Beau Smith Talks Earp, Guy Gardner, and the Man of Steel

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Hey, everybody, welcome back. It's time for word Balloon, the
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Coup Conversation show. John Suntrass here. Now I'm gonna present
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a new conversation I just had last night with both
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smith folks. I don't know what's been going on, but
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I've had the biggest problems with technology. Monday and Tuesday
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I interviewed Jeremy Adams. I'm gonna that'll be on the
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next episode of word Balloon, and my microphone settings jumped,
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so it's gonna sound like I am in the bathroom,
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while Jeremy is very clean. With his zoom interview that
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we did, we tried. We started on Streamyard, didn't work,
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so we had to go to Zoom, and then my
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settings jumped and I didn't pay attention, so I'm gonna
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sound crappy. Then Keith Williams and I tried to do
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stream Yard. His video was freezing, and so again we
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switched to zoom and that sounded like hell, and we
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had a bunch of problems. So that interview is coming
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on Friday, but it'll just be the clean stream Yard part.
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At least we had a good, clean thirty minute. Now
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it comes to bo Bo and I could not get
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stream yard working. We couldn't get zoom working. So finally
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we just recorded something called a telephone conversation. Your grandparents
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might have heard of this technology. But the good news
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is it turned out great, and it's great to talk
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to Bo, a true cowboy of comics, from creating the
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cult favorite Winona RP. To seeing it ride high as
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a Sci Fi Channel hit TV series. We talk about
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the roots of Winona, how he's now teaming up with
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the shows stars Melanie Scrafano and Tim Rozen to bring
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new comic book adventures to the page. Totally new concepts,
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but that's just the start. Bo shares his unfiltered thoughts
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on the new Superman movie why he thinks the portrayal
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of Guy Gardner in The Justice Gang might be the
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most accurate DC comic adaptation to date, especially considering he
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wrote the book on Guy literally taking over from Chuck
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Dixon on Guy Gardner Warrior. We also hit the DC
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vaults to visit botht time Writing, Catwoman, Wildcat, and other
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unsung gems that his knack for tough characters with heart.
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You're really gonna love this conversation with Bo Smith, word
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Balloon is brought to you by the Legend of Kingdom Come.
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com slash word balloon. Boat smith, Welcome back to word Balloon.
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Gee bar was.
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I'm so sorry that technology was conspiring against this, but
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you're not alone. I had trouble today interviewing Keith Williams
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the inchor we were having trouble and even last night
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with Jeremy Adams. So it's been a bad luck week
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for me. So I blame it on me, but good
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to talk to you.
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Well, no, the pleasure is all mine. And trust me,
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it never shows because like I said, I always watch
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you when you're on and it's always flawless, and I think,
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my gosh, it must be nice to be that computer
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computer literate.
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It's all right, man, Well you're comic book literate and
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that's the important thing, literally literate. Lots of great work
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over the years. And I was even saying, as we
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were getting prepared for this, I was grabbing some covers
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here and there and got the last time we talked
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to was when you were doing cob Wow. No great,
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because we did that. I got so much response from
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the interview that you did that people discovered it on
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yours for the first time. Because I always have made
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a habit, you know, being in marketing for over forty years,
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I always asked, but where'd you hear this?
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Or where'd you hear that?
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And they said, well, you know, word blue John Word Blue.
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Wow, and that that was a big deal to me.
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That truly was because you You really helped put that
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book over a hump.
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There was you.
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And again at that point USA Today in the paper
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they had done I think on the the best crime
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comics that had come out, and they did five and
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Cobb was listed as that and that's where a lot
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of people discovered the book.
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With the success of Win on Earth, have you tried
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to shop Cob around and get any nibbles.
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Cobby Cobb was At the same time we got Wine
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on Earth with Sci Fi, we had also put in
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development Cobb and pilot script was done, showrunners were picked right,
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you know, everything was everything was right on the thing,
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and I was working with them very close.
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And then are.
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Our Hollywood guys they called you know, I always called
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him here. Yes, he left IDW Entertainment, and things seemed
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to just kind of what is it developmental hell, they
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seemed to just go into that after that, which, Hey,
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when things are meant to be, they're meant to be,
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and when or not they're not. And I've already had
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Wine on Earth optioned and three different times before that,
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one with Peter Lindkoff, from Magnum p I and I
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think mcguy were on CBS, But back then he was
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a young guy in Los Angeles that was just starting out.
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He optioned at the first he had it for eighteen months,
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really couldn't get anywhere at that point. Then the second time,
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it was optioned by Fox, along with Fringe and Dollhouse,
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JJ Abrams and Joss Whedon at the same time, so
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and both Smith, Well, those two got made. Mine was
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getting ready to be made, and about the same time
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theirs were getting canceled, and they said, well, we really
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don't want to go with another one of these things
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right now, so they put that on the show. So, man, no,
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that's fine. But because again what was meant to be
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was meant to be and IDW At the time, Ted
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Adams was the CEO and the founder and stuff, and
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he calls me, he goes this. A few years later,
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he goes a sci fi network's real interest and win
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on Earth. You know they're really interested.
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I said, oh, good, good.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, well let me know if anything
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happens and hung off the phone. And to be honest
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with you, I never thought anything more about it because
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I didn't do this before and you know things are
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meant to be.
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They are.
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Well, he kept calling back, and then you know, Ted's
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been one of my best friends since nineteen ninety when
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we hired him an eclipse years ago. And wow, he
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kept saying, he goes, no, they're very serious about this,
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and I said, well, great, what do you need? So
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I'd give him what he needed. You know, he'd go
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back and forth, and I gotta be honest with you, John,
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Long story short, The next thing I knew, not only
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do we have a showrunner this that the other day
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sent me the Bible. They sent me what they want
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to do. They sent me the specs for script this
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at the other it was we were on the set
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before you knew it. And it was again right place,
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right time, And with Emily Andrews, who was the showrunner
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and head writer on the show, it was the right
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eyes on the right project. She got what Wine Owner
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Earth was and was able to transfer that to the screen.
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And I honest with you. You know, you've been in
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the comic book business a long time, and you know
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a lot of people, and you've you've heard all the stories. Well,
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at this point, when starting words started getting out amongst
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my peers, reed, sailors, fans, everything, and they started getting
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out a little bit that Hey, I was getting those calls,
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bo is this cruise is going to be happening. I said, well,
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we'll see, we'll see. And the cause that I was
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getting from my peers but other creators was hey, make
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sure you're right in it, make sure you're doing this,
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make sure you're doing that, blah blah blah.
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And.
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Are Yeah. I gotta be honest with you. I had
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to go against green because I was partly raised with
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that kind of thing. But I thought, no, you know,
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this is what they do every day. This is what
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their job is. If they were if I were taking
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a television show and transferring it into a comic book
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of a graphic novel, They're going to have to trust
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my expertise. And my thing was with wine Onna. We've
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been publishing it since ninety six, and my audience was solid,
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but it was there. It wasn't going up, it wasn't
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going down, but it was solid. To get it to
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a world wide audience, I set over a weekend and
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I said, I'm gonna have to let them do what
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they do best, and anything I can do to help
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great and I only had two actually small changes that
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they made and they were great, Yep, no problem. And
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they were small because I said, I've got to let
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them go with what they know, what they're doing to
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get this. And I got to tell you, John, it
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was like I handed Emily Andrews a loaf of bread
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and she fed the world. It's one of those kinds
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of things because she got wine on her Earth was
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about when she had away with cast in her right
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to get it to an audience that I did not
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have because, as you will know, for most of my
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career in comics, a lot of two fifty stuff like
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testosterone driven comics. That's what I've always done. I've done
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with female characters. I've always done them strong. But back
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then we just it's a good character. And I went
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from being the Titan of Testosterone in the Emperor of
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Estrogen and it more than doubled my fan base. I
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went from having males fifteen to fifty five to women
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fifteen to fifty five. And I also got a lot
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of different walks of life that came in because of it.
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And I am not one. And you've read a couple
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of my comics through the years I'm not one thenner
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now that puts my own agenda or politics or anything
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like that into comics. Being the things got like this
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because I've always I've always figured you're gonna lose half
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year that you got it. I just want to do
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entertainment for everybody. And they had the same vein and
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bang there went.
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Nine years later. You know.
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Yeah that honestly, it is so great because you're right.
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And also we've seen enough other comic properties come and
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go fast. Uh, that should have gotten the longer period
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if if it was on the right channel and the
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right time slot, all that stuff matters. And my god,
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you got four seasons out of one owner.
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Right, four seasons and the movie.
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But we did last year.
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Yeah, yeah, movie and the movie absolutely. Man. So with Emily,
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she was the showrunner. Had Emily done any other show
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running prior to.
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This, Yes, she did the Lost Girl on SPA that.
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I think that I ran about four seasons as well,
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and she did. There was another one, but I and
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I'm you don't nail me down on this. I think
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it was a Canadian only show. I'm not positive, but
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but definitely Lost Girl was her uh you know, big
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springboard and uh she's, I tell you, amazing person. I
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mean working with her, she was super gracious with everything because,
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to be honest with you, contractually, you know, it was
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one of those things where here's your check, mister Smith
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will have based on by you, and this that the other.
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That's all they and you know, you come up here
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on the set. That's basically all they had to do.
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But I was your embraced and brought him on everything.
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I mean, it was amazing. In fact, I was screwing
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things up from day one because Melanie Scrafano. I mean
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they sent me all the three all the three hundred
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Doug dish was for wine Own, for this character that
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made the rushes every day every morning. I was in
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on everything and they did not have to do all that.
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But with with.
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Melanie Scraffano is wine on Earth. She was gonna buy
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it at a three hundred. She was one of my
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top three, and which was kind of neat, but Ted
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Adams and the guys at IDW call said hey, yeah,
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they're gonna do this and the wine Own is gonna
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be played by Melanie Scraffano. So I immediately took that
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as oh, okay, the news is broke it's correct. So
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I emailed Melanie, Hey, Melanie, gad glad to have.
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You on his Wine on Earth.
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This is great.
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Blah blah blah. I get an email back from immediately
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going I got it, I got it, and I'm like, oh, man, oh,
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rookie mistake here you can tell I haven't you know?
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And but it was, you know, it was okay everything,
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and it makes a great anecdote for later, But uh, there.
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Was it good, be awesome.
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In the nine years that we were all doing this
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show and doing the other things, there were a few
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times I had to have Emily call and go, Bo, no,
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we're not supposed to say anything here. That's okay, you know.
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That's great. Well, you know, I'm continuing to enjoy Melanie's
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career because she's on Star Trek Strange New Worlds is
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Captain Battel, and we're all worried about her because it's
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it's uh uh this this new season started, and she's
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got a Goren lizard growing in her kind of like alien,
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so we're all worried her stomach's gonna explode. But meanwhile, also,
279
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and this is great serendipity, two other friends that are
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comic creators Tim Seely and Mike Norton. Yeah, make their
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comic revial Revival, excuse me not Revial, and and Melanie's
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the lead and also now and you'll appreciate this boat
283
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because you are the king of tistosterone. I don't know
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why I ignored Jag in the nineties and early two thousands,
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but I did. And all of a sudden, I'm looking
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on Amazon Prime and I'm like, oh, you know Jag,
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And I don't know where I read it a few
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months ago, but someone's like, yeah, you know, it's like
289
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a few good men meet top Gun. And I'm like, well,
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I like both of those things. I like military tribunals
291
00:16:14.759 --> 00:16:18.080
and I like fighter pilots vinjets. I'm like, where are
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I signs? And the pilot sucked me in. I've been
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watching it and to find that the guy is the
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sheriff and Melanie's dad in Revival. So I'm like, oh,
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this is crazy. So always she's great. She's great in
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Revival as well.
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She is.
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We ended up.
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I gotta tell you, we ended up. Oh, this is
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probably about about the second season. I left the door
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open for Emily, Melanie and Tim Rozan, who played Doc Holliday. Yeah,
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Tim is a lifelong like you and I a lifelong
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comic book fan, knows this stuff inside and out. Just
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I left the open door. I said, got want to
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co write someone on a comics I said, we can
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do that.
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Well, Tim and.
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00:17:06.839 --> 00:17:11.000
Melanie luckily enough to jump on it right then. And
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Emily was just you know, bombarded with the show and
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stuff that she tipped going. She'd always I will, bah will,
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I will. But unfortunately, you know, four seasons of the
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movie do I and we never got the chance. But
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she I would have loved that. But Melanie and Tim,
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you know, had written screenplays in this and yet, but
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they had not written a comic book script, which you know,
316
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if you look at them, especially mine, I do it
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on final draft, they look just like, you know, a screenplay.
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So I was familiar.
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But I got both of them, and to.
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This day, Tim and I are continuing to write together,
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and so are Melanie. And I'll tell you right now,
322
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Tim and I are doing a five issue series with
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Moonstone with is Chicago area guys Moonstone books called Apocalypse
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Agents of Danger, and that's five issues. Travis Smith is
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the artist Donning, So we're doing that. That should be
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coming out to Oh gosh, that's to the beginning of
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twenty six and Melanie and I've already finished and done
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with Clover Press, which is Robbie Robbins and Hank Cannelts
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that used to be with DC and IDW a new
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book of the she and I created together called Stopwatch.
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So the art is done by Randy Green who.
332
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Did work at top Cow and Marvel and.
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Just some amazing stuff. So we are continuing that which
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we all own together, and it's great. And Tim writes
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scripts like he's been writing them, comic book scripts, like
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he's been writing them all his life. There he is.
337
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So the only person I've ever worked with co writing
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00:18:50.759 --> 00:18:54.920
that was quicker is Chuck Dixon. And Tim is right
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there on his heels.
340
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Yeah.
341
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On the other hand, you talk about you know, everybody
342
00:19:00.680 --> 00:19:04.000
talks about Jack Kirby and a lot of ideas and
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even Rob rob Leifeld, Rob, who I work with all
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those years, you know, tons of ideas tons, I mean,
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can come up with. She is the same way, and
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it's just been it's been a wonderful relationship for me
347
00:19:19.559 --> 00:19:22.960
on a lot of different levels to continue the legacy
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of comic book craft, to others. And at the same time,
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you know, I'm getting I'm still the twelve year old
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that I've always been. So it is nice to know
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that at my orderly state, one day, when I quoke
352
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and shuffle off this mortal coil, there'll be other people
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to do it, and that I've done my little bit
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of helping them know how to write comic books, which
355
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are different from screenplays, and they just are amazing.
356
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So a long.
357
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Story short, I got to draw them into our web
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of comics and they'll never leave.
359
00:19:59.640 --> 00:20:03.240
BEF. That's outstanding. And I noticed that they were co
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00:20:03.319 --> 00:20:06.160
writing with you on some white known and stuff. So
361
00:20:06.440 --> 00:20:08.880
and also now to do their own projects. That's wonderful.
362
00:20:09.599 --> 00:20:10.240
Exactly.
363
00:20:10.799 --> 00:20:13.279
Yeah, I know that's great man, And and isn't it
364
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wonderful because you always hear these things about actors that
365
00:20:17.200 --> 00:20:20.519
and and no disrespect at all, But I mean some
366
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of the Star Trek guys like, well, so what do
367
00:20:22.119 --> 00:20:26.359
you think? And suddenly after many seasons they've got ideas
368
00:20:26.359 --> 00:20:29.160
and thoughts on their character. But sometimes it's like, so
369
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what do you think, Like, oh my god, big Cloud, Cliffhanger,
370
00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:32.880
what do you think is gonna happen next season? I
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don't know. I'll find out when I get the script,
372
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you know. And it's that kind of just and that
373
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was that any real. Now it's just like, hey man,
374
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I couldn't give me the lines. I try to do
375
00:20:40.880 --> 00:20:43.279
the best I can, of course, but now it's it's
376
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wonderful when Melanie and Tim were so invested Andy, and
377
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also to go further now and and really develop their
378
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own ideas, that's terrific.
379
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It makes such a difference. I can write, you know,
380
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I'm pretty fast writer and stuff. But with Tim again,
381
00:20:59.640 --> 00:21:02.519
it was like with Chuck. It's at hyper speed because
382
00:21:03.000 --> 00:21:05.559
the ideas are front and we're back and forth. We
383
00:21:05.599 --> 00:21:07.960
both will work on final draft at the same time.
384
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It's on both screens. And with Melanie, oh my gosh,
385
00:21:12.680 --> 00:21:14.759
I feel like I got to wear adult diapers when
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00:21:14.759 --> 00:21:16.799
her parts of the script come in, because I always
387
00:21:16.920 --> 00:21:22.000
piffed my pants. She is a hoot. She has got
388
00:21:22.039 --> 00:21:25.640
a great sense of humor and a great way to
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00:21:25.880 --> 00:21:31.119
work characterization in to not only humor but the action
390
00:21:31.319 --> 00:21:37.920
parts as well. And it's just it really has ignited
391
00:21:38.279 --> 00:21:42.440
a lot of my own enthusiasm that you know, old
392
00:21:42.440 --> 00:21:46.160
dog new tricks, but giving me hope that you know,
393
00:21:46.759 --> 00:21:48.720
there's a legacy out there that people are going to
394
00:21:48.799 --> 00:21:54.759
continue entertainment in comics, and that entertainment.
395
00:21:54.480 --> 00:21:56.960
Me means an audience that is wide.
396
00:21:56.960 --> 00:21:59.359
Like Kirby and Lee used to do. It was eight
397
00:21:59.400 --> 00:22:02.160
to eighty. Anybody could read it, get something out of it.
398
00:22:02.200 --> 00:22:04.799
And that has just made my day.
399
00:22:06.279 --> 00:22:10.680
Before we leave Winona, our mutual friend Alison Baker, of course,
400
00:22:10.839 --> 00:22:13.519
was a big part of the TV show and I
401
00:22:13.559 --> 00:22:17.720
know did a lot of the after show chats online
402
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:21.240
things like that. And it's funny because I think building
403
00:22:21.279 --> 00:22:26.640
a community is so key in today's disparate media world
404
00:22:26.920 --> 00:22:29.839
where you really have to gather your fans and keep
405
00:22:29.880 --> 00:22:33.720
them in a very positive way. So, you know, again,
406
00:22:33.880 --> 00:22:37.440
would would you participate on those after episode chats at
407
00:22:37.440 --> 00:22:40.400
all or any of the other stuff that was you
408
00:22:40.440 --> 00:22:43.240
know made me the supplemental stuff, Yeah, tell me about that, Paul,
409
00:22:43.279 --> 00:22:45.640
the live tweets, we you know, on the stuff, the
410
00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:46.680
extras on the DVD.
411
00:22:47.279 --> 00:22:53.880
Let me tell you, Allison from day one was the mother,
412
00:22:54.000 --> 00:22:56.680
Hen was the school teacher. She was the one that
413
00:22:56.759 --> 00:23:00.240
took all of us kneed to cast everything from Wine
414
00:23:00.279 --> 00:23:02.480
on Earth cons to when we were on set to
415
00:23:02.480 --> 00:23:06.160
where we were doing any kind of press all that well,
416
00:23:06.200 --> 00:23:09.440
no matter, I mean from the biggest Things entertainment weekly
417
00:23:09.599 --> 00:23:13.079
to you know, podcasts that were maybe this guy's got.
418
00:23:13.160 --> 00:23:14.720
We don't know how many of you know. It's a
419
00:23:14.720 --> 00:23:15.359
good place to be.
420
00:23:16.160 --> 00:23:18.359
She is amazing.
421
00:23:18.680 --> 00:23:24.480
I have never met anyone so organized, so in tune
422
00:23:24.559 --> 00:23:28.119
with everything that was going on. And the very best
423
00:23:28.160 --> 00:23:31.440
part is, you know, she comes from comics as well
424
00:23:31.480 --> 00:23:36.519
as film, working for Rigez, Robert Rodriguez, and she comes
425
00:23:36.559 --> 00:23:40.799
from it. She was a dream come true. Beth and I,
426
00:23:40.920 --> 00:23:43.720
my wife, truly felt not only with the cast and
427
00:23:43.759 --> 00:23:46.400
the crew that the big King's family, but Alison was
428
00:23:46.559 --> 00:23:53.359
family from moment one. I mean, she is a true gem.
429
00:23:53.440 --> 00:23:56.160
And the fact that and I say this and it
430
00:23:56.240 --> 00:24:01.440
sounds maybe too big or whatever, let me tell you
431
00:24:01.480 --> 00:24:05.240
she could be running a studio. She's seriously, and I'm
432
00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:08.000
not talking about some small times, she could be running
433
00:24:08.279 --> 00:24:12.880
a studio. She is that smart. She was an incredible
434
00:24:12.920 --> 00:24:17.240
asset at IDW Entertainment. I mean an incredible asset.
435
00:24:18.240 --> 00:24:20.519
She's been a big help to me, man, I'm telling you,
436
00:24:20.599 --> 00:24:22.759
especially the last couple of years. And she's a very
437
00:24:22.759 --> 00:24:25.400
good friend of mine as well. So that's that's great
438
00:24:25.440 --> 00:24:27.960
to hear. I kind of suspected it was that kind
439
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:31.440
of good working relationship with all of you. She's very
440
00:24:31.480 --> 00:24:34.400
proud of one on one Ona and everything. I keep saying,
441
00:24:34.400 --> 00:24:37.319
win Ona. I don't know why because I don't know.
442
00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:37.519
Man.
443
00:24:37.559 --> 00:24:39.920
Again, I guess that's my northern coming out and everything.
444
00:24:39.960 --> 00:24:44.559
And it's all right though, that's all right. Yeah, seriously,
445
00:24:45.640 --> 00:24:48.880
Allison was a I can't tell you how on even
446
00:24:48.920 --> 00:24:53.559
a creative end of how everything was put together, press wise,
447
00:24:53.640 --> 00:24:57.640
with with the urpers, with the public. She was amazing.
448
00:24:57.880 --> 00:25:01.279
And uh, like I said, if I were to win
449
00:25:01.319 --> 00:25:03.839
the lottery and start my own thing, there's my first
450
00:25:03.920 --> 00:25:04.880
hire right there.
451
00:25:05.640 --> 00:25:08.319
I get it. I absolutely get it. All right, Let's
452
00:25:08.400 --> 00:25:10.559
let's talk about some of the other stuff, all right.
453
00:25:10.559 --> 00:25:14.119
Obviously the Superman movie is out there, and uh, you know,
454
00:25:14.359 --> 00:25:17.240
uh and one of your one of the big characters
455
00:25:17.240 --> 00:25:19.799
that you had a big hand in. Uh didn't create him,
456
00:25:19.799 --> 00:25:21.759
but certainly you know, put your imprint on him in
457
00:25:21.799 --> 00:25:25.119
the nineties and everything, the great guy Gardner. And was
458
00:25:25.160 --> 00:25:27.240
that a handoff? How did you how did you start
459
00:25:27.279 --> 00:25:28.519
writing guys?
460
00:25:28.759 --> 00:25:31.240
Well, I'll tell you, and again the name will come
461
00:25:31.319 --> 00:25:35.519
up here in a minute. They were doing DC was
462
00:25:35.559 --> 00:25:40.799
doing a whole deconstruction of the Green Lantern core. Yes,
463
00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:44.640
Howell was going to become parallax and dark.
464
00:25:44.920 --> 00:25:48.079
What was that Eternal Dart was? What was it called
465
00:25:48.079 --> 00:25:53.039
the Events? I can't even remember, gg goodn Sorry.
466
00:25:53.400 --> 00:26:00.640
Emerald was to be honest with yeah, that it was
467
00:26:01.000 --> 00:26:03.240
that that Wait a minute, hold on, hold on, I
468
00:26:03.279 --> 00:26:06.599
may be able to help you here. I just happened
469
00:26:06.599 --> 00:26:12.839
to have. I got Emeralds fall Out, Okay, Emeralds fall Out. Yeah,
470
00:26:12.880 --> 00:26:14.880
I've got three issues. A guy right here. I was
471
00:26:14.880 --> 00:26:18.559
a part of Emeralds Fallout, Zero Hour and Capital Punishment.
472
00:26:19.039 --> 00:26:22.279
So those were all Green Lantern related.
473
00:26:22.720 --> 00:26:23.720
I'll tell you how I got it.
474
00:26:23.880 --> 00:26:27.160
Chuck Dixon was doing Guy Gardner and that's when they
475
00:26:27.200 --> 00:26:30.039
said we're gonna changing and I'll give you aust me.
476
00:26:30.160 --> 00:26:34.039
Chuck's made this note that they took Joe they were
477
00:26:34.160 --> 00:26:36.599
to take Joe Staton off of the book as well,
478
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:39.319
you know, And I gotta be honest with me. The
479
00:26:39.319 --> 00:26:43.519
sales at that point we were, you know, fairly low,
480
00:26:43.559 --> 00:26:46.799
and they were at that point fairly low was forty thousand,
481
00:26:46.799 --> 00:26:49.799
which people would dance on top of the table for now.
482
00:26:49.839 --> 00:26:53.240
But Chuck said, well, you know, I took this book.
483
00:26:53.359 --> 00:26:56.319
He goes, you know, it's okay, Guy Gardner saying, he goes,
484
00:26:56.319 --> 00:26:58.759
but I took this book to work with Joe, and
485
00:26:58.799 --> 00:27:00.799
he goes, you know, I got well. You know, at
486
00:27:00.839 --> 00:27:03.000
that point in the nineties, Chuck had more than enough
487
00:27:03.079 --> 00:27:06.839
work and he was easily doing six to ten books
488
00:27:06.839 --> 00:27:10.200
a month. He said, no, I go there, well and
489
00:27:10.279 --> 00:27:12.680
Kevin Dooley and Eddie Braganza with the editors on it,
490
00:27:13.279 --> 00:27:16.400
and he goes, I got to suggest, and he goes,
491
00:27:16.960 --> 00:27:20.000
once you get both Smith call he go and Kevin
492
00:27:20.079 --> 00:27:22.319
and I and Eddie and I had known each other
493
00:27:22.680 --> 00:27:25.359
for years before this, and they go, well, good idea
494
00:27:25.359 --> 00:27:25.720
of y'all.
495
00:27:25.720 --> 00:27:26.680
We will definitely do that.
496
00:27:27.240 --> 00:27:30.519
And they called me up and they were very honest,
497
00:27:30.519 --> 00:27:32.759
because again these I'd known these guys for a long time,
498
00:27:32.759 --> 00:27:36.480
they were friends, and they go, look the books bordering
499
00:27:36.559 --> 00:27:39.440
on cancelation. Would you come in and you know, maybe
500
00:27:39.480 --> 00:27:40.440
do four issues?
501
00:27:40.519 --> 00:27:41.680
And you know we might.
502
00:27:41.559 --> 00:27:44.759
Be canceled by that. So you know, by that point
503
00:27:44.920 --> 00:27:47.359
I said no, I'd be glad to He goes, but
504
00:27:47.480 --> 00:27:50.480
you can't do Guy Gardner as he's been done, because
505
00:27:50.480 --> 00:27:52.319
we're deconstructing all the.
506
00:27:52.240 --> 00:27:53.079
Green Lantern corps.
507
00:27:53.240 --> 00:27:56.240
He's going to have no powers and we're starting from scratch.
508
00:27:56.279 --> 00:27:58.480
We're doing this with all the green lanterns. And to
509
00:27:58.559 --> 00:28:02.279
me that was like, yeah, sure, you know, as a kid,
510
00:28:02.319 --> 00:28:04.319
I grew up, you know, I knew who Guy Gardner was.
511
00:28:04.359 --> 00:28:08.279
But I liked Chuck, I liked I liked the uh,
512
00:28:08.400 --> 00:28:11.920
the Kevin McGuire and all those issues. Those were fun.
513
00:28:12.039 --> 00:28:12.440
Those were.
514
00:28:14.160 --> 00:28:15.960
Matis absolutely, yes.
515
00:28:15.799 --> 00:28:17.720
One hundred percent, I mean those were That was one
516
00:28:17.759 --> 00:28:24.319
of my must reads every time everyone and that and I.
517
00:28:24.279 --> 00:28:25.319
Got to be honest with him.
518
00:28:25.440 --> 00:28:28.799
DC in the nineties was a lot different than it
519
00:28:28.880 --> 00:28:30.880
is now. It was corporate then, but it wasn't really
520
00:28:30.920 --> 00:28:34.279
corporate like it is now, so I had tons of freedom.
521
00:28:34.480 --> 00:28:37.960
Not only was it not as corporately strict, but it
522
00:28:38.000 --> 00:28:40.240
was a book that they, well, we might cancel this,
523
00:28:40.480 --> 00:28:45.039
you know. So I was getting to do anything I wanted.
524
00:28:45.680 --> 00:28:48.279
And I was getting to work with Mitche Byrd, an
525
00:28:48.359 --> 00:28:51.119
artist that I had admired for so long because his
526
00:28:51.559 --> 00:28:55.160
organic style, with Dan Davis incinan who is as solid.
527
00:28:55.480 --> 00:28:59.000
He's a modern day Joe Sennate. He was that solid.
528
00:28:59.559 --> 00:29:01.559
And I got to work with.
529
00:29:01.480 --> 00:29:04.599
These guys, and so the first thing I wanted to do.
530
00:29:04.839 --> 00:29:06.240
I looked at it, and I got to give you
531
00:29:06.279 --> 00:29:09.160
honest I said, guys noted for being a jerk.
532
00:29:09.359 --> 00:29:10.359
I said, I love that.
533
00:29:10.480 --> 00:29:14.720
I love that aspect of his personality. I said, but
534
00:29:15.599 --> 00:29:18.960
I want him as time goes on, at least during
535
00:29:19.000 --> 00:29:22.279
my run, my goal is to make more than a
536
00:29:22.279 --> 00:29:25.960
one trick pony or one you know, one joke pony,
537
00:29:26.319 --> 00:29:29.440
I said. I want to be able to show that
538
00:29:29.559 --> 00:29:30.200
guy is.
539
00:29:30.119 --> 00:29:30.920
Truly a hero.
540
00:29:31.279 --> 00:29:37.599
The guy really has this, you know, rub your wrong personality.
541
00:29:37.839 --> 00:29:38.160
I said.
542
00:29:38.160 --> 00:29:41.160
But the bottom line is, as the old cliche goes,
543
00:29:41.200 --> 00:29:43.160
if you're in the foxhole, this.
544
00:29:43.000 --> 00:29:43.680
Is the guy you want.
545
00:29:43.759 --> 00:29:49.920
Slit in Nazis throats. They said, yeah, sure that sounds good.
546
00:29:50.319 --> 00:29:53.119
We went, I wasn't going to give him many powers.
547
00:29:53.160 --> 00:29:57.319
He was going to be a modern day Doc Savage,
548
00:29:57.400 --> 00:29:59.720
and part of it was he was going to gather
549
00:30:00.519 --> 00:30:03.359
the misfit toys of the ZC universe, which I got
550
00:30:03.359 --> 00:30:05.720
to do. I wanted to give him supporting casts, using
551
00:30:05.839 --> 00:30:08.000
DC characters that I loved as a kid, that no
552
00:30:08.039 --> 00:30:11.359
one ever heard of. And I got to bring in
553
00:30:11.839 --> 00:30:14.680
Lady Blackhawk, I got to bring in Wildcat, I got
554
00:30:14.680 --> 00:30:16.920
to bring in a couple of the Metalmen, which I
555
00:30:16.960 --> 00:30:20.559
always loved. I got to bring in tiger Man Tigerman,
556
00:30:20.599 --> 00:30:24.000
who was in My Greatest Adventures for two issues, and
557
00:30:24.079 --> 00:30:27.640
I had plans for others as well, but they said, yeah,
558
00:30:27.799 --> 00:30:30.200
you can have him, Yeah you can have them, and
559
00:30:30.240 --> 00:30:32.440
I've got them, and I got to do that. But
560
00:30:32.599 --> 00:30:36.839
my goal was to make guy likable on all accounts,
561
00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:40.599
to not make the guys that loved him a jerk
562
00:30:41.119 --> 00:30:43.480
run off and say that's not my guy, and the
563
00:30:43.480 --> 00:30:45.599
people that go, eh, he's all right, but he said,
564
00:30:46.039 --> 00:30:48.599
I ended up, and I honestly believe in a two
565
00:30:48.640 --> 00:30:51.599
and a half year run I did that that goal
566
00:30:52.039 --> 00:30:58.119
was achieved. I kind of defy anybody to read that
567
00:30:58.240 --> 00:31:00.480
two and a half year run and go like that
568
00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:05.079
asshole he could, you know? God Gardner and we went
569
00:31:05.119 --> 00:31:07.559
to the whole thing. DC said at one point, you know,
570
00:31:08.480 --> 00:31:12.319
we were forty thousand. Well after about it kept going
571
00:31:12.400 --> 00:31:14.279
up and up, and we got up to like sixty
572
00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:16.839
five thousand, and they were going, well, we're up, but
573
00:31:16.880 --> 00:31:18.680
to cancel. Let's keep going. We went to and a
574
00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:22.960
half years and two annuals, and they at one point
575
00:31:23.000 --> 00:31:25.400
wanted to give him superpower, so he did the it
576
00:31:25.440 --> 00:31:28.440
originally started off goud Gardener a warrior. He would only
577
00:31:28.480 --> 00:31:32.119
be able to morph weapons of the greatest warriors, which
578
00:31:32.119 --> 00:31:36.880
would be tomahawk, a bow and arrow, a gun. You know,
579
00:31:37.000 --> 00:31:40.400
keep it pretty basic. But I knew once the character
580
00:31:40.480 --> 00:31:44.160
got semi popular, did they would have chainsaws and egg
581
00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:47.519
beaters and everything else, And they did. But I kind
582
00:31:47.519 --> 00:31:49.279
of took that with a grain of salt. But you know,
583
00:31:49.759 --> 00:31:52.279
I got to work with a lot of different artists,
584
00:31:52.759 --> 00:31:57.880
Phil Jimenez who was just amazing, Dan Jurgen's that got
585
00:31:57.880 --> 00:32:01.039
the and that you know wash That was a great
586
00:32:01.119 --> 00:32:04.200
moment for me because they don't come any more professional
587
00:32:04.480 --> 00:32:06.920
than Dan. And I got to work with Dan on that,
588
00:32:07.119 --> 00:32:10.559
Mark Campos and Brad Gorby and Flint Henry and a
589
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:11.839
bunch of other people that we got to.
590
00:32:11.839 --> 00:32:12.559
Pull in great.
591
00:32:13.119 --> 00:32:14.759
But it was a two and a half year and
592
00:32:15.119 --> 00:32:18.599
getting to the movie, the Superman movie, Yeah, this is
593
00:32:18.640 --> 00:32:20.720
a dream come true to me because not only do
594
00:32:20.799 --> 00:32:25.440
they have Nathan Fillion, who is amazing and perfect for
595
00:32:25.480 --> 00:32:31.119
the role, but this John is the handshake to the
596
00:32:31.160 --> 00:32:36.119
world for God Gardner. No, a lot of people, you know,
597
00:32:36.240 --> 00:32:37.799
are never heard of it. They never heard of the.
598
00:32:37.799 --> 00:32:38.759
Guardians of the Dallas.
599
00:32:39.519 --> 00:32:42.359
Now they are going to know God Gardner, and I
600
00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:46.400
really think he's going to be you know, he could
601
00:32:46.440 --> 00:32:51.440
be DC's Deadpool out of this all that popularity and stuff.
602
00:32:51.920 --> 00:32:54.240
No, and also kind of a fly in the allointment
603
00:32:54.240 --> 00:32:57.160
the way Deadpool is as well. No, I agree. And further,
604
00:32:57.880 --> 00:33:00.480
you know, as I understand it, I just a clip
605
00:33:00.519 --> 00:33:03.759
of Nathan being interviewed and he's in the Lantern show
606
00:33:03.759 --> 00:33:07.440
that HBO is developing that Tom King is working. So
607
00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:10.680
that's you know, that was my one concern BO was
608
00:33:10.759 --> 00:33:13.599
regarding the movie. They put so much stuff in and
609
00:33:13.599 --> 00:33:17.240
it's like, Okay, how quickly are you gonna be able
610
00:33:17.240 --> 00:33:20.279
to exploit these characters? And you don't want to rush it,
611
00:33:20.319 --> 00:33:22.839
and also you don't want to overkill with too much product.
612
00:33:23.160 --> 00:33:26.359
But it's like this Justice Gang. I mean, I really
613
00:33:26.359 --> 00:33:29.160
think I felt that Hawk Girl didn't get a lot
614
00:33:29.200 --> 00:33:32.200
to do, unfortunately, but I really loved mister Terrific and
615
00:33:32.240 --> 00:33:34.720
I really loved Guy, and it was like, man, they
616
00:33:34.839 --> 00:33:38.880
fulfilled both of those characters' potential in this movie. And again,
617
00:33:39.160 --> 00:33:42.319
I wonder where we'll see mister Terrific next. And I'm
618
00:33:42.319 --> 00:33:44.720
relieved to hear that guy is coming up right away.
619
00:33:44.920 --> 00:33:47.519
I don't know when the Lantern Show is starting, if
620
00:33:47.519 --> 00:33:49.920
it's starting this year or next. I think it's next year,
621
00:33:50.480 --> 00:33:54.440
but I do know that. Yeah, but it's no, it's
622
00:33:54.480 --> 00:33:58.559
exciting and it is. It's wonderful to see, and especially
623
00:33:58.559 --> 00:34:02.400
given the failure of the Ryan Reynolds first Green Lantern movie,
624
00:34:02.559 --> 00:34:04.640
I mean, we always do the Greenland and was comic
625
00:34:04.640 --> 00:34:07.160
book fans know it's a great concept. The animated show
626
00:34:07.240 --> 00:34:10.400
is terrific. But yeah, this is a big release that
627
00:34:11.440 --> 00:34:14.079
guy debuted as well as it did, and I thought,
628
00:34:14.159 --> 00:34:16.440
you know, the effects with the ring all look great.
629
00:34:16.480 --> 00:34:18.440
So no, I'm I'm glad you agree. I thought it
630
00:34:18.480 --> 00:34:18.960
was terrific.
631
00:34:19.039 --> 00:34:20.519
What did you think of the rest of the movie.
632
00:34:21.079 --> 00:34:24.360
I enjoyed the movie because I met here. Let me
633
00:34:24.440 --> 00:34:27.320
put it this way, I and this is Bosmith talking
634
00:34:27.360 --> 00:34:32.000
as a superman or as a superhero fan. It was
635
00:34:32.039 --> 00:34:38.880
what I needed, I I believe. And then this is
636
00:34:38.880 --> 00:34:41.840
going from a creator standpoint and even from a reading standpoint,
637
00:34:41.840 --> 00:34:44.599
because this is what drew me to I was a
638
00:34:44.639 --> 00:34:47.559
Sergeant Fury fan over a Sergeant rock Than even though
639
00:34:47.559 --> 00:34:51.400
I liked both, because there was humanization and their humor.
640
00:34:52.000 --> 00:34:56.119
Hubert doesn't have to be slapstick. It just li likeability is.
641
00:34:56.239 --> 00:34:58.639
It's what I an old guy like me, calls the
642
00:34:58.760 --> 00:35:02.599
James Garner effect. Everything jings Gardner was then as a kid,
643
00:35:02.920 --> 00:35:07.559
I liked because he could make any character likable without
644
00:35:09.000 --> 00:35:12.039
you know, without it being the same he was, you know,
645
00:35:12.559 --> 00:35:15.800
he wanted to hang out. And that's that's what jings
646
00:35:15.840 --> 00:35:21.280
Gun is so so very good at, is making characters
647
00:35:21.519 --> 00:35:25.920
iconic or you know, like mister Terrific and even guy
648
00:35:26.320 --> 00:35:29.320
not so iconic you know, to the world. He can
649
00:35:29.400 --> 00:35:32.119
make them all likable, well done. And this reminded me
650
00:35:32.199 --> 00:35:35.559
of the Fantastic Four run as a comic as a kid,
651
00:35:35.840 --> 00:35:38.760
and the fact the Fantastic Four comic books was where
652
00:35:38.840 --> 00:35:43.800
that was the springboard for new characters Silver Surfer, Black Panther,
653
00:35:44.159 --> 00:35:46.679
you can name, you can keep naming, on and on
654
00:35:47.039 --> 00:35:50.519
that were invented to creating and not for that very long,
655
00:35:50.920 --> 00:35:53.159
just like in the movie. But Bang, that was a
656
00:35:53.239 --> 00:35:56.760
springboard for him. And I think, I think if.
657
00:35:56.559 --> 00:35:58.199
That's James Gun's.
658
00:35:59.599 --> 00:36:02.280
Idea, I think it's a brilliant one and I think
659
00:36:02.320 --> 00:36:04.559
it's going to really work for a lot.
660
00:36:04.360 --> 00:36:06.000
Of DC movies to come.
661
00:36:06.239 --> 00:36:09.320
And he's been you know, very honest with you know,
662
00:36:09.360 --> 00:36:11.880
some people have the dark one's gone. No, he said
663
00:36:11.960 --> 00:36:15.159
it's gonna be different things for different characters and different stories.
664
00:36:15.519 --> 00:36:19.119
So I think he's going to appeal more to everyone,
665
00:36:19.679 --> 00:36:22.000
and everyone's going to have something that they're going to
666
00:36:22.280 --> 00:36:23.320
be able to enjoy it.
667
00:36:24.400 --> 00:36:27.920
Have you did you watch Creature Commandos the cartoon?
668
00:36:28.679 --> 00:36:31.400
No, that's on my list. I have not gotten to
669
00:36:31.519 --> 00:36:33.280
and I'm done you.
670
00:36:33.599 --> 00:36:36.119
You will not be disappointed, because again, based on our
671
00:36:36.159 --> 00:36:39.440
former conversations, you like great action. You were not a
672
00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:42.880
I mean, it's it's an R rated cartoon in the
673
00:36:42.920 --> 00:36:46.320
best way. And that's okay because, as you know, Bo,
674
00:36:46.440 --> 00:36:49.199
it took a long time for American animation to catch
675
00:36:49.280 --> 00:36:52.159
up with the Japanese, and the Japanese have always given
676
00:36:52.239 --> 00:36:55.519
us adult animation. I even remember, I always bring this up.
677
00:36:55.719 --> 00:36:58.800
I remember when Paul Levitz was at a Wizard Chicago
678
00:36:58.920 --> 00:37:02.000
convention and they were announcing that first animated movie, the
679
00:37:02.039 --> 00:37:05.760
Superman Doomsday Animated Movie, which obviously you know doesn't hold
680
00:37:05.840 --> 00:37:08.800
up to the comic story at all, but people were asking,
681
00:37:08.840 --> 00:37:10.719
even back then, are we going to get the Titans
682
00:37:10.719 --> 00:37:13.519
in the Judas Contract, maybe a Watchman and everything? And
683
00:37:13.519 --> 00:37:17.719
he's like, well, right now, there's a concern about you know,
684
00:37:17.800 --> 00:37:19.960
making it all ages, and that doesn't mean it's not
685
00:37:20.000 --> 00:37:22.559
gonna have action and suspense, but you know, we want
686
00:37:22.599 --> 00:37:25.480
to make it fur the whitest audience possible. Well, thankfully,
687
00:37:26.360 --> 00:37:30.119
even DC themselves with their own animation, not only Creature Commandos,
688
00:37:30.119 --> 00:37:33.360
but even what was happening before James took over. Uh,
689
00:37:33.719 --> 00:37:36.199
you know we're getting We're getting good animation, and that's
690
00:37:36.239 --> 00:37:39.760
great because again the potential for the inn and international
691
00:37:39.840 --> 00:37:42.280
audience is there. So I am relieved. But yeah, so
692
00:37:42.440 --> 00:37:46.199
that's good. And of course Peacemaker is fantastic. I'm sure
693
00:37:46.199 --> 00:37:46.840
you're watching that.
694
00:37:48.079 --> 00:37:50.920
I enjoy that to know end. And this is coming
695
00:37:50.920 --> 00:37:53.480
from someone who loved the comic book as a kid
696
00:37:53.480 --> 00:37:55.920
when it was brand new, and you know, you gotta
697
00:37:55.920 --> 00:37:59.519
admit it was it was pretty stiff. But us I'll
698
00:37:59.880 --> 00:38:03.400
d it as a kid slash creator, going, you know
699
00:38:03.519 --> 00:38:05.440
that they did this, it'd be great they did this,
700
00:38:05.960 --> 00:38:08.239
and they end up kind of doing that, even though
701
00:38:08.239 --> 00:38:10.239
on the adult level, which I like now is an
702
00:38:10.239 --> 00:38:14.199
adulty more and Bwana Beast was my other one of
703
00:38:14.360 --> 00:38:17.239
this is a character no one likes, but if I could.
704
00:38:17.079 --> 00:38:18.400
Do it, I would do this this, and.
705
00:38:20.079 --> 00:38:23.960
I think again, James Gunnett has that mindset to be
706
00:38:24.039 --> 00:38:26.639
able to do that, and the writers that he has
707
00:38:26.679 --> 00:38:31.079
with him too. You know that's it's it's just great stuff.
708
00:38:31.360 --> 00:38:33.320
It's it's a real shock me ar.
709
00:38:34.519 --> 00:38:38.159
Yeah, man, No, I'm with you. Get already asked about
710
00:38:38.400 --> 00:38:40.280
Fantastic four of You. I think I asked you off
711
00:38:40.320 --> 00:38:42.480
the air if you're gonna see it right away? He said,
712
00:38:42.599 --> 00:38:44.119
you're gonna right away.
713
00:38:44.480 --> 00:38:47.519
Just because I'm to be honest with me, I'm slow
714
00:38:47.559 --> 00:38:51.440
at ship on stuff sometimes, but I am definitely definitely
715
00:38:51.440 --> 00:38:54.400
gonna see it. I love just the little bit that
716
00:38:54.480 --> 00:38:55.719
I've seen online.
717
00:38:56.199 --> 00:38:57.639
I love the rest of you. Look.
718
00:38:58.159 --> 00:39:03.800
I love that it's just, oh it looks it looks
719
00:39:03.840 --> 00:39:06.000
like a lot of fun. So I'm really and I
720
00:39:06.119 --> 00:39:08.960
just saw online speaking of that kind of stuff that
721
00:39:09.400 --> 00:39:12.159
at the premiere or or one of the things that
722
00:39:12.440 --> 00:39:16.440
they invited the Roger Corman task ye to it, and
723
00:39:16.920 --> 00:39:22.119
that made my day. That really I made my day.
724
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:26.840
I said, that's that's great, that's an excellent that might be.
725
00:39:27.039 --> 00:39:30.239
I mean, yeah, that movie's got warts, don't get me wrong,
726
00:39:30.360 --> 00:39:32.679
But for what it was and the shoe string that
727
00:39:32.719 --> 00:39:36.199
they made it on and also the great documentary Doomed
728
00:39:36.639 --> 00:39:39.880
that Chris Gore made and everything and talked to everybody. No, man,
729
00:39:39.960 --> 00:39:43.639
I I've always I mean I bought the bootleg vhs
730
00:39:43.800 --> 00:39:46.920
back in the day two of us. Yeah, there you go, man.
731
00:39:47.039 --> 00:39:49.000
Well I know that's why we're talking. Man, we'll get
732
00:39:49.000 --> 00:39:54.039
into low budget, low budget action and stuff. And yeah,
733
00:39:54.280 --> 00:39:57.199
now a couple other characters that, of course you had
734
00:39:57.440 --> 00:40:00.159
time with. And also I do want to acknowledge a
735
00:40:00.159 --> 00:40:02.440
great writing partner, Chuck Dixon, who is one of the
736
00:40:02.480 --> 00:40:06.079
most brilliant guys in comics, can write any genre, and
737
00:40:06.599 --> 00:40:09.000
you know, yeah, I've always had tremendous respect for Chuck
738
00:40:09.519 --> 00:40:11.400
as a writer. I think he's an incredible I mean
739
00:40:11.440 --> 00:40:15.079
literally from the Simpsons to the War stuff he's done
740
00:40:15.440 --> 00:40:18.639
at any genre, the Western stuff he's done. He could
741
00:40:18.639 --> 00:40:22.119
do any he could do any genre. Absolutely. But I
742
00:40:22.840 --> 00:40:25.880
took and I assume it was through Chuck, because as
743
00:40:25.920 --> 00:40:29.159
I remember, you guys were co writing wild Cat and
744
00:40:29.199 --> 00:40:30.639
Catwoman stories. Am I correct?
745
00:40:31.519 --> 00:40:36.280
Yes, we originally we're gonna do Batman Wildcat, which we did,
746
00:40:36.519 --> 00:40:39.719
Then we did cat Woman Wildcat, which we did. The
747
00:40:39.760 --> 00:40:44.000
next one in line was going to be Robin Wildcat
748
00:40:44.320 --> 00:40:48.519
and that one. There was a DC Change editorial with
749
00:40:48.559 --> 00:40:49.480
a lot of people this that.
750
00:40:49.599 --> 00:40:50.800
The other, and that was.
751
00:40:52.400 --> 00:40:54.679
And again I'm not talking bad about anything because it
752
00:40:54.679 --> 00:40:56.400
was anything. It was just one of those things when
753
00:40:56.719 --> 00:40:59.360
a lot of editors leave, new ones come in, they
754
00:40:59.360 --> 00:41:03.119
get transfer and the new ones want to do their
755
00:41:03.159 --> 00:41:04.360
books or with their.
756
00:41:04.280 --> 00:41:05.920
People and stuff. You know.
757
00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:09.000
It was just one of those situations. But yeah, that
758
00:41:09.519 --> 00:41:11.639
or it was going to be fun because it was
759
00:41:11.679 --> 00:41:17.159
going to be Robin getting to do everything. Wildcat was
760
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:19.599
going to be the bad uncle. And by bad uncle,
761
00:41:19.639 --> 00:41:22.840
I don't mean bad to me, but the uncle that hey, here, kid,
762
00:41:22.960 --> 00:41:24.559
you know we're at the family. You go ahead have
763
00:41:24.599 --> 00:41:26.840
a beer, you know, that kind of thing.
764
00:41:27.719 --> 00:41:29.400
And it was.
765
00:41:30.880 --> 00:41:32.559
And Robin would you know, at the end of the
766
00:41:32.559 --> 00:41:34.480
whole series, were would have Robin, you know, and Batman
767
00:41:34.519 --> 00:41:37.199
back together on whatever. And he was said and Ted
768
00:41:37.199 --> 00:41:39.920
blah blah blah blah, and they're getting really to do things,
769
00:41:39.920 --> 00:41:43.599
and Robin's busting heads and jaws before Batman goes, we
770
00:41:43.760 --> 00:41:46.239
didn't have to do you know, he was going, it's quicker,
771
00:41:46.519 --> 00:41:49.840
more efficient, you know, It's that little bit of hanging
772
00:41:49.880 --> 00:41:52.719
around with Ted Grant, you know, rubbed off kind of
773
00:41:52.719 --> 00:41:57.199
a thing. So which anyway, I think it was it
774
00:41:57.280 --> 00:42:01.280
Timid or was this it was Yeah, it was the
775
00:42:01.360 --> 00:42:03.960
one Chuck had been doing all that time. It was
776
00:42:04.119 --> 00:42:05.840
Tim Drake. Yeah, Jim Drake.
777
00:42:06.480 --> 00:42:09.920
Okay, that's cool. No, that's cool. Well, Bo, you I
778
00:42:09.960 --> 00:42:12.559
think we've discussed this before. But you know, I covered
779
00:42:12.599 --> 00:42:16.920
boxing for like fifteen years and and and really for
780
00:42:17.079 --> 00:42:18.760
radio and TV and a lot of a lot more
781
00:42:18.840 --> 00:42:21.000
radio and also print. I used to write for Bird
782
00:42:21.039 --> 00:42:23.559
Sugars Magazine Boxing Illustrated.
783
00:42:24.480 --> 00:42:27.480
By the stopping a big boxing tane all my life.
784
00:42:27.920 --> 00:42:30.239
I kind of figured, because you certainly want to cover
785
00:42:30.679 --> 00:42:33.960
Oh no, Ted, Ted's always been one of my favorite characters.
786
00:42:34.320 --> 00:42:38.119
I love Bob Haney. Yeah, I figured, hey, man, Bo,
787
00:42:38.239 --> 00:42:40.119
it shows with the work he did with the character,
788
00:42:40.440 --> 00:42:44.880
absolutely man, And uh no, I am yeah, yeah, well
789
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:47.880
well again it's uh it's a great character. And I
790
00:42:47.920 --> 00:42:50.960
really love the way they positioned him to be kind
791
00:42:50.960 --> 00:42:55.639
of the the the combat sport teacher of so many heroes,
792
00:42:56.320 --> 00:42:59.239
men and women, and I love that about Ted Grant.
793
00:42:59.280 --> 00:43:01.320
And I'm kind of listen, I love what Lamiir is
794
00:43:01.360 --> 00:43:04.800
currently doing Jeff Lamire on on Yes This Society, But
795
00:43:04.920 --> 00:43:07.599
I can't deny. I was a little disappointed to see
796
00:43:07.599 --> 00:43:11.119
that he Ted is currently dead. I hope that change.
797
00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:14.159
Will but hey, you know he's been dead before, Yes
798
00:43:14.239 --> 00:43:16.639
he has, but yeah, he gotta remember.
799
00:43:16.719 --> 00:43:19.960
Now, this is some DC trivia, is that.
800
00:43:20.360 --> 00:43:23.800
I don't know what they've done with it, but there
801
00:43:24.400 --> 00:43:28.760
is was There was an editorial story stamp on that
802
00:43:28.760 --> 00:43:31.239
that he and I'm not giving anything away and they
803
00:43:31.480 --> 00:43:36.719
get used. But Ted has nine lives right. It came
804
00:43:36.760 --> 00:43:38.519
from one of those I think it might have been
805
00:43:38.559 --> 00:43:43.280
in a Jim Oparo drawing story. But anyway, so, yeah,
806
00:43:43.480 --> 00:43:46.840
Ted's never gonna I really believe he's never gonna really
807
00:43:46.880 --> 00:43:47.280
be dead.
808
00:43:47.400 --> 00:43:49.559
So I hear you, man, No, I hear you.
809
00:43:49.599 --> 00:43:52.239
Now I want to You've got the background and everything
810
00:43:52.239 --> 00:43:54.599
I want to. I'm gonna tell you who about two
811
00:43:54.639 --> 00:43:56.000
favorite boxers of all time?
812
00:43:56.039 --> 00:43:57.719
Oh please do I love that? Now?
813
00:43:58.159 --> 00:44:01.559
One of them I got to see and and you know,
814
00:44:01.639 --> 00:44:03.480
during his career and stuff, and I was like, and
815
00:44:03.519 --> 00:44:08.119
that's George Schavalo, the Wall that Wouldn't fall, I mean,
816
00:44:09.360 --> 00:44:10.599
great part.
817
00:44:11.920 --> 00:44:12.679
You know, I went on.
818
00:44:12.639 --> 00:44:15.559
To do some acting, you know, which was always neat
819
00:44:15.599 --> 00:44:18.000
and stuff. And the other one I only got to
820
00:44:18.039 --> 00:44:22.440
watch in a couple of very I think maybe two reels,
821
00:44:22.679 --> 00:44:25.079
but I read everything I could get my hands on,
822
00:44:25.159 --> 00:44:29.480
and growing up was Harry Greb the uh Pittsburgh Windmill.
823
00:44:29.800 --> 00:44:34.440
I believe it was the great middle would.
824
00:44:33.639 --> 00:44:37.480
And would fight heavyweight, you know, Gay Gene Tunney that
825
00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:40.480
the time of his life. And those are my two
826
00:44:41.840 --> 00:44:44.039
favorite boxers of all time. The only reason I'm telling
827
00:44:44.039 --> 00:44:46.000
you because I know you would know who they were and.
828
00:44:48.000 --> 00:44:51.480
Are great names, and especially Greb because he doesn't get
829
00:44:51.639 --> 00:44:55.079
uh you know, well Shavalo was more mod slightly more modern,
830
00:44:55.119 --> 00:44:58.960
being in the sixties seventies. But Greb, no, and I'm
831
00:44:59.000 --> 00:45:01.960
sure you know you know he blind in one eye. Yeah,
832
00:45:02.079 --> 00:45:04.519
that was a great discovery. We're not sure exactly when
833
00:45:04.559 --> 00:45:06.960
it happened in his career, but he fought blind in
834
00:45:07.039 --> 00:45:09.239
one eye for for a long time. And like you said, no,
835
00:45:09.760 --> 00:45:13.039
I had a Gene Tunny biographer. I interviewed him for
836
00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:17.599
sports radio back in the two thousands and he's like, oh, no,
837
00:45:17.800 --> 00:45:20.519
that's the fight that Tunney really learned the most from
838
00:45:21.079 --> 00:45:24.119
losing that first time and then beating him two or
839
00:45:24.159 --> 00:45:26.920
three times after that. But it's because he figured out
840
00:45:27.000 --> 00:45:29.239
he figured out grem and that's the kind of scientific
841
00:45:29.360 --> 00:45:32.000
fighter that Tonny was. But now Greg, Greg was amazing
842
00:45:32.039 --> 00:45:34.559
and yeah, man, no Shavallo, My god, did he go
843
00:45:34.679 --> 00:45:36.639
to distance with Foreman? I know he did with Ali.
844
00:45:37.519 --> 00:45:39.760
He did with Ali, but he never.
845
00:45:40.239 --> 00:45:43.760
He was never knocked down, but he didn't go I'm
846
00:45:43.800 --> 00:45:46.519
trying to remember now. Crap, I'm like shitting here looking
847
00:45:46.519 --> 00:45:50.159
at his autographic picture on my wall. That's great was
848
00:45:50.679 --> 00:45:53.760
he was a very nice guy. And the other boxing
849
00:45:53.840 --> 00:45:57.320
thing I got for you is my family was always,
850
00:45:57.920 --> 00:46:03.000
you know, a part of the Golden Gloves, and my cousin, Johnny.
851
00:46:02.719 --> 00:46:06.360
Clark, he at a gym and taught.
852
00:46:06.440 --> 00:46:09.079
And this at the other and bottom line is the
853
00:46:09.119 --> 00:46:12.320
Golden Gloves thing was coming through, and there was Muhammad
854
00:46:12.320 --> 00:46:16.519
Ali was in town. And I used to work radio
855
00:46:16.960 --> 00:46:20.880
advertising sales. So my old manager goes, hey, you know
856
00:46:21.599 --> 00:46:23.400
he's going to be up here, you know, talking to
857
00:46:23.440 --> 00:46:25.559
people's sign and once you come up, it was just
858
00:46:25.599 --> 00:46:28.320
one of those things. I took my son, he's forty
859
00:46:28.360 --> 00:46:32.480
two now, but he was five years old. Then I said, Wow,
860
00:46:32.679 --> 00:46:34.639
we're going up here and meeting he's going who is he?
861
00:46:34.719 --> 00:46:34.880
You know?
862
00:46:35.000 --> 00:46:37.119
He didn't, you know, really know, And I put him
863
00:46:37.159 --> 00:46:39.239
on the way up there, I go taught him all
864
00:46:39.280 --> 00:46:40.000
the history of him.
865
00:46:39.920 --> 00:46:43.039
I said, and he's probably Nick, I said, he's probably
866
00:46:43.159 --> 00:46:47.239
the most well known man on the planet. I said,
867
00:46:47.679 --> 00:46:50.119
any country anything. I said, So you're going to meet
868
00:46:50.440 --> 00:46:54.719
a man that you could go to anywhere. It's stunnin
869
00:46:54.760 --> 00:46:55.679
Bull wherever, and.
870
00:46:55.719 --> 00:46:57.400
They're going to know his name. He was.
871
00:46:57.559 --> 00:46:59.840
So he was, you know, really, you know, okay, we'll
872
00:46:59.880 --> 00:47:02.559
go there. And we went up there and they had
873
00:47:02.639 --> 00:47:05.239
the posters and you know, he would sign one from
874
00:47:05.360 --> 00:47:07.960
from my son Nick, and he goes, wait a minute,
875
00:47:08.079 --> 00:47:10.559
come over here, and he got Nick behind the table
876
00:47:10.840 --> 00:47:13.480
and this was like a card table out in the field.
877
00:47:13.559 --> 00:47:16.199
I mean, you know, people, it wasn't anything fancy back then.
878
00:47:16.719 --> 00:47:18.880
And Nick went back there.
879
00:47:18.920 --> 00:47:21.239
He's going put up your fists like you will fight me.
880
00:47:21.599 --> 00:47:24.199
And Nick did, and he sparred around.
881
00:47:23.920 --> 00:47:25.800
For him for se he goes, he goes, you got
882
00:47:25.920 --> 00:47:26.519
a bad last.
883
00:47:26.559 --> 00:47:28.800
You gotta fa you could push to light Nick. But
884
00:47:28.960 --> 00:47:31.320
he did that for you know, a minute, and that
885
00:47:32.440 --> 00:47:36.800
just made my day in the fact that I pulled
886
00:47:37.199 --> 00:47:40.000
away home and for years later I said, you're a
887
00:47:40.119 --> 00:47:43.840
part of a history that you know, I just couldn't
888
00:47:44.239 --> 00:47:47.880
you know. It was amazing just to get that opportunity,
889
00:47:48.079 --> 00:47:51.239
and being a boxing fan, I knew, yeah, I was
890
00:47:51.320 --> 00:47:53.559
living my life to him, you know at that moment.
891
00:47:53.880 --> 00:47:57.039
But and Nick appreciates it and stuff and does now.
892
00:47:57.159 --> 00:48:02.159
But uh, that was just that was a prime moment
893
00:48:02.280 --> 00:48:02.480
for me.
894
00:48:03.320 --> 00:48:04.880
No, I get it, man. And again I had my
895
00:48:04.920 --> 00:48:08.360
own personal like encounter with Ali and the magic up there,
896
00:48:08.400 --> 00:48:10.559
and it was it was post you know, he was
897
00:48:10.679 --> 00:48:14.400
he was trembling but and then scammered, but his mind
898
00:48:14.480 --> 00:48:18.599
never his stage sharp. And it was right before Holyfield
899
00:48:18.679 --> 00:48:22.079
fought George Foreman, and I asked him about it. This
900
00:48:22.199 --> 00:48:27.679
was then an ESPN card in in South Bend, Indiana,
901
00:48:28.119 --> 00:48:30.639
and because Varying Springs, where he lived in Michigan, was
902
00:48:30.639 --> 00:48:33.519
only like forty five minutes away, and the pros like, hey,
903
00:48:33.559 --> 00:48:35.159
ALA's coming, I'm like, yeah, right, he goes No, he
904
00:48:35.159 --> 00:48:36.760
gets like that far away. He does show us for
905
00:48:36.840 --> 00:48:39.559
local fights. I'm like all right. And he had one
906
00:48:39.599 --> 00:48:42.079
guy with him on one front man and I was
907
00:48:42.159 --> 00:48:44.639
writing for Bird Sugar and Boxing Illustrated back then, and
908
00:48:44.719 --> 00:48:46.519
It's like, okay, you got five minutes with him. I'm
909
00:48:46.559 --> 00:48:49.000
like fantastic. So I asked him about the you know,
910
00:48:49.199 --> 00:48:52.079
the fight with Foreman and Holyfield, and he's like, listen,
911
00:48:52.199 --> 00:48:55.239
I know old guys. We like to stay together and stuff.
912
00:48:55.480 --> 00:48:57.679
He's like, George is a different fighter. He goes. I
913
00:48:57.719 --> 00:48:59.960
don't know if he's gonna win, but it won't surprise
914
00:49:00.280 --> 00:49:02.880
that after twelve rounds George is still there because he's
915
00:49:02.880 --> 00:49:05.599
a completely different fighter than what he was in the seventies.
916
00:49:05.840 --> 00:49:08.800
And he went through his strategy and he's like George
917
00:49:08.920 --> 00:49:11.079
jabs George and jab when I thought him, he throw
918
00:49:11.119 --> 00:49:13.159
every big punch and he goes and he rests. He
919
00:49:13.280 --> 00:49:15.079
knows how to rest, and he see him in the
920
00:49:15.159 --> 00:49:18.480
corner and everything he goes. He's taking his time and
921
00:49:18.559 --> 00:49:20.159
he goes in those exactly there were ways I was
922
00:49:20.199 --> 00:49:22.159
able to beat him because he wasn't taking his time.
923
00:49:22.320 --> 00:49:25.880
And I'm just stunned that this version of Ali was
924
00:49:26.000 --> 00:49:30.000
so smart and analytical despite being trapped in this body
925
00:49:30.079 --> 00:49:33.599
that unfortunately didn't work well. But man, he was so
926
00:49:33.760 --> 00:49:36.719
no but he was so delightful and so sweet to me,
927
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:39.679
and it's oh my god. I mean, yeah, boyhood hero man,
928
00:49:39.719 --> 00:49:42.719
and he fulfilled every hope. And in terms of guy,
929
00:49:42.760 --> 00:49:44.360
if I ever meet him, I hope he's a great guy.
930
00:49:44.719 --> 00:49:47.079
He was beyond that and like you said, an ambassador
931
00:49:47.199 --> 00:49:49.559
to the world. And that's why it was so important
932
00:49:50.039 --> 00:49:51.960
at nine to eleven when he and Will Smith was
933
00:49:52.039 --> 00:49:56.119
standing there and Ali had the guts to get political
934
00:49:56.639 --> 00:49:59.559
in the right way and and not you know, and
935
00:49:59.679 --> 00:50:01.639
really just kind of like, Hey, this is wrong, this
936
00:50:01.760 --> 00:50:04.480
can't happen. You gotta you know, at least I'll follow
937
00:50:04.559 --> 00:50:06.960
this person. And it worked. I mean he was he
938
00:50:07.159 --> 00:50:09.760
was no an incredible and incredible man. So no, I
939
00:50:10.280 --> 00:50:12.599
I welcomed the boxing tangent. That was great. Man.
940
00:50:13.639 --> 00:50:17.440
You think about it, John, he real quick, I'll stay you.
941
00:50:18.519 --> 00:50:20.960
For example, we hadn't Nick and I had our moment
942
00:50:21.000 --> 00:50:23.920
with him. You had your moment with him, coming moments,
943
00:50:24.400 --> 00:50:27.280
hundreds of thousands of moments did he had with people
944
00:50:27.599 --> 00:50:31.079
in his lifetime and he was you. I don't think
945
00:50:31.119 --> 00:50:33.679
you would find anybody did say. Yeah, he was brisk,
946
00:50:33.800 --> 00:50:37.000
he was brusque, he was no every story is like ours.
947
00:50:37.760 --> 00:50:38.519
And now he had.
948
00:50:40.360 --> 00:50:41.880
Yeah, he knew where he came from. Man, he was
949
00:50:41.920 --> 00:50:43.599
the people. He was from the people, and he never
950
00:50:43.679 --> 00:50:47.440
forgotten You never forgot that absolutely. Man. Well, Catwoman you
951
00:50:47.519 --> 00:50:49.400
had you had a good run on Catwoman as well.
952
00:50:50.960 --> 00:50:55.719
That was The Batman Wildcat was fun. We had a
953
00:50:55.760 --> 00:51:00.280
lot of really good time, but the Cat Woman Wildcat was,
954
00:51:00.639 --> 00:51:02.840
as Chuck and I always put it, that was the
955
00:51:03.239 --> 00:51:09.800
meanest rom com ever made ever. We still can't believe
956
00:51:09.960 --> 00:51:16.000
DC let that go. The violence in that book was.
957
00:51:18.639 --> 00:51:19.960
It was borderline bud.
958
00:51:20.039 --> 00:51:21.719
I mean, there was some stuff going on there that
959
00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:25.280
was pretty rough. The comedy, I'll put it that way
960
00:51:25.400 --> 00:51:29.280
is rom com was all there, and we got to
961
00:51:29.400 --> 00:51:35.880
do a really unique issue with those iconic characters and
962
00:51:36.320 --> 00:51:41.599
the bad guy Clawhammer, who is this big dumb I
963
00:51:41.639 --> 00:51:45.559
mean he was writing down things on cheeseburger rappers, so
964
00:51:45.679 --> 00:51:49.719
you remember, I mean, but everything that we had the
965
00:51:49.840 --> 00:51:52.599
best time with that, and that's one of those books
966
00:51:52.840 --> 00:51:54.599
that when people come up and I sign up but
967
00:51:54.760 --> 00:51:57.239
shows in same way with Chuck, they would say, this
968
00:51:57.440 --> 00:51:59.000
is my biggest guilty pleasure.
969
00:51:59.480 --> 00:51:59.840
This thing.
970
00:52:00.000 --> 00:52:04.800
It was just it was fun and again the keyword entertaining.
971
00:52:05.119 --> 00:52:08.199
But it was the most violent rom com ever done,
972
00:52:08.239 --> 00:52:09.239
I'd say in comics.
973
00:52:11.400 --> 00:52:12.760
I love it again.
974
00:52:13.159 --> 00:52:16.360
At that time period, DC was a different world.
975
00:52:16.719 --> 00:52:19.519
We could do whatever we want and one of.
976
00:52:19.480 --> 00:52:21.280
Those issues a guy Gardner and I think it was
977
00:52:22.639 --> 00:52:26.440
twenty twenty or twenty one. You know, she's going up
978
00:52:26.440 --> 00:52:30.599
against some of the parallaxes made you know, these green things.
979
00:52:31.840 --> 00:52:34.079
I got like three or four pounds where they're literally
980
00:52:35.039 --> 00:52:38.960
beating the crap out of her. I mean, it's it's rough,
981
00:52:39.519 --> 00:52:43.559
and part of the thing the editorial they goes, you know,
982
00:52:44.400 --> 00:52:48.280
I don't think I've ever seen Wonder Woman, you know, get.
983
00:52:48.440 --> 00:52:49.880
Beat up like this before.
984
00:52:50.000 --> 00:52:53.199
Because I gotta be honest with you. Even though everyone says, oh,
985
00:52:53.400 --> 00:52:55.599
you know, women are equal of this, that and near comics,
986
00:52:56.079 --> 00:53:00.320
they never showed the other end of it, where you know,
987
00:53:00.480 --> 00:53:04.679
occasionally like Batman gets, you know, not beat out of him.
988
00:53:04.719 --> 00:53:08.719
Sometimes it happened to Superman warning and I said, we've
989
00:53:08.719 --> 00:53:11.000
got to show this with Wonder Woman to make her
990
00:53:11.800 --> 00:53:14.320
who she really is. I mean, she's a true warrior.
991
00:53:14.360 --> 00:53:18.960
And everyone okay, And it ended up it happened.
992
00:53:19.000 --> 00:53:20.599
And that was the other thing.
993
00:53:20.639 --> 00:53:24.559
Wonder Woman was a I did Eduardo and Bretto and
994
00:53:24.639 --> 00:53:26.199
I and I don't know if you even know about this.
995
00:53:27.000 --> 00:53:31.239
We did the else Worlds. It was wonder Woman and
996
00:53:31.639 --> 00:53:34.599
it was called The Princess War Diaries, and it was
997
00:53:34.760 --> 00:53:37.719
wonder Woman and Zena. It was a depressed these book
998
00:53:38.239 --> 00:53:41.760
and nothing against Dan Debio, who I like, we were buddies.
999
00:53:41.800 --> 00:53:43.559
I mean, he really is a good guy. But that
1000
00:53:43.719 --> 00:53:46.440
was when he came in and and you know, it
1001
00:53:46.639 --> 00:53:50.119
had that a little bit of humor in it, but
1002
00:53:50.440 --> 00:53:54.360
like a humor that the Zena Show had in it
1003
00:53:54.519 --> 00:53:55.280
had that type of thing.
1004
00:53:55.320 --> 00:53:57.719
And he's gone, oh, I mean this book was done.
1005
00:53:57.800 --> 00:53:59.440
And he's got nine. I don't think we're going to
1006
00:53:59.519 --> 00:54:02.960
do that, you know. And it was again I understand,
1007
00:54:03.400 --> 00:54:05.440
you know, that's his job. He comes in and that
1008
00:54:05.639 --> 00:54:08.679
is I understand it completely. But the boy, I sure
1009
00:54:08.760 --> 00:54:10.159
wish that one could have come out because it.
1010
00:54:10.239 --> 00:54:11.159
Was a lot of fun.
1011
00:54:11.679 --> 00:54:15.000
Oh that's too bad, man. Well good news. Uh. Tom
1012
00:54:15.119 --> 00:54:20.360
King just finished a Black Canary mini series where part
1013
00:54:20.400 --> 00:54:22.639
of it was her in the ring with Lady Shiva,
1014
00:54:23.239 --> 00:54:25.840
and Shiva beats the hell out of him. And that's
1015
00:54:26.000 --> 00:54:28.880
and as as she should, because Sheiva is the I mean,
1016
00:54:28.920 --> 00:54:31.760
as great as a fighter as Canary is than everything
1017
00:54:31.840 --> 00:54:35.559
trained by Wildcat as we know, and her mind. No,
1018
00:54:35.960 --> 00:54:39.159
it was it was great. So no, that's I hear you,
1019
00:54:39.320 --> 00:54:41.760
and I and I agree with you that it is
1020
00:54:41.840 --> 00:54:44.440
great to have equal footing as far as how important
1021
00:54:44.760 --> 00:54:47.199
female heroes are now. But it is also good to
1022
00:54:47.280 --> 00:54:50.039
show that, yeah, man, sometimes just like a male hero,
1023
00:54:50.239 --> 00:54:51.880
let's show them getting the ship kicked out of him.
1024
00:54:51.880 --> 00:54:53.960
I got no print on that, just I mean what
1025
00:54:54.400 --> 00:54:55.360
we went through. You know.
1026
00:54:55.480 --> 00:54:57.239
That was one thing with Wine on Earth that I
1027
00:54:57.320 --> 00:55:00.000
went through early on with her was I wanted to say.
1028
00:55:00.039 --> 00:55:02.119
I said, she's not going to be this always to
1029
00:55:02.239 --> 00:55:05.280
be the smartest person in the world. She's you know this,
1030
00:55:05.440 --> 00:55:07.920
that she's gonna make mistakes, I said, But they're mistakes
1031
00:55:08.000 --> 00:55:10.800
we all make on any job we have. Hers is
1032
00:55:10.920 --> 00:55:14.280
just the happens to be fighting the undead in most cases.
1033
00:55:14.400 --> 00:55:17.920
But my mom and my grandmother both taught me that that,
1034
00:55:18.119 --> 00:55:22.440
you know, everybody makes mistakes, and yeah, that's that ways stuck.
1035
00:55:23.000 --> 00:55:26.639
But the hero's journey needs those kind of like misdepths
1036
00:55:26.679 --> 00:55:31.519
and conflict and failing along the way to succeeding. And
1037
00:55:31.719 --> 00:55:34.239
and truly that has been my frustration with some of
1038
00:55:34.320 --> 00:55:36.119
the hero TV shows.
1039
00:55:36.159 --> 00:55:38.960
And I'm saying this everybody, this is John's editorial, but
1040
00:55:39.199 --> 00:55:42.800
that you know that really they're not h They're two
1041
00:55:42.880 --> 00:55:46.360
perfect ray in the Star Wars movies. I like Daisy
1042
00:55:46.480 --> 00:55:50.599
Ridley and there's potential there. But she walked, she almost
1043
00:55:50.679 --> 00:55:53.840
walked on water. And it's like, that's not interesting. I'm
1044
00:55:53.880 --> 00:55:58.199
sorry it isn't. Again my own individual opinion on that.
1045
00:55:58.719 --> 00:56:00.960
And when they said, hey, guess what did these three movies?
1046
00:56:01.159 --> 00:56:03.519
We're making another ray movie, I'm like, can we get
1047
00:56:03.719 --> 00:56:04.519
something else? Please?
1048
00:56:05.880 --> 00:56:09.400
No, that's just I understand and getting getting for the
1049
00:56:09.480 --> 00:56:11.880
second you brought it up there. Let's getting back to
1050
00:56:11.960 --> 00:56:17.920
the Superman movie. This one is he was not infallible.
1051
00:56:18.000 --> 00:56:21.000
He was like a great he was like a regular.
1052
00:56:21.480 --> 00:56:24.559
He was It was the most and let's say this,
1053
00:56:24.719 --> 00:56:26.800
you know, going from a lot of them, he was
1054
00:56:26.800 --> 00:56:30.079
the most relatable Superman that I'd seen. He was more
1055
00:56:30.599 --> 00:56:33.960
this is what I'd always dreamed in a way he
1056
00:56:34.000 --> 00:56:37.760
would be in the comics. It's given the chance because
1057
00:56:38.119 --> 00:56:42.639
he's not infallible, and he's I like him because you know,
1058
00:56:42.760 --> 00:56:44.800
it's not because I like him because he's had a
1059
00:56:45.360 --> 00:56:48.519
terrible childhood. This has happened to happen. No, he's he's
1060
00:56:48.639 --> 00:56:52.639
making human mistakes. He may not be yes from here,
1061
00:56:52.880 --> 00:56:55.280
but he was making human mistakes the way.
1062
00:56:55.599 --> 00:56:56.320
That's the man part.
1063
00:56:56.599 --> 00:56:58.880
Yeah, that's the man part of the equation. And also,
1064
00:56:59.440 --> 00:57:02.719
you know, again, it seems like all these movies are
1065
00:57:02.800 --> 00:57:06.119
made at the right time, the ones that work. And
1066
00:57:06.559 --> 00:57:08.840
Man of Steel, I didn't hate it, but I didn't
1067
00:57:08.920 --> 00:57:11.400
love it, and it was too serious, like you said,
1068
00:57:11.440 --> 00:57:13.719
and it was just missing a sense of humor, and
1069
00:57:13.880 --> 00:57:16.440
this movie had a sense of humor. And also God
1070
00:57:16.519 --> 00:57:20.440
when Lois is interviewing him, and I remember seeing the
1071
00:57:20.519 --> 00:57:23.199
issue reactionally when they released the cliff and again, people
1072
00:57:23.239 --> 00:57:25.679
who don't understand are like, man, she's really being mean.
1073
00:57:25.760 --> 00:57:29.679
It's like, no, she's big, a devil's advocate. And that's good,
1074
00:57:29.920 --> 00:57:32.840
that's great because he needs to hear that of ye, well,
1075
00:57:32.880 --> 00:57:35.079
what are you gonna do when another reporter who isn't
1076
00:57:35.159 --> 00:57:37.440
me and isn't in love with you, It's gonna ask
1077
00:57:37.519 --> 00:57:40.119
these tough questions. And it's like that is exactly what
1078
00:57:40.280 --> 00:57:43.000
and and just that kind of concern for people that
1079
00:57:43.119 --> 00:57:46.119
they showed and his he's, hey, I'm just trying to
1080
00:57:46.199 --> 00:57:48.119
do the right thing. I mean, it's forget about the
1081
00:57:48.199 --> 00:57:51.280
politics and another country. I'm just trying to do the
1082
00:57:51.400 --> 00:57:51.840
right thing.
1083
00:57:52.480 --> 00:57:54.960
And you see the frustration on the character on his
1084
00:57:55.199 --> 00:57:57.239
part as a character, I'm just you could.
1085
00:57:57.119 --> 00:58:00.199
Tell he did it, but he needed that.
1086
00:58:00.559 --> 00:58:04.840
That was actually some excellent writing, you know, on that
1087
00:58:05.079 --> 00:58:09.079
that was it. You know, the scene wasn't overly long,
1088
00:58:09.360 --> 00:58:14.480
so it brought the point to there without getting a
1089
00:58:14.559 --> 00:58:17.039
lot of other people that that scene was in double
1090
00:58:17.159 --> 00:58:19.440
the time and it would have gone.
1091
00:58:19.400 --> 00:58:20.159
Off the rails.
1092
00:58:20.280 --> 00:58:22.760
But no, this was this was efficient.
1093
00:58:22.840 --> 00:58:25.039
It was dead on. I agree with you.
1094
00:58:25.840 --> 00:58:28.559
Yeah, I'm with you man. Very good, very very good.
1095
00:58:29.800 --> 00:58:33.320
And the other thing is probably my favorite part because
1096
00:58:33.639 --> 00:58:34.440
I lived with one.
1097
00:58:35.079 --> 00:58:36.119
Crypto was great.
1098
00:58:36.719 --> 00:58:40.119
Oh my god, yes, Jesus. And it's great that they
1099
00:58:40.199 --> 00:58:43.360
make him like like any other dog and you know,
1100
00:58:43.519 --> 00:58:46.679
getting into ship ripping stuff up. How many shoes have
1101
00:58:46.800 --> 00:58:47.960
we all lost to our dogs?
1102
00:58:48.000 --> 00:58:51.360
Absolutely, I'm looking at my legs right now. I got
1103
00:58:51.440 --> 00:58:55.039
shorts on and their band aids all over were the
1104
00:58:55.639 --> 00:58:59.519
Merchant of Menace. Here he's sitting there here under my desk.
1105
00:59:00.360 --> 00:59:03.400
He's seventy pounds of sin and grind and he is
1106
00:59:03.760 --> 00:59:09.159
just he's a super mutt. He's he looks just like Crypto,
1107
00:59:09.320 --> 00:59:12.480
only he's tan and white. I mean serious, It looks
1108
00:59:12.480 --> 00:59:16.440
like he's seventy pounds and he's part pitbull, park poodle
1109
00:59:16.760 --> 00:59:17.880
and part Golden retriever.
1110
00:59:18.599 --> 00:59:20.559
I did the DNA thing on him, and.
1111
00:59:20.639 --> 00:59:25.079
He's what's his name Eddie, Eddie excellent.
1112
00:59:25.519 --> 00:59:26.760
That's yeah.
1113
00:59:26.800 --> 00:59:28.480
He's looking up at me like right now, well you
1114
00:59:28.559 --> 00:59:29.440
got for me, old man.
1115
00:59:29.800 --> 00:59:32.440
He's a minis. He is a sweet dog, but he's
1116
00:59:32.519 --> 00:59:34.559
a minace. It truly is.
1117
00:59:35.480 --> 00:59:37.440
Well Again, one of the reason why I talk to you,
1118
00:59:37.519 --> 00:59:40.199
bo is because you know, you know your good low
1119
00:59:40.239 --> 00:59:43.280
budget action movies and stuff. And shame on me. I
1120
00:59:43.360 --> 00:59:47.599
have not seen Chuck's movie with oh now Blanket. Of
1121
00:59:47.639 --> 00:59:50.840
course you'll know him, right, Jason Jason Stace, Jason Stathon,
1122
00:59:50.840 --> 00:59:54.000
who's an amazing actor. And once I heard that casting,
1123
00:59:54.039 --> 00:59:57.280
I'm like, Okay, I will get to it. I promise Chuck,
1124
00:59:57.320 --> 01:00:00.679
I will get to it. But it is perfect CASTI
1125
01:00:00.679 --> 01:00:04.119
because that's the kind of character, uh, that that Chuck writes.
1126
01:00:04.320 --> 01:00:06.760
So I get it and everything. And much like yourself.
1127
01:00:06.840 --> 01:00:08.920
With Cobb, you know he'd make a he'd make a
1128
01:00:08.960 --> 01:00:10.519
pretty good Cob if he wasn't British.
1129
01:00:11.920 --> 01:00:12.800
No, that's true.
1130
01:00:12.920 --> 01:00:18.679
I tell you the person physically that I always you know,
1131
01:00:18.719 --> 01:00:20.599
if he were, if he were an actor, that could
1132
01:00:20.639 --> 01:00:21.079
play Cob.
1133
01:00:21.719 --> 01:00:25.239
But if he's not an actor. Is the big wave
1134
01:00:25.320 --> 01:00:26.480
surfer Laird Hamilton.
1135
01:00:27.800 --> 01:00:30.679
Okay I don't know him, but okay, you look him up.
1136
01:00:30.719 --> 01:00:33.920
Sometimes you'll see what God's cool. This guy, Yeah, I
1137
01:00:33.960 --> 01:00:38.159
could walk in six three two forty and looks just
1138
01:00:38.400 --> 01:00:39.280
like Cob.
1139
01:00:40.360 --> 01:00:42.239
Okay, it looks that the guy's and I.
1140
01:00:42.800 --> 01:00:46.079
But I've and I've learned in the last more so
1141
01:00:46.239 --> 01:00:48.440
when I started walking working for Todd and you know
1142
01:00:48.920 --> 01:00:52.440
we did the HBO thing, we did the movie. I
1143
01:00:52.519 --> 01:00:56.159
took every opportunity then to make that a school till
1144
01:00:56.280 --> 01:01:00.280
everything that I dealt with with animation and with them
1145
01:01:00.639 --> 01:01:04.360
was to learn as much as I possibly could about
1146
01:01:04.440 --> 01:01:06.880
all aspects of it. And with Wine on the Earth,
1147
01:01:07.000 --> 01:01:09.920
the same thing. Every time I was on set, I
1148
01:01:10.079 --> 01:01:13.079
was talking to everybody, learning what they did, every job,
1149
01:01:13.440 --> 01:01:15.760
every job they had, I wanted to know, and it
1150
01:01:15.920 --> 01:01:19.360
was a free education. I took advantage of it. And
1151
01:01:20.960 --> 01:01:26.199
casting is one that just amazes me. A good casting
1152
01:01:26.280 --> 01:01:32.159
director can seriously take credit, i'd say, for seventy five
1153
01:01:32.159 --> 01:01:33.239
to eighty percent of a film.
1154
01:01:33.360 --> 01:01:37.400
Sometimes I get it, sure, well, now, yeah, they're they're
1155
01:01:37.599 --> 01:01:39.079
choosing the people absolutely that.
1156
01:01:40.559 --> 01:01:43.719
You know what you see, sure exactly. And how many
1157
01:01:43.800 --> 01:01:47.280
people have we seen in the last especially twenty five years,
1158
01:01:47.360 --> 01:01:50.559
that you go this person for that role, Oh no, no, no,
1159
01:01:50.800 --> 01:01:53.519
and they end up you know, being well beyond it.
1160
01:01:54.159 --> 01:01:58.760
So I do have a movie for you, please don't
1161
01:01:59.159 --> 01:02:02.360
and I just want watched it recently and I was late.
1162
01:02:03.320 --> 01:02:07.920
It's not the highest budget, but it is a very
1163
01:02:09.039 --> 01:02:15.480
entertaining and gritty and seriously well shot film. And it's
1164
01:02:15.559 --> 01:02:18.239
on Toby and it's on for free. It's it's an
1165
01:02:18.320 --> 01:02:22.360
original movie done for that. It's called Day of Reckoning
1166
01:02:23.440 --> 01:02:28.679
and uh, probably the biggest name star in it is
1167
01:02:28.800 --> 01:02:34.320
Billy Zane Okay, and it's got the female lead.
1168
01:02:34.480 --> 01:02:38.199
She was from the book and then.
1169
01:02:39.880 --> 01:02:45.719
Killer Moon, the DiCaprio movie Flowers of the Killer Moon.
1170
01:02:46.159 --> 01:02:47.719
I believe, you know, shame of me.
1171
01:02:47.840 --> 01:02:49.519
I haven't seen it yet, and I know how great
1172
01:02:49.559 --> 01:02:51.119
it is. Critically it was.
1173
01:02:51.760 --> 01:02:56.239
Well she yes, she's in it.
1174
01:02:56.519 --> 01:02:56.639
Uh.
1175
01:02:56.719 --> 01:03:00.920
And then there's there's other leads and it is a
1176
01:03:01.159 --> 01:03:06.760
fantastic what i'd call neo Western, modern day Western with.
1177
01:03:08.840 --> 01:03:09.159
With a.
1178
01:03:10.920 --> 01:03:13.960
Billy Zaying is an is an intense character in this,
1179
01:03:14.280 --> 01:03:18.400
but he's some great lines. This is your low budget action.
1180
01:03:19.519 --> 01:03:20.920
Definitely check out your big going.
1181
01:03:21.519 --> 01:03:23.719
Damn. I like this.
1182
01:03:23.960 --> 01:03:26.159
I mean it's it's you know, I try to get
1183
01:03:26.199 --> 01:03:28.480
the word out on things like that. The Day of
1184
01:03:28.719 --> 01:03:33.920
Rikening and Billy saying, and again, how can anybody pass
1185
01:03:33.960 --> 01:03:38.440
it up? It's free onto me And definitely I am
1186
01:03:38.559 --> 01:03:42.719
such a two by person. And uh my buddy Gabriel Hardman,
1187
01:03:42.760 --> 01:03:46.679
who's an excellent complot card, one of my art heroes,
1188
01:03:47.679 --> 01:03:50.719
Oh my gosh everything. He used to put up stuff
1189
01:03:50.800 --> 01:03:52.760
on Twitter all the time and I would just drool
1190
01:03:52.840 --> 01:03:57.159
and write fanboyish tweets on it and oh I was terrible.
1191
01:03:57.199 --> 01:03:58.840
He know, he is awesome, awesome.
1192
01:03:58.880 --> 01:04:01.880
Well, we do. We it's a shame that you're because
1193
01:04:01.920 --> 01:04:05.079
you're you're you're on your East Coast time. Obviously he's
1194
01:04:05.159 --> 01:04:06.000
Wabe Coast time.
1195
01:04:06.440 --> 01:04:06.679
We do.
1196
01:04:07.639 --> 01:04:10.159
We do a show where we talk about obscure movies
1197
01:04:10.320 --> 01:04:12.960
or you know, just people that might fly unto the radar.
1198
01:04:13.079 --> 01:04:15.679
We call it scene missing. And one of our wrinkles
1199
01:04:15.800 --> 01:04:17.360
is that we want to make we want to talk
1200
01:04:17.400 --> 01:04:19.840
about movies that you can either watch on to be
1201
01:04:20.199 --> 01:04:23.599
or watch on they might be even pirated on YouTube whatever.
1202
01:04:24.280 --> 01:04:27.679
And uh yeah, so no, I've I've really been a
1203
01:04:27.760 --> 01:04:29.880
fiend about watching a lot on to me, there's a
1204
01:04:29.920 --> 01:04:32.679
lot of great comic book documentaries currently on Tube that
1205
01:04:32.760 --> 01:04:35.840
Dave Stevens won The Warren ellis one the great where
1206
01:04:36.039 --> 01:04:39.320
One on Earth movie was, Yeah, absolutely it was. I
1207
01:04:39.440 --> 01:04:41.440
am more well aware of that. So yeah, no, I'm
1208
01:04:42.119 --> 01:04:43.719
I'm a big fan. No, I'm a big fan of
1209
01:04:43.800 --> 01:04:45.679
two B and everything because yeah, as we were saying
1210
01:04:45.719 --> 01:04:48.440
off the air, uh you know, the red box culture
1211
01:04:48.559 --> 01:04:51.559
is it's slowly physical media is going away. So thank
1212
01:04:51.599 --> 01:04:54.320
god we've got these channels like Pluto and to Be
1213
01:04:54.800 --> 01:04:58.159
and even us Zumo is a new one that Universal
1214
01:04:58.679 --> 01:05:01.639
is putting out there, and uh you know, is uh
1215
01:05:01.840 --> 01:05:04.920
in fact my my friends that I've made friends with
1216
01:05:05.039 --> 01:05:08.719
over the last few years, Alexander Nevsky, Russian action hero.
1217
01:05:09.000 --> 01:05:12.760
I don't know if you're aware of his body about well,
1218
01:05:12.800 --> 01:05:15.920
he's he's made a couple of Westerns lately and they're fun.
1219
01:05:16.360 --> 01:05:19.960
They're they're fun. I honestly I enjoyed watching them and
1220
01:05:20.039 --> 01:05:23.119
they're they're they're great, and he's the mysterious stranger that
1221
01:05:23.199 --> 01:05:26.000
comes to town and it's like, all right, that's cool,
1222
01:05:26.400 --> 01:05:29.480
you know. Uh No, they're a lot of fun there,
1223
01:05:29.480 --> 01:05:31.440
and and a couple of them are on to Be
1224
01:05:32.079 --> 01:05:33.639
right now. The newest one that he made is on
1225
01:05:33.840 --> 01:05:36.440
Zumo and shame on is getting the name of it.
1226
01:05:36.920 --> 01:05:39.599
But uh no, so you know, and that's you know
1227
01:05:40.159 --> 01:05:42.920
is it's was it Scott Foley? I forget the guy
1228
01:05:43.000 --> 01:05:45.679
that was in like a bunch of or no Scott
1229
01:05:46.039 --> 01:05:47.199
Scott Atkins.
1230
01:05:48.119 --> 01:05:50.559
Scott Atkins is one of my favorites.
1231
01:05:50.920 --> 01:05:55.320
Sure guy can do no wrong. He's an amazing actor.
1232
01:05:56.280 --> 01:06:01.719
He has ranged and he's prolific as anything. Oh when
1233
01:06:01.719 --> 01:06:04.719
he does one, I'm there every time I hear you, man.
1234
01:06:04.840 --> 01:06:06.719
And again that's the kind of so no day of
1235
01:06:06.840 --> 01:06:11.440
reckoning everybody with Billy Zane on tob good recommendation from
1236
01:06:11.440 --> 01:06:15.239
the Flying Fist Ranch. I like it, well done, dude,
1237
01:06:15.440 --> 01:06:18.280
there you go, we can wrap. I think this has
1238
01:06:18.320 --> 01:06:20.960
been a great conversation. I always appreciate talking to you.
1239
01:06:21.239 --> 01:06:25.199
And when either the Melanie what else have you guys
1240
01:06:25.239 --> 01:06:26.719
coming up? Have you got anything else coming up? Say?
1241
01:06:27.079 --> 01:06:30.400
That is stop Watch with Melanie Scorfano. But we're co
1242
01:06:30.519 --> 01:06:34.119
writing then and Randy Green's doing the artwork. That is
1243
01:06:34.239 --> 01:06:40.280
twenty six, that's with Clover Press. Eight Apocalypse Agents of Danger,
1244
01:06:40.840 --> 01:06:42.360
that's with Tim Rozan.
1245
01:06:42.079 --> 01:06:42.719
And I are doing.
1246
01:06:42.880 --> 01:06:46.800
And that the artist is Travis Smith. No relation even
1247
01:06:46.800 --> 01:06:48.880
though he's from West Virginia to believe it or not,
1248
01:06:49.199 --> 01:06:51.599
But that's coming out from Moonstone Books up in the
1249
01:06:51.639 --> 01:06:54.639
Chicago area that they they've been around for forty years
1250
01:06:54.719 --> 01:06:55.159
and stuff.
1251
01:06:55.519 --> 01:06:57.599
So those are the two newest.
1252
01:06:57.280 --> 01:07:01.119
Ones coming out and they're getting comic book form and.
1253
01:07:01.159 --> 01:07:05.840
They're both went in next year twenty six. Yes, cool,
1254
01:07:06.159 --> 01:07:08.519
All right, well, bo, you know when they're when they're ready,
1255
01:07:08.599 --> 01:07:11.159
let me know and I will definitely do so if
1256
01:07:11.199 --> 01:07:15.480
you will improve by then. And uh no, no, bo,
1257
01:07:15.599 --> 01:07:18.800
I'm telling you as much as my my my suspicion,
1258
01:07:18.920 --> 01:07:21.159
and I don't normally believe in this stuff, but when
1259
01:07:21.159 --> 01:07:24.559
everything goes wrong, I'm like, is mercury and retrograde? And
1260
01:07:24.679 --> 01:07:27.280
I kind of believe in that. I gotta admit it. No,
1261
01:07:27.599 --> 01:07:31.159
because weird, weird stuff happens where it's like, why is it,
1262
01:07:31.480 --> 01:07:32.960
you know, all of a sudden, the string of bad luck?
1263
01:07:33.000 --> 01:07:36.519
What the hell's going on? So that's my concern. I'll
1264
01:07:36.559 --> 01:07:37.360
look to the stars.
1265
01:07:37.920 --> 01:07:40.880
But it's been a pleasure as always. And you know,
1266
01:07:41.199 --> 01:07:43.360
if you ever need anything, all you know, just give
1267
01:07:43.400 --> 01:07:43.840
me a buzz.
1268
01:07:44.440 --> 01:07:46.519
Well it means a lot, but I appreciate it. And uh,
1269
01:07:46.840 --> 01:07:47.960
this is a great conversation.
1270
01:07:48.199 --> 01:07:51.039
Thank you, all right, Bud, you stay out of trouble.