NBS #144: She Got So Sick, She Forgot Where She Lived

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Look at the diagnosis as everybody really needs to be looking at the diagnosis as to be getting because the diagnosis is like, hey, we understand some level of what's going on.
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My name is Michael Rivino.
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I'm on a personal mission to make sure you don't get sick inside your own home.
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I knew there was something wrong.
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I just so believe there's something that you can do about it.
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Hello, and welcome to another episode of Never Been Sicker.
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I'm your host, indoor air quality expert Michael Rivino.
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And today's very special guest is Dr.
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Diane Mueller.
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Dr.
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Diane, thanks for taking time out of your busy day to be here with us.
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Thanks, Michael.
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Great to be here.
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So before you became Dr.
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Diane Mueller, you were a patient, is that right?
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Correct.
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What was the darkest moment in your health journey?
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Oh goodness.
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So there's several, but the one I will pick today is I was taking a walk.
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I was very sick at this point.
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So at this point, taking a walk was about five minutes around the block.
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I was dedicated enough to my health and knew enough at that point to know that when you're really sick, it's really important to move the lymphatic system.
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At this point, I was not sure what was wrong with me, but I was having really significant pain, brain fog, crazy headaches, you know, fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue on the laundry list, right?
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That people go through.
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And so I'm taking my daily five-minute walk around the block because that was all I could do.
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And I get a few blocks from home, and the dissociation that came over me was so severe that I actually blanked on where I lived.
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I just completely forgot how to get home.
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And I was living in Oregon at the time where we had these beautiful big Doug fir trees.
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So there was a park across from where I was.
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So I walked and just sat under this Doug fir tree for it, it didn't take long for kind of that way to go through, um, you know, five, 10 minutes, something like that.
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It wasn't a long period of time before all of a sudden it was like, okay, I it's just like the association level came down when I was able to get home.
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But it was one of like the scariest things, right?
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It's like so many of us when we go through these, these, the, these situations where we're sick, we go through a lot of neurological dysfunction and brain fog.
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And I was already experiencing brain fog, but had not experienced it to the level where it was like, I don't even know how to get home.
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So that was one of the scariest moments to actually realize like the neurological brain impact was starting to be at a point where I didn't know what was going to happen.
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Totally.
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I can't imagine how scary that is.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I mean, at that point in time, I was, you know, considering like, do I need to just move to some sort of island and just find a hut I can rent for cheap and just like live out my days?
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It was really, I just you know, but what happens, I think, when we get really sick like that and we don't know what's going on, it can feel like we're dying.
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And there was an element where I just I didn't know if this was like like me on death row because there was no logical explanation for why I was feeling the way I was.
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And, you know, back then, especially it's still a problem now, but back then with Lyme, there was still such this belief that, well, if you um weren't living in the New England states of the United States, that it wasn't possible.
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And so I, you know, it was something that was not being tested for.
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And mold illness, we know, is like still not being tested for now.
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And 25 years ago, you know, what we're talking about here was really not tested for then.
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So yeah, it was just in this category of like, well, we don't know, labs are normal, probably in your head.
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And here I was losing my mind and thinking I was dying.
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It was scary.
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That is scary.
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How many doctors were you seeing at the time?
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Did you go to a bunch of different conventional medicine doctors?
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Like what was that?
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What was that like?
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I went to, I mean, not a crazy amount, honestly.
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I went to four or five.
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It wasn't anything crazy, but I stopped going because everything was normal.
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And I was just like, well, like, why?
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Like, okay, if there's everything normal, like I just felt like at that point, like nobody had anything else to offer me.
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So um, and I was like towards the end of that, that was when I was it actually in school for medicine, which is just amazing.
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I got through that and did well despite all of that.
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And then once I got out of school and just had a moment to breathe, because that was another reason why it was not, I think, taken seriously, was because there was just an element around like, well, you're in, you know, you're in like a medical school program.
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This was probably just, you know, stress and sleep deprivation.
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And it was the big moment for me when I realized, oh, yeah, there, there's gotta be something wrong, was after graduation, and a lot of my friends within a couple of months were talking about how their vitality was back and all they were able to do.
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And I was just worried, like progressively getting rapidly worse.
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And so that's when at that point, I was like, what else is out there?
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And luckily I had a medical background at that point.
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So that's I was the one that actually tested myself for Lyme, tested myself for mold illness.
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And once I was positive for those things, that's when my study of lime and mold really began.
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And that's, you know, basically how I ended up specializing in it was because I I was, you know, I was the patient.
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I went through it and in my own process of healing myself because a lot of the doctors I went to or I talked to back then, I didn't go to them, but I talked to about treatment.
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They all wanted to treat with just high doses of antibiotics.
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And when I was doing my own research, like one of the things I was finding is that a lot of people with antibiotic use were having a lot of recurrence rates or things getting worse, or things like um, like their microbiome and gut health problems coming out of it.
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And so I did not want to go that route.
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And everybody I could find in the Lyme literate community was all of that route.
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And I'm not an anti-antibiotic by any means.
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I think there's a place for them.
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I think an acute Lyme, it's a great strategy.
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One of the only, I think there's more to the strategy just than just that.
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So it's not like it's I'm anti-pharmaceutical by any means, but a lot of like what Lyme and how Lyme is treated, it's triple antibiotic therapy.
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Oftentimes people are on it for a year and you know, three different antibiotics.
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And it's like, what with my medical knowledge, like the long-term problems that come from that are just so big.
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So I wasn't willing to go down that road and couldn't find anybody that was doing things differently, hence began my own journey of knowledge of this.
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Yeah, how how did this experience help you shape the way you practice medicine today?
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I mean, a lot of ways.
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I mean, the one of the key things that I feel when people are really sick and when we're dealing with Lyme, mold, MCAS, et cetera, is it's not just about going after those things.
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So, like my process is a four, four-step process that you know goes for most people in a general way, which I talk about in my book.
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And in that process, though, there is some individualization, but there's also some general rules that I find hold true most of the time for most people.
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And this is part of what I learned in my own wellness around one is it's not just about getting rid of the bad stuff.
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So a lot of people, it's like, okay, well, we got to kill the lime, we got to kill the apesia, we got to kill all the co-infections, get rid of the mold, and all that's true.
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But oftentimes people don't respond well to those treatments because there's so much cellular damage, whether it's the cellular membranes, whether it's the mitochondria, whether it's a hormonal system, whether it's the receptors of the cells that aren't getting the signals to function correctly, whether it's how the cells detox, whatever it is, there's so many dysfunctions of the cells that come from these disease processes.
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So it's not really just about getting rid of the bad.
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For many people, it's actually starting with getting the cells a little more vitality, helping the cells function better.
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So then the cells and the immune system can come back online and actually fight these things.
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So that's a philosophy that really came out of my own journey.
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And then the other biggest thing that I would say it really is in treating the whole person.
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So a lot of people out there, for example, that are Lyme literate docs like myself, they are really just focused on Lyme disease.
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Well, I don't find that works super well because we know that Lyme disrupts the hypothalamus and pituitary.
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So we have adrenal issues, we have cortisol issues, we have thyroid issues, and all these other things that are happening.
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And if we're just going after the Lyme, we're gonna miss the fact that they're living in mold.
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We're gonna miss the fact that their thyroid's been, you know, just, you know, is has a this level of dysfunction.
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So I have really found my own journey, as well as treating other people, that the way people get better when they are really sick is when we're treating all of these things.
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And I think for a lot of people, it's like, you know, you have your laundry list of, say, 50, 60 different symptoms, as a lot of my patients do.
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And it's very easy to be like, well, this treatment didn't work, and that treatment didn't work in that treatment, because maybe Lyme is 20% of the problem.
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Maybe mold is 20%, maybe this is 20%, maybe that's 5%.
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And a lot of times people don't feel well until enough of these different things are addressed.
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So it's not that maybe that treatment didn't work, it's that that root cause, that particular root cause, might only be a small percentage of the whole picture that needs to be addressed.
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So really helps me take a very my own experience plus my training really helped me take a holistic approach to, you know, to people that are very, very, very ill.
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Yeah, thank you for that.
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That was really valuable.
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I'd love to learn a little bit more about your book.
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Tell me about your book.
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So my book is called It's Not in Your Mind.
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You can find it on Amazon and most online stores as well.
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You can just go to it's notinyourmind.com and find it there.
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And I really use it, like I created it as almost having a playbook for those that are really sick, that have been told that it's not in your mind.
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So it starts with going through things like what lab tests you may not have had done.
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I talk about even the problems with a lot of the standard lab tests out there.
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For example, the first line test for Lyme disease, there are studies that show that it has a 67% chance of a false negative, the test.
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So we're diagnosing Lyme oftentimes with a test that is a 67% chance of a false negative.
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Like that's insane, right?
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So a lot of people are, even when they're getting tests done, it's very common that people be like, well, I ruled this out, it's not this.
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And they think they ruled it out, which confuses everybody even more because if you run the test, like you would think logically that is true.
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But if it's not the right test and it's not a good test, that's a problem.
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So I go through a lot of this stuff.
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What are the reference ranges?
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What are the lab companies?
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What are the problems with some of the current testing mechanisms that people are doing?
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And really look at like body part by body part.
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When somebody is really sick, you know, what's going on in their thyroid, what's going on in their gut, what's going on with the toxins, what's going on with the infections.
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And so it's a very holistic approach to it.
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And then I also teach about my four, my four-step process for healing.
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Why, for example, like why we wind up building the body up first and what that means.
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And then goes, you know, I go through like, here's how we treat for Lyme, here's how we treat for moles.
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So I give people a really good insight into the treatment as well.
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And teach a lot of like, there's a lot of tiny mistakes that people do that make a big difference.
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So dispelling some myths, um, teaching like like an example of a mistake, for example, is Lyme.
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So Borelia is the microorganism that causes Lyme, the bacteria that causes Lyme disease.
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And it's a spirochete, it's a it's a corkscrew like like shape.
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And so just like a screw burrows into the wall, this particular shape of lime allows it to burrow really deep in the tissue.
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And lime is real smart.
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Borelia is real smart.
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It has these biofilms, and the biofilms communicate.
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And we see, for example, that when somebody goes through stress, it allows the biofilms of two different borelia microorganisms to communicate, which then allows them to share information about antibiotics that are being used, share information about how they're surviving.
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So stress really promotes that.
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And because borelia is so smart, it can get very resistant to anything pretty quickly.
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It can also burrow and hide and go deep in our tissues where the antimicrobial herbs or antibiotic pharmaceuticals are just not able to get to it.
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So we see studies that prevent that help with like the prevention of the burrowing and the hyper resistance by pulsing things.
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So doing things like five days off, your treatments five days on, and it's not not five days off, five days on and two days off can really help to lower the uh impact of Lyme of the Borelia driving deeper into the tissue or becoming resistant to the medication.
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So I go through stuff like that in my books, um, as well as just very basic things around like how to shop for a doctor, what kinds of questions you ask for ask a doc, what kind of answers you're looking for.
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If you hear this, okay, that's probably good.
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If you hear that, that's probably gonna, you know, bring you up uh, you know, get you into a problem with the wrong provider.
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So it really is like a you know survivor's guide or survivor's playbook for how to heal from chronic illness.
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Wow, that's so helpful.
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Thank you for writing that book.
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Yeah, yeah.
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It's very useful.
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I'm curious if you see in your practice, I see it a lot in mine, but basically, you know, where you have so someone who's sick and maybe their spouse isn't, and they really quite don't understand.
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Uh, do you see that a lot?
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It's it's a there's it's all over the place, right?
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It's it's a ton.
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There's definitely people where their spouse understands, but a lot of times it's really hard for the spouse.
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And I have so much compassion for both people because and I really do feel like chronic illness when we are in partnership.
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It doesn't happen to just the person, it happens to the partnership because the spouse, you know, had somebody that they fell in love with, that they were able to do all these things with and create the life.
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And now the person that's going through this is, you know, when we're in this, when we're really sick, we're kind of like a shell of who we actually are.
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And when we're just in survival stress mode, like obviously that's going to impact the spouse.
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Um, so for people that are going through this, it really is.
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It's it's a it affects the partnership.
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One of the things that I think is really hard for the spouse is you see your partner and they get lab tests after lab test after lab tests that oftentimes are mostly normal.
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And then it's so easy to be like, well, you're making this up in the head, you know, this isn't that bad.
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Well, of course, when you you know something's wrong with you and you hear that and you feel like your spouse is not believing you, like that leads to so many, you know, relational and or marital problems.
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And sadly, I've you know seen divorces through this process just because of how hard this is.
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So, and another reason that I think it's another thing that I think gets really complicated is when people have mold illness, which oftentimes is with mold in their home, and mold being reactive to mold is a genetic thing.
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So 24% of the population has this genetic anomaly where mold toxins build up in the system.
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Immune system doesn't tag them correctly, meaning the immune system doesn't recognize them, meaning the immune system can't remove them.
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So it's a genetic thing.
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And this explains why a house can have high levels of mold and you can have a spouse and children that feel fine, but yet you are impacted because it's not about is mold there or not.
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It's about is mold there combined with do you have the gene where you are affected by it?
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And so there's a lot of times where people, even if they get to a point where they're lucky enough to figure out what's wrong with them, they get to a point where it's like, oh, my house is a problem.
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And then getting that spouse to believe that when they don't feel sick and it is also another thing that is a huge strain on the relationship.
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And, you know, oftentimes I find that when spouses can, you know, come along and be educated about it, it can really help.
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But um I think that the, you know, just having a process for getting the spouse on board and coming, you know, it's like once you find like, here's actual reasons, here's what's going on, and getting the spouse involved can be helpful, but there's no way around the fact that it is hard on a relationship.
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Yeah.
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And because of that, obviously, people typically need advice.
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What advice would you give to someone who is dealing with chronic illness, might be dealing with mold and need to remediate?
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And what advice do you have to sort of get their spouse on board and help them understand what they're going through?
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Well, definitely get them into an appointment, right?
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I mean, the first real thing is figuring out answers.
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So it might be good to not bring a spouse along until you find the doctor, the clinician that is going to actually provide answers because I think hearing more of the, you know, know you're fine, know these lab tests say you're fine is not going to pattern anything.
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So that's a big one.
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I do think turning people on to, you know, spouse on to podcasts like this can be really, really helpful.
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Sometimes spouses are willing and sometimes spouses are not willing to listen to things like this.
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But as soon as you find that that information, you know, as soon as you find out what's wrong, then bringing and starting to bring a spouse along to the appointment.
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You know, and I have spouses that are like, you know, very um transparent with me around like, you know, I don't know that this is real and here's my concerns.
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And I have found that over the years I've been able to really alleviate that a lot by just having a transparent conversation and being like, well, well, tell me why you don't believe this, or, you know, tell me these sorts of things.
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And that all being said, oftentimes people do really well with um, you know, with counseling with this.
00:19:03.119 --> 00:19:16.880
Sometimes people like do well with saying, okay, well, maybe we're gonna time box because it's so easy when we're going through this to get into our stories of our thought loops around like, okay, what's wrong with me today?
00:19:16.960 --> 00:19:18.000
And we do the body scan.
00:19:18.079 --> 00:19:23.200
I'm like, okay, I have a headache, I have this, I have this, and like you're constantly trying to get out of it.
00:19:23.440 --> 00:19:33.519
So as a, you know, as a survivor of chronic illness, you are really working in your with your adrenaline system to say, okay, I can survive this, I can survive this.
00:19:33.599 --> 00:19:35.119
And it just takes over the mind.
00:19:35.279 --> 00:19:47.759
And so sometimes having like, you know, forming new agreements with a spouse to say, okay, well, it's really helpful for me to vent and process this, but I know you've heard about nothing about but this most of the time.
00:19:48.000 --> 00:19:54.079
So here's my time where, you know, can you can you be this person for me to vent about this?
00:19:54.400 --> 00:20:08.079
And then I'm going to find other resources to vent about this and to, you know, talk about this the other time so that the relationship doesn't become where the only thing that you're talking about is this, because that can really wear out a spouse.
00:20:08.240 --> 00:20:14.240
So, you know, forming new agreements around like, here's how we're gonna work together interrelationally through this.
00:20:14.480 --> 00:20:25.039
Um, you know, another thing comes down to intimacy and to sexual intimacy, and that can be really hard on a marriage or on a relationship as well, because we feel bad.
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:28.720
You know, our desire typically is like we're just trying to survive.
00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:39.519
So being having a transparent conversation around this, around like, okay, well, how can we expand what we do intimately to not always just being like sexual?
00:20:39.680 --> 00:20:40.960
What can we do in the meantime?
00:20:41.119 --> 00:20:53.440
How can we work in a way where I'm engaging in some sort of way where a partner feels like they get like some little element of that, but I don't have to, in this example, you know, be all in, right?
00:20:53.519 --> 00:21:07.440
So we we want to negotiate all of these different things that are coming up and forming like, okay, while we're in healing mode, here's our new current set of rules and agreements with our partner to get us through that.
00:21:07.680 --> 00:21:20.799
And a lot of times that's where having a good, you know, therapist that even if it's just like a couple sessions to help navigate those type of conversations and saying, okay, well, what are the needs of each person during this time?
00:21:20.960 --> 00:21:25.119
And how can we come together to these agreements where we're both getting our needs met?
00:21:25.200 --> 00:21:36.640
And then one of the most important things there for the relationship is that we then, you know, whatever new agreements we come, you know, to the table with, that we honor and respect them.
00:21:36.799 --> 00:21:45.680
So if we're the person that's ill and we make an agreement around, like, okay, you know, it's twice a week I get to vent about this for an hour, and that's what my partner has.
00:21:46.000 --> 00:21:49.680
Then it's my responsibility to say, okay, well, am I going to talk to friends?
00:21:49.759 --> 00:21:51.200
Am I going to talk to my own therapist?
00:21:51.440 --> 00:21:55.839
Am I going onto social media chat forums to, you know, to vent?
00:21:56.079 --> 00:22:18.160
Um, the only other caveat I would say about that is that I'm always And I talk about this in my book too, that I'm very, very cautious around social media chat forums when it comes to chronic illness, because it's a very, it's a very good way to feel understood, but it's also a very good way to get into a period where you feel like a ton of despair.
00:22:18.480 --> 00:22:23.920
Because when people are well, when people have healed, they don't go back to those chat rooms, right?
00:22:24.000 --> 00:22:25.359
They're living their lives.
00:22:25.599 --> 00:22:29.119
So everybody in those chat rooms are just like kind of they're stuck.
00:22:29.200 --> 00:22:34.880
And so it's very easy to get into the mindset of it's impossible to heal from this.
00:22:35.039 --> 00:22:46.240
So if we use stuff like that, we have to you go into it and just use it as like, I'm using this to feel understood and heard and vent my frustrations about this, but I'm not forming beliefs.
00:22:46.319 --> 00:22:51.279
I'm not using this to justify any sort of story in my head that I cannot heal.
00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:52.799
So we just have to be cautious.
00:22:53.119 --> 00:22:54.079
No, that's really smart.
00:22:54.160 --> 00:22:55.279
You got to build your own story.
00:22:55.359 --> 00:23:05.359
You know, you can't uh drive off the stories of others because unfortunately, some people, you know, aren't taking the right steps, aren't doing the right things, and are offering that advice.
00:23:05.519 --> 00:23:06.480
You gotta be really careful.
00:23:06.559 --> 00:23:07.839
I agree with that wholeheartedly.
00:23:08.079 --> 00:23:08.720
Exactly.
00:23:09.039 --> 00:23:17.599
If someone walks into your office today, how do you decide whether they're, you know, dealing with mold, lime, both, something else?
00:23:17.839 --> 00:23:19.200
How do you determine that?
00:23:19.599 --> 00:23:21.680
Well, lots of testing, right?
00:23:22.000 --> 00:23:35.119
And I do find that more than not, when somebody has been to dozens of doctors, and a lot of times by the time people have reached me, they've already been diagnosed with Lyme.
00:23:35.279 --> 00:23:40.160
Not everybody, but a lot of people have and have tried a bunch of things and nothing's worked.
00:23:40.400 --> 00:23:45.440
The majority of people that end up in my office wind up having both Lyme and mold when we test them.
00:23:45.680 --> 00:23:54.880
You know, I have a, I like to say that though, because it's I don't want anybody to make an assumption that because I say that, that I'm saying that most people have both.
00:23:55.119 --> 00:24:04.160
No, it's just the type of people that that get to my office are usually people that have seen dozens of other people and who have tried a lot of other things is the most common patient.
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:06.240
So, but it's really through testing.
00:24:06.480 --> 00:24:09.759
So we just have to make sure we have good testing.
00:24:10.000 --> 00:24:18.240
So with Lyme, like I said, the common most first uh standard conventional test has that 67% chance of a false negative.
00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:22.079
So we want to make sure we're using companies that don't do that.
00:24:22.319 --> 00:24:29.039
And two, that most classically, lime is borrelia borgdurferi, that's a species.
00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:31.599
But there's tons of other lime species out there.
00:24:31.680 --> 00:24:33.680
There's tons of other borrelia species out there.
00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:40.000
There's borrelia of zelli, borrelia californicis, borelia miamoti, on and on and on and on.
00:24:40.160 --> 00:24:50.000
So we want to make sure that we're using companies that are testing for more than just one of these species of borrelia, because otherwise, that's another reason we could get a false negative.
00:24:50.319 --> 00:24:54.160
And then with mold, there's you know, several companies out there that are great.
00:24:54.319 --> 00:24:57.519
I use a lot of vibrant wellness for mold testing.
00:24:57.920 --> 00:25:12.799
One of the biggest um things that is, you know, still a conversation around mold and around um the testing is you just want to work with a doctor who understands the pros and negatives of any test out there.
00:25:12.960 --> 00:25:18.640
So, with mold, for example, there's a lot of people that are um doing the richie Dr.
00:25:18.720 --> 00:25:26.559
Richie Shoemaker, you know, markers, what are people known as the people know as the SERS markers or TGF beta ones or MMP9s, et cetera.
00:25:27.039 --> 00:25:28.720
And they're using that to diagnose.
00:25:28.880 --> 00:25:37.599
And I would not recommend that to diagnose because these are inflammatory markers that oftentimes elevate with mold, frequently elevate with mold.
00:25:37.680 --> 00:25:42.160
I have seen cases where they do not, and but they're very nonspecific.
00:25:42.240 --> 00:25:50.640
So they're, you know, they're great to use as far as just like tracking inflammation, making sure you're making changes, but they're not diagnostic for this is for sure a mold problem.
00:25:50.720 --> 00:25:52.400
And people need to understand that.
00:25:52.640 --> 00:26:04.000
Then we get into mold, the question of well, what about where there's like blood tests that are antibody tests where which are essentially looking for our immune reaction to toxins, to the mold toxins.
00:26:04.160 --> 00:26:08.079
And so people that are really pro those tests say, well, this is very specific.
00:26:08.160 --> 00:26:12.960
Your immune system's reacting, and so there's, you know, obviously a mold problem.
00:26:13.599 --> 00:26:22.400
Well, your immune system could be reacting to something, but it could be at a level where it's like not causing the symptoms.
00:26:22.480 --> 00:26:27.119
So, you know, we don't we don't know the level of mold built up in the body from that, right?
00:26:27.279 --> 00:26:39.759
Could you have an immune response because you um went on vacation and you had a um exposure and all of those antibodies were flaring from that exposure, right?
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:40.799
That's possible.
00:26:40.960 --> 00:26:46.240
So we don't know for sure then, like, is it actually really built up in your body as a huge part of the problem?
00:26:46.400 --> 00:26:50.640
Or is there an immune reaction just from a very random recent exposure?
00:26:50.880 --> 00:26:55.279
Um, likely, if you have a large immune response, likely there's a problem.
00:26:55.440 --> 00:26:57.119
We don't know for sure.
00:26:57.599 --> 00:27:06.720
And then the third thing is the urinary mycotoxin test, where we are looking for the toxin level built up in the body.
00:27:06.880 --> 00:27:08.960
Now, there is still something to be said, right?
00:27:09.039 --> 00:27:15.519
Where it's like if the toxin level is really high, it could certainly also be from a recent exposure.
00:27:15.759 --> 00:27:33.680
I tend to find that that if you have five, 10, 15, 20 different of these toxins high in your blood or in your urine, I mean, most of the time that that is due to a mold in the house scenario or mold in a recent, recent house that you lived in scenario.
00:27:33.920 --> 00:27:38.559
So we just want to go through and like understand the pros and cons of these different tests.
00:27:38.720 --> 00:27:53.359
I tend to use the urinary mycotoxin test the most, but regardless, you just want to look, you know, work with somebody that kind of understands the pros, the cons, and how to not only do the right test, but really how to dice decipher the data once the test comes in.
00:27:53.839 --> 00:27:59.119
Uh just curious, are you familiar with the dust test and uh how it correlates between the house and the body?
00:27:59.440 --> 00:28:05.440
Yeah, I use more of the ERMI than the dust test, just out of you know, years of it being around.
00:28:05.599 --> 00:28:23.519
Um, the ERMI, the biggest thing with the ERMI, it's like, or the dust test, the idea with it is you we need to make sure that we understand when we're testing the home, we are using a dust or a swatch sample, which both of these do.
00:28:23.680 --> 00:28:29.839
These tests that were people are just doing airborne tests and you're comparing air inside air to outside air.
00:28:30.000 --> 00:28:37.440
It's not like they're not, you know, there's there's value to them, but they just don't tell the full picture, you know, is one of the biggest problems.
00:28:37.599 --> 00:28:44.480
And like our really heavy molds, like stacky bot trees, aka black mold, is is molecularly heavy.
00:28:44.559 --> 00:28:46.640
So it's not going to suspend in air very well.
00:28:46.720 --> 00:28:49.440
It ends up in the dust, it ends up in our surfaces.
00:28:49.599 --> 00:29:03.359
So any of these types of tests, whether you're using dust tests or ERMI tests, or whether you're using an inspector who's coming in and testing through their own, you know, mechanisms, the dust, not just the air, I think is extremely important.
00:29:03.599 --> 00:29:20.240
The biggest thing with the ERMI, though, that uh, you know, people need to understand, and this is where I think a lot of people like talk about like problems with it, is the calculation, the way like the scores are calculated, are is not very accurate for determining if there's a problem.
00:29:20.319 --> 00:29:32.799
But the ERMI is very accurate from a standpoint of it's a DNA-based test and you're looking to see if there's a problem, you just can't take the scoring that that test uses as value because the scoring was really built for research purposes.
00:29:32.880 --> 00:29:43.920
Um, but I do see from you know those types of tests, there's definitely a correlation from what I see on an ERMI with what I and the dust would be the same because you're collecting dust either way.
00:29:44.160 --> 00:29:50.960
Um, and and what I see in the body, it doesn't correlate a hundred percent perfectly, uh, most of the time.
00:29:51.039 --> 00:30:00.559
So most of the time there is something outside of the home, maybe through the work, maybe in the grocery store you go through most frequently that people pick up, but most of the time there is that correlation.
00:30:00.720 --> 00:30:05.839
Sometimes too, the house is fine and it's the house that they were in previously.
00:30:06.160 --> 00:30:21.119
And when we have this genetic anomaly that I'm talking about, if the house that somebody was in previously was problematic and the current house is fine, well, if you have that gene, you're not gonna be able to eliminate that toxin very well on your own.
00:30:21.359 --> 00:30:24.559
Plus, it's not always about just breathing in the toxin.
00:30:24.640 --> 00:30:33.119
Sometimes we get colonized with mold, meaning the spores actually start growing in our in our body, oftentimes in our sinuses and in our lungs.
00:30:33.359 --> 00:30:36.400
And so this is where we quote unquote become the house.
00:30:36.480 --> 00:30:48.319
So sometimes the problem is not that the current house is a problem, but that the previous house was, and then you not only breathed in the toxins from the mold in the previous house, but you breathe in the spores from the previous house.
00:30:48.480 --> 00:30:54.319
And then you're creating the toxins actually internally because you have the spores living inside of you.
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:55.680
That makes good sense.
00:30:55.839 --> 00:31:03.279
You know, I'm curious, on your opinion, how how much do you think chronic illness is being driven by environmental factors?
00:31:04.079 --> 00:31:05.599
Oh, huge, huge.
00:31:05.759 --> 00:31:11.599
I mean, I I look at chronic illness as being a puzzle of many, many, many pieces, right?
00:31:11.680 --> 00:31:15.839
And I think this is where a lot of people get sidetracked.
00:31:16.079 --> 00:31:26.079
And what I kind of hinted at earlier in our conversation here is it's very easy for people to say, okay, well, environmental is like largely everything.
00:31:26.160 --> 00:31:28.559
And then you try environmental and you're not 100% better.
00:31:28.640 --> 00:31:31.680
And it's like, oh, throw that off, you know, baby out with a bath water.
00:31:31.759 --> 00:31:39.920
And I've seen too many situations where people will be like, Well, I talked to another provider, and they told me that nothing works until you treat parasites.
00:31:40.000 --> 00:31:45.839
And you know, then they go to this other provider who's starting with parasites and they don't get all better, and all of a sudden they're back in my office.
00:31:46.000 --> 00:31:55.440
And I get really frustrated when I hear stories like that because what I feel like in medicine is it's a puzzle, and there's many pieces to the puzzle.
00:31:55.519 --> 00:31:58.079
And for this person, you might need to do parasites first.
00:31:58.160 --> 00:32:02.720
For this person, you might need to do this, and it's about learning what the body will work with.
00:32:02.960 --> 00:32:07.759
And it's it's you can't be this sick without having many different factors.
00:32:07.920 --> 00:32:23.359
So I say that in in response to your question because I feel like environmental factors, whether we're talking about mold or toxic metals or glyphosates or pesticides, or besides all the different things, I feel like are a major piece.
00:32:23.440 --> 00:32:46.240
And we look at like the neurological inflammation, and we look at things like even Alzheimer's plaques have been shown to have an immune function to them, where there's you know, theories now that what we're doing with Alzheimer's plaques is the brain is actually creating these plaques as a way to trap toxins like our environmental toxins or trap um infections from an immune perspective.
00:32:46.319 --> 00:32:55.839
And of course, this mechanism goes haywire, and then somebody gets, you know, some some you know these severe dementia symptoms.
00:32:56.319 --> 00:33:04.079
But so it's a long-winded way of saying like environmental toxins have a very big impact on our health.
00:33:04.240 --> 00:33:07.200
And I do think they play an extremely big role.
00:33:07.359 --> 00:33:19.440
And anytime we're in chronic disease, or anytime we want to prevent chronic disease, like let's run these tests, let's get these toxins up before it becomes something like Alzheimer's or Parkinson's or these very scary degenerative diseases.
00:33:19.759 --> 00:33:27.599
And that being said, they are still one piece of a very complicated puzzle of what being well really is.
00:33:28.240 --> 00:33:29.680
That's so true.
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:35.599
What's the most surprising symptom you've seen resolve after mold exposure was addressed?
00:33:36.160 --> 00:33:38.559
I mean, definitely severe dementia.
00:33:38.720 --> 00:33:53.279
Um, you know, I've seen people where they're in wheelchairs, not from like a you know paraplegic or um, you know, type of thing where people are just like largely in wheelchairs because they're so disabled and they can't walk, and all of a sudden they can get rid of their wheelchair.
00:33:53.519 --> 00:33:54.720
That one's really fun.
00:33:54.880 --> 00:34:01.759
You know, chronic pain of 20 years going away, weird things like the dissociation types of things.
00:34:02.000 --> 00:34:15.119
Like um, you know, I I've had a patient where the dissociation came on where going over a bridge, like anytime she has a lot of bridges in her town, and going over a bridge was causing all this dissociation.
00:34:15.199 --> 00:34:16.719
And so that goes away.
00:34:17.039 --> 00:34:21.679
Hormonal problems, um, infertility problems, you know, so many different things.
00:34:21.840 --> 00:34:38.480
It's I could go on and on and on and on because the thing about mold illness and the thing about these environmental toxins is they will disrupt our hormones, they will disrupt our nervous system, they cause that neurological inflammation, they will cause cardiovascular problems, so circulation.
00:34:38.639 --> 00:34:48.159
So all these like, or you know, these body systems of everything like connecting, it's it's so easy for these parts of our body to get dysregulated.
00:34:48.239 --> 00:34:57.440
So this is why the symptoms can be so incredibly widespread is because our nervous system connects everything, circulatory system connects everything.
00:34:57.519 --> 00:35:04.159
So we start affecting those types of systems in our body, and of course, we're gonna have widespread dysfunction.
00:35:05.440 --> 00:35:07.119
Yeah, oh, makes sense.
00:35:07.360 --> 00:35:12.960
What do you think the biggest thing conventional medicine gets wrong about chronic illness?
00:35:13.519 --> 00:35:15.679
Oh, also so many things.
00:35:16.079 --> 00:35:25.840
The biggest, um, I mean, the biggest thing honestly is using a medication that is not designed to go to the root.
00:35:25.920 --> 00:35:31.920
If I was to pick one thing, it's to say, okay, well, let's do, let's do something easy.
00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:34.239
Let's talk about high blood pressure, right?
00:35:34.800 --> 00:35:41.679
So the biggest thing is saying, well, I'm going to give you a drug to lower your blood pressure, and my job is done.
00:35:41.920 --> 00:35:44.719
Now, like I said at the beginning, I'm not anti-pharma.
00:35:44.800 --> 00:35:47.840
I think, you know, there's really good reasons for pharmaceutical medicine.
00:35:47.920 --> 00:35:56.639
And sometimes if somebody has high blood pressure, you better get that blood pressure down fast, or we're gonna have a really serious problem, depending upon how high it is.
00:35:56.960 --> 00:36:07.440
But I think the biggest thing that we're doing is that is a, we should be using um pharmaceutical and conventional medicine for what it's really good at, which is acute things.
00:36:07.519 --> 00:36:09.199
And it's amazing at that.
00:36:09.440 --> 00:36:16.800
And so if we're using, you know, this medication to get somebody out of a crisis where it's like, okay, you are now out of a danger zone.
00:36:16.880 --> 00:36:20.239
Your blood pressure is in like a relatively normal-ish thing.
00:36:20.480 --> 00:36:25.679
Now we know we've prevented likely any major cardiovascular event.
00:36:25.920 --> 00:36:32.400
And now we have time to say, get to the root to actually figure out why this is happening to begin with.
00:36:32.639 --> 00:36:43.679
So I think oftentimes with when we get a diagnosis, you know, people get so excited when we've been sick for so long to have a diagnosis because it's so easy to be like, okay, I finally know, right?
00:36:43.760 --> 00:36:44.800
I finally know.
00:36:44.960 --> 00:36:50.880
But one of the things we're really doing wrong in medicine is we look at the diagnosis as like the end, right?
00:36:51.119 --> 00:36:55.039
The end around like, okay, you have Lyme or you you have fibromyalgia.
00:36:55.119 --> 00:36:57.760
It's like, you know, you have irrital bowel syndrome, right?
00:36:57.840 --> 00:36:58.639
You have dementia.
00:36:58.800 --> 00:37:01.199
We look at the diagnosis as the end.
00:37:01.599 --> 00:37:10.239
And we really need to be looking at the diagnosis as the beginning, because the diagnosis is saying, hey, we understand some level of what's going on.
00:37:10.400 --> 00:37:14.159
And now we need to look at, well, what are all the reasons to cause that?
00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:16.159
And then be and then go beyond there.
00:37:16.400 --> 00:37:24.079
So that would, if I can bring it into like a nutshell, I would say using diagnosis as the end instead of using diagnosis as the beginning.
00:37:24.639 --> 00:37:25.679
Yeah, that's well said.
00:37:25.840 --> 00:37:35.360
I mean, that's one of the things that I've always wondered like, we're why are we so focused on diagnosing instead of asking, why do I have that diagnosis?
00:37:35.679 --> 00:37:36.559
Yeah, exactly.
00:37:36.719 --> 00:37:41.440
Life is defined by the questions we ask, and we're not asking the right questions in medicine a lot of times.
00:37:41.679 --> 00:37:42.079
Yeah.
00:37:42.400 --> 00:37:49.280
Do you think many autoimmune diseases are actually downstream effects of unresolved infections, toxins, or environmental triggers?
00:37:49.840 --> 00:37:50.480
Oh, 100%.
00:37:50.800 --> 00:38:03.280
I mean, if you look at the research by Alicio Fasano, um, who's done a lot of research on autoimmune disease, his work really showed, and his research really showed that autoimmune disease is a triad, oftentimes of three things.
00:38:03.440 --> 00:38:07.280
So one is having a genetic predisposition.
00:38:07.760 --> 00:38:11.199
But of course, just because we have the gene doesn't mean we have the disease.
00:38:11.360 --> 00:38:16.880
So you have the genetic predisposition, then you have an environmental trigger that turns it on.
00:38:17.039 --> 00:38:18.719
So there's your environmental trigger.
00:38:18.800 --> 00:38:23.679
And the third thing he found in his research was that then there is um leaky gut.
00:38:23.840 --> 00:38:30.719
And so, and that's like the triad that in his research was like true almost all the time in autoimmune disease.
00:38:30.880 --> 00:38:33.280
So the gene we can't do anything about, right?
00:38:33.360 --> 00:38:35.119
We we have our genes, we're born with them.
00:38:35.199 --> 00:38:38.719
But the cool thing is just because we have the genes doesn't mean we have the disease.
00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:47.360
So, in working with reversing autoimmune disease, which every conventional doctor, you know, not every, but a lot of the conventional doctors I talk to don't believe this.
00:38:47.519 --> 00:38:56.719
But I tell you, like when I see symptoms go normal and autoimmune reserve markers go from high to normal, to me, we've reversed that autoimmune disease.
00:38:56.800 --> 00:39:02.960
If you have no symptoms and your blood work shows that autoimmune disease is not existing, like to me, that's like pretty much like curing.
00:39:03.519 --> 00:39:09.039
But from a standpoint then of like how and why, it's looking at that environmental trigger.
00:39:09.119 --> 00:39:10.000
And so this is when.
00:39:10.159 --> 00:39:11.760
Like, what are environmental triggers?
00:39:11.920 --> 00:39:16.400
Well, there are things like viruses and microorganisms, right?
00:39:16.559 --> 00:39:21.039
We see in studies that they activate genes, these disease-promoting genes.
00:39:21.119 --> 00:39:25.360
So we have our infection category, toxins have been shown to do the same.
00:39:25.599 --> 00:39:28.239
And then we have the third thing of this is leaky gut.
00:39:28.320 --> 00:39:33.519
And leaky gut is where it gets a little tricky because it's again, it's so easy to just diagnose with somebody.
00:39:33.599 --> 00:39:40.559
You test a zonnulin, for example, and say, oh, somebody has intestinal permeability, aka leaky gut.
00:39:40.960 --> 00:39:44.960
And but that oftentimes is still like the closer to the beginning, right?
00:39:45.039 --> 00:39:49.280
Because then we have to say, well, why is the gut having this scenario?
00:39:49.440 --> 00:39:54.079
And that's when we get into things like, well, mold toxins, for example, can cause that.
00:39:54.239 --> 00:39:56.159
Certain infections can cause that.
00:39:56.320 --> 00:39:59.039
Toxic metals have been shown to cause leaky gut.
00:39:59.119 --> 00:40:01.760
And then we get into all our gastrointestinal abnormalities.
00:40:01.920 --> 00:40:03.360
We get into parasites, we get into H.
00:40:03.519 --> 00:40:06.639
pylori, we get into SIBO, and on and on and on and on.
00:40:06.880 --> 00:40:29.679
And so a lot of really reversing autoimmune diseases say, okay, well, less, we have to look at this category of everything that can cause leaky gut, remove those things, heal the leaky gut, and then this category of all these environmental toxins that are keeping this genetic, um, this gene expressed, and we work on clearing those, and that's when we can really see these changes.
00:40:29.840 --> 00:40:33.360
But again, it's not one thing, it's all of these different things.
00:40:33.519 --> 00:40:35.840
And I think that's where people just continue to go wrong.
00:40:35.920 --> 00:40:38.480
It's like, what is that one root cause?
00:40:38.719 --> 00:40:47.840
And that's some of our own, you know, I think um where we've gone wrong in functional medicine is you we use oftentimes the root cause.
00:40:48.000 --> 00:40:50.239
We use this term over and over and over again.
00:40:50.320 --> 00:40:59.760
And so I think it's like when we're talking about it in a singular fashion as cause, it's really led the public to believe that, oh, there's a one cause.
00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:10.239
And we should be talking about this as root causes, so that people really hear this in the plural form, so that we're really beginning to think around, like, oh yeah, it's not one thing.
00:41:10.400 --> 00:41:14.559
There's this, we have to fix all of these little pieces to get somebody well.
00:41:15.119 --> 00:41:16.000
Totally.
00:41:16.400 --> 00:41:20.880
What do you believe today that you couldn't say publicly 15 years ago?
00:41:22.159 --> 00:41:24.159
Oh, that's such a good question.
00:41:24.320 --> 00:41:27.039
Nobody's ever asked me that question.
00:41:27.360 --> 00:41:37.360
I mean, I really think when it comes to this idea of Lyme, um, I really think it is such a, it's still like such a taboo thing.
00:41:37.519 --> 00:41:44.320
There's even political stuff going on with Lyme, which is like anytime we bring politics and medicine together, it just frankly drives me nuts.
00:41:44.559 --> 00:41:44.960
Never good.
00:41:45.119 --> 00:41:46.159
I never good, right?
00:41:46.239 --> 00:41:48.079
Keep these things separate, in my opinion.
00:41:48.400 --> 00:41:58.320
But I think one of the biggest things that um 15 years ago we couldn't say is that we can, especially in chronic Lyme, treat it without antibiotics.
00:41:58.559 --> 00:42:11.280
So, for example, there's um there's a study that came out probably on like maybe six years ago or so, maybe seven, something like that, definitely um more recent than 15 years, that was looking at Lyme.
00:42:11.440 --> 00:42:16.639
And a lot of the Lyme studies are are done in um in vitro in a lab.
00:42:16.880 --> 00:42:22.000
And they're done, and that's just because of the nature of the funding, and it's a hard thing to study in vivo.
00:42:22.320 --> 00:42:24.239
And so the they're petri dish studies.
00:42:24.320 --> 00:42:36.880
And so, this one study, what it did was it took um borrelia and it grew borelia in petri dishes, and it subjected a lot of different antibiotics to it, including doxycycline, our number one go-to for a borelia for lime.
00:42:37.360 --> 00:42:41.280
And borrelia eliminated the lime on the petri dish.
00:42:41.440 --> 00:42:44.079
Looks good, looks like it's treated, it's cured.
00:42:44.239 --> 00:42:46.320
But then they left the petri dish out.
00:42:46.480 --> 00:43:00.239
And after a few days, the the borrelia just spontaneously grows back and it looked like it was gone, and it attested completely like it was gone, and it just spontaneously now there's borrelia back on the petri dish.
00:43:00.320 --> 00:43:11.840
So this is these are called persister cells, like the cells that like the DNA remains in the cells where it looks like there's no material left, but there's still some level of material that it's like regenerating.
00:43:12.639 --> 00:43:20.000
So, in the same study, they were also um subjecting a bunch of herbs to the lime in their own petri dish.
00:43:20.239 --> 00:43:28.960
And the herb, there's an herb called cryptolepis that I use in basically almost almost 100% of my patients based upon this study.
00:43:29.199 --> 00:43:41.760
And what this would happen is killed all the lime, and then the petri dish is out, and seven days go by, and 14 days go by, and 21 days go by, and it was it, the lime never returned.
00:43:42.239 --> 00:43:45.039
And study was stopped at 21 days.
00:43:45.119 --> 00:43:51.679
So I would love if we do a another study at some point that's like six months long, just to really know this for sure.
00:43:52.000 --> 00:43:59.679
But you know, I think there's a lot of you know, people really feeling like, okay, yes, we you have to use antibiotics for Lyme.
00:44:00.159 --> 00:44:08.719
And it's becoming less taboo to think that now that there's studies like this that really truly support herbs can be very powerful.
00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:15.440
So even in acute Lyme, even though for acute, I would do something like, you know, like an antibiotic.
00:44:15.599 --> 00:44:36.960
I would never do it in an acute Lyme without also combining it with, you know, something like the cryptolepis, because you can get what can happen, and what we would this study also in many studies have actually shown what I'm about to say is that antibiotics cause the active form of Lyme to go into this dormant form, sometimes at a 96 to 97% chance rate.
00:44:37.119 --> 00:44:40.559
So what that means is you clear the active form sometimes.
00:44:40.639 --> 00:44:46.639
And so people can sometimes even feel a little better, sometimes a lot better, but then you put it into this dormant form.
00:44:46.719 --> 00:44:51.440
So then all it takes is a stressor or virus, you know, something like that.
00:44:51.519 --> 00:45:01.280
That's why I think with COVID, I was seeing all these like re, you know, people that were like coming into my office are like, yeah, I had Lyme 20 years ago and it's reactivated because viruses can do that.
00:45:01.599 --> 00:45:14.400
And so I think, you know, one of the biggest things with this is making sure that we're using, if we're using that antibiotic, that we are at a very minimum combining it with herbal therapy to really work at those dormant persistent forms.
00:45:15.360 --> 00:45:16.880
Yeah, that that's a good point.
00:45:17.039 --> 00:45:18.079
That makes a lot of sense.
00:45:18.320 --> 00:45:18.960
Yeah.
00:45:21.599 --> 00:45:31.519
I want to kind of get into like your health routine a little bit, you know, because you you provide so much value not only as a doctor, but also as a patient, having gone through this yourself.
00:45:31.760 --> 00:45:35.039
Like what is what is your health routine adapted?
00:45:35.119 --> 00:45:36.400
What what can you share about that?
00:45:36.639 --> 00:45:42.320
I feel better at 45 than I did at 25 and 35 by a long shot.
00:45:42.559 --> 00:45:50.320
So right now, what I'm doing is I get up every morning and six days a week I go for a three to five mile run.
00:45:50.800 --> 00:45:53.119
I lift weights three times a week.
00:45:53.280 --> 00:45:59.840
Um, I have a meditation/slash visualization practice that I do most days, not every day.
00:46:00.000 --> 00:46:02.320
Um, I am mostly gluten-free.
00:46:02.480 --> 00:46:04.559
I'm doing a bunch of peptides right now.
00:46:04.639 --> 00:46:09.679
So I'm on as, you know, being in perimenopause, I am on bioidentical hormone replacement therapy.
00:46:09.920 --> 00:46:16.960
Um I'm really, both in my own health as well as in my practice, been super excited about the growth hormone peptides.
00:46:17.119 --> 00:46:25.199
Um, I'm seeing a ton of benefit for them for sleep as well as for in a lot of my patient population in pain.
00:46:25.360 --> 00:46:30.639
Um, so I really think there's something huge there with like regeneration of tissues and cells.
00:46:30.880 --> 00:46:34.400
So don't drink a lot of alcohol, do drink some, but not a lot.
00:46:34.559 --> 00:46:37.840
Um, drink a lot of water, you know, make sure I'm moving my limp.
00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:40.239
I have a red light device for my bed.
00:46:40.400 --> 00:46:43.039
It's a complete panel that lays across my bed.
00:46:43.280 --> 00:46:51.199
So um a few times a week, my partner and I at bedtime, we lay in that for an hour, drink tea, you know, kind of wind down.
00:46:51.920 --> 00:46:54.000
Um, those are the those are the biggest things.
00:46:54.079 --> 00:46:58.239
And then just, you know, eat clean, organic, that sort of thing.
00:46:58.559 --> 00:46:59.840
High protein diet.
00:47:00.159 --> 00:47:00.800
Cool.
00:47:01.679 --> 00:47:02.719
Those are all great things.
00:47:02.800 --> 00:47:03.280
That's awesome.
00:47:03.519 --> 00:47:04.639
Thank you for sharing those.
00:47:04.960 --> 00:47:17.840
So I I want to do like a rapid fire, if that's all right, where I basically the rules are I ask you five questions, the best answer that comes to mind goes it, and we just kind of go through it, you know, in a few minutes.
00:47:17.920 --> 00:47:20.000
Um, just keeps it fun and exciting.
00:47:20.239 --> 00:47:26.880
And for all our friends on social media who will watch all these clips, uh, that these these clips usually become very popular.
00:47:27.119 --> 00:47:33.840
So, without further ado, number one is what's one thing almost everyone believes about health that you think is completely wrong?
00:47:34.079 --> 00:47:35.760
Oh, this is hard rapid fire.
00:47:35.840 --> 00:47:38.400
Um, intermittent fasting does not work for everybody.
00:47:38.559 --> 00:47:40.559
They think that it is, and I do not think it does.
00:47:40.800 --> 00:47:41.920
Good, love that.
00:47:42.880 --> 00:47:43.519
Love it.
00:47:43.760 --> 00:47:47.679
If you could remove one thing from every American home tomorrow, what would it be?
00:47:48.159 --> 00:47:50.320
Um, high fructose corn syrup.
00:47:51.920 --> 00:47:52.800
Amazing.
00:47:53.039 --> 00:47:59.920
So, 20 years from now, what health practice will people look back on and say, I can't believe we used to do that.
00:48:01.920 --> 00:48:03.840
Eat processed food.
00:48:05.679 --> 00:48:07.119
That's a good one, too.
00:48:07.679 --> 00:48:12.159
What's the symptom that people dismiss that scares you the most?
00:48:13.360 --> 00:48:14.239
Brain fog.
00:48:16.719 --> 00:48:17.360
Good.
00:48:17.920 --> 00:48:24.320
If you could run only one test on every person listening right now, what would Total toxin test without a doubt?
00:48:24.639 --> 00:48:34.880
Because the level that I see toxins built up in the body and the level of impact on the entire body is just it's just so widespread.
00:48:36.559 --> 00:48:37.519
That's a good answer.
00:48:37.599 --> 00:48:38.079
I like that.
00:48:38.320 --> 00:48:40.800
And I like vibrant as well, too, by the way.
00:48:41.760 --> 00:48:47.920
What symptom gets blamed on aging, stress, or anxiety that is actually a major red flag?
00:48:48.559 --> 00:48:49.760
Every symptom.
00:48:50.559 --> 00:48:52.960
Chronic, we'll go with chronic fatigue, though.
00:48:53.840 --> 00:48:54.239
Yeah.
00:48:54.559 --> 00:48:55.519
Chronic fatigue.
00:48:55.599 --> 00:48:56.079
Perfect.
00:48:56.320 --> 00:48:56.719
All right.
00:48:56.800 --> 00:49:12.480
And so um now that we we've kind of gone through that, you know, I I there's another like game that I really like to play because um, you know, it's people love controversy typically because controversies typically have some truth to it, right?
00:49:12.960 --> 00:49:16.559
What's the biggest lie people have been told about chronic illness?
00:49:16.880 --> 00:49:23.679
Well, I I mean, I think you actually hit on the biggest lie, actually, which is that it's supposed to happen with age.
00:49:24.559 --> 00:49:28.719
You know, this whole thing around like, like, you're getting older.
00:49:28.880 --> 00:49:30.880
This is just happening because you're getting older.
00:49:31.039 --> 00:49:37.199
And the number of times I've heard through my family, through my patients, around like, oh, this is this is just getting older.
00:49:37.360 --> 00:49:38.639
Like, I think it's such a lie.
00:49:38.800 --> 00:49:41.519
Like, now I'm getting like really passionate in my body.
00:49:41.599 --> 00:49:44.559
I can feel getting ramped up with this question.
00:49:44.800 --> 00:49:57.679
Because it's so common that our people are just told this and we're like thinking that, oh, yeah, it's normal to have pain, it's normal to not sleep well, it's normal to put on weight, it's normal for all this dysfunction to happen and you're just getting older.
00:49:57.920 --> 00:50:08.000
The reason I hate it so much is because it stops people looking and it stops doctors from being curious, it stops people from like figuring out things that are wrong.
00:50:08.320 --> 00:50:14.639
And I think it's just so it's so easy to be like just the in this state of total acceptance.
00:50:14.800 --> 00:50:17.840
Like, I'm not gonna, you know, it's like, yes, things change with age, right?
00:50:17.920 --> 00:50:23.199
We're the things don't work in your 40s and your 50s at the same level as when you're, you know, 20.
00:50:23.840 --> 00:50:24.480
For sure.
00:50:24.960 --> 00:50:36.960
But this whole thing that that this means that you're supposed to have all these wide variety of symptoms as you age and that you're supposed to be fatigued and all, you know, and have all this pain, it's just it's so wrong.
00:50:37.039 --> 00:50:41.119
And it just stops people and doctors from figuring out why.
00:50:43.039 --> 00:50:45.440
Yeah, that's well, that's a really good point.
00:50:45.599 --> 00:50:48.000
I can't tell you how many people have said that exact thing.
00:50:48.159 --> 00:50:49.679
Well, it's just I'm just getting older.
00:50:49.760 --> 00:50:50.480
It's just normal.
00:50:50.559 --> 00:50:56.079
It's like, and just because it was common, that's exactly the exact phrase I use over and over again.
00:50:56.239 --> 00:50:57.679
Couldn't have said it better.
00:50:59.280 --> 00:51:00.480
Yeah, that's awesome.
00:51:00.719 --> 00:51:05.119
So I think the last question that I have is is is probably the best uh to end with.
00:51:05.199 --> 00:51:09.599
And that's if someone listening feels hopeless about their health, what would you tell them?
00:51:09.920 --> 00:51:11.440
The body doesn't lie.
00:51:11.920 --> 00:51:14.320
The body absolutely does not lie.
00:51:14.559 --> 00:51:28.480
So if you have a symptom, even if you've been told that there's not a reason, even if you've had what feels like all the tests and all the imaging and all the things done, there is some sort of reason.
00:51:28.559 --> 00:51:31.840
The body doesn't do this for no reason, the body doesn't do this just for age.
00:51:32.000 --> 00:51:33.840
So you're not crazy, right?
00:51:34.000 --> 00:51:37.360
That is why my book is called It's Not in Your Minds, right?
00:51:37.440 --> 00:51:38.559
You're not making this up.
00:51:38.719 --> 00:51:45.039
If your body has a symptom, one of your biggest responsibilities is to believe your body.
00:51:45.199 --> 00:52:01.119
And if you are not finding a doctor that is willing to put in the work, the time, the effort to find you the reason for it, then it's time to find another doctor and just keep self-advocating for yourself because there's absolutely a reason this is happening.
00:52:03.360 --> 00:52:03.920
I love that.
00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:05.519
Yeah, it's it's so true.
00:52:05.760 --> 00:52:16.320
I've I've sure you've heard this before, but uh, you know, dealing with what I do, and I help people kind of overcome the problems in their homes and get rid of mold and things of that nature.
00:52:16.480 --> 00:52:29.840
And, you know, a lot of people they'll they'll tell me they had to go to 20, 30 different doctors to finally find one that that that understood them and said, hey, have you thought about mold or some other indoor toxins, et cetera?
00:52:30.000 --> 00:52:32.159
Um, so it's and I think it's really important.
00:52:32.239 --> 00:52:34.000
Like you need you need to look.
00:52:34.159 --> 00:52:38.480
And sometimes, you know, you have to interview a few different doctors.
00:52:38.639 --> 00:52:42.480
Um, I think you you did a great job talking about your book today.
00:52:42.719 --> 00:52:53.840
Um, everyone, and where can they find Amazon, any other like online platform it's on, or you can just go to my website at it's notinyourmind.com to get that.
00:52:54.000 --> 00:52:59.519
You can also find me and and my book at my main website, which is just mylimedoc.com.
00:53:01.519 --> 00:53:10.960
Cause I I think it's so valuable that you put all these questions in there for people to be able to ask their doctors, um, you know, so to really help find the doctor that's gonna be right for them.
00:53:11.119 --> 00:53:12.159
Um exactly.
00:53:12.239 --> 00:53:15.039
Yeah, and the right, you know, I definitely work with a lot of people.
00:53:15.119 --> 00:53:17.440
We have we're licensed in six states right now.
00:53:17.599 --> 00:53:23.039
We're in the process this summer of adding on another six more, so that'll be up by August 1st.
00:53:23.199 --> 00:53:26.480
Um, and that being said, we're not the right fit for everybody.
00:53:26.559 --> 00:53:32.880
And the most important thing is that you find a doctor that you're um you know aligned with, aligned with in their philosophy.
00:53:33.039 --> 00:53:36.320
And so, you know, if it's me and our practice, I'm happy to help.
00:53:36.400 --> 00:53:46.960
And if not, then the goal is to, you know, help you have questions um to ask your doctor and know how to interview a potential doctor so you end up with the right person, whoever they are.
00:53:48.800 --> 00:53:50.079
Yeah, I know that's that's great.
00:53:50.239 --> 00:53:51.119
I really appreciate that.
00:53:51.280 --> 00:53:52.639
I appreciate all the work that you do.
00:53:52.800 --> 00:53:53.920
Thank you for doing what you do.
00:53:54.159 --> 00:54:02.800
You know, that's really important, obviously, for people to get public care and for it's wholeheartedly, and that's why I should do that.
00:54:03.039 --> 00:54:04.639
I just wanted to thank you for that.