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Welcome to Off Script, a conversation with no fakes, no filters, just real conversations about how faith and flesh meet in the everyday life, where we experience a God who made us on purpose for his purpose.
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This is off script.
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Let's talk.
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All right, parents, this is Caleb.
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I just want to let you know that we were in the middle of a conversation and we were talking about Colossians 3, and we didn't stop the conversation.
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We actually just I just reached over to the soundboard and I just hit record in the middle of our conversation.
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I didn't want to stop it.
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So what's going to happen is you're going to pick up in the middle of a conversation.
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Okay, so I we're recording this now to let you know.
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We were in the middle of a session.
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It was going too good.
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I just hit record, and so you're picking up at the beginning.
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And it's about 20 parents in the room, and we're just talking through Colossians 3.
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So just to give you an update of kind of where you what you may have missed or what you're walking into.
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Colossians 3.23.
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It says to work hard at everything you do as if for the Lord and not for man.
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So that we started with a little bit of that basis 3.23, and then we applied it to what chapter 3, verse 14 on down.
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It gets into really verse 18, it gets into wives and husbands and the duties of those two.
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And so here's what you're missing.
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The passage in 18 says, wives, submit to your husbands as is fitting for the Lord.
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And then husbands, love your wives and do not be harsh with them.
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And then it goes on and talks about children with your parents.
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And so the part of the conversation that you're missing with those parents that I just want to catch you up on is the duties of a wife and a husband.
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And so we talked about it's unique that all the time you can see a passage where the husband, the Lord always tells, hey, you need to love your wife.
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I mean, so the command is always husband, love your wife, love your wife, love your wife.
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But it never really tells the wife to love the husband, even though the Lord taught tells everyone, hey, everyone, you need to love your neighbor.
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So, but it's just unique that it highlights for the husband to love your wife.
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On the opposite side of that, it never caused the husband to be the helper, but it caused the wife to be the helper.
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And so, not that a husband should never help his wife, but that was the role of the wife is hey, you be the helper to the family, you know, and husbands love your wife.
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And so, what does that look like?
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What does that mean?
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And so we were opening up that conversation.
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And so you'll find uh the conversation come alive.
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You'll hear some people in the background that are asking questions or making comments.
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You might have to turn it up when some of them are doing that as well.
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And so we, I think we jump into the conversation where we're talking about if husbands are to love their wife as Christ loved the church, then we should act like Christ in our marriages, which means Christ was the initiator in everything that happened.
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And so think about what Christ did for his people.
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He initiated every single thing.
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And so, as the husband, you are to be the initiator, like you in everything, in the intimate parts of it, in the the biblical aspect of it, the spiritual side of it, like you are supposed to be the initiator.
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And so, what does that look like in a marriage?
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And then we talked again, what does it look like to to submit or to be the helper?
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And I brought to attention some people like I I do a lot of weddings, and a lot of those weddings, they say, Hey, could you just not read this verse?
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Could you not say this part of the passage?
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And more and more weddings, people are saying, Hey, would you not say this part?
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It just sounds weird.
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I shouldn't do this.
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And so we opened a little bit of that conversation as well.
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So this is where you're getting probably about 20 to 30 parents in a room talking through this passage in Colossians.
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I highly encourage you to read it as you begin to, as we pick up and listen to the conversation in the room.
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I think it's important for our family unit to be as God intended.
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He intended it for to be a husband and a wife, a male and a female, you know, and to and to pour into the kids.
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And, you know, the wife and the husband are there to protect the kids, to train them, to show them the way they they should go.
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I think that's necessary.
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The other part of it is our community.
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You know, our community is church.
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We raised our kids, we we brought them to church every Sunday so they would have godly kids that they would learn from and be poured into because they're going to live in the world.
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Kids will live in the world, and if we don't develop those boundaries at an early age, they won't know the the guidelines, the guardrails.
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They'll they'll go all over the place.
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So I think it's important that we are there.
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And sometimes it's strict, right?
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Sometimes you have to say this is the way it is, and we're doing it for your because we love you, we're doing it because for your protection, but this is the way it is.
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Uh I don't know what Caleb's kids are running off doing, but you know, we're gonna do this.
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Yeah.
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I you know, I I do I do think the Bible is very clear of when you if you want to do that, you start with a husband and a wife.
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That's right.
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And I would say you take my my my world when I you know grew up, like I you know, okay, well then what do you tell say the person whose dad's not there or whose mom's not there?
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And they read this and they're like, Well, I guess I'm missing something.
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And I would put in to when when I when my dad wasn't there.
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I mean, I'm sure I I don't know, I'm not a mom and I'm not a woman, but I would assume just being married to Brittany, like if I'm not there, her her thought is who are the men there's gonna be in my kids' life.
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Right, you know, like and I would assume my mom thought that.
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Well, what where who's these guys gonna be?
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And because we were around so many godly men at a church, right?
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You know, like I there's so many people that I looked at like they were a dad to me, you know.
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I mean, I didn't call them dad, you know, like I most of them I called coach, I but he crazy, you know, but there's so many men that were around that uh yeah, he he says, hey, the blessing comes from there's a husband and a wife.
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There's not two wives, there's not two husbands, right?
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You know, it's a husband and a wife, and you train your child up.
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And I would say with many people be like, Well, you know, it's just the husband, there's no wife.
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You know, there's that, you know, the wife walked out or the wi wife passed away, or vice versa.
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And I would just say that many people they're gonna hear that and they're gonna walk through, you know, this thinking like, Well, I can't do this passage, you know.
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And I would say that the Lord has what Stan was talking about.
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There, there's a covering that the Lord has for his church.
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And and I I you know, I think of my mom listening to this, you know, if she's listening to this and she's thinking, I'm lacking something, but the Lord made up in so many unique places that, you know, like one of the one of the men in my life that played a huge role of being like a male role model figure to me.
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I didn't know I was gonna come to a church one day and be a pastor for him.
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You know, it's it's Jeff is Jeff Man.
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You know, he was when all this is going on in my world, he was a Sunday school teacher.
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You know, I mean that is that not full circle, you know?
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He's the first person I ran into when I walked when I came into the church.
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You know, he said, What is it, who the heck's doing background checks?
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You know, like so you know, it's crazy how the Lord has a unique covering that you know provides.
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And I think that's true.
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We all got here somehow.
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You know, it may have been through a mom and a dad that were together.
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It may be a single parent like you talked about, but having those godly people like you were talking about surrounding you and training you and training you up in the way you should believe and go.
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Absolutely.
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And that's why it's important to be a part of a group, uh a church body.
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Yeah, because there's all these places that the church body can fill in these voids, especially like if it's a single parent home or whatever, and there's all these examples like you're talking about, and especially, you know, Hebrews says forsake not the gathering of the saints.
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So but having a a group that you're a part of and and you feel like you belong in a group, and you have then you have a single purpose, and that single purpose is the gospel of Jesus Christ and uh and to take care of the widows and the orphans and uh and to to serve the community around every place.
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I think too, when you s when uh when a parent, it could be both of them, it could be one of them, when they show a high value to something.
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I'm not saying every kid automatically is like, well, hey, this is we we love this, this is what we do.
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Right.
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But it's almost like they don't flee from it.
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I mean, they might, you know, be like, well, hey, I don't have any friends that come here, I really want to go here.
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But they they they don't live they might have a season where they they don't want to come around the church.
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Okay, but if this is a high value to you, you know, you're there's just something about your kids wanting that to be a value to them too.
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And and so I I I just I mean, even when I grew up, my mom never had to be like, hey, we're going to church.
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It's like, are you kidding me?
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Like, I like going to church.
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I was not part of the youth group, I was not around only on Sunday mornings when I came in for our life group, you know, or Sunday school class then, you know.
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And you know, so I was my parents.
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I didn't go on any trips.
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I loved our church.
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And there are many guys that played roles in my life because this was a high value in my family.
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Right.
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And it's not something that was negotiated.
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This is just what we did.
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And so I would say that that plays a huge role in, you know, now I mean we're in a room, obviously, with if uh you don't know this, I've already hit record on here.
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I've been recording for the last like 30 minutes anyway.
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But I would just say we've all had we we've been around people, and we we might be people in this room that feel this way, that only you can discipline your kid.
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Like and I would say that that's dangerous.
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You've got to allow somebody else to discipline your kid too.
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Not just only, but if I get onto your kid or I discipline your kid, it's for a reason.
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And you if you immediately come to their rescue, how will that person learn to grow up and obey?
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Right, right.
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If it only is gonna come from you, or if it you're constantly coming to their defense, and you know, I can't tell you how many times in student ministry this, you know, somebody's done something wrong.
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Sydney can attest to this, somebody's done something wrong, and then the other person is apologizing, the parents apologizing, and you're like, You didn't do it?
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Why are you apologizing?
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Why are you apologizing to your kid?
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Why are you yelling at me?
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What your kid's the one that did it, you know, like, and so I would say that's a dangerous world.
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How do you train up somebody that obeys?
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Allow other people to discipline your kid too.
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And most people now won't discipline somebody else's kid because they're gonna get sued or I'm gonna get fired, or you can't talk to my kid that way.
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Well, you should have heard what they said to me, you know.
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And I would say that's a huge role in allowing someone to discipline your kid.
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That sounds good until it happens and it feels weird.
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But I think it's a sign of respect too, you know, that you teach your kids to respect authority, right?
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You teach them to respect your teachers, respect your leaders, you know, respect police officers, things like that.
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If we don't teach them, you know, they won't learn.
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Yeah, just look at current events.
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Right.
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I mean, we see teen takeovers and everything, and it's a lot of seem like a lot of feral kids, teenagers, and one of the common factors there is that there's uh there's no father in the pitcher.
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Right.
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So but but they've also not been disciplined, they have no respect for authority.
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Which I think leads into probably the last verse, which just because I hit record, guys, doesn't mean you can't jump in.
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Okay, anybody got anything they want on that?
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We also have to be willing to have a hard conversation with a with a fellow parent.
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If there's something if we see something in a kid's life.
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Um, and I think there's a fear of doing that.
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But if sometimes losing a friend.
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If we're committed to our our community, you know, we'd have a role in that as well.
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Not to rat out the kid, but to say, look, they're they're running down Coubble Street and they're they're gonna find it.
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Yeah, if they don't turn around.
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Yeah, I've I've dealt with a little bit of that.
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I mean, I guess I'm telling on myself.
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I remember at a basketball game this last year, lady came up to me and told me my son was talking too much trash on the court.
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And she said, Hey, he needs to quit talking to everybody out there.
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You know, like he, you know, I told him he needs, you know, I yelled at him and said, Hey, Finn, you need to be quiet while you're out there, you know, like and you know what?
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That didn't feel good.
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And I also told her, I was like, Well, hey, they got those people need to toughen up a little bit.
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Okay, and I walked out and be like, Is that did somebody discipline my kid?
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And I just, you know, like you didn't call her carry.
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You didn't call her caring.
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It's just a little talk, right?
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Yeah, like so if I you know, anyway, uh it felt awkward and weird, you know, and all they did is just yell.
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You know, like, hey, you're talking too much out there, be quiet, Finn.
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You know, like I'm like, oh, don't talk to my kid, okay?
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Like, you know, so I I you know that's weird.
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So but thinking back, that was he wasn't cussing, geez, lady.
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He was just in your garbage, yeah.
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Toughen up, buttercup.
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One of the greatest beers of my life as a kid was that I would do something and somebody would tell my dad.
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Yeah, yeah.
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Oh, yeah.
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And and I've I've just observed that society has lost that, and I think it's because we're not willing as a community to do something out of blood, not out of blood.
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Oh, that kid running to the mouth, but like that kid's better than that.
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That kid's parents would not want him to do that.
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Yeah, so I I think too, okay, to answer the question, how do you raise a kid that that obeys?
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Not um not just you, they just obey, is Colossians 3 23, do everything that you do as if for the Lord and not for man.
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I mean, you don't need a whole lot of explanation with that.
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Everything everything is everything.
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Everything that you do, work it hard at it, as if you are working for the Lord and not for man.
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And that can get tiresome.
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Sure.
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And you, you know, if you're I can how many times I've like been cutting grass, weed eating, thinking, the Lord was coming to our house today, would I would I do this a little better?
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If you think about that for everything, that will wear me out.
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You know what I'm saying?
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Like, you know, when we get finished with here, I'll move the chairs back and be like, man, if the Lord was gonna come into this room, would I put the chairs back better than I put them back now?
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It is tiresome thinking through that, but it just builds a standard too of excellence.
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And and I don't I don't think it's an uh build a standard of excellence that involves stress.
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Right.
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As much as it does trying to achieve something.
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I don't I don't think that should add stress to your life.
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You know?
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But if we go back and look at the family in those in these first four verses, you know, we're we're talking about the husband, if he leads well, the wife will follow.
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If the husband and wife lead well, if they lead with excellence, we weren't always perfect, you know.
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We we did, you know, we were learning how to raise kids, but you try to put that and instill that into your children, and they see that.
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And I think when they see that, they'll you know be more tempted to want to lead and and and follow.
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Yeah, you're setting the standard there.
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Right.
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And how often have we had teachable moments where your kids be you raise them, not that they're perfect, but you're raising them in the Lord, and they look at the outside world, the unbelievers, and they're like, What's up with them?
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What what what's and then they start seeing the difference between your household and an unbeliever's household.
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And so, and there's that there's that true delineation between the between the two.
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It's a great teaching example.
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Like, you know, just turn on the evening news and watch that, you know, like you can point out, you know, it uh what they're doing, do you does that glorify Christ in any way?
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No.
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And so, well, what are we doing to glorify Christ?
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Okay, so take an example of that.
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I'm using the Bobos as an example, okay.
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They have awesome, they have awesome.
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I mean, ever most people in here, most of you in here have awesome kids.
00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:14.559
I so but I would say my bad yeah.
00:17:15.519 --> 00:17:17.359
Yeah, but I would say they have great kids.
00:17:17.599 --> 00:17:19.680
Every single one of them are very different.
00:17:20.400 --> 00:17:21.279
Would you all agree?
00:17:21.599 --> 00:17:22.079
Very different.
00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:32.640
They're all very different, they all have their own personalities, they all like things that the other person doesn't like, but you can't find one of them that like are aren't enjoyable to be around.
00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:35.920
They're great kids, but they're all very different personalities.
00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:52.240
And that comes from a standard that was set probably a long time ago, wasn't set last week, and you're like, gosh, you know, we've now that we've gotten in middle school, you know, we really need to tighten up on some of our, you know, I need to discipline them for the first time, you know, like that that was already a behavior that was set.
00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:53.440
Yeah, start early.
00:17:53.599 --> 00:17:58.640
Yeah, and I I I think it's it's early and often, and you don't have to do it a whole lot.
00:17:58.960 --> 00:18:10.720
And I I would just say, how do you I can go to any any of their kids, I can go to any of their kids and ask something, and one, they'll look at you, and the other thing is they'll they'll do what you just asked, they'll obey.
00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:15.599
Yeah, you know, and I would say despite our parenting.
00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:19.599
I was getting to remove that anyway, don't I?
00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:36.160
Yeah, but I would just say that's that's the kids in the in in in this room, you know, like the the parents of kids in this room is is a lot of that is is there's a standard that you had, and it wasn't something that you made.
00:18:36.319 --> 00:18:41.920
I mean, I tell people all the time, I didn't, I mean, I it wasn't like there was a a dad telling me what to do.
00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:42.880
It just happened.
00:18:43.119 --> 00:18:45.359
And I that you know, I'm trying to figure it out.
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:47.759
You know, some of it's just because Brent's like, hey, do you think we should do?
00:18:47.839 --> 00:18:51.279
And I'm just thinking, like, I probably should, you know, like I probably should do what you just added.
00:18:51.359 --> 00:18:52.480
I don't know, nobody did that to me.
00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:52.960
I don't know.
00:18:53.039 --> 00:18:53.920
I guess I'll try it.
00:18:54.160 --> 00:19:01.680
You know, but and I think some of that is as you strive for that, as you strive for those things, the Lord does what Sand says.
00:19:01.759 --> 00:19:11.599
I mean, there's an umbrella that He shows grace and He shows you and delivers and and He He makes things happen and gets you to the point of where this passage started.
00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:23.440
Wives, submit to your husbands, husbands, learn to love your wife, you know, like you know, to to raise children that obey and to do everything that you do as if you were working for the Lord and not for man.
00:19:23.680 --> 00:19:25.680
And you think, well, how am I supposed to do all that?
00:19:25.839 --> 00:19:29.039
Well, I think you just do the next right thing.
00:19:29.440 --> 00:19:31.200
And then do the next right thing.
00:19:31.440 --> 00:19:39.519
And there's gonna come battles from that, but you like I said, you you have an army of people if you you do it with with other people.
00:19:39.759 --> 00:19:41.359
So they're always looking.
00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:41.759
Yeah.
00:19:42.160 --> 00:19:44.240
Anyone else want to add to any of that?
00:19:45.440 --> 00:20:06.480
I will say this generation that's coming up, they I I don't I mean, we were we were kids at one point, and I'm not saying that our raising was any harder or any easier than now, but I'm sure you'll notice with your daughter we can we can put Anna Kate in the court.
00:20:06.640 --> 00:20:13.599
We can, you know, we don't beat her, but we could potentially beat her or ground her, take things away from her.
00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:22.720
We do all the things, and she's just kind of like so parenting her is much different than how I was parented.
00:20:22.960 --> 00:20:25.599
I grew up in a single mom household.
00:20:25.839 --> 00:20:27.519
So I didn't have the father figure.
00:20:27.680 --> 00:20:33.440
So letting Taylor parent is difficult because I didn't.
00:20:33.920 --> 00:20:47.680
I grew up in a house tall boy, so yeah, and so so having letting stepping aside as her mother and being like, okay, you do what you need to do is difficult for me because I didn't have that.
00:20:47.759 --> 00:20:50.240
Now, did my mother instill the fear of God in me?
00:20:50.480 --> 00:20:51.359
Absolutely.
00:20:51.680 --> 00:20:55.599
I was 27 when I found out I was pregnant with AK, I was ready to move to Canada.
00:20:56.000 --> 00:20:57.519
I was like, I'm out of here.
00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:16.480
Um, but it just not only the pushback that the kids give now, but just leading them and not being an aggressor in the leading process is just difficult.
00:21:17.359 --> 00:21:20.559
I think you had a great question or immediately had a question.
00:21:20.640 --> 00:21:25.759
How many of you parent your kid the way that you were parented?
00:21:28.880 --> 00:21:32.160
Anybody you think you think you I mean I don't think it's wrong or right.
00:21:32.240 --> 00:21:32.559
I just wonder.
00:21:33.599 --> 00:21:34.400
Yeah, to a degree.
00:21:34.480 --> 00:21:34.960
I agree with that.
00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:43.200
How many of you parent completely different the way that you were parenting?
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:45.920
I do, yeah.
00:21:46.400 --> 00:21:48.160
I I don't know what that means.
00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:51.039
I just was wondering that when you said that, I was like, do I parent like mom?
00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:53.440
I mean, I think I got the worst spanking out of everybody.
00:21:53.599 --> 00:21:55.519
I mean, I know I got the worst spanking out of everybody.
00:21:55.759 --> 00:21:57.839
Uh I remember, yeah, yeah, I remember that.
00:21:57.920 --> 00:22:01.279
I remember everybody was crying, telling my mom, please stop my mom.
00:22:01.920 --> 00:22:04.000
I'd hit my sister in the face with a hockey stick.
00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:14.720
I and uh she right here next to her face, and she had this big old knot right here, and then my mom was, you know, she's just kicking me, you know, and so and everybody's like, mom saving many.
00:22:14.799 --> 00:22:17.039
She's holding mom's something, you know.
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:19.039
So anyway, yeah, yeah, anyway.
00:22:20.480 --> 00:22:21.519
That's crazy.
00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:24.640
I'm just taking back being thrown down them steps.
00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:28.079
Anyway.
00:22:28.400 --> 00:22:30.160
I will say it's a little different for us now.
00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:38.720
We've got grandkids, you know, we've got a two-year-old and a three-year-old, and and Lauren and Alex do a really good job parenting them, but I'm the big kid, so I have to be careful what I do.
00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:41.039
Like, okay, we got to do it this way.
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:46.160
But but but I do try I I think uh we parented like our parents raised us.
00:22:46.480 --> 00:22:47.599
So for the most, you know.
00:22:48.079 --> 00:22:51.279
I've got I've got a story when I was probably about nine years old.
00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:57.759
I was trailing behind my mother in the grocery store, and they kept playing the same song over and over and over.
00:22:57.920 --> 00:23:00.240
And you may have to beat this, beat this.
00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:00.640
I don't know.
00:23:00.720 --> 00:23:01.359
I won't say it.
00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:07.759
But anyway, uh little n little chubby nine-year-old Jeff was like, 'I wish I quit playing that D-A-M end song.
00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:20.400
My mom turned around, she was pushing this cart, she turned around and backhanded me.' And she stuck her finger in Chubby Little Jeff's face and said, We don't talk like that in our house because we represent Christ.
00:23:20.559 --> 00:23:28.799
And then that stuck with Chubby Little Jeff even to this day, where you know, I'm really mindful if I'm gonna say anything.
00:23:29.119 --> 00:23:39.920
But they'd always tell me when I'd go to leave, and they're like, Jeff, remember who you are, who you represent, Christ first, and then this family, don't bring shame upon either one of them.
00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:45.680
And so that was all it took for me to really have in that decision process.
00:23:45.920 --> 00:23:50.880
Do I go with this group that's going to do whatever they're going to do, or do I go home?
00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:51.279
Right.
00:23:51.440 --> 00:23:56.319
And I would say probably 99% of the time I would go home because I remember getting backhanded.
00:23:56.559 --> 00:24:04.000
Not that you should backhand your children, but that would that we I've never backhanded my children, but I have told them that story.
00:24:04.240 --> 00:24:05.759
And I've I tell them the same thing.
00:24:05.839 --> 00:24:07.119
I was like, remember who you are.
00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:07.759
That's right.
00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:14.079
Who you represent, Christ first, and then this family, and don't bring shame upon either one.
00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:22.880
But also follow up with that in saying that, you know, if you do mess up, then there's forgiveness in that, uh, and through Christ Jesus.
00:24:23.119 --> 00:24:24.240
And we will forgive us.
00:00:01.600 --> 00:00:14.720
Welcome to Off Script, a conversation with no fakes, no filters, just real conversations about how faith and flesh meet in the everyday life, where we experience a God who made us on purpose for his purpose.
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This is off script.
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Let's talk.
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All right, parents, this is Caleb.
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I just want to let you know that we were in the middle of a conversation and we were talking about Colossians 3, and we didn't stop the conversation.
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We actually just I just reached over to the soundboard and I just hit record in the middle of our conversation.
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I didn't want to stop it.
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So what's going to happen is you're going to pick up in the middle of a conversation.
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Okay, so I we're recording this now to let you know.
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We were in the middle of a session.
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It was going too good.
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I just hit record, and so you're picking up at the beginning.
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And it's about 20 parents in the room, and we're just talking through Colossians 3.
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So just to give you an update of kind of where you what you may have missed or what you're walking into.
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Colossians 3.23.
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It says to work hard at everything you do as if for the Lord and not for man.
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So that we started with a little bit of that basis 3.23, and then we applied it to what chapter 3, verse 14 on down.
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It gets into really verse 18, it gets into wives and husbands and the duties of those two.
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And so here's what you're missing.
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The passage in 18 says, wives, submit to your husbands as is fitting for the Lord.
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And then husbands, love your wives and do not be harsh with them.
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And then it goes on and talks about children with your parents.
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And so the part of the conversation that you're missing with those parents that I just want to catch you up on is the duties of a wife and a husband.
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And so we talked about it's unique that all the time you can see a passage where the husband, the Lord always tells, hey, you need to love your wife.
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I mean, so the command is always husband, love your wife, love your wife, love your wife.
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But it never really tells the wife to love the husband, even though the Lord taught tells everyone, hey, everyone, you need to love your neighbor.
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So, but it's just unique that it highlights for the husband to love your wife.
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On the opposite side of that, it never caused the husband to be the helper, but it caused the wife to be the helper.
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And so, not that a husband should never help his wife, but that was the role of the wife is hey, you be the helper to the family, you know, and husbands love your wife.
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And so, what does that look like?
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What does that mean?
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And so we were opening up that conversation.
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And so you'll find uh the conversation come alive.
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You'll hear some people in the background that are asking questions or making comments.
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You might have to turn it up when some of them are doing that as well.
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And so we, I think we jump into the conversation where we're talking about if husbands are to love their wife as Christ loved the church, then we should act like Christ in our marriages, which means Christ was the initiator in everything that happened.
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And so think about what Christ did for his people.
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He initiated every single thing.
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And so, as the husband, you are to be the initiator, like you in everything, in the intimate parts of it, in the the biblical aspect of it, the spiritual side of it, like you are supposed to be the initiator.
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And so, what does that look like in a marriage?
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And then we talked again, what does it look like to to submit or to be the helper?
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And I brought to attention some people like I I do a lot of weddings, and a lot of those weddings, they say, Hey, could you just not read this verse?
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Could you not say this part of the passage?
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And more and more weddings, people are saying, Hey, would you not say this part?
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It just sounds weird.
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I shouldn't do this.
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And so we opened a little bit of that conversation as well.
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So this is where you're getting probably about 20 to 30 parents in a room talking through this passage in Colossians.
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I highly encourage you to read it as you begin to, as we pick up and listen to the conversation in the room.
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I think it's important for our family unit to be as God intended.
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He intended it for to be a husband and a wife, a male and a female, you know, and to and to pour into the kids.
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And, you know, the wife and the husband are there to protect the kids, to train them, to show them the way they they should go.
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I think that's necessary.
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The other part of it is our community.
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You know, our community is church.
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We raised our kids, we we brought them to church every Sunday so they would have godly kids that they would learn from and be poured into because they're going to live in the world.
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Kids will live in the world, and if we don't develop those boundaries at an early age, they won't know the the guidelines, the guardrails.
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They'll they'll go all over the place.
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So I think it's important that we are there.
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And sometimes it's strict, right?
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Sometimes you have to say this is the way it is, and we're doing it for your because we love you, we're doing it because for your protection, but this is the way it is.
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Uh I don't know what Caleb's kids are running off doing, but you know, we're gonna do this.
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Yeah.
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I you know, I I do I do think the Bible is very clear of when you if you want to do that, you start with a husband and a wife.
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That's right.
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And I would say you take my my my world when I you know grew up, like I you know, okay, well then what do you tell say the person whose dad's not there or whose mom's not there?
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And they read this and they're like, Well, I guess I'm missing something.
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And I would put in to when when I when my dad wasn't there.
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I mean, I'm sure I I don't know, I'm not a mom and I'm not a woman, but I would assume just being married to Brittany, like if I'm not there, her her thought is who are the men there's gonna be in my kids' life.
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Right, you know, like and I would assume my mom thought that.
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Well, what where who's these guys gonna be?
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And because we were around so many godly men at a church, right?
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You know, like I there's so many people that I looked at like they were a dad to me, you know.
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I mean, I didn't call them dad, you know, like I most of them I called coach, I but he crazy, you know, but there's so many men that were around that uh yeah, he he says, hey, the blessing comes from there's a husband and a wife.
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There's not two wives, there's not two husbands, right?
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You know, it's a husband and a wife, and you train your child up.
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And I would say with many people be like, Well, you know, it's just the husband, there's no wife.
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You know, there's that, you know, the wife walked out or the wi wife passed away, or vice versa.
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And I would just say that many people they're gonna hear that and they're gonna walk through, you know, this thinking like, Well, I can't do this passage, you know.
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And I would say that the Lord has what Stan was talking about.
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There, there's a covering that the Lord has for his church.
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And and I I you know, I think of my mom listening to this, you know, if she's listening to this and she's thinking, I'm lacking something, but the Lord made up in so many unique places that, you know, like one of the one of the men in my life that played a huge role of being like a male role model figure to me.
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I didn't know I was gonna come to a church one day and be a pastor for him.
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You know, it's it's Jeff is Jeff Man.
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You know, he was when all this is going on in my world, he was a Sunday school teacher.
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You know, I mean that is that not full circle, you know?
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He's the first person I ran into when I walked when I came into the church.
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You know, he said, What is it, who the heck's doing background checks?
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You know, like so you know, it's crazy how the Lord has a unique covering that you know provides.
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And I think that's true.
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We all got here somehow.
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You know, it may have been through a mom and a dad that were together.
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It may be a single parent like you talked about, but having those godly people like you were talking about surrounding you and training you and training you up in the way you should believe and go.
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Absolutely.
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And that's why it's important to be a part of a group, uh a church body.
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Yeah, because there's all these places that the church body can fill in these voids, especially like if it's a single parent home or whatever, and there's all these examples like you're talking about, and especially, you know, Hebrews says forsake not the gathering of the saints.
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So but having a a group that you're a part of and and you feel like you belong in a group, and you have then you have a single purpose, and that single purpose is the gospel of Jesus Christ and uh and to take care of the widows and the orphans and uh and to to serve the community around every place.
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I think too, when you s when uh when a parent, it could be both of them, it could be one of them, when they show a high value to something.
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I'm not saying every kid automatically is like, well, hey, this is we we love this, this is what we do.
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Right.
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But it's almost like they don't flee from it.
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I mean, they might, you know, be like, well, hey, I don't have any friends that come here, I really want to go here.
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But they they they don't live they might have a season where they they don't want to come around the church.
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Okay, but if this is a high value to you, you know, you're there's just something about your kids wanting that to be a value to them too.
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And and so I I I just I mean, even when I grew up, my mom never had to be like, hey, we're going to church.
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It's like, are you kidding me?
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Like, I like going to church.
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I was not part of the youth group, I was not around only on Sunday mornings when I came in for our life group, you know, or Sunday school class then, you know.
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And you know, so I was my parents.
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I didn't go on any trips.
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I loved our church.
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And there are many guys that played roles in my life because this was a high value in my family.
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Right.
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And it's not something that was negotiated.
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This is just what we did.
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And so I would say that that plays a huge role in, you know, now I mean we're in a room, obviously, with if uh you don't know this, I've already hit record on here.
00:10:00.399 --> 00:10:03.120
I've been recording for the last like 30 minutes anyway.
00:10:03.360 --> 00:10:16.720
But I would just say we've all had we we've been around people, and we we might be people in this room that feel this way, that only you can discipline your kid.
00:10:18.000 --> 00:10:21.120
Like and I would say that that's dangerous.
00:10:21.519 --> 00:10:24.240
You've got to allow somebody else to discipline your kid too.
00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:32.159
Not just only, but if I get onto your kid or I discipline your kid, it's for a reason.
00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:38.799
And you if you immediately come to their rescue, how will that person learn to grow up and obey?
00:10:39.039 --> 00:10:39.759
Right, right.
00:10:40.000 --> 00:10:51.120
If it only is gonna come from you, or if it you're constantly coming to their defense, and you know, I can't tell you how many times in student ministry this, you know, somebody's done something wrong.
00:10:51.279 --> 00:10:59.519
Sydney can attest to this, somebody's done something wrong, and then the other person is apologizing, the parents apologizing, and you're like, You didn't do it?
00:10:59.600 --> 00:11:00.559
Why are you apologizing?
00:11:00.720 --> 00:11:02.159
Why are you apologizing to your kid?
00:11:02.320 --> 00:11:03.600
Why are you yelling at me?
00:11:03.759 --> 00:11:09.200
What your kid's the one that did it, you know, like, and so I would say that's a dangerous world.
00:11:09.440 --> 00:11:11.759
How do you train up somebody that obeys?
00:11:11.919 --> 00:11:14.080
Allow other people to discipline your kid too.
00:11:14.639 --> 00:11:24.000
And most people now won't discipline somebody else's kid because they're gonna get sued or I'm gonna get fired, or you can't talk to my kid that way.
00:11:24.159 --> 00:11:26.320
Well, you should have heard what they said to me, you know.
00:11:26.480 --> 00:11:31.679
And I would say that's a huge role in allowing someone to discipline your kid.
00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:35.440
That sounds good until it happens and it feels weird.
00:11:36.080 --> 00:11:40.960
But I think it's a sign of respect too, you know, that you teach your kids to respect authority, right?
00:11:41.039 --> 00:11:46.799
You teach them to respect your teachers, respect your leaders, you know, respect police officers, things like that.
00:11:46.960 --> 00:11:49.360
If we don't teach them, you know, they won't learn.
00:11:50.240 --> 00:11:51.919
Yeah, just look at current events.
00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:52.240
Right.
00:11:52.399 --> 00:12:03.679
I mean, we see teen takeovers and everything, and it's a lot of seem like a lot of feral kids, teenagers, and one of the common factors there is that there's uh there's no father in the pitcher.
00:12:03.919 --> 00:12:04.080
Right.
00:12:04.639 --> 00:12:09.120
So but but they've also not been disciplined, they have no respect for authority.
00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:16.639
Which I think leads into probably the last verse, which just because I hit record, guys, doesn't mean you can't jump in.
00:12:16.879 --> 00:12:18.799
Okay, anybody got anything they want on that?
00:12:19.519 --> 00:12:25.279
We also have to be willing to have a hard conversation with a with a fellow parent.
00:12:25.600 --> 00:12:28.720
If there's something if we see something in a kid's life.
00:12:30.159 --> 00:12:33.200
Um, and I think there's a fear of doing that.
00:12:33.279 --> 00:12:34.960
But if sometimes losing a friend.
00:12:48.960 --> 00:12:53.440
If we're committed to our our community, you know, we'd have a role in that as well.
00:12:53.600 --> 00:13:00.799
Not to rat out the kid, but to say, look, they're they're running down Coubble Street and they're they're gonna find it.
00:13:00.960 --> 00:13:02.159
Yeah, if they don't turn around.
00:13:02.639 --> 00:13:05.360
Yeah, I've I've dealt with a little bit of that.
00:13:05.519 --> 00:13:07.600
I mean, I guess I'm telling on myself.
00:13:07.840 --> 00:13:15.600
I remember at a basketball game this last year, lady came up to me and told me my son was talking too much trash on the court.
00:13:15.840 --> 00:13:18.960
And she said, Hey, he needs to quit talking to everybody out there.
00:13:19.120 --> 00:13:26.720
You know, like he, you know, I told him he needs, you know, I yelled at him and said, Hey, Finn, you need to be quiet while you're out there, you know, like and you know what?
00:13:27.039 --> 00:13:27.840
That didn't feel good.
00:13:27.919 --> 00:13:31.279
And I also told her, I was like, Well, hey, they got those people need to toughen up a little bit.
00:13:31.440 --> 00:13:34.399
Okay, and I walked out and be like, Is that did somebody discipline my kid?
00:13:34.480 --> 00:13:37.279
And I just, you know, like you didn't call her carry.
00:13:37.759 --> 00:13:38.480
You didn't call her caring.
00:13:39.279 --> 00:13:40.320
It's just a little talk, right?
00:13:40.559 --> 00:13:47.679
Yeah, like so if I you know, anyway, uh it felt awkward and weird, you know, and all they did is just yell.
00:13:47.840 --> 00:13:50.879
You know, like, hey, you're talking too much out there, be quiet, Finn.
00:13:51.120 --> 00:13:53.279
You know, like I'm like, oh, don't talk to my kid, okay?
00:13:53.440 --> 00:13:56.799
Like, you know, so I I you know that's weird.
00:13:57.519 --> 00:14:01.120
So but thinking back, that was he wasn't cussing, geez, lady.
00:14:01.759 --> 00:14:03.200
He was just in your garbage, yeah.
00:14:03.440 --> 00:14:04.559
Toughen up, buttercup.
00:14:05.279 --> 00:14:10.080
One of the greatest beers of my life as a kid was that I would do something and somebody would tell my dad.
00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:10.879
Yeah, yeah.
00:14:11.039 --> 00:14:11.440
Oh, yeah.
00:14:11.679 --> 00:14:22.960
And and I've I've just observed that society has lost that, and I think it's because we're not willing as a community to do something out of blood, not out of blood.
00:14:23.039 --> 00:14:27.200
Oh, that kid running to the mouth, but like that kid's better than that.
00:14:27.440 --> 00:14:31.200
That kid's parents would not want him to do that.
00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:38.559
Yeah, so I I think too, okay, to answer the question, how do you raise a kid that that obeys?
00:14:38.720 --> 00:14:49.200
Not um not just you, they just obey, is Colossians 3 23, do everything that you do as if for the Lord and not for man.
00:14:50.639 --> 00:14:53.840
I mean, you don't need a whole lot of explanation with that.
00:14:54.240 --> 00:14:55.759
Everything everything is everything.
00:14:56.159 --> 00:15:02.240
Everything that you do, work it hard at it, as if you are working for the Lord and not for man.
00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:04.720
And that can get tiresome.
00:15:05.120 --> 00:15:05.600
Sure.
00:15:05.919 --> 00:15:16.960
And you, you know, if you're I can how many times I've like been cutting grass, weed eating, thinking, the Lord was coming to our house today, would I would I do this a little better?
00:15:17.840 --> 00:15:20.000
If you think about that for everything, that will wear me out.
00:15:20.159 --> 00:15:20.720
You know what I'm saying?
00:15:20.799 --> 00:15:27.600
Like, you know, when we get finished with here, I'll move the chairs back and be like, man, if the Lord was gonna come into this room, would I put the chairs back better than I put them back now?
00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:34.960
It is tiresome thinking through that, but it just builds a standard too of excellence.
00:15:35.360 --> 00:15:40.960
And and I don't I don't think it's an uh build a standard of excellence that involves stress.
00:15:41.200 --> 00:15:41.759
Right.
00:15:42.320 --> 00:15:44.480
As much as it does trying to achieve something.
00:15:44.559 --> 00:15:47.759
I don't I don't think that should add stress to your life.
00:15:48.240 --> 00:15:48.639
You know?
00:15:48.960 --> 00:15:57.200
But if we go back and look at the family in those in these first four verses, you know, we're we're talking about the husband, if he leads well, the wife will follow.
00:15:57.360 --> 00:16:02.480
If the husband and wife lead well, if they lead with excellence, we weren't always perfect, you know.
00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:09.200
We we did, you know, we were learning how to raise kids, but you try to put that and instill that into your children, and they see that.
00:16:09.440 --> 00:16:14.399
And I think when they see that, they'll you know be more tempted to want to lead and and and follow.
00:16:14.799 --> 00:16:16.559
Yeah, you're setting the standard there.
00:16:16.720 --> 00:16:16.799
Right.
00:16:16.960 --> 00:16:31.600
And how often have we had teachable moments where your kids be you raise them, not that they're perfect, but you're raising them in the Lord, and they look at the outside world, the unbelievers, and they're like, What's up with them?
00:16:31.759 --> 00:16:38.559
What what what's and then they start seeing the difference between your household and an unbeliever's household.
00:16:38.879 --> 00:16:43.679
And so, and there's that there's that true delineation between the between the two.
00:16:44.240 --> 00:16:46.080
It's a great teaching example.
00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:57.200
Like, you know, just turn on the evening news and watch that, you know, like you can point out, you know, it uh what they're doing, do you does that glorify Christ in any way?
00:16:57.600 --> 00:16:57.840
No.
00:16:58.480 --> 00:17:00.960
And so, well, what are we doing to glorify Christ?
00:17:01.360 --> 00:17:03.279
Okay, so take an example of that.
00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:05.920
I'm using the Bobos as an example, okay.
00:17:06.160 --> 00:17:08.000
They have awesome, they have awesome.
00:17:08.400 --> 00:17:11.759
I mean, ever most people in here, most of you in here have awesome kids.
00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:14.559
I so but I would say my bad yeah.
00:17:15.519 --> 00:17:17.359
Yeah, but I would say they have great kids.
00:17:17.599 --> 00:17:19.680
Every single one of them are very different.
00:17:20.400 --> 00:17:21.279
Would you all agree?
00:17:21.599 --> 00:17:22.079
Very different.
00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:32.640
They're all very different, they all have their own personalities, they all like things that the other person doesn't like, but you can't find one of them that like are aren't enjoyable to be around.
00:17:32.960 --> 00:17:35.920
They're great kids, but they're all very different personalities.
00:17:36.559 --> 00:17:52.240
And that comes from a standard that was set probably a long time ago, wasn't set last week, and you're like, gosh, you know, we've now that we've gotten in middle school, you know, we really need to tighten up on some of our, you know, I need to discipline them for the first time, you know, like that that was already a behavior that was set.
00:17:52.559 --> 00:17:53.440
Yeah, start early.
00:17:53.599 --> 00:17:58.640
Yeah, and I I I think it's it's early and often, and you don't have to do it a whole lot.
00:17:58.960 --> 00:18:10.720
And I I would just say, how do you I can go to any any of their kids, I can go to any of their kids and ask something, and one, they'll look at you, and the other thing is they'll they'll do what you just asked, they'll obey.
00:18:10.880 --> 00:18:15.599
Yeah, you know, and I would say despite our parenting.
00:18:17.200 --> 00:18:19.599
I was getting to remove that anyway, don't I?
00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:36.160
Yeah, but I would just say that's that's the kids in the in in in this room, you know, like the the parents of kids in this room is is a lot of that is is there's a standard that you had, and it wasn't something that you made.
00:18:36.319 --> 00:18:41.920
I mean, I tell people all the time, I didn't, I mean, I it wasn't like there was a a dad telling me what to do.
00:18:42.160 --> 00:18:42.880
It just happened.
00:18:43.119 --> 00:18:45.359
And I that you know, I'm trying to figure it out.
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:47.759
You know, some of it's just because Brent's like, hey, do you think we should do?
00:18:47.839 --> 00:18:51.279
And I'm just thinking, like, I probably should, you know, like I probably should do what you just added.
00:18:51.359 --> 00:18:52.480
I don't know, nobody did that to me.
00:18:52.559 --> 00:18:52.960
I don't know.
00:18:53.039 --> 00:18:53.920
I guess I'll try it.
00:18:54.160 --> 00:19:01.680
You know, but and I think some of that is as you strive for that, as you strive for those things, the Lord does what Sand says.
00:19:01.759 --> 00:19:11.599
I mean, there's an umbrella that He shows grace and He shows you and delivers and and He He makes things happen and gets you to the point of where this passage started.
00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:23.440
Wives, submit to your husbands, husbands, learn to love your wife, you know, like you know, to to raise children that obey and to do everything that you do as if you were working for the Lord and not for man.
00:19:23.680 --> 00:19:25.680
And you think, well, how am I supposed to do all that?
00:19:25.839 --> 00:19:29.039
Well, I think you just do the next right thing.
00:19:29.440 --> 00:19:31.200
And then do the next right thing.
00:19:31.440 --> 00:19:39.519
And there's gonna come battles from that, but you like I said, you you have an army of people if you you do it with with other people.
00:19:39.759 --> 00:19:41.359
So they're always looking.
00:19:41.519 --> 00:19:41.759
Yeah.
00:19:42.160 --> 00:19:44.240
Anyone else want to add to any of that?
00:19:45.440 --> 00:20:06.480
I will say this generation that's coming up, they I I don't I mean, we were we were kids at one point, and I'm not saying that our raising was any harder or any easier than now, but I'm sure you'll notice with your daughter we can we can put Anna Kate in the court.
00:20:06.640 --> 00:20:13.599
We can, you know, we don't beat her, but we could potentially beat her or ground her, take things away from her.
00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:22.720
We do all the things, and she's just kind of like so parenting her is much different than how I was parented.
00:20:22.960 --> 00:20:25.599
I grew up in a single mom household.
00:20:25.839 --> 00:20:27.519
So I didn't have the father figure.
00:20:27.680 --> 00:20:33.440
So letting Taylor parent is difficult because I didn't.
00:20:33.920 --> 00:20:47.680
I grew up in a house tall boy, so yeah, and so so having letting stepping aside as her mother and being like, okay, you do what you need to do is difficult for me because I didn't have that.
00:20:47.759 --> 00:20:50.240
Now, did my mother instill the fear of God in me?
00:20:50.480 --> 00:20:51.359
Absolutely.
00:20:51.680 --> 00:20:55.599
I was 27 when I found out I was pregnant with AK, I was ready to move to Canada.
00:20:56.000 --> 00:20:57.519
I was like, I'm out of here.
00:20:58.079 --> 00:21:16.480
Um, but it just not only the pushback that the kids give now, but just leading them and not being an aggressor in the leading process is just difficult.
00:21:17.359 --> 00:21:20.559
I think you had a great question or immediately had a question.
00:21:20.640 --> 00:21:25.759
How many of you parent your kid the way that you were parented?
00:21:28.880 --> 00:21:32.160
Anybody you think you think you I mean I don't think it's wrong or right.
00:21:32.240 --> 00:21:32.559
I just wonder.
00:21:33.599 --> 00:21:34.400
Yeah, to a degree.
00:21:34.480 --> 00:21:34.960
I agree with that.
00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:43.200
How many of you parent completely different the way that you were parenting?
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:45.920
I do, yeah.
00:21:46.400 --> 00:21:48.160
I I don't know what that means.
00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:51.039
I just was wondering that when you said that, I was like, do I parent like mom?
00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:53.440
I mean, I think I got the worst spanking out of everybody.
00:21:53.599 --> 00:21:55.519
I mean, I know I got the worst spanking out of everybody.
00:21:55.759 --> 00:21:57.839
Uh I remember, yeah, yeah, I remember that.
00:21:57.920 --> 00:22:01.279
I remember everybody was crying, telling my mom, please stop my mom.
00:22:01.920 --> 00:22:04.000
I'd hit my sister in the face with a hockey stick.
00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:14.720
I and uh she right here next to her face, and she had this big old knot right here, and then my mom was, you know, she's just kicking me, you know, and so and everybody's like, mom saving many.
00:22:14.799 --> 00:22:17.039
She's holding mom's something, you know.
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:19.039
So anyway, yeah, yeah, anyway.
00:22:20.480 --> 00:22:21.519
That's crazy.
00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:24.640
I'm just taking back being thrown down them steps.
00:22:27.519 --> 00:22:28.079
Anyway.
00:22:28.400 --> 00:22:30.160
I will say it's a little different for us now.
00:22:30.240 --> 00:22:38.720
We've got grandkids, you know, we've got a two-year-old and a three-year-old, and and Lauren and Alex do a really good job parenting them, but I'm the big kid, so I have to be careful what I do.
00:22:38.960 --> 00:22:41.039
Like, okay, we got to do it this way.
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:46.160
But but but I do try I I think uh we parented like our parents raised us.
00:22:46.480 --> 00:22:47.599
So for the most, you know.
00:22:48.079 --> 00:22:51.279
I've got I've got a story when I was probably about nine years old.
00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:57.759
I was trailing behind my mother in the grocery store, and they kept playing the same song over and over and over.
00:22:57.920 --> 00:23:00.240
And you may have to beat this, beat this.
00:23:00.319 --> 00:23:00.640
I don't know.
00:23:00.720 --> 00:23:01.359
I won't say it.
00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:07.759
But anyway, uh little n little chubby nine-year-old Jeff was like, 'I wish I quit playing that D-A-M end song.
00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:20.400
My mom turned around, she was pushing this cart, she turned around and backhanded me.' And she stuck her finger in Chubby Little Jeff's face and said, We don't talk like that in our house because we represent Christ.
00:23:20.559 --> 00:23:28.799
And then that stuck with Chubby Little Jeff even to this day, where you know, I'm really mindful if I'm gonna say anything.
00:23:29.119 --> 00:23:39.920
But they'd always tell me when I'd go to leave, and they're like, Jeff, remember who you are, who you represent, Christ first, and then this family, don't bring shame upon either one of them.
00:23:40.160 --> 00:23:45.680
And so that was all it took for me to really have in that decision process.
00:23:45.920 --> 00:23:50.880
Do I go with this group that's going to do whatever they're going to do, or do I go home?
00:23:51.039 --> 00:23:51.279
Right.
00:23:51.440 --> 00:23:56.319
And I would say probably 99% of the time I would go home because I remember getting backhanded.
00:23:56.559 --> 00:24:04.000
Not that you should backhand your children, but that would that we I've never backhanded my children, but I have told them that story.
00:24:04.240 --> 00:24:05.759
And I've I tell them the same thing.
00:24:05.839 --> 00:24:07.119
I was like, remember who you are.
00:24:07.359 --> 00:24:07.759
That's right.
00:24:08.000 --> 00:24:14.079
Who you represent, Christ first, and then this family, and don't bring shame upon either one.
00:24:14.160 --> 00:24:22.880
But also follow up with that in saying that, you know, if you do mess up, then there's forgiveness in that, uh, and through Christ Jesus.
00:24:23.119 --> 00:24:24.240
And we will forgive us.
