00:00:00
Speaker 1: Victoria McCurdy, the South Australian LGA CEO, will join us in just a moment to talk about a vote that the Local Government Association are taking from its members with regard to compulsory voting. We thought we should do the same among our listener base. We spent a lot of time talking about councils. We spent a lot of time being critical of councils, and we know participation rates are very low.
00:00:23
Speaker 2: Is.
00:00:24
Speaker 1: The cure worse than the disease. 8223 0000. Is it time to make it compulsory? If you don't like it, should you be compelled to have your say in it? Raymond in Salisbury has called in on this. Raymond, good morning. What do you think?
00:00:39
Speaker 3: Good morning, folks. Look, I tend to agree. It should be compulsory. But at the same time, we need to maybe look at making voting online.
00:00:49
Speaker 1: Because.
00:00:51
Speaker 3: Yeah, because it's one thing to have federal and state elections, and it's a nightmare lining up. You could spend all day to do it. And councils is probably harder because you wouldn't have as many polling booths and whatnot in your local council area. But if it's online, it's simple. It's easy for everybody to do. And I'm of the opinion that it's no good. planning about something unless you're prepared to do something about fixing it.
00:01:16
Speaker 1: You know, it's funny, Raymond, you've just brought up the very thing I was thinking about last night, and I wonder if the barrier to entry was reduced, whether it would change, and let us know, folks, whether it would change your position on this. If you could do it on your phone. Now, let's forget the technological challenges. Let's imagine we live in a world where that is possible. Is that the one thing that's in the way from this being a good idea, or do you have other philosophical problems like Scott does on the text line? He says, guys, hell no. He says, why is that? Because what's the end game? I'm forced to vote nationally, and that doesn't stop me from getting stuck with a PM that gets slagged off by eight-year-old children. Scott, drawing reference to Bronte Manuel's son yesterday, getting all political. Sorry, you were about to say something, Scott.
00:01:58
Speaker 4: I was going to say, I don't actually think it's too hard to vote in council elections.
00:02:02
Speaker 1: It's a postal one. Yes.
00:02:03
Speaker 4: It gets sent out to you. You fill out a form. You put it back in the envelope it came in.
00:02:07
Speaker 1: So there's no line-ups as it is.
00:02:09
Speaker 4: So you don't– it's not– it doesn't have to become a big– thing on a Saturday like we do with a state and federal.
00:02:16
Speaker 1: Or is the intention to change that? I guess we can ask our next guest. Yeah, well, let's find out. Victoria McCurdy joins us now. Victoria, good morning to you.
00:02:24
Speaker 2: Good morning.
00:02:25
Speaker 3: How are you?
00:02:26
Speaker 4: Good, thank you. So this vote will happen. Has there been a look at how council elections could look if we do end up going down the track of compulsory voting?
00:02:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there's been lots of conversations and it has been a topic for quite some time. And your caller just a moment ago makes a very good point. So there's two votes. There's one to see whether our sector is keen to look at advocating for postal voting, sorry, for compulsory voting. And the other decision is about looking at an alternative method of voting. Because we know once upon a time it was polling booths and then we went into postal voting. Postal voting, when you think about our return rate, is very expensive for councils. It is fully funded by the councils. It costs about $ 9. 8 million a year. And I'll provide you a couple of examples. So there's 131,000 electors, that's people who are eligible to vote in, say, the city of Onkaparinga. If they're only getting a 24% return rate, all of those postal votes are going out and only 24% are returned. but the postage is paid. So it's a very expensive exercise. I don't feel there is that much confidence nowadays in terms of the postal voting, although it is a very valid way. It's an easy and convenient way. But there are other alternatives, like your caller said, digitally, polling booth or a mixture. But there are two decisions. It's one about compulsory voting and the other is about alternative methods of actually obtaining those votes.
00:04:03
Speaker 1: I've got a pretty good handle because it's coming through on the text line now on what the average punter thinks about the arguments for and against compulsory voting. What are the proponents and the detractors among your membership saying, Victoria, those that are councils themselves, what are those for it say the reasons for doing it are and what are those who are against it say the reasons for not doing it are?
00:04:25
Speaker 2: Again, there's a mixture of conversations. There are some who are concerned that compulsory voting would... attract more political parties into local government. And it's not to say they aren't already present. You would say the majority, and if you're looking at the statistics from the 22 election, the majority of the 600-odd elected members declare themselves as independents. They are there to represent their community, as they should be. But there is a mixture of those who have to declare if they are a member of a political party. That's a concern because it should be about... your elected member representing the community where they live and where they represent those residents. And there's also, I mean, there's others that will say, you know, it's a privilege to be able to vote in our country. It's a privilege to have three levels of government. That's why we have the country that we do, because of our government system. And so there's arguments for and against, but what the LGA is looking to do obtained from its members, those 68 councils, to go, is this a priority for us as the LGA to advocate to the state government? Because it requires a decision of our state government to make it legislation, whether that voting is compulsory or not.
00:05:45
Speaker 4: Okay. And is the vote purely about that fact that the LGA will advocate to the state government for it, or do you then look at some of the minutia, some of the detail about how it could work and you know, how you get to know your candidates because that's another thing. A lot of people on the text line are saying, I've never had a candidate knock on my door. I don't know what they stand for until I get that thing in the letterbox and then I don't know who to vote for because I don't really know anything about them.
00:06:13
Speaker 2: Absolutely. And they're all valid questions. So currently now we're not looking to change for the 27 elections in April. Let's make that very, very clear. If this is a decision that our members are looking for, for the LGA to work on. It would be something that we would be working towards the 2031 election. And it wouldn't just be we advocate for compulsory voting, but what we would be working with our state government about going, well, what does that look like? What needs to change? Then what methods of voting are going to be the most appropriate? So it would require that work and energy to go into that. It's not just advocating. We want compulsory voting. It's also about educating our community. I think It always surprises me the amount of people. I listen to your radio and other radios a lot about the amount of people who want to complain or criticise about council. There's a lot of good things that come back and feedback about councils. But when you think of the percentage of 32%, 34% of electors only participate, yet they want to complain, you're going, you should be involved. You should know who your elected member is. they're not all going to get to knock on your door. Many do work exceptionally hard in their communities. It's not the same as a state or a federal member because they get a stipend, they get an allowance. Most people work full-time as well as being an elected member. They give it their time because they're usually passionate about their community. They're usually volunteering their communities already and they're trying to make where they live the best place possible. So I just think people should be paying more attention to their local elect members because it is that most local level of government.
00:07:55
Speaker 1: Victoria, someone's texted through with the suggestion that local government elections happen on the same day as state government elections. We synchronise the process. You go into the ballot box, it's an extra piece of paper, and you vote there. Is that something that's ever been canvassed at local government association level?
00:08:12
Speaker 2: No, it hasn't. And I actually heard that yesterday. I think the same question was asked of our president when she was talking about the same matter. And it's a very interesting way of looking at it. My personal opinion is I believe there can be just as much confusion at a state election as to who they're voting for, whether you're voting in the upper house, the lower house, who are the candidates. Imagine mixing that in with 600 other elected members who are coming in at local governments. I think they're very distinctive, different levels of government, and they should be given the attention that they deserve in separate elections.
00:08:49
Speaker 1: How do they do it interstate?
00:08:50
Speaker 4: Because I know in Tasmania and I think Victoria, it's compulsory. It is.
00:08:55
Speaker 2: So Tasmania, it came in compulsory in 2022. South Australia and WA are the only states where it is not compulsory. So again, they require this compulsory in every other state except South Australia and WA.
00:09:10
Speaker 1: It's a fascinating conversation and it's really stirred up our listeners, Victoria. There's some terrific feedback coming through, so we'll get to that. Thank you so much for your time this morning. Appreciate it.
00:09:18
Speaker 2: No, thank you very much.
00:09:19
Speaker 1: LGA South Australia CEO Victoria McCurdy on the push. But it's not a push yet. They're canvassing their members to see what the attitudes are from council to the potential for compulsory elections. Our listeners at the moment are having their views and they're very forthright because people feel very strongly on both positions on this one. I think it's pretty 50-50. I don't know.
00:09:40
Speaker 4: What are you gauging from the text line?
00:09:43
Speaker 1: No, I think 50-50. And then there's some outside of it, like Rob, who says, all in the same day limits access to multiple chances of democracy sausage. So think carefully about what you're asking. That's a great point, Rob.
00:09:54
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:09:54
Speaker 1: We haven't really thought through the ramifications of that. Yes, the sausage ramifications. Brad says.
00:10:00
Speaker 4: seriously, compulsory voting for councils is ridiculous. I've never heard a better example of blowing your own trumpet. One, no one really knows much at all about the candidates. Their voting info cards are a carbon copy of each other.
00:10:10
Speaker 1: And two, the cost.
00:10:12
Speaker 4: Really, focus on rubbish and roads. Thanks, Brad. And then the next one. Yes. Council voting should be compulsory. I'm never notified about council elections or receive information in the post.
00:10:23
Speaker 1: So, yeah, people have very different views on it. I'm intrigued by how this rates in terms of councils because it's a 50-50 issue in the 5AA breakfast order, which is no doubt. And it's really hard to get 50-50 issues these days. Usually it's heavily skewed one way or the other.
00:10:41
Speaker 4: Yeah.
00:10:42
Speaker 1: I think it would need to be clearer. People are passionate about this.
00:10:44
Speaker 4: Because that little blurb that you get about each councillor is sometimes not enough and it can be very... It's like getting a government statement. It's just a bit of propaganda. It's what they want you to know about them. You don't have a chance to prosecute and question them. And a lot of them can just get rid of their party membership so then they can say, I'm not a member of a party just before the election. And they can say they're unaffiliated when really they do have certain views on certain issues because they do affiliate themselves.
00:11:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm... I'm not sure what's worse, the current situation with not a great deal of transparency or a formalised system where it's all political parties. Yeah. I think it might actually be, whilst I think there's this repulsion of, oh, we don't want politics in local council, if it's already there a little bit, it's already there. Yeah, it is. It's there. It's there. So maybe we should just go whole hog and have this declared, have it compulsory and have the entire process be totally transparent. At least we have a broad sense of what you're voting for as opposed to, relying on blurbs alone, which is not really a way to conduct things.
Speaker 1: Victoria McCurdy, the South Australian LGA CEO, will join us in just a moment to talk about a vote that the Local Government Association are taking from its members with regard to compulsory voting. We thought we should do the same among our listener base. We spent a lot of time talking about councils. We spent a lot of time being critical of councils, and we know participation rates are very low.
00:00:23
Speaker 2: Is.
00:00:24
Speaker 1: The cure worse than the disease. 8223 0000. Is it time to make it compulsory? If you don't like it, should you be compelled to have your say in it? Raymond in Salisbury has called in on this. Raymond, good morning. What do you think?
00:00:39
Speaker 3: Good morning, folks. Look, I tend to agree. It should be compulsory. But at the same time, we need to maybe look at making voting online.
00:00:49
Speaker 1: Because.
00:00:51
Speaker 3: Yeah, because it's one thing to have federal and state elections, and it's a nightmare lining up. You could spend all day to do it. And councils is probably harder because you wouldn't have as many polling booths and whatnot in your local council area. But if it's online, it's simple. It's easy for everybody to do. And I'm of the opinion that it's no good. planning about something unless you're prepared to do something about fixing it.
00:01:16
Speaker 1: You know, it's funny, Raymond, you've just brought up the very thing I was thinking about last night, and I wonder if the barrier to entry was reduced, whether it would change, and let us know, folks, whether it would change your position on this. If you could do it on your phone. Now, let's forget the technological challenges. Let's imagine we live in a world where that is possible. Is that the one thing that's in the way from this being a good idea, or do you have other philosophical problems like Scott does on the text line? He says, guys, hell no. He says, why is that? Because what's the end game? I'm forced to vote nationally, and that doesn't stop me from getting stuck with a PM that gets slagged off by eight-year-old children. Scott, drawing reference to Bronte Manuel's son yesterday, getting all political. Sorry, you were about to say something, Scott.
00:01:58
Speaker 4: I was going to say, I don't actually think it's too hard to vote in council elections.
00:02:02
Speaker 1: It's a postal one. Yes.
00:02:03
Speaker 4: It gets sent out to you. You fill out a form. You put it back in the envelope it came in.
00:02:07
Speaker 1: So there's no line-ups as it is.
00:02:09
Speaker 4: So you don't– it's not– it doesn't have to become a big– thing on a Saturday like we do with a state and federal.
00:02:16
Speaker 1: Or is the intention to change that? I guess we can ask our next guest. Yeah, well, let's find out. Victoria McCurdy joins us now. Victoria, good morning to you.
00:02:24
Speaker 2: Good morning.
00:02:25
Speaker 3: How are you?
00:02:26
Speaker 4: Good, thank you. So this vote will happen. Has there been a look at how council elections could look if we do end up going down the track of compulsory voting?
00:02:39
Speaker 2: Yeah, so there's been lots of conversations and it has been a topic for quite some time. And your caller just a moment ago makes a very good point. So there's two votes. There's one to see whether our sector is keen to look at advocating for postal voting, sorry, for compulsory voting. And the other decision is about looking at an alternative method of voting. Because we know once upon a time it was polling booths and then we went into postal voting. Postal voting, when you think about our return rate, is very expensive for councils. It is fully funded by the councils. It costs about $ 9. 8 million a year. And I'll provide you a couple of examples. So there's 131,000 electors, that's people who are eligible to vote in, say, the city of Onkaparinga. If they're only getting a 24% return rate, all of those postal votes are going out and only 24% are returned. but the postage is paid. So it's a very expensive exercise. I don't feel there is that much confidence nowadays in terms of the postal voting, although it is a very valid way. It's an easy and convenient way. But there are other alternatives, like your caller said, digitally, polling booth or a mixture. But there are two decisions. It's one about compulsory voting and the other is about alternative methods of actually obtaining those votes.
00:04:03
Speaker 1: I've got a pretty good handle because it's coming through on the text line now on what the average punter thinks about the arguments for and against compulsory voting. What are the proponents and the detractors among your membership saying, Victoria, those that are councils themselves, what are those for it say the reasons for doing it are and what are those who are against it say the reasons for not doing it are?
00:04:25
Speaker 2: Again, there's a mixture of conversations. There are some who are concerned that compulsory voting would... attract more political parties into local government. And it's not to say they aren't already present. You would say the majority, and if you're looking at the statistics from the 22 election, the majority of the 600-odd elected members declare themselves as independents. They are there to represent their community, as they should be. But there is a mixture of those who have to declare if they are a member of a political party. That's a concern because it should be about... your elected member representing the community where they live and where they represent those residents. And there's also, I mean, there's others that will say, you know, it's a privilege to be able to vote in our country. It's a privilege to have three levels of government. That's why we have the country that we do, because of our government system. And so there's arguments for and against, but what the LGA is looking to do obtained from its members, those 68 councils, to go, is this a priority for us as the LGA to advocate to the state government? Because it requires a decision of our state government to make it legislation, whether that voting is compulsory or not.
00:05:45
Speaker 4: Okay. And is the vote purely about that fact that the LGA will advocate to the state government for it, or do you then look at some of the minutia, some of the detail about how it could work and you know, how you get to know your candidates because that's another thing. A lot of people on the text line are saying, I've never had a candidate knock on my door. I don't know what they stand for until I get that thing in the letterbox and then I don't know who to vote for because I don't really know anything about them.
00:06:13
Speaker 2: Absolutely. And they're all valid questions. So currently now we're not looking to change for the 27 elections in April. Let's make that very, very clear. If this is a decision that our members are looking for, for the LGA to work on. It would be something that we would be working towards the 2031 election. And it wouldn't just be we advocate for compulsory voting, but what we would be working with our state government about going, well, what does that look like? What needs to change? Then what methods of voting are going to be the most appropriate? So it would require that work and energy to go into that. It's not just advocating. We want compulsory voting. It's also about educating our community. I think It always surprises me the amount of people. I listen to your radio and other radios a lot about the amount of people who want to complain or criticise about council. There's a lot of good things that come back and feedback about councils. But when you think of the percentage of 32%, 34% of electors only participate, yet they want to complain, you're going, you should be involved. You should know who your elected member is. they're not all going to get to knock on your door. Many do work exceptionally hard in their communities. It's not the same as a state or a federal member because they get a stipend, they get an allowance. Most people work full-time as well as being an elected member. They give it their time because they're usually passionate about their community. They're usually volunteering their communities already and they're trying to make where they live the best place possible. So I just think people should be paying more attention to their local elect members because it is that most local level of government.
00:07:55
Speaker 1: Victoria, someone's texted through with the suggestion that local government elections happen on the same day as state government elections. We synchronise the process. You go into the ballot box, it's an extra piece of paper, and you vote there. Is that something that's ever been canvassed at local government association level?
00:08:12
Speaker 2: No, it hasn't. And I actually heard that yesterday. I think the same question was asked of our president when she was talking about the same matter. And it's a very interesting way of looking at it. My personal opinion is I believe there can be just as much confusion at a state election as to who they're voting for, whether you're voting in the upper house, the lower house, who are the candidates. Imagine mixing that in with 600 other elected members who are coming in at local governments. I think they're very distinctive, different levels of government, and they should be given the attention that they deserve in separate elections.
00:08:49
Speaker 1: How do they do it interstate?
00:08:50
Speaker 4: Because I know in Tasmania and I think Victoria, it's compulsory. It is.
00:08:55
Speaker 2: So Tasmania, it came in compulsory in 2022. South Australia and WA are the only states where it is not compulsory. So again, they require this compulsory in every other state except South Australia and WA.
00:09:10
Speaker 1: It's a fascinating conversation and it's really stirred up our listeners, Victoria. There's some terrific feedback coming through, so we'll get to that. Thank you so much for your time this morning. Appreciate it.
00:09:18
Speaker 2: No, thank you very much.
00:09:19
Speaker 1: LGA South Australia CEO Victoria McCurdy on the push. But it's not a push yet. They're canvassing their members to see what the attitudes are from council to the potential for compulsory elections. Our listeners at the moment are having their views and they're very forthright because people feel very strongly on both positions on this one. I think it's pretty 50-50. I don't know.
00:09:40
Speaker 4: What are you gauging from the text line?
00:09:43
Speaker 1: No, I think 50-50. And then there's some outside of it, like Rob, who says, all in the same day limits access to multiple chances of democracy sausage. So think carefully about what you're asking. That's a great point, Rob.
00:09:54
Speaker 2: Yes.
00:09:54
Speaker 1: We haven't really thought through the ramifications of that. Yes, the sausage ramifications. Brad says.
00:10:00
Speaker 4: seriously, compulsory voting for councils is ridiculous. I've never heard a better example of blowing your own trumpet. One, no one really knows much at all about the candidates. Their voting info cards are a carbon copy of each other.
00:10:10
Speaker 1: And two, the cost.
00:10:12
Speaker 4: Really, focus on rubbish and roads. Thanks, Brad. And then the next one. Yes. Council voting should be compulsory. I'm never notified about council elections or receive information in the post.
00:10:23
Speaker 1: So, yeah, people have very different views on it. I'm intrigued by how this rates in terms of councils because it's a 50-50 issue in the 5AA breakfast order, which is no doubt. And it's really hard to get 50-50 issues these days. Usually it's heavily skewed one way or the other.
00:10:41
Speaker 4: Yeah.
00:10:42
Speaker 1: I think it would need to be clearer. People are passionate about this.
00:10:44
Speaker 4: Because that little blurb that you get about each councillor is sometimes not enough and it can be very... It's like getting a government statement. It's just a bit of propaganda. It's what they want you to know about them. You don't have a chance to prosecute and question them. And a lot of them can just get rid of their party membership so then they can say, I'm not a member of a party just before the election. And they can say they're unaffiliated when really they do have certain views on certain issues because they do affiliate themselves.
00:11:10
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm... I'm not sure what's worse, the current situation with not a great deal of transparency or a formalised system where it's all political parties. Yeah. I think it might actually be, whilst I think there's this repulsion of, oh, we don't want politics in local council, if it's already there a little bit, it's already there. Yeah, it is. It's there. It's there. So maybe we should just go whole hog and have this declared, have it compulsory and have the entire process be totally transparent. At least we have a broad sense of what you're voting for as opposed to, relying on blurbs alone, which is not really a way to conduct things.
