments.
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I had an uncle who was president of Del Webber and the Sahara Hotel back in
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the day. He's passed away.
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And one time he pulled me pulled me aside because he knew I loved business and
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he said Mark he goes let me just give you some advice this entrepreneurship
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never go without insurance,
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You need health insurance specifically. Yeah. You need health insurance.
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Make sure your health is covered. Yeah. And that stuck with me.
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And so there you are at the critical fulcrum.
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And how can you not be who you are? Yeah. That's right. This morning I got email
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and I have no idea where I signed up for this, but it was fascinating.
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And it was about medications that will be launching, are being pulled from the
00:16:31.196 --> 00:16:34.684
market, or they have a new biosimilar. Okay.
00:16:35.212 --> 00:16:40.616
And I thought, man, this is a really good thing for employers to ask their vendors
00:16:40.616 --> 00:16:45.050
about how they're going to handle it from a plan design perspective. Yes.
00:16:45.306 --> 00:16:49.496
So I crafted an email and attached that and sent it to all my Coffee with Kara
00:16:49.496 --> 00:16:53.920
participants. There's about 50 employers in that think, I call it kind of a think tank. Yeah.
00:16:54.460 --> 00:16:58.186
And I said, if you're fully insured, here's what you do. If you're self-insured,
00:16:58.186 --> 00:17:01.426
here's what you do. If you can't figure it out, call me, I'll help you.
00:17:01.891 --> 00:17:04.966
And one of the things that people say is like, well, Kara, aren't you afraid
00:17:04.966 --> 00:17:08.630
of giving away your advice to people who aren't your clients? And I'm not afraid.
00:17:08.897 --> 00:17:11.730
And the reason I'm not afraid is because no one can do it like I can.
00:17:12.186 --> 00:17:15.405
And I hate to, that is not coming from a place of arrogance.
00:17:15.527 --> 00:17:20.507
That is coming from a place of someone who's been a steward of the business for 30 years.
00:17:21.133 --> 00:17:23.286
Someone said to me once, well, I'm an expert in self-funding.
00:17:23.286 --> 00:17:26.595
And I said, okay, great. When's the last time you read an administrative services agreement?
00:17:27.386 --> 00:17:30.756
Then you're no expert because the terms and provisions of an administrative
00:17:30.756 --> 00:17:35.026
services agreement are locked keenly in this brain. And it is the reason why I'm an expert.
00:17:35.586 --> 00:17:38.666
It is the reason why I can find things that no one can find. Right.
00:17:39.888 --> 00:17:42.744
So get in the weeds. If you want to be an expert, you've got to get in the weeds.
00:17:43.052 --> 00:17:47.123
You would never go to get heart surgery from a primary care doctor.
00:17:48.043 --> 00:17:52.533
Not saying primary care is awesome. We need it, right? So we need people that
00:17:52.533 --> 00:17:57.889
aren't experts in something or are experts in something different. But you want an expert.
00:17:58.040 --> 00:18:02.093
You want someone who does 20 hearts a day, who knows exactly how the heart works,
00:18:02.093 --> 00:18:03.932
who's doing it at a facility that's high quality.
00:18:04.251 --> 00:18:07.563
You want all of that. Why would you treat your broker relationship any differently
00:18:07.563 --> 00:18:10.654
than that? You would never do that in any other part of your business.
00:18:11.072 --> 00:18:14.793
If your business was a company that built something, you would never buy subpar
00:18:14.793 --> 00:18:17.295
products to give to your customers.
00:18:17.644 --> 00:18:21.393
But you're using subpar service providers to give one of the most important
00:18:21.393 --> 00:18:22.243
things to your employees.
00:18:24.050 --> 00:18:26.983
It's like thinking about it differently. Yeah, it really is.
00:18:27.283 --> 00:18:30.763
And I love that. There's an analogy that just popped in my head.
00:18:30.763 --> 00:18:33.059
It was like, why did the Titanic sink?
00:18:33.605 --> 00:18:35.630
And the answer is it hit an iceberg.
00:18:36.199 --> 00:18:40.793
But if you go back to the manufacturing of the Titanic, when it came to the
00:18:40.793 --> 00:18:44.233
little rivets that held the steel hole onto the ship,
00:18:44.948 --> 00:18:49.936
they skimped. They bought lesser material on the rivets. So that ship should
00:18:49.936 --> 00:18:52.476
have been able to withstand that particular iceberg.
00:18:52.956 --> 00:18:57.376
But because the rivets were faulty and of less quality, what happened was it
00:18:57.376 --> 00:18:58.793
hit and the rivets popped.
00:18:59.113 --> 00:19:02.526
The steel hole decayed and boom, the rest is history.
00:19:02.950 --> 00:19:06.356
And so when I think about what you're building and how you're trying to get
00:19:06.356 --> 00:19:10.107
that across, you're like a rivet that's not the fake stuff.
00:19:10.339 --> 00:19:13.248
It's the real stuff. And I think when it comes to health care.
00:19:14.056 --> 00:19:18.116
What is it? Is a percent of our business expense for an organization, 30 to 50?
00:19:18.316 --> 00:19:23.876
Top three, top five. Yeah, it's a big percentage. Yeah, your analogy makes me think of something.
00:19:24.316 --> 00:19:27.486
So one of the things that I don't do, and we don't do at the Curse Group,
00:19:27.486 --> 00:19:29.856
is we're not here to disparage anyone, okay?
00:19:30.436 --> 00:19:34.506
I believe that most people, whatever business they're in, but I'll use mine
00:19:34.506 --> 00:19:37.355
as the example, brokers want to do a good job.
00:19:37.976 --> 00:19:41.556
And I get asked a lot by employers, well, why isn't our broker doing that?
00:19:41.789 --> 00:19:46.516
Yes. The system is working exactly as it was set up to work. Okay.
00:19:47.136 --> 00:19:56.487
So most firms are run at a very large margin and their people are stretched incredibly thin. Yes.
00:19:56.847 --> 00:20:00.132
So it wouldn't matter if they wanted to spend time with you.
00:20:00.730 --> 00:20:05.670
If they did that, the next day they would have 200 emails that they have to respond to. Yes.
00:20:06.181 --> 00:20:10.396
So they are not going to choose the fun stuff, the good stuff,
00:20:11.016 --> 00:20:15.116
strategy, innovation, making a difference, doing something that might take a
00:20:15.116 --> 00:20:18.456
little bit longer because it impacts their life. Yes.
00:20:19.643 --> 00:20:23.290
They can't do it. And so it's not because they're not good.
00:20:23.911 --> 00:20:27.571
It's not because they aren't smart. It's not because they don't want to do good work.
00:20:27.571 --> 00:20:33.771
In fact, I would argue that employees in big firms are so unhappy and don't
00:20:33.771 --> 00:20:38.411
know how to get out because of their comp or their benefits or whatever they
00:20:38.411 --> 00:20:40.047
feel like they're just stuck with,
00:20:40.729 --> 00:20:42.691
that they don't feel like there's a way out.
00:20:43.225 --> 00:20:46.480
And there is a way out. Yeah. But that's hard.
00:20:47.194 --> 00:20:50.410
And we all know that hard things are hard for people. Yes.
00:20:50.555 --> 00:20:53.521
You know, they might be easier for me, but for other people,
00:20:53.521 --> 00:20:58.398
not so much. And so I'm not here to tell employers like your broker's not good. Right.
00:20:58.833 --> 00:21:01.591
What I am here to say is that costs are going up.
00:21:02.204 --> 00:21:07.091
It's very complex. In those two situations, you need an advisor who has the
00:21:07.091 --> 00:21:09.891
time to spend with you and can teach you what to do.
00:21:10.271 --> 00:21:15.677
Yes. If you don't, the risk is that complexity and that cost is going to eat you.
00:21:16.055 --> 00:21:21.651
Yes. And it just will. Felt that. We're expecting this next year the largest
00:21:21.651 --> 00:21:25.192
increase in healthcare costs for employers that we've seen in 17 years.
00:21:25.892 --> 00:21:29.959
And there's reasons for that. You know, hospitals and physicians now have AI
00:21:29.959 --> 00:21:33.949
in their office to make sure that they can bill for every single thing that you're in there for.
00:21:34.639 --> 00:21:38.579
It's totally different. If you have, if you're having twins and they do ultrasounds
00:21:38.579 --> 00:21:42.812
every week, you're getting charged double because they charge double for a twin ultrasound.
00:21:43.375 --> 00:21:47.739
Okay. If you're having a mastectomy and they want to use cadaver skin instead
00:21:47.739 --> 00:21:52.751
of your skin, the plan's getting billed a multiple of what it would be if it were your skin.
00:21:53.629 --> 00:21:58.759
So there are things happening in the system that unless employers have their
00:21:58.759 --> 00:22:04.128
eye on the ball and part of that ball is their broker, it's not going to be good. Yeah.
00:22:04.331 --> 00:22:08.589
Well, and Kara, I'm just reflecting back on my time in the suite as I sat there
00:22:08.589 --> 00:22:10.506
and was in charge of plans like that.
00:22:10.860 --> 00:22:15.149
That's exactly why I liked working with you. I don't have time to learn that.
00:22:15.149 --> 00:22:17.429
I mean, I just learned it right now when you said that. I'm like,
00:22:17.429 --> 00:22:18.708
oh, didn't think about that.
00:22:19.062 --> 00:22:22.199
But you're absolutely right. AI in there is going to make their billing more
00:22:22.199 --> 00:22:24.785
efficient. And at the same time.
00:22:25.881 --> 00:22:29.126
The physicians and the medical community is getting, you know,
00:22:29.370 --> 00:22:34.641
also trying to make money and trying to figure out ways to kind of increase their bottom line.
00:22:34.919 --> 00:22:37.929
So I think it's really important that we all kind of bind together.
00:22:37.929 --> 00:22:40.753
But to my point is you need an expert.
00:22:41.067 --> 00:22:44.556
Yes, you do. And you need someone that is unafraid.
00:22:45.130 --> 00:22:47.879
So I went to a board meeting this week. I'll share this with you.
00:22:47.879 --> 00:22:52.265
And I've had a good amount of rejection through this process.
00:22:52.619 --> 00:22:56.979
And good news is God made me incredibly strong, but it doesn't mean I don't
00:22:56.979 --> 00:23:01.384
get mad when I don't win. Yes. Okay. Cause I do. And especially get mad when the reason is dumb.
00:23:02.081 --> 00:23:06.529
And so anyway, yesterday I learned that I think the board meeting was on Wednesday
00:23:06.529 --> 00:23:09.839
actually. So I learned they did a broker RFP. It's a public entity.
00:23:10.315 --> 00:23:14.999
Did you know, none of the bidding brokers showed up on the day of the reading.
00:23:14.999 --> 00:23:16.126
I was the only broker there.
00:23:16.370 --> 00:23:19.870
Wow. It was a hundred thousand dollar broker compensation deal.
00:23:20.609 --> 00:23:23.845
None of them showed up that day. Now, just think about that. Yeah.
00:23:24.689 --> 00:23:30.839
That's not okay. Right. Okay. I agree. And so then the directors announce who
00:23:30.839 --> 00:23:31.852
they're going to pick, fine.
00:23:32.311 --> 00:23:36.139
And the commissioners who are voting are like, okay, yeah. One of the commissioners
00:23:36.139 --> 00:23:37.727
asks a couple of key questions.
00:23:38.087 --> 00:23:42.481
Is the broker going to take bonuses and will they be a co-fiduciary?
00:23:42.940 --> 00:23:45.436
One of the other commissioners says, why do we care about that?
00:23:46.448 --> 00:23:50.964
Now, Kara Kirsch is like, okay, I got to reach out to him so I can teach him
00:23:51.237 --> 00:23:54.622
because he's using taxpayer money, not just in the role he's in,
00:23:54.622 --> 00:23:56.502
but in his other role as a commissioner.
00:23:56.966 --> 00:24:01.448
So like now I have a responsibility. Responsibility is one of my Gallup strengths.
00:24:01.715 --> 00:24:05.022
And so I am like a dog with a bone when it comes to responsibility.
00:24:05.822 --> 00:24:09.742
And so they invited their broker, the winning broker, to a Zoom call to answer
00:24:09.742 --> 00:24:12.062
these questions. Fine. So the broker gets on and they say, yep,
00:24:12.062 --> 00:24:15.612
they kind of him-haw around. Yeah, we take bonuses, but we don't.
00:24:15.844 --> 00:24:18.866
It doesn't conflict with our ability to consult you, blah, blah, blah.
00:24:19.360 --> 00:24:21.512
And then they say, well, are you a co-fiduciary? And they said,
00:24:21.512 --> 00:24:27.392
yes, Nebraska state law precludes you from taking bonuses if you are a co-fiduciary.
00:24:27.392 --> 00:24:30.465
So they flat out lied on the record.
00:24:31.082 --> 00:24:33.257
Now, Kara Kirsch has a choice.
00:24:34.003 --> 00:24:39.670
What can Kara Kirsch do? So Kara Kirsch for the past two days has been real
00:24:39.670 --> 00:24:41.218
fired up about this. Yes.
00:24:41.567 --> 00:24:44.760
Okay. Because I didn't get the business. Right. Somebody else got the business.
00:24:44.760 --> 00:24:47.784
And when they were asked directly if they were a co-fiduciary, they said yes.
00:24:47.981 --> 00:24:51.650
But they also said they take bonuses in Nebraska state law. That is illegal.
00:24:52.751 --> 00:24:59.330
So I've thought a lot about it. And I am going to do something.
00:25:00.074 --> 00:25:03.840
But not in the spirit of me getting the business. Right. I'm going to do it
00:25:03.840 --> 00:25:07.730
in the spirit of making sure that the commissioners understand,
00:25:07.730 --> 00:25:09.460
number one, why that question was asked.
00:25:10.168 --> 00:25:16.129
And number two, what effect that lack of transparency has on the plan.
00:25:16.477 --> 00:25:20.720
Yes. So when brokers get bonuses, money, last time I checked,
00:25:20.720 --> 00:25:22.056
Mark, does not come from thin air.
00:25:22.670 --> 00:25:26.316
I agree. It makes the system more expensive. It does. Right?
00:25:26.879 --> 00:25:32.830
And so if they're going to take bonuses, that ultimately leads to cost in the system.
00:25:33.833 --> 00:25:39.120
And if this is a public entity using taxpayer dollars to serve our most vulnerable
00:25:39.120 --> 00:25:43.243
community members, don't you think they should have to redo their bid? Yeah.
00:25:43.813 --> 00:25:46.942
Yeah. Don't you think the lying bidder should be kicked out?
00:25:47.603 --> 00:25:50.890
Yeah. Quite frankly, I don't care about any of that. What I do care about is
00:25:50.890 --> 00:25:52.200
that they're held accountable. Yeah.
00:25:53.047 --> 00:25:57.847
One of the things I wanted to talk about, too, is I know that you've launched,
00:25:58.474 --> 00:26:00.839
and now you're evolving. Yeah.
00:26:01.419 --> 00:26:05.869
Tell us a little bit about what you're evolving to and what other niches you're
00:26:05.869 --> 00:26:08.842
starting to feel or fill at the Curse Group.
00:26:09.370 --> 00:26:12.660
It's interesting because when I launched, I thought we'll be a broker firm.
00:26:13.119 --> 00:26:16.898
Now, we'll be different because we won't take bonuses and overrides and incentives.
00:26:17.473 --> 00:26:21.609
But this co-fiduciary idea is new because I'm like, that's going to be a differentiator.
00:26:21.609 --> 00:26:25.832
I think there's five firms in the country, including us. That is a different industry. Huge.
00:26:26.035 --> 00:26:30.298
In fact, I just conducted what is our second new line of service I'll share,
00:26:30.687 --> 00:26:35.449
and none of their bidders can agree to be a co-fiduciary, and they were all the global firms. Okay.
00:26:36.196 --> 00:26:40.639
So the Kirsch Group launched as a broker firm, serving employers with 50,000
00:26:40.639 --> 00:26:43.489
to 3,000 employees. That was always the target. And the reason that was the
00:26:43.489 --> 00:26:46.836
target is because that's where strategy happens, and that's what I'm best at. Yes.
00:26:47.341 --> 00:26:53.489
So over time, I got asked by my network, hey, Cara, we have this big global
00:26:53.489 --> 00:26:55.892
piece that you don't really have experience in.
00:26:56.506 --> 00:27:00.639
Will you run our broker RFP independently to ensure that, A,
00:27:00.639 --> 00:27:04.399
we don't have to screw around with it, and B, it's perceived as independent
00:27:04.399 --> 00:27:06.293
should the DOL come knocking? Okay.
00:27:06.763 --> 00:27:13.289
Great. I said, yep, got you. So I'm doing independent broker RFP work for employers
00:27:13.289 --> 00:27:16.459
who believe that we're not a good fit for them. Wow. Okay?
00:27:16.859 --> 00:27:20.729
So we don't participate in the bid. It is a bid that we conduct on behalf of
00:27:20.729 --> 00:27:21.989
the employer. So just think about that.
00:27:22.500 --> 00:27:25.733
We set up the RFP. We run the Q&A.
00:27:25.977 --> 00:27:29.399
We make sure that they've responded to all the questions. We create the scorecard.
00:27:29.399 --> 00:27:32.199
We create the finalist mechanisms if they choose to do interviews,
00:27:32.199 --> 00:27:33.506
and we help them make the selection.
00:27:34.231 --> 00:27:39.293
The third part of that is we do fiduciary oversight advisory services.
00:27:39.915 --> 00:27:44.329
So what that looks like is that looks like an employer who says,
00:27:44.329 --> 00:27:48.699
hey, fiduciary responsibility is important to us. It starts there because not
00:27:48.699 --> 00:27:49.837
everybody cares about that. Right.
00:27:50.995 --> 00:27:54.036
And they say, but we have a broker and we have a really good relationship with
00:27:54.036 --> 00:27:56.190
them. Like, I can't imagine anything would be wrong.
00:27:56.829 --> 00:28:01.525
And so as I meet with people, and remember I said I share my knowledge freely,
00:28:02.227 --> 00:28:07.272
they start to think, huh, we're not getting that. Yeah, that's not happening over here.
00:28:07.933 --> 00:28:12.815
So we've been hired to do fiduciary oversight and it can work a couple of ways.
00:28:13.198 --> 00:28:19.194
One is that client can have us work directly with our broker and that's been the case.
00:28:19.415 --> 00:28:22.716
And that broker we work with, to get, I've said to that broker,
00:28:22.716 --> 00:28:25.522
I want you to keep this business. Like this is yours.
00:28:25.911 --> 00:28:30.386
I don't intend to compete for it. I intend to support you. Now they're making their own bed.
00:28:31.303 --> 00:28:34.826
Okay. And some employers want us to work with them and they'll work with their
00:28:34.826 --> 00:28:35.866
broker, which is fine too.
00:28:36.354 --> 00:28:39.651
But what we do is number one, we help them set up a benefits committee,
00:28:39.808 --> 00:28:43.436
kind of like a retirement committee that has a cadence meeting notes,
00:28:43.436 --> 00:28:45.735
agenda items that are important to cover, et cetera.
00:28:46.370 --> 00:28:51.745
We help them set up a good vendor review process and contract SharePoint.
00:28:52.238 --> 00:28:54.386
Most employers don't have their contracts in order.
00:28:54.984 --> 00:28:58.836
So one of the clients we serve doesn't have two of them. They don't have a PBM
00:28:58.836 --> 00:29:01.933
contract, a pharmacy benefit management contract for their self-funded plan.
00:29:02.650 --> 00:29:08.264
Problem. Yep. Never would you be in business, Mr. Employer, with any company
00:29:08.484 --> 00:29:10.550
without a contract. Mm-hmm.
00:29:11.506 --> 00:29:15.270
So, like, these are things that I'm like, oh, my, Lanta.
00:29:15.433 --> 00:29:20.316
Yes. You know, and then we go from there to look at data and data integrity.
00:29:20.316 --> 00:29:23.346
And are they looking at their claims in the way that built strategy?
00:29:23.346 --> 00:29:26.719
And so all of those things come into play.
00:29:27.224 --> 00:29:32.612
And those customers are like, damn, I didn't know that this was how we do it.
00:29:32.943 --> 00:29:36.582
But if you give them grace, they don't have a time either. Right.
00:29:36.989 --> 00:29:39.897
They don't have, they're counting on their broker, but here's the truth.
00:29:40.315 --> 00:29:45.824
If the DOL comes knocking, your broker holds no skin in that game.
00:29:46.097 --> 00:29:50.218
You are standing alone. Yes. And so if you're standing alone,
00:29:50.491 --> 00:29:54.607
you best well make sure that your I's are dotted and your T's are crossed.
00:29:55.940 --> 00:29:58.387
A couple of thoughts that just popped in my mind. First of all,
00:29:58.387 --> 00:30:03.793
it was like hard stop, like double click on this because as a CHRO,
00:30:04.246 --> 00:30:08.901
I recognize how much bandwidth it takes to go through the broker process.
00:30:10.227 --> 00:30:16.027
And so to be able to outsource that and to be able, it does two things that
00:30:16.027 --> 00:30:18.967
I see. One, saves right off the top.
00:30:20.116 --> 00:30:24.327
Two, it gives an expert in the seat instead of- Someone who's been in the walls.
00:30:24.327 --> 00:30:27.146
Exactly. Yeah, exactly. Who knows the game, right?
00:30:27.907 --> 00:30:31.497
And we get educated. So we know the game. We know where to push back.
00:30:31.497 --> 00:30:35.987
I mean, I always had a standard complain, grumble and cry. And then,
00:30:35.987 --> 00:30:37.096
you know, we'll get down there.
00:30:37.867 --> 00:30:41.839
But you know the game. You know what needs to happen. You're saving time,
00:30:42.187 --> 00:30:47.972
energy and effort, and you're delivering a clean RFP process. That's crazy to me.
00:30:48.234 --> 00:30:50.376
That saves so much. It's so valuable.
00:30:50.683 --> 00:30:56.757
The other thing is, as the rates come back, there's something interesting from
00:30:56.757 --> 00:31:01.532
a CHRO perspective that the organization needs.
00:31:03.682 --> 00:31:08.614
Outsource with the best and now they understand that their information's good
00:31:08.614 --> 00:31:13.544
because a lot of times that chro gets blamed for negative health outcomes and
00:31:13.544 --> 00:31:18.009
why that plan is so a lot of times we spend answering the question well,
00:31:18.476 --> 00:31:22.134
you know you just don't manage to plan good you just stink right and we're all
00:31:22.134 --> 00:31:25.984
working with brokers right yeah but but the key is to have someone independent
00:31:25.984 --> 00:31:27.910
like that boy i see a lot of upside
00:31:28.142 --> 00:31:32.114
and a lot of freedom for people that are sitting in seats like that or similar
00:31:32.114 --> 00:31:34.899
because a lot, sometimes it gets pushed down a few levels,
00:31:35.230 --> 00:31:38.829
but that same person has the same thing. Wow. You could have an expert on your side.
00:31:39.125 --> 00:31:45.094
So, so I mean, in everything that you just said, again, radical, but really helpful.
00:31:45.514 --> 00:31:48.194
And right here in Nebraska. And right here in Nebraska. So like,
00:31:48.194 --> 00:31:51.438
if you think about Nebraska and you grew up in Nebraska.
00:31:52.194 --> 00:31:56.164
Yeah. I grew up in a small town in Nebraska. And so I love Nebraska.
00:31:56.164 --> 00:32:00.777
I've moved away many times. So I've lived lots of places, but I come back to this.
00:32:01.183 --> 00:32:05.724
Nebraska is rich in resource. We are rich in things that other people are not
00:32:05.724 --> 00:32:09.734
rich in. Do I think we'll do business across the country? Yes, we are currently. Yeah.
00:32:10.105 --> 00:32:12.149
But these are my people.
00:32:12.734 --> 00:32:17.634
I care about the economy here. Yeah. If Union Pacific is having healthcare struggles,
00:32:17.634 --> 00:32:22.384
if Kiewit's having healthcare struggles, and if Elfco is having healthcare struggles,
00:32:22.384 --> 00:32:27.204
all different size companies, all different industries, you can call me. Yeah.
00:32:27.419 --> 00:32:32.904
I will help you it doesn't have to be complicated yes but you do have to have
00:32:32.904 --> 00:32:37.414
someone who is an expert and can navigate i think the biggest thing on the rfp
00:32:37.414 --> 00:32:40.028
front that was interesting to me was.
00:32:40.916 --> 00:32:44.304
Each of the brokers participating in the bid yeah they all wanted to have a
00:32:44.304 --> 00:32:49.036
call with me okay and i love that because that was a tactic i used to yeah and,
00:32:49.629 --> 00:32:52.734
it was all like oh the rf you know just this sort of i call it,
00:32:54.118 --> 00:32:57.829
head, head tapping, especially it happens to women like, oh,
00:32:57.829 --> 00:33:01.499
good girl. You did. You did so good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I'm always,
00:33:01.499 --> 00:33:06.619
I'm listening and I'm like, there was one woman of the four firms that led the
00:33:06.619 --> 00:33:08.489
team. So just think about that too.
00:33:08.855 --> 00:33:14.049
There were three teams led by men, only male teams and one led by a woman.
00:33:15.519 --> 00:33:20.854
And that's important to me. Like, how are we being intentional about supporting?
00:33:21.063 --> 00:33:28.932
And it's not to say that we're asking for less because we're looking at other groups of people.
00:33:29.112 --> 00:33:32.879
It's that we're being intentional about elevating experts in other groups of
00:33:32.879 --> 00:33:35.429
people, which is what I'm asking people to do when they choose us.
00:33:35.769 --> 00:33:37.369
Because we are 100% female owned.
00:33:38.049 --> 00:33:43.399
And so it has been very interesting. The fiduciary process makes me very sad
00:33:43.399 --> 00:33:48.274
for employers. And I often have to say to my clients on behalf of the industry, I'm sorry.
00:33:48.425 --> 00:33:52.602
Yeah and one of my clients called me this week and she said why is it like this,
00:33:53.132 --> 00:33:56.989
why do i feel like even though i keep on saying like what was the three things you said big,
00:33:57.618 --> 00:34:02.519
big plead and cry yeah like she's almost in crying because she's like i've talked
00:34:02.519 --> 00:34:05.489
to them and talked to them and talked to them about the importance of sending
00:34:05.489 --> 00:34:09.209
our materials two days in advance and all these things and i said you know why
00:34:09.209 --> 00:34:11.794
they can't do it they don't have enough time yeah,
00:34:12.402 --> 00:34:14.881
yeah she goes well how do i fix that and i said here's how we fix it,
00:34:15.560 --> 00:34:20.419
when you do your bid next year we're going to put their fees at risk if they don't deliver.
00:34:21.475 --> 00:34:26.517
That's the best way to hit it. So now their company, I always say innovation,
00:34:26.517 --> 00:34:29.132
pain, innovation comes from pain.
00:34:29.666 --> 00:34:32.367
Think about the things in our lives that are better than they were when we were kids.
00:34:33.207 --> 00:34:36.928
Innovation came from pain. What is pain for brokers?
00:34:37.154 --> 00:34:41.560
Money, lost money, lost clients, lost people.
00:34:42.527 --> 00:34:46.007
So how do you respond to that? Clearly, it's not been painful enough. Right.
00:34:46.552 --> 00:34:50.877
Right. Well, we're about to put the pain in the system and make sure that people
00:34:50.877 --> 00:34:52.072
are held accountable. Yeah.
00:34:52.240 --> 00:34:55.997
For the work that they're doing or not doing. And again, I say not here to disparage
00:34:55.997 --> 00:34:58.707
anyone. Right. Step up or step out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:34:59.299 --> 00:35:01.743
I'm fired up. That's exactly right. I'm real fired up.
00:35:02.707 --> 00:35:07.838
And so let's talk about this. So plans for growth. Yeah. You started out.
00:35:09.234 --> 00:35:13.967
An idea yeah typical entrepreneur it's now morphing into something uh-huh,
00:35:14.824 --> 00:35:19.453
where do you see yourself in five years ten years five years,
00:35:20.080 --> 00:35:25.364
well i'll start with the latter question okay so i'm 53 okay i plan with god's
00:35:25.364 --> 00:35:31.926
good grace to work till i'm 67 okay i plan to have an employee-owned firm okay that is not sold,
00:35:32.600 --> 00:35:37.284
because i want to build generational wealth for my people yes okay so So that's
00:35:37.284 --> 00:35:38.387
first and foremost. Okay.
00:35:38.864 --> 00:35:44.324
At 67, I want to be able to consult, but not be in the day-to-day. Okay. Okay?
00:35:44.981 --> 00:35:51.377
And I want to create a legacy of some type for our state and our community and women in our state.
00:35:52.082 --> 00:35:58.094
In the next five years, I see us as having 20 employees. Okay.
00:35:58.717 --> 00:36:03.082
So growth to sustain that. Remember I said our model isn't burn and turn. Right.
00:36:03.285 --> 00:36:08.024
We're picking, we're hand-picking people. Yes. The first employee we picked, handpicked.
00:36:08.992 --> 00:36:11.664
And she wasn't picked because she worked at a broker for 20 years.
00:36:12.164 --> 00:36:15.504
She was picked because she's smart. Because I can teach all the rest of the stuff.
00:36:16.339 --> 00:36:19.427
Remember, I said, I have tech stack. We're about efficiency here.
00:36:20.299 --> 00:36:22.984
We're not asking people to come in who have all the knowledge because a lot
00:36:22.984 --> 00:36:24.965
of times they have a lot of baggage and I don't want that.
00:36:25.847 --> 00:36:31.333
So 20 employees, lots of happy employer customers in all three lanes that we
00:36:31.333 --> 00:36:35.078
serve, full broker services, RFP support, and fiduciary support.
00:36:35.478 --> 00:36:40.183
I'm telling myself a story, and the story is that people who use our fiduciary
00:36:40.183 --> 00:36:43.133
support who thought we weren't the right fit for them because of our size are
00:36:43.133 --> 00:36:46.373
going to be like, yeah, this is stupid. Why are we paying someone else and her?
00:36:46.373 --> 00:36:49.079
We'll just have her. Right. Brilliant.
00:36:50.573 --> 00:36:54.753
And if we need a broker to market our ancillary coverages and she can't do it
00:36:54.753 --> 00:36:57.793
because she doesn't have time, we'll hire a broker as a project based and have them do it.
00:36:58.984 --> 00:37:03.576
Now you're being smart about how you're using your vendors.
00:37:03.994 --> 00:37:07.403
And I don't like to think of brokers as vendors. They're partners if they really
00:37:07.403 --> 00:37:08.633
are showing up as partners.
00:37:09.178 --> 00:37:12.673
But if I were your attorney partner, do you think you wouldn't have a contract?
00:37:13.933 --> 00:37:17.155
If I were your accounting partner and I forgot to file your taxes,
00:37:17.439 --> 00:37:19.313
what would you say? You're fired.
00:37:20.069 --> 00:37:24.433
Yes, exactly. So there would be no, oh man, you were stretched really thin.
00:37:24.433 --> 00:37:27.503
Like, sorry that you couldn't get our taxes filed on time. Right.
00:37:27.503 --> 00:37:28.833
Mark, how do you feel about that?
00:37:29.173 --> 00:37:32.633
You know what, Joe, it's okay. Let's get some golf going and we'll be fine.
00:37:32.973 --> 00:37:38.203
I'm being funny, but. Exactly. No, we're not letting that happen.
00:37:38.203 --> 00:37:39.460
Yeah. You're fired. Yeah.
00:37:40.023 --> 00:37:42.633
And if they're not fired, guess what? The CHRO is fired.
00:37:43.353 --> 00:37:46.643
So somebody's getting fired. Somebody gets fired for those kind of things.
00:37:46.643 --> 00:37:48.811
Absolutely. Love your vision.
00:37:49.693 --> 00:37:54.059
Love where it's going. Now let's just talk about Kara as a leader.
00:37:55.124 --> 00:37:58.844
Since launching, tell me about you. What's changed?
00:38:00.191 --> 00:38:04.170
Kara didn't used to be a very good leader. Kara is demanding,
00:38:04.455 --> 00:38:09.033
has high expectations, is Gen X, was raised by a military father,
00:38:09.981 --> 00:38:14.590
has had some bad leaders in my experience that have been minimizing and mean.
00:38:15.728 --> 00:38:16.564
And so...
00:38:17.901 --> 00:38:20.699
I would say my early leadership days was command and control.
00:38:20.902 --> 00:38:26.761
Okay. I have no reason to basically, you know, not say that.
00:38:26.900 --> 00:38:29.478
Because I believe it was. Looking back on it, it was like.
00:38:31.591 --> 00:38:40.493
Ew. I bet you got stuff done, Kara. Gross. And now, like, we're doing employee benefits.
00:38:41.111 --> 00:38:43.431
Okay? No one's carrying a heart in their purse.
00:38:44.712 --> 00:38:48.931
Yeah. Right? When my employee comes and says her baby is sick,
00:38:50.036 --> 00:38:51.539
go take care of your baby. Yeah.
00:38:52.175 --> 00:38:55.621
When she says, my husband and I are thinking about having another baby,
00:38:55.621 --> 00:38:56.877
what would be a good time for you?
00:38:57.912 --> 00:39:02.050
Not my concern. Yeah. Have a baby when it's a good time for you. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
00:39:02.657 --> 00:39:07.154
When she needs coaching, we stop the bus and talk about it.
00:39:07.822 --> 00:39:11.681
We don't, people know where they stand. Right. There's none of this emails on
00:39:11.681 --> 00:39:13.591
Sunday that say meet me in the office tomorrow.
00:39:13.591 --> 00:39:17.051
Right. so you can not sleep for the whole night we're not doing that very nice
00:39:17.051 --> 00:39:22.941
so my leadership is evolving it's growing it's changing it's led with more heart
00:39:22.941 --> 00:39:27.083
than ever before it's more understanding,
00:39:27.911 --> 00:39:35.004
it's it still is very very high expectation led sure i have extremely high expectations
00:39:35.178 --> 00:39:40.159
yeah but i'm also keenly aware of the fact i don't have a heart in my purse yeah.
00:39:41.447 --> 00:39:47.417
That I'm transplanting. Yeah, the crazy ones, which are those visionary entrepreneurs.
00:39:47.417 --> 00:39:51.607
I have that sign in my office. Because I was like, I'm not calling you crazy.
00:39:51.607 --> 00:39:54.047
No, I am a crazy one. And hire the divas.
00:39:54.387 --> 00:39:57.803
Like, I am a diva. Yeah, you have that vision.
00:39:58.467 --> 00:40:01.861
You're trying to change the industry for the better.
00:40:02.476 --> 00:40:06.302
The Kirsch Group has doubled down on being that change agent.
00:40:06.726 --> 00:40:12.188
So you have to have all of that. And yet, you're transforming from command control.
00:40:12.606 --> 00:40:15.073
What is this, Kara, in front of me now?
00:40:15.887 --> 00:40:20.391
Well, this Kara is— You said a lot of heart, but what would you call it? This person is at peace.
00:40:20.763 --> 00:40:24.205
I have so much peace, even though I get fired up.
00:40:24.820 --> 00:40:30.549
And that's what I was built to do. Yeah. You know? Well, it's just caring, right? Yeah.
00:40:30.677 --> 00:40:35.461
And I always cared. Absolutely. But the thing about me that is different is,
00:40:36.029 --> 00:40:42.966
I was raised to go to work, get your work done, do your very best, go, leave.
00:40:43.198 --> 00:40:48.162
I was never a person that I always said, you know, there's a separation of church and state.
00:40:48.289 --> 00:40:51.127
In fact, a leader told me once to not say that because it was off-putting.
00:40:51.127 --> 00:40:52.382
And I was like, what are you talking about?
00:40:53.533 --> 00:40:58.707
But at any rate, because I think for women, we're not allowed to show up in that way.
00:40:59.047 --> 00:41:03.117
We're expected to do all this chit-chat and story sharing and all this.
00:41:03.414 --> 00:41:04.975
That's never going to be me. Yeah.
00:41:05.515 --> 00:41:08.156
But that doesn't mean that people who work with me...
00:41:08.806 --> 00:41:12.698
Don't feel compassion. So I'm always going to be a person that's like,
00:41:13.030 --> 00:41:14.975
what's the deliverable? When's it due?
00:41:15.212 --> 00:41:18.729
Do you have what you need to get it done? Yeah. In fact, I've even had to share
00:41:18.729 --> 00:41:23.877
with my own team, like, this voice of Kara, it doesn't have any feeling in it.
00:41:24.051 --> 00:41:26.008
Meaning, I'm not upset. Right.
00:41:26.530 --> 00:41:30.443
Because sometimes people will hear me speak and say, oh, she's pissed. Right. No.
00:41:30.953 --> 00:41:35.777
This is my work voice. Right. If we were out having a tea in the afternoon,
00:41:36.079 --> 00:41:37.719
it would be a different Kara voice.
00:41:38.199 --> 00:41:42.836
Okay. But it's still Kara. Yeah. And Kara is someone who cares about people,
00:41:43.405 --> 00:41:47.509
who is compassionate, who wants people to be successful, who want to be successful,
00:41:47.509 --> 00:41:53.024
because not everybody does, who wants to push, who wants to think and listen.
00:41:53.697 --> 00:41:57.239
Yesterday, I had a prospect meeting, Mark, and it was my best one since I've
00:41:57.621 --> 00:42:00.704
launched. Oh, exciting. And someone asked me why.
00:42:01.336 --> 00:42:03.409
And I said, because I listened more than I talked.
00:42:04.141 --> 00:42:08.816
Now, I've always been a good listener. Yeah. But I think about that in parallel
00:42:08.816 --> 00:42:11.936
to the meeting of the client I didn't get because they said I was too passionate. Yeah.
00:42:12.256 --> 00:42:14.497
Maybe if I had listened a little bit more, I would have got it.
00:42:15.054 --> 00:42:17.436
And will they come back around? Yeah, because remember what I said,
00:42:17.436 --> 00:42:18.654
costs aren't going down. Yeah.
00:42:19.596 --> 00:42:22.946
You're right. They're coming back. I don't know when. Five years,
00:42:22.946 --> 00:42:25.055
two years, one month, doesn't matter. Right.
00:42:25.426 --> 00:42:28.166
But it does matter what I learned. So I'm very introspective.
00:42:28.294 --> 00:42:30.528
I pray. I journal. I write.
00:42:31.109 --> 00:42:34.326
I write a lot about my crazy ideas so that they don't come out.
00:42:34.899 --> 00:42:37.226
Okay. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Because you know how sometimes we can
00:42:37.226 --> 00:42:39.456
be like, oh, well, we should do this. Yes. We should do this.
00:42:39.456 --> 00:42:42.336
I totally do. It's too much for people. Yes. They cannot take it.
00:42:42.856 --> 00:42:46.586
So I've got a notebook filled with, let's do this. Let's do this.
00:42:46.586 --> 00:42:48.581
Let's do this. And sometimes I'll look back at it and think,
00:42:48.767 --> 00:42:51.656
well, that was stupid. Yeah. Good thing I didn't talk about that out in the
00:42:51.656 --> 00:42:53.010
open. That would have cost me. Yeah.
00:42:53.504 --> 00:42:59.579
Wow. And so what is your routine like? So I know you lead.
00:42:59.846 --> 00:43:07.744
I mean, you're a leader in Nebraska, and you lead Ignite, and you lead the Curse Group.
00:43:08.231 --> 00:43:13.719
So what's your routine, and how are you proactive about you being the best version of yourself?
00:43:15.076 --> 00:43:18.900
I took a lot of things that I adapted in COVID and I kept them.
00:43:19.603 --> 00:43:23.844
Okay. Interesting. So someone, I had my largest new business growth year during
00:43:23.844 --> 00:43:26.644
COVID, which seems crazy. Yeah. But I did. Okay.
00:43:27.639 --> 00:43:32.247
And I, I attribute it to these things. I was outside more.
00:43:33.269 --> 00:43:36.654
I cooked. I love to cook and I love to take care of my home.
00:43:36.654 --> 00:43:40.111
I'm very domestic. Okay. I like to be at home. Yeah.
00:43:40.784 --> 00:43:44.221
I like to walk. I like to grow things, plants otherwise.
00:43:44.877 --> 00:43:47.364
And someone said, why was that such a successful year for you?
00:43:47.364 --> 00:43:51.237
And I'm like, I had to really think about it. I woke up at 7 every day.
00:43:52.044 --> 00:43:57.941
I didn't, I wasn't scurrying around all the time. I wasn't not drinking water.
00:43:58.595 --> 00:44:04.834
I wasn't not sleeping. I was doing all the things that actually make our body more powerful.
00:44:05.979 --> 00:44:08.649
Okay. And I do those things to this day.
00:44:09.689 --> 00:44:16.995
So, you know, I'm not a big TV watcher. I do believe that what you put in your brain matters.
00:44:17.344 --> 00:44:18.981
And I'm not a negative self-talker.
00:44:19.973 --> 00:44:22.501
I'm not like, oh, Kara, now you've bit off more than you can chew.
00:44:22.501 --> 00:44:24.809
Now, do I remanade sometimes? Absolutely.
00:44:25.504 --> 00:44:29.497
But for the most part, I wake up in the day and I'm like, first of all,
00:44:29.683 --> 00:44:31.042
thank you for letting me wake up today.
00:44:31.994 --> 00:44:35.461
Secondly, whose ass am I going to kick today? Yeah, I love that.
00:44:35.461 --> 00:44:39.571
That's so awesome. But you know what I mean? Like, I'm excited.
00:44:40.393 --> 00:44:45.280
My mind does not stop but i also spend time with my kids,
00:44:45.974 --> 00:44:51.031
i am present for them i show up to the relationships that are most important
00:44:51.031 --> 00:44:55.953
to me that need me and i make them a priority and everything else will be just fine,
00:44:56.668 --> 00:45:00.931
wow i love it now i will say that one of my primary goals right now is to become
00:45:00.931 --> 00:45:05.172
better at managing my time i was always a really really good time manager yeah
00:45:05.526 --> 00:45:09.230
i can get a lot done in a short period of time and now i'm finding like as a founder,
00:45:09.822 --> 00:45:13.011
that's something i have to lean into a little bit because there are parts of
00:45:13.011 --> 00:45:17.241
the business that i have to focus on that aren't the things that i love which
00:45:17.241 --> 00:45:21.511
is the hunt exactly okay so so operators and,
00:45:22.064 --> 00:45:26.203
people have different things that they love in the business i love the hunt yeah,
00:45:26.824 --> 00:45:31.371
i love the education i love the spending time with people but the bills still have to be paid,
00:45:32.271 --> 00:45:36.591
right like okay kara you have a bookkeeper but like you still have to watch it.
00:45:37.211 --> 00:45:40.701
And so I'm learning how to pivot and I'm learning how to make time for those
00:45:40.701 --> 00:45:42.488
things in a different way.
00:45:42.639 --> 00:45:46.452
Nice. But as far as taking care of myself, I stay close to God.
00:45:47.555 --> 00:45:54.965
I take care of my health and I rest. Sleep and rest are a critically important part of my life.
00:45:55.493 --> 00:46:01.943
I love everything about that. I often tell leaders that sometimes we learn the
00:46:01.943 --> 00:46:04.331
most during the greatest challenge, right?
00:46:04.749 --> 00:46:08.973
COVID was a challenge, especially for those of us in the corporate setting.
00:46:09.548 --> 00:46:12.763
And then the seclusion that took place and how long it went.
00:46:12.763 --> 00:46:17.713
I mean, we all had to change. I love that you took the lessons and you emerged
00:46:17.713 --> 00:46:22.760
stronger than you did going into it. And that, I think, is the secret, right?
00:46:23.265 --> 00:46:26.443
Okay. But that's true in any part of our life. It is true. If we're willing
00:46:26.443 --> 00:46:29.871
to be introspective. Yes. And most of the time we're not. Yeah.
00:46:30.028 --> 00:46:33.923
And we blame it on our busyness. Yeah. It doesn't take too long to sit down
00:46:33.923 --> 00:46:36.053
with a notebook and say, you know what, that was a really good season in my
00:46:36.053 --> 00:46:37.325
life. What made it great? Yeah.
00:46:37.644 --> 00:46:40.033
Love that. And you're so right.
00:46:40.553 --> 00:46:44.976
And I always call it, you have to face the cliff. Yes. Like so many of us have that cliff.
00:46:45.464 --> 00:46:49.903
And instead of facing the realities of that cliff, we like put our head in the
00:46:49.903 --> 00:46:51.495
sand and hope it goes away.
00:46:51.808 --> 00:46:55.053
And the problem is that just keeps us in a different state longer.
00:46:55.453 --> 00:47:00.597
And we're never able to react and be the leader. We're meant to be fully engaged with our strengths.
00:47:01.676 --> 00:47:05.938
Final question. We're talking to a lot of leaders out there,
00:47:05.938 --> 00:47:09.356
people in business, people in nonprofits, all over.
00:47:09.985 --> 00:47:15.828
And I love your take on leadership. And so as you have now transitioned from
00:47:15.828 --> 00:47:20.196
the corporate world to the curse group, which is radically different,
00:47:21.015 --> 00:47:25.069
what advice would you give to that one leader who's thinking,
00:47:26.128 --> 00:47:30.547
I think I want to, or maybe their circumstances said you need to?
00:47:31.228 --> 00:47:37.608
Or what is it to get yourself up, pull your socks up, and get going on this
00:47:37.608 --> 00:47:40.316
entrepreneur journey? What advice would you give that person?
00:47:41.236 --> 00:47:45.064
Well, if you're doing something that is challenging your piece,
00:47:45.715 --> 00:47:47.357
it's probably time for you to find something else.
00:47:48.037 --> 00:47:53.104
And money will always be there if you work hard. So don't let money be the reason you don't do it.
00:47:54.028 --> 00:47:57.285
Okay. For me, I got pushed.
00:47:58.998 --> 00:48:05.018
But it was going to happen at some point. And so don't let the fact that you've
00:48:05.018 --> 00:48:09.727
got a great paycheck be the reason that you stay in something that is not bringing you joy.
00:48:10.228 --> 00:48:12.676
And I know that sounds cliche, right?
00:48:13.216 --> 00:48:18.290
But there's joy in corporate work. There's joy in entrepreneurialism.
00:48:20.543 --> 00:48:22.836
But find the place that brings you the most joy.
00:48:24.062 --> 00:48:27.554
And if you don't have it today and maybe you can't make a move for whatever
00:48:27.554 --> 00:48:31.649
reason, start to create boundaries that allow you to have joy. Yeah.
00:48:31.905 --> 00:48:38.000
You know, some organizations will continue to take and take from you until you're
00:48:38.204 --> 00:48:41.904
either not with us or they're kicking you out.
00:48:42.813 --> 00:48:47.334
And so find a way to have boundaries if you're in a large company so that you
00:48:47.334 --> 00:48:53.492
can have joy and or decide what your path is. But I like writing about things. Yeah.
00:48:53.609 --> 00:48:57.240
I find it to be very helpful to me to write.
00:48:57.975 --> 00:49:01.475
Here's an idea I'm thinking about, and I'll go back to it. In fact,
00:49:01.655 --> 00:49:06.664
I've met with over 60 employers since I launched, and every employer,
00:49:06.664 --> 00:49:09.904
sadly, has been told a mistruth by their broker.
00:49:10.544 --> 00:49:15.026
Now, some are big, some are small. Right. I've been challenged a few times like, what do you mean?
00:49:15.683 --> 00:49:19.700
And I've been keeping track of what those myths, truths are. Yeah.
00:49:20.182 --> 00:49:25.544
And I'm framing them into a potential tell-all book. Yeah. Well, I love it. I love it.
00:49:25.944 --> 00:49:28.431
I'm like, I want people to know. Yeah.
00:49:28.861 --> 00:49:35.095
Yeah. Like, if your broker's keeping you from your vendor partners, that's a red flag. Yeah.
00:49:35.449 --> 00:49:38.700
You're giving Blue Cross a million dollars a year. You should be able to talk to them.
00:49:39.339 --> 00:49:41.214
Why do you think you're not able to?
00:49:42.062 --> 00:49:45.789
Because someone's controlling the message. They may be controlling it 100% accurately.
00:49:45.789 --> 00:49:49.129
I can tell you that Kara Kirsch with 30 years of experience and expertise cannot do that.
00:49:49.969 --> 00:49:51.958
I cannot profess myself to know everything about everything.
00:49:52.549 --> 00:49:54.106
Even if I said, I know a lot.
00:49:54.971 --> 00:49:59.812
I still, I know this much and I'm learning this much. So I would just say, find joy.
00:50:00.349 --> 00:50:04.349
If I could summarize all of that, find joy. And if joy means boundaries,
00:50:04.649 --> 00:50:08.032
if joy means taking time for yourself, if joy means finding a different job,
00:50:08.305 --> 00:50:13.169
if joy means moving into a new industry, find it. Life is so short.
00:50:14.375 --> 00:50:18.649
Brilliant. Brilliant. Okay. So how do people get in touch with you and the Kirsch
00:50:18.649 --> 00:50:23.849
Group? If we have employers out there who need help in any one of your channels,
00:50:24.369 --> 00:50:27.268
how do they interact with you? And what are some ways to follow you?
00:50:27.448 --> 00:50:31.744
And then let's speak to the women out there because I want you to put in a plug for Ignite. Yeah.
00:50:32.115 --> 00:50:34.489
So if you want to find more information about the Kirsch Group,
00:50:34.489 --> 00:50:39.290
you can go to our website, kirschgroupinsurance.com. You can also follow me on LinkedIn.
00:50:39.673 --> 00:50:43.289
I put a lot of meaningful content on LinkedIn, myself personally,
00:50:43.289 --> 00:50:45.635
Kara Kirsch, as well as under the company banner.
00:50:45.914 --> 00:50:49.379
If you could follow us on LinkedIn, that helps. If you can give us a star on
00:50:49.379 --> 00:50:51.241
Google, if you've worked with us, that helps too.
00:50:51.694 --> 00:50:54.989
But you can find me there. That's the best place. I respond to every LinkedIn
00:50:54.989 --> 00:50:58.789
message I get. Okay. So know that. I think that's how we connected, right?
00:50:58.949 --> 00:51:01.249
Yes. When we were both transitioning out of our jobs. That's right. Yeah.
00:51:01.749 --> 00:51:05.269
And then secondly, you know, I said this at the Ignite conference this year,
00:51:05.269 --> 00:51:07.182
and I'll say it to the women that are listening today.
00:51:07.658 --> 00:51:12.409
Ignite 2027 is our 10th year. It's March 2nd, 2027, right here in Omaha,
00:51:12.409 --> 00:51:15.819
Nebraska. Scott Conference Center, awesome facility. Shout out to them.
00:51:16.145 --> 00:51:17.602
It's gonna be a magical day.
00:51:17.991 --> 00:51:24.233
And this is what I want you to leave with. If you feel minimized, stand up for yourself.
00:51:25.072 --> 00:51:29.886
And if you are talking crap about other women and jealous and envious, it stops now.
00:51:30.855 --> 00:51:32.469
So figure out a way to elevate.
00:51:33.833 --> 00:51:37.299
Very good. Well, Cara, thank you so much for your time. You're so generous with it.
00:51:37.716 --> 00:51:41.443
I'm continuing to wish you the best of luck as your company continues to grow.
00:51:41.780 --> 00:51:46.381
Keep being one of the crazy ones. I absolutely respect and love it.
00:51:46.381 --> 00:51:48.926
Thank you so much. Keep it up. Thank you for joining us, Cara.